======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: ? about giant lathe (Noble & Lund 96"x30') From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 25 Aug 1998 05:57:22 GMT -------- As big lathes go this is a baby (well mid-range at best) I spent part of my apprenticeship running a monster 108" swing dual bed ,dual carriage, roll turning lathe, that would take 48 feet and 90 tons between centers. Speeds ranged from 1 minute per rev to 12 rev per minute. It took a crane and about an hour to change the position of the four face plate jaws. Drive was DC and all controls were on a multi button pendant...At one rev/ minute jogging speed you learned to true up a job in two revolutions or less!! The carriages each had a staircase up about eight feet from ground level, then there was another staircase up to the top slide which had about twelve feet of travel and could be set up to cut threads from 8 tpi to about 12" pitch!! One of the fun jobs was screw cutting the cable ways on eight foot diameter x 14 foot long hoist winding drums. These were a half round groove for a 1 1/2" dia. cable. Half the drum was left hand thread the other half right hand pitch. Thats a half round form tool 1 1/2 inches across cutting full width!..Screw-cutting!! On some larger (longer) jobs you would have both carriageways machining at once..that was fun!!! Tools varied from HSS to carbide inserts and even some early cermets for chilled iron rolls. Average insert size was 1 1/2" square x 1/2" thick and held in tool holders up to six inches square. These were in turn held down by a couple of huge straps with four nuts on each about six inches across flats. The wrench was about eight feet long and had to be brought up on the crane. I remember one job on a huge steam turbine rotor where we strapped the head and turret from a bridgeport mill onto the tool post to mill a key way. This type of machine is used daily in heavy engineering works, steel mills, shipyards arsenals etc. and their work includes the aforementioned steam turbines, hydro electric generators, steel mill rolls, gun barrels, monster reduction gears for aircraft carriers, oil tankers etc. I spent an interesting and informative six months running that machine and then went on to a 42 foot diameter vertical boring machine and thence to a 24 foot wide x 48 foot stroke planer. One thing I learned was to plan the job ahead..mistakes were big and expensive!! The other thing I learned was that I didn't want to spend the rest of my life doing that...I still have one shoulder almost an inch lower than the other and now, in my fifties I hurt all over, every day as a direct result of the sheer "horse work" of running machines like that while I was in my teens. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Little Elevator/Big Lathe From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 25 Aug 1998 06:14:14 GMT -------- The Millwrights,(riggers) if they are worth their salt, will find this one a breeze! Standard practice is to drop the elevator to the basement, open the doors and hoist the machine up the shaft..on end if necessary. Yes they do drop them on occasion!! I saw the very first Herbert CNC lathe dropped four stories..made a right mess of the elevator. They may decide it is easier to go up the outside with a crane and scoot it through the window. My advice is to leave it to the professionals..if only for insurance purposes. I put a Smart and Brown Model A Toolrom lathe into my (then) townhouse basement by dropping it vertically through a 24"x30" hole I cut in the floor right inside the front door. I built two custon "A" frfames out of 4x4 lumber, one for outside and one for inside. The lathebed was split from the base, which was the heaviest piece. Total weight close to a ton. Myself and two helpers had the hole cut, lathe in and the hole buttoned up with carpet relaid inside an hour..before "She Who Must Be Obeyed" came home from the mall. I never did tell her how I got the lathe in there. OBTY it came out the same way in even less time..we were experts by then!! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: looking for 52100 alloy From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 25 Aug 1998 06:21:26 GMT -------- You'll be real lucky to find it outside of custom rolled mill lots. When and if you do you'll have a bunch of knifemakers lining up (or running all over you). 52100 alloy is a specialised steel for bearings and a favorite with some knifemakers. They have to forge blades out from large balls, rollers or races. Good luck. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Bolt, thread and tap sizes reference From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 25 Aug 1998 06:27:14 GMT -------- What you need are "ZEUS" charts ....standard in any machinist's box. Dunno where you'd find them but when you do..let me know..I need to replace mine. Starrett do a single page chart too..try a distributor. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: #2 MT collets / Hex and Square From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 25 Aug 1998 06:33:17 GMT -------- Hardinge will make hex., square, or any other shape you want in 2MT, 3MT 3C 5C and B&S. You might try Myford in England..2MT collets are their standard...they have a web address..try a search. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: how to bolt together to S-section I-beams From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 25 Aug 1998 06:39:36 GMT -------- You use taper washers..they are available from where you buy your steel. Don't bother to ask at Ace Hardware..they will look at you funny. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: aligning holes in tube From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 28 Aug 1998 04:34:30 GMT -------- The good 'ole eyeball will never let you down. Assuming that you are using a drill press and know how to align and clamp down a vee block to said drill press table. Drill your first hole and swap ends. Now put as long a piece of close fitting rod as you can get under the ceiling,through the first hole. Drop a plumb line somewhere beyond it and eyball the rod to the plumb line. It will be plenty close enough for almost any purposes. This does assume that your drill press is somewhere close to being perpendicular. You might want to eyeball it with the plumb line first. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Auger screws; anyone know how to make them????????????? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 29 Aug 1998 06:20:53 GMT -------- Two ways I have used..depends on I/d to O/d and thickness of material. Narrow flights (1 to 4 inches wide) can be rolled on edge from strip stock. You may need custom grooved rollers. For larger and thicker flights..flame cut a series of plate rings (Annuli !) cut one side on centerline, heat and pull open to pitch dimension..(axially that is). weld to next flight and repeat. For really big ones, flame cut segments of a turn to save material. I have built them (For continuous decanting centrifuges) with a core dia 36'' , O/D of 60 inches, length 12 feet'' material..1/2" stainless. Hard faced and ground to gage. Don't want to make another!! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: "I" beams as lathe beds etc. From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 02 Sep 1998 04:53:59 GMT -------- One of the "top of the line" German CNC Lathes (GDF I think) Has a bed/mainframe made of reinforced concrete with hardened steel ways bonded in place. I did hear of one instance where the ways fell off. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Help with 4 Jaw Chuck From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 06 Sep 1998 00:22:57 GMT -------- It is not easy to figure out, from your description , exactly what the problem is..but it sounds like a bent screw. Remove all four jaws. You will notice that the screws have a necked section that runs in a forked insert. Look at the back of the chuck and you may see four round plugs. If not, remove the backplate and you should see them. Using a narrow, flat ended punch , and from the front of the chuck, gently tap the forked plugs out and the screws should slip out of their holes. Check the screws and straighten if required. Make sure the jaws are a good sliding fit. Pop the screws back in and tap the forked plugs in from the back..DON'T GO TOO DEEP Or the screws will bind. Reassemble jaws and backplate. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Mounting a back plate on a three jaw chuck From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 11 Sep 1998 09:03:33 GMT -------- Cutting a step to suit the recess in the back of the chuck is certainly the "textbook" way. However, it may not be the "best" way! I always mount my 3-jaws without a locating spigot and drill rather oversized clearance holes for the mounting bolts. That way you can ease off the bolts and tap any particular job into dead alignment. (don't forget to tighten the bolts up again before turning) Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: MSC nice guys From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 25 Sep 1998 05:43:31 GMT -------- MSC _are_nice guys (and Gals) to deal with. I'm fortunate in that I live in Atlanta and can nip around the perimeter to their main distribution center (not in rush hour!!) Service is quick, competent and very friendly..nothing is too much trouble. Never yet ordered anything that was out of stock and not ready for me when I arrived thiry minutes after placing a phone order. Prices and quality are more than competitive. Specials are really a good deal, but their regular prices are usually as good or better than other suplpiers "specials" There is always something "tasty" on the "scratch and dent" table in the store, which makes each visit an adventure. I have had only one return so far and that was done without question or quible. These people are to be commended and encouraged..they get 90% of my business! I haven't been able to spring a new catalogue out of them..yet! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Stupid Question From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 25 Sep 1998 06:33:34 GMT -------- Scott S. Logan wrote: > If I've got this straight, to cut a 1.75mm pitch with a 6mm pitch lead > screw, you would need a threading dial with some multiple of 7 teeth > in the gear. (6mm x 7 turns=42mm and 1.75mm x 24 turns=42mm) > > To cut 1.25mm, you would need some multiple of 5. (6mm x 5 turns=30mm > and 1.25mm x 24 turns=30mm) This is precisely what I have on my Maximat Super II It is fitted with an 8tpi leadscrew and a thread indicator dial with three gears..14, 15 and 16 tooth which can be engaged at will with the leadscrew. For Imperial pitches only the 16t gear is ever used and pickup is the usual 1,2,4 or 1,2 or 1only, depending on the pitch. With metric threads I am stuck with the same pickup problems as anyone else with an imperial lead screw. However, if I had a lot of metric threads to cut, I would change to a 3mm pitch leadscrew. I would then be able, by ringing the changes on the three pickup gears, to get 1,2,4 or 1,2 or 1,3 or 1 pickup on the following range of metric pitches: 0.175, 0.35, 0.4, 0.45, 0.7, 0.8, 0.9, 1.25, 1.75, 2, 2.25, 2.5, 3.5, 4.5 and 5.0 (this according to the instruction manual) It is significant that 0.5 and 1mm pitch are missing from this list. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Stupid Question From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 25 Sep 1998 06:52:02 GMT -------- Robert Bastow wrote: However, if I had a lot of metric threads to cut, I would change to a 3mm pitch leadscrew. I would then be able, by ringing the changes on the three pickup > gears, to get 1,2,4 or 1,2 or 1,3 or 1 pickup on the following range of metric > pitches: > 0.175, 0.35, 0.4, 0.45, 0.7, 0.8, 0.9, 1.25, 1.75, 2, 2.25, 2.5, 3.5, 4.5 and 5.0 > (this according to the instruction manual) > > It is significant that 0.5 and 1mm pitch are missing from this list. > > On re-reading the manual (which appears to have been translated from the original German by a first year Chinese student of Arabic, with English as a fourth language!!)..I _think_ that pickup on 0.5 and 1.0mm pitch can be done at any position. Robert Bastow ======== To: alshinn@sirius.com Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Casting a sailboat keel From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 26 Sep 1998 07:10:31 GMT -------- Alan Shinn wrote: > Richard Sewell wrote: > > > > In article <360B7F4C.E7E694CB@mindspring.com>, gashmore@mindspring.com > > (Glenn Ashmore) wrote: > > > > > Steve Rayner wrote: > > > > > > > How about sealing the drain, and using the back of the tub as a spout. > > > > Pivot the back. Rig a tripod of heavy steel tubing over the front. > > > > Use a > > > > chain block, or tripod and boom to lift the other end from a distance. > > > > Make sure that the tub can't tip over sideways! > > > > > > Considering how much I am abusing this tub already, I don't even want > > > to tickle it while it is > > > hot. > > > > Incidentally, with all this talk of plugs, I've started to worry about the > > force you'll need to apply to lift a plug against the pressure of the lead > > above it. It'll be equal to the weight of the lead cylinder directly above > > the plug, if you see what I mean. > > > > Richard Sewell rsewell@cix.co.uk > > Or at least a plug the diameter of the drain. > For this same reason, an iron ball would not float once completely > immersed (you would have to hold it down for awhile with your myrtle > branch). Try this with water and a tennis ball in your (real) bathtub. > -- > > Looking forward: > Alan Shinn > > Experience the > beginnings of microscopy. > Make or buy your own replica > of one of Antony van Leeuwenhoek's microscopes. > visit http://www.sirius.com/~alshinn/ I strongly recommend setting up a screw (threaded rod about 3/4" dia should do it) to raise the plug with some control and give yourself a fighting chance to throttle the flow or close it off if something starts to go wrong (remember murphy?!!) Another consideration is the bubble of air that will be explosively ejected from the flow pipe when you open the valve..you need to control, and protect against, that. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Not a great weekend (and some car tips) From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 26 Sep 1998 07:25:04 GMT -------- Fitch R. Williams wrote: > I used to love heading out to the barn to do chores on those cold > winter evenings when the snow was falling in the soft light of the > barn pole lamp, made crunching and squeaking sounds as I walked, and > the cold dry air tingled the hair in my nose. Havn't experienced that > in a looooong time. > > Thanks for the plesant memory. > > Fitch > In So. Cal. Fitch...you're sick!!! 8^) I lived for twelve cold years in the (lake effect) snow belt of the Niagara Peninsular before finally escaping back to the sunny south (Atlanta) Yes I know we get tornados and the fringe effects of hurricanes...I don't care so long as I don't have to shovel it!! I don't do snow any more..my family knows that robins, holly and Santa are ok on Christmas cards...but no snow!!! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Not a great weekend (and some car tips) From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 26 Sep 1998 15:55:24 GMT -------- Fitch R. Williams wrote: Once or twice a year - most but not all years - we get a tiny bit of snow here. It lasts about 24 hours to 36 hours max, the FWY is shut down, then melts. Two or three years ago we had the "Blizzard of the Century" here in "Hotlanta".....4 to 6 inches..which would have been classed as a light sprinkle in Ontario. Funniest thing I ever saw was the first snowfall in Cairo, Egypt for about 25 years. About a sixteenth of and inch that stayed all of ten minutes! But in a city of eleven million people who had never seen it or driven in it, with an _accumulative_ total of 1/8th inch of tire tread between them and not a single windshield wiper in the city, it was a hoot to watch! On a normal ,dry day there is a major collision at ever major intersection, every hour, on the hour. You can imagine that with the snow it was "Fred Karno's Karnage"! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Not a great weekend (and some car tips) From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 26 Sep 1998 23:17:16 GMT -------- DoN. Nichols wrote: > Robert Bastow wrote: > > I would have replied by e-mail, but that e-mail address looks like a > spam-proof one, so I'm going for the newsgroup instead. > > >Funniest thing I ever saw was the first snowfall in Cairo, Egypt for about 25 > >years. About a sixteenth of and inch that stayed all of ten minutes! But in a > >city of eleven million people who had never seen it or driven in it, with an > >_accumulative_ total of 1/8th inch of tire tread between them and not a single > >windshield wiper in the city, it was a hoot to watch! > > Especially given the typical speeds and inter-vehicle clearance > there. :-) > > >On a normal ,dry day there is a major collision at ever major intersection, > >every hour, on the hour. You can imagine that with the snow it was "Fred > >Karno's Karnage"! > > Interesting. I was *told* (by someone in the tourist industry) that > there were never any accidents, and I started looking at the vehicles as > they whizzed by. I saw *no* crumpled metal, or signs of crumpled metal > having been "fixed", even though quite a few of the vehicles had been in use > long enough so the paint was wearing thin, and there was a light film of > rust forming on some of the vehicles. > > So -- since what you say agrees with what I felt *must* be the case, > what happens to the victims? Are all the vehicles totaled in these wrecks? > > I was rather amazed at the skills of the taxi drivers, with what > felt like a fore-and-aft clearance of 1-3 feet, and a lateral clearance of > 8-12 inches -- at speeds around 50+ MPH. > > Thanks, > DoN. All I can say Don is that either, Cairo has changed a LOT in the past twnty years, or,we are talking about a different Cairo. The carnage was horrendous. At almost every intersection you would come across a high speed, total write-off wreck and bodies. Almost without exception there would be a black and white Fiat taxi involved. So far as dings and dents went..you could NEVER find a car without plenty. I once had a bet on with a friend that he couldn't find a car without a dent. After a whole days searching he dragged me triuphantly into a new car showroom and presented a gleaming, brand new black Mercedes. We walked around it and sure enough there was a ding in the door!!! My scariest trip was hammering across the desert road from Cairo to Alexandria in a clapped out diesel Peugeot 504 with eight people in it and four bald tires. One a cross ply, one a steel belt and two different sized/makes of textile belts! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Not a great weekend (and some car tips) From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 27 Sep 1998 04:37:38 GMT -------- DoN. Nichols wrote: > Wonderful! I figured that the first part of the vehicle to fail > *must* be the horn, They don't have horn buttons....just an on switch....or wired direct to the ignition. The cacophany of blaring horns, mixed with braying donkeys starts at five am and goes on twenty two hours a day > and the brakes probably lasted for the life of the > vehicle. :-) > > BRAKES????? > > -- > I once passed an interesting hour watching a pavement crafts man in the "Souks" (Bazaar). He was sitting on a carpet on the ground holding a Ford piston between his bare feet while he filed off about 60 thou on diameter to fit an old Mercedes engine. I have no doubt in my mind that it worked perfectly when he had done. Those street craftsmen were incredible. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: The perfect shop: floors From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 28 Sep 1998 08:22:33 GMT -------- Steve Rayner wrote: > A wooden floor is best, with the machines mounted on raised concrete slabs > that extend just above the floor. > > Scott A. Moore (samiamREMOVE@cisco.com) wrote: > : Oh, well, its two months off, but its on my mind! > > : I am planning to insulate and roof in my new shop garage, but > : I also know that concrete floors suck the heat right out of > : the air. I can't think of a whole lot of surfaces that are > : appropriate for machining ! I second the wooden floors bit. I am slowly building my perfect shop in the basement(with slightly damp concrete floor). Main bitch is the back and leg problems caused by hard concrete floor, plus the dust and damp problem. After a lot of research I decided to go with a fairly springy arrangement and I love it. My procedure is to first seal the floor with a thick coat of black roofing "tar"..it is far cheaper than the floor sealants and seems to work just as well. Over this, while it is wet I lay a layer of thick roofing paper. On this I lay 2 x 2 pressure treated sleepers, first in a 4' x 8' perimeter and then cross to divide in to eight.. 2 ' square sections. I tried one area with only 3 dividers and that (in front of the bench) is maybe a little too springy. The perimeter bearers are pinned with a couple or three concrete nails, the rest are glued down with "liquid nails" This is done while the sealant is still wet so that the few nails will be self sealing On top of this goes 3/4" tongue and grooved, flooring grade, plywood which is nailed to the sleepers. Under areas where I placed benches and light machines I added additional wood blocking...To the point of being almost solid under the table saw and jointer. I tried the same under my Maximat Super II lathe and it was a no-go. Solution was to mark VERY carefully the position of the jacking screws (by screwing them down into the wooden floor). Move the lathe to one side and drill 2" diameter holes through the plywood. into these I dropped close fitting 2'' diameter steel plugs, faced to the floor thickness (2 1/4'') in length and into one end of which I had put a substantial drill dimple to suit the jacking screws. Moved lathe back and leveled it...solid as a rock!!..with a nice "springy" floor all around it. Proof of the effectivness of the water proofing came a week later. While we were away on vacation the neighborhood was hit by a tornado. Missed us by a few yards!! But the power was out for several hours and without the sump pump the basement flooded to a depth of one inch..ie below the new floor. Absolutely no loss or damage to any equipment or materials..Phew!! As of yet I haven't decided on the best finish for the floor but I'm hankering after prefinished oak parquet (surprisingly cheaper than vinyl) for the wood working area and the hardest, thickest vinyl tiles I can find (like the old "Battleship Linoleum in the metal shop. I like tiles because they can be replaced if worn or damaged. Expensive? Yes but I worked long and hard to be able to spend a lot of time in the future in MY "Perfect Shop" I would welcome other suggestions on a suitable finish for the metal area..I'm kinda committed to the structure! Do you know the difference between "involved" and "committed"? Its kinda like bacon and eggs.....The chicken is involved, the pig is committed!! Robert Bastow Don't force it...Use a bigger hammer! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Interrupted Screw Threads? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 28 Sep 1998 10:02:20 GMT -------- > OK, may I muddy the waters a little here :) > > The process described works fine for *single* interrupted threads. > But look more closely at that artillery piece (especially a large > one). Chances are, it's not a single thread cut at 90 degree points, > but *two* interleaved threads cut out at 60 degrees. > So moving around the circumference, one sees: > > 1. Large diameter thread > 2. Smaller diameter thread > 3. Cut clean away > 4. Repeat from [1] > > When disengaged, the small (male) thread can pass clean through the > large female, while the cut-away section passes clean through the > small thread. > The closed breech now has engaged threads over 66% of its > circumference, not 50%. Result: a stronger gun. > > Now please, how to cut those threads (esp. the interior one)? > > -- Dave Brooks > PGP public key via , or servers Dead on description Dave of what is called a "Welin" breech screw. Some of the larger ones have three or even four steps. For a good picture of one go to your search engine, enter" breech" and it will take you to a site in Finland that has as good a picture as I've seen. I do have the URL but it doesn't seem to transmit well. Now as to how they are made. The article in the ME was not a very good description. In real life they are done on special machines that combine the operation of a relieving lathe (used also for turning relieved form tools such as gear hobs) and an intermitant drive (probably some form of "geneva" motion. I am currently building a 1/8th scale model of a WW I 9.2" howitzer which has a two step Welin screw. Here's how I plan to do it. First job is to slow the lathe down from minimum low speed of 55 rev/min to a tenth of that. I have rigged a temporary drive from a DC motor to an auxilliary pully on the main drive motor with a 10 to 1 reduction. The main drive acts only as a jockey shaft. Now I get variable speed from zero to five rpm..Lotsa torque!! Fitted to the chuck back plate is a cam that controls the cross slide movement via a direct push rod. The cam has four quadrants at 90 degrees, each quadrant has a full dia (controls major thread dia on the female bush..opposite on the male). then there is a sharp drop off (square edge follower) to relieve from major dia to minor dia. The minor dia is not controlled by the cam but independently by an adjustable back stop on the cross slide. This gives me independent control of the two thread diameters..relative to each other. The final step of each quadrant is ramp back up to major dia. In operation the feed screw is removed from the cross slide just as in taper turning and cross slide is controlled by a strong spring in one direction and and adjustable stop in the other. Segments are planed out of the bush and breech block , obviously, before threading. Not quite as simple as some people think but quite straight forward after you have thought about it for 35 years as I have done with this particular model!!! Robert Bastow Don't force it..Use a bigger hammer!! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: The perfect shop: floors From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 29 Sep 1998 04:58:16 GMT -------- Where I "served my time"....in a hundred year old, multi-acreage sized, engineering plant..all the floors were wooden "sets" These are end grain wooden blocks set on a rammed earth base. Very durable, non slip, "warm" (relative term..the shop could be well below freezing during winter!!), tough as old boots, yet gentle on dropped parts. Added advantage that chocks could be spiked down to stop things rolling or slipping. In machine shops we were provided with wooden duck boards for the operators to stand on. A good one would be strips of softwood say 1/1/2" x 3/4" x 6ft long; nailed at 3/4" spacing onto four, underneath, cross battens of the same section and about 30" wide. These are resilient, thus easy on the back and legs, allow swarf (chips) and coolant to drain, and provide a non slip surface. As a by-word I would implore all machinists to ensure that the area around machinery is kept clean, dry and free of obstacles. Always know your escape route if something goes wrong. I once witnessed an apprentice, with his hands in his pockets, trip and fall head first onto the table of a large, rotating, VTL (Vertical Turning Lathe). I had to help pick up the bits!! Wood floors do seem to stand up reasonably well and the advantages outweigh the disadvantages in my honest opinion. Indeed we found the most durable and comfortable footwear was wooden soled, leather upper, clogs shod with clog irons and nails. Your feet would remain snug and comfortable for 16 hour double shifts and the uppers wore out before the soles! Robert Bastow (Who is not as old as I maybe sound) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: lathe reconditioning From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 29 Sep 1998 05:25:22 GMT -------- Russ Kepler wrote: > > > Turcite apparently comes in a couple of liquid forms, a thicker and > thinner version. There is also several thicknesses of sheet > available. The type I saw used was the thicker liquid. > Hi Russ, I used the 1/16'' Turcite to rebuild a Smart and Browne Model A toolroom lathe (very similar to a Monarch EE) After getting the bed reground I set up the saddle on the milling machine and removed enough metal from the ways to accomodate the Turcite (pronounced Tur-Kite) This material is a tuquoise colored, extruded PTFE based material with additives. One side is etched to provide a key for the special (and VERY expensive) two part epoxy used to bond the Turcite to the saddle. After thorough degreasing, the ways are buttered with epoxy, precut strips laid in place and the saddle clamped onto the bed. After curing the saddle pops off and can then be finish scraped into true alignment. It is best to machine the saddle to remove oil contamination and to avoid having to shim the apron and leadscrew back into position Turcite does a wonderful job. Slip-stick is virtually eliminated and clearances can be set to zero..thus eliminating chatter. It will turn a good lathe into a superb one. Turcite is made by Shamban and they do have a web site. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Why turn rotors? WAS Not a great weekend From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 29 Sep 1998 06:05:35 GMT -------- Rev Chuck wrote: > > > Know the difference between a Yugo and a Jehovah's Witness? > > You can shut the door on the Witness. > > -- > Do you know why Trabants have a heated rear window? So your hands don't freeze when you push it! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Antique gas engine kits?? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 29 Sep 1998 06:14:54 GMT -------- Russ Kepler wrote: > Actually, as list-mom Are you my Mommy? Hey guys come on over and give the modeleng-list a try..lots of good information and company. Just don't try to run off subject as long as you do here. Thats when Russ turns net-nanny!! And don't mention Weetabix!! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Rotary Table for sale From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 30 Sep 1998 19:34:45 GMT -------- Dick Brewster wrote: > Enco also has H/V rotary tables on sale. $189 for the 8 inch Enco, > and you can get the table plus tailstock and dividing plates for > $289. > The 10 inch Enco is $220 for the table and $339 for the combo. > > MSC has the 10" Phase II H&V Rotary table for sale at $299 Phase II is usually good quality. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Precision reciprocating grinder From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 01 Oct 1998 06:57:06 GMT -------- Steve Rayner wrote: > They are called a toolpost grinder. .......... > I have one in the design stage right now. I would be very interested in the bearing design and specification. Do you intend to use angular contact bearings? What size and ABEC spec? What provision for preloading? What about sealing? What HP drive and belt type? Spindle nose and/or collet sizes? Appreciated. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Amazing Press From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 02 Oct 1998 11:47:48 GMT -------- This is a big press but by no means the worlds largest. I used to work for a company in the UK with a 50,000 ton press. It was used for making large steel pressure vessals...hydraulic accumulators etc. It would take a huge cube of 4140X and in one push would back extrude it into an open ended cup with a six inch wall thickness. Hydraulic mains were 24" dia (saw one break once...Oops!!) Demag in Germany have a 75000 tonner and I believe there is an even bigger one in Russia. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Hare brained scheme, hole poking invited... From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 02 Oct 1998 12:12:57 GMT -------- Jeff DelPapa wrote: > I have gotten very tired of losing register every time I need to move > the head on my mill drill. (snip) So now I have another strange idea, > replace the > round section with a square one, and carve out the head casting to > match...(Big snip) > As you say....a hare brained scheme and a collosol amount of uneccessary time and expense. A square column with a dovetail is redundent design..you only need one or the other. Simplest way is to attach a feather key to the column (no need to mill a key way for it). Take the head casting to a decent machine shop and have them broach a keyway in it for you. Have this made 1/8" wider than the feather key and offset from C/L by that amount...then you can fit a gib strip and adjusting screws. A better device would be a triangular gib key..but that would be a whole lot more difficult to machine and fit. I was looking at a JET Mill/drill the other day and it was fitted with an elevating rack. This was designed to swivel around the column...exactly like a drill press. You have most of the elements there for a feather key alignment....Get the rack strip ground accurately parallel on its sides. Screw it to the column..a few counterbored capscrews will not interfere with the rack operation.Figure out how to fit and adjust a thin flat gig strip (or open up the existing keyway as above). I realise you will loose the swing head feature, but that may be an acceptable compromise. There are mill/drills built in Europe with exactly this system of alignment. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: mill/drill From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 02 Oct 1998 12:32:37 GMT -------- rkurtz wrote: > I recently bought a mill/drill from harbor freight. After cleaning the > shipping grease off I sprayed the gibs and ways with wd-40 (what I could > get to). I tried to move the x and y tables. The x moves but with great > effort. The y takes 2 hands on the wheel and even more effort. I can > get to the x lead screw from underneath to lube it. How do you lube the > y lead screw? I've tried to loosen the gibs to hopefully lessen the > pressure there but that didn't help. The instruction manual is in > English but very Chinese written (worthless). Does anyone have a > suggestion on the lube and table movement? That much effort is NOT a lube problem. First loosen lock screws! Still a problem? Then loosen the screws holding the feed screw mounting brackets If that frees in up, move the table as close to the feedscrew mounting end as possible before snugging up the screws. If it tightens up again try shimming the mounting bracket. It may be out of square. Next check the feed nuts. If they are loose it could cause jamming. If they are not loose..try loosening them..they may be out of alignment. If they have an antibacklash adjustment try backing this off (see your manual) Still a problem ? Remove the feed screws altogether..you should be able to push the slides reasonably easily from one end to the other without shake or tight spots. Check that the feedscrews rotate freely in their bearings If you find tight spots you are into slideway scraping. If you know how to do this...fine. If not you now have grounds to demand a replacement machine. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Blackbird From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 02 Oct 1998 12:41:00 GMT -------- Fitch R. Williams wrote: > >There is also an SR71 on display at the Castle AFB museum. > There is an SR71 Blackbird on display at the Air Force Armament Museum at Eglin Air Force Base, Pensacola FL. (actually Fort Walton/Crestview area) Lots of other goodies including missiles, "gatling" type guns, a 12000 lb "Tall Boy" bomb and the casing for "Fat Boy" Well worth a visit if you are ever in the Florida Panhandle Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Is Millink kweston From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 02 Oct 1998 12:57:24 GMT -------- Big Bad Wolf wrote: > Hello > Can helping my pls Im gotink millink big whavt ist gray und > lectric 7 KW motro being.Vhast its max revloutions beink vith ths tip > millink whist caste iron beink. > Can carbide stronger beink, vhat speed being. > With lath round steel an bras long round along color. Should tap M12 > Am use understandink me beink. sory my elgland ist not goot. First time > metal verkink > > Thks > > Ivor Achtung! Das machin nicht is fur gerfingerpoken!Oder rubbernechin touristen gervatchen!Und a hans, neez, und boompsadaisy to you too Ivor! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: mill/drill From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 02 Oct 1998 13:24:01 GMT -------- Dick Brewster wrote: > With one large entrance to the shop at loading dock height. > > -- > Dick Brewster > > Watch that first step...Its a Doozie!! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Grinding spindle From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 02 Oct 1998 13:50:25 GMT -------- I am looking for a successful design for a small grinding spindle. Ideally about 1 1/2" o/d x 6" long, suitable for up to 30,000 rev/min and with collet chuck. Any ideas? Much appreciated. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: The only advantage of metric! From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 02 Oct 1998 14:44:08 GMT -------- IMHO the ONLY advantage of metric is that you can tell your date that 150mm is equivalent to about 10 inches. By the time she finds out..it's too late!! 8^) Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Grinding spindle From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 02 Oct 1998 18:13:44 GMT -------- Randy O'Brian wrote: > Metal Lathe Accessories( advertises in HSM) has a kit for a tool post > grinder which is about the same size. The internal grinding spindle uses > double angle collets. Top speed is 30,000 rpm. I built the kit, but > modified the bearing arrangement somewhat since I didn't agree with the > original design. It works well and could be modified fairly easily to meet > some special need. > > Randy > Randy, Thanks for the imput. How and why did you modifiy the bearing arrangement? All I need is the spec on the bearings and a sketch of the pre-load arrangement. This will be a "cartridge" type spindle..machined from solid cast iron bar stock. The mounting, motor, and gards I will fabricate. Does any one have a set of drawings for this or the Quorn spindle that I can scrounge a copy of? Costs will be covered of course. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking,alt.machines.cnc Subject: Re: Power req for threading machine From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 02 Oct 1998 18:17:21 GMT -------- Hoyt McKagen wrote: > Am helping a guy with an unusual stepper-driven threading machine, to be > dedicated to a given product. He has decided to use a gear-head stepper > and thinks he can thread up to 3/8-24 in 304 stainless rod with 200 oz/in > output to the die. I think if he could use that little torque, an > ordinary NEMA #34 frame 450 oz/in stepper could be used, but intuitively > I don't think that is powerful enough. In order to size this guy's system > for him, can anyone give me a solid idea what torque is going to be > needed at the die? > > Many thanks and best wishes, > > Hoyt > Too many variables..die sharpness and lubrication etc.. Suck it and see...put a torque wrench on a sample..then you will be sure. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: The only advantage of metric! From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 03 Oct 1998 17:11:03 GMT -------- plastic wrote: > Robert Bastow wrote: > > >IMHO the ONLY advantage of metric is that you can tell your date that > >150mm is equivalent to about 10 inches. > > > >By the time she finds out..it's too late!! 8^) > > > >Robert Bastow > > > If you did have 250 MM your date would be screaming in pain. Yeah..but not PAIN!! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Need ideas for removing tank From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 03 Oct 1998 17:25:44 GMT -------- Howard Eberly wrote: > I have a tank in my basement that was lowered in with a crane after the > basement was poured. (snip), and I don't have a clue as to how I can > get this monster out of the basement. (snip) It has to be taken out in > sections, > and the asphalt/tar coating makes me think burning would not be a good > idea. If the rivets are round, raised heads, chop them off with a club hammer and cold chisel then punch the rivet out. An air hammer would be an asset. If they are flathead rivets you will need to drill them out. Good luck, I don't envy you the job...but think of all the new tackle you can put in that space! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Bending of Non-Circular Tubing? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 03 Oct 1998 17:49:28 GMT -------- Akilli wrote: > Greetings, > Is there a method of bending tubing of polygonal cross section, > without the buckling/crimping at the bend, or does the geometry just make this > impossible? > Much Obliged, > Ethan Gross Commercially this would be done by filling the tube with lead or similar material. The bend would be done on a "Stretch Bender"...a machine which stretches the tube as it is bent. Stretching puts all the material above the neutral axis and eliminates kinking. (In normal bending the neutral axis is at or close to the centerline. Material above the NA is stretched and does not normally kink. Material below the NA is compressed and will kink.) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: The only advantage of metric! From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 03 Oct 1998 17:58:09 GMT -------- PLAlbrecht wrote: > >> If you did have 250 MM your date would be screaming in pain. > > > > Yeah..but not PAIN!! > > If there were a perceived problem, you could install a travel stop, like on a > lathe bed. Clamp firmly with setscrews. > > Pete ROTFLOL!!! OUCH!!....That would bring tears to a glass eye. Reminds me of the kid who went to buy his first pack of condoms. "Thank you sir." says the shop assistant, "that will be $2.00 including tax" " never mind the tacks" says the kid "I'll tie them on!" Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re:Kit Machines From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 03 Oct 1998 18:25:00 GMT -------- greybeard wrote: > If it was a "kit" > machine I could agree Theres a thought for an enterprising Importer. I would love to get my hands on a set of finish machined castings and do all the detail finishing, fitting and assembly. You could "mix and match" your own custom machine and choose the level of sophistication you build in. Probably a pie in the sky dream. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Surface Grinder lead screw replacement From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 04 Oct 1998 00:18:39 GMT -------- Gunner wrote: > Thanks everyone for your information.! I was figuring on cutting off > the old leadscrew just below the bearing surface, faceing and then > boring a hole. Then turning a matching stub on the end of the new lead > screw, inserting it into the hole and then heliarcing them togather, > then grinding down the weld. Is this a good way to proceed? Overkill and risks warpage. Use loctite permanent..it will hold! > The delta > has a odd shaped cast iron casting with the nut threads, threaded id. > I was figuring on boring it out, and making a bronze or oilite sleeve > to fit inside the bore with the threads single pointed inside the > sleeve. Silver solder should hold it into the casting? Don't use Oilite...way too soft. Use hard bronze or cast iron is even better. Make the bush a slide fit and use loctite. OBTW never try to solder Oilite (a) it won't stick (b) you will drive out most of the oil. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Calling Tom Hammond From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 04 Oct 1998 01:15:44 GMT -------- Tom I got your email and the offer is much appreciated However your return email address didn't work for me. Can you contact me off list at tubal_cain@hotmail.com Thanks Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Jimmy Airs a Junkyard Dog TV Plug. From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 04 Oct 1998 04:29:37 GMT -------- PLAlbrecht wrote: > Geez, now I'm making people snarf their herb tea? We must be getting old. I can > remember when it was still chocolate milk back at dear old Lane Tech... Good > joke was chocolate milk out of both nostrils... Timing is everything....With the right joke or repartee and perfect timing, you can get beer coming down nostrils AND out of both ears!! Robert Bastow Blessed with perfect pitch and perfect timing. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Reverse Polish Notation From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 04 Oct 1998 04:34:15 GMT -------- Where does this term originate and what precisely does it mean Sounds more like a sexual aberration than a mathematical term. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Calling Tom Hammond..again..sorry list. From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 04 Oct 1998 18:21:49 GMT -------- Sorry listers, but Tom and I seem to have a major communication problem. Tom I got your last message and sent a (long) reply Mailer demon bounced it right back. Address I am using is: thamm10502@aol.com What am I doing wrong? Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What is "Blanchard grinding?" From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 05 Oct 1998 15:50:24 GMT -------- Rev Chuck wrote: > If I understand correctly, it's sort of a reversed lathe where the > cutter spins and you move the workpiece by hand. A copying machine > essentially, with the cutter linked to a pattern follower. Originally > used to mass produce gunstocks for the U.S. Army. A familiar > variant is the key duplicating machine at your local hardware store. > Sorry Chuck, what you describe is a duplicating lathe A blanchard grinder is a horizontal magnetic table,(usually rotating but there are reciprocating models) The grinding wheels are segments, some bigger than house bricks mounted on a vertical spindle with provision for fine feed. Used for rough and finish grinding of plate material which finihes up with characteristic swirl grinding marks. A common example would be the top of most table saws. In the hands of an EXPERT it can produce work within a half thou or so of flat. However, for most purposes a flatness limit of plus or minus a couple of thousandths is expected and acceptable. The largest I ever saw had a 120" dia table, the smallest was 12" x 6" (cute..wish I had one.) In that case the table was fixed and the vertical spindle grinding head was swung by hand in an arc. This would make an interesting, useful, and fairly straight forward project, for the home shop...I'm gonna build one!! My initial thought would be to use the base and column from a bench drill press Once assembled the machine would generate its own accuracy with a finish pass over the base before mounting the magnetic chuck. Blanch.grinding experts..... Are 10" to 12" dia wheels available? Would a 1 1/2 hp - 3450 rev/min 220v single phase motor have enough oomph for such a machine? Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Opinions on Webb vertical mill? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 05 Oct 1998 16:09:49 GMT -------- PLAlbrecht wrote: > >They were rather poorly finished and not as smooth as a B'port but > >then a B'port is not much of a mill either, though they are good drill > >presses. > > Oooh... zinger.... > > What mills would you put ahead of BP then? Deckel? the Japanese? What? I'm > willing to change my jones list... > > Pete I would put the small Deckel WAY ahead of the Bridgeport, or any of its clones, in terms of quality, versatility, accuracy and, oh yes..price and resale value. Do-All, in Canada, built a better version of the BP. They used square edge ways that were more resistant to wear. Kondia and several other makers build a larger version of the BP that is more rigid and powerful. IMHO the Bridgeport is now way overpriced. Several clones are available that are as well or better built and half the price. They use castings from the same Asian sources as BP. I would not hesitate to buy one after completing my own "Due Diligence" I would not buy ANY machine tool, new or used on a "sight unseen" basis. For the home shop my personal preference is for a horizontal mill with vertical head attachment. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Moore and Wright measuring instruments From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 05 Oct 1998 16:58:10 GMT -------- Clive Warren wrote: > I have been told that a number of messages have been posted in this group > requesting information on Moore & Wright micrometers and other products. > > I am pleased to advise that Moore & Wright are able to respond directly to > all enquiries via e-mail. Their address is: info@moore-and-wright.com > > Clive Warren > General Sales Manager > Moore & Wright, Sheffield, UK. I hope Mr Warren will post the name of their US distributor. I would like to be able to purchase their products here..if the price is not too silly! As an ex-patriot English tool and die maker (who settled in the US twenty-two years ago) I have extensive experience of Moore and Wright tools and rate them right up there with Starrett for quality. I still have the M&W 0-1" Micrometer I bought with my first week's wages as an apprentice. It is used almost daily and has never failed to pass calibration. I have no connection with M&W except as a very satisfied user (who was born in Sheffield!!!) Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Reverse Polish Notation From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 05 Oct 1998 17:37:15 GMT -------- Stan Stelmach wrote: > Go to Dr. Math and check it for your math question. > BTW, where to get help on the second subject you mention, I don't know. > Stan Stelmach > > Robert Bastow wrote i > > Where does this term originate and what precisely does it mean > > > > Sounds more like a sexual aberration than a mathematical term. > The group has already answered my first question. The very first calculator I purchased, (a Casio I recall) worked on the RPN principle. I was familiar with it and liked it very much. I had a long term curiosity about the ORIGIN of the term which I had heard so many times. I just wasn't sure whether this was a "proper" title for it or a derogatory term, as in "French Automobile Styling" or "Jap Scrap". ;^) (Note to Self....Self, put on Nomex Knickers and find secure hiding place!!) So far as my second question: I have other sources for sexual aberrations of which I am an avid collector and experienced practitioner. It is the only thing I would rather be doing than cutting metal. ( Usually anyhow.....) However I always welcome constructive advice on how to get the best out of them!! 8^) 8^) 8^) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Copper Question From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 05 Oct 1998 17:43:26 GMT -------- GlassFishy wrote: > Hi! > > > Here's what I'm trying to make and some questions I have. I am wanting to make > a Range Hood Cover. I plan to make it out of wood and cover it with Copper > sheeting (in some sort of design or piecework.) Can the copper sheeting be held > together in the same manner as plumbing pipes with solder or is there a > different process? I've also seen some copper art projects with like a lacquer > look on them. Does this keep them from tarnishing? I would advise against a wooden lining simply on the grounds of fire risk. Properly designed and constructed a solid copper hood would not need a lining. Soft solder will hold it together quite adequately but overrun would be unsightly and difficult to remove. If I were to make something similar I would opt for nice straight rows of polished copper rivets. For what it is worth 8^) Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Decorative ironwork From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 05 Oct 1998 17:48:21 GMT -------- A Spammer wrote: > G***** F**** consists of a highly qualified team of professionnals : > blacksmiths, polishers, patinaters, varnishers, producing components in forged > iron and bronze. It’s also has designers who constantly draw and innovate with > respect to the traditions. > > G***** F**** appears on any five continents !!! > So does this group mate! But we don't like spammers ! Sod off!! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Bison 5-C collet chuck From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 05 Oct 1998 17:58:37 GMT -------- Stan Stocker wrote: > Topless Pig wrote: > > > > Does anyone have any opinions good or bad about a Bison 5-C collet > > chuck? If 250 is too steep, consider making one yourself. If you decide to build a collet chuck you might want to consider ustilising the excellent Jacobs "Rubberflex" collets. They are very accurate, grip mor securely and have a wider tolerance range than standard spring steel collets. Jacobs Chuck Co have a web page which your search engine will find. Naught but a satisfied user. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Moore and Wright measuring instruments From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 05 Oct 1998 18:40:51 GMT -------- Brian Evans wrote: > When last in Jolly Old, I went to a flea market and picked up a complete, in the > original box, still had the packing slip Moore and Wright inside Mic set. 2" to > about 10" with interchangeable extensions. Paid about 15 pounds (maybe $25 US). > Now I need to find a depth mic with all the extensions, and I'll be all set! Yer lucky sod! Next time I'm over I intend to raid Tony Griffiths establishment. I always fancied one of those cute little instrument makers mill. How about a group discount Tony? BTW does anyone know if there are import duties on used equipment coming into the US? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re:Expletives to be deleted From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 05 Oct 1998 18:57:05 GMT -------- > MERDE ?? > > Is this French for Bullshit ?? > > Regards, > > John Stevenson at > No it is french for Shit..as in this thread!! 8^) "Zut...merde alors!"......a favourite french expletive does not translate! Nor does the French Canadian "Tabernac!" Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: British Cars From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 05 Oct 1998 19:26:56 GMT -------- Carl Byrns wrote: > True enough, but English cars in general have had a rotten reputation > for quite sometime. If you've ever dealt British cars, it soon becomes > impossible to say "Lucas" or "SU" without bursting into tears or > laughter, depending on which side of the repair bill you're on. It was the Scottish soldier that won the British Empire ....And Lucas Electrics (Prince of Darkness) that lost it! The best thing ever to happen to Jaguar was their purchase by Ford. First thing they did was chuck Lucas out and put in Bosch electrics and the excellent Ford Q1 program. My (third) XJ12 is as smooth, quick and reliable as you could wish for in any car. Not that that is a major consideration as it is covered bumper to bumper by factory/dealer extended warranty for as long as I own it. It even covers routine sevices, oilchanges and windshield wiper blades! Definitely a "keeper" My delight with this car is in sad contrast to my buddy who has a Mercedes 600SLC (V12) and it spends (literally) more time in the shop than on the road. If you think Jags are expensive, try maintaining a Benz!! The BMW 750 V12 is the worst dog of the bunch! They sell for cheap round here. I was an avid fan of the earlier Triumphs..had at least one example of every model from the original TR rumble seated roadster, up to three TR6's The UK version of the TR6 was a flying brick on wheels with fuel injection (albeit Lucas)..not the anemic carburetted "federalised" version sold here. If anything the power exceeded the capabilities of the chassis and they could be very hairy to drive in wet weather. Lotsa fun though! The TR7 [ 8^( ] was one of the many reasons why I left the country! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What is "Blanchard grinding?" From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 05 Oct 1998 20:52:13 GMT -------- David Berryhill wrote: > > > I've thought the same thing for some time but wouldn't it be easier to have > a vertical grinding wheel like a surface grinder instead of a horizontal > grinding wheel? At least I think it would be easier to true the wheel since > it would only be necessary to dress the edge of the grinding wheel instead > of the face. > > What do you guys think? > Very much more complicated Dave. On a Horizontal spindle (a regular surface grinder) you need table travel back and forth on VERY accurate ways. You need Y axis adjustment (ditto) and Z axis too. All to be protected from grit if you ever get it built. Not a project for the average HSM On the other hand the small blanch type only needs fine adjustment in the z axis (the head up and down the column) traverse over the fixed table is by swinging about the round column. All moving parts are out of the way of most grit and easily protected. The wheel is a cup wheel that is easily dressed by swinging over a diamond held on the magnetic chuck. The wheel axis is tilted VERY slightly from true vertical to prevent contact on two arcs. There was, maybe still is, a kit of parts available in the UK for a similar grinder designed IIRC, by Edgar Westbury or Arnold Throp. This is well within the capabilities of many HSMs...Even me! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: egg launcher: Max egg rpm? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 05 Oct 1998 20:58:42 GMT -------- Ted Edwards wrote: > James J Wygralak wrote: > > > the 2 lb bird at 500 MPH has over 22,000 joules of kinetic energy. > > The 500 lb bird at 2 mph only has about 90 joules > > Yet both have the same momentum. Which counts? Sounds like the > perenial debate over hunting arrows - heavy and slow or light and fast > from a bow with given stored energy. > > Ted B***S***. Stop and think! Which would you rather be hit by? The five hundred pound bird would likely bowl you over. The five hundred mph bird would likely vaporise you!!! Robert Bastow ======== To: STJ28 Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Another Thread Question: PLEASE HELP From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 06 Oct 1998 08:36:11 GMT -------- Sounds like a fundamental design problem. If you have to have a particular material in contact with the product and that material will not perform needed functions then you need to separate the functions. Choose materials that will do the adjustment function, like carbon steel and bronze and arrange a telescopic shield of the required grade of SS. alternatively move the adjustment "out of harms way" The initial cost will be repayed many times over. Anything else is stretching the envelope of compromise and that NEVER pays off long term. If your designers can't come up with an answer I am available for $2000 per deum plus first class travel and living expenses on a "no tickee..no laundree" contract basis. ( I've been around the Pharmaceutical Industry long enough to know that that is PEANUTS to youse guys!!!) 8^) Robert Bastow Consultant designer (Really!...Guess who put Birth Control pills in daily dial packs??) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Make Woodburning Stove? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 06 Oct 1998 08:42:46 GMT -------- Gary Hansen wrote: > I'd like to build a woodburning stove for my own use. I have zero > experience with wood stoves but I have (and know what to do with) a good > wire welder and a plasma torch. Northern Hydraulic, among others, sells > some steel stoves made of 11 to 13 gauge rolled steel. I had in mind > using 3/16 to 1/4" material for longer life...... Get a four foot length of three foot diameter bar. Chuck in suitable lathe........8^) Robert Bastow Who is only half kidding!! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Why turn rotors? WAS Not a great weekend From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 06 Oct 1998 09:29:25 GMT -------- Carl Byrns wrote: > What can I say? You chaps also drink warm beer and eat kidney pie! Not > to mention you all drive on the wrong side of road. > Urban Myths.... English beer is served just 3 degrees warmer than US bee....shit! English beer is full flavored and designed to be quaffed in large quantities from wide mouth glasses..not sipped pansy style from long necked bottles!! Find an English or Irish Pub (the fastest growing segment in the bar business) and try it. It will knock you flat on your ass the first few times...but I'll guarantee you come back for more. ( Newcastle Brown Ale is called "Oil of Olay"....four pints makes every woman look beautiful!!!!) The correct name is "Steak and Kidney Pie"....with the emphasis on STEAK. The kidney is there in miniscule quantities to add delicious flavor. If you find a piece of kidney in a steak and kidney pud..it hasn't be made right. Check out a Ford "Fliver" most of them were Right hand drive. The US drove on the left in the days of Horses and the early days of Horseless carriages. No-one seems quite sure as to when and why the US went "cack-handed" In terms of population the majority of people in the world drive on the left. I love the Good 'Ole US of A...I CHOSE to live here twenty-three years ago and married a Southern Belle from Olde Alabamie. I do think though, it is time that WE Americans woke up to the fact that there is a whole different world out there and stopped being so bloody PAROCHIAL!!! All flames to be written on $100.00 bills and forwarded by express mail. PS I love fried okra...But I REALLY love Liver and Onions FWIW 8^) Robert Bastow Proud Brit, Proud Yank. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Another What Is It ?? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 06 Oct 1998 09:34:30 GMT -------- John Stevenson wrote: > Amongst a job lot of gear I have a Starrett 'Gauge ?' > It is tapered like a sine bar with a sliding stepped piece with two rollers screwed > onto the sliding stepped piece > I thought it might be an adjustable packing block but the clamp arrangement is not > strong enough. > The Starrett part number is 246 [ could be 240 but I don't think so ] > Its obviously some form of level as it has a small bubble level in the base. > > Regards, > > John Stevenson at > > engineers@btinternet.com > > Nottingham, England. It is a Planer gauge..used originally to set the height of planer and shaper tools. Set with a micrometer..it is adjustable from 1/4" to six inches (using the cylindrical extensions) Useful bit 'o kit if you explore its possibilities. Cheers Robert Bastow..who has one too. ======== To: Denis Boboritsky Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: need From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 06 Oct 1998 09:43:19 GMT -------- A Spammer wrote: > We need purchasers/buyers/ of iron pipes,U-beams,I-beams, > construction rods etc. Yeah...so do we! Go sit on yours. Sheesh..these Eastern European, ex Commies have a LOT to learn about marketing in the Free Enterprise System. Robert Bastow Who is just right of Attilla the Hun ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Why turn rotors? WAS Not a great weekend From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 06 Oct 1998 09:51:28 GMT -------- PLAlbrecht wrote: Things like this are one reason people lease cars. If it's really, truly bad, maybe you still have some recourse (not sure about that, but if the thing is truly a lemon, seems you can let them have it back...) Pete Nope! A vehicle lease is a cast iron contract. The lessor takes no responsibility for "fitness for purpose" Your contract is likely sold within hours of you signing it, to a finance/collection outfit who will shit all over you and your credit rating if you don't pay up. No matter what the reason! Been there..done that...couldn't afford the tee-shirt! 8^( Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Jimmy Airs a Junkyard Dog TV Plug. From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 06 Oct 1998 09:55:15 GMT -------- Peter Drumm wrote: > > > If you like driving a 8000lb boat that gets 4 MPG, then it's good, > otherwise... > > Jeez.... That makes my XJ12 an Econo-cruiser!! Robert Bastow Ecologically aware! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: went to Heaven today, well, almost From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 06 Oct 1998 10:02:08 GMT -------- Martin H. Eastburn wrote: > My property moved > 7 feet NW during the last big one. I can only hope the next real > big one is long after I migrate back to the Texas hill country. > > Martin > Sit tight Martin, the next big one may well move you AND your house back to Texas. Robert Bastow Who prefers hurricanes and tornados to either snow or earthquakes. I live near Kennesaw GA where every household is REQUIRED to have a gun. We don't have gangs around hereabouts! 8^) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Sheldon lathe From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 06 Oct 1998 10:57:31 GMT -------- > . I have no idea how much > movement is too much. On my machine the chuck moves about .125 inch--I > suspect that's about .124 inch too much. > > Thanks! Gmasterman@aol.com > > > ROTFLOL 8^) 8^) 8^) I'll give this group its due....Its a mile a minute comedy routine. Thanks for the chuckle. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Expletives to be deleted From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 06 Oct 1998 12:05:59 GMT -------- Steve Rayner wrote: > Robert Bastow (nil_carborundum@hotmail.com) wrote: > > : "Zut...merde alors!"......a favourite french expletive does not > : translate! > : Nor does the French Canadian "Tabernac!" > > : Robert Bastow > > Rubbish! Tabernac means tabernacle, or church. French Canadian is old > French as used in the 1700s, mixed with a lot of slang. I know what it _means_as well as I know what "Zut..Merde, alors!" translates to literally. I lived for three years in France and twelve years in Canada and I speak fluent French. However the literal translation of "tabernac" to tabernacle means nothing to anyone but a French-Canadian who would expect the wrath of his priest for taking the name of the Lord's HOUSE in vain. (fer chrissakes) For someone to stand in the middle of the street in New York, London or even Paris and shout "CHURCH" at the passing traffic might get him taken into protective custody, poor sod....but not arrested for public profanity. On the other hand a French or F-C Priest, wouldn't turn a hair if you said "Sanguine' " in his presence. The word "Bloody" does not translate. There are parallels in the English speaking world. "English" English is Queens English of the twentieth century. American English is Kings English, or, as you so aptly put it...Old English of the seventeenth century, mixed with a lot of slang!! Nothing wrong with that but we are two peoples "separated by a common language". A prime example is the usage here in "Polite Company", Network TV, Sears advertisments and CNN, of the Old English word "Bugger" which is used here in the connotation of broken or bent. Particularly of threads or the flats of nuts, bolts etc. It seems that people do not use or view it as a pretty naughty expletive as it is in England, nor do they seem to make the connection between it and the crime of Buggery...Corn-holing to you.....particularly of little boys!! If my mother, or teachers, had heard me say "Bugger" I would have been thrashed within an inch of my life. But if I were to tell her that the girl next door had asked me to stop by in the morning and "Knock her up!!" Mother wouldn't have batted an eyelid, knowing that I had simple been asked to make sure the lady didn't oversleep. Try saying it to Your Mother, Wife or Significant Other!!! Yeah! Right! 8^( I rest my case 8^) Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: (no subject) From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 06 Oct 1998 12:12:05 GMT -------- Michael P. Henry wrote: > Thanks Glen. There don't seem to be any holes in the two countershaft > bushings for oil to flow through. At least I can't see any while looking > inside the bushings. They appear in decent shape. I'm wondering if oil is > supposed to diffuse from the oilers through the bushings to the shaft. If the bushings are "Oilite" (porous, sintered bronze) that is exactly what is supposed to happen. It is not "Good Practice" to drill oil holes through that type of bushing. Cheers, Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Expletives to be deleted From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 07 Oct 1998 01:41:51 GMT -------- Alden Hackmann wrote: > ">The other night on a British comedy TV show I'm surprised they let that onto > the air. It means exactly what you > think it means ;-) For British TV that is VERY mild...Childrens Hour stuff! We don't get the good stuff here...just watered down , faint facsimilies Classic example was "Sandford and Son" a barely recognisable,pablum version of the original BBC series "Steptoe and Son" which though aired in the sixties would probably carry warnings on late night pay tv here in the US today. The forerunner of "All in the Family" was "Fings ain't what they Use'ter Be" . "Archie Bunker" wouldn't have lasted two minutes in the ring with "Alf Garnett" Alf wrote the book on bigotry and intolerance and would have regarded Archie as a namby pamby, leftwing , panty waist, pinko commie, grammar school boy and would have dealt with him as such in thirty seconds flat. I doubt that "Fings" would be allowed into this country even now. It probably contravenes every hate and tree hugging law there is!! But, Dear Lord, they were FUNNY and would have you on the floor in stitches. The absoluteness of the hatred and bigotry was such that it created an awareness and distaste for the real thing in Britain . Bunker, on the other hand, was so watered down that it did the opposite and created the monster it failed to parody. People looked up to him, and thought if it was good enough for Archie Bunker, it was good enough for them. A ghastly result of unwritten and unspoken censorship!! Just my honest opinion. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Expletives to be deleted From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 07 Oct 1998 01:55:09 GMT -------- Mike Graham wrote: > Rogering is sex the 'normal' way. > > "There once was a man from Perdue > Who found he had nothing to do, > So he took out a carrot > And rogered his parrot > And sent the result to the zoo." > It never ceases to amaze me what some people consider "normal" sex . Still Mike is from the hinterlands of "Canerderr" Eh? Rogering parrots is an art form there. Hey Mike, tell everyone why they call it "duck" tape in Canada... You wrap it round your pet duck so it doesn't explode when you "Roger" it!! Sorry Mike...but you asked for that one. I will atone. 8^) Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: British Cars From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 07 Oct 1998 02:28:58 GMT -------- John Stevenson wrote: > If only we had discovered North Sea oil a few years earlier the british Motorcycle > Industry would not have died. That way we could have kept up with the leaks. > I once had an early "A" frame supension, Lotus Cortina MKI. A pretty unique car in that the first owner worked for Cosworths in Nuneaton ( Builders of the Ford Cosworth Formula I engine) and this was his Sprint car!! Turned out it Had an almost full race formula III engine with forged ,stroked and nitrided crank, overbore Hepworth forged "slipper"pistons, 5 speed ZF rear transaxle, "On/Off" Racing clutch that DID give me a hernia. Borrani wire wheels and some quite special tires from Goodyear.. Had four Weber 45DCOE carbureters with trumpets like a colliery band. It got 8 mpg steady..two if you pushed it The thing was a screamer...12000 rpm in top gear!! Fell "off the cam" at five grand and would stall out on you at 4500 The brute taught me how to REALLY drive and we had a lot of fun together. For all that it was immaculately turned out. Unusual for a Lotus Cortina which were invariably white with a light green flash, this one was in British Racing Green with a light grey flash. Grey painted wire wheels. Very striking..what a bird puller!!! I was tweny four and VERY single at the time!! ;^) It had a lot of vices, oil consumption of a quart of that lovely green Duckhams per fifty miles. Not that it burned oil..It just slung it out of every joint and gasket that Ford, Cosworths and Colin Chapman ever dreamed off. That's when I realised that oil was a dielectric..Damned thing wouldn't run unless the plugs were immersed in green gold. For all that..It is one of the few cars I have owned that I wish I had now. I hope it survived..It would be worth a Kings Ransom today. Sentimentally yours, Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Expletive to be deleted From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 07 Oct 1998 02:53:18 GMT -------- Carl Byrns wrote: > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > English beer is served just 3 degrees warmer than US bee....shit! > Not around here ( Upstate NY). We tend to like our brew damn near frozen > in the summer and slightly warmer in the winter. I lived in Canada and Friday/Saturday Nights the border crossings were jammed both ways.Yanks heading to Canada for the stronger beer (used to knock 'em on their asses) and the strip clubs in Niagara and Windsor Ontario. Canucks heading south to buy Canadian beer cheaper in the US than Canada, to fill up with cheap gas and to cruise the easy pickins among all the delectable but neglected Buffalo Gals!! New York Beer was a tragedy..you had to freeze it down to hide the taste. If it got five degrees above absolute zero it would gag a maggot!! > > > > > There's a couple of bars around here serving English beers and ales. My > favorites are Samuel Smiths Nut Brown Ale and Tadcaster. Good stuff. Better than Genessee huh! > We also have several 'microbreweries' that produce beers that are > excellent by any standard. And, of course, Samuel Adams Boston Lager is > world-class. You gotta be shittin' me..by who's reckoning...The Delhi Llama? > > > Still... the thought of eating any part of an animals urinary tract > gives me the willies. You never tried Tripe and Onions? Very Tasty. Just don't ask!! Just as when I lived in Oklahoma (Enid) I didn't ask about the wonderful "Prairie Oyster" Like Tripe and sheeps eyeballs (yup) you just chow down and swallow What a wonderful world we share. 8^) Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Why turn rotors? WAS Not a great weekend From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 07 Oct 1998 03:01:16 GMT -------- plastic wrote: > That fuel costs far to much in England. Yeah. But you don't have to drive half a day to get anywhere. My wife commutes to work, daily, further than most English people drive on an annual vacation Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: alt.machines.cnc,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Why are drill points commonly 118 deg. ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 07 Oct 1998 03:52:47 GMT -------- > > > Why are drill points commonly 118 deg. ? > > > Nobody got the right answer..which is quite simple and straight forward. The first element of design in a twist drill is the helix angle, it is what determines the cutting angle which is the equivalent of top rake on a lathe tool. Drills for soft or "stringy" material are designed with a fast helix. Drills for friable materials like Brass and Cast Iron are designed with a low or zero helix (straight flute) The vast majority of drills, including Jobbers drill are expected to be all rounders but most of the holes will be in Mild Steel I forget off hand what the exact helix angle is for a Mild Steel / general purpose/Jobbers drill. but it is the one we are all familiar with. Which brings us to the point angle. Have you ever noticed what happens if you grind a flatter point angle..all the way through to a flat bottoming drill? The flatter the included angle THE MORE CONCAVE BECOMES THE CUTTING EDGE AND THE MORE ACUTE AND FRAGILE BECOME THE OUTER LIPS. Now go the other way, grinding a more and more acute point. In this direction the lips becom even more rapidly curved in a convex direction and one very quickly reaches a point where the cutting edge is a spiral and is aproaching zero rake. The reason why a point angle of 118 deg is chosen for a "Standard" jobber type drill for mild steel is simply that at that angle the cutting edge is neither concave nor convex IT IS DEAD STRAIGHT. and the cutting angle and cutting edge thickness are optimised and constant. The curved inner surface of the flute is designed to produce this optimisation at exactly 118 degrees So now you know. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Why turn rotors? WAS Not a great weekend From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 07 Oct 1998 04:31:18 GMT -------- plastic wrote: > I did have a series 2 Jaguar V12 and it was a dog, then I got a series > 3 and it was 100% reliable. All the Jags were imported. God they were > beautiful to drive. Yeah they kinda spoil you for anything else thats on the road. My experience mirrors yours 1st was a Series II XJCV12 2 door piilarless coupe. A dog but smooooooth wish I had it now ..they are highly sought after. 2nd was a Series III XJV12 1989..the very last of the series and a very reliable and refined car I did 189000 miles in it with nothing but routine maintenance. Plugs were changed at 90,000 averaged 18 mpg around town and 23 on a run. 22 pints of oil for an oil change. (I didn't say cheap) 3rd 1995 XJV12 6 liter and the last of the breed. Absolutely superlative vehicle..cannot fault it. Will go faster from 60 to 120 than most "sports cars" can get 0-60 Total delight to drive, docile,silent and smooth. But that pussy cat can growl when you need it. Finished in Black Cherry...this is a Keeper. Interestingly, Insurance cost is very reasonable, My Agent told me that in terms of vehicle/miles/fatalities they are the safest car on the road in N America with not a single recorded fatality in an XJV12!! The reasons are..not many about. As I recall mine was one of only 42 sold in 96 and the only Jaguar on the whole continent painted this color! Age and experience of drivers. The few young people that can afford them want something flashier. The safety of superb handling acceleration ad stopping power can get you out of situations where lesser cars would have a major accident. Last but by no means least..they are built like a tank. and at something approaching 5000 pounds would plow straight through most cars (and a lot of trucks) without noticeable deceleration!! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: British Cars From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 07 Oct 1998 05:07:07 GMT -------- Ron Moore wrote: > Silly question, I'm sure, but how did it have 4 dual throat webers on a 4 cyl engine? Just > curoius. > Respectfully, > Ron Moore > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > .. Had four Weber > > 45DCOE carbureters with trumpets like a colliery band. It got 8 mpg steady..two if you > > pushed it ......... > > You are correct......brain fart......two twinchokes = four monster chokes (for an 1860cc engine!!) Look down the trumpet and blip the throttle, it was, I swear, like turning on a bathroom faucet. I only did that one time! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Expletive to be deleted From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 07 Oct 1998 06:11:26 GMT -------- Carl Byrns wrote: > Buffalo? You went to Buffalo to pick women? I knew things were bad in > Canada, but not that bad! I didn't say _I_ did, just half the male population of southern ontarioLooking for an American Wife!!We used to say a Canadian is someone who can't get a Green Card!! Speaking of Canadian women. This American guy is talking to a friend in a bar and he says, " I can't stand Canadians, they are all either whores or hockey players" There is a tap on his shoulder and he turns to look up,and up, into the eyes of the biggest meanest looking SOB he had ever set eyes on. 'I heard what you said about Canadians" says the big guy. "I'll have you know, my wife is from Canada" "Oh!" says the little guy, "What position does she play?" > Now, now. Genny Cream Ale is an ideal winter/summer coolant :-) Also > good for occasional irregularity. Real good, in fact. I guess if I were real hot I might pour it on my head too I know about its purging effects...thats why I don't drink it. > Metalworking content: I cook on cast iron. I just converted a cast iron sauce pan into a grinding wheel guard Ain't Life great? Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Why turn rotors? WAS Not a great weekend From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 07 Oct 1998 17:20:12 GMT -------- Fitch R. Williams wrote: > My Dad had an XK140 fixed head coupe followed by a XK150 Drop Head Coupe back in > the lathe 1950s. I recall that it took quite a slug of oil. the engine and > drive train were near perfection except that the synchromesh on the transmission > wasn't particularely wonderful, and it had a really really long throw from first > to second. The rest of the car was a continual PITA in Michigan. Doors would > freeze shut at night, disc brakes on the 150 were totally allergic to the > chloride used on the roads and pads were major expensive. Dad loved both of > them but only drove the 140 45K miles and the 150 about a 50K before selling > them. > > do they still have the same inline DOHC six with the nice sounding chain drive > cams? Nobody ever bought a Jaguar just for transportation! The old DOHC Six was replaced by SOHC six in, I believe, 1997. That, and the V12 have been replaced by a V8 in the last couple of years Very nice engine but I will miss the turbine-like smoothness of the V12. However, they do have a supercharged version of the V8 in the XJR. I test drove one. The handling is superb and the performance is shattering. It's on order!! My wife wants the XJV12. Robert Bastow JagNut! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Chicken and egg From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 07 Oct 1998 17:26:17 GMT -------- Fitch R. Williams wrote: > Sure has, we should be discussing how to get the 500mph chicken to lay an egg > with proper spin! > > Fitch > In So. Cal. > Egg and chicken are making love. Suddenly the egg stops, rolls off and lights a cigarette. Chicken says, " I guess that answers_that_question!" Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How to deburr narrow slot in tube From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 07 Oct 1998 19:45:17 GMT -------- PLAlbrecht wrote: > I'm cutting 1/32 wide slots in 1/4 OD thinwall aluminum tubing, 7/32 ID. > Anybody have any good ideas on how to deburr the underside of these slots? I > > > Is there a dedicated deburring tool for this sort of job? I looked through > pages of deburring tooks in MSC and didn't find anything that looked suitable. > > Pete Make a dedicated scraper. Use 3/16 drill rod, square the end, . mill a flat 60 thou deep starting 1/16 back from the end.(this will leave a stiffer shank than simply turning it down) Harden the end and temper to a medium straw. sharpen the other end and bang on a handle of your choice, Hone the buisness end and use with a push or pull actin or both, according to preference. Tip: If you ever need to deburr a drilled hole internally, say after countersinking. Use the original size drill in a pin chuck and PUSH it straight in and out--do not twist it! 8^) Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Sheldon lathe problem From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 07 Oct 1998 21:42:30 GMT -------- Brad Heuver wrote: > >I have a 10" Sheldon [pre war].With the halfnuts engaged I get .018" end > >play of the apron. Most often the wear in a leadscrew is at the headstock end, for obvious reasons. A quick and inexpensive fix is to swap the leadscrew end for end and bring the little used tailstock end to the much used headstock end. Obviusly some cut and shut modifications will be required, but these are well within the capabilities of most machinists. New nuts would be adviseable but thes are easy to make. This may be the only solution for an obsolete lathe (other than an expensive custom leadscrew.) Robert Bastow Who has done it a couple of times ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: align-boring engine blocks.. From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 07 Oct 1998 21:49:22 GMT -------- Jan Ben wrote: > > > Can you think of a way to do it w. "proper" machine shop techniques, e.g > on a vert or Horiz. mill maybe? > Thx > Jan The "proper machine shop way" would be to do it on a Horizontal Boring Mill Check around your local Jobbing Machine Shops, it shouldn't be difficult to find one. Failing that, an excellent substitute is a large lathe, with a between-centers boring bar and the block strapped to the carriage and packed up to bring the bore on center height. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Stolen Suburbans From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 08 Oct 1998 01:41:40 GMT -------- Charles Gallo wrote: > What I was going to do was coat it with DMSO and Lemon > juice. I like that one. What is DSMO and where can it be obtained? Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: align-boring engine blocks.. From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 08 Oct 1998 01:49:07 GMT -------- Erich Coiner wrote: > I think the real question is, will there be any meat left in the main > bearing caps after you open them up .2 inches? If in doubt, fit new thicker steel ones before boring. Not difficult to flame cut from plate and mill to fit. We used to fit home made steel bearing caps to our Race/Rally blocks before align-boring on a lathe as I previously outlined. We went up .125 to .180 in size to suit new forged steel Raceing cranks. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Why turn rotors? WAS Not a great weekend From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 08 Oct 1998 02:28:38 GMT -------- Wayne Cook wrote: > . I can get 3 phase > anytime I want and can probably get it for little to no money (it > helps to be friends with the local head of the power company ..... > ...............so when I need 3 phase to my new shop (going up > in the next year I hope) to tell him and he'll see what he can do. > > Wayne Cook > Shamrock TX As ever...It is not what you know..It is who you know, that knows how! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Expletive to be deleted From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 08 Oct 1998 05:08:09 GMT -------- Chilton Gregory wrote: > And then there's haggis...... > > Chilton Och aye mon, noo yer i' ma parrrticulah arrreah o' experrrtise! "haggis" , spelled wi' a wee "h" is use t' denote the boiled specimen consumed by everry true Scot on Rabbie Burrns' nacht, ( and many a Sassenach fewl the noo ye ken) 'tis an aquired flavorr te be sure, aboot five generrations aught t' do it! But the rrreal joy o' a guide Haggis (the use o' th'capital denotes th' live specimen..t' them that ken, ye ken) Och mon 'tis a delecht, on a braw, brecht, moonlecht necht, to stalk the wee buiggers i' the gloamin' o'er hill an' glen. Harrrd stalkin'ye ken. ye canna shuit the wee beasties o' accoont 'o therrr s'quick, the little buiggers will jump the musket ball an' be ower in th' next shire aforr the smoke has ceased t'borrn yer guid eye, ye ken. Och noo mon, ye have t' ruin doon the wee sods t' beat the life oot o th' puir wee buiggers wi' a guid big stick ye ken. Ah! hoo the puir Haggis sets a greetin' when a' furrst ye crack his wee heed, Ye has t' bang the buiggers prettty harrd ye ken, for they're tough wee sods. If yer borrn i' Bonnie Sco'land ye ha' tae be tough ye ken. Ye ken,we stalk the Haggis i' Novemberr. The tough wee beasties haftae hang fa a guide two months, an'then be boiled fae another guide month tae be guid an' tender fae the Burrns night. Rabbie Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Stolen Suburbans From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 08 Oct 1998 05:49:43 GMT -------- I hope everyone is taking into account the fact that, although you may not be able to pursue the perp, legally, south of the border, he can legally pursue YOU, north of the border. IIRC you do not have to be a legal resident or a US Citizen to bring a civil case in a US court. Given the number of litiginous, ambulance chasing, low life pond scum suckers in California...you guys are talking about creating a whole new market for them. If you are going to do anything, best kill the perps..You stand a better chance of not being extradited to Old Mehico for wasting a low life than you do defending yourself against a multimillion dollar, demonstrably provable, premeditated, bodily harm law suit for giving a scum bag belly ache. If you persist in your current line of reasoning, I for one, am going to register in a Californian law school. There's gold in them there thrills! 8^) Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Stolen Suburbans From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 08 Oct 1998 12:24:34 GMT -------- Don Foreman wrote: > Maybe they're just kidding and I'm over-reacting -- but look at some of > this stuff that's being posted! Perhaps these people watch too much TV. > I really wish TV and movies would quit trivializing the matter of killing > people. They make it look like cutting down a tree -- just a thing a man's > gotta do when he's gotta do it, no big deal. Wrongo! > > I skipped the part about consequences -- beyond the TV stuff of lawyers and > trials. If a man steals my truck, I'd be angry but I'd collect the > insurance and be more careful about securing the new one. Been there, done > that. > > If my kid stole someone's truck, she'd be wrong for doing that and > would deserve to be punished. If she is killed for that, the guy that > killed her need not worry about social security. As said, we all have our > thresholds. > > I'm of Finnish extraction -- generally thought of as slow and docile > people, difficult to provoke. Think about how a Mexican might react in a > similar scenario. I wonder if the hot-trigger posters have thought things > through that far. > > But after your comment, Mr. North, I shall shut the hell up on this > matter right now. Hopefully most of the "kill-em" posts are empty swagger, > and I sure don't need to be publicly judged and labelled as having > homicidal tendencies for trying to get people to think about what they're > saying. > > Regards > > Foreman > At Last a voice of reason, Lets leave the Rambo stuff on alt.guns.politics Go check it out....it will make you sick and scared. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: homemade abrasive waterjet cutter From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 08 Oct 1998 13:01:43 GMT -------- Rev Chuck wrote: > Why not just leave some empty space in the water tank and feed a > carburetor into it? Shoot some fuel into the tank and spark it, let > the expanding vapors push the water through the nozzle. Ok..Ok, already, This is getting beyond the bounds of reason! First thing, you are talking about generating 50,000 psi...Quickly! Very Quickly! This is the pressure level inside a high powered rifle breech! We are talking about pressure vessels the size of a howitzer! The only "fuel" that will generate these kinds of pressure levels are nitro based propellants, "gunpowder"! Gasoline won't hack it. Given the wrong circumstances, propellants that burn fast enough for this application, will detonate. Not something you'd want in your basement. Don't even think about the liability insurance premiums if you want to market it commercially. Go back and read some of the earlier posts from some real experts. Fluids, even distilled water, at these pressure levels are dangerous..don't fuck with them! How many diesel, or hydraulic mechanics do you know that have never been hurt by pinpoint leaks, some of them badly? Are you ready to sacrifice a hand, an eye, or a testicle (happened to a buddy of mine..working on a fork lift truck!) to the furtherance of home shop machining? I know a lot of this stuff is tongue in cheek, some of it from experts who are well aware of this fact. There ar a lot of very knowledgeable and experienced people in this group but with knowledge comes responsibility. Just consider how many times a week we get a posting that says "Hi I'm new to this stuff". This is a public forum to which people come to learn from "we" (collectively, ) the experts! Remember what Goebbels(SP) said: " If you repeat something often enough, people will believe it" That cost the life of millions of people. I'm sure nobody on this list wants even the tiniest contribution to a death or maiming on their concience! At least if you are going to post something YOU know is dangerous YOU should attatch a warning "Don't try this at home in your living room children" Kidding? No, not really! Two cents for what it is worth. 8^) Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Tiny belts From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 08 Oct 1998 13:43:53 GMT -------- Ian Bee wrote: > Yeah......I make special effects stuff, and I use the O Ring Splicing > Kit from R S Componenets here in Australia, although I beleieve that > they are an International Company. > > Cinch to use, just cut the desired length of O ring material, drop it > into a jig & glue, sets in seconds, and is unbeleivably hard to break, I > kid you not. > > Our stuff has run for years on these belts.......best of luck!!!!!!!! > > Ian Hi Ian,An excellent suggestion!You can get a similar and even stronger effect with round (or even vee section) polyurethane belting. Available at any belting suppliers, it comes in sections right down to 1/16th (or maybe less) Buy it by the foot. It is joined by heating and butt welding. In a pinch put an old knife blade in the vice, heat it to the point where th P-U just starts to "Slide" Gently press the two end to each side of the blade and when they soften quickly remove and press together until they cool. Remove flash with a sharp blade or on a grinder is better. Do not over heat as this will seriously weaken the joint. It takes a little practice but makes a first class belt. Small jigs of the sliding vee block type are available. Ask to see one and go make it!! I once designed, manufactured and marketed a spring loaded, tong type tool, and an electrically heated, teflon coated blade for the job. It is still on the market 'cause I get a royalty check every month...what I call "Mail Box Money" 8^) This is not a plug..so I'm not going to tell you the brand name or the supplier. There are several equally good copies available...but mine was the FIRST!! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Van Norman Milling Machine From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 08 Oct 1998 13:50:02 GMT -------- gfulton wrote: > There will be an auction soon in a town near me of an old machine shop. I > stopped and talked to the fellow that is retiring yesterday and he's got a > '40's vintage Van Norman milling machine. Works in either horizontal or > vertical mode, presently in vertical. Has the full set of gear cutters. > Says it was rebuilt a few years ago, new bearings, etc. I was wondering > what a good bid on this machine would be as it's the right size for my small > garage and if the company is still in business, parts availability, etc. I > am admittedly a rank amateur with just a Shoptask at present. Thanks for > any help. > > Garrett Fulton > > gfulton@ctc.net This is an excellent machine for the home shop. If it is reasonable shape, will fit in your shop and you can afford it, pay whatever you are comfortable with to get it. If you don't want it, please let me know the name etc. of the auctioneer....Off line off course. 8^) Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How to deburr narrow slot in tube From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 08 Oct 1998 14:08:02 GMT -------- The best cure is, of course, prevention. Slide a close fitting plug of the same material inside the tube and use a VERY sharp cutter. You won't have a burr! Of course this is sacrifical of the plug material but the same piece will do a lot of tubes by rotating and swapping ends, On a Mass Production basis this would be done on a fixture with a closely fitted hardened plug with an accurately ground slot. Deburring would be done with abrasive blasting, tumbling, a bench mounted, rotating, wire brush on an extension mandril..or the aformentioned custom scraper. Yer pays yer money..yer takes yer choice! 8^) Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: align-boring engine blocks.. From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 08 Oct 1998 22:33:11 GMT -------- brian wrote: > Robert, what material did you use for the caps, and what heat treat (if any) did > you give them? I've fabricated straps for main caps, from mild steel, and they > were just fine, but I've never made complete main caps before. If you heat > treated them was it before or after rough boring on the block? You'd have to do > the final hone after any treating, I'd guess... It is a long time ago...1966/69..but I do recall we flame cut the caps from HR Plate which was already blanchard ground to thickness. They were then milled on face and width drilled and mounted. We would mill the seat sfew thou lower to give us a machining allowance. No heat treating was done, before or after line boring. We didn't have the tackle to hone so we just bored 'em to dead size. Never had one break, 'cept once when I rear ended a Rover 3 Litre. Totalled the Ford but he didn't even stop at the scene...I genuinly believe he never felt it!! These were mostly 120E blocks, some three bearing, five, when they started appearing in scrap yards. We would stuff them in Anglias and the older Populars. The three bearing 997cc Anglia opened up and stroked to 1100cc, cross flow head and some wild cam work was a screamer. We could only get ten thousand rev tacos and we would bend the needle against the stops. I had a 997 that was clapped out and decided to break it on purpose..every one said the 3 bearing motor was fragile. Baloney I was taking it over 12,000 revs and the sucker Wouldn't break. I finally topped it by dropping the clutch, in second gear, doing 90 down a steep hill. I'll swear that motor did 20K before it exploded. Not the bottom end though! I think I vaporised the springs and collets, dropped the valves and you can imagine the rest!! Couldn't have done a better job with an Exocet missile!! 8^) > > > I'd also guess that just about any billet steel material main cap would be > stronger than it's cast iron equivalent. Any actual knowledge of this? Two to three times as strong/stiff. And it's stiffness that counts. ;^) > Also, since you're an ex-brit who obviously played with Ford Kent based engines > in the bad old days, have you ever heard of Martin engines? I have an 1865cc > Martin, circa 1966, based on the Ford 120E block, with a 12 valve alloy cylinder > head, push-rod, two gear cam drive, 82mm stroke, 85mm bore. I'm running it in a > 1965 Merlyn MK6A sports racer... > > Cheers, Brian Never Heard the Martin, but it may well have been one of the multitude of Formula Ford engine builders. There were a lot of outfits following the Cosworth/Lotus lead in developing these engines. Sounds very like the Cosworth mill I had in my Lotus Cortina...same bore/stroke/displacement. 1865cc was the absolute outer limit for that block if you weren't to be able to crumple it in your hands. With the twin cam Xflow heads, 45DCOE Webers etc they were approaching 2OO bhp..at the wheels!! That's well over a bhp per cc. I chuckle even today when I read of "high performance" engines here that don't come close to 1 bhp per Cubic INCH. Those WERE the days my friends. 8^) Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Aluminum Materials From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 08 Oct 1998 22:37:24 GMT -------- zj wrote: > Looking for aluminum? We offer light weight aluminum and stainless steel. > You can order online. Contact us with any questions. > http://www.thermsulate.com Any one here ever come across HEAVY weight aluminum? Robert Bastow In a playful mood 8^) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: British Cars From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 08 Oct 1998 23:07:37 GMT -------- Paul Amaranth wrote: > The 7 was a pretty lousy car. The 7 was an UGLY lousy car!! Looked like a flying cheese dish. > (I'm putting together a Stag whose V8 engine........ > I remember the Stag as a nice car with a lousy engine. Block and heads had permanent, terminal tendency to warp. What made it a really nice car was the conversion to the Rover V8. This started life as the small alloy block BuickV8. One of those might fit your Stag. I wouldn't recommend spending money on the Triumph V8 Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What are CNC machines used for ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 09 Oct 1998 03:19:21 GMT -------- I think you have had enough good reasons why CNC reigns supreme in Industry. But if they haven't convinced you maybe this one will. IMHO the biggest advantage of CNC is that it has freed up a whole bunch of good quality machine tools that the home shop machinists can buy at reasonable prices! IMHO the one and only benefit of NAFTA to the average stiff, is exactly the same thing. Robert Bastow Average Stiff ======== To: Erich Coiner Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: align-boring engine blocks.. From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 09 Oct 1998 20:14:43 GMT -------- Erich Coiner wrote: > Jan, > > When you get this project all sorted out, I would like to know the > details for increasing the displacement on the Buick 215. I have all > ways wanted to do a project using that motor. > I was doing web searches on Buick 215 and remember finding a site that > indicated that somebody is making a bellhousing and trans adapter that > allows you to use a Borg Warner T5 tranny. That is a great solution for > a front engine rear drive car. > > Good luck, > > Erich Hi Erich, I may be mistaken, but is the Buick 215 the engine that was bought by Rover in the UK and produced as the Rover 3.5 V8? If so, you might want to find one of those..they are used in the Range Rover, and one helluva engine!! ======== To: John Stevenson Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Are you all strange? From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 09 Oct 1998 20:35:41 GMT -------- John Stevenson wrote: > Not really I just class Harleys with all the other BS brands that sell by pure hype. > To me they are as technical advanced as a cinder block. > In fact a cinder block is more pleasing to the eye. [ the grey type that is, the > white one compares to the electro glide ] > > Regards, > > John Stevenson at > iiiiiIIIIIIIINNNNNN.............COMMMMMIIIIIIIIiiiiiiiiiigg !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Robert ======== To: Ron Moore Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: British Cars From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 09 Oct 1998 20:46:39 GMT -------- Ron Moore wrote: > I have a 71 Stag with the original Triump engine having been balanced and > blueprinted. Has a NICE rip to it. > Respectfully, > Ron Moore > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > Paul Amaranth wrote: > > > > > The 7 was a pretty lousy car. > > > > The 7 was an UGLY lousy car!! Looked like a flying cheese dish. > > > > > (I'm putting together a Stag whose V8 engine........ > > > > > > > I remember the Stag as a nice car with a lousy engine. Block and heads had > > permanent, terminal tendency to warp. > > > > What made it a really nice car was the conversion to the Rover V8. This started > > life as the small alloy block BuickV8. > > One of those might fit your Stag. I wouldn't recommend spending money on the > > Triumph V8 > > > > Robert Bastow Granted, but you do need to be aware that the Stag engine had a nasty reputation of warping..just a caveat FWIIW By the way, outside of the Buggatti engine the sweetest rip I ever heard was the fuel injected (UK version) TR6. Pure music on the original factory tailpipes..after market exhaust systems never could reproduce it. I used to drive mine "Harry-flatters" with the lid down, just to listen to the "music". Robert ======== To: PLAlbrecht Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: British Cars From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 09 Oct 1998 20:53:25 GMT -------- PLAlbrecht wrote: > Then he put a Rover V8 in it and that put an end to the snide comments. > It has already been pointed out that this remarkable British engine started > life (many engineering redesigns ago) as a Buick engine. Another item GM tossed > on the scrap heap of history, to be picked up, dusted off, and made viable by > others. > > Pete I had one of these great engines in a Rover 3500S (Manual 4 speed) Helluva Sleeper!! My understanding is that Rover paid $100,000.00 for the design AND the entire production line and tooling. This must rank with the Louisiana Purchase as one of the all-time best deals in human history!! Robert ======== To: chilton@unm.edu Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Expletive to be deleted From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 09 Oct 1998 21:02:49 GMT -------- ======== To: chilton@unm.edu Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Expletive to be deleted From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 09 Oct 1998 21:03:43 GMT -------- Chilton Gregory wrote: > Ne govorish dobro engleski jesik! > > I tambien porque vivo en nuevo mexico, mi gusta muchisimo el menudo.. > > Chilton HUH?? Robert ======== To: Felice Luftschein & Nicholas Carter Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Stolen Suburbans From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 10 Oct 1998 02:25:36 GMT -------- Felice Luftschein & Nicholas Carter wrote: but my wife is jewish and as > far as I'm concerned the only good nazi is a dead nazi. > Unless you like Quisling, Vichy et al, I think all you europeans will > agree with me. Think it can't happen? Look at Kosovo. Here, Here. You got my vote. Robert Bastow ======== To: PLAlbrecht Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Stolen Suburbans From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 10 Oct 1998 02:35:40 GMT -------- PLAlbrecht wrote: > Felice Luftschein said > > And who gets to clean up > Europe's soiled diapers again? Yup. American troops again. And my tax dollars. > And we won't get so much as a thank-you. > > Pete Absolutely, but somebody HAS to do it! With authority and capability comes responsibility, and facing up to one's moral responsibility simply for, or in expectation of, "gratitude" would be to debase the whole thing. Robert Bastow ======== To: Myjakjs Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How do you mill a cube accurately From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 10 Oct 1998 02:41:30 GMT -------- Myjakjs wrote: > What do experienced machinists do ? > > Here's how I square up blocks. > Machine one side with the flycutter as you did. > Rotate 90 placing machined side against fixed jaw. Use a rod between rough side > and movable jaw & tighten. > After machining that side rotate part so the side you just machined is on > bottom & tighten with rod again. > Now you can put part in vise & cut the side opposite your first cut. > Use a square to line up the block for the fifth side. > Note -the jaw has to be square to start with. > > John Myjakjys, If you are 'LISTENING" this is the way an experienced machinist would do it!! (Thankyou John, you saved me a whole lot of "hunt and peck" 8^) Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How do you mill a cube accurately From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 10 Oct 1998 02:51:33 GMT -------- Steve Austin wrote: > > >I'm trying to mill a cast iron cube as accurately as I can with a > > >fly-cutter. > > > The most accurate flycutting techniques on a milling machine will > approximate those used on a surface grinder. Your part will have > been roughed in. Your table will be stoned flat. You will use > an angle block that's as true as you can get it and prove. Clamp > the part to the angle with kant twist clamps and lightly clamp > the block to the table with your standard table clamps. Take > light cuts. You will use a surface plate and an indicator to set > up and prove your 90 degree angles. > > Steve A. And starve to death as a machinist!! You have introduced an un-neccessary and guaranteed inaccurate second element in the angle plate. What is wrong with , and more accurate than the machine table and rear vise jaw as primary referenc and clampin surfaces? Robert Bastow ======== To: Erich Coiner Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Stolen Suburbans From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 10 Oct 1998 03:41:47 GMT -------- Erich Coiner wrote: > It sounds like you guys need to build the device I saw at my Uncles > Ranch in Oklahoma. (Just outside of wide spot known as Byers, NE of > Paul's Valley but I digress) > My sister in law dubbed this thing the "heifer hefter" > > > > Cows did not like this machine but it didn't seem to hurt them. > > Seems a bit rough for horses but you never know. > > Erich Sounds like cows and maybe horses have the same weak spot as dogs do. From experience I can assure you...no matter how nasty, vicious, or powerful a dog is, if you can manage to grab it around the mid-section and lift it bodily off the floor, it is "game over". The brute will hang immobile in your arms...they don't like losing contact with the ground and go totaly to pieces when they do. It is up to you to figure out where to go from there. The fastest way to immobilise, and kill a vicious dog is to grab its front paws and jerk its legs apart as far as they will go, perpendicular to its chest. This collapses its chest and lungs and compresses its heart. Failing that thrust your hand far back into its mouth and grab hold of its lower jaw. With your other hand, grab its upper jaw, and tear the two apart. In case anyone is wondering if I am a dog hater or sadist, let me assure you, quite the opposite. I love dogs, I breed and train Dobermans, I speak "dog" and given the choice, most times I prefer the company of a dog to that of a human being. But in this world of "Trained attack dogs", brutalised pit bulls, inbred shepherds, and a general media overhype, I feel that the thinking person should understand the general risk and remedies. The dog hasn't been born that could take down and kill a knowledgeable, fit, and determined adult Human Being. Note: I didn't say it couldn't hurt you, it can..big time! FWIIW Robert Bastow FWIIW, Hoping it may save someone's ass in the future. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: machine keysetters for sale From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 10 Oct 1998 04:12:03 GMT -------- WGalcik wrote: > i have a davis keyseater set #da-17-2 cutter type( a f a) for sale > 1/16 -3/4 plus some extras . 14 broaches in all plus 2 wood boxes. > contact walter, WGALCIK@A0L.COM Walter, You are wasting your time and (more importantly) our time by not posting a price (best offer won't hack it) age and condition is a must and location doesn't hurt. You are more than welcome to try again. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: identity of carbon steel part? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 10 Oct 1998 04:33:23 GMT -------- Robert A. Lodder, Ph.D. wrote: > I am hoping that someone has seen something like these objects before > (bearing1.jpg and bearing2.jpg in the drop box at > http://www.metalworking.com/dropbox/). They are both carbon steel in > composition. One is brass-plated. The composition has been confirmed > by xray fluorescence spectrometry. Possible uses that have been > suggested for the objects are valves, tapered roller bearings, or "feet" > for a box or cabinet. Only place I recall seeing similar objects was as a peining medium in a tumbling machine. FWIIW Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re:One Mans Perspective From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 10 Oct 1998 14:21:01 GMT -------- PLAlbrecht wrote, regarding the reasons for the American Revolution and throwing off the yoke of the"tyrannical British": > Agree, the U.S. (and Australia, and Canada, and the other former colonies) owe > much to Britain as the mother country. We just think we've had a chance to do > it better over here. (As do you in Australia.) Absolutely True! I am from the Old Country and chose to emigrate to N. America in 1976, since when I have spent about half my time in Canada and half in the Good Old US of A. I hold dual American /British Citizenship, and my beautiful wife is from "Olde Alabamie" Many times I have been asked why I came here, and whether or not I would ever consider returning to the UK. My response, in simplified terms is this: IMHO Britain was the founder of modern civilisation, the concept of civil rights and democracy (Magna Carta,Elected representation, trial by peers etc) and led the world in this until the 18th century when it seems to have become set in its ways and further progress has been slow. I have no problem with a Constitutional Monarch..Which means the people own the Monarchy, not the other way round, and the Monarch reigns only so long as the people allow.So far as I am concerned it is cheaper than a Presidency, garners way more in tourist dollars than it costs, and removes the Titular Head of State from any power or influence in the running of the country. I like the fact that any government can be brought down at any moment by a majority of one vote in a "Motion of No Confidence" and a General Election called to elect a new government. Wouldn't that have been nice, here in the United States over the past few months. I think it is WAY past the time to get rid of the hereditary peerage! (Britains equivalent?? to the Senate) It is also way past time to smash the "Class System" where one is judged by where, and who, you come from socially as opposed to what you have achieved personally. As the son of a coal miner and a coal miner's daughter, who broke out of that mould, I hit the "Glass Ceiling" at the age of twenty three!! That was the moment I decided to leave and it took me ten more years to "work my passage" over here. No I will never return to live in England, 'tho' there is a lot that I miss culture wise. It is a wonderful place to come from, and a wonderful place to visit, but IMHO a lousy place to live!! My feeling is that the "baton" of modern democracy, was dropped by Britain in the 18th Century and picked up by the United States of America. Sure, there have been many stumbles along the way, and there are many more to come! But this Country is only 222 years old, a toddler in historical time spans. (a helluva toddler for a' that!!!!) We have a long way to go, and a lot of problems that will not be solved in our lifetime's, but we are on the right track and at last starting to take a hard earned lead in the world on a moral basis rather than simply on a power basis. I would choose no other place on earth to live and bring up my children!! We are not perfect..but be patient..God isn't finished with us yet! One Mans Perspective. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Stolen Suburbans From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 10 Oct 1998 15:37:15 GMT -------- Mike Graham wrote: > .................................................................. though I've used the > 'throat jab' method to train dogs to not bite (these aren't viscious > dogs, just young dogs that haven't lost the puppy habit of nipping > fingers etc.; my young beagle used to always grab my nose with those > needle-sharp teeth of his. OW!). Anyway, when he goes for my fingers > I stick them down his throat. Doesn't hurt him; he gags then jumps > back into the fray. > > Mike Graham We certainly have the same approach to training dogs. A well bred Doberman has a genetic program to guard, never to attack! Sure they have the equipment, speed and power, to make a real mess of someone. Not that I fancy either but I would rather take on a pit bull that a Dobe. Pit bulls instinctively grab and hang on and that gives you the chance to disable it. Dobes slash repeatedly, at hight speed, will never let you "get inside" and would cut you to ribbons! Except they don't have the instinct to do that..they make an exceptionally good guard dog, but the only way to make an "attack" dog out of a dobe is to brutalise it..and I mean BRUTALISE!! I know this is done...by sickos!! Of course I am excluding the cross bred and inbred kind of "Junkyard Dog" from this generalisation. I brought up all my pups to be unaware of the fact that they had a powerful weapon in their teeth, and NEVER to use them around people. This starts right at the puppy stage when any amount of rough and tumble is acceptable, but the instant they nip it is corrected by a tap of the finger on the nose..every single time without fail. Trained this way (and in obedience etc. of course) the Dobe is a wonderful family dog..all my kids were brought up with dobes...who were very protective but liked nothing better than to rough and tumble with the kids. They never used their superior strength, and NEVER nipped at them! Even when poked up the bum with a pencil, or being ridden like a motor cycle, with their ears used as the handle bars and throttle!! When pushed too far , they would simply dump the child and withdraw. They loved riding in vehicles and I wouldn't have hesitated to leave a brace in my Bronco parked in downtown Atlanta (temperature permitting), with the door unlocked! Ain't NOBODY gonna mess with that truck! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How to Cut Steel with a saw? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 10 Oct 1998 17:10:20 GMT -------- Red Rider wrote: > The way it works is the friction from the blade gets the metal you are > cutting white hot and it is easily pushed out of the way as slag. The blade > gets hot but doesn't change color, as the moving edge of the blade is acting > against the non-moving part being cut, and heat doesn't build up fast on the > blade. A number of years ago I worked with a company that produced vibratory bowl feeder systems. The primary construction was 1/8" 300 series Stainless Steel. All the cutting of this material was don on friction bandsaws, running at wood cutting speeds and feeding by hand at about th speed you would feed 1/2" plywood. These were, in the main, large, high powered, industrial bandsaws but we did buy a couple of asian built 14" wood cutting bandsaws for odd job cutting. In the interests of longer blade guide life, we converted them to ball bearing guides..just like their bigger brothers. The special friction cutting blads were used for the larger machines but on the smaller ones a regular 18 tooth metal cutting saw blade was used. Obviously,, at woodcutting speeds on SS, the blade soon lost its "sharpness"..probably in the first 1/4" of cutting but thereafter it settled down to a long and successful life as a friction saw. This usage does not strip all the teeth off as one may expect, it simply reforms them into a shape remarkeably similar to the teeth on a regular friction cutting blade. I have tried this at home on my delta 14" band saw which is not yet fitted with a speed reducer. It works like gangbusters on steel sheet up to 1/8'' thick. I use regular wood cutting blades to cut aluminum up to 1" thick with great success. Using WD40 as a lubricant the blades last longer on aluminum than they do on hardwoods and plywood. I guess the aluminum is far less abrasive. This, I am sure will work well on the tubing in question, I would hold the tube in a vee block in order to present the blade with a corner to cut thro' rather than a 1" high slab of tube wall on edge. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Info on monster lathe; J Butler From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 10 Oct 1998 23:35:11 GMT -------- Mike Graham wrote: > A friend of mine who's a woodworker has a really big metal lathe > that I'd be interested in getting a bit of info on. Unfortunately, I > can't get at the main I.D. plate of it (it's behind a bunch of stored > stuff) but the tailstock has a plate that reads "J Butler & Co" makers > of fine machine tools blah blah "Halifax, England". The bed on this > puppy is about 6', and it was originally wide-belt driven. It's got a > gearbox that can shift on the fly (!) and apparently it has some > pretty funky features; it can cut threads as heavy as 1 tpi. I'm > sure there are bigger lathes out there, but this one is pretty huge to > me. I wish I could get a model number, and in a few months I should > be able to, I was just curious if anyone was familiar with the > company. > > Mike Graham > Very familiar with the name Mike, Butlers are in Halifax, Yorkshire, just up the road from where I served my time. First class company, they made lathes, planers, shapers, radial arm drills and a very nice vertical slotter. I don't know if they are still in business or what the parts situation is, but if the lathe is not too big for you and if it is not badly worn, with no parts broken, then you have a great lathe. I remember Butlers as building some REALLY big lathes. My company used to make some huge bed castings for them which we rough machined to "prove" them before shipping for seasoning. Hope this helps. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Anti-Harley propaganda (long); was Are You All Strange? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 10 Oct 1998 23:45:47 GMT -------- rick d wrote: > Mike/Bob- > > What about (slobber, drool) a Vincent Black lightning......? > > Rick D I thought they built the Black shadow and the Black Knight....'course I may be full of S*** because I don't profess to know a llot about the Vincents. All Ikno is that a LOT of British bikers would sell their first born to get one. These are guys with their pick of Besas, Nortons,Triumph AJS and yes, Harleys! I understand they are increasingly popular over there. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: FS: Rhino, the best 3d modeling program at the best price From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 10 Oct 1998 23:54:10 GMT -------- Andrew Werby wrote: > Since many of us are model makers as well as computer-users, I thought > I'd mention Rhino, which I think is the best 3d modeling tool available I am a model maker, and I was wondering if the Rhino could build me a 1 1/2" scale "Big Boy". You know, like carve it out of solid in one setup? Or are we talking about a whole differnt kind of "Model Making" here? ;^) Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking,sci.engr,sci.engr.mech,sci.engr.manufacturing Subject: Re: What is the difference between a Form Tap, Plug Tap, Bottoming Tap, and a Taper Tap ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 11 Oct 1998 00:37:55 GMT -------- wg wrote: > What's the difference between a Form Tap, Plug > Tap, Bottoming Tap, and a Taper Tap ? > > wg When (if!!,I never do) you prchase a set of Hand taps you will get a Taper tap, a plug tap (called a Second Tap in the UK) and a Bottoming Tap (called a Plug Tap in the UK) The ONLY difference between them is the degree of taper ground on the CRESTS of the threads. Contrary to what a lot of people think, there is no taper on the thread root and pitch diameters. Only Taper Tread series (Pipe threads) are form tapered. Neither do taps have any "form relief"..like a milling cutter or gear hob. Ground HS taps are centerless form ground out of pre_hardened blankc and the flutes are ground in afterwards. The taper tap is used first especially in tough materials. It has a taper ground over th first 1/3rd (approx.) of the tap length. This taper IS backed off to give a cutting relief. The Plug tap is tapered and backed off over about half the length that you see on the taper tap. It follows the taper tap..though generally this tap will be the ONLY tap you use under most circumstances. The Bottoming tap has only the first thread chamfered and relief ground. It is used to follow the taper tap and cut the thread right to the bottom of a blind hole. Very rarely called for except where the material is thin and you need maximum thread possible. 'Scope mount screws on a rifle reciever are one of the few applications where there is a genuine requirement. Internally threaded pipe unions would be another. Sadly most "botttomed" threads I have ever had to cut from drawings were the result of a designer that didn't know his a** from a hole in the ground!! I have never bought a taper or a bottoming tap (for home use) If I REALLY need one or the other, I will hand grind one from an old taper tap. It is easier than grinding a drill. I am not sure what you mean by " form" tap. All taps are form taps in that they carry the form of the thread to be cut. Could you be thinking of a "Forming" or "Roll Forming" tap? This is a tap without flutes, has a rounded polygonal section and is designed to roll form the threads without removing metal. All my smaller taps are of this type as they are FAR stronger than a regular tap and give a smother and stronger thread. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How do you mill a cube accurately From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 11 Oct 1998 01:01:33 GMT -------- Peter O'Leary wrote: > Scott S.Logan) wrote: > > > (Peter O'Leary) wrote: > > > >> > >>The original poster said he was using a Kurt vise. They don't bend. > >>Period. Besides they have a cam lock mechanism where the moving jaw > >>is forced down at an angle as the jaw is tightened to prevent the > >>workpiece from lifting. I think the original poster's problems were > >>resolved by trying dowels against the movable jaw and smacking the > >>workpiece down, > > > >Sorry, if you really believe "They don't bend. Period." I have a > >surprise for you. They DO! Exclamation point! > > > >It is all a matter of degrees (sorry). A Kurt Vise will bend LESS > > You're absolutely correct, > Peter J. O'Leary The whole point is that the original poster asked "What would an EXPERIENCED Machinist do" An experienced machinist is fully aware that nothing on the face of the erarth is truly flat, straight,round or rigid. He takes that into account and does NOT whale down on an expensive, precision vice. A Kurt vice (or my favorite the Girardi) will hold a piece like this, especially for a light load like fly cutting, with almost a finger tightening. If I saw an alleged "experienced" machinist whaling on MY vice in MY tool and die shop, I would have fired his butt before he caused further damage..or hurt someone! The very best vice can be damaged permanently by over tightening. Experienced machinists don't do this, it is usually a less experienced and nervous amateur or an unskilled "thug". An experienced machinist faced with something that he knows he cannot grip firmly enough in a vise without overtightening, will use auxilliary clamps for security, or, he will dispense with the vice and (in this case) edge dog it right to the table top using a trammed in stop bar for squareness. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Strange division on my Spindle nose From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 11 Oct 1998 10:08:23 GMT -------- Ostcroix wrote: > We a French lathe called casenave ( I may have spelled it worng ) > ON the end of the spindle nose ( The left most part of the spindle nose ) > are divisions from 5 all the way to 60. What is a practical use for for > these division? > Othniel Rawlins > Ostcroix@aol.com > ============== Cazeneuve make a nice lathe. 5 to 60 divisions on the tail end of th spindle sounds like a dividing facility. FWIIW Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: best way to bore a hole in pulley From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 11 Oct 1998 10:36:31 GMT -------- DAVID NIEMELA wrote: > Cowards! > > Just chuck a shanked-down 5/8" bit in your 3/8" drill, clamp the pulley > in your vise, and go for broke! It won't take long to break!!!! ;^) Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Are you all strange? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 11 Oct 1998 10:51:53 GMT -------- J R North wrote: > Just passing through? Thats nice..... > JR > > Ham Burger wrote: > > > Just passing through this group I wonder what else he is passing? Like blood hopefully! Robert Bastow ======== To: John Stevenson Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re:US & UK M/c ToolManuf. was Info J Butler From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 11 Oct 1998 11:24:02 GMT -------- John Stevenson wrote: > On Sat, 10 Oct 1998 23:35:11 GMT, Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > > > > >Very familiar with the name Mike, Butlers are in Halifax, Yorkshire, just > >up the road from where I served my time. > > > >First class company, they made lathes, planers, shapers, radial arm drills > >and a very nice vertical slotter. > > > Butlers have since gone the same way as a lot of the British Machine Tool industry. > I have a 5" stroke Butler slotting machine. > They were famous for their slotters in the UK. They seemed to have cornered the > market. > > Regards, > > John Stevenson It is tragic, if not criminal, what has happened to the Machine Tool Industry in The UK and here in North America. It seems like all the great names are gone. I worked, closely, with Alfred Herbert, once the largest machine tool manufacturer in the world, pioneers in machine tool automation, builders of the first production, hard wired NC machines, and originators of the universally used "G Code" programming system. In the early 80's they were a shadow of their former selves, but had a magnificent CNC turning center on the market. I was in there at the end, in 1982/3, when the recession killed what was left. They still owe me money!! 8^( Co-incidentally, for many years, and probably even still, the magnificent range of Herbert Capstan and Turret lathes was built in India! The quality was unimpeachable..better even than the UK built machines..so don't knock Imports just because they are Imports!! Does anyone have a handle on the few great Names that are left. Bridgeport and Southbend, of course, Cincinnatti Milacron? Myford, Jones and Shipley (maybe), Boxford, are all names that spring to mind. What about K&T, P&W and Smarte & Brown? Any more that come to mind? Cheers, Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: . Clinton, resign... From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 11 Oct 1998 16:42:54 GMT -------- Dan wrote: > http://resignation.ariannaonline.com/ Any, so called "poll" or petition, that does not give an equal opportunity to those canvassed to vote "nay" if they wish, has no validity regardless of the subject! The vast majority in this country (and the rest of the world) want to see the end of this stupidity and do not see strong enough grounds for impeachment, nor do they want Clinton to resign. As I see it, if the most powerful man in the world can't get a bit 'o pussy ANY time he wants it...then where does that leave the rest of us? If I had been caught red handed, and knew my wife was listening to the question, I would LIE LIKE RUG!!! Your only hope of survival in that case is DENY! DENY! DENY! no matter how strong the evidence, never never confess. The instnat you do your goose is cooked, and ready to stick a fork in! Just MHO, 8^) Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How to Cut Steel with a saw? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 11 Oct 1998 16:49:01 GMT -------- Mike Graham wrote: > >A "Cold Saw" is a device that looks sort of like a chop saw but has very > >low rpm, appropriate for steel. They are fairly expensive, but maybe you > >could rent one. > > Actually, does anyone know the RPM that these things operate at? > Somewhere around 200RPM? > > Mike Graham > Usually they are variable speed but IIRC that would be about mid range. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What is the difference between a Form Tap, Plug Tap, Bottoming Tap, and a Taper Tap ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 11 Oct 1998 17:16:18 GMT -------- ldkeith@home.com wrote: > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > The Bottoming tap has only the first thread chamfered and relief ground. > > It is used to follow the taper tap and cut the thread right to the > > bottom of a blind hole. Very rarely called for except where the > > material is thin and you need maximum thread possible. 'Scope mount > > screws on a rifle reciever are one of the few applications where there > > is a genuine requirement. > > Internally threaded pipe unions would be another. Sadly most > > "botttomed" threads I have ever had to cut from drawings were the result > > of a designer that didn't know his a** from a hole in the ground!! I > > have never bought a taper or a bottoming tap (for home use) If I REALLY > > need one or the other, I will hand grind one from an old taper tap. It > > is easier than grinding a drill. > > I find myself using bottoming taps quite reqularly, and do not > share your > opinion of them. For anyone building a Gingery lathe a few > bottoming taps > will come in very handy. Lots of blind holes need to be tapped, > and the > bottoming taps make finishing these holes that much cleaner and > safer (from > broken taps). > > dave I stand by my statement! As I said there are a few obvious exceptions, but I am not alone in thinking that no designer/draughtsman worth his salt would spec. a blind hole with a bottomed thread if he could possibly avoid it. The penalty in production time, tool changing and down time plus scrapped parts and broken taps, is the spur to find a better way. Not to mention keeping his job!! In most cases a deeper drilling, which allows enough space to use a taper tap to get the required thread depth, can be allowed and gives somewhere for the chips to go. I have seen cases where a cast boss was provided on the UNDERside to allow this, when a fluid tight component was required. Use of thicker material or a straight thro' hole should be considered. Last but by no means least, many designers specify far too deep a thread. In most cases, two to three times diameter is adequate. (Look at the thickness of a nut if you doubt me.) If this is not the case the designer should investigate the use of more fasteners of a smaller size, finer threads, or the use of stronger materials. FWIIW Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: SINE BARS?? NEED HELP From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 11 Oct 1998 17:35:23 GMT -------- Scott Logan wrote: > The other posts are helpful, and give the answer you are looking for, > but I have one "warning". Beyond about 30 degrees, a sine bar/plate > loses it's accuracy. After 30 degrees, a small error in the stack of > jo-blocks makes a big error in the angle. > > For instance (assuming 5" sine bar/plate): Thankyou for sharing that Scott. I have been aware of the "caveat" ever since I was an "Oily Rag"and had to share the services of a laborer, but, although I took account of it,and never used a sine bar for larger angles in a critical application, It never really made sense. Textbooks and Instructors quote it "parrot fashion", but never expand upon the real reasons....Guilty as charged m'Lud!!! But I have never before seen an explanation that made sense! Thank you Scott for reminding me that one is never too old to learn 8^) 8^) Warmest regards Robert PS considering the cost of a set of gauge blocks our listers should be aware that it is standard practice to machine your own block of the required height. You can make that as permanent and accurate as the occasion demands. PPS. I was in a production meeting on one occasion, when the subject of sine bars came up in conversation. "Oh yes!" piped up our new "Hot Shot" Production Manager. " I have a set of those...a six inch and a twelve inch"..... ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: . Clinton, resign... From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 11 Oct 1998 17:55:26 GMT -------- Ron Moore wrote: > Mr. Bastow > How do you define "vast"? In Oklahoma, from the folks I know and talk > to, that's about 20%, maybe. I lived for a while in "Enid, AMERICA!!!" I can understand your belief that what Okies think, should be good enough for the rest of this great Nation!!! If you were to pull your head out of that dark place and check the NATIONAL POLLS you will see a different picture. And as I said... > > Just MHO, 8^) And No, you haven't changed it. 8^) Respectfully, Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What's in "denatured" alcohol? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1998 02:46:31 GMT -------- DAVID NIEMELA wrote: > 95% ethanol, 5% methanol eh? If a guy knew the boiling points for the > two he could probably distill some pretty potent shine out of it. > > All that would be needed would be a boot-draging idiot cousin to test > the end result. . . In the UK "de-natured Alcohol" is known as "Methylated Spirit"..."Meths" for short. In addition to the Methanol it also contains an additive that dyes it a permanent purple and gives it a FOUL taste. There is no known means of separating them. Nevertheless the next depths to which a " wino" sinks is to drinking Meths..Usually with a soft drink called "Tizer" [Which needs something like meths to make it palatable ;^) ] after that comes "brasso" (metal polish) and finally (literally) comes boot polish, spread on bread. ".......And now you know the REST of the story" 8^) Robert Bastow ======== To: Jeff DelPapa Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re:An elegant solution..was Hare brained From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1998 03:44:51 GMT -------- Jeff DelPapa wrote: > Ok, I got a bunch of comments, > So I have a new harebrained idea... Since it seems that a square > collumn and a dovetail are redundant, and adapting for a square column > is a real pain, the current scheme has me getting a round hunk of cast > bar, and machining to match the current one. Cut a slot to fit a > dovetailed slide into the cylinder, and make the matching slide with a > round back, the length of the existing head. The new column would > mount where the existing shaft does, and the dovetail block would be > at the back of the machine, so it could be easily bolted/pinned to the > head. I LIKE THIS > To get the slider to have the needed matching > curved back, the simplest thing looks like fitting it into the column, > tightening the gib to lock it in place, and turning both parts to > finish diameter at the same time.... Good thinking. Use steel for the "slider" It will be stronger, stiffer, and will wear better. > Any suggestions as to how thick should I be planning for the gib? > (space to come from the plug) About how far apart is reasonable to > space the gib adjusting screws? (the head is about 15" tall). Cast > iron or brass for the gib? 1/8 to 5/32.....use ground 01 gauge stock (unhardened) place the gib screws 1" to 1 1/4" apart > Anyone on the east coast have a source for > cast iron rounds, thats cheaper than MSC? Try Scott Logan, he'll be around. > I notice that MSC sells > both grey cast iron, and a higher tensile strength malleable iron (for > about the same price). Any advantage of one over the other for this > application? Cast Iron will be fine..Malleable Iron will wear better. "semi steel' will be far stiffer Why not just use HRS? Thickwall tubing if you can find it at "Jones the scrap" A steel column inside the cast iron housing will give better friction and wear qualities. If you decide to use steel, then go for a much wider,deeper "slider" and think about using a taper gib. They are easy to make,and can be adjusted in situ. If you kneed to know how to make one contact me direct. I think you maybe on to an elegant solution for a perennial problem. Patent it as an improvement, licence its use to OEMs and arrang for the manufacture and marketing of conversion kits for the thousands of users out there that are slowly being driven NUTS by this problem. Let me know if I can help Robert Bastow > > > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: It would be funny if it wasn't so sad. . . From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1998 03:50:37 GMT -------- Ron Moore wrote: > "Here,Here" or is it "Hear, Hear" Mr. Hoover. > Respectfully, > Ron Moore I believe the term, is "here, here" meaning 'Here I am in support" rather than " I hear You and agree" No wonder people have such difficulty learning English/American, as a second language. Respectfully Robert Bastow ======== To: chilton@unm.edu Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Expletive to be deleted From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1998 04:11:49 GMT -------- Chilton Gregory wrote: > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > > > > Och aye mon, noo yer i' ma parrrticulah arrreah o' experrrtise! > > > > "haggis" , spelled wi' a wee "h" is use t' denote the boiled specimen consumed by > > everry true Scot on Rabbie Burrns' nacht, > > ( and many a Sassenach fewl the noo ye ken) > > > Ne govorish dobro engleski jesik! > > I tambien porque vivo en nuevo mexico, mi gusta muchisimo el menudo.. > > Chilton Ach, noo a' ken what yer meanin' is, ye Sassenach!! An' why, be tellin' me, would a guid,braw, bonnie, an' brave Hielander like ma sel' iver be wantin, (or needin') ta be speakin' a heathen language like th' ainglish? But a' ken well, laddie tha' ye' have rrresisted well, the temptation ta lerrn the language yersel' Guid fe' ye, an a' wull raise ma cup an' drrink a wee dram t' ye. "Pip,pip old bean" as th'Sassenachs declare whan they're a drinkin' the filth we Scots export especially ta debilitate the ainglish!! Rabbie Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: !2x36 Atlas: Installing QC toolpost problems From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1998 04:34:14 GMT -------- David R. Birch wrote: > I now have my new Dorian/Aloris type QC tool post and I find that > if I install it as offcenter in the compound rest T slot to the > left, the tool holders will still not clear the compound rest. I > want to set the compound rest at a 30 degree angle, but it looks > like I'll have to mill the corner of the compound rest, which I > am not eager to do. Who has already solved this problem? > > David If I understand correctly, you are saying that, in order to bring the tool point on center, the tool holder has to hang below the top of the cross slide? If this is the case it sounds as though your QC system is way too big for your 12" Atlas. And /or You are trying to hold tools that are way too big (deep) And/or your topslide is too close to the center height of your lathe for comfort The size usually recommended is the AXA. This size fits comfortably on my Maximat Super II. The ideal height from top of topslide to lathe center is about 1,110" I skimmed a few thou off my top slide, to bring it to this height, to suit some Hardinge toolholders and accessories I already had. This topslide height will put the tool holder squarely in the center of the sliding gib (I have a Dorian MKII) with about 3/13" clearance over th topslide when I adjust it to put the maximum, 1/2" square,tool bit right on the center height. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Best Kitty Litter? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1998 04:53:57 GMT -------- Gunner wrote: > Ok ok, I can speak as an expert at kitty litter. Taft, Ca. where I > live is the home of the two kitty litter manufactures. Johnny Cat, > (A&M Products) and Golden Cat. Virtually every pound of kitty litter > in the US comes from here. Millions of pounds of the same diatemaceous > earth are pulverized, milled, dried and bagged. You realise that this makes kitty litter a major component of Dynamite!! The other component is Nitro-Glycerine..far too sensitive and dangerous, on its own, to be generally accepted. Nobel's breakthrough was to soak up the Nitro in "Kieslghur"...the German? name for diatomaceus earth...a kind of soft limestone made up of the skeltal remains of trillions of tiny sea creatures. Now, about my neighbor's cat.....here kitty kitty... ;^) Robert Bastow Who would be a helluva fellow in a "political organisation" ======== To: Ostcroix Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: SINE BARS..Alternative methods From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1998 05:29:48 GMT -------- Ostcroix wrote: > Let's say a machinist needed to check that > Angle and it's very critical. And the shop > is too cheap to buy JO blocks. What other > method can the Machinist use to check the Angle? Assuming he has access to an accurate sine bar,and it is not difficult to make your own, it is perfectly ok to make your own block to the required height, You can make it as permanent (Hardened) and as accurate (ground and lapped) as you like. Absent a sine bar, one can resort to using accurate rollers or balls and a micrimeter to measure angles If his shop math is not up figuring out the geometry, he can always go to the library and get "Machinerys Handbook" I am assuming that his boss is too chintzy to buy a copy. Another method is to use a projection comparator. The magnifed shadow of the piece is compared with an accurate drawing, sample or gage. There are many other ways, you will find experienced machinists can figure out a way to do almost anything. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How do you mill a cube accurately From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1998 06:05:07 GMT -------- mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > In article <36200460.E4061282@hotmail.com>, > artificer@netscape.net wrote: > > > > > An experienced machinist is fully aware that nothing on the face of the > > erarth is truly flat, straight,round or rigid. > > > > Not quite. A truly experienced one will have a good estimate in > his mind for how *much* the object deviates from flat, straight, > round or rigid. > > And compensates accordingly - if needed. > > Jim > Yer got that "Bass-Ackwards" Jim!! I wasn't speaking of specific deviations just a FACT that an E.M. keeps in mind. Au contraire to your statement, an experienced machinist has learned, from bitter experience, never to rely on a instinctive judgement or "eyball measurement" on his raw materials or his tackle. Measure twice..cut once, is his maxim. Mistakes are expensive. The "experience" in a machinist comes not from winging it or skipping steps but carrying out those necessary steps with speed and accuracy. Then he KNOWS how much it TRULY deviates from flat, round, straight or square, to the best of his ability and need. If he is wise he will WRITE down those details before he starts, because, especially in a jobbing shop environment, he never knows if or when he may be broken off to do something more urgent and have to pass that job on to another EXPERIENCED Machinist. Only when he has done that does he formulate the best and FASTEST way to make the piece within the required tolerances. Rest assured that if the spec. is tight he will not start to set up and cut metal until he has first checked out his equipment...regardless of whether or not he was the last to use them...................."a good estimate in his mind"..Baloney! And surely, someone will respond with "I have thirty years experience as a machinist....blah blah... But if he propagates baloney, I will respond that it sounds like he has one year of experience...thirty times over!! Respectfully Robert Bastow With forty-one year's of experience.....not all of it repeated (or repeatable..Thank God!!) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Can you use Slick 50 as Cutting and Tapping Oil ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1998 06:45:09 GMT -------- Martin H. Eastburn wrote: > I read in this group about Crisco. I tried it on steel. > Now I have an old Peanut Butter Jar (sans peanut... and label) > in the shop with a serving spoon size lump in it. I press the tap > into the lump and tap away. Works nice on 6061 Al as well. > Cheap as well. > Martin > When "I were a lad", serving my six year aprenticeship we didn't haveall the (excellent) modern cutting and tapping lubricants that are available now. we used "suds" ( emulsion of lard oil in water) for machining. straight lard oil for tougher jobs and sulphurised EP oil for real arduous machining like hobbing gears for warships and gundrilling or trepanning deep holes in naval gun barrels. The favorite for tapping on all materials, including all grades of steel, Stainless steel, phosphor bronze, admiralty and aluminum bronzes, alluminum alloys and brasses, Monel Metal, titanium and a host of others, was home made. We would heat up a small can of tallow or suet, even lard in a pinch, and stir in as much powdered graphite as it would hold. the resultant mix, when it cooled was about the consistancy of boot polish. to use, you poked your hand tap in it and tapped away. Hint, when hand tapping..ignore the text books...they repeat the mistakes of people a century ago. Modern taps are designed to cut, not tear the material..and to BREAK the CHIPS. Do NOT except under extreme circumstances repeatedly back off the tap to "break the chips" chances are you will break the tap. The modern, HSS ground thread tap, properly sharpened and with the appropriate lubrication will tap a hole "straight through" without reversals at every turn. Don't believe me? Visit a jobbing machine shop and watch them tapping holes all day long on a drill, mill or lathe, and using HAND taps...often without benefit of a tapping head. The reason taps "bind" are: a. the tap is blunt. b. set out of square or torqued unevenly. c. galling...choose a tap with a suitable finish..of which there are many. d. frequent reversals.......leading to chipped teeth...leading to a. above Coincidentally, I would like to make up some of this black "Goop" for my own use, now my new shop is getting to the point of actually "making stuff" Can anyone tell me where I might find some powdered graphite? Cheers, Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: An elegant solution..was Hare brained From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1998 14:09:02 GMT -------- plastic wrote: > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > > > I dont know if you can get it in America but the ASSAB steel > (Associated Swedish Steel) company sells "hollow bar" steel in various > grades including tool steel grades. This is essentially a very heavy > walled tube. They have various wall thickness/diameters available. > You could also use solid steel. I dont think cast iron running in a > cast iron head is a good or practical option. My thought too, but hollow bar tends towards the "spendy" which is whyI suggested trying to scare some up at "jones the scrap" We have one here in Atlanta and a suitable chunk, if it were to be found might cost twenty bucks > > > I still believe that if you are using the back of the "dove tailed > runner", even turned to match the ID of the head that if it is only > bolted/pinned it will move and negate the whole purpose of the job. > get a slot broached so the "dove tail" piece can be fully located. > Absolutely, although properly fitted, hardened dowels, or taper pins willstand up to a heck of a lot of thumping in a die set. As this is a low- stress application, dowells will probably be more that adequate..certainly worth proving out. I have in mind also, the possibility of marketing this as a conversion kit, and here, of course, minimum complexity and cost are important. To mill an integral key on the fixed :slider would prevent the use of his elegant solution of turning it "in situ" with the column. To machine a slot in he slider for a fixed key would add complexity to both the supplier and the supplyee, and introduce two or three probable sources of error. Bear in mind, that any angular error will have a twisting effect that will be multiplied many-fold at the spindle. Broaching a slot is a "one shot deal" whereas the bolted "slider" can be proved out for alignment before finally, inserting the dowels. Finally, a dowelled construction, as in tool and die work can be realigned by reaming the holes oversize and fittiing new dowel pins, or in the case of taper pins, tapping in new ones in deeper after re-reaming. I would prefer taper pins but the reamers are spendy for a one shot deal. Respectfully Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How to Cut Steel with a saw? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1998 14:22:58 GMT -------- Glenn Lyford wrote: > >> Actually, does anyone know the RPM that these things operate at? > >> Somewhere around 200RPM? > >> > >> Mike Graham > >> > > > >Usually they are variable speed but IIRC that would be about mid range. > > > >Robert Bastow > > > I just received a Grizzly catalog, they offer a cold saw blade for > use in their abrasive cut-off saw, prices run about the same as for > the rest of the saw... > --Glenn OUCH!!A Cold saw needs to be a whole lot more robust and rigid than a chopsaw, and run a whole lot slower..unless they are talking about cutting aluminum. When I had my own jobbing and tool and die shop, I cut tens of thousands of pieces of custom extruded aluminum sections, with a chop saw, using ten inch blades, made for that purpose, and purchased at the local Wallymart. I also had a cold saw for ferrous materials, and that weighed ten or twenty times as much as the chop saw. Robert Bastow ======== To: Brian Hornaday Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Suggestion for new RCM group (WAS: Clinton, resign...) From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1998 14:28:43 GMT -------- Brian Hornaday wrote: > I like this group, in fact I credit you guys/gals as the source of most of > my metalworking knowledge and everything not relating to welding (gotta > thank old Mr. Tilford for that). What I think we should do is create a sub > group called rec.crafts.metalworking.clinton-opinions and get the national > debate off of the group. I realize I don't have to read them, but they > really don't have a place here. Face it, everyone here has formed their > opinion, and no amount of verbal (written) sparring is going to change our > minds. > > Respectfully, > > Brian Hornaday Here, Here.I'm done with this thread. rec. guns.politics is doing a great job of cluttering up the ethernet with Clinton and similar garbage if anyone needs a "fix"! Robert Bastow ======== To: "Scott S. Logan" Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: SINE BARS?? NEED HELP From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1998 14:54:24 GMT -------- Scott S. Logan wrote: > As Robert pointed out, making a sine bar is possible, although I would > spend the relatively small amount and buy a good one. > When I was an apprentice, making a sine bar and plate was a standard "Government" job, along with toolmaker's vices, miniature angle plates, "1-2-3' blocks, angle slips and a whole host of other toolmaker's acoutrements. On $6.00 a week we couldn't afford "boughten" tools. We were allowed to do this at lunch hour, and after work...the company freely supplying materials, equipment and heat treatment. Most were made of cyanide case hardened HRS, Ground and lapped to at least inspection grade standards. They had to pass through our Inspection Dept. (a right bunch of "bar-stewards") and be stamped or etched, before we were allowed to use them in the shops I still have and use regularly, all my stuff including a full 81 piece set of Inspection grade 1" square gage blocks that are traceable and have "passed muster" with visiting Quality Auditors on numerous occasions. Robert Bastow ======== To: "Richard H. Williams" Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: FS: Rhino, the best 3d modeling program at the best price From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1998 16:02:07 GMT -------- Richard H. Williams wrote: >Andrew Werby wrote: > >> Since many of us are model makers as well as computer-users, I thought > >> I'd mention Rhino, which I think is the best 3d modeling tool available > > >I am a model maker, and I was wondering if the Rhino could build me a 1 1/2" > >scale "Big Boy". You know, like carve it out of solid in one setup? > > >Or are we talking about a whole differnt kind of "Model Making" here? ;^) > > >Robert Bastow > > Bob: Are you actually building something like this? Can you actually find > the real estate to run it? A fella out our way built a 3" (yes quarter > size) pacific that is just enormous, and very taxing on the track. > > Rich Williams Hi Rich, No I was only kidding..sorta!! I would love to build a 1 1/2" "Big Boy" or better still the 1 1/2" scale "King George V" from Reeves' exquisite castings. And Yes...I do have the real estate to run it! Robert, PS I do really prefer "Robert"...I was "Bob" for too many years and he was not a very nice person...you wouldn't want to meet "Bob"!! ;^) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Suggestion for new RCM group (WAS: Clinton, resign...) From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1998 16:14:25 GMT -------- Scott A. Moore wrote: > .................................................................................................. > For example, > Clinton would not have that problem if....... he had an unfortunate groin accident > with a lathe....... NOT FUNNY!!!! ;^) I saw an apprentice hit in the nuts by a 2 pound chunk of steel that flew out of the chuck! Dropped him like a log. No permanent damage, fortunately. Brought tears to his glass eye tho'!! > FBI disclaimer: ........... Too little too late. The FBI have NO sense of humor, and precious little sense of priorities! Look out your window Scott...see that van across the road?? Cheers, Robert ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What are CNC machines used for ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1998 16:37:10 GMT -------- mledtje@my-dejanews.com wrote: > I(Scott A. Moore) wrote: > >> Here's a stupid subject, or is it ? > >> > >> What, exactly, are CNC machines used for ? > If our competitors had access to CNC and we did not we would not be able to > stay in business. Any Jobbing shop that did not use CNC as much as possible would die of starvation! Go check out a few of your local ones..you will be made more than welcome. Strike up a relationship there and you might, eventually be given access to their scrap bin, or even get a few small subcontract jobs to earn some "tool money"! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Can you use Slick 50 as Cutting and Tapping Oil ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1998 16:53:59 GMT -------- Felice Luftschein & Nicholas Carter wrote: > >Hint, when hand tapping..ignore the text books...they repeat the > >mistakes of people a century ago. Modern taps are designed to cut, not > >tear the material..and to BREAK the CHIPS. > Gun taps are certainly designed to do this, but a lot of my hand taps > need to be backed up, or they jam, especially used under power. > Besides some of my taps are practically antiques, having come from > estate sales, etc. As I clearly stated, I was refering to MODERN, SHARP, Hand Taps!! I would respectfully suggest you invest in a few of your most frequently used taps. Buy the best you can afford, avoid the "Imports", this is not a place to skimp! You will be delighted with their performance, and your investment will be amply returned, if only in reduced stress levels!! Robert Bastow PS. If you enjoy high stress levels, try setting up a (shop built),high speed "ejector"type, deep hole drilling machine. Tooling can go from $300+ to garbage in two seconds flat. You need the reactions of a snake, the concentration of a chess player and the deductive powers of a nobel prize physicist! Guaranteed to make your palms sweat!! Robert ======== To: Felice Luftschein & Nicholas Carter Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Suggestion for new RCM group (WAS: Clinton, resign...) From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1998 17:06:59 GMT -------- Felice Luftschein & Nicholas Carter wrote: > Well, if you were hanging around in a shop, having a few beers at the > end of the day, these subjects would certainly come up, as well as all > the other political debates we engage in. Topics like taxation, gun > control, environmental regulation, etc. are germane to the running of > a shop and the practice of metalworking. We should be adding the OT > prefix to the posts, so newcomers know that what the newsgroup is > primarily about is metalworking, not healthy intellectual debate. > > I find it interesting that although we have a few dyed in the wool > liberals, and a few hardcore social conservatives, most on this group > have a pragmatic fiscal conservative/social liberal outlook. If only > we ran the world. > > The U.S. has a healthy tradition of free political discussion, in > spite of the powers that be, and I like to see it exercised. My only > complaint is that people should think about the common ground of their > philosophies: right to bear arms, gay rights, ending excessive gov. > regulation, ending public land pollution, decriminalization of drugs, > lowering taxes, all have the same root, that of promoting individual > private liberty. Someday we'll all work together and all the > entrenched politicians will be out of work. > > Hell yes I'm a Libertarian. Well said, that man!! Robert Bastow Who CHOSE to become an American in the firm belief that this IS the Land of the Free and the Brave. And who believes that, one day, we WILL settle our minor differences, and work together to build this Great Nation into what it is truly capable of becoming. We owe that much at least to our children and their children!! Who may not believe in what you say, but will fight to the death to defend your right to say it!! An' oil foight the man who sez it isn't so!! ;^) Robert ======== To: Chas Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: early turn benches, or lathes From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1998 17:24:59 GMT -------- Chas wrote: > I've been experimenting with a foot-powered wood lathe for a while, but > would like to try a different variation. Does anyone have resources they > can suggest on making a "turn-bench," or small bow-lathe such as was > used by watchmakers for fine work? > > I've got access to Joseph Moxon's "Mechanic Expercises"(circa 1680) but > he really just mentions it in passing as part of his chapters about > turning. I've posted to rec.crafts.woodturning, but have gotten no > response. > > Chas > -- > MacGregor Games > Purveyors of historic pastimes to re-enactors around the world > http://www.historicgames.com Try "Fine Woodworking" for treadle, bow and spring "Lathe" ( pronounced "lat"..a springy stip of wood and the origin of the name of our modern lathes) One of the neatest "serious wood turning lathes I ever saw, was based on a bicycle hub gear with freewheel. and driven by a length of bicyle chain. One end was attached to a foot treadle with a heavy flywheel and it went up and over the drive gear to a coil return spring. This developed some seriously useable, smooth, power and speed. Such a drive, mounted under the headstock with a flat belt, multi-step pulley drive to the spindle would make for a very useable set of "Turns" or a precision Clock and Instrument Lathe. The range of speeds (20 or more+ variable speed treadling. would be ideal. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: A question about stainless steel and magnetism. From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1998 17:39:30 GMT -------- mrsfixit@TheGarage.com wrote: > I was wondering why a magnet won't stick to some grades of stainless steel? > > Candice > mrsfixit@postoffice.ptd.net Too little iron and nickel and too much (non-magnetic) chrome. PS, there are no "dumb" questions only dumb answers! Never be afraid to ask if you don't know.. ther is no shame in "ignorance" because.... "Ignorance can be fixed..Stupid is forever!!" Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Are you all strange? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1998 17:59:54 GMT -------- PLAlbrecht wrote: > Professor Bruce Plastic wrote > > >Personally I think these poof types are strange. They are only tolerated not > accepted. > > G'Dai, Bruce. > We will now have the reading of the rules of RCM. Rule one: NO POOFTAHS. Does this include Ladies of a homosexual persuasion?I certainly hope not! One of the best apprentices I ever employed, was as butch/dyke as they come. But she? made a helluva tool and diemaker and could run rings around most men in areas of skill and expertise. (As well as in arm wrestling and beer drinking) She went on to head up the toolroom of a major aero-space Contractor. I would certainly welcome her in this news group. Regardless of her pecadillos. I would like to think ANYONE who comes here to learn and to contribute would be welcome no matter what their sexual prefference. I truly trust that your post was in jest. If so it was in poor taste and the joke should be made clear to a casual observer or better still, withdrawn. "You are known by the company you keep" and I prefer nNOT the company of Bigots! Respectfully Robert Bastow (Who has his own Pecadillos) ;^) > Professor Bruce (who is in charge of the sheep dip) Plastic has finally come out of the closet!! ;^) Perhaps he is a Bigamist or a Pimp!! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: An elegant solution..was Hare brained From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1998 18:11:20 GMT -------- Kelley Mascher wrote: > > > How about milling a 90 degree V into the column and a matching > 90 degree V in the head (vertically, of course). Fit and pin a > piece of keystock into the square opening you have created. > You could probably fit a gib to the V groove on the head. > This would have been my first choice, and is similar to the "Urwick wedge key" the only drawback IMHO is the difficulty most people would have in broaching a Vee keyway inside the head casting. bearing in mind that this is a "one shot deal and any angular error will be magnified at the spindle. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: SINE BARS?? NEED HELP From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1998 21:25:12 GMT -------- Phil Clark wrote: > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > angle slips > snip > > What is an angle slip please? > > I am a self taught, would-be, amateur machinist. My books don't cover > angle slips. Thanks That's what we called them, now called angle blocks and sold by MSC, Grizzly etc. Made of steel about 3-4"" long 1/2' thick, cyanide case hardened, stabilised with a liquid nitrogen quench, ground and lapped. Look like a set of parallels with the top edge "wonky" This because it is lapped to a very accurate included angle with the base. A good starter set would have angles from 5 deg, by 5deg steps to 30 deg. plus a 45 deg., and from 1 deg to 5 deg in steps of one deg. Used individually, or wrung together like Gage block they are a quick and accurate setup aid. I use them a hundred times more often than my sine bar or plate. You could add a further range of 5 minute slips os even 5second slips. but that would be overkill I can honestly say that in my entire career I have had to set up a non aliquot angle to +/-- 1 second of arc maybe three or four times. Robert Bastow ======== To: PLAlbrecht Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Are you all strange? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1998 21:34:15 GMT -------- Okay Okay already!! Uncle! Uncle! You are right I was wrong ! and I apologise in front of God and everybody. OK? Sorry you caught me on a day when my piles were giving me GYP!! It probably WILL happen again, so bear with me OK? Sheesh--settle down and take one of your tablets Perhaps a nap might help!! Hey...whose day is it it watch this guy anyway 8^) cordially Robert "todays butthead" Bastow ======== To: James Wilkins Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Can you use Slick 50 as Cutting and Tapping Oil ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 12 Oct 1998 21:47:09 GMT -------- James Wilkins wrote: > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > ...Don't believe me? Visit a > > jobbing machine shop and watch them tapping holes all day long on a > > drill, mill or lathe, and using HAND taps...often without benefit of a > > tapping head. > > I've tapped many electronics rack rails #10-32 with a hand-held VSR > drill, changing the tap every thousand or so holes in case it was > getting dull. I use my VSR to free hand tap up to 3/8" in steel and 1/2" in CI and ally. through or blind. No secret except a sharp tap (as James confirms).. the right lube, the courage of your convictions, and a good eye for square. > > > > ...Can anyone tell me where I might find some powdered graphite? > > Robert Bastow > > Lock oil. > > jw Ta s'much> Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Stolen Suburbans From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1998 00:40:43 GMT -------- Mike Graham wrote: > I'm 6' 300 lbs. I've had experienced horse folks gape at the way I > can anchor a horse (i.e. keep them from going anywhere). .............. > I had the halter rope quite slack, because she calmed down that way, and > anyway I just braced myself and when she hit the end of the rope she > flipped right sideways off her feet. Hey, I guess this guy wasn't kidding when he said he was a bouncer in a biker bar. I had nasty reminder of the power of horses. (don't you love it when they stand on your foot and the harder you push 'em the more they bear down..) Many years ago I was going through a "horsey" phase and was into point to point and hunter trialing. I had a big, (17 1/2 hands) rangy, mean,sonofabitchin' , thoroughbred, ex-steeplechaser, called Tosca. I got him cheap, when they retired him early, with a split hoof, which we fixed with a bar-shoe. I was the only person he wouldn't try to kill in his loosebox. He tried it a couple of times and then we had a "Come to Jesus" meeting and he never tried it again..with me! The compensation was that this corn-fed fellah could run like the wind ..flat out over fences, across country....next best thing to s*x......Come to think of it....8^) Anyhoo, the only other person who could handle him in the paddock was a young slip of a lass who had the gift of hores talking. Mind you, if she had whispered an' cooed in MY ear the way she did HIS I would have followed her ANYplace she wanted to take me. Until , one morning she was leading him out for exercise, with a rope halter wrapped around her hand. For some unknown reason Tosca spooked and tossed his head. The girls thumb was torn clean out of its socket!!! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Stolen Suburbans re-buke - british_ad.htm (0/1) - british_ad.gif (0/1) From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1998 01:31:39 GMT -------- Gunner wrote: > gunner@lightspeed.net (Gunner) wrote: > > An interesting bit of trivia for those of you whom feel that British > gun laws are wonderful. This ad is from the 1940s, Taken from the > American Rifleman, the publication of the National Rifle Association. > Gramps sent several of his guns, including some handguns to help arm > the Brits, seems the silly buggers had taken most of the arms from the > subjects even then. And the Hun was knocking at their doors. > Enjoy your crow. > >Gunner > > For a period before I left England, I was an avid collector and shooter, mainly of muzzle loaders but I always had a couple of modern pistols about for "plinking" Back in those pre-ban days, one could get a Firearms Certificate (FAC... better known as a "ticket), if one could show good reason and usually only for use at a registered target range. Hovever you didn't need the contacts of "The Jackal" to easily pick up an "off ticket" weapon of ANY type. usually cheaper than a legal one. Every shooter and gun collector I ever met had several, if not many, "off ticket" guns. Well now they have banned all the legal hand guns and called them all in from the people that tried to follow the law. Do the silly buggers imagine they got all the OFF ticket guns as well...hell no but they can sop the public with that and THOSE stupid buggers will believe them. Well, now they have criminalised hand guns....by definition, only criminals will have guns, (Hmmm..where have I heard THAT truism before??) I can guarantee that if I were to return to Blighty and IF, for whatever reason, I needed a hand gun, an UZI, a Bazooka, or an M60 tank.I could lay my hands on one within 24 hours..Hey there's no waiting period or background check required! And my search would begin in the nearest pub! In fact, one transatlantic phone call, and I could have it waiting for me when I got off the plane!! So my fine British (OZ , Kiwi et.al. friends) get down off your high horses. Heck..the massacre of school kids in Scotland was by a Nutbar with an FAC and a LEGAL gun collection. Hey don't blame the guns or even the Barmpot shooter!! Blame the STUPID Police and Laws that allowed him to have one in the first place...With a mental record like his, he wouldn't be allowed, under current legislation, to buy one , legally, in the United States!! If he tried, he would be in for a sh**pot full of grief! As I recall both Oz and N.Z have had their share of people "Gone Postal" in each case with permitted weapons. Respectfully, Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Can you use Slick 50 as Cutting and Tapping Oil ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1998 01:54:07 GMT -------- Michael P. Henry wrote: > What brands of taps and dies do you recommend? > AMERICAN!!! Cleveland is my first choice for "staples" but I have been very satisfied with "Generic" US made taps, when I need an expensive ,large nonstandard tap for a "One -off" I get most of my stuff from MSC..never had a complaint about quality or service. I bought a couple of tandem ACME taps on sale for $40.25 each. A left and a right hand 1/2" 10tpi, for a special project. Tested this weekend on Aluminum-Bronze and Con-Cast Iron, they worked like a treat. These, from MSC were "generic" USA manufacture. Truth be known these generics are probably made by the major "names" just as "Own Brand" products at the grocery store are made by Kelloggs etc. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: SINE BARS?? NEED HELP From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1998 02:05:29 GMT -------- k.kinnison wrote: > Please keep response as simple as possible, > > bar elevation = bar length x sine of desired angle. > > so much for a simple answer, jeeeezzzzz > Lets not confuse the lad! If you actually read the response you will see that my post was not in response to the original question..Your research may show you that has already been done..simply!! My post was in fact in response to Mr. Clarks perfectly justified question regarding ANGLE BLOCKS!! > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > Phil Clark wrote: > > > > > > > > > > What is an angle slip please? > > > > > > I am a self taught, would-be, amateur machinist. My books don't cover > > > angle slips. Thanks > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Stolen Suburbans re-buke From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1998 13:08:14 GMT -------- James Wilkins wrote: > It was acquaintances, not family members, but in practice it means your > (Huge snip) > Do you hear anyone campaigning against pleasure boats, or to require > steak to be sold as hamburger? No, neither of them is a way to attack > only conservatives. A first class, well thought out, and well written response James! ThankYou, Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Stolen Suburbans re-buke From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1998 13:08:40 GMT -------- James Wilkins wrote: > It was acquaintances, not family members, but in practice it means your > (Huge snip) > Do you hear anyone campaigning against pleasure boats, or to require > steak to be sold as hamburger? No, neither of them is a way to attack > only conservatives. A first class, well thought out, and well written response James! ThankYou, Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: SINE BARS?? NEED HELP From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1998 13:16:58 GMT -------- k.kinnison wrote: > I certainly was not attacking the answer to the gentleman's post, only the > length at which this thread has grown. > Your post just happened to be most recent. > So before you wet yourself, I will apologize for any frustration I may have > caused you. > Possibly start a new thread on " ANGLE BLOCKS" would be interesting. I too, apologise Mr Kinnison, for over-reacting and not "looking before I leaped" However, though advancing years inevitably cause medical and physical problems incontinence is not one of mine yet! ;^) As to a new thread on angle blocks...I will leave that to someone else to start. I have said my piece on that subject. Sincerely, Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: early turn benches, or lathes From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1998 13:37:23 GMT -------- > Chas wrote: > > > I've been experimenting with a foot-powered wood lathe for a while, but > > would like to try a different variation. > > > > Chas Robert Bastow wrote: > One end was attached to a foot treadle with a heavy > flywheel......... One caveat Chas....On any treadle powered machine, especially one with a heavy fly wheel attached, be sure to include a "one way link" That is to say a crank arm with a slot in it or, of course, the chain drive, so that the fly wheel is driven by the treadle but the treadle cannot be driven by the fly wheel. Otherwise, when, not if, you or a bystander, get your foot under the treadle while the flywheel is freewheeling, it will simultaneously try to drive your foot into the ground and lift the machine in the air. The machine will win!! Not something you would enjoy and God forbid it should happen to a child at on of your demos. Regards, Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Double Lead Threads From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1998 14:03:59 GMT -------- Jim Santee wrote: > How do you cut double lead threads? > > The only way I can think of is to cut one at 1/2 the TPI and then > disengage the lead and rotate the spindle 180 degrees by counting gear > teeth. Will that work? It seems error prone. I thought that I had > seen a post for another way. Yes that will work, so long as you make it clear that you mean disengage the gear drive 'twixt spindle and lead screw and not simply the half-nuts. An even simpler method is to wind back the topslide the required distance to start the second (or third or fourth) thread. The math is a little more complex if your topslide is set at half thread andgle but most people could figure it out. Working on the same principle as your suggestion there are indexing chucks and I have an indexing driver plate that will allow me to cut threads up to eight start...not that I ever contemplate cutting an eight start thread!!...... Life is too short for that! The simplest way, if you are turning between centers, is to have two or more tapped holes in your driver plate (some have two slots for precisely this purpose when using "safety dogs") Myself, I prefer straight dogs, and a straight pin, screwed into a flat plate that doubles as a small face plate. I always tape the driver to the pin to prevent overrun and those irritating "clonking" noises! Anyhow the trick is, after finishing the first thread, you simply remove the drive pin and replace it at 180 degrees, (for a two start..120deg, for a 3 start...90deg for a 4 start....you get the picture..) pop the job back between centers and continue cutting your next thread. That's it...s'F.M. 8^) Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Krono Labs "Kroilz" (sic.) Sought From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1998 14:08:48 GMT -------- Gunner wrote: > Ill ask the boss at work tommorow, We got a can that works WONDERS for > rusted bolts, Works almost better than Coca Cola for breaking nuts. I agree, coke makes a great rust remover..but it makes it almost undrinkable afterwards! Robert Bastow Who was brought up by "Waste not..Want not" depression era parents!! > Gunner ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How do you mill a cube accurately From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1998 14:17:59 GMT -------- mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > In article <36219D0C.9A4EA853@hotmail.com>, > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > ...................."a good estimate in his > > mind"..Baloney! > > > > Good estimates are not baloney - yes, they have to be accurate. If > a vise has been off square, or the bridgeport head out of tram, then > eyeballing it and saying "right on" is not by any means a good > estimate. > > Good estimates, to be good, have to be accurate - or at least > have the magnitude of the uncertainty and its source understood. > Absolutely, Jim!! But the original post did not convey that context. > Example: > > Estimate how much *your* lathe deflects if pushed on. Imagine > putting a dial indicator in the toolpost, and touching off on > a part in the spindle. Then simply lean on the headstock, as > one often sees done. > Learned that my first day on a lathe as an apprentice, leaned on thetailstock, got a cuff around the ear AND an explanation from the Toolroom Superintendent!! Also picked up on "First you got to get their Attention!!" Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How do you mill a cube accurately From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1998 14:27:48 GMT -------- One final (from me) comment on the subject and then I'll shut up!! I eventually learned, and took pains to pass on to MY apprentices is this. "Extreme accuracy, in your workshop and your methods is not achieved overnight.! Rather it is the slow, methodical, attention to detail, that will inevitably bring the desired results". Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Double Lead Threads From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1998 15:57:33 GMT -------- Richard H. Williams wrote: > Good Info Robert. > > We have done this using a similar technique. Chuck a piece of CRS in a 4 jaw > and turn a center. Use the chuck jaws as a driver for the dog. You could do > a 2 start or a 4 start thread like this. Chuck jaws are accurately spaced. > If there is a problem, usually the dog will spin on the work. Never lost a > chuck yet. 3 start threads? Use a jaw chuck. BRILLIANT!! That,s one I never thought of, and a technique anyone can use, Me included!! Thank you, Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Metal VS Wood From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 13 Oct 1998 16:04:32 GMT -------- plastic wrote: > >We insult Bob Vila plenty ! > > > >He deserves it, too. > > Who is he and why does he deserve insulting? OH-OH! Plastic's looking for a new playmate!! ======== To: Misty & Sean Foley Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Double Lead Threads From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 14 Oct 1998 00:59:35 GMT -------- Misty & Sean Foley wrote: > Could someone please humour the village idiot and explain the how a double > lead thread is used?...Tinker In a double lead nut...silly. 8^) Robert ======== Newsgroups: comp.robotics.misc,sci.engr,sci.engr.mech,sci.engr.manufacturing,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re:Slick 50...LOOONG! From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 14 Oct 1998 03:00:22 GMT -------- Todd Rogers wrote: > Exactly. For tapping all you really need is something to lubricate > (lower friction and remove chips) and act as a coolant. For hand > tapping, almost anything would work (you could probably even get away > with water, though your tools might not last as long that way). Sorry Todd, with all due respect I gotta tell you it ain't so simple. Hand tapping is one of the most arduous machining operations,both for the tap, the resulting thread and for the operator,especially if he doesn't do it every day, and he is tapping 6-32, with a relic tap, in a component that has taken him a year of precious part time to make, and it is made of some tough, stringy "stuff" of indeterminate parentage!!! (Pause for deep breath!) It doesn't pay to be cavalier and slosh on any liquid that comes to hand. Sorry, but water, beer, moonshine,baby oil,or slick 50, won't hack it! (I almost said ..won't cut it! But you'd think I was trying to be "punny") Bear in mind that a tap, especially a hand tap is stressed to it's limit under the best of conditions. Of necessity, the core (the bit down the middle of the tap!!!) is way undersized on a small tap, it is purposely weakened by a host of "stress risers" (32 per inch in this case) it is taking a cut that would stall a small lathe, and on a larger one, single pointing a thread with this depth of cut would result in a badly torn thread. Chuck in a surface speed, ** a tenth of the recommended one and you have a serious problem, just looking for a place to happen. **The reason you get better cutting action close to the maximum speed the tool and the material can stand is that cutting metal is NOT like cutting wood!! A sharp paring chisel or a well set plane actually SHEAR the fibers of wood. Finish is not a function of speed, so much as a function of sharpness. "Cutting" metal is almost the exact opposite..it is a process of PLASTIC DEFORMATION. That is to say, a metal cutting tool does not slice and wedge itself under the surface like a wood chisel..rather it applies EXTREME PRESSURE to the work piece that, coupled with the forward SPEED, creates a zone of extreme HEAT that PLASTICISES the metal and eventually, (rather quickly in practice) it decides to find a friendlier environment, SLIDES over the tool and escapes, taking most of the heat with it! You have probably been made aware of this common phenomenon, by the occasional hot chip down your shirt neck!! (Don't you just HATE that?...Now at least you know WHY! It will also help to explain why, switching from a positive to a negative rake insert, will remove more metal faster, using LESS HP, leave a better finish and a cooler work piece! (Please forgive all my caps..I'm not shouting.....just trying to emphasise the important bits.) The reason a tool wears has not so much to do with abrasion (Which is what blunts a wood chisel) but more to do with the hot metal, welding to the tool surface and physically tearing tiny lumps out of it on its way to your shirt neck. If you doubt my veracity, do a simple test: Take a piece of wood, six inches long, And with a sharp plane take a continuous shaving end to end. Next, take a piece of mild steel the same length, set it up in a shaper and take a good cut end to end. Use a catchers mitt to save your specimen...And your tender neck!! Now, measure the length, width and thickness of the two shavings and compare with the original length,dept and width of your cuts. ( this is an example assignment I used to set to first year engineering student/apprentices at the local Technical College Ok...Back to our original hand tapping problem. Understanding better, the arduous conditions the poor little blighter is expected to put up with, and expecting a pristine thread and an intact heirloom at the end, it behooves us to be sympathetic and to offer the best assistance we can! Consider that, at the speed of a hand tap, very little heat is generated, thus little plastic deformation takes place, thus extreme pressures of the chip on the tooth are created....Add to that, the fact that a tap has no radial relief means that it is also doing a certain amount of cold forming and burnishing! Busy little bugger isn't he?...and you thought YOU were doing all the hard work!!! So what does he need?...Certainly not cooling, which IS a concern in high speed tapping. What he needs is LUBRICATION and lubrication of a HIGH PRESSURE type NOT Slick 50 ferchrissake!...REAL HP additives...the best that money can buy!! Go to a jobbing machine shop...just like we HSM's, these guys have to watch every penny, indeed it comes down to tenths of a penny..just to stay in business! Observe what they use for (the occasional, hopefully) hand tapping job. Fer sure it ain't water! Nor is it machine oil, spindle oil, baby oil, way oil, Slick 50, or any other oily, or greasy fluid that happens to fall to hand or is the "Deal of the Week" at the local Wallymart! What he uses is the best that money can buy..like his taps! He uses a custom formulated, well researched and developed, trusted brand name, dedicated hand tapping fluid that, chintzy as he has to be, he springs all of SIX BUCKS for a can that will last him quite a while, used on a twenty-four/seven basis. I wonder why? Sorry for rambling on Guys but I find........ It helps to figure out HOW ? If you better understand the WHY! Thanks for bearing with me. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re:Gun snatch From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 14 Oct 1998 04:57:05 GMT -------- Robert Bastow wrote: > I can guarantee that if I were to return to Blighty and IF, for > whatever reason, I needed a hand gun, an UZI, a Bazooka, or an M60 tank.I > could lay my hands on one within 24 hours..Hey there's no waiting period > or background check required! And my search would begin in the nearest > pub! In fact, one transatlantic phone call, and I could have it waiting > for me when I got off the plane!! > As a follow up I made that transatlantic call...to my best buddy in the UK. Yes the Filth (Polite English for police) have snatched his legal pistols.. A 9mm Hi-Power, 1911AI Colt and a Bergmann-Mars Automatic. In this last instance, this is a crime against humanity the B-M is a rare, surviving example of a VERY early automatic, renowned for the power of its ammunition. (which is no longer available..not that it matters ..he would no more think of shooting it, than you would your great-great- grandpappies, original, low numbered, mint condition, Walker Colt .44 !!) HOWEVER!.....They never even knew about..so left him with... a collection of over a hundred, OFF-Ticket Pistols (he collects historically interesting automatics, mainly 9mm and all military and or prototypes. I asked him how come he only had three pistols left on his permit and so many off-ticket (about the reverse of what he had when I left England, twenty three years ago) He told me that he, and a lot of other collectors had seen the writing on the wall, many, many years ago, and he had, over the years, sold his "legal" pistols and replaced them with off-ticket weapons. The Bergmann-Mars was irreplaceable, so he just hung on to it to the bitter end. The other two were "Junkers" so that he would have something to give the "Rozzers" to keep them happy. I asked how he felt about the Ban. He said "Great, now I can move my collection from the cellar, to the Gun Room" (Hardened, steel door, Bars, alarms etc, required by previous law, of any FAC permitted gun owner, and subject to random inspection, at ANY time by ANY police officer without warrant!) "Best part is" he chuckled, " the filth won't be popping round at midnight any more, cos they think they cleaned me out!) Its a f***ing JOKE, Guys! OBTW, he still has the Browning Hi-Power, the single action Colt.45 Bisley, the 1911A1, AND the 9mm Sten mk 11 submachine gun, that I left with him 23 years ago! "Sure" he said, " I'll pick you up at the airport any time you come over" "No problem..I'll bring the guns if you need them" "What are you gonna do?...Start a f***in' WAR!....Hey you need anything else..let me know....Charlie still has that box of Mills grenades his Dad brought back from the war!) Gentlemen, the Defense Rests. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: to Curt on Double Lead Threads From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 14 Oct 1998 05:06:18 GMT -------- Richard, W. wrote: > Every time I thought of this there were no engineers around to ask. So this is > my idea of why a multi start thread is better in certain instances. For what > it's worth. May be some one has a better reason than mine? > > Richard W. Quite simple really! Pitch for pitch, a multi start can be more compact and/or stiffer, especially in compression, than the same pitch in a single start. Most ball screws, for CNC positioning are multi-start. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Heavy Black "Fibered" Grease From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 14 Oct 1998 05:31:02 GMT -------- plastic wrote: > > > Okay I give up, what's a 5th wheel for a truck? > Jeez, did you just arrive from Mars? [8^o) The "fifth wheel" on a truck is the STEERING wheel, what else? The sticky black grease is used to hold the drivers hands on the wheel when he takes his legally required nap every few hours. That way they can put it on Cruise Control..kinda like automatic pilot on a 'plane....and keep right on rolling. You see it often on roads in this country, where, you know, of course, that truck grivers are renowned as "Knights of the Road" for their courtesy, their driving skills and of course their patience and consideration for those of us not able to drive as fast as they can, especially in the fast lane at rush hour. Sometimes they will encourage you with melodious, but very genteel little "toots" on their ubiquitous, multi-tone air horns.Quite enchanting, if I may say so. Why, only the other day one came up behind my V12 Jaguar and offered to push me , very gently, of course. But I decline and moved over for him. I felt that 155mph was plenty fast enough for a doddering old POOFTAH like me! Cheers, Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: master copy type From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 14 Oct 1998 06:21:13 GMT -------- titanium@mich.com wrote: > I would like to find out how can go about making my own brass master > copy type used with a pantograph for engraving. Anybody have any ideas? > Thanks > Ralph > titanium@mich.com Been there done that; two simple ways.. Simple way #1 (the one I used) Check in yellow pagers for an _Industrial_ engraving company (not one of these chicken scratch gift or trophy shops) Go down there with a case of premium brew. Explain your problem (they may even have a spare set) Offer to leave a substantial deposit if they will loan you a set of master type for twenty four hours. Drive home _quickly_ and make as many copies in as many sizes as possible. Return promply, and repeat with other fonts. PS. If your pantograph is remotely portable you may have a quicker nod to taking it down there and copying "in situ" PPS. They will be able to put you on to a supplier af brass strip stock that comes in a variety of sizes, ready dovetailed! You just cut it to length. Simple way #2... Draw out your type full size. stick to straight lines and one or two standard radii. Co-ordinate dimension all the straight X and Y cuts try to design for a minimum of different lengths make a full size master for each radius, in the form of a vee groove to suit your follower. do the same for each X and Y cut and each diagonal for Q W R Y K Z (X is same as Z, so is V &A) You can do all this on the pantagraph, on brass stock using straight edges a few stops, and bits and pieces that catch your eye as you get the hang of it. What you are building up are all the bits that you would find on a stencil, only instead of all being neatly punched in a piece of card they are all in a little heap.. you get the drift.. Hint, do the curves in a letter first. FLASH TRAFFIC!! Don't know why I didnt think of it before. Go to your local drafting or artist supplier an get one of those thick plastic Lettering templates, not a stencil but the ones that have all the bits of each complete letter, laid out neatly in rows. To use them you shift the template laterally to line up the elements. You will be able to use it in exactly the same way on your machine. Let me know how you make out Cheers Robert Bastow. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Weight of air, please? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 14 Oct 1998 06:45:31 GMT -------- Elliot Burke wrote: > At STP air weighs 1.29 g/l > there are 1728 cubic inches in a cubic foot and 61 cubic inches in a litre, > so > 1.29 x 1728/61 = 36.543 g/cu ft > there are 28.35 grams / oz, so > 36.543 / 28.35 = 1.29 oz / cu ft > > isn't that neat? > Something's cockeyed Somewhere! Just estimating: If average atmospheric pressure is 14,7 lb/sq ft at sea level And average atmospheric pressure at (say) 20,000 ft is negligible. And the drop in density is assumed to be linear. This means a column of air of constant density 10000 feet high X 1 ft square weighs 14,7 lb 14,7 / 10000 = 0.00147 lb/cu.ft If atmospheric pressure extends out further, the effect is to reduce that figure. atmospheric air contains moisture dry air would weigh less Am I missing something here? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Weight of air, please? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 14 Oct 1998 09:23:15 GMT -------- Robert Bastow wrote: > > Elliot Burke wrote: > > > At STP air weighs 1.29 g/l > > there are 1728 cubic inches in a cubic foot and 61 cubic inches in a litre, > > so > > 1.29 x 1728/61 = 36.543 g/cu ft > > there are 28.35 grams / oz, so > > 36.543 / 28.35 = 1.29 oz / cu ft > > > > isn't that neat? > > > > Something's cockeyed Somewhere! > > Just estimating: > > If average atmospheric pressure is 14,7 lb/sq ft > at sea level > And average atmospheric pressure at (say) 20,000 ft > is negligible. > And the drop in density is assumed to be linear. > This means a column of air of constant density > 10000 feet high X 1 ft square weighs 14,7 lb > > 14,7 / 10000 = 0.00147 lb/cu.ft > > If atmospheric pressure extends out further, the effect > is to reduce that figure. > > atmospheric air contains moisture dry air would weigh less > > Am I missing something here? OK!OK! Mea Culpa Before all the scientific erks leap in and verbally rip me a new one I just realised wher I went wrong!! Atmospheric pressure is, of course 14,7 lb/sq INCH!!!!!!!!!!! Would "Sorry" help? 8^) Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Weight of air, please? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 14 Oct 1998 20:37:10 GMT -------- Louis Boyd wrote: > I thought everyone checked Machinery's handbook first! :-) > > Lou Boyd Naw!...We all figure we know it by heart!! ;^) Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Making Very Small Holes - Funny Story From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 14 Oct 1998 21:05:30 GMT -------- brian whatcott wrote: > In another version, a metal tube is sent, and it is returned (from the U.K in this > case) with three nested tubes and a wire in the interior. > > Brian Whatcott Altus OK That company was Tube Investments, a company I used to work for. SFAIAA it is a true story, never heard about the wire though. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Slick 50...LOOONG! From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1998 01:05:53 GMT -------- Tom Holt wrote: > > > [excellent post snipped] > > Thanks; now tell us what we *really* need to know - how to get the > bits of broken tap out of the hole after you've snapped the ruddy > thing off flush... I dunno..never happened to ME!! ;^) I have never had much succes with tap extractors. Sometimes, but not often, you can gently tap the gruesome remains out in reverse with a small ,flat pointed punch and a SMALL hammer If the component is "not for pretty" I take a stout flat nose punch and a BIG hammer and just belt the sucker right on through!! Itworks better than you might imagine, as the tap threads/flutes being more brittle than the tappee, shear right off and the threads, usually are not much damaged. Best way is to find a local company that will EDM it out. There was thread, recently about, this that came up with dome chemical solutions that I have no experience of. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Stolen Suburbans From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1998 01:49:22 GMT -------- Paul Amaranth wrote: > > > I don't like hearing about people actually *beating* horses, but if > >you give them a light punch in the side of the nose *very* quickly > >after they do something wrong (within three seconds) then it's very > >effective. I don't like to hear about anybody beating anything living, so please don't get the impression that I beat my horse. Our "come to Jesus meeting" lasted a whole lot less than three seconds!! He came at me, in the loose box, teeth bared, determined to rip my face off. For a split second it was him or me! At the time I was an pretty good, amateur, light heavyweight boxer.(Jeez! Where did this other 100Lbs come from??) My instincts took over and I nailed him at the side of his jaw! (a la Blazing Saddles!) Knocked all 17 1/2 hands of him flat on his ass! Never had a problem thereafter..but had to quit boxing because I broke just about every bone in my hand!! ! Went to the ER with my right ring finger sticking out the palm of my hand! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: All read please From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1998 17:18:33 GMT -------- As in most things in life, there is no hard and fast "right and wrong way"...In this or anything else. My preference, depends on the source to which I am replying: For news groups and subscriber lists, I prefer to see and receive, a sensibly edited quote of comment, or question first, followed by response. That way, all readers have the opportunity to understand what the response is all about, with out having to scroll down first and then return to top of page, to read the response. It is quicker and seems more natural to me, to read down rather than down, up, down again. On the other hand, when recieving or sending a response, one on one, to an INDIVIDUAL, I usually assume that they know the question they asked, and put the response first, with a severely edited or deleted question last. I find this to be a generally accepted format over a wide spectrum of correspondents. My pet peeve on news groups is to read hare-brained responses, from people who have obviously no knowledge or experience of the subject, who have OBVIOUSLY failed to read and comprehend previous accurate and definitive responses, and who are taking a "Flyer" just to see their name in print!! This happens a LOT on this NG. IMHO an obviously, technical NG is a forum where one can and should expect, to tap into knowledge, experience and wisdom. In a perfect world, one should not expect to have to wade through a sea of bullshit to get to the truth! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Gunz.. From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1998 18:00:21 GMT -------- CharlieDIY wrote: > > Good idea. We've got laws on the books that regulate social mores, including > what a man or woman may wear, in a manner more fitting to Victorian ideas (or > at least those Victorian ideas that were publicly expressed). That bastion of > over-simplificaton, Reader's Digest, used to run articles on such idiotic laws > but seems to have quit in recent years. > > In some areas it is still legally necessary for someone to precede a motorized > vehicle carrying a lantern, or so I am told. > > Charlie Self > Word Worker I believe oral sex is still against the law in several states. I'll bet a lot of us would have to be mighty hungry to prefer eating steak!! And a large percentage of the population sould be serving life sentences as "three time losers"!!!!!! ;^) Robert "Muff Diver" Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Anti-Jacknife..was Black grease From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1998 18:21:59 GMT -------- Martin H. Eastburn wrote: > > Ok Ok - I'll be straight this time. :) > > The fifth wheel is the metal plate in the middle of the bed > of a pickup that is set up to tow a trailer. > > These are small versions of those used on large Tractor-trailers > that are around the world. > > It looks somewhat like a horseshoe. > > The Grease is needed to lube the plate. > In the UK and probably the rest of the EEC, tractor?trailers have been required, for many years, to be fitted with an "anti-jacknife" auto-locking coupling. This allows for extreme angle,low speed turns but locks up solid in an emergency braking, high speed situation and effectively prevents THE KILLER...."Jackknife" event. As I recall these couplings are not greased. I don't think these are mandated or even available, in the US...I saw a multiple death accident only recently...Where a TT rig had jacknifed at high speed and "wiped out" several other vehicles. Carnage!! Robert Bastow Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Metal VS Wood From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1998 19:02:39 GMT -------- Ted Edwards wrote: > > Lately our accrual rate has gone from about 100/day to about 200/day. > The majority of these have nothing to do with metalwork. I have no > interest in "stolen suburbans", "junkyard dogs" or "harleys". The odd > diversion is fun but I am unwilling to spend the amount of time required > to plow through a couple hundred off topic posts. I guess I can say > that I see the problem as two fold. Far to many off topic posts and far > too many repititions probably due to folk not reading other replies > before posting. What you all do about it, if anything, is up to you but > if this trend continues, I for one won't be here. > > Ted Well said, Ted. Me too! I enjoy some of the rambling threads but they do have half lives approaching that of plutonium! Maybe it's time to kill a few, and lets see what next our fertile, but unfocused, collective minds can come up with! Robert Bastow Who will sin no more. Yeh!...Right!! ;^) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Metal VS Wood From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1998 19:12:13 GMT -------- plastic wrote: > > Ted Edwards wrote: > Far to many off topic posts and far > >too many repititions probably due to folk not reading other replies > >before posting. What you all do about it, if anything, is up to you but > >if this trend continues, I for one won't be here. > > > >Ted > > > Buy now. > > Regards > David Lamprell Surprise! Surprise! Another pearl of wisdom from our Ass...Er...AUssie, "Enfant Terrible"! Buy WHAT David? I wasn't aware Ted was selling anything!! Sorry, but you walked right into that one David! All in jest of course. ;^) Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Any body doing any metalwork? (or, 'nother good day in the shop) From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1998 19:46:54 GMT -------- James Wilkins wrote: > > Curt Brown wrote: > > > > > What type/style/size boring bar do you use to pass down a long tiny > > hole? > > > > - Curt > > Old, long ones made from drill rod(?) The limiting factor of length/diameter is always deflection and its soulmate..Chatter! The determining factor of deflection under load, is the "stiffness" of the material...Called "Youngs Modulus" or "E" The Youngs Modulus, (to paraphrase a recent contributor,) "for any material that can pass itself off as steel, from low carbon junk, at 30,000 psi tensile, to high alloy, heat-treated, Maraging Steel at 250,000 psi, is exactly the same at 30X10power6!" In other words, two samples of similar cross section and length, will deflect the SAME distance, providing the load is below the YIELD POINT of the weaker material. The only difference between the two, in this example, is the load required, and the distance deflected, before deflection is PERMANENT. Boring bars, made from each material, of similar dimensions, would each have the SAME performance down a deep hole. The ONLY way to STIFFEN a boring bar is to choose a material with a higher Youngs Modulus! In Industry the choice is solid Tungsten Carbide...Spendy but VERY effective. Note: Many designs of "Anti-Chatter" or "Vibration Damping" boring bars have been put on the market, Some, plumb don't work worth a rats ass! Some are VERY effective! All are more expensive that solid carbide bars. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Who supplies mechanical prototyping kits? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 15 Oct 1998 20:00:16 GMT -------- brian whatcott wrote: > > On Thu, 15 Oct 1998 10:19:18 -0400, Alex Koelb,euroserve@mediaone.net > says... > > > >Hi, there: > >Does anyone know where I can buy a mechanical prototyping kit, i.e. > >miniature components like wheels, gears, clutches, shafts, springs, > >slides, motors, bearings and anything for experimental work and tests? > >Alex > > > There was one incomparable resource: Meccano ( a metal construction set) > There were beautiful brass spurs and worms and crowns, angle strips and thin > plates, curves and all.... Still have a box of stuff somewhere. Good suggestion, The Berg et. al. stuff is VERY spendy! Meccanno is still on the market, I believe they have a web site, or at least a NG. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Anti-Jacknife..was Black grease From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1998 01:09:41 GMT -------- John Stevenson (very rudely)wrote: > > On Thu, 15 Oct 1998 18:21:59 GMT, Robert Bastow wrote: > > >In the UK and probably the rest of the EEC, tractor?trailers have been required, > >for many years, to be fitted with an "anti-jacknife" auto-locking coupling. > >This allows for extreme angle,low speed turns but locks up solid in an emergency > >braking, high speed situation and effectively prevents THE KILLER...."Jackknife" > >event. > > > >As I recall these couplings are not greased. > > Load of bollocks. > There is No regs here either EEC or otherwise to require artics to have anti > jackknife couplings. > They played with these a few years ago but dropped them. > > John Stevenson at > Well EXCUUUUSE me!! Should have deferred to the REAL EXPERT! Thank you for your prompt correction John. Certainly, for several years before I left that benighted (and Blighted) land,in 1976, there WAS a legal requirement for the anti-jacknife device. Why and when, they dropped it, I will leave you to explain. Or maybe it is well before your time. You sound (and certainly ACT) as though you might be far too young to remember so far back. Respectfully as ever Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Gunz.. From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1998 01:21:25 GMT -------- Eric R. Snow wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > >I believe oral sex is still against the law in several states. I'll bet a lot of > >us would have to be mighty hungry to prefer eating steak!! And a large > >percentage of the population sould be serving life sentences as "three time > >losers"!!!!!! ;^) > > > >Robert "Muff Diver" Bastow > After reading some of the posts I'll bet that there are a lot of guys > that wouldn't go diving. And I imagine that there are even some who > have no clue what you are talking about. I don't mean non-americans > either. > ERS I'll see your Shopsmith and raise you a Bridgeport on that wild assumption!! The rest of the world has known about "muff diving" for centuries before Linda Lovelace finally introduced it to the Americans! 8^o Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Metal VS Wood From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1998 01:28:24 GMT -------- plastic wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > >> By now. > >> > >> Regards > >> David Lamprell > > > > > >Surprise! Surprise! > > > >Another pearl of wisdom from our Ass...Er...AUssie, "Enfant Terrible"! > > > >Buy WHAT David? I wasn't aware Ted was selling anything!! > > > >Sorry, but you walked right into that one David! > > > >All in jest of course. ;^) > > > >Robert Bastow > > > Touche, I did, walk into that so I have modified my screw up. Hope you > got a laugh anyway. > > Regards > David Lamprell As always David, as always, mon frere. 8^) Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Metal VS Wood From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 16 Oct 1998 02:43:59 GMT -------- darby wrote: > > bye now (I did so look it up) > > darb > > plastic wrote: > > Touche, I did, walk into that so I have modified my screw up. Hope you > > got a laugh anyway. > > > > Regards > > David Lamprell Be patient with him, God hasn't quite finished with him yet! That or he was built on a Friday!!! Or maybe he was too busy, pushing his way to the front of the Dick Line, and didn't have time to go through the Brains Line! David, three strikes and you're out! Can you say "Dik-shon-ary"? 8^) 8^) 8^) Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re:Double Lead Threads-Bottle molds From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 17 Oct 1998 07:20:56 GMT -------- Richard, W. wrote: > > I guess we may never know. It could also be the way the engineer wanted it done. > > Richard W. "Kurt says... > > > >I dunno. They are much more intricate than those on a pop (soda) bottle. > >They gotta be harder to mold as well. . . > > > >>I would think that the multi start on the OJ bottle would have more > >>to do with the molding of the threads. > >> Richard W For a long period, I had subcontracts for bottle molds for a large glass plant. Molds were turned from split, doweled and clamped blanks machined from close grained grey iron After roughing out the interior, it was turned to finish shape on a German made hydraulic copying lathe. This machine had a second spindle behind the main spindle and geared to it. The drive ratio could be set at 1:1, 1:2, 1:3, etc. There was a corresponding second bed and tailstock for the second spindle. With this spindle you had a choice of copying from a flat plate master, held in special clamps, a stationary cylindrical master, held between centers,or a rotating master, if the finished job was anything but round. For instance,we could finish machine,ready for thread milling and polishing, an exact internal,mirror image mould for an old fashioned style, Coca-cola bottle..including the logos and lettering!! The multi-start threads in the mould were then cut by thread milling, on a thread milling machine using a solid shank milling cutter of the correct profile about 3/8" dia. We ground these from standard "Woodruff" keyway cutters. If you take a close look ar the moulded thread on a bottle or jar, you will observe that the thread does not go all the way round the neck. It stops with a radiused "Higby" just short of the mould part line, and recommences with another "Higby" just the other side of it. This is done to eliminate problems with a raised part-line or flash on the thread itself. Whether a MARKETING Dept, or PURCHASER of the bottles, specifies 3, 5, 7, or any other number of starts to the thread, is of supreme indifference to the toolmaker that makes the mould, or the engineer that runs the moulding plant..It's just metal to cut and glass to mould. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Collets: R8 vs 5C. From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 17 Oct 1998 07:46:53 GMT -------- ppierce wrote: > I have a couple of 5C mounted chucks. 3" 4 jaw, and 4" 3 jaw. > They come in other sizes. > > I use also a Jacobs chuck with a 3/4" straight arbor in a 5C in the > headstock of my lathe... They all go real nice in the spindex... > > -- > Paul in AJ AZ, I too have the 5C mounted chucks. 3" 4 jaw, and 3 jaw from Sherline. Excellent quality and VERY useful. I am just putting the finishing touches to an upgrade of my spin indexer to a full blown 40:1 worm and wheel dividing/rotary machining center, complete with division plates and sectors. Very similar to a blown up G H Thomas Versatile Dividing Head This will take all my 5C tooling from the lathe including a custom 6" dia face plate with tee slots. The head will fit on the lathe tee slotted cross slide, on my hefty, shop made vertical slide, and on my shaper and mill. I have always wanted to have an integrated shop, and this goes a long way towards that goal The one draw back of 5C collets appears to be that lack of holding power for extreme operations. I strongly suggest R8 for a mill. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Gunz..(+ humor) From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 17 Oct 1998 08:05:32 GMT -------- Two High School kids have gone "Parkin' and Sparkin'" and are steaming up the windows in a remote, dark, parking area. A bright light and a rap on the widow disturbs them. "And just what do you think you're doing?" Says the Cop. "Just necking" says the boy. "Then put your neck back in your pants, and move on." Says the Cop! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Toolroom Lathe? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 17 Oct 1998 08:24:29 GMT -------- GMasterman wrote: > > How do define a toolroom lathe What makes a toolroom lathe different from any > other lathe of similar size? Any ideas? Gerry Size for size, 1000 to 2000 lbs of extra weight Built to higher standards of precision. Higher top speed, wider range of speeds, feeds and threads. Extra "goodies"...high speed threading, retractable topslide better, more acurate feedscrews etc.,etc... Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re:Radius v Dia dials From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 17 Oct 1998 08:42:44 GMT -------- rabue@my-dejanews.com wrote: >Things like dials > that read directly in thousandths taken off the diameter, Whether you like direct diameter reading dials, or radius reading is a matter of personsonal preference. I have replaced the 2.25" dia. direct reading dials on my Maximat Super II with 3.25" dia, black anodised aluminum radius reading dials from Sherline. Reasons: When I had my own T&D shop with several lathes..I never had anyone take off too much because of a radius dial...happened all the time on the direct ones. direct dials are ok for a machine that has a single operator per shift and an operator who runs only that or similar lathes. I prefer to have similar increments/division on top slide, cross slide, carriage, tailstock,vertical slide, mill shaper.etc.. Using the lathe for many different functions, as most of us do makes a direct reading dial a pain in the a**. IMHO direct dials are a challenge to Murphy!! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How does one friction weld on lathe? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 18 Oct 1998 06:13:52 GMT -------- Bill Machrone wrote: > > When I was a youngster I watched my dad friction weld a drill onto an > I tried to do the same thing today, needing to put a metric thread on a > piece of 1/4" CRS rod. I faced the top of a small bolt and a rod, > chucked them up and ran them together. > They got a little warm and they graunched a few times, then the bar > deflected a bit. When I stopped the lathe, the bolt had little > stalactites of steel that it had torn out of the end of the rod, but no > overall welding, just these little spots. > > I straightened the bar, cleaned up the ends, and tried it again. Same > result. > > Is there a technique to this, or should I stop trying to destroy my > lathe? > > - Bill A friction welding machine runs the two parts together under pressure fore a preset time, until they reach FORGE welding heat. It then stops DEAD an rams the two parts together under enormous pressure, and a carefully controlled distance. I have had tens of thousands of parts friction welded to make blanks for after market photocopier rollers. These were made from aluminum, stainless, or MS and comprised a drawn tubular body and two solid end pieces. Both welds were made simultaneously on specialized equipment by my vendor. In every case the rule was that the cross section of the ends must be similar. In the case of tube to solid end piece, I had to prepare the end pieces by drilling them, bore dia of the tube for about 1/4 x bore dia., and, if necessary, turning down the o/d for the same distance. After a little experimenting, we were successful in getting SS ends welded to aluminum bodies. As to whether you should do it on your lathe...It is a useful technique to use in an emergency...like on the (usually) beat up lunker in the millwrights shop. But I wouldn't like to do it on my own lathe. Robert Bastow ======== To: frwillia@ptw.com Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What is the difference between a Form Tap, Plug Tap, Bottoming Tap, and a Taper Tap ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 18 Oct 1998 15:37:53 GMT -------- Fitch R. Williams wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > >Sadly most > >"botttomed" threads I have ever had to cut from drawings were the result > >of a designer that didn't know his a** from a hole in the ground!! I > >have never bought a taper or a bottoming tap (for home use) > > The only bottom tapping I have had to do at home was in the "T" slotted cross > slide I made for the 9" south Bend. So I have a 5/16" and 3/8" bottoming tap. > The issue there is the need to keep the cross slide thin to maximize swing over > it, and provide threads, and maybe very important, to avoid the situation where > somebody gets in a contest of wills with a bolt that is slightly to long and > jams it into the thread taper and either splits the casting or jams the bolt. > > I can see a number of design situations where one would use bottoming threads. > We use them a lot in the space business because no designer worh employing in > the space craft business, especially the rocket engine business, is going to > make anything weigh even an oz more than necessary just to avoid having to use a > bottoming tap. And nobody wants to sacrifice any strength or reliability > either. The design window is very small in a lot of cases. > As I stated Fitch, there are notable exceptions, and these are two that definitely fall under that heading. The Southbend application being by FAR the most critical!! ;^) Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Expletive to be deleted From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 18 Oct 1998 15:49:11 GMT -------- plastic wrote: > > Chilton Gregory wrote: > >> Didn't they used to speak gaelic in that big island West England? > > > > Yes, and they still do, but not a lot. A closely related celtic language > >(britanic) is spoken by the Wales and in Brittany. There are still quite a few > >people who speak only Welsh (Cumraeg). > >Chilton. > > Correct me if I am wrong but isn't Wales actually near west England > and the big island far west England. > > Regards > David Lamprell Hi David, My ex-wife was Welsh, her mother spoke nothing but Cumraeg (Welsh), until her teens. To this day, she considers England to be a remote nation of heathens, located on unimaginable distance to the far east of Cymru. (Wales!) My children have often visited this beautiful land and speak a little of this lilting, melodic and poetic language. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Any body doing any metalwork? (or, 'nother good day in the shop) From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 18 Oct 1998 15:54:59 GMT -------- John Stevenson wrote: > > Are you related to Robert Bastow by any chance?? Could be..Was his mother ever in Yorkshire? Or yours for that matter? Lots of bastards out there!! ;^) Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Radius v Dia dials From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 18 Oct 1998 16:05:00 GMT -------- Kurt Bjorn wrote: > > FWIW when I bought my Hardinge, it had Diameter cross-slide dials, and after > a short period to get used to it, I never went back. Occasionally, you > might need to generate a shoulder of specified height, such as .125", above > the smaller diameter surface, in which case you must double that and run the > cross-slide in .250 indicated. > > Otherwise, it is simpler to use. Let's say you start with .500" dia stock, > and want to turn it to .375". Set the dial to zero, feed in .125", and cut. > No more arithmetic. > > -- > Kurt > No disagreement Kurt, as I stated..A matter for personal preference. But for the HSM who uses his lathe as a horizontal borer, vertical and horizontal mill, dividing head, co-ordinate drill, broaching and planing machine,etc.,etc...Direct reading dials are a constant source of error and a pain in the ass. You have to double the readings in most cases. Robert Bastow ======== To: frwillia@ptw.com Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: SINE BARS?? NEED HELP From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 18 Oct 1998 16:11:43 GMT -------- Fitch R. Williams wrote: > I set my tenths reading micrometer (most accurage > measuring instrument in my shop) to the desired dimension, make sure both the > mic anvils and the adjustable parallel are "clean" (usually by wiping them with > Laquer thinner - and relubing them later),....... An easier, and much used, traditional method of cleaning 0-1 mic. anvils, is to lightly close them on a clean sheet of paper and pull the paper out. You are then only a fraction of a turn away from checking zero. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 8mm & WW collets From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 18 Oct 1998 16:28:56 GMT -------- Don Foreman wrote: > > > WW collets and a jeweller's lathe, eh? Mmmm! > > I am building a high speed toolpost grinder, and this will be equipped to use draw in collets. I need only 1mm to 1/4" holding range for internal grinding "points". My original plan was to use 8mm Watchmakers collets but I would also like to consider something just a little larger to give a little more "meat" in the arbors for external grinding wheels. These will each be fitted to a dedicated arbor, trued and balanced, and swapped as a unit. Can anyone point me to a source for the dimensions of 8mm and WW collets, some idea for relative availability, accuracy and costs, and a good source for high quality collets of either pursuation? I would consider buying top class, used collets. Any other suggestions would, of course, be welcome. Thanks Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Bridegport Lighting From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 18 Oct 1998 17:01:11 GMT -------- Michael P. Henry wrote: > > I've been using articulated lamps from a local hardware superstore ($10 or > so). These are sold as desk lamps and the end of the arm is inserted into a > screw clamp that is used to attach them to a table top that also allows the > arm to swivel back and forth. The 60 watt bulb does get a bit hot, though, >and I like Jon's idea of using small fluorescent bulbs. > I use the same type lamps, ($1.00 ea. from garage sales). I found a source for neat little 75W halogen spot bulbs, at a buck apiece from a local surplus store. Ideal for my purposes so I bought a bunch of them. Brighter, whiter light than incandescent bulbs and, surprisingly, far less heat in the beam and in the lamp itself. I now use them exclusively for local lighting in the shop. I got four, 8' dual tube fluorescent fixtures from "Wallymart"..Hate them!! They buzz like a cheap TV and give nowhere near the level of background light I need. Wallymart had some 100W, dual bulb, halogen fixtures, "fer cheap" and I find these ideal over my benches and lathe etc. I had to arrange extra shading/reflection, to avoid direct glare in my eyes and concentrate the light where I need it..otherwise..perfect! And no heat problems. Robert Bastow Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re:Shop Lighting From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 18 Oct 1998 23:06:14 GMT -------- Randy O'Brian wrote: > > Robert, > > I'm using articulated lamps(Luxo style) for task lighting now. I have one > on the mill mounted on top of the head. By cutting one of the struts and > removing a spring, it will bend down toward the table and works fairly well. Thanks for the tip > What is the bulb number on those 75W halogens? On closer examination I find in fact they are 50W not 75..but they turn out more light that a 100W incandescent and less heat. Mine are Phillips "MasterLite" 50W 120V N FLOOD 30 Made in Mexico. No idea what retail is...I bought a bunch at $1.00 each > Wallmart fixtures have cheap ballasts in them. If you get commercial >grade fixtures, you won't have noise. I took it up with the Wallymart "Experts"..Response was the usual " I dunno..They all do that"!! Commercial quality ballasts alone cost more that I paid for the entire fixtures and tubes. I must say though, recently after 18 months of use, they do seem to be a lot quieter. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: All read please From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 19 Oct 1998 03:17:06 GMT -------- Gerry Einarsson wrote: > > plastic wrote > >> > > Hmm, how exactly do you know what shit tastes like? > > I have to admit, I don't know *exactly*; although having raised a >couple of kids, and living in a "poop and scoop" neighborhood, I feel I >can claim some familiarity with the subject. > Obviously you have never played Rugby on a freshly vacated (evacuated?) cow pasture!! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Anti-Jacknife..was Black grease From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 19 Oct 1998 03:43:40 GMT -------- Fitch R. Williams wrote: > > So all is not roses for an anti-jacknife device. > > Fitch I totally agree! On the other hand, I was south-bound, in the fast lane, on the M6 (in England), just south of Keele service area, when a TT rig passed me at high speed in the center lane. Suddenly he braked, swerved, jacknifed, missing my front end by inches, and lost his trailer. The trailer rolled right over the Renault in front of me and made hamburger out of five college kids. I know, because I stopped to render help, spent an hour shovelling "Terrys" chocolates out of the way and helping to peel the roof off the (now) 18" high Renault, meanwhile, feeling the pulse in the female drivers neck, flicker and fade away!!! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Shop Lighting From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 19 Oct 1998 03:57:19 GMT -------- PKDickman wrote: > > In article <362A7584.A9AF1417@hotmail.com>, Robert Bastow > writes: > > > > >I took it up with the Wallymart "Experts"..Response was the usual " I > >dunno..They all do that"!! Commercial quality ballasts alone cost more that > >I > >paid for the entire fixtures and tubes. > > > > > > Perhaps this tells you something > > Paul K. Dickman No. What? Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Tubal-cain, Tubal Cain and tubal_cain From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 19 Oct 1998 04:32:27 GMT -------- Kurt Bjorn wrote: > Are you the "real" Tubal Cain? If so, hats off to you, sir, for years of > fine writing for model engineers. If not, you are confusing me and quite a > few others I'm sure! ;-) > > Kurt Bjorn Absolutely no intention to confuse..but there is a story behind it. The "real" Tubal-cain died a long,long time ago...Genesis 4:22 "and (Cain)...bare Tubal-cain, an instructor of every artificer in brass and iron." Tom Walshaw.."Tubal Cain" was, along with George H Thomas, both of "Model Engineer" renown, a role model and mentor to me. I learned much from both of them and we corresponded often over the years. George passed on several years ago and Tom followed him quite recently. They both made a huge contribution to our avocation and will be sorely missed by friends and readers alike. I chose "tubal_cain" (note the lower case), "In memorium"...As a tribute and mark of respect, not as an imitation. I guess I knew that one day, someone would ask your question and I could help carry on Tom Walshaw's memory in my explanation. Many have, and I hope many more will so do. Robert Bastow "tubal_cain" ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: making a die? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 19 Oct 1998 04:42:46 GMT -------- Bluey527 wrote: > > Anyone have any suggestions about how to make a die.Have a shaft at work where > the threads for the shaft nut after a bearing get buggered up.Have to leave > shaft in place and was wondering if I could make a die out of drill rod just to > clean up these threads.Is this possible?Any thoughts on how to make > one?Appreciate any comments Thanks Bill Get a thread file..MSC, etc., sell them, If the thread is a standard size, buy a split die or a hex reforming nut. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Coffee Can Foundry From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 19 Oct 1998 04:51:13 GMT -------- What best kind of small (1-2 lbs) crucible should I buy to melt grey cast iron in my fan blown propane forge/furnace? Temperature reaches 2400+ degrees. Can you suggest a good supplier and an average cost range, Thank you, Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: comp.robotics.misc,sci.engr,sci.engr.mech,sci.engr.manufacturing,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Can you use Slick 50 as Cutting and Tapping Oil ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 19 Oct 1998 05:02:24 GMT -------- atex57@frontiernet.net wrote: > > > Try good old bacon grease or lard, thats what I have been using in my >machine shop for all hand tapping. Ed By no stretch of the imagination is this the best available tapping compound available. However it does taste much better than Tap Magic when it spatters in your mouth as you blow chips out of the hole. Try mixing your grease with powdered graphite for vastly improved performance....ruins the flavor though!! (Does anyone ever READ or follow the whole thread before replying anymore???) Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Metric Pipe Thread Question From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 19 Oct 1998 05:48:29 GMT -------- johnsonr@carol.net wrote: > > I am trying to remove the air injection gallery on my '86 Isuzu since it > has developed an exhaust which is very irritating. After I remove it I > want to plug the holes in the head. I can't figure out what to ask for > in terms of the thread form. It would appear that it is some kind of > 13mm or so fine metric thread. It is not easy to get to for an accurate > measurement. If I take it off, then I run the risk of a bigger leak. > > I have talked with poeple from the dealership level all the way to the > factory and naturally they are no help. "some kind of" won't hack it in the real world. You need to have a pretty good idea of what pitch/dia you are looking for. Only then will you know whether people are sidestepping the issue..Or just plain bull sh*tting you!! Take a piece of Play-Do, Silly Putty, modelling clay, Ivory Soap, Wrigley's Double-Mint Gum or what-have-you. Stick it on a suitable spatula, tongue depressor, popsical stick, pencil or....what-have-you. Take an impression of the thread form, measure the pitch with a "very-near" thread pitch gauge, ruler, barley corns...Or what-have-you!! Ditto the threaded hole core diameter, at top and bottom. If they are different, and the top is wider than the bottom..it's a taper thread!! Check the pitch you measured against a chart in "Machinerys Handbook"..your library will have a copy. Check both Imperial (SAE) and Metric (I.D.I.O.T.S.) tables and find the nearest one. Look up the Thread Depth for the corresponding pitch. Double it and add it to the top core diameter you measured. Check that dimension against the tables in "MH". Note: The O/d of a tapered pipe thread is not its "Official Size" but that thread suitable for a piece of pipe of a given, nominal pipe size. That is to say...A one inch pipe thread would be a suitable size for the OUTSIDE diameter of an iron pipe with a nominal one inch bore. You now will have enough information to return to your dealer, give 'em hell, and bullshit them long enough to come up with what you ask for...or get their undivided attention for long enough for them to prove you wrong and come up with what you NEED...Or what-have-you!!!!!!! Good luck Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: making a die? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 19 Oct 1998 06:05:31 GMT -------- ddouglas@dibbs.net wrote: > > Bill, The trouble with using a die, is that it will cut off some of your > thread making it weaker. A friend told me how he had fixed a thread on > the front spindle of an antique car. He bought a box of the correct > size nuts and screwed them on the spindle one after the other. Each nut > was destroyed at the start, but gradually, the thread was "formed" back > into shape. Of course, a die might be cheaper than a box of nuts. But > this worked in his situation. Doug The best way to "reform" rather than "recut" an old, buggered thread (or a newly cut one for that matter,) is to buy or make a "nut" of the same size and start to screw it on. Each time it starts to get tight, rap it smartly, all round its circumference, until you can turn it further..Each time it STARTS to bind, repeat the tapping process. It can take a while but you will get an almost perfect reformed thread out of it. I do this with every thread I cut, rather than trying to cut it to "dead size" Because of minor imperfections and burrs, a dead size thread will almost always, settle down to being oversize after an nominal amount of running in. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What is the difference between a Form Tap, Plug Tap, Bottoming Tap, and a Taper Tap ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 19 Oct 1998 13:59:17 GMT -------- John Stevenson wrote: > How can a thread be oversize after 'reforming' it ? The "oversize" was a typo. I will not lower myself to respond to the rest of your vindictive message. Members of the group are welcome to check out the messages I have posted and let me know PUBLICLY if they have, or have not, found them generally helpful as is my intent. If not let me know whether I should continue to make contributions to this News Group. If anyone doubts my veracity, experience or qualifications, please feel free to contact me directly and I will send you a copy of my CV. Respectfully, Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: comp.robotics.misc,sci.engr,sci.engr.mech,sci.engr.manufacturing,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Can you use Slick 50 as Cutting and Tapping Oil ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 19 Oct 1998 22:55:04 GMT -------- atex57@frontiernet.net wrote: > > In <362AC8FF.FE251178@hotmail.com>, Robert Bastow writes: > >atex57@frontiernet.net wrote: > >> > > > >> > >> Try good old bacon grease or lard, thats what I have been using in my >machine shop for all hand tapping. Ed > > > >By no stretch of the imagination is this the best available tapping compound > >available. > > > > Have you ever tried it???? Yes. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Gun show finds From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 01:12:58 GMT -------- Moore and Wright are Britains equivalent of Starrett...good tackle. They are indeed small hole gauges, the finish sounds like satin chrome. You will find that as you turn the knurled sleeve at the end, the two hardened balls are pushed out of their little holes by an internal tapered spindle. They are captive, so they won't pop right out. Use them as you would a regular split button SHG. Put the ball end inside the hole to be measured and turn the sleeve gently until you feel light contact. Withdraw and measure the gauge across the balls with a regular micrometer. Nice find! Robert Bastow David R. Birch wrote: > > I just picked up a Machinery's Handbook 17th edition(1965) for $10 and > three of what appear to be VERY small hole gauges for another $10. > Each ia marked: > > MOORE & WRIGHT > SHEFFIELD,ENGLAND > > They are then marked "CAT. No. 899BB" > 0.080-0.095 > 2.03MM-2.41MM > > 899CC is 0.095-0.110 > 899DD is 0.100-0.125 > > They are about 2" long, each with a shaft with two balls > set in holes in the shaft, with the handle end knurled, > and a smaller knurled post that turns, sticking out from > the handle. The appearance is like a telescoping gauge, > with the two balls replacing the crossbar of the T. > They look new with a brushed stainless finish, although > they respond to a magnet more like regular steel than a > 400 series stainless. > > Anyone got any info on these? They were too cute to pass up. > > David ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: shapers...any out there? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 04:52:15 GMT -------- CroweLance wrote: > > I could really use a small-mid size shaper. It just burns me up these aren't > made. Hey, I know what you're going to say, but look, I'm old fashioned OK? > Anyway, where can I find these old gems? Try Randy Pettus at 706 265 1902 crpettus@mindspring.com Randy has a bunch of Atlas, Southbend and other shapers, location north of Atlanta. I got an 8" Boxford from him recently that had never cut metal...It does now!! Tell him I sent you. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: A couple of questions From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 20 Oct 1998 15:06:07 GMT -------- Steve Herring wrote: > > I was in a local scrapyard last week looking for some metal to practice > turning on. I was talking with the dealer about some stuff and another > customer, this older gentleman with a grease covered overall walks up > and tells me "You'd never even get though the doors of my shop." when I > asked why, he told me my fingernails were too short and that it is > unsafe. I keep my nails to where they dont stick past the ends of the > tips of my finger so they don't get torn off juggling(my other hobby). I > originally dismissed this as a guy just being really cranky and not > liking a young hobbyest, but I am wondering is it conventional shop > practice to keep your nails longer than your fingertips? > I have been in and around machine shops since "Adam was a lad," and that is a new one on me!! On the contrary, long fingernails can be a hazard around rotating machinery..Murphy's Law, (Subsection 27: para.23. line 18.) dictates that..(I paraphrase..) "Any thing sticking out will be ripped off first" I keep my fingernails well trimmed: A) It makes it easier to clean them after an evening in the shop. (HSM by night...Stockbroker by day!) B) I find that, especially when giving something a final rub with emery cloth, close up to the collets, (which I use a lot,) the split in the collet will snip off the corner of your thumb nail..usually down to the quick. Ouch! My advice is to ignore this curmudgeonly remark. Long dirty fingernails do not a machinist make! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: pressure vessels From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 21 Oct 1998 14:17:29 GMT -------- robert anzellotti wrote: (Three times!!) > > Good time to revive my pressure pot quest. Grab the stick and pull it back...Grab the stick......8^) > Felice Luftschein & Nicholas Carter wrote: > > > Once again I'm in search of Aluminum information. A local restaurant > > has an older pressure cooker that is no longer manufactured. They used > > to be able to get replacement hold down hinged bolts, as they wear > > over time, but can't get them anymore, so they want me to make some. > > Issues of product liability, etc (as done to death on several threads > > on this n.g.) aside, what is the best (actual) type of Al and temper > > for this application? > > If constant wear is a problem, might it be time to try a suitable grade of stainless steel for the hinged bolts? Perhaps with easily replaced clamping pads of aluminum if wear of the lid becomes a concern? > > (I bet this thread will devolve into a discussion of funny pressure > > cooker explosions....) Not a pressure cooker per se..But.. When I was a kid my best pal's parents went out for the day and left him with a can of baked beans for lunch. He popped it in the oven (without opening it or perforating the lid...!) Blew the oven door clear across the kitchen...along with a full complement of rapidly hardening baked beans...! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: NEVER EVER AGAIN WILL I BUY SHIT PRAZI MACHINES!!!!!!!!!!!!!! From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 22 Oct 1998 23:25:43 GMT -------- Philmpc1 wrote: > > I own a small machine shop where most of my work is CNC milling. Once in a > while I have to turn and bought a Prazi due to space requirements. NEVER again > will I buy such shit. Damn thing costs $1,300 and is absolute CRAP. Anyone out > there with a good old piece of benchtop iron let me know. I need a lathe now. > Thanks. Phil Pretty sweeping statement!! I had been led to believe that the Prazzi was a cut above other"benchtop" lathes. As I am in the market for a small precision lathe and Prazzi is (was) on my short list, would you care to expand on your reasons? Thanks, Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 1938 Ford body panel restoration (shrinking sheetmetal). From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 23 Oct 1998 19:00:25 GMT -------- Mike Graham wrote: > I am by no means an expert, but I have had some luck with body work > shrinking primarily because I spent a couple of months of Sundays > trying to figure out plate straightening. I found a bit of info on it > in "Practical Blacksmithing", and just banged around on warped plates > until I had a reasonable success rate. Straightening plates is a precise science, an art form and requires a little black magic too! As an apprentice I enjoyed watching our "Stretching Gang" at work. These were three or four of the widest guys I have ever seen out side a zoo! Arms like utility poles. Their job was to straighten heavy plates from the presses, flame cutters or annealing furnaces etc..1" to 3" and thicker. They worked with 32lb sledge hammers on a 10' dia x 3' thick, solid steel "anvil". A warped plate would be swung in by the overhead (100ton!!) crane and dropped on the table. For a while they would sit around "eyeballing" it and drinking beer from pint bottles. [workers in the forge, press, furnace and heavy metal shops had a daily allowance, supplied by the company of up to 8 pints...except apprentices!! 8^( ] Then , one of the gang would get up, hammer in hand, and pace slowly around the plate, occasionally squatting to get an eye level viewpoint. Sometimes this process would take fifteen or twenty minutes, but eventually he would reach out and make a mark or two on the plate with a piece of chalk. Spitting on his HUGE palms he would swing his thirty-two pounder effortlessly, and hit the mark dead on. The plate would appear to shudder and visibly settle and as often as not he would walk away, without a backwards glance, signalling the laborers to take away the now flat plate and bring up the next one. Not surprisingly, all the members of the gang were stone deaf and somewhat "addled"!! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: NEVER EVER AGAIN WILL I BUY SHIT PRAZI MACHINES!!!!!!!!!!!!!! From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 23 Oct 1998 19:24:46 GMT -------- PLAlbrecht wrote: > > Find yourself a nice Logan (like another poster said) or a South Bend or > another well preserved American machine. Clausing. Monarch? > Pete I am not in the market for a Logan size lathe...I have a Maximat Super II, with which, after many modifications, additions and adjustments, I am very happy. As I stated, I am in the market for a small, PRECISION, BENCH lathe..of the Levin, Boley, Schaublin, etc type, with a full range of collets and attachments. I will probably wait until I next visit England and pick one up from Tony Griffiths. Thanks for the lowdown on the Prazzi..It is off my list, Sherline and Taig are also not what I am looking for (very nice as I am assured they both are! The only Sherline products with which I am familiar, are the anodised aluminum BP dials I adapted to the Maximat and a VERY tasty 3" four jaw chuck with a 5C arbor) Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Help - move safe! (800 lbs.) From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 23 Oct 1998 21:10:10 GMT -------- Bob Frazier wrote: > > Hi y'all ! I need to move a 800 LB safe from one suburb to another, and down > a half flight of stairs into the basement. A local mover will do it for $250, > which sounds like a profitable venture, for him. I'm looking into lift > trucks, kegs of beer, whatever it takes to move this thing. Any advice? > Thanks, Bob IMHO it sounds like a good deal!! Double check his references and LIABILITY INSURANCE!! If you are satisfied, pay the $250.00, sit back and drink the beer yourself and avoid HURTING YOURSELF AND OTHERS!!!! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Shop Lighting From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 24 Oct 1998 14:53:44 GMT -------- Mike Graham wrote: > I'm not a fan of fluorescent lights over a lathe. I find that at > higher speeds it makes the work seem to almost 'squirm'. Very weird > on the eyes. > Fluorescent lights have a stroboscopic effect, that at certain speeds, can make a spindle or cutter appear to slow down, run in reverse, or even stop! Very dangerous in a machine shop! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Metal Halide for Shop Lamps?? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 25 Oct 1998 14:22:56 GMT -------- BeeCrofter wrote: > > Down at Home Despot they have made in China (of course) quartz halogen > shoplights for 20 bucks bulbs 7ft cord and all. > It consists of 2 150 watt lamps in a shorter version of the old shoplight. > Looks like the same lamps that are in porch lights and such. > Nice to have something in the shop other than flourescent. I bought a couple of those when they were on sale for $15.00 a couple of months ago. I have one over my lathe and one over my bench, plus angle poise type lamps with 50w halogen spots for detail illumination. I am delighted with the setup. I find the articulated desk lamps at garage sales for $1-$2.00 each. They are only $7.00 brand new at Wallymart. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Prazi lathe From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 25 Oct 1998 14:40:21 GMT -------- Jon Barnard wrote: > > Mr. Bastow, > > So how much for your "piece of shit Prazi"? > > Jon Sorry Jon, that wasn't me! I only asked what the problem was because Prazi was on my short list. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What type of steel should I use for collets? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 25 Oct 1998 14:44:18 GMT -------- Steve T. wrote: > > I need to make some new 1/4" i.d. collets for my router, but I am not > sure of what type/grade of steel would be best to use. I assume some > type of spring steel would be the best. Can anyone give me the right > type of steel to use. Also what method would be the best to cut the > slots in the collet. > Thanks in advance, > Steve T. Unless you intend to harden and grind the collets, internally and externally, then regular mild steel or drill rod will do the job...take your pick. To slit them...use a hacksaw! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Brass Cups From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 25 Oct 1998 19:43:01 GMT -------- David Green wrote: > > I need to obtain several hundred cylindrical brass cups with an inside > diameter of 7/8" and an outside diameter of 1". Is that your standard > machine shop type of job, or is there a better way to go about getting > it? > DG They might better be deep drawn from sheet brass. Enquire at a local punch press shop..they may have the dies. What you will save on brass barstock may well pay for a simple draw die. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Wot's with "Mils"? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 27 Oct 1998 07:16:28 GMT -------- >The original bushing were half-inch > long, but I made the new one 300 mils. ............. I set it for 50 mils per inch..... > I can now move the tool point 50 mils ............ or half > a mil per 10 mils of slide travel. ...........1 mil of slide travel > > ......to get my tenth-mil ......... > > ......2 whole mils....... When did people start using "mils" when they mean, and wish us to understand, thousandths of an inch..what is wrong with the good old "thou"? Last I heard, "mils" were a measure of angle used by some countries for artillery laying. Maybe we just have a younger generation trying out their own brand of "Inspeak" Curious. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: HELP: Rod growls while turning. From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 27 Oct 1998 07:49:59 GMT -------- Sorry to disillusion you about the correct feeds and speeds to use for carbide tools. The essence of carbide tooling is that it will resist softening and erosion at the high SFM required to induce plasic flow in the chip. Bluntly put..the hotter the chip the better! The chip flows easier, demands less HP per cu.inch removed and takes more heat away with it. Surface finish is improved too. Thermal shock is induced by an interrupted flow of coolant. Coolant is used to cool the work piece, so as to maintain sizes..its function is not to cool the tool or the chip. Visit your friendly, local jobbing shop, ask for a job and tell them you never produce blue chips...The only job they will offer you is to dig out the TONS of blue "clock-spring" chips that their top machinists produce each week. Machine shops have to produce Fast, Good, AND Cheap!! Robert Bastow k.kinnison wrote: > > Not so! > Tool life is directly proportional to RPM, feed rate, depth of cut, and > grade of carbide used. Uninterupted cut or not? Coated inserts or not? > This is true for any tool, HSS or carbide. > > Can you say "thermal shock", on the way to the supply house to get more > inserts? > > Nowadays, the term "carbide" is too general to describe many applications. > Assuming that one is using a C-5 grade(brazed) or better for turning,the > "blue chip" rule will most certainly increase tool life and decrease the > likelyhood of a person contracting silicosis from repeated regrinding. > > There are always exceptions. > > Fast, Cheap or Good > Pick any two..... > > K. Kinnison > > Jens wrote in message <363b4782.20800687@news.rdc1.bc.wave.home.com>... > >"k.kinnison" wrote: > > > > > > > >> Almost molten metal instead of swarf > >> > >> > >>If your chips are blue, you are going to fast. > > > >Not if you are using carbide ! > > > >Jens > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: HELP: Rod growls while turning. From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 27 Oct 1998 08:08:36 GMT -------- Jhko wrote: > > >It is specially ground (but real easy to grind - much easier than a > >normal cutting tool) > > > >Jens > > > >PS.: It took me a long time to figure out (from an article) exactly > >what the heck they were talking about. Once the light went on it was > >'duuuhhh - that's simple'. Don't ask me to explain it because it will > >be even more confusing than the article. > > Hi Jens, Am I correct in assuming this is a "shear" cutting tool..a near vertical or slightly inclined, cutting edge with minimal front clearance, that is set with the center of its cutting edge on lathe C/L. We used a similar tool for finishing steel mill rolls. Chatter free,(never heard it called "growling" before)...fine finish cuts and a superb finish due in part to its burnishing effect. The action is similar to that obtained from a "Toolmaker's Reamer"...a length of drill rod of the required diameter, hardened and ground at an acute angle to the C/L..cuts fine, great finish and superb accuracy. A similar tool with increased cutting and side rake, works well on rubber and soft plastic..good tool for turning wood in an engine lathe too! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Any body doing any metalwork? (or, 'nother good day in the shop) From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 27 Oct 1998 08:26:00 GMT -------- ldkeith@home.com wrote: > > Mark Kinsler wrote: > > > 1) What the heck is an engineer's ring? Sort of like a World Series ring, > > or a class ring, or what? I didn't know that engineers wore any kind of a > > special ring, traditional iron or any other kind. > > Ya gotta be a Canuk!(it's a Canadian Engineer thing.) Beyond > that we have to shoot you after we tell : ) I will say that I'm > a young buck and my 1981 vintage ring is stainless steel. Real > old guys may still have plain (mild?) steel editions : ) (duck) > > dave Chartered Engineers (CE) or Professional Engineers (PE) traditionally wear an iron or SS pinky ring..often with facets like a multi faced polygon. REAL Canadian Engineers wear a ring made from wrought iron, salvaged from the Montreal bridge that collapsed..objective being to remind them that even Engineers are fallible. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Steel Slivers From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 27 Oct 1998 15:04:56 GMT -------- Heartily endorsed!!!!! Gloves, while useful when handling dirty, sharp, hot or toxic materials have NO PLACE around moving machinery. They can be DEADLY!! Robert Bastow Been there...Seen that! Loren Titsworth wrote: > > I beg to differ on this recommendation for a newbie. Too many of my cohorts > using latex gloves to keep their parts clean and "get a better grip" have > ended up with their hand wrapped into their work with some nasty cuts before > the latex gave away. One guy actually picked up a 200lb. bench knee mill > with one hand, when he tried to "get away". Now, it could be said, "Well, > they were just stupid". I agree, but still not a good thing to have anything > on or near your hands with spinning tools. > > Experienced, alot bad. > > Tom Holt wrote in message <1998102702024076639@zetnet.co.uk>... > > > >> Larry Sleznikow wrote in article > >> <36378f8b.175966@204.246.1.19>... > >> > with steel, I'm picking slivers out of my hands using a 10 pwr > >> > eye loup and needle and tweezers. What am I doing wrong? > > > > > >When I started using carbide burrs in the Dremel for fitting & > >finishing small steel parts freehand, I ended up with so many > >teeny-tiny steel needles in my hands I couldn't walk through an > >airport metal detector without setting off all the alarms in the > >place. Now I use thin rubber dentists' gloves, both with the Dremel > >and the mill. Problem solved. > > > > > > > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Cupla MT Twistdrill Questions... From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 27 Oct 1998 15:39:48 GMT -------- A Morse taper socket, in good condition, will adequately grip a Morse taper shank in equally good condition. Set screws etc. should NOT be required except as an extreme backup. First thing to do is ensure your taper socket is in excellent shape. If it isn't...THEN MAKE IT SO!!!! Yeh! I know it's a bother..But accuracy doesn't happen overnight..You have to work slowly and methodically towards it. A Morse taper finish reamer is not expensive...Especially compared with the cost of a new tailstock barrel!! Get one and use it. Secondly, be absolutely scrupulous about cleanliness in the socket, and examine every taper shank before popping it in place. Shanks should be deburred etc., with a fine file or stone..A rub with emory cloth while spinning is NOT the way to do it. Larger Lathe tailstocks often have the same, built in tang driver as do drill presses. A simple "insurance job" is to drill and tap the tailstock barrel for TWO opposing setscrews that will bear on the drill TANG. Yes, it is inconvenient to have to run the TS barrel all the way out to adjust them. Lastly, be aware that, unless the drill is grossly worn and tapered, the bigges cause of "grabbing is trying to open up a hole with a larger drill. If you must drill a pilot hole first, make this only about 1/4 the finish drill size. To reduce grabbing, and improve finish, grind and stone a small radius on the drill corners. For brass and other "grabby" materials, grind the cutting lips to a zero rake angle. If you do a lot of brass work..buy a straight flute drill. Robert Bastow Brian, Evans wrote: > > snip... > > > >Of course, you will want to clean the tailstock taper, and you might > >want to check with a new dead center and some Dykem to see if there > >are any burrs or other gross problems. Otherwise just realize there > >isn't that much torque that you can transmit through this without > >external support and then you can consider something like the vise > >grips supported by the lathe ways. > > > >Grant Erwin > >Seattle, Washington > > > >strictly an amateur opinion > > The tailstock taper on my 16" Southbend has a grubscrew that can be used to lock > tools into the MT3 taper. I've never needed more that a deadblow hammer hit to > seat a drill chuck, and normally just kind of pop them in by hand. Then again, > I also sneak up on the finish size and the biggest drill I have is 3/4", so > maybe I'm not over taxing the grip of the taper. If I was going to use the > grubscrew, I might grind a flat on the tool, like the one on an endmill. > > Brian ======== To: Spehro Pefhany Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Wot's with "Mils"? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 27 Oct 1998 15:47:32 GMT -------- Cross cultural?? Sounds more like a cross DRESSER to me!! 8^) Robert Bastow Cross PATCH!! Spehro Pefhany wrote: > > the renowned Robert Bastow wrote: > > > When did people start using "mils" when they mean, and wish us to understand, > > thousandths of an inch..what is wrong with the good old "thou"? > > Mils are electronic terminology, whereas thou are machinist terminology. > For example, a "300 mil DIP package" or 100 mil spacing. It is a > cross-cultural thing as a linguist such as yourself should appreciate. > > -- > =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= > Spehro Pefhany "The Journey is the reward" > speff@interlog.com > Fax:(905) 332-4270 (small micro system devt hw/sw + mfg) > =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Hardinge help! From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 28 Oct 1998 01:37:19 GMT -------- Dave Johnson,(masquerading as a) Machine Man wrote: > > we do mostly small machining and the > largest lathe we have in the place is a Hardinge Toolroom that is not > all that old. Probably 2000 hours on it but the swing of the frame I > had made was about 1/2" bigger than the Hardinge could do. > > I looked at the length of the saddle supports of the Harding and they > were about 5" long front and back so decided I could safely remove > some metal from the bed to allow the frame to rotate while I machined > the clamp portion of it where the plate would sit. > > I figured that 5" of saddle would slide over the "gap" of about 1-1/2" > wide and 3/4" deep without problem Obviously not even enough of a "machine man" to fool the real ones!! However, just in case this butcher should finally "lose it" and do as he describes to a "recent Hardinge Toolroom Lathe" he will find that his grinding..3/4" deep...did not go all the way through the bed plate, which is a hardened and ground steel plate, 7/8" thick bolted from below before finish grinding. This would make the Hardinge the easiest lathe extant, to fix after such ministrations. I have seen much better trolls!!....Remember, there is no perfect crime!! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Any body doing any metalwork? (or, 'nother good day in the shop) From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 28 Oct 1998 01:50:44 GMT -------- > Robert and Brian, just a small nit : _graduate_ engineers wear da > ring. > You don't have to be a PE / CE, just have a B.Sc. in Engineering. > > I'm a real engineer, (B.Sc. EE, UofS, 1981) and my ring is SS. > We didn't have a choice. The ring was originally iron (wrought > very possibly) but it caused skin problems like discoloration. > So, in the fine tradition of good engineers everywhere, it > was improved. > > dave Jeez! They'll be giving them to shade tree mechanics next!! Time was when it MEANT something!! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Steel Slivers From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 28 Oct 1998 02:18:59 GMT -------- Any kind of glove!! Touch the inside of your wrist, inadvertantly, to a rotating milling cutter, while wearing latex gloves, and you will be heading, at very least, to some serious rehab. And don't tell me you are too careful around machines to do a silly thing like that...because I won't believe you. Robert Bastow Steve Cranage wrote: > > Huh? I use surgical gloves all the time with the mill and lathe. These > things are so flimsy I have to change them after and hour or less of use, I > just can't imagine how getting the latex caught in anything could pull your > hand into the work before ripping a large flap of the glove free. I tear a > large percentage of them just putting them on. Besides, since they are skin > tight, there is no way to get caught in the first place, at least as far as > I can see. Maybe we're talking about a different type of gloves? > > Robert Bastow wrote in article > <3635E115.4FACD424@hotmail.com>... > > Heartily endorsed!!!!! > > > > Gloves, while useful when handling dirty, sharp, hot or toxic materials > have NO > > PLACE around moving machinery. They can be DEADLY!! > > > > Robert Bastow > > > > Been there...Seen that! > > > > Loren Titsworth wrote: > > > > > > I beg to differ on this recommendation for a newbie. Too many of my > cohorts > > > using latex gloves to keep their parts clean and "get a better grip" > have > > > ended up with their hand wrapped into their work with some nasty cuts > before > > > the latex gave away. One guy actually picked up a 200lb. bench knee > mill > > > with one hand, when he tried to "get away". Now, it could be said, > "Well, > > > they were just stupid". I agree, but still not a good thing to have > anything > > > on or near your hands with spinning tools. > > > > > > Experienced, alot bad. > > > > > > Tom Holt wrote in message <1998102702024076639@zetnet.co.uk>... > > > > > > > >> Larry Sleznikow wrote in article > > > >> <36378f8b.175966@204.246.1.19>... > > > >> > with steel, I'm picking slivers out of my hands using a 10 pwr > > > >> > eye loup and needle and tweezers. What am I doing wrong? > > > > > > > > > > > >When I started using carbide burrs in the Dremel for fitting & > > > >finishing small steel parts freehand, I ended up with so many > > > >teeny-tiny steel needles in my hands I couldn't walk through an > > > >airport metal detector without setting off all the alarms in the > > > >place. Now I use thin rubber dentists' gloves, both with the Dremel > > > >and the mill. Problem solved. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Steel Slivers From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 28 Oct 1998 02:23:25 GMT -------- Tom Holt wrote: Now, it could be said, "Well, > > they were just stupid". I agree, but still not a good thing to have anything > > on or near your hands with spinning tools. > > > Experienced, alot bad. > > All due respect; but provided you're taking proper care, it shouldn't > be a problem. Put another way; the best and only way to avoid > accidents is to keep your hands well away from those spinning tools > until they stop spinning. If you're close enough for gloves to pose a > danger, you're too close anyhow. There is always one idiot who thinks he is different. Dream on. and keep buying those lottery tickets. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: HELP: Rod growls while turning. From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 28 Oct 1998 03:20:36 GMT -------- Wayne Cook wrote: > > On 27 Oct 1998 17:14:46 GMT, jhko@aol.com (Jhko) wrote: > >Hey Robert, OK maybe I'm dense, but I'm still not picturing this cutting tool > >(or the reamer). We really need a picture here. Any chance of drawing one and > >putting it in the dropbox? We don't want to deprive the group of a great tool > >bit and reamer, do we? :-) Thanks in advance for your help. > > Look out Robert it can be almost impossible to describe this thing > where it can be understood. I think I went through 6 or 8 different > versions before everybody got it last time. > Murphy and The Bastow love a challenge!! To make a "contrary ground" or "shear cutting" tool.... Preheat oven to 350deg (gas mark 5) ;^) (Sorry..Wrong NG!!) Take a "virgin" square HSS tool bit. say 1/2" square. Grind the END face to a 5 deg clearance angle mantaining the edge square to the tool bit. Grind the TOP face to a rake angle of 5 to 15 degrees. The tool now looks like a big, fat, parting tool with no side clearance or relief. It would in fact make a pretty good broad finishing tool for a planer or shaper!! Hone and polish the front and top faces as though it were an exhibit at the NAMES show. Set the tool bit in your tool post and adjust 'til it is square to the lathe axis and right on center height..Just like a parting tool!! Now take the tool bit OUT, flip it 90 degrees CCW and replace it in the tool post with an additional 1/4" packer underneath it. The C/L of the cutting edge is now on C/L of the work piece and it looks as though you are all set to PLANE a keyway in the work piece by racking the saddle back and forth. You now have a crude shear cutting tool. It can be vastly improved by grinding the (now leading face) relief at an angle such that the bottom corner leads the top corner. Use a LIGHT cut, Medium speed and a fairly fast feed rate with a high quality cutting oil (Use reaming speeds/feeds as a guide.) It works like a skew chisel does in wood turning!! Toolmakers Reamer.... Imagine you are a Samurai warrier! Armed with your trusty Katana sword. Your mortal enemy (a bamboo stem) stands before you....with a mighty, sweeping,downward angled blow you cut him from left side of neck, angling through flesh and bone to emerge just above his right hip bone. Picking up the fallen top half of your vanquished foe..the angled cut through the round stem gives you an idea!!! Go make that out of a 1/4" dia length of drill rod, harden, temper to dark straw, hone the flat..BUT DO NOT TOUCH THE SIDES. You have just invented the Toolmakers reamer!! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Steel Slivers From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 28 Oct 1998 03:47:27 GMT -------- Tom Holt wrote: > > The message <3636801D.EDB8193D@hotmail.com> > from Robert Bastow contains these words: > > > There is always one idiot who thinks he is different. Dream on. and keep buying > > those lottery tickets. > > Type on, while you've still got at least one finger. If you're as > casual around cutters as your posts suggest, you'd better enjoy it > while you can I have been around cutters for over 40 years and still have all my fingers..because,not only do I have a very healthy respect for any machine without an "Ouch Switch", but I do not imagine that my constant vigilance can protect me from a machine that never rests..especially if I tempt Murphy. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Any body doing any metalwork? (or, 'nother good day in the shop) From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 28 Oct 1998 16:30:21 GMT -------- I stand corrected. Robert Bastow Spehro Pefhany wrote: > > the renowned ldkeith@home.com wrote: > > > No, it's always been the same. The Iron Ring ceremony has > > always presented the rings to new graduates, not PEs or CEs. > > Would our other Canadian engineers please confirm this for > > the persistant Mr. Bastow ? It seems he is quite mislead. > > Yes, it is true. It only signifies that you have received a degree, not > that you have paid dues to the appropriate provincial organization and > thus become a "licenced" P. Eng.. These days, you also have to pass an > ethics exam and a law exam (cramming for an ethics exam?), to get the P. > Eng. > > -- > =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= > Spehro Pefhany "The Journey is the reward" > speff@interlog.com > Fax:(905) 332-4270 (small micro system devt hw/sw + mfg) > =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Hardinge help! From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 28 Oct 1998 17:11:46 GMT -------- AZOTIC wrote: > > Dear Dave > > There might be one one way to fix the problem. I remember reading in some > welding book about the repair of large > castings. since a lathe bed is nothing but > a casting this might work for you. go down to the local welding store and > buy about > 10 pound of thermite, Ref: Dave..the Machine Man!!!! This Phillistine/Troll should buy about 200 pounds of thermite, salt it well with U235 and set up his process in a small, unventilated place..he will find the fumes invigorating!! Make the funnel etc from the pages of the Starr report and stand over the reaction ready to mold the molten heap back into the form of a Hardinge Toolroom lathe. Bare hands should be protected with latex gloves. Then put it on Ebay..there is sure to be some punter as stupid as the original poster who will jump at the deal...Especially if you throw in a 1995 copy of the MSC catalogue and offer to pay the freight!! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Electricity guys - HELP PLEASE!! More observations From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 28 Oct 1998 17:16:56 GMT -------- David Berryhill wrote: > > I have formed an organization that you may want to join. The SECM (Society > for Electrically Challenged Machinists) is a support group that helps > machinists deal with the envy that they have for those with knowledge of > electricity and electronics. I only know enough about electricity to get > myself into trouble (deep trouble)! ;-) > > Dave Berryhill > Founder and President, SECM > > > Count me in..(In Imperial Units, if you don't mind) Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Turning Large Pieces Of Steel Plate From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 28 Oct 1998 17:43:06 GMT -------- Excellent suggestion Doug! I have had success using a sheet of very coarse sandpaper, glued to the faceplate, and a similar facing on the pressure pad. For thicker plate, hold in the four jaw by somewhat less than total thickness, (using backup pads.**) Turn to diameter, flip, true up and match turn remaining diameter. ** Tip!..All my 3 and 4 jaw chucks and faceplates are tapped (on the face, between jaws,) to allow me to mount soft pads or simply, hex head bolts with locknuts. With the jaws removed the pads are skimmed to the required height to provide a backup for thin parts held in the jaws. Helps to machine plates etc, exactly parallel. You can machine them with a step of the required diameter to true up plates etc., axially. Larger 4 jaw chucks have tee slots which can be used for this purpose. FWIW Robert Bastow Doug Smith wrote: > > Gary, How about this: Mount three or four sharp points (preferably carbide) > out close to the OD of a faceplate. Make another plate slightly larger > than > the diameter of the boltcircle of the points. Put a centerdrilled hole in > this > plate. Use the tailstock to force the plate being turned against the pins > via > the centerdrilled plate. This is the principle of a "drive dog" that is > usually > used for shafts that must be turned between centers over their entire > length. > By the way, you will probably want to recess the side of the pressure plate > so the pressure is concentrated out around the points. > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Suitability of dremel tool as die grinder From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 28 Oct 1998 17:56:16 GMT -------- I would not be without my dremel for some fiddly jobs..esp. cutting off hardened pins etc. However, the kind of work you describe is WAY outside the Dremel's capability. I would suggest getting a flat disc grinder, 4", or better, 7" dia. and use it with a hard, recessed center disc. With a bit of practice you will be able to do surprisingly accurate work. I used mine to refinish the top of my anvil, and it is FLAT! A vist to your local pawn shops should turn up scores of them!! Look for an OLD Black and Decker Industrial Grade, in reasonable shape. I have have mine since Adam was a Lad, and I can't wear it out!! Robert Bastow Rob wrote: > > I don't have a compressor in my home shop and I have no plans to add one > soon or I would get a pneumatic die grinder. I saw a Makita electric die > grinder in a store and have been considering getting it. Something else > that struck me though, was whether or not a Dremel tool would be suitable > for this purpose. I have a couple of jobs in mind for it right now. One > is cutting out some welds that I made on members that needed to be more > nearly parallel than they are (I didn't measure first - sue me, I'm new at > this). The other job is removing some hardfacing from my anvil (I used the > wrong kind of electrode). The latter seems more a job for a heavier duty > tool, but I don't know what the Dremel can take. > > Thanks for any suggestions, > Rob > > Rob Dennett, Software Engineer > > Top Drawer Productions > Multimedia that entertains, educates and uplifts. > > 1606 Headway Cir. > Austin, TX 78751 > (512) 719 - 4001 ======== To: machman@ibm.net Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Hardinge help! DISAPPOINTED From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 28 Oct 1998 21:33:34 GMT -------- ======== To: machman@ibm.net Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Hardinge help! DISAPPOINTED From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 28 Oct 1998 22:01:50 GMT -------- Dave Johnson, Machine Man wrote: > > In a newsgroup message on Wed, 28 Oct 1998 01:37:19 GMT, from Robert > Bastow , who said: > > >>Obviously not even enough of a "machine man" to fool the real ones!! > > Dear rec.crafts.metalworkers, I am disappointed. > Dave, if we mis-read your post and you have a genuine problem, then I for one, apologise for the levity with which it was treated. Here's a couple of (genuine) suggestions: Did you grind right through the hardened bed plate? If not, it MAY be possible to remove it and reverse it end to end..Putting the sound tailstock end towards the headstock where it will support the saddle properly. I imagine that most of your work is done close to the chuck and, in any case the tailstock will bridge your "excavation" more successfully than the saddle will. With the bed plate removed you may be able to clean up the gouge, square and true enough, to precision fit a heat treated "plug" that could be soft soldered in place. Do most of the hard fitting before fixing, and leave just a coupla "tenths" for finish stoning after you re-bolt the bed plate in place. If you did cut though the bed plate entirely!!...Or want to finish it off and do a permanent repair: Remove the two pieces and grind the ends square to the axis but with a small taper towards the bottom. This should expose enough of the original bed casting seating area, to be able to hard fit a slightly dovetail section to replace the missing section. Make this a very small interference fit and the original bed plate pieces will pull it down and firmly anchor it in place. You might want to fit a blind dowel from the plug into the bed casting to ensure relocation while you grind it to fit. Again leave a tenth or so for finish stoning after fitting. Best regards, and let us know if you need further help. Robert Bastow ======== To: "Scott S. Logan" Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Hardinge help! DISAPPOINTED From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 28 Oct 1998 22:07:17 GMT -------- For the moment Scott...Only for the moment!! Scott S. Logan wrote: > > Wassamatta Robert? Speechless? > > -- > On Wed, 28 Oct 1998 21:33:34 GMT, Robert Bastow > wrote: > > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: metal vs. paper From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 29 Oct 1998 05:18:13 GMT -------- Allen Adler wrote: > > Suppose I have a saw that is normally used to cut metal. > Which will wear out the saw faster: cutting metal or cutting paper? > > The paper would be stacked and clamped in reams and the cuts would > be perpendicular both to the edge and to the stack. > > Naively, > Allan Adler > adler@hera.wku.edu Not a naive question. Probably the paper will wear out the blade faster than the metal will. Paper is very abrasive, I use a wad of folded newspaper to finish hone knifeblades and wood chisels. Similarly, I use regular wood cutting bandsaw blades at woodcutting speeds to cut aluminum. Blades last indefinitely...unlike cutting wood especially plywood and fibreboard. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Hardinge help/Leadscrew tip From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 29 Oct 1998 20:56:42 GMT -------- I am not altogether convinced that this was a troll posting. We all do stupid things from time to time..especially when under pressure from SWMBO ('er indoors) As they say in the Navy.."It will drag you further than dynamite can blow you!!!" Whatever. I got a very polite and appreciative direct email from Dave telling me that he was going to follow my suggestion, and try to turn the Hardinge bedplate end for end!! I guess the moral is: When in doubt..do what's right! OBTW..This switching ends trick is often possible on a worn leadscrew. In most cases the majority of past and future usage is up at the headstock end and the tailstock end is virtually unworn. Flipping it end to end may take a bit of "cut and shut" but can give a whole new lease of life to a lathe. FWIW Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Steel Slivers From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 29 Oct 1998 21:24:48 GMT -------- Steve Cranage wrote: > > You are kidding, right? I wouldn't get any of my body parts within a foot > of a spinning endmill or anything else with a cutting edge, gloves have got > nothing to do with it. Why on earth would you ever get that close to > something that's razor sharp and spinning at a couple of thousand RPM???? > Amazing. I guess there are people out there that clean clogged grass out of > the lawnmower without turning it off first too... > Of course you wouldn't, nor would I, nor would any sane thinking person. I suppose though, knowing that you are a careful and experienced driver who never takes risks, you don't need to wear a seat belt...it can never happen to you. Right? My whole point is, that after a lifetime around machinery I am only too aware that Shit happens. I once witness a 65 year old machinist, who had worked on the same Horizontal Boring Mill for most of his life, KILLED by it on his last day at work. I also witnessed an experienced guy, running a large vertical roll bender, have his arm torn out at the shoulder when a shear "spike" on the edge of a 1" thick plate, snagged the mailed palm glove he was wearing! Machines have a way of "Reaching out to touch someone" As an apprentice, running a twin spindle drill press, I had the nasty experience of spinning swarf from the drill snagging a bandage on my hand and in a SPLIT SECOND it wrapped my hand and wrist around the spinning drill before I could tear loose. Nasty cuts, damaged tendons and a weakened wrist that I still feel, decades later, when the weather turns cold and damp. It is a documented fact that gloves and machinery don't mix. No machine shop owner worth his liability insurance will tolerate the wearing of gloves around moving machinery. If the trade off is dirty fingernails and a few splinters (Waa-Waa)..So be it. If you don't like that...take up needlepoint!! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: drilling A 286 s/s rivets need advice From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 30 Oct 1998 04:16:36 GMT -------- Do the rivets have heads? What is the depth of the hole? Do you have a punch press? Thank you Robert Bastow MONTMACH wrote: > > Alright you wanna be manufacturing engineers, I got a job here, I have > 7,000 pcs of A286 blind rivets the OD is .093" length is 7/8" with a .065" hole > in it. The operation is to enlarge the ID to .076" +- .001. problems, since > the wall is so thin theres problems of deformation on the OD where the gaps in > the collet are, the material being pushed out into the gaps, causing out of > roundness and out of tollerance parts. The material is annelled and I also > have drill life problems, and the drill likes to wander. I will pay the person > who comes up with a idea that works, and will run in a decent cycle time. Note > the operation is being done on a brown & sharp screw machine. > > Dave Griffith > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Dave Griffith > The R.A.T.T.-works > Monterey Machine Products > 1504-A Industrial Park Street > Covina, CA 91722 U.S.A. > http://www.rattworks.night.net/ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: SB Lathe Carriage Lock - thanks! From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 31 Oct 1998 13:12:47 GMT -------- Scott Logan wrote: > > McMaster DOES carry them, ask for/look for toolpost screws. > Speaking of which...I would like to change over all the hex socket setscrews in my (purchased and homemade) AXA tool holders to square head type. Just to eliminate the digging out of chips every time I change or sharpen a tool. MSC list square headed setscrews but these appear to be soft? and plated. What I would prefer are the unplated, case hardened traditional type of screw...and a good quality, tee handled square socket wrench to go with them. Size is 1/4-20 x 3/4" and I need 100 pcs. Any Ideas? I don't have a Mcmaster catalogue and am sick of asking for one!! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: SB Lathe Carriage Lock - thanks! From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 01 Nov 1998 17:31:46 GMT -------- Thanks Scott...this is what I need. Robert Bastow Scott S. Logan wrote: > > 91410A540 - 1/4-20 x 3/4 Sq Hd Set Screws, case hardened $7.11 pkg > pkg/100 > > Keep in mind, McMaster-Carr has their entire catalog on the web at > http://www.mcmaster.com > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: SB Lathe Carriage Lock - thanks! From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 01 Nov 1998 17:38:33 GMT -------- Martin H. Eastburn wrote: > > Suggest you measure all of them - (holders & bits) - since the setscrews > will screw below the surface. The square head type won't. Excellent point Martin...which I did take into account. ALL my tools are 1/2" square..in the interests of standardisation. Even smaller toolbits are held in 1/2" square "sub-holders" so that I do not often have to adjust centerheight when swapping out the few "oddball" tools that don't warrant their own holder. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: SB Lathe Carriage Lock/Swivel Thumb Screw Devices? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 01 Nov 1998 23:50:05 GMT -------- DTJ6PPC wrote: > Speaking of unusual and impossible to find bolt/screws, where can I find a > source for the swivel thumb screw type devices that I see on many drill presses > and other machines that are used in moderate tightening applications with > little access room, what are they called? > > The ones I am familiar with have a slot on the head end with a tumb tab > postioned in the slot, held in place and pivoting on a split pin. > > I would love to replace all heavily used, low torque adjusting bolts/screws on > all my various machines, to minimize the use/searching for any wrenches. > > Thanks, > > Don in Redondo They are called "little swivel thumb screw devices with a slot in the end and a thumb tab that swivels on a split pin" Major source of supply seems to be Taiwan...cost about $300 each but they throw in a POS drill press for free! Suggest you could make them real easy. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Homemade waterjer cutting machine From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 02 Nov 1998 15:56:16 GMT -------- Mike Graham wrote: > > That reminds me of a story. I heard (didn't see, might be an urban > legend) This is not an urban legend...A good friend of mine (name and address supplied to sceptics) lost most of the use of his right hand..almost lost his right arm to blood poisoning etc, from a pinhole leak in a forklift truck hydraulic union. Best advice to our wannabe water jet experimenter is to read the recent string (on Dejanews) and not f**k with the pressures involved here. You are on the outer limits...close to the "nuclear fusion" of hydraulic pressures. I used to sell high pressure, ceramic piston, ram pumps in Europe...1400 diesel hp through a saphire 1/16" nozzle!!! There are a lot of horror stories about what high pressure fluid can do...and a lot of funny ones!! Like the diver in Copenhagen harbor who was experimenting with underwater blast cleaning of ship hulls. Only about 5000 psi involved but he rigged a magnetically anchored unit with a non"deadman" ball valve. When the anchors inevitably let go, he was last seen heading off across the harbor at a high rate of knots!! BTW a water jet does not need abrasive entrainment to cut ANY porous material that the discrete droplets in the jet can penetrate. Concrete, trees, humans..all the same..like a knife through butter. They are used for cutting up frozen beef carcases and cutting out mass made suits for men. The jet "cuts" by means of the discrete droplets penetrating the surface and "exploding" like a mini cluster bomb. OTOH, non porous materials (glass,steel etc) need abrasive to work well..although 50,000 psi will crater steel quite impressively!! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Decided to get a welding gismo From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 03 Nov 1998 01:46:01 GMT -------- Ted Edwards wrote: > > Mike Graham wrote: > > > Whoa. Are you saying you can't cut stainless with a torch? > > That's right. You can melt a very crudy path through it but you can't > get a cut like you do on mild or even moderately high carbon steels. > Ted The way we used to do it was to inject iron powder into the cutting stream. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Aluminum? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 03 Nov 1998 01:55:14 GMT -------- zj wrote: > > Looking for aluminum? We offer light weight aluminum and stainless steel. > You can order online. Contact us with any > questions.http://www.thermsulate.com There they go again with this special "light weight" aluminum!! Wish I could get some "heavy weight" aluminum...might be good for boat anchors! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Knurling Question From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 03 Nov 1998 02:09:46 GMT -------- No! Knurls are not gears, they do not "mesh" there is enough slippage for them to find their own pitch, regardless of work diameter..AND REGARDLESS OF WHAT THE THEORETITIONS MAY TELL YOU TO THE CONTRARY!!! Robert Bastow Gary B. Advise wrote: > > I'm looking into buying a knurling tool for the lathe. I've read what > I could find on them in publications such as South Bend's How To Run A > Lathe book. I want to do course diamond patterns. However, something > isn't clicking in my mind. Perhaps someone can explain it to me. > > The knurling wheel has a certain circumference as does the stock to be > knurled. Each knurling wheel has a certain number of lines per > circumference (ie 14, 21, 33, etc). > > Doesn't the stock being knurled have to be the same circumference or > be evenly divisible by the numbers of lines on the knurling wheel? > Otherwise, won't the knurling wheel crush it's own indentations if it > doesn't. Doesn't the carriage travel speed also have to be tied to the > speed of the chuck much like when cutting threads? What am I missing > here? > > Thanks for your time. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Should I buy a Myford super 7 From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 03 Nov 1998 02:20:50 GMT -------- Mr. Nice Guy wrote: > > I am considering buying a Myford Super 7 for my shop. I know it is > expensive but is it still a quality machine? I don't have space for a > large machine ant the Myford should fill my needs. > Superb machine for the "Home Shop Machinist" Years of development and thousands of satisfied customers can't be far wrong. Versatile...Way beyond its nominal capacity, high quality, lots of accessories, a silky "feel" and high resale value retention. More available literature on how to do and what to do on a Myford than the Kharma Sutra has on sex! Price? Relative..It's a machine for a lifetime. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Bridegport Lighting From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 03 Nov 1998 02:40:59 GMT -------- Funny!! I replaced all the 75/100 watt incandescent bulbs in my work lights with 50 watt halogen spots and got more light and a LOT less heat!! Yer pays yer money and yer takes yer pick!! Robert Bastow Felice Luftschein & Nicholas Carter wrote: > > >Well, I tried a 28W halogen, and it nearly burned the hair off the back > >of my arm! > I was working in the shop and started feeling funny, noticed a bad > smell and some smoke...from my head! The lamp had shifted so it was > above my head, and the halogen almost balded&scalded me. > I took out all the halogens that day. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Cost of used Armstrong or Williams tool holders? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 03 Nov 1998 02:50:34 GMT -------- IMHO, tho' there have been, and continue to be, gifted people who do superb work with lantern toolposts and Armstrong/Williams toolholders, they are the result of a conspiracy to reduce the number of people that stick out the shop machine courses!! I have a number of Armstrong toolholders suitable for 9" to 12" lathes in the LH, RH, parting, boring and knurling persuasions....any reasonable offer that includes postage will be considered. Robert Bastow Grant Erwin wrote: > > > Tim947 5 wrote: > > > > > > Can somebody give me an idea of a fair price for used Armstrong and > > > Williams tool holders? I'm talking about knurling, right, and left > > > hand, and straight tool holders, and cut off tool holders, and > > > threading holders, with a lot of tool left on it. Plus the square > > > hole wrenches that you use on them. These are all in good conditition. > > > Many thanks, Bob > > I consider $120 for a complete set of Armstrong holders, in the > red Armstrong box with all the wrenches, to be a fair price. If > the brand is mixed i.e. some Williams mixed in, well, a little > less but not too much if they all fit the same size lathe. > > If I ever upgrade to a modern TP I'll sell mine. I got a real > nice set that I really like. > > Armstrong might cost a lot but they sure make nice stuff. Ever > wonder why of all the toolholders made 50 years ago most of the > ones left are Armstrong? > > Grant Erwin > Seattle, Washington ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: MSC Catalog-What's the big Deal? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 03 Nov 1998 04:11:55 GMT -------- After several requests and even more promises I picked up two copies(on separate visits) from the Atlanta Distribution center. Why two?..One for the upstairs bathroom and one for the downstairs bathroom...Too damn heavy to lug up and down stairs every time I need a sh..er..read!! Robert Bastow JR North wrote: > > I got tired of waiting for my MSC Big Book to arrive, so I went to the > website and ordered it. In the "comments" box, with characteristic > acidulity, I reminded them I was a customer and was just expecting them > to send one to me. 5 days hence, here it is, marked 'URGENT' no less. > The squeaky wheel gets the grease, as they say.... > JR ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Test. Don't read From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 03 Nov 1998 04:13:02 GMT -------- Dammit! Me too...new marketing tool? JR North wrote: > > Oh shoot. I read it > > Berny Ramirez wrote: > > > Test message. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Gas Bottles From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 03 Nov 1998 04:19:42 GMT -------- > Since you guys are so full of misinformation on the gas bottle subject how > about a little test. Why is the small acetylene gas bottle designated size > "MC"? I'll bet 1 in 10 of you can't get this right without asking a > knowledgable person like your friendly welding supply dealer. I'll even bet > over 1/2 of them can't answer the question. It stands for "Motor Cycle" Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Welding on TV: always wrong! From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 03 Nov 1998 04:43:44 GMT -------- Martin H. Eastburn wrote: > > Yea socket hot, but your bare toe must touch ground when inserting > finger... Bare toe not neccessary..My thinly insulated bare ass on an aluminum step ladder was enough to make me glad I wasn't sitting astride it!! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Decided to get a welding gismo From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 03 Nov 1998 13:20:14 GMT -------- > Again, its been awhile but I seem to remember cutting some 420 SS by > feeding a piece of oxy welding rod into the cut as I went along. > Anyone out there want to try and let me know if I remember correctly? > > Mark White This will work, as I mentioned earlier we had profile cutting rigs that cut up to 5" thick SS by feeding Iron Powder into the flame. The objective was to augment the iron deficient SS to the point where the oxidising (burning) was sufficient to sustain the cut. Cuts were not quite as clean as on carbon steel but quite acceptable. Same thing worked on Monel and ..IIRC...copper and CI. Of course this was 35+ years ago and I imagine other technologies are used now. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: explosion forming? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 03 Nov 1998 16:41:12 GMT -------- Grant Erwin wrote: > > I was told that they were exploded together. Not explosion > forming, but rather sort of "explosion welding". > > probably the least useful of the answers you will get > > Grant Erwin > Seattle, Washington Not at all Grant, you have it dead right! One of the primary uses of "explosion welding" is to make dissimilar metal "sandwiches" An example would be the cladding of a thick billet of A36 (boiler plate) with a much more expensive and corrosion resistant layer of stainless steel. The resultant billet is then rolled to the required thicknesses. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: MSC Catalog-What's the big Deal? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 04 Nov 1998 00:33:50 GMT -------- Jhko wrote: > > Geeze, Robert, I'm amazing you can read that MSC catalog in such a position. > Usually I have to use an engine hoist to lift the book off of the table. > Joe Osborn > After having a consulting engineer check out the loads involved I had the floors and supporting structures specially strengthened. A local firm of millwrights gave me a special deal on moving it into place. They were pretty good, taking the window out without damage. But the "Big Cat" slipped in the slings and took out the bathtub before the eight man team were able to get it back under control!! I have designed a special self levelling stand (Anyone have a handle on good used 5" dia hydraulic cylinders) and the next stage will be a self balancing page turner. I think this last item will lend itself to full CNC operation. Old catalogues fetch several hundred dollars from recyclers..but they refuse to pick them up. OTOH the Sally Army sent me a very kind note of thanks...apparently this represents several years supply of TP for a needy family. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: AD:SHERLINE HOLIDAY SALE SAVE 20% From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 04 Nov 1998 00:38:23 GMT -------- Jim Harvey wrote: > > At this point, I wouldn't sell you a 10-32 screw for $5000.00. I like > customers, not scam artists. > Good fer yer Jim! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: laser Ballistics From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 04 Nov 1998 01:02:57 GMT -------- Bruce W. Singer wrote: > > Stu, > I just returned 2 torpedo laser levels I bought from Harbor Freight > for $75 each. I like the idea of a small accurate laser level and > thot for the money that these would be as advertised. Boy was I wrong! > One was off 1" in 10 ft. (a far cry from +- 1/4 inch in 100ft > advertised) Also, the dot size was to large as if there was no attempt > to focus the beam. What you experienced here was the gravity drop effect on a large heavy beam at low velocity. Did they not supply trajectory correction tables (similar to ballistic tables for rifle ammunition)? First class lasers run a little more expensive but are worth the extra. They project a smaller,lighter beam at a much higher velocity. The effect of the inevitable drop is negligent at up to 1000 feet. Robert Bastow Laser Consultant to the Clinton Administration ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Grooving 300-series stainless - carbide essential? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 04 Nov 1998 02:56:34 GMT -------- Curt Brown wrote: > > Is it practical to make deep (3/8), narrow (1/8) grooves in 300 > series stainless _without_ using carbide? > > Thanks > Curt Your material is showing all the symptoms of work-hardening. There is no way to "overcome" this..but it can easily be "undercome" ;^) The secret is to take a cut deep enough to get "under the skin" of the surface hardened by the previous cut. And NEVER let the tool "dwell" even for an instant without cutting. This takes a little experimenting..and a lot of confidence/courage when parting off or cutting grooves. First, make sure your cross slide moves smothly with no trace of play in the ways. Reduce overhang and increase the rigidity of your tool/toolholder. Lock every carriage movement not in use. Be sure the headstock bearings are correctly set up. In other words totally eliminate any cause of chatter...Chatter in itself can produce work hardening in a hurry!! Now sharpen and hone your HSS parting tool..razor sharp!! grind the front quite square (any angle to the front..such as is sometimes suggested to "remove the pip" only results in imposing a side force on the tool as well as producing a chip that is wider than the groove..not a good idea) The front clearance should be around 5-7 deg and must NOT have any flat to it (Work hardens). side clearance should be a little greater than for MS say about five deg/side..again, honed and razor sharp. Top rake should be 5 to 10 deg. Its a trade of here as you want to "slice" off the metal with a minimum of pressure (to reduce the depth of WH)...but you can't afford to weaken the tool too much. Make the tool from the largest section of HSS that you can and keep the blade you grind to minimum length. Set the tool EXACTLY on C/L..if you must err..go below C/L. If you go above you are creating excess pressure that will cause WH) Set your work in the chuck or collet with a minimum of overhang, even if it means resetting for every groove. If you can, arrange tailstock support. The objective is to eliminate deflection = shallower cutting or rubbing = work hardening!! Now comes the gutsy bit. Reduce speed to about 2/3 of that normally recomended for that material/diameter, arrange a full flood of lubricant and GO FOR IT!! You have to feed in at a quite aggressive pace..to "get under" the hardened surface you are constantly creating. You must not hesitate or slow down until you reach full depth and you must instantly reverse out without "dwell" when you hit the right depth. I suggest you practice a bit on a piece of similar material and find the best automatic infeed rate for the job. Approached like this it should be a piece of cake. Robert Bastow ======== To: "'Grif' w. keith griffith" Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Cost of used Armstrong or Williams tool holders? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 04 Nov 1998 03:00:55 GMT -------- I surely did Grif...I surely do...And I surely will!! Robert Bastow 'Grif' w. keith griffith wrote: > > > Robert Bastow > > If you didn't get my e-mail,,, give me a eholler and let me know your > address and if you still have any of the holders. thanks > > Grif ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Test: Please Read From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 04 Nov 1998 03:04:56 GMT -------- It never appeared on my screen!! Robert Bastow Dave Ficken wrote: > > If anyone sees this post, I'd appreciate an email. > I've posted several replies to various topics and have never seen them > appear on the group. > > Thanks, > Dave@mermac.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Indexable carbide inserts From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 04 Nov 1998 03:17:24 GMT -------- Lathenut wrote: > > Hi, all. Would someone offer their opinion on what would be the absolute worst > thing that could possibly happen to some idiot that used a C-2 insert on steel? > Or a C-5 on brass? > I would, of course, never consider something so stupid, but I know a few that > would. In fact, I would rather burn my shop down than be forced to do something > so unthinkable. > Thanks, Bill. Frankly Bill...not a whole heck of a lot! The sky wouldn't open and s*** on you. Any difference in surface finish and tool life would take months to evaluate. Remember that the speeds, feeds, grades and surface coatings are designed for industrial settings where costs are measured in thousandths of a penny and time in milliseconds. Been there, done that. Now in the serenity of my own shop I use or buy whatever comes to hand quickest and cheapest. Damned if I can tell the difference...or even want to know it anymore. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: laser Ballistics From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 04 Nov 1998 03:39:27 GMT -------- Right first time Martin! Mind you, don't write off those big, slow moving suckers..They have their uses. I have both types of laser and find the heavy, slow moving photons penetrate better..so I use my old laser when there are intervening bushes or buildings that the new, slick little suckers just bounce right off. The lasers come with a warning label and it pays to heed them!! I was flashing mine around willy-nilly the other day and I was followed home by a Tomahawk Missile! Turned out to be lost and very grateful for directions back to the White House...but it put the wind up me for a moment!! Robert Bastow Martin H. Eastburn wrote: > > Yea right Robert - must have been using those big slow deep red > photons instead of those small fast light red photons... > Martin > -- > NRA LOH, NRA Life > NRA Second Amendment Task Force Charter Founder > Martin Eastburn, Barbara Eastburn > @ home on our computer oldtree@pacbell.net ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Size of Unimat 3 spindle threads? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 05 Nov 1998 14:21:27 GMT -------- Other than the thread pitch, is it correct to assume that WW collets are similar in other detals to "standard" 8mm collets? (there appear to be many standards..most of which are interchangeable?) Robert Bastow Steve Rayner wrote: > > The WW standard is American! It was developed my the master tool makers, > Webster & Whitcombe of the old Waltham watch factory. The thread is a > metric diameter ( 6.875 ) X 40tpi. > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Thought for today From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 05 Nov 1998 14:27:34 GMT -------- Guido (Guy) Fawkes wasn't an elected representative, his intention was to BLOW UP the Houses of Parliament!! Come back Guy Fawkes..All is forgiven! Robert Bastow Amma Miller wrote: > > On Thu, 5 Nov 1998 10:51:58 GMT, Tom Holt > wrote: > > >Today we celebrate the life and legacy of Guido Fawkes (1570-1606), > >the only man in history to enter the British Parliament with the > >intention of making life better for his fellow-citizens... Please to > >remember, and light a candle, not a bonfire > > > > does'nt sound like any American politicians I have ever heard of ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: explosion forming? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 05 Nov 1998 14:35:59 GMT -------- There is another type of explosion forming..a variation of "High Impact Extrusion" Here a billet of steel is extruded through a die at EXTREMELY high velocity by the "explosion" of a capacitor bank in the fluid above the billet. IIRC hardened high speed steel can be extruded to shape with this process. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: explosion forming? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 05 Nov 1998 16:33:06 GMT -------- Tungsten carbide I imagine. I am by no means and expert on this subject...Just recalling an article I once read. Robert Bastow Spehro Pefhany wrote: > > the renowned Robert Bastow wrote: > > > Here a billet of steel is extruded through a die at EXTREMELY high velocity by > > the "explosion" of a capacitor bank in the fluid above the billet. > > > IIRC hardened high speed steel can be extruded to shape with this process. > > What would you use for a die material? > > -- > =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= > Spehro Pefhany "The Journey is the reward" > speff@interlog.com > Fax:(905) 332-4270 (small micro system devt hw/sw + mfg) > =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lathe set-up questions From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 06 Nov 1998 15:58:34 GMT -------- The best, single improvement I ever made to a Myford was to mount it on a Blanchard ground 2 3/4" thick x 8" x 24" steel slab. It improves rigidity, hogging capacity and repeatable accuracy, by a tremendous amount. Scrape in the foot pad areas to eliminate warp or twist in the bed..level does't count except "for pretty" Robert Bastow Steve Rayner wrote: > > When I moved here, I mounted my Myford on a Taiwanese stand. This is the > one made for the 8 inch swing lathe. It has two mounting holes, vs the > Myfords four. I made adapter plates from 3/8 aluminum flat bar. The > adapters were drilled, and bolted in place. I then transfered the lathe > to the stand. A home made transfer punch was used to mark the centers for > the lathe mounting holes. This arrangement seems to have stiffened the > lathe, as well as removing any tendency to twist the bed. The machine is > now more accurate than ever. > > -- > > Steve. > ************************************************************************** > Visit my website at: > http://www.victoria.tc.ca/~ud233/homepage.htm > > ************* Tu ne cede malis, sed contra audentior ito. **************** > ******************************** - Virgil ******************************** > ******Yield thou not to adversity, but press on the more bravely.********** ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Moving tribulations..Was..Be Nice To Minnesotans From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 06 Nov 1998 16:33:43 GMT -------- Neil Gilmore wrote: > So when we arrived in > Madison, the tool had slid off the end of the table, and was sitting on the > 'gearbox' on the couch, on top of a box full of misc (non fragile) > stuff. So it worked out OK, because we had 3 of us to wrestle it back onto > the table. Because my original contract, moving me from the UK to the US, gave me all of a weeks notice to "Be in Place" I had to leave the packing and shipping of all my worldly goods to the "most competent" shipper I could find at short notice. In this case it was P&O..Also the most expensive, but that didn't matter as my company picked up the tab. However, when my stuff eventually turned up in Enid, Oklahoma, after spending six weeks in a steamy warehouse in Houston I found that my Myford had been shipped, lying on its side, on a cloth pad, on top of a very expensive and almost new, Damask Sofa!! The Myford was fine, except for a few sweaty handprints on the brightwork..The sofa however, had a new and interesting pattern to it!! They wrecked just about every piece of furniture, one way or another, and then had the gall to try and welch on the insurance because I had not signed off on the insurance documents before the shipment left my home!! To add insult to injury, the loss adjuster eventually showed up and wrote his report, in ballpoint pen (Press hard..You're making three copies) on the top of my french polished, mahogany, dining room table..Thus far the ONLY undamaged piece. To this day I still have a full, readable, copy of his report impressed in the table top!! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Moving tribulations..Was..Be Nice To Minnesotans From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 07 Nov 1998 02:57:46 GMT -------- True!...Once it lifts off the french polish!! Anyhow I am kinda used to it..If nothing else it is a conversation piece. Robert Bastow RX7drivr wrote: > > >To this day I still have a full, readable, copy of his report impressed > >in the table top! > > Hmmm. Have you tried a medium hot iron over a piece of damp cotton T-shirt? > It's more than likely to steam the dents out. > > James > Cheers, > James > > In accordance with 47 U.S.C.A. section 227, sending Unsolicited Commercial > Communications to the originator's account implies acknowledgment of the > account owner's rights to minimum damages of $500 per violation. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: EMCO 11" Lathe From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 07 Nov 1998 15:53:26 GMT -------- I have a Maximat Super II. Excellent design and quality. VERY rigid and repeatably accurate. Useful speed range, plenty of power. 5C spindle with a 1 3/8" through hole and D1-3 spindle nose. Easy to cut inch or metric threads. Now I have carried out a few mods to suit myself..I love it!! Downside is the initial cost (now close to $8000!) and the price of spares and accessories from the new dealer (Blue Ridge) I know where there is an excellent used model for around $4200..contact me off line for details. Robert Bastow DoN. Nichols wrote: > > In article <71vkc3$7ak@hsun27.chevron.com>, John L wrote: > >I am interested in receiving comments (good or bad) on the EMCO 11" Lathe. > >I have a chance to purchase one and appreciate receiving feed-back from some > >users. > > I've got an Emco-Maier Compact-5/CNC (5" swing), which I love. It > is amazingly solid for its size. (I would like a larger size to keep it > company, but I don't think that I would get rid of this one for anything.) > > I have no idea how good the thread-cutting is on the manual > versions, but this one will do metric and inch threads at the flip of a > switch. (It also doesn't have to be a "standard" thread, but that's the CNC > working there.) > > If it is anywhere near within reason, go for it -- or turn it over > to me. An 11" should be about all that I need to complete my shop. :-) > > Good Luck, > DoN. > > -- > NOTE: spamblocking on against servers which harbor spammers. > Email: | Donald Nichols (DoN.)|Voice (703) 938-4564 > My Concertina web page: | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html > --- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero --- ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: EMCO 11" Lathe From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 08 Nov 1998 15:00:09 GMT -------- Doug White wrote: > > I have one as well, and except that I don't get to spend as much time on > it as I would like, it's wonderful. Mine leaks a little oil around the > headstock when it's running, but I've had it for about 5 years now, and > the sight glass still reads full. > > Doug White If the sight glass is full there is too much oil in the headstock..whick may be why it is leaking. You don't say where the leak occurs..It can only be from either bearing or layshaft seals, sight glass,drain plug or top cover. Mine is as tight as a drum. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How do I "square up" small lathe? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1998 13:27:17 GMT -------- A properly set up lathe should machine 0.0005" concave over a twelve inch diameter plate. Robert Bastow Kurt Laughlin wrote: > > Have you tried mounting an indicator on the toolpost and running along the > face of the chuck or a faceplate? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Drilling brass, was Micro 100 ... From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 16 Nov 1998 23:55:49 GMT -------- Jim Harvey wrote: > > Hmm ... I've never seen anyone offering indexes full of drills > >ground to zero rake for brass work. Is *everyone* expected to modify their > >own drill bits? :-) > Brass drills have zero rake ie...straight flutes. You can buy them in sets. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re:FS/ SouthBend Faceplate 1 1/2" X 8 TPI From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 17 Nov 1998 16:21:52 GMT -------- FOR SALE: SouthBend Faceplate 7 3/8" o/d 6 slot Fits 1 1/2" x 8 tpi spindle. Unused..As new. $40.00 including postage. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lathes in the UK. From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 20 Nov 1998 20:07:18 GMT -------- John stevenson wrote: > South Bend was lisenced to > >Boxford Machine Tools, Yorks. Neither still produce lathes. Someone > >mentioned Harrison, which are fine lathes, I have an 11" one, but Harrison is > >no longer made. > > > Harrison Lathes are still made in Yorkshire. > Harrison and Colchester are all part of the 600 Group > - > Regards, > So far as I am aware, Boxford are still building lathes, tho' possibly not of South Bend heritage anymore. They do have a web site..enquiries for spare parts for my Boxford shaper have gone unanswered!! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Diamond tool holder From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 21 Nov 1998 02:28:53 GMT -------- ddd wrote: > > When I first saw the thing I thought that I would experiment with > a similar tool holder where I could vary all three degrees of freedom. > > This way I would be able to set the rake and relief angles that I > wanted. > (clip tedious stuff!!) > I'd be interested if anyone has looked at this problem and if they > have any ideas about how to solve it. > > DOC Yeah!....grind the angles you want and quit trying to substitute technology for skill!!! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Diamond tool holder From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 21 Nov 1998 02:30:46 GMT -------- DGoncz wrote: > > The diamond tool point used to be a forged tool that would be clamped in the > rocker tool post with cap screw. It was easy to sharpen then as now. You can > make a v groove shim for your rocker tool post. Set above center to provide > clearance, it will produce a good finish on a run of steel parts, but since > it's off center, it only works for a particular cut, say rough from 1 inch to > 7/8 then a few thou for a nice finish. You can always file a steel diameter for > a good finish. > Not in my shop you don't!!!! > Yours, > > Doug Goncz > Replikon Research, Fairfax County, VA > > In a letter from my landlord: "...the baiting treatment is odorless > and harmless because of where it's applied. > Everybody can and will be exterminated...." :) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.crafts.misc,comp.robotics.misc Subject: Re: Need positioners for lasers and mirrors. From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 21 Nov 1998 02:33:31 GMT -------- mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article <01be1483$e65edb00$8b295381@wilkins-pc.mitre.org>, > "James Wilkins" wrote: > > > > The worst case I ever saw was a Ph.D.... > A Ph.D...is a BS that is Piled high and Deep!! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Should I drive over to Canada From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 21 Nov 1998 02:49:06 GMT -------- Martin H. Eastburn wrote: > > Sounds like to me - NAFTA isn't functional unless you live south. > I don't know the details of NAFTA - some of the bad ones - but good > grief trade should be much easier between Canada and the U.S. > > Martin Problem is that Canadian Manufacturing Base was built behind a wall of tariff barriers. If a US company wanted the extra ten percent of market that Canada represented then they pretty well had to manufacture in Canada. NAFTA did away with that..most US companies could retreat to their US facilities, turn up the wicks ten percent (at a time when they were running 15 -25% under capacity) and ship product north of the border via the shell companies they left there to handle marketing and distribution, Ontario and Quebec lost THOUSANDS or manufacturing jobs in the couple of years following NAFTA. I know...my company and three hundred skilled employees were among them!! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Grizzly Mill Model G5966 From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 21 Nov 1998 05:07:04 GMT CC: modeleng-list@swcp.com -------- I seem to be homing in on the new Grizzly model G5966 Tilting head and swivel table Milling machine as being just about the right size for my purposes. I do not have the space headroom or need for a Bridgeport or clone thereof. The Model G5966 has a dovetail column rather than the usual round column found in most Mill/Drills and has a 9 1/2 x 31 1/2" table with facility to swivel the table like a universal mill. Weight is given as 1300lb gross. and motor is a two speed 220v 1.5/.85hp unit. Price in 1998 catalogue is $1795. Without getting into the relative merits of other suppliers per se..HF Jet, Enco etc..Does anyone have any DIRECT experience of this particular machine? Can anyone think of any use for a swiveling table..other than large radius milling and ease of tramming up long workpieces? Thanks Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Mill functions From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 21 Nov 1998 05:30:46 GMT -------- SRW60021 wrote: > > I cannot fit a BP clone in my shop, so a full function mill is out of the > question. The two options I cant find together in a 70in. high machine are a > knee and power downfeed. > > Thanks > Shawn Check out the Grizzly model G1004..this is a full function Knee type mill with power table feed and downfeed. Height is given as 67" Looks like a Clausing Clone. List Price is $2650 I see no need for a knee..provided the head has sufficient "Lift" and can be held in alignment during its perambulations. Most jig boreres are of the "Bed" type construction. Power downfeed is far more useful than a hand cranked knee..especially when it comes to boring operations or deep hole drilling, Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.antiques,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Is there an alternative to eBay (and on line auctions)? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 21 Nov 1998 05:34:41 GMT -------- I have had good results buying and selling directly through the metalworking group (of bits and pieces relevant to this NG and in the $25 - $50.00 range) Beats eBay anytime. Robet Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Clausing..was Grizzly Mill From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 21 Nov 1998 05:42:35 GMT -------- Thanks for the tip-off Garry..this is exactly the kind of info I was looking for. Next question..What is the going rate for a Clausing in excellent condition? What are the chances of finding one with an R8 spindle. I saw a nice one recently for $1400 but it had a B&S spindle nose..any disadvantage in this? Thanks Robert Bastow Garry wrote: > > They have stopped importing this mill. The units had many problems > when actual delivery started. What they have they were selling for > 1500 dollars with no support...... > > Shame as the idea looks sound. > > I think a claussing will meet your space requirements. Dave Sobel had > three when I got mine.. > > Garry > > On Sat, 21 Nov 1998 05:07:04 GMT, Robert Bastow > wrote: > > >I seem to be homing in on the new Grizzly model G5966 Tilting head and swivel > >table Milling machine as being just about the right size for my purposes. I do > >not have the space headroom or need for a Bridgeport or clone thereof. > > > >The Model G5966 has a dovetail column rather than the usual round column found > >in most Mill/Drills and has a 9 1/2 x 31 1/2" table with facility to swivel the > >table like a universal mill. Weight is given as 1300lb gross. and motor is a > >two speed 220v 1.5/.85hp unit. Price in 1998 catalogue is $1795. > > > >Without getting into the relative merits of other suppliers per se..HF Jet, Enco > >etc..Does anyone have any DIRECT experience of this particular machine? > > > >Can anyone think of any use for a swiveling table..other than large radius > >milling and ease of tramming up long workpieces? > > > >Thanks > > > >Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: FIRE PROFF SAFE ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 22 Nov 1998 14:46:16 GMT -------- im no poet wrote: > Safes are made from two pieces of steel sandwiched by an insulating > material made from a mixture of powdered aluminum and potassium > chlorate. He would be a helluva feller in a political organisation!! ......Just add diesel fuel to taste!! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Bright or dull ideas. From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 22 Nov 1998 14:49:24 GMT -------- John Hofstad-Parkhill wrote: > The base is about 30" wide, cast iron. It has a set of centers on one way, > parallel to that way it has what I can describe as the biggest micrometer > head I've ever seen, on it's own casting & way. Perpindicular to the centers > is another head with some kind of probe. The ways that hold the centers and > the probe look to have been ball-bearing ways. I'm only guessing as they > look exactly like they should, except sans any balls. > > It was $10 poorly spent. > > I'm trying, and failing, to come up with creative uses for this thing. How about the world's largest watchmakers "turns"...or a wood lathe? Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: starting a machineshop-opinions? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 22 Nov 1998 14:56:35 GMT -------- This is not "starting a business"..this is "buying your own job" and there is a huge difference!! The one will pay you money (eventually) whether you get out of bed or not. The other will only get done if YOU do it....No tickee...No laundry!! Ask yourself..Where do I want to be in five year's time? Will this get me there? Is there a better way to utilise my time and effort to get me to the same destination faster and with more certainty..less risk? Robert Bastow KE6DHE wrote: > > hello all, > I have been in the metals industry for 28 years and a machinist for about 10. > lately I have been considering buying a cnc machining center and a cnc > turning center to install in my own shop to do short run and quick turn around > prototyping as well as turning out some products of my own. I have figured the > setup costs and plan to finance the operation thru the machine dealer. I plan > to continue my current job (as I like the place and is steady) and have figured > that even if I dont get this paying for itself the first year I could cover the > expenses > with 25% of my paycheck. I currently have manual equipment but have reasoned > that I couldn't be competitive. I've already invested about 15,000 in my tool > chest plus another 10k in support equipment such as welders plasma > cutters, stock reduction tools, and whatnot. I am not green, but would > appreciate any input. thanks, Rufo ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How are files made? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 22 Nov 1998 15:01:24 GMT -------- dan wrote: > > Con1BLou@aol.com wrote: > > > > I am a machine shop instructor at a local community college. One of my > > students asked me a question that I had never considered before. He wanted to > > know how are files made. Any help out there on this question. Thanks Louis > > Quindlen Laney Community College > > starting with a piece of hardedable metal, you take a sharp chisle and > cut into the blank over and over again. Then you harden the cut blank. > > At least thats how it used to be done. I'm sure theres a more involved > process in use today. This is still the basic process...Only now it is done automatically on a machine rather than by a highly skilled man with a Big Hammer. Robert Bastow ======== To: darby Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Any Ideas? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 22 Nov 1998 17:15:50 GMT -------- Looks like a very handy little machine...lets us know how much it fetches. Thanks, Robert Bastow darby wrote: > > I am interested in bidding on the little horizontal mill on the page > listed below and wondered if anyone had ever seen one of these. There > appears to be a lever on the right side of the knee and another near the > Z axis hand wheel on the left of the knee. Wondered what function they > might serve also wondered if that type of "add on vertical head would > have a "Z feed in it" > > Anyone venture a guess?? > > Thanks in advance Bill Darby > > http://www.pwgsc.gc.ca/cadc/text/quebec/tools-e.htm ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What comes out the top of a small cupola? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 22 Nov 1998 17:23:13 GMT -------- What is the smallest practical size for a coal/coke fired cupola? What would be minimum stack height? Would it be possible to arrange a pilot light..A la flare tip? Where does one locate suitable fuel? Limestone flux etc? Is the slag regularly tapped off above the iron? Robert Bastow Russ Kepler wrote: > > In article <36571997.2012669B@comhiway.com>, Corky wrote: > >I've never seen a cupola in action and I was just wondering about the > >feasability of actually running one in the back yard. There are plans > >available for really small ones (12 inches or so), but will the fire > >engines be showing up on the first heat or what? Does charcoal burn > >cleaner than coke? Love to hear from anyone actually using a small > >cupola to melt cast iron. > > Look at Stewart Marshall's at http://rockisland.com/~marshall - he > has a nice little volume on building and feeding a small cupola > furnace. It's fairly slim but packed with the information that you > need. > -- > Russ Kepler russ@kepler-eng.com > > Please Don't Feed the Engineers ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: WTB: Emco Maier Super-11 bed (only) From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 04 Dec 1998 19:04:10 GMT -------- You can have the bed off mine for $8000.00!!...Plus shipping! Robert Bastow wrench@poboxes.com wrote: > > Hi: > If anyone out there has an Emco Maier Super-11 bed, I may be interested > in it. I don't care if the headstock is trashed, there is no tooling, > or the tailstock/carriage is missing.... I only want the bed. > > Thanks. > > -----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==---------- > http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: ENCO: Still alive? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 07 Dec 1998 15:28:33 GMT -------- Dick Brewster wrote: I believe the previous poster was referring to J&L MSC DO NOT HAVE A MINIMUM ORDER LEVEL!! Robert Bastow > Paul, I just noticed that you are a highly influential (:-) MSC > shareholder. A letter from you to MSC telling them why a student > exception to their $25 minimum would be a good idea just might > cause someone to change the rule. > > -- > Dick Brewster > > Username is: dbrewste > Domain is: @ix.netcom.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re:Indian Quality From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 07 Dec 1998 15:59:50 GMT -------- YES! For many years the Alfred Herbert range of capstan and turret lathes were built under contract in India...By HSM as I recall. They may still be building them. The quality was SUPERB!!! Robert Bastow Curt Brown wrote: > Generally true, but -- do you know of a single example > of a quality machine tool or accessory made in India? > > - Curt > (SPAM-resistant address) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Squares From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 07 Dec 1998 16:17:43 GMT -------- A good 2lb ball pein hammer is an essential part of any machinist/toolmakers equipment. What separates the skilled from the unskilled is not just knowing that it needs to be hit with a hammer...But precisely WHERE!...and precisely HOW HARD!! Mike Graham's method is accepted, PROVEN practice. Robert Bastow Don't force it...Use a bigger hammer!! B&L Denard wrote: > > I shure would hate to hire that cat with the ballpein hammer he wouldn't > last as long as a snow ball in hell in my shop. > Bill D. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Micrometerss etc. FS cheap. From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 07 Dec 1998 16:29:37 GMT -------- Mitch Haley wrote: > > Starrett 0-1/2"x0.001" mic heads, small thimble, .236" shank, > spindle about .11". Can use these to make some nifty pocket > mics for Xmas presents, new in box, $10each. I recently bought a couple of these from Mitch...cute as buttons they are!! Thanks Mitch. I am going to use them on the 6" x 6" universal grinder I am in the process of reconditioning. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Pearl Harbor Day... From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 07 Dec 1998 18:11:16 GMT -------- Naw!...Just another shitty day in a shitty period!! Robert Bastow James Wilkins wrote: > > ppierce wrote > > REMEMBER PEARL HARBOR (Also the Alamo)............. > > Paul in AJ AZ > > British possessions were also attacked by surprise. Do you make note of the > event? > > jw ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Pearl Harbor Day... From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 08 Dec 1998 03:36:01 GMT -------- The British tend to commemorate the day that wars END....Rather that the day they BEGIN! Robert Bastow Steve Rayner wrote: > > Do you mean something like the battleship Royal Oak, sunk at Scapa Flow? > > Jack Erbes (jack@vom.com) wrote: > : James Wilkins wrote: > : > > : > ppierce wrote > : > > REMEMBER PEARL HARBOR (Also the Alamo)............. > : > > Paul in AJ AZ > : > > : > British possessions were also attacked by surprise. Do you make note of the > : > event? > > : I think not. For Americans, Pearl Harbor was a particularly memorable > : event out of many that occurred that day and the days that followed. > : And I think each nation honors its own history. > > : Do the British honor the victims of the events of that day also? Maybe > : they lack a good focal point, like the sunken battleship that is a tomb > : for more than 1500 sailors at the USS Arizona Memorial. > > : -- > : Jack in Sonoma, CA, USA (jack@vom.com) > > -- > > I'm a Canadian eh! Steve. > ************************************************************************** > The FAQ for rec.crafts.metalworking is at: http://w3.uwyo.edu/~metal > The metalworking drop box is at http://208.213.200.132 > ************************************************************************** > Visit my website at: > http://www.victoria.tc.ca/~ud233/homepage.htm > > ************* Tu ne cede malis, sed contra audentior ito. **************** > ******************************** - Virgil ******************************** > ******Yield thou not to adversity, but press on the more bravely.********** ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: WTB: Jet 13" threading dial indicator From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 08 Dec 1998 03:43:37 GMT -------- Kevin Pinkerton wrote: > > I am in the market for a threading dial indicator for a 13" x whatever > Jet lathe. My lathe is a 1986, but it uses the same indicator dial the > current model 13x40, 13x36 lathes use. It is the kind that pivots on > one bolt, with a 24 tooth gear in it. I have checked with Jet and can > buy it piecemeal from them, but the helical gear alone costs $167 and > I am hoping to find a used one somewhere for less. If all else fails...file a 16 tooth gear up from 1/16" or 1/8" sheet steel...it doesn't have to be a worm gear....it doesn't have to be thick and it doesn't need to be particularly accurate!! Robert Bastow > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: help! MAXIMAT SUPER 11 carriage problem From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 11 Dec 1998 02:54:19 GMT -------- It sounds as though one or both of your gears has excessive endplay. Skew gears generate a lot of axial thrust..almost as much as the radial thrust. Dig a little deeper into the box..find out what the end thrust arrangements are and rectify any end play. It will be jamming in the direction that moves the gear along its axis. This same symptom can occur with a wormwheel that is free to move axially. Let us know....I too have a Maximat Super II Thanks Robert Bastow > My faithful lathe has developed a quirky problem in the power feed gears > inside the apron. Simply put, the power feed rod going into the apron > will turn one way but binds in the opposite direction. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Guinness Records TV Program From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 11 Dec 1998 15:33:32 GMT -------- I can think of worse ways to go...But not off-hand!! Yech! Robert Bastow Jens wrote: > > Spehro Pefhany wrote: > > >http://www.deathtrap.com/looking/nasty/bandsaw1.jpg > >http://www.deathtrap.com/looking/nasty/bandsaw2.jpg > >http://www.deathtrap.com/looking/nasty/bandsaw3.jpg > > > >Not pretty. Apparently a family argument and some booze led up to this. > > It slices, it dices, it even juliennes (sp?) ...... ugh ... > > Jens ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Darwin award From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 11 Dec 1998 16:29:04 GMT -------- Pal o'mine ran the flat of his hand over a jointer. When it healed (long and nasty) he could plaster a wall with the palm of his hand!! Robert Bastow Mike Graham wrote: > > On Thu, 10 Dec 1998 17:50:34 -0800, dbrewste@ix.netcom.com (Dick > Brewster) wrote: > > >There is another way to look at the problem. A nasty noisy, > >obviously dangerous circular saw normally gets a fair amount of > >respect from its users. A smooth running bandsaw just sits there, > >nearly silently waiting to be feed human flesh. > > I read some stats regarding which woodworking machines people get > mangled on, and way near the bottom was a shaper. It's just such a > nasty, huge noisy thing, that apparently people just seem to have more > of a clue about sticking their sundry appendages near it's whirling > blades. > > Mike Graham > Caledon, Ontario Canada > > Mangler of metal. User of many grinding discs. > Cut with an axe, beat to fit, paint to match. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Darwin award From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 11 Dec 1998 16:33:00 GMT -------- Richard Weich wrote: The drill goes > through the board and into his private parts. OK! UNCLE! UNCLE! Enough already!! I like to sleep at nights!! (Please tell me it wasn't a 1" spade drill!) Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What's the best hand cleaner? From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 11 Dec 1998 16:44:58 GMT -------- If I am doing something particularly dirty in the shop...Like disassembling an old machine or machining cast iron...I always put on a double coat of "liquid glove". Rub it well under the fingernails and up to the elbows. Clean up with soap and hot water and a nail brush. I don't like solvent/abrasive cleaners on my delicate, machinists hands!! Robert "The Wuss" Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Please explain British fractions??? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 14 Dec 1998 20:24:24 GMT -------- These are (old) BRITISH wrenches..not European..They would be Metric sizes. The numbers refer to Whitworth (W) and British Standard Fine (BSF) The rule of thumb is that the Whitworth nut is one size larger than the corresponding BSF size and the size denoted corresponds to the BOLT size..not the a/f size of the nut. Eg. 1/4" W = 5/16" BSF = 0.442 (nominal) A/F This wrench will fit the nut on a 1/4"-20 Whitworth Bolt OR a 5/16"-22 tpi BSF Bolt. When Sir Joseph Whitworth calculated sizes for his standard screw thread system he was generous in the A/F dimensions to alow for the generally weaker materials then in common usage. When the later BSF system was developed, the smaller A/F sizes were standardised upon. Later still the BSF nut sizes wer standardised for bot thread series. You will only find the old, larger whitworth A/F nuts on older equipment. One, often missed, strong point about the W/BSF series is that (generally) the A/F dimension of a given nut is larger than the A/C dimension of the next size smaller. This means that if you pick up the wrong size wrench and try to use it in an out of sight location it will not "catch" on the corners of the smaller hex. This has prevented many a buggered nut, busted knuckle and deleteable expletive!!! US A/F sizes and (even more so) Metric size wrenches are a Royal pain in the A** for this reason. Robert Bastow PS if anyone has a set of W/BSF wrenches for sale...please contact me directly. tubal_cain@hotmail.com Mark To - CVLE/W96 wrote: > > Hi all, > > Would somebody please explain the fractional numbering system for > European wrenches. I just came across a really nice set of wrenches with > two sets of numbers on each end. The first fraction number is followed by > the letter W, the second fraction number is followed by the letters > BS. And both of these numbers do not correspond to fractional inches. > > Please help. > Oops, did I mention that I am also the new owner of said wrenches :) > Thanks > > mark to ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Please explain British fractions??? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 14 Dec 1998 20:28:40 GMT -------- Lee Marshall wrote: Ignorance can be fixed...Stupid is forever!! > > What you have run into is the Whitworth system. That is about all that I > know about it, other than if you turn the wrench upside down, the W > becomes an M, which can be said to correspond to "monkey wrench". It has > to do with the size of the bolt itself, not the size of the head. For > example, if you have a wrench marked 1/4, it would be used on a 1/4" > bolt, and I have no idea what size hex head that it would have. > > Lee ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Customs inspectors From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1998 04:10:02 GMT -------- Bob Primmer wrote: > > Ya know, a "newbie" here might have some trouble seeing how this relates > to metal.Please excuse me if I am out of line. > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > I am BJ1 You are excused ;^) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: WTB angle plate or two From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1998 04:31:26 GMT -------- MSC has them...good and cheap if you buy the workshop grade. Robert Bastow Grant Erwin wrote: > > I have a small shaper, a mill, and a surface plate, but no angle plates. > > I'm looking for something on the inexpensive side, to use for machining > operations (i.e. you can clamp to it). > > I'm in 98102 zip code. Please email. > > Grant Erwin > Seattle, Washington ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Darwin award From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1998 16:23:14 GMT -------- I watched an apprentice try to clear chips out of a 7/8" dia hole he had just tapped on the bar (capstan) lathe. It screwed his middle finger in to the hilt and, as he went down on his knees, and a split second before it twisted his finger off, the guy on the next machine wacked the clutch lever down to stop the spindle. Then, with a wicked look in his eye, and against the wimpered protests of the entrapped youth...he moved the lever slowly over to "reverse"...and let it go with a BANG!! The kid arched over the lathe bed, screaming...more in fright than pain...as his finger was slowly unscrewed from the hole. "Wassermatterwidya?" asked the old hand as the kid howled his protest. "yer wanna go to the Ambulance Room with a twenty foot bar on yer finger?" Sure enough, he had a perfect 7/8"-55deg.Whitworth form thread on his finger. No blood..didn't even break the skin..hellish sore for a couple of days though...and a lifetime lesson!! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Darwin award From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1998 16:30:37 GMT -------- David Berryhill wrote: > I was at a gun show talking to a vender who makes custom knives. On his > table were dozens of beautifully polished custom knives. While we were > talking, this gentleman walks up, picks up a knife and runs his thumb > lengthwise along the blade (I guess he wanted to see if it was sharp - it > was!). He stared in amazement as the line of blood on his thumb grew. At the recent Blade show in Atlanta I watched as a young guy picked up one of the many beautiful knives on display. "Careful!" said the maker. "It's got that special edge on it." "Oh yeah!" says the youth. "Whats that?" "The one that stops when it gets to the bone!!" Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Selling parts... From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1998 19:17:38 GMT -------- James Harvey wrote: > > Right here. > CHEAP!!! Robert Bastow > Jim Harvey > > Elliot Landes wrote in message <36763C5D.EE638ABD@mother.com>... > >Where's the best free place to post metalworking parts and tools for > >sale? > > > >Elliot > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Brass or Copper rings From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 15 Dec 1998 19:36:15 GMT -------- Tandy Leather have solid brass "D" and "O" Rings...possibly up to the size you need. How many do you need? Do they need to be brazed at the joint? Polished? Ther are quite a few people on this list who could make them for you..at the right price! Robert Bastow Alasdayr Kilgour wrote: > > Mel Owen wrote: > > > > I need brass or copper rings. 2" diameter made of 1/8th 0r 3/16th rods. Sure > > would appreciate a source. > > Mel, > > Any place near you deal in tack, like for horses? Any place that has the > makings for harness should have some brass ones. > > -- > Beannachd liebh-sa, > > Rick Schmidt > Oak and Iron Forge > aka > Duncan Alexander Malcolm MacDuibh Kilgour > Blacksmith > OOOO- #16, Man at Hand #006 > Guild of St. Wilde (Oregon Chapter) > Wizard #24 > Mad Scot- An Ah'v the claidhmor ti pruiv it! > CAPASPWMULD > > "Lead me not into temptation. I can find my own way, thankyouverymuch." > > > [~] > {(((((((((({*} > [_] > |~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~| > | | > | | http://www.peak.org/~ilona > \~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~/ > \ / > /``````````````\ > / \ > |~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~| > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Darwin award From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 18 Dec 1998 16:15:35 GMT -------- Peter Drumm wrote: this > afternoon(Thursday) the whole crew was laid off til Feb or later. I'll > be working Friday, Monday, and Tuesday cleaning up, putting equipment > away, etc, then it's the unemployment line. Been there..done that. Just remember your motto.... > Illegimiti Non Carborundum Don't let the Bastards grind you down! Good luck Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Anyone built the "BIG 50" Rifle Action by Gunmetal Designs? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 20 Dec 1998 01:12:10 GMT -------- To make a simple, one step,four segment "interrupted thread" is easy. However the "Welin Thread' used on artillery pieces is a whole different animal. Ther you have two, sometimes three or four different thread diameters over twelve to sixteen segments...It is a bear to make in smaller sizes. I know because I am tooling up to make one for a 1/8 scale madel of a WW1 9.2" Howitzer. A single stage thread would have little advantage over a conventional bolt head...which is in fact a form of single turn thread. Robert Bastow Gunner wrote: > > How difficult would it be to make something like the "artillary > thread" used in many field pieces? Basicly a large interupted thread > that matches a similar thread in the breach? > Gunner > > "Randy O'Brian" wrote: > > > > >Robert Bissett wrote in message <3677F66F.12D2@monmouth.com>... > >>Ole-Hjalmar Kristensen wrote: > >>> > >>> "Randy O'Brian" writes: > >>> > >>> > Yes, cutting the block mortise has been the problem unless one has a > >shaper > >>> > or something similar. The late Frank de Hass, a leader in single-shot > >>> > gunsmithing and action design used a round falling block mortise in one > >of > >>> > his designs so that it could be machined on a lathe or mill. He called > >it > >>> > the "FM Vault Lock Action". It seems it would work well with the > >50BMG. > >>> > > >>> > Randy > >>> > > >>> > >>> Yes, I've read his book about single shot action, but he cautions that > >>> it should not be used with magnum cartridges. I think the .50 should > >>> qualify as a magnum, but perhaps you could scale it up. On thing that > >>> puzzles me, is that he states that an action made with a square hole > >>> would be stronger. I would think that a round holde would put less > >>> strain on the metal, and thus be stronger. Anyone got a definitive > >>> answer on this? > >>> > >>> Ole-Hj. Kristensen > >> > >>The reason Frank de Haas cautioned against the round (cylindrical > >>really) > >> bolt for high power cartridges is that the round form would tend to > >>spread the > >>walls as a wedge would. Also most of the thrust then is back through the > >>middle of the receiver which is hollowed out for the firing mechanism. > >> > >> Bob > > > >I agree that the round block would tend to act as a wedge. Frank de Haas > >was a very conservative designer and all his writings were full of cautions > >about which cartridges were suitable for which actions. However, for the > >50BMG, one could certainly scale it up without penalty since extra weight > >would be an advantage. Also, I see no need to scale up the firing mechanism > >proportionally because the primers are just slightly bigger than normal > >ones. If one scales up to account for the bigger case head and knowing the > >max. operating pressure of the 50BMG(50,000psi?) then it doesn't seem to be > >very complicated to modify the design to allow plenty of safety margin. The > >final design may not be very pretty, but it would be easier for the HSM to > >fabricate. > > > >Randy > > > > --------------------------------------------------------- > > "A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an > invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write > a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort > the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, > solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program > a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die > gallantly. Specialization is for insects." Robert Heinlein ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Anyone built the "BIG 50" Rifle Action by Gunmetal Designs? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 20 Dec 1998 01:44:16 GMT -------- Kurt Laughlin wrote: > > >How difficult would it be to make something like the "artillery > >thread" used in many field pieces? Basically a large interrupted thread > >that matches a similar thread in the breech? > > I think it would be quite a chore - In fact, I've always wondered how they > do it! > > Good description Kurt. There is an excellent picture of a "Welin" screw breech at: http://www.hkkk.fi/~yrjola/war/kuivassa/gun/html In full size practice the male and female threads are SCREWCUT (not Milled) on specially adapted, relieving lathes with an interrupted indexing motion. This usually takes the form of a special, heavy duty, "geneva" type motion. Contemporary accounts speak of "great crashings and bangings and sudden shuddering stops" accompanied by a tool point that moves in and out, under cam control, to cut the various thread diameters. Size for size, the Welin Breech is far lighter, stronger and cheaper to manufacture than the monsterous sliding blocks favoured by the Germans. It is also more gas tight..using the "DeBange Pad"...and easier and cheaper to load...it uses silk bags of powder rather than huge brass cartridge cases. No wonder we won the war!! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: h.b.m. From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 20 Dec 1998 01:48:52 GMT -------- > : On 15 Dec 1998 19:53:06 GMT, "B&L Denard" wrote: > > : >Has any one out there have a 12 or 14" RED HEAD for sale? > : > Bill D. > A local dealer has a Ferrari RED HEAD (Testarossa) for sale. It has 12 cylinders but they are probably metric. ;^) Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Anyone built the "BIG 50" Rifle Action by Gunmetal Designs? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 20 Dec 1998 18:00:16 GMT -------- Sorry! that should read: http://www.hkkk.fi/~yrola/war/kuivasaa/gun/html Robert Bastow wrote: > > There is an excellent picture of a "Welin" screw breech at: > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Anyone built the "BIG 50" Rifle Action by Gunmetal Designs? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 20 Dec 1998 18:06:13 GMT -------- The Ross Straight Pull was a superb action, silky smooth, fast and accurate. Problem was it challenged Murphy's First Law and COULD be wrongly assembled! When that happened the bold blew back in the firer's face! Robert Bastow Robert Bissett wrote: > > Gunner wrote: > > > > How difficult would it be to make something like the "artillary > > thread" used in many field pieces? Basicly a large interupted thread > > that matches a similar thread in the breach? > > Gunner > > One of the models of the Canadian Ross straight-pull service rifle of > World War I used a thread-type bolt locking arrangement. > Maybe you could find a military museum or a collector and see what it > looks like. Maybe someone on this ng knows which book has it. I've > seen pictures of it but I can't remember which book. > > Bob ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Anyone built the "BIG 50" Rifle Action by Gunmetal Designs? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 20 Dec 1998 18:19:25 GMT -------- Gunner wrote: > > The reason I was asking, was to determin what type of breaching method > would be most cost effective for a home user whom decided to build a > single shot 50BMG. Cost effective for a HSM is a very subjective term. Without special equipment..the conventional rotating bolt would be easiest and amply strong without need for extremely tight tolerances. The square sliding block is very strong and more compact..but much more difficult to properly design and manufacture. The cocking and firing and extraction mechanisms become complex and fragile. The Martini (hinged falling block)is a very strong and compact action that might be worth consideration. The cocking etc. are simple and robust. The weakness there, is in lack of primary extraction. All in all..I would opt for the bolt action..I wouldn't want to get into the stress calculations and proving of an action using that monsterous BMG round. Especially as a factor with a falling block is not just strength, but fatigue stressing. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Cleaning Cast Iron surface plate (was Re: Surface Plate) From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 20 Dec 1998 18:36:19 GMT -------- DoN. Nichols wrote: > > Well, we've been discussing the pros and cons of waxing granite surface > plates, with what looks like a concensus for *not*. > > However, I've got a different question. I have a cast iron surface > plate (at least it feels like cast iron, with cavities and ribs in the > bottom.) I've had it for quite a while, and during a time of storage, some > rust started to form on the surface. (Interesting growth pattern, somewhat > like crystal growth.) > > Anyway, I used some Marvel Mystery Oil to help me remove the part > which was standing clear, and then slathered it with waylube to keep it from > forming more of that between uses. But -- there is still a stain pattern in > it, and I'm wondering whether: > > 1) it affects accuracy significantly? NO! > 2) there is a way to clean the rest off, without removing the metal > under it? NO! > 3) What is the *best* way to prevent rusting without building up layers > which have to be cleaned off with solvents prior to use? In a constant temperature, sealed in with dessicants. > > It is an 18"x18" one, and at the moment, it is residing under its > wooden cover, Worst place for it..even without moisture, the wood may contain substances that will stain or rust the plate. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Anyone built the "BIG 50" Rifle Action by Gunmetal Designs? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 21 Dec 1998 15:28:03 GMT -------- I will try one more time (now I am sober) ;^) http://www.hkkk.fi/~yrjola/war/kuivasaa/gun/html Robert Bastow wrote: > > Sorry! that should read: > > http://www.hkkk.fi/~yrola/war/kuivasaa/gun/html > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > > There is an excellent picture of a "Welin" screw breech at: > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: FS Odds and Ends From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1998 15:08:37 GMT -------- RATS!!! He has a 3/4" die head and dies for sale at 50 Bucks...I JUST paid $401 for mine on eBay!!!!! Good site..Have Bookmarked. Robert Bastow gordon abrahamson wrote: > > If anyone is interested in some odds & ends tooling see > http://www.angelfire.com/ok2/gordotool > Bookmark this site it is changing weekly. > Thanks Gordo ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How to remove chuck - WAS [Which drill press for $400.] From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1998 20:39:25 GMT -------- On many Jacobs chucks you can drill through the (soft) body...axially from the jaw side though into the JT side and tap this with a fine thread. Use a machine bolt to jack the chuck off its taper. Robert Bastow Bill Machrone wrote: > > You need a Jacobs wedge--a tapered, two-pronged fork that fits between > the top of the chuck body and the arbor. Larger chucks need two of > them--one from each side. With the single wedge, you just tap it with a > plastic hammer, and the chuck falls into your hand. With the pair of > wedges, you use a clamp to squeeze the two together; same result. > > Maybe you don't need to remove it at all. Does the chuck have a brand > name and model number? A machine dealer (or someone here) can probably > tell you what size key you need. Measure the diameter of the hole and > the distance from the center of the hole to the deepest part of the gear > ring, the valley between two of the teeth. Double this, and you'll have > the diameter of the gear. Chances are, with these two pieces of > information, you can get a key that fits. There aren't that many > different ones out there. > > - Bill > > Christo Slee wrote: > > > > Thanks for all the advice on the drill press. After using it again on the > > weekend, I have decided that I am going to recondition that one I have. I > > can get a replacement motor for about $100 and the chuck is OK, but I need a > > key. > > > > Now how do I remove the chuck so that I can take it to the shop and find the > > right key and failing that a new chuck. > > > > -- > > Christo Slee > > 4x4 (at) interpex(dot)com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: low flush=no flush From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 22 Dec 1998 20:46:01 GMT -------- Lee Marshall wrote: > It works like a charm!!!! I have a POWER FLUSH that you would not > believe. Truely amazing at what only 1-1/2 gallons of water will do when > you add a bit of gravity. > > Happy flushing to all of you over the holidays. > > Lee Hey Bubba...You wanna take a look at this one before I flush it?? Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: CORRECT circumstances to use WD-40 ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 24 Dec 1998 14:47:00 GMT -------- Glenn Ashmore wrote: > > Has anyone but me noticed that WD40 relieves arthritis pain in the fingers? Yes...it is a well known remedy. Said to be good for haemorrhoids too...But I never had the courage to try it!! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Machinery's handbook From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 24 Dec 1998 14:59:43 GMT -------- On the other hand, as new material is added...the "Good Old Stuff" is dropped. Older versions have lots of information on hand and machine processes that are now obsolescent in industry. I have a 21st edition but I am looking for a much older edition to supplement it. Similarly, I have a 14th Edition of "Encyclopaedia Britannica"; it is the same size as a "modern" edition..but, without all the space age stuff, it covers the "basics" in much more detail. I wouldn't swap it for a new one. Robert Bastow Spehro Pefhany wrote: people tend to keep the older books, however > if you buy an older one you will miss newer information on newer materials > and processes. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Machinery's handbook From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 24 Dec 1998 22:44:44 GMT -------- Try the "Can-Do Book Store" On King st IIRC (If it is still open) Robert Bastow > > alain labbe wrote in message ... > > >Hi, I have been looking for a machinery's handbook for a while in used book > > >stores. I'm in Canada in the Toronto area and could not find it anywhere ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Anyone built the "BIG 50" Rifle Action by Gunmetal Designs? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 27 Dec 1998 05:25:12 GMT -------- Not all of them...The Lee Enfield SMLE Mk III* was way ahead of the pack when it came to digesting mud etc., and for speed of action due to its short throw. Robert Bastow Rick Cook wrote: One of the > advantages of a bolt action is that it's _rugged_ > > --RC ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Little light of mine--loose ends From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 28 Dec 1998 17:54:41 GMT -------- Obviously you have reached that dangerous age for a man...When one fancies both mother and daughter...and probably couldn't handle either!! Robert Bastow Nigel Eaton wrote: A *very* decorative young blonde lady got on the > train and I sat admiring subtly (no dribbling) from a safe distance > (as I am wont to do). Then she said in a clearly audible voice to > her friend 'Yeah, my mum does that and she's 36'. Oh dear....... > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Changing Lathe Spindle Oil ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 28 Dec 1998 18:55:24 GMT -------- I popped a small but powerful magnet into the "sump area" of my Maximat Super II. It rests in an area where it can do no harm, is imprisoned by its own magnetism and is retrievable by a wire "leash". Every month or so I pull it out and clean off the metal crud attached to it. The last couple of times this was a miniscule amount. The (emco supplied) oil in the headstock now remains "gin clear" Robert Bastow Fitch R. Williams wrote: > > This isn't fair! I don't even have the original post yet and there > are two replies. I know, I know, the usenet .... yada yada ... and > David isn't all "that" far away from here, but it still isn't fair! > > Anyway, my import gear head has a drain plug under the removable cover > where the gears are changed for metric threading, etc. I've never > replaced the oil in it - so hopefully the manufacturers oil was the > right choice. > > Fitch > > "David Berryhill" wrote: > > >ohmwork@technologist.com wrote in message > ><3686fbb4.20106893@news.3web.net>... > >>After reading a post about the use of non-detergent oils being better > >>for non-filtered applications (less grit held in suspension..) i > >>wanted to change the oil behind those sight glasses on a Taiwanese > >>lathe. > >> > >>My problem lies in finding a drain hole/screw anywhere below the > >>bearings. Short of a tiny vacuum line, or turning the lathe upside > >>down, i can't think of a way to drain the oil...do i wait until the > >>seals get worse ? > >> > >>thanks for any insights you may have, > >> > >> > >>mike II > >> > >> > >Mike - you didn't say what make or model your lathe is. I have a Chinese > >gear-head 13 x 40 lathe. On mine, you remove the fiberglass gear/pulley > >cover on the left side of the headstock and there is an allen head drain > >screw on the side of the headstock. > > > >Dave Berryhill > > > > In So. Cal. > > The FAQ (Frequently Asked Questions) for rec.crafts.metalworking > is at http://w3.uwyo.edu/~metal. > > The companion web page for rec.crafts.metalworking is the > Metal Web News at http://www.mindspring.com/~wgray1/ > > The "Drop Box" for metalworking related pictures and binary files > is at http://www.metalworking.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What Santa brought me From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 28 Dec 1998 19:20:48 GMT -------- Bill Browne wrote: > > > So what did Santa bring you folks? > My wife let it be known among her folks that I wanted tools or "tool money" from Santa. Result? Two regular sized Leathermans, Two Gerbers and a "Micra" Some people got no Imagination!! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Darex Drill Dr. - does it work for you? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1998 16:49:46 GMT -------- Doesn't anyone know how to sharpen a drill by hand anymore? In the Large Engineering works, (1800 employees) where I "served my time", off-hand drill grinding was the norm. Only drills over 1" dia went back to the tooroom for machine grinding..and only then iat the end of a run or if badly chipped. I suggest a little practice...it is a knack that is easily mastered. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Tool and Cutter Grinding From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1998 16:52:55 GMT -------- > What ever happened to the good old days like when I went to school where a > machinist or even a drill press operator had to be able to sharpen his own > drills by hand? I've never used a drill sharpener or worked in a shop that had > one. > Engineman1 I agree...27 years in the trade and I wouldn't have a clue how to set up a drill grinder! Never used one...Never needed one! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What alloy was (is) used for metal type? (as in printer's type) From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1998 17:08:41 GMT -------- Type Metal is a lead/tin/antimony mix. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: ISO B'port M head From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1998 17:13:33 GMT -------- There is one on ebay right now. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Parting from the rear on a lathe From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1998 17:24:35 GMT -------- Fundamentally it is a question of geometry. Sketch it out and you will see that with a rear mounted tool any deflection in tool, slides, bearings or workpiece tends to lift the tool OUT of the cut. The front mounted tool tends to dive INTO the cut. Robert Bastow Paul-Ernest Lévesque wrote: > > Could someone tell me what are The virtues of parting-off from the rear of > the cross-slide , on a lathe > Paul ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Tool and Cutter Grinding From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1998 22:09:59 GMT -------- Sorry to disappoint you AJ..But my hand sharpened drills do NOT cut 0.015" oversize..Nor do they drill off location by 0.010". Nor do I guess do those on this list who have taken the time to learn their craft properly. Don't know what your experience is but it obviously ain't up to much!! AJ wrote: > > No one would need a drill sharpener to drill holes .015 to .025 oversize or > off location .010 to .020 ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Parting on a lathe From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 29 Dec 1998 22:33:00 GMT -------- It works better for ALL machines..new or old...regardless of condition and adjustment. Obviously the improvement is more marked on a well adjusted machine. If you are using a broad formtool on the best lathe in the world you will still get better performance with it rear mounted. Prof Chaddock (of Quorn fame) made his double ended ball handles with one plunge cut from a full width form tool mounted upside down in a Myford. In my old shop we machined locomotive driving wheel tires to full profile with a form tool held upside down and the lathe in reverse. However..the fundamental reason WHY it works lies in the geometry..the upside down or rear mounted tool tends to deflect or pivot OUT of the cut. The front mounted one deflects INTO the cut. Sketch it out and see. In operation it is very like a swan-necked tool on a shaper or planer..indeed parting tool holders with a swan-necked configuration are (or were) available from Armstrong and Williams. Robert Bastow > Is this practice only for older lathes where one is attempting to reverse the > torque pressures to the opposite dovetail surfaces or does this produce > superior results in new and old lathes alike? > > Just wondering, > > Don in Redondo ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: how to put a handle on a file From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1998 17:22:26 GMT -------- I use plastic wall plugs in the end of worn handles. Robert Bastow Tom Stovall wrote: > Just stick a wooden toothpick into the hole in the handle before you > drive the rasp/file on. The older the handle, the more toothpicks it > takes. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: For Sale: Large lot of tooling From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1998 17:42:03 GMT -------- Sad, sad, story! Just goes to prove...IT will drag you further than dynamite can blow you!! Robert Bastow Bob Edwards wrote: > > Found this over on r.c.blacksmithing and thought it would be of some > interest to the group. (I just don't care > > about this stuff anymore. Nothing's worth losing my sweetheart over. > > Nothing. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Query For The Brits From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1998 17:51:41 GMT -------- Ethyl alcohol adulterated with a foul tasting Methyl..something or other..that dyes the alcohol purple and is impossible to remove. Doesn't stop some people drinking it tho'! Robert Bastow Doug White wrote: > > A friend of mine was wondering what the US equivalent of 'methylated > spirits' might be. My best guess was Methyl Alcohol. > > Thanks! > > Doug White ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Narex Boring & Facing Head Experience? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1998 17:56:41 GMT -------- Excellent, state of the art piece of tackle...What do you need to know? Robert Bastow ncdogwood wrote: > > Anyone have any experience with a Narex boring and facing head? > > Thanks, > Mill ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: REALLY Dumb Question..... From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 31 Dec 1998 23:20:31 GMT -------- With the right boring tool you can get WAY below that size. I have a set of micro boring bars that can go down to 0.050" diameter. Shanck sizes are 3/8" so I use a sleeve in my 2" Criterion "clone" Robert Bastow Bill Machrone wrote: > You can't bore truly small holes with a boring head; that's not what > they're for--use a drill. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Sherline lathe help From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 01 Jan 1999 17:14:01 GMT -------- Hi Stoney, Happy New Year..and welcome to the best little group of miscreants, misfits, malcontents and recidevists this side of the solar system!! From your description and particularly the extreme length (32-36" BC) I would say you are heading for a whole heap of heart ache trying to do these on a lath OF ANY DESCRIPTION!! Without VERY elaborate support/back up/steadying the whip and deflection will drive you nuts. If these are straight dowels, it sounds like an arrow making job? Arrows are not turned on lathes but in dedicated dowel making machines..most of which work like a pencil sharpener..where the raw stock is rotated and pushed through a guide with a fixed blade or a spinning abrasive wheel. I make my own arrow shafts on a "centerless grinding" device I rigged up for my Burr-King 2" x 72" knife grinding machine. This regularly holds tolerances of less than 0.0005" on the diameter of maple and ash shafts. Perhaps if you tell the group a little (LOT!) more about what you are trying to achieve..in terms of dimensions, form, finish, tolerances and quantities we may be able to come up with a solution...if not..it will be a FIRST!! Robert Bastow Stoney wrote: > > I need to turn wooden dowels (rods) to (by woodworking standards) fairly > tight tolerances. Conventional wood lathes do not offer the > repeatability or basic automation (motorized lead screw) that this > process requires and the project does not warrant investing in evan a > used conventional engine lathe. I believe the Sherline lathe would be > more than adequate for my purposes if it were not for the between > centers limitation (allowing for tooling I need about 32"-36" between > centers). > > Sherline has said they will sell me the raw bed and lead screw stock and > then I am on my own if I want to have a longer bed. Fair enough. I > have gotten quotes ranging from about $150.00 to over $1700.00 to > grind/mill the bed to specs from local shops. It seems to be a straight > forward proposition for any shop having the equipment to handle a piece > approximately 48" long but when I show up with a sample piece of bed > stock or furnish them drawings of what I require I get so much back > pedaling I begin to doubt whether they could even sharpen a pencil. I > live in a fairly large metropolitan area (600,000) and shouldn't have to > go outside the area to get what I need but it is beginning to look that > way. > > Since I am a cabinetmaker, not a machinist, I am probably am missing > something here but I can't figure out what. Any suggestions or comments > would be greatly appreciated. BTW I am a 'newbie' here but have been > lurking for a short time in hopes of seeing something like this > discussed and searching Dejanews wasn't very helpfull. > > Regards, > Stoney ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: REALLY Dumb Question.....Question #2 (diam) From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 01 Jan 1999 17:34:05 GMT -------- Fitch, I couldn't have put it better myself!! Another way to get that "Last Half Gnats Whisker" is to give the boring bar a TEENSIE rub (on the top face..NOT the cutting dia.) with a very fine stone or diamond lap. Take another pass through and the (sharper) bit WILL take a fresh, but tiny bite out of the hole. A really high quality, (and Expensive) head..like a Darex..will allow you to dial in AND GET a 0.0001" increment on diameter. But they are beyond the pockets of most of us. Robert Bastow Fitch R. Williams wrote: > > "Martin H. Eastburn" wrote: > > >How does one set the diameter that the boring bar will cut out. > > I'm strictly a self taught user of this device and will be interested > in how the others do it. > > Meanwhile, back at the ranch, what I've been doing on the mill: > > 0. Locate the work piece under the spindle so that the centerline of > the hole will be where required with the required accuracy. How this > is done depends on whether the rough hole is to be cut on the mill or > was cut someplace else. If someplace else, I usually set up > positioning "stuff" in the form of stops, or pins, or whatever works > to locate the "mark" that shows where the hole is to be. I've been > known to use my edge finder on two blocks or stops and then dial to > the center of where the hole is to be so that when the piece is > placed, its quite accurately located - but this isn't always feasible. > > 1. Arrive at a rough hole size - usually by drilling but I've been > known to use a hole saw and once used a torch and grinder (to get rid > of the heat affected zone before boring to size - as close as I can > but being absolutely "certain" to be undersize by .040" or so at the > start of the boring operation. > > 2. I position the boring head so that the end of the boring bar is in > the hole, and then adjust it so it just makes contact with the hole. > > 3. Make passes adjusting the cut until the hole cleans up, then use > the telescoping gage and the mike that measured the part that has to > fit inside to get a measurement on the starting diameter. After that, > since the boring head is calibrated (sort of) its a matter of setting, > cutting, tracking your progress, getting a feel for exactly how much > is taken off by a setting of .0xx", etc. so you arrive at the final > size. > > I am sort of "retentive" about keeping notes on my progress boring > holes or machining diameters - I always have the calculator right > there and fill out my litle table during the course of which I always > make a prediction of what the size should be after the next cut, and > then measure the error after the cut. If you havn't done this, try it > - very instructive about the effect of doc, feed and rpm on the > performance of your lathe - and an objective indication of its > rigidity compared to another lathe - like between my SB and my 12 x 36 > import. The import is so much more rigid it isn't even a contest. > But I'm digressing here. > > A trick(s) I learned from a machinest friend. I was boring the > vertical hole for the feed nut in the "T" slotted cross slide casting > from MLA, and was about .0005" undersize. Ok, I know that seems > rediculous, but it "was" undersize cause the brass (?) part to be > inserted didn't would not go in there, but it "almost" did if you know > what I mean - since this was my very first hole boring experience with > my genuine $129.95 including shipping Criterion look alike boring head > with carbide tipped bars - and there was this casting I had invested > hours machining into perfection with dovetails and all sitting there > on the verge of ruin - so I was nervous. To top it off this was for > my Dad to use on his (now my) 9" SB, and I wanted it to be "perfect" > (OK, OK,OK, already - I confess - I want "almost" everything to be > perfect, but thats my excuse this time). > > Time to take a break! > > I knew from my experience and tracking tables that if I loosened the > clamp screw and adjusted I was going to be oversize and the casting > would be history and itwasgonnabejustawful - the tolerances on the > drawing are quite tight for this dimension and the other cross slide i > had for dimensional checks - a SB original normal cross slide because > Dad had the taper turning attachment on the lathe back in Michigan at > the time - was "right exactly on" the dimension. > > So I called him up and asked what to do - He asked what rpm I was > using and the hole size - 80 rpm, I forget the size. Then he made two > suggestions, one was to make another pass at about twice the rpm and > then measure it again. The second was to chuck up a brake cylinder > hone (the hole was in the right size range for this) and run it slow > for a very few seconds. > > The pass at higher rpm did make the hole about .0004 bigger, and a few > (maybe 5) seconds of honing with the brake cylinder hone finished the > hole exactly the right size close as I can measure. And then the part > "fit" in there "just right" - it stll does - I have that cross slide > ready to use on the lathe in the garage now. > > All in all, it isn't so different from what one does boring on the > lathe with the boring bar mounted on the cross slide - which was the > model for my approach on the mill with the boring head. > > Fitch"interested in better ways for achieving perfection"Williams > In So. Cal. > > The FAQ (Frequently Asked Questions) for rec.crafts.metalworking > is at http://w3.uwyo.edu/~metal. > > The companion web page for rec.crafts.metalworking is the > Metal Web News at http://www.mindspring.com/~wgray1/ > > The "Drop Box" for metalworking related pictures and binary files > is at http://www.metalworking.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Calling Tony Griffith From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 01 Jan 1999 18:14:27 GMT -------- Sorry to have to use the NG this way. Tony, if you are "listening"...I can't seem to get through to your web page. I am using www.lathes.co.uk. Email me off line direct. Thanks, Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lathe Dork's New In Box FS From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 02 Jan 1999 04:57:14 GMT -------- Kinda like a lathenut but more intense!! ;^) Lathenut wrote: > > What the heck is a lathe dork? Bill. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Precision Indexing From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 03 Jan 1999 01:41:49 GMT -------- One of the beauties of a worm and wheel indexing or dividing system is that it inherently produces results more accurate than itself. Any error on the index plate is divided by the gear ration of the head. This can be used to generate very accurate index plates. For example..I just finished building a dividing head based on a 5C spin indexer and a 40:1 worm and wheel from Boston gear. To produce the division plates I first made a "slave" plate to fit the dividing head. This was divided by whatever means available...Direct from the indexer's 36 hole plate available odd gears, or by careful manipulation of dividers and scriber. With the "slave" plate mounted on the crank end of the dividing head and the soon-to-be-master plate blank on the spindle end, I was able to generate rings of holes with 1/40th of the error of my slave plate. Henceforward, each time I use the master plate to produce a job, any error will again be reduced by a factor of 40:1 Let us suppose I was a massive 0.040" out in the position of one of my hand divided holes on the slave plate. This would produce a hole on my shiny new master plate that is 0.001" out of position..Which is closer than I can consistantly drill anyway. But this error will be reduced to 0.000025" on any job I make on that head!! Professor Chaddock, (Quorn) once remarked that one could produce accurate index plates with a school protractor and a large sheet of paper!! Robert Bastow wfhabicher@hotmail.com wrote: > > I'm interested in knowing how the great machine tool builderss achieved the > accuracy in their dividing heads (indexing heads) > > It seems to me that just setting up a commercial hobbing machine is not good > enough because all the gears in the various gear trains would have to be of > similar or greater accuracy. > > I seem to recall tha B & S advertised their index heads with a positional > accuracy of .001" at a 10" radius. > > Quite an achievement 40 or so years ago! > > I would appreciate hearing from people who made a career out of achieving > these results. > > Thank you very much for your efforts. > > Wolfgang F. Habicher, Cambridge, Ontario, Canada > > -----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==---------- > http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own wfhabicher@hotmail.com wrote: > > I'm interested in knowing how the great machine tool builderss achieved the > accuracy in their dividing heads (indexing heads) > > It seems to me that just setting up a commercial hobbing machine is not good > enough because all the gears in the various gear trains would have to be of > similar or greater accuracy. > > I seem to recall tha B & S advertised their index heads with a positional > accuracy of .001" at a 10" radius. > > Quite an achievement 40 or so years ago! > > I would appreciate hearing from people who made a career out of achieving > these results. > > Thank you very much for your efforts. > > Wolfgang F. Habicher, Cambridge, Ontario, Canada > > -----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==---------- > http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Introduction From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 03 Jan 1999 01:46:55 GMT -------- Terry Sumner wrote: > > Hello all, > Just like to intoduce myself. I find now though that I've forgotten > a lot of stuff now that Ihave the little lathe set up and running. > > I guess that's enough of that! Hope you all will take pity on me when > I come up with stupid questions. Hi Terry, Welcome to the group. We have a rule here...There are NO stupid questions! Unfortunately we can't always say the same about the ANSWERS!! Robert Bastow > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How do you age iron castings? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 04 Jan 1999 05:31:25 GMT -------- It is not the rain (or lack of it) that counts. It is the continuous cycling of temperature (day/night, summer/winter) that gradually releases stress in the castings. Nowadays most castings are stress relived with heat treatment and/or vibration. Works well but not as well as a couple of years outdoors. Robert Bastow Michael Schetterer wrote: > > That's about it, if you follow what General up in Canada does -- last I > heard their table saw and jointer castings literally sit in the rain for a > year or two. I wonder if the rain is a prerequisite, or can you age > castings in AZ, too? > > PLAlbrecht wrote in message > <19990103204825.21435.00007515@ng-fa1.aol.com>... > >What's involved in aging iron castings? Do you just let them sit out in the > >yard for a couple of years, or what? > > > >Pete Michael Schetterer wrote: > > That's about it, if you follow what General up in Canada does -- last I > heard their table saw and jointer castings literally sit in the rain for a > year or two. I wonder if the rain is a prerequisite, or can you age > castings in AZ, too? > > PLAlbrecht wrote in message > <19990103204825.21435.00007515@ng-fa1.aol.com>... > >What's involved in aging iron castings? Do you just let them sit out in the > >yard for a couple of years, or what? > > > >Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Making metal look old......? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 04 Jan 1999 05:33:15 GMT -------- Bury it in the dung heap!! (old antique fakers trick) Robert Bastow Don Foreman wrote: > > > Enigmaridl wrote: > > > > > > Does anyone know of a chemical solvent that can make metals such as > brass, > > > bronze, steel or aluminium look old and worn? Maybe even add a little > rust to > > > it? > > Road salt, AKA calcium chloride. Scrounge a little from the highway > department. Prestone "Driveway Heat" is also calcium chloride, available > at Wal-Mart (at least in Minnesota). > > We suspect that Detroit and Japan ship it to the highway department free.... ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: I'm a great Ironworker From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 04 Jan 1999 05:35:43 GMT -------- Ok Big Boy..You're on! What are you holding? Vito A. Longo wrote: > > I can blow you all out of the water ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Sherline headstock bearings oozing grease From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 04 Jan 1999 23:59:52 GMT -------- SCHMUCK!! Edward H. Currie wrote: > > On reflection, you are obviously right ... can't expect the non-technical to > understand something as complex as a leaking spindle. And it does explain > why they are reducing the dealer discount. > > Thanks for pointing that out. Don't know how I missed it ... > > Regards > > Felice Luftschein & Nicholas Carter wrote in message > <3690f97f.300989@news.casco.net>... > >On 3 Jan 1999 18:01:08 GMT, "Edward H. Currie" > > wrote: > >>Interesting ... a distributor unable to tell a user whether or not stuff > >>should be oozing out of the headstock ... > >I think this is a little unfair - Jim is a dealer, but he isn't a > >technical support person who knows exactly how each component of the > >machine is supposed to behave over time. When my customers have > >problems with Taig components (not often) I have them send them to the > >factory, not me, as I'm not the one who will test the component & > >support the warranty. > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: annealing cast steel From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 05 Jan 1999 00:02:28 GMT -------- Are you sure this is cast STEEL and not cast IRON ( as most ferrous trigger guards are) If so ..Not a lot you can do!! Robert Bastow doug white wrote: > > I need to anneal a cast steel triggerguard for a muzzloader I'm building > so I can bend it to shape. How do I do it, have already broken one. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Precision worm gear hobbing From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 05 Jan 1999 17:01:26 GMT -------- > I am just interested in knowing how the tool companies achieved those remarkable > indexing accuracies. Just like the rest of us....VERY carefully!! By which I mean that "Accuracy" doesn't just "happen"..It is the result of careful, methodical, attention to extreme detail. An "ANALists" delight! Lindsay has a reprint of "Modern Toolmaking" (of which I have an original) I recommend this as a primer on how to achieve extreme accuracy in dividing etc., working from basics. Here's how it was done in the "Old Days" Let us suppose you want a division plate with a prime number of divisions..Say 31. First make 31 "toolmakers buttons"...Say, 1/2" dia x 1/2" long, each with an axial hole of 1/4" dia. The buttons must be hardened, ground and lapped to as close to the same diameters as Human Endevour can make them. The ends must be lapped dead square with the axis and parallel to each other. Next, calculate the EXACT diameter of circle that will be contained by the 31 buttons when they are placed in a circle, in radial contact with each other, and in contact with the "master circle". Let us call this diameter "X" On a VERY accurate lathe, face up a circular blank of "X" + 1" diameter Turn a 1/4" spigot to PRECISELY "X" dimension and at the same setup, bore the center hole, accurately, to fit your dividing head, gear cutter, or whatever. Now, arrange the "buttons" around the master circle, drill and tap for 8-32 screws and fasten the buttons in place, arranged so that they are ALL touching the master diameter AND each other. You now have a VERY accurate Master Division Plate for 31 divisions...Repeat as required!! Robert Bastow Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: annealing cast steel From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 05 Jan 1999 17:07:58 GMT -------- In the Custom Knife Making world, W1 is referred to as "O.F.S."...Old File Steel!! Similarly, 5160 is known as "O.C.S."...Old Chevvy Spring!! Robert Bastow Steve Rayner wrote: > Yes! Never throw out an old file. My late father used to make very good > hunting knives, and scrapers from them. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: haedening? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 05 Jan 1999 17:10:25 GMT -------- Mark Kinsler wrote: > I guess they must make alloy-steel taps and dies either very carefully or > by grinding the threads. How on earth do they make small high-speed steel > threading dies, anyway? You'd need something like a teeny tiny internal > thread grinder... > > M Kinsler YUP!! That's why they ain't cheap!! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Drilling hardened steel From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 05 Jan 1999 17:27:45 GMT -------- If you just want a hole and don't mind the LOCAL annealing that WILL take place...Then use a carbide drill. Otherwise Abrasive Waterjet or submerged EDM. Robert Bastow Rev Chuck wrote: > > Looking for a quick and dirty method for drilling holes up to 1/4" > diameter through wood plane irons without annealing. Hardness will > range anywhere from Rc 58-65. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Precision worm gear hobbing From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 06 Jan 1999 03:54:12 GMT -------- > Robert, thank you for your input. > My question remains: How did the top notch machine tool builders do it??? > > Wolfgang. My answer remains Wolfgang...This (and similar methods) is PRECISELY how top notch machine tool makers did it and still do..if they have to generate accurate divisions from scratch. Obviously they don't need to do it often..having already filled their tool cribs with all the "Masters" they can conceive of. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Here it is, so what is it? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 06 Jan 1999 04:00:58 GMT -------- "It" is a dental technicians "Articulater"...used for making dental plates and precisely setting the "bite" This is a VERY precise example of the breed...most are much simpler (and less accurate) Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Drilling hardened steel From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 06 Jan 1999 04:08:52 GMT -------- James Harvey wrote: What, pray tell, is a "COLE" Drill. The only ones I am familiar with drill long holes into the seam for the placement of blasting charges ;^) Robert (Son of a Coal Miner and a Coal Miner's Daughter) Bastow > COLE DRILL > > Jim " I own one" Harvey > >Rev Chuck wrote: > >> > >> Looking for a quick and dirty method for drilling holes up to 1/4" > >> diameter through wood plane irons without annealing. Hardness will > >> range anywhere from Rc 58-65. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Aging cast iron = Old wife's tale? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 06 Jan 1999 04:20:40 GMT -------- You are dead right Kurt....this is gonna cost ya!! First of all..I didn't mentioned "Room Temperature" aging. The reason castings were aged out in the foundry yard was to subject them to temperature cycling. There are modern methods of heat treatment and/or vibration that substitute technology and cost for time. Back then, time was not an important factor. Robert Bastow Kurt Laughlin wrote: > > This is gonna cost me, but I gotta do it. . . > As I thought, "aging castings" is an Old Mechanic's Tale, just like > "crystallizing firing pins" by dry firing. > > KL ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Large Dia. Ball Bearings ( 9/16 x 7-3/16 " ID 8-1/2" OD ) For sale From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 06 Jan 1999 04:23:44 GMT -------- Make a helluva lazy susan for your TV ;^) Robert Bastow Goerge Von Torne wrote: > These bearings were made for Hamilton Standard Propeller Co. div. of > United Aircraft Corp. Part # 522122 ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Drilling Brass From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 06 Jan 1999 04:35:57 GMT -------- Paul-Ernest Lévesque wrote: > > Is there a trick for drilling brass, I find that the drill tend to grab in > the metal sudenly, do I have to change angle of the drill like we do for > lexan plastic. Yes, Brass drills best with zero rake (Straight flute) drills You can modify your standard twist drill by grinding the rake angle (the bit inside the flute) and making about 1/16" of it zero rake (parallel to the drill axis) That will stop all that nasty grabbing. If you have a lot of holes to drill..you can buy straight flute brass drills. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Hideous college food; was Parenting teenage girls/raising boys as if they girls. From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 06 Jan 1999 04:39:37 GMT -------- Fitch R. Williams wrote: >......the cheese from some of the packages - unwrapped of > course - So THAT'S where I've been going wrong!! Robert "Cheesy" Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Aging cast iron = Old wife's tale? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 06 Jan 1999 05:31:54 GMT -------- Sorry Kurt..but I think we have a case here of ten year's "book learnin" not being worth five minutes of experience!! Respectfully, Robert Bastow Kurt Laughlin wrote: > > >The reason castings were aged out in the foundry yard was to subject them > to > >temperature cycling. > > Well, unless the foundry yard got hot enough to heat the castings to up > 600F, it wouldn't do poo for stress relieving. The time-temperature curves > don't show any real change from room temperature until about 500F. > > >There are modern methods of heat treatment and/or vibration that substitute > >technology and cost for time. Back then, time was not an important factor. > > Or utility, apparently. Like the article said, for the most part, > stress-relieving cast iron, even at 1000F, doesn't do you much good. There > is some benefit for very complex designs with low stiffness, and for class > 40-60 irons. As the article also states, cylinder heads don't seem to be in > these categories (at least in 1961). > > I don't doubt this is what was done. I just think it was more of a pacifier > than a metallurgical method. > > KL ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Precision worm gear hobbing From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 06 Jan 1999 06:18:56 GMT -------- Fitch R. Williams wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > Robert, > > You have the dividing part done to a "T". He has a reasonably good > one too - not as good as the buttons but not bad either. > > I think he is looking for hobbing or cutting techniques that will > preserve the accuracy of the circle of tool makers buttons (or his > ball bearings) during the machining process. He's gashing the gear a > bit first, but then with the worm cutter letting it rotate which it > apparently doing non-uniformly. He thinks his major source of error > is in the machining process - the fact that the cutter rotates the > worm gear being cut less than accurately, or cuts each tooth slightly > unsymmetrically. > > The only way I could see to improve the machining was to force the > gear being cut to rotate by driving it with a gear. Several people > suggested the same thing. > > Are there some tricks in the machining that are being missed here? > > Fitch I think not Fitch. In "Professional Practice" the wheel blank would be positively driven by a very precise gear train...that could probably trace its ancestry back to a "Master Plate" of one kind or another. Wolfgang's method of having the hob drive the gashed blank does work quite well in practice..I have done it myself. However he mentions that once he reaches full depth any further running degrades the accuracy because the "Hob" starts to cut on one side or the other, and unevenly at that. I think that "Aye and there's the rub"!!..Actually the lack of it!! ;^) Firstly this form of cutting SHOULD NOT be attempted with a conventional hob!! That is, one with relief formed or ground on the teeth. This will only work with a non form relieved tool which CANNOT cut on its flanks. A tap or a screwcut worm, with simple gashed teeth, works best. Secondly, it is advised that, to even out prior inaccuracies in the gashing of the wheel blank, the hob be withdrawn and re-engaged a part of a turn round, several times during the hobbing process. I have produced several wormwheels that met all MY requirements..ranging from a 63 tooth wheel (For my Howitzer) that was produced from a blank gashed with a hacksaw!! and an 8-32 tap..to a 90 tooth wheel cut with a 1/2"-10 ACME hand tap. (For a rotary table) I would not however, rely on the above methods to produce a worm and wheel to National Physics Lab Standards...or even, with predictable consistancy, to meet the standards of a $40.00 set from Boston Gear. Do however, bear in mind, that when using, even "crudely" produced worms and wheels in a dividing application..that the error is divided and subdivided into "smidgins" that are beyond the measuring capabilities of most HSM's..me included! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Aging cast iron = Old wife's tale? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 06 Jan 1999 06:30:23 GMT -------- Edward Haas wrote: > > --FWIW I've heard that it was common practise to "age" castings by > placing them next to machinery that produced lots of vibrations, like punch > presses, etc. Did this actually make the ageing process less lengthy than just > having the castings sit around in an out-of-the-way place or is this another > myth?? No it is not a myth, one of the most effective stress relief methods used currently is by means of high frequency vibration. Back in my apprentice days, I recall the occasional "Rush Job" casting would be brought in from the yard "before its time" and subjected to an hour or so on the vibrating screen, used to shake out casings from the sand moulds. After rough machining it would be brought back for another hour "on the screens". Robert Bastow ======== To: FELIZXs Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: WTB Drafting equipment From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 06 Jan 1999 06:32:18 GMT -------- Lotsa that stuff on Ebay ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Removing Mill Scale From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 07 Jan 1999 01:27:09 GMT -------- Salt and vinegar! Robert Bastow AntiFog wrote: > > Correction: > > What are the best ways to remove mill scale from HOT rolled mild steel? > > Eric. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Drill sizes? - whazit From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 07 Jan 1999 01:31:34 GMT -------- Tell it to the Marines, Jim. Robert Bastow Jim Santee wrote: > I disagree. I have found calipers to be accurate to about .0002. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: The search for precision From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 07 Jan 1999 03:27:37 GMT -------- Hi Wolfgang, I have absolutely no problem with you taking issue on this or any other point. That's what this is all about. Two things spring to mind though: Firstly, that while I agree that in THEORY, the use of balls would be just as accurate as using rollers...there is a snag. With rollers you have line contact, with balls you have point contact. Consider the effect of two balls, resting on a common base and varying in diameter by say, 20 millions. Now you not only have two different diameters in contact but one dia is further from the base line than the other (by 10 millionths). The point of contact is no longer on the median diameter of the ring of balls in your indexing device. Secondly, I did mention that the buttons or rollers should be as "CLOSE IN DIAMETER AS HUMAN ENDEAVOUR CAN MAKE THEM" (Remember we are searching for EXTREME accuracy here) I am afraid that 20 millionths isn't in the right ball park for definitive, primary, reference work. HOWEVER, for HSM purposes, your ring of balls is an excellent choice..Personally, I would choose to use reference grade Roller bearings for the above reasons. Regards, Robert Bastow wfhabicher@hotmail.com wrote: > > However, I would take issue with your statement that the indexing accuracy > of, say 40 toolmaker's buttons assembled around a spigot, is greater, or > better, than 40 selected ball bearing balls arranged in a similar circle > (always assuming, of course, that the buttons or the balls touch each other. > I suppose it depends on the workmanship, and on the accuracy of the > toolmaker's buttons. The bearing balls, on the other hand, are selected to > be all of a diameter within 20 millionths of an inch of each other. ======== Newsgroups: rec.wordworking,rec.crafts.metalworking,trial.rec.metalworking Subject: Re: Please recommend a bench drill press From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 07 Jan 1999 06:17:08 GMT -------- Don't pay the extra tab for a Delta. Mine is the same Made-in-Taiwan-with-Chinese-motor-piece-of-sh*t that you can buy cheaper at Grizzly, Harbor Fright etc. Rattles like a "Can o' Mabs" (Marbles in Brit-Speak)..Will vibrate the drill vice clear off the table if left to its own devices, and has more slop in the spindle bearings than Monica has between her legs!! Robert Bastow Charlie Zito wrote: > > Does anyone have any info/opinions on Ryobi 10", 1/3 HP drill presses or > opinions as to how they compare with other makes, such as Delta, > Craftsman, etc.? A local dealer has one on sale. It has a very wide > range of speeds, runs almost 6 amps and seemswell made. I am chiefly > concerned with the 1/3 HP for drilling knifesteel. I would prefer a > 1/2HP. The ten inch Craftsman is 1/2 HP with a wide variety of RPM but > costs about $30.00 more. > Thanks. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Removing Mill Scale From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 07 Jan 1999 06:49:51 GMT -------- Serious as a heart attack. Ordinary household white vinegar + pinch of salt (optional) Soak overnight. (Outdoors or your shop will smell like Guiseley Crossroads!!) Robert Bastow AntiFog wrote: > > << Salt and vinegar! >> > > That's interesting. How much salt and how much vinegar? And how fast does it > work? And are you serious ;-)? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Hideous college food; was Parenting teenage girls/raising boys as if they girls. From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 07 Jan 1999 17:48:42 GMT -------- Not so Don! Goddamyankee is two words! ;^) The traditional first word of the southern redneck child is not "Dadda" but "Mutha****" Robert Bastow (In the deep South) Don Wilkins wrote: > On the other hand a lot of people in the deep South get to their late > 20's before they learn that damned Yankee is two words. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Drill sizes? - whazit From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 07 Jan 1999 20:53:55 GMT -------- There is a world of difference between measuring a KNOWN STANDARD DIMENSION with a caliper and by varying the pressure,angle or other fudgeable factors, to get the caliper to agree with what you believe it should be. If I were to give you a stack of gauge blocks..dimension unknown to you..and tell you your life depended on telling me the correct dimension within +/- 0.0001"...I think most people would pass on the opportunity!! Robert Bastow Randy O'Brian wrote: > > Me too, I just measured 3 different mike standards with my heavily used > Mitutoyo Digimatic caliper. > > 1" read 1.0000, 2" read 1.9995, 3" read 2.9995, all three are Starret > standards. I very rarely need anything better than this unless I'm fitting > ball bearings.....Randy > > Jack Erbes wrote in message <3694D634.D0D1AECA@vom.com>... > >Jim Santee wrote: > > > >> I disagree. I have found calipers to be accurate to about .0002. The > >> problem is getting the calipers at 90 degrees to the work. In that > > > >I would want a caliper that reads to .0001 to feel that I was able to > measure to > >within .0002. > > > >I have great confidence in my typical electronic caliper, when I measure a > high > >precision gage block calibrated to a thousandth and hold both items > carefully and > >apply the "right" pressure I get the right reading consistently. But the > program > >deteriorates if you have to measure, come off the material, and then read > it. > > > >Associated question, has anyone ever read what the logic is that is used to > turn > >the "5" in the tenths place on and off on these typical imported calipers? > Like > >at .0003 it comes on and at .0008 it goes off or something like that? > > > >-- > >Jack in Sonoma, CA, USA (jack@vom.com) > > > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Approx price of helical gears ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 07 Jan 1999 21:02:00 GMT -------- Maybe easier, especially with cast iron gears: Drill and tap a line of holes in the broken tooth's gap, screw in a line of threaded studs and file to shape. Use a template made by bashing a bit of lead into an unbroken section of the gear. Frequently used by Millwrights and usually lasts the life of the machine. Robert Bastow Mike Graham wrote: > Just lay down a couple beads of weld, then coat it with braze and > file to shape. Is there an easier way? > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Precision worm gear hobbing From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 08 Jan 1999 03:06:38 GMT -------- Jon Barnard wrote: > I have been following this thread, > I am also curious about whether this > type of worm gear would be suitable for a rotary table for a milling > machine. Of course I would use steel for the worm, and bronze for the gear. > > Anybody tried this? > > Thanks, If you have indeed been "following this thread" you will recall that I specifically mentioned that I had "free" hobbed a 90t wheel for a rotary milling table. Robert Bastow > Jon ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Opinions reguested From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 08 Jan 1999 05:27:18 GMT -------- Jens wrote: > > Question: the contra ground HSS toll bit only took off about 1 thou or > less of the surface - would a cutting load this small result in a > workpiece spring of almost 1/2 thou at 4" on a 1.25" thick solid steel > bar ? > Short answer Jens, is yes it will. Not all of this will be actual "bending" of your test piece..Some will be the bending of your spindle between the bearings, some will be due to the oil film thickness in bearings and slides etc etc. Try this test: Start your cutter (BTW the "contrary" ground cutter applies a lot more force than a regular knife tool) after 1/4" or so, stop the spindle without removing the tool from cut. Now set up a "tenth" reading TDI and zero it on the reverse side of test piece. Retract the tool and watch the needle!!! Press against the test bar with your pinkie...Watch the needle!! NOTHING is totally rigid. > Related questions: How the heck does one produce something like a 10 > or 12" bar that has a dimensional tolerance of 0.0001" ? I didn't want > to use the tailstock as that introduces more chances of a screw-up but > is that the best way of insuring dimensional stability ? Yes. I would never turn even a three inch protrusion without tail stock or steady support. > Should I worry about correcting things or should I leave good-enough > alone ? If the lathe will turn a 1.5" FREE length, up close to the chuck or collet with less than 0.0005" taper TOWARDS the head then I wouldn't worry about it. If the taper is WIDER at the head end...adjust your slides..not the bed. Otherwise you will find your tool point "dragging" as you retract from a bored hole. Try snugging up the carriage clamp EVER SO LIGHTLY when taking the cut. If, after adjusting your tailstock to give EQUAL diameters at both ends of a large diameter, twelve inch bar, you find less that 0.001" of "barrel" in the middle...You are doing fine. If however the test piece is "swamped"..That is it is smaller in the middle than at the ends..you might want to "tweak" the cross leveling at the Tail stock end to see if you can improve it a bit. All the above criteria fall well within the results to be expected in a well adjusted lathe that is anything less than a spanking new "Toolroom" lathe. More importantly the errors are in the "Right" direction..leaving a small amount of metal on O/Ds or I/Ds that can be corrected with a file, emory cloth, lapping or grinding..depending on the results you seek. Designers of good machine tools recognise that wear is inevitable, but try to make the resultant errors lean in the right direction. This is one major advantage that Vee ways have over Flat ways Regards, Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Definition of Lathe "Swing"? From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 08 Jan 1999 07:55:01 GMT -------- It all depends...On whether it is an English or an American lathe!! In the UK the convention is to quote the center HEIGHT..therefore a 6" lathe will swing 12" over the bed. In the USA the "swing" is understood to be the TOTAL diameter...Therefore a 6" lathe will swing a workpiece of 6" diameter over the bed. Confusin' ain't it? Robert Bastow John A. Landry wrote: > > This should be a simple question for most of you... > > I'm confused. Does a lathe "swing" specification mean the maximum *diameter* > or *radius* of a workpiece that can be turned? For example, if a lathe > manufacturer says their machine has a 12" swing above the bed, does that mean > a 12" diameter workpiece will fit in, or does that mean a 24" diameter > workpiece will fit? > > Thanks, > > John L. > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- > jlandry AT halcyon DOT com | For such a promiscuous conglomeration > Conservative Libertarian | of numbskulls as generally constitutes > Life Member of the NRA | an army a six pound pull is well > WA Arms Collectors | enough. With an easy pull soldiers > Commercial Helicopter - Inst. | would decimate their own ranks more > http://www.halcyon.com/jlandry/ | than those of the enemy. T. S. Van Dyke ======== To: Chris Topp Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Tudor Cannons Forging Techniques From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 08 Jan 1999 18:00:04 GMT -------- Hi Chris, You are to be commended for such an undertaking..Quite a task!! So far as the swivel gun is concerned there is only one possible method that comes to mind that would not involve forge welding..either logitudinally or spiral welding' This is to forge from a solid billet in the way that much later (and modern) gunmakers did it. The billet is heated and pierced part way through to form a fat "cup". It is then forged out to length over a bore size mandrel, the outside diameter getting progressively smaller the bore remaining constant and the length growing as forging progresses. In modern practice the proces is called "Drawn over Mandrel" and is used for both pressure vessels and tubing. First a cubic billet (actually the cross section is called "Gothic") is sawn to length, heated to forging temperature and subjected to a piercing/back extrusion operation, that first produces a thick walled cup. This cup is then placed on a long mandrel of the required bore diameter and pushed , horizontally, (on a "Push Bench" no less) through a series of ring or roller dies, that reduce the O/D and elongate the length. This all takes place in ONE heat in about ONE minute!! Interestingly a similar technique is used to make toothpaste tubes!! You might want to contact TI CHESTERFIELD...(if they are still in business)in Chesterfield, Derbyshire. They are the gas cylinder manufacturing arm of Tube Investments (Head Office in Birmingham) They may be able to show you how it is done...they may even be able to do the rough forging and drawing for you! 8^) Robert Bastow (Ex Export Sales Manager..TI Chesterfield) ;^) PS Where in N Yorks are you? I am from the Huddersfield area..now in Atlanta GA Chris Topp wrote: > > We are a company of traditional blacksmiths in England who through our > sister company 'The Real Wrought Iron Co.',are, as far as we know the only > world supplier of real wrought iron. > > We recently constructed a replica wrought iron cannon for the Mary Rose > Trust and the Royal Armouries using metal staves, hoops and bands which was > for the purposes of both firing to ascertain the effectiveness of tudor > weaponary and for display puposes at the Artillery section of the Royal > Armoury at Fort Nelson nr Portsmouth in England. > > We have now been asked to construct a replica of a ship borne swivel gun, > again from the Mary Rose. The gun is a breach loader, some 6ft long with a > 2" bore and will be made from Charcoal Iron. The original however does not > appear from either visual examination or XRay to have any welds in the > barrel. > > Does anyone have any information on how this may have been constructed as we > do not believe they had the ability to bore this size of material. We wish > as far as is possible to use the manufacturing techniques of the period. > > Thanks > > Steve Suff > > Office Manager > > -**** Posted from remarQ, Discussions Start Here(tm) ****- > http://www.remarq.com/ - Host to the the World's Discussions & Usenet ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: HELP making bearings? From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 08 Jan 1999 18:11:39 GMT -------- I made a sliding cross cutting table for my table saw using 2" diameter tubing (a galvanised clothes post!!) for the rail. The rollers came from an up-and-over garage door. Each element had two rollers set at 90 degrees to each other (in a kind of VEE formation) You might want to obtain a copy of "Fine Woodworking on Making and Modifying Machines" Published by: The Taunton Press Inc. 65 South Main Street Box 355 Newtown Ct 06470 This contains several different articles on sliding tables. Robert Bastow onecritter1@webtv.net wrote: > > I am making a sliding woodworking jig that needs to slide back and forth > about 4 feet. In looking at the price of linear bearings and shafting. > I need a cheaper substitute. Could I make the bearings using a collar > that is bored a little larger than the shaft, turn a groove of the > proper depth. and pack with steel ball bearings. I would guess this > groove would have to be polished somehow. I'm thinking about using 1" > hot rolled for the shafting. In the end I want to slide a router along > this tool, need 4 feet of travel. > > I have a lathe, ambition, lack an engineering degree. Any help would be > appreciated. > Tom Albers > Lacey WA ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Drill sizes? - whazit From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 08 Jan 1999 18:15:55 GMT -------- Randy O'Brian wrote: > > I think you would, too, Robert. No Question!!! I would feel REAL nervous about doing it in a temperature controlled Metrology Lab with a Bench Micrometer!! Robert Bastow > > Randy > > Robert Bastow wrote in message <36952063.ECC7C065@hotmail.com>... > >There is a world of difference between measuring a KNOWN STANDARD DIMENSION > with > >a caliper and by varying the pressure,angle or other fudgeable factors, to > get > >the caliper to agree with what you believe it should be. > > > >If I were to give you a stack of gauge blocks..dimension unknown to > you..and > >tell you your life depended on telling me the correct dimension within +/- > >0.0001"...I think most people would pass on the opportunity!! > > > >Robert Bastow > > > > > >Randy O'Brian wrote: > >> > >> Me too, I just measured 3 different mike standards with my heavily used > >> Mitutoyo Digimatic caliper. > >> > >> 1" read 1.0000, 2" read 1.9995, 3" read 2.9995, all three are Starret > >> standards. I very rarely need anything better than this unless I'm > fitting > >> ball bearings.....Randy > >> > >> Jack Erbes wrote in message <3694D634.D0D1AECA@vom.com>... > >> >Jim Santee wrote: > >> > > >> >> I disagree. I have found calipers to be accurate to about .0002. The > >> >> problem is getting the calipers at 90 degrees to the work. In that > >> > > >> >I would want a caliper that reads to .0001 to feel that I was able to > >> measure to > >> >within .0002. > >> > > >> >I have great confidence in my typical electronic caliper, when I measure > a > >> high > >> >precision gage block calibrated to a thousandth and hold both items > >> carefully and > >> >apply the "right" pressure I get the right reading consistently. But > the > >> program > >> >deteriorates if you have to measure, come off the material, and then > read > >> it. > >> > > >> >Associated question, has anyone ever read what the logic is that is used > to > >> turn > >> >the "5" in the tenths place on and off on these typical imported > calipers? > >> Like > >> >at .0003 it comes on and at .0008 it goes off or something like that? > >> > > >> >-- > >> >Jack in Sonoma, CA, USA (jack@vom.com) > >> > > >> > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: newbie question: what finish to expect turning 6061 aluminum? From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 08 Jan 1999 19:03:19 GMT -------- It depends what you mean by "SHARP"! The tool should be honed to a razor edge but not to a "sharp" point. Try honing a small flat or radius on the "point" of the tool. Run fast..Feed slow, and use WD40 as a lubricant. This should give you a mirror finish. Robert bastow Daniel A. Segel wrote: > > What kind of finish should I expect when turning a piece of 6061 aluminum > with a sharp HSS tool bit? All the descriptions I see say "smooth", but I'm > getting little lines that are almost (but not quite) big enough to catch > a fingernail on. > > Is this normal? Is it the result of improper speed/feed? How smooth a > finish can I reasonably expect? I haven't had much time to experiment > yet, but I will this weekend. > > Thanks, > > Daniel > -- > Daniel A. Segel > daniels@netcom.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: PG & E bomber From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 08 Jan 1999 19:09:01 GMT -------- No, but at three years of age, they might have done if the thought HAD occured to them!! Robert Bastow Ed Rinehart wrote: They never thought to poke a sparkler in someones > eye. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Cutting Fluid - What to use for Home Shop? From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 08 Jan 1999 21:20:03 GMT -------- Nasty stuff to get around your nuts..One of the occupational hazards of old machinists working around this stuff was (is) cancer of the testicles!! The fumes can be quite nasty..I use it quite a bit but have set up a fume extraction system and wear a mask...Otherwise I wake up coughing!! Finally, the oil when heated can produce sulphuric acid that will stain the bright parts on your machinery a nasty brown color (found that out on a newly reground bed!!) It also stains brass and copper badly too? Robert Bastow Jon Elson wrote: > > Danny Hopping wrote: > > > I have a Sherline mill and need to cut metal but I know nothing about > > cutting fluids. Joe Martin, in his 'Tabletop Machining' book says NOT > > to use thread cutting oil. He says it has a high sulfur content and to > > avoid it 'like the plague'. > > Why? What problem, exactly, does it cause? I've been using this > stuffexclusively on the lathe, and quite often on the mill. I am not aware > of > any problem in particular. > > Jon ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: The search for precision From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 09 Jan 1999 03:19:20 GMT -------- > What do you think of the work spindle (which holds the gear blank) driven by a > stepper motor (or servo) with signal from a pacer encoder on the hob (cutter) > spindle? > > Between the pacer encoder and the stepper, or servo, motor would be a > computer and motor driver arranged as an electronic gear box. Just punch in > whatever gear ratio you need. What do you think, is such an animal > available? Or could one be built inexpensively from surplus equipment? > Computers I have, same with spindles. Encoders and drivers are strange > beasts to me. > > Regards, Wolfgang > Strange beasts to me too Wolfgang, I don't trust anything I can't see and only half of what I can see. I am sure that, on a production basis, all this fancy, dancy "Electromasonics" stuff works fine...and I'm sure the "True Believers" will, very shortly, explain why it is better than sliced bread. HOWEVER!!!! When it comes to fundamental generation of stuff from first principles I will stick with the good 'ole Mechanical Methods. (When they chime up....ask them how their leadscrews and encoders got calibrated in the first place???) Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: PG & E bomber From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 09 Jan 1999 03:25:24 GMT -------- Wise Council Don! Wise, wise council! There is no black...no white...just shades of grey. Robert Bastow Don Wilkins wrote: > > On 8 Jan 1999 06:01:52 GMT, "Don Foreman" > wrote: > > > > > > >Don Wilkins wrote in article > ><36ae07dc.9441386@news.wcta.net>... > > > >> Anyone who has seen a two or three year old running around with a > >> sparkler should have seen enough to "not like fireworks" in the hands > >> of the innocent. If it was your child who lost the eye it might have > >> reinforced that opinion. > >> > >What the hell are the parents of the three-year-old doing while he/she is > >running around with a sparkler? > > Standing around watching with their finger up their..... Not an > unusual behavior for some parents. Their kids were out there running > rotary mowers and three wheelers. > > > >Better drain the lake -- the un-parented child may not be able to swim. > > I suspect that we would probably agree on this topic but their is not > enough metal content here. > > I would like to address your comment concerning draining the lake. > Before retirement I put a very large pond on the property I owned. My > kids were under five and my immediate goal was to get them comfortable > in deep water. I was delighted when the youngest passed his mile swim > merit badge at age seven. He was an excellent swimmer at five. > > A good many years later I sold the farm and moved. I returned for the > first time this year in twelve years and the couple was kind enough to > let me wander over the property and reminisce. It was disappointing. > The barn which I had gutted out and put in a basketball court with > lights was filled with junk. The pond was a disaster. > > I asked her about the pond and she said "we don't want the kids to > know it is there". I said nothing but guess whose kids may find the > pond before they know how to swim. > > I know there is all sorts of legislation to protect the stupid. I have > mixed feelings about some of these. Minnesota is a no helmet law state > for motorcycles. I think that this is a good thing because the ones > who don't wear helmets are usually young. They are in good health and > make excellent organ donors so there is a potential positive outcome. > This comes from a rider who was in a head on collision and survived. > > On the other hand it is illegal in Minnesota to place a junk > refrigerator with a positive latch out unless you remove the door. In > fact refrigerators are required to have doors which do not have a > positive latch. God only knows how many kids lives have been saved > because of this legislation. > > You might very well have a different opinion on the helmet law than > you do on the refrigerator doors but both are intrusive. Would you > approve getting the legislation off your back by approving of positive > latches on refrigerator doors? Would you have a problem if your > neighbor had a few of these out behind the garage? > > The dilemma is just how do you decide when someone's ox is being gored > or that someone has had their rights infringed. > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Opinions reguested From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 09 Jan 1999 03:31:30 GMT -------- Hey Buddy...Yer wanna swap lathes??? Robert Bastow Jens wrote: > Robert Bastow wrote: > > >If the lathe will turn a 1.5" FREE length, up close to the chuck or collet with > >less than 0.0005" taper TOWARDS the head then I wouldn't worry about it. > Great, in that case, since I did 3.5" at half a thou taper I am in > great shape. > > Jens ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Titanium gloat from Boeing surplus in Seattle From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 09 Jan 1999 03:40:43 GMT -------- Drop 'em on your foot...the Titanium hurts about mid way between Al and SS!! With apologies for the obvious. Robert Bastow > Does anyone know a quick field test to distinguish Ti alloys from Al and/or > SS? > Mike > Seattle ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Aging cast iron : time to move on From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 09 Jan 1999 03:44:28 GMT -------- I'm willing to bet money on it Kurt..Are you?? Robert Bastow Kurt Laughlin wrote: But we can do the > following: 1) Make casting; 2) Set-up and rough machine; 3) Break set-up, > set the part up (re-indicate, etc) again; 4) finish machine. > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Bridgeport REbuild From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 09 Jan 1999 03:47:42 GMT -------- FOB means...Free On Board...YOUR Transportation...At THEIR loading dock. No matter WHERE that is. Robert (The Pedantic) Bastow ppierce wrote: > > tinkertool wrote: > > > > Here is link to pic of the Bridgport series2 that I just finished > > putting together sale price is 3500.00 F.O.B. > > Like F.O.B. where??? > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Aging cast iron : time to move on From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 09 Jan 1999 05:45:11 GMT -------- You're right Kurt, it is time to move on. I don't mean to belittle your belief in experimental data. BUT!! I am the one who roughed out a lathe bed on a 42' planer and came back after the weekend to find 3/8" of movement had taken place...Damned thing "Twanged" when I loosened the clamp bolts!! Same bed came back after 3 weeks of ambient temp. aging, and I finish planed it "dead on" Three months later the finished machine passed final inspection..no further movement in bed. From PERSONAL experience I can assure you that castings move for months after casting...and again after rough machining. I can also assure you that nothing but "aging" is required to rectify that. Respectfully Robert (well aged) Bastow Kurt Laughlin wrote: > > Yeah, but the same person would have to do the machining, on the same tools, > from the same casting (grey iron), and the part would be of sufficient > complexity as to make distortion control important. Also, for statistical > significance, at least 20 pieces of each method would need to be done (no > joke - I laugh when cartridges are judged on the basis of 5 rounds). Also, > the machinist can't be you. If you're willing to put up the front money, > I'll bet ya $20!! > 8-p > > If you mean to bet on whether or not you can machine a part better than I, > then nope. You are a machinist, I'm an engineer. You have real machine > tools, I have a 7x10 lathe with a mis-aligned tailstock and a Mill-Drill. > Obviously you can machine a part better than I can. But that doesn't mean > that every method, practice, or superstition from 1948 actually added value > to the parts that where made. Nor does it mean that every coolant, > abrasive, or control scheme from 1998 improves the situation. But, given > the choice of legend or the scientific method, I'll go with the repeatable, > controlled, experiment. The alternative, in life more so than machining, is > unthinkable. > > KL ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Bridgeport REbuild From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 09 Jan 1999 16:22:57 GMT -------- International convention is FREE ON BOARD and has very specific definitions. It covers packaging insurance and transportation to FOB point. If it is FOB a ship the insurance covers the shipment to the point it "Crosses the ship's rail" "Fob your transportation" means that the shipper is responsible for packaging and insurance plus lifting etc to place it safely on your truck at his loading dock. You should pre-arrange YOUR insurance to cover the shipment from that point. Cif means all fob costs, PLUS...Carriage, Insurance and Freight to the destination. It does not include offloading, again the insurance stops at the ship's rail. Robert Bastow Maguire wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > FOB means...Free On Board...YOUR Transportation...At THEIR loading dock. > > > > No matter WHERE that is. > > > > Robert (The Pedantic) Bastow > > > > ppierce wrote: > (snip) > > > Like F.O.B. where??? > > > > > I was of the opinion that F.O.B. meant "Freight on Board", same > definition as above. > > Matt Maguire ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Opinions reguested From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 09 Jan 1999 19:39:34 GMT -------- Inaccurate tailstocks are one of the EASIEST parts of a lathe to adjust or rectify. Robert Bastow Kurt Bjorn wrote: > The problem with using the tailstock is that if it is not *perfect* (and few > are) it will induce taper. > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: iron box advice From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 09 Jan 1999 19:44:56 GMT -------- Blacksmiths achieve this finish by heating the part to 4-500 degrees and rubing it with tallow, beeswax or boiled linseed oil. This will produce that blackish, "irony" look and will be durable for indoors use. Robert Bastow TopSpin wrote: > > I've seen a blackish, irony finish on some iron items some time ago and > would quite like a finish similar to this. > > I've no idea how to achieve this or what to use. > > Has anyone got any advice, please? > > thanks, > > Simon ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Auction madness From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1999 01:25:35 GMT -------- Perhaps it was signed by the Author...Blue thumbprint!! Robert Bastow Pat Dworzan wrote: > > News flash! In case you're wondering if your old, dog-eared copy of > Machine Tool Reconditioning is still worth what you originally paid for > it, you'll be happy to know that one just sold for $193.50 plus $8.50 > s/h on the eBay auction website. A brand new one cost only $92.50, plus > $6.00 s/h. I wonder how much I can get for my NIB copy? I think I gave > $73.25 for it six or seven years ago and still have the original > shipping carton to go with it. Do I hear $250.00? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Looking for LATHE MILL DrILl From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1999 01:26:33 GMT -------- They are ALL lower end Hans! ;^) Hans Vogel wrote: > > I need a lower end 3 in one Lathe mill drill. Any recommendations? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Opinions reguested From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1999 01:29:59 GMT -------- Vertically!! Ted Edwards wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > Inaccurate tailstocks are one of the EASIEST parts of a lathe to adjust or > > rectify. > > Horizontally, yes. Vertically??? > > Ted ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Best steel for making a boring bar? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1999 02:57:29 GMT -------- Hi Kevin, By "Best" steel I take it that you are looking for the most rigidity..thus least vibration. ALL steels have the same modulus of rigidity..doesn't matter what the alloying or heat treatment!! Thus, a piece of dead mild steel, old rebar or heat treated tool steel will ale give the same performance in a boring bar. To gain rigidity you have to go to a "stiffer" material. Generally the choice is Tungsten carbide, used in the solid or as a core. However, for the length/diameter ratio you are talking about here...forget boring! you will need to use some kind of drill and reamer combination to prevent chatter. Sorry, Robert Bastow Kevin C. Archibald wrote: > > Hello, > > I am going to make a LONG boring bar, and I'm looking for the best > suited steel for it's construction. The hole I'm going to be boring > will be 1-1/4" diameter, and 10-1/2" deep. Any suggestions? > > Thanks, > _kevin ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Bridgeport REbuild From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1999 18:29:04 GMT -------- Spehro Pefhany wrote: > > > > Sometimes items are specified as (forget the acronym, but..) just moved to > alongside the conveyance, so if there are longshoremen or whatever to be > paid (off) it is your cost. > Hi Spehro, The term you are looking for is "FAS"...Free Along Side. You are dead right about the "WHERE". All these are clearly defined terms under INTERNATIONAL LAW and, among other things, stipulate the point at which the contract is fullfilled, payment is due, responsibility and liability ends or starts and ownership passes. FOB "X" means FREE on board at X and, under International Convention implies that delivery to the customers hands and responsibility takes place at the suppliers "end". If the contract calls for delivery to the customer at his home port or loading dock etc., the correct term becomes CIF...Costs, Insurance and Freight. "FOB your dock" is incorrect (but common) usage here in the USA where "exporting" means the next county to most people!! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Bridgeport REbuild From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1999 18:31:15 GMT -------- Charlie..see my response to Spehro. Robert Charles Gallo wrote: > > Robert, > Being pedantic, actually it depends - if it's F.O.B. THEIR > dock, your right, if it's F.O.B. Mars, it's F.O.B. Mars and they are > responsible for getting it there - F.O.B Your dock, means that they > will transport to you, at their responsibility and cost. F.O.B Your > Dock, bill customer - They are responsible for the shipment (If it > breaks, they still own it), but they will bill you back for the cost > of the shipping. > > Like the man said - F.O.B. WHERE - and even if it is their dock, > where is that dock? > > Charlie > > On Sat, 09 Jan 1999 03:47:42 GMT, Robert Bastow > wrote: > > >FOB means...Free On Board...YOUR Transportation...At THEIR loading dock. > > > >No matter WHERE that is. > > > >Robert (The Pedantic) Bastow > > > >ppierce wrote: > >> ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: stress relieving castiings and other metals From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1999 18:42:06 GMT -------- Hi David, Please go to your nearest library and look up the aims, definitions and processes of: Annealing Normalising Stress Relieving Hardening Tempering Then re-read that what you just writ!! David P. Anderson wrote: > > Hi, > > All metals, regardless of hardness, or material have stresses built up in > them, and most stress "relieving" techniques are designed to allow the > material structure to become plastic enough so that the stresses equalize, and > balance each other out. > > Annealing is the process of making a ferrous material the softest it can > be, allowing it to deform in small areas, and have a uniform structure. If you > annealed a hardened piece, it would no longer be hard. What you want to do, > and what you described, is tempering. Tempering softens, and stress relieves > the material, but it's main purpose is to make the material "tougher" or not > so brittle. > > Most steels will stress relieve really well, if placed in a 400-500 deg. > kitchen oven for several hours. Which really pisses my wife off, every time I > do it. > > http://www.matweb.com/ has a lot of info on a wide variety of materials, and > some good links, as does www.mlc.lib.mi.us/~stewarca/steelynx.html > > Dave > > JF wrote: > > > i am just recently getting started in the hobby of machining and all the > > recent discussion on stress relieving got me to thinking about some books i > > have been reading about machining and metals. they say that even metals > > such as cold rolled steel and just about every other way steel is formed > > will cool to have stresses in it such that if the piece being machined isn't > > > > done uniformly or taken into consideration that the piece will "warp". > > > > so i guess that every metal basicly has loads of stress built up as it cools > > > > unless it is cooled very slowly, like hours. isn't that one reason that > > after a peice of metal is heat treated it needs to be annealed by heating to > > > > the straw color and then quenching again. > > > > like i said i am only recently getting interested in all this stuff but in > > reading about the metalurgy aspects of this craft there is a couple of > > things that can mess up a well thought out project after many hours of time > > spent on it. > > > > ps several years ago when i was in the woodworking fun i had i jointer > > that i bought new. it was one of the taiwan type machines. it worked fine > > > > for several years and then it slowly started to have a problem with the > > fence. the stupid thing had begun to warp into a twist so that the board > > being machined was changing it's angle relative to the table as it was moved > > > > down the machine. > > > > just my two cents to a very interesting topic. > > David Anderson > > David Anderson > > HTML Mail > Additional Information: > Last Name Anderson > First Name David > Version 2.1 ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Best steel for making a boring bar? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1999 21:08:17 GMT -------- What kind of wood do you recommend? ;^) B&L Denard wrote: > > Why not build a floating boring bar? > Bill D. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Opinions reguested From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1999 21:20:05 GMT -------- First rescrape tailstock base to fit bed. Plane or mill top of base DEAD parallel to newly scraped surfaces. Reassemble base and tailstock, true for horizontal axis. Measure EXACT distance that T/S axis is below headstock axis. Make a shim..Full size of base and glue in place (between T/S and Base)...with super glue. Reassemble...Smile! Note: final T/S position should be 0.001 to 0.002" ABOVE center to allow for bedding in of T/S in use and to ensure that future wear only makes the machine more accurate. Robert Bastow Ted Edwards wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > Vertically!! > > How? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 6" buck chuck on ebay (wrong item no) From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 10 Jan 1999 21:23:36 GMT -------- That number worked for me!! mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article <19990110025312.01576.00007609@ng36.aol.com>, > azotic@aol.com (AZOTIC) wrote: > > Hi All > > > > Anyone needing a 6" buck adjust-tru chuck can > > check ebay item # 55498711 > > The item number is incorrect - you cannot mount > a dresser on an NC lathe. At least not that I > know of... > > Use the search facility for "buck chuck" and it > will pop up. > > Jim > > -----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==---------- > http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Ebay From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1999 03:56:09 GMT -------- I HATE EBAY!!! I NEVER GO THERE!! WHEN I DO I GET NOTHING BUT JUNK FROM TWISTERS!! NOBODY IN THEIR RIGHT MIND WOULD USE EBAY!! PLEASE BOYCOTT EBAY!! Robert Bastow ;^) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Ebay From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1999 05:59:05 GMT -------- Moi???? Joe Way wrote: > > On Mon, 11 Jan 1999 03:56:09 GMT, Robert Bastow > wrote: > > >I HATE EBAY!!! I NEVER GO THERE!! > > > >WHEN I DO I GET NOTHING BUT JUNK FROM TWISTERS!! > > > >NOBODY IN THEIR RIGHT MIND WOULD USE EBAY!! > > > >PLEASE BOYCOTT EBAY!! > > > >Robert Bastow ;^) > ==== > Got a few bids in and you're trying to run off the competition, eh > Robert? > > Joe ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Ebay From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1999 06:05:50 GMT -------- Interesting dissertation Kurt. I hope you didn't stay up late writing it. You are dead right about the "caveat emptor" that appears on the last line..one should read the fine print before jumping in. By the way...Did you read what I said on my last line?? Robert Bastow ;^) Kurt Laughlin wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > >I HATE EBAY!!! I NEVER GO THERE!! > > > >WHEN I DO I GET NOTHING BUT JUNK FROM TWISTERS!! > > > >NOBODY IN THEIR RIGHT MIND WOULD USE EBAY!! > > > >PLEASE BOYCOTT EBAY!! > > > >Robert Bastow ;^) > > Yet another thing we disagree on, Robert. I have bought model kits and > books from EBAY and have found the items to be exactly as described. > Obviously, since I chose my max bid based on what I considered a fair price, > I think I made an acceptable deal. Sure, I've been sniped out of items by > fifty cents, 10 seconds before the end of the auction, but so what? The > cost to me was zero. > > In my experience, the people who complain the most about ebay are those who > got sniped at the last minute on an item that they considered "theirs", or > people who let their egos run wild and kept bidding an item higher and > higher because someone dared to challenge them with a higher bid. > > As to the quality of the items you've gotten, on the bottom of every screen > are the words "Caveat Emptor". Only rarely is the item not as described. > More likely people are upset because it's not what they *imagined* it to be. > If you have doubts, don't bid. > > As to the "twisters" they are not ebay's fault, anymore than a drive-in > theater is to blame when there is a shyster at their Sunday AM flea market. > Ebay is just the forum, about as much to blame as your ISP. > > In summary, I've gotten through ebay things I wanted (things that in many > cases I have not been able to find elsewhere), at prices I considered fair, > all based on my own judgement. I'd say this is pretty good evidence of a > right mind. Screaming in a news group, on the other hand. . . > > KL ======== Newsgroups: rec.knives,rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.woodworking Subject: Re: Help remove protective coating from new drill press! From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1999 06:21:12 GMT -------- Leave the protective coating on it Charlie...It might deaden some of the noise if it vibrates as much as the POS I bought new from Delta last year. Bonus is...You can always sell it as "New in Box" on Ebay ;^) [Are you watching Kurt? I said ;^) ] Robert Bastow Charlie Zito wrote: > > Finaly made a decision and bought a 12" Delta drill press. The first > assembly instruction regards removing the protective coating from the > machined surfaces. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Ebay From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1999 06:28:26 GMT -------- OK! OK ALREADY!! I'll come clean. I think Ebay is great..I have bought many wonderous devices already and have been delighted with the quality and service I have received from ever single supplier. (Except one...and I fully expect our little difficulty to be resolved when he eventually gets round to reading his email!!!) Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Looking for LATHE MILL DrILl From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1999 15:29:45 GMT -------- My apologies Hans...By "Lathe,Mill,Drill I usually infer the Import Taiwanese/Chinese Grizzly type. I forgot about the Emco range. Heck! I have a Maximat Super II myself, tho' I don't ever want to hang a milling machine on the back of it. In general I prefer the separate, dedicated machine approach...but that is a purely personal choice. Robert bastow Hoyt McKagen wrote: > > Scott Logan wrote: > > > > On Sun, 10 Jan 1999 01:26:33 GMT, Robert Bastow > > wrote: > > > > >They are ALL lower end Hans! ;^) > > Not true. I have Maximat V10 and it's as fine a bit of mfg as anything > I've ever seen, well at least anything with Acme screws. I converted it > to CNC using ball screws and so forth and though it's about 35-40 years > old will still hold .0005" and repeat .0002". > > Best regards, > > Hoyt McKagen > > Belfab CNC: http://www.freeyellow.com/members/belfab/belfab.html > Best MC Repair- http://www.freeyellow.com/members/batwings/best.html > Camping/Caving- http://www.freeyellow.com/members/batwings/caving.html > 'It's the end of the world as we know it; I feel fine' <=Michael Stipe ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: PG & E bomber From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1999 16:37:47 GMT -------- Think how much you would save on Viagra!! John Robinson wrote: > and 160 listings for erector sets!!! but over $150 for a set???! ouch! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: PG & E bomber From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 11 Jan 1999 21:07:47 GMT -------- Better to fail than never have dared to begin eh! ppierce wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > Think how much you would save on Viagra!! > > Cut the pill in half (or quarters) $3 or $6 beats the hell out of $12. > What they need is one for girls (over 60)..... > > -- > Paul in AJ AZ, NRA Endowment Member MSC stockholder (150 shares) > Checkout http://www.dejanews.com > also("Dropbox")http://www.metalworking.com > Checkout (MWN)the Metal Web News at: http://www.mindspring.com/~wgray1/ > Checkout the FAQ at: http://w3.uwyo.edu/~metal ======== Newsgroups: rec.knives,rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.woodworking Subject: Re: Help remove protective coating from new drill press! From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1999 02:24:24 GMT -------- My local Delta Distributor did exchange the motor under warranty (after 6 months of bitchin' from me) Same old POS Chinese motor...helped a bit but not a whole heluva lot. I changed the belts..no effect; everything I can pull off and balance has been so dealt with. Still it rattles like a can o' mabs!! Way too much "for and aft" play in the spindle drive splines for my way of thinking. Thinking now of dumping the sorry SOB back on them. Robert Bastow Roger Blake wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote in message <369999EC.D087E89F@hotmail.com>... > >Leave the protective coating on it Charlie...It might deaden some of the > noise > >if it vibrates as much as the POS I bought new from Delta last year. > > I concur, the Delta Taiwaness drill presses are POS. I bought one once had > to take it back. Checked more at that store, most were the same way. > Probably the motor but not sure. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: what are these Mic's worth? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1999 02:38:50 GMT -------- A) Does it matter whether Lufkin are made any more? They were (still are) the equal of Starrett in every way! B) "Everybody" don't know a whole helluva lot about GOOD tools C) Check 'em out yourself..not just for zero on the end standards but properly, with a set of micrometer gauge blocks and optical flats. If you don't have any or don't know how to calibrate a micrometer...find some one that does. D) If they check out they are likely to outlive you..So buy the damned things or shut up about it..don't question the veracity of those who try to help you. E) Next time you have a question..Ask "Everybody"...You'll get far politer answers from them than you will from these good folks. Robert Bastow Who is known to suffer fools gladly...ONCE!! Jeff Pack wrote: > Really? hm,, everyone, except Grant, has said they werent worth the money. > > MSC has some nice prices on equal quality some said... > > Is Lufkin even made anylonger? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Off Topic: Killing Rats From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1999 02:42:57 GMT -------- Dogs are better for rats...get a Jack Russel, Schnauzer or a Doberman. The Dobe will see off the cats too Pure poetry to watch!! 8^) Robert Bastow > Get your own cat - large, female. > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Off Topic: Killing Rats From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1999 02:46:33 GMT -------- Yeh! But whatcha gonna do when they start shootin' back? Felice Luftschein & Nicholas Carter wrote: > At 50 yds. I can pick off little green plastic armymen with mine. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: questions: jet lathe 1340, belt vs. gear drive, taper attachment From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1999 02:53:53 GMT -------- Fundamentally...In that grade of machine the belt drive is simpler cheaper QUIETER and less likely to go awry. The finish on parts will be better too..It takes a helluva gearhead to eliminate gear "ripples" from the work piece. Only disadvantage of belt drive is that it take a wee bit longer to change speeds. Robert Bastow tim wrote: > > i'm considering a new jet lathe, and am interested in a few more > opinions. i've been looking at the 1340 models. > > what are the practical differences between belt drive and geared head? > there is a significant price difference (geared model is priced more > by 400USD - 900USD), but i haven't found a reason to not get the belt > drive model. why should i consider the geared model instead? > > have any of you used the jet taper attachment? what is your opinion > of that? why does it cost $200 to have installed? if i install it > myself, will i wish i paid to have it done? > > as an aside, can you tell me where i might find some nylon (or > similarly soft) chuck jaws? i want them to hold wood without marking > it. > > finally, if you have a lathe in that class (not necessarily jet, or > new) for sale in mn, feel free to make a pitch (dealers welcome). > > thanks for your help, > > tim ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Of MSC and whining From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1999 03:08:11 GMT -------- Hey Gail..I hope you don't mind my occasional bad language (and spelling0 ;^) Hey Assberry..Give her a chance to respond! I have had nothing but great service from my (Local) MSC center ...Still trying to get a catalogue from the "other guys" What does that tell YOU?? Robert Bastow AAsberry wrote: > > >You will have a helluva time getting your refund if you have to return a > >"drop > >shipped item. MSC wants you to return in to the supplier and then the records > >will mysteriously disappear. They will "yes" you when you call but do > >nothing, > >and eventually you will just give up and take the loss. As you can tell, I am > >not > >a fan. > > > > > Here is an e-mail I received from Gail at MSC: > > Andy-- My name is Gail and I work for MSC in NY. I read rcm everyday > and I was quite concerned when I saw you post this morning. I spoke > with the manager of the Dallas branch (Gary Banner) to better understand > the shipping of Kennedy tool boxes. He asked me to get in touch with you > to get the details on your order. Could you email the account number > used to place the order(or the packing slip #) so we can investigate > your situation. Gary advised me that the normal practice is NOT to ship > tool boxes-- especially a short distance as you indicated(20 miles). > The branch will "van" deliver them. We are both anxious to get this > situation checked out. I look forward to your email. < > krauseg@mscdirect.com > Thanks, Gail > > After repeated e-mails, haven't heard from her since. Draw your own > conclusions. > > Andy > > Prescription without diagnosis is malpractice. In medicine and mechanics. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Enco 12X36 lathe taper attachment From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1999 03:45:16 GMT -------- Making one is not difficult...Chris Heapy has the "words and music" on his web page. > > > > I'm sort of interested in a taper attachment. Comments??? > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lufkin From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1999 20:27:38 GMT -------- I am glad to see that someone else shares my view of Lufkin's products. To my way of thinking they were the best of all...better designed and finished than even Starrett, and with that certain "feel" that is so hard to define. If our original poster does not want to buy this set of Lufkins..would he please pass on the source so that other, more discerning listers, can have a crack at them! Robert Bastow APP Leader wrote: I have yet to see any product from that country that could > compare to a Lufkin product. It's too bad they're no longer in business. I > had a 0-1" Lufkin once, I loved it. Sombody stole it and the only mic I > could ever find that could even compare is a Starrett. That Lufkin just felt > good in your hand. > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: what are these Mic's worth? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1999 20:31:54 GMT -------- One thing is for sure...The Lufkins, well taken care of, will only appreciate in value. Take a look at the prices being paid on ebay (Ebay eBay??) for good condition Lufkin, B&S and Starrett products...Compared with Polish or Japanese stuff. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: what are these Mic's worth? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1999 20:46:23 GMT -------- Fitch R. Williams wrote: Fitch, You won't get any flak from me one any of your points. You do bring a much needed air of rason to this discussion. Us "Old Farts" have reached a time of life when Quality means more than Quantity and the "Doing of" means more than the "Achievement of"...Which, with our experience, becomes more and more of a given. Would I pay $400 for a set of Lufkins, or Starretts, or Moore & Wrights in fine condition? Undoubtably!! Should someone, younger, with less disposable means pay that, when: A) Nostalgia hasn't occured to him yet. B) 400 bucks will buy a set of decent mikes, a dial indicator, a set of drills, shoes for the kids and half a weeks groceries! Ain't non of my Damned Business!!! Ther will be other Lufkins in his future..Maybe yours or mine if we take care of them. Robert Bastow > >In good shape, this guy wants 400$, seems high, comments? > > I have a set of Ratchet Lufkin mics up to 3". I was given them by my > Dad who was bequeathed them by a Plastic Surgeon friend (whom I also > knew) that had a lathe. I love them, and have them on the shelf over > the lathe in their nicely fitted mahogany box. They check out dead > nuts after I adjusted the zero on them. They will outlast me by a lot > of years and may be older than I am (56) to start with. I always > reach for them first if I happen to be standing at the lathe. they > are a pleasure to hold and to use - no question. > > IMO they are as good as Starrett mikes in every way (I have two > Starrett 0 - 1" mics). The ones I have are essentially as new having > seen only infrequent hobby use over the many years. > > Now is where I get in trouble ... I can hear Pete's and Robert's guns > traversing from here ... oh well ... what's life with out a good cross > fire ... > > Having said that, would I spend $400.00 to buy a set as you describe? > The answer is not if the $400.00 was a significant sum to me - and it > would be, or I just couldn't bear the though of using something else > to measure with and would hate myself the rest of my life - and I > wouldn't. I bought a set of Chinese mics from 0" to 4" before the > Lufkin mics came into my posession. I haven't been able to find an > instance where the chinese mics weren't as good as the Lufkin ones. > The Chinese set cost me less than $90.00 including tax. The chinese > set has the advantage that they are marked in .0001" divisions, the > Lufkin are marked to .001". > > For $400.00 one can have a usable set of Chinese mics and a dividing > head, or mikes and a QC tool post with holders, or ..... > > Its the same old trade off. Shop capability for the buck. You gotta > want Lufkin mics really bad to spend $400 on the functionality you can > buy for less than a $120 someplace else - and your projects will never > know the difference. > > Still, they do feeeeeeel gooooooooood ... > > YMMV > > Fitch > In So. Cal. > > The FAQ for RCM is http://w3.uwyo.edu/~metal. > Metal Web News at http://www.mindspring.com/~wgray1/ > The "Drop Box" is at http://www.metalworking.com/ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Off Topic: Killing Rats From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1999 20:53:52 GMT -------- If you are a single guy in need of a date...Borrow a puppy or a baby and go sit in the park or a mall!!!!. When invitably approached by a lovely lass..Say to the puppy or baby, "See if you can get her phone number kid!" Works every time! Robert Bastow Don Wilkins wrote: > I know a young (single) male here who has his dog trained so that when > he is talking to a sweet young thing the dog will circle her and then > pull enough on the leash to pull her towards him. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: questions: jet lathe 1340, belt vs. gear drive, taper attachment From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1999 21:06:08 GMT -------- Yeh! But now we are talking high quality, high cost, toolroom lathes. Whole different subject! Robert Bastow (Who misses his Smart and Browne Model A) Bob Powell wrote: > > Most (?) modern gear-heads may be this way, but some older lathes have the > best of both worlds -- in the higher speed settings using a belt for the > final spindle drive, to reduce vibration transmitted to the workpiece. Mine > uses a toothed flat belt, outboard of the gear case, to connect the gear > train to the spindle in the top 4 speeds. > > Bob > > Fitch R. Williams wrote in message <369bcb58.8781528@news.newsguy.com>... > >Robert Bastow wrote: > > > >>The finish on parts will be better too..It > >>takes a helluva gearhead to eliminate gear "ripples" from the work piece. > > > >Couple up gear head with single phase power and you get really > >interesting finish sometimes. Can't "feel" it but sure can see it as > >an interesting moire pattern reflecting the light. Lots less of it > >with three phase running off a balanced converter. > > > >Fitch > >In So. Cal. > > > >The FAQ for RCM is http://w3.uwyo.edu/~metal. > >Metal Web News at http://www.mindspring.com/~wgray1/ > >The "Drop Box" is at http://www.metalworking.com/ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Titanium gloat from Boeing surplus in Seattle From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 12 Jan 1999 21:16:20 GMT -------- The competition darts were probably tungsten...objective being to make them as DENSE as possible. However, I agree with you on the machineability of Titanium..It is not difficult at all if you know how to go about it. Point your server at Titanium and you will find lots of usful information on machining this material. APP Leader wrote: > Don't laugh. I haven't seen any Titanium lawn darts -Yet-, but I have seen > some Titanium darts for dart board competition. > > I don't think anyone gets the Warm Fuzzy's from having to deal with a piece > of Titanium. Personally, I don't think it's that bad. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: New Shop Nirvana From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 13 Jan 1999 00:05:59 GMT -------- Nigel Eaton wrote: The only snag is the tendency to stand in the > middle of the floor with a big silly grin on my face, accomplishing > nothing :^) This is not a SNAG Nigel...Sometimes it is the WHOLE POINT!! I do it often. I would add that an essential piece of equipment in my shop is a comfortable armchair where I am often content to sit and dream. Thanks for sharing this and I wish you many, many happy hours of "silly grinning". Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Shoptask users list? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 13 Jan 1999 00:31:11 GMT -------- All sounds a bit incestuous to me. ;^) Sure you will all learn from each other..but like any closed society the knowledge will eventally suffer from a limited gene pool. Opinions nad guesses will eventually become to regarded as "the only true way". You are going to be cutting yourself off from a vast pool of experience and knowhow. Now, you may argue that you will visit here as well..But I and many others are sure as hell not going to visit there. Think about it. FWIW Robert Bastow RatliffGrp wrote: > > GOOD IDEA! > > I, for one, would very much like to be included in a list specifically for > SHOPTASK owners. I feel we could all learn from one another. If you find any > such list, or decide to create one, keep me informed please. > > Ratliffgrp@AOL.COM ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Dividing Head From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 13 Jan 1999 04:02:49 GMT -------- I dunno WHAT you are counting..But Brown & Sharpe dividing heads have 40 teeth on the worm wheel!! a 75:1 ratio would be pretty useless..Especially with the hole circles that you quote (which are standard for the #1 plate on any B&S dividing head). Robert Bastow > I cannot help but also have a Brown & Sharpe dividing head. The main > wheel (If I have counted corrected) has 75 teeth to engage with the > worm, and has 18,19,22,24,26, & 28 holes.The number is 3325. > I wonder if mine is the same type as yours, if you findout how to get n > instruction mnual please let me know > > GW > > > > -----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==---------- > http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: what are these Mic's worth? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 13 Jan 1999 06:39:19 GMT -------- mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > >...So buy the damned things or > > shut up about it..don't question the veracity of those who try to help you. > > Wow. I really don't think Jeff was trying to be difficult with his post. > I suspect he was just trying to make sense of the wealth of information > that came back at him, reconciling what looked like markedly different > opinions. In retrospect I was very rude to Jeff and for that I apologise. Jeff...Please forgive an Old Fart who was ready for his warm milk and a nap > Now about using optical flats to inspect micrometers - I've never > heard of it. Is it done to check for flatness and paralellism on > the faces? Does one need a special lamp to illuminate for this, to > see the lines? > > Thanks - Jim Optical flats are cylinders of special glass with their two flat faces ground, lapped and polished to be as flat and parallel as possible. Placed on a "flat" surface to be checked, or held lightly between the anvils of a micrometer they give a clear indication of the flatness, parallelism etc by means of bands of color. Any deviation from flatness on the subject surface will produce a gap of varying thickness and this in turn will allow for refraction of light between the two surfaces..the wavelength of which will vary as the error varies. As different wave- lengths produce different colors, the degree, extent and nature of aberration can be clearly seen. Domeing will produce concentric rings, "Umps and 'ollers will show wavelike mands and out-of-parallel anvils wil produce arcs, like a seashell. As different colors represent very precise distances, optical flats can allso be used to measure objects down to the length of a wavelength of light. The gage blocks in a mic. checking set are designed, not only to check accuracy at different length settings, but also at different angular positions of the thimble. Using optical flats in conjunction with gage blocks will show up cases where the faces are parallel but not square to the true axis. More than you wanted to know huh! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Help removing studs From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 13 Jan 1999 07:06:51 GMT -------- Here's how we used to remove studs from steam turbine casings..some of them up to 6" diameter. If they are true studs, that is they have a plane cylindrical section between the two theaded ends your job is somewhat easier. Take a large block of steel (we used bronze as it is less likely to put stress rising marks on the studs..Yer pays yer money and yer takes yer choice) Bore a CLOSE fitting hole through its center (cut a thread to match the stud if it is allthread) Split the block lengthways. Drill holes and fit at least four BIG clamping bolts and nuts (six or eight is better. Dust the bore surfaces with powdered resin and clamp the two block halves TIGHTLY onto the stud. Use a "hammer wrench" to start the stud moving. (A hammer wrench is a short wrench with a heavy pad on the end of the handle designed to be hit with a hammer. Ours were flame cut from six inch boiler plate, slung from the crane and hit with a 32 pound sledge hammer by the biggest guy in the shop) Robert Bastow It is not just knowing that it needs to be hit with a hammer...But WHERE and how HARD!! Stan Stocker wrote: > > Can you get two nuts that match the stud threads? Run one down as far as > you can, run the second one down and tighten, then use a wrench on the > lower nut. It might actually require more than two nuts to get sufficient > clamping pressure on the threads, but this usually works. I must admit > though that 3/4 inch studs are about the biggest I've pulled this way, and > they sure were not 4 foot long! > > Stan. > > John Lynch wrote: > > > I've been given the task of finding an easy to remove some very long > > engine studs. Any one have some ideas? Here is what I'm dealing with - > > > > The engine - Fairbanks Morse V16 > > The head studs - Roughly 1 1/2" dia 4 feet long > > > > The reason for removel is to have the studs tested for fatigue. > > > > Thanks - John (john@erie.net) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Help!!! From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 13 Jan 1999 07:10:26 GMT -------- There may well be (SHOULD BE) a torque limiting clutch in that gear box. It perhaps needs adjusting. Robert Bastow Greg wrote: > > I got a Steinell horizontal mill last summer and just got the > single/three phase converter to run it a couple of days ago. The main > motor runs ok, the pump motor runs ok, the mechanical power feed does > not run ok. I pulled off the back cover and the belts driving the > gearbox are not slipping but the tork out of the powerfeed gearbox is so > low the shaft can be stopped by grabbing it. Does anybody know what is > in the powerfeed gearbox? Or eaven better where I might find some > documentation on the mill. > Greg ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Mysteries Revealed (B'port M head) From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 13 Jan 1999 07:16:32 GMT -------- Save some money Jim, I very much doubt that ABEC 7 bearings would be justified ANYWHERE on a Bridgeport. They are designed for highly critical, usually high speed applications such as small hole grinders etc. I doubt that, under workshop conditions, one could maintain the cleanliness and the lubrication system required to keep them running for long. FWIW Robert Bastow mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > For those who care, here's an update: > > I am in the middle of a doing the spindle bearings on an M head. > When I got the machine, it was pretty noisy, indeed it howled a > *lot* on the highest speed. > > With the idea in mind of at least inspecting the spindle bearings, > I dismantled it completely. It is now down to (as my wife says) > "individual Bridgeport molecules." > > The disassembly was easier than I thought. These things are built > like a puzzle - the bearings are as far "in" as you can go, so > everthing has to come apart to get at them. The hardest part > was making some special pin wrenches to remove the nuts that secure > the bearings' inner races to the spindle. The small press at > work was helpful but not essential. (thanks, Roger!) > > After looking at all the pieces, I now understand how the oiling > on this head is done. There is one large oil cup at the top, which > feeds a gallery machined into the upper aluminum castings, to deliver > oil to the very top of the pulley bearings. The cup is situated > slightly above the uppermost bearing, ensuring correct flow. > There is a wick in the cup which sets the flow rate. > From there the oil drips into the top of the opening in the quill, > which is nicely chamfered to help the drips to make it inside. > The upper bearings in the quill get the flow first, and then from > there gravity sends the oil to the lower bearings. It drips out > the two holes in the bottom of the nosepiece in a total loss > system. > > There are no seals or sheilds on these bearings, and there is no > seal at the bottom other than a sort of labyrinth which might stop > some junk from being blown back up. I might consider a felt washer > here during reassembly. > > The bearings that came out: Pulley bearings were a bit dry and > contaminated, but were not in bad shape. I might almost consider > re-using them. The spindle bearings were mostly toast, though. > One upper and one lower bearing were almost OK, but a bit rough when > I spun them. The other two were really bad, inner races spalled and > even the balls badly marked up. This then was the source of all that > noise. I suspect the machine was run without proper lube for some time, > and the chips in the lower bearings would not help things either. > > I have a line on some ABEC 7 bearings but also have purchased 5's > as well, for only $16 each. I plan on using ABEC 1 grade for the > upper spindle bearings and the pulley bearings. If they die > at least I will know how to disassemble it quickly to change them. > I have seen angular contact pairs in MSC for 185 dollars per pair, > but I doubt that Bridgeport put bearings in these that were that good. > The manual parts list just shows "Bearing, SAE 205" as the part. > Quantity of four. But interestingly enough the bearings show signs > that they might have been fitted to the quill - the faces are kissed > off with a surface grinder. > > The lower bearing pair seem to be run in opposition to take the > thrust loads. The outer races (spacer in between) are captive in > the quill with an end cap compressing the assembly. Likewise the > inner races are constrained with another spacer on the spindle. > I suspect that varying the relative lengths of the id/od spacer > pairs sets the preload. I will have to get this right during > reassembly or the new ones will be ruined quickly. > > The upper bearings cannot take thrust loads at all, as the outer > races are constrained neither above nor below in the quill bore - > they are designed to "float," probably to account for thermal > expansion of the spindle during use. > > Well that's all for now, wish me luck. > > Jim > > -----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==---------- > http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Off Topic: Killing Rats From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 13 Jan 1999 07:23:43 GMT -------- My alltime favorite "Far Side" cartoon Momma dog and Poppa dog are answering the door to visiting relatives. Junior dog is hanging back. "Don't be rude Junior" says momma "Go sniff your Auntie's butt!" Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Help removing studs From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 13 Jan 1999 15:11:04 GMT -------- Good point Bill, I recall that we ALWAYS replaced studs after taking them out! Depending on the application I would imagine that replacement is a cheap insurance of peace of mind. Robert Bastow Bill Machrone wrote: > > Since he wants to do stress analysis on the studs, don't all of these > extraction techniques stress the studs more than they probably were > while in service? > > - Bill > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > Here's how we used to remove studs from steam turbine casings..some of them up > > to 6" diameter. > > > > If they are true studs, that is they have a plane cylindrical section between > > the two theaded ends your job is somewhat easier. > > > > Take a large block of steel (we used bronze as it is less likely to put stress > > rising marks on the studs..Yer pays yer money and yer takes yer choice) Bore a > > CLOSE fitting hole through its center (cut a thread to match the stud if it is > > allthread) Split the block lengthways. Drill holes and fit at least four BIG > > clamping bolts and nuts (six or eight is better. > > > > Dust the bore surfaces with powdered resin and clamp the two block halves > > TIGHTLY onto the stud. Use a "hammer wrench" to start the stud moving. (A > > hammer wrench is a short wrench with a heavy pad on the end of the handle > > designed to be hit with a hammer. Ours were flame cut from six inch boiler > > plate, slung from the crane and hit with a 32 pound sledge hammer by the biggest > > guy in the shop) > > > > Robert Bastow > > > > It is not just knowing that it needs to be hit with a hammer...But WHERE and how > > HARD!! > > > > Stan Stocker wrote: > > > > > > Can you get two nuts that match the stud threads? Run one down as far as > > > you can, run the second one down and tighten, then use a wrench on the > > > lower nut. It might actually require more than two nuts to get sufficient > > > clamping pressure on the threads, but this usually works. I must admit > > > though that 3/4 inch studs are about the biggest I've pulled this way, and > > > they sure were not 4 foot long! > > > > > > Stan. > > > > > > John Lynch wrote: > > > > > > > I've been given the task of finding an easy to remove some very long > > > > engine studs. Any one have some ideas? Here is what I'm dealing with - > > > > > > > > The engine - Fairbanks Morse V16 > > > > The head studs - Roughly 1 1/2" dia 4 feet long > > > > > > > > The reason for removel is to have the studs tested for fatigue. > > > > > > > > Thanks - John (john@erie.net) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Bearings was - Mysteries Revealed (B'port M head) From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 13 Jan 1999 15:16:58 GMT -------- Good point Brad. But consider that the MAXIMUM runout difference between ABEC 5 and ABEC7 is, according to your numbers 0.00005"...50 MILLIONTHS!!! On the other hand the cost difference is of an order of magnitude! What do Bridgeport fit to new machines? Robert Bastow Brad Heuver wrote: > > On Wed, 13 Jan 1999 07:16:32 GMT, Robert Bastow > wrote: > > >Save some money Jim, I very much doubt that ABEC 7 bearings would be justified > >ANYWHERE on a Bridgeport. They are designed for highly critical, usually high > >speed applications such as small hole grinders etc. I doubt that, under > >workshop conditions, one could maintain the cleanliness and the lubrication > >system required to keep them running for long. > > > >FWIW > > > >Robert Bastow > > > ****Robert, I have to take exception here. One thing the ABEC bearing > class indicates is radial runnout of the bearing. For the spindle > bearings in particular, you want this to be as small as possible. > Remember the thread on collets VS end mill holders? Well with a few > ten thousandths of runnout on the spindle, that all becomes a moot > point. From the Torrington service catalog, using a bearing with a > bore over 30mm, but under 50mm here are the radial runnouts of the > inner raceway with the outer held for the various bearing classes: > Class 1 = 0.0006" > Class 3 =0.0004" > Class 5 =0.0002" > Class 7 =0.00015" > Class 9 =0.0001" > Axial runnout is affected by class as well: > Class 5 = 0.0003" > Class 7 = 0.00015" > Class 9 = 0.0001" > As can be seen, if you are providing a bearing for a pulley to ride > on, use whatever you want, but for a spindle, you want the high class > bearings that will provide the accuracy the machine is capable of. > This applies to the bearings used for the other thread on the HSM > toolpost grinder as well. By using standard bearings, you will be > introducing a greater runnout of the wheel, and a source of chatter > into the work, vs a better class of brg. I'd go with sealed bearings > for that grinder as well, as the shielded are not made for that > environment, and will only keep large items out. > Brad > > >mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > >> > >> For those who care, here's an update: > >> > >> I am in the middle of a doing the spindle bearings on an M head. > >> When I got the machine, it was pretty noisy, indeed it howled a > >> *lot* on the highest speed. > >> > >> With the idea in mind of at least inspecting the spindle bearings, > >> I dismantled it completely. It is now down to (as my wife says) > >> "individual Bridgeport molecules." > >> > >> The disassembly was easier than I thought. These things are built > >> like a puzzle - the bearings are as far "in" as you can go, so > >> everthing has to come apart to get at them. The hardest part > >> was making some special pin wrenches to remove the nuts that secure > >> the bearings' inner races to the spindle. The small press at > >> work was helpful but not essential. (thanks, Roger!) > >> > >> After looking at all the pieces, I now understand how the oiling > >> on this head is done. There is one large oil cup at the top, which > >> feeds a gallery machined into the upper aluminum castings, to deliver > >> oil to the very top of the pulley bearings. The cup is situated > >> slightly above the uppermost bearing, ensuring correct flow. > >> There is a wick in the cup which sets the flow rate. > >> From there the oil drips into the top of the opening in the quill, > >> which is nicely chamfered to help the drips to make it inside. > >> The upper bearings in the quill get the flow first, and then from > >> there gravity sends the oil to the lower bearings. It drips out > >> the two holes in the bottom of the nosepiece in a total loss > >> system. > >> > >> There are no seals or sheilds on these bearings, and there is no > >> seal at the bottom other than a sort of labyrinth which might stop > >> some junk from being blown back up. I might consider a felt washer > >> here during reassembly. > >> > >> The bearings that came out: Pulley bearings were a bit dry and > >> contaminated, but were not in bad shape. I might almost consider > >> re-using them. The spindle bearings were mostly toast, though. > >> One upper and one lower bearing were almost OK, but a bit rough when > >> I spun them. The other two were really bad, inner races spalled and > >> even the balls badly marked up. This then was the source of all that > >> noise. I suspect the machine was run without proper lube for some time, > >> and the chips in the lower bearings would not help things either. > >> > >> I have a line on some ABEC 7 bearings but also have purchased 5's > >> as well, for only $16 each. I plan on using ABEC 1 grade for the > >> upper spindle bearings and the pulley bearings. If they die > >> at least I will know how to disassemble it quickly to change them. > >> I have seen angular contact pairs in MSC for 185 dollars per pair, > >> but I doubt that Bridgeport put bearings in these that were that good. > >> The manual parts list just shows "Bearing, SAE 205" as the part. > >> Quantity of four. But interestingly enough the bearings show signs > >> that they might have been fitted to the quill - the faces are kissed > >> off with a surface grinder. > >> > >> The lower bearing pair seem to be run in opposition to take the > >> thrust loads. The outer races (spacer in between) are captive in > >> the quill with an end cap compressing the assembly. Likewise the > >> inner races are constrained with another spacer on the spindle. > >> I suspect that varying the relative lengths of the id/od spacer > >> pairs sets the preload. I will have to get this right during > >> reassembly or the new ones will be ruined quickly. > >> > >> The upper bearings cannot take thrust loads at all, as the outer > >> races are constrained neither above nor below in the quill bore - > >> they are designed to "float," probably to account for thermal > >> expansion of the spindle during use. > >> > >> Well that's all for now, wish me luck. > >> > >> Jim > >> > >> -----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==---------- > >> http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own > > -- > Brad Heuver ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Wanted: Bridgeport mill spindle cartridge From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 00:27:12 GMT -------- Tell it to mail in its own requests!! ;^) Dennis E. Maiden wrote: > > I have a Bridgeport mill that needs a spindle cartridge, ie., > spindle, 3 bearings, spacers, and screwon collar. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: REALLY Dumb Question..... From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 06:14:54 GMT -------- This what is Known as a "Boring and Facing Head" Some of the real sophisticated (read..Expensive) examples of the breed can be set up to cut a specific taper in a bore. Robert Bastow (DoN. Nichols) wrote: > There was a knurled ring which you could > >grasp while it was turning, and once, twice, or three times per revolution > >(depending on some mechanical switches on it), it would step the toolholder > >out to the side, This feature was used in facing a hole, and is probably no > >longer needed in machines with CNC capabilities, but was rather neat back > >then. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Reducing shaft length of reamers From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 18:32:08 GMT -------- When cutting sheet metal, or any other job where jamming and shattering of the disc becomes a pain, I use two discs on the same arbor. Cutting speed is just as fast because you can "bear down" a lot harder. Time and cost saved because of less breakage is an order of magnitude. Does anyone market a stronger, more flexible disc suitable for use on a Dremel? Robert Bastow Jack Erbes wrote: > The cutting disks are fragile (especially the #409) and will shatter if > you cock or bind them in the groove. Don't even consider trying it > without eye protection. > > -- > Jack in Sonoma, CA, USA (jack@vom.com) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lathe setup and precision levels From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 18:40:01 GMT -------- Yes, you were lucky...but you created your own luck! You followed proven procedures without trying to re-invent the wheel, as so many on this list try to do! Steve Cranage wrote: > > I've been looking for a precision level for some time at a good price so I > could keep my Logan/Powermatic 12x36 properly setup without having to keep > borrowing one. Last night I moved the lathe, and decided to use my regular > machinist level (no graduations, just a centerline) to get it roughly set, > then do the trick in the Southbend book to turn 2 collars a few inches > apart, check dia, adjust level and recut, recheck, etc. > > I expected this to be a long, torturous process. Imagine my surprise when > the first cut showed the *exact* same diameter on two ~1 1/2 collars 6" > apart measured with a .0001 mic. This after only eyeballing the bubble > around the centerline at the headstock and tailstock ends. So what do I need > a $400 level for? Was I just unbelievably lucky? I thought about messing up > the levelers and seeing if I could repeat the process, but who wants to mess > with perfection. > > -- > Steve Cranage > Colorado Springs, Colorado ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: UK: diff between "slot drill" and "end mill"? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 20:16:43 GMT -------- Excellent discription John. One major point is that a two or four flute cutter will cut closer to dead size than a three flute simply because the opposing edges are "in the cut" at the same time and thus balance each other. Robert Bastow John stevenson wrote: > > On 14 Jan 1999 01:34:47 -0500, amb@bronze.lcs.mit.edu (andrew m. boardman) > wrote: > > > > >I (resident of the US) am looking at a UK tooling catalog, and trying to > >figure out the difference between what they call an "end mill" and what > >they call a "slot drill". Anyone have the answer? They seem, so far as > >we can tell, the same... > > > >(I'm looking at UK tooling catalogs (the J&L UK catalog, actually) > >because I need some metric-shanked tooling that no one that I can find in > >the US carries. The funny thing is, though, mail order from J&L in the > >UK is about as cheap as buying over-the-counter from J&L or MSC locally. > >Go figure...) > > > >andrew > > The difference between Slot drills and end mills was forged in the past. > due to newer manufacturing technologies these terms now overlap. > > At one time you had slot drills [ ALWAYS 2 flute ] and End mills [ Usually 4 > flute but going up in number according to size ] > Because slot drills were ground with one flute over centre they could plunge > down and the traverse sideways to cut something like a keyway. > End mills couldn't do this because they had a relieved portion in the centre > that would leave a pip on the work and break the cutter when you tried to > traverse it. End mills were made for attacking work from off the job into a > traversing cut. A slot mill could do all that an endmill could do but nor visa > versa although an end mill with more cutting edges was better at stock removal. > > Now with better technology and grinding techniques you can get 3 flute centre > cutting slot drills and 3 flute centre cutting end mills. Both one and the same > animal. > Suppliers don't help either as their catologues describe these tools in any > haphazard manner. > Suffice to say we won't go back to the old ways so the main thing to look out > for is whether the tool is centre cutting. Looking at my latest J & L book it > seems that almost all the mills or slot drills are centre cutting so the old > term of end mill that had the relieved portion has died a death. > > I for one am pleased as it always seemed that the only sharp cutter left that I > needed for an overnight keyway job was an endmill. Now with centre cutting I can > use anything. > - > Regards, > > John Stevenson at > > engineers@btinternet.com > > Nottingham, England. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Need engraving done!!!(can you spell ENTRAPMENT?) From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 20:19:26 GMT -------- ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Need engraving done!!!(can you spell ENTRAPMENT?) From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 20:23:30 GMT -------- I (unfortunately) am personally aquainted with one ATF agent..Meanest Daughter-of-a-Bitch you could ever wish to meet!! To hear her gloating over the way they entrap and obfuscate people is sickening. Robert Bastow Sorry about the last post..my trigger finger twitched!! Gunfreak wrote: > > Basically, if the BATF "wants > your ass", this is one way they can get you. Chances are they'd lose in court, > but who has the money to fight the government? > > Mark Serbu ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lathe setup and precision levels From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 14 Jan 1999 21:04:15 GMT -------- Steve Cranage wrote: And this is the whole point!! Not many people do have this item!! Let us not forget the objective..Which is to have a machine that produces accurate parts. The manufacturer's instructions are designed so that ordinary mortals can get their machine set up properly and quickly. Steve has achieved that!! What else matters?? Robert Bastow > Sure, but I don't happen to have a precisely ground, perfectly centered bar > of sufficient diameter, although I've always got an eye open for one if it > comes along. > > > > >Kevin > > > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: what are these Mic's worth? From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 15 Jan 1999 00:09:52 GMT -------- Didn't I mention that? Sorry! Peter Drumm wrote: > > Don't you need a monochromatic light source to use optical flats? > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: UK: diff between "slot drill" and "end mill"? From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 15 Jan 1999 00:13:48 GMT -------- Pedantics apart...In the UK "slot drill" refers specifically to a two flute,end cutting mill. Robert Bastow wrote: > > Excellent discription John. > > One major point is that a two or four flute cutter will cut closer to dead size > than a three flute simply because the opposing edges are "in the cut" at the > same time and thus balance each other. > > Robert Bastow > > John stevenson wrote: > > > > On 14 Jan 1999 01:34:47 -0500, amb@bronze.lcs.mit.edu (andrew m. boardman) > > wrote: > > > > > > > >I (resident of the US) am looking at a UK tooling catalog, and trying to > > >figure out the difference between what they call an "end mill" and what > > >they call a "slot drill". Anyone have the answer? They seem, so far as > > >we can tell, the same... > > > > > >(I'm looking at UK tooling catalogs (the J&L UK catalog, actually) > > >because I need some metric-shanked tooling that no one that I can find in > > >the US carries. The funny thing is, though, mail order from J&L in the > > >UK is about as cheap as buying over-the-counter from J&L or MSC locally. > > >Go figure...) > > > > > >andrew > > > > The difference between Slot drills and end mills was forged in the past. > > due to newer manufacturing technologies these terms now overlap. > > > > At one time you had slot drills [ ALWAYS 2 flute ] and End mills [ Usually 4 > > flute but going up in number according to size ] > > Because slot drills were ground with one flute over centre they could plunge > > down and the traverse sideways to cut something like a keyway. > > End mills couldn't do this because they had a relieved portion in the centre > > that would leave a pip on the work and break the cutter when you tried to > > traverse it. End mills were made for attacking work from off the job into a > > traversing cut. A slot mill could do all that an endmill could do but nor visa > > versa although an end mill with more cutting edges was better at stock removal. > > > > Now with better technology and grinding techniques you can get 3 flute centre > > cutting slot drills and 3 flute centre cutting end mills. Both one and the same > > animal. > > Suppliers don't help either as their catologues describe these tools in any > > haphazard manner. > > Suffice to say we won't go back to the old ways so the main thing to look out > > for is whether the tool is centre cutting. Looking at my latest J & L book it > > seems that almost all the mills or slot drills are centre cutting so the old > > term of end mill that had the relieved portion has died a death. > > > > I for one am pleased as it always seemed that the only sharp cutter left that I > > needed for an overnight keyway job was an endmill. Now with centre cutting I can > > use anything. > > - > > Regards, > > > > John Stevenson at > > > > engineers@btinternet.com > > > > Nottingham, England. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Morse Taper does not like its home From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 15 Jan 1999 02:48:27 GMT -------- I too, have a Delta drill press...worst POS I ever spent hard earned money on. Had the same problem with the spindle taper too. Had to WHOMP it into place good and solid, with a deadblow mallet, before it would behave itself. Tig sounds like a GOOD IDEA!! I don't have one so maybe if I cut the tang off the chuck arbor and just FRICTION WELD the sucker in place! Robert Bastow CROQ wrote: I have a Delta 16.5" drill press > with a Morse Taper. Every time I am about to finish drilling through a > piece of metal, the bit bites into the last .004" or so, and pulls the bit, > chuck, and Morse Taper out of the "head stock" ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: what are these Mic's worth? From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 15 Jan 1999 03:46:17 GMT -------- Next time someone asks a question about mics I'm gonna defer to THIS fella!! Robert Bastow...who knows enough to be dangerous!! Bob Ranck wrote: > > Don, > You, Fitch and the others raise a lot of very valid points. But now I must > weigh in on this one. > > My credentials: I am tool & Gage Supervisor in a LARGE machine shop. > > I supervise Calibration and maintain over 5300 pieces of measuring and test > equipment, just in this one plant. We have nearly 450 comopany-owned OD > micrometers alone in this machine shop - Brown&Sharpes, Lufkins, Scherr-Tumico, > Mitutoyo, Starrett, and Craftsman primarily, and I won't even begin to hazard a > guess at the value (the largest ones go to 70 inches, $1400.00 per copy) but we > also have a lot of the individual operators who have brought their own personal > mics into the system, too. We calibrate EVERY ONE of these on a monthly > schedule. > > It is my exerience that , being first of all in good repair, being cleaned and > recalibrated monthly, and having been of good manufacture to begin with, there > is little PRACTICAL differencein the equipment. Added to this, there are many > Chinese and Japanese "knock-offs" in our system that, with the same care, will > produce equal result. When the ganefs were stealing all my new 0-1" > Brown&Sharpe and Starretts , I bought a dozen of the $12.95 0-1's from somebody, > Westport, MRO, Penn Tool, I'm not sure, They are a Chinese copy of the Mit's > with the BIG scales on the sides, read to tenths, also. And they ARE just as > reasonable and just as accurate and repeatable and reliable as the > aforementioned high-dollar-herd. > > But the single differentiating factor is (you guessed it) THE USER ! We have > some real craftsmen, genuine *machinists*, who will make accurate measurement > with any and all mics. Then, there are the "second-tier" individuals who > somehow, always manage to just get the part within sped - barely- unless the mic > has STARRETT on it. I don't know, just some sort of ego problem, a confidence > factor, who knows? Personally, I find an esthetic appeal it each different one. > > Anyway, that's why GR&R is divided into GAGE REPEATABILITY (the equipment > factor) and GAGE REPRODUCIBILITY ( the operator factor). > > We actually calibrate over 1,000 mics, (ID, OD, & depth) evry month, not to > mention about 150 lbs. of calipers, 80 lbs of small snap-gages, etc, ad > infitum, nauseamque. > > Bob Ranck > > In article <77gteg$ijh@izalco.d-and-d.com>, dnichols@d-and-d.com says... > > > >In article <369ac5ea.7391293@news.newsguy.com>, > >Fitch R. Williams wrote: > >>jeffpa@microsoft.com (Jeff Pack) wrote: > >> > >>> > >>>a set of OD mic's 0-1, 0-2, 0-3, 0-4, 0-5, 0-6, > >>>with 2, 3, 4, 5, 6 in standards. > >>> > >>>In wood case, by Lufkin. > >>> > >>>In good shape, this guy wants 400$, seems high, comments? > >> > >>I have a set of Ratchet Lufkin mics up to 3". I was given them by my > >| Donald Nichols (DoN.)|Voice (703) 938-4564 > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Morse Taper does not like its home From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 15 Jan 1999 03:49:44 GMT -------- I would do all the things John suggests and THEN weld the POS in place!! John Hofstad-Parkhill wrote: > > >Morse Taper out of the "head stock" > > Quill. > > The morse taper is not the problem, it will hold things quite securely, > sometimes almost too securely. > > First things first. > > * Make sure both the quill and arbor tapers are clean > * Check the quill taper for burrs, check the arbor for burrs. > > After that, I'd consider trying a new or different arbor (because it's not > expensive to do so). > Then I'd get a 2MT finishing reamer and clean out the quill. > > Welding is rather permanant, you might get a tapping head for instance. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Seeking an opinion From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 15 Jan 1999 06:22:04 GMT -------- My gut feeling is that it won't. Just be sure to drill and tap all the holes to the same depth. Let me know how you make out with the new blades..I have been contemplating the use of them on my 8" Powermatic Jointer. Robert Bastow Jim Levie wrote: Assuming the holes (probably for 8-32 screws and about 3/8 deep) were drilled with a mill > to the same depth, would it be reasonable to expect the procedure to > not upset the cutterhead balance at operating speed (about 5000rpm)? > My gut feeling is that it wouldn't, but I'd like a more informed > opinion. > > Thanks... ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Tudor Cannons Forging Techniques From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 15 Jan 1999 16:16:39 GMT -------- Gregory Stapleton wrote: > > On Fri, 08 Jan 1999 18:00:04 GMT, Robert Bastow > wrote: > > >Hi Chris, > > > >You are to be commended for such an undertaking..Quite a task!! > > > >So far as the swivel gun is concerned there is only one possible method that > >comes to mind that would not involve forge welding..either logitudinally or > >spiral welding' > > > >This is to forge from a solid billet in the way that much later (and modern) > >gunmakers did it. > > > > Greetings! > I was under the opinion that most such pieces as this were cast in > period. I contacted some friends regarding the forging of such > cannons and this is the reply I received. Hope it helps to shed some > light. > > Gregory Stapleton > =================== The inescapable fact remains Gregory, that the gun Chris wants to reproduce WAS forged!! IIRC the guns on Mary Rose were "Faggot Built"...Longitudinal staves of iron bound with iron rings. The ability to cast iron into cannons did not come until much later. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Help! LeBlonde 13" (older) From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 15 Jan 1999 20:28:01 GMT -------- Ivan Vegvary wrote: Do I have the spindle built up and ground > back down to size? Can I rebore the tailstock to an oversize by using a > boring head in my headstock and somehow rigging a feedscrew (maybe a > automotive screjack) behind my tailstock? Have the T/s spindle hard chrome plated and ground oversize. To bore the T/S : Mount the tailstock inboard..ie. between the Headstock and the carriage. Make a long boring bar that will pass from the Headstock, through the Tailstock and pass through a guide bushing mounted on the tool post. You can drill and bore this bushing in situ before moving the T/S Lightly clamp the T/S to the bed, fire up the lathe and engage power feed on the carriage..Towards the headstock. The carriage will push the T/S along and over the boring bit. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Uses for precision hose level From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 15 Jan 1999 21:18:18 GMT -------- Papermills, steelmills, shipyards all come to mind! How does it work? Robert Bastow lehmann@thinkerf.com wrote: > > Hello, > > I have developed a precision version of the carpenter's hose level. In > controlled conditions, it is accurate within +/- 0.001 inches. On the plant > floor +/- 0.005 inch is easy. This degree of accuracy is comparable to laser > alignment systems (much better than contractors' laser levels), but for much > less money. > > I developed this instrument for aligning sawmill equipment, and have used a > prototype sucessfully for 2 years. To expand the market, I am looking for > other industries that need to level large equipment. I would appreciate any > suggestions. > > TIA > Bruce Lehmann > Thin Kerf Technologies www.thinkerf.com > > -----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==---------- > http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: density From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 16 Jan 1999 00:21:29 GMT -------- I learned to pronounce schedule when I went to Shool!! > Schedule, pronounced shed-yule. > > Mike Graham mike at headwaters dot com > > Mangler of metal. User of many grinding disks. > Cut with an axe, beat to fit, paint to match. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Spring steel source? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 16 Jan 1999 09:27:00 GMT -------- Hi Ron, I know OCS (Old Chevey Spring) makes great knife blades...But it would make hellacious corset stays (Refer to original post) Robert Bastow Ron Reil wrote: > > Well, I read all the other replies, and I think you may need something else, > but I don't know what your metal working abilities are, so here is a source. > > Almost every fair sized town has a spring shop. These guys get spring steel, > both flat and coil, in bulk and work it into the final spring required. If > you will visit your nearest spring shop you can often get the "drops" for > free. You will have to work them into the shape you need, but for a > blacksmith that is a piece of cake. If you are limited to machining > techniques you may have a problem. > > Ron > > Golden Age Forge and Foundry > E-Mail: rreil@micron.net > http://www.webpak.net/~rreil > Boise, Idaho, USA > > > > > vance burnham wrote in message <369F2C26.E157EBA7@worldnet.att.net>... > >Hello, > > > >I'm looking for a supplier of flat spring steel stock ~1-2mm X 3-19 mm. > > > >My wife restores and makes museum quality antique dresses and needs this > >for hoops and bones se we need pounds not metric tons. > > > >Respectfully, > >Vance S. Burnham > >Zoar Research & Development > >440 Zoar Road > >Charlemont MA 01339 > > > > > >-- > >Remove the 333 from the email address (Hopefully foils Spammers) > > > > Ron Reil wrote: > > Well, I read all the other replies, and I think you may need something else, > but I don't know what your metal working abilities are, so here is a source. > > Almost every fair sized town has a spring shop. These guys get spring steel, > both flat and coil, in bulk and work it into the final spring required. If > you will visit your nearest spring shop you can often get the "drops" for > free. You will have to work them into the shape you need, but for a > blacksmith that is a piece of cake. If you are limited to machining > techniques you may have a problem. > > Ron > > Golden Age Forge and Foundry > E-Mail: rreil@micron.net > http://www.webpak.net/~rreil > Boise, Idaho, USA > > > > > vance burnham wrote in message <369F2C26.E157EBA7@worldnet.att.net>... > >Hello, > > > >I'm looking for a supplier of flat spring steel stock ~1-2mm X 3-19 mm. > > > >My wife restores and makes museum quality antique dresses and needs this > >for hoops and bones se we need pounds not metric tons. > > > >Respectfully, > >Vance S. Burnham > >Zoar Research & Development > >440 Zoar Road > >Charlemont MA 01339 > > > > > >-- > >Remove the 333 from the email address (Hopefully foils Spammers) > > > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Got the B-port, how to setup?? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 16 Jan 1999 09:34:20 GMT -------- As I stated (in another thread recently) Hood machine tool designers always try to arrange things so the as wear inevitably takes place the machine will tend first to get even MORE accurate...before it starts to deteriorate. Bridgeport (and others) are also allowing for the fact that, before even the first cut is taken on a new machine, the table will likely be loaded with hundred pounds plus, of vise and job. Remember that NOTHING (least of all cast iron milling machines) is perfectly rigid. Robert Bastow mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article <77o3ja$226$1@news-2.news.gte.net>, > "Kathy and Erich Coiner" wrote: > > Snip a bunch of good suggestions > > > I would do this adjustments with the knee lock loose. You don't want to have > > to lock the knee on every cut to assure squareness. > > Does this imply that if one trams the head with the knee loose, > and then happens to tighten the lock, that things will be out by > several thousanths? > > I also was suprised to read in the Bridgeport manual I have that > the saddle ways are (or were when that book was produced) fabricated > so they tilt from front to back, the front being about 0.005 high. > > Jim > > -----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==---------- > http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: looking for info. From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 17 Jan 1999 06:01:14 GMT -------- Robert Grauman wrote: > > >There is a modelmaking group that you subscribe to (free) that may be > >interesting to you. This how you access it according to Scott Logan: > > Very little of consequence on the Model Engineering mail list. Most > discussion revolves around English breakfast cereal, or some equally trivial > and unrelated subject. Yeh? Like killing rats and lawyers? Lighten up Grauman! Robert Bastow > > Robert Grauman in Sunny Alberta ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Darts What Material? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 17 Jan 1999 17:41:40 GMT -------- Most "competition" darts are made from a tungsten/nickel alloy. I don't know the composition or where you might find it. DU would be a good substitute...easy to find on a darkened pub floor!! Robert Bastow Gunner wrote: > > I wrote a CNC lathe program to kick out a few sets of darts for my > buddys and myself. Anyone know what material most darts are made of > besides brass? I made a set from Titanium , but were way too light... > fun though..... > These are gonna be soft tip, threaded 10-32, using store bought shafts > (unless I can find some really tiny bearings to mount the flights > on.... muhahahahaha) > > Gunner > > --------------------------------------------------------- > > "A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an > invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write > a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort > the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, > solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program > a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die > gallantly. Specialization is for insects." Robert Heinlein ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Knock, Knock! From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 17 Jan 1999 19:23:29 GMT -------- You just did Jackie! Welcome Jackie Shaw wrote: > > Am interested in joining. My email is jsahw@proaxis.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: how to measure lathe center height From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 18 Jan 1999 17:03:08 GMT -------- This is a perfectly good way to go about it Grant. I use a ground dowel in an accurate collet. Robert Bastow Grant Erwin wrote: > > One idea is to mount a test bar of known diameter between centers, > then measure from the bottom of the test bar to the top of the > cross-slide using gage blocks or an inside micrometer. Don't > have either. I suppose I could use a 1-2-3 block and an adjustable > parallel, or just use a planer/shaper gage, either of which I > could measure with an outside micrometer. > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: how to measure lathe center height From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 18 Jan 1999 17:04:21 GMT -------- An even better plan!! Jhko wrote: > > Hi Grant: > > I like your idea of using a planer gage or adjustable parallels if you have > them. A height gage would ideal, but I assume you don't have one of those. By > the way, put a piece of scrap bar in the chuck. Take a light cut. Measure the > diameter with a mic. Add half the diameter to the measurement (or subtract half > if you are measuring to the top of the bar). This is better than a test bar in > the chuck, since the chuck will have some runout. Good luck. > > Joe Osborn > "A Live Steamer in Every Backyard" > > Osborn Metalworks > OMW Metalcrafts > "Quality Tools for the Home Shop Machinist" > OMW HOME PAGE: http://members.aol.com/omwmetal/omw.htm > EMail: JHKO@AOL.COM ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Casting mild steel From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 18 Jan 1999 20:07:57 GMT -------- Here are two thick wall formulae used by ordnance designers: Birnies Equation t = D [ / s+(1-u)p ] - [ / --------- -1 ] 2 [ \/ s+(1=u)p ] Where: p = int pressure in psi D = inside dia t = wall thickness u = Poissons ratio s = allowable stress in psi Clavarino's Equation: t= D [ / s+(1-2u)p ] - [ / --------- -1] 2 [ \/ s-(1-u )p ] Clavarino's is obviously the more conservative formula. Robert Bastow Ted Edwards wrote: > Do you have a general thick wall formula? > > Ted ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Casting mild steel From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 18 Jan 1999 20:20:46 GMT -------- Sorry. The center line of each formula seems to have shifted one space to the left in transmission...I should read D/2(root).... see if this works Robert Bastow wrote: > > Here are two thick wall formulae used by ordnance designers: > > Birnies Equation > > t = D [ / s+(1-u)p ] > - [ / --------- -1 ] > 2 [ \/ s+(1=u)p ] > > Where: p = int pressure in psi > D = inside dia > t = wall thickness > u = Poissons ratio > s = allowable stress in psi > > Clavarino's Equation: > > t= D [ / s+(1-2u)p ] > - [ / --------- -1] > 2 [ \/ s-(1-u )p ] > > Clavarino's is obviously the more conservative formula. > > Robert Bastow > > Ted Edwards wrote: > > > Do you have a general thick wall formula? > > > > Ted ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Casting mild steel From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 18 Jan 1999 20:22:44 GMT -------- Robert Bastow wrote: > > Sorry. The center line of each formula seems to have shifted one space to the > left in transmission...I should read D/2(root).... > > see if this works > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > Here are two thick wall formulae used by ordnance designers: > > > > Birnies Equation > > > > t = D [ / s+(1-u)p ] > > - [ / --------- -1 ] > > 2 [ \/ s+(1=u)p ] > > > > Where: p = int pressure in psi > > D = inside dia > > t = wall thickness > > u = Poissons ratio > > s = allowable stress in psi > > > > Clavarino's Equation: > > > > t= D [ / s+(1-2u)p ] > > - [ / --------- -1] > > 2 [ \/ s-(1-u )p ] > > > > Clavarino's is obviously the more conservative formula. > > > > Robert Bastow > > > > Ted Edwards wrote: > > > > > Do you have a general thick wall formula? > > > > > > Ted ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Tudor Cannons Forging Techniques From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 19 Jan 1999 01:31:39 GMT -------- Indeed it could be and was. The preferred method of forming gun barrels was by forging and welding..bores were left as forged. The problem our friend has, is that according to X-rays etc., the barrel he wishes to duplicate was NOT welded! It sure as heck wasn't cast..Ergo it must have been forged from the solid. I AM curious as to why we haven't heard from him since..not so much as a thank you, by your leave, or kiss my ass!! Robert Bastow dave pierson wrote: > > Educational TV. > History Channel, USA, Cable. > Four show sequence, entitled Arms in Action > Based on (produced by?) Royal Armoury collection in UK. > The 'Guns' segment showed (parts of) the forging of a 'handgun' from the > dawn of powder weapons, be a recerator. Hammer falt a piece about 1/2". > Hammer to a tube, over a mandrel ("the trick is not to get the mandrel stuck"). > True the bore. (i missed this. i Assume an abrasive job? Or reaming?) > It was not verbalized, but i infer the seam was 'hammer welded'. > Such guns were unreliable, tending to make the transition from 'gun' to > 'greanade' with no warning.... > > Not clear to me if this could be scaled to a 2" bore... > > thanks > dave pierson |the facts, as accurately as i can manage, > Compaq Computer Corporation |the opinions, my own. > 334 South St | > Shrewsbury, Mass USA pierson@gone.enet.dec.com > "He has read everything, and, to his credit, written nothing." A J Raffles > "....the net of a million lies...." Vernor Vinge ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: please take this machine !!!! From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 19 Jan 1999 01:47:03 GMT -------- This has GOT to be an early contender for best written troll of 1999 Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Metal for bookbinding From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 19 Jan 1999 05:40:25 GMT -------- This one ought to keep the list going for about three years!!! Who's going to ask the first question? Welcome Arlene...You have NO idea what you just started!! ;^) Robert Bastow Arlene Radbourne wrote: > > I am interested in trying to make my own books > with metal covers. > > Can anyone direct me to a source for > what to use? > how to cut the metal? > where to get supplies? > etc, any help would be appreciated. > > Thanks > Arlene Radbourne ======== To: oz@hex.net Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Source for Small Quantity of Dowel pins? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 19 Jan 1999 05:43:35 GMT -------- Contact me off line with your snail mail and I"ll send you one. How rough should I grind it? ;^) Robert "Share the Wealth" Bastow Rich Osman wrote: > > I need a (one each, uno, eins, ichi) roughly 1-1/2" X 1/2" ground steel > dowel pin (I need to make a more precise measurement.) MSC and Travers > Tool are happy to sell me a bag of 100, but I just need one. Any idea > where to look? > > -- > Oz@hex.net Rich Osman +1 972-879-2301 (Pager) > POB 93167; Southlake, TX 76092 (Near DFW Airport) ARS: WB0HUQ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: CUTTING OIL From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1999 00:54:54 GMT -------- While we are on the subject of missing things..It is my experience that any oil grease or fat with an organic base does eventually go "bad". Cuts and scrapes are an integral part of the machinist's life,,Sepsis and gangrene should not be!! Robert Bastow Bob & Marilyn Tonkins wrote: > > Jonathan, > I sympathize with your disgust over "the good old days." However, there is ONE > basic consiseration you may not have thought about that makes this old system of > animal fats work BETTER than the "superior" cutting oils. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Dividing Head/Errors in message From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 22 Jan 1999 21:09:56 GMT -------- Damndest thing I EVER heard of!! Robert Bastow Geoffrey.Walsh@ed.ac.uk wrote: > Brown & Sharpe Dividing Head. > > The main wheel has 75 teeth. I was initially not sure if there were 74 or 75 > or 76. Now I have done it several times and get it to 75. > > So 75 turns of the worm gives one full rotation. The plate for the worm has > 20 holes so each hole represents 1/1500 of a circle. This is of course not a > degree or any easy fraction of a radian . > > There is an angular unit called a grade ( = 0.9 degrees). The subdivision does > not fit with that. either. > The main wheel has circles with the following number of holes > > 18, 20, 22, 24, 26 & 28. > > The head will thus divide by the following prime numbers 2, 3, 5 ,7 ,11 & 13. > > I dont know about the 40 teeth ! > > GW > > -----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==---------- > http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: I should consolidate, sorry. From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1999 10:55:28 GMT -------- All of my 3 and 4 jaw chucks have holes tapped in the face , between the jaws. Backstops, in the form of blocks or simple setscrews can be skimmed to the required length, with the jaws removed. Parts with a non-flat back, can be securely and accurately supported by adjusting the standoff length Most larger 4 jaw chucks have tee slotted faces for this purpose. IMHO the Royal gizmos are a "royal" ripoff!...A triumph of marketing over commonsense! Robert Bastow Eastburn wrote: > > I've looked at those fancy things in MSC - needed one from time to time > trying to turn short stock. Kinda wish I had two - one just shy of the end > of my jaws (for thinish washers of custom sizes) and another allowing most > of the jaw. A set would be best - but that price seems high - but they > are ground to size. > Martin > -- > NRA LOH, NRA Life > NRA Second Amendment Task Force Charter Founder > Martin Eastburn, Barbara Eastburn > @ home on our computer oldtree@pacbell.net ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: PRE-FIRE SALE From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1999 11:01:23 GMT -------- "Sorry to hear about the fire in your shop" "Shhh! It's not 'til next week"!!! Robert Bastow AZOTIC wrote: > > Hi All > > The land developers are on the prowl, several small machine > shops have had mysterious fires after refuseing to comply with > the offers of the rehabers. Their message is clear, resistance > is futile, you will sell to us. Well it looks like its time to move and > clean out the shop before we encure spontanious combustion. > Anyone know how to get put on the endangered species list. > > Available on Ebay:: > > servo table feed mod80 110vac 1phase ( item # 57588123 ) > > 5C indexer hor/vert. ( item # 57597054 ) > > Dumont Keyway broaches ( item # 57950493 ) > > Drill Chucks ( item # 57951315 ) > > 4" h.s. drill ( item # 57589285 ) > > Lathe carriage travel dial ( item # 57600466 ) > > Universal quick switch master holder ( item # 57535430 ) > > I have been collecting for 30+ years so there is a lot of tooling > that i have to sell as i pack things up for the move. Anyone needing > a specific item please e-mail me and i will see if i have it. Sorry i > do not have a list. > > Best Regards > Tom. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Centec Mill From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 23 Jan 1999 15:40:43 GMT -------- You are correct, the Centec is one of several small, high quality horizontal/vertical mills from England. About the size of an Atlas or Hardinge. I would love to get my hands on one! See Tony Griffiths GREAT web page..a must for any small machine tool lover: http://www.lathes.co.uk Robert Bastow Dave Ficken wrote: > > In <36A95357.7049@escape.ca> Alan Inness writes: > > > >Hi, Anyone out there have any information on a Centec 2B Vertical & > >Horizontal mill? Is it Chinese or ? any information would be welcome. > >(There is one offered for sale in my area). > >Thanks > >Al Inness. > > This goes back at least 8 years, and I'm trying to stretch my memory, > but I believe you are talking about a Brittish made machine that is a > real sweetheart of a small combination mill. > The problem is that if I'm right, it is likely already gone if you > waited for an answer to your post before looking at it. > Then again, maybe everyone else thought it was Chinese too. > > Regards, > Dave Ficken > Meridian Machinery > http://www.mermac.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Dividing Head/Errors in message From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 24 Jan 1999 04:09:52 GMT -------- 90:1 is the most common for rotary tables followed by 60:1 and 120:1..in other words, rotary tables tend to be calibrated in degrees. Robert Bastow Still puzzling over the rationale of that 75:1 ??? PLAlbrecht wrote: > > >I have a 1929 B&S catalog that lists both machines and tooling and it > >lists many dividing heads but the worms are all either 40:1 or 60:1. > > I just checked my Gorton rotary table, that has 60 as well. 1 turn of handwheel > = 6 deg. I thought rotary tables were usually the same number of teeth on the > worm as dividing heads, i.e. 40. > > Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: babbitting for idiots From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 24 Jan 1999 04:25:12 GMT -------- Most auto engine bearing shells have a babbit component! Babbit has a No-Lube forgiveness factor..and tends to be self healing. BTW, Lignum Vitae makes great bearings too!! Robert Bastow Larry Silkaitis wrote: > > I disagree about the speed issue. Babbitted bearings are extensively used > for steam turbines and reduction gears. I work on application with > 10,000 > RPM. One major advantage of babbitted bearings is that they do not fatigue > fail like rolling-contact bearings. In addition, babbitted bearings are > usually split and there can more easily be replaced than one-piece rolling > contact bearings. > > -- > _______ > Larry > Two Black Cats, Two Grey, One White & one White&Grey > ============ > Ron Reil wrote in message ... > >They are certainly not high speed > >bearings, and have to be used where appropriate, but in the right location > >and situation they can't be beat. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Trueing Lathe center From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 24 Jan 1999 18:02:46 GMT -------- Standard practice is to use a hard center in the tailstock and a SOFT center in the headstock. For critical work it is normal to skim the headstock center EVERY time you use it. Robert Bastow PLAlbrecht wrote: > > Well, I got a MT3 center from MSC a while ago, promptly filed it for later use > without checking. When I did finally need it for a job, I found it to be about > .012 out. (First I thought the electric motor armature I was trying to machine > for a toolpost grinder was bent... nope, it was the center). The giveaway that > it was ground wonky was that the MT3 section of the taper that extended past > its socket indicated true, but the point section was way out of whack. > > I haven't ground it yet (still afraid of what grinding dust will do to the > lathe) but this is commonly done for lathe centers. I just saw mention (and > illustration) of it in the Army Machine Tool Manual I have. Maybe it's in the > online version too. In my 1973 edition it's on p. 84, Fig. 75, section 72. > > Basically, it just says to set the compound at 30 degrees and grind away... > > Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: babbitting for idiots From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 24 Jan 1999 19:37:02 GMT -------- Lignum Vitae is still used for ships propeller shaft bearings. Wood tends to expand and contract across the grain as moisture content varies, plus tthe fact that end grain has a far higher compressive strength..I would imagine that end grain is better. Robert Bastow Eric Taylor wrote: > > On Sun, 24 Jan 1999 04:25:12 GMT, Robert Bastow > wrote: > > ->BTW, Lignum Vitae makes great bearings too!! > -> > I read about that, but never talked to anyone who had used them. I've > been using Lignum Vitae for sliding components, but never for bearings > (yet!). What is the best grain direction to use? Is there any > difficulty due to the wood expansion-contraction, which is different > along the different axes? Anything else to keep in mind? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Trueing Lathe center From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 25 Jan 1999 06:31:41 GMT -------- I know what people commonly do..or more usually, advise others to do! I was telling you the CORRECT way to achieve best accuracy!! Stephen J. Rayner wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > : For critical work it is normal to skim the headstock center EVERY time you use > : it. > ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > > It is more common to make a register mark on the spindle nose, and the > centre. A new headstock centre should always be machined in place before > using. The usual mark is a light centre punch dimple. Once machined in > place, good alignment will be achieved by simply lining up the marks. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Original prices of vintage lathes From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 25 Jan 1999 18:30:50 GMT -------- I couldn't agree more Pete!! When the history of the "Decline and Fall of Western Civilization" is eventually written (not in English I might add)..The root cause will be traced to the "Harvard MBA School of Qarterly Bottom Lines" Robert Bastow PLAlbrecht wrote: > > If you want, we can blame somebody else -- the Harvard MBA mentality, which > gave us the quarterly earnings report and all that that brought with it. > > Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Spontaneously leaking oil cans From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1999 02:03:53 GMT -------- Oil seems to have a "self levitating" ability!! I keep a jar of cutting oil on a shelf behind my lathe..No matter how well I clean the shelf and the outside of the jar I always find it sitting in a ring of oil that has migrated up and over the rim. Robert Bastow GJRepesh wrote: > > I have an Eagle pump oiler leaking. I know its not the bottom but I'm not sure > where its getting out from the top. > > I keep it on an empty tuna can so I don't get oil all over the place. > > Gary R. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What is it? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1999 02:09:07 GMT -------- Wierdest thing I saw in a long time: http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBay/SAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=60325001 What or how would one use it? For double headed nails? BTW there are TWO of them on eBay right now!! Also, check out the curved ruler!! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Brass or Bronze? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1999 02:11:25 GMT -------- The price they're askin' for it!! shermfry wrote: > > How does one tell the difference between brass and bronze at the scrap > yard? Inquiring minds need to know! > > Sherm ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What is it? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1999 02:19:55 GMT -------- Damned if I can tell 1 (one) from l (L)..Try mixing and matching..BTW IT is a double clawed hammer!! or is that 11 or ll ? Robert Bastow wrote: > > Wierdest thing I saw in a long time: > > http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBay/SAPI.d11?ViewItem&item=60325001 > > What or how would one use it? For double headed nails? > > BTW there are TWO of them on eBay right now!! > > Also, check out the curved ruler!! > > Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What is it? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1999 02:21:51 GMT -------- Screw it..Find it yerselves!!! Robert Bastow wrote: > > Damned if I can tell 1 (one) from l (L)..Try mixing and matching..BTW IT is a > double clawed hammer!! or is that 11 or ll ? > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > Wierdest thing I saw in a long time: > > > > http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBay/SAPI.d11?ViewItem&item=60325001 > > > > What or how would one use it? For double headed nails? > > > > BTW there are TWO of them on eBay right now!! > > > > Also, check out the curved ruler!! > > > > Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What is it? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1999 03:54:27 GMT -------- BRILLIANT!! PLAlbrecht wrote: > > >Wierdest thing I saw in a long time: > > > >http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBay/SAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=60325001 > > > >What or how would one use it? For double headed nails? > > > > > > Ever notice that if you're trying to pull really long nails, you run out of > travel before the nail comes out? Then you go hunting for a chunk of 2x4 to put > under the hammerhead to continue pulling? With this thing, you do the first > pull with the claw opposite the head, then when you've gone as far as you can > with that, transfer to the other claw. > > Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Position of Follower Rest From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1999 13:18:57 GMT -------- The travelling steady is set to TRAIL the tool point..ie: on the freshly cut surface. How else can you guarantee that the surface being steadied is ROUND and of the CORRECT DIAMETER?? Think about turning a bolt shank from hexagonal stock! Think about finishing to a shoulder! There are exceptions however, one of them being when screwcutting..it is better to have the steady riding AHEAD of the tool..on the pre-finished o/d, rather than on any burrs that may be thrown up by the cutting tool. Robert Bastow Stephen J. Rayner wrote: > > In Britspeak htey are called travelling steadies. Myfords mount them on > the left side of the saddle, at least on the 7 series lathes. The tool bit > can be positioned so that the point just leads the steady, ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Trueing Lathe center From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1999 13:28:03 GMT -------- Sorry Jack, I guess I chose my words badly. I was referring to the HEADSTOCK center and to the method that is commonly used to GUARANTEE concentricity. Of course many people, myself included, will mark the center and the spindle nose for replacement. On many cases this will result in ACCEPTABLE accuracy. However, one can get ACCEPTABLE accuracy for most purposes..and a durn sight quicker and easier from a chuck or a collet. I only turn between centers when I want it to be DEAD NUTS...Skimming up the sof center is the only way to guarantee that it will be. Robert Bastow Jack Erbes wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > I know what people commonly do..or more usually, advise others to do! > > > > I was telling you the CORRECT way to achieve best accuracy!! > > Gee, is there a book that has *all* the CORRECT ways accumulated in it? > We'll start getting our answers there and eliminate the confusion that > results from sharing our experiences and describing other ways that may > work. > > I use both methods, my carbide tipped dead center (used with harder > materials and offset tailstock) got a touch-up grind in place and was > then indexed. > > -- > Jack in Sonoma, CA, USA (jack@vom.com) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Hole boring problems From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 26 Jan 1999 14:40:13 GMT -------- Hi Doug, First "dumb fool" question...Are you running in the right direction..or have the right "hand" boring tool. Secondly, check that you have the tool oriented correctly in the head..ie with the flat face of the tip at "normal" to the axis. If you haven't already tried it..slow down the speed and increase the feed. 0.005" per rev feed..Stainless tends to work harden and you have to ensure that each bite you take cuts under the toughened "skin" Use cutting oil. Use a drill to open up the hole closer (-0.015") to your finish size. Hope this helps. Robert Bastow Douglas A. Greblunas wrote: > > First time poster, short time reader..... I have been trying > unsucessfully to use a boring head in 304 stainless. My objective is > to bore a .500" hole is a piece of flat stock .250" thick 1.000" wide. > I have a criton 2" boring head with .500 shank HSS boring bars. I > start by drilling a .375 hole. After installing a .250 face width > bar, I set the cutting edge plus .010 to the radius. Set the power > down feed on .003 ipr and start at 100 rpm and flood coolant. The > bore starts nice, but tapers in and snaps the bar!!!! I'm kind of new > at this, but these boring tests are the only problems to date. Worked > great in alluminum. Have tried all three down feed rates and various > rpm's under 100 fpm. Carbide tipped bars????? I know some of you can > give me some ideas, maybe I'm overlooking something simple??? Please > be gentle, my wallet allready is feeling the pain. Feel free to > e-mail me if so desired. Any help greatly appreciated. > Thank You > Douglas Greblunas > Palmyra, Pennsylvania > greggreg@leba.net ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: PHASE II TOOLPOST From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 28 Jan 1999 02:01:11 GMT -------- How much do you want for it Chuck? I have a yen to use it as a dedicated rear toolpost. Contact me direct. Robert Bastow Chuck Sherwood wrote: Anyone want a piston toolpost cheap? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lufkin mic set .. followup From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 28 Jan 1999 02:12:12 GMT -------- You mean you actually FELL for all that guff about Lufkins??? ;^) Of course you do realise that Starretts are only pot metal under that shiny enamel. To save you further embarrassment I will take them off your hands for five bucks!! Grant Erwin wrote: > > Posted Wed. 1/27 > > This thread was called something like "What are these mics worth". > I met with the guy, and showed him a lot of your feedback. He saw > the light of day and rolled his price back a fair amount. I'm now > the proud owner of a nice set of Lufkin mics, 1" to 6", in the > original box with wrenches, standards, even the key to the box. > > I paid more than I would have for a Polish set, but much less > than I would have for new Starrett, Mitutoyo or even Fowler. I am > pretty satisfied. > > Now I have to sell my previous mis-mash of micrometers. I am > offering for sale to this NG, not on ebay, the following 2 lots > with more to come: > > 1. Two Mitutoyo mics, 0-1 and 1-2. Carbide faces, locking spindle. > Includes spanner wrench and 1" standard and hardwood sized for a > Kennedy toolbox drawer outline milled for these two plus a 2-3" > (not included). Measure to .0001", in very nice condition. The > 0-1 has a ratchet, the 1-2 has a friction barrel. $90 obo > http://www.halcyon.com/meretrix/images/mitumics.jpg > > 2. Two Starrett mics, model 436. See them all over ebay. I have > a nice pair, 3-4" and 4-5". Friction thimbles, locking. Japanning > is in excellent condition. Measure to .001". $75 obo > http://www.halcyon.com/meretrix/images/starmics.jpg > > Usual terms apply (buyer prepays, pays for shipping). In addition, > I will only hold this offer open until Sunday 1/31, after that I > will put these items on ebay. > > Grant Erwin > Seattle, Washington ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: WANTED: I'm looking for a sliderule. Really. From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 28 Jan 1999 03:43:47 GMT -------- There is a K & E on EBAY as we speak..asking $7.90 last time I looked. Mike Graham wrote: > > Okay, guys, one of my welding instructors has a hardon to buy a > sliderule. Honest. No 5-digit accuracy necessary, just a standard > 'highschool' type sliderule. > > Where should I look? > > Mike Graham mike@headwaters.com > > Mangler of metal. User of many grinding disks. > Cut with an axe, beat to fit, paint to match. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Knurls From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 28 Jan 1999 18:08:14 GMT -------- Can you tell me what those diameters are?? In forty plus years of metalcutting I have NEVER found a diameter that couldn't be perfectly knurled with standard diameter knurls!! If the army says it ain't so then you know why army pencils have erasers on the other end!! Knurls are NOT GEARS!! The "pressure angle is such that thy cannot fail to slip into mesh whenever the pitch diameter is "mathematically incorrect" The only time when this is unlikely to happen is when the initial bite is not deep enough. So quit worrying about something that ain't going to happen!! And quit repeating "Stuff" read in books written by so-called "experts" who obviously have never tried out their theories in practice!! Robert Bastow ...Who is sick of hearing the same old garbage repeated by one generation after another!! > There are diameters that cannot be knurled with standard size knurls. > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Speed for grey wheel: 1725 or 3450? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 28 Jan 1999 18:34:12 GMT -------- Like a lot of other things Michael.."it all depends"!! There is a bit of "Black Art" in grinding and the operator tries to optimise a whole lot of variables such as: Grit size...how big are the individual grains in the wheel Density/Porosity...the ratio of grit to fresh air. Hardness..the strength of the bond holding the grit in the wheel. Fragibility..the fracture strength of the grit particles. The objective is to use the largest grit possible, commensurate with the desired finish. Larger grits cut faster and produce less heat in the workpiece. Hardness determines how easily the wheel "Lets go" of dull grits..exposing fresh cutting facets. Fragibility determines how easily worn or "glazed" grits fracture to reveal fresh cutting facets. Unfortunately "hardness" is also a function of speed..The faster the peripheral speed the "Harder" a wheel will act. Blunted grits will not release as easily. The glazed wheel will create more heat..leading to distortion and in some cases (surface or cylindrical grinding) this will lead to "crowding" of the wheel...Literally the part expands, creating more pressure = more heat = more expansion, in a viscious cycle. Stainless steel is particularly nasty in this respect. The downside of a slower speed is that the wheel acts "Softer"..redressing has to be done more frequently if precision grinding is to be maintained. How does this answer your question Michael? My advice is to go with the SLOWER speed UNLESS you are concerned about excessive wheel wear. Michael T Kasimirsky wrote: > > Hey everyone, > > As the subject says, I'm trying to get some input on what you folks > prefer, speed-wise, for an 8" Aluminum oxide grinder wheel. I'm > overhauling a grinder and I need to decide a motor speed for it. The > wheel is direct drive, so it's either 17xx or 3450 rpm. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Centering square stock From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 28 Jan 1999 18:59:21 GMT -------- The quick way to get PDC (pretty damn close) is to first set a ROUND bar of the same dimension to run true in your four jaw. The back off ONLY two ADJACENT jaws to remove it. Put in your square piece and retigten ONLY the aforsaid two jaws. Most times it will be close enough for "Govmint" work. Quick tip for setting work true in a 4 jaw in two revolutions! (I learned this, setting up roll turning lathes with 108" swing and a jogging speed of two to four MINUTES per revolution.) 1. Revolve the work through one revolution..noting the TOTAL swing of the indicator needle. Bring the spindle to a halt at the MIDPOINT of the swing and ZERO the dial to the needle. 2. Revolve spindle to bring jaw one to be "on the plunger". Adjust jaw one and jaw three to ZERO the needle again. 3 Rotate 1/4 turn and adjust jaws two and four to re-zero needle. Job is done! Robert Bastow Felice Luftschein & Nicholas Carter wrote: > > On 28 Jan 1999 14:10:02 GMT, fidln1@aol.com (Fidln1) wrote: > > > Recently when trying to center a piece of 1 inch square stock in a 4 jaw > >chuck what had seemed like a simple chore turned out not to be. If I set the > >indicator on the flats I would have to move the indicator (mounted in the > >toolpst) back out of the way with the crosslide to turn the work to opposite > >flat then crosslide back in to the cross- dial setting. > If you take up all the backlash in the slide screw each time, this > will work. It helps if you can zero the crosslide dial. > > I tried making a center mark on the end of the bar and > >eyeballing it with the tailstock center which got that end pretty close but > >when I went back and indicated close to the chuck that was off about 20 thou. > For this method, use a wiggler, with an indicator bearing on the > wiggler shank. > This is a hard job. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Satire ok for advertisers ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 28 Jan 1999 19:17:02 GMT -------- This is a public forum..do not put anything here that you do not want to be public, answered in public, criticized in public, ridiculed in public or satirized in public. Public forums, like public life, are not for the faint hearted or the easily offended. More power to you Scott..Just don't get offended when YOU are the target! ;^) Robert Bastow Scott A. Moore wrote: > > I'll leave it to you folks. I recently got a letter taking me to task > for satirizing an ad posted here. > > My personal opinion ? Advertise here, I am at liberty to poke fun at it. > > Whats the group opinion ? > > After all, everyone knows what a mellow guy I am :):):):) > > -- > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > See me at http://www.employees.org/~samiam > See the ANSI Pascal page at http://www.employees.org/~samiam/pascal.html > See the Classic Basic Games page at http://www.employees/~samiam/basichome.html > The first casualty of the internet was truth. > Manners and clarity fell soon after that, and the body count still rises.... > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Knurls From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 29 Jan 1999 00:57:39 GMT -------- VICTORCAP wrote: Sorry you are having trouble..I don't EVER!!! I still Maintain there is NO DIAMETER THAT CANNOT BE SUCCESSFULLY KNURLED WITH STANDARD DIAMETER KNURLS...PERIOD!! That assumes you know what the hell you are doing, how to go about it, and the mechanics involved. Robert Bastow > in the MSC and J&L catalogs in the knurl pages they have a trouble shooting > list. they say if you get double track to change the pitch of the knurl or > change the dia. of the work by a few thou. > i have set up a turret lathe that has a knurl tool in it and had a problem > getting a clean knurl until i changed pitch. now it can do no wrong. i knurl at > cutting rpm so i don't have to stop and change speeds. > fred ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Stark #4-1/2 Lathe? From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 29 Jan 1999 02:17:16 GMT -------- What you are looking at is commonly referred to as as a "Bench Lathe"..No not like an Atlas, SB or Myford "bench lathe" but a specific type of plain (non sliding, non screwcutting) high precision lathe used by tool and instrument makers. I have no knowledge of this particular maker..but at one time almost every lathe manufacturer listed a lathe of this type, along with a wide range of accessories. Robert Bastow Robert Lorenz wrote: > > I came across a Stark number four and one half lathe made in Waltham Mass. > > It looks like a large jewlers lathe, Can anyone tell me any kind of > information on the Stark company or general information on such a huge > jewlers lathe? > > - > ROBERT LORENZ KHJC64B@prodigy.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Machinist t-shirt From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 30 Jan 1999 01:45:06 GMT -------- A simple narrow band of oil spray running from waist to left collar bone would be all the cognicenti would need to see. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Brass to Silver From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 30 Jan 1999 01:49:43 GMT -------- There is an old formula used by clockmakers for "silvering" dials etc. I thought it was in Machinerys Handbook but turned up empty handed. As I recall it involved rubbing the surface with a paste of Cream of Tartar and silver nitrate. I will try to find it later. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Dumore model 77 From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 31 Jan 1999 17:22:18 GMT -------- Thanks for that pointer Russ. I have just aquired a Dumore "toolpost" grinder (on Ebay"..Old but in excellent condition...AND the price was right at $238.00!!) This is a BIG unit..Model 77 NOT 57..but I can fit it on my 11" Maximat Super, no problem. The motor is a Dumor unit, 1/2 HP 3450 rev/min and built like a battleship. It is the SMOOOTHEST running motor I ever came across. Anyone ever heard of the model 77..Dumore don't list it anymore? Robert Bastow Russ Kepler wrote: > http://www.dumorecorp.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Costco Delta Drillpress From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 31 Jan 1999 17:26:08 GMT -------- I guess you got lucky with that Delta drill press Dick. Mine is the biggest POS ever to waste perfectly good floor space!! Robert Bastow Dick Brewster wrote: > > On todays trip to the Santa Clara Costco I saw a Delta 13 inch > floor model drillpress for $225. There was virtually no play in > the quill with it fully extended. The general level of finish was > also better than than most other Taiwanese drillpresses. > > I can feel the 0.002 inch play in my Harbor Freight model 583 16 > inch drill press, so the Delta must be better. They are worth a > look for anyone looking for a low priced drillpress. I bought > the Harborfreight 583 after looking at a lot of other imports > because the HF was a lot less sloppy than the other Asian > imports, including the Sears stuff, but the Delta that I saw > today beat them all. > > -- > Dick > > username. dbrewste > domain. ix.netcom.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Does anyone have experience with Levin equipment? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 31 Jan 1999 17:34:06 GMT -------- I just aquired a Levin Watchmaker's lathe on Ebay..Beautiful bit 'o kit. Levin are reputed to rank with the BEST but their prices will bring tears to a glass eye. I plan to make my own accessories for it..compound slide rest and capstan tailstock etc..maybe even go the whole hog and put on a leadscrew, power feeds and screwcutting gearbox!! robertadkisson wrote: > > I was looking through their pages; it seems to be nice stuff. No > prices, though, so I'll bet it is a bit pricey. > > Anyone have any comments? > > Thanks, Bob ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: T - Shirts From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 01 Feb 1999 12:49:55 GMT -------- CHIPS!!... You're never alone with a HSM!! Measure twice..Cut once!! Measure again..Redesign!! Support your local HSM.. He can't support HIMSELF!! It's past 11 o'clock.. Do you know where your TOOLS are? Be a Better Father.. Spend more time with your TOOLS!! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Stuck Chuck From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 01 Feb 1999 15:36:34 GMT -------- You could do what one of my (EX!!) apprentices did on a 65 HP Cincinnati CNC turning center!! SOMEHOW he managed to program out the "Safety Zone" and machined the chuck right off the sucker!! I did say EX!! Robert Bastow James Peter wrote: > > My 10 inch Clausing lathe has the chuck stuck on the spindle. I've tried all > the usual tricks to remove it. What worries me is that if I twist it too > hard I'll break something and if I heat it I'll warp something or damage a > seal or bearing. Pounding on it seems risky too. Help me. > > Thanks, > > Jim ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Aligning the headstock of a JET 920N lathe From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 01 Feb 1999 18:12:10 GMT -------- Bit 'o lateral thinking needed here. You DO have an accurate "test bar"...The one you just machined!! "But it's not parallel!" So what!! You know the taper on it..so if it is .004" larger at the tailstock end simply set your headstock such, that when you traverse your carriage and DTI towards the tailstock..You get a + 0.002" reading!! This will give you a far more accurate setting than any lash-up of bits that MIGHT resemble a pukkah "Test Bar" Robert Bastow George Erhart wrote: > > I recently purchased a jet 920 after chasing classifieds for > 2 1/2 years looking for an american built lathe in the machinery > desert known as central Ohio. > > Since I have been watching this news group for around 5 years and > I have read the HSM review of the Jet lathe in question, I knew > that I would need to do some work on it. > > From my minimal testing, I can conclusively state that the headstock > is twisted slightly and points to the back of the bed. I turned a > 6" long, 1.5" diameter aluminum round down to a nice finish. It measured 4 > thousands wider at the free end than at the chuck. > > The headstock is bolted to the bed and uses a pair of set screws on > the back side of the headstock for "fine" alignment. From the > assembly diagram, the setscrews appear to push against the studs that > hold the headstock to the bed. (As Peter Nolan pointed out quite > some time back, this is a very poor way to get alignment!) Anyway, I > know that I could use the following cycle to get the alignment: > > 1. make test cut > 2. measure taper > 3. unmount motor > 4. loosen headstock nuts > 5. adjust headstock via setscrews and tapping with soft hammer > 6. tighten headstock nuts > 7. remount motor > 8. goto #1 and repeat until TIR is very small. > > Personally, I will get no joy from continually dismounting/remounting > the motor. So, I was thinking, since I do not have a lathe test bar > and have not seen any on the market ... what about using a 1/2" MT#3 > end mill holder and 1/2" precision ground drill blank to check for > alignment. This way, I could take the motor off once. I could also > get a #2 holder to verify the tailstock. > > I have borrowed a copy of the Connelly machine tool reconditioning > book and the tests listed in there would seem to match my approach, > but he uses special test bars made with a taper on one end that > exactly fits the headstock taper. My approach is the poor man's > version. > > Any helpful suggestions would be appreciated. > > George Erhart > gerhart@lucent.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Ain't it nice From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 01 Feb 1999 22:04:47 GMT -------- Something that might tickle you more John..While the rod is sinking, give it a spin with your fingers. If the fit is CLOSE and the finish is GOOD, the rod will spin..on an air bearing no less..for quite a long time. A pal of mine used to knock these out in his lunch time and SELL the little suckers to wide eyed "Civilians" (non-HSMs) It works better if you make a heavy (say 1 1/2" x 3/4" hex) spinner with a blind, reamed hole in it and put it on top of a hardened dowel pin. The two can be lapped together to get the right fit and finish. Good practise..and maybe a stocking filler for the nippers! Robert Bastow jmkasunich@my-dejanews.com wrote: > > I'm still enough of a newbie that little things make > me happy. > > The project: make a sleeve, 1/2" OD, 3/8" ID, with > slits like a collet, so I can use a 3/8" shank end mill > in the 1/2" collet of my router. This is for (dare I > say it?) a woodworking project. Anyhow, start with a > chunk of 1/2" drill rod, drill 1" deep and bore. No > boring bar yet, so improvise by grinding one flute off > of a cheap 5/16 end mill, use the remaining flute to > cut. No reamer yet either, so take lots of fine cuts. > I finally got the best fit I've ever put on _anything_. > Hold the rod vertically with hole facing up, put 3/8" > end mill in, and watch it slowly (10 seconds) settle > to the bottom of the hole as the trapped air leaks out, > driven only by the weight of the endmill. > > I just had to tell somebody... > > John Kasunich > > -----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==---------- > http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 8mm WW tap From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 01 Feb 1999 22:08:17 GMT -------- Levin can supply one. The thread is 0.275"-40 NS GH2 They won't be cheap. Point your searcher at Levin Precision. Robert Bastow Joyce Hug wrote: > > Can anyone direct me to a source for a tap specifically for WW collets. I > have tried MSC etc. and no one seems to have the correct size tap. > > Thanks > Steve Ross ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Cute little truck From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 01 Feb 1999 22:14:41 GMT -------- Sob, Sniffle, SNORK!! I (sob) like Fitch too! (sniffle) Scott your eloquence brought a tear to BOTH my glass eyes!! Not easily moved... In wet and chilly (just like bloody YORKSHIRE) Atlanta. Robert Bastow Scott S. Logan wrote: > > On 1 Feb 1999 17:14:35 GMT, "James Harvey" > wrote: > > >So you're really upset about Fitch's new truck ain't ya. > > > > > >Lighten up a little DAHLING...... > > LOL! Thanks, Jim. > > It's really a shame that ANYONE would fault Fitch for a little > bragging. He earned it, and besides, he has proven repeatedly, that > he is an asset for all of us here. > > Personally, I like a little off topic information once in awhile. > Someone once said that this group is a bit like a machinists club. > Machining is what brings us together, but we have other things in our > lives as well. As at a machinists club meeting, the principle topic > should be machining, but a little wandering is tolerable. > > Hey Fitch? I'll admit, I'm just damn jealous. Not only the truck, > but the daughter and the wife as well. > > Peace. > > -- > +--------------------------------------------+ > | Scott Logan - ssl "at"loganact.com | > | Logan Actuator Co. http://www.loganact.com | > | Chicago, IL | > |++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++| > | Parts and Accessories for Logan Lathes and | > | Montgomery Wards Lathes | > | Logan-Lilly Mine Hoist Safety Controllers | > +--------------------------------------------+ > "Measure Twice, Cut Once" > > RCM FAQ - http://w3.uwyo.edu/~metal > Metal Web News - http://www.mindspring.com/~wgray1/ > Help squash SPAM: http://www.cauce.org/ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Ain't it nice From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 01 Feb 1999 22:19:52 GMT -------- PS If you hit them with a blast from an air gun, they will reach INCREDIBLE speeds and run forever!! Robert Bastow wrote: > > It works better if you make a heavy (say 1 1/2" x 3/4" hex) spinner with a > blind, reamed hole in it and put it on top of a hardened dowel pin. The two can > be lapped together to get the right fit and finish. > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 8mm WW tap From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 01 Feb 1999 22:43:40 GMT -------- PS There are a couple of much cheaper alternatives: A 6-40 HELICOIL insert tap is 0.276-40 tpi and lists for 50 cents The WW thread..0.275 - 40 is an "Anglicized" version of the original 8mm collet thread which is 7mm x 1mm pitch (0.276 - 39.4 tpi) the two are said to be (designed to be) interchangeable. You will note that the metric thread is a teensy bit bigger..its meant to be, so that buyers of US made WW tackle could use their existing 8mm collets etc...but not vice versa..Cunning. Huh!! This is the choice I would make..the 7x1mm lists at about 6 bucks MSC lists both these alternatives. Robert Bastow Robert Bastow wrote: > Levin can supply one. The thread is 0.275"-40 NS GH2 They won't be >cheap. > Point your searcher at Levin Precision. > Joyce Hug wrote: > > > > Can anyone direct me to a source for a tap specifically for WW collets. I > > have tried MSC etc. and no one seems to have the correct size tap. > > > > Thanks > > Steve Ross ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Snowed IN!!! From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 01 Feb 1999 22:55:26 GMT -------- PLAlbrecht wrote: > > Hey, Bill. > > Wanna amaze your daughter and confuse your enemies? Try shifting the Jetta > without the clutch. Upshifts are a no-brianer. Downshifts require a bit of > throttle to match revs. Actually the quicker you upshift the better this > technique works. Try it at least once, you won't break anything. > Er! You might!! In my rally driving days, clutchless shifts were the norm..and in those days most gearboxes could take it. It was much, much faster than declutching..actually if you did it right, it was easier on the drive train. You might make it through a WHOLE COUPLA stages without replacing the clutch and its release bearing. We were driving Semi-Works Ford Twin-Cam Escorts then. Snorty little SOBs! HOWEVER!!! I tried to demonstrate the technique to my disbelieving buddy..in HIS Ford Escort and the damned gearshit lever snapped clean off in my hand. We made it home shifting gears with vice grips...No he never did let me forget it!! Robert Bastow ..Who probably will have to buy him a pint AGAIN next time we meet!! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Machinist t-shirt From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 01 Feb 1999 23:08:42 GMT -------- Hey guys! Remember who broached the "oil slick" idea FIRST!! I wanna ROYALTY! ;^) Grasping as ever.. Robert Bastow Marc Warden wrote: > The idea of a vertical brown strip on the left side is a great one. All > my t-shirts/coveralls had that.. > > MarcW. > > Bill Machrone wrote: > > > I like the vertical oil stripe idea best, ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: B&S mic question From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 01 Feb 1999 23:38:31 GMT -------- Your 3-6" mike should only HAVE three anvils 3-4" 4-5" and 5-6" It should also have three standards 3" 4" and 5" (not 4 5 &6") Standards are regulars on ebay..don't pay more than 5 bucks apiece for them used or 10 bucks new and certified. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Snowed IN!!! From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 02 Feb 1999 03:22:13 GMT -------- PLAlbrecht wrote: > > >HOWEVER!!! > > > >I tried to demonstrate the technique to my disbelieving buddy..in HIS Ford > >Escort and the damned gearshit lever snapped clean off in my hand. > >We made it home shifting gears with vice grips... > > Wonder if that's the same shift lever design used in the German/Dutch/British > Ford Capri. There's a raised ring on the lever, and two halves of a plastic > ball slip over that ring to act as the pivot inside the gate. The sharp corner > transition at the ring is a wonderful little stress riser, and the lever > eventually snaps clean right above the ring. Is that what happened to yours? YUP!..One and the same!! I forgot the cars we rallied were, fitte with a "cast iron" ZF five speed, straight cut, gear box..."You could crash 'em and mash'em but you couldn't break 'em!" We (kinda) bought the "Twincs" from Ford (Competitions) in Dagenham..my old buddy Stuart France was Competitions Manager there and we got a "deal" Those cars were TOUGH little Muthas you could NOT break them!!..Not with a HAMMER!! Every seam was hammer welded AND brazed, shock mountings, engine mountings, etc., were 1/4" plate...they needed to be, as every suspension bushing was replaced with solid steel or bronze! Did I say SUSPENSION?? They rode like farm carts, but did they ever hold the road!! The only thing that prevented compressive fractures of the spine and curdled kidneys, were the superb Reccaro race/rally seats..which were as much a part of the handling as any other part of the car. I took one over a hump back bridge, at close to 130 mph..I am in mid-air, looking for the road that even the eight (count 'em) Cibies hadn't yet illuminated, when my navigator,inhisusualmonotoneandwithout lookingupfromhispacenotes says"... "Bridgeahead/sharpleftover/second3000/third/five/fiftyards/second/3000/righthand/straight220ydsflat" "BIT BLOODY LATE MATE!!" I yelled grabbing second from fifth, with enough clutch to yank the revs down to 3000 and putting on left full lock just in time to hit the gravel..where it stuck like SH*T to a blanket!! Before figuring whether it made it round THAT bend I'm clog down to 5000 grabbing third gear, then smack it back into second.. scrubbing off speed and revs to 3000, fifty-yards-to-the-NEXT-bend, hard right and wind it back throught the box to around 145 on the straight away. There was no time for declutching!! " SHIT!!" I screamed "WAKE UP!!" "Ijustdidhesaid!!!!!!" Obviously we made it round THAT bend..well the Twinc. and most of my body parts did..but I swear to this day there were bits of me that went straight on..And I've never seen them since!! Did I say they handled?..Like a brick on a string Mate..Like a brick on a string!! Robert Bastow > I fixed mine way back in the 70s by using the handy dandy little Emcomat lathe > in Argonne Labs' solar energy department (somebody on this list informed me > that they still have MY lathe which I ordered from McMaster-Carr back then in > the basement) to put a threaded splint in the shaft, and then silver solder it > for good measure. It lasted about a week, by that time I had gotten a new one > from the dealer. Broke just outside the home garage the second time. > > The third time, I was about a mile from home, by this time I was getting good > at quick fixes. Pulled over, reached under car from under driver's door, > counted shift rods (let's see, reverse rod, 1-2 rod, 3-4 rod... I want 2nd... > jam that forward...) and proceeded to drive with the trans permanently in 2nd, > using the clutch. > > Funny, they must have changed the metallurgy or something, haven't had that > happen again in 20 years and I'm still driving that car when it rains here. > Sort of. (Body replaced, engine replaced, trans replaced, still same car...) > > Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Ain't it nice From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 02 Feb 1999 03:30:32 GMT -------- Not for a boring bar Scott..way too soft. They double temper the hell outa them to get maximum toughness...but you can file them easy! Scott A. Moore wrote: > One trick I saw, but did not try, is to take an allen > wrench and grind the short end of it to a bit for boring. > Its the right kind of metal. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Dust collector for grinding? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 02 Feb 1999 04:05:52 GMT -------- They work fine..but you want a dedicated system..all those red hot steel grindings will mix all too well with the wood dust in your system..for a VERY short while!! Can you say "DUST EXPLOSION!!" What I, and a lot of other knife grinders do, when using a 2HP 2"x72" belt grinder, is to place a five gallon pail half filled with water in path of the "jet stream" Add a little bi-carb to the water to inhibit rust (which can be instantaneous when quenching fresh ground high carbon steel)..Plus a dash of washing up liquid, which lowers surface tension, lets the steel bits sink and prevents a surface accumulation of dust, rust and oily slime. YECH!! Oh, and by the way..we do it in a place set aside from other machinery, we wear heavy, heatproof gloves, a full leather apron, boot protectors face shield, buttoned up shirt neck , sleeves down, hat on..AND A FULL FILTER RESPIRATOR!! Grab a push stick and BEAR DOWN till it flames!! 8^) Who needs a dust extractor?? ;^) Robert "Power Grinder" Bastow By the way, if anyone doubts that grinding is anything but a CUTTING operation, should grab a handful of "Dust" from my pail...It comes out like coarse steel wool and I have been known to use it as such! These big belt grinders will take an eighth of an inch off the end of a two inch square bar, FASTER and almost as ACCURATELY, as any milling machine! Greg Dermer wrote: > > Has anybody tried using woodworking dust collectors for collecting > pedestal/surface/tool/abrasive belt grinder output? > > Anybody made up anything from scratch for this purpose? > > Seems to me the characteristics of grinder grit are considerably different > than woodworking dust (heavier for one thing) so I wonder how well the > woodworking collectors work for this purpose. > > -- Greg ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Way Oil..The Kiss of Death! From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 02 Feb 1999 05:15:22 GMT -------- Kevin Pinkerton wrote: > > I just got a quart sample of the ISO 68 (medium weight) Syn Way oil > from Royal Purple. It acts very tacky and leaves strings between the > fingers (like I would expect it to) very similar to the way Chain Saw > Bar oil does. Personally I am very leery of "Way Oil"..Especially on home shop type machines. Understand that this stuff is developed and formulated for Industrial machines, working under arduous, heavily loaded conditions THAT ARE DESIGNED ESPECIALLY TO USE IT. By that I mean that their ways are as fully protected from chips, scale and dust as possible..by mechanical design and layout. Secondly, they use way protectors and wipers that cost more to replace than most of us would consider paying for a complete work shop of machines. Thirdly they are used with timed or constant flow lube systems designed to flush, filter and recirculate way oil constantly. Lastly, those machines, expensive as they are, after a short life of careful, scheduled maintenance, are..in the final analysis...DISPOSABLE!! Like your hard earned machines RIGHT?? In other words..every thing is done to prevent contamination of the lube..and prevent that contaminated lube from being carried UNDER the way wipers and into the (Expensive) guts of the machine. Now consider your precious HS Mill or Lathe. Sure, especially on a mill, the ways are out of sight and SOMEWHAT protected from flying debris. But, remember the last job you did on cast iron..Or scaly, hot rolled steel? Boy how the dust flew..took weeks to rid the shop of it didn't it? Well I got bad news for you...some of it is still there, trapped in that lovely sticky, flypaper-like WAY OIL that does such a good job of sticking to your ways EVEN WHEN those half-assed, half worn wipers pass over it..thats what its supposed to do RIGHT?? Wrong, That sticky paste is the reason machine tool rebuilders have a business..that and the people who use an air gun to "clean down" their machines. (A whole other subject!!) So what should the HSM use? what do *I* use? SCRUPULOUS CLEANLINESS..I wipe the ways on my lathe EVERY time I traverse the saddle any distance and RE-OIL with a squirt of 10W MOTOR OIL...Yeah the stuff with DETERGENTS in it!! Why? Because I WANT all that sh*t held in suspension and flushed out where I can wipe it off in a couple of minutes. How do I know my ways get lubed UNDER the carriage? Because the stuff gets past the rinky-dink wipers that, even I, only replace once or twice a year. Controversial? Obsessive/compulsive? Not if you value, enjoy and respect, the knife edge precision I have slowly built up in my machinery.. I have reground, rescraped and rebuilt MY kit, for the last time in MY lifetime! I have no place for "way oil" in my shop!! Robert Bastow..With asbestos knickers in place!! 8^) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: T-Shirt Slogans From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 02 Feb 1999 05:19:22 GMT -------- Gerry Einarsson wrote: > > The collection, as it currently stands is..... Is it time to take a vote? > A simple narrow band of oil spray running from waist to left collar >bone.....would be all the cognicenti would need to see. Gets my vote. Heck I don't even need to buy a new tee shirt..I got a closet full already!! Robert "Oily" Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Threading Gurus! From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 02 Feb 1999 05:31:11 GMT -------- Jens wrote: > > untmaintco@aol.com (UntMaintco) wrote: > > >I just have to add That I bought a Kennametal Top notch ( please forgive my > >spelling ) Threading tool I think its great. On my small lathe 13" swing 5hp > >drive motor. I can cut most threads in one (1) pass it might not be by the > >book but it sure does work. I know I can cut 18 tpi one pass . Sometimes > >depending on material and what kind of accuracy maybe 2 or 3 cuts. Even then we > >just go straight in no compound angle. I have had great results. Maybe I am > >lucky......... :) > > You MUST be lucky .... either that or you are milling the thread > rather than cutting it. Yes, I can take fairly heavy cuts in the > beginning but there is a lot of tearing and unless I follow it up with > a lot of thinner passes I get terrible finish on mild steel (which is > most of the threading I do). I did some threading in mystery stainless > once, a 1" dia chunk, and it threaded real nice in 2 or 3 passes but I > find it difficult to believe that you could do a single point > threading job in a single pass. > > Jens Whenever possible I use Geometric type thread chasers (pick up odd ones for free..aint no use unless its a full set) to cut threads. Retain the original "Lead" or duplicate it. Straight in, one, two or three passes... At as high a speed as the material, the configuration, and my gut will stand. ..Perfect thread every time! I learned that one running center, capstan and turret lathes, on piecework, as an apprentice. And yes..they had to pass inspection, or we had to re-make the parts..The WHOLE batch..on our own nickel!! Robert Bastow Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Block boring From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 02 Feb 1999 05:44:21 GMT -------- All that plus.. A pukka engine reborer will have the required "False Head"..A block of thick steel, prebored to clear the bar..that he can torque down on the block to bring it to its actual running configuration while it is being bored and honed..All in less time than it will take you to bolt it down on your mill table so it don't move..too much! PumaRacing wrote: > > >Subject: Block boring > >From: cstemple > >Date: 2/2/99 2:57AM GMT > >Message-id: <36B66987.5BF83DDD@pacifier.com> > > > > I need to bore a cast iron single cylinder engine block 0.020, > >Question should I attempt to bore it to the 0.020 over in one pass or > >take light cuts on the cast iron? I have a Bridgeport mill to use for > >the job. What type cutter is best to use on cast iron? and what speed > >should it run? > >Thanks in advance > > My best advice is not to do it. Take it to an engine reconditioner for the > small amount it will cost. A mill won't have the rigidity to get an accurate > bore. You'll get chatter marks. You'll have to leave 3 or 4 thou to be honed > out anyway to get rid of the tool marks whereas a jig borer will bore to within > a thou. You'll pay as much for the honing as you would for the whole job > anyway. You'll spend hours making up a boring bar long enough, you'll have to > clock the concentricity very accurately - spend the time fishing and save > yourself the anguish. Been there, done that, got the teeshirt - got a proper > boring bar now and would never go near a mill for that sort of job again if my > life depended on it. > > BTW - if you are thinking of running the engine with a bored finish without the > proper honing work and cross hatch pattern may the engine gods bring a plague > of boils and pestilence upon you :) > > Dave Baker at Puma Race Engines (London - England) - specialist flow > development and engine work. . ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: STP??? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 02 Feb 1999 07:53:26 GMT -------- Scientifically Tested Products..And don't ask me WHERE I picked up that useless nugget!! Robert Bastow..Who needs to get OFF this damned machine..before I start answering questions on Harbor Fright Bandsaws..fer christ's sake! 'Night all. Adam Widmeyer wrote: > > Can anyone tell me what STP stands for? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Milling questions! From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 02 Feb 1999 09:06:26 GMT -------- The name "End Mill" is a bit of a misnomer in as much as they are designed to cut on the SIDE more efficiently than they cut on the END Repeatedly cutting a wide, shallow swathe as you are doing means, effectively, that the very end .025" of your cutter is doing all the work..no wonder they wear out quickly and break..poor little buggers are EXHAUSTED. Especially as they are..at that feed rate..having to do the job ten times over...You are cutting and recutting chips..any slot that emerges will be a BY-PRODUCT!! 8^) So..reduce your WIDTH of cut and increase the DEPTH..1/2 x cutter diameter to 1 x cutter diameter are good starting guide lines when cutting into "solid" metal Width of cut approximately 1/5 to 1/4 cutter diameter as you get to depth and start to "open out"..cutting now only on the side of the mill. with a stiff enough set up and enough HP depths of cut of 1/4 x diameter by 2 to 3 times the mill diameter in "width" are the norm.** Feed .002 to 003 per tooth per rev..more if it will take it..Remember.. the extra "strain" on the cutter taking .003 per rev as opposed to .002 per rev is miniscule..compared with the wear occasioned by having to cut 1/3 more metal on the lower feed!! Flood coolant and brisk brushing, or air jet to get those bloody chips out of the way and give it chance to do the job it was designed and is very capable of doing. My recommendations rely on you having as stiff a setup as you claim..they may sound a bit excessive..but be assured the mill would rather, and can, bend a bit than be plumb wore out. ;^) ** in case I confuse...on the question of depth and width of cut.. A one inch HSS end mill should be capable of taking a 1/4" cut off the full width of the edge of a 2" steel plate.. or a 3" to 4" aluminum plate. PROVIDED THAT the milling machine is of sufficient HP and Rigidity Modern machines with massive power and rigidity are capable of far more than that with carbide cutters..in materials far tougher Robert Bastow Reckless wrote: > > I finally got the stepper motors on the xy table and got them hooked > to a computer. That all works ok. My problem is that I am breaking > or dulling end mills. I'm using my Atlas/Clausing 12x36 lathe for > power, with the endmill held in a collet. > > So here's the parameters: 3/16" 2 flute hss endmill, 0.85"/minute > feed, .025" doc, .072" width of cut, 750 rpm. Material is h.r.s. cut > from 1" x 4" bar stock. I am under the scale/skin. This sort of > works, but the import (yeah, I know) endmills get dull pretty quick. > > I have tried faster feed (makes more crunchy sounds as chips are > recut). Faster speed, up to about 1800 rpm, that burns up the cutter > which then breaks. Killed 2 cutters that way. They worked nice until > the cutter burned up. Coolant really isn't an option yet. > > I've tried climb milling and conventional milling. Both seem to work > equally well. > > If my numbers are correct, I'm feeding too slow. The only endmills I > have left are a couple of US-made 4-flute, which I'll try tomorrow > night. > > So how's about telling me what does work?? Thanks guys! > > -Reckless (Dave) in damp Placentia, California > +---------------------------------+--------------------------------+ > | Same Sh*t, Different Day | Spam deflector in operation: | > | #include | * please remove 'x' to reply * | > +---------------------------------+--------------------------------+ > | RCM FAQ - http://w3.uwyo.edu/~metal | > | Metal Web News - http://www.mindspring.com/~wgray1/ | > +------------------------------------------------------------------+ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Snowed IN!!! From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 02 Feb 1999 12:37:18 GMT -------- CharlieDIY wrote: >I used to show off by shifting with my right foot at the base of the >shaft, without using the clutch. "Of course I've never made love to a girl in the car before," he said, changing gear with his knee!! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 8mm / WW tap From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 02 Feb 1999 13:54:25 GMT -------- It appears I made an error in the metric equivalent of the WW thread. Somehow, I equated 40 tpi with 40thou which equals 1mm pitch! DUH!! 40 tpi = 0.625mm pitch The correct "American" thread for WW collet DRAWBARS** is, according to the Levin catalogue, faxed to me two days ago: Catalogue No 0031-01 Drawbar Tap Type WW 0.275-40tpi NS GH2 No they didn't quote prices!! **Note this is for Drawbars NOT necessarily the correct spec for male threads cut on collets etc. I say this because it is known that the WW threads are originally an anglicized version of the original 8mm European sizes..of which there are MANY..most of which are interchangeable with WW collets, drawbars etc. It is also known that, in order to facilitate this interchangeability..drawbar threads are purposely cut to maximum sizes Thus, if you have a drawbar tapped to the above spec..either .275-40 tpi H2 or the equivalent metric size 6mm x .625mm you can use WW or 8mm collets in it from all the following manufacturers..my sizes are taken from "the Model Engineers Handbook" by ..Tubal Cain..the other guy..the REAL ONE as someone said!! 8mm collets from Adams, Boley, Boley-Leinen, Coronet, Derbyshire, Pultra and WW are all threaded 0.268-40 and will all be a fairly sloppy fit in your drawtube. 8mm collets from Wolf-Jahn are threaded 0.270-40 and will be a little tighter in your WW drawtube 8mm collets from I.M.E. and LORCH are threaded 0.275-40 (6mm-.0625) and will be a fairly snug fit in your drawbar. Now I uderstand the significance of Levin's blurb on the taps "these taps offer a convenient means of producing the matching threads WITH THE APPROPRIATE THREAD CLEARANCES" (Caps are mine) What is the point of all the above? Somewhat selfish..but hopefully helpful to those who have or contemplate buying a watchmaker's or other WW/8mm lathe in future. High quality collets of these types ar BRUTALLY expensive to buy new. I an most others will collect them slowly, from a variety of sources and be confronted with a whole slew of different manufacturers..as above, plus many, many more, It will be a comfort to know that a mixed batch of collets..Boley, Lorch, Levin, WW, etc. will ALL fit my Levin Lathe and that I can make a drawbar that will accomodate them all. My detailed interest in WW collets started over a year ago when I first contemplated using them in a Quorn type grinding spindle. In setting out to get dimensions ...just of WW collets I ran into a quagmire of conflicting and simply, missing information. It took until now for me to analyse all the bits and pieces and be able to set it down as above. I hope someone else will find it just as useful one day. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Way Oil..The Kiss of Death! From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 02 Feb 1999 14:25:43 GMT -------- Doug White wrote: If you think you have a > better answer, you are welcome to your opinion. I'll stick with what the > pros do. > I AM A PRO Doug!! Six year apprenticeship in the Machine tool building industry as as toolmaker/machinist/machine builder. Service/ Commissioning engineer for ALFRED HERBERT..At one time the LARGEST machine tool builders in the WORLD... Ever heard of them? or DeVlieg or Churchill, Broadbent, Coventry Dieworks..all part of Herberts Thirty seven years in the Industry, Managed three different LARGE custom/jobbing machine/Tool and die shops. Owned Two (smaller thank God) machine shops of my own. Model Engineer and HSM for forty plus years. I have seen inside, pulled to pieces, sweated over, wept over,crawled in and crawled over, bought and sold, rescued, rebuilt and scrapped more machine tools that your Hardinge "Operators" have had hot dinners. I know what I know and I am glad I am not paying for their ignorance. But to return to my post....and please re-read it Doug before going off half cocked again.. I simply stated for the reasons I set out..that "way oil" has no place in MY SHOP!! It doesn't now and, until I choose to buy the kind of equipment for which it is a BENEFIT not a DEATH SENTENCE...IT NEVER WILL HAVE!! Respectfully, Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Metric Threading on SB 9" model A From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 02 Feb 1999 16:07:39 GMT -------- Depending on the material involved and the length of engagement required I doubt that you, the pen, or your customer will notice the difference between 36 1/4 tpi and 36 tpi. That should be obtainable (I am no expert on South Bends) on your machine one way or another If the thread engagement is over 1/2" long you might want to consider making a trial barrel out of a softer (sacrificial) material first..just to be sure of how the land lies!! Robert Bastow Doug Speck wrote: > > I'd use 36 1/4, but how do I set that on the QC gearbox? It only does > whole number threads, as far as I can make out from the plate. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Way Oil..The Kiss of Death! From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 02 Feb 1999 16:45:05 GMT -------- Some people didn't receive this original post and I have been asked to repeat it.... Kevin Pinkerton wrote: > > I just got a quart sample of the ISO 68 (medium weight) Syn Way oil > from Royal Purple. It acts very tacky and leaves strings between the > fingers (like I would expect it to) very similar to the way Chain Saw > Bar oil does. > Personally I am very leery of "Way Oil"..Especially on home shop type machines. Understand that this stuff is developed and formulated for Industrial machines, working under arduous, heavily loaded conditions THAT ARE DESIGNED ESPECIALLY TO USE IT. By that I mean that their ways are as fully protected from chips, scale and dust as possible..by mechanical design and layout. Secondly, they use way protectors and wipers that cost more to replace than most of us would consider paying for a complete work shop of machines. Thirdly they are used with timed or constant flow lube systems designed to flush, filter and recirculate way oil constantly. Lastly, those machines, expensive as they are, after a short life of careful, scheduled maintenance, are..in the final analysis...DISPOSABLE!! Like your hard earned machines RIGHT?? In other words..every thing is done to prevent contamination of the lube..and prevent that contaminated lube from being carried UNDER the way wipers and into the (Expensive) guts of the machine. Now consider your precious HS Mill or Lathe. Sure, especially on a mill, the ways are out of sight and SOMEWHAT protected from flying debris. But, remember the last job you did on cast iron..Or scaly, hot rolled steel? Boy how the dust flew..took weeks to rid the shop of it didn't it? Well I got bad news for you...some of it is still there, trapped in that lovely sticky, flypaper-like WAY OIL that does such a good job of sticking to your ways EVEN WHEN those half-assed, half worn wipers pass over it..thats what its supposed to do RIGHT?? Wrong, That sticky paste is the reason machine tool rebuilders have a business..that and the people who use an air gun to "clean down" their machines. (A whole other subject!!) So what should the HSM use? what do *I* use? SCRUPULOUS CLEANLINESS..I wipe the ways on my lathe EVERY time I traverse the saddle any distance and RE-OIL with a squirt of 10W MOTOR OIL...Yeah the stuff with DETERGENTS in it!! Why? Because I WANT all that sh*t held in suspension and flushed out where I can wipe it off in a couple of minutes. How do I know my ways get lubed UNDER the carriage? Because the stuff gets past the rinky-dink wipers that, even I, only replace once or twice a year. Controversial? Obsessive/compulsive? Not if you value, enjoy and respect, the knife edge precision I have slowly built up in my machinery.. I have reground, rescraped and rebuilt MY kit, for the last time in MY lifetime! I have no place for "way oil" in my shop!! Robert Bastow..With asbestos knickers in place!! 8^) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Sachs - Wankel rotary engines From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 02 Feb 1999 16:59:02 GMT -------- Janos Ero wrote of the NSU Ro 80: > > This car was only sold in Germany, as no maintenance was available abroad. They were quite popular in the UK for a period..the styling was WAY ahead of its time and would not look out of place on today's roads. Sorta rounded wedge..not unlike today's Chryslers IIRC. Very comfortable, handled well, quite sparkly performance..sold like hot cakes. And then...And then..ER.ER!! Along came the maintenance and repairs and spares and rust and gas mileage and paint problems ..and....and.....and.... PLONK!! And we all know what PLONK means..Don't we!! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 8mm / WW tap From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 02 Feb 1999 20:51:22 GMT -------- As you can see..it is a real can of worms!! Let me know (directly too please Steve) what you come up with so I can correlate it with information from other sources. Three "Reliable" reference sources have come up with three, significantly different sets of dimensions for 8mm Boleys and WW collets from different makers in the US. Thanks, Robert Steve Rayner wrote: > > > > Please note that some Wolfjahns collets will NOT fit well in a Boley > lathe! The Wolfjahns Mandrell ( Faceplate ) will fit my Boley, but the few > collets I have won't. Fortunately I have a complete set of Boley collets > in wire sizes, as well as wax chucks & step chucks. I will have to dig out > the six jaw ring chuck, and see what make it is. > > Robert Bastow (Tubal_cain@hotmail.com) wrote: > : It appears I made an error in the metric equivalent of the WW thread. > > : Somehow, I equated 40 tpi with 40thou which equals 1mm pitch! > > : DUH!! > > : 40 tpi = 0.625mm pitch > > : The correct "American" thread for WW collet DRAWBARS** is, according to the > : Levin catalogue, faxed to me two days ago: > > : Catalogue No 0031-01 Drawbar Tap Type WW 0.275-40tpi NS GH2 > > : No they didn't quote prices!! > > : **Note this is for Drawbars NOT necessarily the correct spec for male threads > : cut on collets etc. > > : I say this because it is known that the WW threads are originally an anglicized > : version of the original 8mm European sizes..of which there are MANY..most of > : which are interchangeable with WW collets, drawbars etc. > > : It is also known that, in order to facilitate this interchangeability..drawbar > : threads are purposely cut to maximum sizes > > : Thus, if you have a drawbar tapped to the above spec..either .275-40 tpi H2 or > : the equivalent metric size 6mm x .625mm you can use WW or 8mm collets in it from > : all the following manufacturers..my sizes are taken from "the Model Engineers > : Handbook" by ..Tubal Cain..the other guy..the REAL ONE as someone said!! > > : 8mm collets from Adams, Boley, Boley-Leinen, Coronet, Derbyshire, Pultra and WW > : are all threaded 0.268-40 and will all be a fairly sloppy fit in your > : drawtube. > > : 8mm collets from Wolf-Jahn are threaded 0.270-40 and will be a little tighter in > : your WW drawtube > > : 8mm collets from I.M.E. and LORCH are threaded 0.275-40 (6mm-.0625) and will be > : a fairly snug fit in your drawbar. > > : Now I uderstand the significance of Levin's blurb on the taps "these taps offer > : a convenient means of producing the matching threads WITH THE APPROPRIATE THREAD > : CLEARANCES" (Caps are mine) > > : What is the point of all the above? > > : Somewhat selfish..but hopefully helpful to those who have or contemplate buying > : a watchmaker's or other WW/8mm lathe in future. High quality collets of these > : types ar BRUTALLY expensive to buy new. I an most others will collect them > : slowly, from a variety of sources and be confronted with a whole slew of > : different manufacturers..as above, plus many, many more, > > : It will be a comfort to know that a mixed batch of collets..Boley, Lorch, > : Levin, WW, etc. will ALL fit my Levin Lathe and that I can make a drawbar that > : will accomodate them all. > > : My detailed interest in WW collets started over a year ago when I first > : contemplated using them in a Quorn type grinding spindle. In setting out to get > : dimensions ...just of WW collets I ran into a quagmire of conflicting and > : simply, missing information. It took until now for me to analyse all the bits > : and pieces and be able to set it down as above. > > : I hope someone else will find it just as useful one day. > > : Robert Bastow > > -- > > I'm a Canadian eh! Steve. > ************************************************************************** > The FAQ for rec.crafts.metalworking is at: http://w3.uwyo.edu/~metal > The metalworking drop box is at http://208.213.200.132 > ************************************************************************** > Visit my website at: http://www.victoria.tc.ca/~ud233/homepage.htm > > ************* Tu ne cede malis, sed contra audentior ito. **************** > ******************************** - Virgil ******************************** > ******Yield thou not to adversity, but press on the more bravely.********** ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Block boring From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 02 Feb 1999 21:04:13 GMT -------- I willingly defer to an Expert..I guess I have read too many copies of "Cart and Dribbler" and believed it when they said that modern, thin wall blocks "gotta have a torque plate" Perhaps I'll shut up and stick to my areas of expertise!! Robert Bastow Who is now looking for a News Group that covers Fish and Chips, Yorkshire Pudding...and the incidence of ingrown toenails in Lesser Striped Mongolian Mongooses...Know of one? PumaRacing wrote: > > >Subject: Re: Block boring > >From: Robert Bastow > >Date: 2/2/99 5:44AM GMT > >Message-id: <36B53F9D.C7ACB921@hotmail.com> > > > >All that plus.. > > > >A pukka engine reborer will have the required "False Head"..A block of thick > >steel, prebored to clear the bar..that he can torque down on the block to > >bring > >it to its actual running configuration while it is being bored and honed..All > >in > >less time than it will take you to bolt it down on your mill table so it > >don't > >move..too much! > > No he won't ! - only once in a blue moon and only for very common blocks do you > find anyone with a "torque plate" to bore and hone them with. In the USA you > certainly have plates for standard V8s cos there are shit loads of em about. > Over here I have never seen a block bored with a torque plate in 20 years of > building engines. 1 or 2 firms have plates for certain types of race engine if > you think the extra cost is worth while. There are too many types of engine and > not enough of each one for it to be cost effective to make the plates up. > > For road use, (and most race engines) torque plates are a complete waste of > time anyway. For some thin walled engines taken to flat out drag race spec they > allow you to gap the rings a tad tighter but it's debatable if any extra real > power shows up at the end of the day. > > Dave Baker at Puma Race Engines (London - England) - specialist flow > development and engine work. . PumaRacing wrote: > > >Subject: Re: Block boring > >From: Robert Bastow > >Date: 2/2/99 5:44AM GMT > >Message-id: <36B53F9D.C7ACB921@hotmail.com> > > > >All that plus.. > > > >A pukka engine reborer will have the required "False Head"..A block of thick > >steel, prebored to clear the bar..that he can torque down on the block to > >bring > >it to its actual running configuration while it is being bored and honed..All > >in > >less time than it will take you to bolt it down on your mill table so it > >don't > >move..too much! > > No he won't ! - only once in a blue moon and only for very common blocks do you > find anyone with a "torque plate" to bore and hone them with. In the USA you > certainly have plates for standard V8s cos there are shit loads of em about. > Over here I have never seen a block bored with a torque plate in 20 years of > building engines. 1 or 2 firms have plates for certain types of race engine if > you think the extra cost is worth while. There are too many types of engine and > not enough of each one for it to be cost effective to make the plates up. > > For road use, (and most race engines) torque plates are a complete waste of > time anyway. For some thin walled engines taken to flat out drag race spec they > allow you to gap the rings a tad tighter but it's debatable if any extra real > power shows up at the end of the day. > > Dave Baker at Puma Race Engines (London - England) - specialist flow > development and engine work. . ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Way Oil..THE FIRST INTELLIGENT RESPONSE From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 02 Feb 1999 21:18:59 GMT -------- So Alex, I resisted my first urge to simply PLONK that unbelievably knowledgeable and obviously (for you) clearly thought out and SO ELOQUENTLY constructed remark. Would it be stretching you a little too much perhaps, to ask you; what is the sum of your experience, in and thoughts on the practice and theory of the use of way oil in the Home shop as opposed to its many, perfectly correct uses in industry. That's if you ever DO stop to think before you open your big yap!! Contemptuously...But after all Alex..It IS a free country!! Robert Bastow Alex Rein hold wrote: > > On Tue, 02 Feb 1999 05:15:22 GMT, Robert Bastow > wrote: > > Robert- > You are so full of shit it's unbelievable. But hey, it's a > free country. > > Alex ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Speeds and feeds horizontal milling From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 02 Feb 1999 23:33:41 GMT -------- Brian Evans wrote: > > Read with interest the discussion on feeds and speeds > > Any advice from anyone who's had some horizontal milling experience? > > Thanks, Brian Milling speeds and feeds are a real can of worms..not because there aren't readily available GUIDELINES..but simply because different people have different (honest) opinions based upon a whole range of different experiences. THE ONE CONSTANT FACTOR IS CUTTING SPEED IN FEET PER MINUTE..It doesn't matter whether I am using a 1" diameter slitting saw on my lathe cross slide, or you are running a 10" diameter x 12" long slab mill on a 60 HP Cincinnati mill..if we are both using HSS cutters on hot rolled steel, we are both limited to the 80 to 100 surface feet per minute. You may find it hard to believe that, during a six year apprenticeship, during which I ran SCORES of different mills..from the teensiest Instrument Mill to 48 foot Planer Mills...I never was taught, nor did I find it necessary to apply any "magic formulae" But the reason for that is simple..THERE AREN'T ANY!! The objective is to remove metal as quickly (therefore economically) as possible. In the early days of (particularly horizontal) Mills it was common practice for manufacturers to rate and compare them in terms of "CUBIC INCHES OF METAL REMOVED PER MINUTE" And, believe me, some of those old slabmillers could shift IMPRESSIVE amounts of metal. But there are so many other variables..some you have control over..width and depth of cut, feed per tooth, coolant, tool geometry, SHARPNESS!! etc. And there are a whole HOST more, that you , generally, do NOT have control over..Age and CONDITION of the machine. Size of the machine, rigidity of its design, its dynamic behaviour under load. the part itself, its rigidity and clamping etc etc. Heck a Kray Mainfrain couldn't calculate all the "BEST" parameters for all the jobs and all the machines in a large shop. So how DID we do it? As do it we did..most Jobs were "on ticket" ...piecework! Commensurate with meeting specs. on fit and finish..we were paid to shift metal as fast as possible. In reality it was nowhere as complicated as one might imagine! Get a job ticket, go to machine..never seen it before! Clamp down job, install cutters. Quick reference to Starrett Chart pinned in lid of tool box (No-body figured it out in their head..the chart was quicker, especially on a Monday morning!!) X" dia at 90 ft/min = Y rev/min. Crank the speed change dial (on most CINCI's, Kearney & Trecker, Herbert's etc the speed and feed changes were through crank handles on large dials. Now set the depth and width of cut. HMMmm! In MOST cases the fastest way to shift metal was to engage as much of the cutter as possible get as many teeth cutting as wide and deep as possible at the same time.."Bury the Bugger" the saying went. That way you removed more metal per tooth, per rev and were less likely to wear the cutter out before the job was done Limiting factors..HP..got MORE than enough. Machine rigidity..slide conditions etc...NO IDEA..never seen the bugger before..only one way to find out though!! What's next..the work piece..this one is sturdy enough to take some "elbow"...Set Up..NO PROBLEM..we soon learned to fasten things down so Dynamite wouldn't shift 'em..before tickling them with fifty plus Horsepower. Whats left?..the FEED rate..you know, how many thou per tooth per rev..I have absolutely NO IDEA until all the other factors start inter-acting and the whole stage play gets into the dress rehersal. Curtain up time, light a fresh fag and take a last swig of cold tea. Lights, curtain.. One last check around...spindle clear, feed disengaged, SAFETY CHECK..these machines are NOT fitted with an "OUCH" switch. No "oily rags" about (apprentices rubbernecking) No laborer shoveling chips out of the back of the machine. Bootlaces tied, floor clean and dry..two or three clear escape routes..nothing to trip or fall over. Did I mention safety glasses? Safety WHAT?? Deep breath. Concentrate. Start spindle. Coolant, GENTLY feed cutter into job BY HAND. Feel the cut, feel the whole set up shuddering and settling into equilibrium as the cutter digs deeper and the motor starts to push some serious horspower into its job slowly build up the hand feed rate until the cutter is "Buried"..In full depth and width. Continue to gradually increase the feed rate, as every sense and instict strains for any sign of trouble. So far so good..you figured the right starting points..now you and the machine begin to understand each other and trust starts to grow..We are NOT going to hurt each other or let each other down are we!!!..Still gradually increasing the hand feed pressure..the machine, now all the slack is taken up, all the castings have bent and bedded into unity..is READY!! Quick check of the chips, cutter seems happy coolant flow good...You're READY. NOW!! Lets show them what we REALLY CAN DO!! start to crank the feed faster and faster until you feel that first shuuder of discomfort..back off a bit...engage power feed and crank the selector handle fast until you start to feel the power feed catch up with and overtake your hand feed. Ease off on the crank handle..let the machine take over..But don't let go yet..Every sense organ is tuned in as the machine settles down to a steady pace after its quick acceleration..everything feels, sounds, smells, good....turn up the feed another notch..settles down..happy..turn it another...settles happy...turn it another,,machine grunts..unhappy..turn it back...happy. You just arrived at the CORRECT FEED PER TOOTH !!!! Slowly you relax, letting your hands creep away from the knobs and handles..the machine munches on..in equilibrium..chips and coolant sound like frying bacon..machine is bunched into and happy with its job. You turn to find the cigarette..after that first puff..has burned away. Light another. wipe your hands..gradually your senses retreat from the machine. as it does what it does best..shifting metal. You have a bond of trust now. You and that Machine. It will let you know in good time..in your secret language..if something start to go amiss. It trusts you, to hear and respond, before any harm befalls it. You are a team now..both doing the job you do best. Now you realise your throat is dry!! no cold tea left, check the clock check the job...ten minutes left "in cut", before you need to stop and replace the workpiece. You turn, and without a backward glance, you stride confidently toward the canteen for a welcome "cuppa" On the way we happen to meet.."Hey Robert" you ask "what feed rate are you using on that job?" "Haven't a clue" say I "go check the dials..I'm off for a cuppa!!" It may not be the answer you want Brian..But I'm afraid it's the only one I can give you! Happy milling. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Metal sculptures From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 03 Feb 1999 03:25:28 GMT -------- Hey Wanda, if you like metal in ANY of its multitude of forms you ARE in the right place and welcome here. Not many of us know much about glass/cera...Hey better shut my Big mouth What people on the list know about never ceases to amaze me!! So feel free to stick around "Lurk" if you want to..weigh in if you feel like it..ask questions and more questions. Hey, you teach us about YOUR metal and we'll teach you about OURS. DEAL? Robert Bastow Wanda Thomas wrote: > > Boy, I see all this stuff about belt pulleys and lathes and I think I'm > in the wrong group, but let me try my question anyway... > > I saw advertised in a catalog some metal sculptures (copper) with a > ceramic glass finish on some of the metal parts. The ad said they were > made in Connecticut. Does anyone have any info, web sites, email or > anything where I can get more info on these? > > My apologies if this is not the correct group.... > > -- > Extinct is forever, > > Wanda Thomas > > http://members.xoom.com/wandathomas > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > "You can't keep a bird from landing on your head... > But you can keep it from building a nest there. -- Mom > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: eBay Humor & 1200 tons of steel From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 03 Feb 1999 03:31:27 GMT -------- Hey Tom, I had seen it but didn't quite think I could swing the whole deal myself! But hey Good Buddy..if you're in that's good enough for me..count on me for a corner. If you want the majority I'm sure we can find somebody willing to take the other 25 cents. Robert AZOTIC wrote: > > I was just scanning ebay and thought this might be of interest > > Item # 60932789 > > Ad reads: > > 1200 tons of steel ready to ship. > > no reserve, current bid $1.20 > > Maybe someone could buy it for $2.00 and make some money. > > Best Regards > Tom. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Way Oil..The Kiss of Death! From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 03 Feb 1999 03:53:53 GMT -------- Ooohh! sounds like a sore nerve was hit here! An almost credible response from a guy who (It just so happens) seems to make a living from selling this stuff. Hey this can really be relied on as ballanced Warren Lemoi wrote: > Snip a whole lot of smooth but irrelevant technical stuff about what way lubes are supposed to do and how they do it. Hey if you read my post without that purple haze of rage in front of you you might have noticed I didn't raise a single objection to the stuff in the right application I have bought and used thousands of gallons of the stuff. Buddy when you only got one shot you had better aim it at the right target!! > Luvox 300mg q day should help. And right there, Mister Lemoi, is where you lost not only the argument..but the right to a fair hearing if I know this group. Certainly you lowered youself to a level that I will not descend to so this discussion is over! Grow up, learn some manners and in a few years lets talk again. You are dismissed. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: what size level do I need From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 03 Feb 1999 05:18:04 GMT -------- I have to second Jims thoughts on this..level is nice, but it is TURNING results that count in the end. You can set up to levels and test bars all day long.. but until you cut metal and measure THOSE results you truly have nothing but a guess and by golly as to how all the different bits interact DYNAMICALLY! Robert Bastow > I just use a 6 inch carpenter's level when I start to set machines > up. Just because I don't like the tools rolling around in the chip > pan. After that, I use the collars on the test bar. > > Have fun with your new toy! > > Jim > > -----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==---------- > http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Way Oil..The Kiss of Death! From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 03 Feb 1999 07:16:52 GMT -------- Warren Lemoi wrote: > (Snip irrelevancies) > I will post here no longer and let this die out. > -- PLONK ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Way Oil..The Kiss of Death! From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 03 Feb 1999 07:27:40 GMT -------- Jon Banquer wrote: > > >> Luvox 300mg q day should help. > > Is Luvox in the same class as Paxil and Prozac ? > Meaning, they both (I think) increase the saratonin (sp ?) > level to the brain. This make the neurons in your brain fire > faster or slower ? How about Zanex what does that do ? > > This area of medicine seems to have taken off. Lets see > if we can make this discussion semi-productive. Can you > fill me in on the details. > > jon > Er! excuse me Jon..but what the #$%& does this have to do with Way Oil, Metal working, or the price of tea in China for that matter!! It just so happens I have been on Seratonin uptake blockers for years as the result of lifelong, Clinical Depression and a Nervous Breakdown, This forum is a vital part of my therapy and I would rather not have you or anyone else cross post here on that particular subject. Go to alt. morbid medical curiosities.com, or someplace..ANY place, else with it. Yes..you touched, probably, the ONLY raw nerve I have in my Body!! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Speeds and feeds horizontal milling From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 03 Feb 1999 07:30:04 GMT -------- James P. Riser wrote: > > Robert; > Wonderful post! Thanks for the benefit of your experience. BTW - what kind > of oil were you using on that machine? 8-) > Jim Back off Jim..Back off ;^) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What's wrong with way oil? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 03 Feb 1999 08:33:08 GMT -------- Thanks for you polite posting Jim. It deserves a polite response. I think (obviously) a lot of people are missing the whole crux of my viewpoint..the use of way oil in the HOME SHOP and particularly in MY SHOP. I am well aware as I have stated several times, of the properties, purposes and uses of way-oil..especially in industry and especially in machines designed to use it. Our late lamented and dear departed recent snide-sniper made a fuss about Stick-slip. I was doing stick slip research on early, hardwired NC machine tools thirty years ago. It is a major problem with machine tools that can be and often are, programmed to move tons of weight by steps of a tenth of a thou. But on a Bridgeport mill or a South bend lathe..I doubt you could detect it..neaver mind measure it. My research was done on forty ton BROADBENT Oil Country Lathe..30 inches THROUGH the headstock. I found those skinny little slip-sticks pretty elusive!! It is STICKY to stay on vertical surfaces and to maintain a film under EXTREME pressure ADMIRABLE!! But my Maximat Super II don't have non o' they vermiculite...vermita..that wot you said, faces. And Bridgeports sure don't exert the kind of unit surface pressures he is talking about. But you touched on the down side Jim. Dust! it isn't chips that wreck machines it is the constant lapping away of vital metal surfaces by entrapped abrasive DUST particles. I have "Opened up" countless, ruined machine slides and never found chips..they're too big to get in there. What I do find is a dark brown, abrasive, GUNK, that results from a mixture of way oil, rancid residue from soluble cutting oils (Won't use them either..so there) plus Iron Oxide! Iron Oxide? yeh..you know...Rust..Caused by soluble oils, the scale off hot rolled steel, the skin off iron castings and that batch of rusty pipe fittings you machined last year. Anyone know another name for Iron oxide..ground very fine?..did I hear "Jewellers Rouge"? thats right..it is a helluva good abrasive, Now, Jim, I want to machine some hot rolled steel today. Clean the machine down, wipe the ways clean and apply a fresh coating of that nice gentleman's thick, gooey, sticky, extreme pressure, Way-Oil on all the ways we can find. Ain't gonna be no starved bearig surfaces or those invidious little stick-slips aroun my lathe Jim. Wow this stuff is really tenacious..see how even those new wipers can't scrape it off the bedways..they just ride right over it and leave a nice thin film to go ALL the way under the slides. Let's cut metal Jim, I love machining that good hot rolled stuff..lots easier than cold rolled. My only beef is that reddish dust that comes off it. I wonder what it is? OK stay with me on this one Jim..where is that dust going? Yeh, right all over the place...but some of it falls on that nice film of sticky oil that is protecting our bed ways. Then the wipers will wipe it off so it doesn't get into the slides? NOoo this stuff is designed to be almost unwipeable.. So the dusty oil goes into the slides and then you clean it out?.. NO..once those tiny but sharp and hard little boogers get in there..you cant get at them. Anyway, they just love to snuggle up between those smooth steel and iron surfaces and just kinda burrow in there. Isn't that kinda like a LAP?? Sure is Jim!! Hey why don't we go and do this stuff on Your lathe Jim? Drop dead Robert!! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Help identify this lathe and win a cheese From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 03 Feb 1999 21:51:22 GMT -------- PLAlbrecht wrote: > > Hey, you didn't say if anybody won the cheese. By the way, what kind of cheese > is it? > > Red Leicester? (afraid we're fresh out...) > Tilsit? (Never at the end of the week) > Caerphilly? (been on order for two weeks) (snip.Mouthwatering list of some of the world's finest cheeses) > What cheese DO you have then? > > Pete Hey Pete, you must shop at the same store that I do. Their Idea of an "International Cheese Counter" has : 10 varieties of (processed) Brie, but no Camambert 20 varieties of Danish Blue, but no Roquefort 100 varieties of red plastic coated Edam..UGH!!..for which there IS no Upmarket equivalent. I swear that Edam was developed as a wartime substitute for rubber..but somehow along the way the flavor got WORSE!! Robert Bastow Who would Kill for a bit of Caerphilly , Lancashire or Wensleydale! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Way Oil..The Kiss of Death! From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 03 Feb 1999 22:11:01 GMT -------- Finally found a way to get a nasty dig in did you Kurt?? I make it a rule however never to fight in the mud with a pig... You both get dirty but the Pig enjoys it. However I have another rule never to let a lie or a slur go unanswered lest it be construed as the truth by others. You my friend are not telling the truth and I am going to dig out the correspondence we had on this subject, several months ago..before I, on several occassions,made you look the Idiot you are. I have been asked this same question many times by current members of this list..so don't imagine that you go un-noticed. Meanwhile I am going to ask Fred..to whom I had already responded on his private request..to please post that answer here for all to see. Kurt, I feel sorry for you because I know you are not man enough to retract that remark or apologise. So I will consider our once harmononious relationship at at am end and trust you will enjoy your.. PLONK Cordially Robert Bastow Meanwhile I am going to ask Kurt Bjorn wrote: > > No, I already asked this question. He simply ripped off the guy's pen name. > > -- > Guy Lautard > > VICTORCAP wrote in message <19990203150601.10998.00000050@ng58.aol.com>... > >are you "the" Tubal Cain, author of all the wonderful books on model > >engineering that have brought me so much pleasure over the years? > >thanks, > >fred ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 8mm / WW tap From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 03 Feb 1999 22:17:06 GMT -------- Thanks Steve, I will "fold "this in with the information I continue to collect and hope one day..we may never "Rationalise" it all but at least we may have some reliable documentation. Robert Bastow Steve Rayner wrote: > > The dimensions that I use for 8MM collets, came from an old table > published in the Model Engineer Plans Book years ago. They match the > dimensions of the Boley collets I have. The threads of the Wolfjahns > collets fit my Boley drawbar, but the collet body is slightly too big for > the Boley headstock. I expect that it was a marketing thing! The > Wolfjahns collets were much less costly than Boley. I suspect that each > lathe maker was trying to force the use of their own accessories. I > suspect that my Wolfjahns mandrel was polished down to fit the Boley. > ............Ok! I just removed the ring chuck from the lathe, it too is > Wolfjahns. Some years ago a friend tried his chuck of this make in my > lathe, and it was too fat. It also didn't fit any of the three Boley > Standard lathes he had. > > Robert Bastow (Tubal_cain@hotmail.com) wrote: > : As you can see..it is a real can of worms!! > > : Let me know (directly too please Steve) what you come up with so I can correlate > : it with information from other sources. > > : Three "Reliable" reference sources have come up with three, significantly > : different sets of dimensions for 8mm Boleys and WW collets from different makers > : in the US. > > : Thanks, > > : Robert > > : Steve Rayner wrote: > : > > : > > : > > : > Please note that some Wolfjahns collets will NOT fit well in a Boley > : > lathe! The Wolfjahns Mandrell ( Faceplate ) will fit my Boley, but the few > : > collets I have won't. Fortunately I have a complete set of Boley collets > : > in wire sizes, as well as wax chucks & step chucks. I will have to dig out > : > the six jaw ring chuck, and see what make it is. > : > > : > Robert Bastow (Tubal_cain@hotmail.com) wrote: > : > : It appears I made an error in the metric equivalent of the WW thread. > : > > : > : Somehow, I equated 40 tpi with 40thou which equals 1mm pitch! > : > > : > : DUH!! > : > > : > : 40 tpi = 0.625mm pitch > : > > : > : The correct "American" thread for WW collet DRAWBARS** is, according to the > : > : Levin catalogue, faxed to me two days ago: > : > > : > : Catalogue No 0031-01 Drawbar Tap Type WW 0.275-40tpi NS GH2 > : > > : > : No they didn't quote prices!! > : > > : > : **Note this is for Drawbars NOT necessarily the correct spec for male threads > : > : cut on collets etc. > : > > : > : I say this because it is known that the WW threads are originally an anglicized > : > : version of the original 8mm European sizes..of which there are MANY..most of > : > : which are interchangeable with WW collets, drawbars etc. > : > > : > : It is also known that, in order to facilitate this interchangeability..drawbar > : > : threads are purposely cut to maximum sizes > : > > : > : Thus, if you have a drawbar tapped to the above spec..either .275-40 tpi H2 or > : > : the equivalent metric size 6mm x .625mm you can use WW or 8mm collets in it from > : > : all the following manufacturers..my sizes are taken from "the Model Engineers > : > : Handbook" by ..Tubal Cain..the other guy..the REAL ONE as someone said!! > : > > : > : 8mm collets from Adams, Boley, Boley-Leinen, Coronet, Derbyshire, Pultra and WW > : > : are all threaded 0.268-40 and will all be a fairly sloppy fit in your > : > : drawtube. > : > > : > : 8mm collets from Wolf-Jahn are threaded 0.270-40 and will be a little tighter in > : > : your WW drawtube > : > > : > : 8mm collets from I.M.E. and LORCH are threaded 0.275-40 (6mm-.0625) and will be > : > : a fairly snug fit in your drawbar. > : > > : > : Now I uderstand the significance of Levin's blurb on the taps "these taps offer > : > : a convenient means of producing the matching threads WITH THE APPROPRIATE THREAD > : > : CLEARANCES" (Caps are mine) > : > > : > : What is the point of all the above? > : > > : > : Somewhat selfish..but hopefully helpful to those who have or contemplate buying > : > : a watchmaker's or other WW/8mm lathe in future. High quality collets of these > : > : types ar BRUTALLY expensive to buy new. I an most others will collect them > : > : slowly, from a variety of sources and be confronted with a whole slew of > : > : different manufacturers..as above, plus many, many more, > : > > : > : It will be a comfort to know that a mixed batch of collets..Boley, Lorch, > : > : Levin, WW, etc. will ALL fit my Levin Lathe and that I can make a drawbar that > : > : will accomodate them all. > : > > : > : My detailed interest in WW collets started over a year ago when I first > : > : contemplated using them in a Quorn type grinding spindle. In setting out to get > : > : dimensions ...just of WW collets I ran into a quagmire of conflicting and > : > : simply, missing information. It took until now for me to analyse all the bits > : > : and pieces and be able to set it down as above. > : > > : > : I hope someone else will find it just as useful one day. > : > > : > : Robert Bastow > : > > : > -- > : > > : > I'm a Canadian eh! Steve. > : > ************************************************************************** > : > The FAQ for rec.crafts.metalworking is at: http://w3.uwyo.edu/~metal > : > The metalworking drop box is at http://208.213.200.132 > : > ************************************************************************** > : > Visit my website at: http://www.victoria.tc.ca/~ud233/homepage.htm > : > > : > ************* Tu ne cede malis, sed contra audentior ito. **************** > : > ******************************** - Virgil ******************************** > : > ******Yield thou not to adversity, but press on the more bravely.********** > > -- > > I'm a Canadian eh! Steve. > ************************************************************************** > The FAQ for rec.crafts.metalworking is at: http://w3.uwyo.edu/~metal > The metalworking drop box is at http://208.213.200.132 > ************************************************************************** > Visit my website at: http://www.victoria.tc.ca/~ud233/homepage.htm > > ************* Tu ne cede malis, sed contra audentior ito. **************** > ******************************** - Virgil ******************************** > ******Yield thou not to adversity, but press on the more bravely.********** ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Way Oil..The Kiss of Death! From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 03 Feb 1999 22:27:18 GMT -------- Thanks Mike, a friend indeed. By the way the "tubalcain" is in lower case in DEFERENCE as well as "IN MEMORIAM" to that Great Mentor. Further, I never "sign" myself as such. What matter, 'tis of no import to me whether Kurt " Guy Lautard" Bjorn tells the truth or not. Enough of the people I REALLY care about know the the TRUE story and understand my motives. Sincerely, Robert Bastow Mike Graham wrote: > > "Kurt Bjorn" wrote: > > >No, I already asked this question. He simply ripped off the guy's pen name. > > > >-- > >Guy Lautard > > Why is it that "Kurt Bjorn" who signs his messages "Guy Lautard" has > a hard time with Robert Bastow using the name Tubal Cain in memory of > the original? > > Mike Graham mike@headwaters.com > > Mangler of metal. User of many grinding disks. > Cut with an axe, beat to fit, paint to match. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Graziano SAG180 info please From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 03 Feb 1999 22:37:04 GMT -------- Ole-Hjalmar Kristensen wrote: > Try http://www.graziano.it > > I believe the quality of the Graziano lathes is very good in general. > -- > E pluribus Unix It is indeed a VERY high quality lathe in the best "toolroom" tradition. I had a couple in one of my own shops. The only downside is..(surprise)..The cost and availability of spare parts. But then again..They don't break often!! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Help identify this lathe and win a cheese From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 04 Feb 1999 04:08:19 GMT -------- Hi Lennie, With your obvious and undoubted enthusiasm..plus the fact that people buy a TON...make that SH*T LOAD of Edam even my opinionated and, admitedly biased sensibilitis tell me ..I must be MISSING something here!! What is it..and where can I get an Edam Cheese that is representative of the BEST?? I will give you that point if you promise to let me then reach my own PERSONAL taste conclusions!! DEAL? Robert Bastow Lennie the Lurker wrote: > > In article <36B773CA.5E3F5730@hotmail.com>, > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > > I swear that Edam was developed as a wartime substitute for rubber..but > somehow > > along the way the flavor got WORSE!! > > > > Robert Bastow > > > > Who would Kill for a bit of Caerphilly , Lancashire or Wensleydale! > > > > I'll take my Edam smoked, but only from Verne's in Wisconsin, must have good > liversausage from Milwaukee, and fresh coffee. Followed three days later > with a good way oil enema to get rid of it. Almost forgot, make that on rye > bread from Paiellis danish bakery(?). > > Richard > > "Measure with Micrometer" > "Mark with crayon" > "Cut with axe" > http://homestead.dejanews.com/user.rabue/index.html > > -----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==---------- > http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Ebay and intelligence of bidders? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 04 Feb 1999 04:41:10 GMT -------- As apprentices we were brain > washed into doing everything the 'Gov'mnt' way. > Often made me wonder if every time we went to the bog we were breaking some rule > by destroying Gov'mnt property. > -- > > Regards, > > John Stevenson > No John!! You were OK so long as you stuck to "Government Guidelines and Allowances" YOLUME 3392 (edition 19 rev 304).. ChVIIIpviipara5sec.xxviiivix subsection243page97para.51,line2 297ff.... And I quote.. "Three Sheets per Man, per Day" ...One UP.. ...One DOWN.. ...And One ACROSS...To POLISH!!! Remember the stuff you had to scrub between your knuckles to avoid friction burns and paper cuts? There was a downside when I moved here though! I couldn't break that..."pre-conditioning..Scrub between the Knuckles"...habit for a couple of weeks... until I realised I didn't need to do that with the local stuff!! Plus the fact..If I desisted, I need not spend half my day trying to extract my middle finger from my Fundament!! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Way Oil..The Kiss of Death! From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 04 Feb 1999 05:05:55 GMT -------- Jens wrote: > > Robert, if you keep plonking people you will soon be talking to > yourself. Seems I have seen the 'plonk' numerous times from you in the > past little while. > > Jens PLONK!! ;^) And I mean that only HALF seriously Jens!! You have in the past earned my respect..but comments like that make me wonder if you are part of the solution..or by wimpy default, becoming part of the problem!! It is easy to say "lighten up" when you are a bystander, not subject to PERSONAL atack and abuse every time you come up with a bit of helpful advise, hard earned experience Seriously Jens, It seems like every time anyone comes up with any original thought around here, he publishes with the certain knowledge that the first reaction from "The Intelligentsia" is to imply you are a mental defective, uneducated lying, thieving, old fart!! I remember, not too long ago, when this was a fun place to be and, when the tone deteriated too far there were certain fair minded people that could be relied on to restore sanity. You USED to be one of those people Jens! Robert Bastow (tubalcain to anyone who gives a SHIT anymore) PLONK ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Cutting thick rubber gaskets? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 04 Feb 1999 17:10:30 GMT -------- Depending on quantity, a "Rule" die might be a good investment. Ask your local printer where he gets his. Robert Bastow Michael P. Henry wrote: > > At work we need to make some gaskets out of 1/4" thick rubber. They'll be > about 7" x 10" with some 3/8" holes, some slots and a 4" x 6" hole in the > center and we'll need about 10-20 of them. > > Is it worth trying to locate someone (preferably in the Chicago area) that > cut these for us with a die or should we just try to make them ourselves > with an Exacto knife or something similar? > > TIA Michael P. Henry wrote: > > At work we need to make some gaskets out of 1/4" thick rubber. They'll be > about 7" x 10" with some 3/8" holes, some slots and a 4" x 6" hole in the > center and we'll need about 10-20 of them. > > Is it worth trying to locate someone (preferably in the Chicago area) that > cut these for us with a die or should we just try to make them ourselves > with an Exacto knife or something similar? > > TIA ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Maximat Super II From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 04 Feb 1999 17:38:23 GMT -------- Can anyone out there with a Maximat Super II give me dimensions for the leadscrew brass shear pin. I know th o/d and length but need to know if it is "knecked" and how deeply. I discovered that mine had been replaced with a STEEL pin only AFTER I stripped the teeth off a VERY expensive 127t conversion gear! Ouch! Thanks, Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re:an end to bickering From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 04 Feb 1999 21:28:10 GMT -------- Rudy, I whole heartedly agree..certainly it has taken all the fun out of this ng for me. I therefore wholeheartedly offer my apologies to those I offended and hope they will accept and forgive Secondly, though *I* know my motives were pure in adopting the name of tubalcain "In memorium" I can well see how others might misconstrue..even resent this. After all Tubal Cain is a legend to a lot of us, and even if I had aspirations to fill his shoes (which I do NOT)..they are certainly too big for me. So this is the last post from tubal_cain@hotmail.com. Sorry you don't get rid of ME that easily though. My new address will be: teenut@Hotmail.com If anyone has any objections to THAT please let me know. Thanks, Robert Bastow Rudy Kohoupt wrote: > > Boys! Boys! > > Stop this foolish bickering! We're here because of our mutual love of > machining, metalworking, and ingenious design. We solve problems, not > start them. ======== To: Jens Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: an end to bickering From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 04 Feb 1999 22:41:08 GMT -------- Just what I might have expected from you Jens ;^) Jens wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > My new address will be: > > > > teenut@Hotmail.com > > > >If anyone has any objections to THAT please let me know. > > What ???? Take our beloved tee nuts name in vain ..... shame on you > Robert :) > > Jens > > PS.: Sorry, couldn't resist .... ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Clausing 6300 series lathe From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 05 Feb 1999 04:24:49 GMT -------- IIRC Morse 4 1/2 is quite common as it is used on Southbends..certainly the 13" model with D1-3 camlock nose I come across them more frequently than the 5 MT stuff I need for my maximat Murphy's Law I suppose. What are you looking for? (I missed the first part of the thread) I may be able to point you in the right direction. Robert Bastow > Daniel Becker wrote: > > > snip > > The factory told me that the head stock is a Morse taper 4 1/2. Where do I > > find such an animal? > > Turn it on your lathe. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Clausing 6300 series lathe From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 05 Feb 1999 04:26:07 GMT -------- IIRC Morse 4 1/2 is quite common as it is used on Southbends..certainly the 13" model with D1-3 camlock nose I come across them more frequently than the 5 MT stuff I need for my Maximat. Murphy's Law I suppose. What are you looking for? (I missed the first part of the thread) I may be able to point you in the right direction. Robert Bastow > Daniel Becker wrote: > > > snip > > The factory told me that the head stock is a Morse taper 4 1/2. Where do I > > find such an animal? > > Turn it on your lathe. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Snowed IN!!! From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 05 Feb 1999 14:31:08 GMT -------- > Everything worked fine until some day on the test stand > in the lab, the computer decided at 140 mph that it were time to > shift to bottom gear, and shifted to bottom gear. Brings to mind the recent string on "Idiot Proofing" The Jaguar has, what they call a "J Gate" Shifter... P 2 R 3 N D < D In the right hand leg of the "J" you have a standard 4 speed shifter, kick down + "sports" setting etc. Flip the shifter over to the left hand gate and you have an automatic "manual" gearbox at hand. All very versatile, smooth, etc. One Day, threading my way through medium heavy, fast moving traffic, I had been in and out of "manual" a few times. I saw a suitable gap, indicated left to change lanes and slammed the shifter into "3", flooring the gas at the same time. You guessed it!! Wrong gate!! 2 tons of V12 goes into REVERSE at 65 mph!!...It makes quite a big cloud of tire smoke. I took it into the dealer for a check out...no damage (except my pride) "happens all the time" the guy said!! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Spanish Inquisition From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 05 Feb 1999 15:54:23 GMT -------- You're BAD, Bill! BAAAAD!! Robert Bastow Bill Machrone wrote: > > Jens wrote: > > > or put up a real ugly gigantic wooden building from scrap lumber found > > in the town dump > > This is strongly reminiscent of a "spite fence." My father built a > classic spite fence after our > clueless-city-bred-former-apartment-dweller neighbor put in central air, > with a heat exchanger that exhausted horizontally--right at our screened > back porch. In post-WW II suburbia, on 75 by 100 lots, you could feel > the heat. > > The fence was a sight to behold: Wood of every color and kind. Peeling > plywood. Rec-room paneling. Two-bys. Four-bys. Rough tongue-and-groove > flooring. Wedges driven into the earth. A sheet of aluminum. Some > galvanized ducting opened and hammered flat. A piece of corrugated > fiberglass. Big nails, bent over. Rusty sheet metal screws. > > This from a master craftsman who enjoyed working to "half a tenth" and > used to make me practice filing brass and driving nails. > > The neighbor came over, wanted to know what all the fuss was about. Dad > refused to tell him--told him to figure it out for himself. Dad could > have put a lot less effort into making a 90 degree deflector out of > sheet metal for the thing, and it would have looked factory. But > retribution for the neighbor's inconsiderateness was more important, at > least to Dad. > > The neighbor was an optometrist by trade, but had no interest in or > orientation to the physical/mechanical world beyond eyeglasses. > Optometry was a respectable profession for a nice Jewish boy from the > Bronx, and it began and ended there. > > When I was a teenager, the same neighbor got spotlights for his driveway > and aimed them more at the side of our house than at the driveway. They > shone directly into my 3rd-story window. I asked him to re-aim them (not > quite as taciturn as Dad) a couple of times, then re-aimed them myself > one night when he failed to. They illuminated the driveway much better > after I was done. > > To my everlasting surprise, he had the electrician come back to his > house the following weekend to install a new dual-spotlight > fixture--with tamper-resistant screws--aimed at the side of our house! I > guess he was trying for maximum ground coverage, but from lights that > were only about 7 feet off the ground, and somehow the photons didn't > know enough to stop at the property line. > > I took a page from my old man's book and hung a bedsheet from my window, > upon which was painted, "Jesus Loves You." > > My mother had a fit (when she could supress the laughter), but I > wouldn't take it down. > > The electrician came back and re-aimed the lights. > > - Bill ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Set up and levelling From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 05 Feb 1999 20:16:08 GMT -------- In the FINAL analysis you can't. But you can go along way to having a good understanding. The turning test is the final "proof of the pudding" In my time I have installed scores of lathes and other machine tools. Yes, we would go throught all the static tests with sensitive levels and test bars etc. But I never once yet met a machine shop owner or plant manager sign off on a machine and accept the invoice, without seing it "Cut Metal" The tendence is, as home shop machinists, especially people new to the business, to think that a lathe, because it is "heavy" and made out of "Metal" is a rigid chunk. That the only difference between "Static" and "Dynamic" is "Movement". Nothing could be further from the truth. First of all, there is nothing that is perfectly flat,level, round, rigid, square or straight. It is all degrees of the above. In real terms, the bed of a typical HSM lathe is aboud as rigid as a wet noodle. I have learned not to stick my neck out here, even to play "devils advocate" But am as sure as I can be that if you were to set up a brand new example of such a lathe,to be perfectly level and statically aligned, you would be left wondering where the problem was when you did a machining test! Why? A ton of reasons. Differential expansion of the headstock and PART of the bed as things warm up. Twisting of the bed as you tighten the tailstock down. Even more twisting as the carriage with its lop-sided weight and offset thrust vectors starts traversing down the bed. Can you stop this? No! Can you work around it? Definitely! Just a tweak of the cross level may bring the "Cut Metal" result WITHIN ACCEPTABLE PARAMETERS!!! What are those parameters? You tell me, it's your lathe and you are paying the tab. Press hard..You're making three copies! ;^) Robert Bastow J. Reid wrote: > > Yes lots of things interact. So how to tell if problems are caused by way > twist or wear,headstock cant or tailstock centering? > Can these effects offset each other in the test operation but cause > trouble later? > > On Wed, 3 Feb 1999, Robert Bastow wrote: > > > I have to second Jims thoughts on this..level is nice, but it is TURNING results > > that count in the end. > > > > You can set up to levels and test bars all day long.. but until you cut metal > > and measure THOSE results you truly have nothing but a guess and by golly as to > > how all the different bits interact DYNAMICALLY! > > > > Robert Bastow > > > > > > > I just use a 6 inch carpenter's level when I start to set machines > > > up. Just because I don't like the tools rolling around in the chip > > > pan. After that, I use the collars on the test bar. > > > > > > Have fun with your new toy! > > > > > > Jim > > > > > > -----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==---------- > > > http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own > > > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: The Feel-Good Zone From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 05 Feb 1999 20:24:54 GMT -------- As Urban (or Rural) Legends go this is as hoary as Jack Frost!! I still squirm a bit..And laugh my socks off every time it comes up!! Thanks, Bruce. 8^) Bruce Closs wrote: > > Wanna feel better? Read this one. > > [Arkansas Democrat gazette] Two local men were seriously injured when > their pick-up truck left the road and struck a tree near Cotton Patch on > State Highway 38 early Monday morning. Woodruff County deputy Dovey Snyder > reported the accident shortly after midnight Monday. Thurston Poole, 33, of > Des Arc, and Billy Ray Wallis, 38, of Little Rock, are listed in serious > condition at Baptist Medical Center. The accident occurred as the two men > were returning to Des Arc after a frogging trip. > On an overcast Sunday night, Poole's pick-up truck headlights > malfunctioned. The two men concluded that the headlight fuse on the older > model truck had burned out. As a replacement fuse was not available, Wallis > noticed that the bullet from his pistol fit perfectly into the fuse box next > to the steering wheel column. Upon inserting the bullet, the headlights > again began to operate properly, and the two men proceeded on east-bound > toward the White River bridge. After traveling approximately twenty miles > and just before crossing the > river, the bullet apparently overheated, discharged and struck Poole in the > right testicle. The vehicle swerved sharply to the right exiting the > pavement and striking a tree. Poole suffered only minor cuts and abrasions > from the accident, but will require surgery to repair the other wound. > Wallis sustained a broken clavicle and was treated and released. > "Thank God we weren't on that bridge when Thurston shot his balls off or > we might both be dead" stated Wallis. > "I've been a trooper for ten years in this part of the world, but this > is a first for me. I can't believe that those two would admit how this > accident happened", said Snyder. > Upon being notified of the wreck, Lavinia, Poole's wife asked how many > frogs the boys had caught and did anyone get them from the truck. > > There now, don't you just feel better? > > Bruce Closs > http://www.closs.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Butler 18 x 50 Lathe Info? From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 05 Feb 1999 20:28:13 GMT -------- Oldie but goodie if it is by Butlers of Halifax. (England) One of their portable bench top models no doubt! (They specialised in huge roll turning lathes, planers and vertical slotters. Scott Goodyear wrote: > > Does anyone have any information about a Butler 18 x 50 lathe? > > I've never heard of one, maybe someone in the group has. > > thanks > > Scott Goodyear > > goodyear@REMOVEvianet.on.ca ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Bridgeport benchtop mil? From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 05 Feb 1999 22:11:36 GMT -------- Jack Erbes wrote: > Wow!! The thing says these were built "Using just ordinary workshop > facilities at home...". That probably underscribes the casting and > machining used equipment pretty badly but probably the "least ordinary" > thing in the entire process were the gentlemans's skills and > dedication. > -- > Jack in Sonoma, CA, USA (jack@vom.com) Wish I had an "ordinary" machine shop too! Seriously though these are masterpieces of the art. I'm having to wipe drool from my keyboard. Maybe there IS something in a name. I remember a BILL Jordan..Member of the TISME group in Toronto. He built a couple of exquisit working models in 1/5 th and 1/4 scale IIRC of a Porsche flat four and a flat 6 cylinder racing engines. The latter had fully working fuel injection and was turbo-charged. Impressive little screamers they were at 24000 rev/min. Do any of our Canadian readers remember those engines and what became of them when Bill passed away? Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: "sphelter" metal From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 06 Feb 1999 03:38:46 GMT -------- "Spelter" is an old name for silver soldering or, more usually, brazing alloys. Robert Bastow Janusz Chris Terlecki wrote: > > Hi, > > Does anyone knows what type of alloy is called "sphelter" metal. Your > help would be greatly apprectiated. Thank you in advance for your > reply. > > Chris ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: New truck on its way. From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 06 Feb 1999 05:53:33 GMT -------- A POX on you Lee..Now I have beer all over my monitor and keyboard!! Robert Bastow Lee Marshall wrote: > > One of the reasons that they never built wrist-watches in the UK is that they > couldn't figure out where to put the drip pan! :-) > > Lee > > Jim Stewart wrote: > > > Alan Wood wrote: > > > > > > Has anyone assayed the North Sea oil to determine it's origins? Given > > > the reports of motorcycle oil leaks in Britain I have to wonder if this is > > > really just were all the MotorCycle oil accumalates after leaking out.... > > > > It was common knowledge in the '70s that the North Sea oil fields were > > created by disgusted Norton (pronounced "not-run") owners flinging their > > mounts into the sea... > > > > -js > > > > -- > > > > http://www.strappe.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How'ed they do that? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 06 Feb 1999 06:05:21 GMT -------- The old way was to drill the holes in a "straight flte" forged blank, which was then twisted to form the helix, befor machining, heated treating and finish grinding. The new way is to investment cast, or isostatic press from powdered metal, to near net shape. Robert Bastow Danny Hopping wrote: > > I have in my possession a drill bit that is about a foot long. > The top of the bit has had the shaft reamed to form a hole about 1/2" > deep with about 1/16" wall thickness. (drill2.jpg) > Along the outer edge of the bored out hole are two 1/16" holes that > travel the entire length of the bit and appear at the business end of > the drill bit. (drill1.jpg) The two small holes are too close to the > edge to be cut stright through. > I am sure that this is used to pump coolent down to the bottom on the > drill bit, but how did thay make these holes? The holes definetely > appear to follow the twist of the bit, even at the top of the bit where > there is no spiral cutout. > The only marking on the bit are: > 23/64 PTD H42 USA > > http://www.baycoast.com/pics/drill1.jpg shows a photo of the business > end of the bit. > http://www.baycoast.com/pics/drill2.jpg shows a photo of the back end of > the drill bit. > > I think I picked this bit up at a government auction a few years back > but never used it or even looked at it until today?? > I know it's not magic but it looks like it! > How'ed they do that? > > Thanks, > Danny ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Why are my bored holes tapered? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 06 Feb 1999 16:21:24 GMT -------- This is what I refered to in my recent post on setting up. Because of inevitable clearances and thrust vectors working in differnt ways...if you think about it..it is virtually impossible for a lathe to both turn an o/d AND bore a hole that are both dead nuts. The age condition setup etc., only determine the DEGREE to which this becomes a problem. As I said before, it is a compromise, and a compromise that only you can determine. My lathe is pretty "tight" and I have chosen to set it up so that it will bore "dead nuts" at the expense of having it cut an external taper of 0.0001 to 0.0003" on an unsupported external diameter of about 3"in length. This is the maximum length that I am likely to cut without tailstock support. Anything longer gets it, as does anything shorter, if it is thin and/or I need more accuracy. My philosophy on this, is simply that it is more difficult to correct a tapered bore, and a few rubs with emery paper will easily take off a few tenths of external taper. Likewise you CANNOT use T/S support to correct internal taper. Yer pays yer money, yer takes yer choice!! Robert Bastow Larry Meile wrote: > > I have an old Atlas 6" engine lathe with flat ways and plain bearings. > When I turn an outside diameter, I can get a six-inch or so cylinder > that is within a thousandth. If I mount a boring bar on the toolpost > and turn an inside diameter, it ends up tapered with the mouth about > three thousandths larger than the bottom of the hole. > > I have checked: > Play in the bearings. A dial indicator shows no visible slop on a > bar clamped in the chuck. > Play in the apron. A thousandth or two might show up here under > moderate (cutting) load. However, both cuts are taken in the same > direction. > Boring bar interference. I thought perhaps the boring bar had i > nsufficient clearance so that it was being deflected by the hole as > it entered the cut. This does not seem to be the case. > > What have I overlooked? > > Larry ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Question: Spindle Nose type From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 06 Feb 1999 19:45:30 GMT -------- What you have is a standard , long taper, spindle nose. It hase a key mounted on it right? I BELIEVE this is a LOO size, as used also on the Hardinge Toolroom lathes..No doubt some one will correct me if it is not the case. Right now there a re several chucks on ebay that might fit your machine. Robert Bastow Alan Inness wrote: > > Hi, > Anyone out there identify spindle nose types? > I recently picked up an Elliot Lathe (UK) older vintage, It did not come > with a backing plate and I am trying to identify the type# of the > spindle. The spindle is a through hole type and has a knurled ring which > uses a 'C' type wrench to tighten, the ring has a 4.5" female thread > (6tpi) to screw on to the chuck or back plate, the spindle itself has a > male taper, 3.25" at the back and 2.75" at the front. The chucks have a > 4.5" male thread and a female taper. > Does this conform to a common standard is am I looking at making > something up to suit? > Any information would be appreciated. > Thanks > Al Inness ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Question: Spindle Nose type From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 06 Feb 1999 19:46:50 GMT -------- Thank you Scott. Robert Bastow wrote: > I BELIEVE this is a LOO size, as used also on the Hardinge Toolroom lathes..No > doubt some one will correct me if it is not the case. > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: A challenge for the BEST of you. From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 08 Feb 1999 04:11:13 GMT -------- Your question was answered by several people Danny, The holes were drilled and then the "blank" was twisted, before HT and finishing!! Robert Bastow Danny Hopping wrote: > > OK, Now I am REALLY Curious! I put the following message up a few days > ago thinking that SOMEONE in the group would have the answer. I > received one response from someone who also did not know. It is really > that mysterious? One of you experienced people know how it was > accomplished. It's really got me intrigued. Here it is again. > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > I have in my possession a drill bit that is about a foot long. > The top of the bit has had the shaft reamed to form a hole about 1/2" > deep with about 1/16" wall thickness. (drill2.jpg) > Along the outer edge of the bored out hole are two 1/16" holes that > travel the entire length of the bit and appear at the business end of > the drill bit. (drill1.jpg) The two small holes are too close to the > edge to be cut straight through. > I am sure that this is used to pump coolant down to the bottom on the > drill bit, but how did they make these holes? The holes definitely > appear to follow the twist of the bit, even at the top of the bit where > there is no spiral cutout for the drill. > The steel is high quality looking and the edger of the drill are clearly > machined, so it does not appear to be a casting unless it was turned > down and then the drill twists machined in later. > > The only marking on the bit are: > 23/64 PTD H42 USA > > PHOTOS of the bit: > http://www.baycoast.com/pics/drill1.jpg shows a photo of the business > end of the bit. It shows one of the two holes clearly. > > http://www.baycoast.com/pics/drill2.jpg shows a photo of the back end of > > the drill bit. It also shows one of the two holes, the other hole is > directly opposite. > > I think I picked this bit up at a government auction a few years back > but never used it or even looked at it until today?? > I know it's not magic but it looks like it! > How'ed they do that? > > Thanks, > Danny ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: wobbly grinder From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 08 Feb 1999 04:16:02 GMT -------- Only one, How can you be assured that the welding will not embrittle the shaft..Resulting in rapid plastic surgery for the next user?? By all means, skim the shaft true, shrink or glue on a collar and face the result true. But stay away from welding please! Robert Bastow Jim Stewart wrote: > > I have a 20-year-old bench grinder with a lot of runout on both wheels. > Last weekend I attempted to square up the faces of the cup washers that > locate the wheel, but that didn't do much good. > > I've concluded that the problem is the shaft diameters: the outer end > of the shafts is 5/8" while the shaft in the motor is stepped up maybe > .200" in diameter. > > I figure this small step isn't enough to square the cup washers, hence > the side runout. > > I'm thinking of removing the shaft and armature, welding some flat > washers onto the shaft at the step, then squaring them between centers > in the lathe. > > Any thoughts? > > -js > > -- > > http://www.strappe.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: FS Chart Recorder, Flow Gauges From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 08 Feb 1999 04:21:31 GMT -------- MAN!!! That auction fever REALLY got to you huh!!! Robert Bastow Wayne Cook wrote: > > Well I got caught by the auction bug and had to go to one yesterday. > I managed ok but spent more money than I meant to and thus I need to > sell some of the stuff that it doesn't look like I'll need anytime > soon. > > Maybe someone is interested in some of this so I'll post it here > before putting it up on ebay. > > Item #1 is a Chart Recorder. It's made by Honeywell and takes a 12" > round chart. It's a pressure recording type and states a 200-400 psi > range on the tag (don't know for sure if that's just the max or is the > actually range) it takes 120V to run and looks like it's in new > condition. I'm not sure what it's worth but a smaller one in my old > McMaster-Carr catalog goes for nearly $300. I think that I'd like to > get $50 out of it but any reasonable offer will be considered. > > Item #2 is a flow gauge. It's a Brooks Instrument liquid flow gauge > that's got a scale going from 0-42.5 GPM (it's a rather large one). > It's fully protected inside a case with heavy sealed windows on two > sides. Looks like it takes a 1 1/2" pipe fitting on each end and has > been used. The closest thing I can find in MMC goes for over $400. I > think that $50 would be a bargain for this one. > > Item #3 is also a flow gauge. It's a smaller one than above but is > basically the same otherwise. It looks in new condition except that > someone has lost the shuttle out of it (one end cap is loose) and > there's a crack in one of the windows. It's rated 300 psi at 200 deg > F. It's got a scale going from 0-100 percent of flow. There's a > calibration tag on the side that states multiplying that with .014 > would read correct for a fluid of 1.0 SP. GR. at 70 deg. I don't know > where a shuttle could be found for this one but maybe somebody else > does. I guess just make me a offer on this one since it's not complete > and you would know what it's worth better than I would. > > I can supply model numbers and any other info desired on these. Just > e-mail me with asking me what you want to know and I'll get back to > you as soon as I can. > > Thanks. > > Wayne Cook > Shamrock TX ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: A challenge to the best of you. From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 08 Feb 1999 07:23:22 GMT -------- Danny, Grab the stick and pull it back!! ;^) Danny Hopping wrote: > > (Sorry this posted twice: My computer time stamp was off...) > > OK, Now I am REALLY Curious! I put the following message up a few days > ago thinking that SOMEONE in the group would have the answer. I > received one response from someone who also did not know. It is really > that mysterious? One of you experienced people know how it was > accomplished. It's really got me intrigued. Here it is again. > ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ > > I have in my possession a drill bit that is about a foot long. > The top of the bit has had the shaft reamed to form a hole about 1/2" > deep with about 1/16" wall thickness. (drill2.jpg) > Along the outer edge of the bored out hole are two 1/16" holes that > travel the entire length of the bit and appear at the business end of > the drill bit. (drill1.jpg) The two small holes are too close to the > edge to be cut straight through. > I am sure that this is used to pump coolant down to the bottom on the > drill bit, but how did they make these holes? The holes definitely > appear to follow the twist of the bit, even at the top of the bit where > there is no spiral cutout for the drill. > The steel is high quality looking and the edger of the drill are clearly > > machined, so it does not appear to be a casting unless it was turned > down and then the drill twists machined in later. > > The only marking on the bit are: > 23/64 PTD H42 USA > > PHOTOS of the bit: > http://www.baycoast.com/pics/drill1.jpg shows a photo of the business > end of the bit. It shows one of the two holes clearly. > > http://www.baycoast.com/pics/drill2.jpg shows a photo of the back end of > > the drill bit. It also shows one of the two holes, the other hole is > directly opposite. > > I think I picked this bit up at a government auction a few years back > but never used it or even looked at it until today?? > I know it's not magic but it looks like it! > How'ed they do that? > > Thanks, > Danny ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Test Bars Sag From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 08 Feb 1999 16:59:47 GMT -------- For this reason "Real" test bars are not solid. They are drilled out with a series of decreasing diameter drills, right up to the start of the taper shank. Thus they retain maximum stiffness with minimum weight. A plug is then shrunk in the open end, before machining, heat treatment and finish grinding. Robert Bastow Eric Taylor wrote: > > Connelly, in Machine Tool Reconditioning, says that a 1" x 12" steel > test bar, clamped at one end, will sag .00038" at the other end. I > need to figure the sag for other lengths and diameters. Specifically > right now, it's for my HF7x10, whose max chuck swallowing capacity is > 5/8". Would anyone know the general equation for sag, or simply (I can > use Connelly's figure a starting point) how the sag changes as a > function of length and diameter (exponential, square, cube, or ?) > > Thanks very much for any help. > > Eric > ======== To: mulligan@advinc.com Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Darn you Mr. Bastow! From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 08 Feb 1999 17:03:11 GMT -------- Just happy to be of help Jim!! ;^) Robert Bastow Who may be a fart...but I ain't THAT old!! mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > I will never be the same again. Here I was cutting the huge > piece of steel to use as the support for my new M head, and > as I cut the face off the end of it there was some rust there > which landed on the bed of the lathe. Whoops says I, better > get it right out of there. So I take my shopvac and wisk it > away. Robert would do that says I. > > Then after I made about a bucket full of blue chips I went to > clean the machine off. I wiped down the ways and then - horrors > I inspected the residue closely. Big mistake. Looked like it was > full of all kinds of trash and tiny abrasive particles. Damn > says I better wipe that all off. But now I know it's under those > ways. > > Probably never be able to sleep at night. I suspect that I am > degenerating into an old phart and if Mr Bastow had never made > the subliminal suggestion that I might be trashing the ways on > that lathe I would still be a happy man. > > Then again maybe I'm just turning into an old phart on my own. > At least the ways are clean now. > > Jim > > -----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==---------- > http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: A challenge to the best of you. From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 08 Feb 1999 21:07:31 GMT -------- Deep hole drilling (Gun Drilling) is an extremely accurate process. these holes would be no problem at all. Robert Bastow Spehro Pefhany wrote: > > the renowned Edward Stone wrote: > > could the drill been formed with the two small holes and then twisted > > then> hardened and then finnished by grinding the spirial fluts and the cutting > > edges? > > Since drilling two 1/16" holes a foot deep, close to the edge, sounds > unlikely, what about using two rectangular pieces with grooves in one, TIG > welding them together, annealing, twisting and then machining? Are the > small holes quite round or are they channels or semi-circles? > > -- > =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= > Spehro Pefhany "The Journey is the reward" > speff@interlog.com > Fax:(905) 271-9838 (small micro system devt hw/sw + mfg) > =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: ëÕÐÌÀ üöë!!!! From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 08 Feb 1999 21:09:33 GMT -------- He's ba-ack! max wrote: > > üöë-0Â22; á2 ËÌ. 2 > 712 - 820 ÉÌÉ 712 - 910 > obval@mgn.ru ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Delta Drill Press Spindle From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 09 Feb 1999 01:10:43 GMT -------- These sound like spindles from a multi-spindle drill head. This generally takes the form of a conical, open frame, wilh a geared multiple spindle drive at the top. The spindles have universal joint so they can be clamped on the bottom plate, in whatever pattern is desired. They also have a splined, sliding coupling arrangement, in order to accomodated different "spans". Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Got any hints on "deep hole drilling"? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 09 Feb 1999 03:31:57 GMT -------- Deep hole drilling was a specialty of one of my companies. If you will tell me the tolerance and finish you require, the acceptable runout and straightness and the equipment you have to work with, I might be able to give you some pointers. Is the material heat treated, normalised or annealed? Robert Bastow Jay McMunn wrote: > > It is my desire to drill a ~3/4" dia. hole through a pc. of 17-4PH > or 4140 that will be about 10" long. I do not want to drill a smaller > hole from each end, bore clear through, ream, etc. Deep hole > drilling would be the way to go but I lack expierence in the > process. > > thanx, > > Jay > jmcmunn@nidlink.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: A challenge for the BEST of you. From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 09 Feb 1999 05:54:52 GMT -------- The type of drill being discussed is NOT a "Gundrill" but is referred to as an "oil hole" or "oil feed" drill...A very different animal! And yes, they REALLY ARE produced by pre-drilling and twisting!! "Gun" drills don't have holes drilled down them!! A "traditional" gun drill is like a "D" bit and is brazed into the end of a "D" section tube. Oil is pumped under high pressure though the tube, it exits via a SHORT hole in the cutting bit and exits back up the outside of the tube carrying the chips with it. In actual fact, the tube and bit describe somewhat more than the half circle of a true "D" bit the actual section being nearer to 225 degrees and the tubes are given this section by roller swaging from round tubing. Commercially, this type of gundrill is available in sizes down to 0.050" and less. These drills are usually run on very precise, specialised Gundrilling machines although it is not difficult to adapt a standard center lathe to do the job. Speeds are high and feeds of the order of 0.0005" to 0.003" are the norm. Multiple spindle setups are common, indeed the operatio I observed drilling the twin holes in oil hole drill blanks, was done on a specially adapted ACME or NEW BRITAIN type of multispindle automatic lathe Each of the multiple stations had twin spindle gundrills such that there may be ten or twelve gun drills all doing their thing at the same time!! Ther are several othe deep hole systems..on of the better lnow being the Sandvik "Ejector" system. Here the tubes are circular and the head has three brazed carbide bearing pads, one of which also acts as the cutter. In this system the Cutter Head, is screwed by a multi start thread into a thickwalled outer tube. Inside this tube is a smaller, thinner walled tube. Oil at pressures from 300 to 1000psi and in great volume is pumped through the annular gap between the two tubes and exits through ports in the cutter head. Thence it returns via large throats in the cutter heads, flushing chips with it down the center of the inner tube. The name "Ejector" stems from the fact that, just before reaching the cutter head, a small proportion of the oil is bypassed straight into the inner tube via specially shaped, backward facing ports. This creats a venturi effect and greatly enhances the ability to "Eject" chips. Speeds and feeds are much faster..0.005 to 0.015" per revolution. The horsepower requirements, both for the workhead and the fluid pump is high. One such machine that I custom built to drill out, from solid steel forgings, the bodies of large jackhammers, had three independently controlled DC drive motors. The spindle had 50 HP the feed had 25HP and coolant pump had 75 HP!!! The 3 3/8 diameter x 21" deep hole, in preheat treated 48RC alloy steel was drilled in four minutes...floor to floor!! Lotsa chips..had a 1 1/2hp DC motor on the chip conveyor!! Robert Bastow mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article <36BD12E9.A15DC290@hotmail.com>, > Robert Bastow wrote: > > Your question was answered by several people Danny, > > > > The holes were drilled and then the "blank" was twisted, before HT and > > finishing!! > > Right, but now how did they gun drill the holes in the drill > that was used to drill the holes in the larger blank?? > > And please don't say they made two short blanks with short holes > and welded 'em end to end to make the long one! > > Jim > > -----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==---------- > http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How to true up chuck jaws From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 09 Feb 1999 06:13:51 GMT -------- This is the way that I was taught to do the job. Ie. by grinding a carefully calculated amount from each jaw, on a surface grinder. At that time I was given a simple geometric formula that, once you had taken a clean up skim off the jaws and replaced them in the chuck, all one needed to do was to indicate a test bar, determine the value of the maximum TIR AND its PRECISE angular position to say, jaw one. You then applied the formula and it told you EXACTLY how much to grind off each jaw in sequence. I have searched high and low for that formula without success. It is beyond my rusty math now, but I am sure one of our listers can figure it out on his trusty slip stick. ;^) Of course, all the caveats that Dave quotes about varying diameters and using different key sockets apply to this method as well as they do to any other. I got my very first Pratt-Burnerd "Grip-Tru" chuck a couple of weeks ago. THAT IS THE WAY TO GO!!!! Best investment I ever made and, strangely, given my background, the very first time I had ever used one. Am I ever a convert! Robert Bastow Dave Baker wrote: > Find a bit of bar in about the mid range of the size you do most of your > machining on. Make sure the bar is perfectly round. If necessary take a light > cut over the length of it including the part you will hold in the jaws. One > inch or so diameter is reasonable for most hobby machinists. Clamp this in the > chuck with 1/2 an inch sticking out and run a dial guage over it. Note the > lowest spot which will correspond to the "biggest" jaw. Mount that jaw on the > mill and shim it up until the jaw face is vertical. You might find that > mounting straight off the scroll does not quite give you this because jaws > should be a bit closer at the front so they grip a bar with no wobble. > > Take a light cut over the face and reassemble. Keep doing this until the bar > runs true. With care you can get an old chuck to run within a thou on a > particular size bar although it might go all over the place on another size > bar. > > I got my 3 jaw just about dead true like this. Don't grind too much off though > or you will go through the case hardening and then the jaws will mark up every > time you clamp something hard. > > A final tip when another size bar doesn't clamp true. Try tightening using > another key slot. There are normally 3 of these on a 3 jaw chuck. You will find > that one will give the best results with each particular size of bar. If you > need a dead true job then get a collet chuck or a 4 jaw. > > You can of course get new scrolls and jaws for most chucks but it usually isn't > worth the money if your time is your own and you can play with jobs a bit until > they run ok. > > Dave Baker at Puma Race Engines (London - England) - specialist flow > development and engine work. . PumaRacing wrote: > > >Subject: How to true up chuck jaws > >From: "Nick Alexander" > >Date: 2/8/99 7:32AM GMT > >Message-id: <79m3rc$m79$1@nnrp01.iafrica.com> > > > >I have recently bought a Graziano lathe which came with a Taylor 3-jaw > >chuck. Unfortunately it appears that there is quite a lot of wear on the > >inner jaws. What is the correct method for truing up the jaws? I would > >prefer not to use a grinder as a friend suggested. Is it possible to use a > >sturdy boring bar, or will the flex of the bar be too great for reasonably > >accurate jaws? Will the jaws be too hard for decent cutting? > > > >Regards, > >Nick Alexander > > > > > > Chuck jaws are case hardened and although a carbide tool will just about cut > them it is not the best way. > > On an old chuck you will find it inpossible to get jaws absolutely true for > various reasons. > > 1 - If there is wear in the scroll then the jaws will centre differently when > you clamp different size bars. > > 2 - You will find that the jaws centre differently depending on which key slot > you tighten with the chuck key. You should get into the habit of using one > particular slot to final tighten a job with. > > Having said that the best way I find is to do this. Mount up a grinding wheel > on an arbour in a mill if you have one. Use a wheel with a diameter just bigger > than the largest bar you intend to hold or that the chuck will extend out to. > > Find a bit of bar in about the mid range of the size you do most of your > machining on. Make sure the bar is perfectly round. If necessary take a light > cut over the length of it including the part you will hold in the jaws. One > inch or so diameter is reasonable for most hobby machinists. Clamp this in the > chuck with 1/2 an inch sticking out and run a dial guage over it. Note the > lowest spot which will correspond to the "biggest" jaw. Mount that jaw on the > mill and shim it up until the jaw face is vertical. You might find that > mounting straight off the scroll does not quite give you this because jaws > should be a bit closer at the front so they grip a bar with no wobble. > > Take a light cut over the face and reassemble. Keep doing this until the bar > runs true. With care you can get an old chuck to run within a thou on a > particular size bar although it might go all over the place on another size > bar. > > I got my 3 jaw just about dead true like this. Don't grind too much off though > or you will go through the case hardening and then the jaws will mark up every > time you clamp something hard. > > A final tip when another size bar doesn't clamp true. Try tightening using > another key slot. There are normally 3 of these on a 3 jaw chuck. You will find > that one will give the best results with each particular size of bar. If you > need a dead true job then get a collet chuck or a 4 jaw. > > You can of course get new scrolls and jaws for most chucks but it usually isn't > worth the money if your time is your own and you can play with jobs a bit until > they run ok. > > Dave Baker at Puma Race Engines (London - England) - specialist flow > development and engine work. . ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: A challenge for the BEST of you. From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 09 Feb 1999 06:31:48 GMT -------- Sorry but I respectfully have to tell you that you are indeed wrong on this one. Gundrilling is a VERY PRECISE operation. Holes much, much longer than 12" can be drilled to "as good as reamed" finish, to +/- .0005" tolerances and with as little as ZERO runout. The holes we are discussing would be a piece of cake to an experienced and well equiped deep hole driller. I know because I used to do it for a living!! See if you can't find "Eldorado Tool" on your server..I used to get most of my tackle from them. They put out a catalogue that is jam packed with useful and fascinating information. Robert Bastow Spehro Pefhany wrote: > > the renowned mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > > Right, but now how did they gun drill the holes in the drill > > that was used to drill the holes in the larger blank?? > > > And please don't say they made two short blanks with short holes > > and welded 'em end to end to make the long one! > > I thought I posted on this, but it hasn't shown up a few hours later, so, > yes I don't think you can drill a 1/16" hole 12" deep close to the > edges, gun drill or not. If I am wrong, please tell me!!! > > So, I am thinking two long pieces with two lengthwise grooves in one, > welded together to form two "U' shaped channels, then heated and twisted. > C'est possible? > > Do the coolant holes appear perfectly round? > > -- > =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= > Spehro Pefhany "The Journey is the reward" > speff@interlog.com > Fax:(905) 271-9838 (small micro system devt hw/sw + mfg) > =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: A challenge for the BEST of you. From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 09 Feb 1999 17:07:51 GMT -------- Spehro Pefhany wrote: >How much would you expect a 1/16" hole to drift going through 12" of steel? Would > it depend on the quality of the steel (something like P20 having less > inclusions and being better?) As in all things Spehro...It all depends!! First of all, 1/16" dia x 12" is an awfully deep hole and not the sort of hole I would expect to see in an oilhole drill. Most of these are not much longer than standard drills I have one that is 1.093" dia x 8" long and the oil holes are about 3/16" dia. Having said that I am sure that it can be done. I have watched .177" dia holes being gundrilled through a 22" rifle barrel with no problem. Getting to the "it all depends" bit...Obviously there are a number of factors. Gun drills have to be set up DEAD true and have to be started DEAD tru into the cut. This is achieved by either pre-boring a starting hole to dead size and 2-5 x hole diameter, or, more usually by using a hardened and ground starting bushing. The question also arises as to whether the part or the drill is rotated...or in some cases BOTH. Obviously if the part is rotated the setup is inherently far more accurate as the drill head is constantly self centering. Given all that the forces that tend to push the drill of center include using a too high feed rate, insuficient oilpressure sothat chips jam and blunt or chipped drill head. By FAR the most common cause is variations..Hard or soft sponts in the material. Remember my oft used statement, to the effect that NOTHING is perfect, we are in a situation in gundrilling where we are "pushing the envelope" and everything had better be as close to perfect as possible. To this end, manufacturers of custom gun barrels go to inordinate lengths to ensure consistancy in thier raw materials which will be specially rolled and normalised. On receipt the bars will be checked, straightened and re-heat treated. Given that, runouts and straightness are expected to be within pretty tight limits. Even so there is a selection process for "Premium" barrels. Gun drilling is a facinating and versatile process..did you know that overlapping "8" shaped holes can be done quite easily. In this respect the gundrill is similar to a woodworkers "Forstner" bit. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Cutting hex holes in drill rod From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 10 Feb 1999 04:34:07 GMT -------- That is probably the quickest and easiest way. If you only need a few Parts, just use a short section of allen wrench. This is a bit on the soft side for this application, but if you don't mind regrinding a few times it will do the job.. Failing that, grind one up from HSS. When you grind the end, try doing it on the very edge of the smallest wheel you have. Spin it as you grind and you will finish up with a concave end. This gives the cutting edges a bit of positive rake. Going a few thou over on the pilot drill, (larger than the A/C of your hex), will make the job a LOT easier without sacrificing anything important in the way of looks or strength. Robert Bastow Gary Coffman wrote: > > Ok, time for me to ask what is probably a Duh! question. How can I cut a > hex hole in the end of some drill rod stock to form an Allen head pocket? > Do I drill a hole and broach to size, or is there a better way? > > Gary > Gary Coffman KE4ZV | You make it |mail to ke4zv@bellsouth.net > 534 Shannon Way | We break it | > Lawrenceville, GA | Guaranteed | ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Cutting hex holes in drill rod From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 10 Feb 1999 05:14:25 GMT -------- Robert Bastow wrote: > Going a few thou over on the pilot drill, (larger than the A/C of your >hex), will make the job a LOT easier Er..A/F not A/C Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Cutting hex holes in drill rod From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 10 Feb 1999 05:20:54 GMT -------- This technique works well with buggered hex sockets. After all, the metal has only one place to go, and that is UP!! Faced with this problem, ( I rebuild a lot of old Machinery), I find that a judicious smack on top of the screw with a hammer, will push most of the metal back into place. I then grind the end of a hex key square and tap it into the socket. Works like a charm. Robert Bastow Don Foreman wrote: > > Tonight I buggered a tight phillips screw in my Makita angle grinder ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Snowed IN!!! From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 10 Feb 1999 18:41:47 GMT -------- CharlieDIY wrote: > > And for the rudest city in the western hemisphere, my vote goes to...Montreal. > NYC doesn't even compare, because there you don't have people acting as if > they'd like to spit on you for not speaking "their" language. I think one of > the reasons I forgot my French almost as fast as I learned it was the absolute > and unwavering arrogance of those who speak the language from birth. > > Charlie Self > Word Worker Je suis d'accord!! Before going to live in Canada I spoke almost perfectly fluent French. After a couple of years I decided to "forget" it. Les Quebecois really do take the Blue Biband, even among French speakers world wide, for the # 1 place in rudeness and arrogance!! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: A challenge for the BEST of you. From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 10 Feb 1999 18:55:47 GMT -------- Danny Hopping wrote: The ones I saw being made were forged to a straight flute section before being drilled. They were then flash butt welded to a shank before being heated by an induction coil and twisted. The assembly was then machined, heat treated and finish ground. Don't forget that , in Industry, processes that we might find incredibly difficult to imagine, are carried out daily, with casual aplomb. It would also be possible to extrude the required twist drill section, holes, flutes, twist, and all. If anything, extruding a STRAIGHT section is more difficult!! Robert Bastow > So, let me get this straight. They drill the two small holes, then twist the blank, > then machine out the groves that form the drill twist? > This LOOKS like how this bit must have been formed as the small holes are perfectly > round. I am amazed that a 1/16" hole can be drilled 14" long. Do they heat up the > blank before drilling then drill it hot? > Wouldn't the twisting affect the OD of the blank? > Is it turned down after twisting? > > Thanks for the answer, now I can sleep again :-) > Danny ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How to true up chuck jaws From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 10 Feb 1999 19:14:47 GMT -------- You are not missing a thing George!! Remember there are more ways to kill a cat than choking it with cream!! This was the method I was taught and it was quick and dead accurate. It does not require a spider (try finding one the right size in your scrap box when you need it!!) It loads the jaws exactly as they will be loaded in operation. It requires the measurement of only ONE dimension. The jaw faces are flat..This means that accuracy at other radii is not a function also of the WIDTH of the jaw face. It also means tha SMALLER radii are not held by a couple of Knife edges = less chance of marking the job and more durable accuracy in the jaw itself. BTW. The chuck jaws on a HIGH GRADE CHUCK are NOT case hardened...They are solid, heat treated alloy steel. Often we would need to take a brand new chuck and gring the jaws to a particular special configuration. I newr came across case hardened jaws until it was mentioned here. In confirmation, I have just replaced the old EMCO chuck on my Maximat with a PB Grip-Tru and I am converting the old chuck to a replaceable jaw type (soft Jaws). Coming out of a Scool as it did, the jaws had already been machined (buggered) WAY below the thickness of any case hardening. I can assure you that they are hardened all the way through and my first job was to anneal them for machining. Robert Bastow George Keeney wrote: > > Maybe I misunderstand you, Robert, but it seems to me that once you have: > > 1. Removed the jaws > 2. Cleaned up the faces on the grinder > 3. Reinstalled them > > You could now just chuck up on your spider or what have you and indicate > each jaw as you manually rotate the chuck. Once you have determined which > jaw's face is farthest from the spindle C\L set the indicator to zero and > check the other jaws. The indicator should give you a DIRECT reading of how > much each jaw needs to be trimmed. I don't see why, if you have ground each > face to be perpendicular to it's line of thrust, you would need some angular > position calculation. This obviously assumes that one knows (I know you know > this, Robert, just trying to be accurate) that as each jaw is indicated the > needle will start low at the the jaw's edge, climb to a high point and then > decrease as you approach the other edge. Readings should be taken at the > high point. > > Am I missing something? > > Robert Bastow wrote in message <36BE812A.BC30F2B@hotmail.com>... > >This is the way that I was taught to do the job. Ie. by grinding a > carefully > >calculated amount from each jaw, on a surface grinder. > > > >At that time I was given a simple geometric formula that, once you had > taken a > >clean up skim off the jaws and replaced them in the chuck, all one needed > to do > >was to indicate a test bar, determine the value of the maximum TIR AND its > >PRECISE angular position to say, jaw one. > > > >You then applied the formula and it told you EXACTLY how much to grind off > each > >jaw in sequence. > > > >I have searched high and low for that formula without success. It is > beyond my > >rusty math now, but I am sure one of our listers can figure it out on his > trusty > >slip stick. ;^) > -----snip----- ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How to true up chuck jaws From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 10 Feb 1999 19:20:58 GMT -------- I have been searching for this formula and it occurs to me, for those with a collection of ME, I last heard it referred to in ME, and it was by EITHER GH Thomas or Martin Cleeve. Robert Bastow Robert Bastow wrote: > > This is the way that I was taught to do the job. Ie. by grinding a carefully > calculated amount from each jaw, on a surface grinder. > > I have searched high and low for that formula without success. It is beyond my > rusty math now, but I am sure one of our listers can figure it out on his trusty > slip stick. ;^) > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Test Bars Sag From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 10 Feb 1999 19:23:13 GMT -------- Sheesh! It is easier to make a proper test bar!! ;^) Robert Bastow > I think you can use the "cantilever - uniform load" equation: > > The > maximum deflection, Ymax = -(w * L**4)/(8 * E * I) where w is the weight (in > pounds) of the bar extending from the jaws, L is the length (in inches) > extending > from the jaws, E is the "Modulus of Elasticity" of the material (E > = 30,000,000 psi > for carbon steel), and I is the "moment of inertia"(in > inches**4) of the bar > (I = (pi * d**4)/64 for a solid round bar). > > I used the > "*" as a multiplication symbol and the "**" as "raised to the power of". > The equation has a negative sign because the bar deflects down and the > coordinate system has Y as positive when going "up". ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Nothing to do with Mr. Bastow! From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 10 Feb 1999 19:26:00 GMT -------- I have taken the libery of changing this thread title..Whatever else I may stand accused of..radiation treatment of testicles is NOT one of them!! ;^) Robert Bastow J. Reid wrote: > > Believe it or not-a few decades ago there was a report that the Japanese > were trying to import an ultrasonic bathtub for humans. Never heard of it > after that, but it had obvious applications to birth control! > > J. M. Reid > Issaquah WA > > On Wed, 10 Feb 1999, Tony Jeffree wrote: > > > On Wed, 10 Feb 1999 01:41:29 GMT, ohmwork@technologist.com (ohmwork) > > wrote: > > > > >On 9 Feb 1999 07:09:48 GMT, "Don Foreman" > > > knowing there was a quote coming, > > >wrote: > > > > > >>Probably the best plan is to disassemble the lathe and run the ways thru > > >>the ultrasonic cleaner after each use. > > > > > >hey, that's what I do...but then the ultrasonic cleaner itself > > >collects micro-dust which requires micro-machine scrubbing. the never > > >ending fight against abrasive inclusions has so far cost me my wife > > >and family, but that's ok..she never really understood the NEED for a > > >clean machine..... > > > > > >mike II > > > > > > > Hey...you mean you put your wife & family through the ultrasonic > > cleaner too? Sounds like a great alternative to the bathtub... :-) > > > > Regards, > > Tony > > > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Cutting hex holes in drill rod From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 10 Feb 1999 19:35:51 GMT -------- Matt Stawicki (APP Leader) wrote: > I think you slipped. The pilot drill may be a a thou or 2 larger than the > DISTANCE ACCROSS THE FLATS, not accross the corners. If you make the hole > slightly larger than the distance accross the corners, you'll have nothing > left to broach. DEAD RIGHT Matt...See my follow up post on this point. And Hey, dont't EVER hesitate to try to prove me wrong on any point!..just stay away from personal attacks and you will get no grief from me That's what this forum is all about. ;^) Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Stitch Welding ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 10 Feb 1999 19:41:41 GMT -------- Try searching umder "Metal-Stitch" I used an outfit in Sheffield, England, to repair a huge press frame casting once Yes the process is Lloyds approved for See Going Vessels. There are many example of castings etc., braeking again...but never at the stitch mend. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Stitch Welding ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 10 Feb 1999 19:47:25 GMT -------- Try: http://www.metalcoatings.com/stitchingmetal.htm Robert Bastow Robert Bastow wrote: > > Try searching umder "Metal-Stitch" I used an outfit in Sheffield, England, to > repair a huge press frame casting once > > Yes the process is Lloyds approved for See Going Vessels. > > There are many example of castings etc., braeking again...but never at the > stitch mend. > > Robert Bastow Robert Bastow wrote: > > Try searching umder "Metal-Stitch" I used an outfit in Sheffield, England, to > repair a huge press frame casting once > > Yes the process is Lloyds approved for See Going Vessels. > > There are many example of castings etc., braeking again...but never at the > stitch mend. > > Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How to true up chuck jaws From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 10 Feb 1999 19:57:29 GMT -------- THANK YOU Norman!! Printed and safely filed. Robert Bastow Norman Yarvin wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > >At that time I was given a simple geometric formula that, once you had > >taken a clean up skim off the jaws and replaced them in the chuck, all > >one needed to do was to indicate a test bar, determine the value of the > >maximum TIR AND its PRECISE angular position to say, jaw one. > > > >You then applied the formula and it told you EXACTLY how much to grind > >off each jaw in sequence. > > > >I have searched high and low for that formula without success. It is > >beyond my rusty math now, but I am sure one of our listers can figure it > >out on his trusty slip stick. ;^) > > Pencil and paper is all that is needed (and that just for doodling): > > c = x * (1 + cos(theta)) > > where: > > c is the amount to grind off, > > x is the distance by which the center is to be moved (half of the > total indicated runout), and > > theta is the angle between the jaw in question and the point on > the surface of the bar that was closest to the center. > > -- > Norman Yarvin yarvin@cs.yale.edu ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Cutting hex holes in drill rod From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 11 Feb 1999 06:15:02 GMT -------- It seems the hardness of high grade allen wrenches is in the 45 to 50 range which falls in line with their need to be at maximum toughness. I have run into much harder Examples but the snap easily.(I don't seem to be able to find a good metric set. Most of the good ones are advertised as "vanadium" which leads me to suspect they would be something like 4340 or 4350. Tough as old boots but not exactly what I would choose for a cutting tool. Robert Bastow Ted Edwards wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > That is probably the quickest and easiest way. If you only need a few Parts, > > just use a short section of allen wrench. This is a bit on the soft side for > > this application, but if you don't mind regrinding a few times it will do the > > What steel do they generally use in Allen wrenches? Could one just > harden and temper it? > > Ted ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Harbor Freight "Auction"??? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 11 Feb 1999 06:19:28 GMT -------- SHUSH Jeff..let everyone believe it is all high priced junk!!! ;^) Robert Bastow Who is delighted with the stuff he's been "conned" into buying! 8^) jeffpa@microsoft.com wrote: > Its definately "caveat emptor", but in all fairness, shop around, there are > some really attractive deals there... ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How to true up chuck jaws From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 12 Feb 1999 02:37:43 GMT -------- Wish it were so simple Bill but I don't believe it is. Robert Bastow Norman Yarvin wrote: > > Bill Darby wrote, in response to the formula I > posted: > > >Could you just zero an indicator on a test bar opposite the jaw that was > >furthest from center then indicate and record the readings opposite the other > >two jaws then take them down a corresponding amount? > > Yes, that would work even better than using the formula. > > >Perhaps I'm not getting the point of this exercise. > > There wasn't much of one, not on my part anyway. > > -- > Norman Yarvin yarvin@cs.yale.edu ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What's a CAR reamer? From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 12 Feb 1999 02:49:38 GMT -------- Well it looks kinda like a BRIDGE Reamer, and I'm not sure if that means it was originally used to build bridges or it just meant it was used to "bridge" over two mismatched holes. We used them in boilermaking and machine frame building to finish-align holes for 'Fitting Bolts'. (When was the last time you came across one of those?) Other than the length and extremity of taper it is a ringer for a bridge reamer. Could the "Car" have something to do with railroad car frames..Or more likely the fitting of axle bearing slides? Robert Bastow pjones@caltel.com wrote: > > Hi: > > Got this a swap meet. Dormer HSS CAR reamer. > #B122 3/4". Is this a special for a particular > purpose? Picture is at: > > http://www.caltel.com/~pjones/reamer.jpg > > Thanks.....Paul > > -----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==---------- > http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: adhesives From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 12 Feb 1999 02:55:27 GMT -------- Well Routerbitguru, there are several adhesives that will bond metal to metal (ever tried "Gorilla Glue"?) But when you start talking about a bond that would be stronger than the (carbide) base metal I think you are just dreaming!!! When you find it..let me know and I will pay you whatever you ask for the Icelandic and Papuan rights!! ;^) I'm an optimist too! Robert Bastow routerbitguru wrote: > > Does anybody know of an adhesive that would bond carbide to carbide, steel > to steel, steel to carbide etc. > to the point that the joint is not the weakest point and can handle temp. in > excess of 1000 deg. F. > > Any suggestions would be appreciated. > > thanks. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How to true up chuck jaws From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 12 Feb 1999 04:21:44 GMT -------- But the way I was taught didn't require "Iterations" (Stop that..You'll go blind!!) And "pretty close " isn't what we are trying to achieve here!! With a few "iterations" with a big hammer and a couple of shims, any one can get "Pretty Close" Robert Bastow Joe Way wrote: > > On Fri, 12 Feb 1999 02:37:43 GMT, Robert Bastow > wrote: > > After two or three iterations one would be pretty close, I think. > > Joe > === > >Wish it were so simple Bill but I don't believe it is. > > > >Robert Bastow > > > >Norman Yarvin wrote: > >> > >> Bill Darby wrote, in response to the formula I > >> posted: > >> > >> >Could you just zero an indicator on a test bar opposite the jaw that was > >> >furthest from center then indicate and record the readings opposite the other > >> >two jaws then take them down a corresponding amount? > >> > >> Yes, that would work even better than using the formula. > >> > >> >Perhaps I'm not getting the point of this exercise. > >> > >> There wasn't much of one, not on my part anyway. > >> > >> -- > >> Norman Yarvin yarvin@cs.yale.edu ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 0.007" 304 ss wire - what do I do with it? From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 12 Feb 1999 04:24:09 GMT -------- Hair weaving?? ;^) isaac wrote: > > Anyone have an idea on what to do with 304SS wire? > > Mostly 0.007 inch diameter. Continuous lengths up > to, say up to 10 oz. on a spool. It was scrap > from a previous employer which I rescued. Just > found it again while burrowing behind other > treasures. > > Any (preferably constructive) ideas? > > P.Isaac ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: adhesives From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 12 Feb 1999 15:51:06 GMT -------- I think you will find that the tips on your old Myford tools are BRAZED on ..Not BONDED!! Mine are! Robert Bastow Steve Rayner wrote: > > I don't know of a brand, but it certainly exists. Myfords have been > selling mild steel shanks with HSS ends cemented on for decades. of a set > I purchased when my now elderly Myford was new, only the cut off tool > failed. Some of the others have been resharpened down to a nub, but the > bond held. > > routerbitguru (router@twave.net) wrote: > : Does anybody know of an adhesive that would bond carbide to carbide, steel > : to steel, steel to carbide etc. > : to the point that the joint is not the weakest point and can handle temp. in > : excess of 1000 deg. F. > > : Any suggestions would be appreciated. > > : thanks. > > -- > > I'm a Canadian eh! Steve. > ************************************************************************** > The FAQ for rec.crafts.metalworking is at: http://w3.uwyo.edu/~metal > The metalworking drop box is at http://208.213.200.132 > ************************************************************************** > Visit my website at: http://www.victoria.tc.ca/~ud233/homepage.htm > > ************* Tu ne cede malis, sed contra audentior ito. **************** > ******************************** - Virgil ******************************** > ******Yield thou not to adversity, but press on the more bravely.********** ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Screwed, machinery and hammers. From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 12 Feb 1999 16:15:06 GMT -------- Yes John, Although CounterSINKS usually come with nominal screw size pilots, you can get counterBORES in three varieties (or more): Nominal screw size (eg 1/4" x 13/32" for a 1/4" cap head BOLT) Clearance size (eg 9/32"x 13/32" for a 1/4" cap head SCREW) (Which one you choose to use may depend on whether you prefer your heads to be centered in the BOLT-EE or the BOLT-ED.If you catch my drift!! 8^) The most useful is a set of replaceable pilot Counterbores which can also serve as spotfacing cutters. Robert Bastow John Hofstad-Parkhill wrote: > On the subject of SHCS. Are there actually piloted countersinks with a pilot > that actually fits the standard body drill size hole? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Cutting small involute cam on lathe/mill? From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 12 Feb 1999 16:20:22 GMT -------- That is as good a way as any..Absent a CNC setup. With careful grinding/filing you should be able to "split the line" and that will be damn close to "dead on" Robert Bastow Ramset wrote: > > I'm making a replacement part for a key machine. The cam is about .100" thick > with a .250" hole to mount on a shaft. The diameter starts at about .350" and > increases to about .500" through 360 degrees of rotation. I was able to layout > the piece on a slug from an electrical box. I drilled a .067" hole in the > slug, wrapped a piece of fine wire one turn around a screw I put in the hole, > attached a scribe to the end of the wire and scribed a line on the slug while > unwrapping the wire. It turned out pretty good and will try grinding the slug > to the layout line. > > Any better ideas? > I have a Shearline mill and lathe. > > Best Regards > Kevin T ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: what size level do I need From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 13 Feb 1999 01:28:29 GMT -------- That would be what they call in Yorkshire "A hiding to nowhere!!" Robert Bastow John Wasser wrote: > Feel free to decide for yourself if the error is caused > by your headstock or bed and correct whichever you like. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Clausing 6300 series lathe From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 13 Feb 1999 01:37:29 GMT -------- Hi Daniel, What you have is a standard turret which take round shank tooling of standard sizes...5/8" 3/4" 1" 1 1/4" diameter etc. Yes you should be able to find taper adaptors plus a whole universe of neat tooling for this turret. The stuff tends to be VERY expensive new! But if you shop around AND KNOW WHAT YOU ARE LOOKING FOR!!!!..You will be able to buy it for pennies a pound. First you need to read up on the subject. Turret lathe setup is a whole different world than a center lathe. Get a good book on the subject...I have seen them go for a few dollars on Ebay. Good Hunting, Robert Bastow > Daniel Becker wrote: > > > Hello, > > > > I just bought a Clausing 6329 lathe. Factory said it is 1961 vintage. There > > is a turret tail stock. The turret does not use a taper set up. Instead it > > uses a straight round that is held in by a wedging bolt. Does this type of > > system have a formal name? Are there sleeves avalible which allow the use > > of a taper end tool in such? Is there a source for centers to fit this type > > of turret? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: new to list From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 13 Feb 1999 01:40:17 GMT -------- me wrote: " Me" You cannot possibly be ME!! I'm ME!! You must be "YOU" Whoever you are..Come out and join the fun!! Robert bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Southbend 14x36 FS on EBAY From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 13 Feb 1999 02:11:33 GMT -------- Kevin Pinkerton wrote: Sound advise indeed Kevin! How do I open more than one window on it? I need one to monitor ("Reload" every few seconds etc.) and a couple open at "review" or "place bid". Thanks, Robert Bastow > Keep and eye on it, especially during the last 15 minutes. If it stays > in your price range, get one or two Netscape/IE windows open to it > pointing at the bid page or the bid verify page. Use another window to > monitor the bidding. Wait until about 30 seconds or so before the end > and go for it. If you are bidding, bid your max amount you would pay > at that point, even if it is $500 more then the current bid. That way > someone might just try a $100 bid higher at the last seconds and not > go past your bid. > > Kevin > > My Gun Page: http://extra.newsguy.com/~kpinkert/ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re:extra windows on EBAY From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 13 Feb 1999 03:29:51 GMT -------- Thanks Joe, Now I am going to be REALLY dangerous on Ebay!! (No I am NOT going to quote your answer!!) ;^) Robert Bas Joe Way wrote: > To open another instance of Netscape, ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: adhesives From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 13 Feb 1999 04:47:01 GMT -------- If the "tips" are HSS and the shanks are MS then they will have been flash butt welded together..regardless of what the package calls it. I might be ready to believe that some incredible new adhesive has been discovered that would stand up to the strain on a parting tool. But several years ago..NO WAY!! Robert Bastow Steve Rayner wrote: > > No, mine are bonded. It said so on the package. Note these are Hss ends on > Mild Steel shanks. The bond is vertical, the parting tool failed along the > joint. > > Robert Bastow (Teenut@hotmail.com) wrote: > : I think you will find that the tips on your old Myford tools are BRAZED on ..Not > : BONDED!! > > : Mine are! > > : Robert Bastow > > : Steve Rayner wrote: > : > > : > I don't know of a brand, but it certainly exists. Myfords have been > : > selling mild steel shanks with HSS ends cemented on for decades. of a set > : > I purchased when my now elderly Myford was new, only the cut off tool > : > failed. Some of the others have been resharpened down to a nub, but the > : > bond held. > : > > : > routerbitguru (router@twave.net) wrote: > : > : Does anybody know of an adhesive that would bond carbide to carbide, steel > : > : to steel, steel to carbide etc. > : > : to the point that the joint is not the weakest point and can handle temp. in > : > : excess of 1000 deg. F. > : > > : > : Any suggestions would be appreciated. > : > > : > : thanks. > : > > : > -- > : > > : > I'm a Canadian eh! Steve. > : > ************************************************************************** > : > The FAQ for rec.crafts.metalworking is at: http://w3.uwyo.edu/~metal > : > The metalworking drop box is at http://208.213.200.132 > : > ************************************************************************** > : > Visit my website at: http://www.victoria.tc.ca/~ud233/homepage.htm > : > > : > ************* Tu ne cede malis, sed contra audentior ito. **************** > : > ******************************** - Virgil ******************************** > : > ******Yield thou not to adversity, but press on the more bravely.********** > > -- > > I'm a Canadian eh! Steve. > ************************************************************************** > The FAQ for rec.crafts.metalworking is at: http://w3.uwyo.edu/~metal > The metalworking drop box is at http://208.213.200.132 > ************************************************************************** > Visit my website at: http://www.victoria.tc.ca/~ud233/homepage.htm > > ************* Tu ne cede malis, sed contra audentior ito. **************** > ******************************** - Virgil ******************************** > ******Yield thou not to adversity, but press on the more bravely.********** ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: what size level do I need From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 13 Feb 1999 15:14:04 GMT -------- mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > If it is the headstock, loosen the bolts holding the headstock to > the bed. Hold the bed steady and move the headstock into alignment. > > If the bed is off, loosen the bolts that hold the bed to the > headstock. Hold the headstock still and shift the bed till alignment > is achieved. I am sincerely hoping that a few "smiley's" were omitted from my copy of this ;^) 8^) 8^) Robert Bastow ======== To: routerbitguru Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: adhesives From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 14 Feb 1999 02:10:03 GMT -------- Kinda figured that was what you were trying to do..But why? What extra benefit do you see in bonding rather than brazing? Brazed on carbide tips in metalworking stand up to far higher temperatures and shock loadings than could ever be produced in cutting wood. I have run them at a dull red heat without problems, and, with the right grade of carbide, on interupted cuts that shook the building! I use "woodworking" carbide router bits regularly on hardwoods, Composite boards, plastics, fibreglass, and non-ferous metals...I wear 'em out but the "bond" (braze) never lets go un less I REALLY munch 'em. Curiously, Robert Bastow routerbitguru wrote: > > Thanks for everyones responses. > > I'm trying to bond carbibe to steel in a router bit without the heat of > silver brazing. ======== To: Kurt Bjorn Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Please check my shop out... From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 14 Feb 1999 02:32:13 GMT -------- BEAUTIFUL!!!!!!! Robert Bastow Kurt Bjorn wrote: > > At the request of some friends, I have made a www site at > http://www.flash.net/~pyroware with details of my shop and current > 9-cylinder radial engine project. There are plenty of photos, including the > current project, some old completed engines, and details of foundry work > showing the casting of an impellor in aluminum with a Pyramid furnace and > petrobond sand. > > Eventually, I hope to have some good links and shop hints and anecdotes to > go with it. The site is 80% complete. Let me know what you think! > > Thanks gang, > > Kurt Bjorn ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Receiving posts. From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 14 Feb 1999 06:42:38 GMT -------- I am not sure that the ISP is at fault. I use Netscape messenger via (if that is the term) Bellsouth.net for two different newsgroups. This one (rec.crafts metalworking) always downloads messages very quickly...indeed it is usually only a few seconds after I post a message to it coming up on my screen if I hit "Get Message" On the other hand "rec.guns" seems to wait until it has 200 to 300 messages before it will down load to me or show "unread messages" Often it is two to three days before I can get a new batch. My posts there don't appear on my screen until up to a week has passed. Does anyone know why two ng's on the same server should act so differently? Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Receiving posts. From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 14 Feb 1999 06:43:59 GMT -------- Got this and replied inside a minute!! Robert Bastow wrote: > > This one (rec.crafts metalworking) always downloads messages very > quickly...indeed it is usually only a few seconds after I post a message to it > coming up on my screen if I hit "Get Message" > ======== To: Gary Coffman Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Receiving posts. From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 14 Feb 1999 20:03:29 GMT -------- Thanks Gary, That would explain the difference. I agree that moderation is required on any guns NG..the subject does seem to bring out some SCARY people!! I looked at alt.guns.politics once...Whoo-Boy!!! Robert Bastow Gary Coffman wrote: > Ah, Robert, rec.guns is a *moderated* newsgroup. Your post is sent to the > moderator, who reviews it, *then* it is posted to the group. That's why you > see the posts there appear in batches. Remember the moderator is a > volunteer, and has a life, so he may not get around to reviewing messages > for a day or two. The group is moderated so that those who don't understand > that gun control means hitting the target won't turn it into a flamefest. > > Gary > Gary Coffman KE4ZV | You make it |mail to ke4zv@bellsouth.net > 534 Shannon Way | We break it | > Lawrenceville, GA | Guaranteed | ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Victor Machinery Exchange From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 15 Feb 1999 02:39:11 GMT -------- Yes, several times, and I am a "satisfied client" Robert Bastow JVGilbert wrote: > > Has anyone purchaced from this company? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: knurl pattern From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 15 Feb 1999 17:52:18 GMT -------- This is usually done with a "Chequering File". You can buy them from Brownells. Robert Bastow William Dubin wrote: > > Hello, > > Can anyone tell me how to put the raised diamond pattern that looks like > the same thing you get when you knurl on a lathe, on to a flat surface? > > I am working with very small brass pieces 1/2 inch across X 1/16 inch > thick. > > Thank you in advance > > Wm. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT Re: Nasty answering machine messages. Was SNOWED IN!!!! From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 16 Feb 1999 23:57:56 GMT -------- "You have reached the Cabinet Room.Please hang up and dial your number again..." This is Robert, Sorry I can't take your call right now..But please leave a message and I'll get back to you as soon as I make bail!!!" "Heaven...God speaking...." RB Brian Hornaday wrote: > Dummm Dummm Dummm Were sorry, the number you have reached is no longer in > service, if you believe you have reached this number in error, please hang > up and dial again..... > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Used machinery for sale in North Central Area From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 17 Feb 1999 01:43:45 GMT -------- "CHAARGE!!!" John Lovallo wrote: > > I am thinking about closing down my "home" shop. The only problem is > that I don't want to get in the hassel of trying to ship this stuff. I > am located near Milwaukee, WI. and the buyer would have to pick it up > here (might be able to get a couple of neighbors to help move it out of > basement for a case of beer!). > > Clausing 8520 vertical milling machine. > Very nice condition, completely rebuilt, two milling vises, full set > of #2 Morse collets, Complete set of ETB DA collets and collet chuck, > numerous #2 Morse end mill holders. 6" Rotary table (never used). > Motor is original single phase. Color is John Deere Green. Table was > blanchard ground when rebuilt. Also have boring head, but no shank. > Price: $1750 cash and carry > > South Bend 9" X 24 Model C Bench Lathe > This lathe has been completely reconditioned and is in excellent > shape. > Also includes a Southbend gearbox leadscrew assembly to convert it to > a Model A quick-change unit + power crossfeed apron. Unit still shows > much of the original scraping on the ways. Priced with out chucks, > see below. Color is John Deere Green. > Price: $900.00 > > South Bend 10K Cabinet Lathe > This is the latest one in here. I have reconditioned most of it, > still > have a little problem on the tailstock. Floor standing unit will > underneath drive, I think the motor is three phase. Of course this is > a quick-change gearbox unit. This unit has a quick release collet > chuck and a couple of 3 jaw chucks. Color is John Deere Green. > Price $1100.00 > > Chucks for lathes > I have a 3 jaw and a 4 jaw chuck that will fit either lathe. Also > a Jacobs Rubber-Flex collet chuck that will fit either. Also a > Southbend heavy steel tapped faceplate that will fit either. Not > really interested in selling these unless both lathes sell.... > > Well thats enough for today, happy scheming... > > John > jlovallo@ticon.net ======== To: Tom Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Overexposure to carbide grinding From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 17 Feb 1999 05:29:09 GMT -------- I have heard of this before in conection with long term carbide grinding and I hear it is pretty serious stuff. I suggest: A. Quit now! B Do some serious web searching on the subject. C Get a good Lawyer and sue your employer. This may not have been a recognised problem 13 years age..but if I heard about it ten years ago..they sure the hell should have!! Good luck, Get well. Robert Bastow Tom wrote: > > Wonder if any of you machinists here can help? I've been a carbide tool > grinder for 13 years and have done this kind of work in a non-ventilated > shop, and without a dust mask. Now, I'm paying the price. > I've had extreme coughing fits for a year. Have had 2 bronchoscopy > surgeries with no results. Now in 2 days I get hospitalized to have a > lung biopsy. All this to find out if carbide and/or its alloys are > affecting me. Oh, I've also lost 25 pounds in the last 3 months. > Now, my question is: is this rare or have I been an ignorant > machinist? > I'll let you know how the biopsy went....if my lungs blow back up. > Thanks for letting me spill my > ...lungs. > > TK > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Plastics Fabrication Web Site From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 19:55:42 GMT -------- Both alt-248 = ° and alt-0176 = ° work for me. Thanks Robert Bastow Spehro Pefhany wrote: > But, anyway, to answer your question, you hold down the "Alt" key and type > 0176 on the numeric keypad, then release the Alt key, and if the font has > that symbol it should come out. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Interesting places for a HSM to visit in Toronto From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 20:09:56 GMT -------- Didn't Ford Machinery used to be Down Town Tronna? With a couple of other used machinery places right next door. If it is the place I am thinking about..it was a HSM's dream world!! Is "Can-Do Bookshop" still open on (I think) Queen Street? Another Mecca to visit. Be sure to check the local newspapers classified section too, especially for the Hamilton/Burlington/Stoney Creek area..There are more Machine Shops, HSM's and Dachinery Dealers there than you can shake a stick at!! Robert Bastow Doug Speck wrote: > > Hey! Don't you snub my home town! :P :) > Ford Machinery Supply is in the Northeast of the city (but he's the one > with 9" South Bend lathes in the city), 50 West Pearce, (905) 882-6317. > This is near the Buttonville Airport, for those who are curious - other > end of the city from Pearson Airport. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Interesting places for a HSM to visit in Toronto From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 20:14:53 GMT -------- Another "Must Go" place is the Hamilton Steam Museum at the Old Pumping Station. They have a GORGEOUS Twin Beam Engine that used to run under steam on Sundays. I believe now it is just a stationary exhibit, but well worth a visit. There is (was?) a permanent "Live Steamers" track there too! Enjoy!! Robert Bastow Arthur F. Ross wrote: > > Only there once, but visited a wonderful science museum they have there, > with an old Brit. loco cut in half so you can see how all the bits work- I > must have spent an hour tracing all the tubing connections, valves, etc. > and finally got it straight in my head how a steam loco does it's thing. > > Arthur > > Jon Pritchard wrote in article > ... > > I'm going to be stuck in Toronto for a day a couple of weeks down the > road. > > Funny how this business travel works...the execs get the plane > connections > > that work properly...the grunts lose a day out of their life to save the > > company $1500 in plane fare. > > > > Can anyone suggest interesting places to visit for new/used machine tools > > and accessories? Any surplus mechanical/electrical places worth looking > at? > > How about museums where one can look at old iron instead of dinosaur > bones? > > > > Thanks, > > Jon Pritchard. > > > > > > > > ======== To: paul_probus@yahoo.com Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Machinist Workshop Magazine Question From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 20:16:21 GMT -------- I got mine a couple of weeks ago. Robert Bastow paul_probus@yahoo.com wrote: > > I'm just curious, I've seen a couple of posts referring to the new Machinist > Workshop Magazine (formerly PIM). Has anyone who subscribed to PIM received > their copy yet? If so, how long ago? ======== To: paul_probus@yahoo.com Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Machinist Workshop Magazine Question From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 20:16:29 GMT -------- I got mine a couple of weeks ago. Robert Bastow paul_probus@yahoo.com wrote: > > I'm just curious, I've seen a couple of posts referring to the new Machinist > Workshop Magazine (formerly PIM). Has anyone who subscribed to PIM received > their copy yet? If so, how long ago? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 75:1 ratio - the answer? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 20:22:43 GMT -------- It makes more sense than anything else I have heard or thought of!! But I believe this was an old (Pre-stepper/CNC) head with manual handle and dividing plates. Robert Bastow Tony Jeffree wrote: > > Some while back there was a thread that caused lots of scratched > heads...someone reported a dividing head with a 75:1 worm drive & no > satisfactory answer was forthcoming as to *why* 75:1 (as opposed to > the more conventional 40, 60, 90 etc. ratios). How about this: > > - 75:1 means 4.8 degrees rotation of the wheel per rotation of the > worm > > - Steper motors commonly have step angles of 1.8, 7.5 and 15 degrees. > A 7.5 degree/step motor takes 48 steps to perform a full rotation (or > 96 steps in half-step mode). > > - Slap a 7.5 degree/step motor on the worm shaft and you have made a > 10 steps/degree (20 half-steps/degree) stepper controlled dividing > head. > > The same rationale would work for 15 degrees/step, but not for 1.8 > degrees/step. > > So my guess is that the dividing head described was intended for some > CNC-based application & would normally have had a stepper attached. > > Does this make any sense? > > Regards, > Tony > > http://www.jeffree.u-net.com/ > > "If you're not confused, you're ill-informed" ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Rotary aircraft engines (Was: Please check my shop out...) From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 20:27:46 GMT -------- Now you've REALLY Pissed me off!!!! ;^) Robert Bastow PLAlbrecht wrote: > > >3 Porsches?? Is that so as you can count on at least one being in > >running order at any one time?? :-) > > Uh, not quite. You must be thinking of Jag-hew-ars. ======== To: brian@uunet.ca Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Interesting places for a HSM to visit in Toronto From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 18 Feb 1999 23:06:52 GMT -------- Alas, no longer (;^) I couldn't take the cold any more. I am now in "Hotlanta" (a HSM's DESERT!!!) I lived in Stoney Creek for a while and ran a couple of machine shops there. (Me and a coupla hundred others!! Very competitive...Cut metal or DIE!!) Robert Bastow Brian Evans wrote: > > Are you from the Hamilton area, Robert? I'm in Dundas, just up the hill from > Hamilton on the north side. > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Where is Ron Moore? From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 19 Feb 1999 02:48:28 GMT -------- Rhbuxton wrote: > > Hi Folks, > Ron Moore use to post here and he hasn't for almost a month. I am concerned > for two reasons. The first is that he owes me money.... Lets get the priorities right. Eh? >.......and the second is I am concerned about him! >Does anyone know anything about him or what has happened > to him? > Rick ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Wotta Place! From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 19 Feb 1999 02:55:53 GMT -------- Jim, If you have any two brain cells talking to the other one, you need to get back in there with donuts, coffee, cigarettes, booze, dancing girls...WHATEVER it takes. No matter if some one threatens the life of your first born child do NOT divulge the whereabouts of this mother lode to ANYONE (except me) ;^) Robert Bastow > I guess I owe them some doughnuts, eh? > > Jim ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Plastics Fabrication Web Site From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 19 Feb 1999 06:09:10 GMT -------- What the F*** are you talking about DoN??????????? ;^) Please don't try to confuse me with facts...I was just happy that it works for me!! 8^) Robert Bastow DoN. Nichols wrote: > > In article <36CB1F7F.A882A5B0@hotmail.com>, > Robert Bastow wrote: > >Both alt-248 = ° and alt-0176 = ° work for me. > > Well ... they both give the same code, as you can see from this > formatted hex dump of the line in question (follow the arrows): > > ====================================================================== > | > V > 000003a0: b0 20 20 61 6e 64 20 20 61 6c 74 2d 30 31 37 36 | 0 and alt-0176 > 000003b0: 20 3d 20 b0 20 20 77 6f 72 6b 20 66 6f 72 20 6d | = 0 work for m > ^ > | > ====================================================================== > > Exactly why you get the same code from two different inputs is a > good question. I would think that the one with the leading zero to be > perhaps octal, but the conversion is not correct. The octal 176 should be > decimal 126, which is the '~' (tilde) character. The 248 must be decimal, > and that works out to 0370 (octal), or 0xF8 (hexadecimal). The actual code > *sent* was 0xb0 hex (see the formatted dump), or 176 decimal (hmm ... *that* > matches your second alt code), or 0260 octal. > > As it turns out, they both look right to me (Sun workstation) when > using the pager to *read* the article, but they appear as '0' in the editor > while composing this response -- which again supports the suggestion that > you *not* use these (or any character which you need the 'ALT' key to > create. It will show up correctly on *some* systems, but on others will > simply leave people scratching their heads. :-) > > If you want to see the extreme of that -- look at the spams from the > Ukraine in Cyrillic. :-) > > Enjoy, > DoN. > -- > NOTE: spamblocking on against servers which harbor spammers. > Email: | Donald Nichols (DoN.)|Voice (703) 938-4564 > My Concertina web page: | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html > --- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero --- ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: brass vs. bronze bushings From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 19 Feb 1999 14:35:21 GMT -------- He did say he was making a Homebuilt 'Plane Tony!! In ANY application, bronze is superior to brass as a bearing material..even clocks!! Robert Bastow Tony Jeffree wrote: > Depends on the application, as always...if you're making a clock, > brass plates and wheels with steel pinions and steel arbors seems to > work just fine, with a re-bushing required every coupla hundred years > or so on the bits that get heavy wear. I don't think I would advocate > phosphor bronze as a clockmaking material... > > Regards, > Tony > > http://www.jeffree.u-net.com/ > > "If you're not confused, you're ill-informed" ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Machinist Workshop Magazine Question From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 19 Feb 1999 14:45:42 GMT -------- Don't worry Guys...He'll get back to metalworking in another couple of months!! Hey Paul, can your new Bride tell the difference between Brass and Steel swarf yet? In the DARK?? ;^) Robert Bastow paul wrote: > My wife and I just got married recently, and what gets me are all those > bridal magazines. You see them in bookstores and grocery stores on sale all > the time, but if you go to a bridal show, they practically force them on you > for free. I don't see how they can stay in business giving away so many > magazines (for each one there'd be stacks and stacks of them even at very > small shows). A better question is, knowing this, why would anyone buy them > or, better yet, subscribe to them? Around here (No. Virginia), it seems > there's a bridal show of somekind at least once every couple of months. > (Funny how you don't notice these things until you get engaged and go through > it.) > > Paul Probus > paul_probus@yahoo.com > > -----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==---------- > http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Sherline 2000 mill From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 19 Feb 1999 14:55:40 GMT -------- As I point out to SWMBO...It's cheaper than a BOAT!! (But of course...Most things are!!) Robert Bastow (Who gave up Loose Women, Fast Cars, Slow Horses and Hard Liquor to buy his first Myford!!) shoptask wrote: > This is a good point- consider the years you will have your machine >and the seriousness with which you approach your hobby, then the price >becomes a secondary factor- ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Drill press vibration (sorry!) From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 19 Feb 1999 15:08:56 GMT -------- As I have publicly stated several times on this NG..My Delta 16" is the worst POS I ever had the misfortune of paying hard earned cash for!! It vibrates itself across the floor at ANY speed. A replacement motor from Delta, plus new, high grade belts, have done nothing to improve it. This sorry heap of junk is slowly working its way up my priority list, for a complete teardown, balance and rebuild. That is, if I don't take a BFH to it first! A few years ago I had a similar machine from Busy Bee (Yeh! Really!) that ran as sweet as I could wish for. Go figure!! Robert Bastow Brian Evans wrote: > > Apologies in advance for asking a drill press question, but i did do a > dejanews search and couldn't find what I needed. > > I'm buying a new drill press to replace the wornout Jet bench model that > I now have. I looked at a Delta 16" model last night and was totally > amazed at the amount of vibration when running at the lowest speed. > stuff on the drill table walked right off it due tto the vibration! A > Delta 20" 1 HP model that I also tested was far better, at more than > twice the price, though. > > The question I'd like to get some quick feedback on is: Do all the > generic Tiwan 16" drill presses vibrate in the same way, or do I stand a > chance of finding one that will run smoothly? If they all vibrate, is > there anything that can be done to fix it without going the full rebuild > route? (I don't have a Correa mill to bore our the headstock:)) > > Finally, presuming that i can get SWMBO to free up the cash, should I > dump the idea of getting an acceptable 16" tiawan machine and look at > the 20 - 22" models? > > Thanks much, Brian ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Where is Ron Moore? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 03:38:01 GMT -------- I figured that!! The written word is SO powerful.. we must all take care which way our mouths are facing before we pull the trigger. Been there, too many times! Robert Bastow Rhbuxton wrote: A poor choice of words on my part that should not be > taken in any other way. > Rick ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Machinery Mounts/Pads From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 03:42:18 GMT -------- >.... some say if machine is level you can set, or rough set your work >with a level; ... then indicate in... > ray mueller Never worked for me either Ray!! Roberty Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Halogen bulb failure From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 03:48:02 GMT -------- Just switch from Lucas Electrics!!! QED! Robert Bastow Lee Marshall wrote: > > This is getting to (what I think) is the source of the problem. > Lee ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: sharpening drill bits From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 03:59:15 GMT -------- This is a troll..Right?? Take about an hour of your time Karl. Look..I mean really LOOK at the end of one of your drills. Take it over to the grinder and try to reproduce it..then go drill a hole with it. I know!! It doesn't work, Right!! So go do it again!! And again, 'til it does! IT WILL!!! It's called PRACTICE!!! Robert Bastow karl klein wrote: > > -Is there any way to sharpen drill bits? Got so many dull ones-seems like > a waste.- > -- > karl klein > kklein@iglou.com > http://members.iglou.com/kklein ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: sharpening drill bits From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 04:02:02 GMT -------- Tell me your sh****ng me Dave!! >but when a drill bit is blunt it's time to throw it away. > Dave Baker ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: sharpening drill bits From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 04:08:18 GMT -------- Well put Bob! This is a fundamental skill that needs to be mastered from day one. It takes thirty minutes, not thirty years, and if you cannot grind any drill fom # 80 to 1", to cut right and within ACCEPTABLE limits you have no business calling yourself a machinist and should take up NEEDLEPOINT!! Robert Bastow Bob & Marilyn Tonkins wrote: > > Karl, > I hope some of these young turks chime in with a newfangled machine > that sharpens drills. I've seen SOMe advertised, but never seriously > considered one. Not to say, they don't work. But we learned to do them > by hand. And I think it's a skill that can be learned. > > Oh! Oh! Sorry about memory lane. But just to say, you CAN do it. > > Blessings > BobT*** ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Elliot shaper price From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 20 Feb 1999 05:17:15 GMT -------- Elliot made a Helluva good shaper!! 10" is a Very usable size. I paid more than that for my 8" Boxford..no regrets (it was in "new condition" The pleasure and high value of good quality far outlasts the pain of high price. I say "Go for it!!" Jens wrote: > > I have the opportunity to buy a 10" Elliot (I think) shaper in > excellent condition. The guy wants $1100 which seems awful high to me. > What would something like that be worth on average ? > > Thanks > > Jens ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: sharpening drill bits From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 00:18:03 GMT -------- John Kunkel wrote: > For identical angles and rakes you can't beat a machine. No you can't..and I never said you could! > All this talk of he-man eyeball sharpening, sorry but I'm skeptical. A. That's because you never took the time, or ever had the need to learn! B. Anything beats throwing away a perfectly good drill just because it is blunt C. Not everyone can justify, afford or even NEEDS a drill grinder. I think that there is a lot of misperception as to the true uses and usage of a drill bit. People expect and seem to need them to drill a dead size hole and quite frankly that is a bit unrealistic for most people and NOT the way to arrive at an accurate hole. I find I very rarely use the "aliquot" sizes of drills in my sets...1/16",1/8" 1/4" etc. Why? Because I very rarely NEED a DRILLED hole of those sizes. The hole sizes I need are.. Tapping sizes...Above 1/4" plus or minus .005" doesn't make a whole hoot of PRACTICAL difference in the strength of the thread. Clearance Holes...a few thou either way doen't affect function. Fitting holes...Most often, drill, (again a few thou isn't important) bore or open up with the correct reaming size. Then ream, bore, grind or lap to dead size required. By the way, if you need a hole closer to drilled size, be aware that, if you drill it a few thou under and then follow through with the correct size of drill it will cut pretty damn close to nominal diameter. If you "break" the corners of the drill...stone a small radius on the outer corner...it will also give a close-to-reamed finish. Now before all the "Industrial" drill users jump down my throat..Yes I am aware that OCCASIONALLY the case arises when it is NICE and MORE ECONOMICAL to be able to drill pretty close to size in one shot. But please bear in mind that this is REC.CRAFTS.Metalworking. Most people looking here for advice are just happy to get a hole of ANY size when they first start out. To them I say again. Take a drill and STUDY it, see how the same tool angles you need on your turning tool are present and correct. They are just "twisted" a little bit. Take it to jour grinder and do a few "dry runs", before removing material, so as to get the hang of the twisting and swinging motion involved. I generally use the rim of the wheel for sizes between 1/8" and 1/2"..below or above that I find it easier on the flat side of the wheel. Grind a few drills! Test them! Grind them again. Practice makes perfect, it doesn't take long to get the hang of it, and like riding a bike...You never forget it. Now, as to "Teensy Little" drills... One of our regular jobs was drilling some kind of injector nozzle, No 80 size in 416 stainless. Hand feed on a Herbert #1 capstan lathe...not exactly a "sensitive" feed. Those drills were always sharpened, as required, by the operators (apprentices) It was done in a few seconds with an eye loupe and a fine slip stone. Stone in one hand, drill in the other, moving the drill on the stone. Once again, when you got the HANG of it and KNEW WHAT YOU WERE TRYING TO ACHIEVE (geometry wise)..it became a simple routine job and drill breakages were rare. Robert Bastow ======== To: Jens Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Elliot shaper price From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 00:38:41 GMT -------- Jens wrote: I am now at the stage of > trying to figure out just exactly what I need a shaper for since I > have a Bridgeport clone. >I know I always wanted one. That in itself is a good enough reason Jens. There are a few tricks you can easily do on a shaper that are more difficult on a mill..either in setup time or in cost of tooling, accessories, etc. Mine gets used every day..but thats maybe because I don't have a mill!! On the other hand, justifying the cost of one..just to watch the cutter go round.....;^) Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Antique finish to copper From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 05:01:06 GMT -------- D. Michael McIntyre wrote: > > >All the sculpture folks at UW Madison used to put bronze, brass, > >and copper pieces into the catbox for a few weeks, so they would > >acquire a patina. > > That's actually a good idea. It would probably work better than human > urine, and it's at least somewhat more sanitary than whizzing in a > bucket for a couple of weeks. Its a lot easier than trying to get a cat to sit on a bottle though!! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Zippo Art From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 05:15:43 GMT -------- Beautiful work Steve, which I have often admired at Knife Shows. Obviously you are man of many talents...The restored Hardinges are to DIE for!! Thank you, Robert Bastow slindsay@nyx.net wrote: > > If you looking for hand engraving I may be able to do it for you. > > Please visit my hand engraving pages and view other items that have been hand > engraved. > > Custom Hand Engraving > http://www.nyx.net/~slindsay ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Snowed IN!!! From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 16:28:09 GMT -------- The F-104 Starfighter was know in Germany and Canada as "The Widowmaker" Robert Bastow wayne wrote: > > A lot of those F-104 turned post holes were flown by Canada. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Dovetail milling From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 21 Feb 1999 17:25:21 GMT -------- I would advise not to increase the speed over that recommended for the max. diameter of the cutter. For a finishing cut..feed slowly..use lubricant..WD 40 works. Do NOT try to cut on two faces of the DT cutter together..it may chatter. If your setup will allow..try to climb mill..It will give a better finish, especially if your cutter is less than razor sharp. Robert Bastow John Anderson wrote: > > I'm fairly new to machining and have a speed/feed question. I need to clean > up a dovetail that was not cut parallel originally. There is plenty of > metal to do this. I know how to arrive at a proper speed for milling with a > normal end cutter, but am unsure as to whether the additional cutting edges > on a dovetail mill affect the speed or not. I expect with more tool edges > per revolution, the feed will be higher, but don't know whether to increase > spindle speed over what I would normally use with an end mill. Material is > 6061-T6. Machine is a Clausing 8520. > > Any suggestions appreciated. > > -- > John Anderson > anderiii@qni.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Tap questions (novice) From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 22 Feb 1999 00:59:37 GMT -------- D. Michael McIntyre wrote: > > I'm fairly new to metalworking, and I'm having trouble tapping > threads. Maybe I could use a doweling jig > to start the tap... That's not a bad idea, if my doweling jig has a > 3/8" hole... You hit the nail on the head there Michael. Use a tap guide! If your dowelling jig doesn't have a 3/8" hole, then get a chunk of steel, aluminum or even hard wood. Drill a 3/8 hole through it, nice and square, on your drill press. Now clamp it on your plate, nicely centered on your tapping hole and tap merrily away. BTW, if you are raising smoke, hand tapping, you are either going too fast, using the wrong fluid, or, likliest, your tap is chipped or blunt. Happy tapping, Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Toolpost grinder underway From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 22 Feb 1999 03:28:36 GMT -------- I think a masonary drill will cause you grief Jim. Too brittle for steel. If you are intending this spindle block to be at lathe center height, why not take advantage of that. Mount the block on your tool post, drill the hole from the chuck (with a bit of pushing assistance from the tailstock) Then mount a boring bar between centers. I believe you will find a recent thread on this in Dejavu. Robert Bastow Jim Stewart wrote: > > This weekend I started work on the toolpost grinder featured in the > Jan/Feb '99 HSM. > The article specifies a 3/4" hole for the clearance hole for the shaft, > which I don't have handy. I was thinking of drilling an 9/16" hole and > opening it out to 3/4" with a freshly-sharpened masonry bit (carbide). > Anyone have thoughts? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Bison chuck service? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 15:16:59 GMT -------- The three empty tapped hole are for jacking screws to remove the backplate, which will be a firm press fit in the body. Once inside you will see three more screws, each just to the side of the pinions. Remove these and the pinions will come out of their holes. There is nothing further preventing the bevel/scroll gear from coming out. Turn the chuck upside down and with a brass or hardwood drift you can tap it out of the back. Robert bastow boris beizer wrote: > > I just landed a great 8" Bison chuck with a 1.5 x 8 back. The only numbers I > can read on it are 7193-91, which could be a serial number or model number. > It is in excellent shape but-- Apparently it had not been cleaned -- ever. > Took a lot of work to get the jaws out and clean the scroll. That's fine, but > there seems to be an accumulation of swarf and grit inside, probably on the > gear that's on the back of the scroll. The backplate was factory fitted and > the run-out is great -- but I want to clean out the garbage. > There are six hefty socket head screws on the back that apparently > attaches the backplate to the chuck. There are also 3 tapped holes 1/4-20 > that don't have anything inside -- they might be for micro-adjusting the > backplate. My quesion. > > 1. If I undo the backplate screws and remove the backplate, will I be > able to get at the gears? Clean the mess out, and regrease? > > 2. Will doing this hurt or otherwise screw up the present excellent > allignment. > > 3. Is there some secret way to get at the gears and clean it out? > > I've done the CRC bit, and everything that can be done from the outside -- > I think. > > Boris. > > -- > > ------------------------------------- > Boris Beizer Ph.D. Seminars and Consulting > 1232 Glenbrook Road on Software Testing and > Huntingdon Valley, PA 19006 Quality Assurance > > TEL: 215-572-5580 > FAX: 215-886-0144 > Email direct: bbeizer@sprintmail.com > Email (Forwarded): bbeizer@acm.org, bbeizer@ieee.org > ------------------------------------------ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Bison chuck service? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 16:43:17 GMT -------- It will be just a LIGHT "tap in" fit. Use a soft faced mallet and TAP gently around the circumferance to make sure it goes in square. Robert Bastow boris beizer wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote in message <36D2C74C.DA8B220C@hotmail.com>... > >The three empty tapped hole are for jacking screws to remove the backplate, > >which will be a firm press fit in the body. > > Thank you. Makes sense. But putting it back together? Big press? In the > vice? Hammer and a 2x4? > > >There is nothing further preventing the bevel/scroll gear from coming out. > Turn > >the chuck upside down and with a brass or hardwood drift you can tap it out > of > >the back. > > Okay. But reassembly? > > Thank's for the poop, guys. Never took one of those apart before and I didn't > want to do something patently silly -- I've run into more than one tool whose > re-assembly was impossible. > > Boris > > ------------------------------------- > Boris Beizer Ph.D. Seminars and Consulting > 1232 Glenbrook Road on Software Testing and > Huntingdon Valley, PA 19006 Quality Assurance > > TEL: 215-572-5580 > FAX: 215-886-0144 > Email direct: bbeizer@sprintmail.com > Email (Forwarded): bbeizer@acm.org, bbeizer@ieee.org > ------------------------------------------ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: toolpost grinders From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 16:46:05 GMT -------- Best to cover up and suck it out. Lathes are not built like cylindrical grinders and the coolant will just wash the grit into places you DON'T want it to go!! See my imfamous piece on WAY LUBE!! 8^) Robert Bastow Jan Ben wrote: > > to protect the ways and the chuck, whould it be better to use coolant > and try to catch it, or maybe run a vacuum right by the grinding wheel? > just wanna know. > jan ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Bison chuck service? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 24 Feb 1999 17:03:52 GMT -------- 3 and 4 jaw chucks catch a lot of S**t!! They are also one of the easiest lathe bits to pull down, clean and reassemble. I strip and clean mine regularly, ALWAYS after a session with the tool post grinder, cast iron, or even emory cloth! I reassemble and lube with graphite..I don't want grit to stick in there and form a lapping paste. The reward is in the retention of that crisp accuracy you expect from a new chuck. Robert Bastow > > Thank's for the poop, guys. Never took one of those apart before and I didn't > > want to do something patently silly -- I've run into more than one tool whose > > re-assembly was impossible. > > > > Boris > > > > ------------------------------------- > > Boris Beizer Ph.D. Seminars and Consulting > > 1232 Glenbrook Road on Software Testing and > > Huntingdon Valley, PA 19006 Quality Assurance > > > > TEL: 215-572-5580 > > FAX: 215-886-0144 > > Email direct: bbeizer@sprintmail.com > > Email (Forwarded): bbeizer@acm.org, bbeizer@ieee.org > > ------------------------------------------ ======== To: sherwood@lucent.com Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Overexposure to carbide grinding From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 25 Feb 1999 00:08:07 GMT -------- The cobalt in tool steel is alloyed with the other components and does NOT carry the same risks as FREE, pure, unalloyed cobalt used as a BINDER in tungsten carbide tool bits. Nevertheless, the normal precautions, mask, positive ventilation etc., need to be taken whenever grinding or other dusty operations are carried out. Robert Bastow Chuck Sherwood wrote: > > Lets skip the legal stuff and talk about the affects of grinding toolbits > in a home shop. I grind cobalt toolbits on a Baldor carbide grinder > with white wheels. What precautions should I be taking??? > > 1) Am I taking risks by grinding dry without a mask? There is no > ventilation in my basement. I dont really grind that many tool bits, > but when I do grinding I usually grind several at one time. I typically > use 5%,10% cobalt import or mo-max tool bits. > > 2) Does wet grinding control the dust? It does seem to make the grinding > debri stay in the drip pan. > > 3) Should I move the grinder to the garage and open the door when > grinding to get some ventelation? > > 4) Anything else I should do??? > > chuck sherwood ======== To: sherwood@lucent.com Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Overexposure to carbide grinding From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 25 Feb 1999 00:08:16 GMT -------- The cobalt in tool steel is alloyed with the other components and does NOT carry the same risks as FREE, pure, unalloyed cobalt used as a BINDER in tungsten carbide tool bits. Nevertheless, the normal precautions, mask, positive ventilation etc., need to be taken whenever grinding or other dusty operations are carried out. Robert Bastow Chuck Sherwood wrote: > > Lets skip the legal stuff and talk about the affects of grinding toolbits > in a home shop. I grind cobalt toolbits on a Baldor carbide grinder > with white wheels. What precautions should I be taking??? > > 1) Am I taking risks by grinding dry without a mask? There is no > ventilation in my basement. I dont really grind that many tool bits, > but when I do grinding I usually grind several at one time. I typically > use 5%,10% cobalt import or mo-max tool bits. > > 2) Does wet grinding control the dust? It does seem to make the grinding > debri stay in the drip pan. > > 3) Should I move the grinder to the garage and open the door when > grinding to get some ventelation? > > 4) Anything else I should do??? > > chuck sherwood ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: PC briefcase instead of notebook From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 25 Feb 1999 00:11:37 GMT -------- DTJ6PPC wrote: > Along the same lines of this topic, I am interested in assembling a briefcase > size PC system instead of notebook size, that would allow me to take advantage > of the variety, availability, capacity, and low cost of standard desk top PC > components relative to notebook systems. The 2 inhibiting factors appear to be > the monitor/screen and small briefcase size enclosure. > > The first factor could be solved using a laptop/notebook screen, are these > available as seperate components or are they always built into the > laptop/notebook packages? If they are available who would be good source? > > Are there briefcase style and size PC cases that would accept standard desktop > size and priced componentry along with the capability to mount or house a > laptop/notebook screen/monitor, and what also would be a good source? > > Has anyone already done this? > > Any feedback would be greatly appreciated, > > Thanks, > > Don Jackson in Redondo ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: PC briefcase instead of notebook From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 25 Feb 1999 00:16:14 GMT -------- Sorry about the previous post..My finger slipped 8^) DTJ6PPC wrote: > Along the same lines of this topic, I am interested in assembling a >briefcase size PC system instead of notebook size. >The 2 inhibiting factors appear to be the monitor/screen and small >briefcase size enclosure. Then use a SUITCASE Silly!! ;^) Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Spelling From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 25 Feb 1999 16:26:49 GMT -------- There are three 2's in French...Tu and Tou-Tou! Robert Bastow Eddy Wells wrote: > > You guys tell me how to spell: > > There are three '2's in the English language... > > Eddy Wells ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Methodology? making rifle brass From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 02:03:51 GMT -------- Bob Frazier wrote: > > In some older references I've heard of people making odd caliber brass > on their lathe. I haven't heard of any modern attempts at this. Anybody > tried it? > NO! NO! NO! Turning cartridge cases from barstock might (did) work OK for Black Powder pressures..But for modern nitro powder pressures you are almost certain to get a base blowout. Very few actions support the base of the cartridge case fully. Some of them by little enough to make your hair curl. Modern cartridge brass is VERY carefully formulated, and the heat treatment and work hardening controlled to the "n"th degree, to be able to safely hold the 50,000 plus psi pressures experienced. It is easy to forget, that it wasn't the development of sophisticated breech mechanisms that made modern weapons feasable. Rather it was the development of the modern brass cartridge case. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What's a CAR reamer? From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 26 Feb 1999 20:29:16 GMT -------- To be honest it has been 35 years since I used one, but I believe they were left hand spiral/right hand cutting. That way they didn't tend to "screw in" to the work. Robert Bastow Curt wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > Well it looks kinda like a BRIDGE Reamer, and I'm not sure if that means it was > > originally used to build bridges or it just meant it was used to "bridge" over > > two mismatched holes. We used them in boilermaking and machine frame building > > to finish-align holes for 'Fitting Bolts'. (When was the last time you came > > across one of those?) > > Do your bridge reamers have a left-hand twist like his appeared to have? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Gingery awed by Lewis engine From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 04:50:07 GMT -------- Once a Knight..always a Knight...But twice a night is Enough!! Mike Graham wrote: > > Let me attempt to beat Robert Bastow to the punch, and be the first > to tell you that a 'nighthood' is a condom. You meant to suggest a > knighthood for Lindsay. 8-) > > --=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-- > > Mike Graham mike@headwaters.com > > Mangler of metal. User of many grinding disks. > Cut with an axe, beat to fit, paint to match. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Spelling From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 16:52:08 GMT -------- Again Charlie, it is a question of "two peoples separated by a common Language" What he was saying was that the American pronounced "Lion" as an ENGLISHMAN would pronounce "Lan"...Not necessarily as an AMERICAN would pronounce "Lan" A Texan's pronunciation of "lion" "Line" and "Lying" would all sound similar to a Southern Englishman who would pronounce "Lan" as "LAHN" The Texan's pronunciation of "Lan" is indescribable to an Englishman..but something like "Lihn" with the emphasis on the "I" sound (as the I in light pronounced the English way) Robert Bastow CharlieDIY wrote: > > ud233 writes: > > >That was when I first realised that some > >Americans pronounce lion as " Lan ". > > Where? I've been around and about the U. S. and some parts of Canada and never > heard that pronounciation. > > Texas sounds the most likely, but I didn't hear it there. > > Charlie Self > Word Worker ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Methodology? making rifle brass From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 27 Feb 1999 22:50:25 GMT -------- Tom Holt wrote: > > The message <36D4B070.1DB24B2C@hotmail.com> > from Robert Bastow contains these words: > > > Bob Frazier wrote: > > > > > > In some older references I've heard of people making odd caliber brass > > > on their lathe. I haven't heard of any modern attempts at this. Anybody > > > tried it? > > > > > > NO! NO! NO! > > Well... Yes and no, actually > > > Turning cartridge cases from barstock might (did) work OK for Black Powder > > pressures... > > Might, did and does. > > >But for modern nitro powder pressures you are almost certain to get a > > base blowout. > > Depends. If you're talking about high-pressure centrefire rifle > calibres, agreed. Many pistol calibres (38 spl, 45 LC, 32 S&WL > etc)don't develope ferocious enough pressures to cause this sort of > problem. 9mm, 357 and 44 mag - well, there's no need to home-brew. > > > Modern cartridge brass is VERY carefully formulated, and the heat treatment and > > work hardening controlled to the "n"th degree, to be able to safely hold the > > 50,000 plus psi pressures experienced > > For modern nitro rifle cases, agreed - but they're available > commercially, so you don't need to moonshine them. For black powder > centrefires of 1870-80 vintage, properly-made turned cases are > perfectly OK; Isn't that what I just said?? Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Just who is the Chuck Jacobs guy? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 03 Mar 1999 16:21:23 -0500 -------- Hi Peter, It, along with two other clone types and four "real" Albrechts are working just fine. All of them are very accurate and durable! The only difference is the PRICE!! RB PLAlbrecht wrote: > > The puns in this thread are so bad that they leave even me speechless... On > top of being keyless. > > Hey, after Enco went T.U., I sold one of those Taiwanese Arblecht chucks on > ebay. Pride would not let me use it in my own shop. RB, you know who you are, > hope it's working but if it isn't, don't look at me, my name's not on it. > > Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Economy Tig Welder From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 10 Mar 1999 00:58:57 GMT -------- Has anyone got any FIRST hand experience of the Safeco tig welder set http://www.salesco.com/migs/tig/economytig.htm I am looking for a small set suitable for gunsmithing and model making duties..no aluminum, max 1/8" steel 1/16" and smaller electrodes. A watercooled torch is NOT a requirement but I would like a variable foot power switch that will give a "no scratch" start. Informed opinions would be welcomed. Thanks Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Recontouring Morse Tapers From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 10 Mar 1999 21:11:57 -0500 -------- Marv Soloff wrote: Heck Marv...I have an electric toothbrush that takes bigger than #0 MT Robert Bastow Marve wrote: >......, the simplest solution > would probably be to go out and buy another lathe that doesn't take > Morse #0 fittings. Like a South Bend or Monarch or such. It's only > money. > > Regards, > > Marv ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Mill speeds From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 10 Mar 1999 21:16:52 -0500 -------- This is technology gone crazy!!! If you don't have a Machinerys Handbook..just lift the lid on your Taiwanese drill press and the speeds for HSS in a variety of diameters and materials are there. FIVE PAGES....You're NUTS!! Robert Bastow Jon Elson wrote: > > GMasterman wrote: > > > I am looking for a rule of thumb guide for setting spindle speeds on my > > mill/drill for different metals. What I am trying to avoid is the complex way > > of figureing these as is stated in Machinerys Handbook. I am talking about > > end mills of less than 1 in dia. Can any of you enlighten me as to your method > > of figuring out what speed to set up for? Thanks! Gerry > > I wrote a little program that generates a 5 page matrix of RPM, a variety of > circle diameters, and the surface speed you would get for that diameter at > that RPM. The diameters work the same for lathe workpiece size or end > mill diameter, so this table works for both milling and turning. > The diameters go from 1/8" up to 5", and the RPM's go from 25 to 5000, > more than the speed range of my machines. I just decide what surface > speed (in FPM) would be good, find the closest diameter, and scan down > unitl I find the closest surface speed. Then I look across to find the RPM > that will give that speed, compare to the available speeds on the machine, > and finally, decide whether it would be better to choose the next higher > or lower speed to the one from the table. It only takes a few seconds > to do it this way. Maybe I should post this at the drop box, in plain > ASCII text and PostScript, so everyone could print it out. > > Jon ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: what's wrong with this picture? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 10 Mar 1999 21:30:20 -0500 -------- Yeh Chris..Straight up!! Chris Braid wrote: > ...straight up? > ======== To: Randy O'Brian Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Economy Tig Welder From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 11 Mar 1999 04:12:35 GMT -------- You hit the nail on the head there Randy, thanks. Robert Bastow Randy O'Brian wrote: > > The ability to start and sustain an arc at very low currents is critical in > gunsmithing since the welds often have to be cosmetic as well as > mechanically adequate. The ability to throttle the arc down to nearly > nothing at the start and at the end elimnates the craters which can save > much metal removal when the finishing phase begins. Also, many times sharp > edges are adjacent to the weld and to much current will not allow > preservation of those edges. Therefore, check to see how low you can go > before buying a machine. For about 5 years, I have been using a Miller > Maxstar 151 with the Snap-Start hf unit and torch mounted thumbwheel current > control. The specs say it will sustain an arc down to one amp with a hot > tungsten. All I know is that I can't read the ammeter with the helmet on, > but it has been completely satisfactory for use in firearms > restoration/modification. > > Randy > > Robert Bastow wrote in message <36E4737D.EF98D020@hotmail.com>... > >Has anyone got any FIRST hand experience of the Safeco tig welder set > >http://www.salesco.com/migs/tig/economytig.htm > > > >I am looking for a small set suitable for gunsmithing and model making > >duties..no aluminum, max 1/8" steel 1/16" and smaller electrodes. > > > >A watercooled torch is NOT a requirement but I would like a variable foot > power > >switch that will give a "no scratch" start. > > > >Informed opinions would be welcomed. > > > >Thanks > > > >Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Recontouring Morse Tapers From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 11 Mar 1999 04:23:59 GMT -------- Of course it is practical to cut a #1 MT down to a #0 MT. For this you need a Morse Taper Cutter-Downerer machine. (often called a Lathe) Unless of course the tapers are hardened...in which case you need a Morse Taper Grinder-Downerer!! (often called a toolpost grinder) Going the other way is rather more difficult, for this you need a Morse Taper Putter-Onerer machine (often called a Welder!!) Robert Bastow Marv Soloff wrote: > > Quick question: > > I need several live centers with a Morse #0 taper. MSC has the Skoda > (Czech) live centers on sale at $28.00 each. Problem is, they are > Morse #1 taper. Has anyone recut a Morse #1 to Morse #0? Is this > practical? If so, what's the best was to do this. > > Regards, > > Marv ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Need source for metal initial stamp From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 11 Mar 1999 09:33:36 -0500 -------- Lee Valley Tools, Woodworkers, Brownells, and Garret Wade all list custom made stamps for wood and metal in any number of letters you want. Robert Bastow ======== To: Michael March Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Bridgeport Vertical Mill / Jet bandsaw / Jet bench lathe all for sale From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 11 Mar 1999 17:49:51 GMT -------- Michael March wrote: > > Hello fellow metal workers, > > This is my first time on the newsgroup. Welcome Michael. >I hope I'm doing this right. All except for one thing!! > Good condition. make offer. State your best price..You will generate more interest and feedback. Robert Batow ======== To: Michael March Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Bridgeport Vertical Mill / Jet bandsaw / Jet bench lathe all for sale From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 11 Mar 1999 17:50:13 GMT -------- Michael March wrote: > > Hello fellow metal workers, > > This is my first time on the newsgroup. Welcome Michael. >I hope I'm doing this right. All except for one thing!! > Good condition. make offer. State your best price..You will generate more interest and feedback. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: what's wrong with this picture? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 11 Mar 1999 17:55:25 GMT -------- Used upside down with lath running reverse direction. Avoids dig in and chatter, plus chips fall free. This is standard setup on a lot of CNC Turning Centers. I have a set of Valenite Micro bars in "bass-ackwards" persuasion..use them all the time and don't feel need to swap. Robert Bastow Louis Boyd wrote: > > Grant Erwin wrote: > > > > There's this boring bar on ebay .. > > http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=74189322 > > > > Uh, it looks to me like it is BACKWARDS - you'd have to run the > > lathe in reverse! Is this a funny photo or do they actually > > make bass-ackwards boring bars or is my coffee singularly > > ineffective this morning? > > Now you know why it's never been used and it's for sale on ebay! > > Does someone make a left handed lathe (headstock on the right)? > > Lou Boyd ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: ebay inflation From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 11 Mar 1999 16:43:32 -0500 -------- All the time you are searching for, and moaning about examples of over inflated prices on Ebay there are scores of people getting Great Deals! I just got a B&S 6-7" Micrometer and a Lufkin 7-8"...both in perfect condition..for under $25.00 each. A full set of Brand Name, USA made, brand new, gunstock checkering tools for $14.85 How about a full set of HSS broaches 1/16" to 3/8" plus all the bushings and shims...for $70.00? A Starret 18" Vernier Height Gage for $78.00? Full set of "as new" Hardinge 5C square collets for $87.00. 6" Pratt-Burnerd "Grip-tru" Chuck..Unused for $282.00 81 pc set of recently calibrated B&S Hoke gages for $88.01 A pre-64 Winchester model 70 barrelled action for $206.00 New in box Hornady loading die set for $6.85 Brand new Royal 5C master cup collet for $10.00 I could list almost fifty items I have bought on Ebay (Books and Tools) Not once have I been disappointed! Not once have I overpaid! Not once have I been cheated! If there is a "Feeding Frenzy" going on it is the BUYERS!! Quit yer Bitchin' Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: ebay inflation From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 12 Mar 1999 02:59:05 -0500 -------- We have ALL bought five dollar dial indicators at garage sales...and will continue to do so. Comparing that to a brand new, Precision Brand, 2 1/2" dial, 0.0001" Indicator for $62.00 is pedantics at its most dishonest. When you shoot the only shot in your locker, Dear &NM7U...Better make sure it has the legs to reach the target!! Robert Bastow &NM7U wrote: > > Kevin Pinkerton wrote: > > > > On Thu, 11 Mar 1999 16:43:32 -0500, Robert Bastow > > wrote: > > > > >All the time you are searching for, and moaning about examples of over inflated > > >prices on Ebay there are scores of people getting Great Deals! > > > > I just got a new Precision Brand (made in england) .0001" indicator, > > 2-1/2" face for $62. I am very pleased and will continue to shop for > > bargains there. > > > > Kevin > > > > My Gun Page: http://extra.newsguy.com/~kpinkert/ > > Well, that makes the point that EBAY forces prices WAY out of > range, doesn't it. I've bought .0001 dial > indicators at garage sales for $5. > You can NEVER get a good deal when you're competing with the > entire world. There's always someone with more money than > knowledge. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: HTML From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 12 Mar 1999 21:22:05 -0500 -------- I'm not a computer "nut"..to me a hot boot is pullin the plug!! But I use windows 95 every day..have done for a couple of years, and I have never yet had a crash or a problem!! Do you guys pay a cheaper price..or shout at it a lot??? Windows and Netscape work fine for me, What am I doing wrong?? Robert Bastow > You make a valid point, however the amount of time that I lose to bugs and > crashes under windows is far more offensive to me than the time I 'lose' > studying to use Linux. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: HTML From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 12 Mar 1999 21:26:56 -0500 -------- Er! What the F*** has all this to do with Net.Crafts.Metalworking?? Ted Edwards wrote: > > Carl Byrns wrote: > > > > > Educate me here: why do NGs continue to use ASCII over HTML? Tradition? > > By now you should have been educated - if you ever will. > > > And I gather that you have never considered modifying the tool to do the > > job better. > > Frequently - almost daily. But it has be an improvement not merely a > change. > > > Lighten up, Francis. > > Who's Francis? > > Ted ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: "Blueing " From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 12 Mar 1999 21:44:33 -0500 -------- Absolute Poppycock!! A blued finish will out-wear a color case hardened finis any day of the week!! David A. Holly wrote: > > Dez, > > Bluing is not "hard wearing." It barely gives the steel any protection at > all. It can still rust and get scratched. I think bluing was mainly > invented to take the glare off firearms for hunting or military use. > > Now, if you want a finish that does wear hard, check into color case > hardening. Regardless, the place to check is Brownells Gunsmithing > supplies. Check most any major firearms magazine and you will find and add > for them. I'm not sure if they have a web site yet or not. But, they have > bluing and case hardening supplies as well as thousands of other items for > gunsmithing. They also have many books on these subjects. > > They sell "cold blue" which can be rubbed onto steel cold to produce the > coloring. Traditional bluing requires a hot bath of bluing salts. The > metal surface must be free of any oil or lubricant. The better the polish, > the better the blue finish. From what I've read, the metal must get hot > enough in the bath that when you remove it, any liquid evaporates > immediately. Brownells sells stainless steel tanks with burners underneath > for bluing rifle barrels. For the occasional pistol, I think you might get > by with a large stainless steel pot on your stove. > > Another place to check for more information is Shooters' Online Services. > That URL is http://www.shooters.com/ > > Hope this helps. > > =David= > > Dez Wood wrote in message <990312114419.n0006257.dezwood@mail.clara.net>... > >The process of putting a hard wearing coating on steel as in > >hand guns (but not in this case) > > > >Anyone tell me how it is done please > > > >Thanks > > > >----- > >Dez Wood G3HKO > >G-QRP 124 ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: "Blueing " From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 13 Mar 1999 09:32:46 -0500 -------- You are missing the entire point David (and thanks for the patronising discourse on the process of case hardening..as a tool and die maker, that was all NEW to me!!!!) The question was on SURFACE FINISH if you took the trouble to read it. While no one disputes that case hardening produces a longwearing surface the COLORS on the other hand are very transitory (short lasting) It is usual to laquer them in order to preserve them a litle longer. As a surface treatment (coloration) I REPEAT...Bluing will out last case hardening any day of the week!! So There!! Robert Bastow David A. Holly wrote: > > Gentlemen, > > I think we should reveal some facts about these 2 processes. The original > post that I responded to mentioned "putting a hard wearing coating on > steel." Bluing, while it is a "coating" is not "hard wearing." Case > hardening is. In fact, case hardening is a heat treatment of steel. Bluing > is not. > > Case hardening is not used all that much today mainly because there are > better steels available that are "harder wearing" to start with. Plus, case > hardening is a time consuming process and it can be dangerous. Colt's > famous case colors is produced with, I think, cyanide, or some other > poisonous chemical. So, only professionals with the right equipment can > duplicate those beautiful colors. Other case hardening processes are > easier, but don't always produce colors. > > When tougher steels are used to start with, the bluing inherits these > qualities. Hence, today's blued finish can last a long time. However, what > I was responding to was the request for a "hard wearing" coating for steel. > This, bluing is not. Bluing does not add strength to the steel surface. > > In Brownells catalog, under "Heat-Treating Accessories" you will find a > product called Kasenit. The description reads . . . > > [ For case hardening plain or low carbon alloy steels. Carburizes surfaces > quickly to uniform depth. Gives "Surface Hardening" while retaining the > toughness of the core. Protects delicate, highly finished work, eliminating > cleanup or remachining. (After quenching, surface is clean and extremely > hard.) Reliable and inexpensive. Non-poisonous, non-explosive, > non-flammable. excellent for drills, firing pins, hammer davits, trigger > pins, sears, punches, all low carbon, high wear surfaces. Sprinkle parts > with powder or "dunk" for deeper case. ] > > Now, be honest, when have you ever seen bluing recommended for drill bits or > "high wear surfaces?" I challenge you to take 2 drill bits, blue one, and > case harden the other. Then see how long they last. Most of the bluing > would come off after the first hole was drilled. > > In fact, in Brownells' book, "Gunsmithing Kinks," there is information on > how to "break through" the surface of case hardened receivers for scope > mounting. They recommend using a small pointed grinder first. Another > method used acid. Otherwise, the drill bit will dull or even break trying > to drill through. Regular blued surfaces need no special handling for > drilling. (Even in modern steels.) > > Notice in the product description above, it says "After quenching, surface > is clean and extremely hard." Bluing does not "harden" metal surfaces. > Case hardening, or color case hardening, does. Case hardening is actually > recommended for tools to improve their wear. It is recommended for bearing > surfaces. Take a look at some blue (not stainless) Smith & Wesson service > revolvers and you will most likely see a case hardened hammer and trigger. > > If anyone has "facts" to the contrary, please post them. > > =David= > > Tom Holt wrote in message <1999031403221276639@zetnet.co.uk>... > >The message <36E9D111.D55A4FC1@hotmail.com> > > from Robert Bastow contains these words: > > > > > >> Absolute Poppycock!! > > > >> A blued finish will out-wear a color case hardened finis any day of the > week!! > > > > > >This is true; and explains why antiques gun with traces of their > >original hardening colours are so highly prized. > > > >For a really durable finish, try browning, preferably done the > >old-fashioned way rather than by slopping on some chemical gunk. Can > >look pretty darn cute, too. > > > > > > > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Help with Walking Stick From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 13 Mar 1999 09:35:46 -0500 -------- Eddy Wells wrote: > > I need some ideas on what kind of handle to make for it... > BALLS..(Bulls of course) ======== Newsgroups: talk.politics.guns,rec.crafts.metalworking,alt.music.bootlegs,rec.toys.action-figures.discuss Subject: Re: Do you use eBay? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 14 Mar 1999 22:19:09 -0500 -------- And, Pray what, is wrong with that? If I couldn't simply go to the supermarket and pick up the meat I eat (with all the nasty, smelly, work already done) then I would quite happily go out and shoot it myself!! As for human beings...threaten me, or mine, with deadly force and I would have less compunction in shooting you than I would treading on an ant!! If I didn't have a gun capable of doing the above, I would use a bow and arrow or a rock!! Hope you're a Vegan with three stomachs!! Robert Bastow Matt wrote: > > All right, good point Garry. That said, the primary use of guns is still to > kill things. > > Matt ======== Newsgroups: talk.politics.guns,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Do you use eBay? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 14 Mar 1999 22:27:41 -0500 -------- I think that sums it up best!! Thanks Jack, These people are so enamored with the sanctity of life we should stop distracting them and let them get back to dynamiting abortion clinics. Robert Bastow Jack Erbes wrote: > > Gee Matt and Bubba, > But I am really glad you guys don't like guns. Guns should not be in > the hands of people with your temperament. > > -- > Jack in Sonoma, CA, USA (jack@vom.com) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How to turn a simple taper? Tailstock adjustment? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 14 Mar 1999 22:35:16 -0500 -------- It would if you wanted to turn an eccentric..but not a taper!! Think about it! Robert Bastow Bob Frazier wrote: > > Would offsetting the center (headstock end) with a four jaw chuck be a more > adjustable method? Bob > > George Glines wrote in message <7chi4f$k8f$1@mtinsc01.worldnet.att.net>... > >Chris, > > > >There are three main ways to cut tapers on a lathe: > > > >1. Taper attatchment > >2. Compound Rest/Slide method > >3. Tailstock Offset > > > snip ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: SWMBO? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 14 Mar 1999 22:51:11 -0500 -------- This guy has GOT to be a Batchelor!!!! Mike Graham wrote: > Well, it's 'fess up' time. I don't know what SWMBO stands for. She Who Must Be Obeyed...Updated recently on the Modeleng-List to: SWIMBO..She Who Must INDUBITABLY Be Obeyed. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Timepiece for machinists. From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 15 Mar 1999 01:40:14 -0500 -------- I agree! Cool is the word. Er! Did you check the price?? For $155.00 each I'll bet there is a rush from this NG to Ebay to buy up every Starrett indicator available..plus a bunch of those $5.00 battery clock drives!! Now where did I put that box of Jun...Er.."Repairable" dial indicators? Robert Bastow Don Foreman wrote: > > Cool! > > SSmith1636 wrote in article > <19990315211453.21653.00001040@ng-ce1.aol.com>... > > One of the guys from this forum has developed a timepiece that is > really > > sharp. It can be viewed at http://members.aol.com/ptengin/mtp.html. > Check it > > out for a very creative idea. > > Scott > > "Nothing is impossible for the guy not doing the work." > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Collet Type Question From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 15 Mar 1999 17:01:19 GMT -------- I'll second that guess. If they are W20 size they will also have a 4mm wide keyway in the threaded end. Now all you need is a Schaublin lathe to put them in. You should be able to pick one up cheap from Dave!!! ;^) Robert Bastow Dave Ficken wrote: > >>Overall Length: 4.770" > >>Diameter of Face: 1.105" > >>Back Bearing Diameter: .787" > >>Thread (Outside only): about 12.5/inch. The thread is a "Buttress". > > The Buttress thread is a clue they might be swiss. The backbearing > diameter is almost exactly 20 millimeter. My guess is W20 collets as > used on Scaublin and other swiss machines. > > Regards, > dave ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Off topic: Gun question From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 15 Mar 1999 17:13:22 GMT -------- Hi Mike, I can't help you on the specifics of the mounting, 'tho I'm sure one of our readers can. The requirement for "short " range is the stinger. Most "Generics" are parallel adjusted for 75 yards or more. Unfortunately it takes a special scope to focus down close enough to be able to plink at 5 to 15 yards. These are usually sold as Rimfire Scopes. Air Rifle scopes have the same facility but they start to get really spendy because of the need to be able to stand up to the peculiar recoil characteristics of a powerful air rifle. First thing then, is to check that the scope you have will focus at the ranges you anticipate using. Robert Bastow Mike Graham wrote: > It does a pretty good job, but the factory sights are deplorable > so it needs a scope badly. Since this will primarily be close-up > shooting, where 50 yards is a *long* shot, I figured a nice little > generic scope should do the job. > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Tired of getting "SPAM"!? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 15 Mar 1999 17:22:57 GMT -------- I LOVE SPAM!! Fried! with beans, eggs and Chips (French fries)!! ======== Newsgroups: talk.politics.guns,rec.crafts.metalworking,alt.music.bootlegs,rec.toys.action-figures.discuss Subject: Re: Do you use eBay? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 15 Mar 1999 12:35:05 -0500 -------- I certainly did, and the more I understand it and how it came to be the way it is..The more I am determined to fight for it..ANY way I have to!! Robert Bastow John E. wrote: > Many people would give everything they have and do give everything >they have to come to this country to enjoy a way of life not found >anywhere else in the world. > John E. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Recycling staples From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 15 Mar 1999 12:45:28 -0500 -------- I can't get mine to stick together reliably...I have tried all the usual "sticky" stuffs. Have you tried running a fine bead of weld down the center? Would my Miller 5000 with 1/4" wire feed be suitable. Do I need a foot control? Did I tell you about the stepper drive and ballscrews I fitted to my TP re-roller? Do you think MaxCad would be the answer to several alignment problems I've been having. I want to send a sample to Matt!! Dis-ingeniously yours, Robert Bastow PLAlbrecht wrote: After that, I'm recycling used > staples. Straighten them out, glue them back together, put them back in > stapler. ======== Newsgroups: talk.politics.guns,rec.crafts.metalworking,alt.music.bootlegs,rec.toys.action-figures.discuss Subject: Re: Do you use eBay? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 15 Mar 1999 17:54:01 -0500 -------- Oh good, perhaps a nap will help Matt. Maybe time for one of your tablets too!! Robert Bastow Matt wrote: > At any rate, this entire thread grows tiresome. ======== Newsgroups: talk.politics.guns,rec.crafts.metalworking,alt.music.bootlegs,rec.toys.action-figures.discuss Subject: Re: Do you use eBay? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 15 Mar 1999 22:15:14 -0500 -------- What do you expect people to do with a position counter to their own..Roll over and play dead? I would have thought that was more in your line of philosophy. If you can't take the heat, stay out of this kitchen! Robert Bastow Matt wrote: . I don't recall trying to exert > influance, so much as trying to keep my head above water as the gun folks took metaphorical shot after shot against a position counter to their own. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Recycling staples From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 15 Mar 1999 22:49:35 -0500 -------- PLAlbrecht wrote: > >>Did I tell you about the stepper drive and ballscrews I fitted to my > >>TP re-roller? > Well, I see I misjudged you. You're a fellow professional. Do you run >it through the laundry cycle before or after re-rolling? LAUNDRY!!! But there's still one GOOD side!! > >>I want to send a sample to Matt!! > Send him used TP. Actually I was thinking of TWICE used Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Metal stamp manuf. found - Thanks! From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 16 Mar 1999 01:16:06 -0500 -------- Share the wealth Steve, share the wealth!! Robert Bastow Steve Russell wrote: > > A quick note to say thanks to all who responded to my request for a > supplier of metal stamps. I found a company to make the stamp I need and > for far less than I had figured. > > Thanks again, > > Letting the chips fly... > Steve Russell > Eurowood Werks > The Woodlands, Texas Steve Russell wrote: > > A quick note to say thanks to all who responded to my request for a > supplier of metal stamps. I found a company to make the stamp I need and > for far less than I had figured. > > Thanks again, > > Letting the chips fly... > Steve Russell > Eurowood Werks > The Woodlands, Texas ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: guns RE:do you use e-bay? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 16 Mar 1999 15:02:24 GMT -------- This may not be as far-fetched as it may appear at first glance!! Not too long ago, in countries behind the "Iron Curtain" there was a a requirement for ALL typwriters, duplicating machines, photocopiers, printers and computers to be registered and be subject to strict controls. Free speech and the ability and willingness to protect it, are the things that ALL Governments fear the most. Robert Bastow Gunner wrote: > Remember fellas, if they take the guns, and you have the means to make > one, in your home shop, how long do you think that you will be allowed > to keep your lathes and your mills? > Do you think that it would be long before you need a liscense to have > an Atlas or Bridgport? > BATFMT? ======== To: Matt Newsgroups: talk.politics.guns,rec.crafts.metalworking,alt.music.bootlegs,rec.toys.action-figures.discuss Subject: Re: Do you use eBay? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 16 Mar 1999 15:05:21 GMT -------- Piss off Matt..You have outstayed your welcome on this group. Go pester someone who cares about your anally retentive views! Matt wrote: ======== Newsgroups: talk.politics.guns,rec.crafts.metalworking,alt.music.bootlegs,rec.toys.action-figures.discuss Subject: Re: Do you use eBay? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 16 Mar 1999 15:10:35 GMT -------- Absolutely TRUE Matt. And after removing ALL civilian held guns..They used the remaining GOVERNMENT held guns to ensure the EXTERMINATION of the Jews. It was only a bunch of GUNS in the hands of more rational people that stopped them!! Robert Bastow By the way..it is propAganda...Thought you would have known that!! Matt wrote: > Remember that about 60 years ago, the German government did a helluva job > using numbers to prove Jews were the cause of all Germany's woes. > > Your propeganda is noted, and dismissed. > > Matt ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 0-12in Starrett Mic Set From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 16 Mar 1999 15:29:34 GMT -------- You will be able to buy a full set (Individually) for far less than that on Ebay. Prices seem to average around $50.00 for 1' to 3" Starretts, $40.00 for 4" to 6" and about $30.00 apop from there on up. Make your own case!! Robert Bastow jeffpa@microsoft.com wrote: > > I have a chance to get a set, about 30 years old, for about 800$. > > Obviously new, these are like 2200$ at J&L. > > Forgetting the Chinese versus American debate, and all of that, anyone > have any good thoughts as to the value of them? > > Assuming are in good shape obviously. I dont think these come with > standards though. But do come in original wood case. > > -----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==---------- > http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own ======== To: john@coefac.engr.wisc.edu Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Nearly got me! From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 16 Mar 1999 15:40:22 GMT -------- OK!!! THAT one FINALLY did it!!! I have coffee and snot all over my keyboard!! Thanks for the ROTFLMAF. Robert Bastow John Robinson wrote: Sure enough, couple of > nights later, "WHAM" .....very short pause, then a car door slams, and > tire screeching for most of the block.......still had the battery > too.....behavoral modification is what I called it, ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Dividing From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 17 Mar 1999 04:11:07 GMT -------- Bottom line is..You can't get there from here!! By which I mean; you can't get 5 divisions from 12 by simple indexing (Which is what you have) However!! Welcome to the world of the HSM where every job is preceeded by making the tools to make the tools to make the tools...You get my drift!! What you need is a plate with 5 as a factor..5 , 10, 15,....60, 120..the more the merrier. Step one: Check out the bull wheel on your lathe, that is often a multiple of 5. If it is then simply arange some means of detenting the wheel, hold your brass in the chuck and spot/center drill through a guide hole in a piece of bar held in the tool post. Then go drill to size and depth on the mill or drill press. Failing that....Locate a master..a changewheel from your lathe..scrounged from "Jones the Scrap"...what ever. Set that up on a mandrel on the tail end of your lathe spindle and do as above. Stage three..the "Posh" way is to use your master to make a new division plate for your indexing head. 60 divisions would be good because that would give you all multiples of 2,3,4,5 and 6. You May even be able to simply cut new notches in your existing plate..depending on the size of the original notches of course. Robert Bastow Tom Holt wrote: > > Help, please. > > I need to drill five evenly-spaced blind holes > I don't have a proper dividing head; what I've got is a 6" 3 jaw > chuck rotating around a spindle mounted on a baseplate that bolts to > the mill table, with 12 notches milled at regular intervals around > the edge of the chuck, and a sprung-loaded plunger arrangement to > lock it in place. This makes a perfectly good (for my purposes) > dividing head for when I want 3, 4, 6 or 12 divisions, but my poor > insect brain can't figure out how to calculate 5 with this rig. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Dividing From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 17 Mar 1999 04:16:32 GMT -------- Damn!! I could have saved myself a lot of typing if I had remembered this obvious answer!! Use the tables in "Machinery's" its easier!! Then make yourself a new division plate..Its faster!! Robert Bastow Jon Elson wrote: > Now, using your leadscrew dials, DRO or whatever you have > setup for measuring table position, go to these X and Y > coordinates, and drill your holes. > > Machinery's handbook has tables for this under 'jig boring'. > Mr. Machinist (a shareware program) does this, under > bolt circles or thereabouts. > > Jon ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: MSC adjustable reamers. No problems ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 17 Mar 1999 04:29:45 GMT -------- I HATE adjustable hand reamers!! Possibly because the only ones I have ever tried (and failed) to use were cheap ones. The problem to look out for is not so much the quality of the blade..but the quality of the body. It needs to be heat treated alloy steel. The cheap ones seem to have bodies made of FC mild steel and the tendency is for the blades to grab in the hole and twist the whole reamer up like a wet noodle...CRUNCH!! Robert Bastow David G. wrote: > > I would simply like to learn if the import adjustable (hand) reamers > from MSC are OK. They are almost suspiciously cheap compared to others I > have noticed. Any user reports ? > > TIA > David ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: FS: Vertical Knee Mill From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 17 Mar 1999 04:33:36 GMT -------- Pound for pound, dollar for dollar, condition for condition, the Exello is a far better machine than the Bridgeport! I have had several of each. Robert Bastow MP Toolman wrote: > > A little while ago, I bought a Bridgeport Series 1 from a local small machine > shop. They also have an Excello which is looking for a home. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: guns RE:do you use e-bay? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 17 Mar 1999 04:40:10 GMT -------- I didn't meean to imply that you didn't Gunner..I just wanted to add emphasis to a very valid point. In Northern Ireland the "Authorities" keep a very watchful eye on machine shops, knowing full well that they are a ready source of weapons from sten guns to 5" mortars. I believe it is difficult to import seamless drawn tubing into N I for that very reason!! Robert Bastow Gunner wrote: > > I posted it in all seriousness. I know how the "politicaly correct" > mind works > > On Tue, 16 Mar 1999 15:02:24 GMT, Robert Bastow > wrote: > > >This may not be as far-fetched as it may appear at first glance!! > > > >Not too long ago, in countries behind the "Iron Curtain" there was a a > >requirement for ALL typwriters, duplicating machines, photocopiers, printers and > >computers to be registered and be subject to strict controls. > > > >Free speech and the ability and willingness to protect it, are the things that > >ALL Governments fear the most. > > > >Robert Bastow > > > >Gunner wrote: > > > >> Remember fellas, if they take the guns, and you have the means to make > >> one, in your home shop, how long do you think that you will be allowed > >> to keep your lathes and your mills? > >> Do you think that it would be long before you need a liscense to have > >> an Atlas or Bridgport? > >> BATFMT? ======== Newsgroups: talk.politics.guns,rec.crafts.metalworking,alt.music.bootlegs,rec.toys.action-figures.discuss Subject: Re:Two Peoples Separated.. From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 17 Mar 1999 05:24:30 GMT -------- Anton Sherwood wrote: > > I wonder - are there people who really believe there are *no* big > cultural difference between Europe and the USA? They should try > spending time in Europe! There are probably no other two countries that have a closer bond of cultural and idealistic backgrounds than the United States and the United Kingdom. It is a "Special Relationship" that has stood the test of peace and war, good times and bad times...and long may it continue. However, I spent the first thirty something years of my life as a Brit (albeit travelling and working in (too damned) many different countries). I have spent the last twenty-two years over 'ere. I have been married to two English girls a Welsh lass and (FINALLY) to a Southern Belle from "Old Alabamie" Two of my sons are English, One is Canadian and One is American. I think I can lay claim to understanding BOTH cultures as well as anyone can. Let me assure you that the differences between, even our two cultures, are HUGE...Far bigger than anyone might imagine..especially an outsider looking at the "Special Relationship" The differences have to do with work ethic..even the whole POINT of work. They have to do with the whole concept of self reliance and self sufficiency. It is a difference of the expectations and the right of the individual to better himself. Above all they have to do with the whole concept of the rights and freedoms of the individual and the role that government is allowed to play. In my honest and considered opinion Britain has the right to claim to be the originator of modern civilisation and democracy...Magna Carta and all that. But quite frankly, whatever lead they had in that field was lost around 230 years ago (1776 and all that) when the banner was dropped by a society that had developed and perfected a system that let you know your place and kept you in it!! It was picked up and carried forward by a new nation of ragamufins who are STILL stumbling forward like a toddler taking its first steps. The point is that this ungainly toddler still manages to head in the right direction because ENOUGH PEOPLE STILL BELIEVE IN THOSE BASIC HUMAN RIGHTS AND ARE PREPARED TO DIE TO DEFEND THEM. And because government is reminded (not often or forcibly enough) but nevertheless it IS constantly reminded that this is Government OF the People BY the people and FOR the people. In other words..the government is there for the peoples benefit NOT the other way around. And, as students of history we know that the INEVITABLE tendency is for government to get bigger and for the people to slowly become RULED rather than GOVERNED. This is what has happened in the UK, it is why after years of firearms registration without protest, it was a simple matter for the government to round up all the "legal" firearms and leave the honest citizen without the means to defend himself, not just against the DIShonest citizens who daily become bolder...But against the TYRANNICAL Government that ALWAYS follows when absolute power corrupts absolutely. The point of all this..is that I am talking about two nations, that most Citizens of the two think are "Very Similar" Now extend that to OTHER nations..who we KNOW are "Different" and you might begin to imagine just HOW different they really are!! Above all we must NEVER take the lead for our destiny from those who have so miserably failed in theirs! Rant Mode OFF!! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Polyurethane adhesives? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 17 Mar 1999 05:33:57 GMT -------- And it is the Divils Own to get off your hands..has to WEAR off!! PKDickman wrote: > > In article <9q0H2.7127$l_3.8613@news.rdc1.bc.wave.home.com>, "Marty Reynard" > writes: > > >Have any group members had occasion to use any of the polyurethane adhesives > >(e.g. Franklin's Titebond) for metal to metal applications? I have some > >specialized jewelry projects and am curious how these adhesives perform over > >time compared to industrial epoxies. Marty R. > > > > I bought a tube of gorilla glue for a project. > It works by reacting with moisture in the wood or in the air and has a limited > shelf life. > The stuff foams up so you have to use very little. > As a result I've been gluing every thing together with it so I can use up the > tube before it goes bad. > The stuff will stick two pieces of metal together probably as good as epoxy and > probably better than superglue. > It's handling characteristics, however, are probably not well suited to > jewelery applications. > 1. The foaming action generates quite a bit of pressure (it's like great > stuff foam) as a result you can't reliably glue without clamping and you need > to keep the pressure on for at least 4 hours. > 2. It doesn't take too much glue to become too much. You have to keep an > eye on it for at least on hour to be sure the foam hasn't oozed all over your > project. > 3. The dried glue is an opaque beige foam like great stuff. > > Hope this helps > Paul K. Dickman ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Premonitions From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 17 Mar 1999 05:37:19 GMT -------- QUICK!! Put it on Ebay..I heard Chris is looking for a new one ;^) Robert Bastow Gunner wrote: > I offered $10, got it for 15. Thing is almost completly mint. > I do ok? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Two Peoples Separated.. From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 17 Mar 1999 05:49:02 GMT -------- Citizenship is a "Work In Process"...Interminably!! I have just had my fingerprints taken for the FOURTH time in three years...Because "they were out of date"!!!!!! Hey I love this country..but perfect it ain't. However I do appreciate y'awls hospitality. Robert Bastow Johnny Skinner wrote: > > Robert, > > I don't know if you have taken American citizenship, but I'm > convinced you are as American as any of us. Well stated, > old chap! > > Cheers, > > Johnny Skinner ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Recycling staples From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 17 Mar 1999 05:52:08 GMT -------- You ARE talking about using said knapkin at the TABLE, aren't you?? ;^) Robert Bastow Felice Luftschein & Nicholas Carter wrote: > >LAUNDRY!!! But there's still one GOOD side!! > The really sad thing about this thread is that my inlaws use a napkin > (paper) on one side, sharing it between them, then fold it over and > use the other side the next night. > They do this even though they get the napkins free from whichever > restaurant they eat at once in a blue moon. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: model eng.books From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 18 Mar 1999 00:31:13 GMT -------- Hey Dipshit! we have gone over this. Does your intellect have something to add?? The guy is just trying to be helpful..What is your contribution? Robert Bastow dip@shit.com wrote: > > On Wed, 17 Mar 1999 13:57:08 -0500, fay wrote: > > >I have 60 issues of Model engineering from England. 1951 thru 1952. all > >can be had for $40, interested write.:}sample cover in attachment. > > Thank you SO much for posting a 445Kb picture in a discussion group. > Since you mention this magazine is from England, perhaps the readers > of this group who are IN England will have some choice words for you. > > BINARY ATTACHMENTS DO NOT BELONG IN A DISCUSSION NEWSGROUP. > > The fact that you were unable to figure out how to reduce the file > size (as I just tried, and reduced it to under 70Kb) only further > endears you to us. > > I suppose I should be grateful you didn't post it as a 24 bit TIFF > file. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Apology and a question From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 18 Mar 1999 04:06:24 -0500 -------- Of course it does..I HAVE already done it! It is also the way they used to put the necks on gas cylinders. Ever wondered about that? Nowadays it is done by CNC controlled spinning machines. Robert Bastow Jayverni wrote: > > On >3/18/99 6:26 PM EST, Robert Bastow wrote: > > >It Will work if you make yourself a split die..like a blacksmith's top and > >bottom fuller only with the shape that you want to finish with. > > Awesome, Thank you very much! I will try it and let you know how it works! > [even though it sounds like you already know how it will work ;-). ] > > James Gribbon Jayverni@aol.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Ever made a box trailer? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 18 Mar 1999 04:13:06 -0500 -------- A VAST improvement on the original bodywork!! ;^) Robert Bastow KD6JDJ wrote: > > On making a box trailer ------- > > I made my last small box trailer for my V W pickup using the rear >axle from a V W Rabbit. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Bridgeport vs. Copies From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 18 Mar 1999 04:35:34 -0500 -------- The Exello is a heavier build, more rigid and more durable machine. The Exello has a stiffer spindle..most I saw used a 40 taper rather than R8. It also has square ways on the cross slide...just like REAL mills. All I hear about Bridgeports is people asking how to fix this, that, or the other!! One feller says they are wonderful "once you strip off the chrome and flake the ways and.." Faint praise indeed. Side by side in the same shop the Exellos were ALWAYS preferred by the operators, even with the extra usage, they way out-lasted them. When it comes to hogging a die or mold block out of a fifty or hundred pound chunk of tool steel there is NO comparison! Given heavy daily usage in a tool and die shop a Bridgeport starts to loose its "edge" in three years and is junk in 5 or 6. Need I go on? Please don't get me wrong! I am not saying that a Bridgeport is a "Bad" mill...any more than the Southbend is a "Bad" Lathe. Just be aware that in the greater scheme of things..There ARE better Machines! Robert Bastow Ryan Reid wrote: > > Someone recently stated that pound for pound an Excello mill is better > than a bridgeport (assuming both are in the same state mechanically). > > We all know that bridgeport was one of the first milling machine > manufacturers in the United States, if not the first. From my limited > exposure I have seen that most other milling machines are just copies > of the bridgeport machines without the nice rounded corners. > > What makes other mills of similar capacity and size better than a > bridgeport J or 2J? > > (I own a 2J) > > Ryan > ryanreid@sprintmail.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Tig Welder Question From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 18 Mar 1999 04:40:17 -0500 -------- I hope you get a better response that I do! I keep asking that question too! Perhaps BOTH our voices may get heard this time!! ;^) Robert Bastow acw@ecn.ab.ca wrote: > > Does amybody have any suggestions as to what is a good machine to consider > if you are concerened about: > 1) Quality workmanship on fine work mostly. > 2) Price (can you actually get a good machine for low cost) > Note: I am doing models in all sorts of materials. > Thanks > Avrum Wright > > -- > email: acw@freenet.edmonton.ab.ca ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Tig Welder Question From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 18 Mar 1999 08:51:23 -0500 -------- Ernie Leimkuhler wrote: Thanks Ernie, I was begining to wonder if it was Body Odor or something ;^) Ernie wrote; > I guess it just takes a keen eye for someone to see your question amid the > some 250 posts per night. > I am sorry if you feel your question was being ignored. > > And now on the the answer. > > Or should I say, more questions. > > What scale of work are you doing? Small to tiny; Gunsmithing and Model Engineering...Max 1/8" thickness, no plate or section welding. Bolt handles, shortening receivers will be the heaviest. Welding up pits, building up sears, sights, will be small end. > What vollume of work are you doing? Small volume..Infrequent use. Duty rating isn't a consideration. > What is your price range? I'd like to keep it under a grand > What machines are sold in your area? Most I guess I'm in Atlanta > What experience do you have with TIG? LOTS...Tiny stuff...1/16" or less electrodes..Had a side business rebuilding pockets on inserted carbide tooling (Engine block broaches and the like) No water cooling required, want a foot control, precise low amp control and timed afterflow. > What metals are you most likely to be welding? Exclusively ferrous...Mild and alloy steels. No interest in aluminum! > Throw some answers out and I will do my best to help. Again, Thanks Ernie. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Bridgeport vs. Copies From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 18 Mar 1999 11:49:47 -0500 -------- Jhko wrote: Ok, Lets put this straight! The Exello is NOT a CLONE of anything!! it is an Exello...Built in Canada for donkeys years befor anyone thought of cloning. As to who came up with the knee type layout and self contained head..probably Bridgeport. But if they hadn't sat on their fat asses and sold the same old stuff for YEARS after other manufacturers had PROVED that there were good improvements that cold be made to same basic design (Exello, Kondia, Tree etc) then maybe they wouldn't be trying now to sell a made in ???? piece of outdated machinery in the face of clones, some of which are equal or better in quality and all of which sell for half the price. If I were a millionaire I wouldn't buy a new Bridgeport when I can get three machines of equal quality for the same price. Robert Bastow > I think we are talking about two different things here. No question, a heavier > built #40 taper machine is better than a light R8 machine., especially for > hogging steel. A light bridgeport is nowhere near the usefulness of a heavier > #40 clone in this regard. What I was talking about the overall *quality*, in > terms of tightness of tolerances, finish, etc. I'm > not familiar with Excello, and maybe they are great, but the clones I've looked > at were good, but not as good as a bridgeport in terms of the quality as I've > defined it. > > Joe Osborn > > OMW Metalcrafts > "Quality Tools for the Home Shop Machinist" > OMW HOME PAGE: http://members.aol.com/omwmetal/omw.htm > EMail: JHKO@AOL.COM ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Tig Welder Question From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 18 Mar 1999 11:52:28 -0500 -------- What sort of price level for a used Miller? Mlnam wrote: > > If you can find a used Miller Syncrowave 300, buy it. You won't be > disappointed. They can't be beat for range, quality, versatility, durability > and ease of use. (MHO) Some welders and welding equipment repairmen say they > are still better than the newer 350 and 351 models. I've used them for many > years doing art restoration and fabrication as well as architectural work on > all kinds of metals from old brasses and bronzes to new stainless steel. > > Richard Coke > Delete .delete for e-mail ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Recycling staples From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 18 Mar 1999 17:25:32 GMT -------- Stay on their good side!! They are going to have a LOT of money to leave to someone!!! ;^) Robert Bastow Felice Luftschein & Nicholas Carter wrote: > > On Wed, 17 Mar 1999 05:52:08 GMT, Robert Bastow > wrote: > > >You ARE talking about using said knapkin at the TABLE, aren't you?? ;^) > Yes, I am, but I wouldn't put it past them to share TP. > This is a man and woman who: > resole $5 kmart shoes w/silicone and rubber scraps > make his own air filters for the car out of foam rubber > fly standby everywhere > never eat out without a coupon > etc. etc. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Apology and a question From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 18 Mar 1999 23:26:45 GMT -------- It Will work if you make yourself a split die..like a blacksmith's top and bottom fuller only with the shape that you want to finish with. Mild steel will do for a few hundred pieces..No need to harden it. Bore out the shape you want on a 2" cube of steel. split it in half and WELL CHAMFER/ROUND THE INTERNAL EDGES and I mean WELL chamfer them or you will have all kinds of problems with cold shuts. Weld on a long U shaped handle to keep them together (and keep them apart if you catch my drift) Heat up your pipe and slowly introducit into the big end of your die, rotating the pipe and bounding with a BFH at the same time. Stop when your necked piece is long enough. Robert Bastow I actually tried heating the pipe up and pounding it and that > definitely doesn't work so any other suggestions would be greatly appreciated. > Thanks for trying though! > > James Gribbon, Jayverni@aol.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Tig Welder Question From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 19 Mar 1999 17:11:03 GMT -------- Mike Graham wrote: > > On Thu, 18 Mar 1999 08:51:23 -0500, Robert Bastow wrote: > > >Small to tiny; Gunsmithing and Model Engineering...Max 1/8" thickness, no plate > >or section welding. Bolt handles, shortening receivers will be the heaviest. > >Welding up pits, building up sears, sights, will be small end. > > Do you have personal objections to inverter machines? Wots an Inverter machine?? Is portability an issue? No...it can be as light or as heavy as required...It ain't going nowhere! Since you're doing all ferrous > stuff, does scratch-start bother you, or would you need hot-start because of > the cosmetic issues in guns and models? Cosmetics is all important. I liked the foot control because you didn't have to scratch or even touch. Lotsa people can run a nice bead ONCE they get it started..it's at the start and finish where you get all the craters and chicken-shit. With the foot control one could start the arc tiny, play around with a pool of metal a 1/16" diameter, boost it up to 1/4" and back down again with the tip of your toe. No Craters, no chickensh** no porosity, perfect weld every time and I could teach girls to do the welding in half an hour!! They took to it fast..it was just like needlepoint in metal!! > > If you want portable it would be worth looking at the Lincoln >Invertec V250-S. It's a relatively high-amperage machine, but has some >really nice bells and whistles. Starting to narrow the field Portable not required High amps not required. Does anyone make a LOW (Top end) amperage machine like this? > The Square Wave 175 would probably be cheaper, but it's not portable, >and being a good ole' fashioned transformer/rectifier machine it only >goes down to 12 amps instead of 1 amp like the Invertec jobbie, which >is a factor if you want to weld tinfoil. 8-) Not tinfoil but certainly .030" thickness would be handy >If the touch-start TIG aspect of the V250-S is not practical (not >scratch-start, it's touch-start) then a Invertec V200T would be >better. One of the strong points of non contact start is the lack of electrode contamination, and maintainence of the point equals better control of the arc. Thanks Mike, I will print this and go look at prices..I still would like to keep this under a grand (Dream on Huh!!) Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Cupola Furnace Construction and Aluminum From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 19 Mar 1999 13:53:27 -0500 -------- I agree entirely with you, but there is one other factor to consider; and that is the "Ash Content"...How much non-combustible material is incorporated in the carbon form. I would imagine that some highly silacious woods would have a higher content than others. Certainly it is a factor when calculating the BTU content of different grades of coal. Robert Bastow Gary Coffman wrote: A pound of willow charcoal has exactly the > same BTU content as a pound of oak charcoal, but it has a different burning > rate in its raw state. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Bridgeport vs. Copies From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 19 Mar 1999 13:57:56 -0500 -------- I entirely agree! Than, I guess was the whole point of my message..That the Excello is not a CLONE of the BP, but a whole different and beefier machine. Robert Bastow G L Keeney wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote in message <36F0C8E6.6FC824D7@hotmail.com>... > >The Exello is a heavier build, more rigid and more durable machine. The > Exello > >has a stiffer spindle..most I saw used a 40 taper rather than R8. It also > has > >square ways on the cross slide...just like REAL mills. > > > -----snip----- > > No disrespect intended, Robert, but considering the differences you mention, > this seems an awful lot like comparing apples and oranges. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Tig Welder Question Thanks From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 19 Mar 1999 14:15:06 -0500 -------- I just want to say a BIG THANK YOU!!!..To all those guys who rose so magnificently to my plea for information. I Feel I know have enough information to get exactly what I need. Knowing that, it makes it a LOT easier to bite the bullet and spring $1400 to $2000 for the right equipment...Or at least know what to look for in used equipment. (Dream on..Huh!) Thanks Guys, it's what this NG is all about. Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: FS Monarch 10EE From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 20 Mar 1999 20:17:30 GMT -------- I'd say your trolling (before Troll was a BAD WORD) will raise a spark or two of interest!! Robert Bastow Bruce Lowell wrote: > > Just fishin' right now,but may soon have my 10 EE for sale, its a pre > tube model, runs beautifully, includes , Buck 3 jaw ,a 4 jaw, Face plate > ,5C collett holder (needs Draw bar) and numerous colletts, Steady rest, > Follow Rest, KDK tool holder/with many bars, Trav-a-Dial, True Trace, > tracer, and rotary phase converter.lots of other small stuff, am > thinking around 5K is this reasonable? located in So. Cal. > Thanx. > Bruce > brulow@ecom.net ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: A new model project From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 21 Mar 1999 01:39:50 -0500 -------- Mike Graham wrote: A MODEL .22!! Now there's a project! Say 1/10th scale to make it interesting. Make a heck of a varmint rifle for flies and roaches!! ;^) In that caliber (0.022") you would probably need sabot discarding, depleted uranium, arrow shot for roaches. Robert Bastow > Remington Cyclone .22LR 36 grain bullet > muzzle velocity 1280fps > @100 yards 1017fps > energy at muzzle 131ft-lbs > @100 yards 82ft-lbs > mid-range trajectory: 100 yards = 3.0" > > Hopefully this is enough info to build a model from. > > -- > Mike Graham, mike@headwaters.com > Caledon, Ontario, Canada (just NW of Toronto). > > Raiser of animals. Weldor of metals. Driver of off-road vehicles. > Writer of FAQs. Keeper of the faith, and all around okay guy. > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: '98 Darwin Awards From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 21 Mar 1999 01:47:32 -0500 -------- Erich Muschinske wrote: They were probably only a couple of hours from port! But with two days of good fishin' ahead, hey, what's the rush!! Hit the ball..Drag Fred...Hit the ball...drag Fred....? Three golfers, who's partner and best friend dropped dead on the second tee!! Robert Bastow Nominee #2: A sportsman fishing off the coast of Mexico. Refused to drop > a can with a homemade firework in it. Blew his hand off and bled to > death. His buddies being the sportsmen they are, tossed his body in with > the other catch and proceeded to the nearest port, two days away. > > There will be others, the year is still young. > > Erich ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Off topic, a request From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 21 Mar 1999 02:02:37 -0500 -------- Carl Byrns wrote: > > Hi, folks > I have a little problem that I know some of you have had in the past. Join the witness protection program! Robert Bastow > I have a relative who insists on e-mailing me an amazing amount of > drivel: warnings about viruses, lame jokes, inspirational stories from > Reader's Digest, you name it. Snip > The sender is my sis-in-law and I love her dearly, but she is driving me > nuts. > Any ideas? > TIA- Carl > PS- e-mail responses are appreciated. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: '98 Darwin Awards From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 21 Mar 1999 09:41:09 -0500 -------- Alan Shinn wrote: At one time I was heavily engaged in Export Sales, covering Europe, Africa, Middle East and North America. As you can imagine I was a "Frequent Flier"!!! The ONLY 'plane I ever missed in all that time...Was the Turkish Airlines DC10 from Paris to London..That crashed after takeoff!!! First and only time I ever found something good to say about Parisian traffic!! Robert Bastow > How about the rest of you, stepped aside to grab something just as the > grinding wheel exploded, stumbled just before some idiot runs a red > light where you would have been, etc? > Might be a fun thread. > -- > Looking forward: > Alan Shinn > > Experience the > beginnings of microscopy. > Make or buy your own replica > of one of Antony van Leeuwenhoek's microscopes. > visit http://www.sirius.com/~alshinn/ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: A new model project From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 21 Mar 1999 10:02:35 -0500 -------- Unfortunately "Nature doesn't Scale" that conveniently. Dimensions scale directly but volume, hence mass, varies as the cube root. A .22 lead ball (Assuming equal MV which would be unlikely because area varies as the square..equals less push in the first place) but assuming equal velocity to it's big brother, would sting like heck at close range. MAYBE it would penetrate a soft spot. However, another characteristic of small scale is that fluids, effectively become more viscous. To a fly, flying is more akin to swimming!! The velocity and energy of our miniscule bullet would drop off rapidly...a matter of inches. One good thing about this is that bits of grit thrown from,say a grinding disc, don't penetrate us through and through. Going the other way in scale, Imagine a 2.20" inch projectile at 1100 fps!! Soldiers in a bygone age, were paid a bounty for collecting enemy cannon balls that could be fired back at them. Many found to their cost, that a trundling, almost spent cannon ball, could still take your leg off!! ;^) Robert Bastow Mike Graham wrote: > > On Sun, 21 Mar 1999 01:39:50 -0500, Robert Bastow wrote: > > >A MODEL .22!! Now there's a project! > Well, if a 1/10 scale model .22LR had 1/10 power then at 100 yards (real > yards, not scale yards) it would have an impact power of 8 ft/lbs. I think > this thing would have about the power of a blow-gun, ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Re '98 Darwin awards From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 21 Mar 1999 10:12:37 -0500 -------- Close..But no cigar!! The 'Powder' used in big guns is a double basted nitro propellant, just like you would use in a modern rifle...except it comes in fist sized 'grains'!! Where the confusion may have arisen, is that the bag of 'powder' has a smaller bag of black powder stitched to its base, to act as as an 'igniter/booster' to get the real propellant going. Robert Bastow Nick Hull wrote: > Actually, the propellant used in the 16" guns IS black powder, and leaves > huge clouds of white smoke when they fire it. The accident would not have > hAppened with smokeless powder. > > -- > > Committees of Correspondence Web page: > http://www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/5357/ > - free men own guns, slaves don't ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: duplicating the knurling on a Japanese rifle safety From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 21 Mar 1999 10:30:14 -0500 -------- Me too! Me either!! I'm looking for a set of fine knurls in a convex *and* concave persuasion...the kind you would find on fine instruments..drafting instruments or microscopes etc. I saw them in a catalogue not too long ago...but I can't remember where. Any suggestions? Thanks, Robert Bastow Kurt Bjorn wrote: > I have seen advertisements for knurlers which will do convex knurls, but > they aren't common. I'm sorry, I don't remember where I saw them. > Kurt Bjorn > http://www.flash.net/~pyroware > Certified IC Engine whacko ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Need parts for South Bend 10L From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 21 Mar 1999 10:38:15 -0500 -------- My Heart felt condolences. I can imagine the sick feeling in your stomach as you heard that particular "Crunch" that falling machine tools make!! Cheer up though, there should be no problem finding the bits you need and I am sure our worthy listers will come up with all the right information. Could be worse..Could have been a new import machine, then you'd be SOL for parts!!! ;^) Robert Bastow Bill Edison wrote: > > Hey, > Just incase the inquires I have out aren't successful... > As the result of a foolish move on my part and some well-placed > floor-cracks, my 10L took a topple over the weekend. When it was upright > again, the carnage wasn't as bad as feared. The gearbox lever and > detent broke (The gear itself and knurled knob survived) and the > cross-slide handle, dial, and screw are history. Anyone got anything? > The rest of the lathe is in good shape. If I can't > come up with the parts, it may be Grizzly 12 x 36 time... > > cheers, > > Bill Edison ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Two Peoples Separated.. From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 21 Mar 1999 19:12:29 GMT -------- "Firearms Banned in the UK!!" Its a F******G JOKE!!! The joke of it is, that ILLEGAL guns were always easy to come by in the UK. As a (legal) collector and shooter, I, and every other shooter I knew had "Off-Ticket" weapons that ranged from pistols and rifles to full-auto weapons. I had a Sten gun that I bought from an ex National Service Quartermaster's clerk...Brand new in the original packing...for Five Quid!! I know where that gun is RIGHT NOW..and could have it in my possesion within hours of landing in the UK. From what my mother tells me about the fear she feels daily, even in my sleepy little Pennine home village...I wouldn't feel real safe without it!! I still maintain a lot of contacts over there, some of them are shooters/collectors. They still have guns, only now, a 100% are illegal rather than only 50% to 75%. Only difference is, that now they don't have to keep their collections in a police specified, police inspected "safe" room and they are no longer subjected to the possibility of a random inspection by the police as previously allowed by Firearms Certificate regulations. Naturally the price of illegal weapons and ammunition has gone up some..but availability is greater now! Like Prohibition in the USA, the "Illegality" and the larger market that has has been created has resulted in a flood of weapons being smuggled into the country. They come in container loads, welded into machinery frames car bodies, consumer electrics..You name it. Any one over there feel the need for a little "Homeowner's Insurance" contact me off list, once I establish your credentials I'll put you in touch with the right "Insurance Agent"!! When the Law is an Ass...people treat it as such!! Robert Bastow PumaRacing wrote: > >Don't know who you talk to Tony, but only about 1 % of my acquaintances > >think that removing legal guns was going to make them feel safer. ======== To: paul_probus@yahoo.com Newsgroups: talk.politics.guns,rec.crafts.metalworking,alt.music.bootlegs,rec.toys.action-figures.discuss Subject: Re: Do you use eBay? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 21 Mar 1999 19:21:35 GMT -------- Well put Paul, I know EXACTLY what you mean about the Anti-Immigrant, Anti-Foreigner, sentiments. It got scary for a while!! Robert Bastow paul_probus@yahoo.com wrote: > > In article <36F4AA1F.A4F3F0FA@ix.netcom.com>, > "W. E. Woods" wrote: > > > > > > Matt wrote: > > > > > > In article , dasher@netcom.com (Anton > > > Sherwood) wrote: > > > > > > > : wolfone@dillinger-2.io.com (no one of consequence) wrote: > > > > : > In other words, your mind is made up and you don't want to be confused > by > > > > : > facts? > > > > > > > > Matt writes > > > > : Or just perhaps he's heard the facts, ad nauseum, and has drwan the > > > > : obvious conclusions. Guns, on the whole, are instruments of death. > > > > : The United States would be a better place to live if they were kept > > > > : out of the hands of all but the police and the military. > > > > > > > > Would you like to hear about some other places where guns were kept > > > > out of the hands of all but the police and the military? > > > > > > As long as the government remains a democracy, it's not a problem. > > > > Something you cannot guarantee if you disarm the people. > > > > Exactly! What I never understood is why the ACLU and other liberals are > willing to defend every other right guaranteed in the Bill of Rights as an > individual right *EXCEPT* the right to bear arms. That is the only right > that, they say, is a "collective" right. > > Another example of people not having weapons when they needed them, in > addition to the LA riots mentioned in another part of this thread, is the > Bosnian civil war. Had the Muslim and Croat majorities been well armed at > the start, the Bosnian Serbs would not have stood a chance. Here is an > excellent example of where democratic rights were trampled (the war broke out > after the majority of Bosnians voted in *DEMOCRATIC* elections to succede > from Yugoslavia) by a well armed minority. > > While the situations in Bosnia and here in the US are very different. > However, if some people are proposing to allow only law enforcement and the > military to have weapons, they are creating a well armed minority and unarmed > majority, not unlike Bosnia. They are also gambling that a charismatic > political leader is not going to come along at the right time and convince > the military that the US would be better off with him/her as dictator. Don't > think it can happen? I say, Nazi Germany. With the recession we had in the > early '90's, I noticed an increase in anti-immigrant, anti-foreigner or > whatever you want to call it, sentiment. Imagine if the economic down turn > lasted 5 years, 10 years, 15 years or longer, how ripe this country would be > for someone with dictatorial ambitions. Imagine if the economy's in the pits > for that long and the newly elected President (at that time) suddenly > declares he needs absolute power to fix the economy, there'd be people > falling over themselves to give it to him. Disband Congress? Arrest all the > Senators? Martial law for the citizens? Sure, anything to fix the economy. > We're willing to overlook our President's perjury because the economy's doing > very well. > > Every citizen of the US has not only the right, but an obligation to defend > the Constitutional government our founding fathers laid out for us, until the > time we, democratically, choose to write up a new Constitution. > > Paul Probus > paul_probus@yahoo.com > > -----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==---------- > http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Emco-Maier Maximat Super 11 From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 21 Mar 1999 19:43:36 GMT -------- I have a Maximat Super II..Excellent machine, highly recommended! They are no longer being made, but Blue Ridge, (the Emco Distributor) had a couple of new ones for sale recently for, IIRC about $8500 each. Be warned that spares do NOT come cheap..but you won't need many!! The used price, in excellent condition, seems to be around $4500. I paid less than half that, ex school property and, after a good clean, de-burring of a few "Kiddy-bumps" and a few mods to suit me, it is perfect for my purposes and hopefully will see me out in my retirement. Get it if you can!! Robert Bastow ssmart@axionet.com wrote: > > Hi All, > > My Neighbour has this Emco-Maier lathe and I think he is willing to part with > it as he has only used it about 6 times in the last 4 years. It appears to be > in very good shape, I know he has not used it much and the previous owner > only did plastic prototyping with it. I'm not sure what tooling it has, > although it has what looks like a minature quick change toolpost (says emco > on it). I was told he only paid $1500 for it and a floor standing mill/drill > ( I think the other guy owed him some money as well). Anyone know what this > lathe would be worth? Is this a good lathe, opinions please. > > Thanks in Advance > > Scott > > -----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==---------- > http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Emco-Maier Maximat Super 11 From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 21 Mar 1999 19:46:38 GMT -------- Where is this place? For $3500 I will buy it NOW!!! And I am DEAD serious! I can get $4000 for my used one any day of the week!! Robert Bastow Marv Soloff wrote: > > ssmart@axionet.com wrote: > > > > Hi All, > > > > My Neighbour has this Emco-Maier lathe and I think he is willing to part with > > it as he has only used it about 6 times in the last 4 years. It appears to be > > in very good shape, I know he has not used it much and the previous owner > > only did plastic prototyping with it. I'm not sure what tooling it has, > > although it has what looks like a minature quick change toolpost (says emco > > on it). I was told he only paid $1500 for it and a floor standing mill/drill > > ( I think the other guy owed him some money as well). Anyone know what this > > lathe would be worth? Is this a good lathe, opinions please. > > > > Thanks in Advance > > > > Scott > > > > -----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==---------- > > http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own > > Scott: > > Clifton Tool (up the street from me) has had, for the last few years, > a NOS (new, old stock) Maximat 10 or 11 - I'm not sure - sitting in > their showroom. Price was $6500, now marked down to $3600 - but if > it continues to gather dust, it can probably be had for some $3000 or > so. > > Regards, > > Marv ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Emco-Maier Maximat Super 11 From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 21 Mar 1999 19:54:41 GMT -------- I should add...That is, if this is a Maximat Super II. The 10 is a toy by comparison and $3000 is WAY too much to pay for it. Get a good used Myford..or SB for that money. Robert Bastow Robert Bastow wrote: > > Where is this place? For $3500 I will buy it NOW!!! > > And I am DEAD serious! > > I can get $4000 for my used one any day of the week!! > > Robert Bastow > > Marv Soloff wrote: > > > > ssmart@axionet.com wrote: > > > > > > Hi All, > > > > > > My Neighbour has this Emco-Maier lathe and I think he is willing to part with > > > it as he has only used it about 6 times in the last 4 years. It appears to be > > > in very good shape, I know he has not used it much and the previous owner > > > only did plastic prototyping with it. I'm not sure what tooling it has, > > > although it has what looks like a minature quick change toolpost (says emco > > > on it). I was told he only paid $1500 for it and a floor standing mill/drill > > > ( I think the other guy owed him some money as well). Anyone know what this > > > lathe would be worth? Is this a good lathe, opinions please. > > > > > > Thanks in Advance > > > > > > Scott > > > > > > -----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==---------- > > > http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own > > > > Scott: > > > > Clifton Tool (up the street from me) has had, for the last few years, > > a NOS (new, old stock) Maximat 10 or 11 - I'm not sure - sitting in > > their showroom. Price was $6500, now marked down to $3600 - but if > > it continues to gather dust, it can probably be had for some $3000 or > > so. > > > > Regards, > > > > Marv ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Re '98 Darwin awards From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 01:25:03 -0500 -------- Nope, It's Nitro based with a (small) black powder primer. Not real smokeless..but that doesn't matter when you are sitting behind 16" of armour plate and directing fire by radar. Some of the smoke is generated by the burning of the silk bag the charge comes in plus the little bit of balck powder. Most of it comes from the nitro powder and is not white, but the characteristic dirty orange/brown of burning "Big Gun" powder. Robert Bastow Eastburn wrote: > > I have also heard that it was black powder - I think smokeless powder burns to fast to use. > Remember - the 2000+ lbs shell has to start moving - not rocket out of there. > Martin (whos great grand father commanded the great white fleet) Eastburn > -- > NRA LOH, NRA Life > NRA Second Amendment Task Force Charter Founder > Martin Eastburn, Barbara Eastburn > @ home on our computer oldtree@pacbell.net ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Ebay reality check ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 01:27:33 -0500 -------- David, Shhhh! ;^) Jack Erbes wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > David, Shhhh! > > > > > Boy, you can say that again. But maybe you better not. > > -- > Jack in Sonoma, CA, USA (jack@vom.com) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking,alt.usenet.usap Subject: Re: USAP Analysis of this newgroup, rec.crafts.metalworking From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 01:31:25 -0500 -------- WHO'S A LOUDMOUTH???? Robert Bastow > BTW, does whoever provides this review service think we don't know > who the > loudmouths are ? > > dave (ducking under his desk for a while) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Got a J Head Bridgeport Now what? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 01:34:39 -0500 -------- Look out Mike et. al.!! Gunner's after the title of "Starter of the Longest Thread in Recorded History"!! Robert Bastow Gunner wrote: > > Ive just been told that I am about to be the owner of a J-head > Bridgeport, step pully model. Ive seen the mill, and it is rusty and > nasty looking, but seems to be all there. It is three phase, and I can > run it. on my converter. Ok here is the question > Once I get it home, where do I start? If you got one like I did, where > would you start checking, testing etc etc, > > I am going to clean it up, repaint and all the rest, so Id like to > know just what order everything needs to proceed. > > Thanks > > Gunner > > "A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an > invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write > a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort > the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, > solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program > a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die > gallantly. Specialization is for insects." Robert Heinlein ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Ebay reality check ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 23:55:50 GMT -------- David, Shhhh! David Erickson wrote: > And as a seller, I probably should not give away the single best strategy > to get a lower price, but here it is: Bid *only* at the very end of the > auction. > > Don't give away your cards early; when you bid, others will respond. > > Ever notice how many of the items that sell for ridiculous prices are bought > by ebay users with feedback ratings under 10? These guys have no clue what > things are worth, they are new to the auctions and just want to win, and will > bid higher when they are outbid. > > Also notice how the number of bids on an item attracts attention to it. > > And finally, how easy it is to bookmark the current bidding list of other > users who like the same sort of tools you do, and who like to bid early. > > All of these point to one thing: bid only during the closing seconds of the > auction, when no one can respond to your bid, and no one has a clue that you > are interested. > > Dave > -- > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- > David Erickson Software Engineer Rational Software Corporation > email: davide@rational.com > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Ebay reality check ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 23:57:01 GMT -------- David, Shhhh! David Erickson wrote: > And as a seller, I probably should not give away the single best strategy > to get a lower price, but here it is: Bid *only* at the very end of the > auction. > > Don't give away your cards early; when you bid, others will respond. > > Ever notice how many of the items that sell for ridiculous prices are bought > by ebay users with feedback ratings under 10? These guys have no clue what > things are worth, they are new to the auctions and just want to win, and will > bid higher when they are outbid. > > Also notice how the number of bids on an item attracts attention to it. > > And finally, how easy it is to bookmark the current bidding list of other > users who like the same sort of tools you do, and who like to bid early. > > All of these point to one thing: bid only during the closing seconds of the > auction, when no one can respond to your bid, and no one has a clue that you > are interested. > > Dave > -- > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- > David Erickson Software Engineer Rational Software Corporation > email: davide@rational.com > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Ebay reality check ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 22 Mar 1999 23:57:14 GMT -------- David, Shhhh! David Erickson wrote: > And as a seller, I probably should not give away the single best strategy > to get a lower price, but here it is: Bid *only* at the very end of the > auction. > > Don't give away your cards early; when you bid, others will respond. > > Ever notice how many of the items that sell for ridiculous prices are bought > by ebay users with feedback ratings under 10? These guys have no clue what > things are worth, they are new to the auctions and just want to win, and will > bid higher when they are outbid. > > Also notice how the number of bids on an item attracts attention to it. > > And finally, how easy it is to bookmark the current bidding list of other > users who like the same sort of tools you do, and who like to bid early. > > All of these point to one thing: bid only during the closing seconds of the > auction, when no one can respond to your bid, and no one has a clue that you > are interested. > > Dave > -- > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- > David Erickson Software Engineer Rational Software Corporation > email: davide@rational.com > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------- ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Ebay reality check ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 23 Mar 1999 01:23:39 -0500 -------- I have successfully bought over a hundred items on ebay and AuctionArms..every single one under my maximum price/bid level!! How do I do that? I'll never tell!! ;^) Robert Bastow Jack Erbes wrote: > > David is right on the mark as far as bidding at the last minute, it is > the only way bidders can keep prices down if there is any interest. > > But remember, that has become the standard technique for many bidders. > So when you bid, bid the highest amount that you are actually willing to > pay for the item. > > That way if there are other last minute bidders who bid less than you do > you will still end up high. It bids your amount as a proxy bid so it > not go your full amount unless another bidder forces the bid up. > > You may end up getting it for one bid increment over the current high, > the full amount you bid, or you may not win at all. But you are in or > out at a figure you were willing to spend. > > -- > Jack in Sonoma, CA, USA (jack@vom.com) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Help (hints) needed for boring project From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 23 Mar 1999 01:29:55 -0500 -------- You could trepan it out..But if I have to explain how to do that..Best not try!! It will give you grey hairs! ;^) Try a spade drill. Robert Bastow Greg Holmes wrote: > > Here is the (hopefully simple) problem -- I have to bore out a 3" diam. > hole in a 4.5" diam. chunk of aluminum (this is for a collet for a > microscope stand). > > The question is -- Are there any quick ways (using standard shop tools) > to rough cut the center portion of this aluminum out (say, 2.75" diam.) > so that I can bore to specs without having to create a lot of aluminum > scrap? > > Thanks in advance. > > Greg > > ******************************* > Gregory M. Holmes, Ph.D. > CBNA > The Ohio State University > Columbus, OH 43210 > > holmes.38@osu.edu > ******************************* ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How to shread some .22 cases? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 23 Mar 1999 01:39:03 -0500 -------- I hope you don't want to machine the castings afterwards. Cartridge brass is 70/30..great for deep drawing..But the nastiest, stringiest, stuff you can imagine to machine. Chips have the uncanny ability to weld back on the work piece behind the tool. Forget negative rake tooling, treat it like soft copper..Lots of toprake, razor sharp tools and plenty of lube. Robert Bastow John Wasser wrote: > > I have access to a large supply of .22 rimfire amunitaion cases (fired) and > would like to melt them in my Propane-Fired Coffee-Can Foundry > (http://www.John-Wasser.com/NEMES/PCCF.html). The main problem is that they > allow so much air circulation that the zinc content tends to burn. I think if > I could grind or shred them into smaller pieces I could fit more in the > crucible and they would melt better. > > I have thought of using a kitchen meat grinder on them but don't want to spend > $50 on one without knowing if it has a > chance of working. Does anyone have other ideas? I suppose I could try > crushing them, too. > > -----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==---------- > http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Milling squared inside corners From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 23 Mar 1999 01:47:15 -0500 -------- Simple HSM solution.. File the corners of the mating piece to match the round corners of the hole!! Robert Bastow Tom Holt wrote: > > As far as I'm aware, there is no simple answer to this for the small > home workshop. If anybody out there can prove me wrong, I'd love to > hear about it. ======== Newsgroups: alt.machines.cnc,rec.crafts.metalworking,alt.machines.misc Subject: Re: Milling squared inside corners From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 23 Mar 1999 01:49:11 -0500 -------- HUH? /* Joseph H. > Allen */ > > int > a[1817];main(z,p,q,r){for(p=80;q+p-80;p-=2*a[p])for(z=9;z--;)q=3&(r=time(0) > > > +r*57)/7,q=q?q-1?q-2?1-p%79?-1:0:p%79-77?1:0:p<1659?79:0:p>158?-79:0,q?!a[p+ > q*2 > > ]?a[p+=a[p+=q]=q]=q:0:0;for(;q++-1817;)printf(q%79?"%c":"%c\n"," > #"[!a[q-1]]);} ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Sparkler From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 23 Mar 1999 01:55:20 -0500 -------- Thanks for the vote of (misplaced) confidence Eddy!! My considered, experienced, advice would have been to "RUN LIKE F**K".. I bet you couldn't have out run this old fart!! Robert Bastow Eddy Wells wrote: > DAMN !! WHERES ROBERT BASTOW?? HE KNOWS ABOUT THIS STUFF... > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What am I doing wrong with threading tool? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 23 Mar 1999 01:59:04 -0500 -------- Run faster..first direct gear! Robert Bastow Alden Hackmann wrote: > > I recently got a threading toolholder for my Aloris quick-change > toolpost. It takes TMNC inserts. I had a chance to use it yesterday, > and broke or chipped the tip of the insert in pretty quick order on all > three surfaces. After the first one, I was careful to check the > alignment, and take small (0.001-0.002) feeds. > > I'm cutting 5/16-18 threads in O-1 drill rod, with (I think) a C-7 > insert, on a 9" South Bend, lowest back gear. > > What should I be doing differently? > > Alden > > > -- > Alden F.M. Hackmann darkstar@u.washington.edu > Web: http://weber.u.washington.edu/~darkstar/ > "Beati illi qui in circulum circumeunt, fient enim magnae rotae." ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Ebay reality check ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 23 Mar 1999 04:21:51 -0500 -------- I was doing that years before ebay was invented!! Robert Bastow AZOTIC wrote: > > I herd connecting to the ebay auction site > causes you to be infected with a virus, you > can not resist the the temptation to buy things > you don't need once you are infected. This > infection is far worse than any drug known > to man, you loose all your friends and family > your home and job, ending in you living out > of your shop scrounging in scrap yards for > bits of metal to support your habbit. > > JUST SAY NO !!! > > Best Regards > Tom. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Micro welding? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 24 Mar 1999 02:44:14 -0500 -------- THERE'S a thought!! Let's Incorporate, go Public and make a fortune!! 8^) Robert Bastow Don Foreman wrote: > You could only wish for an engineering organization with the diversity, > talent, ingenuity, motivation level and resources that exist in this group. > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: ToolPost grinder? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 24 Mar 1999 03:10:08 -0500 -------- Been there..Done that! I'm afraid you will find that the bearings on your grinder (ANY hand grinder) are nowhere NEAR good enough and all you will get is a very rough finish. Now as a drive unit, belt driving a well made grinding spindle, your disc grinder may have possibilities. Check out Home Workshop Magazine recent issues for ideas. (Or is it Home Shop Machinist? Why are there two identical magazines coming from the same publisher??) Robert Bastow Clare Snyder wrote: > > Has anyone tried using a 4" disk grinder as an external tool-post > grinder? I was looking at mine and my Myford yesterday. If I make a > bracket to fit into a T-Slot on the carriage that sticks out towards > the chuck, wirh a bolt going up through the end into the threaded > handle hole in the grinder head, and then make a bracket to go from > the other handle hole back down to the carriage at an angle it should > fit pretty snuggly. This would allow me to grind shafting to a very > nice finish if I can get fine enough wheels. How fine does the stone > have to be at the cutting speeds we are looking at here? With a slow > enough feed and the high wheel speed just about anything should make a > smooth job?. > On the top bracket I can make a mount for the diamond wheel dresser. > The grinder centerline and work centerline will be just about dead on. > > Any feedback on this - Am I missing some dragons that are likely to > bite me? > > When grinding on the lathe, what precautions are usually taken re: > abrasives and ways, crossfeed, etc?. > Snyder Enterprises > Appropriate Technology for the Information Age > Waterloo Ontario. > > To reply please drop the r, and send to : > clsnyde@ibm.net or clare@snyder.on.ca > Too many misdirected replies plugging my mail box!!! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Re '98 Darwin awards From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 25 Mar 1999 01:41:39 GMT -------- (Yawn) Whatever happened to good 'ole HTML??? Drag is greater than proportional to V squared near the > speed of sound so in fact the bullet wouldn't go as far as I predicted. > As for the drastic difference in numerical values for bc, I think we > have a units problem here. My bc is defined as (the rate of change in > velocity in fps/ft) divided by (the velocity in fps) so the units are > ft^-1. Note that the approximate calculation of bc I posted is quite > close to the value we see here. > Just for the heck of it, I tried a bc of 0.008 (~10 times larger) with > the same V0 and get 151 yds range and opt angle of 21.6 degrees. This > is consistent with the previous results. > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Milling squared inside corners From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 25 Mar 1999 01:49:26 GMT -------- I guess therein lies the difference! To me the file is as accurate (or more so) than any other tool in my shop. It is capable of sub, tenth-thou accuracy if you take the time to learn its use. Tom Holt wrote: > > The message <36F738F3.68766641@hotmail.com> > from Robert Bastow contains these words: > > > Simple HSM solution.. > > > File the corners of the mating piece to match the round corners of the hole!! > > There you go, using the F word again. In my dictionary, "file" is > defined as "a long, serrated hand tool used for buggering up a > precisely machined piece of work"... ======== Newsgroups: alt.machines.cnc,rec.crafts.metalworking,alt.machines.misc Subject: Re: Milling squared inside corners From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 25 Mar 1999 01:52:06 GMT -------- D'accord! hamei@pacbell.net wrote: > > hate to get into this same old argument, but NO !!! it is NOT possible to > make "precision' gears on a cheap lathe. It is NOT possible to make 'precision' > gears on an *expensive* lathe. Precision gears are cut on gear machines. > (references and data available on request) > > skål ! > > ---------------------------------------------------------- > Härad Ængravvård > Master of all he surveys > ----------------------------------------------------------- ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What am I doing wrong with threading tool? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 25 Mar 1999 01:57:33 GMT -------- Practice, Practice, is all it takes. That, and the knowledge that if it CAN be done, YOU can do it!! It is a LOT easier than you imagine...How the heck do you think *I* could do it otherwise?? Robert Bastow Alden Hackmann wrote: I'm not sure I can disengage the carriage and pull the tool > out in time at higher speeds, but I'm willing to try it. Suggestions of > how to gain this skill will be appreciated. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What am I doing wrong with threading tool? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 25 Mar 1999 02:00:26 GMT -------- There you go again Marc..shooting your mouth off!! Soon, we Girls will have NO secrets!! ;^) Robert Bastow Marc Warden wrote: but where one needs to > turn the part at a (relatively) high speed for finish, I've turned the threading > tool upside down and threaded from the headstock out towards the tailstock. The > threading tool is on the operator side of the part, just upside down. The part > must be turned in reverse. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Weight of a Heavy 10... From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 25 Mar 1999 02:10:54 GMT -------- Best advice Sean! FIND a pro mover, pay the tab, and go drink beer while they do the job! Quite apart from the danger and liability of doing it yourself...It is worth it, in terms of not having to worry and scheme about it for the next month. Concentrate on the joys of making stuff!! Voice of experience! Robert Bastow Sean Thomas O'Malley wrote: > > Howdy folks, > > In anticipation of taking delivery on a South Bend Heavy 10, I've been > perusing the old threads on moving machinery. Those various anecdotes > have me concerned both about getting the crated machine from the freight > terminal to my shop and then into its final resting place and out of > the crate. > > For those of you who have done this before, how much does a SB like > this weigh? For the record, it's a Heavy 10 with 4 ft bed and a > tube steel cabinet base. I'm assuming this won't be the nightmare > experience that a vertical mill would be, but I still want > to go at this the right way. I live in a small town, so there > aren't a whole lot of pro movers to choose from. > > Thanks, > > --sean ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Flat Rolling From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 25 Mar 1999 02:16:00 GMT -------- Yer Kiddin'! Right?? The "Real Fifi" FEFA wrote: > > Hi .. Need your help to figure out a way to solve this problem. I have a 2 > in. thick steel plate , we want to reduce its thickness by some rolling steps > so its final thickness is 0.75. The roll s radius are 30 in. and the > coefficient of friction between the rolls and the steel is 0.25. Now the > problem is.. how many steps do I have to make so that the reduction is always > the same.And what draft should I use. The maximum draft is 1.875 in. > > Really would apreciate it if you could at least HINT me!!! He-he!!! > > Thanx!!!! > > Maria! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: a fine cut on electroplated nickle From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 25 Mar 1999 02:21:45 GMT -------- Use a series of split laps. Robert Bastow john deffner wrote: > > I've got a 9" diameter cylinder that has an electroplated nickle > sleeve about 5 thou thick mounted on it. The sleeve has ripples in it > that are about 200 micro inches high in addition to general surface > roughness. We've tried polishing, and can get the surface pretty much > mirror smooth with lots of work, but are having trouble getting rid of > the ripples. We need to get them down to under about 20 micro inches > and also pr0oduce a mirror finish. > > We've been talking about turning or grinding off the 200 micro inches, > and have the bearings and carriage to hold the tolerances easily, but > I'm pretty baffled about the proper tool. Would a diamond or carbide > be reasonable? Would a grinding wheel mounted on the carriage be > better? I've got *really* good control over feed rates in both the > linear direction and rotation if that's significant. > > Any ideas? > > John ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Auction Report From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 25 Mar 1999 02:23:43 GMT -------- And you thought Ebay was the "Great Satanic Paper Tiger"??? Robert Bastow J. Kimberlin wrote: > > Went to a machinery auction today in San Leandro, California. > The company going out of business was Plynetics, a rapid > prototyping company. The auctioneers were Ashman Company. > > I thought prices were rediculous and would like to know what > y'all think. > > Bridgeport mills $5000, not junk but still rather ordinary > Kurt 6" Angloc milling vises $175-$250 > 6" Baldor grinder on a nice pedestal $225 > roller cart with 24 CAT-40 tool holders $800 > 3 shop vacs $150 standard 35 gal size > Harig 6x18 surface grinder $5000 > > But for me the real item was the Sherline lathe, nothing special, > with a tool holder that went for $850. Was billed as a jewelers > lathe. Wasn't even cleaned up for the sale. > > I haven't been to an auction for a few years, but I didn't know > how far out of it I really was. > > JerryK ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: FS: Guy Lautard Stuff From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 25 Mar 1999 02:24:46 GMT -------- Lautard musta said sumpn' Huh? NJRich wrote: > > Best Greetings, > > I'm selling my Guy Lautard stuff. I'm selling it altogether for > $55. This includes: > > -Machinist Bedside Reader #1, #2 & #3 > -Hey Tim I Gotta Tell Ya > -Guy Lautard's Comprehensive Index to the above 4 books. > -The 90 minute video " A Visit With Guy Lautard and Bill Fenton. " > > The price includes shipping. Please email me if interested. > > Thanks, > > NJRich ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Atlas lathe bearings From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 25 Mar 1999 02:30:04 GMT -------- Nearly got me there Grant! I was all set for a "You gotta be SH****N me!!!" Response. Then I read the last line! Robert Bastow Grant Erwin wrote: > > Simple! Put a sensitive sensor on the spindle, and filter the > data, then do a FFT on it and look for a dominant harmonic at > some integer number of the spindle speed. If there is a > prominent peak (like say at 12X spindle speed) well then you > have ball bearings with 12 balls! > > Just kidding, I only give answers like this to college professors! > > Grant Erwin > Seattle, Washington > > who has no idea - maybe if there's the capacity to oil the bearings > they aren't rollers? > > -- > Please don't 'reply', rather, mailto:grant_erwin@halcyon.com > as my 'reply-to' mailing address is anti-spammed. > > "J. Reid" wrote: > > > > I need to know how to tell if my Atlas 618 lathe has roller bearings or > > bronze, without trying to disassemble. I have an extra casting that could > > sell if it fits the rollers. Both castings have bored holes, not split, > > with oil cups on top. > > > > thanks > > > > J. M. Reid > > Issaquah WA ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Resonance? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 25 Mar 1999 02:40:48 GMT -------- It is commonly called "chatter" and your thrust bearings need attention. Robert Bastow (look out Mike...I'm after the title!!) Lathenut wrote: > > Hi, guys. Is this the correct term? I have, on more that one occasion, > experienced this problem. It happens almost always when I run the carriage in > reverse (toward the tailstock). I wind up with minute ridges equally spaced > along the workpiece. Can anyone tell me what causes this and what, if anything, > I can do about it? > Thanks in advance, Bill. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT: Opinions regarding metal 'backstop' for indoor shooting From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 25 Mar 1999 00:48:16 -0500 -------- I would add some form of positive ventilation too Mike. With all those lead fumes in the basement..you don't want to finish up like me!! Robert Bastow Mike Graham wrote: > > I'm looking for opinions. > > I want to make a backstop, or 'target' for indoor shooting with a .22LR > (that might make it *on* topic, actually, given recent threads. 8-) > > My plan is to take a foot square chunk of 1/2" plate as the primary > backstop, and then surround this by a field of heavy sheet metal (1/8" or > so), and the sheet will be angled forwards, it won't just be flat. > > What I'm trying to avoid, here, is taking a ricochet between the eyes. 8-) > > A layer of easily-replaceable chip-board would coat the steel to dampen > rebounds. > > An alternate, but much heavier, idea, would be to use a 2' x 1' chunk of > 1/2" plate angled forward 45 degrees so that any bullet that hits it bounces > down into a bin of sand or something. > > I'm assuming that 1/2" plate will put up with a virtually unlimited number > of direct hits from a .22LR without injury. > > So what do you think? > > Is there a standard size of paper targets? > > -- > Mike Graham, mike@headwaters.com > Caledon, Ontario, Canada (just NW of Toronto). > > Raiser of animals. Weldor of metals. Driver of off-road vehicles. > Writer of FAQs. Keeper of the faith, and all around okay guy. > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Sites for homebuilt shop equipment? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 25 Mar 1999 00:55:53 -0500 -------- Try www.bloodyhardwork.com ;^) Sometimes it is better to buy these items. If you have to ask how to make them you are going to have a real hard time running the equipment you will need to even make a start on them. Robert Bastow BrinkWeld wrote: > > I would appreciate any links to sites that show how to build home shop > equipment such as disk sanders, shop/machinist vises, fixtures and the like. > Thanks in advance! > Bud ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What am I doing wrong with threading tool? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 25 Mar 1999 09:44:10 -0500 -------- Firstly, what gave you the idea that you should/could advance the tool into the workpiece without it rotating? Secondly, it is standard practice and usually acceptable to turn a narrow groove at the end of a thread..Called a "Landing Groove" It is equally permissible and very desireable to turn a similar grove when you are threading left to right. In which case it would be OK to call it a "Starting Grove" In either case, the tool is advanced into the work or the groove, with the spindle rotating but befor engaging the half-nuts. Unless of course you do not have disengageable half-nuts, or for some reason a groove is not desireable..In which case you have to, with the spindle stationary, first advance the tool to within a few thou of penetration, start the spindle, and advance the tool ASAP. This is left to right of course. Right to left, you have to ramp out the tool as it approaches the end of the thread and stop the spindle before you hit the shoulder!! A bit of fast and fancy handwork needed, and you might want to practice a bit at a slower speed. But can and is done all the time. Robert Bastow paul_probus@yahoo.com wrote: > OK, I haven't tried to thread with the carbide inserts I have (TT-221), but I > did try to turn down a piece going from left to right (headstock to > tailstock). When I advanced the tool into the piece (about .005"), while the > lathe was not turning, I snapped the point off the tool. Unless I'm missing > something, don't you have to advance the tool into the workpiece with the > spindle not turning? Other than making a groove, how can you advance the tool > without snapping off the point? Or can negative rake inserts take being > advanced into the work a short distance (is .005" short enough?) without > breaking? > > Performing the same operation, while the lathe was turning, I was able to > advance the tool into the piece without snapping the point. > > TIA, > Paul Probus > paul_probus@yahoo.com > > -----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==---------- > http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own paul_probus@yahoo.com wrote: > > In article <36FAA5F7.10864F67@diabloresearch.com>, > mwarden@diabloresearch.com wrote: > > Sorry. I'll go stand in the corner... > > > > Sincerely, > > > > MarcW. > > > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > > There you go again Marc..shooting your mouth off!! > > > > > > Soon, we Girls will have NO secrets!! ;^) > > > > > > Robert Bastow > > > > > > Marc Warden wrote: > > > but where one needs to > > > > turn the part at a (relatively) high speed for finish, I've turned the > threading > > > > tool upside down and threaded from the headstock out towards the > tailstock. The > > > > threading tool is on the operator side of the part, just upside down. The > part > > > > must be turned in reverse. > > > > OK, I haven't tried to thread with the carbide inserts I have (TT-221), but I > did try to turn down a piece going from left to right (headstock to > tailstock). When I advanced the tool into the piece (about .005"), while the > lathe was not turning, I snapped the point off the tool. Unless I'm missing > something, don't you have to advance the tool into the workpiece with the > spindle not turning? Other than making a groove, how can you advance the tool > without snapping off the point? Or can negative rake inserts take being > advanced into the work a short distance (is .005" short enough?) without > breaking? > > Performing the same operation, while the lathe was turning, I was able to > advance the tool into the piece without snapping the point. > > TIA, > Paul Probus > paul_probus@yahoo.com > > -----------== Posted via Deja News, The Discussion Network ==---------- > http://www.dejanews.com/ Search, Read, Discuss, or Start Your Own ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: He's Ba-ack!!! From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 31 Jul 1999 14:14:42 -0400 -------- Hey, I missed youse guys!! Due to a screw-up in changing over to a new ISP I have been unable to receive the RCM for quite some time. However, that is now sorted and my withdrawal DT's, nausea, etc are assuaged!! Tell me what is new and exiting? On my front, I have completed my wooden subfloor in the basement workshop and am installling vinyl/asbestor tiles (excellent for the job) I have just installed my new (Used) Deckel FP1..an Ebay coup!! Have recently been building a couple of custom, English style, "Express Rifles" in .500 Jeffery and .505 Gibbs calibers. I hade to "Magnumize" a couple of standard Mauser 98 actions to handle these honkin' great shells!! Next project is tooling up the Deckel. Had a bad start there!! I bought a 12" Troyke Rotary table and had it shipped UPS. Large package arrives (24"x24"x12") In spite of red sticker warning "Heavy!! Weight 170lbs" the UPS man hands it to me with ONE HAND!! Inside, a bunch of Charlotte NC newspaper and the Troyke handwheel!! SH*T!!! The Deckel has horizontal and vertical spindles, both with 4MT tapers. First job is to make an adaptor sleeve so I can use my considerable collection of R8 tooling. Eventually this will be a semi-permanent installation of a hardened and gound-in-situ sleeve in each spindle bore. However, as a temporary expedient, I bought a cheap 4MT to 2MT adaptor sleeve, with soft body/hardened tang, from MSC. I plan to part off the tang end, wack it into the spindle, take out the quill, transfer to lathe and machine/grind the R8 configuration using the fixed steady and running the spindle in its own bearings. For those not familiar with the Deckel mill, Tony Griffiths Has som excellent pics on his web site. Glad to be Ba-ack! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: FS: Rolling Mill From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 01 Aug 1999 06:16:06 -0400 -------- Now that's JUST what I need for my Home Machine Shop!! Gives a whole new meaning to "roll your own" No more fighting the Atlanta traffic on a Friday afternoon dash (crawl!!) down to Metal Supermarket for the chunk of hot rolled I need for the weekend's project. As you didn't specify a price (an ABSOLUTE requirement if you wish to get anyone's serious attention hereabouts!!) but invite offers...here's mine: US$1.98 delivered CIF my back door. Robert Bastow EJOG wrote: > > For Sale ex UK Works:- > > United 90" 4 High Reversing Steel Rolling Mill. Work Roll 24.125" Dia. Back up > 46" Dia. with in and out roller feed tables and descaling unit. Available with > associated Furnaces, 2m x 100 mm Hot and 96" x 3" Cold Levelling Rolls, 3660 > mm x 32 mm Cross Shears, Roller and Transfer Tables etc.. > > Offers invited > Richard J Green, BA > - Machinery & Equipment Services Broker > Hexham, NE47 7JD, England. > Fax +44 1434 344247 ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: DC Motor From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 01 Aug 1999 13:25:10 -0400 -------- Hi Yourself Eddy, If you haven't already done so...Your first choice might be the drill press!! It is the ONLY machine in my shop where I feel a VS drive is REALLY justified. I just picked up a 90V DC drive on Ebay and am looking for a suitable motor to convert my drill press (Delta POS). I can't wait to get rid of the POS motor and the "wrasslin'" with dual vee belts every time I change drill size! Robert Bastow ewells@my-deja.com wrote: > > Hi List, (and you to TEENUT) > > I have an old DC Motor, that belonged to my Dad, and > am trying to find a use for it. > > It's a Baldor, frame 56, 1HP, 24VDC, and draws 42AMPS > at 2200RPM. Weights about 30 lbs..... > > Any Ideas?? > > Please don't say boat anchor.... > > Eddy Wells > Conroe,Texas > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Share what you know. Learn what you don't. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: He's Ba-ack!!! From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 01 Aug 1999 13:31:51 -0400 -------- Very kind of you to say so. Thanks, Robert Bastow Don't force it...Use a bigger hammer!! Glenn Neff wrote: > > Welcome back I have missed you to :) > Glenn Neff > Medford OR ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Electrical setup for Harbor Freight gearhead lathe? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 01 Aug 1999 17:19:15 -0400 -------- Welcome to the real world!! If you REALLY ARE an Electrical Engineer, and someone else asked YOU that same question..Wouldn't you be the FIRST to advise him strongly to go wring it out for himself?? You are better qualified to do this than most people..and you have no excuse for not wanting to be 100% sure of every nuance and vagiary of electrical stuff that you yourself have paid good, hard cash for, are going to be poking about in, and running, (eventually) on a consistant basis. Or do I neeed to remind you, that that electrical sh*t can KILL you!! Robert Bastow Alan Mimms wrote: > > Hi folks, > > I just bought a new Harbor Freight lathe. It's their item number 33274 > - 12"x36" heavy duty geared head lathe. It was on sale ($1999 - sale > ends TOMORROW). I had a HELL of a time moving the >800lb lathe (and the > >600lb vertical mill I bought at the same time) down into my basement > shop, but that's all done now and my friend and I are mostly able to > walk again :->. > > Now I want to fire up the lathe. I had a 220V 30A circuit wired up with > a drop connector and have wired up the wire from the lathe. Before > I plugged it in, I checked the wiring diagram to see if it came wired > for 220V or 110V. Apparently it comes wired for NEITHER, although the > panel lamps are powered from a conservatively wired transformer lashup > wired for 220. (If you plug it into 110, you just get half-brightness > lamps. If you wire it to 220, they're full brightness.) > > The problem is the wiring diagram and "explanation" that comes with it. > The book refers to various terminal block connections like U1, U2, V1, > V2, Z1 and Z2. Unfortunately, one of the terminals I need to wire up > (according to the little diagram) labelled "V1" is NOT PRESENT on the > terminal block or on the schematic diagram. There is no terminal block > with no label, no likely candidates of any kind that I could check out > to be sure. I would like to avoid buzzing out all of the wires to see > how they actually are wired to find where V1 is supposed to be. I am an > electrical engineering major - I know something about electronics - but > this is OPAQUE stuff. > > Has anyone done the electrical wireup for this lathe before? I suppose > I can try calling Harbor Freight, but I expect them to be pretty hard to > get any info out of. The tool is made at the Shaoxing Machine Tool > Works in China and the manual is pretty hard to understand. It has a > lot of grammatical difficulties and a lot of references to non-US style > of engineering terms and abbreviations. > > Thanks for any help. > alan ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Hendey Machine tools From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 01 Aug 1999 17:42:23 -0400 -------- Bearing in mind that this is a REC CRAFTS metalworking group ie for recreational rather than "working" machinists, I would argue a strong case for choosing the shaper as a first machine..rather than a mill. I have just aquired a Deckel FP1 for my home shop..the realisation of a lifelong dream!! However, the 8" Boxford shaper came FIRST, and takes pride of place beside the Deckel. It has many projects planned ahead for it, that the Deckel CAN"T do and if, GOD FORBID, I was reduced to having to choose to keep one or the other, there is absolutely no doubt in my mind that I would choose to keep the SHAPER!! So far as your own PROFESSIONAL shop is concerned...you know your own business requirements. However I too, have had a LOT of experience in owning and running Professional, high precision jobbing shops. I always made sure I had a shaper on hand..and from time to time it was a LIFESAVER!! I guess the other, unsaid point is YOU HAVE TO KNOW HOW TO USE, (I mean REALLY use) A SHAPER, TO TRULY APPRECIATE ITS VALUE! Robert "The Metal Shifter" Bastow Yasmiin wrote: > > Hi, > > Well I can't defend the practicality of a shaper in a modem shop -- the > shaper, ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: flat belt >> multi-V belt From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 01 Aug 1999 18:03:02 -0400 -------- Conversion to Poly-Vee belt drive, from flat belt or Vee belt drive is one of the most worthwhile HSM Projects!! In most cases the machine is TRANSFORMED!!...Quieter, better balanced, more efficient and capable of taking muck heavier cuts than before. (This latter assumes that the original metal, design and bearings are up to snuff) Robert Bastow ken mayer wrote: > > Does anyone have experience using a multi-rib belt in place of a plain > flat belt? I'm thinking of modifying my Logan 11x36 to use a 10-rib "J" > belt in place of the flat one. Any suggestions, comments, precautions, > etc? > > -- > > Ken > :-) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: TIG welder question From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 01 Aug 1999 18:09:45 -0400 -------- I just Got me a Lincoln Square Wave 175. Price was VERY reasonable and the more I use it the more I like it..real "weld a wing on a gnat" stuff. Two thumbs up from me. Robert Bastow Georgina Bourke wrote: > > I am going to in the near future invest in a Tig welder. > Does anyone know of any good sites for info about them? > other than do a search. > I live in Australia so the overseas brands may not be available here. > I need one that can weld S/S and Al but not together, I believe that one > requires AC current and the other DC abd also the ability to be able to > reverse the polarity. > Any and all assistance is most welcome > Thanks in advance > -- > Kindest Regards > Wayne. > Metal Work Page http://modelengines.freeservers.com/ > Model IC Club page http://www.clubs.yahoo.com/clubs/modelicengines ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: kaowool From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 01 Aug 1999 18:13:46 -0400 -------- Try the knifemakers list Used to be several regular contributors willing to supply smaller quantities of Kaowool and the IPC 100 to line it with. tom wrote: > > I am hunting for a source for Kaowool, can anyone help? > > Thanks > Tom Black > vango@hiwaay.net ======== Newsgroups: alt.engineering,alt.rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.crafts.metalworking,alt.autos,alt.railroad.steam Subject: Re: The car of the future: why not use steam? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 02 Aug 1999 04:57:58 -0400 -------- "Sometimes it is better to remain silent and be thought a fool, than to open your mouth and remove all possible doubt" Go research Doble and Stanley Steamer and thn come back and apologise!! Teenut James W. Swonger wrote: > > In article <37a3733c.1898675@news.erols.com>, > wrote: > >The car of the future: why not use steam? > > > ... (snippage) ... > > > >Surprise, we had them over 60 years ago. With a few updates, > >the Stanley Steamer, an auto design that goes back to 1918, > >could be the zero-emission car of tomorrow. I've read that the > >Stanley Steamer could go over 120 miles per hour, and could run > >on any fuel that would create a flame hot enough to boil water. > > > >The combustion chamber in the boiler can be designed to > >accommodate any combustible substance. The fuel is burned > >clean, producing no more pollution then a household gas > >heater. The steam cars of yesteryear used inexpensive fuel > >oil or kerosene. For even less pollution, wood alcohol or > >the new bio-diesel fuels being developed by the Department > >of Energy could be used. A properly designed burner system > >could burn a variety of fuels by using an oxygen sensor in > >the exhaust to control the proper fuel air mixture. That > >means as prices change over time, your car could always use > >the cheapest fuel available. > > > >But would steam cars be durable and reliable? How about this > >for reliable; A Doble model E14 steam car produced in 1923 > >was driven over 600,000 miles requiring only normal > >maintenance! That's even better than a Volvo can do! The > >Doble cars required no more maintenance then their internal > >combustion counterparts. Other Dobles are known to have > >traveled over 200,000 miles having only routine oil and tire > >changes. Try getting that out of any 1999 American or Japanese car! > > > >With all these advantages, and with no real cost for new > >research, the major car companies would be recklessly > >wasting their stockholders money not to use steam as > >the automobile power source of the Twenty-First Century. > >DaimlerChrysler could save that $1.4 billion and put it > >into dividends for its shareholders. Think about that, investors! > > Now, I'm a fan of steam power and all, but this seems like > a lot of hyperventilating. > > Paragraph 2, all full of "could/can be designed/developed", > and then paragraph 4, "no real cost for research". Just a > little bit of dissonance there. Stick to one story at a time, > it's more believable. > > I've seen two steam powered automobiles up close. Neither > of them would be saleable today. The Guvmint aside, nobody's > going to buy a car with a warm-up time of 1/4 - 1/2 hour, > or with a boiler prone to developing leaks (like the Stanley). > The other one I saw had, I'd guess, a few HP of power, chain > drive (less stout than my motorcycle). How much power do > you get out of a double-action, 1" bore x 1' stroke cylinder? > Top speed is one thing, but you'd best get there within the > space of an on-ramp. At least it had a roof.... > > If you want widespread acceptance, you need closed cycle > operation. That means a pretty big radiator and even so, not- > so-hot efficiency. You need flash boilers with very high > efficiency and flow, to get the performance and the size > envelope consistent with an auto. Got one handy? Didn't > think so. Somebody's going to have to "recklessly waste" > some money getting that perfected. And a bit more making > sure that less than one in a million fails in such a manner > as to make the evening news. > > Show me, not a bunch of secondhand images and rambling > technopolitical goo, but a functioning, 100MPH, <10sec > 0-60, 30MPG{pick your liquid fuel}, crashworthy and > yes, I want a trunk, vehicle. How about starting with > a 20HP steam powerplant with no hidden wires that would > even fit? > > -- > ########################################################################## > #Irresponsible rantings of the author alone. Any resemblance to persons # > #living or dead then yer bummin. May cause drowsiness. Alcohol may inten-# > #sify this effect. Pay no attention to the man behind the curtain. Billy!# ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Cleaning Files From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 02 Aug 1999 05:39:33 -0400 -------- The file cleaner doesn't need to be as soft as brass or copper!! Remember that files are "Dead Hard"...60-62 Rockwell!! My file "comber" is a strip of 16Ga Mild steel, 3/4" wide. It is so successful that it now sports a custom turned cherry wood handle with a chic polished brass ferrule and occupies acoveted slot in my file rack. By The Way..The old saw about chalking files to prevent "pinning" is the biggest heap of "dump" ever perpertated on unsuspecting metal shifters. I also recall reading a couple of times that a file, ""contaminated with oil would never cut again!! BOLOGNA!!!!! A file is a CUTTING TOOL!! A Linear Broach!!! A "flat" Milling Cutter!! I spray my files with WD40..Before, during, and after "filing for effect" Not only does it prevent rusting (the file's biggest enemy)..BUT...It almost totally eliminates pinning, promotes easy, fast and smooth cutting..AND..With a bit of practice, leaves a surface finish that rivals that of surface grinding!! HUH!!??? Go get yourself a new, SHARP, file of good quality..Nicholson, Grobet, American-Swiss... Treat it like GOLD!! (Hey...Try MAKING one!!) Break it in for a coupla years, filing only Non-Ferrous materials. Spray with WD40 and get down to some SERIOUS filing...Say a double rifle action body from solid steel..."Striking" (draw filing) a set of Purdey barrels...Sinking, fettling and detailing a mold cavity before handing off to the Polishers.... When finishing, wipe the file with the ball of your thumb, against the "cut", every few strokes. Brush the file clean and re-spray every dozen or so...Enjoy a new dimension in metal smithing!! Brush her down, spray her down, and "Put her up wet!!" I other words, treat your files like any other precision tool in your shop. Learn the skills and the art of filing... The back wall of my bench sports a rack of over fifty files..some as old as I am???? They get a daily workout and good treatment..They will see my lifetime out..and a couple more generations too..if handled right! PS.. Thinking about it. I do not recall EVER, walking into a store and actually BUYING a file!! The hundred plus I have, have just been "Accumulated" over the years!! Curious Huh? Teenut ppierce wrote: > > Kevin Pinkerton wrote: > > > > On Sun, 1 Aug 1999 16:13:44 -0400, "xray" wrote: > > > > >I have a few favorite files that I use ....... > > ........ How can I get my files really clean. > > > Hi Dave. Here is a method that works for me: > > > > Take a larger caliber rifle shell (fired of course) such as a .243 > > If you don't have access to a large caliber rifle casing, get a piece of > copper tubing and flatten it. Either clean the files or make a soft > jaw for your vise. > > -- > Paul in AJ AZ, NRA Endowment Member MSC stockholder (150 shares) > Checkout http://www.dejanews.com > also("Dropbox")http://www.metalworking.com > Checkout (MWN)the Metal Web News at: http://www.mindspring.com/~wgray1/ > Checkout the FAQ at: http://w3.uwyo.edu/~metal ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Electrical setup for Harbor Freight gearhead lathe? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 02 Aug 1999 05:48:48 -0400 -------- This from an Electrical Engineering Major?? Send for the local "Sparky"!!! Don't touch the machine again 'til he says it's okay! Teenut Alan Mimms wrote: > FYI I DID try it in a chickensh*t way. I poked the START button and > NOTHING happened. No hum, no dimming or change in the one panel light, no other > lights lit, etc. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: DC Motor From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 02 Aug 1999 05:53:46 -0400 -------- You need an electric motor for this?? ;^) Teenut Gerry Einarsson wrote: me effortlessly guiding (----------) into the exact spot picked > by the wife - you know , just a little to the left, no. no, that's too > far, just a little back now...... > > Cheers > > Gerry ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: TIG welder question From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 02 Aug 1999 06:15:42 -0400 -------- $1100.00 I phoned the local distibutor and he said "$1000.00...Special Deal" Went down there and the Manager said " Mistake!! Mistake!!..It is $1200.00" Threatened to punch the pair of them out and all parties concerned were happy to settle at the mid-point! Lovely machine. Most of my welding is gunsmithing. "Magnum Mauser action Sir? Certainly Sir!" Take two standard 98 actions, cut 'em in two..one "long"..One "short". Take the two long bits, align on a mandrel, tig weld 'em together and clean up. Repeat with bolt and fireng pin. Make new "bottom metal" from solid steel. Voila! $1500 to $4500 Magnum Mauser action!!) (Description a bit over-simplified..Do not attempt this in your living room!!) Point is..weld integrity, minimised extraneous heating and cosmetics are all vital factors. This machine is like an artist's paintbrush!! Teenut Rex the Wrench wrote: > > Robert, > > I was just at my local welding supply house, looking at TIG machines. > They recommended the Square Wave 175 very highly. Might I ask what > you paid for yours? > > Thanx, > > Rex the Wrench > > Robert Bastow wroted: > > > > I just Got me a Lincoln Square Wave 175. Price was VERY reasonable and the more > > I use it the more I like it..real "weld a wing on a gnat" stuff. > > > > Two thumbs up from me. > > > > Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: kaowool From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 02 Aug 1999 06:17:35 -0400 -------- What are "Pectates"?? Teenut Stan Stocker wrote: > > Kaowool is an insulating blanket material that is used to line > furnaces. It is lighter in weight and easier to work with then castable > refractory. I don't know about its life in a melting furnace for steel > or CI, but it seems to hold up well in aluminum furnaces. > > Jack Erbes comments about their pectates is a classic though! > > Stan. > > David Berryhill wrote: > > > >> > > >> I am hunting for a source for Kaowool, can anyone help? > > >> > > >> Thanks > > >> Tom Black > > >> vango@hiwaay.net > > > > What is Kaowool? > > > > Dave Berryhill ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: No Used Chinese Tools! From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 02 Aug 1999 06:27:17 -0400 -------- Hey Pete! For a guy who boasts of his prowess as an Ebay vendor you musta made an awful lot of "small mistakes" ;^) Robert Bastow Who has no complaints about Ebay in general, and Pete in particular!! PLAlbrecht wrote: > "Ebay -- where your small mistakes > turn into somebody else's bigger ones!" > > Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Ted Edwards Walk [OT] From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 02 Aug 1999 06:37:15 -0400 -------- Hey Mike an' Fitch, What kinda metal are these here "Tolts" made of?? Teenut (Who warned you he was ba-ak!!) Mike Graham wrote: > > On Sun, 01 Aug 1999 19:51:19 GMT, Fitch R. Williams wrote: > > Is the tolt a clean tolt? One of ours has a trot tolt, and it's going to > take a lot of work to clean it up. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Belt Sander Question From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 02 Aug 1999 06:46:58 -0400 -------- Yup! It's a "piece of string" question. However, to attempt a response..Slower than you might think! That is to say, high belt speed is great when it works well, but the invariable answer to most of the (Many) problems you may encounter, is to "slow it down". My 960 Burr King is probably the most used machine in the shop..The motor I chose is 18xx rev/min rather than 36xx. It might be a little slower when "Hogging"..but I really enjoy the added control when finishing. Georgina Bourke wrote: > > Hi all > I have acquired a 240v,1.5HP 2850 RPM electric motor and wish to build a > belt sander. > My question is what is the safest, most effective rate in FPM that a sanding > belt can be run at? or is this like asking how long is a piece of string > (too many variables). > Thanks in advance > Australian > -- > Kindest Regards > Wayne. > Metal Work Page http://modelengines.freeservers.com/ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: VARIAC From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 02 Aug 1999 07:02:53 -0400 -------- Think of it as a sophisticated variable resistor..A big light dimmer!! Used to control motor speeds etc. Teenut Thomas R. Csibor wrote: > > Can someone educate me on what a VARIAC is and what are its uses. > > Thanks > Tom. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Tool Cleaning From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 02 Aug 1999 12:10:02 -0400 -------- Vinegar with a dash of salt. CocaCola works too..but it ruins the flavor!! Robert Bastow DMI wrote: > > I've recently acquired a large quantity of used tooling. (Mills & drills). > Some of the tooling is in excellent cutting shape but are somewhat dirty and > rusty. What is the best way to clean and restore the finish on these tools ? > > Thanks > Tom. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Another 3 phase question... From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 02 Aug 1999 12:32:40 -0400 -------- And yet another!! I recently installed a Deckel FP1 mill which is driven by a 3PH 2 speed motor of 1.25/1.75HP. Parsimonious as my Yorkshire backgroud demands, I decided to buy a static converter kit from Cedarberg ($150 via MSC) and spend the money saved over a rotary converter on much desired tooling for the Deckel!! WRONG!!!! Although the unit is rated at 3 to 5HP it will not start the Dekel under full load..ie with spindle and feed gears engaged. It has difficulty starting the unloaded motor, especially in low speed. Once the motor is up to speed it runs well..but uselessly!! You can't change or engage gears with the motor running. I also suspect that the motor is pulling a high current as, often, on attempting to start up, it will throw an overload breaker in the panel. The solution to that seems to be to give the rear mounted countershaft handwheel a tug befor turning on the juice. An altogether unsatisfactory state of affairs! Possible solutions that come to mind: A) Buy a used 5HP motor and use that as an "Electrical flywheel" in series with the Deckel motor. Question. Does a large 3PH motor, started with a static converter come anywhere close to being a proper roary converter? B) Use the components of the Static converter to build a "Proper" rotary converter..can this be done? C) Bite the bullet and go buy a good quality rotary converter.. Any one want to buy a (cheap) static converter is "as new" condition???? Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: TIG welder question From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 02 Aug 1999 12:38:59 -0400 -------- But I don't WANT two rifles in 7 x anything!! I want ONE rifle in 505 Gibbs and there is NO WAY to squeeze that BUFF into a standard length action!! Jack Erbes wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > "Magnum Mauser action Sir? Certainly Sir!" > > > > Take two standard 98 actions, cut 'em in two..one "long"..One "short". > > Or take the same two actions, don't cut them up, chamber two barrels for > the 7x61 S&H, and have twice as many rifles. > > I think Misters Sharpe and Hart had existing actions in mind when they > created that cartridge. And I have found it will outperform the 7 mm > Rem Mag almost across the board with better velocities at lower > pressures with less powder. > > -- > Jack in Sonoma, CA, USA (jack@vom.com) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Help--ww collets From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 02 Aug 1999 12:48:04 -0400 -------- A) Try Ebay..usually lots of top name brands there. Not cheap and you may have to buy several in sizes you will never need. B) Buy new ones from Levin, Hardinge, Derbyshire etc. Their prices will give you a nose bleed...but if you only need one or two specific sizes..That would be my recommendation. C) Tell us the sizes you need..you MIGHT get lucky!! Robert Bastow chuggers wrote: > > I've got some real small work to do and need the most accurate ww > collets I can find. Any ideas? > > -- > J.B. Neiswander > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Share what you know. Learn what you don't. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: VARIAC From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 02 Aug 1999 12:52:55 -0400 -------- That will teach me to keep my big yap shut on subjects I know nothing about. As my last post indicates..that includes ANYTHING electrical..beyond changing a light bulb!! Suitably chastened!! Robert Bastow Jesse Brennan wrote: > > In article <37A57ADD.88E93B96@hotmail.com>, Robert says... > > > >Think of it as a sophisticated variable resistor..A big light dimmer!! Used to > >control motor speeds etc. > > > >Teenut > > > >Thomas R. Csibor wrote: > >> > >> Can someone educate me on what a VARIAC is and what are its uses. > >> > >> Thanks > >> Tom. > They are not a variable resistor. > Its an auto transformer with a variable secondary winding. > They consist of a single winding on an iron core. The line is connected accross > most of the coil and a variable tap is run along the same winding. Part of the > taped section is longer than the primary setting so you can get higher outlet > voltages than input voltage as well as lower outlet voltages. > The secondary is across the line and there is no isolation protection. > I hope this isn't too confusing. > Jesse ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Cleaning Files From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 02 Aug 1999 12:58:53 -0400 -------- Bring all the BIG friends you got!! I will not surrender my files 'til they pry them from my cold,dead hands!! Teenut Who once knocked a horse flat on its a$$..."with a crashing blow from a huge right hand"** ** Quoted from the words of "Big John" mledtje@my-deja.com wrote: > > In article <37A56755.B7002225@hotmail.com>, > teenutNOSPAM@hotmail.com wrote: > > > > Thinking about it. I do not recall EVER, walking into a store and > actually > > BUYING a file!! The hundred plus I have, have just been > "Accumulated" over the > > years!! Curious Huh? > > > I always wondered where my files went. > > I'm coming over there with my buddy and we are going to get my files > back!!!!!!!! > > Mike > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Share what you know. Learn what you don't. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Removing a chuck From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 02 Aug 1999 13:24:15 -0400 -------- Go ahead and drill it out Mike...Nothing to hurt in there...except the point of your drill as you break through and hit the Hardened Mandrel Robert Mike Graham wrote: > > On 2 Aug 1999 15:04:01 GMT, ken mayer wrote: > > >Use a heat gun on the back of the chuck to get it nice and warm. Dip the > >arbor into icewater to shrink it. Then, without delay, use the punch to > >knock the arbor out. My chucks have a fairly large through hole , so I > >just snug a 3/8" bolt in its jaws and smack the bolt head down against > >the vise. The arbor pops out every time. > > I'm toying with the idea of drilling the 1/8" hole out to 1/4" or so. The > only thing holding me back is that it's a Jacob's Superchuck, and I just > bought it a few months ago. I can't think of anything that would be hurt by > the process, but that doesn't mean there isn't. > > -- > Mike Graham, mikegraham at sprint dot ca > Caledon, Ontario, Canada (just NW of Toronto). > > Raiser of animals. Weldor of metals. Driver of off-road vehicles. > Writer of FAQs. Keeper of the faith, and all around okay guy. > > < homepage currently off-line due to change of ISP; back soon > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Another 3 phase question... From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 02 Aug 1999 13:25:37 -0400 -------- How much does one of THOSE cost??? Randy O'Brian wrote: > > D) The obvious solution: a 5 Hp variable freq. drive, even if you don't > think the variable speed feature is needed. However, once you get it, I'll > bet you will use it.:-) > > Randy ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Another 3 phase question... From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 02 Aug 1999 16:37:03 -0400 -------- In anticipation of this requirement..I went out and bought a 5HP motor today, cost me $100.00. Pus I got a single phase contactor and a push button start/stop unit. The only motors I could find are 3450 rev/min so that will have to do for now. Please explain "run caps" What value do I need, where do I find them, how are they wired in and what do they cost? Grant Erwin wrote: > > This seems simple. Add a cheap 3ph idler motor (~5hp) plus a couple > of run caps. Let the static converter start the idler. Then you can > just start/stop your machine normally. > > In my viewpoint, a static convertor plus an idler motor plus run caps > IS a rotary converter. > > Grant Erwin > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > And yet another!! > > > > I recently installed a Deckel FP1 mill which is driven by a 3PH 2 speed motor of > > 1.25/1.75HP. > > > > Parsimonious as my Yorkshire backgroud demands, I decided to buy a static > > converter kit from Cedarberg ($150 via MSC) and spend the money saved over a > > rotary converter on much desired tooling for the Deckel!! > > > > WRONG!!!! > > > > Although the unit is rated at 3 to 5HP it will not start the Dekel under full > > load..ie with spindle and feed gears engaged. It has difficulty starting the > > unloaded motor, especially in low speed. Once the motor is up to speed it runs > > well..but uselessly!! You can't change or engage gears with the motor running. > > > > I also suspect that the motor is pulling a high current as, often, on attempting > > to start up, it will throw an overload breaker in the panel. The solution to > > that seems to be to give the rear mounted countershaft handwheel a tug befor > > turning on the juice. > > > > An altogether unsatisfactory state of affairs! > > > > Possible solutions that come to mind: > > > > A) Buy a used 5HP motor and use that as an "Electrical flywheel" in series with > > the Deckel motor. > > > > Question. Does a large 3PH motor, started with a static converter come anywhere > > close to being a proper roary converter? > > > > B) Use the components of the Static converter to build a "Proper" rotary > > converter..can this be done? > > > > C) Bite the bullet and go buy a good quality rotary converter.. > > > > Any one want to buy a (cheap) static converter is "as new" condition???? > > > > Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: alt.engineering,alt.rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.crafts.metalworking,alt.autos Subject: Re: The car of the future: why not use steam? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 03 Aug 1999 18:08:31 -0400 -------- Hey! I resemble that remark too!! Ain't got no Granny no more..But I ain't poor either! Go find another minority to pick on..How 'bout these Chinee guys that keep posting here. It might be harder to offend them..But I bet you can do it if anyone can!! Teenut ewells@my-deja.com wrote: > > HEY MATTY BOB! > > I RESENT that!! > > Why has it got to be Us Red Necks??? AN! We got grandmommas > to(too,also)you know!! > > You coulda used Polak lak they do up North or maybe onea > them guys like Ol'e TeeNut....(Ain't he from England or > somewhere?) By the way....Somea us ain't POOR!! > > Eddy(LOL)Wells > Conroe,Texas > > > less the occasional oil change? An 80-year-old grandmother who only > > drives to church on Sunday? Can't you see a poor redneck driving one > of > > these things that hasn't been mantained in years being launched into > the > > stratosphere because of a blocked water feed pipe? The personal injury > > > -- > > -Matt Conrad, jmconrad@InfoAve.net - http://web.infoave.net/~jmconrad > > All opinions expressed above are my own and do not represent the > > opinion of any organization I belong to or work for. > > Copyright 1999 Matt Conrad. Do not print or forward. > > > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Share what you know. Learn what you don't. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: duplicating a lathe From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 04 Aug 1999 10:29:05 -0400 -------- Theoretically you can..It will take a LO-ONG time and your main product will be chips...The lathe will be a By-Product!! Robert Bastow Allan Adler wrote: > > I have heard and read frequently that a lathe can duplicate itself. > Is there a book that actually explains in detail how to do that? > Is any metal casting involved? > > Can I also conclude from that assertion that if I build a Gingery > lathe out of aluminum, I can use it to build an otherwise identical > lathe out of steel without having to cast any steel? > > Allan Adler > ara@altdorf.ai.mit.edu > > Disclaimer: I am a guest and *not* a member of the MIT Artificial Intelligence > Lab. My actions and comments do not reflect in any way on MIT. > Morever, I am nowhere near the Boston metropolitan area. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Building a puller, UNF or UNC thread? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 04 Aug 1999 11:09:12 -0400 -------- Thanks for a very erudite explanation of the relative mechanical advantage of fine vs coarse threads and the min/max length to use. (take note all designers who insist on spec'ing 4-40 threads tapped 3/8" deep in titanium etc!!!) One point I would take issue with is that...'though the THREADFORM of fine vs coarse presents, in theory an equal shear length in male and female combined, and are as you state..Of equal strength..This is not the usual form of failure. For threads engaged to a depth of 1.5D or greater, the CORE will shear radially, before the threads shear axially. Therefore the CORE diameter enters the equation as a factor of "Strength" Finer thread = larger core dia = "stronger" So, given the greater mechanical advantage and greater "Strength" of a fine thread..It is hardly surprising that these are used on thread pullers and such. Teenut Bob & Marilyn Tonkins wrote: > > Re: Coarse-vs-Fine threads for pullers. > Neither of the thread forms is "stronger" IF by that you mean capable > of holding under more tension. What IS better about the finer thread is > that it gives you more leverage. A thread is an inclined plane, a wedge, > and the finer the slope (the thread) the more leverage you have. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: ..woodcutting with a mill? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 04 Aug 1999 11:17:08 -0400 -------- As a further aside...NEVER machine Oak on any machine tool you value. The tannic acid in the chips will blacken every exposed surface in a heartbeat!! If you are tempted to make an oak tool box..a la Gerstner etc...DO make sure you thoroughly seal the INSIDE as well as the outside surfaces. Teenut Kevin Pinkerton wrote: > > On Tue, 03 Aug 1999 15:01:27 GMT, silvr@pilot.infi.net (Jim Waggener) > wrote: > > >I have a project where I need to cut a handle out of ebony. > >I can rough cut the shape but would like to do the finishing on a > >small mill. Can someone suggest what end mill would be best > >to use on ebony? > > As a side note. I have been warned that you need to make sure you > clean up all the wood chips/dust real well after turning/milling wood > on metalworking equipment. The wood tends to collect condensation and > can be a source of extra rust. > > Kevin > > My Gun Page: http://extra.newsguy.com/~kpinkert/ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 1917 RAILROAD LOCOMOTIVE MANUAL FOR AUCTON. From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 04 Aug 1999 14:07:55 -0400 -------- Speak for yourself, don't presume to speak for me, or other members of this list...Certainly not in that tone of voice! I, personally, don't mind items of interest to this group being brought to my attention! The original post was two lines of useful information. Your post was half a page of useless invective! Get off my bandwidth and get a LIFE!! Robert Bastow Judy Swinney wrote: > > Muck, > An appropriate name, I dare say! Why should I check into this auction and > find it has 8 more days to run? It would only aggravate me, especially if I > wanted to make to make a fair price, maximum bid, only to find out at the > very last minute, some shark would come in with an extremely high bid and > grab the article. You're doing no one on this news group any sort of a > service by advertising what you're selling on E-bay. I could research the > same book on Amazon.com and probably find it at a fair price -- and not be > frustrated by having to frequently check your auction on E-bay, only to find > that some S.O.B. with more money than brains could steal it at the last > minute! Why don't you place your thinly disguised display of total greed on > some other forum and not insult the intelligence of the decent and > fair-minded participants of this one? > Bob Swinney > > muck wrote in message <37a7f389.4174555@news>... > >LOOK AT: > >http://www.evansville.net/~doug/listings.html ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 1917 RAILROAD LOCOMOTIVE MANUAL FOR AUCTON. From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 04 Aug 1999 14:13:24 -0400 -------- I feel the problem here is that you are too cheap to pay the going rate for something you want!! Ebay has been satisfactory source for me for many items. Know what you are buying and be prepared to pay your assessed value, not a penny more. Judy Swinney wrote: > > Fred, > That's precisely the problem - if I do want a RR book and find it advertised > on this news group for sale on E-bay, then my frustration begins, for I know > there is a very slim, read that almost none, chance of getting it on E-bay. > On the other hand, I do kinda appreciate being reminded of what's for > sale -- so I can look elsewhere. > > Bob Swinney > > fred veenschoten wrote in message <7o9r2t$7to$1@nntp9.atl.mindspring.net>... > >hey lighten up. I appreciate people letting us know what's for sale. if you > >don't want a RR book don't click on the posting. you sound like the > tv/movie > >censors who want to dictate to the rest of us what we should have available > >to us. > >fred > > > >Judy Swinney wrote in message ... > >>Muck, > >>An appropriate name, I dare say! Why should I check into this auction and > >>find it has 8 more days to run? It would only aggravate me, especially if > >I > >>wanted to make to make a fair price, maximum bid, only to find out at the > >>very last minute, some shark would come in with an extremely high bid and > >>grab the article. You're doing no one on this news group any sort of a > >>service by advertising what you're selling on E-bay. I could research the > >>same book on Amazon.com and probably find it at a fair price -- and not be > >>frustrated by having to frequently check your auction on E-bay, only to > >find > >>that some S.O.B. with more money than brains could steal it at the last > >>minute! Why don't you place your thinly disguised display of total greed > >on > >>some other forum and not insult the intelligence of the decent and > >>fair-minded participants of this one? > >>Bob Swinney > >> > >>muck wrote in message <37a7f389.4174555@news>... > >>>LOOK AT: > >>>http://www.evansville.net/~doug/listings.html > >> > >> > > > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: flat belt >> multi-V belt From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 04 Aug 1999 15:50:53 -0400 -------- Hi Veronica..Small world isn't it. The type of belt Tony sells is probably a modern composite that has a leather facing...excellent stuff. Far better than plain leather belting because it does not stretch. However, the degree of tension required to get the best performance out of modern, composite, flat belts, is way more than most older pulley and headstock bearings can take. That being the case I would expect poly-vee belts to give the better performance on older machines. Robert Bastow Veronica Parsons wrote: > > Fancy meeting you here Robert :) > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > Conversion to Poly-Vee belt drive, from flat belt or Vee belt drive is one of > > the most worthwhile HSM Projects!! > > I agree with this. It does make a difference. > > Sometime ago I had some info from a UK suppilier of a flat belt replacement > material > that looked good but I never (still haven't) got round to getting some. You have > to have > it cut to length by them and need a special tool to join it in place which I seem > to remember > was borrowable. However, this was some time ago. > > The contact is Tony Griffiths . Perhaps if Tony is around he > would > kindly post some details. > > Veronica ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Newbie lathe question From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 04 Aug 1999 16:03:03 -0400 -------- Using the regular 3 or 4 jaw chuck will cover most of the milling you want to do. A 5MT to 5c or R8 collet adaptor can be made right on the lathe itself. 5c collets are available new and used in a huge variety of sizes and, as such would be first choice for turning applications. For milling purposes you will find the R8 type collet gets a better grip on the cutter, however I, personally have used 5c collets for milling with (generally) satisfactory results. Teenut appleseed wrote: > > I would like to set my lathe up to do some light milling work, > however, I don't know what kind of setup to use for my spindle to hold > the end mill. What I do know is that I have a 5MT internal taper for > the headstock spindle. What can I buy/make to hold my endmill? > Any help would be greatly appreciated. > > Thanks. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Bolts & Other STANDARDS From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 04 Aug 1999 21:58:23 -0400 -------- At Last voices of reason!!!!! Mind you, better keep your heads down! I remember what happened, in the middle of the last Curvature of the Earth/Flatness to millionths/granite v/sscraped steel debate, when I suggested that a bit of good float glass, a table saw top or even a good bit of formica topped kitchen counter would produce a flat enough reference for 99% of what most model engineers/home shop machinists could ever need!! Now people will come back and say they regularly work to "tenths" and to them I issue this warning...You had better be able to back it up with recently, independently calibrated, traceable standards and you had better be able to prove that all your work is done in an air conditioned, temperature controlled, clean room! 'Cos if you can't, I, and several other, wiser people than are going to tell you you are full of sh*t!! Robert Bastow John Stevenson wrote: > > On Wed, 04 Aug 1999 15:43:32 -0700, Bob & Marilyn Tonkins > wrote: > > >Ted Edwards & ALL; REASONABLY NEEDFUL STANDARDS. > > > > Ted takes exception to my saying that a fine thread bolt is not > >"stronger" than a coarse threaded one. Maybe he's right, super > >technically, but it doesn't really matter. We are talking at cross > >purposes. I'm talking about workable standards and he's using > >metallurgical standards. This illustrates a divergence well noted in > >this N.G., sometimes with flame wars and sometimes in good gentle humor. > > We have a hobby group here. Yet we have members debating the efficacy > >of granite surface tables vs. cast iron ones, ten thousandths > >measurements and machine levels costing as much as many of us paid for > >our entire lathe! What I'm saying is; it doesn't matter! We have no REAL > >need for all this fussiness. > > Way to go Boy. > I particularly like the thread about hand scraping lathe beds. > Some Boyo gets a 50 year old South Bend / Hendy / Logan [ insert make here ] > and then proceeds to ask how to do it and within 2 days is back on the group > saying that it will now hold to 0.0002" over 20 " > If that's the case why does industry need cylindrical grinders if these boyos > can hit 2 tenths every time on something that industry threw out ?? > > If you have a long bed lathe with the model number and date stamped on the end > will you have to take the earths curvature into account to keep this 2 tenths > accuracy? Also will the lathe crash at the end of this year with the Y2K bug ?? > > I know this is a hobbies group but it seems that there are more people moaning > and less doing hobby work. Or perhaps it's that the people working don't have > time to reply to every little nitpicking item. > -- > Regards, > John Stevenson > Nottingham, England ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Innocent Abroad From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 05 Aug 1999 05:18:15 -0400 -------- Tom Holt wrote: Apart from that; > nothing springs to mind. Brits don't seem particularly interested in > their engineering or scientific heritage. Tom You're Sh**ing me! Right? Either that or you live in a hole!! > By the way; watch your step going round London. It's a dangerous > place, especially after dark (worse, in my experience, than NYC or LA) Different subject..But living proof that gun control doesn't prevent crime!! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: WTB Milling Arbor From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 05 Aug 1999 05:21:11 -0400 -------- I am looking for a 4MT horizontal arbor for a Deckel Teenut DMI wrote: > > Does anyone have for sale a milling arbor for a Bridgeport right angle head. > Also looking for a shaper attachment for a Bridgeport mill. > > Tom. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Bolts & Other STANDARDS From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 05 Aug 1999 12:13:42 -0400 -------- Points very well taken Gary and represent the other side of the argument. I agree 100% that my piece did NOT define the difference between "accuracy" and "precision". I would argue that our best efforts combine the two on many occasions. I guess my point was (is), for the benefit of newer devotees, that one does not need to have "all the bells and whistles" to begin to enjoy this hobby. Robert Bastow (teenut) Gary Coffman wrote: > > On Wed, 04 Aug 1999 21:58:23 -0400, Robert Bastow wrote: > >At Last voices of reason!!!!! > > > >Mind you, better keep your heads down! > > > >I remember what happened, in the middle of the last Curvature of the > >Earth/Flatness to millionths/granite v/sscraped steel debate, when I suggested > >that a bit of good float glass, a table saw top or even a good bit of formica > >topped kitchen counter would produce a flat enough reference for 99% of what > >most model engineers/home shop machinists could ever need!! > > I've recently read James Nasmyth's autobiography. He comments that > Maudslay supplied his workmen with surface plates for their benches, > and the quality of their work, whether it depended on the flatness of a > surface or not, improved as a result. The idea was to banish the notion > that one needn't do one's best. That instills a slipshod attitude which > results in second class work. > > Particularly as hobbyists, we shouldn't be satisfied with 99%. Our efforts > are matters of pride rather than profit, and should be done to the highest > quality standard that we can muster. The first time that I produced a fit > which resulted in the pin floating on the air column in a hole was a moment > of great satisfaction to me. That was a very high precision bit of work, > no doubt more precise than I could have gotten by with for the job, but it > mattered to me that it was the best work I could do. > > >Now people will come back and say they regularly work to "tenths" and to them I > >issue this warning...You had better be able to back it up with recently, > >independently calibrated, traceable standards and you had better be able to > >prove that all your work is done in an air conditioned, temperature controlled, > >clean room! > > You're confusing accuracy and precision. We don't often need to work > to tenths accuracy, but we often do need, or desire, to work to tenths > precision. We do that every time we make a precision fit. We don't much > care how our work relates to the distance between two marks on a platinum > bar kept in an air conditioned vault in Paris (or more recently the wavelength > of a certain atomic transition), but we do care that our fits are right. That > requires working to a high precision. > > The worst enemy of excellence is the notion of "good enough". In the practical > profit driven world, we aren't willing to strive for excellence because it is more > costly than "good enough". But in the hobby world, striving for excellence is > often the entire object of the exercise. > > There is, of course, a bit of absurdity to the notion of "measure with a > micrometer, mark with a crayon, and cut with an axe" that sometimes > creeps into these discussions. We do need to maintain some perspective. > But I think that we need to keep excellence of workmanship clearly in > sight as one of our main goals. We aren't likely to be very proud of > shoddy work, even if it does get by. > > Gary > Gary Coffman KE4ZV | You make it |mail to ke4zv@bellsouth.net > 534 Shannon Way | We break it | > Lawrenceville, GA | Guaranteed | ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Innocent Abroad From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 05 Aug 1999 12:22:40 -0400 -------- Point well taken Tom. Robert Tom Holt wrote: > > The message <37A956D7.7C702154@hotmail.com> > from Robert Bastow contains these words: > > > Tom Holt wrote: > > Apart from that; > > > nothing springs to mind. Brits don't seem particularly interested in > > > their engineering or scientific heritage. > > > Tom You're Sh**ing me! Right? > > > Either that or you live in a hole!! > > Nah. See my reply to John. We have an 'Arts Council' to promote > awareness of French, German & Italian music and painting; my daughter > can tell you all about the classics of Indian medieval literature, > 'cos that's what they teach her about in school. Ask her about > Matthew Boulton or Stevenson (the other Stevenson...) or Brunel and > she hasn't a clue. And that's sad. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Newbie lathe work questions From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 05 Aug 1999 18:10:52 -0400 -------- I bet he never forgets again though! Teenut PumaRacing wrote: > A friend's teenage son was learning to use a lathe and started the spindle with > the chuck key in. Might have been no big deal except he had his other hand > resting on the lathe bed just under the chuck for some ungodly reason. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: FS Might interest someone. Looks like good "stuff" From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 05 Aug 1999 23:37:04 -0400 -------- Durn you Bill! Just when I thought I had everything I need!! Teenut BillDarby wrote: > > http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=141845959 ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Must-have mill goodies. From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 05 Aug 1999 23:52:42 -0400 -------- I get all my cutters in Ebay for pennies on the pound..Haven't had a bad one yet. No need for solid carbide unless you are machining really tough steel. On MS etc they loose thier wear advantage by chipping and crumbling if your mill and setup are not perfectly rigid. Toolholders? R8 collets are adequate for most jobs. Better buy good used brandname than cheap imports. Vice I have a 6" Kurt clone that is as accurate and durable as I can measure. MSC have a DEAL on the new Kurt 6" right now that takes some beating. A clamping kit..you can buy them cheaper than you can make 'em..Having the right bits on hand for a proper set up saves time and frustration Parallels..get the 1/8" wide imports..steer clear of the "superthins..they'll drive you nuts. Next most useful big purchase..8" H&V rotary table Phase II is good. You can add tailstock and dividing plates as needed. Robert Bastow That ought to keep you going Dick Brewster wrote: > > In article , > mikegraham@sprint.ca says... > > I know that someone out there is going to put DROs and indexing heads down > > as 'must-haves', and they probably are if you're going to be using the mill > > to make money, but I'm looking for 'the basics' that I'm going to want to > > have when I pick up my Bridgeport tomorrow. > > I look through the industrial supply catalogues and my head just spins. I > > see ball-nosed endmills and ball-nosed slot drills and I wonder what the > > difference is. I see hundreds of designs of cutting doohickeys. I wonder > > which ones you *really* need. > > I appreciate that this is going to depend on how you use it (what metal > > you're cutting, etc.) so I'll just say that it will be 90% mild steel, 5% > > tool and hi-carb steel (old car springs etc) and 5% 'other'. > > So if you had a gun to your head and needed to prune your collection down > > to half a dozen bits (mill stuff, not drill bits or reamers etc.) then what > > would they be? > > Are high-end bits worth the money for an occasional user? The good stuff > > (Dormer, etc.) cost some serious coin. $40 CAD for a 1/2" 2-flute endmill > > is one price I've gotten. This encourages me to choose wisely. 8-) > > > > > > Mike, I eagerly await the responses to your question. > > I'm a long way from getting DROs or CNC, but I do buy various > cutting doohickies. > > I did buy a set of Enco 2 and 4 flute milling cutters, and both > my machine shop instructor and self taught (but good) > machinist/engineering student son were impressed with the bang > for the buck. > > I see end mills as something like drill bits. A complete set of > reasonable quality but cheap bits is better than holding out for > the ultimate. Just fill in the worn out stuff with high quality > parts, and the lower quality lightly used stuff just faithfully > sits there for years waiting for you to need it some Sunday > afternoon when all the stores are closed. > > Dick > > -- > username. dbrewste > domain. ix.netcom.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Circular saw blades From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 05 Aug 1999 23:58:08 -0400 -------- Straightening and "tensioning" a saw blade to run true and safely at speed are jobs for an expert. If it is an expensive one..get a good regrind shop to "inspect and advise" If a cheap one ..chuck it!! That whack may have cracked the blade or loosened teeth. Better luck next time. Robert Bastow Donald Warner wrote: > > I just bought a new 10 in carbide fine cross cut blade for my chop saw to > make miter cuts for a > crown molding job. Unfortunately one hour later a small wedge of wood jammed > and bent the > blade 1/4" out of true. How do you true up a blade to a reasonable > condition? > Don Warner ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: mill as lathe? From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 06 Aug 1999 12:08:29 -0400 -------- A HORIZONTAL mill makes a dandy "teebed" lathe of adjustable center height. Have done this a couple of times over the past forty years and it was a lifesaver. Milling machines (horizontal spindle at first) evolved from lathes. Witness the "Lincoln Miller". First came milling attachments..just like hobbyists use, next came elevating heads..the Lincoln, Then came elevating beds. The vertical mill is a relative late comer and its development had to await the development of effective end mills etc. The modern lathe, shaper and planer were British developments. However, the modern milling machine is almost entirely an American grown machine tool. Robert Bastow rodgerdodger@homeplate.com wrote: > > its quite common to use a lathe as a mill..... > but how about using a mill as a lathe. > has anyone tried this. > with autofeed on the quill then it looks like maybe..... > Rodger ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: grizzly milling machine From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 06 Aug 1999 14:36:58 -0400 -------- I would second that with a couple of caveats!! Firstly, a lot of the "Old Iron" is into its third or forth owner and is pretty well clapped out. Thats OK if you are looking for a "Project" but be sure that parts are available etc. Secondly, always figure freight costs into the price. New Machines of Asian origin are often available close at hand or with subsidised freight costs. I recently bought a used Deckel FP1 on Ebay for $2025.00 The Machine is better than I ever hoped dream about..as close to "as new" as anyone could wish. Obviously I am delighted with it. Cost of getting it from Silicon Valley to my shop in Atlanta? Rigger to pick up in SV and deliver to Freight Co....$450.00 Freight to Rigger in Atlanta..........................750.00 Rigger to deliver and place on my shop floor..........425.00 Sub total............................................1575.00 Add to that: Cost of building/connecting 3 ph rotary converter.....300.00 Total including machine.............................$4900.00 I could have bought a GREAT used Bridport,locally for less than that. Or a NEW Asian Clone. But it would not have been a Deckel FP1 and I would have been willing to pay DOUBLE what it cost to get what I wanted. Robert Bastow Kevin Pinkerton wrote: > > On Fri, 06 Aug 1999 09:16:15 -0500, Steve Smith > wrote: > > >Buy a used machine like a Millrite or Rockwell. Far better value. Try Dave > >Ficken: > >www.mermac.com > >He gets many favorable comments here. > > I have to second that. I believe that you always get more bang for > your buck when you buy used machinery. I would suggest that you call > around all of the local machine shops in your area telling them you > are looking for a vertical knee mill. You might be real surprised at > what you will find. I found my Wells-Index mill that way. It is more > then enough mill for me and only cost $1200. > > Kevin > > My Gun Page: http://extra.newsguy.com/~kpinkert/ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: What did I do Wrong?? From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 06 Aug 1999 14:47:15 -0400 -------- Four posts today..all AGREEING with what I have written. Even one that is COMPLEMENTARY!! Have I lost my touch..Or are all Youse Guys turning into a bunch of sheep?? ;^) Teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What did I do Wrong?? From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 06 Aug 1999 14:49:49 -0400 -------- Make that COMPLIMENTARY!!.. Robert Bastow wrote: > > Four posts today..all AGREEING with what I have written. > > Even one that is COMPLEMENTARY!! > > Have I lost my touch..Or are all Youse Guys turning into a bunch of sheep?? ;^) > > Teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: grizzly milling machine From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 06 Aug 1999 14:58:37 -0400 -------- I wondered where the (recent) rust spots and fingerprints came from!! Small world isn't it?? I'm glad I beat you to it but better luck next time!! Tom Sharples (the seller) seemed like a helluva nice guy. He was ready to ship before I was able to extricate the funds from my long term investments (I didn't ask him and I wouldn't let him) He did however ship it before the check cleared. Did you buy the EXCELLO? If it was in anything like the shape of the Deckel...You got a great machine. Robert Teenut DMI wrote: > > Soooooo!!! > > You're the one that got that Deckel.. Nice machine. I was over at his place > looking at the XLO Mill he was selling and I was salivating all over the > Deckel, which by that time was yours and was awaiting shipment. Nice buy. > > Tom. > > Robert Bastow wrote in messa.ge <37AB2B4A.D7B9237F@hotmail.com>... > >I would second that with a couple of caveats!! > > > >Firstly, a lot of the "Old Iron" is into its third or forth owner and is > pretty > >well clapped out. Thats OK if you are looking for a "Project" but be sure > that > >parts are available etc. > > > >Secondly, always figure freight costs into the price. New Machines of > Asian > >origin are often available close at hand or with subsidised freight costs. > > > >I recently bought a used Deckel FP1 on Ebay for $2025.00 The Machine is > better > >than I ever hoped dream about..as close to "as new" as anyone could wish. > >Obviously I am delighted with it. > > > >Cost of getting it from Silicon Valley to my shop in Atlanta? > > > >Rigger to pick up in SV and deliver to Freight Co....$450.00 > >Freight to Rigger in Atlanta..........................750.00 > >Rigger to deliver and place on my shop floor..........425.00 > > > >Sub total............................................1575.00 > > > >Add to that: > > > >Cost of building/connecting 3 ph rotary converter.....300.00 > > > >Total including machine.............................$4900.00 > > > >I could have bought a GREAT used Bridport,locally for less than that. Or a > NEW > >Asian Clone. > > > >But it would not have been a Deckel FP1 and I would have been willing to > pay > >DOUBLE what it cost to get what I wanted. > > > >Robert Bastow > > > > > >Kevin Pinkerton wrote: > >> > >> On Fri, 06 Aug 1999 09:16:15 -0500, Steve Smith > >> wrote: > >> > >> >Buy a used machine like a Millrite or Rockwell. Far better value. Try > Dave > >> >Ficken: > >> >www.mermac.com > >> >He gets many favorable comments here. > >> > >> I have to second that. I believe that you always get more bang for > >> your buck when you buy used machinery. I would suggest that you call > >> around all of the local machine shops in your area telling them you > >> are looking for a vertical knee mill. You might be real surprised at > >> what you will find. I found my Wells-Index mill that way. It is more > >> then enough mill for me and only cost $1200. > >> > >> Kevin > >> > >> My Gun Page: http://extra.newsguy.com/~kpinkert/ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What did I do Wrong?? From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 06 Aug 1999 15:02:23 -0400 -------- No Dave..I corrected my spelling error..before someone else did!! However, I found your criticism reassuring !! 8^) Robert Dave, Fleming wrote: > > " And then says I. " > OK, here the pin to burst the balloon. > Ya posted your self complimentary spiel twice! > > dave > ::Make that COMPLIMENTARY!!.. > :: > ::Robert Bastow wrote: > ::> > ::> Four posts today..all AGREEING with what I have written. > ::> > ::> Even one that is COMPLEMENTARY!! > ::> > ::> Have I lost my touch..Or are all Youse Guys turning into a bunch of sheep?? ;^) > ::> > ::> Teenut > > "I wouldn't say I'm idle, I just have a sedimentary lifestyle." ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: grizzly milling machine From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 06 Aug 1999 19:13:25 -0400 -------- I take it you mean 125 Thousandths per rev?? a "mil" is an angular measurement used in artillery. Teenut Colin Bosch wrote: > The only negative thing I can find with the machine is that > they use 8 pitch screws so the handwheels are 125 mils per > revolution. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Calibrated weights? From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 06 Aug 1999 19:27:28 -0400 -------- Don't worry about it too much..Old Will Shakspere..Shakespeare...Sh..Er.. Wagglepike!.. had a dozen or more spellings for his own name!! 8^) Teanut (sp) Gerald Miller wrote: > >Shakespear (sp) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Must-have mill goodies. From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 06 Aug 1999 19:34:34 -0400 -------- Talk about days of wine and roses! After a lifetime of scrounging old rags, dishcloths, teatowels used diapers (????don't GO there) I now find that Home Despot sell bundles of white hand towels for 3.89 per.. Mine now go through a cycle: Sweat wipe, handwipe, washing machine (X 2 or three cycles) Hand wipe,tool wipe, part wipe. (X 2 or three times) Handwipe, tool wipe, part wipe, machine wipe, floor wipe..Garbage!! Wealth indeed. Teenut Ted Evans wrote: > > Many great suggestions. I wouldn't think of working at the mill/lathe > without a couple of shop rags nearby. They probably get used more > than anything in the shop, but then I admit to being messy. > > Ted ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Tile & machines From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 06 Aug 1999 20:24:22 -0400 -------- Are you sure you want stone tile in your workshop?? It will be hell on your feet and back!! I just spent a pile of time and money putting down a sprung, wooden floor over my concrete floor...for just that reason! So far as dropping things is concerned...Sod's law applies: When standing on soft floor nothing is dropped.. When standing on hard floor dropped objects increase as the square of their value and fragility!! Teenut sunworshiper wrote: > > I just acquired enough man made stone tile from Italy to > do my new shop floor. I know how to install it right. > Thing is ..... How many times in a home shop does one > drop a heavey part or tool? I can't remember once of > moving a foot quick as not to be hurt. > > -- > The Sun shines , people forget. > > Without the Sun none of us would be here. > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Share what you know. Learn what you don't. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Going to Hungary and Czech Republic - suggestions? From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 06 Aug 1999 20:30:42 -0400 -------- The Czech Republic is home to such munitions greats as Skoda and Brno. A web search will bring up LOTS of information on them and possible company or municipal museums in their home towns. Teenut Alberic wrote: > > In article <37AB0361.55AE04ED@sea.hp.com>, Jim McGill wrote: > > >I'm going to be in Prague and Budapest in September for a couple weeks > >and was wondering if anyone had metalworking / old machinery collections > >to recommend. Ideally I'd like at least one destination in each place to > >counteract all the art museums, old castles and cathedrals that my wife > >will be interested in. Musical instrument collections would also be > >interesting. > > > >Thanks > > > >Jim > > Humm....I can't think of any metalworking collections specifically, but I > was only in the area for about 2 weeks. There's a castle/schloss not far > from Prague that has a pretty good medieval armour collection, and a > completely unpronouncable name. (It was Archduke Franz Ferdinand's summer > home. (Franz Ferdinand was the one who got shot in Sarajevo...)) It's > definitely worth the trip just for the castle tour. Looking around for > F.Ferdinand's castle should get you there. There's an absolutely amazing > collection of hunting trophies... > > In between Prague and Budapest is a little hole-in-the-wall place called > Czesky Crumlov, which is a medieval town that's pretty much unchanged > since the 15th century. It's a UNESCO world heritage site, and with good > reason. Amazingly pretty place, good for a day at least. The castle's in > pretty good shape, and has an absolutely astounding Baroque theater. (One > of two surviving 15th century theaters left in the world.) Unfortunately, > the theater will probably still be closed to the public, but the rest of > the castle is definitely worth seeing, especially the "modern art" > ceramics gallery in the old dungeon. > (really.) It's actually a pretty nice gallery, and the lighting down in > the dungeon is....not what you'd expect. I know I'm misspelling Czesky > Krumlov, but that's close enough to get you there. If you can get a > reservation, the Hotel Rosse (?Rose?) is very good: it's a 15th century > monastary. Really. Perched on a rock over the river, and one of the few > hotels within the walls. > > In Budapest...humm...well, the only thing I can think of is that you > absolutely *must* get to the national history museum. The building's a > wreck, and looks awful, (or did, 2 years ago) but the collections inside > are amazing, and whoever was running the place was doing a really > impressive job with display. The building may be falling down around > their ears, but every object in the place had wall cards in Magyar and > English. They had a really good computer interactive history system set > up in several languages, and really seemed to be on the ball. They've > also got a lot of very early celtic and medieval metalworking that just > *doesn't* get published over here. Some really astounding stuff. > > Hope you have fun, > Brian > > -- > To Email me: there are no numbers of any sort in my real address. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What is it? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 07 Aug 1999 00:48:45 -0400 -------- Sounds more like a counter-bore into which you can put varying diameters of pilot. Are the teeth end cutting? Robert Bastow Craig C. wrote: > > done wrote: > > >I found among some stuff that I purchased what I think is some form of > >reamer. > >It is 5/8 x 14" one end is rounded over with what look like keyways > >cut about 8" > >from rounded end down the shaft. Keyways are 180 deg from each other. > >Other > >end is larger diameter and hollowed out 1/2" with two set screws in it > >that would > >hold a shaft inserted into the hollowed out portion. Is this a reamer? > > sounds kinda like an adjustable reamer without all of the parts there. > > Craig ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: C.E. Johansson guage blocks From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 07 Aug 1999 00:53:26 -0400 -------- The surely are..by everybody and his dog!! Look for "Gage Blocks" although I tend to use "Jo Blocks" for the rectangular type, to distinguish them in my mind and shop from the square type favored by Brown & Sharpe, P&W and other makers. Lots on Ebay ;^) Teenut MttnBob wrote: > > Does anyone know if these guage blocks are still made? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: kaowool From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 07 Aug 1999 01:15:45 -0400 -------- Unfortunately thes people will only sell a full roll..Very expensive if you only need a few feet for a propane forge. As I said in my earlier post..Try the knife-list..I always get mine through sources there. Robert Bastow Alfred Kimmel wrote: > > A.P. Green refactorys check your local phone book > > tom wrote: > > > I am hunting for a source for Kaowool, can anyone help? > > > > Thanks > > Tom Black > > vango@hiwaay.net ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Quorn: what is quorn please?? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 07 Aug 1999 18:15:42 -0400 -------- Close...But no cigar!! The "Quorn" was designed by Prof Dennis Chaddock, a frequent contributor to Model Engineering and a Professor at Loughborough College. This College is in Leicestershire in England and close to the village of Quorn..Famous for it's Fox Hunting. So now you know ;^) Teenut Grant Erwin wrote: > > Quorn isn't a what, it was a he. Professor Quorn was an English guy > who cobbled up a design for a tool and cutter grinder and wrote a book > on it. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Quorn: what is quorn please?? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 07 Aug 1999 18:15:49 -0400 -------- Close...But no cigar!! The "Quorn" was designed by Prof Dennis Chaddock, a frequent contributor to Model Engineering and a Professor at Loughborough College. This College is in Leicestershire in England and close to the village of Quorn..Famous for it's Fox Hunting. So now you know ;^) Teenut Grant Erwin wrote: > > Quorn isn't a what, it was a he. Professor Quorn was an English guy > who cobbled up a design for a tool and cutter grinder and wrote a book > on it. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Quorn: what is quorn please?? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 07 Aug 1999 18:15:54 -0400 -------- Close...But no cigar!! The "Quorn" was designed by Prof Dennis Chaddock, a frequent contributor to Model Engineering and a Professor at Loughborough College. This College is in Leicestershire in England and close to the village of Quorn..Famous for it's Fox Hunting. So now you know ;^) Teenut Grant Erwin wrote: > > Quorn isn't a what, it was a he. Professor Quorn was an English guy > who cobbled up a design for a tool and cutter grinder and wrote a book > on it. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Quorn: what is quorn please?? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 07 Aug 1999 18:36:16 -0400 -------- Sorry about the multiple orgasms! My server kept telling me I had a config. error, while all the time it was sneaking behind my back and posting anyway!! Same thing is happening when I try to cancel the excess messages. Right now I show several..Some I get an expired message on, some I don't. I will try to re-config. and get rid of the excess. Robert Robert Bastow wrote: > > Close...But no cigar!! > > The "Quorn" was designed by Prof Dennis Chaddock, a frequent contributor to > Model Engineering and a Professor at Loughborough College. This College is in > Leicestershire in England and close to the village of Quorn..Famous for it's Fox > Hunting. > > So now you know ;^) > > Teenut > > Grant Erwin wrote: > > > > Quorn isn't a what, it was a he. Professor Quorn was an English guy > > who cobbled up a design for a tool and cutter grinder and wrote a book > > on it. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Inert Gases From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 07 Aug 1999 18:58:32 -0400 -------- I tig weld ..so far, using only straight argon. The welding store gave me a bottle of A/CO2 in error and it blew holes in everything..No A/CO2 does not work for tig!! What are the advantages for A/He? Bear in mind I only ever weld steel. Teenut Ted Edwards wrote: > > Alfred Kimmel wrote: > > > The mixed gas is about 70% cheeper > > > Ben wrote: > > > > I would like to know the pros and cons of mixed CO2/Argon gases versus > > > straight Argon for GTAW welding of various metals. > > I've never heard of CO2/A for TIG (GTAW). MIG - yes, TIG no. No doubt > someone will quickly correct me if I'm wrong about this. > > I use 75/25 A/He for all my TIG work. It's a bit more expensive than > straight A but it works very well. > > Ted ======== Newsgroups: alt.machines.cnc,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Swarf in your "Fur" From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 08 Aug 1999 02:55:50 -0400 -------- A good blowdown with a SAFETY air line nozzle is the old stand by! Watch your eyes!! A shop vac with a home designed comb might be safer and better. The great inventions are always those that address an existing problem...you appear to have found one. Now find the best solution and tell NO-ONE until you have patent protection!! ;^) Robert Bastow Charles Gallo wrote: > > Ok, > Here's one for discussion. I'm one of those guys who doesn't just > have hair on his arms and chest, but I have HAIR - like a fur suit. > One of my big problems, especially when running a drill press is the > swarf gets stuck to my arms and the base of my neck, just above the > collar. > > What do you guys do? My wife doesn't like me tracking this stuff into > the house > > Charlie ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What do you call this accessory? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 08 Aug 1999 04:36:31 -0400 -------- It is officially called...."a little tool designed to help remove gunk from the inside threads of a chuck" ;^) Making one is dead easy...Take a suitable length of 3/16 dia drillrod and bend it into a "U" shape a little larger across than the diameter of your spindle nose. (I bent mine AROUND the spindle nos and it turned out just right!!) If you wand to get REAL fancy..make a double turn..soe it looks like the butt end of a safety pin. Cit both ends to the same length, which should be about 4" for a 2" dia spindle. Now, heat the ends to a dull red and bend the last 1/4 inch outwards at 90deg. At the same time, forge these ends down to a flat blade section. Grind or file these blades to fit your thread form, harden and temper right back to a full purple. No need to heat treat the whole issue..just the last inch or so. You're done, enjoy! Teenut Alden Hackmann wrote: > > I saw a drawing once of a little tool designed to help remove gunk >from the inside threads of a chuck It would make it easier to find in a > catalog if I knew its name... ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: where to find knife rivets From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 08 Aug 1999 04:55:36 -0400 -------- Any Knifemaker's Supply can supply what are called "Cutlers rivets" or a slightly better version called a "Chicago Rivet" Better still are what are known as "Loveless" screws or "Hidden Bolts" Janz Supply, Texas Knifemakers Supply, Sheffield Knifemakers Supply, Koval Knives will all be able to help. Try a web search, failing which, get a copy of one of the better Custom Knife Magazines..."Blade" or "Knives Illustrated" You would be well advised to get a book on the fundamentals of knife making. Consensus seems to be that, "How to Make Knives" by Bob Loveless et. al. is probably the very best to start with. Do be WARNED!!! Health risks involved Blade making is a contagious, reportable disease!! Once you make your first knife it is incurable!! Teenut Adam Whiteson wrote: > > I am making a few woodworking knives for my shop but I little > experience and less knowledge of this craft. My first attempts have > been encouraging. I was wondering where I could find the proper > kind of rivets to make simple wooden handles riveted thru the handle? > And what kind should I get? I have been using brass screws which are > ok but not really the best. > > Thanks - adam > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Bringing home the Bridgeport. LONG. From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 08 Aug 1999 23:15:48 -0400 -------- Kathy and Erich Coiner wrote: > Snip great tale of why professional riggers have job security. > Erich I have moved, literally, hundreds of tons of machinery in my (too long?) time. I am getting to old and too wise to do it anymore! Some days I can hardly stand without my back brace...And before you laugh young laddies, let me assure you that none was "Tougher" when I was younger!! Bit the heads off nails, carried Bridgeports on my back, leapt tall buildings and talked with God!! Finally I wized up! My last machine was handled by professionals every inch of the way. During the final stage I stood in the shade (98 deg at the time) and pointed out the route. While the pros did their thing I relaxed, made a couple phone calls that more than covered their bill and next I knew the machine was in place, in my basement, "placed on prepared foundations", and I hadn't broken a sweat. Moving your own tackle, unless you are well prepared, well experienced and well insured is kinda like adding up the TRUE cost of marital sex.. A) You can't afford it! B) Hookers are cheaper! Teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Inert Gases From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 08 Aug 1999 23:28:02 -0400 -------- In other words, if I read you correctly, their is no advantage in using anything but straight argon for tig welding steel?? Teenut Roz Michaels wrote: > > The addition of Helium to Argon shielding gas for aluminum GTAW > serves to form a hotter plasma, and improve the fluidity of the > puddle. This usually translates into improved bead appearance and > penetration. 75Ar/25He can definitely improve the AC performance > of the small AC-DC machines on the market such as the Econotig, > Syncrowave 180, and Square Wave Tig 175. > > There are unusual situations where small amounts of CO2 are added > to GTAW shielding gases, but these are almost unheard of. > > BTW, In the USA, an Ar/CO2 mix usually costs more than a bottle > of straight argon, due to the addition labor of making a 2-part > mix. > -Roz > > -- > Welding equipment, supplies, technical support. Can ship > throughout the continental U.S. 1-800-248-1215-307 ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What did I do Wrong?? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 09 Aug 1999 19:16:27 -0400 -------- I AM on the correct side of the pond!! 8^) Robert Veronica Parsons wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > Four posts today..all AGREEING with what I have written. > > > > Even one that is COMPLEMENTARY!! > > > > Have I lost my touch..Or are all Youse Guys turning into a bunch of sheep?? ;^) > > > > Teenut > > You should have stayed on the correct side of the pond. Me thinks 'it' has finally > effected you!! > > Veronica ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What did I do Wrong?? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 09 Aug 1999 19:17:33 -0400 -------- So do I..check my next message before you leap!! Robert Bissett wrote: > > Veronica Parsons wrote: > > > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > > Four posts today..all AGREEING with what I have written. > > > > > > Even one that is COMPLEMENTARY!! > > > > > > Have I lost my touch..Or are all Youse Guys turning into a bunch of sheep?? ;^) > > > > > > Teenut > > > > You should have stayed on the correct side of the pond. Me thinks 'it' has finally > > effected you!! > > > > Veronica > > --- > Can't resist. Here's the disagreeing comment: > > Us guys know how to spell "complimentary". 8^) > > Bob > --- ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: rip off alert From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 09 Aug 1999 19:49:16 -0400 -------- I think you choose your words badly dogbert. A rip off implies that the seller is dishonest..All I see here is buyer stupidity. There are no laws against that..other than natures own law of survival of the fittest. Let me put it this way: If you buy an item in a store for $300.00 and later see it for sale at another store for $275.00, is the first store guilty of "Ripping you Off"? Or are you purely to blame for not researching the market properly? Robert Bastow dogbert@theoffice.com wrote: > > purchased new 329.99 HarborFreight > on ebay for 414.00 > http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=142166329 > > dogbert ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Bridgeport motor... replace with one phase or stay 3? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 10 Aug 1999 11:51:47 -0400 -------- Thank you John for a very erudite explanation of things electrical that I, a Brit/Canadian/American have been puzzled by for years!! Saved AND Printed! Teenut John Kasunich wrote: > > john@engineers-com.freeserve.co.uk (John Stevenson) wrote: > > > I'll try a little ascii art here. > > > > R S > > X X > > X X > > X X > > U.V.W. > > X > > X > > X > > T > > > > This is the layout for 440v with the 3 phase lines > > at R.S.T. The other 3 terminals are linked to form > > a star point. To run this same motor off 240v 3 phase > > you connect as :- > > > > R XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX U > > V X X T > > X X > > X X > > X X > > X X > > X X > > X X > > X > > S W > > > > With a phase at each corner so that the links connect r.v, > > u.t and s.w > > and in another post: > > > As I have stated in previous posts this three winding type motor > > is the ONLY type [ except specials ] that is available all over > > Europe, the middle East, Far East etc. I cannot see how anybody > > can make that statement that it's not a common motor design. > > In fact from the more I read and emails I have received from > > others it seems that only America has this 9 wire design motor. > > > > A typical motor plate will read > > 220 -240 delta 1.5Kw 7.51 Amp > > 380 -415 star 1.5Kw 3.51 Amp > > > > -- > > Regards, > > John Stevenson > > Nottingham, England > > > > And NOW we are finally getting to the bottom of the confusion!!! > > First some background - I am an EE, and work for a company > that makes both VFDs and motors. I work on VFDs, unfortunatly > not HSM sized ones. (In the last six years, I have worked on > drives from 200 HP to 5500 HP!) I have pretty good knowledge > of US motor and drive standards, and _some_ knowledge of > European standards. John or others feel free to correct me! > > John - look at the nameplate data that you quoted - the high > voltage (380-415) is 1.732 times the low voltage (220-240). > All the Americans in this thread keep talking about running > at 2X the voltage, and refer to 230/460 volt motors. There's > a big difference between 1.732X and 2X. I think I can explain > it. > > First, let's see where the 1.732 comes from. Go back to the > ASCII art. Good pictures. Now, get out a piece of paper and > draw them to scale. Make each winding 2.4 inches long, to > represent 240 volts. In the delta configuration, the distance > between corners is 2.4 inches, for 240 V line-to-line. Now > measure the distance from corner to corner of the wye (star) > version. 4.15 inches, or 415 volts line-to-line! Matches the > nameplate exactly! The factor of 1.732 is actually the square > root of 3, which comes from the geometry of the picture and > shows up alot when dealing with three phase. Line-to-line > voltage for any three phase source is always 1.732 times the > line-to-neutral voltage. > > Now back to US vs. Euro motors. I think this relates back to > the differences in electric power on opposite sides of the pond. > > Here in the US, standard residential wall sockets are 120V > single phase, with one side grounded. Houses are fed by single > phase center tapped transformers, 240 volts end to end, with the > center tap grounded. Small loads are connected from either end > (line) to the center tap (neutral), and large loads (240V) are > connected from from end to end (line-to-line). > As loads scale up, we switch to three phase. The line-to-line > voltage remains 240V. As loads get even bigger the voltage is > stepped up another factor of 2 and we get 480 volts line-to-line. > So, American power follows a 1:2:4 progression, 120V single phase, > 240V single and three phase, and 480V three phase. > > Now let's look at Brit/Euro power. Please correct me if I have > this wrong! I think the standard wall socket in Europe is 240V > single phase. I don't know if one side is grounded or not, can > somebody fill me in? I would expect that houses are fed by single > phase transformers, with either one side or the center tap grounded. > Larger buildings are fed with three phase, 240 volts line-to-line. > Single phase loads are connected line-to-line. Still larger > buildings are fed from wye transformers, 415 volts line-to-line. > Single phase loads are connected line-to-neutral where they still > recieve 240 volts. So three phase power over there is either 240 > or 415 volts, a 1:1.732 progression. > > So, in the US, where power follows a 1:2:4 progression, motors > are 6 winding, 9 lead. They can be connected as two wyes in > parallel for 240V, or one wye can be split into three individual > windings and connected in series with the other wye for 480V. > In Europe, where power follows a 1:1.732 progression, motors are > three winding, 6 lead, and can be connected in delta for 240V or > in wye (star) for 415V. What do you think - does this make any > sense? > > If you are still confused, don't read any further, this will > only make it worse! This stuff is more like trivia, but if > I don't put it in, somebody is bound to bring it up. > 1) Most US motors are rated at 230/460, not 240/480. This > is basically an allowance for the drop in line voltage under > load. The basic concept is that 240/480 is the _supply_ voltage, > and 230/460 is the _load_ voltage. > 2) Older standards used 115/230/460 or even 110/220/440 as > the supply voltage, and many people still use those terms. The > present standard is 120/240/480. > 3) Some US motors have 208V on the nameplate, either alone > or in addition to 230. This is because some commercial buildings > with mostly single phase loads are fed from a wye transformer, > center point grounded and 120 volts from center (neutral) to > each corner (line). The 120V single phase loads are connected > from line to neutral. Any three phase loads see 208V line-to- > line (120 x 1.732). This type of power is often referred to as > 120Y/208, and the 208 volt motor rating is for use on such power. > 4) Don't even get me started about those crazy Canadians with > their 575 volt three phase lines! > 5) An American 460V 60Hz motor can be used in Europe on 380V > 50Hz power. It will deliver rated torque, at rated amps, but will > run at a no load speed of 1500 RPM instead of 1800 RPM and will > only deliver 5/6 the HP. This is because the voltage/frequency > ratio for 460V/60Hz is almost exactly the same as 380V/50Hz. > > Enough trivia, this post is already too long... > > John Kasunich > Sr. Drives Development Engineer > Rockwell Automation/Reliance Electric > (I speak for myself, not my employer) > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Share what you know. Learn what you don't. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Roller Bearing Loads? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 00:16:21 -0400 -------- I am waiting for the Roller bearings in my Maximat Super II to give up the ghost..So that I can figure out how to replace them with tapered bronze bearings..Just like a "Proper"lathe!! Teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article <19990810084525.26640.00000024@ng-fq1.aol.com>, > geneleis@aol.com (GeneLeis) wrote: > > > ... so with big expensive stuff,... > > some serious thought goes into the mounting of these bearings. > > Or even the little stuff. There was a reasonably long thread > recently here about the tapered roller bearings in a milling > machine spindle, and what would be the absolutely best way to > set them up. > > Home shop stuff does not cost as much as the big boy's toys, but > we sure care a lot about it! > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Share what you know. Learn what you don't. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Roller Bearing Loads? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 00:16:55 -0400 -------- I am waiting for the Roller bearings in my Maximat Super II to give up the ghost..So that I can figure out how to replace them with tapered bronze bearings..Just like a "Proper"lathe!! Teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article <19990810084525.26640.00000024@ng-fq1.aol.com>, > geneleis@aol.com (GeneLeis) wrote: > > > ... so with big expensive stuff,... > > some serious thought goes into the mounting of these bearings. > > Or even the little stuff. There was a reasonably long thread > recently here about the tapered roller bearings in a milling > machine spindle, and what would be the absolutely best way to > set them up. > > Home shop stuff does not cost as much as the big boy's toys, but > we sure care a lot about it! > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Share what you know. Learn what you don't. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Roller Bearing Loads? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 00:17:22 -0400 -------- I am waiting for the Roller bearings in my Maximat Super II to give up the ghost..So that I can figure out how to replace them with tapered bronze bearings..Just like a "Proper"lathe!! Teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article <19990810084525.26640.00000024@ng-fq1.aol.com>, > geneleis@aol.com (GeneLeis) wrote: > > > ... so with big expensive stuff,... > > some serious thought goes into the mounting of these bearings. > > Or even the little stuff. There was a reasonably long thread > recently here about the tapered roller bearings in a milling > machine spindle, and what would be the absolutely best way to > set them up. > > Home shop stuff does not cost as much as the big boy's toys, but > we sure care a lot about it! > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Share what you know. Learn what you don't. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Help! opening LOTS of cans From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 00:41:51 -0400 -------- Simple! Mark them "Fragile" and send them UPS!! Teenut Peter Logghe wrote: > > I was approached to help someone open over a million cans, > at a rate of about 20,000 in less than a shift. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Roller Bearing Loads? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 04:41:29 -0400 -------- Hi Tom, Provocative! Moi? It takes a hellaciously precise, (read Expensive!!) rolling bearing to equal the performance of a well designed taper bronze bearing (in the hands of someone that knows how to adjust it properly. The fact that your Monarch is one of the few machines so equiped does nothing to sweeten my mood ;^) Robert tmartin@xtra.co.nz wrote: > > You are in a rather provocative mood, aren't you? > Of course you will revert to a non-geared headstock in > keeping with such "purist" designs won't you? > As I own a Monarch, one of the first to eschew such > pagan ideology, I will await with interest your reversion > to the "Dark Ages" and the subsequent demise of the > precision bearing industry as we know it! (LG) > > Tom > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > I am waiting for the Roller bearings in my Maximat Super II to give up the > > ghost..So that I can figure out how to replace them with tapered bronze > > bearings..Just like a "Proper"lathe!! > > > > Teenut > > > > mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > > > > > In article <19990810084525.26640.00000024@ng-fq1.aol.com>, > > > geneleis@aol.com (GeneLeis) wrote: > > > > > > > ... so with big expensive stuff,... > > > > some serious thought goes into the mounting of these bearings. > > > > > > Or even the little stuff. There was a reasonably long thread > > > recently here about the tapered roller bearings in a milling > > > machine spindle, and what would be the absolutely best way to > > > set them up. > > > > > > Home shop stuff does not cost as much as the big boy's toys, but > > > we sure care a lot about it! > > > > > > Jim > > > > > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > > > Share what you know. Learn what you don't. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Roller Bearing Loads? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 12:44:45 -0400 -------- Tom, I have no personal experience of the Holbrook but I have had a Smart & Browne that was superb. IMHO the Myford Super 7 has one of the best designed plain bearing headstocks ever..considering its relatively low cost. Interestingly, my recently aquired Deckel FP1 has the same arrangement on both horizontal and vertical spindles. It must be agreed that this is a machine on which no expense was spared (By the manufacturer) The Maximat Super II, is a very nice lathe...but cannot begin to pretend to be in the same class as the Hardinge, Monarch, Holbrook, Rivett etc, class of "Toolroom Lathes" Right now the bearings are in good shape..but I find that, no matter how carefully they are adjusted, I get "bearing chatter"..the characteristic spiral marks of a roller bearing headstock..especially when high speed finishing softer metals like Aluminum or copper. Any attempt to adjust the bearings to a closer running fit, results in over heating at high RPM. I can put up with this for now..having bigger fish to fry at the present moment. However!! The cost of replacement bearings, knowing Blue Ridge etc., will be frightening! Yet I will have no guarantee that the performance will be any different. As I said earlier, the present bearings are in perfect condition. Obviously the problem lies in the design and I CAN change that!! This was what set my mind off in the direction of replacing (someday) the front roller bearings on my Maximat with a properly designed, fully adjustable, conical plain bearing. I plan to replace the inner race with a hardened steel cone and the outer with a plain conical bearing. I may go to a close grained cast iron for this, rather than bronze..to give better load bearing capabilities in the limited length available. The rear bearing, currently a taper roller, will be replaced with an ABEC 7 angular contact, opposed pair. The current lateral adjustment will then allow the front bearing clearances to be set VERY finely. Robert Bastow Robert tmartin@xtra.co.nz wrote: > > Well Robert, > What would you consider to be the "sans-pareil" of > plain-bearing headstock? Would Holbrook be amongst > the contenders? > Tom > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > Hi Tom, > > > > Provocative! Moi? > > > > It takes a hellaciously precise, (read Expensive!!) rolling bearing to equal the > > performance of a well designed taper bronze bearing (in the hands of someone > > that knows how to adjust it properly. > > > > The fact that your Monarch is one of the few machines so equiped does nothing to > > sweeten my mood ;^) > > > > Robert > > > > tmartin@xtra.co.nz wrote: > > > > > > You are in a rather provocative mood, aren't you? > > > Of course you will revert to a non-geared headstock in > > > keeping with such "purist" designs won't you? > > > As I own a Monarch, one of the first to eschew such > > > pagan ideology, I will await with interest your reversion > > > to the "Dark Ages" and the subsequent demise of the > > > precision bearing industry as we know it! (LG) > > > > > > Tom > > > > > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > > > > > I am waiting for the Roller bearings in my Maximat Super II to give up the > > > > ghost..So that I can figure out how to replace them with tapered bronze > > > > bearings..Just like a "Proper"lathe!! > > > > > > > > Teenut > > > > > > > > mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > > > > > > > > > In article <19990810084525.26640.00000024@ng-fq1.aol.com>, > > > > > geneleis@aol.com (GeneLeis) wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > ... so with big expensive stuff,... > > > > > > some serious thought goes into the mounting of these bearings. > > > > > > > > > > Or even the little stuff. There was a reasonably long thread > > > > > recently here about the tapered roller bearings in a milling > > > > > machine spindle, and what would be the absolutely best way to > > > > > set them up. > > > > > > > > > > Home shop stuff does not cost as much as the big boy's toys, but > > > > > we sure care a lot about it! > > > > > > > > > > Jim > > > > > > > > > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > > > > > Share what you know. Learn what you don't. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: glue brass to glass From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 12:49:12 -0400 -------- Try "Gorilla Glue" That stuff sticks like sh*t to a blanket!! Teenut Don Stauffer wrote: > > There ARE gap filling variants of instant or super glue. I have used it to > glue magnets to glass, and it seems to work fine. > > john clark wrote: > > > hello > > i am making a wimshurst machine and need to fix a bos to the 18 inches > > diameter glass plates,this i have made from brass and is three inches in > > diameter > > the plates will revolve at up to 600 rpm but have little strain except > > for their own weight > > a referance chart indicates an instant glue is the best option but i > > feel somthing with a gap filling property and some flexibility would be > > better. > > I have a fish tank that holds thirty gallons of water,is twenty years > > old and is held together with silicone sealer only at the edges so > > does anyone have any experiance using silicone for glass to brass joints > > and will some sort of primer be required ? > > i would also be interested to hear about wimshurst machines made by > > other contributors to this group > > kind reguards > > > > -- > > john clark > > -- > Don Stauffer in Minneapolis > stauffer@gte.net > http://home1.gte.net/stauffer/ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 3450 Rev/min converter motor From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 13:08:01 -0400 -------- DoN. Nichols wrote: The only problem is that it is a > 3275 RPM motor, so it will make a bit more noise as a converter than a > slower one would do. I have just finished building a rotary converter using an almost new 5 HP 3450 Rev/min Motor as the converter. Starting is accomplished by a kit built Cedarberg 3-5HP static converter and start-up is virtually instantaneous. The indicator light for the start capacitor goes out in less than 2 seconds. This converter has no difficulty starting the (Heavily gear loaded) 2 speed motor of my Deckel...a task which the static converter on its own was just not up to. I am experiencing some hard vibration in the converter motor..nothing that I can't live with or cure with a bit of resiliant mounting. Is ths simply the problem inherent in a 3450 converter that you refer to above? Will it cause long term damage to the converter motor? Will "Phase Balancing" with run caps improve the smoothness of running? My learning curve on "Things Electrical" especially phase converters, has reached nose bleed levels recently. My thanks to the group for helping me to get even this far!! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Roller Bearing Loads? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 21:00:53 -0400 -------- That's exactly what I am talking about! Teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article <37B0FF18.8C88F458@hotmail.com>, > teenutNOSPAM@hotmail.com wrote: > > I am waiting for the Roller bearings in my Maximat Super II to give > up the > > ghost..So that I can figure out how to replace them with tapered > bronze > > bearings..Just like a "Proper"lathe!! > > I have owned a small horizontal milling machine and a pratt & whitney > lathe, both with tapered front bearings. Despite having been abused > to a great extent before I got these machines, the spindles ran > smooth and true at any speed. > > I especially like the ability to adjust the front bearing for play > by snugging the rear locknut. > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Share what you know. Learn what you don't. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 3450 Rev/min converter motor From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 21:04:44 -0400 -------- Always present Grif wrote: > > Does this vibration just occure when under load, or is it always > present? > > > Is ths simply the problem inherent in a 3450 converter that you refer to above? > > Will it cause long term damage to the converter motor? Will "Phase Balancing" > > with run caps improve the smoothness of running? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 3450 Rev/min converter motor From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 11 Aug 1999 21:07:46 -0400 -------- I'll try it...when I get hold of some of them they "CERPACITERS" and when I figer out whur to put they!! Teenut Grant Erwin wrote: > > I suggest you try some run caps across both sides of the generated leg; > i.e. if L1 and L2 are the single phase lines, you need a run cap L2-L3 > and one L1-L3. You can experiment, or you can just shove on about 30-50 µF > on each side. > > I run a 7.5 hp idler, and have 60 µF connected as above, each side. Runs > quiet, only gives a mild protest when starting the mill (3 hp) on its > highest speed, or when doing a plug reversal. > > My buddy has a phase converter with no run caps and it sounds LOUD. > I've been after him for years to put on a little run capacitance. > > Grant Erwin > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > DoN. Nichols wrote: > > The only problem is that it is a > > > 3275 RPM motor, so it will make a bit more noise as a converter than a > > > slower one would do. > > > > I have just finished building a rotary converter using an almost new 5 HP 3450 > > Rev/min Motor as the converter. Starting is accomplished by a kit built > > Cedarberg 3-5HP static converter and start-up is virtually instantaneous. The > > indicator light for the start capacitor goes out in less than 2 seconds. > > > > This converter has no difficulty starting the (Heavily gear loaded) 2 speed > > motor of my Deckel...a task which the static converter on its own was just not > > up to. > > > > I am experiencing some hard vibration in the converter motor..nothing that I > > can't live with or cure with a bit of resiliant mounting. > > > > Is ths simply the problem inherent in a 3450 converter that you refer to above? > > Will it cause long term damage to the converter motor? Will "Phase Balancing" > > with run caps improve the smoothness of running? > > > > My learning curve on "Things Electrical" especially phase converters, has > > reached nose bleed levels recently. My thanks to the group for helping me to > > get even this far!! > > > > Robert Bastow > . ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 3450 Rev/min converter motor From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 12 Aug 1999 10:51:43 -0400 -------- Hi Fitch, I guess this is where my ignorance REALLY shows!! I am not too familiar with the jargon and buzz words used by EEs. What do you meen by "connect ACROSS" and "BETWEEN"? Does the first imply connection in parallel and the second, in series? Robert Fitch R. Williams wrote: > > Grant Erwin wrote: > > >I suggest you try some run caps across both sides of the generated leg; > >i.e. if L1 and L2 are the single phase lines, you need a run cap L2-L3 > >and one L1-L3. You can experiment, or you can just shove on about 30-50 ?F > >on each side. > > Robert, > > Just for fun, connect 60uF across the motor terminals where your static > converter starter is connected, 50 uF between the other two lines, and 50 uF > across the input leads. > > Fitch > In So. Cal. > > The FAQ for RCM is: http://w3.uwyo.edu/~metal > Metal Web News at http://www.mindspring.com/~wgray1/ > The "Drop Box" is at http://www.metalworking.com/ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 3450 Rev/min converter motor From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 12 Aug 1999 10:57:20 -0400 -------- Oops! Forgot the OTHER question...(does four questions per paragraph rate me as ignorant or just dumb stupid) Across WHICH imput leads? The 220v imput to the static phase converter? Robert Robert Bastow wrote: > > Hi Fitch, > > I guess this is where my ignorance REALLY shows!! I am not too familiar with the > jargon and buzz words used by EEs. > > What do you meen by "connect ACROSS" and "BETWEEN"? > > Does the first imply connection in parallel and the second, in series? > > Robert > > Fitch R. Williams wrote: > > > > Grant Erwin wrote: > > > > >I suggest you try some run caps across both sides of the generated leg; > > >i.e. if L1 and L2 are the single phase lines, you need a run cap L2-L3 > > >and one L1-L3. You can experiment, or you can just shove on about 30-50 ?F > > >on each side. > > > > Robert, > > > > Just for fun, connect 60uF across the motor terminals where your static > > converter starter is connected, 50 uF between the other two lines, and 50 uF > > across the input leads. > > > > Fitch > > In So. Cal. > > > > The FAQ for RCM is: http://w3.uwyo.edu/~metal > > Metal Web News at http://www.mindspring.com/~wgray1/ > > The "Drop Box" is at http://www.metalworking.com/ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Help! opening LOTS of cans From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 12 Aug 1999 11:38:43 -0400 -------- This USED to be my field...the automation of processes, assembly,disassembly, etc. (Before I finally realised that it was bottom of the food chain and became a Licensed Securities Broker!!) There is a world of difference between automated handling at 10/20pcs/min and 50/100 pcs a minute. Generally, above about 60pcs/min the process jumps from an INTERMITTENT to a CONTINUOUS process and the costs jump by an order of magnitude. I cannot design a machine for you..you are the "expert" in that you have direct experience of what works and what doesn't work. I can only help you design your own machine. ("Teach a man to fish"!!) Firstly, from your trial and error, determine which process works BEST, most RELIABLY, and (Lastly) the FASTEST for EACH STEP of the job. Then, understand that, to achieve your objective of one piece per second, these operations must be going one SIMULTANEOUSLY, and most probably on SEVERAL cans at a time. Special rotary "continuous processing" machine stations are available..but you don't even want to know how much a basic, untooled, station costs!! Your best bet is to use a linear, intermittent BATCH process. Best achieved by a pocketed conveyor with a geneva type drive or, cheaper, a linear push system that transfers a batch of say ten cans, progressively from station to station. Let us say that you have four operating stations. Open can, remove foil, remove spoon, dump contents. Let us imagine you have a ten second cycle. Each operation is being carried out on say ten cans at a time and a completed batch is coming off the end every six seconds. There you have 60 pcs/min BUT with TEN seconds to achieve EACH step of the process rather than ONE second to complete ALL FOUR!! I hope I am making sense so far! Your next step, is to go to a used, food or pharmaceutical machinery dealer and explain your problem, time line and BUDGET to him. I say "Used equipment" because you don't have a PRAYER of building this stuff yourself within any reasonable time or budget. Nor do you want to try and reinvent the wheel!! The dealer will be able to point you to a few possible alternatives..he is doing this stuff all day, every day remember..so use his experience. What you will probably be able to do, given the short term requirement and basic "cleanliness" of your operation, is to arrange a lease or "sell back" on the equipment. This of course, provided that you don't butcher it too much in adapting it to your needs. That is about the best I can do to help from a distance. However, If you would like to fly me out there and pay my professional fees (you understand if I ask for cash in advance!) I will be delighted to design and build the whole bloody issue!! ;^) Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Help! opening LOTS of cans From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 12 Aug 1999 11:55:42 -0400 -------- Let me rewrite this paragraph to eliminate the brain farts!! Let us imagine you have a ten can BATCH with a ten second cycle. Six times per minute you are completing ten cans = 60 cans/min. But now you have TEN seconds per operation, per can rather than trying to do ALL four operations one each can in one second. Robert Bastow wrote: > > Let us imagine you have a ten second cycle. Each > operation is being carried out on say ten cans at a time and a completed batch > is coming off the end every six seconds. There you have 60 pcs/min BUT with TEN > seconds to achieve EACH step of the process rather than ONE second to complete > ALL FOUR!! > > I hope I am making sense so far! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Small lathe source From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 12 Aug 1999 14:03:31 -0400 -------- Failing which...have it shipped to a friend or associate in the USA. If this is close to the border..go fetch it. If not, have them ship it to you. Maybe someone on the list can help...I would but I don't think you want to drive to..Or pay shipping charges from..Atlanta! Teenut Darcy Roberts wrote: > > Greetings all: > > I've noticed that the HF 7x10 lathe is currently > selling around $329. HF won't ship to Canada last > time I checked. Busy Bee has a similar lathe for > about CDN$899 (less when on sale). > > Are there any retail stores in upstate New York that > sell a similar lathe? (I am near the border south > of Ottawa). Even with exchange, it is still half > price in the US. > > Thanks, > Darcy Roberts. > H T Watt and Associates Ltd. > Contract Electronic Design & Development Services. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 3450 Rev/min converter motor From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 12 Aug 1999 22:44:25 -0400 -------- Ok, getting closer. Forgive me if I press the point..but we are dealing with line voltages here (I HATE electricity..I don't trust anything I can't SEE!!) I think I'm with you so far as "between L1 and L2"...straight forward enough, even for me! But what precisely is "one side" of a power line and what is "the other side"? Of the SAME Line? Do I cut L1 and put the capacitor in the middle? Or are you still telling me to connect it from L1 to L2? If so, WHERE? At the Motor Terminals? At the Switch Terminals? At the 220v imput..still L1 and L2 isn't it? Please be patient with me! Teenut Chuck Harris wrote: > > Across and between mean the same thing to us EE guys. > > If I tell you to hook a capacitor across the power line, I > mean to connect one terminal of the capacitor to one side of > the power line, and the other terminal to the other side of > the power line. > > If I were want to use the term "between", I might give the terminals > of the power line names like "L1" and "L2", then I might say, hook a > capacitor between L1 and L2. By this I would mean connect one terminal > of the capacitor to L1, and connect the other terminal of the capacitor > to L2. > > ----- > Chuck Harris - WA3UQV > cfharris@erols.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Delta Saw Adjustment From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 12 Aug 1999 23:02:15 -0400 -------- Hi Robert, (GREAT name..I like you already!!) I think you are fooling with the wron set of bolts. Alignment of the spindle/sawblade to the table tenons is don UNDERNEATH the table. The spindle bearings and trunion housing is bolted to the table, from underneath. If you take out the bolts holding the table to the base you will see that the top will lift up and bring the trunions with it. It might be easier to get at the trunioin bolts that way. The Other Robert robert anzellotti wrote: > > My Delta 10" Contractor is out of alignment, and doesn't seem very > adjustable. 4 bolts hold the frame to the table, but the bolt holes have > little play, and I see no other way to adjust the parallelism between > the blade and the T-slots. Do I have to take the whole thing apart and > enlarge the bolt holes? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Buck TRU Adjust From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 12 Aug 1999 23:19:54 -0400 -------- Hi Brian, There is no adjustment for "swash" (axial runout). However, if you experience any, feel free to split the chuck and take a LIGHT facing cut off the back half of it. Don't take too much or you will bind the gears, but a couple of thou won't hurt. I know this because I did it to my own adjust-tru just a few months ago. So far as the jaws are concerned, it is pretty safe to assume that the INSIDE gripping surfaces on the "Drill Jaws" (correct name for the regular jaws) are still reasonably intact. If so, simply grind or mill the damaged "drill" gripping surfaces to be equidistant from these faces. Extreme precision is not required..I did mine on the Burr King belt sander with a little bit of "Kentucky windage" built in (I actually tapered the jaw faces back about half a degree so that they were sure to touch first with the outer tips.) I checked the front to back distance with a "verynear" and got them as near as possible the same. On reassembly and with the body of the chuck running true I had less than a thou of radial runout on a half inch x 6" dowel and ZERO swash!! A twitch or two of the adjusting screws and runout was less than a "tenth". I haven't touched the adjusters since and it continues to hold as true as most of my collets over quite a wide range. Teenut Brian Lawson wrote: > > OK. MY turn! Bought a used 13 x 40 with a 6" Buck TRU-Adjust 3 jaw > chuck. I figured out and set the 4 periphery screws to adjust and > correct the OD runout to "0", no problem. But what about face > run-out. Is that what the other 6 screws are for? Not that it > matters, but this is a D1-3 spindle mount with the 'large' (5/8") > camlock studs. Any suggestions, or better yet practical knowledge? > How about a manual. Probably all of 8 pages. I'll pay! I'll pay!! > Secondly, this has bolt on jaws, which appear a 'bit' soft maybe. > Looks like something hard was chucked up real short (like only 1/4") > and it 'dug' in and 'spun out', leaving some dig, but worse, some > peening. I'm afraid if I try to remove 'bumps', I'll end up with jaws > not true through. Does anyone know if new are available, and price? > > TIA > > Brian Lawson > Windsor, Ontario ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Gould-Eberhardt shaper info From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 13 Aug 1999 00:23:06 -0400 -------- Congratulations on the shaper. Or should I say SHAPER!!!! 5000 lbs is a Helluva shaper! Grab the $400 deal. It just cost me $750 freight for a 1600 lb Deckel from Cal to Atlanta plus another $400+ at EACH end for riggers. teenut 8" Boxford shaper (about 250lb) 8^) deano wrote: > > Hello everyone > > I just purchased a Gould-Eberhardt shaper. It was one of the pair of > shapers on ebay this week. I have a few old machine shop text books > that have some good info on shapers, but I would like some reading > material specific to the G&H shapers. This one is a 20-24. I also bid > on the other G&H shaper but got outbid in the last minute. > The price was very reasonable but shipping is going to be expensive, I > got a rate from one company for $400 shipped from Trenton, NJ to > Shelby, NC. The unit is about 5' high, 4' wide, 8' long, and weighs in > at about 5,000 Lbs. That seems pretty reasonable, is this in line with > what other people have seen? > I know shapers are considered obsolete, but hey I wanted it :) > I kinda see it the same as saving a classic car from the crusher. > Shapers seem to be getting fewer and fewer, and there will probably > never be any more made. > If anyone has any good info they want to share I would certainly > welcome it. > > Dean ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Cutting circles with a mini mill From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 13 Aug 1999 10:04:54 -0400 -------- The fastest and cheapest way is to slice them off 2" diameter bar. Most stock suppliers would do this cheaper than profile cutting. If required, they could then be faced up in the 3-in-one. A decent lathe could be set up to PART them off from round bar! Robert Bastow Stan Stocker wrote: > > While you could do this on a mill, using a rotary table or a home brew table to > allow you to turn the work, you will need to cut a lot of metal up to get pieces > small enough to swing through 360 degrees, and then do a lot of cutting on the > mill. You also need a way to clamp the work, easy until the mill is all the way > through (What was that BANG - wasted end mill and workpiece when the free piece > jams the cutter). If I had to do this, and wanted to apply the $125 to shop > tooling, my approach would be to buy a Taiwanese bandsaw (Grizzly's $199 dollar one > is Taiwan, or at least was in March of 98), add a bimetal blade (17 dollars), and > hit the scrap yard for 2 inch shaft stock. Allowing for kerf and waste, you'll > need about 4 feet (37.5 inches + kerf*100(7 inches or so) + cut off the ends which > may be torched at a scrap yard). At 25 cents a pound the metal cost will be small, > the parts will be round, and you can just let the saw cut. The time will be far > lower than to mill 100 rounds, and you won't be eating up end mills and lots of > cutting fluid. $1.25 per piece labor is pretty good, and a plasma cut edge is > pretty good. In this quantity, it may well be worth farming out the work if you > already have the sheet stock on hand. A 3/8 through cut is fairly hefty, as you > probably can't go much over .040 inch per pass. You're looking at 10 times around > per piece. Hole saws will give a center hole, and won't last for 100 pieces. A > trepanning tool is an option, but you'd have to make the tool, harden it, hone it, > lots of work. > > Good luck, > Stan. > > LoranceD wrote: > > > I recently inherited a small Central Machinery Mini-mill. I am working on > > a project that requires cutting 100--- 2 inch diameter circles out of some 3/8" > > steel plate pieces I have. I am not sure what kind of steel the plate is. > > I got an estimate from a local welding shop. He has a jig made up for > > cutting with his plasma torch. He guarantees the cut to be within 1/16" which > > is OK with me. He wants $125 for the job using my metal. I have a lot of time > > on my hands so time is not my main concern.What kind of tool could I use on the > > mini-mill to cut these circles? What kind of cost would I be looking at and > > would the tool do the One hundred cuts without being ruined? I guess the last > > question would be: is this mini-mill large enough to do the jo? > > I am a newbie to this hobby so I am hoping to gain some knowledge from some > > of you more experienced hands. > > Thanks for any help. > > > > Dennis ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 3450 Rev/min converter motor From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 13 Aug 1999 13:40:44 -0400 -------- I think I am beginning to get it now!! Do "Sparkies" have secret handshakes too? Teenut Gary Coffman wrote: > > On Thu, 12 Aug 1999 22:44:25 -0400, Robert Bastow wrote: > >Ok, getting closer. Forgive me if I press the point..but we are dealing with > >line voltages here (I HATE electricity..I don't trust anything I can't SEE!!) > > If you make a mistake, you're likely to *see* the electricity in the form of a > big nasty arc. :-) > > >I think I'm with you so far as "between L1 and L2"...straight forward enough, > >even for me! > > > >But what precisely is "one side" of a power line and what is "the other side"? > > > >Of the SAME Line? Do I cut L1 and put the capacitor in the middle? Or are you > >still telling me to connect it from L1 to L2? If so, WHERE? At the Motor > >Terminals? At the Switch Terminals? At the 220v imput..still L1 and L2 isn't > >it? > > When electrical types talk about a "line", they usually don't mean a single > wire. The single phase 220 "line" consists of 2 hot wires and a neutral. We > aren't using the neutral, so the two sides of the line are the 2 hot wires. > One ties to L1, the other to L2. Just connect the capacitor between them. > You can do that directly at the motor terminals, back at the switch, or > anywhere in between. > > At power frequencies it doesn't matter whether you put the capacitors > directly at the motor or somewhere else. A few feet of wire one way or > the other doesn't make any phasing difference. At radio frequencies it > would matter. > > Gary > Gary Coffman KE4ZV | You make it |mail to ke4zv@bellsouth.net > 534 Shannon Way | We break it | > Lawrenceville, GA | Guaranteed | ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Low RPM Motor Needed From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 14 Aug 1999 12:41:25 -0400 -------- What he needs is a "Gear Motor"...and a very small one at that. Perhaps a visit to a scrap yard will yield up a barbeque/rotisserie motor. Teenut James A & Tarren Y Renn wrote: > > I have a coworker that is looking for a low RPM motor, > something in the 30 RPM range. He wants to slowly spin > cartridges that he reloads so that he can anneal them. Any > ideas were I can find one for him? I've looked at the > American Science & Surplus site but they didn't have > anything that low of an RPM. Thank you. > > James > > -- > James A. & Tarren Y. Renn (tyr@mediaone.net) > Please specify to whom mail is directed, thank you. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Trouble in paradise: that 5hp motor I got for free is a Canuck 575V From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 14 Aug 1999 12:45:19 -0400 -------- Smoke?? Teenut 8^) Mike Graham wrote: > > If I were to use this 575 as an idler motor taking in 240V single phase, I wonder what the output would be? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 3450 Rev/min converter motor From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 16 Aug 1999 11:34:51 -0400 -------- Thanks Chuck, Your explanation makes it all clear now. Thanks for your patience. Robert Chuck Harris wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > Ok, getting closer. Forgive me if I press the point..but we are dealing with > > line voltages here (I HATE electricity..I don't trust anything I can't SEE!!) > > > > I think I'm with you so far as "between L1 and L2"...straight forward enough, > > even for me! > > > > But what precisely is "one side" of a power line and what is "the other side"? > > > > Ah, Ok. What I mean is the two wires that give you 220V. > > L1--------------------------(this is one side of power line) > > L2--------------------------(this is the other side of power line) > > If I say to hook the capacitor across the powerline, I mean to connect > one terminal of the capacitor to L1, and to connect the other > terminal of the capacitor to L2. > > You can think of this as "Shorting" the capacitor across the 220V > power line. Because of the mystical and magical properties of > capacitors, this will not blow your fuses, but will actually make > your motor draw less current if you pick the right capacitor value. > > OBTW, in this case, it doesn't really matter where the capacitor is > physically connected. Just so long as it is connected somewhere > along the wires that go to the motor. At low frequencies (60HZ) > we think of anywhere on the wire as being at the same point. > > > Of the SAME Line? Do I cut L1 and put the capacitor in the middle? Or are you > > still telling me to connect it from L1 to L2? If so, WHERE? At the Motor > > as I stated above, connect it from L1 to L2...Anywhere you like > but it would best if it is on the motor side of the on/off switch. > > > Terminals? At the Switch Terminals? At the 220v imput..still L1 and L2 isn't > > it? > > > > Please be patient with me! > > No problem, glad to help. > > > > Teenut > > > > Chuck Harris wrote: > > > > > > Across and between mean the same thing to us EE guys. > > > > > > If I tell you to hook a capacitor across the power line, I > > > mean to connect one terminal of the capacitor to one side of > > > the power line, and the other terminal to the other side of > > > the power line. > > > > > > If I were want to use the term "between", I might give the terminals > > > of the power line names like "L1" and "L2", then I might say, hook a > > > capacitor between L1 and L2. By this I would mean connect one terminal > > > of the capacitor to L1, and connect the other terminal of the capacitor > > > to L2. > > > > > > ----- > > > Chuck Harris - WA3UQV > > > cfharris@erols.com > > -- > ----- > Chuck Harris - WA3UQV > cfharris@erols.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What is a lathe "boring table"? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 16 Aug 1999 19:16:46 -0400 -------- On a "between centers" boring bar, the diameter of cut is adjusted on the bar itself. If you don't have a screw adjustment on this it has to be set with a micrometer and a bit of cut and try. However you can get a much finer adjustment by offsetting the tailstock center. (No this DOES'NT result in a tapered bore!!) Teenut Clem Jensen wrote: > > I understand the concept but how do you accurately adjust the cut ie. how > do you adjust for just a few thousandths more ? > > Clem Jensen > > In article <19990816134851.14610.00000570@ng-ca1.aol.com>, dgoncz@aol.com > ( Doug Goncz ) wrote: > > > Only a boring bar can provide a truly straight untapered hole. In a lathe the > > bar goes between centers through the work, which is clamped to the boring > > table. > > > > > > Yours, > > > > Doug Goncz, > > Experimental Machinist ( DOT 600.260-022 ) ( A.A.S.M.E.T. ) > > Replikon Research ( USA 22044-0094 ) > > http://users.aol.com/DGoncz or /ReplikonVA ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What is a lathe "boring table"? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 16 Aug 1999 21:14:29 -0400 -------- DUH...!! Brain Fart! The off set would need to be on the bar, one end or both, not the center. Back to the drawing board. Teenut PKDickman wrote: > > In article <37B89BDE.D98C9F6E@hotmail.com>, Robert Bastow > writes: > > > > >However you can get a much finer adjustment by offsetting the tailstock > >center. > >(No this DOES'NT result in a tapered bore!!) > > > >Teenut > > > > Offsetting the tail stock changes the tool path in one plane only. > > As a result the the only way it could make a larger hole is by making it an > oval hole. > > Paul K. Dickman ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What is a lathe "boring table"? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 17 Aug 1999 03:31:56 -0400 -------- I guess by now you have realised I had a brain fart. However!! (and what I really was trying to say in the first place ;^) If the boring bar were held in an offsettable boring head type holder at the DRIVE end, the off set could be used to make minute adjustments to the finished diameter. I wouldn't advocate using large offsets, the bar would need to be set to run dead true at first and roughing cuts take by adjusting the cutter in the bar. The offset adjustment at the headstock end would then be used for the last few thou. In most cases the boring bit is pretty well in the center of the bar..so an off set of 0.002" would result in an offset at the cutter of 0.001" or 0.002" on diameter. Exactly how close this is to actuality, would depend on the length of the boring bar and the position of the cutter, both in its positioning along the length of the bar AND its radial positioning relative to the axis of adjustment. Robert Bastow George Glines wrote: > > Robert, > > Is there a formula to calculate the tailstock offset needed for a given > increase in bore diameter? > > Thanks, > > George > > Robert Bastow wrote in message <37B89BDE.D98C9F6E@hotmail.com>... > >On a "between centers" boring bar, the diameter of cut is adjusted on the > bar > >itself. If you don't have a screw adjustment on this it has to be set with > a > >micrometer and a bit of cut and try. > > > >However you can get a much finer adjustment by offsetting the tailstock > center. > >(No this DOES'NT result in a tapered bore!!) > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Looking for lights From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 17 Aug 1999 03:40:13 -0400 -------- Just be aware Russ, that Halogen lamps turn out a hellacious amount of radiant heat. Working with your head close to them is NOT comfortable. I am still searching for the best kind of light, fluorescents have it for background lighting every time. I would like to find a type of fluorescent that will give the high intensity "spot"lighting we sometimes require. (Old farts need more light, more often!!) Robert Russ Kepler wrote: > > I'm looking to add a couple of lights to my mill. Right now all I > have is a 60W incandescent on a flex arm and I'd like to replace it > with a couple of halogen lights. Anyone have a source of lights that > would be suitable and reasonably inexpensive? I don't use flood > coolant, so that shouldn't be an issue. > > -- > Russ Kepler russ@kepler-eng.com > > Please Don't Feed the Engineers ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: will my beam hold a jib boom? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 17 Aug 1999 03:52:59 -0400 -------- The moment is indeed distributed between the top and bottom support..tension at the top and compression at the bottom. However, none of the strain is transmitted to the supporting beam in the form of a bending stress..that is taken up by the vertical leg of the boom. Theoretically ;^) you could remove the structural beam, six inches above the lower hinge and six inches below the upper one, with no effect on the strength of the jib....However..Your roof may then fall in!! Robert Bastow Grant Erwin wrote: .....the moment is not localized to one spot, but > is rather distributed between the top and bottom of the vertical beam. > > How do I figure how much moment a building support beam like this > can take? I want to be conservative, obviously! > > Grant Erwin > Kirkland, Washington ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What is a lathe "boring table"? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 17 Aug 1999 11:25:27 -0400 -------- You are perfectly correct, in that the path described by the tool tip would still be a circle..and in would indeed be simply displaced laterally. However, as the work piece was traversed over it, the effect would be to remove metal from one side only and thus produce an oblate sectioned hole. Robert Bastow Brian Evans wrote: > > Wouldn't offsetting the tailstock just move location of the hole over a bit? > the tool is still turing in a circle, it won't cut a oval hole. > > Brian > > PKDickman wrote: > > > In article <37B89BDE.D98C9F6E@hotmail.com>, Robert Bastow > > writes: > > > > > > > >However you can get a much finer adjustment by offsetting the tailstock > > >center. > > >(No this DOES'NT result in a tapered bore!!) > > > > > >Teenut > > > > > > > Offsetting the tail stock changes the tool path in one plane only. > > > > As a result the the only way it could make a larger hole is by making it an > > oval hole. > > > > Paul K. Dickman ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Gear reduction unit From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 17 Aug 1999 11:29:13 -0400 -------- Go to the local junkyard or machinery dealer and see if you can find a REALLY old lathe. These have been used many times as the basis for a successful stock twister. Teenut Marc V. Davis III wrote: > > Hi > > I am looking for a gear reduction unit. Probably around 30 or 40 to 1. I > plan on using a 1 or 2 hp motor to twist square stock to at least 5/8" > Thanks > Marc ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Unsticking Carpet Tape From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 17 Aug 1999 11:35:09 -0400 -------- Turners of old, used what was called a "Pitch chuck" This was a faceplate or similar, with the face relieved enough to contain a good dollop of "Pitch"..one of many different formulae were used. In use, the pitch is warmed over a flame and the part pressed in place. Reheating would release the part. I suggest you use hot melt glue as a modern variant of this. Teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: LINE BORING From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 17 Aug 1999 11:46:03 -0400 -------- This is what I had in mind, when I sugested using a boring head to hold the bar at the HEADSTOCK end. I too have run many a Horizontal Boring mill and agree that in full size practice a tap with a hammer is as precise as any other method. However, in the usual small scale of "our" stuff, this becomes more dificult to control. and those last couple of tenths become elusive when chased with a hammer!! Teenut Bob Tonkins wrote: >You CAN'T increase the diameter of a hole by offsetting the center..... >.........You can easily make screw adjustable boring bars that copy the >big boys by offsetting the BORING BAR head, ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OLD masking tape, getting off?? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 17 Aug 1999 11:52:27 -0400 -------- I have had the same problem! I don't know what compound, ten year old masking tape turns into..but it is virtually indestructable!! I have tried every solvent known to man...to no effect. In my case I finally scrubbed off the paper backing with lots of hot water and wire wool., and then used a blowtorch to carbonise the remaining residue!! There has to be an easier way!! Randall Bradley wrote: > > I've got some multi-year old masking tape on raw aluminum, > any suggestions about getting it off?? > > As you probably know, the adhesive hardens with time and > bonds very nicely in a mottled pattern.. > > Your favorite non destructive removal method please! > > _-_-randy ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Bending thicker gauge sheet into small ID tubes From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 17 Aug 1999 17:05:27 -0400 -------- If steel is an acceptable substitute..find some "drawn over mandrel" steel tube of the corect size. If your project is indeed a paintball gun, then why not (other than cache') use brass copper aluminum or plastic. Have you considered a "wound on mandrel" fiberglass tube? Trust me, drilling, reaming and honing a 14" length of ANY material is not to be lightly undertaken, even by Pros, who have the experience AND the right equipment. It would be an exercise in futility for a beginner with a "Table Top" lathe. Been there and done it (or not..as the case may be) Teenut bob wrote: > > In article <7pb6j5$81q$1@q.seanet.com>, kollmm@hotmail.com says... > > > >What I want to do: > > > >Bend a sheet of 18 gauge Ti into a 14 inch long tube that is (appx) .684" > >ID. > > > >(And then (MIG?) weld the seam, grind the weld down to flush on the outside, > >ream the tube out by a few thousandths of an inch, and turn the tube on a > >lathe to round out the outside.) > > > >The slip rolls I've seen that will do tubing this small are too wimpy (22 > >gauge mild steel); the tough guys will do thicker metal but their min radius > >seems to be way over an inch, *and* they are way too fricking big to fit in > >my basement (serious chunks of metal - many feet long and many many hundreds > >of pounds). > > > > The more I think about this , it would be easier and maybe cheaper > to use a 14 inch long 1" diameter steel rod, a boring bar and a table-top > lathe. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: high performance CNC Benchtop Mill From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 17 Aug 1999 17:24:43 -0400 -------- In short Carlos...You ARE reinventing the wheel...Whether you like it or not!! Your manufacturing budget is WAY under a realistic cost for what you describe. Have you ever actually MADE a dovetail slide with tapered gibs? And then assembled, scraped and fitted it...To "Machine tool" standards? In searching for the trees, you have lost sight of the forest. If your intention is to actually USE this machine to cut material..you can forget that for a year or more. Your budget of $5000.00 would purchase a nice, used, CNC mill of the brigeport type. (why, by the way do you assume you would have backlass problems only on a bridgeport?) Alternatively it might allow you to "CNC'ify" a good quality, used, standard knee mill. Teenut \ cg wrote: > > To all benchtop CNC mill enthusiasts/dreamers: > > I've just finishing designing my 3-axis CNC benchtop milling machine, and I > figured before I start making chips, I'd do a sanity check and try to get > some feedback. > > I'm a mechanical engineer working as a product development consultant, and I > have long had a need for a means to produce prototype parts and molds for > various projects I work on. I always work in 3D solids (Solid Edge, > mostly), so I have 3D CAD data available for export to a CAM package. I've > been looking at the 3D CAM packages out there, and with my computer and > machining experience, I'm sure I'll be able to produce the G-code needed for > simultaneous 3-axis machining of complex parts. > > I was hoping to buy a system, but I couldn't find anyone who made what I was > looking for. I've looked at Sherline, Taig, Unimat (haha), converted > mill-drills, Minitech, Light Machines, Denford, MHO Millright, Emco, > Defiance, converted Bridgeports, Techno-isel, MAXNC, and whoever else I > could find, and I could not find one system that met my requirements for a > small CNC mill. > > Here is some of what I wanted: > a.. zero-backlash > b.. high rigidity (for limited steel-cutting, and accuracy) > c.. decent feedrates (120 ipm) > d.. generous travels (16" x-axis, 8" y- & z- axis) > e.. low friction slides and screws (for speed and power requirements) > f.. PC-based (Windows, pref.) > g.. affordable (under $5k minus PC) > h.. compact (forklift and crane not required...) > > Here's why I ruled out what I found: > > The price limit ruled out Light Machines, Millright, and Defiance, although > they are definitely sweet machines and meet most of my other requirements. > Except for Millright, they are also shorter in travels than what I hoped > for. > > The Minitech machine is getting closer to what I wanted, but the price is > still on the steep side, and the travels are too short. > > Sherline, Taig, and both the MAXNC 10 and 15 are just too small and slow, > and I have serious questions about wear and accuracy after extended > machining. As hobbyist-oriented machines they seem wonderful, but I need a > fast, rigid, reliable machine for extended use. > > Denford and Emco have nice systems, but, again, they seem to be targeting > deeper pockets than I have, and their travels are just too short. > > Techno-isel's are nice, just not rigid enough, and the price is a little too > high anyway. > > A converted Bridgeport is too big and the price adds up (bigger motors > needed, high friction, leadscrew backlash, etc.) > > A converted mill-drill was about the closest to what I wanted, but it would > need to be retrofitted with ballscrews, and the quill feed would need > extensive work to maintain repeatability, let alone get 8" out of it. Five > inches on the quill could make do, however, since the headstock can be > adjusted up and down. > > To buy or not to buy?: > > Through all my browsing, searching, and asking over the past 1-2 years, I > couldn't find what I was looking for. I would have to wait, or do it > myself. > > So, I decided to apply my design expertise and design my own machine in > order to get what wanted. The penalty, of course, is that time is money, > and in the end the money and hours that go into this one machine will > probably exceed what it would cost to buy a more expensive machine. Even if > I was willing to spend the extra money, I didn't find anyone that produced a > rigid enough machine with the travels and compactness that I needed. > > In designing and building my own machine, as a product designer, I could not > control the compulsion to design for manufacture and assembly, and to design > around cost-effective components. It's just a habit of mine, which finds > its way into anything I design. This is usually a good quality, but the > extra design time required is not always economical for one-time projects. > So, in the back of my mind, I hope I can impress enough people with the > performance and potential cost of my machine, and that maybe others will be > interested in one of their own. > > Here's what I ended up designing: > > Mechanical: > a.. 3 independent slideway systems (linear stages) mounted in x-y-z > fashion like a full-size CNC mill > b.. each linear stage is built up independently and precisely mounted to > a low-precision cast iron or welded steel (or...) machine base via a > precision alignment fixture and polymer chocking material > c.. slider/saddle of X and Y stages are mounted face to face, and rail > of X stage is used as table > d.. variety of spindles, routers, dremel tools, engravers, etc. > mountable to z-axis plate (starting off with Sherline setup until I design a > beefier setup) > e.. dovetail slides with adjustable gibbs (tapered design) > f.. slide locks that clamp the gibbs against the dovetails, 2 per slider > g.. low-friction, low wear polymer bearing surfaces cast (injected) > between slider/saddle block (the sorter part) and rail/table (the longer > part) > h.. rail/table is anodized (Type II or Type III, depending on wear test > results) > i.. rails and sliders are designed as potential aluminum extrusions and > have integral limit/home switch mounting channels > j.. each rail/slider system has a mated cross-sectional envelope of 8" X > 3" > k.. sliders/saddles are 8" X 8" > l.. .631" X .200" pitch ballscrews and 2 ballnuts (preloaded against > each other) on each axis > m.. motor mounting plate bolted to bearing end blocks; couples motor to > screw via toothed belt. Pulleys are changeable from 2:1 ratio to 1:2 ratio > n.. bearing endblocks, ballscrew nut mounting block, and screw support > block are based on common design (extrusion-ready) > o.. each linear stage is identical with the exception of rail length and > corresponding ballscrew length > p.. X-axis: 16" travel x 24" table > q.. y-axis & z-axis: 8" travel x 16" rail > Motors/drives system: > a.. 315 oz-in steppers, 200 full steps/rev, geared down 2:1 > b.. .200"/rev screw > c.. microstepping driver: 40V, 5A/phase, set to half-stepping > d.. 110 ipm at 354 lb thrust (without losses) > CNC control system (currently available): > a.. FlashCut CNC (max 7300 steps/sec) > b.. serial cable to signal generator (MPU) box > c.. Windows-based > d.. lookahead capability > e.. reads G-code and DXF > CNC control system (if/when it is available): > a.. Windows-based CNC control interface to IndexerLPT device driver > b.. parallel port step/direction output > c.. 90,000 steps/sec (allows more steps/rev for microstepping) > d.. unlimited lookahead > > What do you think? > > I'm packing alot of punch with the system I'm composing, and I believe I've > designed it as inexpensively as possible for what I want it to do. Is there > anything I've overlooked or that you would want to see in your own system of > this caliber? > > How much will it cost?: > > Well, I was willing to spend $5K for a complete system, minus PC, but I > think I will be spending more cash than that to build my own. The economy > of scale is working against me on a one-off. Fortunately, I have access to > a small machine shop. The mechanicals will require some tooling fixtures > for assembly, most of which I can jerry-rig with a granite surface plate and > some parallels, and there are other things that are hard to amortize over a > production run of one unit. > > In any case, the breakdown of costs for purchased items, and estimated costs > for machined items (in medium production quantities), not including tooling, > assembly costs, etc., is: > a.. 3 Linear stages (complete, inc. ballscrews, bearings, etc.), machine > base (welded 8" x 4" x .250" wall steel tube), and basic headstock: $1500 > b.. Motors, drivers, power supplies, cables & switches: $1800 > c.. CNC control software and signal generator box: $1100 > TOTAL: $4400 > > These costs are just about rock-bottom for a system of this type. I've been > wondering what a reasonable price would be if this system were to see > production, taking into account tooling, assembly, profit, R&D, advertising, > and all the other expenses that companies incur to produce, promote, and > sell a product. I admire Sherline's approach to offering excellent price > for the quality, while still making enough profit to stay in business with a > bit of dignity. If I were to actually sell this machine, I would definitely > try to follow their example. > > Please, if anyone has already found what I'm looking for, let me know so I > don't have to "reinvent the wheel". Otherwise, if you have any comments, > suggestions, warnings, etc., they would be greatly appreciated. I'm > designing this for myself, but it would surely be nice to generate enough > interest to make it profitable to build it for others (if it hasn't already > been done) at a really good price. > > If you have made it this far, thank you for your interest. If you would > like to respond personally, you can reach me at the address below. > > Sincerely, > > Carlos Guillermo > > VERVE Engineering and Design > 8 Margo Lane > Clinton, CT, 06413 > email: carlos@verve-engineering.com > or cnk@ct1.nai.net ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: properties of metals, is 10kt gold similar to brass, etc... From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 17 Aug 1999 17:35:56 -0400 -------- Cost of materials apart I would imagine that casting, fabricating and finishing bits of almost anything would be somewhat easier in 10K gold, than brass. No problem with the parts sagging at silver/gold soldering..gold has a higher melting point. Less work hardening of gold. Lest in-process tarnishing and cleanup required. Why has no one ever done it before?? Or have they? I have seen solid silver "Brass instruments"..trumpets, cornets etc. They have a different and (to some) a "Purer" tone. Robert Bastow Long time fan of "Brighouse and Rastrick Silver Prize Band" and "Grimethorpe Colliery Band" Teenut sales@gems.com wrote: > > I am a jeweler and musician and was joking around about casting a trumpet > piece by piece in gold, (the small parts anyway.) Then I realized hey, gold > is low and silver is always cheap, and brass should be almost free for the > quantities I'm talking about, so I really could do this. Especially > mouthpieces should be easy. > Then I started wondering where I could find out what I would need to know > about the metals. I guess hardness is the easiest but I'm sure there are > other factors I should look at before I make a mess. Any ideas or leads? > > Bill ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OLD masking tape, getting off?? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 17 Aug 1999 21:01:07 -0400 -------- I tried lots and lots of wd 40 and every other kind of oil grease or solvent. Soaked some of it for weeks. NOTHING touched this stuff!! Teenut Mike Graham wrote: > > On 17 Aug 1999 11:28:48 -0400, Randall Bradley wrote: > > I've got some multi-year old masking tape on raw aluminum, > > any suggestions about getting it off?? > > > > As you probably know, the adhesive hardens with time and > > bonds very nicely in a mottled pattern.. > > > > Your favorite non destructive removal method please! > > WD-40. Spray today, peel tomorrow. > > -- > Mike Graham, mikegraham at sprint dot ca > Caledon, Ontario, Canada (just NW of Toronto). > > Raiser of animals. Weldor of metals. Driver of off-road vehicles. > Writer of FAQs. Keeper of the faith, and all around okay guy. > > < homepage currently off-line due to change of ISP; back soon > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: high performance CNC Benchtop Mill From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 18 Aug 1999 03:17:01 -0400 -------- Carlos, I wonder why, with all your knowledge and experience, you ever felt the need to ask us Peons for feed back or advice. Perhaps a quest for universal acclamation of your brilliance (which surely you knew we couldn't fail to recognise...Despite your modest attempts to hide it!) It would appear you have all the design and manufacturing skills required to finish your project ahead of time and under budget. It only remains for me to wish you "Good Luck"! But do please keep us abreast of developments. Teenut cg wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote in message <37B9D31B.80CB75E8@hotmail.com>... > >In short Carlos...You ARE reinventing the wheel...Whether you like it or > not!! > > > >Your manufacturing budget is WAY under a realistic cost for what you > describe. > >Have you ever actually MADE a dovetail slide with tapered gibs? And then > >assembled, scraped and fitted it...To "Machine tool" standards? > > Robert, I briefly mentioned in my post that I intended on using castable low > friction polymer as the bearing surface on my dovetails. This way, as long > as the longer part of the slide (the "rails" or table) is very straight, > very low on twist, and has a smooth hard surface (simply a machined aluminum > extrusion, anodized), I would only have to precisely align the mating halves > relative to each other and then inject the low-friction polymer. I would > NEVER consider having to scrape the pieces myself. I have no clue how, and I > have no interest in trying it. > > >In searching for the trees, you have lost sight of the forest. If your > >intention is to actually USE this machine to cut material..you can forget > that > >for a year or more. > > You must be God's cousin...or you've tried a similar project and failed. > Actually, the benefit of working professionally as a product development > consultant gives me excellent experience on how long projects end up taking, > and how to avoid the pitfalls on the next job... > > > > >Your budget of $5000.00 would purchase a nice, used, CNC mill of the > brigeport > >type. (why, by the way do you assume you would have backlass problems only > on a > >bridgeport?) Alternatively it might allow you to "CNC'ify" a good quality, > used, > >standard knee mill. > > I have found through my experience that there is a point in any retrofit job > where it actually would have been easier to start from scratch. This is > usually a feature of hindsight, but I'm trying to be "proactive" and just > avoid the problems and expenses of fixing/modifying/retrofitting to someone > else's work, and expecting to meet my requirements. Tasks such as > installing ballscrews on the Bridgeport and retrofitting the axes to CNC are > easy enough, but to get the feedrates I need with the masses and friction of > a Bridgeport would require motors, drives, power supplies, etc. that would > quickly inflate the costs of this project. Of course, I could settle for > slower speeds, but I don't want to if I don't have to. I believe I can > assemble the mechanicals of my design for $1500 cash plus alot of time, of > course. Even if you double that as a contingency, it is less than a > Bridgeport clone and the ballscrews alone (~$3k+), not including motor > mounts, belts, pulleys, etc. I did not intend to single out Bridgeports for > backlash problems. Any leadscrew or ballscrew setup with preload will give > you backlash, which can most always be accounted for at time penalty. > > Sincerely, > > Carlos Guillermo > > VERVE Engineering and Design > email: carlos@verve-engineering.com > or cnk@ct1.nai.net ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: properties of metals, is 10kt gold similar to brass, etc... From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 18 Aug 1999 03:42:40 -0400 -------- A bell's resonation is more a function of its integrity and shape than the particular material used. Bell metal (Usually..but not always, a bronze alloy) was easier to cast and much tougher than iron. it was harder and therefore more "resonant" than brass. Those were about the only three choices the ancients had. It is hardly surprising that they picked bronze and thus started somewhat of a tradition. They picked bronze for cannon for many of the same reasons. However, modern peals of bells have also been successfully cast of steel and aluminum!! The eastern cultures were as likely to forge them from iron or copper. I know nothing of the effects of resonance of the metal on the tone of wind instruments. I would imagine there, that the shape has far more bearing on it. I do remember a (silver) cornet playing neighbour, renowned for the purity of his tone, (not to mention the brilliance of his "Triple Tongueing"!!) who point blank refused, to have any of the generations worth of dents smoothed out of his prized cornet. He feared it would never sound the same again!! Teenut Who longs to hear the strains of "A Cornish Dance" and "Abide With Me" drifting over the Pennines, at least one more time, before I go to that great Workshop in the Sky. (Sob, Snivel, Snuffle!!) sales@gems.com wrote: > > What other properties do metals have that I should consider? Malleability, > hardness, density, what kind of things could make a difference in the tone > of a instrument? What makes a bell resonate anyway? > > Bill > ......................................................................... > You'll love the prices at http://www.gems.com > > Robert Bastow wrote in message <37B9D5BC.686BEC16@hotmail.com>... > >Cost of materials apart I would imagine that casting, fabricating and > finishing > >bits of almost anything would be somewhat easier in 10K gold, than brass. > > > >No problem with the parts sagging at silver/gold soldering..gold has a > higher > >melting point. Less work hardening of gold. Lest in-process tarnishing > and > >cleanup required. > > > >Why has no one ever done it before?? Or have they? I have seen solid > silver > >"Brass instruments"..trumpets, cornets etc. They have a different and (to > some) > >a "Purer" tone. > > > >Robert Bastow > > > >Long time fan of "Brighouse and Rastrick Silver Prize Band" and > "Grimethorpe > >Colliery Band" > > > >Teenut > > > >sales@gems.com wrote: > >> > >> I am a jeweler and musician and was joking around about casting a trumpet > >> piece by piece in gold, (the small parts anyway.) Then I realized hey, > gold > >> is low and silver is always cheap, and brass should be almost free for > the > >> quantities I'm talking about, so I really could do this. Especially > >> mouthpieces should be easy. > >> Then I started wondering where I could find out what I would need to > know > >> about the metals. I guess hardness is the easiest but I'm sure there are > >> other factors I should look at before I make a mess. Any ideas or leads? > >> > >> Bill ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Gear cutting bits. From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 18 Aug 1999 03:58:35 -0400 -------- Mark Fraser wrote: (Speaking of gears) ......profiles from Aston Martin gearboxes.... / mark > > Profiles!!! The last Aston Martin I drove, was my buddy's DBV8 with manual box. I don't think those gears had any profile but straight up and down!! The clutch in itself was a brutal experience..no finesse to it..just like a light switch with HUGE spring to make it go on/off with a wallop. The gears sounded and felt, straight cut, and any synchromesh was vestigal at best. My wrist still hurts in cold weather from pounding that short stick into place..and having it kick back as the gears engaged. This latter accompanied by my knee and hip joints being booted up to my navel!! But BOY did that mother FLY!!! Pure, unadulterated, power and uncompromising road holding. Braking? Er, WHY would you want to BRAKE in an Aston sir? Teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: melting points of solder From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 18 Aug 1999 04:05:26 -0400 -------- Just like a cat, Huh?? KD6JDJ wrote: > > I think that you can see how the heated 'male' part might expand to grip into > the cooler 'female' part. > > Jerry ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Adjustable quill bore on milling machines? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 18 Aug 1999 04:15:05 -0400 -------- The quill housing on the vertical head of my Deckel FP1, has JUST such an arrangement!! There is a spring loaded, rack and pinion down feed on the quill, but this is used only for light drilling and tapping. Milling (and boring) operations are carried out with the quill locked and using the table (power) upfeed. This is one of the factors that contribute to the extreme rigidity and accuracy of the Deckel. Doug Jackson wrote: > > I've noticed that many drill presses have adjustable quill housings, > in which there is a vertical slit in the head casting at the front of > the quill bore. Two or three cross-bolts in front of the quill are > tightened to adjust the bore diameter to precisely fit the outside > diameter of the quill. > A few years ago I modified a Delta 12" drill press by drilling a > 1/4" hole in the front of the head casting, just behind the power > switch (just above the top of the quill bore). I cut a vertical slit > from this hole down to the bottom of the quill bore (just above the > chuck). The purpose of the 1/4" hole was to prevent cracking of the > casting above the slit. There wasn't enough meat in the head casting to > pass a horizontal through-bolt in front of the quill, so I made a clamp > out of a 1/2" machine screw and a few scraps of 1/4" steel plate. This > clamp goes around the front of the head and serves in place of the > horizontal through-bolts. > The modification works beautifully. I can tighten the quill for > precision drilling and *very* light milling with a cross-vise. I can > also tighten the quill enough to keep it from moving when I let go of > the downfeed handle- this is convenient in a lot of situations. I'm > thinking about making a similar modification to my Chinese mill/drill. > There even seems to be enough meat in the head for through-bolts (and > besides, it's no huge loss if I screw it up: -) > My question is this: it seems like the split bore would be useful in > a *real* vertical milling machine, but the ones I've seen (at least the > few that I've used- Bridgport & South Bend) do not have this feature. I > can see how it could possibly reduce the rigidity of the machine > (depending on the dimensions of the head around the quill bore) but it > seems like the advantages of being able to tighten up the quill would > outweigh this. Obviously this doesn't matter if you lock the quill, but > it could help a lot for taking plunge cuts with an end mill (where the > quill can't be locked because you're downfeeding). > Does anybody know a reason why the split quill-bore might be a bad > idea on a mill? Is is simply not necessary on the larger mills because > of good manufacturing tolerances, or is there another downside to it? > Elasticity of the through-bolts might affect rigidity when doing > heavy milling cuts. However, looking at the tensile loads on the bolts, > if you just use big enough through-bolts it should act just like a solid > head. Of course the bolts would not resist shear strain along the > plane of the slit (induced by radial loads on an end mill) but this > should be minimal if there is enough iron in the head casting just > behind the quill and directly above the slit. > I dredged out some of my old Engineering Mechanics textbooks & did a > rough calculation of the difference this modification would make to the > overall rigidity of my mill/drill (assuming that the original "unsplit" > bore had zero radial slop in the fit of the quill to begin with). I > found that the loss of rigidity for the split bore is almost nil- > especially compared to the (lousy) rigidity of the 4-1/2" column (but > even on a Bridgeport it shouldn't make a significant difference, if I'm > doing the calculations correctly). Am I overlooking something? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Hiram Maxim, or...a penny shaved is a penny...um...turned? A very old story. From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 18 Aug 1999 04:46:16 -0400 -------- Jon Elson wrote: > Whew! This guy (Hiram Stevens Maxim) was sure a good machinist! I could probably > carry this off, too, but I'd probably go through a dozen pennies before getting the > > clamping right. Then, I can't even guess how many it would take before I got > such a good solder joint that it could be hidden by burnishing the edges! > > Jon Making double headed (English) Pennies, was a favorite lunch hour pastime when I was an apprentice. So much so that they were often come across "on the street" and no soccer or cricket match would have the coin flip without ALL parties carefully scrutinising the coin to be flipped. God help the Ref. who inadvertantly produced a "double header" for the start of a local "grudge" match!! Ours were produced entirely without solder and if well done were virtually undetectable!! First, a penny was gripped in a custom collet and a recess bored to half depth in the face..ending just shy of the raised "milled" edge. A second penny was held on a "pitch clutch" (of previous mention) and carefully aligned with the thumb nail, while rotating and before the pitch set up hard. (Try doing THAT with carpet tape or super glue!!) The penny was first turned to the exact o/d of the recess and then faced to half thickness. The two parts were then pressed together. The secret was to have the two mating internal faces SLIGHTLY dished away from each other. That way they didn't vibrate when the penny was flipped or dropped. That "Dead" sound was a "Dead Givaway" and a sign of careless workmanship. A solder joint would give the same effect of "deadness" Robert "The Ringer" Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: One more electrical question From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 22 Aug 1999 14:17:54 -0400 -------- It's no wonder "Mechanical" Engineers don't understand explanations from "Sparkies"....They don't even understand each other!!! Teenut DoN. Nichols wrote: > > In article <37BF2ACE.ACF19531@technologist.com>, > mike II wrote: > >"DoN. Nichols" wrote: > > > >> >For single phase giving 240V, think of a battery with two cells. 1.5 V across > >> >one cell, and 1.5 V across the other. Both together give 3 V. The centre link > >> >between these cells is the electrical equivalent of the centre tap on a > >> >120/240 transformer. As in the battery, the voltages are Zero degrees out of > >> >phase with each other. > >> > >> Only if you count from one end, and measure both the center tap > >> and the for end from that point of view. > > > >I interchanged the voltmeter leads....the + probe is ALWAYS to my right :-) > > O.K. Let's do it this way: > > 1 | 2 3 | 4 > 0----||---0 0---||---0 > | | > > By convention, the wide line is the positive terminal of the > cell. > > If you connect terminals 2 and 3 together (as the center tap), > and use that as the reference point, (put your black lead on that > point), and touch the red probe to terminal 1, you will read the voltage > of the battery. If you touch the red probe to terminal 4, you will > either peg the needle below zero (on an analog meter), or disply the > same voltage, preceded by a minus sign (a negative voltage.) This is a > pretty good representation of one instant during the cycle of the AC. > (Somewhere during the first half cycle.) > > >> >As the phase between the two voltages changes (increases) the resulting > >> >voltage from each phase leg to centre tap stays the same, but the voltage from > >> >phase leg to phase leg will be reduced, until the voltages are 180 degrees out > >> >of phase, when it becomes zero. 180 degrees out phase is the same as > >> >connecting two batteries at the positive terminals, and then getting a reading > >> >of zero volts between the two negative posts. > >> > >> I'm afraid that you're describing 0 degrees out of phase, not > >> 180 degrees. > > > >nah...when I add 120 V at 0 degrees and 120 V at 180 degrees I STILL end up > >with Zip.. > >your way would work if we add 120 V at 0 Degrees AND -120V at 180 Degrees... > > 180 degrees phase shift *should* provide a negative voltage at > the same instant that the first phase is positive, so it will work as > described. With 120 degree phase shift, that is true only part of the > time. (I *wish* that I could easily draw sine waves with ASCII > graphics. It would make this a lot easier to draw. > > O.K. Let's start at a point in the center of the graph paper > which we will call zero. Put a protractor on the paper, and draw a line > from that zero point at 0 degrees on the protractor (pointing to the > left, or to the right, depending on which scale you pick on the > protractor. Now -- starting from exactly the same zero point, draw > another line the same length in the 180 degree direction on the *same* > scale on the protractor. (Keeping the base of the protractor aligned > just as before.) Now -- measure the distance apart the non-zero ends of > the lines wind up. That should be double the length of either of the > individual lines. This is what is happening with the center-tapped > transformer winding. > > Now -- just for the fun of it, draw a *third* line, at the 120 > degree point from the first -- also the same length. Measure the > distance between the two. If the first and second lines are each 120 > units long (inches, millimeters, or whatever takes your fancy), the > distance from the end of the first line to the end of the third should > be 208V. Now, shift the base of the protractor, so it is along the line > you just drew, but with the zero in the same place as for all the > others. Draw a new line at 120 degrees to the last line. Check the > angle between the line you just drew, and the first line, and that > should be 120 degrees as well. Now, excluding the second line (which > was 180 degrees), measuring the distance between the free ends of any > two of the other three lines should give you the same length (208, if > the length of the drawn lines was 120). > > >Besides, I live a metrified country and our degrees are different..:-) > > Hmm ... how many do you squeeze into a full circle? That could > explain a *lot*. :-) (Mind you -- I've seen other systems for measuring > angles (radians, and gradians), but none of those are called degrees, so > we should be safe from them. :-) > > > > >> Your understanding is good -- but your terminology is wrong, I > >> fear. > > > >Fear no more...my understanding truly s*cks too > >... > >> > >> >a real world example is 3 phase current, where the voltages are 120 degrees > >> >out of phase with each other. Each leg produces 120 V to the centre tap, but > >> >only 208 V between themselves. > >> > >> Yes -- *if* there is a center tap at all. If you've got delta, > >> you won't have one, but if you've got a Wye connection the "center tap" > >> is possible -- although it won't be like a center tap on a transformer, > >> since in a transformer, the phase is locked by a common magnetic field, > >> with the only options being in phase or 180 degrees out of > >> phase, depending on the selection of winding ends. > > > >but it could be like a centRAL tap (wye) on 3 separate transformers, with each > >having 120V.. > >on the secondary side..with each humming it's own little 120 degree shifted > >magnetic humm.. > > Yes -- or 208V between any two of those wires. But no 240V > available anywhere to be seen. :-) > > BTW -- the hum should be interesting with the three separate phases. > You get a 120Hz hum from most transformers (one sound peak for > the positive voltage peak, and another for the negative one.) > Here, you've got more peaks between those, so the hum should be > near 360Hz. > > Enjoy, > DoN. > -- > Email: | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564 > My Concertina web page: | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html > --- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero --- ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: One more electrical question From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 22 Aug 1999 14:21:20 -0400 -------- At LAST..a voice of reason! Two Phase DOES exist,,and it is alive and well in my shop!! Teenut AAFRadio@erols.com wrote: > > ivanveg wrote: > > Question: How possibly could two 120 volt lines produce 240 volts, unless > > said lines were not 180 degrees out of phase with each other. If said lines > > are in fact 180 degrees out of phase, is that not a "two phase" system. > > That's actually a perceptive question, and I have to admit some > amusement at the "two phase/one phase wars" I've seen on various > newsgroups about the definition of same. The battle always boils down > to the writers' perceptions of theoretical versus accepted convention. > In polyphase systems with more than two wires, there's no *theoretical* > restriction on the vector difference between phases, other than it all > has to add up to 360 degrees in the end. Normal US residential service > thus a special case of a two phase system, where the difference between > phases happens to be 180 degrees. Since the phase difference makes it > appear like a single phase supply, one could just as easily call it a > special case of a single phase system. This is one of those cases where > *all* the protagonists are right! :-) What creates the controversy is > that the *accepted* convention for practical two phase systems places > the two phases 90 degrees apart. Nothing in the general case polyphase > equations for "n" phases absolutely requires it, though. Interestingly > enough, two phase was touted for quite a while over three phase because > it was thought that unbalanced loads wouldn't affect the total system > performance as much as it does three phase, but that turned out to be > one of those engineering religious arguments that was won by economics. > > Regards, > Mike Hanz ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: One more electrical question From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 22 Aug 1999 14:27:02 -0400 -------- MikeII, You should be a Politician. The prime requirement being the ability to say it all, and tell nothing! Teenut mike II wrote: > I think you are mixing up the power factor angle (cos theta etc...) between > the voltage and amperage which is due to inductance/capacitance, and the phase > angle between voltages of a supply.. > > There are two separate vector diagrams at work at any one time, with one being > superimposed on the other. > In, say a three phase supply, the voltages are 120 degrees apart, but the > corresponding currents in each leg could be (theoretical worst case) at +/- 90 > degrees to each of those voltages. At a perfect 100% power factor, the > voltages and their respective amperages would be all at the same angles...eg 0 > +/- 0 degrees for a single phase supply or 120 +/- 0 degrees apart for a 3 > phase. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: One more electrical question From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 22 Aug 1999 14:38:58 -0400 -------- I have made it perfectly clear, on this list, that my knowledge of things electrical is limmited..To say the least! However, being an ex-pat Brit, I could never figure out why, in the USA I can take two 110V leads out of my "Single phase" mains box and get 240V SINGLE PHASE...Yet by adding ANOTHER phase by means of capacitors etc..I suddenly had THREE PHASES. In the UK I could NOT take two 220V SINGLE Phases from my box and have 440V SINGLE Phase!!! To myself..a Layman..the ONLY description of US domestic supply,that makes any sense, is that of TWO PHASE supply. Teenut Fitch R. Williams wrote: > > mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > >And it would still be a two phase system! > > Yup. Tis true. That is why I said "by convention". But its good to give the > general case too. > > Fitch > > In So. Cal. > > The FAQ for RCM is: http://w3.uwyo.edu/~metal > Metal Web News at http://www.mindspring.com/~wgray1/ > The "Drop Box" is at http://www.metalworking.com/ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Auto Darkening Helmet Recommendations? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 22 Aug 1999 15:00:17 -0400 -------- A "Ghost in your vision" is NOT a "FLASH". That is no more inconvenient nor dangerous than glancing momentarily at the sun or having a flash bulb pop in your eyes. A "Welding Flash" is something else..caused by RELATIVELY longer exposure to the ultra voilet rays from the arc. This can be direct..but most often is caused by a peripheral or reflected source...No one looks directly at an arc long enough...nor, unless they are stupid, often enough to get a true "Flash" You will know it when you get one!! There is, usually, no immediate indication of a flash burn until it wakes you up in the wee small hours feeling as though someone poured white hot sand in your eyes. You cannot open your eyes and tears stream down your cheeks. One of life's more painful afflictions. Damp tea bags on the eyes are the only home remedy I have found will give any relief. Teenut XPRTEC wrote: > Thanks for the clarification! I am glad to know that I ain't gettin a burn, > when I get that flash that leaves you with the ghost for hours. Also didn't > want to be misleading somebody either. > > Jim XPRTEC@AOL.COM ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT: Famous HSMs? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 22 Aug 1999 17:34:08 -0400 -------- HRH The Duke of Edinburgh is (was?) patron of the Model Engineers Society in the UK and I recall reading at one time that he had a Myford lathe installed at Buck House. Teenut Brian Lawson wrote: > > Hey, how about Scott Logan. Only guy I know who has his name on a > company and is into HSM. > > Gone now, but Timothy Eaton, of Eatons store fame (grandson to the > founder) was an HSM. > > How come Walt Disney didn't get mentioned by you Californians, Gunner? > > There are quite a bunch of guys who are famous to me, but only BECAUSE > they are HSM's. > > Brian Lawson > Windsor, Ontario. > > On Sat, 21 Aug 1999 21:18:47 GMT, al@chelmsford.com wrote: > > > Walter Chrysler, who founded the car company of the same name, was a > >machinist. I read that he was one of those people who was always taking > >stuff apart to see how it worked. I have even have some 1950's era > >Popular Science Magazines around that have Chrysler Co. ads in them > >that feature a nice picture of a wooden machinists tool chest. It is > >full of lots of finely made machinists measuring tools, that where made > >by Mr.Chrysler himself. > > > > > >In article <37bde950.882107@nntp.ix.netcom.com>, > > mklotz@REMOVETHISalum.mit.edu (Marvin W. Klotz) wrote: > >> In a recent thread someone mentioned the possibility that Tom > >> Clancy might be an HSM, since his writing reflects more than average > >> knowledge of things metallic. Maybe he just has good researchers. > >> > >> Anyway, it got me thinking. Are there any famous people who > >> work metal as a hobby? I posed the question to my wife, who knows > >> lots about famous people. Between the two of us, we could only come > >> up with Jimmy Carter, a (in)famous woodworker - the White House staff > >> presented him with a complete woodshop when, to the delight of many, > >> he finally left the White House. The guy who played the Colonel on > >> the M*A*S*H TV series (the older guy, can't remember his name) is/was > >> an accomplished woodworker. George III loved to repair clocks as > >> did Catherine the Great's husband - whom she had murdered. Peter the > >> Great dabbled in all kinds of things while training to be czar. > >> > >> Are there any LIVING famous people who are known to be HSMs or > >> something similar - jeweler, gunsmith, etc.? > >> > >> - Marv > >> > >> Email address is spam protected, use: > >> Email: mklotz at alum dot mit dot edu > >> > >> Home shop utility freeware page at: > >> http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hall/4425 > >> > > > > > >Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > >Share what you know. Learn what you don't. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: One more electrical question From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 22 Aug 1999 18:05:00 -0400 -------- I think you misread my Question Alan. Here in the USA I can take two "Feeds" each of 110V single phase and get 220V "Single" phase. Add a phase (by means of capacitors etc) and I have THREE PHASES. Right?? One plus one equals three!!! HUH?? In the UK the regular domestic supply is 220V SINGLE PHASE (I know how easy it is to get three phase piped in..but that isn't my point.) SFAIK you cannot take two "Feeds" out of the UK domestic box, each of 220V single phase, and by adding a third (generated phase)..have a 440V three phase supply...Or CAN you?? I do know that you can "Borrow" a single phase from each neighbor, on either side and have three phase 440V..I don't think that is possible in the USA. It appears to me, that in the UK the domestic supply is ONE phase of a 3 Phase 440V supply and here in the US it is TWO phases of a three phase 220V supply. ERGO..we have a TWO phase electric supply here in the US!! Semantics not withstanding...If it Walks like a Two Phase supply and it Quacks like a two phase.....!! Teenut >> Teenut wrote: > > However, being an ex-pat Brit, I could never figure out why, in the USA I can > > take two 110V leads out of my "Single phase" mains box and get 240V SINGLE > > PHASE...Yet by adding ANOTHER phase by means of capacitors etc..I suddenly had > > THREE PHASES. Alan Inness wrote: > As an ex-pat Brit also, who was involved with the electrical industry > there, I am not sure what you mean by '2 SINGLE Phases' ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: One more electrical question From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 22 Aug 1999 23:20:25 -0400 -------- mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > >Teenut wrote: > > To myself..a Layman..the ONLY description of US domestic supply,that > > makes any sense, is that of TWO PHASE supply. Jim replied: > > Well, it is two phase. Of a sort. > > Typical US residential power is, by convention, termed center-tapped > 240 volt single phase, probably so nobody will attempt to run > multiphase equipment on it. > > Jim OF A SORT!!! BY WHOSE CONVENTION???? Simple question: Is it Two Phases or ain't it? It appears that it is...But like the Emperor's clothes..Everyone wishes it were not. I can hear the "Big Sparkies In The Skys"... "Hey guys..It suits us, for a lot of reasons, to give them two phases...but the poor, dumb, f**ks are too stupid to understand that, because the two phases are in sync. at 180 deg., you can't start a motor with it, so we'd better just tell them it is single phase." "Anybody questions that and we'll just give 'em a long "politicians" answer and make out they are stupid!!" "Then lets call it A CONVENTION!!! and most people will just accept whatever WE say!!" "Let's tell them that it is too difficult to draw a picture in ASCII and maybe they will leave us alone" Well hey! I got news for you..I don't need a picture in ASCII....Or crayon even! Anything you can find the words, in the English language, to describe, I and the majority of people on theis NG, can understand. BUT..If you guys need to go off for a while and get your story straight... 8^) Hey Guys! You "Sparkies" in particular...I am not trying to be awkward here, or start a war. However it is time to realise, that this "Intimanet" thing allows a lot of people access to a lot of information and prompts a lot of questions! All I can say is...The next time you-all are asked "Is it Single Phase or Two Phase?" you had better all have your ducks in a row!! Now..About Way Oil!! ;^) Teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: One more electrical question From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 22 Aug 1999 23:23:47 -0400 -------- KEEE...RIST!! Do these people LISTEN?? When did I mention using a Goddamn PHASE SHIFTER???? READ IT AGAIN!! Teenut..Who is getting pissed off by dumb answers11 Robert Nichols wrote: > > In article <37C0740C.13367E97@hotmail.com>, > Robert Bastow wrote: > : SFAIK you > :cannot take two "Feeds" out of the UK domestic box, each of 220V single > :phase, and by adding a third (generated phase)..have a 440V three phase > :supply...Or CAN you?? > > Sure you can. Let's call the original feed wires "A" and "B". Using a > phase shifter (any type) generate a new voltage on wire called "C" such > that the voltage between A and C is 220V with a phase shift of 120 > degrees. Now consider what the voltage is between B and C. It's also > 220V but with a phase shift of 240 degrees. Presto, 3 phases. Yes, > it's 220V, but that's just a step-up transformer away from the 440V you > asked for. > > With just two wires there is only one way to connect the load -- it > connects between the two wires. Add just one more wire and there are > now three ways to pair the wires and connect the load. > > [SNIP] > >ERGO..we have a TWO phase electric supply here in the US!! Semantics not > >withstanding...If it Walks like a Two Phase supply and it Quacks like a two > >phase.....!! > > You can call it anything you like in private. If you talk to an > electrician and want to be understood you'd better use the accepted > terminology. There's a basic principle in power engineering that you > can transform any polyphase system into any other using only > transformers. If you've got real 2-phase input (90 degree phase shift) > and want 3-phase output, it can be done, as can the reverse. But when > your input is single phase (with or without the center tap) your > transformers can't give you any phase angles other than the 0 degrees > and 180 degrees you started out with. That's the basic distinction of > single-phase and the reason that the center-tapped version is never > referred to as "two-phase." > > -- > Bob Nichols rnichols@interaccess.com > PGP public key 1024/9A9C7955 > Key fingerprint = 2F E5 82 F8 5D 06 A2 59 20 65 44 68 87 EC A7 D7 ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: One more electrical question From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 22 Aug 1999 23:50:53 -0400 -------- Ron Moore wrote: > > Ok, Look. My Eyes are peeled > In the UK, a 240v motor is supplied by a 240v source. >If you look at the waveform, you will see a (singular) sine wave. I knew that..even before this thread started > In the US, a 240v motor is supplied by a 240v source. Agreed >If you look at the waveform, you will also see a singular sine wave. Agreed Both will have two zero crossing events during one conplete cycle. Both WHATS??? Phases??? > > You "could" have a center tap on the UK 220v to ground system. But DO YOU?? The only > difference is where the ground is connected in the supply circuit. It does not make it 2 phase. Why not? Because the two phases are separated by 180 degrees instead of 90 degrees. Does one disappear? Or is it simply masked by the other? > A multi-phase system has multiple sine waves with different zero > crossing event timing. The number of non-coincidental zero crossing events > of same direction in one cycle time determines the number of phases. Is this a "Legal definition" or a "Convention" > Two phase power is achieved, usually, "USUALLY"...Meaning What? >when a standard single phase (Here comes the obfuscation!) > 120-0-120 has an added 120v high leg from another (120 degree offset) phase > of a three phase source. This will give 240v on the original lines and 208v > to the closest phase (120 degree offset) leg of the original 120. So far, > two legs of a Delta 3ph source. A third "phantom" phase occurs (240 degree > phase difference) with the other original 120 leg. We are not discussing three phase here Ron. I think, by now even the dimmest members of the NG understand three phase supplies. >This voltage is a bit higher, as I remember, than the 208v on the second phase And here I was thinking that this was a precise science...How silly! >and this configuration will operate "most" 3ph motors. I am not going to be the first to start a new thread on what exactly is a THREE PHASE SUPPLY and what kind of motors CAN'T it run What we are asking here is.. Why, if a 220 V supply is made up of two "IMPUTS", each of 110v and they are 90 or 120 deg out of phase ..it is called a "Two phase supply" BUT if they happen to be 180 deg apart it is only a "Single Phase supply"? What do you call it if they are only 179 deg or 181 deg apart? Is that a "nearly Two phase" > Respectfully, > Ron Moore Right about now I'll bet he is going to get a bit less respectful!! ;^) Sorry Ron, Nothing personal...but we have a ways to go yet. Equally respectfully Teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: china lathe's(JUNK) From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 22 Aug 1999 23:54:24 -0400 -------- Close though ;^) Jeff Pack wrote: > > saying all Chinese lathes are junk, is like saying all Americans are > assholes... > Nothing like a gross exaggeration.. > > there are different "grades" of Chinese (and Taiwanese) equipment > that aren't so bad. Grizzly and Jet as examples... > > gstuff wrote in message news:37C06C14.2D905033@sgi.net... > > I just installed 3 new small lathes in a shop ,(I did not sale them to > > the guy)all 3 motors fryed on the spot. > > co. will send new motors ,but if you want to put american motors on them > > they will not give you a refund for the def. and will not pay for the > > repair work. I for one would not send my money over there for the crap > > you get. > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How to file aluminum...? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 23 Aug 1999 01:56:02 -0400 -------- The problem you experience is common to all files on all metals...Its "official" name is "Pinning" Conventional wisdom is to rub the file with chalk..but in 40 plus years of filing I haven't found this to be worth a tinkers cuss!!! A file is a cutting tool like any other, and, like other cutting tools, responds to the correct lubricant. Kerosene will work..but is IS SMELLY!! I use good 'ole WD40 because it is cheap and handy to apply. On real heavy duty filing, particularly of tool steels etc., I take the trouble to fetch my suphurised oil squirter from the lathe. Even this treatment will not, totally, prevent pinning. Get yourself a good "file card"..one with stiff bristles on one side and wire bristles on the other, and USE it frequently. Don't wait for the problem to arise..but get in the habit of brushing with the bristles every few strokes. Even EVERY stroke on critical finishing cuts. If the "pins" won't come out with the card, then get a 3/4" wide strip of 16 gage steel or brass...Fix it in a handle and keep it with your files. To use it, file or grind the end dead square and first rub it a few times along the length of the teeth, up near the tang where they are single cut. This will establish "teeth" on the steel that mirror the teeth on your file. Use it to push out pins and other grunge, working carefully, always in the lay of the teeth. New files benefit from a gentle break in period, during which fragile burrs are worn off, rather than snapped off..taking a chunk of tooth with them. At the same time the gullets become polished and less likely to pin up. I have found that this process can be speeded up by gentle brushing on a soft wire brush on the grinder. Naturally you always work in the direction of the tooth gullets. A file that has not had this break in process, but is pushed hard, straight out of the box, will have a short but nasty, lifetime tendency to pin badly!! Teenut Bill Richman wrote: > > (And if anyone says "Under 'A'" they get a free set of aluminum jockey > shorts, poured in place... ;-) > > I'm having a heck of a time with my files "gumming up" with aluminum. > When I file a casting, it keeps going "rasp, rasp, rasp, rasp, HACK"; > little globs of aluminum stick in the teeth of the files, and on the > next pass if I don't notice and stop in time, they leave these lovely > furrows across the almost-smooth surface I'm filing. I don't recall > having this much trouble early on when filing my castings, but I don't > think they alloy has changed. I've tried two different cross-cut files > and a mill file, and they all do the same thing. The mill file takes > longer between problems, but eventually it, too, succumbs. One of the > cross-cut files is a few years old, and the other is brand-new. I've > seen comments about dipping the files in kerosene (first, gotta find > somewhere I can buy it, and second, gotta convince myself the smell is > worth it.) I've also seen something about files with curved teeth; > haven't been able to find one at any of the hardware stores, and haven't > made it to the industrial tool store before closing time in the last 10 > days. Just poured the head stock for my Gingery lathe, and don't want > to hack it all up trying to clean off the fins. Any suggestions? > > -Bill Richman (bill_r@inetnebr.com) > http://incolor.inetnebr.com/bill_r - Home of the COSMAC Elf Microcomputer > Simulator, Fun with Molten Metal, Orphaned Robots, and Technological Oddities. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: One more electrical question From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 23 Aug 1999 02:38:39 -0400 -------- It helps a lot Bob. The term split phase seems to offer a middle ground between the case hardened Sparkies who have always understood it this way because that is what they were taught and that is always the way it has been done. They appear never to have questioned it, or been questioned..inbreeding at its worst!! The fact remains that a 220v single phase supply in the UK is just that...One phase of a three phase 440volt distibution system. It is not split at the consumers box into two feeder busses (or whatever the correct term is) of 110V each. The 220V supply to any appliance..be it a night light or a domestic oven, consists of a live and a neutral plus a ground. You cannot take two separate 220v "lives" out of a UK box and feed them to a 440v single phase motor (If such a beast existed) Nor can you take two such 220v feeds,(From the SAME domestic box) add a third from whatever source and have a three phase 440V supply. Au Contraire..In the US the incoming 220V supply is??? What? And I guess here is the point of misunderstanding. If the incoming supply is 220V TRUE SINGLE PHASE, how is it possible to split this between two busses and have each one a TRUE 110v single phase, albeit, 180 degrees apart? Where does the phase shift take place? How come I can take two of those 110V "Lives" add a third by means of a capacitor etc and have a three phase supply? Explain that to me, (deleting all expletives,) in laymans terms and I for one, will be content. Teenut RWatson767 wrote: > > Robert > >: One more electrical question > > I have had enough. Now I have to reply. > To have N phases you must have N sources. No more-No less. In the US we > typically have a primary of much greater magnitude that is stepped down to what > we need. In most cases the transformers have 1 primary winding consistent with > the voltage that is distributed. And 2 identical secondary windings. The > secondary windings can be connected to add in voltage or add in current. We > usually have the voltage added configuration for our use in homes etc. The > connection between the 2 windings is usually grounded at the consumers power > panel. The 2 leads from the connected secondary windings, L1 and L2, gives > us 110 volts in reference to the neutral that is grounded and 220 from each > other. It is usually called single phase. However some call it split phase in > reference to the single phase that is distributed. If you look at it with an > oscilloscope you will possibly come to the conclusion that it is 2 phase but in > reality it is simply 2 potentials that are 180 phase degrees from each other. > We need this difference to make things work when we hook things across L1 and > L2. This gives us the option for not only 110 voltage loads but also for 220 > volt loads. Were the 2 secondary leads in phase there would be no difference in > potential from each other. Also were there any different phase relationships > there would be other problems that would add to the costs which ultimately > would be born by the consumer. > Hopr this helps. > Bob AZ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: One more electrical question From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 23 Aug 1999 02:51:28 -0400 -------- I disagree! I think the two "Sides" are A) Mature enough to understand that there is genuine misunderstanding here. B) Just at the point of a breakthrough..In the way of understanding on the one hand and in the approach to explanation on the other. Isn't that what this NG is all about? Teenut Dick Brewster wrote: > > In article <7pqnj1$edr$1@nnrp1.deja.com>, mulligan@advinc.com > says... > .... > > I can see from these comments that you now understand my explaination, > > and have completely mastered the issue at hand. Now quit getting > > everyone's panties in a knot and go do something useful! Any more > > 3 phase questions from the teenut gallery will be met with 30 lashes > > with a wet henway. > > > > Jim > > It is currently time to phase out this shocking discussion. It > has the potential to polarize this group. > > Dick > > -- > username. dbrewste > domain. ix.netcom.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: One more electrical question From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 23 Aug 1999 11:32:23 -0400 -------- Thanks Mike, Now I begin to see the light. Mike Graham wrote: > > On Sun, 22 Aug 1999 23:50:53 -0400, Robert Bastow wrote: > > >Both will have two zero crossing events during one conplete cycle. > > > >Both WHATS??? Phases??? > > Both power supplies - UK and US. > > >Why not? Because the two phases are separated by 180 degrees instead of 90 > >degrees. Does one disappear? > >Or is it simply masked by the other? > > The two lines are in phase. When one 120V line is at peak, the other is > at a peak. When one is at zero, the other is at zero. > Let me put it this way. Imagine you need to push your car down the road > to the gas station. Imagine that you are doing the pushing in pulses; every > time you take a step you give the car a push. The car still goes along, and > you are giving it a push about every second. You are a single-phase source > providing power. Now add another guy. If he pushes the same way, in > lockstep with you, so that you are both pushing at exactly the same times, > then you are still a single phase source, but you are pushing the car twice > as hard. That's 120V + 120V = 240V, single phase. If the second guy was > pushing at a different time than you, then it would be two-phase. If the > pushes are in sync, then there is only one phase. > > >> 120-0-120 has an added 120v high leg from another (120 degree offset) phase > >> of a three phase source. This will give 240v on the original lines and 208v > >> to the closest phase (120 degree offset) leg of the original 120. So far, > >> two legs of a Delta 3ph source. A third "phantom" phase occurs (240 degree > >> phase difference) with the other original 120 leg. > > > >We are not discussing three phase here Ron. I think, by now even the dimmest > >members of the NG understand three phase supplies. > > Nope, you're getting off track here, Robert. A 120-0-120 pair coming off > of a SINGLE TRANSFORMER can't help put be in sync, because it is being > formed by a single source - the primary of that transformer. There is no > way to get multiple-phase from that 120-0-120 pair. However, your neighbour > has his own transformer. It's hanging on the pole in front of his house, > and it's run off of a different line than yours. If you can pinch a 120 > line from *his* transformer, and add it to the lines from *your* transformer > then you now have two phases. > > Imagine a drummer. This drummer has two drumsticks and a drum. He > beats the drum steadily with one stick. Single phase. 120V. He starts > beating with the other stick as well, but keeping the same beat. The sticks > rise and fall as a unit. It's now twice as loud, but it's the same beat. > Single phase. 240V. Now he lets one stick drag behind the other stick so > that instead of DUM....DUM....DUM.....DUM.... he gets > dumdum...dumdum...dumdum...dumdum... that would be two phase. Two events > (beats) in a single cycle. If he grows another arm so that he can use three > sticks independantly then he can beat out dumdumdumdumdumdumdum to get three > events per cycle, and have three phase. > > >And here I was thinking that this was a precise science...How silly! > > Now, now, Robert... let's not get unpleasant. 8-) > > -- > Mike Graham, mikegraham at sprint dot ca > Caledon, Ontario, Canada (just NW of Toronto). > > Raiser of animals. Weldor of metals. Driver of off-road vehicles. > Writer of FAQs. Keeper of the faith, and all around okay guy. > > < homepage currently off-line due to change of ISP; back soon > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: One more electrical question From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 23 Aug 1999 11:39:53 -0400 -------- MOI?? Seriously Spehro I was not (deliberately) trying to yank anybody's chain..except to prompt some one to come up with a non-jargon, simple answer to a simple question. It would appear that the US domestic supply of 220v single phase is made up of two components, each of 120V single phase. They are distinctand complementary but, because they are 180 degrees out of phase they do not ACT like a multiphase supply and under well established convention they cannot be CALLED a multi phase supply. How did I do? Teenut Spehro Pefhany wrote: > > the renowned Dick Brewster wrote: > > > It is currently time to phase out this shocking discussion. It > > has the potential to polarize this group. > > Yeah, I think teenut's been yanking my (bead) chain, a little light just > came on. > > -- > =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= > Spehro Pefhany "The Journey is the reward" > speff@interlog.com > Fax:(905) 271-9838 (small micro system devt hw/sw + mfg) > =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: One more electrical question From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 23 Aug 1999 21:06:01 -0400 -------- My Apologies Bob. Robert Bastow Robert Nichols wrote: > > In article <37C0BEC3.C746AD24@hotmail.com>, > Robert Bastow wrote: > :KEEE...RIST!! > : > :Do these people LISTEN?? > : > :When did I mention using a Goddamn PHASE SHIFTER???? > : > :READ IT AGAIN!! > : > :Teenut..Who is getting pissed off by dumb answers11 > > I suggest that you go back and read your own article again. Here, in > that same article that I was responding to, is where you mentioned using > what you now call a "Goddamn PHASE SHIFTER": > > In article <37C0740C.13367E97@hotmail.com>, > Robert Bastow wrote: > : > :Here in the USA I can take two "Feeds" each of 110V single phase and get 220V > :"Single" phase. Add a phase (by means of capacitors etc) and I have THREE > :PHASES. Right?? One plus one equals three!!! HUH?? > > And, in the next paragraph you said: > > :SFAIK you cannot take two "Feeds" out of the UK domestic box, each of > :220V single phase, and by adding a third (generated phase)..have a 440V > :three phase supply > > All this talk about generating a third phase "by means of capacitors > etc" is discussing a phase shifter. If you cannot grasp even that > simple fact then this discussion is pointless. > > Your main comment was about the supposed impossibility of adding one > more phase to a single-phase system and getting 3-phase power, and > that's what I was mainly addressing. Sorry if the method of generating > that added phase got in the way. But to your comment, "One plus one > equals three!!! HUH??" I have to say that with just two wires there is > just one way to select two wires to connect across your load. Add just > one more wire carrying an independent phase, and you've now got three > ways, not two, to select a pair of wires. It is true that they are not > three independent phases, but indeed the phases of 3-phase power are > very closely related by simple vector sums. > > -- > Bob Nichols rnichols@interaccess.com > PGP public key 1024/9A9C7955 > Key fingerprint = 2F E5 82 F8 5D 06 A2 59 20 65 44 68 87 EC A7 D7 ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: One more electrical question From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 23 Aug 1999 23:05:59 -0400 -------- I ALWAYS keep one hand in my pocket!! ;^) Robert Robert Swinney wrote: > > Robert, > Keep one hand in your pocket when you do this. > Robert Bastow wrote in message <37C043C2.FEDC8797@hotmail.com>... > >I have made it perfectly clear, on this list, that my knowledge of things > >electrical is limmited..To say the least! > > > >However, being an ex-pat Brit, I could never figure out why, in the USA I > can > >take two 110V leads out of my "Single phase" mains box and get 240V SINGLE > >PHASE...Yet by adding ANOTHER phase by means of capacitors etc..I suddenly > had > >THREE PHASES. > > > >In the UK I could NOT take two 220V SINGLE Phases from my box and have 440V > >SINGLE Phase!!! > > > >To myself..a Layman..the ONLY description of US domestic supply,that makes > any > >sense, is that of TWO PHASE supply. > > > >Teenut > > > >Fitch R. Williams wrote: > >> > >> mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > >> > >> >And it would still be a two phase system! > >> > >> Yup. Tis true. That is why I said "by convention". But its good to > give the > >> general case too. > >> > >> Fitch > >> > >> In So. Cal. > >> > >> The FAQ for RCM is: http://w3.uwyo.edu/~metal > >> Metal Web News at http://www.mindspring.com/~wgray1/ > >> The "Drop Box" is at http://www.metalworking.com/ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: One more electrical question From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 23 Aug 1999 23:06:52 -0400 -------- I ALWAYS keep one hand in my pocket!! ;^) Maybe that's why my eysight is fading!! Robert Robert Swinney wrote: > > Robert, > Keep one hand in your pocket when you do this. > Robert Bastow wrote in message <37C043C2.FEDC8797@hotmail.com>... > >I have made it perfectly clear, on this list, that my knowledge of things > >electrical is limmited..To say the least! > > > >However, being an ex-pat Brit, I could never figure out why, in the USA I > can > >take two 110V leads out of my "Single phase" mains box and get 240V SINGLE > >PHASE...Yet by adding ANOTHER phase by means of capacitors etc..I suddenly > had > >THREE PHASES. > > > >In the UK I could NOT take two 220V SINGLE Phases from my box and have 440V > >SINGLE Phase!!! > > > >To myself..a Layman..the ONLY description of US domestic supply,that makes > any > >sense, is that of TWO PHASE supply. > > > >Teenut > > > >Fitch R. Williams wrote: > >> > >> mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > >> > >> >And it would still be a two phase system! > >> > >> Yup. Tis true. That is why I said "by convention". But its good to > give the > >> general case too. > >> > >> Fitch > >> > >> In So. Cal. > >> > >> The FAQ for RCM is: http://w3.uwyo.edu/~metal > >> Metal Web News at http://www.mindspring.com/~wgray1/ > >> The "Drop Box" is at http://www.metalworking.com/ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Maximat V10-P Lathe Motor Switch From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 23 Aug 1999 23:15:42 -0400 -------- You might try Blueridge..they carry spares for Emco. Hang on to your wallet..They ain't cheap! I don't know if the V10 has the same switch as the Super II...two speed forward and reverse...5 position Rotary switch. I have a spare that I might be tempted to part with for a HUGE bag of gold!! Frankly..I hate the thing and am considering replacing it with a push button/relay system. However..From previous posts, you can see that this is beyond my capability to design. Maybe one day! Robert Wolfgang Habicher wrote: > > The switch on my 1976 pride and joy finally packed it in! > I took it apart...carefully...and determined it's a mechanical fault. > The cam bar with the 3 latches is broken in the middle, which is a very > difficult spot to repair. Soooooo, before I tackle this miserable task, > are spare parts still available for this machine? All I need would be > the mechanical assembly, not the contact blocks. > Alternatively, has anybody replaced this switch with a commercially > available substitute? > I figure it could be done with 3 relays, each with 5 poles, one of them > double acting. > Your urgent input would be greatly appreciated since my lathe is hors de > combat until I repair it. It's the only lathe I have. > Thanks for your help. Wolfgang ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: One more electrical question From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 24 Aug 1999 03:11:41 -0400 -------- Robert Nichols wrote: > Close enough to perfect to be not worth arguing about. There you see..All your hard work was not in vain! > You mean there really _was_ a misunderstanding? And here all this time > I'd been thinking you were the second coming of Altav*z and just being > obstinate about a point of semantics. Sheesh, you really had me going > on that one. > Yes Bob..there REALLY was a LACK of understanding on my part..compounded by mixed signals I was getting from various, undoubted experts. I think we all are experts in our own particular fields..but we tend to forget that words, phrases, definitions, CONVENTIONS etc., that we use every day, can be very confusing or even misleading, to someone with less knowledge. So far as AL****v*z is concerned..Have no fear! If I ever decide on, or am pushed into obstinacy...YOU AIN'T SEEN NOTHING YET!!!! ;^) Robert ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Request for help for a newbie with used mill From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 24 Aug 1999 03:14:56 -0400 -------- Send it to ME!! Teenut James Atchison wrote: > The mill was sold > with a built in tracer unit that I have removed. If anyone has any > suggestions I would be very receptive. Thanks, > > Jim ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: One more electrical question From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 24 Aug 1999 03:17:58 -0400 -------- I guess YOUR Mother never warned you John! Teenut John Stevenson wrote: > > On Mon, 23 Aug 1999 23:06:52 -0400, Robert Bastow > wrote: > > >I ALWAYS keep one hand in my pocket!! ;^) > > > >Maybe that's why my eysight is fading!! > > > >Robert > > > WHAT?? > -- > Regards, > John Stevenson > Nottingham, England ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Pressing Problem From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 24 Aug 1999 07:29:55 -0400 -------- Hi John, I don't think you can "overkill" on the broach itself..provided that it is al aligned properly and clear underneath. (If not..You're screwed at any pressure. Your two limiting factors then become the press frame itself and, of course..time. You can calculate or test the time by dividing the gpm by the swept volume of the cylinder. The press frame..I can't help you with much. Is it steel or CI? It might be worth making a new 'H" frame out of welded steel for the hydraulic cylinder and keeping the arbor press for smaller and more sensitive jobs. Robert Bastow John Stevenson wrote: > > Hey you guys help me out. > > I have a mandrel press that I use for broaching keyways up to 3/8" wide [ 10mm ] > It's quite hard work when you get batches of 100 in at a time. > I'm looking at building a electro hydraulic unit just for broaching. > I have quite a few bits, in fact all I need except side rails and that's just > bought in channel. > The problem I have is deciding which pump / ram combination will be best. I > don't won't to go over the top with pressures. > > At the moment I have a 30" long handle that will move the rack 6" for I > revolution. Assuming I can pull 120 pounds max [ good day with 8 wheatabix ] > I work that out to be putting 30/6 * 120 lbs force on the rack which equals > 600lbs force > > Are my figures OK on that ? or have I missed something out ? > > I have a brand new pump unit with pressure and speed controls on it that has a > max gauge pressure of 1000 psi. Assuming 1/2 that working pressure that's 500 > psi on a 3" dia ram I work that out to 3,534 lbs force. Again am I right? > > If so I either need to drop down to 85 psi or use a smaller ram. > > Comments, Insult , Abuse ?? > -- > Regards, > John Stevenson > Nottingham, England ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Pressing Problem From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 24 Aug 1999 16:21:38 GMT -------- gmarsden wrote: > > Now, what is wheatabix? -- the "breakfast of (English) champions"? > George in Houston, TX > > OMIGAWD Stephensen!! You have gone and done it now!! Teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Slitting Saws From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 24 Aug 1999 16:38:16 GMT -------- Virgil wrote: > I need to cut a .040x .040 slot in a piece of unhardened > 5/32 drill rod. Right now I am using a cut-off whell from a > Dremel tool on my Sherline mill to accomplish this. It works > ok, but the quality of the slot is not as good as I would > like. > > Would a slitting saw or jewelers saw work for this purpose? > I read on the Sherline site that the speed must be correct > or the saw blade will dull immeadiately. What speed would be > appropriate for this kind of operation? > > Any help or suggestions would be appreciated. > > Virgil > > Dremel make a HSS slitting saw on an integral 1/8" mandrel The one I have is .0435" wide and about 3/8" diameter..it looks like a tiny woodruff cutter> I run it at 300 rev/min in a 1/8" collet in my mill and use lots of lubricant. So far it is standing up as well as any HSS cutter. Teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Pressing Problem From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 25 Aug 1999 16:13:01 GMT -------- Gerald Miller wrote: > Don't know about English champions but I do believe those from Scotland > develop maximum output on oatmeal! Maximum output of used oats!! Teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Possible Am Rifleman Story Post From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 27 Aug 1999 03:10:48 GMT -------- Go for it...It is far easier to beg forgiveness, than to obtain permission!! Harry Pope serves as an example and a warning to any self respecting machinist.. Example: No matter how good you think you are..there is always someone better!! Harry Pope for one! Warning: Don't expect to get rich by just being the best at what you do...Harry Pope died alone and in abject poverty! Robert Bastow Fdmorrison wrote: > > Hi, All: > I have reduced a story from a 1941 issue of _American Rifleman_ to txt that I > could break into three or four messages to post here. > It is about Harry M. Pope, the rifle barrel maker, and I think it would be > enjoyed by many. > I was wondering if anyone could point out where I might request permission to > do so from the copyright owners (if any copyright still exists). > I have e-mailed the NRA's website, but there is no response after several > weeks. And I'm not an active shooter or a gunsmith, so don't have contact with > those folks. > > Best regards, > Frank Morrison ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: looking for web site From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 27 Aug 1999 03:21:13 GMT -------- That wot which you seek, used to be called Hobby Plan and they had a web site < http//:www.hobbyplan.com> But there is no response there now. Teenut mact wrote: > > I used to know of one but can't remember the name of it. The site I am > searching for sells plans for metalworking and woodworking for about > $6.50/each. If any body knows of the site that I am search for please > contact me. > Thank you > mike ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Oil Of Olay From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 29 Aug 1999 17:49:04 GMT -------- We used to call Newcastle Brown Ale "Oil Of OLay".... Six pints and every woman in the room looks beautiful!! Teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Center to center measuring From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 30 Aug 1999 13:06:03 GMT -------- IF you WERE being a Purist....You would take both outside AND inside dimensions (of the rods) with gage blocks,not a caliper, add or subtract the rod diam..etc, and then take the MEAN of the two results. The reason for this being that the pins are never an EXACT fit in the holes an wll "lean" in or out depending on the direction and pressure of measurement. Using this technique will give a reasonably accurate center distance..even if the pins are a bit "Sloppy" Teenut Eastburn wrote: > > Being a purist - I'd put a precision rod into each hole. [requires 2 sets ;-)] > Measure with a trusted and true caliper. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT: Incredibly comfortable chair discovery. From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 30 Aug 1999 13:09:32 GMT -------- Monty Python was one of the reasons I left the UK!! Among the other reasons were Benny Hill and the TR7!! Teenut David Berryhill wrote: > > BTW, I've made Monty Python references in the ng before but not too many > people seemed to get it. One night (when I was a cop working graveyard > shift) my Sergeant and I decided to see who could use the word "shrubbery" > the most when talking on the radio. No one else had the slightest idea what > we were doing (but we enjoyed ourselves!) > > Dave Berryhill > PLAlbrecht wrote in message > <19990829222551.13746.00001665@ng-fj1.aol.com>... > >>Just saw in the paper that Monty Python is going to get together and > >>do a 30th reunion in October... > >> > >>Nee > > > >Oh, what sad times are these when passing ruffians can `nee' at will to > >old ladies. There is a pestilence upon this land, nothing is sacred. Even > those > >who arrange and design shrubberies are under considerable economic stress > at > >this period in history. > > > > > >Pete > >Who, as keeper of the sacred words: Nee, Pang, and Nee-wom!, formerly said > Nee, > >but now says Ecky-ecky-ecky-ecky-pikang-zoom-boing-mumble-mumble. > > > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT: Incredibly comfortable chair discovery. From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 31 Aug 1999 00:14:13 GMT -------- Neither did I!! Sounds about right though! Teenut John Stevenson wrote: > > On Mon, 30 Aug 1999 13:09:32 GMT, Robert Bastow wrote: > > >Monty Python was one of the reasons I left the UK!! > > > >Among the other reasons were Benny Hill and the TR7!! > > > >Teenut > > > Didn't know Benny Hill had a TR7 > -- > Regards, > John Stevenson > Nottingham, England ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: inner workings of firearms From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 31 Aug 1999 00:23:54 GMT -------- No one will disagree with your theories. However, in practice, an injection and ignition system for liquid propellants, plus a durable breech sealing system, has proven somewhat elusive! Teenut Bill Robert wrote: > > I have an idea to build a firearm using lead balls as projectiles, and > hydrogen and oxygen mix as propellant. I never could figure out why this > idea has never been popular. From a practical standpoint the fuel is > cleaner, the ballistic force is adjustable, you could go from the force > of a .22 rimfire, to the force of a .223 long rifle with a mixture > adjustment. I think if you took equal weights of brass and powder, > compared to equal weights of 2 tanks of gas. You would get more shots > per pound with gas than powder. As far as going fully automatic you can > use the liquid fuel to cool the barrel, much like rocket engines do. Any > way this idea has always fascinated me, I am a machinist by profession, > so I don't think I can build it, I know I could. One of these days when > I retire, I would like to have a fully working machine shop in my > garage. I would also like to build a miniature jet engine. I can't think > of any better way of spending endless hours playing with devices that > create power. > > boyd wrote: > > > > Peter Larsen wrote: > > > > > > This is slightly off-topic, but these are my thoughts. > > > > > > I like guns. I've always had guns. I've always been fascinated by the > > > mechanics of them. I'm also interested in machining & injection molds..... > > > and clever design. > > > At one time I had the compulsion to design an assasin pistol - an injection > > > molded, electric/battery operated, throw-a-way, .22, kind of like a > > > Pez-dispenser (you old guys remember them, right?) > > > The conclusion I reached, after not too long was----- better brains than > > > mine have been working on weapons forever, so why bother - whatever I though > > > of had probably already been done.... also, I got kind of a dirty feeling > > > working on weapons design ....... and finally, you're dealing with > > > explosives ...... which means you could loose a finger, a hand or an eye > > > .... and for what???? > > > Bottom line ..... it's dirty work and not worth bothering with. > > > > Metalworking can be used for good or evil. If you assumed when you > > design a more efficient automobile engine that it will be used by a > > drunk to drive through a crowded playground you would be depressed and > > unlikely to continue. > > > > Most weapons designers have the attitude that they are building their > > devices to protect themselves and their families from those who would do > > evil, whether it's a handgun, a battle tank, or a supersonic fighter. > > The metal used and the designs are neutral in their morality. It is > > only the morality of those who employ the devices that matters. > > > > If people all decided "why bother - whatever I thought of had probably > > already been done" we'd still be living in caves and trying to kill wild > > animals for food and protection by throwing rocks. > > > > -- > > Lou Boyd > > FCSA-GOA-NRA-JPFO > > Article II: A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of > > a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not > > be infringed. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: looking for zamak From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 31 Aug 1999 00:32:30 GMT -------- Yeh Dave! And a lot cheaper! Go to any scrap yard and pick up a bushel basket of scrap; car door handles, mirrors, carburetters etc and melt them down. You will have to skim off the dross and chrome plate etc... Teenut David Alexander Johnston wrote: > > Does anyone know of a supplier in or around Ottawa or Ontario or Canada > that will sell 10 or 20 lbs at a time? > thanks > Dave > -- > q > #### ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Shaper From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 31 Aug 1999 00:34:48 GMT -------- Give me a call off line! PS there is one on Ebay right now teenut Tom Csibor wrote: > > I'm still looking for a shape, preferable a 7" benchtop, but would consider > a full sized one. I'm located in Northern California. On a bench top I would > entertain shipping from most places. > > Thank you. > Tom Csibor. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Find of the week From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 31 Aug 1999 00:41:37 GMT -------- NO TOOLING!!! You were ROBBED!!!! ;^) teenut John Stevenson wrote: This is a Clarkson > tool and cutter grinder with the air spindle but no tooling. > -- > Regards, > John Stevenson > Nottingham, England ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.marketplace,rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.crafts.misc,rec.crafts.polymer-clay,rec.crafts.pottery Subject: Re: Attention 89369 From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 01 Sep 1999 02:11:41 GMT -------- I don't know what you guys on polymer clay are into (I hate to even stab a guess!!)..But could you please ask your regular suppliers to keep their "supplies" to themselves!! Thanks, A rec.crafts. metalworking regular. ly87m@aol.com wrote: > > Want to talk with 100% REAL horny girls? > > The women on the line are NOT paid. > They call for free phone sex with guys like YOU - it's Free for them! > > Only $1 per minute or less > > =====================>1-888-335-HOTT (toll-free) > > =====================>1-888-302-ORGY (toll-free) - phonebill billing available here > > ---------------------------------------------------------------- > > For gay talk call:1-888-800-GUYS (toll-free) > > 18 and over only please! > > tG3.$C>e1[ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: It's a Mad Mad Mad ebay World! From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 01 Sep 1999 02:18:51 GMT -------- Whoopdedoo!! What about all the brand new Starrett stuff going for 1/2 list price?? Get a LIFE!! Teenut Ned Simmons wrote: > > Fluke 123 with 4 hours to go and already at twice list price: > > http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=153481165 ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: inner workings of firearms From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 01 Sep 1999 02:35:06 GMT -------- And while you were loading your "People's" gun and waiting the couple of seconds before ignition..The "Ruling Minority's" gun would have blown them to Kingdom Come!! "If the Meek ever inherit the Earth...The Strong will take it back within 24 hours" Teenut nobody wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > No one will disagree with your theories. > > > > However, in practice, an injection and ignition system for liquid propellants, > > plus a durable breech sealing system, has proven somewhat elusive! > > The "people's gun" would be built with a lightweight > pneumatic cylinder, a small spark plug, and a piezoelectric > ignitor from a fireplace lighter. Fueled with gasoline and > using 1/4" ball bearing projectiles. > > To fire, you would rapidly stroke out the piston, creating a > partial vacuum. At the end of that stroke, a quantity of > gasoline would be metered into the cylinder and the intake > valve of the cylinder would open, thoroughly vaporizing and > mixing the gas with air. A rapid stroke shut would compress > the stochastic mixture and force it into the combustion > chamber, blocking the passage between cylinder and chamber > at the end of the stroke. You would ignite the mixture within > a couple of seconds of charging the combustion chamber. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Is this a record?? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 01 Sep 1999 02:41:46 GMT -------- Even for RCM this thread has got to hold the record...From home foundries to the analities of computer languages in two posts!! Teenut kenneth knaell wrote: > > Mark et.al., > I was on campus regularly up until 1965 when I finally graduated with a PhD. > I never got to see the foundry in action and can't imagine where it was > located and I knew those engineering grounds very well. VERY well having > gotten three degrees there. However when I mention that I programmed in > SCATRAN in 1964-5, every programmer I have ever talked to laughs at me so I > say I programmed in FORTRAN . Using punched cards to correct your original > code in the partially compiled /assembled jibberish they gave back was a > real hardship. They kept the original source code card deck so you were > forced to use their jibberish output. Then I think they got the idea that > people were reproducing their source code card decks on the reproducing > machine before the they turned the job in (duh) so they started giving the > source code decks back with the printed output results of the run. > > Ken "Go Bucks" Knaell > > Mark Kinsler wrote in message ... > >Greg Holmes wrote: > >>I've been curious about casting AL and Brass at home but I don't want to > >>invest in something without seeing the technology in action. > >> > >>Are there any home foundries in the central Ohio area that would be open > >>to having an outsider looking over their shoulder? > > > >Hah. If you'd gone to Ohio State University when I did, you'd have been > >able to watch an aluminum foundry in action right on the campus. > >Industrial engineering students in the 1960's had to take an industrial > >technology course. I wandered into their foundry lab one day in maybe > >1966. It was outside, under a sort of shelter. The kids were whanging > >away at sand molds on a little production line, ramming the sand in, > >flipping the cope/drag assembly over, dusting with mold release, and all > >that. They'd pour the aluminum in at the end of the line, break open the > >mold after it cooled, and deburr the casting. The kids worked like crazy: > >I don't know what they were being graded on. > > > >Oh: the product was, I believe, an aluminum hamburger press that had the > >Ohio State seal emblazoned upon it. At least that's what I remember. You > >might see if there's one in the IE department somewhere. There were two > >parts that had to be assembled. > > > >Ohio State's IE department was also the repository of the only computer > >science program there. All computer science courses were listed under > >industrial engineering. It was there that I learned the SCATRAN > >programming language. This was one of the precursors of the new-fangled > >FORTRAN. > > > >M Kinsler > > who would have graduated in 1969 if he hadn't spent his time at Ohio > >State screwing around. > >-- > >........................................................................... > . > >Athens, Ohio, USA. Home of the "How Things Work" educational program. > >See http://www.frognet.net/~kinsler ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: drummond lathes From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 01 Sep 1999 02:50:24 GMT -------- Tom Holt wrote: > > My first lathe was a Drummond; wish I still had it. A friend of mine > still earns his living with one. He must buy a lot of road-kill helper!! Teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Realigning gap pieces From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 01 Sep 1999 03:04:44 GMT -------- "DoN. Nichols" wrote: > > Anybody out there who has actually *removed* the removable > secion in a gap-bed lathe? If so -- how much trouble was it to restore > the accuracy? There are a couple of possible anwers to that question Don.. 1. It is easy, once you replace exactly the same amount of crap that was left in the joint when first set up for grinding!! 2. Surprising..but try it!! Even a (thumbnail detectable) discrepancy in alignment doesn't make a fat lot of difference to the accuracy or alignment of the lathe! (I will now retire while y'all argue the toss on that point!!) Teenut Question.. Were slant bed lathes invented in China?? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking,sci.engr.joining.welding Subject: Re: Grinder numbness From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 01 Sep 1999 03:14:22 GMT -------- Yes Mike, It can lead to serious nerve damage. Try getting a pair of the gel palm gloves made specifically for users of high vibration devices (NO...NOT THAT ONE!!!) You might want to balance your wheels a bit too!! ;^) Robert Mike Graham wrote: > > I do a fair bit of hand grinding. I just came in from the shed where I'd > been grinding for a couple of hours. I have the normal 'surface numbness' > that I'm so used to that I hardly notice it any more. It lasts for about > half an hour after a prolonged grinding session. I just got to thinking, > has anyone ever heard of any long-term health issues caused by this? > > -- > Mike Graham, mikegraham at sprint dot ca > Caledon, Ontario, Canada (just NW of Toronto). > > Raiser of animals. Weldor of metals. Driver of off-road vehicles. > Writer of FAQs. Keeper of the faith, and all around okay guy. > > < homepage currently off-line due to change of ISP; back soon > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Help with machine shop safety tips From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 02 Sep 1999 07:11:21 GMT -------- Compressed air, especially from a non "Safety Jet" can be (and has been) lethal. Against the skin, it can penetrate, just like a diesel injector jet , and cause a fatal embolism. The deadliest form of "horseplay" is the apprentice who decides to "Goose" his workmake with an air jet. Compressed air entering the rectum will rupture internal organs, literally blowing S**T out of the victim's mouth, and result in an agonising death. It happened once in my works..I was fortunate enough not to witness it, but I did know the two kids involved. Not to be fooled with! Teenut Gerald Miller wrote: > > It doesn't need to be directed toward an orifice, high pressure air in an > industrial application can penetrate the skin pores and kill! At least this > is the warning we were given when we were told that any horseplay with an > air hose would result in escort from the plant NON-STOP. They had had a > couple of deaths from horseplay. I never bothered to investigate the truth > of these allegations, no sense of adventure I guess. > > Gerry > London, Canada > > Spehro Pefhany wrote in message > news:Jrnz3.956$1p5.79884@cac1.rdr.news.psi.ca... > > the renowned Allan Adler wrote: > > > > > I didn't know this. How can compressed air kill you? > > > > I have heard that you can get a fatal embolism from having compressed air > > blown into a vulnerable orifice. Similar to injecting air into a vein > > with a syringe. > > > > -- > > > =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- > = > > Spehro Pefhany "The Journey is the > reward" > > speff@interlog.com > > Fax:(905) 271-9838 (small micro system devt hw/sw + > mfg) > > > =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- > = > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: quick violin repair HELP From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 02 Sep 1999 07:20:54 GMT -------- Take the drive!! It is an easy job for an expert..an even easier job for an amateur to screw up. If you take it NOW it won't cost as much as when you inevitably take it LATER!! Been there, done that! Teenut Sherm Fry wrote: > > Ok rcm guys here is the deal. My Daughter sat on her violin tonight and > poped the finger board off the neck of this thing. What kind of glue > should I use to reattach the finger board to the violin? The finger > board looks like ebony wood, the part it glues is some sort of soft > wood. > I tried to sand the residue off of the ebony with 80 grit sandpaper > without removing much of it. > > Should I try to repair this thing my self or drive 100 miles to a real > violin repair shop? > > Sherm Fry ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Help with machine shop safety tips From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 03 Sep 1999 03:11:59 GMT -------- Why? Grant Erwin wrote: > > I am skeptical of the mortality probability with compressed air. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Drilling angled holes From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 04 Sep 1999 08:48:31 GMT -------- Take a block of steel, drill a hole of the size required, cut the block to the angle required, clamp it to your job and drill the hole. Works well for one or two holes. For more holes/longer life, make the jig out of tool steel and heat treat accordingly. Teenut Bruce Simpson wrote: > > Now excuse my ignorance (cringe)... but I'm about to start work on my > pulse-jet engine and I've encountered a situation that's never arisen > before in my very short time as a rec.metalworker. > > I need to drill a hole at an angle to a flat surface. > > How do I make sure that the drill will run true? > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: METAL STORM From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 04 Sep 1999 08:59:06 GMT -------- Oh No...Not the old multiple loading trick again! Even Leonardo (da Vinci) couldn't make that one work...or even Adolf (Hitler) Maybe THIS time!! Teenut David R Brooks wrote: > > Eastburn wrote: > > :Wow - multi-color add. > :Here it is in text. > :Martin > > Or, the following URL has a "Metal Storm" that may be more on-topic > here: > http://www.dsto.defence.gov.au/corporate/publicity/media/metal.html ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Elevator Bolts : was : info on sheet metal stud welders? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 04 Sep 1999 09:02:13 GMT -------- Elevator bolts are a large flat, slightly countersunk head bolt..used to fasten buckets or slats onto elevator chains or belts. Elevator as in bucket type..not people or grain type!! 8^) Teenut Dave, Fleming wrote: > > " And then says I. " > From a catalog of 1926 > elevator Bolts > No:1 Forged steel, large countersink head > Length 1 inch Diameter 1/4 inch Weight 4 Lbs per 100 > My description from illustration in catalog. > Similar to carriage bolt with very large flat diameter head. > It would be my guess that they were used to secure the floor boards or > the side panels of elevators to the structural frame work of the > elevator car. > ::From the description my guess is a bolt to screw into the bottom > ::of a table or desk leg to level or "elevate" the leg. > :: > ::Bob > :: > ::In article <7qooj4$ga3$1@autumn.news.rcn.net>, "kenneth says... > ::> > ::> > ::>Now what do you suppose such a thing is used for on elevators? Why > ::>elevators in particular? > ::> > ::>"Speed Nuts" ..I understand > ::>"Railroad Spikes" ..I understand > ::>"Fender Washers" ..I guess I understand > ::>"Sheet Metal Screws ..I definately understand > ::>. > ::>. > ::>"Elevator Bolts" ..?? > ::> > ::>Ken Knaell > ::> > ::> > ::>PLAlbrecht wrote in message > ::><19990903101755.02098.00001077@ng-ba1.aol.com>... > ::> > ::>...... > ::> > ::>>Here's another idea. Ever hear of "elevator bolts"? Just saw some at the > ::>local > ::>>hardware store. Think of a bolt with a very thin, washerlike head. Or a > ::>stud > ::>>with a washer welded to one end. Plenty of material there to spot weld > ::>AROUND > ::>>the stud. Or braze, silver solder, etc. Just checked McMaster-Carr, they > ::>have > ::>>'em but the bad news is smallest size is 1/4-20. > ::>> > ::>...... > ::>> > ::>>Pete > ::> > ::> > > "I wouldn't say I'm idle, I just have a sedentary lifestyle." ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Help with machine shop safety tips From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 04 Sep 1999 21:38:41 GMT -------- I can second the fact that one good burn MUST lead to a lifetime of vigilance. I got mine, sunbathing in Cairo, thirty years ago. For the past ten years I have had an annual checkup with a Dermatologist and each time they have found "Something" and nipped it in the bud..usually quite painlessly, with a shot of liquid nitrogen. Now I go semi-annually. I watched someone die of melanoma one time...Not pretty. Teenut BeeCrofter wrote: > > >bad burn. > >I know this isn't what you want to hear, but keep a sharp eye out for > >abnormal spots and growths in the affected area. > > Bigger than a pencil erasor > Irregular in shape > Multi colored. > > Maybe we got a metalworking Doc out there to enlighten us further? > > Tom > > There is an extra Bee in the Email address after the AOL.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Oilite bearing VS needle bearing? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 05 Sep 1999 02:09:07 GMT -------- The pressed on, hardened race is obviously better...or they wouldn't sell 'em would they?? ;^) However, if you do need to run on a "bare" shaft for any reason, I would advise using "Thompson Shafting"..this is case hardened and ground to close limits and can be obtained in short lengths. teenut Kevin Pinkerton wrote: > Would I have to use a pressed > on inside race on the shaft with needle bearings or would a drill rod > shaft be ok for direct contact with the needle bearings? > > Thanks, > Kevin > > My Gun Page: http://extra.newsguy.com/~kpinkert/ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.marketplace,rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.crafts.misc,rec.crafts.polymer-clay,rec.crafts.pottery Subject: Re: Phone Numbers 96769 From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 05 Sep 1999 02:10:44 GMT -------- Is there some way to STOP this GARBAGE??? tnmom12@aol.com wrote: > > Meet someone tonight! (18+ only) > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: METAL STORM From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 05 Sep 1999 02:18:48 GMT -------- You betcha, ever since man discovered the art of stuffing powder and ball down a tube. Usually the first step of every charlatan inventor..often the last too, because the whole thing explodes sooner or (rather than)later!! A double barrelled shot gun has the FASTEST rate of fire ever devised..problem is, it is only for two rounds and then you have to reload!! ;^) Scott Moore wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > Oh No...Not the old multiple loading trick again! > > > > Even Leonardo (da Vinci) couldn't make that one work...or even Adolf (Hitler) > > > > Maybe THIS time!! > > > > Teenut > > I saw an article on it, his first gun is based on loading several rounds > at once > with an arrangement to have each one light the next in the barrel in > turn > after a delay. > > Done before, eh ? > > [sam] ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: "Little John" Raglan lathe info please From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 05 Sep 1999 04:51:12 GMT -------- Nice Nice Machine! One of the "top end" UK machines..I always lusted after in my ..shall we say..penurious youth. Tony Griffiths has a ton of information for you.. http://www.lathes.co.uk/page14.html Go there and look at some of the other stuff he has too. It is worth enquiring about shipping charges from the UK on some of the tastier items. teenut Nick Alexander wrote: > > I have just bought a Little John lathe on an auction sale. It seems a > fairly sturdy model engineer's size lathe with a rather useful 3 morse taper > headstock, 5.5 inch centre height and 26 inches (or so) between centres. > It also has a power cross feed which is rather nice on a lathe of this size. > > Does anyone know of any info on this lathe? This one has a spring loaded > taper pulley speed control; is this standard? The taper pulley works fine > in the forward direction, but slips in reverse. Is this a common problem? > How does one lubricate the spindle bearings? It seems to have a rather > complex change wheel arrangement; does anyone have instructions on setting > up the gear train? > > I would be interested in hearing from other users of this lathe. > > Regards, > Nick Alexander ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.marketplace,rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.crafts.misc,rec.crafts.polymer-clay,rec.crafts.pottery Subject: Re: Phone Numbers 96769 From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 05 Sep 1999 05:18:15 GMT -------- What the hell are you talking about Mike..Did I say I had made a call or did your imagination get the better of you again? BTW there are obvious signs that your hand was still shaking when you typed your response!! Might I suggest you try: alt.rec.vicariouspleasures.com I'm sure someone there will help! ;^) teenut mike II wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > Is there some way to STOP this GARBAGE??? > > > > tnmom12@aol.com wrote: > > > > > > Meet someone tonight! (18+ only) > > > > So....is that 18+ the IQ requirement of a 'customer' or the charge for > the call, in Dollars per Minute? What exactly bothered you so much about > the call? I mean I'm curious and all, but I don't have the nerve to call > them myself, so I'd like the opinion of a world traveller, such as > yourself...who's been AROUND..nudge nudge, wink wink...know what I mean? > Eh? Is she a SPORT? nudge nudge...SAAAY NO MORE... > > monty mike II ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Phone Numbers 96769 From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 05 Sep 1999 07:01:48 GMT -------- I think that's funny. teenut PLAlbrecht wrote: a guy is > sitting in a bar, and a hooker walks up to him and says "I'll do anything you > want for $100." Guy draws on his beer, thinks a moment and says "You're on. > Paint my house." > > When you think that is funny, you have definitely become domesticated. > > Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: "Little John" Raglan lathe info please From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 06 Sep 1999 05:26:27 GMT -------- Naw! I had to settle for a Smarte and Brown Model A!! Teenut Nick Alexander wrote: > > Well, did you ever get one, once you graduated from your ..penurious.. > youth? > > Robert Bastow wrote in message > news:37D1F6D6.6ACB13AE@home.com... > > Nice Nice Machine! > > > > One of the "top end" UK machines..I always lusted after in my ..shall we > > say..penurious youth. > > > > Tony Griffiths has a ton of information for you.. > > > > http://www.lathes.co.uk/page14.html > > > > Go there and look at some of the other stuff he has too. It is worth > enquiring > > about shipping charges from the UK on some of the tastier items. > > > > teenut > > > > Nick Alexander wrote: > > > > > > I have just bought a Little John lathe on an auction sale. It seems a > > > fairly sturdy model engineer's size lathe with a rather useful 3 morse > taper > > > headstock, 5.5 inch centre height and 26 inches (or so) between centres. > > > It also has a power cross feed which is rather nice on a lathe of this > size. > > > > > > Does anyone know of any info on this lathe? This one has a spring > loaded > > > taper pulley speed control; is this standard? The taper pulley works > fine > > > in the forward direction, but slips in reverse. Is this a common > problem? > > > How does one lubricate the spindle bearings? It seems to have a rather > > > complex change wheel arrangement; does anyone have instructions on > setting > > > up the gear train? > > > > > > I would be interested in hearing from other users of this lathe. > > > > > > Regards, > > > Nick Alexander ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: glass glue From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 06 Sep 1999 05:30:11 GMT -------- Tell her to use a smaller hammer!! Teenut Felice Luftschein & Nicholas Carter wrote: > > I have a similar need - the rear view mirror on my car keeps coming > off. I tried the glue they sell for that purpose, and will try again , > but it didn't work. I tried crazy glue as well, and it works for about > two weeks and then comes unstuck. Odd that it only happens when my > wife adjusts the mirror.... > Any particular solutions? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Wanted Carbide Inserts From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 06 Sep 1999 05:42:13 GMT -------- Go to your nearest, friendly, neighborhood Machine Shop. Say Hi, and tell them what you need. Most shops will have a couple of buckets of used carbide inserts set aside for the scrap buyer. They will let you cull through and, if you don't need but a few will probably let you have them for free..Just because Machinists are Nice Guys! (Well most of us..Most of the time) Teenut Gina Vizzard wrote: > > I am looking for carbide squares about 3/4 x > 1/4 thick.... ve seen them in machienest catalogs. They do not need to > be coated or anything fancy. just hard. Is there a used market where > thease are available ? any info on scorces would be nice..... thanks > in advance, Gina ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Metalworking Health Hazards? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 06 Sep 1999 05:49:07 GMT -------- Bill, you might do better addressing this question to: Rec.crafts.chest surgery. Failing which..See your Doctor..NOW!! Good luck Teenut ..and yes, most of us use breathing protection when required. Bill Richman wrote: > > I hope this isn't a naive question, but... do any/all of you wear a dust > mask or other breathing apparatus while grinding/filing/machining/sanding > metal? [Warning - icky biological reference coming up!] The reason I ask > is because sometime over the last month or so I've started coughing up a > little blood after I do something strenuous; at first I thought it was only > when I had been grinding or casting, but now it seems like if I go out and > carry a bunch of heavy stuff around or push the lawn mower around for a > couple hours, I get the same thing. About the same time I noticed it, I had > started taking "Nasonex" nasal-spray anti-allergy medicine, which apparently > contains steroids of some type. I took it all last spring/fall with no > problem, though, so I suspect that's not it. I've never really seen > anything in the metalworking books I've read that indicates you should wear > a dust mask, and they said nothing about it in the lathe and milling machine > classes I took at the local community college. I mentioned it to my dentist > and he sort of freaked out and went into this big lecture about how they > make them wear masks and use a suction device when they're grinding gold for > teeth, etc. I'm planning on visiting my doctor as soon as I can get an > appointment, but I was wondering what, if anything, everyone else does in > terms of protection from metal dust... > > -Bill Richman (bill_r@inetnebr.com) > http://incolor.inetnebr.com/bill_r - Home of the COSMAC Elf Microcomputer > Simulator, Fun with Molten Metal, Orphaned Robots, and Technological Oddities. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT: FCC Mandates Surveillance Features From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 06 Sep 1999 05:53:48 GMT -------- How about this one: http://www.techweb.com/wire/story/TWB19990903S0014 Teenut Bill Richman wrote: > > I know this is totally off-topic, but considering the number of people in > this group who have expressed concerns about privacy issues and freedom from > government jerking-around, I thought it might be worth posting. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT: FCC Mandates Surveillance Features From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 06 Sep 1999 08:05:44 GMT -------- I have NEVER claimed to be innocent!! teenut PLAlbrecht wrote: > > "If you're innocent, you have nothing to fear. Now then, do you REALLY want us > to get a warrant?" ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: lathes and milling machines from PROMAC From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 06 Sep 1999 08:15:25 GMT -------- Hi Beat, I am very fond of Swiss made machine tools even if they are somewhat "over engineered" I swear that the "Christen" drill grinder I just bought has more moving parts than my Rolex!! The name "Promac" doesn't ring any bells..excepting the tablets I take!! Where are these machines built? In Switzerland? Or China? There IS a difference, believe it or not!! Teenut beat straehl wrote: > > Hi > > Does anybody know a manufacturer of milling machines > and lathes named PROMAC. This machines can be > bought in switzerland. I'm wondering whether this > machines are good enough for professional work > especially if they are robust and precise enough. > > Thanks > > beat straehl > flumenthal, switzerland ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Help a newbie decide which lathe to buy..fast From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 06 Sep 1999 08:27:47 GMT -------- Hi Eric, You are to be commended on your perseverance..twelve months turning metal on a wood lathe!! Been there, done that...You wanna get together and compare scars? Now you are in a position to buy your first REAL lathe. You find yourself in a position we have all been in..Or would like to be in. There are other considerations apart from the condition of the bed ways..wear on the feed screws being a major one. However, as you soon will find out, the lathe (or mill) is just the first (and often cheapest) step. Tooling up can cost as much as the basic machine. Prices you quote sound pretty reasonable.. All things being considered, and depending on the AMOUNT of additional tooling..I would go for the one with the taper attachment and tooling. Always buy the BEST quality you can afford..You will never loose money on GOOD tools. At the risk of being flamed out of the skys..Forget the Atlas..it is not in the same league. Not that it isn't a good lathe..for what you pay..but you will "Grow out of it" too quickly Teenut Eric Kudell wrote: > > Hello all..I am a metal working newbie who has been using a wood lathe > to machine metal for the last year..(dont ask how). > > Well here is my dilema, I have the chance to buy one of four lathes. I > would like your opinions. Here are the choices, > > 1.Southbend 13" TKL made in 1953 with no tooling. Bed is in good > condition - $500 > > 2.Southbend 13" TKL made in 1953 with 3 jaw chuck. in better condition > that the 1st lathe, owner says you can still see the grind marks on the > bed. - $900 > > 3.Southbend 13" TKL made in 1953 with chuck, taper attachment and misc > other tooling. About the condition of the 1st lathe - $1200 > > 4.and lastly, Sears atlas engine lathe 36" between centers with 3 jaw > chuck. didnt ask the condition. $200 > > Please give me your advice. If I purchased one of these, would I be > able to resell it and recoup my money if I want to change to another > down the road. Also, do the prices sound high, or low, etc. I am going > to look at them Monday. I have thought about buying a new lathe, but > anything made in america is expensive. I will be learning on this lathe, > but using it make prototype parts for a product. > > Thanks in advance, > > Eric ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: knurling question From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 07 Sep 1999 04:25:16 GMT -------- You sure can, that's what the graduations are for. Set the axles parallel to the lathe axis for straight, slew both cutters to the same angle in the same direction for spiral knurling and in opposite directions for diamond knurling. If you can find some knurls without a lead in chamfer..these tools will do a "Cut Knurl" that will open up your metalworking world to a whole new set of possibilities. Failing that, take your knurls to a machine shop and have them surface ground to remove the chamfer. Make up the space behind them with hardened spacer washers. If you have ever wondered how camera and tool manufacturers get such crisp knurling, especially on thin wall material..You just learned the secret!! You have one of the best knurling tools ever made. I don't know what you paid for it..DON'T tell me!! I failed to be high bidder on one on Ebay that went for around $160.00!!! Teenut John Jacobs wrote: > > I picked up a Brown & Sharpe knurling tool at a flea mrkt. I think it > came off a screw machine. It has straight knurls and it is the scissor > type. The knurls are fully adjustable. They even have graduations on the > holder. My question is Can I produce diamond knuls just by rotating the > cutters? I was going to order l.h. and r.h. cutters. Thanks in advance > for the help. > > John Jacobs > wgm ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: LATHE Logan 1955 H From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 07 Sep 1999 04:39:23 GMT -------- Probably WE think they are worth a whole lot less than YOU think they are worth!! ;^) Teenut "C.W. Thomas" wrote: > > HI; > > I'm thinking about selling my Logan. its a 1955 model H. it was mfgd in > 1968 or there abouts. it has a quick change transmission for doing threads > and a back gear. Its in reasonably good shape and has an attached cabinet > with drip pan and bison 3 Jaw also A 4 jaw chuck. theres a few 10thous wear > under the chuck but other than that its in good shape. its wired for 110 and > has a 3/4 horse motor if I remember. also it has a royal thru the head > collet chuck and a box of collets (4C I think). as well as a bunch of > tooling. > > I have a 12 inch rotary table (chinese) from Enco in 1997 in good shape. > also I have a ten year old mill drill made in china a typical one. > in fair to good shape with a set of holders and abvout 10 or so carbide > mills in good shape. . what do you guys think theyre worth?? > > thanks; > C.W. Thomas ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Royal collet spindle collar question... From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 07 Sep 1999 12:04:51 GMT -------- Check that the adaptor isn't simply TOO LONG!! Some lathe spindle bores are 5MT (Mine is) but if the spindle bore is 1 3/8" you may find that the taper is only cut back a couple of inches or so, and that there is a step inside the bore (Mine has). My lathe spindle will take the 5C adaptor I have BUT it will NOT take a 5MT sleeve that I purchased, I had to cut that back in length to avoid hitting the step in the bore. teenut Kevin Pinkerton wrote: > > On 7 Sep 1999 01:45:02 -0400, dnichols@d-and-d.com (DoN. Nichols) > wrote: > The MT on the inside of the spindle is great. The collect adapter does > not fit snug in the nose of the spindle. This is obviously not the > right size adapter for the lathe. I was suspect of that in the first > place. It is definitely a MT5 adapter, but too small for my spindle. > > Thanks for the help. > > Kevin > > My Gun Page: http://extra.newsguy.com/~kpinkert/ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: WANTED: Bench Mounted Hand Operated Metal Shaper From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 07 Sep 1999 12:10:57 GMT -------- If you are in the UK try Tony Griffiths Tony@lathes.com or http://www.lathes.co.uk If you are in the USA GOOD LUCK!! I don't think the hand operated shaper was ever very popular here. OTOH..There are lots of seven inch motorised shapers out there. teenut Bob wrote: > > I would like to purchase a bench mounted hand operated metal shaper in > very nice condition. Any one have one for sale? > > Bob ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: It's a Mad Mad Mad ebay World! From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 07 Sep 1999 12:16:06 GMT -------- Jim, Obviously you are an expert on spotting shill bidding on Ebay. For the benefit of the Ebay addicts (Myself)..Could you please explain exactly what it is that makes it so obvious to you, and perhaps give a recent example..with the ebay number, so that we can all share the secret. Thank you teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article <37D3F50D.4AA8CFE2@bellatlantic.net>, > Festave wrote: > > It is against ebay rules to bid on your own item, or to get others to > > bid on > > your item to artificially increase the price. > > Stop, you're killin me here. I see so many instances > of shill bidding on ebay that nothing suprises me any more. > > > And anybody who actually tries your experiment, if caught, could be > > de-registered from ebay. > > Which would slow that person down for about 2.5 microseconds in the > ebay world. Honestly, what amazes me the most is how *many* honest > folks I see selling items on ebay. I personally have never been > scammed (well, if at all, not much) there, but one sees the signs > of shill bidding again and again. > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Share what you know. Learn what you don't. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Bolting down milling machine?? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 07 Sep 1999 12:24:01 GMT -------- Oh how we HSMs love to sweat the small stuff! I would imagine that, in the case of a 'quake severe enough to knock over a Bridgeport, one is going to have other, far more important things to worry about!! Teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Blank MT arbors From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 07 Sep 1999 12:30:27 GMT -------- I used to buy these very useful items from Busy Bee when I lived in Canada. I haven't seen any advertised since getting back to the USA and yet I see them referred to by quite a few people on the list. Who sells them? are they available in larger sizes? Thanks teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT: FCC Mandates Surveillance Features From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 07 Sep 1999 12:35:04 GMT -------- W J Ward wrote: > Governments HATE free speach. They DESPISE the Internet. They also hate the idea of an armed population, ready and willing to defend themselves. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Royal collet spindle collar question... From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 08 Sep 1999 00:42:48 GMT -------- Kevin Pinkerton wrote: Hmm!! With That amount of slop (0.1") one or the other isnt 5MT..sounds like you adapter is a 4 1/2 MT Check the "Major Dia"..if it is 5MT it should be pretty close to 1.75" dia ( IMMSMC) Teenut > > The 5C to MT5 collet adapter is rather short and probably only about > 1.5 to 2" long I think. It fits loosely in the nose of the spindle. I > would say there is at least .1" slop. I am almost certain it is a MT5, > because a MT4 is noticeable smaller diameter out where the collet > adapter would go (in the reference books anyway). > > I have emailed Royal asking for guidance and possible solutions short > of buying a whole new setup. Maybe they will sell me a proper adapter > (for a pretty penny I am sure). Otherwise I cannot imagine any other > options, except for maybe a home made thin sleeve and I think I will > pass on that. > > Kevin > > My Gun Page: http://extra.newsguy.com/~kpinkert/ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: knurling question From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 08 Sep 1999 17:52:58 GMT -------- Preset to size and feed straight in from the end. In other words, don't try to squeeze them gradually onto the diameter to be knurled. Don't try it with an Armstrong or scissors type..It needs to be very ridgid. Best type I saw were built very like a Geometric die head and opened at the end of the stroke. teenut kenneth knaell wrote: > > OK, I've heard this before but I still don't know how to do it. So you have > got knurls without the lead-in chamfer that have sharp square edges on one > or both faces. How do you use them to get the "camera quality" > knurls(either diamond or straight longitudinal)? Its still a secret as far > as I'm concerned. > Ken Knaell > > Robert Bastow wrote in message <37D493D2.5114976F@home.com>... > >You sure can, that's what the graduations are for. > > >If you have ever wondered how camera and tool manufacturers get such crisp > >knurling, especially on thin wall material..You just learned the secret!! > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: dro report From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 08 Sep 1999 23:36:22 GMT -------- If you can't make and fit a set of rollers to run closer than .0005" runout...Why all the sweat over making a DRO to read to "tenths"..you need practice on the basics first! teenut fred veenschoten wrote: . my feeling now is that unevenness of the wire and out of round > rollers are affecting me most. the rollers are running within .0005. that's > about as close as i can get them. > fred ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Bedside Reader and changes at Starrett From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 08 Sep 1999 23:42:10 GMT -------- Sounds reasonable to me, I once poked myself VERY close to my eye with the curved end of a SG scriber! Ever since then I have kept a cork on the end not in use. teenut Mike Graham wrote: > > On Wed, 08 Sep 1999 13:21:00 -0400, Robert Bissett wrote: > > >Maybe it was to reduce the damage to your eye or other body parts when you peered closely. > > Somewhat like the question "What is the purpose of the ball on top of a flag pole?" > > > >On the surface gage it was more likely for looks. Almost all the older tools and instruments > >had these nice touches. > > Actually in the book Lautard reported that the purpose of the ball was to > sort of 'protect' the curved point on the surface gauge; you set the curved > point into the 'armpit' of the ball, and then nobody can get stabbed. > Apparently that is what the boys and girls at Starrett told him. > As for lacking in artistic touches, the new ball-less surface gauges would > appear to be colour-casehardened, which is somewhat artistic in a > mock-tortoiseshell kind of way. The ones with the cast iron base aren't > colour-casehardened, of course, but the hardened steel ones are. > > -- > Mike Graham, mikegraham at sprint dot ca > Caledon, Ontario, Canada (just NW of Toronto). > > Raiser of animals. Weldor of metals. Driver of off-road vehicles. > Writer of FAQs. Keeper of the faith, and all around okay guy. > > < homepage currently off-line due to change of ISP; back soon > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: knurling question (For Teenut) From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 09 Sep 1999 02:21:18 GMT -------- The round shank is intended to fit in a TURRET tool slide and be fed AXIALLY onto the work. In other words, the work piece, as it is knurled disappears up the hollow shank. Yes you can hold it in your saddle tool post..but do please feed it axially, not like a "scissors" type. teenut John Jacobs wrote: > > This knurling tool is shaped like a t. I said it was a scissor type for > lack of a better word. It also had a one inch shank. I cut off the shank > and made a nice one to fit my toolholder. I got 6' of 3/4 aluminum a > Jacobs (no relation) micro chuck and the knurling tool for six dollars. > Probably my best score yet! > Thanks Teenut for the info. > John Jacobs ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: While we're talking about edge finders... what about conical tips? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 09 Sep 1999 02:41:03 GMT -------- These double ended devices ar called "Edge and Center Finders" The cylinder is for edges, the point is for centers, center drilled holes, center popped locations...but particularly for aligning very accurately with scribed center lines. You do this ONE LINE AT A TIME!! Don't try to do both at once! First center the point by pushing the edge of your rule against it while the point is about 25 thou clear of the surface. Yes, you can use your thumb nail..but the first time it rides up over it will be the last time you pull that fool stunt!!! Back the point about 100 thou away from one line, bring it down to within a few thou of the surface and align it as accurately as possible, with the other line using a good glass and a light. Now, set that axis at zero and BACK it away from the first line. Set it to the second line with glass and light and finally return your first axis to zero. You are now on center. The old timey toolmakers, (Including my good self,) used to get "on center" within a thou, REGULARLY!! Closer if the job demanded and using nothing but a "Sticky Pin" Believe it or not..I had never heard of or seen an "Edge and Centerfinder" until I came to the USA in my mid thirties. Nor had the venerable George H Thomas..who independently "reinvented" it in his eighties!! They were not in common use in the UK..perhaps now..but not 40 years ago when "I were a lad" teenut BillDarby wrote: > > I've thought about how to use the "pointy end" a good deal and I believe that > accurate readings may be taken in tight places with it ,,,,,,,,,so long as you > remember that the edges being defined have to be at equal height and the pointy > end must be set to the same height for comparative readings. > > For instance: > > If you wanted to set up over the center of a slot about .100" wide > then you would first have to consider if the sides of the slot were (well > defined) and of equal height. Then so long as that condition was met then no > error due to difference in height / ill defined edge, would be introduced. > Then the pointy end could be brought into the slot and moved against successive > sides noting the readings of each, while taking care to have the quill set to > the same height for each reading. It is realized that there is little > likelihood of requiring any quill movement during such work in a single slot but > the principle applies nun the less, and if, for instance, you were trying to > locate the center of the space between two slots then it would, undoubtedly be > necessary to alter the quill height in order to move from taking the reading on > the wall of the first slot to taking the second reading on the wall of the > second slot. IE you'd have to move "up", "over" and "down" to get the > two readings. > > Regards Bill Darby > > Brian wrote: > > > One question along similar lines: I've got a double ended edge finder with > > one end a 0.2" cylinder that works great. Now how/why/when do I use end #2 > > which has a conical tip? Use of the cylinder is simplicity in use and > > understanding but I can't see how you could get any accuracy with the cone. > > > > Brian ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: MSC Delivery From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 09 Sep 1999 02:49:59 GMT -------- Yeh! I'm jealous; depending on traffic, I have at least a twenty minute drive to the HUGE Atlanta distribution center. One day I will have them do an urgent delivery..Just to see it they can deliver faster than I can fetch it. 8^) Considering the incredible service I, and others, have been experiencing..I wouldn't place bets on me being able to beat them..in EITHER of my Jags!!! teenut Marv Soloff wrote: Its ONLY 10 minutes to Heaven on Earth! > > > > Jim XPRTEC@AOL.COM > > Lucky, lucky man! > > Regards, > > Marv ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Help choosing new drill bit sharpener From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 09 Sep 1999 06:39:22 GMT -------- The best drill grinding machines in the world are built by Christen in Switzerland. Their US Agent is Jerico Inc 630 616 7901..ask for Tom Blechschmidt. How do I know this? I have a Christen..the small one..handles drills from 0.011" to 0.356" that I could be persuaded to part with for the right price...Should you decide that throwing small drills away is not a good idea. Buy a Machine like this, sharpen your small drills PROPERLY...BEFORE putting them in service and see the huge savings you can make. Don't know what the big ones cost, but replacement cost on mine (still a current model) is about $12,000.00!!! No! I didn't pay that for it! ;^) teenut Margaret & Rick wrote: > > I work for a large company that is going to start sharpening there > larger drill bits themselves. The small ones are junked, the ones under > 3/8 or 1/2. What we are looking for is a professional sharpening > machine. No two hundred dollar specials, but a professional rig. In > the past we used to sharpen all our bits and then went to out sorcing > around 10 years ago. Well they want return to doing the sharpening in > house. We already own a sharpener for the large bits, like 3/4 and up > to 2 1/2 inch and plan to return it to service. So the question is what > is the best sharpener for the 3/8 to (3/4 or 1") type usage, preferably > American made but this not an absolute requirement. Any help or > recomendations on a sharpener that fits these requirements wil be > apreciated. > Washington State Rick ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Help choosing new drill bit sharpener From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 09 Sep 1999 06:43:06 GMT -------- Oh! By the way. If your company still insists on junking small drills when they are blunt..chuck a few towards these list members. We may even do you a deal..we sharpen 100% of them and send 25% back to you..for FREE!! teenut Robert Bastow wrote: > > The best drill grinding machines in the world are built by Christen in > Switzerland. > > Their US Agent is Jerico Inc 630 616 7901..ask for Tom Blechschmidt. > > How do I know this? > > I have a Christen..the small one..handles drills from 0.011" to 0.356" > that I could be persuaded to part with for the right price...Should you decide > that throwing small drills away is not a good idea. Buy a Machine like this, > sharpen your small drills PROPERLY...BEFORE putting them in service and see the > huge savings you can make. > > Don't know what the big ones cost, but replacement cost on mine (still a current > model) is about $12,000.00!!! > > No! I didn't pay that for it! ;^) > > teenut > > Margaret & Rick wrote: > > > > I work for a large company that is going to start sharpening there > > larger drill bits themselves. The small ones are junked, the ones under > > 3/8 or 1/2. What we are looking for is a professional sharpening > > machine. No two hundred dollar specials, but a professional rig. In > > the past we used to sharpen all our bits and then went to out sorcing > > around 10 years ago. Well they want return to doing the sharpening in > > house. We already own a sharpener for the large bits, like 3/4 and up > > to 2 1/2 inch and plan to return it to service. So the question is what > > is the best sharpener for the 3/8 to (3/4 or 1") type usage, preferably > > American made but this not an absolute requirement. Any help or > > recomendations on a sharpener that fits these requirements wil be > > apreciated. > > Washington State Rick ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Carbide endmill help From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 09 Sep 1999 06:47:49 GMT -------- Bottom line is that your mill simply doesn't have the rigidity for solid carbide End Mills. The microfine ones have a razor sharp edge and that tends to snatch at the work unless restrained from so doing. The only thing that will constrain it is MASSIVE rigidity. Been there, done that!! teenut "Douglas A. Greblunas" wrote: > > Ok in a nut shell...sort of... Bridgeport clone, 3hp, 3/8" carbide > endmill 4 flute. Thought I would try carbide ems for the first time. > I work mainly on small 304 stainless steel pieces, say under 6"x6"x6". > Test piece is a 2" cube of 304. Wanted to study as much flute length > for wear as possible..... the set up: Kurt vise 1.375 " (all inch to > follow) mounting depth, .500 depth of cut, .100 radial depth of cut, > 2000 rpm spindle speed, 8 ipm feed rate, no coolant, locked Y, > slight drag on X (feed rate set with drag engaged, stop watch and > dro). My best calculation in 3 H.P. + or - required. I did set the > spindle speed for 2200 and feed at 9 ipm to compensat for load. > Results: First pass yielded micro chips out of the cutting edges, > surface of .5 face apeared smeared, chips looked pretty much the same > as if cut by HSS at correct speeds and feeds. Next pass with new em > oposite side of cube with flood coolant, same set up. Em looked the > same, .5 face looked 50% better, but not near the finish achieved by > HSS. There appears to be no chip buld up in either test run. Am I > expecting too much from my machine? I suspect that it lacks the > ridgidity and HP to fully gain the durability and removal rates > carbides are capable of. You kind and gentle people have helped this > learning novice before..... any thoughts or experiences passed on will > be greatly appreciated. Thanks Doug Greblunas ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Newly "discovered" devices From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 09 Sep 1999 12:16:32 GMT -------- John Stevenson wrote: > There are always what can best be described as vacuums in all trades. > I've been into machining all my life and I still come across setups that others > do that are so obvious but I or people around me haven't heard about. I came across one the other day: Two years ago I had the good fortune to pick up almost the entire contents of an old toolmaker's shop..at a Garage sale! for a "song"!!! Among the many, top quality tools and bits and pieces was a little "square" of a type I had never seen before. It has a makers name on it, "Moore Tools, Bpt Conn" I knew the name but I had NO idea what this particular little, precisely made "gizmo" was used for. Many is the time I picked it out of my tool box and mulled it over..but for the life in me I couldn't fathom its purpose..perhaps part of a special setting jig, was my best guess. Let me describe it: It is a tiny "angle plate" 1 1/2 long, x 7/8" high x 1 1/8" wide. Made of two precisely gardened and ground plates, joined with a step joint and two 8-32 capscrews. In the center of one side is a rectangular hole, again, precisely ground formed by a slot in one plate and the steped edge of the other plate. One thing I failed to take significant note of...was that the inside edge of the "angle plate" coincided EXACTLY with the center of this slot. And so the puzzle remained until, surprise, surprise, in browsing through Ebay (surprise, surprise) I came across this item: http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?MfcISAPICommand=ViewItem&item=149340009 Unfortunately the auction is ended now and the photo is gone from the archive. But there, Large as life was my little "angle plate"..Only now it has a name and a purpose!! It is called an "Edge Locating Chair" and is used by popping it on the edge of the work piece and indicating, first one side of the slot (using a finger type, auto reversing TDI), bringing the dial reading to zero and noting the cross feed dial reading. The other side of the slot is then indicated, bringing the TDI reading to the same point and again noting the cross feed dial reading. Lastly (and with due allowance and care in taking up backlash) the crossfeed dial is brought to the midpoint reading..at which point the spindle centerline is EXACTLY over the edge of the work piece!! I haven't had chance to try this out in practice yet..but when I do I will report on it's efficacy and accuracy..compared to other methods of edge location. Live and learn! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: While we're talking about edge finders... what about conical tips? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 09 Sep 1999 12:41:21 GMT -------- The "Kick out" feature on the double end type, lets you know precisely when the point is centerd and running true. This as you center it with a rule or against an edge. With a well made E&C it will center or kick out within a tenth or so. Alignment with the scribed lines can then be done with the spindle stationary. Which is not a bad Idea when getting up close with a magnifying glass!! teenut BillDarby wrote: > > What I find perplexing is that the center finders that I've seen all have the "kick > out" feature. > > Now, if you use it , as Robert suggests, to optically get aligned on a scribe > line then why bother incorporate the "kick out" design, as any old pin ground to a > point would do that for you. or; > > If you use it in round stock as John suggests, how is it done? Do you, > align it optically with the hole and adjust the X Y by trial and error until you can > go down into and back out of the hole without "kick out"? If / when it kicks > out, do you have some way of knowing which edge it kicked away from ?? or is it just > sort of just best guess? > > I do not ask these questions to be in "any way" critical of anything that's been > said. I simply ask as an amateur machinist wishing to understand how to do things > properly. > > Regards Bill Darby > > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > >These double ended devices ar called "Edge and Center Finders" > > >align it as accurately as possible, with the other line > > >using a good glass and a light. > > > > > > > > John Stevenson wrote: > > > THey list that vee shaped centre finder that you put in a collet chuck and lower > > onto the round stock in a miller or drill to find the centre. So obvious but I > > hadn't seen one before nor had my apprentice and he's 73. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: While we're talking about edge finders... what about conical tips? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 09 Sep 1999 17:02:31 GMT -------- BillDarby wrote: > > Robert,,,, thank you for responding, but forgive me for being just plane thick, but I just > don't get it. Are you saying that the function of the center's "kick out" feature is to > let you know that it's tip is running true? > > I can see how you could use it to optically align the point onto a scribe line, but > then any pin ground to a fine point could do that. That is true..but only provided that the point on the pin is ground "Dead on" in the first place and that it is held "dead on" in the chuck or collet of the machine it is used on. Both are unlikely circumstances in the greater scheme of things and certainly not guaranteeable. The function of the kick out is to tell you when you reach concentric running of the disc or the point..if the point is undamaged from its original grinding, then it doesn't matter where, along the cone, you make contact..the result is the same...the point will run true regardless of any eccentricity in the body or the holding of the body. The double ended type, with the spring loaded caps are, if made properly, VERY sensitive and VERY repeatable..my old Starrett will indicate edge or center position within less than a tenth either way. I certainly don't need to take a "mean of multiple readings" > As for using it against any edge, I do not see how it could be accurate unless you > were getting the mean of multiple readings under given conditions. Beyond that, I do > not see how getting the point to kick out against a single edge would be of any value > because in order to get it to kick out you have to have the edge touch the side of the > point and if you touch the side of the point then you are not touching the tip of the point > and if your not touching the tip of the point then you are not on center Yes you are..see my above remarks! I think you are confusing the function of the EDGE finder with that of the CENTER finder. All my remarks have been with regard to the latter. The objective is not to find the edge of the work by bringing the pointy end up against it..If that were the case your above comment would be perfectly true. With a CENTER finder, Th. objective is to bring that to a true running condition..by touching it with or against an edge..ANY edge..even a thumb nail if you must!! The true running point is then used to line up with layout lines..by EYE!! ...............It's > kind of a circular argument and to compound matters I doubt that a tip can be brought out > to a perfect point. Of course it can..the very act of grinding it cannot produce anything but a perfect point..down to the point ?? of molecular level..then you are on your own. My Starrett is twenty years plus "young", examine it with a glass and it is still sharp and concentric..perhaps because it has never been abused! > > Would very much like to know what you mean by " Closer if the job demanded and using > nothing but a"Sticky Pin" " A "sticky pin" is just that! A pin or a needle stuck in a glob of wax, putty, chewing gum..whatever, and stuck in turn on the end of the cutter. Trued up while running..yes we used our thumb nails..but that didn't hurt like a regular center finder does, when it runs amuck over your nail bed!! For real "picky jobs" we would use a gramophone needle..I still have a tin of them in my tool box..That would be trued up with a feeler blade with the pin point only a few thous from the surface. Holes could be drilled and bored..to layout lines..that would be within a few tenths of dead position. For really REALLY picky stuff.we went to either toolmakers buttons or to a jig borer with optical centering and dead length scales. Hope this helps. Teenut > > Thanks in advance Robert. > > Regards Bill Darby > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > The "Kick out" feature on the double end type, lets you know precisely when the > > point is centerd and running true. This as you center it with a rule or against > > an edge. With a well made E&C it will center or kick out within a tenth or so. > > > > Alignment with the scribed lines can then be done with the spindle stationary. > > Which is not a bad Idea when getting up close with a magnifying glass!! > > > > teenut > > > > BillDarby wrote: > > > > > > What I find perplexing is that the center finders that I've seen all have the "kick > > > out" feature. > > > > > > Now, if you use it , as Robert suggests, to optically get aligned on a scribe > > > line then why bother incorporate the "kick out" design, as any old pin ground to a > > > point would do that for you. or; > > > > > > If you use it in round stock as John suggests, how is it done? Do you, > > > align it optically with the hole and adjust the X Y by trial and error until you can > > > go down into and back out of the hole without "kick out"? If / when it kicks > > > out, do you have some way of knowing which edge it kicked away from ?? or is it just > > > sort of just best guess? > > > > > > I do not ask these questions to be in "any way" critical of anything that's been > > > said. I simply ask as an amateur machinist wishing to understand how to do things > > > properly. > > > > > > Regards Bill Darby > > > > > > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > > > > > >These double ended devices ar called "Edge and Center Finders" > > > > >align it as accurately as possible, with the other line > > > > >using a good glass and a light. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > John Stevenson wrote: > > > > > > > THey list that vee shaped centre finder that you put in a collet chuck and lower > > > > onto the round stock in a miller or drill to find the centre. So obvious but I > > > > hadn't seen one before nor had my apprentice and he's 73. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: While we're talking about edge finders... what about conical tips? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 09 Sep 1999 17:49:30 GMT -------- Here we go again....8^) mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > > teenut@home.com wrote: > > The "Kick out" feature on the double end type, lets you know precisely > when the > > point is centerd and running true. > > I'm still missing something here. I think so > > We're talking about the center finders with conical tips, right? Right > > If one jams the cone into a hole that one wishes to indicate to, > and uses a fingernail to see when it is on center (not under power) > then that is practically useless it is so inaccurate. The human fingertip can detect discrepancies (steps) between two surfaces of the order of a couple of tenths of a thou!! > > If one runs it under power, and gets it to kick out on the > inner edge of the hole, one has no idea of what distance the > spindle axis is from the hole edge, by virtue of the cone shape. > The same can be said for going to an edge with the cone end. Absolutely NOT the way to use it and, not what I said. > And if one centers the cone under power, and aligns it 'by eye' > with a scribed line or a center punch mark, then things are still > pretty sloppy. Not true!!! With good light and magnification, the human eye can line up two "fiducial" reference points or lines within a few millionths of an inch. > > I have to weigh in on the side of the folks who do not have > a really good understanding of exactly what those cone-shaped > center finders are for. I'm not sure what you mean by the above statement..Are you saying that because you don't understand it then it must be no good? As I said in my previous response to Bill..the objective of the cone shaped center finder is to have an accurate point that can be set VERY accurately, to run TRULY CONCENTRIC and to be able to do that quickly and reliably. Using it then, to align to a given Center Point depends on how accurate you want the alignment. First let's dispense with the center pop. In the first place..it has no reason or right to be there!! Best just leave the lines as scribed..you can do a far better job of alignment. You would in any case align to the lines individually..remote fro the actual intersection..just as I outlined in my earlier submission. Aligning to a center drilled hole. Can be done, by eye with the spindle running. No question here of running the point into one side or the other..you are right..that doesn't work. What you do is carefully lower the true running point into the hole WITHOUT making contact, and gradually adjusting X and Y as the annular space gets smaller...probably only good for a thou or two accuracy-wise. But then the idea is to move the centered point up and down in the center hole..it follows, by definition if you like, that if it contacts one side before the other..it will "Break" (or at least make a visible attempt to break)..thus indicating that it is not yet on true center. However..there is another way!! With the spindle stationary, drop the point right into the hole and adjust x and y until you can neither see, nor feel, a "step" in the alignment of point and body....this you can do with surprising accuracy! Or you can use a micrometer to measure the diameter of the centerfinder at the junction point. If the CF is a dead .5000" diameter and your mic says .5010"...you are half a thou off center..though you would be able to see and feel that gross error withou needing a mic...! Repeat at x and y locations, adjusting as required. One caveat..these last two methods DO depend on the body being held with reasonable accuracy in the spindle. Otherwise one would need to rotate the spindle through the four points of the compass to be sure of getting an accurate setup. I prefer the wiggler type, anyway as > they seem to be more versatile. Yes they are more versatile...but GENERALLY less sensitive/accurate. I use both..depending upon circumstances. teenut > > Jim ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Apeal for UN intervention - Stop East Timor Genocide From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 09 Sep 1999 17:53:00 GMT -------- 'Ere! Gettin' a bit RACIST aren't we?? Teenut..who ressembles that remark!! Paul Hardy wrote: I personaly believe that the french > and the english are the two biggest purveyors of misery that this world has > ever known, ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: ventilation in basement shop From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 09 Sep 1999 18:05:22 GMT -------- I have a big extractor fan in the wall. When "makin smoke" I set up another fan to blow air past me, taking the noxious stuff towards the wall fan. I am a two pack a day Camel smoker..but two minutes of WD40 smoke will have me up all night coughing my lungs up! teenut. karlmilwaukee@my-deja.com wrote: > > I'm running out of space in my garage and thinking about moving my lathe > and mill to the basement. I guess my biggest concern is ventilation. I > have those small windows in my basement and thought about just running a > fan with some ducting from each machine and out the window. What are > other people with basement shops doing about this? I mostly use Cool > Tool and WD40 for cutting lubes. > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Share what you know. Learn what you don't. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Carbide endmill help From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 10 Sep 1999 00:42:15 GMT -------- Well now you got the "Expert's" angle on it!! But you still bust cutters..because the machine isn't rigid enough. Hey..You are paying for the cutters!! I already paid for mine and quit trying to do what you're trying to do, because I figured out..all the theory in the world can't argue with the facts. Yer pays yer money and yer takes yer choice! teenut "Eugene N. Neigoff" wrote: > > I believe your wrong on your Feeds and Speeds; > 1st. > In accordance with the published standards the Cutting > speed for > uncoated Carbide milling is 305 to 780 SFM. Feeds are in > the area of > .004-.007 inch per tooth. See the MACHINISTS HANDBOOK > VERSION 25 Page 1012 > > 2nd > If you calculate RPM using the formula > SFM x 4 > rpm = -------------- > DIAMETER of TOOL > > you will get 305*4/.375 = 3280 RPM > > 3rd > The nominal feed rate of 0.004"/tooth would be > > FEEDRATE = (FEED/TOOTH)*(No. of TEETH) * RPM > > you will get .004*4*3280 = 50 inches per minute. > > 4th > > As this will require that you have more horsepower than > the 3 HP of > of your lathe, You should reduce the Depth of cut, > Carbide works best > when compressed to the design limits. STAINLESS STEEL > CUTTING needs 1.5 HP per Cubic Inch/Minute. > > When you reduce RPM below the CARBIDE tool material limits you are not > improving the cutting life, and you sacrifice finish and tool life. This > is a fact which most people will not understand, but is true in CARBIDES > and CBN tooling. The ridgidity of the machine is a limit, but, not as > much as many are making it out. > > For The Record, I am retired and have the credentials of both a degreed > Mechanical Engineer and a Journeyman machinist certification. I teach > Machining Technology for the TOOLING & MANUFACTURING ASSOCIATION Apprentic > Training Program > > Hope this answers your question. > > Gene Neigoff > > "Douglas A. Greblunas" wrote: > > > Ok in a nut shell...sort of... Bridgeport clone, 3hp, 3/8" carbide > > endmill 4 flute. Thought I would try carbide ems for the first time. > > I work mainly on small 304 stainless steel pieces, say under 6"x6"x6". > > Test piece is a 2" cube of 304. Wanted to study as much flute length > > for wear as possible..... the set up: Kurt vise 1.375 " (all inch to > > follow) mounting depth, .500 depth of cut, .100 radial depth of cut, > > 2000 rpm spindle speed, 8 ipm feed rate, no coolant, locked Y, > > slight drag on X (feed rate set with drag engaged, stop watch and > > dro). My best calculation in 3 H.P. + or - required. I did set the > > spindle speed for 2200 and feed at 9 ipm to compensat for load. > > Results: First pass yielded micro chips out of the cutting edges, > > surface of .5 face apeared smeared, chips looked pretty much the same > > as if cut by HSS at correct speeds and feeds. Next pass with new em > > oposite side of cube with flood coolant, same set up. Em looked the > > same, .5 face looked 50% better, but not near the finish achieved by > > HSS. There appears to be no chip buld up in either test run. Am I > > expecting too much from my machine? I suspect that it lacks the > > ridgidity and HP to fully gain the durability and removal rates > > carbides are capable of. You kind and gentle people have helped this > > learning novice before..... any thoughts or experiences passed on will > > be greatly appreciated. Thanks Doug Greblunas ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: knurling question (For Teenut) From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 10 Sep 1999 00:54:30 GMT -------- No, John Jacobs, (of chuck key fame) You are not way off base. The set up as you have it will probably work after a fashion. The only problem is that you are imposing a lot of "Racking" stresses on lathe parts not really up to it. The advantage of axial feeding is simply that all of the stresses are compressive..Rather than torsional. Bottom line is..you have a helluva nice knurling head there and you should go ahead and use/enjoy it. teenut John Jacobs wrote: > > ok now I understand how this was used. But, Why couldn't I rotate the > tool 90 degrees and also rotate the knurling cutters? As far as the > workpiece is concerned nothing has changed. Does that make sense or am I > way off base ? > Please advise > Thank you, > John (where's the chuck key) Jacobs ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: SB 10k or Jet BD 1340 From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 10 Sep 1999 00:58:22 GMT -------- Agent Provocateur!! Who wants to go first? Pete?? teenut SRW60021 wrote: > > Opinions please on buying a used Southbend (great condition) or a new Jet. Its > crunch time. > > Thanks > Shawn ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Non marring vise jaws. From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 10 Sep 1999 11:46:41 GMT -------- Hardened steel, honed and polished to a dead fit! teenut boyd wrote: > > I need to be able to clamp a polished moderately hard steel rod in the > jaws of a vise then apply high torque to one end of the rod without the > rod slipping or having it's surface marred. What materials make good > non maring vice jaw caps from the standpoint of providing high torque > before slipping for a given jaw force? What shape should the jaw caps > be for the best hold? I'm assuming that adhesives are not used so the > rod will be free when the vise is opened. Non adhesive coatings which > improve the hold are of interest. > > -- > Lou Boyd > Fairborn Observatory ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Why are shapers dead ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 10 Sep 1999 17:27:06 GMT -------- Answer: E...All the above and wire edm. and cnc. Plus the lack of skilled operators. teenut Scott Moore wrote: > > Warning, this is an admitted troll, I am bored. > > So why were shapers/planers abandoned by modern industry ? > Have mills got that good at surfacing ? How about horizontal > milling ? Perhaps surface grinding after milling made it redundant ? > Shapers were too slow ? What ? > > [sam] > > -- > If it ain't broke....... > > Fix it till it is. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Best 4 x 6 Horizontal?vertical metalcutting bandsaw? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 11 Sep 1999 02:15:21 GMT -------- I have a "Delta" drill press..Made in China!! Biggest (ONLY) POS in my shop! teenut Grant Erwin wrote: > You, sir, appear to be suffering from the delusion that because the > Delta name is on it, that it is US-made. Check again .. > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Why are shapers dead ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 11 Sep 1999 02:34:30 GMT -------- The magazine well on an automatic pistol would have been BROACHED in days of olde. Nowadays, such a cut would be done on a wire cut EDM (for a one off) In modern production..Automatic pistol frames, bolt action receivers etc., are investment cast, to near-net shape. That is not to say that, in a prototype shop, a shaper no longer has a place. In HSM it is probably one of the most versatile machines imaginable..It is to flat as a lathe is to round!! I bought my Boxford 8" shaper before my milling machine (Deckel) In a crunch the mill would have to go first! Teenut Alfred Kimmel wrote: > > There are some set up cuts that only a shaper can make. Mostly used for > internal cuts nowdays and large industrial shapers are still in > production. Look at a magazine well on an automatic pistol. > Al > > Scott Moore wrote: > > > Warning, this is an admitted troll, I am bored. > > > > So why were shapers/planers abandoned by modern industry ? > > Have mills got that good at surfacing ? How about horizontal > > milling ? Perhaps surface grinding after milling made it redundant ? > > Shapers were too slow ? What ? > > > > [sam] > > > > -- > > If it ain't broke....... > > > > Fix it till it is. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Why are shapers dead ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 11 Sep 1999 03:40:44 GMT -------- ironman_dale@my-deja.com wrote: > Most shapers got hooked on cigarettes when they were kids. > > > Share what you know. Learn what you don't. If that is an example of what YOU know Ironman..Please don't share anymore!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: While we're talking about edge finders... what about conical tips? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 11 Sep 1999 16:40:15 GMT -------- mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article , > mikoberg@earthlink.com (mikoberg) wrote: > Not as > > > acurate either. And if you had a grandfather like mine, if he caught > > you, he would bop you on the > > back of the head for not indicating the edge of the work (even if he > > couldn't measure any difference). > > Thank you - this explaination of what the conical tip is used for > seems to make a lot of sense. Sounds like these are used for +/- 5 > thou jobs, not for half-thousanths ones. > > Jim If you do it that way, then 5 thou accuracy would be a happy accident...no wonder Grandpa used to bob him!! ;^) Do it the way I described and a few tenths accuracy is obtainable. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Workbench surface From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 11 Sep 1999 17:15:31 GMT -------- Coupla thoughts!! The best surface for metalworking is wood!! Mine is laminated maple, that I got cheap from a school lab sale. Reasoning being that it is "Dead"..thump a part or center punch something and it doesn't bounce or "ring". It doesn't damage parts or tool edges either...Nor does it rust! However..I can see your need for a metal surface if you are going to be welding on it. Yes! YES! Definitely ground it!! Stainless sounds great..'til you examine the cost. But also consider the "glare" factor of overhead lighting being reflected off it. Black Iron (steel) sheet in minimum 1/8" thickness is the way to go! my preference would be thicker. The reason being, that if you pound on it much, the thinner sheet will stretch and buckle. IMHO the bench is the most important "tool" In your shop. I have learned, from years of experience, never to scrimp on it. Try a local scrap yard, you may find a chunk of steel plate big enough for the welding end of your bench. Then you could leave the fitting and assembly end with a hard wood surface. (MDFB won't last very long in that application) teenut Bruce Simpson wrote: > > I'm about to build a new bench for my workshop. For various reasons > I'll be building it from wood but with a hi-density particle-board > benchtop. > > Since this bench will be used for all manner of metal-working > activities (including welding), I want to surface it with a good, > long-lasting material. > > I was thinking of some stainless steel sheet -- but my budget is > limited. > > Any ideas? > > Material? > Thickness? > > And... should I ground the metal top-surface? It will likely have > several electricaly powered tools on it such as a drill-press, > grinder, etc. > > --------------------------------- > Don't send email to me, send a Memo.to me > http://memo.to/BruceSimpson > Memo.to, your email firewall, stops junk email dead! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 2 flute vs. 4 flute endmills From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 11 Sep 1999 18:14:44 GMT -------- Mike Graham wrote: The "center cutting" end mill..or as it is often called in the UK a "Slot Drill" has one lip ground longer than the other..so that it comes to or crosses over the center line. They will cut straight down without the need for a pilot hole. Because the cutting forces are balanced ( previous poster put it best) a slot dill will plung and cut an accurate width slot..which is what a four flute END mill cannot be relied upon to do. For this reason, they are the first choice for cutting blid or open ended keyways. A four flute mill is best when only cutting on one side. Its advantage then is lower chip load per tooth and better surface finish. I have come across "center cutting" fourflute mills..They maybe can cut their own starting hole and would be used in "Pocketing"..but not for cuttin an accurate slot of nominal width in one pass. teenut > > I'm familiar with the concept of 'center cutting endmills' but it's not > something that I've done much of. Do you just drill a small pilot hole, or > do you drill out the vast majority of the material so that the endmill just > 'tastes' it on the way down? > > -- > Mike Graham, mikegraham at sprint dot ca > Caledon, Ontario, Canada (just NW of Toronto). > > Raiser of animals. Weldor of metals. Driver of off-road vehicles. > Writer of FAQs. Keeper of the faith, and all around okay guy. > > < homepage currently off-line due to change of ISP; back soon > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: palmgren rotary table handles From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 12 Sep 1999 07:11:29 GMT -------- SFAIAA Palmgren are still in business..I can't find a web page for them, but that is hardly surprising for a company that hasn't changed its product line in half a millenium!! 8^) Try MSC..they handle Palmgren and have always been helpful when dealing with non-catalogued items from their suppliers. teenut Alan Sadler wrote: > > I picked up a couple of Palmgren 8" rotary tables today at a garage sale, > but the handles were missing/broken. Any ideas how I can get replacements? > I'd love OEM handles. Thanks. > > -- > Alan Sadler > "It just followed me home." ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: While we're talking about edge finders... what about conical tips? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 12 Sep 1999 15:35:55 GMT -------- Well put! Many time, in writing to this NG I am somewhat controversial, over- emphatic. yeh, verily, even arrogant! This is mainly for the benefit of the newbie..I have trained many Apprentices in my time and the gol den rule is "First get their Attention" Oft times this takes a two by four!! Many time I make a deliberately Emphatic statement..I know it has achieved its purpose-to make people THINK- when I get a host of replies pointing out the obscure circumstances under which my statement would not hold water. My whole philosophy..Like Grandad..is to teach the principle behind the skill and enforce its practice. Once that is achieved, the practitioner has some basis on which to make objective decisions about when to bend the rules. They don't need my help anymore, to do that. teenut mikoberg wrote: > > In article <37DA862B.69917DCE@home.com>, teenut@home.com wrote: > > ----snip--- > > > If you do it that way, then 5 thou accuracy would be a happy accident...no > > wonder Grandpa used to bob him!! ;^) > > > > Do it the way I described and a few tenths accuracy is obtainable. > > > > teenut > > Ahh... Most time the bobs were well earned. I was just trying to desribe > a short-cut when great acuracy was _not_ needed. Many times you need to > line the center of the mill to a scribed line and thousanths are not needed > by a job. Thats what I meant by the difference in accuracy of the object > couldnt be told by grandpa, the final outcome would be within tolerances > needed. He was just a perfectionist espesially when it came to leaning > something. After you knew the skill well then you could bend or break the > rules. The bob on the head remark was to show it was a non prefered but > quick once you got the height trick down. The rest of the post was manly > for the many lurker and newer users who don't have the advantage of a > granfather to bob 'em once in a while. > > Mike -well boped- Oberg ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 2 flute vs. 4 flute endmills From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 12 Sep 1999 15:41:31 GMT -------- Er! Get hold of a center cut slot drill and look at the bottom please..you WILL find that one lip is ground longer than the other!! Usually there is a small relief slot ground between the two lips and this is invariably off center. Were it not, the mill would NOT cut to center but would leave a "pip" in the middle. God knows..I have ground enough of them!! teenut Hoyt McKagen wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > Mike Graham wrote: > > The "center cutting" end mill..or as it is often called in the UK a "Slot Drill" > > has one lip ground longer than the other..so that it comes to or crosses over > > the center line. > > Afraid not. They have equal length flutes. If one were longer it would > cut on the portion facing rotation and drag on the portion facing > away. You would get the same wear pattern on that part of the flute as if > the whole thing run backward. > > They will cut straight down without the need for a pilot hole. > > True, have plunged many many starting holes for pockets or whatever. > > > Best wishes, > > Hoyt McKagen > > Belfab CNC - http://www.freeyellow.com/members/belfab/belfab.html > Best MC Repair - http://www.freeyellow.com/members/batwings/best.html > Camping/Caving - http://www.freeyellow.com/members/batwings/caving.html > Rubber balloons kill more young kids than ALL other toys ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 2 flute vs. 4 flute endmills From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 12 Sep 1999 15:42:50 GMT -------- That just about sums it up George! Thanks, teenut George Willer wrote: > > A 2 flute endmill will cut an accurate slot...a 4 flute endmill cannot! The > reason is obvious if you understand that an endmill flexes slightly while > cutting due to an unavoidable side thrust. At the point of maximum > thrust...the following cutting edge of a 4 flute is flexed into the side of > the cut. A 2 flute eliminates this problem. I guess that's why some call > them "slot drills". > > George Willer > Gwill@toledolink.com > http://www.toledolink.com/gwill > Public opinion: > What everyone thinks everyone else thinks. > > kenneth knaell wrote in message <7rceb8$1l1$1@winter.news.rcn.net>... > >Mike, > >My undrstanding is that 2 flute endmills are better for deep slots because > >the chips can be cleared better. > >Strangely enough all the roughing side cutting mils I have gotten surplus > >have four flutes so side milling cutters must not be used for deep slots or > >their chips are easier to remove. > >ken knaell > > > > > > > > > >Mike Graham wrote in message ... > >> I'm no expert on pricing endmills, but I just noticed in the latest KBC > >>flyer that it would appear that 2 flute and 4 flute endmills cost the > same. > >>This strikes me as odd. I know that 4 flutes cut smoother/faster on the > >>side, so what is the benefit of 2 flue endmills that allows them to sell > at > >>the same price as four flute endmills? > >> > >>-- > >>Mike Graham, mikegraham at sprint dot ca > >>Caledon, Ontario, Canada (just NW of Toronto). > >> > >>Raiser of animals. Weldor of metals. Driver of off-road vehicles. > >>Writer of FAQs. Keeper of the faith, and all around okay guy. > >> > >> < homepage currently off-line due to change of ISP; back soon > > > > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Machinists' Contract Work From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 12 Sep 1999 18:14:49 GMT -------- Been there..Done that! You had better be prepared to be a better salesman than you are machinist. A big part of your time will be spent "selling" yourself, in order to get work! teenut "machinist.com" wrote: > > Sirs.... > > All my machining career I have "worked for" one company or another and > always heard about "contract work". > > In the global economy I am ruminating over possible career paths for > todays technically savvy but often disrepected machinist... > > My questions are... > > What is contract work, or just plain is it? > > What are your experiences with it one way or another? > > How does one go about launching a "contract" career? > > What resources are there? > > What are the pit falls, methods and etc? > > I am thinking about this for two reasons.... I would like to write on > it in my next news letter and I believe that the coming decade will > bring about a renaissance for crafts people, more respect and > hopefully more money. > > After all if this is going to be the century of mobile "knowledge" > worker and their independence and impowerment (don't like the word > much myself either) why just the computer techs.... it is not much of > stretch and I am not the only one thinking this way.... > > What say you? > > Throw me a bone here.... > > -------------- > The Machinists Exchange On-line > http://www.machinist.com > > "Trying To Do The Right Thing For Machinists" > > Phone: > 1-888-825-3422 > > Fax: > 1-888-866-4829 > > Email: > director@machinist.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 2 flute vs. 4 flute endmills From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 13 Sep 1999 06:51:45 GMT -------- And just how much "stress" do you think is too much for an end cutting slot drill? Industry has been using them, to plunge cut blind end keyways for over a century. I did tens of thousands of them as an apprentice and never had to drill a pilot hole. The shop Foreman would have had a seizure if I had suggested it!! Cutter life was extensive to say the least, slots were always on size..I would have got my butt kicked if they were not! What more do you need?? BTW..do you imagine the "Stress" on the end of the pilot drill you advocate is any less? Or of any less consequence? The chisel point of a drill..even when split or thinned..is a whole lot less efficient at cutting than the end of a slot drill. Teenut "DoN. Nichols" wrote: > They will -- but not without stress. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Machinists' Contract Work From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 13 Sep 1999 07:13:35 GMT -------- Hey Mr Swinney, First of all.."Been there..Done that" cannot possibly be construed as an insult to anyone..unless you are looking for one..in which case I have some Doozies!! Second of all..I HAVE "been there and done that"..Which is why I didn't belabor the point that, in this or ANY subcontracting, consulting..call it what you like! In ANY career where the careeree (?) is on his own and moving from temporary employer to temporary employer..the biggest skill he has to have is to SELL himself and his services...CONSTANTLY...Day after day, week after week, YEAR AFTER YEAR!! Most good "Technicians" are NOT good salespeople..if they were they would be out SELLING and making a bunch more money!! The problem is..that this selling has to be done while the current job is still in progress. He who waits until one job is over, before searching for the next one is in for very lean times. Remember that this "Selling" has got to be done during "Office Hours" while he is trying to put in a full day's work. Bottom line is, though it may sound attractive to be "independent" most people can't hack it for long. "Independence means working eighty hours a week for yourself..so you don't have to work forty hours a week for someone else.." Been there..Done that!! Teenut Robert Swinney wrote: > > Good reply, Mike! You didn't insult everyone with "been there, done that" - > you gave pertinent information. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Machinists' Contract Work From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 13 Sep 1999 07:29:59 GMT -------- You really are as stupid as you sound!! I could have, as you so politely put it, drivelled on for pages on the subjects he asked about. The bottom line is that NONE of his Questions are relevant UNLESS he is ready willing and able to find work OVER and OVER again. Skills don't count! Benefits don't count! 401k s don't count! Smart ass comments from jerks like you don't count! So what is your contribution to his future? teenut Robert Swinney wrote: > > Teenut, > You didn't answer the man's question. A simple answer would have been as > easy to post as what you posted. He didn't ask for philosophical drivel. > If you have real, relevant experience with contract machine work, I think > we'd like to hear about it. I think most people on this NG have heard enough about my subcontract experience to know I HAVE been there and I HAVE done that. What is more relevant is..why am I NOT doing it now?? I answered that in my first post! I just answered it again! > Bob Swinney > Robert Bastow wrote in message <37DBEDD7.21A8E903@home.com>... > >Been there..Done that! > > > >You had better be prepared to be a better salesman than you are machinist. > > > >A big part of your time will be spent "selling" yourself, in order to get > work! > > > >teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Machinists' Contract Work From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 13 Sep 1999 08:15:55 GMT -------- The problem with working out of an agency is that THEY have the relationship with the client, THEY are paid by the client and THEY decided how much to pay you. You are as effectively an "Employee"..without the long term security. teenut "machinist.com" wrote: > > On Sun, 12 Sep 1999 18:14:49 GMT, Robert Bastow > wrote: > > >Been there..Done that! > > > >You had better be prepared to be a better salesman than you are machinist. > > I can see how that would be the case. What about working out of an > agency (or two) as a temp, trends these days seem to support that > concept? > > Another angle.... > > I know of a company that will do all the HR stuff for you, the > business, from interviews and testing to 401K and benefits through > discipline and firing. It takes a load off the employer for sure and > is a model that is working in many cases already. Not much of a squint > to the "contracted employee" working for whomever... Yes? No? Pipe > Dream? > > cough cough..... > > -------------- > The Machinists Exchange On-line > http://www.machinist.com > > "Trying To Do The Right Thing For Machinists" > > Phone: > 1-888-825-3422 > > Fax: > 1-888-866-4829 > > Email: > director@machinist.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Machinists' Contract Work From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 13 Sep 1999 08:47:38 GMT -------- Well well well! I should have checked this gentleman's credentials before now! Machinist dot com is a machinist employment agency! Now I don't mind a few "up front" questions from anyone..but this is pretence verging on misrepresentation! Fess up Mr Director..and, maybe, we can give you straighter answers to straighter questions teenut "machinist.com" wrote: > > Sirs.... > > All my machining career I have "worked for" one company or another and > always heard about "contract work". ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: cool HSM type goodie! From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 13 Sep 1999 15:35:57 GMT -------- Yeh! but 79 bucks for a magnet in a tube!!! And it won't pick up Brass, Aluminum or Sawdust? Catch me sometime when I have forgotten to take my tablets! Teenut Jeff Pack wrote: > > http://www.detroittoolworks.com/Magbrush.htm > > I saw one of these last weekend at the Puyallup Fair > (The Rodman guys come every year, and he goes to > Germany, for a big tool fair, and finds cool goodies > to big back). ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Machinists' Contract Work From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 13 Sep 1999 15:50:33 GMT -------- John Stevenson wrote: then he's obviously a wanker. > Pity his dad wasn't Darwinism by Default? teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 2 flute vs. 4 flute endmills From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 13 Sep 1999 16:37:24 GMT -------- Hoyt McKagen wrote: I did look at some and they are > either made with symmetrical flutes or I can't determine the right point > to measure to on the web in the center. None of mine however have a > relief at center; instead the edges of the flutes simply blend together > and form a thin web of approx zero width. I don't consider that > definitive and would like to see a reference if you have one. TIA!! Your message sent me scooting down into the shop to grab a handful of evidence! Guess wot! Out of aproximately 20 two flute endmills I found only TWO that were ground "Proper" That is, with one lip longer than the other and a relief slot across the end, to one side of center. All the rest, most of them brand new, are sharpened like a split point flat drill!! No Bloody wonder everyone (** see further note) is having problems cutting slots to width in one pass! The manufacturers have gone chintzy and selling us a cheap grind. I wonder if anyone, anymore, understands the cutting geometry of the sh*t they are turning out..Or do they just figure that the customers don't know! The reason that a two lipped cutter cuts dead to size, as has already been said, is because the cutting forces are balanced at all times, there isn't a third flute cutting at 10 o'clock and tending to deflect the lips at 4 and 8 o'clock into the sidewalls of the slot. BUT!!!! Without a proper, "cross center" grind we now have our two flute mill leaving a "Dead" area in the middle..a "pip" if you wish, on which it tends to skate and dance about! Result is carved up sidewalls!! ** (I was having the same problem..Couldn't cut a keyway to dead width, even with a new, sharp, endmill. I put it down to the fact that I was doing all my milling on the lathe, with a less than perfectly ridgid vertical slide.) Now the culprit(s) are exposed!! Remedy?..better than nothing at all?? Take a THIN wheel,(like a dremel cuttoff wheel) and cut a short shallow groove across the end of your slot drill. This should be at an angle of about 105 degrees to the cutting edge. The slot should be OFF-CENTER such that the edge of the slot passes through center. This will leave you with one long (original length) edge and one short edge.. I will try some ascii art..but I can't promise anything!! (---\\--) Rotation: Anti-clockwise as viewed. The edge of the first backslash passes on, or a shade to left, of center When my son returns from school, I will take a picture of a large slot drill,with the proper grind, and figure out how to get it to the drop box. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 2 flute vs. 4 flute endmills From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 13 Sep 1999 16:41:11 GMT -------- DUH!! Make that a shade to RIGHT of center! (Now where did I put my tablets??) teenut Robert Bastow wrote: > (---\\--) Rotation: Anti-clockwise as viewed. > > The edge of the first backslash passes on, or a shade to left, of center ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How to spend 300 to shape steel. From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 13 Sep 1999 16:49:01 GMT -------- 'Twas I! http://www.shavings.net/SCARY.HTM#original teenut Gary Coffman wrote: Someone posted a website here a while back which > describes how to get a better than razor sharp edge on plane irons > using the sandpaper sold for color sanding auto finishes. Perhaps > someone remembers and can offer a pointer. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: cool HSM type goodie! From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 13 Sep 1999 16:53:48 GMT -------- Still wouldn't pick up brass and sawdust though!! teenut Erich Coiner wrote: > > Bob & Marilyn Tonkins wrote: > > > > I TRULY don't get it file; > > Re: Pickup magnet: > > It sure is cute. But $79.95 for a cutsie tool to pick up scrap? Whoah! > > There must be a lotta somebodies with way too much moolah!! Put a baggie > > over a magnet on a stick. Pick up all the scrap you can. Fold the bag > > back over the scrap and you've got a clean magnet. Repeat. > > Lessee . . . Ten cents for the old speaker magnet at a garage sale plus > > ten cents for the soft steel rod and a penny for the baggie, Whoops! > > Forgot the penny for the rubber band to hold the bag over the mag. > > Hmmmmm! > > 22 cents versus 7,995 cents. That's a toughie. > > Oh. Please excuse me, but I guess I'm calling us back to SOME sort of > > essentials. I know, I know. Lots of us folk CAN afford beau coup bucks > > for a big boy toy. I just bought one. But, we can make simple crap like > > THIS. If we CAN'T, we're in the wrong group. We might wanta check out > > alt.goodhousekeeping. > > > > BTW - Great fair/great farm town Puyallup. Best onions in the world. You > > (I) can eat 'em like apples! > > > > Jeff Pack wrote: > > > > > > http://www.detroittoolworks.com/Magbrush.htm > > > > > > I saw one of these last weekend at the Puyallup Fair > > > (The Rodman guys come every year, and he goes to > > > Germany, for a big tool fair, and finds cool goodies > > > to big back). > > There was a project in Projects in Metal about a year or two ago. The > guy built an electric swarf picker-upper. He used the electromagnet from > a car airconditioning clutch and a 12 volt battery or power supply. > He mounted it to a handle like a metal detector. Looked very cool. > > Erich ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Machinists' Contract Work From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 13 Sep 1999 18:40:15 GMT -------- Robert Swinney wrote: > > Teeheenut, ROTFLMAO That's about the level of your intelligence/humor is it Robert? Perhaps the guy with the innocent > question is also not aware of your subcontract experiences. Not so "innocent" as it turns out, Eh Robert? irrititable, impatient and un-called for statement of "been, there, done that" . You're the only one that is irrititable(sic) around here Robert. "been there, done that" is a phrase in common usage that generally denotes previous experience and a lack of desire to repeat said experience. Not taken by normal people to be "irrititatable, impatient or uncalled for" My original statement said all that I needed to say on the subject ...that is the need for strong self-marketing skills. Others touched on this and covered other aspects of the subject. Surely you don't expect every contributor to cover EVERY single aspect of every question do you? Or present their theses with a full curriculum vitae? >After the way you showed your ass awhile back in the long thread > about 2 phase - 3 phase, etc., you should be careful about how you hand down > the decree of "stupid" to anyone, What has electrical engineering got to do with sub-contract machining? So far as that thread was concerned, judging by the confusing and often contradictory replies handed down by the "Experts" maybe it was a good thing that someone had the guts to ASK the "stupid" questions. How about role playing here Robert..I'll ask the stupid questions..I'm good at it! You, on the other hand, are much better at the Dumb answers!! >but alas, I guess that's just natural for > someone to do that has appointed himself the conscience of this news group. Alas yourself, Robert..you are now outside my field and I defer to your greater experience as "the conscience of this news group" That is what this is all about isn't it Robert? To paraphrase.."Those that can, contribute. Those that can't, criticise!!" I eagerly await YOUR contribution to this subject. You CAN! Can't you? > Robert Bastow wrote > >You really are as stupid as you sound!! And sounding stupider by the moment!! teeheenut..I kinda like the ring of it ;^) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Slot drills -was-2 flute vs. 4 flute endmills From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 13 Sep 1999 21:51:46 GMT -------- PS to Jeff, There is no "r" in Bastow!!...that's the other side of the family we don't talk about! ;^) Photos of "LA Difference" will be posted just as soon as I can milk my son for the Knowhow. Please be gentle with me..it's my first time!! teeheenut Jeff O'Malley wrote: > > I guess I'm pretty dumb, but I still do not really understand the > "real" difference between a US "two flute" end mill and a "slot drill". > Is there some reference picture or illustration available on the web > that can clear the cobwebs out for me?? > Jeff O'Malley > > P.S. to Robert Barstow, I thought I had it with your description, but > apparently it was just the whirr of wings going overhead. :^) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Centre runout, live or dead! From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 13 Sep 1999 21:57:46 GMT -------- Tony Jeffree wrote: > ...and (sneaking in quickly before Robert Bastow gets there first ) > in any event, if you want the most accurate results, you machine the > centre *in situ* to make sure that any spindle runout & any runout in > the original machining of the centre are of no consequence. Ah, Kind Sir, you do me to kindly methinks. Me..I just smack it with a hammer 'til it learns some manners! ;^) teeheenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Centre runout, live or dead! From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 13 Sep 1999 22:02:26 GMT -------- Read again good son! There are LOTs of people on this list with both the Knowledge and the Means. Plus a heck of a lot more, without the "means" who could figure out a way to do it in a pinch. Me? I got both..and still prefer a swift smack with a hammer 8^) teenut > > By reading some of the posts in this NG I doubt that many here have > neither the > knowledge nor the means to machine a center in the spindle. Most centers > I've > used have been too hard to machine by turning and had to be ground using > a tool post grinder. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Mill/Drill-HOW? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 13 Sep 1999 22:48:54 GMT -------- Bob & Marilyn Tonkins wrote: > > Regarding A: so-called "Slot-Drill" or "Slot-Mills." and B: Accurate > Milling > > > ITEM A: Without disagreeing that plunge cutting CAN be done with a > so-called "slot drill" on a blind slot job, may I ask . . . WHY? > > I have, on occasion, put in a 3/8" internal key way by hacksawing down > each side of the layout and the on the diagonal to clear more stock out > and then by filing to fit. My point is; you CAN do just about anything, > but WHY, when there are much more appropriate measures. > > I have worked over twenty years in everything from forging shops to > aerospace and I know this; while you can get away with drilling with a > mill, DRILLS are for drilling and MILLS are for milling. One poster said > his foreman would have a fit if he pre-drilled before milling. Well, if > I were his company comptroller I'd have his foreman's wallet on my desk > subtracting the negative cash flow. The reason is simple physics: Sorry Bob..you are SO WRONG here! Firstly..Even assuming the Company Comptroller knew his ass from a hole in the ground..when it comes to machining sequences... What you are advocating is a tool change or even a machine and setup change in a simple milling operation that must have been carried out BILLIONS of times since blid ended keyways and motor shaft Slot drills are designed to PLUNGE cut...straight into a motor shaft. CUT a key way to acceptable limits and WITHDRAW..Ready for the rapidly following NEXT of a batch of 500 motor shafts! They don't get pushed back in a properly designed holding system..even with collets, your major problem is not pushing back but PULLING OUT..oh how embarassing that can be when you mill a slot of increasing depth in a BRAND NEW MILL TABLE!! (Yeh Robert Swinney...Been there, Done That!!) > > Most commercially used drills have either a Morse Taper shank or are > specialty units that fit a Jacobs-Collet etc shank or have stops of some > design that allow relatively little or NO axial slippage. When you drill > with a mill you are pushing a relatively lightly held straight cylinder > back into a recess. As I noted above, you may very well get away with > it. Or, conversely, you may just loosen that bond between collet and > mill enough to yank that mill out or ruin the depth setting. This is > especially true of up-cutting mills designed to take chips out of the > cut. Have you never heard of Weldon Shanks?? > Even if your depth of cut isn't critical AND your mill doesn't loosen > or get sucked out, you're putting un-needed stress on a collet with > attendant wear and galling. To imply that what amounts to a badly ground > bottoming out drill (that's what a "slot-mills working edge is like) is > as workable as a drill is just not even close. A slot drill, is far stiffer and the geometry is far better than any flat bottom drill. Yeah, you can pour on the > horsepower and bust a few mills and get the job done, but it's bad > practice. And for those of us with already stressed out machinery > (industrial rejects or clapped out asiamills or made for hobby machines) > this is just too stressful on machine AND tool AND "Armstrong" drives > (US) > > Please don't ring in specialty mills. As a pro, I know they exist . . . > mills that drill, but these units ain't it. > > ITEM B: Another milling practice dreamed about on this n.g. as if it > actually existed in the real world is milling a 3/4" slot with a 3/4" > mill. (substitute your size) Now, I've had my hands on BRAND NEW mills > with systems as rigid as a harem owner's tool and running brand new > mills and chip coolant/lube . . . and I haven't pulled this off in > twenty years. OH! CLOSE. Bicycle yokes and engine lifter key ways etc. > But that is not the point. Here in this group we've got folks drooling > over $300 levels and .0005 dimensions. And we're teaching (I sure hope > we are) newbies. > Truth be told, ANY mill will either wander in the job OR wobble in the > collet OR grab on chips OR suffer from the machine's running clearances > or ALL FOUR. Specially OUR junk. Good procedure takes that into account. > For jobs that really matter to within .005, you start out with undersize > mills poked into a pre drilled clearance hole. Then you rough out the > meat to around .010 to .015 on a side; then you strap on a finish mill > which is, itself a bit undersized (THEY mess up all four ways too) and > you go to depth in the middle of the cut, then up one side and back the > other to size. No No No Bob! Surprisingly, to some, it would seem, properly ground slot drills (two flute End Mills) are cutting "on size" keyways every hour of every day in shops around the world, on tackle you would not consider for a boat anchor. Industry does not have the luxury of "cut and try", undersized mills,or predrilled clearance holes..they are NOT neccessary and they sure as heck ain't profitable! > > Do what you wish with your tools, but I STILL wish you all - espesh the > newbie > Happy and Easy (and a SHADE more realistic) Machining. Me? I'm just trying to HELP!! Having made yet another enemy!! I remain, emphatically yours, teeHEEnut ;^) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: cool HSM type goodie! From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 00:27:11 GMT -------- Either they have changed the price since I went there??? Or I need to take an extra tablet tonight! Tee er! Not.. Net..Naa...Er!! Taamuch..thats it! Right? XPRTEC wrote: > > Teenut, > > Where does everybody get this $79.95 crap? Or were they getting like the > gasoline stations and taking advantage of the special event? When you go to > the site link it says $49.95. > > Still pretty high. Guess I'm like you I'll wait for the ALUMINUM version! > > Jim XPRTEC@AOL.COM ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Centre runout, live or dead! From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 00:28:23 GMT -------- Of course..I only use rubber centers!! Teeheeheenut Mike Graham wrote: > > On Mon, 13 Sep 1999 22:02:26 GMT, Robert Bastow wrote: > > >Me? I got both..and still prefer a swift smack with a hammer 8^) > > This *would* be a rubber hammer, right? > > -- > Mike Graham, mikegraham at sprint dot ca > Caledon, Ontario, Canada (just NW of Toronto). > > Raiser of animals. Weldor of metals. Driver of off-road vehicles. > Writer of FAQs. Keeper of the faith, and all around okay guy. > > < homepage currently off-line due to change of ISP; back soon > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Machinists' Contract Work From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 02:41:07 GMT -------- ROTFLMAO = Roll On The Floor Laughing My Ass Off Conflict? What conflict? The advantage of being an old fart is that I "CRESTBAG" = Can't Remember Enough Sh*t To Bear A Grudge!! Anyway I enjoyed our verbal workout..It's the only exercise I get nowadays..No doubt we will have more in the future but your stock is TRULY restored in my book, by your unilateral extension of the olive branch..(Or was that the misletoe on your shirt lap) Either way, I apologize for the somewhat corrosive qualities of my posts, and wish to see the matter laid to rest..In the best traditions of this truly remarkable News Group. Sincerely and equally respectfully, Robert "You can call me teeheenut" Bastow Robert Swinney wrote: > > Teeheenut, > > Below, way below, you wrote "I eagerly await yourcontribution to this > subject . You Can! Can't you"? Robert, now I'm gonna have to bite > here --- not sure what part of the subject you mean, but my abject stupidity > may show again -- you wrote "R O T F L M A O" ?? Now really, Robert, I > don't get it -- let's see ROTFLMAO, that is 7 letters, right? Oops, my > stupidity reared its ugly head again, that's 8 letters. Sorry! > > Eight letters with an "F" -- does that indicate your IQ, and a thinly > disguised sex reference you are ashamed to script, or do you just need > spelling lessons? Help us out here, Robert -- we, the stupid and unwashed > await your next great revelation. > > Thanks for explaining the "been there, done that" bit. I'd have never > guessed what that phrase meant! > > Why don't we give this nonsense a rest, Robert? Legitimate contributors to > the NG can use the space, I'm sure. If I kept it up, I might become the > stupid, smartass, jerk you described! I know when I've met the superior > intellect. I'm sorry if you are, but if you aren't, kindly notice the > misteltoe hanging from my shirt tail. > Respectively yours, > Bob Swinney ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 2 flute vs. 4 flute endmills From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 02:55:01 GMT -------- David R Brooks wrote: > I just checked the endmills in my shop, and lo behold, they are made > exactly as Robert describes, with the "Dremel" slot. Thank the Lord for that!! I was beginning to doubt my own memory/sanity!! (I know..I know..Many of you think there is no doubt at all!!) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Centre runout, live or dead! From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 11:24:29 GMT -------- Actually it is a short end of 1" copper rod about 2" long. My live center is a hard one..not usual practice..But I was able, by juggling the radial positions of the center sleeve and the center itself, to get zero runout. I then marked the relative positions of spindle nos, sleeve and center so that I am always able to return to that happy condition..provided that every thing is scrupulously clean and properly seated. If, given those condition, I check and find a modicum of runout, then a judicious tap with the copper "tup" teaches it manners. The culprit may be an oil film that is thicker on one side than the other..or just the way I twist them into position..whatever! So far I have always been able to get zero runout and intend to take good care of the tackle so that situation continues. "It is not, simply, knowing that it needs to be hit with a hammer...But knowing WHERE and HOW HARD!" ....teenut's Law. "Don't force it son..Use a bigger 'ammer!"..teenut's Mentor's Law. teenut Glenn Neff wrote: > > In article <37DD739D.D048CB39@home.com>, Robert Bastow > writes: > > >Ah, Kind Sir, you do me to kindly methinks. > > > >Me..I just smack it with a hammer 'til it learns some manners! ;^) > > > >teeheenut > > > > > > I'm taking notes now ...after I wipe the coffe off the screen... would that be > an air hammer or just a regular ol eingineerss maul?? > > :) > > Glenn Neff > Medford OR ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Centre runout, live or dead! From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 11:25:52 GMT -------- You read my mind Glenn...Or was it a previous post? ;^) teenut Glenn Neff wrote: > > In article <37dd5840.38980907@news.u-net.com>, tony@jeffree.X.co.uk (Tony > Jeffree) writes: > > > > >...and (sneaking in quickly before Robert Bastow gets there first ) > >in any event, if you want the most accurate results, you machine the > >centre *in situ* to make sure that any spindle runout & any runout in > >the original machining of the centre are of no consequence. > > > > > >Regards, > >Tony > > And then matchmark the spindle and center so you can put it back in the same > orientation ... did I get that right Robert ;)' > Glenn Neff > Medford OR ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Newbie: Drilling Brass/drill grind From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 15:04:05 GMT -------- Hi George, Unlike a lot of the problems/queries encountered on this NG yours is simple enough to explain and even simpler to rectify. 8^) In days of yore, and even now if you care to track them down, there were/are available special STRAIGHT FLUTE BRASS DRILLS..No spiral therefore, no positive rake on the cutting edge of the drill lip. It is this positive cutting rake that is causing your problems..Brass being such a (Relatively) easy and amenable material to machine, it always seems in a hurry to get it over with and tries to hurry things along by grabbing at, and trying to ride up that positive rake!! The solution is simple..remove the temptation!! Take your drill to the grinder, align the axis parallel to the flat side of the wheel and gently remove the sharp positive rake edge of the drill lips, equally on both sides. For your 3/4" drill, a flat, somewhat less than a 1/16th of an inch will be perfect. Voila! you now have a negative rake "Brass Drill"! Now, you can go search out a special set of straight flut drills, especially as you do a lot of brass work. OR, do as I and alot of other machinists do..Get a new set of regular drills, modify the lot and keep them just for brass and bronze. In doing this, of course, as you get to the smaller sizes the flat you need gets smaller and smaller..to the pont that, under about 3/16" diameter you can achieve it with just a few wipes with a slip stone. Quite frankly I recommend the latter course of action..If only because it is probably cheaper. But another good reason is because the remaining spiral on the drills does help clear chips out of the hole easier< I think, than a straight flute drill. Happy drilling teenut George Glines wrote: > > I want to modify a new 3/4" MT2 (118 degrees) drill bit I have to drill 360 > (free-machining) brass. The hole is 1 1/4 inches deep completely through > the material. I'm drilling a pilot hole but having some trouble with the > brass grabbing the drill bit. > > My metalworking books, including Machinery's Handbook have been no help as > to the way to sharpen/grind the bit. I searched through DejaNews, and > posters mention either grinding a flat on the drill, or grinding a zero rake > on the helix??? > > Does this mean that I would hold the drill at a 90 degree angle to the > grinding wheel to remove all rake on the flutes? It appears that the drill > is grabbing on the flutes not on the point. > > To make things more complicated, I've looked in all the big tool catalogs > for special purpose drills. Several show "fast-spiral" drills as good for > drilling deep holes in brass, then on the next page, recommend "slow-spiral" > as good for cutting brass. Since I work with brass quite a bit, I wouldn't > mind dedicating a group of drill bits just for that material, but since > these bits are all expensive, I don't want to buy the wrong ones. > > Thanks, > > George ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Centre runout, live or dead! From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 15:14:20 GMT -------- Bob, you are deliberately "twisting" the truth here! ;) Everyone knows I use a Crescent Hammer to put in wood screws. In fact I have a matched set of inch and metric, that take pride of place alongside my 6" and 12" sine bars, and my special 89 deg squares!! teenut Robert Nichols wrote: > Robert Bastow wrote: > : > :>Me? I got both..and still prefer a swift smack with a hammer 8^) > : > : This *would* be a rubber hammer, right? > > "Crescent hammer" seems more likely to me. > > -- > Bob Nichols rnichols@interaccess.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: The Bridgeport Saga - Finally got around to starting the idler motor From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 15:17:07 GMT -------- Is this a sign of a "Street Smart" Machinist? Someone who knows how to "Hot Wire" a Bridgeport!! teenut Collector of Bridgeport Hubcaps > Mike Graham wrote: > > > For weeks I've been avoiding it. It seemed such an odd thing to wire an > > electrical device to the two hot wires ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Endmill holders From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 15:20:37 GMT -------- Grant Erwin wrote: > I have a slot > milled right into my old BP table, which gets slightly deeper from one > end to the other. I bet the guy who cut that wished he were using an end > mill holder instead of a collet. > I'll bet he wished the ground would open up and swallow him when the Boss saw that!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Newbie: Drilling Brass/drill grind From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 16:38:48 GMT -------- John Hofstad-Parkhill wrote: > > George: > > I can't quite bring myself to grind a drill bit, as big as the dividends > might be. It's the "equally on both sides" part that has me stumped. > Hi John, The little flat you grind is easy to do off-hand and the width of it is NOT CRITICAL !! Just eyeball untill they look about the same and you will be fine. On a smaller drill, just a few wipes with a slip stone will do the trick. Give it a try..You'll LIKE it!! ;^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Newbie: Drilling Brass/drill grind From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 16:47:14 GMT -------- There is far more tendency to grab when opening up a hole in ANY material..Brass is no exception! The center of any drill..being a less than efficient cutting zone, helps hold the work down against the forces tending to make it grab. If you must use a regular drill and don't like the idea of zero rake flats, then just BLUNT THE POINT a bit, run slower than usual and feed steadily. The blunt point, while not best practice, may at least reduce the tendency to grab. and save the job, your nerves..even your fingers!! teenut John Hofstad-Parkhill wrote: > What I have found is that the combination of a small pilot and a big drill > works very well. > If I need a 1/2" hole or larger, I'll spot, pilot with 1/8" then use the > 1/2" jobber twist drill. My theory is that with more material to remove the > less tendancy to grab, ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Centre runout, live or dead! From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 16:51:20 GMT -------- Theyn are all perfectly normal, I'll thank you to know! Non of that "cross-point" preversion in MY shop! teenut Tony Jeffree wrote: > > On Tue, 14 Sep 1999 15:14:20 GMT, Robert Bastow > wrote: > > >Bob, you are deliberately "twisting" the truth here! ;) > > > >Everyone knows I use a Crescent Hammer to put in wood screws. > > > >In fact I have a matched set of inch and metric, that take pride of place > >alongside my 6" and 12" sine bars, and my special 89 deg squares!! > > > >teenut > > > > Tell me - does your set of screw-hammers include slotted and > cross-head versions too? :-) > > Regards, > Tony > > Website: http://www.jeffree.u-net.com/ > When replying, delete "X." from the Email address to remove anti-SPAM measures. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Craftsman power hacksaw From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 20:10:24 GMT -------- Gary Coffman wrote: > > Sure, but I can do that with my metalcutting bandsaw too. The only difference > is that my bandsaw runs smoother and cuts quicker than a reciprocating power > hacksaw. So I still ask, what value is all that extra monkey motion? > > Gary If nothing else Gary, A reminder of slower, gentler times!! I just bought a Keller Hacksaw. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Centre runout, live or dead! From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 20:15:10 GMT -------- But then it won't bounce back when I hit it Erik!! 8^) teenut Bjerg & Olsen wrote: > > Robert Bastow skrev i meddelelsen <37DD96EA.E631A10D@home.com>... > >Of course..I only use rubber centers!! > > > No, just use an unhardened steel center that can be finish-turned. Any > piece of unhardened steel in the 3-jaw chuck will in fact do, though a > harder grade will last longer. > > Faithfully > Erik Olsen ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Machinists' Contract Work From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 14 Sep 1999 20:25:43 GMT -------- Aw shucks, 'tweren't nuthin' 8^) But thanks anyway. tee (HE) nut Robert Swinney wrote: > > teenut and the general NG, > Thanks, Robert. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Newbie: Drilling Brass/drill grind From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 15 Sep 1999 03:34:51 GMT -------- Hmmm!! I KNEW you were going to ask that question...This is like trying to describe Gina Lollobrigida without using your hands!! OK, you are familiar with a regular twist drill...Ok..It might help to hold the drill horizontally eyeball the cutting edge and imagine it is a regular HSS lathe tool. You can see that the cutting edge of the drill has a distinct wedge shape..just like your lathe tool The angle of the "point" face is pretty well fixed..this is the CLEARANCE angle...It is like the FRONT FACE on a lathe tool! However, the angle of the top face..the RAKE ANGLE..., is variable..It is determined by the HELIX if the drill...It corresponds to the top face of a lathe tool. With a fast spiral drill, this angle is very acute, with a slow spiral it is a blunter wedge, and with a straight spiral it is at 90 deg to the drill axis..In other words George, you have a ZERO top cutting rake on your wedge/cutting edge...Just like a zero top rake on a lathe tool (Oft described as NEGATIVE rake..but it ain't really!!) Now imagine what you would have to do to a positive top rake lathe bit..to turn it into a zero top rake bit? Grind a bit off the top! "Bust" that sharp angle... Blunt the wedge...Right! This is what we want to duplicate! So what we do is "Blunt" the wedge on a regular drill by grinding or honing...INSIDE THE FLUTE and PARALLEL TO THE CUTTING EDGE. Just "busting" it enough to produce a visible flat on a small drill, is all that is necessary..so long as the flat is wider than the depth of the chip (depth of cut) then you are fooling that dumb 'ole brass into thinking it is being cut by a zero rake drill!!! I hope to have my web page up soon so I will be able to post pictures and sketches to illustrate points..(no pun intended!!!) That will save me a bunch of peck, peck, sh*t! peck, with my tired old finger. I hope this helps..please don't hesitate to ask again if all I have done is confuse you further!! It has been known to happen before!! teenut George Glines wrote: > > Robert, > > Many thanks!!!! I want to be sure I understand correctly. Am I grinding > the "side/flutes" of the drill or the "point/tip" of the drill? I'll > practice on some old bits first, but having a brass only set would be great. > > George > > Robert Bastow wrote in message > news:37DE642B.CF2B542@home.com... > > Hi George, > > > > Unlike a lot of the problems/queries encountered on this NG yours is > simple > > enough to explain and even simpler to rectify. 8^) > > > > In days of yore, and even now if you care to track them down, there > were/are > > available special STRAIGHT FLUTE BRASS DRILLS..No spiral therefore, no > positive > > rake on the cutting edge of the drill lip. > > > > It is this positive cutting rake that is causing your problems..Brass > being such > > a (Relatively) easy and amenable material to machine, it always seems in a > hurry > > to get it over with and tries to hurry things along by grabbing at, and > trying > > to ride up that positive rake!! > > > > The solution is simple..remove the temptation!! Take your drill to the > grinder, > > align the axis parallel to the flat side of the wheel and gently remove > the > > sharp positive rake edge of the drill lips, equally on both sides. For > your > > 3/4" drill, a flat, somewhat less than a 1/16th of an inch will be > perfect. > > > > Voila! you now have a negative rake "Brass Drill"! > > > > Now, you can go search out a special set of straight flut drills, > especially as > > you do a lot of brass work. OR, do as I and alot of other machinists > do..Get a > > new set of regular drills, modify the lot and keep them just for brass and > > bronze. In doing this, of course, as you get to the smaller sizes the > flat you > > need gets smaller and smaller..to the pont that, under about 3/16" > diameter you > > can achieve it with just a few wipes with a slip stone. > > > > Quite frankly I recommend the latter course of action..If only because it > is > > probably cheaper. But another good reason is because the remaining spiral > on > > the drills does help clear chips out of the hole easier< I think, than a > > straight flute drill. > > > > Happy drilling > > > > teenut > > > > George Glines wrote: > > > > > > I want to modify a new 3/4" MT2 (118 degrees) drill bit I have to drill > 360 > > > (free-machining) brass. The hole is 1 1/4 inches deep completely > through > > > the material. I'm drilling a pilot hole but having some trouble with > the > > > brass grabbing the drill bit. > > > > > > My metalworking books, including Machinery's Handbook have been no help > as > > > to the way to sharpen/grind the bit. I searched through DejaNews, and > > > posters mention either grinding a flat on the drill, or grinding a zero > rake > > > on the helix??? > > > > > > Does this mean that I would hold the drill at a 90 degree angle to the > > > grinding wheel to remove all rake on the flutes? It appears that the > drill > > > is grabbing on the flutes not on the point. > > > > > > To make things more complicated, I've looked in all the big tool > catalogs > > > for special purpose drills. Several show "fast-spiral" drills as good > for > > > drilling deep holes in brass, then on the next page, recommend > "slow-spiral" > > > as good for cutting brass. Since I work with brass quite a bit, I > wouldn't > > > mind dedicating a group of drill bits just for that material, but since > > > these bits are all expensive, I don't want to buy the wrong ones. > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > George ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Newbie: Drilling Brass/drill grind From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 15 Sep 1999 03:46:41 GMT -------- George Glines wrote: > > Bob, > > Thank you very much! Since you are trying to achieve a "flat", do you grind > on the side of the grinding wheel or the normal face of the wheel? Does it > matter? > > [I do know that you should never, ever, ever grind on the side of a grinding > wheel]. > Sure you can! For certain special cases. This is one of those special cases. (Thinning points and finishing the side clearance on a parting tool also come to mind) The caveat about grinding on the side is for "the regulation of idiots and the guidance of wise men" (teenut's law) Don't treat the side of your wheel as a "regular" grinding face..true it up and keep it for those little finishing touches. Don't apply extreme pressure to it. Don't undercut, groove or score it. Don't grind and true to less than 2/3 of its original thickness..replace when in doubt. " wheels are cheap, faces are not" (teenuts law) Otherwise..being one of the wise..grind away! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: any possible problems? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 15 Sep 1999 04:01:09 GMT -------- Bob & Marilyn Tonkins wrote: > Among my many projects, I too am modifying a wood cutting band saw to > cut metal. Maybe not your particular requirements..but for anyone who only cuts sheet metal up to 12 gauge....YOU DO NOT NEED TO SLOW YOUR SAW DOWN from wood cutting speeds!! Ok..teenut's finally lost it!! No..seriously! The technique is called FRICTION CUTTING and is used regularly in industry. Fit your wood cutting bandsaw with a regular fine toothed metal cutting blade (carbon or hss) Rev 'er up and feed your steel sheet into the blade at about half the feed rate you would expect to use on plywood. Don't be shy with the feed..dont let it dwell too much. The blade will cut through your steel..even stainless or tool steel..like a hot knife through butter. After your first cut, the blade won't be up to much as a regular "slow" cutting blade..but it will continue to work as a friction cutting blade for an extended period of time! Try it..you will be amazed! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Stainless steel From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 15 Sep 1999 04:06:51 GMT -------- See my post on friction cutting! teenut Ian wrote: > > What equipment do I need to cut 1-2mm sheet stainless steel?........apart > from an angle grinder! I need something to give a better cut. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: HSS - How do you cut it ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 15 Sep 1999 04:14:21 GMT -------- A cutoff wheel in a Dremel..absent which, the corner of your grind stone. Which ever you use, you don't need to cut all the way through..Just score it well all the way round. Take it to your vise and grip it TIGHTLY, right at the score point. PUT ON YOUR SAFETY GLASSES!!! Cover and wrap the protruding piece of bit with a couple of shop rags..(otherwise you may never see it again) and tap it smartly with a BFH (about a 2 pounder). The tool bit will snap like glass! teenut billw01775@my-deja.com wrote: > > I need to make some short tool bits. Is there an easy way to cut HSS ? > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Share what you know. Learn what you don't. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Whats the true definition of millwright From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 15 Sep 1999 04:26:00 GMT -------- Where I came from (UK) the millwrights covered every function from installing and removing machine tools. They also repaired, realigned and rebuilt all manner of machine tools and plant machinery..Generating, hydraulic (BIG stuff).steam engines..cranes, furnaces, presses and forges, boilers..the whole gamut. A highly skilled jack of all trades...Rigger, Fitter, Machinist, Plant engineer, etc. teenut Mike Graham wrote: > > On Tue, 14 Sep 1999 19:50:36 -0400 (EDT), John Jacobs wrote: > >What is the true definion of millwright? Please advise. > > True definition? No such thing. 8-) > > A millwright used to be the guy you'd call to level your new mill or lathe > or whatever and get it ready to work. He was often also the guy who'd > scrape the ways and do a lot of the refurbishing. He was also often a > rigger who would move the machine from place to place before levelling it. > Technically, dictionary definition, a millwright is a person who builds > mills. > > -- > Mike Graham, mikegraham at sprint dot ca > Caledon, Ontario, Canada (just NW of Toronto). > > Raiser of animals. Weldor of metals. Driver of off-road vehicles. > Writer of FAQs. Keeper of the faith, and all around okay guy. > > < homepage currently off-line due to change of ISP; back soon > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 2 flute vs. 4 flute endmills From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 15 Sep 1999 04:47:56 GMT -------- Wayne, I am really curious as to why you have such difficulty creating that first flat. This is SOP for drilling or milling holes on the "Slantendicular" and shouldn't be a problem..PROVIDED THAT.... The setup, your machine and slides are rigid and locked in all directions but the feed. You use a TWO FLUTE, END CUTTING MILL...I would recommend one of FULL hole diameter, as short as possible and held as rigidly as possible. You can either plunge cut or feed in sideways..either will work...you should be able to go right through in one push..bugger the flats, pilot drilling yada..yada..yada. One cut, straight trough and follow with a boring bare if dead size or finish are important! I suspect that the 3/4" end mill you are using, is too long and too small in diameter (They do bend y'know) It is not truly end cutting. (see my previous posts on THAT subject!!) BTW, center cutting, carbide insert drills and slot cutters ARE available..I have used them. Because of the above..you are feeding "nervously"..slow and steady huh? This will cause work hardening..hence the pops and groans (Screeching too?) If you have a nib of ANY size when using a slot drill..It ain't ground right..period!! teenut Wayne Cook wrote: > > On Tue, 14 Sep 1999 02:55:01 GMT, Robert Bastow > wrote: > > > > > > >David R Brooks wrote: > > > >> I just checked the endmills in my shop, and lo behold, they are made > >> exactly as Robert describes, with the "Dremel" slot. > > > >Thank the Lord for that!! > > > >I was beginning to doubt my own memory/sanity!! > > > > I've seen both types but the most common ones I've seen are the > other style with the extremely thin web. I don't like them since they > don't tend to work very well for plunging (especially in SS). But my > experiments with cutting a slot haven't worked to well either. > > There's one job where I do a lot of plunging that's a real bear. > It's when I'm making some swirl rings for a large waste gas burner. > These rings are 12" dia of 1" thick 316SS and I've got to put 12 each > 1 5/8" holes through them. But the real kink is that the holes have to > be at a angle and not just a simple angle either but at a compound > angle. The angle works up to a total of about 37 deg so it's not to > terrible but it's bad enough. > > The way I go about this job is to start out with a 3/4" end mill and > get 12 flats (oh yeah I do all of this on a old #3 Cinci horizontal > mill). Then I use a 1 1/4" carbide insert mill to enlarge the flats. > Then I push a 1 1/4" drill bit through (the bit has to be ground on > the outside from time to time to prevent binding but hole size doesn't > matter here just getting the metal removed). Then I push a home made 1 > 1/2" insert cutter through and finally end up with a finishing cut > from a home made 1 5/8" insert cutter. We used to use a 1 1/2" insert > end mill but it's geometry isn't right and it wasn't really long > enough. In all of this long process the worst and most gut wrenching > part is getting that first flat. I've tried sharpening every way I > cain think of but the best so far is to sharpen kind of like a brad > point drill bit. Just a little bit of a point helps to keep it from > wandering all over the place. It won't work for a mill that you want > to actually cut a slot with but it works better for plunging. I tried > cutting a slot but it proved impossible to get it just right and there > was always a little nib sticking up that pushed everything around. No > matter how it sharpened there's a terrible series of pops and groans > during the plunge that I'm always expecting the end mill to shatter > anytime during the process. > > Wayne Cook > Shamrock TX ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 2 flute vs. 4 flute endmills From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 15 Sep 1999 05:19:50 GMT -------- Peter Drumm wrote: > Clarification; When cutting 'down' it does rub, it has to. When > cutting with the side, like in cutting a keyway, only the corners cut. > > Custom machining; Tool & Cutter grinding > Peter Drumm, Wausau WI > > Cyrix6x86/300 MII, OS/2 Warp 4, Linux Have you ever turned a piece in the lathe, with a knife tool, right down to the center in one cut? You can even do it with the tip of the tool sticking appreciably PAST the center point. At some, infinitesimally small point, you have ZERO cutting speed, and the only way metal is being moved is by plastic deformation. But the area in which this takes place is so small it doesn't really present much resistance..certainly a LOT less than that afforded to a drill point..which must "Shove aside" a relatively large area of metal Or perhaps because your lathe tool was not perfectly on center, you left a perfect little cylinder of 5 to ten thou diameter? Which you could break off with your thumb nail! That is what an end cutting "slot drill" will do when plunge cutting. Now, can you imagine how much (Should I say how LITTLE) resistance that little pip affords..in the greater scheme of things? I was laboring under the impression that the British "Slot Drill" was exactly the same as an American "Two flute end mill" It now appears that this may not be the case! Peter, being in the T&C Grinding business, you must have seen more two flute "end mills" than the rest of us have had hot dinners! Obviously there are two different grinds available from manufacturers..the "equal length, meet in the middle like a flat point drill" type, and the "Unequal length, cross over the middle, with a slot" type that I have described..and that are now popping up in toolboxes around the world. Now, I know for a fact, that the latter type will plunge, end cut, all day long..without a problem. I have my doubts about the former type. Do you meet with both types? What sort of percentage mix? Do you grind both types? If so, does the customer ever specify the difference? What do you and they call them? One final question that REALLY concerns me!! The next time I order an "End cutting, two flute, end mill", how the heck am I going to ensure I get the right kind? teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Engine newsgroup? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 15 Sep 1999 05:30:13 GMT -------- Wassamatter with this forum Mark?? Don't you feel free to ask that kind of question here? Or don't you trust a bunch of "Metal Shifters" to come up with the right answers to that sort of question? Surely it can't be because you don't think it is "Relevant" here..'Cos if you do you are wrong and in a minority of one. Anyway, how are us metal heads going to hear the answers you get if you take your "Business" elswhere? Please stay 8^) teenut NOSPAM ORTRASH Mark White wrote: > > Count me in too. I don't mind them in here, but I agree that it is > off-topic in the literal sense and some may object. Plus, it would be > nice to have a forum to ask questions like the one I am trying to > figure out right now, which is a recommendation for a small (3/8" ID) > thrust/radial bearing. > > Mark > > >>Don Stauffer wrote: > >>> > >>> Personally, I love the threads on unique or old engines (current Opposed > >>> Piston thread, or previous Rotary Engine threads). > >>> > >>> However, they probably are a bit off-topic. What I would like is a > >>> survey. How many folks object to these threads? If there are a number > >>> of folks who do, maybe we should see if there is enough interest for a > >>> seperate newsgroup, something like rec.engines or something. > >>> > >>> -- > >>> Don Stauffer in Minneapolis > >>> stauffer@gte.net > >>> http://home1.gte.net/stauffer/ > >> > >> ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Whats the true definition of millwright From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 15 Sep 1999 05:41:52 GMT -------- Jack Erbes wrote: > Now that the easy question has been answered, lets decide what a > toolmaker is. > > In my book it is every human from the first primitive man who hammered > an animal dead with a hand held stone forward, but some disagree with > that. That gets my vote! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Milling shallow curved surfaces From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 15 Sep 1999 05:53:09 GMT -------- You are definitely on my home turf now, as I am currently manufacturing a series of LARGE bolt actions. The Model 70 has one of the smallest receiver ring diameters.at 1.3" The Remington 700 series(and their ancesters, the Model 17 Enfield) come in at 1.35" as does the '06 Springfield. Mauser '98s including the Magnum Mauser are 1.410" The Brevex Magnum "Mauser" and the Brno BKK602 are/were 1.5" So what kinda receiver ARE you fitting a 'scope base to? A .50BMG perhaps? teenut Robert Bissett wrote: > > What on earth kind of rifle are you making a scope mount for? Most rifle > > receivers that I am familiar with have diameters of 1.1 to 1.3 inch dia. > --- > Some rifle receivers have the top of the rear ring made to a much larger radius > than the front ring. For example, the Winchester Model 70. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Adapter for faucet From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 15 Sep 1999 07:06:22 GMT -------- Alan, Are you sure of that 27tpi? There is a standard series of brass threads which are all 26tpi. They are all 55 deg Whitworth form in the UK. I am not sure if they are 60 deg in the USA...it won't matter a whole hill 'o beans which you use as they tend to be tolleranced on the sloppy side. Similarly with the "truncated thread" 50% thread form is not unheard of. On a fitting it is unlikely to be a taper thread..that is reserved for pipes. teenut Alan Mimms wrote: > > Greetings fellow space travelers. I have recently purchased a new > kitchen. That is, somebody came in, tore the old one out and put in a > new one, along with removing a wall and doing LOTS of other expensive > stuff. One of the things the guy did was install a Price Pfister > curved-neck faucet in the kitchen sink. This is pretty - nickel > plated brass, I think. Trouble is, it has a non-standard diameter on > the end. > > Now my wife wants her angle-able spray nozzle from the old sink to > work on the end of this curved-neck thing. It doesn't fit; the curved > neck faucet's diameter is about 1/16" smaller than the diameter of the > old "standard" faucet. I wandered around town looking in hardware > stores' stock of adapters and new-fangled angle spray nozzles, to no > avail. I finally decided to buy another of the little end nozzles > that come with the new faucet - the ones that hold the ($%#@^%^&) flow > reducer, which I have already removed). This would, in theory, be > machined into an adapter onto which I could screw the angle spray > nozzle. Diameters appear to be compatible with this notion of > machining it into this useful shape. Buying another has the advantage > that I can go back to the original if I screw up the new one. > > The issue I'm trying to resolve is the type of external threads to put > on the new adapter thingie. It looks like the angle nozzle has 27TPI > threads. Would these be 27 TPI 60 degree threads like a screw has, or > would they be the truncated variety used in pipes? The Bible says > that most pipe threads are on tapered diameter pipes and that 27 TPI > is only used on 1/8" diameter, but there are "exceptions" for special > cases wherein 27 TPI is used on larger diameters (this is, as I > recall, 13/16") and wherein the taper is left off if the application > is "low pressure". > > What is likely to be the thread form, and will I have to grind a new > tool or can I use the standard 60 degree triangular tool I already > have? > > I wonder if I will find that the nickel is applied some way other than > plating? Would you guess that the finish on this little adapter > widget will flake off if I abuse it with a sharp threading tool in a > lathe and chuck it? It does not LOOK like it's a paint or similar > process - it looks HIGHLY conformant to the base metal like a plating > job would be. > > I have never cut threads on my lathe on anything but aluminum. I > suppose I should practice a lot before trying to do this. What should > I look out for in doing this precisely right the first time? > > Thanks in advance from a recovering newbie. > -- > Alan Mimms > Home machinist in (self) training. > E-mail: alanm@unforgettable.com > Metalworking web page: http://alanm.penguinpowered.com/metalworking ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Spring Steel From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 15 Sep 1999 07:16:37 GMT -------- Try an industrial supplier..ask for blued steel shimm stock, You don't spec a size, but this is usually available in narrow strip or wider..6" stock. To cut without burring it, make yourself a scriber out of an old HSS hacksaw blade. Sharpen it to a hook cutter, that cutts on the pull stroke. Use a steel straight edge, clamped down, score the sheet (both sides if necessary) and break it upwards against the straight edge. You might have to wiggle it a couple of times..but any burr will come off with acouple of rubs with an oil stone. It will at least stay flat!! teenut Andrew Roberts wrote: > > Im after some 0.2mm spring steel to make a set of reed valves. > I have had to try and track some down because I haven't been able to find the > right style reed vavles I am after. > Is this steel readily availble and how is is it to work with? > I was thinking that if you could use tin snips to cut it with, the steel would > warp and twist to much for them to seal right. > > --------------------¦ > Andrew Roberts- ¦ > Napier, ¦ > New Zealand ¦ > ¦ > villiers@xtra.co.nz ¦ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Whats the true definition of millwright From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 15 Sep 1999 16:00:44 GMT -------- Yeh! So? Now tell us something we didn't already know! While you are at it..Make a note in your $20 "Webster's New Universal Unabridged Dictionary" (and your "$1.98 Funk and Wagnell's too for that matter..) News Group: Sub Heading: Rec.Crafts.Metalworking A eclectic and international group of highly intelligent people, joined only by a common interest in all things mechanical and the desire to share and further, collective knowledge. This includes a continuing effort to reconcile the many different definitions and understandings of common words, descriptions and technical terms as experienced in widely flung locations, language bases, local custom, continual language usage developments, time periods and experience factors. And then go smoke it!! teenut John Wasser wrote: > > [[ This message was both posted and mailed: see > the "To," "Cc," and "Newsgroups" headers for details. ]] > > In article <4162-37DEDF4C-18@newsd-263.iap.bryant.webtv.net>, John > Jacobs wrote: > > > What is the true definion of millwright? Please advise. > > Buy a dictionary. From my $20 "Webster's New Universal > Unabridged Dictionary": > > mill'wright (-rit), n. 1. one who makes a > business of planning and building mills or > mill machinery. > 2. a worker who installs, attends, or repairs > the shafting, belting, and other machinery in > a mill > > mill, n. > 5. any of various machines for stamping, > shaping, polishing, or dressing metal surfaces, > coins, etc. or for making something by some > action done again and again. > 6. a building or group of buildings with > machinery for manufacturing something; a > factory; as, a textile mill. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT-Auto Code Checkers-How & Why they work.Secrets! From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 15 Sep 1999 16:15:48 GMT -------- XPRTEC wrote: > > Auto Code Checkers > Big snip of highly informative, fileable information. Thanks Jim. > Some models do more than test for codes on engine, to wit, > gentlemen that said it tests ABS brake circuits. My 1996 Jaguar XJ V12 has an orange ABS warning lamp that always stays on for a few seconds longer, after start up, than all the other lamps..I understand this is normal. However, in the past couple of days it has taken to intermittent flashing..usually, but not always during normal braking. A hard brake test confirms that the ABS system is fully functional and there is plenty of fluid in the reservoir. This started a couple of weeks after a major, scheduled service, by the dealer. What's up wi' mi Big Cat? teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Table to spindle clearance?? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 15 Sep 1999 16:40:35 GMT -------- Tom Krause wrote: > I introduced my wife to it as "one of those mills that I've been > talking about". > "WHAT in the HELL do you think you need with THAT!!!" (My wife is a bit > tool handicapped as well). > I promptly explained to her that I realized that it was a large amount > of money.However that $3500 would most likely still be $3500 when I'm > dead,unlike that $500 she spent on the latest excercise machine that > turned into $50 when she tried to get rid of it. > > She didn't say another word.................... > > Tom While I applaud your weaponry I think your tactics stink! This what is known as a MADD (Mutually Assured Destruction Deterrent) only to be used "in extreme circumstances" ( Extreme circumstance being when your wife comes home unexpectedly and catches you in the final stages of installing a Bridgeport in the basement..you not, of course, having previously informed her of your intent, that you had sold her jewellery to pay for it, as well as liquifying your 401k and the kids college fund!!) Now you are screwed!! A. She may never speak to you again (Some sacrifices are worth the price!!) B. Now you pretty well have to get permission before buying a mill. We all know that it is easier to beg forgiveness than to seek permission..but you just burned your "Get out of Jail free" card and whatever the eventual outcome it is going to involve plea bargaining!! FWIW..in jest of course. ;^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Craftsman power hacksaw From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 15 Sep 1999 16:50:55 GMT -------- Gary Coffman wrote: > The reciprocating mechanisms I've tried to build tend to shake >themselves apart with distressing regularity. :-( > Not to mention blindness at an early age ;^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 2flt vs 4 flt - What about 3 flute endmills From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 15 Sep 1999 16:56:14 GMT -------- Yes, for the same reason and probably more so. teenut Mark Fullerton wrote: > > So if 2 flute end mills are better at holding accurate dimensions when > plunging down into material and 4 flute are better for side milling. > > Where do 3 flutes fall. > > Do they generally have the same problem as 4 flute as far as cutting larger > holes when plunging??? > > Just Curious > > - Mark ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: While we're talking about edge finders... what about conical tips? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 15 Sep 1999 16:59:23 GMT -------- At least he didn't tell us he used the pointy end for MAKING center punches!! Thankful, as always,for small mercies.. teenut mikoberg wrote: > > It's for locating centerpunches. > > > > -- Mike Graham > snip > > Great! How does it work? I lost one of my Starrett center punches and > need to find it! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Sine Bars was Centre runout, live or dead! From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 15 Sep 1999 17:02:47 GMT -------- Mike Rehmus wrote: > > Yeah, but it took two hands to get that many. Must have been a machinist. > Naw, Tool and Die Maker!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Newbie: Drilling Brass/drill grind From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 15 Sep 1999 17:07:14 GMT -------- George Glines wrote: > > Robert, > > Outstanding description! I appreciate your taking the time to clarify that > for me. Your message will definitely go into my "Save for All Time File". > > By the way. . . what's a lathe? [just kidding] > > Thank you, > > George > Glad to help George. Now what is a "Save for All Time File" Gotta get me some of those..I keep wearing my bastards out!! Do you thing MSC might carry them? 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Newbie: Drilling Brass/drill grind From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 15 Sep 1999 17:10:38 GMT -------- George Glines wrote: > > Robert, > > I do use the side of the wheel sometimes after doing the heavy grinding the > normal way. It still scares me though, so I stand way off to the side. A > little respect is a good thing. Wise and prudent precaution at ALL TIMES. A habit usually developed the INSTANT you ever see a grinding wheel "grenade" They get LOTTSA respect from me. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: any possible problems? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 15 Sep 1999 17:32:06 GMT -------- We used honkin' great 15 HP band saws and slicing a 10" file lengthways was a good demo of the potential!! 3/16-1/4" was possible on 300 series stainless tho' most of our work was 12 gauge. I KNOW a Harbor Fright type, two speed, bandsaw will do it..cause I bought one for the lads to use on small cuts...It took too long and too much power to wind up the big buggers for a 3 second cut. The metal "cutting" blade that came with it lasted about ten times longer at "Woodcutting" speed, than it would have done at "Metalcutting" speed. This doesn't work as well on highly conductive or soft/ gummy materials..like aluminum and copper. Not enough friction heat developed and what there is, is conducted away too rapidly. It will cut, but heavy burrs are produced that hang up and jam the feed. In any case..I use my wood cutting bandsaw and blades to profile aluminum up to 1 1/2" thick. There is less wear on the blade than if I were cutting plywood, particle board or hickory!! I am not so sure about using wood cutting blades for friction cutting..not enough teeth/thickness to share the load of carrying the heat away. Probably not enough beam strength or tension to withstand the feed pressures involved either. NO! I am NOT going to test it out on my $35.00 "WoodSlicer" resaw blade!! teenut Steve Knight wrote: > > On Wed, 15 Sep 1999 04:01:09 GMT, Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > >No..seriously! The technique is called FRICTION CUTTING and is used regularly > >in industry. > > how thick of steel can be done this way? I have seen it done with a woodworking > blade too. > > Knight's Toolworks & Custom Furniture Galoot Made Products > Records and tapes turned into CD's Save your vinyl and still enjoy it > Visit www.pacifier.com/~stevek/ for details. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: any possible problems? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 15 Sep 1999 17:38:22 GMT -------- Ned Simmons wrote: > > It depends primarily on the speed of the blade. > > Real friction saws run up to 10,000 FPM. Grob makes some beauties, I've > seen them as large as 48". Scary things ain't they..thats what we used. 15HP drives. >It's also nice to minimize breakage as a blade breaking at 6500 FPM can be > exciting. Now THAT gets the "Understatement of the Month" Award. GUARANTEED to require an immmediate change of skivvies!! teeenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Machinists' Contract Work From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 15 Sep 1999 18:08:22 GMT -------- Brian Evans wrote: > > The tears obscured my vision, and ruined my keyboard. Now UUNET has to buy me > a new laptop. Youse whimps should be ashamed.... Ashamed? Of what Brian? Apologising for an unseemly display of anger in a public forum? Remind me never to apologies to YOU for anything! Now BUTT OUT!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Whats the true definition of millwright From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 15 Sep 1999 18:30:32 GMT -------- Brian Evans wrote: > > I've stopped crying now, and my laptop keyboard seems ok too... > I still ain't gonna apologize for apologizin' ;^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Has anyone make own DRO for sherline? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 15 Sep 1999 18:33:26 GMT -------- I have this wonderful, spankin' new DRO and I am thinking of whipping up a Lathe or Mill to fit it..basic materials will be string and sealing wax.... ;^) teenut PLAlbrecht wrote: > > For that matter, anybody done this for the small (old) Atlas horizontal mill? > > Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT-Auto Code Checkers-How & Why they work.Secrets! From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 15 Sep 1999 20:54:45 GMT -------- > >What's up wi' mi Big Cat? > > > >teenut > > Fur ball ?? > > John Stevenson Jeeze John!! Coffee and snot all over the monitor again!! Can't you give some kind of warning when you are going to do that? I wonder if Furballs are covered by the warranty ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 2 flute vs. 4 flute endmills From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 16 Sep 1999 00:50:52 GMT -------- Oops! I obviously asked the wrong person!! teenut Peter Drumm wrote: > > In message <37DF2CBA.DBC24088@home.com> - Robert Bastow > writes: > :-> You can even do it with the tip of the tool sticking > appreciably PAST the center point. > > IME that almost always breaks the tip off the tool. > > :-> > :->Peter, being in the T&C Grinding business, you must have seen more two flute > :->"end mills" than the rest of us have had hot dinners! > > Maybe 4-5 hundred, since I just started this in the last few months > and people aren't exactly breaking the doors down to get things > sharpened. > > :-> > :-> > :->Obviously there are two different grinds available from manufacturers..the > :->"equal length, meet in the middle like a flat point drill" type, and the > :->"Unequal length, cross over the middle, with a slot" type that I have > :->described..and that are now popping up in toolboxes around the world. > > I've never seen one with the slot you described. > > :-> > :->Now, I know for a fact, that the latter type will plunge, end cut, all day > :->long..without a problem. I have my doubts about the former type. > > Never had any problem plunging with the meet-in-the-middle type, nor > have I run into anyone that has. > > :-> > :->Do you meet with both types? What sort of percentage mix? > :-> > :->Do you grind both types? If so, does the customer ever specify the > :->difference? What do you and they call them? > > I sharpen them as close to original as I can, no one's ever asked for > any of the 'slotted' type. > > :-> > :->One final question that REALLY concerns me!! The next time I order an "End > :->cutting, two flute, end mill", how the heck am I going to ensure I get the right > :->kind? > > Ask for a Center Cutting EM and it'll work. > > Custom machining; Tool & Cutter grinding > Peter Drumm, Wausau WI > > Cyrix6x86/300 MII, OS/2 Warp 4, Linux ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 2 flute vs. 4 flute endmills From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 16 Sep 1999 01:21:06 GMT -------- As I said, I asked the wrong guy and you asked the right one. (Please Steve..Don't take this as an attack on your competance or veracity...There is a gap here, and I am as much on one side of it as you are on the other, and just as surprised to find that a gap exists!! There is more to this and I for one will not quit until I get a definitve answer. One thing I know about this business is that..if you dig deep enough, ANYTHING that has become an established pattern, an accepted standard, has so become for sound, solid reasons..no matter how long ago it was that anyone questioned it, the reasons were sound then, and are sound today. Half the world is using end cutters that work properly..the other half is using end cutters that are half assed. The sad thing is, people accustomed to the half assed ones don't even know they are missing out. I have been accused of hanging my butt out before. So I maybe, am about to do it again, no matter, the truth is there and it will be outed!! Call your favorite tool supplier/regrinder and , as John has done, ask them...What do THEY understand by a "Two flute, End Cutting Mill (or Slot drill)" Ask them to check and verify the grind format. Ask them to check and verify the reasons, claims, demand etc., for the type they supply, use, regrind, recommend or specify. If necessary, prompt them with the descriptions you have seen printed here..If anyone needs clarification or further explanation...email me direct. teenut John Stevenson wrote: > > On Wed, 15 Sep 1999 22:08:59 GMT, pdrumm@dwave.net (Peter Drumm) wrote: > >I've never seen one with the slot you described. > > > >:-> > >:->Now, I know for a fact, that the latter type will plunge, end cut, all day > >:->long..without a problem. I have my doubts about the former type. > > > >Never had any problem plunging with the meet-in-the-middle type, nor > >have I run into anyone that has. > > > There is something amiss with these two flute slot drills that are being > described by Robert and queried by others. > I have checked all my stock and they are ALL the over centre type described by > Robert. At first I thought that it may be that there are differences in how the > UK and the USA grind their slot drills but all my recent stock comes from the US > via J&L. > Anyway to get back to the original post I asked them about the 2 flute cutters > and they said they should all go over centre with a nick to relieve the cutting > edge. > > -- > Regards, > John Stevenson > Nottingham, England ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Wilton 14" Vert Bandsaw? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 16 Sep 1999 01:26:07 GMT -------- Both made in China..the only difference in price is determined by the fact that..in the HSM/Hobbyist field, the Delta name is more marketable than the Wilton name. My observation and opinion only!! teenut "R. Nair" wrote: > > Does anyone have any thoughts about the Wilton Model 8201 14" Vertical > Metal Cutting Bandsaw? > > Can anyone compare the the Wilton and the Delta 28-303, they have the > same speed range, power rating, but I'm not sure about the features on > the wilton. The wilton's about $1000 new v. the delta at $1500. > > Thanks ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Machinists' Contract Work From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 16 Sep 1999 01:43:08 GMT -------- Mr " Director@machinist.com" Sir, Either you or I, are smoking bad shit, and need to change our dealers! Forgive me, but that wot which you sed..is total gobbledegook to me..I can't speak for anyone else on this NG..They all have their own dealers. You have been absent while the dust arisen by your last ethereal appearance has settled..we haven't heard from you, (Except your private missive to me..and I'm sure you don't want me to answer THAT in public!!" So What is your angle? Cut the COY! What are you trying to determine/prove/demonstrate? Who and what are you? As I said before..A few more honest questions might elicit a whole lot more honest answers! 'Til then..GO AWAY!! 'Til then..STAY AWAY!! teenut "machinist.com" wrote: > > ..... bbbbut I must be stupid..... what about the profit margin made > on the job contracted? If an employer is able to get a job done faster > and with a profit would that not be an incentive to use one? > > Generally we function as gears in the production machine anyway... to > my adled (arrr...) way of thinking with the aid of a contracted worker > the manufacturer would be able to scale his operation faster with less > risk.... the risk is deferred to the contracted worker in essence... > > Somehow I feel that that was a weak argument especially coming from a > guy with only a little entrepreneurial experience and none as a > contracted employee..... But still, squinting, I can see that a > contracted worker might be a close parallel to the worker that has a > vested interest (profit sharing? stock options?) in the doings of the > company.... If he does well he makes money.... above and beyond the > contracted amount? > > Perhaps another pipe dream of mine.... > > -------------- > The Machinists Exchange On-line > http://www.machinist.com > > "Trying To Do The Right Thing For Machinists" > > Phone: > 1-888-825-3422 > > Fax: > 1-888-866-4829 > > Email: > director@machinist.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Machinists' Contract Work From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 16 Sep 1999 01:48:41 GMT -------- I think machinist.communist needs to wake up and smell the turds he is peddling! teenut "machinist.com" wrote: > > I have a broader vision of a virtual community for machinists' that > will in time and with the support of machinists I aim to serve offer > a meaningful and unbridled platform on which to air there concerns.... > > Like this one.... > > I am not ashamed to say that the question I posed was for my own > personal needs not those of this fledgling business I am trying to > create..... > > Now about my dad..... > > Fortunately he is quite dead so he does not have to listen to peanut > gallery yammering. > > You guys are so mean.... sniff snifff you hurt my feelings.... damn > you..... > > Anon.... "If rape is inevitable, relax and enjoy it ! " > > On Mon, 13 Sep 1999 12:44:03 GMT, john@engineers-com.freeserve.co.uk > (John Stevenson) wrote: > > >Good call Robert on the first post, > >If this bloke is a director of a employment agency and he's asking " and > > always heard about "contract work". end quote, then he's obviously a wanker. > >Pity his dad wasn't > >-- > >Regards, > >John Stevenson > >Nottingham, England > > -------------- > The Machinists Exchange On-line > http://www.machinist.com > > "Trying To Do The Right Thing For Machinists" > > Phone: > 1-888-825-3422 > > Fax: > 1-888-866-4829 > > Email: > director@machinist.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: D1-4 chuck? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 16 Sep 1999 02:00:42 GMT -------- Collet chucks are like sex and eyesight! What you've never had..You never miss! Once you have tried it..You wouldn't want to be without! teenut Jim Stewart wrote: > I'm not really sure how much I'll use it, but everyone who uses them > seems to think collet chucks in the lathe are wonderful. > > Comments? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Why are shapers dead ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 16 Sep 1999 02:06:25 GMT -------- Ruger! teenut Curt Brown wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > In modern production..Automatic pistol frames, bolt action receivers etc., > > are investment cast, to near-net shape. > > Just curious, but which major manufacturers do you know of for sure that > use investment casting for their bolt-action receivers? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 2 flute vs. 4 flute endmills From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 16 Sep 1999 19:08:07 GMT -------- Hoyt McKagen wrote: > > Bob, I order CCEM all the time and I've never gotten anything but the > equal-edge-length style; in over thirty years have never even seen > anything else. > > Best wishes, > > Hoyt McKagen > Then, with all due respect Hoyt, you cannot really speak with authority on whether the "over center" type cuts better than the simple "to center" type. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: any possible problems? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 16 Sep 1999 19:14:36 GMT -------- No Martin, I regularly cut 3/8" to 1 1/2" 6061T6 alloy with my regular 6 tpi skip tooth woodworking blade on my wood working bandsaw! teenut Eastburn wrote: > > With a wood blade - oh .001 Al... :-) > > The blade is exchanged with a metal cutting type that is designed for the > type of metal and also shape (hollow....). > Martin ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Milling shallow curved surfaces From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 16 Sep 1999 19:28:28 GMT -------- Yes you are right..I misread your previous post wher you referred to the REAR ring (Bridge) rather than the FRONT ring (Receiver ring) Mea Culpa. I don't have a Model 70 to measure but it seems to me tha most Bridges..those that are not flat top, and certainly any that ar Mauser or Mauser based clones, have an arched rather than a radius form. That is, in the case of the Mauser IMMSMC two flats at 15deg to horizontal, blended by about a 3/4" radius. I don't deal with "modern" rifles enough to really comment. teenut Robert Bissett wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > You are definitely on my home turf now, as I am currently manufacturing a series > > of LARGE bolt actions. > > The Model 70 has one of the smallest receiver ring diameters.at 1.3" > > The Remington 700 series(and their ancesters, the Model 17 Enfield) come in at > > 1.35" as does the '06 Springfield. > > Mauser '98s including the Magnum Mauser are 1.410" > > The Brevex Magnum "Mauser" and the Brno BKK602 are/were 1.5" > > So what kinda receiver ARE you fitting a 'scope base to? A .50BMG perhaps? > > > > teenut > > Robert Bissett wrote: > > > > > > What on earth kind of rifle are you making a scope mount for? Most rifle > > > > receivers that I am familiar with have diameters of 1.1 to 1.3 inch dia. > > > --- > > > Some rifle receivers have the top of the rear ring made to a much larger radius > > > than the front ring. For example, the Winchester Model 70. > > --- > > teenut, (Robert Bastow) > > Get out your measuring tools and measure the radius of the TOP of the REAR ring > of the M70 Winchester. > I don't have a radius gage that big but comparing it to various > coffee can lids it is in excess of 3 inches. > The rear ring of the M70 receiver is not round above the rails. > Maybe that is what he is cutting the scope for. > > Also please quote me correctly if there is a next time. > > I did not say "What on earth kind of rifle......for? Most.........inch dia." > That was part of someone else's reply. > > Bob > > --- ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT-Auto Code Checkers-How & Why they work.Secrets! From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 16 Sep 1999 19:36:49 GMT -------- That makes more sense than a hair ball..I have never seen my "Big Cat" licking its fur!! It is booked in for a look-see next week and I'm assured that there is no danger in driving in the meantime AND that it will be covered by warranty. OooAhh! Thanks Carl for a SENSIBLE reply..Unlike some I could mention but won't, but Whose name MIGHT begin with JOHN STEVENSON!!! ;^) teenut Carl Byrns wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > > > > My 1996 Jaguar XJ V12 has an orange ABS warning lamp that always stays on for a > > few seconds longer, after start up, than all the other lamps..I understand this > > is normal. > > > > However, in the past couple of days it has taken to intermittent > > flashing..usually, but not always during normal braking. A hard brake test > > confirms that the ABS system is fully functional and there is plenty of fluid in > > the reservoir. > > > > This started a couple of weeks after a major, scheduled service, by the dealer. > > > > What's up wi' mi Big Cat? > > > Robert- > If your dealer did any kind of greasing of suspension components, check > to be sure there is no excess grease between the speed sensors and the > pulse rings. > These are located (on most cars, not sure about your Jag) on the inside > of the rotors and look like a gear with the teeth blunted. The ABS uses > pulse counting to determine individual wheel speed. If there is a > grease/dirt build up, the sensor may not be reporting a correct speed. > The processor can't deal with three wheels turning at X rpm and one at 0 > rpm without braking and drops off-line and reports a code. > > As an aside, when I worked for Honda, we had some Acura Legends come off > the truck with ABS problems. The ABS system fuse is left out for > shipping and as soon as we put it in and moved the car, the ABS would > shut down. After much head-scratching, we finally figured out that the > pulse rings on the left front wheel of the cars had fewer teeth than the > right. A factory tech told us that cars bound for Europe use a lower > frequency signal (because the road speeds are higher) and a batch of > left front driveshafts ( the pulse ring in on the outer CV joint) got > installed on US cars. The processor gagged on the difference in wheel > speed. > > Hope this helps- Carl ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Steam engine: Boring and drilling, fits and fits From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 16 Sep 1999 19:55:48 GMT -------- If it "slides in with slight stickiness" it is pretty damn close to .500" Maybe a couple of tenths over. If it were .002" over you would be able to throw it in from across the room. If you want to bore rr turn to dead dimensions..don't rely on your feedscrews and indices...Set up a "tenth" reading dial indicator on the axis in question and work to that. Thus you will be able to withdraw the tool and return it to the same place with some reasonable assurance that it IS the same place! teenut John Hofstad-Parkhill wrote: My pin gauge at .500"+ fits the > bore. My understanding is that were the bore .500" and the pin gauge .500" > then I'd have a hell of a time getting the gauge to fit the hole, with all > those other damn molecules interfering. As it is, the pin gauge fits with a > slight, um... stickyness. It's pretty close is the best I can describe. So > I'm guessing the bore is .502" or so. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.autos.tech Subject: Re: rec.engines newsgroup From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 17 Sep 1999 00:41:00 GMT -------- I vote NO! Divide and be conquered if you must, but I for one enjoy reading the stuff about engines..though I have no real imput to make most of the time. Go to another newsgroup and I will miss out on all that stuff. My interest is not strong enough to subscribe to yet ANOTHER fractionally distilled group. Similarly, anyone with an engine machining problem is going to find his data base much more limited. I guess eventually your group will split again into Gasoline and Diesel, then vee and flat, marine and land? Following the same logic..maybe we could split this group into Amateur and Professional, Lathe and Mill, grinder and welded etc., ad nauseum.. So far I haven't seen a single objection on this group to the posting of threads on engines!! So wot's yer rush?? FWIW teenut Don Stauffer wrote: > > While there were few negative comments on my query about OT discussion > of engines in rec.crafts.metalworking, I still have in mind exploring > the creation of a new newsgroup, and am putting together info on the > procedure for creating newsgroups. If anyone has already created a > group, I certainly would appreciate help. > > One benefit of a new group is that I could post the RFD about the group > in many other newsgroups that might have people interested in engines. > > I see the charter of the group as a group to discuss steam and IC > engines of any application. It would include messages on engine > history, engine technology, new/unusual engines, questions on how they > operate, etc. > > It looks like a vote must have more yes votes than no votes by at least > 100 votes. Even if we get no no votes, do we really have 100 people in > this group interested in engines? > > -- > Don Stauffer in Minneapolis > stauffer@gte.net > http://home1.gte.net/stauffer/ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 2 flute vs. 4 flute endmills From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 17 Sep 1999 05:01:52 GMT -------- Wayne Cook wrote: (Snip a long and miserable story of tight fisted M/c shop owners) > >BTW, center cutting, carbide insert drills and slot cutters ARE available..I > >have used them. > > > Yes I know. What I actually think would be the greatest thing for > this job is one of the new carbide insert drills. They are made in a > length that would be about right for the job and are much stiffer than > a standard drill. The problem here is that there's now way I can > convince them to spend the money on one of these without proof that it > would work and I can't prove it without having one (catch 22). Wayne, My BEST advice!! Tell the owners to go shove the job where the sun don't shine!!...there are plenty of better jobs around for someone with your skills, perseverence and analytical ability. However, if you do decide to see this one through..you need hands on help. Call your nearest Sandvik Valenite and Iscar DIRECT sales office, ALL of them! Have each of them send a Technical Rep to see you, explain the problem and arrange for a DEMO of the tooling they recommend. This will cost the owners NOTHING! But if they see the tooling work they might just spring for it. If on the other hand, they refuse to buy it ..even after seeing it work. QUIT on the spot! This is the only way to save your sanity! Good luck teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: AMAZING FEAT! Rec.Crafts.metalworking members stumped! was: Elliptical groove in round stock From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 17 Sep 1999 05:05:43 GMT -------- He did say he was making wood carving chisels. I don't think a picture is necessary for even the dimmest of the lights around here!! teenut > Do you want it parallel to the axis of the stock or around it? > Hell, why dont' you just post a drawing of what you want somewhere. > > -- > Lou Boyd ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.autos.tech Subject: Re: rec.engines newsgroup From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 17 Sep 1999 05:15:00 GMT -------- Hey, you RCMers out there with a passing but genuine interest in engines had better start voting NO or this group is going to splinter!! Don, Your criteria for having more yes than no votes is about as valid as the old "Have you stopped beating your wife yet" question. teenut Jay s wrote: > > I'll vote for one as well. > > Don Stauffer wrote: > > > While there were few negative comments on my query about OT discussion > > of engines in rec.crafts.metalworking, I still have in mind exploring > > the creation of a new newsgroup, and am putting together info on the > > procedure for creating newsgroups. If anyone has already created a > > group, I certainly would appreciate help. > > > > One benefit of a new group is that I could post the RFD about the group > > in many other newsgroups that might have people interested in engines. > > > > I see the charter of the group as a group to discuss steam and IC > > engines of any application. It would include messages on engine > > history, engine technology, new/unusual engines, questions on how they > > operate, etc. > > > > It looks like a vote must have more yes votes than no votes by at least > > 100 votes. Even if we get no no votes, do we really have 100 people in > > this group interested in engines? > > > > -- > > Don Stauffer in Minneapolis > > stauffer@gte.net > > http://home1.gte.net/stauffer/ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Milling shallow curved surfaces From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 17 Sep 1999 05:27:41 GMT -------- Ooo! Getting a bit "snippy" are we Bob? If you refer back to my post you will notice that the quote you accuse me of ascribing to you, has double "arrows". SOP in newsgroups, and it denotes that you had previously quoted it from an earlier post. Shucks even *I* knew that!! teenut Robert Bissett wrote: > Also please quote me correctly if there is a next time. > > I did not say "What on earth kind of rifle......for? Most.........inch dia." > That was part of someone else's reply. > > Bob > > --- ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: any possible problems? From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 17 Sep 1999 07:40:56 GMT -------- I have been around machine tools for far too long (40+ years) to trust to luck in any aspect of use. The biggest cause of binding/breakage in any saw blade is the failure to remove the chips you work so hard to produce. Yes I buy good wood blades. I buy the best tools of any kind. If I can't afford the best..I do without! I find that even (relatively) cheap, say Delta's own brand, do quite well on aluminum. Heck the stuff isn't near as tough as Hickory or as abrasive as plywood or particle board. I used to buy special triple cut blades, for aluminum, on my tablesaw. Then I came across an industrial user that had cut over 200,000 aluminum parts with a regular alternate top rake blade on a chop saw. The blade was still going strong..though the chop saw was plumb near wore out!! Since then I use my best grade Forrest alt. top bevel for every thing..certainly aluminum doesn't seem to hurt it one bit!! Granted the Saw is a top of the line Powermatic and I use hefty anti-vibration/bolster washers..but I use those for all cutting tasks. I think the biggest enemy of carbide blades..be it on the Table saw, a lathe or a milling machine..is vibration or lack of rigidity causing the blades to snatch and crumble the tips. I would guess that very few carbide blades/tips last long enough to get WORN out by HSMs..Myself included!! teenut Eastburn wrote: > > Teenut - > 1. lucky. > 2. skiptooth - that helps. > 3. I bet you buy a good wood blade. > 4. Some wood blades are tipped or flame hardened - another metal. > 5. some wood blades are metal blades with wood teeth... ;) > (those are the ones I use on my 14" W/extension for slicing up logs.) > ( Takes a strong blade to do some logs.) > Martin > -- > NRA LOH, NRA Life > NRA Second Amendment Task Force Charter Founder > Martin Eastburn, Barbara Eastburn > @ home on our computer oldtree@pacbell.net > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > No Martin, I regularly cut 3/8" to 1 1/2" 6061T6 alloy with my regular 6 tpi > > skip tooth woodworking blade on my wood working bandsaw! > > > > teenut > > > > Eastburn wrote: > > > > > > With a wood blade - oh .001 Al... :-) > > > > > > The blade is exchanged with a metal cutting type that is designed for the > > > type of metal and also shape (hollow....). > > > Martin ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Whats the true definition of millwright From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 17 Sep 1999 07:58:58 GMT -------- I think you hit the nail on the head there Fred. "Tool and Die Maker" is an easy catch-all term for a highly skilled metal worker. That is someone able to take a set of drawings or a sketch, make and fit together those parts, into a functioning entity. I trained as a Machine Tool Machinist/Toolmaker/Fitter/Repairer, and went on into Special Machines/Automation/Robotics/Materials handling/packaging, with periods spent in Subcontract Machining/prototype building and development...yada..yada..yada..YAWN!! So much easier to say "I am a toolmaker".. teenut fredcf@my-deja.com wrote: > That's something that has puzzled me for as long as I can remember. > My father was a "tool and die maker", but to my knowledge he never > made a tool or a die (well, he may have, but that wasn't the mainstay > of his work); he made prototype machines and assemblies for companies > who patronised his shop. I guess the title "tool and die maker" is > just easier to say than "prototype machine and/or sub-assembly > fabricator". ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Milling shallow curved surfaces From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 17 Sep 1999 08:12:35 GMT -------- Jack Erbes wrote: > Well, it good to finally find a topic where the teenut will come out of > his shell and share an opinion with the group. :>) > Touche' teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.autos.tech Subject: Re: rec.engines newsgroup From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 17 Sep 1999 13:06:02 GMT -------- "N. Nelson" wrote: > A yes vote from me! > > Don has an excellent idea/proposal here, the recent posts on engines in > r.c.m. were nothing short of fascinating, Agreed, I am sure that many RCMers with primary interests OTHER than engines found them fascinating too! I'll bet some of them even CONTRIBUTED!! >spinning off another newsgroup > would make it easier for some of us to follow these threads ... I don't follow your logic here. Why would it be any easier to follow them there, than here?? >not to mention > opening up the discussion to others who may not have been aware of the > discussion in r.c.m. or those who just aren't subscribed for what ever > reasons. > And CLOSING it to existing RCMers who don't have the time or inclination to follow yet ANOTHER Newsgroup teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 3 jaw eccentricity From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 17 Sep 1999 13:17:43 GMT -------- Standard "accuracy" on non precision 3 jaw chucks is .003" TIR. This is found to be quite adequate for purposes for which a three jaw is properly used. Keep your three jaw for those jobs and learn to use the 4 jaw where greater accuracy is required. With a bit of practice you'll be surprised how fast you can set it to a couple of tenths TIR. As an aside: If your three jaw shows a CONSISTANT inaccuracy (Same JAW, regardless of pinion used, or diameter of workpiece) then you may be able to get a far more acceptable level by machining the mounting spigot down a few thou, then re-setting the chuck to run true, according to a test piece held in the jaws. This is a sort of "poor man's Set-Tru chuck" and is perfectly acceptable and safe practice. teenut kerrad@iname.com wrote: > > Hi, > > I have a cheap(ish) chinese lathe (Xing Shen or something) which came > with a 3 jaw and a 4 jaw. It's actually not a bad lathe, and is sold > here in Melbourne (Australia) by a fairly reputable machinery dealer. > > Anyone have any idea how much eccentricity I should expect from a 3 jaw > chuck? This one's about 10 thou out of true. I was kind of expecting to > be able to chuck a piece of round bar and have it run true to within a > thou or so. All arguments about the perils of Chinese machinery aside, > am I being unreasonable? > > Tony ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Honest dimensions in steel? From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 17 Sep 1999 13:20:55 GMT -------- What you need to ask for is 1 inch x 1/8" wall DOM (Drawn Over Mandrel) MECHANICAL TUBING. teenut Chip Sylverne wrote: > > I need some steel tube that measures and honest 1" OD, .75" ID. Seems > getting the OD is easy, but ID on 3/4" tube seems to run 13/16 to 7/8". > > Anybody know where I can find what I need? Is this a special order item? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Quill runout.. how much is bad enough to be worried? From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 17 Sep 1999 13:24:49 GMT -------- The extra flutes are SPARES. The come into play automatically as the others wear down!! Kinda like shark's teeth. ;^) teenut Gary Coffman wrote: > > On Fri, 17 Sep 1999 01:02:01 GMT, rnichols@interaccess.com (Robert Nichols) wrote: > >Runout is pretty important too. Typical end mill feed rates can be on > >the order of .001" per flute, so a radial runout of that magnitude is > >enough to make a 4-flute end mill perform like a 1-flute end mill with 3 > >spare flutes that you can rotate sequentially into position when the one > >that's been doing all the work gets dull. > > I wondered what those extra flutes were for. :-) > > Gary > Gary Coffman KE4ZV | You make it |mail to ke4zv@bellsouth.net > 534 Shannon Way | We break it | > Lawrenceville, GA | Guaranteed | ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: rec.engines newsgroup From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 17 Sep 1999 15:47:53 GMT -------- Gary Coffman wrote: >That would dilute the vitality, and value, of *this* newsgroup. Beautifully put Gary!! >I'd strongly urge those > thinking of creating one to consider what may be lost *here* in the >process. Those with the new NG bit between their teeth are unlikely to consider this. But those who will stand to loose this "vitality and value" should get off their Bu..Er,... sidelines, and let their feelings be known! VOTE NO!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: rec.engines newsgroup From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 17 Sep 1999 15:52:28 GMT -------- Amazing isn't it how quickly an argument, bereft of merit, degenerates to personal attack and insults. For once, I am going to treat this with the contempt it deserves and ignore it!! teenut Gar Willis wrote: > > On Fri, 17 Sep 1999 13:06:02 GMT, Robert Bastow wrote: > > >>spinning off another newsgroup > >>would make it easier for some of us to follow these threads ... > > > >I don't follow your logic here. Why would it be any easier to follow them > >there, than here?? > > Since you've chosen to make alotta noise about this, I'll answer you. > It's simply a matter of ease of sorting. The additional newsgroup is > simply a CONVENIENCE, nuthing more. It adds no additional labor nor > excludes anyone. Just add another group to your browser's index, that's > all. It's called "hierarchy", which is a sorting method. That's ALL. > Argue the *issues* if you wanna blather about something; multiplying > hiearchy levels incessantly gives more "sorting" but past a certain > point, it looses efficiency because you have "too many levels". If your > opinion is this would suddenly be "too many levels" for YOU to handle, > then say so and vote your personal "no". Otherwise, spare us the > hysterical crap about excluding people or being a showstopper burden of > time and effort for everyone. Sheesh. > > >And CLOSING it to existing RCMers who don't have the time or inclination to > >follow yet ANOTHER Newsgroup > > This is rubbish. You've gotta be pretty lazy to call adding a clearly > distinct branch in a hierarchy as weighing on your "time or > inclination". Sheesh. I'll bet you consider sorting your socks (or your > clothing at all) a big tax on your available energy, too. Heh. > > Garfield (oh, and I vote YES, btw :) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Dead center lub From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 17 Sep 1999 16:54:04 GMT -------- I used a mixture of tallow and powdered graphite for years..and never found anything better. I learned this concoction as an apprentice. In recent years I have used a slimline live center so I haven't felt the need for a lube. However, if the occasion arose I would probably first try some moly based anti-seize compound. teenut Chuck Sherwood wrote: > > HI Folks, > I am starting to use dead centers instead of live centers, > because the bearing assemble seems to get in the way. > > What is a good lub to use for dead centers?? > > I asked a friend and he uses a small tube that says it for > center use, but I cant find anything like it in the MSC catalog. > > thanks > > chuck sherwood ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.autos.tech Subject: Re: rec.engines newsgroup From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 17 Sep 1999 21:38:07 GMT -------- If you think it is going to be "a cut above" you are dreaming! The average "redneck" that is going to subscribe to "rec.engines" is going to BURY you with "Muh '81 Chevvy don't run right since muh dawg died! Should ah git maself a new puppy?" Good luck! teenut "N. Nelson" wrote: > > In article <37E23D14.441F5D50@home.com>, Robert Bastow wrote: > > > "N. Nelson" wrote: > > > > > A yes vote from me! > > > > > > Don has an excellent idea/proposal here, the recent posts on engines in > > > r.c.m. were nothing short of fascinating, > > > > Agreed, I am sure that many RCMers with primary interests OTHER than engines > > found them fascinating too! > > yes, it seems there were no objections from rcm subscribers to the engine > threads. > > > I'll bet some of them even CONTRIBUTED!! > > It appeared to me that most if not all contributions were from rcm regulars... > > > >spinning off another newsgroup > > > would make it easier for some of us to follow these threads ... > > > > I don't follow your logic here. Why would it be any easier to follow them > > there, than here?? > > Often when I download a new batch of postings, there will be but one or > two postings in a thread that I'm following, they tend to get lost in with > other postings that I'm not following, ie: I rarely follow rcm threads > about 3 phase electric motors or rotary phase convertors (not that I have > anything against 3 phase or rotary convertors)....8^) > rec.engines does seem to be a logical organizational step towards culling > them (big ol' submarine diesel) out. > > > >not to mention > > > opening up the discussion to others who may not have been aware of the > > > discussion in r.c.m. or those who just aren't subscribed for what ever > > > reasons. > > > > > > > And CLOSING it to existing RCMers who don't have the time or inclination to > > follow yet ANOTHER Newsgroup > > If they want it bad enough they will subscribe, and besides as was > mentioned in another post in this thread, there will be a certain amount > of cross posting, though hopefully some level of sanity will prevail. > Another point I was trying to stress was that there are probably quite a > few rat contributors that don't subscribe to rcm because they are un-aware > of the engine discussions. Ideally, rec.engines will attract a level of > post a little above the often seen rec.auto.xxx post that goes something > like...."my engine runs like crap, what should I do now?" > > > > > > teenut > > Interesting discussion......look forward to other comments. > > -- > Neil Nelson > *********************************** > Send Lawyers Guns and Money, > The shit has hit the fan. WZ > *********************************** ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.autos.tech Subject: Re: rec.engines newsgroup From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 17 Sep 1999 21:39:14 GMT -------- Was that a "NO" Don? ;^) teenut Don Murray wrote: > > I found this group because I got a lathe and was looking for > information. I am new to RCM, 6 months. Learned a lot and try to give a > little back. I enjoy the discussions here about engines and other > things, such as shipping issues, 3-phase electricity, politics in SE > Asia, which do not seem at first to have anything to do with > metalworking. Wouldn't want to see this group fragment. Not interested > in another newsgroup, and don't know why you need a vote if you say you > are going to start it anyway. > > Don Murray > > Don Stauffer wrote: > > > > The response to my post about an engine newsgroup from both rec.autos.tech > > and rec.crafts.metalworking has been very positive and supportive. I have > > downloaded stuff on how to form a new newsgroup, and intend to procede. It > > will take awhile, but eventually there will be a call for a vote. I will > > post the request for the vote in this and other newsgroups, so stay tuned. > > > > -- > > Don Stauffer in Minneapolis > > stauffer@gte.net > > http://home1.gte.net/stauffer/ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Att. Model and clock makers From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 17 Sep 1999 21:42:36 GMT -------- This is Bill's Son-in-Law, Right? ;^) teenut Jerry Kenney wrote: > > Hi Group, > > Last Friday, Sept. 3, Bill Smith announced release of his third, and > newest > videotape. Bill has reached back to remember what he went through > developing the shop he has now, and has made a tape directed to > practical > ways for mechanics to make clock and other parts before they have every > tool > or machine on their wish list. This tape is invaluable to anyone just > starting to equip a shop, to anyone with a space problem, or to anyone > unable to justify the cost of an extensively equipped machine shop. > Bills > new tape is an unlocked box of tricks and secrets collected over a > lifetime > of finding a way to get any job done. > I received an advanced copy of the tape and, on second viewing, I began > to > make a list of specific items which I though were separate techniques or > subjects. These are in addition to basic turning, and can be performed > with > a conventional bench lathe such as a Myford or South Bend, or a > micro-lathe > such as the Sherline. I noted twenty ideas before I lost count (some > got > past me) as well as a few other little tricks and ideas supplementing > the > main theme of the tape. I learned several things, especially practical > shortcuts, and I am not going to give them away. > Bill Smith has placed a lot of emphasis on the use of Sherline > products. > He is not connected with the company, and I asked him why he emphasized > Sherline products. His answer is in line with the objective of the > tape: > "They are available at an affordable price." I have to say that I would > much rather have my Waltham-Nashua # 3 toolmaker's lathe (which are > almost > totally unavailable) or my 9" South Bend (good used ones now sell for > more > than the original purchase price). I was not an advocate of early > Sherline > products, but the company is continually improving its line, so I have > to > back off in the face of reality. Furthermore, Bill has included some > improvements to these lathes that can be made by their owners. Sherline > has > even adopted some of his suggestions. > Getting to specifics, Bill has shown how to make gears and pinions on a > lathe, how to do both horizontal and vertical milling on the same lathe, > making and using dividing plates for wheel cutting, the former with just > the > use of a steel tape measure! There are numerous ideas for drilling, > making, > and special grinding of drills, drilling lantern pinions, steps for > making > fly-cutters for wheels and pinions, and much valuable information about > forming, hardening, and tempering tool steel. Want to know how to use > your > lathe for a metal cutting table saw, or a filing device? It's all here, > including how to make the attachments. > There is a section of this tape on spinning metal. This is the > technique > used to make pendulum bobs, bezels, and a lot of decorative hardware on > clocks. I said I would not reveal any of Bill's secrets, but I learned > about a lubricant that will certainly improve the finish of my > spinnings; > and that's as much as I am willing to reveal. > In fairness, I have to say that this is not a tape directed to > craftsmen > with well-equipped machine shops. Having said that, I do know that even > the > most advanced workmen are likely to learn a thing or two or three from > this > video. It prompts thought and ideas extending beyond the scope of the > video. The tape is certainly directed to anyone trying to expand his > proficiency without waiting to get a fully equipped machine shop. I > wish I > had experienced the benefits of information like this forty years ago. > Bill Smith is very emphatic that he makes his tapes, and writes his > books, > in order to pass on a lifetime of experience in horology and > engineering. I > understand his motives because I share them. Here we are, two old men > trying to make our experience meaningful. (Bill is 78, and will get mad > at > me for telling.) I won't speak for myself, but Bill's information is > worth > hearing, seeing and reading. > Bill's tapes are available directly from him or through the BHI in > Great > Britain (British tapes are in VHS-PAL format). Contact him at his > e-mail > address: WRSmith2@AOL.COM or at his home page: > > http://horology.magnet.fsu.edu/wrsmith.htm > > Take the time to read his biography if you go there. I think you will > enjoy it. > Jcl > > John C. Losch > Holliston, Mass. > Web page: http://home.att.net/~jclosch/otis.htm ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What else is 1.75" x 8acme From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 17 Sep 1999 21:44:12 GMT -------- Probably none! My S&B Model A had a Vee form Thread! teenut Adrian Hodgson wrote: > > Similar to another question on the group, can anyone tell me what other > lathes spindles have the same as a Smart and Brown Sable at 1.75 inch > dia with 8 TPI thread ACME form??? > > -- > Cheers Adrian > > Return any mail to me via this link:- mailto:adrian@aphtrading.co.uk ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: SOUTH BEND ?? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 18 Sep 1999 00:30:52 GMT -------- "Gordis, Joshua" wrote: > > I have heard from some that the reason plain (bronze) bearings are superior > to ball or roller bearings is that the latter can "read out" on the part, > i.e. the infinitesimal "tick-tick" of balls traveling around ends up on the > part. > > Personally, I have come to think this explanation as a lot of BS, and that > if plain bearing were superior, than the Hardinge HLV would have them, > rather than properly preloaded tapered roller bearings. "Sometimes it is better to remain silent...!" You should have stopped after your first paragraph, because you were dead right! So far as the use of rolling bearings by the likes of Hardinge..In the first place they don't use roller bearings but preloaded, angular contact ball bearings, whose specification and tolerances put them up in the ABEC 7 region. The cost of a replacement set of such bearings is more than the new cost of the lathes that most of us use. The other factor..not to be ignored is the cost of manufacturing and assembling a properly designed, fitted and adjusted plain bearing nowadays. These are not exactly Oilite bushes y'know. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 3 jaw eccentricity From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 18 Sep 1999 00:43:45 GMT -------- That's kinda like having a busted watch. You can be sure it is dead right, twice a day!! 8^) teenut Jim Stewart wrote: > > kerrad@iname.com wrote: > > > > Hi, > > > > I have a cheap(ish) chinese lathe (Xing Shen or something) which came > > with a 3 jaw and a 4 jaw. It's actually not a bad lathe, and is sold > > here in Melbourne (Australia) by a fairly reputable machinery dealer. > > > > Anyone have any idea how much eccentricity I should expect from a 3 jaw > > chuck? This one's about 10 thou out of true. > > I also have a Chinese lathe. The runout of the 3-jaw chuck seems to > depend on how you hold your mouth when you tighten the chuck, but I've > never seen worse than .004, usually around .002-003. And once in a > while it's dead on. > > -js > > -- > > http://www.strappe.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.autos.tech Subject: Re: rec.engines newsgroup From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 18 Sep 1999 16:17:52 GMT -------- Glenn Lyford wrote: > > As you may guess, I'm not terribly enthusiastic about the idea. > And because everyone will be crossposting all the stuff anyway, > all the responses like that are going to end up _here_, too! Ug. I hadn't even considered that aspect! As you say Glenn, UGH! "Be careful what you wish for..You may GET IT"" teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.autos.tech Subject: Re: rec.engines newsgroup From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 18 Sep 1999 16:19:40 GMT -------- Simply because rec.engines, with its core of RCMers, does not yet exist. teenut "N. Nelson" wrote: > > In article <8E4526A09glyfordicinet@news.goodnet.com>, glyford@ici.net > (Glenn Lyford) wrote: > > <> > > > As you may guess, I'm not terribly enthusiastic about the idea. > > And because everyone will be crossposting all the stuff anyway, > > all the responses like that are going to end up _here_, too! Ug. > > > > But go ahead and do the RFC (request for comment) anyway, you'll > > get a lot of useful feed back, and maybe it'll prove us wrong... > > > > --Glenn > > By "_here_, too", I take that to mean r.c.m, my question is, if they > aren't showing up there now, why would they show up there in the future? > > -- > Neil Nelson > *********************************** > Send Lawyers Guns and Money, > The shit has hit the fan. WZ > *********************************** ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: J&L and freight. From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 18 Sep 1999 19:02:33 GMT -------- Gary, I live in Atlanta too (Dunwoody) Where is J & L located? I have never rec'd a catalogue from them in spite of several requests, how does their price and quality compare with MSC/ Thanks, teenut Gary Coffman wrote: So I've started > driving over to their warehouse to pick them up myself. It is quite a bit > further away than J&L (60 miles round trip versus 3), ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT-Auto Code Checkers-How & Why they work.Secrets! From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 18 Sep 1999 23:15:21 GMT -------- No Lucas electrics on a modern Jag. It's all Bosch, same as a Merc.! PS. The problem appears to have cleared itself. Maybe it coughed up the furball! teenut Corey & Tina Aikens wrote: > > the dealer. > >> > >>What's up wi' mi Big Cat? > >> > >>teenut > > > > > >Fur ball ?? > > > >-- > >Regards, > >John Stevenson > >Nottingham, England > > > NO NO > its a lucas thing... > Prince of darkness > Corey ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Cutting Aluminum w/Abrasive C/O Wheel From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 18 Sep 1999 23:27:36 GMT -------- In my sub contract machining days, I had a similar job, on an ongoing basis. (I made tens of thousands of replacement rollers for copying machines.) A chop saw with a triple grind blade is the LONG TERM answer. I don't think an abrasive blade will work to well on aluminum..so it seems a special aluminum cutting blade on your bandsaw is worth trying. Of course, you could always buy the chop saw (tax deductable?) for the shop..and then take it home when this job is finished. ;^) teenut "Matt Stawicki (APP Leader)" wrote: > > I was wondering if anyone out there has ever used one of > those Abrasive Cut-off wheels to cut Aluminum bar. > > I've got an order for 1000 pieces of some 1 1/4 dia. 6061 > Aluminum slugs (2.75 long) that will eventually get faced > and turned on each end in my chucker. The problem is that it > is taking forever to cut these slugs on my horizontal band > saw (I've got a little one, 64 1/2" blade). I've got to chop > up 25 bars and its taking almost 1.5 hrs. per bar. It takes > 1 minute 12 seconds to cut through the bar and I have to do > this 51 times per bar. > > I have thought about picking up a used chop saw (miter saw) > and putting a carbide or abrasive blade on it. The other day > I stoped in to Harbor Freight to pick up a band saw blade, > and spotted a chop saw with an abrasive blade and a built in > vise. Looked perfect for what I have to do. They had 3 > different models and the better one of the bunch was a > little over $200, which is a little more than I wanted to > spend, but I'm loosing my ass by cutting these slugs on the > band saw and this chop saw is starting to look real > attractive. > > I just don't know how well this saw / blade is going to > work. I would be great if I could cut through this bar like > you would cut through a 2x4, but I know that's a little > unrealistic. But if I could at least cut my time in half, it > would be worth it. > > If anyone out there has had any experience using one of > these blades (or even Harbor Freight's saw) and could give > me a little input, I would greatly appreceiate it. > > Thanks, > Matt ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT-Auto Code Checkers-How & Why they work.Secrets! From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 19 Sep 1999 00:24:30 GMT -------- I SAW one only last week, parked in a driveway close to here. You reminded me that I meant to go check it out. This was an OLD one! Was it Marcos 1600GT..the one with the plywood frame and fiberglass body? Seems to have survived quite well, because this must go back to the early 60's teenut PLAlbrecht wrote: Marcos > ("Who?") > > Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Jewellers Lathe on Ebay From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 19 Sep 1999 00:28:11 GMT -------- Check this out: http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=165725832 teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Cutting Aluminum w/Abrasive C/O Wheel From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 19 Sep 1999 02:06:27 GMT -------- You're kidding right?? 8^) teenut Doug Goncz wrote: > > One way to cut these slugs is to grab the bar in the chucker with the raw stock > extending away from the chuck, then part off the needed slug. Normally the bar > would go through the headstock of a lathe and you'd part off the slug, and it > would drop away freely, while the long section of bar would still be spinning. > There is only one reason not to do it the other way. If you part all the way to > the center, it'll grab. To avoid that, you just go in a little at a time and > try bending the remaining stub with the bar moving. When you have found the > depth at which you can bend the stub, the repeating cycles of tension and > compression will cause a break in the stub, and you'll be holding the bar in > your hands, while the slugs is in the chuck. > > What can go wrong: > > Wrong kind of gloves. Burr on long stock grabs gloves and yanks off your arms. > Wrong lube. Part too deep. > > The usual advice in parting off is don't use the tailstock, and stay within one > diameter of the face of the chuck. > > Sawing round stock is very inefficient. You have too few blades in contact with > the work at first, then too many, then again at cut through, too few. You lose > blades and time this way. > > If you can rotate the stock during sawing, that helps, but still it's a varying > radius of curvature. > > A single point tool doesn't care what the radius of curvature is: you always > have one point on the work. > > It's even more efficient if you can control the lathe speed to deliver constant > cutting speed to the tool. > > On the other hand, if the lathe work takes more than the quoted 1 minute 12 > seconds to complete, you just start a new bar before turnig each slug, > accomplishing two things at once. It's OK to accomplish two things at once. > It's not OK to do two things at once. > > Yours, > > Doug Goncz > Experimental Machinist ( DOT 600.260-022 ) ( A.A.S.M.E.T. ) > Replikon Research ( USA 22044-0094 ) > http://users.aol.com/DGoncz or /ReplikonVA > http://www.deja.com/profile.xp?author=dgoncz@aol.com > The mm in com is anti spam. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Maximat parts From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 19 Sep 1999 14:55:19 GMT -------- What model of Maximat is (was?? ;^) that Hoyt? I have a Super II and might be interested in the parts if you do decide to sell them. However, my best advice is to keep them. You never know..when you retire to a kinder, gentler, way of life, you might want to convert it back to manual to commune closer with the metal. 8^) teenut Hoyt McKagen wrote: > > Having converted the Maximat to CNC I have the original gearbox and lead > screw asm on hand, plus the handles and screws etc off the other axes, am > wondering what my best course of action is. Should I save it against the > day I may sell the whole combo, on possibility the new owner will convert > back? I doubt 1) I'll ever sell it and 2) anyone buying would re-convert. > OTOH, I'm a bit reluctant to break the set. Or should I seek buyer for > all this? So I'm asking my peers. Advice? > -- > > Best wishes, > > Hoyt McKagen > > Belfab CNC - http://www.freeyellow.com/members/belfab/belfab.html > Best MC Repair - http://www.freeyellow.com/members/batwings/best.html > Camping/Caving - http://www.freeyellow.com/members/batwings/caving.html > Rubber balloons kill more young kids than ALL other toys ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: painted metal bar ends? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 19 Sep 1999 15:06:49 GMT -------- Very Rough! Every shop seems to use their own. About the only common occurrence is a deep red for cold rolled mild steel..and I wouldn't rely on that for anything critical!! Ask the distributor where you got the metal, what the codes mean. teenut Bob & Marilyn Tonkins wrote: > > Adrian, > There IS a roughly standardized color coding system for indicating the > type/grade of steel, I know, but I forget what the varying colors > represent. Someone here may know and redirect you. > BobT > > Adrian Hodgson wrote: > > > > Can anyone help with this question. > > Some time ago I paid a few pounds for scap bar ends from a steel > > stockest. I just asked for some bits small enough to go in my athe for > > practice etc. > > > > The ends of the bars had paint on them, either a sort of pink or yellow. > > The question is does this indicate a type of steel and is there a common > > collor code to type of metal. > > -- > > Cheers Adrian > > > > Return any mail to me via this link:- mailto:adrian@aphtrading.co.uk ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Making lathe bigger From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 20 Sep 1999 04:49:28 GMT -------- Bob & Marilyn Tonkins wrote: > > Why is it that most lathes are set up so the centerline (C/L) is in the > center of the bed? A lathe C/L could be almost back to the rear ways > since one (usually) only cuts to the center of the piece. Not only that, > but if the C/L were set back AND the rear way was set down lower than > the front, a larger swing could be designed in the same form factor. > Just a thought. Patent pending . . . > Excellent thinking Bob..but about 150 years too late!! ;^) The spindle C/L should NOT be over the bed C/L and indeed it is not in a well designed lathe. The layout should be such the a line through the centerpoint of the inside face of the front VEE and at right angles to that face, should pass through the spindle centerline. Some where in my "reference library" I have a detailed "blueprint" with the proportions and layout of the "Ideal Lathe" The device made by Logan (Hey Scott...How come you were named after a lathe??) and a similar device. marketed IIRC by Reeves for the Myford Lathe (Was it a Rodney "Big Turn"?)were both designed to push the spindle c/l back, further over the rear shear...both in order to increase the swept area of the existing cross slide..But also to maintain that Ideal of thrust being directed in a way best handled by the front shear. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Cutting Aluminum w/Abrasive C/O Wheel From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 20 Sep 1999 05:09:40 GMT -------- Mike Graham wrote: > > On Mon, 20 Sep 1999 00:01:37 GMT, Gerald Miller wrote: > > >Candidate for a Darwin award? :-)> > > Could be done. Mike! Go wash your keyboard out with soap! However commendably lateral the thinking is behind this proposal..it is suicidale and should never have seen the light of day. I have, and continue to use the same methodology, when I need a short slug parted off, say a two foot length of 2" diameter that will not fit through the headstock. I hold the "Stub to Be" in the chuck, support the bar in the fixed steady and part it off...steadying the long end with an oiled hand...No Glove, no how, no Sir Not me Sir..Never!!!. However there is a world of deadly difference between my two feet of two inch bar, driven at 300 rev/min by a one horse motor and the twenty foot length of aluminum in an industrial sized chucker. That is a lethal accident just waiting to happen! So Doug! 10/10 for effort! 0/10 for result. Anyway, *I* know you were only kidding..Right!! 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: shear & tension calcs steel From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 20 Sep 1999 05:32:31 GMT -------- Clark Magnuson > wrote: > > > I bought a 45/70 today. It is a Handi rifle [break action]. I wanted to > > do some calculation to see if it could be loaded to .458 Win Mag like > > pressures without the gun blowing up. > > > > The hinge pin is 3/8" in diameter and the case of the > > cartridge is .5" in diameter. The force = (pressure) (area) = [50,000 > > psi][(.5)(.5)(Pi)/4] = 9817 pounds > > The shear stress = force/ area = 9817 lb/ [[(3/8)(3/8)(Pi)/4](2)]= > > 44,444 psi {the (2) comes from the fact the pin will have to shear in > > two places} You are making a seriously erronious assumption here! While I am not familiar with the detail design and lock up system of the "Handi Rifle" I can tell you thet the primary mode of failure of any break action rifle (or shotgun) is not shearing..But BENDING!! The action body will bend at the junction of the horizontal and vertical faces..This will leave the case head unsupported while under Extreme pressure..Resulting in either a primer pocket blow ou or a case head rupture. Both events are likely the last thing you will ever see!! In a bolt action it is serious enough and they are carefully designed to channel the resulting blast of white hot gasses and molten brass away rom the shooter's face. In a break action you have no such safety backups and the result will be akin to a Shaped charge going off in your face. BTW..The 458 Magnum is the LAST cartridge you want to be fooling with! It is loaded to the max. as a factory round..to try to get acceptable performance from a case that is now recognised as being too small. The factory load is severely compressed and even in a modern bolt action a great deal of "freebore" is required to keep pressures down! If you want a good single shot in a "Dangerous Game" loading..Go with a Ruger #1 ...I have seen those in up to .577 Nitro Express! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Milling shallow curved surfaces From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 20 Sep 1999 05:57:40 GMT -------- Robert Bissett wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > Ooo! > > > > Getting a bit "snippy" are we Bob? > > > > If you refer back to my post you will notice that the quote you accuse me of > > ascribing to you, has double "arrows". SOP in newsgroups, and it denotes that > > you had previously quoted it from an earlier post. > > > > Shucks even *I* knew that!! > > > > teenut > > > > Robert Bissett wrote: > > > > > Also please quote me correctly if there is a next time. > > > > > > I did not say "What on earth kind of rifle......for? Most.........inch dia." > > > That was part of someone else's reply. > > > > > > Bob > > > > > > --- > > --- > You bet I'm snippy. When I quoted the other two people both their names were shown. > You put two quotes under my name. There is no indication that one is from someone else. > Anyone not reading the previous posts could assume that you are attributing both to me. > > Get it right next time. > > And anyone who can't tell the REAR from the front has got a problem. > > Bob > --- Y'know Bob, I am a patient and reasonable person But quite frankly, I get real pissed off by people like you, who cannot have a rational discussion about something without throwing in a snide comment or insult. Quite frankly, I don't give a rats A** anymore, whether anyone thinks I ascribed the wrong dumb remark to you or not. You just lost the right to any further polite consideration from me. Now I will return to the kinder, gentler me, and pointedly ignore anything else you have to say on this or any other subject. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Help machining ball holding collet From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 21 Sep 1999 05:38:54 GMT -------- My sentiments entirely Tony..PLUS, I might add: If the collet is less than 1/2 diameter deep..it won't hold! If it is greater than 1/2 dia deep..How do you get the ball in? And once it is in...like the monkey's fist..How do you get it out?? A cylindrical recess a little deeper than 1/2 diameter will hold the sphere firm enough for any operation. Teenut tonyp wrote: > > Mark Fullerton wrote in article > < > > I would like to machine a collet that will hold a steel ball bearing. > > I am having trouble figuring out how to machine the inside of the collet > to a > > perfect sphere. > > Mark, why would you WANT to? You'd never get perfect contact over the > whole spherical surface unless you matched the radii EXACTLY. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: shear & tension calcs steel From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 21 Sep 1999 06:33:57 GMT -------- Clark, it is not physically possible to collect a Nobel prize for mathematics AND a Darwin award at the same time. You are going to have to choose!! teenut Clark Magnuson wrote: > The latch lodges between the receiver and barrel. The contact is .16 > x.61". The hinge pin is 16 degrees off the center of barrel measured > from the breech face. The shear force is then [sin (16 degrees)] 9817 lb > = 2706 lb of shear. The shear stresses = F/A = 2706/[[.16][.61]] = > 28,000 psi shear stress on latching surface of barrel. The latch itself > sees 28,000 psi of compression. > Clark ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: shear & tension calcs steel From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 21 Sep 1999 06:37:19 GMT -------- Why does that not surprise me?? ;^) Building up for the BIGGEE!! HUH! teenut Clark Magnuson wrote: > You should see my face now. I have had a lot of accidents. > Clark ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: shear & tension calcs steel From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 21 Sep 1999 16:45:22 GMT -------- In a Rolling Block action there is an arc shaped segment cut in the underside of the breech block. As the hammer falls, a matching arc shape on its upper side engages and locks the block in place. At the moment of firing there is a true metal to metal lock up making the rolling block a pretty strong action. Certainly stronger than a break action, but a bit springy for maximum accuracy and strength with modern pressures. teenut Gary Coffman wrote: > > On Tue, 21 Sep 1999 06:25:39 GMT, Clark Magnuson wrote: > >Isn't that a FALLING block? > >Clark > > No, Mike is talking about a rolling block action. The only thing > holding it shut is the tension of the hammer spring and the > inertia of the block (around the axis of rotation). Definitely not > suitable for high power cartridges, but Ok for the little .22lr > cartridge. > > Gary > Gary Coffman KE4ZV | You make it |mail to ke4zv@bellsouth.net > 534 Shannon Way | We break it | > Lawrenceville, GA | Guaranteed | ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 2 flute vs. 4 flute endmills From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 21 Sep 1999 23:56:12 GMT -------- Yes!! Glenn Lyford wrote: > Excuse me for butting in where I don't have experience, but I > believe it means that on the end of the cutter, where the two > flutes meet (aka the "point" if it were a drill, except it's > flat) one continues past the center, and the other stops short > of it, separated by a small slot used kind of like a thread > groove is, to give an easier spot to change grinding angles. > To allow (I'm assuming) one cutting edge to continue past the > center and guarantee a flat center without a pip, and this long > flute also sweeps out the metal left by the gap where the flutes > meet off center. > > Yeah, yeah, someone else will probably say it better in two lines, > but that's the basic idea, yes? > --Glenn ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Damned Drop Light From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 22 Sep 1999 00:00:23 GMT -------- Nooky!! ;^) Grady & Patty Gamble wrote: > > i understand these things > but what in the ell is a crumpet? Now, what is an "English Muffin"? I had never seen one 'til I came over to the USA teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: painted metal bar ends? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 22 Sep 1999 00:05:41 GMT -------- What is "the resistor color code"? How, on earth, do you correlate it with Mild steel, 4140, 416SS, d2 etc? And if you did..How would anyone else know? BeeCrofter wrote: > > We color code the ends to indicate the length of the bar stock so you dont have > to pull every bar to find a short one. > The resistor color code works close enough. > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT-Auto Code Checkers-How & Why they work.Secrets! From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 22 Sep 1999 00:13:08 GMT -------- Mit Hans, Knieze und Bumpsadaisy!! John Stevenson wrote: (Snip Classic prose) > Today ze spelink; tomoro ze vurld !! > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Jewellers Lathe on Ebay From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 22 Sep 1999 02:40:55 GMT -------- My understanding, on further investigation, is that these lathes were designed and used for making contact lenses!! As such, I would expect them to have a top class spindle and drive! They appear to have a swiveling carriage with x and y adjustments fitted with dial indicators. I would imagine that they have a form of hard wired NC, ball screws drives etc. I thought long and hard about getting one..I figure it would make a wonderful second op. lathe in my shop. It might even tempt me back into the realms of CNC!! But reason in all things...Having just put in a Deckel Mill, a Deckel 3D pantograph and a Christen drill grinder..even I am pushing it with SWMBO!! More of the lathes..5 I believe... are back on Ebay. This is going to be a tough week..temptationwise!! Let us have a report Bill, when you get your machine!! teenut BillDarby wrote: > > The point re the tail stock is noted but,,,,,, The fellow at the company > doing the selling says that were made in the UK and sell new for $7900 US. > He said all the lathes are fully functional and that he was sure that the > buyers would be very pleased. They have a host of spare parts (I hope I > don't need any) and the crating and shipping was $135 US I haven't seen > the lathe yet but already I wish I had bid on two of them. > > Don't know if they are any good though. Pays your dollar and takes your > chances. > > Bill Darby > > Bradford Chaucer wrote: > > > On Sun, 19 Sep 1999 13:15:31 -0400, "fred veenschoten" > > wrote: > > > > >something wrong here, must be the "republic of Georgia" not the state at > > >that price > > > > > >Robert Bastow wrote in message <37E42E7A.F6362836@home.com>... > > >>Check this out: > > >> > > >>http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=165725832 > > >> > > >>teenut > > > > So is anyone familiar with these lathes?? Are they worth > > anything?? They don't appear to have a tail stock. > > > > Bradford Chaucer > > BChaucer@ix.netcom.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: painted metal bar ends? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 22 Sep 1999 02:45:49 GMT -------- It all sounds very commendable, but the level of hired help they get stuck with in steel stockist's, would have to ask, twice a day, for directions on which end to put the paint!! teenut Chris Braid wrote: > > In article <37E81DC4.B37D9C5C@home.com>, Robert Bastow wrote: > > > What is "the resistor color code"? > > Resistors and other electronic components are marked with colored bands > which identify their value, eg a 1000 ohm resistor is banded > brown-black-orange, which is read as brown black the> orange, according to the following table: > > Colour Digit > Black 0 > Brown 1 > Red 2 > Orange 3 > Yellow 4 > Green 5 > Blue 6 > Violet 7 > Grey 8 > White 9 > > Mnemonic: Bad Boys Rape Our Young Girls But Violet Gives Willingly. > > (there's also a Politically Correct version which I can never remember, > making it pretty useless as a mnemonic). > > In addition silver and gold bands indicate the tolerance; silver = 10% and > gold = 5% respactively. > > This system could readily be adapted to identifying alloys, eg 4140 would > be coded yellow-brown-yellow-black. There'd also have to be a convention > for which direction to read it (in the resistor colour code, the tolerance > band comes after the bands that give the value). > > - Chris > > -- > -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= > Bellman's Theorem : What I tell you three times is true. > Aunt Jabossica's Theorem : It's a fact the whole world knows. > Pollyannian Paradigm : Mother Nature is nice. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Now this truck has balls! off topic From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 22 Sep 1999 04:58:48 GMT -------- ROTFLMAO!! Beats the heck out of swinging dice!! I might just get some for the back of the V12!! 8^) teenut James O'Neil wrote: > > eBay item 167642147 (Ends 09/27/99, 07:25:48 PDT) - Buggy Balls ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Help machining ball holding collet From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 22 Sep 1999 06:39:39 GMT -------- Use a spring stop. Otherwise you might have a devil of a problem getting it out again! teenut James Sehr wrote: > > I guess you need a 5c collet bored to hold a ball bearing. I have done this by > just using an emergency 5c collet and bored to size and depth just a little past > centerline of ball. Didn't have to have any sphere at all. Worked fine for me. Or > you could use 5c collet with stop. > Jim ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Now this truck has balls! off topic From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 22 Sep 1999 06:41:51 GMT -------- Funny, the image came up for me OK. Often they don't..anything on AOL comes up with an error message. teenut Jack Erbes wrote: > > James O'Neil wrote: > > > > eBay item 167642147 (Ends 09/27/99, 07:25:48 PDT) - Buggy Balls > > Too bad the guy that put it on the auction was not smart enough to > either get the link to his image right or preview it to see if it was > right before he put it on the auction. > > -- > Jack in Sonoma, CA, USA (jack@vom.com) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Can't get it in? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 22 Sep 1999 12:36:13 GMT -------- No not that Silly!! (Spit!!) It is quite normal practice to splice the belt in situ, after threading it through the machine. If you do this, wrap the skived ends with clean paper etc., to ensure thay are not cotaminated by ouil during the threading process. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Where is Delta in the grand scheme of things. From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 22 Sep 1999 20:53:35 GMT -------- I have two delta tools..bought within the last two/three years: One is a 6" slimline grinder..very pleased with it. The other is a Drill press..biggist POS ever! Made in China. Yer pays yer money.... teenut _Brad wrote: > > I refer to the quality of Delta as a whole are their tools worthy of my > money ? > > -- > _Brad > ------------------------------------------ > The world needs wannabe's > So do that brand new thing. > ------------------------------------------ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Where is Delta in the grand scheme of things. From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 22 Sep 1999 21:12:53 GMT -------- Will it float? ;^) John Stevenson wrote: > > On Wed, 22 Sep 1999 20:53:35 GMT, Robert Bastow wrote: > > >I have two delta tools..bought within the last two/three years: > > > >One is a 6" slimline grinder..very pleased with it. > > > >The other is a Drill press..biggist POS ever! Made in China. > > You obviously want that Elliott one I'm giving away for free > [ Gloat gloat gnash chuckle chortle snigger ] > > > > >Yer pays yer money.... > > > >teenut > > > >_Brad wrote: > >> > >> I refer to the quality of Delta as a whole are their tools worthy of my > >> money ? > >> > > -- > Regards, > John Stevenson > Nottingham, England ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: New kind of cutting tool ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 23 Sep 1999 14:50:13 GMT -------- It is a simple trepanning tool..commonly called a circle cutter. I inherited one from my Father!! Goes to show..There are no new inventions...just new (re)discoveries! teenut Pointeau wrote: > > I found, I think, a fabulous tool which can do large diameter with a little > drill. > Do you know this tool ? > > http://www.vaco-france.com/fr/p01.htm ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Setting Tailstock height From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 23 Sep 1999 20:38:39 GMT -------- Having read a score of people come up with as many different ways to check center alignment...Most of which WILL Work..but are takin a hammer to crack a nut...Let me now tell you the fastest and most accurate way... Put a piece of .75" to 1.0" cold rolled in your three jaw chuck. Take a skim over the o/d to true it up. Face one end and center drill it carefully. Now part off a slice about 3/8" long. Face the remaining bar end left in the chuck. Accurately measure the diameter of the "Slug" and the "Nub" (they should be the SAME. Right!!) and make a note of the dimension. Now bring up your tailstock and, with the tailstock center in the center hole, hold the centerdrilled slug up against the piece left in the chuck so that they are flat face to flat face. Now measure the diameter across the JOINT between the two. Any difference in height or sideways alignment will be apparent. The error is HALF the difference measured and the diameter of the slug originally measured. It takes longer to describe than it does to do it..it is the way I realign my centers after taper turning. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Making lathe bigger From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 23 Sep 1999 20:41:46 GMT -------- Who? The guy who wrote "Patent Pending" or the Barrack Room Lawyer that used all the bandwidth? Teenut John Flanagan wrote: > Is there a reward if we turn him in? :) > > John ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How do you shape brass? From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 24 Sep 1999 02:34:51 GMT -------- Hmmm! There is "Brass" and then there is "Brass" It is a catchall name that covers a whole slew of different copper/zinc alloys. All of them can be annealed by heating and cooling/quenching (it doesn't matter which) All of them can be hardenened by cold working..and by no other means. SOME of them work cold better than others...MUCH better..eg 70/30 "Cartridge Brass"..but just try machining it!! Nasty stringy stuff! Some machine better than others..."Leaded" brass and "Half Hard" brass for example...lots of cross-over here. Most are "Hot Short"...Hit them at red heat and they shatter! SOME are suitable for "Warm Forging"..just at or below dull red heat. Other than that...there are so many varieties and properties, you need to consult a REAL expert. Teenut..Who isn't! eberlein wrote: > > gene takae wrote: > > > > So the question is-can brass be heated > > and then shaped like steel, or does it have to be cast to it's final > > shape? > > Brass is one on the more easily shaped alloys. As other posts have > mentioned, it is easy to anneal and soften by heating to a dull red and > water quenching. > > Most firearms ammunition is made from brass sheet ("cartridge" brass) > because of the elongation properties and ease of cold working of this alloy. > > If you can't do it with brass, better try Bondo and then paint it! > > Regards, > > M. Eberlein 9/23/99 > > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Jewellers lathe on ebay From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 24 Sep 1999 03:05:18 GMT -------- Dammit!! Quit this or I am gonna hafta go buy me one, just so I won't miss anything!! teenut raffles97@my-deja.com wrote: > > Took the plunge today and bought one of the five units put back up on > ebay. Looks like a few of us are going to be fiddling and scratching our > heads when the shipments arrive. Could this be a good forum topic so > everyone can benefit from what individuals figure out? > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: micro welders From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 24 Sep 1999 03:12:15 GMT -------- My simple Lincoln 175 will crank down to that level..but I can't!! It takes a far steadier hand than I have got...or ever had! Now, if you want to drop tiny beads into tiny holes..as in welding up rust pits or extraneous stampings etc in a Mauser receiver..Me an' my 175 can do it all day long! teenut fritzmister@my-deja.com wrote: > > been trying to find a welder that can basically drop a bead of weld on the > head of a pin. anyone have any ideas who makes a welder like this. any > thoughts ?? tried a search for micro arc welder but nothing showed up. > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Share what you know. Learn what you don't. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: WTB 3C collets From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 24 Sep 1999 03:18:31 GMT -------- 3c collets are regularly offered on Ebay. So far as dealers are concerned, they seem to be more prevalent in this area than 5C. Lots of brand spanking new ones about!! I wish I could use them!! Price, for Hardinges, in the $10 to $15.00 range for brand new/old stock...$5.00 used. Maybe I should buy them all and corner the market!! ;^) teenut John Hofstad-Parkhill wrote: > > > I'm looking for a decent set of 3C collets (or as much of a set as I can > > find). > > As popular as the 9" SB is, I might think there would be more of them. So > far they've proven fairly elusive. > > MSC carries 3C rounds Lydex brand, and Dave at Meridian might have some, > never dealt with Sobel, but it sounds like he's got a little bit of > everything. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Physics, vindication, and owner's manuals. From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 24 Sep 1999 04:26:23 GMT -------- John, If you have need of an extension 9/16" drill I will happily loan you one...2MT x 12"....I KNOW WHERE YOU LIVE!! So I'm not concerned about not getting it back eventually!! 8^) Let me know. teenut John Hofstad-Parkhill wrote: > > Project #14,378). Replace shop-made pillow blocks with real pillow blocks. > As mentioned earlier, my Craftsman hacksaw made it through the 1-5/8" x 5" > steel plate, had to reverse the piece to complete the cut. > > Face milled the hacksawed ends in my meager mill/drill (smallest one you can > get) and had nothing but difficulty. Same sad song I played when I was > facing the cast iron parallel. Not particularly tough steel otherwise, > drilling and tapping went relatively easily. I even used my Supreme > Versa-Tapper II, why I didn't start tapping with it I'll never know, but I > definately finished 3/8"-16, 1" deep. The first two took me 20 minutes, the > last four took me about 90 seconds. > > Took the wobble-matic die cast pulley and removed the wobble on the lathe. > Now the scotch brite wheel and buffing wheel spin w/o all the racket, a > success, although the link-belt is flaying all over the place and I don't > know why. Let's see, link belt $5/ft, AxMan motor $25, pillow blocks > (auction lot) $1, shop time $~, Hey! wait a minute! > > Project #32,768). Spot grinder, as per TMBR. Picked up a slide table, > actually very nicely made by Master Machine Tools, KS. The table "top" is > 12" long, but the supplied lead screw provided for about 4" of travel. Lead > screw is 1/2-20", standard thread. I just happened to have some. Everything > went swimmingly until it came time to assemble. That's when I more carefully > examined the base to find the lead screw disappeared into a bore. Hmmm, > wonder how deep that bore is? What are the chances of it being deep enough > for my new lead screw? If your answer is more remote than winning the > lottery you are correct. > > I don't have any 9" drills, not 9/16" or any other size. So, in a fit of > "gotta get this done", I decided to mill a slot behind the existing bore to > stretch it out. Mounted the piece on the mill/drill and inserted a 3/8" > chinese 4-flute center cut end mill. Turns out this ground piece is cast > iron. OOOh boy. > > But wait! It seems to be cutting just fine! Time to go deeper I decided. So > I did. I stopped at .050" per pass. But the little mill/drill just cut and > cut and cut. > To make it wider, I shifted over .080" and made .100" per pass. I probably > could have been more agressive, but not much more. In any event, I was > cutting with much more ease than I'd experienced in CI ever before. > > Seems I've forgotten. While paging through the J&L catalog, wishing I'd win > the lottery, I was reminded that the maximum end mill size on my machine is > 1/2". Now I've cheated often on that regard. But it seems that there must be > a non-linear relationship between effort and diameter. While .100" per pass > may send any self respecting machine shop into bankrupcy, it's a veritable > mile on my mill/drill. > > Vee shall see on that hunk of steel. > /*-------------------------------------------------------------------------* > / > Does anybody ever even look at those tremendously annoying little > advertisement pages that pop up on those ISP web sites? I think if I did, > I'd make a mental note to NEVER buy from whomever it was. > /*------------------------------------------------------------------------*/ > Does anybody have a 7" shaper in need of a new home? > /*------------------------------------------------------------------------*/ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: question: what are those brown streaks in my steel? From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 24 Sep 1999 04:34:02 GMT -------- Have you had all your shots?? ;^) The surface looks "Marbleised"..Right? If it is just on the surface, it sounds like the aftermath of heating..probably while brazing the tips on. The surface has been fairly heavily oxidized and then cleaned up some. Nothing to worry about in this application. If it were a solid, tool steel, cutter of some kind then it would be...being indicative of surface decarburisation. teenut Rick Berchiolli wrote: > > I have a pair of shaper cutters that I recently took down to the bare > metal in preparation for repainting them. I noticed thin brown lines, > something like vericose veins, throughout the surface of the metal. Any > clue what these might be? > > Thanks, > > Rick ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.autos.tech Subject: Re: rec.engines newsgroup From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 24 Sep 1999 04:37:48 GMT -------- kingsnake wrote: > >Robert Bastow wrote: > Any misfit nut ... And your meaning is...?? teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Need Advise on Bridgeport purchase (Kind of Long) From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 24 Sep 1999 05:37:32 GMT -------- Playing "Devil's Advocate" here Assuming you can find a place to put these and eventually work on them, get them up to snuff and use them...What are you going to make with them?? They are a bit heavy for run-of-the-mill home machine shop stuff..yet too small/antiquated to hope to earn much of a living on. The Machines themselves are both good makes, spares are available..but very expensive, and it sounds like you may need a lot of them!! Bottom line, I guess is: IF they are close to FREE (and no-one else is going to pay real good money for what amounts to a couple of "Basket cases")... If you have a place for them... If you have a need/use for them... If you want to spend an AWFUL lot of time and money on them.. .....go ahead..With the right amount of TLC you could have a couple of VERY nice machines. If not...PASS!!! teenut "David Q. R. Wagoner" wrote: > > Gentlemen, > > I am seeking advise/opinions on a chance that I have to > purchase a Bridgeport Series 1 CNC machine. The machine has seen > better days, but the machine is still in working order (except it > does/did regularly blow fuses for the table drive). The machine seems > to be accurate and comes with a Hass (Hauss?) rotary controller, a > BUNCH of cutters (maybe a hundred in various stages of usage) , many > holders for the cutters, a vice or two, a coolent setup. The machine > is covered with gunk and the table is a little rusted and has been > covered with chips for 4 months from when the last guy that used it > quit. > I can also get a Clausing 15" lathe with a bed thats about 5 > or 6 feet long. This poor thing has really been "rode hard and put up > wet". Each handle on the carrage can be turned from 1/4 to 1 full turn > before the carrages or cross slides begin to move. This machine also > has sat idle for 4 to 5 months rusting, covered with chips. The lathe > still runs, has a 3 and 4 jaw chuck, a steady rest, various boring > bars, 8 or 10 quickchange tools (all carbide insert tool holders), 2 > tail stock drill chucks, dozens of various drills, coolent setup etc. > Each machine is at least 10 if not 15 years old. > > OK, now the advise, What would be the value of this kind of > equipment. I work for the company so I would get first shot at it, but > with the condition of the equipment I am having second thoughts. (I > won't mention that I have NOWHERE to put this stuff, but that doesn't > really matter does it). Anyway, rebuilding this equipment is not > impossible for me, but being out of machine tool and die work for 20 > years, it would not be as second nature as it is for many of you. So, > what do you think? I'm wondering what someone of more experience might > consider in this case. I know this is a really open question but I > really do not want to go into something like this with high hopes and > wind up with a bunch of junk on my hands. Am I absolutely insane for > considering this, or is there possibilities......??? > > Best Regards > > Dave Wagoner ======== Newsgroups: rec.autos.tech,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Engine newsgrooup progress. From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 24 Sep 1999 19:32:19 GMT -------- Start trying to take the STEAM ENGINES away from this NG and you will start WWIII ! NO SURRENDER! ta ta ta taaa V for Victory! Damn the Torpedoes I have not yet begun to fight! Praise the Lord and pass the ammunition! and all that good stuff ;^) teenut Don Stauffer wrote: > > We should probably hold off on these discussions until the call for > discussions. Sometimes folks are lothe to take the time to make the same > comment twice. These questions (on charter) are just the kind of > questions the formal process is designed to solicit. > > Now, my own personal opinion. I started out with the idea of IC engines. > However, I remember some fascinating threads on both of these newsgroups > on steam engines. So, in preparing the proposal, I am calling for > including both. However, creation of a Usenet newsgroup is a very > democratic process, and the group that responds to the call for discussion > will have their way :-) > > Bruce Simpson wrote: > > > On Thu, 23 Sep 1999 13:05:07 -0500, Jacob Langford > > wrote: > > > > >Don Stauffer wrote: > > > > > >> After suggestion of a better name, I have come up with > > >> sci.engr.engines. How does that sound? > > > > > >It sounds broad. Are you intending to include gas turbines and > > >steam engines as well, or only internal combustion? Will this > > >include motorcycles, lawnmowers, and top-fuel dragsters? > > > > I think anything that coverts fuel to motive power would qualify no? > > > > --------------------------------- > > Don't send email to me, send a Memo.to me > > http://memo.to/BruceSimpson > > Memo.to, your email firewall, stops junk email dead! > > -- > Don Stauffer in Minneapolis > stauffer@gte.net > http://home1.gte.net/stauffer/ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Where is Delta in the grand scheme of things. From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 24 Sep 1999 19:40:46 GMT -------- I have had a Unisaw and it is not in the same league as the Powermatic I now have. There are features of the Unifence that I like though, and my old Delta 12 1/4" planer is the ONLY one I have had that NEVER "snipes" Probably because it has a plain table without bed rollers. I will never part with it. I wouldn't swap my 8" Powermatic jointer for a Delta though! Horses for courses! teenut teenut PLAlbrecht wrote: > > >Their table saw's and fences - by which I'll assume you mean the great > >cabinet saw > >they make - are top of the line hobby or small industrial stuff. But there > >exists a > >whole different world of saws that industry uses that make the Delta stuff > >look like > >toys. > > I regularly use a friend's Powermatic arbor saw, and it makes Delta look like > garage shop quality. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Table to spindle clearance?? From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 24 Sep 1999 19:50:34 GMT -------- Glenn Ashmore wrote: Sounds like an excellent ROI for the average RCMer (especially if you include the nooky he gets from a grateful and worshipping girlfriend "My Hero!!") Anyway, A guy needs a hobby! I have tried them all...Fast cars..Faster Women...Slow Horses! At least my lathe never breaks a leg on the back straight! 8^) teenut > Let's see: > > Machine tools $10.000+ > Metal for vice $5 > Fly tying supplies $500 > Fly Rods $1,000 > Drift boat $3,000 > > Total Cost $14,505 > Trout caught 20 @ Avg weight 2 pounds > Average cost of fish caught $362/pound > > -- > Glenn Ashmore > > I'm building a 45' cutter in strip/composite. Watch my progress (or lack there of) > at: http://www.mindspring.com/~gashmore ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Interesting engine facts From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 24 Sep 1999 19:58:41 GMT -------- John Stevenson wrote: Was it De Gaulle who said that France was a Nation of one Religion and 365 cheeses..and the problem with Britain, was that it had 365 Religions and only one Cheese!! teenut > >Mike Eberlein 9/23/99 - Who wants to live in a world with English cooking, Italian > >engineering, German police and French laws. Oh...yeah, well, maybe English laws, > >Italian Police, French cooking, and German Engineering? Shucks, its time to go to > >bed! > > > > > > -- > Regards, > John Stevenson > Nottingham, England ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Verdigris finish on copper and brass - Help required please From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 24 Sep 1999 20:09:25 GMT -------- A year or so ago this verdigris/patina question came up on the knife-list. General consensus was that the the "non plus ultra" was...cat pee!! Of course the thread then degenerated..as these things do!!..into ways and means to get kitty to pee in a bottle! However, accepted practice is to bury the object in the kitty litter tray for a week or so!! Rather you than me! teenut Jim wrote: > > Richard Jeffery wrote: > > > > Hope someone can help - I make in wood, not metal. However, I want to give > > a verdigris finish (real, not paint) to some copper clock hands I'm working > > on. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.autos.tech Subject: Re: rec.engines newsgroup From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 24 Sep 1999 20:18:13 GMT -------- I guess you had to be there!! ;^) teenut Terry Greene wrote: > > It was a joke. Stud,... objection by misfit "nut"... Get it? :-) > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > kingsnake wrote: > > > > > >Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > > Any misfit nut ... > > > > And your meaning is...?? > > > > teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: do you use coolant? From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 24 Sep 1999 20:49:50 GMT -------- In industry, with proper systems and quality control/monitering etc., flood coolant systems are the "vicars nickers" for optimum cutting, surface finish, size control etc., etc. How ever I do NOT use any form of COOLANT in my Home Shop..cutting oils, yes..as required. Reasons: Mess..I have never been in a machine shop that didn't have either pools of coolant or piles of soggy kitty litter lying about the place! I would rather dodge hot chips than sprays of cold smelly coolant! Smell and health risk..Unless carefully monitored and upgraded, coolants turn nasty sooner or later. (Yeh I know..all except XXXXX..the one YOU use ;^) The Biggy!!! I have never yet pulled to pieces a machine tool on which water based coolant has been used without finding SEVERE damage and corrosion caused by the coolant and its byproducts of degeneration, evaporation etc. I often think that bed ways rust away faster than they wear away!! BTW.. this includes modern, sophisticated top dollar machining and turning centers..where no expense is spared in sealing eras against colant ingress. It breaks your heart..not to speak of your pocket..to have to (as a personal example) rebuild the indexing and turret lock-up system ao a one year old Cincinnati turning center where the (very expensive) face locking gear was reduced to garbage by corrosion!! Ask any Machine Tool Rebuilder..they would be out of business if people quit using water based coolant. Having said all that.. I recognise that there are certain machining ops that are difficult, if not impossible to achieve without adequate cooling as well as lubrication..surface grinding large thin, (especially stainless steel) components springs to mind. So..you pays your money and takes your choice..Me..I don't use them!! teenut karlmilwaukee@my-deja.com wrote: > > I don't currently use any coolant system on my stuff, just some cutting > fluid. Do any of you use pump coolant systems? I don't really know > anything about them. Are they worth the trouble? How much trouble are > they? It seems like coolant would go all over the place and is that bad > for the machine? > > karl > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Wanker----New Engine Type???? From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 24 Sep 1999 21:10:09 GMT -------- Odd but True.. I make a regular trip down through Southern Alabama to my Condo in Destin. On a street corner in Florala AL is a store that sells fireworks..apparently owned by a lady. Prominent is a large sign proclaiming.. "Betty's** for the best Bang in Town" **Name changed to protect the innocent !! teenut JP wrote: > > "Mabel's", (where the customers always come first) > closed yesterday...there was a sign on the door that read, "Mabel's is > closed, beat it!" > > Regards, > JP > > tony@jeffree.X.co.uk (Tony Jeffree) wrote: > > ">"On Fri, 24 Sep 1999 12:40:11 GMT, > john@engineers-com.freeserve.co.uk > ">"(John Stevenson) wrote: > ">" > ">">On 24 Sep 99 07:26:39 GMT, ud233@vtn1.victoria.tc.ca (Steve > Rayner) wrote: > ">"> > ">">> > ">">> > ">">>This whole thread is wankers! > ">"> > ">">There are a lot on this group, > ">">Pity their dad's weren't > ">" > ">"Too many people keep dogs and bark themselves, I guess... > ">" > ">" > ">"Regards, > ">"Tony > ">" > ">"Website: http://www.jeffree.u-net.com/ > ">"When replying, delete "X." from the Email address to remove > anti-SPAM measures. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Where is Delta in the grand scheme of things. From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 24 Sep 1999 23:28:00 GMT -------- I always was impressed by the General line of WW equipment. Built in Canaderrr..It is hard to find in the US now,. Had it been available it would have been my first choice when I bought my Powermatic equipment. Not that I have any complaints about the Powermatic...except the gawdawful puke mustard color they come in!! Whoever picked that color must have beeen in a world of pain!! teenut Speaking of..naw..this is a new thread!! Mike Graham wrote: > > On 24 Sep 1999 15:51:18 GMT, PLAlbrecht wrote: > > >I regularly use a friend's Powermatic arbor saw, and it makes Delta look like > >garage shop quality. Decent but not pro equipment in any case. > > > >I think Laguna is another heavy-duty work-for-a-living brand, but I haven't > >looked at one close up. I think they may be made in Europe (which could mean > >anything from Germany to the Balkans these days). > > Those of us in the know in Canada speak of Poitras in hushed, loving > tones. Awesome equipment. Wood stuff, eh? > > -- > Mike Graham, mikegraham at sprint dot ca > Caledon, Ontario, Canada (just NW of Toronto). > > Raiser of animals. Weldor of metals. Driver of off-road vehicles. > Writer of FAQs. Keeper of the faith, and all around okay guy. > > < homepage currently off-line due to change of ISP; back soon > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Machine tool colors From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 24 Sep 1999 23:38:54 GMT -------- This started when I was forcibly reminded of the nightmarish, mustard yellow/ochre color of my Powermatic equipment. I once built special manufacturing machinery for IBM and the color spec was a dusty pink! Actually looked quite good when finished. I have machines in that awful "Safety Green", "Powermatic Puke" Hammertone Silver (Yuk!!) and good old "Machinery Grey" of several different hues. My preference is for a mid, dove grey. Looks smart, shows the oil runs (so they can be wiped off silly!) and matures well. One day (Yeh, Right!!) all my machines will be rubbed down, filled, prepped and painted...?? What color would YOU choose and WHY?? teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Tool collecting vs. building stuff.... From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 24 Sep 1999 23:56:14 GMT -------- BRILLIANT!! Deserving of a Pulitzer, no less! I propose an annual Boris Beizer award for..The furtherance of understanding of the true meaning and social importance of "HSM" I hosted an informal meeting of our local "Metal Munchers" group, in my home shop, a couple of weeks ago. Great bunch of guys (Hi Rich!!) However..as I proudly demonstrated my latest aquisition (A Deckel 3D Pantograph Mill) at least two people asked "What are you going to make with it!! IMBECILES!! Showing off my latest Magnum Mauser in 505 Gibbs Caliber and explaining my plans to scratch build a "Magnum" Magnum Mauser action in 700/577 Bastow Rimless Nitro Express, I had at least three IDIOTS ask "what are you going to shoot with it"?? Will these small minded, anally retentive, folks NEVER understand?? RANT MODE OFF!! teenut teenut boris beizer wrote: > > Manifesto: > > 1. The main reason to have tools is in order to build other tools. > > 2. A secondary reason is to repair tools that you have collected. > > 3. A tertiary reason is to improve tools that you have collected. > > 4. A fourth reason is to restore tools to their previous condition after your > improvements did not work. > > 5. A fifth reason is to create anew missing parts of collected tools that are > made out of unobtainium. > > 6. In collecting and restoring tools it is essential to obtain only original > manufactured parts even if these are much more expensive and there are > perfectly serviceable equivalent, after-market parts at a fraction of the > cost. If the tool is to be used for any of the above 5 reasons, then it is > okay to use the un-official after-market part in a pinch -- but it is always > preferable to find and restore the official one when you can -- even if it > come to cutting 3/4 x 8.1 acme thread lead screws for you old Logan lathe. > > 7. It is theoretically possible to use tools for non-tool building and > restoring purposes, but this is largely speculative and hotly debated. > > 8. When tools are used for purposes such as 7 above, the more and heavier the > tools used to accomplish that purpose, the more glory there is in it. For > example. This afternoon, the elastic on my wife's favorite pair of jeans > broke. Because of the way it was manufactured, it was impossible to thread a > new elastic into the waistband. The obvious solution was to install a dozen > brass eyelets around the waistband and to provide a tie made out of a pair of > old shoelaces. I had the eyelets, but because of the huge number of drawers > full of tools, I could not find the eyelet tool or the proper hole punch. I > made a new hole punch, using both lathes and a tool-post grinder. Then I had > to make a die for the punch. Having no stock of the proper diameter, I mounted > a square piece of stock on my rotary table and used the mill to cut it to an > approximate round shape. More work on the lathe to cut the die and on the > other lathe, to cut the punch. I had to use the taper attachment both times. > Of course, there was heavy-duty work on the bench grinder to make all the form > tools that were obviously needed for this task. I admit that because I did > not have a heat-treating oven, it was not possible for me to properly > heat-treat and harden the punch, the die, or the hole cutter. I did an > admitedly half-assed job using a big torch. It is obvious that I am missing > (1) a heat-treating oven, (2) a centerless grinder, (3) a precision tool > grinder. When I finished the job, I put the new tools away in the proper > drawer and found the existing hole punch, die, and grommet punch. However, my > labors were totally vindicated because the hole punch was at least 1/64 > oversized and the die for the grommet as well as the corresponding grommet > punch were about the same amount under. The proper solution, had I been able > to truly and fully practice the religion would have been to make my own > grommets that would properly fit the existing hole punch, die, and grommet > punch. For this I would have made the appropriate four punch die -- It is > clear that I also needed, therefore, a 10 ton punch press. No doubt the shim > stock that I would have used would have been wrong, mandating a small rolling > mill suitable for brass -- and an anealing oven since one should have separate > heat-treating and anealing ovens. All these deficiencies and problems > notwithstanding, I did the best I could. > I mounted the jean's waistband on a piece of heavy steel stock - 2 x 1 x > 26 (she is a small person) and clamped the waistband to the stock using every > single small machinist's clamp that I had. First however, I had attached > (after careful milling and scraping) a right angle block at both ends so that > the jig could be placed either upright or lying down. Then, carefully > applying dykem blue on the backside of the jig, I let that dry and took the > lot over to the surface plate where I marked a horizontal line at the proper > distance, and then standing the jig on end -- first one side and then the > other, I carefully market the spacing for the grommets and then center punched > all the holes -- obviously, the fact that my height gauge is only 18" is a > serious deficiency, and I really need a 36" height gauge for this job -- I did > briefly consider making one but rejected that as being excessively > punctilious. Having marked the hole locations, I took them over to the drill > press and drilled small pilot holes (1/8) through the steel and into the > cloth. I had to move the job several times -- the fact that I did not have > that essential 24" throat radial drill press really bothered me -- another > item for the shopping list. I suppose I could have done it on a Bridgeport in > a pinch -- but my mill table has only 15" of travel so that was obviously > inadequate. I won't go into the jig I used to allign the hold punch and > grommet punch with the pilot holes because that is obvious and elementary. > The final tool was a 28" steel corkscrew with forged eyelet. That > was formed on a die of the right pitch -- which was a job because neither of > my lathes will cut screw threads of that pitch -- I obviously was missing a > gunsmith's rifling set-up which with suitable adaptation would have made > making that forming die for the corkscrew a trivial task: But I fixed that by > hobbing a pair of special change gears for the small SB lathe. It took > several tries to get the pitch just right (2.5403") so that it was possible to > thread the corkscrew through all the grommets, then snag the shoelace in the > forged eyelets and withdraw the lot to accomplish a perfectly threaded > shoelace-beltMission accomplished. > What I don't understand is why she complained about the cutting oil > that inevitably got on the jeans -- and after all my work she threw the damned > things into the garbage can -- there is no explanation of such things to > people who do not understand the purpose of tools. > > Boris > > -- > > ------------------------------------- > Boris Beizer Ph.D. Seminars and Consulting > 1232 Glenbrook Road on Software Testing and > Huntingdon Valley, PA 19006 Quality Assurance > > TEL: 215-572-5580 > FAX: 215-886-0144 > Email direct: bbeizer@sprintmail.com > Email (Forwarded): bbeizer@acm.org, bbeizer@ieee.org > Copyright 1999, Boris Beizer > ------------------------------------------ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: do you use coolant? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 25 Sep 1999 00:09:03 GMT -------- Et tu Mike? Of all people, I would have expected better!! ;^) Actually Compressed air is a fine coolant and I have used it a lot. The problem comes in the fine MIST coolants...I have WAY too much respect for my lungs than that (and I'm a two to three pack a day Camel smoker!!) My only problem with Compressed air around machines, is the use to blow down clean! Ask your local machine tool rebuilder about that Luddite-istic(???) practice!! teenut Mike Graham wrote: > What about using compressed air as a 'coolant'? I realize that you have > an Extreme Hatred of compressed air around machine tools, but I thought I'd > ask anyway. 8-) > > -- > Mike Graham, mikegraham at sprint dot ca ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: do you use coolant? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 25 Sep 1999 00:12:47 GMT -------- Hey Jon, For someone using and advocating coolant use..you sure came up with a heck of a strong endorsement for my choice NOT to!! 8^) teenut Jon Elson wrote: > > karlmilwaukee@my-deja.com wrote: > > > I don't currently use any coolant system on my stuff, just some cutting > > fluid. Do any of you use pump coolant systems? I don't really know > > anything about them. Are they worth the trouble? How much trouble are > > they? It seems like coolant would go all over the place and is that bad > > for the machine? > > I built a flood coolant system for my mill. Yes, it was a big mess. > I built some Plexiglas shields that collect the (soggy) chips, and can > make the cleanup almost as easy as dry machining. If you are going to > be removing prodigious amounts of metal, it makes a BIG difference > in accuracy, tool wear, surface finish, etc. Also, in deep pocket milling, > so much heat builds up that it can cause real problems in the workpiece > or tools. Only flood coolant can deal with that kind of heat removal. > > For light machining, it is WAY too much mess, so I only fire it up for the > heavy or long jobs. > > The biggest problem I've had is (smelly) gunk growing in the coolant, > because I don't use it often enough to aerate it. I need to get an aquarium > > pump and hook it to a timer to aerate the coolant once in a while. > There is a product called Kill-Cide 700 that keeps the coolant fresh for > months, but then I forget to replenish it, and, stinko again! > > Another problem is coolant getting under the vise and rusting the vise > bottom > and mill table. I grease the vise and table lightly before mounting it, and > > that pretty much eliminates that problem. But, I have to get all the water > out of the vise ways. I squirt LPS-1 on the ways, and run the vise jaw back > > and forth a few times, cleaning and spritzing each time to remove any > trace of water beads. This has kept the vise bed from showing any signs > of rusting, so it DOES work. > > For very light work including some deep hole drilling, you can put coolant > into a squeeze-squirt bottle, or a pump spray bottle from the grocery > store, and just give a spritz where needed. It works quite well, and > doesn't soak the whole area. Just a quick sweep with a paper towel > gets everything cleaned up. > > Jon ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Machine tool colors From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 25 Sep 1999 05:21:04 GMT -------- I must admit to a soft spot for black..especially on antique machines. In the earlier days of machine tools it was the color of choice (or dictate..like Henry Ford) It looks very smart as you say, contrasting with the shiny bits. The problem is..Like a shiny new black car..they are hell to keep clean!! Worse than white in fact as you never seem to get rid of the smears no matter how hard you polish. I think that herein lies the secret of a "succesful" machine tool color. It is more in the way it "matures" than in its initial eye appeal. I have seen machines beautifully finished, for exhibitions, in a whole variety of colors..But I have also seen the same machines five and ten years later, when the grime of a machine shop has settled into every corner. On balance, and it is but a personal preference, I think the mid greys hold up best. teenut Carl Byrns wrote: > Myself, I like a really high-gloss black. Rustoleum "Transport Black" to > be exact. It looks sharp and contrasts nicely with chrome handles and > polished steel. > > -Carl ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: plans for a metal shear From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 25 Sep 1999 05:29:10 GMT -------- Homemade 52" x 3/8" shear?? Where in Bejeezus name are you going to put it?? I hope you have some concept of the sheer size and weight of such a brute and the fact that you will set off every burgular alarm, seismic sensor and neurotic dog in a ten mile radius when that thing crashes through a plate of steel!! Just curious 8^) teenut Trexdiamond wrote: > > I was wondering if anybody has plans or pictures for a homemade shear. i am in > the design phase of building a 52 inch 3/8 capable machine ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Where is Delta in the grand scheme of things. From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 25 Sep 1999 05:40:01 GMT -------- Gross aren't they! In actual fact, come to think of it, I used to date a gal whose family harkened from Hurricane Hollow, McMinnville Tn. (Honest!!) I wouldn't be surprised at WHAT color folks from thereabouts might chose to paint things!! Shades of "Deliverance" !! (McMinnville, Tn. is the home of Powermatic!! ) PLAlbrecht wrote: > > >Not that I have any complaints about the Powermatic...except the gawdawful > >puke > >mustard color they come in!! > > > >Whoever picked that color must have beeen in a world of pain!! > > > >teenut > > And don't forget that was their SECOND attempt at "art & color." Ask Scott > Logan about the first. After they bought out "his" lathe line, they painted the > things sort of an iridiscent-beetle-wing blue-green. > > Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Interesting engine facts From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 25 Sep 1999 06:06:36 GMT -------- Dammit Pete! I got beer all over my screen!! Only problem is..I haven't HAD a beer since last night!! teenut PLAlbrecht wrote: > This Monty Python Moment is brought to you by "Kid" Cheddar and the entire cast > of "Ilchester '73," Hollywood's very first cheese Western... ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Need Advise on Bridgeport purchase (Many Thanks) From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 25 Sep 1999 06:17:25 GMT -------- I think a wise decision David. Have no fear that "someday" WILL come and it will come sooner and "better" than you ever dared imagine! Just ask anyone on this list (at least anyone that has been on the HSM gig for more than a couple of years) We have all been where you are now. Right Guys!! teenut "David Q. R. Wagoner" wrote: > the machines do seem > too far gone for someone of my (as yet) inexperience to rebuild. But, > if I keep "lurking" and reading all that I can, maybe > someday..........maybe someday! > > Best Regards > > Dave Wagoner > (Houston, Tx) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: do you use coolant? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 25 Sep 1999 06:22:16 GMT -------- I don't think ANYTHING is better than smoked salmon!! With capers and a splash of lemon, melba toast (The REAL stuff) on the side! Yum! But then I'm partial to Caviar, Kippers and "finny" Haddock too! teenut Mike Graham wrote: > > On Sat, 25 Sep 1999 00:09:03 GMT, Robert Bastow wrote: > > >lungs than that (and I'm a two to three pack a day Camel smoker!!) > > I've never had smoked camel. Is it better than smoked salmon? > > 8-) > > -- > Mike Graham, mikegraham at sprint dot ca > Caledon, Ontario, Canada (just NW of Toronto). > > Raiser of animals. Weldor of metals. Driver of off-road vehicles. > Writer of FAQs. Keeper of the faith, and all around okay guy. > > < homepage currently off-line due to change of ISP; back soon > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Interesting engine facts From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 25 Sep 1999 20:10:39 GMT -------- Actually it is a conspiracy! Pete wrote privately to John Stevenson over a year ago to ask if he could goad the Bastow into mentioning cheese! I was FRAMED!! teenut eberlein wrote: > > Pete, > > We KNOW you have been waiting/plotting/scheming for an appropriate moment to air > this!!! > > Mike Eberlein 9/25/99 > > PLAlbrecht wrote: > > > >.and the problem with Britain, was that it had 365 Religions and only > > >one Cheese!! > > > > I have to do it. > > > > No, don't do it. > > > > But I have to. > > > > Don't. > > > > I'm sorry, it's my duty. > > > > Well, all right then. > > > > ================== > > > > C: Well, eh, how about a little red Leicester. > > O: I'm, a-fraid we're fresh out of red Leicester, sir. > > C: Oh, never mind, how are you on Tilsit? > > O: I'm afraid we never have that at the end of the week, sir, we get it > > fresh on Monday. > > C: Tish tish. No matter. Well, stout yeoman, four ounces of Caerphilly, if > > you please. > > O: Ah! It's beeeen on order, sir, for two weeks. Was expecting it this > > morning. > > C: 'T's Not my lucky day, is it? Aah, Bel Paese? > > O: Sorry, sir. > > C: Red Windsor? > > O: Normally, sir, yes. Today the van broke down. > > C: Ah. Stilton? > > O: Sorry. > > C: Ementhal? Gruyere? > > O: No. > > C: Any Norweigan Jarlsburg, per chance. > > O: No. > > C: Lipta? > > O: No. > > C: Lancashire? > > O: No. > > C: White Stilton? > > O: No. > > C: Danish Brew? > > O: No. > > C: Double Goucester? > > O: No. > > C: Cheshire? > > O: No. > > C: Dorset Bluveny? > > O: No. > > C: Brie, Roquefort, Pol le Veq, Port Salut, Savoy Aire, Saint Paulin, Carrier > > de lest, Bres Bleu, Bruson? > > O: No. > > C: Camenbert, perhaps? > > O: Ah! We have Camenbert, yessir. > > C: (suprised) You do! Excellent. > > O: Yessir. It's..ah,.....it's a bit runny... > > C: Oh, I like it runny. > > O: Well,.. It's very runny, actually, sir. > > C: No matter. Fetch hither the fromage de la Belle France! Mmmwah! > > O: I...think it's a bit runnier than you'll like it, sir. > > C: I don't care how fucking runny it is. Hand it over with all speed. > > O: Oooooooooohhh........! > > C: What now? > > O: The cat's eaten it. > > C: Has he. > > O: She, sir. > > (pause) > > C: Gouda? > > O: No. > > C: Edam? > > O: No. > > C: Case Ness? > > O: No. > > C: Smoked Austrian? > > O: No. > > C: Japanese Sage Darby? > > O: No, sir. > > C: You...do *have* some cheese, don't you? > > O: (brightly) Of course, sir. It's a cheese shop, sir. We've got-- > > C: No no... don't tell me. I'm keen to guess. > > O: Fair enough. > > C: Uuuuuh, Wensleydale. > > O: Yes? > > C: Ah, well, I'll have some of that! > > O: Oh! I thought you were talking to me, sir. > > Mister Wensleydale, that's my name. > > > > (pause) > > > > C: Greek Feta? > > O: Uh, not as such. > > C: Uuh, Gorgonzola? > > O: no > > C: Parmesan, > > O: no > > C: Mozarella, > > O: no > > C: Paper Cramer, > > O: no > > C: Danish Bimbo, > > O: no > > C: Czech sheep's milk, > > O: no > > C: Venezuelan Beaver Cheese? > > O: Not *today*, sir, no. > > (pause) > > C: Aah, how about Cheddar? > > O: Well, we don't get much call for it around here, sir. > > C: Not much ca--It's the single most popular cheese in the world! > > O: Not 'round here, sir. > > C: and what IS the most popular cheese 'round hyah? > > O: 'Illchester, sir. > > C: IS it. > > O: Oh, yes, it's staggeringly popular in this manusquire. > > C: Is it. > > O: It's our number one best seller, sir! > > C: I see. Uuh...'Illchester, eh? > > O: Right, sir. > > C: All right. Okay. > > 'Have you got any?' he asked, expecting the answer 'no'. > > O: I'll have a look, sir... > > nnnnnnnnnnnnnnnno. > > C: It's not much of a cheese shop, is it? > > O: Finest in the district! > > C: (annoyed) Explain the logic underlying that conclusion, please. > > O: Well, it's so clean, sir! > > C: It's certainly uncontaminated by cheese.... > > O: (brightly) You haven't asked me about Limburger, sir. > > C: Would it be worth it? > > O: Could be.... > > C: Have you --SHUT THAT BLOODY BAZOUKI OFF! > > O: Told you sir.... > > C: (slowly) Have you got any Limburger? > > O: No. > > C: Figures. > > Predictable, really I suppose. It was an act of purest optimism to have > > posed the question in the first place. Tell me: > > O: Yessir? > > C: (deliberately) Have you in fact got any cheese here at all. > > O: Yes,sir. > > C: Really? > > (pause) > > O: No. Not really, sir. > > C: You haven't. > > O: Nosir. Not a scrap. I was deliberately wasting your time,sir. > > C: Well I'm sorry, but I'm going to have to shoot you. > > O: Right-0, sir. > > > > The customer takes out a gun and shoots the owner. > > > > C: What a *senseless* waste of human life. > > > > ==================== > > This Monty Python Moment is brought to you by "Kid" Cheddar and the entire cast > > of "Ilchester '73," Hollywood's very first cheese Western... ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: do you use coolant? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 26 Sep 1999 06:14:49 GMT -------- If that was a joke it wasn't real funny. If it wasn't a joke it was even less funny! teenut > My condolances to your family. > > Jim ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Bridgeport shipping cost? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 26 Sep 1999 06:40:08 GMT -------- I just had my "New" Deckel FP1 shipped from Silicon Valley to Atlanta GA. Rigger to Load in California.....$200.00 Freight to Atlanta................750.00 Rigger to deliver and emplace.....405.00 The FP1 is 2/3 the size of a Bridgeport and weighs 1800 lb. A lot depends on which way you are going..Shipping east-west is more expensive than west-east and north-south costs more than south to north. A smaller, lighter, Deckel GK21 3D pantograph/mill (1600 lb) cost me $700.00 from East London, Connecticut to Atlanta (HALF the mileage) by the SAME carrier. Loading up there, only cost $50.00 (by a breakdown truck)..but the delivery and emplacement here was the same $405.00. Mind you I did get 4 Club Level Baseball tickets from the Riggers..both times!! Both my loads were unpalletised, strapped down and tarped on flat bed trailers. teenut Sherm Fry wrote: > > Has anyone bought a Bridgeport type of machine and had it shipped across > county ? How much was the shipping cost? Any thoughts about shipping vs > hauling the thing with an suv and an implement trailer? > > thanks for the input > > Sherm Fry > > slicer of fingers -smasher of thumbs ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Self adjusting steady From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 26 Sep 1999 08:54:12 GMT -------- I have seen a self adjusting, travelling, three point roller steady used for turning the outside of rifle barrels. This is a hydraulic device and try as I may, I can't figure out how it works...unless there is an accumulator or pressure make-up supply. I want to make one! Any Ideas or sources? teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Are shapers dead ? - The New Synergy From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 26 Sep 1999 15:40:40 GMT -------- The first time I switched on my (new/old) Boxford shaper (after calling my wife downstairs to proudly display its newly restored shine), the ram came smoooothly forward..Ran smooothly back....And punched a six inch by four inch hole in my newly applied wallboard!! To her credit, she never said a word!! The woman is a Paragon!! teenut sunworshiper wrote: > > > I've been tempted to clear out an area and let it run free one time. > > Unfortunately, in my shop, that's not possible. > > Not a good idea..... Mine went ape on me once. > > Its getting bolted down in its new home. > > The Sun shines , people forget. > > Without the Sun none of us would be here. > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Self adjusting steady From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 26 Sep 1999 18:27:11 GMT -------- Yup! Plumb wore out my hand. No "stiffening" is required..just dampening. I do quite well with an oiled softwood wedge betwixt tool post and barrel. The tapers involved are gradual enough that periodic adjustment works fine. Howerver this is only good for light finishing, and a 3 point fixed steady is a pain-in-the-a$$ necessity when roughing. This has to be shifted and reset several times and I want rid of it!! I think I am going to scratch about with the Idea of three cylinders, cross connected with bleed orifices, and fed from a gas pressurised accumulator. Heck, I think three stiffly spring loaded fingers might even do the job, especially if they had replaceable UHMV tips. The whole thing can be self contained and quite compact I think. The device I saw, briefly had three HINGED arms, with the tool side one curving up, under the job..looking almost like a scissor type knurling tool. Thanks to all for your suggestions..More are welcome. teenut Jack Erbes wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > If the barrel was between centers the steady would only have to provide > a little extra stiffening near the cut to work well. I am sure with > your experience playing around with guns that you have experimented with > using your hand to damp out vibrations when turning barrels. > > -- > Jack in Sonoma, CA, USA (jack@vom.com) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: do you use coolant? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 26 Sep 1999 18:30:36 GMT -------- Yeh I know..I guess I was just mildly pissed because you are SO right!! The only way I know to defend the indefensible is to Attack!..That's the British Bulldog in me!! Sorry Jim. teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article <37EDBA59.A675FA41@home.com>, > Robert Bastow wrote: > > If that was a joke it wasn't real funny. > > Not meant to be a joke. Metalworkers and folks who work with > solvents, etc, have a tendency to show up heavy in the cancer > statistics. Bob, there are few enough inhabitants in rcm and > I would hate to have one fewer. As an educated person you know > the story behind this. > > Nag mode off - sorry to have brought it up. > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.autos.tech Subject: Re: rec.engines newsgroup From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 26 Sep 1999 20:43:47 GMT -------- Wot's a "Metric Nut"...Ypu mean the TIGHT ones!! teenut kingsnake wrote: > > On Fri, 24 Sep 1999 04:37:48 GMT, Robert Bastow > wrote: > > >kingsnake wrote: > > > >> >Robert Bastow wrote: > > > >> Any misfit nut ... > > > >And your meaning is...?? > > > > ...ever try to screw a metric nut onto a SAE stud? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Are shapers dead ? - The New Synergy From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 26 Sep 1999 22:27:26 GMT -------- Chuck Harris wrote: > Reminds me of the time I planed my unattached vice off my shaper's > table! > Sure am glad I was standing along side it, and not in front. It seemed > to float down to the floor in a slow downward arc, falling, falling, > falling....THUNK!... Thunk!... thunk..... > They DO! They DO! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Self adjusting steady From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 26 Sep 1999 22:37:05 GMT -------- tonyp wrote: > Now the "gearing" between the three arms _might_ be done hydraulically. The "gearing" is certainly not done mechanically! > What you'd need is a slave cylinder on each arm, each connected to its own > separate master cylinder. You then mechanically tie the three master > cylinders together, and drive them as a group with whatever you want -- > screw, air piston, deadweight, will power :) > -- DUH! Maybe I am being real dense here..But how would three masters tied together differ from just one big one? BTW. This type of steady is used on longer bed CNC lathes and other than longitudinal positioning, and "Open/close" commands there is no regulation of the jaw positions. I believe some are operated by coolant pressure...on lathes without a separate hydraulic system. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Self adjusting steady From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 26 Sep 1999 23:32:12 GMT -------- I have often used the "Free Floating Fixed Steady" on long parallel parts. often on quite large lathes (In my "other life") However, until I finish my 26" long taper turning and copy turning attachment, I am tapering my barrels by offsetting the tail stock. Sliding the "fixed steady" along the bed doesn't work in that case. My own major requirement is for damping rather than support as the barrels I turn are pretty thick (.510 and .577 caliber with a "heavy sporter" profile" The type of steady I have in mind is good for even very whippy featherweight profile. I seem to recall seeing briefly, in HSM or PIM, the tail end of a series of letters written by an individual, who built his own barrel boring, turning and rifling equipment. There was a brief reference to the use of this type of steady in one of those letters. This would be about 18 months to two years ago..just as I was starting to subscribe to these magazines. As I said, I only caught the tail end of the correspondence.But perhaps someone with the complete set could take a look and see if he covered the steady in more detail. teenut eberlein wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > > > > > I think I am going to scratch about with the Idea of three cylinders, cross > > connected with bleed orifices, and fed from a gas pressurised accumulator. > > Heck, I think three stiffly spring loaded fingers might even do the job, > > especially if they had replaceable UHMV tips. > > > > The whole thing can be self contained and quite compact I think. > > > > > > Robert, > > If you get this figured out, please post to this ng what you did. I > agree that turning tapered barrels with a fixed steady is a pain. For > turning no taper barrels, I have used a regular steady rest with good > results. I mount it between the carriage and headstock, and leave the > basenut loose so it slides freely as the carriage moves towards the > headstock. It functions like a traveling steady (which I don't have, > yet). Pretty good roughing cuts are possible with this set-up and no > chatter or bowing occurs, even on slender barrels. Unfortunately, it > doesn't work for tapered barrels. > > Mike Eberlein ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: FS Deckel FP1 From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 26 Sep 1999 23:54:25 GMT -------- It's kinda like buying a new red car isn't it! All of a sudden they are all over the place!! (This refers to the fact that, after searching for YEARS for an FP1 (at the right price!!) and having finally bought one a couple of months ago...this is the third or forth one I have seen for sale since then!! BTW The Deckel FP1 comes pretty close to being the perfect HSM milling machine. The faults/wear he lists are easy to fix or work around (DRO for example. They are an easy machine to recondition back to new condition (Parts are EXPENSIVE!! but they a virtually indestructible and a joy to work on, rescrape etc.!) I have seen hard working Deckels, in industry..forty plus years old and on their third or fourth "New Life" Tooling especially 4MT arbors, collet adaptors (4MT to 20 mm specials!!) are hard to come by and expensive. It is however, relatively easy to make a 4MT to R8 Adaptor..my own solution. Alan, does this machine have the plain milling table or the universal swiveling one? Do you also have the overarm and arbor support for the horizontal spindle? Any other tooling and accessories? (Can *I* buy those please??) ;^) You can see pics etc on Tony Griffith's page. teenut Hey Alan...I will expect my usual commission on this machine ;^) Catherine Huelsman wrote: > > For sale, Deckel FP1 toolmakers mill. Ser. No. 30698. > Horizontal and vertical spindles, No. 4 Morse taper in both. > Minimal tooling, collet holder, a couple collets, and one horizontal > arbor. Machine is setup and running at my home. This is a nice > clean machine that runs well, it does show signs of wear however. > The table feed screw is worn but usable and the power feed lever > slips out of gear. Located on the north side of Los Angeles in the > San Fernando Valley. Price is $2,000.00. Email any questions > and I'll answer the best I can. Thanks. > > Alan > alan@vitesse.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Isn't that a neat little vise. From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 27 Sep 1999 00:04:35 GMT -------- Expect to see a feeding frenzy on this item!! Normally they are pretty rare..but this is the third one on ebay in the last month!! Prices go up to the $2-300 range tho' a new one is double that at least. I want one..real handy for picky filing, dremel work, etc., not just for engraving. If you get it, do NOT drop it on your foot!! ;^) BillDarby wrote: > > Isn't that a neat little vise. > > http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=167276569 > > Reduced to ,,,, Just looking! > > Bill Darby ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Self adjusting steady From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 27 Sep 1999 01:11:32 GMT -------- The more I think about a hydraulic solution, the more I realise I am missing a fundamental operating principle that IS being used here. Think of it as a ring with three (or four) equally disposed fingers, each free to slid in and out and each impelled (inwards) by equally strong springs or equal pressure on hydraulic pistons. If you imagine the workpiece as being pushed away from center or even rotated precessively, then in the above example, while all the fingers would remain in contact, there is no resistance to the displacement of the center line. This system can accomodate changes in diameter..but cannot resist changes in the center of rotation. (Which is, after all, the primary function of a steady!!) A mechanical solution might be to have the jaws/fingers under control of a lever operated cam ring or scroll..exactly like a lever operated scroll chuck but with the "tommy bar" actuated by spring or hydraulic pressure. This would remain centered as the jaws closed..I am not sure it would work well or efficiently as the jaws were forced open. (it is usual to have the thick end of the barrel up at the headstock end) Now, The examples I have seen, (Oh how I wish I had taken better notice at the time) all had three rollers which impinged upon the workpiece in the customary 12, 4 and 8 o'clock positions BUT all three rollers were mounted on arms that pivoted (one above the other) at the REAR of the workpiece..in the 3 o'clock position if you wish. The three arms were therefore of disparate lengths. No 2, at 4 o'clock being the shortest and no 3, at 8 o,clock being the longest as it had to curve right round under the work piece. I doo not recall seeing any separate hydraulic cylinders, certainly not one per finger and no obvious sign of interconnection.... AHAH!! A crack of light methinks (or a train coming).. If the "butt ends" of the three pivoting arms are controlled by the SAME cam, cone or wedge, then their movements must always remain RELATIVE TO EACH OTHER..Exactly as in the case of scroll operation. pre-supposing that the wedge or cam has ONLY one degree of freedom of movement. Now, the three fingers are free to move IN or OUT if the diameter changes..but like the scroll chuck they cannot move INDEPENDANTLY..ie. there common center cannot be displaced. Now...And I am thinking on paper here..While the scroll chuck actuats easily in the inward direction..it does not happily work in the other..the scroll can drive the jaws..but the jaws cannot drive the scroll. Friction and relative degrees of mechanical advantage being in play here. (think of a worm and wheel) However, in our lever steady system the friction and mechanical advantages are the SAME, whether the jaws are being forced open or closed. (And now I am assuming that the Butt ends of the levers have rollers impinging on an operating wedge or cone.) Because the workpiece side of the levers is so much longer they have a powerful mechanical advantage when it comes to being forced open, conversely the will need a powerful push to translate into any useful force at the workpiece. Our (single) hydraulic cylinder can provide that force or resistance. Now it occurs to me that the arms must each have the same RATIO of mechanical advantage..but not necessarily the same physical lengths. So the actuating "side" must be a MIRROR, but not necessarily same SIZED image of the operating side! Dawn begins to break!! I am going away to scratch on paper after giving my poor aching brain a rest!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Tool collecting vs. building stuff.... From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 27 Sep 1999 03:41:37 GMT -------- The Home Shop Machinist represents, in so many ways, the epitome of the "Driven, Determined, Dreamer" It is not an avocation for the flippant or the faint hearted What other *Voluntary* endeavor can take a lifetime of such determined, single-minded dedication, simply to learn the skills and put together the means, to fulfill, what is often, a youthful dream. What other endeavor can bring such unsung rewards, sense of accomplishment and fulfillment in the "Doing" and often such a sense of loss at the "Finishing" I don't think I ever want to "Finish" what I set out to accomplish; rather I would shuffle off this Mortal Coil content in knowing the "Doing" was well done! teenut > Grant Erwin wrote ... > >OK, I couldn't resist. > > > >Phase I: build a home machine shop > > > > During this phase you collect old machine tools. You learn about > machinery > >restoration. You learn about bearings, belts, and Bridgeport moving. You > >learn about 3-phase power, and you build or buy a phase converter. You > >spend more money on tooling than you've ever spent on your wife. You build > >one shop, then move and build your "real shop". You make many things, but > >they are all for your tools. You learn to do CAD drawings, you learn about > >blueprints, you learn all about grinders and bandsaws and welders. You > >make lots of tool racks. You learn how to clean paint brushes. You finally > >grow up and learn to pick up your room. You memorize the contents of this > >email and recite them to the people who ask you, "But what do you make?" > >Phase I takes a lot longer than most people think. > > > >Phase II: make things ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Q: Centrifugal force, etc. From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 27 Sep 1999 06:10:51 GMT -------- True meanings of words are the result of common usage in every day language.. There might be a stronger argument to strike "centripetal" from the language and replace it with "centrifugal"..! "Centripetal" is after all used by an (albeit specialist educated) minority. ;^) Almost kidding!! On the other hand!! Centrifugal force is defined in my OED as that force tending to make an object fly from centre. Centripetal force being that which prevents it from so doing. In a common centrifuge (spin dryer) there appears to be manifestation of plenty of centrifugal force..but not a fat lot of centripetal!! Perhaps centrifuges should be renamed "Anti-Centripetal Force Machines" Again, (almost) Kidding!! teenut Phil Kangas wrote: > > Very good Neil! One thing I have to add though and that is > that there is no such thing as "centrifugal" force! It is > known > as "CENTRIPETAL" force. Centripetal force is center seeking > as that is how the force acts. Should this force be removed > the mass would travel in a straight line. I vote that > 'centrifugal' > be struck from all languages! Study any college level > physics > book and you will find extensive discussions on centripetal > force and absolutely nothing on 'centrifugal' force. BTW, > this > is one of my pet peeves in life! > Phil Kangas > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Virus Alert??? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 27 Sep 1999 06:13:24 GMT -------- Oh Boy!! I must have managed to download that sucker thirty years ago!! teenut Ron Moore wrote: > > Thought some might like this one. > > VIRUS ALERT!!! > > If you receive an e-mail with a subject line of "Badtimes," > delete it > immediately WITHOUT reading it. This is the most dangerous > E-mail virus yet. > It will copy all your personal information (SS #, bank > accounts, > credit cards) and post them on a semi-legal web page for > sale. > It copies all the addresses in your e-mail address list and > sends obscene > messages from you. > It changes passwords for all protected files and > applications. It will re- > write your hard drive. Not only that, but it will scramble > any disks that are > even close to your computer. > It will recalibrate your refrigerator's coolness setting so > all your ice cream > melts and your milk curdles. > It will demagnetize the strips on all your credit cards, > reprogram your ATM > access code, screw up the tracking on your VCR and use > subspace field > harmonics to scratch any CDs you try to play. > It will give your ex-boy/girlfriend (ex-husband/wife) your > new phone number. > It will mix antifreeze into your fish tank. > It will drink all your beer and leave its dirty socks on the > coffee table when > there's company coming over. > It will hide your car keys when you are late for work and > interfere with your > car radio so that you hear only static while stuck in > traffic. > It will give you nightmares about circus midgets. > It will replace your shampoo with Nair and your Nair with > Rogaine, all while > dating your current boy/girlfriend (husband/wife) behind > your back and billing > their hotel rendezvous to your Visa card. > It will seduce your grandmother. It does not matter if she > is dead, such is > the power of Badtimes. > Badtimes will give you Dutch Elm disease. > It will leave the toilet seat up and leave the hairdryer > plugged in > dangerously close to a full bathtub. > It will not only remove the forbidden tags from your > mattresses and pillows, > it will refill your skim milk with whole. > It is dangerous and terrifying to behold. It is also a > rather interesting > shade of mauve. > These are just a few signs. Be afraid. Be very, very > afraid. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: do you use coolant? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 27 Sep 1999 06:33:22 GMT -------- Joe Landau wrote: > > What do you (i.e., should I) use on a surface grinder? > Flood coolant!! In 99% of cases, flood cooling will give better results. Same applies to cylindrical and centerless grinding. (And I know I am going to get BURIED by people quoting cases where it isn't) If you are way grinding dry you might as well not bother!! That doesn't mean to say that it isn't preferred, for certain very picky jobs where light cuts reign and visibility is a major factor. Just try flood coolant on an optical projection, profile grinder and you will catch my drift! Most HSM jobs can be done dry..a lot of small hand grinders are not kitted out for flood cooling. Grinders are one class of machine where the use of coolant actually reduces damage to the machine. The slides etc., are protected against grit being WASHED down..but tend to be vulnerable to airborn grit! They also tend to have MUCH better, continuous filter systems. Hey! Nothing is SIMPLE in this business!! ;^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Homemade TIG welder WEB sites From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 27 Sep 1999 06:42:04 GMT -------- Ooops! Sorry Ladies! I am sure you a lot of other people know exactly what you are talking about Martin. But it was all so far over my head, that when I read it I felt just like I had walked into the Ladies room by mistake! ;^) Have you ever opened up an exam paper and double checked around the room to see if you were there on the right day? Cordially, teenut Eastburn wrote: > > I'll back that up - and add that my favorite RMS AMP meter was an RF (radio frequency) > Amp meter that measured antenna current 0-5A. The method seems very complex - > since the RF could be any master frequency - and the modulation could be any kind. > > The technique used was heat a non-inductive resistor - and with a thermocouple - > measure the temp. (all within a nominal vacuum). The resistor would integrate the > pulses and have nominal thermo time delay due to size. > > But in 'the olden days' calculation for strange wave forms was the norm. > > Martin > -- > NRA LOH, NRA Life > NRA Second Amendment Task Force Charter Founder > Martin Eastburn, Barbara Eastburn > @ home on our computer oldtree@pacbell.net > > Ted Edwards wrote: > > > > > >>>With sinewave the RMS Volts times Amps. will also be Watts. > > > > RMS Volts times RMS Amps is Volt-amps. Same as Watts if and only if > > Volts and Amps are in phase. > > > > > I was reluctant to the way I did, but I wanted to get dirrectly to the > > > question of "whats RMS". > > > > RMS stands for Root Mean Square. It is the square root of the mean of > > the square. It is calculated as follows: Square the values of signal > > vs. time. Integrate over one period with respect to time and divide by > > the period. Take the square root of the result. For pure sine waves > > this comes out to 0.707 x peak. > > > > Ted ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Magnetic Chuck Poles From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 27 Sep 1999 06:51:17 GMT -------- Magnetic chuck parallels don't care which way they go on the table..they still work. teenut kenneth knaell wrote: > > There was a time when I was thinking that it would have been nice if the > laminations on my fine pole chuck ran in the other direction but I can't > remember exactly what it was. > > Maybe it was this though. I saw some "Vee" blocks and other accessories > that are made to sit on a magnetic chuck. These were not self magnetized I > believe but were stacks of laminations of soft iron and brass. It appeared > that these would have to sit on the magnetic chuck with their laminations > parallel with the chuck's laminations in order to conduct any flux up to the > workpiece and cause a holding effect. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Weight of lead From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 27 Sep 1999 18:43:15 GMT -------- In my competitive skeet days, I would shoot (and reload) a MINIMUM of a case (500rds) a month just practicing. This would often double or triple if a tournament was involved. When guns are criminalised..Only criminals will have the guns! teenut ppierce wrote: > My buddy was a trap shooter and went through (never did get a count) > a lot of 12 ga rounds. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Isn't that a neat little vise. From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 27 Sep 1999 20:55:56 GMT -------- Rubbish! Go up and read my earlier post! teenut Doug Goncz wrote: > > It's a standard two jaw chuck. No way is that worth $91, which is the latest > bid. > > Yours, ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Machining a Maadi Griffin .50 rifle From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 27 Sep 1999 21:00:08 GMT -------- Please post the details here so we can all share. That's the reason for this NG. I am building large bolt actions for Express rifles in 500 Jeffery, 505 Gibbs and 577 Nitro Express. "You show me yours and I'll show you mine" ;^) teenut Dennis Danich wrote: > > I built 4 actions so far, e-mail me for details > > On Sat, 25 Sep 1999 11:50:27 GMT, filter_1@yahoo.com wrote: > > >I am considering making a .50 Maadi Griffin/Grizzly LAR rifle and was > >wondering if anybody else has tackled one and the learning curves and > >ins/outs of it. Any help would be greatly appreciated. Thanx, David ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Anybody using a Lincoln Square Wave TIG 175???? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 03:32:49 GMT -------- I too, am just learning on my 175. Blind leading the blind? Teenut CDT wrote: > > I'd be interested in corresponding with anyone using a Lincoln > Square Wave TIG 175. Nice little TIG machine!...I'm still > learning it however and could use some tips. > > thanks in advance, > > -CT > > -- > >>>Remove the X's from my email address before using<<< > > XctX@onr.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Homemade TIG welder WEB sites From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 04:30:09 GMT -------- I STILL don't know what the heck you are talking about!! But that's ok, it is not important that I understand..Just so long as you do. 8^) teenut Eastburn wrote: > > Yep - knew the room so well I was the Prof. :-) only for 11 years. > > I'm not sure when your mental compass flipped - but maybe it was the RF. > Radio Frequency Consider the A.M. (amplitude Modulated): constant carrier > freq. of say 1090 KHz or Kc's - then the mike in the hands of a '....' says - > and the carrier has impressed on the top/bottom of the wave so a > wave form is 'placed' on the carrier and rides its way to the antenna. > The carrier is the Antenna frequency - the modulation is the 'music'. > This is a very complex wave form that constantly changes - so a meter > (long before a chip was invented (or transistor)) was developed to > measure current. The current heats the (nonconductive) resistor. > (nonconductive so it will pass most of the frequencies). As this > RF and AF or RF and RF are placed on the resistor - it heats. > A thermocouple is placed on the resistor to 'detect' the current > in the form of heat to voltage transform. So now - RF to heat to voltage. > This voltage is then calibrated to match the meter movement (more resistors :)) > And then the 'french name :) ' movement rotates an angle - needle points to > xx.xx Amps. which is really yy.yy mV . > > Hope that was it. > > Martin > -- > NRA LOH, NRA Life > NRA Second Amendment Task Force Charter Founder > Martin Eastburn, Barbara Eastburn > @ home on our computer oldtree@pacbell.net > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > Ooops! Sorry Ladies! > > > > I am sure you a lot of other people know exactly what you are talking about > > Martin. > > > > But it was all so far over my head, that when I read it I felt just like I had > > walked into the Ladies room by mistake! ;^) > > > > Have you ever opened up an exam paper and double checked around the room to see > > if you were there on the right day? > > > > Cordially, > > > > teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Searching a dealer in France ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 04:38:04 GMT -------- So are we mon brave! So are we. teenut Pierre Ludovic Loriguet wrote: We are looking for all kind of > cutting tools and equipments for machine-tool. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: FOUNDRY COMPANY PRODUCES CASTINGS FROM FERROPUS AND NON-FEROUS ALLOYS tel./fax : ++0038=044-4446 From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 07:16:34 GMT -------- Large order, if you please my man..and be quick about it!! teenut PLAlbrecht wrote: > > >> Any ideas on how to get rid of this bozo? Every day I delete this > >> "message" and the next day it's back. > > > >Easy! > >Send him a large order! > > Better yet, EVERYBODY send him a large order! > > Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: WW1 Era Explosive Ordinance Disposal: Need Advice From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 12:30:20 GMT -------- Alberic, Hello, HELLO-OH! Is ther anybody ther?? If you are still alive or if you have an internet connection from the other side of the Styyx.... GET THE F**K OUT OF THAT BUILDING AND CALL 911!! NOW! Before you and more importantly, someone else gets KILLED! I say "more importantly, someone else" because, in my book, you already qualified for a Darwin Award!! It is only a question of time before you collect it! Sorry to shout...But if something you think might be a live mortar round hasn't already got your attention... teenut Alberic wrote: > > Greetings folks, > > No, I wasn't joking. I've got a 2" mortar round to deal with. > Some background: I'm a silversmith. (who incidentally happens to know a > fair bit about explosives and *modern* military ordinance.) I'm doing a > bit of consulting with a historic estate in southern CA. The owner had > become a well known local silversmith, and they're trying to turn his > mothballed shop into a historical museum. So I'm helping out by > identifying all the old tools (while quietly salivating over some of > them: the mint 1934 12" SB lathe, for example.) > (***MINT***...I don't think it's got 20 hours on it, lifetime.) > Anyway, over in the corner, I found a 2" mortar projectile. Under normal > circumstances, I'd assume it was an inert display piece. Unfortunately, > these are not normal circumstances: the guy made his money by > owning/running a munitions factory during WW1. This is clearly a sample > from the plant, and when I picked it up, it was heavy. (The body case was > made from spun steel, so it's obviously got *something* in it.) It also > has a little lead cone on the tip of it. None of the little propellors > that I'd expect to see on a live fuse, but... > Again, under normal circumstances, I couldn't imagine anybody stupid > enough to keep a live, fused mortar shell in the shop, but.... > More background: the original owner died suddenly in 1921, of a stroke, > brought on, everybody assumes, by guilt over accidentally killing his shop > assistant with a carbide cannon they were working on. This guy clearly > was comfortable enough around explosives to get sloppy. Which leads me to > wonder about this mortar shell.... > So, does anybody out there know anything about WW1 mortar shells? > How would I spot an impact fuse? (Would they even have *had* propellor > timers?)(or would the fact that it's not there mean that the little beast > has armed itself?) No, clearly I'm not going to attempt to dig into it > myself, but I don't want to call out the bomb squad if it turns out to be > a paperweight. > Any suggestions on low risk methods of determining paperweight status? > I don't really want to over react to what could turn out to be something > completely innocuous, on the other hand, I really have no ambitions to be > the *second* person who got dead because he got sloppy, especially 70 > years later. > > Also, there's a closet in the shop. In this closet there was a complete > Stanley #55 wood plane (with original cardboard box, and all the original > widgets and wooden widget holders. Box in "ok but obviously old" > condition, all others in good to very good.) Any idea on what it's worth? > > That's not the real question. Because *also* in this closet were all of > his shop chemicals. Now nearly 90 years old, some of them. The normal > silversmithing type shop chemicals I can recognize and know how to deal > with, but he also did "research" for the munitions factory out there. I > know there are some of those sorts of chemicals that get...err..touchy > with age. > Which ones do I need to watch out for? (As long as I'm calling the EOD guys...) > I know there's a promanginate of some sort or other that is *really* ugly > when old. Which one is it? > Anybody got any suggestions beyond "pull back and nuke it from orbit"?? > And yes, I'll definitely bring in qualified chemists to help, if it turns > out to be neccessary, but like all historical sites, the budget could be > accurately likened to a shoestring. I'm trying to make that determination > before just blindly saying "ahh! get chemists!". (Frankly, I'm worried > about finding the money to "properly" dispose of some of the stuff I > *know* is in there, nevermind any antique explosives.)(and you thought > simple toxics were hard/expensive to get rid of!) > > Tom, if you're reading this, the place is beautiful. *This* is the shop > I'd build if I had the time and money. Wow. I'll show you pictures at > christmas. > > I know this R.C.M isn't exactly the right newsgroup for this question, but > I couldn't think of a better one, and there's likely to be a few people > here who might know what I need. > > Thanks for any help > Brian (he who walks *very* softly when carrying antique mortar shells) > > -- > To Email me: there are no numbers of any sort in my real address. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Tool collecting vs. building stuff.... From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 12:36:01 GMT -------- Oh no! Even *I* have some pride and some limits! I draw the line at fixing toilet seats! I would spend good TOOL money on a NEW one first! teenut Kevin Pinkerton wrote: > > > > > Why, just last weekend I noticed that the plastic lever on the choke > > shaft of my string trimmer was cracked ... > > Well, early on in metal collecting phase I noticed that the little feet under > the toilet seat where breaking apart. The seat had holes drilled in it and > these feet where pressed in there. So, not being one to waste resources and > spend unecessary money, I took some delrin rod and turned a 1/2" diameter down > to make new feet! They are still there and I am very proud of them! > > Kevin ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Weight of lead From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 13:13:45 GMT -------- Mike, RANT MODE ON: It is not often you and I disagree on anything much. Please re-read your statement..ask yourself..Does having land of your own to shoot on, make you any different from a "Townie" who is a member of a Hunt Club, a Rifle Club, or for that matter a once-in-a-lifetime African Hunter? Do they have fewer rights, dreams, ambitions than you? If, as, and when the Sh*t hits the fan..Do they have any less right to survival, or to the protection of their lives and God Given Rights? I am sure you are aware, that in Canada, (I lived there for twelve years remember) you have NO RIGHT TO OWN THOSE WEAPONS!! By which I mean, that if your Government (Or the Next, or the next...) decided, for whatever reason THEY deemed necessary, to "do a Trudeau" and declare Martial Law (You remember that, don't you? Montreal, '76 IIRC) they could come and collect your guns and' (being now disarmed) put you in jail or against a wall. You don't have a SINGLE Constitutional protection against that! Sure, you can rely on the "Good Guys" staying good..Right! I'm afraid I DON"T!! History tells us OVER AND OVER AGAIN that Absolute Power Corrupts Absolutely! It May not happen in your, or my lifetime..God Forbid. But if it EVER does..It will be partly because we allowed RIGHTS to be slowly eroded and gave up the Ultimate Right and MEANS to protect ourselves and our loved ones from tyranny! Our Founding Fathers, unlike those in Canada, recognised the ultimate and absolute need for the Government to be answerable to the People. And that, bottom line, only an ARMED population had any hope of resisting an ARMED government. They SET IN STONE the inalienable RIGHT for the People of THIS Country, to KEEP and BEAR ARMS!! The wisdom of that single act has still not been recognised, fully understood, and certainly not ACCEPTED YET by a large..but shrinking section of the population it was designed to PROTECT. RANT MODE OFF!! Cordially as always, 8^) teenut Mike Graham wrote: I, however, live on a farm. I think that living on a farm offers a > certain justification for rifles, whereas I don't see the need for the > average apartment dweller to have them. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: newbie and mig welding and SHOCK From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 13:20:45 GMT -------- Mike Graham wrote: That means you can give yourself a brutal 'puncture' > burn if you're not thinking. I discovered, shortly after getting my Tig Welder, that, given a little too much argon pressure, in a nozzle, rather too small, with filler rod feeding hand a little too close, and a moment's inattention....You have a pretty close approximation to a plasma jet that can fry those thin tig gloves onto your finger tips in a split second!!! YOUCH!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: shaper operation question From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 13:48:19 GMT -------- I don't think there are any hard and fast rules David. Small shapers don't often have but one axis of "self act" (what a curious, old English term for "Power Feed") When they get expensive enough, or big enough the next one to be added is invariably the Up/Down feed on the work table. Lastly comes the tool slide, but most "Industrial Strength" shapers have all three (or even four if they have a power rotation on a universal table) So, it is obvious that shapers are intended to be fed "any which way" that gets the job done best. Certainly, I was taught to use them that way. Most of the "down cuts" you do are short, many are at an angle..as in dovetails. It that case I always use the tool slide downfeed, keeping my hand (and FULL attention!) on it. I love getting in close, usually sat on an old typist chair, sleeves and collar buttoned, safety face shield on, and with both hands and full attention on the machine. It is a time of close "Communion" with the machine and the metal, that never quite seems the same on any other machine. Part of the attraction of the shaper I believe. The crank handle stays on the cross feed, ready to apply the next cut (or for an emergency). More importantly, the work table stays locked to it's slides, with the support rod down so I know everything is still in tram. Plus, I have one less "axis zero" to worry about as the job progresses. However, if I have a longer vertical cut to make, or one that I need to know is "Dead Square" to the horizontal faces, then I will use the vertical table feed without compunction. teenut "David M. MacMillan" wrote: > > A question about operating a shaper... > > The Logan 8-inch shaper now in my shop does not have an automatic > or power downfeed. I'm wondering how one should operate the downfeed > when slotting or vertical facing? > > Should I simply run the shaper slowly, keep my hand on the downfeed > handle on top of the oscillating ram, and feed it down a little on each > stroke? > This seems potentially dangerous, though it certainly could be done with > > appropriate care and attention. > > Should I stop the shaper after each stroke, downfeed while stopped, and > then start up again? > This seems difficult; the shaper doesn't stop all at once, and one would > > have to reposition the ram by hand-crank each time. > It also causes the lights to dim each time it starts up; I'd like to > minimize this. > > In theory one could run it by hand (hand cranking), which would be quite > > safe but very laborious. > > (It is fun, though, turning the shaper over by hand crank and watching a > > chip being shaved off. Very instructive.) > > None of the sources I've checked have anything at all to say about > actually operating the downfeed. (I've checked three books from > Lindsay, > several other old shop texts, and two newer shop texts.) > > All suggestions welcome, however simple. Don't assume that I know > what I'm doing :-) > > Thanks! > David M. MacMillan > dmm@lemur.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.autos.tech Subject: Re: rec.engines newsgroup YES From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 13:55:33 GMT -------- But Tom, If you barely have time for THIS NG, how do you expect to find time for TWO?? Or, as I suspect, and wish to avoid, will YOU be one of those that SPLIT off to the new group..leaving it AND this one, all the weaker and poorer for it? teenut Tom Fenn wrote: > > I for one vote YES for a engine group. That is what the internet is all > about, providing areas where people with common interest can share > common ideas. There is room for all types of special interest groups, if > you would like to see some diversity try sex or politics. > Since joining this metal crafting group I have found a lot of good > information, however I have probably miss a lot. This is due to the > large numbers of messages that are posted on a daily bases to this > group. I limit the number of messages that I receive to 200 and just > have time to skim the subjects and may read 3 or 4. As it is I am > spending more time on the net than I can afford, I do have to make a few > dollars to support my interest in steam engines. > Regards to all, > Tom Fenn > > kingsnake wrote: > > > On Mon, 27 Sep 1999 03:43:26 GMT, see.my.sig.for.my.re@l.address > > (Bruce Simpson) wrote: > > > > >On Sun, 26 Sep 1999 19:50:32 GMT, gyrgrls@gyrogearloose.com > > >(kingsnake) wrote: > > > > > >>...ever try to screw a metric nut onto a SAE stud? > > > > > >That's nuthin a bigger wrench won't fix! > > > > Weld done, my son. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Drilling small straight hole From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 14:24:54 GMT -------- Yup! Dead on Dan! I have drilled muzzle loading, match target rifle barrels, (.452 cal x 36" long) with the same slow but sure method. The only luxury touch was to braze the "D" bit onto a tubular shank so I could get lube right down to where it was needed. I was also able to use a high speed steel cutting tip. Eventually I made a tip with brazed on carbide cutting tip and rubbing pads. 300 sfpm cutting speed and about half a thou per rev feed. The holes would come out within a couple of thou TIR and would be ready for rifling and a finish lapping..no reaming required. The only real difference between that and a REAL gun drill, is that the pro. tool has a grooved, tubular shank, down which oil is pumped at VERY high pressure and it, reurning up the groove in the shank, washed the chips out continuously. Thus there is no need to "Peck Drill"..the tool goes end to end in one push. The one VITAL consideration is that the drill be give a DEAD TRUE start..as has already been mentioned..a short starter hole is first bored true to dead size. (or a hardened starter bush is used in industrial practice) teenut Dan Bollinger wrote: > > Allan, Here's how I've drilled holes straight that where about 20-50 times > as long as the diameter. It requires making a simple, "D" drill. Get a > length of 7/32 drill rod. On one end grind a flat almost half way through > so the end-view looks like the letter D. The flat ought to be about 3/4" > long. Now grind the end with a little cutting and relief angle. The goal > here is to make a drill which only cuts on its end, and not its sides. > Using a torch, heat and quench to harden. Polish. Heat to "Straw" colored. > Start a 7/32" hole with a twist drill after making a centering hole. Use > lots of coolant/lubricant. Drill for about 1/16" and extract the bit to > clean the chips being stored on the "flat." I usually loosen the tailstock, > slide the drill out, swipe off the chips and return the bit into the hole. > With a little luck, you can drill a 6" hole that will require a caliper to > measure how off center it is. :-) > -- > > Dan Bollinger > Clay Critters > www.claycritters.com > Allan Hudson wrote in message > news:37EF4C94.D8B72F85@ultra.net.au... > > How do I drill a long straight round hole approx. 7/32 dia. Obviously a > > regular twist drill is not the answer. Runout soon becomes obvious as I > > proceed. Professionals who do rifle barrels must conquer this problem. > > Any ideas ? thanks Allan the Aussie > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.autos.tech Subject: Re: rec.engines newsgroup YES From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 14:41:22 GMT -------- Don, Whatever gave you the idea that anyone thought that engine related postings were "Off Topic" on this NG. I sure hope it wasn't me!! I Loved 'em!! Just don't know enough to make any kind of real contribution, that's all. I want them to continue..so I can learn. I am still trying to figure out how a "Delta" configuration works..but I will lose that opportunity if the next time the subject is raised, it is on a different news group! And NO! (he added, grammatically correctly!!) I won't be visiting a specialist engine NG..*I* don't have time or specific interest enough for that. BTW Putting Sci. in the name might be a grave mistake. Visit some of the Sci. type groups and you will see they are packed with Prima Donnas, PCs and flame wars that will make your hair curl. Same reason I never go to the rec.CNC machines group. Sheesh..what a bunch of Jokers they all are! Please don't take your ball home! You CAN play with it here. ;^) Cordially, teenut Don Stauffer wrote: > The vote for the new group may succeed, it may fail. However, if it fails then at > least I will no longer feel guilty posting OT engine-related posts to this group. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Drilling small straight hole From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 15:13:17 GMT -------- Sure, it can drill the hole. I'm not sure I can tell you how to get so much wander though!! ;^) Are you SURE you want it so far out? I usually find that .003 to .005 is more than sufficient! Kidding apart! If you do as suggested you should have no problems. teenut Brian Evans wrote: > > Can a D-tip drill made from drill rod, heat-treated and tempered at home, drill a > 1/4" hole 16" deep in un-hardened drill rod, with say .030" - .050" wander? > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Ball Bearings - how are they made From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 15:38:32 GMT -------- Same way that regular bearing balls are made! (You did mean the balls..not the complete bearing I presume?) High speed, cold heading machines take a wire or rod feed, chop it to length and cold forge a ball to fairly close limits of size and sphericity. Basically this is done by taking a cut slug of the right volume and "bonking" it between two hemispherical dies. Heat treatment follows..in continuous conveyor fed furnaces. Then the balls are fed in a continuous stream to a series of grinding and lapping machines. These look like the old flour grinding mills..two discs contra-rotating (or rotating at differential speeds) the balls feed in the center and sphericity is 'Generated" just as jou would form a ball of play-do by rolling it between your hands. Gauging is automatic..usually by rolling the balls alon two, slightly divergent hardened knife edges..amazing accuracy! Balls are graded for size and sent off to be assembled with similarly graded inner and outer rings on a "Selective Assembly" basis. This may be done in the building next door..or one half way around the world!! Bearings are a Multinational concern! The assembly plants run, 24/7/365 fully automated, on an almost "lights out" basis. Noisy places they are..Busy but no one about unless something needs fixing. A modern ball bearing can go through every stage of manufacture, assembly, packaging, shipping and assembly (For instance into an automobile) without being touched by human hand or seen by human eye. Inexpensive..Yes! Cheap?? These plants cost BILLIONS..but people Like SKF can ship a complete plant, in "knocked down" condition, to a green field site any place in the world and have it up and producing in a month from get-go. teenut Mark Fullerton wrote: > > Just one of those curious questions that has been bothering me. > > How are SS ball bearings manufactured? > > They are so perfectly round and so cheap. > > I was trying to visualize how it would be done and couldn't come up with a way > to do it. > > Just wondering . . . > > Mark E. Fullerton ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Drilling small straight hole From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 15:48:58 GMT -------- I would add just one thing! The "Shank" of your drill MUST be a few thou (0.005" - 0.015") less in diameter than the hole and the D bit producing it. In other words..don't make a D drill from 1/4" drill rod and expect it to drill a 1/4" hole of that depth. You must relieve the shank. Otherwise it WILL sieze up solid in short order! For a shorter hole..say up to 3-5 times diameter deep you might get away with it..But even regular jobbers drills have a back taper on them. (or SHOULD have!!) teenut teenut Robert Bastow wrote: > > Sure, it can drill the hole. > > I'm not sure I can tell you how to get so much wander though!! ;^) > > Are you SURE you want it so far out? I usually find that .003 to .005 is more > than sufficient! > > Kidding apart! If you do as suggested you should have no problems. > > teenut > > Brian Evans wrote: > > > > Can a D-tip drill made from drill rod, heat-treated and tempered at home, drill a > > 1/4" hole 16" deep in un-hardened drill rod, with say .030" - .050" wander? > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Homemade TIG welder WEB sites From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 16:03:49 GMT -------- OHMIGAWD!! You've got Gary doing it now!! Gary Coffman wrote: > > On Mon, 27 Sep 1999 21:03:14 -0700, Eastburn (Huge clip) No offense meant Gary..but you make me feel so..so..so INADEQUATE!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Hammer handles From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 16:14:12 GMT -------- Ideally the hole should have taper in BOTH directions with a goodly radius at the handle side. About 2 1/2 deg of taper per side should do it. The handle should be VERY carefuly shaped//parallel portion to clear the narrowest point and a taper fitting the underside taper in the head. It should then be sawn down 2/3 of the thickness of the head along the widest axis of the handle, and fitted with a wooden wedge, properly sized, and glued in place. Put your hammer handle in a warm dry place for a couple of days before fitting it, to get the moisture content down as low as possible. Then as humidity changes it will only tend to get tighter. I have fitted hammer shafts this way that have withstood a third of a century of hard usage with never a wobble or a metal wedge in sight!! teenut Christian Darce' wrote: > > I am looking to make something very simiar to a hammer head. > I plan on putting a hickory handle on it and attaching it with a wedge > as is normally done. > > My question is should the hole in the casting of the hammer head have a > slight taper to it in order to hold the hammer head on? Or is just a > straight hole OK? > > To reword it some, should the radius of the top of the hammer hole be > larger or smaller than the bottom of the hole where the handle enters > into the head? > > It seems it would be stronger if the top hole is larger than the bottom. > But I measured one of my hammers and it seemed the opposite. > > If there is a slight taper, about what angle should it be? I can get a > 1 degree taper mill that may do the job if that is enough. > > Thanks ahead, > Christian Darce' > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: shaper operation question From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 17:34:03 GMT -------- A shaper is at its best when taking a relatively wide, shallow cut, especially when finishing. Here are the depths of cut and feed I use on steel in ideal situations. Roughing.......0.06 to .09 deep x .005 to .010 feed Finishing......0.002 to .005 deep x .025 to .050 feed on cast iron I will aim for at least a 1/8" wide feed using a broad tool, 3/8" wide, with a fair amount of rake and shear, honed razor sharp and set DEAD flat to the work surface. Tip for seting tool face dead flat to surface... Set the tool as close as you can, by feel and by eye..get down on one knee and backlight it. Then raise the tool to about 1/8" closer to the surface than the thickness of your best honing slip. (say 1/4" away if your slip is 3/8" thick. Place a clean sheet of paper** on the work surface, under the tool, place the slip on the paper and gently press the tool edge down on the slip. Now slide the slip back and forth a few times..It will hone the edge dead parallel to the work and the 1/8" of "tilt" you used will have left just about enough of a back rake and a tiny land, to prevent dig in and chatter. ** The paper is used on cast iron because the surface MUST NOT be contaminated with oil. Even an oily thumbprint will cause the tool to skid and slip..leaving an ugly blemish in your perfectly planed surface AND a measurable high spot!! teenut kenneth knaell wrote: > > Thanks Robert, great information there. I have had an Atlas shaper that > needs alot of work before it is ready to go for quite a whle but some > day.... The problem of feeding the tool sliide occurred to me also and I > thought about putting a digital stepper motor on it and route the wires to > it in such a way as to be safe and secure. This seems like a perfect > application of a small stepper motor since one would advance the slide when > the load is off the tool although one obviously needs drag on the feed > itself. If not a stepper motor, how about a small permanent magnet gear > head motor. One would just hold a pushbutton down for a length of time > corresponding to the amount of feed needed. Only a twisted pair needed for > this. > > While we are on the subject, what size of feed steps would be appropriate > for the tool slide on a 7" shaper so maybe I can have a good gear motor on > hand when the project is reactivated? > Thanks, > ken knaell > > Robert Bastow wrote in message <37F0C7B6.AC18AB6@home.com>... > >I don't think there are any hard and fast rules David. > > > ...... > > > >teenut > > > >"David M. MacMillan" wrote: > >> > >> A question about operating a shaper... > ...... > >> > >> Thanks! > >> David M. MacMillan > >> dmm@lemur.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: headpicking From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 18:00:06 GMT -------- I surely can Hoyt! For REAL gundrilling, call the REAL gundrilling experts..Eldorado Tool. The have a Web page at < http://www.pcc-spd.com/eldorado.html > I am not trying to duck the question, but there are too many variables to even guess at speeds and feeds..but these people are the cat's meow in this field. Teenut Hoyt McKagen wrote: > Obviously this means gun drilling. I hope Robert Bastow will be kind > enough to make specific suggestions about those holes in feeds/speeds, > coolant supply, starting holes, and everything else germaine. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Machining a Maadi Griffin .50 rifle From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 18:12:10 GMT -------- Julian S Hatcher ("Hatcher's Notebook") did a whole series of tests which involved sitting in the middle of a large, placid lake and firing bursts of 30 cal machine gun fire from a gun whose barrel was plumbed dead vertical. Objective: to observe and quantify the fall of bullets fired vertically. Observations: Although they started out with overhead protection, it was soon discarded. Although the tests were carried out over an extended period (US Army tests) they were rarely able to detect the fall of even a single bullet into the lake surrounding them!! Those that they were able to recover came down at low velocity..barely fast enough to break the skin and...most often...base first! Conclusions: The chances of being hit on the head, by a projectile fired vertically upwards are slim to zip!! Leastways when that projectile is a high velocity bullet. I wouldn't want to take bets on a low velocity cannon ball though! ;^) teenut Bruce Simpson wrote: > We never stopped to think that it could come down on our heads -- ah.. > the folly of youth. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Ball Bearings - how are they made From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 18:18:10 GMT -------- Not since I started using Exlax!! ;^) In any case GH Thomas and Tubal Cain (Yeh! the REAL one) beat me to the kind of book I would have liked to write...by a LOOOONG ways! teenut Robert Swinney wrote: > > T-nut, > Thanx for a very informative post! I always sort of wondered about that > one, myself. I do think there may be a book in you somewhere - ever thought > of it? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: WW1 Era Explosive Ordinance Disposal: Need Advice From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 18:25:06 GMT -------- GAWD!! Not the ATF! Those crazies will either shoot you or blow themselves up! Call the local Bomb Squad. You DO have one don't you? Try Yellow pages! 911?? teenut gstuff wrote: > > Do not play with this stuff call local bomb squad or the ATF > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Ball Bearings - how are they made From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 20:02:51 GMT -------- That's the easy bit! Again, it is a fully automated assembly, Rows and rows of machines each with large hoppers full of balls...In all my years of automated orientation, feeding and assembly of thousands of different parts, I have never found one that is as difficult to bulk feed as steel balls. Sounds silly, but until they are all in a row, in a track or tube the little buggers will jam up at the slightest provocation. The recent thread on lead shot and different packing matrices made me smile..and cringe. If you don't believe me, get a large funnel, fill it half full of balls and see how fast you can shake them out of the end. Truth is..you can't! Regardless of the size of hole in the bottom! They will flow until they form a bee hive shaped cavity..actually an eliptical cross section..and there they will stay..locked and no amout of shaking or poking will shift them!! Any hoo! Moving right along..The balls are dumped into the assembly machines in carefully graded lots..maybe five or ten different size gradations each demanding its own machine. Inner rings and outer rings, similarly graded are fed in on overhead tracks...thousands of feet of track in a plant..all jingling and jangling like a cross between the background noise in a Vegas Casino, amplified a thousand times and fed into the Musak at Disney's "Its a Small, Small World" Without ear protection you would go stark, staring, bonkers in an hour!! As an aside..Because of their expertise in track conveyor systems, SKF are one of the world leaders in this type of prefab. automation tracking systems!! The inner rings and outer rings are fed into stations on a continuous motion, vertical axis, turret type assembly machine. The rings are held to one side while the quota of balls is dropped in and then a "Spider" pops up from underneath, separating and centralising the rings and balls while the two sides of the cage are inserted and either riveted, clipped, glued or spot welded together. Some types have the cage injection moulded in place, some, newer types, have a one sided plastic cage that simply clips over the balls. (Though getting them to the right place, at the right time, right side up, was one of my nightmare applications. The little suckers were more "Hooky" than a fishermans hat and clung together like a ball of spiderlings!) This all taking place at speeds up to 120 completed bearings per minute, per machine!! (And you wonder why I quit the automation business!!!) MAD I tell you, MAAAADDD!! On some high capacity bearings (large number of balls) the inner and outer rings have to be sprung out of round by a precise amount to get the last few balls in. Others have loading slots cut in the outer and sometimes the inner rings..of precise depth that they don't interfere with the track of the balls in service. As I said...Thats the easy bit! teenut DanD wrote: > > Great description of the balls - now, for thoes of us out here, what > about getting those balls in between the two races? Dan ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: permanent molds From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 20:33:17 GMT -------- "Permanent" molds are usually made out of metal and called dies. I think what you have in mind, is, or was, called "Shell Moulding" It is a kinda cross between green sand moulding and investment moulding. Patterns are invariably match plate type and made of metal. The process consists of pre-heating the matchplate and its mold half, and riddling over it a thin layer of sand mixed with resinous binders..most of them of a proprietary nature. The sand mix softens and sags over the patern as it is then passed through a (Very) hot oven. By the time the plates emerge the sand has set sollid, hard as a rock! The outside has a kind of amorphous shape to it..but the inside has a very precise and smooth impression of the split pattern. The color of the sand has changed from "Sand" color to a curious, puky, greenish, brownish, orange in the baking process. As the cured molds 9 now called "shells" emerge from the oven (usually a continuous, automated rotary kiln) the shells are poped off the patern, mated with upper or lower halves, fastened together with spring clips and conveyed straight in, while hot to a continuous casting machine. As they cool to a dull red...Having been filled with molten steel, stainless steel, nickel, monel, iron, meehanite, bronze or whatever, they are dropped onto a shaker screen where the mould is broken up and separated from the still hot castings. The sand could NOT be recycled but was ground up and mixed with the regular foundry floor sand. I suppose you could do this process at home..if you could get the resins or formula. Not in the domestic oven though..at least not in mine!! The stench is appalling! I don't know what the operating temperature is..I do know that every steel mould that came back to us for repair had been heated well over the blue temper level..so 500 deg plus I would imagine. teenut Allan Adler wrote: > > If permanent molds really can't be made without an oven, I'm willing > to consider building or acquiring one. For a small mold, can one > use a kitchen oven, microwave or toaster oven to produce a permanent > mold suitable for casting aluminum? If you use your kitchen oven > for this, can you ever use it for food again? What temperatures > does one have to achieve to bake a mold? > > If I really can't produce a permanent mold, I'll just do it the way > Gingery says, but I would at least like to think this alternative > through first. > > Allan Adler > ara@altdorf.ai.mit.edu > > **************************************************************************** > * * > * Disclaimer: I am a guest and *not* a member of the MIT Artificial * > * Intelligence Lab. My actions and comments do not reflect * > * in any way on MIT. Morever, I am nowhere near the Boston * > * metropolitan area. * > * * > **************************************************************************** ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: WW1 Era Explosive Ordinance Disposal: Need Advice From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 20:44:44 GMT -------- Alberic wrote: Bombs are like guns...Always loaded until PROVEN otherwise. I don't care what "other considerations" are involved..Call it in!! ...before some one, with more common sense and concern for their fellow citizens puts a tracer on you and calls it in over your head. OR!! somebody gets killed or maimed while you dither!! If that happens, I for one, will see you rot in jail for the rest of your life. So, Mr "Bomb Curator"...you are either pulling our tassles over this..or you are serious. I hope it is the former!! Because if you ARE serious..IT is serious...and I for one am about to get REAL serious and DO something about it!! teenut..Who has never been known to suffer fools gladly! > No, there's absolutely no chance I'd ever mess with the thing myself, > beyond sandbagging it where it sits. I know enough to know that I *don't* > know enough to try to defuse the beast if it really is live and loaded. > The question is how to make *that* determination, remotely. There are > unfortunately, other considerations that make me want to have some firm > backstop before calling in EOD. > > Thanks for the comments > Brian > > -- > To Email me: there are no numbers of any sort in my real address. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: WW1 Era Explosive Ordinance Disposal: Need Advice From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 20:49:19 GMT -------- Is this guy for real!!! He certainly lied about having any explosives expertise! Kids (and adults) have taken live munitions and kicked and hammered them around..in some cases for YEARS before they were killed by them. I have done pleading with this Bozo! teenut > Nah, I'm still here. > We found the thing by way of knocking over a stack of books, and guess > what came bumping out on the floor? (along with my heart) If it was > shock sensitive, I'd already be gone. (and it's currently living behind a > pile of books and sandbags until we decide what to do with it.) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: shaper operation question From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 21:03:18 GMT -------- Felice Luftschein & Nicholas Carter wrote: > You can even cut tee slots with a shaper, but I haven't done that yet. I have..and the first coupla times rank along with your first quadruple bypass so far as stress levels are concerned. Two ways to do it.. I. lock the clapper box so the "Elling" tool (Thats its name..honest!)..can't lift and jam. That, I tried once, briefly...way too stressful for me, it seems like a disaster waiting to happen! 2. Put a "lifter" behind the tool. It can be a hinged flap..I used an old cupboard hinge once. Or, as I now do, use a strip of spring steel shimstock clamped behind the tool. The idea is that on the cut stroke, the hinge or shim lifts up over the workpiece. Then, at the end of the slot (DO allow enough space at the end of the stroke for this) it flips down behind the tool and lifts it clear of the top surface of the job. Works like a charm..put it on power feed and go for a cuppa kind of stuff..once you get used to it!! teenut (teeslot???) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: headpicking From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 21:06:28 GMT -------- It has in the past..but wouldn't for me this time. I assumed they were "Down". Try a search on "gundrilling" There are a couple of others..Thompson IIRC and, again if IRC Pacific Tool?? teenut Hoyt McKagen wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > The have a Web page at < http://www.pcc-spd.com/eldorado.html > > > Does not compute ... Is the URL correct? > > Best wishes, > > Hoyt McKagen > > Belfab CNC - http://www.freeyellow.com/members/belfab/belfab.html > Best MC Repair - http://www.freeyellow.com/members/batwings/best.html > Camping/Caving - http://www.freeyellow.com/members/batwings/caving.html > Vaccinations kill or injure more kids than the diseases do. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: French?? on Sword From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 21:09:54 GMT -------- French it ain't Maybe Spanish for "Special catch price for Tourist"?? teenut Eddy Wells wrote: > > "CONCORDIA RES JOURUOE CES CANT" > > What language is this and what does it mean?? > It's on the blade of an old sword. > > Eddy Wells > Conroe,Tx. > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: French?? on Sword From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 21:11:34 GMT -------- Will you QUIT doin' that Albrecht!! That's TWICE this week I got snot and coffee all over!! PLAlbrecht wrote: > > >What language is this and what does it mean?? > >It's on the blade of an old sword. > > > > > > This end toward enemy? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: WW1 Era Explosive Ordinance Disposal: Need Advice From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 21:18:27 GMT -------- THREE TIMES THIS WEEK PETE!! Enough already!! PLAlbrecht wrote: > > If you guys are done (rightfully) scaring the bejeesus out of this guy, would > somebody please find out where this virgin South Bend is located? It might > survive the blast, and at that point I can probably get a better price for it > from the strange-sounding owners/heirs. > > It sounds like it's in my area. I think I'll watch the news tonight to find out > just exactly where... > > Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: WW1 Era Explosive Ordinance Disposal: Need Advice From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 28 Sep 1999 22:29:01 GMT -------- I figure track it down BEFORE the bang..how many Mint Southbends does it take!! teenut Bob Chilcoat wrote: > > PLAlbrecht wrote: > > > > If you guys are done (rightfully) scaring the bejeesus out of this guy, would > > somebody please find out where this virgin South Bend is located? It might > > survive the blast, and at that point I can probably get a better price for it > > from the strange-sounding owners/heirs. > > > > It sounds like it's in my area. I think I'll watch the news tonight to find out > > just exactly where... > > > > Pete > > If it's close, just listen for the BOOM. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Homemade TIG welder WEB sites From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 29 Sep 1999 18:45:09 GMT -------- Y'all just tryin' ter confusticate this 'ole country boy now? I had just got used to the idea that electricity was smoke and it worked fine 'til you let the smoke out!! It might seem strange to some of our readers, that I could spend a lifetime (almost) around the mechanical/electrical world and appear clueless about how electricity works. Especially as a lot of that time was spent in the CNC Machine tool development field and Industrial Automation/Robotics. Truth is, I always found it sufficient to know what electricty could DO and left the worrying about HOW to the "Experts" It always seemed when I asked an "expert" I finished up more confused...and if I asked two "experts" they would finish up not speaking to each other for weeks!! Consequently...I didn't ask many "experts" I think this experience has been born out here on the NG! Please don't take this to mean that I think all OUR "experts" are "Drips under Pressure" ;^) It is increasingly obvious that the workings of the invisible forces of electricity have to be mentally visualised, even by "experts". Obviously they are successful in doing this..But when it comes to explaining it in layman's language, or even to another "expert" we get a massive breakdown in communications. I am lucky, my chosen field of expertise is solid, tangible, moves only in three non-mysterious ways (planes) and as such, much easier to describe in layman's terms. But please, all you "Expert Sparkies" out there..you have been very patient with me, I have learned more in the last three months than the previous thirty years, and I beseech you not to quit on me just yet. teenut Grif wrote: > > Robert,,, don't lettem fool you,,, electricity is just really thin, > lightweight oil in a springie rubber pipe with balloons and buckets > along the way with a pump that leaks. > > Flame on > > "Grif" ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: what goes up; was 'Maadi Griffin' From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 29 Sep 1999 19:05:09 GMT -------- I am always sceptical when I read stories of people hurt by bullets fired UP IN THE AIR (At long range, on a flat rajectory is very different) Seems to me that a lot of the cases so ascribed were people hit by the bullet on the way UP! Remember that before falling to earth, abullet fired near vertically has to reach a velocity of ZERO. It then starts to accelerate verically under nothing greater than the force of gravity. Falling base first, with the consequent air resistance, it is likely to reach its terminal velocity quite quickly. One can assume this as being a bit faster than that of a human body (120mph..176 fps..) but also remember the damage it can do and its penetrative power is the product of its speed AND its weight. A 175 grain bullet at 200 fps (about slingshot velocity) would give you a NASTY bruise..but unless it hit a very vital, soft spot, is unlikely to prove lethal. As I said earlier..I wouldn't take bets on a cannon ball though!! Hoyt McKagen wrote: > > Robert Swinney wrote: > > >Robert Bastow wrote in message <37F1058E.B5498910@home.com>... > > > >>discarded. Although the tests were carried out over an extended period > > (US > > >Army > > >>tests) they were rarely able to detect the fall of even a single bullet > > >into the > > >>lake surrounding them!! > > I distinctly recall news stories of people being hurt by 'spent' > celebration rounds. In one case there was a fatality. Must not have been > aiming stright up. > > Bullets can obviously fall as fast as Immelman darts ... These are about > .50 caliber, steel, and bullet shaped, have a set of fins. Were dropped > in mass from aircraft as anti-personnel measure. Dad had a few when we > were kidz, probably rare now. > > Best wishes, > > Hoyt McKagen > > Belfab CNC - http://www.freeyellow.com/members/belfab/belfab.html > Best MC Repair - http://www.freeyellow.com/members/batwings/best.html > Camping/Caving - http://www.freeyellow.com/members/batwings/caving.html > Vaccinations kill or injure more kids than the diseases do. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Drilling small straight hole From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 29 Sep 1999 19:18:43 GMT -------- Nope, I wish I did have an old P&W Sine Bar machine tucked away..they are worth a fortune now. I made my own machine..Sine bar type, using some hardened steel guide bars (3/4" x 2 1/2" section) that I scrounged from a scrap yard. The rack was from Boston 1/2" x 1/2" 20 dp. Cutter heads I made myself. Motive power was by hand. Rifling a barrel is quite straight forward (with a twist to it ;^) I left the machine in England when I emmigrated..but I still have the rack and pinion. Nowadays it is so easy (in the USA) to obtain a premium quality rifled barrel of almost any caliber and twist rate imaginable, that I don't see myself ever going to the trouble of drilling and rifling one again. teenut Ole-Hjalmar Kristensen wrote: > > Robert Bastow writes: > > > I would add just one thing! > > > > The "Shank" of your drill MUST be a few thou (0.005" - 0.015") less in diameter > > than the hole and the D bit producing it. In other words..don't make a D drill > > from 1/4" drill rod and expect it to drill a 1/4" hole of that depth. You must > > relieve the shank. > > > > Otherwise it WILL sieze up solid in short order! > > > > For a shorter hole..say up to 3-5 times diameter deep you might get away with > > it..But even regular jobbers drills have a back taper on them. (or SHOULD > > have!!) > > > > teenut > > > > teenut > > You mentioned making a rifle barrel earlier in this thread. How did > you rifle it after having drilled the hole? I suppose you don't have > an old Pratt & Whitney rifling machine stashed away? > Modified lathe, perhaps? > > -- > E pluribus Unix ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Drilling small straight hole From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 29 Sep 1999 19:19:41 GMT -------- There are several for sale on ebay right now! teenut Charles Swain wrote: > > Yes. You can buy drills with carbide ends and hollow to inject coolant > through. They are stock items. They are called "gun drills". The > smallest I've done is .062 dia 3.5 inches deep. > > Brian Evans wrote: > > > > Can a D-tip drill made from drill rod, heat-treated and tempered at home, drill a > > 1/4" hole 16" deep in un-hardened drill rod, with say .030" - .050" wander? > > > > Brian > > > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > > Yup! Dead on Dan! > > > > > > I have drilled muzzle loading, match target rifle barrels, (.452 cal x 36" long) > > > with the same slow but sure method. The only luxury touch was to braze the "D" > > > bit onto a tubular shank so I could get lube right down to where it was needed. > > > I was also able to use a high speed steel cutting tip. > > > > > > Eventually I made a tip with brazed on carbide cutting tip and rubbing pads. > > > 300 sfpm cutting speed and about half a thou per rev feed. The holes would come > > > out within a couple of thou TIR and would be ready for rifling and a finish > > > lapping..no reaming required. > > > > > > The only real difference between that and a REAL gun drill, is that the pro. > > > tool has a grooved, tubular shank, down which oil is pumped at VERY high > > > pressure and it, reurning up the groove in the shank, washed the chips out > > > continuously. Thus there is no need to "Peck Drill"..the tool goes end to end > > > in one push. > > > > > > The one VITAL consideration is that the drill be give a DEAD TRUE start..as has > > > already been mentioned..a short starter hole is first bored true to dead size. > > > (or a hardened starter bush is used in industrial practice) > > > > > > teenut > > > > > > Dan Bollinger wrote: > > > > > > > > Allan, Here's how I've drilled holes straight that where about 20-50 times > > > > as long as the diameter. It requires making a simple, "D" drill. Get a > > > > length of 7/32 drill rod. On one end grind a flat almost half way through > > > > so the end-view looks like the letter D. The flat ought to be about 3/4" > > > > long. Now grind the end with a little cutting and relief angle. The goal > > > > here is to make a drill which only cuts on its end, and not its sides. > > > > Using a torch, heat and quench to harden. Polish. Heat to "Straw" colored. > > > > Start a 7/32" hole with a twist drill after making a centering hole. Use > > > > lots of coolant/lubricant. Drill for about 1/16" and extract the bit to > > > > clean the chips being stored on the "flat." I usually loosen the tailstock, > > > > slide the drill out, swipe off the chips and return the bit into the hole. > > > > With a little luck, you can drill a 6" hole that will require a caliper to > > > > measure how off center it is. :-) > > > > -- > > > > > > > > Dan Bollinger > > > > Clay Critters > > > > www.claycritters.com > > > > Allan Hudson wrote in message > > > > news:37EF4C94.D8B72F85@ultra.net.au... > > > > > How do I drill a long straight round hole approx. 7/32 dia. Obviously a > > > > > regular twist drill is not the answer. Runout soon becomes obvious as I > > > > > proceed. Professionals who do rifle barrels must conquer this problem. > > > > > Any ideas ? thanks Allan the Aussie > > > > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: newbie and mig welding and SHOCK From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 29 Sep 1999 19:36:10 GMT -------- I can attest to that!! I got involved with some plastic film conversion machinery and static electricity is a given with that kind of machinery. We had static charges up in the millions of volts..no real amperage, so it couldn't do any "real" damage. But, given the right circumstances it sure could "reach out and touch someone"...a couple of inches!! Guaranteed to send you home to change your shorts! teenut Mike Graham wrote: > Generally speaking amps do the damage, and volts cause the pain. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: WW1 Era Explosive Ordinance Disposal: Need Advice From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 29 Sep 1999 19:51:16 GMT -------- Mike, You disappoint me! teenut eberlein wrote: > Sometimes I'm ashamed of this newsgroup! If I read previous posts correctly, this > thing dates back to WWI (1918 end, if I recall). This is 1999, so it has managed to > stay inert for 81+ years? I doubt it will blow up if you don't do something > stupid. Store it carefully, so it won't get in a fire, and AT YOUR LEISURE, find > someone who can identify and determine if it is live. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: WW1 Era Explosive Ordinance Disposal: Need Advice From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 29 Sep 1999 19:59:12 GMT -------- Yeah, you're right Gary. I could have bitten my tongue off when I read what I had writ!! The yokels in the Swat and Bomb Squads in the Atlanta area are more dangerous than the threats they respond to..and that includes being dangerous to themselves! teenut Gary Coffman wrote: > > On Tue, 28 Sep 1999 18:25:06 GMT, Robert Bastow wrote: > >GAWD!! Not the ATF! Those crazies will either shoot you or blow themselves up! > > Amen to that! > > >Call the local Bomb Squad. > > Not unless they're better trained than the ones around here, Teenut. > You must not have dealt with Atlanta's finest. They'd just hit it with > their water cannon toy to see what would happen. Call military EOD. > They're the experts in this sort of thing. > > Gary > Gary Coffman KE4ZV | You make it |mail to ke4zv@bellsouth.net > 534 Shannon Way | We break it | > Lawrenceville, GA | Guaranteed | ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Ball Bearings - how are they made From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 29 Sep 1999 20:25:54 GMT -------- Hmmm! Thats a new one on me Hoyt. I don't dispute that it is done in certain circumstances. But all the inners and outers I ever saw made, started life being machined to size, from hollow forged bar, on multi spindle automatics. Of course these were only bearings up to about 3" o/d and different procedures may well be used on larger ones. The largest bearing I ever had a hand in making, was a thrust bearing about 24 feet in diameter!! It was a replacement slewing bearing for a HUGE dockyard crane, built by my company a half a century earlier. I was an "oily rag" (apprentice) at the time, in about the third year of my six year "time" Working on a 42 foot diameter (not a typo!!) vertical boreing mill. (VTL to some) The upper and lower bearing rings, of about a 2 foot square section had been forged and heat treated in Sheffield and I got the job to machine them. After roughing out all over with brazed carbide tip tools, each with a 2" square shank..(indexable carbide tips were in their infancy back then) and rough machining the ball track to template, it was then finish ground (The ball groove only), on the boring mill using a BIG toolpost grinder and a radius arm attachment. IIRC the Bearing balls were over six inches diameter, and each one came packed in its own wooden crate!! Great work when you can get it!! teenut Hoyt McKagen wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > Inner rings and outer rings, similarly graded are > > fed in on overhead tracks.. > > You forgot to tell us that IR and OR are forged in one piece and after > machining/seperation/HT/grinding are kept matched to each other all the > way through. > > Best wishes, > > Hoyt McKagen > > Belfab CNC - http://www.freeyellow.com/members/belfab/belfab.html > Best MC Repair - http://www.freeyellow.com/members/batwings/best.html > Camping/Caving - http://www.freeyellow.com/members/batwings/caving.html > Vaccinations kill or injure more kids than the diseases do. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Ball Bearings - how are they made From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 29 Sep 1999 20:31:17 GMT -------- I dunno...just describing what I saw. It may well be that they are contained in pockets or tracks as an earlier writer stated. Come to think of it..there must be a three point contact..as in a centerless grinder..otherwise there would be a natural tendency to produce a lobular, constant diameter body. teenut David R Brooks wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > ... > :Then the balls are fed in a continuous stream to a series of grinding and > :lapping machines. These look like the old flour grinding mills..two discs > :contra-rotating (or rotating at differential speeds) the balls feed in the > :center and sphericity is 'Generated" just as jou would form a ball of play-do by > :rolling it between your hands. > ... > I would have thought (indeed my old school geometry book explicitly > stated) that this was likely to produce not spheres, but > constant-breadth polygons (strictly, polyhedra). How does the process > avoid that? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: French?? on Sword From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 29 Sep 1999 20:42:54 GMT -------- Infamy! Infamy! They've all got it Infamy!! (Kenneth Williams as Julius Caesar) I NEVER wrote a private Email to anyone about Pete. I am quite capable of insulting him in public, thank you very much! (Though Pete is a dificult guy to insult!) ;^) teenut PLAlbrecht wrote: > > >Pete !! > > > >Are you SURE about that ?? > > 'Course not. But it seemed funny at the time. > > As for pissing on anybody's leg, that's probably just Teenut, snorting his > morning coffee over the keyboard again, and some of it missed... > > Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: WW1 Era Explosive Ordinance Disposal: Need Advice From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 29 Sep 1999 21:09:48 GMT -------- Just be glad you didn't try hitting an ounce or so of the stuff!! Picric acid, originally developed as a dyestuff, was used extensively as a high explosive shell filler during WWI. It can be handled with safety under the right circumstances..but where free chrystals are encountered..look out!!! teenut jrlloyd@cwcom.net, [John, Lloyd/Wales] wrote: > > What's the big deal about picric acid? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Smallish propane (?) cylinders FS/Tr From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 29 Sep 1999 21:14:44 GMT -------- Make great pipe bombs!! Try alt.wreck.anarchy teenut Bob Frazier wrote: > > I came up with too many bottles which were described to me as old > propane cylinders from long ago. Maybe for plumbing? They're about 18 inches > long and 5 inches in diameter. No reasonable offer refused - or any other > ideas on what I could use them for. Wind chimes, anyone? How about a water > rocket like when I was a kid? The only serious use I can think of is cut off > and used as a crucible. > Thx, Bob (MN., USA) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: newbie and mig welding and SHOCK From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 29 Sep 1999 22:30:16 GMT -------- Isn't that the degree course where they teach them how to ask: "Do you want Fries with that"? teenut "Marvin W. Klotz" wrote: > Marv - who still doesn't know what social ecology is, nor cares to. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: A personal rant! From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 01:36:10 GMT -------- DON'T get me started on this subject!!!!!!!!!!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: brass chicago screws ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 01:39:24 GMT -------- Texas Knifemakers Supply Jantz Supply Sheffield Knifemakers Supply Need I continue? They are used for fastening scales on knives. Go get a recent copy of Knives Illustrated or Blade Magazine and you will find the addresses of these and many more suppliers. teenut MacMac wrote: > > Does anybody know where i can get brass chicago screws? If so, please > email me sforrest@soltec.net > > Thanks, > > Stephanie ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Machining a Maadi Griffin .50 rifle From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 04:43:02 GMT -------- Jack, You are made of tougher stuff than me!! I would have kept going 'til I FOUND something a lot stronger than coffee! teenut Jack Erbes wrote: > Spooky. I went and got a cup of coffee and wished I had something > stronger. > > -- > Jack in Sonoma, CA, USA (jack@vom.com) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Weight of lead From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 04:46:27 GMT -------- You mean we get to burn the White House AGAIN?? Long overdue if you ask me! teenut Eastburn wrote: > > And if it turns out like 1812 in D.C. - we might loose the White House and some lives > but things will change for the better. > Martin > -- > NRA LOH, NRA Life > NRA Second Amendment Task Force Charter Founder > Martin Eastburn, Barbara Eastburn > @ home on our computer oldtree@pacbell.net ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Thermal Expansion Question From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 04:50:09 GMT -------- And yet again, a potentially explosive situation on RCM is de-fused! I love this group! teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article <37F17B23.43CF@i-plus.net>, > Hoyt McKagen wrote: > > > If you stick to assumptions given: ... > > Grrrr. > > You did not list those on the post offering the bet. > > Growl. > > I can see my brand new Deckel receding into the distance. Oh > well. Nice dream while it lasted! > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: WW1 Era Explosive Ordinance Disposal: Need Advice From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 04:56:26 GMT -------- Hey! Up yours Pal! We are not supposed to be chemists on this group, but at least we know enough not to f*ck with explosives..Picric Acid or any other!! What is YOUR particular claim to fame? teenut > > I have never seen such a chemistry-ignorant newsgroup. > > Dr. Barry L. Ornitz ornitz-at-dpnet.net ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: A personal rant! From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 05:22:54 GMT -------- You are partly right and partly wrong George! The economic factors you quote are some of the reason why there is a "Shortage of (skilled people)" The other reason is that the average age of said skilled people is rising rapidly. a) For the reasons you quote the old guys simply don;t want to do it any more. (Working in a machine shop IS HARD WORK!!) b) Because of the reasons you quote, there is no DEMAND from younger people, or their parents, for the training opportunities required to replenish the pool of skills that will be required in the future. I got HEAVILY involved in the training programs for young people in Canada. (Hamilton Industrial Training Board and Mowhawk College Advisory Board..If anyone wants to check my credentials). In 1987 IIRC the AVERAGE age of skilled machinists in Canada was 59. 90% were immigrants..ie having learned their skills in some other country. Canada is still accepting immigrants from countries that teach skills..the good old USA quit doing that a long time ago.. most immigrants to this country, nowadays, bring no Industrial Skills with them whatsoever. Now, don't imagine I advocate closing the doors to these people..not at all...But unless the US opens the doors to immigrants with industrial skills in the near future, there is going to be a REAL shortage very soon. Even if (and it won't happen) we were to instigate a crash program to train machinists, etc., there is no way we could replace the numbers that are simply dying of old age. teenut I WARNED you NOT to get me started on this subject!! George McDuffee wrote: > > I have followed this thread with interest. I have just completed > my doctoral dissertation on a parallel topic. >  > There is no shortage of machinests, tool and die makers, etc. > There is only a shortage of machinests, tool and die makers, etc. > that are willing to work for what people are willing to pay > and under the conditions they are willing to provide. >  > Do the math. How long does it take to become a qualified > machinest or tool/die maker (opportunity cost), and how much do > you have to invest in your tools. How frequent/long are the > layoffs? What is the internal rate of return or discounted cash > flow for this investment? Compare this to what you can earn if > you invest the same money in mutual funds and work at Walmart. >  > I am amazed that we *ANY* one left to actually make something. >  > George >  >  > > -- > If education is the answer, just what was the question? >  >  >  ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Machine Tool Gearboxes From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 05:50:05 GMT -------- Boy, you really Do want to get into it don't you Anthony! Good for you..I HAVE been there, Done that! The best texts written on the theory and practice of machine tool design, that I have ever read came out of Russia, Poland, East Germany, Czechoslovakia and Hungary. I simply can't remember the names or authors or publishers..but if you were to point your searches towards that source you will find riches beyond your wildest dreams. Start with searching for Machine Tool Design and Performance or Machine Tool Elements books published in Russia...These are standard text books..translated into English. If you have any questions on specific design elements..Machine Tool Structures, Spindles, Transmissions, etc., please feel free to contact me directly. teenut Anthrhodes wrote: > > Having seen the recent remarks on gearbox transmission losses, can anybody > suggest one or more good text references on the design of machine tool > gearboxes? I am interested in the design of spindle drive gearboxes such as > gearhead lathes, mills, etc., also screwcutting gearboxes of various forms, > Norton-type but also various other forms of screwcutting gearboxes. > > All assistances appreciated. > Anthony ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Vehicle gearbox transmission losses From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 06:11:20 GMT -------- "Pomgolia" indeed (SNORT!!) (HUFF....PUFF!!) I will have you know my dear Colonial Cousin, that I once tried to immigrate to the Antipodes. "Do you have a criminal record?" asked the gentleman.. "No sir" said I (truthfully) "I didn't know you still needed one!" ;^) teenut "Geoff Merryweather." wrote: > Since you live in Pomgolia (the UK to non-Australians and New > Zealanders), ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: WW1 Era Explosive Ordinance Disposal: Need Advice From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 06:16:58 GMT -------- So please quote where I Robert H Bastow Esq. suggested anything BUT calling in the proper authorities post haste. But get your attitude AND your manners in order before you do so. Sir! teenut "Barry L. Ornitz" wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote in message <37F2EE12.E37100AE@home.com>... > >Hey! > >Up yours Pal! > >We are not supposed to be chemists on this group, but at least we know > enough > >not to f*ck with explosives..Picric Acid or any other!! > >What is YOUR particular claim to fame? > >teenut > >> > >> I have never seen such a chemistry-ignorant newsgroup. > >> > > > >> Dr. Barry L. Ornitz ornitz-at-dpnet.net > > PhD in chemical engineering/electrical engineering. Close to 30 years in > R&D for the chemical industry, including work for Holston Army Ammunition > Plant which manufactures RDX and HMX high explosives, and C4 military > explosive (RDX/TNT blend with plasticizer). > > Ignorance can be corrected with education. Stupidity, like passing on > incorrect information as if it were the truth, like you did, requires a > much greater effort to correct. > > Calling in a military demolition disposal unit is the correct advice. Old > explosives can degrade in numerous ways, many of which make them far more > sensitive to shock. A military disposal unit is trained in this and how to > handle these old devices as safely as possible. Calling the local bomb > squad is the second best option. > > Dr. Barry L. Ornitz ornitz-at-dpnet.net ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: WW1 Era Explosive Ordinance Disposal: Need Advice From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 06:20:11 GMT -------- Tom, That was cruel and unusual.. teenut tmartin@xtra.co.nz wrote: > As picric acid was used at times in conjunction with Welin > breeches perhaps you could oblige us with a dissertation > on their manufacture? > > Tom Martin who perceives this NG as Metalworking with > occasional diverse sojourns into the esoteric. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Cast Iron Warpage ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 06:40:25 GMT -------- That is a good question Mike. There is a tendency to imagine that our machine tools are as solid and immovable as the Rock of Gibraltar. But it just isn't so! It wouldn't take a great deal of instrumentation to demonstrate that the weight of a medium sized dividing head or a large machine vice will cause a measurable deflection on the structure of even a quite heavily built milling machine. Yes, those deflections can become permanent! I have seen Bridgeport tables with .020" plus of permanent bow in them due to the practice of mounting a dividing head at one end and a large vice at the other. I almost bought a large jointer once (12" industrial, heavyweight dude) until, upon arriving to inspect the machine at the used M/c tool dealer's, I noticed that a large disc grinder was sitting on the out feed table, both covered with equal amounts of dust. Upon removal and close (eyeball) inspection, it was obvious that the outfeed table was permanently bowed a good 1/4" (Bowed as in curved..not sagging on the dovetail slides..the infeed table was as flat as the day it was made!!) Cast Iron is deceptive stuff..it has the appearance and reputation of the Rock of Ages!! Wonderful, irreplaceable, stuff as it is for machine tools...rigid it ain't!! Bottom line..We need to put heavy weights on our machines..and work around the deflections..but don't leave them there for extended periods. teenut mike II wrote: > > Once finances allow, I'd like to get a dividing head to keep the small > rotary table company. Is it normal practice to keep these rather heavy > dividing heads on the milling machine or would that cause the table to > eventually warp? The more I read about seemingly rock-stable materials > like metals, the more un-rock-stable they appear. > > Semi-Mandatory RCM ENGINE content: > > I've heard of cast car cranks having to be stored upright on their > ends so that warpage does not occur, but for all I know that MAY be > just an 'urban myth'... > > mike ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Cast Iron Warpage ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 12:53:12 GMT -------- I don't think you need worry about a large vice in the middle of your table Eddy. Especially on a Mill/Drill type machine which has solid support at that point. The references I made were to cantilevered loads..say a large vice at one end and a large dividing head at the other end of a long table..say on a Bridgeport type machine. I have a large (6" Kurt)vice for my Deckel..for use when required..but it doesn't stay there any longer than required. Fortunately, most of my work can be handled by the smaller 4" vice that came with the machine. I think it may help people to understand that cast iron falls *roughly* half way between aluminum and steel in terms of "rigidity".** **Based on Modulus of Elasticity..(Youngs Modulus) of 30x10 to 6th for steel and its alloys, 10 to 11 x 10-6 for aluminum and cast iron which ranges from 12 to 19 x 10-6 depending on class. No machine tool is totally rigid...I have to remember not to lean on the tailstock of my lathe when doing a finishing cut..otherwise the taper is measurable!! My Apprentice superintendent used to clip me round the ear for leaning on the lathe...I thought it was for "Idling" until he explained the above to me (graphically I might add!!) So I leaned on my tool locker..he clipped me again..this time it WAS for "idling"!! teenut As an aside..How DOES one write 30x 10 to the power of 6 on a keyboard that won't put the 6 "upstairs" Is there a convention? Eddy Wells wrote: > > Robert, > > That's a new one, to me.... > > I have a 6" BP vice I leave on my import > mill/drill.(in the middle of the table) > > You say that's a bad idea ?? NOW what am I > going to do ?? > > Eddy Wells > > In article <37F30671.746D2E33@home.com>, > Robert Bastow wrote: > > That is a good question Mike. > > > > There is a tendency to imagine that our machine tools are as solid and > immovable > > as the Rock of Gibraltar. But it just isn't so! > > > > It wouldn't take a great deal of instrumentation to demonstrate that > the weight > > of a medium sized dividing head or a large machine vice will cause a > measurable > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Ball Bearings - how are they made From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 13:32:19 GMT -------- I certainly can see where that might be called for, especially in high performance bearings. If the bearing races were being made from individual forgings, I would expect that they were up at the sharp end of performance and price. However, As the Overseas Marketing Manager for a MAJOR tubing company, I sold tens of thousands of tons of hollow bar to bearing manufacturers world wide and most of it had wall thickness sufficient only for inner or outer races..not both. teenut Hoyt McKagen wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > Thats a new one on me Hoyt. I don't dispute that it is done in certain > > circumstances. But all the inners and outers I ever saw made, started life being > > machined to size, from hollow forged bar, on multi spindle automatics. > > I've seen shots of the inner and outers still attached; they offset them > across a narrow conical land but they do come out of the same die. I > don't know what sizes or if these are special purpose but I thought that > was the common way to do it. Obviously for large specials this would not > be practical. The reason I've heard for it is to make sure the races are > matched fatigue-wise. > -- > > Best wishes, > > Hoyt McKagen > > Belfab CNC - http://www.freeyellow.com/members/belfab/belfab.html > Best MC Repair - http://www.freeyellow.com/members/batwings/best.html > Camping/Caving - http://www.freeyellow.com/members/batwings/caving.html > Vaccinations kill or injure more kids than the diseases do. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: unloading and moving a 3-in-1 combo machine From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 13:37:23 GMT -------- Then you hoist the machine up on the boom, trundle it to the top of the basement stairs, position your Sweetie at the bottom of the stairs, give it a shove and shout "CATCH"!! Works every time for me ;^) teenut Dan Mauch wrote: > > Rent one of those hydraulic boom hoists for engines. The rent for about $25 > for four hours and will make the job easy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Cast Iron Warpage ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 18:37:50 GMT -------- That works! Thank you, teenut LaVerne wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote in article > > > > As an aside..How DOES one write 30x 10 to the power of 6 on a keyboard > that > > won't put the 6 "upstairs" Is there a convention? > > > > 30 x 10^6 ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: WW1 Era Explosive Ordinance Disposal: Need Advice From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 30 Sep 1999 18:43:15 GMT -------- That's a new one on me. What does it mean? NetONE wrote: > > C|N>K!!! > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: WW1 Era Explosive Ordinance Disposal: Need Advice From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 01 Oct 1999 01:09:46 GMT -------- You know me Joshua..just joking all the time! 8^) teenut Joshua_Putnam wrote: > > In <37F300F2.4817005B@home.com> Robert Bastow writes: > > >So please quote where I Robert H Bastow Esq. suggested anything BUT calling in > >the proper authorities post haste. > > >But get your attitude AND your manners in order before you do so. Sir! > > Coming from you, that's a joke. > > -- > > Josh@WolfeNet.com is Joshua Putnam / P.O. Box 13220 / Burton, WA 98013 > "My other bike is a car." > http://www.wolfenet.com/~josh/ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: WW1 Era Explosive Ordinance Disposal: Need Advice From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 01 Oct 1999 01:15:48 GMT -------- Hey Barry, welcome to tne group! We need all the experts we can get (as you somewhat bluntly pointed out!) Please accept my apologies for the abrupt..nay rude response..to your valued contribution..anyone here will tell you that my bite is worse than my bark..er!..(Did I get that right?) teenut AAFRadio@erols.com wrote: > > Jack Erbes wrote: > > This is a newsgroup that knows a little about everything, more about > > some things. And is always willing to listen to an opinion. > > You're quite right, Jack. And that is our uniqueness. I've followed > Barry's postings in a private vacuum tube radio reflector list for a > number of years, and I would plead for the same sort of tolerance and > understanding we have for the other distinguished and knowledgeable (if > occasionally abrupt) folks here. He may have expressed a moment's > frustration with our usual flailing about in somewhat direct terms, but > who hasn't? I can assure you that, given some time to experience the > fruits of his knowledge, training, and years in the chemical industry, > everyone here will be requesting the same of Dr. Ornitz that we now > reserve for Robert Bastow, and Fitch, and a host of other experts - > "Hey, Barry, where are you?" is a common theme on the Boatanchors list, > and I suspect you'll begin to see it here as well. Let's give him some > time to become acclimated to the dynamics of this group (which has one > of the highest value-added content in the newsgroups, IMO) and then you > can make your own judgments. I know the "Ornitz file" in my "GURU" > folder is as useful and appreciated as the "Bastow File". :-) > > Best Wishes, > Mike Hanz ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: WW1 Era Explosive Ordinance Disposal: Need Advice From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 01 Oct 1999 01:21:48 GMT -------- Charleson Mambo wrote: Or maybe you'll get a story about the time > ole Stumpy found one just like it. :) ROTFL!! Like the old ad: Lost: Three legged dog, one ear, no tail, blind in one eye; Answers to "Lucky" teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Rotary tables-6 inch From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 01 Oct 1999 01:35:20 GMT -------- I might have had a shot at answering that question..but he obviously was excluding ME!! Perhaps you would like a shot Pete! ;^) teenut Alan Rothenbush wrote: > > So, here's a request for words of wisdom ....... ( aka - you old > farts ). > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Rotary tables-6 inch From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 01 Oct 1999 01:38:45 GMT -------- SEE!! You didn't need an old fart..a young fart did remarkably well! (It's a COMPLIMENT, Chuck!) 8^) teenut Chuck Sherwood wrote: > > >1. I understand that dividing plates allow one to precisely rotate the table > > by an angle that would otherwise be hard to calculate ( e.g. 1/13th turn ). > > The dividing plates are used to easily divide into a fixed number of > steps without calculating fractional angles etc. Much less prone to make > a mistake. Could be more accurate too, but I question that. Most rotary > tables allow you to set them to 10 Arc Seconds, which is pretty accurate. > > >2. What's the tailstock used for ? > > The tailstock is used to hold parts between centers (probably on an arbor). > The rotary table would be in the vertical mode. I have seen pictures of > gears mounted on arbors being cut this way. > > chuck sherwood ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Rotary tables-6 inch From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 01 Oct 1999 03:57:05 GMT -------- A mere child Chuck! I have socks older than that! ;^) teenut Chuck Sherwood wrote: > See how much a young'en can learn by listening to the old farts here. > BTW, I'm over 40. Am I still "young"? > > chuck sherwood ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Anyone for homemade accessories for Asian 12x36 gearhead lathe? From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 01 Oct 1999 12:21:28 GMT -------- The only area I might be remotely qualified to comment on is the accuracy of lathe cut threads. Yes, in theory, a lathe can cut a perfect pitch thread of any length..but in practice, I wouldn't want to trust one cut on typical HSM equipment as a measurement reference. Firstly, you must consider the overall accuracy of the leadscrew, many of these were/are rolled threads, some are milled, very few a singlepoint cut on a dedicated machine, with a certified, corrected and frequently, re-calibrated leading screw. Not to speak of temperature controlled conditions. Next you must consider cyclical errors and they can come from a plethora of sources: Original errors in the leadscrew, caused by some of the conditions found in any machine tool, including yours and mine. Some of these are: Bent Leadscrew...causes a "Wow" in the thread Off center or bent gear hubs Worn halfnut slides in conjunction with.. Worn bed ways..this can lead to the saddle oscillating on the bedways and conditions of stick/slip. Last but by no means least, the homogenity and stability of the chosen material. al or any of these factors can be present and work together in ways that would need a main frame computor to predict the actual pitch produced at any one moment in time. Now, these types of errors are absolutely negligible when used for fasteners or power transmission purposes. But consider that the errors built into your primary standard will be transfered..multiplied by other errors in your system..to every piece you machine henceforth! Scary init? If I were to tackle the building of my own DRO (which is very unlikely!!) I would take a leaf out of the Newall book..One of the best respected names in the industry, they use a simple row of precision ball bearings in a non-magnetic tube as the linear reference standards. Steel balls, of all sizes, ground to closer limits than you or I can measure, are available for pennies. I am surprised that no one has investigated this obvious source of fundamentally accurate length measurement. It is water/oil proof, tough and can be made or cut to any length. When the time comes to BUY my DRO I doubt that I will consider any other system! teenut Alan Mimms wrote: > > Ah, but MY DRO project won't use a PC, but instead would use a <$50 > microcontroller board which doesn't have to be as pampered as a PC. > Like the Shooting Star folks, I think the whole thing ought to fit on > the little box the display digits are displayed on. Also, I do not > think the US Digital encoders are the way to go. I'm thinking about > making an optical encoder using my inkjet printer (which is VERY > accurate or at least repeatable and could thus be calibrated and does > 1440 DPI). I believe a wheel will do what I want and driving it with > a thread-cut rack is the right way to do it. (Thread cutting is very > accurately done and easily on most lathes without any magic indexing > hardware and tedious cut/move/repeat steps). Since the rack doesn't > actually have much power to transmit to the pinion that drives the > encoder wheel, I think it can be V (thread) shaped and the pinion can > be a lantern pinion made with round leaves. > > Anybody have any comments on this approach? I admit I am pretty > nearly just pulling ideas out of my hat (or elsewhere, some might > say), but I don't see any fundamental problems with this. Do you? > -- > Alan Mimms > Home machinist in (self) training. > E-mail: alanm@unforgettable.com > Metalworking web page: http://alanm.penguinpowered.com/metalworking > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Original Message <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< > > On 9/30/99, 8:52:42 AM, "fred veenschoten" > wrote regarding Re: Anyone for homemade accessories for Asian 12x36 > gearhead lathe?: > > > the dro has already been covered by two other guys. see: > > http://www.mcs.net/~kulaga/dro.html > > and http://www.angelfire.com/biz3/handengraving/dro.html > > fred > > > >Alan Mimms wrote: > > >> > > >> Hello fellow machinegeeks. > > >> > > >> I have the Harbor Freight version of the Asian 12x36 gearhead lathe. > > >> I wonder if people would be interested in construction projects for > > >> new designs and adaptations of designs for accessories for this > lathe? > > >> Perhaps for the various cheap Asian mill-drills as well > > >> I am considering doing a homemade DRO somewhat like the one from > > >> Shooting Star. I want to make it flexible enough for 3-axis on the > > >> lathe (topslide is Z) and for the mill-drill. I am a software guy, > so > > >> I can do What's Right for the software (just like Shooting Star has - > > >> their product is sweet but fairly expensive for my tastes). > > >> ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Rotary tables-6 inch From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 01 Oct 1999 16:59:47 GMT -------- HURUMPFF!! teenut Alan Rothenbush wrote: > 4. The rest of you guys .. many thanks for not giving me more grief about > my "old fart" nomenclature .. thanks for taking it in the sprint in which it > was intended. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: This one doesn't look bad either. From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 01 Oct 1999 21:35:59 GMT -------- It looks remarkably like the others, same geometry, different make, cnc control rather than "automatic" Have you got your machine yet? teenut BillDarby wrote: > > Robert! This one doesn't look bad either. > > http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=173755665 ======== Newsgroups: sci.electronics.repair,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 220V 50Hz induction motor in NA From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 02 Oct 1999 00:44:38 GMT -------- Robert Swinney wrote: > > Peter, > It is highly unlikely that you have a 2 phase line at home. Ha! It all DEPENDS!! ;^) ;^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Rotary tables-6 inch From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 02 Oct 1999 00:52:30 GMT -------- I'd say you are on thin ice there Doug!! ;^) teenut Doug White wrote: > Not that it's likely that anyone else here will understand, ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: permanent molds From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 02 Oct 1999 05:28:34 GMT -------- I have never heard of "dry sandcasting"..which makes me wonder about his definition of "green sand casting" How does "Rusinoff" define the two processes? And who is he BTW, al the "green" sand casting I ever did, or saw, was a nasty black color!! ;^) teenut..just trying to be helpful 8^) Allan Adler wrote: > > "Dan Bollinger" writes: > > > Green sand casting are a one-time mold. The cores that are used for > > hollow-sections are also one-time use. They are washed out, or sand-blasted > > out. Green sand is re-used after sifting and re-conditioning. The only > > permanent part are the wood or aluminum patterns that the green sand is > > tamped around. Ask at a foundry if you can take a tour, or sign up for a > > class at your local technical college. > > Rusinoff distinguishes between green sand casting and dry-sand casting. > My question about permanence applies to dry-sand casting. > > Allan Adler > ara@altdorf.ai.mit.edu > > **************************************************************************** > * * > * Disclaimer: I am a guest and *not* a member of the MIT Artificial * > * Intelligence Lab. My actions and comments do not reflect * > * in any way on MIT. Morever, I am nowhere near the Boston * > * metropolitan area. * > * * > **************************************************************************** ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: permanent molds From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 02 Oct 1999 14:58:35 GMT -------- Thanks Allan, for the double clarification...If I had read earlier posts more carefully I may not have needed to ask the question ,Eh! teenut Allan Adler wrote: > > Robert Bastow writes: > > > I have never heard of "dry sandcasting"..which makes me wonder about his > > definition of "green sand casting" > > > > How does "Rusinoff" define the two processes? And who is he > > Rusinoff is the author of "Manufacturing Processes: Materials > and Production", published by the American Technical Society > in 1962. On pages 53-54, he writes: > > "Molds are of two kinds, namely green sand and dry sand. Green sand > or damp molds are used principally because of their low cost and > simplicity of operation. They are formed by mixing silica (8 percent > silica to 15 percent clay) and a small amount of water. Dry sand molds > are formed by mixing sand of somewhat coarser grain with a clay bonding > material and water and then baking the mixture dry. Linseed oil, molasses > water, gelatinized starch or other suitable solution can be used as the > bonding substance, in which case the mold is dried out by air, oven heat, > or torch. These bonding materials are also used in the preparation of > dry-sand cores, which are baked in an oven." > > Allan Adler > ara@altdorf.ai.mit.edu > > **************************************************************************** > * * > * Disclaimer: I am a guest and *not* a member of the MIT Artificial * > * Intelligence Lab. My actions and comments do not reflect * > * in any way on MIT. Morever, I am nowhere near the Boston * > * metropolitan area. * > * * > **************************************************************************** ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Any experience buying from Al Babin? UPDATE From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 02 Oct 1999 15:03:22 GMT -------- Oh! THOSE "Real Machinists"! 8^) teenut Jack Erbes wrote: > > Kevin Pinkerton wrote: > > > Ok, I am curious now. What other "machinists" groups are available in > > the alt.* area? Thanks in advance, > > alt.machines.cnc > > -- > Jack in Sonoma, CA, USA (jack@vom.com) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Help needed getting cross-feed to work -- Update From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 02 Oct 1999 15:44:16 GMT -------- Regardless of age, and in spite of the accumulated crud that comes with it, it shouldn't be neccesary to "whale" on bits of a machine built to the quality standards of the old Butlers. Friction clutches were NOT a feature that I have found on any English lathe (except the Boxford..which is a clone of the Southbend) Somewhere in the saddle, in the immediate vacinity of the "Sliding, Surfacing and Screwcutting" (to give it its correct terminology) controls is a mechanical interlock that prevents both modes from being engaged at the same time. I suspect that this interlock/block, is doing its job..but is either stuck there..or you haven't yet discovered how to shift it. Hauling on the knobs will only result in shearing them off! The most common interlock is activated by the act of engaging the half nuts. First thing to check, Mike is that, when the half nuts a DIS-engaged, that you are geting a full range of movement, both on the half nut lever AND on the half nut slides that it operates. There isn't usually an IN/OUT detent for the half nut lever (for obvious reasons 8^)..but, if the slides inside have become filled with crud, OR if the pitman block, slide or pin is worn, you may not be getting enough movement. Enough to clear the leadscrew yes, but not enough to disengage the S/S block..that is usually activated in the very last part of the half nut lever's motion. One other area to check, is the feed shafts. It might be an obvious question..but do they continue to rotate when the feed is "engaged"? If not..then, either a protective shear pin has broken at the Norton Box end, or, more likely on a lathe of that size, age and quality, there is an adjustable, releasing, dog clutch fitted for overload protection. This may (probably) need cleaning and re-adjusting. tenut Mike Graham wrote: > > On 02 Oct 1999 03:27:42 GMT, Fdmorrison wrote: > > >Butler is, I think, an English mfg--now defunct???--so the actual blueprint > >stuff has to be sought there. > > I don't want a blueprint, I just want somebody to tell me that 'yeah, you > do such and such to engage the feed'. You see, there's a lot of STIFF old > controls on this lathe. It was bought for scrap value a few years ago, and > then largely ignored. Now I have it running, and I want to figure it out. > However, there are a lot of controls that you have to whale on with a rubber > mallet to make them go, so not everything is obvious by just fooling around, > if you see what I mean. So maybe I'm supposed to turn these knobs to the > right, but I won't know that unless I put a chain wrench on them and 'break > the seal of the centuries', which might work, or might wreck it. > > >But, I agree with Frank Sennett, you ought to be able to reverse engineer to > >figure how to run it. > > I've got most of it figured out, but it's got a HUGE carriage; probably > weighs 300 pounds. I believe (didn't look real hard) that the apron is part > of the casting - not removeable). I've had the carriage feeding in > 'threadcutting mode' with no problems, and that alone is useful (I can make > up gouges for him that fit in the toolpost and he can have the machine make > precision dowels of potentially significant size (like a foot across, say) > for special projects. > > >If you place the carriage way to the right and engage the back gears--as you > >say you now can do--then you ought to be able to run the lathe forward slowly > >(carriage going left) and try the knobs and handles, before anything drastic > >happens before you can shut it down again. > > I can have the leadscrew turning, but the carriage doesn't go anywhere. > It stays where it is. Unless I engage the half-nuts for thread-cutting, the > carriage doesn't move. The knob for longitudinal feed will *turn* when I > engage the feed, but the carriage doesn't move. When I say that the knob > turns, I don't mean that I can turn it, I mean that the gears turn it, and > turn it with feeling; I have no doubt that if I managed to stop that knob > from turning when the feed was engaged that I would stall the lathe. I can > even make the knob turn the other way with the feed selection handle, but > the carriage doesn't move. It seems to me like maybe the knobs are part of > conical clutches, because in the center of the knob is the end of a stud > (with a slot on it for holding with a screwdriver) and a nut, and these > don't turn with the knob. Perhaps if I loosen off this nut and tighten up > the stud the cones will be pulled together and the clutch will have some > friction again. Perhaps. This is all guesswork at this point. I'll be > playing with it some more this weekend. > > >If the lathe has a compound (so you have a three-layer cake consisting of > >carriage, cross slide, and compound slide on the top) then it ought to > >swivel--as that was really the point of having a compound slide. > > I agree! I simply haven't figured out *how* yet. 8-) The underside is > packed with crud, so maybe after we scrape that out we will see something to > put a wrench to. This definately has a compound slide; I thought that > *maybe* it might have a fixed-angle slide.. I can envision manufacturing > situations where that might be preferable (remove a vector of 'give' to > increase rigidity) and maybe the compound scale would be calibrated in ten > thousandths for cross-feed given an angle of 4.73 degrees or whatever the > heck that is. It seems unlikely, but not impossible. > > >In any case, you can find out everything if you look in back of the apron where > >all the gearing is (take it off, if you have to to get a view). If there is a > >spur gear on the cross slide, then there is power cross feed. > > It's pretty crowded under there, and visibility is not good. I can see > most of the stuff, but I think my problem is in the clutches. > > >Hope you find some chucks, and make some chips (I mean swarf). > > I hope so, too. I'm on the lookout, now, for a big-ass old 3-jaw chuck... > maybe a 16" or so. > > -- > Mike Graham, mikegraham at sprint dot ca > Caledon, Ontario, Canada (just NW of Toronto). > > Raiser of animals. Weldor of metals. Driver of off-road vehicles. > Writer of FAQs. Keeper of the faith, and all around okay guy. > > < homepage currently off-line due to change of ISP; back soon > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Mars space shot From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 02 Oct 1999 15:49:21 GMT -------- Or pounds per horsepower/hour! The same > is true of fuel consumption. Weight per hour or volume per > distance has been the way its been measured for a long time > and is perfectly logical. > ...lew... ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Help needed getting cross-feed to work -- Update From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 02 Oct 1999 20:19:18 GMT -------- Mike, This doesn't sound like the "Butlers" I am familiar with. They tended towards being BIG heavy, especially "T-Bed" type boring and facing lathes. Their specialty was Planers and vertical slotters. Does the leadscrew have a keyway running the full length of it? If so, the feeds are driven by a key sliding in the keyway. That key may be sheared or missing. If not....then the lathe doesn't have "separate feeds" (you say there are so separate feed shafts..just the lead screw) If that is the case then "feeds" are simple "fine threads" Mike Graham wrote: > > On Sat, 02 Oct 1999 15:44:16 GMT, Robert Bastow wrote: > > >Regardless of age, and in spite of the accumulated crud that comes with it, it > >shouldn't be neccesary to "whale" on bits of a machine built to the quality > >standards of the old Butlers. > > The things I've needed to pound on so far are the bull-gear engagement > lever (it was stiff, and needed to be moved before it could be freed up; now > it's fine) and the threading speed slider. The quick-change gearbox on > this lathe is not like ones that I've seen before. I'm used to two tumbler > selectors, one being, I believe, the pitch, and labelled 'A','B','C' etc, > and the other being the feed rate numbered in this case 1 through 11 (with > number 4 being the 'normal' location in this case - this is where you leave > it for oiling and whatnot). Anyway, instead of a pitch tumbler selector you > have a long-ish shaft with a handle that slides through the box. This thing > is *STIFF*! Only the rubber hammer will move it. > > >Friction clutches were NOT a feature that I have found on any English lathe > >(except the Boxford..which is a clone of the Southbend) > > >I suspect that this interlock/block, is doing its job..but is either stuck > >there..or you haven't yet discovered how to shift it. Hauling on the knobs will > >only result in shearing them off! > > The apron is pretty much a dead ringer for a South Bend, except instead of > having a clutch knob it has two big (3-4" diameter) hand knobs (with fairly > short lobes; kind of a cross between a hand knob and a palmgrip knob). It > also has a knurled disc that when pulled disconnects the handwheel from the > rack. It has a halfnut engagement lever, and a feed selection lever (up is > one way, middle is neutral, down is the other way). That's all it has. If > you have the feed selector lever in neutral then you can engage the halfnuts > and it feeds fine for 'threading mode' as long as you didn't leave the > handwheel engaged in which case it will stall the lathe. With the halfnut > lever not engaged you can set the feed engagement lever to forward or > reverse, but the carriage doesn't move; all that happens is the > aforementioned knobs turn. Well, actually only one of them turns; the one > that relates to longitudinal feed. If, with the feed disengaged, you turn > the knobs, you can make the feeds work the same as if you were turning the > handwheels, yet if you engage the feed the knobs disconnect from the > handwheels and just turn with no effect. > > >The most common interlock is activated by the act of engaging the half nuts. > >First thing to check, Mike is that, when the half nuts a DIS-engaged, that you > >are geting a full range of movement, both on the half nut lever AND on the half > >nut slides that it operates. > > No problem operating the half nut as long as the feed selector lever is in > 'neutral'. > > >One other area to check, is the feed shafts. It might be an obvious > >question..but do they continue to rotate when the feed is "engaged"? > > This doesn't seem to have any feed shafts per se... it only has the > leadscrew. This didn't worry me at the time because those knobs turn when > you engage the feed, so *something* is happening, but on reflection perhaps > the knobs are turning because the leadscrew is 'going past' if you know what > I mean. Perhaps if you hold the knob from turning the carriage will feed. > Maybe that's the safety feature.. if you let go of the knob it just turns > and the carriage stops feeding. This would mean that you couldn't do > unmanned cuts, though. > > I'll go and look at it again today now that I've had a mental 'break' from > it. > > -- > Mike Graham, mikegraham at sprint dot ca > Caledon, Ontario, Canada (just NW of Toronto). > > Raiser of animals. Weldor of metals. Driver of off-road vehicles. > Writer of FAQs. Keeper of the faith, and all around okay guy. > > < homepage currently off-line due to change of ISP; back soon > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Wanted: plans for div.head&boring head From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 02 Oct 1999 20:47:39 GMT -------- I built a useful dividing head, starting with one of those ubiquitous, asian, spin index heads..cost me $32.00 IIRC. I added an extension boss at the rear to carry an ambidextrous banjo (can be switched to operate from LH or RH side) The worm and wheel came from Boston Gear and the rest of the bits, division plates, quadrant fingers, handle and plunger, etc., I made myself. The device will mount handily on the lathe cross slide, milling machine or shaper tables. It takes all the same 5C collets, including a Sherline, 5C mounted 4 Jaw and a 6" faceplate that can be transferred from lathe nose to dividing head nose. Work is in hand to adapt it also, to my miniature cylindrical grinder. Though I now have a "Proper" B&S type dividing head and a 10" vert/horizontal rotary table (with dividing plates) I still find I use my "special" most often..simply because of its integrated nature. Many jobs will never leave the collet, chuck or faceplace they start out life upon in the lathe and be shifted back and forth beween lathe , mill, shaper, and grinder..maybe several times, without loss of register or time in resetting. Currently I am working on a tailstock and a "sub bed" that will allow for shifting as a unit and for the setting of angles or tapers in two axes. teenut craig_suslosky@my-deja.com wrote: > > Hello, > I`ve been having trouble posting again, so I hope this > goes through. Does anybody have plans,drawings,prints or > advice & hints on building a boring head & dividing head? > I would like to build these items, but cant find plans. > The dividing head should be 6 or 8 inch. Should it be 40:1 or > 90:1 ??? Any help would be appreciated. > Could you please e-mail me direct with your > comments, thank you. > > Craig > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Annealing Brass From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 02 Oct 1999 20:52:40 GMT -------- Dull red..no more! Allow to cool in air or quench in cool water. Quenching doesn't affect the "temper" but it is quicker and helps loosen the scale. teenut John Lovallo wrote: > > What temperature should I heat CA360 brass to in order to anneal it? > > TIA, John Lovallo ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Weight of lead From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 02 Oct 1999 22:01:01 GMT -------- I am not one to post just to say "I agree" But in this case I think an exception is called for. Gary has hit it right on the head ! The objective of the Founding Fathers in determining that the right to arm and protect ONESELF!! was to ensure that the working tools ..the Ballot box and the Jury box were never seriously abused or arbitrily removed. Why oh why, don't people of today, with another three hundred years of absolute historical proof, that an unarmed population is at the mercy of tyrants, recognise that this INALIENABLE right is more important than ever. I believe the USA is the last holdout, and God help us and the rest of the world if we allow that very last "check and balance" to be taken away! This is NOT about shooting targets, hunting or collecting guns!! It is about the last defense line of a Free people who wish to REMAIN FREE PEOPLE!! teenut Gary Coffman wrote: > > On Tue, 28 Sep 1999 17:36:09 GMT, mikegraham@sprint.ca (Mike Graham) wrote: > >On Tue, 28 Sep 1999 12:40:53 -0400, Gary Coffman wrote: > > > >>Yeah, since the people you'll be defending against will have an initial near > >>monopoly on the arms in military depots. You didn't think he meant defending > >>the country against *foreign* forces did you? We hire professionals to do that. > >>It is when the professionals are misused against us that we need the capability > >>to resist. (The right, and capability, to rebel against a government gone bad > >>is built into our Declaration of Independence, our Constitution, and our social > >>mores.) > > > > Really? Who does it then? Since Article II, Section 2, Clause 1 seems to > >indicate that the President is the supreme commander of the Army, Navy, > >etc., and the Militias, who is left? > > *The people*. This is the big difference between our form of government > and that of other nations. We recognize the right of the people to act > as the ultimate check on those in positions of power. To be able to do > that effectively, the Constitution forbids government from infringing the > right of the people to possess effective tools to do so. > > >Keep in mind that the first amendment > >gun clause was put in there to arm the Militias, not private citizens for > >their own use, so in theory anyone in the states who arms themselves under > >the umbrella of the first amendment is 'signing a pact' to use that gun > >under the President's direction. > > No, that is incorrect on a number of grounds. In the first place, the first > amendment forbids the government to infringe on the right of the people > to practice free speech and operate a free press. It is the second amendment > which forbids the government to infringe on the right of the people to bear arms. > > The entire so-called Bill of Rights is actually a set of prohibitions on government > infringements of the inalienable rights of the people. Our founders believed that > certain rights were inherent properties of our humanity. Prominent among those > were the right to think and act as we believed, the right to hold and benefit from > property, and the right to defend ourselves and families against any threat. > > The Supreme Court ruled in 1899 that the militia is the whole of the populace > capable of bearing arms. It is not the Army, it is not the National Guard, it is > not an agent of any organized branch of government. It is the people's tool. > > As recently as 1996, the Supreme Court has ruled that where the > Constitution refers to "the people", it means individual people, not > some nebulous collectivist class. The writings of the Founders also > confirm this interpretation. Jefferson said that the ideal was for > "every man to be armed." That was to serve as a check against > government tyranny or abuse. His reasoning was that it is difficult > to bully armed men. > > >>Apartment dwellers never have the need to deal with predators (particularly > >>of the two legged variety)? Apartment dwellers never go hunting? Apartment > >>dwellers never shoot competitively? Of course they do, all three. > > > > Not the "average apartment dweller", which is what I stipulated. > > I'd suggest even that stipulation is too broad. In our large cities, one in two > of us will be the victims of violent crime in our lifetimes. That's 50% right there > who have a need for a defense against predators. Over 20 million of us regularly > go hunting, and most of those have to be non-farmers because there aren't that > many farmers, and not all farmers hunt. Only a minority of competitive shooters > are farmers too, so the majority must be urban dwellers. > > There are ample practical reasons why apartment dwellers may possess > arms, particularly powerful military style arms. There is certainly nothing in > our founding documents, or our cultural mores, which would limit the bearing > of arms to certain privileged classes. Indeed, as Jefferson said, the ideal is > that we all be armed and able to spill the blood of tyrants if the need should > arise. > > The right to rebel is recognized in the Declaration of Independence as a > fundamental human right. That's the primary reason our government > has not become a tyranny, as so many others have. Those in power know > that if they push too hard, the people will rebel, and that they have the > capability to rebel effectively. > > Three boxes define our freedoms. They are the ballot box, the jury box, > and the cartridge box. The latter guarantees the former will be respected > by whoever may be in power. So far it has worked for the most part (nothing > is perfect). But if the present trends continue, like Rome, we may find that > the populace is more interested in bread and circuses than in the integrity > of the republic. We see signs of that in light voter turnouts, frantic attempts > to avoid jury duty, and a tolerance of a subversive pounding propaganda > attack against the right of people to bear militarily effective arms. > > Gary > Gary Coffman KE4ZV | You make it |mail to ke4zv@bellsouth.net > 534 Shannon Way | We break it | > Lawrenceville, GA | Guaranteed | ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: DC Motor for drill press From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 03 Oct 1999 01:40:46 GMT -------- Could someone, with a lot more electrical knowledge than me, please take a look at the following item on ebay: http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=173273810 I want to put a DC drive on my drill press and wonder if this motor would be suitable? I have a Boston RatioTrol 90V DC drive (Power unit) and hope that this kind of motor would work with it. Comments appreciated, Thanks, teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Mars space shot From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 03 Oct 1999 01:47:28 GMT -------- Interestingly, that's not the kind of joke you usury tell Mike. teenut Mike Graham wrote: > You're a guy who likes puns, Mike, so I'll let you in on a little-known > variant of puns called a "Tom Swifty". I'm not making this up. Here are a > couple of examples, and doubtlessly you will be able to pick them up: > > "I killed a vampire." said Tom painstakingly. > "I like camping." said Tom intently. > "I'm into gay necrophelia." said Tom in dead ernest. > > and one of my all time favourites is what I call "The Swiftest Swifty", > and I invented it myself. It's: > > "Texas." Tom stated. > > -- > Mike Graham, mikegraham at sprint dot ca > Caledon, Ontario, Canada (just NW of Toronto). > > Raiser of animals. Weldor of metals. Driver of off-road vehicles. > Writer of FAQs. Keeper of the faith, and all around okay guy. > > < homepage currently off-line due to change of ISP; back soon > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Annealing Brass From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 03 Oct 1999 01:53:36 GMT -------- No! It won't harden with time or anything else except deformation..Work Hardening! teenut teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article <37F67142.737E53D0@home.com>, > Robert Bastow wrote: > > Dull red..no more! > > > > Allow to cool in air or quench in cool water. Quenching doesn't > affect the > > "temper" but it is quicker and helps loosen the scale. > > > > teenut > > OK. Robert, here's something you might have experience with: Once > annealed, how can one re-harden brass? I now it will work harden > with time, but any way to do it all at once? > > TIA - Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Anyone for homemade accessories for Asian 12x36 gearhead lathe? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 03 Oct 1999 02:03:13 GMT -------- I believe the magnetic steel balls are contained in a non magnetic stainless steel tube. Pretty near bullet proof if you ask me. Plus you can chop it to length with impunity. I wouldn't imagine it would be real difficult to lengthen one either. teenut Alan Mimms wrote: > > Thanks for the wisdom Robert. I'll consider the balls idea carefully. > Sounds very good to me. I was HOPING that the errors in a leadscrew > could be "calibrated" around, but I can't think of a way to calibrate! > Of course we can put a table in the DRO that undoes any arbitrary > error, but that implies absolution position measurement rather than > relative. > > Balls might be the best way at that. When you said they were in a > nonmagnetic container, does that mean that they are counted as they go > by magnetically? Nice clean sinewave would be easy to detect the > angle wrt the ball. I LIKE it. > > -- > Alan Mimms > Home machinist in (self) training. > E-mail: alanm@unforgettable.com > Metalworking web page: http://alanm.penguinpowered.com/metalworking > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Original Message <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< > > On 10/1/99, 4:21:28 AM, Robert Bastow wrote regarding > Re: Anyone for homemade accessories for Asian 12x36 gearhead lathe?: > > > The only area I might be remotely qualified to comment on is the > accuracy of > > lathe cut threads. > > > Yes, in theory, a lathe can cut a perfect pitch thread of any > length..but in > > practice, I wouldn't want to trust one cut on typical HSM equipment as > a > > measurement reference. > > > Firstly, you must consider the overall accuracy of the leadscrew, many > of these > > were/are rolled threads, some are milled, very few a singlepoint cut > on a > > dedicated machine, with a certified, corrected and frequently, > re-calibrated > > leading screw. Not to speak of temperature controlled conditions. > > > Next you must consider cyclical errors and they can come from a > plethora of > > sources: > > > Original errors in the leadscrew, caused by some of the conditions > found in any > > machine tool, including yours and mine. > > > Some of these are: > > > Bent Leadscrew...causes a "Wow" in the thread > > Off center or bent gear hubs > > Worn halfnut slides in conjunction with.. > > Worn bed ways..this can lead to the saddle oscillating on the bedways > and > > conditions of stick/slip. > > > Last but by no means least, the homogenity and stability of the chosen > material. > > > al or any of these factors can be present and work together in ways > that would > > need a main frame computor to predict the actual pitch produced at any > one > > moment in time. > > > Now, these types of errors are absolutely negligible when used for > fasteners or > > power transmission purposes. But consider that the errors built into > your > > primary standard will be transfered..multiplied by other errors in > your > > system..to every piece you machine henceforth! > > > Scary init? > > > If I were to tackle the building of my own DRO (which is very > unlikely!!) I > > would take a leaf out of the Newall book..One of the best respected > names in the > > industry, they use a simple row of precision ball bearings in a > non-magnetic > > tube as the linear reference standards. > > > Steel balls, of all sizes, ground to closer limits than you or I can > measure, > > are available for pennies. I am surprised that no one has > investigated this > > obvious source of fundamentally accurate length measurement. > > > It is water/oil proof, tough and can be made or cut to any length. > When the > > time comes to BUY my DRO I doubt that I will consider any other > system! > > > teenut > > > Alan Mimms wrote: > > > > > > Ah, but MY DRO project won't use a PC, but instead would use a <$50 > > > microcontroller board which doesn't have to be as pampered as a PC. > > > Like the Shooting Star folks, I think the whole thing ought to fit on > > > the little box the display digits are displayed on. Also, I do not > > > think the US Digital encoders are the way to go. I'm thinking about > > > making an optical encoder using my inkjet printer (which is VERY > > > accurate or at least repeatable and could thus be calibrated and does > > > 1440 DPI). I believe a wheel will do what I want and driving it with > > > a thread-cut rack is the right way to do it. (Thread cutting is very > > > accurately done and easily on most lathes without any magic indexing > > > hardware and tedious cut/move/repeat steps). Since the rack doesn't > > > actually have much power to transmit to the pinion that drives the > > > encoder wheel, I think it can be V (thread) shaped and the pinion can > > > be a lantern pinion made with round leaves. > > > > > > Anybody have any comments on this approach? I admit I am pretty > > > nearly just pulling ideas out of my hat (or elsewhere, some might > > > say), but I don't see any fundamental problems with this. Do you? > > > -- > > > Alan Mimms > > > Home machinist in (self) training. > > > E-mail: alanm@unforgettable.com > > > Metalworking web page: http://alanm.penguinpowered.com/metalworking > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Original Message <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< > > > > > > On 9/30/99, 8:52:42 AM, "fred veenschoten" > > > wrote regarding Re: Anyone for homemade accessories for Asian 12x36 > > > gearhead lathe?: > > > > > > > the dro has already been covered by two other guys. see: > > > > http://www.mcs.net/~kulaga/dro.html > > > > and http://www.angelfire.com/biz3/handengraving/dro.html > > > > fred > > > > > > > >Alan Mimms wrote: > > > > >> > > > > >> Hello fellow machinegeeks. > > > > >> > > > > >> I have the Harbor Freight version of the Asian 12x36 gearhead lathe. > > > > >> I wonder if people would be interested in construction projects for > > > > >> new designs and adaptations of designs for accessories for this > > > lathe? > > > > >> Perhaps for the various cheap Asian mill-drills as well > > > > >> I am considering doing a homemade DRO somewhat like the one from > > > > >> Shooting Star. I want to make it flexible enough for 3-axis on the > > > > >> lathe (topslide is Z) and for the mill-drill. I am a software guy, > > > so > > > > >> I can do What's Right for the software (just like Shooting Star has - > > > > >> their product is sweet but fairly expensive for my tastes). > > > > >> ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Help truing 4 jaws chuck From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 03 Oct 1999 02:13:56 GMT -------- If this is a 4 jaw INDEPENDENT chuck we are discussing, and IF the jaws are not sloppy in their grooves, then all you need do is remove the jaws and grind the faces square with the bottoms. I did mine (Lightly, with proper eye protection,,yada..yada..yada) on the side of my grinding wheel..checking with an accurate square. The chuck hold "dead knickers" now. If the jaws are LOOSE in the slots..toss it and buy a new chuck! At the prices for good used or new ones, it ain't worth screwing with..certainly if you are fussy to .025" in 16"! If it is a four jaw selt centering chuck follow the same procedure as you used for the three jaw..but substitute "4" for "3" in all the directions. 8^) "Paul-Ernest Lévesque" wrote: > > I have repair the jaws of my 3 jaws chuck with fixture (by grinding the > inside )describe in Scoot Logan web > site. > It is ok now. > Now I wish to repair my 4 jaws chuck which is way out in paralell .025 on a > 16 inches bar lenght, > the backplate is .0000 on the two axes and the body of the chuck is the same > o.k. It obvious that the 4 jaws are way out of paralell. > I was wondering if I was to make another fixture for the 4 jaws(4 jaws holes > instead of 3) and make the holes very precisely, since this time it will not > be self-centering. > I have doubt ????? Does someone have some experience on this or other better > ideas. > Thank you in advance > Paul > pelevesq@globetrotter.qc.ca ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What is this metal? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 03 Oct 1999 03:54:17 GMT -------- Does it glow in the dark ? teenut Chris Reddie wrote: > > Hiya. > > I was out metal detecting today, and I found a lump of someth'n. > > It's about 1/2 the size of my fist, very heavy, and black from the years > in the ground. > > I put it in a chemical solution to clean silver, and it didn't help. There > are hints of a silver sparkle through the black. > > I sawed through it and it was brilliant like silver. I melted a bit of > it, and it was duller than a previously melted Sterling wad. I drilled > it and the hole looked like aluminum, but of course it was too heavy. > > What peaked my interest was that it almost resembled a huge gold nugget, (only > much larger, and of course it was silverish), meaning that it was not > manufactured, as it had had many protruding lumps, and is apparently quite > old. > > Any ideas? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: what goes up; was 'Maadi Griffin' From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 03 Oct 1999 07:26:29 GMT -------- Indicating that it had ricochetted off a flat surface while still going at a high velocity..probably making a noise like a Spaghetti Western!! Yes it could have spoiled your whole day had it hit you! Had this been a bullet that had gone any where close to straight up in the air, it WOULD have returned BASE first at a quite moderate velocity Any (slight) deformation would have been on the base, not the side. teenut Dan Clarke wrote: > > Hi, > I'm not much for all the technical stuff but I'd like to say that I > once found laying on the sidewalk on the fifth of July, a bullet about > a third of an inch in dia., copper coated lead that had landed on its > side and was flattened more than I could have done to is with a > hammer. > Dan ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Weight of lead From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 03 Oct 1999 16:50:17 GMT -------- Now what is so damned difficult to understand about that!! Or is it, that those that DO understand are afraid of what it means? Well put Gary! Thank you, teenut Gary Coffman wrote: > > On Sun, 03 Oct 1999 15:41:09 +1300, tmartin@xtra.co.nz wrote: > >Gosh Gary , how can we get some of this Utopian Government? > >We've only got a democratically elected parliament. > >Tom Martin > > Well, first you have a revolution..... > > Seriously, our nation was born in the crucible of the fire of > revolution, and that did shape it in ways that are different > from the way some other nations were formed. You also > have to discard the collectivist notions of a democracy. > Our nation was formed as a constitutional republic rather > than as a democracy. > > Our founders were rightly suspicious of the whims of the mob > (see classical Athens or the aftermath of the French Revolution > as illustrations of the dangers of that), and designed a system > of government that's intended to temper those whims through > a set of checks and balances on power. The popular passions > of the majority of the moment can't easily change core values > because of those checks and balances. > > It isn't a Utopia, of course, but it started with a different set > of core values that put the rights of the individual ahead of > the whims of the mob, or the interests of a king. Our founders > believed that people have certain inalienable rights that are > an inherent part of their humanity. Governments must not > be allowed to infringe those natural rights. Our constitution > was shaped to limit the ability of the mob, a king, or a dictator > to infringe those individual rights. > > Our founders believed that rights were an inherent part of our > natures, a natural and logical result of our humanity. At base > they believed we have the right to our own lives, and as a natural > result of that, believed that certain other rights needed to preserve > and defend our lives flow from that notion. This is the basis of the > right to own property, engage in commerce, own the means of > personal defense, etc. > > Perhaps the most important of our natural rights, however, is the > right to fail, and suffer the consequences of failure. Our founders > weren't trying to guarantee our prosperity. The Declaration of > Independence says we have the right to *pursue* life, liberty, and > happiness, but doesn't guarantee that we will achieve them. > Enforcing equality of result was repugnant and alien to our founders. > (Unfortunately, it seems a basic tenet of the welfare state.) > > Our founders understood that governments can't grant rights, > which are after all inherent, governments can only grant privileges. > They disliked the notion of privilege with a passion. They believed > that government shouldn't be allowed to create privileged classes, > and they believed that governments shouldn't be allowed to infringe > the natural rights of the individual. These were basic core values. > > Our founders also believed that the individual was the best judge > of how to pursue his own interests. Thomas Jefferson said that the > sole legitimate function of government was to stop one man from > harming another, and in all other things to allow the individual to > pursue his own interests in his own way. The notion of the individual > as sovereign was a new idea. > > Our founders also understood, as was later articulated by Mao, > that all power ultimately flows from the barrel of a gun. So they > made sure that the individual would have a share in that power > as a matter of natural right. That idea is practically unique in the > world today. It creates a dynamic tension in the fabric of society > that is often uncomfortable, but it is ultimately necessary if our > freedoms are to be preserved. > > As Ben Franklin said, those who would trade their essential > freedoms for the illusion of security deserve neither freedom > nor security. > > Now it should be obvious that the US has deviated from some > of these core principles and beliefs over the years, usually to > our detriment. We aren't exactly the nation our founders envisioned. > But we do still hold many of the core values that they articulated. > Our founders were among the brightest, best educated, and most > thoughtful of their time. The core values and principles that they > articulated are based on a sound view of the nature of the world > and the human condition. They are as true today as they were > 200 years ago. > > Gary > Gary Coffman KE4ZV | You make it |mail to ke4zv@bellsouth.net > 534 Shannon Way | We break it | > Lawrenceville, GA | Guaranteed | ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: of chickens and cannons From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 03 Oct 1999 17:01:18 GMT -------- As I heard this old legend, the boot was on the other foot. It was British Aerospace engineers who developed the air cannon (for Concorde etc.) and the dumb NASA Engineers who fired the frozen chicken. Make more sense to me because, until relatively recently, one would have quite a search to come up with a FROZEN chicken in the UK! "Iceboxes" and Refrigerators were not yet common household items..even in the early sixties. FWIW teenut Susan Hill wrote: > > that joke is SO OLD - and besides last time I heard it - it was the Japanese > bullet train engineers and they were all (10-12 of them - as they would) > standing round in lab coats. Thaw the chicken. Oh PLEASE ! > > Brook Hill > >> > > Sometimes it DOES take a rocket scientist: Scientists at NASA built a > >gun specifically to launch dead chickens at the windshields of > >airliners, military jets, and the space shuttle, all traveling at > >maximum velocity. The idea was to simulate the frequent incidents of > >collisions with airborne fowl to test the strength of the windshields. > >British engineers heard about the gun and were eager to test it on the > >windshields of their new high-speed trains. > > > > Arrangements were made, and a gun was sent to the British engineers. > >When the gun was fired, the engineers stood shocked as the chicken > >hurtled out of the barrel, crashed into the shatterproof shield, smashed it > to > >smithereens, blasted through the control console, snapped the engineer's > >backrest in two, and embedded itself in the back wall of the cabin, like > >an arrow shot from a bow. The horrified Brits sent NASA the disastrous > >results of the experiment, along with the designs of the windshield, and > >begged the U.S. scientists for suggestions. > >NASA responded with a one-line memo: "Thaw the chicken." > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Anyone for homemade accessories for Asian 12x36 gearhead lathe? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 03 Oct 1999 20:17:03 GMT -------- I should have made it obvious the the balls are a close fit in the tube!! Teenut John Flanagan wrote: > > On Sun, 03 Oct 1999 02:03:13 GMT, Robert Bastow > wrote: > > >I believe the magnetic steel balls are contained in a non magnetic stainless > >steel tube. > > > >Pretty near bullet proof if you ask me. Plus you can chop it to length with > >impunity. I wouldn't imagine it would be real difficult to lengthen one either. > > The trick would be to find a SS tube with an id identical to your > balls od (SS that is) so that they won't move or ride up on each > other. Perhaps the tube is filled with a low viscosity epoxy with the > balls being held together with light force from each end of the tube. > > John ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Help Need Operator Manual From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 03 Oct 1999 22:03:39 GMT -------- Speaking of bandwidth consumption.. Nigel Eaton (Expansively) wrote: > 'The first thing we do, let's kill all the lawyers' > - William Shakespeare > 'When my client says "kill all the lawyers" he actually > means render all legal practitioners, present, past > or future, practicing or retired, hereinafter referred > to as lawyers, notwithstanding their actual legal status, > expressed or implied, non-vital in the usual legally > accepted sense of that term' - Wm. Shakespeare's lawyer > > ------------ > Nigel Eaton ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: tool box question From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 03 Oct 1999 23:09:39 GMT -------- Traditions die hard! Having said that..I don't recall seeing but two or three of the Gerstner/Kennedy style "Toolmakers" box until I came to N America. I saw similar ones in the Moore and Wright catalogues but no one I worked with had one..probably too damed expensive in those days. Most of us used ex army ammunition boxes..That way you didn't mind so much when someone spiked it to the floor and welded it shut!! I have two of the 11 drawer Kennedy's now and wonder how I did without. The Gerstners are too damned expensive..If I ever want a wooden one myself I will make it out of Walnut or cherry..I don't trust oak around my tools! teenut teenut Trexdiamond wrote: > > i was wondering why the quote machinist boxes dont come with roller bearing > drawers like the tool truck mechanic boxes . i personaly prefer my pretty blue > matco rool around and top box than a brown old kennedy that has sticky drawers > . must admit i was a mechanic before i got into metal working but the box i > have has lasted a long time and still looks and performs like new. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: starting a thread perfectly square From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 04 Oct 1999 11:42:59 GMT -------- Now why, in a lifetime of cutting metal, had I never thought of that?? Thanks Fred. teenut fredcf@my-deja.com wrote: > If the rod is short enough and small enough in diameter, you could > chuck it in the drill press and clamp the die to the table, couldn't > you? It'd be the reverse of the method of tapping a hole. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Recommend to buy a die filler? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 04 Oct 1999 11:50:47 GMT -------- Obsolescent might be a better term..I certainly wouldn't want to run a commercial shop without one tucked away somewhere. Like shapers..there are just some jobs where they are the cat's meow! With a bit of practice you can do very fine and accurate work. Machine files are available..expensive!! But most you can make yourself from standard files. Top Names..Keller, Milwaukee. Prices $100 to $350.00 Make sure you get the support arm with it. teenut SSmith1636 wrote: > > I have heard die fillers are obsolete, also they are hard to find on the > West Coast. Would you suggest this tool for a home shop? What price range > would I expect to be looking at? Short of an EDM is there another tool to do > this with. > Scott > "Nothing is impossible for the guy not doing the work." ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: starting a thread perfectly square From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 04 Oct 1999 18:29:52 GMT -------- Mostly true..though there were periods of famine between the feasts!! During those times I either did without, bought threaded rod, or could cut a thread with a die stock with fair accuracy..the good 'ole eyeball rarely lets me down. teenut Mike Graham wrote: > > On Mon, 04 Oct 1999 11:42:59 GMT, Robert Bastow wrote: > >Now why, in a lifetime of cutting metal, had I never thought of that?? > > Because you were always near a lathe. 8-) > > -- > Mike Graham, mikegraham at sprint dot ca > Caledon, Ontario, Canada (just NW of Toronto). > > Raiser of animals. Weldor of metals. Driver of off-road vehicles. > Writer of FAQs. Keeper of the faith, and all around okay guy. > > < homepage currently off-line due to change of ISP; back soon > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 5C collet chuck - Camlok From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 05 Oct 1999 03:22:51 GMT -------- I have yet to come across a camlock spindle that didn't have a witness mark on it..usually half way between two of the key sockets. As a matter of course I mark, usually with a stamped "0", the chuck socket that gives me the most accurate centering and arrange for this to be always mounted in the same relationship to the camlock backplate. For "rough" jobs I don't care which socket I use to tighten the chuck. But on rare occassions where I need a job "reasonably" accurate I will tighted up with the marked jaw. Usually one finds that the initial accuracy of tightening can be improved with a DTI and a couple of taps with a dead blow hammer. More accurate jobs of course go in the collets..even then a little twisting or tapping can give a marked improvement in the TIR. "Dead Nuts" jobs go in the 4 jaw..Which, if a choice has to be made when first tooling up, is the workholder to get first. It is surprising how fast and accurate one can true work in a 4 jaw..given a bit of practice. teenut "Dennis A. Armstrong" wrote: > > One good technique with camlok spindles is to mark one of the spindle holes, > and then mark each different chuck so that you can always put the same pin > into the same hole. This will make the mount up much more consistent. > > Dennis A. Armstrong > armstdaa@3-cities.com > Inventing is a combination of brains and materials. > The more brains you use, the less material you need > . ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: starting a thread perfectly square From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 05 Oct 1999 03:31:25 GMT -------- Even a clapped out old lathe, in the hands of an expert, will produce threads far superior to any die. The differences in finish, thread pitch accuracy, and "squareness" will be magnified the longer the thread length and the finer the pitch. For a quick dirty job, a couple of passes with a single point tool and a fast waft over with a die, will usually suffice. But on a job where thread pitch and squareness are important..say the bearing retaining end caps for a grinding spindle..you shouldn't allow your dies anywhere near the job. teenut Lou Boyd wrote: > > Assuming one has both a lathe and a die of the correct size, what is > usually easiest and what produces the best quality threads. Use 1"x20 > threads on a 1" steel rod for this example. Is it better to cut by hand > using the lathe to only start the die, to do the entire cutting on the > lathe using a single 60 degree tool, or to to cut the thread nearly to > size on the lathe then run the die over it. Would a commercial die or a > typical 12" Atlas lathe produce more uniform threads? > > -- > Lou Boyd ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Gorton engraving cutters and fonts needed From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 05 Oct 1999 05:38:11 GMT -------- I recently bought a Deckel 3D Pantograph..it came without Fonts!! Maybe you and I should split the cost of a set and reproduce them. After all, that's what these machines do best!! I am keeping my eyes open for the type of Draughtsmans lettering templates that aare engraved on black plastic. My machine will scale UP as well as Down (I imagine they all will) so I will produce a couple of type sets that way. I sure am not going to pay full new price for a set. My machine cost almost as much to ship as it did to buy..that seems par for the course as distances increase and weights go up. Unfortunately I don't have much option as the South East is a desert when it comes to used machinery Dealers. teenut Robert Mitchell wrote: > > I just obtained an antique (1942) Gorton 3U pantographic engraver, > and I am looking for Gorton taper cutters and 1.25" fonts for it. > > I have already determined that I can not afford the new price on these. > > If anyone has any they could part with, or knows who might, > please let me know... > > Note to EBay shoppers: it cost as much to ship a machine like > this across the country as the purchase price. > Almost twice what the used machinery dealer estimated, so be careful. > > - Robert Mitchell - rmm20@worldnet.att.net ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Mars space shot From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 05 Oct 1999 13:32:38 GMT -------- I didn't know that they still built castles in Wausau WI ;^) teenut Peter Drumm wrote: > > I recently heard about a drawbridge that was built not far from here, ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Thermal Expansion Question From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 05 Oct 1999 13:45:41 GMT -------- Dave Baker wrote: A couple of > thou is not hard to get between just turned and cooled off temp on a lathe job. And another half thou if you leave your micrometer on the hot lathe headstock!! teenut Pet Peeve..Tray Top lathe headstocks!! Lathes should have nice rounded tops...like Hardinges and Colchesters, Monarchs, etc. The tray top is a recent abomination! Reason..Safety! I saw a kid get a faceful of assorted tools, shims, micrometers, etc, when a rag he had on the tray got tangled in the chuck and threw everything on the tray at him!! Knocked out a couple of teeth..he was lucky not to be blinded or worse. I had the pattern shop make up sloping shields to prevent it happening again. God knows what the liability situation would be like nowadays! Other reason...The above mentioned heat effect on measuring tools. Yes I have one on my Maximat Super II. No I don't leave anything on it!! Grouchy this morning!! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Large Lazy Susan Bearing From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 05 Oct 1999 14:05:16 GMT -------- I have been looking for a LARGE, (CHEAP) lazy susan type bearing for a while now. I want to mount my table saw on it!! I have got to the stage in my shop, where I don't have space to both cross cut and rip an 8'x4' sheet without swiveling my 10" Powermatic through 90 deg. I hate the kind of wheels or trolleys supplied to do this..If nothing else they are a PITA to sweep around. The "Design Decision" has been made that the saw will pivot on a center pintle and that location and locking will be accomplished by foot operated, jacking/leveling feet on the outboard end of the extension table. Up until now I had decided that the pivoting would take place on two opposed sheets of formica faced plywood..this is not exactly a high speed, or even, frequently used, bearing. However, recent mention of a used truck trailer bearing caught my eye..(Geoff Merryweather..Building a Welding Positioner). Before I go galloping down to my local truck stop to steal one ;^)..How big are these things? Diameter and height? For stability I would need about 24" diameter and would prefer height to be right at 2"..so I can pocket it into the 2" raised floor in my shop. Thanks, teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Paint that sticks to polyethylene sheet? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 05 Oct 1999 14:09:27 GMT -------- Dead right Gordon! Polyethylene bottles etc., that are to be printed, are first passed briefly through a gas flame. The process is called "Activation" teenut gcouger wrote: > > I believe that polyethylene surfaces can be rendered active enough > to take paint and glue by passing a flame over them, bombarding them > with ion's and possibly radiation. > > If I remember correctly you just want to knock the shine off using an > oxidizing flame. > > It also works to get epoxy to stick to PVC. Or it did for West Epoxy. > > Gordon > > Gordon Couger gcouger@couger.com > Stillwater, OK ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Gorton engraving cutters and fonts needed From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 05 Oct 1999 14:12:51 GMT -------- I have replied privately to John regarding this very generous offer. I will, however, say (another, very public,) Thank you! teenut John Stevenson wrote: > > On Tue, 05 Oct 1999 05:38:11 GMT, Robert Bastow wrote: > > >I recently bought a Deckel 3D Pantograph..it came without Fonts!! > > > >Maybe you and I should split the cost of a set and reproduce them. After all, > >that's what these machines do best!! > > > >I am keeping my eyes open for the type of Draughtsmans lettering templates that > >aare engraved on black plastic. > > > >My machine will scale UP as well as Down (I imagine they all will) so I will > >produce a couple of type sets that way. > > > >I sure am not going to pay full new price for a set. > > > Hey there Robert Sir, > > How about I engrave a full set of letters and numbers plus :,;'[ ] and the other > stuff on a sheet of perspex and mail it to you. > I could do uppercase on one side and lower on the other. > Shouldn't cost much to send but anyway I'm over in CA at the end of this month I > could drop it in the US mail. > > Let me know if you want this and some idea of sizes. > -- > > Regards, > > John Stevenson at > L Stevenson [Engineers] > Nottingham, England. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Gorton engraving cutters and fonts needed From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 05 Oct 1999 14:17:22 GMT -------- I assume you mean the tapered, single edge, engraving cutters with parallel shanks? I got a couple extra in 1/4" diameter..If you contact me off list with your address I will mail one to you to get you going. You will see that they are very easy to make yourself. teenut Robert Mitchell wrote: > > I just obtained an antique (1942) Gorton 3U pantographic engraver, > and I am looking for Gorton taper cutters ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: American Precision Museum needs a Director! From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 05 Oct 1999 14:20:28 GMT -------- Pick ME..Pick MEEEE!! Trouble is..You would have to move it to Atlanta. I don't DO snow anymore!! ;^) teenut Erik Larson wrote: > > Hello Members of the rec.crafts.metalworking. > > My name is Erik Larson, I am from Windsor Vermont. You have probably > seen some of my postings here before and I see this group of wonderful > people helping each other as an incredible resource. I have had the > great fortune to be associated with the American Precision Museum in > Windsor Vermont and I have become good friends with it's founder Edwin > Battison over the last couple years. Ed is now 85 years old and the > American Precision Museum is looking for a new Director. Finding just > the right person with just the right mix of skills is very important to > this incredible museum and I am hoping that someone in the group will be > > able to direct us to such a person. I am pasting in the inquiry that the > > museum has out for a new director to this posting. Please reply directly > > to the museum at the below address . If you are not familiar with the > nature of APM or need any further help you may email me directly with > questions but I am not the one to talk to about applying for the > position. My email is erikl@dieco.com. > > Also if you are into the history of machine tools and precision > manufacturing, please consider becoming a member and supporter of this > fine museum and collection. You may become a member at the website > http://www.americanprecision.org or by contacting the museum at the > address below. > > Thank You. > > Erik Larson > > ...................................................................................................................................... > > Executive Director > > The American Precision Museum in Windsor, Vermont seeks a technically > oriented director who would enjoy working with an enthusiastic, 25 > member volunteer Board and small staff. The Museum is housed in the > brick, 4 story Robbins, Kendall and Lawrence armory built in 1846 and > now a National Historic Landmark. Here the first guns with > interchangeable parts were manufactured. The Museum contains one of the > largest collections of antique machine tools and measuring devices in > the country. Its mission statement is: "The American Precision Museum > is the national center for the collection, preservation and the > interpretation of the history of precision manufacturing. Our mission > is to enhance the public understanding of the importance of precision > manufacture, the ingenuity and the entrepreneurial spirit which drive > it, and its effect on our everyday lives." Scenic Windsor is known as > the birthplace of the Vermont State Constitution and is just off I91 and > > south of I89. Applicants should have at least five years of experience > in Museum management, and salary will be commensurate with experience. > Send resume and/or a request for a complete job description and further > details regarding the Museum to: 'American > Precision Museum, PO Box 679, Windsor, VT'. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: rollforming lubricant for Galv From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 05 Oct 1999 14:38:45 GMT -------- What is the nature of the build up (compressed flakes of zinc?) and where is it taking place? Just as Forgivness is easier to get than Permission..Prevention is better than Cure!! I can imagine that any added lube, be it oil grease or wax, will bring all kinds of downline problems with it. Have you looked at mechanical solutions? Wiper or Doctor blades, revolving wire brushes on the rollers, coupled with air jets or suction to remove the detritus before it can get compacted. I would also imagine that a regular, scheduling of roller cleaning BEFORE the build up gets out of hand, will have to be part of your solution too. I assume the form rollers are hardened steel? If not..they should be and well polished to boot. There are a variety of bake on, anti stick coatings available nowadays..but however good they are, they WILL need refurbishing from time to time. Have you tried Molybdenum treatment? Rather than being a "grease" this, once applied, becomes a "plating" on the metal at an almost molecular level. I have a spray can of stuff called "Dri Slide" that I bought to protect and lubricate the surfaces of my table saw and planers. Sprayed on (like Johnsons Pledge) it is buffed to a shine before using the machine. Wonderful stuff! NOTHING sticks to it..not resins, pitch, paint, layout dye, rusty palmprints..Nothing! teenut cjmetal@ix.netcom.com wrote: > > I am looking for the best way to cut down on build up from running > galvanized sheet stock through a roll forming machine. We have tried > several types of lubricants, and each has it's disadvantages. Any > suggestions. > > Augie > > -- > * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * > C & J Metal Products Inc > 6925 Downey Avenue > Long Beach CA 90805 > 562-634-3101 > 800-500-8660 > 562-634-8823Fax http://www.CJMetals.com > > ADOBE ACROBAT READER download: > http://www.adobe.com/prodindex/acrobat/readstep.html#reader ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: starting a thread perfectly square From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 05 Oct 1999 14:50:53 GMT -------- Ground thread, HSS dies ARE available..at a HIGH price, especially in the smaller sizes. Even then, there is (I suppose) a lower limit to size. You are correct though Kenneth..the run-of-the-mill, cut thread, die from Rangoon or wherever, is an abomination! The worst problems being threads out of square with the body and burrs left in the thread when the relief holes are drilled. A quick waft with a mounted grinding point, in the relief holes, will improve performance no end in that respect. A drunken thread never sobers up though!! teenut...who doesn't go to meetings anymore! ;^) kenneth knaell wrote: > > These posts on how to get the most precision out of our tools are great. > The difference between what I could do when I first started out and what I > can do now is simply an accumulated reporatorie (the French word) of ways to > do things when a situation presents itself. > > Anyway what I wanted to say was threading dies seem to me to be an inferior > product compared to threading taps in general because I have never seen a > small die that had ground threads. If I had one with ground threads then I > might believe that the axis of the thread form inside the die was actually > perpendicular to the ground face of the die but with the thread profile made > the way it is, it seems that these things don't measure up to good taps (if > they can be compared). It looks like the threads are made the way cheap > hardened tools usually are made - the metal is cut and then it is hardened. > with all the shortcomings involved. > ken knaell ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Paint that sticks to polyethylene sheet? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 05 Oct 1999 14:54:05 GMT -------- Robert Bastow wrote: > > Dead right Gordon! > > Polyethylene bottles etc., that are to be printed, are first passed briefly > through a gas flame. > > The process is called "Activation" > > teenut > Or maybe that's "Passivation" ! It has been a long time, and ICRS!!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Large Lazy Susan Bearing From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 05 Oct 1999 20:28:57 GMT -------- "Geoff Merryweather." wrote: > It is a few years since I used on on the jig I mentioned previously, > but from memory they are around 24"dimaeter and 3-4" tall, and pretty > heavy Sounds just about right! This puppy is HEAVY..about 400 pounds I guess. I will go and see if I can scare one up. Thanks to all for your help. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Large Lazy Susan Bearing From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 05 Oct 1999 20:35:16 GMT -------- Hmm the nylon balls sound interesting. The "Race" material would have to be pretty tough..this tablesaw weighs at least 400 pounds. Then I ask myself about keeping out sawdust (lots of it about under a cabinet saw!!) The Idea of UHMV slide blocks on a formica plate sounds increasingly attractive..with a center pintle of course. I don't think wear will be a problem..if it does the equivalent of 100 complete revolutions in my remaining lifetime..I need to quit and get back to cutting metal!! teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article <37FA0652.6D374CE8@home.com>, > Robert Bastow wrote: > > I have been looking for a LARGE, (CHEAP) lazy susan type bearing > > Another thought - just make your own! We did this because we > needed a large non-magnetic turntable for an experiment - nylon > balls from McMaster Carr, and we turned two V-grooves as races > in a couple of pieces of phenolic. > > Finding the right material for this (that would support the > balls and not brinell) might be a bit tricky, but if you could > find some sheet of the correct type (really tough masonite, > maybe?) and had a lathe large enough to trepan in the race, > it works fine. > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: M Head right angle spindle adaptor From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 05 Oct 1999 20:49:15 GMT -------- This item on ebay may interest those with M head Bridgports. Price right now, with 16 hrs to go is $45.00 FWIW teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: home saw mill ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 05 Oct 1999 20:57:14 GMT -------- That is a CHUNK of wood to tackle!! Before making your own "sawmill" Check to see if there are any MOBILE units in your area. Do a search on mobile sawmills, find a couple of the (many) manufacturers and ask them if they can point you to the nearest contractor. They do this as a service to THEIR customers. This is what I did and found a couple of units. Both refused to cut my tree up because it was a big-a$$ed Hickory! Thet said it would wear their blades out too fast..and, unless I planned on making a LOT of axe handles!!.it was worth more as firewood! Burns beautifully!! teenut Bob Frazier wrote: > > I have a large oak trunk I'd like to make into some smaller lumber. I > haven't found a sawmill in the metro Twin City Minnesota area, and I was > thinking of setting up a one time use machine to cut this without moving the > wood. It's pretty large, about 24 inches in diameter and 12 ft. long. I was > thinking of something along the lines of an electric hacksaw, scaled up a > bit. This would be an electric motor making a wheel go round that would saw > a heavy blade back and forth. Maybe a couple pieces of pipe to guide the rig > down the length of the log, with something to move it every so often. I'm > sure this has been tried before. I did look for rec.crafts woodworking but > they don't seem to be on my server - or if I recall correctly that wasn't > the name anyway. > Any ideas? Thx, Bob > > (dropped the 80 ft tree in the 90 foot yard with the help of a come along, > tow ropes, and the Sub wagon. The Sub wagon had it's back wheels almost off > the ground when it was pulling!) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Large Lazy Susan Bearing From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 05 Oct 1999 21:03:16 GMT -------- You may have something there Gunner! With the lesser (though substantial) weight of my saw I may be able to work it of my (NOISY!!) shop vac. I haven't yet found a need for an air compressor in my shop..it will have to wait until I run out of "STUFF" to buy!! ;^) Thanks Gunner wrote: > > On Tue, 05 Oct 1999 14:05:16 GMT, Robert Bastow > wrote: > > >I have been looking for a LARGE, (CHEAP) lazy susan type bearing for a while > >now. > > > >I want to mount my table saw on it!! > > > >I have got to the stage in my shop, where I don't have space to both cross cut > >and rip an 8'x4' sheet without swiveling my 10" Powermatic through 90 deg. > > > >I hate the kind of wheels or trolleys supplied to do this..If nothing else they > >are a PITA to sweep around. The "Design Decision" has been made that the saw > >will pivot on a center pintle and that location and locking will be accomplished > >by foot operated, jacking/leveling feet on the outboard end of the extension > >table. > A gent who has a production shop at his home, showed me his turntable > for a full sized Harding HC. He took a plate of 3/8 plate steel, and > drilled and tapped a 3/8 pipe fitting in the center. He then screwed > in a air fitting, and placed the lathe on the plate. When he wants to > move the beast, he simply fires up the air compressor, attaches a hose > and blows in air. That 2500lb machine rides right up off the floor on > a very thin cushion of air and he simply pushes it to where he wants > it. When moved he turns off the air and it is SOLID on the concrete > floor. I would imagine that someone could do the same thing with a > stiff layer of plywood under the saw, with a pivot in the center. Its > self cleaning too :) > > Gunner > > > > >Up until now I had decided that the pivoting would take place on two opposed > >sheets of formica faced plywood..this is not exactly a high speed, or even, > >frequently used, bearing. > > > >However, recent mention of a used truck trailer bearing caught my eye..(Geoff > >Merryweather..Building a Welding Positioner). > > > >Before I go galloping down to my local truck stop to steal one ;^)..How big are > >these things? Diameter and height? For stability I would need about 24" > >diameter and would prefer height to be right at 2"..so I can pocket it into the > >2" raised floor in my shop. > > > >Thanks, > > > >teenut > > --------------------------------------------------------- > > "A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an > invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write > a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort > the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, > solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program > a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die > gallantly. Specialization is for insects." Robert Heinlein > > Free Hobby Buy/Swap/Sell Website > www.cyberg8t.com/gunner/hsm/index.html > > Home Page > http://userzweb.lightspeed.net/gunner ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: MSC Warehouse Reduction Sale From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 05 Oct 1999 21:06:48 GMT -------- Me too!! I'll have to ask SWMBO for my next two month's allowance in advance! I wonder what I will be able to get for my $12.00 ;^) teenut Skarsaune wrote: > > Got this flyer sitting here in front of me, thought members of the > group near Atlanta might be interested: > > MSC Industrial Supply is having a Warehouse Reduction Sale 10/7-10/9 at > the Mableton, GA location. From the flyer: "Over $1,000,000 in inventory > must go. Savings from 20%-50% off catalog prices. Extra volume discounts, > dealers welcome, special dealer discounts." Thursday and Friday 9am to 5pm, > Sat. 9am-2pm. "Over 80 machines, hand tools, cutting tools, power tools, > abrasives, adhesives...", yada yada yada. "All items are close-outs, > discontinued, and limited in supply. 6700 Discovery Blvd, Mableton, GA 30126. > Call 1-800-617-3671 x8555 for more information." > In the fine print it says payment in cash or credit card, checks accepted w/ > MSC account in good standing. "No returns. No refunds. All merchandise sold > as is. No warranties." "Machines may have been returned, freight damaged, > or have missing parts." > Thought y'all might like to know. I'll be there bright and early Thursday am. > Not affiliated with MSC except as a too frequent customer. > > Chuck Skarsaune > Oaktree Machine & Engineering ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Casting Lead Sheet From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 05 Oct 1999 23:25:50 GMT -------- The "Float Glass" process was developed by Pilkingtons in the UK. The objective of using tin..as opposed to sodium, lead, sulphur or whatever, is that it: Being liquid, imparts a dead flat surface to the underside of the glass. Being hot, it keeps the glass hot and fluid long enough for top surface imperfections to level out. It remains liquid at a temperature BELOW that at which glass becomes rigid enough to cut, handle and remove...this is a continuous process..molten glass being metered (doctored) onto the surface of a LOOOONG tank of molten tin, cooling as it moves allong and being removed in solid, cut lengths of top grade plate glass at the other end. Tin is non toxic and (relatively) non reactive nor does it vaporise readily at the temperatures involved. It is relatively inexpensive. The Float glass process was the worlds first CONTINUOUS plate glass process and was licensed all over the world by Pilkingtons. The plants where float glass is made are the hottest places on the face of the earth!! teenut T Mulone wrote: > > You don't want to chil the glass when you float it on the metal or it will > crack. On the other hand, You don't want to add heat to the already molten > glass. I suspect that the melting point of tin is a good match for the hot > glass. > Tim ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Making a dividing plate. From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 06 Oct 1999 00:12:20 GMT -------- So how would you make a 31 tooth or a 127 tooth gear? teenut Mike Graham wrote: > > I was just browsing through TMBSR#2, and I was reading the direction for > making an accurate dividing plate. This is a *very* time consuming and > difficult method, indeed. Let me tell you how you do it the easy way. Go > to the local farm supply and buy yourself a 60-tooth sprocket for #35 chain. > You've probably already figured it out. Now, a weld-on sprocket will cost > you about $10 Canadian ($7 US) and be at LEAST as precise as the method that > Lautard describes. The sprockets come without a hub; various sizes of hubs > can be had, which is a benefit because you can buy a 1/2" hub for the > sprocket and use a piece of 1/2" drill rod as a pivot for your dividing > plate blank, or whatever. The same 'springy indexing finger' will work > wonders on the gear as on the buttons. > > (by the way, I appreciate that the whole point of the Lautard missive was > to describe the production from first principles, but I'd use the sprocket, > for sure). > > I suggested a 60 tooth sprocket because it's so easy to halve, quarter, > etc. For 5 degree indexing you can use a 72 tooth sprocket. > > -- > Mike Graham, mikegraham at sprint dot ca > Caledon, Ontario, Canada (just NW of Toronto). > > Raiser of animals. Weldor of metals. Driver of off-road vehicles. > Writer of FAQs. Keeper of the faith, and all around okay guy. > > < homepage currently off-line due to change of ISP; back soon > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Making a dividing plate. From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 06 Oct 1999 02:13:36 GMT -------- I guess my point is, that the use of a "standard" gear has it's uses..probably covers 90% of what most home shop guys need to do anyway. I wasn't criticizing the method, and I'm sorry that it did rather seem to come across that way. Far from it, I use it myself whenever possible. HOWEVER!! (You knew that was coming, Huh!) The simple system breaks down when you want to divide in prime numbers..31 being a prime number. Would I ever want to cut a 31 tooth gear? God I hope not..but I can!! 127 tooth?...that is a standard metric translation gear..a prime number! The "Complex" methods used to generate division plates ARE necessary in certain circumstances. I just finished building a little dividing head with a 40 to 1 worm gear. I needed to drill rings of holes in my index plates that included 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 23, 26, 27, 29, 31, 33, 37, 39, 41, 43, 47 and 49 (don't jump down my throat if that sequence isn't exactly right..it's from memory OK!!) Some of the rings I was able to generate by simple indexing from "Master" gears etc., at hand. Others by angular dividing and yet others had to be laid out by hand. The method I used..layout on a large disc, transfer via dividing head to slave disc and then via dividing head to the master discs ensured that any errors were infinitesimally small. (Each transfer through the 40 - 1 gear reduces the error by a factor of 40) BTW..I STILL can't generate a 127 tooth gear from all the above!!..I would have to make a special master plate to do that...but I do know how! Hopefully I will never need to...but if I shear all the teeth off the 127 tooth gear on my Maximat (again)!! I certainly will NOT pay the $135.00 replacement cost of the last one. I now can make my own!! teenut Mike Graham wrote: > > On Wed, 06 Oct 1999 00:12:20 GMT, Robert Bastow wrote: > > >So how would you make a 31 tooth or a 127 tooth gear? > > 31? Is this like that 8.1 tpi leadscrew we just had on here? 8-) > Seriously, you want 31 holes in a dividing plate? I can do 30 or 32, but > not 31. Well, I can file a tooth off of the 32... 8-) > Are these 'magical' numbers for some weird usage? I suspect that if I > really wanted to I could find sprockets with that number of teeth, but I'm > curious why it would be useful. I can't think of any reason off of the top > of my head. > > -- > Mike Graham, mikegraham at sprint dot ca > Caledon, Ontario, Canada (just NW of Toronto). > > Raiser of animals. Weldor of metals. Driver of off-road vehicles. > Writer of FAQs. Keeper of the faith, and all around okay guy. > > < homepage currently off-line due to change of ISP; back soon > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Question about Shot-Peening Vs. Forging (Crankshafts) From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 06 Oct 1999 02:26:05 GMT -------- UntMaintco wrote: > Heres another story on Chevy cranks They are poured inline all of the throws > in a row. When they are cooling they twist the throws in to place. This is why > the casting line is not straight down the middle of the shaft rather its on > every counter weight. I dont know if this is 100% true but its in HP books How > to rebuild a Big Block Chevy. > > Think Forged > Tom I dunno much about High performance engines..but Quite a bit about forging and casting. The writers have probably got their cast and forged cranks twisted..when it comes to twisting. Casting a crank with its throws in correct angular relationship is dead easy..and even the nodular high tensile Irons and semi steels used, would not allow them to be twisted to that degree, hot or cold! On the other hand, drop forging a crank, in an open die with all the throws in the right places would be next to impossible. Forged steel does lend itself to twisting..so that is most likely the way they are done. The "Casting" line could well be a casting line on a mould..nothing says they have to be all in a line. Forgings ALSO have a parting line..which is what you can see on a forged crank..before and after twisting. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Large Lazy Susan Bearing From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 06 Oct 1999 02:34:48 GMT -------- No, I'm serious..I don't have an air compressor yet. I just haven't found a real need for one. I have a hankering for a *little* one..just so I can run a small bead blaster..I love the finish effect on weldments and castings. Other than that..what else would I need one for ..for MY purposes. (Nasty Noisy things) ;^) Not going to turn a free one down though..so pass the hat if you will! teenut eberlein wrote: > > Admit it Robert, > > This is a slick idea! Almost worth $200 to try out (are you serious, you don't have an > air compressor? I will offer a donation/help take up a collection). No, you don't > have to blow off chips from machines; even I don't do that (anymore). > > Regards, > > Eberlein 10/5/00 > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > You may have something there Gunner! With the lesser (though substantial) > > weight of my saw I may be able to work it of my (NOISY!!) shop vac. > > > > I haven't yet found a need for an air compressor in my shop..it will have to > > wait until I run out of "STUFF" to buy!! ;^) > > > > Thanks > > > > Gunner wrote: ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Making a dividing plate. From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 06 Oct 1999 02:37:42 GMT -------- Felice Luftschein & Nicholas Carter wrote: > > On Wed, 06 Oct 1999 00:12:20 GMT, Robert Bastow > wrote: > > >So how would you make a 31 tooth or a 127 tooth gear? > You'ld use the 60 tooth sproket to generate a 60 tooth worm gear, make > an worm gear indexer with that, and then make the odd gears. Not without introducing prime numbers in way of index plates you wouldn't!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: ideas for ball screws From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 06 Oct 1999 02:41:47 GMT -------- With fifteen of the suckers to play with, you could have a servo drive on your mail box lid if you wanted!! You would still have a few left over to give to your friends. Your Friend teenut 8^) Trexdiamond wrote: > > happened to go through the scrap truck that comes around and hauls off our > waste steel at work today and found a stack of bubble wrapped ball screw shafts > with the ball nuts on them . he said they were from the medical supply place > down the road . they are about eighteen inches long and > an inch in diameter with a bearing seat on both ends and a key way for driving > the shaft . i was wondering if anyone had any ideas for projects for these. i > have about fifteen of them . > > needless to say i will be checking the scrap truck every week from now on !!! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Large Lazy Susan Bearing From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 06 Oct 1999 02:51:50 GMT -------- George Willer wrote: > > Hey Teenut! How about making your own lazy susan bearing? > A man of your talents should be able to make such a device about as quickly > as it took for this old hunt and peck typist to type the description. > True..but I'm getting lazy! I thought maybe if I could go to the nearest truck stop and pick one up for free.,(a BEARING not a hooker!!) then I could fit it and write in to the NG and gloat about my success! (Isn't that what it is all about? ;^) Guess I'm gonna have to make one though..and in view of the low speed, low stress application, I will stay with a simple plain bearing. Hey, if it is good enough for the Hubble telescope (or whatever) it is good enough for my table saw!! Thanks to every one for their help..I have stashed away a few ideas for other projects. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Making a dividing plate. From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 06 Oct 1999 02:55:08 GMT -------- Mike, with your obvious talents I feel sure you could find a 127 tooth sprocket ANY TIME you wanted to!! ;^) Probably find one on a French tractor!! teenut Mike Graham wrote: > > On Wed, 06 Oct 1999 02:13:36 GMT, Robert Bastow wrote: > > >127 tooth?...that is a standard metric translation gear..a prime number! > > Aahhhhhh... 127 x 2 = 254, 25.4mm = 1 inch. Gotcha. > > I still think that I could find a 127 tooth sprocket if I wanted one. > > -- > Mike Graham, mikegraham at sprint dot ca > Caledon, Ontario, Canada (just NW of Toronto). > > Raiser of animals. Weldor of metals. Driver of off-road vehicles. > Writer of FAQs. Keeper of the faith, and all around okay guy. > > < homepage currently off-line due to change of ISP; back soon > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Need source for octagon ts From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 06 Oct 1999 03:12:49 GMT -------- Good Luck in your search..I haven't seen any octagon bar for sale for years. However, your query does beg the question...Why not have the students FORGE the octagon from square or round. If at first it doesn't look as pretty as the store boughten stuff..then they need more practice in forging!! Isn't that the object of the exercise? Come to think of it, I don't think I have more than a couple of octagon chisels or punches in my entire (large) collection!! Most are square, rectangular, hexagonal or flattened rounds in section..anything that won't roll off the bench or anvil stump!! teenut James Peter wrote: > > I need a source for about 50 feet of 1/2 inch octagon, water hardening (w1) > tool steel. I teach a forging class and our starting project is a 6 inch > chisel made from this material. For year I've bought it from Recto-Alloy, > Elk Grove, IL but recently they haven't been able to supply it. They claim > no one manufactures it anymore. I hope they're wrong. I been getting by > using square stock but the results aren't nearly as satisfactory. > > Thanks in advance, > > Jim ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Thermal Expansion Question From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 06 Oct 1999 03:14:53 GMT -------- Why would you keep your battery charger on top of the lathe or refrigerator?? AAsberry wrote: > > >> I had the pattern shop make up sloping shields to prevent it happening > >again. > > > >Ha! I've been wanting to build a pyramid top for our refridgerator > >for years. Yup, a hollow plywood pyramid that would sucessfully > >prevent the accumulation of junk up there - I really hate it > >when it gets loaded to the angle of repose. One bounce and there's > >a rain of 'stuff' that descends on the victim. > > > >> Grouchy this morning!! > > > >No more so than ususal.... > > > >Jim > > > > Ditto for battery chargers... > > Andy > > Prescription without diagnosis is malpractice. In medicine and mechanics. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Question about Shot-Peening Vs. Forging (Crankshafts) From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 06 Oct 1999 03:17:46 GMT -------- You forget Pete! I have never SEEN a vee 8 crank..racing or otherwise!! Where I come from they were all fours, sixes and twelves ;^) teenut PLAlbrecht wrote: > > >On the other hand, drop forging a crank, in an open die with all the throws > >in > >the right places would be next to impossible. Forged steel does lend itself > >to > >twisting..so that is most likely the way they are done. > > Don't know the details of how the forged versions are made, but conventional V8 > cranks have their throws in two planes. And the Porsche flat-6 crank, which I > know is forged (look at a picture of one, the webs are so thin you'd never be > able to make a casting hold together) has three planes of throws. > > There is another configuration of V8 crank, though -- the flat crank. All > throws in one plane. Normally used for racing only. This should be easy enough > to forge in an open die. > > Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: starting a thread perfectly square From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 06 Oct 1999 03:22:59 GMT -------- Ain't that the truth..I picked up a couple of Geometric heads and a bushel basket of chasers for a song. Quite frankly..a waste of time and money in the home shop. In the time it takes to change the die (always the wrong one in there) and set it up I can have singlepointed a dozen, more accurate threads! They are going on Ebay !!! teenut Jack Erbes wrote: the > geometric heads are probably nice but I have never owned one. They seem > more like a production shop item. > > -- > Jack in Sonoma, CA, USA (jack@vom.com) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Making a dividing plate. From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 06 Oct 1999 03:26:01 GMT -------- For many purposes, angular division is quite adequate..even for making division plates!! However, for gears and splines, it is not accurate enough! teenut Alan Mimms wrote: > > Forgive the newbie question, but why oh why are division plates so > vital for all of these indexing operations? Can't one simply > accurately generate the angles given a rotary table or dividing head > by dialing the angles up? The rotary table I have (8 inch) has 360 > degrees around the circumference and each rotation of the gets me 4 > degrees. If I rotate the handle by a very small increment, I can get > 10 second resolution. Isn't that enough? All I need do to utilize > this is to use my degrees/minutes/seconds calculator to tell me how > much to turn for each tooth of the gear and make a table. Or I could > even use a spreadsheet (I use StarOffice) if I wanted to to generate > one and print it out. Would the result be somehow inferior? > -- > Alan Mimms > Home machinist in (self) training. > E-mail: alanm@unforgettable.com > Metalworking web page: http://alanm.penguinpowered.com/metalworking > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Original Message <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< > > On 10/5/99, 4:03:30 PM, mikegraham@sprint.ca (Mike Graham) wrote > regarding Making a dividing plate.: > > > I was just browsing through TMBSR#2, and I was reading the direction > for > > making an accurate dividing plate. This is a *very* time consuming > and > > difficult method, indeed. Let me tell you how you do it the easy way. > Go > > to the local farm supply and buy yourself a 60-tooth sprocket for #35 > chain. > > You've probably already figured it out. Now, a weld-on sprocket will > cost > > you about $10 Canadian ($7 US) and be at LEAST as precise as the > method that > > Lautard describes. The sprockets come without a hub; various sizes of > hubs > > can be had, which is a benefit because you can buy a 1/2" hub for the > > sprocket and use a piece of 1/2" drill rod as a pivot for your > dividing > > plate blank, or whatever. The same 'springy indexing finger' will > work > > wonders on the gear as on the buttons. > > > (by the way, I appreciate that the whole point of the Lautard > missive was > > to describe the production from first principles, but I'd use the > sprocket, > > for sure). > > > I suggested a 60 tooth sprocket because it's so easy to halve, > quarter, > > etc. For 5 degree indexing you can use a 72 tooth sprocket. > > > -- > > Mike Graham, mikegraham at sprint dot ca > > Caledon, Ontario, Canada (just NW of Toronto). > > > Raiser of animals. Weldor of metals. Driver of off-road vehicles. > > Writer of FAQs. Keeper of the faith, and all around okay guy. > > > < homepage currently off-line due to change of ISP; back soon > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: starting a thread perfectly square From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 06 Oct 1999 03:44:36 GMT -------- Lou Boyd wrote: > > So if you use a die after starting the threads with a lathe will they > come out better if the die cuts at high speed? Probably not! Reasons being..lack of proper chip forming, breaking and clearing in a die. Difficulty of getting in enough lubricant at high speed. Problem of maintaining correct pitch (unless you use leadscrew control on the die head) > > What RPM would be considered a good speed for the 1" rod in the > example? About 1/3 the speed you would use for drilling..kinda like reaming speeds or a bit less. > > On a split "adjustable" die is it good practice to run the die down > almost finished thread, tighten it, then run the lathe in reverse and > let the die run off the end of the rod or is there a better way? NO! Almost guaranteed to bugger the thread. It is almost impossible to have a die, with a thread straight enough, held in a holder, straight enough, and with the leading and trailing flanks of the threads and the cutting leads all co-pacetic enough to cut a good thread that way. Plus the fact that you are dragging the die/holder/tailstock/whatever with one flank in one direction and then with the opposite flank in the reverse direction. Just too many factors mitigating against success. Better to run on the die in one direction..and if you MUST adjust it..then OPEN it up to run it off. That is what a chaser type die head does after all. > Where's a good place to order "quality" dies which produce a properly > shaped thread? I take it the ones made in third world countries are > junk or is that an incorrect assumption? "Third World" Countries only turn out junk because we are daft enough to buy it. Quality dies can be bought from MSC or any other major supply house..Just don't expect them to be the cheapest! ;^) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Casting Lead Sheet From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 06 Oct 1999 03:51:02 GMT -------- It is a moot point! It seems most of the melt shops I was in, were wide open to the elements and (In Winter) had howling gales running through. Seemed to spend half the time dripping with sweat and half the time freezing!! ;^) I guess I also spent more time in the steel mills during shutdowns for repair or maintainence. teenut Jesse Brennan wrote: > > ONTINUOUS plate glass process and > >was licensed all over the world by Pilkingtons. > > > >The plants where float glass is made are the hottest places on the face of the > >earth!! > > > NO way the hottest They are quite comfortable compared to a steel meltshop floor > Or any place steel or iron is poured intom molds. I've been alongside 10 of the > US floats. plus a numnber of steel melt shops. > Jesse ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: M Head right angle spindle adaptor From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 06 Oct 1999 04:01:12 GMT -------- O..Kay!! My Lawyer advised me to make the following clarification.. This Item may interest those with M head Bridgeports that are NOT mounted on horizontal mills, those that don't already HAVE a horizontal attachment for the M head that they DO have..or those that think that one day they MAY have an M head that isn't EVER going to be mounted on a horizontal mill.. Unless of course the horizontal mill in question is a PLAIN horizontal mill, rather that a UNIVERSAL horizontal mill and they feel the need to do some spiral milling... How am I doing ;^) teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article <37FA6502.F156D2A8@home.com>, > Robert Bastow wrote: > > This item on ebay may interest those with M head Bridgports. > > But not those owners who have the M head mounted on a horizontal > machine! This may account of the low price. > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Making a dividing plate. From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 06 Oct 1999 04:56:22 GMT -------- Even I have to call a halt somewhere!! I have read up on Differential dividing..my reading started about ten years after I was doing it full time for a living!! I made a conscious decision, when I built this head to exclude differential dividing facilities.and I certainly would not need to go back and rebuild it just to make a 127 tooth gear. Now if I were into Clocks or planetary tracking gears, Norden Bomb Sights, or Battleship "Rate of change of Rate of change" type fire control predictors..I might go back and build me a whole new dividing head with differential facilities and a whole slew of other geegaws. ;^) teenut Anthrhodes wrote: > > Robert, > > Consider adding differential dividing capabilities to your 40/1 dividing head > or remaking it from scratch to include differential dividing. That would enable > you to cut 127 without having to generate a 127 plate from scratch. It would > also enable use of the dividing head for spiral milling. Read up on B&S-type > dividing heads. > > Anthony > > >I just finished building a little dividing head with a 40 to 1 worm gear. I > >needed to drill rings of holes in my index plates that included 15, 16, 17, > >18, > >19, 20, 21, 23, 26, 27, 29, 31, 33, 37, 39, 41, 43, 47 and 49 (don't jump > >down > >my throat if that sequence isn't exactly right..it's from memory OK!!) > > > >Some of the rings I was able to generate by simple indexing from "Master" > >gears > >etc., at hand. Others by angular dividing and yet others had to be laid out > >by > >hand. > > > >The method I used..layout on a large disc, transfer via dividing head to > >slave > >disc and then via dividing head to the master discs ensured that any errors > >were > >infinitesimally small. (Each transfer through the 40 - 1 gear reduces the > >error > >by a factor of 40) > > > >BTW..I STILL can't generate a 127 tooth gear from all the above!!..I would > >have > >to make a special master plate to do that...but I do know how! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: M Head right angle spindle adaptor From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 06 Oct 1999 07:09:36 GMT -------- The "Opposition has put in a high bid..maybe his maximum, maybe not! Anyway, you have not out bid him yet. Each time you bid (Lower than his max) his bid will automatically match yours, this will continue until you reach the maximum you have set for yourself..and quit! Or..until you out bid him by at least a penny. I can't advise you on the value of the item..that is way too subjective. How much is it worth to you? How much do you want to spend..sight unseen..caveat emptor and all that? Two ways to play it: Plan A You can bid your absolute maximum right now and see if that is enough to make you high bidder. Not a good plan..firstly you arouse the competition to the fact that you are there..Competition makes people more competitive..you might just make him mad enough to slug it out with you! Whichever wins will pay more than necessary! Plan B: Take the time between now and the ending time to REALLY think about how badly you need this, how much you are ABSOLUTELY BOTTOM LINE prepared to spend..and, importantly, what else could you do with the money? Do not bid until the very last moment! As the closing time approaches, check the official ebay time and "synchronise watches" Ebay is often up to five minutes out of wack with the rest of the world!! During the last five minutes, hit "Reload" every forty seconds or so..with a bit of luck your competition will be asleep at the switch and the price will remain steady..hopefull where you last left it! Get your timing right! at about 70 seconds befor the ending time, hit reload for the last time. Stay calm. at one minute to..start your bid process..force your self to move slowly..it takes about twenty seconds to get to the point where you are ready to bid. Wait..and at twenty seconds to go..hit the "Place Bid"..It is now out of the hands of both of you..neither has the time left to rebid. If your bid is high enough..you win. If not, at least you have the satisfaction of knowing you gave it your best shot AND you made the other SOB pay top dollar!! Be careful..it can become addictive! Good luck teenut "Matt Stawicki (APP Leader)" wrote: > > Perhaps you might know what one of these things are worth. > > The bidding is up to $61.55. Looks a little suspect though. > Every time I bid, it tells me that I have been outbid. Out > bid by the same guy, at the exact same time that I bid. Is > there some way that this guy has put in a maximum, and > everytime someone else bids, e-bay automatically outbids the > current bidder? There is no way that in the time it take me > to click my mouse, that someone else could see my bid, and > top it. > > I've only played around on e-bay a few times, perhaps > someone can enlighten me. > > Matt > > Robert Bastow wrote in message > <37FA6502.F156D2A8@home.com>... > >This item on ebay may interest those with M head > Bridgports. Price right now, > >with 16 hrs to go is $45.00 > > > >FWIW > > > >teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: M Head right angle spindle adaptor From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 06 Oct 1999 07:25:40 GMT -------- I failed to point out, that the objective of plan B is to get it as cheaply as possible. Let's assume you have decided your maximum is $75.00 Suppose, with the bid now standing at $61.00 you have pushed him to within 9 dollars of his CURRENT maximum bid of 70.00. If you leave him alone, and assuming no third party joins in, he will assume he is sitting pat..very few people increase their maximum bid when they are high bidder. If however you push over his current maximum of 70.00 he may well come back and raise his max to 80.00..just to be on the safe side! Left alone he will sit pat and when you "show your hand" of 75.00 at the very last moment, you will become high bidder and take the sale at $62.00!!! teenut Robert Bastow wrote: > > The "Opposition has put in a high bid..maybe his maximum, maybe not! > > Anyway, you have not out bid him yet. Each time you bid (Lower than his max) > his bid will automatically match yours, this will continue until you reach the > maximum you have set for yourself..and quit! Or..until you out bid him by at > least a penny. > > I can't advise you on the value of the item..that is way too subjective. > > How much is it worth to you? How much do you want to spend..sight > unseen..caveat emptor and all that? > > Two ways to play it: > > Plan A > You can bid your absolute maximum right now and see if that is enough to make > you high bidder. > > Not a good plan..firstly you arouse the competition to the fact that you are > there..Competition makes people more competitive..you might just make him mad > enough to slug it out with you! Whichever wins will pay more than necessary! > > Plan B: > > Take the time between now and the ending time to REALLY think about how badly > you need this, how much you are ABSOLUTELY BOTTOM LINE prepared to spend..and, > importantly, what else could you do with the money? > > Do not bid until the very last moment! > > As the closing time approaches, check the official ebay time and "synchronise > watches" Ebay is often up to five minutes out of wack with the rest of the > world!! > > During the last five minutes, hit "Reload" every forty seconds or so..with a bit > of luck your competition will be asleep at the switch and the price will remain > steady..hopefull where you last left it! > > Get your timing right! at about 70 seconds befor the ending time, hit reload for > the last time. Stay calm. at one minute to..start your bid process..force your > self to move slowly..it takes about twenty seconds to get to the point where you > are ready to bid. Wait..and at twenty seconds to go..hit the "Place Bid"..It is > now out of the hands of both of you..neither has the time left to rebid. If > your bid is high enough..you win. If not, at least you have the satisfaction of > knowing you gave it your best shot AND you made the other SOB pay top dollar!! > > Be careful..it can become addictive! > > Good luck > > teenut > > "Matt Stawicki (APP Leader)" wrote: > > > > Perhaps you might know what one of these things are worth. > > > > The bidding is up to $61.55. Looks a little suspect though. > > Every time I bid, it tells me that I have been outbid. Out > > bid by the same guy, at the exact same time that I bid. Is > > there some way that this guy has put in a maximum, and > > everytime someone else bids, e-bay automatically outbids the > > current bidder? There is no way that in the time it take me > > to click my mouse, that someone else could see my bid, and > > top it. > > > > I've only played around on e-bay a few times, perhaps > > someone can enlighten me. > > > > Matt > > > > Robert Bastow wrote in message > > <37FA6502.F156D2A8@home.com>... > > >This item on ebay may interest those with M head > > Bridgports. Price right now, > > >with 16 hrs to go is $45.00 > > > > > >FWIW > > > > > >teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: M Head right angle spindle adaptor From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 06 Oct 1999 07:28:34 GMT -------- Sorry..it's late!! Your final bid price will of course be $71.00..you are the winner, even though he was prepared to go to $80.00 teenut Robert Bastow wrote: > > I failed to point out, that the objective of plan B is to get it as cheaply as > possible. > > Let's assume you have decided your maximum is $75.00 > > Suppose, with the bid now standing at $61.00 you have pushed him to within 9 > dollars of his CURRENT maximum bid of 70.00. > > If you leave him alone, and assuming no third party joins in, he will assume he > is sitting pat..very few people increase their maximum bid when they are high > bidder. > > If however you push over his current maximum of 70.00 he may well come back and > raise his max to 80.00..just to be on the safe side! > > Left alone he will sit pat and when you "show your hand" of 75.00 at the very > last moment, you will become high bidder and take the sale at $62.00!!! > > teenut > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > The "Opposition has put in a high bid..maybe his maximum, maybe not! > > > > Anyway, you have not out bid him yet. Each time you bid (Lower than his max) > > his bid will automatically match yours, this will continue until you reach the > > maximum you have set for yourself..and quit! Or..until you out bid him by at > > least a penny. > > > > I can't advise you on the value of the item..that is way too subjective. > > > > How much is it worth to you? How much do you want to spend..sight > > unseen..caveat emptor and all that? > > > > Two ways to play it: > > > > Plan A > > You can bid your absolute maximum right now and see if that is enough to make > > you high bidder. > > > > Not a good plan..firstly you arouse the competition to the fact that you are > > there..Competition makes people more competitive..you might just make him mad > > enough to slug it out with you! Whichever wins will pay more than necessary! > > > > Plan B: > > > > Take the time between now and the ending time to REALLY think about how badly > > you need this, how much you are ABSOLUTELY BOTTOM LINE prepared to spend..and, > > importantly, what else could you do with the money? > > > > Do not bid until the very last moment! > > > > As the closing time approaches, check the official ebay time and "synchronise > > watches" Ebay is often up to five minutes out of wack with the rest of the > > world!! > > > > During the last five minutes, hit "Reload" every forty seconds or so..with a bit > > of luck your competition will be asleep at the switch and the price will remain > > steady..hopefull where you last left it! > > > > Get your timing right! at about 70 seconds befor the ending time, hit reload for > > the last time. Stay calm. at one minute to..start your bid process..force your > > self to move slowly..it takes about twenty seconds to get to the point where you > > are ready to bid. Wait..and at twenty seconds to go..hit the "Place Bid"..It is > > now out of the hands of both of you..neither has the time left to rebid. If > > your bid is high enough..you win. If not, at least you have the satisfaction of > > knowing you gave it your best shot AND you made the other SOB pay top dollar!! > > > > Be careful..it can become addictive! > > > > Good luck > > > > teenut > > > > "Matt Stawicki (APP Leader)" wrote: > > > > > > Perhaps you might know what one of these things are worth. > > > > > > The bidding is up to $61.55. Looks a little suspect though. > > > Every time I bid, it tells me that I have been outbid. Out > > > bid by the same guy, at the exact same time that I bid. Is > > > there some way that this guy has put in a maximum, and > > > everytime someone else bids, e-bay automatically outbids the > > > current bidder? There is no way that in the time it take me > > > to click my mouse, that someone else could see my bid, and > > > top it. > > > > > > I've only played around on e-bay a few times, perhaps > > > someone can enlighten me. > > > > > > Matt > > > > > > Robert Bastow wrote in message > > > <37FA6502.F156D2A8@home.com>... > > > >This item on ebay may interest those with M head > > > Bridgports. Price right now, > > > >with 16 hrs to go is $45.00 > > > > > > > >FWIW > > > > > > > >teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Large Lazy Susan Bearing From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 06 Oct 1999 12:55:49 GMT -------- My (reconsidered) conclusion too! ;^) teenut > In the long run I'd give the nod to the slick (UHMW) cutting board > material on plastic laminate (Formica). Seems much simpler and the > overall height would be easier to control. > > Keith Bohn ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: M Head right angle spindle adaptor From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 06 Oct 1999 18:13:12 GMT -------- I was thinking of the family motto: nil illigitimus carborundum (don't let the Bastows grind you down) Or: Carpe diem Which means either "Fish of the Day" or "seize the fish" depending on provenance. teenut Mike Graham wrote: > > On 06 Oct 1999 04:11:40 GMT, PLAlbrecht wrote: > >T. Nutt, Esq., wrote > > > >>How am I doing ;^) > > > >True legalese must have, ipso facto, some gratuitous Latin phrases. > > I nominate > "Cum tam iuvenis eram quam nunc es in salinis diu laboram" > > (when I was your age I had a full-time job in a salt mine) > > with > "Cogito ergo doleo" thrown in > > (I think, therefore I am depressed) > > and for a closer, > > "Obesa cantavit" > > (the fat lady has sung) > > With apologies to Henry Beard... > > -- > Mike Graham, mikegraham at sprint dot ca > Caledon, Ontario, Canada (just NW of Toronto). > > Raiser of animals. Weldor of metals. Driver of off-road vehicles. > Writer of FAQs. Keeper of the faith, and all around okay guy. > > < homepage currently off-line due to change of ISP; back soon > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Making a dividing plate. From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 06 Oct 1999 18:19:19 GMT -------- Why am I not surprised at your solution Erich? When I see that you work for Hewlett Packard!! ;^) I wonder what people did before Scientific Calculators or DROs? (A rhetorical question..I have neither!!) teenut Erich Coiner wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > > > >BTW..I STILL can't generate a 127 tooth gear from all the above!!..I would > > > >have > > > >to make a special master plate to do that...but I do know how! > > My solution would be to use my calculator to make a table of the x and y > locations of all 127 holes. Then use a mill with a DRO to locate each > hole and drill it. QED. Well maybe not Q but certainly ED > > Erich ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Making a dividing plate. From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 06 Oct 1999 18:22:45 GMT -------- This was the point I was making..regarding the repeated division of error each time it is "run through" the 40 : I worm gear. You could lay out plates with a school protractor and a pencil and still get accuracy closer than you could possibly machine to! teenut Paul Amaranth wrote: > > In article <37FAB108.2647D1BE@home.com> Robert Bastow writes: > >The method I used..layout on a large disc, transfer via dividing head to slave > >disc and then via dividing head to the master discs ensured that any errors were > >infinitesimally small. (Each transfer through the 40 - 1 gear reduces the error > >by a factor of 40) > > > >BTW..I STILL can't generate a 127 tooth gear from all the above!!..I would have > >to make a special master plate to do that...but I do know how! Hopefully I > >will never need to...but if I shear all the teeth off the 127 tooth gear on my > >Maximat (again)!! I certainly will NOT pay the $135.00 replacement cost of the > >last one. I now can make my own!! > > > >teenut > > > > A method that works pretty well for generating master plates is to mount > the plate on a spin index jig, calculate the nearest whole degree point > to where you need the hole and drill at that point. The 40:1 gearing > reduces the error in the final gear. At most, you're going to be > off by what, 1/2 a degree? If you're making a 4 inch gear that > works out to a maximum positioning error of .0004 inch, or about one > ten thousandth per inch of diameter of the gear. And that's worst case. > > If you did it on a rotary table with a degree vernier, you could probably > get even better than that. > > -- > Paul Amaranth | Rochester MI, USA > Aurora Group, Inc. | Systems & Software > paul@AuroraGrp.Com | Unix / Windows / NT ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Making a dividing plate. From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 06 Oct 1999 20:24:40 GMT -------- Not as trial intensive as you may imagine! Use a big enough disc..I use the 10" diameter lid from a Riley's toffee tin. Scribe the pitch circle in the lathe..using the cros slide to get an accurate pc radius. Use trig or chordal tables to determine the chordal length, scribe two VERY fine lines on a bit of scrap, the correct distance apart..I use my vernier hieght gage and jo blocks to get it as close as I can. Use a good pair of draftsman's dividers, with sharpened needle points and a strong loupe to set the divider to the lines. Step out, half way round in each direction..error will be small. Start at half way point and step around half way in each direction..errors will be split. Do not center punch! I made my dividing head so that I can mount the large tin disc where the division plate normaly goes, and the division plate to be drilled, on the spindle. I also made the locking plunger, that normally engages the division plate, with a removable tip. I can replace this tip with a needle pointed one for these purposes. I also have an extended crank arm and quadrant, so I can pick up my fine scribe marks, split the error if required and drill my new ring of holes on the division plate. The error on the tin master is unlikely to be greater than 0.010" cumulative..a heck of a lot less if you are careful!! transfering this to the division plate divides it by 40 (or 60 or 90:1) Using the division plate to cut a gear, divides the error by 40 AGAIN!! I can't machine to that close of a limit!! Note..I didn't use a calculator, a dro OR a piece of knotted string (I have FAR better things to do with my knotted strings!!) ;^) teenut Mike Graham wrote: > > On Wed, 06 Oct 1999 19:10:37 GMT, John Stevenson wrote: > > >Knotted string ?? > > Actually, I believe they stepped them off with dividers. *Very* trial and > error intensive. > > -- > Mike Graham, mikegraham at sprint dot ca > Caledon, Ontario, Canada (just NW of Toronto). > > Raiser of animals. Weldor of metals. Driver of off-road vehicles. > Writer of FAQs. Keeper of the faith, and all around okay guy. > > < homepage currently off-line due to change of ISP; back soon > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: GET FREE INCENSE AND INCENSE HOLDER HERE From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 06 Oct 1999 20:26:20 GMT -------- Will this prevent rust in damp workshops? incense wrote: > > for a free pack of incense and a free incense holder, just send a self > addressed envelope along with (3) .33cents stamps to: > > the best incense co. > pobox 91098 > los angeles, ca 90009-1098 > > our incense is hand-dipped, long burning made with the finest oils and > made fresh to order. HURRY WHILE SUPPLIES LAST... > > visit us at http://www.bestincense.com > -- > Posted via Talkway - http://www.talkway.com > Exchange ideas on practically anything (tm). ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Book for absolute novice From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 06 Oct 1999 20:35:06 GMT -------- Jeeze Terry! Talk about beginners luck!! You couldn't have landed on a better spot in the whole ethernet. Welcome and stick around. This message will be followed by a DELUGE of sound advice from people who have been where you are now. Don't be afraid to ask questions here...there are NO dumb questions..though I can't speak for some of the dumb answers you will get from time to time. ;^) Where are you, and what are your interests..Introduce yourself and say Hi. The first , sound bit of advice you will get, is to join a Machine shop class ASAP and to delay the purchase of any major tools and equipment for a short while..Heck you may not even LIKE cutting metal..I have heard that there ARE people like that out there!! teenut Terry Pinnell wrote: > > I'm seriously thinking about starting elementary metalwork as a hobby > - but know so little that I don't even know what I need to know! Is > there a really basic book that will prime me on the essentials please? > Or any introductory Web sites? > > Terry ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Heads up on Ebay shaper From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 06 Oct 1999 20:48:45 GMT -------- 7" AMMCO http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=176786921 FWIW teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Making a dividing plate. From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 07 Oct 1999 00:23:58 GMT -------- All of which suppose you have the other gears available!! And, if you didn't...How would you generate them? Lets start a different thread on metric gear train substitutions , eh? teenut Peter Logghe wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > I guess my point is, that the use of a "standard" gear has it's uses..probably > > covers 90% of what most home shop guys need to do anyway. > > > > I wasn't criticizing the method, and I'm sorry that it did rather seem to come > > across that way. Far from it, I use it myself whenever possible. > > > > HOWEVER!! (You knew that was coming, Huh!) > > > > The simple system breaks down when you want to divide in prime numbers..31 being > > a prime number. Would I ever want to cut a 31 tooth gear? God I hope not..but > > I can!! > > > > 127 tooth?...that is a standard metric translation gear..a prime number! > > > > The "Complex" methods used to generate division plates ARE necessary in certain > > circumstances. > > > > I just finished building a little dividing head with a 40 to 1 worm gear. I > > needed to drill rings of holes in my index plates that included 15, 16, 17, 18, > > 19, 20, 21, 23, 26, 27, 29, 31, 33, 37, 39, 41, 43, 47 and 49 (don't jump down > > my throat if that sequence isn't exactly right..it's from memory OK!!) > > > > Some of the rings I was able to generate by simple indexing from "Master" gears > > etc., at hand. Others by angular dividing and yet others had to be laid out by > > hand. > > > > The method I used..layout on a large disc, transfer via dividing head to slave > > disc and then via dividing head to the master discs ensured that any errors were > > infinitesimally small. (Each transfer through the 40 - 1 gear reduces the error > > by a factor of 40) > > > > BTW..I STILL can't generate a 127 tooth gear from all the above!!..I would have > > to make a special master plate to do that...but I do know how! Hopefully I > > will never need to...but if I shear all the teeth off the 127 tooth gear on my > > Maximat (again)!! I certainly will NOT pay the $135.00 replacement cost of the > > last one. I now can make my own!! > > > > teenut > > The 127 tooth gear could possibly be replaced with an 80/63 ratio. > This is even closer than the 47/37 ratio that is sometimes used. > > Also, both 80 and 63 can be divided, for example into a > compound gearing of 20/21 and 4/3 or 21/20 and 3/4 . > > I wouldn't use that to generate a master disk, but as compund gearing > in the lathe gear box, instead of using a 127 tooth gear. > > Pete Logghe ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: vaccinations; was bearings From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 07 Oct 1999 00:36:41 GMT -------- Then you Sir are placing my child at risk! That offends me! I accept the risks you quote, I accept the mindless fears you have, I accept your right to choose! But, having accepted those risks myself, having faced those mindless fears and dealt with them, having face MY responsibilities, I choose to protect society as well as my children. If you attempt to put your children in the same school as mine, Sir, I will object!! Do not ask me how far my objection will go..I don't think you want to know that!! Now, having said that, I also strongly object to this forum being used to discuss this, or any other Social or Political agenda. Take it some place else..take your trite "bumper sticker" mores to some place where someone gives a shit!! Respectfully. teenut Hoyt McKagen wrote: > > My child like every other child whose parents state an objection, does > not have to have any vaccines to attend schools and she is presently > attending one w/o them. You're not well informed, are you? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Torch-colored Steel From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 07 Oct 1999 00:50:53 GMT -------- No pain..no gain!! Every one wants a cheap, quick, easy, amateur way to achieve professional results!! Gun makers use clear varnishes to protect (however temporarily) the brilliant case hardening colors they so painstakingly achieve. After centuries of experimentation, they accept that there is no way to avoid the trade off betweeen protection and the loss of some of the color quality. Accepting that the colors will eventually wear and fade away, they employ very expensive engravers to decorate surfaces..originally, so that said surfaces will not look so "Plain Jane" when the colors fade. So, the answer to your question is..Go hire an engraver!! ;^) teenut Doug Von Gausig wrote: The best thing I've found so far is automotive wax to provide a > non-rusting surface, but this is extremely labor-intensive. > > Has anyone found a good clear coat for colored steel that does not ruin the > colors and that is economical to apply? > > Thanks in advance, > > Doug ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: vaccinations; was bearings From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 07 Oct 1999 01:05:45 GMT -------- brian whatcott wrote: What would you know about an ETHICAL issue...Strikes me that a lot of folks wouldn't understand ethics if they fell over them. ETHICS = Doing unto others as you would be done by... What YOU face is a MORAL, CHARACTER and INTESTINAL FORTITUDE issue. FACE it!! Have the Moral Fiber, the Strength of Character and the GUTS,to do what you know needs to be done..and quit trying to protect you and yours..at the expense of mine..hoping that some other sucker will do the job for you! You want your country protected..but don't want YOUR kids to carry a gun and do the work. You want your kids to grow up in a disease free environment..but expect not to play your part or pay your end of the tab. YUK!! CONTEMPTUOUS!! teenut > Here's the ethical issue: without protection, a thousand children > die every year of disease X. > It is an act of God. Everyone feels sad.... > > WITH protection, 50 children die a year. > And you KNOW it was because of a vaccine. > > Such a deal! But not to the grieving parents. > They led their children to the slaughter > ( or so their sub-conscious whispers...) > > Brian Whatcott Altus OK ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 5C collet chuck From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 07 Oct 1999 01:27:05 GMT -------- Welcome! "Accuracy doesn't just "Happen"..it results from attention to detail"...teenut's law. Jim Stewart wrote: > > This business of working to tenths is sorta fun. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: of chickens and cannons From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 07 Oct 1999 02:02:55 GMT -------- Well, at least with the training wheels on the Harley, you couldn't go fast enough to hurt yourself!! ;^) teenut BgBdBiker wrote: > > >>Whether Lucas made appliances or not should never stop one from > >>taking an opportunity to insult the prince of darkness. > > My experience with Lucas electrics about got me killed. Young and dumb riding > my 650cc Triumph Bonneville late at night at a very high rate of speed when > headlight blows. The 10 or 15 seconds that it took me to slow down and stop > seemed like an eternity. When I did stop I was straddling the center line. My > guardian angel was working overtime that night. I bought a Harley the next > week. > Dennis ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Titanium grinding??? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 07 Oct 1999 02:54:47 GMT -------- Centerless grinding is the only way to go. Check your local supplier directory..any good grinding house should be able to quote you on the job. teenut Greg Nuspel wrote: > > I have to make some titanium shafts the limits are 0.270 to 0.271 this > wouldn't be such a problem if they weren't 12 inches long. I was > wondering if anyone does centerless grinding of titanium. Any other > suggestions are welcome. > > -- > Greg Nuspel > > To invent, you need a good imagination and a pile of junk. > Thomas Edison > > http://www.cadvision.com/nuspelg ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: vaccinations; was bearings From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 07 Oct 1999 02:56:19 GMT -------- Watch yer lip!! ;^) teenut Jim Stewart wrote: > That's it!!! He's not ignorant, he's English! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Thread chasers for "single pointing" From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 07 Oct 1999 18:40:18 GMT -------- A tip (trick,technique..call it what you like..) that I learned as an apprentice, is to use a die head chaser as a "multi-point", single point screw cutting tool. This way, the thread form is always dead on,as geometric type chasers ar form ground very accurately. This feature alone is invaluable when cutting whitworth form or other radius root/crest threads. I have made special holders to clamp my chasers in..just a slot, milled in a chunk os keystock, with a couple of setscrews to hold the chaser. I grind a rather longer "lead" on some chasers, especially the ones in "Boring tool" type holders, that I use for threading internally. Others, for threading up to a shoulder, I leave with a short or zero lead. "single, multi-point" threading is a joy..most threads up to say 20 tpi, can be cut in a couple or three passes, dead to size..no need to swing the compound over to half thread angle...A practice almost uniquely American, and virtually unheard of in the UK. I was taught, and till do, leave the compound parallel to the thread axis. On large threads the compound is advanced a half a thou or so with each pass..this having the effect of relieving the trailing flank of the cutting tool. Much faster to set up and to do..Makes the math a lot simpler too! An alternative technique is to let the hand gently "Brake" the carriage hand wheel on every alternate pass..this has the same effect of allowing the thread tool to cut mainly on one side. Don't do this if your leadscrew nuts are badly worn though..you will wipe out all trace of a thread!! These techniques, especially in conjunction with a "Rapid Tool Withdrawal" device..such as fitted to Hardinge and many other high class lathes, enables accurate, correct form threads to be produced faster than it takes to write about it. Over the years I have collected pretty well a full set of chasers for "single-multi pointing" both for internal and external use. Usually these can be had for free from your local screw machine shop..you are only interested in one or two, and they need a full set of four. When one of a set is damaged, or they are ground down too far for production use..they heave them in the scrap bin!! Bear in mind, you don't need a chaser for every thread SIZE! A 1/4 - 20 chaser will happily cut 3/8" 7/16" 1/2" by 20 threads too! All my "Special threads" are 12, 20, 32, or 40 TPI, depending on application, so four chasers covers the lot. Happy threading teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Need source for octagon ts From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 07 Oct 1999 19:07:34 GMT -------- Coil and flat spring material (OCS..Old Chevy Spring) is 5160 steel..excellent for forged knife blades, prybars, screwdrivers etc. My favorite material for the above. It is DEFINITELY an oil quenching material. Water quench of a full section will usually cause cracking. However it is a bit low in carbon content for a really hard edge..so one of the techniques used by knife makers is to "Edge Quench" If you are brave, this can be done in 1/4" of water in a shallow pan. I sometimes float a 1/4" of olive oil on top of the water (no better than any other oil..just smells better ;^) This moderates the quench a bit and I prefer (read.."chicken out") to do it this way on thin blade sections The thickness of hot metal, backing the blade, moderates the quench enough to (usually!!!), avoid cracking. The result is a tough blade backing up a hard edge..with a "Temper Line" similar in appearance..but of a slightly different nature, to the "Hamon" on a Japanese blade. (A Hamon is a *hardening* line, produced by coating the blade in varying thicknesses of special clay, heating the whole blade, differentially..hotter on the edge than the back..and plunge quenching in tepid water) teenut Steve Smith wrote: > > I've had zero luck treating coil springs as water hardening. They always crack. I > use oil. > > Steve Smith > > Ted Edwards wrote: > > > James Peter wrote: > > > > > I need a source for about 50 feet of 1/2 inch octagon, water hardening (w1) > > > tool steel. I teach a forging class and our starting project is a 6 inch > > > chisel made from this material. For year I've bought it from Recto-Alloy, > > > > May I make a suggestion? When I took part of a farrier course that > > included much blacksmithing, here's how we made cold chisels and other > > tools. > > > > Get some discarded vehicle coil springs made with appropriate diameter > > "wire". These are usually free for the asking in anything from quite > > small to seriously big. Each student cuts off one turn with a cutting > > torch, straightens it over the horn, forges a chisel and hardens and > > tempers it. Treat it as water hardening. Material cost - zero, > > experience - priceless and you don't even need Master Card! :-) > > > > I have made two large cold chisels this way along with many drifts, > > punches, ... . One of the large cold chisels was for my son-in-law, a > > professional mechanic, after he broke three Snap-On chisels. This was > > several years ago. Last time I spoke to him (recently) he has yet to > > sharpen it let alone break it. I have used mine for chipping concrete, > > breaking stone and even (fancy that) cutting metal. It is still in > > excellent shape although it did need sharpening after chipping all the > > blobs off the walls of a large concrete basement. > > > > Ted ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: vaccinations; was bearings From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 07 Oct 1999 19:15:53 GMT -------- Hoyt McKagen wrote: > If vaccinations work and she's the only one w/o them in her peer group, > where is she going to get a disease to give to your fully immunized > child, and how will your child if truly immune get it from her? You're a > good guy Bob, on the whole, but you didn't think this one through. > Hoyt, I like and respect you enough not to want to get into a pissing contest here. But surely it is you, not I, that fails to think this one through. What if every parent decided not to have their child immunised..for the same strongly felt reasons that you hold? How long would it take for an epidemic of whatever you care to name? Excepting Smallpox, which miraculously "disappeared" at around the same time that the WHO was vaccinating every child they could!! Respectfully teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Book for absolute novice From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 07 Oct 1999 19:49:12 GMT -------- Tony Jeffree wrote: > ....and equally important...Don't let on just how much it is going to > *cost*... Cost? COST!!!! Tony, Oh Tony! So close, but yet...So far to go. Write out one hundred times.. "Tools don't COST money, they SAVE money!" Terry! You will expunge Tony's remark from your mind! All in Jest of course. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: power drawbar actuator From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 07 Oct 1999 19:59:43 GMT -------- I have a vague recollection of reading that one make of power drawbar is based on an industrial sized, electric drill motor. For the "Compressor Challenged" among us..;^)...What is a "Butterfly Style air wrench" ? teenut shoptask wrote: > > Karl, > We built several for the Shoptask using 3/8" drive " butterfly" style air > wrenches. They are not expensive and work fine, on R 8 tooling, but Morse > tapers hold a bit tighter and require a bit more power. Check out our > users group for some discussions on this. > > karlmilwaukee@my-deja.com wrote: > > > Has anybody built their own power drawbar actuator? I'm trying to > > figure out how to make one because I don't think I can justify buying > > one. The Kurt I saw was about $650. > > > > karl > > > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: getting lathe to run true From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 07 Oct 1999 20:32:51 GMT -------- BillDarby wrote: (Snip excellent discourse on bed wear) > BTW I would bet that if you mount an indicator on the tool post and meaned the high and low readings > every inch or so along a good test bar you would see that the taper would be as you describe but > then as you move well out on the bar the taper would stop then reverse itself till it came > straight. If it does do that then you know that the problem is wear. With taper as much as he quotes you could check the wear on the bed with a (Not Very) stretched piece of string!!! 0.001" per INCH is a heck of a lot of taper to be caused by simple wear. I am assuming for some pretty obvious reasons, that the head has never been parted from the bed. A fair assumption..because it is a BITCH of a job to do on a big lathe!! Even then, the headstock on a lathe of this quality would drop right back into place..certainly well within the sort of error range Ronald is experiencing. He gives us a clue when he says he just got it..and that he is machining short bushings.. My best bet is that the problem is not wear in the bed..but the LACK of it..particularly in the section of bed he is now using! If the lathe had previously been used up to its full capacity..Very likely, in that the original buyers would not purchase a 72" B/C lathe to machine "short bits", then it may have had a bigger chuck on it than the one he is now using. It is thus likely, that the are of bed wear did not reach as close to the headstock and resulted in a quite rapid transition...even a noticable step down..from the unworn bed area directly under the chuck. Thence the wear would taper out gradually towards the tailstock end until it reached an area of "virgin" bed again. My guess is that he is now running the carriage closer to the headstock than it, maybe ever, has before. The leading edge of the carriage, which had previously bedded into and run quite happily (they are designed to do so) on the worn area of bed, is now "ramping up" quite abruptly onto a new, unworn section of bed. Solution: Try working a few more inches away from the headstock..check the results there. If the taper is less abrupt you may need to devise a "longer" workholder, chuck or whatever. It could be that you could avoid the problem simply by using a longer reach tool, and/or running the top slide further to the left. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lucas Electrics From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 07 Oct 1999 20:45:19 GMT -------- STJ28 wrote: > > I have heard that Lucas has just released an improved headlight switch. It has > three positions: Dim, Flicker, and Off. You are behind the times! That is the old Mark 27, three position switch to which you refer. Lucas have come a LONG way since those dreadful, uncertain days. "Absolute Reliability" and "Ease of Operation" are the new Company slogans. The new and improved, MARK 28 switch has only TWO positions for the customer to worry about: "Dim" and "Flicker" "Off" is now FULLY AUTOMATIC!!! teenut PS I hear that Harley Davidson are switching over 100% to Lucas Electrics as part of a campaign to improve the reliability of their bikes. "Duck and Cover" ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Oval Turning Chuck? What the hell? 99-10-07 0330pm From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 07 Oct 1999 20:57:58 GMT -------- Tubal Cain did a good write up on Eliptical Chucks in his book on Ornamental turning...Much more easily understood than the Holtzapfel era stuff!! Maybe this is a source you haven't run into yet. Unfortunately my copy 'sappeared!! in one of my many moves, or I could help you more. The book is probably still in print..Check with Nexus, the publisher of "Model Engineer" Wise Owl Press are their agents in the USA. Frankly though, I would try TEE Publishing..they will almost certainly have it new or used in stock. Wise Owl and TEE have web pages..Nexus don't (or didn't recently) Let me know what you find..I want to make one too!! teenut boris beizer wrote: > > I've been through several books that describe this chuck and various > designs -- also known (technically more correct) as an ellipse turning > chuck -- not to be confused with a rose-chuck. Anyhow, after staring at the > drawings and trying to parse that quaint 19th century English, I still can't > figure out how it works. Anybody? Anybody can point to plans? > > Boris > ------------------------------------- > Boris Beizer Ph.D. Seminars and Consulting > 1232 Glenbrook Road on Software Testing and > Huntingdon Valley, PA 19006 Quality Assurance > > TEL: 215-572-5580 > FAX: 215-886-0144 > Email direct: bbeizer@sprintmail.com > Email (Forwarded): bbeizer@acm.org, bbeizer@ieee.org > ------------------------------------------ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Oval Turning Chuck? What the hell? 99-10-07 0330pm From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 07 Oct 1999 21:30:44 GMT -------- Further thoughts: Your question prompted a deeper search of my memory and library and I came up with an old, old copy of "Ornamental Lathework For Amateurs" by "C H C", published by Percival Marshal. This book does not describe either the construction or use of an eliptical chuck, it concentrates on eccentric chucks, geometric and "dome" chucks. The curvilinear apparatus and "Goneostat" are described too. Absent the construction of a proper, two slide, eliptical chuck, it would of course be possible, and much simpler to use a "Rotative Goneostat"...simply an eliptical template fastened to the chuck and a pivoted roller follower pressed by hand lever into contact with it. This may meet your need if it is for a simple low quantity job. I made a few steel pistol grip caps (for rifle buttstocks) this way, a number of years ago, and it worked surprisingly well. (Of course, we "Old Farts" are now going to be deluged with recommendations from the "Young Turks" on how to do it all with CNC..) They just don't understand!! ;^) teenut boris beizer wrote: > > I've been through several books that describe this chuck and various > designs -- also known (technically more correct) as an ellipse turning > chuck -- not to be confused with a rose-chuck. Anyhow, after staring at the > drawings and trying to parse that quaint 19th century English, I still can't > figure out how it works. Anybody? Anybody can point to plans? > > Boris > ------------------------------------- > Boris Beizer Ph.D. Seminars and Consulting > 1232 Glenbrook Road on Software Testing and > Huntingdon Valley, PA 19006 Quality Assurance > > TEL: 215-572-5580 > FAX: 215-886-0144 > Email direct: bbeizer@sprintmail.com > Email (Forwarded): bbeizer@acm.org, bbeizer@ieee.org > ------------------------------------------ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Thread chasers for "single pointing" From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 07 Oct 1999 22:08:18 GMT -------- John Stevenson in fully justified outrage wrote: > BLAGARD, PIRATE, THUNDERER. > This is definitely the last straw Bastow, You've pinched my post. > I posted this about 3 months ago and I was a little amazed that I got no > comeback on it. > I've been using this trick for years. > Anyway I challenge you to a duel, seeing as I'm the injured party I chose > weapons. > > I chose chinese dial gauges at 50 paces. Sorry John..Didn't read it. You may recall, I was "off the List" for quite a period..right around that time! Goes to show though...we both learned at the knees of the same breed of Masters!! At least I didn't claim Originality...Like most of the stuff I know, I was taught or picked it up from someone else. Interestingly, I believe the Japanese word for "Apprentice" is the same (or has the same root) as "Thief" Japanese apprentices are "Taught" or told NOTHING! In return for lodging, a miserly allowance and doing nothing but sweep the shop and sharpen tools etc, for a couple of years, they are allowed to WATCH the Master at work. No questions allowed or answered! Eventually they will be given a simple job to do. On completion it will be scrutinized by the master. If it is (as is likely) not up to standard, it will be tossed on th fire or scrap heap..no reasons given..it is enough that it is not enough. The process is repeated, without help other than silently observing, until the Master is satisfied. Another task is assigned and the process repeated. For SEVEN years. The Apprentice literally has to "Steal" his craft from the Master. Like it or not..Japanese Craftsmen, in whatever field are arguably the best in the world. I did a full six year apprenticeship..and was told repeatedly that it would "Make me a good Beginner" Little did I realise how true that was! Again John, my apologies! teenut John Stevenson further (and rather boastfully) wrote: > > Anyway I'll see your post and raise you one. > > If you use an 11tpi chaser it's bog on for doing J series Poly Vee groove > pulleys, been using that years as well, so there. Handy tip! > > I have even made a fly cutter type holder to put in the > CNC mill and by doing one rotation whilst dropping the tool one pitch you can > thread mill about 1/2" at a time, inside or out. > > I have actually been making a special tap today 10mm by 0.5 pitch by using a M3 > die segment. Came out bang on and saved me a lot of fiddly internal > screwcutting. > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: vaccinations; was bearings From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 07 Oct 1999 22:16:05 GMT -------- I am sorry if I misread your previous post Brian..But I just went back to re-read it. It STILL reads to me, as though you are AGAINST vaccination! teenut brian whatcott wrote: > > On Thu, 07 Oct 1999 01:05:45 GMT, Robert Bastow says... > > >What would you know about an ETHICAL issue.. > >.Strikes me that a lot of folks > >wouldn't understand ethics if they fell over them. > > > >ETHICS = Doing unto others as you would be done by... > > > >What YOU face is a MORAL, CHARACTER and INTESTINAL > FORTITUDE issue. > > > >FACE it!! Have the Moral Fiber, the Strength of Character and the > GUTS,to do > >what you know needs to be done..and quit trying to protect you and > yours..at the > >expense of mine..hoping that some other sucker will do the job for you! > > > >You want your country protected..but don't want YOUR kids to carry a gun > and do > >the work. > > > >You want your kids to grow up in a disease free environment..but expect not > to > >play your part or pay your end of the tab. > > > >YUK!! CONTEMPTUOUS!! > > > >teenut > > What on Earth is this fellow babbling about? > Who wouldn't get his kids innoculated and innoculated? > > Brian Whatcott Altus OK ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Found today UK only From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 07 Oct 1999 22:31:46 GMT -------- It is such conversations that bring back home to me the differences in (Travel) scale between the UK and the USA. Cheshire to Nottinghamshire is what? 75 miles? A major journey in England..to be planned for a least a week in advance (in order to have car fully serviced, etc) ;^) Here in the USA it is just a slight detour on the way to work and back! (I did a 75 mile round trip yesterday to fetch a couple of end mills!!) Please don't take this as a criticism..just an observation. I DO remember, in days before the Motorways, that the trip from Yorkshire to London (198 miles) was a two day ordeal that entailed staying overnight with distant (and unintelligible) relatives in Northampton. teenut John Stevenson wrote: > > On Thu, 07 Oct 1999 18:25:02 GMT, timleech@dutondok.u-net.com (Tim Leech) > wrote: > > > > >How readily could it be transported? > > > >I'm seriously interested, but in Cheshire. > > > > If you live in Cheshire it's just gone up to 100 pounds > > It's all in one lump, about 100 lbs. > takes up 3 ft square by 6 feet as I said. > Would go in an estate car laying down or a trailer. > Definitely not go in a car. > Didn't look to close at the construction but if it's anything like mine it's all > welded construction > > >On Thu, 07 Oct 1999 08:32:20 GMT, john@engineers-com.freeserve.co.uk > >(John Stevenson) wrote: > > > >>Right this weeks special offer, found it this morning UK only for obvious > >>reasons. > >>Pallet truck with forks. > >>About 3 foot square 6 foot high, 2 large wheels at the rear, 2 small at the > >>front. > >>Hydraulic lift platform with hand operated pump max, capacity about 600lbs > >>Max lift about 5 foot > >>Very good condition, it was built for a local utility company cost regardless > >>and hardly used. > >> > >> > >>Ideal for lifting heavy objects onto milling tables, benches etc. > >>The guy wants 80 UK pounds for it. I'll pass any interested parties over to him > >>to deal direct. I'm making nothing off this. > >>I already have one very similar but mine is a two stage one that goes up to 8 > >>foot reach although this bigger one is in a lot better condition than mine. > >>Mine has been an absolute godsend for loading heavy things onto machines. > >>-- > >> > > >>Regards, > >> > >>John Stevenson at > >>L Stevenson [Engineers] > >>Nottingham, England. > >> > >> > > > >------------------------------------------------- > >Tim Leech > > > >timleech@dutondok.u-net.com > > > >Traditional & Modern canal craft repairs > > > >------------------------------------------------- > > -- > > Regards, > > John Stevenson at > L Stevenson [Engineers] > Nottingham, England. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Oval Turning Chuck? What the hell? 99-10-07 0330pm From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 07 Oct 1999 22:55:14 GMT -------- Tony Jeffree wrote: > > Surely you're not suggesting that an "Old Fart" (or even an "Old > Bastow?? ;-)) could not make good use of CNC?? > > I think the real problem is that the "Young Turks" understand only too > well... > > Regards, > Tony > Time to dry behind a few ears!! I worked for Alfred Herbert (Once the largest machine tool manufacturer in the world) during the transition period from cam operated automatics through rotary switch, relay operated, through "Peg Board" programming to hard wired NC and on through Herbert's invention of the G Code system!!! Right on through to full CNC, circular interpolation, user friendly, real time interactive programming. I have punched, proved and re-punched thousands of feet of paper tape on manual flexowriters. I have also OWNED two 65 HP Cincinnatti Turning Centers, both with IIRC GE 1050 control, cutting SERIOUS metal 24/7, in my own sub-contract machine shop. So I would say I DO understand what CNC can do..and what it could do for me...IF I WANTED IT TO!! It is the fact that I don't WANT it to anymore, that the "Young Turks" don't understand. YET!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Found today UK only From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 08 Oct 1999 01:09:16 GMT -------- Station Wagon! Gunner wrote: > > On Thu, 07 Oct 1999 19:45:51 GMT, john@engineers-com.freeserve.co.uk > (John Stevenson) wrote: > > >Would go in an estate car laying down or a trailer. > > Pardon the OT question.... but Ive heard of almost every kind of > car...from a flower car, to a AutoCar... but what the dickens is an > estate car? A pickup? > > Gunner > > --------------------------------------------------------- > > "A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an > invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write > a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort > the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, > solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program > a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die > gallantly. Specialization is for insects." Robert Heinlein > > Free Hobby Buy/Swap/Sell Website > www.cyberg8t.com/gunner/hsm/index.html > > Home Page > http://userzweb.lightspeed.net/gunner ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: vaccinations; was bearings From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 08 Oct 1999 01:24:39 GMT -------- Brian, I tried to be "kindly" in my last message to you. I apologized for misunderstanding what you had written. Not my fault..but hey! I did that without resorting to calling you a "twerp" and I am going to refrain from name calling again. However, be it known..to anyone who wishes to check back on what you wrote, the reason why this "twerp Bastow" picked on you is simply because you don't, apparently, patently obviously, have a good enough grasp of the English language, to be able to make yourself clearly understood. Does that help,,or do I need to break it down into words of fewer syllables. teenut brian whatcott wrote: > > On Thu, 07 Oct 1999 11:27:29 -0700, Erich Coiner says... > > > >brian whatcott wrote: > >> > >> On Thu, 07 Oct 1999 01:05:45 GMT, Robert Bastow says... > >> > >> >What would you know about an ETHICAL issue.. > >> >.Strikes me that a lot of folks > >> >wouldn't understand ethics if they fell over them. > >> > > >> >ETHICS = Doing unto others as you would be done by... > >> > > >> >What YOU face is a MORAL, CHARACTER and INTESTINAL > >> FORTITUDE issue. > >> > > >> >FACE it!! Have the Moral Fiber, the Strength of Character and the > >> GUTS,to do > >> >what you know needs to be done..and quit trying to protect you and > >> yours..at the > >> >expense of mine..hoping that some other sucker will do the job for you! > >> > > >> >You want your country protected..but don't want YOUR kids to carry a > gun > >> and do > >> >the work. > >> > > >> >You want your kids to grow up in a disease free environment..but expect > not > >> to > >> >play your part or pay your end of the tab. > >> > > >> >YUK!! CONTEMPTUOUS!! > >> > > >> >teenut > >> > >> What on Earth is this fellow babbling about? > >> Who wouldn't get his kids innoculated and [vaccinated]? > >> > >> Brian Whatcott Altus OK > > > >Hoyt McKagen is on record in an earlier part of this thread. > >His 4 year old daughter is not vaccinated. > > > >Erich > > So why is this twerp Bastow babbling at me? > > I thought he was making good sense with his ball bearing transport > troubles but the topic has evidently swung over to marbles. > Missing marbles. > > Why do the loonies pick on *me*? > > Brian Whatcott Altus OK ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Do you use your laptop in the car? From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 08 Oct 1999 01:29:24 GMT -------- Boy..I thought I was getting past it! But not to the point of objecting to oral sex..anywhere I can get it!! teenut Gerald Miller wrote: > > I have no problem with cell phones, computers maybe, the ones I object to > are in order; books, magazines, road maps, newspapers, and oral sex. :-0) > > -- > > Gerry > London, Canada > > Seppo Vataja wrote in message > news:Lt7L3.1140$oq.5067@newsfeed.slurp.net... > > PET PEEVE > > > > Drivers have enough problems with cell phones > > a laptop CO PILOT???? > > > > Don't get me started > > > > > > Tony Jeffree wrote in message > > news:37fc5d8f.4258758@news.u-net.com... > > > On Thu, 07 Oct 1999 08:15:40 GMT, "informer" > > > wrote: > > > > > > >If you use your laptop PC in the car, than the laptop Copilot could be > of > > use to you. > > > > > > > >Log onto > > > > > > > >www.laptopcopilot.com > > > > > > > >for complete details and a video of the laptopCopilot in action. > > > > > > > >The laptopCopilot holds your PC securly for easy use form within any > > parked vehicle. > > > > > > > >$49.95 includes ground s&h to 50 US states, in stock for immediate > > shipment. > > > > > > > >A GREAT tool for on-the-road salespersons... > > > > > > > > > > *Exactly* what has this got to do with metalworking?? We don't do > > > salespersons in this group...except medium rare, maybe... > > > > > > Regards, > > > Tony > > > > > > Website: http://www.jeffree.u-net.com/ > > > When replying, delete "X." from the Email address to remove anti-SPAM > > measures. > > > > > > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lucas Electrics From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 08 Oct 1999 01:31:28 GMT -------- Motorcycles go faster and are a lot more fun than PRODUCTS! teenut mike II wrote: > > Harley is PRODUCT, Triumph is Motorcycle! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Wanted: EMCO Maximat Super 11 From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 08 Oct 1999 01:46:01 GMT -------- Not very likely. A) They don't make them anymore, Haven't done for years. B) Because the USA is a Non-Metric Country, it is doubtful that many of that persuation were ever imported here. The last two, new ones, I heard of were "found in furrin parts" and imported by Blue Ridge. They asked close to $8000.00 each for them, and they were gone in days. I have a Maximat Super II in (now) better than new condition. You wouldn't want it though..its all in those nasty imperial units! I am not even going to ask why you would want it in foreign dimensions..I have already started enough wars for today. teenut Neil Viljoen wrote: > > I am looking for above mentioned lathe in metric configuration. Eastern > states preferable. Would love to get hands on new one. > > Regards Niel ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Making a dividing plate. From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 08 Oct 1999 02:12:50 GMT -------- Mike Graham wrote: > > A lot of old cultures used knots for various purposes. Even maps! > I have enough difficulty unFOLDING maps at high speeds..unTYING them must cause a lot of accidents!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Making a dividing plate. From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 08 Oct 1999 04:13:30 GMT -------- Wolfgang Habicher wrote: > > I wonder how accurate a commercial worm gear / worm combination is for > indexing use? A friend of mine spoke with an engineer at Boston Gear, > trying to find out about cyclical and tooth-to-tooth error.....The guy > didn't even know what indexing or dividing was. Then he wasn't talking to an engineer at Boston gear! Maybe he got through to the security guard! > 8 or 10 months or so ago I posted a query on this news group on how to > machine a really accurate worm gear suitable for indexing use (for my > custom-sized dividing head). I don't think I ever got a satisfactory > answer. I followed that thread. IIRC the reason you didn't get what YOU maybe considered a satisfactory answer was because, as now, I don't think you posed a really satisfactory question. Nor did you seem to have a real fundamental grasp of the principles involved. > The theory that the worm gear ratio will reduce any error in the > dividing plate is fine as far as it goes; however, it cannot do better > than the inherent accuracy of the worm and worm gear used for indexing. It reduces any inaccuracy by a factor equal to the reduction ratio. > I suspect, and that's all it is at this time, What leads you to suspect this? >......that commercial gears, > made for speed reduction use, have substantial error in one revolution. It is a "Given", Wolfgang, that nothing, made by Man, is perfectly round, straight, flat or perfectly positioned. Having said that, without fear of contradiction, please define "Substantial error in one revolution"...Give an example of what you consider a "substantial" error and then, perhaps, we may be able to qualify your obvious concerns and quantify the resultant error in a part produced on a dividing head with such an "substantial error" incorporated into it From there we can go on to discuss whether or not that error would be "Significant", that is..would the error preclude the use of the part for its intended purpose. Perhaps, to save us having to dig up a lot of available, but obscure data, you could include the specifications that Boston Gear work to, and will, undoubtedly, be please to supply to a serious inquirer. (Provided you talk to the right person!!) Might I suggest that you call them yourself, so that our subsequent discussions are based on other than third party information...we all know how quickly that can lead to time wasting, erroneous, suppositions. You might also, again in the interests of saving time and misunderstandings, obtain the specification for cyclical error from a precision dividing head manufacturer..someone like Moore Tool, DeVlieg or SIP ought to satisfy the most persnickety of us. I am sure they too will be delighted to respond to a serious enquiry..again, provided you talk to the right person. Separate data will be required of course, for errors in both worm and wheel, they both are made to tolerances, as you well know. The math involved in defining the interactive error will be "interesting", to say the least, and far beyond my personal capabilities. However, I feel confident that there ARE people, reading this, to whom this will be a "mere bagatelle"..once the data and questions are clearly defined. Perhaps, you have expertise in this area and can help us..to help you. > Would anyone care to comment on this and, perhaps, correct me if I am > wrong? Perhaps we can address that question, when the question is a little better defined. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Wanted: EMCO Maximat Super 11 From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 08 Oct 1999 04:35:47 GMT -------- Call and ask for a quote..Hang on to your hat though, they never were competitive with Rong-Fu!! ;^) I am glad to hear further rumors of the recommencement of manufacture..Perhaps it will bring down the brutal cost of spares and accessories. Let us know what you find out..I for one would love to trade in for a V13!! Or at least dream about it. Neil contacted me directly with similar information and we had a cordial "on line" exchange. He also, very politely, pointed out that his preference for Metric stems from childhood..and a greater ease with its use. DUH!! If I had taken closer note of his name, I may not have been so all fired hasty in firing off the usual "snippy" response that so many of us are so conditioned to give (and receive!) whenever the "Imps" play the "Mets" I apologized to Neil privately, and feel that I should also apologize publicly! Sorry Neil. By the way Neil..have you any Idea what you are missing..with fractions...? ;^) teenut Neil Viljoen wrote: > > It appears in emco's website again, www.emco.at and I would be interested if anyone > knows what they charge for the "new" S11. > > Cheers and thanks > Niel > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > Not very likely. > > > > A) They don't make them anymore, Haven't done for years. > > > > B) Because the USA is a Non-Metric Country, it is doubtful that many of that > > persuation were ever imported here. The last two, new ones, I heard of were > > "found in furrin parts" and imported by Blue Ridge. They asked close to > > $8000.00 each for them, and they were gone in days. > > > > I have a Maximat Super II in (now) better than new condition. You wouldn't want > > it though..its all in those nasty imperial units! > > > > I am not even going to ask why you would want it in foreign dimensions..I have > > already started enough wars for today. > > > > teenut > > > > Neil Viljoen wrote: > > > > > > I am looking for above mentioned lathe in metric configuration. Eastern > > > states preferable. Would love to get hands on new one. > > > > > > Regards Niel ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Wanted: EMCO Maximat Super 11 From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 08 Oct 1999 04:49:17 GMT -------- Yeh! So! ;^) It appears I shall have to republish my old, but critically acclaimed pamphlet entitled: " A Defense of Sacred Measures" (One shilling and sixpence, from the Publisher) For which, it was generally agreed, thoughout the Civilized,Literary World, I would have been awarded the Pulitzer AND the Nobel prizes..had the Second Punic War not robbed me of my due! So there! teenut..(exit, stage left, muttering darkly about "furrin plots") Wolfgang Habicher wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > Not very likely. > > > > A) They don't make them anymore, Haven't done for years. > > > > B) Because the USA is a Non-Metric Country, it is doubtful that many of that > > persuation were ever imported here. The last two, new ones, I heard of were > > "found in furrin parts" and imported by Blue Ridge. They asked close to > > $8000.00 each for them, and they were gone in days. > > > > I have a Maximat Super II in (now) better than new condition. You wouldn't want > > it though..its all in those nasty imperial units! > > > > I am not even going to ask why you would want it in foreign dimensions..I have > > already started enough wars for today. > > > > teenut > > > Robert, Robert, Robert, > Why would you want to make a statement like that? > Have you checked the bits and pieces on your car lately? > The good ol USA produces roughly 10 or so million cars a year, and they > are all METRIC. Have been for decades, for that matter. > Sorry about that, old chap! > Wolfgang ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Wanted: EMCO Maximat Super 11 From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 08 Oct 1999 04:52:41 GMT -------- Oh, about a four pound ball pein wrench fixes most problems. Gawd..does that mean I need a METRIC HAMMER as well as my metric moveable spanner?? teenut Mike Rehmus wrote: > > Actually, most U.S. cars are a bastard mix of Imperial and Metric. Really > hard to know which wrench to take under the hood these days. > > Wolfgang Habicher wrote in message > news:37FD5817.A228069E@hotmail.com... > > > > > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > > > Not very likely. > > > > > > A) They don't make them anymore, Haven't done for years. > > > > > > B) Because the USA is a Non-Metric Country, it is doubtful that many of > that > > > persuation were ever imported here. The last two, new ones, I heard of > were > > > "found in furrin parts" and imported by Blue Ridge. They asked close to > > > $8000.00 each for them, and they were gone in days. > > > > > > I have a Maximat Super II in (now) better than new condition. You > wouldn't want > > > it though..its all in those nasty imperial units! > > > > > > I am not even going to ask why you would want it in foreign > dimensions..I have > > > already started enough wars for today. > > > > > > teenut > > > > > Robert, Robert, Robert, > > Why would you want to make a statement like that? > > Have you checked the bits and pieces on your car lately? > > The good ol USA produces roughly 10 or so million cars a year, and they > > are all METRIC. Have been for decades, for that matter. > > Sorry about that, old chap! > > Wolfgang ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Wanted: EMCO Maximat Super 11 From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 08 Oct 1999 04:55:22 GMT -------- I use Whitworth wrenches, plus a penny to jam the little 'uns! The right tool for every Foul Up!! teenut PLAlbrecht wrote: > > > Really > >hard to know which wrench to take under the hood these days. > > Naah. Don't you watch TV? Through the Wonder of Vila-fication, Sears will sell > you a one-size-rounds-all wrench. ("Gee, Bob, I'm too stupid and lazy to get > the right tool to bolt on these legs on this fine hand-made table...") And > don't you watch infomercials? Isn't there a brand called Metrinch? Sheesh. I > have to think of EVERYthing... > > Me, I use 11 mm on 7/16 boltheads (1/4-20), 13 mm for 1/2 inch, internchange > 3/4 and 19 mm, and versey visa if I need two wrenches etc. > > Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Book for absolute novice From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 08 Oct 1999 05:04:55 GMT -------- ppierce wrote: > I believe that the subscription to HSM and PIM (now MW) and the purchase > of the hardbound books of selected reprints sure have made my learning > a lot easier. I can honestly say that I learned far more of use, in my Metal Working career, from "Model Engineer" GH Thomas and Tubal Cain than I ever did from "text books" and "Shop" Instructors. Many, many times, tips picked up from ME sources, saved the day in real life industrial situations. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Oval Turning Chuck? What the hell? 99-10-07 0330pm From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 08 Oct 1999 05:12:13 GMT -------- Dan, Could you be persuaded to make a couple of sketches and post them to the Drop Box. I want to make one one day, and my brain just doesn't seem to bend around words like it used to. I need a picture!! Thanks teenut Dan Bollinger wrote: > > Boris, I made an elliptical jig for a Rockwell wood lathe. I made a few > parts on it, and then I left my job at the University and don't have a lathe > to bolt it on! The operation is pretty simple, and I made mine from a few > turned parts and flat stock. A small face plate is attached to the > spindle, on it are two slides with a movable chassis. Mine is 1/4" CRS, > about 4" x 8". It has a pair of cam followers made from bar stock attached > on the back. These touch, on opposite sides, a circular "cam", actually a > 1/2" long piece of 5" steel pipe. With the pipe cam mounted on center, the > device will make circles. As you slide the cam off center it begins to > describe ellipses with greater ratios between major and minor diamters. I > was about to make an elliptical box with matching cover when I stopped doing > lathe work. It must be used at very low speed, the vibration and eccentric > weight is very substantial. Not to mention the blurry image of all that > metal flying about! In the four or five Holtzapfel books, I think this one > is in the second or third book. "Plain turning" (cylinders) is just in the > first book. > > -- > > Dan Bollinger ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: European Tools From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 08 Oct 1999 11:25:30 GMT -------- I am not laughing ;^) I have a 500 g, German made, Machinist's hammer, in my collection. Of classic German style..I think it was hand made as an apprentice project, beautifully proportioned, polished, heat treated and differentially tempered, the colors still bright. The square face is handy for getting into tight corners. I have never seen a European tradesman with a ball pein hammer (worked with lots of them in Canada)..Do they exist in (continental) Europe? If not, what is used for riveting etc? I have never seen a Japanese hammer with either ball or cross pein, all those I have come across, have two square faces..one a little bit mor domed than the other. Same question applies. I have seen Metric adjusting wrenches! They are graduated in mm along the side of the fixed jaw. No doubt Imperial versions are made too. teenut Janos Ero wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > Oh, about a four pound ball pein wrench fixes most problems. > > > > Gawd..does that mean I need a METRIC HAMMER as well as my metric moveable > > spanner?? > > Don't laugh, they exist. In Europe hammers are weighted in grams. > There are 200 gram, 500 gram and 1 kilogram hammer heads available! > > Janos Ero ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: ADVERT: Collectors books re-published From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 08 Oct 1999 11:28:51 GMT -------- So much for the promised "Paperless Society"!! Great news..You can't, easily, take a CD to bed or the bathroom!! teenut Les Rix wrote: > > A personal message from me; not a big corporation. > Hopefully of interest. > > Responding to requests from traditionalists we have been pleased to > reverse-engineer the first three of our electonic books-on-cd to good old > paper 8) > > The originals are scarce and very costly so if actually reading them is > more important than investing in them, see > > http://www.enginfoserv.com/paper > > The titles are: > 'The Development of the English Traction Engine' > 'The Development of the English Steam Wagon' > 'Chronicles of a Country Works' (The Burrell Story) > all by Ronald Clark. > > The titles are fully authorised and approved. > > Thank you, > > Les Rix > > p.s. Engine Enthusiasts - wait till you see what's coming soon (3 or 4 > weeks). ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Making a dividing plate. From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 08 Oct 1999 11:31:26 GMT -------- They would be neither! French (tires/tyres) are Pneu! Try saying that with a head cold! teenut Nigel Eaton wrote: > > In article <37FB5BD9.9D0D6FAE@kotamicro.com>, Steve Smith > writes > > > >Is that so the French tractor can use English tires? > > > >Steve Smith > > > > Ahem. If they were ENGLISH, they'd be 'tyres'. Only 'Mercuns have > 'tires'..... :^) > > Nigel > -- > 'The first thing we do, let's kill all the lawyers' > - William Shakespeare > 'When my client says "kill all the lawyers" he actually > means render all legal practitioners, present, past > or future, practicing or retired, hereinafter referred > to as lawyers, notwithstanding their actual legal status, > expressed or implied, non-vital in the usual legally > accepted sense of that term' - Wm. Shakespeare's lawyer > > ------------ > Nigel Eaton ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Relative distances From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 08 Oct 1999 11:43:25 GMT -------- Curiously, in spite of the relative distances involved, I do less total mileage in N America than I used to in England/Europe. My worst year in the UK was 81,000 miles!! in a MkII Ford Cortina 1600E..great car in its day! Mind you I was covering most of Europe at the time!! Average mileage here is around 12000 miles per year (maybe less). However, you have to temper that with the fact that there are more two (three, four five!!) car families here. (Can you say "Yard Car"?) What is the Average mileage in the UK? Continental Europe? OZ? teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Large Lazy Susan Bearing From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 08 Oct 1999 13:02:08 GMT -------- Eric Gossard wrote: > > Well, here it is: > (Snip practical design outline for VERY heavy duty bearing) Thanks Eric..I will plug your design features into my (Mental) hard drive! Appreciatively, teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Making a dividing plate. From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 08 Oct 1999 13:03:59 GMT -------- Joe Breslawski wrote: > > Find your Boston Gear Rep and buy one :-) > Cheers > Joe B > Robert Bastow wrote in message <37FA949B.CD9DA758@home.com>... > >So how would you make a 31 tooth or a 127 tooth gear? Oh Joe!..Now why didn't *I* think of that!! 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Oval Turning Chuck? What the hell? 99-10-07 0330pm From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 08 Oct 1999 13:08:59 GMT -------- Thank the Lord for that! I thought it was just another sign of the CRS syndrome! ;^) It is nice to know I am not on my own! teenut boris beizer wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote in message > news:37FD7DF2.37D7ED15@home.com... > > Dan, > > > > Could you be persuaded to make a couple of sketches and post them to the > Drop > > Box. > > > > I want to make one one day, and my brain just doesn't seem to bend around > words > > like it used to. I need a picture!! > > Amen. That would be appreciated. > Boris Beizer Ph.D. Seminars and Consulting ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Found today UK only From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 08 Oct 1999 14:00:38 GMT -------- Tim Leech wrote: > I was thinking more of the wasted time spent travelling there & back - > far more valuable (even here ;-) ) than the vehicle costs. > True..if it were true! I rolled the top down on the XJS and enjoyed a leisurly, stress free drive, in the Autumn Sunshine. Prime objective of the trip was to blow the cobwebs off. I had to think of somewhere to go to "Justify" the trip. Plus I really didn't have anything better to do! In my book..that IS time well spent! Cost per mile? Hey, like Harleys, Triumphs, Porches, "Rollers" and Yachts..it's not just transportation! In actual fact, the XJ12 and the XJS both cost less to run than the Toyota Land Cruiser (My wife's) that the XJS replaced!! A LOT less! Average gas mileage on both, is 17/23 Mpg (Town/trip, US gal) the Land Yecht! was lucky to get 2/3 of that. Other than routine maintenance, the "Cat" and the "Kitten" cost us very little..very much more reliable and cheaper to fix!!! than the Jap Scrap (Can you say "New Engine at 65K miles..Brutal tire costs!!) Both Jaguars are covered by bumper to bumper 100K mile warranties, and surprisingly, are cheaper to insure than the Land Cruiser. The V12 is cheaper than the XJS!! We get a free courtesy car on the (rare) occasions that they are in the shop. The original "thinking" (Yeh, Right!!!) behind the truck, was to have a means to fetch sheets of plywood, 2x4s, etc from Home Depot. That's a crock reason when I can go there and get a truck load delivered and offloaded for $55.00...Or rent a truck there, for 75 minutes at a cost of IIRC, less than $20.00. Oh, and Valet Parkers call you "Sir"....keep them right out front..to impress the Peons, and where they don't get dinged or broken ito while you shop or have dinner! They remember you when you come out, bring your car up ahead of the line, and don't ask for the ticket before going to fetch it!! People really ARE more polite to you on the road. "Boy Racers" and big black Mercs, don't try to cut you off, and apart from being a delight to drive, that extra reserve of power, handling and braking, make them a lot safer to drive. The "Big Cat" V12 can open up a space in traffic in no time flat!! It is faster from 60 to 120 mph, than a lot of "Sports Cars" can get from 0-60! That engine is an Engineers Delight..just like a Turbine! I don't know what else one could ask for in everyday transportation. Am I missing something here?? teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Was . . . "What is this metal". From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 08 Oct 1999 14:06:38 GMT -------- What a delightful story. Thanks for sharing it Boris, and I hope there is another button in your future! teenut boris beizer wrote: >.... my metal lump story. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: vaccinations; was bearings From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 08 Oct 1999 14:46:35 GMT -------- Hoyt McKagen wrote: > Have you ever looked into the dead eyes of one of your own children, who > had a documented reaction to a vaccine? If you had your ideas on the > issue might be subtly different. As the father of four RUDELY healthy begats and (So Far) two, equally healthy grand-begats you have my heartfelt sympathy Hoyt. The loss of a child is more than any human should ever have to bear. I was beginning to suspect that this might be the root cause of Hoyt's stance. This being the case, I think he has PAID his part of any dues to Society, and is fully justified in his position. He is entitled to take a "free ride" in my book. I don't think anything we have collectively said was not previously well know and understood by him. But collectively accepting "Small percentage risks, for the greater good of Society" is very noble and necessary..when your child is a benefactor. But when your child is one of that "small Percentage" it means a small coffin at YOUR DOOR and that small percentage is a HUNDRED PERCENT...For EVER!! I think it is time to drop this subject and leave Hoyt to his genuine beliefs, his private grief, and our heartfelt sympathy. If I know this group, there won't be a single objection to that. Sincerely, teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Found today UK only From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 08 Oct 1999 19:42:12 GMT -------- Not so Mike, The XJ V12 weighs over 5000 lb loaded. Hit a bus broadside at 155 mph it would go right through! (Of purely academic interest only..I don't intend to try it!!) I mentioned the low insurance rates..Surprised me, so I made enquiries. Apparently the XJ12 has a VERY high survivability rating, based on accidents per 100 vehicles. At the time I enquired there was not a single fatality case on record in the USA. Has to do with rarity, of course, in terms of numbers of accidents. But the major reasons given are: Maturity of drivers..by the time you can afford one of these babies, you have got over the "Boy Racer" stage of life. Which also points to.. Driver skill. This is a "Drivers Car"..if you survived the "Boy racer" stage in one piece one would assume a few well honed skills. Weight and solidity of construction..built like a brick outhouse ! Accident avoidability...the number one reason!!...resulting from: Superb road holding and handling. Powerful ABS brakes. Reduced TED.."Time Exposed to Danger" Overtaking particularly, is TED..If you have adequate power it can be done quickly and safely in places wher another car would have to crawl past..increasing the TED. How many times have you tried to overtake someone who suddenly decided to make a race of it? Deadly!!..The big jag just needs an extra twitch of the gas to leave the idiot standing! The hidden bonus to this is..reduced stress, and less need to take risk..You don't have to seeth behind a Sunday driver, on narrow roads, long enough to become impatient and to then take excessive risks at the first marginal opportunity Choices of action..one not appreciated by many drivers until they have driven a car with a massive reserve of power. When the driver of an "average" powered vehicle sees a potential accident scenario coming up fast...(Which he should do, if he is paying attention, reading the road, and the traffic well in front, well behind, to both sides including "blind spots" and makes a rigid rule of keeping adequate safety distances around him..I was taught to drive "defensively" by the British Institute Of Advanced Motorists..Our UK readers will know what that entails..or at least did!! The final testing includes VERY high speed driving on regular roads, during which you have to keep up a running commentary to the Instructor on EVERYTHING that is happening around you..on Interstate type roads this includes reading and PREDICTING the actions and interactions of every vehicle around..up to a mile in front and half a mile behind at times..Similar training is (was?) given to Police drivers in the UK Anyway..I digress (as usual) In an average powered vehicle one usually is limited to braking, swerving or both! Plus prayer. In a high performance vehicle one has another option..Power!...Floor it and get the Heck outa Dodge!!...I can categorically state that that is the option of choice in the greatest percentage of "situations"! Entering and leaving Interstates are a prime example of danger zones..leaving probably the more so..because you have traffic doing sudden things on FOUR sides of you. More often than not I cruise at regular traffic speeds, but when leaving a BUSY, high speed multilane highway (Try Atlanta's I285 at rush hour..four to six lanes doing 80 plus MPH at times..or zero..never seems to be a happy medium) Anyway, trying to thread your way out of that is a nightmare and can be deadly! It is then that you can boot up to "Flank Speed"..very rapidly! This opens up available gaps in the traffic remarkeably..and because of the accelerative speed..it clears your rear end totally..no one else that WAS going your speed is going to accelerate fast enough to present a danger from your inside blind spot. within a few seconds you can concentrate almost 100% on picking a safe path to your front...the rear is taken care of. A very different driving technique..and one I'll grant even the "Kitten"..the XJS, simply does not have the reserves to do. That IS a "bus window wiper" car..but it is pure FUN to drive. Maybe not much "metal content"..but lots of Engineering! teenut Mike Graham wrote: > > On Fri, 08 Oct 1999 14:00:38 GMT, Robert Bastow wrote: > > >In actual fact, the XJ12 and the XJS both cost less to run than the Toyota Land > >Cruiser (My wife's) that the XJS replaced!! A LOT less! > > Well, that's only fair since it only weighs a third of what the Land > Cruiser weighed. Which would you rather get in an accident in (from a > strictly 'survivability' perspective, not financial). Which model of > 'cruiser was it? > > >Both Jaguars are covered by bumper to bumper 100K mile warranties, and > >surprisingly, are cheaper to insure than the Land Cruiser. > > It's because of public liability. If you hit a bus with a Land Cruiser > you kill 10 people. If you hit a bus with a jag the bus driver just has to > put on his windshield wipers. 8-) > > -- > Mike Graham, mikegraham at sprint dot ca > Caledon, Ontario, Canada (just NW of Toronto). > > Raiser of animals. Weldor of metals. Driver of off-road vehicles. > Writer of FAQs. Keeper of the faith, and all around okay guy. > > < homepage currently off-line due to change of ISP; back soon > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: vaccinations; was bearings From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 08 Oct 1999 19:46:03 GMT -------- Not a great deal of difference on the psyche. Let it rest! teenut Mike Graham wrote: > > On Fri, 08 Oct 1999 14:46:35 GMT, Robert Bastow wrote: > > >As the father of four RUDELY healthy begats and (So Far) two, equally healthy > >grand-begats you have my heartfelt sympathy Hoyt. The loss of a child is more > >than any human should ever have to bear. > > I believe that his daughter was quite sick, but did not die. She had a > reaction to a vaccine. At least, that is the impression that I got from his > previous messages. He said "dead eyes" but not "eyes of a dead..." > > -- > Mike Graham, mikegraham at sprint dot ca > Caledon, Ontario, Canada (just NW of Toronto). > > Raiser of animals. Weldor of metals. Driver of off-road vehicles. > Writer of FAQs. Keeper of the faith, and all around okay guy. > > < homepage currently off-line due to change of ISP; back soon > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: ADVERT: Collectors books re-published From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 08 Oct 1999 20:36:02 GMT -------- Pete, you have got to be Sh***in' me!! Hope you have shares in Preparation H! teenut PLAlbrecht wrote: It IS possible to read by > means other than the printed word, even under special circumstances. See > http://members.aol.com/plalbrecht/thronerm.jpg > > Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: ADVERT: Collectors books re-published From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 08 Oct 1999 20:38:44 GMT -------- Oh I get it! That is the WC at your workplace!! "Not on company time you can't" teenut Robert Bastow wrote: > > Pete, you have got to be Sh***in' me!! > > Hope you have shares in Preparation H! > > teenut > > PLAlbrecht wrote: > It IS possible to read by > > means other than the printed word, even under special circumstances. See > > http://members.aol.com/plalbrecht/thronerm.jpg > > > > Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Today's Gloat Bwa-Ha-Ha-Ha! From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 08 Oct 1999 23:35:28 GMT -------- Isn't that spelling Oneida..and isn't that a town in upper New York State? teenut tmartin@xtra.co.nz wrote: > > With that spelling even I know it has to be Taiwanese! > > Don't choke Mike everyone gets caught at least once! > Tom > > Mike14k wrote: > > > > Ok and one more auction deal..... set of Onida Sterling, (not stainless as > > the auctioneer said). Service for 12/8 piece place setting...... $13.00.... > > !!!!! Still got it for special occasions..... ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Making a dividing plate. From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 09 Oct 1999 06:05:46 GMT -------- Wolfgang Habicher wrote: > Robert: > Why would you waste your time and effort in responding to someone who > "obviously doesn't have a real fundamental grasp of the principles > involved"? > Can I decide for myself, what is a waste of MY time and effort? By your own admission...This was the second time you had asked the same question. The subject had been covered in detail...You presented a pretty reasonable facsimile of "someone who obviously.......principles involved" However, my choice of words was VERY bad! Reading it again for the second time, (For some reason, my own message failed to show up on my reader..an increasingly frequent occurrence) I can see how you could easily read my comment as a "put down". For that I apologize! It was certainly not my intent. The reason why I decided to invest a bit more time and effort is two fold: Firstly, there is enough of the teacher left in me, not to quit, when some one doesn't "Get it" the first time. If all OUR teachers had done that, we probably, none of us, would read and write well enough to be HAVING this discussion. Secondly, I don't think your concerns HAVE been addressed in full. There are sure to be errors in every thing we do, and, in this case, in every Boston gear we use for dividing purposes. Just how big those errors are, how they compare with standards used by manufacturers of "precision" dividing devices, how big, and in what way these errors manifest themselves in "OUR" devices and the work we produce on them...These are all unanswered questions in my mind too..probably a few other listers are a bit more than curious, now the questions have been asked. However, I think I made a case for postponing any further theoretical discussion (we have already done that!!) until we had some hard data to go on! For all we know, Boston Gear may work to CLOSER limits than Moore Tool! Unlikely? Why not..they make a heck of a lot more worm wheels in a week than Moore Tool have, maybe, in their entire existence!! Somebody has to get that data..You raised the question, so you got to "Volunteer"!! ;^) > As one who served his apprenticeship as a tool, model, and gauge maker > with IBM when they still made mechanical stuff, including gear hobbing, > I am in a position to refute you opinion. You did a pretty good job of hiding any expertise that you might be bringing to this discussion! I make no apology for getting a vague suspicion that this might be a "Troll" and for attempting to "flush you out" without offending you too much. I guess that worked, huh? At least we know know who you are, and that your we should take your questions seriously. We also know that future discussions don't need to be couched in words of a few syllables! > Perhaps YOU don't read de englisch too good? I guess not. > > Anyways, Robert, I appreciate your suggestion of going to the "horse's > mouth" and get information first-hand. > So go do it! Assignments due on my desk first thing Monday morning! ;^) > Regards, Wolfgang Regards teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: drill sharpening FAQ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 09 Oct 1999 06:12:27 GMT -------- Robert Swinney wrote: > > I don't think anyone could sharpen a small > drill >1/8< by hand and do a credible job -- you just can't hold that > steady. Sorry, Jerry. > Bob Swinney Don't bet the farm on that Bob? ;^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Wanted: EMCO Maximat Super 11 From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 09 Oct 1999 06:27:04 GMT -------- Er! Maybe I am missing something here Mike..But I don't have the FOGGIEST idea what you are talking about! Could you please explain? 8^) teenut mike II wrote: > > Response To:Robert Bastow > who, after deep thought, wrote: > > #had the Second Punic > #War not robbed me of my due! > > The stupid Munich bore has the FLU?? > You'll have to speak up, laddie, the ears ain't what they used to > be.... > > mike ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Rust, Acids and Re: Vinegar and salt From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 09 Oct 1999 06:35:39 GMT -------- Thanks for that very clear explanation Barry, Saved to file for future reference. One caveat about using muriatic acid or hydrochloric acid..Don't do it in your shop or it will turn every bright surface an ugly shade of brown overnight..and continue to do so for months! Salt and vineger seems not to have this effect. teenut "Barry L. Ornitz" wrote: > Pete and others, the reaction is simple - acetic acid and salt form a > dilute solution solution of hydrochloric acid through what chemists call a > double displacement reaction. The hydrochloric acid is rather dilute, but > once it reacts with rust or iron, some additional salt is converted and it > is replenished. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Rust, Acids and Re: Vinegar and salt From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 09 Oct 1999 06:38:14 GMT -------- I use Malt Vinegar! That way I can dip me fish and chips in it while I'm waiting for the rust to dissolve! teenut "Barry L. Ornitz" wrote: > When using vinegar which is a mild solution of acetic acid, use the > cheapest white vinegar you can find. Save the fancy cider, garlic, and > balsamic vinegars for your salads+ACE- > > Barry ornitzNOSPAM+AEA-NOSPAMdpnet.net ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: diy chipper/shredder ideas or plans From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 09 Oct 1999 06:45:30 GMT -------- You might talk to my old buddy "Three finger Jack" and his sidekick "Stumpy" ;^) teenut rick wrote: > > I am looking to build my own wood chipper/shredder, does anyone have > experience and advice? thanks rick ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Wanted: EMCO Maximat Super 11 From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 09 Oct 1999 08:00:42 GMT -------- Mike, you need HELP! teenut mike II wrote: I caught myself in the garage, actually > sorting woodscrews and putting them into little glass jars with the > screw on lids. It's frightening. > > mike ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Gorton engraving cutters and fonts needed From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 09 Oct 1999 16:09:57 GMT -------- John Stevenson wrote: The Best Suggestion I have heard since Betty Grable's!! Why not hire out your font sets so they > can copy them even if it's only a returnable deposit. Mr Nordquist I would be delighted to purchase a set..But they fetch top dollar "on the street" and I know that you would probably prefer to keep the machines and type sets together as a set. I would, however be very willing to do as John suggested, rent the sets from you and leave a (returnable) deposit for your protection and piece of mind. Do you think this might be possible? Thanks teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Tapping fluid's From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 09 Oct 1999 16:46:05 GMT -------- Tallow, (from a candle maker's supply) melt it..add same volume of flake graphite and allow to set. Makes a wonderful, non-drip tapping compound, pack the flutes with it and it will push the chips out of blind holes, etc. Great for dead centers. and for bandsawing or chop sawing non ferrous metals. The lard and kerosene mixtures, already mentioned by others, are good too..bit drippy for tapping but good general purpose machining lubes. teenut KEN wrote: > > Could anyone give me an amateur list of common tapping fluids for > various metals. (the at home kind) Nothing fancy. Metals would be steel, > stainless, brass, aluminum. Nothing fancy just hobby stuff. Thanks a > $1,000,000,000 Ken > -- > Visit My RC Web Site http://home.rochester.rr.com/sar/ > Finally Soloed > New Project 747 jet ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 5C collet gripping range From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 09 Oct 1999 17:15:21 GMT -------- He knows more about collets than you give him credit for. Best accuracy is + zero to - .002" Above + five thou will damage the work, below .010" will damage the collet. 1/32 is vandalism! teenut "David R. Birch" wrote: > > What is the allowable gripping range of a 5C collet that > doesn't risk springing the collet? I worked for a former > Hardinge salesman who thought he was an engineer who thought > he was a machinist who thought he was a CNC programmer. > This guy claimed that 5C collets only had a range of +.005", > but he had been selling them and claiming a narrow range > meant more collets sold. The way he ran his company > suggested he had little knowledge of or talent for > manufacturing or machining. > > So what increments are best? 1/64? 1/32? > > David ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: drill sharpening FAQ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 09 Oct 1999 17:25:22 GMT -------- Commercial practice vs HSM Chalk and cheese I don't dispute anything you say about needing the very best when you are cutting metal for a living. But I do strongly object to giving struggling amateur learners, on a RECREATIONAL.CRAFTS.METALWORKING list the impression that they can't grind a drill, perfectly satisfactorily, by hand and without a microscope. That, dear boy is BULLSHIT! teenut Who has never used a drill drinder or a microscope and has drilled more holes for business and pleasure than most people have had hot dinners! mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article <37FEDD94.A62DC553@home.com>, > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > > > Robert Swinney wrote: > > > > > > I don't think anyone could sharpen a small > > > drill >1/8< by hand and do a credible job -- > > > Don't bet the farm on that Bob? ;^) > > Of course one can hand-shapen small drills, and do a > reasonably good job. But to inspect it and see if it > will cut decently requires a pretty good microscope, > not just a loupe. > > A hand-sharpened drill will not consistently meet the > quality standards of a commercial drill. The Guhring > parabolic flute drills I was using at work were a > real life-saver for drilling deep holes in tough material. > > For drilling one or two holes in a home shop, a hand > sharpened small drill is just fine. But if the job > in question is at work, my boss would scream at me if > I didn't use the best tool available for it. Those > drills are amazingly cheap for what they do. > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: drill sharpening FAQ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 09 Oct 1999 21:09:02 GMT -------- Lordy, Lordy,..here we go throwing $300.00 or more of good tool money at a five cent problem. One that doesn't work for "tiny drills and those above 1/2" to boot!! I think Darex are paying hidden commissions here!! (Just Kidding Grant) ;^) I could teach anyone on this list how to grind a drill in less time than it would take for them to drive down to the hardware store to buy the bolts to fasten a darex onto the bench. It is (Was?) considered a fundamental "first grade" skill among machinists. Learned first couple of days on the job..not twenty years!! Even today I doubt you will find a drill grinder in many Jobbing Shops, and any so called "Skilled Machinist" that wandered around with a dull drill in hand looking for a drill grinder..or. (Ferchrissakes)) a new drill, wouldn't make it through his first day!! teenut Grant Erwin wrote: If you have twenty years to learn a motor skill, no wonder > it seems like falling off a log for you. > > The best solution IMHO for a HSM is a Darex M3 setup. For about $300 you > get drills that are sharpened RIGHT. Doesn't work for tiny drills or those > larger than 1/2" ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: drill sharpening FAQ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 09 Oct 1999 21:12:39 GMT -------- Ned Simmons wrote: > > And the larger problem is describing in text how it's done. > Dead right Ned! It takes a lot longer to write about than it takes to *learn* the technique...Never mind do it! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: drill sharpening FAQ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 09 Oct 1999 21:14:44 GMT -------- John Jacobs wrote: > > AMEN Church is tomorrow John! AMEN to WHAT? teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Wanted: EMCO Maximat Super 11 From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 09 Oct 1999 21:22:10 GMT -------- This, and the previous posts prompted me to go do a long over due job. For years, in common with a lot of other HSMs, I have been collecting every stray nut, bolt, washer, screw, pin etc., that passed my way. These were accumulated in a passle of assorted boxes, jars, tins etc., with the good intention of sorting them all into separate, neatly labled containers "one day"!! Well, today was "D-Day" I went downstairs, gathered them all together.... AND SLUNG THE LOT IN THE TRASH!!! Aren't y'all proud of me? I am!! teenut Gerald Miller wrote: > > I use Tobacco cans from my younger daze:-)> > > -- > > Gerry > London, Canada > > mike II wrote in message > news:3803ea16.30244699@news.spots.ab.ca... > > Response To:Robert Bastow > > who, after deep thought, wrote: > > > > #had the Second Punic War not robbed me of my due! > > > > > > The stupid Munich bore has the FLU?? > > > > I was just practicing for the onset of geezerism, where I will > > misunderstand everything anyone says to me 'cause I'll be too stupid > > to get a hearing aid. > > I KNOW I'm almost there, as I caught myself in the garage, actually > > sorting woodscrews and putting them into little glass jars with the > > screw on lids. It's frightening. > > > > > > mike ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Puzzle Machine -Identify From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 09 Oct 1999 22:08:03 GMT -------- "Sounds like..." Possibly a special, dedicated use, production mill. could have come out of the automotive industry, maybe a gun or typwriter factory. Standard practice in the "olde days" was to build dedicated machines for each machine cut..rather than using "Standard" mills and lathes. Pratt and Whitney were major suppliers to Government Arsenals of this type of equipment. From your description, you and John Stevenson should get together!! You have the bottom half and he has the top half of a great horizontal surface grinder!! teenut Bob & Marilyn Tonkins wrote: > > Folks, > I rescued PART of a machine from our local scrap yard. I'll likely make > something different of it than it used to be, but I'd be intrigued to > know what it WAS. > The base and some of the upper structure of it was wrecked by the > minimum wage bozos who rammed it into the big pile with the lift truck, > but the main table is intact. It weighs 350# without any of the > operating head mounted. It's German, but the only remaining sign merely > indicated table feed direction. > The base is 16" by 32" and is a one piece casting with a raised lip > around it for containing coolant. (Some pipes remained) In the middle > two islands raise that have bolted on, hardened ways with 90 degrees vee > grooves on just the inner surface. The table has matching ways and > grooves on its tongue. The table runs on the base with alternating 90 > degree orientation rollers held in two race strips about 12" long. > There are raised outer pads that straddle the raceway about halfway > along the major length of the base. If there had been nothing mounted in > their tapped holes I would have guessed "straddle mill" or grinder. But > there was a setup bolted in one side that looked like a milling > attachment. It had vertical and horizontal (broken off) vee ways with a > mating assembly holding a quill and a motor hanging off the back like a > drill press. It drove the spindle with matched mini-vee belts. The > spindle had angular contact ball bearings and it held a 3-1/2" long MT2 > shank arbor which had a blind hole in its end tapped 16 mm fine. > The table had a full sized upper portion that was set up to swivel > about a center post and the table was moved by a roller chain as small > as an electric chain saw. The ends of the chain ran down over roller > blocks and were controlled by machinery too damaged to identify or > salvage. > I can think of all kinds of lovely uses for this good junk, but maybe > knowing its provenance would suggest other uses. Oh yeah! Almost forgot. > The unit was absolutely caked with a waxy deposit that jammed > everything. I couldn't even move the table. After scraping off literally > pounds of it and using kero, the table slides wonderfully easy. > It only cost me 15 cents a pound. I'd appreciate any ideas as to its > origins. The color scheme of all the unit was grey with red trim. > > Thanks Mates > BobT ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Wanted: EMCO Maximat Super 11 From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 09 Oct 1999 22:11:35 GMT -------- PANIC!!!! (two hours pass...) I found them!! Where they belong..should have looked there first, Huh! Don't DO that John! teenut John Stevenson wrote: > > On Sat, 09 Oct 1999 21:22:10 GMT, Robert Bastow wrote: > > >For years, in common with a lot of other HSMs, I have been collecting every > >stray nut, bolt, washer, screw, pin etc., that passed my way. These were > >accumulated in a passle of assorted boxes, jars, tins etc., with the good > >intention of sorting them all into separate, neatly labled containers "one > >day"!! > > >I went downstairs, gathered them all together.... > > > >AND SLUNG THE LOT IN THE TRASH!!! > > > >Aren't y'all proud of me? I am!! > > Robert, > > Can you pass me the collets for the Deckel.?? > > They are on that shelf there in a small jar labeled ODDS > > Where?? > > Well they were there !!! > -- > > Regards, > > John Stevenson at > L Stevenson [Engineers] > Nottingham, England. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Altavoz Reincarnate? or the Thought Police? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 09 Oct 1999 22:18:53 GMT -------- I got the following (unsigned of course) message on my private email... Subject: Re: WW1 Era Explosive Ordinance Disposal: Need Advice Date: Sat, 9 Oct 1999 10:12:13 -0500 (CDT) From: esci Organization: esci To: teenut@home.com Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking References: 1 , 2 , 3 , 4 , 5 , 6 , 7 , 8 >You're making a really good case for not reading RCM. Why don't >you follow Altovoz and go away? Just thought I would tell the author publicly, to go screw himself. Whoever he is!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Hydrochloric and Muriatic Acid From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 09 Oct 1999 23:52:27 GMT -------- It is easy to see why the Baume scale is still preferred by many! teenut "Barry L. Ornitz" wrote: (Snip: a welcome clarification of "Muriatic Acid" You may note that the term Baume is often used to > designate the concentration. This is an antiquated hydrometer > scale that is rarely used today, although many acids are specified > that way. The table below gives the conversion of degrees Baume > to density in grams per cubic centimeter. > ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ > Degrees Density > Baume grams/cubic centimeter > > 15.0 0.9655 > 16.0 0.9589 > 17.0 0.9524 > 18.0 0.9460 > 19.0 0.9396 > 20.0 0.9333 > 21.0 0.9272 > 22.0 0.9211 > 23.0 0.9150 > 24.0 0.9091 > 25.0 0.9032 > 26.0 0.8974 > 27.0 0.8917 > 28.0 0.8861 > 29.0 0.8805 > 30.0 0.8750 ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: drill sharpening FAQ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 10 Oct 1999 03:48:00 GMT -------- I bet he had you drill a check hole with the drill to make sure it cut on size! For the benefit of the doubters..How long did it take to get it right..the first lesson? How long does it take you now? One of out jregular jobs in the apprentice training school (All jobs were regular production jobs...no "Test Pieces") was to drill #80 holes in some stainless nozzles. Usually you got a batch of 100 to do and you were issued with ONE NEW DRILL! The job, which entailed machining complete, from barstock, including several diameters, threaded section etc, was done on an OLD Herbert # 1 capstan lathe..not a sensitive, high speed drilling machine. The drill, which usually didn't cut worth a toss, right out of the packet, had to be sharpened with a slip stone and an eye glass (loupe) You quickly got the hang of it..and could feel/hear/sense when it was cutting right. Properly sharpened, the #80 drill would drill 20 to 30 holes 1/8" through, before needing to be touched up. The incentive to "get it right"? First time you broke a drill the Forman would look at you like something that crawled from under a stone and molested his virgin daughter. Most people only ever broke one drill! Second time came the "Walk of Shame"!! You would be draped with a flour sack "Poncho", a hangmans nose set loosely round your neck. You would be handed the broken drill and "Banged around the shop" ie lead by the rope around the shop while 50 or so Apprentices banged on their machine locker doors with anything that came to hand!! teenut John Jacobs wrote: > > Good point teenut. My vo-tech teacher would take a jobber lenght drill, > grind it flat, and have us grind it back. Of course we used a drill > guage to keep the lip lenghts correct. After we did it, he would do it > again, etc. What no one has mentioned is that as you resharpen a drill, > the web gets thicker. Sharpening a drill, and thinning the web is on > page two. How to read a steel rule is on page one. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: drill sharpening FAQ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 10 Oct 1999 03:53:46 GMT -------- Sorry..I wasn't questioning the response. Just that my newsreader sometimes loses messages older than a few days..without a quoted reference I have no Idea what subject is being referred to. 8^) teenut John Jacobs wrote: > > teenut, > I was responding to "That dear boy, is bullshit". > John Jacobs ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: MSC sale From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 10 Oct 1999 04:13:34 GMT -------- Gary Coffman wrote: I should > have gotten some collets too, $1.99 each, but somebody bought the whole table > full when my back was turned. Look out for a bunch of 1/8" square and 13/16" and 7/8" hex 5C collets on ebay. I went through the lot and those were the only three sizes..I bought one of each for 1.99 each. My only other purchase was a jug of heavy screw cutting oil. Total expediture..$14.99 Aren'tcher PROUD of me!! Thursday AM was the only time I could make it there, and I wasn't exactlu impressed by the prices on small stuff! $149.00 for a dented 1/2 HP single phase leeson motor!! Maybe they brought more stuff out later and dropped the prices..There were a quite a few people there muttering things like.."Back to Ebay!!" Good prices on the heavy stuff though..I looked hard at the 12 and 13"x 40" gear head lathes. If I were in the market I would have sprung the 2 to 3000 they were asking for them...Way better investment than a clapped out Southbend IMHO !! (Flame shields UP!!) Nothing like the bargains we heard of reported at the ENCO sale in Kalifornia last year!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Altavoz Reincarnate or Thought Police From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 10 Oct 1999 04:50:13 GMT -------- Well well well! It would appear that my little Hate Mailer can't take a hint!! I just got ANOTHER anonymous (or so he thinks) Message from him!!... >Subject: Re: WW1 Era Explosive Ordinance Disposal: Need Advice > Date: Sat, 9 Oct 1999 21:53:20 -0500 (CDT) > From: esci To: teenut@home.com >The only good advice you've ever given! (Unsigned) I would like to thank all those RCMers who wrote privately to me with messages of support. Especially this one! >Hi, Robert. >He's some kind of computer geek. Did a DejaNews search for esci@fastlane.net, got just 28 posts which started on Jan. 20 and ended on April 22ish of this year. Congratulations, you've beaten a lurker out of the bushes. If successful in baiting and running him to ground, you will be awarded the ears and tail. Here's a typical post, he's not bright enough to disguise who he is on all posts, you can read at the bottom who he is, now you can call him somtime during the night and reply to his suggestion. Here's the most likely private phone number: REGINALD BEARDSLEY PLANO TX 75075 (972)867-8240 Have fun. Signature Deleted A couple of other people confirmed that information..so it doesn't appeear that I am disclosing something not in the "Public Domain" Hi Reggie, How're yer doin' teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: DC Motors and Drives From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 10 Oct 1999 05:41:14 GMT -------- I guess it's time for 'ole teenut to kiss and make up with all the "Sparkies" I have managed to aggravate, recently, with my dumb questions! ;^) Hi Guys! (Throws cap in through door before entering) I have "Acquired" the following non-descript collection: 2 Motors (identical, $6.00 each) Pacific Scientific Cat # SR3635-4664 Diameter 4 5/8" length 6 1/2" Flange mounted, 90 VDC. 5.7 Amp. Field PM Duty SPC HP 1/2 RPM 3800. They each have ther wires coming out: Red green orange. Resistance across Red and orange is zero Resistance from green to either red or orange is infinity 2 Dart Controls (identical $6.00 each..new, one still in antistat wrapping) These are not in panels but consist of a circuit board in a HD aluminum heat sink type, open mounting. Model # 510-100RC-W1348. 120 v imput (it says) There is a row of thumb wheel controls at the top marked: MIN. ACCEL. DECEL. MAX. IR COMP. CUR LIM. And a row of output terminals marked: GND. AC LINE. AC LINE. +ARM. -ARM. -FIELD +FIELD. Down the side is a row of terminals marked: Amp Ref. Pot Lo. Wiper. Pot Hi. Spare> Rev 1. Rev 2. +Tach. Pilot L. Stop. Comm. Start. I also have a Bodine "DC Motor Speed Control" "Basic Speed Range" This is in an enclosure with an on/off switch, forward/reverse switch, pilot light (which lights!!) and a fuse holder all mounted on the front. A small plate on the back Bears the legend: ASH-400 Encased type Dc Motor Speed Control Use with Series 400 Control Motor 1/15 HP - Type NSH Three unmarked wires exit to three pin plug. At mid-range of the front selector, the output appears to be about 150 V DC. (Half scale on the 300VDC setting of my Multimeter) The Forward/Reverse switch reverses polarity of this output. This output is not steady but rises slowly to max setting, then there is a faint click and it falls, momentarily before rising again..this, obviously with no load on the out put. What do I got? Can any of these be made to WORK together..except as boat anchors? If so..How do I wire them without HURTING TEENUT!! (Very Important...please pay special attention to this seemingly unimportant detail) All contributions gratefully accepted..and I promise I won't pick on Sparkies again!! 8^) 8^) teenut If not..What else do I need to get? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Altavoz Reincarnate? or the Thought Police? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 10 Oct 1999 05:53:08 GMT -------- Thanks for the kind words Jim > Some are less gruff than you. > > Jim GRUFF!! Moi? I'm from Yorkshire..You don't know what Gruff is!! ;^) I do try, never to be unkind or rude, to anyone that I don't consider well able to defend themselves..That in itself is a compliment to the opponents I pick! In other words, I never pick on the weak..but the strong better look out!! I Challenge..but many times I stand corrected..and I will be the first to recant if I am proved wrong, or to apologised if I have wronged or appeared rude! I can promise no more nor less than that! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: drill sharpening FAQ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 10 Oct 1999 06:09:45 GMT -------- Jim, Sorry if I mispoke you! Ref Microscope..I meant I have never used one to grind a drill..YET! I recently acquired a Christen drill grinder, which is equiped with its own seting microscope. I hasten to add..lest I be misunderstood ;^) I bought it only because it looked pretty, and it was lonely, and it was cheap, and it looked to have the makings of a nice little T & C grinder..sort of a cross between a Deckel and a Quorn!! I have used microscopes many times for other purposes..checking tool edges, measuring details and lookig endlessly at micrographic samples of metal alloys in the days when I *almost* became a Metallurgist. Mater of fact I am watching Ebay now for a half decent stereo toolmakers microscope..But not for grinding drills!! 8^) teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article <37FF7B4D.C1A1D17B@home.com>, > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > But I do strongly object to giving struggling amateur learners, on a > > RECREATIONAL.CRAFTS.METALWORKING list the impression that they can't > > grind a > > drill, perfectly satisfactorily, by hand and without a microscope. > > Go back and read my comments - I was agreeing with you. > Your condescention ill-suits you. > > > That, dear boy is BULLSHIT! > > teenut > > Who has never used a drill grinder or a microscope... > > You should give the microscope a try sometime. Actually > quite valuable for getting a good view of lots of things like > cutting edges. > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: drill sharpening FAQ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 10 Oct 1999 06:15:56 GMT -------- David Harmon wrote: > When my H. F. drill bits get dull I just rub them on the sidewalk, makes > them good as new. Now THERE"S a Guy after my own heart!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: drill sharpening FAQ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 10 Oct 1999 07:27:55 GMT -------- Memories, Eh! gcouger wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote in message <38000D38.E3E64840@home.com>... > >I bet he had you drill a check hole with the drill to make sure it cut on > size! > > > >For the benefit of the doubters..How long did it take to get it right..the > first > >lesson? > > To learn to sharpen a bit so it worked resonaly well took about 4 hours. > > For cutting on one lip it didn't take very long. For cutting flat bottom > holes > it took a lot of tries. In the aircraft shop I would check the drill every > time I sharpened it with a test hole. And on those flat bottomed things > I inspected every part as soon as it was drilled with 8 of these things. > I always drilled them first so when I killed a part it didn't have much > time in it. > > The meanest drilling job I ever saw was the grease hole on the > Jesus bolt on a helicopter. The bolt was 8 & 1/2 inches long and > the hole was 1/16. I never had to drill one. And the bolt was 4140 > with a 90,000 yield. Not exactly soft. I used some of the bolts with > broken drills in them for tooling and they weren't easy to cut. > > Gordon > > Gordon Couger gcouger@couger.com > Stillwater, OK ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Changing times From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 10 Oct 1999 07:45:49 GMT -------- John Hofstad-Parkhill wrote: > Then Jet tools buys Powermatic. I think PM dug their own grave. God help us all...they are at the Gate!! I'm just glad I have all my PM equipment..stick a fork in..it's done!! > > I happen to be a Starrett nut. I don't really mind, and rationally I > understand that just because it says Starrett, does not make it the best > tool for that particular task (nobody makes everything perfect). But they > _do_ make nice stuff. I Like Starrett stuff too, if only because it works and is consistant. Must profess a *Slight* preference for the older Lufkin and B&S small tools..they always seem to have just that "edge" over the Starrett stuff. They fetch less on Ebay too!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: A Quicky for the Sparkies From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 10 Oct 1999 18:34:40 GMT -------- My son just cam home from school with a straight A grade report (Grade11)! Not bad for a kid in his first term in a new school in a new country, in a new home, with a new Mom..and who was about to drop out of school !! Kinda proud of him..and would like to encourage him all I can! OK..Proud Dad Rant over! His interests lie in computor programming and electronics...right now he is building robots using the motors out of quartz watches!! Way over my head, I don't mind admitting!! I got him a top of the line fluke multimeter and a precision power supply for his Birthday..so he is ok in that area. I think (know) he would like an oscilloscope. could someone take a quick look at this item for me http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=175390482 Usual caveats apply on buying unseen..But is this the TYPE of device that would be useful to someone at his level? What are "good Manufacturers" Price levels for good, used, equipment etc. Bear in mind we are not planning a moon shot here (not this year anyway!! ;^) I could wait until Xmas..tell him to pick what he would like from a catalogue and (price, my bank account and SWMBO all in alignment) just go get it. But I would kinda like to give him a bit o' something for his tremendous effort this past couple of months. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Muriatic Acid in the loo? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 10 Oct 1999 18:36:49 GMT -------- Heck! Just be sure to do the first flush BEFORE you take the next DUMP!! teenut Gerald Miller wrote: > > Just do yourself a favour and make certain the lid is down, or even better, > cover the bowl with plastic wrap before the first flush. You are, after all, > adding water to acid, which IIRC is a definite NO-NO!! :-)> ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: South Bend takes a bath From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 10 Oct 1999 18:50:12 GMT -------- Congratulations on the new baby!! sounds like it found a good home! mulligan@advinc.com wrote: I think I should be able to turn a > > replacement tube without much trouble (a nice beginner's project). > > Actually a pretty tough job. The hard part is getting the right > thin-wall tubing, Suggestions: Royal can supply the tubing in correct od/id or a new drawtube complete..I don't imagine they are cheap..but not THAT far out of line. Cut the threaded section off and weld on a new section or even build up the damaged threads with weld before recutting..a lot easier than turning a "Near size" piece of scrounged tubing to "Right size" I have a short section of "politically correct tube" cut off when I adapted a Southbend 13" drawtube to the much shorter headstock on my Maximat. If you NEED it it's yours. 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Making taps From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 10 Oct 1999 18:53:42 GMT -------- Taps are not tapered on the pitch diameter, nor are they form relieved. Only the o/d of the thread is tapered and relieved! Easy to make specials yourself. teenut tonyp wrote: > > Folks, a recent thread reminded me of a > question I've been meaning to ask: how are taps made? Specifically, how > do you taper the pitch diameter on the start end and transition to the > fixed PD without losing continuity? I can imagine CNC lathes doing this > easily, but how was it done in the olden days? > > -- > Tony Prentakis > Consumer of time, occupier of space, producer of Z-stages > "How can I know what I think until I hear what I have to say?" ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: drill sharpening FAQ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 10 Oct 1999 19:02:55 GMT -------- I can probably guess that a "Jesus" bolt is so called because it is kinda important! Guessing again, but is that the "only" bolt keeping the rotors in reasonable proximity to the rest of the helicoptor? Jesus?? JESUS!! This is ONE case where I thing I would want the drill (for the grease Hole) ground on a Multi-million dollar CNC pointer and set/checked with an electron microscope!! By an EXPERT with at least twenty years experience..Who was going to fly in it with me!! ;^) teenut Gerald Miller wrote: > > Now there's a supply of good quality material if one could find out where to > purchase it - "I'll have half a tonne of helicopter Jesus bolts please" :-)> > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: MOVING MUST SELL LATHE & MILL From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 10 Oct 1999 19:17:08 GMT -------- Can't ship!!! I would carry it on my BACK before sell a kit of tools like that Unless you are quitting the hobby (Yeh right! It has been tried before...They call it the $30,000 "cure" 'cos that's what it costs to get kitted up again when you quit trying to quit!!) Counselling is available from this NG. teenut Irving Olson wrote: > > Complete fine metal workshop in my basement and must sell only because I > am moving. I live in Akron, Ohio and can't ship. Must be seen to be > appreciated. If you live in a radius of 300 to 500 miles and if you > want to improve your shop, call me and come over. Included: Monarch > 10EE Lathe(3500 lb), Deckel Mill with digital read-out (1300 lb), > Rockwell band saw, Die filing machine, 24" precision metal shear, Bear > metal edge trimmer, Rockwell tool grinder, Arbor press, 3HP Air > compressor, Drafting table with hydraulic lift. electric hacksaw, Lista > steel tool drawer cabinet (made in Switzerland, weighs 700 lbs empty), > Gerstner Wooden Tool chest plus every imaginable chuck, collet, reamer, > drill, end mill, vise, instrument. Also a stock of brass, aluminum and > steel appropriate for the model maker. > > I am an amateur and have been making model locomotives and steam engines > for fun. Irving Olson Tel, (330)867-1111, Akron, Ohio ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: drill sharpening FAQ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 10 Oct 1999 20:03:58 GMT -------- What IS your problem Jim?? mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article <38000D38.E3E64840@home.com>, > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > The drill, which usually didn't cut worth a toss, right out of the > > packet, had > > to be sharpened with a slip stone and an eye glass (loupe)... > > Hold on there. First you've never resorted to a microscope to sharpen > a drill. Yet in the above narrative, there's the loupe. Since when was a loupe a microscope?? > Hmm. Did you also walk 17 miles to school every day, in snow > "up to here" wearing nothing but that flour sack? Do I detect a hint of disbelief? Could that be because so many things are outside YOUR obviously limited experience? Mockery as a tactic is a first resort of an idiot and the last resort of a failure! In actual fact it was eight miles and yes, we did walk it "Up to here in Snow" Not every day..but often enough, when the buses couldn't get through.. a not infrequent occurrence on the Yorkshire Moors. There were times when I would have been damned thankful for an extra layer..sacking or otherwise! Kids didn't have "Snow Suits" and Mommas with 4WD Broncos then! > Any shop that would rather have it's workers re-sharpening > drills like that (strictly a waste of time in a production environment) > rather than making parts, is probably long since out of business. Jim, I was talking of Forty years ago.!! We were talking of a TRAINING CENTER!! They were training SKILLED tradesmen..You know (Maybe) the kind of people that produce the kind of equipment that your "Workers" need in todays "Production Environment" Incidently the company IS still in Business..and probably making similar parts by better (production) methods tho' the quit training their own skilled people a generation ago and probably Import all their production equipment as a consequence. It is called "Dumbing Down" and part of the reason is the short term kind of "third quarter Bottom Line" thinking that you exhibit above. God knows what the eventual cost will be! We had been discussing whether it was POSSIBLE to sharpen a drill properly without a Darex $300 whizz bang. We have been discussing this on a News Group..where, by definition ( Rec.Crafts.Metalworking..not alt.ind.hightechproduction) most of the people are just glad to get the drill to go around the right way and cut a hole. The thrust of yourself, and other, even more supercilious and arrogant posters has been that it is impossible to properly regrind a drill without a slew of expensive equipment. That is Bullshit as I have already stated. Just because YOU can't, doesn't mean it is impossible..or even that damned difficult! I think enough people with the skill to do it, have spoken up and perhaps encouraged some of our newer comers to metalworking to go and try it for themselves. > Good drills are expensive - but like most tool steel, cheap stuff > is no bargain. Even brand new, top of the line, expensive drills, often don't cut worth a toss straight out of the packet..I think that was confirmed by quite a few people too! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Making taps From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 10 Oct 1999 20:20:00 GMT -------- Almost that easy Tony, except you do need to "Back Off" i.e give radial relief to the tapered cutting edges of the tap. This is just a top relief..think of it as the FRONT relief on a turning tool. FORM relief..like a gear cutting hob is not required..or even desireable..It would cause digging in, chatter and for sure, oversize cutting. For a real, quick, dirty, one off tap: Take a steel bolt of the correct size. Grind a couple of gashes in the end..just like a "Gun Tap" Case Harden in Kaseite etc..dip it in soft soap before heating, to prevent scaling. Quench out dead hard and go cut the thread. Most times it will cut well without needing any top relief. teenut tonyp wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote in article > <3800E185.6CEC4C7C@home.com>... > > Taps are not tapered on the pitch diameter, nor are they form relieved. > > > > Only the o/d of the thread is tapered and relieved! > > > > Easy to make specials yourself. > > > > teenut > > Hey, Robert, thanks for the instantaneous response! If I read you right, > you're saying that I can make a tap by: > > 1. Turn a drill rod to the desired OD; > 2. Taper the front end of it; > 3. Cut threads to desired PD in the usual way; > 4. Cut flutes, harden, etc. > > IOW, the root diameter is the same everywhere and the threads on the taper > are simply truncated on the OD. Have I got the order of 1,2, and 3 right, > or would you recommend a slightly different sequence? FYI, if I try to do > this, I'll be making something like 3/8-56, and using it to tap into Oilite > bronze -- once. > > -- > Tony Prentakis > Consumer of time, occupier of space, producer of Z-stages > "How can I know what I think until I hear what I have to say?" ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: A Quicky for the Sparkies From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 10 Oct 1999 20:21:36 GMT -------- Thanks Tom, Exactly the kind of guidance I hoped for! teenut Tom wrote: > > > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > His interests lie in computor programming and electronics...right now he is > > building robots using the motors out of quartz watches!! Way over my head, > > I > > don't mind admitting!! > > > > I think (know) he would like an oscilloscope. > > > > could someone take a quick look at this item for me > > > > http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=175390482 > > > > Usual caveats apply on buying unseen..But is this the TYPE of device that > > would > > be useful to someone at his level? > > > > What are "good Manufacturers" Price levels for good, used, equipment etc. > > As someone who does this stuff for a living,the first thing that struck me > was that is only a 20Mhz model........... > With today's computers running 100Mhz+ bus speeds,the usefulness may be a bit > limited,however if you can get it for a decent price it would still be useful > for basic experimenting. > I'd shoot for something at least 100Mhz or more. > E-mail the seller and double check the frequency range,also find out the > reserve.I'd be hard pressed to pay much more than $100 for it. > I've seen 100Mhz+ used scopes in the $2-300 range > > B&K is one of the more common manufacturers,especially in the consumer/economy > models.Fluke, HP and others are all decent.Not many companies bother to make a > crappy scope since it is a somewhat limited market,even more so than > metalworking > > Do a search on Altavista or such for oscilloscopes,I'm sure something will > pop up. > > Tom ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Barker Bench mill From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 10 Oct 1999 22:14:37 GMT -------- Nifty little tool for someone: http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=178758313 FWIW teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Altavoz Reincarnate? or the Thought Police? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 10 Oct 1999 23:53:59 GMT -------- Methinks the lady doth protest too loudly! Reginald Beardsley wrote: > > Just to set the record straight: > > Any inference of an attempt at anomynity inferred from the setting of > my GECOS field in the passwd file is erroneous. > > While it it possible that my .signature file did not get appended to > my initial email to Mr. Bastow, I suspect that the truth is simply > that he did not read far enough to see it following the post of his I > had thoughtlessly (but not unintentionally) included in my email. Truth is, Sunshine, you sent the wrong message to the wrong person and got caught! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Taps as roughing endmills? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 11 Oct 1999 00:06:29 GMT -------- That thought has occurred to me too..but (see earlier thread on making taps) taps don't have any radial relief..like milling cutters. I'm not sure how effective a tap would be, or for how long. As soon as you got any edge wear, you would get full flank contact, a cessation of cutting action, temperature rise and funny smells!! ;^) If it was a rough old tap, and you had a collet that would hold it, (all my ROTs are the wrong diameter..which is why I have never tried it in moments of stress (or poverty!!) and you if really NEEDED a roughing mill, in a hurry..it might be worth grinding back relief and give it a whirl. Wouldn't want to use it as a tap afterwards though! teenut Mike Graham wrote: > > I was looking at a picture of a roughing endmill today and it occurred to > me that it doesn't look that different from a tap. I haven't tried it yet, > but does anyone think it's possible to use a big tap as a roughing endmill > (I know it won't plunge cut at all; it would be just for chewing off edges). > I've also considered cutting the shanks off of big reamers and using > *them* as endmills, as I have a very cheap source of them. Any thoughts? > > -- > Mike Graham, mikegraham at sprint dot ca > Caledon, Ontario, Canada (just NW of Toronto). > > Raiser of animals. Weldor of metals. Driver of off-road vehicles. > Writer of FAQs. Keeper of the faith, and all around okay guy. > > < homepage currently off-line due to change of ISP; back soon > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Hydrochloric and Muriatic Acid From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 11 Oct 1999 01:55:04 GMT -------- Alan Mimms wrote: > And we ALL know how much the English (Robert) LOVE the French, don't > we? Moi? What did I say now?? ;^) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Muriatic Acid in the loo? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 11 Oct 1999 02:02:42 GMT -------- Don Wilkins wrote: > As long as it is sitting in the bowl there is no problem. You can > always slurp most of it back out either using a straw and blowing it > into a plastic bucket... Did I miss something here..or is Don talking about Muriatic acid in a toilet bowl? Finally lost it too, Huh Don! This NG has that effect! ;^) Your friend in insanity, teenut...I think? Er, How soon do you need to know? The great thing about Alzhiemer's, is that you get to meet new people every day! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Welding hard steel From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 11 Oct 1999 02:12:22 GMT -------- The welding experts herein, will probably be able to tell you how to do it SAFELY!! But consider the consequences of a broken blade flying out at ankle level!! As you have the Axy/Act set up, might it be safer to braze or silver solder them together? Loss of a bit of temper in the middle being by far the lesser evil than loss of strength through embrittlement or cracking. teenut JAC wrote: > > I was wondering if this is possible. I would like to weld two lawn > mower blades together in an X formation. I know that they are some > type of hard steel, but do not know how to weld them. I have a baby > mig, and an Oxy/act setup. > > If anyone is wondering why I would want to do this, here is the > awnser. I am a commercial lawn service, and have found that running 2 > blades really improves the discharge of the mower. I have been > putting them on loose, but think that the welded blades will make > faster remove/install. > > I have only worked with mild steel before. Never did anything like > this. Is it the same, or is there something that I need to do? Can > it even be done? > > Thanks for reading. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Thankyou One and all From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 11 Oct 1999 02:26:11 GMT -------- Helluva group of people we have here. I just wanted to say a HUGE "Thank you" to all those who took the time to respond to my recent questions about DC Drives and about an oscillascope for my son. Many of the responses you have read here, many, many more, were sent privately and included words of encouragement regarding myself, my son and some of the "late unpleasantnesses" There were just too many, to respond to personally. I can't thank y'all enough. I have printed and filed all the information and will now let my "Non-Sparky" brain, slowly chug and rumble through it all! Sincerely, ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: drill sharpening FAQ?(new topic) From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 11 Oct 1999 02:51:40 GMT -------- > When tightening a a drill >chuck, do you only put the key in one hole and tighten or do you put it >in all three? > It depends..;^) With a new, or unworn, quality, chuck, especially of the ballbearing variety, It shouldn't be necessary to tighten on more than one hole for maximum grip security. Nor should it be neccessary to use all three pinion holes..or even be selective, in order to get acceptable accuracy. I have never seen this advocated by any of the chuck manufacturers, certainly I have never made a practice of it. However, not all our chucks are unworn as we well know!! Nor are all of our drill shanks perfect. Huh? Certainly for maximum security, when opening up a piloted hole, counterboring etcetera., when drilling in sheet metal, when a countersink bit just will NOT stop chattering...( 8^) yours too, huh?) I have been known to give 'em all a tweak for luck! You may also find (actually fer damn' sure you will find), that on a less than pristine chuck, one of the pinion holes will give better accuracy than the rest. So feel free to mark it and use it..I do! Slowly I am replacing all my keyed chucks with keyless ones. Albrechts I reserve for the "picky" stuff, but even the cheap "clones" are vastly superior to any keyed chuck, except, perhaps, the larger, ball bearing Jacobs chucks. In an industrial setting, where time is money, the keyless chucks have my vote every time...if only because there is no need to find and pick up a chuck key! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: drill sharpening FAQ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 11 Oct 1999 07:59:04 GMT -------- mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > , > Robert Bastow > > What IS your problem Jim?? > > None whatever. Life's just grand. Glad to hear it, last thing I want is, for what should be a professional discussion to get out of hand and start to spoil anyone's day! > > > The thrust of yourself, and other, even more supercilious and arrogant > posters > > has been that it is impossible to properly regrind a drill without a > slew of > > expensive equipment. > > Here you are really off base, Robert. You mis-state my position > completely. Of course one can grind > a decent drill offhand. Then I apologise Jim!! SOMBODY said that and, in the convolutions of this thread I had come to believe it was you! (trust me..if it gets any more convoluted I will be writing nasty missives to myself..and so will you!) The task becomes more complex as the > size goes down, and at some point becomes impossible without > some extra magnification. 1/8 - sure, that's easy. But I would not > bother to do the ones in the 60 thru 80 index without some help. No disagreement..unless you HAVE to! My point is that a lot of people on this list have only the option of tackling it with no help, no aids, no skill and no practice...or NOT DOING IT! What a tragic waste! I can't be there to help them..but at least I can give them the confidence to TRY..knowing that it CAN be done, It has been done, and by golly, if that old fart teenut can do it SO CAN I!! (Forgive me Jim..I am not SHOUTing..just putting emphasis on the key points!) > > Anyone who wants to learn this skill should start large - and I > mean 1/2 inch and above. This is a great way to make long drills > short. I believe I learned on a 3/4" taper shank drill..it is a lot easier to see all the angles and begin to understand how they work and interact. By the way..we had a handy little dohickey to help get the drill lips level. I have never heard it described before.. For the morse taper shank drills from 1/4" up to about 1" diameter, we had a piece of 2" by 1/8" hot rolled steel strap..about 14" long. One end was bent at right angles, about 2" from the end to form an L shape with one 12" upright and a 2" horizontal. In the geometric center of this short leg was afixed a "dead" center..not a lathe tailstock center!!...more like a 1/2" bolt, 1/2" long, turned or ground to a 60 deg point (Approx...no great precision required) and screwed in from the under side. Thats IT..toolmaking over! In use the inner face of the upright was coated with whitewash (Never SAW marking blue 'til I got in the toolroom!) The drill was ground, freehand, on the FACE of the wheel (not the flat side)...care being taken to keep the POINT angle as equal as possible on both sides..I'll tell you how to do THAT in a moment.. Lets do that now in fact.. Jim, You are dead right about not being able to grind a drill without mechanical help! Well here's how you create your own "6 Million Dollar Bionic Darex" ;^) Let's assume we are going to sharpen a 3/8" diameter, 2MT shank drill..it is about 8" long (these figures are arbitrary..I just want every one to have the same mental picture of what I am describing. We approach the wheel, which has been dressed on its face, dead straight across with no grooves..(Ve SHOOT anyone ve catch putting grooves in ze drill wheel!!..No Pity..No Prisoners..Ya! Verdampt!) (Sorry)... The drill shank is held firmly in the RIGHT hand...ALL the movement and control is imparted by the RIGHT hand. For the purposes of drill grinding, the left hand could be...with benefit..a LUMP OF CLAY!! It is from this "lump of clay" that we fashion the Bionic Darex". Place your left hand thumb and finger tips LIGHTLY together..Relax the other three fingers aand let them naturally curl against the palm of your hand. Let the drill flute drop into the vee between thumb and fore finger and let the tip of the finger "Find" the curve of the flute where it fits comfortably. The tip of the thumb rests on the sharp junction ot the land and the flute, about an inch back from the drill tip. Now...SQUEEZE HARD!!! YOUCH!...I said it would be easier if it were clay! 8^) Lift the drill from your fingers...see the GROOVE?...Drop the drill back in..it locates within a thou or two! Magic?..Bionic at least! Squeeze again to set the groove. You have created a customised drill guide that fits better that that on any machine ever built! You can relax your grip now..feel how smoothly the drill will ride back and forth, guided by the groove you have created for it. Place the knuckles of your left hand, LIGHTLY on the ginding wheel tool rest, and swing the drill shank, from left to right (using ONLY your right hand) and push the drill lengthways though that groove in your fingers back or forth using the groove to make the drill twist or "rifle" in your fingers. Do NOT move your left hand in any way..it is made of clay remember! UNTIL.... A) The drill axis is "eyeballed" to be at half the required point angle to the wheel face...You can scribe or chalk reference lines on your grinder benchtop to help you line this up..at least untill it become almost second nature. B) The drill axis is dropped JUUUst below horizontal. This will ensure that your soon to be ground drill lip will start with a "smidgin" of cutting clearance. (Ideally, and certainly for a beginner, the grinder rest should be set dead radially to the wheel center and about half the drill diameter below the true center of the wheel) C) The two cutting edges of the drill..the straight, sharp bits, formed by the junction of the flute and the back face (the only bit you grind), should be horizontally disposed..with the edge uppermost on the side closest to your left hand..the othe sharp bit of course, pointing downwards (Jeeze this would be a lot easier with a sketch pad) This I will call the SET or START position! NOW, move your left hand for the first, last, and ONLY time during th is whole exercise. GENTLY ease the cutting edge towards the spinning wheel, carefully maintaining all the angles and orientations of the SET position..until the cutting edge is JUST shy of touching the wheel. If you listen carefully you will hear the tone of the entrained air, whistling through the narrowing gap. You will hear a subtle but distinct change of tone JUST, I mean Just...a couple tenths of a thou BEFORE the edge touches the wheel. STOP!!! FREEZE!! DO NOT MOVE!! Now, press the knuckles of your lump of clay..sorry, your left hand FIRMLY down onto, into and around the grinding rest..establish a "Groove" on the back of your hand as well as between your fingers. We are now ready to grind, Your left hand locked to the drill and grinding rest is otherwise quite relaxed..letting the drill slide, twist and tilt wherever your right hand and the groove in your fingers tell it to go. The actual grinding is a bit of an anticlimax. You have previously studied a new drill point, you have read about clearance, and cutting angles, and rakes and...... With the RIGHT hand in control, gently, kinda, lean forward... bending or squeezing your arms hands and body..rather than actually moving them..untill you take up that last couple of tenths and the wheel begins to cut. Let it cut..don't force it, and dont' rush it..it really won't hurt anything if you take a full minute Per pass per face. YOU and your "Bionic Darex" are totally in control of that drill and the wheel..Forget the times when, close to panic, you swung the drill wildly past the wheel, hoping to get "the dirty deed" over with as quickly as possible. Take your time, enjoy the moment, THINK about the shape you are trying to generate. Just the one face is left to "Interpretation"...every other aspect,angle, facet, what have you...Has ALREADY BEEN TAKEN CARE OF!! and is locked in place under your control! The right hand should perfome a "Lower Quadrant sweep" for want of a better term..An observer behind you would see your hand move from about 17 minutes past the hour on a clock face, to roughly 25 minutes past. But it isn't a smooth arc of a circle, more a sector of an elipse..You see, as your hand starts to drop slowly, you are also rotating the drill in "the groove"..the first third of the turn needs to maintain that very slight clearance angle on the cutting edge, and not increase it too rapidly. You need the clearance to cut..But too much at that point will WEAKEN the edge, and cause the drill to snatch and chip...So the first part of the rotation is ALMOST but not quite, just as though you were grinding a straight cone point on the end of your drill. Only as you approach the second third, does your right hand start to noticably drop..kinda "Catching Up" on the rotary motion...increasing the clearance as it does. In the last third of the rotaion the right hand drops quite rapidly..Thogh not enough to catch the OTHER drill lip on the wheel..that lip is coming around quite rapidly by now. Above all, take your time, if it helps, move the drill one degree at a time, and think ahead what shape or angle the next degree of cutting face needs...Remember, you have control, and IT ain't going nowhere 'til you decide. After a pass on one face, flip the drill in your "Bionic Darex" DO NOT MOVE THAT LEFT HAND!!, return to SET position and repeat, the pass on the other face. Having done a couple of passes on each face..it is now time to check the results on our homemade "Optical Comparator" (Sorry Jim I couldn't resist!!) ;^) Rest the center hole in back end of the drill shank, on the center point of the "Comparator" and use, first one and then the other drill lip to scribe a light line on your whitewashed (OK Blue or red dyed) surface. You will readily see if the lines coincide..if the lips are even..or not, as the case may be. Lets assume they are..Now look directly DOWN on the end of the drill to check the clearances. HUH? How can you check radial clearance by looking it staight in the face? Surely you need to look at it sideways? Well no you don't...for once all thos interacting and confusing angle and faces and clearances are going to work together in YOUR favor and make what could be a tricky bit of metrology..quite simple. While we are looking at the end of the drill, we will also check that the POINT ANGLE is correct too!!! (Ok guys, leave quietly..teenut has finally lost it!!) No really, trust me. IF you look straight down on the point of a well sharpened, standard drill, you will see the two cutting edges, joined by the CHISEL edge which crosses over the web of the drill The angle fromed by the chisel edge to each cutting edge, should be ABOUT 50 deg...anywhere between 40 and sixty is ok for a first attempt. (I can hear the purists and theorists screaming and lighting up their flame throwers) But believe me, get it in that ball park and your drill will CUT. If the angle is too steep..you don't have enough clearance...negative clearance will give you an angle event greater than 90 deg. Too MUCH clerance and the angle will appear too shallow! While looking at the end, check the point angle, How? Look down the axis of the drill at the cutting edges. Are they straight? If so, your point is pretty close to the right angle (As designed for that drill, by its manufacturer when he set the helix angle and the cross section of the flute) If the edges appear CONCAVE the point is too flat and if they appear CONVEX, the point is too "Pointy" If your drill passes all these tests, which take but a second or two to perform, THEN IT WILL CUT..pretty close to size, without chattering, chipping, overheating, wandering or seizing. I guarantee it! Hey, thats a pretty good start for the first drill you ever ground! All it takes now is a bit of practice for it to become second nature and almost as easy with a little 'un or a big 'un! Hey guys! My apologies for "goin'on" but If it helps just one person to pluck up the couragre and go hand sharpen his (or Her) first drill, by hand... Then I hope you will bear with me. It is late, I am tired and I am not even going to proof or spell check this, 'night all teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: drill sharpening FAQ?(new topic) From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 11 Oct 1999 08:12:16 GMT -------- OOPS! Sorry Jens You copied me on email with this and I answered directly! So I'll let someone else respond..you can see if I lied!! Perhaps we can get Pete (Mr Klue..er..Keyless) Albrecht 'imself to respond!! teenut Jens wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > >Slowly I am replacing all my keyed chucks with keyless ones. Albrechts I > >reserve for the "picky" stuff, but even the cheap "clones" are vastly superior > >to any keyed chuck, except, perhaps, the larger, ball bearing Jacobs chucks. > > Why is a keyless one better than a keyed chuck ???? I would have > thought that in a production environment you would want a keyed chuck > since you can really tighten them down. (no, I have never used a > keyless one ....) > > Jens ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 5C collet gripping range From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 11 Oct 1999 08:30:14 GMT -------- I make all my own D1-3 Backplates (or machine 'em right into the back of the chuck if possible) I have made them in the past, for several other D1-x sizes as well as A and LOO types. Not real difficult if you have the specs handy. Probably easier than a large threaded one. I made myself a "dummy" D1-3 nose gage a long time ago and that speeds it up..though not absolutely necessary. Beats the heck out of buying them..Have you PRICED them lately!! I do buy the camlock pins though..Special order by MSC from Bison. Threads are standard 7/16 -20 teenut Jens wrote: > Has anyone ever attempted to make a D type backplate (or done anything > that has the D mounting as integral part)? How difficult is this to > get accurate enough to make the effort worthwhile ? > > Just kinda curious .... > > Jens ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: VFW Post needs M-1Garande clips!! From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 11 Oct 1999 08:43:36 GMT -------- Pop into the next Friendly, Neighborhood, Gun/Computor/YK2/Survivalist/ Militia/Tent Revivalist Show. Aisle three, between the Bazookas and the Gourmet MRE's Seriously tho' you will find lots there for cheap! teenut RStolz5833 wrote: > > To All, > > My VFW post is in need of 24 clips for the 30-06 M-1, We used to get them when > we ordered Blank Ammo.. They don't come with it anymore. We need these to fire > at funerals, and other cerrimonial functions. If someone can help please email > me and I will pass along to our commander. > > Rick > Life member 2260 Oconomowoc, WI ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Useful tool idea on Ebay From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 11 Oct 1999 13:27:24 GMT -------- Heads up, anyone with parting off problems.. http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=179120337 This type of tool DOES work, and can be the answer to parting off problems on smaller, lighter or just plain "tired" lathes. Not as effective as a rear tool post but a lot easier to make.. I have no idea on the size, age, condition or quality of this one..Caveat Emptor!! Easy enough to make your own or adapt one to try the idea. FWIW 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: drill sharpening FAQ?(new topic) From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 11 Oct 1999 13:52:11 GMT -------- Son of a gun! I never "twigged" the difference before. Thanks Mike..It makes more sense now! teenut Exit: stage left, muttering to self......;^) Mike Graham wrote: . The > other kind is the Albrecht/Rohm style, and on it the fingers *do* rotate > with the sleeve when you tighten and loosen. This means that the force on > the drill bit causes it to tighten. The more force exerted on the bit, the > harder the chuck hangs on. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Defacing Currency Was . . . "What is this metal". From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 11 Oct 1999 13:55:59 GMT -------- Naw! If that were the case, like the old silver dollars, they would be worth more than face value! teenut "Chris K. Hepburn" wrote: (of Canadian Dollar coin..aptly named "Loonies") Maybe they really *are* chocolate > inside? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lapping internal threads From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 11 Oct 1999 14:29:40 GMT -------- I have a couple of sets of the cheaper version, no name brand I bought at $8.00 a set for cheap drill press packers. They have exactly the same problem..Maybe they haven't heard of "plus five" taps in ...wherever. To add insult to injury, the clearance holes are even smaller than the tapped holes..so there seemed little point in wasting time on the threads. I do have a couple of "Good" sets if required. If you "Really" need to open up the threads don't waste time and money buggering up a couple of good taps..'cause it WILL bugger up the tap!! Make a brass or even mild steel lap, screw cut to fit the existing "thread" drill full length and tap the end half the length for an 8-32 setscrew, split the end with a fine saw about 2/3 the length of the lap. No need for fancy tapers inside..just insert the screw,loosely, coat the lap with 180 grit Clover Compound and lap away. Twitch the screw up as it gets sloppy. If you want or need a better lap..for this or another job. Make it out of Mild Steel, forget tapping the end..see if you can split it half way from each side..kinda like the eye of a needle, and leaving the end solid. You can "adjust" for wear and sizing, to very fine limits, by inserting the tip of a screw drive in the slot and tweaking gently. Commercial "Mini" or "Micro laps" work on this principle. It works on threaded or plain laps..the smallest I have is about 0.045" diameter and are used with diamond paste. (Which is invaluable to have around and isn't as expensive as one might expect. Especially as a tiny tube of a couple differnt grades will last a lifetime for most people!) It will work quite quickly..as any Tool and Die guy will tell you. If he tells you he NEVER forgot to use an oversize tap..you can tell him to his face he is a Lyin' SOB!!! Makes you wonder about the current quality of B&S though... "How are the mighty fallen...!" teenut "w.j.ward" wrote: > > I bought a pair of those Brown & Sharpe "Ultra Precision" 1-2-3 blocks. > Unfortunately, I couldn't get the supplied screws into the threaded > holes. They are 3/8x16 (I think). I don't know if the holes shrunk > during hardening, or if they are just fouled up with scale. These > blocks are supposed to have been made in the U.S. At least, that's what > the MSC catalog said. Since there is no indication of the country of > origin on the blocks or the package they came in, I can't say for sure. > I have a suspicion that they are from China. Anyway, they are really a > disappointment. > > Any suggestions of how I can clean up the threads? The steel is really > hard. I don't have a carbide tap, but I was thinking about lapping with > a bit of threaded rod or a bolt. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Mobility scooter: can I build one? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 11 Oct 1999 14:34:17 GMT -------- Nick Hull wrote: >Do you need maneuverability or just straight line motion? "Keep right on to the end of the road...!" GUESS, Nick! ;^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Mobility scooter: can I build one? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 11 Oct 1999 14:41:26 GMT -------- Doug Goncz wrote: >One of my projects is to wire all ten from this case in series and run >the cappucino maker on the moped. Let me guess Doug!...California!..Right? Aywhere east of there, it would be a four-ale beer cooler, on the back of the Harley! Just kiddin' Doug! 8^) Doug! DOUG!! You ARE just kidding? Right! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Grooves in slate From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 11 Oct 1999 14:45:14 GMT -------- Diamond saw blade..run wet and feed slow. Slate will spall like the blazes. Granite would be easier, Harder, but less likely to fall apart on you! teenut charles wrote: > > I need to do some machining on some pieces of slate 1 inch thick - > counter-bored holes and blind 1/8 in. grooves. > What sort of cutters should I use to mill or rout? Presumably at a > fairly slow speed. > Any advice would be most welcome. > regards, > -- > charles ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Bipolar Disease. (was:Re: Altavoz Reincarnate? ) From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 11 Oct 1999 14:51:47 GMT -------- brian whatcott snidely wrote: > I guess I should watch out for posters who use many exclamations, and > all caps. This is supposed to be a sign that you should humor them >and not disagree with any wild flight of fancy they express. How WISE you are Brian!! ;^) tEEnuT ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: what are gage balls used for? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 11 Oct 1999 15:11:21 GMT -------- They sell them in sets or singly. Uses: Generally to measure tapers in one way or another. Two different sized balls and a depth mic. plus a bit of trig will tell you the exact taper of a hole or socket. Reversing the math will tell you if a hole of known taper, has the right depth to a specified gauge line. Tooling Balls, on the other hand, have an integral shank and are used, often as location devices in fixtures..Especially when it is required to locate an angled or taper bore from some datum that does not fall on a flat surface. Very useful if you need to intercept one bore with another. teenut Grant Erwin wrote: > > I know, it's a dumb question. Well, I'm not a machinist, just a middle-aged > EE who usually sits in front of a keyboard, so I'm entitled. I see these > really nice sets of balls sized with extreme precision, and I wonder, what > are these used for? > > I once had a trombone with a dent in the tube. They put a ball in the > tube and pushed it through, bye bye dent. But that can't be what these > are used for. > > By the way, on the subject of ignorance, you'd think they'd cover gage > balls in the book "Inspection and Gaging" by Kennedy et al, which I own > and have read. But they don't. So at least I haven't done ZERO homework > before asking the question. > > Grant Erwin > Kirkland, Washington ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: On the front of a mill table .. From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 11 Oct 1999 15:23:55 GMT -------- Hi Grant, Ther are NO dumb Questions! (That, ref your self-deprecating remark in your last post about gauge balls) I can't count the number of MY "dumb" questions you have found the time and patience to answer. The slots on the front face of the milling table are for "Stop Blocks". In their simplest form, these are blocks you pre-set to trip the power feed lever so you don't cut too far on auto traverse. Perhaps someone with a similar machine can supply you with a sketch so you can make some. The slots can also be used to mount a chip or splash guard!! :^) Glad you are enjoying the new mill. teenut Grant Erwin wrote: > > OK. I have a mill, I've now used it on a few projects, took a milling class > at the local vo-tech, I'm starting to "get it". I am wondering, though. On > the vertical surface which is the front (farthest from the column) of the > milling table, there is a T-slot. It isn't the same size as the T-slots > on the table. Obviously, you can use this for bolting a stop or something > to the table. Is there some common application for this T-slot that I'm > not aware of? > > Grant Erwin > Kirkland, Washington > > hey, if you don't ask, you'll NEVER know! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Backing Plate ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 11 Oct 1999 17:13:35 GMT -------- It was many, many, years ago (mid-late 60s) for the old Harrison lathe I had for a brief time..which didn't have a key in the spindle. So many problems were caused by the key and/or the key way getting banged up that they were often just dispensed with. The taper could then be cleaned properly and the chuck slightly "wrung" into place as the locking ring was tightened. The key on mine was "long gone" when I got it, It was never replaced but I never had problems with slipping under load. The taper is not a "self holding" But snugged up with the lock ring, like a 40 or 50 mill spindle taper, it was certainly a "self driving" one. If I had to do one now, and I AM working from distant memory here, I would simply cut the keyway on the shaper. If you don't have a shaper, you could cut it on the lathe itself, by racking a sideways mounted, boring bar type tool, through the bore. Slow to be sure..but effective. teenut GD wrote: > > I saw your post about making your own backing plates and I have a > question. When you make a backing plate for a L00 spindle how do you > cut the key slot? I don't have a broach and hope that you had an other > way to do it. Any info would be appreciated. > Thanks > GD ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: drill sharpening FAQ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 11 Oct 1999 19:21:26 GMT -------- mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > Quite a tutorial. Thank you for taking the time to put it here. > It gives a good start, but really one has to ruin a boxfull of > drills before it can be really understood. I don't think that is the case Jim, Most 15 year old apprentices got it right after a couple of tries..It isn't rocket science! > > Fortunately most of us have boxfulls of clapped out drills to > start on. Should have started earlier, Huh? ;^) > > I might add the following: When checking the included angle of > the cutting edges it is helpful to light it properly. I like > to have the drill itself in darkness, with a bright white or light > colored background behind it, giving that optical comparo effect > you mention. I find that if I can discern the flutes and so on > it makes it tougher to look at *only* the angles and the relative > lengths of the cutting edges. Sort of an optical illusion. A bit of practice and you can do it (almost 8^) in the dark. Our apprentice training shops were pretty dimly lit at best. In any case, a lot relies on the "feel" especially with smaller drills (an older eyes I might add) The whole point of the "Bionic Darex" is that, once "locked in" it is not a lighting and vision dependent operation. > > I also have gotten into the habit of grinding two reliefs on the > back of the edge. The first one provides the actual cutting > relief, and the second one prevents the back edge from scuffing. > The second one is a lot easier than the first because the angle > is not a critical. > > This is not as pretty as a real 'twist ground' back relief, but > works quite well for most applications. Beauty is in the eye of the beholder..some people and drill grinding machine companies swear by the "Two Facet" method. Others swear at it! Certainly the edge isn't as strong and is more prone to dig in, catter and break down as a consequence. My Christen is designed exclusively for two facet grinding..which is maybe one reason why I may never use it for drills. It is designed for drills only from .0020" to .025" diameter..but I still prefer to hand grind or stone! Dammit it's faster!! It is interesting to note, that the people who are probably the "Worlds Experts" on drill pointing viz. The gundrill makers, use a properly relief ground cutting edge geometry. > > Also important to *stone* the cutting edge before using. I like > to stone along the edge, not across it. Why, no other cutting edge is stoned along the edge! Enough research and ecperience has shown that striations running parallel to an edge, weaken it more than striations at right angles to it. Ask any woodworker, or knife maker. Stoning along the edge of a metal cutting tool makes it more prone to edge pick up/welding and all the horrors that attend it..ask any pro. turner worth his salt! If the technique is right and the wheel is right you shouldn't need to stone the edge. Indeed, unless your stoning technique is dead on..chances are you will blunt the drill!! > > Now, Robert, if you could do a treatise on thinning the web, that > would be enjoyable to read. Hmm! Here goes.. Bung the inside of the flute against the radius corner of the wheel, flip it over and repeat for the other side. Inspect and correct or go drill the hole! Yeh, I'm kidding..a bit! ;^) But on drills under 3/8" (For HSM purposes) web thinning is more trouble than it is worth. Above about 9/16"..most HSMers are better advised to pilot drill first..I do. In between..the above technique has served countless thousands of machinists for generations. The point to watch is that the thinning is even..to eyeball standards and that it not weaken the web too much..on jobber length drills there really is no need to thin the web until you get to the last inch or so of flute. If you genuinely manage to use, and grind a drill that far..you will have enough skill and experience to be writing this piece! If on the other hand you need a shorter drill..use a stub or screw machine length..They start out with thinner webs. I have seen a very nice technique > that not only thins the web, but creates a nearly-centercuttin > second set of edges at the same time - but it requires a wheel > with a nearly right angle to do so. Split point drills..Hmm! My Christen is specifically designed to do that, it needs the diamond wheel to hold the square edge that you mention. Plus microscopic adjustments to do it right. Certainly not a technique for the HSM without spending a lot of good tool money. $300 for Darex?..I have heard people swear BY them and AT them. A new Christen will run in the $12.15000 range and we KNOW that will do it, first time, every time! but had this one not "Fell off a truck in front of me and not got broke" I wouldn't have sprung the thirty dollars of good tool money it cost me. I only bought it because I thought it had the makings of a little T&C grinder..sort of a cross between a Deckel and a Quorn. If it can't "split point" drills when I am done the conversion..then I am not going to loose a minute"s sleep over it. So there! ;^) Split point drills have a lot of claims made for them..The major one I hear, is that they are self centering and don't need a center drilling operation first and thus save an operation, and a tool change on a CNC machine. Well (can't you hear 'ole teenut sucking his teeth over the validity or worth of THAT one??" If you have a CNC machine (Hands Up For A Head Count) and want a LOT of holes (HUFAHC) and don't mind some of those holes being "just a few teeny thous or tenths" off position (HUFAHC) and if you don't mind some of those holes being the same "teeny bit" off size (HUFAHC) and if having come this far you are a GENUINE HSMer (HUFAHC)..then I guess (who's left?) you have need for a Darex or a Christen to do your split points! For the rest, let's keep the good ol' twist drill in perspective. It is a means of making a hole. Period! If that hole is to put a (non-fitting) bolt through, lighten something, let water out, or prepare the way for further operations, it has served its purpose admirably. IMHO anything else is expecting way too much of it. Any other "Holey" condition can better, faster, and certainly, more accurately, be achieved by specialist, follow up operations with tools and techniques better suited to the job. And, (he said grammatically correctly) And, if any of the CNC, split point users who had their hands up earlier, expect that a drill ANY DRILL, can replace, to name but a few, a boring head, reamer, roller burnisher, or jig grinder Them I am afraid they are missing the whole point of this. > Also, have you a recipie for those nice sheet metal drills that > have the reverse angle cutting lips and a center pip - so they > don't grab - they cut out small slugs? I've made a few of those, > but they are a lot more hit-n-miss! No recipe fot them Jim..But you've got to love 'em! I like the B&D bullet points..I was fortunate enough to pick up a lifetime"s supply on ebay, cheap cheap cheap I will meter those out for the job they do best..sheet metal, where I can't get a unibit at it! I don't do any sheet metal work but once a blue moon. I can grind a workeable facimily by hand, on the corner of the wheel,,basically a flat botton drill with a tit left on seems to work quite well. For wood work I like brad points (if it is too small for a forstner) Those are ground the same way..a flat bottom drill with a tit in the middle and a cutting skirt st the rim. In all the above, and earlier work, I have tried to stress, over and over again, that this is not just my opinions..but my lifetime's experience as both a "professional" metalworker, as a HSMer and as a long time teacher of "Machine shop"..in the class room, on the floor AND on the Advisory Boards of Vocational trainig Centers and Regional Apprentice Training Organisations I have repeated, over and over again, that, in view of the forum, this is TOTALLY slanted towards the HSMer, and my objective always has been, to simplify (Not over simplify) and to debunk and demystify enough so that the newcomers among us are encouraged to go "do it" without being afraid of the initial failure that always preceeds success. As I said earlier..If just one struggling, unsure, beginning HSMer gets to hand sharpen a drill and work his way through a bit of metal to daylight on the other side..then, to me this will all have been worth it. I am WELL AWARE that I have, deliberately, made statements that my "Fellow Pros" will cringe at, and would be all over me like white on rice..IN A DIFFERENT FORUM. Hey, I would lead the wolf pack!! But the real pros, share a lot of my concerns about the loss of skills and training, and understand how difficult it is to put across, highly visual and dexterous techniques using only the written word. I thank THEM for their "silent" support. They know too how difficult that is, without them becoming part of the problem..The howling mob of "Pseudo Experts" who haven't heard a word I have said, and never will. To them I say..Step right up! .but remember it is a lot easier to make something sound difficult, than it is to simplify it! Talk to you later Jim, teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: drill sharpening FAQ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 11 Oct 1999 20:09:22 GMT -------- Maybe the rules of tungsten contamination don't apply in some parts of the world..Wish I lived there! But I have found MY immunity blanket!! ;^) When I bought my Lincoln S W 175..the salesman, of course, loaded me down with enough supplies, spares, collets...to rebuild the Titanic..I don't think I'll need to buy another electrode as long as I live. Among the "Pills and potions, soaps and lotions" he wafted in front of my glazed eyes was a small, wide topped jar. I must have nodded, because it was at the bottom of the HUGE cardboard box of "STUFF" I unloaded at home that evening. "Wassis" ? "Anchor Brand" I read, "Chemical Sharpener" :^0 "Chemically sharpens tungsten electrodes without grinding, splintering, flat spots or ridges" Yeh, Right!! They really did read me for the total amateur!! Hide it, Hide the shame!! A week later, knee deep in a Waffle House Menu of Scattered, splattered, shattered, tattered, ridged, splintered and contaminated electrodes, I swallowed what little pride I hade left and reached for the bottle!! After sobering up.. Whoops, wrong meeting!! That's Tuesdays..What's today? :^o Instructions are simple..Hold electrode on Ground Clamp until cherry red. Quickly immerse tep about 1/4" deep into the Chemical Sharpener (THEY spell it in caps..but Brian says I mustn't ;^) Repeatedly dip until a satisfactory point results, or reaction ceases. Reaction Ceases!! Theirs? Mine?? Well a couple of "Flashburns" later...I peer from under the tea bags at.. The most beautiful, chemically clean, slender, polished, needle like POINT (sorry..), point, you ever saw in all your born days. Now you would read, (if this were a "true story" on National TV) how my tig welding woes were over..how I went on to National Fame and Wealth within days of my discovery..Sponsorships...Endorsements....Oprah.. Not so..this is RCM!! Thud! My tig welding education was just beginning, truth be known I probably will only graduate grade 12 by repeating grade 6 twice! But among my many tribulations..Im-Perfect Points does not number! Every time I drop the pedal on that sucker..I know, whatever trials may (will) come to pass..it won't be caused by a "lumpy, splintered....yada yada..contaminated point! Ain't science wonderful ? Now I wait for someone to respond and say it ain't so and how you can't put a proper point on a 0.040" electrode without a Darex and a Microscope!! teenut Ted Edwards wrote: > > Mike Graham wrote: > > > and the tolerances aren't hideously tight. Usually the only bench grinder > > around is the one for the TIG tungstens, and if anyone catches you grinding > > a drill bit on it, you are a dead man. > > Why? I don't grind Al, brass, ... on my only bench grinder. It's used > for steel and tungstens and I haven't had any problems that I can > attribute to contaminated tungstens. BTW, I was welding Al yesterday > and had to re-do my tungsten several times (I have a depth preseption > problem). > > Ted ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: drill sharpening FAQ?(new topic) From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 11 Oct 1999 20:10:48 GMT -------- Gary Coffman wrote: (Well, maybe a pipe wrench.) Go wash your mouth out Gary ;^) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: encoder test results From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 11 Oct 1999 20:25:04 GMT -------- John Flanagan wrote: > I'm not sure this idea will work all that well or have any particular > advantage over the wire drum idea but I do know that some company > somewhere builds a unit like this. Can't remember their name althogh > I was at their website once. Prices weren't cheap so I moved on and > didn't think of making one like it for myself at the time. > "Some Company" is Newall Yes it's expensive! Yes it works! Like Gangbusters! Recognised as one of, if not THE best DRO on the market. One of its strongest features is complete imperviousness to contamination of any kind! These encoders? will work indefinitely, immersed in coolant, chips etc that would stop a glass scale, precision rack, cable system or anything else dead in its tracks. My only complaint..given how simple they are..is the price!! To the Victor the Spoils Eh! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: drill sharpening FAQ?(new topic) From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 11 Oct 1999 20:39:35 GMT -------- So you can find one quickly So you don't have to twist around a high geared spindle! So it is balanced. So it looks pretty. 'cos it's cheaper than 4 holes. "cos they've always made them that way. 8^) teenut james askew wrote: > > The real question is ---- Why does it have three holes if one is > enough??????? > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: drill sharpening FAQ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 11 Oct 1999 21:24:43 GMT -------- John Stevenson wrote: Incidently Cyril now works for me part time, he's 73 > and still has it all together, he'll be out his time in a couple of years So then he will be a "Good Beginner" ;^) Which just reminded me that first couple of years out of time an Apprentice was called an "Iprover" The tradition, in my part of the world was, that, on the day you finished your time, usually six or seven years, you were given your Certificate and a 'Pink Slip". Seriously, you were fired and told to go elswhere! Admittedly you maybe just walked across town to another shop that hired you, on the spot, to replace the "Lad" thay just fired..and who was, likely, just settling in the warm spot you had just vacated. Company Personnel people made sure you knew who was hireing before you left. The "method" behind the "Madness" was two fold. Firstly it ensured that their permanent skilled workforce brought skills other that those just taught there. It taught a wider skill base to the 'Improver" When you returned..and many did, two, three five years later, to guaranteed employment (if they were hireing)..it ensured that they could, if you were qualified, put you back in the shops where you served as a "lad", as a lead hand, chargehand, eventually Forman or Chief Engineer. They could put you back, with authority, over the very skilled men that had taught you your trade. And they would ACCEPT you (on a strictly merit basis) You see, You left a "Lad"..and went back a "Man"! Regrettably, that all ended just a couple of years before I finished my time...as a regular, established practice. I eventually became Sales Director, of my "Parent Company"..But I can guarantee it would never have happened if I hadn't left the year after I finished my time and "Journeyed" until they called me, seven years later with an offer that eventually brought me to North America. This remarkeable system dating back centuries..was a parallel to the Guild System and Journeymen...forced to leave town or even the country, forbidden to work for any one master for more than a year. Jouneying..to learn the REAL trade in which the Apprenticeship had prepared them to be "A Good Beginner" Fobidden to return to their home Guild Town Often for many many years..on pain of Death! ..until they could return with documented proof of their "Journeyman" experience He then had to produce the required Guild Test Piece whereapon he would be inducted into the Guild, with its Inner Secrets, Rights, Obligations CONSIDERABLE privileges and guaranteed Protection. Some of the most beautiful examples of the craftsmans art ever to emerge...in many many different fields, were created by returning Journeymen as their Guild test pieces. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: A Quicky for the Sparkies From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 11 Oct 1999 21:50:17 GMT -------- Dale Grover wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > > > > His interests lie in computor programming and electronics...right now he is > > building robots using the motors out of quartz watches!! Way over my head, I > > don't mind admitting!! > > The stepper motors from old disk drives are not too hard to > use. Much discussion at comp.robotics.misc. Could be very > fun to play with, driven from a PC's printer port. > He has "taken" over the Bonus Room over the large 9very large) Garage and jammed it to the gunnels with "Treasure trove" I swear, after two months in Atlanta, he knows the location of every computor dumpster in town..and dives them regularly. My wife, a credit to her Southern Steel Magnolia Heritage...Who wouldn't go in the FRONT door of any store that admitted to having a dumpster out back..has Bless her!! taken him out on many "Dumpster Diver" forays and doesn't bat a well trained eyelid, while purging the Cream Connolly leather interior of her immaculate V12 Jag of the residual detritus. What a woman!! I swear he has more hard drives up there than NASA..One day I will hear him ask the question: "Is there a GOD?" To which his cobbled up computor system will reply" "There is NOW!!" Scary these young 'uns teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: question re:antiqueing brass From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 11 Oct 1999 21:55:01 GMT -------- Kitty Litter tray..with the kitty! Couple or three days if it is a Tom..Longer if Neutered or a female! Seriously..I kid you not! Old Pro Antique Fakers trick, will age it a hundred years in a week Rinse well with a bit of baking soda and clear laquer to preserve the "Patina" teenut Elizabeth Greenlee wrote: > > Hello- > I'm not sure if this is the right newsgroup to post to, so > please forgive me if it's not. :) I searched on a number of > possible "topics" and this one seemed to match the best. > Hope I was right. > > My mom just purchased brass numbers and a mailbox for her > house that she'd like to antique. She asked at the local > craft store how to do it and they said it couldn't be > done. She knows she's seen it done somehow but can't remember. > > Does anyone have any suggestions on how to do this? > If so, could you send email to me at elizg@sgi.com as > I may not be able to get back to this newsgroup very often. > > Thanks in advance. > > Elizabeth Greenlee > elizg@sgi.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 5C collet gripping range From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 11 Oct 1999 23:47:37 GMT -------- $ 20.00 sounds about right, I only bought one set of three..I have since scrounged a set and my largest(11") and my middle (9") faceplates share a set until I get lucky again. I figure I can't use both at once and I never bother with the locking screws (I mean, where are the pins going to go?) so it takes a few seconds to spin them out and change over when required. teenut Jim Stewart wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > I make all my own D1-3 Backplates (or machine 'em right into the back of the > > chuck if possible) I have made them in the past, for several other D1-x sizes > > as well as A and LOO types. > > > > Not real difficult if you have the specs handy. Probably easier than a large > > threaded one. I made myself a "dummy" D1-3 nose gage a long time ago and that > > speeds it up..though not absolutely necessary. > > > > Beats the heck out of buying them..Have you PRICED them lately!! > > > > I do buy the camlock pins though..Special order by MSC from Bison. > > Threads are standard 7/16 -20 > > > > How much are you paying for the camlock pins, Robert? IIRC, I was > finding them in the J&L catalog for something over $20, while the > backplate complete with 3 pins was $88... > > -js > > -- > > http://www.strappe.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: question re:antiqueing brass From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 12 Oct 1999 00:12:30 GMT -------- Elizabeth Greenlee wrote: > > Thanks for the suggestion...however neither my mom nor I have > a cat...Oh well. > Hmm! Coupla old "Tom Cats" hang aroun.... (No Robert, lets NOT go there!!) Hey guys, help me out here...What is a good substitute for cat tinkle? Don't go away Elizabeth, these guys can figure out a way to tarnish anything! 8^) Wha...What did I say now!! Hey, come back you Guys.... Oops, Elizabeth, Can we get back to you? We know it works and I'm sure at least somebody roun' here's got a cat. Just got to figure out how to get it to sit on the bottle! Amazing isn't it..we have a bunch of people around here that could send a guy to the moon and back (come to think of it..already HAVE!! But when it comes to getting a cat to sit on a bottle...Amateurs!! hey Guyyyys.... teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: what are gage balls used for? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 12 Oct 1999 00:28:29 GMT -------- ULAV8R wrote: > > Also used to accurately measure dovetails, inside or outside. > That gets a bit tricky unless you have an extra pair of hands but Gage ROLLERS work fine. Clamping a ring of XX rollers or balls, around a precisely calculated and machined retaining ring, is one of the "Definitive" ways to generate a very precise indexing plate of XX divisions. Some Jig borers used a row of balls (Newall IIRC) or rollers (Sip) as the reference for fine measurements in the days before electronic DROs. Four balls inside each of two accurate rings, on a surface plate, make a very precise pair of Vee Blocks. The uses are legion. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: crummy flasques From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 12 Oct 1999 00:38:20 GMT -------- Allan Adler wrote: > The flasque is crummy, since I have no woodworking skills beyond what > I have acquired in the last few days. The cope and drag fit together > but are not completely flush with each other. Does it matter? > Normally, I would just proceed and see what happens, but since > liquid aluminum will be involved, I prefer to be cautious. As well you may Allan, as well you may ;^) You might find it easier to spend a few extra days practicing wood working skills with ten toes, Rather than to spend the rest of your life practicing metal working skills without them!! The Flasks don't need to be "cabinet grade" Allan..But if you can figure one way for hot metal to escape..It can figure a dozen you never thought of. Please be carefull! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Copper patena recipe needed From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 12 Oct 1999 01:13:52 GMT -------- TS wrote: > > Bandwidth is cheap.... > > C'mon guys, has no one read the very same FAQ for this group? > > and I quote, (exhaustively) > As you say TS: Exhaustingly! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: what are gage balls used for? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 12 Oct 1999 03:04:48 GMT -------- Carbide is used for most industrial purposes, but a steel ball would work for one or two specials in mild steel..and a whole bunch in nonferrous metals. Dont imagine you can accurately size a bore by bashing a hard ball through it..it will leave the most Gawdawful ridged and ringed mess you ever saw. Steady, even hydraulic pressure is required, if the Ball hessitates for a moment it will "ring" the bore. Even the Spring in a narrow push rod will cause this, due to "stick/slip of the ball. For this reason, elongated "buttons" are preferred, both for smooth bores and as a high precision, high production method of rifling. The "secrets of the trade" here surround the Proprietary lubes required for this high friction process. Many, many years ago, the rifle barrel of choice for target shooting in the UK was a selected and specially gauged .303 Enfield barrel, that was "Ball-Burnished" by Parker-Hale in Birmingham. Idoubt if that has been done for many years. Oh! Don't try ball burnishing on a blind bore! ;^) teenut Mike Graham wrote: > > On Mon, 11 Oct 1999 22:49:02 GMT, Dan Bollinger wrote: > >Robert, Right on! And, balls used in the fashion Grant described are > >called sizing balls. After pressing in a bushing, a sizing ball can be > >pressed through with an arbor press to re-sized the I.D. for the shaft. You > >can buy them oversized, too. > > I don't think you use gage balls to ball-size holes, do you? I would have > thought that you'd need something harder. > > -- > Mike Graham, mikegraham at sprint dot ca > Caledon, Ontario, Canada (just NW of Toronto). > > Raiser of animals. Weldor of metals. Driver of off-road vehicles. > Writer of FAQs. Keeper of the faith, and all around okay guy. > > < homepage currently off-line due to change of ISP; back soon > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: FS, 1 Ton Chain Fall From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 12 Oct 1999 05:08:41 GMT -------- Harvard University Eh! They probably use it in the Library! teenut Demirj wrote: > > Hand chain Hoist 1 Ton capacity Spur Gear hoist, made in late > 1930's has flexible link chain with 2 drop forged swivel hooks, > has 12 foot lift, weight 36 lbs. In good working condition, new 545, > sell for $195. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Oval Turning Chuck? What the hell? 99-10-07 0330pm From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 12 Oct 1999 11:43:17 GMT -------- Me too, can't find it though! Anyone got an Index? Thanks teenut Edk4 wrote: > > I'm pretty certain that either HSM or Projects In Metal described the building > of just such a device, several years ago. > ------------------ > Ed Kingsley ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Defacing Currency Was . . . "What is this metal". From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 12 Oct 1999 11:44:59 GMT -------- Those Geishas are getting real pricy nowadays! ;^) teenut Eastburn wrote: > > No - > But when I was in Japan last week - > I spent 1000's and 5000's like candy. > Went through 70000 in 7 days - in cash! - > Hotel was on credit. And almost all of it in Taxi's - > Breakfast and lunch were on the company. > > Martin > -- > NRA LOH, NRA Life > NRA Second Amendment Task Force Charter Founder > Martin Eastburn, Barbara Eastburn > @ home on our computer oldtree@pacbell.net ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Hydrochloric and Muriatic Acid From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 12 Oct 1999 11:47:18 GMT -------- Chemical Warfare? teenut Engineman1 wrote: > This reminds me of the time, shortly after ww 2 I mentioned the term Baume and > my wiseguy friend said "thats what the English airforce dropped on the > Germans." > Engineman1 ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Mobility scooter: can I build one? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 12 Oct 1999 11:54:19 GMT -------- Well I guess you made a long term client outa him Carl! Maybe you could send some Sales Brochures to the drop box, so we can all share? 8^) teenut Carl Byrns wrote: > > JP wrote: > > > > Well guys, > > > > I finally thought that I'd ask for your ideas and knowledge about > > building a three or four-wheeled scooter for guys with limited > > pulmonary function, like me. I have congestive heart failure (no sob > > story...just a fact..HATE to be thought of as a lazy bastard!!!) and > > walking more than about 60', or rolling around a store in my chair for > > 30 minutes, I'm washed out. I have looked at them many different > > places and it chaps my ass what they charge for medical equipment...it > > is a damned ripoff!! > > I take exception at the "ripoff" comment. > The home care company I work for sells mobility products. At the > reseller level, I can assure you we are not getting rich on scooters. In > fact, we stopped selling them after taking a loss on the last two sales. > Scooters and power wheelchairs cost a lot because a) they are made out > of expensive parts, b) there is no economy of scale, and c) liability > insurance is baked into the purchase price. > Insurance companies and Medicare are reluctant to pay for power mobility > because of both the initial high cost and the cost of maintenance. Power > mobility products are high-maintenance items and the insurance companies > get to pay for new tires, batteries, seat cushions and any damage. > Heaven forbid a client has to pay for damage! We had one client who > regularly rammed her chair into the curb, breaking the front wheels and > caster brackets. New front tires and caster brackets are about a hundred > bucks a corner. That gets expensive every two weeks. > > > > > > I can still build things and can easily build one of these except I > > don't know what kind of drivetrain to set up. I don't know where and > > what kind of motor to buy, whether to use a chain drive, single wheel, > > or a small differential. The setup must have reverse and variable > > speed. What kind of controller do I use and where do I get this > > stuff?? That's the information I need. > > > Most scooters ( and all chairs ) use two drive motors. Chairs use > differential steering ( like a skid-steer ). Scooters use a DC chopper > for speed control, chairs use two chopper circuits and proportional > control with a joystick. > > > I don't need any fancy > > schemes or exotic drive trains or fiberglass that weighs a ton to hide > > the workings. I just need some bolt on or weld on parts that I can > > design together to get me around more than my wheel chair. > > > The fiberglass bodywork weighs a couple of pounds tops. It's there to > protect the workings, not hide them. On the scooters, it also encloses > the tires and protects them from damaging furniture, small animals, and > other folk's feet. > > If you are going to build a scooter, remember that it'll have to easily > come apart for transportation. Really good scooters can be taken out of > a car trunk and be assembled in a parking lot by 70-year old grandmas > using no tools. In the rain. In about three minutes. > Some not-so-good scooters require a custom trunk-mounted boom hoist to > get the damn thing out of the car. And they go downhill from there. > > > Thanks for any > > and all replies, I promise to post a picture when I finish it!! > > > Looking forward to it. I'm sure we would appreciate you posting your > real e-mail address as well. > > -Carl ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: what are gage balls used for? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 12 Oct 1999 11:57:32 GMT -------- I NEVER thought of that ( the blind hole..not the smart-ass bit 8^) Maybe EDM would be easier though! I bet you use a LOT of EDM huh? 8^) teenut Curt Brown wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > Oh! Don't try ball burnishing on a blind bore! ;^) > > Well, it might be wasteful, but you could burnish most of > a blind hole with a carbide ball and shatter the ball for > removal. > > Yes, I'm in a smart-ass mood. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: question re:antiqueing brass From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 12 Oct 1999 12:06:43 GMT -------- "Chris K. Hepburn" (possibly in all seriousness) wrote: > > Ummm...can't you just buy ammonia? Isn't that the active ingredient in > cat pee? Obviously never had a cat Chris!! There is something FAR more active than ammonia in cat pee! > What about using ammonia based cleaners? > > Or is this somehow less amusing than getting a tomcat to pee into a > beaker? Bottles Chris, Not beakers! We are trying to Market it, and Wall Mart prefers Bottles! The REAL amusing bit is trying to get them to wash their hands after using the bottle!! 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Jet Milling Machine From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 12 Oct 1999 12:44:48 GMT -------- They got FACTORIES in Taiwan Jim? Wow! No wonder they sometimes manage to turn out two machines that look alike!! I'll bet even some of the parts are INTERCHANGEABLE!! There's a new concept! Relax Jim! Just pulling your leg a bit..perpetuating the myths, protecting home industries too sorry-assed to protect themselves..usual jingoism stuff! It helps with the anger!! (No, not at You Jim, or anyone else that buys offshore, we work damn hard for our money, and we have a right to get value for it!) I AM raging mad at the stupid, complacent, Domestic Manufacturers, who imagine we will keep paying more and more, for less and less, and think that because the B52 was good enough for three generations, then so is the (Fill in name of your favourite US machine tool) That blind arrogance, and the "Third Quarter Bottom Line"/"Harvard School of Bancrupty" will find their rightful places, when the history is written of "The Rise and Fall of Western Civilisation" Assuming always, there is anyone left around who gives a SH*T, big enough to even record it for Asian Posterity. Isn't it the Winners that get to write the History? (Rant mode off) There is however a hidden caveat in the first couple of paragraphs, Jim. Those Jet Mills are great value, but if you expect to need spares in the future, it might pay to get them now. Those Asian factories and the Distribution networks tend to be rapidly moving targets. (You know, rapid change, in response to rapidly changing Customer Demands, Market Forces, Technological Advances..and other seditious, Foreign, ideas!) Sorry, my foot slipped on the "Rant" pedal ;^) teenut FELIZXs wrote: > > Could someone with a Jet milling machine ( copy of a Bridgeport ) tell me what > factory in Taiwan it was made ? I just purchased a 9" X 49" Variable speed > mill from Rutland under the trade name FREJOTH and am curious to know if both > models are built at the same place. It could be helpful to me in the future if > I need to buy spare parts. My Rutland mill was made at the JIH FONG Machinery > Co., LTD. Taiwan. > > Thanks, > > Jim Miller ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: The insides of Loonies From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 12 Oct 1999 12:57:48 GMT -------- So does the revolutionary idea of having different denominations in different sizes. Revolutionary that is, except for just "The Rest of the World", where they have considered the needs of visually impaired people, for a century or more! teenut Who is starting to have difficulty discerning the difference between $20.00 bills and nickels. Especially when the bills arrive!! Mike Graham wrote: > It's no good for the vision impaired, though. Granted if you're > completely blind funky colours won't help you, but if you just have really > bad eyes the colour helps a *lot*. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: what are gage balls used for? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 12 Oct 1999 13:12:12 GMT -------- Mike Graham wrote: above. > > >Oh! Don't try ball burnishing on a blind bore! ;^) > > That was mentioned in Lautard's paragraph; apparently they make the balls with shafts on them so they can be driven in and pulled out. It was a JOKE Mike..At least *I* was kidding!...Not sure about Lautard though! ;^) Maybe on short bores..but roller burnishing would be quicker, cheaper, a "hole" lot less messy, size right to the bottom of the bore, and reduce scrap levels because the roller burnisher shanks won't break as often as pullrods, brazed I assume, to carbide balls. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Dressing grinding wheels; Was: drill sharpening FAQ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 12 Oct 1999 13:44:05 GMT -------- Whatever gets the job done! 8^) In order of preferrence...(Mine) Star wheel..still the best hand dresser for a fresh, open, sharp, cool cutting wheel! Cheap, easy to use, as accurate as you wish it to be, and almost impossible to screw up. No shop should be without one! Or Two! Crush roller..not easy to use SAFELY on a bench wheel, certainly not by a first timer. Diamond...Must be used under rigid control, at precisely the right angles, indexed frequently and methodically, etc. Under the right circumstances and used by a knowledgeable person, on the right wheel..yad..yada..a diamond can produce a near perfect wheel surface. Used wrongly, on the wrong wheel, in the wrong way, it is an expensive, short lived device for totally screwing up a wheel surface!! Stick...Do not like those on bench wheels. Cheap, but produce a blunt hot wheel unless expertly used. Handy for touching up corners etc on grinding machines. Spinning abrasive dressers...like a Star wheel but with an abrasive wheel. I have never seen or used one. Great claims made by the manufacturers, but until I see or hear different from a REAL expert, I can't visualise a technological breakthrough that would make them any better than a stick dresser with a higher price tag and an ability to do more damage faster. Strike me as a sort of "Ginsu knife" of the dressers. However, I have an open mind and I'm ready to be convinced otherwise. (Caveat to Ex-Spurts..Please don't bring a Ginsu knife to a gun fight!!) 8^) Teenut Glenn Lyford wrote: > > > A wheel with a nice square edge helps for > >splitting the points and it is a good idea to keep your wheel > >dressed properly > >... but that applies to almost any grinding operation, no? > > So the obvious next question is, what type of wheel dresser do > you prefer to use with a bench grinder? Wheel type? Abrasive > stick type? Point type? Or does it not really matter as long > as you get an even wheel? > --Glenn ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Dressing grinding wheels; Was: drill sharpening FAQ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 12 Oct 1999 19:21:45 GMT -------- mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > Doggone. We agree about *something*, Robert. Oooh! You walked right into this one Jim!! (I wouldn't be able to sleep tonight if I didn't say it...) "Maybe that's because you were correct about something,for a change!!!" 8^) 8*) 8*) 8*) Yes I KNOW I am going to pay for that one Jim! Give me at least 24 hours to enjoy it though. Please! > > Now if you have a magic recipe for inhibiting the spray > of abrasive particles whenever I use mine that would be > truly amazing. The Impossible we do immediately...Miracles take a little longer!! I do a LOT of grinding in my shop..98% of it on my 2HP 2" x 72" Burr King Belt Grinder...Making Blades. I find that placing a tray, bucket, saucer of water under the grinder, in direct line with the jet of grit, will catch a very large portion of it..like MOST of it. I use a five gallon pail, because it is my slack tub (quenching container) for cooling while grinding. I don't use plain water (Never Drink Water...Have you seen what it does to the inside of RADIATORS!!!) I add a half a cup of dishwasher liquid to it (the sort that is kindest to my hands!!) The purpose of this is to break the surface tension and allow the dust to sink..this stops it scumming up, rusting, contaminating the work piece and yukking my hands when I "dunk" I swear, it stops dust etc from bouncing off the surface, back into the air. Makes for a quick wash up tub, if I have to touch something clean..Like going to take a leak!! How about that for a Teeshirt slogan: Machinists always wash their hands BEFORE going to the Bathroom I also add a half cup of Pine Sol...stops Science Experiments in their tracks! Also prevents minor infections to your hands..makes it pong a bit sweeter too!! Finally, I add half a cup of baking soda to my brew..stops newly ground surfaces from instantly rusting when you dunk...for a surprisingly long time too. I have BAD "Rusty Hands"..every steel surface I touch will turn to rusty palmprints before your eyes. It used to be a major PITA, UNTIL I started using the above mixture. I think the constant dunking of my hands in it also helps to neutralize the acid sweat before it can do any harm! Steel parts come out with what seems to be a short to medium term protective coating. I can freshly grind a blade, quench it and chuck it under the bench for a month or more..even in the middle of summer. Provided I don't handle it too much, it will remain rust free. (As an aside to that, when I went to interview for my Apprenticeship, the "Super" gave me a freshly made steel bolt to look at and handle. I later discovered this was standard hiring procedure, The bolt was left on the desk overnight, and if it was tool badly rusted the following morning..They didn't hire you as an apprentice!!) I don't get much dust from grinding on the wheels, and I try to avoid dressing needlessly. If a wheel is properly chosen, mounted, balanced and dressed in the first place, and provided it is properly used..it won't need redressing wery often. Couple of times a year in my shop. When I DO fetch out the star wheel, I use the above quoted receptacle of "water", and I cover everything in sight with DAMP towels..They catch and trap the dust far better than dry ones do. Spray down every exposed surface with WD 40 or something similar and then have a good wipe up after. The oil may trap dust on machine surfaces..but that is far better than having the DRY dust ricochetting around and finally settling on surfaces you CAN'T reach. cheers teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 5C collet gripping range From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 12 Oct 1999 19:48:54 GMT -------- mledtje@my-deja.com wrote: > > > > > I do buy the camlock pins though..Special order by MSC from Bison. > > Threads are standard 7/16 -20 > > > > teenut > > Why do you buy the camlock pins? I made a set for a chuck that didn't > have any. It was not difficult, even for a rookie like me. > Good question Mike, I agree with you, making the lock pins is not difficult and the techniques you outline would work fine! Except for one tiny detail. 8^) Camloc bolts are kinda like the "Jesus" bolt on a helicopter..The only thing between you and a sudden demise! When I lived in Canada, a guy was killed in a shop just up the road from my shop, by a chuck that came off a 12" lathe and hit him in the chest. The subsequent inquiry showed that the chuck was hit by the toolpost, and that sheared the one remaining good lock bolt (one was missing, and one was cracked. That one good bolt had done its job, so far as they could discover, for five or more years until Murphy decided it was time. Then it killed him! Frankly, it's not the machining that makes me hesitate..but the raw material and the heat treatment, that concern me. I will happily heat treat knives and tools all day long by "guess and by golly and by the intuition borne of years of practice. Most give stirling service..but occasionally one is a bit brittle and fails. Not of awesome consequence, make another, try a different tweak on the HT. But I will frankly admit, machines scare me enough I still have all the bits I need. I do not have the equipment or skills to heat treat Camloc pins..! So I will buy my Camloc pins from a reputable supplier. Hey, nothing is perfect..they may still fail..but at least my widow will know who to sue!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: what are gage balls used for? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 12 Oct 1999 19:58:20 GMT -------- OK then, If you insist on ball sizing a blind bore..be sure to add enough gunpowder to blow it out again!! teenut Dan Bollinger wrote: > > Oh! Don't try ball burnishing on a blind bore! ;^) > > LOL, Isn't that called a muzzleloader? ;-) > > -- > > Dan Bollinger > Clay Critters > www.claycritters.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: WW1 Era Explosive: So what happened? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 13 Oct 1999 12:24:33 GMT -------- Alberic wrote: > and then had a mortar round/rifle grenade come bouncing out on the > floor from under a stack of papers. Guaranteed to wake you up and >grab your undivided attention. It is called "Enhanced Pucker Factor" As in.."....couldn't have beat a four penny nail up my a** with a two pound ball pein hammer!!".... (Local Talk Radio Host, talking about a "Surprise!!" visit from the IRS...) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What kind of fool am I? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 13 Oct 1999 12:27:54 GMT -------- Oh Gawd! A Myford "MiniKop" for $150.00 and he threw it back! I'm going to my "Dark Place".. Teenut ivanveg wrote: > > Went to a machine auction today (Livermore, CA) mainly to see how much money > a Hardinge toolroom lathe will bring. It went for $ 3,000 including closer, > chucks, taper attachment, and a new bed "way" in a box, but never installed. > I thought it was a good deal, but at this time I was just looking. > > While I was chatting with the fellow that bought the above, I noticed that > a Myford lathe was being bid. I quickly glanced over there, it looked > formidable from 30 feet away, raised my hand and won the bid at $ 150.00. > > My new acquaintance, by now knowing that I am a mere hobyist, asked me what > I am going to do with a "Tracer Lathe". My heart sunk. I looked at it, and > it had all of theses attachments sitting on the floor, most of them > hydraulid mechanisms to automatically operate the motions of the tool. > Luckily, this auctioneer, (Ashman inc.) is kind to fools and put the item up > for aucion again. It sold for $ 100 to same fellow that I had earlier > bumped to $ 150. > > Everybody happy. > > One red face. > > Ivan, amateur from California. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Countersink sharpening fixture??? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 13 Oct 1999 12:33:40 GMT -------- There is a "relief grinding attachment" currently running on Ebay, that will do this. A search will find it. Basically a spin index fixture with interchangeable cams that impart axiall and/or radial relief. teenut Sam Frogge wrote: > > Looking for a fixture that attaches to my #2 Cincinnati tool and cutter > grinder to sharpen the Zero Flute (deburring) Countersinks. All I can > fathom is that it must have axial AND radial relief. I saw one a few > years ago but don’t know the maker. Does anyone have any suggestions? > Thanks for all assistance!!! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lathe Bed Grinder From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 13 Oct 1999 18:41:29 GMT -------- Marshall Pharoah wrote: > > I just purchased a 13" South Bend for the exorbitant fee of $310, and there > is some > noticeable wear under the carriage. NO!! The SOB,s ripped you OFF! Just kidding Marshal..At that price it is worth putting some serious work into rehab. (The LATHE..Silly!) Before going to a heap of trouble trying to regrind the bed yourself..iffy proposition at best 8^{..You might want to investigate the possibility of having it reground professionally! It is NOT as expensive as one might imagine..Rebuilding companies with bedway grinders to keep running are glad of the business and you can usually cut a deal. Heck, they can regrind a bed, that size, in half an hour..Floor to floor! What IS expensive, and what often kills the Idea, is the transportation to and from the Grinders. Usually more than the grinding cost. However, you are fortunate in being located in the North east. I am guessing..but I'll bet 75% of the way grinders in North America are located within a day's drive of you! Time to hit the Thomas Directory. 8^) When you have the ways ground..tell them you are going to fit turcite linings (Beats the heck out of scraping!!) and ask them to take enough off and to leave you a suitable finish..No, NOT dead smooth, a cross hatch grind is much better! The waygrinders usually use cup wheels..like a miniature Blanchard grinder. Have fun! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Dressing grinding wheels; Was: drill sharpening FAQ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 13 Oct 1999 19:00:24 GMT -------- Mike Graham wrote: > > On Tue, 12 Oct 1999 19:21:45 GMT, Robert Bastow wrote: If a wheel is properly chosen, mounted, balanced and dressed in the > >first place, and provided it is properly used..it won't need redressing wery > >often. Couple of times a year in my shop. > > Do you include 'deglazing' under the heading of 'dressing'? Absolutely!..Which is why I only need to redress a couple of times a year...usually for a picky job, or because the wheel has worn out of balance! NEVER to deglaze! Because my wheels never get glazed! I hasten to add, that, that is because I do all my heavy, rough,and soft metal gringing on a BIG belt sander..never on a hard wheel grinder! I have two D/E grinders, one is fitted with a 60 grit White alox wheel for tool steel roughing, and, my frequently used, soft steel wire brush. The other has straight cup wheels at each end..Green grit for carbide and 60 grit white alox for finish grinding HSS tools. The bonds on all these wheels are soft enough to prevent glazing..and of course, not grinding anything much under 58/60 Rc means I dont get any loading. First thing I do with a new grinder is take off those 'orrible grey "Rocks" they come with and chuck them in the trash! Tho' next time I'm gonna put them on Ebay!! ;^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Making taps From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 13 Oct 1999 19:14:25 GMT -------- Great Idea..if you have one to hand of the right size! Knowing not much about structural fasteners, can anyone tell me how hard a grade 12 bolt is? In my ignorance I would have guessed they wer heat trated for toughness..40 Rc ballpark, rather than a hardness suitable for use as an impromptu tap. If that is the case..I would take the minute or so extra to case harden it anyway. Or if the material is suitable..just heat and quench dead hard. teenut Ted Edwards wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > For a real, quick, dirty, one off tap: > > > Take a steel bolt of the correct size. Grind a couple of gashes in the end..just > > like a "Gun Tap" Case Harden in Kaseite etc..dip it in soft soap before > > If your going to grind it, use a grade 12 bolt - it's already hardened. > > Ted ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Dressing grinding wheels; Was: drill sharpening FAQ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1999 04:22:04 GMT -------- If you plan on using the grinder for a lot of "Other stuff" becides grinding tools, then the grey Aluminum Oxide is the best all round choice..just keep it cleanly dressed. If you are going to stay with that type of wheel..Do bear in mind, that the wheels fitted as OEM, even by "Reputable, Name Brand, Domestic" manufacturers are the cheapest, nastiest POS they can get away with. The import "Rocks" are unspeakable!! Invest in a couple of good quality, grey wheels..They are not expensive, and the difference will amaze you. Best advice I can give is to have one Grey wheel for general grinding and one white wheel reserved for tool grinding. teenut Jens wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > >First thing I do with a new grinder is take off those 'orrible grey "Rocks" they > >come with and chuck them in the trash! Tho' next time I'm gonna put them on > >Ebay!! ;^) > > Hmmm .... my two grinders still have those 'orrible grey rocks' they > came with on them. > > Jens ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Dressing grinding wheels; Was: drill sharpening FAQ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1999 04:40:33 GMT -------- Mike Graham wrote: > > On Wed, 13 Oct 1999 19:00:24 GMT, Robert Bastow wrote: > > >NEVER to deglaze! Because my wheels never get glazed! > > How do you keep the white wheel from changing shape when you're roughing > HSS? I have a hard time not gouging it. Don't push so hard!! ;^) Let the wheel cut and keep it moving. The white wheels for tool steel are soft enough to let go of grains as they get blunted. In effect, you are continuously dressing the wheel. Just don't keep redressing it all in the same spot!! It might help to remember that the wheel is a "consumable" Don't try to or expect it to last for ever. > > >I have two D/E grinders, one is fitted with a 60 grit White alox wheel for tool > >steel roughing, and, my frequently used, soft steel wire brush. > > I've got two; an 8" and a 6". The 8" has the original coarse 'rock' on > one side (actually handy for rough deburring of stuff that's going to be > welded) and an 8" scratch wheel on the other side. I wouldn't be without > that wire wheel, for sure! I have never managed to get as good results with an 8" wheel as I do with 6"..for any purposes, but especially tool grinding. Bear in mind, that the "Hardness" of any given type, or grit size wheel, is a function of the bond, the density (Structure) AND the peripheral speed. The faster the wheel turns the HARDER it acts!! The 6" grinder has a brown-grit wheel for > general purpose stuff, and a white wheel for 'delicates'. I'd love to be > able to justify a diamond cup-wheel. Justification is a "Bad Work"! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lathe Bed Grinder From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1999 05:29:08 GMT -------- Turcite isn't really expensive in the small areas and thicknesses required for a Southbend sized lathe. I doubt you need more than 6 or 10 square inches, and 1/32" or 1/16" maximum thickness. The epoxy they sell is pricy..but there are, nowadays, other sources of epoxys that will do the job. Re-furbishing a lathe with turcite ELIMINATES the need to drop the saddle or raise the feed shafts etc. The Idea is to remove enough metal from the bed to clean it up, and then mill enough off the saddle, not just to clean it up..but to bring it back to exactly the same place it was when new...After you interpose a layer of Turcite of the required standard thickness. No scraping of the saddle is required! The Turcite and epoxy are alowed to adhere and set, without applying any pressure and while the saddle is temporarily shimmed to the right height and level. Once the Turcite has adhered, then a very light spottin and scraping can be done..if required. If the epoxying is done carefully...no "post scraping" should be required. Applying Turcite will absolutely transform any lathe. Firstly it virtually eliminates "stick/slip". Secondly, you can snug up the retaining gibs, literally, to "negative clearance". That, and the natural tendancy of Turcite to deaden vibrations, means that chatter will be virtally eliminated. IMHO, having read, frequently of various ways that people have reground their own beds, using a variety of ingenious, but convoluted methods..any accuracy remotely approaching the accuracy of a new lathe..or a proper regrind..is PURELY ACCIDENTAL! I don't care how you care to figure it...using the tailstock ways to grind the saddle ways because they are "less worn" than the saddle ways..is a crock of the first order. However you run the trig..using a less than PERFECT guiding reference to generate another one.will MULTIPLY, not decrease the original errors! Of course, when you have ground your ways until they look nice and shiny, and you have twisted your lathebed so you can barely detect a taper (can you say sway or swell?), then I guess it is easy to convince yourself, not to speak of a casual, awestruck,observer, that you have indeed made it "as good as new"! I wonder why Professional Rebuilders don't do it that way? They could bring a portable rig and regrind your lathe bed while you nipped out to lunch. I bet they just haven't thought of it yet, Huh? 8^) A decent lathe deserves better..even if that means hand scraping the whole thing. Of course then a decent set of scraping masters and references will case more than a professional regrind. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What kind of fool am I? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1999 05:35:24 GMT -------- ULAV8R wrote: > > Mentioned this to my wife, and she said " tracer as in a copy lathe?" > and then shook her head. You should be flat broke before admitting > turning down a buy like that. Maybe Teenut will come out of that dark > place in a week or two! No he won't! :^( > > fredcf@my-deja.com wrote: > > > > In article <38047BAB.EF33A29B@home.com>, > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > Oh Gawd! A Myford "MiniKop" for $150.00 and he threw it back! > > > > Take comfort in the fact that someone else picked it up for > > only $100. > > > > What is a MiniKop, and for that matter, a tracer lathe? > > > > Fred > > > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: anybody get their CROWN-ROBERTSON lathe?? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1999 05:39:16 GMT -------- Been going to ask the same thing..They are back on ebay and this time I AM going down to see them! I couldn't resist putting a bid in this time though! If when I see them they are not what I expect, I will say so and withdraw my bid. teenut mike grady wrote: > > havent been watching the group lately > what are they like ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Dressing grinding wheels--Loading up From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1999 05:46:27 GMT -------- mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article , > Joe Way wrote: > > > Hmmm....one really shouldn't grind anything that doesn't throw sparks. > > Drat. The wrong person replied!! Joe, get off the hook and > give Mr B a chance.... > > Jim I thought that Joe summed it up rather well. 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lathe Bed Grinder From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1999 07:37:34 GMT -------- mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > It is NOT as expensive as one might imagine.. > > I have seen this topic go 'round the ng for years. But I have > never heard the final message that said, 'yes, I got the > bed ground *here* for X dollars, and they will do yours for > the same. I guess it is time for me to "Put Up or shut Up" 8^o The last lathe bed I had reground was in about 1983. It was a Smart & Browne Model A 10" x 24" The grinding was done in Cambridge, Ontario and cost IIRC about Can$125.OO at the time. I drove up there, with the bed, from Stoney Creek, and watched and waited while they did the job. It took less than an hour! I can't remember the exact name of the outfit that did it, and I don't know if they are still in business...But the name Cambridge Machine Tool Rebuilders rigs a faint bell I was able to scrounge enough advice, scraps of turcite and a big enough "Dip" of their epoxy pot to line the saddle ways for free. I re-machined the saddle ways, taking them down far enough, that when I epoxied on the 1/16" Turcite, it brought the saddle back to precisely the right height for the lead screw and feed shafts to slip easily back into the new bronze bushings I fitted. I could have chosen to do the Saddle milling at the machine shop I was managing at the time, or I could have taken it to the local Vo Tech, where I was a member of the Board of Advisors. However, that would have meant two trips and two setups, because it was necessary to first machine the saddle ways to clean and level. Then I had to assemble the saddle to the bed with shims in place, to determine PRECISELY how much more I needed to take off to bring everything back to the right place when the Turcite was glued on. IIRC the grinders took off about O.008" to get the (Hardened) bed back to dead true. They ground it with a cup wheel, leaving a criss-cross pattern that is best recommended for turcite. The tiny hatching provides for oil retention and reduced friction in exactly the same way that scraping or frosting does. I chose to do the machining at home, on my home made, hand cranked planer. This I had made from a 36" Standard Modern lathe bed (factory rejects turned up regularly at the local scrap yard). The table was 24" x 14" IIRC a tee slotted table from a Deckel or Gorton Diesinker. The bridge and uprights were machine ON the machine by ingenious and/or devious means. The feed screws and nuts were "Liberated" a few years earlier, from the spare parts inventory of Alfred Herbert (Canada) as reparations (partial) when they closed down owing all the employees at least two month's wages and any and all severance pay, bonuses, commissions and expenses!!! Drive was via rack and pinion, directly connected to a VERY heavy 14" diameter, six spoked, cast iron handwheel that once graced the saddle of a huge old center lathe! The tool slide came from an old shaper as did the downfeed screws and clapper box. Eventually it was graced with a Bridgeport M Type head that I "won" from a guy that couldn't pay me for a job! Thus it became a "Planer Mill" and went on to do sterling service..the first job, (and the reason it was built) was to re-manufacture a $25.00 "basket case" of a Myford Super 7. I had to plane and scrape, over 75 thousandths of an inch off the bed to straighten out wear and the depredations of a previous "Restorer" Eventually that Myford was rehabilitated to become a better, more accurate machine than its makers ever dreamed of (It had turcite linings too) The entire saddle was missing so I scratch built a new one and fitted it with a rebuilt cross slide and compound from an old Hardinge lathe. The only "Boughten" parts were a new lead screw and nuts which cost four times as much as I had paid for the rest of the Lathe!! Eventually I sold the Myford for over $2000.00..to a fellow member of TISME who couldn't wait to write a check!! As usual I digress..But I did want to establish a bit of credibility, when it comes to talking about lathe reconditioning. (Coincidentally I do have photographs of the Planer and the two lathes..If anyone is interested I will try to figure how to get them on my new web page. (Where the heck IS that son of mine when I need him?) Moving right along...When I got my Maximat a couple of years ago, it was (still is) my intention to give it the Turcite treatment..even though it has no measurable wear on bed or saddle! Once you have used a lathe with turcite lined ways, you will never be satisfied with less. So, about a year ago, I tracked down (and befriended) the local Turcite Rep. (FIND YER OWN!!!) which resulted in an accumulation of enough "Evaluation Samples" to do the job! 8^) (Hey..Haven't you noticed how NICE I am to people all the time!) I also made several inquiries regarding regrinding the bed. No it probably doesn't NEED it but if I am going to all that trouble it will be done RIGHT!! If for no other reason, than that cross hatch patern IS important. There is no one in the south east that knows what a way grinder is (Dammit, or even a lathe for that matter!!) But I was able to talk to a couple of shops in the North-East (Philly. New Jersey etc.) and the median ballpark was under $300.00. Unfortunately it would cost almost as much to ship...EACH way!! So, as it is not a priority, it may wait a while..but one of these days...! I didn't even keep a note of who was chea..least expensive! I was content to know that, when the time comes, finding someone to do it won't be a problem. I will just bite the bullet and suggest a leisurly motoring vacation to my lovely Southern Wife..who has never low...who has never been so lo..far north..as the Mason-Dixon!! Oh Honey.. by the way..being as we are going to... Yes the bed will fit in the trunk of the Jag..I measured it! 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: The insides of Loonies From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1999 07:44:47 GMT -------- From what I recall of the hookers on both sides of the Niagara..you would need change from fifty cents! NO...I haven't...But if you have ever visited Niagara Falls, (Ontario OR NY), you will know it is impossible to miss them!! Right Mike! 8^) teenut Spehro Pefhany wrote: > Then there are the stories of hookers in Buffalo accepting Canadian Tire > money (50 cents couple as a "Canadian fifty". ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Got your Goose! From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1999 08:20:07 GMT -------- Someone asked a short while ago, what is a "Gooseneck Tool" Here is a picture of one: http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=181416443 teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Update: Cutting Aluminum w/Abrasive Wheel From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1999 13:01:55 GMT -------- Hi Matt. Erm! Seems to be a bit of confusion here still.. A "Cold Saw" Is a HEAVILY built circular saw,running a large diameter High Speed steel (Or carbide tipped blade on the more rigid machines.) The blade runs at SLOW speed...Milling cutter speeds for the same cutter material..a couple of hundred rev/min or less. Can be of a "Chop" configuration on small machines. More usually a "roll in" feed of the saw, to a fixed table on the larger machines. Cold saws are used, primarily, for ferrous metals or for heavier sections of aluminum, bronze etc Always they are equipped with a heavy duty vise, flood coolant, accurate end stops, and , on the larger ones, power feed, automatic stock advance and sometimes, fully automatic cycling. Definitely overkill and way too slow for your application. This was not what Pete was recommending! Abrasive cut off saw...High speed, much lighter build, "Chop" or Radial Arm configuration. Often wrongly named and thus confused with a genuine "Chop Saw" as described below. Usually fitted with a vise, sometimes with flood coolant auto stock feed etc, Perfect for fast cuts on lighter sections of ferrous metals. Nasty burrs, nasty smells, smoke and other airborn contamination etc, Wheels are a consummable and can get expensive on heavy section cuts. Probably the absolute worst choice for aluminum!! Why..because aluminum conducts heat away too fast..Abrasive saws rely on local heat to soften the material being cut. Yet aluminum is also too maleable to be "friably cut" (for want of a better term ;^) by the blunt trauma of the badly shaped "cutting edges" in an abrasive wheel. Add to that the affinity that aluminum has for aluminum oxide and its ability to tuck itself into every available void "loading the wheel"..and maybe you can see why it is not the weapon of choice. "Chop Saw" Lighter, Highspeed, Most are simply the self same machine sold to woodworkers as a "chop saw", "miter saw" etc. Fitted with a triple grind, carbide tipped blade a chop saw will do a super job on your type of application. With a good quality machine, sharp blade, wax based lube etc I would expect the cut you describe to be done in a matter of three to five seconds..tops, with a perfect burr free finish. The cut of part will be barely warm to the touch!! Yes, they do make abrasive cut of wheels for aluminum..because they can sell them..not, as you dicovered, because they work worth a tinker's cuss!! How do I know all this? Several years ago I too, was the proud owner of a Contract Machine Shop! Over a period of several years, I made Hundreds of Thousands (Probably Millions..I was too tired ever to count!) of replacement "after market..no name" rollers for every conceivable make, model and size of photocopying machine ever put on the market. Each of these required the chop sawing of two slugs of 1" to 1 1/2" diameter solid aluminum bar and a similar diameter of tubing. The three pieces were friction/inertia butt-welded together to form a blank that was high speed turned on CNC machines etc. Using "Child slave labor" (Students) I could expect fifteen to twenty slugs a minute! I ran teams of two, one cutting, the other fetching and feeding stock and carting away slugs and CHIPS!!...By the Barrel load! During that period I plumb wore out, several high quality, Swedish made, "Chop Saws", specifically designed for non ferrous metal cutting. They carried a price tag three or four times as high as the "Home Depot..Japanese import" brands of Miter/Chopsaws. Well over two thousand dollars each! I could "Kill" one in six months.. running two to three shifts, to keep up with the CNCs, running three shifts, seven days a week...But not one died owing me money!! After a while I started getting replacements FREE! The Manufacurer used me as a destructive testing Laboratory for new developments and improvements! If I had relied on any other method (and believe me I tried them all), I would have gone bankrupt in a month! So I strongly suggest you replace that abrasive wheel with a top quality, triple chip ground, carbide tipped saw blade that is specifically designed for aluminum (hint..Home depot don't carry them!!) Get some wax stick lubricant...And have FUN!! 8^) FWIW teenut "Matt Stawicki (APP Leader)" wrote: > > First, I'd like to thank all of you who responded to my > question. Next, I'll tell you what I did. > > Pete A. described the best solution, Mike G. put a name on > it. I talked to quite a few different people and a Cold Saw > is definately the way to go. However, I simply didn't have > almost $500 to spend. I probably could have gotten away with > trying to find a coarser blade for my horizontal band saw, > but it still would have been tied up for way to long. I use > it for many other things and I really don't want to have to > change blades back and forth and reset my stop all the time. > > I wound up buying a Milwaukee brand Chop Saw. > With an abrasive blade made for cutting aluminum, I can cut > through the 1 1/4 bar in about 18 seconds. Beats the crap > out of the 72 seconds it was taking on the horizontal > bandsaw. I get almost 200 pieces per blade and the blades > sell for under $5. The only bad part about using the > abrasive blade is that the parts get HOT! Made the mistake > of trying to pick one up after cutting it off and now have a > little dead skin on the ends of 2 fingers and my thumb. > Smooth move, Exlax! > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Knife handle care From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1999 13:06:24 GMT -------- For a permanent, high gloss finish; swab it LIBERALLY with Super Glue..keep it wet until it can't soak up any more. Let it dry overnight and buff to the best finish you ever saw on leather! 8^) teenut Drinkwine wrote: > > I have a knife with a leather " disk " handle. > A kabar marine knife and an air force knife. The knife was stored and developed some mold on the handle. > I've cleaned this off and was wondering if any on had any recommendation on treating the leather. > Should I use oil on it, or something like Sno Seal? > Any advice greatly appreciated. > > iDrinkwine > > watch the spam spoofer...... > > **Spammers** > The following losers have sent me spam. In complience with > the law they site, in order to be removed from my spammer > list, just post a message to alt.2600 with the > header: I'm a loser, I spam! > and I'll remove you from my list! > \\|||// > (@@) > ooO_(_)_Ooo__________________________________ > |______|_____|_____|_____|_____|_____|_____|_____| > |___|____|_____|_____|_____|_____|_____|_____|____| > |_____|_____Please pardon the intrusion_|____|______| > Under Bill s.1618 TITLE III passed by the 105th US > Congress this letter cannot be considered spam as long as the sender > includes contact information & a method of removal. > For removal utilize the reply link and write remove in the subject line > OBC PO BOX 114, Chapel Hill, NC 27514, 919-839-2942 > > helprmv@www.yu > carole@turbomail.net > regkooulcz@my-deja.com > ADMS1@excite.com > dynobond@home.com > sendit@nfocomm.com > tomlist@prodigy2001.com > tom@prodigy2001.com > car2@misc321.com > racecars@pinoymail.com > hot-offers@hkg.net > soul.mate@start.com.au > free_web_sites@123india.com > iti3@mail.com > iti99@start.com.au > cmijvsrnij@slo.net > mailrmv1@www.yu > cmijvsrnij@slo.net > mailrmv1@www.yu > sender2@usa.co.jp > sender1@usa.co.jp > sender1@brazil.co.jp > Semerion76045@basemail.com.br > playtime697548@888.nu ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lathe Bed Grinder From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1999 13:20:16 GMT -------- In that case..you have it made!! A lot of "Bedway Grinders" started out as planers. Even the custom built ones bear a remarkeable family resemblance. The big ones are double column with a bridge, more modern ones are like an openside planer. Kit it out with dust protection for the ways, a tool post grinder and a flaring cup wheel and you could even go into the bedway grinding business! When can you do mine..for free of course! I'll bring the beer. Eh! :^o teenut Marshall Pharoah wrote: > > But, I do have a cousin that has a huge old Brown and Sharpe planer with a J > head > to go on it. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Another quickie for the Sparkies From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1999 14:03:56 GMT -------- I ma looking to buy a set of small screw drivers..flat and phillips in the sizes favored by Jewellers and Electronics Techs I am sick of replacing the Chinese Noodles which are all I have ever been able to find in sets. This time, I am buying the last set I will ever need! Almost regardless of expense!! Having just been outbid at close to thirty bucks for a nearly new set of Starrett flat bladed Jewellers Screw Drivers, I realise this could be and expensive little purchase. Before I weigh back in on Ebay, Can someone tell me: A) What a new set of Starretts costs nowadays? B) Who does make the best flat and phillips in the weeny sizes? C) How much and where can I get them? Thanks, as always, teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Dupont (?) lathe info From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1999 14:10:19 GMT -------- It could be DUMORE! I never knew they made lathes..but I recall seeing a small, solid looking bench lathe by Dumore, on Ebay a few weeks ago! From vague memory it was about a 6" x 12" but built like a brick. Dumore motor, of course! teenut > > > > >Has anyone heard of a lathe manufacturing company named Dupont? I know > > >someone selling a small lathe +- 600mm that he "thinks is some name like > > >Dupont" I would like to know if this a reputable name before I trek out > to > > >see that lathe. > > > > > >Regards, > > >Nick Alexander ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: DRO Compatibility and interchangeability From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1999 14:26:09 GMT -------- Is it at all likely that linear encoders from one manufacturer could be made to work with encoders and or DRO monitors of a different manufacturer. For example, Will an Accurite DRO work with Mitutoyo Scales? Presupposing of course, that they are the same voltage and sensitivity. Thanks, teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lathe Bed Grinder From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1999 15:12:25 GMT -------- I can't disagree with you on a single point Jim. Except where to go (come) for free Turcite. (MINE I tell you...all MINE!!) 8*) HSMs and Commercial Operators inhabit different worlds. Had that been one of my Business's money making machines, one of two things would have happened (actually I would never have bought it in the first place :^) After a careful ROI analysis, it would how been sent off thbe rebuilt at a fixed, quoted price, and on a strict delivery schedule. Or it would have been traded in on a new one. Period! The other alternative, still followed by too many, of keeping a clapped out machine around for the occasional odd job, is not an option any more. Indeed, rebuilding would only be undertaken under fairly unique circumstances..take our big old planer for instance. No way could it earn its floor space as a planer. But remanufactured, fitted with modern drives, controls and modular,high powered milling heads, it could possibly justify a $200.000.00 investment, if the alternative were a million dollar Floor Borer! Made in Russia, Poland or China!! On the other hand, with my HSMers hat and teeshirt ("Machinists wash their hands BEFORE using the Bathroom".. Replete with simulated oil slart over left front)...I can perhaps help some other HSMer to find a way to get the kind of rebuild done that he would really prefer..and not be stopped by a pre-concieved notion that it is too difficult or expensive to do it right. In actual fact, were I faced with the need to regrind my own lathe bed, i would hi me to the nearest scrap yard and see if I couldn't scare up the makings of another Plainer/grinder! With a fixed bridge, hand feed and a lot of patient chipping, filling, shimming etc, A real good end could result, independant of whatever "Residual" accuracy might be left in the lathe bed itself, If I found myself stuck, with no alternative, I would reference fom the untouched portions of the bed..the narrow lands beteen the ways..rather than the tailstock guide ways. Incidentally, I just "Won" a pair of ex aerospace reference parallels, on Ebay for less than forty bucks. These are 30" long x 1 1/4" x 3" stabilised and precision ground. This is my back-up reference and potentially a set of precision guide rails if I ever do need to regrind my own lathe bed. teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article <38058922.9C9619C9@home.com>, > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > As usual I digress..But I did want to establish a bit of credibility, > > when it > > comes to talking about lathe reconditioning. > > Not really in doubt. But your posting of your experiences > sort of proves my point - the average hsm will not be able > to call in as many favors, nor will have the resources available > in terms of other machines (a PLANER?!) to achieve your > results. > > Granted favors make this business go around. And if you know > the right folks, all the better. > > So - anyone who wants to get Turcite for their machines, > they now know who's door to go rapping on! > > But if you had been in the business of re-doing that lathe bed, > it would have been a loss of a job, money wise, given the > time you put in. Not that it was not worth it, of course - but > the conclusion one can draw is that a real, money making shop > would go broke if they re-conditioned hsm-type lathes for money. > > They could not charge the cost of the job. > > So I propose an assembly line production for reconditioning them - > sort of like a cast-iron chain letter. Send your bed to the > hsm who can re-grind it. Then he sends all the beds to the person > who can do the turcite - and then the assembly goes to the person > who re-fits the carriage. One person will be in charge of scaping > in the tailstocks (if not turcited). > > Final stop is at somebody's paint shop. > > At the end, everyone gets a brand new lathe, and the stock of > clapped out machines is rejuvinated. > > Only problem is the darn bosses, who will be wondering why the > *real* work is going so slow!! > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: MOVING MUST SELL LATHE & MILL From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 14 Oct 1999 17:13:00 GMT -------- That is what is called "Asking for the Money to be put where the Mouth is" ;^) teenut Irving Olson wrote: > > Will accept $41,000 for the entire shop. Cost me over $100,000 and used very > little. Will consider splitting up. For more info please call me 330-867-1111 > > Dens gt wrote: > > > What kind of prices are you planning on charging? I live reasonably close, but > > don't want to waste a trip. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Another quickie for the Sparkies From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 15 Oct 1999 02:44:04 GMT -------- Ron Moore wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > I ma looking to buy a set of small screw drivers..flat and phillips in the sizes > > favored by Jewellers and Electronics Techs > > > > > > A) What a new set of Starretts costs nowadays? > > Don't know. Brand new $50.00 !'m told (Jeez!) Fortunately I managed to land the set of "As New" for $31.00...Way nore than I expected or hoped for!! But at least, now, neither I, nor my children, nor my children's children, need worry about buying another set for a while!! I know I have wasted WAY more than 30 bucks of even MY discounted time, because I didn't have the right screw driver to hand..or the one I had trashed out at a critical moment! Now I need the weeny Phillips in the same quality and I am set! Wiha huh? Search mode ON!! Thanks, teenut > > > B) Who does make the best flat and phillips in the weeny sizes? > > Wiha brand Set of 7 set # 261 90 > > > C) How much and where can I get them? > > Most electronics houses for about $30; sometimes at flea markets for $10. > > Respectfully, > Ron Moore ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Myford MiniKop From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 15 Oct 1999 02:51:20 GMT -------- I have come out of my Dark Place long enough to post this ling for thoe who asked what a MiniKop is. http://www.lathes.co.uk/myford/page4.html Read it and weep! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: "Dunlop" Lathe From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 15 Oct 1999 02:59:23 GMT -------- This seems the likeliest candidate: With acknowledgements to Tony Griffin teenut Home Back to Lathe Illustrations Small lathes for Sale E-MAIL Tony@lathes.co.uk Craftsman 80, Dunalp, AA109 Craftsman 6" Craftsman 9" & 12" The "Craftsman" label was used by the famous American mail-order company "Sears and Roebuck" for not only metal and wood-turning lathes, but also a much wider range of power and hand tools. Although the company had offered a range of lathes from the late 1800s, it was in 1932 that their most famous machine first became available, a 9" swing lathe manufactured by the Atlas Company. This machine was updated yearly in line with changes to the Atlas range and then, in about 1936, replaced by a much heavier 12" model based on the Atlas F10. It seems surprising that Atlas built a 12" model for Sears, yet restricted their own machine to 10", especially since it would be the early 1960s before they increased the centre height of their own lathe to match. The introduction of the large Atlas clone was followed in the late 1930s by a version of the same company's 6" lathe. This latter machine was marketed in an almost unchanged form until about 1970, when a redesigned machine was introduced and Atlas also began selling direct to the public; these machines are featured on other pages. The lathes on this page are all products of the AA Company (some people prefer to say "Double A Company") another supplier to Sears whose earliest machines were wood-turning lathes offered with metal-turning accessories. In 1935 the options list expanded to include a rack-feed saddle with top and cross slides, full screwcutting with changewheels and leadscrew - and a proper multi-speed countershaft (jack-shaft) assembly. By 1940 the lathe was being offered as a complete metal turning unit and by 1942, marked "Dunalp", had become recognisable as an early version of the better known "Model 109". ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Need advice - Small lathe From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 15 Oct 1999 05:12:44 GMT -------- One thing, for sure and certain! If you are cutting all those metric thread sizes, you MUST get a metric leadscrew. Cutting them with translation gears on an "Imperial" Leadscrew will drive you NUTS!! Unfortunately this rules out about 99.999% of all the used lathes in America 8^( You don't mention quantities. It could be that small CNC lathe would be right up your street..Especially if you don't have much lathe experience. Once the programs are written..you are done, and it is easier to get help to do that on a ome time basis, that it is to look for help every time you switch it on. The size ranges rule out some of the miniature "toy" lathes (you think I am going to mention names here you are very mistaken..I have to LIVE in this "town"..) The Emcomat 5 seems a good size for you...a well built machine, available in manual or CNC. For workholding of that delicate nature, even a six jaw chuck is a bit "iffy", unless you fet one with replaceable jaws and make a full set of "Pie Jaws" to suit the diameters you need. Good luck. teenut aorestee@avana.net wrote: > > I'm a newbie to metalworking (well, the last time I used a metal lathe > was 1969). I would like to make custom screw-in adapters for camera > lenses so I need to be able to cut precise metric theads (27mm to 95mm > diameters; .5mm,.75mm, 1.0mm pitch). > > I also want to make custom lens mounts. Diameters of up to 95mm will > be encountered. > > Materials will be aluminum, brass, and steel. > > Any advice on what lathe I should buy? And from whom should I buy it? > > Are there any good sources for used equipment? > > I live in the Atlanta area. > > Thanks in advance! > > Tony Oresteen > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Onion Killer From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 15 Oct 1999 05:26:27 GMT -------- Simon..(Being from some fringe organisation, with an obscure political agenda, and who was obviously laboring under the illusion that he was talking to some one (any one) who gives a rats a**) wrote: > There are lots of different brands of government but none of them > work... Isn't that a clever way to ensure that anything else he might have to say, will be taken seriously! You must be VERY bright Simon! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Another quickie for the Sparkies From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 15 Oct 1999 05:29:56 GMT -------- Oh! <8^( You spoiled my day. I'm going back to my Dark Place! teenut NOSPAM ORTRASH Mark White wrote: > > Mr. Bastow, > > I don't want to be a stick in the mud here, but I have done a > fair amount of work with the wee lil' drivers, and have been able to > twist off the tips of a lot of them. You know how it is, you have to > get something fixed, and if the screw is in so tight that it chews up > a driver, well then the driver gets the short end... Starrets are > nice, but I have buggered them up too. Wiha makes a pretty good small > set of screwdrivers too. Even the top of the line craftsman drivers > are pretty decent, and the best value IMHO. > I guess my rambling here is just to say that Starrets aren't > the only choice, but don't expect them to be the last set you buy > because you'll chew some up eventually... My big tip here is that you > can buy a lot of tiny sizes in 1/4" drive bits, I believe my last ones > were from Snap On, and are great to have for those jobs that will eat > up a quality screwdriver, plus you can use them in a decent sized > handle that you can put some force into. > > Mark White > > On Thu, 14 Oct 1999 14:03:56 GMT, Robert Bastow > wrote: > > >I ma looking to buy a set of small screw drivers..flat and phillips in the sizes > >favored by Jewellers and Electronics Techs > > > >I am sick of replacing the Chinese Noodles which are all I have ever been able > >to find in sets. This time, I am buying the last set I will ever need! Almost > >regardless of expense!! > > > >Having just been outbid at close to thirty bucks for a nearly new set of > >Starrett flat bladed Jewellers Screw Drivers, I realise this could be and > >expensive little purchase. > > > >Before I weigh back in on Ebay, Can someone tell me: > > > >A) What a new set of Starretts costs nowadays? > > > >B) Who does make the best flat and phillips in the weeny sizes? > > > >C) How much and where can I get them? > > > >Thanks, as always, > > > >teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Need R8 spindle for Bridgeport From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 15 Oct 1999 17:21:10 GMT -------- AH-Hah!! The truth will out! The truth will set us free! Per previous posts, the cost of replacing your Mill spindle may be prohibitive. But converting the drive shank in your right angle attachment to fit the 30 taper in you mill. I can say, without fear of contradiction, that someone WILL contradict me if I am wrong here...8^) But I believe that the R8 taper and the 30 tapers are the same.. In other word, if you cut the top end off your R8 adaptor, you can re-machine the stub to fit your #30 spindle! teenut GM Carlson wrote: > > I'd stick with the #30, except that I would like to be able to use my > right angle adapter. > The #30 would be excellent for someone who was converting to CNC. > > On Fri, 15 Oct 1999 00:43:59 -0500, Jon Elson > wrote: > > > > > > >GM Carlson wrote: > > > >> I just recently bought a 2J head for my Bridgeport project, but the > >> head has a #30 taper. This may be great for some, but I would find an > >> R8 more usefull. Does anyone know where I could find an R8 spindle. > >> Also, would anyone like to buy the #30 spindle. > > > >Best thing might be a 30 taper to R8 adaptor. A spindle is going to be > >VERY expensive - maybe $600 or more. An adaptor might be had at > >about $100. > > > >Jon > > > > GM Carlson > email - gcarlson at omnistar dot com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Another Update - Cutting Aluminum w/Carbide Blade!!!! From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 15 Oct 1999 18:25:59 GMT -------- + "Matt Stawicki (APP Leader)" wrote: > > Robert Bastow, you are the man of the hour! "You like me...You really LIKE me!" (Sally Fields at the Oscars) Now when has 'ole teenut ever lead you wrong? (A rhetorical question guys!!) 8^) > > About every 4 - 5 pieces I give the blade a shot of WD-40, > which is suggested in the sales manual (and comfirmed by the > service tech). WOW! a "Technical Expert" at Home Depot!! Yes I know WD40 works..but PLEASE do as I suggested, and use a stick lubricant. For reasons relating to PERSONAL EXPERIENCE!! 1) The fumes from heated or burning WD40 will tear your lungs out...sooner rather than later! I am not sure of what all the ingredients are...and certainly not sure how they break down or recombine... 2) WD40 is a "Carrier"...Anything on your hands or in the air or your clothes will finish up in your bloodstream. It is maybe and acceptable risk for the occassional, well directed squirt..but every 3 or 4 cuts on a spinning blade...Do I need draw a picture!! I have no idea, what are the clinical effects of longterm exposure to WD40 but I doubt it is benign. Not to long ago, cancer of the Scrotum was known as "Machinist's Disease" 3) Your machine may never rust.. but it sure will jam up in a hurry. WD40 will wash all the grease or oil out of bearings etc and replace it with a packed in slurry of aluminum fines etc... There are more..but who's listening?? teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lathe Bed Grinder From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 15 Oct 1999 18:38:41 GMT -------- You hit the nail right on the head there.. Pure teflon makes slides a slick as.. Problem is that it "Cold Flows" under pressure, so it is difficult to maintain pre-set clearances for long. Turcite (pronounced tur-Kite) is a blend of teflon and other ingredients designed to prevent this creeping effect. Wear on surfaces if very low..The turcite is to soft to be abraded much..it tends to be self healing. Abrasive particles that would damage the metal slide surfaces, tend to be totally absorbed by the teflon. In other words it makes a poor lapping base. teenut wwest2112@my-deja.com wrote: > > In article <7u6ehk$i5s$1@usenet01.srv.cis.pitt.edu>, > ted+@pitt.edu (William E Williams) wrote: > > In article <7u4jji$h6e$1@nnrp1.deja.com>, > wrote: > > >looked great. I did not scrape then, but took out the fine lines to > > >smooth with a frosting scrape. > > >Since the hight dropped, I remachined the saddle ways and epoxed > teflon > > >and machined that. > > >The result was like moving on ice, very slipery. > > >Keep the ideas comming. > > >Walt West > > > > Walt, > > How did the teflon work out? Has there been much > > wear in it > I did not have the lathe long enough to evaluate the wear.I used pure > PTFE (Teflon) because it was available as scrap pieces used as facing > for elastomeric diaphragm valves. Many types of filled > (carbon,glass,etc) Teflon are available today that would reduce wear. I > expect if only the Teflon wore and not the bed it should be fine. I > recently bought a Teflon rod from Cadilac Plastic and Chemical for > machining some seals. They have sheet stock available, but in order to > epoxy it requires a chemical surface etch to get it to bond. The other > point is the stuff is so creepy I don't think scraping after machining > is necessary as any high spots would soon creep flat. > Walt West > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lathe Bed Grinder-Moglich From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 15 Oct 1999 18:49:01 GMT -------- Hi Mike. I am going to try this type stuff next occassion I need it. One version is made by the same people as Turcite. teenut Mike Rehmus wrote: > > The nifty stuff is called Moglich (sp?), a pourable epoxy version of > Turcite. You wedge the carriage up to height on bits of Turcite and then > pour this stuff in. Makes a made-to-order Turcite-lined carriage. This is > the way they build some new machine tools (large ones), especially on-site. > > John Hofstad-Parkhill wrote in message > news:H%xN3.1775$b84.268297@ptah.visi.com... > > I was wrong about the turcite. It is expensive, but not nearly as much as > I > > thought I heard. Just checked this evening and it runs about $0.50 / > sq.in. > > Still not cheap, but a little would go a long way. > > > > > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Machines available for sale by San Jose State University, CA From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 15 Oct 1999 20:23:38 GMT -------- Take a look at the Rivitt for me. No. I don't need amother lathe..but I have na awful soft spot for Rivitts teenut John Stevenson wrote: > > On Fri, 15 Oct 1999 12:15:03 -0700, Scott Moore wrote: > > >Hi all, I am posting this message as a friend of the university. The following machines are available for > >immediate sale: > > > > Inventory List for Courtyard > >No. ID # quantity Type of Machine/Part > >1 50782 1 Fellows 7 type high speed gear shaper > > List snipped > > >27 215585 1 Jones & Lamson"" Optical Comparator, Model PC-14 > > > > > > >Please understand, this is a college, not a machine dealer. They did not give me prices because > >they got the machines as donated from industrial concerns around the valley, and they are not experts > >about the "going prices" for these machines. Their prime concern is to clear the machines out, not > >to make huge amounts of money. I asked the gentleman responsible for the machines to let me have > >a chance to clear the machines by letting the machine hobbyists here have a chance at them > >instead of letting a dealer buy them in bulk. > > > >San Jose State is not a for profit outfit, and the money you pay for the machines will go > >towards building the engineering program there. Just offer them a fair price. These machines > >are going to go for a price that you will not find anywhere else, for a long time. > > > > Well folks this must be the Luck of the Irish or something > Would you believe 'Chief Weasel' Stevenson is in San Jose in a couple of weeks. > > Ho Ho what's the most excess baggage you can take back. > I fancy lots 1 to 26, I found an optical comparator a couple of weeks ago but > let someone else on the list have it. > If anybody is interested in lots 10 or 11 that's OK by me. > Bet I can beat you down there Mike > -- > > Regards, > > John Stevenson at > L Stevenson [Engineers] > Nottingham, England. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Aircraft Sheet Metal Parts Formed with Reconfigurable Tooling From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 15 Oct 1999 20:27:53 GMT -------- They say there is nothing new under the sun! This is no except1on..just a fancier name for an OLD idea. teenut tgallati@hotmail.com wrote: > > The sheetmetal skin of aircraft can be formed with a reconfigurable > tool that uses a "discrete-pin die" system that assumes the metal > shape desired through computer control. Northrop Grumman is doing it > with a tool developed under government and private industry supported > R&D. > > http://www2.toolingonline.com/welcome/ngck ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: A Quicky for the Sparkies From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 16 Oct 1999 00:10:53 GMT -------- Thanks Bill, and to all the many other people who have made such valuable contributions. If I am the only one who has saved and catalogued every single post on this question..I could probably pass myself off as the resident expert on the subject!! 8^) teenut Bill Richman wrote: > > First of all congratulations to your son on his report card. Good going! > Keep on encouraging him! If you haven't found something you like yet, check > with Jim Shannon at http://www.aactrinity.com/tektroni.htm - he and his son > check out and sell surplus scopes. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Aluminum casting? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 16 Oct 1999 03:57:14 GMT -------- If it is from outboard motors it should be ok for casting. What kind of fish are you casting for? 8^) teenut Mark wrote: > > Aluminum sources?? I have access to about 400 lbs of aluminum from outboard motors > is this a good aluminum to use for casting? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Need advice - Small lathe From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 16 Oct 1999 04:02:03 GMT -------- Not as easy as it looks, this metal munging. Huh! You mentioned you were in the Atlanta area Tony. So am I (Dunwoody) Contact me directly and lets see if we can't get you fixed up! teenut aorestee@avana.net wrote: > > Thanks to every one who has helped me!!!! Wow! A simple > task isn't so simple. > > I see I have a lot of researh to do and I appriciate the help so far. > I plan to take it slow and not make a $1,000 mistake. Thanks again! > > Tony > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Need advice - Small lathe From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 16 Oct 1999 04:11:21 GMT -------- The point about cutting metric threads on a none metric leadscrew lathe, is not the number of different threads it will cut, but the EASE with which they can be cut. When using a translation gear (as you must with an imperial screw to cut metric pitches) one is not able to "Drop the nuts" at the end of each pass. The tool must be removed from cut and the spindle and carriage reversed to the starting point. Royal PITA if you do metric threads on a regular basis. (Royal PITA if you only do one a month, if you ask me!!) Wouldn't it have been a LOT easier if the stupid French had asked first..we could have had a nicely compatible, interchangeable unit from the get go. But Nooo...! teenut gene wrote: > > > Seconding T-nut on giving high priority to a metric lathe. > > Not to be picky but back in the early 70's when I was working in a > camera store doing camera repair we made the assumption that we needed a > metric lathe. But after getting the lathe and working with it I found > that I could cut more metric threads on the english version than on the > metric lathe. It just had to do with the way the gear ratios worked out. > Just check the math and exactly what threads each model will do before > you buy. > > gene > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: MSC made my jaw drop!!! From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 16 Oct 1999 04:24:08 GMT -------- JP wrote: (clip a well earned testimonial to MSC confirming my own experiences with them, and why, though I understand a couple of major competitors are also here in Atlanta..I have no idea where they are..and feel no urgent need to go find them!!) Monday I am writing Mitch > Jacobson, head of MSC and letting him know he's doing something right. > > Thanks to all of you who recommended MSC to me. I'm still > flabbergasted. Today was a good day! > > Regards, > JP Be sure to tell him the name of the Guy who was so helpful and ask him if he has the NGs monitored regularly for feed back. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lathe Bed Grinder From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 16 Oct 1999 04:33:17 GMT -------- mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > Ha - but he does not need a lathe to fix that jag, he needs the > oft-mentioned oscilliscope. Or at least a good soldering iron. > > Lucas electrics, you know. > > Jim When the final "History of the Rise and Fall of the British Empire" is written, it will be recognised that the Scottish Soldier won it...And Lucas Electrics lost it!! (Mind you..the rot started when the Scots learned to duck!!) (However, sorry to spoil your fun and all that...but my Jags don't have Lucas Electrics..I would never have brought (got) them home from the dealer's if they had!! 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: anybody get their CROWN-ROBERTSON lathe?? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 16 Oct 1999 04:35:18 GMT -------- Looks like I might see mine before you see yours 8^) teenut Mark Winlund wrote: > > Yeah, I bought one and haven't seen it yet. I'd like to hear your comments > also, if you see one. > > Mark > > mark@maxmachine.com > > Robert Bastow wrote in message <38056D67.F80C489E@home.com>... > >Been going to ask the same thing..They are back on ebay and this time I AM > going > >down to see them! > > > >I couldn't resist putting a bid in this time though! If when I see them > they > >are not what I expect, I will say so and withdraw my bid. > > > >teenut > > > >mike grady wrote: > >> > >> havent been watching the group lately > >> what are they like ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: DELURK: matchlock gun barrels From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 16 Oct 1999 05:39:10 GMT -------- richgoth, sydney wrote: > Black powder develops pressures of up to 25,00psi... Whoaa! Where did you get THAT idea!! It is a MYTH that can KILL you! BP can develop pressures WAY over 25000psi ! If you want to make your own barrels, use mechanical DOM (Drawn over mandrel) hollow bar. Use MILD STEEL not 4140..it is easier to cut and has better elongation. No need for fancy stuff unless you are using jacketed bullets. With lead bullets you are likely to wear it out from cleaning LONG befor you shoot it out. It is spec'ed by O/d and wall thickness, thus 1 1/4" - 3/8" wall will give you a half inch bore. Unless you are fussy about a particular bore diameter..which the old time gunmakers never were..you are ready to rifle and lap. Then take a LARGE (14") mill bastard file to the outside, and remove all the bits that don't look like a rifle barrel. Hard work, but it goes surprisingly quickly! If I had to do one today, I would do it by hand (might cheat a bit on the big belt grinder)..but it is how it was done, and it IS faster than setting up on the mill!! Especially if you want a nice, elegant, swamped muzzle. The old gunsmiths made beautiful barrels with what appears, to the modern layman, to be crude tools. But the principles are sound and they work as well today as they did then. I HAVE made rifle barrels (very accurate ones too) by the same methods...and, because I was in the UK at the time, for the same reasons and under the same restrictions. You certainly don't need a lathe, but neither do you need to go welding up your tubes from reclaimed horseshoe nails.(Though I do know a guy that welds his own four wire Damascus Twist barrels, and they are works of art!!) The old gunsmiths would have died to have hollow bar available from the local Metal Supermarket!! ;^) Indeed, one of the first, widely distributed iron/steel mill products was octagonal hollow bar for rifle makers!! Octagonal because it was easier to roll it thus, and it stayed octagonal because it is quicker and easier to file and finish it thus! (..and you always thought..!!) ;^) You sound like someone who enjoys the research aspect of this too. I can suggest no better beginning than books like Ned Robert's "The Muzzle Loading Caplock Rifle" It is out of print..but not rare or expensive. Start your search in OZ with Michael Treloar Antiquarian Books in Adelaide (+61 8 8223 1111 ) Say Hi to Sue for me!! I just ordered an OOP, two volume, Slip Covered, Limited Ist Edition of "The Bolt Action - A Design Analysis" by Prescott, from them. Now that IS rare and expensive..so they might be taking a vacation when you call!! 8^( teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Why is leads crew jerky??? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 16 Oct 1999 06:01:00 GMT -------- Simply a bit of "Stiction"..Stick-slip..which CANNOT be avoided on sliding surfaces (which includes your acme leadscrew and nut) Your mill sounds as though it is as well set up as any I have ever met with! If you had been using a REALLY sensitive DTI (Not a DRO) you would see the table, as you turn the screw, would HOLD for a moment (thats the "stick") then JUMP a wee ways (Thats the "slip") Then you would see it CREEP a tiny amount before coming to rest..that last bit is the oil film settling down after being squeezed. See what you miss with a DRO!! (O.0005" or even 0.0002" is way too coarse to see this happen) 8^) teenut Kpnorm wrote: > > I was double checking my 0 with the edge finder today. I"m .002 away and cound > a series of 9 small jerky movements as I go those .002. Now I've noticed this > many times but why isn't it smooth when I dial over in slow small amoonts on > this mill? Lead man said it was because mill is old but I don't believe it. > I've used maybe 20 mills but no new ones. I tiink it has more to do with > friction. > Ken ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Look at this? More Al Babin From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 16 Oct 1999 06:17:27 GMT -------- One of the nice things about this group, is that people don't hesitate to sing praise when it is due. Brickbats are guaranteed too..but that is just like any other NG..THIS is what sets us apart! Similarly I have never seen anyone fail to apologise when they were rude, to rethink when proven wrong, or admit lack of skill or experience in any particular area. Nor have I seen an apology refused or accepted less than gracefully. There have been spats (Hopefully will be more ;^) But SFAIAA we all soon get back to mutual respect and friendship, and move on to tackle new challenges together, That this is accepted as the norm, is what makes it valuable, credible and worthwhile. All of you guys, reach over and pat yourself on the back and say "Well done! I'm proud of you!" 8^) teenut PS I am leaving Alan's message in full, just in case 'Ole Al missed it. He IS worthy of our praise and encouragement when he gets it right...God knows we need good suppliers. At least we know he isn't a QUITTER!! Alan Mimms wrote: > > FYI I just got a sh*tpile of slitting saws from ol' Al for $20. The > pic he had showed only about six saws, which I thought was fine priced > at $20. I got about 15. They are all in great shape and it took him > only two weeks to get them to me. Since I paid with a personal check, > I do not believe there was any reason to expect them sooner. > > I certainly was one of the skeptics about Al. Still am, I suppose. > But this story at least gives me SOME confidence in him. More power > to him if he can learn from his (apparently many) mistakes and get on > with life! > -- > Alan Mimms > Home machinist in (self) training. > E-mail: alanm@unforgettable.com > Metalworking web page: http://alanm.penguinpowered.com/metalworking > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Original Message <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< > > On 10/12/99, 8:05:23 PM, TS wrote regarding Look at > this? More Al Babin: > > > Just spotted on ebay, just ended. > > If the picture's gone I'll send you a copy... > > > http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=176506808 > > > 1. Its another Al Babin (mbabin@snet.net) offering. > > 2. Great description: WHEEL TOOL FORM GOOD COND. > > 3. no bids at $65.00....no bids at all. > > 4. This thing looks cool. > > 5. what the hell is it? > > 6. looks like a lathe compound, with a collet chuck mounted on it. > > 7. what'sa Wheel tool? > > 8. the picture is clear, but I have no idea how big it is. > > 9. could be $6.00 Priority Mail, or $85 Motor Freight. > > 10. $65? I would have bought it just to have it. Make a lamp or > > something. > > 10a. If Al just wrote another five words of vague description, so I > > could somehow justify the purchase to SWMBO I'd have bid on it for > sure. > > Maybe a coin in the picture for scale. > > 11. I wonder if his business is down after the recent trashing here. > > 12. Note to self, check ebay in five days... see how he did with the > > four pages worth of stuff. > > oh yeah. > > What does a cherrying head do? Do I want it? How much does it weigh? > > > Tony - all questioned out.... ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Onion Killer From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 16 Oct 1999 06:23:33 GMT -------- mikoberg wrote: > to brew their.... Ahh oh yea.... > alternative truck fuel. ROTFLMAO The local "Shine" around hereabouts is more like ROCKET fuel... Man, is the good stuff ever Smooooth though!! Real "Sippin'" whiskey! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re:Common Household objects as power feeds From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 16 Oct 1999 15:08:08 GMT -------- Hi Fitch, I figured that while I was over "here", visiting with the "Lunatic Fringe"....I would remind, what every serious metal munger knows, that Kitchen Aids make superb temporary POWER FEED DRIVES (permanent in some cases) Indeed, some noted Kitchen AIDS (HIV positive at least) historians, digging in early industrial deposition layers (The rust belt being particularly fertile) have remarked on the design similarities between the Modern Day Kitchen Aid and the, now distinct, Cincinatataurus #3 Rex. Numerous attempts have been made to extract living DNA from surviving Kitchen Aids (or even their owners) without success, making it likely that one of the few remaining "Living Dinosaurs" will be forever denied its rightful place in the fossil record! Reporting for RCM Live from the West Coast teenut "Fitch R. Williams" wrote: > I regard having at least one Kitchen Aid mixer to be both normal and > healthy. Having two, one of which presents potential metal working > opportunities is even more normal and healthy!! > > So there! > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Aluminum casting? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 16 Oct 1999 15:18:22 GMT -------- elf15641@my-deja.com wrote: > > Hi Wayne, > > The others are right about melting of beer cans. Too many for so little > and what little you have isn't worth the trouble. The info available on > this group have has saved me quite a bit of time, trouble and headaches. Ah! If only the sage advice of this NG had been available in my youth..how many headaches might I have avoided. As it was, I had to discover the hard way, when attempting to melt aluminum beer cans (to pour casings for my Gingery Iron Lung), that by the time I had accumulated enough empty cans to maintain a steady melt...I was too looped to maintain a steady pour. What a waste of a great brain!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Another Update - Cutting Aluminum w/Carbide Blade!!!! From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 16 Oct 1999 15:27:22 GMT -------- And now we turn to todays comic strips, for more sagely considered advice from our resident Dr Strangelove... We love yer Doug..this would be a dull place without you! Keep 'em coming!! 8^) teenut Doug Goncz wrote: > > > I prefer a good saw lube stick rather than the WD 40 but I guess if that > >is what was recommended then go with it. > > Yes, indeed. Maybe an applicator like a Chap Stick would "screw" the lube > forward onto the blade, rotating the solid lube stick as it moves to prevent > carving a notch in the tip. Some of the NC lathes and mills have software > controlled coolant. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Sorting Drills. How would you do This? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 16 Oct 1999 16:14:42 GMT -------- "Gauge Rollers" Commercially available from Automation Companies like Morfeed or Syntron..both in Indianapolis..but easy enough to make yourself A pair of long, dead straight, rollers (I used to use Case Hardened,Thompson Shafting). Chain driven together, contra-rotating and adjustable, independently at each end, for the gap between them. Rotation is OUT of the gap. 48"long x 2" diameter ought to work well here. In use they are finely set to cover a small range of diameters, with a tapered gap between and are set with their axis at a slight decline, narrow end at the top. Objects (drills) to be gauged or separated are fed end to end, onto the narrow end and will proceed "down hill". As they approach the section of the gap that first begins to match their diameter, they will first start to tilt upwards, and then will drop between the rollers. Adjustable baffles beneath, direct the flow of separated diameters to a series of catch boxes. This device will make "cuts" as finely as you want to make them..certainly on drill diameters to a lot less than one thou., if you so wish. And well you may wish, unless you want to physically measure every one! A bank of Gauge Rollers set to graduated sizes can be set up..you decide how far to go!! Obviously, a "pre-sort" into groups of similar diameters will be needed, similar methods will work, or even the old eyeball! But this is the tried and true solution to the tricky end! Email me direct and I will send sketches if you wish. teenut RStolz5833 wrote: > > I have a contract with a company to sharpen their drills. They come in a box > and all together. 2,000 -3,000 at a time. MM, Alph. Number, and fractional, all > together. I have to sharppen, and sort, before sending back. > > What would you do to sort them the most accuratly and fastest? > > Thank you in advance, > Rick ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Dressing grinding wheels; Was: drill sharpening FAQ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 16 Oct 1999 16:28:53 GMT -------- I thought I covered that. Star wheels are hand held, used for bench wheels and roughing on machine Grinding wheels. Unless you have a Surface, Cylindrical or Tool and Cutter grinder you probably don't need a diamond dresser. The diamond dresser should not be used free hand, (unless you have LOTS of cheap ones ;^) The diamond holder should be held in a controlled feed holder and, to get best life, it should be systematically indexed between jobs They cut the abrasive grains as well as pulling blunt ones out of bond. Because of this, a diamond dressed wheel of a given grain size, bond type and strength, running at a given speed, will act "harder" will give a finer finish and will run hotter, that a comparable "Star Dressed" wheel. 8^) teenut Ted Edwards wrote: > > Robert, > > Since I have both starwheel and diamond dressrs, I would like to see > what you have to say about using the diamond. > > Ted ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Tempering From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 16 Oct 1999 16:36:37 GMT -------- Ted very modestly ommitted to tell you that he has 250 years experience in making flat steel springs by "Eye and experience" on an open forge. He also failed to tell you that it took him 249 years to "get it right"! Right Ted! Unless you are making a spring with distal taper, or with a u-bend in it, you will find it much easier and much less "alarming" to make it out of pre-tempered, blue spring steel stock. Thats why they sell it..even to Old Pro's like Ted. Right Ted! 8^) teenut Ted Edwards wrote: > > Andrew Roberts wrote: > > > Could someone please tell me the go on tempering. > > I want to give some 0.005" shimstock a bit of spring. > > First, you harden it by heating it to a uniform cherry red (somewhat > bright red in subdued light) and quickly quench in water. This can be > hard to do with a flame as uniformity is important. If you do much of > this, it would be worthwhile to build yourself a small forge. Try this > on a piece of scrap. It should be too hard to file and *very* brittle. > If it won't harden up this way, the steel probably doesn't have enough > carbon. > > Then you temper it. Clean a surface and heat while watching the oxide > colors. You want a dark brown to blue for a spring. You'll have to > experiment a bit to get it right since the exact color depends on the > steel. It is *very* difficult to do this with a flame because > uniformity is even more important here. I have a steel plate which I > heat to a dull red in the forge. I remove this and set it on the anvil > and use it to heat the part. This gives me much better control > especially on small or thin part. > > Ted ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lathe Bed Grinder From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 16 Oct 1999 16:55:02 GMT -------- That is one big mutha lathe Jim! To answer your first question last.. Of course a "wanna be" like you, can fix it! It just takes a little know how, a lot of determination, and in the case of a 16 x 60 Southbend...A LOT of blood, sweat and tears!! Lots of people here can lead you through the steps and help with the "know how"...But you are expected to provide your own B,S&T! ;^0 First off, although 30 thou sounds like a lot of drop..What effect does this have on the level of accuracy you EXPECT and NEED from the lathe. In other words: What kind of job are you doing on it, what sizes and what accuracy do you NEED. If you are doing small bits and want to hold tenths of a thou tolereance...you have a BUNCH of work and expense ahead. Probably pay you to invest in a different machine. On the other hand, for "Agricultural Engineering", an old "War Horse" like that is invaluable..for roughing out, even finishing a lot of heavier jobs. Lots of life left in the "auwd sod" too. teenut JWise48740 wrote: > > i have been reading this and doing a lot of thinking on this subject. i have a > old southbend lathe 16x60 that the ways are worn badly. the apron seems to > drop about 30 thousands at the most worn spot .i am worried about acting to > rash . i don't want to do anything i can't undo. i.would like to have the > machine working properly.it is a good old machine .how does this teflon stuff > work .could a wannabe like me fix it? > jason ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Common Household objects as power feeds From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 16 Oct 1999 17:02:03 GMT -------- boris beizer wrote: > > How about reverse? Anybody looked inside? (I don't dare). No need to look inside Boris..The ones I used had two contra-rotating PTO points!! 8^) I wasn't (only) pulling Fitch's Plonker! Old HD variable speed mixers make a hell of a power feed drive unit! Let us say..it would take a helluva lot of work and/or money to come up with a better one!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Need advice - Small lathe From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 16 Oct 1999 17:04:34 GMT -------- All I can say Ted, is that you and I were born under very different Stars!! ;^) teenut Ted Edwards wrote: > > Jack Erbes wrote: > > > lathes that either don't have a threading dial or can't use the one they > > have for all metric pitches. So you wind up on a metric lathe with > > I have cut threads both with half nuts and threading dial and by the > reversing method. Personally, I find the reversing method easier so I > don't see the above argument as significant. > > Ted ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: MSC made my jaw drop!!! From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 16 Oct 1999 17:07:37 GMT -------- John Stevenson wrote: > UNMARRIED ??? > Does she get staff discount ??? Send picture..of staff discount card!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Best 15 x 40 Lathe From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 16 Oct 1999 17:14:44 GMT -------- Of that (Nardini or similar) quality there AIN'T a "best" or even a very "Good" lathe, of that size, in that price range! Have you priced them recently...try three to six TIMES the price levels you mention!! Unless we are discussing used equipment...and then we may as well ask "how long is a piece of string" teenut dwilk1@my-deja.com wrote: > > What is the best 15-40 lathe in the $10,000 to $15,000 dollar range. I > used to run a Nardini at a former employer. It wasn't too bad, but > would like something maybe a little better. Need to buy soon. Thanks in > advance. > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Aluminum casting? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 16 Oct 1999 17:24:00 GMT -------- John Flanagan wrote: > > On Sat, 16 Oct 1999 15:18:22 GMT, Robert Bastow > wrote: > >As it was, I had to discover the hard way, when attempting to melt aluminum beer > >cans (to pour casings for my Gingery Iron Lung), that by the time I had > >accumulated enough empty cans to maintain a steady melt...I was too looped to > >maintain a steady pour. > > Ah, I think he was talking about beer cans that were already empty :) Hey! Me too 'ole buddy! I ony tried a full one ONE time! Wheee! Fourth of July!!! You just gotta be Patient an empty all those little rascals fust! 8^) teenut > . ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Dressing grinding wheels; Was: drill sharpening FAQ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 16 Oct 1999 18:35:08 GMT -------- Should have known the "rules" don't apply to Mike!! ;^) As I said Mike "unless you have lots of cheap diamonds" Dwelling on the wheel will overheat and crack the diamond. Too fine a feed will cut rather than dress and reduce the wheel to a parody of its former grit and grade. Taken to its logical conclusion a diamond is quite capable of machining a wheel to a bearing grade finish!! It will make a lousy bearing..but a not much better grinding wheel! There are "jigs" and "JIGS" Yes, with care, correct presentation angles etc., you can dress, even a surface grinder wheel, "By Hand"...many systems are not much removed from this. The diamond being pushed by hand or lever. It is the RATE of such pushing, the DEPTH of cut and the ANGLE of the diamond to the wheel that is likely to cause a biginner problems. But that isn't "Freehand" which is what I was originally asked about. For "freehand" dressing of a bench grinding wheel you can't do better than a star wheel dresser. teenut Mike Graham wrote: > > On Sat, 16 Oct 1999 16:28:53 GMT, Robert Bastow wrote: > > >The diamond dresser should not be used free hand, (unless you have LOTS of cheap > >ones ;^) The diamond holder should be held in a controlled feed holder and, to > >get best life, it should be systematically indexed between jobs > > I use mine sort of freehand; handheld, but running against a jig. Works > great for me. > This actually brings up a question. Several times Lautard has said not to > tarry when using a diamond dresser; that it will make the wheel *too* smooth > and it won't cut quickly enough etc. etc., which I suppose is what you were > talking about it acting 'harder'. I've always gone reeeeeally slow with the > dresser to make sure I don't miss any spots, like, say 8 or 9 seconds per > inch.. Since I use the jig I can't dig past the depth I've set, so it > doesn't do any more 'work' as far as I can tell. Any thoughts on this? > > -- > Mike Graham, mikegraham at sprint dot ca > Caledon, Ontario, Canada (just NW of Toronto). > > Raiser of animals. Weldor of metals. Driver of off-road vehicles. > Writer of FAQs. Keeper of the faith, and all around okay guy. > > < homepage currently off-line due to change of ISP; back soon > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Some advice needed From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 16 Oct 1999 19:13:26 GMT -------- Jeff O'Malley wrote: > In todays market, what are the differences between a CNC lathe and a > "turning center"? Between a CNC vertical mill and a "vertical machining > center"? > I realize this is probably not a very smart question, but all help and > explanations will be helpful. > He is seriously thinking about opening a machine shop for aerospace > type developmental fabrication and small run production of parts. Jeff, please forgive me here, I am trying Hard not to make this sound like a "Smart Ass" reply! I do hope you won't take it as such...but as sage advice from one who truly has "Been there and Done that" Frankly if your son doesn't yet know the difference between a "Turning center" and a "CNC lathe" etc etc..(There isn't any difference...just Industryspeak and a Designer paint job!!) then he is NOT YET READY OR QUALIFIED to go into business for himself in any area of the Metalcutting Industry. Aerospace or otherwise. Sub contract machining etc is a JUNGLE where he will be eaten alive, not by competitors...there will be nothing left for them but the bones, by the time the CUSTOMERS have done screwing and picking him over. I don't care how good a craftsman ANYONE is..It is one thing to turn out stuff in your basement that makes family and friends say "Ooohh" It is a quite different thing to do that, day after day 24/7/365...Because that is the only way to pay for the level of equipment needed..NOT just to be able to compete, pricewise and make a profit, but to just get on the approved vendor list in the first place! Contract shops are known, for good reason, as the "Whores of the Mechanical World" available always to the highest bidder. There is no such thing as "Customer Loyalty"! Last delivery!..Next Price!! is all that counts. Your "Good Buddy" down at the plant had better be prepared to screw you or he will loose HIS job! So don't count on any favors when the chips are down! Ask him who is going to "Run the Shop"? Is he going to cut the metal and hire someone else to "Do the Books" "Get the Business" "Clean the Toilets" and head up all the other "Corporate Divisions" Don't laugh, even a one man business has to take care of every single one of those aspects...or go broke! Finally, Go buy him a copy of "The E-Myth Revisited" and have him learn it backwards before wasting another single moment's worth of his time "dreaming" Sorry to be the "Bad Guy" again..but someone needs to say it. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Aluminum casting? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 16 Oct 1999 20:57:56 GMT -------- Not a campfire... When I was a kid, the parents of a friend went out and left him/us, a LARGE can of Hienz Beanz to warm up for lunch. Totally unaware of the consequences, these were placed carefully, unvented, on the middle shelf of a HOT oven..... Fortunately, we were NOT in the kitchen when the can reached critical mass..or youse guys might have to be pickin' on someone else!! As I recall, by the time the debris stopped flying and the Sh*t hardened, the oven and a lot of the kitchen were unsalvageable. Lotsa energy in those Beanz! teenut kenneth knaell wrote: > > My uncle did the same thing with a can of baked beans in a campfire one > time. He talked about that for a long time. > Ken Knaell ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Fiberglassing From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 16 Oct 1999 21:07:15 GMT -------- In order to give a one line url "Geoff Merryweather." Self professed spamblocker and protecter of our bandwidth, wrote: > > On Sat, 16 Oct 1999 23:25:32 +0000, Andrew Roberts > wrote: > > >I know it is not metalworking, but I thought someone might know the answer. > > > >I am making a mould for a seat out of polystyrene (styrofoam I think you call > >it) and I need to know how to go about it. Can plaster of paris stick to my > >mould? -there are a few holes and bit taken out where there shouldn't be. > >After the mould is smooth what do I do to stop the fibreglass from sticking > >to the mould? > try http://www.fibreglast.com/ > -- > Radar detector FAQ, Forte Agent automation FAQ, bathroom fan FAQ > and THE WORLDS BEST CHRISTMAS PUDDING RECIPE are at http://www.poboxes.com/geoff_m > REMOVE "DELETEME" SPAMBLOCKER FROM ADDRESS TO REPLYTO USENET POSTINGS > **Telecom introduces 2 cent/min tax on internet use for residential customers of other Internet Service Providers. Sign the Petition against this at: http://www.talk.co.nz/0867/ Does anyone else see the ludicracy of this? teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: MSC made my jaw drop!!! From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 16 Oct 1999 21:22:38 GMT -------- Or disappear totally! As happened a couple of months ago to me. The UPS driver one-handed me a LARGE battered carton clearly labeled "Heavy" and with a "70 kg" sticker over top of which was handwritten the now legendary, legend "parts Missing" You're not kidding "Parts Missing" Like an entire 12" diameter Troyke horizontal/vertical rotary table!! It never did turn up, and eventually I got a refund..But I still wonder if anyone at UPS heard it hit the floor and roll out the door! teenut Jens wrote: > Seems that a lot of UPS drivers aren't too pleased with the high > weight limit and stuff like that will take a lot of sh*t and abuse. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Dressing grinding wheels; Was: drill sharpening FAQ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 16 Oct 1999 22:49:32 GMT -------- Whatever you say Mike 8^) teenut Mike Graham wrote: > > On Sat, 16 Oct 1999 18:35:08 GMT, Robert Bastow wrote: > > >Should have known the "rules" don't apply to Mike!! ;^) > > I've been using the same single diamond point for about 10 years, so I > must be doing *something* right. It gets used about weekly, on all of the > stones even the 8" rock on the rough grinder. > > >Dwelling on the wheel will overheat and crack the diamond. > > I don't agree with this. Since the depth of cut is set and can't be > changed, why would it overheat? After a couple of revolutions of the wheel > the diamond should have removed all it's going to remove, and after that > it's just sittin' in the wind getting cooled down. I'll have to try feeling > the diamond after using it. My only worry with it is taking too deep a cut > and nicking the brass that holds the diamond in place. > > >There are "jigs" and "JIGS" Yes, with care, correct presentation angles etc., > >you can dress, even a surface grinder wheel, "By Hand"...many systems are not > >much removed from this. The diamond being pushed by hand or lever. It is the > >RATE of such pushing, the DEPTH of cut and the ANGLE of the diamond to the wheel > >that is likely to cause a biginner problems. > > > >But that isn't "Freehand" which is what I was originally asked about. > > Well, my 'jig' amounts to a collar on the dresser that rides along the > front edge of the toolrest. I lay the dresser flat on the tool rest, and > move it from the left to the right in one pass. Are you saying that I'd be > better off doing several fast passes instead of one slow one? > > >For "freehand" dressing of a bench grinding wheel you can't do better than a > >star wheel dresser. > > I like the diamond because it allows me to get the face of the wheel > parallel with the toolrest which makes life simpler when I'm using it. > > -- > Mike Graham, mikegraham at sprint dot ca > Caledon, Ontario, Canada (just NW of Toronto). > > Raiser of animals. Weldor of metals. Driver of off-road vehicles. > Writer of FAQs. Keeper of the faith, and all around okay guy. > > < homepage currently off-line due to change of ISP; back soon > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Dressing grinding wheels; Was: drill sharpening FAQ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 17 Oct 1999 01:39:23 GMT -------- Mike Graham wrote: > > On Sat, 16 Oct 1999 19:54:07 -0400, Gary Coffman wrote: > > >The textbooks say that moving the diamond quickly will essentially > >"thread" the wheel, which makes it softer and more aggressive > >cutting. Moving the diamond slowly will give a harder and less > >aggressive wheel which will produce a finer finish on the work. > > It was this 'threading' effect that I was trying to avoid. At the time I > couldn't imagine any reason why you would want a serrated surface on a > grinding wheel. I suppose for roughing it might make sense, but I still > have a hard time imagining a good reason for doing that on a finishing > wheel. Gary is right on the money there Mike Think of it like the spiral toothed, roughing end mill that we discussed earlier, Mike..though the face is "threaded" it won't produce a "thread" across the work..unless it is guided at the same pitch as in thread grinding. There is however less of the wheel in contact at any given moment = less heat, "easier", deeper cutting, but faster wear!! The opposite extreme is a wheel face that has been "dressed into submission"!! It is SO smooth, that, while it can, with care produce a finish finer than its grit size..it is very slow cutting and easy to "burn" the work. "Burning" happens when the work suddenly reaches a temperature where a spot on the face gets into a momentary "Chain reaction"..The spot expands locally, digs into the wheel, expands more, digs deeper..This happens in a split second and can ruin the workpiece by leaving marks too deep to grind out. Not only that, I have seen jobs so buckled by the heat that they lift right off the table. I have also seen wheels burst by the sudden expansion of the job against the wheel..in one case a 24" diameter x 4" wide cylindrical grinder wheel! The operator, a highly skilled toolmaker, shakily lit a cigarette, told me he was going to the pub for "a cup of tea" walked out and the following day got a job as a truck driver!! It can happen, even to an "Expert"..but is a noted "tyro's" disease, because it is generally caused by "Too much care" That is, in trying too hard, to get the finish "perfect' the wheel is dressed juuust a little too smooth, and traversed juuuust a little too slowly on that last cut! Some materials..Stainless steel and titanium for example can be really troublesome to finish grind because of this phenomenon. You really do have to have your ducks in a row on wheel choice, dressing, speeds feeds coolant....etc, or it will turn you grey before your time! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: what is wrought iron? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 17 Oct 1999 02:37:33 GMT -------- Wrought Iron is made by "puddling" in a "Puddling Furnace" Scrap iron is remelted in an open hearth type furnace and once molten is stirred by "Puddlers"..Guys using long wooden "Puddling sticks" As the carbon and other impurities are burned off the melting temperature starts to rise and the liquid iron starts to "Puddle"..that is, because it has a higher melting point now, higher than the temperature they are able to achieve, the metal starts to partialy solidify into a pasty mass. After many, many hours at heat and constant puddling, only the non reducible elements of the slag are left in the iron..mainly silica. This slag has a lower melting point than the pasty iron but is trapped in the matrix of iron and cannot be poured off. Large lumps of the puddled iron called "Blooms" are hauled from the furnace and taken to the "Bloom mill" where they are pounded endlessly by big guys with big hammers (in Yorkshire) or by trip hammers, tilt hammers and the like in more "weeny" parts of the world. The effect of this pounding is two fold..it actually raises the temperature of the iron!! (Just as a blacksmith can light his fire by pounding on a piece of cold iron 'til it glows) This further liquifies the slag and it is ejected from the bloom in brilliant jets and streamers. All the time the bloom is turned and turned again under the hammers until no more can be done. The metal starts to cool rapidly and, after final forging into an ingot it is hauled away to the rolling mill for further processing. Wrought Iron, therefore consists of almost pure iron, interspersed with fine threads of slag, mainly silaceous in nature. It is a joy to forge and forge weld, the slag acting as a natural flux. Hey guys, there were certain advantages to being around in the 14th century!! teenut mike II wrote: > > TmcGroup wrote: > > NO idea what "wrought iron" is. > > A long time ago (pre 1400/pre Bastow???) the only way they could get the > iron out of the ore was with the use of charcoal for heating. Things > could be forged from the lumps of iron that melted out of the ore. The > impurity content was pretty high because of the slag and non metallic > debris. These impurities had the added effect of making the metal easier > to shape/work, hence the word 'wrought'. > > mike ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Allowed Amperes in a Conductor Contest.. From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 17 Oct 1999 02:45:35 GMT -------- On the size of his pockets! Our Band Conductor wor a big chap! I know for a fact he could get ower a ston' o'spuds in 'is cap. I'll bet 'e cud get 10 pounds of raisins and as many punds of currents in 'is pockets! teenut mike II (Seriously expecting anyone to take him seriously) wrote: > > On what is the current carrying capacity of a conductor based on? > > mike ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Newbie: Cam-Lock Safety From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 17 Oct 1999 03:06:27 GMT -------- I take no legal responsibility for the following statements... Firstly the camlock studs, retaining threads, cam sizes etc are all carefully sized so that, by rotating the stud forward or backwards and then replacing the lock screw, the correct locking relationship of stud and lock can be obtained UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES!! (those threads, cut outs etc didn't just pop out of the air onto someones drawing board. Nor are the arrows ther "Just for Pretty") The locking screw should always be turned in the direction of the arrow. so that: A) it can readily be observed to be correctly locked B) It can be checked for tightness with no danger of actually LOOSENING it. C) it can be loosened by turning contra the arrows..all in the same direction and avoiding the danger of overtightening one by turning it in a direction that SHOULD loosen it. Finally, it is a good check on whether the studs etc are in good condition and properly adjusted and tightened! Now I am sure that isn't the answer you were hoping for! The chances are that you can adjust the position of the studs (Hint..try swapping them from threaded hole to threaded hole) If you can't get them all to lock by turning in the correct direction..chances are they are worn or stretched to the danger point. Replace them!! For your own safety, and for the safety of the next person to use that lathe. The choice is yours of course...but your ignorance can no longer be claimed to be blissful 8^) Teenut George Glines wrote: > > After reading the thread where someone got killed by a cam-lock chuck > coming off, I thought I'd ask. . > > My SB Heavy 10 has a D1-4 Camlock Spindle. This one has three studs. > Theoretically, you lock the cams by turning them to the right. This is the > direction that the arrow points to on the spindle. > > Does it matter if you lock to the right or the left? None of the > attachments I have (3-jaw chuck, 4-jaw chuck, spindle protector, drive > plate) will allow me to turn all the cams to the right. Every attachment is > different. Some all turn to the left, most have two studs that I turn right > and then one left. I can feel the studs locking, so I know they are all > engaged. I can't reposition the studs on the attachments because they are > all held by locking screws. > > Do I have a problem or may I return to my formal blissful ignorance? > > Thanks, > > George ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Look at this? More Al Babin From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 17 Oct 1999 03:10:30 GMT -------- Alan Mimms wrote: > > Robert you worthless SOB Is THAT the best you can do Alan? My this IS a polite list! You need to listen in on a few of the alt. lists to expand your vocabluary! 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: what is wrought iron? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 17 Oct 1999 03:27:08 GMT -------- Jeez Don, I don't know where you got that encyclopaedia but it gave you the biggest load of Horse hockey I ever heard on wrought Iron. Probably because the authors were thoroughly confused or drunk at the time. Wrought iron predates the Bessemer process by hundreds of years and I can categorically tell you the Bessermer process NEVER NEVER NEVER figured in the making of wrought iron. Bessemers's process is a STEEL making process.first last and always. teenut Don Wilkins wrote: > > On 16 Oct 1999 19:33:15 GMT, tmcgroup@aol.com (TmcGroup) wrote: > > >Hi group, > > > >I've worked with 1018, 1045, 1141, S-7 and other assorted steels over the years > >but have NO idea what "wrought iron" is. > > > >Can anyone enlighten me? > > Encyclopedia definition..... > > > wrought iron > commercially purified IRON. In the Aston process, pig iron is refined > in a Bessemer converter and then poured into molten iron-silicate > slag. The resulting semisolid mass is passed between rollers that > squeeze out most of the slag. Wrought iron is tough, malleable, > ductile, and corrosion-resistant, and melts only at high temperature. > It is used to make ornamental ironwork, rivets, bolts, pipes, chains, > and anchors. > > The above suggests the need for the "poor bastard" Mike mentions > sitting there with the paddle stirring the mix until it is ready to > pour. It would take some stirring since there are two phases present. > > The final material has a fibrous structure. > > I wonder if this is somewhat similar to what occurs in the tungsten > filaments which also have a fibrous structure due to the added > silicates. In this case (tungsten filaments) the silicates control > grain growth. There is no one sitting there with a paddle in this case > as the as the tungsten is not poured from the melt. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Steady bearings From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 17 Oct 1999 05:47:53 GMT -------- Sounds like a couple or three possibilities..all combining together..these things are never simple!! Firstly, the lube: As Doug has pointed out, slideway lube is not for this application (Don't get me started on slideway lube again!!) ;^) Absent anything else, EP cutting oil is ok, EP gear oil is better. Speed and heat + stainless steel. Some grades of stainless have high coeficients of thermal expansion compounded by their low thermal conductivity means greater local expansion. The forces involved when your shaft expanded may well have been enough to simply crumble away the bronze. Especially if it were a cast alloy. It makes good practice to constantly relieve the pressure on steady points (tailstock points too) Many times you can hear the "grunt" of relief when you loosen up the binders!! teenut Doug Goncz wrote: > > >for this job, the nearest handy lubricant for > >the steady was an aerosol of slideway lubricant, so I used that. > > That's a low pressure lube. A high pressure lube like grease, or poisonous > white lead is better for the high loads of a steady rest. > > Polishing the shaft section in contact with the steady will reduce the wear, > but the lube is essential. > > I suppose stainless can weld to bronze under the pressure. Tribology. Maybe > overheated the bronze. > > An extreme pressure lube like sulphured oil is used for thread cutting, and > should work fine on a steady rest. > > Yours, > > Doug Goncz, A.A.S.M.E.T. > Experimental Machinist ( DOT 600.260-022 ) > Replikon Research ( USA 22044-0094 ) > > http://www.deja.com/profile.xp?author=dgoncz@aol > http://users.aol.com/DGoncz ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Newbie: Cam-Lock Safety From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 17 Oct 1999 07:04:41 GMT -------- You are dead right George. The studs are not supposed to be tight and it would be dangerous if they were. If you look at the studs there is (Should be!!) a witness line scribed around each one, just where it disappears into the backplate. Ideally this line should be right at the face..sorta half in, half out, when the cutout for the lockscrew aligns with the lockscrew pocket. This not being a perfect world..it is not often that all three land dead on the middle of the line..but the line is about .020" wide and as the pitch of the stud thread is 20 tpi we have a full turn equal to a movement of .040" It is therefore possible to get the ring somewhere between just fully "buried" and just fully "exposed" in the stud pocket. Usually, (I guess it is a normal distribution curve) the majority finish up with the ring more closely centered on the edge of the pocket. If the studs and camlocks are in good shape, then the camlock will lock up correctly, by turning in the direction of the arrow (clockwise) and will come to that locked position after turning somewhere between 15 and 175 degrees from the release position. Anywhere within that quite broad arc is acceptable, and will give a secure lock up Because of the shape of the cams and notches, that represents a quite wide range of movement..enough so that the accumulated assembly tolerances can be quite wide. Most times you can chuck any three pegs into any three holes, screw them in so that the ring is in the neighborhood of the edge of the pocket, fine tune (Turn) so you can get the lock screw in...and it works fine. But not always!! 8^( One peg out of every three or four might give a lock up position that you are not totaly comfortable with...Either the cam balks when you try to turn it, or it locks up to soon or too late (less than 15 degrees or more than 175 degrees and I start to get a bit nervous). So off comes the chuck, out with the lock screw, one full turn of the peg, back with the lockscrew...Back on with the chuck, try the camlocks again and USUALLY, (like 90% of the time), that fixes it. all three cama lock within the acceptable arc and we are ready to cut metal! But not always!! 8^( Every so often you will find a peg/hole/cam combination that plumb just don't belong together! no matter which way you turn and lock the peg into the chuck backplate, it just will NOT give a good lockup. One way it is to tight, back it off a turn and it is too loose! Now is the time for a bit of SELECTIVE assembly (And I am sure that they do this at the factory too!) Take off the chuck. Again!! More often than not there is one of the pegs that locks up just perfectly..dead center. Leave that alone! But pull the other two out and switch them round in their pockets, readjust and voila..perfect lockup! But not always!! 8^( Once or twice in my life, I have had that fail...one or two pegs just didn't work no matter how I swapped or adjusted them. OK, Which of your OTHER chucks has a peg that, while you have lived with it so far, you were never 100% happy with it. Well now is the time to fix BOTH those suckers!! Switch them around and chances are you will have the perfect lockup you seek. (I already have my eye on one peg in my largest faceplate that is the candidate for the next time ;^) Forgive me for going into so much (to some tedious) detail. But George contacted me off list too, and that usually means that my first explanation wasn't clear enough..or I had skipped over or confused an important detail somewhere. Camlocks are IMHO by far the best spindle nose configuration ever devised. I wouldn't choose any other. But they can be a bit trickier to set up than first imagined, They are a bit more complex in design parameters than most people EVER realise! But once set up properly they will give a lifetime of secure accurate service. And to answer the last part of your question George...No there is nothing wrong with your spindle nose. Just a combination of the way it needs to be adjusted, and the confusion I caused in my last response. I hope I have helped clear up on both accounts! 8^) teenut George Glines wrote: > > Robert, > > How can you adjust the position of the studs on the attachments? There is a > cut-out on the bottom of each stud for the locking screw to fit it. It > doesn't allow for the studs to be turned, other than a little looseness, > unless you took the locking screw out completely. I wouldn't be able to > reinstall the locking screw then, because the little cut-out groove would be > out of position. In other words, if you tighten the studs completely, the > locking screws can't fit back in, because the cut-out for the screw is out > of position. > > Also, none of the studs are tight on any of the tooling (chucks, drive > plate, spindle protector) for the same reason. It isn't from wear: the > drive plate, lathe backplate, 4-jaw and spindle protector were original > (1976) but never used. The 3-jaw that came with the lathe looks to be a > Bison, but without a lot of use. The fact that NONE of these had tight > studs, and none of them would tighten on the spindle the "correct" way led > me to believe that was how it was supposed to work. > > Could the problem be with the spindle nose? > > Many thanks, > > George > > Robert Bastow wrote in message > news:38093E25.CC7B4260@home.com... > > I take no legal responsibility for the following statements... > > > > Firstly the camlock studs, retaining threads, cam sizes etc are all > carefully > > sized so that, by rotating the stud forward or backwards and then > replacing the > > lock screw, the correct locking relationship of stud and lock can be > obtained > > UNDER ANY CIRCUMSTANCES!! (those threads, cut outs etc didn't just pop > out of > > the air onto someones drawing board. Nor are the arrows ther "Just for > Pretty") > > > > The locking screw should always be turned in the direction of the arrow. > so > > that: > > > > A) it can readily be observed to be correctly locked B) It can be checked > for > > tightness with no danger of actually LOOSENING it. C) it can be loosened > by > > turning contra the arrows..all in the same direction and avoiding the > danger of > > overtightening one by turning it in a direction that SHOULD loosen it. > > > > Finally, it is a good check on whether the studs etc are in good condition > and > > properly adjusted and tightened! > > > > Now I am sure that isn't the answer you were hoping for! The chances are > that > > you can adjust the position of the studs (Hint..try swapping them from > threaded > > hole to threaded hole) > > > > If you can't get them all to lock by turning in the correct > direction..chances > > are they are worn or stretched to the danger point. Replace them!! For > your own > > safety, and for the safety of the next person to use that lathe. > > > > The choice is yours of course...but your ignorance can no longer be > claimed to > > be blissful > > > > 8^) > > > > Teenut > > > > George Glines wrote: > > > > > > After reading the thread where someone got killed by a cam-lock chuck > > > coming off, I thought I'd ask. . > > > > > > My SB Heavy 10 has a D1-4 Camlock Spindle. This one has three studs. > > > Theoretically, you lock the cams by turning them to the right. This is > the > > > direction that the arrow points to on the spindle. > > > > > > Does it matter if you lock to the right or the left? None of the > > > attachments I have (3-jaw chuck, 4-jaw chuck, spindle protector, drive > > > plate) will allow me to turn all the cams to the right. Every > attachment is > > > different. Some all turn to the left, most have two studs that I turn > right > > > and then one left. I can feel the studs locking, so I know they are all > > > engaged. I can't reposition the studs on the attachments because they > are > > > all held by locking screws. > > > > > > Do I have a problem or may I return to my formal blissful ignorance? > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > George ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How to make brass or aluminum tokens? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 17 Oct 1999 07:27:18 GMT -------- slindsay@nyx.net wrote: > > Just read my post.... So did I and enjoyed it immensly..emormen..LOTS! Thank you, Please tell us more. teenut Who will tackle anything that requires the cutting of Straight!! But is reduced to quivering jelly by the teeniest little non-mathematically defineable curve. DOWN PETE! I am talking about the engraver's art..NOT the girl next door! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lapping plates... where to find? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 17 Oct 1999 19:22:22 GMT -------- Try a pet store! Kittens use them all the time. teenut Mike Graham wrote: > > Does anyone still sell lapping plates? > > -- > Mike Graham, mikegraham at sprint dot ca > Caledon, Ontario, Canada (just NW of Toronto). > > Raiser of animals. Weldor of metals. Driver of off-road vehicles. > Writer of FAQs. Keeper of the faith, and all around okay guy. > > < homepage currently off-line due to change of ISP; back soon > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Common Household objects as power feeds From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 17 Oct 1999 19:28:07 GMT -------- Yeh! SUNBEAM! I have been wracking my brains to remember the brand name. Anyway, with dual contra-rotating PTOs and variable speeds..they make dandy power feed units. teenut Roger Duncan wrote: > > That would not be a KitchenAid but maybe a Sunbeam or such with dual > mixing blades that intermesh. > > On Sat, 16 Oct 1999 17:41:05 GMT, mikegraham@sprint.ca (Mike Graham) > wrote: > > >On Sat, 16 Oct 1999 17:02:03 GMT, Robert Bastow wrote: > > > >>No need to look inside Boris..The ones I used had two contra-rotating PTO > >>points!! > > > > Hmm... I've never seen that before. Maybe this was a *really* old model. > > > >-- > >Mike Graham, mikegraham at sprint dot ca > >Caledon, Ontario, Canada (just NW of Toronto). > > > >Raiser of animals. Weldor of metals. Driver of off-road vehicles. > >Writer of FAQs. Keeper of the faith, and all around okay guy. > > > > < homepage currently off-line due to change of ISP; back soon > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Another Update - Cutting Aluminum w/Carbide Blade!!!! From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 17 Oct 1999 19:33:04 GMT -------- I have no Idea what brands or grades are available any more! Sorry teenut Ted Edwards wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > Yes I know WD40 works..but PLEASE do as I suggested, and use a stick lubricant. > > Any particular "stick lubricant" you would recommend? > > Ted ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: what is wrought iron? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 17 Oct 1999 23:20:46 GMT -------- Definitely caught me on terminology if not on technology..To me, all "Scrap Iron" is cast iron and includes pig iron. (as opposed to "scrap steel" ) Comes from the time I spent in an Iron Foundry as a "Yoot" And the burning off of impurities Is of course an oxidising process not a reduction..at the time of writing, my mind was off in terms of "reducing iron to a purer form" william thomas powers wrote: > > Nope; you don't make wrought iron from scrap--- ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: what is wrought iron? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 17 Oct 1999 23:44:48 GMT -------- > >The "Byers" process: take pig iron and run it through the Bessemer > >to get molten mild steel. Then pour the steel into the molten slag > >and mix then off to the hammers/rollers Really has got my curiosity aroused as to why someone would take a superior product (Mid 20th C mild steel) and turn it into an inferior product (wrought Iron) Using the Bessemer process to make wrought iron is kinda like using a cnc mill to rough out parts for finishing on a Lincoln Mill. Obviously there must have been a demand for wrought iron much later here in the US than there was in the UK..only place I ever heard of it was in history books!! Not ever being into structural steel, anchor chains or Anachronistic Happenings...What was the Wrought Iron in demand for in the Mid-20th Century? 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Steel Making History. Henry Bessemer From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 00:11:50 GMT -------- For those with an interest in learning more about steel and iron making history, in particular the Bessemer steel process: http://www.bibliomania.com/NonFiction/Bessemer/Autobiography/index.html teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Need advice - Small lathe From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 05:05:05 GMT -------- No! teenut Jack Erbes wrote: > Am I the only guy that on the group that doesn't find it easier to do it > the hard way? > > -- > Jack in Sonoma, CA, USA (jack@vom.com) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: what is wrought iron? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 06:13:29 GMT -------- william thomas powers wrote: >teenut > > Thomas who tries not to spill his hot beverages in his lap > (every time I see your handle all I can think of is YOUCH!) Awe come on William Thomas! You more than hold your own, and you sure make me use the "brain-chek" when I know I am on your subject. ;^) You'll be telling me you're "Just a Simple Country Boy" next! (It didn't stop you pulling me up dead on the "Scrap Iron" remark either!!) I asked an honest question: > >Really has got my curiosity aroused as to why someone would take a superior > >product (Mid 20th C mild steel) and turn it into an inferior product (wrought > >Iron) And you said.. > There you go using loaded terms again! I figured that would get your attention!! ;^) >This "inferior" product is much > superior to mild steel for certain uses. In the USA it hung on for such > things as bridges down in Florida, it makes a long lasting fence wire > (back in 1907 there was a government inquiry on why the "new" mild steel > fences were all rusting out), it also takes a heavier zinc layer when > galvinizing. My stash came from a water tower built in the 1920's. > WI corrosion resistance was a big help before some of the stainless > steels became economical to use. So it is mainly the corrosion resistance properties that made it hang on..not any mechanical properties. Hey, I can understand and accept that much better that to think that someone in "Bridge Building Authority" thought that somehow Wrought Iron was better (stronger, tougher, more reliable etc) than the MS of that era. Or if indeed it was..It doesn't say a great deal about the strength of their MS! I feel real nervous about crossing bridges all of a sudden! > You know as a smith I find cast iron to be pretty much totally > worthless; however I keep hearing that folk like to machine stuff > out of it; perhaps we should go easy on the value judgements... I wasn't making a value judgement Tom..I was asking a question and stating a fact! 8^) > > >Using the Bessemer process to make wrought iron is kinda like using a cnc mill > >to rough out parts for finishing on a Lincoln Mill. > > No its a matter of getting your raw material as quickly and as easily > and then mixing your metal to suit yourself. If you think of Wrought iron > as a composite material---which is what it really is--- then the idea > of taking both materials and making your composite from them doesn't > seem so strange---I mean is is any screwier than taking high grade > carbon fibre and mixing it with resin?" That makes sense, especially now I understand better WHY any one would have continued to manufacture WI in the 20th Century..which was my question that follows: > > >Obviously there must have been a demand for wrought iron much later here in the > >US than there was in the UK..only place I ever heard of it was in history > >books!! > >Not ever being into structural steel, anchor chains or Anachronistic > >Happenings...What was the Wrought Iron in demand for in the Mid-20th Century? > And you gave me some dang good reasons: > Well ships, chemical factories, bridges, And then a coupla bad (Commercial) ones: > demented blacksmiths---its all Yellin used, (or Tijou for that matter). Absolutely agree with you on the fact that these, and other, great ornamental smiths did their best work in WI..For the Blacksmith, anything else is a poor substitute. But one Bessemer Converter load would have taken care of their needs for most of a lifetime...I just couldn't see anyone being in commercial production just to satisfy the ornamental demand. The reason it died out was that > it was more expensive to make and you couldn't make it from scrap steel > like we make A36 these days. A36!! %#*^&#$&..Don't get me started on THAT #%@&&*%^#$ stuff! ;^) >It also has some characterisitcs that > can make it harder to work with---like yield strength differing between > the rolling axis and the non rolling access and the green stick fracture. Which is why I would rather have my bridges made out of Good 'Ole Mild steel and painted regularly..thank you very much! Which I think is why it may have been obsoleted much earlier in the UK. (Any UK guys know when WI ceased to be used for structural purposes?) For that matter when DID it cease to be used/manufactured on a large scale in the USA? One report I read said the the Titanic would not have sunk had it been made of steel rather than WI. (Confessing I heard that third or fourth hand and VERY willing to be corrected by "Them as knows") > OTOH it forge welds like a dream---there are pictures of shops that > need a large shaft just stacking up wrought iron till they get large > enough and then welding it and turning it, say for a 19" dia shaft! > > When forging it likes to work at a temperature that would have mild > steel burning up---but at that temperature it is so plastic that you > can tie knots in it! > > The Byers' book has four pages of suggested uses everything from > trash gratings on hydroelectric power plants to underground pipelines > for the petroleum industry,heat exchangers for ships---look up the book > if you really want to know what it was used for. > > "Wrought Iron" James Aston and Edward Story > Thank you for a very informative response. You have answered a lot of questions that, until Yesterday, I didn't even know I HAD!! You have also posed a lot more and roused my interest in the subject, so I am going to add the above book to my collection! Do you know the Publisher and date? Thanks, teenut BOO! ;^) Gotcha agin! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: what is wrought iron? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 06:20:38 GMT -------- Tom Stovall wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > [deletia] > > >Really has got my curiosity aroused as to why someone would take a >superior product (Mid 20th C mild steel) and turn it into an inferior >product (wrought Iron)... > > Compared to mild steel, wrought iron is easier to forge, forge weld, and > doesn't need to be finished. From a blacksmith's perspective, for > ornamental projects, wrought iron is superior to mild steel. > > Tom Stovall CJF > Farrier & Blacksmith Absolutely no arguement with that Tom..I like to work in WI myself (when I can get it) My question though, was on the commercial side of steel production..why would anyone take perfectly good MS and turn it into WI? WT Powers answered that..and, much as we would like it to be the case, it wasn't then, it isn't now, and it (sadly) never will be, to supply the needs of ornamental or anachronistic Blacksmiths. 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Why Cold-Rolled? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 06:27:41 GMT -------- Exact other way round!! Hot rolled is relatively stress free. Cold rolled has all kinds of stresses locked up in it! Never use coldrolled (Unless it is annealed first) for any job requiring anything but minor machining! It will twist like a pretzel on you, and KEEP on moving! You never will be able to pin it down to any precise tolerences. teenut Phil Juvet wrote: > > I was told (taught) that hot rolled steel develops internal stresses during the > cooling period in the manufacturing process, and will sometimes warp after the > machining process. CRS is free of this problem. > > PJ > > Gary Coffman wrote: > > > On Sun, 17 Oct 1999 11:14:04 GMT, mikegraham@sprint.ca (Mike Graham) wrote: > > > I've been looking at plans for little shop jigs and such, and I was going > > >to make a flycutter, but I noticed that plans for thing like that invariably > > >specify cold-rolled steel. I've got drill-rod for the spindle, and I happen > > >to have a foot-long chunk of 1"x2" mild steel. I fail to see why CRS would > > >be any better for this, especially when you have to take such pains with > > >stress-relieving it and whatnot. > > > Any thoughts? > > > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Was: What's this metal. From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 06:40:39 GMT -------- Would that it were that easy Anthony, but you can't separate two alloyed metals like that, anymore than you can separate any other mixture of solutions. If this really is a found lump of native metal you need first of all to take it to an ASSAY office..for a nominal fee they will tell you what it is. Then go see if there is more where you found it (assuming this wasn't the local land fill or behind the local foundry. ;^) If there is...GET A LAWYER and Register a Claim!! Any metal found in a native form (Lump of metallic material) is potentially valuable in quantity..be it Zinc or Gold! Don't tell anyone else where it is and carry a gun! Them pesky claim jumptin' bushwackers are everywhere!! teenut Anthrhodes wrote: > > >You can't > >melt the clump, as the gold would melt too. > > Zinc melts at a bit over 400 deg. Celcius, Gold at over 1000 deg. Celcius. I > think you could melt the Zinc to see if any Gold seperates out from it. > > Anthony ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lapping plates... where to find? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 06:47:54 GMT -------- Judging by your language Marlene you watch quite a lot of TV yourself. teenut Marlene wrote: > > Fuck you, he asked a legitimate question. I can see this is just > another fuck stick ng, probably loaded with WEBtvers! > > mike II wrote: > > > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > > > Try a pet store! > > > > > > Kittens use them all the time. > > > > > > > Lap dogs do good work too! > > > > mike ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Why Cold-Rolled? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 06:53:10 GMT -------- JEEZ Ken! Where do you buy your cold rolled? I want some JUST like it! All my Hot Rolled machines a LOT nicer that Cold Rolled. Are you sure you are not mixing them up? 8^) teenut kenneth knaell wrote: > > The few times I've done similar machining operations on CRS and hot rolled > mild steel. I felt that CRS machined nicer and was less gummy than hot > rolled. It was not as easy machining as leaded or screw machine stock > though. I guess what I observed was that you could turn the feed in a .001" > on a final cut and remove something like a .001" instead of having the > surface work harden and gall like hot rolled does. Since the cold rolled is > already work hardened thruout this does make a little sense. > > So to answer Mikes original question - I thinke it machines a little nicer > than hot rolled. > Ken Knaell > > Gary Coffman wrote in message <2RwKOP=M27lYmRs+fskAjkD2+JfX@4ax.com>... > >On Sun, 17 Oct 1999 11:14:04 GMT, mikegraham@sprint.ca (Mike Graham) wrote: > >> I've been looking at plans for little shop jigs and such, and I was > going > >>to make a flycutter, but I noticed that plans for thing like that > invariably > >>specify cold-rolled steel. I've got drill-rod for the spindle, and I > happen > >>to have a foot-long chunk of 1"x2" mild steel. I fail to see why CRS > would > >>be any better for this, especially when you have to take such pains with > >>stress-relieving it and whatnot. > >> Any thoughts? > > > >CRS is usually specified when mild steel is an acceptable material > >because CRS is cheap and starts out with a reasonable surface finish. > >A more expensive steel can be substituted, if you don't mind the additional > >expense. Or you can use hot rolled steel if you're going to cut or grind it > >enough to eliminate the mill scale. > > > >Gary > >Gary Coffman KE4ZV | You make it |mail to ke4zv@bellsouth.net > >534 Shannon Way | We break it | > >Lawrenceville, GA | Guaranteed | ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Neat toolbox........ From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 07:11:38 GMT -------- Tom, it sounds like you found the OTHER one! I knew that MY Wife could not possibly be the only Perfect HSMers Partner. Congratulations! The "Project Center" sounds great..But did you say "moulded" cup holders?..As in plastic? Is the whole thing plastic? Please don't think I am trying to rain on your parade, but you might want to think that through before buying it (or putting it into service if you have already) One good stream of chips from your Burke "ThunderMill" will reduce it to a soggy shapeless pile on the floor...That's what happened to my shop vac. <(8^( A Metal cabinet might be more serviceable... 8^) teenut Tom wrote: > > Hello all, > Well,now that I have my Burke Mill up and running,I soon realized that > I needed some sort of work surface/tool tray near by the mill,and some > place to put the 6" Kurt-clone vice when it wasn't in use. > I decided that a roller tool chest would work well.Flat top,plus some > drawers to put all the most important and often used tools/end > mills/parallels/etc in,and I could roll it over by the lathe when > working there also. > I mentioned my quandry to my wonderful wife,and told her I was going to > look at Sears etc to see what they had......... > Bless her soul,she says that she'd buy me whatever I decided on for an > early Christmas present!! Gotta love her most days,especially > lately,she's taking this new mill deal well in stride.(Showing her that > $3500 BP awhile back turned out to be a good move on my part,especially > in light of discovering the Burke deal) > > We get to Sears,and discover their latest nifty little deal.A five > drawer unit they call a "project center".Standard lower portion,5 nice > size drawers,3.5" castors etc,but on top rests a neat compartmentalized > plastic assembly with a sliding sheetmetal covered top. > A bunch of nice sized compartments around the edge,and a large area > under the top that can be divided up however you want.I even found that > it nicely holds my 9 x12x3" suface plate!! Plenty sturdy enough to hold > the vice too. > And the best part?? > CUPHOLDERS!!! 2 of 'em molded into the back edge of the top!!! > Got to have it!! > On sale in this weeks circular for $169.95 > > Go take a look............... > Tom ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Tool Drool Time From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 08:11:42 GMT -------- http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=183411546 teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Why Cold-Rolled? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 08:56:16 GMT -------- Engineman1 wrote: When something like you described > happened my fellow machinists would say "oops, there's a ball bearing". I had almost come to think that that was a thing of the past...'Til I ran into exactly thet..a ball bearing inclusion in a 4140 barrel blank I was turning down to finish size. As the barrel (.505 cliber) had already been threaded chambered and headspaced, I was NOT a happy camper! Close examination showed no sign of it in the bore, and a bit of careful measurement of exposed diameter vs distance to go showed it would all come out just before I hit finished muzzle diameter (it was about 4" from the muzzle end) so I pressed on. THAT was a long night!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Why won't halfnut work when cutting metric threads? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 12:46:12 GMT -------- Ah, would that it were so simple. But it isn't. 8^( That only works when the pitch being cut is a factor of the leadscrew pitch, and is the "Olde Fashioned Waye" used before thread dial indicators were common. With metric pitches, of course, the pitch being cut never is an exact factor of the leadscrew pitch, so it doesn't work. Period! I will leave you to figure the math out. 8^) Hint. It would work if you put a white paint mark on one tooth of each wheel in the gear train. Then having set your carriage, you wait until all the paintmarks line up again, before engaging the halfnuts. It takes a LOOOONG time for that happy circumstance to re-occur. IIRC the Hardinge and others, use, not only a single dog clutch to engage forward direction of the lead screw, but reverse too, and have a tumbler reverse gear that maintains the relationshop of the leadscrew to the rest of the gear train at all times. Perhaps one of our Harding owners can elaborate on the exact system used. teenut Dennis Danich wrote: > > The half-nuts will work if you can return the saddle to the exact same > spot on the bed, and engage on the same number on the dial. > 1. mount a stop on the bed to the right of the saddle, presuming you > are cutting RH thread > 2. position this so the saddle touches this and the tool is in its > starting position to cut > 3. engage the halfnuts on the number 1 > 4. dissengage at the correct spot on the thread > 5. return saddle to the stop > 6. advance feed, engage on the number 1 again > 7. repeat > this should work, try on a piece of scrap, A Hardinge hlv toolroom > lathe never dissengages the leadscrew when threading, but the screw > only engages the drive in the same spot every time, so the correct > relationship is maintained, I have only needed tyo do this twice in 30 > years of being a maintnance machinist, worked both times, i'm either > lucky. or it works. > dennis > > On Sat, 16 Oct 1999 20:36:13 GMT, foxeye@ddyne.com (foxeye) wrote: > > >Our lathe has a metric and inch setup. This past week has been the > >first time I have ever had to cut metric threads. The half nut can't > >be used, and the crossfeed has to be backed out, and the cutting bit > >run back towards the tailstock, then adjusted into make another fresh > >cut, and then this is done over and over., until the threa is cut to > >spec. Can someone explain why the half nut works for inch, but not > >metric thread cutting? > >thanks > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Why Cold-Rolled? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 12:53:22 GMT -------- Wots the spec and who makes it? Unless it were "free machining" in one way or another, all the (Countless Tons) of cold rolled I ever cut were a lot "rougher" machining than hot rolled. All things are relative of course..Maybe your cold rolled feels good because you are just used to shitty hot rolled! ;^) teenut "Fitch R. Williams" wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > >Where do you buy your cold rolled? > > > >I want some JUST like it! > > > >All my Hot Rolled machines a LOT nicer that Cold Rolled. > > > >Are you sure you are not mixing them up? > > I buy my nice machining cold rolled at Industrial Metal Supply, San > Fernando Road, CA. Machines a lot better than the pink pearl hot > rolled stuff. > > Fitch > In So. Cal. > > The FAQ for RCM is: http://w3.uwyo.edu/~metal > Metal Web News at http://www.mindspring.com/~wgray1/ > The "Drop Box" is at http://www.metalworking.com/ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Neat toolbox........ From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 17:53:23 GMT -------- <(8^(+ Dunce's Cap (As in DUH!!) with frown, wide open eyes (Surprise) and a dimple!! teenut ;^) Mike Graham wrote: > > On Mon, 18 Oct 1999 08:03:29 -0400, TS wrote: > >Not to mention that the cup holders and anything else that can collect > >chips, will collect chips... > > > >Hey, Teenut.... <(8^( does that mean you have a pointy head, AND > >glasses? > > > >-Tony 8-{) .... glasses and mustache.... > > I'll see your glasses and a moustache and raise you a beard and a bald > head! > > (8-{)> > > -- > Mike Graham > (who actually has grown his winter hair and is not currently bald), > mikegraham at sprint dot ca > Caledon, Ontario, Canada (just NW of Toronto). > > Raiser of animals. Weldor of metals. Driver of off-road vehicles. > Writer of FAQs. Keeper of the faith, and all around okay guy. > > < homepage currently off-line due to change of ISP; back soon > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Some advice needed From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 18:54:45 GMT -------- Mike Graham wrote: I need > to point out that just because someone has 'been there and done that' > doesn't mean they necessarily know what they're talking about. > In closing, I do *not* consider the venerable Mr. Bastow to be > close-minded. At least, not in the face of contrary evidence. 8-) > I think that is the crux of the matter Mike and the fine line that "old Farts" have to walk! On the one hand, is the desire to pass on knowledge..some of it gained in the expensive, painful "School of Hard Knocks" But a lot of it gained from people who took the time to pass on THEIR experience and knowledge to ME..so that I didn't have to make all the mistakes myself!! As such, as the years pass, and your own Mentors shuffle on, one becomes increasingly aware that one has become a *temporary* repository of a vast accumulation of knowledge...most of it freely offered to anyone who would be willing to use it. There also comes and increasing awareness that this knowledge is yours "IN TRUST" and with it comes a responsibility! With increasing years, there comes too, an urgency, born of increased awareness of mortality. Mans achievements are the result of the SUM TOTAL of our discoveries, and we cannot EVER afford a hiatus in the passing of that knowledge from one generation to the next....to form the foundation upon which THEY will build and discover things that I can only guess at. That responsibility and that urgency multiply manyfold when there comes an increasing fear "If I don't..who will? If I can't..Who can"? Increasingly, as our schools cease to teach manual skills, as our Government and Industries side step the responsibility to train new generations there begs the question..If not HERE...WHERE? The other side of that line (or more aptly..the other edge of the cutting tool) is that development is continuous. Things that WERE impossible or too dangerous in "My Time" are considered so easy as to be passe' now. I cannot hope to keep up with it all..but I have to be aware of it. Every time I unsheath my pen to try to help or clarify something, I risk ridicule or a merciless drubbing at the hands of some "Young Turk" who really DOES know better, because of recent new developments, but who yet hasn't come to appreciate where the FOUNDATION of his new knowledge came from, and how he got it! Nevertheless, *I* have to be the one ready to apologise, to learn how to walk softly and yet still carry a big stick! S'okay..it goes with the territory! So forgive this old fart, if sometimes I appear gruff or defensive...Yea verily, some would say..even OFFENSIVE!! As I said...It goes with the territory..Mine...AND yours! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Why Thread dial won't work on Metric threads From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 19:05:44 GMT -------- John Ireland wrote: > > To add to Teenut's post, >The standard approximation of 1" = 2.54 cm will be used. That > means that I need a ratio of 2.54/1 or 254/100 or more commonly 127/100 > X 2/1. If I multiply the factors of our ratio 254 X 100 I can see that > we will be in sync to close the half nut every 25,400 revolutions of the > headstock. Since a mechanical thread dial for this ratio is > impractical, you could use an electronic counter, or do it the old > fashioned way by putting a chalk mark on the chuck and the leadscrew, > and wait till they come back into sync. It is an interesting exersize, > but as Teenut said, it takes a loooooonnnng time. Thanks John, for adding mathematical meat to an old "metal munger's" bones. 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lapping plates... where to find? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 19:11:03 GMT -------- Marlene wrote: > > Not as proud as when yours catches you screwing their grandma! Stand to Attention everyone! Intelligentsia on Deck!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT Reo trucks From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 20:54:03 GMT -------- John Stevenson wrote: > A modern tractor unit is about equivalent to a 4-5 year old Jaguar in >comfort and design. Oh I DO wish you hadn't said that John... A lot of people are going to have a FIELD DAY with it! 8^( teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Steel Making History. Henry Bessemer From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 20:58:45 GMT -------- Fdmorrison wrote: > Don't forget, however, that there was some self-aggrandizement in 19th century > autobiobraphy. Hey, there is in mine ! ;^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Why Cold-Rolled? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 18 Oct 1999 22:36:19 GMT -------- A voice of reason here from Mike...with sound advice! I forget sometimes that the hot rolled I use, comes from a reputable supplier (Metal Supermarkets) and is NOT the hot rolled "steel" (???) one finds at the Ace Hardware or Home Despot. "Good" hot rolled steel is a joy to machine..Unfortunately a LOT of steel suppliers will ship A36 on all hotrolled orders unless you tell them not to..in which case you may be SOL because it is all they have! There is NOTHING wrong with A36 for the purposes for which it is intended...Fabrication, and in particular for boiler work. Problem is, to be good for boilers it has to be very ductile, elongation up in the 27-30% range IIRC. But that ductility makes it a ROYAL PITA to machine...those chips will NOT break and the usual rats nest will ruin your whole day...especially on an enclosed cnc machine with a chip conveyor!! Anyone who has had to deep hole drill it on a production basis..as I have, will have few good things to say about its machineability!! By comparison, cold rolled steel (Non FC) has locked in stresses and work hardening, that not only make it dimensionally unstable..even if you DON'T machine it sometimes!!..but also make the material so variable in texture and character, that it is impossible to get a decent finish on it without resorting to subterfuge. One of the reasons for this, is that a piece of say 7/16" diameter CRS will go through a whole different sequence of dies and draws etc, than a piece of 1/2" diameter that came from the same melt on the same day!! So far as machining is concerned it may as well be a different material, from a different Planet! Where I came from, CRS was for near-net finished shapes and "For Pretty" Any Draftsman that spec'ed CRS on a fully machined part would be LAUGHED out of the Drawing Office, BOOED out of the Cost Office and BOOTED out of the Machine Shop!! teenut mikoberg wrote: > > in a fit of sanity, EVERYBODY (net somewhere@some time.net) snatched up > their respective keyboards and typed: > > ---snip--- snip--- > --somthin somthin somthin---Cold rolled, is much better/worse than > --somthin somthin somthin--- Hot Rolled. > > Ok My 2c: > I think that one of the things that confuses most amateur is the > different steel qualities and how to tell them out of the scrap pile. Tool > steel unless it still has it's wrapper and/or end paint is impossible to > distinguish between 01 02 A1 W1 etc. and hot rolled can be anything under > the sun. (usually it's just structural crap that is REAL fun to machine. > Cold rolled's minimum quality on the other hand is usually pretty good. It > as a minimum is fairly easy (in comparison to the usual hot rolled scrap) > to machine. > I have found that cold rolled, if _just_ turned threaded etc and lightly > milled, holds its shape pretty well. > Now if I was telling a person what to pick up new from the metal yards I > would say go with 1118 hot rolled if he wanted to color case harden it > (even 11L18 color cases okay) and probably go with 12L14 if hardening was > not an issue. If I figured that the machinist was a beginner and would find > his stuff in the scrap yard; for the project outlined I would suggest the > cold rolled. > > -mikoberg ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Making taps From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 03:01:37 GMT -------- Isn't it marvelous how, if you wait long enough, things come full circle 8^) Gordon, probably totally and innocently unaware of how this thread got started a couple of weeks ago..Has just repeated almost verbatim my original suggestion viz: > On the subject of taps I have made pretty good ones by filing groves > in a soft bolt and case hardening it with Casite. > > Gordon Ok, now we start over again...I believe the next question has something to do with grade 13 bolts being "Hard" enough to make taps without having to bother with Kasenite.. And the next one is... Yawn! 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: split rec.crafts.metalworking up? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 03:09:59 GMT -------- Hey, I have a great idea for a start! What about a special engines group? An' then we could have a "Taiwanese Mill drill.but not the ones with round columns, you know..the dovetail ones.com" or a Alt.wrought iron metric leadscrew.com The possibilities are endless Ed!! Or you could simply not read the ones that don't interest you. 8^) teenut Ed Elser wrote: > > I love this group, but hundreds of messages a day is toooo much!!! > perhaps we could give it some subcategorizes? > machining, fabricating, art, etc.? > just a thought. > Ed > > -- > > "A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an > invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write > a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort > the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, > solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program > a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die > gallantly. Specialization is for insects." Robert Heinlein ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: split rec.crafts.metalworking up? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 03:14:03 GMT -------- I trust you have a Business Plan written for that Peter! Perhaps you could share it. 8^) teenut Peter Reilley wrote: > > A forsale or auction subgroup would be good too. Give ebay a run > for their money. > > Pete. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Aluminum..when was it first made? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 03:17:32 GMT -------- Metallic aluminum was, I believe known in that period at the French Court where it was more precious than diamonds, and was used for jewellery. Perhaps Washington was introduced to it via 'Ole Ben Franklin. teenut PLAlbrecht wrote: > > >Problem is, George Washington had a > >prized spoon and fork he used during the Revolutionary War, made or rare > >Aluminum, or so I'm told.... > > According to Britannica, not possible. Of course, they might be covering > something up because George Washington was the leader of those pesky > revolutionaries. But no, I don't think they had aluminum in his day. Not in the > metallic form. > > Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Aluminum..when was it first made? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 04:34:26 GMT -------- Just curious... Did they call it Aluminium back then? 8^) teenut brad wrote: > > Charles Hall developed the process that made aluminum cheaply,using electric > current and chemicals. With the help of Alfred Hunt,who had financed many > earlier experiments,the Pittsburgh Reduction Co. was formed. In 1888,the > first commercial aluminum ingot was produced(on Smallman St.,in > Pittsburgh,PA) with the help of Arthur Davis.Later,Pittsburgh Reduction was > to be known as Alcoa,with Hunt and later,Davis serving as presidents. > Today,there is a plaque on the Smallman St. building where the first ingot > was produced.Hope this helps. Good Luck-brad > Jim Waggener wrote in message <380b66ad.8855859@allnews.infi.net>... > >Can anyone tell me what year aluminum was invented/made > >and commercially available ? > > > >thanks, > > > >JimW ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Aluminum..when was it first made? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 06:01:48 GMT -------- OK OK ALREADY! (Just when I was winning the argument..you come up with FACTS!!) I stand corrected (For now) <(8^( Going to track down the stories on Washington and Marie Antoinette's Jewellry tho'. HEY! Maybe Their stuff was Aluminium not Aluminum..Would that explain the Hysterical Despondancy? 8^) teenut PLAlbrecht wrote: Snip endless reams of humilliating FACTS!! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Aluminum..when was it first made? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 06:28:03 GMT -------- Perfectly true Dear Boy!! The Halhumin-I-Hum Pellets were added in 1997 at the insistance of Socialist PM Tony "Up YOURS" Blair, to replace all the nasty Non-Working Class Diamonds and other "Haristocratic Baubles" in the Crown Jewels. The official record states that the proceeds of a private in-house (of Commons) Raffle were in excess of 40 billion Euros (37Poundsand23Pee).. Which "Toney Tone" (as he is known in East Cheam) used to treat the Char -Ladies at No 10 to a Right Royal Pis...er Knees Up down the Kings Road, Chelsea Reuters (teenut) Bureau > PLAlbrecht wrote: > > > According to Britannica, not possible. Of course, they might be covering > > something up because George Washington was the leader of those pesky > > revolutionaries. But no, I don't think they had aluminum in his day. Not in the > > metallic form. > > I remember a story about a couple of AL pellets being added to the crown > jewels of England as it was so rare at the time... Is this urban legend, historic > fact, and if so when? > > EBo -- ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Why shapers are terrific! From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 07:24:12 GMT -------- Never seen one (Not sure I want to see one! ;^) Where in the name of all that is holy did THAT come from? I though I had seen em all but that's a Doozy (Deuzy ?) That Shaper ram fair gave me the wobblies..! Machines like this were/are fromtwo or three different sources viz: A) Military..for mobile workshops and shipboard use..The "Bormilathe" is an example, a stout and versatile machine especially if it is all you have room for. Not a Modern Practice as airborne lift capabilites, large repair shops on Carriers and a mountain of replacement parts have reduced the reliance on "Front Line" machinists and shops with bare metal capabilities. B) Someone's Five Year Plan to give every Commune a self sufficiency in tractor repair..(or Yugo/Trabant manufacture!!) C) Screaming Nutcases...By Rube Goldberg out of Heath-Robinson (AKA Harbor Freight!...in the 3-30 at Granite Park, Shopsmith up! The Urwick "Metalmaster" was an Amateur designed machine of surprising sophistication..Designed and built by one brilliantly "Potty" British Model Engineer for his retirement to a small apartment in Malta. Several variations of this machine went into (Brief!!) production IIRC in the 60's or 70's The machine in the picture is too "Modern" looking for (A) Too big and well designed for (C)...My money is on (B) with design origins in the Russian Bloc..Manufactured in China. FWIW teenut tmartin@xtra.co.nz wrote: > > Check this out! Look at the attachments this shaper has! > A picture is at the Drop box as lathecom.jpg > > Combination multi-purpose machine tool incorporating a lathe, > milling machine, drill press and shaper on one bed and from one > drive motor This is a quality machine intended for a factory > maintenance, workshop, mobile workshop, ships workshop or small > general engineer. > Has hardened and ground headstock gears, taper roller bearing > spindle, Norton quick-change gearbox, shaved gears in gearbox, > hardened and around bedways with gap, plunger lubricated ways, > square turret, toolpost. Lathe headstock is a rigid and ribbed > column to provide the shaper, drill and mill which use, in > common a table, saddle and knee, > The Lathe swings 16" and admits 40" between centres with a gap > to swing 25 1/2" > The Shaper has a stroke of 11" and a cross feed of over 12" > The Milling Machine has a 1" horizontal arbor over a 24" x 8" > table > The Drilling Machine has a capacity of 1 1/2" diameter with a > 5" spindle travel. > > Amongst the cognoscenti who can identify it? Has anyone seen > one in the flesh? > Cheers > Tom Martin ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Drill Doctor bashing ... again From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 07:37:32 GMT -------- I'll see your M5 and raise the offer to my Christen for $12000.00 and then we will REALLY see some drill grinding! Or..For $20,000. Starting with a random sized, blunted drill, on the table in front of you..Hands raised above waist height...On the signal, I will race the lot of you to seeing daylight through a steel plate!! You use your drill grinders..and I will use a 6" bench grinder! Kidding of course..Kinda ;^) 8^) teenut Barb Hardy wrote: > > I,ll extend this offer to any one on the NG that thinks that Darex products > are the cats whiskers. I'll sell this M5 and all related for $2,200.00 plus > S&H E-mail me and we'll get this ball rollin... > > Thank you Paul > > John Kunkel wrote in message > news:380B621B.3F0A5523@worldnet.att.net... > > Jens wrote: > > > > > > End of rant ... climbing off the soap box > > > > > > Jens > > > > It seems that every product is going to have its fans and its detract- > > ers. I love my DD, use it all the time and have never had the problems > > cited here. > > John ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Tool Drool Time From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 08:03:58 GMT -------- How do you like it done sir? (The Hat) If I am any judge of horse flesh this could be a feeding frenzy. I am not in the market right now..I blew my Christmas Wad (Till 2006!!) But I would offer $500. cash for it right now..if I didn't think Dave would laugh at me! The compound slide alone would fetch more than that! Fact is, just to put my money where my mouth is...I'm going to mosey over there and do just that! Just talk among yourselves for a minute.. ...Back again! As I suspected..My $500.00 bid didn't even put a dent in 'ole "Hard Hearted Dave"'s reserve price! He is probably lurking here and having a right chuckle over this! Hi Dave!! It is going to be an interesting few days.. 8^) teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article <380AD737.B9CE23DF@home.com>, > Robert Bastow wrote: > > http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=183411546 > > Granted the Schaublin's real nice, _but_: > > It has no back gears > No threading > No power feeds of any kind > > Which is not to say that it's not a bargain at 152 bucks. > Now if it actually *sells* for that, I may be in the > hat-consumption business! > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Wot's in a name? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 10:43:46 GMT -------- PLAlbrecht wrote: > > Found it. It all comes together here. Napoleon, crown jewels, spoons, utensils. > But look at the dates. But not in the times, the crowns, or even the Napoleons, > one might have believed. > > This is how urban legends get started. Hey, I know this guy on rcm, he invented > the T-nut... I will have you know, My Good Man, that the Honorable and Ancient Family name I so proudly bear, predates the founding of this uncouth colony of Ruffians by almost half a mile..milli..mellin..500 years! Back indeed to 1066 and all that dont'cha know! My Ancestor, Robert the Sheepherder, was forced to flee his native land of York, because of NASTY, UNFOUNDED and to this day..UNPROVEN rumors regarding the simple affection with which he regarded his helpless charges..(as he vainly tried to explain..he was just trying to help a helpless lad..y..er..ewe over a gate!!). One day far south of his native pennines he happened upon a broad down, (A STRETCH OF GREEN SWARD, PERVERTS..not a lady recumbent!!)..whereupon mighty armies were arrayed for imminent and bloody battle..for, as it transpired..no less a prize than the Crown of England. Never one to miss a good show...not to speak of a FREE one..my parsimonious predecessor, parked his posterior, firmly upon a vacant tree stump..regretably or so it would seem in a while...for a while..right in the chosen path of the two approaching Titans... As the melee' surged about him, as he watched in horror the Flower of England slaughtered in their thousands and the blood of the invading, usurping, Nords'manders, in their tens of thousands..was spilled in gobbets about him....he fought mightily to keeep himself from the spilling! The pint of beer he had purchased at the concession tent was rocked many times to the lip..but nary a drop was wasted that day..or any other for that matter!! In midst the dusty din and clanging, clanking, crashing clamor of war, came a mighty rallying cry... "Where's me TNUT"..again..and again..."Where's me TNUT" "Wot's a tnut" inquired my Yeoman kin of a large and very sweaty protaganist who had appeared..as if from nowhere, to plant foresquare before him, dressed (very badly I might say for the season) in battle slashed shirt of mail bearing the double haft of a mighty battlesword in his huge right hand...and the blade of same mighty battlesword in his (equally huge, Robert noted rather nervously) left hand. "TNUT" Roared the mighty warrior "The TNUT you caught in your beer mug"....."The TNUT that flew off me SWORD" He roared!! (Dear reader you will realise of course that this, rather one sided conversation was taking place in a language unheard by young Rob until that moment..in the crude early French of the Nords'mander..But as is well understood by all American tourists..the Man WAS bellowing at the top of his voice..and that made it easier for poor Robert of York to understand..Indeed such was his fear that he became instantly fluent in the strange tongue..that and any other tongue the MAN might have wished for at the moment!!)..but I digress.. "Tnut" mumbled Robert "Tnut" as he produced the oddly castelated, beer dripping object of all the excitement from his now empty mug (No he didn't..he drank every drop!!) "Tnut"..."OH..tha means t'NUT!!" Smiling idiotically now..."T'Nut that owds thee 'andle on!" "TNUT!..T'NUT...My Kingdom for a T'nut.." the Warrior was babbling happily now, as Robert..with his truly genetic mastery of all things pertaining to mechanics, (and/or survival), deftly re-united Blade, Haft, Knight and T'Nut with a few clockwise flicks of his wrist... "KNEEL"...the sudden command awoke poor Rob from his reverie..again "KNEEL" "OMIGAWD 'E's GOIN' TER TOP ME!!" He thought as he blindly complied and awaited the icy chill of blade on neck..But WAIT, wot's this?? A light tap on the shoulder? "Arise Sir T'Nut of York".?? And that, as they say, is the REST of the story! 8^) teenut (the 23rd) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Patchy Service From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 10:51:33 GMT -------- Summat's up at t'mill My receipts of messages have been patchy and disjointed for the last week or so. I figured out that several were missing..and the order they arrive in is all over the place. I don't even get back all the messages I send..though I can tell by the brickbats that SOMEBODY is getting them! I thought it was my server but I am using TWO in tandem to monitor..Netscape AND Outlook Express and both are having the same problems. Wot's up? Did we forget to pay the rent? teenut kenneth knaell wrote: > > Man - my server must be slow. I come online here and find the whole history > of Alum has been discussed before I got the first posting. I wonder what > you guys are talking about now? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Teenut is a disappointment! From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 10:59:40 GMT -------- I'm not sure what you mean.??? I posted an extensive comment on this machine..is this one more victim of the ethernet void? teenut tmartin@xtra.co.nz wrote: > > I thought this would have been right up his alley! > > http://www.metalworking.com/dropbox/lathecom.jpg > Text is there as lathecom.txt > > Tom ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Tip: Broken stud in cast iron (long) From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 12:23:05 GMT -------- Way back when I was an apprentice..long before Plasma Jet or abrasive jet cutters we had an O/A system that fed iron powder, from a hopper on the torch, into the cutting jet. This was highly effective for cutting stainless steel...probably be 303/304 series in today's nomenclature, up to 6" thickness..Not a pretty cut and a bitch to grind clean for fitting and welding..but it did the job. The same iron powder injection system was used for cutting Cast Iron...heavy sprues and risers off thirty ton lathe bed castings and the like. Then you had to jackhammer chip and grind them clean ready for the pre-seasoning roughing cuts. Filthy Heavy, Grunt work...You got that job for a week if you really pissed off the Chargehand by welding his locker shut! teenut BeeCrofter wrote: > > To cut cast iron with a torch you feed some steel into the melt and it burns > taking the cast iron with it. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Aluminum..when was it first made? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 12:31:40 GMT -------- I dunno! Sounds daft enough to be true! The last time I checked, when this same perennial question of spelling came up about five years ago..ALCOA was still officially the ALUMINIUM Company of America. If ALCOA don't know..Who the heck does?? teenut Marshall Pharoah wrote: > > Legend has it that ALCOA ordered a few tons of letterhead which was > dicovered to have > Alunimium mispelled. Rather than scrap the paper, they changed the name of > the metal. > Is this true? > > -- > Marshall Pharoah > Software Engineer > Adirondac Software > PIC/6805/6811/68000 > Asm/C/C++ > > Robert Bastow wrote in message <380BF5CF.F812C621@home.com>... > >Just curious... > > > >Did they call it Aluminium back then? > > > >8^) > > > >teenut > > > >brad wrote: > >> > >> Charles Hall developed the process that made aluminum cheaply,using > electric > >> current and chemicals. With the help of Alfred Hunt,who had financed many > >> earlier experiments,the Pittsburgh Reduction Co. was formed. In 1888,the > >> first commercial aluminum ingot was produced(on Smallman St.,in > >> Pittsburgh,PA) with the help of Arthur Davis.Later,Pittsburgh Reduction > was > >> to be known as Alcoa,with Hunt and later,Davis serving as presidents. > >> Today,there is a plaque on the Smallman St. building where the first > ingot > >> was produced.Hope this helps. Good Luck-brad > >> Jim Waggener wrote in message <380b66ad.8855859@allnews.infi.net>... > >> >Can anyone tell me what year aluminum was invented/made > >> >and commercially available ? > >> > > >> >thanks, > >> > > >> >JimW ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: EDM power supply From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 12:33:48 GMT -------- I would think you would need a better grade of paper than Lindsay uses! 8^) teenut Mark wrote: > > "Metal Disintegrator", has anyone tried building one from the Lindsay catalog? > Mark ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Wot's in a name? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 12:55:35 GMT -------- John Stevenson wrote: > [ Twice removed, once forcibly from the Flying Horse ] > -- That Sir, is a termill..a termingo..A Lie..!! I only went back to get me Whippet..and to politely enquire as to the upcoming nuptuals of the Landlord's Parents!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: split rec.crafts.metalworking up? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 13:07:52 GMT -------- Ernie Leimkuhler wrote: > I agree that it is getting a bit out of control, but a lot of it could be > reduced if we could just split off 2 groups. > If we could have > rec.crafts.metalworking.general > rec.crafts.metalworking.machining > rec.crafts.metalworking.forsale > > rec.crafts.metalworking would cease to exist once it splits. > > Quite honestly I have trouble dealing with too many large newsgroups, and > this is only one of 8 that I check ever night. This must be the "New Math" I keep hearing about!! 8 groups is too much to handle. Add 3 new groups, minus the one you first thought of.. 8 + 3 - 1 = ? Ten?? And that is easier to handle than Eight? Gotta ask my son about this when he gets home from school! teenut 8 plus 3 plus..no, minus.. er..8 minus.. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: anybody get their CROWN-ROBERTSON lathe?? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 13:32:18 GMT -------- I didn't manage to get one second time 'round. In a way I am glad..I have enough projects for now. Your description sounds pretty much as I expected,,sliding head Swiss screw machine style...That has a LOT of possibilities!! (Gazes into precision machined, chrystal ball..."I see LOTS of small screws in your future...." Surprised about the solid spindle though..Need a long drill?? 8^) Be careful with the diamond..It is very fragile inits present condition My suggestion would be to return it to the manufacturer. I would be surprised if they charged you for recementing it. The last diamond tipped insert I bought was on Ebay....Four bucks!! 8^) What possibilities do you see so far fot the machine? teentu BillDarby wrote: > > This lathe is equipped with a diamond insert cutter to, I presume, work on a type > of plastic lens. The diamond has about a 60 degree (-) tip, about .100" on edge with > a small radius. > > The holder bears the fol. T4508 NEHBEN SFC B361 (not sure of the > name?NEHBEN?) > > On very close inspection the very tip of the diamond appears to be lifting away from > its mount. > > Does anyone know how the diamond could be cemented back in place?? > > Does anyone know who supplies these inserts and what they might cost?? > > Thanks Bill Darby > > BTW Do any of you other guys have any comments on the lathe? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: split rec.crafts.metalworking up? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 16:35:35 GMT -------- If you skip all the jokes, no one in the1r right mind would be interested in metalworking! 8^) teenut Chuck Sherwood wrote: > > How about just sticking to metalworking! If we skip the jokes, political > stuff and other off topic discussion, it would much better. > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Teenut is a disappointment! From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 16:56:22 GMT -------- Sorry it wasn't teenut's fault. You dumb asses were looking in the wrong place. 8^) teenut Repost, with apologies to those who saw it the first time...(by looking in the RIGHT PLACE!! From: Robert Bastow 3:24 AM Subject: Re: Why shapers are terrific! Never seen one (Not sure I want to see one! ;^) Where in the name of all that is holy did THAT come from? I though I had seen em all but that's a Doozy (Deuzy ?) That Shaper ram fair gave me the wobblies..! Machines like this were/are fromtwo or three different sources viz: A) Military..for mobile workshops and shipboard use..The "Bormilathe" is an example, a stout and versatile machine especially if it is all you have room for. Not a Modern Practice as airborne lift capabilites, large repair shops on Carriers and a mountain of replacement parts have reduced the reliance on "Front Line" machinists and shops with bare metal capabilities. B) Someone's Five Year Plan to give every Commune a self sufficiency in tractor repair..(or Yugo/Trabant manufacture!!) C) Screaming Nutcases...By Rube Goldberg out of Heath-Robinson (AKA Harbor Freight!...in the 3-30 at Granite Park, Shopsmith up! The Urwick "Metalmaster" was an Amateur designed machine of surprising sophistication..Designed and built by one brilliantly "Potty" British Model Engineer for his retirement to a small apartment in Malta. Several variations of this machine went into (Brief!!) production IIRC in the 60's or 70's The machine in the picture is too "Modern" looking for (A) Too big and well designed for (C)...My money is on (B) with design origins in the Russian Bloc..Manufactured in China. FWIW teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: NIST emc From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 20:29:11 GMT -------- Hey Youse Guys!! This is PRECISELY the kind of crap that stops me from subscribing to alt.machines.cnc!! I see it hasn't matured one bit Please take your childish bickering and back-biting back where someone gives a s**t. Quit crossposting..and note I have had the courtesy NOT to crosspost this polite request! Thank you teenut PS. should you choose Not to take this in the spirit in which it is offered..be sure to come out swinging! Jon Banquer wrote: > > Marshall, > > > Most of us just ignored your rantings, as well as Darrells and Gars. > > I get a lot out of Hoyt's posts. As far as Darrell is concerned, I haven't > seen any rantings but then again, I haven't seen any real info either. > Certainly not much is on his web page in regards to his retrofit. > He certainly does have a closed mind in many areas. I have > never noticed this about Hoyt. Very, opinionated...yes. Close > minded....no. > > > I'm beginning to suspect Darrel is right, you're selling I-LPT, so nothing > > else is worthy of being looked at. I try to maintain an open mind and read > > what everyone has to say with an eye towards learning something I can use > > someday, but you are making it hard. > > Funny you should say this. I have never seen a post by Hoyt pushing > anything. I see Darrel Gehlsen push his system all the time....without > providing any real detail on it !!! I'm glad that you say that you try and > maintain an open mind. I think it's pretty obvious that Darrel doesn't. > Here is what I really don't understand in your post. You start off saying.... > > "Most of us just ignored your rantings, as well as Darrells and Gars." > Then you go on to say : > > "I'm beginning to suspect Darrel is right, you're selling I-LPT, so nothing > else is worthy of being looked at" > > Sorry, but this seems like a major contradiction to me, you ignore Darrell's > rantings but you "suspect Darrel is right" ????? Can you have it both > ways ??? > > I can assure you that Darrel is NOT right. Hoyt maybe opinionated but > is far from having a closed mind. I can also assure you that Hoyt (who does > not believe in God ( I do) is far more objective, open minded and a much > nicer human being than Darrel Gehlsen ( who also believes in God) will > ever be... even if he attends church all day, everyday, for the rest of his life. > > jon ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: split rec.crafts.metalworking up? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 20:31:30 GMT -------- You already have Gunner's list and Ebay plus this one What else do you need B & L Denard wrote: > However we do need some place to sale Equipment and Tools. > Bill D. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: split rec.crafts.metalworking up? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 20:36:53 GMT -------- As usual Boris, your voice of reason helps to keep we Hotheads on task! I think you have covered all that anyone could reasonably want in way of choices, except one...! Rec.craft.letstartanewlist.com If we can add that to the agenda I think I can assure you of my support. teenut boris beizer wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote in message > news:380C9ED6.A36D664F@home.com... > > If you skip all the jokes, no one in the1r right mind would be interested in > > metalworking! > >> teenut > > > > Chuck Sherwood wrote: > > > > > How about just sticking to metalworking! If we skip the jokes, political > > > stuff and other off topic discussion, it would much better. > > > > > As usual, T-nut doesn't get it, or doesn't take things as seriously as he > should. I recant my previous posting on this and offer a multi-way split. > Clearly, the subject line is not doing it for some of us, so we should split > this group -- but why only 3-ways? Here is my initial list for a better > split of r.c.m. I invite all participants to submit their breakdown into > subgroups and post it to rec.craft.metalworking.subgroup_project. Once the > splits are implemented and enforced (see the appropriate subnewsgroups) we > should have no more of these problems. > > rec.craft.metalworking.castiron > rec.craft.metalworking.castiron.bridges > rec.craft.metalworking.castiron.chastity_belts > rec.craft.metalworking.castiron.cleanup > rec.craft.metalworking.blacksmith > rec.craft.metalworking.coppersmith > rec.craft.metalworking.silversmith > rec.craft.metalworking.goldsmith > rec.craft.metalworking.tinsmith > rec.craft.metalworking.whitesmith > rec.craft.metalworking.just_plain_smith > rec.craft.metalworking.bickering > rec.craft.metalworking.bickering.bickering_about_bickering > rec.craft.metalworking.bronzesmelters > rec.craft.metalworking.brassbound > rec.craft.metalworking.brass_balls > rec.craft.metalworking.iron_balls > rec.craft.metalworking.cnc > rec.craft.metalworking.sexist_humor > rec.craft.metalworking.sexist_humour > rec.craft.metalworking.sexist_humor.flames > rec.craft.metalworking.sexist_humour.flames > rec.craft.metalworking.spinning > rec.craft.metalworking.scraping > rec.craft.metalworking.bowing > rec.craft.metalworking.cowering > rec.craft.metalworking.scrapping > rec.craft.metalworking.female > rec.craft.metalworking.female.feminists > rec.craft.metalworking.female.feminist.flame > rec.craft.metalworking.gunsmithing > rec.craft.metalworking.gunsmithing.survivalists > rec.craft.metalworking.gunsmithing.artillery > rec.craft.metalworking.gunsmithing.thermonuclear > rec.craft.metalworking.humor > rec.craft.metalworking.humour > rec.craft.metalworking.significant_other > rec.craft.metalworking.significant_other.grousing > rec.craft.metalworking.significant_other.help > rec.craft.metalworking.significant_other.support_group > rec.craft.metalworking.significant_other.humor > rec.craft.metalworking.significant_other.humour > rec.craft.metalworking.southbend > rec.craft.metalworking.boxford > rec.craft.metalworking.myford > rec.craft.metalworking.logan > rec.craft.metalworking.logan.help_me_scott > rec.craft.metalworking.sherline > rec.craft.metalworking.where's_my_favorite? > rec.craft.metalworking.clausing > rec.craft.metalworking.shapers > rec.craft.metalworking.neat.projects > rec.craft.metalworking.ornamental_turning_metal > rec.craft.metalworking.three_phase > rec.craft.metalworking.three_phase.delta > rec.craft.metalworking.three_phase.wye > rec.craft.metalworking.three_phase.why? > rec.craft.metalworking.brits > rec.craft.metalworking.brits.guide_to_strange_terminology > rec.craft.metalworking.brits.yanks_don't_speak_english > rec.craft.metalworking.brits.apologies_to > rec.craft.metalworking.brits.apologies_to.that's_all_right_old_chap_we_can_tak > e_a_joke_just_as_well_as_the_next_fellow > rec.craft.metalworking.brits.superiority_of_british_engineers > rec.craft.metalworking.brits.superiority_of_british_engineers.tradition_y'know > rec.craft.metalworking.brits.superiority_of_british_engineers.genetic > rec.craft.metalworking.brits.superiority_of_british_engineers.besides_they_bri > ng_three_phase_to_our_residences_directly_so_there! > rec.craft.metalworking.brits.superiority_of_british_engineers.history > rec.craft.metalworking.brits.superiority_of_british_engineers.yank_bashing > rec.craft.metalworking.brits.superiority.oh_yeah!_lucas > rec.craft.metalworking.brits.superiority.oh_yeah!_lucas.humor > rec.craft.metalworking.off_topic > rec.craft.metalworking.sort_of_off_topic > rec.craft.metalworking.is_this_off_topic? > rec.craft.metalworking.off_topic.flame > rec.craft.metalworking.off_topic.flame.get_a_life > rec.craft.metalworking.three_in_one > rec.craft.metalworking.three_in_one.abject_stupidity_of > rec.craft.metalworking.three_in_one.religious_wars > rec.craft.metalworking.harbor_freight_bitching > rec.craft.metalworking.chinese_junk.bitching > rec.craft.metalworking.indian_junk.bitching > rec.craft.metalworking.darex_bashing > rec.craft.metalworking.bomb_making > rec.craft.metalworking.altavoz > rec.craft.metalworking.altavoz.flame_wars > rec.craft.metalworking.altavoz.clones > rec.craft.metalworking.wtb > rec.craft.metalworking.for_sale > rec.craft.metalworking.for_sale.we_can_do_all_your_machining_tasks_at_a_very_m > odest_price_in_huge_quantities_all_in_former_sovietskaya_people's_machining_co > mmune_of_lower_Baluchisnoye_314-44-445-7680_fax_312-44-445_768001_thanking_you > _for_your_very_kind_attention > rec.craft.metalworking.for_sale.chinese_people's_commune_do_much_better_qualit > y_work_at_lower_prices_and_faster_delivery_than_corrupt_russkies_who_not_know_ > proper_use_of_subject_line_protocol > rec.craft.metalworking.lookit_ebay > rec.craft.metalworking.lookit_ebay.idiocy > rec.craft.metalworking.gloat > rec.craft.metalworking.gloat.lathe > rec.craft.metalworking.gloat.milling > rec.craft.metalworking.gloat.dumpster_diving > rec.craft.metalworking.gloat.trash_trolling > rec.craft.metalworking.gloat.flea_market > rec.craft.metalworking.gloat.garage_sale > rec.craft.metalworking.gloat.widows_I_took_advantage_of > rec.craft.metalworking.sob > rec.craft.metalworking.sob.lathe > rec.craft.metalworking.sob.milling > rec.craft.metalworking.sob.flea_market > rec.craft.metalworking.sob.widows_who_took_advantage_of_me > rec.craft.metalworking.broken_machine_help > rec.craft.metalworking.impossible_machining_tasks > rec.craft.metalworking.trolls > rec.craft.metalworking.rec.craft.metalworking.improvement_project > rec.craft.metalworking.rec.craft.metalworking.quality_assurance > rec.craft.metalworking.rec.craft.metalworking.quality_control > rec.craft.metalworking.rec.craft.metalworking.control_freaks > rec.craft.metalworking.rec.craft.metalworking.subgroup_project > rec.craft.metalworking.rec.craft.metalworking.subgroup_proposal > rec.craft.metalworking.rec.craft.metalworking.subgroup_proposal_plebiscite > rec.craft.metalworking.rec.craft.metalworking.subgroup_final_vote_tally > rec.craft.metalworking.rec.craft.metalworking.subgroup_ratification > rec.craft.metalworking.rec.craft.metalworking.subgroup_enforcement > rec.craft.metalworking.rec.craft.metalworking.subgroup_enforcement.appeals > rec.craft.metalworking.rec.craft.metalworking.subgroup_change_request > rec.craft.metalworking.rec.craft.metalworking.subgroup_change_request.denied > rec.craft.metalworking.rec.craft.metalworking.subgroup_change_request.approved > rec.craft.metalworking.rec.craft.metalworking.conflict_resolution > rec.craft.metalworking.rec.craft.metalworking.subgroup_arbitration_board > rec.craft.metalworking.rec.craft.metalworking.constitution > rec.craft.metalworking.rec.craft.metalworking.subgroup_descriptions > rec.craft.metalworking.rec.craft.metalworking.subgroup_descriptions.FAQ > > and, of course > > rec.craft.metalworking.rec.craft.metalworking.index ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: grade 12 bolts and other questions From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 20:45:38 GMT -------- Kathy and Erich Coiner wrote: > > Brian Evans wrote: > > > >Inquiring minds want to know...how do you select a bolt to do what you > >want? > > The short.... I'm all for that..inspite of appearances! >and not particularly helpful answer is: Lots of places to go for unhelpful answers..with or without "Smart Ass" seasoning, or "Crispy Crunchy Superciliousness" coating This isn't one of them though! 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Aluminum..when was it first made? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 20:48:47 GMT -------- Jim Waggener wrote: > I tip my hat Which race is it in and who's the trainer? teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What is wrought iron? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 20:52:52 GMT -------- Kudos John, for a pretty good,concise and accurate synopsis of a complex subject. 8^) teenut John Ireland wrote: > > kenneth knaell wrote: > > > > Before this thread disappears completely I would like to ask the following > > question of all you smiths. I asked this before but I never saw the posting > > or any answers so I am repeating this question. > > > > Actually I got kind of interested in Roman technology lately and was > > wondering if the short sword that was so basic to their organized war > > fighting might have been made of good steel. I had gotten the impression > > from somewhere that they were still using bronze in those. William Thomas > > Powers told me that the Romans used *alot* of wrought iron but I wonder if > > they had gotten to the point where they were able to make the high > > performance swords that were available in the times of the crusades. So > > anyway here is a repeat of my question. I hope somebody that knows might > > say something. Thanks. > > > > ......... > > > > OK, now we all know where wrought iron comes from. I am curious how the > > high quality swords that were supposedly made in Sheffield England, Solingen > > Germany, and Damascus in the middle ages were made from this soft cruddy > > mallable stuff. Was it just beat on more? Carbon added? > > Sorry, I forgot the Samurai > > Ken Knaell > > Ken, > There are really only two types of steel used in early knives. Blister > steel(sort of case hardened wrought iron), and Wootz steel (Cast Iron > combined with wrought iron). These were the two methods used to control > carbon content. There are many different smithing processes used to > turn those raw materials into blades. I know a guy 20 miles from here > who spent years in Japan and is a master Katana maker, and he makes his > own blister steel for swords. That is just the beginning, since what > makes a Katana is the processes that follow. It is a lot more than just > getting a hard core in a soft shell. There is a lot of myth and some > reality about these old techniques with tales of forged meteorites etc. > Although I have been a hobby smith for numerous years, the subject has > such depth and bredth that I know beyond any doubt that any short answer > is wrong, and I would suggest trying to find someone seriously involved > in the historical side of smithing, and start a good reading list. > Anyway, all this leads to fact that some smart clockmaker in England > decided to cut up blister steel and melt it in a crucible for clock > springs, making possible the reliable production of carbon steel, and > hence the industrial revolution and hence rec.crafts.metalworking. This > is a very interesting and sometimes controversial subject. Enjoy! > > john ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Tool Drool Time From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 21:00:03 GMT -------- mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > But honestly I still think it would be a poor first lathe for > a beginner, at that price. Certainly limited for what most > want to do, and its qualities as a Schaublin would probably > be unrecognized by the beginner. > > Jim Absolutely Agree on every point there Jim. Quite frankly, a Myford would be a better all round choice for a first, second, third or tenth lathe!! But I wouldn't want to SLEEP with my Myford!! ;^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Tool Drool Question From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 19 Oct 1999 22:37:16 GMT -------- Hmmm! The P&W and the Hardinge are every bit as good as any machine that ever came out of Switzerland. Similarly the Corvette is arguably as "good" as anything out of Maranello I already made my point about the Myford..IMHO a far more versatile and practical machine than this Harbeggar. Only the French have a phrase to truly describe what we bumblingly gloss over as "Sex Appeal" They simply call it "Je ne sais pas" Translates as "I don't know what"!! Neither do I! But, as they used to say in the (British) Navy.."It will drag you further, than dynamite can blow you" teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article <380C26EB.418E3E28@home.com>, > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > If I am any judge of horse flesh this could be a feeding frenzy. > > Okay - I'm gonna break the rules and reply to your post twice - > because now I have a unique opportunity to pick the brains of the > self-styled old phart, and looking at the auction again finally > crystalized my feelings: > > Exactly what is it about Schablin lathes that renders them so > desirable? From what I can see (and have observed, looking at the > one in Dave Sobel's shop) the slide assembly does look to be a true > work of art. I am sure the headstock must have high speed precision > bearings in it - and it takes 5C tooling directly, which is nice. > > But it does seem to have a flat belt cone-pulley drive, not variable > speed. That would seem to make a Hardinge DV59 more desirable > right there. And yet several DV59s have come and gone, some unsold > and another one for (what seemed to me) a _real_ pittance. 350 bucks > or so. > > But I own a small Pratt & Whitney machine like this - granted the > Ames compound is pretty old, and it only takes 3AT collets. But > the cone bearing in the headstock is in pretty good shape. And I > bought it for about 50 bucks. But before you go and pass a bubble > thru a heart valve or something, no, I am not seriously comparing > the P&W to the Schaublin. No fool I. > > But surely you have the insider's knowledge (possesed by all those > with the O-P certification) of why the Schaublin excites such > amazement from all who come into contact with one. > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: split rec.crafts.metalworking up? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 11:38:58 GMT -------- What would all you guys do without por 'ole teenut to pick on? 8^) B & L Denard wrote: > BTW Did you guys know Teenut has some stripped threads ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Faceplates advice/opinions From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 12:27:27 GMT -------- Hi Boris, I isn't often you are presented with the golden opportunity to have a bit 'o kit EXACTLY to your liking..so it behooves taking a close look at your options and what you need. Having recently gone through the same exercise with the faceplates for my own 11" lathe here are my thoughts and conclusions. Firstly, a single faceplate will not cover all you requirements..so this large one of yours should be made and reserved for use on "large" bits. That means that you can go ahead for starters and bore a hole right through it as big at least as your spindle bore. Bigger even! It si surprising how many jobs have a big boss or somsuch on the back that you need to "lose" in order to bolt the important bit to the faceplate. But when you bore this big hole, counterbore for a plugging plate with a retaining flange. You could make this out of the cut off boss. Drill and tap for csk retaining screws and bore the center for a half inch dowel to act as a set up refference. Finisch machine the two pieces as a unit. You could go a step further and make the center plug in two or even three steps..so you can select the center hole size to suit the job. Location/set up aids: Mill 1/2"wide x 1/8"deep, slots across the faceplate..Six of 'em..four at 90 deg and two extra to form a 120 deg set with one of the other four. Drill and tap these slots so that you can fasten in locating keys as required Forget through slots and tee slots...They look pretty but are never in the right place!!! Drill and tap the face plate with a matrix of 3/8 - 16 holes. Figure out a pattern that includes both a diametric and a chordal (Square) pattern. Drill as many as you can!! Counterbore each of your tapped holes and ream 3/8" diameter for 1/4" deep. This will allow you to use dowels in the same holes for locating purposes. Occasionally one or more of your set up screws will be called on to provide a torque stop, so it is a good idea to have the pressure taken on the cylindrical shank rather than on the root of the thread. Now make an 8" and a 5" to match! 8^) Teenut Good luck boris beizer wrote: > > I picked up (ugh) a big unfinished backing plate for a chuck yesterday. 11" > diameter, 1.25 thick, with a 5" diameter x 4" boss for the spindle hole. I > making a faceplate out of it for my 12" Clausing (1.5 x 8 spindle). Finally, > a faceplate that's big enough. I don't intend to use this for working between > centers with a dog -- my smaller face plates are fine for that job. This is > strictly for setting work up for boring and faceplate machining. I will > machine the blank down to a simple plate 1.125 thick and 11" in diameter. The > big boss would just increase the overhanging weight and increase the tendency > to chatter. The 1.125 thickness is more than adequate for the 1.5 x 8 > spindle. I'll use the cut-off for some other spindle tool. > Here's the opinions I seek. What should I do with respect to > T-slots, through-slots, and threaded holes? T slots would be 1/2", through > slots 3/8" and threaded holes tapped for 3/8-16 -- all picked so I don't have > to get new clamps, fixtures, etc. Here are some pros and cons as I see it. > > Through-slots: Pro: Easiest to machine, flexible to use. > con: unless I hollow out the back, the plate can't lie > flat for set-up. Harder to adjust, things can wander. > How many slots (I already have a 5" 4-slot and a 7" 6 > slot)? Eight slots? What pattern? > Drilled holes: Pro. Easy to machine. Rigid. Not very flexible. > Con: very easy to ruin. I don't have an edm to take > the broken taps out -- have to sweat out tapping all those holes in cast iron. > T-slots. Pro. Rigid. Flexible. More than enough room for 6 slots, > but also for 8. > con: hardest to machine. Weakest. The metal on this > blank seems a bit more porous than I'd like. > Other? Can't think of any but am open to suggestions. > > Combination? Infinite variety possible. So what are your favorites and why? > If you were making the ultimate11" faceplate, what would your choices be? > Why? What have you done/bought? > > Boris > > ------------------------------------- > Boris Beizer Ph.D. Seminars and Consulting > 1232 Glenbrook Road on Software Testing and > Huntingdon Valley, PA 19006 Quality Assurance > > TEL: 215-572-5580 > FAX: 215-886-0144 > Email direct: bbeizer@sprintmail.com > Email (Forwarded): bbeizer@acm.org, bbeizer@ieee.org > ------------------------------------------ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lathe Info _ Shopmaster From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 12:32:39 GMT -------- What is the spec on these $650.00 Mitutoyo DRO's and does that include all the hardware..or just the box it comes in!! The lists I am looking at, price the read out alone at more than that! I am looking for 3 axis 6" x 12" x 14" Thanks, teenut Stephen Young wrote: > > Don't know about the Shopmaster but you can get Mitutoyo DRO's for around > $650.00 that fit on just about anything. Cheaper to do it this way. Penn > Tool always has a good price for this setup. > > Tony Oresteen wrote: > > > I'm making progress! One lathe (3-in-1 type) that seems to be a good > > value is the Shopmaster 2000. Questions: > > > > 1. How good have their machines been in the past? Support? > > > > 2. Any "bad" features that I should be aware of? > > > > 3. The tech that I spoke with sugested an upgrade to a "digital read > > out". It wasn't cheap ($999) but he said it would really help cutting > > those internal metric threads. Opinions? > > > > Thanks! > > > > Tony > > > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT:Penny-Farthing Bicycle From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 12:37:08 GMT -------- Never a truer word spoken!! teenut of York Alan Inness wrote: > ”Never ask a man if he comes from Yorkshire. If he does he will tell > you. > If he does not, why humiliate him?" - Canon Sydney Smith (scholar and > humorist 1771-1845) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Why shapers are terrific! From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 12:49:53 GMT -------- Right hand carriage wheels are standard on gap bed lathes. Teenut Hugh Strong wrote: > > One very unusual aspect of the lathe part is that the carriage handwheel is > on the right side, > not the left as is the usual practice. Where in the world are lathes > customarily made with > the handwheel on the right side? I think that might help to answer the > question. > > -- Hugh Strong > > Robert Bastow wrote in message > news:380C1D98.8BA4946B@home.com... > > Never seen one (Not sure I want to see one! ;^) > > > > Where in the name of all that is holy did THAT come from? > > > > I though I had seen em all but that's a Doozy (Deuzy ?) That Shaper ram > fair > > gave me the wobblies..! > > > > Machines like this were/are fromtwo or three different sources viz: > > > > A) Military..for mobile workshops and shipboard use..The "Bormilathe" is > an > > example, a stout and versatile machine especially if it is all you have > room > > for. Not a Modern Practice as airborne lift capabilites, large repair > shops on > > Carriers and a mountain of replacement parts have reduced the reliance on > > "Front Line" machinists and shops with bare metal capabilities. > > > > B) Someone's Five Year Plan to give every Commune a self sufficiency in > tractor > > repair..(or Yugo/Trabant manufacture!!) > > > > C) Screaming Nutcases...By Rube Goldberg out of Heath-Robinson (AKA Harbor > > Freight!...in the 3-30 at Granite Park, Shopsmith up! > > > > The Urwick "Metalmaster" was an Amateur designed machine of surprising > > sophistication..Designed and built by one brilliantly "Potty" British > Model > > Engineer for his retirement to a small apartment in Malta. Several > variations of > > this machine went into (Brief!!) production IIRC in the 60's or 70's > > > > The machine in the picture is too "Modern" looking for (A) Too big and > well > > designed for (C)...My money is on (B) with design origins in the Russian > > Bloc..Manufactured in China. > > > > FWIW > > > > teenut > > > > > > > > tmartin@xtra.co.nz wrote: > > > > > > Check this out! Look at the attachments this shaper has! > > > A picture is at the Drop box as lathecom.jpg > > > > > > Combination multi-purpose machine tool incorporating a lathe, > > > milling machine, drill press and shaper on one bed and from one > > > drive motor This is a quality machine intended for a factory > > > maintenance, workshop, mobile workshop, ships workshop or small > > > general engineer. > > > Has hardened and ground headstock gears, taper roller bearing > > > spindle, Norton quick-change gearbox, shaved gears in gearbox, > > > hardened and around bedways with gap, plunger lubricated ways, > > > square turret, toolpost. Lathe headstock is a rigid and ribbed > > > column to provide the shaper, drill and mill which use, in > > > common a table, saddle and knee, > > > The Lathe swings 16" and admits 40" between centres with a gap > > > to swing 25 1/2" > > > The Shaper has a stroke of 11" and a cross feed of over 12" > > > The Milling Machine has a 1" horizontal arbor over a 24" x 8" > > > table > > > The Drilling Machine has a capacity of 1 1/2" diameter with a > > > 5" spindle travel. > > > > > > Amongst the cognoscenti who can identify it? Has anyone seen > > > one in the flesh? > > > Cheers > > > Tom Martin ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Why Cold-Rolled? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 13:00:43 GMT -------- "Fitch R. Williams" wrote: > Maybe I've had bad hot rolled, don't know, but most of it is so gummy > it is terrible to machine and I end up taking the last pass with a > Mill Smooth. > Sounds like the A36 plague is becoming endemic! It seems to me that, because A36 is an absolute requirement for some applications and because it will meet spec. on almost any other HR application, that is all that a lot of steel stockholders carry. The fact that it drives the poor machinist nuts, doesn't seem to figure, and I suspect that a lot of users really don't suspect that this material is shortening their life spans! Ask your local stock holder what grade of steel he would NORMALLY supply in say 1" to 6" dameter HRS I'll bet when you pin him down, it is A#^...sorry Freudiand slip...A36. Ask him WHY? teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lathe Info _ Shopmaster From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 16:32:18 GMT -------- Who sells CBX? It isn't a name I am familiar with. Thanks teenut (or Robert...I was "Bob" for 35 years...You don't want to meet "Bob"!! 8^) XPRTEC wrote: > > Teenut said "I am looking for 3 axis 6" x 12" x 14" > > Bob, > > I just bought the CBX 3d Digital Readout set at $750, it has all the parts, > fasteners, and readout. They advertise that they have never found a machine > that it could not be fit to. Also a 30 day return privilege. Manual is a bit > "thin", they assume some intelligence on buyers part. (Guess that leaves you > and I out!) The readouts are nice but if you have bright lighting in your area > you may need to put a shade on the top because readouts are not real bright. > > SHOPTASK says their machine has the mounting spots already drilled and tapped > and the scales cut to right size (a plus) but their site shows the price as > $699 in one place and $799 in the tools section. > > Jim XPRTEC@AOL.COM ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: CHAT about splitting REC.CRAFTS.METALWORKING From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 16:35:47 GMT -------- That about sums it up Tony! 8^) teenut TS wrote: > > Get over it. > Do you walk around with your magnifiers on too? > > Metalwork does not exist in a vacuum of isolation in the world, nor do > the people who practice it. > Newsgroups are like communities. Communities by nature thrive on > diversity. > Thetas why messages have subject lines. People put OT in the subject > JUST FOR YOU so you can skip it > Read what appeals to you. Who said you have to read everything? If you have to read everything because you're afraid of > missing something, that is something to take up with your shrink. > > BTW: anyone who has to post a message like this anonymously is a real > pussy. > Flame me back directly, by mail or come to my door. Want my phone > number? I at least have the courage of my convictions. > > Tony > ( who occasionally enjoys OT humor, anecdotes, and tails of woe) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Any Ideas for containing swarf on mill From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 16:52:37 GMT -------- I long ago quit on trying to rid my shoes of chips. Now I have special shelf at the top of the basement stairs to hold my "Upstairs shoes" when I am "Downstairs" and my "Downstairs shoes: when I am 'Upstairs" I wear "Topsiders" both "upstairs" and "downstairs" and as they wear out the "Downstairs Topsiders" are honorably retired, the "Upstairs Topsiders" become the "Downstairs Topsiders" and a new pair of "Upstairs Topsiders" are procured to replace the old "Upstairs Topsiders" Did everyone follow that..or shall I repeat it? 8^) teenut TS wrote: > > I have found this to be a problem as well - worse is finding chips in > every room of the house as I can't seem to remember to fastidiously wipe > my feet every time I go upstairs. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: tap, chuck and tooling wanted From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 16:57:56 GMT -------- Ebay! teenut Charles VanLeeuwen wrote: > > I am looking for the following used items (I know where to get them > new--just don't want to pay that much). > > 1.5 inch diameter 8 TPI tap--prefer taper versus plug or bottoming. > > 1.5 inch diameter 8 TPI 3 jaw or 6 jaw self centering chuck--5 to 10 inch > diameter. > > knurling tool. > > set of 5C collets. > > rocker style toolpost to fit 1 1/16 tool post slot on compound. > > quick change tool post set for above. > > (My lathe is a 10 inch Rockwell) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Anyone heard of 'GAMET' Lathe From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 19:49:14 GMT -------- The lathe is probably a Colchester. Every one I ever saw had a nameplate proclaming the use of GAMET bearings. teenut Adrian Hodgson wrote: > > Came across a lathe under covers today could not get a good look, seems > to be around 5" centre height and 24 to 30 inch between centres. > > Would say 3 phase. > > Left hand side cover was off and saw an electric clutch to the top and a > few flat toothed belts. > > Small name plate on the head stock had the word GAMET or so it seemed > under a lot of muck. > > Could not see any information on Tony pages www.lathes.co.uk > > Any body know of this machine? > -- > Cheers Adrian > > Return any mail to me via this link:- mailto:adrian@aphtrading.co.uk ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How'd they do that? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 20:04:15 GMT -------- I was, (still can be) done the hard way...Hammer, chisel, hacksaw, files, surfaceplate and "raddle" (red lead & oil)! No micrometers or verniers..just a surface plate, square, ruler and a sharpe scribe. Youthful eyes help! Good for building skills, character, muscles, calouses, patience and perseverance. Yes I have done one. Yes I could still do it. No I don't ever want to do another!! teenut Bob Chilcoat wrote: > > I was touring around the RAF Aircraft Museum at RAF Hendon on a trip to > London last year, and up on a balcony came across some beautiful > examples of apprentice examination pieces from the early days of > aircraft construction and repair. The most common of these examination > pieces were blocks of steel, roughly 3-4" on a side, with a square hole > through the center. A second cube-shaped steel block was inserted into > this hole so that it just fit, with an almost invisible gap between the > two. Apparently to pass the exam, this inner block had to fit in any of > the possible orientations, without binding and without any significant > ridge formed between the inner and outer pieces on the surfaces with the > hole. > > This seems tough enough using good machine tools, but I gathered from > the description that these had to be made by hand, using only files and > scrapers. If so, what was the technique used to make these things? > Blew my amateur metalworker's mind. > > Bob > > Applying technology is simply finding the right wrench with which to > pound in the correct screw. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Any Ideas for containing swarf on mill From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 20:26:06 GMT -------- That's the spirit Attilla! we need more people like you to lighten up this group. To many "Over Achievers" trying to actually MAKE things!! With a name like "Attilla" I know you and I could have some FUN in a machine shop! 8^) teenut the terrible Attilla Danko wrote: > Making chips is fun. On rare occaisons, I keep the leftovers. > > -ad ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How'd they do that? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 20:32:59 GMT -------- Doug Goncz wrote: > The apprentices should be glad they didn't have to dig the ore, collect fuel, > slag a furnace, pour an ingot, and then finish the block, hole, and mating cube > while the metal was still hot from the pour! Did I ever say we DIDN'T!!! ;^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Any Ideas for containing swarf on mill From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 23:34:48 GMT -------- Jeff Pack wrote: > > A better shoe chip cleaner, is what us farm types have, to brush > sheep shit, off our shoes. > Sheep shit has no stick..no "Staying Power"! I am waiting for an authoratative response from the pig farmers...They KNOW shit!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Pointed Edge Finder From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 23:41:11 GMT -------- We discussed this a coupla weeks ago John. Try dejanews. Fundamentally, the pointy end isn't an edge finder but used to pinpoint the center of a couple of scribed lines..as in: Eyeball one..back off..eyeball t'other..advance to position first thought of..Bingo, you're on center. teenut John Jacobs wrote: > > Anybody use a pointed edge finder ? I have never used one but I am > assuming that it is used somewhat like a wiggler. Any help would be > apprecated. > Thanks, > Chuck Key ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: split rec.crafts.metalworking up? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 23:50:32 GMT -------- Welcome to the Rec.crafts. metalworkinghotstove. 8^) teenut Bill Richman wrote: > > I'd vote against a split. I'm here to learn about metalworking from the > people who do it, and I like to see all the opinions from well-rounded > people. Right now, it's like going into the old hardware store and sitting > around the world's largest wood stove, drinking coffee and listening to a > couple of hundred guys shoot the breeze. I've found interests here and > learned about useful things that I would never have known existed if they'd > been pigeon-holed off in a specific category. I love the historical > digressions, the off-the-wall humor, and the shaggy-dog stories. If you go > chopping the group into pieces, I'm afraid you'll end up with more arguments > about "That message is more appropriate to rec.crafts. > metalworking.pins.cotter, and shouldn't have been posted here in rec.crafts. > metalworking.pins.clevis" than you do about metalworking; I've seen it > happen to other good newsgroups. I don't always read every message, but I > scan all the headings. Generally I use my newsreader's "mark as read" > option to hide batches of messages I'm sure I don't need to read, "mark for > retrieval" any that I'm interested in, hit "retrieve marked messages" and > start reading. I'm afraid you'll lose a lot of the personal feel and the > benefits of knowledge cross-over if you start segregating. > > -Bill Richman (bill_r@inetnebr.com) > http://incolor.inetnebr.com/bill_r - Home of the COSMAC Elf Microcomputer > Simulator, Fun with Molten Metal, Orphaned Robots, and Technological Oddities. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: split rec.crafts.metalworking up? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 20 Oct 1999 23:52:41 GMT -------- John Miller wrote: > > kenneth knaell wrote in message > news:7ujgos$8o3$1@autumn.news.rcn.net... > > Isn't splitting the group up to make it quicker to read the same as > cutting > > a pizza in fewer pieces so that you don't eat so much? > > Almost. Maybe more like cutting a pizza in pieces and putting them on > different plates. Yeh!..they all get cold before you get to them! Maybe some people just need to learn to read faster! 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Olympic Pins From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 21 Oct 1999 03:37:54 GMT -------- We make our all own pins here Cobber! 8^) teenut johnnyhart@start.com.au wrote: > > Hey All! > > Just wondering if anyone in this group is interested in collecting > Olympic Pins. I sell some via online auction as do many other people, > check out http://www.stuff.com.au if you're interested in Olympic Pins, > it's a Sydney based auction site and there are a lot of Sydney 2000 > Olympic Pins up for auction there, heaps, it's going off! > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Welding a rifle bolt handle..... From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 21 Oct 1999 03:45:09 GMT -------- Regular MS wire works fine. The Mauser bolts are only MS, casehardened. I use it when I cut and lengthen or shorten 98 actions, bolts etc., as well as replacing bolt handles, square bridging, pit filling and any other welding on those actions. Some swear by 3% nickel for gas welding..I don't gas weld but I have tried that for tig, it works ok but is expensive and blues a different shade. teenut west wrote: > > I'm going to replace the bolt handle on a '96 Mauser this weekend. > I'm planning to Tig weld the new handle on. Any advice on the best wire > to use? > > west ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Pointed Edge Finder From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 21 Oct 1999 03:50:43 GMT -------- Waddya mean "If this is true"..Do you think I lied to you?? ;^) A solid pointed piece works JUST as well...Provided that the point on the piece is dead center and the collet or chuck spins it dead true. Most don't!! So the ability to center the point has a certain advantage..wouldn't you agree? teenut Mark Winlund wrote: > > If this is true, why is the point moveable? If it's just eyeballing, > wouldn't a solid pointed piece work just as well? > > Mark > > Robert Bastow wrote in message <380E5415.6C5278C5@home.com>... > >We discussed this a coupla weeks ago John. Try dejanews. > > > >Fundamentally, the pointy end isn't an edge finder but used to pinpoint the > >center of a couple of scribed lines..as in: Eyeball one..back off..eyeball > >t'other..advance to position first thought of..Bingo, you're on center. > > > >teenut > > > >John Jacobs wrote: > >> > >> Anybody use a pointed edge finder ? I have never used one but I am > >> assuming that it is used somewhat like a wiggler. Any help would be > >> apprecated. > >> Thanks, > >> Chuck Key ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Pointed Edge Finder From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 21 Oct 1999 04:05:47 GMT -------- Just to clarify for the newcomers Alfred...It is used to locate the center of a hole that you wish to drill..the centerlines that is. Though it CAN be used to locate an existing hole..by "eyeballing" it in the center or by "running it off" on the edge of the hole, it is not reliably accurate for this, simply because, for the method to be dead accurate the hole must have perfect lip...any imperfection of the lip of the hole will give a false reading because you are only getting a knife edge contact with the tapered center point To find the center of an existing hole, the regular cylindrical edgefinder is more reliable..working off the inside face of a larger hole, or a gauge block against an inserted pin gauge on a smaller hole. 8^) teenut Alfred Kimmel wrote: > > Yes- It is used to locate the center of a hole. > Al > > John Jacobs wrote: > > > Anybody use a pointed edge finder ? I have never used one but I am > > assuming that it is used somewhat like a wiggler. Any help would be > > apprecated. > > Thanks, > > Chuck Key ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How'd they do that? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 21 Oct 1999 06:04:44 GMT -------- Steve Rayner wrote: > > 1) A vice 2)Copper jaw protectors [ protect the work from the jaws) 3) > files. 4) Skill! > Hey! Did you guys get to use a VICE!! No Fair!! ;^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Carbide Drill Wisdom? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 21 Oct 1999 07:03:15 GMT -------- Carbide drills are for REALLY hard or abrasive materials Steve..I don't thing you will have much joy useing them on something as soft as stainless steel. The reason they chip is that they are too sharp!! Huh! The tendency with a newly sharpened drill (or reamer for that matter) is to grab and snatch a little bit, until the dege gets a microscopic amount of wear on it...Kinda like a regular drill snatches in brass. Normally, with a HSS drill, this doesn't present a problem..the drill is tough enough to take the microscopic deformations etc without chipping. Carbide, on the other hand, just isn't. The only way it can "Give" is to chip or snap. You will find the same thing happens with carbide milling cutters too! If you are in a position where you simply "Haveta, Gotsta" use those drills you should try using a MINIMUM center hole...just enough to get the drill running true. Better still, use a proper centering drill..it is what they are made for. A "Center Drill" AKA a "Slocombe" drill is properly used for making the center holes in which your lathe tailstock center runs. It is all the wrong shape for starting drills!!. They tend to be used for that "bastard" purpose because a) the name sounds about right, b) there is usually one close at hand. c) they are short and stiff enough to start reasonably true!! ARRGHH!! So use a pukkah centering drill..ground to the same point angle as your carbide drill. You can get those cheap on ebay too..I just stocked up on them. DO NOT use a pilot drill!! Go to full diameter, run about 150% the speed you would use for HSS and use a fine feed. Don't let it rub..that will only work harden the stainless, but don't try and "Horse" it through either..in other words, use it just as you would a HSS drill, with a bit finer feed, but be more wary of applying sudden loads. If you have a quill lock, snug it up. Not so you can't push the drill, but enough to dampen vibrations..Especially the RADIAL vibrations which are doing most of the damage here. Try "Busting" the edge of your new drill with a diamond hone..just a couple of wipes to take that razor edge off it. It sounds cruel and unusual I know, but it works like gangbusters in taming the chatter on gundrill bits and chambering reamers. A "D" type gundrill bit will sing like a lark and fall to pieces on you until you learn the art of "doctoring" the edge in the way I described. One trick, maybe not applicable here..but useful to keep up your sleeve, is to start the drill through a business card!! Obviously it spins with the drill and only the very tips of the cutting edges protrude through the card. However, the fibre that is trapped just back of the cutting edge acts as a microscopic "Traveling steady" for just long enough to get the tool "Settled down" into the cut, without starting to snatch and chatter. This also will cure chattering on a morse taper, a rifle chamber, a taper pin or a taper lede hand reamer..the trick in all these cases is to wrap the reamer in a single thickness of typing paper and feed in firmly, again, damping the quill against RADIAL movement. 8^) teenut Steve Lindsay wrote: > > I'm new at using carbide drills. I picked up a bunch of carbide > twist drills from ebay. They look and are sharpened similar > to a regular high speed twist drill. I'm drilling 303 stainless > and am setting up in the turret like thus: > 1st position is just a stop to help stock in the collet chuck in the right > spot. > 2nd position is carbide .258 drill full depth (1.512") > 3rd position is carbide .297 drill full depth (1.512") > 4th position is highspeed steel 9/32 (.281")flat end drill to > square up bottom of hole full depth (1.512"). > 5th position is 5/16" carbide reamer (the reamers I'm using have a step). > Ream so the second step is a depth of 1.222" deep > > I am first center drilling in another lathe the end of 303 to help > the carbide drill center. The center drill I am using > is 5/16 dia and I'm almost taking it in to where the 5/16" dia starts. > I then move it to the turret lathe and am having trouble with > the first carbide drill. The carbide is chipping big > time. At first I ran the lathe about the speed you would > for a high speed drill thinking there would be less chatter > until the drill gets in a ways and then I would speed it > up. Well I guess it must be chattering. It really didn't sound > like much of a chatter....about what it would if you were using > a high speed drill. But I guess it was to much chatter as > it sure made a mess of the carbide cutting edge. I finally > just didn't worry about the chipping and speeded up the > lathe and pushed. It went in pretty good even chipped. > With the next (3rd) position I ran the speed and feed fast > right away. It didn't chip this drill much but there are still > tiny chips on the edge if you look close. > > What am I doing wrong? I'm wondering if I should skip the > first carbide drill and just go directly to the larger one. Also > maybe I should use a smaller centerdrill hole so the carbide > drill doesn't have as much time to chatter around until it hits > the bottom of the center drill hole. Any ideas? > > What about the 5/16 carbide reamer? Should I be running this > slow with cutting oil or fast without the cutting oil. > > Thank you for any carbide wisdom! > Steve > > -- > Hand Engraving > http://www.angelfire.com/biz3/handengraving ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 1/16" staineless rods From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 21 Oct 1999 07:13:02 GMT -------- Some Welding Supply!!! But not unusual..even the big one I go to in Atlanta has to order in anything but structural welding/MS rods?? Go back and try to talk to someone other than the "Counter Hand"...the outside tech rep is usually a bit more up on the stuff they have hidden in the back. In my case I was in need of 1/16" 4140 and they had to order them in!!! but meanwhile I did find some mig wire on their shelf that kept me going for the week it took them to get the real McCoy. Maybe you can do the same. Still shaking my head!! teenut Andrew T wrote: > > I was told that I could get 1/16" stainless steel rods at a welding > supply. All I could find was 1/8" and they were the type with the > coating on them for welding. Perhaps I'm looking in the wrong type of > place? Any ideas as to where to look? Eagle and Home Depot have nothing > like that. Thanks! > > Andy ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: split rec.crafts.metalworking up? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 21 Oct 1999 07:32:08 GMT -------- mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > rec.crafts.metalworking_with_teenut and > rec.crafts.metalworking_without > > Those who are the strictly dry, bare bones technical sorts > can choose accordingly. I choose the one WITHOUT!! Hey! It's bad enough I have to SLEEP with the bugger!! Robert Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Seasoning temp for cast iron? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 21 Oct 1999 11:54:31 GMT -------- I am not sure what you mean by "seasoning" "Meehanite" is a proprietary material/process that includes heat treatment that will be done at the foundry that casts the lathe bed. "Seasoning" on the other hand is the term generally used for the longer term "weathering" of grey iron castings..leaving them outdoors where normal daily and seasonal temperature changes effect a relieving of casting stresses over a 3 to 12 or more month period. On larger or complex castings..like a lathe bed..this is best preceeded by a rough machining operation. Claims are made by some, that this period can be shortened by heat cycling or vibration..but then these are generally the same people who complain when their lathe bed or table saw top warps. ;^) teenut Marv Windecker wrote: > > Delurking now... > > Does anyone know at what temp an iron casting > would be seasoned at before final machining? > Specifically a lathe bed cast of Meehanite iron. > > Thanks in advance, > Marv ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Pointed Edge Finder From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 21 Oct 1999 13:48:08 GMT -------- Yes! Go read the Deja news..it was all covered then! teenut Tony Jeffree wrote: > > On Thu, 21 Oct 1999 13:01:10 GMT, mikegraham@sprint.ca (Mike Graham) > wrote: > > >On Wed, 20 Oct 1999 20:20:36 -0700, Mark Winlund wrote: > >>If this is true, why is the point moveable? If it's just eyeballing, > >>wouldn't a solid pointed piece work just as well? > > > > This whole conversation happened a month or two ago. The reason the > >pointy bit is moveable is so you can center it in the quill. If you have > >one thousandth of runout in the quill then you have that amount of > >inaccuracy built into any solid indicator. If, however, you spin the > >indicator up to 1000rpm and you use the blunt end of your pencil to gently > >nudge the point it will begin to run true. Apparently (have no way to > >measure it, personally) it's possible to get the point accurate to within a > >ten thousandth of an inch, even if your chuck has a thousandth of runout. > > So basically, it slides so you can center it. Then you shut off the mill > >and use the point to visually locate the scribe marks or whatever. > > > > So paraphrasing: > > 1) You centre the point using a technique that can centre it to > within a tenth of a thou. > > 2) You then use the terribly accurately centred point to locate > scriber marks etc. using a visual technique that cannot possibly get > you closer than a couple of thou or so, on a good day. > > Am I missing something here? > > Regards, > Tony > > Website: http://www.jeffree.u-net.com/ > When replying, delete "X." from the Email address to remove anti-SPAM measures. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Extending a motor shaft? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 21 Oct 1999 14:06:32 GMT -------- I know for a fact that Leeson will supply an extended length shaft on almost any motor. I know for a fact that they do this by welding on an extension (Accurately of course) and re-milling the keyway) I know this for a fact, because me and a buddy used to make good money doing this for them on a sub-contract basis. There is nothing to stop you from doing this yourself..or if you prefer, get a good welder to do that bit for you. Dismantle the motor first or you will fry the bearings. Weld on a shaft extension, straighten and centerdrill in a steady. Turn to finished dimensions, remill the keyway. reassemble, return to Leeson with invoi...OK forget the last bit!! But you get the Idea!! teenut 8^) Marty Escarcega wrote: > > I have an odd ball 56C motor that I need to replace. Its odd in the fact that > it has a 4" long 5/8" shaft. I can't find one anywhere. The shaft is this long > because it extends into a housing with a multi-step pulley on it. The pulley's > hub is not long enough to be able to use a standard motor shaft and reach. > > My question is this: > Can I use a rigid shaft coupler and a length of 5/8" shaft to extend the > motors shaft? There is room to do this... > > If not, does anyone else have any ideas? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How'd they do that? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 21 Oct 1999 15:52:12 GMT -------- Jack Erbes wrote: > They may have clamped it in a Henway, that was a common technique back > then. > > -- > Jack in Sonoma, CA, USA (jack@vom.com) The only thing we clamped in "Henways" was chickens! Now I know some of the "old boilers" were tough and required a correspondingly heavy duty henway. But I never saw one strong enough (or the right shape for that matter), to hold a chunk of steel while you filed it to shape. What IS a "Henway"? teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Pointed Edge Finder From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 21 Oct 1999 18:23:17 GMT -------- A lot of valid points Tony so I'll try to answer them as I come to them..And thanks for taking the time to read through Deja stuff as we can now start off on the same page. Tony Jeffree wrote: > > On Thu, 21 Oct 1999 13:48:08 GMT, Robert Bastow > wrote: > > >Yes! > > > >Go read the Deja news..it was all covered then! Ouch! Bit snippy wasn't I..Sorry Tony! > > > >teenut > I couldn't disagree with you on the principle. The point (pardon the > pun...) of my post was to question how accurately it is possible to > get the point centered over scribed lines using visual sighting > methods. A tenth of a thou? a thou? ten thou? Half a thou is fairly easy with a bit of care...Closer than that not a deal more difficult..using a glass and the right techniques. Scribing fine lines using a height gage, Jo blocks and a surface plate..and subsequently "reading them back" or setting up to them (with the aid of a 10X loupe,) to a repeatable accuracy of less that half a thou total spread, should be..Certainly used to be..an expected skill of any "toolmaker" Professional or self-respecting "amateur" CONSISTANTLY? Yes, but how much closer would depend on luck and a following wind as well as a pretty skilled operator. > If the answer is a small number of thou or worse, then you are not > losing terribly much by using a solid pointed piece directly in a > collet or chuck. Real BAAAAD assumption..!! "Accuracy is the result of methodical attention to extreme detail" teenut's Law! At every stage, in almost every machining operation, errors tend to grow..to multiply in fact. If we get sloppy about the "tenths" at the front end then there is no way to expect to hold tolerances larger by an order of magnitude >Particularly if your next action is to cut metal > using that collet or chuck, as the resultant cutting will itself be > made inaccurate to the extent of the runout. Fortunately the runout is negated if we introduce a boring operation. I think we should bear in mind, that "wigglers" and "centerfinders" etc date back to before DRO's and indeed to before the common availability of traceable length standards...Johannsen Blocks and the like. It was a vital part of a Toolmaker's skill to be able to produce and reproduce extreme accuracy with simple bench methods. Indeed, until quite recently, our international standards of length relied on someone reading fine scribed lines on a bar, with a microscope! Not many of us need or want that order of accuracy in our home shops. But from time to time some do..and it is comforting to know how to go about achieving it should the need ever arise. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Pointed Edge Finder From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 21 Oct 1999 18:30:48 GMT -------- Please don't show him that method !! Pretty please 8^) 8^) Go to Deja news and read the explanations, the theory and the practice of how to properly use a "Center finder" that were so lovingly and laboriously typed out my myself, and several others...less than a month ago!! Pleeeease 8^) teenut Felice Luftschein & Nicholas Carter wrote: > > On Wed, 20 Oct 1999 20:20:36 -0700, "Mark Winlund" > wrote: > > >If this is true, why is the point moveable? If it's just eyeballing, > >wouldn't a solid pointed piece work just as well? > I use it by getting the point running true, then bringing it down into > the centerpuched spot. It it is off center, when you bring it up again > it will describe a small circle, rather than continuing to run true - > this is because as it goes down the slope of the conical punch mark, > it will deflect towards the center of the punched depression. > On soft metals (Al) you can sometimes cause an error as the > centerfinder tip will make it's own little divot in the work, and seem > to be running true to the centerpunch - moving it a little and > retesting will avoid that error. > (come on over Mark, I'll show you how I use it.) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Pointed Edge Finder From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 21 Oct 1999 18:39:29 GMT -------- Please read earlier posts..the Center finder is not for finding the center of existing holes..it cannot do that with any consistant or repeatable accuracy. The center finder's function is to find the center of a hole..by design, one that has been laid out with scribed lines..BEFORE it is drilled or bored!! In other words it is used to locate the center of a LINE and by definition..at the intersection of two lines..the POINT an which you want a hole to be made. Using the tapered face to locate on and edge (of a hole or slot) is so fraught with potential areas of error as to not ever be considered seriously for accurate set up. teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article <2529-380E405B-49@storefull-267.iap.bryant.webtv.net>, > JNS99@webtv.net (John Jacobs) wrote: > > Anybody use a pointed edge finder ? I have never used one but I am > > assuming that it is used somewhat like a wiggler. Any help would be > > apprecated. > > Hmm not this again. I too was confused about the pointy tip, but > the previous discussion made two things clear. > > You can use the pointy end to line up to a hole that is too small > to use the cylindrical end in. One inserts the running point into > the hole, and dials back till it just runs out. Here, if using the > cylinder type, you subtract half the diameter of the finder to get > your spindle over the edge. > > But you don't know the diameter you are running the finder at, because > of its cone shape, right? So what to do. Easy - just don't change > the *height* of the finder, and then sweep the other side of the hole. > The exact diamter of the finder drops out of the calculation if doing > two sides of a hole. By keeping the height the same, you keep that > effective diameter the same. Other's comments about burrs or > chamfers on the holes edge are well taken. > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Welding a rifle bolt handle..... From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 21 Oct 1999 18:49:58 GMT -------- Jack Erbes wrote: Different experience, thats all Jack. I have never tried to blue a bolt handle after welding...I prefer mine bright or color case hardened. The only one I ever did with Bownells 3% nickel rod polished out to show a discernable band of different hue, It was quite obvious where the weld was..I didn't like it, cut it out and rewelded with MS wire. "Color" on polished metal is a subjective thing at best and so much depends on the finishing methods and mediums..and in the case of ancient mild steels such as found in old "Mousers" a lot depends on how they tarnish out over the next few days after polishing. teenut > I started using that wire because Brownells said it blended in perfectly > with the steels used in bolt handles and bodies when polished or when > blued. And that has been exactly my experience with it. Also it flows > nicely, is very low in impurities, and comes in .080 and .062 sizes in > 1/4, 1/2 or 1 pound quantities. > > I noticed that t-nut said his results with it were the opposite from > mine. I suppose that can happen. But remember, he also said a while > back that he is not always right :>). > > -- > Jack in Sonoma, CA, USA (jack@vom.com) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Defacing Currency Was . . . "What is this metal". From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 21 Oct 1999 18:55:32 GMT -------- Spehro Pefhany wrote: > I wasn't into metal the last time I was there, but it's got just about > anything you might want for DIY purposes, including stuff I have not seen > at home. Do tell?? 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Threading on a CNC Mill From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 21 Oct 1999 19:05:26 GMT -------- Gee that's Purty! 8^) teenut Tony Jeffree wrote: > > Following a previous thread (pun intended) on threading, I have been > experimenting with cutting threads using a stepper controlled dividing > head as a 4th axis on a Taig CNC mill. The penultimate photo on the > following page: > > http://www.jeffree.u-net.com/divhead.htm > > shows an example of cutting in progress. > > Regards, > Tony > > Website: http://www.jeffree.u-net.com/ > When replying, delete "X." from the Email address to remove anti-SPAM measures. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Any Ideas for containing swarf on mill From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 21 Oct 1999 19:16:37 GMT -------- The footware of choice in heavy machine shops during 'My Time" (and maybe still is) was the steel shod, wood soled, leather upper, clog. Far more comfortable for long shifts on hard floors but also an order of magnitude more resistant to hot, sharp, chips than leather soles. Rubber soles would not have lasted a week in that environment (even a shift by some machines!!) I'll bet they are still available in the north of England. teenut Paul Koning wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > Jeff Pack wrote: > > > > > > A better shoe chip cleaner, is what us farm types have, to brush > > > sheep shit, off our shoes. > > > > > Sheep shit has no stick..no "Staying Power"! > > > > I am waiting for an authoratative response from the pig farmers...They KNOW > > shit!! > > Well, the classic Dutch solution is wooden shoes. No, those > aren't worn because they are cute -- but rather because > you can step in and out of them quickly, so you can leave > the mud and clay outside. I'd expect it would work just > as well with swarf. Well, almost. Mud &c. washes off, swarf > might be harder. > > Only issue would be where to get them if you aren't in Holland... :-( > > paul ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Pointed Edge Finder From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 21 Oct 1999 19:28:36 GMT -------- Just like using it in a hole Bill..this presupposes that the slot (or hole) has a perfectly formed edge that is dead even on both sides. That is with a dead sqare and unblemished edge..or a chamfer that is equal on both sides to a pretty fine degree. Better to work off the flat inside face with the cylindrical edge finder (if the slot is wide enough) or off a wedged in block if it is not. As an aside. I do have one of those double ended edge and center finders..with the cylinder on one end and the center point on the other. If I were to buy today I would get one with a (Different sized) cylinder at both ends and stick to the wobbler point for center and line location..it is a lot easier to use accurately. 8^) teenut BillDarby wrote: > > No trig at all John,, Just go into the (narrow groove) slot, move to one side till it > kicks out, record the reading, then move to the other side until it kicks out again, > note the reading, mean the two readings and that's the center of the slot. (just > don't move the Z between readings) > > Bill Darb > > John Ireland wrote: > > > Tony, > > Just got a new edge finder, so I went out and got the instruction > > sheet. Lots of pointy ends displayed, but no mention of how to use it. > > The technical discussion is on finding edges using the cylindrical > > parts. I believe that people have found ways to make the pointy end > > useful, but the intent of the pointy end is to sell one to the guy who > > realizes that the next guy has one and he doesn't. If you need to work > > to scribed lines, a center-scope is the way to go anyway (my opinion). > > I guess that I've seen too many times when a guy wuth a small kit and a > > good head can get the job done, and the guy who doesn't have a clue will > > try yet another tool to make up for his lack of understanding of first > > principles. > > > > One use I do see for the point is locating the edge of a narrow groove. > > It would take a bit of trig, and knowing the angle of the point, but > > this is the type of thing I would do by putting a pin in the slot, and > > measure from the pin. Lots of different ways for different folks, and > > in the end all that matters is that the path you took to get the job > > done (to print of course) made a bit of money for the shop. Enough with > > old fart philosophy. Enjoy the stuff on your site, and keep up the good > > work. > > > > john > > > > Tony Jeffree wrote: > > > > > > On Thu, 21 Oct 1999 13:48:08 GMT, Robert Bastow > > > wrote: > > > > > > >Yes! > > > > > > > >Go read the Deja news..it was all covered then! > > > > > > > >teenut > > > > > > > >Tony Jeffree wrote: > > > >> > > > >> On Thu, 21 Oct 1999 13:01:10 GMT, mikegraham@sprint.ca (Mike Graham) > > > >> wrote: > > > >> > > > >> >On Wed, 20 Oct 1999 20:20:36 -0700, Mark Winlund wrote: > > > >> >>If this is true, why is the point moveable? If it's just eyeballing, > > > >> >>wouldn't a solid pointed piece work just as well? > > > >> > > > > >> > This whole conversation happened a month or two ago. The reason the > > > >> >pointy bit is moveable is so you can center it in the quill. If you have > > > >> >one thousandth of runout in the quill then you have that amount of > > > >> >inaccuracy built into any solid indicator. If, however, you spin the > > > >> >indicator up to 1000rpm and you use the blunt end of your pencil to gently > > > >> >nudge the point it will begin to run true. Apparently (have no way to > > > >> >measure it, personally) it's possible to get the point accurate to within a > > > >> >ten thousandth of an inch, even if your chuck has a thousandth of runout. > > > >> > So basically, it slides so you can center it. Then you shut off the mill > > > >> >and use the point to visually locate the scribe marks or whatever. > > > >> > > > > >> > > > >> So paraphrasing: > > > >> > > > >> 1) You centre the point using a technique that can centre it to > > > >> within a tenth of a thou. > > > >> > > > >> 2) You then use the terribly accurately centred point to locate > > > >> scriber marks etc. using a visual technique that cannot possibly get > > > >> you closer than a couple of thou or so, on a good day. > > > >> > > > >> Am I missing something here? > > > >> > > > > > > Ok...have read the old thread. And the main use as recorded in that > > > thread was to sight along perpendicular scribed lines to get a visual > > > centring of the spindle over the intersection of the lines. The > > > punchline (from yourself, Teenut) was: > > > > > > > A solid pointed piece works JUST as well...Provided that the point > > > > on the piece is dead center and the collet or chuck spins it dead true. > > > > > > >Most don't!! > > > > > > >So the ability to center the point has a certain advantage.. > > > >wouldn't you agree? > > > > > > I couldn't disagree with you on the principle. The point (pardon the > > > pun...) of my post was to question how accurately it is possible to > > > get the point centered over scribed lines using visual sighting > > > methods. A tenth of a thou? a thou? ten thou? > > > > > > If the answer is a tenth, and assuming, of course, that the scribed > > > lines themselves are accurate to a tenth...big assumption there...then > > > it certainly is useful to be able to centre the point on the axis of > > > the spindle to a tenth. > > > > > > If the answer is a small number of thou or worse, then you are not > > > losing terribly much by using a solid pointed piece directly in a > > > collet or chuck. Particularly if your next action is to cut metal > > > using that collet or chuck, as the resultant cutting will itself be > > > made inaccurate to the extent of the runout. > > > > > > Regards, > > > Tony > > > > > > Website: http://www.jeffree.u-net.com/ > > > When replying, delete "X." from the Email address to remove anti-SPAM measures. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Hey Ned! From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 21 Oct 1999 19:31:09 GMT -------- Ned-less to say! Plonk teenut nedc2508@my-deja.com wrote: > > Hey Ned! > > We hope you will join... Club Ned! > > Neds from around the world are participating. Our unusual name and our > experiences with htis name are what we have in common. > > You can even appoint members of your family or personal friends to be > Honourary Neds as associate members of Club Ned. > > Plus the Head Ned will even call them to congratulate them on their > new found Ned-dom. > > Please visit: > > http://members.home.com/clubned for all the fun. > > or email: clubned@home.com > > We would love to hear from more Neds! > > Regards, > > Ned Courtney > Head Ned (self-appointed) > Club Ned World Nedquarters > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Any Ideas for containing swarf on mill From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 21 Oct 1999 20:12:52 GMT -------- Arghh! Is nothing sacred any more! I bet they don't come in my favorite color back then...Chrome tanned green! Seriously IIRC, that was the only color..you dubbined the heck out of them, plus a week in the shop and they were gloss black!! One pair lasted me three years of double shifts in the "Heavy Shops" teenut teenut Tony Jeffree wrote: > > On Thu, 21 Oct 1999 19:16:37 GMT, Robert Bastow > wrote: > > >The footware of choice in heavy machine shops during 'My Time" (and maybe still > >is) was the steel shod, wood soled, leather upper, clog. Far more comfortable > >for long shifts on hard floors but also an order of magnitude more resistant to > >hot, sharp, chips than leather soles. > > > >Rubber soles would not have lasted a week in that environment (even a shift by > >some machines!!) > > > >I'll bet they are still available in the north of England. > > > > That they are. However, they mostly emanate from designer boutiques > these days, with designer price-tags that are heavier than the > original working clogs... > > Regards, > Tony > > Website: http://www.jeffree.u-net.com/ > When replying, delete "X." from the Email address to remove anti-SPAM measures. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Any Ideas for containing swarf on mill From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 21 Oct 1999 23:21:49 GMT -------- John Stevenson wrote: True Yorkshire style..in a bowl not a sausage skin. I used to have to go to the local Co-oP Slaughterhouse to fetch a bucket of pig's blood for it. Delicious, fried with ham and eggs! teenut > [Q] Where did you mam used to make the black pudding ?? > > [A] ?? > -- > > Regards, > > John Stevenson at > L Stevenson [Engineers] > Nottingham, England. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How'd they do that? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 21 Oct 1999 23:24:11 GMT -------- Chuck Sherwood wrote: > (IMO monica jokes are too) > > chuck mOnica jokes are too..What? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How'd they do that? From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 22 Oct 1999 00:44:50 GMT -------- I am begining to get the impression that I have just been introduced to "snipe hunting" ?8^) teenut List of "Fellow Hunters" Jeff O'Malley Jack in Sonoma Paul Liebenberg "Lest they be forgot". 8^) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Machinery's Handbook 17 th 1966 From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 22 Oct 1999 01:40:29 GMT -------- Machinerys Handbook. 1966 - 1999 without a single rip, tear or dirty fingermark! What a waste of a young life!! It shouldn't happen to a dog. Will somebody who cares please give this lost little book a good home, where it can get all the rips, tears, and dirty finger marks it has been so CRUELLY deprived of. I would bring it here..but all my MHs have been brought up to such a happy, rough and tumble life that I am afraid the shock might just prove too much for it. As for you MISTER Dale Randall I have NOTHING to say to you!! teenut dale randall wrote: > > I have this for sale on ebay it is like new no rips tears or dirty > finger marks. > http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=183969392 ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Power drive question? From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 22 Oct 1999 01:57:39 GMT -------- Hmmm! A drive shaft 1/2" dia x 36" @ 10,000 rev/min. Estimated half life less than one nano second. Have you thought of using a regular, high speed, heavy duty flexible drive shaft, inside your tube, in place of the 1/2" solid shaft? What are the service conditions? Duty cycle, expected working life etc. If this is for a one shot job, you would probably get away with running the shaft in a series of moly-filled nylon bushings inside the tube. Otherwise... The only other solutions that spring to mind are a couple of intermediate support bearings, OR a very stiff outer tube and the shaft under extreme tension. I doubt you want to go that route! Tom Albers wrote: > > I want to run a drive shaft, 1/2 in. dia, inside a pipe. The shaft > would be about 36" long, running about 10,00 RPM. I plan on a ball > bearing at each end. The load at the end of the shaft would be a > router-type cutter. The drive end would be powered by a pulley-belt > drive. Would this work?? I'm concerned about the shaft whipping and > vibrating due to the length of shaft between bearings. I'm no engineer, > but aligning a center bearing would be really difficult. I realize this > is not the kind of thing a normal person would do every day , but,,, > > Any input greatly appreciated. > > Tom Albers > Lacey WA ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Boring Small Engine Cylinders From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 22 Oct 1999 02:11:28 GMT -------- Mike Baldwin wrote: > > Ah gee Kevin, maybe you should have emailed you're super response, > thanks for the insightful observations a-hole > > MIKE "I'm sorry I asked" BALDWIN Yes Mike, and so are a lot of other people on this list. What Kevin pointed out is perfectly valid..this is a PUBLIC forum where advice is FREELY given..often by people really pushed for time..and certainly too pushed for time to want to start what often becomes a protracted exchange with a perfect stranger The advice given is made part of the PUBLIC Domain so we can all share it, and for your protection too. How otherwise would you know if you were getting good advice? Or as is now certain, following your uncalled for and unseemly outburst, a slew of carefully diguised, privately emailed instructions, on how to go screw yourself...and the small cylinders you rode in on! Plonk! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Rhodes Shaper Question From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 22 Oct 1999 04:43:07 GMT -------- Hmm!! Which of my Children, Limbs and Organs could I manage without? 8^) teenut PLAlbrecht wrote: > Apply the same ratio to today's car prices, and what would/should such a shaper > cost? How many here would/could actually buy one new at 1999 prices? > > Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.woodworking Subject: Re: Safety question: Wearing gloves From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 22 Oct 1999 04:50:26 GMT -------- Please please please Albert..go with the barrier cream!! Try this demo..It always worked on my students/apprentices. Chuck a SMOOTH length of 1/2" drill rod in the lathe or mill chuck. Take a latex glove, hold it gently by one finger tip and brush it against the rotating rod. Now imagine your hand was inside it and that was a razor sharp end mill! Barrier creams are Excellent!! Bone grafts are not! teenut Albert Lee wrote: > > I know not to wear gloves while operating machinery (stationary > tools and hand-held power tools) because the glove could get caught > by a moving part and pull my hand in with it. > > But what about a skin tight latex glove? > > Unfortunately I have sensitive skin which peels after prolonged > contact with oil. Wearing latex gloves takes care of that problem, > but I'm worried it could cause a new problem (eg. losing a finger > in an accident). > > What do you guys think? I know there is also some kind of barrier > cream I could use but I haven't tried it. > > Thanks. > --Albert (acllee@megsinet.net) > > PS. Sorry for the crosspost but I think my question could be of > interest to both newsgroups. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Cutting 2024 ALuminum plate From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 22 Oct 1999 04:57:34 GMT -------- I would cross cut it on my table saw..CAREFULLY!! teenut LoranceD wrote: > > I recently acquired a piece of 2024 Aluminum plate 6"x11/2"x120". I have a > project that requires 6"x11/2"x91/2" . I will have to take this to a local shop > to get this cut into the 12 pieces that I can use. What would be the best and > cheapest method to do this? > > thanks in advance, > > Dennis ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Yet another sparkies question From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 22 Oct 1999 05:18:51 GMT -------- I know why I am not..nor ever could be a Sparkie. A) I couldn't put up with idiot questions like that. You could walk to one end of the line or the other and see if there was a sub-station or a tea kettle, in half the time it takes to get your slide rules warmed up! B) Who really gives an Industrial Strength, Flying F*** which end is which? C) The more I hear Sparkies arguing the toss about what would appear to be simple fundamentals...like wireing a Barn or whether there really are two phases or four...the more I realise Sparkies and me had to be born under different stars!! 8^) teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > Okay, in light of the recent rash of electrical questions I am going > to throw this out to see if anyone has any ideas. > > Imagine you are walking thru the woods and come to a power line - a > pair of wires on a pole line that crosses your path. In one direction > is the generator, or substation that feeds power into the line. In > the other direction is the load - the house or village or whatever > where the electricity is being used. > > Given that you are allowed to use whatever test instruments you want, > like voltage or current measurements of whatever kind, could one > determine which is the load side and which is the supply side? > Further the voltage might be ac, or dc. > > Any guesses? > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How'd they do that? From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 22 Oct 1999 05:33:50 GMT -------- TS wrote: > > I'm heading to the basement now. What happens to a & b above if I cheat > and use a milling machine and broach? > TS Not a damn thing..If you don't care I can assure you no one else will! But supposing, just supposing mind..It was REAL important that you get it finished. And the power went out! Or the broach cut just a thou undersize. You would be screwed..I wouldn't! Over simplified..yes But who do you think made the machines that made the machines that made the wire to bring power to the machines you use? Some time, some place, it had to be someone that didn't have to relay on somebody else to get something done. And No..it wasn't me! 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Pointed Edge Finder From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 22 Oct 1999 05:45:24 GMT -------- As I recently stated Jim...Sparkies are born under a different star. I make it a point never to argue with a made up mind, nor do I expect you to take it on trust that even if the scribed lines ARE two thou wide..which they certainly would not be in the class of work the REST of us are discussing..it is possible to line up to a lot closer than the width of a line. The human eye is an incredible device when it comes to alignment. The simple fact that, Jim, probably even you are capable and find it useful, to read a vernier caliper to within a thousandth of an inch is proof that the eye can discern misalignments of that order..Even though the lines on your vernier are very much wider than a thou. teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article <380f15e7.193351393@news.u-net.com>, > tony@jeffree.X.co.uk wrote: > > > So paraphrasing: > > > > 1) You centre the point using a technique that can centre it to > > within a tenth of a thou. > > > > 2) You then use the terribly accurately centred point to locate > > scriber marks etc. using a visual technique that cannot possibly get > > you closer than a couple of thou or so, on a good day. > > > > Am I missing something here? > > Sure - the fact that the scribed line itself is probably a couple > of thousanths wide. Sounds kinda nutty to me too. > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.woodworking Subject: Re: Safety question: Wearing gloves From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 22 Oct 1999 05:49:09 GMT -------- No they won't!! teenut Carl Byrns wrote: > I wear surgical gloves while repairing medical equipment. They're thin > enough that they would tear if caught in machinery. > > -Carl ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Website From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 22 Oct 1999 05:53:57 GMT -------- Neat! teenut Robert Grauman wrote: > > Take a look at my shy friends website, describing some of the things he has built, including his ingenious foundry furnace(s). > > > > Robert Grauman in Sunny Alberta ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.woodworking Subject: Re: Safety question: Wearing gloves From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 22 Oct 1999 06:48:27 GMT -------- That isn't what happens when rubber gloves get "grabbed" by machinery! The smooth roller or sharp cutter takes a broader "Bite" or grab at the glove than it can at your skin..precisely because the rubber IS loose..by the time a wide area has been gathered up its TOTAL strength is enought to pull you in to the cutter or roller. If you want to prove me wrong..try using a cordless drill for a while, wearing your gloves..8^) It maybe won't bite a finger off..but I will GUARANTEE it will give you a nasty suck!! It is analagous to saying that a piece of string isn't very strong..but a cargo net..made from the same string..will pick up scores of tons. Hey, I have no ax to grind..if you wish to wear gloves..and find out the hard way, I can assure you I will not say "I told you so"..but neither will I feel a damned thing..or shed a tear. You are the one taking the risk, so I suggest you need to be as dead sure you are as right as I know you are wrong. I assume you carry some form of industrial injury coverage for your job. Insurance companies are one of the leading researchers into the causes of accidents. Why don't you ask them how they feel about you wearing latex gloves around moving machinery? If they tell you not to..ask them why. They can probably come up with enough hard facts, figures and accident statistics to curdle your blood. But as I say..'tain't my fingers..it's yours! 8^) teenut "Craig C." wrote: > > If you are talking about standard type surgical gloves, then there is > really no problem. the surgical glove will take a little punishment, > but not a lot. When I have to use them, I have to give my hands a good > washing and drying and then a light powdering to be able to ge them on > without tearing. > > Craig ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Inner workings of Hardinge topslide From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 22 Oct 1999 11:50:27 GMT -------- I am designing a replacement cross slide and retracting topslide for my Maximat Super 11. Does any one of our fortunate readers with a Hardinge happen to have details of the inner workings of the quick return topslide. I hate to have to re-invent the wheel. Thanks teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Hard white plastic..Melamine From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 22 Oct 1999 11:58:06 GMT -------- I am replacing all the feed dials on several machines with the Hardinge type black numerals on white backgound. I need a source of HARD white synthetic material that can either machined from stock or cast to near net size. A dead white Melamine type material comes to mind...but I have never seen it in bar stock form. I need this in sheet form of minimum 3/8" thick, or bar form up to 4" diameter. Ivory micarta or ivory substitute might be an attractive alternative. Materials suggestions and sources appreciated Thanks, 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Oops! From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 22 Oct 1999 12:02:24 GMT -------- Being the gentleman that I am, I have not opened your mail Dave, nor I am sure have any of our regulars. You can delete it yourself. teenut Dave Carlson wrote: > > Moderator: > > Please do not publish the note I just sent my sister, that may also > inadvertently have been sent to the newsgroup. > > Many thanks, > > Dave Carlson ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.woodworking Subject: Re: Safety question: Wearing gloves From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 22 Oct 1999 12:19:34 GMT -------- Craig, my Father in law and my Brother in law are both surgeons..I get latex and non latex surgical gloves from them by the case load. Quit trying to convince me that you are not an idiot! I frankly don't give a rats a** whether you think different rules apply to you, that you have a source of special "Quick release gloves" whether you think the machines you work on have an "Ouch" switch, that you can move faster than any machine, that you have a deal with Murphy, or that you give special prayers to St Jude every morning. The fact that you would wear gloves of ANY kind around moving machinery of ANY kind is enough to brand you as Doctorate Level Stupid! That you should advocate such use on a public forum and thus endanger OTHER people makes you DANGEROUSLY NEGLIGENT of the safety of others...and that earns you my CONTEMPT! teenut "Craig C." wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > >No they won't!! > > Next time you are at the Dr's office, talk him out of a couple of > pairs and play with them yourself. The material that is used in > surgical gloves is about .001" thick, and has a tensile strength of > about 15psi. They will tear if you just rub your hands together too> hard. > If you can get surgical gloves > caught in machinery, then you > obviously have your hands where they don't belong. > If you are thinking of the heavy latex gloves for dishwashing or > handling chemicals then you are correct. They have significantly > thicker material and are not skin tight. > > Craig ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Where'd "SWARF" come from? was:Any Ideas for containing swarf on mill From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 22 Oct 1999 12:43:22 GMT -------- TS wrote: > > WELL? > > Where'd the word swarf come from? > > Inquiring mind want...no, need to know. > > TS The word does not appear in my Concise Oxford Dictionary..therefore it does not exist!! Following modern PC/Legal doctrine there is therefore no such thing as swarf and any substance bearing any resemblance to this mythical material is obviously either the result of a right wing conspiracy or a figment of your deranged personality. The repeated propagandist tactic of constant referral to this none existant substance as "creating constant marital stress" in the homes of a clearly defined, Elitist group of the Right Wing Intelligentsia does not sway this court, and further, similar, outbursts or public questioning of legally established facts will result in your detainment, the suspension of Habeus Corpus, the removal of any remaining Civil Rights, the delaration of Martial Law, and Suspension of the Constitution! DO I MAKE MYSELF CLEAR ? 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Allen Wrenches From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 22 Oct 1999 12:57:20 GMT -------- "Buggered" hex socket heads can often be almost completely rehabilitated by lightly hammering straight downwards on the head and peening the "erupted" material back into place. A freshly square ground end of a good quality hex key can then be tapped into place to finish reforming the socket. I use the short 1/4" hex drive alen keys from my cheap socket set as pocket swages for this purpose With a bit of care, socket heads can be restored to an almost "as new" condition. You can also reform metric sockets to imperial sizes this way!! Pity we can't reform Metric Advocates with a few judicious taps with a hammer! Worth a try though. 8^) teenut David Berryhill wrote: > I remember seeing a special tool for removing stripped allen-head screws in > one of the tool catalogs. It has a hex-shaped shank but it's tapered > instead of straight-sided. You drive the tool into the allen head with a > hammer and turn the screw out with a wrench. > > It was probably the MSC or Rutland tool catalog. > > Dave Berryhill ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: what is dural From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 22 Oct 1999 13:32:21 GMT -------- "Dural" is the generic, laymans, name used in the UK for any aluminium based "Light Alloy"...The US generic term. Originally "Dural" was a short form for "Duralumin" the name given by IIRC, Rolls Royce to a patented, high strength, heat treatable, aluminium alloy..one of the first ever developed. I believe "Hiduminium" was another I doubt that "Duralumin" is still available as such. teenut Tony Jeffree wrote: > > On Fri, 22 Oct 1999 08:05:14 -0400, GD > wrote: > > >What is dural and is it still available. Where can I get some? > > > > I believe that it is an aluminium alloy. > > Regards, > Tony > > Website: http://www.jeffree.u-net.com/ > When replying, delete "X." from the Email address to remove anti-SPAM measures. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Hard white plastic..Melamine From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 22 Oct 1999 13:33:50 GMT -------- Now why didn't I think of that!! Certainly worth a try! Thanks Ned, teenut Ned Simmons wrote: > > The first thing that comes to mind is Corian countertop material. Scraps > and cutoffs should be available from places that do high-end kitchens. > I'm not sure exactly what this stuff actually is. It machines well and > takes a nice finish. > > Ned Simmons > > In article <3810525A.8AD3CB@home.com>, teenut@home.com says... > > I am replacing all the feed dials on several machines with the Hardinge type > > black numerals on white backgound. I need a source of HARD white synthetic > > material that can either machined from stock or cast to near net size. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How'd they do that? From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 22 Oct 1999 13:50:50 GMT -------- Pretty good summary I'd say. One of the main reasons for "inflicting" these torturous test pieces on trainees is as both a right of passage..he KNOWS and so does everyone else, that he (She) has reached certain minimum standards and thus has earned the right to be treated as an equal in by their peers...Just like any other Entrance Exam to a Professional Body It is also a supreme confidence builder. God forbid he/she should ever have to resort to hammer and chipping chisel ever again in his/her career. But the knowledge that, if all else fails, and it "just gotsta be there in the morning" it WILL be...gives the confidence needed to push other processes and machines a bit closer to the limit..knowing that if something breaks while the stores are closed, one does not come to a dead stop. teenut Fdmorrison wrote: > > >Robert Bastow teenut@home.com > > >But who do you think made the machines that made the > >machines that made the wire to bring power to the machines you use? > > From my incipient understanding of the way things developed in the Industrual > Revolution, this isn't quite the way it worked. > The situation is more like that of the imaginary paleolithic fire starter. > Once you find the flame, and get it to the hearth, you insure that it never > goes out (until, at least some sophisticated technology--like rubbing > sticks--comes along). > > In the Industrial Revolution *leaping ahead, slightly* there seems to have been > a dramatic change in methods of work, when hand fitting was replaced by > production of goods by 'self acting' machines which translated a prime mover's > power into rotary, reciprocating, and link motions within their frames. > > This was, in some ways, an almost overnight change in the means of production. > There were no machinists in the U. S. (for example, where the IR hit later than > Europe) until the early decades of the 1800s. Some of the same work was done, > yes, but the designation was not recognized. > There was literally a situation where a prior generation knew nothing of the > technology embraced by its children. Dad was a scythe maker, not a machinist. > > There was no liner progression in technology in the IR; there was the > intervention of a dramatic economic phenomenon, one that has yet to be fully > assessed. > > When the spark goes out maybe the frustrated operative goes back to hand > fitting for a while, but society does not. > (It reverts to pedal power. ;) ) > > Otoh, for some industries, locks and guns, e. g., hand fitting is never totally > eliminated. > > Frank Morrison ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Where'd "SWARF" come from? was:Any Ideas for containing swarf on mill From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 22 Oct 1999 14:00:48 GMT -------- The PC indoctrination is clearly manifesting results as you begin to understand that "Metals have Feelings too!" Well done Tony! Group! Lets all say "Well done" to Tony. (Makes yer wanna Puke doesn't it) 8^) teenut Tony Jeffree wrote: > > On Fri, 22 Oct 1999 12:43:22 GMT, Robert Bastow > wrote: > > > > > > >TS wrote: > >> > >> WELL? > >> > >> Where'd the word swarf come from? > >> > >> Inquiring mind want...no, need to know. > >> > >> TS > > > >The word does not appear in my Concise Oxford Dictionary..therefore it does not > >exist!! > > > >Following modern PC/Legal doctrine there is therefore no such thing as swarf and > >any substance bearing any resemblance to this mythical material is obviously > >either the result of a right wing conspiracy or a figment of your deranged > >personality. > > > >The repeated propagandist tactic of constant referral to this none existant > >substance as "creating constant marital stress" in the homes of a clearly > >defined, Elitist group of the Right Wing Intelligentsia does not sway this > >court, and further, similar, outbursts or public questioning of legally > >established facts will result in your detainment, the suspension of Habeus > >Corpus, the removal of any remaining Civil Rights, the delaration of Martial > >Law, and Suspension of the Constitution! > > > >DO I MAKE MYSELF CLEAR ? > > > >8^) > > > >teenut > > Perfectly. > > Besides...referring to these small, inoffensive strands and chips of > metal by use of such a derogatory term is clearly "swarfist" and > therefore not Politically Correct regardless of whether the term > appears in COD or not. The PC term is surely "Mechanically challenged > metal". > > Regards, > Tony > > Website: http://www.jeffree.u-net.com/ > When replying, delete "X." from the Email address to remove anti-SPAM measures. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Where'd "SWARF" come from? was:Any Ideas for containing swarf on mill From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 22 Oct 1999 14:11:19 GMT -------- This subversive and diversively inflammatory statement from an infamous member of the "Elitist Intelligentsia" is another example of the need to accelerate our program for re-education of the masses.(usually known by its acronym and rallying call..DUMDOWN!! Books, such as the one he so brazenly flaunts as his twisted version of "the truth", have long been subject to the sanctions of our wonderful "Fahrenheit 451" policy. Silence that dangerous dissident!! teenut boris beizer wrote: > > That's what you get for using marginal dictionaries. The word does appear in > the **full** OED where it has almost an entire collumn devoted to its various > meanings. First appeared in literature in 1566. According to the OED, > probably Old Norse, swerva, to file. Worth looking up and reading. > > Boris ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Where'd "SWARF" come from? was:Any Ideas for containing swarf on mill From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 22 Oct 1999 14:18:23 GMT -------- I dunno how you define "recent" or "regional" My "Alma Mater" company in the UK was manufacturing "Swarf Extractors"..Centrifuges for seperating tramp coolant from swarf..and "Swarf Baling Presses"..before WWI. If nothing else, its usage separates metal "Swarf" from wooden "Chips" teenut Ned Simmons wrote: > > In article <7upo7d$o0q$1@oak.prod.itd.earthlink.net>, > bbeizer@sprintmail.com says... > > > > That's what you get for using marginal dictionaries. The word does appear in > > the **full** OED where it has almost an entire collumn devoted to its various > > meanings. First appeared in literature in 1566. According to the OED, > > probably Old Norse, swerva, to file. Worth looking up and reading. > > > > Boris > > > Which more or less agrees with my original understanding of the word. > When I first started reading this NG I objected to the use of swarf to > refer to any sort of waste. > > For me swarf always meant the nasty slurry that resulted from wet > grinding. The OED confirmed this as the earlier meaning, but that more > recent usage includes waste from any machining operation. > > One of those regional things perhaps? > > Ned Simmons, New England ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Boring Small Engine Cylinders From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 22 Oct 1999 14:21:34 GMT -------- Why thank you Mike..not bad for an elitist Huh? Now! What WAS your question? ;^) teenut Mike Baldwin wrote: > > Hey teenut Bob, you are sure one clever wordsmith,,, > > Mike "the NG whipping boy" Baldwin ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Hard white plastic..Melamine From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 22 Oct 1999 14:31:53 GMT -------- Many times, just asking the question helps to clear the mind! Thinking on it.."Dead white" will probably look real tacky, real soon. I am going to find me some scraps of Ivory Corian and some "Artificial Ivory"..a fine PAPER based phenolic material developed for..or certainly used by..Custom Knifemakers and Scrimshanders..(Now THERE is something I wish I could do!) I can use sheet material as these will all take the form of annular rings bonded to steel backings. Thanks for the suggestions. teenut Kurt Bjorn wrote: > > Hey Teenut, obviously the plastic needs to be hard enough to engrave; the > engraving must also take black paint. This rules out Delrin, which was my > first thought. Delrin is a bit soft and won't bond with glue or paint worth > a darn. I like your ivory micarta idea. Be sure to get the finest > "grained" phenolic you can. Perhaps there is a straight phenolic without > the fabric available. Since the dials won't take any serious loads, the > loss of strength shouldn't be a problem. Best of all, it can be obtained as > round bar, which will be a problem with the corian. > > Good luck > > -- > Kurt Bjorn > http://www.flash.net/~pyroware > > Robert Bastow wrote in message <3810525A.8AD3CB@home.com>... > >I am replacing all the feed dials on several machines with the Hardinge > type > >black numerals on white backgound. I need a source of HARD white synthetic > >material that can either machined from stock or cast to near net size. A > dead > >white Melamine type material comes to mind...but I have never seen it in > bar > >stock form. I need this in sheet form of minimum 3/8" thick, or bar form > up to > >4" diameter. Ivory micarta or ivory substitute might be an attractive > >alternative. > > > >Materials suggestions and sources appreciated > > > >Thanks, > > > >8^) > > > >teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Mega Garage Sale in Central NJ From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 22 Oct 1999 14:37:08 GMT -------- A truly fine gesture of "sharing the wealth" Thanks Matthew. How long is it open? I figure, given the circumstances, it will take me about 3 hours to get there, by road, from Atlanta..it is less than a thousand miles and worth a couple of speeding tickets!! 8^) teenut "Matthew J. Prusik, Jr." wrote: > > Recently I went to the garage sale of a lifetime across the highway from my > house. > The location of the sale is Miller Industries, near where Ernston Road > meets Rt. 35 South in the Morgan section of Sayreville, NJ. > Miller's used to be an underwater outfitter for the boat building industry, > and a working brass an aluminum foundry. The operations have been > reconstituted to become a marine propeller sales and service unit and > underwater outfitter. Pretty much the same, but on a smaller scale. > The upstairs portion of the building is filled with the contents of a > metalworker's dream. There are tons (literally) of stock metal scrap > (brass, steel, aluminum, other alloys and stainless), small tools and > supplies, foundry equipment, marine supplies and hardware as well as a whole > host of interesting and useful stuff. In addition, there are several pieces > of woodworking equipment, lumber, plywood and a large selection of "carved > furniture" items, all well stocked for sale at a reasonable price. > A few points to consider: > > 1. Wear old clothes and prepare to spend time getting dirty pawing through > the stuff. > > 2. Most of the stock is not priced. Be prepared to dicker by making a > reasonable > offer. > > 3. Many of the items are "projects" rather than plug ins ready for work. > So make your offers accordingly. > > 4. There are any number of items that can be bought in BULK for substantial > savings. Again, make feel free to make a reasonable offer. > > 5. You will get a better deal by paying cash and bringing help and a truck > to get the larger items out of the place ASAP. > > 6. The object of the sale is to clear the building as much as possible so > it can be converted to rental property. If you are looking for shop space, > or storage space, do talk to the owner. > > 7. Enjoy yourself! > > No affiliation, etc. Just passing on a bit of information to be shown to > those who have helped me out through the years. > > Matt ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Pointed Edge Finder From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 22 Oct 1999 14:45:37 GMT -------- Mark Winlund wrote: > > Teenut... you must be a young fellow to see that well. I can barely see the > spindle sometimes. > Oh would that I were! My short range eyesight is failing fast, and my home, shop and office are littered with scores of pairs of different strength reading glasses. Frustrating, especially as my long distance vision is still as sharp as a hawk's. Maybe I should have been a Sniper rather than a machinist. When I was younger they always said it was your legs that go first.. It is not! It isn't your eyes either! 8^( teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Where'd "SWARF" come from? was:Any Ideas for containing swarf on mill From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 22 Oct 1999 14:56:10 GMT -------- You Noticed the CARROT PHENOMENON TOO!! Codified as "Oor Wully's Law" Defined by Billy Connolly. I paraphrase.." it doesna matter hoo lange i'was sin' ye ate carrots last..six months or more....Thur's a'ways carrots there when ye puke!! teeenut Tony Jeffree wrote: > > On Fri, 22 Oct 1999 14:00:48 GMT, Robert Bastow > wrote: > > >The PC indoctrination is clearly manifesting results as you begin to understand > >that "Metals have Feelings too!" > > > >Well done Tony! > > > >Group! Lets all say "Well done" to Tony. > > > >(Makes yer wanna Puke doesn't it) > > > >8^) > > > >teenut > > > > Now, Robert, why do you feel the need to let of steam in such an > unsavoury way? We all know what puke is, but in your case, we > CERTAINLY don't want to be reminded of it...all those diced carrots > and brown ale... > > We're sure that you will feel SO much better if you can find a gentler > and more constructive outlet for your feelings...like BEATING THE CRAP > out of whoever invented the PC movement (whoever it was, h/she must > have been intellectually challenged...) > > Group Hug... > > Regards, > Tony > > Website: http://www.jeffree.u-net.com/ > When replying, delete "X." from the Email address to remove anti-SPAM measures. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How'd they do that? From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 22 Oct 1999 15:07:06 GMT -------- Any fool knows that copper wire was invented by two Yorkshiremen...Fighting over a Penny! teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article <380FF84A.5FF34C83@home.com>, > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > But who do you think made the machines that made the > > machines that made the wire to bring power to the machines you use? > > Easy - they took a bunch of green apprentices, put them in the room > with a block of copper and some pen-knives and hammers, and told > them to whittle and tap the block into a coil of wire. > > And no walking the 17 miles back home 'till they were done! > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.woodworking Subject: Re: Safety question: Wearing gloves From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 22 Oct 1999 15:29:23 GMT -------- Jeff Pack wrote: > > Just because you both have a difference of OPINION, it doesnt need to result > in name calling... Ordinarily I would agree and offer you an apology Jeff But I think there is a well enough developed baseline of facts pointing to the absolute idiocy of wearing gloves around any moving machinery, for this not to be a matter of opinion! We hear this same old line repeated over and over..about every three months..."MY kind of gloves aren't a danger around MY kind of machinery if you take the precautions that *I* take....yada yada" Unfortunately it is human nature to only need to hear the WRONG thing ONE time, sofly said, to get into trouble..But we need to hear the RIGHT thing, said many times, LOUDLY!..To stay out of it. Ordinarily I do not argue with made up minds. Nor do I fight in the mud with pigs..(you both get dirty but the pig enjoys it!!) However, when the debate is public, concerns safety, and has an audience that includes newcomers and beginners, then I reserve the right to SHOUT and call names without apology to anyone! I have seen too many tragedies! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Hard white plastic..Melamine From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 22 Oct 1999 15:37:45 GMT -------- There you go again Albrecht...Showing us all up by being a "Scholar and a Gentleman" again. Thanks for the kind offer. Gonna go "Dumpster Diving" with my wife and son tonight ;^) teenut PLAlbrecht wrote: > > If all else fails locally, I have some remnants of 0.480" thick white and "gray > granite" Corian sheets here. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Die filer From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 22 Oct 1999 16:13:38 GMT -------- I doubt you will find a web page..different era y'know! Work?..In the hands of a skilled operator..Like gangbusters. Very accurate and as versatile (almost) as a wire EDM Speed..not for "hogging" but faster than hand filing for sure. Can also be used with abrasive "files" and hones. I am still looking for a "good" one..making files isn't a problem...you need to know how to customise files to get the best out of one anyhow. Nice project for a home made machine. teenut Steve Smith wrote: > > I follow that part. What I'm after is a description of how well they work, what > sort of volume of metal is reasonable to remove with one. > > Steve > > Tony Jeffree wrote: > > > On Fri, 22 Oct 1999 09:45:32 -0500, Steve Smith > > wrote: > > > > >I've thought about a die filer for some time. I've never used one and > > >don't have any feel for how well they work. Can anyone point me to a web > > >page or give a quick description? > > > > > > > Description? Imagine a heavy-duty scroll saw, with a metal file > > clamped where you would put the saw blade. > > > > Regards, > > Tony > > > > Website: http://www.jeffree.u-net.com/ > > When replying, delete "X." from the Email address to remove anti-SPAM measures. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 2 Morse sleeve From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 22 Oct 1999 19:17:25 GMT -------- A standard turret lathe socket has a 1" od and 2Mt i/d . get them from MSC or suchlike teenut > Edward Haas wrote in message <7uq7ri$hee$6@ultra.sonic.net>... > > --Looking for something with a 2 Morse i.d. and cylindrical o.d. > >Anyone got a source?? TIA, > >-- > > "Steamboat Ed" Haas : Men are from Mars > > Watch link rot in action! : Women are from Flornblat VII... > > http://www.nmpproducts.com > > ---Decks a-wash in a sea of words--- ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Pointed Edge Finder From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 22 Oct 1999 19:59:25 GMT -------- > >Hmm. Just how wide is a narrow scribed line? > > > >So a steel block is scribed with a sharp, new scalpel - with a > >very light line. And then plopped under the microscope and the > >width measured with the stage translator. > > > >The answer is about 0.1 mm. Which translates into about 4 mills. Pretty heavy handed scribing if it is .004" wide (I take it that is what you mean by that quaint phrase "4 mils" a "Mil" is an angular measurement ;^) > >Caveats: That particular stage has a vernier that only resolves > >to about .1 mm - so the answer could be 50% either way. 2, or 6 > >thousanths. Kinda bringing a (Blunt) knife to a gun fight aren't we? Rule # 1 of metrology..don't try to make an accurate measurement with a measuring device that is less than an order of magnitude more accurate and sensitive than the object being measured! I am sorry to give such an imprecise answer but hope > >to find a better setup for this today. I honestly am curious. Not curious..you made a few broad and inaccurate statements and now you are scratching around for justification. > > >Now what I cannot find is one of those pointy edge finders. We > >all use the cylindrical ones - but I bet a coke that the radius > >on the tip of the cone is about 5 thou right there. For all I know the one you use serves as a centerpunch too. Loose your coke..if we are talking about mine though....I use a honed needle on a bit of chewing gum and a 10X loupe....I will guarantee it is a LOT sharper than .005" radius With a honed point on a scriber you can HEAR it click into a scribed line. With a line the width of yours you would be able to feel the slop! I have and still can, set a pair of needlepoint dividers and step around a scribed circle, 33 divisions and come up with a CUMULATIVE ERROR less than the .004" you claim is some limit of human capability! Instead of theorising about what no person can do..just because you can't envisage needing, wanting or ever being able to do yourself, why don't you get a hold of a good book on the subject. Get hold of a copy of "Accurate Tool Work" by Goodrich and Stanley. Published early in the century, before Dial Indicators and Gauge blocks or even micrometers were commonplace. Learn how, with simple devices, ingenuitiy and extreme attention to detail, those early toolmakers laid out and made the jigs and tools for the Waltham Watch company. Read it and weep! Lindsay's publish a reprint so it is relatively easy to get a hold of. > > > >Yes, the human eye is probably one of the most remarkable sensing > >devices around. Dynamic range that's about 8 orders of magnitude, > >sensitive to individual photons when dark-adapted. Self-healing > >and autofocussing. > > > >But if the things you are lining up to are wider than the resolution > >you claim, then that's a pretty big challenge, even for a human eye. Why? Could you not line up two one inch wide blocks closer than 1"? Do you never set the fiduciary line on your lathe feed thimble closer than half the width of the line? teenut > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Carbide Drill Wisdom? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 02:43:16 GMT -------- laura wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > This also will cure chattering on a morse taper, a rifle chamber, a taper pin or > > a taper lede hand reamer..the trick in all these cases is to wrap the reamer in > > a single thickness of typing paper and feed in firmly, again, damping the quill > > against RADIAL movement. > > > > teenut > > Robert, > > Is this really as simple as it sounds? Wrapping a chambering reamer with paper will > reduce/eliminate chatter marks? I'll be a dumb SOB! > > About 1 in 4 of my chambers in stainless barrels end up with mild chatter marks > (usually can be polished out, so they are not very deep, but VERY annoying). > Exactly how do you do this if you have to take multiple passes with the reamer? I > usually use only a finishing reamer, and go 0.030-0.040 inch deep before > withdrawing and cleaning off chips for each pass. If you do more than one or two chambers of the same size, it mught be (WILL be) worth investing in a roughing reamer. Less likelyhood of inducing chatter and will save the edge on your finisher..for finishing! Failing that, try boring out with the compound, or even step drilling to rough size, befor using the finisher. Always buy top of the line reamers..Clymer set the standards. No two (sizes of) reamers have the same geometric requirements...Staggered spacing on the flutes is mandatory and so is a slightly different "Hone" for 4140 and stainless. This I hear from the "real experts"..I have only ever done 4140 Use a fresh wrap of paper for each cut & try..though once you get smooth and close to correct headspace, chatter shouldn't be a problem. I use firm pressure and turn SLOWLY by hand at that stage > > I use a floating reamer holder (Brownell's) and indicate both ends with tight > fitting bore plug in barrel and a DTI before reaming. Good technique > > Regular 4140 barrel steel works great in my lathe (much abused, rebuilt and modified > Logan-Wards 10 inch with spindle bored open to 0.95 inch dia). 416 stainless steel > barrels give me fits all the time. Sometimes figure that the 10 inch Logan was just > too light weight for the chambering operation, but I get beautiful results with > regular chrome-moly steels, just not in stainless. SS is a LOT harder than 4140 and will show up any lack of rigidity in the setup. If you plan on doing a LOT of SS barrels, then an investment in a heavier lathe will save what little remains (By definition if you do many barrels) of your hair! > > If this fixes my problem, I promise I'll never call you an OLD F**T again!! > > Regards, > > Mike Eberlein 10/22/99 WHEN this works, let us all know...I will call you a "Dumb SOB" ONE time! and then we'll be quits!! ;^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Cutting 2024 ALuminum plate From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 02:48:35 GMT -------- Any guy tough enough to use a chainsaw on 1 1/2" aluminum plate could probably tear it off in his teeth anyway! Teenut > >Come on girls -- what good is a chainsaw if you're afraid to use it at > >times like this? :-) > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Die filer From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 02:53:27 GMT -------- Mike, Have you ever heard the story, as related by the famous Stanley Holloway, entitled "Albert and t'Lion" Perhaps John will relate to you what happens to Albert. 8^) teenut mikoberg wrote: > Yes Yes poke him again. Half-nut.. ooh I mean Tea-nutz needs a good poking. > > Mike -standing on the sidelines and cheering both sides- Oberg ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How'd they do that? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 03:21:23 GMT -------- David wrote: > > Teenut wrote: > > > >God forbid he/she should ever have to > >resort to hammer and chipping chisel ever again in his/her career. > > > I`ve been following this and now I HAVE to ask..these blocks, are they > chiselled through without benefit of a drill? No. (Unless the instructor was a more than usually sadistic SOB)..The usual way was to drill out the waste and chip and file to finish And how do these chisels (and > technique)differ from wood chiseling? I can deduce somewhat, but I`d like to > hear more. A "Chipping Chisel" can be a simple as a regular cold chisel or can be of a variety of shapes to reach odd corners. Tapped briskly with a 2 to 4 LB hammer it as a very quick and accurate way (Practice is all it takes) to shift metal fast. Can be used to level a machine pad on a BIG casting for instance where it would be too awkward or slow to set it up on a Floor Borer...Or can flatten out the bottom of a Dolls Head Extension pocket on a London Grade "Best Gun" Am I crazy for wanting to actually make one for the sake of "what > it`s worth"? YES!! Or No..depending on what it is "worth" to you! There isn't much of a market for "Square 'oles in square blocks an' bits wot fit closely therein" On the other hand, the experience and confidence you gain could be priceless..to you! My only objective in hauling over all this "medieval stuff" is to help people, like yourself, to understand that very extra-ordinary work has and can be done by very ordinary people..just like you and me! teenut > > > > > > It`s not the hallucinations that frighten me..... > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Inheritance of tools From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 03:27:17 GMT -------- SHOOT THE BITCH!! No jury with a single male member would convict! An all female jury would earn you a dismissal on appeal! teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article , > "Mark Winlund" wrote: > > > I would certainly like to have my wife benefit as much as possible > > from this, given the fact that she has put up with my eccentricities > > and foolish expenditures over the years. > > Why should I bother to do this if she clearly does not care about > getting the most money for the machines herself? > > I know this for a fact, because at *least* once a week I arrive > home, and there is a sign tacked up in front of the house, and it > says: > > ======================================== > = = > = GARAGE SALE TODAY = > = = > = = > = ALL CAST IRON STUFF IN BASEMENT = > = ONE DOLLAR EACH!!!!! = > = = > ======================================== > > And I have to keep ripping the darn things down. What's > a man supposed to do?? > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Inner workings of Hardinge topslide From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 03:28:59 GMT -------- Mike, you are starting to piss me off! Mike Baldwin wrote: > > Dear teenut > > Only after proving that you have exhausted all means of totally > researching the forementioned subject MAY you ask for POV's on this > NG,,,tsk tsk > > Take it from someone who has learned the hard way! > > The NG elitest _MUST_ have proof that you are not; > A. To lazy to further your research. > B. To poor to go to school and/or buy a book. > C. A thief looking for free information to include on your own web site/ > business. > > What goes around, comes around,,,but a teenut would already know > that,,,sorry I just had to preach to the choir! > > Mike Baldwin ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Pointed Edge Finder From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 04:23:37 GMT -------- Norman Yarvin wrote: > What I'd be curious to hear from Teenut is how the scribing is done > accurately. Ok, you scribe against a precision block, but what sort of > scriber to use? I suppose it has to be very sharp indeed, almost a > perfect cone of small angle, since any significant radius on the tip will > mean that the line ends up some distance from the gauge block. My "Best" scriber is culled from a set of drawing instruments...an ebony handle intended to take a double nib pen, but fitted instead with the needle holder from the dividers. My "Best" dividers came from the same source. The needle points are about .040" diameter, taper finely and are sharpened for critical jobs on a hard arkansas stone (the translucent type) which has a narrow vee groove in it ..originally for fly fishing hooks. I use a loupe to check progress and it is not difficult to get a point down to an almost "molecular" level of sharpness. Obviously at this level of "accuracy seeking" layouts are not done with a quick swipe down the side of a square or alongside a ruler mark..or even on marking blue. The surface to be marked must be capable of accepting the line..400 grit finish is minimum if you expect to ever find it again!! I mark on bare steel, or darken the surface with gun blue..Blue or red "ink" is useless at this level. I also have an old copper sulphate chrystal in my toolbox..spit on the surface and rub with the stone and it leaves a molecular thickness of copper "Wash" on the steel. The most accurate layouts..as you suggest..are done with gauge blocks. Even so, care must be taken not to tilt the point into the small radius on the edge of the block. I have an agate straight edge...3" long that is straight well within "blue light" (Split waveband) levels, and this has a true square edge to it. It is the "Final Arbiter" along with a 5" "optical flat" Less "Picky" layouts..you know, the rough stuff to plus or minus a thou or so!! :^)...Are done on a laboratory grade granite "Flat" with a vernier height gauge. Not a digital or dial one..but a REAL "verinear" that has provision for accurate calibration and equally accurate setting with a Loupe. The scriber on this is a narrow wedge shaped carbide blade, diamond honed to a knife edge. A couple of scars on my hands and arms attest to the "molecular level" of THAT scriber too!! Setting dividers for accurate layout...Scribe two parallel lines on a plate by methods described above and, with a strong glass, set the points to those lines. In the case of the 33 divisions I mentioned earlier (For a division plate) I scribed the circle on the lathe using Hoke Blocks and a 1/10000" dial indicator to set the radius. A dead sharp, narrow vee tool to cut the circle etc. The chordal length for 33 divisions on that diameter was calculated trigonometrically, two lines scribed and the dividers set to the require distance. Once round to check revealed no more than four or five thou CUMULATIVE error. Once round to scribe lightly. Once round the opposite direction to cross scribe and SPLIT the error and the slave plate was mounted on the dividing head in place of the regular division plate. I used a needle point and a glass, in place of the regular plunger and generated my real division plate from it. Considering that what error I had in the slave was thus divided by a factor of 40 I would say that my division plate is "close enough" even by "teenut" standards. Now, does anyone else want to bet a coke?? Thanks Norman 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.woodworking Subject: Re: Safety question: Wearing gloves From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 04:26:24 GMT -------- Jeff Pack wrote: > > nothing wrong with shouting (if done with style), nothing wrong with > sticking with your opinion > (kindly), but name calling degenerates into an area that seems totally > un-neccessary > on this board. > > (the above is soley MY opinion). That's what it is Jeff, and not only are you entitled to it, but I will fight to the death to defend your right to express it! Whether I agree with it or not! All I ask is the same courtesy. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.woodworking Subject: Re: Safety question: Wearing gloves From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 04:40:40 GMT -------- "Craig C." wrote: > > If you don't mind doing so, REREAD what I said. Nowhere in my post did > I say, advocate or indicate anything about wearing them on OPERATING > MACHINERY. No you didn't..but you did make the absolute assertion that they would tear rather than pull you in... So a natural assumption would be...? > > I don't have to resort to name calling, being nasty or ranting or > raving like a lunatic to have an open discussion or argument or > difference of opinion with someone. Argue or discuss facts not > opinions. > > Craig The Facts on accidents with machinery and any kind of gloves speak loudly enough for themselves..to any SANE, Rational, person. I figured as you obviously couldn't hear THEM, then maybe *I* needed to raise my voice a little. Obviously I was wasting my breath on you..because I dont think even now you understand. There are none so deaf as those that don't want to hear, and I pity you for that. But maybe, just maybe, one other person has overheard our "discussion" and that person will think twice before wearing even those "nice safe Doctors gloves" around anything with no brain, no pity and no "ouch switch" If so, It will have been worth it! Have a great life and count your fingers EVERY day! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.woodworking Subject: Re: Safety question: Wearing gloves From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 04:43:09 GMT -------- > You have exercised that right fluently. > -- > ============================================== > Dale I take you agree then Dale? teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.woodworking Subject: Re: Safety question: Wearing gloves From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 04:51:16 GMT -------- > > They are great for working on bikes, cars, etc. Do I wear them while > running spindles? On very rare occasions, yes. But I try to avoid it. > > Jim Murphy Loves people like you Jim. Have you ever SEEN a hand or arm that has danced the light fantastic with a milling machine spindle? It is the kind of sight they blur out on the real ER programs! Do you know how long, painfull and often futile is the rehab from even a "Lucky escape" Please lose the gloves before switching on!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: welding HSS From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 04:57:47 GMT -------- Tack weld with tig John. Even HSS wil be adversly affected by the prolonged heat required to braze them together. teenut John Jacobs wrote: > > I have a job now that requires a custom tool. I ground two hss bits and > would like to weld them side by side to give me the tool shape I need. > Can I tig weld them together? The material I am cutting will be plastic > so if I loose some temper in the tool it will be ok. I was also thinking > about silver braze. Please help. > Thanks, > Chuck Key ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Width of scribed line, cont. From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 05:05:30 GMT -------- mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > FWIW I checked the width of that scribed line with an optical > comparator, and the full width wound up being about 1.4 thousanths, > > Also of interest was the fact that that the reading repeated > better then .0001 when I repeatedly centered the reference line > in the groove, by eye. > Score so far, Robert 1, Jim 0. > > Next on the list.... Quit while you are ahead Jim!! ;^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Duraluminum, naming of From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 05:54:38 GMT -------- Vague memories stir of a Rolls Royce connection..did they license it..or invent a competitor? What is Hiduminium? teenut Veeduber wrote: > > To All: > > Aluminum-copper-zinc alloys were developed as the result of a program sponsored > and largely funded by Count Ferdinand von Zeppelin. The new alloy was first > smelted in the town of Dura in southern Germany and the new material was > commonly referred to by its place of origin -- Dura aluminum -- which was soon > shortened to a single word. > > -Bob Hoover ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Any Ideas for containing swarf on mill From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 06:01:43 GMT -------- Doug, we need to start a business...Steel Toed Topsiders!! Hmm..Then people would drown in them!! Back to the drawing board! teenut Doug Jackson wrote: > > > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > I wear "Topsiders" both "upstairs" and "downstairs" and as they wear out the > > > > "Downstairs Topsiders" are honorably retired, the "Upstairs Topsiders" > > become > > the "Downstairs Topsiders" and a new pair of "Upstairs Topsiders" are > > procured > > to replace the old "Upstairs Topsiders" > > You mean to say that you don't wear "steel-toed safety shoes" in the shop? > NOOOOO! > > In the Navy we were required to wear such things anytime we were in the > shop. The standard joke...a pencil would fall off a bench and someone would > say "Thank GOD for steel-toed safety shoes!" > > I did hear of one guy on a boat who lost a couple of toes sliding down a > ladder with a big fire extinguisher in his hands. He was wearing sneakers. > Then there was the time I had a 6" Kurt clone bolted to the edge slots on > the milling table. The jaw was all the way open, which shifted its center of > gravity past the edge of the milling table. I removed the T-slot nuts and > WHAM! My reaction time was slow and I was wearing Topsiders, but fortunately > there was a wooden stool between the vise and my foot. BIG gouge in the > stool, important lesson learned but ignored, as I still wear Topsiders in the > shop. ...Someday I'll probably have to learn the hard way. > > -actionj ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Duraluminum, naming of From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 07:31:31 GMT -------- I think you are confusing it with Conduminium..the new Rubber/Aluminium hybrid material. Possible applications: "NOFLOP" the all natural Viagra substitute. "Flexicrutch" for the cripple in a hurry! "Flexicrotch" for the adaptable politition! "Pogoladder" for increased construction site mobility! I'm sure the surface is only just scratched for this exciting new engineering material!! teenut Inventor of CONDUMINIUM...The worlds first prophylactic alloy! PLAlbrecht wrote: > > >What is Hiduminium? > > First made in Hidu, a small village in the Cotswolds. > > (Hey, this is easy! I can make up history on the fly too!) > > Pete > (but seriously, I don't know...) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Pointed Edge Finder From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 16:30:37 GMT -------- I thought I had clarified. 8^) I thought you did a pretty good job in your last post of confirming the statement I made about being able to align by eye to very close limits (you consistantly got .0001") and that the accuracy of alignment was not dependent upon the actual width of fiducial (Line Jim..its just a line) You left the score at teenut = 1 jim = 0 and I advised you to quit while you were ahead. (the score can only get worse from here) How bad a PAK do you want? ;^) 8^) teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article <38113958.8947107E@home.com>, > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > Now, does anyone else want to bet a coke?? > > Hmm. The coke bet is quite serious business indeed. And yet > unresolved. > > From my previous post: > > "Now what I cannot find is one of those pointy edge finders. We > all use the cylindrical ones - but I bet a coke that the radius > on the tip of the cone is about 5 thou right there." > > That was the bet I offered. I expected either a counter offer > (like - "ok, but I supply the edge finder!) or perhaps a > turn-down, because you don't trust me to not pick the nastiest > looking edge finder I can scare up. Or maybe it's a "I take that > bet but it has to be a NIB Sarrett finder." > > You are ascribing words to me that never were there. Now what's > it gonna be? > > In? > Out? > or Clarify? > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Safety question: Wearing gloves From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 23 Oct 1999 21:42:17 GMT -------- mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article , > Gary Coffman wrote: > > > A flat prohibition on gloves is much too strong. There are many times > > when gloves are appropriate. There are a few times when they are not. > > You've just got to have enough sense to know which is which. We aren't > > five years old, .... I have never advocated a flat prohibition on gloves inside or outside the shop. I have several different types I wear, depending on requirements. I do however absolutely abhor the wearing of any kind of gloves around moving machinery, of any kind. If that is too difficult a guide line to understand, or for some reason you believe the dangers don't apply to YOU..then you need to be treated like a five year old. Personally I wouldn't trust you with a sharp crayon! > > Well, no. But Robert delights in *treating* us like we were. That's > part of his, err - *charm*. No doubt honed to a razor edge as an > instructor. > > In his defense, I might add that he seems pretty clear to me about > prohibiting glove use, only around moving spindles. On the rest he is > mute. > > But he will dig to the bottom of a post, and find the one thing > he disagrees with, and reply to that - ignoring the rest. There is no point in going through a post, item by item simply to say "I agree with that" repetitively By definition, most people respond only to the points they disagree with. "Any lie that goes unchallenged, becomes the truth." When the concern is safety I tend to respond strongly..I really have seen too many (avoidable) tragedies. When I read some self styled "authority" advocating patently unsafe practices...usually because they made a rash statement and don't have the balls to withdraw it..or in a lot of cases..simply to pick a fight with me..then I get pissed! Hey, if all you want to do is prove 'ole teenut is wrong, go right ahead and wear any kind of gloves you want to,in YOUR shop, around YOUR machinery. Don't mistakenly believe that I give a rat's ass whether any of you dumb f**ks chop off every finger you have! I don't, I would probably laugh louder and harder than I have since the hogs ate my baby sister. Hell, given chance I would probably give you a push!! What you do in the privacy of you own workshops is entirely your own affair. But when you come into a public forum and try to justify your stupidity, or advocate unsafe practices to other people..then expect a public ass-kicking from me! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Newsgroup accuracy, was Re: what is dural From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 24 Oct 1999 01:45:56 GMT -------- Jeez..I didn't know Pete was THAT old!! teenut Mark Winlund wrote: people of like minds can tap into > literally thousands of years of experience... ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Hand made kinves From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 24 Oct 1999 01:59:57 GMT -------- Knives: try the Knife-list no subject, message...subscribe knife-list "other steel objects" stick around here..the subject OCCASIONALLY comes up ;^) teenut Buzzrd wrote: > > I was wondering if anyone could tell me where to look for information about > making knives or other steel objects by hand from "scratch" ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Pointed Edge Finder From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 24 Oct 1999 02:04:26 GMT -------- Beats me! ;^) teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > How does one achieve true concentricity on the point - better than > a thou? And be satisfied that it really is dead true? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Please take a quick shufti at this From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 24 Oct 1999 02:26:50 GMT -------- Any "Sparkies" with DC motor drive knowledge out there this evening? Would you mind taking a quick shufti (English slang/Arabic word = look) at this motor/drive which closes soon on Ebay. The motor seems ideal for my Maximat Super II but try as I may I cannot fathom if this is a complete motor AND control unit...ie. bolt it on, plug it in and dial up the speed required. Or will I need something else to actually control the speed? Slowly I have learned on this NG that all DC motors are not created equal..some are "servos" and need extra bits to make them work. This is a "servo" motor and has an "Amplifier"...Does that mean I will need to buy as set of sub-woofers to go with it? Thanks teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Duraluminum, naming of From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 24 Oct 1999 02:46:36 GMT -------- You mean it ISN'T 8^o teenut PLAlbrecht wrote: It's kind of like basing foreign policy on reports in the National > Enquirer. > > Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Looking for magnets From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 24 Oct 1999 02:49:42 GMT -------- Try Ebay do a search on magnets, there are usually scores of sources, sizes etc..cheap. But why do you need magnets to make flies stick? Back home we used horse manure. 8^o teenut Rick Maston wrote: > > I'm looking for flat or cylinder shape strong magnets to hold flies on your > vest for flyfishing. Can anyone recommend a good source?Any info is > appreciated. Thanks... > > -- > Rick Maston > RM Specialties > http://www.canoeoutriggers.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.woodworking Subject: Re: Safety question: Wearing gloves From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 24 Oct 1999 03:36:52 GMT -------- Albert Lee wrote: I then touched it to edge of > the rod. The latex immediately snagged and in a split second had > wrapped itself around the rod. Surprisingly, the material did not > tear at all. > > By the way, I measured the thickness of the latex to be around 0.005 > inches. Hardly surprising...Condoms are made of even thinner material and they can stand up to far more "hammer" than they would get in a machine shop!! ;^) > I'll be using a barrier cream around moving machinery. I ordered three > different types from MSC and will let the group know which I think is > most effective. That will be a very worthwhile research project Albert. I use "Liquid Glove" especially when working on cast iron. The secret is to work a good solid wedge of the stuff under your fingernails..That washes out, when the time comes, and brings all the crap with it teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.woodworking Subject: Re: Safety question: Wearing gloves From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 24 Oct 1999 17:50:51 GMT -------- Ted Edwards wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > Have you ever SEEN a hand or arm that has danced the light fantastic with a > > milling machine spindle? > > Have *you* ever seen a hand damaged when the user had been wearing thin > latex or nitrile examination gloves. It seems to me that glove/machine > injuries come from one or both of two circumstances: The glove wearing > user does not feel contact until in serious trouble. The glove is > strong enough to pull in a hand once the glove is caught. > > Neither of these apply to latex examination gloves or the thinner > nitrile gloves. And this profoundly reasoned statement is based on what ??? If you disagree with this, let's see a reasoned or, at > least, evidential argument. > > Ted Personal experience of having latex gloves twisted around a pistol drill bit... Read also the previous experiences of a couple of our listers. If you wish to advocate the adoption of a procedure which is considered even REMOTELY dangerous by most experienced people, then I think the burden of proof falls on YOU, not on ME. I think I may be convinced if you were to, while wearing gloves of YOUR choice, and in fromt of witnesses (preferably with medical training), place your hand in contact with a rotating milling cutter and PROVE that the glove is ripped off before any damage is done to YOUR hand. Failing the willingness to do that, I strongly suggest you STOP advocating a practice that could hurt someone OTHER than yourself. As I have previously stated...I DON'T CARE IF YOU HURT YOURSELF!!! It is part of nature's way of thinning the STUPID genes out of the pool. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Update: Cutting Aluminum w/Abrasive Wheel From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 24 Oct 1999 18:00:15 GMT -------- Working on the principle that if it ain't fixed don't broke it (and bearing in mind that I no longer have the need, the facilities, or for that matter, the remotest interest in) chopping off multiple lengths of aluminum billet...Why would I want to try an abrasive blade of any kind..especially a more expensive one, to do a job that a carbide saw will do indisputeably better? The logic escapes me...unless I were trying to SELL them! teenut Kelmar23 wrote: > > >The only bad part about using the > >abrasive blade is that the parts get HOT! > > Try using a pcd coated blade ( add a couple of zero's for both your cost and > parts per blade) . I've always wanted to tip a circular saw with diamond (pcd) > and try it out on cutting aluminum, but never found the cost to justify the > mean. Wonder if Tnut ever tried using one? > > Mark > Kelmar Tool ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Metal removal on successive passes? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 24 Oct 1999 18:26:25 GMT -------- fredcf@my-deja.com wrote: > B: Metal has resiliance; at the microscopic level the metal of the > workpiece is "rubbery" (or, more accurately, flows like a liquid) and > deforms sligthly under pressure from the toolbit. After the toolbit has > passed the brass "springs back". Each successive pass puts less > pressure on the workpiece and allows the bit to cut rather than push > the metal. This is the reason. Kinda like "sparking out" on a grinder..it can go on all day long if you let it..and still throw the occassional spark! > > C: I'm doing something terribly wrong and/or my lathe is shot and/or > I'm missing something fundimental. :-) Nothing wrong with you or your lathe...Quite the reverse in fact. It takes really well set up slides and sharp tooling to be able to observe this effect..and not be able to put it down to sloppy slides and blunt tooling which do have a similar effect EXCEPT the cut is more pronounced in one direction than the other AND it is not repeatable cut after cut. In other words, the tool point is taking a different path with each cut and /or in each direction. Relax. 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Favorite Graffiti From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 24 Oct 1999 19:04:14 GMT -------- Favorite Graffiti: Seen often on Condom Vending Machines in the UK..which bear the "British Standard Kitemark" and the legend..."Built to British Standard XXXX".... "Yeh!...So was the Titanic..." Or: "This is the worst G*damn chewing gum I ever tasted!" teenut BeeCrofter wrote: > > an ametuer built the ark > professionals built the titanic > > Tom > > There is an extra Bee in the Email address after the AOL.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lapping plates... where to find? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 25 Oct 1999 02:17:20 GMT -------- By Definition: If you have three "flat" plates that "spot" together, interchangeably That is: 1 & 2 match 2 $ 3 match 1 & 3 match They are all three dead flat. Period!!! That is how surface plates were originally made, How hundreds of thousands of apprentices hve made their own plates, and how you can make your own plates today without any "reference" tools being required. teenut Mark Winlund wrote: > > Wouldn't the flat have to be the size of the surface plate? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Update: Cutting Aluminum w/Abrasive Wheel From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 25 Oct 1999 02:59:53 GMT -------- I owe you an apology..I misread your original post..I just re-read it though and I still am not sure what you are trying to describe, or the question you are trying to ask Some kind of abrasive blade coated with diamond? As in a rock or concrete saw type of blade? I assume PCD is Polychrystaline diamond? Why would that work (well)on aluminum? How would that cut cooler on aluminum than a regular abrasive blade? I am missing something here.. Please bear with a slow old fart and illuminate. Unless...DUH!! Unless you mean tipping a SAW blade with PCD TEETH?? HMM! Certainly you could achieve cutting speeds up in the Mach ranges..as is being done on modern "turn-mill" operations. There are no chips!! the waste comes off as a liquid and heat removal from the work piece is close to perfect. I wouldn't want to try it on a chop saw, with a regular style of blade..the vibration would kill the PCD in short order. But on a purpose built, high rigidity, high horsepower, machine..Why not? The saw blade itself would bear little resemblance to a "Freud Triple Chip" for example. It would have to have a very much thicker center section with perhaps, just a narrow outer band of actual cut thickness. May be even one of the "Inside out" blades we heard tell of a couple of weeks ago. Interesting thought!! Let's not even get INTO the cost effectiveness though! 8^) Again..My apologies! teenut Kelmar23 wrote: > > >The logic escapes me...unless I were trying to SELL them! > > The relpy was to suggest an alternative solution to the problem > > >The only bad part about using the > >> >abrasive blade is that the parts get HOT! > > pcd will eliminate this problem > > > I've always wanted to tip a circular saw with diamond (pcd) > >> and try it out on cutting aluminum, but never found the cost to justify the > >> mean. > > I am a toolmaker, not a salesman, I have neither the time nor the desire to > make sales using this site. I am just a newbie to this sight and the net, who > thinks its nice to talk and listen to others in my field. > > >Wonder if Tnut ever tried using one? > > I asked this because from reading all of your responses I have aquired respect > for you and your knowledge. I'm just a sponge in your ocean of wisdom. > Asskissing aside I always wondered how well diamond blades worked, was just > hoping that you would know. > > Mark > Kelmar Tool ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Missing Messages From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 25 Oct 1999 06:36:44 GMT -------- There seem to be an awful lot of messages missing recently...Fully 1/3 of the responses I have posted...including a couple of apologies (before you all cheer!!) have simply disappeared into the ether. Is this a function of the server that *I* am using..if so what better one can anyone suggest? This never used to happen when I used netscape, hotmail, and bellsouth net. Whenever I posted a response it would show up on my screen within minutes..seconds even, sometimes. Now it has become a shell game...spend twenty minutes writing something...and about a one in three chance of ever seeing it again Some of the messages that I don't ever see are obviously showing up on other peoples screens because I see responses to them. What is going on? BTW An explanation of how all this stuff works..What is a "server" what is an "ISP" what is a "news reader" etc would be much appreciated by this computor challenged and internet ignorant old fart! Thanks teenut Then again, no-body may ever read this!! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lapping plates... where to find? From: "Robert Bastow" Date: Mon, 25 Oct 1999 06:44:17 GMT -------- In your dreams Jim...In your Dreams! 8^) teenut > Damn - somebody stop me 'cause I'm starting to sound like Robert > B here! > > Jim ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Lost messages From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 25 Oct 1999 08:26:37 GMT -------- A quick count in my "sent file" shows 30 messages sent since Friday Midnight. Similar period count shows only 12 of these reached my RCM reader..Some must have reached other people because I have had responses to them...but well over half the messages I sent have simply disappeared. Is this normal? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Missing messages From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 25 Oct 1999 09:27:43 GMT -------- So far I haven't seen either one of the two messages I posted on this subject. Obviously they are getting to some people because I have already received a direct response from John Stevenson. Cross checking with rec.crafts. woodworking, where one string was cross posted by the originator I see that between Friday at 12.50 and Sunday at 1.50 I posted 11 messages under the heading of "Safety Question: Wearing Gloves" Only 4 of these have shown up on the version of RCM that I receive..Through a quirk of the way my son set things up for me on cable net I am able to use either Netscape or Outlook Express to view newsgroups. Both have shown exactly the same messages as turning up and or missing on RCW and RCM. All of which points to a problem with the RCM server...Has anyone else been missing messages? Is this normal or acceptable? Thanks teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.woodworking Subject: Re: Question for Robert From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 25 Oct 1999 17:14:08 GMT -------- Cast Iron is "Lovely, Filthy" stuff to machine. Lovely, because a good piece of grey iron cuts like cheese, requires no lubricant and is easy to get a "professional finish" on. Filthy, because the swarf is dusty and contains a large amount of free graphite, it turns everything, including skin a glossy black! It ingrains in the skin, especially under the fingernails and it can take a week to get rid of the vestigal traces of a cast iron session. What it does to the tender, inner, workings of machine tools is nothing short of criminal!! A different kind of "filthy" as it is very abrasive....! teenut Larry Root wrote: > > Robert: > > Way back in ancient archives of time when I worked on cars, I'd rub cold > cream into my hands; they have better products available now. But that > was to keep out the grease. I don't work around cast iron (other that > my TS top), why do you need the liquid gloves "especially" for cast > iron? > > Respectfully, > Larry Root > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > > > I use "Liquid Glove" especially when working on cast iron. The secret is to > > work a good solid wedge of the stuff under your fingernails..That washes out, > > when the time comes, and brings all the crap with it > > > > teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Missing Messages From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 25 Oct 1999 18:11:42 GMT -------- Thank you Marshall and thanks to the other people who have taken the time to respond and bring me up to speed on this problem. First I need to analyse and quantify the nature and extent of the problem...I can do this with numbers and dates provided by Kevin, Scott John et al. and my own "sent" and received records. Then me and my ISP are going to have a "Come to Jesus Meeting" ;^) Not wishing to take up any more of anyone elses (Now more appreciated!!) valuable bandwidth, I will call these proceedings to a close... Thanks, teenut Marshall Pharoah wrote: > > Normally, your ISP (Internet Service Provider) provides you with a news > server, which is just another computer on their net. > When you post, you are posting to that server. That server then relays your > post to a news feed service. This then relays it to other servers it > services, and to other news feed services. Theres actually more to it than > that, but the idea is there. You miught possibly have your news reader set > to ignore your own posts, but if you are seeing some of them, then it isn't. > But, if you look at the traffic on this group, and cosider that there are > over 44000 news groups last time I checked, It's most likely that your posts > are expiring as fast as you make them, at least locally. There are tons of > binary (image) news groups that suck up a lot of available storage on you > news server. Since the storage space is finite, it is necessary to expire > messages by keeping track of the date/time and expiring the oldest first. > If you post when some big porn purveyor is posting large quantities of > images, and if your ISP is not providing sufficient storage, your messages > may get deleted quickly. It may also be that your ISP simply has problems > that they're unaware of. > > What you can do: > Talk to your ISP, they might be willing to look and see if they have a > problem. > They might be willing (if able) to assign a longer expiration time to > this new group. > You can subscribe to an external news service (for a fee). These > services typically charge $10-$25/month But supposedly have a higher quality > of services. I've never dealt directly with one. Deja news provides one on > a fee basis, as do NewGuys, and a few others. The problem with this is that > you are now going through several links to get your messages, which means > that you will see delays for each message you read. Normally you are > reading from a machine on your ISP's local net. > You can purchase a news feed and set up your own news server, and just > suppost a few of the groups you want, and set your own expiration. You then > can supply your buddies with access to it. ;^) > > I think I would call tech support at your ISP first. > > I hope this answers your questions...... > > -- > Marshall Pharoah > Software Engineer > Adirondac Software > PIC/6805/6811/68000 > Asm/C/C++ > > Robert Bastow wrote in message <3813FB96.B27C1364@home.com>... > >There seem to be an awful lot of messages missing recently...Fully 1/3 of > the > >responses I have posted...including a couple of apologies (before you all > >cheer!!) have simply disappeared into the ether. > > > >Is this a function of the server that *I* am using..if so what better one > can > >anyone suggest? > > > >This never used to happen when I used netscape, hotmail, and bellsouth net. > > > >Whenever I posted a response it would show up on my screen within > >minutes..seconds even, sometimes. Now it has become a shell game...spend > twenty > >minutes writing something...and about a one in three chance of ever seeing > it > >again > > > >Some of the messages that I don't ever see are obviously showing up on > other > >peoples screens because I see responses to them. > > > >What is going on? > > > >BTW An explanation of how all this stuff works..What is a "server" what > is an > >"ISP" what is a "news reader" etc would be much appreciated by this > computor > >challenged and internet ignorant old fart! > > > >Thanks > > > >teenut > > > >Then again, no-body may ever read this!! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lapping plates... where to find? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 25 Oct 1999 22:42:59 GMT -------- In the mid 1800's if not before,,,Sir Joseph Whitworth. Manchester, England. teenut John \"EBo\" David wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > By Definition: > > > > If you have three "flat" plates that "spot" together, interchangeably That is: > > > > 1 & 2 match > > 2 $ 3 match > > 1 & 3 match > > > > They are all three dead flat. Period!!! > > > > That is how surface plates were originally made, How hundreds of thousands of > > apprentices hve made their own plates, and how you can make your own plates > > today without any "reference" tools being required. > > Notw I have to ask... when was the technique developed? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Question for Group From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 25 Oct 1999 22:53:29 GMT -------- About 400 years! teenut Atlanta GA/Yorkshire John Jacobs wrote: > > I have learned so many valuable things in this group. Most of which > cannot be found in any book. I was wondering how far away my info was > coming from. I am located south of Philadelphia, PA > Thanks, > Chuck Key ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Missing messages From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 25 Oct 1999 23:02:02 GMT -------- mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > Then again, Robert, the new version of Gruff-O-Trim may be in > operation by now. Did any of those messages contain highly > personal comments about another user's parentage, or maybe > any reference to ~~how we used to do it in the old days~~? > > Jim It was a simple, polite, request as to the actual date and time for the upcoming nuptuals of a certain contributors's parents!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Which tool post for Atlas Lathe? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 25 Oct 1999 23:11:00 GMT -------- I got the AXA size for my Maximat 11" and it is a perfect trade-off (as these thing always are), between mass and compactness....Not being able to get a tool in where you need to cut will P*** you off a lot faster than some percieved lack of rigidity, Frankly, if I could have found a smaller one at a decent price I would have got it. "Theoretically" the wedge is far superior to the piston....In practice, on "Our" size of lathes..I defy anyone to quantify the difference. Mine is the Mk II or something..neither wedge nor piston..but a sideways moving plunger! It works just fine. teenut Chuck Sherwood wrote: > > >I have an Atlas-Craftsman lathe model # 101 07403 12"x36" > > I have the same lathe and I have the small one. It is an AXA or 100 series. > It works very well. This was the size that Dave Ficken recommended. > I got the wedge type, but others use the piston type and are happy with it. > > chuck sherwood ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Question for Group From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 25 Oct 1999 23:15:45 GMT -------- Tak PiPPi, for those kind words. But please don't be a stranger..Jim doesn't really bite..He just likes everyone to think he can!! What do you do (HSM wise!!!) during those long Sverige evenings? teenut Par Willen wrote: > > John Jacobs wrote: > > > I have learned so many valuable things in this group. Most of which > > cannot be found in any book. I was wondering how far away my info was > > coming from. I am located south of Philadelphia, PA > > I haven't posted anything in here but like any newsgroup RCM has lurkers > like me enjoying the information and banter. Usenet is truly > international and has a worldwide reach, I'm myself based in Stockholm > Sweden. > > Regards > PiPPi ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.woodworking Subject: Re: Safety question: Wearing gloves From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 25 Oct 1999 23:22:55 GMT -------- Good whisky and a dock leaf poultice would be much more appreciated! 8^) teenut Haynes-Henry wrote: while the middle-of-the-roaders try to dispense bandages and soothing > herbal tea to all combatants. Jolly good entertainment, what? Cheers -- > Ronnie Henry ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Last Flight of the 'Marie Celeste' SICK JOKE ALERT!! From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 25 Oct 1999 23:29:08 GMT -------- Rumour has it that the tragic crash of the runaway Lear Jet resulted from a pact the Golfer made with the Devil...His Soul for a Hole-in-One on Network TV!! Now you know where they come from!! Seriously..I mean no disrespect towards these people and their families..Morbid humor is nature's way of helping us face the unfaceable. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Safety question: Wearing gloves From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 25 Oct 1999 23:41:01 GMT -------- And I think yours is absolutely pedantic Gary! You know damn well what I was talking about. Remain silent and be thought a fool rather than open your mouth and remove all doubt!! Sorry, but you asked for it!! 8^0 teenut Gary Coffman wrote: > > On Sat, 23 Oct 1999 21:42:17 GMT, Robert Bastow wrote: > >mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > >> > >> In article , > >> Gary Coffman wrote: > >> > >> > A flat prohibition on gloves is much too strong. There are many times > >> > when gloves are appropriate. There are a few times when they are not. > >> > You've just got to have enough sense to know which is which. We aren't > >> > five years old, .... > > > >I have never advocated a flat prohibition on gloves inside or outside the shop. > >I have several different types I wear, depending on requirements. > > > >I do however absolutely abhor the wearing of any kind of gloves around moving > >machinery, of any kind. > > Jackhammer? Jitterbug? Sidewinder? Chainsaw? I think many well respected > health and safety experts recommend gloves for operating those machines. > In particular, anti-vibration gloves. One of the scariest machines to operate, > the trip hammer, requires the wearing of gloves because the work is too *hot* > to handle with the bare hand. Shears are another sort of machine where the > hand needs the protection against sharp edges of the work that a good glove > will provide. > > Now understand that I agree that wearing gloves when operating a lathe, > mill, drill press, or bench grinder is just asking for trouble (though I think it > is acceptable to wear gloves when working on and around those machines > when they are stopped). But there are other sorts of machinery with moving > parts where the wearing of gloves isn't considered a bad practice. Those > machines are generally the ones which have handgrips that you have to > grasp firmly while operating the machine. That tends to keep your hands > (and gloves) out of der springenwerks. That's why I think your statement > is too absolute. > > Gary > Gary Coffman KE4ZV | You make it |mail to ke4zv@bellsouth.net > 534 Shannon Way | We break it | > Lawrenceville, GA | Guaranteed | ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.woodworking Subject: Re: Safety question: Wearing gloves From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 00:22:00 GMT -------- I thought Long and Hard about how, or even if, to respond to this Jim. Perhaps it would be better if save the specific horror stories for occasions when they have a direct bearing..or risk diluting their value with over exposure..yada yada. But you are correct..I have not..will not, ever forget..It just didn't come up. Serious accidents in "Machine Shops", particularly Home Machine Shops are mercifully, few and far between. That isn't because the equipment isn't dangerous...I think it is because, in general the "Pros" are very well trained..and the "newbies" are sufficiently scared (so are the pros) to treat the machinery with the respect it deserves. Lurking on the rec. Crafts Woodworking site recently..(Because of my missing posts) I was (surprisingly??) surprised by the number of threads and posts that basically began..."Well I just got back from the ER and you guys need to call me "Lefty" now"...The common thread in the "fess ups" being lack of attention/respect brought about by lack of proper training..among the "Pros"..and therefore, by association, among the "Yros" We just all "enjoyed"??? a good "Dust up" here over safety issues (and if I have omitted to apologise to anyone who might have felt the "rough edge"...I hereby do so apologise..) I do not, however promise not to do it again!! Hey..be careful out there!! 8^) teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > "B & L Denard" wrote: > > > You forgot three things ,Rings, Ties,and Long Hair. in my 52 years > > in > > metal working i have seen more men mangle because of these three > > things , > > and i truly beleive a Dillpress is the most dangerst machine in any > > shop. > > I bet tnut didn't forget - it just never came up! I am willing > to bet that, as an instructor in the metalworking trades, he had > the obligatory 'scalp' in his shop to show the new folks. Be it > a hairpiece or a piece of mangled roadkill. This is a required > prop in the orientation lecture! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 9" SB geartrain noise From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 00:24:38 GMT -------- Leave the wrapping paper between to eliminate the noise entirely..;^) teenut Just kidding Gerald!! Gerald Miller wrote: > > Idler gears between the reverse rocker and the lead screw gear are > adjustable on their mount. Engage the gears with a piece of wrapping paper > in between to provide the recommended clearance. :-)} > > -- > > Gerry > London, Canada > > Grant Erwin wrote in message > news:38148156.63816359@halcyon.com... > > Hi. Now that I've got my lathe running, I'm trying to get all the spurious > > noises out of it. The new flat belt runs absolutely silently. However, for > > a time I thought it didn't. Then I realized I'm getting noise out of my > > gear train. 100% diagnosis by putting the forward/reverse lever into > > neutral, all noise disappears. Is there an adjustment up around there that > > might be out a little? > > > > Not related to backgears or the quick-change gearbox, these noises are > > up by the spindle. > > > > Grant Erwin > > Kirkland, Washington ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Tool & Cutter Grinder From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 00:27:43 GMT -------- NOT the one I am bidding on on Ebay!! Find yer own! teenut Tom Csibor wrote: > > Can anyone recommend a good book into the proper and advanced uses of a > universal tool & cutter grinder. > > TIA > Tom Csibor ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Question for Group From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 00:37:35 GMT -------- Ok Bob, Please don't tell us where you're from..then you won't need to waste bandwidth responding to Par's post will you? Perhaps a little less starch in the shorts next time Huh! 8^) teenut (Y'all know I'm from Lower Alabama) Robert Bissett wrote: > > Par Willen wrote: > > > > John Jacobs wrote: > > > > > I have learned so many valuable things in this group. Most of which > > > cannot be found in any book. I was wondering how far away my info was > > > coming from. I am located south of Philadelphia, PA > > > > I haven't posted anything in here but like any newsgroup RCM has lurkers > > like me enjoying the information and banter. Usenet is truly > > international and has a worldwide reach, I'm myself based in Stockholm > > Sweden. > > > > Regards > > PiPPi > > --- > Please, not again. > One of these "Where are you located" threads showed up in another ng. Cross-posted > to 6 or 7 groups it dragged on for over a months with dozens, sometimes a hundred replies > a day. > > Bob > ---- ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.woodworking Subject: Re: Safety question: Wearing gloves From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 00:42:54 GMT -------- ABSOBLOODYLUTELY Now go back to the rec.Lefties group and read all the posts bragging about the number of stitches they had this week. Dumkopf cs_posting@my-deja.com wrote: > > In article <38105763.25676ED9@home.com>, > Robert Bastow wrote: > > Craig, my Father in law and my Brother in law are both surgeons..I > get latex and > > non latex surgical gloves from them by the case load. > > > > Quit trying to convince me that you are not an idiot! > > > > I frankly don't give a rats a** whether you think different rules > apply to you, > > that you have a source of special "Quick release gloves" whether you > think the > > machines you work on have an "Ouch" switch, that you can move faster > than any > > machine, that you have a deal with Murphy, or that you give special > prayers to > > St Jude every morning. > > > > The fact that you would wear gloves of ANY kind around moving > machinery of ANY > > kind is enough to brand you as Doctorate Level Stupid! > > > > That you should advocate such use on a public forum and thus endanger > OTHER > > people makes you DANGEROUSLY NEGLIGENT of the safety of others...and > that earns > > you my CONTEMPT! > > > > I guess all those woodturners who wear gloves because they couldn't > work without them are idiots then > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Alien artifact? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 00:47:16 GMT -------- Its an anti-personnel mine Chris. Chris? CHRIS?? Hello-oo? Teenut "Chris K. Hepburn" wrote: > > Hey all... > > I'm cleaning up (read: excavating the living room) in preparation for > moving and I rediscovered a bit of strangeness I found at the side of the > road a few years ago. I have no idea what it is and am wondering if > anyone out there might be able to tell me... > > It's four inches across, an inch thick, and made of steel. > > It has a hole about 3/4 inch across, dead in the middle of it. The hole > is inset in such a way that I'd guess the thing probably goes onto a > shaft. > > There are three more holes, about 5/16 inches across set in a triangle > around the central hole > > There are three slits cut into the sides of the thing and a set screw > installed horizontally in the slits. > > Each slit points to one of the smaller holes. > > There is an inscription around the central hole that reads (vaguely, > because some of the letters are double struck): "No(with a line above the > "o")NREREo(with a line under the "o")Co(with a line under the "o")VA > VANCBC "4" (in quotes, upsidedown) and another 4 (also upsidedown). > > Any idea what kind of steel this is? What does the thing do? Is it > valuable? If I recall correctly, the only reason I rescued it from the > side of the road is that it looks like it would make a good mini-anvil. > > At any rate, I'd sure appreciate some input from anyone who might know > what this thing is! > > Chris, AB ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Grinder for making Knifes? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 01:01:30 GMT -------- Eventually a 2 x 72 Blade grinder will probably fit your developing needs better. More Horsepower, variable speed, wider variety of belts at cheaper prices etc etc. But for starters the grinder you have now will more than suffice. Most "Pro" bladesmiths started with far less. Try Bob Egnath and Don Hogg..both have web pages that a simple search will throw up. Rec.craft. knives too. teenut tom wrote: > > I'm new at metal working. I bought a 4"x36" belt sander from Sears. > Would a 2" be better for grinding knife blades that I am forge shaping? > Anywhere on the Web with anything like this? > > Thanks > Tom ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Yet another sparkies question From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 01:07:10 GMT -------- Finally confirmed all I ever suspected about Sparkies!! teenut Kevin Szabo wrote: > P.S. For those that care, Hole Current is an abstraction used in > semiconductor physics to model the 'absence' of electrons in P-doped > semiconductors. Current still moves with electrons but it appears > that the 'absence' (hole) moves instead of the electrons. Makes > a whole lot of mathematical modelling of the device easier. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Laminated drill bits? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 01:47:44 GMT -------- Probably not, (in fact almost certainly not) "laminated" What you have is a bunch of old carbon steel drills. Unlike more modern High Speed Steel drills these were not ground to shape out of a solid, hardened blank. More usually they were first milled, then heat treated, and finally, centerless ground on the O/D. As a result the, "land"..the 1/16" wide strip along the edge, is usually more pronounced, the relief cut being deeper (to allow for warpage in HT and with a squrer edge to it than you would see on a HSS drill. Of course the land is left with the ground finish, the rest of the drill body being left as heat treated. This is a good "Rule of Thumb Recognition Point" when faced with deciding whether a bunch of old drills are Carbon Steel or HSS. Old HSS drills often have a very shallow and much less clearly defined land relief...to the point of almost looking "Blurred" teenut AAsberry wrote: > > This weekend I bought a cigar box of rusty drill bits at a garage sale. > Masonry, spur, cheap, quality; all kinds. I cleaned up a few and sharpened > them. A few have what looks like a different metal on the cutting edge. It is > about 1/16 thick (wide?). It looks almost like the metals were laminated and > then twisted. I don't find anything like them in the catalogs I have. > > What are they called? How are they made? Any special use? > > Andy > > Prescription without diagnosis is malpractice. In medicine and mechanics. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: One for the CNC buffs From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 03:52:29 GMT -------- What is this and what are its capabilities and limitations ref HSM 3 axis machine tool control. Would YOU use something like this to CNC retrofit a small mill? http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=188107267 Apart from the obvious drives, ballscrews servos..what else would be required? I do like the manual overide/operating feature. Just curious...trying to get my skills into the 20th century..before it is the 21st 8^) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: torquing bolts: to oil or not to oil? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 04:08:45 GMT -------- Bolts to be torqued shoul always have a consistant coefficient of friction...Otherwise the tension generated will vary from bolt to bolt..kinda defeats the object. There are only two conditions that can guarantee consistant coefficients (assuming consistancy of materials, hardness and surface finish) Dead clean and dry Dead clean and lubed Dry runs the risk of galling (with similar materials)and after-corrosion. With stainless fasteners you would never get them on..never mind off again! Clean and lubed is the way it SHOULD be spec.'d, with torque value based on that condition. Teenut Jim Stewart wrote: > > Once again (on the BritIron motorcycle list) this question has come up, > something like "In the unlikely event I ever waste money on a torque > wrench, should I oil the threads or torque 'em dry?". > > Well, how about it, guys? > > I've always used a drop of oil on the threads because I've always been > working with used studs/bolts that are sorta grotty. I figure I have no > choice when dry torquing causes a sound like "eek-eek-eek". > > I've been told lubing threads reduces the required torque. I've also > been told it increases the required torque. But I have *not* been told > why. I mean, "why" as in "here's what's happening" rather than "why" as > in "because so-and-so says so". > > -------- > > My own intuitive take is to lube the fastener because I don't want > friction to interfere with proper stretching of the bolt. > > And then I've seen one shop manual that gave two torque readings, one > for lubed and one for dry. But that was for a Fiat, therefore suspect. > Some of you will know what I mean. > > -TIA, js > > -- > > http://www.strappe.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Yet another sparkies question From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 04:17:24 GMT -------- Not a chance!...meaning absolutely no disrespect to Sparkies..but I really do think the two disciplines of Electrical vs Mechanical Engineering, require two very different thought and logic patterns. Kinda like the difference (though that is not it) between left and right brain thinkers. I'm a "Mechie" and I don't think I would make a GOOD "Lechie" if I studied for the next hundred years...no more than I could become a Concert Harpist. But I know how to ask 'em questions!! teenut mike II wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > Finally confirmed all I ever suspected about Sparkies!! > > > > Join them, Robert...they're calling you....join them...Be one with > them..... > > mike ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Yet another sparkies question From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 05:46:48 GMT -------- Kevin Szabo wrote: > > In article <3814FFE1.484566F2@home.com>, > Robert Bastow wrote: > |Finally confirmed all I ever suspected about Sparkies!! > |teenut > > just been insulted, but he just isn't sure. And lord knows how > to respond 'cause he hasn't figured out the insult yet. So > much for plan A to avenge his name. He decides to go for plan > B ... which involves grunting, a quick f*rt, and then resignation. > He moves on to the next article in the newsgroup :-> Please don't take what I said as an insult Kevin..It wasn't meant to be such! I was refering to the statement you made in the last post..Which..Tho' I do not doubt its veracity was absolute greek to me! (Greek not Geek) It confirms..what I always suspected..simply that me an' Sparkies were born under different stars. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: One for the CNC buffs From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 11:56:38 GMT -------- I have written programs for 2 3 and 4 axis NC and CNC machines since the early days..when everything had to be laboriously punched onto paper tape on a flexowriter. I guess what you are saying is that it is still possible to do this without "Programming Software"..providing one has time, a calculator and reasonable facility with trig.? and then imput this to a Control, via a lowpowered laptop (I have a spare PentiumII) Bear with me on this one, as I haven't had the need (or the urge) to go near a CNC machine tool for 14 years! Dunno Why it should suddenly catch my interest again..maybe laziness! teenut "Matt Stawicki (APP Leader)" wrote: > > You don't NEED programming software. That's a luxury, not a > necessity. I have been Teaching programming since 1982 and > have yet to find a NEED for programming software. Oh sure, > there have been times when it would have been nice, but > there has never been a time when I couldn't get by without > it. This includes complex 5 axis conturing moves on round > parts, like letering. > > Keep in mind that I have been programming lathes. Swiss > lathes specifically. Now these have not been your basic 2 > axis machines. These have been 6 axis turning centers. In > fact, I have programmed, and taught programming on, 11 axis > turning centers. There is no programming software for > machines like this. The machines (Tornos Deco 2000) come > with software that compile the programs, but you still write > and synchronize, the programs by hand. > > Now, I do realize that when you get into complex milling, > that a programming system begins to approach necessity, and > makes things much easier. But, you can still get buy without > it. > > Tony Jeffree wrote in message ... > >Apart from the hardware, the major item you may need > (depending how > >effective the bundled software is) is a decent NC software > package. > >Supercam (the package bundled with the Taig) is fairly > versatile - has > >rudimentary drawing capability to allow you to define > toolpaths, but > >will also import files from CAD packages. There are a good > number of > >others. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: One for the CNC buffs From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 12:21:47 GMT -------- Tony Jeffree wrote: Clipped a detailed and welcome sybnopsis) Oh Lordy...I think I have been hanging around youse guys too long...I believe I actually understood most of what has been said so far!! Still, I hope there isn't a test later!! Maybe the urges will go away..I'll ask my shrink about increasing the dosages etc..But I find myself looking at my "new" Deckel FP1 and going "Hmmm!" Now, if I could retrofit with full four five or even six axis CNC (X Y Z plus 2 axis rotation plus quill) AND retain full manual control..using a (Bedside)console with analogue positioning controls (electronic remote calibrated dials)....Machine vision and In-process Gauging..... Hmmm! 'An if I included an automatic "Tombstone" pallet loader plus a 40 tool carousel changer with power drawbar... "Lights out" fully integrated CAD/CAM Flexible Manufacturing anyone? Gotta call the Shrink and bring my appointment forward!! 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Missing messages From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 12:38:19 GMT -------- I had my "Come to Jesus" meeting with my ISP... Lord be Praised..'tis a Miracle!! At first, they tried to "fluff" me off..but a little gentle insistance that I talk to "Someone that knows what the f*** they're talking about", plus other gentle "Diplomatic Exchanges" as in.."I know where you live and where your kids go to school"...Y'know...use of my well honed interpersonal skills and usual charm.... It now takes a measured 45 seconds from when I post to the appearance of my own messages back on my news reader! Back down to DEFCON 3 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Test only From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 12:42:14 GMT -------- Can't get much faster than this!! Robert Bastow wrote: > > Testing response/turnaround time > > teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Test only From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 12:43:14 GMT -------- Stand down invasion forces 8^) teenut Robert Bastow wrote: > > Can't get much faster than this!! > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > Testing response/turnaround time > > > > teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Test only From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 12:46:17 GMT -------- My "ISP Encouragement/incentive program" will shortly be available on CD-Rom! 8^) teenut Robert Bastow wrote: > > Stand down invasion forces > > 8^) > > teenut > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > Can't get much faster than this!! > > > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > > > Testing response/turnaround time > > > > > > teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: One for the CNC buffs From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 15:11:50 GMT -------- Thanks Tony, I figured that would get the creative juices flowing!! ;^) Tony Jeffree wrote: > Laziness?? Hell no. Appropriate use of available technology?? > Definitely. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: One for the CNC buffs From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 15:18:26 GMT -------- Tony Jeffree wrote: > > > > Yep...and the additional robot arm to reach over to the bedside table > from time to time & replenish your empty glass of single malt... Nobody, I repeat..NOBODY... touches my single Malts but me!! > > >Gotta call the Shrink and bring my appointment forward!! > > > > *Exactly* what are you on?? Give me your shrink's phone number - I > could do with some of what you're taking... ;-) I dunno. They won't tell me.. But if I can get these straps loose enough to lean over and check the writing on this big, lead lined container... 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Knickers & golf funerals From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 15:27:57 GMT -------- Except the ones worn by Vicars ("Vicar's Knickers"*) More properly known as Knee Britches. *Britspeak for "the cat's meow"...meaning, exactly right for the purpose. Teenut mikoberg wrote: > Oh I guess I had better say that across the big puddle knickers are > womens underpants. > > -Mike Oberg ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: One for the CNC buffs From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 17:10:55 GMT -------- Where do you keep it? When are you away from home? Do you have a dog? Can it be bribed? teenut Tony Jeffree wrote: > > On Tue, 26 Oct 1999 15:18:26 GMT, Robert Bastow > wrote: > > > > > > >Tony Jeffree wrote: > >> > > > >> > > >> Yep...and the additional robot arm to reach over to the bedside table > >> from time to time & replenish your empty glass of single malt... > > > >Nobody, I repeat..NOBODY... touches my single Malts but me!! > >> > > > I resemble that remark... > > I have a small quantity of the first year's production from Arran - > the first new, independent distillery to be built in Scotland for many > years. They issued a small batch onto the market early as a > taster...only just legally allowed to be called Scotch, but already > showing considerable promise. Once it "comes of age" it looks like > being VERY drinkable indeed... > > Regards, > Tony > > Website: http://www.jeffree.u-net.com/ > When replying, delete "X." from the Email address to remove anti-SPAM measures. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Yet another sparkies question From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 17:15:14 GMT -------- Ha! You can't catch me that easy Gary!!! The pump would be on the DOWNHILL side...'cos iffn the water was needed to go THAT way, there wouldn't be no need for a PUMP!! You think I'm stoopid ! teenut Gary Coffman wrote: > > On Tue, 26 Oct 1999 04:17:24 GMT, Robert Bastow wrote: > >Not a chance!...meaning absolutely no disrespect to Sparkies..but I really do > >think the two disciplines of Electrical vs Mechanical Engineering, require two > >very different thought and logic patterns. Kinda like the difference (though > >that is not it) between left and right brain thinkers. > > The physics required to master either discipline is the same. But we "sparkies" > have to be able to work it without seeing the essential parts spin or reciprocate > (because they are submicroscopic charge carriers, or non-material fields). > > Think of the problem we're discussing as if you had stumbled upon a pipe > carrying water under pressure in the woods. How would you tell which way > was the pump and which way was the faucet without severing the pipe? > > Gary > Gary Coffman KE4ZV | You make it |mail to ke4zv@bellsouth.net > 534 Shannon Way | We break it | > Lawrenceville, GA | Guaranteed | ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lapping plates... where to find? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 17:41:32 GMT -------- Ted Go read abook on BASIC Metrology! teenut Ted Edwards wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > By Definition: > > That is shear nonsense. A reasonable definition of a flat surface is > one for which all points lie in a single plane in Euclidean 3-space. > *NO* mechanical (or optical, for that matter) process supplies a > definition only a procedure to approximate one. > > > > If you have three "flat" plates that "spot" together, interchangeably That is: > > Define spot. How is this done? With what equipment and/or materials? > To what level of precision and accuracy? > > > > 1 & 2 match > > > 2 $ 3 match > > > 1 & 3 match > > How do you determine match? > > > > They are all three dead flat. Period!!! > > Not period but question. What is "dead" flat? > > While I respect your knowledge and experience, Robert, it would be nice > if you would attempt to answer the question in practical terms rather > than religious dogma. > > Ted ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Elec. Motor Question From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 19:26:24 GMT -------- It means even an electrical clutz like me can't screw it up!! 8^) teenut Better qualified people than me will give you a more definitive response John. John Jacobs wrote: > > What does "Drip-proof" mean when talking about a motor ? Just wondering > Thank You, > Ken Ametal ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Yet another sparkies question From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 19:27:48 GMT -------- A definitive response from Superman!! teenut Dan j Clingman wrote: > > Absolute Hockey Puck! > > I have a electrical engineering degree and do significant amount of > mechanical design and analysis. If you understand one you understand > the other. > > Stress analysis, modal analysis, heat transfer, network and control > theory share the same math. The same for thermal, aerodynamics and > propagation theory. Duality is so prevalent that it is the first thing > I look for. > > The only advantage a EE has is he/she is required to take a lot of > applied math hidden in electrical engineering classes. > > Dan Clingman > > > > On Tue, 26 Oct 1999 04:17:24 GMT, Robert Bastow wrote: > > > >Not a chance!...meaning absolutely no disrespect to Sparkies..but I really do > > > >think the two disciplines of Electrical vs Mechanical Engineering, require two > > > >very different thought and logic patterns. Kinda like the difference (though > > > >that is not it) between left and right brain thinkers. > > > > > > The physics required to master either discipline is the same. But we "sparkies" > > > have to be able to work it without seeing the essential parts spin or reciprocate > > > (because they are submicroscopic charge carriers, or non-material fields). > > > > > > Think of the problem we're discussing as if you had stumbled upon a pipe > > > carrying water under pressure in the woods. How would you tell which way > > > was the pump and which way was the faucet without severing the pipe? > > > > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Hard drive case metal ? What about the platters? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 19:30:52 GMT -------- Oh oh! Now you have done it Janos.. Ted is going to be on YOUR case until you define "Dead Flat" teenut Janos Ero wrote: . The rest is aluminium, machined > to dead flat. > > Janos Ero ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Help me identify this lathe bed From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 21:03:48 GMT -------- No idea on identity...but ebay it anyway..don't put a reserve on it and start at $5.00 or so. Describe it as Ideal as a base for a rifling machine...quite a few people into that. Where are you and how much do you want for it? 8^) teenut TS wrote: > > There's a photo of it here. > Its in pretty good condition, with some light rust, but the inverted > v-ways are smooth and mostly rust free. > Its 43" long and the v-ways have a 5" spacing. The rack is still under > the front edge. Probably 100#. Came from the basement of a deceased tool > and die man. > > http://www.ts-art.com/ebay/lathebed.jpg > > Any idea of make / model appreciated. Approx. Value? > Anyone interested in it for a price that makes it worth crating and > shipping? > Should I Ebay it, or keep it and make it a planter, lamp base, or boat > anchor? > > TIA > > Tony ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: FS, Levin lathe in Grass Valley, pics posted From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 23:34:02 GMT -------- VERY Nice! I was always told.."If you have to ask how much it is..you can't afford it" Being that I can't afford the lathe..how much for the pics? 8^) teenut Jon Anderson wrote: > > Still have the Levin for sale, posted pics to: > > http://www.prototype-design.com/images/levin1.jpg > http://www.prototype-design.com/images/levin2.jpg > http://www.prototype-design.com/images/levin3.jpg > http://www.prototype-design.com/images/levin4.jpg > > Jon ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Yet another sparkies question From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 23:38:13 GMT -------- I don't know what kind of beer YOU drink Mate..but in mine the Bubbles go UP and the beer better stay where it is 'til I"M ready for it to go DOWN!! teenut Steve Smith wrote: > > Hole current was explained by a nice analogy in one of my classes. Holes are > like bubbles in your beer. It looks like the bubble is moving up, but its > really beer molecules moving down! > > Last time I checked, holes and electrons were nice classical items, not > quantum. Transistor physics can be explained very nicely in classical terms. > > Steve Smith > > Norman Yarvin wrote: > > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > >Kevin Szabo wrote: > > > > > >> P.S. For those that care, Hole Current is an abstraction used in > > >> semiconductor physics to model the 'absence' of electrons in P-doped > > >> semiconductors. Current still moves with electrons but it appears > > >> that the 'absence' (hole) moves instead of the electrons. Makes > > >> a whole lot of mathematical modelling of the device easier. > > > > > >Finally confirmed all I ever suspected about Sparkies!! > > > > > >teenut > > > > That part of the business is quantum physics, and even electrical > > engineers don't understand it. Their relation to the quantum physicists > > who work for semiconductor manufacturers is much the same as your > > relation to the chemists who work for steelmakers: there is some very > > complicated and expensive work that goes on in a lab somewhere, but all > > you or they see are the end results of the few projects in those labs > > that succeed. > > > > -- > > Norman Yarvin yarvin@cs.yale.edu ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Help on temperatures to melt metals? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 26 Oct 1999 23:52:52 GMT -------- I have got steel bar up to forge welding temperature in a Coffee Can Furnace! I think the previous poster was mistakenly imagining that you meant the coffe can was used as a crucible. Not so, the coffee can simply serves as the outer wall of a furnace (Forge or Foundry), lined with refractory material. In my case I have an inch of 2600 deg ceramic blanket, lined with SPC100 and with a swirl type burner of my own design, fired with propane, I can make the end of a half inch steel bar sag and burn. Even a Bernz type propane, or Mapp gas torch will produce temeperatures up close to these ranges. Fierce temperatures can be developed without even singeing the paint on the can. With the right crucible and arrangement for a larger burner I feel sure that small quantities of cast iron could be melted. One of my "Round Tuit" projects! teenut John Wasser wrote: > > [[ This message was both posted and mailed: see > the "To," "Cc," and "Newsgroups" headers for details. ]] > > In article <7v2ud6$1ml$1@bgtnsc01.worldnet.att.net>, Wayne Lundberg > wrote: > > > Adrian Hodgson wrote in message <38152F29.C4D@aphtrading.co.uk>... > > >Just getting going with a Coffee can foundry. > > > > > About the only thing you can melt in a coffee can would be solder which is a > > eutectic alloy of lead and tin and melts at a lower temperature than either > > of the two alloys. > > I have melted both aluminum and (barely) brass in a Coffee-Can > Foundry. See: http://www.John-Wasser.com/NEMES/CCF.html ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: C'mon fellows - be civil From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 27 Oct 1999 00:07:04 GMT -------- Moi, William? Why I do it for the FUN of it and to break up the boreing LOOOONG waits between receiving a worthwhile contribution from YOU! This is an open forum..nobody gets paid to give the often invaluable advice that is available here on a daily basis. It is NOT a research Institute, which you, or anyone else pays to remain silent until you get around to consulting it. No one here OWES you an answer on anything William..Profound or Ribald!! Unlike a lot of NGs this one operates more like a "Club" where friends and strangers from around the world can drop it, have a chat, tell a joke, ask a question, share experiences an, yeh! Occasionaly have a spat! None of this is any of your damn business unless you want to be part of what it IS..not what you think it ought to be! So get your panties out of your crack and join in or pass..it's all the same to me!! William Mundus wrote: > > If you feel that you have to answer every post with some smart > remark.....you should ask "Why an I doing this". > > You,I hope, know who you are. Rethink. > > Thanks > > -- > > --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > Willliam J. Mundus Ann Arbor, MI 48104-1738 > Phone or Fax 734-663-8172 > Annoy a liberal - - Work hard and be happy. > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Where'd "SWARF" come from? was:Any Ideas for containing swarf on mill From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 27 Oct 1999 00:15:19 GMT -------- brian whatcott wrote: > Swarf is from the old norse 'svarf' for file-dust according to COD > > Brian Which begs the question..Did the Norse have files, and if so what is the Olde Norse word for a file?? teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Turning ss tube in steady rest From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 27 Oct 1999 01:12:20 GMT -------- Hopefully you still have enough material left to take a bit of corrective action. Firstly understand that, with a steady rest it is "Monkey see..Monkey Do" If the O/d is out of round..then the I/d will simply mirror it. First thing is to normalise the material..otherwise any locked up stresses will simply keep distorting the tube as they are released. Nothing elaborate required..heat evenly to a dull red heat and let it cool in a draft free corner. Next problem is to get a truly circular o/d for the steady to run on. "Gently" is the keyword here. First you need to get it running on a true center. If you were doing a lot of them, I would suggest making a "cathead" or "spider"..simply a boss with radial setscrews that can be adjusted outwards to GENTLY grip the inside of the tube, without distorting it. However on a one off the usual practice is to use a wooden plug..Tapped GENTLY into the end. The tube will run sufficiently well in the steady to be able to GENTLY drill and ream a center hole in the plug. Now you can remove the steady and with the tube supported GENTLY between centers, you can turn the O/d truly round for sufficient length to provide a running surface for the steady jaws. Again, do this skimming GENTLY so as not to disturb your rather fragile set up. Best tool to use is a 60 degree screw cutting tool..lots of top rake, minimal radius, slow speed and slow feed...Take several cuts of only a few thou deep until you clean up all round. Once this is done you can remove the tailstock center and plug, re-introduce the steady and bore your inside diameter..confident that now it will be truly round. 8^) teenut John Jacobs wrote: > > I am boring 3.25 od ss tube with .100 wall. The trouble is out of the > three pcs. I am doing the last one is coming out out of round. I am only > cutting th id to 3.135. What is going wrong? I am using a steady rest > with rollers and I indicated the length of the tube. Like I said, two > pcs are perfect, the third is oblong. Please help. > John Jacobs ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Hard white plastic..Melamine From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 27 Oct 1999 02:21:13 GMT -------- Any Knife Makers supplier will have it in an unimaginable array of sizes types and colors. Try Texas Knifemakers or Jantz Supply. teenut "Eric R. Snow" wrote: > > On Fri, 22 Oct 1999 11:58:06 GMT, Robert Bastow > wrote: > > >I am replacing all the feed dials on several machines with the Hardinge type > >black numerals on white backgound. I need a source of HARD white synthetic > >material that can either machined from stock or cast to near net size. A dead > >white Melamine type material comes to mind...but I have never seen it in bar > >stock form. I need this in sheet form of minimum 3/8" thick, or bar form up to > >4" diameter. Ivory micarta or ivory substitute might be an attractive > >alternative. > > > >Materials suggestions and sources appreciated > > > >Thanks, > > > >8^) > > > >teenut > Can anybody tell me where to find the ivory subsitute micarta? I buy > my plastic from Laird. They have a Micarta display. There is no ivory > colored micarta that they can get. Or any other good ivory subsitute > for that matter. > ERS ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Yet another sparkies question From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 27 Oct 1999 02:37:32 GMT -------- I don't think "Sparkies" are bright enough to know when someone from the "Real World" insults them! It is not and never has been construed as a derogatory term in the UK where it originated. They always respond when addressed as such..and even here, on the NG we have a group of Sparkies who didn't even know they were Sparkies 'til I bought it up, who are now addressing each other as Sparkies. It seems to fill a need for a short, easily recogniseable term (Of Endearment even) for some one who's expertize lies in oneor more ot the electical disciplines EE sounds as pompous as it is..and there are so many fields of expertise in the "Electrical World" nowadays that it is a meaningless as "Mechanical Engineer" A term that, in North America invariably is taken to mean a HVAC/Plumber/Mechanical Services wallah...as opposed to a "Real" "Engineer" which most lay people equate to Civil Engineer. Maybe we should start calling us mechanical types.."Crankies" teenut eberleins wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > Kevin Szabo wrote: > > > > > > In article <3814FFE1.484566F2@home.com>, > > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > |Finally confirmed all I ever suspected about Sparkies!! > > > |teenut > > > > > > > > just been insulted, but he just isn't sure. And lord knows how > > > to respond 'cause he hasn't figured out the insult yet. So > > > much for plan A to avenge his name. He decides to go for plan > > > B ... which involves grunting, a quick f*rt, and then resignation. > > > He moves on to the next article in the newsgroup :-> > > > > Please don't take what I said as an insult Kevin..It wasn't meant to be such! > > > > I was refering to the statement you made in the last post..Which..Tho' I do not > > doubt its veracity was absolute greek to me! (Greek not Geek) > > > > It confirms..what I always suspected..simply that me an' Sparkies were born > > under different stars. > > > > teenut > > Robert, > > "Sparkies" may be considered an insult by some, so be careful. I used to call > Electrical Engineers (double E's) "Short Circuits".. Only got physically assaulted > by one guy, 'bout 15 years ago (who learned that Mechanical Engineers ARE good nut > re-arrangers, unlike Electrical Engineers). "Short Circuit" might be considered > more of a PC label these days. > > Regards, > > Mike Eberlein 10/26/99 ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: C'mon fellows - be civil From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 27 Oct 1999 04:18:48 GMT -------- If the cap fits!! Mark Winlund wrote: > > I also agree. I was among those that gave the unmentioned person a hard > time (years ago) and wish I hadn't. By the way, Robert, what gave you the > impression Peter Logghe or William Mundis were refering to you? They > certainly didn't mention anyone by name. > > Mark > > Peter Logghe wrote in message <38162D1B.67ED9CBC@sgi.com>... > > >As a group, we should make an effort to not tolerate > >the rudeness, and one-upmanship we have been > >seeing lately. > > > >Pete Logghe > > > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: "Who you all are" Census Report From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 27 Oct 1999 04:30:14 GMT -------- + mike II wrote: All real names have been > withheld for the protection of the individuals concerned. As you made a point of mentioning my "Nom de NewsGroup" twice (pointedly, for some obscure reason) I am relieved to know that you don't know my REAL name!! Begins with A ends with Z ;^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lapping plates... where to find? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 27 Oct 1999 04:53:28 GMT -------- It has often been said thet there are no stupid questions...But you are doing a pretty good job of giving the lie to that. Get one thing straight My Friend...I don't owe you an explanation of ANYTHING..you don't pay me for answers, you don't even offer common courtesy when you ask for , nay DEMAND explanations of things you don't understand. As someone has already pointed out..MOST people on this NG understood perfectly well enough, what is meant by "dead flat"...in the context I used it. Apparently so do you..in your response to a different thread you said "Dead Flat is closer than I can measure" or words to that effect. So which is it Mr Edwards? Do you really not know what I meant in the context? Do you really not know what is meant by the term "Spotting" Do you really not understand, that the technique I described will produce "dead flat" surfaces without any outside reference being required. Have you REALLY read all those books on basic metrology but still don't understand the principles and practices involved? Do you really expect me to believe that? Do you really expect me to HELP you understand. Do you really WANT to understand? Or, as is becoming pretty obvious, you have made up your mind that you will have bigger balls or something equally macho if you can JUST catch old teenut out one time and make him feel like the idiot you must feel like every time you tangle with me? It ain't going to happen Ted! ;^) teenut Ted Edwards wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > Go read abook on BASIC Metrology! > > Actually, I've read several. Your post has added absolutely *NO* > information. > > I asked, "How can we measure the degree of flatness in a reasonably well > equipped HSM shop?" You have added absolutely no information of > practical use. Why don't you climb down off your high horse and > contribute something other than sarcasm and put downs? > > Ted ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Yet another sparkies question From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 27 Oct 1999 05:01:54 GMT -------- What he is trying to say (gently) is that all the "Sparkies" would be screwed without all the "Crankies" to make their screw drivers!! ;^) (It is far too peaceful around here, he noted, crying "Havok" and letting slip the Dogs of War!! ;^) teenut tonyp wrote: > > Gary Coffman wrote > > > The physics required to master either discipline is the same. But we > "sparkies" > > have to be able to work it without seeing the essential parts spin or > reciprocate > > (because they are submicroscopic charge carriers, or non-material > fields). > > Gary, there are two things I've often envied "sparkies" for: > 1. You have linear dissipative elements (note to teenut: that means > resistors) to work with. While vaguely equivalent elements exist in > mechanics, they are nowhere near as cheap, widely available, or precisely > calibrated. > 2. You can see the _functional_parameters_ of your contraptions more easily > than we can. I mean things like voltage and current, compared to speed or > stress. There is no real equivalent to the oscilloscope in the mechanical > world. > > One NICE thing about mechanical pursuits is this: there will always be > work for MEs in our material world. When you think about it, most things > (outside of usenet discussions) involve moving some physical mass from one > place to another. As technology progresses, more and more human activity > may get devoted to lighting up interesting combinations of pixels on > computer screens, but as long as we have to feed, shelter, and transport > ourselves, the world will need the F=ma priesthood :) > > -- > Tony Prentakis > Consumer of time, occupier of space, producer of Z-stages > "How can I know what I think until I hear what I have to say?" ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Yet another sparkies question From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 27 Oct 1999 05:05:15 GMT -------- So THAT'S where it comes from! NOT the amusing way they light up when testing circuits with their thumbs!! Live and learn! teenut John Ireland wrote: > > SO, the term is actually more correctly applied to radio operators > > rather than to 'renaissance men'... > > > > mike II > > Well, almost right. The Shipboard radio operator was pretty universally > called sparks, but the actual sparks came from a rotary gap spark > transmitter. They were/are obnoxious sounding things and dangerous > (with a big variable speed DC motor driving the rotary gap). Didn't > want to get your tie near that baby. The receivers at the time were > crystal sets either Galena or Carborundum. Thay have been illegal > internationally for many years since they create unbelieveable broadband > interference. I think the ARRL still has one on display in Newington > CT. > > john ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Braille mic on ebay From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 27 Oct 1999 05:07:59 GMT -------- ROTFLMAO That has to get the comeback award of the week!! Thanks Bill, teenut Bill Browne wrote: > > Two? For that? 30,000 comedians out of work, and you guys are looking > at a career change? > > Red Rider wrote: > > > > OK STAN! YOU GET 2 ATTA-BOYS FOR THAT ONE. I wish I had said it. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Tool Drool Time From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 27 Oct 1999 06:21:23 GMT -------- http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=188844028 No I'm not bidding on this..Unless my lottery ticket comes up tonight I am in the process of building a similar system though based on a 5C spin index and a couple of angle plates, You can put together a system which will do most of what this can do..Actually a bit more because it has full dividing capabilities too Mine's not as pretty though! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Yet another sparkies question From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 27 Oct 1999 11:37:49 GMT -------- I don't need to imagine it Janos..you describe Atlanta traffic to a Tee!! teenut Janos Ero wrote: > > > (Just imagine: there is a traffic jam on a bridge. > All cars stop. In one moment the first car leaves > the bridge. It leaves a hole where is was standing. > The second car fills in the hole, leaving another > one. The third one does the same. After a while > all cars move forwards and the hole goes through > the bridge in the opposite direction. As the cars > have a mass, you can see, that after this movement > the targer side of the bridge is heavier, than it was > before. This is because the cars have positive mass. > But it can be considered such a way that it is the hole, > who has a negative mass. This is mechanics. In the > quantum physics those holes inside the semiconductors > have positive mass!) > > Janos Ero ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Home Brew Wanted for Degreaser & Paintstripper From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 27 Oct 1999 11:44:42 GMT -------- Hot, Soapy water!! No I am not kidding. In this day and age of always seeking an easy out we often forget the best ways are often the simpest. It takes a heck of powerful (lethal) solvent to do what simple, hot soapy/alkaline water can do. teenut Andrew Roberts wrote: > > Can someone help me out on a simple brew made up out of easy to find items that > will clean and degrease, > It has to be able to used on aluminium and brass as well as other alloys. > I just want to chuck whatever in a tub full, and let it soak, then take it out > and hose the 'brew' off. > > I found the following one on the web and I would like know if any one has tried > it out. > --------- > Mix equal parts Kerosene, Automatic transmission Fluid, Mineral Spirits and > Acetone. > --------- > > I also would like a recipe to make paint stripper with similar requirements to > the degreaser. > > Thanks > > --------------------¦ > Andrew Roberts- ¦ > Napier, ¦ > New Zealand ¦ > ¦ > villiers@xtra.co.nz ¦ > -------------------- ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: PLEASE HELP: SEEKING TUREEN $$$$$$ - jbjesq.jpg (0/1) From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 27 Oct 1999 11:49:05 GMT -------- Your search is over!! I have one JUST like the one you seek..it is the only one like it in the world... It is NOT for sale! teenut But there are people on this NG who can make one JUST LIKE IT..for the right price. What is it worth? cmj@mediaone.net wrote: > > Please see the attached picture. > > If you can help please contact me at cmj@mediaone.net or Joel Johnson > at jbjesq42@aol.com (760) 346 7660 (Palm Desert, CA) > > We are seeking the following: > > 1) a Tureen similar to the one in the photo (an old English style > Tureen / Victorian Foliated scrollwork) and > > 2) a water container simialr to the one in the photo > > Thank you, > > Cary ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Soldering or brazing to Tungsten From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 27 Oct 1999 11:59:31 GMT -------- I can't help with brazing..but I sure know how to WELD 2% thoriated electrodes to everything I try to tig weld!! 8^) Electron beam or even spot welding may be a route to investigate. Try a web search on tungsten..there is a ton of information out there. SOP..Find a company that makes the equipment to do it and ask for literature/tech help. If you can duplicate the technology, great. If not BUY it or find a different product to make and save yourself a bunch of time and heartache! BTDT too many times. teenut Jon wrote: > > I need to attach some other metals to tungsten TIG welding rod I am > using as electrodes in glass-envelope tubes I make myself. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Home Brew Wanted for Degreaser & Paintstripper From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 27 Oct 1999 12:21:59 GMT -------- I had an old Aunt..Sworn TT, who used to make her own "Tonic" from parsnips. Lethal stuff..would take the enamel off your teeth and knock a Parson off his bike!! She swore by it..lived to almost 100 years old..most of it in an alcoholic fog yet firmly beleiving she was tee-total! teenut Tony Jeffree wrote: > > On Wed, 27 Oct 1999 11:44:42 GMT, Robert Bastow > wrote: > > >Hot, Soapy water!! > > > >No I am not kidding. In this day and age of always seeking an easy out we often > >forget the best ways are often the simpest. > > > >It takes a heck of powerful (lethal) solvent to do what simple, hot > >soapy/alkaline water can do. > > > >teenut > > > >Andrew Roberts wrote: > >> > > I used to make a really lethal home-brewed solvent. If I recall, the > ingredients were malted barley, hops, water and yeast. Allow to > fester for a ccouple of weeks & then serve in tall glasses. (No, put > the solvent in glass drinking vessels, silly!). It was particularly > good at dissolving the user's mental abilities... > > Regards, > Tony > > Website: http://www.jeffree.u-net.com/ > When replying, delete "X." from the Email address to remove anti-SPAM measures. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: "Who you all are" Census Report From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 27 Oct 1999 12:23:51 GMT -------- I went to Wales for a month one weekend. It was closed! teenut Mike Graham wrote: > > On Wed, 27 Oct 1999 11:17:16 GMT, John Stevenson wrote: > > >Wales is not England. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Turning ss tube in steady rest From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 27 Oct 1999 13:07:40 GMT -------- Hoyt McKagen wrote: > > I faced the same problem once. We had to cut successive rings off a tube. > They had decent spec for diameters but did need to be round. We made a > plug for the chuck end that sat decently tight inside tube and simply > locked down on the combo. The free end was turned inside and out and then > parted off. You're limited by how much you can use out of the stock this > way as chuck will still distort it some, but we got about 75% of each > blank. > That works fine if you have a chuck and spindle bore big enough to "Deep Throat" the tube. The fact that he is using a steady indicates that is not the case!! 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: WNTD: commission of candle mold - preferably from Austin area From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 27 Oct 1999 15:58:45 GMT -------- Does this mold need to be tapered in any way..to be able to withdraw the finished candle? teenut James Michael Stewart wrote: > > I am looking for someone who can create a candle mold for me. I've > searched through craft and hardware stores and cannot find what I > want. > > I need a mold build from sheet metal, probably 1/16 or 1/32. I don't > care about what type of metal is used, as long as it retains its > strength and shape around 200 degrees. The mold is to be 2.5 inches > square and a tube 12 to 16 inches tall. One end must be capped or > enclosed. All seams must be fully sealed so the container is > water-tight like a tall metal mug. > > I'll gladly pay for the materials, time/effort, and shipping (if > necessary), if possible I'd like to obtain this for less than $30 - > since I don't know how involved this project is I may have the wrong > expectations. > > Please respond here or e-mail (mcintyre@io.com) to discuss the project > before you get started. If you have other ideas where I could purchase > or mail-order a similar item, your input is appreciated. > > Thanks, > Michael ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Ball turning - Will this work? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 27 Oct 1999 16:05:27 GMT -------- That will work Karl..I have done it that way myself! The bar doesn't need to be so long, a foot should be adequate. Neatest cheap way to make a ball turning tool is using one of the $50.00 boring heads from ENCO. Someone put the "words and music" on the Drop Box, though you sound like the kinda machinist that could figure it out from here. Go about it the right way and you retain the use of the boring head too! Best of both worlds. 8^) teenut Karl Townsend wrote: > > I need to make a couple of ball ends on my lathe. I'm wondering if I can > bolt a three foot long cheater bar to the compound vice. I'd then loosen the > hold down bolts on the compound just enough so I could rotate the compound > at the end of the cheater bar. Diameter would be determined by the location > of the compound slide. Any comments before I try it and break something? > > PLAN B: Seen any good plans for a ball turning attachment that won't take > 100 hours to build? > > -- > <(©¿©)> An apple a day keeps the doctor away. > Two apples a day gets the doctor's OK. > Five a day makes you a fruit grower like me. > > Karl@cmgate.com in Dassel,MN ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lapping plates... where to find? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 27 Oct 1999 16:07:16 GMT -------- Simply because you asked, nay demanded, in a very rude manner! Go figure! teenut Ted Edwards wrote: > > Doug White wrote: > > > limited by how good your spotting technique is. When done with care, > > I've heard it's pretty damn good. He used practical terms, you just > > don't understand them. > > So why not explain them? > > Ted ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lawyers+Metals in the news... From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 27 Oct 1999 16:13:30 GMT -------- Saying that lead, in leaded free machining alloys, could harm you is like saying that watching "Arsenic and Old Lace" could poison you. I do hope there is a "malicious and frivolous" clause in the law there..this guy needs taking to the woodshed! teenut Tim Shoppa wrote: > > I found this floating about on misc.consumers this morning. Are > California Home Machinists going to suddenly find it impossible > to import free-machining alloys as a result of this? > > Subject: > Re: Brass Keys cause cancer/poisoning? > Date: > Wed, 27 Oct 1999 08:52:40 -0500 > From: > Keith King > Organization: > Posted via Supernews, http://www.supernews.com > Newsgroups: > misc.consumers > References: > 1 > > Wilson wrote: > > > Has anyone heard anything about keys being dangerous because of lead > > content? > > I heard a news report last week, as I recall the California attorney > general was suing all of the makers of keys, which have a small amount > of lead added to the alloy to improve cutting characteristics. While he > blathered on about the risks of lead, he never mentioned any indication > that lead in keys had ever affected anyone. I finally figured out what > this was all about with his last couple of sentences when he said that > this suit could be worth hundreds of millions of dollars (if I recall > the amount correctly), i.e., state initiated lawsuits as revenue > generators. > Regards, > Keith ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Favorite Graffiti From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 27 Oct 1999 20:17:24 GMT -------- Beer.....It's not just for breakfast anymore! teenut Susan Spargo wrote: > "Prune Juice Shall Set You Free" ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lapping plates... where to find? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 27 Oct 1999 20:28:22 GMT -------- mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article <3816866E.DDC41A13@home.com>, > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > ..MOST people on this NG understood perfectly > > well enough, what is meant by "dead flat"...in the context I used it. > > In general though, a flatness spec has to have a *number* associated > with it - In "General" yes but I wasn't talking "In General" I was talking "In Specific" at the time.. Specifically..the tried and true method of GENERATING flat surfaces. How flat? doesn't enter in that conversation simply because it will produce "Infinite Flatness" (For want of a better phrase)....There is NO LIMIT to the degree of flatness that can be generated that way until you come to an atomic level...the longer you keep going..the flatter it gets! Which is why, coming from someone professing to to be an expert on metrology, "How Flat?" is a dumb fool question!! (Just like "How long is a piece of string") Thus any qantifying answer I could have given IN THAT CONTEXT would have been a dumb fool answer..and I TRY not to do that! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: C'mon fellows - be civil From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 27 Oct 1999 20:33:14 GMT -------- 8^) 8^) 8^) 8^) 8^) 8^) (A few for inventory..in case I ever forget!!) teenut Edward Haas wrote: > > --Don't forget the smileys, gang! They add a bit of civility to many > (otherwise) easily misconstrued remarks... ;-) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: "There was a disturbance in the force..." From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 28 Oct 1999 00:18:51 GMT -------- Mark Winlund wrote: > > You can pretty easily grind the t nuts to work. The only critical surface is > the one that faces up. There is no amount of grinding could ever get me to lift a bat again!! As to which of my (many) faces is critical...and which one faces up at any particular time...I will thank you Sir, to allow me to decide that!! Respectfully (for the moment 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Any experience buying from Al Babin? UPDATE From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 28 Oct 1999 00:42:19 GMT -------- The machinery business is no different than any other business... You can survive, without technical knowhow, long enough to learn. Without contacts, trust and mutually beneficial understandings, you are DEAD...day one!! Personally I have had no dealings with Al Babin that had any problems he and I couldn't and didn't sort out with a phone call. Al is a good guy..hampered by sometimes writing ko when he means ok..Jeez you need me to spell it out guys?? He is learning fast, and improving fast..he finds and offers good kit at better than reasonable prices. If you need further information..CALL him...he has always been more than honest with me and I trust him. What you don't call and ask about..consider as your Caveat well and truly emptored!! teenut riverine@my-deja.com wrote: > > How the heck does a vending machine guy get all that cool stuff? > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Yet another sparkies question From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 28 Oct 1999 01:01:29 GMT -------- eberlein wrote: > > Mike Eberlein 10/27/99 - Who always thought that "Newton" who be a cool last > name until he saw that a Kg-m/sec^2 + other factors would replace a perfectly > good German surname. Mike raised an interesting question in my mind. We are ultimately in control of most every facet of our lives except In most cases) the name we are born with. Supposing, you had just arrived in (Your native or adopted country here) with a name that was spelled #@@#$*^% or was for some reason "Socially unacceptable"..like Adolf Hitler or Vladimir Draakula..whatever.. What new surname WOULD you choose? and why? Which of your Mentor/Heros would you chose to be permanently associated with. Brunel? Tessla? Einstein, Smith, Guillotin... teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Yet another sparkies question From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 28 Oct 1999 02:46:59 GMT -------- Okay, enough already!! I have lurked awhile til you girls quit trying to convince yourselves how just like boys you really are!! It has been amusing watching you go round in circles wondering who was going to disappear up their own fundament first 8^) But now the statments and assertions about just how much us crankies really are, and ought more to be, like sparkies has tepped well over the lines of indulgent credibility. So, it is time to you pause for a while, and actually come up with a bit of "verification of veracity" for some of the stuff you would attempt to obfuscate us into accepting.."just for the sake of peace and quiet" tonyp wrote: > All correct. My point about the oscilloscope was simply that, as a > general-purpose, easily available, minimal-set-up instrument, it beats hell > out of the various kludged-up combinations of stuff MEs often have to put > together -- Please describe and define exactly what "kludged up combinations of stuff" you have in mind >and then we have to look at the output signal on a scope > anyway! O woe is us :) O Woe...Whoa!..my heart bleeds for you..but don't you always have to look at the output of an oscilloscope "on a scope" anyway? Seriously, though, there are obviously excellent > reasons why........measurement instruments are much better when > they're electronic. Starting right now: on one sheet of paper, define, qualify, quantify and justify that wildass statement...Please 8^) So sparkies merit the praise and deserve the thanks of > all right-thinking MEs, IMHO. And then maybe we can determine if this statement has any merit or not! > > > You bet! Designing mechanisms that operate under computer control is about > all I've done my whole career. Lots of wide ranging assertations being made for one of such a narrow range of experience ;^) > > Yes! When it comes to dynamics, anyway. First and 2nd order ODEs are > common ground to EEs and MEs. I don't know if Mohr's circle has an analog > in electricity, but then there must be analytical tools in the sparkies' > bag that don't map on to mechanics. So there may still be a reason for > separate "disciplines", in academia anyway. I am going to invite some one else to translate that mixed and confused bag of "in-words"and "buzz words" for me..It may have well have been written in Greek for all the sense it makes to me! Just as a starter, what does "map" mean in this context? (Being generous, and allowing that maybe..just MAYBE..there IS a context here.) > > Now if we could only make do without those pesky software engineers ... :) Er...Aren't they the guys that make all your "mechanisms that operate under computer control" work..so that you can get paid? 8^) Do we get rid of them before, or after, all the Lawyers? > Tony Prentakis Just in fun Tony...Just in Fun. 8^) You may turn over your paper and begin NOW!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Home Brew Wanted for Degreaser & Paintstripper From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 28 Oct 1999 02:50:42 GMT -------- "Barry L. Ornitz" wrote: > For simple cleaning and degreasing, I second Robert Bastow's > suggestion of using soap and water. I tend to like Dawn(r) > Dishwashing Detergent, but often use Tide(r) and other detergents > too. These are safe and wash off easily. But Palmolive is SO much kinder to my hands...;^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Another thing you can do with a shaper From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 28 Oct 1999 02:55:38 GMT -------- And to think; All this started with the question "Why are shapers obsolete" We had better quit now, with all the neat stuff a shaper can do...before we start to push prices back up again!! ;^) teenut PLAlbrecht wrote: > > Well, here's another neat thing to do with a shaper. ..................... > Anyway, the shaper was able to do something that the router table couldn't and > the mill probably couldn't. Not with that surface finish anyway. > > Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Allowed Amperes in a Conductor Contest.. From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 28 Oct 1999 03:07:15 GMT -------- Chuck Harris wrote: > > Ok, > > Let's see if I remember how: 1 BTU is the heat required to raise > 1 lb of water 1 degree F. > > We have 2 gallons of water, so that is 16 lb of water. > (...a pint's a pound, the world around....) Oops..! A US pint is 16 oz...But a UK pint is 20 oz (the ounces are the same) A UK Gallon is 25% bigger than a US Gallon. Best stick to ounces and pounds when doing calculations..or risk hitting the wrong side of Mars! 8^o No wonder we are known as "Two peoples, separated by a common language" 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 1/2 x 32 tap and die? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 28 Oct 1999 03:28:02 GMT -------- Jeez John, you need to start charging for that kind of service! 8^) teenut John Hofstad-Parkhill wrote: > > > does anyone know of a place where i can get a 1/2x32 tap and die. > > J&L Industrial part # TSP-15752D, 1/2-32 tap, $12.71 (import) > DSP-74925L is a 1" O.D. round 1/2-32 die. $10.66 (import) > > If you order via the web on www.jlindustrial.com they will ship for free. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lapping plates... where to find? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 28 Oct 1999 05:43:24 GMT -------- You are still missing the point Jim (and Ted) I am not interested in whether or not someone wants to get the last word in and validate a claim that if I discuss "flat" I must specify a limit or define units and methods of measurement. That is no more a valid demand, than wishing to know the SIZE of a "Point" or the WIDTH of a "Line" In mathematical terms they have none!! A "point" has position but no size..A "Line" has length but no width. Similarly, "flat" means "Plane"..which has area but no thickness..to ascribe a tolerance between which the plane may deviate means we are no longer discussing a plane because it isn't FLAT anymore. The discussion started with my description of a technique that..by mathematical/physical definition, self generates FLAT...DEAD FLAT. Not "flat within xxx micro inches or angstroms" But FLAT period end!! To recap, or redefine, the original statement I made..in effect... If three surfaces are such that perfect contact is made between any two of them regardless of sequence or orientation...they are FLAT! Flat being the only condition for all three that will MATHEMATICALLY allow this to happen. That's it...no more to define or discuss. If I WERE discussing the manufacture of a particular object, of a particular size in a particular material and for a particular purpose then OF COURSE you would expect to get and I would expect to give, a measure of the deviation from perfect flatness that would be adequate for the purpose, attainable by reasonable known and available methods, and within the limitations of the material to "Take and Hold"...Tolerances and governed by practical limitations But that isn't what the discussion was/is about. Is it! Certainly not the one I have been having. teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article <3816866E.DDC41A13@home.com>, > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > ..MOST people on this NG understood perfectly > > well enough, what is meant by "dead flat"...in the context I used it. > > In general though, a flatness spec has to have a *number* associated > with it - or at least a "better then I can measure, and I can > measure down to X" or something. > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: "Who you all are" Census Report From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 28 Oct 1999 05:51:57 GMT -------- Ah! the well documented 19th Century "Welsh Brain Drain" when any Welshman that could find his way to the border kept right on going! The present day population of Wales is the product of natural selection in reverse!! teenut Steve Rayner wrote: > > Of course! One of the two proprieters, my grandfather LLewellyn, left the > place 100 years ago! > > Robert Bastow (teenut@home.com) wrote: > : I went to Wales for a month one weekend. It was closed! > > : teenut > > : Mike Graham wrote: > : > > : > On Wed, 27 Oct 1999 11:17:16 GMT, John Stevenson wrote: > : > > : > >Wales is not England. > > -- > > I'm a Canadian eh! Steve. > ************************************************************************** > The FAQ for rec.crafts.metalworking is at: http://w3.uwyo.edu/~metal > The metalworking drop box is at http://www.metalworking.com > or http://208.213.200.132 > ************************************************************************** > Visit my website at: http://www.victoria.tc.ca/~ud233/homepage.htm > > ************* Tu ne cede malis, sed contra audentior ito. **************** > ******************************** - Virgil ******************************** > ******Yield thou not to adversity, but press on the more bravely.********** ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Home Brew Wanted for Degreaser & Paintstripper From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 28 Oct 1999 06:36:06 GMT -------- Don Wilkins wrote: > > On Wed, 27 Oct 1999 11:44:42 GMT, Robert Bastow > wrote: > > >Hot, Soapy water!! > > > >No I am not kidding. In this day and age of always seeking an easy out we often > >forget the best ways are often the simpest. > > > >It takes a heck of powerful (lethal) solvent to do what simple, hot > >soapy/alkaline water can do. > > I agree but perhaps not alkaline water for aluminum. It depends on how > alkaline and how long. > > My first thought was a power washer with a mild detergent. > > Second thought was a basket and a trip to the car wash. Low overhead, > no inventory. Perhaps a bit better definition of soap and alkali and their relative roles in the washing process... "detergents" are commonly mixtures of a soap and an alkali..brighteners, deodorizers scents etc are also added for various purposes..not really relevant here Alkali..(Not Lye..but usually a sesquicarbonate or similar soda compound..even bi-carbonate which I use) This is what actually does the cleaning..by breaking down the grease that holds soil particles on or in the object or fabric thus allowing them to be flushed or more easily abraded away. Soap, in and of itself has no "Cleaning Power" (surprised me too!) Its main purpose is to hold soil particles in suspension and prevent the redeposition of dirt on the objects being washed and as a "wetting" agent..allowing the water and other cleaning agents to get in closer contact with the soil. The above is about the sum total of recollection I have from a four week course I took in "The Technology of Washing" some thirty years ago at the British Launderer's Research Institute in Hendon England. (My company at the time built institutional laundry equipment) I THINK I may still have the text book (somewhere) so if the above raises any serious questions or doubts..I may be able to come up with a few facts, figures formulae etc. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: "There was a disturbance in the force..." From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 28 Oct 1999 08:05:44 GMT -------- > Robert - > > I thought all of your faces were critical... > > Regards, > Tony Only as to Fit and Finish 8^) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Home Brew Wanted for Degreaser & Paintstripper From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 28 Oct 1999 08:14:56 GMT -------- Tony Jeffree wrote: Anyway, basically Ethanol with stuff added to > make it REALLY unpleasant as a cocktail) Oh I don't know..you can get used to anything! Especially with the price of my favorite vintage wine getting up close to 60 cents a bottle nowadays! 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Warehouse Clearance Sale From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 28 Oct 1999 14:04:01 GMT -------- RATS!! That is a heckuva price on the Kurt 6" vices..I just paid a lot more than that for mine!! Where were you when I needed you Dave? ;^) teenut Mermachine wrote: > > Greetings: > > I'm having a clearance sale at the warehouse on Saturday November 6th. from 8am > till 4pm. It's time for me to get rid of some hard to ship, hard to list items. > A preview can be seen at: > > http://www.mermac.com/iron.html > > It is by no means a complete list. > I hope to see some newsgroup members in attendance. Stop by early for coffee > and doughnuts. > > Regards, > > Dave Ficken > Meridian Machinery > http://www.mermac.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: TURCITE - suitable adhesive?? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 28 Oct 1999 14:21:01 GMT -------- The price of Shamban's adhesive is a killer if , like most of us, you are only in need of a small amount. Here is one way to get around it...Contact your local or regional Shamban rep, explain the situation and ask if he can help. He may be able to put you in contact with one of their larger users..who may be willing to let you have enough for your needs from their "leftovers" Once opened the cans have a limited shelf life..or they may just open a fresh pack for each application, simply as a quality control measure. You have to find and talk to the right people. Alternatively you can do without their adhesive! My first aplication was on the planer I built and using 1/16" material with a combination of thin film double sided tape AND mechanical "entrapment" I had a very serviceable end result. On most applications the Turcite is fastened to the "Saddle" rather than the "bed ways" so it is usually easy to arrange some form of mechanical retention..anything that stops the "meat" sliding sideways out of the "sandwich" Finally, you may try chatting with your local Loctite Rep. While it may be true, that at one time, the adhesive had to be specially formulated by Shamban..because nothing else was available, I doubt that is true now and several grades of adhesives, now available, will do the job. 8^) teenut Tony Jeffree wrote: > > Anyone suggest a suitable epoxy adhesive for Turcite? Busak & Shamban > (who make the stuff) sell their own special grade of epoxy - but > apparently only in 1 pint quantities (here in the UK at least) & > charge 50 pounds a pint (75 bucks) for it. More than three times what > they are quoting me for a metre of Turcite strip. > > More expensive than good whisky...and not NEARLY as tasty... > > As a pint is probably a hundred times the quantity that I will > actually need, this seems an expensive waste. Anyone used regular > epoxy adhesives with any success? Which ones? > > Thanks in advance... > > Regards, > Tony > > Website: http://www.jeffree.u-net.com/ > When replying, delete "X." from the Email address to remove anti-SPAM measures. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: TURCITE - suitable adhesive?? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 28 Oct 1999 19:33:13 GMT -------- I wouldn't rely on it for material less than 1/16" thick and I have no experience of anything as thick as 3/16". Bearing in mind the tendency for these type materials to cold extrude, I would be wary of it..and of using screws through it. Knowing my relationship with Murphy (He has it in for me as I have challenged and cheated him far too many times!!)..I would Expect the screwws to come in contact with the ways eventually!! What I HAVE done is to use the aformentioned double sided tape simply as a means to hold the turcite in place during fitting and assembly. Eventually cutting oil etc will degrade it to zero effectiveness. Howerver, by adding retainer lips, just like and incorporatin wiper seals, the turcite is trapped with no place to go. Before Turcite, the only teflon alternative was pure white teflon. Many machine tools..especially NC and CNC HAD to use teflon to overcome the bugaboo of stick/slip. In those cases, with glues simply not available, the manufacturers used mechanical means of retention..the main one being as I detailed above..with entirely satisfactory results. Turcite and other teflon based slideway materials offer several advantages, some of which may not, immediately obvious: Reduced friction and massively reduced stick/slip differentials (The ratio between static or "stuck" frictional coefficient and dynamic or "slip" coefficient, are probably its best known and understood advantages. Others include; Reduced sensitivity to lubrication (or rather, lack of it). Reduction of wear on slideways..teflon tends to simply "swallow" abrasive contaminate particles rather than simply holding the at the surface to act like a lap. Reduction of chatter..teflon tends to act as a damper. To me, however, one other feature is, in itself, worth all the effort. This is what I call "Zero Clearance slideways Hard metalic slideways always need a minimal clearance to opperate..without a thou or two of carefully adjusted clearance, they become "clamps" rather than slides. Any wear, taper or other inaccuracy of the sliding surfaces makes this controlled clearance difficult or impossible to set and maintain. With resiliant, low friction teflon lined slides the need for clearance is ZERO..indeed I set up slides, whenever possible with NEGATIVE clearance..a clamp arrangement even!! The low friction material makes a lousy clamp though..so the result is a slide without ANT wobble or shake, and which can accommodate quite large degrees of wear or taper. The difference this makes to the "Feel" of the machine and the accuracy and improved surface finish obtained, have to be experienced to be truly appreciated. As a bonus, given adequate power, the depth of cut and feed rates can often be dramatically increased..Chatter is a thing of the past! 8^) teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article <38185CFB.6C92820E@home.com>, > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > Alternatively you can do without their adhesive! My first > >aplication was on the planer I built and using 1/16" material with a > > > combination of thin film double sided tape AND mechanical "entrapment" > >I had a very serviceable end result. > > Hmm. I could see milling a pocket under the saddle ways and making > the wear strips a nice snug fit into them - how about also using > screws in from above, if the material were thick enough - say, over > 3/16 or so? > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Home Brew Wanted for Degreaser & Paintstripper From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 28 Oct 1999 19:50:32 GMT -------- Well, Obviously Don went on a longer "Washing Technology" course than I did..and paid a lot more attention!! I was trying to help people to a BASIC understanding of the processes and components involved..on a KISS basis, this being RCM not RCAdvanced Chemistry. Don filled in, filled out and filled up the details for those of a more, shall we say, "Retentive" nature. What a team 8^) tenut Don Wilkins wrote: > > On Thu, 28 Oct 1999 06:36:06 GMT, Robert Bastow > wrote: > > >Don Wilkins wrote: > >> > >> On Wed, 27 Oct 1999 11:44:42 GMT, Robert Bastow > >> wrote: > >> > >> >Hot, Soapy water!! > >> > > >> >No I am not kidding. In this day and age of always seeking an easy out we often > >> >forget the best ways are often the simpest. > >> > > >> >It takes a heck of powerful (lethal) solvent to do what simple, hot > >> >soapy/alkaline water can do. > >> > >> I agree but perhaps not alkaline water for aluminum. It depends on how > >> alkaline and how long. > >> > >> My first thought was a power washer with a mild detergent. > >> > >> Second thought was a basket and a trip to the car wash. Low overhead, > >> no inventory. > > > >Perhaps a bit better definition of soap and alkali and their relative roles in > >the washing process... > > > >"detergents" are commonly mixtures of a soap and an alkali..brighteners, > >deodorizers scents etc are also added for various purposes..not really relevant > >here > > "detergents" generally are considered to be synthetic compounds and I > wouldn't expect them to contain soap. > > > >Alkali..(Not Lye..but usually a sesquicarbonate or similar soda compound..even > >bi-carbonate which I use) This is what actually does the cleaning..by breaking > >down the grease that holds soil particles on or in the object or fabric thus > >allowing them to be flushed or more easily abraded away. > > > >Soap, in and of itself has no "Cleaning Power" (surprised me too!) > > I have a problem with that. > > Soap is usually made by the hydrolysis of fat with either sodium or > potassium hydroxide. > > (RCOO)3C3H5 + 3 NaOH ---> 3RCOONa (soap) + C3H5(OH)3 (glycerine) > > Soap then consists of mixtures of compounds such as sodium stearate, > C17H35COONa, sodium palmitate, C15H31COONa, sodium oleate, > C17H33COONa as well as the sodium salts of other fatty acids. > > Soap functions as a cleaning agent by lowering the surface tension of > water and as an emulsifying agent to disperse oil and grease. A > disadvantage is the fact that heavy metal (metal content) ions form > greasy precipitates with those fatty acids. > > Before the days of the synthetic detergents many a housewife used soap > to clean and some in fact made their own using the ashes from the wood > stove and fat from the unfortunate (formally) livestock. Most or all > complained about the deposits left on the laundry but it did remove > the grease. The greasy deposits (insoluble heavy metal fatty acid > salts) were going to appear all the time because in most cases water > softeners were not in the home so the water usually contained enough > calcium (and probably iron) to cause the problem. > > The harder the water the more the housewife bitched about the problem > until someone started making synthetic detergents. > > A synthetic detergent on the other hand has the carboxylic acid > replaced with a sulfonic acid. The heavy metal salts of the sulfonic > acids are much more soluble. > > 2C17H35COONa + Ca++ (e.g.) ---> (C17H35COO)2Ca (insoluble) > soap > > 2C17H35OSO3Na + Ca++ (e.g.) ---> (C17H35OSO3)2Ca (soluble) > synthetic detergent > > > >Its main purpose is to hold soil particles in suspension and prevent the > >redeposition of dirt on the objects being washed and as a "wetting" > >agent..allowing the water and other cleaning agents to get in closer contact > >with the soil. > > Yes this is the way they work but soap does this the same way as the > synthetics. Soaps run into cleaning problems when the water is not > "soft". Synthetic detergents work OK in "hard" water. > > > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: WHY are shapers dead, take two From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 28 Oct 1999 19:59:39 GMT -------- Jacob Henteleff wrote: > > Why are shapers dead? Let me count the whys. > I would take issue with only one of Jacob's "Whys" and that is that the shaper can do FAR more than just generate flat surfaces. In SKILLED hands it is one of the most versatile machine tools around..still it. Which brings us to another of the major reasons they have become obscelescent in industry: A dearth of tradesmen with the SKILLS to use them as thay are capable of being used. Nobody is teaching anyone these basic skills anymore. Teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Favorite Graffiti From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 28 Oct 1999 20:03:11 GMT -------- A rural sideroad off SH400 just north of Atlanta is officially named and labelled "Jot-em-down Road" I often wonder, as I pass it, where THAT name came from! 8^) teenut PLAlbrecht wrote: > > There's a sign near the University of Chicago that says "Heavy Pedestrian > Traffic." > > There's a rural road near Lost Hills, CA called "Brown Material Road." Have a > picture of self and a car magazine photographer, done with his camera's self > timer, standing in front of the street sign examining the bottoms of our shoes. > > Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Safety question: Wearing gloves From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 28 Oct 1999 21:14:27 GMT -------- Jack Erbes wrote: > (Snip)...a pretty convincing (on the face of it) argument that fingerless gloves are safer around (Rotating, reciprocating..ad flavor of day) machinery, and that if you get close enough to get caught you are too close anyway. Y'know, in the face of all these high powered arguments and pleas for "special exceptions that therefore prove teenut is full of S**t"...from so many people with so much experience and who would appear to be living ten digited proof that Murphy can be foiled indefinitely..maybe I should just back off, say OK you win, I was wrong.. Except for the fact that I am not in the habit of lying..and, as I have said before.."any lie that goes unchallenged..becomes the truth!!" What Jack is omitting to mention (Maybe because he doesn't know or maybe because it might weaken his position) is that machine tools have the ability to "Reach out and Touch someone" Two examples: The only time I ever got wrapped around a spindle was on a large drill press. Earlier in the day I had badly burned the palm of my hand on a hot chuck. After a soak in Boracic and an aspirin, I was sent back to the shop with my hand and the base of my fingers swathed with WOW (White Open Woven Bandage) A couple of hours later I was treated to a grandstand view in almost suspended animation/slow motion, Todd AO cinematography, as a foot long "propeller" of spinning swarf from a 1" diameter drill, went on a search and destroy mission across the drill table to where I was holding the end of a long bar, (against a dead stop of course) in my bandaged left hand. I watched in frozen horror as the blind "snake" of steel, sought out and captured the only loose thread on my bandage and started to wind it in towards the drill bit. At first it was just the one thread, then it was joined by others and, increasingly, more and more...all in seemingly dreadful slow motion. (Though that gave time for my life to flash before my eyes the whole thing happened in a split second, and far too fast even for my 17 year old reactions to trigger a response) Before I had chance to pull clear the thin line of threads turned into a rope that viscously pulled my hand into and around the drill bit and spindle. (This was a geared head 2" capacity Herbert # spindle gang drill with a 5 HP motor, and it WASN'T fitted with an "Ouch" switch!! Fortunately, just as my wrist and forearm broke in three places, and the drill started to nibble at my coverall sleeve, the bandage also broke, and I was thrown clear! Had it not done so the next couple of times around that spindle may well have torn my arm off, or as often happens, crushed my ribcage lungs,and heart, and killed me!! Another accident I personally witnessed, in real time slow motion, was when a Plater's Mate was helping to feed a large steel plate, standing on its long edge into some massive steel vertical bending rolls. The man was wearing mailed palm gloves..a reasonable protection against the razor sharp, sheared edges of the 1" thick plates being fed. Obviously a safe operation too..this particular guy had done this every day for more than twenty years, and of course he was careful to keep his hands two to three feet away from the rollers and the added protection af a massive welded steel mesh safety guard. Given the feed rate of the rolls was only a few inches a minute this was a "safe" operation. Well on this particular day, Murphy must have been bored and decided it was "time to play". As the plate was fed in a razor sharp, needle pointed shear "spike" (Where the shears took a double cut) about three inches long, lying close enough to the edge to escape notice, caught the wrist band of the man's glove. As I watched from thirty feet away, and in the time it took me to react, and cross the intervening distance, the plate pulled him in THROUGH the guard and pull his hand his arm AND the crumpled remains of the guard and it's Angle iron frame inexorably into the zero gap between the roll and the plate. I reached him and punched the "Big Red One" as his shoulder and chest started to crunch and collapse. During all this time he didn't utter a sound and is mate, around the other side of the plate was totally unaware of any problem until he came around to see why the machine had stopped! As I hit the stop I grabbed him to prevent him from falling as he lost conciousness. My Job, for the next 40 minutes, was to hold him upright as the millwrights tore the machine apart to free him. For twenty of those minutes I listened to the crackling, gurgling of his slowing breathing, in and out of his half crushed chest. For the remaining twenty minutes I gently cradled a dead man..to stop his face from getting all dirty!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: TURCITE - suitable adhesive?? From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 01:19:13 GMT -------- EUREKA!!!! (Or rather Ted did!!) That certainly would answer any problems and applications I have or am likely to run into. Thanks Ted, teenut Ted Edwards wrote: > BTW, adhesive backed Teflon tape is available in various widths and > thickness. The bond isn't as good as epoxy but for some applications is > adequate. > > Ted ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Allowed Amperes in a Conductor Contest.. From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 01:29:26 GMT -------- Chuck Harris wrote: > Gee Robert, everyone knows us 'mericans are xenophobes, and as such > don't like or believe the rest of the world exists (or matters). > Probably not too far wrong in that assumption! Becoming a bit xenophobic myself...I do have a problem with the 'merican "pint" being 4 oz short of a "Real" pint though. It cuts it down from three swallows to two, and when I have a real thirst on me I need two, full time, barkeeps to keep up with me!! 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Test only - Uh, oh! From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 02:57:22 GMT -------- I am already starting to hear STRANGE voices Jim! 8^) teenut Jim Stewart wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > My "ISP Encouragement/incentive program" will shortly be available on CD-Rom! > > > > 8^) > > > > teenut > > > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > > > Stand down invasion forces > > > > > > 8^) > > > > > > teenut > > > > > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > > > > > Can't get much faster than this!! > > > > > > > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Testing response/turnaround time > > > > > > > > > > teenut > > Uhh, Robert, I hate to be the one to break it to you, but you've started > talking to yourself. > > Only a matter of time before you start arguing with yourself. > > You know what happens then. Flames! Character assasination! Fun for > the spectators! > > -js > > -- > > http://www.strappe.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Safety question: Wearing gloves From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 03:15:40 GMT -------- I apologize if I spoiled anybody's supper..But with the "Does'nt apply to me..I'm a special case" crowd going on and on like Ever Ready Bunnies I thought maybe it was time to introduce some realities the the discussion. 8^( Teenut eberlein wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > .. > > For the remaining twenty minutes I gently cradled a dead man..to stop his face > > from getting all dirty!! > > > > teenut > > Jes*s H. Chr**t, Bastow! You made your point, alright! I'm not going to wear > gloves again, around machinery or even when shoveling snow and it's 20 below. > > M. Eberlein 10/28/99 ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Scratch and dig samples From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 04:01:10 GMT -------- First time for everything!! What are these used for? http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=189971830 All I can think of is that they are either: Quality control acceptable blemish samples...or Surface coating Hardness/toughness comparator samples. I know one thing for sure..SOMEBODY on this list knows!!! 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: TURCITE - suitable adhesive?? From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 04:44:44 GMT -------- Never have used teflon loaded delrin, "Pure" teflon will cold flow more readilly than turcite, which is formulated to minimise it. On the applications where I used pure teflon I made sure the surface areas under load were as generous as possible and never had any problem. I guess there must always be a little cold flow..but it should be easy to nip up the retaining clips to compensate. very few applications would that affect machine geometry significantly..if it does the machine aint designed right!! (One of the principles of good machine tool design practice is the a machine should first wear "More Accurate" befor it starts eventually deteriorate) teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > Have you used teflon-loaded delrin for any applications like this, > and do you worry about cold-flow of the teflon eventually causing > the saddle to 'sink?' > > Jim ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Latest Metal Project! From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 05:03:09 GMT -------- Congratulations! Just don't go bragging on too many "Finished Projects" around here..you will alienate half the readers!! ;^) The rear shelf is the best arrangement of (Far too many) I have tried, and is what I have now...All the QC blocks, wrenches along the back within easy reach. You might want to continue the theme and, as I have done, completely box in the back and rear side of the lathe to the wall. No more sweeping chips out of dark and awkward corners! Just make sure there is enough air flow to keep the motor cool. Soon after I installed mine I found it adviseable to build in a chuck guard, after a can of (What else?) WD40 was knocked off the shelf and onto the spinning chuck and from thence towards my head!! Missed me, and no harm done..But I came over "all wobbly" when I thought about an AXA tool block following the same path, especially now Murphy had "got his eye in" Now I keep heavy things over towards the tailstock end. Stay safe, 8^) teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In the hopes of starting a more appropriate thread (than the dreaded > YASQ one) I wish to report to the ng that I finished a project which > has been long in the works. > > A wooden one, though. > > But it was for the lathe! I hope this redeems it. I have always > been enamored of shops where the lathe has a tidy shelf behind it, > holding all the special wrenches and tools for that particular > machine. > > The top drawer of my tool cabinet has been the repository for all > the specialized tools, but I get tired of digging them all out from > the back. They always wind up in the back! > > So I went to Home Desperate and purchased some strange foreign material > (oak) and rendered it into a tidy shelf with appropriate slots > and holes for the tools, and a lip around the edge to keep odds'n'ends > from falling off. Tonight with great fanfare (Nora says "hmm. Nice" > it was attached to the brick behind the machine and the tools > installed. Very tidy. I like tidy. > > Regards - Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Oldie but goodie for someone?? From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 06:10:08 GMT -------- http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=190083289 Southbend 13" in MA FWIW teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: WHY are shapers dead, take two From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 06:53:18 GMT -------- Yeh Jim, I can see why you resent the way I worded it. My Apologies Let me rephrase it... Very few people want to learn the skills any more, very few Institutions are willing or equiped to teach the skills anymore, and even fewer companies are willing to train their own people any more. And I am just as unemployed as you are in that area! teenut Ex Advisory Board Member-Metalcutting Trades, Mohawk College, Hamilton Ontario, Ex Advisory Board Member: Hamilton Industrial Training and Apprenticeship Center. (DON'T get me started!!!) 8^( Jim Wright wrote: > > In article <3818AC5B.3791A5A7@home.com>, Robert Bastow > writes: > > > > >Which brings us to another of the major reasons they have become obscelescent > >in > >industry: > > > >A dearth of tradesmen with the SKILLS to use them as thay are capable of > >being > >used. Nobody is teaching anyone these basic skills anymore. > > > >Teenut > > I kinda resent that. As an Instructor in Machine Technology, I teach basic > skills at > Rento Vocational-Tecnical College. > > This Semester my class was cancelled because there were'nt enough students to > run the class. However, the classes in CNC were full. > > Seems that the demand is for button pushers and material loaders. Machinists > are gettin kinda hard to find because it takes time to learn the trade the > right way. > > Unemployed in Seattle - (Kinda) > > Jim Wright, Owner > Wright Edge Mfg > IUnstructor, Renton Vocattional-Technical College. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Shaper Ratchet From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 07:43:20 GMT -------- Maybe I have missed anearlier post..but I'm not absolutely sure I understand your Problem/Question. I am not familiar with the specifics of the Logan Shaper either..I do know you have a great little machine there. Am I to understand that the feed pawl is operating in one direction but not the other? Most small shapers work it very similar ways...On the feed screw is fitted a ratchet wheel in which are cut square topped "gear" teeth. There is a reciprocating carrier/housing, pivoted on the x feed shaft and driven by a pitman arm from the main layshaft of the machine. That housing carries the spring loaded ratchet "tooth" that engages the ratchet wheel ON THE RETURN STROKE OF THE RAM..and causes the feed screw to turn and feed the carrige along. The "tooth" is usually set off center of its housing..this is so it can only engage the wheel and turn it in the one desired direction. To reverse the direction of feed two things must be done.... First the plunger that carries the offset tooth must be REVERSED in its housing...many times this is accomplished by pulling up the spring loaded plunger, turning it 180 degrees, and dropping it back in place, Secondly the position of the moveable pivot block..at the crank end of the feed pitman arm, must be moved to the opposite side of the disc that it bolts to. This is done so that, having reversed direction of the carriage feed (Usually marked A and B or L and R) is arranged to still take place ON THE RETURN STROKE of the ram. The disc on thdrive end of the feed crank will be similarly marked A/B or L/R to help you get it right. So-o! The ratchet WILL only feed in one direction..unless and until you physically change its settings and geometry. Take a look at your LOGAN and see if this is the case..the cause of your "Problem" If this is not the case then something is BADLY worn or broken (I say badly worn because this simple mechanism is usually built like the proverbial "Brick Outhouse: and it takes a tremendous amount of wear to throw it out of whack!! Tell us what you find out..and, if need be..we can then take another, deeper look at it. 8^) teenut sunworshiper wrote: > > Is there a trick to fixing the pin or gear teeth > of this "logan" 7" shaper? Scott says it was before > they took over. Only thing I can think of is that the > pin tooth is off center, the gear teeth are rounded, or > the spring is not strong enough. I can get it to catch > one way and then not the other. > > -- > The Sun shines , people forget. > > Without the Sun none of us would be here. > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: lapping stuff flat From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 12:05:09 GMT -------- paulwomack@my-deja.com (Quite innocently i'm sure)wrote: > > A perrenial topic of concern amongst woodworking restoring > (non-flat) planes. > > references: > > 1) To make a truly flat surface you mutually refernce > 3 surfaces. This can be done either by marking-and-scraping, > or mutual lapping. AARRGHHH!! (Not your fault Paul..but I am not going to touch that subject with a tenfoot pole for at least six months!! However, plenty other people on this great NG are qualified to give you good answers..and they will) ;^) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Yet another sparkies question From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 12:11:55 GMT -------- Cliff Ray wrote: > > On the other hand the concept of testing Archimedes principle with a bath of > beer seems a good idea. > > Cheers, > A good drinking buddy of mine drowned in a vat of beer while working in a brewery. 8^( According to the Coroner's Report he got out three times for a pee before finally succumbing!! 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: One for the Foundry Buffs From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 12:22:16 GMT -------- http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=190330608 FWIW teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.crafts.woodworking Subject: Re: Safety question: Wearing gloves From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 19:18:22 GMT -------- Tony Jeffree wrote: I guess no-one foresaw the possibility that the operator > could become "attached" to the workpiece, and what the consequences > would be. With 20/20 hindsight, ...... Which is always 20/20 vision... > I guess the fundamental problem is understanding all the possible > sources of risk. With the nature of Murphy, that is never possible to > do. I guess that pretty well sums up the situation Tony. To whom it may concern....... I am never good at summarising a complex, emotion ridden, stuation in just a few words...But here goes: Machines of any kind, can seriously hurt or kill human beings. There are risks we take and accept when we decide to use them..just like crossing the road has risks. Very quickly we (collectively) learn what the major and commom risks are..that information is shared..so that no-one has to make them all. To ignore, well established, well documented, safety precautions one's self is tempting at times..by doing so we "should know" that we increase the chance of being hurt by a massive percentage. Should our actions result in a forseeable accident, we run the risk of being called "Stupid"..especially by our Peers, who "Know we know better"!! For any one of my "Peers"..who I "know to know better" to advocate the use of unsafe practices, to untrained, inexperienced,innocent and "Ignorant"** third parties, is, in my judgement, a criminal act of irresponsibility and I personally, will be merciless with my hounding of that person. This being a public forum and an "Open University" to which inexperienced people come for information..they have a right to be protected from those who would seek to harm them..by negligence, incompetance, self aggrandizement or malicious intent. I will never change that viewpoint. I will never apologize for that view point. I will never compromise that view point, for the sake of seemliness, popularity, politeness or political correctness. I know have raised a few hackles in the past few weeks..I know that people have written to me AND to third parties,on and off this list and on other news groups, with strong criticism of my stance and my "Rudeness" to certain people. I am writing this..not in defence or justification but simply to state my position and to inform anyone who cares to listen, that they are wasting their time trying to change or silence it. Robert Bastow teenut ** I use the term in the sense of people who don't know, simply because of a lack of previous exposure. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: lapping stuff flat From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 19:24:08 GMT -------- To REALLY see this "standing wave effect" one needs to try "Flat finishing" something on a high speed, high powered belt grinder. Using a fine cut belt on a "Flat" Platten will often produce very noticable ripples on the finished surface. The longer and harder you press down, the deeper and more pronounced they will become. teenut Randy O'Brian wrote: > > I believe the main reason that abrasive paper develops a convex surface on > the flat chisel is that any significant downward pressure on the chisel > causes the flexible paper to develop a microscopic convex "standing wave" at > the edges of the chisel, wearing them more rapidly. The wave is propagated > across the surface of the paper, continuosly generated at the leading edge > of the chisel as it is moved about. This phenomenon can be minimized by > reducing the pressure, but then the cutting rate falls off. If you want > flat, then a truly flat lapping plate, stone, or better yet, a surface > grinder is the way to go. > > Randy > > Mark McAniff wrote in message <381c8683.4246491@news.mindspring.com>... > >paulwomack@my-deja.com wrote: > > > >>3) Woodworkers common use a variant of (2) were normal > >>sheet abrasive is fixed to a "flat-enough" reference > >>surface, and the workpiece (a wood plane) rubbed over it. > >> > >>My query is: > >>When using (2) or (3) what prevents the workpiece > >>becoming CONVEX. It (obviously?) can't become concave. > > > >I've tried using sandpaper on glass (what is called the Scary Sharp > >System tm) in a variety of ways. I find that the abrasive that is worn > >off of the sand paper build enough to cause the edges to where faster > >creating a convex surface. It seems to be avoided by extreme diligence > >in emoving worn off abrasive. This slows things down to the point of > >ridiculaous IMHO. > > > >OTOH I've used a grooved lapping plate (#2) with less problems. For > >chisels I use a diamond stone with water, just have to keep the > >abraded metal from building rather than the abrasive grit. > > > >Mark McAniff ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Scratch and dig samples From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 29 Oct 1999 23:51:11 GMT -------- mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > Robert, I'm suprised you could not figure this out given the discussion > on optical flats recently! The term scratch and dig is peculiar, I > believe, to the optics community. Now how am I supposed to equate scratch and dig with, among all the subjects covered recently, one in particular, and the optics industry in peculia...sorry, particular? It could just as well relate to the powder coating thread or one of Mike Graham's pecadillo's. I had no reason to imagine it related to anything whatsoever on the NG,,being as how my question related to something I saw on Ebay. My original guess of a QC standard, particularly referring to surface coatings or surface finish wasn't so far wide of the mark under the circumstances I beg. However, if it will help you sleep I will give you this one.. Jim = 1 teenut = 0 ;^0 teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Now *that's* tool drool From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 30 Oct 1999 00:00:50 GMT -------- Absobloodylutely Jim!! And worth about ten times as much! Go to ** they have some pretty valuable machines there ;^) teenut **http = "he's taking the p**s" mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > For everyone's edification, I offer: > > http://www.angelfire.com/biz3/handengraving/hardinge.html > > which seems even nicer than that haebeggar machine. > > Enjoy! > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Source for Engraving Tools? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 30 Oct 1999 00:05:35 GMT -------- How fine a line do you want to cut Jim? I have a plenty of spares I will never use. Contact me off list and I'll send you one. teenut James Harvey wrote: > > I am involved in a project for a customer that requires some engraving to be > done on his parts. I don't as a rule do any sort of complex engraving, TExt > and Serial Numbers mostly. This requires some artwork to be vectorized and > then cut. I usually use a small center drill to cut my engraving, but the > smallest that I have is still to large for a clean line on this artwork. > Anyone have a source for small ( 3/8" Shank or smaller) fine engraving > cutters? > > J&L & MSC sell blanks, but I really don't want to spend any time grinding my > own . Easier and more cost effective to buy some. > > Thanks > > Jim Harvey ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: LATHE/MILL GROUP PURCHASE accepting new members. From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 30 Oct 1999 00:15:14 GMT -------- What is this..is halloween bringing out all the Spammer/spooks tonight?? teenut Cass wrote: > > x-no-archive: yes > > Well, to be honest, we always have but, we need fresh meat in order to > participate in a large group purchase of a LATHE/MILL/DRILL > combination at almost illegal price discounts. > > I have managed to get one company to commit to $495.00 for this > machine and that is down from almost $900.00. However, I want to have > more folks participate in this so that we will have a larger choice of > suppliers. > > We will not be making one cent on this purchase by any means! When > the time comes, you will send your money directly to the company and > that way, there will be no opportunity for any hanky-panky. > > We are a group of professionals who just want the tools to further > delve into our hobbies. > We are made up of engineers, physicists, professors, neon folk, > students, machinists, lay folk and other scientific minds. We know > from past experience that we can get things at prices that we would > not normally pay to have them from our buying power. > > It won't happen without you so, if you want a LATHE/MILL/DRILL > combination, you can join our LASERGROWERS list by sending an email > to: > buzz_ard2@bigfoot.com and put SUBSCRIBE in the subject and then, reply > to the email that you will be sent. After that, you will be a member > and should you want to get in on this deal with the rest of us, simply > send another email to the same address and put LATHE in the subject > line. > > I have to have a fair commitment so that I can negotiate prices or in > other words, dangle a large order in front of the supplier to gain a > fantastic deal. > > You can always unsubscribe after you get your machine, if you want > however, I hope you won't. > > By the way, you are free to ask any of our members about our past > purchases/discounts/integrity, etc. > > Thank you > > Cass ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: TURCITE - suitable adhesive?? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 30 Oct 1999 00:20:12 GMT -------- Ted Edwards wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > Thanks Ted, > > You're welcome. But what is TURCITE? > > Ted http://www.thomasregister.com/olc/busakshamban/bearing.htm teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Home Brew Wanted for Degreaser & Paintstripper From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 30 Oct 1999 02:50:11 GMT -------- Isn't that why they make Lysol in different colors? :^# (eyes like pissoles in the snow, mouth like a parrots cage! teenut Red Rider wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote in message <3818072E.E3D3AD2E@home.com>... > >Oh I don't know..you can get used to anything! > > > >Especially with the price of my favorite vintage wine getting up close to > 60 > >cents a bottle nowadays! > > > >8^) > > > >teenut > > If you want a high class cocktail, try mixing Listrene with Pepsi. > > Red Rider ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 7" South Bend Shaper Manual and Parts advice needed From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 30 Oct 1999 02:53:38 GMT -------- bulletbobb wrote: > Shapers may be fun to watch, but IMHO they are the most totally > useless machine tool ever invented. Any small table model mill will > do anything a shaper will, faster, and easier. The voice of inexperience...So much to learn..so little time! 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: New Search Engine 7688 From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 30 Oct 1999 03:04:19 GMT -------- Not much of a search engine!! I just did a search on .585 Nyati (a caliber of heavy game rifle ammunition) Metacrawler = 8 hits linkgrinder = 0 hits Plonk teenut vyiypz@forno.eg.net wrote: > > Brand new search engine. > http://www.linkgrinder.com > > Brand new search engine. > http://www.linkgrinder.com > lzhdolnyqxmjzfomqqoqtnmldpwqlxjbwykvdv ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Missing messages From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 30 Oct 1999 03:19:30 GMT -------- Flosi Guðmundsson wrote: > > On my mail reader (Netscape) most of the messages that I receive are written by > Robert Bastow. Large proportion of them is of the kind that I would not miss, Wow!! with you that makes two people (including my Mum) 8^) i I suspect that the problem might lie within the "View" category. I use > Netscape for historical reasons. In it "View" has among other options "Messages". I > check "All". If I check "Sort by thread" it means that I dont see but the first > message with each subject heading. Try changing to "Sort by date". It might help. I am using netscape too..I have the "messages - all" checked but have switched to sort by date. I never had any problems with netscape until I switched to a cable modem...which downloads porn mpegs like greased snot (Should I ever want to)..but totally misses the boat with a basic Newsgroup Service. This is progress?? For a few days after our little chat the server (@home.com) was vastly improved..now it is back to FUBAR and I have only seen one of my own posts in the last four days!! I have switched to "sort by date" as you suggest, and see if that helps. Thank you teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Missing messages From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 30 Oct 1999 03:22:46 GMT -------- Robert Bastow wrote: > For a few days after our little chat the server (@home.com) was vastly > improved..now it is back to FUBAR and I have only seen one of my own posts in > the last four days!! > > I have switched to "sort by date" as you suggest, and see if that helps. WOW!! Maybe it is early days..but the last four posts came back in seconds!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Scratch and dig samples From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 30 Oct 1999 05:18:44 GMT -------- mike II wrote: > > EVERYONE knows that Pecadillos can NOT survive Canadian winters. That's why, when I lived (relative term) in Cana-der I had to get a whole new, matching set of Pecadillos every spring! You have gotta admit, they're cute when they're pups though > mike (leeve my seester alone....) II Hmm...Was she the blonde?? teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: LATHE/MILL GROUP PURCHASE accepting new members. From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 30 Oct 1999 05:27:16 GMT -------- There's something narsty in the castle yard. We know what it is.. and we know who did it.. Methinks Cass, it is time to put up or shut up! Who ARE you? What are you selling? Why? And none of the coy stuff about subscribing to some undetermined list to find out all about this deal of a lifetime! Time to be up front or be gone!! teenut Cass wrote: > > This is not spam. If you don't want to get in on this then don't. We > don't make one penny. > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: does MSC sell to non commercial people? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 30 Oct 1999 05:29:33 GMT -------- Eastburn wrote: > > MSC sells to Medium companies, small companies, people and anyone with > a MC, VISA, AMEX..... ;-) > > They have a massive book/catalog. Two more years of MSC catalogues and I'll be able to finish my new barn!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: WHY are shapers dead, take two From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 30 Oct 1999 05:56:25 GMT -------- kenneth knaell wrote: > > I guess that is what my stockbroker means when he says we (USA) have made a > successful transition to a service based economy. Too bad ... > ken knaell > You are going to hate me for this Ken.. Several years ago, recognising the inevitable trends and sick of being, like all Engineering/Tech type PRODUCTIVE people..at the bottom of the food chain... I QUIT the Engineering business in disgust, and spent a couple of unpaid years, retraining, and re-establishing myself in a totally new career. It took five more years of blood, sweat and tears to get to the point where I could ease back..into virtual retirement in my mid-fifties...A few hours a week, working from my home office, and in the average month I make almost as much as I did in a year as a more "productive" member of society! My new career? A Licensed Stock Broker/Dealer, Investment Councillor, Estate Planning, and Financial Adviser! No it ain't fair! The wrong people are being rewarded for the wrong things nowadays. No..I don't think it makes sense either! But I finally reached the conclusion I couldn't beat them...So... 8^( 8^) (mixed feelings!!) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: __ B r a ___ made of ___ m e t a l ___ ??? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 30 Oct 1999 06:00:14 GMT -------- Er... Do YOU want to answer this one Mike? Sounds more like one of your pecadillos than mine! (I'm a leg man myself!) teenut evelyn937@go.com wrote: > > I want a Bra/chest cover made of metal. > > it would only cover my breast and ribs... > ending right above my bellybutton... > > what sort of metal would be best to use > for this... > > Does anyone know of any web sites > featuring these... > or any other resources to direct me to... > > private eMail welcome and KEPT private... > > ~Evelyn (937) 254-6649 > ~ USA - Ohio ~ > http://www.dominaohio.com/evelyn.html ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: __ B r a ___ made of ___ m e t a l ___ ??? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 30 Oct 1999 06:09:18 GMT -------- Pssst, Mawdeeb..If you check the url the lady posted..this is not SCA stuff she's talking about! 8^) teenut Mawdeeb wrote: > > Check with your local renassiance performance group or costume makers. > > > private eMail welcome and KEPT private... > > > > ~Evelyn (937) 254-6649 > > ~ USA - Ohio ~ > > http://www.dominaohio.com/evelyn.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Missing messages From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 30 Oct 1999 06:16:54 GMT -------- Fouled up beyond all redemption or some say F***ed up beyond all recognition. In Britain it was more usual to use the term SNAFU...Situation Normal..All Fouled Up. In modern military "Argot" it has been replaced by the snappier and far more evocative and all encompassing..."Cluster F**k" 8^) teenut kenneth knaell wrote: > > What does FUBAR mean? Heard it in "Saving Pvt. Ryan" and couldn't figure it > out. Maybe heard it back in 1942 also but definatey don't remember that. > ken 'acronym challanged' knaell > > Robert Bastow wrote in message <381A659B.82FA8744@home.com>... > > > > > >Robert Bastow wrote: > > > >> For a few days after our little chat the server (@home.com) was vastly > >> improved..now it is back to FUBAR and I have only seen one of my own > posts in > >> the last four days!! > >> > >> I have switched to "sort by date" as you suggest, and see if that helps. > > > >WOW!! Maybe it is early days..but the last four posts came back in > seconds!! > > > >teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Scratch and dig samples From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 30 Oct 1999 06:23:35 GMT -------- No Jim, if you check your Funk and Wagnall's you will see that Pecadillos are FAR more fun than Possums (It isn't a cross between a Possum and an Armadillo either!!) 8^) teenut Who just remembered.... Hey Mike! Wasn't she the Redhead with the wooden leg?..The Hockey Player? mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article <381A7227.9A60694B@technologist.com>, > mike II wrote: > > > > > EVERYONE knows that Pecadillos can NOT survive Canadian winters. > > ARe you sure you are not referring to possums? I actually saw > one of those buggers heading up my driveway towards the shop > last night! > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Favorite Graffiti From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 30 Oct 1999 06:27:56 GMT -------- "No act of kindness..No matter how small, will go unpunished!" Theme song of RCM!! teenut PLAlbrecht wrote: > > >My favorite - at an intrsection from our local supermarket is a sign > >that says "no left turn" -- underneath is written "unstoned". > > A local shopping center in Huntington Beach, CA has a "sea bird" theme. Rusty > pelicans perched on pilings, etc. One exit has a sheet-metal bird scupture with > the words "No left tern." > > I ignore it regularly as it is not an official California road sign. > > Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Favorite Graffiti From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 30 Oct 1999 06:36:50 GMT -------- Favorite, "once in a lifetime" bumper sticker seen on the back of a Mk V Bentley.. "All my other cars are Rolls Royces" The owner, a client of mine, and just a regular working stiff..(but a lifelong bachelor) had collected and restored eight or ten vintage "Rollers" and the one Bentley...because he liked British Racing Green and "One simply couldn't DO that to a Roller!" 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Pyramid Furnaces From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 30 Oct 1999 07:07:51 GMT -------- I am assuming that these Kaowool lined furnaces are propane fired (you don't actually say so) A small furnace for cast iron melting is slowly working its way up my Round tuit list so, If you don't mind I would rather like to pick your brains. I have built a couple of forges using my own design of Blown, turbulent combustion "Swirl Burners" Fearsome things they are too!! Blower is 1/6 hp 220v 4" square squirrel cage, throttled WAY down. It will run anything from 3 psi to 60plus psi of propane through a straight 3/8" nozzle into a 4" swirl mix chamber, a 2" diameter x 8" long reverse swirl to a 2 1/2" diameter flared burner cone. 20lb of propane in 20 minute if I need it!! Sure as heck don't need it! not for forging anyway Do you use single or multiple burners? Atmospheric I assume? Bore sizes, jet sizes and pressure? Do you use the 2300 deg or 2600 deg Kaowool, and how long does it last? Have you tried IPC 100 (Ron Reil put me on to that) or even Satanite as a protective wash on the Kaowool. I have both but haven't got around to applying either of them. How big (Physically) is a # 10 crucible, how large a cavity does it need, (is there an optimum clearance,) and how thick is your Kaowool. Do you need to cover the furnace during the melt or would that create combustion problems? I am doing a bit of experimenting with liquid feed propane burners..no problems with icing tanks and you can really belt some fuel through them!! Have you come across anyone else working on these? Appreciate your help teenut Jim Kreter wrote: > > On Tue, 26 Oct 1999 02:16:11 GMT, "John A. Galea" > wrote: > > >10-25-99 > >Jim: > >I thank you very much for all your help. Today I had been quite bussy reading all > >the information and web sites. Lots of reading. Thank you again. > >John > > > > > >Jim Kreter wrote: > > > > My pleasure. A year ago I knew nothing about building crucible > funaces or pouring cast iron. With careful reading and a lot > of advice from real foundrymen I have been able to produce > acceptable castings in iron and aluminum. The first furnace was a > Kao-wool lined vertical propane tank (ala Reils miniforge design) with > a refractory bottom made out of cut-up kiln shelf. It will hold a #10 > crucible (about 25 lbs of cast iron). It is low tech and ugly but it > works. I am working on a scaled up version of the Gingery crucible > furnace using a 30 gal drum lined with Kao-wool. I had to redesign > the vertical lifting mechanism and now I am trying to figure out how > to best scale up the lid lifting mechanism. This furnace will hold a > two man crucible (# 20 ??). Having the ability to pour metal has > added a new dimension to this metal working madness. Items to be cast > are a ball/pulley turning set, D 1-4 backplates, lathe faceplates, a > tool post grinder and a machinests cube. I have already cast hand > wheels, pump impellers, tongs and a 10 inch bore steady rest. By far > the hardest part for me is to make accurate and sound molds/patterns. > Good luck. > > regards, > Jim > Riverside, CA ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Yet another sparkies question From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 30 Oct 1999 07:11:27 GMT -------- mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > If it is in a dark room, it hardly goes on at all - but if you > shine a flashlight on it (not too bright a light, so you can > still tell if it is on or not) then all of a sudden it will start > to illuminate most of the time. Maybe it just likes the company! Lights get lonely too y'know. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Favorite Graffiti From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 30 Oct 1999 07:26:43 GMT -------- I have FAR more class than that! I HATE bumper stickers, I will not wear printed tee shirts or buy "Designer" clothes from some idiot who thinks the label should go on the outside rather than the inside!! Anyone who understands anything about Human Behaviour knows that all the above , while appearing to be statements of individualism are in fact, quite the reverse and are prompted by the stronger instinct to "Belong" to the herd. You get to sniff a lot of butts in a herd! And if you ain't the leader, the view never changes! 8^) teenut Tony Jeffree wrote: > > On Sat, 30 Oct 1999 06:36:50 GMT, Robert Bastow > wrote: > > >Favorite, "once in a lifetime" bumper sticker seen on the back of a Mk V > >Bentley.. > > > >"All my other cars are Rolls Royces" > > > > ..As opposed to your own bumper sticker that says "My other Jag is an > XJS" of course.... > > ;-) > > Regards, > Tony > > Website: http://www.jeffree.u-net.com/ > When replying, delete "X." from the Email address to remove anti-SPAM measures. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: __ B r a ___ made of ___ m e t a l ___ ??? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 30 Oct 1999 07:53:51 GMT -------- Oh he certainly DOES have "other" interests I'm sure..but I'm not sure he means to tell you..Yet awhile anyway! Hi Evelyn, don't imagine we were trying to "dis" you earlier. Not the sort of technical question we get asked every day. However, if you ARE remotely serious about The Ultimate in stressed skin construction for your "prom outfit" you certainly have come to the right place. Their is a bunch of people here with enough, collective knowhow to build you a moon rocket if you need one. (Actually, several have already done so) Do you have any particular style in mind(Geometric..like Madonna's steel cones or more form flattering like the Goddess Diana's) Material choice will be dictated by weight and strength considerations, fit and finish I will leave up to the younger guys around here to discuss with you!! Some form of lining will be a practical requirement. Metal transmits heat and cold readily..The effect of going out in hot sunlight I will leave to your imagination. The effect of sudden cold I will, again leave to the imagination of our younger contributors!! Suffice it to say, if the headlamps come on suddenly inside a steel bodice...they ain't got no place to go!! Fastenings...Let your imagination rip (Down Mike..) Getting in and out of it should not be a chore and tho' maybe not the original intention, may have to be accomplished singlehandedly (If you get a headache or somesuch) Perhaps the above will give you a few things to think about (I know it will me!!) and help to gel your ideas on a design outline. "All things are possible," as they say in the engineering business "it just costs money" I am sure they have a similar saying in your business too! 8^) teenut evelyn937@go.com wrote: > > pete, > > do you mean to tell me that you are > ONLY about whatever work you do 9-5 and > have NO other interests ?? > > ~E > > On 30 Oct 1999 06:34:50 GMT, plalbrecht@aol.com (PLAlbrecht) wrote: > > >>Mawdeeb..If you check the url the lady posted..this is not SCA stuff she's > >>talking about! > > > >Well, you made me do it... I checked the site. It's an ad for a phone sex > >service. (Tells us it's expensive so it's only for wealthy, self-assured > >perv... uh, gentlemen.) > > > >So why would somebody who can't show themselves need the Valkyrie getup? Losing > >inspiration at the workplace maybe? > > > >Does this thing have to have a phone jack on it? (Don't go there, Robert...) > > > >Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: __ B r a ___ made of ___ m e t a l ___ ??? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 30 Oct 1999 17:42:32 GMT -------- evelyn937@go.com wrote: > > Hi Robert, > > It *felt* like a "dis".... but that's okay... Hey, My apologies once more... > as far as design I haven't decided... > I don't want the Madonna cone-type... > Good!! Then I can help! > I vision something that gives the impression > of liquid silver or silver SKIN.... ultra thin... > and as lightweight as possible... Then I think I have the perfect answer for you and one which should be relatively easy and inexpensive for you..if not to do yourself, then certainly to arrange and co-ordinate. Called "Electro-Forming" it is the same process used for "Bronzing" baby shoes, autumn leaves and the like. The final article can be flash chrome plated and look just like the guy in "Terminator 2" !! and can be as thin as a piece of bond paper. Heres what you need to do... First, call on the services of a CLOSE friend with artistic/sculptural abilities who is familiar with body casting techniques. because the first step is to make and EXACT mould of your ..Er..Torso. I would volunteer myself but...Ah well! The cast should be made of plaster of Paris, over an armature of reinforcing wire..your artist friend will know how to do that. Next, An exact copy of your torso is cast in plaster or laid up in the mould in fiberglass. This should encompass the full area of coverage required..and at this stage you can decide on the design elements of how far you want it to afford coverage in any given direction. Best to keep it to the front aspect and avoid any wrapping around the rear. (Though it does occur to me that a modicum of "wrap around" could make this thing entirely self supporting and supportive!! The finished object will have enough flexibility to be a "Clip On" fit to your rib cage. Ok, at this stage we have an exact replica of the "Bits" in question..down to the last freckle if your artist knows his/her stuff. It is on this master (Mistress??) copy that the final article will be made...but first you need to consider what, if any lining, will be required. Bearing in mind the desire to have as close a fit and external replica of "THE ORIGINAL" as possible, I am going to suggest a single layer of silk..Engineering wise it is great insulator for its thickness and it will feel GOOD!! We need to create a bit of space for this lining, inside the bodice and the way to do this, without loosing too much detail, is to dip the master in hot wax, lift it out and let it drain and cool. A thin, uniform layer of wax will be left on the master and the process can be repeated until a sufficient thickness is accumulated to accomodate the lining. Some small detail will be lost..but not the general shape, and the artist can recarve any lost detail of importance, right back into the wax coating. The Master is now ready for the final electro forming. Seek out a sympathetic Baby Shoe Bronzer!! the technique is simple and well known to any electroplater. There are indeed, companies that specialise in the electroforming process and you might find one in your local area. Try a search in the local yellow pages or Thomas directory (Online or at the library.) The technique is simple. The plater will first dust or dip the master in graphite powder..to make its surface a conductor. The master then becomes the anode (Or cathode? never can remember) in an electro plating bath that will first deposite a thin layer of pure copper which then can be built up with nickel to the required thickness. Because of the three dimensional "Free form" nature of the bodice, it will be self supporting and even a thin layer will be surprisingly srong and rigid. The finished nickel matrix can then be polished to a bright but soft, silver finish, or if you desire a harder, "harsher" brighter finish it can be chrome plated to look like a Cadillac bumper!! Other finishes and colors are possible too..a finish flash coat of copper, brass, bronze or silver can be left as bare metal or chemically treated to an amazing array of "Patina" colors. This master can be used over and over again, so you could have a whole wardrobe to suit your mood! > > it isn't for a prom or any specific date... > I just want it... Hey, that is as good a reason as anyone will ever ask for on THIS group! We are all a little Eccentric/Quixotic in nature, and "Because I CAN" is as good a reason as any of us need to go do something! > > Thanks for sharing ideas with me.. > > ~E > You are more than welcome..it got the old grey matter working..(in more directions than one 8^) Don't be afraid to ask further questions. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: does MSC sell to non commercial people? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 30 Oct 1999 17:47:05 GMT -------- I doubt a whole truckload would be adequate for that purpose..the penetration (with solids) is phenomenal. teenut Robert Swinney wrote: > > Teenut, > Or you could use them for bullet stops for those 0.585 Suckahotchies you > were looking for. > Bob Swinney > Robert Bastow wrote in message <381A834A.98519A9C@home.com>... > > > > > >Eastburn wrote: > >> > >> MSC sells to Medium companies, small companies, people and anyone with > >> a MC, VISA, AMEX..... ;-) > >> > >> They have a massive book/catalog. > > > >Two more years of MSC catalogues and I'll be able to finish my new barn!! > > > >teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Now *that's* tool drool From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 30 Oct 1999 18:12:05 GMT -------- I knew you'd miss it if I didn't put a smiley after it!! 8^) The url is a joke!! The Topkapi Museum in Istambul is a storehouse of fabulous jewels..The Topkapi Dagger was the subject of a Peter Ustinov movie many years ago. One whole large room is stacked floor to ceiling with tons of emeralds..rom tiny cut ones to fist sized uncut stones..(there is an armed guard at the door!!) The reference was towards the fact that anything can be dressed up, fitted and finished, jewel encrusted even to become a fabulous work of art. Along the way, somewhere there is a crossover line between useability and "display only" and the objects become "Objets" and properly belong in a museum. This is not a criticism of the machines seen on the earlier web site..they are fabulous and just beg to be used, as I am sure they are, by someone who truly appreciates their beauty! teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article <381A364C.33046C8D@home.com>, > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > > Go to > > I did - and there's nothing there - did you typo > the url somehow? > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: __ B r a ___ made of ___ m e t a l ___ ??? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 30 Oct 1999 18:19:30 GMT -------- mulligan@advinc.com wrote: BTW if you get involved with Mr. > B, then be sure to keep his pacemaker battery topped up > or he may conk off unexpectedly.... First rule of war..Never underestimate the enemy! Second rule of war...Never interrupt your enemy while he is making a mistake!! 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Manual for SB 7" Shaper (On Ebay From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 30 Oct 1999 19:09:05 GMT -------- IIRC someone was asking about one of these recently http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=190740076 FWIW teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: JB Weld ? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 31 Oct 1999 23:01:59 GMT -------- Usually known as "Sod's first law of adhesives" teenut John Kunkel wrote: > > gene takae wrote: > > > > Doe this stuff actually work like they claim. > > It's subject to the standard law of adhesives: "If you want it to stick, > it won't. If you don't want it to stick, it will". ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Safety question: Wearing gloves From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 01:43:08 GMT -------- > On 31 Oct 1999 19:22:34 -0500, yarvin@cs.yale.edu (Norman Yarvin) >>I, for one, will be discounting anything said by Robert Bastow > >on the subject of chemistry, You will miss out on some wonderful cocktail mixes!! >>a subject which he very visibly does not know Bear in mind, gentle readers..I pissed Mr Yarvin off a LONG time ago..I guess he has a memory with a length only equalled by the narrowness of his mind, the pettiness of his thinking and the vitriol of his ink. ;^) >>and does not want to. A very sweeping statement indeed..one that I doubt Mr Yarvin, on sober reflection, will want to try and justify! As Mr Yarvin is by claim a chemist..not a psychiatrist, I doubt that he is qualified to speculate on my innermost desires and long suppressed yearnings...Or that anyone will take any notice of him if he does. >>This does not mean disregarding the chemical > >recipes he gives; To my Knowledge the ony "Chemical Recipes" I have given are salt and vinegar mixes for rust removal and fish and chips! >>it only means taking with a grain of salt the chemical > >explanations he gives for why the recipes work. I don't recall ever trying to explain why it works so well in either case. I do know the balance of salt and vinegar can be critical..and the extra grain (avoirdupois??) of salt you advocate taking, will absolutely ruin the flavor of fish and chips. But then of course..you are a Chemist and not expected to be an expert on fish and chips!! I do hope the unwedging operation is a success! 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Precision vise on Ebay From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 03:10:20 GMT -------- I just took delivery of one of these Cuter vises..very nice!! Bigger than it looks..just the right size for my Deckel and as accurate as I can measure. It appears to be machined from solid steel, hardened and ground all over and comes with certificate of inspection. Just a satisfied customer..FWIW http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=188111295 teenut PS Anyone want to buy a brand-new-in-the-box 6" kurt clone w/swivel base. Still in cosmoline! Nothing wrong..I just bought it and it is WAY too big for my Deckel!! OOPS! I will give a good deal on it..but be warned, shipping will be expensive x country..I am in Atlanta. Contact me direct.. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Model Engineering Mailing List From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 05:40:20 GMT -------- Modeleng-list...Very similar to this NG, politer, (Even Me!!) Model engineering based but wide ranging over any and all engineering/machining/metal subjects. Often off track..not many serioussly object to that..it fills in the quiet periods. DO NOT EVER MENTION Weetabix or Foucaults pendulum!! email to No subject required body of message: subscribe modeleng-list Follow instructions on the email you receive. teenut Ed Phelps wrote: > > This sounds interesting. Can someone tell me about it? > > Ed ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Acronyms From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 05:45:28 GMT -------- PLAlbrecht wrote: > I still think these jet and rocket and thermonuclear-device-powered things > aren't cars, they're very bad airplanes doing high-speed taxi tests. The > problems aren't insignificant nor their achievements trivial, but they're not > cars. >Cars drive through the wheels... I am with you on that Pete!! I'm not sure that the rules prevent an SR71 from doing a one kilometer "Tip and run" in each direction. Land speed maybe...cars it ain't anymore!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Screwdrivers changing state? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 08:52:11 GMT -------- That's reassuring Tony. I thought it was just me! teenut Tony Jeffree wrote: > I've noticed a related phenomenon recently - that objects become > temporarily invisible if you are holding them in your hand. Spent > several minutes last night searcing for an Allen key that I had been > holding all the time... ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: New & Used Machinery Supermarket - 15 Acres of Machinery From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 18:12:01 GMT -------- Hey Paul, Don't be so fast to "Down" (Under?) them..maybe they do free delivery to the US and Europe!! teenut Paul Koning wrote: > > Bill Meredith wrote: > > > > Bill's Machinery has over 15 acres of New and Used Machinery. > > If we don't have it - We'll find it! > > Come to http://www.bmms.com.au and check out our online database of stock. > > I think posting a message like this is fine. > > But also spamming off a copy by email is not, especially > when you send it to people at the other end of the globe. > > paul ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: TURCITE - suitable adhesive?? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 18:22:14 GMT -------- Jack is correct, the table should be a smidgin higher at the front than the back..it takes account of weight and cutting loads plus eventual wear. Sound machine tool design principal..the machine should get MORE accurate as it wears...before it starts to deteriorate. I would be tempted to leave the full 0.001" in there..ast least until the machine has had time to bed in. Turcice will bed a bit further than cast ron slides will..even they will do so to some small degree. Should you feel the urge..Turcite is scraped with regular scraping tools..same shapes and angles etc., but they do need to be RAZOR sharp or you will just float over the surface as the turcite "dodges" out of the way. If you know how to sharpen and use a cabinet maker's scraper, you will find that better for evenly reducing large areas before final spot scraping. teenut Jack Erbes wrote: > > Dave and Sue Erickson wrote: > > > > The reason for the post is that there is a third problem; the > > table is about .001" too high in the front. My question: if > > I plan on adding turcite, should I correct the .001" alignment > > problem before or after adding the turcite? If after, will I > > be able to scrape it using the same tools and techniques that > > are used on cast iron, or should the scrapers be sharpened > > differently, or different tools used? > > Bridgeport manuals say that the front of the table should be .0005 > higher than the back. They don't explain why, but I assume it allows > for settling that occurs under load. Maybe your Hardinge needs > something there for the same reason. > > -- > Jack in Sonoma, CA, USA (jack@vom.com) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Safety question: Wearing gloves From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 18:39:58 GMT -------- Some people just never get it! I have said what I have to say and don't intend to say anything else..Teenuts first law of retained sanity.."Never argue with a made up mind!" Most thinking people have already decided what point I have tried to make and will recognises Gary's "Wriggling Ramblings" for exactly what they are...An otherwise inteligent man that just can't bear not to have at least one last word that is "Right" in his mind.and who simply doesn't know when to quit defending the indefensible. I don't doubt, for one moment, that whatever personal experiences I had come up with, someone, suffering from a surfeit of "Indignant and righteous 20/20 wisdom" would come up with a detailed scenario of "ah buts" and "what ifs" and "if onlys" that would prove me an outright liar! There is just one point that I will not leave unchallenged.... Gary Coffman wrote: What I > protest against is this macho man image of always letting our bare skin hang > out when working in potentially hazardous situations that Robert seems to be > trying to project. That is an out and out figment of your imagination and a totally unjustified and uncalled for aspersion! I think I deserve an apology for it! Or would it be too "Un-Macho" to do that! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: T&C Grinder? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 20:56:51 GMT -------- Does anyone have a handle on price and availability of the Quorn castings? Last I heard they were available in the US via a supplier in OZ. I have sold the Christen...Saving it from a "conversion worse than death"!! Now I have decided to bite the bullet and build me a Quorn!! teenut ppierce wrote: > > Michael P. Henry wrote: > > > > You might want to take a look at Lautard's site - www.lautard.com > > > > He has plans for his "Tinker" T&C grinder for sale at one of the links > > (http://lautard.com/tinker-s.htm). > > > > Looks interesting and a lot easier than the Quorn......... > > I'll say a few things about the Quorn. It is a real education. > Sort of a hole to pour $$ into also. See Ron Chernich's artiocle > on MWN. > > The back half of The Book (from Tee) is devoted the use for sharpening. > After the third reading I sort of have an idea of what is going on. > > > > -- > Paul in AJ AZ, NRA Endowment Member MSC stockholder (150 shares) > Checkout http://www.dejanews.com > also("Dropbox")http://www.metalworking.com > Checkout (MWN)the Metal Web News at: http://www.mindspring.com/~wgray1/ > Checkout the FAQ at: http://w3.uwyo.edu/~metal ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Looking for a 1 3/16-16 tap From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 21:09:04 GMT -------- I have a spare 1.188" x 18tpi for quite a bit less than that..if it will fit the bill. Let me know teenut mledtje@my-deja.com wrote: > > In article <381cc537.5228967@nntp.amplex.net>, > vwbugs@amplex.net (Rick) wrote: > > Hello, > > I'm looking for a 1 3/16-16 tap. 4 flute machine tap prefered. > > Thanks > > Rick > > > MSC lists that size in the Special Taps section. Plug, Taper or Bottom > tap $45.31 ea. > > -- > Mike > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Safety question: Wearing gloves From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 01 Nov 1999 21:14:55 GMT -------- We! We??? You got a frog in your pocket Jim? Who invited you? It's weird enough with just me in here! 8^) teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > Uh oh. I think we're entering a very *weird* zone here. > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Favorite Graffiti From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 01:10:54 GMT -------- Ah Well..Reading them is a whole lot removed from displaying them. One of my favorites..from way back in the days of "Custom Vans" was the mobile boudoire carryiing the ubiquitous.."Virgins wanted..Appply within..No Previous experience required" Standard stuff..but along side it was a little sticker saying.."Don't Laugh..Your daughter may be Next!!" Now, Having admitted to enjoying reading them..I still won't display one..Mainly because I like to keep my options open and my commitments closed! But What would or DO you say on YOUR Bumpersticker? ("Don't blame me..I voted for Dewey" has no validity in the fast moving world of stickerism) Teenut P'rfesser wrote: > > Scorning increased entropy, Robert Bastow wrote: > > >I have FAR more class than that! > > >I HATE bumper stickers > > Welllll... > ...for me it depends on the bumper sticker. Some are pretty clever, > some say what needs to be said. I used to have one with a picture of > a phone covered with circle/slash. It said "Hang up and drive!" > > P'rfesser > ...one pet peeve is people who don't drive when they drive... ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Favorite Graffiti From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 01:17:53 GMT -------- In all seriousness, so would I..and I would leave it switched on permenantly for "Prophylactic" purposes. But what would be required to do that..can't be much! I know in the days when I lived and died on a cell phone it was difficult to AVOID blackouts! I would pay SERIOUS money for a little black box that would put the fritz on any cell phone I pointed it at. It would be worth it just to watch the varying reactions of people for whom life, as they know it, has just ceased!! C'mon Sparkies..we need you! 8^) teenut PLAlbrecht wrote: > > > It said "Hang up and drive!" > > > >P'rfesser > >...one pet peeve is people who don't drive when they drive... > > > > > > I'll say it again, I'd pay good money for a device that will put all cell > phones within about a 100 yard circle of the air. > > Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: T&C Grinder? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 01:30:00 GMT -------- I tried to download/open the article on the dividing head but it was written in @#@#$%^&*()!@#$%^&*()!@#$%^&*() I have tried several times to contact Wise owl and suubscribe to their VASTLY overpriced publications..but nobody ever emailed or called me back. Are they in the present century now or still following the Nexus lead of being FAR too busy to actually communicate with customers!! teenut Tony Jeffree wrote: > > On Mon, 01 Nov 1999 20:56:51 GMT, Robert Bastow > wrote: > > >Does anyone have a handle on price and availability of the Quorn castings? Last > >I heard they were available in the US via a supplier in OZ. > > > > Price? No idea. But worth getting hold of a copy of the current Model > Engineers' Workshop - issue 62 (Wise Owl distributes in the 'states) - > there is the first part of a 2-part article entitled "Compendium of > the Quorn" which combines constructional experiences with lots of > useful refs to the collected wisdom on the machine. Second part to > come in Issue 63. (Coincidentally the same two issues carry the > dividing head design that appears on my website...) > > The article lists a UK supplier: > > Model Engineering Services, Pipworth Farm, Pipworth Lane, Eckington, > Sheffield S21 4EY > Tel 01246 433218. > > I guess they may well be able to point you at a US supplier if the > freighting is too frighting... > > Regards, > Tony > > Website: http://www.jeffree.u-net.com/ > When replying, delete "X." from the Email address to remove anti-SPAM measures. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: T&C Grinder? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 01:33:32 GMT -------- Just what I needed Tom, I will email them for a quote on shipping..with the US/OZ $ exchange rate, those look like very attactive prices. I just airmailed a book from OZ and it was faster and cheaper than from Europe! Thanks, Teenut Tom Csibor wrote: > > Robert, > > You may wish to check this out. Because of the exchange rates, this may be a > feasible venture. I was thinking of going this route until I found a used T > & C grinder. > > http://www.hobbymechanics.com.au/products_page.htm > > Tom Csibor. > > -- > Robert Bastow wrote in message <381DFE8B.429EE26E@home.com>... > >Does anyone have a handle on price and availability of the Quorn castings? > Last > >I heard they were available in the US via a supplier in OZ. > > > >I have sold the Christen...Saving it from a "conversion worse than death"!! > Now > >I have decided to bite the bullet and build me a Quorn!! > > > >teenut > > > >ppierce wrote: > >> > >> Michael P. Henry wrote: > >> > > >> > You might want to take a look at Lautard's site - www.lautard.com > >> > > >> > He has plans for his "Tinker" T&C grinder for sale at one of the links > >> > (http://lautard.com/tinker-s.htm). > >> > > >> > Looks interesting and a lot easier than the Quorn......... > >> > >> I'll say a few things about the Quorn. It is a real education. > >> Sort of a hole to pour $$ into also. See Ron Chernich's artiocle > >> on MWN. > >> > >> The back half of The Book (from Tee) is devoted the use for sharpening. > >> After the third reading I sort of have an idea of what is going on. > >> > >> > >> > >> -- > >> Paul in AJ AZ, NRA Endowment Member MSC stockholder (150 shares) > >> Checkout http://www.dejanews.com > >> also("Dropbox")http://www.metalworking.com > >> Checkout (MWN)the Metal Web News at: http://www.mindspring.com/~wgray1/ > >> Checkout the FAQ at: http://w3.uwyo.edu/~metal ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: T&C Grinder? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 01:37:50 GMT -------- Those are pretty, pretty impressive, castings Einar! I am ashamed that I have put off my Quorn for best part of twenty five years...even with "Boughten" castings! teenut Einar Sjaavik wrote: > > MichaelHenry@msn.com (Michael P. Henry) wrote in > <7viv43$17ds@enews2.newsguy.com>: > > >You might want to take a look at Lautard's site - www.lautard.com > > And: > http://home.eunet.no/~einar/casting/ > > That project is not very highly prioritized now, > as I got a Clarkson for a lick in the face at an auction. > > After two weeks it looks as new. > > But I will finish it (I think). > > If you tinker with aluminum castings, my page may also > be of interest. Then please send me an email. > > Regards > Einar Sjaavik ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Favorite Graffiti From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 07:09:51 GMT -------- I know, personally only two people that REALLY need to have an active cell phone or beeper close by at all times.. One REALLY is a Cardiologist/Heart Surgeon. The other REALLY is a Drug Dealer!! As for the rest.....? teenut PLAlbrecht wrote: > > >You know, it's > >probably not legal either. > > No kidding. Neither is driving like a moron. I won't tell the FCC if you won't. > > BTW I hear that in Europe, where it's also illegal to jam cell phones, many > shopkeepers are so tired of self-important yuppie scum walking around SHOUTING > THEIR HALF OF A CONVERSATION INTO THE FONEBONE that they've installed hidden > jammers. > > Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: TURCITE - suitable adhesive?? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 07:20:44 GMT -------- Your plan sounds fine, I still suggest letting it bed in a little befor taking of that last five tenths...it is a lot harder to put it back on! Sandpaper? No! A) I don't think it would cut the turcite...it is "harder" than straight teflon but abrasives work best on friable materials. B) Every piece of abrasive pulled off the sandpaper would finish up embedded in the Turcite..it can absorb some..but that is just asking for rapid wear problems later. Try the cabinet scraper..you will be amazed how fast it will shift the excess..just as it will remove wood a lot faster than sandpaper and to a "cleaner" finish. teenut Dave and Sue Erickson wrote: > > Thanks for the suggestions; I'm aiming at .0005" high in front, which > is also the amount the front relaxes if I unlock the knee. The current > measurement is .001" too high, i.e. it is .0015" high in front, based > on swinging an indicator around the spindle axis. It is .0010" too high > in front based on moving the table along the y axis. > > So if my math is correct, that means that if I take the full .001" off the > table, I'll end up with about .0005" high in front, and it will all be in > the knee, which is what I want, since the knee will wear towards more accuracy. > > I'd like to end up with a machine that I can use for surfacing (fly) cuts > that remain parallel to the table, and at the same time keep the geometry > with respect to the column correct, since boring on the Hardinge is done > by raising and lowering the knee. > > So, reading between the lines, I guess that it makes sense to add the > turcite then scrape it, rather than scrape the ways first. Is sandpaper a > no-no, due to embedding grit into the turcite? > > In article <381DDA4E.E387296E@home.com>, Robert Bastow wrote: > > > Jack is correct, the table should be a smidgin higher at the front than the > > back..it takes account of weight and cutting loads plus eventual wear. > > > > Sound machine tool design principal..the machine should get MORE > accurate as it > > wears...before it starts to deteriorate. > > > > I would be tempted to leave the full 0.001" in there..ast least until the > > machine has had time to bed in. Turcice will bed a bit further than cast ron > > slides will..even they will do so to some small degree. > > > > Should you feel the urge..Turcite is scraped with regular scraping tools..same > > shapes and angles etc., but they do need to be RAZOR sharp or you will just > > float over the surface as the turcite "dodges" out of the way. > > > > If you know how to sharpen and use a cabinet maker's scraper, you will > find that > > better for evenly reducing large areas before final spot scraping. > > > > teenut > > > > > > Jack Erbes wrote: > > > > > > Dave and Sue Erickson wrote: > > > > > > > > > > The reason for the post is that there is a third problem; the > > > > table is about .001" too high in the front. My question: if > > > > I plan on adding turcite, should I correct the .001" alignment > > > > problem before or after adding the turcite? If after, will I > > > > be able to scrape it using the same tools and techniques that > > > > are used on cast iron, or should the scrapers be sharpened > > > > differently, or different tools used? > > > > > > Bridgeport manuals say that the front of the table should be .0005 > > > higher than the back. They don't explain why, but I assume it allows > > > for settling that occurs under load. Maybe your Hardinge needs > > > something there for the same reason. > > > > > > -- > > > Jack in Sonoma, CA, USA (jack@vom.com) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Model Engineering Mailing List From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 07:24:54 GMT -------- Rather you than me Charlie Gallo (G-A-L-L-O...did everyone make a note of that!!) People tend to resent these things for a long time...and to remember who started it!! ;^) Charles Gallo wrote: > > On Mon, 01 Nov 1999 05:40:20 GMT, Robert Bastow > wrote: > > > >DO NOT EVER MENTION Weetabix or Foucaults pendulum!! > > > ACK! The W word and the F word in one message! Ack, how could you do > this? (Think we could get a thread going here ?) > > Charlie > > -- PGP Key on Request > For the Children RKBA! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Favorite Graffiti From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 07:45:43 GMT -------- I mentioned it a few weeks ago..but: In Florala Alabama is a Fireworks store, presumably owned by a (Dim) female.. A sign proclaims: "Bettie's..For the best Bang in town" I can't remember if that is the actual female's name..but anyone heading down to Destin or such parts will pass it. teenut "w.j.ward" wrote: > > In my neighborhood, there is a sign proclaiming ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: patina From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 07:47:28 GMT -------- No J!! You don't want to hear our FAVORITE!! ;^) teenut JORNT@mindspring.com wrote: > > hi everyone! I am a furniture maker who is new to metalworking and I would > love to hear your easy, fun, around the house patina recipes! thanks! > > J ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: almost ashamed From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 07:52:23 GMT -------- Perfectly normal!! Acceptable?? My Boxford Shaper came out of a school system covered with twenty years of grime. A thorough cleaning revealed it had never cut metal! That sad story is not at all unusual. Probably the real reason your furnace was never used was that the Teacher had no idea how to turn it on! teenut Barb Hardy wrote: > > Well did it again, bought a surplus Mifco heat treat furnace mdl HTG. 94 for > the grand total $200.00 come out of a high school. it does not look like it > has ever been fired. Of course if the staff was nervous about the little > tykes playing with 2,400 F I can understand why it was not fired. can you > imagine spending 10,500.00 for a piece of equipment and then just sit there > and stare at it ? > This was such a good deal that I almost feel ashamed about it. is this > normal? I don't know how I'm gonna live with my self but I'll figure > something out Paul ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: 40T bronze wormwheels on ebay From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 08:04:53 GMT -------- FWIW, for anyone contemplating building a dividing head..these look suspisciously like Boston bronze wormwheels. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 40T bronze wormwheels on ebay From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 08:39:15 GMT -------- Oops http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=192529411 sorry! Robert Bastow wrote: > > FWIW, for anyone contemplating building a dividing head..these look > suspisciously like Boston bronze wormwheels. > > teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 40T bronze wormwheels on ebay From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 16:49:15 GMT -------- Works for me..Ebay announced an image retrieval system shutdown this AM..try it now. 8^) teenut PLAlbrecht wrote: > > Well, I went to look at it, the ad copy says "see picture for information" and > the picture is a broken-image icon. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Favorite Graffiti From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 16:51:33 GMT -------- Nah! I tried that, but I kinda like to be able to go back to restaurants if I like the food!! teenut Tom Stovall wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > re: Rendering cell phones inoperative > > [...] > > >But what would be required to do that..can't be much! I know in the >days when I lived and died on a cell phone it was difficult to AVOID >blackouts! > > >I would pay SERIOUS money for a little black box that would put the >fritz on any cell phone I pointed it at. It would be worth it just to >watch the varying reactions of people for whom life, as they know it, >has just ceased!!... > > How about a concussion grenade? Its effectiveness would be limited only > by one's ability to place it in proximity to the offending cell phone > and its use would certainly meet your criterion of modifying "life as > they know it..." > > Tom Stovall CJF > Farrier & Blacksmith > stovall@wt.net > http://web.wt.net/~stovall > > "Los muertos no hablan." -Francisco Villa ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: __ B r a ___ made of ___ m e t a l ___ ??? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 16:58:14 GMT -------- dave pierson wrote: Its stated purpose is > to prevent 'low sperm count in men' resulting from being > exposed to 'electromagnetc radiation from computers..." Jeez! Where were computors when I was going around impregnating half the female population!! I would've paid MONEY for a lower sperm count back then! Come* to think of it..I DID pay money for a ZERO sperm count later (Far too later) in life. 8^) teenut * no pun intended ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 40T bronze wormwheels on ebay From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 17:19:06 GMT -------- Well, Worm wheels are easier for the average HSM to machine than the worm wheel..and a HELLUVA lot cheaper to buy, even at retail prices!! Hey, you don't want 'em..might buy them myself!! ;^) teenut PLAlbrecht wrote: > > Two worm wheels without worms seem kind of like a matched pair of three-legged > dogs... I suppose one could buy the missing worm if one knows what it should > be. > > Or if cheap enough, it's a source of bronze stock for making something else... > > > Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Carbide From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 18:45:10 GMT -------- Go to any local machine shop..they will have a bucket full, waiting for the scrap buyer. They should sell it to you if you are nice to them. teenut Paul Spieringhs wrote: > > Who knows where to find scrap-carbide? I am willing to pay good money for > it... > > Greetings, > > Paul ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How are shapers sized? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 18:47:01 GMT -------- Maximum length of stroke of ram = maximum width of material it can machine. teenut Bruce Miller wrote: > > If someone says that they have a 7" shaper, what does that 7" refer to? > > Thanks > BAMiller ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: GENTLEMEN , DEPARTING From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 21:44:22 GMT -------- Jack Erbes wrote: > > Geez, maybe we ought to send someone along to help. Let's see, who can > we manage without... I am FAR too busy myself..find someone else!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: bridgeport mill From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 21:45:28 GMT -------- Now THAT'S a new twist!! 8^) teenut Todd Burley wrote: > > would like to purchase a good used bridgeport series I milling machine. > > thank you > Todd Burley (tburley@neo.rr.com) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Ultimate HSM bumper sticker From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 21:49:37 GMT -------- Quit Honking..I'm Reloading! Driver only carries fifty rounds! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Stuck Knee! From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 21:52:38 GMT -------- Nigel Eaton wrote: > A thousand thanks for all the advice and encouragement > gentlemen. You lot are an international treasure, and what's > holding up the cold fusion project? :^) Aswering dumb fool questions about stuck knees!! 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Vice "tuneup" From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 02 Nov 1999 22:18:58 GMT -------- Take the bugger back and exchange it..Even the Kurt clones work well if properly put together...its more a geometry thing than tolerances. A "Real" Kurt Might have slightly tighter tolerances..it is a bit more luck of the draw with the clones..but in reality the majority of the price difference is for the name! teenut Alan Rothenbush wrote: > > So I bought a fine looking vice from Grizzley - one of their Kurt clones, the vice doesn't clamp down, > but instead lifts up, ever so slightly. Taking a hammer to tap the work > down just isn't something I'm comfortable with. > > Is this something I just get to live with, or is there some magic tip/fix ? > > Thanks in advance. > > Alan > > -- > > Alan Rothenbush | The Spartans do not ask the number of the > Academic Computing Services | enemy, only where they are. > Simon Fraser University | > Burnaby, B.C., Canada | Agix of Sparta ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking,dfw.forsale,rsn.hp.forsale Subject: Re: Testing Hardness/Temper of Hand Tools From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 04:04:22 GMT -------- You don't say what the tools are Loren 8^) It would be easier to come up with a comparison test that would mean something if we knew what they were. I doubt that a center punch tes it going to prove much..unless you have the means to measure the imprint to a thousandth of an inch diameter..even then it is only going to tell about surface hardness..which may mean a lot or nothing, depending on the tool. A file test is simply going to ruin the chrome plate!! Yes, with a lot of experience, a set of "graduated" files, and knowledge that both tools are made from exactly the same material, then an "indication" of the state of heat treatment can be obtained. But not knowing the composition makes it virtually meaning less. By definition..tools are meant to do a job, and the final analysis must rest on how well they do that job..Field testing in other words! Do the HF tools do the job as well as the Craftsman tools? Do they break, or blunt or bend or chip or bugger up faster or slower? It is the only test that means anything in the long term. I could suggest you put each tool in the vise and smite it mightily with a hammer..but supposing they both bend or break..What have you learned other than not to hit the next ones quite as hard! 8^) teenut Loren Coe wrote: > > import tools are often tempting, and i have had mixed feelings wrt > to quality over the past 30 years. > > recently i have seen lots (and purchased some) of nice looking hand > tools at the local Harbor Freight outlet. how can i test the metal > hardness and temper? what would be the 'accepted' method? > > i plan to compare the hardness to some Craftsman tools, using a spring > loaded punch and/or a file. but what about temper? will that be > part of the "hardness"? > > the fit and grind of these tools seems to have improved remarkably > since i last purchased a sample. the chrome plating is a little spotty > and thin, but that is not of any real concern to me. any advice will > be greatly appreciated. > > Loren > > < do you use KILLFILES? if no, you should. are they fully implemented > > < and easy to use on your system/isp/news reader? if no, you should find > > < out why, complain, change news readers or isp's. rn or trn will add > > < a subject with two keystrokes (^A, j), fully killing all present and > > < future posts to the thread being viewed. now, THAT'S a NEWSREADER !!! > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: __ B r a ___ made of ___ m e t a l ___ ??? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 04:10:21 GMT -------- Hey Gerry, I'll do it for you..I read a book once! Shucks, what are friends for..? I DO promise, on this occasion, just for you, I will wear gloves around moving machinery..My SkilSaw! 8^) teenut Gerald Miller wrote: > > I'm still looking for someone to do a retroactive vasectomy;-)} > > -- > > Gerry > London, Canada > > Robert Bastow wrote in message > news:381F1821.F0C9B715@home.com... > > > > > > dave pierson wrote: > > Its stated purpose is > > > to prevent 'low sperm count in men' resulting from being > > > exposed to 'electromagnetc radiation from computers..." > > > > Jeez! > > > > Where were computors when I was going around impregnating half the female > > population!! > > > > I would've paid MONEY for a lower sperm count back then! > > > > Come* to think of it..I DID pay money for a ZERO sperm count later (Far > too > > later) in life. 8^) > > > > teenut > > > > * no pun intended ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: patina From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 04:14:45 GMT -------- Nope! The only reason I haven't marketed my BEST recipe is that I can't get the cat to pee in a bottle! teenut TS wrote: > > Sez teenut, while filling the patina tank with his favorite brew.... > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > No J!! You don't want to hear our FAVORITE!! > > > > ;^) > > > > teenut > > > > JORNT@mindspring.com wrote: > > > > > > hi everyone! I am a furniture maker who is new to metalworking and I would > > > love to hear your easy, fun, around the house patina recipes! thanks! > > > > > > J ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Vice "tuneup" From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 04:47:10 GMT -------- Robert Mitchell wrote: > > Alan does not say how bad the work rises up. True! > > Keep in mind that it is standard practice to tap the work down > with a lead hammer even with a good vice! It is! 8^o > The Kurt just makes the work rise less; it does not eliminate it. In that case, y'all need to sell your Kurts an buy a decent pulldown vice! Like a Gerardi! (Told ya Pete!!) ;^) Or one of the clones..like the one I just got. I haven't cleaned off all the grease yet..but, never having used a Kurt OR a Klone I did want to see how well the sucker did its stuff. I have a steel box square,4" x 5" x 6", hardened and ground, to as near "dead on" as the considerable assets and endevours of my old Alma Mater Company could (unknowingly) muster..I called in every marker I had to get that made!! On a large surface plate, I first checked the vise for level, using a 20 millionths dial indicator..The Klone factory musta had a bad day because a couldn't detect any movement "cross and corner"..other than the steady bobble it was picking up from my heart beats!! Then I popped my Carefully cleaned block in the Carefully cleaned jaws and checked "cross and corner" again..same result..No surprise! Finger tight..No sign of lifting!..No real surprise. "Drilling tight" Nope! "Milling tight"..Nope ! "Reefed for a Sou'wester and a honkin' great slab mill" Definite Movement of several tenths...not from Lift though..but from the bowing of the vise body. Had it been properly bolted down on a good mill table...it would have been straight enough for any job one could ask a mill to do. I must say, I was Impressed..Not just by the Kurt design..but by the $165.00 Klone performance! Didn't need to hit it once! Damn..I must be doing something wrong! ;^) teenut > > - Robert Mitchell > > Robert Bastow wrote in message > news:381F634E.21AB3857@home.com... > > Take the bugger back and exchange it..Even the Kurt clones work well if > properly > > put together...its more a geometry thing than tolerances. > > > > A "Real" Kurt Might have slightly tighter tolerances..it is a bit more > luck of > > the draw with the clones..but in reality the majority of the price > difference is > > for the name! > > > > teenut > > > > Alan Rothenbush wrote: > > > > > > So I bought a fine looking vice from Grizzley - one of their Kurt > clones, > > the vice doesn't clamp down, > > > but instead lifts up, ever so slightly. Taking a hammer to tap the work > > > down just isn't something I'm comfortable with. > > > > > > Is this something I just get to live with, or is there some magic > tip/fix ? > > > > > > Thanks in advance. > > > > > > Alan > > > > > > -- > > > > > > Alan Rothenbush | The Spartans do not ask the number of > the > > > Academic Computing Services | enemy, only where they are. > > > Simon Fraser University | > > > Burnaby, B.C., Canada | Agix of Sparta ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Ultimate HSM bumper sticker (was favorite grafitti) From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 13:13:39 GMT -------- In a similar vein: "It is impossible to spoil kids..unless you over cook them!" and a genuine story of heartbreak seen locally in Atlanta... "Proud Parent of a second year Pool Shark at UGA" teenut John Flanagan wrote: > > My favorite: > > I Love Cats, They Taste Just Like Chicken > > Laughed for twenty minutes. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Electromagnets From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 21:00:28 GMT -------- You won't have a problem with chips flying everywhere either! teenut KStuempges wrote: > > Does anyone know of a source for electromagnets? I want to incorporate one in > a micro drill press to hold small ferrous pieces. > > Ken ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Safety question: Wearing gloves From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 21:03:21 GMT -------- Not even if you say "OUCH" real loud?? ;^) teenut Brian Evans wrote: > > I decided not to wear gloves around the lathe and mill pretty early on. > one day just after I got the mill I was using a brush to add lubricant and > clear chips from a milling cutter. I was using about a 5" dia. by 1" > cutter, horizontal milling, and the brush was caught up by the cutter, and > spat out the other side. A three inch wide paint brush, with an 8" long > wooden handle, fed right thru the cutter, and the mill didn't even > shudder. Didn't even affect the surface finish! If you're wearing a > glove and it gets caught, your hand will go through the machine and it > won't even slow a bit. > > Brian > > mledtje@my-deja.com wrote: > > > Robert, > > > > I wanted to thank you for being so persistent in presenting your views > > and reasons for not wearing gloves. > > > > I have on occasion been tempted to wear gloves in the cold shop. Now I > > know I will never yield to that temptation. > > > > If your goal was to prevent one person who didn't understand the > > possibilities from wearing gloves under the wrong circumstances, you > > have succeeded. > > > > Thanks again for not yielding to the pressure that was obvious. > > > > Cold Hands Mike (and happy about it) > > > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Safety question: Wearing gloves From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 23:22:24 GMT -------- Let me know when they have one that can see about twenty seconds into the future! 8^) teemut Tony Jeffree wrote: > > On Wed, 03 Nov 1999 21:03:21 GMT, Robert Bastow > wrote: > > >Not even if you say "OUCH" real loud?? > > > >;^) > > > > Well, with PCs being able to do voice recognition these days...plug a > microphone into your CNC system & hey presto - an "ouch" switch is now > possible.... > > Regards, > Tony > > Website: http://www.jeffree.u-net.com/ > When replying, delete "X." from the Email address to remove anti-SPAM measures. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Vice "tuneup" From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 23:27:03 GMT -------- S'easy.. Vices feel BAD when you drop them. Vices feel GOOD when you drop them. teenut Erich Coiner wrote: > > Tony Jeffree wrote: > > > > On Wed, 03 Nov 1999 18:57:25 GMT, Hoyt McKagen > > wrote: > > > > >Alan Rothenbush wrote: > > >> > > >> So I bought a fine looking vice from Grizzley - one of their Kurt clones, > > > > > >EXCUSE ME FOR SHOUTING BUT IT'S IMPORTANT: YOU BOUGHT A 'VISE', NOT A > > >'VICE'. > > > > Depends which side of the pond you live/were brought up on. If you > > speak English, the word is "vice". My dictionary says "vise: American > > for vice". > > > > Q.E.D. > > > > Regards, > > Tony > > > > Website: http://www.jeffree.u-net.com/ > > When replying, delete "X." from the Email address to remove anti-SPAM measures. > > Then how do you Brits distinguish between a lump of cast iron designed > for clamping and Bad habits like smoking, drinking to excess, etc. > > Erich I always wondered why Miami Vice was not a tool show ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Nuts From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 03 Nov 1999 23:41:28 GMT -------- After a 2 year study, the national science foundation has determined the following results on corporate America's recreational activities: The sport of choice for unemployed or jailed people is BASKETBALL. The sport of choice for maintenance employees is BOWLING. The sport of choice for line workers is FOOTBALL. The sport of choice for Supervisors is BASEBALL. The sport of choice for Middle Management is TENNIS. And finally, the sport of choice for Upper Management is GOLF. CONCLUSION: That the higher you are in the corporate structure, the smaller your balls become. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Tradeshow Marketing, Inc From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 00:09:39 GMT -------- Er..Obfuscation? If they expected hordes of excited people to respond to THAT shining example of English prose,I have no doubt that their numbers fell short of projections! 8^o teenut jim ross wrote: > > Does anyone know why the following trade show was called off? > > jim > > November 2-4, 1999, will be heading into it's eighth cycle in 1999. For > the first time, in 1999, the > Philadelphia/Delaware Valley Chapter of the National Tooling and > Machining Association (NTMA) will join > with Tradeshow Marketing, Inc. to present this show, at the Valley Forge > Convention Center.Tradeshow Marketing, Inc., owns and operates a series > of metalworking exhibitions throughout the United States. Located in > Scottsdale, Arizona, > > Tradeshow Marketing, Inc. produces exhibitions in Charlotte, North > Carolina, Cleveland, Ohio, Ft. Lauderdale, Florida, Greenville, South > Carolina, Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, Phoenix, Arizona and San Diego, > California, and Birmingham, Alabama. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Nuts From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 00:16:26 GMT -------- I bought a whole book of tickets for the Policeman's Ball.. I thought it was a raffle! 8^( teenut Tony Jeffree wrote: > > On Wed, 03 Nov 1999 23:41:28 GMT, Robert Bastow > wrote: > > >After a 2 year study, the national science foundation has determined the > >following results on corporate America's recreational activities: > > > > The sport of choice for unemployed or jailed people is BASKETBALL. > > The sport of choice for maintenance employees is BOWLING. > > The sport of choice for line workers is FOOTBALL. > > The sport of choice for Supervisors is BASEBALL. > > The sport of choice for Middle Management is TENNIS. > > And finally, the sport of choice for Upper Management is GOLF. > > > >CONCLUSION: > >That the higher you are in the corporate structure, the smaller your > >balls become. > > > >teenut > > Q: Why do policemen have bigger balls? > > A: Because they sell more tickets. > > Regards, > Tony > > Website: http://www.jeffree.u-net.com/ > When replying, delete "X." from the Email address to remove anti-SPAM measures. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: You're probably a HSM if... From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 00:33:23 GMT -------- Did you hear about the Redneck that took his Mother-in-Law to a Tanning Salon. The Taxidermist said she had been dead too long to do anything with! You are probably a HSM if.... ....the only Bad Vice you have is a Chinese clone! 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Change of Email address From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 03:04:57 GMT -------- Sick and tired of "Outlook Depress" I am going back to Hotmail. My new Email adress is my "old" email address.. Thanks teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: __ B r a ___ made of ___ m e t a l ___ ??? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 06:33:22 GMT -------- Being the Expert, I'LL decide what he needs...once I get in there!! teenut Steve Rayner wrote: > > Hmmm, well I think he wants a vasectomy reversed, not a radical > orchectomy! > > Robert Bastow (teenut@home.com) wrote: > : Hey Gerry, I'll do it for you..I read a book once! > > : Shucks, what are friends for..? > > : I DO promise, on this occasion, just for you, I will wear gloves around moving > : machinery..My SkilSaw! > > : 8^) > > : teenut > > : Gerald Miller wrote: > : > > : > I'm still looking for someone to do a retroactive vasectomy;-)} > : > > : > -- > : > > : > Gerry > : > London, Canada > : > > : > Robert Bastow wrote in message > : > news:381F1821.F0C9B715@home.com... > : > > > : > > > : > > dave pierson wrote: > : > > Its stated purpose is > : > > > to prevent 'low sperm count in men' resulting from being > : > > > exposed to 'electromagnetc radiation from computers..." > : > > > : > > Jeez! > : > > > : > > Where were computors when I was going around impregnating half the female > : > > population!! > : > > > : > > I would've paid MONEY for a lower sperm count back then! > : > > > : > > Come* to think of it..I DID pay money for a ZERO sperm count later (Far > : > too > : > > later) in life. 8^) > : > > > : > > teenut > : > > > : > > * no pun intended > > -- > > I'm a Canadian eh! Steve. > ************************************************************************** > The FAQ for rec.crafts.metalworking is at: http://w3.uwyo.edu/~metal > The metalworking drop box is at http://www.metalworking.com > or http://208.213.200.132 > ************************************************************************** > Visit my website at: http://www.victoria.tc.ca/~ud233/homepage.htm > > ************* Tu ne cede malis, sed contra audentior ito. **************** > ******************************** - Virgil ******************************** > ******Yield thou not to adversity, but press on the more bravely.********** ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Any cool metalworking\welding site? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 14:00:39 GMT -------- Yer just found it!! Welcome to the best kept secret in NG's..Where "Knowledgeable, Helpful, People" abound..."Experts" will be proven wrong and "Newbies" are always welcome! There are no "Dumb Questions" here...(but occasionally a few "Dumb Answers" ;^) Who are you? Where are you? Waddya Do, Waddya Got, and Waddya want? 8^) teenut Tad Bungener wrote: > > I cannot seem to find any fun sites relevant to welding or metalworking. > I am looking for some websites where I can go and chat with people > familiar with welding products and generators. I would also like to be > able to get some information on welding projects or products. > Does anyone have any sites they would recommend visiting? > Please, I am desperately seeking such a website. > > Thanks, > Tad ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Vice "tuneup" From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 14:03:44 GMT -------- Hoyt McKagen wrote: > What can be expected from a country that gave us 'windscreen', 'boot' and > 'bonnet' for autos? Yeah, and look what you did with them!! ;^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Elec. Motor Question From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 14:06:13 GMT -------- Isn't that what caused the 747 to blow up off Long Island? Or maybe it was some one making an "October Skies" movie! teenut Ned Simmons wrote: > > >How about the Air to fuel ratio of the vapor going thru the pump is too > > >rich to burn. > > > > > >Erich > > > > The area of the restriction that the spark-caused flame must go through is so > > small that the heat of combustion is carried away and it goes out. This is the > > principle of the Davy safety lamp. > > Bring a piece of metal window screen down on a candle flame. The screen > > conducts the heat away so fast that the flame cannot go beyond the screen. > > Engineman1 > > > This is the way explosion-proof electrical devices are constructed as > well. Any ignition that occurs inside the enclosure is quenched before it > can reach the outside environment. > > Ned Simmons ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: RCM is NOT the worst group on the net From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 14:08:53 GMT -------- To see a newsgroup that should relinquish its title to more rational people..check out the alt.machines.cnc NG The kinda place you wipe your feet as you are LEAVING!! teenut elf15641@my-deja.com wrote: > > In article , > "Jeff Pack" wrote: > > try rec.motorcycles, same thing... > > > > Scott Moore wrote in message > > news:381FD49C.9B132994@cisco.com... > > > Just a thought, if you want to appreciate this group, hang out > elsewhere. > > I have been > > > spending time at the rec.aviation groups, it is fairly amazing how > fast > > simple questions > > > degenerate into namecalling and shouting. Not that this group does > not > > ever do it, just > > > not on EVERY thread ! > > > > > > -- > > > Scott A. Moore is samiam@cisco.com > > > > > > N733HZ Cessna 172 > > If you really want to see some nasty posts, visit just about any of the > religion groups. Always some uninvited moron who wants to tell you why > your believe in one religion or another is going to send you straight to > hell. > > This newsgroup generally gets by without the nasty posts which is one of > the reasons I check on it each day, not to mention the fact I tend to > learn something new just about every other day here. > > Elf1564 > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 7" South Bend Shaper Manual and Parts advice needed From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 14:20:41 GMT -------- Could be that they were planed or even gang broached. Some of the so-called "Low end" machinery manufacurers in Taiwan use state-of-the-art, top-end, Fexible/CAM manufacturing equipment from Europe Japan and the US. They are capable of producing world class quality, competitively, because of this fact..not because of the "bowl of rice" myth! Communist China is likewise capable of turning out World Class equipment..and do so, in the larger sized machinery end of the market..Floor borers, Roll Lathes, VTLs, Planer Mills and the like. Any reduced quality results from lack of demand and QC from the buyers! If we only want to pay junk prices..they will happily make it for us! teenut Hugh Strong wrote: > > If I went to a factory in, say, Evil Red Communist China , would > I still see shapers in everyday use? The reason I ask is that the > top of the cross-slide dovetails on my 12X36 Chinese lathe definitely > look like they might have been shaped (Long, parallel cut-marks > running down the dovetail) but they are NOT smooth as ground. > Maybe a very deep cut was taken. > > -Hugh > > PLAlbrecht wrote in message > news:19991103024319.01657.00000364@ng-ba1.aol.com... > > >>Shapers may be fun to watch, but IMHO they are the most totally > > >>useless machine tool ever invented. Any small table model mill will > > >>do anything a shaper will, faster, and easier. > > > > As someone who has both, I wouldn't part with either. There are definitely > some > > jobs better done on a shaper. The shaper may be slower but you can make a > > custom single-point cutter to do almost anything. With the mill, you'd > have to > > find the right cutter, made and sharpened by somebody else. > > > > As Peter Wiley says -- > > >>I don't think so. For cleaning up dirty castings, you'd be spending > > more time on a tool & cutter grinder than machining metal with a mill. > > > > Also as Peter Wiley pointed out, the shaper leaves a surface that's > nearly as > > smooth as ground. For sliding surfaces like dovetails etc. the mill can't > hold > > a candle to what the shaper can do. > > > > I just had a job on which I did most of the cutting on the mill, but had > one > > odd angle where I just couldn't set it up in any convenient way so I did > it on > > the shaper in just a few minutes. Set in vise by eyeball and let her go. > > > > The shaper may be slower, but it's the more "universal" tool. It will do > many > > if not most of the things a mill can do, with hand-sharpened cutters yet. > Back > > to basics... > > > > Pete > > > > > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: metal bra for real... From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 14:23:57 GMT -------- The only thing missing is arm rests, and a tray top to her head for your beer!! teenut Gunner (and others) wrote: > >> Lordy, > >> That woman looks like she has been run fast, rode hard, and put away > >>wet waaay too many times. > > > > I warned you, man! I said she was a beast of burden, but as soon as you > >see a URL you go hareing off to take a peek. Like Mick Jagger in drag, I > >said. I thought it was pretty descriptive. And accurate! 8-) > > Ah, but she had a mouth that Monica would be envious of. Plus a built > in handle. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Change of Email address From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 14:30:29 GMT -------- Willing to try anything twice! Have always been satisfied with Hotmail..easy to manage but would like to get my NG on a similar programe..sorta "one stop Shopping" "Outlook Depress" is an absolute abortion!! teenut Gunner wrote: > > On Thu, 04 Nov 1999 03:04:57 GMT, Robert Bastow > wrote: > > >Sick and tired of "Outlook Depress" I am going back to Hotmail. > > > >My new Email adress is my "old" email address.. > > > >Thanks > > > >teenut > > Why not download Eudora, and have a real email program. And its free > > www.eudora.com > > --------------------------------------------------------- > > "A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an > invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write > a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort > the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, > solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program > a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die > gallantly. Specialization is for insects." Robert Heinlein > > Free Hobby Buy/Swap/Sell Website > www.cyberg8t.com/gunner/hsm/index.html > > Home Page > http://userzweb.lightspeed.net/gunner ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Enco 5c collets/ Bison 5c Chucks From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 14:38:32 GMT -------- Faced with a similar problem. Though I have 5C system and a slew of collets..I never seem to have the right size to hand! So, I have just aquired a Jacobs Rubber Flex chuck and a full set of collets. I have yet to set it up and try it out, and I have never used one before, but though the initial cost of collets is brutal, the flexibility of sizes each will accomodate, makes them cheaper in the long run that spring collets. Does anyone have direct experience of the Jacobs system..and are all the claims made for it true? Thanks, teenut Hugh Strong wrote: > > Jim Stewart wrote in message > news:3820F2BC.6067@strappe.com... > > > BTW, if you get this chuck you'll quickly realize that you want collets > > in 1/64" steps... > > Keep in mind that with badly over-or-under sized stock (more than +/- .005) > that 5C collets will not grip very well, or the stock can olnly be forced > in, possibly ruining the collet. Unfortunately, I've found stock (1" 6061, > new, purchased from MSC) that did not fit in 1" collet, and was really too > undersized to be held in 1 1/64. I made do anyway, but just to take the > stock down > to 1" so that it could be held securely. > > There's no such thing as 1/128" increment collets, unfortunately. > > > > > http://www.strappe.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: __ B r a ___ made of ___ m e t a l ___ ??? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 14:44:41 GMT -------- Kurt Bjorn wrote: > Wierd but true. And no I don't glow in the dark! Pity!! Think of the money you could make with your own porno web page!! "Kurt and his incredible "Lightstick-Nightstick" " ;^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Moving a Bridgeport/Stonehenge From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 15:02:09 GMT -------- As Engineering students in co-op type programs, all of us with practical Machine Shop, Millwrighting and Rigging experience, my class placed a Lecturer's Jaguar up on top of the 10 story "Engineering Tower" at the University, as part of the College "Rag Week" celebrations (excesses??) This was done at night, in total darkness, secrecy and silence, using telephone pole "A" frames, shearlegs, ropes, rollers, comealongs, snatch blocks and the like. The College had to hire a HUGE mobile crane to fetch it down again!! We didn't scratch the car..but they did! 8^) teenut STJ28 wrote: > > Just an observation but in all my watching of "scholars" on TLC, Discover > Channel etc. try and replicate building the pyramids, Stonehenge, Easter Island > they have yet to get a bunch of riggers and machinists together. I've watched > 40 foot planner mills, 200 ton crucibles etc. moved with the utmost precision > and accuracy using very simple equipment. In the 1800's the railroad wrecking > crews could fish a steam locomotive out of a canyon with block and tackle. > Seems to me our college types are the wrong guys to ask. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: metal bra for real... From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 15:09:18 GMT -------- Leave out the teeth altogether! They look dangerous enough to bring a tear to a glass eye!! 8^) teenut Ned Simmons wrote: > > Let's not leave out the rubber teeth while we're making improvements. > > Ned Simmons > > In article <38219702.F99CC85B@hotmail.com>, teenut@hotmail.com says... > > The only thing missing is arm rests, and a tray top to her head for your beer!! > > > > teenut > > > > Gunner (and others) wrote: > > > > > >> Lordy, > > > >> That woman looks like she has been run fast, rode hard, and put away > > > >>wet waaay too many times. > > > > > > > > I warned you, man! I said she was a beast of burden, but as soon as you > > > >see a URL you go hareing off to take a peek. Like Mick Jagger in drag, I > > > >said. I thought it was pretty descriptive. And accurate! 8-) > > > > > > Ah, but she had a mouth that Monica would be envious of. Plus a built > > > in handle. > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Inexpensive tube bender for 1 3/4 thin-wall(1/16")??? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut (remove)"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 15:42:18 GMT -------- Peter Logghe wrote: The end of the track is just like > that sidewalk coming toward you. On the end of a bungie cord!! teenut (still trying to rid myself of the smell of FEAR!! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: metal bra for real... From: Robert Bastow <"teenut (remove)"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 17:00:15 GMT -------- In this particular instance I think even teenut might dispense a waiver!! Robert Bastow (teenut's Boss) Ned Simmons wrote: > > I'm way ahead of you. Considering what we've got to work with here, > aesthetics seemed to outweigh safety concerns. Would gloves be > appropriate? > > Ned Simmons > > In article <3821A1A3.94D2BD67@hotmail.com>, teenut@hotmail.com says... > > Leave out the teeth altogether! They look dangerous enough to bring a tear to a > > glass eye!! > > > > 8^) > > > > teenut > > > > Ned Simmons wrote: > > > > > > Let's not leave out the rubber teeth while we're making improvements. > > > > > > Ned Simmons > > > > > > In article <38219702.F99CC85B@hotmail.com>, teenut@hotmail.com says... > > > > The only thing missing is arm rests, and a tray top to her head for your beer!! > > > > > > > > teenut > > > > > > > > Gunner (and others) wrote: > > > > > > > > > >> Lordy, > > > > > >> That woman looks like she has been run fast, rode hard, and put away > > > > > >>wet waaay too many times. > > > > > > > > > > > > I warned you, man! I said she was a beast of burden, but as soon as you > > > > > >see a URL you go hareing off to take a peek. Like Mick Jagger in drag, I > > > > > >said. I thought it was pretty descriptive. And accurate! 8-) > > > > > > > > > > Ah, but she had a mouth that Monica would be envious of. Plus a built > > > > > in handle. > > > > > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Favorite Graffiti From: Robert Bastow <"teenut (remove)"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 20:25:16 GMT -------- Obviously someone beat him to the PMPMOBL plate! I saw a big black Stretch Limo not too long ago with a "Mafia Staff Car" sticker. teenut Jim McGill wrote: > > Not quite a graffiti, but nearly caused me to have a one car accident: > > I was driving though the local Scandinavian district (Ballard) when I > saw coming towards me the most immaculate, totally decked out late 60's > Cadillac I've ever seen. It was very deep red, almost black, with tinted > windows, white walls and in better than show room condition. A true > labor of love. At the wheel was a very large African American man in > shades, gold chains, and gold rings on every finger. The personality > plate was "NGRCAR". I got about half a block past when it hit me and I > nearly pulled into a parked car I was laughing so hard. Talk about > totally not PC. I wonder how he ever got that plate! > > Jim ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Favorite Graffiti From: Robert Bastow <"teenut (remove)"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 20:28:02 GMT -------- AAsberry wrote: (refering to Football Jocks) > lunch room. > > If I were a band member, I would be ready to take one of them out with a > clarinet. > I would make sure it was well greased and a comfortable fit up my ass first! 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: You're probably a HSM if... From: Robert Bastow <"teenut (remove)"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 20:40:25 GMT -------- You are probably a HSM if your wife finds lipstck on your collar and asks how the "spotting and scraping" is going! teenut Tony Jeffree wrote: > > On 4 Nov 1999 17:15:00 GMT, powers@cis.ohio-state.edu (william thomas > powers) wrote: > > >>You are probably a HSM if.... > >>...your wife has to get an MSC stock number from your friends to buy you a > >>birthday present! > > > >You mean you *didn't* get her her own copy of the catalog for her birthday! > > > >Thomas > > > You ar probably a HSN if... > ...your wife gets more jelous about oil on your collar than > lipstick... > > Regards, > Tony > > Website: http://www.jeffree.u-net.com/ > When replying, delete "X." from the Email address to remove anti-SPAM measures. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: FS-Shaper Located in Florida From: Robert Bastow <"teenut (remove)"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 20:45:36 GMT -------- Gunner wrote: > > That is, if no one wants to volunteer..... lol With all the friends you have on the NG Gunner, call in a few "Markers" and with a bit of co-ordination you could probably have it passed hand to hand across the country to you!! Where in Florida is it? I may be able to get it as far as Birmingham Al for you! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How to turn down a 10" x 10' pipe? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut (remove)"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 20:50:25 GMT -------- Get sanding! If you had a few to do rig up support rollers and a belt sander in a kind of three point arrangement and have someone hand turn while you sand. teenut Bob Chilcoat wrote: > > Here's the problem. I'm making a sail box for my catamaran trailer out > of 10" PVC pipe, 10' long. I bought two end caps. One I will glue on > with pipe cement. The other end I want to be a slip fit (yeah, I know, > but I couldn't find a 10" cleanout fitting). I need to take a few thou > off the OD of one end of the pipe to increase the clearance. Obviously > this won't fit on my Myford. I do have a 12" wood lathe. I've been > thinking about rigging up a remote tailstock and using the wood lathe > and a scraper. I suppose I could also just sand off a few thou by > hand. Any of you gents have a better suggestion? > > Bob ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Favorite Graffiti From: Robert Bastow <"teenut (remove)"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 20:56:28 GMT -------- Ex-Rugby Player and Boxer..it was a voice of advise..not experience! 8^) teenut Tony Jeffree wrote: > > On Thu, 04 Nov 1999 20:28:02 GMT, Robert Bastow <"teenut (remove)"@ > hotmail.com> wrote: > > > > > > >AAsberry wrote: (refering to Football Jocks) > > > >> lunch room. > >> > >> If I were a band member, I would be ready to take one of them out with a > >> clarinet. > >> > > > >I would make sure it was well greased and a comfortable fit up my ass first! > > > > Sounds like the voice of experience there, Robert... ;-) > > Regards, > Tony > > Website: http://www.jeffree.u-net.com/ > When replying, delete "X." from the Email address to remove anti-SPAM measures. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Scrap Carbide From: Robert Bastow <"teenut (remove)"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 04 Nov 1999 21:05:41 GMT -------- Someone asked for sources.. try these people $3.25 a pound, minimum 25 pounds> Teenut ======== Newsgroups: alt.machines.cnc,alt.machines.misc,comp.robotics.misc,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Sherline Revisited From: Robert Bastow <"teenut (remove)"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 00:07:22 GMT -------- Considering your stated purpose for posting here in the first place... Cass wrote: > Fred, I am simply gathering a large group of purchasers together, in > one place, to buy one quality product. Considering that your motives are not entirely selfless.... Considering that you have refused to answer any of the REAL questions posed.... Considering the sheer amount of bandwidth you have managed to consume over the past couple of weeks... Isn't it time you considered shutting up on this subject! Stay, contribute, (or lurk) on other subjects..but if this one goes around one more time it will disappear up its own asshole! Thank you. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Change of Email address From: Robert Bastow <"teenut (remove)"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 00:49:52 GMT -------- I am currently using Communicator and I don't mind the way it handles the News Group..but for email it sucks (IMHO) Hotmail, for all its detractors gives me a real fast, easy way to handle a LARGE volume of email traffic. I am more than willing to try any other free alternatives though. teenut "Walter R. Greene" wrote: > > I use Netscape Communicator, and like it's integration. E-mail, Browser, Newsgroup > reader, and yes, even a web page editor (of sorts). It's available for download > from Netscape. It's big though, ~15 Mbytes. I've used several versions, currently > 4.6, but I understand they have version 4.7 out now. Good luck! > > Walter > ======== > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > Willing to try anything twice! > > > > Have always been satisfied with Hotmail..easy to manage but would like to get my > > NG on a similar programe..sorta "one stop Shopping" > > > > "Outlook Depress" is an absolute abortion!! > > > > teenut > > > > Gunner wrote: > > > > > > On Thu, 04 Nov 1999 03:04:57 GMT, Robert Bastow > > > wrote: > > > > > > >Sick and tired of "Outlook Depress" I am going back to Hotmail. > > > > > > > >My new Email adress is my "old" email address.. > > > > > > > >Thanks > > > > > > > >teenut > > > > > > Why not download Eudora, and have a real email program. And its free > > > > > > www.eudora.com > > > > > > --------------------------------------------------------- > > > > > > "A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an > > > invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write > > > a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort > > > the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, > > > solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program > > > a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die > > > gallantly. Specialization is for insects." Robert Heinlein > > > > > > Free Hobby Buy/Swap/Sell Website > > > www.cyberg8t.com/gunner/hsm/index.html > > > > > > Home Page > > > http://userzweb.lightspeed.net/gunner ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Remember...Remember... From: Robert Bastow <"teenut (remove)"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 00:58:49 GMT -------- Come back Guido..All is forgiven!! teenut Tom Holt wrote: > > Tomorrow is, of course, St Guido's Day, when it is fitting to honor > the memory of a man who understood that the only way to strike a fair > and equitable balance between monarchy, oligarchy and democracy is to > blow all three of them up at the same time. > > Gone, but not forgotten. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: New Albrecht Keyless Drill Chuck Catalog From: Robert Bastow <"teenut (remove)"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 01:02:28 GMT -------- Hey Brian, I know your Cousin..Pete! Got any Free Samples (or scratch and dent) We will even take last year's old stock!! teenut brian wrote: > > On 10/4/99 the new Albrecht Keyless Drill Chuck catalog came out. It > features many new > style chucks for different applications. It also has the repair > instructions and a list of > all the replacement parts. > > If anyone is interested in receiving the new catalog send your name & > address to brian@royalprod.com. > > -Brian Mecca > Regional Sales Manager > Albrecht USA Inc. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Pillar Drills From: Robert Bastow <"teenut (remove)"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 01:21:48 GMT -------- Sorry you were disappointed! Maybe if you had come forth, in the beginning, with what YOU consider defines a "Pillar drill" I, for one know of the name being applied to at least two, entirely different types of machine. While you are about it..you might want to define "Post" drill as you know it..because there are a couple of possibilities there too. Or maybe you just prefer to spend the time making your "Pillar, not Post (or Sensitive either) Drill" as only you know best! 8^) teenut jimmyjava wrote: > > Many thanks for the info on pillar drills. To answer one fella, no, they > are not the same as a sensitive drill press. Instead of a rack and > pinion to move the quill up and down you would simply use a fingertip to > move the spindle down and through the work. I have a pretty good idea of > how to make one, I was only hoping to get a few ideas. > Ross > www.northstar.itgo.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Change of Email address From: Robert Bastow <"teenut (remove)"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 01:32:17 GMT -------- I have read and re-read your message Jim..Looking for a clue! ?8^( I am still not sure whether your intention is to tip me off to the "Opportunity of a life time"...Or if it is your way of letting me know your cheeks slammed shut before you could get your shorts out again! Pray, enlighten this unworthy one! 8^) teenut@slicendice.com Jim Stewart wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > Sick and tired of "Outlook Depress" I am going back to Hotmail. > > > > My new Email adress is my "old" email address.. > > > > Thanks > > > > teenut > > Robert, why don't you quit screwing around? You have a golden > opportunity here - I just did a "whois" on the internic site for > "teenut" and got no matches. > > You, Sire, could register the domain name of www.teenut.com. Think of > the prestige! > > Not only that, but any mail to that site would go to you - so you could > give out different email addresses for different reasons. > > Like spam@teenut.com or sarcasm@teenut.com or grumpy@teenut.com or > sweetness@teenut.com. For example. > > Think of the possibilities! > > -js > > -- > > http://www.strappe.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: FS-Shaper Located in Florida From: Robert Bastow <"teenut (remove)"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 01:33:21 GMT -------- Contact me off list! Gunner wrote: > > On Thu, 04 Nov 1999 20:45:36 GMT, Robert Bastow <"teenut (remove)"@ > hotmail.com> wrote: > > > > > > >Gunner wrote: > >> > >> That is, if no one wants to volunteer..... lol > > > >With all the friends you have on the NG Gunner, call in a few "Markers" and with > >a bit of co-ordination you could probably have it passed hand to hand across the > >country to you!! > > > >Where in Florida is it? > > > >I may be able to get it as far as Birmingham Al for you! > > > >teenut > > Its in Largo, Florida. I think I have a guy who drives produce into > California, who lives somewhere in Alabama. > > Gunner > > --------------------------------------------------------- > > "A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an > invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write > a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort > the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, > solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program > a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die > gallantly. Specialization is for insects." Robert Heinlein > > Free Hobby Buy/Swap/Sell Website > www.cyberg8t.com/gunner/hsm/index.html > > Home Page > http://userzweb.lightspeed.net/gunner ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: FS-Shaper Located in Florida From: Robert Bastow <"teenut (remove)"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 01:34:52 GMT -------- "T.Trott" wrote: > > Basement???? > You obviously have never been to Florida, the watertable is about 6" below > the sod!! > > That is..when it isn't six inches above it! teenut ======== Newsgroups: alt.machines.cnc,alt.machines.misc,comp.robotics.misc,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lathe/mill/drill group purchase is rolling - join us. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut (remove)"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 01:43:37 GMT -------- Thank you Mike. It took someone with a well developed sense of the ridiculous, to sum up what every one else was trying...but couldn't quite...put into words.! Many, many, words!! 8^) teenut Mike Simard wrote: > Robert, you might miss out on the juggernaut that turns a $500 hobby toy into a > $490 finely crafted machine tool with full support! > Mike Simard ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Change of Email address From: Robert Bastow <"teenut (remove)"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 01:47:53 GMT -------- Ah Ha!! If you had said that in the first place.....! Clue???? ?8^{ Teenut John Miller wrote: > > Robert Bastow <"teenut (remove)"@ hotmail.com> wrote in message > news:BsqU3.4747$Ur4.75898@news.rdc1.tn.home.com... > > I have read and re-read your message Jim..Looking for a clue! ?8^( > > > If you would but follow his advice, you could find it at clue@teenut.com! > > jm ======== Newsgroups: alt.machines.cnc,alt.machines.misc,comp.robotics.misc,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lathe/mill/drill group purchase is rolling - join us. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 02:09:43 GMT -------- Er..Didn't YOU know that? teenut Cass wrote: > > I like to learn: are you saying that the 3n1 machines are junk and > toys? > > I know that they will not compare to stand-alone machines costing many > thousands of dollars but you call the 3n1s toys? > > Cass > > -- > x-no-archive: yes > > Robert Bastow <"teenut (remove)"@ hotmail.com> wrote in message > news:dDqU3.4752$Ur4.76055@news.rdc1.tn.home.com... > > Thank you Mike. > > > > It took someone with a well developed sense of the ridiculous, to > sum up what > > every one else was trying...but couldn't quite...put into words.! > > > > Many, many, words!! > > > > 8^) > > > > teenut > > > > Mike Simard wrote: > > > > > Robert, you might miss out on the juggernaut that turns a $500 > hobby toy into a > > > $490 finely crafted machine tool with full support! > > > Mike Simard ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Warning, Buying From Teenut.. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 03:36:27 GMT -------- What Rick is trying to say, Gentle Readers, is that the delicate and precise (and expensive) piece of equipment he purchased from me, arrived in good shape..thanks to teenut's Cabinet (Casket?) Making Skills, and in spite of the best efforts of UPS!! Thanks Rick. teenut RStolz5833 wrote: > > Don't buy anything from him!!!!!! You will have to recharge your cordless at > least twice to get it apart. Have enough styro. to insulate a 1400 sq ft. > attic. 8000 drywall screws, and enough wood to build your daughter a hope > chest. > > Item was 8 # packing was 56# Or something like that.. > > Thanks Robert > Rick ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: atlas parts wanted From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 03:39:54 GMT -------- Mike, If you finally got a lathe worth talking about, and it is your first and it is all YOURS..it ain't going to get more perfect!! Enjoy! Congratulations!! 8^) teenut mact wrote: > > Finally got a lathe worth talking about, but it ain't prefect yet. > I need a steady rest and follower rest wouldn't hurt. > thanks > Mike ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OFF topic minimal metal content..Squirel fishing From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 03:47:28 GMT -------- Wonderful!! There is new confidence that our education system is turning out people with the "Right Stuff" and renewed hope for our competitive future! Seriously..can you see this stuff being condoned at U of Bejing!!...First thing you have to learn about Engineering is how to laugh at it..otherwise it will kill you! Thanks Don, 8^) teenut Don Wilkins wrote: > > The minimal metal content is a key (like for a lock). > > For you who are a bit long in the tooth this might remind you of some > of the nonsense that occupied your time when you should have been > studying. For others it might create a longing for the time when a > pursuit such as this was one of the more important things in life. For > some a reminder of the time when you weren't beating the wolf from the > door. > > If you don't have a sense of humor hit the delete key now otherwise > > for a laugh....... > > http://www.eecs.harvard.edu/~yaz/en/squirrel_fishing.html > > Flames for an off topic post via email please. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Favorite Graffiti From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 03:51:18 GMT -------- I really do need to be more careful of the way I word things around you guys! What I MEANT to say wa....Aw forget it!! teenut william thomas powers wrote: > > >> If I were a band member, I would be ready to take one of them out with a > >> clarinet. > >> > >I would make sure it was well greased and a comfortable fit up my ass first! > >teenut > > Teenut; its nice of you to offer this service; but you need to tell > us where you're at and what hours you are available for the go/no go > test. > > Thomas just reading what the fellow wrote! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: DoAll Saw Blade Butt Welder Problem From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 04:22:16 GMT -------- David Bush wrote: > That is how this one is trying to weld, but the blades never join. There is still a > gap between the blades. > > > It is kind of a ratchet/escapement mechanism on mine, and requires VERY > > tricky adjustment. Also, the spring(s) that apply pressure closing the blade ends > > together need to apply just the right force. Too much and the upset gets lumpy, > > too little could cause the gap to not close quickly enough, leading to blowing > > holes in the weld area. > > I am beginning to think that this is where my lies. It acts like the timing is not > correct. It might help, to understand that this process..called "Flash Butt Welding" is not a FUSION process per se..but more akin to the old Blacksmith's "Forge Welding" process..which takes place just below the melting point of the material. Electical power is used, simply to heat the blade ends to a temperature, well below fusion, but to a point where, WITH THE POWER SWITCHED OFF..the mechanical energy of suddenly forcing the ends together is converted to enough heat to further plasticize the metal and allow it to FORGE WELD together. Timing is critical. There is usually a short period during which the two ends creep slowly together..the current flow is insufficient to heat them to fusion, but the sparking between the two (relatively) uneven faces is sufficient to burn off any irregularities. There may even be a "Make and Break" cyclical movement of the faces together and apart, to promote this surface sparking. Once the two surfaces are evenly enough in contact to promote steady flow of current, the "heating proper" begins and as I said earlier the current is then switched OFF, an instant before the forging pressure is applied. If the power remains one for an instant too long, the combination of forging pressure temperature rise and resistance heating will push the joint "Over the Top". Fusion, even vaporisation will occur, and the joint..if indeed one survives, will have a "Blown" appearance The control of this process can be simply a timer in a "simple" application like bandsaw welding...or it can be as complex as all getout on a large, versatile, flash butt welding machine. Hope this helps. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: RCM is NOT the worst group on the net From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 04:24:34 GMT -------- Mike, You have been hanging around with the likes of teenut too long! 8^) teenut mike II wrote: > > Response To:mulligan@advinc.com > who, after deep thought, wrote: > > #Hey. We can do juvenile here. And damn well, I am sure. > #Don't sell us short! > > No We Can't, and if we want your obviously biased, near-sighted, self > serving, borderline lunatic, almost as smart as a potato pancake > opinion we will darn well ask for it, Miscreant! > > like that? ;-) > > mike ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Rifling Leads From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 07:12:40 GMT -------- Commercial, practical rifling leads go all the way from 1turn in 6" to 1 in 72" or more. generated by: Single point methods for cut rifling.. Spiral gear train Sine bar rifling machine master spiral and follower copying old barrel with cast in follower Multi point methods...... broaching Button rifling Hammer forging Pictures of machines... Few and far between that would tell you anything useful!! Very little on the net. Try a search on barrel rifling and rifle barrel, there is only one site I have found where a barrel maker goes into much more detail than "we drill, ream and then rifle"! There is one site, in England, that goes into a bit more detail and actuall has a photo of an old Pratt & Whitney Mk 1 Sine bar rifling machine sat forlornly outside a Scottish barn. You are not going to build one from that photo!! Very few Gunsmithing books give more than a half a cursury page on the actual rifling machines...and I think I have a copy of every book ever published on the subject. Building up a knowledge base on the subject has taken me about forty years and That is only a cursury knowledge. If all you want to do, is make a shootable muzzle loading rifle barrel, get a copy of Ned Roberts "The Muzzle Loading Cap Lock Rifle"..find out how the old smiths did it with string and a roller to lay out the pitch!! The methods worked then and still do! If what you have in mind is a modern, high powered target or hunting rifle barrel..Good Luck!! The few people that REALLY know how to do it are not about to tell you a great deal. Your searches may lead you to a couple of books published by Hoffman Publishing, purporting to tell in detail how to build the equipment and Make rifle barrels...be warned,,the material is badly presented, badly written, badly spelled, badly edited and even badly printed! Having already read pretty well everything ever written on the subject, I can tell you..so has this guy, and some of it is copied verbatim, stupid errors included, from people who never made a barrel..repeated by someone who I seriously doubt ever made one either!! teenut sunworshiper wrote: > > Does anyone know the range of leads for rifling? > And the many ways of generating them? > Any pictures of machines? > > The Sun shines , people forget. > > Without the Sun none of us would be here. > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Change of Email address From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 15:59:41 GMT -------- Veronica? How the hell are you? Where the hell have you been? I was getting worried. teenut Veronica Parsons wrote: > > > sweetness@teenut.com. For example. > > > > Must be a different teenut your thinking of ;) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Moving a Bridgeport/Stonehenge From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 19:22:40 GMT -------- I'll bet nobody knocks THOSE guys out of the lunch line, with a clarinet!! teenut STJ28 wrote: > > As a follow up to my earlier note re: riggers and ancient technology many > "experts" have lived in librarys so long that they have no concept of brute > force and ingenuity. Years ago when we had a new machine delivered to the shop > a couple of the Bridgeports were in the way so this refrigerator size rigger > takes a 4" strap puts it around his waist and under the knee. Then he gets his > shoulder under the tail end of the ram, grabs the strap and proceeds to waltz > this mill across the floor without rollers etc! > > During my close to 20 years of prepping SCCA formula fords, Atlantics etc. we > discovered that four good sized guys could lift a ford off the ground. One year > at the runoffs we were paddocked next to Dan Gurney's operation and rather > scarred them as we rountinely put our cars on jack stands without a jack. (We > were a bunch of big Minnesota boys, except for the driver) Opening long neck > beers with our teeth made them nervous as well. > > PS: two guys with a chain and a four inch timber can change an engine in 20 > minutes. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Pillar Drills From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 19:35:34 GMT -------- Totally relaxed here too. More so when people spell my name right! So what IS a "Pillar Drill" Ross? 8^) teenut jimmyjava wrote: > > Sorry Tony > That message was supposed to go to Barstow. I gat your names mixed up > Many apologies > Ross > > Tony Jeffree wrote: > > > On Fri, 05 Nov 1999 17:18:52 GMT, jimmyjava > > wrote: > > > > >You should really learn to relax Tony > > > > > > > > > > > No problem there ;-) > > > > Regards, > > Tony > > > > Website: http://www.jeffree.u-net.com/ > > When replying, delete "X." from the Email address to remove anti-SPAM measures. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Change of Email address From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 19:36:46 GMT -------- That my dear boy, is a question a Gentleman NEVER asks of a Lady!! teenut Tony Jeffree wrote: > > On Fri, 05 Nov 1999 15:59:41 GMT, Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ > hotmail.com> wrote: > > >Veronica? > > > >How the hell are you? > > > >Where the hell have you been? > > > >I was getting worried. > > > >teenut > > You're slipping, Teenut... > > You forgot the "..and who have you been there with??" > > ;-) > > Regards, > Tony > > Website: http://www.jeffree.u-net.com/ > When replying, delete "X." from the Email address to remove anti-SPAM measures. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: (no subject) From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 19:45:25 GMT -------- PLONK jimmyjava wrote: > > Take a friggin pill will ya Rob. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How leave a lug on barrel? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 20:06:20 GMT -------- Couple or three different ways Clark..depending on the type of barrel, quality pressure and the century you are working in ( 8^)..kinda!) Shot gun barrels can be forged to rough shape, with the "Lump" as an integral part of it, or a cheaper way is to dovetail and braze the lump on afterwards. "Monobloc" double barrels have a solid breech piece machined to shape and bored through for two tubes to be soldered in place...you can usually tell this type by the little ring of engraving around the barrels..about three inches up from the breech face, and put there to hide the joint. Not as "High class" as the chopper lump but better than the soldered on lumps. Some surprisingly expensive doubles are done this way (IIRC, Beretta for example) On High pressure barrels..Thompson Center Contender and other break action types, the manufacture will start with either a solid chunk or a forging..depending on volume..and simply cut away all the bits that don't look like a barrel with a lump on the side!! Making one yourself...Get (or make) a barrel blank big enough around to accomodate the lug, (or sight base or sling swivel or what ever) Turn it in the lathe to leave full diameter "islands" where you want your lump to be. Transfer to mill or shaper, betwenn centers and cut away all the bits that you don't need. Take to bench and finish with files, blending and polishing as required. No real "easy" way to do a good quality job! teenut Clark Magnuson wrote: > > If you are making a gun barrel, how do you leave a lug on the barrel on > one side of the barrel and make it small and round on the other side? > Clark ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Where can I get custom ream? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 21:41:27 GMT -------- I doubt that you would get any kind of taper reamer to survive that operation Clark. In effect you are asking it to take an 18" long cut? The torque would be enormous. Add to that the cost of a special reamer..Guessing at $1000.00 plus..Do you REALLY need to do it that way? Might I ask..What ARE you trying to achieve..there has to be an easier way! teenut Clark Magnuson wrote: > > I need an 18" ream to follow a pilot hole and cut a tapered hole from 1" > down to 3/8" in aluminum on a Jet 13x40GHL. What would be a good source? > Clark ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Warning, Buying From Teenut.. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 05 Nov 1999 21:52:17 GMT -------- Dead Right! With the Garbage Pickup Fees being what they are around here, it was cheaper to ship 'em to Wisconsin! teenut John Flanagan wrote: > > On Fri, 05 Nov 1999 03:36:27 GMT, Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ > hotmail.com> wrote: > > >What Rick is trying to say, Gentle Readers, is that the delicate and precise > >(and expensive) piece of equipment he purchased from me, arrived in good > >shape..thanks to teenut's Cabinet (Casket?) Making Skills, and in spite of the > >best efforts of UPS!! > > > >Thanks Rick. > > > >teenut > > What Teenut is trying to say, Gentle Readers, is that he had bags and > bags of these peanuts laying around and had to get rid of them somehow > and just couldn't bear to throw anything with a value of more than 50¢ > away. Suddenly, opportunity knocked :) . ======== Newsgroups: alt.machines.cnc,alt.machines.misc,comp.robotics.misc,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Sherline Revisited From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 00:47:39 GMT -------- I wish you every bit if good luck you are going to need..if you think that is going to be the new order of "Things according to Cass" teenut "[©ØMMÄÑУ®]" wrote: > > Saving $50? I'm sorry, but Cass does have a supplier that is willing to sell > a $1000 machine for $500. That's 50% off, and a savings of around $500. As I > have stated before, I purchased optics at %10 their original price through a > group purchase by Cass. > > Regards, > > Robin > > Jon Banquer wrote in message > news:s26lcemehpc92@corp.supernews.com... > > Jim, > > > > > I'm busy trying to figure out exactly how many NEW customer's I'll have > if I > > > cut my SHERLINE prices to 35% below MY cost. > > > > I'm sure Cass will tell you that you will make it up on volume. :) > > > > If this is a hobby for Cass and possible crew, why the hell would they > want > > to make such a huge fuss about saving a few bucks on a machine when it's > the > > machining knowledge they should be after ??? > > > > Isn't the whole idea to gain skills and make stuff, not save a lousy $50 > > bucks ?? It's a hobby for them, ain't it ??? Is it me or is this really > misplaced > > priorities ?? If this so called "group" REALLY wants to save, they should > > buy used machines and help each other out rebuilding them !!! This guy is > > thinking save a few pennies and completely missing what the real return > > on his investment is. > > > > I don't get it but them maybe I'm just a shmu.....you know how it goes. :) > > > > Look Jim, I didn't even change the subject !!! > > > > jon ( I don't sell machine tools. ) > > > > > > > > > > > > > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Warning, Buying From Teenut.. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 00:52:10 GMT -------- Loren Coe wrote: > this is a very readable thread, but it makes me wonder if this ng is > some kind of "good 'ole boys" club? > Loren Damn right it is..but it is one that anyone can join! > > < do you use KILLFILES? if no, you should. are they fully implemented > > < and easy to use on your system/isp/news reader? if no, you should find > > < out why, complain, change news readers or isp's. rn or trn will add > > < a subject with two keystrokes (^A, j), fully killing all present and > > < future posts to the thread being viewed. now, THAT'S a NEWSREADER !!! > THIS is not the way to join! 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Group Purchases From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 00:54:59 GMT -------- Ned..save your breathe! We Know! He Knows! The twain shall never meet! teenut Ned Simmons wrote: > > I must be missing something very basic here. > > You're not consolidating orders, you're supplying the vendor with a "list > of members". You're giving him no guarantee that any of these folks will > actually buy anything, but you want him to make a concession on price > because they are members of a "group". > > From the vendor's perspective the participants on this NG are just as > valid a group as yours. If he were inclined to offer machines at a > discount, why would your group be more attractive to him than the > population of the NG at large? All you are doing is taking a poll of who > may be interested in a yet to be detemined 3-in-1. Why does the vendor > need you? He has the same access to the newsgroups as you. > > I should think that your group is *less* attractive. If he offers the > machines to the NG in general and there is a great response, the worse > that can happen is that those that are disappointed because he runs out > of stock may have to wait for him to restock. > > The members of your group have an expectation that there will be a > machine for them when they send their money in. If he buys a machine for > each "member" and some don't follow thru, he's stuck with excess > inventory. If he figures on this, but misjudges and doesn't buy enough, > peopled are going to be pissed off. > > If you were taking substantial non-refundable deposits and forwarding > them to the vendor with the understanding that he will stock enough > machines to supply your "members", that would be a different matter, but > apparently that is not the case. > > My point is that any dealer could make the same offer to this NG in > general, that he might make to your group. You don't have a proprietary > client list you can offer, you have the same access to usenet that he > does. You're not taking care of any bookeeping, you're not easing the > hassle of numerous individual shipments. You're offering him nothing but > headaches. > > So sign me up for one of those machines, if I like the deal you > negotiate, and if I have any money when the time comes, and if my wife > doesn't find out, and if the Moon is in the second house and Mercury > aligns with Mars, maybe I'll buy one if I still feel like it. > > Ned Simmons > > In article <7vva97$9q1$0@dosa.alt.net>, cassegrainian@galaxycorp.com > says... > > Sorry, but that is wrong. > > > > We have a purchase order form and we will provide a list of members to > > the vendor. > > We will not accept any monies. People will send their money directly > > to the vendor of choice. > > > > We are plain and simply gathering new customers for the company that > > we decide upon. We are un-paid and will try to negotiate the best > > deal that we can. That is the American way. > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Group Purchases From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 01:02:41 GMT -------- And YOU PERSONALLY are going to guarantee that everyone on the "list" is going to take delivery and pay the balance? If not...Who is? And if you say.."That is the Business Risk the Vendor takes" I promise you I am going to puke all over you in public!! 8^) teenut John Miller wrote: > I think what you *might* be missing is that the vendor would be supplied > with a list of pre-sold firm orders, as opposed to a group of prospects. ======== Newsgroups: alt.machines.cnc,alt.machines.misc,comp.robotics.misc,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Group Purchases From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 01:39:43 GMT -------- Dear God! This "Cass" guy must have sweet tasting shit...here comes another ass licker! Please leave us alone..we have tried so hard to be polite and reasonable..but even this group of Paragons has its limit! Go..Buy your "Stuff"..be happy! We wish you no ill will..just that you be GONE! teenut In case you wonder... It is not your desire to "Get Something Cheap".... It is not your preference for, or defense of, any particular configuration of machine... It is not your Elmer Gantry style promotion of the "Free Enterprise: system... Nor your Jim Bakker..."Whine Me" style of defensiveness... It's not your O J Simpson style of "Injured Innocence" Or your Richard Nixon style of "plausible denial"...(We have you "on tape" from your very first posting...) It is just a "Gut Feeling" that pisses us off..."Cass et al"..... And that is...That you think we are STUPID!! We have been the "Polite Hosts" for far too long! Please leave us alone now.. Before things get Ugly! Thank you, 8^) teenut "[©ØMMÄÑУ®]" wrote: > > Mr. Smith, > > Cass owns his own small business, so it would not be unreasonable for him to > be both an engineer and a purchasing agent. > > I find Cass to be quite genuine. I have enjoyed more than one of his group > purchases, and am VERY VERY satisfied with it. As I have stated, I now own > over $2000 worth of high-power CO2 laser optics of the highest quality, that > I paid $200 for. You may not see this as much of a discount, but I would > have to say that paying 10% of what something is worth would be a > considerable savings. > > BTW, these optics were purchased from Laser Research Optics, > http://www.optics-r-us.com/. This company supplies optics to medical laser > producers. As such, their optics must be of the highest quality. (You don't > want a lens to shatter when your working on someone. The results are less > than pretty) > > If you have doubts as to my validity, I would be a happy to talk to you via > privet e-mail or ICQ. My e-mail address is lasernerd@hotmail.com and my ICQ# > is 18918288. I encourage you to contact me. > > I have never found Cass to be *under the table* or incapable of being > trusted. He will also be purchasing one of these machines, and it would be > in his, and everyone else's best interests for him to set up a deal with a > good dealer on a good machine. > > Many people have asked for the specifications of the machine in question. > There is currently no machine in question. Cass is investigating machines, > and when he sees one worth his, and the group members money, he will post > these specs. > > I find it odd that you find Cass' language inappropriate. He is attempting > to address you, and everyone else, with respect. Anything less would be > unacceptable. > > Finally, I must ask you why you are so against this group purchase. Right > now, it is merely an idea. No one is obligated, in ANY way, to purchase a > machine right now, as there is no machine to speak of. Major purchases like > this take time to research and organize. > > Regards, > > Robin Stoddart > lasernerd@hotmail.com > ICQ# 18918288 > > Fred Smith wrote in message > news:NjcjOC8uIhsyhcLOh8QdTGAQ72t=@4ax.com... > > On Fri, 5 Nov 1999 13:26:18 -0600, "Cass" > > wrote: > > First he was an electrical engineer now he is a purchasing agent. > > > > smarmy spam "how convenient" > > > > Cass you are as genuine as the people that call and say they work for > > Ameritech(phone company), but don't know what kind of phone service I > > have. You may not be a liar, but there is a certain lack of veracity > > to your words. > > > > No one is asking me to join the group, yet I receive every one of your > > stinking smarmy spams every day. You have worn out your welcome long > > ago. Your methods are distasteful, your motives are suspect, and your > > approach is not above board. > > > > The language you use is almost verbatim from the press releases from > > the likes of the NIH, the Department of the Interior, the Justice > > Department, and all the other agencies affected by the BIG liars in > > the White House. It is insincere, elitist and leaves a bad taste in > > my mouth. > > > > I encourage all who have been drawn in by your smooth rhetoric to > > closely examine the music before they follow the pied piper. > > > > My company is NOT associated with ANY of the makers of the small > > machines, we do not sell machinery, and we have NO relationship with > > any of them. I suggest that they be extremely careful when dealing > > with you as your actions, motives, and words are suspect. They remind > > me of all the things they tell the old people to avoid scams that take > > away their life savings. I have many friends and customers who are > > both hobbyists and professional metal workers. I encourage all of > > them to be very cautious if dealing with the likes of you and your so > > called "group". > > > > > > > > > > Best Regards, > > > > Fred Smith > > IMService > > > > imserv@imsrv.com > > > > Voice: 248-486-3600 or 800-386-1670 > > Fax: 248-486-3698 ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How leave a lug on barrel? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 02:07:52 GMT -------- Clark Magnuson wrote: > > Thanks for the response. I don't have a shaper or mill. Is there > grinding from an indexed lathe possible? Would that cost more than a > mill? How do you get the mill to go around in a semi circle? > Clark Yer gotta crank hard on the steering!! (Sorry Clark..it was just too good to miss!..Forgive Me!!) Grinding is an option..but to shift that amount of metal, from scratch (No pun intended) is a High Horsepower, "Industrial Undertaking" (Lordy..I wish I knew what you are trying to make..and with what equipment!!..It would make this SO much easier!!) "Rectilinear" milling (Old... Mid 19th Century term for cutting curved paths)..is eminently possible on a mill, shaper or grinder. All you need is a center (axis) about which to turn the work...While the cutter does its job...A means to effect and CONTROL that turning (Wormwheel, worm and Crank), or simply a BFH (large handle 8^) )..and some means of stopping the rotation when you have gone far enough! Dividing heads, rotary tables, etc., provide the usual conventional means. But magnificent work has been done by people using just dead centers, a lathe dog and a BFH to control rotational movement, with blocks of scrap steel and toolmakers clamps or vise grips to limit the arc of movement. Now, Clark, to prevent me having to write a complete treatise on "Rectilinear"..(or more properly "Arcuate") machining..and, possibly disappearing up my OWN rectum in the process...PLEASE tell us what you want to make..and what means you have at your disposal!! 8^) Ta s'much! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Change of Email address From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 02:15:46 GMT -------- Jim Stewart wrote: no > offense intended. This time. Absolutely none taken...This time (or for a few more times Jim) > > Seriously, a personal domain name is, in a way, the key to freedom. You > got a problem with a predatory, incompetent ISP? Change to another. Of > course, your email address will change, you'll lose contact with some of > your friends, etc. etc. I like the idea. > > And, as I said, teenut.com is available... And just WHAT do you mean to imply by that, Young Man???? I may be free..but I don't come cheap!! ;^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Group Purchases From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 02:19:00 GMT -------- Cassy, Dear Girl! You never met "Bob" I can promise you never want to! teenut Cass wrote: > > Bobby, > > Forgive me but I thought puking is what you had been doing each time > you post ;) > > By the way, Bobby, are you on our group purchasers list? Also, have > you been on any ledges and craning your neck, lately? > > Just a poor attempt at humor, Bobby. It has been a long week. > > Cass > > Anyone wishing to join our group purchase for a 3n1 lathe/mill/drill, > simply email cassegrainian@galaxycorp.com and put LATHE/MILL in the > subject line. > > -- > x-no-archive: yes > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote in message > news:R6LU3.5099$Ur4.84848@news.rdc1.tn.home.com... > > And YOU PERSONALLY are going to guarantee that everyone on the > "list" is going > > to take delivery and pay the balance? > > > > If not...Who is? > > > > And if you say.."That is the Business Risk the Vendor takes" I > promise you I am > > going to puke all over you in public!! > > > > 8^) > > > > teenut > > > > > > > > John Miller wrote: > > > > > I think what you *might* be missing is that the vendor would be > supplied > > > with a list of pre-sold firm orders, as opposed to a group of > prospects. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Toolholder From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 02:26:48 GMT -------- Before you "Splash the cash" Gilles... The AXA size (IIRC..the smaller size than the 200) will be more than "man enough" for your 12 x 30..It will allow you to get into tighter corners..and save you money!! (It will take 1/2" shanks) FWIW teenut Gilles Jalbert wrote: > > I'm buying a toolholder for my Standard Modern 12 x 30 with Phase2 (piston) > size 200 toolpost. So far I know I want I want positive rake and 1/2" shank > size, but I'm undecided on the type of insert and clamping system. > Any suggestions from the group would be appreciated. > > Gil ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Pillar Drills From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 03:06:18 GMT -------- My apologies for being my usual blunt (some say "snippy") self! It is not easy to always bear in mind, when asking a group like this, what might appear to be a "simple: question"..that it is a truly International gathering.."separated by a common language". I was brought up to know a "Pillar Drill" as a pretty hefty piece of equipment...heavier than a "drill press"...a massive, square columned geared head, tee slotted tabled, 5 hp 2" capacity, single spindle drill..one step down from a radial arm drill. Not what you had in mind at all!! One the other hand, the name has also been applied to a very much lighter device..typified by George Thomas' "Universal Pillar Tool"..a handy little combination of a light bench drill (Another Name!!) and a heavy Jewellers staking tool. The little jobbie you have in mind is even lighter than this and transcends "Sensitive drill" (A Yorkshire "PIN Drill" = US "Bench drill")...Do you see how complicated this can become? I really wasn't trying to be a smart ass..(well I wasn't trying HARD to be a smart ass anyway)..when I asked you to define YOUR understanding of the name!!) From your description, you seem to be looking for a Horologist/Watchmaker/Instrument maker's style of drill..Belt driven from a small, bench mounted, motor, at the rear..via twin, "up an' over" jockey pulleys etc., etc. Feed via finger pressure, directly on a little free wheeling, knurled knob, mounted directly on the spindle..which is in turn fitted with an adjustable, counter balancing arm. George H Thomas' "Sensitive Pillar Drill" is right on the top end, "weight wise" of "that which you seek" It is available, in kit form, from Hemingway in the UK and the "Words and Music", by GHT in his chrystal clear writing style, is available from Tee Publishing. (if you have any problem finding them on the net..contact me off list) The "Universal Pillar Tool" would certainly meet the most demanding of sensitive feed requirements..As designed, it is lever fed, but to modify it to a counter balanced, finger tip feed would not be difficult. Hope that helps. Now! Just what the hell do you mean by a POST drill!! ;^) teenut Jimmyjava wrote: > > Ok Rob > Like I said in my second post about this thing the spindle is spring loaded and you use > finger pressure to push the drill through the workpiece. The spindle is slotted and > driven by a small pulley with a key in it that engages the keyway in the spindle. They > are not large, sized about right for Sherlines, Unimats and the like. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Pillar Drills From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 15:27:30 GMT -------- That is my understanding of the term too. Delightful examples of pre-industrial art..and fetching a fortune now among the Blacksmith/knifesmith fraternity. There are also Post (or pillar) vises (or vices!!) Similar to a Leg Vise, but designed to be fastened to a vertical column, rather than a bench. You are right about the gloves though...but they do fit my criteria because they are one of the few machines that stop when you say "Ouch"!! 8^) teenut Jack Erbes wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > Just what the hell do you mean by a POST drill!! > > > > Post drills are a common family of old (first quarter of the century or > so) drilling mechanisms (many hand powered) that could be mounted to > posts (which could also be called or pillars) in shops or barns. That > was a good choice of machine in a dirt floored shop and got them to a > convenient height for applying rotary and downfeed pressure. > > They faded away in favor of the drill press as near as I can tell. > > The biggest advantage of the manually powered post drill was that you > could wear gloves while you were operating it. > > -- > Jack in Sonoma, CA, USA (jack@vom.com) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Newbie: SB Shaper From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 16:24:27 GMT -------- Congratulations George. Welcome to the world of "Real Machinists" ;8) See my individual comments below..and enjoy your new toy..er tool! George Glines wrote: > > Just uncrated, cleaned up, and changed the oil on my just arrived South Bend > 7" shaper. Runs great. Somewhere under many coats of badly applied paint > and rust is a beautiful machine. BTW, in addition to the Lindsay reprint of > the manual, South Bend will send you a Xerox'd copy for free. > > Stupid Questions: No such animal is recognised here! > > 1. Anyone know when South Bend stopped making these? The gal at South > Bend wasn't sure. > > 2. What's up with the slots in the table? They aren't T-slots, so you > must use the holes and regular bolts. What's the point of the slots then? The slots are use for alignment purposes..vices, centers, jigs etc., You will find the matrix of tapped holes more versatile even than tee slots on a small table like this. Feel free to drill and tap more! > > 3. Are toolholders still available? I need the toolholder that the > toolbits clamp into. (The toolholder then clamps into the toolpost) Use 1/2" or 3/8" square HSS tool bits held directly in the lantern clamp..Far more rigid than a tool holder. The only "Shaper" type tool holders I have and use include a Williams rotating turret toolholder that allows the 1/4" square bit to be set at a variety of angles right round the clock almost...good for firkling in odd corners. I also have a 1/2" diameter bar holder for keywaying and just picked up a 3/4" diameter similar one on ebay. That is as good a source as any for such stuff. Go to the Library and request a copy of "Treatise on Planers"..By The Cincinatti Milling Machine Co. It may well be available as a reprint from Lindsays. I have made do with a dog eared photo copy for years..Just got a pristine example off Ebay for under ten bucks! This is a "Degree Level" course, for ALL machinists, in setting up, clamping, special tooling, fixturing etc. A great book, even if you never envisage using a Planer or Shaper. Useful even for the 5 axis CNC machining crowd!!! > 4. The machine has 4 speeds. Why? It doesn't seem like you could overheat > a toolbit at even the fastest speed. As you learn to know and love your little shaper, you will find uses for the full range of speeds. Indeed..along with a drill press, the shaper ranks as the hottes candidate for a variable speed drive in my shop! However, you will soon find the need for different speeds for steel, cast iron and aluminum cutting. with HSS tools and with carbide tips too. The main point to understand is that the speed changes regulate the NUMBER OF STROKES PER MINUTE!! So that the actual cutting speed in surface feet per minute depends upon the LENGTH of STROKE!! You will want to use a fast speed when you are using a 1" stroke and a much slower speed for the full 7" stroke. Enjoy! 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Help me with web site From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 16:28:12 GMT -------- Hmm! A good start would be a URL that works!! ?;^) Good luck on the project, and keep us abreast of developments. teenut David Heaney wrote: > > I have recently started building a web site that, if things go as planned, > will be a > very good resource for machinists / metalworkers / toolmakers. > I need input from others to make it a success. > Check it out. > Thank you. > David H. > http://dedtru1.members.easyspace.com/index.htm > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Mill Buy a grizzly G-108 and never look back! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 16:32:59 GMT -------- Roy Bertalotto wrote: (Three times :^)...) > > Buy a Grizzly G-1008 and never look back! Grab the stick and pull it back! Grab the stick and pull it back! Grab... 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Boxford Lathe for sale - UK From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 16:39:48 GMT -------- Nice lathe! Will it float? 8^) teenut (In Atlanta GA) Gary Wooding wrote: > > Boxford CUD 5"x24" lathe on manufacturer's cabinet. Imperial leadscrew with > dual imp/metric dials. Full set change wheels, 4-way toolpost, 3-jaw (2 > sets of jaws) and 4-jaw chucks. £1100. Vertical slide also available > £150. > Buyer collects - Warwick area. > > -- > > Gary Wooding > > - ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Toolholder From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 16:50:43 GMT -------- I just had a breakthrough in thinking on the subject of inserted tip tools and QC toolholders for the small lathe.. DUH!! Instead of buying (at a premium price), small (1/2" sq) tools to fit the AXA style tool holders I already make myself, I have bought several LARGE tools...1" and 1 1/4" square...for under 10 bucks apiece. Cut to length and machine the tool post dovetail right in the side of the tool shank, add a height adustable stop...bingo!! Cheap and rigid (enough for a small lathe) Big tips are cheaper and easier to find on sale than little ones too. As I said.. DUH!! Jack Erbes wrote: > > Many people here have had great luck making their own holders, I should > try that too. > > -- > Jack in Sonoma, CA, USA (jack@vom.com) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 'Hobby' lathes From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 17:00:17 GMT -------- Real good point there Ted! A useful point to hold in mind..and one which often escapes we HSMers..Far better to get a small, high quality machine, that will do 90% of our machining and "Put Out" the odd large job. Too often we try to get machines "Big enough for everything" Let me tell you...Such a machine doesn't exist!! So we finish up buying, hauling, rigging, installing and tooling up a machine that we don't need 90% of the time..and then find it STILL isn't big enough! 8^) teenut Ted Edwards wrote: My wife pointed out that if we got the > Smithy, I could go to a professional machine shop for the odd job that > was too big/fine/accurate/whatever for my own machine. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 'Hobby' lathes From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 17:58:10 GMT -------- John Miller wrote: > Point well taken. So how small is still "big enough" for the 90%? My > concern with the small lathes is not so much their dimensional capacity as > their lack of "grunt." "Grunt" I take it is the ability to hog metal off! Bear in mind, that every machining job ends with a fine finishing cut..! If your big "Grunter" can hog off metal and finish to fine limits..great! But it is going to cost an arm and a leg more than buying TWO machines...A small precision lathe for finishing and a clapped out old "Scrap Yard Queen" for roughing things out to size. It is no coincidence, that in the hundred years of history enjoyed by HSMers, the lathe of choice..world-wide, has proved to be somewhere between 6" and 12" swing..Craftsman, Atlas, Portass, Zyto, Southbend, Myford, Boxford, Hurco...etc. The shop of most ESTABLISHED HSMers includes at least TWO even THREE lathes..This doesn't just point to a surfeit of either wealth or space..but rather to the fact that there IS no all round perfect "Machine for all seasons" When we are starting up, it is natural to want to be able to do "everything" for the minimum expenditure and in the limited space we may have available. Having "Started over" and equipped three or four Home Shops from scratch..I can assure you that that perfect machine doesn't exist except in the minds of certain machine purveyors. My Considered, non snobbish, experienced and caring advice to the beginner, is to start with a lathe of around 7" to 12" swing and a good book on "milling in the lathe without special equipment"!! Build up gradually from there as funds and space permit. Be patient and limit the scope of projects within reasonable expectations. Believe me.."It will Come" I know we live in an age of instant gratification..but if anyone wants to jump straight in and do everything from the get go..I would expect them to show me a 400 square foot empty shop space and a $20,000.00 cash budget before I wasted a minute of my time trying to advise them what to buy. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 'Hobby' lathes From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 18:46:06 GMT -------- Dan j Clingman wrote: > A machinist friend of mine told me once that he could make a living with > only a mill and saw. He didn't think it was true for the lathe. That is because he obviously didn't know how to use a lathe well enough! > > I think I would get the mill. With a horazontal/vertical rotary table > and boring head one can do 85% of what a lathe can do although not > nearly as well. That is because you don't either!! ;^) > I went the 3-1 way, and the first thing to get replaced was the mill. I > got a mill-drill. I never use the mill on the 3-1 any more. That is the usual progression..Don't you wish now you had bought one (or the other) at a time? > Respectfully, teenut ======== Newsgroups: alt.machines.cnc,alt.machines.misc,comp.robotics.misc,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Group Purchases EDIT NEWSGROUP LINE From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 18:57:43 GMT -------- Wake up and get off the line Frank...there is a train coming! Your LOOOOONG repetitive postings have nothing to do with robots either..this isn't the Robotics group..it is Rec.Crafts. Metalworking and the responses were to an idiot that insists on cross posting! I now see there are two of you! teenut "Frank G. Haymes" wrote: > > You need to edit your newsgroups. What does this have to do with robots. > > Frank G. Haymes > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Suicide Special From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 19:27:06 GMT -------- I thought Kavorkian was in jail! http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=194922759 teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Suicide Special From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 06 Nov 1999 23:15:35 GMT -------- Music? You hear music? I have my sound player permanently disabled! 8^) TS wrote: > > I especially loathe the cheesy music that comes on with the ad. Is it > shopping music? > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > I thought Kavorkian was in jail! > > > > http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=194922759 > > > > teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 'Hobby' lathes From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 07 Nov 1999 02:14:28 GMT -------- 300 usually nowadays..The old fart is loosing the reflexes for 500+ two handed threading! 8^) teenut Jim Stewart wrote: > > Alfred Kimmel wrote: > > > > Hi Steve > > I have one of the lathes you are talking about. I have the Grizzly model. > > You will note that the slowest speed of the lathe is 110 RPM this is too fast > > for you to close the half nuts and make a good thread. I am going to add a > > reduction to my lathe so I can cut threads. > > Hi, Al - my experience is the opposite. My lathe has a two-speed pulley > from the motor (which drives the 9-speed gearbox). Slowest speed is 60 > rpm, which I found to be a bit slow for threading after I got some > practice. I now use the faster pulley at 90 rpm quite happily. I > suspect it just takes a bit of practice. > > I seem to recall someone, probably teenut, saying he threads at 500 > rpm. Must be a treat to watch the virtuoso performance... > > -js > > -- > > http://www.strappe.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Drilling and rifling barrels From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 07 Nov 1999 02:54:14 GMT -------- Someone asked recently about rifle barrel making, and I referred to an article on the net, which is, IMHO the most comprehensive description I have found so far.. After diligent serching I managed to find it again... http://www.border-barrels.com/articles/bmart.htm It includes pictures of a sine bar rifling machine. Enjoy teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lathes vs mills From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 07 Nov 1999 03:00:48 GMT -------- Putting it quite simply.. A lathe, pound for pound, HP for HP, size for size, will shift far more metal than a mill and in terms of "roundy round bits" is far more versatile than any mill is for "flatty square bits" Therefor you don't need as many to cover the range and quantity of work to be done. teenut bulletbobb wrote: > > Almost every book or magazine article I've ever seen on what tools > should be bought first for a home shop states that a lathe should > be the first tool purchased, and I wouldn't disagree. Yet, when I > think of the shops I have been in mills outnumbered lathes by four > or five to one. Where I work now (I'm a mechanical designer for a > firm that makes analytical instruments) I do some shop work, and I'd > guess I spend 75% of my shop time on the mill. I wonder what it is > that HSM's do that makes a lathe so important, whereas in industry, > at least in my experience, the mill is more useful? > > * Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet's Discussion Network * > The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet - Free! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lathes vs mills From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 07 Nov 1999 05:49:59 GMT -------- No way could you make a mill with a mill...unless you like square bearings! A lathe with a lathe is possible and has been done..Many times. Making a lathe that "makes itself" is Gingery's whole principle. teenut James Harvey wrote: > > Jim : > > I think that quote was referring to a Mill. > > Jim Harvey > > Jim Grimes wrote in message ... > >Something I read somewhere once- > > > >A lathe is the only machine tool that can be used to duplicate itself or > any > >other machine tool. > >-- > >Jim N8QWX > >jim-from-akron@neo.rr.com > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Rifling Leads From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 07 Nov 1999 06:10:05 GMT -------- The Scottish company, Border Barrels, have added another page to their wesite since I last visited it, and now have some nice photos of their sine bar rifling machines. http://www.border-barrels.com/workshop.htm teenut Robert Bastow wrote: > There is one site, in England, that goes into a bit more detail and actuall has > a photo of an old Pratt & Whitney Mk 1 Sine bar rifling machine sat forlornly > outside a Scottish barn. You are not going to build one from that photo!! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: "CASS" - Troll or Irritant? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 07 Nov 1999 06:31:06 GMT -------- mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > Hmm. Granted. But here's the rub - he won't say who he is > negotiating with. I think more to the point, is that we don't even know who HE is. I don't care how good a deal sounds..I never send money to a PO box number..And I have a lingering DEEP DEEP suspicion of anyone hiding behind a "Nom de Scam" Most people who subscribe to this list either sign their name or include it in the heading. Until "Cass" Publishes a verifiable name and location, I for one will not take anything he says at face value. There IS a scam in there somewhere..I smell it, I sense it and I feel it "Tangibly"...So do a lot of other people. Not quite sure what it is..may never know...Don't need to know. It is sufficient to be aware of danger to avoid it. Coupled to that, is the oily smoothness of Cass' presentation..he is GOOD, plausible..Maybe early training as a Revivalist Preacher?? Every time I read one of his posts I get this composite picture of Elmer Gantry and Jim Bakker flash up on my radar screen. "There is something nasty in the castle yard.. "We know that it's there and we know who did it.. "All we need to know Cass; Is where did you hide it?" And just who the hell ARE you? teenut Robert Bastow Dunwoody, Atlanta GA...I'm in the book! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: "CASS" - Troll or Irritant? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 07 Nov 1999 07:11:19 GMT -------- With a name like that I doubt your SANITY!! "[©ØMMÄÑУ®]" wrote: > > I will assume that you also doubt my validity, though. > > Regards, ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Rifling Leads From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 07 Nov 1999 16:04:25 GMT -------- Border Barrels are in Scotland, Their web pages are a bit screwed up, in the there is no "Back" function on them..once you leave the Home page..you're screwed! This is the home page: Under "Articles" is as good a review of the barrel making procees as I have seen. teenut ppierce wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > The Scottish company, Border Barrels, have added another page to their wesite > > Nice page. I did note the name, Border Barrels, but no location, etc. > or > who the page is from. > > -- > Paul in AJ AZ, NRA Endowment Member MSC stockholder (150 shares) > Checkout http://www.dejanews.com > also("Dropbox")http://www.metalworking.com > Checkout (MWN)the Metal Web News at: http://www.mindspring.com/~wgray1/ > Checkout the FAQ at: http://w3.uwyo.edu/~metal ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: old Caftsman lathe From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 07 Nov 1999 16:20:09 GMT -------- The 12" refers to the largest diameter that can be swung over the bed. The lathe you are looking at is nominally a 12" x 36", which means it will swing 12" max diameter, over the bed (in front of the cross slide) and a piece 36" long between centers. No, that dosn't mean you can put a 12" diameter x 36" long cylinder in the lathe...the diameter or "swing" over the cross slide is somewhat less. Hey!..I didn't make the rules!! 8^) Hope you get it and enjoy it. teenut Mike hide wrote: > by the way the operating instructions spec it as follows"12 metal > turning lathes". > Presumably they refer to the width of the bed??? mjh ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Rigging From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 07 Nov 1999 16:28:05 GMT -------- Wouldn't this be just the "Cat's Meow" for getting your machines undergrou...Er!..In the basement!! http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=195717838 teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Flying insects From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 07 Nov 1999 17:12:13 GMT -------- If cooling of the sheet isn't an issue, try an "air curtain" Mosquitos don't like flying in a breeze. Perhaps an "air knife" would blow any remaining ones off before the squishy stage. teenut Mark Kinsler wrote: > > wrote: > >Is there a electronic/sonic device for repelling flying insects such as > >mosquitoes in the finishing sections of a Cold Rolling Mill. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lathes vs mills From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 07 Nov 1999 17:16:05 GMT -------- Now we are REALLY grabbing at straws!! ;^) teenut James Harvey wrote: > > Rotary Table? > > Jim Harvey > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> > wrote in message ... > >No way could you make a mill with a mill...unless you like square bearings! ======== Newsgroups: alt.machines.cnc,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Servo Based Retrofit System Keeps Getting Better !!! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 07 Nov 1999 21:51:49 GMT -------- This entire thread ,which is being cross posted to rec.crafts.metalworking for some reason, appears to be a conversation between two people on the Alt.machines.cnc group. It is kinda like listening to a couple in the next hotel room...no real interest, but you can't switch it off!! Can you cut the link on the next go around please guys. Thanks. 8^) teenut Mike Simard wrote: > > Oops, my last post showed Steve as saying most of the stuff I said, I don't know how > I managed to screw that up. > Mike Simard ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Suicide Special From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 07 Nov 1999 21:54:38 GMT -------- I read that with my blind eye ;^) teenut Gerald Miller wrote: > > Smartass! :-)} > > -- > > Gerry > London, Canada > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote in message > news:rE2V3.5663$Ur4.94602@news.rdc1.tn.home.com... > > Music? > > > > You hear music? > > > > I have my sound player permanently disabled! 8^) > > > > TS wrote: > > > > > > I especially loathe the cheesy music that comes on with the ad. Is it > > > shopping music? > > > > > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > > > > > I thought Kavorkian was in jail! > > > > > > > > http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=194922759 > > > > > > > > teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lathes vs mills From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 07 Nov 1999 21:57:21 GMT -------- You need new bearings in that lathe Gerry!! 8^o teenut Gerald Miller wrote: > > The C.I. base for the pattern follower for my wood lathe was made on my > 9"SB"A". It has 14 flat surfaces! :-)} > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lathes vs mills From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 07 Nov 1999 22:04:51 GMT -------- Right. Very passable milling can be done on a lathe, especially with a verticle slide. Until recently a milling machine was the exception, rather than the rule in Home machine shops, and most project instructions for live steamers etc., concentrated entirely on how to do all milling on the lathe. It is nice to have both, and yes, you CAN turn on a mill...but your enthusiasm for doing that would soon wain! teenut John Miller wrote: > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote in message news:ptiV3.5834 > > No way could you make a mill with a mill...unless you like square > bearings! > > So, let me see if I understand . . . a mill is better-suited for making some > things, and a lathe is better-suited for others, but the decision point for > picking a single machine revolves more around what is either impossible or > extremely difficult to make on a each. And the lathe wins on that count, > i.e., you can do a better job of milling on a lathe than you can do turning > on a mill. Right? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Flying insects From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 07 Nov 1999 22:07:52 GMT -------- Do I know you? teenut Arnold wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > If cooling of the sheet isn't an issue, try an "air curtain" Mosquitos don't > > like flying in a breeze. > > Haven't had many landing on you lately :) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lathes vs mills From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 04:15:14 GMT -------- Oh leave off Jim!! The conversation went pedantic along time ago! teenut James Harvey wrote: > > Really? And could you explain to me how you make the Knee and Table on a > Lathe? > > Jim Harvey > > B & L Denard wrote in message <01bf294f$3cb65240$9d2822d1@default>... > >The Lathe is The only Machine that will reproduce Its Self. also you have > >to have the lathe to build all other Machines ie Mill,ect.ect. > > Bill D. > > > >bulletbobb wrote in article > ><0a0133f8.c8808cf2@usw-ex0101-006.remarq.com>... > >> Almost every book or magazine article I've ever seen on what tools > >> should be bought first for a home shop states that a lathe should > >> be the first tool purchased, and I wouldn't disagree. Yet, when I > >> think of the shops I have been in mills outnumbered lathes by four > >> or five to one. Where I work now (I'm a mechanical designer for a > >> firm that makes analytical instruments) I do some shop work, and I'd > >> guess I spend 75% of my shop time on the mill. I wonder what it is > >> that HSM's do that makes a lathe so important, whereas in industry, > >> at least in my experience, the mill is more useful? > >> > >> > >> * Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet's Discussion > >Network * > >> The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet - Free! > >> > >> ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Jewelers rouge From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 04:46:29 GMT -------- Steel wool for making rouge!! I thought the entire world supply was used for knitting bridges! ;6) teenut Steve Rayner wrote: > > All polishing compounds should not be called rouge! Rouge, also known once > as "Red stuff", is made from steel wool, and is a form of iron oxide. > > Lyle Craver (lcraver@home1.com) wrote: > : On Tue, 02 Nov 1999 02:21:01 GMT, "Robert Swinney" > : wrote: > > : >Jeweler's rouge is red and usu. comes quite dry in stick form or sometimes > : >powder. Generally the polishing wheel (soft cotton pad) is charged with > : >rouge and applied to the work. Go to Home Despot or Sears and get a 4 stick > : >polishing set - i.e., 4 grades of abrasive -- the finest grade is jewlelers > : >rouge. > > : Actually jewellers rouge also comes in yellow, white, black and > : green (among others) though yellow and black are the same > : aluminum oxide base you're used to in red, while white is tin > : oxide based and green is chrome oxide based. > > : As someone who sells all of the above in my day job (and do come > : see me if you're in Vancouver, BC - free plug) red is everybody's > : second choice for everything and first choice for a few things, > : white and yellow are used for lightening the appearance of > : silver-coloured and brass-coloured metals respectively, black > : darkens silver-coloured metals and green is particularly good for > : steel and jade but does require a lot more cleanup afterwards. > > : The fellow who suggested touching the stick to a turning wheel is > : on-target, my favorite technique being to turn the motor on and > : off and while the motor is slowing down hold the rouge stick to > : the wheel - by the time it stops it's usually fully charged. > > : Although he WAS completely right about the need to wear an apron! > : :) > : ------------------------------------ > : To reply to me remove 1 from address > > -- > > I'm a Canadian eh! Steve. > ************************************************************************** > The FAQ for rec.crafts.metalworking is at: http://w3.uwyo.edu/~metal > The metalworking drop box is at http://www.metalworking.com > or http://208.213.200.132 > ************************************************************************** > Visit my website at: http://www.victoria.tc.ca/~ud233/homepage.htm > > ************* Tu ne cede malis, sed contra audentior ito. **************** > ******************************** - Virgil ******************************** > ******Yield thou not to adversity, but press on the more bravely.********** ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Federal Gages From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 05:59:42 GMT -------- Federal are as good as it gets. teenut Charles Town wrote: > > Group: > > I recently aquired several Federal brand indicators yet know nothing > about thier acuuracy, durability and general worth as machine > tools....Comments? > > Thank You ahead > > C Town ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Purpose of Starrett #25? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 16:50:42 GMT -------- "Very-nears" with the facility to move both heads are used to deternine the center distances of two holes. The holes do not need to be measured and need not be the same diameter. IIRC (It has been a Long time!!)..start with End jaw at zero..take an inside measurement. Lock second jaw. Now take an outside measurement..moving ONLY the end Jaw...Result will be the center distance. It is a LONG lime since I used one so I can't be specific on the "Modus Operandi"..maybe you do the outside first...... but you can probably figure it out from there. teenut paulwomack@my-deja.com wrote: > > Help! > One of these just followed by home. > > I can't find it on the web anywhere - here's the closest. > > http://www.mjdtools.com/tools/list_113/21810.htm > > Differences are minor: > mine is 5" overall, scale is 3" > mine doesn't have the fancy "fine adjust" mechanism. > > There are scales on both faces, in 1/100" and 1/64". > > As a measuring device > it's far inferior to a simple vernier. > And I can't see why you'd want to move BOTH heads > of a caliper. Surely one can stay fixed? > > So can anyone with an old Starrett catalogue tell me what > a #25 was/is for? (please) > > BugBear > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Call for group buying plan, 1/4-20 fasteners From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 16:58:55 GMT -------- Perhaps we can get Pete, Cass and Commander to combine resources..Imagine the possibilities. I have need coming up for 10 x 3/8"-24 bolts..But I would take a dozen 1/2"-13 if I can get a good enough price break! This is one of you better ideas Pete and I encourage everyone to contact Pete direct with a projection of their future fastener requirements. teenut PLAlbrecht wrote: > > Well, I'm appalled at the cost of 1/4-20 bolts at Home Depot. It has come to my > attention that we can buy standard hardware lots cheaper in bulk. To that end, > I'd like to put together a group buying plan. > > I'd like to form an ad hoc group of dedicated home shop machinists who are > tired of the tyrrany of individual bolt sales. We have a big job ahead of us; > we'll have to work out a standard Group Purchase Bolt Specification to submit > to manufacturers. > > To that end, I invite interested parties to suggest their favorite bolt grade, > surface finish, length, and head style (hex, cap, countersunk cap, carriage, > etc). Once we figure out what we want, we will submit a request for proposal to > leading bolt manufacturers all over the world. > > Who knows, we might be able to get huge discounts if we get together an order > for more than, say, 1000 bolts? > > If this is successful, I intend to expand this concept to cover nuts, > lockwashers, and maybe even 5/16 and 3/8 hardware. > > Send no money now... > > Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lathes vs mills From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 17:21:09 GMT -------- I think you are missing the point Mike. I am sure you could figure out a way to make a lawnmower with a wheel barrow if you put your undoubted talents to the task! The point of the whole thing is, that a lathe has the facility to make pretty damn near anything, in the way of metal cutting...With relative ease and with a minimum of adaptation. Generations of Model Engineers, Live Steamers and the like have done work that would blow your mind with nothing but a lathe, a vertical slide and a lot of ingenuity. I have never come across one that chose a mill as their first and only machine tool. As I have said before...You CAN circular mill..even TURN on a milling machine..sometimes it is a nifty way around a tricky job. But to have to do ALL your turning on a mill..Gimme a break!! Like any other thread, this one is in danger of degenerating into a "can".."can't" load of rubbish! teenut > Tell what it is, and how you do it on a lathe. I'll see if I can figure > out how to do it on a mill. > > Mike > Lagun Mill, Enco 13x40 lathe > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Rifling Leads From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 20:17:46 GMT -------- Don't hold your breathe for Border Barrels to go out of business because of Britain's firearms laws. They make only high class riflebarrels for target and sporting rifles and appear to have an international client base. Maybe even me..I just sent an enquiry for a couple of .577 barrel blanks to their US agent. 8^) teenut Ole-Hjalmar Kristensen wrote: > > Tom Holt writes: > > > The message <3825B139.C358EBE8@vom.com> > > from Jack Erbes contains these words: > > > > > I sort of wonder who they > > > are making barrels for in view of Britain's stand on personal firearms. > > > > > > Let's put it this way... Very soon, there'll be a lot of extremely > > high-class machinery going very cheap. > > > > That would certainly be very interesting for the rest of us with less > restrictive laws. Keep us informed! > > -- > E pluribus Unix ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 'Hobby' lathes From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 20:20:19 GMT -------- Going to be making a few Chess sets for Xmas are we? ;^) teenut Mark Winlund wrote: > > Gawd, I was thinking nobody would ask! It is: > > Vertical Machining Center > 50 x 20 x 20 way travels > 10,000rpm 30HP water cooled spindle > Full 4 axis control > ridgid tapping > Full enclosure > 32 tool changer > high speed machining option > chip conveyor > programmable coolant nozzle > tool offset automatic probe > work offset automatic probe > > I will post to the group about it when I get it if there is any interest. > > Mark (went a little crazy there) Winlund > > Jim Kreter wrote in message <38263acb.979430@news.earthlink.net>... > >On Sun, 7 Nov 1999 07:12:52 -0800, "Mark Winlund" > > wrote: > > > >>Fitch... I can say that I am quite satisfied with the 18" Jet (That had > the > >>chuck problems). I use it far more than I thought I would. After being > >>retired for three years now (!) I have finally sold my CNC mill (Chinese > >>iron, Centroid control) and put a down payment on a new Haas VF4B. I feel > >>like a kid just before Christmas.... > >> > >>Best, > >> > >>Mark > >> > >Errr... Mark, what is a Haas VF4B?? Inquiring minds want to know. > > > >Regards > > > >Jim > > > > > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Call for group buying plan, 1/4-20 fasteners From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 20:41:45 GMT -------- I have 1/2" - 12 nuts if you need them (BSW) I used to find them on the garage floor every time I took the Triumph out! 3/8 - 23 sounds like a great Idea! I normally "torque to stretch" on this application, and the 3/8-24 finish up at 5/16 - 23..but then the nuts don't fit anymore. With the 3/8 - 23 I could get away with "finger tight" if I could just get nuts to suit. teenut PLAlbrecht wrote: > > >I have need coming up for 10 x 3/8"-24 bolts.. > > I have done an exhaustive study of this and determined that we can get a price > break from one manufacturer for 3/8-23 bolts. It seems they made a mistake in > manufacturing, but their mistake is our goin because they're selling these very > slight "blems" at rock bottom prices. > > Their loss is our gain. > > These can go right in the parts bin alongside the Taiwanese 1/2-12 bolts. > > Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Call for group buying plan, 1/4-20 fasteners From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 20:52:41 GMT -------- But Tim, you are missing the whole BRILLIANT concept behind Pete's idea! Whether it is Home Despot, Ace Hardluck, or whoever..These people have grown rich and fat by taking advantage of the typical HSMer's sloppy buying habits. Don't you SEE!!...By excercising a little self discipline and aforethought, we can cheat these Blatant Profiteers out of their bood money. Simple put, If I follow Pete's logic, If we ALL order 10,000 1/4 - 20 bolts at the SAME TIME.....the savings will be MASSIVE!! More than enough I feel to justify the added cost of re-engineering every job we ever do to utilise 1/4 - 20 bolts. I mean, if 4 bolt main bearings are good...surely 16 or 32 will be even better. Wouldn't you agree? 8^) teenut Tim Shoppa wrote: > > PLAlbrecht wrote: > > > > Well, I'm appalled at the cost of 1/4-20 bolts at Home Depot. It has come to my > > attention that we can buy standard hardware lots cheaper in bulk. To that end, > > I'd like to put together a group buying plan. > > I'm appalled at Home Depot in general :-(. Sure, they aren't the > worst mass-market retailer to drive the old mom and pop stores out > of business, but their selection of metalworking items and tools > is frustratingly limited. > > If you aren't happy with Home Depot (and I can't blame you there), have > you tried other local suppliers? When I lived in LA, I was *very* > happy with IPS. Most smaller towns have welding shops where folks > can walk up and purchase bolts, etc., for reasonable prices. And > small-town lumberyards (yes, Virginia, Home Depot isn't everywhere > yet!) are another good source for fasteners. > > Tim. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Call for group buying plan, 1/4-20 fasteners From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 20:59:48 GMT -------- I think Pete is way ahead of you on the type of price breaks he is looking for. Per my earlier response to another lister of similar small mindedness..the savings to be enjoyed by buying in LIFETIME quantities could be HUGE!! Knowing Pete, and his powers of persuasiveness, he may be able to get the price down to a negative figure! We could all then apply the money saved towards the purchase of a 3 in 1 from Cass. (of course..it would have to be held together with 1/4"- 20 bolts as well as the usual string and sealing wax) teenut karlmilwaukee@my-deja.com wrote: > > Yeah, you definitely can't buy hardware from Home Depot. Have you > looked at McMaster-Carr though? It seems like their prices aren't that > bad compared to a real fastener place like American Fastener or > Fasten-all. McMaster is definitely higher, but they have lower minimums > and easy ordering with fast delivery. A box of 100 1/4-20 GRADE 5 in a > 2" length are only $7.62. 1" is only $4.40. That's pretty cheap. They > also have just about any bolt you can think of. They even sold me 4 > bolts of M8 x 20mm with a special 1.0 thread for about $1. or so. > > karl > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Pewter - need some info on crafting From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 21:02:40 GMT -------- Lordy! I haven't see one of those in years. Starrett used to make them in matched sets! Perhaps Ebay? teenut Bob wrote: > > ummmm...... > > a nosepicker. > > yeah, that's it! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: caliber questions From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 21:38:55 GMT -------- Welcome to the totally confusing world of caliber designations.. Yes a .380 is the same diameter as a .38..but both are .357" diameter!! So is a 9mm (.356") A .44 Colt percussion revolver uses a bullet .454" diameter as does a .45 Colt Single action army. However a .45 Colt Automatic is probably happier with a bullet.452" diameter. The 44 Magnum fires a bullet .429" diameter!! 30-06 refers to the .30 caliber (Actally .308" bullet dia) developed in 1906. On the other hand a 30-40 was/is a 308 caliber, loaded with smokeless powder that could be reloaded with 40 grains of black powder!! The .577 Enfield fired a bullet of nominally .570 diameter. The .577 case wase necked down to fire the 577/450 which had a bullet diameter of .458" as opposed to the .450 Whitworth, which had a bore of .452 and fired a bullet of .442". That same 577/450 case was then necked back up and lengthened to form the 577 - 3" and 3 1/4" Nitro Express..both of which fire a bullet of .585" diameter..just like the .585 Nyatti and the .577 Tyrannosaur! The .500 Jeffery, .50 Browning Machine Gun and the 577/450 Nitro Express all fire a bullet .510" diameter as do the .510 Wells and the 500 A-Square. On the other hand, the .505 Gibbs fires a bullet .505" diameter!! The British .303 is actually .311" diameter..as is the German 8mm (unless it is the later 8mm which is .323" diameter. Confused enought yet?? Sometimes the reference is to bore diameter, sometimes to groove diameter, year of introduction, grains of powder, velocity (250-3000) parentage (22-250) manufacturer (284 Win)..yada yada yada... Bottom line is..there are no hard and fast rules Marvin!! A real good source of information, would be "Cartridges of the World" by Frank Barnes..available from any good bookstore or Amazon.com. teenut "Marvin W. Klotz" wrote: > > I was always under the impression that caliber referred to the > diameter of the bullet, measured in inches. I measured a .22 bullet > and it miked out to 0.222" so my impression appears not too far off. > > This only raised some more questions. > > Is a .380 the same caliber as a .38? If so, what's the significance > of the trailing zero? > > I've heard of a .30-06. What caliber is it? Does the "06" really > refer to six ten-thousandths of an inch or does it denote something > else? > > Does anyone know of a website where I might learn more about this? > All of the ones I've found so far don't address such naive questions. > > TIA, Marv > > Email: mklotz@alum.mit.edu > > Home shop utility freeware page at: > http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hall/4425 ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lathes vs mills From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 08 Nov 1999 21:46:23 GMT -------- mledtje@my-deja.com wrote: > > Leadscrew - Hmmmm, I'd start with a piece of stock of the correct OD. BZZZT..Wrong Answer!!..We are making out mill or lathe from scratch! Remember? So Mike would start with a square piece of bar... With regards to the "Knee" Where is it written that a mill has to have a knee..or even a "table" for that matter? teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Excellent quality from China? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 09 Nov 1999 00:44:08 GMT -------- The day that happens, I will call it a helluva good $6.00 bottle of wine! Problem is..I may not be around to see it and when it does taste as good as the du pape..it will cost a lot more than $6.00. California (and other) wines are improving every year..but let's not get carried away with comparisons yet! teenut tonyp wrote: > if a $6 bottle of California Zinfandel tastes exactly like a $60 bottle of > Chateauneuf du Pape, which one should we call crap? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Flying insects From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 09 Nov 1999 00:50:44 GMT -------- Barely!! Those Northern Ontario Mosquitoes are mean mothers!! They will zap you right through the back pocket of your jeans (billfold an'all) Twice put me in the emergency room with blood poisoning! They had to shear through my stainless watchband one time to get it off! Hate the sobs!! teenut Gerald Miller wrote: > > Up home (Highlands of Halliburton) an A-10 Warthog would have worked ;-)} > > -- > > Gerry > London, Canada > > Don Foreman wrote in message > news:38266940.302042921@news.goldengate.net... > > > > I did some research on this many years ago, actually found a > > publication called "The Mosquito News" (or something like > > that) out of Canada. > > > > Bottom line: sonics and ultrasonics did NOT work with > > skeeters -- at least the species they tested. > > > > But this was at low sound-pressure-levels, comparatively > > speaking. Levels compatible with human presence -- no such > > constraint in a steel mill..... > > > > A skeeter is maybe 1/4" wingtip to wingtip except in > > Minnesota. Sound with a wavelength of 1/4" is about 52.8 > > kiloHertz. So maybe if you tried ultrasound at 52.8 KHz at > > a high enough SPL, it might just zing them into resonance > > and shake their wings off... > > > > Another alternative would be screens..... > > > > Vinyl flooring mfrs have the same problem. When recently > > having my kitchen redone, the flooring guys layed out the > > material on the deck to cut and found a perfectly-preserved > > mosquito mashed flat under the gloss in the new flooring > > material. Unlike MicoSoft, I got no argument from Home > > Depot in replacing the lot with bugfree material. > > > > Regards from Foreman, dforeman@Ugoldengate.net. > > Please remove U from email address to reply ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Splined shafts From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 09 Nov 1999 01:07:27 GMT -------- Internal splines are broached on a production basis..Can be cut one at a time on a shaper or slotter using an indexing device. External splines can be milled one at a time or hobbed on a production basis. What diameter, spline form, dimensions and number of splines do yoy want to reproduce. Be aware, a professionally produced spline broach can cost hundreds of dollars. teenut Aaron Anderson wrote: > > Hi There! I am Running this question again: how are splines made male > and female and how many per shaft the axle is 1" diameter can i do the > preliminary machining first then have or the splines first then the > machining also the metal is 4340 and will be heat treated later the > application is bicycle cranks and the rage now is splines. Thanks. Aaron > Anderson ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lathes vs mills From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 09 Nov 1999 05:35:33 GMT -------- Well I guess I can't help you to learn anything new Mike! Sorry 8^( The way you put it I guess I have to agree with you..I can't think of a damn thing, that is normally considered "Lathe work" that..Given the time, resources and sheer bloody determination I could not make on a Mill. But at the same time, under the same circumstances, I can't thing of a single bit of "Mill work" that I couldn't do on a lathe! Or on a bench with a hammer chisel and a few files for that matter. It is all a question of degree really, isn't it? 8^) teenut 8^) mledtje@my-deja.com wrote: > What does a lathe do that a mill cannot do? Nothing that I can see. So > what makes that statement up there accurate? Nothing that I can see. > Prove me wrong, and I will have learned something. Just keep learning, > that's all I want to do. > > Mike > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Rifling Leads From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 09 Nov 1999 06:16:59 GMT -------- "Spiral Gear Trains" are covered amply in Machinery's Hand Book..Just like a gear train for thread cutting on a lath exept that they are much "Over geared" Ie if you set up to cut a lead of 1 in 72" on a lathe and then tried to turn the headstock it would jam and break something! However if you were to turn the LEADSCREW, the headstock would be turned by the gearing, at the correct rate to generate the spiral you needed. This can be done on a lathe with a milling head on the toolpost, It can be done on a mill with the correct spiral milling attachments, or it can be don on a special machine..purpose built in this case to pull a rifling head,attached to the carriage, through a bsarrel blank held in the headstock. A sine bar machine works in a very similar way to the taper turning attachment on your lathe. The barrel is held in the headstock which does not turn during cutting, but is simply indexed between strockes to generate the required number of rifling grooves. The rifling head and its pull rod are held in a free running bearing in a bracket on the carriage. The bearing incorporates a small gear that engages in a rackmounted to a free sliding bar that runs under or over the gear and can move only a right angles to the main bed ways (like the cross slide on your lathe.with the feed screw removed) The end of this slideway has a shoe or "slipper" that engages the sine bar..the taper turning slide on your lathe. If the sine bar is set parallel to the bed ways, then no amount of carriage movement will cause the cross bar to move in or out..the gear will not be turned and the grooves you cut will be straight!! However, if you set the sine bar at an angle to the bed ways, then, as the carriage moves the cross bar, with its rack, is forced to slide in or out and the rack causes the gear and the rifling rod to rotate as it moves though the barrel. Changing the angle or gradient of the sine bar changes the pitch of the riflig that is cut. If you refer back to the picture of the machine at Border Barrels.... ....you will see the same elements arranged in a slightly different way. The Sine bar is suspended and adjustable inside the large "O" shaped casting. Beneath it, at right angles to the bed, is the cross slide bar, and the rack is mounted to its underside. Beneath that is the "Pull Bracket" housing the gear and the bearing in which the holder for the rifling rod is mounted. Most modern rifling machines, whether for single point, broaching or button rifling, have been purpose built by their users to do a specific rannge of twists and many have dispensed with any means of "generating" the required twist. Rather they use an interchangeable twist guide..A groove milled in a large round bar, geared directly to the pull head. This faster, cheaper and more consistantly accurate to set up. Once upon a time this meant locating a shop with a universal milling machine and all the bits and pieces (and skills) required to set up and mill a set of master guides. Nowadays, any shop with a big enough CNC mill can knock them out quite easily. tenut sunworshiper wrote: > > Teenut; Great info. and sites. I don't want to make a gun. (Got one) > I need to build a machine to go into production of my patented > invention. Can you explain the spiral gear train and the sine bar > helical generator? BTW I need the outside cut , not the inside. > I was just curious as what the leads were. Mine is one turn in 6'. > Need some different concepts before I go too far. > > The Sun shines , people forget. > > Without the Sun none of us would be here. > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Confessions of a Junior/Amateur "Rigger" From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 09 Nov 1999 06:38:03 GMT -------- >BTW, how can I run this thing without flat belts that switch back and >forth on the pulleys to reverse the motion of the platten? Some years ago I built my own, small planer, hand operated at the time..Not as hard work as one might imagine..but I did do a lot of investigations into ways and means of achieving a pwerful enough, cheap and ACCURATELY reversing drive. Cutting a long story short, the likely candidates were: Electric clutch/brakes..as some one has said already..Expensive!! Reversing DC drive...needs a big motor! Hydraulic motor..noisy and inefficient! The best plan I came up with was to use a reversible hydraulic transmission of the type fitted to some types of Lawn Tractors. Driven by a non reversible electric motor, these can be readily thrown into forward or reverse with a single lever. The guy I eventually sold the planer to fitted a dc reversible/variable speed drive to it..he had more money than I had at the time!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Excellent quality from China? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 09 Nov 1999 06:44:43 GMT -------- Point taken..I don't drink the expensive stuff unless someone else is paying!! Shoot, it is a waste of good money on me anyway! My dissipated lifestyle and heavy smoking have left me only able to taste salt and pepper...And I can't tell the difference between THEM!! ;^) teenut tonyp wrote: > > Robert, > > Trying to keep it short, I didn't make myself clear enough. The one time > in my life I had a really good Chateauneuf (vintage '76, consumed 1983 in > Tokyo of all places) I thought I'd gone to heaven without having to die > first. But that was just luck, I think. Since then, most times I've > indulged myself enough to spring for a $60 bottle of wine, I've thought > "Geez, this doesn't taste much better than the $6 Californian I drank > yesterday." So, I hestitate to call the cheap stuff "crap" seeing as it > gives me (say) 1/2 the satisfaction, but for only1/10th the price. > > Same for wine, same for machine tools, was my point. > -- > Tony Prentakis > Consumer of time, occupier of space, producer of Z-stages > "How can I know what I think until I hear what I have to say?" > VVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVVV > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote in article > ... > > The day that happens, I will call it a helluva good $6.00 bottle of wine! > > > > Problem is..I may not be around to see it and when it does taste as good > as the > > du pape..it will cost a lot more than $6.00. > > > > California (and other) wines are improving every year..but let's not get > carried > > away with comparisons yet! > > > > teenut > > > > tonyp wrote: > > > > > if a $6 bottle of California Zinfandel tastes exactly like a $60 bottle > of > > > Chateauneuf du Pape, which one should we call crap? > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Purpose of Starrett #25? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 09 Nov 1999 13:05:54 GMT -------- There does not appear to be a fiducial line on the left hand jaw..which would be present if this were a center gauge. I tend to lean towards Dougs assessment..that the intent is to zero the left jaw according to whether inside or outside measurements are to be taken. This does sound very clumsy..what if you want to take a series of inside AND outside measurements? One other thought is that this is only part of a set that included a surface plate base, to replace the LH jaw and turn it into a height gauge. Doesn't anyone out there have an old catalogue? The simple expedient is to look it up!! Or contact Starrett..Duh! teenut Doug Goncz wrote: > > Rather than read a second index mark or an offset scale to make inside > measurements, one would move the end jaw so that the extensions read their OD > when the jaws are closed. The extensions are radiused to something near that > figure, smaller, I guess. > > That's what it looks like to me. > > Yours, > > Doug Goncz, A.A.S.M.E.T. > Experimental Machinist ( DOT 600.260-022 ) > Replikon Research ( USA 22044-0094 ) > http://users.aol.com/DGoncz > (Can't afford letterhead so I use this signature. :) > No longer reading mail sent to ReplikonVA ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Call for group buying plan, 1/4-20 fasteners From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 09 Nov 1999 13:17:39 GMT -------- I can personally vouch for the honesty of Mr Albrecht (Did I say it right Boss?) Only Last year he supplied over 2000 Albrecht chuck keys to members of our organisation (alt.perpetualmotion.com) at a price far, far below the official DEALERS invoice price. The Dealers in question have all ganged up on Mr Albrecht and are refusing to honor the balance of the Special Deal they signed..the Free Chucks have not yet arrived..but are expected momentarily. teenut PLAlbrecht wrote: > > And furthermore... > > I see somebody on the list has mentioned a new Albrecht keyless chuck catalog. > > I am selling the missing keys for anybody who wants them, to have a really > complete Albrecht chuck. > > Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Rong Fu 45 in New England? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 09 Nov 1999 13:33:28 GMT -------- Alan Mimms wrote: But the people who fulfill their orders need > better glasses. The first two duplicates I got were 1-5/16 and > 1-3/16. The ones that corresponded that were missing were 15/16 and > 13/16. See how that happened? Obviously someone with not very good > eyesight or too busy to do their job carefully. > Many years ago, I was reffered by a Dentist, to a Dental Surgeon, to have my (Large and DEEP rooted) wisdom teeth extracted. Seating me in the chair, the guy proceeded to shoot me up with local anesthetic...rear right upper, rear left upper..and somewhere just left of center upper jaw!! Away he went, to let the shots take effect and then returned to bgin his gory work. I asked if he was going to pull all four wisdom teeth that day...or was I going to have to go back for the two left hand ones. A look of sheer panic crossed his face, he consulted the chart and discovered he had read 1,2, as 12 (teeth are numbered in the dental world) and was all set to pull the wrong tooth. I received hurried shots in 1 and 2 while he chopped out the other two..needless to say the shots had not taken full effect when he got round to 1 and 2... NOT the most pleasant experience of my life!! 8^( teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Rong Fu 45 in New England? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 09 Nov 1999 13:41:45 GMT -------- Robert Bastow wrote: .rear right upper, rear left upper. Not enough coffee yet this AM ...Rear right upper and rear right lower!! \ teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Removing rust with phosphoric acid From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 09 Nov 1999 15:59:46 GMT -------- Mike KNOWS!! This is what he does to Trespassers and Bill Collectors!! teenut Mike Graham wrote: Tie the chains behind the > truck and drag them around for about 15 minutes. They will look like BRAND > NEW. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Purpose of Starrett #25? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 09 Nov 1999 16:06:38 GMT -------- Jack Erbes wrote: > The No. 24 (apparently similar to the 25) had jaws that could be fitted > with a variety of pieces like trammel points and stuff so that it could > be used for specialty measuring. That fits better with my "second take" on the picture. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Call for group buying plan, 1/4-20 fasteners From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 09 Nov 1999 16:13:01 GMT -------- Not so far fetched really..the old Rolls-Royces tended to use many small bolts rather than a few big ones..Better engineering practice and eliminated the need for gaskets etc. OTOH the Royal Navy wouldn't allow the use of bolts under 1/2" on the proven grounds that the "Matelots" would twist the head off anything smaller. The British Coal Board would not allow hex socket cap screws on underground machinery, because the heads filled up with coal dust! teenut teenut lharts@unm.edu wrote: > Also just think of the reduction in number of drill > bits and taps needed in a shop if all bolts were 1/4 " > ( I assume we will stick to 20 tpi fo everything ) :-) > ,,,lew,,, ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: caliber questions From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 09 Nov 1999 16:21:52 GMT -------- Cheaper and a lot less messy than a Presidential Election every four years!! Absolute separation of the Titular "Head of State" from any involvement with or influence by, the Government of the Day. Not a perfect system..but no-one has yet come up with a better one. BTW the Aussies, like the Kiwies, Canucks and everyone else in the Commonwealth, have been "Self Governing" for years. Membership and retention of the Constitutional Monarchy is entirely voluntary...So I guess it must have something to say for itself. Jack Erbes wrote: > And while we are on the topic of illogical behaviors, this is a good > time to congratulate the Australians on their recently expressed desires > to rule themselves independent of Britain. But what the hell is the > deal on their deciding they still want the Queen of England to be their > titular head? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: caliber questions From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 09 Nov 1999 16:22:49 GMT -------- True! teenut Jack Erbes wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > The British .303 is actually .311" diameter..as is the German 8mm (unless it is > > the later 8mm which is .323" diameter. > > The early 8mm was .318, not .323. > > -- > Jack in Sonoma, CA, USA (jack@vom.com) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Beryllium Copper From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 04:50:22 GMT -------- Beryllium Yes! Nasty stuff. Beryllium copper is perfectly innocuous! teenut Robert Salasidis wrote: > > On Tue, 09 Nov 1999 20:10:27 -0500, k gallimore > wrote: > > One needs to mention the possible health hazard when handling > beryllium as any fine particles that may be inhaled can lead to lung > disease > > http://www.njc.org/MFhtml/BER_MF.html > > >Try Instrument Specialties in Delaware Water Gap, Pa. > > > >Kevin Gallimore > > > >Ron Barthelme wrote: > > > >> Looking for becu, .005" x 1.600"+ and .010" x 3.100"+. Because of thermal > >> and electrical conductivity concerns, it must be 17500 or 17510. (Berylco > >> 14 or 10) > >> > >> Any help appreciated, I'm having a hell of a time finding this stuff. I > >> only need a few sq. feet of both, and the few places that have it have > >> huge minimum lot charges. > >> > >> -- > >> Ronald D. Barthelme > >> Northwestern University > >> Instrument Shop > >> 847-491-7397 ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Hand tapping guide available From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 04:58:04 GMT -------- Handy enough..But I for one will never answer an ad. without a price that asks "a rep to call". If the price is right..post it! teenut If not...Forget it! "Walter E. Stephens" wrote: > > I thought I would make up a batch of these cuties. If interested, > check them out at my website. > > http://www.acs-aerocrafters.com/small_tools.htm > > Walter E. Stephens ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Lest we Forget From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 09:23:52 GMT -------- This is one Helluva fine gesture..My regrets that I will be too far south to hear those whistles blow! This Twentieth Century certainly was a watershed for freedom..Many key issues of our freedom, were disputed, fought and died over...Decisively enough that they should never become issues to die over again. Unless we Forget!! Robert Bastow CPR TO STOP ALL TRAINS ACROSS SYSTEM IN MILLENNIUM TRIBUTE TO THOSE WHO SERVED CALGARY - Lest we forget. Canadian Pacific Railway (CPR) announced today that at 11 a.m. local time on November 11, 1999, its employees will bring all trains across Canada and the United States to a halt, observing two full minutes of silence. Not since the death of CPR's visionary builder, William Cornelius Van Horne, in September 1915, has CPR stopped all trains in such a show of respect. "Citizens of Canada and the United States are closing out this century - this millennium - as a free and peaceful population. We wanted to pay special tribute this Remembrance Day to the millions of Canadians and Americans who served in World War I, World War II and the Korean War, and especially remember the 33,127 of them who were Canadian Pacific employees," said Rob Ritchie, president and chief executive officer, CPR. "It wasn't an easy thing for mothers to say goodbye to their sons and daughters as they went off to war. Our employees wanted to perform a tangible gesture to show our appreciation for our freedom. Two minutes of reflection is time well used to honour those who served, and in particular the many thousands who sacrificed their lives, including 1,774 Canadian Pacific employees." At 11 a.m. local time on Nov. 11, 1999, all CPR trains across its network will come to a full stop in a safe zone and observe the tradition of two minutes silence. At the end of the two minutes, they'll blast one long whistle as a final tribute to this century's freedom fighters. "Our hope is that when the train whistle blows in Revelstoke, Smiths Falls, Toronto or Minneapolis, the sound will unite our thoughts in a moment of thankfulness for our freedom," said Mr. Ritchie. The CPR network stretches across 24,000 kilometres (15,000 miles) passing through thousands of communities across Canada and in the U.S. midwest and northeast. The railway has approximately 19,000 employees in Canada, the U.S. and overseas. Website: www.cpr.ca (Canadian Pacific Railway, November 9 1999) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Thoughts on the Squarewave 175 Tig unit from Lincoln?? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 09:27:33 GMT -------- My Lincoln 175 is AC and DC. teenut ghandi wrote: > > Unless the Lincoln Tigs marketed where you are are different to the > units in Australia , Idon't think they are , this means that you will > not be able to weld alum. efficiently , you need AC powersource to weld > alloy. AC cleans/scours the oxides at the weld , DC from the inverter > won't do this and a whole world of welders wishes it would , shame Eh . > However these little inverter welders are truely wonderful for what > they were made for , you won't beleive how easy bike frames will be. > Please watch the fumes they are really dangerous and I wish you would > do a course at tech or somewhere so you will be rite on top of the > hazards . I can definetly rec. the Lincoln . > > * Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet's Discussion Network * > The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet - Free! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Synchrowave 180 or Lincoln 175 tig unit? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 09:29:34 GMT -------- I love my Lincoln 175 teenut Jim wrote: > > I am throwing another post regarding smaller tig units and would like to > know if anyone prefers one or the other units, either the Synchrowave > 180 or the Lincoln 175 tig units? Both are complete with everything > except the gas and bottle but I would like to hear peoples preferences > of one or the other and why? I have pretty much decided it will be one > of these. > > Thanks > > Jim ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: I don't care if it is only a kit of parts From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 10:00:27 GMT -------- http://albums.photopoint.com/j/ViewPhoto?u=129594&a=950918&p=13271283 For $266.00 I am awfully tempted to get one of these as a backup/second op lathe. At the price I don't care if I have to totally rebuild it! Anyone, with any DIRECT experience of these little machines, please feel free to disillusion me!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: We Must NEVER Forget! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 10:28:31 GMT -------- This is one Helluva fine gesture..My regrets that I will be too far south to hear those whistles blow! This Twentieth Century certainly was a watershed for freedom..Many key issues of our freedom, were disputed, fought and died over...Decisively enough that they should never become issues to die over again. Unless we Forget!! Robert Bastow CPR TO STOP ALL TRAINS ACROSS SYSTEM IN MILLENNIUM TRIBUTE TO THOSE WHO SERVED CALGARY - Lest we forget. Canadian Pacific Railway (CPR) announced today that at 11 a.m. local time on November 11, 1999, its employees will bring all trains across Canada and the United States to a halt, observing two full minutes of silence. Not since the death of CPR's visionary builder, William Cornelius Van Horne, in September 1915, has CPR stopped all trains in such a show of respect. "Citizens of Canada and the United States are closing out this century - this millennium - as a free and peaceful population. We wanted to pay special tribute this Remembrance Day to the millions of Canadians and Americans who served in World War I, World War II and the Korean War, and especially remember the 33,127 of them who were Canadian Pacific employees," said Rob Ritchie, president and chief executive officer, CPR. "It wasn't an easy thing for mothers to say goodbye to their sons and daughters as they went off to war. Our employees wanted to perform a tangible gesture to show our appreciation for our freedom. Two minutes of reflection is time well used to honour those who served, and in particular the many thousands who sacrificed their lives, including 1,774 Canadian Pacific employees." At 11 a.m. local time on Nov. 11, 1999, all CPR trains across its network will come to a full stop in a safe zone and observe the tradition of two minutes silence. At the end of the two minutes, they'll blast one long whistle as a final tribute to this century's freedom fighters. "Our hope is that when the train whistle blows in Revelstoke, Smiths Falls, Toronto or Minneapolis, the sound will unite our thoughts in a moment of thankfulness for our freedom," said Mr. Ritchie. The CPR network stretches across 24,000 kilometres (15,000 miles) passing through thousands of communities across Canada and in the U.S. midwest and northeast. The railway has approximately 19,000 employees in Canada, the U.S. and overseas. Website: www.cpr.ca (Canadian Pacific Railway, November 9 1999) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Pewter - need some info on crafting From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 10 Nov 1999 20:33:49 GMT -------- I have a very Imperial Nose I'll have you know Sir!! teenut Mike hide wrote: > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > > >Lordy! I haven't see one of those in years. Starrett used to make them in > >matched sets! > > > >Perhaps Ebay? > > > >teenut > > > >Bob wrote: > >> > >> ummmm...... > >> > >> a nosepicker. > >> > >> yeah, that's it! > Ah but do they make them in metric sizes??? mjh ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Call for group buying plan, 1/4-20 fasteners From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 00:39:26 GMT -------- THAT is way too easy..Or I would have thought of it first!! ;^) Thanks Jack! teenut Jack Erbes wrote: > Put an easily displaced dab or wax or grease on them. Then you can > brush the chips aside and displace the grease with the wrench. > > -- > Jack in Sonoma, CA, USA (jack@vom.com) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: We Must NEVER Forget! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 00:42:12 GMT -------- Grow up guys! He didn't mention the Falklands, Suez or the Six Day War either! teenut Chuck Harris wrote: > > I suppose it could have something to do with > Canada not being envolved in the war in Vietnam. > > It doesn't seem quite so important to those not > menaced by it. > > -Chuck > > Kurt Bjorn wrote: > > > > I wish he had included Viet-nam in his list of wars. :-( > > > > Slap in 'da face of SEA veterans. > > > > -- > > Kurt Bjorn > > http://www.flash.net/~pyroware > > -- > ----- > Chuck Harris - WA3UQV > cfharris@erols.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lathes vs mills From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 12:46:45 GMT -------- eberlein wrote: > > Don't know, Robert. How would you single point thread the receiver end of a rifle > barrel on a mill? Thread mill >Taper turn the OD? Mill between centers on a dividing head or verticle rotarty table..Not much diferent than milling a tapered octagonal barrel. >Crown the end, dead nuts with the bore? Piloted form tool. Or Boring and facing head. > I know/think you weren't serious. No/Yes I was being pedantically serious in response to an equally pedantic statement that "Anything that can be done on a Lathe CAN be done on a mill" Yes it can..given enough determination! But no one in their right mind would seriously suggest a mill as first choice to do any of the above mentioned jobs. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Changing to Wirefeed/MIG welding From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 16:07:03 GMT -------- Having been called as an "Expert Witness", I can vouch for Bob's concerns. The strange, etherial, world of the courtroom bears no resemblance to that portrayed by "Perry Mason" In it, NOTHING is taken at face value until proven by indisputable and MUTUALLY acceptable, written authority. A simple statement of fact that would be accepted by any layman..such as "It was raining outside" can and will be ripped to pieces by opposing council, unless you can prove that you are a Meterologist, and can provide the scientific data to prove you are correct. On one occasion I spent FIVE days on the witness stand in Winnipeg. Four and a half of those days I was being grilled by a tag team of six or eight lawyers trying to discredit my credentials as an Expert. Once and finally, that that was accepted, I was asked only three or four more questions RELEVANT to the case in question!! For an "Expert Witness" to take the stand, armed only with "heresay" and "third party evidence" is to ask for a public humiliation beyond the ken of most "Lay People". Bob is absolutely right, to stick to his guns here, and demand irrefutable written authority before using any kind of welding process in a situation that could result in a lawsuit! teenut Bob Paulin wrote: > Has anybody here EVER been through ANY sort of court proceeding where > "acceptable methods" were questioned? > > I WANT to believe that MIG can be used in all-position, but I simply cannot > find documentation to that effect. > > Bob Paulin - R.A.C.E. > Chassis Blueprinting Services ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Newall DRO's vr. Sony and Acu-Rite From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 11 Nov 1999 23:37:20 GMT -------- Let's ask Cass!! fred veenschoten wrote: > > maybe we could all go together and get a group discount on one!!!! > > Chuck Sherwood wrote in message <80f0bo$mdq@ssbunews.ih.lucent.com>... > >No comments on the above, but I just ordered a Sargon for my mill drill. > >I considered the Mityo econmony line, but I decided that I wanted the more > >accurate glass scales. > > > >You can get good package deals from places like "Penn Tool" but these all > >have long scales that won't work on a mill drill. If you order a custom > >package the prices are too high. I think I got a good deal from "Can-Do" > >Their phone is 1-800-532-2636 > > > >chuck > > > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: One for the Groupies From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 06:17:30 GMT -------- Don, next time you do that, please put a "Viewer Discretion Advisory" on it...! Damn near lost my lunch! 8^O""" teenut Don Murray wrote: > > http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=194838284 > > Don Murray :) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: If only I had the space!! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 06:43:24 GMT -------- http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=192664009 Now THAT'S a three in one machine!! ;^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: I don't care if it is only a kit of parts From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 13:57:23 GMT -------- It was on Ebay. Went for $276.00 teenut Hoodoo wrote: > > On Wed, 10 Nov 1999 10:00:27 GMT, Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ > hotmail.com> wrote: > > >http://albums.photopoint.com/j/ViewPhoto?u=129594&a=950918&p=13271283 > > > >For $266.00 I am awfully tempted to get one of these as a backup/second op > >lathe. > > Where can one be purchased at that price? > > -- > Remove obvious pest deterrent in > email address for personal replies. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: I don't care if it is only a kit of parts From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 16:58:23 GMT -------- Pete's into SNUFF movies!! teenut PS, The G&L Borer fetched $3,800....I think I will go and get drunk this afternoon :^{ PLAlbrecht wrote: > > Of a tiny turning toy, Robert Bastow wrote > >It was on Ebay. > > > >Went for $276.00 > > > > Now, what I would like to see is this little abortion clamped to the table of > that Giddings & Lewis horizontal boring mill > > (Ebay 192664009 or > http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=192664009), > > put a BIG mill cutter in there, and reduce it to swarf. I'll bet the video > would sell. > > Pete ======== Newsgroups: alt.machines.cnc,rec.aviation.homebuilt,rec.aviation.restoration,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: LATHE/MILL/DRILL Group purchase accepting new members. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 20:00:50 GMT -------- Cass wrote: > > Our group - LASERGROWERS - is accepting folks to participate in a > group purchase of a LATHE/MILL/DRILL combination at almost illegal > price discounts. > > We are a group of professionals who just want the tools to further > delve into our hobbies. We are made up of engineers, physicists, > professors, machinists, mechanical engineers, neon folk, students, > lay folk and other scientific minds. We know from past experience > that with our group purchasing power we can get things that we would > not normally buy. > > One company has offered our group this machine for $495.00 and that is > down from almost $900.00. However, we are looking at other machines, > too. > The manufacturers or distributors like us as they know they get good > exposure of their company all over the U.S.A. and also, we will give > them more business when we need accessories, etc. > > We will not be making one cent on this purchase by any means! When > the time comes, you will send your money directly to the company and > that way, there will be no opportunity for any hanky-panky. > > So, if you want to join us and get in on this one-time purchase for > a LATHE/MILL/DRILL combination, you can join our LASERGROWERS list > by sending an email to: > buzz_ard2@bigfoot.com and put SUBSCRIBE in the subject and then, reply > to the email that you will be sent. > > After that, you will be a member and should you want to get in on this > deal with the rest of us, simply send another email to the same > address > and put LATHE/MILL in the subject line. We will keep the group > informed > of the progress. > > You can always unsubscribe after you get your machine, however, you > may > want to stay and build lasers with us. We have a great group! > > Pictures of a typical machine (NOT TOTALLY ASSEMBLED) that we MAY > purchase may be seen at our webpage: > http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Station/2727/ > > By the way, you are free to ask any of our members about our past > purchases/discounts/integrity, etc. > > ALL ABOARD! > > Cass ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: BEWARE Re: I need a favor. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 12 Nov 1999 23:05:19 GMT -------- Your own bitchin' is directed at the wrong people Dean! I think if it were up to the majority vote of active contributors, on this NG, a new NG rec.blackhole.groupbuy would have been created a long time ago for Cass, his slimy deal and his ass licking entourage! It would be almost worth the $400.00 to buy a machine and get this guy exposed and f**cked over for mail fraud! teenut deano wrote: > > >Cass wrote > > Damn, this shit is getting old. Can you guys just start a > "rec.crafts.metalworking.groupbuy.bitch" newsgroup? > Sorry for the off topic post. > > Dean ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Sleeve bearing for sliding linear applications From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 03:28:23 GMT -------- For wood working stick with a dry bearing..nylon impregnated with moly is good. You might want to try making your own from lignum vitae! Any kind of oil impregnated bearing will gum up fast with wood dust. teenut Kevin McGrew wrote: > > This is my first post here so take it easy on me if you can.... > > I'm looking to build some woodworking jigs that require linear movement > along a metal shaft. I was checking out the latest MSC catalog and was > wondering if something like an Oil Impregnated Bronze or Nylon sleeve > bearing would slide smoothly over a stock piece of drill rod. I'd like > to keep the shaft size around 3/4". Are the tolerances of the drill rod > and sleeve bearing compatible? Will these sleeve bearing work in a > linear fashion? Thanks and let me know. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Are they junk? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 03:30:40 GMT -------- You are the "EXPERT" Cass (or whatever your real name is)..Why don't you give us a rundown on the merits of these machines. 8^) teenut Cass wrote: > > Since we have so very many experts here, I would like opinions on > whether the following 3in1 machines (lathe/mill/drill) are junk: > Smithy, Grizzly, Shoptask, Harbor Freight, Enco. > > I would just like to get a consensus of opinion as to the idea that > the above listed machines are not worth having and are dangerous (as > one said) and are suitable only for boat anchors. However, for those > in the know, boat anchors are a science in design themselves. Just > not anything will make a good boat anchor. > > Ok guys, show your knowledge. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Are they junk? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 04:43:46 GMT -------- Cass wrote: > > Are you now afraid to voice your opinion? What frightened you, the > flame? Which particular flame was that Cassie my dear? 8^) > > So many people on here speak their mind. Why not render your opinion > on those brand-names? I have no personal experience of any of the three in one type machines...so I have no opinion on which brand names are any better than any other. You, on the other hand, have surely been researching and testing machines and suppliers all over the world..on behalf of your trusting "groupies" (You HAVE been working hard, on their behalf and preparing to present a full technical rundown on the alternatives available and the reasons for your final selection..Haven't you??) With all your assurances I am sure that, by now, you have built up a dossier on the technical specifications, strengths, weaknesses, spares and service organisations etc., so that you can offer a deal, worthy of the trust you ask of people, and one not simple based upon the cheapest price you can find. That would be a dishonest thing to do wouldn't it Cass?...Leading all those trusting people astray! You are not that kind of person..we know that because you keep telling us so. Isn't that right Cass? 8^) teenut > > -- > x-no-archive: yes > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote in message > news:AX4X3.1250$pY2.87732@news.rdc1.tn.home.com... > > You are the "EXPERT" Cass (or whatever your real name is)..Why don't > you give us > > a rundown on the merits of these machines. > > > > 8^) > > > > teenut > > > > Cass wrote: > > > > > > Since we have so very many experts here, I would like opinions on > > > whether the following 3in1 machines (lathe/mill/drill) are junk: > > > Smithy, Grizzly, Shoptask, Harbor Freight, Enco. > > > > > > I would just like to get a consensus of opinion as to the idea > that > > > the above listed machines are not worth having and are dangerous > (as > > > one said) and are suitable only for boat anchors. However, for > those > > > in the know, boat anchors are a science in design themselves. > Just > > > not anything will make a good boat anchor. > > > > > > Ok guys, show your knowledge. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Are they junk? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 04:51:04 GMT -------- Ah! So, just who IS the expert that is going to decide whether a particular machine/price combination is the VERY BEST available and to be recommended to you group of trusting followers? Is it you perhaps Robin? Or do you expect someone in this NG to give you a run down on all the available machines..that you can then quote, parrot-fashion, to your devoted followers? You are very good at that though, aren't you Robin? Parrot-fashion I mean! Oops..I hope you are not going to get angry with ME now. 8^) teenut "[©ØMMÄÑУ®]" wrote: > > What a mature response. I don't think Cass ever implied he was an expert. If > fact, on may occasions, he expressly stated that he was not. > > [COMMANDER] > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote in message > news:AX4X3.1250$pY2.87732@news.rdc1.tn.home.com... > > You are the "EXPERT" Cass (or whatever your real name is)..Why don't you > give us > > a rundown on the merits of these machines. > > > > 8^) > > > > teenut > > > > Cass wrote: > > > > > > Since we have so very many experts here, I would like opinions on > > > whether the following 3in1 machines (lathe/mill/drill) are junk: > > > Smithy, Grizzly, Shoptask, Harbor Freight, Enco. > > > > > > I would just like to get a consensus of opinion as to the idea that > > > the above listed machines are not worth having and are dangerous (as > > > one said) and are suitable only for boat anchors. However, for those > > > in the know, boat anchors are a science in design themselves. Just > > > not anything will make a good boat anchor. > > > > > > Ok guys, show your knowledge. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: BEWARE Re: I need a favor. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 05:02:27 GMT -------- Commander Robin (almost certainly at the behest of Batman Cass) wrote: > > Smaller group purchase? That was $2k worth of optics for $200. Now, yes I > suppose there is a possibility that this deal will go sour, but, as they say > in golf, the only shot you can be absolutely sure of is one that has already > been made. > > [COMMANDER] It's fun, taking "shots" with other people's money, isn't it Robin. You don't need to take half as careful an aim! 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Are they junk? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 05:09:44 GMT -------- "[©ØMMÄÑУ®]" wrote: > > Wow. I admire you TeeNut. You were, apparently, born a genius. Jeez, I wish > I was like you, you know, never having to be told how to do something, you > know, because you already know (cause you were born a genius). Perhaps we > can discuss some stuff in privet e-mail.. I have some questions about some > pretty obscure things, but you should know the answer (Why? Well, because > you were born knowing all, remember?) > > You get my drift... > > [COMMANDER] > No. Perhaps you could expand a little..My copy came across with the ink all smeared from the froth and spit splashed all over it. Do tell me how you first came to realise I was a genius..Surely not from my previous post, which simply asked if Cass is not the expert in your group..perhaps you are? I don't need to be a genius to ask an obvious question like that..just a simple country boy! ;^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: BEWARE Re: I need a favor. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 05:16:28 GMT -------- Does the Truant Officer know you take time off from kindergarten to work in a laser lavatory? The point is, my dear child, that THIS time you are fooling with OTHER peoples money. Most of those people are GROWN UPS..and they don't like people like you and Cassie taking badly aimed shots with THEIR hard earned money. Some of those grown ups are just mean enough to come an FIND you if you do that..and you wouldn't enjoy that. teenut "[©ØMMÄÑУ®]" wrote: > > Who in the what now? I didn't get that... If you suggesting that it was not > my money that paid for those optics, you have assumed incorrectly (must be > trendy here). I work hard for my money, plus go to school, plus I work in a > university laser lab. > > Good evening. > > [COMMANDER] > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote in message > news:Dh6X3.1285$pY2.88865@news.rdc1.tn.home.com... > > > > > > Commander Robin (almost certainly at the behest of Batman Cass) wrote: > > > > > > Smaller group purchase? That was $2k worth of optics for $200. Now, yes > I > > > suppose there is a possibility that this deal will go sour, but, as they > say > > > in golf, the only shot you can be absolutely sure of is one that has > already > > > been made. > > > > > > [COMMANDER] > > > > It's fun, taking "shots" with other people's money, isn't it Robin. You > don't > > need to take half as careful an aim! > > > > 8^) > > > > teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Are they junk? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 05:21:01 GMT -------- Cass wrote: > > Well now, Robert, the truth comes out that you have never used any of > the mentioned machines. Have you ever used a 3in1 machine at all? I was waiting for you to put up a compelling case for one..then I was going to buy one. I heard there is this GREAT DEAL going down with some genius in a Laser group!! If you like I can get you his home number! teenut > > What about your other vocal cohorts? Have they ever used a 3in1 > machine? > > Cass > http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Station/2727/ > > -- > x-no-archive: yes > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote in message > news:606X3.1273$pY2.88844@news.rdc1.tn.home.com... > > > > > > Cass wrote: > > > > > > Are you now afraid to voice your opinion? What frightened you, > the > > > flame? > > > > Which particular flame was that Cassie my dear? 8^) > > > > > > So many people on here speak their mind. Why not render your > opinion > > > on those brand-names? > > > > I have no personal experience of any of the three in one type > machines...so I > > have no opinion on which brand names are any better than any other. > > > > You, on the other hand, have surely been researching and testing > machines and > > suppliers all over the world..on behalf of your trusting "groupies" > (You HAVE > > been working hard, on their behalf and preparing to present a full > technical > > rundown on the alternatives available and the reasons for your final > > selection..Haven't you??) > > > > With all your assurances I am sure that, by now, you have built up a > dossier on > > the technical specifications, strengths, weaknesses, spares and > service > > organisations etc., so that you can offer a deal, worthy of the > trust you ask of > > people, and one not simple based upon the cheapest price you can > find. > > > > That would be a dishonest thing to do wouldn't it Cass?...Leading > all those > > trusting people astray! > > > > You are not that kind of person..we know that because you keep > telling us so. > > > > Isn't that right Cass? > > > > 8^) > > > > teenut > > > > > > -- > > > x-no-archive: yes > > > > > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote in message > > > news:AX4X3.1250$pY2.87732@news.rdc1.tn.home.com... > > > > You are the "EXPERT" Cass (or whatever your real name is)..Why > don't > > > you give us > > > > a rundown on the merits of these machines. > > > > > > > > 8^) > > > > > > > > teenut > > > > > > > > Cass wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Since we have so very many experts here, I would like opinions > on > > > > > whether the following 3in1 machines (lathe/mill/drill) are > junk: > > > > > Smithy, Grizzly, Shoptask, Harbor Freight, Enco. > > > > > > > > > > I would just like to get a consensus of opinion as to the idea > > > that > > > > > the above listed machines are not worth having and are > dangerous > > > (as > > > > > one said) and are suitable only for boat anchors. However, > for > > > those > > > > > in the know, boat anchors are a science in design themselves. > > > Just > > > > > not anything will make a good boat anchor. > > > > > > > > > > Ok guys, show your knowledge. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Not your typical Mill question From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 05:33:34 GMT -------- Brings back memories of the huge Planer-Mills at my "Alma Mater"..The chips would, quite literally, punch holes in 16 gage steel chip shields!! teenut "Fitch R. Williams" wrote: > I've gotten reasonably good at setting up shields made out of aluminum > foil to catch the ships and contain the coolant spray. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: BEWARE Re: I need a favor. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 05:36:15 GMT -------- Cass wrote: > > Robert, > > You see, here you go trying to get started with Robin. Not me Cassie my lovely...boys are not my style. 'sides..you saw him first!! He is all yours! 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Are they junk? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 05:38:56 GMT -------- Cass wrote: > > Robin was being facetious. Robin takes after you..both of you are totally fecal. 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: BEWARE Re: I need a favor. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 05:44:40 GMT -------- No Cassie, I already said..I was waiting (with bated breathe, no less) for YOU to tell me which was the best one to buy! Surely YOU Cassie, as the BRAINS behind this wonderful plan would have that kind of information at your fingertips (Do wash them if you have been playing with Robin again) 8^) teenut Cass wrote: > > Robert, > > Have you ever used a 3in1 lathe/mill/drill machine combination? If > so, what brand-name and model? > > Cass > http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Station/2727/ > > -- > x-no-archive: yes > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote in message > news:Mu6X3.1298$pY2.89170@news.rdc1.tn.home.com... > > Does the Truant Officer know you take time off from kindergarten to > work in a > > laser lavatory? > > > > The point is, my dear child, that THIS time you are fooling with > OTHER peoples > > money. > > > > Most of those people are GROWN UPS..and they don't like people like > you and > > Cassie taking badly aimed shots with THEIR hard earned money. > > > > Some of those grown ups are just mean enough to come an FIND you if > you do > > that..and you wouldn't enjoy that. > > > > teenut > > > > > > > > "[©ØMMÄÑУ®]" wrote: > > > > > > Who in the what now? I didn't get that... If you suggesting that > it was not > > > my money that paid for those optics, you have assumed incorrectly > (must be > > > trendy here). I work hard for my money, plus go to school, plus I > work in a > > > university laser lab. > > > > > > Good evening. > > > > > > [COMMANDER] > > > > > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote in message > > > news:Dh6X3.1285$pY2.88865@news.rdc1.tn.home.com... > > > > > > > > > > > > Commander Robin (almost certainly at the behest of Batman Cass) > wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Smaller group purchase? That was $2k worth of optics for $200. > Now, yes > > > I > > > > > suppose there is a possibility that this deal will go sour, > but, as they > > > say > > > > > in golf, the only shot you can be absolutely sure of is one > that has > > > already > > > > > been made. > > > > > > > > > > [COMMANDER] > > > > > > > > It's fun, taking "shots" with other people's money, isn't it > Robin. You > > > don't > > > > need to take half as careful an aim! > > > > > > > > 8^) > > > > > > > > teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Internal Turning tools From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 06:05:26 GMT -------- Congratulations..sounds like a quantum leap forward. What style and size of insert are they Pete? Ta s'much. 8^) Teenut "Fitch R. Williams" wrote: > > Rutland had a set of sale for the last month. I finally managed to > make it in there, order them, and picked them up today. It was a > 3/8", 1/2", 5/8", and 3/4" set of bars, 15 carbide inserts, some extra > screws and a nice wooden case. Price was ~$180. > > I've never had a set of real store bought insert type internal turning > tools before - definitely excited. Opened the box right in the store > and discovered they were made in USA. So were the inserts. Nice box. > Nice inserts. I'm genuinely excited. > > Hurried home, picked up the horse trailer for tomorrow, fed the > horses, cleaned the stalls, filled the water buckets, loaded tack in > trailer for tomorrow, grabbed a sandwich in the kitchen (Nedra and > Tiph are off to a college rodeo) and headed, finally (!!) for the shop > to try these beauties out beginning with the partially bored bushing > project already in the lathe. > > Clamped the 3/4" bar in the tool holder and proceeded to put a > beautiful finish the 25mm bore on a piece of really awful turning > piece of HRS to the desired .986" (25mm +0.002"). I was boring a > blind hole 2.5" deep at 1550 rpm. .010 doc, .00125"/rev. I cut going > in to the stop (I use the SB carriage stop on the 12x36 import), > finished the last few thou moving the carriage by hand, turned off the > spindle, reversed the carriage feed, revved her up and machined back > out of the hole. Boy I gotta tell you I am positively delighted with > the results. > > This 3/4" boring bar is so much better than trying to make do with the > carbide bars from my 2" boring head that even to mention them both in > the same sentence is almost irrational. > > I'm making some bushings to repair a brand new after market bucket for > my little excavator. Bucket came with 1" holes, excavator, Japanese, > has 25mm shafts. Bucket was made in USA too (but not at JPL or > Lockheed)! > > I regret I didn't get this set soon enough to pass on the word, but it > is a very nice set of tools. > > I am looking forward to re bushing the excavator arm. > > Fitch"needs to buy some metric micrometers"Williams > In So. Cal. > > The FAQ for RCM is: http://w3.uwyo.edu/~metal > Metal Web News at http://www.mindspring.com/~wgray1/ > The "Drop Box" is at http://www.metalworking.com/ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: I don't care if it is only a kit of parts From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 09:38:01 GMT -------- Oh, they were only joshin'! I am looking about for a small back-up and second op lathe, to complement the Maximat Super II that I already have. I even went so far as to buy a little 8mm Levin as the basis. BIG mistake!! A compound slide rest for one of those costs as much as a big 3 in 1 machine!! Scratch that avenue! By the time one has bought one of the "Aesthetically Acceptable" small lathes (Derbyshire, Levin, Habeggar,Lorch, Myford etc.) AND tooled it up, the cost is exceeding that of a brand new 13 x 40 Jet. For MY purposes I am going to look HARD at that little 7" import! Even if it IS only a kit of parts!! Anyone want to buy a MINT Levin? ;^) teenut Hardly look wrote: > > Robert, > Regardless of the stupid remarks by some of the RCM "Intelligencia", these > aren't bad little lathes. They are a "kit" ,but mine will cut .0002 from end > to end on a 1"bar. I had to do a little work on the dirve system due to > misalignment, but nothing too major. I did diassemble it completely, clean and > repaint it. And I had to modify the tail stock to improve adjustability, but > it is a nice addition to the shop. I use it a lot on small stuff in fact, come > to think of it, I probably use it more than my Logan. > > Gary Hallenbeck ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: BEWARE Re: I need a favor. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 11:22:07 GMT -------- I BEG your pardon Tom!! In the first instance that professional slur was TOTALLY uncalled for! In the second..I have never been in the Real Estate Business! Ever! teenut tmartin@xtra.co.nz wrote: > > Bloody hell Robert! Give it a rest! > Isn't it a case of the pot calling the kettle black? > Your given "profession" has been credited with more scams than > any other! I refer to real estate etc. > CAVEAT EMPTOR!!!!!!! > > Tom Martin > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > Does the Truant Officer know you take time off from kindergarten to work in a > > laser lavatory? > > > > The point is, my dear child, that THIS time you are fooling with OTHER peoples > > money. > > > > Most of those people are GROWN UPS..and they don't like people like you and > > Cassie taking badly aimed shots with THEIR hard earned money. > > > > Some of those grown ups are just mean enough to come an FIND you if you do > > that..and you wouldn't enjoy that. > > > > teenut > > > > "[©ØMMÄÑУ®]" wrote: > > > > > > Who in the what now? I didn't get that... If you suggesting that it was not > > > my money that paid for those optics, you have assumed incorrectly (must be > > > trendy here). I work hard for my money, plus go to school, plus I work in a > > > university laser lab. > > > > > > Good evening. > > > > > > [COMMANDER] > > > > > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote in message > > > news:Dh6X3.1285$pY2.88865@news.rdc1.tn.home.com... > > > > > > > > > > > > Commander Robin (almost certainly at the behest of Batman Cass) wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Smaller group purchase? That was $2k worth of optics for $200. Now, yes > > > I > > > > > suppose there is a possibility that this deal will go sour, but, as they > > > say > > > > > in golf, the only shot you can be absolutely sure of is one that has > > > already > > > > > been made. > > > > > > > > > > [COMMANDER] > > > > > > > > It's fun, taking "shots" with other people's money, isn't it Robin. You > > > don't > > > > need to take half as careful an aim! > > > > > > > > 8^) > > > > > > > > teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Are they junk? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 20:05:26 GMT -------- mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > Lemme check my archives here, Mr. B - hmm... walked 17 miles uphill > both ways in snow 'up to here' in the big one of '88. I would > respectfully submit that kinda squeezes you out of the boy > catagory! It was the big one of '08 not '88 ;^) > > Jim (dodging that nice leatherette-covered Gerstner toolbox that > Robert hurls in my direction. You really, really got a deal > on that one.) > I did didn't I. 8^) Someone was asleep at the switch! teenut ======== Newsgroups: alt.machines.cnc,rec.aviation.homebuilt,rec.aviation.restoration,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: BEWARE Re: I need a favor. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 20:46:23 GMT -------- When a L/C expires, confirmed or otherwise, it isn't worth the paper it is printed on. Even given that all parties are totally honest, above board, and willing to conclude the transaction..it is still worthless and a new one must be obtained. That, in itself, can be a long and expensive process. (Even obtaining an extension is a PITA) Exporters to certain "third world" countries, soon find out that even a "CILoC" is no guarantee that their goods will not be spirited out of a bonded port area, without payment ever being received. A few dollars to customs, shipping and banking officials and you are SOL!! Add to the spec'n..."Confirmed, Irrevocable LoC".."Drawn on a Bank in LONDON (NEW YORK etc)"..Banks in other parts of the world are often just "Brass Plates"...not worth the brass they are engraved upon!! teenut (Who learned the hard way!!) Spehro Pefhany wrote: > > In rec.crafts.metalworking George McDuffee wrote: > > > -- > > Make that a confirmed non-expiring irrevocable L/C > > George- > > The ones I have seen expire in 180 days or something like that. Would this > give the supplier the option of shipping a year down the road and still > be guaranteed payment, or am I misunderstanding it? > > -- > =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= > Spehro Pefhany "The Journey is the reward" > speff@interlog.com > Fax:(905) 271-9838 (small micro system devt hw/sw + mfg) > =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Shaper/slotting head for Bridgeport From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 13 Nov 1999 22:01:38 GMT -------- I seem to recall someone was looking for one of these: http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=199604543 Good luck. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Are they junk? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 03:23:21 GMT -------- Thank God your Angel prevailed Jim!! My devil had me by the nuts on that one...If yours had been in control too, one or other of us would be looking for a new home by now!! teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article , > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > > > I did didn't I. 8^) Someone was asleep at the switch! > > Actually, no - I watched the auction end. I had the one little > guy on one shoulder, pitchfork in hand. And the other little guy > was on the other shoulder, with the halo. > > You can figure out who prevailed! > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Pumpkins And Pressure Vessels From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 05:28:36 GMT -------- The recoil will be spectacular!...Hope he has skids on his butt! teenut brian whatcott wrote: > > But one thing I think you have right - the kick from a big bore gun. > I've got a feeling that the punkin chunkin enthusiast thinks he's dealing > with a rocket launcher - with zero recoil, instead of a big game rifle > and then some... > > Brian Whatcott Altus OK > > In article <382e2880@news.iglou.com>, mjr@iglou.com says... > > > >Instead of carrying your reservoir of pressure around, why not > >create it as needed, i.e. make a spud gun that would shoot your > >pumpkins. If this thing is shoulder fired you are going to get a > >pretty good kick launching a 4 inch pumpkin 3 football fields > >plus. > > > >Try this: http://www.mshamash.com/spud/spudgun1.html > > >> >Scott > >> >A chunker from Pennsylvania ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Heads up for the casters From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 14 Nov 1999 06:04:13 GMT -------- http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=200025168 New, unused pyramid furnace for someone! FWIW teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Pumpkins And Pressure Vessels From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 14:38:07 GMT -------- IIRC the PIAT "Bomb" was launched by an explosive charge, fired by a pin that was powered by the enormous spring you mentioned. The pin/spring and the heavy weight the spring powered were there to act as a counter to the enormous recoil...as the bomb was launched in one direction, the weight was pushed in the other against, and recocking, the spring. This is termed a "Differential Recoil" system. Even so, the recoil of the PIAT was legendary. If our "Punkin" chucker can provide a few basic figures..weight of projectile, muzzle velocity, weight of gun etc I can calculate the recoil energy in ft lbs and provide some comparisons to judge the effective recoil by. It IS going to be pretty horrendous..I doubt a tripod will provide anything more than a bit of extra metal to go bounding down the field after him! An alternative to the compressed air might be a blank 12 gauge crtridge in what is called a "Hi-Lo Pressure" system. The cartidge is fired into a thickwalled breech or barrel section, and the gases metered through smaller vents into the thinner walled barrel. This system, developed by the Germans during WW2 for an antitank gun, is used today in the US 40MM grenade launcher. In this application, the heavy pressure section and the metering orrifices are part of the cartridge case. teenut Gunner wrote: > > The British during WW2 had a antitank "gun" called the PIAT. This > monstrosity launched a 3lb finned shape charge with an effective range > of about 150 meters. > It was spring powered. It took two men to cock it, and one really > ornery heavy weight to "fire" it. > www.gunpartsinc.com has an illustration of it on its cover, as well > as a parts list. > > As was related to me many years ago, by a Grenadier, it was well known > for sending its users to the infirmary with > dislocated/broken/shattered shoulders, clavicles etc. > Ouch!! > > Gunner > > Charles Gallo wrote: > > >On Sat, 13 Nov 1999 15:44:21 GMT, Scott@*remove*erols.com (Scott) > >wrote: > > > >>Dear Engineers, > >> > >>I plan on designing a shoulder mounted punkin chunker. > > > > > >> My goal is entertain the crowd during down times with a > >>hand held shoulder mounted air gun capable of shooting a 4 inch > >>diameter pumpkin. > > > >I've got a silly question. A 4" Pumpkin has to weigh in at about a > >pound. How much recoil are you going to have here? How about a > >broken shoulder? > > > >Charlie > > > >-- PGP Key on Request > >For the Children RKBA! > > --------------------------------------------------------- > > "A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an > invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write > a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort > the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, > solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program > a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die > gallantly. Specialization is for insects." Robert Heinlein ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: vacumn sweeper motor From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 20:58:40 GMT -------- NEW Vacuum Sweepers? Motorised Belly Button Fluff Brushes? Or any one of a coupla billion other, useful or useless, motorised devices! What would YOU like to make with them? Give us a hint and we could maybe be a bit more specific. 8^) teenut scheblej@my-deja.com wrote: > > have a few old motor's what kinda of project can I make to use them on. > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Rifling Leads From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 21:16:00 GMT -------- First thing Dave..I see you are in the UK. As a on time native/resident of that "Septic...er..Sceptered Isle" I can tell you that you can go to jail for even THINKING about building a firearm!! If field stripping an old Enfield is beyond you...how do you expect to BUILD a useable weapon...with or without drawings? Start by pulling the Enfield to bits..go ahead, you won't hurt it!! Learn how all the bits fit together and how they work together. Learn how to clean and reassemble it..the poor thing is probably in dire need of a bit of TLC. There "USED" to be an outfit in the UK that supplied dimensioned drawings for the Colt Navy "Black powder" Revolver. This is the only type of legal firearm you are likely to be able to build...or get PUBLIC support in the building thereof..The advertised in Model Engineer many years ago. That is the ONLY source I have ever seen for the kind of details you are asking for. Any library in the UK will provide a list of available books on Firearms..get the list and start reading..and reading...and reading!! The information you seek is there..but NOT all on one piece of paper I'm afraid. teenut Dave Phillips wrote: > > sunworshiper wrote: > > > Teenut; Great info. and sites. I don't want to make a gun. (Got one) > > I need to build a machine to go into production of my patented > > invention. Can you explain the spiral gear train and the sine bar > > helical generator? BTW I need the outside cut , not the inside. > > I was just curious as what the leads were. Mine is one turn in 6'. > > Need some different concepts before I go too far. > > > > The Sun shines , people forget. > > > > Without the Sun none of us would be here. > > > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > > Before you buy. > > Sorry to interupt, but I do, want to make a gun that is. I have an > Enfield 303 (smooth bored) and a pidely little air rifle I use for > "playing" with rats. I`d rather not take appart either. For fear the > Enfield might disintigrate! > > This is where my problem lies, has anybody come across > detailed/descriptive diagram(s) of an action suitable for a small > non-descript handgun. To be built as a mechanism display more than > anything. At anytime? > I`ve searched all (most) of the usual manufacturers etc. but came up > against that old cherry, the patent, and a distinct unwillingness to > show off their secrets. > > If anyone can be of any help it would be appreciated and would save me > the time and headache of stripping down and redesgning Mr Enfields > original masterpiece. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Pumpkins And Pressure Vessels From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 21:20:06 GMT -------- Dan Bollinger wrote: > > :) You're welcome, I reserve the right to call mine that name too :) > Dan Recoil can't be much worse than a 12ga. Whooo Boy! are YOU in for a surprise!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Pumpkins And Pressure Vessels From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 15 Nov 1999 21:23:30 GMT -------- Nope Dan! The Zalinski "Dynamite Guns" used compressed air ONLY as a propellant! The projectile contained Dynamite. The reason for using air was that dynamite was too sensitive in those days, to withstand the shock of firing using Black Powder as a propellant. teenut Dan Bollinger wrote: > > teenut, This method of propulsion was used much earlier in the so-called > Dynamite guns. They are considered airguns even though the air pressure was > generated by igniting dynamite. The USS Vesuvius had 15 inchers as did some > shore batteries. Dan > > > An alternative to the compressed air might be a blank 12 gauge crtridge in > what > > is called a "Hi-Lo Pressure" system. The cartidge is fired into a > thickwalled > > breech or barrel section, and the gases metered through smaller vents into > the > > thinner walled barrel. > > > > This system, developed by the Germans during WW2 for an antitank gun, is > used > > today in the US 40MM grenade launcher. In this application, the heavy > pressure > > section and the metering orrifices are part of the cartridge case. > > > > teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Really unusual tap From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 04:08:38 GMT -------- If it really is #10 size (Approx 3/16") diameter, and it really is 20 tpi then it is not a Whitworth or BSF thread. There is no "Number series" of threads as in the SAE (10 -24, 6-40) etc So the size would be 3/16 - 24 if it were BSW or 3/16" - 32 if it were BSF. Could it be a badly worn or rusted 1/4 - 20 ? That would gibe with either BSW or SAE teenut John Hofstad-Parkhill wrote: > > > Are you sure they are not Whitworth threads? Just a thought, because > > my Stanley plane is definitely Whitworth. > > Whitworth! > > Oh great. Just great. > > John "wouldn't-know-a-Whitworth-thread-if-he-saw-one" H-P ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Pumpkins And Pressure Vessels From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 16 Nov 1999 20:14:23 GMT -------- Your "average" elephant gun would be sadly underpowered with only 300 grains @ 2400! That would be equivalent to a .375 H&H..Yes it would kill an elephant...but I wouldn't rely on it to STOP one that was pissed off at you!! Try .500 Jeffery..535 gn @ 2450 .505 Gibbs....525 gn @ 2350 on up .577 Nitro Express 750 gn @ 2050 .600 Nitro Express 900 gn @ 1950 .700 Nitro Express 1000 gn @ 2000 Minimum caliber allowed in most countries, for elephant is the .416 (410 @ 2400) and you wouldn't use that without a Professional backup with something a lot heavier. (at least not as a regular habit!!) http://www.angelfire.com/mo2/rifleroom/recoil.html Plug some of those numbers into the above formula..using a rifle weight of 11 to 13 pounds and a charge wt of 12 to 20 grains. Then plug in the "punking gun with a projectile weighing 2 lbs (14000 Grains) and an MV of 350 fps!! teenut brian whatcott wrote: > > In article <3831386a.3124373@news.erols.com>, > Scott@*remove*erols.com says... > > > >Those guys use plastic PVC! Wow thats pretty dangerouse > >I'm not gonna do that. Nope steel is my material of choice. > >I need the weight any way. It dampen the recoil. > > I surprised myself. > I ran the numbers on yr average elephant gun > (300 grain at 2400 fps) > It does not pale to insignificance beside a gourdzooka > pushing a one pound fruit with 150 psi (initial). > so maybe you WILL live to brag about it! :-) > > Brian Whatcott Altus OK ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Pumpkins And Pressure Vessels From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 01:06:30 GMT -------- Well Brian..In this case you are not difficult to contradict!! The Load for elephant in a 458 Winchester magnum would be a 500 grain Solid (Full metal Jacket) at 2470 fps. 300 grain is a pipsqueak load even for the much over-rated and increasingly distrusted 458 Winchester Magnum. Far superior rounds are available and, for the guy contemplating a once in a lifetime, $10 to $20,000 safari, the 458 Win is too iffy to risk! teenut brian whatcott wrote: > > I thought I would quote representative numbers, as I fully expected > someone to pop up. (That's why I am quite difficult to contradict :-) > > So let me quote Sierra's Manual on the .458 Winchester Magnum: > "Introduced in '56, the .458 Winchester Magnum has become very > popular with African hunters, and has superseded many of the older > big bore "express" cartridges.... > > All the same, I personally think this *is* a light round for the purpose. > Possibly because Sierra do not have a heavier round in the caliber. > Even so, (to get back on topic), it is somewhat comparable to Scott's > intended shoulder arm. > > Brian Whatcott Altus OK > > In article , > "teenut"@hotmail.com says... > > > >Your "average" elephant gun would be sadly underpowered with only 300 > grains @ > >2400! That would be equivalent to a .375 H&H. /snip/ > >teenut > > > >brian whatcott wrote: > >> /snip/ > >> I surprised myself. > >> I ran the numbers on yr average elephant gun > >> (300 grain at 2400 fps) > >> It does not pale to insignificance beside a gourdzooka > >> pushing a one pound fruit with 150 psi (initial). > >> so maybe you WILL live to brag about it! :-) > >> > >> Brian Whatcott Altus OK ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Pumpkins And Pressure Vessels From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 12:43:38 GMT -------- "Water Shot" were used to test big guns is situations where a solid practice shot could not be fired..for example from Coastal Defense guns, overlooking busy, peacetime shipping lanes. They were prefered by the gun crews to "Sand Shot" as there was a lot less clean up to do afterwards! One of the first "Recoil-less" guns was the 2, 6 and 12 pounder Davis gun. Designed for use on aircraft during the first world war, it fired a solid projectile towards the enemy, and an equal weight "counter shot" of lead dust and vaseline out of the other end. teenut Robert Nichols wrote: Actually I'm not sure how essential the > deflector is at all. It's likely that the balloon would rupture in the > barrel and that only a high velocity spray would exit the rear muzzle, > but I'd feel safer if there were some object back there to ensure that > would happen. Of course you do have to ensure that the deflector or > disperser does not break loose and become a projectile itself. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Pumpkins And Pressure Vessels From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 13:18:41 GMT -------- IIRC the British Police only collected hand guns..Yet!! In any case..most of the big old British guns are already in American collections...or still very much in use in Africa! The biggest manufacturer of Brass for these guns (Bertram) is in Australia!! where the local gun laws are even more restrictive than in the UK..go figure!! The "big bores" have seen a tremendous revival in interest recently..prtly due to the large number of wealthier "Baby Boomers" now retiring and determined to fit in that "Safari of a Lifetime". "Modern" calibers, such as the 458 Winchester and the more recent 416 Remington Magnum have been found to be somewhat less than desireable than all the promotional hype would have had people believe. The 458 was designed to minimal size in order to fit into standard size actions. This results in loads that have to be heavily compressed, just to get enough "fuel in the can" These compressed loads have lead to some highly variable pressures under field use. In any case the 458 Factory loads have been found to give ballistics well below the "Official" velocities. The 416 Rem Mag should never have reached the market place!! It is again, an attempt to fit a quart in a pint pot. Pressures, at normal ambient temperatures are up in the high ranges, even for modern rifle actions. In the higher temperatures of Africa, those pressures skyrocket. Sticky extraction is the last thing a hunter needs when a wounded Buff decides to make him part of the landscape! The enduring "strength" of the old British "Big Bores" is that they achieve their impressive ballistics at LOW breech pressures, and because they are generally of a larger case capacity, those pressures tend to STAY lower, even in elevated ambient temperatures. The venerated .577 3" Nitro Express has still to be bettered as an all-round "Dangerous Game" load...and there it would rest! Except that it is designed for use in double rifles and the cost of those is prohibitively high for all but the wealthiest of hunters. The search is still on for an acceptable equivalent loading, suitable for use in a bolt action rifle. Recoil of these big guns is "Stiff"..but very handleable in a properly stocked and heavy enough rifle. Not the sort of thing you would want to shoot all day off a bench..but nowhere near the vicious smack one gets from say a .378 Weatherby. I fired one of those ONE time..never again!! How our "Punkin Plinker" would feel, is open to so many different factors as to be a matter of pure conjecture. Sheer foot pounds of recoil energy do not tell the complete story..the recoil VELOCITY plays a big part in PERCEIVED recoil... I know for sure..I will let someone else take the first shot!! 8^) teenut brian whatcott wrote: > > In article , > "teenut"@hotmail.com says... > > > >Well Brian..In this case you are not difficult to contradict!! > > Let's see: I agree that the 300 grain bullet is a light load for this big > game caliber. But you are plainly in love with the old express > calibers. > (S'funny, I thought those were all collected up by the British police > in the last year or two?) :-) > > But to get back to the point: how do you think the recoil of the > elephant gun of *YOUR* choice compares with Scott's bazooka? > > Brian W > > >brian whatcott wrote: > > >> So let me quote Sierra's Manual on the .458 Winchester Magnum: > >> "Introduced in '56, the .458 Winchester Magnum has become very > >> popular with African hunters, and has superseded many of the older > >> big bore "express" cartridges.... > >> > >> All the same, I personally think this *is* a light round for the purpose. > >> >> I ran the numbers on yr average elephant gun > >> >> (300 grain at 2400 fps) > >> >> It does not pale to insignificance beside a gourdzooka > >> >> pushing a one pound fruit with 150 psi (initial). > >> >> so maybe you WILL live to brag about it! :-) > >> >> > >> >> Brian Whatcott Altus OK ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Shaper toolpost ring? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 17 Nov 1999 14:00:55 GMT -------- Usually it is grooved or serrated and provides a narrower (read higher pressure) area on which to grip the tool shank or holder. It is also Hardened and protects the unhardened clapper block surface...it would ventually get dinged and dented to the point where it might be difficult to set a tool at JUST the angle you needed. The slot in the Lantern is round ended..This ring provides the flat "Bottom" you need to clamp the tool on. Lastly, it raises the tool clear, not just of the clapper block surface, but the side walls of the clapper box...if any chips were to get trapped between the bottom of the tool and the top surface of the box "wall", then your tool would not "return to battery" properly. If you can't immediately obtain a "pukka" SB ring..try an old ball or roller bearing ring as a temporary substitute. Even a soft, shop made steel ring would last for quite a while between cleanups...the surface will get dinged and bent eventually. teenut George Glines wrote: > > The parts list I received from South Bend for my 7" shaper shows a toolpost > ring that slips over the tool post. It looks to sit behind the toolbit or > toolbit holder and rest on the clapper. My shaper doesn't have one. > > What is the purpose of this ring? > > Thanks, > > George ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Flat faceplate From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 00:32:23 GMT -------- Hold a straight edge or parallel in the 4-Jaw (easier to do it "kitty corner" through the jaws)..you could even hold it in the three jaw. Tram the spindle around and adjust the st edge until you get the same reading at both ends. It is now square to the lathe axis. Now run your TDI across (along) the straight edge..using the cross slide traverse. Any deviation from edge to middle will indicate the out of squareness of the cross slide. Ideally it should register from 0 to .0005" concave in 6" radius. teenut LRHermit wrote: > > Ok you guys, how would you go about proving that your > cross slide is indeed cutting perpendicular to the spindle > axis? The two collar test only proves the tool is cutting > parallel to the axis and verifies the bed alignment. Mount > a dial indicator on the faceplate and tram two points on > the vertical edge of the cross slide? Nah, the edge may > not be parallel to the dovetail. Mount the dial indicator to > the cross slide and pan across the faceplate? Nah, it just > proves that the tool is traveling parallel with the > dovetail, not > necessarily parallel to the faceplate. How do you prove > that the dovetail is true to the faceplate? Perhaps it is > really > simple but right now it escapes me! It seems to me that > there must be a way to make a pass across a faceplate > and then prove it's flatness still mounted on the spindle. > Phil Kangas ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Deep hole drilling From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 03:34:30 GMT -------- Try a parabolic flute drill..from your usual supplier. They are designed to drill deeper holes, faster and clear the chips better. You might want to try a carbide tipped one...run faster and sharpen less often. The next stage up in deep hole drilling gets real expensive..real fast!! teenut Gilles Jalbert wrote: > > I'm trying to improve on the time it takes me to drill 1/4" by 6-1/2" deep > holes in mild steel in my lathe. After the hole is started with a center > drill and followed by a jobbers drill to approximately 2 inches, I'm using a > 12 inch extra long hole drill with soluble oil and many clearing cycles. I > have quite a few of these to do (an ongoing job) and would appreciate any > tips on speeding up the process. > > Gil ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: A clock this time, not a Glock, or Plock From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 03:40:15 GMT -------- John Hofstad-Parkhill wrote: > > I made one of those DI clocks today. Your next assignment..Should you choose to accept it.....Is to make a Co-Axial Dial Indicator from a "Big Ben" alarm clock!! 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Southern Amateur Model Show From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 04:10:19 GMT -------- How far is Bonner from Birmingham and/or Atlanta? Thanks, teenut Dave wrote: > > Hello fellow modeler, model supplier and anyone interested. > > This email is to inform you of our upcoming model show this December > 3rd. and 4th 1999. > Our goal is to have a big model show in the South like the big NAMES > show is in the North. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Need tiny metric screw -- M 1.5 x 0.35 From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 04:23:00 GMT -------- If it is European Made..it is likely that the thread is a Swiss "Systeme Thury" The British BA System (British Association) threads are based on the Thury system and have the same 47 1/2 deg flank angle. The nearest to Your 1.6mm x .35 mm would be 10 BA which has a diameter of 1.7 mm x .35 mm pitch. I have a tap and die if you need it Pete! teenut "DoN. Nichols" wrote: > > In article <01bf30e8$1182e480$1e367fcf@steveaus>, > Steve Austin wrote: > > > >PLAlbrecht wrote in article > ><19991115123015.05288.00001382@ng-ca1.aol.com>... > > [ ... ] > > >> Checking the pitch I get 0.35 (3.5 mm difference if I give the "nut" ten > >> turns). Is there such a critter as an M 1.6 x 0.35? > > [ ... ] > > >Did you try a 0-80 yet? > > That doesn't match up to 0.35mm close enough, but 72TPI is > pretty close. I get 72.57 TPI by converting 0.35mm pitch. That is only > 0.79% error. But 1-72 would come out to about 1.85mm clearance > diameter. An 0-80 would be 1.52mm clearance diameter. I wonder whether > 0-72 is a standard at all? > > Another consideration is that the thread may also not be a > standard 60 degree included angle. Some screws from glasses and similar > things have seemed to have a much wider included angle under > magnification. > > Who made the drafting tool? That might help in determining > whether it is a strange inch thread, or an strange (or even standard) > metric one. :-) > > Good Luck, > DoN. > -- > Email: | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564 > My Concertina web page: | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html > --- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero --- ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Deep hole drilling From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 07:05:32 GMT -------- Quicker peck drilling: Start with the tailstock quill fully retracted. Advance the drill, using the tailstock handwheel..one to two diameters of the drill. (ie 1/4 to 1/2" on a 1/4" drill bit) Now, do NOT retract the drill using the handwheel! Instead, UNLOCK the tailstock base and slide it back along the bed. Quick brush to remove chips, squirt of oil up the hole, and slide the tailstock so the drill bottoms in the hole. Relock the tailstock and recommence drilling with the handwheel. Eventually you run out of quill travel..just rewind on one of your out-trips and start over with fully retracted quill. (Those with a Southbend that takes a wrench to lock/unlock the tailstock are SOL on this method..but it works a treat with a lever locked T/s.) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Moore - flat stuff again From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 13:09:41 GMT -------- Hmm! Thar's Gold in them there book boxes!! I have an EXTRA copy of Machine Tool Reconditioning..Original printing, excellent condition. How much do you think it would fetch on Ebay? teenut Russ Kepler wrote: > > In article <80ne8u$d8g@enews2.newsguy.com>, > Michael P. Henry wrote: > >That's one of those books that's been on my wish list for quite a while. > >There's a copy listed on one of the used book seller sites, but the asking > >price is $125. Seems a bit high, but then "Machine Tool Reconditioning" > >lists for $90+ and that's been useful. Hope you got yours for less. > > Keep looking, and often. I finally got a copy for $65 from Powells > a couple weeks ago - this by haunting the web accessable lists for a > few months. I missed several at half the price... > > -- > Russ Kepler russ@kepler-eng.com > > Please Don't Feed the Engineers ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Machine Tool Reconditioning? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 20:53:49 GMT -------- Mark wrote: > > You have hit the nail on the head.... > > Not many scrapers left, anymore. > Not surprising..as John remarked, with "Machine Tool Reconditioning" as their "bible" most have disappeared up their own bums by now!! Hardly surprising too, that there is only the one definitive work on the subject..He was probably the only person who could stay awake during the writing of such a tome..ne'er mind the reading of it!! It is, nontheless, THE book that every would-be machine rebuilder needs to read. Every HSM machine tool user needs to rebuild..just ONE machine in a lifetime..(No John, not TAKING a lifetime 8^) It certainly gives a new appreciation of how accuracy is GENERATED from first principles. It also makes "Good Condition" machines, that seemed expensive once..seem a whole lot more reasonably priced all of a sudden! teenut (who has hung up his scrapers forever!!) (Hopefully) > John Hofstad-Parkhill wrote in message ... > >Bill: > > > >Don't do it. I beg of you. > > > >Ok, actually it is a really good book. There are things just about anybody > >can learn, even if you don't want to ever scrape again. > > > >It get's worse. Even after you swear off scraping, there will still be a > >little voice calling... > > > >The tone of the book, particularly in the early chapters, is in my mind > >_the_ definition of a super-anal perfectionist. I'm not sure I would have > >written it differently, although Ed does seem to take on airs about > >scrapers -vs- the rank ameteur. I would be one of the latter. > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Deep hole drilling From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 21:22:24 GMT -------- Hmm! Yes a parabolic drill will clear chips faster and easier than a regular "Jobber" type. However, a regular drill should not be loading up to that extent after only 1/2 a diameter of peck. Check that the drill is not excessively worn on the lands..a taper here will NOT help! Also check your grind and the chips it produces...is the drill loading up with compacted, fine chips, such that it is difficult to tell discrete chips apart? You may need to grind a "flatter point" (to direct chips in a more axial direction) and give it a bit more back relief..this with a thinned point will give easier penetration..Thus a stronger, more free-flowing chip and with less feed pressure (which will tend to force the point off track) Feeding too "gingerly" can also create broken "scrapings" rather than chips! When you have all the conditions right..speed, grind, alignment, coolant etc..then FEED it don't fudge it nervously along..the chip, produced as the drill designer intended, will scoot right up the flute, rather than collapsing on itself and creating a traffic jam at the tip. You should be feeding at .003" to .005" per rev.** Of course..all the above points apply equally to a parabollic fluted drill too..perhaps even more so. With that depth of hole, I would be using two or three different drills of graduated length..taking each one to within an inch of the end of the flutes before changing to the next longer drill. "peck" drilling should only be resorted to when the depth is such that the chips are not self clearing...so long as they are clearing..Press on! So long as the work is rotating and the drill is sharp and "fed" not "pushed", the drill will tend to remain self centered..unless you hit a hard spot or let the drill get loaded. Good luck teenut ** "Gun" drills on the other hand feed at about .0005" per rev but rely on high pressure oil, returning from the tip, to push the chips out. The Sandvic "Ejector" type drills I used to use would demand a feed rate from .015 to .025" per rev!! Not for the faint hearted!! Gilles Jalbert wrote: > > The procedure I'm using is almost exactly what Robert describes but, I sure > don't get 1 or 2 diameters of the drill in depth. Will a parabolic drill > make this much difference? I currently don't get much more than 1/8" before > I hear the drill loading up. > > Gil ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Off topic jeep leaf springs From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 23:22:34 GMT -------- How long since you cleaned the empty beer cans out of the back?? 8^) teenut Ian Weeks wrote: recently we have noticed an alarming phenomenon > all the vehicles are sinking at the rear!!! in fact the one with the > least mileage has now developed list to starboard at the back end.In > spection shows leaf springs have lost concavity and are either flat or > convex ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Flat faceplate From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 18 Nov 1999 23:56:24 GMT -------- Nigel Eaton wrote: > I have applied my limited intellect to this problem, and right now I > can't find the problem with this scheme.... > > How about: > > 1. Face a faceplate. > > 2. Clamp a 'thing' to the faced faceplate. > > 3. Face the 'thing' > > 4. Reverse the 'thing' (keeping its rotation relative to the faceplate > the same). > > 5. Face it again. > > 6. Mike it at the edges and in the middle. All readings should be > the same? > > So, where did I screw up? ;^) Nowhere Nigel, 'cept you took a dollar to do a five cent job! A parallel is straight right? Deviation from straight and from squareness to the true spindle axis is what we want to establish, Right? So, mount the parallel in the three or four jaw...gripped lightly between the SIDES of the jaws...it doesn't have to be dead on center. Now, with a dti held in the toolpost, touch it to one end of the Parallel and zero it. Turn the spindle through 180 deg and check for zero...adjust the parallel until you get zero on both ends as you turn them past the DTI. The parallel is now set SQUARE to the axis. Right? Now, simply traverse the cross side and DTI along the edge of the Parallel..towards the centerline of the lathe. Any deviation from squareness of the X slide to the true axis will show on the DTI as a direct reading!! QED! The tolerance to aim for is zero (Dead flat) to minus .0005" concave in 6" Radius. Convex is BAD (None of your machined faces will sit straight, bed or seal.) Teenut > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Deep hole drilling From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 02:00:05 GMT -------- Real Good Question!!! My answer would be yes..to straight flute..provided that the "top rake" angle that is provided by the spiral angle of a twist drill to the cutting edge could either be dispensed with or provided for by other means. One other provision...This is for straight in drilling..not for peck drilling (a pox on it!) When the drill is being frequently withdrawn to clear chips, then I would guess that the helix ange adds a bit of "Scoop" to the action. I have never seen a spiral flute, DEEP hole drill!! teenut Steen Family wrote: > > Question for you all on deep hole drilling. > > Would a straight flute drill be better on lathe applications? > > I always thought that in an auger situation you turn the auger not the tube. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Wrought Iron - Byers Company From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 02:10:19 GMT -------- For anyone wishing to explore further: Hurry!! http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=199172235 FWIW teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: WHO IS THE BEST AT TOTAL METAL RESTORATION WORK???? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 02:44:04 GMT -------- Grab the stick and pull it back..we heard you the first (few) times!! Can you spell SPAM!! teenut FVet100176 wrote: > > WHO IS THE BEST AT TOTAL METAL RESTORATION WORK?? > > EMPIRE METAL FINISHING > > http://www.frankievmetal.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Decorative metal arrowheads From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 06:26:19 GMT -------- Locate? As in there is only one and you lost it? Where did you last see it? ;^) Or...You are looking for a source? Is someone already making them? Out of what metal? The shape is that of a knapped flint arowhead so I assume the one(s) you are wishing to "locate" are cast..carving or forging the shape you show would get pretty expensive. Your best bet is with a working jeweler..he or she could knock you those things out in fine style..in Gold, silver, bronze, pewter.....NOT steel!! You would need to come back here for that! I could make them..as could many other contributors here..but they WILL be expensive!! 8^) good luck, teenut John Parkhurst wrote: > > Please forgive the tiny image below, but I need to locate this metal arrowhead, or > something like it...about half the size of this image. Thanks. > > John Parkhurst > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > [Image] ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Precision vise on Ebay From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 06:54:05 GMT -------- I "just happened to have" four toe clamps that were just the cats meow for holding this cute little "Cuter" on my Deckel table..fits like it was meant to be (That's a first!!) I got the toe clamps on Ebay too! Doncha hate it! (Quick dash down to basement, emerge with toe clamp and "very near" caliper (Brown & Sharpe..NIB, Ebay of course) ;^) Made from 4140 (I know 'cos the toolmaker that made, them stamped it on there for the heat treater to see..nice touch!) 1" x 5/8" X 2" long 7/16 " slot from one end to center to form a stubby U shape. butt end is radiused and drilled and tapped for jacking screw...use with a protective slip so as not to bruis the table..but no need to go hunting shims. Another nice touch. The square "business end has a step milled in it, 5/16" deep x 3/16" long..which leaves a tongue of the same dimensions. This tongue engages nicely in the slots cut along each side of the vise body. I use 3/8" cap screws and tee nuts all around..you will need to vary the dimensions to suit the size AND spacing of your table slots. Good luck! (Tasty little vice isn't it!) teenut PS, I got the clamps and a bunch more (all beautifully made) in a box load, at scrap metal prices, from Al Babin. Have done several deals with him..he really is a helluva nice guy to talk to! No complaints from 'ole teenut about 'ole Al!! "Michael P. Henry" wrote: > > Just thought I'd let you know that I took your advice and picked up one of > the Cuter vises that Cal Aero had up for auction. It's a Model 120 and just > arrived today. Apparently new as it was still vacuum sealed in aluminum, > complete with certification. Cost me $150+, but seems well worth the money > and it will be a nice addition to the 3" Kurt on my Clausing 8520 mill. > > One question if you don't mind - what sort of clamps do you use to mount it > to the table? The nose on the toe clamps in my import clamping set are too > big to fit the slots in the side of the vise. Seems like it wouldn't be too > hard to make something up from bar stock, but I'd rather spend the time on > other projects if something is available at reasonable price off the shelf. > > Robert Bastow wrote in message > news:381D0556.6A25E25C@home.com... > > I just took delivery of one of these Cuter vises..very nice!! > > > > Bigger than it looks..just the right size for my Deckel and as accurate as > I can > > measure. > > > > It appears to be machined from solid steel, hardened and ground all over > and > > comes with certificate of inspection. > > > > Just a satisfied customer..FWIW > > > > http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=188111295 > > > > teenut > > > > PS Anyone want to buy a brand-new-in-the-box 6" kurt clone w/swivel base. > Still > > in cosmoline! > > > > Nothing wrong..I just bought it and it is WAY too big for my Deckel!! > > > > OOPS! > > > > I will give a good deal on it..but be warned, shipping will be expensive x > > country..I am in Atlanta. > > > > Contact me direct.. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Deep hole drilling From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 08:05:41 GMT -------- Yer Dreamin' Gordon!! The 3/16" tube would wind up like a torque bar, snap back and repeat (chattering) for as long as the drill lip lasted (about 3 nano seconds!!) How are the chips going to get out? Up the annular space between the 3/16" tube and the 1/4" hole? Get real!! If you are going to tell him how to make a deep hole drill then at least tell him how to make one that will work. A SOLID carbide "D" drill brazed to a solid steel shank, or even a HSS "D" drill would eventually cut an accurate hole..but given the limited chip space available..it would mean an awfull lot of peckin' Given the length of hole and the facilities available, the advice already given on using and grinding a series of parabolic drills is the best bet. As I said in an earlier post..REAL deep hole drilling gets real complex, real expensive, real fast! Unless he is contemplating hundreds of parts, on an ongoing basis..it would be cheaper to job it out. Deep hole drilling services are surprisingly cheap when you consider the level of initial investment, tooling, and hard won expertise involved. teenut Gordon Couger wrote: > > On Thu, 18 Nov 1999 18:10:27 GMT, inet@intellisys.net (brian whatcott) > wrote: > > >In article > > >airnews.net>, valcraig@dhc.net says... > >> > >>"Gilles Jalbert" wrote: > >> > >>>I'm trying to improve on the time it takes me to drill 1/4" by 6-1/2" deep > >>>holes in mild steel in my lathe. After the hole is started with a center > >>>drill and followed by a jobbers drill to approximately 2 inches, I'm using a > > >The folks who really know how to drill deep holes, go after oil. > >They have a secret ingredient - mud. > >We can probably learn a thing or two from them > > > >I have a carbide triangular insert brazed like an arrow head > >into a plain steel shaft. The generous clearance is helpful. > >There is not a standard bit suited to a quarter inch hole though, > >so a little body language might be needed to reduce the diameter > >of the insert. > > > >But here's the thought: a thick wall tube could accomodate a brazed > >bit AND a suds passage. This would really help clear the swarf on > > a long hole, oilman-style, I'd think. > > > >This approach is overkill I'm sure for a six inch hole - but one of these > > days - it might be a six foot hole.... > > > > This is the best solution so far. > > If you can find a 1/4 inch peice of round carbide just point it and > grind it almost in half and grind a litte clearance on the point > cutting edge and braze to 3/16 tube and drill away. > > It's not over kill for a 50 to 1 hole but it will be a problem at a > quarter inch due to stiffness and clearance. It would work great > for a 1 inch hole 4 foot deep. > > gordon > Gordon Couger > Stillwater OK. > www.couger.com/gcouger > Remove the nospam from my return address ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Milling on a lathe From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 17:40:17 GMT -------- Francois, Do as I and a lot more people do.. Go to your friendly neighborhood scrap/machinery dealer and scrounge the top slide off an old lathe. (Translation of "scrounge"..take a couple of bottles of Vin Ordinaire with you..;^) Next go to your friendly neighborhood machine shop supplier..and buy a Taiwanese made PLAIN angle plate and a small "toolmakers vise" of the appropriate sizes. Stick them all together as seems appropriate..et, voila!!..Attachement pour le milling!! 8^) teenut "francois.terseur" wrote: > > I'm looking for a milling attachment for my lathe. Does anybody have > schematics, plans or drawings for building such an accessory ? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Using diamond wheel on toolpost grinder? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 19:17:45 GMT -------- I use a diamond wheel from time to time..only when I need to grind carbide though..special deep hole reamers mainly. Diamond wheels are only for use on VERY hard materials..Carbide, ceramics, glass etc...Anything softer will cause rapid clogging and wear. What makes you think that no "grit" is produced? Both the diamond particles torn off during dressing and usage, and the products of grinding are highly abrasive and I go to inordinate lengths to prevent any from getting into the slides and bearings of my lathe. teenut leonard@stearns.com wrote: > > Has anyone had experience using a diamond wheel on a toolpost grinder. > Seems to me like that would eliminate the problem of grit getting into > the machine. > > Is there some reason why everyone isn't doing it this way? > > Thanks for any advice. > > -- > Leonard Stearns > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Flat faceplate From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 19:41:56 GMT -------- You hit the nail on the head Len! Of course, you don't need to take a cut over your faceplate to determine if the cross slide is square to the axis. See my previous posts on the subject. Here is another, even EASIER way! Of course..you still need an accurately straight edged, parallel bar to do the job..but most people can obtain or make one...absent a surface plate a straight edge can be scraped up by spotting on the unworn sections of your lathe bed. All you need to do is chuck as big a chunk of metal as you have, or can hold in the lathe. Take a facing cut across it and then RELIEVE the center portion of the face by a few thou..just to leave a narrow raised rim around the periphery. Now, by geometrical definition, any straight edge, placed across the face of your piece is SQUARE to the axis of the lathe. (This is how you would make a Master Cylindrical Square) Hold the straight edge, horizontally across your test piece..using gentle pressure from the tailstock if you like. Now you can run the DTI down the legth of the Straight Edge and get a DIRECT reading of any deviation of the cross slide's movement from STRAIGHT or SQUARE to the lathe axis. 8^) teenut leonard@stearns.com wrote: > > I'm only a novice, but it seems to me that if you use this method of > using an indicator on the cross slide to check after making the facing > cut with that same cross slide, the result will appear to be true even > if the cross slide is not true. > > The method I use, though it may be naive, is to make the facing cut, > them place the faceplate face down on my surface plate and slide a shim > gage under the plate through the center hole. That should accurately > measure any convexity. Of course if the plate rocks when face down, > that's all you need to know. > > Am I missing something?? I'd appreciate some good advice. > > Len > > In article <3833556C.EF2B5F2C@halcyon.com>, > Grant Erwin wrote: > > Start with chuck on your spindle nose. Put a piece of 3" or 4" > aluminum > > pipe in the chuck, get both ends of the pipe running true with the > jaws > > snugged up tight. Take a light cut at opposite ends of the pipe. > Measure > > the diameter - when they're identical, then your spindle is true to > the > > bed. Put on the faceplate. Remember, it's running on a true spindle. > > Indicate out by the rim, and turn the faceplate. If the faceplate runs > > true, then the faceplate is true to the spindle, which is true to the > > bed. Now mount the indicator on the cross slide and indicate across > the > > face plate. > > > > Or did I miss something? > > > > By the way, the ultimate authority on this matter is the book "Machine > > Tool Reconditioning". This book goes into painstaking detail on how to > > check setup of a lathe. > > > > Grant Erwin > > > > LRHermit wrote: > > > > > > Ok you guys, how would you go about proving that your > > > cross slide is indeed cutting perpendicular to the spindle > > > axis? The two collar test only proves the tool is cutting > > > parallel to the axis and verifies the bed alignment. Mount > > > a dial indicator on the faceplate and tram two points on > > > the vertical edge of the cross slide? Nah, the edge may > > > not be parallel to the dovetail. Mount the dial indicator to > > > the cross slide and pan across the faceplate? Nah, it just > > > proves that the tool is traveling parallel with the > > > dovetail, not > > > necessarily parallel to the faceplate. How do you prove > > > that the dovetail is true to the faceplate? Perhaps it is > > > really > > > simple but right now it escapes me! It seems to me that > > > there must be a way to make a pass across a faceplate > > > and then prove it's flatness still mounted on the spindle. > > > Phil Kangas > > > > -- > Leonard Stearns > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Deep hole drilling From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 20:07:16 GMT -------- I am not sure what is the point you are trying to make Brian..But I will make the following observations: brian whatcott wrote: > > In article <3834f780.268924360@news.provalue.net>, > gcouger@nospam.couger.com says... > >> a thick wall tube could accomodate a brazed > >>bit AND a suds passage. This would really help clear the swarf ... > > >It's not over kill for a 50 to 1 hole but it will be a problem at a > >quarter inch due to stiffness and clearance. It would work great > >for a 1 inch hole 4 foot deep. > > > >gordon > >Gordon Couger > > This worry about stiffness and clearance is a very natural concern, > even for an expert machinist. > But an engineer is required to keep his prejudices to himself, and > work out the awkward questions like these: > 1)How torsionally stiff is a twist drill? Not very! Which is one of the limiting factors in deep hole drilling with twist drills....torsional "Chatter" becomes a major problem. > 2) How much torsional stiffness does a thick wall tube lose? More to the point...How much torsional stiffness does a 3/16" tube, (as suggested) have when compared to the 1/4" solid shank it replaces? > 3) How narrow can a thick wall tube get, and still be stiffer > than a twist drill? How thick a wall can you retain on a 3/16 tube and still get enough volume and pressure though it to fluss chips up a 1/4" o/d x 3/16" I/d annular gap? > 4) What is a really stiff engineering material. > (solid carbide is very, very stiff...) Carbon fibre? But neither carbon fibre or solid carbide would survive the high pitched chatter set up in deep hole drilling. One of the "Arts"(if you like) is the setting and tensioning of steadies ON THE DRILL SHANK to eliminate the high pitched chatter that will destroy a deep hole drill in seconds. Deep hole or GUN drills of these small sizes do not have circular tubular shanks. The shank is formed by rolling a VEE into the tubular material. A SINGLE lip cutting head is brazed to this preformed tube. This cutter must be VERY rigidly and accurately supported, usually in a hardened starter bushing and on long drills a series of up to four or five travelling steadies are used to support and dampen the drill shank. Cutting oil is pumped down the tube at pressures up to 3000 psi, this exits the cutting head via a port, lubricates the cut and then as it exits up the vee shaped groove it forces the PAPER thin chips ahead of it. Gun drills are manufactured down to 1/16" diameter. Above about 9/16" diameter the "Ejector" type systems (Either single tube or double tube) start to take over the field. > The answers can be surprising.... Oh go ahead then Brian..I know you are dying to surprise us. BTW..I used to own and operate a Contract Deep Hole Drilling Company!! ;^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Precision vise on Ebay From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 20:12:11 GMT -------- leonard@stearns.com wrote: > > I purchased one of these beauties also. Cal Aero seems to be a fine, > reliable vendor. This vise is the nicest I've ever used and it is very > accurate. > > As to mountintg, I think you're on the right track. I machined two > pieces of 3/4 square bar stock the length of the vise's slot drilled > them for mounting bolts in four places, centered on my T-slots. Then I > made two long T-nuts drilled to match the clamping bar. That is an even better way than the four discrete straps that I use. You will still need separate straps if you need to hold the vise at right angles or "On the Slantendicular"...kitty corner across the table axis. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Using diamond wheel on toolpost grinder? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 20:23:20 GMT -------- Hmm! All I can say is that it WAS considered an ass-kicking offense when I was an apprentice!!! However, I would be easily persuaded that a diamond wheel COULD be formulated to cut HSS without clogging up or over heating the tool...It is all a question of grit sizes, abrasive density, bond porosity and bond strength. Bakelite used to be the bond material of choice..and it works great UNTIL you over heat it..then it's to hell in a hand basket! I am sure many more modern materials are available now...but I must confess not to be up on them. All my diamond wheels are scrounged "nubs" of indeterminate parentage! ;^) teenut BillDarby wrote: > > I take your point Robert. I have been using a diamond wheel on my cutter grinder to > sharpen all my HSS cutters. Is this practice wrong or considered just poor > practice in any way. > > Bill Darby > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > I use a diamond wheel from time to time..only when I need to grind carbide > > though..special deep hole reamers mainly. > > > > Diamond wheels are only for use on VERY hard materials..Carbide, ceramics, glass > > etc...Anything softer will cause rapid clogging and wear. > > > > What makes you think that no "grit" is produced? Both the diamond particles > > torn off during dressing and usage, and the products of grinding are highly > > abrasive and I go to inordinate lengths to prevent any from getting into the > > slides and bearings of my lathe. > > > > teenut > > > > leonard@stearns.com wrote: > > > > > > Has anyone had experience using a diamond wheel on a toolpost grinder. > > > Seems to me like that would eliminate the problem of grit getting into > > > the machine. > > > > > > Is there some reason why everyone isn't doing it this way? > > > > > > Thanks for any advice. > > > > > > -- > > > Leonard Stearns > > > > > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > > > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: McMaster-Carr catalog on ebay From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 19 Nov 1999 20:29:38 GMT -------- Ah! But think of the BRAGGING RIGHTS of owning your very own McM-C catalogue!! teenut Jeff Barlow wrote: > > Why pay $5, just go to: http://www.mcmaster.com/ for free. > > PLAlbrecht wrote in message > news:19991119095915.06233.00000036@ng-fx1.aol.com... > > Selling a spare McMaster-Carr #103 on ebay, item no. 203417711 > > > > or > > > > http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=203417711 > > > > Starts at $5, no reserve. > > > > Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Flat faceplate From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1999 02:06:53 GMT -------- LRHermit wrote: BTW, Robert, are you > sure the figure you mentioned is 0.0005/6 inches and not > 0.0005/inch? Yes, According to all the Standards I have ever read..the facing should be concave by between Zero and .001" on 12" diameter. Zero is not good! first bit of wear and it will be a positive (Convex) figure. Machines should always be designed and built to wear MORE accurate first..befor crossing the great divide and starting to become LESS accurate. Concave by more than a thou or two will not hurt on 99% of all the projects you do..most turned shoulders ar too short to measure anyway. Large flanges will simply pull up a bit tighter. Unless you are machining large "Flat" surfaces..for machine slides, for example, I wouldn't worry about it too much! Don't sweat the small stuff! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Deep hole drilling From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1999 02:28:56 GMT -------- brian whatcott wrote: > > I got a sense that you were thinking of using the central port for > exitting the swarf. That *is* unusual Not at all unusual..The Sandvik "Ejector" system uses two concentric tubes. Oil under high pressure is pumped down through the annular space between the inner and outer tubes to ports in the replaceable (At enormous expense!!) drill head. It then returns, flushing chips with it via the central tube. Just befor reaching the drill head, some of the oil is allowed to escape into the inner tube via rearward facing slots..this creates a partial venturi effect, accelerating the main rearward flow of oil and chips..hence the "Ejector" title. There is another, similar system that only uses a single drill tube. Hear the oil is pumped down the gap between the tube and the wall of the hole..returning with the chips, via the inside of the tube. It is a cheaper system to tool up..but relys on having to establish and maintain a high pressure seal between the drill driving head and the work piece. To give you some idea of the power involved...My largest Ejector drill had IIRC a 50 HP V/S DC drive on the headstock, 20 HP V/S DC drive on the Feed shafts and 50 HP AC on the hydraulic coolant pump!! It would drill a 30" deep X 3" diameter hole in solid 4140 @ Rc 35/37 material in about 3 1/4 minutes! Tolerance on the hole would be held within about .002" teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Using diamond wheel on toolpost grinder? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1999 02:39:40 GMT -------- mulligan@advinc.com wrote: Damn I'd like to meet those > folks who were kicking *your* ass, Robert. I thought you were > kick-impervious! > I am..Now!! No you wouldn't want to meet some of the guys that kicked my ass..especially in a dark alley! They would make a Junk Yard Pit Bull with Aids nervous! ;^) teenut teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Deckel FP 1 From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1999 02:49:29 GMT -------- Try Tony Griffiths He can supply a copy. teenut Anders Borg wrote: > > Hello out there > I'm looking for a manual for a Deckel FP1. > I prefere English but any language is OK.I pay in advance for all costs. > mail me direct please! > anders.borg.mdh.se ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Site Slowdown? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1999 02:50:35 GMT -------- Mine is fine..for now! teenut ERich10983 wrote: > > > > >Is it just me or is this site slowing down? > > It seems to be something going on with AOL in the last few days. Are other > providers slow? > > Earle Rich > Mont Vernon, NH ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Flat faceplate From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1999 03:03:42 GMT -------- Dead right Phil! And an important observation too. Lots of machine tools are built to "Schlessinger Limits" (A standard for machine tool accuracy) and will come equiped with a "Cerstifficate" to that effect. (Like my Maximat Super II) HOWEVER!! The proportion that will actually MACHINE to those limits even when new is very small. FURTHER!! The ones that will machine to those limits and HOLD that accuracy through a lifetime of use can be counted on the fingers of one hand!! (And my Maximat ain't one of them!!) LRHermit wrote: > > This makes sense, teenut. My lathe is still new and it looks > like it will wear better. > About the tolerance spec's you mention, am I right to assume > that they apply to the acceptable condition of flatness, not > really what your lathe can/should produce? > Phil ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Deep hole drilling From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1999 03:19:46 GMT -------- The last time I saw that "stars" background was in connection with the "Happy 99" virus!! teenut "DoN. Nichols" wrote: > > *****> The above line is probably the source of your problems, since > *****> it is invoking the stars image. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Precision vise on Ebay From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1999 04:22:23 GMT -------- Drill a hole right through the top of the vise, table saddle and knee and put a piece of 5/8 all-thread through the lot. Should hold it!! Or you could weld it onto the table. Welcome to the "Cuter Owner/Driver Association" ;^) teenut PLAlbrecht wrote: > > Thanks for the heads-up, guys. I had to run some errands up to Manhattan Beach > today so I stopped by Cal-Aero. Looked at the Italian-made Cuter brand vise. I > came. I saw. I bought. The guy said it was the last one, he sold 40-odd to a > guy in Texas. In-store price was $119 plus tax. Yes, it's pretty nice. > > Supposedly over $700 list retail. > > Now I gotta figure out how to mount it on my Atlas mill... > > Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Using diamond wheel on toolpost grinder? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1999 04:49:08 GMT -------- I don't think so..provided that the bond etc is designed for the useage...I would presume that Darex have addressed that problem. I have just checked my little stock of diamond wheels and find one that has a METAL matrix..looks like aluminum or zinc based. I don't think that would be a problem for LIGHT grinding on hardened steel. I also have a couple of Norton diamond hand laps that have a metal matrix. I am not totally sold on the idea of the affinity of iron for the carbon in diamond being a problem in grinding applications..those atoms are locked up tighter than a ducks bum! Tool makers have been using diamond for lapping steel for generations and it is the first time I have heard the subject raised. I use diamond coated "Pins" for high speed internal grinding of small holes. There I believe the diamond dust is actually BRAZED onto the shank. I also use diamond "laps" for sharpening steel knife blades. I think too, that there is some confusion between usage and conditions between diamond grinding with a diamond abrasive in a hard plastic or metal bond..and diamond MACHINING with a single diamond chrystal..I do know that THAT doesn't work too well on ferrous metals! Of course the reaction is only supposed to take place at sustained elevated temperatures..which may well be th case. However, at "elevated temperatures" I would expect to run into problems with thermal shock..that would destroy a diamond real quick. teenut Peter Reilley wrote: > > The original wheel on my Darex M5 is diamond. I sharpen > lots of ordinary high speed drills. Is there something wrong > with this? I believe that this is the intended use. > > Pete. > > Erich Coiner wrote in message <3835E2F2.7E99@NOSPAMhp.com>... > >BillDarby wrote: > >> > >> I take your point Robert. I have been using a diamond wheel on my cutter > grinder to > >> sharpen all my HSS cutters. Is this practice wrong or considered just > poor > >> practice in any way. > >> > >> Bill Darby > >> > > > > > >Bill, > >Here is the problem with using a diamond wheel on steel. > >A diamond is pure carbon. > >Carbon is soluble in iron. (That is how you make steel) > >Grinding generates heat. Steel+carbon(diamond)+heat= casehardening. > >You ruin the diamond bit because the carbon atoms end up diffusing into > >the steel part you are grinding. > > > >Erich ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Precision vise on Ebay From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1999 17:56:44 GMT -------- 1/4 - 20 is good...Drill lots of holes and make a Rolls-Royce job out of it! teenut PLAlbrecht wrote: > > >Drill a hole right through the top of the vise, table saddle and knee and put > >a > >piece of 5/8 all-thread through the lot. > > > >Should hold it!! > > Wull, uh, wut kinda allthred? I don't got no 5/8 anyway, only that 1/4-20 on > the group purchase plan. > > Can we get a group purchase of 5/8 going? > > >Or you could weld it onto the table. > > I'd ask Altavoz what welder he recommends, without his help I'm lost... > > Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Making CRS concentric From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1999 17:57:31 GMT -------- On a lathe! teenut Ed French wrote: > > I don't have access to a centerless grinder, is there a method of doing this > without power tools? I thought about putting three bars together with some > abrasives and rolling them around. How would a machinist's apprentice have > done it 100 years ago? > > Dedtru1 wrote in message <8135vm$15v$1@dumber.ktis.net>... > >Ed, > >Grinding would be the next obvious choice. A manual feed surface grinder > and > >a "spin fixture", such as a Harig style spin fixture works really well. If > >you have access to a centerless grinder, they also work well. For high > >precision, I would choose the manual surface grinder with a "Harig", or > >similar style, precision spin fixture. Centerless grinders usually work off > >of the existing OD of the workpiece and can transfer inaccuracies to the > >new, finished OD. > > > >-- > >David Heaney > >dedtru1@hotmail.com > >http://members.xoom.com/dedtru1/ > >Ed French wrote in message > >news:%R5Z3.87799$YB4.2935985@typ12.nn.bcandid.com... > >> There have been a lot of discussions about how to make something flat by > >> lapping. How do you do make steel bar round, or should I say dead round? > >> > >> P.S. Not with a lathe. > >> > >> > > > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: *CHEAP* Allen bolt C'bores or step drills wanted From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1999 21:58:24 GMT -------- I have a set of counterbores with the pilots off-set from center by 1/8" Is this what you are looking for? 8^) teenut George McDuffee wrote: > > Looking for a source of cheap counter bores or step > drills for 3/8 socket head cap screws (Allen bolts) > material is 1"X 1" CRS. will be used in cheap Chinese > drill press with about 1/8 inch runout at very low > speed. > > George ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT: E-Bay question From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1999 22:01:32 GMT -------- What it means is; that someone put in a bid of 147.50 and your proxy/high bid beat them...They never had a high bid so their name doesn't show up on the high bidder list. teenut Doug Douglas wrote: > > Could someone please explain if this is correct? The item I wanted to > bid on was at $127.50 with a bid increment of $2.50. I put in a > maximum bid of $150.55. I received a confirmation showing I was high > bidder at $130.00 with a maximum of $150.55. Checked it the next day > and I had won item for $150.00. Great so far. > Then I check the bid history. It shows me at $150.00 and the next > highest bid at $127.50. Now, the question is: Why isn't the second > highest bid $147.50? I don't recall if the reserve was met at $127.50 > but it was at $150.00. Did the system raise my bid to meet the reserve > price? Why did the system raise me from $130 to $150 if no one out bid > me? > I'm happy I got the item and am willing to pay $150. But I would be > happier to pay $130. Any opinions? > Thank You, Doug ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Precision vise on Ebay From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 20 Nov 1999 22:03:37 GMT -------- "Michael P. Henry" wrote: BTW, do you know the purpose of the > tapped holes in the sides of the fixed jaw end of the vise? Perhaps for > some sort of vise stop? That is what it is for. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Making CRS concentric From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 21 Nov 1999 00:37:59 GMT -------- Guilty only of inadequate clipping M'Lud...The question asked was "how would an aprentice have done it 100 years ago" The " P.S. Not with a lathe" dated back about three posts earlier and was still tagging along. The simple answer on how to make something TRULY round, with or without a lathe, is to LAP it in a split lap! teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article , > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > > On a lathe! > > > > >> P.S. Not with a lathe. > > Hmm. Sit in the corner with the dunce cap on, Robert. You were > not paying attention. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Favorite Graffiti From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 21 Nov 1999 16:33:08 GMT -------- A "Rathole" is a large diameter (3-4 ft) hole, drilled alongside an oil or water drilling rig and provides vertical storage for drill pipe sections. teenut "Chris K. Hepburn" wrote: > > And the other one I heard on the radio last year. It was some non-profit > project that was financed by "OK Rathole Drilling". I imagine being in > Alberta it has something to do with oil patch but still, what a name for a > company! > > Chris, AB ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Round T-Slots? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 21 Nov 1999 17:25:49 GMT -------- Congratulations on your slide. I have used one as the basis for a lathe milling attachment..until I found the mill I was looking for. The round "Teenuts" are simply made from 1" lengths of 1/2" diameter BDMS..just be sure to drill and tap them reasonably well on center to avoid alignment problems Why SB went with a round "teeslot"? I don't think it was because they are short of teeslot cutters!! In the thin section available, the round section provides a STRONGER slot than a tee slot..fewer "stress riser" corners to break out. teenut George Glines wrote: > > I bought a really cool South Bend machine slide which fits in place of the > compound rest on eBay. Instead of T-Slots is looks like holes were drilled > then milled open at the top. Were there special round clamp down bolts that > originally went with this? Why round? > > Thanks, > > George ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Ebay Jet mill opinions From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 21 Nov 1999 17:35:24 GMT -------- I have visited these people (I live in Atlanta). Large, old and well established machinery dealers..They appear to have contracts with Graingers and a number of other major supply houses, to take and sell surplus, discontinued and damaged goods.....Everything there from 200 ton Bliss Presses to kevlar safety gloves. I would say they are OK people to deal with..not a fly-by-night operation. If you pay them money..the goods will be there So far as the Jet mill is concerned..you must make your own judgement and ask a lot of questions..Caveat Emptor! teenut appsman wrote: > > I see this Jet JVM836 vertical knee mill at what looks like a price > ($2500) substantially less than I have seen elsewhere. Link: > > http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=203402396 > > Does anyone know this seller: called "machinerysales" (located in GA) > on ebay? I want to know if there is any trash on this guy before I buy > blind. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Round T-Slots? (taper attachement based on idea) From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 22 Nov 1999 13:58:20 GMT -------- A taper turning attachment doesn't have to have a dovetailed slide Alan. Most larger machines (and the TTA I built for my Maximat) use a simple square edged guide bar and a "slipper" with a simple gib for adjustment of clearances. The Bar is only required to provide guidance in one direction..there is no tendency to "lift" (or shouldn't be)...the added complication of a dovetail slide is redundant design!! 8^) teenut Alan Mimms wrote: > > I wonder if something like the same kind of idea is useful to replace > those hard to machine dovetails on things like taper attachements for > lathes? > > I have thought for some time that I will eventually make me a taper > attachment which slides on two round horizontal rods supported by an > adjustable angle base attached to the back of my lathe. On both rods > will slide a slide to which the cross slide of my lathe will be firmly > attached. The angle of the two rods with respect to the centerline of > my lathe (the ways) will be variable to give the desired taper. This > is just like the dovetail versions I have seen, except it is way > easier to make for someone without a dovetail milling tool. And > probably easier to adjust and generally understand and get "right" > too. > > The slide won't get much wear, and adjustability to compensate for > what wear it DOES get can be handled by simply clamping more tightly > onto the rods with the slider. It's stable in all axes except > longitudinally (i.e., you can SLIDE the SLIDE but it won't shimmy) as > far as I can tell. > > The Geo. H. Thomas design is one I have seen recently. But his went > so far as to use a worm gear and worm for setting the taper angle. My > thought is that an adjustment screw threaded through a well-made > captive swivel nut would be sufficient, wouldn't it? > > It MIGHT be possible to do this attachment with ONE rod, now that I > think about it. Why WOULD I need two? > > Does anyone of you massively experienced gurus have any comments on > this design? > -- > Alan Mimms > Home machinist in (self) training. > E-mail: alanm@unforgettable.com > Metalworking web page: http://alanm.penguinpowered.com/metalworking > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Original Message <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< > > On 11/21/99, 11:35:18 AM, plalbrecht@aol.com (PLAlbrecht) wrote > regarding Re: Round T-Slots?: > > > >In the thin section available, the round section provides a STRONGER > slot > > >than a > > >tee slot..fewer "stress riser" corners to break out. > > > You know, this seems an excellent idea for a lot of homebrew tooling > designs. > > Instead of struggling with a T slot cutter in an underequipped shop as > many of > > us do, we could just drill and ream. Cutting the non-T part of the > slot is a > > lot easier than the undercut part. > > > Great idea, hope I haven't forgotten it next time I need it. > > > Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Round T-Slots? (taper attachement based on idea) From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 22 Nov 1999 14:06:29 GMT -------- Adding to my previous message..I would go so far as to say that a dovetail type of taper attachment is BAD design!! It demands that the whole unit be mounted absolutely DEAD LEVEL with the lathe bed. Any error in level imparts a twisting moment to the cross-slide that can do no good at all. (Here I am refering to the type of TTA that has the guide bar mounted rigidly on the rear of the lathe bed...NOT the "floating type favored by South Bend. That DOES need to be a dovetail...to stop it falling on the floor!!) 8^) teenut Alan Mimms wrote: > > I wonder if something like the same kind of idea is useful to replace > those hard to machine dovetails on things like taper attachements for > lathes? > > I have thought for some time that I will eventually make me a taper > attachment which slides on two round horizontal rods supported by an > adjustable angle base attached to the back of my lathe. On both rods > will slide a slide to which the cross slide of my lathe will be firmly > attached. The angle of the two rods with respect to the centerline of > my lathe (the ways) will be variable to give the desired taper. This > is just like the dovetail versions I have seen, except it is way > easier to make for someone without a dovetail milling tool. And > probably easier to adjust and generally understand and get "right" > too. > > The slide won't get much wear, and adjustability to compensate for > what wear it DOES get can be handled by simply clamping more tightly > onto the rods with the slider. It's stable in all axes except > longitudinally (i.e., you can SLIDE the SLIDE but it won't shimmy) as > far as I can tell. > > The Geo. H. Thomas design is one I have seen recently. But his went > so far as to use a worm gear and worm for setting the taper angle. My > thought is that an adjustment screw threaded through a well-made > captive swivel nut would be sufficient, wouldn't it? > > It MIGHT be possible to do this attachment with ONE rod, now that I > think about it. Why WOULD I need two? > > Does anyone of you massively experienced gurus have any comments on > this design? > -- > Alan Mimms > Home machinist in (self) training. > E-mail: alanm@unforgettable.com > Metalworking web page: http://alanm.penguinpowered.com/metalworking > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Original Message <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< > > On 11/21/99, 11:35:18 AM, plalbrecht@aol.com (PLAlbrecht) wrote > regarding Re: Round T-Slots?: > > > >In the thin section available, the round section provides a STRONGER > slot > > >than a > > >tee slot..fewer "stress riser" corners to break out. > > > You know, this seems an excellent idea for a lot of homebrew tooling > designs. > > Instead of struggling with a T slot cutter in an underequipped shop as > many of > > us do, we could just drill and ream. Cutting the non-T part of the > slot is a > > lot easier than the undercut part. > > > Great idea, hope I haven't forgotten it next time I need it. > > > Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Ebay Jet mill opinions From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 22 Nov 1999 14:12:54 GMT -------- I meant particularly that you should ensure that you know enough about THAT PARTICULAR MACHINE...It is a Jet (Known Quantity) plus/minus (whatever makes it cheaper and places it in their hands) PLUS the fact that this IS an auction after all, and your buyer's rights are somewhat limited. In short..be sure of what you are bidding for. Good luck, 8^) teenut appsman wrote: > > Robert - Thanks for the info. I've seen a lot of your postings and > appreciate the info, humor, and even the barbs. Your last comment leads > me hanging however. Did you say "caveat emptor" because Jet mills IN > GENERAL have compromises (I know this), or because these particular > mills might not be what they appear to be (new JET JVM-836s, equivalent > to what I would get from an authorized seller). Please clarify...even > with the discount, it's a lot money. > > * Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet's Discussion Network * > The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet - Free! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Cross posting and Cass From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 22 Nov 1999 14:19:53 GMT -------- 'Ere! I resemble that remark!! ;^) teenut Jack Erbes wrote: > Ot it may just be that we have our own special, in bred, but orderly and > well trained, group of weirdoes on RCM ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: compound rotary cross slide table From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 22 Nov 1999 14:39:06 GMT -------- There are two distict types of "Compound,Cross-sliding,Rotary tables"...The common or garden (Palmgren) style with a rotary table mounted on TOP of the x-y..and the, usually far more precise and expensive (Moore,Do-All etc) type where the x-y slides are superimposed on top of the rotary axis. This is the type Steve was referring to..and is far more versatile! It allows you, for instance, to mill a radius, move out at a tangent and mill another radius on a DIFFERENT center..an "S" curve if you like. For now (until I can find a reasonably priced unit) I use a small Palmgren x-y unit mounted on top of my 10" plain rotary table to achieve the same effect..albeit at some loss of rigidity and accuracy. So the answer to your question Steve, is yes..They are still used. 8^) teenut > Steve11449 wrote: > > > Does anybody still use the compound rotary crosslide tables in conjunction with > > their verticle mills? These used to be used in die work before the advent of > > CNC mills. You could traverse in & out arcs with great ease.. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: FS: 100 Gravers on ebay From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 22 Nov 1999 17:31:34 GMT -------- You might have had a better chance of selling them..and got better prices by breaking them up into smaller sets. I would like a nice set of gravers..but a HUNDRED??? That is several lifetimes supply for an amateur! teenut "James P. Riser" wrote: > > I am in the process of sorting through my huge collection of gravers > (for metal engraving, jewelry, scrimshaw,etc.) and will be selling off > the duplicates. This is an assortment of 100 very good gravers. 26 of > them have the small wooden mushroom handle. The others are the graver > only. They are from the following makers: Dixon, E.C. Muller, F.L. > Grobet, M. Lembeck, U.S., Damascus, Arrow, Vautier, Glardon Vallorbe, > A.J. Renard, and F. Thum. The shapes are square (corner cutting), dotter > (rounded bottom), scorper (flat bottom), spitzsticker(knife, "V" edge). > The lengths range from the too long new length to the short usable > length. Some are new and some are used. If you ever wanted to get > started in metal engraving or scrimshaw, this is your chance to do it > cheaply. > > All 100 may be seen at: > http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=205063179 ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Shoptask 2000 From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 22 Nov 1999 22:06:04 GMT -------- The blind leading the blind? teenut Cass wrote: > We have a much larger group that is going to purchase some machine > than we first started with and it is getting larger each day. That is > why I want to be so careful to find out all that I can about the > machines that we are considering purchasing. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Shoptask 2000 From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 22 Nov 1999 22:10:12 GMT -------- Wasn't it EXACTLY these sentiments expressed by many menbers of this group that got you so pissed off in the first place? teenut Cass wrote: > I just want to get at the truth. Alot > of our members are wanting the straight, honest, no double-talk > answers to valid concerns of theirs. You are not expecting folks to > shell out the money blindly without knowing about machines that they > MAY be considering, do you? If so, it just doesn't work that way. > Folks don't donate their money to a company without knowing as much as > they can about what they are buying. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Leveling and true grit From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 22 Nov 1999 22:18:51 GMT -------- Threaded endmills (Clarkson type) or Autolock chucks are virtually unheard of this side of the pond. It is plain collets or weldon style (setscrew) type holders..or nothing. Someone had a nice Clarkson collet chuck on ebay recently (From Canada IIRC) I would have bought it but knew I could never find the threaded shank cutters here. 8^( teenut Tim Leech wrote: > > On Mon, 22 Nov 1999 16:00:34 GMT, mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > >In article , > > "John Hofstad-Parkhill" wrote: > > > >> On my 2nd pass > >> a weird instance of mill creep occurred. The end mill "dove" into the > >> work. > > > >Hmm. John, this has happened to me on occasion as well. 5C > >collets just do not seem to be able to constrain an end mill that > >is taking a heavy cut off its end, no matter how tight I have > >the draw bar snugged. The cutting forces are really trying to > >'monica' that thing out of the collet. > > > >So I stop and check often - maybe it's time to obtain some kind of > >real end mill holder with a setscrew to prevent this. > > I noticed a similar discussion to this a few months ago. > Don't you have threaded end mills and Autolock or similar chucks in > the US? I'd be very surprised if a properly fitted endmill would ever > move in that setup, though I'm quite willing to be proved wrong. > > Cheers > ------------------------------------------------- > Tim Leech > > timleech@dutondok.u-net.com > > Traditional & Modern canal craft repairs > > ------------------------------------------------- ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: German translation help From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 22 Nov 1999 22:52:46 GMT -------- Boy I'm glad I'm not German..All that spittin' an' sprayin' you could die of dehydration just asking for a cold beer!! 8^) teenut Einar Sjaavik wrote: > Es is warscheinlich ein Modellflugmotorbefestigungswinkel. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Making CRS concentric From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 03:31:45 GMT -------- No..Nowhere close!! teenut Ed French wrote: > > Thanks for all the answers. Just one more question regarding this. Does > the split lap have to have tolerances equal or better than the desired > tolerances on the finished piece? > > mulligan@advinc.com wrote in message <817ohl$ei1$1@nnrp1.deja.com>... > >In article , > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > > > >> The simple answer on how to make something TRULY round, with or > >> without a lathe, > >> is to LAP it in a split lap! > > > >Which is actually how the Moore folks finsh their leadscrews. > >First the stock is nitrided, then rough ground. Then another > >nitriding step, and a finish grind. The oil is filtered and > >temperature controlled during the grinding. > > > >But apparently there is a drunken thread error which appears, and > >is eliminated by hand-lapping. But alas, the lead screw is > >held in a lathe for this operation. South Bends, they were, in > >the picture. So this does not satisfy the "without a lathe" > >requirement. I suppose one could do holding the part in the hands, > >but what for, eh? At some point whatever you use to run the lap > >could be called a lathe. > > > >The final lapping was done with kerosene only. No other abrasives. > >Finally the nut is cut and lapped to fit with the lead screw. > > > >But that book had an amazing section on even checking for roundness - > >a real eye opener. How the standard v-block test does not do a very > >good job. > > > >But come to think of it, one would probably be prone to making > >a round part into a conical object if the lapping were not done > >right. There must be a special trick to preventing that from > >happening - ie, as the part gets more circular in cross-section, > >it might also become barrel shaped, concave or convex. > > > >Jim > > > > > >Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > >Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Making CRS concentric From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 03:54:44 GMT -------- Perhaps I should elaborate a little! 8^) A lap, whether internal for a hole or external for a rod or cylinder, does not need to be as accurately round or straight as the surface it is generating. Indeed most laps are far from round..a toolmaker's "micro-lap" looks like the eye end of a large needle and expansion is achieved by wedging the "eye" open further with a special tool (or a screwdriver blade) The accuracy of lapping is achieved by rotation and the even stroking of lap and the hole or rod to be lapped. Material removal is slow and tightspots can be felt and the lapping stroke concentrated until an even "feel" is obtained over the full length. For best accuracy the lap should be as LONG as possible. teenut Robert Bastow wrote: > > No..Nowhere close!! > > teenut > > Ed French wrote: > > > > Thanks for all the answers. Just one more question regarding this. Does > > the split lap have to have tolerances equal or better than the desired > > tolerances on the finished piece? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: compound rotary cross slide table From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 06:16:19 GMT -------- kenneth knaell wrote: > > Robert, > The Palmgren arrangement always seemed redundent for use on a mill >since one already has rectilinear slides in the mill. Totally redundant on a mill..probably intended for laying out bolt circles on a drill press. Or milling...God forbid! >I wonder if it is possible to use one of these upside down to get the >rotary action below the x-y slides. > All things are possible Ken You'll get a hell of a crick in your neck if it is a long job though!! ;^) > I mounted a cheap cross-slide vise on a rotary table and this is also >not very rigid - almost unusable for milling. The little x/y slide I use is surprisingly "tight"..Especially with the locks snugged up. I do believe it is an old Sears unit made by Palmgren or maybe Atlas. However, mounted on top of my 10" rotary I have been able to mill right round the inside curves of a Mauser type triggerguard..in 3/4" thick steel! Slow going though! I need to find and spring for a decent 8 or ten inch Troyke or similar unit. > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> > wrote in message ... > >There are two distict types of "Compound,Cross-sliding,Rotary tables"...The > >common or garden (Palmgren) style with a rotary table mounted on TOP of the > >x-y..and the, usually far more precise and expensive (Moore,Do-All etc) > type > >where the x-y slides are superimposed on top of the rotary axis. > > > >This is the type Steve was referring to..and is far more versatile! It > allows > >you, for instance, to mill a radius, move out at a tangent and mill another > >radius on a DIFFERENT center..an "S" curve if you like. > > > >For now (until I can find a reasonably priced unit) I use a small Palmgren > x-y > >unit mounted on top of my 10" plain rotary table to achieve the same > >effect..albeit at some loss of rigidity and accuracy. > > > >So the answer to your question Steve, is yes..They are still used. > > > >8^) > > > >teenut > > > > > >> Steve11449 wrote: > >> > >> > Does anybody still use the compound rotary crosslide tables in > conjunction with > >> > their verticle mills? These used to be used in die work before the > advent of > >> > CNC mills. You could traverse in & out arcs with great ease.. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Materials used for lapping From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 16:52:38 GMT -------- Linus Sherrill wrote: > > I understand the common wisdom that when lapping, the lap > material is softer than the material being lapped (so the > abrasive embeds in the lapper not the lappee) > > Recently I read an article that described using a steel lap to > lap aluminum scope rings. I have to believe that this works > (i've seen the pictures) so I must be missing something. The steel is soft enough to "take up" abrasive particles..I don't know what technique the person used but I would "charge" the soft steel lap by smearing it with abrasive paste and then rolling it on a hard surface with as much pressure as I could generate. The charged lap would then be washed clean with solvent. Lapping scope rings should involve removing only a tiny amount of material..and the charged steel lap, used gently with a thin lubricant, will achieve this. Some abrasive WILL be left behind..embedded in turn in the even softer aluminum. This probably isn't a problem..maybe even an advantage if it enhances grip under heavy recoil!! However, if the scope rings were some kind of running bearing..this would be a formula for disaster!! > > Similarly, lapping with a glass plate. The glass is harder than > the steel, so why doesn't the abrasive become embedded in the > steel and grind away the glass? It will! Lapping is a "mutually destructive process" both "lapper" and "lappee" suffer material removal..especially when loose abrasive is present. Lapping a piece of steel on a glass surface would be a "Bass Ackwards" approach! Yes, some steel will be removed..but the steel would rapidly become the lap and grind away the glass! However, in the case of useing a glass plate as a TRUING surface (this is NOT true lapping)..this is usually advocated for trueing water or oil stones..using loose abrasive. In this case the abrasive grains "roll and catch" frequently enough to dress the stone by a combination of abrasion..and (I suspect) crushing of the bond holding the stone together. The Glass, being harder, is not ground away quite as quickly..though the surface will become rapidly "frosted". > > I know I must be missing part of the theory. Can anybody help me > out here? > -- Hope this helps. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Leveling and true grit From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 18:12:49 GMT -------- kenneth knaell wrote: > > I also have never had an endmill pull out while using a collet holder Ah Ken...You have missed one of life's finer delights..especially when said cutter, mills an ever increasing depth of slot into SOMEONE ELSES brand new milling machine table!! DON'T ASK!!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Shoptask 2000 From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 23 Nov 1999 18:35:24 GMT -------- One of the best "3 in 1" arrangements I ever came across (though never personally used), was that employed by EMCO on their Maximat range of machines. There, the milling "attachment"..a substantial geared head, riding a round vertical column, was attached to the REAR of the lathe bed, in the place normally occupied by the taper turning attachment. Pictures of this can be seen at; http://www.lathes.co.uk/emco/page7.html The beauty of this arrangement was that one could buy the lathe first, add the milling attachment as funds allowed, and then finally, purchase the complete milling machine base to which the milling attachment could be mounted as a free standing unit. I have a Maximat Super II and did consider going that route at one time..the Maximat mill is a nice small machine. If the makers or suppliers of the Asian 3 in one machines came up with a similar arrangement they may well have a real WINNER on their hands! Gary Coffman wrote: > > On Mon, 22 Nov 1999 22:01:29 -0600, "Cass" wrote: > >Could you tell us why you selected the machine that you did over and > >above some of the other 3in1s? > > In retrospect, probably for all of the wrong reasons. I wanted a substantial > turning and milling capability, and I thought I could get both in one machine, > saving on cost and shop space over buying two separate machines. So I > looked at all of the available 3-in-1 machines to see which ones appeared > to give me the most capability for the least cost. Because the Shoptask has > a large mill table (for a 3-in-1), and a large throat, I figured it would give me the > most milling capability. It also seemed to be robust as a short, large swing > lathe. The price wasn't bad either. > > It turns out that it is a robust, short, large swing lathe, and that's the way > I primarily use it today. But that relatively large milling capability came > at a pretty steep price in terms of rigidity. The long moment arms mean > you can't get down and get serious with it as a mill. You have to take light > cuts or it chatters badly (in steel, in aluminum it can hog pretty well). But > I'd hasten to add that other 3-in-1 machines can't even mount workpieces > the size the Shoptask can handle. Being restricted to light cuts is better > than not being able to do the job at all. > > The lack of a knee, or even a way to run the head up and down, also means > that setting up work for milling is an adventure (often punctuated by curse > words). You can usually do it, but it can be a royal PITA. As a result, I quickly > bought a heavy mill/drill to augment the Shoptask. (I'd really rather have a > knee mill, but the mill/drill has sufficed.) > > So I wound up with two fairly large pieces of equipment anyway, and > didn't really save any money. In retrospect, perhaps I should have bought > the Shoptask configured just as a lathe, and used the money saved by > that as partial payment on the mill/drill. (I have threatened to remount > the Shoptask mill head to a separate column so I can get some use out > of it as a heavy drill press. I think that might work out well.) Now I've bought > a bigger lathe too. The Shoptask is a pretty good lathe, but it isn't as long > as I sometimes need. So it has been relegated to secondary uses. > > I think that the Shoptask machine is about the best compromise available > in 3-in-1 machines in terms of capability versus cost, but for me it still > comes up wanting compared to separate machines. That's what my style > of usage really needed, and what I eventually wound up buying. The Shoptask > did teach me some valuable lessons. It showed me what I really needed in a > way that reading books and newsgroups cannot. So I still consider it money > well spent. I don't think any other 3-in-1 machine would have met my > requirements any better. > > If you visit professional shops, you don't see 3-in-1 machines. There's a good > reason for that. A 3-in-1, *any* 3-in-1, involves more compromises than most > knowledgeable machinists are willing to tolerate. They're targeted to hobbyists > like me who just wanted to put a toe in the water without realizing how deep > that water can get (or how quickly). Now one *can* cross the Atlantic in a rowboat, > but most of us would rather not have to do it that way. Similarly, one can live > with just a 3-in-1, but most of us learn that we'd rather not. > > The fellows telling you not to get a 3-in-1 are probably right, but mostly for the > wrong reasons. Several of the 3-in-1 machines are *not* junk (though a few > pretty much are), but they also aren't as flexible and usable as you're likely to > want or need. I don't regret buying the Shoptask machine, but knowing what I > know now, I probably wouldn't go that way again. I wound up buying three > machines when I would have been satisfactorily served by just two. > > (Actually, I have a bunch of different sorts of machines now, so I wouldn't > have stayed at just two anyway.) > > Gary > Gary Coffman KE4ZV | You make it |mail to ke4zv@bellsouth.net > 534 Shannon Way | We break it | > Lawrenceville, GA | Guaranteed | ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Radial running, lotsa smoke and noise - Thanks! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 01:57:18 GMT -------- Congratulations on a SUPERB achievement Kurt!! 8^) teenut Kurt Bjorn wrote: > > Thanks guys for the recent help in ignition and carburetion. The engine ran > sweet as can be today in a sustained fashion... what a cool sound! Still > much work to go, but I just wanted to thank you guys again. > > Check out the story (if you care) at > http://www.flash.net/~pyroware/first.htm > > Happy Turkey Day! > > -- > Kurt Bjorn > http://www.flash.net/~pyroware ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 1000 words From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 18:41:33 GMT -------- Nice work John! teenut John Hofstad-Parkhill wrote: > > The level that I made, and what it came from: > > http://www.imagehost.com/402/21116-12.jpg > > Two pictures of the clock (both sideways) > > http://www.imagehost.com/402/21116-13.jpg > http://www.imagehost.com/402/21116-14.jpg ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lubrication of lathe chucks? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 19:01:47 GMT -------- Clean frequently, use powdered graphite for lube.. Not a formula for a working Job Shop, but for the HSM who wants to keen the "Gilt Edged" accuracy on his kit! 8^) teenut Nick Alexander wrote: > > What is the consensus on proper lubrication of 3- and 4-jaw lathe chucks? > Should one use oil or grease? What about the fact that this will > undoubtedly trap more swarf and dust in the scroll which will be converted > into an abrasive paste, thereby promoting accelerated wear? > > Regards, > Nick Alexander ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: tool ID and questions From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 19:07:10 GMT -------- What you have are "Clockmaker's Broaches"..used to open up pivot holes to the required working clearances. Modus Operandi is to stick in hole and "twiddle"!! I have a couple that I have never found a (legitimate) good use for!! 8^) teenut "Marvin W. Klotz" wrote: > > Bought what I think are some reamers at a flea market. They look like > rattail > files (with the tang) but have no teeth and are pentagonal in cross > section. > The larger tapers from about 0.180 to 0.080 in 4 inches and the > smaller from > about 0.080 to 0.035 in 3 inches. Looks like high quality tool steel > and the > edges are sharp. > > Questions: > > Am I correct in assuming that these are reamers? Perhaps meant for > use in the > clockmaking trade? If not, what are they and how are they used? > > If they are reamers, why would one want what looks to be a precision > TAPERED > reamer? I would think that, in most precision applications, one would > NOT > want a tapered hole. > > TIA, Marv > > Email: mklotz@alum.mit.edu > > Home shop utility freeware page at: > http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hall/4425 ======== Newsgroups: rec.aviation.homebuilt,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Cass & Altavoz From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 24 Nov 1999 19:13:56 GMT -------- We have all got to stop sticking our fingers down this guy's throat..I am tired of cleaning my screen every time he vomits all over it! teenut Cass wrote: > > Mark, > > You are not going to be able to convince anyone of anything if they > don't want to. > You cannot be the peacemaker with folks of a certain mind. > > It is apparent that there are those in this n.g. with minds that are > shut so tightly that they are incapable of new thought. Now, I > realize the previous sentence will make some mad. It will only make > those mad that it applies to. While it may be helpful, the truth > hurts. > > No one has ever won a war without casualty. This is a small skirmish > and everyone has taken 'damage'. Everyone comes out looking like a > fool, including myself. > > The very intelligent thing to do in these diatribes is to simply not > respond to them. > However, this world contains many individual personalities and just as > many ideas or perspectives. Personally, I would rather come out > looking as a fool and expose the other fools who would deny me my > right to express my ideas or search for information or dispense > information. There are many people who, upon the first sign of > trouble, run off and go somewhere else. That is okay. But it trains > these Neanderthals that they can stomp their collective feet and get > their way when they read something else that they don't like. I can't > save the world, I don't intend that. I do think that folks should > stand up to these types and let them know that they don't run things. > > Let us get this straight and accurate. I came here solely for the > purpose to let folks know that our group had initiated a group > purchase. That was it! Then, later on, I did ask for information > about 3in1 machines as I don't know anything about them. In fact, I > know extremely little about lathes and milling machines. I would like > to learn. > I don't have to know about a machine in order to participate in a > group purchase. > > Your mistake, Mark, if I may say so, is that you kept emailing me and > now I find out that you have emailed others, to try to stop this or > tell someone what to say here or there. > Better that you should have stayed out of it rather than inadvertently > stir the brew with constant meddling. > > We didn't come here for advice or ask for anyone's help in designing > parts. I doubt many, if any here, know much about lasers. I could be > wrong nevertheless, we came here to tell of a group purchase. I/we > were met with an arrogance that bespeaks of child-like minds. We were > labeled as con-artists, when nothing was known about our purchase. We > were labeled as spammers, when we told of our purchase one too many > times for some folks. There have been suggestions to get our ISP > accounts cancelled. > There have been lies and threats. There have been all manner of > things that are in DIRECT OPPOSITION to what a newsgroup should be. > > I have been stunned to see some of the sarcastic and holier-than-thou > attitudes expressed by a few malcontents. > > To correct you, Mark. I did not come out swinging when I came here. > I simply told about our group purchase. At some point, someone took > it upon themselves to attempt to censor us. Then, like the followers > some folks are, others thought it may be fashionable to follow suit. > > You know, the Internet is a wonderful thing and it can help bridge > many gaps. It can help folks of other countries and other cultures, > understand each other better. It can be a tremendously helpful > pipeline to tap into the collective knowledge of the world. > However, when a few loud-mouthed and ignorant, self-important bullies > decide what can and cannot be asked, talked about, discussed, informed > about and the myriad other uses for newsgroups, there is something > very wrong. > > That a few closed-minded bullies gather round and form their > good-ole-boy circle and but their noses into something that they are > not concerned with and try to destroy it, there is something wrong. > > While there is great disparity in the numbers, this is how Hitler > began. He began as a simple street-thug and folks did nothing. He > continued and more thugs joined his camp. Well, you know the rest. > > Cass > > -- > x-no-archive: yes > > "Mark Kinsler" wrote in message > news:5vU_3.43407$YI2.2160733@typ11.nn.bcandid.com... > > Cass wrote: > > >Mark, > > > > > >You need to tell the truth to these folks and quit trying to play > both > > >sides against the middle. You are the very one who suggested that > I > > >come to this newsgroup to tell of our group purchase. > > > > > >I am thoroughly disgusted with all of this back-stabbing and lying > and > > >flame-baiting. > > > > So am I. That's why I wrote to everyone who seemed to be involved > in the > > whole affair and asked them to stop responding to any posts that > didn't > > ask for information. The idea was that once the flame-filled > threads > > died, perhaps we could address the questions of the laser people > more > > efficiently. We still don't know, for example, what sort of parts > need to > > be manufactured, or to what accuracy. > > > > A 3-in-1 machine might be fine for your purposes, and it's quite > possible > > that a group purchase might save you some money. However, it's > quite > > clear that you don't have much metalworking experience--at least not > to > > the point where you're ready to consider machine tools--and that > you're > > ill-equipped to deal with the give-and-take of a newsgroup that's > not > > familiar to you. I had hoped that you'd have come here with > questions > > instead of demands and advertisements. Instead, you came out > swinging, so > > to speak. > > > > Machine tools are just that--tools. They're not like computers or > video > > games: there generally aren't "good ones" and "bad ones." Machine > tools > > are not rated by Consumer Reports. The consumer-activist mentality > that's > > been fostered in the public schools for the last ten years or so is > more > > of a hindrance than a help in a case like this. Parts availability > and > > service? Nobody really needs them: you make your own parts, > generally. > > If you can't, then you really don't have any use for a machine tool. > > Matter of fact, you can build your own machine tools, and a number > of > > folks on this group have done precisely that. > > > > The people who work in this field generally do so because they enjoy > it. > > Nobody gets particularly rich, and if there's been any consumer > fraud in > > the metalworking field, I haven't heard about it. > > > > Mark Kinsler > > -- > > > ...................................................................... > ...... > > 114 Columbia Ave. Athens, Ohio USA 45701 voice740.594.3737 > fax740.592.3059 > > Home of the "How Things Work" engineering program for adults and > kids. > > See http://www.frognet.net/~kinsler ======== Newsgroups: rec.aviation.homebuilt,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Cass & Altavoz From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 00:49:33 GMT -------- See! I TOLD You!! ;^) teenut Cass wrote: > > Robert, > > Don't you think people can see your hypocrisy when you admonish others > to quit sticking their fingers down my throat and then, you go ahead > and do the same thing? > > You are one of the worst trouble makers, in my opinion. You are the > one who accused a kid of homosexual involvement just because he came > and told the group that he had had very good luck with our past group > purchases. > > Also, I find it telling about your mind-set and values that you > consider common-sense and decency and honesty as vomit. > > Cass > > -- > x-no-archive: yes > > "Robert Bastow" <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote in message > news:UNW_3.3707$0f7.628508@news.rdc1.tn.home.com... > > We have all got to stop sticking our fingers down this guy's > throat..I am tired > > of cleaning my screen every time he vomits all over it! > > > > teenut > > > > Cass wrote: > > > > > > Mark, > > > > > > You are not going to be able to convince anyone of anything if > they > > > don't want to. > > > You cannot be the peacemaker with folks of a certain mind. > > > > > > It is apparent that there are those in this n.g. with minds that > are > > > shut so tightly that they are incapable of new thought. Now, I > > > realize the previous sentence will make some mad. It will only > make > > > those mad that it applies to. While it may be helpful, the truth > > > hurts. > > > > > > No one has ever won a war without casualty. This is a small > skirmish > > > and everyone has taken 'damage'. Everyone comes out looking like > a > > > fool, including myself. > > > > > > The very intelligent thing to do in these diatribes is to simply > not > > > respond to them. > > > However, this world contains many individual personalities and > just as > > > many ideas or perspectives. Personally, I would rather come out > > > looking as a fool and expose the other fools who would deny me my > > > right to express my ideas or search for information or dispense > > > information. There are many people who, upon the first sign of > > > trouble, run off and go somewhere else. That is okay. But it > trains > > > these Neanderthals that they can stomp their collective feet and > get > > > their way when they read something else that they don't like. I > can't > > > save the world, I don't intend that. I do think that folks should > > > stand up to these types and let them know that they don't run > things. > > > > > > Let us get this straight and accurate. I came here solely for the > > > purpose to let folks know that our group had initiated a group > > > purchase. That was it! Then, later on, I did ask for information > > > about 3in1 machines as I don't know anything about them. In fact, > I > > > know extremely little about lathes and milling machines. I would > like > > > to learn. > > > I don't have to know about a machine in order to participate in a > > > group purchase. > > > > > > Your mistake, Mark, if I may say so, is that you kept emailing me > and > > > now I find out that you have emailed others, to try to stop this > or > > > tell someone what to say here or there. > > > Better that you should have stayed out of it rather than > inadvertently > > > stir the brew with constant meddling. > > > > > > We didn't come here for advice or ask for anyone's help in > designing > > > parts. I doubt many, if any here, know much about lasers. I > could be > > > wrong nevertheless, we came here to tell of a group purchase. > I/we > > > were met with an arrogance that bespeaks of child-like minds. We > were > > > labeled as con-artists, when nothing was known about our purchase. > We > > > were labeled as spammers, when we told of our purchase one too > many > > > times for some folks. There have been suggestions to get our ISP > > > accounts cancelled. > > > There have been lies and threats. There have been all manner of > > > things that are in DIRECT OPPOSITION to what a newsgroup should > be. > > > > > > I have been stunned to see some of the sarcastic and > holier-than-thou > > > attitudes expressed by a few malcontents. > > > > > > To correct you, Mark. I did not come out swinging when I came > here. > > > I simply told about our group purchase. At some point, someone > took > > > it upon themselves to attempt to censor us. Then, like the > followers > > > some folks are, others thought it may be fashionable to follow > suit. > > > > > > You know, the Internet is a wonderful thing and it can help bridge > > > many gaps. It can help folks of other countries and other > cultures, > > > understand each other better. It can be a tremendously helpful > > > pipeline to tap into the collective knowledge of the world. > > > However, when a few loud-mouthed and ignorant, self-important > bullies > > > decide what can and cannot be asked, talked about, discussed, > informed > > > about and the myriad other uses for newsgroups, there is something > > > very wrong. > > > > > > That a few closed-minded bullies gather round and form their > > > good-ole-boy circle and but their noses into something that they > are > > > not concerned with and try to destroy it, there is something > wrong. > > > > > > While there is great disparity in the numbers, this is how Hitler > > > began. He began as a simple street-thug and folks did nothing. > He > > > continued and more thugs joined his camp. Well, you know the > rest. > > > > > > Cass > > > > > > -- > > > x-no-archive: yes > > > > > > "Mark Kinsler" wrote in message > > > news:5vU_3.43407$YI2.2160733@typ11.nn.bcandid.com... > > > > Cass wrote: > > > > >Mark, > > > > > > > > > >You need to tell the truth to these folks and quit trying to > play > > > both > > > > >sides against the middle. You are the very one who suggested > that > > > I > > > > >come to this newsgroup to tell of our group purchase. > > > > > > > > > >I am thoroughly disgusted with all of this back-stabbing and > lying > > > and > > > > >flame-baiting. > > > > > > > > So am I. That's why I wrote to everyone who seemed to be > involved > > > in the > > > > whole affair and asked them to stop responding to any posts that > > > didn't > > > > ask for information. The idea was that once the flame-filled > > > threads > > > > died, perhaps we could address the questions of the laser people > > > more > > > > efficiently. We still don't know, for example, what sort of > parts > > > need to > > > > be manufactured, or to what accuracy. > > > > > > > > A 3-in-1 machine might be fine for your purposes, and it's quite > > > possible > > > > that a group purchase might save you some money. However, it's > > > quite > > > > clear that you don't have much metalworking experience--at least > not > > > to > > > > the point where you're ready to consider machine tools--and that > > > you're > > > > ill-equipped to deal with the give-and-take of a newsgroup > that's > > > not > > > > familiar to you. I had hoped that you'd have come here with > > > questions > > > > instead of demands and advertisements. Instead, you came out > > > swinging, so > > > > to speak. > > > > > > > > Machine tools are just that--tools. They're not like computers > or > > > video > > > > games: there generally aren't "good ones" and "bad ones." > Machine > > > tools > > > > are not rated by Consumer Reports. The consumer-activist > mentality > > > that's > > > > been fostered in the public schools for the last ten years or so > is > > > more > > > > of a hindrance than a help in a case like this. Parts > availability > > > and > > > > service? Nobody really needs them: you make your own parts, > > > generally. > > > > If you can't, then you really don't have any use for a machine > tool. > > > > Matter of fact, you can build your own machine tools, and a > number > > > of > > > > folks on this group have done precisely that. > > > > > > > > The people who work in this field generally do so because they > enjoy > > > it. > > > > Nobody gets particularly rich, and if there's been any consumer > > > fraud in > > > > the metalworking field, I haven't heard about it. > > > > > > > > Mark Kinsler > > > > -- > > > > > > > > ...................................................................... > > > ...... > > > > 114 Columbia Ave. Athens, Ohio USA 45701 voice740.594.3737 > > > fax740.592.3059 > > > > Home of the "How Things Work" engineering program for adults and > > > kids. > > > > See http://www.frognet.net/~kinsler ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: How SWEET it is (Off topic) From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 07:21:10 GMT -------- I just read on a gun list that K-Mart has axed Rosie O'Donnell for her nasty remarks about gun owners!! If this is true?? it marks a milestone in gun owners standing up for themselves and telling K-Mart to lose Rosie or lose their customers!! Can anyone confirm the report? 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How SWEET it is (Off topic) From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 25 Nov 1999 07:41:49 GMT -------- I was able to confirm the report: http://news.excite.com/news/eonline/991119/13/rosie-guns-for The pressure on K-mart to dump Rosie was orchestrated almost entirely through the internet!! Yee-Haa! teenut Robert Bastow wrote: > > I just read on a gun list that K-Mart has axed Rosie O'Donnell for her nasty > remarks about gun owners!! If this is true?? it marks a milestone in gun owners > standing up for themselves and telling K-Mart to lose Rosie or lose their > customers!! > > Can anyone confirm the report? > > 8^) > > teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Metal Splinters From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 26 Nov 1999 04:38:00 GMT -------- Morris Booton wrote: > > Hi Everyone: > How does the Professional Machinist cope with the small metal > splinters that get in your > hands, most that you can't see. Is there a trick that is a big > secret? Or do you just > live with the problem? > MRB A) The Pro. learns to avoid getting splinters in the first place. B) When putting hands in or on "splintery" places, the pro learns not to press down or squeeze too hard until he is sure no splinter is going to penetrate the skin. He doesn't wipe his hands on splinter covered coveralls or rags. He brushes chips away from machines and machined parts before using his hands around them. He keeps his hands relatively clean and oil free so that chips don't stick to the skin..waiting for the opportunity to penetrate. A pro may go weeks at a time without getting a splinter in his hands that requires a stop to locate and extract it. C) The pro's skin is usually toughened in the places that get splinters. D) Most tiny splinters never pentrate through to the underlying nerves. They form little black spots in the skin that eventually get dug out in an idle moment, or simply disappear in time. When a splinter DOES get through the "outer defenses" the procedure is to immediately go to his toolchest wherein rests a strong glass or lupe, a needle with the point honed to a tiny scalpel like blade, and a REALLY GOOD pair of flat or pointed nosed tweezers..usually both. With a good light the splinter can usually be spotted if backlighted. If it is below the skin it is dug out with the needle/scalpel..or the surrounding skin is excavated until the pointed tweezers can dig in and get a grip. Yes, sometimes it hurts..but not as much as a septic finger or a lost paycheck!! 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Metal Splinters From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 28 Nov 1999 02:45:28 GMT -------- "Marvin W. Klotz" wrote: > > Ok, teenut, listen up, we're waiting, > > You've been ALL OVER gloves in the workshop - time now for your weekly > diatribe on bare feet (is this man insane??!!) in the workshop. I am not going to comment on his sanity or his sexual preferences..I have heard of people who really LIKE pain!! Doug does raise a valid point though! One of my pet hatreds is walking on chips..I have a real aversion to it! Consequently, I try to keep my work area clean at all times. If I make a cut on lathe, mill or shaper, that scatters chips all over the surrounding floor, I will reset the next cut on auto feed and take a swift once around with the broom while it is cutting...Makes use of otherwise "dead" time too. It is a misconception that a "Real" machine shop needs to be knee deep in chips all the time. Most of the "professional" shops that I have worked in (and/or owned) had floors ALMOST clean enough to eat off. Larger plants employed laborers whose job was to keep floors clean. Nowadays machine builders go to great lengths to completely envelope machining centers etc., in guards and chip/splash shields. I dare say you could take a tour through many machine shops, in house slippers, and never SEE a chip on the floor. Personally, I see my shop as a relaxing place, somewhat of a "Gentleman's Workshop" in the old Victorian sense...where I can go and sit, in a comfortable chair, suck down a cold beer and do nothing but "think" if I so wish. "Sometimes I sits and thinks, sometimes I just sits" Consequently my own shop has a sprung wooden floor, finished with hard vinyl tile that is easy to keep clean. Chips get swept up, long before they have time to be ground into either my shoe soles or the floor surface. Each evening, before quitting, I make a point of cleaning up machines, floor etc., and putting away tools. I will also give exposed surfaces a squirt of WD40 too! Why? I never know when I might get down into the shop again..it might be the following day..or it might be a couple of weeks before inclination and opportunity present at the same time. It may well be that I need to go down there to check a dimension for a drawing..in which case I feel quite comfortable going down barefoot!! Barefoot machining?? Hey, I used to "cut quite a rug"...but even now I prefer dancing with a partner and musical accompanyment!! When I do cut metal, those chips are hot and sharp!! To each his own. 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Transfer Screws From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 28 Nov 1999 03:00:27 GMT -------- Short, hardened, set screws, with the end machined to a point. Used by toolmakers and machine fitters to accurately transfer the locations of tapped holes (Particularly BLIND tapped holes) to a mating part. In use they are screwed into the tapped holes until the point is JUST proud of the surface. The mating part is placed in position and given a sharp bonk with a hammer. The points will leave center punches in the required locations. Heinman are the original makers of sets..usually six screws, in a short hexagonal holder with a screwed top. The other end of the holder has a hex drive socket to match a hex section machined on the screw at the pointy end. teenut Jim Stewart wrote: > > XPRTEC wrote: > > > > Ed, > > > > I hate to ask this but the picture didn't come up on my computer. What are > > transfer screws? > > > > Well, the picture did come up on mine, and I *still* don't know what > they are. How about it, Ed? > > -js > > -- > > http://www.strappe.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: ounces and sines From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 29 Nov 1999 01:35:53 GMT -------- Your conversion figures are correct. 8^) teenut "Marvin W. Klotz" wrote: > > Will some of our British cousins please help resolve a disagreement > with SWMBO > by confirming or correcting the following "equivalences"? > > 1 UKlb = 1 USlb = 16 UKoz = 16 USoz (conventional weight, not mass) > 1 UK(fluid)pt = 20 US(fluid)oz > (several references list the UK(fluid)oz = 1.041 US(fluid)oz - what's > this?) > 1 UK(fluid)qt = 2 UK(fluid)pt > 1 UK(fluid)gal = 4 UK(fluid)qt = 8 UK(fluid)pt > 1 US(fluid)gal = 4 US(fluid)qt = 8 US(fluid)pt (I know this is correct > - > purely for reference) > 1 UK(liquid)gal (what the colonies call the Imperial gal) = 5 > US(fluid)qt > > ergo: > > The common(?) mnemonic, "a pint's a pound, the world around" applies > only in > the USA. Sadly, when I was in London, a pint cost a good bit more > than a > UKpound :-), though one never gets two inches of foam, and, > gratefully, the > beer is the proper temperature! > > Mandatory metalworking content: > > It occurred to me that one could make the two-dimensional equivalent > of a sine > plate by constructing an equilateral triangular fixturing plate with a > precision sphere (ball) mounted accurately at each corner. Probably > not useful > for machining, but might be a cheaper way to measure compound angles > than > springing for a couple of sine plates. Anyone ever done anything > along these > lines? > > Regards, Marv > > Email: mklotz@alum.mit.edu > > Home shop utility freeware page at: > http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hall/4425 ======== Newsgroups: alt.collecting,rec.crafts.metalworking,relcom.commerce.talk,relcom.consumers Subject: Re: sewing machine From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 00:09:09 GMT -------- Thank you Victor..I will know where to go to sell Granny's sewing machine! 8^) teenut Victor wrote: > > To sell an antique german sewing machine made last quarter of 19 cen. > :KOELER > MASCHINE BESTES DEUTSCHES FABRIKAT ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: 'andy bit o' kit From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 01:25:32 GMT -------- http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=210440540 Bought one for myself..new price is $40 or $50.00..these go for a lot less!! He has more than one..contact him direct and offer $8.00 plus shipping...$15.00 total. Shhh!! ;^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Ebay and getting machines safely home From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 01:40:48 GMT -------- Rigging and shipping can be brutal!! Example: Deckel FP1 wt 1700# M/c cost $2025 Rigger in Cal. 250 Ship to GA 750 Rigger in GA 405 Deckel GK21 wt 900# M/c cost $1275 Rigger in CT 75 Ship to GA 600 Rigger in GA 405 I could have saved a lot of money by offloading and installing the machines myself..but I ain't that stupid anymore!! Any dealer who offers free loading/palletising and the advantage of group or discount rates for shipping is way ahead on the market. I for one, don't mind hiring good people at this end to do the offload and installation. I have seen a couple of surface grinders on Ebay that I would have bid on (and a Habeggar Lathe ;^) but the cost of shipping is prohibitory! FWIW teenut Dave Ficken wrote: > > Just curious as to how any group members have made out having machines > purchased on ebay shipped. I'm asking specifically about stuff that is too > heavy to go UPS. > > I've noticed a few cheap machines and have been tempted to bid at times,but it > always comes down to too much uncertainty in getting the item safely home. > > Anyone had any interesting experiences they'd care to share (good or bad)? > > Dave Ficken > Meridian Machinery > http://www.mermac.com > Email:Dave@mermac.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Ebay and getting machines safely home From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 01:46:33 GMT -------- Prohibitory!!!! I can't believe I wrote that!!!! Prohibitivatory..Er..Prohibitive?? Huh? Time for a tablet. 8^) teenut Robert Bastow wrote: > > Rigging and shipping can be brutal!! > > Example: > > Deckel FP1 wt 1700# M/c cost $2025 > Rigger in Cal. 250 > Ship to GA 750 > Rigger in GA 405 > > Deckel GK21 wt 900# M/c cost $1275 > Rigger in CT 75 > Ship to GA 600 > Rigger in GA 405 > > I could have saved a lot of money by offloading and installing the machines > myself..but I ain't that stupid anymore!! > > Any dealer who offers free loading/palletising and the advantage of group or > discount rates for shipping is way ahead on the market. I for one, don't mind > hiring good people at this end to do the offload and installation. > > I have seen a couple of surface grinders on Ebay that I would have bid on (and a > Habeggar Lathe ;^) but the cost of shipping is prohibitory! > > FWIW > > teenut > > Dave Ficken wrote: > > > > Just curious as to how any group members have made out having machines > > purchased on ebay shipped. I'm asking specifically about stuff that is too > > heavy to go UPS. > > > > I've noticed a few cheap machines and have been tempted to bid at times,but it > > always comes down to too much uncertainty in getting the item safely home. > > > > Anyone had any interesting experiences they'd care to share (good or bad)? > > > > Dave Ficken > > Meridian Machinery > > http://www.mermac.com > > Email:Dave@mermac.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: V-belt vs. flat Q From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 03:47:23 GMT -------- Good pages Dave...Great looking machine! You will not be sorry you made the trade..In fact you got a DEAL!! That lathe will repay every minute you put into it a hundred fold. I would consider seriously reverting to the original flat belt drive..don't worry about power transmission, a good flat belt will transmit it in spades. (Some of the world's LARGEST belt drives..papermills, cement kilns, etc., are flat belts..vee belts just won't hack it!!) Consult with your local belting and transmission specialists..look for Habasit or Seigling in yellow pages..they have trained people who will be delighted to help you on every detail of your drive. My own preference is for flat belt drives over vee belt or even poly-vee drives every time. Quieter and smoother (with properly made joints) more efficient (don't have to pry the vee out of the groove all the time) Can run faster (less centrifugal force lifting the belt), around tighter corners (smaller pulleys), shorter center distances and/or higher ratios of driver/driven (need less "wrap" to transmit same power) What you HAVE to have though, is a properly aligned pulley system that is capable of putting the required tension on the belt..up to 4% stretch is normal. Modern flat drive belting is an area of advanced technology that too few people are aware of. Take a trip down to your local Seigling or Habasit Distributor's and ask for technical brochures on power transmission application engineering..It's a whole new world!! 8^) teenut David Bush wrote: > > I like it! I like it! Man, what a great idea! > > I could use a belt with a 11/2" or 2" width. Do you know if these belts are > available at 60 to 65" lenghts? > > If anyone is interested, I hastly posted some web pages today of my wee little shop > at: http://members.citynet.net/parmaco/shop.htm . > > Thanks, all > > Dave ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: V-belt vs. flat Q From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 06:25:17 GMT -------- A cast iron or steel pulley will work just fine with your flat belt. Come to think of it..I have never come across a rubber pulley..except on a belt grinder. I suspect the pulley you have may have had a previous life as a castor wheel or some such!! What kind of belt did you buy? Can you lace it or bond it together without stripping the lathe apart? Tell me more about the headstock bearings too..you mentioned that there was wear in them. I will be surprised if that can't be remedied easily! 8^) teenut David Bush wrote: > > Thanks, Robert (made my day :>), > > However, I still have the problem with the pulley that mounts on the motor. I was at > McMaster-Carr web site to look for flat belt pulleys and the don't have a size to mount > on a 1 1/8" shaft. It goes from 1" to 1 1/4". It would let me keep that expensive flat > belt that I just bought ($80) and I wouldn't have to remove the spindle again. I wonder > how a pulley made out of cast or steel would work? Think it would be more prone to > slipping? > > As always any thoughts or ideas most appreciated. > > Dave > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > Good pages Dave...Great looking machine! You will not be sorry you made the > > trade..In fact you got a DEAL!! > > > > That lathe will repay every minute you put into it a hundred fold. > > > > I would consider seriously reverting to the original flat belt drive..don't > > worry about power transmission, a good flat belt will transmit it in spades. > > (Some of the world's LARGEST belt drives..papermills, cement kilns, etc., are > > flat belts..vee belts just won't hack it!!) > > > > Consult with your local belting and transmission specialists..look for Habasit > > or Seigling in yellow pages..they have trained people who will be delighted to > > help you on every detail of your drive. > > > > My own preference is for flat belt drives over vee belt or even poly-vee drives > > every time. Quieter and smoother (with properly made joints) more efficient > > (don't have to pry the vee out of the groove all the time) Can run faster (less > > centrifugal force lifting the belt), around tighter corners (smaller pulleys), > > shorter center distances and/or higher ratios of driver/driven (need less "wrap" > > to transmit same power) > > > > What you HAVE to have though, is a properly aligned pulley system that is > > capable of putting the required tension on the belt..up to 4% stretch is normal. > > > > Modern flat drive belting is an area of advanced technology that too few people > > are aware of. Take a trip down to your local Seigling or Habasit Distributor's > > and ask for technical brochures on power transmission application > > engineering..It's a whole new world!! > > > > 8^) > > > > teenut > > > > David Bush wrote: > > > > > > I like it! I like it! Man, what a great idea! > > > > > > I could use a belt with a 11/2" or 2" width. Do you know if these belts are > > > available at 60 to 65" lenghts? > > > > > > If anyone is interested, I hastly posted some web pages today of my wee little shop > > > at: http://members.citynet.net/parmaco/shop.htm . > > > > > > Thanks, all > > > > > > Dave > > -----------== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News ==---------- > http://www.newsfeeds.com The Largest Usenet Servers in the World! > ------== Over 73,000 Newsgroups - Including Dedicated Binaries Servers ==----- ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: corrugated metal for washboards From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 16:28:24 GMT -------- Naw Pete! They are not for sale because they are still in daily use! 8^) teenut PLAlbrecht wrote: > Doing an international search in ebay for washboard in the UK got zero hits. > You people must have entered the 20th century sooner than many parts of the > U.S... > > Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: where can I find From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 30 Nov 1999 16:37:44 GMT -------- Try a web search for "Cratex"...They are one of the largest manufacturers. teenut sinsun@my-deja.com wrote: > > Anybody know where can I find the Rubber bonding > Wheel or Rubberized Abrasives from the > manufactory. > Thanks > sinsun@ctimail3.com > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: ounces and sines From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 01 Dec 1999 00:19:04 GMT -------- I am so glad to learn that I am no longer 20 pounds (Avoirdupois) over WEIGHT...just a little MASSY for my height! Please, no one is to mention SLUG! ;^) teenut Gene Nygaard wrote: (A LOOOONG definition of weight vs Mass) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Steel in USS Missouri From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 01 Dec 1999 17:34:46 GMT -------- PLAlbrecht wrote: > 4.7. Boat sinking in pool. > There is a famous problem about throwing a stone from a boat into the swimming > pool where the boat is floating. When the stone is thrown from the boat, does > the water level rise, fall, or remain unchanged? Water level will Fall! Boat plus stone displace water equal to their weight (mass) Boat minus stone displaces water equal to its own mass Stone now displaces LESS water than its own mass (assuming it sinks!) Less water in total is displaced so water level will fall in pool. What happens to the > water level if a hole is made in the bottom of the boat and the boat sinks? If > the water level changes, Water level will fall. The unholed boat will displace water equal to its weight. The sunken boat will displace less water (otherwise it would float even though waterlogged) when does the change begin? In particular, does it > begin to change when water first enters the boat?" The change begins as soon as water enters the boat. Displaced water is being replaced by denser (Thus less "Voluminous" "Boat material") teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Mill, or drill press?? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 02 Dec 1999 05:35:48 GMT -------- The Arboga is quite a nice, well made, Swedish Milling machine. See: http://www.lathes.co.uk/arboga/index.html teenut Steve Stallings wrote: > > Arboca is known to me only for drill presses. That and seeing > what looks like an adjustable clamping slit down the front of > the quill housing would lead me to call it a drill press. A very > nice drill press, even worth the $800 it brought at auction. > > Cheers, > Steve Stallings > > > > >Wondering which this might be, mill or drill? > > > >http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=207330815 > > > >I once looked at a simillar "mill" for sale. It also took 3MT tooling, but > had > >no provision for a draw bar and used Tanged tooling. > >My opinion was that it was a drill press (a nice drill press no doubt) with > a > >cross slide table built in. > > > >Anyone familliar with this machine? Which is it, mill or rugged drill? > > > >Regards, > >Dave > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Too smart. (too long) From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 02 Dec 1999 05:51:31 GMT -------- I have a little Sherline 3" 4 Jaw with a 5C arbor. Worth its weight in gold it is! A real gem and a delight to use on smaller jobs. I can also transfer it to my indexer/dividing/rotary milling heads..which is VERY useful at times. I LIKE four jaw chucks but don't like setting up small jobs in big chucks. Consequently my 11 Inch lathe is equiped with the 3" Sherline, a 4" import. 6" Burnerd and an 8" Buck...(for bigger jobs at lower speeds I might add!) The little 3" and the 6" get the most use but the 4" is real handy too. teenut John Hofstad-Parkhill wrote: > > Over-engineering gone bad, or "Help! I'm a Starrett engineer trapped in a > Software Developer's body". BUT the real reason I'm mentioning it, is I > find this little Bison far superior to the Sherline 3". ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: ounces and sines From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 02 Dec 1999 12:01:55 GMT -------- PLEASE!! Have you no decency!! (Anyway, it is a little UNDER a stone and a half (14 + 7 = 21 pounds !!) teenut Mike hide wrote: > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > > >I am so glad to learn that I am no longer 20 pounds (Avoirdupois) over > >WEIGHT...just a little MASSY for my height! > > > >Please, no one is to mention SLUG! > > > >;^) > > > >teenut > > > >Gene Nygaard wrote: > >(A LOOOONG definition of weight vs Mass) > Lets see now 20 lbs, thats a little over a stone and a half....mjh ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking,relcom.commerce.energy,relcom.commerce.machinery,sci.engr.metallurgy,ukr.commerce.metals Subject: Re: ðÒÏÄÁÍ ÅÍËÏÓÔØ ÄÌÑ ÈÒÁÎÅÎÉÑ É ÒÁÓÐÒÅÄÅÌÅÎÉÑ ÓÖÉÖÅÎÎÏÇÏ ÇÁÚÁ, ÅÍËÏÓÔØ 4,2 From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 02 Dec 1999 12:43:28 GMT -------- euromet wrote: > > ðÒÏÄÁÍ ÅÍËÏÓÔØ ÄÌÑ ÈÒÁÎÅÎÉÑ É ÒÁÓÐÒÅÄÅÌÅÎÉÑ ÓÖÉÖÅÎÎÏÇÏ ÇÁÚÁ, ÅÍËÏÓÔØ 4,2 > ËÕÂÏÍÅÔÒÁ. óÔÏÉÍÏÓÔØ 25,000 ÒÕÂ. äÏÓÔÁ×ËÁ ÐÏ ìÅÎÉÎÇÒÁÄÓËÏÊ ÏÂÌÁÓÔÉ > ÂÅÓÐÌÁÔÎÏ. ðÒÉÌÁÇÁÅÔÓÑ ÐÅÒ×ÙÊ ÌÉÓÔ ÐÁÓÐÏÒÔÁ. ðÒÉ ÎÅÏÂÈÏÄÉÍÏÓÔÉ ÐÒÅÄÏÓÔÁ×ÉÍ > ×ÓÀ ÄÏËÕÍÅÎÔÁÃÉÀ. > ó×ÑÚØ ÐÏ e-mail euromet@mail.wplus.net > > begin 666 1.tif > M24DJ`"@%``#6!0``B08``#D'```P"0``A!$``+ 7``"C&0``Z!X``$(J``#1 > M+0``E2X``%DO```?, ``ZC$``#HT``!%-0``!#8``+HV``!W-P``'S@``, X > M``!D.0``+3L``/(^``!K0 ``440``-%+```94P``ZE0``,%5``#,5P``*5D` > M`,]9``![6@``+UL``-];``"P7 ``'5\``"9A``#O80``+6,``*QF``!6: `` > M'&D``-!I``#P:@``.&T``+]Q``"' ``SW@``%UZ``!2 > M? ``;X ``!V#``!ZA ``!H8``*R'``!ZB ``@8D``"R+``#UC ``^HT``,N. > M``"ECP``[) ``..4```VF ``6ID``%6;``#3G0``Y)X``#Z@``"JI0``F:H` > M`/>K``#MKP``Z;D``&"^``!QOP``=, ``$C!```/P@``6<,``/O$``"HQ@`` > M@\<``$O(```-R0``TLD``)S*```TS ``!M$``&C8```MX ``E^8``!#I``!6 > MZ@``,>X``(+S``"K]@``=?D``'S[``"<_0``A_\``/,``0#9`0$`O@(!`*H# > M`0!A!0$`SP@!`#(+`0`E# $`#PT!`%\.`0`1$ $`KQ$!`&(2`0`5$P$`U!,! > M`(H4`0!-%0$`'18!`.<6`0"D& $`QQD!`/\:`0"P'0$`*R$!`&4B`0!5) $` > MDBH!`"8O`0!@, $`A#$!`),S`0!@-0$`*C8!`.@V`0"V-P$`?S@!`$TY`0`3 > M.@$`VSH!`)D[`0!;/ $`%ST!`"X_`0`*1 $`XD4!`!-'`0`S3 $`SU$!`/12 > M`0`.5 $`HE8!`(=:`0!V7@$`:F(!`+-C`0"S````L ```/ M`/,!``!%!0``6@L``(\#``#$````Q ```,8```#+`0``4 (```L!``"_```` > MM@```+T```"H````H0```*0```#)`0``Q0,``'D!``#F`P``@ <``$@'``#1 > M`0``UP````L"``!=`0``I@```*P```"T````L ```-$```!M`@``"0(``,D` > M```^`0``?P,``*H!``#&````M ```" !``!(`@``AP0``,@!``".`0``P $` > M`#P!``"^````C@$``/4!```=! ``K@(``%T!``",`0``I@$``,X````'`0`` > MJP$``,D!```%`0``T0```-H```!'`0``]P,``%,#```D`0``^P$``'X"```1 > M`0``6@$``&P%``#O! ``7@$``/8#``#\"0``=P0``!$!```#`0``U ```,<` > M``!*`0``H@$``*T!``#;````R ```,(```#%````R@```)@!``#2! ``8@<` > M`,4'``!J!@``>0(``$8!``#;`P``404``"D#``#*`@``!P(``" "``#K`0`` > M; $``.8```#E````[ ```+ > M`0``LP```+,```"_````M@```,,```#0````R@```+T!```C`0``. $``+$" > M``![`P``.@$``/ !```]!@``E 0``#H!```D`0``#P(``,T!``#*````O@`` > M`,X```#)````S@```,8```#(````O@```,(```"\````%P(``-P$``#8`0`` > M,0$``" %``" M`0```0```"P!```!````#@#^``0``0```````````0,``0```$((```!`0,` > M`0```'P)```"`0,``0````$````#`0,``0````6 ```&`0,``0`````````' > M`0,``0````,````1`00`H@````@````5`0,``0````$````6`00``0````\` > M```7`00`H@```) "```:`04``0```!@%```;`04``0```" %```H`0,``0`` > M``(`````````@0#E```/EP`!/O^!`.4```>7``$>/X$`Y0``!Y<``3Y_@0#E > M```/_0``()P``3Y_@0#E```.EP`!/G^!`.4```>7``$^?X$`Y0``!Y<``3[_ > M@0#E```'EP`!/G_!```![@``0+H```>7``$^?X$`Y0``!Y<``1[_@0#E```' > MEP`!'O^!`.4```>7``$>?X$`Y0``!]T``("\``$>_X$`Y0``'Y<``1[_@0#E > M```/EP`!'O^!`.4``0> F `!/O^!`.4```>7``$>?X$`Y0``!Y<``1[_@0#E > M```'EP`!'O^!`.4```^7``$??X$`Y0``!Y<``1]_V@``@(T```;J```@KP`! > M'O^!`.4```^7``$>__0``("!`/,```>7``$>?X$`Y0``!Y<``1Y_@0#E```' > MEP`!'O^!`.4```>7``$>_X$`Y0``!Y<``1[_@0#E```'EP`!'W^!`.4```>7 > M``$>?^(```&%```'EP`!'G^!`.4```>7``$>?X$`Y0``#Y<``1Y_[ ``$($` > M^P``#Y<``1Y_@0#E```'NP`!`_S?``$>?X$`Y0``!\<```[V``$'_-\``1Y_ > M@0#E```'QP`!/X#W``$#_-\``1Y_E@`!"^#2```'QP`!?X#W``$!^-\``1]_ > ME@`!'_#F```8_P``@/$```_'``%_@/8``/#?``$>?Y8``1_P^ ``$/ ``QP` > M`8#Q```'QP`!_X#V``#P\@``0/<``A `$/P``1Y_E@`!#^#Q``$!@/@``QP` > M`X#Q```'QP`!_X#V``#PWP`!'O^6``$'P/$``0' ^ `#'@`'@/$```?(``$! > M\/4``/#?``$?_\$``#C7``$#@/$``0'@^ `#'\ ?@/$```?(``$!P/4``/#T > M``$'X/X``@)P#OX```3_``' (/P``1]_P0``?/(``$#G``$#@/ ``/#Y``%\ > M#___`(#Q```'RP``(/\``0' ]0`"\ /@^P`3?X WQI@?^ /A^ ?X'X _P#_ > M#_#[``$>_\$``/S7``$#P/<`$0@`@8 <#P#\18($!?#_C_#_#___\ ``!] ` > M``S_``$/@/X`$@. `O@_`_@/\ `_P ']\ _\`?[]`!/_P#_'^'_\`_?\!_@_ > M@#_ __@?_/L``1[_P0``_-<``0. ^@`)! ! 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'WX /@`'C[```_ > MM `". `'^P`!`2#\```>^ `.`_X/P `!@P@O`?_ ?\?X_S\&P /_X'^'^/X` > M"1\'@!\#_@_])_[P``!PY0`<`? >`? \`\ \#P'P/@^ ?!\`> \!X#@/@^ / > M`/#_``('P/C_`",/P\ \!\ ^!\ >CP!^'P#P^ ? _ /_`/X`_@?X?@#_P / > M`'S[```_M `"/ `/^P`'#_ #P/@`#_[^``,#_'^ _P`7`?X?A_Q_A_Q_@__ > M/\?X/__@!__@/P?P_@`)#P> 'X<\!_ `\/ ``'CD`!OP'@/ / / ? ?#X'X' > M@'@_`/@/`?!X!\/ #P'@_P`"#\#X_P`C!__ ?@? _A_@#_\`/__ ?_ /\/X! > M_P#^`'X/\'\`_X #P !X^P``/[8`$A<`/D/_`#X`?\?X/_@'X_P`/_[^``,' > M^'^ _@`6_!\#^'\#^'\'Q^ _P_ ?__ '@^ ?`^#^``D>#X ?!SP#X #P\ `` > M>.0`&_ ^`\ \`\!\!\/@/@> /#\`_!\!\G@'_\ ?`?#_``(?X?S_`!4#_X#_ > MC_#_'^ '_ `?_\ _X ?P_ #X_ `($!0`# `#X !\^P``/[D`%1_U`'_ /__^ > M`/^ ?\?X?_P#__X`?_[^``(!\#_]`!;X/@#P'@3P/PX!\ ^!X _!\ \!\!\# > MP/X`_P\'``X'& /@`.#P``!PY `;_'P#P#P'X'X'_\ ^#X __@'^/\#_^ /_ > M@#_'^/\``C_C_/\`$ '_`/^?\/\?X /@``?]@ ^ \@`#`^ `?/L``#_%`"'_ > M`^$>'^'^/\'Y_@!__X'_\!___@/WX#^#\/G^`?Y^`/ ^_@`"`> >_0`6^#P` > M\!X!\#X``?@/`? /`? >`> 'AX#^``D/'P`>!@`#X #@\ ``>.0`&S_X!_#\ > M#_'_`_^ ?Y_@'_@#_C_ ?_ !_P`_P_C_``(/X?S^``0P``@`(.<``P/@`'S[ > M```_V0```?D`!@$H&0'T!_#]``C_!^'^'^'^/\#__P``__X#`?GX#__X#0?! > M\!\!P> _`/@>`> >_@`"`> >_0`'^'P`\!X`\![_``OX#P'@#P'P'@'P!\?] > M``D/O@`?!@`#X # \ ``>.0`%3_P#_'_#_#_`/\`?Y_@!_ !_A_ /X#4``,# > MP !\^P``/]D`#Q^ #_'^'^'^/^/^'^/^#_S]``C_#^#^'X'^/\#__Q8!^#X# > MX'P#X' /`/@/@X `#P#P'@'@'OX``@'@/OT`!_AX`/ ^`. >_P`+> \!X MX!X!X /._0`)'_\`#PX``^ !P/ ``'CD``T/X _P_@% 0@`\`#^?X,P``P/ > M`'S[```_\ ``$/8`&@?X`' `4!_ YA_ ?^ ?\?X?\?X?P?X?P?P__OT`&'\/ > M@'P?@/P_`'X/@> \!\!\`\!P#P#X!\/_``8/@/ ?`^(>_0`!X#[]`/_X!0#@ > M?@#P'O\`"W@/`^ /`^ >`> #[/T`"1__P \.``/@`<#P``!XY ```O,``$#M > M``! XP`#`^ `_/L``#_G`!T'\ `/^ /\`?\?X?\_X/_P#_#^#^#\'\#^'X'X > M?G_]`!@_'X!X#P!\'P`\#X/@/ > ? / X X`> /'_P`&#X#@/@/@'OT``?#^ > M_0`'^/ `X/P!\#[_``LX#X/@#P? '@'@`?C]``D?#^ ?#@`#X ' \ ``<-4` > M`$#M```@XP`#!^ `_OL``#_G`!X/^ `'^ _^`/\?P?X?X??X!_#\#\!X#X!^ > M#X'P \`?!\`. \#X#P/@#P#_^ $#@!X`^;_``8'@/!\`\ ^ > M_0`!\/[]``?_\ #A_@#P/O\`"WP/_^ /'X >`. `^/T`"0\#X \.``/@`<#P > M``!XH0`##_@#__L``#_G`!X?_@`'X!^_@/P/P'P?P\'\!_#\#P!X!X ^#X'P > M`!^ _@`8/#X`>!\`>!\`>!\#X#P/`#X#P. >`'P!_/\`!@> \/P#P#[^``(! > MX?[]`!7__ #C_@#__@?A_ __X __`!X!X #P_0`)'P'P'PX``^ #P/ ``'BA > M``0/_ /_@/P``#_G`!Y__P`#X#X/P'P/@'P/@P#\`?!\'P!X#X ^#X/@``^ > M_@#_/@\`>!\`?!\`>!\#X#P/@#X#_\ $'@`\`/S_``8/@/'P`\ ^_@`"`><> > M_@`6(/_^`.><`/_^!__\#^?@#_P`/@'@`/C]``D?`? /#@`#X & \ ``<*$` > M`P_\`?_[```_YP`>_O^ `^ \!\!\#X!\#X `/@'P>#X`>!^ 'P^'P `'P/X` > M&#Y^`'@_`'P?`'@^`> \#P`>`^' '@`\`/C_``8'@/_@`\ >_0`!YQ[^`!80 > M>!\`]QX!^/X'__P/`? /X `^`> `^/T`"1\#\ \,``/@`X#P``!XEP``/^<` > M&/@?@ /@? /@? ^ ? ^ `#X`^'@^`'@_@ __CP. ``/ _@`8?_P`>'\`?_\` > M>/P!^/P/`!X#X< ^`'P`^/\`!@> _P`#X![]``'\'/X`%@AP'P#\'@#P/@> > M_ \!\ ^ `!X!X '\_0`)'P?@#PX``^ #@/ ``'B7```_YP`>^ > ` M'X \#X `/@!\_'P`?'^ #]_/@ `#P/X`&#_^`'W_`'__`'_P`/O^#P`^`^' > M'@!\`'S_``8'@/P``\ ^_0`!^![^`!8"^ \`_!X!\!X'@'@/`> /`< >`. # > MOOT`_Q\'X!\>``/@`X#P``!PT0``@,@``#_H`!D!\ ? `>!X`^!\'X!\#X ` > M/@!___P`>.^ !___`X `!\#^`"$__P!_QP!__P!_X !__ \`/@/AP!X`? #^ > M`#@'@/ 8`^ >_0`!^![]`!5P#P#X'@'@'@/ ^ \!X \#P \`X ,>_0`)/__ > M'_X``> '@/ ``'B7```_Z `9`? 'P /@< /@?@^ ? ^ `!\`/__X`'W/@ /_ > M__\``0/ _@`%/_^ ?X<`__\!`'__`!7X/ ^ / /!@!X`? '^`'P'`? \`> > > M_@`"`? >_0`5\!\`\#P`X!X#P? ?@> /`\ /`? ''_T`"7__`#__``'@!X#P > M``!PEP``/^@`&P'P`\ #X/ !X#__@'__@8!_`!__\ !_SX #__[_``$#P/X` > M(3X?P'\/`'@?`'X``? \!X \`\& #P#X`=\`? \`X#P!X!S^``(!\![]`!/X > M/P'P'@'P/@/@\!^!\ >#P ^'^/\.`(#^``@\( `__X #\ ?O``!PUP```L(` > M`#_H``X!\ / `^'P`> __X __X/__PH`'W_P`#^/``'G_O\``0? _@`A/ ? > M?@\`> \`. X!\#X'@#P#X8 /`/@#GP!\'@#P> 'P/OX``@'P'OX`%P'__@'P > M/@'P/@'SX#_#^ ?'P ?_^#\?P/L```+_``(#X ?O``!XEP``/^@`#@'P!\ # > MX/@!X#Z_@'[_@___#@` `\>.`!@'P/X`(CP'P'P/`/@/`'@>`?@\ > M`\!\`^/ !X#P!P^ ?CP`\'@`_O^ _P`"`? __@`7`__\`? ?`_A_`'_ /\?X > M!_^ `__P/Y_@^ `"`^ '[P``>)<``#_H`!D!X / `>!X`> \!X!^#X'__@`< > M?/@`?@> !_^'`P`\!X#^`!P\#\!\#P!X#P!X'P#X?@/@^ ?SP ?!X ^/P#_\ > M`/_X`P!__X#_``,'^'^ _P`0`__P!_A_@_Q_@#^ +\/X`?S_``3YP!\/X/@` > M`@ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: An Eng'r would say... From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 02 Dec 1999 21:53:23 GMT -------- A REAL Lawyer will argue that it cannot be both 1/2 full or empty. Therefore it doesn't exist and should be excluded from the evidence!! 8^) teenut Seppo Vaaja wrote: > > a lawyer will argue that the glass is both 1/2 full and 1/2 MT ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: An Eng'r would say... From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 03 Dec 1999 00:38:02 GMT -------- That's a Politician's answer!! A Mathematician would argue that, as a line has no width..there is room for an infinite number of lines between half empty and half full. A Cynic would form a group to get a good price on them. But only a Fool would take the word of any of them! 8^) teenut Mike Rehmus wrote: > > Robert, couldn't a line exist between the 1/2-full and 1/2 empty halves? > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote in message > news:nTB14.8403$0f7.725980@news.rdc1.tn.home.com... > > A REAL Lawyer will argue that it cannot be both 1/2 full or empty. > > > > Therefore it doesn't exist and should be excluded from the evidence!! > > > > 8^) > > > > teenut > > > > Seppo Vaaja wrote: > > > > > > a lawyer will argue that the glass is both 1/2 full and 1/2 MT ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: An Eng'r would say... From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 03 Dec 1999 00:39:37 GMT -------- Plea? PLEA!! I always thought they said FEE Bargaining!! teenut LRHermit wrote: > > Isn't that what they call 'plea bargaining'? > > Mike Rehmus > >Robert, couldn't a line exist between the 1/2-full and 1/2 > empty halves? > > > > > >Robert Bastow > >> A REAL Lawyer will argue that it cannot be both 1/2 full > or empty. > >> > >> Therefore it doesn't exist and should be excluded from > the evidence!! > > >> Seppo Vaaja wrote: > >> > > >> > a lawyer will argue that the glass is both 1/2 full and > 1/2 MT > > > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Was: ounces and sines, now about gold.... From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 03 Dec 1999 07:29:18 GMT -------- A Sovereign is (was) always a gold coin worth one Pound or twenty shillings. A Guinea..for which no coin or note existed in recent history was 21 shillings. teenut (who never was paid, or paid for, anything in Guineas in his life!!) NOSPAM ORTRASH Mark White wrote: > > Since we are on this subject, how much is a Sovereign worth, and is it > always a coin? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 3-jaw vs 4-jaw (was too smart, too long) From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 03 Dec 1999 07:48:57 GMT -------- It is only you John ;^) A four jaw chuck has WAY more gripping power than any three jaw. Tweaking out the last thou or so of runnout without ensuring that all the jaws have close to the same "tightness" is simply asking for the job to go off center during machining..especially if there are any interrupted cuts involved. It just takes a little extra patience and practice to get it right..but it does help to treat the jaws as opposing pairs. If you have to back off say number two jaw to twitch number four..go back then to number two and re-tighten it to the same torque as no. four. Then do the same thing with numbers one and three. 8^) teenut John Hofstad-Parkhill wrote: > > Chuck: > > >In general, 3 jaw chucks do not have the gripping power of 4 jaw chucks > > I find the opposite is true, and I'm shooting this out to see if it's only > me. What happens is that I'm so focused on centering the work that I forget > that I also need to hold it securely. Squeezing the last .001" of runout > turns out to be an exercise in adjusting _one_ jaw's torque ever so > slightly. Once I get it set, I'm loathe to make any further adjustments. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Weird Shaper Question From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 03 Dec 1999 08:04:14 GMT -------- Better grip....and somewhere for dirt and chips to go when you slide the tool in and out to "bed" it in before final tightening. (Kinda like you always give something a little twist in the three jaw before nipping it up fully.) Put the grooves in. BTW the ring should be case hardened or it won't stay flat very long. 8^) teenut George Glines wrote: > > My SB 7" shaper and lathe are currently about 800 miles apart, and since I > will be with the lathe this weekend, I thought I would turn the missing > toolpost ring that I don't have for the shaper. It's outside diameter > doesn't appear to be critical (?) , although I can see having it as flat as > possible would be important. > > The pictures in the Lindsay reprint of the shaper book showed a grooved ring > (grooved on the face). Any reason for the grooves? > > Thanks, > > George ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Ah ha! - Indexing success From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 03 Dec 1999 08:08:22 GMT -------- You make repeated references to "AxMan" Who the hell IS AxMan? 8^) teenut John Hofstad-Parkhill wrote: > > And speaking of credit, Jim was the one that found the level vials at AxMan. > I'm the idiot that bought them all up and sold them at a slight loss. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Why posting pictures is a bad idea, was: Re: ðÒÏÄÁÍ ÅÍËÏÓÔØ ÄÌÑ ÈÒÁÎÅÎÉÑ É ÒÁÓÐÒÅÄÅÌÅÎÉÑ ÓÖÉÖÅÎÎÏÇÏ ÇÁÚÁ, ÅÍËÏÓÔØ 4,2 From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 03 Dec 1999 08:25:58 GMT -------- Ah! But what Esther And Mike II failed to note, is that it wasn't me that posted it in the first place. My post was simply as a result of hitting the wrong button!! Geez Guys..of all the stuff on RCM you could find to waste band width on..this must have taken quite a bit of scratching around!! teenut mike II wrote: > > Esther Heller wrote: > > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> > wrote in message ... > > ....another quote... > > > >> begin 666 1.tif > > >> M24DJ`"@%``#6!0``B08``#D'```P"0``A!$``+ 7``"C&0``Z!X``$(J``#1 > > >> M+0``E2X``%DO```?, ``ZC$``#HT``!%-0``!#8``+HV``!W-P``'S@``, X > > >> M``!D.0``+3L``/(^``!K0 ``440``-%+```94P``ZE0``,%5``#,5P``*5D` > > ... end of another quote... > > > I snipped the bulk of it, but starting at ">> begin 666 1.tif.... > > Note the 666. I've always suspected Mr. Bastow of being WAY too grouchy > to be a mere mortal. this MAY be the evidence I've been looking for..;-) > > mike (posting on rec.crafts.metalworking only..) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Weird Shaper Question - now amateur case hardening From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 03 Dec 1999 18:18:37 GMT -------- The Mapp torch will be the easiest..if you can build a temporary hearth out of firebrick to help contain and reflect the heat. A "coffee can forge" should be part of the equipment of every small shop. teenut George Glines wrote: > > Thanks teenut! > > I bought some Kasenite on sale, might as well make this my first case > hardening project. I've got a charcoal barbecue and a MAPP gas torch. > Which (or neither) of these heat sources would you recommend for the > hardening process for a part this small. I've read a number of sources on > heat treating. Everybody seems to conflict. > > I had decided I better just eat the $1,500 bucks and buy one of those cool > programmable Neycraft furnances that Brownell's sells. Then I read in a > heat treating book that you should never case harden in a furnace as the > case hardening compound gives off something that ruins the inside of the > furnace. AAARRGHH! > > Recommendation? > > Thanks again!!!! > > George > > "Robert Bastow" <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote in message > news:2QK14.8697$0f7.732510@news.rdc1.tn.home.com... > > Better grip....and somewhere for dirt and chips to go when you slide the > tool in > > and out to "bed" it in before final tightening. > > > > (Kinda like you always give something a little twist in the three jaw > before > > nipping it up fully.) > > > > Put the grooves in. > > > > BTW the ring should be case hardened or it won't stay flat very long. > > > > 8^) > > > > teenut > > > > George Glines wrote: > > > > > > My SB 7" shaper and lathe are currently about 800 miles apart, and since > I > > > will be with the lathe this weekend, I thought I would turn the missing > > > toolpost ring that I don't have for the shaper. It's outside diameter > > > doesn't appear to be critical (?) , although I can see having it as flat > as > > > possible would be important. > > > > > > The pictures in the Lindsay reprint of the shaper book showed a grooved > ring > > > (grooved on the face). Any reason for the grooves? > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > George ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How does this work? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 03 Dec 1999 18:35:58 GMT -------- I had an Atlas at one time. IIRC you could alter the POSITION of the stroke while it was running..but NOT the length of stroke. The position of the stroke is done by moving the clamp?pivot point of the crank along the top of the ram. IIRC there was a screw adjustment for this that COULD be operated even while the ram was in motion....a real handy feature! The stroke LENGTH is changed by moving the crank pin relative to the center of the bull wheel..ususally this can only be done at Top Dead Center position..certainly not while the machine is in motion. If you ever fail to tighten up the slipper block and have it move while cutting..you will understand why this is somewhat less than desireable!! 8^( teenut Edward Haas wrote: > > --Years ago I had an Atlas, or maybe a South Bend shaper (can't > remember which one it was) and the neat thing about it was that the stroke > length could be varied without turning off the machine. Can someone point me > to a drawing of how the gearing is arranged to make this possible? An > animated .gif would be ideal, but that's probably not available... > --TIA, > -- > "Steamboat Ed" Haas : Cave ne ante ullas > Watch link rot in action! : catapultas ambules :-) > http://www.nmpproducts.com > ---Decks a-wash in a sea of words--- ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 3-jaw vs 4-jaw (was too smart, too long) From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 03 Dec 1999 18:42:57 GMT -------- If you can only have the one ..then the four jaw should be the FIRST choice for either lathe or mill. Far more versatile and accurate than a three jaw. 8^) teenut Brian Evans wrote: > > if you were about (say this Saturday) to buy a 5" - 6" chuck to mount on a 6" > rotary table to make a homemade "superspacer"), would you use a three jaw self > centering or a 4 jaw independant chuck? I've been planning to get the three jaw, > but perhaps I'm pre-judging the case...plus I have another use for a small 4 jaw on > the lathe. > Brian > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > It is only you John ;^) > > > > A four jaw chuck has WAY more gripping power than any three jaw. > > > > Tweaking out the last thou or so of runnout without ensuring that all the jaws > > have close to the same "tightness" is simply asking for the job to go off center > > during machining..especially if there are any interrupted cuts involved. > > > > It just takes a little extra patience and practice to get it right..but it does > > help to treat the jaws as opposing pairs. > > > > If you have to back off say number two jaw to twitch number four..go back then > > to number two and re-tighten it to the same torque as no. four. Then do the > > same thing with numbers one and three. > > > > 8^) > > > > teenut > > > > John Hofstad-Parkhill wrote: > > > > > > Chuck: > > > > > > >In general, 3 jaw chucks do not have the gripping power of 4 jaw chucks > > > > > > I find the opposite is true, and I'm shooting this out to see if it's only > > > me. What happens is that I'm so focused on centering the work that I forget > > > that I also need to hold it securely. Squeezing the last .001" of runout > > > turns out to be an exercise in adjusting _one_ jaw's torque ever so > > > slightly. Once I get it set, I'm loathe to make any further adjustments. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Ah ha! - Indexing success From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 03 Dec 1999 18:54:24 GMT -------- What or who the hell is a "neener-neener"? ?8^( teenut John Hofstad-Parkhill wrote: > > > Who the hell IS AxMan? > > http://www.ax-man.com/intro/intro.html > > This is very close to a "neener neener". ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Too smart. (too long) From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 03 Dec 1999 19:23:07 GMT -------- Sherline is the way to go. The make their own 4 Jaws and I can vouch for the quality. I believe their price is still the $125.00 I paid for mine. In any case..they occasionally put one up on ebay for $90.00!! Give them a call..they may have a deal to make. teenut fredcf@my-deja.com wrote: > > In article , > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > > I have a little Sherline 3" 4 Jaw with a 5C arbor. Worth its weight > > in gold it is! A real gem and a delight to use on smaller jobs. > > I was considering one of these myself. MSC carries them for $151.50. > No brand name mentioned though. > > Fred > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Thanks for all the responses about pricing... From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 03 Dec 1999 20:43:59 GMT -------- Why is that a sad thing? PEOPLE make buying decisions..based mainly on emotion. People are FUNNY!! It takes people to deal with people. teenut songlake wrote: > > its sad to say but the best way of selling is still to have a sales person ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: XY Centering 4 Jaw Chuck; Was: Too smart. (too long) From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 04 Dec 1999 00:21:45 GMT -------- How do the jaws reach the back scroll? 8^) teenut tmartin@xtra.co.nz wrote: > > Gave it a bit of thought: > Imagine a chuck with tandem scrolls, the front scroll driving > 2 normal jaws. The back scroll drives 2 blank jaws that have a > recess machined in the the face to accommodate the front scroll > plus 1/2" of adjustment. The face of the jaws is 3/4" below > the chuck face and are drilled & tapped to take replaceable > jaws which are made in several offsets because of the limited > jaw adjustment. > I've measured several of my chucks and if the adjustment doesn't > have to be as large as above, standard jaws could be modified > rather than making specials. > > Whaddaya reckon? > > Tom Martin > > kenneth knaell wrote: > > > > It occurred to a machinist friend and myself that a lathe chuck that had > > independent X and Y tightening adjustments would have alot of advantages. > > In other words, two opposing jaws would pull the workpiece to center in the > > X-direction and clamp it in that direction. A separate tightening > > adjustment would do the centering and clamping in the perpendicular > > direction. This would allow centering of round and rectangular stock > > quickly. It might also clamp tighter than a three jaw chuck - maybe > > providing the gripping power of a four jaw with just two quick torquing of > > the corresponding X and Y tightening sockets. > > > > It would of course be best if it had a nice large through hole. Also a > > variation of this chuck might be useful on the vertical mill. Four jaw > > scroll chucks and two jaw centering chucks exist but this could do things > > those can't. Anybody who considers themselves a mechanical design guru > > ought to give this whirl. It looks like a tough thing to design in my > > several attempts. > > > > I don't want to judge any attempts at this; I'm just saying that if one > > could come up with a good design for such a device, I'll bet they could > > probably make some bucks. Its a puzzle. > > ken knaell - still thinking about it > > > > Chuck Sherwood wrote in message <826fm0$1j4@ssbunews.ih.lucent.com>... > > >>wrong, and as I mentioned, the Sherline chuck isn't really up to the task. > > > > > >In general, 3 jaw chucks do not have the gripping power of 4 jaw chucks. > > >I think the keyless design of the sherline 3 jaw chuck makes it a bit > > >worse in that area. The sherline 4 jaw does seem to hold quite well. > > > > > >chuck sherwood ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: An Eng'r would say... From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 04 Dec 1999 00:25:25 GMT -------- That is why I am a drunk! Imagine getting up in a morning and knowing that is as good as you are going to feel all day!! teenut John Dunn wrote: > > What's the difference between an optimist and a pessimist? > The pessimist has more experience! > > The optimist believes this is the best of all possible worlds. > The pessimist is afraid that's a true statement. > > -- > John Dunn > Vortex Precision Services, Inc. > e-mail: jpdunnvrtx@att.net > If you don't have time to do it right, > what makes you think you've got time to do it twice? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Why are Smithy prices so high? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 04 Dec 1999 00:29:26 GMT -------- No. But they have produced enough good tools, for long enough, for it to be worth what they charge..to me..for the peace of mind of knowing it will be right! Purchasing decisions are 95% emotional and 100% trust! teenut Hugh Strong wrote: > But - does anyone have any data on how much it actually costs to make, say, > an ordinary name-brand 1" micrometer or something similar? > > -- Hugh ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Removing aluminum rod stuck in rifle bore From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 04 Dec 1999 06:16:50 GMT -------- Blow it out!! According to Hatcher it will do no damage if you use a light charge..NO BULLET!!!!! Hatcher did a lot of tests to see what the effect was if a service man pulled the bullet from a service cartridge and used it to blow out a barrel obstruction...usually a stuck cleanining patch, rod or even a bullet from a half assed round. Net result was that it works fine...with no damage resulting. You might want to try with a very light charge. Do NOT use a blank or blank powder!! If a bulleted cartridge is used..you will blow, or at least ring, the barrel. teenut Jack Erbes wrote: > > David Berryhill wrote: > > > > Any suggestions on removing this? It's about 12 inches and it is stuck in > > the chamber end of the barrel. Is there a way to chemically dissolve the > > aluminum rod without harming the steel barrel? > > Sounds like he hammered the joint where the rod sections go together > until it flared out and got a grip on the rifling and barrel. Try > hydraulics? Put a few inches of grease on top of the rod, then tap a > close fitting lead bullet or plug down on top of the grease, then put a > close fitting rod on top of the lead and give it a few shots with a > hammer. The lead will deform and seal, and the blows should put the > pressure on the entire obstruction instead of on the edges of it. > > Its a write off as it is, so the next step I would try would be a end > mill or drill on a piece of drill rod. > > -- > Jack in Sonoma, CA, USA (jack@vom.com) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Millermatic on Ebay From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 06 Dec 1999 02:11:20 GMT -------- http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=214696614 FWIW 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Am I the only one that feels this way... From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 06 Dec 1999 06:48:31 GMT -------- I think that is wonderful Kris. Leave the bargains for the less paranoid and more knowledgeable among us!! 8^) teenut remove t from my name to get eenut!! (I don't know what a Culler is..but I am sure I would hate them too) Time to get a life Kris! > "physical (Droll Troll)" wrote: > > > >I wouldn't buy anything > >from ebay, no matter how much of a bargain it appeared to be. > >Kris. > > Remove the mapson. from the email address to get to me... > I hate Cullers who gather from newsgroups > > Visit my home page at http://www.esper.com/xvart/index.html ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Milling 4340 From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 06 Dec 1999 13:30:34 GMT -------- If the 4340 is annealed you should have no difficulty with regular HSS..keep your cutting speeds down to 80fps, take a good chip and use lubricant. What are you making Brian? A .50 BMG rifle action by any chance? teenut Brian Evans wrote: > > I have a project I'm planning for that I've been told should be made > from 4340 steel. The lathe part of the project I'll use brazed carbide > tooling on, since that's what I normally use anyway, but I wonder what > tooling would be best for the milling part of the deal? Most of the > work will be done with 3/4" end mills, and 3/8" ball-end end mills to > create radius in the corners. I normally use HSS endmills. Will I use > up the HSS tooling too quickly to be economical, or should I use > carbide? I'll probably create about 10 pounds of 4340 chips on the > mill, if that gives any idea of the size of the project. > > Thanks, Brian ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: home made ( die ) filer From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 06 Dec 1999 13:45:25 GMT -------- 160 FEET Bill!! That is one mother of a planer..where is it and what is it used for? The biggest I have ever run had a 42 foot stroke with a work envelope of 42 x 15 x 9 feet. That was plenty big enough for my "Government Jobs"!! 8^) teenut B & L Denard wrote: > > Any one thought about building a Die Filer out of a Scrole Saw with var. > speed motor with a little modfacation ? > Bill D. > BTW how many out have ever run a 160' Planer ? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: De burring tools - also more on making tool holders. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 06 Dec 1999 14:08:38 GMT -------- "Fitch R. Williams" wrote: > > 1. What is your favorite deburring tool? Tools? I have a big Burr King Belt Sander/Knife Grinder with a 2" x 72" belt. I keep a work rest table set precisely at 90 deg and fin that is the best way to get a quick but high quality debur on edges that ar straight and accessible. I hold the piece so that the belt is travelling the LENGTH of the edge and can produce either a straight chamfer or a radius at will. For quick deburring you cannot beat the VARGUS style (Shaviv) swivelling tools..cutters are available for any deburring operation you can imagine..even the underside of holes. When the first came on the market they were VERY expensive..but worth it!! Nowadays they are dirt cheap and even better value....No shop should be without a couple or three. Final deburring and finishing I always do in the bench vice..using a whole slew of different files and scrapers to suit the occasion. Good quality files are a must..you can get them from MSC. Nicholson are good in the larger sizes..Vermont are rubbish. In smaller sizes I always try to get Genuine Swiss "Swiss" files..Grobet or the like are unbeatable. In a pinch "American-Swiss" will serve. Finally (or Firstly, in many cases) there is the ubiquitous wire wheel on the bench grinder. Depending on the hardness of the wire, it can be used to polish or to remove significant amounts of metal. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: test..Is the NG asleep? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 06 Dec 1999 21:44:46 GMT -------- I haven't received a message in 12 hours!! anyone out there? teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: De burring tools - also more on making tool holders. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 07 Dec 1999 00:02:59 GMT -------- I still have two or three different sizes..but rarely use them for deburring since I started using a Shaviv..those really are the "cats meow". Far safer too..Most machinists I know gave a scar on the ball of the left thumb...where a pointed scraper has slipped at some time in their career!! One place I DO use a simple scraper is on the lathe..For internal deburring "On the Fly" The one I use is ground from an old half round file and was made almost forty years ago..during that time it has deburred countless thousands of holes and been sharpened maybe twice!! teenut Gerald Miller wrote: > > How's about the generic three cornered "bearing scraper" I've been abusing > mine for something over twenty years now an' I can still find it.^_^ > > -- > > Gerry > London, Canada > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote in message > news:GrP24.11505$0f7.766097@news.rdc1.tn.home.com... > > > > > > "Fitch R. Williams" wrote: > > > > > > > > 1. What is your favorite deburring tool? Tools? > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: More Clausing Knee Mill Questions From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 07 Dec 1999 03:49:48 GMT -------- Drill the holes clear through the table and stamp "OIL" beside them!! Actually the best way is to drill and ream the holes oversize and pound in a couple of slightly tapered plugs made of cast iron. Before sending the table for grinding, cut the plugs to within ten or twenty thou of the table and peen all around the edge with a ball pein hammer. You won't be able to find the plugs when it comes back. teenut rlaury wrote: > > Hi Group: > I'm rebuilding an 8520 that I just bought. It has a couple > of endmill gouges in the table about .050" deep X .500" dia. > Is there a (safe) method to fill these with weld and have the table > regound? I'm gonna have the table off anyway so I'm not concerned > about the labor. also, i'm not sure if it's possible with cast iorn. > Also I'm planning on posting the rebuild progress on a website > showing before and after pix. > > Thanks > Ron ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What steel for home ground test bar for lathe? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 07 Dec 1999 04:03:50 GMT -------- This subject was thrashed to death a few months ago..you might try a Deja News search. teenut jeff_r_t@my-deja.com wrote: > > I am finishing up getting a 1941 Rivett 104 cylindrical grinder going > again. One of the things I want to make, and a friend also wants made, > are some lathe test bars, especially with a morse 3 taper to a straight > cylinder. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Who has the best price on a Lincoln 175? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 08 Dec 1999 12:28:43 GMT -------- I bought my (loaded) 175, about 6 months ago, for $1100 from a distributor in Atlanta. They had it advertised at 1200 but were easy enough to beat down a bit. I doubt that prices have risen since then..but that should give you a ballpark figure to aim at. Helluva nice machine. teenut Alfred Kimmel wrote: > > Sears mailorder at $1495 > > JHSTANG51 wrote: > > > I'm in the Lexington, Ky area and the welding suppliers are a rip-off. I saw > > the thread on the Millermatic/E-bay thread and am wondering if anyone knows who > > have the best price on a loaded Squarewave175. > > > > Thanks in Advance, > > > > John Hume > > JHSTANG51 > > Mercenary, Wine Taster > > Stud Service, Lover of fine women and airplanes > > As Conan the Barbarian says, > > "It's not how hard you can hit, it's how hard you can get hit and remain > > standing" ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Real Reasons for Smithy Prices -Support From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 08 Dec 1999 12:38:48 GMT -------- True...I was talking about Starrett vs Import hand tools and instruments. 8^) teenut XPRTEC wrote: > > << Subject: Re: Why are Smithy prices so high? > From: Robert Bastow "teenut"@hotmail.com >> > > > << > But they have produced enough good tools, for long enough, for it to be worth > what they charge..to me..for the peace of mind of knowing it will be right! >> > CLARIFICATION: Robert was not talking about the subject of the thread that > somehow became disjointed. His remarks are fitting though. > > > Robert is right! I have a Smithy and when you compare it to the 3in1Direct ad ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Sine Bar Helical/Teenut From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 08 Dec 1999 12:45:46 GMT -------- That would be a good start. I don't have a scanner..but I do have a fax machine and can send you a sketch. teenut@hotmail.com 8^) teenut "DoN. Nichols" wrote: > > In article <82kj59$c7s$1@nnrp1.deja.com>, > sunworshiper wrote: > > [ ... ] > > >E-Mail me and I'll give you my real E-Mail if you can > >explain it easier that way. > > If you mean that the displayed e-mail address in the posting's > headers is bogus -- how is he supposed to e-mail you? > > Why don't you start it by e-mailing *him*, since his e-mail is > valid? > > Enjoy, > DoN. > -- > Email: | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564 > My Concertina web page: | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html > --- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero --- ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Import Small Hole Gage Sets ? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 08 Dec 1999 12:55:17 GMT -------- Should work perfectly well for your purposes Albert, Not a lot they can do to screw up a small hole gage. Check that the screw threads run smoothly..stickiness here could affect the sensitivity (accuracy) of the gage. teenut Albert Lee wrote: > > Does anyone have an opinion on the imported small hole gage sets sold > in most supply houses for around $10? They're the ones with the > expanding ball on the end. > > Do they do the job? > > I need a set to measure the bore diameters of some plastic gears. I > won't need to use them often and want to avoid paying extra for a set > of Starretts if I don't have to. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: e-Auction search page From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 08 Dec 1999 14:09:45 GMT -------- Thanks Mike, Real interesting to see the ratio of Ebay Items : The Rest. Buy Ebay shares!! 8^) teenut mike II wrote: > > For those following auction items/prices, the following page will list > search results from 5 major online auctions, with links to each item. > > http://www.myopera.com/?req=avenue&lang=en&area=commerce&sqlrec=/auctions/index&lk=b893 > > mike ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Why posting pictures is a bad idea, was: Re: Ä Å =?iso-8859-1?Q?=C4_?=Ñ=?iso-8859-1?Q?_?= =?iso-8859-1?Q?=C5_?=É=?iso-8859-1?Q?=D1_?=É=?iso-8859-1?Q?_?= =?iso-8859-1?Q?=C5=C4=C5_?=Å=?iso-8859-1?Q?_?=É=?iso-8859-1?Q?=D1_?=ÖÉÖÅ Ç Ç , Å 4,2 From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 09 Dec 1999 04:00:14 GMT -------- I *think* that is a compliment. ?8^) teenut jrlloyd@cwcom.net, [John, Lloyd/Wales] wrote: > > In <384773B1.4EC58142@technologist.com>, on 12/03/99 > at 12:39 AM, mike II said: > > >Note the 666. I've always suspected Mr. Bastow of being WAY too grouchy > >to be a mere mortal. this MAY be the evidence I've been looking > >for..;-) > > Grouchy??? You ever been to Yorkshire? I bet they threw him out 'cos he > was too nice! > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- > jrlloyd@cwcom.net Cheers - John Lloyd [Cymru/Wales] > -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Live centre with straight shank From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 10 Dec 1999 00:49:25 GMT -------- If you are going to offset the tailstock center to turn a taper, then 60 degree center is NOT what you need! The cone center cannot possible seat properly in a matching female cone..the result is fretting and wear on both the center and the center hole. What IS recommended in this case is a BALL NOSE CENTER. I haven't seen one of these for sale for a long time..so what I use is a female center with a ball bearing interposed between it and the female center on the work piece..well lubed of course. For your purposes a simple straight piece of drill rod with a female center and a bearing ball will do the trick. You may or may not want to harden the drill rod and temper it to a light straw. teenut Alan Rothenbush wrote: > > I saw a tip on using a boring head in the tailstock to turn tapers. > May be old news to some of you, but struck me as brilliant. > > The secret seems to be getting a live centre into the hole normally > occupied by the boring bar. > > To this end, has anyone ever seen a live centre with straight shank ? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Live centre with straight shank From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 10 Dec 1999 06:09:24 GMT -------- Yup Alan..you have the same problem at the drive end. Ideally a ball center with a driving dog that, as you say, will swash in and out of its slot as it turns. The driveing dog should never, in any case, be tied or clamped too tightly to the drive plate..just enough to stop it from clonking on an interrupted cut..or to make sure it is in the right place when you are screwcutting. Otherwise try not to restrict its movement..let the centers do their job. The problem increases as the angle increases..I don't have much problem turning the taper on a rifle barrel..but when it comes to a shorter, steeper, taper you have to take it into account. Holding in a chuck or collet is a no-no! You will NEVER stop it from trying to work its way in or out. This same effect takes place when you hold a bar in the chuck with one end supported in the fixed steady...Unless the steady is DEAD on center you will find the job slowly working its way out of the chuck. Most disconcerting if you are trying to face the end flat!! Fun isn't it! 8^) teenut Alan Mimms wrote: > > Related question: what happens to the OTHER end of the stock being > taper turned when you do this. I have read various replies to his > question - appears a ball bearing on a female center is the right > thing to do, and it is so OBVIOUS now that I hear it. Don't you > agree, other Alan? > > The issue I'm raising is the other end of the stock. Do you chuck it > in a 3 or 4 jaw or put it on a dead center (which is ALSO at an angle, > I perceive...)? Also, how do you drive this contraption? Do you put > a lathe dog on it driven against a slot in the lathe faceplate or > something? Doesn't that mean that the dog's tail has to shift > position in and out of the faceplate slot continuously as the lathe turns? > > My solution to the taper tailstock setover, like yours, Alan, was to > buy a small boring head. I got one with a thread-on shank and a > matching MT3 shank which fits my tailstock taper. The only issue is > how to match up the ½" hole in the boring head with the end of the > workpiece, which I now know should be a simple rod with a ball. > > I have been wondering about the headstock end of this for some time, > though. I haven't needed to turn a shallow taper badly enough lately > to just try it. Voices of Experience, would you please provide > guidance for the new kids on the block? > -- > Alan Mimms > Home machinist in (self) training. > E-mail: alanm@unforgettable.com > Metalworking web page: http://alanm.penguinpowered.com/metalworking > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Original Message <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< > > On 12/9/99, 9:51:21 AM, beer@sfu.ca (Alan Rothenbush) wrote regarding > Live centre with straight shank: > > > I saw a tip on using a boring head in the tailstock to turn tapers. > > May be old news to some of you, but struck me as brilliant. > > > The secret seems to be getting a live centre into the hole normally > > occupied by the boring bar. > > > To this end, has anyone ever seen a live centre with straight shank ? > > > ( Yes, I could make an adapter, but if I COULD make the adapter, I > > wouldn't NEED to make the adapter, if you see what I mean ) > > > Alan > > > -- > > > Alan Rothenbush | The Spartans do not ask the number of > the > > Academic Computing Services | enemy, only where they are. > > Simon Fraser University | > > Burnaby, B.C., Canada | Agix of Sparta ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Live centre with straight shank From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 10 Dec 1999 17:24:49 GMT -------- People do seem to have an inordinate fear of moving, and consequently, realigning their lathe tailstock. Here is a quick and accurate way to do it: Chuck a stub of (any) metal in whatever chuck or collet happens to be on the lathe at the time. Skim the O/d to any diameter you like, face the end and center drill. (while center drilling you will be able to "Eyeball" the tailstock within a few thou or closer, to center) Part off a slice from the end of the bar..about 5/16" long. Reface the stub left in the chuck. Using the tailstock center, hold the parted off slice up against the stub in the chuck. Adjust tailstock until no discernable step is seen or felt at the interface (The human eye and finger tip can detect a step of less than a tenth of a thou) To speed up the process next time..make the stub an "aliquot" dimension..or note its size carefully. Keep the slice in your toolbox, and next time you need only face and turn a stub to the same diameter. If you have accurate collets..make an accurate stub and slice. To align centers...make two slices, both accurately centered and hold them face to face with the centers. This method will also enable you to measure any vertical displacement very accurately... Measure the stub/slice diameter, put them face to face, measure the diameter across the inter face. Displacement is HALF the diference between the two measurements. When moving the tailstock over or back to center, always use a dial indicator (I use a BIG 20 millionths clock) mounted on a magnetic stand on the back of the lathe. That way you can set or return the tailstock precisely and QUICKLY. Be not afraid! 8^) teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article , > beer@sfu.ca wrote: > > > > I saw a tip on using a boring head in the tailstock to turn tapers. > > Why not just set over the tailstock? Does the same thing, and > does not cost the boring head. If you do use the boring head > be sure to clamp the dovetail on it to keep it from moving during > the cut. > > The forces involved at the center are pretty big, be sure the > head is robust enought to handle them. > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Live centre with straight shank From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 12 Dec 1999 20:00:03 GMT -------- Requested repost: Robert Bastow wrote: > > People do seem to have an inordinate fear of moving, and consequently, > realigning their lathe tailstock. > > Here is a quick and accurate way to do it: > > Chuck a stub of (any) metal in whatever chuck or collet happens to be on the > lathe at the time. > > Skim the O/d to any diameter you like, face the end and center drill. (while > center drilling you will be able to "Eyeball" the tailstock within a few thou or > closer, to center) > > Part off a slice from the end of the bar..about 5/16" long. > > Reface the stub left in the chuck. > > Using the tailstock center, hold the parted off slice up against the stub in the > chuck. > > Adjust tailstock until no discernable step is seen or felt at the interface (The > human eye and finger tip can detect a step of less than a tenth of a thou) > > To speed up the process next time..make the stub an "aliquot" dimension..or note > its size carefully. Keep the slice in your toolbox, and next time you need only > face and turn a stub to the same diameter. > > If you have accurate collets..make an accurate stub and slice. > > To align centers...make two slices, both accurately centered and hold them face > to face with the centers. > > This method will also enable you to measure any vertical displacement very > accurately... > > Measure the stub/slice diameter, put them face to face, measure the diameter > across the inter face. Displacement is HALF the diference between the two > measurements. > > When moving the tailstock over or back to center, always use a dial indicator (I > use a BIG 20 millionths clock) mounted on a magnetic stand on the back of the > lathe. That way you can set or return the tailstock precisely and QUICKLY. > > Be not afraid! > > 8^) > > teenut > > mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > > > In article , > > beer@sfu.ca wrote: > > > > > > I saw a tip on using a boring head in the tailstock to turn tapers. > > > > Why not just set over the tailstock? Does the same thing, and > > does not cost the boring head. If you do use the boring head > > be sure to clamp the dovetail on it to keep it from moving during > > the cut. > > > > The forces involved at the center are pretty big, be sure the > > head is robust enought to handle them. > > > > Jim > > > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Live centre with straight shank From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 12 Dec 1999 20:15:10 GMT -------- I can't claim originality for much that I do..perhaps only in simplification or extensions of a principle or practice. I have taught a lot of Machinist Apprentices in my time, and I guess I know the sort of things that make them nervous..and how to help them overcome that. Obviously, with almost 40 years of experience "in the Trade", I have picked up or "re-invented" a lot of little "'Intsies and Tipsies"..But it may surprise some to know that I learned a heck of a lot from the likes of Tubal Cain, George H Thomas and similar writers in "The Model Engineer" I would love to write a piece on parting off..how to turn it from a horror to a joy..but I just got back from an exhausting "Family/Sibling weekend" so please remind me of my promise in a few days..when hopefully my aching bones will have recovered and my hangover gone away. Incidentally, Brownell's list "centering discs"..so my Idea is certainly not original! 8^) teenut Nigel Eaton wrote: > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@hotmail.com> writes > >People do seem to have an inordinate fear of moving, and consequently, > >realigning their lathe tailstock. > > > >Here is a quick and accurate way to do it: > > > > (Snip of a piece of genius) > > Robert, > > Did someone teach you this stuff, or do you use the Force? :^) > > Many thanks for that, it's cures me of being afraid of moving my > tailstock. Now, can you cure me of partingoffophobia? > > Cheers > > Nigel > -- > 'The first thing we do, let's kill all the lawyers' > - William Shakespeare > 'When my client says "kill all the lawyers" he actually > means render all legal practitioners, present, past > or future, practicing or retired, hereinafter referred > to as lawyers, notwithstanding their actual legal status, > expressed or implied, non-vital in the usual legally > accepted sense of that term' - Wm. Shakespeare's lawyer > > ------------ > Nigel Eaton ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Live centre with straight shank From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 12 Dec 1999 20:19:20 GMT -------- I am holding out for a Million Dollar Book Advance from Lindsay's!! But thanks for the kind remarks..It does kinda make it feel worthwhile. ;^) teenut fredcf@my-deja.com wrote: > > Teenut, others have said it, and now I say it too: PLEASE, please, > write a book on machine shop techniques! Your methods are so simple, > cheap, and sure-fire that people would happily pay to know what you > know. I promise that I'll buy a copy. Heck, I'll send you a check right > NOW! :-) > > Fred > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Live centre with straight shank From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 12 Dec 1999 22:57:23 GMT -------- As if in response: http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=217971308 teenut Robert Bastow wrote: > > I can't claim originality for much that I do.. (Snip) > Incidentally, Brownell's list "centering discs"..so my Idea is certainly not > original! > > 8^) > > teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: More BP Musings..... From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 17 Dec 1999 00:02:03 GMT -------- Hey Jens, can I have your "wellying" bar when it wears down to 2.9999" x 1.0010"?? 8^) teenut Jens wrote: > > Nigel Eaton wrote: > > >Now, in doing this and testing with various cutters I have been > >changing collets quite a bit. Some of them are reluctant to leave > >the R8 taper, so I have been loosening the drawbar, locking the > >quill then wellying the top of the drawbar with a MSFH (Medium > >Sized F****** Hammer). Then my retarded mechanical sympathy > >gene kicked in and suggested that this may not be A Good > >Idea(tm). Any better suggestions? > > I use a 3.0000" long section of 1.0015" diameter brass. It sits on top > of the mill right next to the draw bar and works a charm unless you do > a real heavy intermittent cut in which case it smashes onto your toes > to tell you that you are doing something stupid. > > Jens ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Gas Turbine Engine Test Engineers Wanted From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 18 Dec 1999 02:06:52 GMT -------- Well said George! What goes around, comes around!! teenut George McDuffee wrote: > > After many years in both business and academia I ask > what did you do with the ones you had? > > If you would stop laying them off, working them 80 > hours a week with no overtime, cutting benefits and > raiding their pension funds perhaps you would have > people when you need them. > > Don't go crying that there is a shortage of engineers > and technicians after the way you have treated the ones > you had. Today's graduates have seen how you treated > their parents. > > George > > > leejamieson@my-deja.com wrote: > > > > GAS TURBINE TEST PROJECT ENGINEERS > > > > OPPORTUNITY: World leader in the manufacture of jet engines ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Increasing Capacity on a wire cut EDM Machine From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 18 Dec 1999 02:21:37 GMT -------- I have the opportunity to buy a wire cut EDM machine. The maximum thickness it will cut at present is 5 1/2". I need to increase this to 8". Is it as simple as putting a riser block into the frame (which can be split quite easily)...Just like a band saw? Or are there other considerations that might make this more difficult than it looks? Power requirements, feed speeds etc. (Don't worry about questions of re-alignment..Let's assume I can take care of that....And save the bandwidth on wild guesses..I need to hear from the real experts on this) Thanks teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Polyurethane From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 18 Dec 1999 02:46:54 GMT -------- Put it in the deep freezer overnight..machine with regular tools..Quickly, before it thaws out!! teenut "Richard C. Penney" wrote: > > Hi, if anything like what we use at work, it should respond to sharp > (honed) tooling and air blow off.. treat it like styrene.. usually if > cast, it has only about a 150 deg. F slump point and goes all gooey after > that..in some ways, it acts like cheap Plexiglas and often is quite > grainy..Have fun > toff > > marven30@my-deja.com wrote: > > > We have a lot of work where we have to turn Polyurethane Durometer 80. > > Some of the wall gets down to .010 of a inch. Would someone have > > information on cutting tools, feeds, speeeds, cutting fluids. Is there > > away to mark it. > > > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Increasing Capacity on a wire cut EDM Machine From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 19 Dec 1999 21:42:06 GMT -------- Thanks for the information Dave, I will be back to you with more questions..as I get more information myself. The machine is part of a package..I am looking seriously at buying a complete machine shop ('Ere we go again) and getting back into "The Business".......After all I have said about never doing that again!! Right now all the details are in the hands of my Lawyer and my Accountant..so I can't even tell you,for sure, what the manufacturer of the Wire EDM is. I do know that there is a huge sinker EDM machine and a Large Vertical CNC Machining Center too...They use BobCad, for what that is worth??? teenut dave wrote: > > I own three WEDM's, and been running them for 12+ years, so my comments > might be worth something. > To answer your questions, putting a riser into the frame, and aligning > things is simple mechanics, and should present you no > difficulties...I've done similar things. > But then, things can get tough. The first thing I wonder about is > flushing. Is your machine submerged or flood? Pressures available? The > machine's electronics probably peak out in the 4"-5" thickness range, > and performance will fall off drastically as you get thicker, and you'll > have no adjustments you can make to pick things up. > You can probably kludge up something that will make a cut - however > slowly - but accuracy, surface finish, wiremarks etc will probably not > be very nice. > If you need one or two pieces in the 8" range, and you're gonna buy a > Wire EDM anyway,try it. If you plan to do thicknesses like this day in > and day out, buy the proper tool. > I truly need far more information about you, the machine you're thinking > about, what you plan to do with it, what you expect of it, how much you > can spend in time and dollars, etc, etc, before I could hope to give a > really meaningful answer. > Contact me off-list if you'd like > Regards, Dave ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Hey TEE is this a Mini-Kop Lathe ?? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1999 01:20:33 GMT -------- I believe it is...The tailstock, which is the only recogniseable bit in a very poor photo, is a dead giveaway. I saw this myself, but because of the poor photo and obviously scruffy appearance, I though it best to let sleeping dogs lie!! teenut UntMaintco wrote: > > I saw this on eBay and I can recall you speaking highly of the machine. It > seems like a cant go wrong thing.... What do ya think...... > > http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=220715131 > > For once I am not selling this item on ebay and I dont work for them. Other > than buying a few things I have not had any other dealings Yadda > Yadda.......... > > Tom > Stamford, CT ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: drill sharpeners From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1999 01:36:39 GMT -------- Most Machinists, including myself, are pretty average people. We just invested the ten or fifteen minutes of practice it takes to be able to grind a drill bit "Freehand" I did an extensive writeup on this a couple or three months ago..I don't intend to repeat it!! But you might find a reference in Deja..whatever. teenut epotter wrote: > > In article <19991219153025.16055.00000043@nso-fd.aol.com>, > engineman1@aol.com (Engineman1) wrote: > > > Why not bite the bullet a little harder and learn to sharpen them by hand? > > Engineman1 > > That's a reasonable question, and once I thought I could learn to do > that. But can the average person really learn to do a good job? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: drill sharpeners From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1999 06:27:16 GMT -------- I would, on the other hand, be delighted to demonstrate to Si (???) just exactly how to grind a drill with his ass! 8^) teenut Si Ballenger wrote: > > On Mon, 20 Dec 1999 01:36:39 GMT, Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ > hotmail.com> wrote: > > >Most Machinists, including myself, are pretty average people. We just invested > >the ten or fifteen minutes of practice it takes to be able to grind a drill bit > >"Freehand" > > > >I did an extensive writeup on this a couple or three months ago..I don't intend > >to repeat it!! But you might find a reference in Deja..whatever. > > > >teenut > > From the tone of your reply, one can only surmise that you have > been spinning them in your *ss to do the sharpening (hope you are > using your eye protection!). ;-) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Lathe centering buttons on Ebay From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1999 16:19:24 GMT -------- Ok! NOW I believe what everyone has been saying about bidding frenzy.. http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=217971308 Currently bid up to $42.01..These are available NEW from Brownells for $19.90 and any machinist worthy of the name could make a set in ten minutes or less!! Folks are FUNNY!! ?8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: need source for copper rod From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1999 23:45:43 GMT -------- Have you tried your local Metal Supermarket? If you don't already have one..open one and make a killing!! 8^) teenut "Dan D." wrote: > > Greetings, I just spent almost the entire morning on the > phone and scouring our yellow pages looking for some 3/16 > solid copper rod. At this point I'd be happy to find any > size copper rod from 3/16 to 1/4 inch. > > Any advice on where to look in the form of a phone number or > web address would be greatly appreciated! > > I've tried roofing suppliers, gutter manufacturers, and the > local steel supplier as well as a couple of plumbing supply > shops and an industrial supply house. > (the last one had it but only with a 100 dollar minimum > order) > > Who else would maybe use/sell copper rod?? > > Peace! > Dan D. Louisville KY ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Hey Robert, you ready for that parting off item yet? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1999 23:49:39 GMT -------- What's in it for me? ;^) Santa Nigel Eaton wrote: > > Dear Santa, > > What I would like for Xmas is for 'teenut' to explain how to make > parting off a pleasure. > > I have been quit a gud boy and always swept my swarf up honist. > > How about it Robert? ;^) > > Cheers > > Nigel > -- > 'The first thing we do, let's kill all the lawyers' > - William Shakespeare > 'When my client says "kill all the lawyers" he actually > means render all legal practitioners, present, past > or future, practicing or retired, hereinafter referred > to as lawyers, notwithstanding their actual legal status, > expressed or implied, non-vital in the usual legally > accepted sense of that term' - Wm. Shakespeare's lawyer > > ------------ > Nigel Eaton ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Torque Wrench Question From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 20 Dec 1999 23:54:02 GMT -------- I'm amazed that Military Mechanics have to buy their own tools!! Kinda like an Infantry Rifleman shopping around for a rifle! teenut foxeye wrote: > > Perhaps this is not the group for this question so I appologize. > > I am in need of a torque wrench. However, I am kinda leary on what to > buy. Prefer a click / preset break type wrench, but what scares me the > most is theprice and brands. I have seen them from Craftsman for > $69.00 up to $154.00 for a Snapon, and $135 for a Blackhawk brand. > This is for a wrench in the same class 20-100 ft pounds. I am > militaryt, and we must have our wrenches calibrated every 60 days or > whenever they are dropped etc. Brand new Snapon right out of the box, > have routinely failed when initially calibrated, and according to our > PMEL (precision Measurement Equipment LAb) all torque wrenchs are far > from being right directly from the factory. Getting one calibrated > from them for personal use, is kinda out of the question. Anyone have > any ideas on what or how to see if a wrench is in calibration. No > where do the manufacturers make any guarentee on the accuracy right > out of the box. Craftman looks almost identical to the Blackhawk > brand......... > > Any suggestions appreciated. > > foxeye ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Hey Robert, you ready for that parting off item yet? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 21 Dec 1999 16:08:37 GMT -------- I leared more from George's articles on parting off, than any other single source!! teenut Paul Carre wrote: > > Nigel - > > If you have acces to some old modl engineer stuff George Thomas wrote > quite a few articles on this. I learn't a hell of a lot from them. > > If you have any trouble email me I may have some copies. > > Paul... ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Modified Spin Indexer From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 21 Dec 1999 16:24:04 GMT -------- I built an dividing head out of a "Furrin" spin indexer..using a Boston 40T worm wheel and worm. Kinda like a larger version of George Thomas' Universal Dividing head. The fit of the spindle was such that I was able to lap it "in situ" to get a very smooth running fit and I have had no problems using the adapted head for milling or shaping. I like to be able to transfer things from the lathe to the dividing head and back without having to reset. To this end, I made a 6" face plate that fits both the lathe AND the dividing head nose..Or I use a Sherline 4" 4-Jaw chuck which has a 5C shank on it. Contact me off list and I will send you pictures of it. teenut kenneth knaell wrote: > > I wonder how well the following idea would work. I have a small milling > machine and would like to have a minature index head to use with it. > Sherline makes a nice rotary table but am thinking of buying a spin-index > head and adding a worm gear drive to it. I do not have a spin-index head so > I am wondering how well the shaft fits the body casting in these devices. > Apparently one can mill objects held in these devices while the shaft is > stationary so I wonder if one can mill objects while they are turning if a > good turning mechanism is added. Anybody find a problem with this idea? > Happy Holidays > ken knaell ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: steel bending problem From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 21 Dec 1999 16:26:52 GMT -------- Eat a bowl of Weetabix and bend it in your teeth!! Or, take it to a Professional Fab shop..they will roll it to any radius you wish. 8^) teenut craig barnshaw wrote: > > I am looking to bend an RSJ does anyone have any tips. The RSJ is 8 inch > deep and I need to bend it to 6 foot radius. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Ferrous vs. non-ferrous metals From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 22 Dec 1999 03:49:30 GMT -------- A "ferrous" metal is Iron or any alloy that is predominantly Iron based..wrought iron, cast iron, mild steel, "alloy" steel, stainless steel etc... A "Non-Ferrous metal" is any other kind of metal..copper, brass, lead, titanium, aluminum, etc.. Louis Zimmerman wrote: > > Hi! > > Please forgive if this is a FAQ... > > What defines a ferrous metal? A non-ferrous metal? > > Louis ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Hey Robert, you ready for that parting off item yet? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 22 Dec 1999 17:05:31 GMT -------- OK! OK! Already!!! I promise I will put serious pen to paper right after Christmas..Right now the "Honey Do" list is approaching Millenium proportions..My Daughter flies in today from Canada..I have a woodworkers bench vise to fix up for a friend who, after 6 months of patient waiting, REALLY needs it NOW. Add to that..I am currently negotiating to buy a complete working Jobbing/Tool and Die Shop...with a deadline to take over mid January!! But I promise I will "Slay they Dragons" Nigel..Parting off should be a pleasure not a terror. This may be the last chance before Christmas that I have to say "Happy Holidays" to the greatest bunch of guys (M/F) Thanks to all of you for your help support and, above all, your fellowship. This has been a momentous Century, I feel priveliged to have witnessed and contributed a little, to over half of it. I am looking forward very much to seeing a good chunk of the next Century too...There are many Doomsayers but they don't realise that even in this insane world there are voices of sanity and reason yet to be found..Many of them are contributors to RCM and I am Proud to be One of You. All the best... 8^) teenut Nigel Eaton wrote: > > In article <9CN74.11937$t65.377756@news.rdc1.tn.home.com>, > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@hotmail.com> writes > >I leared more from George's articles on parting off, than any other single > >source!! > > > > OH NO YOU DON'T! > > Nice try Robert, but I'm getting all kinds of off-line email egging me > on to beat up on you 'til you do the deed! > > Seriously, this is an area that is marked 'Here be Dragons' on my > mappe of the metalworking worlde. I've read various articles in > M.E. and so on, but I still break parting off tools with depressing > regularity (often enough that I usually resort to a hacksaw and a > facing tool). > > C'mon Obi Wan, how do I set the Boxford Light Sabre(tm) to 'Part > Off'? :^) > > Cheers > > Nigel > -- > 'The first thing we do, let's kill all the lawyers' > - William Shakespeare > 'When my client says "kill all the lawyers" he actually > means render all legal practitioners, present, past > or future, practicing or retired, hereinafter referred > to as lawyers, notwithstanding their actual legal status, > expressed or implied, non-vital in the usual legally > accepted sense of that term' - Wm. Shakespeare's lawyer > > ------------ > Nigel Eaton ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: caliper problem From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 23 Dec 1999 01:44:54 GMT -------- If you think your dial caliper (of whatever persuasion) is going to give you reliable readings within =/- .001" you are kidding yourselves. For a whole host of reasons calipers are called "Verynears" Use the right tool for the job when your project, living or life calls for it!! teenut Jim Stewart wrote: > > Marvin W. Klotz wrote: > > > > Perhaps someone can help me with a problem I'm having with my Mitutoyo calipers. > > > > If I zero the (movable) dial with the calipers closed, they read 0.001" > > OVERsize when I measure precision 0.500" and 1.000" standards (which check out > > perfectly on my electronic Mitutoyo mike and calipers). So, if I set the dial > > so the calipers read true at 0.500/1.000", it reads -0.001" (a thousandth less > > than zero) when closed. Thin (a few thousandths) shim stock then measures > > 0.001" UNDERsize. IOW, the error seems to "occur" somewhere between a few > > thousandths and 0.5". > > > > While old (~12 years), the calipers have never been abused or used more than a > > few times a week average. The rack is spotless. I find it hard to believe > > that the jaws have worn by 0.001" and wear wouldn't seem to account for what I > > observe. > > > > My only idea is that there may be a tiny fleck of swarf on the spur gear that > > engages the rack but I don't have the guts to disassemble the unit to check > > that - not even sure I'd know *how* to disassemble it. > > > > Anyone have any ideas/suggestions? > > > > How interesting! I just bought a Mitutoyo 6" dial caliper and it > behaves the same way. > > If I zero it at 0 I get .0006 or so error at all measurements from .5" > to 4", measured on gage blocks. If I preset the zero at +.0005, it's > pretty close at all other readings. > > It seems this must mean that the rack has an error in pitch at the left > end. > > I've been living with it, if I need greater accuracy my Mitutoyo digital > is right on the money everywhere... > > -js > > -- > > http://www.strappe.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: electro-stripping chrome plating From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 23 Dec 1999 01:52:21 GMT -------- Why Bother? For $85-90 you can get an original Mk III* SMLE in near perfect, shooting condition. Let sleeping dogs lie..Preserve it as an interesting variation! teenut richgoth, sydney wrote: > > Hey, anyone have any idea how to do this at home...? > I have a 1915 issue SMLE mk111 which was chromed before issue to school > cadets and I want to restore it (it doesn't work though, it has a 1/4 > inch hole drilled in the chamber and a hacksaw cut half way through the > barrell! lucky I checked!!!) > The chrome looks like shite anyway...its spotted and spalling all over > so I figured I'd take it back to spec and learn some restoration skills > (you should see what the cadets did to the woodwork! its original > though so I'm gonna keep it all and *try* very hard to fix it...) > grateful for any advice > richgoth > -- > "I loved physics, so long as it did not try to > take precedence over poetry; now that it is > crushing all the arts, I no longer wish to > regard it as anything but a tyrant...."-voltaire > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Newbie: SB Taper Attachment Help From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 23 Dec 1999 14:36:33 GMT -------- I am no expert on the Southbend..But someone who IS, told me that the tie rod was held into the bracket by babbit metal...poured after aligning everything to that particular lathe. FWIW teenut George Glines wrote: > > I ordered a Taper Attachment for my South Bend Heavy 10 from Dave Sobel. > I'm wondering if I received the correct tie-rod bracket. The tie rod > bracket had "13" SB" written on it in grease pencil. There aren't any part > numbers on it. The other reason I suspected it was too large for my 10" was > that the tie rod was much smaller than the hole in the casting for it. The > V- cut out on the bracket appears to fit my ways as well as any of my other > 10" accessories though. > > Anyway, Dave Sobel was great, and said I could send it back. He also told > me that the tie rod fits in a thick bushing in the tie rod bracket. I don't > want to waste Dave's time if I have the right part by sending it back, so . > . . > > 1) Anyone know of a way to tell a 13" tie rod bracket from a 10" > > 2) What material should I turn the tie rod bushing out of? > > 3) I'm assuming the tie rod slides in the bushing, so what kind of > tolerance should I be shooting for when I bore the bushing? > > 4) What are the two untapped holes on the top of the tie rod bracket for? > (They are located on top of the casting portion that surrounds the bushing > that the tie rod would fit in). There is a third hole with a small square > drive screw in it. I'm assuming this screw holds the bushing in. > > 5) This isn't shown in the parts schematic I have so I don't know what to > call it. In the middle of the tie rod bracket is a 5/8" threaded hollow > stud. There are threads on the outside but not on the inside. I'm guessing > something attaches here but what? > > Thanks, > > George ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What Size of Endmill? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 27 Dec 1999 02:41:46 GMT -------- All things being equal..Use the biggest, stiffest tool you can fit in the space available! (As the actress said to the Bishop!!) teenut Edk4 wrote: > > If you have a mill capable of using any size endmill, from 1/8" to > 1", what determines the diameter of the endmill best for any given job? > > I'm not talking about slots, I'm asking about outside cuts, or pocketing. > I realize that larger diameter endmills are stiffer and deflect less. Are > there other considerations besides stiffness? > > All things being equal, why use one size over the other? > ------------------ > Ed Kingsley ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What Size of Endmill? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 27 Dec 1999 02:45:37 GMT -------- "Fitch R. Williams" wrote: And then two men pick a precision finished part up from where it took a five ton crane to place the original billet!! Kinda makes you feel inadequate! teenut > Then suddenly the thing is done, the machine stops, and the stillness > is almost shocking while the odd drop of coolant drips quietly off the > finished part. (As the Actress said to the Bishop!) > > Fitch > In So. Cal. > > The FAQ for RCM is: http://w3.uwyo.edu/~metal > Metal Web News at http://www.mindspring.com/~wgray1/ > The "Drop Box" is at http://www.metalworking.com/ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Buying a bench grinder From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 27 Dec 1999 03:41:51 GMT -------- Thanks Fitch, you saved me a whole lot 'o typin' Three reasons I use 6" rather than 8" grinders: 1.An 8" wheel at 3450 rev/min always makes me REAL nervous. Those who have never experienced a blown wheel, at close quarters, will have no idea what I mean by this!! 2.6" wheels are cheaper and easier to balance. 3. A 3" radius seems more "useful" when grinding things that need a radius. teenut "Fitch R. Williams" wrote: > > Bench grinders are handy, and, if not used correctly, quite dangerous. > > I think any grinder with reasonable bearings, real inch sized shafts, > and good wheel guards will work. I always make my own fixtures for > them. Contrary to what some Kevlar Chested folks with bullet proof > glasses might advise: > > * keep the guards on the machine. They are there for a reason. Use > the whole guard and use all the bolts that came with it. An exploding > wheel is not a fun thing to stop with parts of your body like the > cornea's of your eyes, or any other part for that matter. > > * do not stand in line with the wheel when you first start the machine > up. This applies every time you turn it on, not just right after you > mount a new wheel. > > * throw away all wheels for which you do not know the pedigree. Do > not buy grinding wheels out of a box of junk at a garage sale! > > * immediately throw away any wheel that has been dropped > > * Pay attention to the consequences of what would happen if the object > to be abraided/polished/derusted was suddenly grabbed by the > grinding/buffing/wire-brushing wheel and propelled at the peripheral > velocity of the wheel (~90 ft/sec for a 6" wheel) in a direction > tangent to the point of contact. If you are grinding a knife blade, > be careful what it will slice if it becomes self propelled. > > I recommend Norton wheels, they will be round and reasonably balanced. > Handy accessories for a grinder are a set of buffing wheels and one > each of stiff wire brush and soft wire brush. Wear goggles, or better > yet a full face shield, every time you use the machine. Period. I > have had wire brush pieces stick themselves right into the plastic of > safety goggles. > > I have to also suggest that for what you are doing, you might want a > 1" x 42" belt sander on one end of the machine with a grinding wheel > on the other, or a cheap 1" belt sander and a cheap grinder. > > Fitch > In So. Cal. > > The FAQ for RCM is: http://w3.uwyo.edu/~metal > Metal Web News at http://www.mindspring.com/~wgray1/ > The "Drop Box" is at http://www.metalworking.com/ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What Size of Endmill? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 27 Dec 1999 05:21:30 GMT -------- Yeah, I have been there! teenut "Fitch R. Williams" wrote: > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > > >And then two men pick a precision finished part up from where it took a five ton > >crane to place the original billet!! > > > >Kinda makes you feel inadequate! > > Were you there? That's almost exactly what happens! > > Fitch"and the conveyer dumps a ton of chips into the bin"Williams > In So. Cal. > > The FAQ for RCM is: http://w3.uwyo.edu/~metal > Metal Web News at http://www.mindspring.com/~wgray1/ > The "Drop Box" is at http://www.metalworking.com/ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What Size of Endmill? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 28 Dec 1999 03:52:12 GMT -------- Use a multi-flute end mill whenever possible..lighter chip load, finer finish and stiffer tool than a two flute. Two flute mills are called "Slot Drills" in the UK and are pretty much reserved (Where Possible!!) to doing just that function...cutting blind ended keyways, accurately to width. On somthing as light as your job you might want to try a solid carbide "Burr"..not a cheap hardware store Dremmel type but a properly, single-cut, "Severence" type run at high speed, light feed and lots of WD 40 (Avoid the smoke and fumes!!) (Gruffly) teenut AAFRadio@erols.com wrote: > > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > All things being equal..Use the biggest, stiffest tool you can fit in the space > > > available! > > Are there any subtle exceptions, Robert? I do a fair amount of trimming > work on WWII repro radio mounts that I bend up out of .062" aluminum, > and I finally settled on a 5/16" 4 flute end mill. (Yeah, I know, it's > overkill, but folks want "exact" duplicates...) 5/16" seems to be a > nice balance from the rip-em-up 3/4" 2 flute I tried and a 1/8" 2 flute > that was too squirrely. I'm sure I didn't have the right combo of speed > and cutting rate, but the gentler action of the 5/16 seems to be more > forgiving on a manual feed mill - it was one of those " feeling" things > as opposed to scientific analysis. Do you or any other gurus have any > thoughts when the workpiece is willowy like that? > > Best Holiday Wishes, > Mike Hanz > Herndon, VA ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Eutectic Question From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 28 Dec 1999 19:31:12 GMT -------- Yes..provided they are clean, fluxed and properly clamped This is how the Japanese make "Makume Gane"..a multilayered, decorative metal. Once the layers are joined, then forging and other manipulations produce beautiful "Moire'" patterns..much like damascus steel. teenut Akilli wrote: > If plates of silver and copper were > polished, clamped, and heated to their eutectic point, would they fuse at the > interface? > > Much Obliged, > Ethan Gross ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Buying a bench grinder From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 28 Dec 1999 20:43:44 GMT -------- Ken, What is making all your posts come through looking like this...Is one of your settings off? 8^) teenut kenneth knaell wrote: > > Just for laughs, isn't there a catfood commercial on TV that says something > like +ACI-My +ACI-cat+ACI- has simple tastes - she just wants the best+ACI- Well, nothing > is perfect, especially my surface grinder at present. > ken knaell > > PLAlbrecht wrote in message > +ADw-19991228114433.01114.00001406+AEA-ng-fh1.aol.com+AD4-... > +AD4APgA+- Typically people who say that > +AD4APgA+- crap works fine are people who have never used decent tools. In this > +AD4APgA+- case I have seen both, and prefer the good stuff. > +AD4APgA+- > +AD4APgA+- Simon > +AD4- > +AD4- > +AD4-Megadittos+ACEAIQAh- Megadittos+ACEAIQAh- (Or is that politically incorrect?) > +AD4- > +AD4-Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Veterinarian tool on Ebay??? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 29 Dec 1999 01:18:50 GMT -------- http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=226903626 Nothing but a pair of good ole English Fire Tongs..worth, maybe, a buck!! Perhaps the seller thinks they are for picking up Bullsh*t!! One born every minute! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Config'ing OE, was Buying a bench grinder From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 29 Dec 1999 19:22:49 GMT -------- Whatever you have done appears to have fixed the problem Ken. Thanks teenut kenneth knaell wrote: > > Gunner, et.al. > I tried and paid for Agent but it hung up on me. I don't think it is any > better than Outlook Express except maybe it allows more control and more > places to misconfigure and there is always the question of whether it > installed itself correctly. If I get the time to really "learn" two news > readers then maybe I will go back to it; its paid for. I think I have > Outlook Express Configured correctly now, I hope. > > I had inadvertently made a change in read fonts by using > [Tools,Options,Read,Font-settings,Universal-Alphabet,UTS-7/8] or similar. > It didn't occur to me that changing the way one reads a message should > change the way in which it was sent, but I suspect it does. > > The problem seemed to occur when I used = ("....") in my > postings. If this works I'll try to summarize it in the next post. I would > think MS could make this precess easier. I wish I could look at it before I > send it but that didn't work before. > ken knaell > > Gunner wrote in message <38739bca.6683733@news.cyberg8t.com>... > >On Wed, 29 Dec 1999 23:22:29 -0500, "kenneth knaell" > > wrote: > > > >>Robert and Group, > >>Sorry, I thought I had fixed the problem. MS Outlook Express is 'doing > it' > >>to me. I have/had all the settings I could find set to 'Plain Text' I > am > >>trying to get out of this mode. > >>Sorry all, > >>ke knaell > >> > >> > >Download Agent and be done with it, and not be vulnerable to the > >"script kids" > > > >Gunner > > > > > >> > >>Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> > wrote in message > >><4i9a4.4520$rt3.122481@news.rdc1.tn.home.com>... > >>>Ken, > >>> > >>>What is making all your posts come through looking like this...Is one of > >>your > >>>settings off? > >>> > >>>8^) > >>> > >>>teenut > >>> > >>................. > >> > >> > >> > > > >--------------------------------------------------------- > > > > "A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an > > invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write > > a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort > > the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, > > solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program > > a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die > > gallantly. Specialization is for insects." Robert Heinlein > > > >Free Hobby Buy/Swap/Sell Website > >www.cyberg8t.com/gunner/hsm/index.html > > > >Home Page > >http://userzweb.lightspeed.net/gunner > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.aviation.homebuilt Subject: Re: Generators- How much do I need? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 30 Dec 1999 03:08:28 GMT -------- For sure...wait until mid January to buy a generator...there are going to be lots around..For CHEAP!! teenut Douglas Palmer wrote: > > I may have another post floating around here somewhere but I cannot seem > to find it so forgive me If this question rings a bell: > I am about to move my shop into a hanger that is without electricity. I > was wondering if anyone out there has experience running power tools on > generator power. The tools that seem as if they will draw the most are > a 5 HP air compressor, A Lincoln square wave TIG 175, and a thickness > planer. The Generators seem to come in three basic sizes: 2500 Watts > and under, 5000 to 6250 Watts, and 7500 to 10,000 Watts I have been > eyeing a few in the middleweight category but was wondering if I need to > go larger. Generally I will only be running one tool at a time, plus a > few fluorescent lights. Any help would be appreciated. > > Thanks, Doug > > dougnlina@mindspring.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Class in basic machine shop From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 30 Dec 1999 03:18:20 GMT -------- Given a good Teacher ;^) any keen and apt student should be able to learn 90% of all there is to learn about lathe settup and operation in that time. The other 10% will take another 40 years!! I applaud the starting off with HSS...It teaches about tool angles and how to achieve and use them. Carbide is for production..a short talk and demo in the next to last week, plus a week of practice should be all that is needed. Good luck with the course. teenut mark center wrote: > What do you really think a student should know and be able to do on the > lathe after going to school 4 hours a day, twice a week, for 18 weeks? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Preparations for Y2K From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 30 Dec 1999 04:12:50 GMT -------- The Best Ways to Prepare for Y2K: 1. Fatten up your closest friends. You may need them later. (Just think "mmm,filet of Ron") 2. Run to the bank and withdraw as much cash as you can carry. Be sure to yell, "I'm going to the bank to withdraw as much cash as I can carry!" 3. Have a ski mask and baseball bat handy. You won't want to miss out on all the looting fun. 4. Dig an underground bomb shelter. If there is no nuclear disaster, at least you'll have an underground bomb shelter. How cool is that? 5. Protect your water supply. Put a drop of yellow food coloring in every container. 6. Get some carrier pigeons. They'll be your best form of communication. They also taste like chicken. 7. Get one of those Indiglo Watches. When we have the big power failure, who's gonna know what time it is? You are, that's who. 8. Buy lots of Spam and .22 Rimfire ammo. It will be the world's new currency. 9. Punch a computer programmer. Why? Why not? 10. Have plenty of clean towels. It's not specific to any millenial disaster, but when have you ever not needed clean towels? 11. Get used to changing the TV channel by hand. Remote controls will be totally inoperable. 12. Stock up on cat food. No, it's not for feeding cats. It's for catching them (if you know what I mean). 13. Have plenty of sharp #2 pencils on hand. Due to computing errors, you may have to re-take your SAT's. 14. Throw out your microwave and VCR. On January 1st, they may come alive and try to kill you. 15. Collect all the spoons you can. Why? Because right now spoons are everywhere, But after January 1st, who knows? 16. Move to Canada. Nothing bad ever happens to those guys. 17. Visit a fertility clinic. It may be up to you alone to replenish the earth. 18. Make friends with the Amish. Because after December 31st, we're all Amish. 19. Hunker down. Then hunker down some more. We just like to say "Hunker Down." Try it, it's fun! 20. Break it to your kids that the world may end. Start by telling them there is no Santa Claus. That way, the news won't seem so bad. 21. Save all your Christmas Wrapping. It doubles as toilet paper. 22. Crawl into the fetal position and practice screaming: We're all gonna die! We're all gonna die! 23. Stock up on earplugs. If you hear "Party Like it's 1999" one more time, you will go insane. 24. Pray. This does no good if you're in advertising, they're all going to hell regardless. TODAY's One liner: Would it be ethical to dig up the remains of our founding fathers, create clones from the bone cells, and place them in a theme park called Clonial Williamsburg? teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: tremor From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 30 Dec 1999 05:55:22 GMT -------- I agree! The Lead Hand in the heavy turning shop at my "Alma Mater" had REALLY bad hand shakes. He would come to my machine to check on work in process...Picking up a part and fishing his mic out of his vest pocket, he would check a dimension and hold out the wobbling blur for me to see..."Look Lad..Tha's two tenths ovver t'limit"!! He was always right!! teenut Terry Nelson wrote: > > Mark, > > Aside from seeing what the Doc says like everybody else recomended you > can do quite well with the shakes. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: copper wool as rust remover on artifact From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 30 Dec 1999 06:11:49 GMT -------- If they really ARE valuable..stay the hell off them until you have talked to a REAL expert!! Touch them with any kind of wool and you risk destroying their value. Oil them, to halt the further spread of rust..but, at this stage, remove ONLY that which comes of with a soft cloth. Search for a sword page on the webb and learn a LOT about the subject before you or anyone else touches them. teenut richgoth, sydney wrote: > > hey, > I recently came into possesion of two valuable swords. They are > valuable because they are in great condition-only a little rust, and > almost no dings or scratches... > An expert recomended tat if I wanted to clean the little rust that is > on them, I should only use aluminium or copper wool and WD40... > I haven't had much luck locating these, but I did find a copper pot > scourer (which is more like copper swarf) > anyone know if this is OK to use??? Or should I make some aluminium > wool on the lathe???? > regards > richgoth > > -- > "I loved physics, so long as it did not try to > take precedence over poetry; now that it is > crushing all the arts, I no longer wish to > regard it as anything but a tyrant...."-voltaire > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Heat treating wheelweight alloy From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 30 Dec 1999 15:53:29 GMT -------- Not altogether true Gary...Usually the LONGER a bullet, the faster it needs to spin to stabalise it. Short, fat bullets or round balls do better with slower spin rates. The problem here could be OVER stabilisation, leading to precession, rather than "tumbling"...or, because of the smaller bearing area, a certain amount of skidding in the rifleing. As these are target loads I would suggest a LOWER velocity might do the trick. teenut Gary Coffman wrote: > A tumbling bullet means it isn't spinning fast enough for its form factor. > Short fat little pills have to spin faster than longer ones to stablize properly. > This particular problem could be that the slugs are undersize for that > particular bore, too slow a twist to the rifling, or not enough oomph behind > the bullet. The latter is most probable. A light bullet in .45 needs to step right > on out to get enough spin. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Noral Alloy From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 30 Dec 1999 16:02:04 GMT -------- I have vague recollections that "Noral" is an old trade name for an aluminum alloy..in the same way that "Dural" is. A high strength, light alloy as the "Prod" for a cross bow would make a lot of sense..provided the heat treatment and design were right. I do know that aluminum long bows were quite successful some time ago. That said...Steel would be more in keeping with the originals..or a fiberglass/wood laminate as is used on modern bows. There are crossbow sites on the web that might help. teenut Andrew Roberts wrote: > > In article , Ned Simmons > wrote: > > Could this be "Noryl"? Noryl is a plastic alloy, outwardly similar to > > Delrin, meaning it looks and feels like black Delrin. More info about the > > application would be needed to recommend a replacement. > > > > Ned Simmons > > > > The part in a crossbow that provides the spring. > > --------------------¦ > Andrew Roberts- ¦ > Napier, ¦ > New Zealand ¦ > ¦ > villiers@xtra.co.nz ¦ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: I made something! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 31 Dec 1999 10:30:33 GMT -------- Wrought Iron perhaps? Nowadays probably stainless steel. Worn to remind Engineers of their fallibility!! teenut Mark Kinsler wrote: > > It seems to me that we had a thread some time ago about the ring that > Canadian engineers wear. These were steel, I think, and the steel (at > least initially) came from the Quebec bridge that collapsed whilst under > construction. > > Mark Kinsler > > -- > ............................................................................ > 114 Columbia Ave. Athens, Ohio USA 45701 voice740.594.3737 fax740.592.3059 > Home of the "How Things Work" engineering program for adults and kids. > See http://www.frognet.net/~kinsler ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: planer question From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 31 Dec 1999 21:47:14 GMT -------- Skipping tool cuts on a planer or shaper mean that something is LOOSE!! First, check the fit of the clapper box and its pivot...it should move freely with NO trace of shake. On a shaper..Check the setting of the ram gibs. Again, the ram should move freely back and forth without any shake or lift whatsoever. Free the ram from the pitman arm to check this, so that you can slide the ram back and forth by hand. Finally, watch the ram, under power, after it has been freshly oiled...If you see oil being "Sucked" back and forth at the point the ram enters the slide...you probably need to adjust it snugger...or rescrape the slides. One other point. Snug up the table locks before cutting, and if the table has one...Make sure the support leg is set and tightened. Given this, a good shaper or planer is as precise as any surface grinder...Though maybe, not as accurate! (Or is it the other way round?) teenut Dan Buckman wrote: > > are planers able to cut semi-close tollerance reliably? I mean without years > of experience. > I ripped off some tapers for some forklift things, and squared up some > railroad rail pieces for practice, sometimes the toolbit bites too much or > too little at the start of the cut and every once in a while it just skipps > along the wole leingth. I recently mounted a grinder in place of one of the > clapper boxes so I could resurface a mill table , worked verry well. but a > little slow for any depth,im wondering if there is some quick pointers that > will make me an expert in one easy lesson.(once i put the grinder on it > actually became usable in some form, so now the "use the table as a work > bench and throw the rest out" is no longer a valid option, sorry) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Heat treating wheelweight alloy From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 31 Dec 1999 21:52:25 GMT -------- Gary! Does this mean a Kinder, Gentler, YOU for the new Millenium? How touching!! 8^) Happy New Year teenut Gary Coffman wrote: > To clarify, Robert is right and I was incorrect in my first post in saying that short > fat bullets need to spin faster. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Smithy Tail stock question From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 31 Dec 1999 22:07:21 GMT -------- Screw the arbor all the way out and remove it from the tailstock..Now you can either hod it in the bench vise and tap the chuck free with a long punch...Or, as I have done...Drop an appropriatly sized steel ball into the back of the ram, screw it back into the tailstock body and it will pop out the chuck in the regular fashion. I use a ball because it will then roll out of the taper rather than having to fish it out!! Your tailstock may however be one of the few "Non ejecting" types..they require a tapered drift in the tang slot (If there is one) Failing which a "U" shaped Block is used that will slip over the ram or drill shank. The ram is then run all the way BACK into the tailstock to pop out the chuck. Jacobs tapers are designed to hold tighter than morse tapers for this reason!! teenut Ted Edwards wrote: > The chuck is on an arbor with a threaded end that can be used with a > draw bar in the mill and you didn't put the little screw-in button on > the end for the ejector to push on. (Don't ask how I know.) :-) > > In either case, first try hitting the back of the chuck to drive it > out. Lock the ram and use a wood, plastic or brass drift - don't hit ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: planer question From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 01 Jan 2000 16:20:36 GMT -------- Lucky you to have BOTH a planer and a shaper..I agree about the "Primordial Pleasure" of watching the tool peel off metal..Sorta makes you feel Master of the Situation!! Learning to set up and use these machines is quick and easy..sort of intuitive. However, a good book on the subject can help enormously, as well as opening up possibilitys and applications one would never otherwise dream of. Try Lindsays..they may have a copy of the book by Cincinnatti Milling Machine which IMHO is the definitive book on the subject. By the way..The Up feed is used for planing vertical surfaces..In which case the other table slides are locked and the vertical slide just snugged up to eliminate side play. Enjoy teenut Dan Buckman wrote: > > > Skipping tool cuts on a planer or shaper mean that something is LOOSE!! > > the clapper box is like brand new. I was wondering how important the tool > shape was, and the overhang. I'm guessing the tool bit is suposto be pulled > into the work so the gibb on the head has to be just loose enough to alow > gravity to pull it down on the feed screw, but my first feeling was I had to > screw the tool into the work (apply down pressure via screw) that would > imply a tight fit. > I have a shaper as well as the planner so your advice on ram adjustment > wasn't wasted. I had wondered on the shaper why there was a power verticle > table feed when the manual recomended the table lock be engaged and the > table support bolted ( when the table is centered of corse.). I find it hard > to believe that it was meerly a labor saving device, not from the men of > iron that forged the industrial age. > I'm not too woried about the shaper, but a piece large enough to need the > planer can get expensive, so I was wondering how much experience this was > likley to take. If it's too much I think I man try the route of mounting > some kind of milling head. but there is something primal about watching a > tool bit rip off steel like that. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Opinions sought on toy hot air engine marketing ideas From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 03 Jan 2000 00:14:57 GMT -------- Reality Check.... No Corporate Legal Dept would ever allow the distribution of millions of pins to kids!!! teenut Bruce Simpson wrote: > A lot simpler to design and engineer -- the whole thing could be > injection moulded with a regular pin used as the shaft/needle-point > bearing. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Buying a bench grinder From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 03 Jan 2000 00:30:59 GMT -------- Did I ever tell you about the time I had to fetch a Buddies head down from the crane tracks?? teenut Nigel Eaton wrote: > > In article <1aos6sgq5fivhg8s3mg15vrg58mdun7tnk@4ax.com>, > Fitch R. Williams writes > >years I've been using it. Think about it, you will figure it out ... > Robert, if you're tempted to give us the 'glove' story again, please, > please, please don't. I'm still feeling delicate from my > millenniellinumium celebrations and I don't have time to get barf > out of my keyboard right now. Thank you so much....... ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: HF band saw From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 04 Jan 2000 14:54:52 GMT -------- I recently picked up one of these saws (Fer CHEAP!!) sans motor and drive pulley..but otherwise brand new, from MSC. I have a half HP 1725 Motor in stock...But can someone tell me the diameters of the drive pulley steps. I believe there are four steps. O/D or Pitch Diameter...I don't mind which (so long as you specify which it is) Thanks. teenut Alan Mimms wrote: > > There is an FAQ page for the Harbor Freight/Grizzly/Jet/Enco/etc. > ~$175 metalcutting bandsaw at > http://www.halcyon.com/meretrix/4x6bsFAQ.html maintained by one of our > major luminaries: Grant Erwin. There is also a little about fixing up > these saws on Chris Heapy's site in the UK at > http://easyweb.easynet.co.uk/~chrish/homepge2.htm . I have found both > of these very helpful and I hope you will as well. > -- > Alan Mimms > Home machinist in (self) training. > E-mail: alanm@unforgettable.com > Metalworking web page: http://alanm.penguinpowered.com/metalworking > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Original Message <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<< > > On 1/3/00, 5:00:14 PM, epotter@mail.utexas.edu (epotter) wrote > regarding HF band saw: > > > does anyone have an opinion or experience with their cheap ($180) > metal > > cutting bandsaw? Thinking of one for occasional use, not daily use. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Help to identify cylindrical grinder From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 04 Jan 2000 15:17:53 GMT -------- Looks like a Jones and Shipman (Leicester England) 'Andy bit 'o kit..especially if the price is right. With a few addaptations it can also be used as a tool and cutter grinder. Lucky you! teenut Esben Beck wrote: > > Hello, all at rec.crafts.metalworking! > > I recently discovered a dust-covered, abandoned cylindrical grinder in a > corner of the workshop in the brewery where I work. Although it looks > bad, it is in pretty good condition and comes with a lot of virtually > unused grinding accessories and a coolant pump, and I am thinking about > taking it to my home workshop. Pictures of the grinder can be seen at: > > http://www.metalworking.com/dropbox/ > > grinder1.jpg > grinder2.jpg > > I am not able to identify it, though. It has a swivelling base unit, and > it can be fitted wit a lot of accessories for internal, external and > taper grinding operations. It also seems possible to perform small > surface grinding operations on it as well, by using one of the different > attachments for internal grinding. The only information on the machine > is the "SJ" logo that can be seen on the front of the pedestal in > "grinder1.jpg". The identification plate above the "SJ" logo says Oskar > Skodtvedt, one of the pre-historic machine dealers in Oslo where I live. > The identification plate on the upper motor says "H.Knudsen & Sons, > Copenhagen", but that is only the motor manufacturer. > > "SJ" reminds me of Jones&Shipman, but that sounds to good to be true. > > A couple of items related to the machine is shown in "grinder2.jpg". > Does anybody know what the rear item leaning towards the wall is > supposed to be used for? > > Any comments and suggestions will be appreciated. Thanks in advance! > > Regards, > Esben Beck, Norway ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: They're Back!! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 05 Jan 2000 00:17:08 GMT -------- CalAero have Cuter Toolmaker's vise back on Ebay... http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=230698150 FWIW teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: They're Back!! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 05 Jan 2000 04:03:48 GMT -------- No quick action..screw down all the way. However the solid bronze handle has a hole for a tommy bar at the extreme outward end and hex flats for a wrench close up to the vise end. I find that hand tight is fine for drilling and light milling. Need to reef down a bit more for hogging cuts though!! teenut Robert Mitchell wrote: > > I am confused about how the handles operate on these Cuter vises: > > Is it a quick-closing slide forward and engage the threads, > or is it screw down the full length? > > The handle comes straight out the back; do you use a tommy bar for > tightening, or just finger tight? > > - Thanks - Robert Mitchell > > "Robert Bastow" <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote in message > news:84wc4.1159$Bd7.15119@news.rdc1.tn.home.com... > > CalAero have Cuter Toolmaker's vise back on Ebay... > > > > http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=230698150 > > > > FWIW > > > > teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: They're Back!! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 05 Jan 2000 04:05:38 GMT -------- $119 is for the larger size..That both you and I have. They now hahave a smaller size too. (A cuter "Cuter"?) teenut PLAlbrecht wrote: > > Interesting. I'll bet if you call up Cal-Aero and ask if they have Cuter vises > (say you heard about it from a friend) they'll be happy to sell you one at $119 > or so. Let's see where the bidding frenzy takes it... > > Remember the auction is for ONE vise. Not a dutch auction. They must have more > than one. Last time they told me some guy in Texas took a whole caseload of > them. They'll be happy for people to call in. > > The $119 is what I paid in the store. > > Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 9" Angle grinders...B/D or Milwaukee? Opinions Needed. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 05 Jan 2000 04:12:58 GMT -------- Sorry to hear about your loss..Those old B&D Heavy Duty grinders are unbreakable. I have had mine "since Adam was a lad"!! and couldn't bear to be parted from it. This same question came up a while ago on one of the forging lists..Consensus was that Dewalt was pretty close to the old B&D..at least on this item. Non of the Japanese, Bosch or Milwaukee products were worth the powder to blow them to hell..but the Porter Cable got good reviews too. On Balance I would go for the Dewalt and knock the s**t out of it while still under warranty. teenut Alberic wrote: > > Greetings folks. > > My shop got broken into around thanksgiving, and the biggest item taken > was my old B/D Wildcat 9" right angle grinder. No big deal, everything > was covered, and I'm not using any of it right now anyway, so replacement > time isn't hurting me any. So I'm looking around at new 9" grinders, and > it turns out that B/D doesn't do the industrial line anymore, they've spun > it off onto DeWalt. > The current Dewalt *appears* to be a brightly colored version of my old > wildcat, which I was pretty pleased with, but I've heard dire things about > DeWalt's quality lately. My other choice seems to be Milwaukee's 9" > grinder. The advantage there is that it comes *with* the grinding wheel > guard, which is a $30-$50 special order for the DeWalt. I've used a fair > pile of Milwaukee stuff over the years, and have been largely pleased with > it, with the notable exception of their 4.5" right angle grinders, which > we used to chew through on a fairly regular basis. (9-12 month lifespan.) > Anybody know anything directly about either tool? I recall a discussion > here a few months back about the relative merits of various makes of 4.5" > angle grinders, and some of the really cheap gearing systems that've come > into use lately. (Somebody using nylon gears in the right angle head, if > I remember right.) > > So, I'm looking for opinions, or suggestions of the "perfect" 9" grinder. > I mostly use it for refinishing anvils, or similar sorts of things, so 5K RPM, > 15 Amp is a minimum. > > Thanks- > Brian > > PS--Tom, if you're reading this, yes, they got Makita the Destroyer, so if > you suddenly see it at the flea-market, it's hot...please feel free to > amuse yourself with whomever is attempting to sell it. > > PPS--> just as a comment on the relative intelligence of the average > thief, they took my $69 5C spin Jig, but left the $800 H/V rotary index it > was sitting next to. They nabbed the angle grinder, but left about 10K > worth of mill tooling that was in the same crate. Let's hear it for heavy > inscrtable tools covered in slimy rust-inhibitor. I figure most of the > stuff in there was just too weird, too heavy, or two slimy to walk off > with. Of course, the one thing I *wanted* them to have taken, they left. > (I've got an old 6" B'port vise, and I'd really rather have a kurt. The > kurt's about 50 pounds lighter.) > Somehow, I just *knew* the 125# B'port vise wasn't going to be the first > thing out the door. > > -- > To Email me: there are no numbers of any sort in my real address. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Bridgeport Cherrying head From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 05 Jan 2000 04:14:17 GMT -------- What is a Bridgeport "Cherrying Head"? teenut Henry wrote: > > I recently aquired a Bridgeport Cherrying head missing its motor and > with a broken hand wheel but otherwise just a little dusty . > What a great find I thought as I lugged it into my truck. When I lugged > it into my shop I suddenly realized that I probably will never use it > and I cant bring myself to throw it away. It's too heavy to make into a > lamp and too light to be a good mooring and I dont want to keep tripping > over it. HELP!!!. I am in eastern Massachusetts on the coast, north of > Boston > > Henry > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Burned by sfal@ala.net on eBay From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 05 Jan 2000 04:31:08 GMT -------- Be assured that Ebay WILL investigate, take appropriate action, and report back to you. Those guys play HARDBALL with any hankypanky nowadays! You can, if you wish, leave a feedback for him or anyone else on Ebay. There is no pre-requirement to be a buyer or seller. HOWEVER..be dead sure of your facts before making any negative comments about anyone..Cases are already on record of successful lawsuits for substantial damages by Ebay vendors who highly value their ratings. Govern yourself accordingly.. teenut "John R. Miller" wrote: > > Update, I examined the email and imagine my surprise... read this letter to > eBay... > > Hi, > I was recently involved in auction #227111115. This was a several day > auction and in the last 10 seconds someone jumpbid me and won the auction. I > immediately complained to the seller (rogersrepairs), then fired off a > letter to the buyer (sfal@ala.net). Imagine my surprise when the same person > (Roger ) responded to BOTH emails! > > So, what was Roger up to? Trying to boost the price of his auction by > bidding on it with an alias? Probably. Perhaps he really didn't want to part > with it? Probably not, it was pretty rusty. In any case, I consider this to > be unethical behavior by an eBay member - whatever his name is and I think > his membership ought to be revoked. > > If you are interested, I have proof positive of the sequence of emails for > your perusal. > > Thanks, > > John Miller > jrm@midohio.net > John R. Miller wrote in message > news:Liyc4.182$eK1.4413@news... > > Complaint: I have been watching and bidding for a collet closer on eBay > for > > the last several days. In the last 10 seconds, sfal@ala.net alias Roger > > alias jumped in and outbid me. I was not able to change > my > > bid fast enough! I checked this person's comments from sellers on eBay and > > they think he's just a wonderful guy. Well, there is no place for other > > bidders to make comments about members, so I am making mine here. Here is > > Roger, alias , alias sfal@ala.net comments to me: > > > > "up yours asshole" > > > > So, please give Roger, alias, , alias sfal@ala.net a > > big warm howdy from RCM! > > > > Thanks, > > > > John Miller > > Delaware, Ohio > > > > > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: dropped my southbend lathe. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 05 Jan 2000 06:17:06 GMT -------- Different folks, different strokes!! I prefer SOLID handles on handwheels..Unless a revolving handle is on something like pre-loaded ABEC 7 bearings, I find that the incipient looseness spoils the "Feel" of the machine. My fingers are usually greasy enough, that a solid handle doesn't present a friction problem. Have you ever noticed that precision lathes..built without regard to cost...usually have non-rotating handles on the balanced ball handles? Ever wondered why? ;^) teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: and the good part was the learned knowledge that > spinning handles are so much nicer, and easy to fabricate out of the > older solid ones. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Test++++please ignore From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 05 Jan 2000 06:21:13 GMT -------- What were you testing...a GALLOWS?? teenut Karaya wrote: > > I'll be hanged...it worked! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: dropped my southbend lathe. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 05 Jan 2000 13:35:20 GMT -------- Not Rosewood but Buffalo Horn..always the sign of top quality on older, precision lathes. Most of the lever knobs on my Maximat are nasty black plastic with a roughly tapered form. I replaced the tailstock lock lever with a longer one in 416 SS and added an elegantly tapered knob in black/marbled Indian Water Buffalo horn. What a difference it makes!! You can buy this material in the form of 1" and 1 1/4" diameter sticks, about 5" long, from Knifemaker's Suppliers. About $8.00 a stick. I would certainly consider puting revolving handles of this material on my feedscrew handwheels..but not without the aforesaid preloaded bearings. Maybe not ABEC 7 ;^) But certainly preloaded, to remove all trace of shake! teenut Marshall Pharoah wrote: > > I thought I was on to a big moneymaker with rosewood and brass replacements. The retrofit market. If you can hop up your car, why > not your lathe. > > Marshall > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote in message news:ClBc4.2068$Bd7.20950@news.rdc1.tn.home.com... > > Different folks, different strokes!! > > > > I prefer SOLID handles on handwheels..Unless a revolving handle is on something > > like pre-loaded ABEC 7 bearings, I find that the incipient looseness spoils the > > "Feel" of the machine. > > > > My fingers are usually greasy enough, that a solid handle doesn't present a > > friction problem. > > > > Have you ever noticed that precision lathes..built without regard to > > cost...usually have non-rotating handles on the balanced ball handles? > > > > Ever wondered why? > > > > ;^) > > > > teenut > > > > mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > and the good part was the learned knowledge that > > > spinning handles are so much nicer, and easy to fabricate out of the > > > older solid ones. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Where to buy boring head ? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 05 Jan 2000 15:03:41 GMT -------- Lots of good deals at MSC...even on Ebay. I got an almost mint, Chandler Boring and Facing head off Ebay for a tenth of its new cost!! The deals are there!! teenut Bray Haven wrote: > > Where can I get a good deal on a decent boring head? Probably a R-8 taper or > straight 3/4 so I could use it in the lathe too. Small lighter work mostly. > 1/2" shank. > > Greg Sefton ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Primer and paint for aluminum From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 05 Jan 2000 15:15:46 GMT -------- I can't agree with you more Gary! The fact that I am a heavy smoker has nothing to do with that..of course!! My Paternal Grandfather, a lifelong teetotaler died in agony, lingering for over a year with cancer of the bladder. At age 62!! My Mother's Father, a coalminer and lifelong chainsmoker of "Woodbines" went out fishing, at age 90, went to sleep on the bank and never woke up! I'm here for a GOOD time..not necessarily a LONG time. If I went today I will have LIVED more in the past fifty plus years, that most people could in three lifetimes. "Life, Liberty, and the Pursuit of Happiness" I promise not to blow smoke in your direction, if you promise not to blow smoke in mine! teenut Gary Coffman wrote: > > On Tue, 04 Jan 2000 13:25:30 -0500, Ted Edwards wrote: > >Bray Haven wrote: > > > >> I agree, but the cost of smoking related illness is costing the economy many > >> times what the tax revenues produce ... > > > >False. There has been a study done on this. Turns out smoking shortens > >the life of a lot of people but tends to get most of them rather > >quickly. Things like lung cancer and heart attacks cost a lot less than > >the lingering care often required by others e.g. Altzheimers. > > Yep, non-smokers live on average 4 years longer than smokers, with the > last year of their lives often costing hundreds of thousands in medical > support costs for a wide variety of terminal ailments. The most common > smoking related cause of death is a heart attack. Many don't even make > it to the hospital. So medical costs are relatively low, and Social Security > benefits are paid for a shorter time to smokers. Smoking actually saves > the government money in many cases (factor in tobacco taxes, and the > government profits). There are individual exceptions to the averages, of > course, but government is practicing the Big Lie when it says it is incurring > excess costs due to smoking. > > Examples, my uncle, a non-smoker, just passed away from bone cancer. > He lingered for nearly a year, in great pain, and ran up huge hospital bills > (paid mostly by Medicare). My grandmother suffered from Altzheimers > the last 4 years of her life. It was a terrible strain on the family. OTOH, > my father, a smoker, keeled over from a heart attack while exercising his > dogs. No lingering pain, and no hospital bills. It doesn't always work out > like that, of course, but that's the way the statistics point. > > I'm now at an age where my kin and older friends are kicking off with > disturbing regularity. Three have died in the last 2 weeks. Something > is going to kill each of us in the end. That's something we all have to face. > On the one hand, I think I'd rather go quickly when the time comes, but > on the other I'd like to get as much of my tax money back from the > government as I can, so I don't want to go out cheap. It's a quandry. > > Gary > Gary Coffman KE4ZV | You make it |mail to ke4zv@bellsouth.net > 534 Shannon Way | We break it | > Lawrenceville, GA | Guaranteed | ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Burned by sfal@ala.net on eBay From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 05 Jan 2000 15:58:25 GMT -------- I resemble that remark!!! ;^) teenut Rick wrote: And get a feel for playing > with the sharks before stepping up. > Best of Luck > On Ebay one will need it. > Rick ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Sheet Wax From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 05 Jan 2000 16:03:21 GMT -------- I is used to put "Filets" on wooden patterns. Melted and dripped into corners and polished to a smooth radius with a filet iron. Leather fillet can also be glued in place and similarly polished. Very much in context..not that anyone minds much around here! Welcome Todd, teenut Todd Burch wrote: > > This is my first post here, so please don't bombard me if this is out of > context. > > A while back, I bought the estate of a retired pattern maker. With it, I > got several boxes of sheet wax. It is old, but still looks too good to > throw away. I'm a woodworker, not a pattern maker, so I don't have any use > for this sheet wax - at least I don't think I do. What's it good for? > > And, I have several boxes steel dowels/inserts. What about these? Thanks, > Todd Burch (Houston, Tx) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Primer and paint for aluminum From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 05 Jan 2000 22:39:38 GMT -------- Depends what you want to do with YOUR life Bray. For sure, I didn't ask for any tips on how to live more like you. Nor would I presume to advise you on how to live yours. As I said..I won't blow smoke in your direction...if you don't blow your smoke in mine! Deal? teenut Bray Haven wrote: > Hmm... I never realized smoking could do that for you :o). Must be a great > adventure; sucking it in.... blowing it out. We're talking tobacco here, > right? > GS ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Miniature edge-finder? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 05 Jan 2000 23:07:11 GMT -------- The advantage of cigarette (Or, in England, Izal Toilet "Tissue"????) is that it will stick to the oil on the work piece. Edge finding can then be done in safety..using the CUTTER. That way, regardless of any runout or size variation of the cutter..you know exactly where its outer edge will cut to. More often than not, that is more important, than the actual placing of the spindle centerline exactly over the "edge" of the workpiece Approach the bit of paper steadily, when it disappears you are .XXXX from the edge. Proceed accordingly. While edge and center finders are a wonderful idea..I, and generations of Brit Tradesmen managed perfectly well without them. Toilet paper or a "Sticky pin" were more than adequate. teenut "Marvin W. Klotz" wrote: > > On Thu, 6 Jan 2000 14:54:27 -0500, "kenneth knaell" wrote: > > >I keep two Philips Audio Cassets (cassetts,casetts, ?) in the vicinity. > >One of them has tape that is 0.0006 and the other is 0.0003 thick. Maybe > >something a little stiffer would be easier to position sometimes though. > >ken knaell > > > > I inherited something from a WWII era machinist. Couldn't decide what it was used for for > a long time. > > It's a decoratively turned rod (apprentice project?) about 8" long with each end slit, > cross-drilled and tapped to form a pinch clamp with a capacity of maybe 0.050". > > While struggling to hold a feeler while edge finding with a dowel, it suddenly occurred to > me that this device was meant to hold short lengths of feeler stock with one's hand > conveniently removed from the working area. > > I mounted pieces of 5 and 10 thou shim stock in it and now it sits permanently on the > mill. Beyond edge finding, it's useful for setting the business end of a fly cutter or > shell mill a known height above a surface. > > I still don't know if that was its intended use but it is now. Too bad these old-timers > didn't document these neat devices they made to make life easier. > > Later I made something similar to hold pieces of a broken 6" scale for making measurements > in areas inaccessible with a standard scale. Thought I was sooo clever until I discovered > the same device for sale in the Starrett catalogue. > > Marv > > Email: mklotz@alum.mit.edu > > Home shop utility freeware page at: > http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hall/4425 ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: recycle carbide From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 06 Jan 2000 00:35:36 GMT -------- Carbide is a high dollar, recycleable material..I am surprised that you do not have a regular pickup of the broken and worn bits...Every machine shop I know does. Then again..maybe you do...But the Purchasing Agent at your company has cut another of those sleazy deals that Purchasing Agents are so good at. (Did I mention I don't like PA's) teenut Greg Nuspel wrote: > > I was wondering if there is any place that recycles carbide inserts and > endmills? It's a shame to toss them out when they are worn out or > broken. > > -- > Greg Nuspel > Quality Assurance Coordinator > Elite Machining Ltd. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: mill/drill indicator From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 06 Jan 2000 00:40:39 GMT -------- Interesting proposal Al. Do you figure on using plastic bolts to hold the column to the base plate..Or will the usual string and sealing wax hold it good enough? 8^) teenut Alfred Kimmel wrote: > > I am thinking of unbolting the collum and placing a plastic or other > material that will not conduct electricity sheet a few thousands of an > inch thick. so as to insulate the collum and head from the table then > using a battery and a light emmiting diode fix it so that when an end > mill just touches the metal affixed to the table that the led comes on > letting you know you are just at the metal. What do you think will this > work has anyone tried it yet. > Al Kimmel > Texas ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: need 100 feet of hydraulic hose line... From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 06 Jan 2000 00:43:17 GMT -------- The friction losses will be colossal..you will be lucky if you can even move fluid through the pipe..never mind do useful work at the end of it!! teenut Choiliefan wrote: > > We have three smallish hydraulic feed motors which need power supplied by a > hydraulic pump unit located approx 100 feet away. Moving the pump closer is > not an option at this time. > We're leaning toward using 1/2" galvanized pipe and fittings buried underground > to make our dream a reality. > Question for the group mind: Will this work or might there be a better way? > TIA > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Who sell 6 flute dies? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 06 Jan 2000 00:51:06 GMT -------- How fast do you want them to run? World record for the 100 meters is held by a skinny little "four fluter" from Hong Kong! 8^) Kpnorm wrote: > > We need a couple of high speed 3/8-24 dies. Any ideas? > Ken Try MSC, they have dies of every persuation, race, creed and color. Must be a coupla outstanding athletes in a book that big!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: dropped my southbend lathe. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 07 Jan 2000 02:03:09 GMT -------- Please crawl back under your stone, William..You are stinking the place up! Respectfully, teenut William wrote: > > Virgil Woods you are the most ignorant person I have ever run across on this news > group. You're a fucking ass hole in any language, spelled any way you want. > > Virgil Woods wrote: > > > Dan Buckman wrote: > > > > > > I think you missed the point> if some people don't learn to take a fue > > > risks ultimatly the the lives you think you are protecting will be > > > jepordised (however you spell that) by a shift in the social climate, I > > > would bet that many more lives were lost last centry from approved > > > government action than all the accidental or personal premeditated deaths > > > combined. I didn't to a scientific study but a starting point is 6million > > > jews by hitler , a figgure probably matched by the purges of stolin both of > > > which I have heard were dwarfed by the chinese in mid century, we can add > > > pot pal, rowanda(small time only half a mill). these are not even counting > > > losses by war. It Didn't happen here so its never figgured in when we > > > mentaly assess risks.. There is nothing wrong with safty, but the U.S. had > > > adopted it as a new religion. some people at osha would love to regulate > > > every aspect of our lives (of course they deny) there will always be those > > > people, what concerns me is that this is becoming accepted by the american > > > people, always under guises like to protect the wives and childeren. the > > > people saying protect the children the loudest are the same ones placeing > > > them at risk. You learn by doing , you grow calluses from rough work. we > > > have been on a picnic too long our hands are getting soft. > > > > > > Is this what they call off topic, > > > > > > Never had a wife and childeren, don't have medical insurance realy can't > > > figure out why I even care what the rest of you do. > > > > > > oh well take care (no realy) > > > > Don't feel ashamed of your improper spelling of some words, alot of > > second graders > > can't spell as well as you.. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: SV: Help to identify cylindrical grinder From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 07 Jan 2000 02:17:37 GMT -------- As I already said in an earlier post..it is a Jones and Shipman. teenut Esben Beck wrote: > BTW: Has anybody figured out who made this machine? I would love to lay > my oil-soaked hands on a user's manual. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: They're Back!! - Cal Aero From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 07 Jan 2000 02:20:22 GMT -------- What IS your problem?? teenut m_vanmeter wrote: > > Cal Aero is at it again. > > http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=231576190 > > This vise sells at full retail for $121 in the Travers Tool Co. 2000 > catalog. A starting price $4 below retail is just trolling for those > without access to good tool catalogs > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Ebay sniping... From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 07 Jan 2000 02:29:54 GMT -------- Naw..too rich for my blood! Just wanted to keep track of prices for future reference. I like to open up the didding with a minimum bid..as you say, it helps to keep track of the item, and is easy to get back to by any number of means. Second screen, last second bidding, is Post Graduate Ebay stuff..so is "Killer Bidding"..but I will let you find out about that stuff for yourselves..Hey, I love you guys..but Ebay is a Jungle. No Pity...No Prisoners...Kill the Wounded...Eat the Dead. (Kinda like Rugby, Huh!) teenut Russ Kepler wrote: I see others do it as well (hey > Bastow - didn't you want those bore mics?) and likely for similar > reasons. > > -- > Russ Kepler russ@kepler-eng.com > > Please Don't Feed the Engineers ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Ebay sniping... From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 07 Jan 2000 02:39:21 GMT -------- mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > (hey > > Bastow - didn't you want those bore mics?) and likely for similar > > reasons. > > No, but he sure liked that leatherette-covered Gerstner toolbox. > He came *this* close to losing it, too. I actually watched the > auction end, but I didn't have the heart to snipe it. Not as close to loosing it as you might think. I put in a "Killer Bid" five seconds before the end!! > Actually Robert seems to have the ebay technique down pat. A >reasonable bid, > and if it goes above that, he says forget it. That man will > probably not be disappointed. Never have been disappointed with what I got..for what I paid!! I even buy a fair amount from Al Babin..no complaints at all..Al is a good guy to work with. Only ever had one Item sent that was misrepresented (through ignorance rather than by design of the vendor)..sent it back and got my money back..no problem. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Where to buy boring head ? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 07 Jan 2000 02:52:19 GMT -------- I have a three inch Criterion and a two inch "import" from MSC..Can't tell any difference in quality or performance. Heck of a difference in price though!! teenut "J. Kimberlin" wrote: > > Bray Haven wrote: > > > > >You can get a small sized Criterion boring head for about $250.00, a > > >quality head > > >and not some import junk. > > > > > > > Thanks, I'm not sure I can justify that much for this item. > > I have a 2" Criterion that I got a long time ago for $139 with a > shank and set of boring bars. Gone are those days, I guess. > Recently, I got a Criterion look-alike from Travers tool for > $63.00 without a shank. It is just fine and just as good as the > Criterion. Shanks ain't cheap but are available and you could > just may your own for your application if you can cut a 7/8-20 > thread and a square shoulder. > > Call travers 800-221-0270, part #: 85-052-902, page 714 in the > 1999 cat. > > JerryK ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Junkyard Wars From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 07 Jan 2000 03:13:50 GMT -------- I'm In!! teenut PLAlbrecht wrote: > > Hey, they're asking for entries for the 2000 series. > > Any RCMers wanna put together a team? I suppose we'd have to pay our own way > over... > > Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Junkyard Wars From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 07 Jan 2000 03:27:08 GMT -------- Davis Recoil-less Gun 6 and 12 Pounder..Used extensively in WW11 fireing down at a steep angle from the front observer cockpit at ships and submarines. Simplest breech ever...Screwed coupling in the middle of a long tube, front end rifled, rear end smooth. Projectile goes forward..counter projectile of lead dust and veseline goes rearward. No recoil! No breech block. Obviously there is a danger zone to the rear..as there is with any recoil-less gun or rocket launcher...But these guys (in the show) were allowed to fire from a bunker anyway. Sort out the Wusses and the Reckless...Change the rules such that the team Leader has to stand to the immediate side of the breech..and the rest of the team have to straddle the barrel at the moment of firing. (Er..Count me out of that US Team!!) teenut R Oppenhmr wrote: > > What did you guys think about the floating breech idea? I know it is popular > in many miltary cannons and is used to increase accuracy by reducing recoil. > However, for a competition like on TV, I think you are losing too much energy > by moving the breech rearward. > > If it was my deal I would have used a small bore long barrel cordite fired > cylinder with more attention to keeping the barrel firmly attached to the > frame. > > Anybody have other ideas? > > David ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Plastic Mouse Mods From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 07 Jan 2000 03:39:36 GMT -------- I have the same problem..big hands (size 16 ring) Have you tried a touch pad? I have used a Cirque PowerCat for the last two years...Personally, I find it FAR easier, faster and more sensitive than any mouse or ball type pointer. The worst device I ever tried was the IBM "Eraser Head"...POS if ever!! teenut Gerald Miller wrote: > > Personally, I would look into the application of 1/4" foam or some such. I > still use the first mouse I bought - a Logitech "MouseMan." I looked around > the store and found a mouse that felt right. Junior son (resident guru) > hates it, cause his hands are smaller than mine, but OTOH he will not use or > recommend any other brand. Meanwhile SWMBO has forbidden me from relocating > this mouse to my playroom for use anywhere other than her bridge connection. > :-)} > -- > > Gerry > London, Canada > > Tony Jeffree wrote in message > news:3874a4db.8422925@news.u-net.com... > > On Thu, 6 Jan 2000 08:13:39 -0500, "Marshall Pharoah" > > wrote: > > > > >Can one of you plastic gurus help me out? I have very large hands and > just gripping a mouse causes pain after a while. Is there > > >some form of malleable plastic that I can mold onto the mouse to make it > wider and maybe taller. I figure most of the pain comes > > >from the mouse being so small, my hand is all bent up trying to hold it. > I've got a couple of old rodents I can experiment with. > > >I've thought of machining a shell to go over it but it looks a little > complicated. > > > > > >Thanks > > > > > >-- > > >Marshall > > > > > > > > > > > > > You might find it better in the long run to go for one of the > > trackballs rather than modifying the rodents. My Logitech Trackman > > Marble is very comfortable to use - you don't need to grip the thing > > at all. Worth taking a look at one at your local PC store. > > > > > > Regards, > > Tony > > > > Website: http://www.jeffree.u-net.com/ > > When replying, delete "X." from the Email address to remove anti-SPAM > measures. > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: a puzzle in the latest HSM From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 07 Jan 2000 03:45:46 GMT -------- The secret is in the differential gear! Variable braking on one pinion gear or the other determines rotational speed and forward or reverse. teenut Larry Ruebush wrote: > > Grain combines,used on farms used this type of transmission for speed > control since back in the 50's. One pulley was connected to a speed control > lever and the other pulley had big springs in it to keep it tight. > Larry > wrote in message news:853aj0$ls3$1@nnrp1.deja.com... > > In article <3874A1B8.7E5D8A79@halcyon.com>, > > Grant Erwin wrote: > > > > > Only thing is, (here you have to read it, sorry) I always thought the > > > variable speed pulley like he uses needs variable distances between > > > shafts, ... > > > > Apparently not. My understanding of this is that the sheaves > > are two-piece, and the one that controls the variation has the > > distance between the two halfs set by the speed control knob. > > I think in a setup like his, the other sheave is spring loaded, > > and will set its width and tension the belt automatically. > > > > Jim > > > > > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Radiant heating lines in concrete From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 07 Jan 2000 03:48:38 GMT -------- Damp down the floor, turn on the heating and watch for the dry stripes. teenut (Kinda the reverse for the old trick with a fat lady..Roll in flour and look for the damp spot!!) "Robert M. Koffsky" wrote: > > Just moved into a new shop with radiant heating in the concrete floor. The > radiant heating tubing is plastic and a couple of inches below the surface. > Problem: How do I locate the tubing before I drill for machine mounting > bolts ? Most of my equipment sits on adjustable mounts but an arbor press > and sheet metal brake have to be bolted down or I wind up with them on my > lap as I sit down hard on the floor. Any suggestions? > Many thanks, > > Bob Koffsky > Hopewell Junction, NY ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Ebay sniping... From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 07 Jan 2000 06:01:15 GMT -------- I think you misinterpreted my position on Ebay...Read it again and engage brain before putting mouth in gear!! teenut Jon Petrzelka wrote: > > Its an adult sport, if you can't stand the heat get out of the sun and quit > crying, EBAY is great fun!!!!!!! > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > Naw..too rich for my blood! Just wanted to keep track of prices for future > > reference. > > > > I like to open up the didding with a minimum bid..as you say, it helps to keep > > track of the item, and is easy to get back to by any number of means. > > > > Second screen, last second bidding, is Post Graduate Ebay stuff..so is "Killer > > Bidding"..but I will let you find out about that stuff for yourselves..Hey, I > > love you guys..but Ebay is a Jungle. No Pity...No Prisoners...Kill the > > Wounded...Eat the Dead. > > > > (Kinda like Rugby, Huh!) > > > > teenut > > > > Russ Kepler wrote: > > I see others do it as well (hey > > > Bastow - didn't you want those bore mics?) and likely for similar > > > reasons. > > > > > > -- > > > Russ Kepler russ@kepler-eng.com > > > > > > Please Don't Feed the Engineers ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Al Babin comes through! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 07 Jan 2000 06:07:48 GMT -------- Many poster's (usually non purchasers from Al) have criticized his auctions etc. It is only fair therefor, to give Kudos when due. My last purchase, an engraver's ball vise, came within days of me sending the money, well packaged..better than most, and was as good, if not better than described. That's all I ever ask. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Ebay sniping... From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 07 Jan 2000 07:44:45 GMT -------- And what if I think the jungle of ebay is fun too? teenut Jon Petrzelka wrote: > > I meant exactly what I said, I dont agree with you is that OK? > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > I think you misinterpreted my position on Ebay...Read it again and engage brain > > before putting mouth in gear!! > > > > teenut > > > > Jon Petrzelka wrote: > > > > > > Its an adult sport, if you can't stand the heat get out of the sun and quit > > > crying, EBAY is great fun!!!!!!! > > > > > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > > > > Naw..too rich for my blood! Just wanted to keep track of prices for future > > > > reference. > > > > > > > > I like to open up the didding with a minimum bid..as you say, it helps to keep > > > > track of the item, and is easy to get back to by any number of means. > > > > > > > > Second screen, last second bidding, is Post Graduate Ebay stuff..so is "Killer > > > > Bidding"..but I will let you find out about that stuff for yourselves..Hey, I > > > > love you guys..but Ebay is a Jungle. No Pity...No Prisoners...Kill the > > > > Wounded...Eat the Dead. > > > > > > > > (Kinda like Rugby, Huh!) > > > > > > > > teenut > > > > > > > > Russ Kepler wrote: > > > > I see others do it as well (hey > > > > > Bastow - didn't you want those bore mics?) and likely for similar > > > > > reasons. > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > Russ Kepler russ@kepler-eng.com > > > > > > > > > > Please Don't Feed the Engineers ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Cutting stainless bolts rather than plating mild steel for Vintage motorcycle restoration From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 07 Jan 2000 07:47:05 GMT -------- I used to be a regular at the Bellevue Speedway in Manchester, England. I don't know if it is still open. teenut Jack Erbes wrote: > > Brian Evans wrote: > > > Brian (who wonders if anyone remembers JAP...) > > > > JAP stood for J. A. Prestwich as I recall. I first saw one of those > engines as a kid in Japan (1950 +/-) at a speedway motorcycle race. My > father would not allow my brother or I to use the word "Jap" as a term > of reference for the Japanese people and we were wondering why they had > put it on a motorcycle engine. He told us that it was an English engine > and what it stood for. I also remember him and another American > discussing the history of the engine and wondering how it got to Japan > and when. > > In later years the Czech Jawa single became the most widely used > engine. Not sure how that goes now. Great lovely beasts, total loss > oiling, no frills, and just lovely to listen to and fun to watch. If > you have never seen world class Speedway racing you have not seen one of > the most truly thrilling forms of racing in the world. > > -- > Jack in Sonoma, CA, USA (jack@vom.com) ======== Newsgroups: sci.engr,sci.engr.manufacturing,rec.crafts.metalworking,alt.hvac,alt.internet.appliances Subject: Re: HONEYWELL 7-Day Prog. Thermostat w/Remotes at ebay auction From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 07 Jan 2000 07:58:07 GMT -------- I agree..terrible item to put on there. No one in their right mind would bid on it. Probably junk anyway. I wouldn't trust anyone named "Dan" under any circumstances. My advice is to stay well clear!! teenut AllTemp wrote: > > Ebay for a thermostat..... Whats next ? > > Dan Bollinger wrote: > > > HONEYWELL 7-Day Heat/Cool Programmable T7300 Thermostat with Q7300B Sub-base > > > > and T7047G Remote Space Sensors. For Commercial or Residential > > Heat-Off-Cool-Auto use. Can be used for other systems by changing the > > sub-base. For systems with one or two 24V transformers. Battery Back-up. > > Removed from 8 month service in new building when HVAC was restructured by > > owner's request. Like new, in perfect working condition when removed. > > Includes Instruction Manuals. Remote Sensors let you average between two > > areas. > > > > See it at: http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=232375715 > > -- > MDamron,AllTemp Heating & Cooling > http://www.alltemphvac.net > Visit our questions and answers bulletin board ... > ( HVAC Q & A ) http://www.alltemphvac.net/board > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Junkyard Wars From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 07 Jan 2000 09:05:50 GMT -------- I have heard the term "Kissing the gunner's daughter" before..never really knew what it meant. I assumed it was a punishment involving being strapped ove a gun barrel for a switching..applied to the young "Powder Monkeys" as opposed to the flogging given to older members of the crew while lashed to a grating. teenut Michael Mandaville wrote: > > Robert, interestingly, this form of behavior was evidently ordered as a form of > punishment in the British Navy in an earlier day. They called it "kissing the > gunner's daughter", and it is depicted in the most recent version of "Mutiny on > the Bounty", which is the reason that I know about it (I am assuming that this > detail is authentic--I know that keelhauling was authentic, so it certainly > does seem reasonable to expect that it was, if you see what I mean). I wish > that I could remember the name of the very-well-known British actor who played > the part of Captain Bligh in this version, but I have trouble remembering > names. > > >Robert Bastow <"teenut" > > > ...straddle the barrel at the moment of firing... > > Michael > > visit yahoo club "model ic engines", an excellent resource for designers, > builders and maintainers of model internal combustion engines. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Junkyard Wars From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 07 Jan 2000 09:28:00 GMT -------- See this reference: http://home.freeuk.com/mkb/tv-fiilm/defiant/defiant.htm teenut Robert Bastow wrote: > > I have heard the term "Kissing the gunner's daughter" before..never really knew > what it meant. I assumed it was a punishment involving being strapped ove a gun > barrel for a switching..applied to the young "Powder Monkeys" as opposed to the > flogging given to older members of the crew while lashed to a grating. > > teenut > > Michael Mandaville wrote: > > > > Robert, interestingly, this form of behavior was evidently ordered as a form of > > punishment in the British Navy in an earlier day. They called it "kissing the > > gunner's daughter", and it is depicted in the most recent version of "Mutiny on > > the Bounty", which is the reason that I know about it (I am assuming that this > > detail is authentic--I know that keelhauling was authentic, so it certainly > > does seem reasonable to expect that it was, if you see what I mean). I wish > > that I could remember the name of the very-well-known British actor who played > > the part of Captain Bligh in this version, but I have trouble remembering > > names. > > > > >Robert Bastow <"teenut" > > > > > ...straddle the barrel at the moment of firing... > > > > Michael > > > > visit yahoo club "model ic engines", an excellent resource for designers, > > builders and maintainers of model internal combustion engines. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: dropped my southbend lathe. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 07 Jan 2000 16:22:14 GMT -------- First thing an apprentice machinist, blacksmith, butcher and woodworker learns..Never try to catch anything you drop!!! This is so ingrained in me that I have instinctively stepped back without trying to catch the family heirloom crystal goblets..Yes it does have a downside!! 8^( teenut George Erhart wrote: > > I "once" grabbed a falling soldering iron ... you know that > there is some kind of law or rule that you will never get > the handle! Amazingly, my fingerprints all came back! > > "Nigel Eaton" wrote in message > news:8y94UIAY8Nd4Iw9l@rcav8r.demon.co.uk... > > It's *really* hard to overcome that 'gotta save it!' instinct. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Junkyard Wars From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 07 Jan 2000 16:29:23 GMT -------- Nigel Eaton wrote: RCM "Scrap Bashers" will be an International team..by definition!! I propose Nigel as the "HNWIC Accomodations"..then we can all stay at his place while we are over there! Thanks Nigel, we will of course come loaded with duty free goodies! teenut > > Need a local? I'm up for it! > > Cheers > > Nigel > -- > "The Mome Rath hasn't been born that could out-grabe me!". > ------------ > Nigel Eaton ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 1x42 sander From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 07 Jan 2000 16:59:05 GMT -------- I have a 2 x 72" Burr King with Knifemakers attachment that is probably the most used machine in my shop..amazing what you can do with one!! The price of the Burr King has gone up out of the roof..Close to 2 grand now..you won't be seeing mine on the s/h market till I'm dead! However there are other machines that are cheaper and, some say, better. The Bader Mk II would be my choice if I were to buy another one. But these machines are so easy to make that I wouldn't bother. Several of the Knifemaker's suppliers will sell you a kit to make your own for half the price of a store bought'n one. Ore for half the price again..you can buy the essential bits like contact wheels, bearings etc., and build your own. I figure I could buld a better machine than my Burr King for $200 to $300..depending on how much scrounging I was prepared to do. 1 1/2 to 2 HP is a must to get full benefit..these suckers can shift metal faster than a milling machine! Variable speed drive opens up a whole new world! Low speed polishing etc. Why 2 x 72 ? Any thing you can do on a smaller machine..you can do on the big ones. I split belts down as narrow as 1/4" for some purposes. The 2 x 72 belts come in a HUGE variety..and are outright cheaper to buy than smaller ones (I pay about $3.50 a belt for Klingspore and 3M quality when I buy in bulk at a Knife Show) Yes you do need access to the contact wheel surface for some operations..mainly Hogging off metal (belt runs cooler) or for hollow grinding..which, in blade making, surprisingly, is a LOT easier to do well than flat grinding!! Hollow ground blades are a bit passe' nowadays..the sign of an expert is an immaculately hand finished, flat ground, blade! Try Texas Knifemaker's Supplies, Jantz Supply in OK, Sheffield Knifemaker's Supply, Al the Knifemaker's Friend etc. Pick up a copy of Knives Illustrated or Blade Magazine for current addresses and articles on using and building these machines. teenut "Fitch R. Williams" wrote: > > David Gissen wrote: > > >Do you know of anyone who makes a good quality 1x42 belt sander? > > I have the same question. I know the Burr King is great, probably the > Hardinge of belt sanders, but its also over a grand new, I've never seen > one for sale used, and I'm not going to spend that much for a home shop > belt sander. I do want one that takes the standard 1 x 42 belt - have an > off size Delta disc sander that I have a heck of a time finding discs for. > That sort of leaves out the little ones in Home Depot, etc. > > Wilton makes one for about $250.00. Any body seen, touched, used that one? > It has a disc I don't need. Another company makes one that apparently they > attach to a normal motor and sell. > > I always worry about the alignment of the belt and being able to use it > with out the belt flying off all the time. > > Is access to the "contact" wheel important on these belt sanders? > > Fitch > In So. Cal. > > The FAQ for RCM is: http://w3.uwyo.edu/~metal > Metal Web News at http://www.mindspring.com/~wgray1/ > The "Drop Box" is at http://www.metalworking.com/ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Al Babin comes through! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 07 Jan 2000 17:07:50 GMT -------- I ALWAYS contact the vendor first! I ask for confirmation of total price plus their address for payment. Give my shipping addr3ess and preference..usually USPS Priority..and say thankyou. I usually get a reply back and the MO on it's way within 48 hours. With Al..I phone him!! It works better for him..we chat..I get unlisted deals..That Engraver's vise was pulled from the auction before anyone else had time to bid on it!! Vendors can and most often, will do that, if you email or phone and ask what the bottom line is! But you have to do that before anyone else has chance to bid! I know, it's not fair. 8^( 8^) teenut Robert Lorenz wrote: > > Glad you got your vise, I am still waiting for an indicator I was high bidder on at > the end of Nov.'99 Al, said it should have gone out last week???? I have purchased > items from him before, I may in the future, but he is exasperatingly SLOW to ship. > I send him money orders promptly after the auction. > Hoping to see the indicator soon > Bob L. > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > Many poster's (usually non purchasers from Al) have criticized his auctions etc. > > > > It is only fair therefor, to give Kudos when due. > > > > My last purchase, an engraver's ball vise, came within days of me sending the > > money, well packaged..better than most, and was as good, if not better than > > described. > > > > That's all I ever ask. > > > > teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Al Babin comes through! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 07 Jan 2000 17:22:56 GMT -------- The Verb is scrimshanding, The Artist is a scrimshander. No I can't..Yet!! I'll let you know when I can! It is something I have always admired and yearned to do..So I decided to give it a shot. I am not an "Artist" by any means..don't expect much in the way of original design..the sign of a true Artist Engraver. But I can copy..Most do. Transferring designs to metal is a snip when you know how..And I sure as hell can cut to a line with any tool God or Man invented! When you break them down..most engraving designs..particularly the English Scroll I admire most..is pretty simple and repetitive. I have examined minutely the work of top engravers and surprisingly, in detail, it ain't THAT precise! The eye takes in the overall effect and light glinting on cut facets..but there is plenty of room to hide the odd "bobble" or two. I don't particularly like the deep, heavy, chased Germanic and the ornate Italian and French styles..and I wouldn't be seen DEAD with an Inlaid Gold Elephant or quail on one of my guns!! My needs are simple! So..We shall see what we shall see! teenut rich williams wrote: > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> > > wrote in message ... > >My last purchase, an engraver's ball > vise, came within days of me sending the > >money, well packaged..better than most, > and was as good, if not better than > >described. > > > >That's all I ever ask. > > > >teenut > > Robert: > > What type of engraving are you doing? > If you can engrave, you can scrimshaw > (can scrimshaw be a verb?) :-) > > Rich Williams ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Alternative to E-Bay From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 07 Jan 2000 17:28:09 GMT -------- James Quick wrote: > > Any body that signs up that wants to use me as a referral in the "win a > Gerstner toolbox contest" can contact me for my user name. > > Not affiliated with Reliable in any way. > > Jim Except you get the chance to win a SECOND tool chest for a referral! ;^) Hey, Guys..It's a good site...I just "won" my first auction there..Please, PRETTY please, tell the I set you. Huh! (Cheesy grin) teenut (They will know who you mean!!) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Custom and Specialty Gears and Gear-Related Website From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 07 Jan 2000 17:30:35 GMT -------- So noted and Bookmarked. thanks, teenut StateToolGear wrote: > > Announcing a new website for a company "geared up" to meet all your gearing > and gear-related needs...http://www.statetoolgear.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Shot peening/sand blasting castings From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 07 Jan 2000 17:34:17 GMT -------- Get as much done with files, emory cloth, dremel tool etc as you can. Then Glass bead blast gently..it will peen metal over to fill scratches etc...Rather than simply cutting it off!! At very least it will show up areas that need extra attention with the hand tools. teenut Misty & Sean Foley wrote: > > Hello all! > > I'm having trouble deciding how to clean up an aluminum pattern for an > engine cylinder. The cylinder is air cooled so there are fins everywhere. I > have filed the pattern to remove all the nasty bits left from casting, but I > now have to polish all very smooth so that the pattern will draw from the > sand for subsequent iron castings. > > I am toying with the idea of either sand blasting or shot peening (fine > grit, lowish pressure) in order to remove the file marks and leave a smooth > enough finish for use as a foundry pattern. > > Anyone ever tried to polish nooks and crannys this way? > > Thanks in advance...........Tinker > > P.S. I don't know if I would fly over to England to take part in Junkyard > wars, but I sure would love to have a similarly stocked junk yard around my > house! (complete with Myford) :o) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Myford Super 7 - Center From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 07 Jan 2000 17:38:10 GMT -------- The Super Seven Has a self ejecting tailstock..provided the tang of your center is long enough. The ML7 has a through bore and you need to use a knockout rod with it. The advantage of the through bore is that it allows long leangths to protrude through it..hand for long threads or can be bushed as a steady. teenut jaw@magnet.at wrote: > > How do I get an MK 2 center out of the spindle after turning between > centers? > Is there lathe spindles for the Super 7, that has a thread on the left > hand end? - so one could press the center out. > > Ciao ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: a puzzle in the latest HSM From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 07 Jan 2000 17:44:16 GMT -------- The Chines invented it a couple of thousand years ago and used it in there "South facing carriage" teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > > My understanding of the differential was it was invented by a > mathematician (french, maybe?) around 1700, and no practical use > for a long, long time. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Ebay sniping... From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 08 Jan 2000 02:21:59 GMT -------- I resemble that remark too...And I resembled it long before you did Spehro..So Butt out!! ;^) teenut Spehro Pefhany wrote: > > The renowned kenneth knaell wrote: > > > We need more pugnaciousness in this world. Not meanness but pugnaciousness. > > Nonsense! ;-) > > -- > =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= > Spehro Pefhany "The Journey is the reward" > speff@interlog.com > Fax:(905) 271-9838 (small micro system devt hw/sw + mfg) > =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: mill/drill indicator From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 08 Jan 2000 02:32:32 GMT -------- Sheesh Guys!! Cigarette paper and a dowel work better than that and have done for over a hundred years. You can take this "Rocket Science" to the point of diminishing return ..real quick you know!! No offense meant..but focus your obvious talents, in a more productive direction please. teenut Dan Clingman wrote: > > One idea I though about is to use a piezo patch/speaker on the spindle > and a sensor piezo the vice/table. High frequency sound does not carry > very far so one could possibly use the end mill or drill for the > indicator. It might even work when the tool was moving. By high > frequency I thinking about a couple of mhz. > > Dan Clingman > > Ted Edwards wrote: > > > > Jack Erbes wrote: > > > > > How much do I need to allow typically for the gap that exists when the > > > current from the AAA battery jumps across to the material? > > > > Forget it. The breakdown voltage for air in normal conditions is about > > 30,000 volts per centimeter or inch - I forget which.so for 1.5 volts > > that's 0.00005" (50 microinches. > > > > > Is it more accurate when the contact tip is polarized negative or > > > positive? > > > > While there is some theoretical difference, depending on the curvature > > of the surfaces, it won't matter. > > > > Ted ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 1/4-20 vs. 1/4-28 From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 08 Jan 2000 02:33:09 GMT -------- Why not? teenut Mike Graham wrote: > > On Sat, 08 Jan 2000 00:31:53 GMT, Hoyt McKagen wrote: > > >Finer threads mean stronger fasteners. QED. > > True, stronger fasteners, but not *necessarily* a stronger connection. > > -- > -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- > Mike Graham | Metalworker by trade > mikegraham at sprint dot ca | Rancher by choice > Caledon, Ontario, Canada | Weird by nature > -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: how do they make oil grooves in bushings??? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 08 Jan 2000 02:41:28 GMT -------- There is a strongly advocated theory that a circumferential oil groove destroys the oil "Wedge" effect that plain bearings depend upon. I support this theory and haven't used or spec'ed a grooved bearing in many years. Never had a problem! teenut Fdmorrison wrote: > > >"fred veenschoten" fred-toni@mindspring.com > > >we do this [X-pattern bearing grooving] for axle bearing for live steam and > just do it by hand with a die > >grinder and suitable cutter. > > One of the simplest forms I've seen is in a Sloan & Chase instrument maker's > lathe that I'm rebuilding (re-hashing is more like it; wasn't much left when it > got to me). > > It has solid (not split) steel bearings in the headstock. (I know that they > are steel because the company was featured in a repro article from a circa 1900 > ed. of Machinery that I obtained from Lindsay.) > > There's a small hole at the top of the middle of the bearing, and along it from > front to back runs only one shallow vee cut, made apparently by hand with a > triangular file. That's it. This in an instrument maker's lathe. > > Frank Morrison > > Frank Morrison ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Al Babin comes through! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 08 Jan 2000 02:42:25 GMT -------- More for me! teenut Kevin Pinkerton wrote: > > I am very happy for you Teenut. However, I will never test the waters > will old Al again. > > Kevin > > On Fri, 07 Jan 2000 06:07:48 GMT, Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ > hotmail.com> wrote: > > >Many poster's (usually non purchasers from Al) have criticized his auctions etc. > > > >It is only fair therefor, to give Kudos when due. > > > >My last purchase, an engraver's ball vise, came within days of me sending the > >money, well packaged..better than most, and was as good, if not better than > >described. > > > >That's all I ever ask. > > > >teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Alternative to E-Bay From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 08 Jan 2000 02:43:35 GMT -------- Hmmm! teenut Mark wrote: > > Yes, I purchased a hardness tester a couple of days ago.... I am concerned > that the same company that is selling most of the items is also running the > auction. While I have gotten many items from Reliable Tools, and the > service has been excellent (one bad item in the lot, and they took care of > it right away), the potential for conflict of interest is high. Since they > are in the tool business, selling their own tools on their own auction site, > the opportunities for "hanky panky" are large. Fr'instance, they can see at > any time what your max proxy bid is, and run the price up to just under it, > with no other bidders participating. There are other advantages as well.... > It make me a little nervous. I got the hardness tester for what I was > willing to pay, but just barely. There were no other bidders except at the > last two minutes, where it went from $750 to $2000.... and that was one > bidder. hmmm...... My max was $2150..... hmmm.... I hope I'm wrong about > this. > > Regards, > Mark > > James Quick wrote in message <3875DE64.78EEE5B8@mninter.net>... > >It looks like there is a new, alternative, online auction forum. Seems > >to have been started by Reliable End Mill. > > > >Go to: > >http://www.reliableiam.com/ > > > >Right now most (all) of the items are listed by Reliable, But they seem > >to all be things that most of us would be interested in. > > > >Any body that signs up that wants to use me as a referral in the "win a > >Gerstner toolbox contest" can contact me for my user name. > > > >Not affiliated with Reliable in any way. > > > >Jim > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Tip tinning From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 08 Jan 2000 02:47:49 GMT -------- kenneth knaell wrote: > More than I started out to say. But no more than needed to be said..And covered it perfectly! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Help Required From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 08 Jan 2000 02:53:51 GMT -------- Whatever gave you the idea that anyone here can actually READ!! ;^) "National Geographic", "Smithsonian", "Hustler" and "The Hog Farmer's and Caller's Digest"! teenut MSBbald wrote: > > Hi everyone > I have had a look at the newsgroup, and am fascinated. I would like to know a > bit more about the publications that you read-magazines etc. Would you be so > kind as to offer some advice in this area. > Kind Regards > Mark ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: mill/drill indicator From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 08 Jan 2000 03:15:13 GMT -------- No offense taken Jack..except at the "Bob"..that isn't my name! And yes, part of the problem is that a lot of this scientific obfuscation IS over my head..if only because I choose not to stick it up into such a rarified atmosphere! 8^) teenut (Or "Robert"..I was "Bob" for too many years. Trust me, you never want to meet "Bob Bastow"!) Jack Erbes wrote: > Bob, this must be over your head. No offense meant... > > -- > Jack in Sonoma, CA, USA (jack@vom.com) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Twin Cities Shows? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 08 Jan 2000 17:06:28 GMT -------- Excellent Idea. We have a small, informal, group in Atlanta that meets monthly at the home/shop of each member in turn. Bit of show and tell/shoot the breeze/swap ideas and sources/twiddle the handles/etc. Pop and cookies to finish by about 10-30pm Any readers interested in joining in (no membership, no fees,) please contact me and I will give you details. teenut James Quick wrote: > > Since there is not a lot a Model engineering type shows in the twin > cities area, except for the train shows that happen every couple of > weeks this time of year, maybe a bunch of us Home shop metalworking > people that live in the twin cities area could informally get together > and network. I am thinking maybe shoot the breeze, show off small > projects, swap ideas, etc. I personally would enjoy a tour of the Kurt > Vise factory (which is here!!), maybe field trips to other machine tool > related types of establishments, trips to a foundry to see how its done > on a large scale, etc. I think many companies might be receptive to a > little show and tell for a group of knowledgeable metalworkers. > Thinking initial meeting could happen at one of the local library > community rooms or similar. Maybe even a "tour the other guys shop" > although mine certainly isn't anything special. > Email off line if interested and in the Twin Cities > > Jim > Minnetonka, Mn > > Larry Sleznikow wrote: > > > Anyone know of any machine tool, model,etc shows in the Twin Cities > > area this winter. I need a break. Thanks, Larry ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: how do they make oil grooves in bushings??? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 08 Jan 2000 17:14:46 GMT -------- An axial groove, to distribute oil evenly across the width of the bearing is acceptable. PROVIDED that it is in the correct position relative to the major load. By "circumferential" I meant the "figure 8" type of groove found in older bearings. As an apprentice I put in hundreds, nay Thousands, of these. We had a special machine to do it. teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article , > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > > There is a strongly advocated theory that a circumferential oil groove > > destroys > > the oil "Wedge" effect that plain bearings depend upon. > > I doubt that anyone uses (or used) a cicumferential groove, you > probably meant an axial one, like Al Morrison was talking about - > supposedly even a *single* groove across one surface of one bearing > half will indeed tend to break down the wedge, even if it is put > in the correct location with respect to the applied load on the > bearing. Which is why, as you commented, they are tending to > go out of favor. > > Interestingly, the old Star lathe I own has the exact same bearing > groove geometry as the one Al mentioned, and it also seems to have > been formed after the bearing was cast and fitted to the machine and > spindle, with a file. > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Two-thirds of an anvil... From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 08 Jan 2000 17:40:53 GMT -------- Tom Stovall wrote: (Clip exellent stuff about anvils) > >Are there better tests? > > I dunno about better, but no field test is faster than checking the > rebound of a hammer face from an anvil face. When I went to choose my anvil..or when visiting an auction etc., I carry a one inch diameter steel bearing ball. Dropped from 18" on to the anvil face, it SHOULD rebound all the way almost to your hand. "Ringing" an anvil is *usually* a good field test..but not 100% effective. The ear pearcing ring of a good anvil can be damped enormously by the mounting conditions and the stand. In fact, in use it is essential the at least some of the ring is damped..or you will suffer hearing damage!! Mine rings like a bell when free standing yet is well muted when dogged to its tree stump stand. There is one, well known, make of first class anvils (May be Peter Wright???) that don't ring at all. Just a dull "thunk" like a HF cast iron boat anchor. Yet they will bounce a ball or hammer head as high as the best. Don't pass up on a Peter Wright under any circumstances..along with "Mousehole" anvils they are the BEST. (I believe there is one running on Ebay as we speak..) 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Flame cutting question? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 08 Jan 2000 17:50:30 GMT -------- Wire cut EDM will leave a parallel kerf only a few thou wide and can be held to VERY tight tolerances. Any conducting material can be cut..even hardened tool steel or cardide. Contact your nearest Tool and Die Shop. teenut craig barnshaw wrote: > > Flame cutting removes approx. 2/3 mm. Laser cutting slightly less. > Plasma cutting will give you a tappered cut. > > Rick Maston wrote in message > news:AIyd4.1578$Mp.4043@newsfeed.slurp.net... > > Can anyone tell me how much material flame cutting removes? I want to make > a > > 1/2" thick steel plug. I'm going to use two plugs to sandwich a piece of > > 1/16" thick stainless flat bar for a cookie cutter to cut plastic. Any > > feedback greatly appreciated. Thanks... > > > > -- > > Rick Maston > > RM Specialties > > http://www.canoeoutriggers.com > > > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Off topic and Career as a Machinist From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 08 Jan 2000 18:28:59 GMT -------- mact@door.net wrote: > > How many other people do metalworking as a career as well as a hobby. > > MikeT I served my time as a Machinist/tool maker/Machine Tool Technician almost forty years ago. My career path took me, through Sales Engineering, through 65 countries on four continents, Fetching me up on these welcoming (?) shores almost 25 years ago. In the US and Canada I worked in and around the Machining/Toolmaking/Special Machine/Automation/Robotics/CNC/ world for many successful years. In that period I started and succesfully ran three different companies, all machining related. Eventually I burned out..too many 24/7/365 jobs in an extremely competitive and over-populated market segment. The coming of the NAFTA agreement literally wiped out my customer base in Canada..overnight. Within six months, my top ten client companies, with whom I did over 2 million dollars worth of business a year, were GONE!!..where the plants stood were CAR PARKS!! It cost me everything I had including my Home, Marriage, and, for a while, my Kids! Starting over is never easy..But I decided I would do it in a different climate..both for business, and where I would never have to shovel snow again EVER!!! I returned to Atlanta, studied and became a Stock Broker and Financial Adviser. But I payed my way while studying and taking License Exams by working in a machine shop..often doing jobs that I had a Laborer to do when I was an Apprentice. I also delivered Pitza!! The Financial world was good to me..I made more money per month than I ever made in a year as a Metal Worker. A few years left me set for life with ongoing "Residuals"..a few hours a week in my home office, keeps my little Financial "Empire" running (I have about a dozen Full time and Part time Licensed Agents) Meanwhile I remarried, bought a beautiful home, rebuilt my "Perfect" workshop and got my Kids back. I have two Jaguars, lots of friends and an "English" pub within walking distance....Literally "My cup Runneth Over" What is the point of all this? Tomorrow or Monday, providing my Lawyer and Accountant don't unearth anything untoward in their "Due Diligence", I will be buying a working Machine/Tool and Die Shop..ten Employees in about 8000 sq feet. The business is a mess..dirty and with a lot of outdated equipment..but all the same doing over a million a year with a large, diversified client base. I will be "back in harness"..Doing what I love best..Doing what I DO best. Another few years of 12/6 (No I ain't that stupid anymore!!) and then Retirement..Again..Hopefully for the last time. (Yeh..Right!!) So, my Fellow Metal Crunchers and Bashers...Follow your Heart. Do that which you truly enjoy. You may never get rich..But you will always be Happy. Sincerely, teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Welding equipment "tent shows" in the Atlanta area? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 08 Jan 2000 18:31:49 GMT -------- Doug, I am in Atlanta..you are welcome to come try out my new Lincoln 175 if you wish. email me direct. teenut@hotmail.com teenut Doug Warner wrote: > > When I lived in NJ, a dealer in the South Plainfield area (Jersey > Welding") used to run outdoor "shows" under a tent. They had a wide > varietey of equipment set up for demo, with many manufacturer's reps > showing off the gear. > Has anyone seen this type of show in the Atlanta, GA area.. I'm > interested in a TIG outfit, but would like to try my hand at a few > before handing over the cash. > > To reply, please remove one letter from each side of "@" > Spammers are scammers, avoid them! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How to Dog Point a Set Screw? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 08 Jan 2000 18:51:15 GMT -------- I have, over time, made a whole set of split "Collets" for holding screws in the Lathe. I chose 1" as my standard o/d. Part off a slice 1' long, chamfering both edges as you do this. Part off a few extras at the same time. Pop a slice in the 1" collet or three jaw chuck, drill and tap through for the thread size you need. Center pop the position of No 1 jaw..so it will go back with reasonable accuracy. Take it out and split it axially with one cut , using a hack saw, deburr by running the tap through again. Voila! No need to use a backup screw or lock screw. Some I have deeply counter bored from the rear...so I can screw in a headed bolt and be able to part it off to a short leangth. The counter bore for the head ensures that the collet is still long enough for accurate holding. Steel stamp the size on the face for future reference. Eventually you will have enough to make it worth adapting a cigar box to hold them in serried ranks...An interesting project in itself..might be worthwhile setting up and making a full set and box one evening. For the Anal among us..Case Harden and finish with Brownells Oxpho Instant Blue. You have a set to be proud of..Good Gift Idea ! 8^) teenut "Michael P. Henry" wrote: > > How does one dog point a set screw? Fitch has mentioned doing this a couple > of times, but I can't recall seeing a description of the process. > > Seems like one could drill and tap an apprpriate hole in a bit of round > stock, screw in the set screw, back it up with a nut, and then turn the dog > point on the lathe. Is there a better way? > > I need to make a couple of them for the knurled nut on top of the spindle of > a Clausing 8520 mill to keep it from spinning off at random moments. The > screws are 1/4-20 by about 1/4" or 3/8". ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Starrett cleaning From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 08 Jan 2000 19:36:32 GMT -------- First the old salt and vinegar treatment..or I use a spray on rust remover. This is to remove/convert rust in pits and pockets without having to take off too much surface metal. Neutralize, wash, scrub and oil. Leave for a few days to be sure you have stopped all the action. If you have the equipment, and know what you are doing, you could replace this stage with a LIGHT, non abrasive blast with fine glass beads or wanlut shell etc. Fill the engraving, if you wish with black enamel or engraver's wax..try to avoid filling any pits at the same time. Bake the enamel if you prefer. Then use 300 grit wet and dry paper BACKED UP with a length of Cold Rolled Steel so that you don't "roll" edges and the engraving. Maintain even pressure and full length strokes to get an even finish, parallel to the length of the blade. Use kerosine or WD40, liberally, as a lubricant. Finally, take a fresh, dry piece of 400 grit paper, wrap it over the edge of an eraser, or piece of hard rubber. Make ONE, SLOW, HARD STROKE the full length of the piece. No not hesitate or "Bobble" it will stand out like a sore thumb. If you don't get it right..repeat with a FRESH piece of paper. Alternatively, as I do...Use a freshly squared off end of a wide stick of fine Cratex Rubber Abrasive...Wunnerful Stuff!! That will restore it to as close to "new" looking as possible. teenut Hitch wrote: > > I have several older Starrett rules which have taken on an almost black > patina of unknown origin. The grads have become difficult to read. > > Would appreciate any suggestions for restoring the original polished > appearance. TIA > > Bob ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Two-thirds of an anvil... From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 08 Jan 2000 19:50:13 GMT -------- I belive you are right (Wright ?) about the Fisher. Pal'o mine has one, HUGE M/F..about 450lb that came out of a railroad shop. Dull thunk when you try to ring it, but it will bounce a hammer right past your ear (Duck) His was the first experience I had, of using a BIG, first class anvil. My own is an excellent 120lb steel anvil of English manufacture and does a good job for blade forging. However, the 450 pounder allows the same movement of metal, using the same hammer, on a similar billet, with about HALF the number of heats! Metal just seems to turn to putty on its surface. I use his anvil when I need to make a Damascus billet or do some serious welding such as the edge steel into the body steel for a Japanese style blade. teenut Mike Graham wrote: > > On Sat, 08 Jan 2000 17:40:53 GMT, Robert Bastow wrote: > > >There is one, well known, make of first class anvils (May be Peter Wright???) > >that don't ring at all. Just a dull "thunk" like a HF cast iron boat anchor. > >Yet they will bounce a ball or hammer head as high as the best. > > Peter Wright ring like a bell. That's what I have. The anvil that you're > thinking of is a Fisher. So I hear, anyway - never used one. They > apparently don't ring but they are fine anvils. Not as good as Peter > Wright, of course.... 8-) > > -- > -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- > Mike Graham | Metalworker by trade > mikegraham at sprint dot ca | Rancher by choice > Caledon, Ontario, Canada | Weird by nature > -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: mill/drill indicator From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 09 Jan 2000 00:14:53 GMT -------- You are right Jim and Jack...I was out of line I guess I was just a little piqued that all that inventiveness wasn't heading in a perceivably useful direction. I know you don't need me to tell you to ignore me, when I am being an old fart. teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article <4lxd4.578$oH1.7279@news.rdc1.tn.home.com>, > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > > > You can take this "Rocket Science" to the point of > > diminishing return ..real quick you know!! > > > > No offense meant..but focus your obvious talents, in a more productive > > direction please. > > But... but... What if we *want* to be the only ones on our block > with ultrasonic edge finders, or a home-made gas turbine to remove > snow from our parking lots!? > > THis stuff is just too much fun to talk about. We're going to keep > on doing it - could you please go sit in the corner and sulk while > we do so, Mr. B? It won't take long. > > We *all* of us inhabit a technologically rarified region. I > think that 95 percent of the folks in my town get the MEGO factor > engaged when it comes to even mildly technical stuff. And it's > getting worse. Which is why I applaud guys like Mark Kinsler who > tries to re-acquaint folks with tech stuff. > > Even reasonably adept individuals I know cannot figure out how, or > why I generate my own three phase power. Most folks can't figure out > single phase! > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Pulley Explosion - & need Rockwell parts From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 09 Jan 2000 21:44:59 GMT -------- Glad to see you alive and well enough to write this. sincerely teenut R Lamparter wrote: > > I'm lucky to still be alive as I sit here and type my story to all of > you, and pose the question of where to obtain replacement parts for a > Delta Rockwell drill press. > > I had set the belts to the highest speed (inadvertantly - since I was > shooting for 1,000 RPM). The machine made an unusaully loud vibrating > noise, and I was about to shut down, when the pulley over the spindle > exploded, showering metal fragments around the cellar. Fortunately, I > was directly in front of the machine, and the cast iron guard > deflected all of the explosion to the rear and the sides. Yes, the > machine is so old that it has open sides. > > Now the rebuilding begins - if possible. It looks like the only part > that was destroyed was the spindle pulley. I need a parts breakdown, > and a phone number for Milwaukee-Delta-Rockwell. > > The drill press is a bench top model. The emblem on the pulley guard > says Milwaukee-Delta, but the manufacturers plate on the side is > listed as Delta-Rockwell. "DP 220" is in the head casting near the > makers plate. The makers plate lists it as Serial No. 87-9865 > There is no specific mention of a model number. > > The drill press was old when I acquired it about 16-17 years ago, so > of course I have no owners manual. > > TIA > Bob Lamparter ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: mill/drill indicator From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 09 Jan 2000 21:47:33 GMT -------- Don Foreman wrote: > Hey Robert, write us a book with all the stuff you DO know, > willya? Seriously! Maybe, one day...But then I would have to kill you! ;^) > Kurt Vonnegut wrote: "Make no mistake: we're put on earth > to fart around." My kinda guy!! 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: precision assembly oil .. ? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 09 Jan 2000 22:10:56 GMT -------- The "angular contact side" will have a smaller annular gap 'twixt the inner and outer races. There is usually a marking on the faces..but what that is may vary from manufacturer to manufacturer. teenut Grant Erwin wrote: > > Years ago I used to work in a motorcycle shop. The guys there, when doing an > engine rebuild, used a pink-red oil or grease during assembly. I've just torn > down the quill assembly of my surface grinder in preparation for new spindle > bearings, and it looks to me like K.O. Lee used the same stuff. I don't know > what this stuff is, or why it's on there. > > Does anyone know what this stuff is, or where to get some? > > Corollary question: does anyone know where to get Chevron SRI grease? > > Last question: this machine uses angular contact ball bearings made by Fafnir, > in a DB configuration (if you don't know about DB, DT or DF configurations, or > want to know more about bearings in general, see the excellent URL: > http://www.mmsonline.com/articles/hsm9802.html). How do you know which side of > a bearing is which? > > Thanks! > > Grant Erwin > Kirkland, Washington ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: BCA Jig Boring Info U.K. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 09 Jan 2000 23:10:33 GMT -------- Try Tony Griffiths at: Http://lathes.co.uk If he can't help..Gawd knows who can!! teenut Tony wrote: > > I have acquired an oldie but goodie BCA Jig Boring Machine ( Mach3 Serial No > RK544.3E). I am in the process of renovating and need some parts and any > info about this machine. It was originally made by R.E. Godfrey who were at > Redhill aerodrome. They are no longer there. Does anybody know if they still > exist or if parts are available? The machine is being renovated for > historical reasons. Many thanks. > > Tony > > tony@kylkrafts.freeserve.co.uk ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: BCA Jig Boring Info U.K. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 09 Jan 2000 23:12:22 GMT -------- For a picture of this machine try: http://www.lathes.co.uk/bca/index.html teenut Tony wrote: > > I have acquired an oldie but goodie BCA Jig Boring Machine ( Mach3 Serial No > RK544.3E). I am in the process of renovating and need some parts and any > info about this machine. It was originally made by R.E. Godfrey who were at > Redhill aerodrome. They are no longer there. Does anybody know if they still > exist or if parts are available? The machine is being renovated for > historical reasons. Many thanks. > > Tony > > tony@kylkrafts.freeserve.co.uk ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: BCA Jig Boring Info U.K. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 09 Jan 2000 23:15:05 GMT -------- Er! Try http://www.lathes.co.uk Sorry teenut Robert Bastow wrote: > > Try Tony Griffiths at: Http://lathes.co.uk > > If he can't help..Gawd knows who can!! > > teenut > > Tony wrote: > > > > I have acquired an oldie but goodie BCA Jig Boring Machine ( Mach3 Serial No > > RK544.3E). I am in the process of renovating and need some parts and any > > info about this machine. It was originally made by R.E. Godfrey who were at > > Redhill aerodrome. They are no longer there. Does anybody know if they still > > exist or if parts are available? The machine is being renovated for > > historical reasons. Many thanks. > > > > Tony > > > > tony@kylkrafts.freeserve.co.uk ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Thickness Dilemma From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 10 Jan 2000 02:35:29 GMT -------- You will probably be happier with the end result of shimming up a piece of 3/16" Material..I know I would if you were doing it for me! What's a "Grok"? teenut "physical (Droll Troll)" wrote: > > . > > Awl-- > > I need a 2.25" x 8" piece of 6061/3, .235 thick--ie, about 1/64 shy of > 1/4". I can do it two ways: remove .015 from 1/4" material, or shim up > 3/16 material. They make alum sheet in all kinds of thicknesses, so > shim wouldn't be a problem, except I prefer one piece. > I am experimenting with 36 grit belt sanding, just gouging the crap out > of one side, which will be concealed. That area of alum seems to really > load the belt sander (pedestal, 6x48 belt), and slow the process down. > But a bigger motor would seem to make this a quick process. > I sort of read the thread on planing, but did not quite grok the > process or tools for planing. Would this apply to me? Is there a more > expeditious way to do this? Cost, ie, speed, is the primary > consideration, since appearance is not a factor. > TIA. > Kris. ======== Newsgroups: sci.engr.joining.welding,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: PhreNNeTik where are you????? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 10 Jan 2000 02:37:46 GMT -------- Justin Headley wrote: > > sorry guys this is OT but I've been talking to a guy every day for > several weeks, and the i don't see him on at all for 3 weeks. Same thing used to happen to me all the time...with girls! 8^( teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Thickness Dilemma From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 10 Jan 2000 03:36:33 GMT -------- Speed AND accuracy!! teenut "physical (Droll Troll)" wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > You will probably be happier with the end result of shimming up a piece of 3/16" > > Material..I know I would if you were doing it for me! > > Why would that be?? Speed? 2 pieces instead of one?? > > > > What's a "Grok"? > > > Verb: to grok: to kapisch, understand. From "Clockwork Orange". > Proly some slavic derivative. > > What is "SV", that I see in the subject of postings? > > Kris. > > > teenut > > > > "physical (Droll Troll)" wrote: > > > > > > . > > > > > > Awl-- > > > > > > I need a 2.25" x 8" piece of 6061/3, .235 thick--ie, about 1/64 shy of > > > 1/4". I can do it two ways: remove .015 from 1/4" material, or shim up > > > 3/16 material. They make alum sheet in all kinds of thicknesses, so > > > shim wouldn't be a problem, except I prefer one piece. > > > I am experimenting with 36 grit belt sanding, just gouging the crap out > > > of one side, which will be concealed. That area of alum seems to really > > > load the belt sander (pedestal, 6x48 belt), and slow the process down. > > > But a bigger motor would seem to make this a quick process. > > > I sort of read the thread on planing, but did not quite grok the > > > process or tools for planing. Would this apply to me? Is there a more > > > expeditious way to do this? Cost, ie, speed, is the primary > > > consideration, since appearance is not a factor. > > > TIA. > > > Kris. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Off topic and Career as a Machinist From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 10 Jan 2000 06:01:12 GMT -------- Not too late..I haven't signed anything yet! Where in Atlanta are you? teenut JBird943 wrote: > > Heck, teenut, if I had known you were looking for a business, I would sell you > mine. J bird ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: FS: Sebastian 16"x36" Lathe, AZ From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 10 Jan 2000 06:05:42 GMT -------- Maybe he was refering to more modern lathes. I had a couple of Cincinnatti CNC Turning Centers with 65 HP on a 12" chuck. Didn't 'arf shift metal!! teenut Dan Buckman wrote: > > If it's an old lathe that turns 500 rpm max then that is plenty of power, > besides these are not sears hp, I had an old lodge and shipley ,I think they > called it an 18" thou it had a 20" faceplate, motor was 2 hp, could take > almost as heavy a cut as the slightly newer geared head lodge and shipley > (same swing) that ran 7.5 hp. no gearcase to chew up power. > > do they have a standard for measuring swing ? like measure 1" from a line > across the top of the bed > Steve Carlisle ... > > Les, wow I am really surprised that those lathes are underpowered > > that much. > > > > Steve Carlisle > > > > > > On Sun, 09 Jan 2000 16:53:41 GMT, lward2789@my-deja.com wrote: > > > > >In article <3878039d.267979126@news.cr.island.net>, > > > quatsein@island.net (Steve Carlisle) wrote: > > >> I would bet that the motor is more close to 7HP. I have a 15" > > >> Colchester and it runs a 5HP. It could even be a 10HP, as I have > > >> seen some 16" lathes with that size motor. > > >> > > >> Steve Carlisle ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: anyone buy tools from southcoast? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 10 Jan 2000 12:39:19 GMT -------- Hmmm!! I have had several small items from them..no complaint. However, I have had one, long running beef with them. Six or so months ago I "won" a tee slot clamping kit from them..in the smaller 3/8" stud size, for 7/16" tee slots. What arrived was the regular 5/8" stud size ste for Bridgeport size tee slots. Several emails and a phone call later they told me "no problem, here's a return number..send them back and we will ship the correct size and refund the cost of return. This was done three months ago, my first email to them they said "It will be done" Four more emails and I am still waiting. You have reminded me, I am pissed, and will call them today! I will let you know the outcome. teenut Bray Haven wrote: > > Anyone buy tools from Southcoast Intl in CA. Just wondering is there were any > recommendations...one way or the other. > > Thanks, > > Greg Sefton ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Museums of Technology - GA, TN & KY From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 10 Jan 2000 17:28:01 GMT -------- Not a whole heck of a lot in Atlanta..they paved it over!! However, Chattanooga Tenn. REALLY does have a Choo-Choo..a regularly running steam loco and Museum. Close by to Atlanta, You can see "The General"...The original of the real "Great Locomotive Chase" which took part during the Civil War. Enjoy your trip, teenut Bruce Simpson wrote: > > I am currently planning a vacation driving in the SE of the USA from > Atlanta to Chattanooga, Knoxville, Lexington and Nashville and return to > Atlanta. > > It would be appreciated if anyone has any suggestions on museums of > science, technology, agricultural machinery, railways, etc along or near > this route that may be of interest to an overseas visitor interested in > the industrial history of the area. > > Thank you for your assistance. > > Regards, > Bruce Simpson > Perth, Australia > > -----------== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News ==---------- > http://www.newsfeeds.com The Largest Usenet Servers in the World! > ------== Over 73,000 Newsgroups - Including Dedicated Binaries Servers ==----- ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Boxford vs Myford? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 10 Jan 2000 17:33:44 GMT -------- Both great machines with similar capacities. The Myford, in my experience, is a "smoother", more versatile machine, with a vast array of accessories available and lots of support in the way of both the factory and articles etc written about it. Model Engineers had a free choice of both machines for a couple of generations or more and the Myford won hands down in popularity. My choice would be the Myford. fwiw teenut Tony Jeffree wrote: > > Am finally bowing to the inevitable & considering acquiring a larger > lathe (presently only have a Taig). I seem to be homing in on a > choice between Myford ML7/Super7 and a Boxford (UK-built South Bend > 9" clone, for the benefit of the trans-Atlantically challenged); at > the moment Boxford is winning on points, given its more massive > construction & larger swing, yet similar "footprint" to a ML7/Super7 > if I go for one of the "under-drive" versions of the Boxford (AUD, BUD > or CUD). > > Any views out there? (Silly question...;-)). All comments gratefully > received... > > Regards, > Tony > > Website: http://www.jeffree.u-net.com/ > When replying, delete "X." from the Email address to remove anti-SPAM measures. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Sounds good to me... From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 10 Jan 2000 17:59:14 GMT -------- In the small villiage I grew up in, in Yorkshire, we could go on vacation and leave the door unlocked (so the neighbor could feed the cat!) without ever dreaming of "bad consequences" Now, in that same village, my 81 year old Mother is afraid to go out on her own!! Robberies and muggings are frequent event. Here in Dunwoody Ga I feel more secure than at any other place I have been. I try to remember to lock the door as I leave..but I wouldn't sweat if I didn't. The local Police have a constant presence and everyone I know has a gun of some sort. The "perps" tend to leave us alone!! The wife of a fried once sounded off about banning guns at a dinner party. I offered to make her a sign for her front yard that read "This is a Gun Free Home"...End of discussion!! Just up the road from here is Kennesaw Ga, which in the early 80's made National Headlines by passing a local ordinance REQUIRING that every Homeowner keep a firearm on his property (after suitable training)...Screams of protest and anguish from the anti gunners to no avail. That law still stands. The Fact is, that Kennesaw has the LOWEST incidence of crimes against person and property of any community in the Metero Atlanta region. In almost twenty years only ONE murder (a local Cop shot with his own gun) Surveys have shown that the "Perps" prefer to find easier pickings!! "An Armed Society is a Polite Society" teenut "Fitch R. Williams" wrote: > > Tom Holt wrote: > > >Basically, in the UK there's very little a burglar/mugger/rapist can > >do to you that wouldn't be preferable to what the State'll do to you > >if you try and resist. > > > >(For the record, I know UK law; I'm a qualified lawyer and was in > >practice until about 5 years ago; since when the law has changed > >further in favor of the criminal as against the householder/victim in > >this respect) > > Gezzuss Tom, its no wonder my ancestors left on leaky boats rather than > stay there! Britain has created a nation of victims ripe for the picking - > just like the do gooders are trying to do here. > > Dang, that sounds just plain awful. You guys need a constitution and bill > of rights in the worst possible way. > > Fitch > In So. Cal. > > The FAQ for RCM is: http://w3.uwyo.edu/~metal > Metal Web News at http://www.mindspring.com/~wgray1/ > The "Drop Box" is at http://www.metalworking.com/ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Snap-rings/Steady rest From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 10 Jan 2000 18:17:45 GMT -------- If you can find one cheap (Ebay?) a large diameter, ball bearing plummer block, makes the basis for a good rolling steady. Those with a long ineer sleeve need only be tapped for four "Cat-head" style setscrews to center and hold the stock (use a bull nosed center while setting it. You may prefer to shrink on a soft steel collar in which to put the screws. Block the bearing up to center height and add a clamp. I have one with a three inch I/d for my 11" lathe. Chuck Andrus wrote: > > Hi folks, > > I've been searching Dejanews the last several days looking for some info.... > and haven't found exactly what I'm looking for. I've got a Jet Bd-920N bench > lathe, and need to cut snap-ring grooves in the ID of the ends of 6061-T6 AL > tubing. The steady rest supplied with the machine will only handle up to > 1.7" stock, and has brass/bronze jaws (scars up the tubing... even at slow > speeds). My best guess..... the path of least resistance would be a > replacement steady-rest with rollers that would handle stock between...... > say 1.5" and 4.25"... or maybe a bit less (I doubt I'll have anything to do > with 4" stock for now). Does anyone know of a source for such an animal for > my machine? If plans are available, I could probably get something made up > locally...... and lastly.... I probably could engineer something to do the > job... with some guidance. > > Alternately.... I suppose there are a myriad of other options for securing > somewhat "Tender" stock for internal operations. Cats-head comes to mind, > but would add a level of complexity, when turning stock anywhere from 1.5" > to 4". Other ideas/suggestions? > > My apologies in advance, if this has been covered recently.... and I missed > it in the archives. My experience has been.... I have few original thoughts > (that is... I know someone has already asked the same question before!!), I > just haven't had any luck searching with keywords. > > Thanks also in advance, > > Chuck > > > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Snap-rings/Steady rest From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 10 Jan 2000 19:44:54 GMT -------- A 'Plummer Block" is a self contained bearing unit..a bearing for a shaft of whatever diameter that is contained in a metal housing, half round , usually, with two mounting feet. Used originally for line shafting. Big ones are expensive to buy new...but keep your eyes open for a cheap one on Ebay or at "Jones the Scrap" teenut "Marvin W. Klotz" wrote: > > On Mon, 10 Jan 2000 18:17:45 GMT, Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > > >If you can find one cheap (Ebay?) a large diameter, ball bearing plummer block, > >makes the basis for a good rolling steady. Those with a long ineer sleeve need > >only be tapped for four "Cat-head" style setscrews to center and hold the stock > >(use a bull nosed center while setting it. You may prefer to shrink on a soft > >steel collar in which to put the screws. > > > >Block the bearing up to center height and add a clamp. I have one with a three > >inch I/d for my 11" lathe. > > > >Chuck Andrus wrote: > >> > >> Hi folks, > >> > >> I've been searching Dejanews the last several days looking for some info.... > >> and haven't found exactly what I'm looking for. I've got a Jet Bd-920N bench > >> lathe, and need to cut snap-ring grooves in the ID of the ends of 6061-T6 AL > >> tubing. The steady rest supplied with the machine will only handle up to > >> 1.7" stock, and has brass/bronze jaws (scars up the tubing... even at slow > >> speeds). My best guess..... the path of least resistance would be a > >> replacement steady-rest with rollers that would handle stock between...... > >> say 1.5" and 4.25"... or maybe a bit less (I doubt I'll have anything to do > >> with 4" stock for now). Does anyone know of a source for such an animal for > >> my machine? If plans are available, I could probably get something made up > >> locally...... and lastly.... I probably could engineer something to do the > >> job... with some guidance. > >> > >> Alternately.... I suppose there are a myriad of other options for securing > >> somewhat "Tender" stock for internal operations. Cats-head comes to mind, > >> but would add a level of complexity, when turning stock anywhere from 1.5" > >> to 4". Other ideas/suggestions? > >> > >> My apologies in advance, if this has been covered recently.... and I missed > >> it in the archives. My experience has been.... I have few original thoughts > >> (that is... I know someone has already asked the same question before!!), I > >> just haven't had any luck searching with keywords. > >> > >> Thanks also in advance, > >> > >> Chuck > >> > >> > >> > >> Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > >> Before you buy. > > Teenut, > > Until you get around to writing that much-anticipated book, could you, for the benefit of > us "napkin scribblers", describe what a *plummer* block is, where typically obtained, and > its original purpose? > > You know, if you compile your correspondence on this ng and edit it, you've got that book > half-written. I don't care what you charge, put me at the top of the list for a signed > copy - remember, no author photo. > > Marv > > Email: mklotz@alum.mit.edu > > Home shop utility freeware page at: > http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hall/4425 ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Q: Camlock specs. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 10 Jan 2000 20:26:11 GMT -------- Remove the backplate (if it is removeable) and make a new one to suit you existing lathe nose. Building your own camlock spindle nose adaptor is a big undertaking..it really needs to be hardened and ground throughout. Add to that the fact that it will STILL have to be made to fit your lathe nose..all it becomes is an added complication AND additional overhang, something you want to avoid!! You should be able to sell the camlock backplate for a good price. teenut Tim Leech wrote: > > I've just come home with a Crawford trugrip 7" collet chuck, it has a > camlock backplate. > I have a couple of choices: > Remove the backplate and machine a new one to fit my (threaded) lathe > spindle > or > Make a camlock adaptor for the lathe spindle nose. > a) is this latter practical? Where do I find Camlock specs.? I've > tried a couple of web searches, with no luck. > > b) Is this particular camlock size a common one? No point making an > adaptor if it isn't. > The large end of the taper is about 3.25 inch, there are six 3/4 inch > pins on about 4.125 inch PCD, the taper is open ended. > > Another question - what sort of range above & below nominal should the > collets be used to cover? There are 30+ imperial collets covering > 1/16 to 2 inch, with steps of 1/32 at the small end up to 1/8 steps > for the >1inch sizes, plus a few useful metric sizes. > > TIA > > Tim > ------------------------------------------------- > Tim Leech > > timleech@dutondok.u-net.com > > Traditional & Modern canal craft repairs > > ------------------------------------------------- ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Sounds good to me... From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2000 00:43:12 GMT -------- Probably not. Aye and there's the Rub. Were it just arms registration..as promised by the Liberals (Commie Socialist, tree hugging, bunny loving pinkoes..Take your pick!!)...Then naturally no harm and alot of good would come from it...Imagine, only "Good Citizens" would have guns and the "Bad Guys" would be denied them. But that ain't the way it works. You know it, I know it and every one with a brain knows that the power that gives, will never stop there. Absolute power corrupts absolutely..sooner rather than later. What honesty this government has, was born in revolution. The imminent threat of revolution is the only thing that preserves what is left of that "Honesty"! teenut tonyp wrote: > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote in part: > > > > "An Armed Society is a Polite Society" > > > > teenut > > Robert, I respect your opinion on all matters, including this one. > So, at the risk of being flamed by half the group, I ask you: > Would a society armed with _registered_ guns be less polite? > > -- Tony Prentakis > Defender of 2nd amendment, non-owner of firearms ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Snap-rings/Steady rest From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2000 00:52:48 GMT -------- You know, Ned, you are right! Pillow Block IS the right name for it! Brain Fart..Dunno WHERE "plummer" block came from! Er! What was I saying? How soon do you need to know? teenut Ned Simmons wrote: > > In article <387a3791.16088334@nntp.ix.netcom.com>, mklotz@alum.mit.edu > says... > > On Mon, 10 Jan 2000 19:44:54 GMT, Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > > > > >A 'Plummer Block" is a self contained bearing unit..a bearing for a shaft of > > >whatever diameter that is contained in a metal housing, half round , usually, > > >with two mounting feet. Used originally for line shafting. Big ones are > > >expensive to buy new...but keep your eyes open for a cheap one on Ebay or at > > >"Jones the Scrap" > > > > > >teenut > > > > > Thanks, I've seen those but never heard a name for them. My Dad had a lineshaft lash-up > > that used them but he always just called them "bearing blocks" or somesuch. > > > > Marv > > > > > > Email: mklotz@alum.mit.edu > > > > Home shop utility freeware page at: > > http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hall/4425 > > > > "Pillow block" is the more common term, at least in this part of the > world. > > Ned Simmons ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Snap-rings/Steady rest From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2000 00:55:07 GMT -------- Huh! That so! Well...From now on it's a "Plummer" Block! 'Cos *I* say so! 8^) teenut "Marvin W. Klotz" wrote: > > On Mon, 10 Jan 2000 16:32:16 -0500, neds@javanet.com (Ned Simmons) wrote: > > >"Pillow block" is the more common term, at least in this part of the > >world. > > > >Ned Simmons > > Yes! Bloody English terminology. Now, if Teenut had just used the *right* term! > Everybody (!) knows what a pillow-block is. > > Marv > > Email: mklotz@alum.mit.edu > > Home shop utility freeware page at: > http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hall/4425 ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Sounds good to me... From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2000 01:00:48 GMT -------- Go figure..or start your own group..then you can monitor and censor it! teenut Tom Seavoy wrote: > > What in the hell does this have to do with rec.crafts. metalworkin? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Sounds good to me... From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2000 01:54:03 GMT -------- I was taking a rather broader, non-partisan view of our "System" of Government and what is left of the Constitutional rights that were fought for in that Revolution. Frankly I wouldn't trust a Republican any further that a Democrat..Unless *I* were the one holding the gun! teenut "Marvin W. Klotz" wrote: > > On Tue, 11 Jan 2000 00:43:12 GMT, Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > > >Probably not. Aye and there's the Rub. Were it just arms registration..as > >promised by the Liberals (Commie Socialist, tree hugging, bunny loving > >pinkoes..Take your pick!!)...Then naturally no harm and alot of good would come > >from it...Imagine, only "Good Citizens" would have guns and the "Bad Guys" would > >be denied them. > > > >But that ain't the way it works. You know it, I know it and every one with a > >brain knows that the power that gives, will never stop there. > > > >Absolute power corrupts absolutely..sooner rather than later. > > > >What honesty this government has, was born in revolution. The imminent threat > >of revolution is the only thing that preserves what is left of that "Honesty"! > > > >teenut > > > >tonyp wrote: > >> > >> Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote in part: > >> > > >> > "An Armed Society is a Polite Society" > >> > > >> > teenut > >> > >> Robert, I respect your opinion on all matters, including this one. > >> So, at the risk of being flamed by half the group, I ask you: > >> Would a society armed with _registered_ guns be less polite? > >> > >> -- Tony Prentakis > >> Defender of 2nd amendment, non-owner of firearms > > Teenut, > > After the Kennedy coverup, Clinton's barefaced lies, the tobacco propaganda, the > guns-cause-crime hysteria, etc., how can you logically use "honesty" and (any, but > specifically, *our*) government in the same sentence? > > Marv > > Email: mklotz@alum.mit.edu > > Home shop utility freeware page at: > http://www.geocities.com/CapeCanaveral/Hall/4425 ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Bryan From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2000 02:58:58 GMT -------- Steve "The Spy" Smith is always sending messages to his Agents. Any increase in frequency will indicate that the revolution is at hand. The Farmer's new drapes are Green. Many Milkmaids make banana Icecream The fish are not flying tonight spymaster Mark wrote: > > Didn't I see this exact same message in the NG quite a few months ago? I'm > sure I did.... > > Mark > > Steve Smith wrote in message <387A1BCF.879CF9F3@kotamicro.com>... > >OOPS! I thought I was sending this elsewhere... > > > >Steve Smith wrote: > > > >> I talked a little to Bryan. He greatly appreciates knowing that there > >> might be a way for him to stay, but doesn't want to pursue the > >> possibility until the need arises. So we leave it where it is. > >> > >> Steve > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: How Old ar YOU?? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2000 13:09:03 GMT -------- Passed on from the Modeleng-List courtesy of Jasper: "Just in case you weren't feeling too old today, this will certainlychange things. Each year the staff at Beloit College in Wisconsin puts together a list to try to give the faculty a sense of the mindset of that year's incoming freshmen. Here is this year's list: --------------------------------------- The people who are starting college this fall across the nation were born in 1982. They have no meaningful recollection of the Reagan Era and might not know he had been ever been shot. They were prepubescent when the Persian Gulf War was waged. Black Monday 1987 is as significant to them as the Great Depression. There has been only one Pope. They were 11 when the Soviet Union broke apart and do not remember the Cold War. They have never feared a nuclear war. They are too young to remember the space shuttle blowing up. Their lifetime has always included AIDS. Bottle caps have always been screw off and plastic. Atari predates them, as do vinyl albums. The expression "you sound like a broken record" means nothing to them. They have never owned a record player. They have likely never played Pac Man and have never heard of Pong. They may have never heard of an 8 track. The compact disc was introduced when they were one year old. As far as they know, stamps have always cost about 33 cents. They have always had an answering machine. Most have never seen a TV set with only 13 channels, nor have they seen a black-and-white TV. They have always had cable. There have always been VCRs, but they have no idea what BETA is. They cannot fathom not having a remote control. They were born the year that the Walkman was introduced by Sony. Roller-skating has always meant inline for them. Jay Leno has always been on the Tonight Show. They have no idea when or why Jordache jeans were cool. Popcorn has always been cooked in the microwave. They have never seen Larry Bird play. They never took a swim and thought about Jaws. The Vietnam War is as ancient history to them as WWI, WWII and the Civil War. They have no idea that Americans were ever held hostage in Iran. They don't know who Mork was or where he was from. They never heard: "Where's the beef?", "I'd walked a mile for a Camel," or "de plane, de plane!" They do not care who shot J.R. and have no idea who J.R. is. The Titanic was found? They thought we always knew where it was. Michael Jackson has always been white. Kansas, Chicago, Boston, America, and Alabama are places, not groups. McDonald's never came in Styrofoam containers. There have always had their MTV. They don't have a clue how to use a typewriter. Do you feel old yet? Pass this on to the other old fogies Metal Content? They probably think a Lathe/Mill always had Serial Port :o) Jasper Fulda, Germany teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Sounds good to me... From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 11 Jan 2000 13:23:39 GMT -------- I honestly believe that the only reason the people still have votes is because they still have guns!! teenut tonyp wrote: > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote in part: > > > > Frankly I wouldn't trust a Republican any further that a > Democrat..Unless *I* > > were the one holding the gun! > > > > teenut > > Most politicians are more afraid of your vote than your gun, Robert :) > > -- Tony P. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How Old ar YOU?? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 12 Jan 2000 00:41:28 GMT -------- The first TV I saw had a four inch screen and had one channel (C1952) I was sixteen before we had more than one channel (3) When I left the UK in 1976 IIRC we had 3 Channels..How many are there now (excluding Satellite TV)? teenut Will Flor wrote: I still wanna know who's seen a TV with only 13 channels, and when that TV > was made. I don't doubt that they existed. > > -Will Flor will@will-flor.spambloque.com > Appropriately adjust my return address to reach me via e-mail. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Trip hammer? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 12 Jan 2000 01:17:50 GMT -------- Don't underestimate the speed of a punch press.."Humming Bird" presses run 600+ strokes per minute!! However, that is not the reason why a punch press makes a poor power hammer. The punch press relies on a "Through stroke" and has no flexible connection from ram to hammer as a power hammer does. Stop a punch press dead..before completing its regulated stroke and you will be sitting with the flywheel in your lap. THAT could spoil your whole day!! However, in this particular application it might just work..Provided that you can accomplish the job in ONE stroke..IE have the die set to the thickness required..the material hot enough, and the press beefy enough, to do the job with ONE hit....a full through stroke. I have hot forged Medieval style broad arrow heads this way..using a 10 ton OBI Bliss and with a three stage die (two heats) You will find a discussion of available air hammers at the "Guru's" Anvilfire page. Any questions you have about power hammers, presses etc including several available build-it-yourself hammers will be answered there. The "Junk Yard Hammer In" of about a year plus ago, was an exersise in building a useable power hammer from junkyard materials. The "Guru's" Hammer (Jock Dempsey) was a very useable bit 'o kit made from a Ford rear axle and differential, a couple of shock absorbers and a scrap cylinder block...Worked like a treat it did, and capable of some really useful work. teenut Steve Smith wrote: > > I've only seen one punch press, but I don't think it would work very good. > You need repeated blows, faster than I picture a punch press working. It will > be excellent practice to do by hand. Use a relatively flat faced hammer, and > be *sure* to dress the face. This means making the face one smooth contour, > no rapid changes in shape. This will go pretty quick with a small side > grinder. You will probably not want a hammer heavier than 2 pounds, unless > your hammer arm gets lots of practice. If your arm, especially your elbow > start feeling really tired, stop. You don't want to get tendonitis (tennis > (blacksmiths) elbow). > > Smoothing the face will help you keep from marking the work. Heat the stuff > up to a nice bright orange and it will work lots easier. Blacksmiths go to > hell for two reasons--beating cold metal, and not charging enough. > > Steve Smith > Loveland, Co. > > Jim O'Neil wrote: > > > Hi There, > > Can anyone tell me if a small punch press (Benchmaster- 4 ton), could be > > used as a trip hammer? > > I'd like to flatten and flare the ends of 3/16" X 3/8" CRS (cherry red of > > course), for a project I'm planning. > > If it can be done, how would I set it up? > > Thanks in advance, > > Jim ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Thickness Dilemma From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 12 Jan 2000 01:35:30 GMT -------- Whatever it takes!! Actually, so long as the planer had the "Umperage" to take it...It probably did less harm to the cutters than a similar sized piece of plywood, particle board, or hickory would have done. teenut..Who currently cuts more aluminum than wood on both table saw and band saw. "Leslie J. Ward" wrote: > Alum. that was a tad to thick. Let me say I do not reccomend this > but I ran it thru my 10" thickness planer ( wood ) a few times and > "wala" much to everyones surprise , a standoff!! I didn't use any > coolant as I was afraid the rollers would slip. > > Aloha, Les ( Any port in a storm ) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Snap-rings/Steady rest From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 12 Jan 2000 01:40:50 GMT -------- I have been racking my brain.."Plummer Block" STILL doesn't sound far out of line. Maybe we used to call the old line bearing blocks by that name. Still digging in ground that has lain fallow for too long!! teenut Ned Simmons wrote: > > In article , Robert Bastow > <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> says... > > You know, Ned, you are right! Pillow Block IS the right name for it! > > > > Brain Fart..Dunno WHERE "plummer" block came from! > > > > Er! > > > > What was I saying? > > > > How soon do you need to know? > > > > teenut > > > > I've heard it, and couldn't think where, and found it in an INA (German) > bearing catalog. Another INA catalog calls them pillow blocks. Perhaps > the first catalog was translated from German into English and the second > into American. > > Ned Simmons ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Found a great QC tool post sale. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 12 Jan 2000 13:34:50 GMT -------- The Aloris/Dorian type of knurling holder IS self centering! Bring it gently into contact with the workpiece and UNLOCK the wedge. Now apply enough pressure to start both wheels running in firm contact and retighten the wedge. The holder cannot be anything BUT on center. For good sharp knurling, cleanliness is more important than Godliness! Start with clean knurls applied about i/3 of their width to the end of the work piece. Apply lots of oil and lots of pressure, until they are cutting FULL DEPTH and any tendency to double track has been overcome. (Any suggestion that a "Special Diameter" is required for knurling is BALONEY!!!!) (and I'll FOIGHT any man that says it isn't so!!) Traverse the tool under full pressure from right to left applying LOTS of oil and constantly brushing with a fine steel wire brush. It may help to have a little "Lead" on the wheels, i.e. Set just a little out of square with the axis..a few thou deeper at the front. For a really "Crisp" job I may then use a small power wire brush in the Fordom or Dremmel to give the Knurling a high polish, clean the wheels again and make a final "Coining" pass, again, with lots of oil. teenut Hugh Strong wrote: > > I wouldn't do that. You can make some truly good knurls > with it, but setting it up is not as easy as it would be > with a self-centering design. > Robert Mitchell wrote in > message news:Ar3e4.2$Ao6.1878@typhoon-la.pbi.net... > > To me, this knurling tool arrangement is pretty bad. > > Has anyone cut off the knurler and just used it as a > toolbit holder? > > > > I hate to be the first cutting up my set... > > > > - Robert Mitchell > > > > "Hugh Strong" wrote in message > > news:859top$ak8$1@nntp9.atl.mindspring.net... > > > > > > Kenneth W. Sterling wrote in message > > > news:ZDkd4.480$Dc3.248174@news.sgi.net... > > > > Ordered and received mine also (AXA).... However, > Fitch, > > > if you're > > > > listening... one of my holders was a KNURLING > > > oolholder - with the wheels. > > > > > > ARGH! That holder is a pain to set on center. Someday > I'll > > > find something better to knurl with! > > > > > > > > > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Class Wars: Making a Living [was Sounds good to me From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 12 Jan 2000 13:43:41 GMT -------- Rubbish Kris!! I have owned and run machine shops and hope to do so again in the near future. For sure, there are occasional delays..a major one might go three weeks or more. But that certainly isn't the NORM in the World in which *I* cut metal. In the Sub-Contract World there isn't, on most jobs, a whole heck of a lot of difference between the capabilities of one shop to another. Service then, becomes the deciding factor for a customer. The only "Customer Loyalty" relies on your last delivery and your next price. Any shop that is CONSISTANTLY late on deliveries would not last long in this EXTREMELY competitive Business. teenut "physical (Droll Troll)" wrote: > Of course, I have never met a machinist who delivers on time! Three > weeks late in machine shop time is actually early. > > Kris. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: dropped my southbend lathe. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 12 Jan 2000 13:54:09 GMT -------- There are exceptions to EVERY rule!!!! ;^) teenut Namnoc wrote: > Did that 2 hours ago with a botle of Scotch and a bare foot in the kitchen. > > I'm pleased to say it hurt like hell, but I still have something to ease the > pain :) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How Old ar YOU?? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 12 Jan 2000 14:02:29 GMT -------- "Leslie J. Ward" wrote: > How about the magnifying glass you sat in front of the t.v. to make it > appear larger, or the colored revolving disc to give it color. > Aloha, Les I watched the Coronation of Elizabeth II on one of those nauseating devices!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Plummer Block Definitive! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 12 Jan 2000 14:33:51 GMT -------- I was finally goaded into reaching up for my Concise Oxford Dictionary.. Plummer-block n,(mech) : Metal Case for supporting revolving shaft, withmoveable cover giving access to bearings. Pillow: no definition given for Pillow Block except..Pillow, shaped block or support. Plummer block is therefore the correct *British* terminology for what the Americans call a Pillow Block. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Vertical Mill From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 12 Jan 2000 21:30:32 GMT -------- Deckel..indeed it is that what which I have FP1 Here are four or five good pics...you can see how versatile it is. http://www.lathes.co.uk/deckel/index.html teenut "Fitch R. Williams" wrote: > > "Kenneth W. Sterling" wrote: > > >I want a floor type machine (not > >bench top or table top). > > Go find a Deckl (sp?) and look at it. There was one for sale near me > recently - Nedra and I couldn't come to terms so I left it there. It was > both horizontal and vertical. It was $2,000. Smaller than a BP, bugger > than a mill drill. Perhaps Robert Bastow who I think has one can > elaborate. From what I understand about it is a very good candidate for > you to hunt for. > > Fitch > In So. Cal. > > The FAQ for RCM is: http://w3.uwyo.edu/~metal > Metal Web News at http://www.mindspring.com/~wgray1/ > The "Drop Box" is at http://www.metalworking.com/ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Vertical Mill From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 12 Jan 2000 21:45:07 GMT -------- In Canada, a "Donnybrook" is a "Punch-up" (English.."Car-park Job") teenut Tim Leech wrote: > > > you will probably have a donnybrook on your > >hands in short order. > > > > > What's a donnybrook? > > The word had a familiar ring, then I realised my recollection of it > is from a narrow gauge railway station in South Africa! > > Cheers > ------------------------------------------------- > Tim Leech > > timleech@dutondok.u-net.com > > Traditional & Modern canal craft repairs > > ------------------------------------------------- ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Journeyman's card still important? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 12 Jan 2000 21:53:00 GMT -------- As they told me, when I started my apprenticeship.."Five years and you'll be a good beginner!!" Boy..Where they ever right! I learn something new EVERY day. teenut Randy Zimmerman wrote: > Actually I > learned just how much I didn't know by the end of my apprenticeship. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Dead Center Lubricant From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 12 Jan 2000 22:00:27 GMT -------- Alden Hackmann wrote: > I have no idea. I am wondering under what circumstances one would want to > use a dead center instead of a live center. I've never used one. Well, for instance if he wanted the work DEAD Concentric..every live center has some runout..however precise or pricey it might be. Or for reasons of clearance..live centers are often a bit bulky or too long. Or if he wanted to use a half center..To machine right to the center. Or if he doesn't have one and can't justify the expense yet..Lotsa things I would buy for a lathe before a live center. There are more..but I will leave some for other readers, to take a kick at your butt! 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Class Wars: Making a Living [was Sounds good to me From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2000 01:32:11 GMT -------- The ideal for any contract shop is to have jobs sent in on an open PO to be billed on a time and cost basis. Without this, every job has to be quoted on a competitive basis..which is fine, so long as you don't hit any unforseen snags. On any kind of development or one off complex device building, there are ALWAYS snags. When that happens the shop eats it! On a big job it can KILL you nnless you can go back to the client and ask for more money The relationship that must be built with a customer to allow that to happen is based on TRUST. Trust is a two way street. If I can finish a job inside the estimate I will pass some of the savings back to the client..With due fanfare of course. But I am building the TRUST that might enable me to recoup unforseen over-runs on the next job. Your NY shops may get away with gouging the customer..but how much repeat business do they expect?? teenut "physical (Droll Troll)" wrote: > > Craig C. wrote: > > > Maybe it's just here in NY, wit dat NY attitude. Maybe God is just mad > at me. I don't know... > > But, this shop you speak of billed you for a lower price than the > quote?? Hell would freeze over before that happened around here. > > Kris. > > > I whole heartedly agree with teenut here. The worst that anyone has > > ever missed a delivery date on anyting that I have had to send out is > > two weeks.....and it was early. > > I gave them a design that they estimated that it would take about 600 > > machine hours and an additional 200 manhours to manufacture. Delivery > > time was estimated as 11 weeks. Got a call 59 calendar day after > > deivery of the design and material to the shop that the part would be > > ready in 3 days. They also beat the estimate on price by a few > > thousand bucks too.... > > > > If a shop can't give me a realistic estimate on delivery, they don't > > get my business. I would rather have them tell me that they can't get > > to the work before a certain date so I can either take the work > > elsewhere or reschedule when I need the part. > > > > I have one shop that I use for just this reason. They aren't always > > the lowest cost, but they do excellent work and are upfron as to when > > they will or can deliver. Fortunately, time is no longer a critical > > item for much of what I do. I am no longer working to a test schedule > > or a delivery commitment, and I enjoy it more. > > > > Craig > > -- ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Dead Center Lubricant From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2000 01:49:56 GMT -------- A classic example of where a dead center is used in preference to a live one, for reasons of precision. I don't recall ever seeing a live center used on a cylindrical grinder. Must get me some of that goop...I have been relying on a blend of tallow and graphite for too long!! Time to get with the program Huh! teenut James P Crombie wrote: > > We use this stuff every day on our cylindrical grinder. Works great and a > tube lasts a long long time. > > Alfred Kimmel wrote: > > > Center-Saver , a tooth paste size tube of greese from Cincinati Milaacron > > sells for about $3 a tube from J&L > > Al Kimmel > > Texas > > > > Jon Griffin wrote: > > > > > It's been a long time since I had to do much turning using a dead > > > center in the tailstock. You know, the non-rotating kind. We used to > > > use "white lead" but that is now a no-no. The last time I had to do > > > it I used STP engine additive as a lubricant. It was so-so at best. > > > > > > What is being used these days? > > > > > > Jon > > > > > > ================================================= > > > Jon Griffin, USN (ret) > > > jgriffin at aracnet dot com > > > ================================================= > > -- > > --------------------------------------------------------------------------- > > James P Crombie > Summerside, Prince Edward Island > Canada > Machinist - Amateur Astronomer - CadCam Guy > > http://www3.islandtelecom.com/~jpcrombie My Astronomy website > http://www3.islandtelecom.com/~jpcrombie/rhino/ My RhinoCad web page > > --------------------------------------------------------------------------- ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Hardinge Cataract headstock flat belt pulley From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2000 01:56:40 GMT -------- Thanks for the tool drool 8^) teenut slindsay@nyx.net wrote: > Fun Old Hardinge Machine tools > http://www.nyx.net/~slindsay/hardinge.html ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Heads up!! Ebay From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2000 02:42:03 GMT -------- Nice 3 in one By EMCO Price is right so far! http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=235557420 fwiw teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Machinist Wages in Boston Area? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2000 03:53:16 GMT -------- Dunno about Boston but in Atlanta he would start at $25.00 per hour. teenut rldjcs@my-deja.com wrote: > > Can anyone give me some recent info. on the going > wages for a very experienced machinist in the > Boston, MA area? A friend of mine may be looking > for a new job soon, and has worked for the same > company for over 12 years, so what life's like "on > the outside" is a little bit of a mystery.... He's > a specialist in the "job shop" environment with > over 20 years of machining experience - > particularly heavy on CNC, etc. "Setup" > experience; has worked on prototypes for just > about every industry you can think of, from high > tech healthcare devices to paintball guns! > Appreciate any info. you can pass along on what to > expect if he goes looking. Thanks! > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How Old ar YOU?? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2000 03:56:54 GMT -------- Dunno how old your body is...But your mind is pre-historic! teenut Pugsley wrote: > > How about when a single parent was a divorcee or widow and not a tramp > that can't > keep her knees together? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Vertical Mill From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2000 04:16:49 GMT -------- It does have a slightly different geometry then the ubiquitous "Knee Mill". The vertical saddle takes care of "Z" and Y" movements, the spindle ram takes care of the "X" and also has a moveable quill on the vertical spindle for sensitive drilling. Variable power feeds are available on Z and Y. The work tables are bolted onto the vertical sadle and can be loosened and slid from left to right without loosing register..thus giving surprisingly more working width than appears at first sight. Two kinds of table are available..the plain table..simply a large, tee-slotted angle plate, or the Universal table which tilts and swivels in both axes. The drive is all geared from a 2 HP 2 speed motor and all the gears are robust, hardened and ground..even at top speed there is little "gear noise" Bearings are my favorite type!!! Tail end of both spindles runs in pre-loaded ABEC 9 angular contact bearings while the front end is a hardened and ground cone running in a bronze bush with forced oil feed. These types of bearings can be readily adjusted (axially) to give virtually zero end and side play. IMHO the very best bearing arrangement for a precision machine tool. BTW The Myford Super 7 is fitted with an identical arangement!! As was my Smart & Brown Toolroom Lathe. One day I plan to chuck out the tapered roller bearings on the front end of my Maximat Super II lathe spindle, and replace them with a similar taper bronze bushing. The rear end already has the required preloaded angular contact bearings and the requisite double nuts to adjust it axially. teenut "Kenneth W. Sterling" wrote: > > Looks like a great machine! Also looks like (and I *really* don't know > squat) its got a "different" table arrangement, almost like one table can > slide up and down on the other? How sturdy is the drive mechanism in the > head? Any way to take up play in bearings, etc? Thanks for info. > Ken > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote in message > news:Yn6f4.3754$G42.70832@news.rdc1.tn.home.com... > > Deckel..indeed it is that what which I have FP1 > > > > Here are four or five good pics...you can see how versatile it is. > > > > http://www.lathes.co.uk/deckel/index.html > > > > teenut > > > > "Fitch R. Williams" wrote: > > > > > > "Kenneth W. Sterling" wrote: > > > > > > >I want a floor type machine (not > > > >bench top or table top). > > > > > > Go find a Deckl (sp?) and look at it. There was one for sale near me > > > recently - Nedra and I couldn't come to terms so I left it there. It > was > > > both horizontal and vertical. It was $2,000. Smaller than a BP, bugger > > > than a mill drill. Perhaps Robert Bastow who I think has one can > > > elaborate. From what I understand about it is a very good candidate for > > > you to hunt for. > > > > > > Fitch > > > In So. Cal. > > > > > > The FAQ for RCM is: http://w3.uwyo.edu/~metal > > > Metal Web News at http://www.mindspring.com/~wgray1/ > > > The "Drop Box" is at http://www.metalworking.com/ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Vertical Mill From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2000 04:18:59 GMT -------- Maybe that is LAGUN!! Nice Heavy Machine..US Built I believe. teenut "Kenneth W. Sterling" wrote: > > Anyone hear of LAGAN? (not Logan) Two HP vertical Mill. > Ken ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Vertical Mill From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2000 04:43:38 GMT -------- That is indeed an excellent price..I paid a bit more than that (Plus nearly as much to ship and install it!!) but it is in pristine condition. Best price I have seen since was $4500 with plain table and 6500 with the universal tilting table (Which mine has) I have located a universal spiraling/dividing attachment, trying to beat the guy down from $6800.00 for it !!! Why the high speed head? Very, VERY expensive if you can even find one. Top speed on the standard head (Horizontal and vertical) is 2000 rev/min I have an water cooled "Precise" jig grinding spindle for mine..Expensive, yes, but not in the $4-5000 range they will ask for the high speed head..and the Precise winds up to 80,000 rev/min!! I know of only one other machine for sale that has both tables..He wouldn't split the plain table out for me..I am sure he wouldn't part the universal table. If you scrounge around at "Evans the Scrap" you might find a large swivel base from say a shaper vise...that could be adapted to give you rotation in one direction at least. Add one of those $75.00 swiveling "Skoda" type tables from MSC or Grizzly and you have your second axis!! I passed on a Slotter head for $900.00 and have been kicking myself ever since..even though it would have had to be shipped from Norway!! Ah well, teenut Mark wrote: > > This is a very fine mill... I have one. The accesories are hard to find, > though. $2000 is an excellent price for one. (It is a toolmaker's mill) If > anyone reading this knows where I can find the tilt table or high speed head > for this, I would love to hear from them. > > Mark > > Fitch R. Williams wrote in message ... > >"Kenneth W. Sterling" wrote: > > > >>I want a floor type machine (not > >>bench top or table top). > > > >Go find a Deckl (sp?) and look at it. There was one for sale near me > >recently - Nedra and I couldn't come to terms so I left it there. It was > >both horizontal and vertical. It was $2,000. Smaller than a BP, bugger > >than a mill drill. Perhaps Robert Bastow who I think has one can > >elaborate. From what I understand about it is a very good candidate for > >you to hunt for. > > > >Fitch > >In So. Cal. > > > >The FAQ for RCM is: http://w3.uwyo.edu/~metal > >Metal Web News at http://www.mindspring.com/~wgray1/ > >The "Drop Box" is at http://www.metalworking.com/ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Vertical Mill From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2000 05:39:17 GMT -------- John Wayne frequently had mass punchups in his movies...all tongue in cheek, and he usually managed to get dinged as hard as the next guy. One of his best was in "The Alamo" My favorite movie "Donnybrook" is in "Seven Brides for Seven Brothers" during the Barn Raising!! Nobody needed Uzis to have fun back then! teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article , > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > > In Canada, a "Donnybrook" is a "Punch-up" (English.."Car-park Job") > > Haven't you folks ever seen _The_Quiet_Man_? > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lathe Tool Setting Level From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2000 05:44:11 GMT -------- Dave Baker wrote: > > I can't see why anyone would want to buy a tool to do a job that turners have > managed to get right by eye for decades. Eyeball works for me..but then I HAVE been doing it for decades!! 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Weiler or Wieler German toolroom lathe? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2000 14:18:17 GMT -------- I know of Weiler lathes...Excellent machines in the Hardinge/Monarch class. Can't help much with specifics though. If it is in good shape and well tooled and the price suits you..go for it! Beware that any parts and tooling will be hard to find and VERY expensive!! If is a plain lathe it won't cut threads, if it needs change gears and doesn't have them a set of metric gears will cost an arm and a leg. A similar Hardinge Cataract bench lathe might run $800 to a LOT more depending on condition and tooling. 8^) teenut teenut Nick Alexander wrote: > > Has anyone heard of a Weiler or Wieler toolroom lathe? It is about a 200mm > swing and 750mm cc. No gearbox, and just a lead screw for sliding and > screwcutting. > > Any info would be appreciated. > > Regards, > Nick Alexander ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: mill holder, SHANK size? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2000 14:25:58 GMT -------- Get 3/8" and 1/2" to start..that will cover 90% of your end milling. 1/4" and 1/8" Next. 1/8" is handy for the cheap solid carbide mills and burrs you find on ebay! 3/4" 3/16" If you can find (and I can't!!) 3MT BLANK arbors, you can make your own weldon holders very cheaply. Blank arbors are supplied with a finished, hardened and ground shank and a soft, unfinished nose that you can machine to suit all kinds of applications. (Who DOES sell them anyone? teenut teenut Loren Coe wrote: > > thanks to all who responded to my last post. now > i am ready to order a couple of holders but hesitate > on what size/s. > > i would rather buy one or two to start, in case > a better deal comes along later on a set. my > Grizzly 3n1 has a 3/4 hp motor, will this dictate > what i should buy? > > i am pretty sure i won't want anything at the > high end for a mt#3, but wonder about the rest. > the bits for the 3/8 size seem to be avail stepped > down, so is a 3/16 unnecessary?. > > my thought is to buy a 3/8, but what should > the 2nd one be? > > thanks again, > > --Loren ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Indoor furnace food for thought From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2000 14:34:31 GMT -------- Hot as HADES!!! The air and combustion gasses, exiting from the mouth of the furnace, are at furnace temperature. Air may be a good insulator..But this is pre-heated air moving upwards by convection. You need a good, heatproof hood and exhaust system and anything flamable..ceiling walls etc well protected with fireproof materials. Apart from that, an indoor furnace of any size (My "Bastow Patented ;^)" Swirl/blown burner, turns out close to 2 Million BTUs!!) will heat the shop up in seconds, suck all the oxygen out of it and rust every tool in there in short order..without proper intake and exhaust arrangements. teenut Bill wrote: > > Here's a question for someone using a gas fired furnace, how hot is the > air above the furnace? Anyone ever measure the air stream? I'd like > to know just what kind of tempuratures I'd be dealing with say, 1ft, > 3ft ,6ft and 8ft above the vent of the furnace. I know I'd be dealing > with extremely high temps in the furnace but how good a conductor of > heat is air? Would the temp drop off quickly from the source or have a > slow ramp down as you get farther away from it. Is the temp related to > how long the furnace is on? Anyone willing to fire up and check it? > > Bill > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Reliable Tool..Monumental Cock-up From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2000 14:45:22 GMT -------- As some are aware..Reliable tool (Who are a GOOD, if not CHEAP supplier) have their own Auction site now. A couple of days ago the sent out a spam message to every past and presumed future customer. I didn't mind it..Useful site. But obviously a lot of people hate smam in any form and get really wadded up about it...Lots of those sent messages in various degrees of tone and language, asking that they be removed from the list. UNFORTUNATELY.....Reliable's server was set to relay every incoming message back out to every-one on the list!!! Talk about a Round-Robin Screw Up. I must have received about 80 messages so far this morning. Some people are so irate and confused they are having flame wars with THEMSELVES!!! I hope Reliable sorts it out quickly..They will have to eat an awful lot of Crow Pie before this one is forgotten. Ain't Science Wonderful!! 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Heads Up Ebay..BA Taps and Dies From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2000 15:11:14 GMT -------- http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=236603849 FWIW teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Class Wars: Making a Living [was Sounds good to me From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2000 15:46:58 GMT -------- mulligan@advinc.com wrote: Exactly, coupled with the ability to "Think outside the Box"..in terms of how best to do the job, without sacrificing quality and a little bit fast/cheaper than the guy down the road! You live or die on your quoting ability..but you have to get the job, and you have to do the job, and you HAVE to make money!! Not a world for the faint of heart!! teenut > I think this probably can make or break a job shop - the ability > to look at prints and estimate the *real* cost of getting it done, > in 5 or 10 minutes. And then fudging the numbers so that a) your > shop gets the job, and b) the finished work's cost is appropriate > for the situation, high, low, or spot on. > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Flood coolant system for HSM? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2000 16:11:37 GMT -------- What kind of cutting oil do you use Fitch? teenut "Fitch R. Williams" wrote: > > "John (EBo) David" wrote: > > > We started out with a 5 gal. plastic bucket and installed the cheapest > >water cooler pump we could find (living in New Mexico just about > >everyone > >uses evaporative coolers). This pump was a semi-submersible (the pump > >housing sits about 6" below the motor an submerges while the motor sits > >above > >the licquid). we drilled several holes near the top of the bucket so > >that we could run the in/out flow lines, and the power cord. We also > >put > >something underneath the pump to raise the bottom of pump inlet so that > >we > >had a simple gravity filter (the chips fell to the bottom and were not > >taken > >back up in the pump). > > What you described is a home made version of what is often sold as a 5 > gallon coolant system. The commercial ones have a very similar looking > pump so you don't have to worry about shutting off the flow. I don't know > about the relative pumping capac=bilities - my cheap chinese one happens to > have a rectangular steel 10 gallon (it is alleged) tank and pumps DORTAN 3 > cutting oil well enough to totally flood the heck out of drilling, > knurling, parting, threading, and power tapping operations on my lathe. > > The tank looked full enough after I poured in 5 gallons of oil so I left it > at that. > > Fitch > In So. Cal. > > The FAQ for RCM is: http://w3.uwyo.edu/~metal > Metal Web News at http://www.mindspring.com/~wgray1/ > The "Drop Box" is at http://www.metalworking.com/ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Boxford vs Myford? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2000 16:39:08 GMT -------- Do that Tony, and I'll never speak to you again!! ;^) teenut Tony Jeffree wrote: > > Hmmm. Perhaps it would be easier to forget the English iron & go for > a new Eastern lathe kit... (just kidding...) > > Regards, > Tony ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OLD timer From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2000 18:12:58 GMT -------- mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > Right. When you turned your headlight 'on' > with a match. > > Jim Unlike Lucas Electrics...Where you lit a match to see if the headlamps were on or off!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Flood coolant system for HSM? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 13 Jan 2000 19:48:44 GMT -------- Don't know a thing about it..I like the idea of a clear cutting oil that lubricates the ways at the same time. As you know..I have no truck with water based coolants in my home shop...I don't even like them in an industrial setting..false economy IMHO. I don't much like "way" oil either..Made my case known on that a long time ago!! ;^) teenut "Fitch R. Williams" wrote: > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > > >What kind of cutting oil do you use Fitch? > > It says DORTAN 3 on the big red plastic 5 gallon bucket. I didn't pick it > out - it picked me out, arrived all by itself in my garage. Peter Nolan > had it as surplus when he changed coolants on his production CNC machine > (thanks Peter). He was kind enough to drop about 15 gallons of cutting oil > off in my garage one day as a gift. 5 gallons of brand new DORTAN 3, 4 > gallons of used DORTAN 3, and 5 gallons of something else I don't remember > at the moment. > > I don't have any references to look it up and find out what it really is. > It works a treat, is clear so I can see to stop when threading, doesn't > smell like anything but oil, lubes the lathe ways big time - they may last > forever - no muss, no fuss, drains to the tank. > > Do you know anything about it? > > Fitch > In So. Cal. > > The FAQ for RCM is: http://w3.uwyo.edu/~metal > Metal Web News at http://www.mindspring.com/~wgray1/ > The "Drop Box" is at http://www.metalworking.com/ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Patina on Copper From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2000 03:06:29 GMT -------- Cat pee!! (Seriously) teenut John Foose wrote: > > Does anyone know of a way (without buying chemicals from the crafts store) > that will help copper turn green real fast? > > John Foose ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: radial arm....surface grinder? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 14 Jan 2000 15:02:59 GMT -------- For the "accuracy" needed for an anvil top this could work well enough. Can you turn the saw head so that the spindle is vertical? If so, a cup wheel, (Of the tough, snagging grinder type!) might give you better, faster and safer results. Keep your head out of the way!! teenut Bray Haven wrote: > > OK, you guys, get out the bics. I need to clean up the face of an old anvil > and no longer have a surface grinder. It's too high (and long) for the small > ones anyway. Anyone ever use a radial arm saw for a noncritical application > like this? Could just move the anvil around on a flat steel sheet after > trueing (more or less). > > Greg Sefton ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Machinist Wages in Boston Area? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2000 00:09:44 GMT -------- Come to Atlanta..Better climate, cheaper living. beautiful women and higher wages!! Did I miss anything?? tenut Peter Drumm wrote: > > I applied at a couple machine shops here last spring, the starting > wage seems to be ~$10/hr, max wage after a few years ~$15. > > In message <387F1707.28540E04@citynet.net> - Fri, 14 Jan 2000 07:31:03 > -0500David Bush writes: > :-> > :->Boy, what a difference area makes. In my area (north central WV) I have around the top wage > :->of only $12 an hour. > :-> > :->tonyp wrote: > :-> > :->> dan wrote > :->> > :->> > we just had a guy leave our shop for more pay...... he was making $25 > :->> > hr. with us. In the Ipswitch area. So I guess we have an opening, if > :->> > he's looking. > :->> > :->> When I saw the previous posts, I thought to myself: > :->> 1) $25/hr sounds low for around here, and > :->> 2) this guy won't be looking for long:) > :->> > :->> -- Tony Prentakis > :-> > :-> > :-> > :->-- > :->-------------------------------------------------------- > :->-Dave > :-> > :->Visit my homeshop at http://members.citynet.net/parmaco/ > :->-------------------------------------------------------- > :-> > :-> > :-> > :-> > :-> -----------== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News ==---------- > :-> http://www.newsfeeds.com The Largest Usenet Servers in the World! > :->------== Over 73,000 Newsgroups - Including Dedicated Binaries Servers ==----- > > Custom machining; Tool & Cutter grinding > Peter Drumm, Wausau WI > > Cyrix6x86/300 MII, OS/2 Warp 4, Linux ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Taper Blanks in UK. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2000 00:16:42 GMT -------- John Stevenson wrote: Welcome back John..we missed you. I don't think I have had chance to properly thank you for the little "Care Package" you so kindly prepared and mailed while you were over here. Just the "Vicar's Nickers" for my purposes, Thank you Sincerely, teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Dividing plates for sale From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2000 00:23:58 GMT -------- Grab it someone!! That is perfect for making a dividing head out of a cheap 5C Spin Indexer. If you need pointers on how to do that..contact me directly and I will send you pictures. teenut John Stevenson wrote: > > Whist diving in the Aladdins cave [ read cupboard under bench ] today > looking for something I came across a set of three diving plates in a > hardwood box with the selector quadrant and arms plus 4 tee bolts. > These are 3 1/2" ish dia with a 32mm hole, 3 csk screw fixing. > Standard B & S hole layout to suit 40:1 head. > These are brand spanking new, never been used. Box is a lovely bit of kit > all finger jointed etc. Thrown in is a small brand new worm and wheel 40:1 > Wheel is Phozzy bronze 2 1/2" dia on a 1/2" steel shaft. Worm is hardened > steel with a thru hole plus drive slot. > Looking 40 quid UK only. > This is a nice piece of plunder, in fact if it don't sell I'm going to > stick it on the mantlepiece instead of the wedding photos's it's that good > to look at. > > Regards, > John Stevenson > Special Purpose Machines > Nottingham, England ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Fun Statistics From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2000 00:32:59 GMT -------- Don't you just love the State of Georgia! "At Will" employment..If I want to fire an employee I just say "Don't let the door hit your butt on the way out Buddy!" No notice or reason required. 8^) If you cap a perp on your property..drag him indoors and give him a knife before the cops arrive. If you don't have a spare gun or knife to "donate" ask the cops..they usually carry a coupla "drops"..They find it saves on paperwork!! 8^) teenut Gary Coffman wrote: In this state, attempting to break > into your house while you're home is sufficient grounds to consider your > life in danger. Some other states are more restrictive. > Gary > Gary Coffman KE4ZV | You make it |mail to ke4zv@bellsouth.net > 534 Shannon Way | We break it | > Lawrenceville, GA | Guaranteed | ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Machinist Wages in Boston Area? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2000 02:01:33 GMT -------- Perhaps you should explain Glenn, (for the benefit of our Bostonian Brothers) that a "Breezy day in March" in Atlanta means temperatures that are bringing out the summer frocks...not a Nor'wester that cuts you in two and promises another three months of woolen undies!!. Spring will start to sprung around here in another couple of weeks! I have yet to put up the roof on the Jag because it was too chilly to drive with it down! In fact the only times it has been up since I bought it is when it goes to the carwash!! After 30+ years in Yorkshire and 12 years in Canada..I think I died and went to heaven!! Oh those Atlanta Girls!!!!!!!!!! 8^) 8^) 8^) 8^) teenut Glenn Ashmore wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > Come to Atlanta..Better climate, cheaper living. beautiful women and higher > > wages!! > > > > Did I miss anything?? > > I don't know about machinist wages but the weather and the women are definitely an advantage. There > just ain't no place like Peachtree Street on a breezy day in late March . > > A favorite pastime at Tech was to hang out at the corner of North and Peachtree and watchin' the > skirts fly. That was long ago but better than Viagra. > > -- > Glenn Ashmore > > I'm building a 45' cutter in strip/composite. Watch my progress (or lack there of) at: > http://www.mindspring.com/~gashmore ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: 'Andy bit 'o kit on Ebay From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2000 02:16:03 GMT -------- http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=237814138 This is a first class milling attachment and could be adapted to fit the back of any lathe to make a far superior 3 in one...Or fitted to a base with an X-Y table to make a small mill. FWIW teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Help My Arm Is wearing out From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2000 05:11:18 GMT -------- What do you consider astronomical? There are several reasonably priced air hammers on the market plus a few Do-it-yourself models you could probably build, with a bit of scrounging, for under $1000.00 How tired is your arm?? teenut Tod Estes wrote: > > Perhaps this is not the right forum, however, does anyone know where to find > a used power hammer for sale. E-bay has had a few for sale. The prices are > astronomical. If I wanted new I would order a nice Kuhn hammer from Centaur > Forge and take out that third mortgage. I would also be living in the forge > shed. I need nothing fancy, or pricey. I can build one myself. Yes I have > seen many plans. I would like to see what the market will provide before > wading in to another project. I am looking for a ram of 50 to 150 lbs. > -- > Time enough for sleep in the grave. > > Tod Estes ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Dividing plates for sale From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2000 05:15:14 GMT -------- Roughly $60.00. Cheap at half the price!! teenut Pat McGuirk wrote: > > How much is 40 quid -US? > Thanks, Pat > > * Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet's Discussion Network * > The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet - Free! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Dividing plates for sale From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2000 17:30:03 GMT -------- No! The expression IS... "Cheap at Half the price"...Meant to be nonsensical, as in..."Never mind the Quality..Feel the Width!!" teenut Jack Erbes wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > Roughly $60.00. Cheap at half the price!! > > > > teenut > > Yeah but will he take half the price? I think the expression is "cheap > at twice the price". :>) > > -- > Jack in Sonoma, CA, USA (jack@vom.com) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Why are they called Gov't Jobs? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2000 17:48:53 GMT -------- "Government Jobs" are so called, because they take Top Priority..Use the best materials and equipment, regardless of expense, and the cost of the outcome is out of all proportion to its true value!! One of the perks of being a machinist!! Or at least, used to be. Most shops have a VERY strict policy against it nowadays..The cost to a company of unbridled "Scotching" can be enormous..as is the Insurance liability. Personally, I like to run a happy shop, and have no objection so long as it is done on "Own Time" and does not tie up machines for their real purpose. "All things within reason" is my motto. In my experience, there are only two kinds of shops..Happy and Miserable..nothing in between. The ambience of the shop is set by the owner and has a direct bearing on productivity, scrap rates, and workforce turnover. You can tell one from the other, the instant you walk in the door..the atmosphere is palpable! I have worked for some really Draconian, Miserable, Pricks in my time...couldn't wait to get out of the shop at the end of the day..But I wouldn't stand in line to p**s on him or his machines if they were on fire!! teenut Bob Chilcoat wrote: > > Leigh/Marmachine wrote in message > news:85p4ja$7gn$1@nnrp1.deja.com... > > In article <38800511.F4FBDF79@onlink.net>, > > dclarke@onlink.net wrote: > > > > > > John Jacobs wrote: > > > > > > > > I always wondered why when you do home projects > > > > at work they are called government jobs? > > > > > I always thought that G-jobs were called such as they were always given > > a high priority though they typically weren't very important. > > -- > I always assumed that they were called Government Jobs because they were > "top secret" and "I can't talk about it." > > Bob (done a few in my time - still can't talk about them) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Galvanized metal From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2000 17:55:43 GMT -------- Galvanised sinks and bath tubs used to be common place. Hot zinc galvanising is one of the best protections for steel..it has a self healing, sacrificial action that actually "heals up" minor scratches and pores. However, if you plan to have a sink fabricated from pre-galvanised stock, be aware that the joints and edges will be unprotected. To gain best benefit from the material the finished sink should be hot dip galvanised after fabrication. Far better and cheaper might be to have it made from stainless steel, by an outfit that specialises in sanitary welding...restaurant, hospital, food industry stuff. teenut Thee Monk wrote: > > Hi. Can someone tell me...will galvanized metal rust? I want to have a > small sink built (custom sized) for my shop and was thinking about > having it made with galvanized steel. Email back or post here, TIA! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: I need some lathe chucking advise From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2000 18:05:40 GMT -------- Interspers soft aluminum or brass strips under the chuck jaws. Better still, as you will have to unscrew the barrel from the reciever, if you hope to do this accurately, grip on the threaded shank of the barrel. At the muzzle end, you should make a centered brass or aluminum plug that is JUST a slip fit into the end of the barrel. If you use your center directly on the muzzle you stand a good chance of damaging the crown and the end of the rifling. The gun will never shoot straight again, until you recrown it!! Be sure your compensator or brake is properly centered and has the correct size hole through it. Importantly, make sure it is the right size!! BATF draws a thin line between what they consider as a compensator and anything that could be construed as adding a supressor (silencer)or flash hider effect. You do NOT want to cross that invisible line!! teenut Fuzzy wrote: > > I want to turn down the muzzel of a finished rifle barrel so > I can thread it and install a compensator. I have a Smithy > 1220XL. > I want to keep the chuck from maring or scratching the > finish. Anyone got any tips? Also I guess I'll use a live > center on the tailstock end unless someone knows a better > way. Thanks ======== Newsgroups: alt.machines.cnc,comp.robotics.misc,rec.crafts.metalworking,sci.engr,sci.engr.manufacturing,sci.engr.mech Subject: Re: Recm for shaft takeup assembly? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 15 Jan 2000 18:25:49 GMT -------- If the foil is being run reel to reel, then a simple, adjustable brake on the supply reel may suffice. I faced a simmilar problem, designing and building high speed, re-reeling machines for Saran wrap. These took the wrap from 18" diameter spools and re-reeled it, measuring ,cutting and restarting etc for the production of 100 ft and 200 ft retail size rolls. When every thing was finally got right and set up right, the new rolls looked like a chrome plated cylinder. Otherwise it was the worst dogs dinner you ever saw. That Saran wrap job contributed a few grey hairs I may say..absolutely preverse stuff to deal with..static was a MAJOR problem. At those surface speeds, (200+ sfm) we were generating MILLIONS of volts of static...six inch sparks..OUCH!!! Happy days! teenut Doug Danielson wrote: > > I am designing a small metal foil coating machine and want to find an off > the shelf shaft bearing/tensioning assembly I can use to keep the foil > tensioned and free of wrinkles. > > The takeup assemblies in my bearing catalogs are way too big and sloppy for > this task. This shaft is about 1 in OD and needs a precise adjustment > mechanism to keep the foil free of wrinkles. > > Can anyone suggest a source? > > Thanks > > Doug Danielson ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: I need some lathe chucking advise From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 16 Jan 2000 03:22:43 GMT -------- Absolutely! teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article , > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > > Interspers soft aluminum or brass strips under the chuck jaws. > > Robert, quick question: would it be acceptable to chuck up a > scrap of brass in this case, and then bore and thread it to > fit the barrel end? > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Bridgeport shaper tooling? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 16 Jan 2000 05:18:20 GMT -------- Go here for an example of a slotting tool. http://www.lathes.co.uk/deckel/page6.html Grind one up from a square HSS tooling bit..remember it is END cutting and tht any cutting tool needs side relief. teenut Peter Reilley wrote: > > After searching for a long time I finally got a shaper attachment > for my Bridgeport mill. It came without any tooling however. > The cutting tool mounting is by way of a 5/8 inch shaft. The > shaft is in line with the oscillating ram. I originally thought that > a 5/8 inch boring bar would be OK. I notice that most boring > bars have the hole for cutting tool is not perpendicular. For > boring on a lathe this is desirable, it lets you cut past the end of > the boring bar. The forces applied by the cutting action are > perpendicular the mounting hole. I am talking tool steel > cutters here, not carbide. > > For my purpose I can see that this might be a problem. Using > standard boring bars with the shaper could cause the cutter > insert to slide due to the force of cutting. What tooling do > you use with the Bridgeport shaper attachment? > > I was thinking that I could get a set of 5/8 inch carbide boring > bars like Cal Aero sells on ebay and grind them to work with > the shaper. The problem with this is that the cutting action > is on the end of the bar not on the side as is intended. Would > doing this knock the carbide loose? These are the braised > carbide type boring bars. > > The guy that I bought the shaping head from also had a cherrying > head for $300. I did not buy it so if anyone is interested I can > forward his phone number. > > Any advice would be greatly appreciated. > Pete. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Plain spindle bearings on lathes From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 16 Jan 2000 20:08:53 GMT -------- It takes a heckuvanexpensive set of rooling bearings to equal the performance of even a simple set of plain bearings. It can be done, it is done, but not with taper roller bearings of the "automotive wheel bearing standard" Rolling bearings also need very special mounting and installation arrangements. In use they require careful adjustment and special attention to lubrication. Personally I prefer WELL DESIGNED plain bearings on a spindle, as I recently described in the thread about the Deckel Mill. This is also the type fitted to the Myford SUPER 7 (NOT the ML7) teenut "Orrin B. Iseminger" wrote: > > Back in the fifties when I was more familiar with South Bend's advertising, I > recall that SB bragged that on a lathe spindle, a plain bearing was superior to > rolling contact bearings. > > I don't know if they were correct, or not, but there is one thing I'll always > remember that suggests they were. One of our belt driven flywheels developed > an interesting wear pattern on the outside surface. As the belt wore the paint > away one could see a bar pattern emerging, sorta like a UPC barcode. The > flywheel was not, in fact, truly round. This was because it was turned on a > lathe with rolling contact bearings. > > Orrin > > In article <388110A1.36958B27@home.com>, sbaer@home.com says... > > > >If a lathe has plain bearings instead of tapered roller bearings, can it > >ever be expected to to accuate work- e.g. holding the diameter of bored > >hole to plus or minus .0005"? I just examined an old lathe that looked > >to be in very good condition for its age. I could not see it under > >power so I but an indicator on the chuck and tried levering the chuck up > >with an 18" prybar. The indicator moved 0.002-.003". Does this mean > >the bearing have to be fixed in some way, or is this because all the oil > >has left spindle bearing? If this lathe had tapered roller bearings, > >could this play be removed by preloading the bearings, or is there > >normally no way to adjust the preload. > > > >stan > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Bridgeport FAQ? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 16 Jan 2000 22:29:02 GMT -------- THE HELL YOU DO!!! teenut John Stevenson wrote: > > On Sun, 16 Jan 2000 11:12:38 -0800, Grant Erwin > wrote: > > >Scott Logan isn't the keeper of the FAQ. He provides disk space for it, and, as > >a longtime > >participant in this circus we call r.c.m., he got tired of pointing people to > >it, so he > >started posting regularly where the FAQ is. > > > >There used to be a guy around named Jim Kirkpatrick or something, he was > >associated with > >the University of Wyoming. He did all the early work on the FAQ, must have put > >hundreds > >of hours into it. What we need is a consensus that we have a FAQ that needs > >maintenance, > >and a new owner, and then that individual should take physical possession of the > >computer > >files and begin doing maintenance while releasing versions for general use. > > > I VOTE TEENUT FOR THIS POSITION ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Plain spindle bearings on lathes From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2000 22:32:47 GMT -------- The Super 7 does have a taper bronze bearing at the front..But IIRC the rear bearing is two opposed angular contact ball bearings fitted in a cylindrical housing, so that they can be adjusted axially by a couple of fine threaded collars. This axial movement is what allows the clearance to be set so finely in the front bearing. This is the same arrangement that I was delighted to find on both spindles of the Deckel Mill. teenut Clare@snyder.on.ca wrote: > Myford Super 7 has tapered front and plain rear bronze bearings. > I had to adjust mine - too tight they get hot, too loose they are > inacurate. Set properly they are beautiful. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Thanks folks! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 17 Jan 2000 22:36:19 GMT -------- Does that mean I am perfectly safe cutting my expensive vodka with anti-freeze for a cheap drunk???? MILLER TIME!!! teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > (Brad Heuver) wrote: > > > Back in High School Chemistry, we learned that the andidote for > > ethelyene glycol is ethyl alcohol, hence, the teacher recommended that > > you give vodka to the victim. For some reason, that has always stayed > > with me. > > Like may grandma used to say, "I'll drink to that!" > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Heads up From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2000 01:24:54 GMT -------- Though it doesn't say so....this is a Boring AND Facing head!! http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=239697001 I bought an identical one recently..nice bit 'o kit. FWIW teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: off topic - but we are sweltering down here From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2000 03:31:08 GMT -------- A bit of "Old Carpet" is probably what Dave got this weekend! "WUFF" ;^) teenut Mark Kinsler wrote: > > >But hey - I got a shag this weekend :) > > Say what? > > M Kinsler > > in Appalachia, where shag means an old kind of carpeting. > > -- > ............................................................................ > 114 Columbia Ave. Athens, Ohio USA 45701 voice740.594.3737 fax740.592.3059 > Home of the "How Things Work" engineering program for adults and kids. > See http://www.frognet.net/~kinsler ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Heads up..Myford Lathe From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2000 03:44:16 GMT -------- On Ebay... http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=239697001 FWIW teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Heads up..Myford Lathe From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2000 06:00:40 GMT -------- Yeh! Sorry about that...My copy/paste dropped the hook. Screw it..find the Myford yourselves!! (Rasp) teenut "Fitch R. Williams" wrote: > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > > >On Ebay... > > > >http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=239697001 > > > >FWIW > > Boy, that Myford sure looks like a Chandler boring head! > > Fitch"must need some sleep"Williams > In So. Cal. > > The FAQ for RCM is: http://w3.uwyo.edu/~metal > Metal Web News at http://www.mindspring.com/~wgray1/ > The "Drop Box" is at http://www.metalworking.com/ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: War Production Board - Linear Programming From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2000 06:04:30 GMT -------- I believe that's how Boxford came to be making the Southbend copy..probably Hercus in OZ too. A LOT of the equipment I served my time on, had the "War Finish" tags on them. Now you get the same finish from China!! teenut Wayne Cook wrote: > > On Tue, 18 Jan 2000 02:26:11 GMT, jenkind@ncfreedom.net (larry) wrote: > > > > >i been told that the board would direct a manf. to allow other > >companies to produce their products. > >the example i know of was a radial drill, they allowed three companies > >to prduce them, but not current model drill, only the old model drill > >press > >the present owner called fo info. and was told this. > >one of the companies was a comerical washing machine manf. > > > > > > > This did happen. We have a D+M Economy lathe at work with the > sticker. It's a exact copy of a Rockwell Economy lathe. The story of > it goes that Rockwell couldn't build them fast enough so the board > gave the patterns to D+M for them to build. > > Wayne Cook > Shamrock TX ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: off topic - but we are sweltering down here From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2000 06:08:41 GMT -------- I still think it was a "Bit of old Rug" he laid! teenut Kathy and Erich Coiner wrote: > > Think "The spy who shagged me" > Doing the horizontal bop. > Doing the wild thing. > > Erich > > Mark Kinsler wrote in message ... > >>But hey - I got a shag this weekend :) > > > >Say what? > > > >M Kinsler > > > >in Appalachia, where shag means an old kind of carpeting. > > > > > > > >-- > >........................................................................... > . > >114 Columbia Ave. Athens, Ohio USA 45701 voice740.594.3737 fax740.592.3059 > >Home of the "How Things Work" engineering program for adults and kids. > >See http://www.frognet.net/~kinsler ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: off topic - but we are sweltering down here From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2000 06:18:53 GMT -------- As the official Bi-Linguist here, (32 years in the UK..almost the same in the States...Yorkshire Born and married to a Steel Magnolia from Birmingham, Alabama!!!) perhaps I should explain.... In America, "Shagging" is dancing!..."Doin' the Shag" In the UK it is Fornicating..getting "shagged" is getting laid!! "An Old Rug" is a lady of far more winters than summers..who lies down readily. Perhaps the "Neigborhood Bike" (Ridden by all comers) I was surprised that the PC's didn't cotton to the real meaning of "The Spy Who Shagged Me"...It didn't refer to dancing!! Oh the Humanity of it!! teenut "John (EBo) David" wrote: > > Mark Kinsler wrote: > > > > >But hey - I got a shag this weekend :) > > > > Say what? ... in Appalachia, where shag means > > an old kind of carpeting. > > Hmmm... I've never been to England, but I think the > translation is roughly: getting some, a congigul visit, > the horizontal bop, getting laid, dance between the sheets, > > possibly also: muff diviging, dining at the Y, moon pie, > 69. But I am still frying to figure out what George > Carlen (sp?) ment by a "mongolian cluster f***". If anyone > can explain thaone email me in private please ;-) > > ie. I think the poster was refering to having sex. > > But I must say that the analogy to old shag carpeting, > and carpet burns, has been known to still hold true in > some instances 8-) > > >>> Just for the record it was a VERY pleasant 72F here in > >>> the Houston area and itwill probably be that way for a > >>> long while. Of course we have had no rain for nearly > >>> two months...but that's another story > > Yea, and now tell him about the Houston late summers... > Didn't it get on the upwards of 105 last summer with a > relative humidity in the mid 90's? I grew up in the > desert and still go out for walks when it hits 105 and > no measurable humidity... When the wind picks up you can > feel it suck the moisture right out of your skin... > It feel like having your face masaged with tiny needles. > The only other time I've felt something similar was when > I moved to Miniappolis Minasota in the dead of winter. > Boy was clueless! The wind can freeze the water in the > the outer layers of skin and feel much the same. > > EBo -- ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Plain spindle bearings on lathes From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2000 09:00:17 GMT -------- Niether! Hardend steel mandrel running in Bronze Bushing (Or hardened steel, or cast iron in some cases) pablo wrote: > > B plain bearing are u refering to poured babbit, or ball? > > * Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet's Discussion Network * > The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet - Free! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Plain spindle bearings on lathes From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2000 09:04:11 GMT -------- No! Blame it on the fact that rolling bearings are cheaper to make and fit than a properly designed plain bearing. Blame it on a market place that has been "Brainwashed" by advertisements, into thinking that roller bearings must be better. teenut tmartin@xtra.co.nz wrote: > > Blame it on carbide tooling. > Fdmorrison wrote: > > Various tapered solid bearing designs were used until well into the 20th > > century. Sometimes the spindle had an involute or a "Schiele" curve. > > > > It is surprising that these designs--at least with the apparent advantage of > > the take-up feature--don't seem to have generally survived. > > > > Frank Morrison ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: DRO - Newall vs Anilam From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2000 09:10:47 GMT -------- I like the Newall system..its steel balls in a steel tube strike me as being damn near bullet proof. I see a lot of Anilams (in commercial shops) that quit working (just about to buy a couple of screwed up Anilams..whole other story) I will be using Newall when the time comes..OBTW I have never seen them priced competitively with Anilams..where did you find them? teenut Paul Carre wrote: > > Anyone out there got any views on the Newall or Anilam DRO systems. Am > fitting a 3 axis DRO to my new mill and both these systems are on > offer. > > Price for each is similar but the Newall appear to have a different > transducer system. > > Paul... ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: knife mail list has been censored From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2000 09:20:09 GMT -------- "Moderated"..just another word for censored!!!! The Rec.guns list is moderated. Problem is, with the volume, it takes a day or so for messages to filter through. Any continuity and spontaneity is totally lost. What you get is just a babble of disjointed statements that usually degenerate to the "Mine is bigger than yours" level in short order. Yech!! May the God Lord and the First Amendment save us from having to call upon the Second Amendment to preserve our Freedoms!! Rant Mode Off!! teenut "Terry L. Ridder" wrote: > > hello; > > over the weekend the knife-list hosted at > knife-list@swcp.com was moved to a new home > > the one change that was made was to a moderated > forum instead of an open forum. > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: off topic - but we are sweltering down here From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 18 Jan 2000 09:25:11 GMT -------- We all have our pecadillos Gunner...Don't ask me about mine and I won't ask about yours! ;^) teenut Gunner wrote: > > Is that like shagging baseballs in the back yard? > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: knife mail list has been censored From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 19 Jan 2000 04:54:51 GMT -------- Pretty well the reply I would have expected!! teenut "Terry L. Ridder" wrote: > > hello; > > the first amendment guarantees that the government will not > censor your "free of speech" it says nothing about a list > mom "censoring" as you call it a mailing list. > > if you wish to have an unmoderated knife list, start one. > www.onelist.com is one place that you could use to host > the list. there are others. > > there is nothing to stop you from starting your own mailing > list which you may run nearly anyway you want. > > On Tue, 18 Jan 2000, Robert Bastow wrote: > > > "Moderated"..just another word for censored!!!! > > > > > > > teenut > > > > "Terry L. Ridder" wrote: > > > > > > hello; > > > > > > over the weekend the knife-list hosted at > > > knife-list@swcp.com was moved to a new home > > > > > > the one change that was made was to a moderated > > > forum instead of an open forum. > > > > > > > -- > Terry L. Ridder > Blue Danube Software (Blaue Donau Software) > "We do not write software, we compose it." > > 22,000 days, 22,000 days it's not a lot > It's all you got 22,000 days > 22,000 nights, 22,000 nights it's all you know > So start the show and this time > feel the flow and get it right > ==== 22,000 Days == Moody Blues ==== ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: COLLETS - confused newbie From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 19 Jan 2000 05:10:05 GMT -------- Excellent write up Boris..pretty well covered it. The Jacobs Rubberflex collets are excellent for use on the lathe..a full set covers 1/16" to 1 3/8"...tend to cost $200+ for the two boxes that make a full set. (BTW I have a Rubberflex chuck available cheap ($50.00) to first bidder. It is a D1-3 fitting and NO it cannot easily be adabted to a different fitting..it is solid, hardened steel. Works well but could use new thrust balls..No collets with it) I have in the past, used IIRC Brown and Sharpe #00 collets on a small lathe. These are available CHEAP as they were designed for turret lathes. They are a push in type and it is easy to make a spindle nos adaptor. At one time I had a full set of imperial and metric plus "Number" sizes in rounds, also squares and hex. Max size about 3/4" teenut boris beizer wrote: > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "Susan Hill" > Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking > Sent: Monday, January 17, 2000 6:09 PM > Subject: COLLETS - confused newbie > > > I am confused by the various collet sets around and am unable to > distinguish > > between them. Is there somewhere I can go for a quick education on > collets > > and collet chucks. I have a 9" South Bend with only a 7/8" or so hole > thro > > the headstock - but both a 3 and 4 jaw chuck and a plain SB slotted > backing > > plate. I was hoping to get some HEX collets to fit at LOW cost in the > range > > 1/4 - 13/16" to match hex stainless and MS bar. > > > > I have been offered a 3MT set which I presume requires a #3 morse taper > > somewhere. I have also seen the Jacobs Rubberflex sets - and Hardinge > > collet sets - on eBay - but have no idea if these can be used. Any > > guidance would be appreciated. > > Okay, here goes a quick collet education for a 9" SB -- I can do it because > somehow or another I seem to have accumulated every damned collet option > there is -- or at least it seems that way. > > 1. The spindle taper of the 9" SB is a #3 Morse taper. Remember that. > > 2. #2 and #3 Morse taper collets are available, but you don't want to do > that. The maximum size for a #3 is 3/4" and a #2 is a1/2". Morse collets > are available, but even on the used market they go for a premium. Expect to > pay $10 each used in good condition and about $26 new. Also, I have never > seen them available by 32nds, never mind by 64ths and forget about hex. The > biggest disadvantage of the Morse taper collet, however, is that the drawbar > is not hollow -- it is a 3/8 x 16 screw. That means you can't get anything > longer than an inch or so into the collet. Often, that obviates the main > reason you were using collets in the first place. > If I were offered a #3 Morse collet set I would not buy it unless is > was outrageously cheap and the collets were in excellent condition. This is > not very likely because these collets were most probably used on a > Bridgeport milling machine where abuse and/or high wear is likely. For > example, if some offered me a set by 1/16ths for $50 or less -- mainly > because of the inability to put anything through the spindle. I have a #2 > set for my rotary table-- there, the inability to put something clear > through the collet is not serious. > > 3. The "native" or "standard" collet for the SB and similar spindles is the > 3C collet. These have a range of up to 1/2", are available by 64ths, > square and hex readily available, both on the new and used market. The > collet set up, excluding the collets consists of three pieces: (1) A nose > piece which has a #3 Morse taper on the outside and a taper to match the > collet on the inside. (2) a hollow drawbar which threads to the outside of > the collet to draw it in. (3) a spindle protector cap -- this last is not > absolutely essential but often you have to use that as an adjustment to get > the collet to tighten properly. Uses prices vary all over the lot. I've > paid as little as $1.00 and as much as $10 each -- they are in heavy demand > by hobbyists. New prices range between $25/collet to $35. > > 4. There is a relatively rare kind of collet set-up that takes larger > collets and that fits on the spindle nose. ( I'll get to the modern option > in 5 below, guys; so read before you flame). One popular one was made by > Speedy Chuck (now defunct) and used Bren collets. There is no drawbar, so > you get to use the full 3/4" spindle diameter. This unit screws on to the > spindle nose. To put change collets you have to remove the unit and put the > new collet in from the back of the unit -- pain in the ass, which is why I > am getting a (5) below. A similar collet setup was made by Sjogren > (expensive) and is occassionally seen, very expensive. I have also seen > various other front-mount collet set ups for the 1.5 x8 spindle lathes. > Usually expensive and usually impossible to find collets for. I have a full > set of these Bren collets by 32/nds. I have never seen them by 64ths, hex, > or square. The maximum diameter is 3/4 -- so you won't make that 13/16ths > either. There are also several of these types available in the UK for the > 9" SB -- known over there as a "Boxford." I don't know UK prices for these > units or for the collets. > > 5. The current best solution (in my not so humble opinion) is the Bison 5C > collet chuck being offered in two versions from $250 for the simple one, or > $350 for the adjust-through version. This takes popular 5C collets. It > will give you a range from 1/16 to 1-1/8 by 64ths. Square, hex, expanding, > machineable, etc. all readily available. These collets are among the > currently most popular and are available new from a low $5/collet for decent > Chinese collets on sale to $35/collet for high precision jobs. Used market > is all over the lot -- I haven't seen lower than $3/collet and not higher > than $12/collet. > > 6. Jacobs Rubberflex sets -- very nice collets, but I believe that these > are used mainly on tapping machines and screw machines -- I have never seen > a collet adapater for these collets that would fit a 9" SB. Maybe someone > else has. > > 7. Hardinge collet sets Hardinge sets the quality and (upper) price > standards for collets http://www.hardinge.com/ [Royal is another good name > for pricey precision collets.] . Furthermore, there isn't a collet that you > might want that Hardinge don't make. I was missing one of my Bren collets > 13/32nds and checked out the Hardinge price about 8 years ago - $350 per > collet. Most of their collets, in popular sizes, are much cheaper -- e.g., > $30 to $40 collet. Probably everybody in the NG lusts over a set of > Hardinge's in pristine shape for their lathe -- wow -- 5c's by 64ths in > round, hex, and square -- wouldn't that be a kicker. I'd put them in a > glass case on display and charge $1 to look at them -- maybe $2 because I'd > have to install windshield wipers on the case to take care of the copious > drools you guys would leave on the glass. > > 8. The easiest way to get an education is to get a big machine supply > catalog and go through the collet section. MSC is the biggest, Grand Tool > has a wider range of collets. You don't want to confuse the collet > manufacturer with the collet type. Common types are : 3C, 3AT (another > alternative for a 9" SB, but more expensive and rarer), 4C (all but > obsolete, replaced by 5C). R8, #9B&S, #7B&S, #2 Morse, #3 Morse -- all > mostly for milling machines. > > Boris > > ------------------------------------- > Boris Beizer Ph.D. Seminars and Consulting > 1232 Glenbrook Road on Software Testing and > Huntingdon Valley, PA 19006 Quality Assurance > > TEL: 215-572-5580 > FAX: 215-886-0144 > Email direct: bbeizer@sprintmail.com > Email (Forwarded): bbeizer@acm.org, bbeizer@ieee.org > ------------------------------------------ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Bronze working question. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 19 Jan 2000 05:27:33 GMT -------- Certainly it could be cast nowadays..any number of Bell or Art Foundries could handle it. Bronze castings for propellers and valve bodies are made that would dwarf this one. So far as Antiquity is concerned, I would be comfortable with the belief that, certainly the Chinese, were capable of such objets, and no reason why other cultures may not have had similar capabilities. The "Art" of copper and bronze founding seems to have been independently discovered (and sometimes lost again) by a number of different Civilisations through history. teenut Padraic Brown wrote: > > I've been reading Herodotus's "Histories", which mention a large votive bowl made > of bronze with 4in thick walls and a capacity of over 5000 gallons. > > I figure that this is about 670cu ft. Could such a monstrous thing be cast now? > Would it be beyond the capabilities of 2500 years ago? > > Padraic. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Progress on shop purchase From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 19 Jan 2000 05:55:10 GMT -------- All the pieces were put in place today for me to go forward with my purchase of the Tool and Die Shop. Final contracts should be signed by weekend!! First thing will be to clean up and clean out!! (Well first thing AFTER starting the building of a $65,000.00 special machine I got the PO for yesterday!!) Close to 7000 square feet and I think 3000 of it is buried with accumulated "Treasures" dating back to and including the tooling and samples of fins made for bombs droped on RNVN!! Motors, Die sets, Hydraulic cylinders, Band saws...I think these people were Magpies!! Any one want a couple of Bridgeports...they will be out the door in a couple of months!! Make way for some "Imports"!!! How about a ten ton punch press that only needs a motor? PLEASE don't contact me yet..I need time to sort it all out..but there is going to be a "Yard Sale" in Atlanta that might be worth buying air tickets to!! ;^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Progress on shop purchase From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 19 Jan 2000 11:57:35 GMT -------- One that punches a series of nail/screw holes into aluminum extrusions 96" (2438mm) long...Just a long "C" frame with a lot of hydraulic cylinders and punches. Variable programed patterns and lots of interlocks clamps etc. "Money for old rope" job!! teenut Ole-Hjalmar Kristensen wrote: > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> writes: > > > First thing will be to clean up and clean out!! (Well first thing AFTER starting > > the building of a $65,000.00 special machine I got the PO for yesterday!!) > > > > Now I'm curious. What kind of machine are you building? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Progress on shop purchase From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 19 Jan 2000 19:33:01 GMT -------- I dunno..these old buggers blend in well with the background!! I AM keeping the Hurco CNC VMC, the large sinker EDM and the CNC Wirecut EDM plus the new Vectrax mill!!! teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > Didn't the contract include the 'broom clean and vacant' clause? > I don't think that one could sweep the place and miss a bridgeport! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: knife mail list has been censored From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 20 Jan 2000 01:24:18 GMT -------- Hey Russ...The haemorroids actin' up or sump'n?? I felt a couple of toes crunch..But I didn't realise it was yours. Ooops..Sorry! 8^) teenut Russ Kepler wrote: > > In article , > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > >"Moderated"..just another word for censored!!!! > > Yup. Just like it needed and still needs. > > >The Rec.guns list is moderated. Problem is, with the volume, it takes a day or > >so for messages to filter through. Any continuity and spontaneity is totally > >lost. > > Yes, as are flame wars that annoy the participants, spam posts, etc. > > >What you get is just a babble of disjointed statements that usually degenerate > >to the "Mine is bigger than yours" level in short order. > > Not on the lists I see. I see that the time from read to reply > allows a more reasoned reply to be formed. It also keeps the heat > down and the content up. > > >Yech!! > > Next time I'll let *you* take the list. I'm sure that you'd be able > to do as good or better a job. I lasted 5 years before I gave up, > we'll see how long Terry makes it but he ought to last as long. With > your (famous) patience I'd give you a couple of weeks, tops. > > -- > Russ Kepler russ@kepler-eng.com > > Please Don't Feed the Engineers ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Progress on shop purchase From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 20 Jan 2000 01:32:03 GMT -------- Naw..You don't want Prime Time pictures of me REALLY kickin' Butt!! teenut..The kinder, gentler, side of Bob!! AZOTIC wrote: > > Hi Robert > > Congratulations, I hope you have > many years of seccess. > > Now how about some night classes > and weekend classes for those of us > that want learn from your expertise, > and of course we all would like to see > some pictures of your new venture, a > live feed web cam would be nice. > > Best of luck to you. > > Tom. > azotic@aol.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: standard 4 flute vs. cntr. cutting From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 20 Jan 2000 01:37:43 GMT -------- So can a 4 flute center cutting! But a two flute will cut a slot dead to size, a four flute won't. OTOH, a four flute is stiffer, for side cutting and, because the chip load is better distributed, can feed faster and last longer. To sum up... Two flute for accurate slots (that's why they call it a "slot drill" Four flute for rigid side cutting. teenut GJRepesh wrote: > > The center cutting end mill can start a cut straight down like a drill bit. > > GJR ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How to "age" brass From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 20 Jan 2000 01:40:29 GMT -------- Cat pee! teenut (for the third or forth time this month!! "M.T." wrote: > > I have some brass on a reproduction antique pistol that I would like to "age" > so that it looks like it is 150 years old. Does anyone have any suggestions on > how to make polished brass look old? > > thanks, > Mark > mtenhol@anet-stl.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: myford lathe From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 20 Jan 2000 01:47:41 GMT -------- What you have is a Myford MiniCop Lathe. It is a specialised High production hydraulic copying lathe and should have provision for mounting and following a master template at the rear. It should also have with it, a heavy duty, hydraulic tank, pump, valving and piping. With this you have a lathe designed to shift serious metal with precision. Well worth restoring..if you have the use for it. Without it, I am afraid you got the shell and someone else ate the pecan!! teenut Dan Buckman wrote: > > I bought a little lathe at an auction yesterday, It is very grungy and I > didn't more than glance at it until I unloaded it tonight. > Name plate says myford and there have been recent postings on myford lathes, > so I guess they are common. But I began noticing oddities, maybe these are > common to this machine: a 2 hp motor on this tiny spindle, drive is directly > from motor to spindle via gear belt, to change speeds it looks like you need > to pull the gears. It has no lead screw, but does have a hydrolic cylinder > to move the carriage, and it has what must be a tracer. now for my question > , is this a usable machine, or maybe is it worth the time to make it > operational. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: knife mail list has been censored From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 20 Jan 2000 12:56:22 GMT -------- Ooops, Sorry! Don'tcha hate when that happens! I guess Daddy's little helper better butt out. Huh! Remorsefully, thoroughly chastened and suitably, Mea Culpa'ed teenut Russ Kepler wrote: > > In article <6tth4.147$ps1.31161@news1.rdc1.ga.home.com>, > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > >Hey Russ...The haemorroids actin' up or sump'n?? > > Naah, still pissed that you pointed out that boring/facing head that > was mis-described on eBay to all and sundry. > > -- > Russ Kepler russ@kepler-eng.com > > Please Don't Feed the Engineers ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Progress on shop purchase From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 20 Jan 2000 13:03:21 GMT -------- Yeh, I know Hurco is not "state of the art". But this came with the deal..for cheap. I plan to replace ALL the equipment as funds allow..But for now it seems to do a good job. What VMC would YOU choose for yourself? teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article , > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > > > I AM keeping the Hurco CNC VMC, > > Arrgh! I just got off a 4 hour shift running a Hurco. They > punish me when I've been "bad" by forcing me to make square > parts rather than round ones. > > Jim (who cringes at that horrible word "hurco") > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking,sci.engr.joining.welding Subject: Re: Updated and Revised Metals Links From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 20 Jan 2000 17:06:33 GMT -------- WONDERFUL STUFF ERNIE!!! I propose a general vote of thanks from all our members. Contribution of the month award!! teenut Ernie Leimkuhler wrote: > > OK guys this is the real final complete list, for now, or at least until a bunch MORE people send me > some more great links. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Making 2 parts simulataneously... From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 20 Jan 2000 17:09:01 GMT -------- "Real" Machinists would drill/mill them together wherever possible. teenut ltl919 wrote: > > Hi all, > If I need to perform some milling and drill holes on 2 alum. plates that > must be identical, is it considered 'professional' machining practice > to clamp the 2 plates together and drill/mill them at once? Or is it > better to perform the same operations on each plate separately? > I have to admit when I am lazy I do clamp them together but I am > wondering what "real" machinists > do.... > Thanks. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Sounds good to me... From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 20 Jan 2000 17:14:31 GMT -------- Excellent piece..the voice of reason..at last. I, for one, thank you for posting here. Metal content..I make guns!! teenut "N. Wynne" wrote: > > I wouldn't ordinarily put something like this in this news group, but > after I went back and forth with Tom Holt about it re an expired part of > this thread, I decided everyone else in the thread would want to see it. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Tachometer for Variable speed lathe/mill From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 20 Jan 2000 17:23:32 GMT -------- This is SOP on CNC Lathes. One caveat though. The most useful application for constant surface speed is when facing LARGE objects. It can be quite disconcerting..not to say dangerous, when a large, out-of-balance faceplate or chuck, tries to reach infinite speed. (Been there, done that!!) Some form of upper speed limit regulator is required in the setting code for CSS. teenut Bruce Simpson wrote: > > I guess if we wanted to get clever we could skip the whole tachometer > concept and build a linear-speed meter that automatically sensed the > size of the workpiece and calculated the material speed at the > cutting face of the tool based on the RPMs and the work diameter. > > Even better, if your lathe has an electronic speed control you could > build an electronic governor into which you could simply key the > surface speed required and then the RPMs would automatically be > adjusted as the diameter of the workpiece was reduced by consecutive > cuts. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: standard 4 flute vs. cntr. cutting From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 20 Jan 2000 20:14:02 GMT -------- Easy to sketch but hard to describe!! The flute on a two flute mill are always "Balanced"..tending not to cut larger than their diameter..even with a modicum of spindle run out. OTOH the lead flute on a three four or more flut mill tends to deflect the spindle and cutter back and to the side, causing "flutter" and a consequent oversize cut. Draw this on a piece of paper and follow the path of each tooth in the slot and you will see what I mean. teenut fred veenschoten wrote: > > why is that? > fred > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> > wrote in message ... > >But a two flute will cut a slot dead to size, a four flute won't. > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: New Magnum "Mauser" Actions From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 20 Jan 2000 21:52:23 GMT -------- I made the following general announcement today.... As some of you are aware I have been investigating the possibility of building an oversized Magnum Mauser type action. This is now much closer to reality than I ever dreamed when I began the investigation process. Yesterday I plunked down several hundred thousand dollars and bought a complete, working, Machine/Tool and Die shop!! 7000 square feet, ten employees and a bank of CNC machining and turning centers plus Sinker EDM, wire cut EDM, plasma cutting,welding and heat treatment facilities. Obviously, my main priority will be to sustain and increase the current work load on the shop...My Family and Employees do like to eat regular meals. However, this is a golden opportunity to put my dreams to work. When machinery like that is standing idle between jobs..anything you can put on them gets machined, virtually for FREE!! So I intend to tool up and produce my Super Magnum Actions..in fact a whole range of custom actions!! First will come a Double Square Bridge, solid side wall, Mauser "Clone" with a bolt diameter of .750" and a magazine length of 4". This will take care of the Gibbs 505 and wildcats based on that basic case. I plan to contract with a brass maker, to produce a Gibbs Basic cylindrical case, 3 1/4" long..ie 1/8" longer than the standard Gibbs. It will have a "Generic" headstamp. Next will come a larger version, slightly bigger all round, with a 800" diameter bolt and a box length of 4.25"!! This should satisfy the masochists among us!!! This will be suitable for the standard RIMMED 3 1/4" .577 Nitro Express. A suitable magazine box for the rimmed round will be available. The traditional Mauser "Inner Ring" breeching will be standard, as, of course, will the mauser third safety lug, guide rib and long "Controlled Feed" claw extractor. One variation will be the ejector, which will be of the Pre 64 Model 70 style, angled BENEATH the left hand locking lug..instead of passing through it. Bolt stop will be traditional Mauser, but the underside of the action will be reinforced for rigidity...a la Model 70. Triggers will also be Model 70 style "over-ride" type. For the experimenters among us, I will be marketing, at reasonable cost, a basic rimless case, based on a 50BMG case redrawn to a .700" rim diameter (from .800" ( I have the punch presses, the toolmakers and the expertise to be able to do this. I hope to offer these cases at $1.50 each!!! I will also be developing, along with a well known quality bullet maker and a maker of high grade CUT rifled barrels, a NEW CALIBER..the 550" 3 1/4" Rimless Nitro Express. Arrangements are already in hand for the first barrels and full patch, steel jacketed bullets in a grain weight of 650. Finally I intend to produce Custom Quality STANDARD sizes of Mauser clones..Double square bridge, solid side wall etc. Single square bridge and thumbcuts, with clip slots will be an option. These will come initially in Magnum and Kurtz lengths. Solid bottom, single shot "Bench Rest" actions will be available too. Additionally I plan to manufacture and sell a range of Mauser type bottom metal with hinged, straddle, floor plates. These will be suitable, for instance for those who want to build a .500 Jeffery on a standard 98 action..without needing to have the ugly and persnickety single column magazine. I have already made several of these for myself and the staggered box works perfectly!! Other products will include TAKEDOWN versions of the above actions. Plus, custom grade, folding leaf express sights, barrel swivel bands, and front sight ramped bands, side swing safety shrouds for mausers etc. Eventually I will supply complete barrelled and headspaced actions, they will come with the option of being "In the White, unpolished", ready for you or your gunsmith to do the finishing work. This will keep the prices down enormously!! Prices???? Not finalised yet..but I see no reason why they should not be held to a seasonable level. The custom action makers have been gouging us too long!!! I would welcome any constructive comments and ideas..Nothing is set in stone yet...EXCEPT the fact that this IS going to happen!!! No I am NOT taking orders yet..I will let you all know when THAT happy day comes..Hopefully within the next three months. I would welcome though, on a direct email basis any expressions of interest etc..teenut@hotmail.com Robert Bastow, The Express Rifle Company/ER Tool and Die, Atlanta, GA ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Progress on shop purchase From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 21 Jan 2000 02:40:24 GMT -------- Yup..Shore did!! Remind me about the riser project? teenut dave wrote: > > Teenut: Did you get the Wire EDM too? Still thinking about the riser > project? > Dave ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: New Magnum "Mauser" Actions From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 21 Jan 2000 02:44:48 GMT -------- If I need..It will come! teenut Lou Boyd wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > I made the following general announcement today.... > > > > As some of you are aware I have been investigating the possibility of building > > an oversized Magnum Mauser type action. > > > I will also be developing, along with a well known quality bullet maker and a > > maker of high grade CUT rifled barrels, a NEW CALIBER..the > > 550" 3 1/4" Rimless Nitro Express. Arrangements are already in hand for the > > first barrels and full patch, steel jacketed bullets in a grain > > weight of 650. > > Sounds exciting. Aren't you going to have a problem with a new .550" > cartridge? > Wouldn't that automatically be considered a destructive device unless > you have specific dispensation from the Secretary of the Treasury? > > -- > Lou Boyd ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Question From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 21 Jan 2000 02:49:41 GMT -------- Others will answer your question here Luigi. But as far as the Language and spelling is concerned, here we have a policy..To paraphrase the famous saying from "Love Story"..."Being a Home Shop Machinist means never having to say you're sorry" Bienvenu teenut Luigi Alleva wrote: > > I have received a small gift from a retirer metalworker (a indicator > accessory kit) and I would like to know what can I do whit this kind of > accessory and what is it use for. > > p.s. sorry for the spalling I am french > > Thank you > Luigi ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Dividing Head, Indexer, or Super Spacer From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 21 Jan 2000 02:51:36 GMT -------- Beats me! Anybody? ;^) teenut MP Toolman wrote: For that matter, what is the difference between a spacer, a > super spacer, and a deluxe super spacer? > > Thanks, > Mill ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: New Magnum "Mauser" Actions From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 21 Jan 2000 03:00:15 GMT -------- I KNEW Albrecht would pick up on my ONE F******G Typo!!! So far as "Nitro Express" is concerned, it has been in the public domain since the early years of the (last!!!!!) Century! Coined by IIRC Holland and Holland, donkeys years before the drag strip was dreamed of. "Express Rifle Company" mustn't have ever been registered..'Cos *I* just registered it as a trade name! So there!! teenut PLAlbrecht wrote: > > >When machinery > >like that is standing idle between jobs..anything you can > >put on them gets machined, virtually for FREE!! > > Why, Robert, what a kind and generous offer!!! I'll start thinking of free > stuff for you to machine for me. > > >Prices???? > >Not finalised yet..but I see no reason why >they should not be held to a > >seasonable level. > > I agree wholeheartedly. I think winter prices should be much lower than summer > or fall prices. > > I've always thought "Nitro Express" would be a great name for a drag car. And > is probably already taken. > > (Later) sure enough -- Dean Shaw - "Nitro Express" - AA/FD - Fremont, 1971; > Art Ward, Nitro Express, 1978; probably about forty-leven other guys who > think they're the first. > > Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: New Magnum "Mauser" Actions From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 21 Jan 2000 03:08:03 GMT -------- Maybe not for free. But, If you understand the economics of contract machining you will know ther are a lot of ways to price a job. I have a real soft spot for fellow HSMs and I promise I will do my best to give you guys a break on jobs if I can. No Promises!! And NO!..I won't do jobs you can do yourselves with a bit of effort...But if you are stuck...Give me a call and if it is in my power I will help out. Fair enough?? teenut PLAlbrecht wrote: > > >When machinery > >like that is standing idle between jobs..anything you can > >put on them gets machined, virtually for FREE!! > > Why, Robert, what a kind and generous offer!!! I'll start thinking of free > stuff for you to machine for me. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: New Magnum "Mauser" Actions From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 21 Jan 2000 08:45:56 GMT -------- The original "Nitro Express" refered to a whole group of calibers some as smal as 240" or 275", but ranging up to the big .577" and .600" used primarily for elephant hunting. Believe it or not, there are probably more elephant being shot now than ever before..most, by Game Control Officers, in areas where they have reached pest proportions!! Having been to Africa a few times, I have seen the damage a herd of elephants can do to the countryside..It is just like the aftermath of a B52 carpet bombing run! As more and more afluent "Baby Boomers" reach retirement and/or financial independence they are starting to want to fulfil some of the dreams of their youth..expensive Harleys, etc. One of those dreams, for many is an African Safari. More people than ever before are going there and it is an important part of the economy of some countries. Now, to kill an elephant costs big bucks in trophy fees alone ($10-15000) Add to that the cost of a once in a lifetime safari and it starts to add up. These people do NOT want to face an elephant or Cape Buffalo with a 30-06..that would just p**s it off! They need a BIG BORE rifle..some countries dictate a minimum .416 caliber..I personally wouldn't want to face down a wounded buff with anything less than a .500 caliber. Backing up our intrepid "hunter" is a Professional Hunter..who's primary objective is to keep the tyro's hide in one piece..especially considering the liability insurance he must carry. So the PH's back-up gun is a CANNON..something that will not just kill an elephant but will knock it flat on its butt! Only a .577 or .600 will do that with absolute reliability! Now the old Nitro Express doubles never were made in huge quantities, but to buy a GOOD used English double of large caliber, today, is going to set you back from $25000 to over $100,000 !!!!! Even our affluent Baby boomer balks at that...so does the PH especially with ammo at $15 to $40.00 a pop! So, there is a growing demand for a cheaper, but dead reliable, rifle with the knock-down power of the big doubles. The old Mauser 98 action has NEVER been bettered in the reliability field, but though Magnum Mauser actions were built before the war (and since by other manufacturers), no one has EVER built a Mauser Action big enough for the big Nitro Express rounds. Until Now!! The Mauser action is a very complex bit of machining...In excess of 600 different operations the way they used to be made. Each one jigged and tooled on a seperate machine with special gages and inspections to verify every stage. Small wonder that manufacturers started to look for different ways to produce bolt action rifles. But that meant simplifying, "Dumbing down" the action itself...loosing step by step many of the features that made the 'ole 98 such an absolutely perfect design. In many cases the manufacturers went back to features patented by Mauser in the 1880's and discarded by him in the 1890's. These features pop up on modern rifles and are sold by the spin merchants as the "Latest and greatest"...Baloney!...They are just cheaper to make that way. Arms manufacture has always been a "Mass Market" production..it still is for the market that the Winchester 70, the Remington 700 and the Ruger 77 are aimed at. Up until recently the custom market has been largely ignored, or catered to by a few, highly skilled, gunmakers, content to turn out a couple of actions a year that people pay up to $15000 each for!! And then along came CNC Machining and EDM and CAD/CAM and the game is different! All those myriad separate cuts on the Original Mauser action can now be done in a half a dozen setups on a CNC Mill, Lathe and EDM machine..to even tighter tolerances than the originals. Not that the annual production would justify the purchase of machines especially to do that...Nowhere close. But when the machines are there..bought and paid for...loaded with other paying work for 80% of their time! THEN it becomes possible to DO this thing. And make money!! THAT is the beauty of CNC! More than you ever wanted to know..Huh! teenut Simon wrote: > > I'm not all that knowledgeable about guns, but wasn't the original Nitro > Express intended for shooting elephants? And would I be correct in > thinking that you are going to make something bigger? > I am jealous of those who can afford such a thing (and justify the cost > to their wife). > I am even more jealous of those who know where there are carnivorous > dinosaurs they can go and hunt. > > Simon ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: New Magnum "Mauser" Actions From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 21 Jan 2000 09:35:11 GMT -------- pablo wrote: > > What you have described would be any true GUN NUTS dream, access to > such a shop would have limitless possiblities. first > let me say i'm not a fan of the Remington action (40x/700 > series)either.it is designed to be cheaply manufactured.However there > are some good features to be preferred over the traditional Mauser, the > faster lock time specfically, Absolutely no reason why the Mauser lock time can't be as fast as the Remington. It is simply a question of reducing the cocking lift cam to shorten the fall..Reduce the weight of the fireing pin assembly and strengthen the spring to compensate for the lack of Ooomph. But this speed lock feature, so beloved of benchresters, is NOT A GOOD THING when the target is likely to shoot back, stomp you into mush or turn you into a pile of predator skat. In situations like that (Military and Dangerous Game hunting) the first requirement is not 1/4 minute of angle accuracy..It is ABSOLUTE RELIABILITY..The Mauser lock time might be a bit slow..but it giveth a mighty smack on that primer! >coupled with the mauser claw extractor and controlled feed. Rightly said, the long claw extractor is expensive to make but it does have a couple of indispensible attributes for the above mentioned applications to War and Dangerous game. The first you mentioned..controlled round feeding. The fresh round from the magazine is held immediately by the extractor, to the bolt face before being fed into the chamber. This makes it possible to reload the rifle in any position...perhaps upside down between the front legs of an elephant who is shaking his head from side to side, trying to focus on you so he can tear bits off!! It also ensures that if you "Short Stroke" the bolt..easy to do under stress. you cannot leave a loaded round in the chamber and try to load another one right behind it. That leads to a monumental jam or the chambered round being fired, with the bolt open, by the point of the following bullet! The big claw is very wide and takes a good grip of the rim...far less likely to tear through the rim when a shell case sticks..a frequent enough event on the narrow "Modern" extractors (actually patented by Mauser for the 1888 rifle and discarded on the 1893 for that very reason) Lastly the claw doesn't rotate on closing or opening..this not only reduces friction..but prevents the shaving of minute brass particles from the rim. These eventually build up..usually inside the bolt..and can lead to misfires. OK on the bench...not good in a tight corner!! >I don't think the angled ejector would be worth > the extra effort over the spring loaded pin of the rem. Problem is..with a plunger ejector, you can't have controlled round feeding!! The Ruger 77 MkI had a plunger..it was changed to an inertia blade on the Mk II so that the rounds could be fed under the extractor hook. As for square > bridges, they should be machined ala Maynard Buelers design, maybe a > little larger as there would be more room on your larger actions. I am not familiar with the Mayard Buelers design. Is it for a telescope mount? Bear in mind that rifles of this caliber are never fitted with a scope..open iron "Express" sights only....... A) Because at fifty yards, down to fifty inches it just gets in the way...remember that these rifles are designed to handle and point like a quail or skeet shotgun. A wounded buff. can flush like a quail, from cover twenty feet or less in front of you...Except that instead of flying away, he comes right at you!! B) The scope sight has yet to be built that can withstand the recoil of these cannons for more than a couple of rounds. (30-06 = 20 ft lbs of recoil. .577 Nyati = 120 to 150 ft lbs !!!) C) The scope eyepiece would probably take your eye out anyway! Just like bench rest or long range target shooting, these rifles are very specialised, for a specific set of circumstances. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: New Magnum "Mauser" Actions From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 21 Jan 2000 12:51:58 GMT -------- They even went as far as a four bore...4 oz of lead!! Few men could handle them...but the effect was similar to a poleaxe! There is a revival of interest in "Gauge Rifles" I believe double 8's are being built at this time. teenut Tom Holt wrote: > > In the 1870s and 80s, the standard kit for hunting dangerous game in > Africa (elephant and, deadlier still according to what I've read, > buffalo) was a double eight bore (.835) rifle, also known as a > 'roer'; short barrels, handled like a skeet gun, two-ounce bullet, > hit the shooter only marginally less hard than the target... There > used to be one in the Tower Armories in London; the stock had split > along the checker line on the hand, and had been repaired with a rawhide wrap. > > To paraphrase Crocodile Dundee; "Nah. That's not a stopping rifle. > *This* is a stopping rifle..." ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lathe instead of Winnebago From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 21 Jan 2000 16:03:36 GMT -------- That is NOT, NOT, NOT, a FAIR Question!!! Do you not realise sir, that scores of readers of this list are recovering LATHAHOLICS!!!! Many of them have wasted their lives, fortunes, families, careers...EVERYTHING...EVERYTHING I tell you, in dreams, lustings schemings, plots, and plannings of what would be their IDEAL LATHE if only they could lay their hands on $20,000...Nay Sir One HALF of that Princely Ransom!!! Our TWELVE STEP PROGRAM here, has helped so many of them to return from the brink of the ABYSS!!! So many have been able to supress their PRIMAL URGES, their SECRETIVE and FURTIVE attempts to SELL their own CHILDREN on EBAY no less to raiser such an impossible sum to slake their BLACK LUSTINGS We have been able to help them find HAPPINESS with far far LESS...Can you believe Sir, in many many cases less than ONE THOUSAND of those DEVIL'S DOLLARS...to buy whatever heap of RUST and MISFORTUNE happened their way...To NURTURE said MISBEGOTTEN heap of JUNK...To learn to CHERISH and UNDERSTAND...aye Sir..Even to LOVE it's many FAILINGS and SHORT-COMINGS. They have come HERE to this PLACE of FELLOWSHIP and UNDERSTANDING..First to CONFESS their FILTHY SECRETS..and to eventually COME to TERMS with them....Many have recovered enough to even begin to REBUILD their SHATTERED LIVES. And now Sir, YOU Sir, with one THOUGHTLESS MISSIVE have DESTROYED all that!! Do you realise how many poor WRETCHES you have condemned to the SLOUGH of DESPOND, the PIT of WRETCHEDNESS that only another LATHAHOLIC can COMPREHEND! BEGON Sir, take your DEVIL'S WORK with you and Let us FEW who are able to SHUN your BEGUILING, SIREN SONG, begin our GENTLE MINISTERINGS over..YET AGAIN...To SALVAGE what we can from the WRECKAGE you have so CARELESSLY WROUGHT!!!!! GET THEE BEHIND US SIR!! teenut H wrote: > > This may sound dumb, but I'm retiring in a few years and I've decided > to shoot the savings account on a lathe instead of the ubiquitous > Winnebago. Decided to stay home and work on guns instead of camping in > the national park system. So.... for really high precision rifle > barrel and chambering work, I'm looking for recommendations. Current > choices seem to be the SB Heavy 10 or the G26T. No import stuff unless > very high quality. Can afford to spend up to $20K or so. So, OK, > experts, what would your dream machine be and why? Thanks for the help! > > * Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet's Discussion Network * > The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet - Free! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How to remove stuck chuck from 13 inch SB lathe spindle From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 21 Jan 2000 16:23:25 GMT -------- BURN the Bugger off!! Seriously though you are fortunate to know that it is stuck by reason of shock over-torquing and not because it is rusted or ill-fitted. Here's what to do. Get a six inch or so length of the largest hexagon bar that will fit thorough the chuck center and grip it tightly in the chuck with a couple of inches protruding. Place a ring wrench of the correct size on the hex and TIE it there with Duct tape..this is to stop it flying off. Clamp a length of two x four lumber on the lathe bed at the point where the wrench will impact it. With the lathe in the lowest high range gear..not back gear!! and the wrench pushed as far clockwise as it will go quickly HEAT the back plate boss with a concentrated torch flame. This need only be hand hot..the boss will expand minutely while the spindle remains cooler..insulated by the oil and air gap. Now, GENTLY jog the starter button..so that the chuck turns over smartly..but NOT under power..to impact the improvised stop. A couple of such "taps" should shock it loose. Been there..Done that!! teenut fdander@attglobal.net wrote: > > HELP! When I momentarily bumped my 13 inch SB lathe in reverse, the 6-inch > chuck with threaded backplate began to unwind. To avoid a nasty > disengagement and free-fall onto the lathe bed, I instantly reversed the > switch to FORWARD before it reached the end of the threaded portion. Big > mistake - under power the chuck screwed itself back on with a vengence, and > now it remains stuck. A 36 inch cheater doesn't move it off ( I estimate > about 150 foot-pounds of torque). Spindle nose thread is 2-1/4 x 8. Any > ideas? Thanx, Dave ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: standard 4 flute vs. cntr. cutting From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 21 Jan 2000 18:55:25 GMT -------- That describes it better than I did!! teenut fred veenschoten wrote: > > i think i see. with the 2 flute, the first flute is out of the cut by the > time the second enters the cut?!! > fred > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> > wrote in message ... > >Easy to sketch but hard to describe!! > > > >The flute on a two flute mill are always "Balanced"..tending not to cut > larger > >than their diameter..even with a modicum of spindle run out. > > > >OTOH the lead flute on a three four or more flut mill tends to deflect the > >spindle and cutter back and to the side, causing "flutter" and a consequent > >oversize cut. > > > >Draw this on a piece of paper and follow the path of each tooth in the slot > and > >you will see what I mean. > > > >teenut > > > >fred veenschoten wrote: > >> > >> why is that? > >> fred > >> > >> Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> > wrote in message ... > >> >But a two flute will cut a slot dead to size, a four flute won't. > >> > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lathe instead of Winnebago From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 21 Jan 2000 18:59:43 GMT -------- Five!! Mea Culpa!! teenut Marshall Pharoah wrote: > > So how many lathes were in that shop you purchased during your backslide this week. > We need to know how many Hail Mary's to say for you. > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote in message news:sr%h4.204$ps1.38842@news1.rdc1.ga.home.com... > > That is NOT, NOT, NOT, a FAIR Question!!! > > > > Do you not realise sir, that scores of readers of this list are recovering > > LATHAHOLICS!!!! > > > > Many of them have wasted their lives, fortunes, families, > > careers...EVERYTHING...EVERYTHING I tell you, in dreams, lustings schemings, > > plots, and plannings of what would be their IDEAL LATHE if only they could lay > > their hands on $20,000...Nay Sir One HALF of that Princely Ransom!!! > > > > Our TWELVE STEP PROGRAM here, has helped so many of them to return from the > > brink of the ABYSS!!! So many have been able to supress their PRIMAL URGES, > > their SECRETIVE and FURTIVE attempts to SELL their own CHILDREN on EBAY no less > > to raiser such an impossible sum to slake their BLACK LUSTINGS > > > > We have been able to help them find HAPPINESS with far far LESS...Can you > > believe Sir, in many many cases less than ONE THOUSAND of those DEVIL'S > > DOLLARS...to buy whatever heap of RUST and MISFORTUNE happened their way...To > > NURTURE said MISBEGOTTEN heap of JUNK...To learn to CHERISH and UNDERSTAND...aye > > Sir..Even to LOVE it's many FAILINGS and SHORT-COMINGS. > > > > They have come HERE to this PLACE of FELLOWSHIP and UNDERSTANDING..First to > > CONFESS their FILTHY SECRETS..and to eventually COME to TERMS with them....Many > > have recovered enough to even begin to REBUILD their SHATTERED LIVES. > > > > And now Sir, YOU Sir, with one THOUGHTLESS MISSIVE have DESTROYED all that!! Do > > you realise how many poor WRETCHES you have condemned to the SLOUGH of DESPOND, > > the PIT of WRETCHEDNESS that only another LATHAHOLIC can COMPREHEND! > > > > BEGON Sir, take your DEVIL'S WORK with you and Let us FEW who are able to SHUN > > your BEGUILING, SIREN SONG, begin our GENTLE MINISTERINGS over..YET AGAIN...To > > SALVAGE what we can from the WRECKAGE you have so CARELESSLY WROUGHT!!!!! > > > > GET THEE BEHIND US SIR!! > > > > teenut > > > > H wrote: > > > > > > This may sound dumb, but I'm retiring in a few years and I've decided > > > to shoot the savings account on a lathe instead of the ubiquitous > > > Winnebago. Decided to stay home and work on guns instead of camping in > > > the national park system. So.... for really high precision rifle > > > barrel and chambering work, I'm looking for recommendations. Current > > > choices seem to be the SB Heavy 10 or the G26T. No import stuff unless > > > very high quality. Can afford to spend up to $20K or so. So, OK, > > > experts, what would your dream machine be and why? Thanks for the help! > > > > > > * Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet's Discussion Network * > > > The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet - Free! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: New Magnum "Mauser" Actions From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 22 Jan 2000 03:48:39 GMT -------- Thanks for the encouragement..You are more than welcome to drop by anytime. teenut rdanzey@seidata.com wrote: > > Nope! I'd like to see a Mauser action whatever. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lathe instead of Winnebago From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 22 Jan 2000 03:56:54 GMT -------- I don't!! The secret is in hiding that fact well.. Perhaps in a few years you will understand, that what the Lord takes away in strength..He replaces with Cunning and Wisdom! ;^) teenut Mark wrote: > > Robert: Great! How do you find the time to do everything? > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Teenut/T&D shop/Wire EDM From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 22 Jan 2000 04:19:28 GMT -------- Mitsubishi, 12 x 14 x 5 DWC 100 power supply Bobwire software teenut dave wrote: > > Weren't you the fellow who was thinking about trying to increase the > heigth of a wire EDM??? > What type did you get? > Regards, Dave ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: New Magnum "Mauser" Actions From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 22 Jan 2000 14:11:08 GMT -------- That would be my first choice too for close in Lion..double Ten Gauge, 18" barrels, 000 buckshot...perfect medicine for soft skin DG like lion, leopard or Tiger. It would just bounce off a Buff, Elephant or Rhino though!! teenut kenneth knaell wrote: > > Kind of missed the chance to say this when the thread was dealing with > stopping power but I read one time that an African hunter who was chasing > down a lion that had started killing humans preferred to have a shotgun in > his hands when he was tracking a lion in tall grass. Don't know what kind. > ken knaell ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Dead Center Lubricant From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 26 Jan 2000 02:17:10 GMT -------- Ah! But his question was NOT what are good reasons for using a live center. It was, IIRC, "Why would anyone ever use a dead center" teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article <%P6f4.3762$G42.70348@news.rdc1.tn.home.com>, > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > > > There are more..but I will leave some for other readers, to take a > > kick at your butt! > > Hmm. Looks like sombebody else has left his own flapping in the > breeze a bit here. Seemed like a tolerably good question to me. > For many jobs a live center is indeed a good alternative. There > are many inexpensive ones aound that do a good job for most of > the work one encounters in a hobby shop. They do tend to be > a bit bulky though. > > I do not think any butt-kickin' is called for - for his question, that > is. > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: New Magnum "Mauser" Actions From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 26 Jan 2000 03:00:49 GMT -------- The Mauser is indeed artistry in design..But if I had to go to WAR with a bolt action rifle, I would pick the Lee Enfield every time...It proved to be far more suitable for rapid fire and simply shrugged off the mud of the trenches that bought mausers and springfields to a grinding standstill. Horses for courses! teenut foxeye wrote: The Mauser was a piece of work before its time, and still > remains so. Pity the americans had nothing in their arsenal at the > time that was even equal to it, and the Brits never came close. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: New Magnum "Mauser" Actions From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 26 Jan 2000 03:17:04 GMT -------- James Paris Lee...Invented the generally accepted best Bolt actioned BATTLE RIFLE. Cock on opening was specifically chosen by the British in both the Lee Enfield and the P13 (P14 and US model 1917) This was because the absolute first requirement of a battle rifle is reliability...and that includest the feeding and EXTRACTION of the fired case..This becomes progressively more difficult with dirty, low quality war time ammo and especially so during rapid fire. The cock on closing concentrates ALL the effort of lifting the bolt handle into primary extraction. BTW the Enfield Model 1917 equipped the MAJORITY of US Doughboys during the First world War, Sgt Alvin York carried one, plus a Colt Model 1911 during his famous exploit (NOT an 03 Springfield and a captured Luger as portrayed in the movie!!) The Us Army found the Enfield FASTER and MORE accurate than the Springfield and pressed for its adoption in place of the Springfield after the war. Only the Political incorrectness of adopting a foreign design kept the Springfield in production. teenut Gary Coffman wrote: > > On Mon, 24 Jan 2000 16:02:29 +0000, Lou Boyd wrote: > >JMartin957 wrote: > >> > >> >Mauser, Browning, and Kalashnikov are considered the premiere small arms > >> >designers of the 19th/20th century. They designed or strongly influenced the > >> >design of the small arms used by most of the world's armies throughout most > >> >of the 20th century. > >> > >> Don't think too many would object if you added John Garand to that list... > > > >Or Eugene Stoner. > > Both gentlemen produced good small arms designs that were adopted for > US service, but they didn't produce the wide range of designs, or have the > large influence on other designers all over the world, that the gentlemen I > listed did. They deserve to be on the list, but there are others I would list > ahead of them. > > Gary > Gary Coffman KE4ZV | You make it |mail to ke4zv@bellsouth.net > 534 Shannon Way | We break it | > Lawrenceville, GA | Guaranteed | ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: New Magnum "Mauser" Actions From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 26 Jan 2000 03:33:09 GMT -------- Thanks for your words of encouragement. Yes I do intend to retain the solid left wall of the original mauser. This has, as you say been slowly eroded by other manufacturers due to the difficulty of "modern Manufacturing" ie Broaching etc. In actual fact, the methods used by Springfield armory to plane the slots (They called it "shaving") would have produced the inner ring with a solid left wall just as easily as the ringless springfield design!! Firstly a lot of the waste was removed by a series of milling cuts. Then they used five separate HAND OPERATED "Shaving machines" to cut the front and rear left hand races plus the front and rear right hand races and the safety lug race in the top of the bridge. The cutting tool was similar to a large pull type hook rifling cutter, It was not full width but about 1/8" wide. As the handle moved it back and forth a ratchet device started to sweep it about an arc(once it reached full depth) so as to shave the raceway to full width. I intend to remove as much waste as possible during the milling operations and then SINKER EDM the raceways to final shape. teenut glazier_retired@my-deja.com wrote: > > teenut. > > Congratulations on your recent acquisition of the T&D shop. I wish > you good fortune in both enterprises. With your tooling expertise and > savvy about things in general, I expect both ventures will be roaring > successes, > > I do have a question about your Mauser action machining. In the > referred post (and subsequent posts) you have talked about CNC mills, > lathes, and various EDM equipment but I saw no mention of linear > stroke type machines (planer, shaper, slotter, broaching machine, die > filer). So how are you going to machine the lug raceways? > Particularly, if you are going to produce Paul Mauser’s design with the > inner collar pierced by only one slot for the extractor (rather than 2 > slots in the weakened design modification by FN etal), how do you > machine the left lug raceway that properly ends at the locking lug > recess? > > Bill > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Stuck Micrometer From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 26 Jan 2000 04:03:14 GMT -------- Yeh! Me!! I just paid full MSC price for a set of Starrett mics 0 to 6" Why? Bottom line of REPEATABLE accuracy, is the quality and repeatability of your measuring instruments and references. Peace of mind for a pro machinist is being able to rely on those essential bits and pieces..EVERY TIME Starrett have earned my confidence, as have Moore and Wright and the older Brown and Sharpe, Lufkin and Tumico instruments I have. I don't know that other brands are NOT just as accurate and reliable..I am sure that some are...Mauser, Interapid, Vis come to mind..the point is...I simply don't have the resources, or time, to find out by trial and error. As for Mitutoyo..I simply refuse to have anything painted "puke green" in my toolbox. So there!! teenut Brian Evans wrote: > > Is there anyone who actually buys Starrett, Moore and Wright, etc, new? I've > got a set of Starret 2" to 6", several Starret, B&S, Lufkin mikes in various > sizes up to 6", but I haven't bought a new one since my Mitutoyo almost 10 > years ago. I pay from $15 - $30, and pick them up in flea-markets. I've never > had one yet that wasn't accurate when I got it home to check. > > Brian > > tonyp wrote: > > > PLAlbrecht wrote > > > > > Gary Coffman wrote: > > > >I get by nicely selling my > > > >services to people like you. I'm told there is one born every minute. > > > > > > Apparently not nicely enough to afford decent equipment. > > > > > > Let's see now... you buy Chinese, I buy Starrett -- who's the sucker? > > > > Whoever is paying more than he needs to, I'd say. That's as good a > > definition of "sucker" as any. > > > > BTW, Donald Trump's former yacht had solid gold bathroom faucets. I doubt > > they turned the water on and off any better than my ordinary plated brass > > ones. What metal are yours made of? > > > > -- > > Tony Prentakis > > Consumer of time, occupier of space, producer of Z-stages > > "How can I know what I think until I hear what I have to say?" ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Stuck Micrometer From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 26 Jan 2000 04:10:13 GMT -------- Wrong Hugh! Those who earn their living with tools are far MORE sensitive to the cost of them. They also discover quickly that a false economy is no economy at all. Cheap cutting tools, cheap machinery, cheap materials, cheap labor..they all cost more in the long (even short) run. teenut Hugh Strong wrote: > > The people who make their livings with the tools are also a > lot less sensitve to the cost of basic shop supplies. > Anyone who flips through a tool catalog can see the results. > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lathe instead of Winnebago From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 26 Jan 2000 04:17:43 GMT -------- I live in the SE USA and the first place I would look is in the NE USA!! This place is a machine tool desert!! teenut in Atlanta GA. John Miller wrote: > > Paul -- > > If you were looking for a ~13x40 Clausing Colchester in the S.E. U.S., is > there any particular place you'd start? And about what price range would > you expect? > > Best, > John Miller, who works in a place with 5 C-C lathes downstairs and likes 'em > > Paul Amaranth wrote in message > news:86d44m$fdi@tiger.auroragrp.com... > > If I had that chunk of money available, I'd look for a late model > > Clausing Colchester 15 inch swing. I have seen a couple in mint > > condition go for $10-12,000 with varying amounts of tooling. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: sometimes the scrapyard gods smile.... From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 26 Jan 2000 04:31:04 GMT -------- One of the reasons I decidede to go BACK into the metal working industry is that, soon, VERY soon, the one eyed machinist will be King in this land of the Blind!! Mind you the industry stank during the last ten/fifteen years! teenut Bob wrote: > > One of the reasons I started HSMing (or at least, some facsimile > thereof) is a belief that the strength of the US came from two places -- > natural resources, and its manufacturing base. It was the combination > of these two things that made it a 1st world power. The natural > resources continue to be depleted, but... > > We can only sell each other hamburgers, manicures and consulting > contracts for so long. There is only so much sand in the sandbox. When > the enormous wealth that allows a paper economy dwindles... What then? > > Just my devalued 2 cents. :) Excuse me while I pooch another part. > > kenneth knaell wrote: > > > > Susan Hill wrote in message <388c2ef7.0@news.esc.net.au>... > > >Gloating over the demise of the western world as industrial force. > > > > > >I have been there and done that. I noticed the same thing here in > > Australia > > >over the last 4-5 years - valuable machinery junked for less than 10% of > > its > > >construction cost - let alone its value including INTELLECTUAL property ! > > >(not valued in developing countries) > > > > > >What you are seeing is the result of liquidated sales of companies that > > used > > >to produce goods and services that are now being made in the Peoples > > >Republic of China. Having spent some time working over there - it is > > >premature for you to gloat over your pickings. > > > > > >I think it will get worse - and when the hi tech bubble bursts - we will > > all > > >wish we had some of our dirty old manufacturing industries back again. > > >Printed circuits can't put food on the table. > > > > I don't know whether or not PC's can/n't put food on the table but I agree > > that we would be much better off if we can keep as many manufacturing jobs > > in this country as possible. Not everyone wants to or can be a computer > > programmer or basketball player. > > > > > > > >Anyway that's my view and you can take it or chuck it - no pun intended. > > > > > >Brook Hill > > > > > >AZBabe520 wrote in message > > <20000123002556.03691.00000928@ng-fk1.aol.com>... > > >>hello from fellow junkyard junkey > > > > > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Compressed air history. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 26 Jan 2000 04:44:54 GMT -------- That was the Zalinsky Dynamite Gun. It actually came about, not because of lack of propellants..Black Powder, even guncotton was known then..But because the dynamite filling of the projectiles was too sensitive for use with conventional propellants. teenut Robert Swinney wrote: > > Funny that no one mentioned the compressed air ordnance the Navy (yes, ours) > experimented with. After a while they decided tri-nitro-guncotten, or was > it tri-nitro wood chips? Anyway, that there was a better way to hurl large > projectiles than with compressed air. > Bob Swinney > > Russ Short wrote in message > news:20000122215835.03571.00001202@ng-cl1.aol.com... > > This is similar to the Taylor Hydraulic air compressor. One of these was > built > > near Ontonagon, Michigan to furnish compressed air for use in a copper > mine. > > Another was used at Cobalt, Ontario. These were in the 30,000 to 40,000 > cfm > > range and are pictured in the Marks Mechanical Engineering Handbook. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Bluing tank parts From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 26 Jan 2000 04:58:51 GMT -------- I would be very interested as I plan to set up a rust bluing operation (Hot water tank needed to scald off after rusting) Where are you located and how much for packaging and shipping to Atlanta? teenut PKDickman wrote: > > Hey: > Any of you guys planning to build a hot bluing tank? > > About a dozen years ago, I scrounged the cast iron burner strip out of a space > heater with the intention of using it for a bluing tank heater. > It's a strip of jets 3" wide and 30" long. I have the original orifice assembly > as well as the pilot light and thermocouple. > > I'm never gonna build a tank and I'm tired of moving it around to sweep. > > Anybody who can use it can have it for the cost of postage. > > If you plan to use the pilot light you'll need to scrounge a furnace valve and > transformer and probably a new thermocouple. If you don't want a pilot light, > all you need is a half inch gas valve and some angle iron to mount it on. > > Paul K. Dickman ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: a lesson in metallurgy From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 26 Jan 2000 06:27:05 GMT -------- British milk still(?) comes in glass, pint bottles, with an aluminum foil cap! teenut Gerald Miller wrote: > > -- > > Gerry > London, Canada > > Mark Kinsler wrote in message > news:z8mj4.7698$W6.117259@tw11.nn.bcandid.com... > > >Aluminum is obtained from milk where it > > >floats to the surface > > >forming a skin. > > > > I don't quite understand this last one. A Britishism? > > > Aluminium = albumin (a protein in milk among others) > > > . > > > > >COPPER is a dark blue variety of Tin, used as an inert filler for Panda > > >Cars and Football Stadiums (Stadia?). > > > > This one escapes me completely. I don't know what a Panda Car is, either. > > Copper, Cop = policeman > > ......... > > [Last thought before hitting "SEND:" a Panda car would be black and white, > > like perhaps a police car. And there are a lot of police present in > > British soccer stadia, from all accounts. Copper... > > ........ > Right on > > > > >TUNGSTON, SODIUM and STRONTIUM are light sorts of Tin. Tungston grows > > >from bulbs, Sodium grows on long stalks at the side of the road. > > > > I understand tungsten and bulbs, but not the sodium and stalks by the side > > of the road... > > > As in street lights? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Technique for making PERFECT CUBE From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 26 Jan 2000 06:36:01 GMT -------- You want it QUICK or ACCURATE???? Next you will ask for CHEAP too! We only do three kinds of work around here.. QUICK, CHEAP and ACCURATE. You can only chose TWO of the above. If it is QUICK and CHEAP.....It won't be ACCURATE! If it is QUICK and ACCURATE.......It won't be CHEAP! If it is ACCURATE and CHEAP..........It won't be QUICK! Yer pays yer money..yer takes yer TURN!! (The above was a sign on the wall at the Machine Shop I just bought...Fell in love with it I did!!!) teenut Miles wrote: > > All right - a poser for you experts out there. How do you quickly > and accurately make a number of 'perfect' cubes, non-ferrous, without > grinding, of an odd size, say around .711". ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Bridgeport Model F-362-00-907 From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 26 Jan 2000 06:40:07 GMT -------- No this would not be a typical price! If it is in "reasonable shape" a typical price might be two or three times higher!!! teenut Dennis van Dam wrote: > > Today, I looked at a Bridgeport mill, model number F-362-00-907. > > It comes with digital readout on X and Y, ( Sony Magnescale EA-210), and a > 3 phase to 220 converter for the electrical hook up. > > To my untrained eye, it appears to be an older mill but in reasonable > shape. The asking price is $1000.00 which also seems reasonable, even > without the digital readout and the converter. Before pursuing the deal > any further I thought I'd check with RCM's resident panel of experts. > > Is there anything in particular I should inspect or be on the lookout for > before making the purchase? > > Assuming it is in reasonable shape, would this be a typical price? > > Thanks in advance, > > Dennis van Dam ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: New Magnum "Mauser" Actions From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 26 Jan 2000 06:50:58 GMT -------- So would I...But it is gonna be a LOOONG time before I make actions of those sizes!! Too many original Mauser actions about, for the "Purists"..as good as anything I could make...for a whole lot less!!! Those calibers are not used for Dangerous Game...A $300.00 Remington 700 will satisfy the vast majority of users and uses for those calibers. Sako would be a better choice in the smaller sizes. teenut ULAV8R wrote: > > Sounds good, I would like to see a set of actions, smallest for .222 > Mag, next for .308 size cartridges, then '06 size and the larger ones. > Of course, I couldn't afford any of them. The one I would like most > would be the standard Mod. '98 length with small ring and large shank > barrel thread for .257 Robert and 7MM Mauser. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Stuck Micrometer From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 26 Jan 2000 06:54:00 GMT -------- Define cheap sex? A thousand dollar Hooker is a lot cheaper than a quick fling with the baby sitter who then comes back pregnant!!! teenut PLAlbrecht wrote: > > Private to you only. Sweetheart. > > >Cheap cutting tools, cheap machinery, cheap materials, cheap labor..they all > >cost more in the long (even short) run. > > Cheap sex? > > Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Question on locating and drilling holes for an amateur From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 26 Jan 2000 07:04:40 GMT -------- If you MUST use a pilot hole.. (Good reasons why....Drill will cut accurately to size even if not perfectly ground. Even with web thinning your drill press simply doesn't have the "Push") Drill a pilot hole only as big as the web..then follow with the full size drill. Less chance of grabbing, chipping the lip or burning out the drill corners. Also faster!! (your Machinist friend is correct) teenut Dan Caster wrote: > > I was told by a machinist to drill the pilot hole about the diameter > of the final size drill web, and then to drill the hole with the > drill that will give you the final size. I can see the logic to this. > The drill web doesn't make a chip with some place for the chip to go. > And if you are doing production work, it is a lot faster to use the > full width of the cutting edge and get it done. The big drill will > also follow the pilot hole, so why go thru a bunch of different > drills. > > So my question is Are there any books that say that you should > do it any other way? And my other question is What do you say, > teenut, Scott? > Dan > > -- > When I was a young man, > I wished I was the son of a rich man. > But now that I am older, > I just wish my son were the son of a rich man > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: New Magnum "Mauser" Actions From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 26 Jan 2000 09:41:09 GMT -------- I surely do!! I recently paid $250.00 for a book entitled "US Rifles and Machine Guns" by Colvin and Viall, McGraw Hill, 1917. This was published by request of the US government as as complete manufacturing guide for the M0del 1903 Springfield Rifle. There plan was..in the event of war, to enable other contracters to set up and manufacture the rifle at short notice..Springfield Armory being unable to keep up with even peace time demand. In the event, they turned to the Enfield Model 1917..The rest is history!! This book details every single manufacturing step of the 03 Rifle..including the furniture, stock, oilers and bayonet!! Thousands of different custom machines, tools, jigs, fixtures, gauges etc are detailed...All you could ever hope for if you wanted to build an 03 from scratch..including dimensioned drawings, tolerances, materials heat-treatment and finishing specs. The Mauser and Enfields were built by identical methods and equipment. I hasten to add that hardly ANY of the toolong and processes are relevant to my project...Built the old way the actions would cost THOUSANDS of dollars each..one reason why commercial actions designed since these classics have been "Dumbed Down" for cheaper manufacturing. However, modern CNC machining makes it possible to reproduce these actions..AND improve on the tolerances, materials and heat treatment. They will never be produced for the same prices though. IIRC the complete Springfield was produced for about $16.00!!! I also have a copy of Stuart Otteson's two volume work, "The Bolt Action"..THE absolute definitive engineering study of bolt actions from the 98 Mauser through to the present. Beside it, Frank Haas' book, "Bolt Action Rifles" is an amateurish and error riddled joke! In effect the 98 sets the standards by which ALL others are judged..the vast majority come up SEVERELY short in many important areas. None are judged to be better!! If you can find a copy of Ottesons books it will set you back close to $200.00!! Other than that I think I have every book on bolt actions, particularly Mausers, that has ever been printed in English. Plus a lot more on Gunsmithing and related subjects. So this project is not going ahead in blind faith..I DO know a little bit about the subject!! By the way...It took a LOOOONG time to find these books. I also put in a search request at my local library for the 03 Springfield book,and,after three months, they obtained it on InterLibrary Loan, from the Pittsburgh State University, Pittsburg, Kansas 66762. The cost was THREE DOLLARS!!!!..But it does have to go back!! I may well be the only person on the face of the earth with TWO copies of this TOME (8 1/2" x 11" x 332pp) in my possession at this very moment!! Ask your local Library to get it for you..It should be easier now its whereabouts are located. teenut Robert Fahey wrote: > > I have a suspicion you have access to references most of us have never > seen. Care to educate us on the sources for this info? Particularly the > comments previously on the number of operations in making the Mauser > originally? > PS = you really know how to start a thread!! > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > Thanks for your words of encouragement. > > > > Yes I do intend to retain the solid left wall of the original mauser. This has, > > as you say been slowly eroded by other manufacturers due to the difficulty of > > "modern Manufacturing" ie Broaching etc. > > > > In actual fact, the methods used by Springfield armory to plane the slots (They > > called it "shaving") would have produced the inner ring with a solid left wall > > just as easily as the ringless springfield design!! > > > > Firstly a lot of the waste was removed by a series of milling cuts. > > Then they used five separate HAND OPERATED "Shaving machines" to cut the front > > and rear left hand races plus the front and rear right hand races and the safety > > lug race in the top of the bridge. The cutting tool was similar to a large pull > > type hook rifling cutter, It was not full width but about 1/8" wide. As the > > handle moved it back and forth a ratchet device started to sweep it about an > > arc(once it reached full depth) so as to shave the raceway to full width. > > > > I intend to remove as much waste as possible during the milling operations and > > then SINKER EDM the raceways to final shape. > > > > teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Stuck Micrometer From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 26 Jan 2000 10:01:23 GMT -------- Mine too!! Contrary to popular opinion, the Indians are capable of producing first class machine tools. Witness the fact, that for many years, all the conventional turret lathes and milling machines marketed by Alfred Herbert, were actually produced in India under licence. From first hand experience (I used to work for Herberts) I can tell you that the quality, fit, finish and performance was as good or BETTER than any of the UK produced machines!! Those machines are probably being produced..to this day, 18 years after the final, sad demise of Alfred Herbert. It has also been my privilege to work with, and employ, machinists who were trained in India. They are World Class! teenut Hugh Strong wrote: > My bet would be on India. > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Stuck Micrometer From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 26 Jan 2000 10:11:45 GMT -------- Hardly a valid point..there is similarly no "researched" evidence that they don't!! I do still have my original Moore and Wright 0-1" mic bought new 39 years ago and it is still as accurate as ever. I have worn out and chucked away several cheap imports (Mitutoyo USED to be cheap!!) in that same time. I stand by my statement, that Starrett and others I mentioned have EARNED the RIGHT, in my honest opinion, to be first choice for the discerning and COST CONSCIOUS Professional!! Quality control is no place to cut corners..not if you want to stay in the business. teenut Hugh Strong wrote: > Perhaps, but the thread was a about measuring tools. There > have also been practically no numbers to back up claims. > Not even a "A Starrett lasts X years more than a Chinese > import" type claim. That's par for Usenet, though. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: New Magnum "Mauser" Actions From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 26 Jan 2000 10:33:58 GMT -------- Gary Coffman wrote: > But I believe the record for most elephants killed in a day is still held by a ivory > hunter (whose name escapes me at the moment) who used a 7mm Mauser for > all his kills. Elephants aren't hard to kill, if you place the shot properly. By "Kilimanjaro" Bell who used a Mauser actioned Rigby 275 Express (7 x 57 Mauser) That rifle is (or was) in Rigby's London Showroom and I have handled it!! But you failed to tell the whole story Gary... In Bell's day, elephant still roamed open grass lands, in huge numbers, unafraid of distant hunters. Bell portered with him, a collapsible, elevated, shooting stand. High enough so that he could see over the tall elephant grass, he could take carefully aimed shots from far enough away not to spook the herd..somewhat like the old buffalo hunters did in N America. He was probably one of the finest rifle shots that EVER lived..with an intimate knowledge of elephant anatomy that enabled him to hit the brain from whatever angle he shot. Those conditions a NOT found now!! Elephant are much warier and have taken to thick cover. The ones left are generally of a larger type than the plains elephant he hunted then. It is on record that, quite literally, SCORES of intrepid (Stupid) hunters have been killed by elephant, while trying to emulate Bell's feats. It STILL happens on an almost annual basis. The 7mm, 303 British, 30-06..even the 375 H&H Magnum are NOT gun enough to go into bush after elephant, rhino, hippo or Cape Buffalo. Too many men have been killed trying to prove otherwise! Some Professional Hunters and Game Control Officers feel that the .577 Nitro Express is barely adequate for today's conditions. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: New Magnum "Mauser" Actions From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 26 Jan 2000 10:39:58 GMT -------- That is true, The hippo is a dangerous beast if you get between him and the water...And he can out run a horse on land!! teenut Bray Haven wrote: > > >THe water Buffalo is the most feared and dangerous. Rhino is bad enough, > >but more hunters killed by Buffalo than Rhino. > > > >Martin > > I'm sure Martin was referring to Cape buffalo rather than water buffalo which > are used in asian countries to plow the rice paddies. Can be mean, but not of > T'Rex caliber. Actually the animal responsible for most fatalities in Africa > is the hippo. > > Greg Sefton ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Winnebago instad of Lathe From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 26 Jan 2000 12:14:41 GMT -------- I have never travelled in a Winnebago..or ever really desired to do so! My idea of roughing it is an hotel without room service!! However, I would imagine that you will stretch your tool, vehicle and gas money a LOT further by buying a panel van or similar and putting a mattress in it. Winnebagos tend to be expensive to buy, HEAVY on gas, slower on the road and more difficult to park up for the night. Truck stops all over the country provide good, inexpensive food, plus hot showers etc.. If you get to Atlanta, look me up..I'm in the book (under Ronald not Robert..anti phone spam!!) I will put you up for a coupla days and let you take all the hot showers you need!! teenut Alan Bone wrote: > > I am considering a visit to the US for about 4 months from late > May, depending on the sale of my old house and cash availability and > would like to know approximate prices of very much used Winnebago's. > campervans or even panelvans I could put an airbed in. It will be > strictly an economy visit - no luxury hotels, fancy restaurants - I > want to have some cash left to buy small tools to take home with me. > > No lathe, I already have one - if I can get it back off one of my > sons, he has been using it to make parts for a motor conversion job - > putting a V6 into a Daihatsu 4wd. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Milling some aluminum, asking for advice. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 26 Jan 2000 15:43:04 GMT -------- With 5HP to play with..don't try to get "Artsy-Craftsy" with it..Wack it off with one roughing cut..leaving .025" for a finisher. Running around with a 1/4" mill will be slower..chips harder to clear, coolant harder to apply and you will still have to do a finisher..A 1/4" mill will flutter too much for accuracy and good finish if you push it at all!! teenut BillDarby wrote: > > A friend has asked me to mill a few hundred aluminum corner brackets for some > box shape frames that he's constructing. He plans to build the frame from 2" > box al tube [the eight side members cut to length with my corner brackets > interconnecting the three side members at each corner] > > The plan is to start with a 3" cube and on each of three adjacent sides, mill > away all but what is needed to project into the 2" box tube side members, to a > depth of an inch. > > I don't have much of a feel for the smartest way to do the job. [never worked > much on al] I have a 5 horse CNC to do the work. I know I could just vice the > cube and take a one inch deep cut around the profile [of the tube interior] > with a 3/4 or 1" dia cutter. Then repeat for each of the other two sides. > > The sort of questions I'm asking myself are > > Could I get away with using a 1/4 cutter doing four 1/4" deep passes around the > profile on each face and let the waste chunk fall away? [I have lots and lots > of 1/4" carbide cutters] > > Would it be wise to cut away the waste on the radial arm saw before milling? > That would mean two 1" deep cuts across the face of each of the three faces of > the cube. [six cuts per] > > Your thoughts would be appreciated. > > Bill Darby ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: New Magnum "Mauser" Actions From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 26 Jan 2000 16:14:58 GMT -------- The point about the real Heavies...577 .600 and .700 is that they DO have a large margin for error. An elephants brain is quite small..and surrounded by a massive honeycombed skull. A small caliber "near miss" will NOT stop a charge..or a terrified wounded animal heading for the next county. If the Brain is missed it will likely give the pachyderm a monsterous headache for a couple of days and full recovery is the norm. For a hunter to find small bore bullets in an elephants head is not uncommon. On the other hand, any one of the above Big Bores will knock an elephant cold for at least 20 minutes (.577) to 35 minutes (.700) even if it misses the brain. They have tremendous penetration and can reach the brain with a shot from any angle..even ranging forward from a rump shot on a fleeing beast..to reach the brain. They have the "Anchoring" or Knock-Down" power that smaller bores just don't have. Once down for the count, the elephant can be given a "Coup de Grace" at leisure if the brain shot was missed. On Cape Buffalo..a similar situation arises...the massive horn boss and frontal plate of the skull will stop a lesser round dead..breaking up even the toughest steel jacketed solids. A "Dead Stop" shot is required, close up, as many shots are, given the Buffs propensity for actively stalking and ambushing his protaganist. Much as the hunters, professional and amateur alike, love the Double Rifle, the cost and availability rules it out for all but the wealthy. A utilitarian grade English Double might start at the $15000.00 level and go on up to six figures!..even if you could find one and afford it..the thought of that getting stomped on is enough to pale even wealthy men! Quite apart from that, Americans do not, generally take to the double rifle, and its "shotgun" handling and technique...They are more accustomed to and more comfortable..Therefore, more ACCURATE with Bolt Action Rifles. And, as you point out, the client has to be able to shoot straight with his rifle. I intend to develop this action and a companion, new, caliber, the 577/550 3 1/4" Nitro Express..which hopefully, with a little less recoil will develop the same penetration and almost the same knock-down power as the .577 3" NE..in a round designed for a bolt action magazine rifle. There is a good chance that this could also become popular as a .495 caliber, long range, caliber...Especially if the Antis manage to ban the 50 BMG and any derivatives there-of. But then, its just a dream!! teenut Gary Coffman wrote: > > On Wed, 26 Jan 2000 10:33:58 GMT, Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > >Gary Coffman wrote: > > > >> But I believe the record for most elephants killed in a day is still held by a ivory > >> hunter (whose name escapes me at the moment) who used a 7mm Mauser for > >> all his kills. Elephants aren't hard to kill, if you place the shot properly. > > > >By "Kilimanjaro" Bell who used a Mauser actioned Rigby 275 Express (7 x 57 > >Mauser) That rifle is (or was) in Rigby's London Showroom and I have handled > >it!! > > That's the fellow. > > >But you failed to tell the whole story Gary... > > > >In Bell's day, elephant still roamed open grass lands, in huge numbers, unafraid > >of distant hunters. Bell portered with him, a collapsible, elevated, shooting > >stand. High enough so that he could see over the tall elephant grass, he could > >take carefully aimed shots from far enough away not to spook the herd..somewhat > >like the old buffalo hunters did in N America. > > Right. In more recent times, shooting platforms on top of vehicles were > used. (In India, the Raj hunted from elephant back, automatically giving > them the proper vantage, and a bit safer position if the game didn't decide > to cooperate.) Today's conditions are a bit different. > > >He was probably one of the finest rifle shots that EVER lived..with an intimate > >knowledge of elephant anatomy that enabled him to hit the brain from whatever > >angle he shot. > > Every *good* hunter should have a thorough knowledge of the ballistics of his > chosen weapon, know his capabilities with it (and stay within them), and know > the anatomy of his quarry. Unfortunately a lot of hunters don't, and even more > unfortunately many of them think that they can make up for that lack by using > a bigger gun. But a poorly placed shot is still a poor shot, and won't immediately > drop the animal even if it is made with a 600 Nitro. > > >Those conditions a NOT found now!! Elephant are much warier and have taken to > >thick cover. The ones left are generally of a larger type than the plains > >elephant he hunted then. > > > >It is on record that, quite literally, SCORES of intrepid (Stupid) hunters have > >been killed by elephant, while trying to emulate Bell's feats. It STILL happens > >on an almost annual basis. > > Yeah, that's why most African countries require that a professional hunter > must guide the tyros, and act as backup. It is for their own protection (as well > as for the protection of the game). From the point of view of the administrations, > the occasional dead hunter isn't a bad thing. It enhances the mystique of hunting > dangerous game. But a wounded animal can be a serious problem. It puts the > native population at risk (which is no longer politically palatable). > > >The 7mm, 303 British, 30-06..even the 375 H&H Magnum are NOT gun enough to go > >into bush after elephant, rhino, hippo or Cape Buffalo. Too many men have been > >killed trying to prove otherwise! > > > >Some Professional Hunters and Game Control Officers feel that the .577 Nitro > >Express is barely adequate for today's conditions. > > A higher energy cartridge does give one a *little* more margin in shot placement > because the zone of massive tissue damage is a bit bigger (not much bigger, > however). The more important quality is the ability to penetrate deeper if the > shot must be made at an unfavorable angle. But you do have to be good enough > to place the shot well regardless of caliber. My lament is that too few tyros are > willing to shoot the big boomers enough to be able to consistently do that. > > I love to shoot the big guns (I consider the .375 H&H a fun plinker). But even > I don't relish the punishment that the really large calibers hand out. A few shots > with my friend's 600 Nitro double rifle leaves me fairly badly bruised, and I > need a couple of weeks before I'm ready to shoot well again. So I'll never > have the accuracy and consistency with it that I achieve with the .375 and > smaller calibers that I do shoot frequently. > > OTOH I love shooting the Barrett "light" .50. The recoil from it doesn't bruise. > Different gun design, of course, it pushes rather than pounds. Unfortunately, > I don't think it is on the approved list in several African countries. Incidently, > that's why most of the African calibers are odd balls. Weapons (and more > importantly, ammo) considered suitable for warfare were prohibited to be > brought into many of these countries. (Fear of them falling into the wrong > hands.) > > I know you want to make traditional rifles, and I wish you well in the endeavor, > but I'd really like to see a modern gas buffered recoil design that lets one shoot > often enough to be good without the bruising that the traditional designs deliver. > > Gary > Gary Coffman KE4ZV | You make it |mail to ke4zv@bellsouth.net > 534 Shannon Way | We break it | > Lawrenceville, GA | Guaranteed | ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Question on locating and drilling holes for an amateur From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 26 Jan 2000 18:04:56 GMT -------- The solid bit down the middle that stops the two flutes from meeting and producing two interesting spiral fingers. The end of it is called the "chisel edge" teenut Kevin Szabo wrote: > > In article , > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > > > >Drill a pilot hole only as big as the web.. > > then follow with the full size drill. > > > >Less chance of grabbing, chipping the lip or burning out the drill corners. > > First dumb question for this wednesday ... > > What part of the drill is the `web'? > > Thanks, > Kevin > > P.S. Did you get your son his 'Scope? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Milling some aluminum, asking for advice. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 26 Jan 2000 18:09:13 GMT -------- I assumed he is trying to make money with this job..not interestingly shaped pieces of scrap? Please don't give up your day job. ;^) teenut Terry Crook wrote: > > From my position of near-total inexperience, it appears that the "waste > chunk" > is a mirror image of the finished piece. If you could start with a slightly > larger piece, and could make the cuts such that the waste piece would be > usable, > you might save not only material, but some machining as well. > > For example, starting with a 3.25" cube, make an L-shaped cut in each face > beginning in the middle of one edge, then to the center of that face, and > ending in the middle of the adjacent edge, to a depth of 1.625. Repeat this > cut on two other faces, and you will have two usable pieces with the waste > being the 1/4" "kerf". > > To reduce the setup time, if you could start with a 3.25" square bar of > whatever length your mill will handle, you could cut several pieces in one > setting, especially with CNC. > > If this is a completely wacky idea, or if my 3-d visualization is failing me > this morning, then never mind. > > ++ > Terry > > BillDarby wrote in message <388EFD16.81A2B55C@sympatico.ca>... > >A friend has asked me to mill a few hundred aluminum corner brackets for > some > >box shape frames that he's constructing. He plans to build the frame > from 2" > >box al tube [the eight side members cut to length with my corner brackets > >interconnecting the three side members at each corner] > > > >The plan is to start with a 3" cube and on each of three adjacent sides, > mill > >away all but what is needed to project into the 2" box tube side members, > to a > >depth of an inch. > > > >I don't have much of a feel for the smartest way to do the job. [never > worked > >much on al] I have a 5 horse CNC to do the work. I know I could just > vice the > >cube and take a one inch deep cut around the profile [of the tube > interior] > >with a 3/4 or 1" dia cutter. Then repeat for each of the other two > sides. > > > >The sort of questions I'm asking myself are > > > >Could I get away with using a 1/4 cutter doing four 1/4" deep passes around > the > >profile on each face and let the waste chunk fall away? [I have lots and > lots > >of 1/4" carbide cutters] > > > >Would it be wise to cut away the waste on the radial arm saw before > milling? > >That would mean two 1" deep cuts across the face of each of the three > faces of > >the cube. [six cuts per] > > > >Your thoughts would be appreciated. > > > >Bill Darby > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: New Magnum "Mauser" Actions From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 26 Jan 2000 18:13:36 GMT -------- You are entitled to your opinion..humble or not Greg. But you are wrong..and that makes you appear not just misinformed, but silly too! I suggest you go do some serious research before opening up half cocked again.! teenut Bray Haven wrote: > > I was afraid I'd start a war with the opinion that smellies are aptly named. > But I guess it's just opinions and you know what they say about those... > everyone has one. > > You can still buy barrels of smellies for $75 apiece. Not so with decent > mausers. The really good British rifle builders apparently didn't share you > enthusiasm and rejected the national jack handle to use Mauser actions on their > many fine sporting BA rifles WR, rigby etc, etc. I also know of no self > respecting gunmaker today who would theink of building a custom rifle on the LE > action. The 303 was a decent single shot round but not a good magazine rifle > cartridge due to the rim. Also a good basis for some interesting SS wildcats > over the years . Try camming a dirty round into a chamber with one in the heat > of battle (yes Gunner, I've ben there too). I've seen them blow up with dirty > bores with injuries. Poorly designed for shooter protection. Shears off the > lug and sends the bolt htrough the cheek of the shooter (ruins your whole day). > Very sloppy and if you shove the bolt home at an angle, it binds, if not > absolutely clean and well oiled. Just my opinion. Lock time measured in > millenia (something around a good flintlock). They sure didn't win many 1000 yd > matches at Camp Perry to my recollection. Of course you can kill a deer with > one or a president just as you can a Carcano. Doesn't make them the "finest > battle rifle ever designed" IMO (nothing humble about it :o). > > Greg Sefton > > > >There is an old saying, and one which I agree with in principle: > > > >The Germans went to war with a hunting rifle > >The Americans went to war with a target rifle > >The Brits went to war with a battle rifle. > > > >I have samples of all,, and I concure, the SMLE #4 is one of the, if > >not the, finest battle rifles ever built and taken to war. > > > >Reliable as an anvil, rate of fire is excellent, accurate enough for > >battle use, simple to maintain, rugged as hell. Ive toted a > >semi-sporter Smellie over a few thousand miles of hills and dales, and > >fed the freezer many times with one. And I have "several" other types > >of arms... and I have some small understanding of the rigors that a > >battle rifle must go through..... > > > >Gunner ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: New Magnum "Mauser" Actions From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 26 Jan 2000 18:24:40 GMT -------- I for one John want to see a solid reliable reference to this "rampage with a fifty caliber"..funny no one else has reported such an incident. Of course a 50 caliber will punch through a steel plate..so will a thirty caliber..so will my .22 caliber!! There is so much unmitigated rubbish INVENTED by the press about the big fifty and its abilities/uses that one has to wonder exactly what agenda they are on. Do a search if you will, on .50BMG..Read, learn and wonder where they get this garbage..and more importantly..what OTHER garbage are these denizens of the Media feeding to you. Don't miss your assignment now..or I will have to come back and slap you HARD with the FACTS!! Trust me..you don't want that! teenut John Flanagan wrote: > > Did you see hte report on CBS last night about the guy who went on a > rampage with a 50 caliber? They made is out to be a real evil gun > with no sporting value and that ANYONE could buy one and it's LEGAL! > They showed a semi-automatic punching through steel plate. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Dead Center Lubricant From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 26 Jan 2000 18:49:26 GMT -------- Go back and read my original post Jim...Notice the "smiley" and take a tablet!! teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article , > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote (after his short > hiatus - ice storm??: > > > Ah! But his question was NOT what are good reasons for using a live > > center. It > > was, IIRC, "Why would anyone ever use a dead center" > > Indeed. It *was* a good question. That's my point. So what's > with the butt-kicking? > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: New Magnum "Mauser" Actions From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2000 03:39:07 GMT -------- I think you have got right off the point Greg..Which is that the Smellie, as it has been AFFECTIONATELY called by several generations of British and Commonwealth soldiers as well as shooters, (From SMLE..Short Magazine Lee Enfield..get it?) is argued by many with greater expertise than me, to be the finest bolt action BATTLE RIFLE ever put into the hands of troops. No one disputes the superiority and strength of the Mauser as a SPORTING rifle. It is a classic of design..but like so many other German weapons..the Luger for instance..it is just too finely fitted for use in the grit and mud of a battlefield. Yes the Smellie is ugly..beyond ugly..but it handles and points like a best grade shotgun. Its short stroke, slick action, allows an expert to fire 30 AIMED rounds a minute. Its misbegotten handle was designed for bayonet fighting and its two piece butt makes a wonderfully tough trench club...try that with a Mauser 98 and you have a long barrelled, mud choked pistol!! Pretty it isn't, accurate and reliable it is..like a Timex they took a licking and kept on ticking..some of them for almost fifty years in front line service. (Cheap shot about my "alleged" plans to build Mauser replicas will be ignored for now..I just plunked down several hundred thousand dollars to by the means and today spent another couple or more hundreds on applications for a BATF "Non Destructive Devices" Manufacturing Licence, an FFL and a PCP..They actually LIKE the idea of me carrying a concealed personal defense weapon when I might be working late hours in an "Arms Factory"!!!!) As for accuracy...How come the Queens Prize at Bisley..which is open to all comers with a current military issue rifle, was never won by a Mauser or a Springfield?? What would have happened if the National Match had been opened up to "Smellies" Trust me, in the 600 to 1200 yard ranges they STILL take a hell of a lot of beating! Respectfully teenut Bray Haven wrote: > > T. Nut says, > >You are entitled to your opinion..humble or not Greg. But you are wrong..and > >that makes you appear not just misinformed, but silly too! > > > >I suggest you go do some serious research before opening up half cocked > >again.! > > Whatever you say, Tee. Try to be more specific though. What did I say that was > wrong? I guess the master gunsmiths of the world are wrong. I've been a > gunsmith for over 40 years. Have shot competitively for 30 some odd. Been a > weapons instructor. Been an infantry officer in combat and hunted big game on > several continents. Was an outdoor writer and editor for many years, on and on > etc. but you're (alledgedly) going to build mauser actions and that makes you > an authority on the design of bolt action rifles. I thought you were building > mausers. Why not build up sized SMELLIES if they are so damn good? I've > worked with many great gunmakers who build the truly fine custom guns made in > the US today and they ALL share my opinion. Your credentials to call me > uninformed and silly are somewhat reversing the insult. Why is my opinion > "wrong" and yours "right"? I think you are just still mad at me for saying > unkind things about public smoking :o). As the legendary philosopher, Josh > Billings once said, "it aint ignorance so much as folks knowing a lot that just > ain't so" OWTE. > > Greg Sefton ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Milling some aluminum, asking for advice. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2000 04:11:28 GMT -------- I'm sorry Terry..forgive my rough edged Yorkshire "Humor" Balanced as I am, between the worlds of "Amateur" and "Pro" it is easy to forget the days when every little offcut of metal was jealously guarded and often set off, in its very shape, a delicious series of creative daydreams. Unfortunately, when you are shifting metal for money..no such luxury has any place in your tactics. Wack the waste out of the way by the fastest and most efficiently brutal way..once it leaves the cutters edge it is only the concern of the floor sweeper and the scrap merchant. Most shops do have a bin for "Useful Offcuts"..some of which reach endemic proportions. But the manager with an eye for the bottom line is aware that "The scrap bit is a wonderful Servant..But a terrible Master" One has to be quite sanguine at times about chucking out all the off cuts...but not after watching a $25.00 an hour machinist spend half an hour culling for "Just the right piece" of hot rolled..when the laborer could have wacked him a perfect piece, off a virgin bar, in the time it took for him to make a potty stop! Having said that..I will not be sending my offcuts to "Jones the Scrap"..they will go in a special bin..for my fellow RCMers and HSMs in Atlanta!! Please don't let my comments drive you back into "Lurk" mode..You will quickly learn...as most people round here already know..that my curmudgeonly bark is far worse than my toothless bite!! teenut Terry Crook wrote: > > I appreciate your concern for my welfare! If someone would pay > me this much to make interestingly-shaped pieces of scrap, I > wouldn't be writing software for a living! ;-) > > Since my metalworking experience is more at the "wannabe HSM" > level, perhaps you could enlighten me as to the shortcomings > of my suggestion? Is it impossible, impractical, or just > inefficient? Or is this so glaringly obvious that I should > just resume lurking until understanding dawns? > > ++ > Terry > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> > wrote in message ... > >I assumed he is trying to make money with this job..not interestingly > shaped > >pieces of scrap? > > > >Please don't give up your day job. > > > >;^) > > > >teenut > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Cutter Hit Mill Table From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2000 04:20:43 GMT -------- Now you are a REAL Machinist!! Don't sweat the small stuff..life is too short. Cheer up..The worst is yet to come!! 8^) teenut WilliamK wrote: > > I know none of you have done this, but last night my hole saw grazed the > top of my mill-drill table. So now I have a shallow groove on what used > to be a clean surface. > > I know its just cosmetic, but does anyone have ideas on how to repair > the damage? The thought of resurfacing the entire table does not sound > appealing. > > Thank you. > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: help on ebay problem From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2000 04:31:14 GMT -------- Grant Erwin wrote: > > I recently "won" an auction for about $6. It's for a small dial comparator > made by Federal. It couldn't weigh more than a coupla pounds. The seller > now wants me to pay over $20 in "shipping". I sent a protesting email, > and now they aren't responding. I'm not sure where I stand. If I refuse > to pay such extortionate "shipping", am I then shunned as a non-paying > customer? Had a similar experience recently..Seller argued that high shipping/handling costs were to offset the cheap price I got it for. I told him to shove it where the sun don't shine..and if he complained to Ebay..I would do the same. He probably wanted me to do just that..so he didn,t have to sell it for the low bid price..but what the hey! Life is too short to sweat the small stuff. > > While I'm at it, another seller refuses to leave me feedback unless I > leave him feedback first. This after sending a MO the first day and not > receiving the goods two weeks later. I'm tempted to leave him negative > feedback about his shipping delay and feedback policy .. what do you think? Go ahead and do just that, succinctly tell the world exactly what you think of his practices. If he counters with anegative..it WILL be groundless and Ebay WILL remove it! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Stuck Micrometer From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2000 04:38:22 GMT -------- Ah, but the point is not saving money..good tools don't COST money..they MAKE money. In a professional/Commercial situation..which IS what we were talking about..A bad tool can cost, in a heartbeat, a hundred times what any accrued savings might be. Rework and returned goods are expensive to rectify and the damage to your reputation can be insurmountable. There are many places where you can cut costs and corners..Basic reference and measuring tools ain't one to even consider. I guess, like Caesars wife..they have to be above reproach! teenut Dan Caster wrote: > > There are good arguments on both sides. But you are wrong when you > just take the cost and divide by the number of years it lasts. > You need to assume that you did something with the difference in the > cost between the higher cost item and the lower one. > A 50$ mike vs a 10$ mike. Did you invest the difference of 40$ in > more tools that let you do more jobs? Or did you invest it where it > doubled say every ten years? And then there are taxes, to consider. > I just hope everyone spent their money where it gave them the most > pleasure. For some it is holding quality in your hand, for others it > is having more tools for the same amount of money so they aren't > frustrated by not having the tool they need. > Cheers, > Dan > > "Hugh Strong" wrote: > > > You've made a claim with some numbers in it. Assuming that > > the cheap imports now are the same as they were then, you > > just have to keep using it another 39 years. (I'm assuming > > a $50-60 "good" micrometer and a $8-10 cheap one.) > > > > -- > When I was a young man, > I wished I was the son of a rich man. > But now that I am older, > I just wish my son were the son of a rich man > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Dead Center Lubricant From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2000 18:04:17 GMT -------- (8^[ teenut (in a REALLY Grouchy Mode) 8^) mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article , > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > > .Notice the "smiley" and take a tablet!! > > Hee hee. Doesn't count, Robert - *all* of your posts have > those in them! I think from now on we are going to have to > enforce a strict bell-curve distribution in your posts - for > every smiley one, we have to have grouchy one. Now what > *does* the grouchy emoticon look like, anyway?? > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: New Magnum "Mauser" Actions From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2000 18:17:25 GMT -------- That is the one...I tried..Lord how I tried..But couldn't find a loose copy. Eventually I decided the $250.00 was a Business Investment and bit down HARD on the bullet. teenut peterwiley@hotmail.com wrote: > > In article , > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > > I surely do!! > > > > I recently paid $250.00 for a book entitled "US Rifles and Machine > Guns" by > > Colvin and Viall, McGraw Hill, 1917. > > > > This was published by request of the US government as as complete > manufacturing > > guide for the M0del 1903 Springfield Rifle. There plan was..in the > event of > > war, to enable other contracters to set up and manufacture the rifle > at short > > notice..Springfield Armory being unable to keep up with even peace > time demand. > > > > In the event, they turned to the Enfield Model 1917..The rest is > history!! > > > > This book details every single manufacturing step of the 03 > Rifle..including the > > furniture, stock, oilers and bayonet!! Thousands of different custom > machines, > > tools, jigs, fixtures, gauges etc are detailed...All you could ever > hope for if > > you wanted to build an 03 from scratch..including dimensioned > drawings, > > tolerances, materials heat-treatment and finishing specs. > > [snip] > > Many years ago I bought a book from (IIRC) Wolff Publishing that has > complete machining details for the Springfield rifle. It may well be a > partial reprint of the one you refer to. Can't chack right now as I'm > separated from my library by a few thousand kilometers. > > I think the title was 'The Springfield Bolt Action Rifle'. > > Fully concur about the number of jigs, fixtures & special machines, > though. > > Peter Wiley > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Milling some aluminum, asking for advice. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2000 18:38:30 GMT -------- See below.... Terry Crook wrote: > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> > wrote in message ... > >I'm sorry Terry..forgive my rough edged Yorkshire "Humor" > > > >Balanced as I am, between the worlds of "Amateur" and "Pro" it is easy to > forget > >the days when every little offcut of metal was jealously guarded and often > set > >off, in its very shape, a delicious series of creative daydreams. > > > 8<----------- > [snipped treatise on false economy] > > Thanks. Actually, I was amused by your phraseology, a fact > which may have been obscured by my feeble attempt at humor. > > However, economics aside and just from a technical standpoint, > I wonder whether my suggestion would work? I don't wish to > drag this out too far, but while I've "got you on the line", > I think I could learn something useful (not to say that I > haven't already). > > My main observation was that the metal to be removed was identical > in shape to the metal being "liberated", and I was proposing an > approach to taking advantage of this fact (not to produce pieces > for the scrap bin, but to produce two usable pieces instead of one). I am not sure I follow your description of this. As I understood the application was to produce a square "tenon" on a square block. Doing this with a small diameter endmill would require a "circumferential" cut PLUS an under cut to release the square "Anulus" of waste. How does this produce two useable pieces? I must be missing something. > > From your "interesting scrap" comment, I gathered that it would > be less than successful. I accept that it may be uneconomical, > especially in a production environment. I think I may be asking > a fundamental machining question here. I'm guessing that maybe > there's a problem "plowing" a deep channel with a small-diameter > mill -- maybe rigidity, chatter, galling, something along those > lines? Or something else? All of the above..plus slower feed rate and, possibly the need to take extra cuts to reach depth. The rule of thumb is depth of cut = diameter of cutter. This is often exceeded...But at the expense of feed rate and finish, plus the danger, esp. with aluminum, of clogging and breaking the cutter. > > Thanks in advance and arrears for any and all edification. You are more than welcome! 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Milling some aluminum, asking for advice. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2000 18:42:28 GMT -------- Has he considered using one of the aluminum extrusion "Construction Systems" Bosch make a good one IIRC. Expensive materials but quick, rigid construction..Forgiving of mistakes or modifications, and easy to hang things on. All you need is a chop saw. teenut Peter Drumm wrote: > > In message <388EFD16.81A2B55C@sympatico.ca> - BillDarby > Wed, 26 Jan 2000 13:56:41 GMT writes: > :-> > :->A friend has asked me to mill a few hundred aluminum corner brackets for some > :->box shape frames that he's constructing. He plans to build the frame from 2" > :->box al tube [the eight side members cut to length with my corner brackets > :->interconnecting the three side members at each corner] > :-> > :->The plan is to start with a 3" cube and on each of three adjacent sides, mill > :->away all but what is needed to project into the 2" box tube side members, to a > :->depth of an inch. > :-> > > I know I've seen those things in catalogs, just can't think of where > tho. It may be cheaper to buy them considering that ~half the Al used > would be waste. > > Custom machining; Tool & Cutter grinding > Peter Drumm, Wausau WI > > Cyrix6x86/300 MII, OS/2 Warp 4, Linux ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Need Advice on making crank pin round From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2000 19:04:04 GMT -------- Have you tried an engine rebuild service..they have crank grinders that could possibly do the job for a reasonable fee. teenut Doug Goncz wrote: > > Dear Pete, > > You asked: > > >Is there any reasonable way to file this crankpin to round within > >a thou or two by hand? > > Sure. A micrometer and a file is all that's needed. You might set up a block to > keep the file from going below the measured minimum diameter. Files remove > metal efficiently, and if the pin isn't hardened, you can follow any > measurements by hand to that tolerance. You might make two pins or blocks the > right size and put them at either end of a pair of files, starting at a loose > spot. Add a shim for the roughing cut, and remove the shim for the finish. The > files would have to be pretty flat and straight for that to work. > > Yours, > > Doug Goncz > Experimental Machinist, Replikon Research ( USA 22044-0094 ) > Home Page: http://users.aol.com/DGoncz > "This free advice is worth whatever you are paying to read it." ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Big 6 inch From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2000 19:13:12 GMT -------- Six inches is a bit on the big side for a 9" lathe..rule of thumb is half the swing in diameter. The problem will lie, not so much in the diameter..But in the added overhang from the bearings. Bigger diameter chucks are thicker, front to back..you could find you have chatter problems you didn't have before. 5" chucks ARE made..how about that route? teenut tombsmith1@my-deja.com wrote: > > I'd like to replace the small 4" chuck on my 9x20 lathe with a 6" chuck. > Would the added weight cause any problems, or might it acutally help > (flywheel effect)? I plan to get a Bison, which should be fairly well > balanced. It looks like the jaws should clear the bed. > > Thanks, > Tom > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Romance of the mill- do you? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2000 19:50:35 GMT -------- I imagine the next paragraph will go on to describe the snort of searing heat from the nostrils of this monster as it grunts and shoulders the burden you lay it to..This apparition of power from bygone days. It is a Monster...Aye, truly a fearsome beast...but it is YOUR beast and it bends to your will! Give us more TS tee TS wrote: > > While I'm recovering from back injury, I thought I'd take an on line > writing course. One assignment was to write a paragraph that engages > all the senses without directly naming them, as in "it looked","smelled > like"... etc... > > [metal contentto follow] > -I aspire to Teenut's prodigious command of the language. > -Alas, I found myself waxing poetic about my milling machine. > > (Imagine Rod Sterling reading this…) > It sits massive and stoic, dominating the corner of the small shop. The > cold glare of the grafted-on modern halogen lamp glints keenly on the > razor edged fluted milling bit fixed in its spindle. He switches on the > forty year old relict of a bygone era, the design and engineering of > which imbues it with a character and soul that newer equipment is no > longer manufactured with. There is a pause as relays charge, then fire, > spinning up the powerful 3 phase motor. Once at full speed, there is a > faint whirring in the quill which can be differentiated from the noisy > gear train above. The way-oiler is pumped, a dash of cutting fluid > applied, and moments later, with the ease of a workhorse a stream of hot > steel crescents cascades forth, leaving trails of french fry smoke. The > vibration in the handwheel and the low rumble of each cutting edge > parting its slice of material combine with the tinkling of chips hitting > the concrete floor. This is the voice of the machine. > ---- > Does this qualify me for the tool-a-holics 12 step meeting? Is there a > meeting soon? I've got some dough burning a hole in my pocket, and this > train of thought is torturing me. > > Tony > > PS: please don't tell SWMBO ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Aluminum suppliers From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2000 19:57:27 GMT -------- Hi Jay, I took the liberty of passing your name, and email address, on to a good friend of mine..Mike Anderson at Metal Supermarkets in Atlanta. He can help you out, so expect an email dirctly from him, in short order. teenut Jay Hartwig wrote: > > Memphis area presents difficulties in finding aluminum tubing. No one > stocks it and few can order it. Any online or mail order places? I am > looking at roughly 500 linear feet of 1.5 " OD 6061 aluminum tubing. > > Any leads appreciated. > > Jay ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 3c Expanding Collets for internal holding From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 27 Jan 2000 20:13:35 GMT -------- I have never seen the beasts..but they are simple to make..especially if you have access to the front..ie., holding a through bore. Chuck a suitable sized stub of suitable metal and turn down about an inch in length to a square shoulder. Reverse this in chuck or collet and turn down to within a few thou of your bore size and to suitable (Bore) length..again to a sharpe shoulder..leaving about 1/8" of shoulder between the two diameters. Drill right through and tap a suitably sized fine thread. Countersink the bore to a 60 deg included angle. Center punche the shoulder at no 1 jaw position, so that you can replace it accurately and remove the stub collet from the chuck. Make or modify a hex socket cap screw by machining th underside of the head to match the 60 deg countersink. Slit the stub collet right down to the collar..if it is a partickularly "stiff" one, you can first plunge a parting tool groove adjacent to the shoulder to make the "wings" more flexible. Replace the stub in the chuck, aligning the pop mark with #1 jaw. Now skim it down to a close slip fit in your component bore. Put in the expander screw and away you go. It will hold concentricity as well as any "Boughten" collet. teenut Bob wrote: > > Ok... I've looked high and low. Everyone sells a set of 5c expanding > collets, and there are some arbor sets (the largest, at 1", is too small > for my needs). I've scoured Hardinge and other sites, but alas, no > luck. There are plenty of "step" type collets, but... ??? > > Is there such a thing as expanding collets for internal holding for the > 3c collet system? > > Thanks... Bob ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: a lesson in metallurgy From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2000 06:18:41 GMT -------- "J. J. Farrell" wrote: In the normal > system, the milk-man takes away the empties when he delivers the > milk, JJ, you just lost ALL credibility here with North American readers!! A MILKMAN! That DELIVERS milk! Next you will be saying that Doctors make HOUSE calls in that Sceptered Isle!! Or that Politicians sometimes RESIGN when they do something wrong! You are kidding of course. Aren't you? 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: a lesson in metallurgy From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2000 06:32:26 GMT -------- I must be older than you JJ. I remember when all police cars were black..usually high performance models (For those days) such as Jaguars, Wolsleys, Humber Hawks etc. The term "Panda Car" came in the early sixties IIRC with the introduction of smaller cars for local patrol..Morris Minors were the first and they were a pale blue with white doors. No doubt you remember the "Flying Jam Sandwiches"...White, XJ V12 Jaguars with a broad red reflective stripe running horizontally around th belt line. Motorway Patrol and Regional Crime Squads had them. My Uncle was the original role model for "Charlie Barlow" Head of the "Wessex" Regional Crime Squad. His role was modeled on my uncle who was instigator and head of the very first Regional Crime Squad..set up in the South West of England. "Charlie Barlow" would have quaked before the real McCoy!! Now tell us how "Noddy Bikes" got their name. teenut "J. J. Farrell" wrote: > > No, no, no - there's no connection between "panda car" and the > Fiat Panda. "Panda car" was in use long before Fiat introduced > the Panda, and referred to early police patrol cars in Britain > which were black and white. > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Cutter Hit Mill Table From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2000 06:54:59 GMT -------- I don't have any literary ambitions..too busy doing "Real Work" In any case..I am not the only dropper of pearls of wisdom on this remarkably talented list. Quite honestly..I come here to learn and only make a comment when I feel I can genuinely contribute (or burst a Bubblehead..hey I'm only human too!) I learn here every time I visit..and I want to thank every single one of our contributors. I often wonder just how many "Lurkers" there are out there..who could make so many rich contributions..if we could only persude them that it is safe to come out. So, while I am, naturally, flattered by frequent cries of "Author! Author!"..I do wish you would quit, and just enjoy the contributions that I and so many, many, more people make. Thanks, teenut rdanzey@seidata.com wrote: > > In article <20000127084819.16984.00000262@ng-cm1.aol.com>, > xprtec@aol.com (XPRTEC) wrote: > > << Now you are a REAL Machinist!! > > > > Don't sweat the small stuff..life is too short. > > > > Cheer up..The worst is yet to come!! > > > > 8^) > > > > teenut >> > > ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ > > > > Real words of wisdom! Have you ever considered writing a book of er, > say, > > "Teenutisms" ? It would surely be a best seller. > > > > Thanks. > > > > Jim XPRTEC@AOL.COM > > > > > > Jim; When I read the last Teenut comment, I was inclined to make a > suggestion, but instead I declined. Then I read your suggestion and > decided I'd write anyway. 'Teenutisms', or 'Robert's Rules of Thumb', > either would make a good book, especially for the newbie like me. > > Whattayasay, Teenut? Let's begin a 'capture the wisdom' campaign from > the old hands who ain't never gonna be replaced. Already this current > crop of metalheads only thinks in 'bits' and pieces. > > BTW that last rule of thumb about depth of cut being the diameter of the > cutter, I presume applies to end mills, right? Best wishes... > > danz > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: NPS vs.NPT From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2000 06:58:14 GMT -------- Oh Yeh! So who dreamed up elevenanferchristsakesahalf TPI?? teenut Phil Kangas wrote: > > Ned Simmons wrote in message ... > > >Confusing, no? > > > >Ned Simmons > > > > > Yeah, it sure can be! Like those darn British Standard > Pipe threads, like 3/8-19 BSP! > Phil ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Romance of the mill- do you? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2000 07:10:01 GMT -------- Bends? I'll tell you one day how I broke the bed of a 30" swing, Ward No 13 Turret lathe clean in half!! And how it was fixed! teenut Les Rix wrote: > > In article , Robert > Bastow <"teenut"@hotmail.com> writes > >I imagine the next paragraph will go on to describe the snort of searing heat > >from the nostrils of this monster as it grunts and shoulders the burden you lay > >it to..This apparition of power from bygone days. It is a Monster...Aye, truly > >a fearsome beast...but it is YOUR beast and it bends to your will! > > > > Bends ? Bends !! > > What sort of crummy machinery you just bought then Robert 8)) > > Regards, Les ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Newbie: Help getting mill off pallet? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2000 07:15:53 GMT -------- All you need is a Sky Hook! I have one running on Ebay as we speak.. 8^) teenut (who is at his most dangerous when he smiles!!) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 3c Expanding Collets for internal holding From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2000 07:21:43 GMT -------- Ha! Gotcha Jim! In falling over yourself to disagree with me you...fell over!! Nanananana... Rasp Snigger ;^) teenut (who NEVER stands in line!!) mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > But his idea will perform very well - the only change I would make > is to machine the working end 20 oversize before removing it from > the chuck - and take a final skim to true it as even a good chuck > will allow a teeny bit of movement, and if you dress it right before > use it will be quite concentric. > > Hmm. Now I'm wondering if Mr B actually did include that step. > Guess I'm getting senile. (wife in background says "watta ya > mean, 'getting?') Guess I'm in for an ass-kicking. Oh well, > he's gonna have to stand in line! > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Ferrari model From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2000 07:40:47 GMT -------- Absolutely F****** incredible!! This is a work of art..on a par with the Cistine Chapel. I have seen a LOT of incredible models in my time ..but nothing that comes even CLOSE to this. The sound of that boxer 12 was just pure music. Some guy in the UK..old whatsisface...Just got an OBE for services to Model Engineering..Which I thought was balony..none of his models are working models..they are just pretty, scratch built, Airfix Kits IMHO! On that scale..they should offer this guy the Crown of England!! Spoiled only by the stupid inanity of the interviewer, who seemed to have a permanent giggling attack. If I had been the model maker I would have decked him! teenut Jim Stewart wrote: > > Check this out: > http://www.johnegerton.co.uk/cmcc/ferrari312.ram > > (Requires RealPlayer.) > > -js > > -- > > http://www.strappe.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: help on ebay problem From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2000 07:54:57 GMT -------- Yeh Grant..That is a hefty chunk of metal..great if you need a comparator stand. If all you need is the clock then ask him to take it off, ship it to you cheap and put the stand back on ebay. Either way it is a steal for the money! teenut Grant Erwin wrote: > > To the person who said this auction must have closed over 30 days ago, nope. > Check out http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=240149213 > > Anyway, I just wanted to let everyone know that the seller finally let me know > I was way off base on the weight, it weighs nearer 10# than 2# .. oh, well, it > still looks like a good deal to me at $20.50, like the man says it's made by > Federal and I don't have one of those comparators. Yet. > > I learned a lot from this, though. Ebay can be a fairly gnarly place for the > uninitiated. > > Grant Erwin > Kirkland, Washington ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: One for the Ex-Pat Brits From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2000 17:48:18 GMT -------- Taken from soc.culture.british Ex-pats, you know you've gone native when.... -You no longer care that there's a store 30 miles away that stocks Marmite. -You call shops "stores". -Writing the month before the day no longer seems weird. -You throw out junk mail, unopened. -During visits to the UK to see family you secretly and guiltily start counting the days 'til the flight back. -You've stopped playing with the garage door opener. -You go to the UK, don't ask permission to make a local call and wonder why everyone gets mad, er, angry, when you stay on for 20 minutes. -You mistake a roll of kitchen towels for loo paper and wonder why the UK version of EVERYTHING is skimpier; thinner, smaller and more pathetic. -You find yourself defending the USA against holidaying Brits who've been here for two weeks and know everything there is to know about America. -You've started paying for a lawn service. -You think nothing of having two unused rooms in your house: the living room and the dining room. -You've given up asking for tea in restaurants. -You routinely ask for a doggy bag with no embarrassment -You have given up using irony on anyone without a college education. -You call university "school". -You don't think ten napkins, two plastic spoons and ten sachets of sugar is too much waste for one cup of coffee 'to go'. -You think that the huge electrical plugs in the UK are hysterical. -You don't think there's anything unmanly about automatic transmission. -You no longer sleep with the bedroom window open. -You wonder how rugby players can play without protection. -You shower everyday. -You ask for 7-UP not lemonade. -It no longer defies the Laws of the Universe that light switches go up. -You've bought a Webster's and the OED is gathering dust. -You wouldn't dream of going for a lunchtime drink. -You are sick of telling Americans your life story and how you came here. -You overhear British (Briddish) being spoken and do nothing to draw attention to yourself as having anything in common with them. -Y'all and Dude sound perfectly normal forms of address. -You've stopped watching Prime Minister's Question Time on C-Span because there are better things to do on Sunday nights. -You are no longer deferential. Period. -You say "Period". -You no longer feel like a prat putting your hand over your heart during the Star Spangled banner. -People have stopped asking you if you're from Australia. -You need an extra wallet for your credit cards. -You can't imagine ever buying less than a full tank of gas. -You think that a car loan is as necessary as a mortgage. -You've forgotten how to use a knife. -You're no longer surprised that your fridge is the same size as a bedroom in the UK. -In the UK you get the feeling you're being ripped off all the time. -You go home, leave a 15 percent tip and are accused of showing off. -You tip. -You contemplate plastic surgery. You envy straight, white teeth. You dry-clean everything. -You ask if they deliver. -Back home, a World Cup Match is being played 20 minutes walk away, but if you can't drive you won't go. -You start to say ZEE not ZED. -You take water pressure for granted, forget about having to jump around in the shower just to get a few sprinkles or wash your hair at record speed before the Water gets cold or turns unexpectedly scalding. -You no longer listen to the BBC on the short wave you bought soon after you arrived. ' -You wear a sweatshirt with BUM, across it. -You go to the movies, not the pictures. -You get annoyed when the store closes before 9pm. -You laugh uproariously at bottles of Britvic Orange juice. -Yow name is Katy but you call yourself Kady to be understood. -You have come to terms with the idea that the rabid, racist, ignorant, redneck nazi you've just met in a bar can also be a genuine family man. -You don't faint when your electric bill arrives. -You don't wince when an American talks about 'erbs, nucular weapons, aloominum or General Co-Lin Powell. -You don't think it odd when a Yank says he's British like you coz his ancestors came here in 1745. I guess I am 99.999% Gone-Native teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Useful bit 'o Kit From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 28 Jan 2000 19:05:54 GMT -------- FWIW http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=248068750 I wonder how many of our members know how useful thes items are..and how they are used. The are officially called "End Setting Standards" and are/were used primarily on jig borers..to precisely set X and Y axis movements. Along one edge of the table, in each axis, was a vee trough fitted woth a stop at one end and a tenth thou indicator at the other. The lenchth reods and one of the micrometer heads would be set in the trough and the indicator zeroed. Then, say, the next hole position was to be 1.026" away, the table would be backed off, a 1.000" standard added to the trough and the micrometer adjusted + 0.0260". Bringing the table up until the dial indicator again read zero would complete the move. These sets sell "For cheap"..I paid around $25.00 for mine..on Ebay, and can readily be adapted to most milling machines or lathes..To give precise axis movements without the cost of a DRO. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Hot Sauces..remedies From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 29 Jan 2000 15:51:52 GMT -------- Half a packet of regular sugar will quell the fiercest burning in the mouth..Tip showed to me by an Indian Girlfriend when she took me for a traditional Indian restaurant in Toronto. Wickedest damn curry I ever ate!!! but it works like magic. Funny aside.. She was a Brahmin..a very high caste Indian..Her father had been a Provincial Prime Minister or some such, and she had been brought up in the lap of luxury in a palace!! Also had a Harvard Degree! The meal she ordered in the restaurant was delicious..a superb balance of the hot and the sweet and sour etc. Each dish, of the dozen or more she ordered, was delicious in itself..but the overall efect and balance was outstanding. I asked her if this was the way she ate on a regular basis "Back Home" as a child. "Naw" she said, " We prefered to send out for MacDonald's!" teenut Christopher A Kantarjiev wrote: > > Milk is the answer ... as I'm sure some folks on this list know, water > does nothing to douse the flames, either on skin or tongue. Bread is a > poor, but helpful, substitute (in the mouth). ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lathe Technique: Conical Facing Problem with Heavy Cuts on a Super 11 From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 29 Jan 2000 19:44:39 GMT -------- I have a similar Emco Maximat Super II, Nice lathe. Locking any slide, saddle, table ect., not actually required to move during a cut, is SOP, be it on a lathe , mill or WHY! Quite aparte from reducing the tendency to shift under a heavy cut it reduces chatter. Research has shown that chatter is a significant factor in rapid WEAR of slides...the hammering effect breaks down and disintigrates guide surfaces muck faster than simple sliding abrasion. I don't allow my slides to chatter under any circumstances, for that reason. It is one thing to grit your teeth and push on during a roughing cut...Quite another, when you realise it is actively reducing the accurate life of your machine!! teenut Robert Swinney wrote: > > Doug, > Sounds like you figured it out - about locking the saddle. > Bob Swinney > Doug White wrote in message > news:86upp3$661@news-central.tiac.net... > > I've been puttering with lathes more off than on for almost 40 years as > > an amateur. I've worked on a large variety of machines in various > > student shops, from little Craftmans to huge LeBlonds & Monarchs. Most > > of these have been a bit old & battered, and I've mostly worked in brass, > > plastic & aluminum. I've always tried to take cuts where the machine > > wasn't really straining at all, and I've had the time to take it easy. > > > > I now have my very own Emco Maier Super 11 lathe, in pristine condition. > > It's not as sturdy as a LeBlond, but it's certainly as tight & rigid > > as a South Bend. It's got a 1 HP motor. I'm also using 303 stainless > > for more and more projects, and when I'm confronted with a lot of metal > > removal, I've been trying to push things a bit harder than I have in the > > past. I'm still pretty timid, but I'm getting more aggressive. > > > > Last night, I was trying to turn some 2 1/4" 303 SS. I need to leave a > > 1/4" long, 1/2" dia. stub sticking out the end, and I was making facing > > cuts. I had the machine at 400 rpm, using a very sharp brazed C6 carbide > > tool (no rake, no chip control), occasinally applying Cool Tool II with > > an acid brush. I ran the compound in & out by hand so that I could get a > > feel for how hard it was cutting, and also to try to compensate for the > > change in sfpm as the diameter of the cut changes. > > > > After taking a couple of fairly light facing cuts, I tried taking off > > about 0.025". This worked OK, although it required a bit more force on > > the Y-axis lead screw than I'm used to. However, when I backed the tool > > out, I noticed that what had started out as a 0.025 deep cut had shrunk > > down to only about 0.010 or less in the center. I now had a conical face > > on the piece. A few more attempts at heavy cuts showed that the cutting > > forces were slowly pushing the entire saddle back away from the cut. > > > > The saddle feed is just a big rack & pinion, and now that I think about > > it, there really isn't anything other than the mass of the saddle & > > compound to prevent it from wandering away from a heavy facing cut. I > > don't recall how other lathes I've worked on operated in this regard, but > > I don't recall ever seeing this conical-cutting problem before. > > > > Now that you've waded through my long-winded intro, I have a few > > questions: > > > > 1) Is this a common problem? Is this an issue with the simple rack & > > pinion feed on the Super 11, or am I being too aggressive? It may just > > be that all lathes behave this way, and I've just never pushed one that > > hard (or noticed the conical effect). > > > > 2) The simple (but slightly more tedious) fix is to lock the saddle. > > There is a clamping bolt on top of the saddle that _should_ prevent it > > from moving. I just checked the manual, and that seems to be what they > > recommend. This may be standard practice, but I don't recall ever seeing > > it done, and clamping & unclamping with every cut is definitely going to > > slow things down. Is there some trick I'm missing? > > > > 3) I've been itching for an excuse to play with carbide inserts. I > > suspect that a cutting edge with a better geometry & chip control might > > help reduce the cutting forces. I've been trying to find someone who > > makes negative-rake trigon inserts (so I get 6 edges) with enogh relief > > at the edge that I get a net positive cutting geometry. There are a few > > out there, but they all come with beefier holders than my AXA tool post > > can handle, and I'd have to cut them down. Any suggestions? > > > > 4) Can anyone give me a feel for just how aggressive one can be with 303 > > on a 1 HP lathe? I'm not under time pressure, I'm not getting paid by > > the hour, and I don't want to push my machine anywhere CLOSE to a point > > that might cause excessive wear or risk damage. On the otherhand, I > > don't want to take all day taking 5 thousandths cuts when I can do 50 > > with the right tools & some nerve. I've also decided that a chip shield > > may be a good investment. The smoke from the Cool Tool is foul enough, > > but the shower of hot chips can be very exciting when one lands on your > > hand. > > > > One of the great things about machining & this news group is that I learn > > something new on almost every project. This one looks very promising in > > that regard. > > > > Thanks! > > > > Doug White > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lathe Technique: Conical Facing Problem with Heavy Cuts on a Super 11 From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 30 Jan 2000 17:23:40 GMT -------- Exactly Bob...I forgot to mention that I have modified lever locks on the saddle, cross slide and top slide of my Super II. Just a flick of the finger to lock, unlock. On heavy cuts I snug up the moving axis too, just enough to give a little drag and damping. teenut Bob Unitt wrote: > > In article <86upp3$661@news-central.tiac.net>, Doug White > writes > >2) The simple (but slightly more tedious) fix is to lock the saddle. > >There is a clamping bolt on top of the saddle that _should_ prevent it > >from moving. > I had the same problem on my Myford 254. I made a replacement clamping > bolt with a lever instead of a hex-head. Moving the lever 1/4 turn goes > from saddle-free to saddle-locked, so I can now lock the saddle for > every facing cut, without having to waste time looking for the right > spanner. > > -- > Bob Unitt (UK) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Dead Center Lubricant From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2000 05:55:21 GMT -------- I already did!! teenut Ed Elzer wrote: > > ARRG someone, please answer this question! > Ed > > Alden Hackmann wrote: > > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> writes: > > > > >Ah! But his question was NOT what are good reasons for using a live center. It > > >was, IIRC, "Why would anyone ever use a dead center" ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: New Magnum "Mauser" Actions From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2000 06:06:24 GMT -------- peterwiley@hotmail.com wrote: > My copy isn't for sale, either. Quite amazing the number of jigs & > fixtures they used. If you can get a similar action down to a handful of > operations, I think that's great. But I'd ask why the big manufacturers > aren't doing it already. Or perhaps they are but are maintaining profit > margins. That is the same as asking why GM don't build a car of Rolls-Royce Quality. The "Big Manufacturers" are only interested in selling rifles by the tens of thousands. They can do that at $350 to $600 apiece..but no way can they make the kind of action I propose building for less than $1000 to $1500. Which means a finished, custom rifle of $3000 on up. Not enough buyers for them at that price. I am aiming at a "niche" that WILL spend that kind of money for a superior product. The quantities I can sell at that price level will more than cover my costs and overhead and allow a reasonable profit margin. Part of the economics of a "Jobbing Shop" is finding a product, preferably your own, that with keep idle hands and machinery at work during slack times...This is mine! Yes, Left hand actions will be available if the demand warrants it..I need a minimum batch of 20 to start..if you order two...I am 10% of the way there!! ;^) teenut > > When you're doing the design, don't forget about us left-handers out > there. Damn few good L/H bolt actions. > > Peter Wiley > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Romance of the mill- do you? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2000 06:11:26 GMT -------- My sentiments entirely shiggins..If you have any positive contribution to make to this list, we haven't heard it yet! (8^[ (you pissed me off!!) teenut Don Foreman wrote: > > On Fri, 28 Jan 2000 21:41:02 GMT, shiggins > wrote: > > >TS maybe... TS Eliot not. > > Share stuff, get sharp stick in eye. > > Why did you do that, shiggens? He said he's taking a > course, right? > > It looks like most of us enjoyed it, TS, and those that > didn't had the grace to keep still. > > Regards from Foreman, dforeman@Ugoldengate.net. > Please remove U from email address to reply ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Tig Welder From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2000 06:14:08 GMT -------- Mine too..But I find I ame doing pretty fine welding, (of the wing to a gnat variety) at around 70 amps with a 1/16" electrode and 1/16" filler. What am I doing wrong? teenut Steve Carlisle wrote: > > I have been told recently that the Lincoln 175 now goes down > to below 5 amps. That should make some people happy. > > Steve Carlisle > > On Sat, 29 Jan 2000 18:45:55 GMT, Dan Caster > wrote: > > > > > > >Don't forget to look at Lincoln Electric too. Miller makes great > >stuff, but I think that Lincoln throws in some goodies at the base > >price that Miller makes you pay extra for. My Lincoln SW 255 > >come with power factor correction and a pulser in the base unit. > >If you buy the pulser for the Miller, it is more versatile, but lots > >more money. Also the Lincoln SW 175 has auto balance on AC. Not > >sure that the Econotig does. Maybe someone here can say. > > Dan > > > > > >Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > >Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Bore compression sleeves ? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2000 06:30:11 GMT -------- Ok Vernon...I'll buy it! How DO you decrease a .1765 bore to .1760? (Other than shrinking a sleeve on it..the size and o/d of which would depend entirely on the material and its wall thickness). I suppose you could calculate an empirical value..but to get within a tenth of a thou, as you imply, you would still have to experiment to get it dead on. So why not suck it and see..and have some fun while you do it! teenut "Vernon Z. Crawford Jr." wrote: > > How to decrease a .1765" ID bore to .1760" within .595" OD DOM tube steel > with external heated compression sleeves via thermal contraction and or > cryogenic expansion of tube ? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: WTB Tail Stock for a 13" Leblond Lathe From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2000 06:35:20 GMT -------- I have one exactly like it, WITH a tailstock and, (Nananana) it ain't for sale!! Helluva nice lathe though, and I wish you luck in your search. One of my (two) LeBlonds dates from 1948 (a dual drive) and has zero (ZIP..NADA) wear on the bed!! What ARE those bed inserts made of..and how are they fixed in place? teenut K & D Rossi wrote: > > I'm looking for a tail stock to fit a 13" Leblond metal lathe. I believe the > lathe is from the 40's? And has a s/n of B6287. Any help would be gratefully > appreciated. Thanks.Don.krossi@flash.net ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: mike II's Conversion... From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2000 06:37:06 GMT -------- Aw Jeeze...Mike II finally "Lost it" teenut mike II wrote: > > I return to you as a new, reformed human being. One month ago I received > a divine inspiration. > It appears all these years I was missing out on all the finer things in > life because I was born into the WRONG religion. Remembering the old > sacred texts and prophets, I decided to do as they had done, and go to > the desert and meditate for thiry days and nights. > The blistering hot days and freezing nights were a constant reminder of > the cyclic nature of our existence. The desire for earthly goods > diminished, as the steps toward enlightenment were taken. > A complete account of my conversion to the Path of Light and Salvation > will follow at some later date, so please be patient with me. > > As a culinary aside, once I overcame my lifelong prejudices and > revulsions, I found the barbecued flesh of tender young Christians to be > actually quite tasty. > > sincerely, a 'pleased to be back in this plane of existence' mike II ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: mike II's Conversion... From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2000 06:39:45 GMT -------- ROTFLMAO!!! Nominated.."Quip of the Week"!! teenut Gary Coffman wrote: >>I found the barbecued flesh of tender young Christians to be >>actually quite tasty. > Donner party, your table is ready. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Bearings on Buffer Question From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2000 06:47:29 GMT -------- Stand well clear when you do Fitch...5HP @ 3600 rev/min would have you as a SNACK!! Concerned. teenut "Fitch R. Williams" wrote: > > Kevin Pinkerton wrote: > > >BTW, I picked up a $5 3ph 3/4 horse grinder at an > >auction awhile back. I cleaned out its bearings and repacked them. I > >have yet to mount the grinder, but it certainly a MUCH more powerful > >grinder then my Sears 110v grinder. > > My neighbor dropped off an older than ancient 5hp 3600 rpm grinder in my > side yard. It looks like it could eat metal 2 x 4s for breakfast. I > haven't turned it on yet. > > Fitch > In So. Cal. > > The FAQ for RCM is: http://w3.uwyo.edu/~metal > Metal Web News at http://www.mindspring.com/~wgray1/ > The "Drop Box" is at http://www.metalworking.com/ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: ON DEMAND WATER HEATER QUESTION?? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2000 13:06:57 GMT -------- I installed one of these units (a gas-fired Main "Severn" in my house in England in 1968..and they were not a "Brand New" idea even then. As a consequence I was the first person *I* knew with a high pressure, HOT water shower you didn't need to run around in to get wet!! The water heater and the gas fired central heating boiler, that I installed at the same time, both had "Balanced flues"..which were really just coming into common used at the time. This was a boon, as they could be installed on any external wall of the house. My hot water central heating (via radiators) was one of the first "Microbore" systems..using 1/4" and 3/8" high pressure piping instead of the usuall low pressure 1/2" to 1 1/4" cpper pipe usually employed. It has been over a quarter of a century since I last lived in the UK..And I am sure things have improved enormously since then...But one reason I never went back was a horror of the, generally low, level of heating and plumbing!! Brrr! teenut davidcbrown@usa.net wrote: > > Al - the units you describe are quite common in countries other than > the US and Canada, but for some reason, have not caught on as well > here. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Chandler Boring/facing head From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2000 13:16:05 GMT -------- Hi Jon, I have one of these..also obtained on Ebay (have another at the shop I just aquired!!) and you are correct..they are a fine unit, not well know it appears, and consequently..Reasonably priced!! I have a rather bruised copy of the manual that came with mine..you are welcome to a copy of it if you contact me off list with your "snail mail" The shanks are screwed in..I have no idea what the thread is...I need to change mine, (it's a B&S #9) but it is TIGHT!! I haven't had the need, or the inclination to take a BFH to it yet!! teenut "Jon F. Lenander" wrote: > > Hi All, > Just received my Chandler boring/facing head purchased on > ebay. It is in fine shape, and I believe quite a bargain! It is a > model D and equipped with a 1" shank. Does anyone have an > owners/service manual for this gem? I would gladly reimburse for all > costs. Also, Does anyone know if there were alternate shanks made for > this model (R8 or 30NTMB)? Where to find them? Thank you for your > time. Best, Jon ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: another ebay wonder From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2000 13:20:15 GMT -------- AAARGHHH!!! I GAVE ONE AWAY LAST YEAR!! {8^{ teenut Mark wrote: > > Thought the group might like to see this.... I ran it up for a while to see > how far it would go.... > > http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=241879998 > > Kinda makes you want to sort through all of your old mfr's lit..... > > $150 bucks for two pages! > > Mark ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lathe Technique: Conical Facing Problem with Heavy Cuts on a Super 11 From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 31 Jan 2000 15:52:27 GMT -------- I got a color TV for mine!! ;^) teenut Bob Unitt wrote: >...... The first time I heard it was from a comedian who said he'd >"been to a wife-swapping party, and had swapped his for a brand-new >socket-set"... > > -- > Bob Unitt (UK) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Tig Welder From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 01 Feb 2000 01:34:08 GMT -------- I have a brand new Lincoln 175. Even with .040 electrodes on 20 GA steel I am using 40-50 amps..Yes my grounding is good. teenut Ted Edwards wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > Mine too..But I find I ame doing pretty fine welding, (of the wing to a gnat > > variety) at around 70 amps with a 1/16" electrode and 1/16" filler. > > > What am I doing wrong? > > I seem to have missed some of this thread. What material? I have > 0.040" tungstens and, AFAIK, 0.020" are available. 70 amps is > ***huge*** for gnat welding! If this is steel or SS, I would be using > my 0.040" tungsten and about 5 to 10 amps (as low as I can go until I > get a pulser). Filler should be fine too. I have some 0.040 347SS that > I use for fine work on steel and SS and some similar size 4043 for Al. > > I think you need a pulser. What machine do you have? > > Ted ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Narrow shank edge finder ..... From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 01 Feb 2000 02:28:21 GMT -------- You could use a collet type "wobbler" edge finder...just as accurate as the cylindrical type. AFAIK they are (were?) available in 1/4" shank size (I have a 1/4" Lufkin set) Failing that you could easily turn the shank down to fit your 1/4" collet. teenut ltl919 wrote: > > Does anyone know if there is such a thing as an edge finder with a > smaller than 3/8" diam shank? > They all seem to be 3/8" only. > I am doing my mill for some precise hole drilling and I have to > constantly switch from the 1/4" drill chuck > to the 3/8" end mill holder to use the edge finder. > I guess I can buy a larger 3/8" capable chuck but an edge finder is only > ~$12 and and I am feeling very cheap today ... :) > > I don't have a lathe, so I can't make my own adapter. > > Thanks! ======== Newsgroups: rec.aviation.homebuilt,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: The Italian Job From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 01 Feb 2000 13:48:24 GMT -------- Issi-GOAN-is teenut Marv Soloff wrote: > > Kevin O'Brien wrote: > > > > In article <38916EA4.2270@worldnet.att.net>, Marv Soloff > > wrote: > > > > > Credit Sir Alec Issigonis for the design of the Mini, totally unique and > > > brilliant and far ahead of it's time. > > > > Right, first FWD transverse engine IIRC... Ithink the first imitator of > > the transverse packaging (albeit mid-engine) is also in the Italian Job > > film, the Miura! > > > > Any idea how one pronounces Sir Alec's last name, definitively? I would > > hate to get it wrong at the next gathering of gearheads and be thought a > > fool, eh. > > > > cheers > > > > -=K=- > > Have no idea on how to pronounce the name. Lusting after a 1275S Mini > Cooper was the closest I got to the Minis. Bought the Haynes manual for > it and still have (somewhere) David Vizard's book on tuning the engine > and transmission. > > Regards, > > Marv ======== Newsgroups: rec.aviation.homebuilt,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: The Italian Job From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 01 Feb 2000 13:51:29 GMT -------- That is the Italian pronunciation..I believe Sir Alec Issigonis used the anglicized Issi..go..nis teenut John Stevenson wrote: > Pronounced ICE-IG-O-NIS ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Bearings on Buffer Question From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 01 Feb 2000 14:14:11 GMT -------- One Basis precaution when starting up a "new" or Strange" griner for the first time.. Take the wheel off and "ring it"..it may wll be cracked. Start the grinder WITHOUT the wheels..check for vibration, bent spindles etc. Put on NEW wheels if you can..If this is not practical or desireable..Check the wheel for cracks (as above)..Check it for BALANCE..wheels left staionary for a long time will go out of balance just by dint of the dust that accumulates. Sometimes I think that any oil that got on the wheel, during its previous life, seems to migrate to the bottom. Of course, if it was left standing, partially in water or coolant (A real NO-NO..But s**t happens!!) could be badly out of balance. Check it also for runout. The danger then is not just an exploded wheel..(You WILL be standing well clear)..but also a bent spindle. I am not trying to "teach Grannie to suck eggs" here Fitch..I know you are fully aware of the precations to take. My comments are aimed at the "Newbies" who have yet to experience the exquisite delight of having a grinding wheel explode nearby...It turns grown men PALE!! teenut "Fitch R. Williams" wrote: > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > > >Stand well clear when you do Fitch...5HP @ 3600 rev/min would have you as a > >SNACK!! > > Trust me on this - I u n d e r s t a n d ! > > >Concerned. > > I'm concerned enough for the both of us. I've looked at the guards and the > welded up "gable" that is 2" away from the wheel and decided it needs many > modifications before it gets used. I am holding off on the mods until I > find out if it runs. So it will get started with me standing far away and > we shall see if it runs. If it does, it will be modified to be safe before > I use it. > > I've had a small piece of steel tubing - part of a model I was making > (maybe 1/8" in diameter) jammed through my hand by a 1/2 hp grinder in my > youth, I have "plenty" of respect for this one! > > I also wish it was a 1725 rpm grinder. The wheels are maybe 1-1/2" thick. > > Fitch > In So. Cal. > > The FAQ for RCM is: http://w3.uwyo.edu/~metal > Metal Web News at http://www.mindspring.com/~wgray1/ > The "Drop Box" is at http://www.metalworking.com/ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Thanks From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 01 Feb 2000 14:31:17 GMT -------- Laser "line" pointers are used on sawmills, to allow the head man to pick and align the best cut fo "opening up" a log. I had a thought of fixing a laser pointer on my Table Saw to align cross cuts with the saw blade. It might not be fine enough for that..in any case I haven't got a round tuit that would fit!! teenut PKDickman wrote: > > Some time back, in a thread about finding a use for cheap laser pointers (other > than blinding rockstars and confusing cats), some one mentioned that he used > his to point out the sweet spot on his forming stakes so, that even when his > view of the stake is obscured by the metal being formed, he could still see > the best place to aim the hammer. > > I thought this was a good idea when I heard it, and it's been rattling around > in my brain ever since. > > Well, while cleaning up the shop, the patron saint of serendipity smiled down > on me and I found all the things I needed to put one together.(my pointer, a > 3volt dc transformer, a ball swivel from a lamp and a piece of 1/2" Cu pipe) > > This thing is a great idea. I used it today while snarling the dents out of a > silver hip flask and it turned a 45 minute job into a 10 minute one. > > I don't remember who suggested it, but I wanted to say thanks. > > Paul K. Dickman ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Bearings on Buffer Question From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 01 Feb 2000 19:08:50 GMT -------- Especially if that "something" is one or more of your body parts!! 8^( teenut Jim Kovar wrote: > > > Take the wheel off and "ring it"..it may wll be cracked. > > > > Start the grinder WITHOUT the wheels..check for vibration, bent spindles > etc. > > One other thing I'm sure you know, (but it's important) is to > check the clearance between the tool rest and the wheel. > Gets scary real fast when something gets pulled down into the clearance > space on a big grinder. They DON'T stall easily. > > Take care :) > Jim Kovar > Iron Mountain, Mi ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Choosing a new 16" gap bed lathe From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 02 Feb 2000 02:13:24 GMT -------- Reality Check time!! I do hope you have lots of money. A new lathe that will hold, and KEEP holding, those limits is going to cost a LARGE bag of gold. I am not sure that anyone has ever made a gap bed lathe of that size that can hold what amounts to half of Schlesinger limits for a (Small) tool room lathe. A well built CNC Turning center could hold this..mainly by dint of built in, programable compensations for geometric deficiencies. Now, What on earth do you want to make, of that size, that has to come off the lathe (as opposed to say, a cylindrical grinder) with those sort of limits "Guaranteed" "J. Kimberlin" wrote: > > Need to buy a new 16" gap bed lathe at least 50" C-t-C capacity. > It has to be guaranteed to 0.0002" accuracy. > > So far the Harrison/Colchester people seem to have a good > product. Anyone out there want to comment on the Harrison or > suggest an alternate brand that meets/beats the requirement? > > TIA > > JerryK ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: School Shop Equipment For Sale From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 02 Feb 2000 02:17:28 GMT -------- Well put Tom! teenut Tom Holt wrote: > May I try? > > 1. Joe runs a factory producing widgets....... ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Pattern on ends of cut shapes of metals question From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 02 Feb 2000 05:08:11 GMT -------- It is a chatter pattern..common with regularly spaced teeth on a band saw. Using a variable pitch blade will eliminate it. teenut foxeye wrote: > > Don't know why it took all these years, but today I noticed a neat > pattern on the end of a cold formed hex bar I cut off. It had a > pattern of small diamonds covering the entire end that I cut off with > a metal cutting band saw. I though it was a fluke, and the second and > consecutive cuts also showed the same pattern of what looks like a > series of diamonds stacked up on each other. Round stock shows up as a > series of partial cured lines, and square stock shows up as another > pattern, and flat stock is different again. Even though the cut marks > can be seen, and it is a rather smooth cut, one can still see and > actually feel the different patterns that is shown on the end of the > varius shapes. What is this called and what makes it? Is it > rearrangement of the metals structure or grain when it is formed or > what? > Seems I have never really noticed this before now, after all these > years. > thanks for any info > foxeye ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: making small parts From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 02 Feb 2000 12:35:35 GMT -------- How LONG are the wedges? How MANY do you need? What MATERIAL? What is your BUDGET? Vital parts of the equation! Greg Nuspel wrote: > > I have to make some small wedge shaped parts. One end has a 1/32" radius > and it tapers down to a 0.010" radius the distance between the centers > is 0.115". They are 1/4 in length. I was thinking that either forging or > drawing a wire through a die might be the best method of making them. If > any one has a suggestion please let me know. > > -- > Greg Nuspel > > "Make everything as simple as possible, but not simpler. " > - Albert Einstein (1879-1955) > > http://members.home.net/gregsdiversions > ICQ 13585790 ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: making small parts From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 02 Feb 2000 16:01:15 GMT -------- "An Engineer is one who can do for five cents, what any fool can do for a dollar"........ ..............teenut's Law 8^) teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article , > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > > > What is your BUDGET? > > > > Vital parts of the equation! > > I've heard tell that there is one critical difference between > physics equations and engineering equations: > > Engineering equations always have units of dollars someplace > buried in them! > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Oil for Headstock? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 02 Feb 2000 17:06:03 GMT -------- What DID happen Terry? We'll never tell!) teenut Terry Nelson wrote: > And if you want to know what really happens when you use detergent > oil, I know someone who was dumb enough to top off his low gearbox > with just a little bit. It was only a pint of it. :) > > Terry ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: The Italian Job From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 03 Feb 2000 03:25:00 GMT -------- Bit like you Pete!! teenut PLAlbrecht wrote: > End of entry. Photo shows1907 Christie in French Grand Prix, Walter Christie at > the wheel. > > Sounds like he was quite a character. > > Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Laziness From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 03 Feb 2000 03:48:10 GMT -------- Hardy, Do you work for, or have shares in McM-Carr? Your comments are DIRECTLY in conflict with the findings of myself..and a lot of other people on this NG. teenut hardy wrote: > > I had been dealing with MSC close to 7 years I asked them to close my acct > about 5 mnths ago part of the problem was slow but steady rising of prices, > and having other accts I have the ability to check prices and I do > faithfully no body is tighter with a buck than me. I figured the money I > save is better in my pocket than theirs....... > Another problem was logistical ,dealing with a sometimes rude, ineffectual, > and unknowing staff, that could care less. now I'm not one to tell someone > who to hire or what qualities to look for in a new hire,the answer is > obvious. But that doesn't mean that I have to deal with them so henceforth I > move on and end of aggravation and I still enjoy better prices.....I must > add that recently in dealing with Mcmaster-Carr I was extremely surprised at > not only their price and with their service.. 7 years ago they wouldn't even > send me a catalog because, and this was actually said to me " my business > was not large enough" I needed a motor quick they opened an accout over the > phone and got the motor the next day catalog is on its way now that caught > my attention... funny how things change in a couple of years. Enco flat out > shafted me about 4 years ago forget what it was even about but it was brazen > what ever it was I've spent a lot of money on tools in the last 4 years if I > was to mention that to someone at ENCO I wouldn't even get a response > [uncaring] so go figure............ > > Paul > Engineman1 wrote in message > news:20000201212516.19679.00000392@nso-fd.aol.com... > > OK, so I,m lazy, I just got a new 735 page catalog from Enco. What I'm > > wondering is how their prices compare with MSC? I have a MSC catal ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: End Mill ? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 03 Feb 2000 03:57:47 GMT -------- Hell NO!! Even a "Cheap" one should be an order of magnitude closer than that! teenut RStolz5833 wrote: > > What is acceptable run out on an end mill? I would like to purchase an endmill > sharpener and the seller said it would do from .001 to .002 . Is this good? > > Rick ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: WTD Info: Lathe Spindle material From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 03 Feb 2000 04:05:13 GMT -------- Hot rolled steel of one description or another...But almost always case hardened and ground. If the spindle runs in plain bearings, this is a must. If it is mounted in rolling bearings, it will be OK for light use..Hardening will not make it any stiffer..primary requirement for any M/c tool spindle. However, under heavy use..epecially when chatter is involved, you should expect the bearing seats to get hammered loose. teenut Marty Escarcega wrote: > > Forgive the newbie question :-) > > What material are lathe spindles usually made of? HRS? Are they typicall > hardened and ground? Is it feasible to make a replacement in the home shop > if so, what are the steps...just curious. > > Thanks, > Marty ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lathe replicating itself? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 03 Feb 2000 04:10:37 GMT -------- ARRGHH!!!!!! Just when it was safe to go out again!! This subject was thrashed to death not long ago..you might try a Deja News search for the whole sordid mess! teenut PS the correct answer IS a lathe! Duck and cover. David & Pam wrote: > > Forgive the trivia, but one of the toolmakers here and I had a discussion as > to what machine tools would be capable of replicating itself. What I mean by > that is, what machine tool is capable of making every piece of itself. I say > it is a lathe fully equipped with some minor milling tooling thrown in for > good measure. > Has anyone tried this out there? > > Trying to settle a bet here in PA. > > Thanks > David Hoover > Pamco & Associates at http://users.penn.com/~pamco/index.html ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: One for the Ex-Pat Brits From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 03 Feb 2000 05:36:59 GMT -------- PLAlbrecht wrote: > "Why did the British build an empire on which the sun never set?" God wouldn't trust us in the dark!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Death of US Manufacturing Capacity? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 03 Feb 2000 11:43:56 GMT -------- Unfortunately, we are NOT still importing skills..There is a virtual moritorium on immigration from first world countries. The roadblocks put in the way of non-refugee, non-prefered nation immigrants are draconian. On and off it took me twenty three years of "living under cover" to get a "Green Card"...Not exactly a warm welcome for someone who (though I do say it myself) has quite a few, useful skills and experience!! teenut Mark Kinsler wrote: > > If we suddenly find that we have a great need for US toolmakers, and there > aren't any remaining in the US, we'll do what we've always done: import > 'em from wherever they happen to live. Almost all of the technologies in > the US were developed this way to begin with: we imported brewmasters and > electrical engineers from Germany, metallurgists from Sweden, machinists > from England, chemists from France, and all the rest. As long as we > remain an open society that respects human rights and welcomes immigrants, > we'll have all the skills we need for as long as we need them. That's > where we got our wealth in the first place. > > M Kinsler > > who learned most of his auto mechanics from two guys from Ecuador. > > -- > ............................................................................ > 114 Columbia Ave. Athens, Ohio USA 45701 voice740.594.3737 fax740.592.3059 > Home of the "How Things Work" engineering program for adults and kids. > See http://www.frognet.net/~kinsler ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lathe replicating itself? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 03 Feb 2000 12:03:37 GMT -------- I think there is some misaprehension about what is meant by "replicating" It would be VERY difficult ..if not impossible for a Bridgeport mill to make a perfect, full size, Bridgeport Mill..Just as it would be next to impossible to make a Harding HLVH one a Harding HLVH. Indeed it would be very dificult to make EITHER of those machines, even if you had first class example of BOTH to work with. However..for a lathe to make a working lathe...of SOME sort..has been done many many times. Headstock castings can be machined flat on the boring table or faceplate. Beds can be round..many still are. Once headstock and bed are assembled the lathe can accurately bore its own spindle bore..etc. Similarly, some form of functional milling device could be made on a milling machine..but in my honest opinion, a great deal more difficulty. After all, a mill is just a highly specialised and modified lathe!! Given my druthers, I would MUCH prefer to make a lathe with a lathe..rather than a mill with a mill. teenut Janos Ero wrote: > > David & Pam wrote: > > > > Forgive the trivia, but one of the toolmakers here and I had a discussion as > > to what machine tools would be capable of replicating itself. What I mean by > > that is, what machine tool is capable of making every piece of itself. I say > > it is a lathe fully equipped with some minor milling tooling thrown in for > > good measure. > > Has anyone tried this out there? > > What about the bed and headstock? > > Janos Ero ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking,alt.machines.cnc Subject: Retrofit CNC on wirecut EDM..Urgent request!! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 03 Feb 2000 14:35:38 GMT -------- One of the machines I am buying with this tool and die shop (at 3PM this afternoon..al being well!!!) is a Mitsubishi CNC Wirecut EDM..Model # DWC-100 It is an old machine (1980) but mechanically perfect..when the control does its stuff it will burn dowel holes to a slip or press fit on demand...in 3 to 5" thick hardened tool steel. The slides, servos, ball screws and power supply etc all seem to be right up to the task. However, the Control is old and a bit flaky..Boot up and software loading is by means of a punched mylar tape..programing is done off machine (BobCad) and imput vial floppy disc. The machine seems to be regularly crashing and is difficult to reboot..sometimes it takes several attempts and the situation is worsening. Obviously, I have no intention of buying a lemon, or a pig in a poke..without a reliable control it isn't worth the powder to blow it to hell! Is there anyone out there who can tell me whether or not: (A) This is worth upgrading with a more modern control? (B) can this, indeed, be done? (C) What is the likely cost for a turnkey retrofit? (D) How long will it take? (E) Know anyone who can do it? (F) Any list member who is capable and experienced enough to want to take a crack at it I am in Atlanta GA., and this would have to be done on site here. Thanks, in advance, for your help. Robert Bastow Express Tool and Die The Express Rifle Company ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: One for the Ex-Pat Brits From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 03 Feb 2000 16:52:51 GMT -------- British Rail Sandwiches used to carry instructions to cafeteria staff to turn them over once a week to prevent the bread from curling!! On the other hand..I used to thoroughly enjoy First Class Breakfast on "The Master Cutler" Sheffield to London Express. I dread to think what it might cost nowadays. teenut Bob Chilcoat wrote: > > PLAlbrecht wrote in message > news:20000203001430.26998.00001526@ng-cj1.aol.com... > > >Agreed. One trip to Britain and I understood how the English could be > mad > > >enough to conquer 1/4 of the world. > > > > No, no... "Why did the British build an empire on which the sun never > set?" > > > > "They were only looking for a decent restaurant... the empire part was a > side > > effect." > > > > With all due respect, you guys must not have been to the UK recently, I > guess. During the 70's when I lived over there it was certainly true that > the quality of food was pretty dismal. You COULD find a decent restaurant > meal, but you had to search for the good restaurants and PAY when you found > one. Good cheap food was virtually unavailable unless you developed a taste > for traditional British fare, and you worked hard to find a good place to > get it. Steak and kidney pie, Cornish pasties, Scotch eggs, fish and chips, > etc. can be quite good if prepared well. Unfortunately the quality was very > uneven. > > For the past ten years or so, though, I have been amazed at the improvement > in food, at least in the metro centers. You can actually get sandwiches > that taste good, and that have more than one thing on them. Whereas the > typical British Rail sandwich of the 70's was two slices of white bread with > one 0.002"-thick slice of ham on it (how could they slice it that thin - a > microtome?) and NOTHING else, you can actually get a pretty decent meal on > the (now corporately run) trains now. In London, at least, most of the pub > grub is very good (of course much of it is no longer "English cuisine"). If > you want to believe that the food in Merry Olde is still awful, that's your > privilege, but if you can think "glass is half full" rather than "glass is > half empty" it's really pretty good these days. JMHO, YMMV. > > Bob (a "glass is bigger than necessary" engineering type) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking,alt.machines.cnc Subject: Re: Retrofit CNC on wirecut EDM..Urgent request!! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 04 Feb 2000 03:37:41 GMT -------- Ok, the deal went down...4 hours of nattering!! Among other things I knocked down the monthly lease by $900.00 (don't ask!...Suffice it to say..They met "Bob" Bastow! Scared 'em! I also got a $5000.00 reduction for the dicey EDM control..figured that ought to cover a multitude of sins. That stuff, and a few more breaks..figure I saved $30,000.00 on my first years budget. Went out and got pissed tonight! I will call Mitsubishi tomorrow and tell them to fix it. 8^) teenut "DoN. Nichols" wrote: > > In article <_mgm4.781$ps1.109974@news1.rdc1.ga.home.com>, > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > >One of the machines I am buying with this tool and die shop (at 3PM this > >afternoon..al being well!!!) is a Mitsubishi CNC Wirecut EDM..Model # DWC-100 > > > >It is an old machine (1980) but mechanically perfect..when the control does its > >stuff it will burn dowel holes to a slip or press fit on demand...in 3 to 5" > >thick hardened tool steel. The slides, servos, ball screws and power supply etc > >all seem to be right up to the task. > > > >However, the Control is old and a bit flaky..Boot up and software loading is by > >means of a punched mylar tape..programing is done off machine (BobCad) and imput > >vial floppy disc. > > > >The machine seems to be regularly crashing and is difficult to reboot..sometimes > >it takes several attempts and the situation is worsening. > > > >Obviously, I have no intention of buying a lemon, or a pig in a poke..without a > >reliable control it isn't worth the powder to blow it to hell! > > > >Is there anyone out there who can tell me whether or not: > > > >(A) This is worth upgrading with a more modern control? > > It sounds as though the mechanical part is well worth having. > > However, let me suggest some possibilities for bringing the > existing machine back to life. > > 1) You could be experiencing aging connectors on the boards > and elsewhere. If that is the problem, cleaning the contacts of > *all* connectors with Cramolin or DeOxit will probably do > wonders for the machine. > > 2) On the same lines, any socketed chips may have developed > similar contact problems, and can similarly benefit from a > treatment with the same chemicals. > > 3) It is possible that one or more of the power supples has drifted > in voltage, and is near the limits of reliable operation. A > check with a voltmeter, and re-adjustment of the voltage-setting > potentiometers may bring it back to stable operation. > > 4) Also -- the filter capacitors in the power supply (if it is the > old transformer and linear regulator style) may be dying, and > allowing more ripple in the final regulated voltages. > Replacement of those will make the system more reliable. > > However, you should get a serious discount on the acquisition > price, to allow for the chance that the problem will be a lot more > serious, and require actual replacement of the controls. (You *will* > need a *good* electronics technician for this repair, of course.) > > I'll now sit back and wait for the other opinions, as should > you. > > Good Luck, > DoN. > -- > Email: | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564 > My Concertina web page: | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html > --- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero --- ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: More Al Babin hilarity From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 04 Feb 2000 03:40:01 GMT -------- So it was YOU you SOB!! (just kidding) teenut XPRTEC wrote: I'm getting > into the TEE-NUT league. > > I sniped a perfect snipe the other night! Placed my last bid and it came back > 0 MINUTES 0 SECONDS! I won a Dutch Auction for the two readouts. > > I have seen Ebay cut auctions up to 3 minutes short and 5 minutes long. They > say it is because of problems beyond their control. > > Regards, > > Jim xprtec@aol.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: WTB MILLING From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 04 Feb 2000 03:47:19 GMT -------- Bridgeport serait toujurs bien!! Je serai deux vielle (vieux?) machines, en, peut etre, deux mois (en Altanta Ga) Donne' moi un coup, svp, a' 770 673 0976 teenut Express Tool & Die Heimrick wrote: > > Recherche milling (fraiseuse) verticale avec table de 36" minimum > (ideal 42), pas de préférence pour la marque, mais Bridgeport serait > bien. faite moi une offre je dois en trouver une rapidement. Je suis > a Montreal QC. > > merci > > JP ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Sliding Metal Parts From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 04 Feb 2000 04:01:26 GMT -------- Rule of thumb is that ANY pair of dissimilar metals will slide together without galling..beter still if one is much harder than the other. Cast Iron is the only exception I know of..surfaces of equal hardnes slide together happily..because of the free carbon (graphite) that exists in the metal. Off hand, the best metal to metal bearings I can think of, are; hardened steel in cast iron..for precision, with hardened steel in babbit being a bit more durable in adverse conditions of shock, contamination and sparcity of lubrication. Steel in Bronze strikes an excellent balance between the two. For your choice of materials..try to stick with steel on brass..not the worlds best, but aluminum makes a very bad bearing material..unless clear, hard, anodised! This makes a good shaft material..until it is even slightly overloaded..or until, inevitably, the thin oxide layer wears through. Failure then is rapid, total and catastrophic! Yer pays yer money..Yer takes yer choice! teenut jim.ubersetzig@lmco.com wrote: > > Which combinations of metals slide well on one another ? > > With the Sherline machine tools, the metals I will use are: > > 6061 T6 Aluminum > > C 360 Brass > > 12L14 Steel > > In designing machinery, I want all sliding surfaces to operate > without galling, and without siezing. I understand that some > combinations of the above metals are better than others. > > Jim Ubersetzig > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What is IIRC ? Thanks From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 04 Feb 2000 04:04:05 GMT -------- IIRC..IIRC means: "If I Remember Correctly" teenut "Ed Ginsberg (ke6bnl) and Family" wrote: > > At 02:49 AM 1/26/00 GMT, you wrote: > > Message from the Deja.com forum: > > rec.crafts.metalworking > > Your subscription is set to individual email delivery > >> > >In article <388E4B1A.848E329D@sympatico.ca>, t.o.jones@sympatico.ca > >says... > >> Just a thought regarding your quest for pump ideas. > >> > >> I saw a Farmer-Egineered parts washer at an auction sale.Was too rich > >> for my wallet,but the idea was there.The maker had used an old Chev(?) > >> fuel pump mounted on a bracket and run by an eccentric on a 1/5 horse > >> motor.The eccentric was nothing more than a disk with an off-center hole > >> dilled in it.IIRC it had about 1/4 inch of throw.Idea could be adapted > >> to any convenient method of getting reciprocating motion from rotation > >> of the motor. > > I have yet to figure out what IIRC means. Thanks Ed ke6bnl > AGUA DULCE, CALIFORNIA > 70 MILES N.E. OF LOS ANGELES > 10X10 67327 > KE6BNL > AS FOR ME AND MY HOUSE, WE WILL SERVE THE LORD > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Given Mill? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 04 Feb 2000 04:07:27 GMT -------- I had one given once! Does that count? Seriously though..the name does ring a FAINT bell..double check the spelling. Could it be Givern? teenut shiggins wrote: > > Has anyone heard of a Given Mill? Maybe Given is misspelled. A friend > of mine has a opportunity to buy one, but I've never heard of Given. > > TIA... Scott Higgins ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Cutting tools, wedge of parent metal forms in front of point From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 04 Feb 2000 04:17:36 GMT -------- Absolutely, under ideal cutting conditions the "Edge" of the tool doesn't do much work....That's why it lasts longer! Under adverse conditions, that "wedge" welds to the tool, cuts deeper until the weld fails, breaks off..leaving a bit stuck to the job and repeats the cycle. Correct lubricant and/or surface treatment helps to minimise this..But if you bear in mind the affinity that similar metals have for each other..it starts to explain the difficulty one has with getting a good finish on dead soft mild steel with a HS steel cutter. teenut..who once spent almost a year, watching planer blades under laboratory conditions..and finished up..Knowing that I know not!! "James R. Johnson" wrote: > > A friend of mine told the story of watching an ultra highspeed movie of a > cutting tool (actually a shaper, because they could see the tool) made at > the University of Texas back in the 60s. He said that a wedge of the parent > metal (the metal being cut) formed just in front of the cutting tool and > that this wedge actually did the cutting. It would cut for a while, then be > peeled off into the swarf, a new wedge would form and cut for a while, then > it would peel off, a new wedge would form, etc. > > Does anyone have any knowlege pertaining to this phenomenon? What causes > it? If it happens all the time, why can't we cut anything with carbon > tools? Any comments? > > James R. Johnson Shadetree Engineering In the heart of Texas ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: One for the Ex-Pat Brits From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 04 Feb 2000 04:19:08 GMT -------- Totaly different flavor!! teenut Kathy and Erich Coiner wrote: > > Bubble and Squeak? Is that anything like Slap and Tickle? > > Erich ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lathe replicating itself? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 04 Feb 2000 04:24:13 GMT -------- The first accurate lead screws were generated on a soft lead cylinder, using an inclined knife cutter on a freely sliding carriage. Varying the angle of the knife edge, precisely varies the pitch it cuts. Refinement and translation into harder metals followed, by a variety of means. teenut Sfc149 wrote: > > What about the leadscrew? > Where did Genesis Lathe get its leadscrew > which would be needed to replicate itself? > Sig. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lathe replicating itself? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 04 Feb 2000 04:34:06 GMT -------- You can also generat a reasonably accurate master screw by wrapping two lengths of, say, 1/16" hardened wire closely around a softer cylinder. Carefully tap one of the wires so as to create a slight "bed" for it. Solder the ends of that wire and remove the other, solder the remaining wire into its "bed" You know have a fairly accurate 1/16" pitch screw. Use this to cut a more durable screw in steel. Measure pitch error and make a flat cam that will compensate for pitch error by advancing or retarding the nut. Repeat through as many iterations as it takes, to get your master screw within millions of an inch of true pitch! Use of an extra long nut helps to average out errors. Tedious? Maybe, but our ancestors seemed to be a lot more determined and patient than we are! teenut Sfc149 wrote: > > What about the leadscrew? > Where did Genesis Lathe get its leadscrew > which would be needed to replicate itself? > Sig. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: swirls on finished surface, how to? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 04 Feb 2000 05:28:13 GMT -------- Swirls!! Often called Damascening (tho' it isn't) A wine cork in a mill with abrasive will work..though not for long. Better try: A pencil end with erasor..with or without abrasive. A stiff bristle brush with abrasive. Cratex rod abrasive soft wood dowel with abrasive Purpose made "damascening" kit..sold by Brownells in Utah (web Catalogue) Fixturing to get the lines straight and the spacing/overlap even is vital. One "bobble" and it looks like s**t! teenut Awilson wrote: > > I am trying to make the nice finish I see on so many projects, the swirls. > I am thinking a wine cork in the mill and some polishing compound. Am I an > idiot? > Well I know my spell check is inop, but other than that. Any ideas? > Thanks in advance!!! > Aaron ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Broaching blind hole From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 04 Feb 2000 05:37:06 GMT -------- Almost have it right Steve! Did you undercut a "landing groove" for the cutter..kinda like you do when screwcutting? Use a stiffer tool (Said the Actress to the Bishop)..A 3/4" shank, like a short boring bar, with an inserted 1/8" tool bit. Or use a 1/8" x 3/4" parting off blade on end. Spindle stiffness and side play will be a big factor idf you are using a drill press...try to bolster the spidle on the side away from the cut. Be patient, take a very small cut and work the tool up and down until it stops cutting. Then take another tiny cut ..etc. teenut SteveK wrote: > > I'm trying to broach a blind hole 1 inch diameter, .5 inch deep with a 1/8 > inch square keyway. I mounted the wheel (this is for a hand crank wheel for > the milling machine, the .5 inch lead screw stud protrudes through the hand > crank) on the milling machine and mounted a 1/8 inch HSS lathe bit (ground > with about 10 degrees of rake) in a drill chuck and move the quill up and > down cutting a groove (this is as close as I get to a shaper). This almost > worked, the keyway is not to full depth of one half the bit (1/16 inch) all > the way down to the bottom of the bore (i.e. it tapers to about 1/4 of the > needed 1/16 depth of the keyway). > > Is there a better way to do this? Is the bit ground right to use this way? > > SteveK ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: surface plate vs. glass plate? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 04 Feb 2000 05:49:42 GMT -------- I heard this and disbelieved it at first. The actual statement is that they cannot make surface plate as flat as the earth.. Then someone calculated the actual (average) curvature of the earth, over a distance of about ten feet. I don't remember what it was..but IIRC, it was an order of magnitude less than the tolerance on a laboratory grade surface plate of that size!! Made a believer out of me!! teenut Mark wrote: > > I don't think so... the process used is a mathematical one. Over time, the > surfaces get flatter and flatter. It has nothing to do with the earth, or > gravity. > > Mark > > Engineman1 wrote in message > > > > >Years ago our shop class went on a tour of the DoAll surface plate plant in > >Savage Minn. Our tour guide told us that the flattest surface plates that > it > >was possible to manufacture would still have the spherical radius of the > earth. > > I'm wondering if that's still true? > >Engineman1 ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lathe replicating itself? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 04 Feb 2000 06:34:11 GMT -------- Glad you spotted my deliberate mistake! ;^) teenut Gerald Miller wrote: > > I do believe it would be 1/8" pitch, yes-no :-)} > > -- > > Gerry > London, Canada > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote in message > news:2Fsm4.814$ps1.110662@news1.rdc1.ga.home.com... > > You can also generat a reasonably accurate master screw by wrapping two > lengths > > of, say, 1/16" hardened wire closely around a softer cylinder. > > > > Carefully tap one of the wires so as to create a slight "bed" for it. > Solder the > > ends of that wire and remove the other, solder the remaining wire into its > > "bed" You know have a fairly accurate 1/16" pitch screw. > > > > Use this to cut a more durable screw in steel. Measure pitch error and > make a > > flat cam that will compensate for pitch error by advancing or retarding > the nut. > > > > Repeat through as many iterations as it takes, to get your master screw > within > > millions of an inch of true pitch! Use of an extra long nut helps to > average > > out errors. > > > > Tedious? Maybe, but our ancestors seemed to be a lot more determined and > > patient than we are! > > > > teenut > > > > > > > > Sfc149 wrote: > > > > > > What about the leadscrew? > > > Where did Genesis Lathe get its leadscrew > > > which would be needed to replicate itself? > > > Sig. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Death of US Manufacturing Capacity? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 04 Feb 2000 12:02:05 GMT -------- But Russia..while (still??) a World power is definitely Second or Third World in terms of the living standards of it's people. It certainly was given preference for immigration along with Ireland, Cuba, etc,. The gates have virtually locked against other European countries. teenut Janos Ero wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > Unfortunately, we are NOT still importing skills..There is a virtual moritorium > > on immigration from first world countries. > > I think the immigration of Russians with University Degree > was quite high in the last 10 years, wasn't it? > > Janos Ero ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: surface plate vs. glass plate? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 04 Feb 2000 12:06:16 GMT -------- For most purposes..especially for HSMs, (including myself), the Formica kitchen counter top is more than adequate! ;^) teenut "F. George McDuffee" wrote: > ... Any body have any comments on using a saw table or drill > press table as a surface plate? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lathe replicating itself? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 04 Feb 2000 12:18:44 GMT -------- Not Mine!! I am a duplicator, not an originator! But using a similar technique one can generate two, three or more, start threads..using the appropriate number of wires. I can remember a childs old-fashioned, "pump action" spinning top (Humming Top) where the archimedian spiral that powered it, was made by simply wrapping a wire around a spindle and soldering it in place. Gunsmiths of old used a similar technique to generate wooden or metal masters for their rifling machines. I made the first rifling guide I ever used by twisting an annealed length of 5/16" square BDMS with one end in a vice and the other held in a big tap wrench. Crude...but the barrel WAS accurate enough for my (Black Powder) purposes at the time. teenut Janos Ero wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > You can also generat a reasonably accurate master screw by wrapping two lengths > > of, say, 1/16" hardened wire closely around a softer cylinder. > > > Brilliant idea, indeed. > > Janos Ero ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: School Shop Equipment For Sale From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 04 Feb 2000 13:21:48 GMT -------- Hugh Strong wrote: > The important factor in the industrialization of the South > was low Southern wages leading to investment in the South, > not people giving up their jobs in New England to work for > lower wages in Dixie. Several other factors too..Lack of Union restrictions, cheaper land and utilities, cheaper building costs, in part because of lower regulatory standards and the elimination of insulation etc., to fend off sub-zero winters. One US owned, Canadian Plant ..(one of my major automation clients) abruptly upped sticks and shipped the plant to Tennessee...The saving on heating bills alone was over a million dollars a year. It was the advent of the NAFTA that, freed from Canadian tariff barriers on their imports to that market enabled them to make that move. That pattern was followed by uncountable numbers of other US/Canadian Companies, costing Ontario alone, IIRC, of the order of a quarter million highly paid manufacturing jobs with a couple of years. Most of those companies avoided the social and political backlash of mass firings by not "Closing Down" the operation publicly. Instead they snuck out the back door quietly..leaving once bustling, Manufacturing Plants with several thousands of skilled workers as mere "Shells" with a staff of a few dozen simply acting as a Warehousing and Distribution Center for the Canadian Market! A lot of those people displaced, are still struggling to get away from the "Hash Slinging" level of jobs that replaced them. Sure, the high, reported, unemployment rate, eventually went down..But the Government doesn't report on "Underemployment" "Dumbing Down" and the shattering of lives, dreams and futures!! The US Government, that was so happy to suck jobs out of Canada, made damn sure the Borders were slammed shut to prevent the workers from migrating with them!! But don't imagine that job, (NOT worker) migration has stopped at the Mexican border!! On the principle of "If you can't beat them..Join them", I upped sticks myself..formed a Consortium of several Canadian Automation companies and headed to Atlanta. (Canadian automation is (was) some of the most advanced in North America..Simply by dint of the high labor costs up there!) However, once I got up and running here in the SE, I didn't find (as I had hoped) a market of high levels of cheap labor content industries, on the verge of turning to automation as wages and costs caught up with the rest of the USA. What I DID find, was companies that came here for the reasons I cited above..But who were quite willing to make the move AGAIN, when this area became un-economical..Usually to the Mexican Border or far, far, beyond that! The Social/Political fall out from that inevitability, has not yet even BEGUN to register on US radar screens!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: More Al Babin hilarity From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 04 Feb 2000 13:30:33 GMT -------- In had too many occasions where I suspected that regular Ebeyers, (Not YOU Gentle Readers of course) were starting to do a bid search on "teenut" to see what they might have missed of value!! I no longer use that name for items I REALLY want!! Catch me if you can!! XPRTEC wrote: > > XPRTEC wrote: > I'm getting > > into the TEE-NUT league. > > > > I sniped a perfect snipe the other night! Placed my last bid and it came > back 0 MINUTES 0 SECONDS! I won a Dutch Auction for the two readouts. For > lathe and mill speed. > > << From: Robert Bastow "teenut"@hotmail.com > >>Wrote: So it was YOU you SOB!! > << (just kidding) >> > > SO, Now Teenut is using an alias also! I'm even more pleased to know that I > beat the Best! > > Jim xprtec@aol.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: The Many eBay Aliases of Al Babin From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 04 Feb 2000 13:42:31 GMT -------- It is inevitable that regular buyers and sellers get a degree of negative feed back..often for no fault of their own. There are some real FUNNY people out there! Myself I have 2 negatives (out of a total of about 150+ positives) One of these came when the MO went missing and I hung on a while before replacing it..it can take six months to reclaim a "lost" Money Order..Both times I have tried to do that, the MO had, in fact, been cashed by an "unknown third party" Yeh! Right! Anyway, I did eventually cough up again, and received the item..but not before the seller posted a negative feed back...one that was never rescinded by him! The other was an attempt by a seller to use "Shipping and Handling Extortion" on an item I scored cheap..with no reserve. It was badly described and in the wrong category..but he took umbrage when I told him to stick it where the sun don't shine!! Caveat Emptied! teenut Dave Ficken wrote: > > >From: plalbrecht@aol.com (PLAlbrecht) > > > > > > >DEFINITELY you need to > > > >1. Leave negative feedback. > > > >2. Contact ebay and file a complaint. Mention that you feel he is trying to > >dodge a sale on which you are the only bidder. > > > >From the "Ebay investigation procedures" page on their "Safe Harbor" page, > >they > >say they will investigate the following. The first may not apply, as you > >haven't sent payment. > > > > Let's not jump the gun. The big thing you missed in all the Ebay quotes is that > Ebay reccommends first trying to contact the other party by telephone. The site > is down this morning for maintenance so I can't direct quote, but I believe > they say that a phone call is the best way to resolve a misunderstanding before > leaving feedback. They also note that many folks don't answer email daily, > people go on vacation, have computer crashes, get sick, etc. etc. > > I'm not trying to come off as the defender of Mbabin. Personally, I'd be better > off if they did throw him off ebay, or the planet in general. If anything, I'm > just shocked, amazed, and a bit fed up at all the grade school nonsense that > surrounds the whole feedback system. > Negative feedback should be a Last Resort when all resonable attempts at a > resolution fail. Part of any "reasonable" attempt should surely involve a phone > call. > Each user must provide a contact phone number as part of the registration. This > information can be requested by any registered user (takes 30 seconds or less). > > regards, > > Dave Ficken > Meridian Machinery > http://www.mermac.com > Email:Dave@mermac.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Death of US Manufacturing Capacity? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 05 Feb 2000 02:27:32 GMT -------- And like generations of immegrants before them they WILL "make it" They will then hammer their kids through schooland college, to get the education that will mean they will never have to go through the deprivations and humiliations of their parents. And those kids will come up against the kids of comfortable middle class third, fourth and fifth generation "Americans" and they will take names and kick ass!! As well they should! teenut John Flanagan wrote: > > On Thu, 3 Feb 2000 06:20:30 -0800, "timerak" > wrote: > > >The present administration in Washington wants to prevent more "evil white > >Europeans" from coming to this country! Its all politics! > > Is it evil white or just plain highly educated, skilled and not > willing to work for a pittance? I've seen illegal aliens working > construction jobs for WELL under minimum wage. They save it up, > living ten to an apartment, and send what they have home. They're > still making more money than they did at home. > > John ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Death of US Manufacturing Capacity? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 05 Feb 2000 03:19:14 GMT -------- PLAlbrecht wrote: Except for United Kingdom at 1.5 > percent [that's how teenut got in, I suppose :-) No..Not a hope in hell of entering from the UK!! I went to Canada and suffered the cold, economic depressions and unemployment, long enough to get Canadian Citizenship, then drove over the border, "Uninspected" for a "short Vacation" and, to all intents and purposes, "Disappeared from the radar screens" I should add that I obtained an SSN, became licensed by SEC and NASD...which involved being fingerprinted by the FBI several times!! I was self employed, (Unemployable!!!!) successful, had several employees, paid all my taxes, and was a good "citizen" for many years before being able to come out of the closet. My penance was a heavy "penalty" (fine) for entering "Un-inspected" and staying past my official welcome. Plus a further two and a half years to be granted permanent residence..during which time I could not leave the country under ANY circumstances..but could be deported at a minute's notice! Hey! It is not a process to be undertaken lightly. But where there is a dream there is a vision, where there is a Vision there is a will, and where there is a will, there is a WAY! In my case it took twenty-three years to bring my dream to fruition! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Death of US Manufacturing Capacity? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 05 Feb 2000 05:55:48 GMT -------- Thank you Tony, that is the nicest thing anyone has said to me in a Long long time. Now, at last, I feel at home, safe, and welcome!! teenut tonyp wrote: > > In my case it took twenty-three years to bring my dream to fruition! > > > > teenut > > > > And we're all grateful that you succeeded! I personally have no doubt > that the US is a better country for having you as a citizen. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Miller table sag was: surface plate vs. glass plate? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 05 Feb 2000 15:31:58 GMT -------- Yes! No material is perfectly rigid, cast iron not a great deal more so than aluminum. I have seen knee mill tables permanently bowed by keeping a heavy accessory cantilevered out there, on a semi-permanent basis. I had a freind who had to regrind the entire bed of his Powermatic 8" jointer, because he used it to store the 6" machine vise for his mill. teenut Tim Leech wrote: > > The thread on glass sagging over time leads me to ask this one: > > Unless I need the whole table, I keep a dividing head (heavy) on one > end of my mill table (cast iron, 36 x 9 inch) and a 6 inch vice > (almost as heavy) on the other end. > When not in use, I take care to leave the table central such that > there is a minimum of overhanging load, lest the ends of the table > should droop. > Is this a real concern? > > Cheers > Tim > ------------------------------------------------- > Tim Leech > > timleech@dutondok.u-net.com > > Traditional & Modern canal craft repairs > > ------------------------------------------------- ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: swirls on finished surface, how to? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 05 Feb 2000 19:34:47 GMT -------- Damascening and engine turning are used interchangeably. the former in the gunsmithing world, usually applied to bolts..about the only place in the world I can tolerate, it except inside a high quality watch. I HATE to see it on machine tools and fixtures where IMHO it is a cheap substitute for frosting. Engine turning is a term more frequently used in general and particularly in jewelry Damascus steel is the term used now-a-days for what is more properly, and increasingly, called "Pattern Welded" steel..Thereis some incredible work being done in this area today. Damascus is not, strictly speaking the correct term for pattern welding. The make up and methodoldy of true damascus is prety well lost..but is though more to resemble the Indian "Wootz Steel" teenut "F. George McDuffee" wrote: > > On Fri, 04 Feb 2000 05:28:13 GMT, Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ > hotmail.com> wrote: > > >Swirls!! Often called Damascening (tho' it isn't) > > > > > >> > >> I am trying to make the nice finish I see on so many projects, the swirls. > > I thought this was called engine turning. Damascening is the > marbleized effect of hammer welding and forging two dissimilar > iron alloys (i.e. high and low carbon steel one for strength and > one for the edge) A similar effect is also obtained from > ultra-high carbon steel. > > George > > If Education is the answer, what was the question? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Graduated Dial Source? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2000 02:23:07 GMT -------- I fitted a beautiful 100 division handwheel to my Maximat Super II. I got it from Sherline and it is made for the Bridgeport mill knee elevation screw. 3/1/4" diameter and made of black anodised aluminum, with bright, crisply engraved, numbers and divisions. Cost, IIRC, about $35.00. It might be a bit on the big side for you..and I am not sure if they do 125 Divisions..but it could be worth asking. teenut David Bush wrote: > > I was out in the shop today playing with my Leblonde Lathe. I noticed that I'm having more > trouble reading the dial on the compound slide and thought about replacing it with a better > one. It needs to be graduated for .125" movement. The one I have is very worn and can no > longer read the numbers and about half the lines. > > At work, there is a 16" SB that the dial is at least 2" in diameter. It is very easy to > read. Mine is just like the one on the 7" Atlas Shaper. (about 1.125") Does anyone know a > source for these dials? I know I would have to modify it to fit mine, which would be no > problem. > > Many thanks, > > -------------------------------------------------------- > -Dave > > Visit my homeshop at http://members.citynet.net/parmaco/ > -------------------------------------------------------- > > -----------== Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News ==---------- > http://www.newsfeeds.com The Largest Usenet Servers in the World! > ------== Over 73,000 Newsgroups - Including Dedicated Binaries Servers ==----- ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Making a bay window From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2000 03:06:46 GMT -------- 4d nails and a BFH? teenut todzo@brouhaha.com wrote: > Big question is how do you attach the glass to the aluminum > or stainless frame? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Starrett Weber Gage Block Set From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2000 06:05:23 GMT -------- I will give you $100.00 to take those nasty things off your hands. ;^) teenut noname wrote: > > I have a set of Starret gage blocks and would like to have some idea > of what they are worth. They are new, never used, still with the > factory preservative on them and in the factory wood case. Model > #SS36A1X. > > They are steel, 41 various blocks from .1000 to .1009 by .0001, .110 > to .190 by .001, .100 to .500 by .1, plus 1.000, 2.000, 3.000, 4.000 > and some fractional and wear blocks. The set also has a variety of > mounting rods and holders. > > Anybody have a clue about the value? I can't find them on Starrett's > site or any of the precision tool sites. > > Thanks! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: FS Gravermeister and accessories, From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2000 06:09:28 GMT -------- Age, condition, Location, pictures? Please email me direct: teenut@hotmail.com teenut Robert Bastow Express Tool & Die Atlanta GA Jay McMunn wrote: > > Gravermeister with one handpiece, $600, with the GRS Powerhone > and two diamond wheels and graver grinding fixture, $900. Or > with those and an enraving ball with all of the accesories, $1100. > Thanks for reading, Jay > jmcmunn@nidlink.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Harry Pope, Gunsmith From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2000 06:33:04 GMT -------- The entire book.."The Story of Pope's Barrels" is on sale right now from Wolfe Publishing for about $17.00. This is a GREAT price, especially as it was a collectors item for a long time. I got my copy almost thirty years ago, one of a limited edition, private printing. It is a fascinating book, a must for any machinist..a story of huge talent, ingenuity, perseverance of a great craftsman. Harry Pope, unfortunately, was probably the worlds worst businessman and struggled all his life, eventually to die in near poverty..His name is unheard of by most..but among gunsmiths, especially Barrel Makers he is revered as a Deity!! I must add though, that the writer was not a machinist himself, so the kind of blow by blow details we pore and drool over, are not there, except in very small, tantalising, morsels. It will not tell you, for instance, how to make a rifling machine..though it does tell you how he used the one he made from an old lathe. Two thumbs up teenut Bob Unitt wrote: > > In article <20000204223216.00140.00001534@ng-cm1.aol.com>, > and > In article <20000204224017.00140.00001535@ng-cm1.aol.com>, > Fdmorrison writes > >The following is offered because it will be of interest to many who read here. > >The source is an old copy of AmRifleman found at a flea market. > >It will complement the "J. M. Pyne" story by Lucian Cary, as reproduced by Guy > >Lautard for TMBR vol. 1. > >I have split this in to two posts, to make it easier to digest for some. > > I'd never heard of Harry Pope, and have no great interest in gun-smithing, but > I found these articles absolutely fascinating. > > Thank you. > -- > Bob Unitt (UK) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Harry Pope, Gunsmith From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2000 16:57:15 GMT -------- Order it for $19.95 + 4.25 sh.....at 1 800 899 7810 Cat# 568.1 teenut "Orrin B. Iseminger" wrote: > > Do you have an address or telephone number for Wolfe Publishing? I checked > on Advanced Book Exchange for this title and the prices ranged from $30 to > $275. > > TIA > > Orrin > > In article , "teenut"@hotmail.com says... > > > >The entire book.."The Story of Pope's Barrels" is on sale right now from Wolfe > >Publishing for about $17.00. This is a GREAT price, especially as it was a > >collectors item for a long time. I got my copy almost thirty years ago, one of > >a limited edition, private printing. > > > > Snip > > >Two thumbs up > > > >teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: FS:SOUTHBEND 10"X4-1/2FT BED toolroom lathe W/tooling From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2000 17:44:17 GMT -------- Tell me about the surface grinder in Georgia!! teenut Gunner wrote: > > fox@NONE.COM (foxeye) wrote: > > >TYPICAL..all the stuff I am interested in is either located way up > >north or on the left coast........anyone have anything in the > >deepsouth they want to part with? > > > Don't feel bad.... I had a gent offer to give me a Rhodes shaper...unfortunatly he was in Florida, > and needed a rigger to remove it, and a gent in Georgia offered 2 days ago to give me a Surface > Grinder. > > Unfortunately, Im in California. > > Someone here on this newsgroup got the shaper, and I am waiting for permission to post the free > surface grinder here on this news group. > > Being a good Samaritan is hard sometimes....sniff...snivel.....sob.... > > Gunner > > > > >On Sun, 06 Feb 2000 03:17:01 GMT, mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > > >>In article <389CD4B4.D41CB263@ix.netcom.com>, > >> ttools@ix.netcom.com wrote: > >>> SOUTHBEND 10"X4-1/2FT BED tool room > >>> lathe, machine is like new > >>> W/ tooling D1-4 spindle T-A attach QC > >>> post Original Owner > >> > >>> http://www.InsideTheWeb.com/mbs.cgi/mb874451 > >> > >>The machine is in New Hope, Pa, and the price is $4K. > >> > >>Jim > >> > >> > >>Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > >>Before you buy. > > --------------------------------------------------------- > > "A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an > invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write > a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort > the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, > solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program > a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die > gallantly. Specialization is for insects." Robert Heinlein ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Acconting program for small Tool and Die Business From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2000 17:50:59 GMT -------- My Financial Management Advisor recommends QuickBook Pro. I have seen some adverse reviews on this..does anyone have direct experience of this or a better system. Metalworking content..it IS a tool & die shop! Thanks, teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: single point threading From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2000 23:47:42 GMT -------- mulligan@advinc.com wrote: Now Robert B is going to > go on with a diatribe about 'how we did it without all that fancy > stuff back when I was a boy' and prove me wrong (again!). Naw! Not this time! Sure I COULD tell you how the old timers did it with a chalk mark on the chuck and one the bed..But even I would rather cut one with a 3-square file than go back to that s**t. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Grizzly Lathe 12 X 24 Questions From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2000 23:54:50 GMT -------- John Robertson wrote: > > Funny how you ignore some newsgroup topics until you are interested. One of these days, just for the hell of it, I am going to buy a 3-in-1 machine and wring it out to find out what it REALLY IS capable of..then fine tune it to confound all the "experts"...Starting with myself!! Maybe there is money to be made in a BOOK!! Maybe I can get one of the suppliers to sponsor me with a free "loaner" 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: BRASS ??? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 06 Feb 2000 23:59:30 GMT -------- Any which way you want to do it..except welded. Brass is one of the easiest metals to soft solder, silver solder or braze. What do you want to join, for what service, what tackle and experience do you have? Apres moi..Le deluge!! teenut "Dr. Robert A. Harms" wrote: > > Please forgive such a simple question, but can brass parts be soldered > together ? > brazed ? something else ? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Tool Drool Time From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 07 Feb 2000 00:12:15 GMT -------- http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=250457362 tee(slurp)nut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What is a slot drill? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 07 Feb 2000 13:58:23 GMT -------- Only two flute Tom, a three or more flut is an end mill and will not cut an accurately sized slot. teenut Tom Holt wrote: > > The message <389E6708.F3E6A4F3@micron.net> > from b contains these words: > > > Sorry for a question that is probably dumb to most of you, but I keep > > reading about them but have never actually seen one unless it is the > > same as an end mill. Thanks > > -brian > > Slot drill is Britspeak for a 2 or 3 flute end mill, such as is used > for cutting slots. Here in the Third World, we use the term 'end > mill' to describe 4 flute cutters for side cutting and other > applications where the cutter doesn't need to go down into the work. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What is a slot drill? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2000 00:06:47 GMT -------- Plunging and pocketing..step milling, side cutting, or end milling. anything but SINGLE PASS slot milling! teenut Tom Holt wrote: > > The message <3cAn4.1066$ps1.114082@news1.rdc1.ga.home.com> > from Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> contains these words: > > > Only two flute Tom, a three or more flut is an end mill and will not cut an > > accurately sized slot. > > OK; so what are all the 3-flute end-cutting end-mills in my tool rack > meant to be used for? > > (Not trying to be funny; I'd just like to know, is all...) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What is a slot drill? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2000 00:11:46 GMT -------- Not exactly by "default"...As I pointed out, not too long ago, on this list..A properly ground two flute, end cutting "Slot drill" has one lip ground longer than the other..so as to pass through the center line. This is usually acompanied by a narrow relief slot between the two lips. teenut ltl919 wrote: > > Tom Holt wrote: > > > Here in the Third World, we use the term 'end > > mill' to describe 4 flute cutters for side cutting and other > > applications where the cutter doesn't need to go down into the work. > > Note that there is such a thing as a center-cutting 4 flute end mill - they > are pretty common. > 2 flute end mills are center cutting by default. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Help! ID Threading/I actually made something! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2000 00:12:56 GMT -------- Musta been a heckuva pinch!! teenut Fidln1 wrote: > > P.S., I've ground some up out of old Allen wrenches that worked in a pinch ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What is a slot drill? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 08 Feb 2000 04:22:48 GMT -------- It isn't me you are disagreeing with John..Just the laws of physics..You know..Equal and opposite reaction. Simply put, the two flutes of a slot drill are balanced..tending to deflect each other equally (assuming both are SHARP!!!) Equal and opposite forces cancel each other out..result is nil deflection and the tool tackes the path of least resistance..which is the narrowest slot it can pass through. That is one that is just as wide as the cutter. A three flute mill always has an unbalanced cuting force..the leading flute in the cut always tending to deflect the trailing tooth with a sideways acting vector. Now, you can argue 'til you are blue in the face about modern CNC grinds, super-rigid milling spindles, antibacklash screws, stiction free , zero clearsnce slides and machines built like brick s**thouses, But the basic physics doesn't change. A two flut will "Follow the slot" a three or more flute will ALWAYS try to have a dig at the sidewalls...if only because the milling cutter itself is flexible to one degree or another. Now, you yourself may be fortunate enough to get away with it, and I can imagine circumstances of cutter diameter, allowable slot tolerances etc., that will allow that. But the vast majority of HSM's on this list have no chance of repeating your performance. Many have battled, trying to cut slots with multi tooth end mills and wondered why on earth it didn't work for THEM. Well now they know they are not alone..it doesn't work for ANYBODY!!! Except John! ;^) teenut John Stevenson wrote: > Sorry to disagree with the famous Teenut but 3 flute cutters CAN AND WILL > cut an accurate slot. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What is a slot drill? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2000 02:11:32 GMT -------- No..but I have seen a lot that were "split point" ground rather than a "cross center..long and short lip" grind teenut ltl919 wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > Not exactly by "default"...As I pointed out, not too long ago, on this list..A > > properly ground two flute, end cutting "Slot drill" has one lip ground longer > > than the other..so as to pass through the center line. This is usually > > acompanied by a narrow relief slot between the two lips. > > Hi, > I am wondering, have you ever seen any non-centercutting 2-flute end mills sold? > All the ones I see in MSC and McMaster just say 2-flute, which I assume to be > centercutting. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Armor-Piercing Arrowheads From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2000 03:30:24 GMT -------- Hi Ed, I have made a LOT of forged medieval arrow heads in my time. Traditional archery is one of my hobbies and I have a 6'3" 70# English (yew) Longbow that needs feeding!! The type of point your friend is asking for is called a "Bodkin" point..a wickedly needle pointed SQUARE section point up to 4 1/2" long x 3/8 square at its widest point. Shot from an English Warbow (Which STARTED at 70 # and went up to 110# plus, mounted on an ash warshaft 32 1/2" long 7/16" diameter with 6" fletches of "Greye Goose Wing" and a horn reinforced nock...its range was an easy 275yds plus and would give a "Grievous Stripe"!! Grievous enough, to punch through 1/16" plus, hardened armour, and pin a man to his dead horse. To slice through chain mail (or modern Kevlar body armour) as though it weren't there. To penetrate a 5" thick seasoned, oak drawbridge!! In the deadly, lifelong trained hands, and disciplined ranks of medieval English Yeoman Longbowmen, the English Warbow was the Maxim Gun of its day...Firepower that was not surpassed in its mass killing power, until the First World War!! The hard way to make these deadly bodkins, is to first forge the long square point from 3/8" or 7/16" square stock, and form the narrower, rounded neck behind it, then cut off with a hot hardie, leaving a stub about 1/2" long. This is then forged out, first into a flat fan which is then deeply grooved at its transition point with a narrow, round edged chisel. The fan is then formed up on swedge blocks around a tapered mandrel (10 deg included angle is the modern standard.) Finally the overlap is forge welded closed and the whole thing trued and straightened. A skilled arrowsmith can forge 20 or 25 of these an hour (NOT me!..One or two an hour is my limit!!) The EASY (teenut's) way, is to start with 3/8" square MS bar in a collet chuck. Drill to full depth of the socket with a 1/8" drill Follow about half way with a 1/4" drill and then finish to size with a tapered "D" bit. Turn the tapered o/d of the socket to a slightly less tapered angle so that the wall thickness starts at about .040" and gets a bit thicker as it goes. The neck should start to flare out to full 3/8" diameter/square, starting from about 2/3 down the length of the socket. Part off the square head about half the finished length required. Now you can forge the square out into a long tapered bodkin. Forging a square point is a lot easier than forging a round one..believe it or not..and one of the first, recognisable, skills, learned by a budding blacksmith!! A 1" long socket and neck with a 1 3/4" long square point, should give your friend a nicely proportioned, balanced point, light enough for a modern bow. Any heavier than this, and he won't be able to get arrows with enough "Spine" without turning to ash or other hardwood. My "Battleshafts" weigh in at almost 800 grains, compared to a modern, hunting shaft, at around 325 grains!! Finish, if you can, to a "polished planish" without filing, or grinding..it doesn't look right and you can never disguise it! With a steel mandrel in the socket, lightly planish this also, to hide the machining marks..(Shh..I never told you that!!) Heat treat by deeply case hardening the point..I double dip in kasenit, and quench in cold water. no temper required. This point, in the hands of a good bowman, will punch through 1/8" mild steel plate!! A friend of mine has a WWII vintage GI steel helmet, with a bodkin pointed Battleshaft, clear through one side and half way out the other! teenut Ed Bailen wrote: > > A friend who is in to SCA-type archery has asked if I can make him > some medieval, armor-piercing, arrow heads. Per his "specs", they are > a simple cone about 2" long and about 0.5" diameter at the base. The > problem is the socket at the base to receive the arrow shaft. > Ideally, it should have a conical shape also to evenly distribute the > load on the shaft (with some "bluntness" allowed at the tip of the > cone), but the actual dimensions are not too critical. (The included > angle at the tip of the socket cone probably shouldn't exceed 45 > degrees.) > > I figure I can make the socket with a stepped series of drills and a > custom HSS tapered tool to finish it off, but I can't figure out how > to hold the beast while drilling the socket. > > One way might be to start out with a 4" length of 0.5" rod and hollow > out one end for 2", with the tapered socket at the end. Then I could > flip it end for end to make the arrowhead, and part it off. If that > would work, how thick would the walls have to be on the hollow shaft > assuming I take light cuts on the arrow head. (My 6" Craftsman > doesn't do heavy cuts.) > > Thanks, > Ed ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Casting Ideas needed From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2000 03:38:18 GMT -------- Esther Heller wrote: > > Don Buchan wrote in message <38a04196.3225190@news.mb.sympatico.ca>... > >We are thinking of starting a mens group at our church and the Pastor > >has asked me to think of a one night casting session for the men to > Something in pewter (doesn't get as hot). tchotchkes for the women in > your lives? fishing weights? checkers? pins to label the ushers as > ushers? Pendants? (our ruling elders wear nametags and wood crosses > with doves on them to be easily recognisable) Recognition medallions > for Sunday School teachers or nursery workers? Got some soapstone or > slate to carve molds out of? > > Esther > eoh at kodak Slugs for the offertory plate? ;^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: pewter paint From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2000 03:39:45 GMT -------- Just melt it and dip your brush in it!! 8^) teenut Ford Gary wrote: > > does anybody know were to get pewter paint ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Morse tapers question From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2000 04:14:48 GMT -------- I have never read anything to confirm, or deny, my own theory about Morse tapers. It is hard to imagine that anyone would come up with such a selection of slightly differing, non aliqot, non standard dimension, tapers, for a nesting series...Without having some obscure but sound reason for it! My theory..and I have never bothered with the math to test it..is that the tapers were carefully calculated to give the REQUIRED Holding, yet easily Releasing, power to shanks and sleeves of differing core diameters and inside and outside dimensions..so that, for example an MT #1 shank drill popped by hand, into a # 2 sleeve, then a #3 sleeve then #4 then # 5 would result in a drill, firmly held...but would not have itself, or one of the sleeve combinations wedged any tighter than any other pair. If you bear in mind, the wide disparity in "Oomph" available when flicking a # 1 TS drill home, as compared to a much heavier # 5 TS drill into its socket, it starts to make sense that a different, calculable, taper might be appropriate for each size For whatever obscure, or obtuse reason they are what they are...the Morse series for sure, does the job it was intended to do extremely well! teenut Fdmorrison wrote: > > >Peter Groepper peter.groepper@wxs.nl > > >has anyone an idea, why morse tapers are designed such, that > >none of both measuring systems (inch, metric) can describe them > >in easy numbers? It's all fractions of an inch or mm, the angles > >are all different for the different tapers. Why that??? > > I don't know. Perhaps an important associated question is why there has not > been more standardization. > > Stephen Morse produced a very popular line of the first milled-flute twist > drills, starting in the mid-1860s, when he founded the Morse Twist Drill and > Machine Co. in New Bedford, Massachusetts, then. He also made the taper > reamers to go with the drill press quills and lathe spindles that used them. > > But I don't know why these standards were originally chosen, or why these > choices apparently resisted standardization in the 20th century. > > There was no standard self-holding taper back then, and these varied from > approximately 1/2 inch per foot to over 1 inch per foot. Some manufacturers > used differing tapers for different sizes of machine. > > In 1885, in response to a survey conducted by _American Machinist_ , the New > Haven Manufacturing Co., reported > > "[t]he holes in all our drill spindles are reamed out with a Morse No. 4 taper > reamer, and the taper to that is about 5/8 to the foot. In our lathes the > tapers vary with the swing of the lathe: 18 inch swing 3/4 inch to foot, 26 > inch and 30 inch, 1 1/4 to foot, etc." > > Other makers of the same lines of machines reported different standards. > > Whether the history shows tool builders favoring art over science, or whether > it shows them concentrating on profit over both, without trade association or > government intervention, is beyond my information. > > Best regards, > > Frank Morrison ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Machinist Job Interview: Suggestions? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2000 04:23:22 GMT -------- An informal resume helps..written or verbal..it does help to know the man's past experience. But you can't judge his skill without observing his work. When I need a machinist, (and they are hard to come by nowadays) I will give all comers a chance at a "working interview" If they will agree to come and work in the shop, for one day at full pay, I will then decide whether to hire them or not. Sometimes just a few seconds of quiet observation will tell you all you need to know..one way or the other. Certainly a day is more than enough. Above all, my experience of machinists is, "Never judge a book by its cover" teenut David Munro wrote: > > After about a year of being completely overwhelmed in my one man shop > (Clock part fabrication and repair) I have advertised for a machinist in > the local paper, and lo and behold, some people have contacted me for > interviews. Are there any job interview suggestions from either side of > the desk? > > David M. Munro > > -- > David M. Munro ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Another dorky engineering idea - digital positioning?!? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2000 10:54:00 GMT -------- Hi Alan, I can see why you are a Software Engineer...they must keep you well away from the Hardware!! ;^) Your problem with this scheme would be cumulative tolerances..Add an inescapable, plus or minus factor to every stage of your "Binary Extender", and you will see what I mean. Chuck in a bit of wobble too, and you will see what the hadware guys have to contend with every day. It is why they are a bit more phlegmatic than Software Engineers..They can't afford to live in Cloud Cuckoo Land all day! 8^) teenut Alan Mimms wrote: > > Hi. I hope this won't be too far off topic. It IS metalworking > related, since the positioning device described herein could be used > for moving cutting tools, work pieces, or for measurement. > > I must first admit (hide behind the fact) that although I am an > engineer by trade, it is SOFTWARE engineering I do with greatest > success (i.e., please excuse the ramblings of one who is by > profession soft in the head). > > Suppose I were to somehow build sixteen "linear positioning devices", > each of which could assume two extremes - fully retracted and fully > extended. If the first had a movement of 0.001" as its difference > btween extremes, the second had 0.002", third 0.004", etc. (double for > each in turn), the sixteenth one of these widgets would have a > positioning difference of 32.768". If I were to arrange these so each > rode on the end of its next larger brother, they would all be strung > together in a straight line. If all were in their fully retracted > state, the distance between the flat end of the very largest one and > the far end of the very smallest one would be some standard constant > value D. If all were in the fully EXTENDED state, the distance would > be, very precisely, D + 65.535". I apply a binary number to the > sixteen positioning devices, with a '0' to mean "retracted" and a '1' > to mean "extended" for each digit. Thus I am representing the binary > number N of thousandths by which I want to move the end of this > widget. After doing so and waiting some settling time, I'll have a > very precisely metered distance of D + N. > > For those who aren't familiar with binary arithmetic, think of the > sixteen binary digits as similar to those of a sixteen digit BIG > decimal number, except rather than having the digits right-to-left > meaning ones, tens, hundreds, thousands, etc., the digits stand for > ones, twos, fours, eights, sixteens, etc. Unlike in the decimal > system, where of course each digit has a range of 0..9, each binary > digit can ONLY have the value of '0' or '1'. If you think this > through, you'll see that given sixteen of these binary digits, you can > make a sequence of '0' and '1' adding up ones, twos, fours, etc. as > required to make any number in the range 0..65,535. I picked sixteen > because it gives a reasonable range and it is a very convenient type > of binary number for a small controller computer to deal with. > > I guess I'm asking for comments. I can see a few possible ways to > build the positioning devices, most of them awkward at one end of the > extreme range required or the other. Perhaps a mixture of techniques > - those best suited for the very small (0.001"..0.256" say) sizes > using one design while the larger ones are based on a different > mechanism entirely. > > Obviously, each postioner must move between retracted and extended > positions very very accurately and repeatably for this to be useful. > This might be achieved through the use of a hard stop at each end of > travel. Also obviously, any wire attached to each positioner must be > quite flexible to be shoved along by the positioner's bigger brothers > over such a great range. > > Of course, if you only need a smaller range of lengths, you can use > fewer binary digits. For 10 digits, you get a maximum extent of > 1.023". For 20 digits you get a whopping 1,048.576"! > > Does anyone have any thoughts on this? Has anyone seen a system like > this before? I very very vaguely recall something like this proposed > a LONG time ago for positioning the read/write heads on a computer > disk drive. Given some other vague recollections associated with > this, I think this was probably around 1977 or so, when I was in high > school. > -- > Alan Mimms > Home machinist in (self) training. > E-mail: alanm@unforgettable.com > Metalworking web page: http://alanm.penguinpowered.com/metalworking ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Armor-Piercing Arrowheads From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 09 Feb 2000 14:17:57 GMT -------- I can relate to the Big Bow Ernie! Though my yew English Longbow is ONLY 70# draw @ my 29" I have seen it humble strong men. An aquaintance of mine, accustomed to a 65# Compound (Training wheels!!!) bow grabbed it and I thought he was going to bust a blood vessel trying to get past 2/3 draw..he never did! It takes a lot of training of particular muscle groups to achieve full draw an a "heavy". There was a lot of controversy about the weight of old English Warbows, especially after the raising of the "Mary Rose" and the discovery of hundreds of well preserved bows from the late medieval period. Because of their sheer size a lot of "Learned Scholars" deduced that thes were "unfinished" bow staves...refusing to believe that an average man..especially of the shorter average stature of those days, could draw a bow of those weights. Which is absolute poppycock, as has been demonstrated since, to the satisfaction of most people..though not all. Firstly, the thought of a warship setting out to go to war, carrying unfinished staves and no finished bows is idiotic. Secondly, examination of a couple of skeletons, has found changes in bone structure that could only be brought about by a lifetime of practice with these big bows. English bowyers have faithfully reproduced several samples..to the best of their considerable ability and working with the poorer quality Oregon Yew..which is about all that is available now. Draw weights have resulted that range from 90 to 125 pounds. There are a select few, practiced archers who can draw this weight effortlessly and the performance results, shooting the heavy, ash shafted, iron headed battleshafts is outstanding!! The thought of seeing a couple of thousand of these fearsome missiles, descending every few seconds into packed ranks is truly frightening. It has been calculated that the English Archers fired off close to three quarters of a million battleshafts during the three hour period of the Battle of Agincourt! The carnage among the French ranks was appalling..Tens of thousands were killed..and they only counted "Those of Rank"!! Not that these old archers were simply trained to shoot en mass at area targets either. When the range got down to 100 yards or less it was a foolish man that exposed an unarmoured armpit, or as one high ranking noble did..raised his visor for a breath of air. Within seconds, two or three shafts hit him full in his open mouth!! teenut Ernie Leimkuhler wrote: > > Well I still have my 100# Martin longbow and occassionally warp my spine stringing the thing. > I made and shot a bunch of armour peircers a few years ago and bodkin points coming off my 100# bow > on 3/8" cedar shafts, will punch big holes in 1/8" steel at 100 yds. > Part of owning and shooting a 100# bow is the challenge of finding out just how much the thing can > do. > I always enjoyed shooting it with the St.Sebastians Guild in Norhern Cal. > We would all fire in cadence in a row. > Releasing simultaneously, my arrows would always hit first with almost no visible arc to the path at > anything below 50 yds. > > I did learn that I have to use flat point blunt tips if I want to get my arrows out of compressed > cedar bails, and straw bails are like tissue, I can't count how many fletches I had ripped off by > arrows flying through bails. > One other problem is that the string is larger than any snap nocks and in the Guild we shot self > nocked arrows anyway. > Fun bow. > I should get back into shooting it before I get to old to shoot the brutish beast. > My 34 year old rotater cup is still pretty strong from many years of power lifting, but I have been > warned about trying to shoot it once my joints start to age. > Believe me, this bow humbles the biggest man. > I always enjoyed bringing it to shoots just because everybody else would have to try drawing it. > Most couldn't even get it half way. > It took me 6 months of training to work up from my 60# bow to the 100# Martin. > I am glad it is fiberglass because wood and sinew bows have a short useful life of about 10 years > before they dry out. > When I bought it for my birthday, I had the choice of 100# or 120# for the same price. > Many is the time I have thanked the stars that I was wise enough not to order the 120# bow. > I have never met anyone else strong enough to draw my bow to full draw, and the thought of someone > shooting a 120# version makes me very scared. > I know that the famous Howard Hill took down a bull elephant with a 160# longbow of his own design. > The arrow had a 1 lb. steel head, and a 1/2" ash shaft. > > BTW I made my bodkin points by cheating. > I forged the points and then TIG welded them onto blunt arrow heads that already had the tapered > hole. > Much quicker. > > -- > STAGESMITH - Custom Metal Fabrication - Renton, WA, US > > "Rich gifts wax poor when givers prove unkind." > William Shakespear ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Cutting tools, wedge of parent metal forms in front of point From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2000 03:42:44 GMT -------- The problem is, that a lot of books repeat, parrot fashion, the duff information printed by earlier authors. Metal cutting is not unique in this respect. The mechanics and dynamics of metal removal are only now beginning to be truly understood..and there is a long way to go yet. tenut..who knows that he knows not! fred veenschoten wrote: > > most all metalworking books I've seen have a good discussion of how metal is > removed complete with pictures and drawings of just how the wedge is lifted > off the work piece. > fred > > Glenn Lyford wrote in message <8ED467A36glyfordicinet@news.goodnet.com>... > >>Does anyone have any knowlege pertaining to this phenomenon? > > > >If you feel like a walk to the library, try: > > > >"Introduction to Manufacturing Processes, 2nd Ed.", by John A Schey, > >ISBN 0-07-055279-7 (chapter 8). > > > > --Glenn ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Armor-Piercing Arrowheads From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2000 03:55:43 GMT -------- Undoubtedly a "square hit" at 100 yards would punch through all but the thickest points of contempory armor. Know ing this, the armorourers went to great length to develop sloping, curved and fluted armour to help deflect the arrow point. The bodkin was case hardened so as to retain the tremendous core strength, required to resist the bending forces involved in penetrating after an off square hit. Armor became progressively thicker and the points progressively shoter and blunter as years went by. Eventually, some crossbow quarrel heads had a lfat or concave punch format. Any die maker will tell you, that a flat shaped punch penetrates far easier than a pointed one. teenut Lou Boyd wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > Not that these old archers were simply trained to shoot en mass at area targets > > either. When the range got down to 100 yards or less it was a foolish man that > > exposed an unarmoured armpit, or as one high ranking noble did..raised his visor > > for a breath of air. Within seconds, two or three shafts hit him full in his > > open mouth!! > > Are you saying that the armor of the day was fairly effective at > deflecting an iron arrow point from a 100 lb bow at 100 yards? I'm not > arguing, just curious. > Was it that the arrow no longer had the energy to penetrate or that the > curves and angle caused it to deflect to the side. Would a lucky > perpendicular hit still penetrate easily? Were the military arrow > points hardened and extremly sharp to allow them to "catch" on non > perpendicular hit? > -- > Lou Boyd ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Armor-Piercing Arrowheads From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2000 04:46:31 GMT -------- It has been demonstrated that the tension required across the back muscles is of the order of five times the bow weight. (Just as weights are best lifted with the thigh muscles, the big bow is drawn with the back muscles, NOT the arms. So, a "puny" 70# longbow such as my own, requires a pull across the back muscles of 350#!! Imagine the modern world record for the longbow is 200# on a yew bow built by Jerry Welch a couple of years ago. That bow is thicker at the nocks than mine is around the grip!! Gerry built this bow, which was subsequently offered for sale for $59,000.00 only about three years after he built mine!! He wasn't as famous then but still had a twelve month waiting list and prices that would bring tears to a glass eye!! Why didn't I make my own? Indeed I have made many composite and self bows in my time. Some quite good ones (and a lot of "Slugs") Well, until you see the pure magic of such a bow, with its rich bronze belly wood and creamy sapwood, with the form following the growth rings so precisely you woud imagine it simply grew into its present form. Heft it in your hand..light as a feather and perfectly balanced it draws as smooth as silk with a steady increase of draw weight throughout, with not a trace of stacking. At release the "Cast" is incredible! Faster and flatter than any other wood, it is easy to see why yew is so prized as the King of Bow Woods. Even with light target arrows, hand shock is totally absent and with its complete lack of vices it is an easy bow to shoot accurately. I was amazed when I eventually received my bow. Jerry and I had struck up quite a long distance correspondence during the waiting period. I had received much encouragement from him in my bowmaking and arrow making endevours. In the long package was my long awaited "Welchman" Longbow, signed and with my name and the draw weight and length inked on it. It came with a spare, hand made, flenish lay bowstring of finest Irish flax. In the package were two "common" yew billets "for practice" and a pair of the finest "sister" billets of Oreon Yew that I ever imagined existed! Those billets, even if they could be purchased now would command a price up to a couple of hundred dollars!! In the package was a long letter from Gerry, Thanking me for for my patience and pointing to the cause of the delay..In the package was ANOTHER gorgeous Welchman Longbow..with MY name on it!! Except that this one had been brutally smashed in two over Gerry's knee. He explained, that in the final tillering and testing it had, inexplicably, turned out to be a "Slug"..lacking the fabulous "cast" of a true thoroughbred. It had been dispatched without mercy and a new bow crafted for me!! Such is the stuff of legend!! A week later another package turned up...seven, (a baker's half dozen??) of magnificent, hand crafted battle shafts, horn knocked and grey goose fletched with red spiral binding to hold the feathers in place, even if the hide glue softened in the rain. Those shafts served as an inspiration to my own efforts, and after a year, I was able, not just to equal them..but to better them!! Gerry himself said so when I sent him a dozen of my own manufacture, spined for his own 65# hunting bow and tipped with medieval hunting broad heads of my own manufacture. Six months later a letter and a photo, attested to the fact that he had stocked their larder with a large black bear..taken with one of my shafts and points!! Such is the stuff of legend!! teenut Bob Unitt wrote: > > In article , Robert Bastow > <"teenut"@hotmail.com> writes > >There are a select few, practiced archers who can draw this > >weight effortlessly and the performance results, shooting the heavy, ash > >shafted, iron headed battleshafts is outstanding!! > > There's at least one archer in the UK regularly shooting a 140-pound yew > long-bow - I never managed to draw more than 70 myself. > > Ever had one break on you at full draw ? They always go into three > pieces - the middle stays in your hand, the top-end whacks down on your > head, and where the bottom-end whips up to I'll leave as an exercise for > the reader... > > -- > Bob Unitt (UK) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: "Warning" Witches Brew From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2000 05:08:20 GMT -------- Bruce Simpson wrote: > > > >WARNING 4: DO NOT IRON CLOTHES WHILE WEARING. > > Okay ... I'll confess... > Do I get some kind of award? Do the Pulitzer people have a Darwin category?? teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: EBay Tool Gloat From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2000 05:12:06 GMT -------- Robert Mitchell wrote: > > This is such a classic EBay find, I had to post this one. > > I just took delivery on a very nice Dumore Toolpost Grinder > (EBay 233020266) for $153. Older, but low usage. > > The seller did several things which kept the price low: > > 1) Listed it in the wrong category: Collectibles:Tools:General > Most people do not look in Collectibles for tools. > > 2) Incorrect description: "#11 Dumore Speedee Tool Sharpener w/Case". > Hard to tell this is really a toolpost grinder... Thank goodness for > pictures. > The description on included wheels is totally incorrect. Biggest is 2". > > 3) Seller feedback rating of zero. Well, you have to start somewhere. > Did make it more risky... > > Beating out one of our pros in the last seconds just made it better! > > - Robert Mitchell Don't imagine you got away scott free!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Armor-Piercing Arrowheads From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 10 Feb 2000 14:45:01 GMT -------- Dunno what kind of 30 caliber you have in mind Hoyt..maybe using soft points? With a solid core or AP bullet I wouldn't want to stand behind the door. The reference to the piercing abilities comes from an incident when IIRC Welsh bowmen fired at a retreating Englishman or Norman an several arrow heads were seen to pentrate the oak drawbridge and protrude from the other side. So far as range is concerned, the English practice sport was called "Clout Shooting"..the target being laid flat on the ground at long range...222 yds was considered the absolute minimum...for Juveniles and Old Men!. At Finsbury Shooting Grounds the farthest mark was at "Nineteen Score" or 380 yards! By the 17th Century these ranges had been reduced to 140 and 220 yards...remember it takes, if not a lifetime, a LONG time to develop the strength to pull the big bows of old..and people had quit doing that. Tests of the "Mary Rose" replicas have shown consistent ranges averaging 320 yards for the bodkin point and 350 yards for lighter type arrows. Remember, that these battleshafts are two to four times as heavy as a modern Port Orford Cedar shaft..ranging from 600 t0 950 grains..the penetration at long ranges is still formidable. BTW the world "flight bow" record now stands at over a thousand yards..albeit with VERY special equipment. Yes you CAN stop a razor edged broadhead with a folded towel..The principle of a lot of ancient (and modern) armour is to cushion and entangle the point.....But don't try it with a needle pointed Bodkin though..you would be skewered through and through! So far as the dummy at 200 yards is concerned..obviously not much of a bow, or a bowman! I can hit a man sized target, often enough at 200 yards, to make it a very dangerous place to be. If the stump I am shooting at, turns out to be less than rotten, I have to chop the arrow head out with an axe! teenut Hoyt McKagen wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > though it weren't there. To penetrate a 5" thick seasoned, oak drawbridge!! > > Nice try Robert, but a modern .30 caliber with ten times the muzzle > energy won't do that reliably, so why should we believe an arrow will? > > In fact, I can stop even a razor edged broadhead shot from full draw, > with a towel, and you probably know that trick too. > > I saw an interesting show BTW on the trebuchet, in which a demo was made > of the longbow, to show how trebuchet could stand off too far for > successful defending. The target was an armored dummy set about 200 yards > from the archer. Most of his arrows fell short. Then they demo'd the > shot from about ten yards, and sure enough the arrow did penetrate the > entire dummy and wound up hanging out the back side by the fletching. > Clearly this was a powerful bow, so I want to question your estimate of > 275 yards range too. > > Best wishes, > > Hoyt McKagen > > Belfab CNC - http://www.freeyellow.com/members/belfab/belfab.html > Best MC Repair - http://www.freeyellow.com/members/batwings/best.html > Camping/Caving - http://www.freeyellow.com/members/batwings/caving.html > No matter how many idiots there are, they're still only idiots ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Armor-Piercing Arrowheads From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 11 Feb 2000 12:08:44 GMT -------- I think the point is Gunner..The man professed to be a "Good Shot" To casually lob an arrow that distance into a target six inches wide would take an absof***inglutely INCREDIBLE Archer. The other guy probably went home, burned his bow, and took up needlepoint! teenut Gunner wrote: > > On Fri, 11 Feb 2000 04:56:29 GMT, ryanreid@sprintmail.com (Ryan C. Reid) wrote: > > >I'm not sure if its true, diluted fact or just urban legend .. but > > > >Howard Hill supposedly while filming the shots for the Robin Hood > >movies was approached by a "lay" archer who professed to be a good > >shot. Hill asked the man if he could see that telephone pole, as he > >pointed to a pole about 75 yds away. The man responded "yes, I think > >I could hit that." Hill drew an arrow and lobbed it into the top of > >the pole, turned and walked away... > > > >Ryan > > And?....... > --------------------------------------------------------- > > "A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an > invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write > a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort > the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, > solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program > a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die > gallantly. Specialization is for insects." Robert Heinlein > > Free Hobby Buy/Swap/Sell Website > www.cyberg8t.com/gunner/hsm/index.html > > Home Page > http://userzweb.lightspeed.net/gunner ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Armor-Piercing Arrowheads From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2000 03:29:29 GMT -------- Lou Boyd wrote: You got me there Lou..I know none of the details. Flight shooting is so specialised..and interests me not one bit so I simply haven't kept up with it. I would imagine that a search on "flight bow" will turn up a wealth of information. teenut > I'd be very interested in hearing a description of the equipment used > for either a 1000 yard or mile shot, especially information about the > arrow including it's weight distribution, shape, fletchings (if used at > all) and initial velocity. I haven't followed archery competition since > the 1960's, but the record was just over 900 yards then if I remember > correctly. > > -- > Lou Boyd ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Armor-Piercing Arrowheads From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2000 03:34:27 GMT -------- "Casually Lobbed" implies it was a snap shot..not a concentrated bearing down of concentration. Try a snap shot with your varmint rifle at a phone pole 75 yards away! teenut Gunner wrote: > > On Fri, 11 Feb 2000 12:08:44 GMT, Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > > >I think the point is Gunner..The man professed to be a "Good Shot" > > > >To casually lob an arrow that distance into a target six inches wide would take > >an absof***inglutely INCREDIBLE Archer. > > > >The other guy probably went home, burned his bow, and took up needlepoint! > > > >teenut > > Oh.. Ok. I was just wondering... I guess shooting at ground squirrels (like a prarie dog) out here > in the desert at various ranges jaded me a bit. I couldnt figure out what I was missing. > > Thanks for clearing that up. I couldnt figure if the gent had "clout" shot into the disk of the top > or just that big assed pole. > > Gunner > > > > >Gunner wrote: > >> > >> On Fri, 11 Feb 2000 04:56:29 GMT, ryanreid@sprintmail.com (Ryan C. Reid) wrote: > >> > >> >I'm not sure if its true, diluted fact or just urban legend .. but > >> > > >> >Howard Hill supposedly while filming the shots for the Robin Hood > >> >movies was approached by a "lay" archer who professed to be a good > >> >shot. Hill asked the man if he could see that telephone pole, as he > >> >pointed to a pole about 75 yds away. The man responded "yes, I think > >> >I could hit that." Hill drew an arrow and lobbed it into the top of > >> >the pole, turned and walked away... > >> > > >> >Ryan > >> > >> And?....... > >> --------------------------------------------------------- > >> > >> "A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an > >> invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write > >> a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort > >> the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, > >> solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program > >> a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die > >> gallantly. Specialization is for insects." Robert Heinlein > >> > >> Free Hobby Buy/Swap/Sell Website > >> www.cyberg8t.com/gunner/hsm/index.html > >> > >> Home Page > >> http://userzweb.lightspeed.net/gunner > > --------------------------------------------------------- > > "A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an > invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write > a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort > the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, > solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program > a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die > gallantly. Specialization is for insects." Robert Heinlein > > Free Hobby Buy/Swap/Sell Website > www.cyberg8t.com/gunner/hsm/index.html > > Home Page > http://userzweb.lightspeed.net/gunner ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Armor-Piercing Arrowheads From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2000 03:48:40 GMT -------- Mine is a precisely?? measured 17"..but I have a draw length of 29 1/2" to a jawbone anchor, on my 70# longbow. If your draw length is so short I suspect you are drawing with your arms ...rather than opening up your chest and using the power of your shoulder and back muscles. When I first started moving to bigger longbows, my draw was a skinny 26"..not far from average for a nose anchor. I now shoot entirely instinctively..the result I believe of being brought up in England..where boys learn to throw rocks and spears, and shoot sling shots and bows..rather than learning from an early age to squint down the barrel of a rifle. It is a good job I can..I am "left eyed" and shoot bows and shotguns right handed (AAA Skeet!!) teenut Charles Gallo wrote: > > On Fri, 11 Feb 2000 15:31:41 GMT, gunner@cyberg8t.com (Gunner) wrote: > > >hehe, sounds like we are built about the same > > My problem is that I have VERY short arms and legs. I've looked for a > bow around town, and I'd have to special order or by a woman's or > child's bow! I don't remember exactly what my draw length is, but we > have a local TARGET (as apposed to hunting) bow shop and range, and > the guy was surprised how short my draw was! (My forearm is 16" from > inside of the elbow to the tip of my middle finger) > > Charlie > > -- PGP Key on Request > For the Children RKBA! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Machinist Job Interview: Suggestions? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2000 03:54:28 GMT -------- The one with the biggest tits!! teenut Engineman1 wrote: > One thing I've always wondered about is if an employer has two job applicants > who come in at the same time and have virtually the same training, experience, > etc., how would he decide who to hire? > Engineman1 ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lamp Black From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2000 04:13:59 GMT -------- You make it yourself!! "Blacking" is the process of holding the object over the smoky flame of an oil lamp...to obtain a thin, even layer of oily soot I make my own by soldering a brass tube in the tin lid of a jam jar..to take a common lamp wick. Buy the cheapest lamp oil you can get..guaranteed to smoke! teenut Alfred Kimmel wrote: > > I am looking for a supplyer of small quanities of "Lamp Black" > to use as the same as pursan blue for metal scraping. > Al Kimmel ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Haas or Fadal? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 12 Feb 2000 16:23:31 GMT -------- I am going to buy a new 4 or 5 axis VMC. Anyone out there with direct experience of Hass or Fadal 20 x 16 x 20 machines, controls, options, reliability, accuracy, service etc? Thanks, teenut Robert Bastow Express Tool & Die Atlanta GA ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Strength of Threads Query From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 13 Feb 2000 04:07:44 GMT -------- Quite the contrary! A finer thread has a greater mechanical advantage than a coarse thread. It takes less force but greater lever/rotational MOVEMENT to move a given load. teenut Don Shenbarger wrote: > > The fine thread is stronger and less prone to vibration problems. It is also > less efficient - that is, it takes more torque to develope the same loading > forces or to lift something if used as jack-like mechanism. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Machinist Job Interview: Suggestions? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 13 Feb 2000 04:09:31 GMT -------- But of course! Is there any OTHER meaning? ;^) teenut mike II wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > The one with the biggest tits!! > > > > For those not 'in the know', TITS stands for Technical Institute > Training Surety. Mr. Bastow most likely assumed all the fine folk here > were aware of this certification standard. > > mike ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: New/old drill press questions From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 13 Feb 2000 04:32:08 GMT -------- Steel stamp "OIL DAILY" by the hole, and everyone will think it is meant to be there! teenut GaryH82012 wrote: Also, there is only one > damaged spot on the table, 3" off center, where someone drilled it. It's > bugging me a little and I was thinking of brazing to fill the hole, which > doesn't quite go all the way through the table. Any tips on doing this so I > don't risk warping the cast iron? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Machinist Job Interview: Suggestions? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 13 Feb 2000 20:44:27 GMT -------- All very interesting..but totally removed from hiring a Skilled MACHINIST!! I doubt you could find 400 to interview in that period!! ;^) teenut Rich Osman wrote: > > I've hired a little over a hundred engineers in the last four years. Doing > this has required 1500 phone screens and about 400 interviews. I've had > some practice. > > With rare exception, I phone screen everyone. This saves a lot of time for > me and the candidate. The gross mismatches and fantasy resumes are largely > weeded out. During the phone screen I try to determine why they are > looking. Before the screen I'll often research a company if I don't know > what they do or shat shape they are in. This is often helpful during the > screen and interview. I have had a few cases where the person I screen > sounded real good, and the interview was a bust. I'm convinced that I > screened a different person than I interviewed in at least four cases. > > I also try to give the candidate a little idea of the range of jobs and > initially broach the subject of pay, and their expectations. Given the > amount of hiring I've done, I have a pretty good view of the market. A lot > of candidates don't. I try and burst the bubbles of those that are > irrationally high, and use those that are too low as an indication of > possible mismatches. I say possible, because I've found a lot of very good, > > very poorly paid people. The good news in this is that they are often > poorly paid because they are very loyal employees and don't complain much. > > I pay competitive salaries, so I'm in pretty good shape. I suggest that you > > be careful to do the same. This isn't the same as average salaries. I try > to be at 110% to 120% of market average. I do this by trying to get > candidates that merit that amount through their personal productivity. > Money is rarely a motivation for more than the briefest period of time. The > > truth is that money is really either neutral or negative. You need a good > workplace, and positive challenges, and a little better than adequate wages > to keep good people. Basically, you need to pay well enough to keep the > focus off money. Pay competitively for the skills hire. Don't hire a > highly skilled person at a low salary because it's a deal. It's not, it's a > > trap. > > I find that the real trick in interviewing is to get candidates to talk > about actual situations from memory, rather than provide responses to > hypothetical ones. Answers to hypothetical questions usually move to what > you want to hear. You are likely to a more accurate picture of their > ability if they are talking about history and, possibly more important, > motivation and reaction to stress. I usually ask them to describe their > biggest technical challenge, best and worst working relationships (why they > are and how they handle them.) I'll often ask about "most challenging' > rather than worst. You get a pretty good idea of how a person views the > world. Challenges can be good or bad. I don not restrict answers to the > workplace. I hired a good supervisor with no supervisory experience on his > resume. His challenge was his Little League team. Organizing this sort of > thing so that all the kids have fun, and managing the parents is eerily like > > the workplace. His strategies were spot on. > > I also ask technical questions that I expect to be *beyond* their > expertise. This gets them to tell me all they know about a subject and lets > > me feed information to see how much they really understand, how they learn > and solve problems. This is particularly helpful with nervous candidates, > feeding them information usually serves as a trigger to discuss the > technology. Think of this type of question as measuring with a ruler that's > longer than the item to get measured. Many current interview techniques are > > the equivalent of using a six inch ruler to measure a 10 foot dimension. I > really dislike written tests. It seems like I get either 0 or 100 percent > and little in between. I can usually find out more in 15 seconds of > conversation that the test shows in an hour. I am dealing with a very wide > range in candidate ability and focus. Tests are good for scoring minimum > skills and over a limited range. I usually prompt the interviewee that I'm > going to ask questions, and I'm no too worried that they have the specific > expertise, but rather I want to see how they think and learn. I make sure > they know that the questions I ask are intended to be a real stretch. > Without this prompting you can really shut a candidate down > > A lot of people get interview stage fright. This type of questioning gets > them on familiar and friendlier ground. It also cuts through all but the > most skilled BS artist. Those folks have little fantasies that have been > honed to closely match reality. They will occasionally be believable, but > I've seen two of these in 400 interviews. > > The only other advice I will offer, is write a job description and be > brutally realistic. Too many job descriptions are wish lists or pure > fantasy. Stay away from 'years of experience' and stick to tasks to be > accomplished. I have a few engineers that work for me that have 20 years of > experience, and it is the same year 20 times. I also have some gifted young > > guys with less than a year out of school that are more valuable than sold > performers with more than five years. Make a two column list with must > haves and nice to haves. Look for transferable skills. I've hired a number > > of engineers with power supply background to do synthesizer work. The > control loops that form the core of these are similar enough where the > learning curve is low. Most skilled people need to have new challenges. > It's a rare job that benefits from someone who has no desire for new > challenges. > > I hope this helps. > > David Munro wrote: > > > After about a year of being completely overwhelmed in my one man shop > > (Clock part fabrication and repair) I have advertised for a machinist in > > the local paper, and lo and behold, some people have contacted me for > > interviews. Are there any job interview suggestions from either side of > > the desk? > > > > David M. Munro > > -- > mailto:Rich@Osman.com http://www.rich.osman.com > Rich Osman; POB 93167; > Southlake, TX 76092 (Near DFW Airport) ARS: WB0HUQ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: this question is a ten-pointer so pay attention From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 13 Feb 2000 20:47:23 GMT -------- We may have an appearance of utter chaos in my shop frequently..but not much chatter. The guys are too busy cutting metal! teenut Hoyt McKagen wrote: > > When I run my machines sometimes I have experience that is familiar to > us all: chatter. STM this is more likely when cut is light. I've had it > be problem in some cases during final lighter cuts. A given remedy is to > ncrease feed rate, which increases cutting load. But sometimes it also > happens with heavy indeed very heavy cuts. So chatter isn't directly > driven by the force itself, other things interact with that. So what > causes chatter? Consider this as it applies to tool and machine condition > and materials being cut. Use lathe turning as conceptual example but be > sure any postulated model applies to all types of cutting. Discuss this > in terms of chaos theory, specifically as that applies to organization of > behavior from interactions of numbers of small coupled dynamic systems. > Give examples of some of these systems in metal cutting machines. > > Best wishes, > > Hoyt McKagen > > Belfab CNC - http://www.freeyellow.com/members/belfab/belfab.html > Best MC Repair - http://www.freeyellow.com/members/batwings/best.html > Camping/Caving - http://www.freeyellow.com/members/batwings/caving.html > No matter how many idiots there are, they're still only idiots ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Need Gear Virtuoso From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 14 Feb 2000 03:20:19 GMT -------- I can do that! teenut Donald Warner wrote: > > Just read an article in EDM mag where they are wire cutting gears one off > with no tooling. > > Marv Soloff wrote in message > news:38A6D3A5.46D@worldnet.att.net... > > Fred Smith wrote: > > > > > > On Sat, 12 Feb 2000 20:36:55 GMT, Marv Soloff > > > wrote: > > > > > > >Russ Kepler wrote: > > > >> > > > >> In article <38A4D4B7.1BD7@worldnet.att.net>, > > > >> Marv Soloff wrote: > > > >> >Somewhere, out here on this NG is a Gear Maven, Wizard, Virtuoso, > who > > > >> >by sheer brilliance, fortitude, skill and cunning can build this > gear > > > >> >for me at a price that doesn't end with three zeros. If you have > the > > > >> >ability, or know of such a person, please contact me. I pay cash. > > > > > > I contacted one of my buddies in the business, and he asked me to make > > > the following reply: > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > Assuming these are straight tooth bevels, not spirals : > > > > > > This is what I do for a living, but I'm not interested. For > > > information only the process is this : from a print do all the > > > calculations for machine settings and tooth measurements. Usually > > > this takes about two hours. Go check to see if you have usable > > > cutters - new sets (you need both rough cutters and finish > > > cutters, new price is $600 each type. I have a huge selection > > > bought at auctions, but if you don't have what you need, it's > > > either $1200 or rent them from Ash Gear for ~ $250.) Check the > > > blanks - > > > usually if a non-gear person has made them they will be wrong. > > > Certain apparently unimportant features have to be done correctly > > > to hold and measure bevel gears. Look around for some kind of > > > fixture that you can modify to hold the blanks and modify it to > > > suit. Set up the machine for roughing - about four hours if you > > > have to make a lot of changes, two or so if the last job was very > > > similar. Rough the first part and and double-check it, 1 hour. > > > Second part and after, about thirty seconds per tooth (just as an > > > average for smallish parts - obviously there's a lot of variation > > > between 2 DP and 20 DP.) Finish roughing all your blanks, change > > > the machine over to finishing. 2 to 4 hours for this, depending on > > > whether your machine uses double-cut, crowning, etc etc. Finish > > > cut the first part, check for size and adjust, recut. Voila, a > > > finished part. If these are miter gears the mate will probably > > > only take a little extra time - bore sizes are seldom the same so > > > all you have to do is change fixtures, or use bushings / whatever > > > to go from pinion to gear. And change the head setting distance, > > > cutter block position, etc, of course . . If they are not miters, > > > the setup operations all get done twice. > > > > > > the methods shown in Colvin and Stanley for milling teeth with > > > involute cutters have been archaic for fifty years - for a home > > > project in a low-stress application they'd probably work fine, > > > but no gear shop in its right mind would make gears that way. What > > > I see other shops charge for onesy-twosies like this is in the > > > area of $900. I get about $5,000 for a set of spiral bevels, > > > though most people opt to get three sets or so at just a little > > > more. Setup is very time-consuming. I would recommend that someone > > > with time on their hands who needs a set of these make several > > > sets and recoup the costs by selling them in the newsgroup or > > > something. They won't be great, but they should work okay. You > > > shouldn't feel that people with hundreds of thousands of dollars > > > in gear machinery and cutting & measuring tools can afford to do > > > this kind of work for the prices you'd like to see. Or, if you > > > really "pay cash" in the amount that it honestly takes, c'mon by. > > > > > > Or move to China or India where the landlords and insurance > > > companies of the world haven't yet made it impossible to do real > > > work at a reasonable cost. India is particularly strong in bevel > > > gears. > > > > > > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > > > > > > I posted it unedited, so as not to mangle the flavor ;-) > > > Best Regards, > > > > > > Fred Smith > > > IMService > > > > > > imserv@imsrv.com > > > > > > Voice: 248-486-3600 or 800-386-1670 > > > Fax: 248-486-3698 > > > > Fred: > > > > I appreciate your friend's candor. Unfortunately, I can't get to India > > this month (pressures of business), so I'll have to keep looking. > > The bevel is straight and the real problem is that it is cut to a 14- > > 1/2 degree pressure angle. I can buy 20 degree pressure angle mitre > > gears of the needed size off the shelf locally, but that doesn't help > > either. The search goes on. > > > > Thanks and > > > > Regards, > > > > Marv ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Need Gear Virtuoso From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 14 Feb 2000 03:22:41 GMT -------- How the hell do you figure that ridiculous figure out Erich? I figure my edm shop time at half that..after all, once set up..it doesn't need an operator! teenut Kathy and Erich Coiner wrote: > > Lets see, shop rate on a wire EDM machine is what $125 or 150 per hour. > It'll take 2 or 3 hours to burn that gear. > I'll leave the math as an exercise for the reader. > > Erich > > Donald Warner wrote in message <38a72aa0@news.cft.net>... > >Just read an article in EDM mag where they are wire cutting gears one off > >with no tooling. > > > >Marv Soloff wrote in message > >news:38A6D3A5.46D@worldnet.att.net... > >> Fred Smith wrote: > >> > > >> > On Sat, 12 Feb 2000 20:36:55 GMT, Marv Soloff > >> > wrote: > >> > > >> > >Russ Kepler wrote: > >> > >> > >> > >> In article <38A4D4B7.1BD7@worldnet.att.net>, > >> > >> Marv Soloff wrote: > >> > >> >Somewhere, out here on this NG is a Gear Maven, Wizard, Virtuoso, > >who > >> > >> >by sheer brilliance, fortitude, skill and cunning can build this > >gear > >> > >> >for me at a price that doesn't end with three zeros. If you have > >the > >> > >> >ability, or know of such a person, please contact me. I pay cash. > >> > > >> > I contacted one of my buddies in the business, and he asked me to make > >> > the following reply: > >> > > >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >> > > >> > Assuming these are straight tooth bevels, not spirals : > >> > > >> > This is what I do for a living, but I'm not interested. For > >> > information only the process is this : from a print do all the > >> > calculations for machine settings and tooth measurements. Usually > >> > this takes about two hours. Go check to see if you have usable > >> > cutters - new sets (you need both rough cutters and finish > >> > cutters, new price is $600 each type. I have a huge selection > >> > bought at auctions, but if you don't have what you need, it's > >> > either $1200 or rent them from Ash Gear for ~ $250.) Check the > >> > blanks - > >> > usually if a non-gear person has made them they will be wrong. > >> > Certain apparently unimportant features have to be done correctly > >> > to hold and measure bevel gears. Look around for some kind of > >> > fixture that you can modify to hold the blanks and modify it to > >> > suit. Set up the machine for roughing - about four hours if you > >> > have to make a lot of changes, two or so if the last job was very > >> > similar. Rough the first part and and double-check it, 1 hour. > >> > Second part and after, about thirty seconds per tooth (just as an > >> > average for smallish parts - obviously there's a lot of variation > >> > between 2 DP and 20 DP.) Finish roughing all your blanks, change > >> > the machine over to finishing. 2 to 4 hours for this, depending on > >> > whether your machine uses double-cut, crowning, etc etc. Finish > >> > cut the first part, check for size and adjust, recut. Voila, a > >> > finished part. If these are miter gears the mate will probably > >> > only take a little extra time - bore sizes are seldom the same so > >> > all you have to do is change fixtures, or use bushings / whatever > >> > to go from pinion to gear. And change the head setting distance, > >> > cutter block position, etc, of course . . If they are not miters, > >> > the setup operations all get done twice. > >> > > >> > the methods shown in Colvin and Stanley for milling teeth with > >> > involute cutters have been archaic for fifty years - for a home > >> > project in a low-stress application they'd probably work fine, > >> > but no gear shop in its right mind would make gears that way. What > >> > I see other shops charge for onesy-twosies like this is in the > >> > area of $900. I get about $5,000 for a set of spiral bevels, > >> > though most people opt to get three sets or so at just a little > >> > more. Setup is very time-consuming. I would recommend that someone > >> > with time on their hands who needs a set of these make several > >> > sets and recoup the costs by selling them in the newsgroup or > >> > something. They won't be great, but they should work okay. You > >> > shouldn't feel that people with hundreds of thousands of dollars > >> > in gear machinery and cutting & measuring tools can afford to do > >> > this kind of work for the prices you'd like to see. Or, if you > >> > really "pay cash" in the amount that it honestly takes, c'mon by. > >> > > >> > Or move to China or India where the landlords and insurance > >> > companies of the world haven't yet made it impossible to do real > >> > work at a reasonable cost. India is particularly strong in bevel > >> > gears. > >> > > >> > >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> > >> > > >> > I posted it unedited, so as not to mangle the flavor ;-) > >> > Best Regards, > >> > > >> > Fred Smith > >> > IMService > >> > > >> > imserv@imsrv.com > >> > > >> > Voice: 248-486-3600 or 800-386-1670 > >> > Fax: 248-486-3698 > >> > >> Fred: > >> > >> I appreciate your friend's candor. Unfortunately, I can't get to India > >> this month (pressures of business), so I'll have to keep looking. > >> The bevel is straight and the real problem is that it is cut to a 14- > >> 1/2 degree pressure angle. I can buy 20 degree pressure angle mitre > >> gears of the needed size off the shelf locally, but that doesn't help > >> either. The search goes on. > >> > >> Thanks and > >> > >> Regards, > >> > >> Marv > > > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: New/old drill press questions From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 14 Feb 2000 03:26:54 GMT -------- A simple drilled hole in a table is best answered with a simple tapered plug of similar material. Pound it in, file it flat and stone to match the finish and I'll bet even you forget where it was within a week! teenut GaryH82012 wrote: > > > > >My opinion; great idea to use JB Weld to fill the hole in the table > > I ordered some Devcon epoxy filler from McMaster-Carr. Sounds like a good idea, > thanks. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Smithy 9001 certified From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 14 Feb 2000 03:32:39 GMT -------- "F. George McDuffee" wrote: > I have just completed a dissertation (for my doctoral degree) > which closely examined this. > If Education is the answer, what was the question? Certainly not this one! ;^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: R8 drawbar screw From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 14 Feb 2000 07:46:40 GMT -------- Shame on you Russ!! We expect this from Newbies and Tyros..but YOU!! We all know you could have MADE one in about the time it took to type your post. ;^) teenut Russ Kepler wrote: > > I'm looking for the 'drawbar' used in a right-angle adaptor that > mounts on a Bridgeport type vertical mill. This isn't the extended > drawbar used to pull the R8 in the adaptor into the spindle, but the > socket head cap screw like guy that draws the collet into the > adaptor. > > An alternative is to find a source for a SHCS with 7/16-20 thread. > Right. > > I'll likely call Dorian in the morning - they make the adaptor but > don't list this part on their web site. Likely it'll list as a > 'repair' part. > > Damn, I just *know* there's at least *one* in the shop, but I cleaned > the whole place and still it's hiding... > > -- > Russ Kepler russ@kepler-eng.com > > Please Don't Feed the Engineers ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: R8 drawbar screw From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 14 Feb 2000 07:48:53 GMT -------- While you are at it..make me one please. I have lost mine too!! ;^) Cordially, as always, teenut Robert Bastow wrote: > > Shame on you Russ!! > > We expect this from Newbies and Tyros..but YOU!! > > We all know you could have MADE one in about the time it took to type your post. > > ;^) > > teenut > > Russ Kepler wrote: > > > > I'm looking for the 'drawbar' used in a right-angle adaptor that > > mounts on a Bridgeport type vertical mill. This isn't the extended > > drawbar used to pull the R8 in the adaptor into the spindle, but the > > socket head cap screw like guy that draws the collet into the > > adaptor. > > > > An alternative is to find a source for a SHCS with 7/16-20 thread. > > Right. > > > > I'll likely call Dorian in the morning - they make the adaptor but > > don't list this part on their web site. Likely it'll list as a > > 'repair' part. > > > > Damn, I just *know* there's at least *one* in the shop, but I cleaned > > the whole place and still it's hiding... > > > > -- > > Russ Kepler russ@kepler-eng.com > > > > Please Don't Feed the Engineers ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Need Gear Virtuoso From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 14 Feb 2000 13:54:44 GMT -------- That was my thought too Steve. My old Mitsubishi is dead accurate, but will only cut to 5 Deg. More modern machines will go to far more than this..but not far enough to cut most shallow angled bevel gears I think. In my case I could program and cut the profile required, including the convergent angles in the tooth..but I would have to mount the blank on an indexing device and manually index between teeth. I am not sure I have ever heard of a three axis wire EDM..but there is no reason why not. teenut Steve Austin wrote: > > Donald Warner wrote in article > <38a72aa0@news.cft.net>... > > Just read an article in EDM mag where they are wire cutting gears one off > > with no tooling. > > We cut a lot of gear forms on wire EDM to use as electrodes on the rams. > The trouble with bevel gears is the extreme angle of the wire. The only > bevel gear form I tried to get on the wire machine wouldn't go because of > the angle limits of the top head. > > Steve A. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Advice on drilling HSS or Carbon Chrome Alloy Steel From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 14 Feb 2000 14:00:23 GMT -------- Carbon alloy, chrome alloy and HSS can be drilled with solid carbide bits..but you need a pretty solid drill presss to do it. Otherwise you will need to anneal and re-heat treat..which is pretty difficult to do at home on Cro-Mo and damned near impossible on HSS. This might be worth a visit to your local Tool & Die shop! teenut gvbale@yahoo.com wrote: > > Can HSS or Carbon Chrome Alloy Steel be drilled normally or does it > need softening, drilling then re hardening. Any Advice please, or hints > and guidance. The chrome steel is 'oil hardening', what does this mean, > and can I do it at home???? > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: New/old drill press questions From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2000 03:28:13 GMT -------- Sure you can..but I just told you the BEST way to do it. But feel free to please yourself! teenut Bruce Simpson wrote: > > On Mon, 14 Feb 2000 03:26:54 GMT, Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ > hotmail.com> wrote: > > >A simple drilled hole in a table is best answered with a simple tapered plug of > >similar material. > > > >Pound it in, file it flat and stone to match the finish and I'll bet even you > >forget where it was within a week! > > Can't you just mill it flat? :-) > > --------------------------------- > Don't send email to me, send a Memo.to me > http://memo.to/BruceSimpson > Memo.to, your email firewall, stops junk email dead! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: AAAAarrrrgh! Major pinkie damage. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2000 03:50:12 GMT -------- PLEASE!!! Don't remind me..It is almost thirty-five years ago, and the memory was starting to dull a little! teenut tony wrote: > > I bet that didn't hurt as much as getting hit in the groin by the knee > elevation handle set to rapid traverse on my KempSmith Maximiller. 7.5 > horsepower all concentrated in one spot. I thought I was a goner. > > -- > Check out my website at www.csgnet.net/toolroom/ > for surplus stuff I'm trying to get rid of > and my Precision Scraping Page > Mike Graham wrote in message > news:slrn8agmjt.m3.mikegraham@localhost.localdomain... > > So I was showing off my Bridgeport to my sister's boyfriend who works > > acrylic for a living. Showing him the benefits of a mill over an overhead > > router. Anyway, I wanted to take the drill chuck out of it. Loosened the > > drawbar, and gave it a smack with the rubber hammer, but the chuck was > kind > > of seized in there (it's been a few months (sorry) since I've used it). > > Anyway, I didn't want to be futzing around with and audience so I heaved > > downwards on the chuck. > > Yeah, you all know what happened. The chuck came hurtling down into the > > vise. Luckily (?) I had my pinkie finger curled under the snout of the > > chuck, so while I saved the SuperChuck from some abuse, I caused some > > heinous maiming to my pinkie finger. It got hit so hard that it didn't > even > > start bleeding for almost five minutes, but then boy howdy did it bleed! > > Didn't break it, though. > > > > In the interest of presenting a moral to the story, don't cut corners > just > > because you have an audience. > > > > -- > > -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- > > Mike Graham | Metalworker by trade > > mikegraham at sprint dot ca | Weld to live, like to weld. > > Caledon, Ontario, Canada | Weird by nature > > > > remove reversed 'nospam' to reply > > -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- > > "By Fire and Iron doth he make Bread." ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Scored an nice one! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 15 Feb 2000 14:15:47 GMT -------- I was surprised and delighted to see I was the high (ONLY!!) Bidder on a rather nice DoAll Heavy Drill Press, on Ebay. http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=259085536 Now to ship it from AZ to Atlanta GA! Any Bright Ideas? teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: New/old drill press questions From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2000 01:26:18 GMT -------- Pounding is a relative term Gary...How about "Firmly tapping in a tapered plug" You are unlikely to crack a cast iron table with a cast iron plug..CI is brittle..but it is also very soft. For perfect results, ream out the offending hole, make your plug a couple of thou bigger than nominal size, taper the end to get it started and tap it firmly into place. Finish to match the table. NOW stamp OIL alog side it and watch people REALLY scratch their heads!! teenut GaryH82012 wrote: > > > > >> >Pound it in, file it flat and stone to match the finish and I'll bet even > >you > >> >forget where it was within a week! > > I filled the hole with Devcon epoxy. I liked your idea, but the part about > pounding in a tapered plug made me nervous. The table is only about 3/8 thick > at that point and possibly brittle enough to crack or break out a piece. I'd > like to experiment first with a scrap piece of cast iron. > > Gary ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: AAAAarrrrgh! Major pinkie damage. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2000 01:39:24 GMT -------- When a flying handle hits you in the nuts it isn't a question of how long before you get up off the floor...Rather, how long before you come down from the roof!! teenut Peter Drumm wrote: > > In message - "tony" > writes: > :-> > :->I bet that didn't hurt as much as getting hit in the groin by the knee > :->elevation handle set to rapid traverse on my KempSmith Maximiller. 7.5 > :->horsepower all concentrated in one spot. I thought I was a goner. > :-> > > OWW OWWEE OUCH!!! How long did it take before you got up off the > floor? > > Custom machining; Tool & Cutter grinding, prices at > > Peter Drumm, Wausau WI > , > Dual Celeron 466's, Abit BP6, Matrox AGP, OS/2 Warp 4, Linux, BeOS ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Harbor Freight Mailing Address? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2000 01:43:22 GMT -------- That is a solution I often used when I lived in Canada. I had friends in Buffal area, so I would pick up stuff from there and drive it back across the bridge. Even if I had to pay duty..I certainly avoided Brokerage Fees. teenut Marshall Pharoah wrote: > > Here's another option for you. You're in Ottawa, right? > I work in Ogdensburg, which is due south from Ottawa right on the St. Lawrence river. > If you want, you can have it delivered to me, then drive down and pick it up. > It's about a 60 mile drive from Ottawa, plus you have bridge fare, but it's an option. > > Marshall > > Larry Phillips wrote in message news:38A8FDB8.A94F14BB@home.com... > > [©ØMMÄÑУ®] wrote: > > > > > > BTW, other than the price of the item (an Argon regulator) and shipping, are > > > there any other costs I should add? Thanks. > > > > If the item is manufactured in Canada or the US, you can expect to pay > > only GST (and perhaps PST, if you live in a province that asks the > > customs folks to collect it). If it is manufactured outside the US or > > Canada, there may be duty payable as well. > > > > Avoid UPS like the plague. They will attempt to charge you about $35 for > > customs brokerage. You can avoid this charge by refusing the brokered > > shipment and clearing it yourself. Clearing it yourself means a trip to > > the airport, where you will have the dubious pleasure of interacting > > with the customs folks. > > > > If they will ship via USPS, it's probably the best way. Your 'brokerage > > fee' will only be $5.00 > > > > Good luck. > > > > -- > > Hukt on fonix werkt fer me! > > > > http://cr347197-a.surrey1.bc.wave.home.com/larry/ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Scored an nice one! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2000 01:57:49 GMT -------- Rats!! I was just informed that the auction was ended early because the drill in question was damaged during a move from storage!! Or is this another variation on a shill bid?? teenut Robert Bastow wrote: > > I was surprised and delighted to see I was the high (ONLY!!) Bidder on a rather > nice DoAll Heavy Drill Press, on Ebay. > > http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=259085536 > > Now to ship it from AZ to Atlanta GA! > > Any Bright Ideas? > > teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Blunder in Education System? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2000 02:29:05 GMT -------- Frankly, having met quite a few Home School Parents in my time, I found the majority to be wierd folks, with wierd ideas, and even wierder kids! teenut Mark wrote: > > Fitch... I have had (and have) employees that are home schooled.... the best > that can be said about them is that usually they are better behaved than > their public school brethren..... usually enthusiastic and hard working. > But as you say, the technical training is just not there. It is sad when > one of these young men announces that they're going to be a "computer > programmer" and you know that they will probably never rise above the paid > labor level. > > Fitch R. Williams wrote in message ... > > >Near as I could tell, neither had a college education, neither was > particularity > >verbal, in fact it was scary to talk to them and realize just exactly how > >ignorant they were about everything but their own opinions. They had > >their opinions down pat, but their explanation of that rocket on this > >"school field trip" was so full of BS it was astonishing. They didn't know > >anything to teach but their opinions! > > > >I have to doubt the rest of that kids educational experience is going to be > >any better. Good luck getting into college. > > > >There are folks who are doing a good job of home schooling, and taking care > >of the social aspects through soccer, basketball, dance classes, etc. And > >I hope for their kids sake it works out. But I think they are the minority > >of home schooling situations. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: MD-80 From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2000 04:15:43 GMT -------- If I remember vaguely..... Murphy was assigned to investigate the crash of a recently designed, WWII bomber which crashed shortly after take off, with a full fuel load. Initial investigations pointed to fuel starvation, and it was eventually discovered that an inline fuel check valve or similar, had been re-installed the wrong way round, after a routine service. This was possible because the threads on each end were identical. His discovery and report lead to the adoption of dissimilar threads at each end of components of that nature and his report, recommending such a change, read, in effect.. 1) If anything CAN go wrong..It WILL! 2) It will always happen at the worst possible time and place. This passed into history as "Murphy's First and Second Laws" Since then, many variations have been added and "Murphy" has come to be looked upon as the root cause of all mischief..whereas he was in fact a great contributor to the cause of safety and reliability. "Murphy loves a challenge" (teenut's Law) "Just wait 'til Murphy gets bored" (teenut's Law) Ron Bean wrote: > BTW Murphy wasn't an optimist, he was an engineer (apparently > some time around WWII-- unfortunately I've lost the reference > for this). His "law" was not a joke, it was a design tool. > In effect, he was saying "If it's possible for something to go > wrong, you'd better have a plan for dealing with it when it does". > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Scored an nice one! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2000 04:24:02 GMT -------- I might ask you to mosey on down to check out if it really HAS been damaged...My nose is twitching a bit and it isn't often wrong! I have emailed asking for a picture of the damage and requesting that a "local, Machinist Friend" be allowed to inspect it with a view to taking it "as is" or making a reduced offer!! Open Copy to Ebay!! teenut Joel Corwith wrote: > > Teenut, I'll help you out. Send me the check and I'll go and pick it up > since it's in town. > > Joel. phx > > I'll let you visit it anytime! ;) > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> > wrote in message ... > >I was surprised and delighted to see I was the high (ONLY!!) Bidder on a > rather > >nice DoAll Heavy Drill Press, on Ebay. > >http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=259085536 > >Now to ship it from AZ to Atlanta GA! > >Any Bright Ideas? > >teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Wind Chimes From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2000 04:34:07 GMT -------- From vague memory of Metrology classes, this is the same two points at which a length standard should be suspended, in order that the two end faces should "sag" into as near a parallel alignment to each other as possible. It is also common to see mounting pads machined at similar positions on the backs of extra large, precision, straight edges. There is a name for it.."XXXXX's points"...or somesuch, that now totally evades my memory. teenut (CRS) > > "Ted Edwards" wrote in message > > wife. One reference stated that the support should be 22.42% of the > > length from the end. It is clear that the support should be at a node ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Blunder in Education System? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2000 11:46:20 GMT -------- Bravo! Bravo! Well said young man! teenut Rex wrote: > > The following is what happens when you let your son read RCM over your > shoulder: > > I am currently a junior at Wilson High School, and, reading your > opinions on public education, I felt I should set a few things > straight. As for my authority, I am a high school student, and I know > a number of home schooled students. I am also a Life rank in the BSA, > three years running on the science bowl team, two years judging the > elementary level science bowl, two years in football, an Honors > student, a track athlete, a participant in our last school play, and a > judge for Destination Imagination. It also seems valid to note that > these are all programs I was introduced to through the school system, > and I have come away from each and every one of them with valuable > "life" skills. > > To be honest, there is no science fact or grammar rule, no history or > math principle, that I could not have learned by just reading some > book somewhere. This doesn't mean I would trade in my school education > for an encyclopedia or the most intelligent parents in the world. > Books don't talk back, and parents quite frankly usually have a total > of one opinion each, sometimes not even that much (sorry dad). This is > not because parents are bad; it is because they are individuals. This > is as it should be. > > Looking at your list of things you taught your children at home > school, I realized I had learned all of these things quite > sufficiently despite my public education. In truth, I knew a great > many of those things before I could read or write. Somehow, despite > the fact that I had already learned everything I would ever need to > know by the end of elementary school, my parents thought I should > continue my education. In fact, so did I. > > It was a good thing I did. The law of cosines may not seem like much, > but the "fun" math (ratios in art, nature, three dimensional polygons > and the basis for understanding the building blocks of the universe), > and ambulance stories (did you know that drunks are less likely to die > in an accident that the people they hit, because drunks don't tense up > first?), that I learned in seventh grade; the concept of "TANSTAFL" > (There Ain't No Such Thing As a Free Lunch) that I learned in eighth > grade science, the ability to carry out a controlled experiment and > get reliable data, as well as a nearly professional level lab report, > which I have done every year in science, advanced writing principles, > economic factors (like the fact that specialization always increases > output) and countless other concepts would never have come home to me > if it were not for school. > > As for public education, I am currently college bound out of a PUBLIC > school that has high AP scores, a great computer science program, > overall very high SATscores and many AP (Advanced Placement, college > credit in high school) programs. We also have a freshman who scored > 1600 on the SAT's with public education, four graduating > valedictorians last year (out of a school that has name recognition > for hard grading), high state soccer and basketball championship > placement, three science bowl teams, and too many other more minor > individual achievements to list. And though I would never say that > these are the only important things to life, they seem more important > than knowing how to replace a shower head (did I mention I learned to > weld in school? We have TIG, stick and gas, and full metal and wood > shop set-ups). > > But more than any of these things, there is one thing I have learned > from public schools that I could have learned no where else. I have > learned to have friends of all kinds. I have friends from the drama > department, black friends, Jewish friends, Asian friends, Arabic > friends, friends from shop, nerd friends, female friends, male > friends, Russian friends, band and choir friends, sports friends, > valedictorian friends, and more. There is just no way to meet all > those people through home school. I would also say that most of the > home schooling I know of is concentrated on personal views and not > societal integration (sorry to those of you who put the effort into > getting your children into social programs) > > Not to say home school has no merits. Nor would I EVER advocate > parents laying the only responsibility to teach on the schools. Home > school does have merits, but there is a reason this country is > internationally renowned for it's education system, and I think its > public schools are a valuable and important resource. > > Columbine was not only unexpected, it was a literally one in a million > (or more) case, not a general example > > Finally, for those of you who were so quick to condemn the school > system, please think twice next time. For those of you who supported > it and defended your beliefs, but did not seek to criticize, thank > you. > Charles > > And gentlemen, that is the opinion my son brings to this discussion. > I would love to brag and quote the lab report he wrote last night on > Reaction Kinetics of the Esterification and De-esterification of > Methyl and Ethyl Benzoic Esters using nuclear magnetic resonance > analysis (from a local college NMR lab), but I'll spare you..... > > I'm really proud of this kid, and he is certainly getting a better > education than I did. ALL education; public, private and home can be > improved, but there is some fantastic teaching going on that we should > be congratulating people on, not criticizing. Let's hear a round of > applause for the teachers!! > > Rex Bosse ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Blunder in Education System? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2000 12:09:16 GMT -------- This isn't the forum to continue this tirade against the Public School System..but I have to say Gunner, that for once I TOTALLY disagree with you! Bad public schools exist certainly, but the vast majority are doing a wonderful job considering the constant battle they have against parsimonious Taxpayers, self seeking Politicians, uncaring Parents, draconian anti-discipline laws, litiginous Parents, wacky Liberals, selfish Conservatives, hysterical Media, oversized Classes, censored textbooks, politically correct Curriculla, hidden Agendas, etcerea., ad nauseum!! How do I know? My wife is a dedicated Middle School Principal who works a regular 12 hour day fighting that battle! Sure, the Public School System is "bent"..but the answwer is not to break it but to fix it! To join the battle not to run away and hide, to become part of the solution, not part of the problem. Remember, like their Governments, people get the kind of School System they deserve! So quit whining and ask yourself whether you want your children to grow up as well rounded members of a healthy society..or part of an anally retentive, self centered, elite, whose only future is to withdraw even further into their increeasingly shrinking and embittered enclaves! Rant mode off! teenut Gunner wrote: > > On Tue, 15 Feb 2000 20:08:55 -0800, "Gary Hallenbeck" wrote: > > > I believe in a free and equal > >education as a right in this country. Instead of talking about schools like > >they are an alien nation we need to identify the problems and address them. > >The alternative is to disenfranchise the public school system and establish > >an educational class system. If you can afford to get a private education > >you get an education, if not ,you don't. > >Gary Hallenbeck > > Well, as long as we have a public education system top heavy with administrators, little or no > standards for teachers competency, self esteme over the 3 rs, we can do 1 of three things: > > 1. Home school (mixed bag at worst) but still preferable to the "average public school" > 2. Voucher system (my personal favorite) and the competition will breed excellence > 3. Continue to assembly line a group of utter social and educational morons through what is arguably > a dumbed down educational system, and graduate children whom can't function in todays world. > > We have been throwing an ever increasing amount of money at the present educational system, and it > is getting progressively worse and worse. A public school is an expensive hole we throw our kids > into. > > Gunner > > --------------------------------------------------------- > > "A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an > invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write > a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort > the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, > solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program > a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die > gallantly. Specialization is for insects." Robert Heinlein > > Free Hobby Buy/Swap/Sell Website > www.cyberg8t.com/gunner/hsm/index.html > > Home Page > http://userzweb.lightspeed.net/gunner ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Scored an nice one! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 16 Feb 2000 12:11:50 GMT -------- From the seller!! Nothing from Ebay!! Hmm! teenut DRC wrote: > > Robert, > > Looks to me like the auction closed normally, according to the URL you > posted. I took a look and nothing seemed amiss on the page. Did you get > a notice from eBay on the auction closing early or from the seller??? > > David > > > > > I might ask you to mosey on down to check out if it really HAS been damaged...My > > nose is twitching a bit and it isn't often wrong! > > > > I have emailed asking for a picture of the damage and requesting that a "local, > > Machinist Friend" be allowed to inspect it with a view to taking it "as is" or > > making a reduced offer!! > > > > Open Copy to Ebay!! > > > > teenut > > > > Joel Corwith wrote: > > > > > > Teenut, I'll help you out. Send me the check and I'll go and pick it up > > > since it's in town. > > > > > > Joel. phx > > > > > > I'll let you visit it anytime! ;) > > > > > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> > wrote in message ... > > > >I was surprised and delighted to see I was the high (ONLY!!) Bidder on a > > > rather > > > >nice DoAll Heavy Drill Press, on Ebay. > > > >http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=259085536 > > > >Now to ship it from AZ to Atlanta GA! > > > >Any Bright Ideas? > > > >teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Blunder in Education System? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2000 02:43:55 GMT -------- Yup! Except I went to public school all day as well! teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article , > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > > I found the > > majority to be wierd folks, with wierd ideas, and even wierder kids! > > Err, I take it then that you, yourself, were home-schooled? > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Sherline vs. Sakai From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2000 02:56:22 GMT -------- Hi Jim, I don't think you are real familiar with the Myford...It would "Play" with a 7" diameter chunk of 6061!! I have turned 9 3/4" cast iron flywheels on the one I used to have, with no difficulty at all. The Myford really is a class of its own in that size range. teenut Jim Harvey wrote: > wrong. Similarly, were you to chuck up a 7" hunk of 6061 on your Myford, I > think you'd get a good indication of lack of rigidity. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Al's moved to pastures new! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2000 03:19:26 GMT -------- He's Baa-ak!! teenut tmartin@xtra.co.nz wrote: > > For all who follow Al's commerce career: > > http://auctions.yahoo.com/user/ababinn?u= > > Was a bit of a shock when Yahoo Alert produced a familiar > product line this morning. > > Tom ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Setting dial on calipers From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2000 03:40:07 GMT -------- Yes John, no need to tear it all apart..but you do need to be able to slide the head off the end of the rack. The little retainer bar, at the end of the measuring bar is usually held on with a couple of little screws..at least on older models. On newer models it is a plastic piece with moulded on rivets. These can be popped loose easily with a small punch. Slide the head right off the bar and take th opportunity to thouroughly clean the rack. Now slide the head back on, right up to the closed position. Needle on zero? If not, slide it briskly off and re-install it. Still not zeroed..try again. Usually two or three iterations will pick up the pinion in the right position to zero the needle. Dial calipers are real convenient to use..but they do have a habit of jumping zero when they pick up the slightest fleck of dust in the rack. A classic example of design, contrary to Murphy's laws! For that reason, I will not allow them to be used for finished measurement of any kind in my shop! I have seen too many parts, beautifully finished, to several thou over or under nominal size! teenut (You have to learn most things the hard way!!) John Jacobs wrote: > > I was cleaning up my shop tonight and I found a long lost pair of > Mititoyo 8" dial calipers. I'm familiar with the tool used to set the > dial back, but this set doesn't have the slot in the back. Right now > zero is at about six o'clock. Is there anyway short of tearing the whole > thing apart to reset zero to 12 o'clock? > Thanks > John Jacobs ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Blunder in Education System? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2000 04:40:37 GMT -------- Pretty typical of the "problem rather than the solution" that I was talking about! teenut Dan Caster wrote: > > In article , > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > > This isn't the forum to continue this tirade against the Public School > > System..but I have to say Gunner, that for once I TOTALLY disagree with you! > > > > Bad public schools exist certainly, but the vast majority are doing a wonderful > > job considering the constant battle they have against parsimonious Taxpayers, > > self seeking Politicians, uncaring Parents, draconian anti-discipline laws, > > litiginous Parents, wacky Liberals, selfish Conservatives, hysterical Media, > > oversized Classes, censored textbooks, politically correct Curriculla, hidden > > Agendas, etcerea., ad nauseum!! > > > > How do I know? My wife is a dedicated Middle School Principal who works a > > regular 12 hour day fighting that battle! > > > > Sure, the Public School System is "bent"..but the answwer is not to break it but > > to fix it! To join the battle not to run away and hide, to become part of the > > solution, not part of the problem. > > > > Remember, like their Governments, people get the kind of School System they > > deserve! > > > > So quit whining and ask yourself whether you want your children to grow up as > > well rounded members of a healthy society..or part of an anally retentive, self > > centered, elite, whose only future is to withdraw even further into their > > increeasingly shrinking and embittered enclaves! > > > > Rant mode off! > > > > teenut > > My kid has long ago finished his formal education. And I do help out > at the local high school, mostly by fixing things that the building > maintenance people aren't equipted to fix. But I still believe that > if someone wants to not use the public system to educate their > children, that they ought to get some portion of what they save the > public school system by not having their kids in public school. > Say if the public school system spends $4000 per year per student, > then the parents would get $3000 if they didn't send their kid to > public school. The parents would be happier, I might pay less school > taxes and also be happier, only the people with a vested interest > in the public schools and the politicians depending on their votes > would be unhappy. > Dan > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Blunder in Education System? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2000 04:43:17 GMT -------- Where DO you get your information? I didn't know "National Inquirer" still had an education supplement. teenut mike II wrote: > And I bet that for every school like yours, there are 2 or 3 with bad > plumbing, a roof that leaks, and a staff that wants be anywhere else but > there...except they teach to get a paycheck and little else. Really good > teachers are maybe just ones who haven't been soured by the system yet. > > mike ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Looking for Tool Steel From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 17 Feb 2000 04:45:35 GMT -------- Can P20 be carburised? (Case Hardened) Does it have an SAE number Where can I get it? teenut NicholasFinney wrote: > P20 is a medium-low carbon prehardened tool steel approx 29-33 RC. Good > general purpose tool steel for Moldmaking. Entire molds can be made from this > if you don't need too many parts. > > N. Finney ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Machineable Wax From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2000 01:12:43 GMT -------- Buy the wax!! teenut Rex wrote: > > Dennis, > Many years ago I took a jewelry class and we made hard jewelry wax in > a warehouse by melting together half and half quantities of paraffin > and finely chopped polyethelene bags (can you say 'I prefer plastic' > when the clerk drones "paper or plastic?). It made a dark dirty brown > mix that I still use. I was told to add more bags to make it harder. > It is probably close to self igniting while being melted, so do it in > a safe place, preferably with a hotplate and no flames. Good luck and > have a fire extinguisher handy. > Rex > > On Tue, 15 Feb 2000 23:33:48 -0500, "Slodysko" > wrote: > > >Does anyone know how to make machineable wax? > >This stuff is expensive to buy. > >Dennis > > > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Quorn Info From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2000 01:23:42 GMT -------- Professor Chaddock taught at Loughborough College, in Leicestershire, England. Besides a wonderful cheese, Leicestershire is renown for the small, Market Town of Quorn and the Worlds largest, and most exclusively expensive, Qorn Hunt, with it's famous pack of Fox Hounds..."The Unspeakable chasing the Uneatable"!! So now you know.."The Rest of the Story" teenut Jordan wrote: > > Issue No.62 of "Model Engineers' Workshop" (29 Oct-25 Nov 1999) has a > big article on the Quorn. Published in UK by Nexus. > What I want to know is how did it get that funny name? > > Steve Rayner wrote: > > > > The whole thing was origionaly written up in the Model Engineer, sometime > > in the 1970s. > > > > b (carlquib@micron.net) wrote: > > : I am still looking for more information on the Quorn. All the links > > : that ppierce sent to me were very helpful, but I would like to gather up > > : as much information possible. Could someone tell me about the > > : difference between the mark I and mark II Quorns or point me to a source > > : for that information. Also, someone gave me a number for an outfit in > > : Canada that had castings available, which I promptly lost so if you > > : could please send it to me again. Also other sources for castings would > > : also be welcomed. Thank you. > > : -brian > > > > : -- > > : "No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms." -- Proposed > > : Virginia > > : Constitution, 1776 "Laws that forbid the carrying of arms. . . disarm > > : only those who are neither inclined nor determined to commit crimes. . . > > > > : Such laws make things worse for the assaulted and better for the > > : assailants; they serve rather to encourage than to prevent homicides, > > : for > > : an unarmed man may be attacked with greater confidence than an armed > > : man." > > : -- Jefferson's "Commonplace Book," 1774-1776, quoting from On Crimes > > : and > > : Punishment, by criminologist Cesare Beccaria, 1764 > > > > : -Thomas Jefferson, of Virginia > > > > -- > > > > I'm a Canadian eh! Steve. > > ************************************************************************** > > The FAQ for rec.crafts.metalworking is at: http://w3.uwyo.edu/~metal > > The metalworking drop box is at http://www.metalworking.com > > or http://208.213.200.132 > > ************************************************************************** > > Visit my website at: http://www.victoria.tc.ca/~ud233/homepage.htm > > > > ************* Tu ne cede malis, sed contra audentior ito. **************** > > ******************************** - Virgil ******************************** > > ******Yield thou not to adversity, but press on the more bravely.********** ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What is "Diamantine" ? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2000 01:30:18 GMT -------- The modern equivalent of "Diamantine" is called "Diamantine" and is available from Jewelers supply houses. teenut fdander@attglobal.net wrote: > > Most 19th century books on clockmaking specify "Diamantine" to polish pivots > and escapement pallets. However, I cannot find any technical reference to > this material, nor its grit size in microns. I guess it was useful in its > day. What would be a modern equivalent? Dave ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Dremel Tools From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2000 01:33:29 GMT -------- "Annonymas"?? Are you in the witness protection program..or just a dead beat dad?? Show your face..we are all supposed to be friends here! teenut Annonymas wrote: > > I was just wondering how good these things really are. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 4140 PH tubing needed...small piece From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2000 01:37:15 GMT -------- I'm not surprised he wanted an arm and a leg! When you want to get THAT specific, just be glad you can buy it and don't count the cost! I will Turn, Gundrill, Ream and Hone a piece for you..any available Rc you spec..for $450.00!! teenut rick a wrote: > > Hello all, > I'm looking for a 13 1/2 long 1.375 od x 1.278 id tubing. > 4140 or 4130 prehard prefered. > Also i'm looking for a piece this size....... > 1.510 od x .062 wall x 20" long > > My local supplier wanted an arm and a leg not to mention other parts > as well. > Thanks for any help. > Rick ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Need Ideas from the best idea group that I know From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2000 06:08:37 GMT -------- Huh? I don't have the foggiest idea what you are talking about! teenut Len Turnbow wrote: > > Time to raise the level of play? > The Amateur Radio group had a singularly evil looking thing mounted on a > wood base called a (help me here, guys) "Woouf Hong" (or something like that). > > The details are really fuzzy but I recall it was "awarded" to the unfortunate > chap who pulled a boneheaded stunt. The "award" implied the use of this > rather nasty looking object, presumably on the body of the offender. > It was all in good spirit, because the way in which the object was to be used > in the conferrence of the award was always left up to the imagination. > (That is to say, the mere mention of the award was the worst thing that > ever actually happened to anyone. Just looking at it made one laugh.) > The shape of one of the object's ....protuberances was rather evocative > in a tasteless but humorous way, if you know what I mean and I think you do. > > --Len > > Lowell Kenney wrote: > > > > Ok here the deal, at the office we have a thing going around about three > > hole punches that has become a stress reliever during a very tense time. We > > have, of course, many standard three ring punches of various type but only > > one large hole 3 ring punch. That one has been used a training device, > > stolen, ransomed, highjacked, hidden, presented and finally has become an > > award. I thought that somebody would have build a really unique three hole > > punch that I might make a copy of so as to introduce a new level of spirit > > into this game. I have a mill that I intend to use and am designing several > > ideas when I thought that somebody out there may already have something > > unique. I have designs that look like ammo reloading presses, hydraulic > > bench press, etc. > > > > If you have any ideas then pass them on to me and when I get it down I will > > share the experience. > > > > Thanks ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Anvil From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2000 06:10:23 GMT -------- ANYTHING is better than a cast iron anvil..you would do better work with a slab of Wisconsin Cheese! teenut Roger Duncan wrote: > > HF has a carbon steel anvil in my new catalog. I wonder if it is > any better than the cast iron anvil they still carry? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Clausing 8520 knee mill? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2000 06:11:37 GMT -------- Clark Magnuson wrote: > What is the > functional difference between a Kurt $340 6" vice and an Enco $115 6" > vice? > Clark About a thousand dollars! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Blunder in Education System? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2000 06:33:46 GMT -------- Dan Buckman wrote: > > If Education is the answer, what was the question? > > I don't know maybe it's " if we have more people wanting to have children > than we need, why does someone who has no children have to subsidize all > those who do?" For pretty well the same reasons that non-combatants subsidize the defense budget! Or healthy people subsidize hospitals. It has to do with the "Common Good". Ask yourself, what kind of education YOU might have got if non-parents hadn't subsidized YOUR education DUH! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Sherline vs. Sakai From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2000 06:46:16 GMT -------- I am not sure what point you are trying to put across Don. The Myford is a 3 1/2" CENTER HEIGHT lathe..which equals a US 7" SWING Lathe...and no, they don't make a 7" CH or 14" swing lathe at all. The question was..Would the Myford "handle" a 7" diameter billet of 6061..as in "Is it man enough to cut meaningful chunks off it?" The answer is that it would play with it...or a 7" diameter chunk of steel for that matter. It is a Gap Bed lathe..up to 10" diameter in the gap...and for its size (and cost!) is extremely well made, rigid and accurate! I am saving up for one!! teenut "DoN. Nichols" wrote: > > In article , > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > >Jim Harvey wrote: > > > >> wrong. Similarly, were you to chuck up a 7" hunk of 6061 on your Myford, I > >> think you'd get a good indication of lack of rigidity. > > > >Hi Jim, > > > >I don't think you are real familiar with the Myford...It would "Play" with a 7" > >diameter chunk of 6061!! > > > >I have turned 9 3/4" cast iron flywheels on the one I used to have, with no > >difficulty at all. > > > >The Myford really is a class of its own in that size range. > > Aren't we also dealing in part with the differing nomenclature > for lathe sizes between the UK and the US? A "7" lathe in the UK will > swing 14" over the bed. They're specifying radius not diameter. (As > I'm sure Teenut knows, since he is from there. :-) > > Now -- I'm not sure, however, whether Myford makes a 14" (our > term) lathe, designated a 7" lathe. > > Enjoy, > DoN. > -- > Email: | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564 > My Concertina web page: | http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html > --- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero --- ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Looking for Tool Steel From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2000 06:50:42 GMT -------- I am NOT a Limey! I am an Ex-Pat Brit! From Yorkshire! "never ask a man if he is from Yorkshire..If he is, he will tell you so. If he is not...Why humiliate him further!" NicholasFinney wrote: > > >Can P20 be carburised? (Case Hardened) > > > >Does it have an SAE number > > > >Where can I get it? > > > >teenut > > > >NicholasFinney wrote: > > > >> P20 is a medium-low carbon prehardened tool steel approx 29-33 RC. Good > >> general purpose tool steel for Moldmaking. Entire molds can be made from > >this > >> if you don't need too many parts. > >> > >> N. Finney > > > > From "Mold Enginering" > > P20: > > AISI material # 1.2311,1.2312, 1.2330 > Steel Code 40CrMnMo7 > > 1.2311 C 0.40, Si 0.30, Mn1.50, Cr1.90, Mo 0.20 > > 1.2312 C 0.40, Si 0.40, Mn1.50, Cr1.90, Mo 0.20, S0.06 > > P20 will case harden. Some toolmakers that I know prefer to make angle plates > etc... from case hardened P20 as opposed to H13 etc... as you will get a piece > that has a more ductile core with less internal stress. > > We get our P20 from uddeholm - www.uddeholmtooling.com (uddeholms' trade name > for P20 is impax supreme). Uddeholm distributes top quality steel but you > should be able to get various grades of P20 from your local distributor if you > ask for it. > > Teenut I think I read somewhere that you were a limey, may I ask from what part > of the U.K. you originate? > > N. Finney > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Locating 90 Deg. Positions on a Tube From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2000 06:53:22 GMT -------- No sheet of paper..no matter how large or how thin..can be folded more than eight times! teenut brian whatcott wrote: > Which reminds me of that old puzzle: > > An old German immigrant wants to fold his newspapers up into tidy > bales. So he starts with a double sheet of newsprint and starts folding > it in two. > Then halving the size with a second fold. He intends to fold it twenty > times in the same way. > But he is short on imagination so he doesn't see the problem. > The paper is three thou thick. > What is the problem? > > Brian Whatcott Altus OK ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Quorn Info From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2000 07:01:04 GMT -------- Steve Rayner wrote: > > Now, how many of you can correctly pronounce "Loughborough"? :) > > Robert Bastow ("teenut"@hotmail.com) wrote: > : Professor Chaddock taught at Loughborough College, in Leicestershire, England. I haven't met many Yanks that could pronounce "Leicestershire" properly. (Or "Aluminium" for that matter!) Duck and cover!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Which to buy - Grizzly, Jet or Enco? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2000 07:06:12 GMT -------- I suppose the down side is, that a machine tool that requires spare parts after only three years, is a pretty sorry POS!! Or am I missing something here? teenut robert anzellotti wrote: > > I have had my Enco 12x36 for 3 years. The only good thing I will say about > it is that parts are very cheap and I get them fast. > > Rob > > Jim Stewart wrote: > > > Robert Schutz wrote: > > > > > > I'm shoping for a 12x36 lathe, considering Grizzly, Jet and Enco. > > > > > > Quality and spare parts are my main concern. > > > > > > Any opinons out there? > > > > > > > Hah! You want opinions? You came to the right newsgroup! > > > > I have the Harbor Freight (Central Machinery) 12X36 which is the same > > machine as the Enco. I'm *very* happy with it. Enco wants more money > > but I believe they have much better tech support. > > > > The only failed part I've had is the power pilot lamp. > > > > Pictures of mine at http://www.strappe.com/hsm.html > > > > -js > > > > -- > > > > http://www.strappe.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Small tank, worth it? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2000 07:09:53 GMT -------- It will freeze the water in short order! Even a propane tank will do that. teenut Kathy and Erich Coiner wrote: > > Set tank in bucket of water. QED > > Erich > > Bruce Simpson wrote in message ... > >On Thu, 17 Feb 2000 16:06:04 -0800, Roger Brown > > wrote: > > > >>One interesting option is to get a liquid CO2 tank (the Powertank) and > since > >>it stores the CO2 in a liquid state, you can get a lot of volume from a > small > >>tank. Other option is to use an old scuba tank with regulator, same idea > but > >>really high pressure air, both can be filled for about $10 or so. > > > >The problem with CO2 is that because it's in liquid form under > >pressure, the latent heat absorbed as the gas is released can really > >freeze up a tank at higher rates of consumption. This has the > >unfortunate effect of reducing the pressure and, after an ice-blanket > >starts providing good insulation, you can run out of PSI long before > >you run out of CO2. > > > >--------------------------------- > >Don't send email to me, send a Memo.to me > >http://memo.to/BruceSimpson > >Memo.to, your email firewall, stops junk email dead! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Dremel Tools From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 18 Feb 2000 07:16:28 GMT -------- I'll back Gunner up on that! I have a Foredom and I love it and use it a LOT. But I would never give up my old Dremel for some of the trickier bits. teenut Gunner wrote: > > And don't forget the Ryobi version. Its every bit as good IMHO as the actual Dremel tool, and use > the same size shanks. > I have a couple Foredoms and some air die grinders, but for doing stuff in a hurry, then getting it > out of your way, they (Dremel and Ryobi) are marvelous tools. > > Gunner > > On Fri, 18 Feb 2000 01:49:37 GMT, see.my.sig.for.my.re@l.address (Bruce Simpson) wrote: > > >On Fri, 18 Feb 2000 10:39:49 +1000, "Annonymas" > >wrote: > > > >>I was just wondering how good these things really are. > > > >I wondered that too -- until I bought one. > > > >They're incredibly useful and I find myself using them for: > > > >1. cutting small bolts -- those cutoff wheels are amazingly tough! > > > >2. grinding (with the steel bur) the surface of aluminum joins before > >welding > > > >3. smoothing up the edges of castings > > > >4. porting small engines > > > >5 milling slots into the top of brass or aluminum fittings to take a > >screwdriver when I can't be bothered actually putting the right tool > >in the mill > > > >6. polishing small things > > > >7. saying to people who visit my workshop -- "and this is my Dremel" > > > >Although some people claim that the newer ones are not as tough or > >well made as the old ones, mine's sure taken a lickin and it keeps on > >tickin. > > > >One day I might buy an air-powered die grinder -- but in the meantime > >the Dremel is quick, convenient and the tooling for them is both > >abundant and cheap. > > > >--------------------------------- > >Don't send email to me, send a Memo.to me > >http://memo.to/BruceSimpson > >Memo.to, your email firewall, stops junk email dead! > > --------------------------------------------------------- > > "A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an > invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write > a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort > the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, > solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program > a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die > gallantly. Specialization is for insects." Robert Heinlein > > Free Hobby Buy/Swap/Sell Website > www.cyberg8t.com/gunner/hsm/index.html > > Home Page > http://userzweb.lightspeed.net/gunner ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Blunder in Education System? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2000 00:43:32 GMT -------- A truly opinionated outburst...considering you can't even spell the word. Now I suppose you are going to tell me that all the squandering of funds was done by fairies in the night. I know you won't even consider the idea that it was done by School Board members, elected by yourself and a bunch of other "oppinionated ass-holes" just like you! teenut RobHarMill wrote: > > >From: Robert Bastow "teenut"@hotmail.com > > >Ask yourself, what kind of education YOU might have got if non-parents hadn't > >subsidized YOUR education > > > >DUH! > > I read this group and find it interesting. > Sometime you have good things to say and some times you sound like an > oppionated (sp ?) asshole - like myself some times. > The school district I live in just spent 72 to 85 million $$$$$ for a new high > school. The cost is not truly known yet dur to cost overruns and repairs to the > design and new construction. WHAT A WASTE! > Ido not begrudge any child a good education, but I resent being taken for a > ride so that some people can point to a Taj Mahal and say "LOOK AT MY SCHOOL" > when all they can do is spell school "skuul"!!!!!!!!!! > Sorry for the RANT, but this subject really gets me going. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Blunder in Education System? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2000 00:46:24 GMT -------- Plonk! teenut (well known by his other alias of Robert Bastow) Dan Buckman wrote: > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote in message > news:eJ5r4.1770$ps1.127970@news1.rdc1.ga.home.com... > > > > > > Dan Buckman wrote: > > > > > > If Education is the answer, what was the question? > > > > > > I don't know maybe it's " if we have more people wanting to have > children > > > than we need, why does someone who has no children have to subsidize all > > > those who do?" > > > > For pretty well the same reasons that non-combatants subsidize the defense > > budget! Or healthy people subsidize hospitals. It has to do with the > "Common > > Good". > > > > Ask yourself, what kind of education YOU might have got if non-parents > hadn't > > subsidized YOUR education > > > > DUH! > > > > teenut > > Well tslot you had to get personal with the big capital YOU so now like when > a bad puppy does something smelly on the living room floor I guess I will > have to rub your nose in it. > During the time I and my siblings attended school (some public and some > private) my parents paid in taxes Quite in excess of the amount needed for > their children. It has been 24 years since the last of us finished any > public school classes, during that time, every year they have paid over > $20,000 in direct school taxes, this does not include the tax money > collected and redistributed by state and federal income tax, So you can add > another 10-20,000. In answer to your question, (which totally missed the > intent of my post, but then what can you expect from someone who goes by an > alias) probably a better one. > We are all blind men exploring an elephant. Please do not assume that > because you are intimately familiar with the elephants ass that you know > more about elephants than any one else. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Which to buy - Grizzly, Jet or Enco? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2000 01:09:00 GMT -------- Standard Modern lathes are a good, solid, "plain vanilla" machine tool..Quality on a par with Colchester, Southbend etc..but a lot tougher than the latter. Excellent choice for a home shop. teenut (alias Robert Bastow ;^) Radar wrote: > > "Robert Schutz" wrote: > > I'm shopping for a 12x36 lathe, considering Grizzly, Jet and Enco. > > Quality and spare parts are my main concern. > > Any opinons out there? > > Robert: I have been looking into the same questions. I am not familiar > with the Enco version 12 x 36, so I cannot comment on their lathe models > specifically. I am in correspondence right now with a semi-retired > mechanical engineer who lived and worked in China for ten years. By > the way, he described China as small pockets of concentrated hi-tech > industry surrounded by vast areas of peasant-level ignorance; an on-the- > scenes evaluation you do not commonly hear about. > > Anyway, in this gentleman's evaluation of machinery manufacturing, the > Taiwan lathes and mills are preferable to the Mainland products. Most > Grizzly Industrial and Jet lathes are produced on the Chinese > mainland. This includes the Grizzly and Harbor Freight 12 x 36. > Look at the gears to the left of the headstock. YUCK, they are one > third the thickness of the gears you will find in the USA Logans. > Also the 12 x 24 and 12 x 36 between centers measurement is rather > "over optimistic". The ad writers are stretching it a bit (opinion > offered by techsupport at Grizzly Industrial). > > One Grizzly lathe is still built in Taiwan, a 13 x 40 with brake, model > G1031. It is of older design, but is better built than the Mainland > stuff. The gearbox runs in oil and runs quieter than any of the > Mainland models. It would be my choice. Note that the stand offered > with the lathe is about 4" to 5" too short for average height American > male operators. The general castings, finish, and detailing of this > lathe are a notch above the Mainland products according to the private > reports I have received. I have not yet seen the lathe in person. > > In my searches, I also investigated the Standard-Modern lathes made in > Canada. They earned a fine reputation in public schools and trade > schools over the years. They are presently manufactured by Kestrel > Machine Tools outside of Toronto. It is my understanding, however, that > the corporate structure was bought out by a business group in East > India in the 1980's, and as a result, the quality of the Standard- > Modern line has begun to deteriorate in the opinion of that same > mechanical engineer who now lives in Canada himself. > > His recommendation - look for S-M equipment built up through 1982. > Sizes of their manual lathes start with a 11" x 26", then move up to a > 13" x 26", 13 x 34, and 13 x 40. Perhaps Robert Bastow "Teenut" might > have some wisdom to share on this brand. The quality is well above > stuff from the Far East, but the prices are about double as well. > Again, I have not yet seen any of the S-M lathes in person, new or used. > Good luck with your search. > -- > John R Page > Medford, Oregon > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Looking for Tool Steel From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2000 02:59:55 GMT -------- From HULL!! That DOES make you a Yorkshire Limey! (Limeys were English sailors..Hull is a Yorkshire seaport) I'm from sheep country..Don't ask what that makes ME!!! teenut NicholasFinney wrote: > > >I am NOT a Limey! > > > >I am an Ex-Pat Brit! > > > >From Yorkshire! > > > >"never ask a man if he is from Yorkshire..If he is, he will tell you so. If > >he > >is not...Why humiliate him further!" > > > >NicholasFinney wrote: > >> > >> >Can P20 be carburised? (Case Hardened) > >> > > >> >Does it have an SAE number > >> > > >> >Where can I get it? > >> > > >> >teenut > >> > > > HA! I'm from HULL teenut! My family emigrated to the US 20 years ago. > > Nick Finney ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Quorn Info From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2000 17:02:54 GMT -------- Michael Gray wrote: > Now if any of you can pronounce the name of ULGHAM, a small village in > Northumberland, correctly then I'd say you'd passed the test! > Next thing someone will be on about Cholmondey. > Mike, an addict of the language. "Ullum" and (Cholmond_l_ey ?) "Chumli" How did I do? Try "Beaulieu" and "St John" teenut teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Small tank, worth it? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2000 17:06:42 GMT -------- Adding extra water will indeed help..Just a constant trickle from a hose will go a long way on a propane tank. I have been to Blacksmith "Hammer Ins" where the propane "heater" tank was used as an effective beer cooler!! Paradise! teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article <5f6r4.1776$ps1.127869@news1.rdc1.ga.home.com>, > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > > It will freeze the water in short order! Even a propane tank will do > that. > > Well, short is a relative term. Water has a huge heat capacity, > and an even larger amount is absorbed at the phase change. But > if you are really worried, you can add heat to the bucket. I > would suggest this be done with some sort of liquid contained in > a closed container, possibly glass or aluminum. Because the > liquid really should not freeze, it should have some minimum > alcohol content. So the ideal situation would be periodically > adding containers to the near-freezing water in the bucket (I > would say 6 at a time would be about right) and having them > give up heat to the system. Once they get near freezing temperature > of course, they will not help any more and must be removed and > disposed of suitably. Add more containers as needed! > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Dremel Tools From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2000 17:23:33 GMT -------- Gary Coffman wrote: > > I wore out several Dremel tools doing circuit board modifications. > Then I wised up and got one of the micro air die grinders (about the > size the dentist uses). It turns up to 80,000 RPM and makes short > work of circuit board modifications. Those dental grinders are the "cats meow" for grinding hard steel too. I used to have a small, side line tool repair business, in Canada, where we repaired the wiped out pockets of inserted carbide tooling...Anything from single pocket lathe tools to multi,multi pocket face broaches for the automotive industry. The best, most economical, way to do this, was by "wing on a gnat" type TIG welding and grinding back to qualified dimensions with dental grinders and diamond burrs. I had a couple of girls who could regularly work to tenth thou limints this way. Another technique we developed, was to build up, with a special mix of spray-on metallizing, around a precise (negative)copy of the pocket, made from sinker EDM carbon. Even screw threads could be quickly and precisely reproduced by this method. If wee could see even a tiny portion of the original pocket, or the screw threads, left in it, after a "wipe out", then we could economically repair it. BTW, trying to reweld, and then remachine with a Deckel Mill was a short trip to insanity and insolvency!.. I was doing "Fire Sale" business with this little sideline..Until the US-Canada NAFTA Agreement wiped out Canadian Manufacturing Industry! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Dremel Tools From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 19 Feb 2000 17:33:20 GMT -------- I picked up a wonderful, old, Dremel Shoe polisher at a Garage Sale..You know, the double ended kind, chrome plated housing, with conical mops for Brown shoes at one end, and black shoes at the other. You used to see them in Hotel lobbies and corridors..Way back when.. I intended to put it to good use in the shop...but it stands next to my dresser in the bedroom..perfect for a last minute spit and polish to my dress shoes, on the way out to an important meeting! Anyone else out there still wear dress shoes with an Military style (Candle and back of a hot spoon) spit shine? teenut elf15641@my-deja.com wrote: > I in my little world figured the Dremal tool had been around for maybe > 30 or 40 years but I have a Popular Mech. mag from 1943 that offers the > Dremal motor tool. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Jig Mills From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 20 Feb 2000 03:46:02 GMT -------- Wasn't my Division at Herberts, but Devlieg were owned by them until the breakup of Herberts in the early 80's IIRC. Devlieg were bought bu Bullard and, ast I heard they were still making Jig Borers and the like. Anything with the Devlieg name on it (or Alfred Herbert's for that matter) is a first class piece of equipment. teenut UntMaintco wrote: > > >I've seen these on used machinery websites. They look like > >horizontal boring mills, only more precise, with DRO scales > >that usually read to .0001. Can anyone shed any light on > >what the other differences are? They all appear to have > >been made by Herbert Devlieg > > Jig Mill is a term started by DeVlieg. I can tell you it is one heck of a > machine. Rock stable, dead on accurate. I would say a hands down best machine > money can buy. It really is a boring mill, can do all of the same jobs except > they dont come with outboard supports. But calling is a boring mill some how > does it an injustice because of its dead on accuracy. The older machines had > "auto position" where you could put in a pre set of rods and the machine would > move the length of the rods. The remove the back lash from the screw (pre ball > screw) by moving the table back and forth. Want a big surprise? open the back > of one of these machines and look at the electrics there must be 50 relays with > no joking. They made Jig Mills in 2" 3" 4" and 5" spindle diameters. The early > pre "spira-matic" machines are not very good and can be bought very cheap. > Bear in mind that the spira matics came out in 1953 or 55 (I forget) The later > machines were a good investment. They still sell used today for more than they > were new. Some place I have the sales ticket for a new 4" with all the tooling. > I think it was around 1960, was alot of money back then. I am not really sure > how Herbert got involved with DeVlieg? I think that Teenut knows that story as > well as more about DeVliegs in general. > > Are you thinking of buying one? If you are you wont be sorry, but you will be > spoiled every other mill will then be a POS to you. > > If you need specific info I still have quite a bit of it. > > Good Luck > Tom ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Tool room lathe? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 20 Feb 2000 03:52:04 GMT -------- There is a particular set of Shlesinger Specifications for "Tool Room Lathes"..I doubt that the Southbend version ever met them..certainly wouldn't have kept them for long!! "Tool Room Lathes" should embody the very finest in lathe design and performance and usually comes in a massively proportioned package. Imagine a short length cut off a 16" Engine lathe and made into a 10" x 12" lathe and you get some idea of the robustness of these magnificent beasts. teenut John Hofstad-Parkhill wrote: > > >What makes a lathe a tool room lathe? > > In the South Bend world, such a machine will sport direct reading dials for > the cross slide & compound and a threading dial. My older catalog also > indicates a collet closer & collets and the taper attachment. > > From what I've been able to gather, the designation "tool room" is a matter > of features rather than any particular increase in accuracy. Lathes that are > traditionally considered top of the line such as Hardinge, Monarch, LeBlond, > etc., would be top notch lathes regardless of configuration. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Drill press as a mill? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 20 Feb 2000 03:56:33 GMT -------- Don't waste your money! The result of your plan will reduce your drill press to garbage and you to tears. teenut BACSTG wrote: > > Has anyone ever used a compound slide table to make a drill press into a mill. > I already own a medium size drill press and for $100 dollars one of these > tables seem to be more reasonable to me than buying a $600 dollar mill. Anyone > ever tried this before? I am looking to use it on smaller pieces made mostly > out of aluminum. > > Thanks, > > Keith (bacstg@aol.com) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: pickled in oil From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 20 Feb 2000 15:15:01 GMT -------- I think, maybe, you are referring to steel sheet that has been "Pickled AND Oiled" teenut John Jacobs wrote: > > What does this mean? Do they soak the steel in oil? > John ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Blanks in automatic pistols in movies From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2000 01:39:49 GMT -------- One important reason why propane fired MGs are used in filming, is that the speed of the film frames and the speed of the muzzle flashes will never correspond properly. The result is either a continuous flash..or more usually an MG that appears to be firing very sporadically. You can often see this effect on older movies..where they DID use blank firing MGs. It is a similar phenomenon to that which makes wagon wheels and airplane propellors run backwards. teenut Gary Coffman wrote: > Gas operated MGs can also use BFAs, but lots of them are just gutted > shells that look like machine guns. They electrically fire puffs of acetylene > to simulate muzzle flash, and move the belt and toss brass using a small > electric motor. (This gets around the NFA restrictions on real machine > guns.) > > Gary > Gary Coffman KE4ZV | You make it |mail to ke4zv@bellsouth.net > 534 Shannon Way | We break it | > Lawrenceville, GA | Guaranteed | ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Spousal Abuse and Cast Iron Woes. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2000 01:55:25 GMT -------- Cast Iron is usually machined dry..but flood coolant won't hurt the cutting and will do a LOT to keep the dust down. Most machinists have a Love/Hate relationship with the stuff! teenut boris beizer wrote: > > Okay, I finished the big face plate and now I'm trying to avoid the divorce > lawyers. It ended up 11" in diameter and has 144 3/8-16 tapped holes in > it -- a hexagonal pattern -- the regular pattern that will give you both > linear and circular symmetry. And I didn't break a single tap!! Okay, the > face-plate is great but it was/is a strain on my significant other -- cast > iron is filthy stuff. And started very heavy. I machined off at least 25 > pounds of the stuff. > > The problem is the cast-iron chips. And the closer you are to making > finishing cuts, the worse they become. I have been faced with a choice of > her or never machining cast iron again. Lest you think I am a total and > uncaring slob, here are the precautions I took, in general order of > increasing meticulousness. Now I want some advice that will make her > satisfied and allow me to work those kits. > > 1. Can't move the shop. It is in my basement and I don't have room on the > property for a separate shop -- she said "rent out a place" -- but that's > kind of extreme. > > 2. I don't wear shoes in the house proper. I have special shoes for use in > the shop. I take them off when I leave and put them on when I enter -- > always, every time. > > 3. There's a cocoa mat at the shop door. > > 4. Bought a new vaccuum cleaner -- quieter but more powerful. I keep it > going near the cutting bit when I am doing heavy cuts. > > 5. Vaccum up several times a day. Don't allow chips to accumulate on the > floor, the lathe, the mill, etc. Clean, clean, cleaning all the time. > > 6. Facing cuts in toward the center so that the chips go to the lathe > rather than to the floor. Also though of mounting the tools upside-down on > the back side that's a bit difficult in many situations. > > Any and all suggestions that will lead to "clean room" cast iron > machining would be appreciated. > > Boris > > ------------------------------------- > Boris Beizer Ph.D. Seminars and Consulting > 1232 Glenbrook Road on Software Testing and > Huntingdon Valley, PA 19006 Quality Assurance > > TEL: 215-572-5580 > FAX: 215-886-0144 > Email direct: bbeizer@sprintmail.com > Email (Forwarded): bbeizer@acm.org, bbeizer@ieee.org > ------------------------------------------ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Heads Up: Machine Tool Recon. On Ebay From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2000 01:59:45 GMT -------- It should certainly fetch more than the opening bid! teenut Jim Harvey wrote: > > Machine Tool Reconditionion by Connelly. Here's the link and this book is > every bit as nice as described. > > http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=265658951 > > Not for the faint of heart, but if you absolutely HAVE to own this book, > this is the nicest copy you'll ever find. > > Caveat: If you don't think this book is worth the opening bid, DON'T Bid on > it! > > Jim Harvey ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Got that ancient lathe. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2000 02:06:56 GMT -------- General! Some of he best woodworking machinery available. I don't know if they are still in business, but I searched unsuccessfully for one a couple of years ago...Finished up buying a Powermatic tablesaw and 8" jointer in default. 8^( teenut Mike Graham wrote: > There was (is?) a company in Quebec that makes woodworking machinery - > good, high-end stuff. A buddy of mine is a woodworker and he scoured the > country buying up tools made by them. Now I'm trying to remember the name. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Grinding vs reaming (for cartridge chamber) From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2000 02:13:43 GMT -------- Try these people: http://www.reamerrentals.com/ Grinding up a hole that length, needs pretty specialised equipment. Even given that, you will have a heck of a job getting the throat and lede concentric with the bore. Try to get a reamer, failing that, make a "D" bit reamer. The grinder route leads to a vale of tears! teenut eberlein wrote: > > Interesting idea. Is this a straight walled case, or does it have some body > taper to it? Boring the chamber would be an interesting project. Only > potential problem I can see is the lead into the rifling. This is usually > tapered to some extent; easy to grind on a reamer, but tough to do inside a > rifle chamber. > > There used to be an outfit that rented chambering reamers mail order, for a > reasonable amout (like $25 or so). I don't remember who they were, but > someone on rec.guns probably knows if they are still active. > > Mike Eberlein > > Lou Boyd wrote: > > > What would be the problems with grinding the chamber in a rifle barrel > > instead of reaming it. It would be bored close to size first. I'm > > considering this for an oddball black powder cartridge for which > > standard reamers aren't available. The alternative is to have a reamer > > made but they're expensive. The grinding would be done on a lathe using > > a die grinder mounted on the tool post. > > > > Any suggestions for the material used for the grinding tool and surface > > speed? Should it be done with a flood coolant of any kind? The > > material is chrome moly steel. > > > > -- > > Lou Boyd ======== Newsgroups: misc.survivalism,alt.survival,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT-British Gun Laws Update From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2000 08:12:59 GMT -------- Let that be a lesson to anyone who thinks that taking guns from law abiding citizens will have any effect...Other than increasing gun crimes. At least (for now) the perps in the US know there is a good chance that SOMEONE can shoot back at them!! Criminalize guns and only criminals will have them. Will these silly F****ers NEVER learn!! teenut Gunner wrote: > > For our British and ex-pat friends: > > http://www.the-times.co.uk/news/pages/sti/2000/01/16/stinwenws02004.html?999 > -------------------------- > > "A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an > invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write > a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort > the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, > solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program > a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die > gallantly. Specialization is for insects." Robert Heinlein > > Rosies Page http://rosie.acmecity.com/flower/277/ > homepage http://userzweb.lightspeed.net/gunner ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: drilling sheet metal From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2000 13:14:30 GMT -------- Try a carbide tipped masonry drill? teenut Bryan Conrad wrote: > > Just had another thought-most windscreen shops have a diamond tip drill bit > to drill holes in windscreens with,if you can easily take the job to them it > may not cost too much to get the holes drilled for you. > "Bryan Conrad" wrote in message > news:aM8s4.35$Tr2.3810@nsw.nnrp.telstra.net... > > Sounds like the enamel is giving you the most trouble,it's bloody hard and > > will probably defy even the best of drill bits. > > You may be able to punch a hole more successfully if your material is > > not too thick,but you would need a good,tough punch and a "die" to recieve > > it.This may also make a large chip in the enamel.It sounds a bit tricky. > > I'm sure you can successfully sharpen drill bits by hand but will need > > to employ some cutting tool principles and then practice a bit,good luck! > > "Zebee Johnstone" wrote in message > > news:slrn8b08u0.ncn.zebee@zipperii.zip.com.au... > > > In rec.crafts.metalworking on Sun, 20 Feb 2000 14:08:23 GMT > > > Dan Bollinger wrote: > > > >Zebee, I've drilled enameled metal before. The enamel is glass and > > > >instantly dull the drill bit. Also, the steel is quite hard, probably > > from > > > >the enameling process when it is heated. You will have to sharpen the > > bit > > > >every few holes. Dan > > > > > > > > > > Makes sense... I did try a new bit but it was a really cheap > > > one so it might have been rubbish anyway. > > > > > > What's the best way of sharpening drills? I've got no lathe or > > > access to one, I have an angle grinder and a bench grinder. > > > > > > I presume it's like sharpening a knife - there's the do it by hand > > > and learn to get the angle exactly right that the pros use and most > > > folk never really master, and various gadgets. > > > > > > Anyone got any gadget recommendations? > > > > > > (I'm in Australia, so please explain by description not brand name > > > or shop name) > > > > > > Zebee > > > > ======== Newsgroups: misc.survivalism,alt.survival,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT-British Gun Laws Update From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 21 Feb 2000 13:18:18 GMT -------- PLONK! Panther wrote: > > Naa Rob, guess we fuck*rs will never learn. We just happily count the guns in your > > marvelous country, where 20% pop lives below minimum living standards and 5% of > you guys > are in prison (5% of a country's pop in prison, what the f*ck is going on???) and > count the > crime rate and whooop, there it is. > Increase in guns -> increase in crime. > > Now, I do recognize that the US has dug itself into a hopeless pit by sending so > many > firearms in circulation in the first place and I can see no easy solution to this. > > Sometimes you NRA bitch*s remind of kids in a toystore: > 'mommy gimme big guuun, gimme.' > 'No you cant have it it dangerous to yourself, your family and your friends!' > 'i dont care mommy, whaaaaa, gimme guuuuun. it says baaaaang and phweeee!!!' > > What you defend as your constitutional rigths are really just friggin' immature > wails, cuz > you need your toys. Well, maybe its a freudian thing. > > I really like this newsgroup due to the many tips on wilderness survival and the > occasional > thread on biblical interpretation (oooh, you guys :)), but you gun guys really > lower the > standards with your crap. Talk abt survival fine, talk abt guns in rec.guns, which > is infected > with NRA dicks anyway. (oh yeah, now I'm in a flaming mood: I forgot, in the > above, to > mention the statitic which says that abt 50% of US pop is overweight. So this > SURVIVAL > ng might not be for those (you)) > > All flames most welcome. > > //panther// > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > Let that be a lesson to anyone who thinks that taking guns from law abiding > > citizens will have any effect...Other than increasing gun crimes. > > > > At least (for now) the perps in the US know there is a good chance that SOMEONE > > can shoot back at them!! > > > > Criminalize guns and only criminals will have them. > > > > Will these silly F****ers NEVER learn!! > > > > teenut > > > > Gunner wrote: > > > > > > For our British and ex-pat friends: > > > > > > http://www.the-times.co.uk/news/pages/sti/2000/01/16/stinwenws02004.html?999 > > > -------------------------- > > > > > > "A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an > > > invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write > > > a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort > > > the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, > > > solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program > > > a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die > > > gallantly. Specialization is for insects." Robert Heinlein > > > > > > Rosies Page http://rosie.acmecity.com/flower/277/ > > > homepage http://userzweb.lightspeed.net/gunner ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: drilling sheet metal From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 02:39:42 GMT -------- And here in Atlanta, the buds are on the trees and I haven't YET had to put the roof up on the Jag because of the cold! (and only for PARKING in the rain!!) I don't DO snow anymore! Not even on Christmas cards!!! teenut (Who finally got his bones warmed through, nine years after a twelve year ordeal in Canabrrrr!) Gerald Miller wrote: > > Then if you come south to Canada, we have maybe 12 inches on the ground and > going fast. :-)} > > -- > > Gerry > London, Canada > > Jim Kovar wrote in message > news:ycbs4.6265$JQ.364084@monger.newsread.com... > > > > "Fitch R. Williams" wrote in message > > news:v831bso58331tnc0b1ko7pmtlidg3ponka@4ax.com... > > > "Jim Kovar" wrote: > > > > > > >Jim Kovar > > > > Iron Mountain, Mi > > > > > > As an aside Jim, > > > > > > How deep is the snow? > > > > > > Fitch > > > In So. Cal. > > > > Hi, Fitch.. > > > > Not much snow this year, level ground maybe 30" at the most. Got > > some drifts around the house 4 or 5 feet, though. > > Still plenty for the sled dog races and the world cup ski jump next > > weekend. > > > > Jim Kovar > > Iron Mountain, Mi > > > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Got that ancient lathe. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 02:42:01 GMT -------- Not difficult to beat the Delta Unisaw!! The Powermatic 66 does it handily! (Yes I have owned BOTH!!) teenut Marshall Pharoah wrote: > > Yes, they are still in business. Their better table saws are "generally" rated as good as or > better than a Delta Unisaw. An assessment I agree with. > > Marshall > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote in message news:451s4.2077$ps1.131423@news1.rdc1.ga.home.com... > > General! Some of he best woodworking machinery available. I don't know if they > > are still in business, but I searched unsuccessfully for one a couple of years > > ago...Finished up buying a Powermatic tablesaw and 8" jointer in default. > > > > 8^( > > > > teenut > > > > Mike Graham wrote: > > > > > There was (is?) a company in Quebec that makes woodworking machinery - > > > good, high-end stuff. A buddy of mine is a woodworker and he scoured the > > > country buying up tools made by them. Now I'm trying to remember the name. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Material for half-nuts? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 02:51:31 GMT -------- Kevin Pinkerton wrote: > >What are most half-nuts made of? > > > >- Bart > > I had one made of cast iron and now I have ones made of brass. You should have thought of that BEFORE someone cut your nuts in half!! 8^o teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: breaking up cast iron tub From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 02:53:01 GMT -------- You wouldn't need to seal it Gerry! 8^) teenut Gerald Miller wrote: > > And here I was gonna suggest about ten pounds of semtex in the tub full of > water with the top well sealed. :-)} > > -- > > Gerry > London, Canada > > Gunner wrote in message > news:38b4e04b.10110180@news.cyberg8t.com... > > On 21 Feb 2000 06:38:59 GMT, dkelly2716@aol.com (DKelly2716) wrote: > > > > >does any one know the best way to break up a old cast iron tub, > > > I used a sledgehammer before but the porcelain and cast iron chips are > sharp > > > I don't want to get a dog and a cane quite yet!! > > > > Sledge hammer is out huh.... safety glasses are a bother? Ok, wrap the > tub with 3 wraps around the > > small side and 3 wraps around the long side, tapeing the 200 gr det cord > with a good quality duct > > tape to both the inside and outside surfaces. Add the appropriate cap, > seek cover and fire. > > Your tub will be in small manageable pieces in less than .0001 seconds. > > > > Gunner > > > > --------------------------------------------------------- > > > > "A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an > > invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write > > a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort > > the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, > > solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program > > a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die > > gallantly. Specialization is for insects." Robert Heinlein > > > > Free Hobby Buy/Swap/Sell Website > > www.cyberg8t.com/gunner/hsm/index.html > > > > Home Page > > http://userzweb.lightspeed.net/gunner > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT-British Gun Laws Update From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 02:55:01 GMT -------- Panther WHO?? teenut PLAlbrecht wrote: > > Never mind "Panther." After a while, one learns to recognize Eurotrash... They > love to point a finger at the U.S. while copying everything we do (and usually > getting it strangely wrong in the process). > > dittoPlonk! > > Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT-British Gun Laws Update From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 03:30:43 GMT -------- With a 2" bore cannon, I doubt ANYONE needs gates and a guard!! I gotta hurry up and finish my 9.2" Howitzer! teenut william thomas powers wrote: > > You know if you want to quote stats; the Eurofolk should look at things > like home ownership...I'm about as low as you can get at my place of > employment yet I bought a 5 bedroom masonry house on a double lot > (detached!). Talking with my counterparts germany and the UK all of them were > renting apartments except one two job couple that bought half a duplex > of about 800 sq feet. Mines 2250 sq ft + full attic and basement. > > Now the ones in Indonesia had a house and three > servants---but were amazed that I was not living in a gated community > or had an alarm system and guards patrolling... > > Of course the only guns I own are BP one's a wheelock and the other fires > a 2" ball... > > Thomas ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Internal Combustion Engine From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 03:42:55 GMT -------- Andy, I highly commend your ambition and wish you every success..keep your eye (and Heart) on the goal and you WILL achieve it!! However, I do hope you are very, VERY young..'cos it is going to take a LONG time to build up your expertise and equipment to that sort of level! Start by taking evening classes in Machine Shop..and take it from there. teenut (who DID!!) Andy Laurence wrote: > > I know this question is very vague, and probably bad practice on this > newsgroup, so I apologise in advance... I have an idea of making an > engine for a project I have in mind. Unfortunately, I don't know where > to start and have no experience. I would assume that the block should > be cast and then cut to the right shape. I was wondering what tools I > would need to buy to be able to build most of the engine (excluding > valves, pistons, spings). The engine is intended to be fitted with a > hydraulic system to activate the valves ('cam' timing is then > infinitely adjustable), and a few other tricks I have up my sleeve. I > was hoping that someone could point me in the direction of where to get > information on how to shape the metal, and what tools I need. ANY help > would be greatly appreciated (yes, I do know I'm biting off more than I > can chew, but I want to learn). TIA > > Andy > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Face Plate question? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 03:44:53 GMT -------- A woodworking lathe perhaps? teenut RStolz5833 wrote: > > In the Atals parts I bought, there was a faceplate that has a 7/8" arbor hole > with 14 TPI. Anyone have a clue as to what this fits? > > Thank You > Rick ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: japanes, swindler.?Ö“¡‚Ü‚³‚«?A‚ð From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 03:48:20 GMT -------- Good Lord..he couldn't have voiced it more clearly (or louder, for that matter)!! You deff or sump'n? teenut Sfc149 wrote: > > >ƒQƒC‚Ì“ú–{?l?¼‹\Žt?A?Ö“¡?³Ž÷?A‚ð‘{‚µ‚Ä‚¢‚Ü‚·?B?º˜a41”N4ŒŽ‚Q‚S“ú?¶‚Ü‚ê33?Î?A?g > >’·167ƒZƒ“ƒ`57ƒLƒ?ˆÊ‚̃QƒC‚Ì?¼‹\Žt‚Å‚·?B‘S?‘‚Ì”hŒ­‰ïŽÐ‚ð“]?X‚Æ‚µ‚Ä?A‘å?ã?A’·–ì > >Œ§‚Å‘½Šz‚Ì?¼‹\‚ð‚µ‚ÄŒ»?Ý“¦‚°‚Ä‚¢‚é?Bˆ«Ž¿”Ú—ò‚È’j‚Å‚·?A“Œ‹ž“s?o?g‚Å?AŽÀ‰Æ‚Í?é > > Uh, could you be a little more clear? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Bearings on ebay From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 03:56:40 GMT -------- KYK Bearings!! These Japanese are going a bit overboard with the High Tech! I'll stick to plain bearings with good 'ole KYK Jelly for lube..Some times an old guy needs all the friction he can get!! 8^o teenut raweich@my-deja.com wrote: > > I put some ball bearings on ebay. See > > http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=266235688 > > I layed them on the scanner and they are shiney but look dull. I don't > know why they did that. My boys foil Pokemon cards do the same thing. > > Richard W. > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Burke knee mill From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 04:01:13 GMT -------- If you give me the name and address of the advertiser I will drive up from Atlanta to Canada and check it out for you! I PROMISE I will call you if it is no good!! ;^) teenut Alan Rothenbush wrote: > > There is an ad for a > > MILLING mach, Burke small horiz knee mill w vert head, pedestal, > table 3.75"x16" sgl slot, tbl pwr feed, 1/2HP, 1" arbor, #9 B&S taper, > 1950's, comp, some acc, nice $995 negot. > > that is not too far a driving distance away. While I have just > retrofitted my Shoptask to CNC, a small knee mill is very > attractive. ( That's Canadian dollars ) > > Anyone know anything about this item ? > > Thanks in advance. > > Alan > > -- > > Alan Rothenbush | The Spartans do not ask the number of the > Academic Computing Services | enemy, only where they are. > Simon Fraser University | > Burnaby, B.C., Canada | Agix of Sparta ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Why Not to BY Cheap Imports! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 04:04:06 GMT -------- THAT is called Customer Relations!! (I wonder if they would put 'ole Al Babin through one of their boot camps?) teenut RStolz5833 wrote: > > Boy was I supprized. Idon't know how many remember my post on Witches brew. But > I just received this email today. > > << Date: 2/21/2000 3:12:54 PM Central Standard Time > From: srobinson@starrett.com (Scott Robinson) > To: rstolz5833@aol.com ('rstolz5833@aol.com>') > Date: 2/21/2000 3:12:54 PM Central Standard Time > > Recently found your note on the web concerning your problem with missing > knobs on your calipers. IF you Email me with the particulars I might be able > to send you the needed replacements to get them back in service. > Regards Scott Robinson tech support group>>> > > That is the reason america is still the best, when you have companys like this > that care enough about there products, and services, to monitor this NG to find > out how things are going. And stand in back of them. > > Rick > In-Country Sharpening ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Mill as a drill press? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 04:06:32 GMT -------- You could always drill two holes at once. Maybe even two holes in the same piece, if space is THAT tight!! 8^) teenut George Glines wrote: > > Here's the reverse of the typical question. > > I have a full sized knee mill but the usual limited garage space. Do I > need/want a drill press? I do all my drilling on the mill now. What would > the advantages of a drill press be over a mill? > > Thanks, > > George ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Buying a vise From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 04:25:27 GMT -------- Hmm!! The vise is one of the most used and versatile tools in your shop..not something to skimp on. I STRONGLY suggest you "make do" just a little bit longer, save up a bit more...and go buy a first class vice. I got my last 5" Record (I have three!!), on sale, for 49.99 at MSC. Replace the serrated jaws with smooth ground ones, made from quenched and tempered 01 steel..and you have a remarkeably good vise that will last a lifetime! If you REALLY want to "spring"..Go for a Starrett or a Wilton..they ARE worth the difference! teenut Justin Headley wrote: > > I'd like to buy a vise, a good one, not the crappy one i have now. > I need one that's 100% > bolted-down-to-the-table-which-is-bolted-down-to-the-floor so it won't > move at all, since i've had problems with vises moving and falling off > at inconvienant times. I checked harbor frieght, and it seems like they > have pretty good prices. 30 dollars for a 5 inch with an anvil > here' what i want > http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/taf/Displayitem.taf?itemnumber=3795&_UserReference=A3A10C38FF32605D38B1C542 > > it looks good to me, i like the anvil since i need a small anvil > sometimes. > But then i realized that it weights 45 pounds and is gonna cost a > helluva lot to ship, so should i just go get one at sears? > > -- > When that lawn mower cuts off your feet, don't come running to me. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Turning cylinders? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 04:31:04 GMT -------- Ok Albrecht! Quit fooling around..This is a Troll! Right? Or is it you Fitch? Jim? Gary? Tom Powers? Fess up..Who ever you are! teenut Sam wrote: > > Hello, > > Please excuse my ignorance, but I have a question about milling > machines. > > I am considering buying a milling maching to produce various widgets and > things for all the hobbies and projects I seem to get involved with. > > Of the different types of milling machines that I have seen so far, they all > have a moveable (x-y axis?) for the bed, and the cutting head/motor above. > > My question is: how would one machine a cylinder shaped object? Wouldn't > the workpiece have to be turning on a lathe? How does one turn down part of > a cylinder on a machine that has a flat bed? > > Any enlightenment you can provide will be appreciated. . . > > Thanks, > > Mike ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: drilling sheet metal From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 04:49:15 GMT -------- Ah yes! Snow in Georgia..we DO get it from time to time and I wouldn't miss THAT experience for a gold clock and a pension!! Biggest hoot since Fred Karno's Army..Kinda like the Keystone Kops and a Chinese Fire Drill mixed up with "The Great Locomotive Chase"!! Haven't laughed so much since the hogs ate muh Baby Sister!! If you saw a snow plow in Atlanta it musta bin hijacked by a bunch a Cracker Rednecks from north of the Mason Dixon Line..I don't think Tennessee has one either...Maybe 'Bama..They're getting kinda uppity nowadays..(Roll Tide!!) tee-y'all-nut Gerald Miller wrote: > > Yeah but you were living in the coldest city in the country, least it was > when I lived in Kingston. In Feb.'96 while southbound on I75 I saw the total > snow clearing fleet of the state of Georgia - two road graders and, believe > it or not, a snowplough. Mind you, it may have been hijacked from Tennessee. > :-)} > > -- > > Gerry > London, Canada > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote in message > news:OFms4.2119$ps1.132768@news1.rdc1.ga.home.com... > > And here in Atlanta, the buds are on the trees and I haven't YET had to > put the > > roof up on the Jag because of the cold! (and only for PARKING in the > rain!!) > > > > I don't DO snow anymore! Not even on Christmas cards!!! > > > > teenut (Who finally got his bones warmed through, nine years after a > twelve year > > ordeal in Canabrrrr!) > > > > Gerald Miller wrote: > > > > > > Then if you come south to Canada, we have maybe 12 inches on the ground > and > > > going fast. :-)} > > > > > > -- > > > > > > Gerry > > > London, Canada > > > > > > Jim Kovar wrote in message > > > news:ycbs4.6265$JQ.364084@monger.newsread.com... > > > > > > > > "Fitch R. Williams" wrote in message > > > > news:v831bso58331tnc0b1ko7pmtlidg3ponka@4ax.com... > > > > > "Jim Kovar" wrote: > > > > > > > > > > >Jim Kovar > > > > > > Iron Mountain, Mi > > > > > > > > > > As an aside Jim, > > > > > > > > > > How deep is the snow? > > > > > > > > > > Fitch > > > > > In So. Cal. > > > > > > > > Hi, Fitch.. > > > > > > > > Not much snow this year, level ground maybe 30" at the most. > Got > > > > some drifts around the house 4 or 5 feet, though. > > > > Still plenty for the sled dog races and the world cup ski jump next > > > > weekend. > > > > > > > > Jim Kovar > > > > Iron Mountain, Mi > > > > > > > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT-British Gun Laws Update From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 04:56:50 GMT -------- I WONDERED when that would turn up again. I sold it cheap to a geezer in a Pub, after it failed to go off at the Inauguration!! Anyone got a handle on some cheap fertilizer? teenut AZOTIC wrote: > > >I gotta hurry up and finish my 9.2" Howitzer! > > > >teenut > > Check out this one on ebay > > 105KT ex-USSR Tactical Nuclear Device > Item #266549991 > > Best Regards > Tom. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Buying a vise From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 05:06:19 GMT -------- The Records I buy ARE steel!! Why on earth would you put a cheater bar on a bench vice? It's not an arbor press y'know. teenut Clark Magnuson wrote: > > I bought a 6" Record at Eagle. I put a cheater bar on it and broke it. I > bought a 6" from Costco for $40 and I have not been able to break it > with a cheater bar using it as a barrel vice and bending bolts. > > I would really like to get a 5 or 6" steel vice and kiss these cast iron > vices good-bye. But I haven't been abel to find one used. > Clark ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Forge From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 22 Feb 2000 05:12:45 GMT -------- Yup! Coffee can, lined with ceramic blanket with a hole in the side for a mapp gas "Swirl Torch". I can forge-weld 1/2" bar with mine! Scale it up a bit, to maybe 12" o/d (A popcorn can) and a blown burner made from pipe fittings and you can do some SERIOUS forging. The whole thing shouldn't cost more than twenty bucks if you go first class! Take a look at Ron Riel's web page..a search will turn it up. teenut Ben wrote: > > Is there any way to cheaply build a small propane forge? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 350 Rigby From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 03:28:08 GMT -------- 350 Rigby Rimless Magnum has a base diameter of .519" Rim of .525" Case length 2.75" O'all length of 3.60". Bullet diameter is .358"..but this was an early high speed round using a bullet of only 225 grains..said to be similar in performance to the old .35 Welen. This is a 375 HH Magnum length cartridge..you would be REALLY pushing it to squeeze it into a standard length 98 action. Hardly worth the time and effort! Bertram Brass has come under a bit of a cloud..softness and other QC problems. They are said to be fixing this in a HURRY, but I wouldn't want to push the brass with "optimistic" loadings. There are better cartridges for a .358 barrel! teenut ULAV8R wrote: > > Tried direct to teenut but message was returned because of unknown > recipient. So here it is for the group. Midway sells 350 Rigby brass > made by Bertram of Aus. What is the head diameter, case length and > approximate capacity? Is it suitable to use with .358 barrel on a M98 > action? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Proper cutoff proceedure?? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 03:38:52 GMT -------- Peter Drumm wrote: > > In message <88ru4202nm1@news2.newsguy.com> - "Marshall Pharoah" > writes: > :-> > :->Using the tailstock when using the cutoff tool is a big no-no. It can cause a pinch and seriously > Oh come on now! I do it all the time, and have done it for years, > without any problem. The trick is to set the center so it just touches > the work, putting pressure on it is a no-no. Me too! I wouldn't try it with a really thin, flexible parting tool..but on the 3/32" "Eclipse" type I normally use, I have parted off up to 3" diameter..using GENTLE tailstock support..without any difficulties. All that happens, as the cutter breaks through, is that the cut-off bit sags against the cutter, slightly, and I stop the spindle. No fuss, no drama!! I can't remember the last time I broke a parting tool!! 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Blanks in automatic pistols in movies From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 03:48:21 GMT -------- Known as "Chargers" in British parlance. teenut Jack Erbes wrote: and stripper clips package 5 to 10 rounds and are > used to refill magazines (either on or off the weapon). > > -- > Jack in Sonoma, CA, USA (jack@vom.com) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: drilling sheet metal From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 03:57:27 GMT -------- I didn't like to say John!! Thanks for Lunch, Met with Gerry yesterday..took him to "The Vinings Inn" for lunch, and gave David a big fat check..First for your New Company (I got invoice # 1) 8^) PS Tell the "Lister's" I really am a NICE guy when you get to meet me..I don't bite...and I only have one head!! Call me..The Milky Bars are on me this time! tee John Miller wrote: > > 'Scuse me, but I just gotta chime in and confirm that. I met Robert at his > shop a couple of weeks ago on a sunny but brisk morning, and the Jag's top > was down. My Miata's top was up. I felt a little ashamed. > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote in message > news:OFms4.2119$ps1.132768@news1.rdc1.ga.home.com... > > And here in Atlanta, the buds are on the trees and I haven't YET had to > put the > > roof up on the Jag because of the cold! (and only for PARKING in the > rain!!) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Spousal Abuse and Cast Iron Woes. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 04:02:51 GMT -------- My wife knows what it means to me..She knows I need a hobby and if it isn't my shop it will be Cheap Booze and Loose Wimin!! teenut Mark wrote: > > Boris... this is a difficult one. My wife kind of had the same opinions > about my shop... (that dirty greasy place with all the smelly tools). No > matter how clean I kept it it was never enough. Finally things reached a > crisis point. I showed her two articles.... one about a fellow that retired > from running a business (like me) and proceeded to take charge of the > household and run it too... the divorce was not long in coming. The other > was about a fellow that retired, had not much to do, and just died a few > weeks later. > > A few gentle words about how much these activities meant to me made quite a > bit of difference. I also have encouraged her to pursue her own interests, > as well. > > You sound like you are doing a better job than most keeping the shop clean. > > Regards, Mark > > boris beizer wrote in message > > >Okay, I finished the big face plate and now I'm trying to avoid the divorce > >lawyers. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Nudie needs help.. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 04:15:16 GMT -------- I forgot to mention the Canadian Mosquitos when listing the things that sent me South!! Steve isn't kidding..Those suckers have proboscii (???) a good half to 3/4" long and will nail you right through the back pocket of your jeans..Billfold and all!! Savage bastards they are..!! Some will cause almost instant septicaemia..I was bitten on a knuckle once, and three hours later, was in hospital ER, having the stainless band of my wrist watch sheared off, in deep shock, and being pumped full of saline, antibiotics, anti-tet. and cortisone!! Gimme snakes and 'gators anytime! teenut Steve Rayner wrote: > > Perhaps a wet shop apron, known to stop speeding bullets, and armour > piercing arrows. Mosquitos will still drill through it though. > > -- > > I'm a Canadian eh! Steve. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT-British Gun Laws Update From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 04:22:47 GMT -------- I would simply add Jim..That it is the Second Amendment that ensures the protection of the First Amendment! Anyone who has studied History, or the Human Psche, that says it isn't so, is being thoroughly dishonest! teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article <38b30210.830861725@news.usit.net>, > jflangan@usit.net wrote: > > On Tue, 22 Feb 2000 18:28:45 GMT, mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > > > >In article <38B2B299.57A6E18D@diku.dk>, > > > Panther wrote: > > > > > >> Guns are holding your country back, no doubt. > > > > > >Too bad you were not there to straighten out the framers of > > >the US constitution with your ideas. I'm sure we could all > > >be living in a much better world right now if they had the > > >amazing insight that you are blessed with. > > > > HA! I think he forgets it's guns that helped allow this country to > > be..... Guns that were owned by an armed populance, not the > > government. > > My wife and I had a protracted discussion about this a month or so > ago. It was sparked by a copy of a notice that the Germans put up > in occupied territory (the language was slavic and german) basically > saying turn in your guns or die. > > After long discussion, it became pretty clear that there > was a very large faction that would *not* ratify the constitution > unless the federal powers were kept in tight check. Her point > was that the *first* change they wanted had to do with freedom of > speech. To which I replied, well, then the next most important > thing was private gun ownership. > > Her comment then was "what made you think they were put down in > order of importance!!" > > Seems pretty obvious that states at that time felt a strong federal > government was a big, big threat to their existence. They were > specifically afraid that the feds would come in and abolish the state > militia, and state militias were powered by privately owned guns. > > Which is why private gun ownership is right there in the second > amendment. It did not have to do with owning guns for hunting food, > it did not have to do with target shooting. The gist of that > amendment is that *if* the federal government (or other states) > attempts to impress its will and ideas on another state, that state > should have the arms available to reject those ideas. By shooting > at and killing those who would try to force those ideas on them, if > need be. > > The historical background is that the states had just finished up > a shooting war with one king. For all they knew, King George > the second was ready to take the throne. > > Obviously things have changed a bit since then. The biggest > change is probably the degree to which power has been further > concentrated in the federal goverment. The individual's access > to federal courts has been severely eroded, and many of the laws > which (by the constitution) should be made and enforced by the > states are now the province of the federal government. > > So saying that the changes that have occured over time render the > spirit of the 2nd amendment obsolete are not really on point. Nor > is the exact wording in doubt at all. The second amendment is > about the prevention of tyranny. And given the overall level > of personal freedoms and protections in the US at present, I would > say it works pretty well. [1] > > Jim > > [1] in respect to my wife the history/law specialist, I feel > bound to emphasize that the first amendment rights are just > as important, as the right to assembly, speech, and press are > just as vital a cornerstone - and perhaps more so. > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Enco horizonal verticle rotary table any good? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 04:33:25 GMT -------- UPS LOST my 12" Troyke table. The guy delivered a re-sealed package, with a UPS "Heavy Package" sticker and THEIR weight of 175 lbs printed on it..and handed it to me with ONE HAND!! Hello-o? teenut Daniel H Lauring wrote: > > Ahhhh, now I read this. I bought one based on some very positive comments > on this newsgroup about this very "deal" a month ago. > > What had me worried, was that Enco refused to ship it UPS. They said UPS > breaks to many of them. I was thinking, "How the hell can they break a > rotary table if it is built properly....drive over it with a truck????" > > Now I'm worried. > > -- > Daniel Lauring > http://www.geocities.com/Hollywood/Bungalow/9795/ > Digital Camera and Video Camera tidbits > . > > John Flanagan wrote in message <38b2121b.769432855@news.usit.net>... > >On Mon, 21 Feb 2000 18:35:20 -0500, "Hugh Strong" > > wrote: > > > >>Phase II is known for having higher tolerances than the > >>other imports. What makes you so sure that you would be > >>getting a quality table if you got the one in the picture? > >>Leaking oil aside, I think this is a pretty good deal. > > > >The specs for the one in the photo is about the same as I remember but > >it is better IMO. The PII has little wimpy locking levers, one hit to > >them should about do them in, etc. I researched what was available > >and decided the one in the photo was better overall, but more > >expensive by about $100. When I saw the incorrect ad for it I called > >to make sure it was in fact the one being sold, which I was assured it > >was. When I got it it was the PII which I decided against! Made me a > >little mad, it did. > > > >I agree it's still a good deal, I like the PII tailstock better but > >it's a HORSE and barely leaves any room for the workpiece on my little > >mill table. If I hadn't been strapped for cash and hadn't been > >needing to use it I would have sent it back, but "oh well, it was good > >enough." :^) > > > >If anyone does order it, I'd call enco back and ask for 10% off for > >sending a RT other than the one that was pictured. > > > >John > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Turning cylinders? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 05:14:28 GMT -------- Please don't take offence Sam..It was just the kind of in-fun remark the regulars chuck at each other around here. Kinda brightens the day and lightens the list! teenut Sam wrote: > > Nope, not a troll. . .I just don't know anything about milling machines. > (I *did* ask y'all to excuse my ignorance :^) > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> > wrote in message ... > >Ok Albrecht! Quit fooling around..This is a Troll! Right? > > > >Or is it you Fitch? > > > >Jim? Gary? Tom Powers? > > > >Fess up..Who ever you are! > > > >teenut > > > >Sam wrote: > >> > >> Hello, > >> > >> Please excuse my ignorance, but I have a question about milling > >> machines. > >> > >> I am considering buying a milling maching to produce various widgets and > >> things for all the hobbies and projects I seem to get involved with. > >> > >> Of the different types of milling machines that I have seen so far, they > all > >> have a moveable (x-y axis?) for the bed, and the cutting head/motor > above. > >> > >> My question is: how would one machine a cylinder shaped object? Wouldn't > >> the workpiece have to be turning on a lathe? How does one turn down part > of > >> a cylinder on a machine that has a flat bed? > >> > >> Any enlightenment you can provide will be appreciated. . . > >> > >> Thanks, > >> > >> Mike ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: SouthBend dial retrofit? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 05:23:31 GMT -------- Not that I am aware of..but George H Thomas covered it beautifully in "Model Engineer" many years ago. It is fully covered in his book "The Model Engineers Workshop Manual" available from Tee Publishing. I used his design of center thumbwheel lock for the graduated drum when I converted my Maximat Super II to take a 100 division dial made by Sherline, to fit the Bridgeport knee lift screw. Works beautifully and is a joy to use!! teenut Edward Haas wrote: > > --While we're on the subject, is anything similar available for > the Myford Super 7 series lathes?? > > -- > "Steamboat Ed" Haas : Just another fart in > Watch link rot in action! : the Elevator of Life... > http://www.nmpproducts.com > ---Decks a-wash in a sea of words--- ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Retrofit feed screw dials From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 05:36:04 GMT -------- I will shortly be installing a new Fadal 4 axis CNC Machining Center and am looking for "HouseProducts" to keep it cutting metal during slack periods. One of my long-time wishes has been for a source of high quality, after market dials for machine tools. Sherline makes a beatiful set of engraved, black anodised dials, for the Bridgeport and I am considering doing the same thing for a variety of popular lathes and mills..even a custom service...you turn and anodise (there is a minimum charge locally of $65.00) and I will CNC engrave it with divisions and numbers. Alternatively..and my preference over the VERY nice Sherline units, is to produce white, hard, plastic rings of varied diameters with black enamel filled divisions, that could be glued onto your old thimbles after turning them down. This is the type of thimble used by Harding and is a delight to use. Comments? teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: îåïâèïäéí ëÒÕÇ 120 , 130 , 150 óÔÁÌØ 15è , 20è , 18èçô ÔÅÌ. ( 0482) 600-399 , 288-212 , 343-157 E-mail : kraft@paco.net From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 05:42:33 GMT -------- Piss off JV..We heard you the first time!! teenut JV Kraft wrote: > > îåïâèïäéí ëÒÕÇ 120 , 130 , 150 óÔÁÌØ 15è , 20è , 18èçô ÔÅÌ. > (0482) 600-399 , 288-212 , 343-157 E-mail : kraft@paco.net ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Mix up in ordering bearing stock From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 06:31:17 GMT -------- You'd need to be VERY specific to get other than hollow bronze bas from a bearing supplier! Just consider yourself luck it didn't come with a 4 1/2" O/d x 5" bore..you would really have felt cheated then!! The supplier SHOULD take it back..if only with a hefty re-stocking charge. That is a very re-saleble chunk. Have a word with the manager or owner. teenut Pete & Sheri wrote: > > FWIW, I just ordered a piece of bronze bearing material. I needed > a rectangular bar, 2 1/2" long, 4 1/2" wide and 5" high. It cost me > $71 plus shipping. > What I got was a 5" long piece of cylindrical stock, with a 4 1/2" > OD and a 2 1/2" ID! > It never occurred to me that by saying "2 1/2 X 4 1/2 X 5" over the > phone that I would get wht I got! It doesn't sound as though the > company is going to accept it back even though I think I did the right > thing in the way I ordered it. I have ordered a lot of stock over the > years from many sources and never had this problem before. > > I guess the problem is that when specifying "bronze" bearing material", > the order takers automatically go the this "tubular" stuff. I had > tried to find the stock I wanted in my MSC catalog, but could only find > that tubular stuff there. That's why I went to a local (St. Paul, MN) > supply company to get what I needed. > > So, this is just a "word to the wise"; I hope it might help someone else > to avoid this same mistake. > > Pete Stanaitis ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Bet you didn't know this? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 06:44:36 GMT -------- Close Jack..but no cigar!! The actual TRUE story is that the French threatened to cut of the first TWO fingers of any capture archer. The Licencious Soldiery, responded by raising those TWO fingers in a reversed "V" for Victory sign..the classic British equivalent of "Flipping the Bird" I am not sure about the "Pluck Yew" part of it..more likely than not, they used the Olde English term "F**K YOU" right from the get-go!! That word, of Anglo-Saxon origin, has been in the English language a lot longer than any of the ones in more polite usage! Those were mainly an introduction by the prudish Victorians teenut Jack Erbes wrote: > > Here is one for the Anglophiles and Archers, we covered a lot of ground > on those topics lately and I can't believe that this was not brought > out. > > /'_/) > ,/_ / > / / > /'_'/' '/'__'/','/' > /'/ / / / /_\ > ('( ' ' _ \ > \ | > \ ' / > '\' \ _./' > \ \ > \ \ > > Before the Battle of Agincourt in 1415, the French, anticipating victory > over the English, proposed to cut off the middle finger of all captured > English soldiers. > > Without the middle finger it would be impossible to draw the renowned > English longbow and therefore be incapable of fighting in the future. > > This famous weapon was made of the native English Yew tree, and the act > of drawing the longbow was known as "plucking the yew" (or "pluck yew"). > > Much to the bewilderment of the French, the English won a major upset > and began mocking the French by waving their middle fingers at the > defeated French, saying, "See, we can still pluck yew! "PLUCK YEW!" > > Since 'pluck yew' is rather difficult to say, the difficult consonant > cluster at the beginning has gradually changed to a labiodental > fricative 'F', and thus the words often used in conjunction with the > one-finger-salute are mistakenly thought to have something to do with an > intimate encounter. > > It is also because of the pheasant feathers on the arrows used w/ the > longbow that the symbolic gesture is known as "giving the bird". > > And yew thought yew knew everything. > > This is credible enough, is there any chance it is true? > > -- > Jack in Sonoma, CA, USA (jack@vom.com) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Bet you didn't know this? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 07:19:29 GMT -------- By the way..This gesture was used BEFORE battles..to provoke the French to charge into a deadly killing ground. Five thousand archers x 18 arrows per minute = wholesale slaughter not seen untill the Maxim gun came along. And English arrows were fletched with "Grey Goose"..more usually, "Domestic White Goose" or Swan feathers...Pheasant feathers are far too small and soft. the Battle Shaft fletch was six to seven inches long, 3/4" high, and usually, cropped in a long, straight, triangular shield shape..though occasionally the "hogsback" shape was used for broad heads. They would be glued on with hide or better, rabbit skin glue, to a glue sized shaftment, and then spiral bound for insurance against damp, with a (traditionally red) linen thread or a single strand of horse hair. The nock end of the shaft would be sawed down, with the grain, about 1 1/4" and a sliver of horn glued in for reinforcement against the tremendous thrust of the bowstring. The nock would then be cut at right angles to the reinforcement. Heads were a simple push fit onto the tapered foot of the shaft and not pinned in place..this served several purposes. Firstly, the head could be chosen and issued just before the battle and fitted or changed in seconds to suit the target. Bodkins for mail or armour at shorter ranges, broad heads or forked "rippers" at longer distance against horses..the objective being to cause pain, blood, disruption and terror among the horses..much more effective than actually killing the horse or rider! Secondly the number of arrows required to be carried in train was reduced if the heads were changeable..and the headless arrows took up less space it the bagage. Remember that an army on the march would cary upwards of a million arrows with it!! Thirdly, an attempt by the wounded enemy to remove the arrow, would leave the head behind to fester. The enemy could not recover arrows and fire them back. And lastly..during a respite in a long battle, arrow parties would be sent out to recover shafts from bodies and the ground. The bare shafts needed only to have a new head twisted into place before being fired again. Medieval Logistics!! The Shaft would be 7/16" to 1/2" diameter x 32 1/2" long (the old "Clothyard") made of ash and weighing, with a 3" bodkin point, between 800 and 1000 grains. Packed a hell of a wallop from a 100lb plus Yew Warbow!! teenut Robert Bastow wrote: > > Close Jack..but no cigar!! > > The actual TRUE story is that the French threatened to cut of the first TWO > fingers of any capture archer. > > The Licencious Soldiery, responded by raising those TWO fingers in a reversed > "V" for Victory sign..the classic British equivalent of "Flipping the Bird" > > I am not sure about the "Pluck Yew" part of it..more likely than not, they used > the Olde English term "F**K YOU" right from the get-go!! That word, of > Anglo-Saxon origin, has been in the English language a lot longer than any of > the ones in more polite usage! Those were mainly an introduction by the prudish > Victorians > > teenut > > Jack Erbes wrote: > > > > Here is one for the Anglophiles and Archers, we covered a lot of ground > > on those topics lately and I can't believe that this was not brought > > out. > > > > /'_/) > > ,/_ / > > / / > > /'_'/' '/'__'/','/' > > /'/ / / / /_\ > > ('( ' ' _ \ > > \ | > > \ ' / > > '\' \ _./' > > \ \ > > \ \ > > > > Before the Battle of Agincourt in 1415, the French, anticipating victory > > over the English, proposed to cut off the middle finger of all captured > > English soldiers. > > > > Without the middle finger it would be impossible to draw the renowned > > English longbow and therefore be incapable of fighting in the future. > > > > This famous weapon was made of the native English Yew tree, and the act > > of drawing the longbow was known as "plucking the yew" (or "pluck yew"). > > > > Much to the bewilderment of the French, the English won a major upset > > and began mocking the French by waving their middle fingers at the > > defeated French, saying, "See, we can still pluck yew! "PLUCK YEW!" > > > > Since 'pluck yew' is rather difficult to say, the difficult consonant > > cluster at the beginning has gradually changed to a labiodental > > fricative 'F', and thus the words often used in conjunction with the > > one-finger-salute are mistakenly thought to have something to do with an > > intimate encounter. > > > > It is also because of the pheasant feathers on the arrows used w/ the > > longbow that the symbolic gesture is known as "giving the bird". > > > > And yew thought yew knew everything. > > > > This is credible enough, is there any chance it is true? > > > > -- > > Jack in Sonoma, CA, USA (jack@vom.com) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 350 Rigby From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 07:29:21 GMT -------- Go with the 9x57 and rent a reamer..excellent, well balanced and powerful round. Stay away from the 284 case..IIRC it is a belted case..that only takes up space in the mag and makes them difficult and noisy to feed (More clicks than a tramway crossing!!) The belt serves NO useful purpose on a bottlenecked case except that of hype by marketing departments!! teenut ULAV8R wrote: > > Have considered .358 Winchester, 9 x 57, 35/284. Maybe the 9 x 57 with > a 30 degree shoulder would be nice. It doesn't really need to surpass > the .35 Whelen, but I do want to keep the overall length less than that. > > Especially if I go with a wildcat, I intend to try making a half reamer > unless I manage to acquire a mill before fitting the barrel. There will > be quite a bit of metalworking in this project. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT-British Gun Laws Update From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 07:52:11 GMT -------- Sorry to say it Jim, but her conviction rests on an unrealistic "Rose-tinted" view point of the "reasonable" nature of human beings. It is only fear of instant retribution that prevents a large part of the Human Race from simply taking from others anything they don't want them to have. That includes money, property, food, shelter, sexual "favors", freedom or "Rights" I never argue with a made up mind..it is pointless. However I hope the truth is never brought home to her in the forcible manner that it would take to do so. It is of no major concern Jim, so long as she has people like you and I to "watch her back"..the world can afford to be amused and bemused by a few "dippy" people. teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article , > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > > I would simply add Jim..That it is the Second Amendment that ensures > > the protection of the First Amendment! > > It is pretty clear that they all work together - and that each > amendment, and the constitution itself, provide remarkable > protection for US citizens. My dear wife, being an historian and > having graduated from law school, tends to think that the first > amendment could probably stand on its own, but that the second > would not fare well without the first. > > Feel free to disagree with her - at your own risk! > > http://www.minuend.com/writers/nora.htm > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Buying a vise From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 08:07:49 GMT -------- Ahh! I made a proper barrel vise right from the get-go..works like a charm, even on US Enfield barrels! 8^) teenut Clark Magnuson wrote: > > I used a cheater bar because the handle was getting bent from me hitting > it with a sledge hammer. > > I later reduced the force needed for traction on removing old rusty > barrels on Mausers by coating two pieces of oak with rosin for a lining > inside the jaws. teenut asked..... > > Why on earth would you put a cheater bar on a bench vice? It's not an arbor > > press y'know. > > > > teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How to power this old lathe... From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 08:11:31 GMT -------- The noise level of a big hydraulic motor will drive you nuts!! teenut Pete & Sheri wrote: > > I have an almost identical problem to solve. It's on a 19" swing > Foster turret lathe. I have been thinking of driving it with a > hydraulic motor. I'd gear the motor down to the proper speed, then > drive the largest headstock sheave with a flat belt. This would give > me more or less infinite speed control. Of course, I also have the > back gears to get it going even slower. > I know this won't be cheap, but all the other alternatives are either > expensive, too, or complex. > > Pete Stanaitis > ------------------- > Dan Caster wrote: > > This is an old 'plain' lathe. The power input is meant to come from a 2" > > > leather belt. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: òåáìéúõåí íåôáììïðòïëáô , ôòõâù ÓÍ. ÐÉÓØÍÏ ( 0482) 600-399 , 343-157 From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 08:27:26 GMT -------- Ooops..Now I REALLY set him off!! And a very good òåáìéúõåí íåôáììïðòïëáô , ôòõâù.... to you too!! teenut JV Kraft wrote: > > ðòáêó-ìéóô æéòíá "ëòáæô" ÓÔÒ.1 > ôÅÌ. (0482) 343-157 , 600-399 , 288-212 . > 23.02.00 > îÁÉÍÅÎÏ×ÁÎÉÅ òÁÚÍÅÒ íÁÒËÁ ÓÔÁÌÉ ãÅÎÁ ÇÒÎ > ðÒÉÍÅÞ. > ôòõâá üìåëôòïó÷áòîáñ ðòñíïûï÷îáñ > > > ôÒÕÂÁ ÎÅËÏÎÄÉÃÉÑ äÕ = 25 > îäì çïóô 3262-75 850 > ôÒÕÂÁ Ü/Ó äÕ = 20 > 4Í çïóô 3262-75 1750 > ôÒÕÂÁ Ü/Ó äÕ = 25 6Í çïóô 3262-75 1750 > ôÒÕÂÁ Ü/Ó äÕ = 32 > 5-8Í çïóô 3262-75 1750 > ôÒÕÂÁ Ü/Ó äÕ = 40 > 4Í 8Í çïóô 3262-75 1750 > ôÒÕÂÁ Ü/Ó äÕ = 50 > 7,5 Í çïóô 3262-75 1750 > ôÒÕÂÁ Ü/Ó ä = 76 > 10 Í çïóô 3262-75 1700 > ôÒÕÂÁ Ü/Ó ä = 219è8 > 10 Í çïóô 3262-75 1650 > ôòõâá ãåìøîïôñîõôáñ > ôÒÕÂÁ Ã/Ô ä= 25è2,5 > 6Í çïóô 8734 1700 > ôÒÕÂÁ Ã/Ô ä= 34è2 > 6Í çïóô 8734 1700 > ôÒÕÂÁ Ã/Ô ä= 57è4 10Í çïóô 8732 1700 > ôÒÕÂÁ Ã/Ô ä= 89è4,5 > 11Í çïóô 8732 1650 > ôÒÕÂÁ Ã/Ô ä= 102È6 çïóô 8732 1650 > ôÒÕÂÁ Ã/Ô ä= 108è4 > çïóô 8732 1750 > û÷åììåò > û×ÅÌÌÅÒ º 8 5 - 9 Í 3 ÐÓ 1230 > û×ÅÌÌÅÒ º 10 5 - 9 Í 3 ÐÓ 1230 > û×ÅÌÌÅÒ º 12 6-12Í 3 ÐÓ 1250 > û×ÅÌÌÅÒ º 14 11Í 3ÐÓ 1250 > û×ÅÌÌÅÒ º 20 11Í 3 ÐÓ 1250 > õçïìïë > õÇÏÌÏË 25È25È4 5,7Í 3 ÐÓ 1300 > õÇÏÌÏË 35È35È5 7-9Í 3 ÐÓ 1250 > õÇÏÌÏË 45È45È5 5-9Í 3ÐÓ 1250 > õÇÏÌÏË 50È50È5 8Í 3 ÐÓ 1230 > õÇÏÌÏË 60è60È6 5 - 9 Í 3 ÐÓ 1200 > õÇÏÌÏË 63è63è6 8Í 3 ÐÓ 1200 > õÇÏÌÏË 75È75È7 5-9Í 3 ÐÓ 1200 > õÇÏÌÏË 80è80È8 2-4Í 3 ÐÓ 1200 > õÇÏÌÏË 90È90È9 6 Í 3 ÐÓ 1200 > õÇÏÌÏË 100È100È10 3 ÐÓ 1200 > ðïìïóá > ðÏÌÏÓÁ 30È6 6 Í 1500 > > ðÏÒÅÚËÁ , ÄÏÓÔÁ×ËÁ , ÉÚÇÏÔÏ×ÌÅÎÉÅ ÚÁÇÏÔÏ×ÏË × ÒÁÚÍÅÒ. > > > îáûå óìï÷ï - öåìåúîï ! > õÓÌÕÇÉ ÐÏÓÒÅÄÎÉËÏ× ÏÐÌÁÞÉ×ÁÀÔÓÑ . > > ÓÔÒ.2 > îÁÉÍÅÎÏ×ÁÎÉÅ òÁÚÍ. íÁÒËÁ ÓÔÁÌÉ ãÅÎÁ ÇÒÎ > áòíáôõòá > áÒÍÁÔÕÒÁ á3 d= 8, 14 4-7 Í; 11,7Í 35 çó 950 > áÒÍÁÔÕÒÁ á3 d= 12 îäì > 35 çó 850 > ëòõç > ëÒÕÇ d= 17,24,32,36 3 ÐÓ, ÓÔ. 45 1100 > ë÷áäòáô > ë×ÁÄÒÁÔ 10È10 3,5Í ÓÔ. 20 1700 > ë×ÁÄÒÁÔ 12È12 > 3,5-3,8Í ÓÔ. 20 1700 > ë×ÁÄÒÁÔ 14È14 6 Í 3 ÐÓ 1300 > ë×ÁÄÒÁÔ 16È16 6 Í 3 ÐÓ 1300 > ë×ÁÄÒÁÔ 20È20 6 Í 3 ÐÓ 1250 > óôáìø ôïîëïìéóôï÷áñ > ìÉÓÔ È/Ë 0,7 > 1,0è2,0 08 ËÐ 1750 11ËÇ. > ìÉÓÔ È/Ë 1,0 1,0è2,0 08 ËÐ 1750 16ËÇ > ìÉÓÔ È/Ë 2,0 1,25è2,5 3 ÐÓ 1700 50ËÇ > ìÉÓÔ Ç/Ë 2,6 1,25è2,5 3 ÐÓ 1650 64ËÇ > ìÉÓÔ Ç/Ë 2,7 1,0è2,5 3 ÐÓ 1600 54ËÇ > ìÉÓÔ Ç/Ë 3,0 1,0è2,5 1,23è2,44 3 ÐÓ 1600 62ËÇ É > 71ËÇ > ìÉÓÔ Ç/Ë 3,7 1,25è2,5 3 ÐÓ 1550 90ËÇ > óôáìø ôïìóôïìéóôï÷áñ > ìÉÓÔ Ç/Ë 4,0 1,22è2,45 1,5è6 3 ÐÓ > 1550 94ËÇ > ìÉÓÔ Ç/Ë 6,0 1,0è3,76 1,25è4,0 3 ÐÓ 1500 171ËÇ > É 236ËÇ > ìÉÓÔ Ç/Ë 10,0 1,55è6,0 3 ÐÓ 1250 731ËÇ > ìÉÓÔ Ç/Ë 12,0 2,1è8,0 3 ÐÓ 1250 1,583ÔÎ > ìÉÓÔ Ç/Ë 14,0 1,85è7,5 3 ÐÓ 1250 1,525ÔÎ > üìåëôòïäù > üÌÅËÔÒÏÄÙ ïúó - 4 d=5ÍÍ. . 1Ð - 5 ËÇ. 9,5 > õÓÌÕÇÉ ÐÏÓÒÅÄÎÉËÏ× ÏÐÌÁÞÉ×ÁÀÔÓÑ. > ðÏÒÅÚËÁ , ÄÏÓÔÁ×ËÁ , ÉÚÇÏÔÏ×ÌÅÎÉÅ ÚÁÇÏÔÏ×ÏË × ÒÁÚÍÅÒ. > > îáûå óìï÷ï - öåìåúîï ! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Blanks in automatic pistols in movies From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 08:36:09 GMT -------- The "Clip" for the Lee-Enfield was properly called a "Charger" and was positioned, like that of the Mauser and the Springfield, in slots in the receiver bridge and inside the open bolt. Pushing down with the thumb stripped the cartridges from the charger, into the magazine box where they were retained by the magazine feed lips and the pressure of the follower. Closing the bolt, loaded the first round and ejected the charger from the slots. The Charger of the Lee Enfield, like the "Stripper Clip" of the Mauser or Springfield, was at no time, retained in the magazine box of the rifle. teenut Steve Rayner wrote: > > Later posts have cleared the "Mag" up. However, there was also a simmilar > clip for the Lee Enfield. You could slip it in the top, and reload the > Mag. > > Steve Rayner (ud233@vtn1.victoria.tc.ca) wrote: > : The British Bren Gun, also had the mag on top. > > : Ron Moore (mlogical@swbell.net) wrote: > : : The "mag" was the bullet magazine. Unlike any other rifle, the "mag" was inserted > : : into the top of the action. It held either 5 or 8 shots and when empty, it would be > : : ejected with the last cartridge. Apparently, the shooter in the movie had never > : : fired a Garand before. I guess he thought is was flying apart. > : : Respectfully, > : : Ron Moore > > : : Alan Shinn wrote: > > : : > Ron Moore wrote: > : : > > > : : > > I remember an old war movie with Cliff Roberson. The scene, a Pacific island > : : > > with American troops fighting their way into the jungle. Cliff and another are > : : > > in the foreground chatting while several men shooting Thompsons and M1 Garands > : : > > are behind them. One fellow in the midst with the M1 shoots several times when > : : > > the mag ejects. He looks at the mag, looks at the rifle, looks back at the mag > : : > > and slowly lays the rifle down like it was nitro ready to blow. A real vet. > : : > > Respectfully, > : : > > Ron Moore > : : > > > : : > > "James R. Johnson" wrote: > : : > > > : : > > : : > Please, whats a mag? Sounds -- unpleasant! > : : > -- > : : > Looking forward: > : : > Alan Shinn > : : > > : : > Experience the > : : > beginnings of microscopy. > : : > Make your own replica > : : > of one of Antony van Leeuwenhoek's microscopes. > : : > visit http://www.sirius.com/~alshinn/ > > : -- > > : I'm a Canadian eh! Steve. > : ************************************************************************** > : The FAQ for rec.crafts.metalworking is at: http://w3.uwyo.edu/~metal > : The metalworking drop box is at http://www.metalworking.com > : Indexes for Model Engineer Magazine from 1950 to 1999 are at: > : http://www.groundlevel.demon.co.uk/me_index.html > : ************************************************************************** > : Visit my website at: http://www.victoria.tc.ca/~ud233/homepage.htm > > : ************* Tu ne cede malis, sed contra audentior ito. **************** > : ******************************** - Virgil ******************************** > : ******Yield thou not to adversity, but press on the more bravely.********** > > -- > > I'm a Canadian eh! Steve. > ************************************************************************** > The FAQ for rec.crafts.metalworking is at: http://w3.uwyo.edu/~metal > The metalworking drop box is at http://www.metalworking.com > Indexes for Model Engineer Magazine from 1950 to 1999 are at: > http://www.groundlevel.demon.co.uk/me_index.html > ************************************************************************** > Visit my website at: http://www.victoria.tc.ca/~ud233/homepage.htm > > ************* Tu ne cede malis, sed contra audentior ito. **************** > ******************************** - Virgil ******************************** > ******Yield thou not to adversity, but press on the more bravely.********** ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Spousal Abuse and Cast Iron Woes. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 23 Feb 2000 12:07:42 GMT -------- Have you heard about the Scottish guy that bought his Irish wife a "Gold" ring for Christmas....and it turned green just in time for St. Paddy's Day!! teenut Kevin Carney wrote: > > St Patty's Day ??? > > mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > > > In article , > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > > > My wife knows what it means to me..She knows I need a hobby and if it > > > isn't my shop it will be Cheap Booze and Loose Wimin!! > > > > Ha, Robert. Got ya beat here. I have my shop, and the loose > > woman as well! Plus she comes with a supply of cheap booze. > > Just cannot find a better wife than an Irish one. (now you know > > where the 'mulligan' comes into the picture. You might guess when > > her birthday is, too...) > > > > Jim > > > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: drilling sheet metal From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2000 03:56:14 GMT -------- Express Tool & Die 5390 Oakdale Rd Smyrna GA 30082 404 799 6304 It is close to the junction of I285 and South Cobb Drive. Go one block east of I285, on E Cobb, turn left at first light (on Highland Parkway) First light, turn left on Oakdale. 2/10 mile on RHS. Coffee's always hot and the Folks are Friendly!! If you get there before 7.30 AM, there might even be a few donuts left! teenut David wrote: > > John wrote: > > > I met Robert at his > >shop a couple of weeks ago > > BTW, Tee, where is your shop? > > Dave > > > > > > > It`s not the hallucinations that frighten me..... > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Nudie needs help.. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2000 04:08:55 GMT -------- Yada , yada, yada. They have those tiny little buggers there in Canader too. They call the "NoSeeUms" Then there are Black Flies that, literally, bite a (large) pinhead sized lump out of you..that bleeds like an SOB..before it swells and itches...sometimes for MONTHS before it heals. Then there are the Deer Flies..been known to bring down a straying Russian "Bison" Long Range Bomber!! Those buggers REALLY bite! They have been known to kill weak or young animals, by driving them to exausted distraction. No Gary..I prefer Atlanta..even South Georgia ANYDAY!! teenut Gary Coffman wrote: > > On Wed, 23 Feb 2000 04:15:16 GMT, Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > >I forgot to mention the Canadian Mosquitos when listing the things that sent me > >South!! > > > >Steve isn't kidding..Those suckers have proboscii (???) a good half to 3/4" long > >and will nail you right through the back pocket of your jeans..Billfold and > >all!! > > > >Savage bastards they are..!! Some will cause almost instant septicaemia..I was > >bitten on a knuckle once, and three hours later, was in hospital ER, having the > >stainless band of my wrist watch sheared off, in deep shock, and being pumped > >full of saline, antibiotics, anti-tet. and cortisone!! > > > >Gimme snakes and 'gators anytime! > > You obvously haven't been to *south* Georgia, teenut. > > The classic down there is two mosquitos arguing over > the contents of a compact car that they've just overturned. > One argues to eat them there, the other wants to take them > back to the swamp. The first crushes that argument by > noting that if they take them back to the swamp, the *big* > mosquitos will take their catch away from them. > > (Truth, the actual problem in south Georgia is "see me > nots". These are tiny gnats that swarm you, trying to get > into every orifice of your body. Ghastly things, makes > me want to load up a BT4 with DDT and diesel and fog > the things out of existence.) > > Gary > Gary Coffman KE4ZV | You make it |mail to ke4zv@bellsouth.net > 534 Shannon Way | We break it | > Lawrenceville, GA | Guaranteed | ======== Newsgroups: misc.survivalism,alt.survival,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT-British Gun Laws Update From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2000 04:35:51 GMT -------- Before I left England..Twenty four years ago, I was an avid target shooter, licensed FAC holder, and collector of antique and modern firearms. Even then it was absolutely DEAD easy to buy a non-registered firearm..I owned many, including a 9mm Sten Gun (Full auto, sub-machine gun) up until I left the UK, when I gave it to a friend. I know for a fact he still has it and I could have it, and a ton of ammo in my hands within hours of landing there. Non registered arms have always been rife and easy to get..in any Pub in the UK..none of THEM have been surrendered and the market is flooded with more with every container ship that docks. The Stupid ban of firearms has simply turned a whole sector of previously law abiding Brits into Criminals..and created an international awareness of a ready market for smuggled guns, that organised criminals are only too happy to feed. Besides that, it has made an international laughing stock..NOT of the Politicians..Pols DO that stuff!..But of the once proud and free Brits who let themselve be suckered and blind-sided, into allowing it to happen, by a noisy, self- centered and politically naive, left wing of Hidden-Agenda tree-huggers. You guys richly deserve what you got..and it will only get worse if you don't start to fight baloney with FACTS..Right NOW!! Sorry I can't help you! I crossed and burned my Bridge a long time ago. I am proud of my British Heritage and the wealth of Knowledge, Law, Civilisation, Peace and Freedom it helped bring to this World. But I am finding it increasingly difficult, to feel real proud of what it has been ALLOWED to degenerate into! Sadly, teenut Eric Pinnell wrote: > > Really? So you mean a nutcase can't go to his local criminal and > buy a gun? Betcha it'll happen in a year or two... > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Re-Conditioning Lathe Beds - SB "Turcite FAQ" From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2000 05:09:41 GMT -------- rdanzey@seidata.com wrote: > > One outfit mentioned--Mogoreh--seems to indicate they can do machine > work on the machine in situ, and presumably use some original un-worn > surfaces to generate the 'new' true ways/bearing surfaces. Bob Bastow's > warning about increased error resulting from this approach seems to fly > in the face of that, and since I suspect both positions have their > 'point', I wonder what I'm missing? Two points you are missing.. Firstly, it is ROBERT Bastow..you don't ever want to meet "Bob"!! ;^) Secondly..I AM familiar with outfits that will come and regrind ways on site..They have been around for donkey's years! HOWEVER! There is a world of difference between using un-worn sections of the bed as a REFERENCE, as opposed to using them as a GUIDE. Most competent travelling regrinders I have ever used, (USED!..Not just heard or read about!!) have brought a portable grinder bed with them..accurate slideways on which the grinder actually travels..and is GUIDED..and which are set up true and level with REFERENCE to a few original and unworn spots on the bed being treated. The same technique could be used by the HSM if he had or had acess to a larger machine bed than his own worn one. He could then set up his bed alongside it and, with patient alignment, I have do doubt that a GOOD job of regrinding could be achieved. However..I hold to my original statement..that anyone who imagines they can regrind the badly worn areas of a bed by GUIDING on the LESS worn areas...I kidding himself, and any you who believe it! teenut AKA ROBERT!! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Buying a vise From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2000 05:38:18 GMT -------- VERY Nice!! About as Simple, Powerful and Effective as you can get!! Mine is a simple split block 6" x 6" x 2" with a 2" hole bored through the joint line..to take custom made , turned bushings, I make on the lathe to fit individual barrels. I split the bushings through on one side..and almost through on the other. A sprinkle of rosin and I have never had one slip or mark a barrel. The two halves of the vise a re pulled tight with 3/4" fine thread High tensile bolts on which I milled collared hexagonal heads to fit a large 3/4" drive socket and a cheater bar..Lottsa Ooompfff! I tried several arrangements of receiver wrench..never could get a handle to stay on one for long!! Then I (Literally) hit on my present arrangement.. The wrench is two, custom machined blocks, each 1 3/4" square x 6" long, bolted tightly together like the vise. No handle at all! I just give it an ALMIGHTY smack with a BIG, BFH..a 7 pounder!! Never damaged a barrel or a receiver..and NEVER had one fail to bust loose FIRST Crack!! I don,t care if it is a factory Mauser or an Eddystone model 1917. No fuss, no damage, no problem. Indeed, some spin all the way off with the first crack!! Now, if you imagine I am going to write in to some Gunsmiths's List, or Gun Magazine, with THAT little gem..you are dreaming! That Trade has incestuously fed itself on the same tired old myths, and half truths for over a hundred years. If an upstart like me, came up with a definitive answer to one of the most frequent problems..too many oxes would be gored..Indeed, some gun writers would have to retire!! Getting barrels off, like passing through Puberty, is SUPPOSED to be difficult! Only HALF-Kidding of course ;^) teenut My Jack Erbes wrote: > Hey Robert, > > Here is a photo of my home made "sweetheart", what is yours like? > > http://www.vom.com/jack/vise_1.JPG > > -- > Jack in Sonoma, CA, USA (jack@vom.com) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Retrofit feed screw dials From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2000 05:49:31 GMT -------- My favorite at the moment is white Corian..it needs to be harder, whiter and more scratch resisant than Nylon or Delsin..with no tendency to absorb oil or swell with humidity changes. I WISH I knew what Hardinge use..though I suspect it is Melmine. teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article <8lKs4.2195$ps1.134265@news1.rdc1.ga.home.com>, > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > > > Alternatively..and my preference over the VERY nice Sherline units, is > to > > produce white, hard, plastic rings of varied diameters with black > enamel filled > > divisions, that could be glued onto your old thimbles after turning > them down. > > This is the type of thimble used by Harding and is a delight to use. > > Delrin? Nylon? Robert, drop me a line with your address and > I could send you a piece of material for experimentation. > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: PUNCH PRESS DOG STEEL From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 24 Feb 2000 06:30:25 GMT -------- The original dogs may well have been Mild steel (or 1025 more like) that were VERY heavily case hardened. Good wear and tough as old boots. It might be worth a try..before going to more expensive experiments. I have three 30 ton Bliss's ..I'll pull a dog from the scrapper, tomorrow, and do a hardness test on it..it could indicate if it is indeed case hardened. Failing that, I could CNC Wire Cut some, out of pre-heat treated VascoWear Die Steel..They would cost a fortune ..but you ain't going to break THEM!! Might rip the rest of the Bliss apart though! ;^) It really sounds as though there is a problem other than the dogs though. Maybe alignment or timing? Is it worth fitting an air-clutch? teenut Tom Gardner wrote: > > I need advice. A couple of my presses break dogs more often than I feel > they should. These two culprits are a thirty ton Bliss and a thirty ton (I > think) L&J. I have gone through 5 dogs in a year. I have made them from > D-2, O1 and some unknown tool steel. I have heat treated them myself, sent > them out, tried them soft (that sucked!) I tempered them to med. dark > straw, light straw, full hard. The cavities seem in fair shape and the > mating parts in the flywheels seem ok. > > So, what steel should I try? What treat is proper? I have 9 other presses > with 20 year old dogs, I have no idea what they are but they are OLD and > they work. I feel so inadequate... > > Tom Gardner ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 350 Rigby From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2000 03:40:05 GMT -------- These people are pretty good.. www.reamerentals.com With that price and service it hardly makes sense to buy one..let alone, MAKE one! teenut Bray Haven wrote: > > Teenut wrote: > >Go with the 9x57 and rent a reamer..excellent, well balanced and powerful > >round. > > Good advice here. All the cartridges based on the 8X57JS are good, 6mm Rem up > to 9mm, as is the original 8X57. The Whelen is a nice caliber too but is a > little tricky to headspace due to the very small shoulder. The 358 (Win) is a > good round for short actions. > > > >Stay away from the 284 case..IIRC it is a belted case..that only takes up > >space>> > > Also good advice. Not really belted, but a recessed rim which is totally > useless. > > I wouldn't try to make your own reamer. Use one made by the raemer people > which are std dimensions which s also important when you get into handloading > for it. As for renting, I chamber about 40 calibers but still need to use an > odd reamer (that I don't have) occasionally and had heard some could be rented. > Anyone have a source for renting. > > BTW, I think I have a new Douglas 98 mauser barrel here (threaded & > unchamebered) in 358 cal. I would give you break on it if you haven't bought > the barrel yet. > > Greg Sefton ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lathes From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2000 03:53:26 GMT -------- "Scott S. Logan" wrote: > > 5 Logan Lathes (you were surprised?) > 1 - 14" x 40" > 1 - 14" Chucker > 1 - 12" x 35" > 1 - 11" x 36" > 1 - 9 x 18" (Parts Lathe) > 1 Monarch 16" x 104" (Actually 18-5/8" swing) > 1 Roeperwerk WEBO-Turn CNC Lathe > Scott, you don't need a parts lathe. You can get all the Logan parts you need at: Logan Actuator Co. http://www.lathe.com Chicago, IL ;^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: drilling sheet metal From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2000 04:11:37 GMT -------- Oadale is definitely still there..right up the road. It was the first supplier account I opened. You wouldn't believe the amount of cash I have spent there this last three weeks, as I lick this shop into shape!! Trivial statistic..I have, so far, sent 14 TONS of scrap to the yard and that has only opened up space enough to see the REAL Junk. A lot of it was large hunks of steel and bar offcuts..enough to keep a hundred HSMs going for a lifetime. I breaks my heart..but this is a major clearout problem and I HAVE to shunt it out. Actually, this place is a HSMs dream..I am GIVING good stuff away, just to clear the space. Yesterday a three head, Buffalo drill press went to one of my employees..Gratis! I know it went to a good home! I have two Bridgeport mills to clear out (to make room for a new 20 HP Fadal 4 axis CNC VMC) They are tired, from being run hard, and put up wet..In true jobbing toolroom fashion. But they have NOT been abused and are NOT excessively worn. They are sound and accurate enough for most HSM projects. But they don't have that 100% crisp "Edge" that you HAVE to have in a Jobbing tool and Die Shop. They just need a bit of TLC..which I simply do not have the luxury of time to do. $1750 each..AS IS..WHERE IS. No tooling! (I am not THAT generous!!) teenut David wrote: > > >It is close to the junction of I285 and South Cobb Drive. > > That`s a hop, skip, and a jump from one of the best hardware stores in the > world, Oakdale, if it`s still there... > I`ll drop by sometime and see all the purty machines ( : > > Dave > > > > > > > It`s not the hallucinations that frighten me..... > > ======== Newsgroups: alt.survival,misc.survivalism,rec.crafts.metalworking,talk.politics.guns,talk.politics.misc Subject: Re: OT-British Gun Laws Update From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2000 04:26:47 GMT -------- Dream on Phil! I don't know where you hail from..but as an Ex-Pat Brit who spent thirty five years there, I can assure you that a large percentage of Brits could name someone they know, that has an off ticket weapon..It was always so, and it appears the numbers have grown rather than shrunk. Maybe you lived all your life with your head in the sand, and only removed it long enough for a swift peek around..before shoving it up your arse! teenut Phil wrote: > > Jeffrey C. Dege wrote: > > > > The British government is reporting 3 million smuggled guns? Seems > > like more than a few. I'd be surprised if the UK had 3 million > > criminals and/or gang members. > > Of course not. > > > It's not that big a country. Either > > the numbers are wildly inflated or there is a sizable population > > buying smuggled guns. > > The most likely explanation is some criminals have large stockpiles of > weapons. The idea that millions of Brits are hiding illegal guns is > frankly ludicrous!! > > Phil > > Peace, Bread, Land ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Re-Conditioning Lathe Beds - SB "Turcite FAQ" From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2000 05:27:43 GMT -------- rdanzey@seidata.com wrote: > it is, what technique can I use to determine the degree of wear it has > sustained over the years? And I hope that doesn't entail a 12' long > straight edge, but I suspect it does! Can a taut enough music wire > serve as a suitable reference? Yes it can..A very accurate one in fact! Don't set it to touch the table, but about an inch above it..then make up a metal wedge with a very shallow taper. Arrange a low voltage circuit that will light a lamp when the wedge contacts the wire. Mark the contact point at each end of the table, and adjust one end of the wire untill it is equi-distant from the table at both ends. You can now plot a "Topograghical map" of your table top. Remember, there WILL be some catenery sag in the wire..but this will be negligible over 6 feet if you use a very fine wire and a lot of tension..almost to the yield point. Another method is to mount a high magnification riflescope, on a "sled" and zero the cross wires on a far enough distant target. Sliding the sled arouund and taking sightings will give you the big picture very quickly. However, I doubt that there is much appreciable wear in the slides..just check that you can't actually "Rock" the table on the slides and it should be fine. It is quite acceptable practice, Indeed, Standard Operating Procedure, to take a fine finishing cut over the table after setting the machine in place...And periodically over its lifetime. Thus, while the ways may not be dead straight and level (What IS!) the table top will follow the path of its movement and produce dead parallel surfaces on anything clamped to it. > And another BTW: I may have missed them, but are there any references > yet to your new machine shop? I've been waiting to see news of the new > enterprise. Thanks again, and best wishes... > Thanks for the encouragement..This last three weeks have been a haze of LOOOONG working hours, licking the shop into shape..A kind of "Shakedown Cruise"...Getting all the kit up to snuff, clearing the undergrowth and cobwebs, integrating the tooling and getting shop and manpower to start to work together as a unit. A strangely alien concept in jobbing shops in this area. For a while it just seemed like an endless descent into despair..no wonder the owner sold, it couldn't have functioned for much longer, the way it was. First thing I did was place all the people on payroll and give them a raise! As they had all, previousl, been on contract, with no hours guaranteed, this surprised the hell out of them. I am putting in an air conditioned lunch room and a new bathroom with shower and HOT water. Can you imagine..Twenty years as a machine shop and no hot water!! I treat my dogs better than that! I wouldn't even expect my dog to use the bathroom there!! (The shower is as much for MY personal benefit..and for safety..in the event of a spillage. But the Lads are tickled pink!!) Anyway, Thousands of dollars and hours later, of "Non-productive" labor and machine repairs, upgrades, maintainance, overhaul, re-arranging and clean up..the shop is starting to take on the semblance of something "Ship Shape and Bristol Fashion" I hired a personal Assistant yesterday to "run the system" And today I hired a Sales Person. Female!!..Helluva Go getter and a Great Engineer to boot! (Great TT&A too..which doesn't hurt in getting through the door.) She took her last Machine Shop Employer from 500K to 4.5 million in three years, so I invested a VERY expensive lunch, a trip in the Jag, a peep into my dreams and a generous commission structure, to hire her away from him! New Computer System up and running, new phone system ditto, new Dodge Ram Pick-me-up truck out front. New Fadal 4 axis Machining center arriving next week. Getting ready for the high speed sea tests..already going to flank speed with every man in the shop working through the weekend to fix three crashed dies picked up today from three different shops..Plus two new diesets to deliver by Tuesday next!! Payroll stands at nine, not including me and SMWBO..and I am starting to advertise for machinists and Tool/Die/Mould/Makers next week. I plan to start a second shift within two months!! Let Battle Commence! 8^) tired but happy teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Re-Conditioning Lathe Beds - SB From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2000 05:31:02 GMT -------- That just about sums up my experience and methods. teenut metalmauler@webtv.net wrote: > > Group: rec.crafts.metalworking Date: Wed, Feb 23, 2000, 3:06am (EST+5) > From: rdanzey@seidata.com Re: Re-Conditioning Lathe Beds - SB > In article <20000222143314.12552.00000973@ng-fs1.aol.com>, > gjrepesh@aol.com (GJRepesh) wrote: > One way to avoid adjusting other equipment on the lathe after a bed > regrind (lead screw, apron, etc.) would be to use turcite on the saddle > to build it up the amount of the grind of the bed. > GJR > I'm curious about the Turcite product and how it's used. Is it merely > glued to the worn bearing surfaces, or are the bearing surfaces made > flat and straight by whatever method first? In any event, a true flat > surface needs to be restored either from the original cast iron or from > the bonded on Turcite material. And it needs to be a surface as close as > possible to where the original way was when the lathe was built. It also > seems to me that the mating bearing surfaces (on the moving parts like > the carriage and the tailstock) need to be restored as well to original > if they are going to relate to the opposing bearing surface in such a > way as to give a true precision machine. > So the success of using the Turcite depends on generating true bearing > surfaces in the right places be it in cast iron or Turcite. The problems > of assuring and generating these accurate bearing surfaces remain. So, > what has been gained? What is the benefit of the Turcite? And how is it > installed and 'finished' so that the machine becomes useful and accurate > again? > Since we often 'play' with older machines, I suspect there are a lot of > folks out there who could benefit by knowing about this material. But > I'm still not sure how the benefit is produced. Your comments greatly > appreciated... > danz > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. > > Actually...We use precision V-blocks on the least used portions of the > bed and measure down to the top of the leadscrew and record these values > for future use. > > Then we strip the machine & put the bed on our way grinder and use the > unworn surface under the headstock and the unworn surface at the > tailstock end and indicate the bed in for height and end to end, to > within a coupla tenths. Our operator records how much he grinds off.(an > educated guess using the vertical travel of the machine and an estimate > of wheel breakdown) > > Then we determine the thickness of the way replacement by how much was > ground off the bed minus how much we mill off underneath the saddle to > clean it up to run true,( also indicated in vertically and horizontally) > > Now you get to glue on the way replacement and scrape it to height of > the original datum point to start with. > > This JUST a brief overview. There's more to it than this. I could go on > & on. It's endless. > > 1.Scrape head square to bed, vert. & horz > 2.Same with tailstock plus centered to spindle > 3.Crosslide > 4.Compound > > Is this any clearer? Or did I make it worse? > Visit our website below. If you go thru it step by step which we explain > maybe that will help. > > BTW, Moglice sucks! Use turcite for lightweight applications, Micarda > for heavyweight apps. > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > Gallery of Machines Machinetool Rebuilders > > New & Used,Reconditioned Machines > > Russ Penrose > > Marathon NY > > Part/timeWoodworker ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Buying a vise From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2000 05:48:51 GMT -------- Gunner wrote: > I have a 5" vise I purchased from HF for rough work, IE, holding stuff while I weld, braze, beat, > twist and hammer on, and it gives good general duty work after 5+ years. However, some day I will > have a Wilton etc for fine or accurate work. Ive used both, and the difference is night and day. I have a medium sized blacksmith's leg vice for pounding and forging on. On my "Precision" bench, (Laminated, 3" maple top no less!!), are two 4 1/2" Steel Record,swivel-based, vices, with custom made, heat treated and precision ground jaws. They are set about 18" apart, one on the face of the bench, the other at the right hand corner. The vices are carefully matched for height and alignment so that they can be used individually, or both in concert, as the occasion arises. Anyone accustomed to a vice as a clunker, crude, clamping device, would have no concept of the versatility and overall improvement in the degree of precision of ALL your work, that such a set up can bestow! After my bench, my files and my hammer..my vices are THE most valuable tool in the shop!! Bar NONE!! teenut..still a bench hand at heart! ======== Newsgroups: alt.machines.cnc,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: fire in table From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2000 06:12:30 GMT -------- Jon Banquer wrote: > Perhaps the best bet would be for a manufacturing coalition > to work with a Community Collage, while lobbying for government > funding to pay for the majority or all of the costs. I can assure you, > we will never product the skills that are needed on a Vocational > School level and we won't produce them with short programs. This is precisely the kind of Industry/College Co-operative Program I helped to set up and manage in Hamilton, Ontario. This is HITAC and is a programme set up with Hamilton Employers and Mohawk College, funded by Provincial Government and managed by appointed members from all three. I was on the Board of Advisors for severak years, as well as being on the Metal Cutting Advisory Committee of Mohawk College. The system worked well (when last I heard in 1990) and offered 3 year Apprenticeship training at the HITAC (Hamilton Industrial Training Association Center) and, co-operatively with half the time beeing spent in "Improver" periods of 6 months and a year in participating Machine Shops and Manufacturers. It felt very rewarding for me, personally, to be able to give back something to a Trade that has given so much to me. It works and we put out some damn fine Machinists (Male AND Female) I wish I could lay my hands on half a dozen of them RIGHT now! Now I have my own shop again, I plan to contact the local Vo-Tech Centers and see if I can get a couple of "Improvers" from them for periods of six months or a year. I will let you know how things develop. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Retrofit feed screw dials From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2000 06:15:27 GMT -------- Thanks, Ivorine is one of the materials I plan to test. I have used it as a good Ivory substitute for knife handles, and can get off-cuts quite inexpensively. teenut Robert Parsons wrote: > > I believe I know what the material is... > Ivorine 3, its available from atlas fiber comapany in Chicago... > The stuff is really expensive, its a paper based phenolic, machines > really nice... its hard enough to polish up nice... takes the enamel for > the numbers and divisons nicely.... > Bob ======== Newsgroups: alt.machines.cnc,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Who sells very small right angle drilling attachments. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2000 06:33:59 GMT -------- Send it back to the Draftsman and tell himm to stop dreaming!! teenut "Preston S. Miller" wrote: > > We have a job where we need to drill some Ø.050" holes through a wall > .100" off the floor of a pocket in a Kovar housing. The pocket is > around .300" wide between walls so we are looking for a small, right > angle drilling attachment that will allow us to get within .100" of > the floor and will fit in the .300" pocket. Does anybody know of > anyone who makes anything like this? > > Preston S. Miller > CNC Programmer > > Micro-Mode Products, Inc. > 1870 John Towers Avenue > El Cajon, CA 92020 > > Phone: (619) 449-3844 Ext. 14 > Fax: (619) 258-8701 > > E-Mail: scot@micromode.com > http://www.micromode.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: lathe design From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2000 06:49:03 GMT -------- Some pretty hefty machine tools are made with Thompson type, split ball bushings, on hardened rod ways that are supported full length. This works well, even on heavy loads where positioning is the primary purpose..Like the huge Cincinnati Sinker EDM I have at present or the large Pratt & Whitney NC Tape controlled drill I used to have. Not as effective on lathes or milling machines, where dynamic forces, vibration and chatter are involved. teenut shoptask wrote: > > Wabeco, a German company specializes in lathes with round bed ways- problem is > length with no support, since the travelling carriage goes all the way around > the tube it can only be supported on the ends- this limits the length of the > bed. > try a small hydraulic pump off the lathe motor pumping your oil through the > plastic piping ( oil pressure guage kits are real cheap-) That way you always > have lubrication when the motor is on-you can set the pressure relief valve > where you want to prevent excess oil- you probably won't notice much difference > in the carriage performance, but it saves doing it by hand and keps chips out if > you don't have wipers > > Bryan Conrad wrote: > > > I had an idea once to build a lathe out of hyd cylinder rods,since then I've > > seen a very similar lathe with round bed rods,my question is how do you > > adjust for wear in the brgs?split tapered bushes?Just a thought. > > Also,I have a chinese 7 by 40" lathe,thought I could use a small > > reservoir pressurised to maybe 5psi by shop air to supply the saddle ways > > with pressure oil via plastic tubing,should tend to exclude chips and take > > care of the oiling,probably have to be a total loss system. > > What would be your thoughts on this,would the benefits justify the > > means? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Magnetised digital calipers From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2000 07:01:34 GMT -------- Take it to your nearest tool and die shop..one with a surface grinder that has a magnetic chuck. They WILL have a demagnetiser! Ask them to run your caliper over (or through) it. teenut Dave Baker wrote: > > After 10 years of being hurled around the workshop and other general abuse my > trusty old Mitutoyo digital calipers are heavily magnetised. This is a major > pain because it's almost impossible to get rid of the tiny bits of swarf that > cling to the jaws when I'm trying to zero them. Back in school I was taught > that holding a magnetised rod east-west and hitting it sharply would > de-magnetise it. Sounds a bit drastic for the old calipers so is there a better > way ? > > Dave Baker at Puma Race Engines (London - England) - specialist cylinder head > work, flow development and engine blueprinting. Web page at > http://members.aol.com/pumaracing/index.htm ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT-Economic Terrorism! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2000 07:33:54 GMT -------- Actually 94% of every dollar you earn WILL pass to one form of government, or another, in the way of taxes collected at one stage or another..Either directly on that dollar as Income taxes, or indirectly at almost every stage of manufacture or distibution, of everything you spend the "Untaxed" portion of your income dollar. Any thing you manage to accumulate from the unspent portion of your dollar can be subject to a "Double dip" death tax of up to 55% (in the USA) In certain Countries (including certain States in the US) your net worth is also subject to annual taxes. In some Scandinavian countries, this can push the total tax load to OVER 110% of every annual dollar earned!!! Neat system huh! So neat, that most people wouldn't believe it, even if they knew about it! teenut Tom Holt wrote: > > The message <38B5E353.4BA82E19@crl.com> > from "J. Kimberlin" contains these words: > > > Ultimately, taxes account for about 94% of your income - this > > includes all the taxes on taxes, taxes that are passed along by > > manufacturers who pay taxes on materials, labor SS, etc. for the > > stuff they make. It is closer to 96% in Europe, so the USA is 2% > > better off. That is enough to make a lot of millionaires..... > > Q; What's the difference between someone who works 96% of the time > for somebody else's benefit, and a slave? > > A; There isn't one. > > Q; But I thought slavery was done away with years ago. Wasn't there > some business with a civil war, or something? > > A; You believe that? Really? Gosh. Now, would you like to buy this > extremely fine gold mine, guaranteed to make you rich in a week, > yours for only $29.95... ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: C h u c k or C o l l e t s From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2000 07:44:28 GMT -------- Because of limited headroom on my home shop Deckel mill, I use the 300 series collets with great success for drills from zero to 1/4" diameter. Picked up a full set of collets (Which each have a wide range) from MSC for under a $100 and a half inch shank Ericson 300 collet chuck, for under $50.00...Don't need a small drill chuck any more!! teenut John Hofstad-Parkhill wrote: > > Hi Dave: > > > considering a set of R-8 collets (expensive) or a chuck (really > expensive). > > I come from the mill/drill world so things are a bit more muddy. The import > R8 collets I use work just fine for the quality of the machine I have. Turns > out I still don't use the collets all that often. A set of "real" R8 collets > will cost more than a shiny new Albrecht. > > Anyway, this question is easier in my mind than all that. I find in practice > I use numbered drills more often than fractional on the mill because I'm > usually making a tap or body hole, and these are very frequently numbered > drills for the #6..#10 screw sizes. I'm not familiar with all the variants > of R8 collets, nor their complete range, but I suspect I'd be driving myself > crazy trying to make sure I've got the right collet mounted for a #29 drill. > > I picked up an 1/2" Albrecht at a flea market and mounted it to an R8 > adapter. I have grown so fond of it that I have retrofit my drill press and > lathe with keyless chucks as well (the Jacobs versions on sale via J&L). > > Anway, the keyless chuck makes the spotting/pilot/bore/tapping operation > much quicker. > > Given the choice, I'll always choose convenience & speed. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: BABINS BACK From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2000 11:54:59 GMT -------- Ernie Leimkuhler wrote: > I missed your offers of 60 foot 92 ton lathes. > Ooo..Goody! I need another small lathe at the shop!! ;^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: micro tubing ... help From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2000 11:58:27 GMT -------- Try your local Hardware Store..Look for the K-Z (?) Metal Center..all kinds of small tube goodies. teenut Jon wrote: > > Don't know where to turn for this one. I need to locate a source of > thin-wall metal tubing with an I.D. of around .1180+ inch which I will use > as a bearing for .1175 inch shafting. Any leads much appreciated. > > Jon ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Almost thought I had a lathe today From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 25 Feb 2000 15:02:07 GMT -------- > I'm waiting for TeeNut to pass on! > > Jim xprtec@aol.com Don't hold yer breath!! Actually, this question of what arrangements to make for disposal of your kit when you go the "That Great Machineshop in the SKY" is a perennial and thorny one. The thought of avaricious vultures descending on my shop and my widow gives me the "Screaming Hab Dabs" I am making a photographic record of every tool in my shop with notes on what it cost, what it is worth and a likely source of buyer. This includes a suitable description for an advertisement and a suggested minimum/maximum price range. Of course good quality pictures always help in the selling process. This is made much easier by using electronic means..A digital camera in my case and a file both printed and backed up on disc. Someone else might prefer to make an audio/video record. These precautions would also be invaluable in case of fire or theft too..and would certainly speed up and verify any insurance claim. I am also adding codicils to my will as I go along..gifting choice articles to close friends, who I know will apreciate and take good care of them. This isn't so much out of generosity on my part..as a way to put my mind at rest in the knowledge that a little something of me will go on. So be NICE to me Jim...and the rest of you Guys, or I will slip you a "Mechanical Mickey Finn"!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Re-Conditioning Lathe Beds - SB From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2000 01:31:37 GMT -------- The name is Micar_T_a Micarta is available from any plastics supply house..It is a Phenolic impregnated , compressed linen, insulating material..Originally designed by GE and now used as a general engineering material for hundreds of purposes.."silent" gears, wearstrips and custom knife handles been just a few that come to mind. teenut Ed French wrote: > > Is this your web site? http://www.galleryofmachines.com/ This is the only > link on the web that AltaVista could find that had Micarda in it. Which > brings up the questions what is Micarda and where is it available from? > > P. S. the site shows the steps to rebuild a lathe > metalmauler@webtv.net wrote in message > <29792-38B5DF0C-69@storefull-124.iap.bryant.webtv.net>... > Group: rec.crafts.metalworking Date: Mon, Feb 21, 2000, 2:42pm (EST-3) > From: frwillia@ptw.com (Fitch R. Williams) Re: Re-Conditioning Lathe > Beds - SB > billw01775@my-deja.com wrote: > >I think you will have to do some other things to > > make things fit after it is re ground. For > > example, I think the gear box and rear lead > > screw bearing will have to be moved down an > > amount equal to the amount ground off the > > bed in order to fit. > > >Fitch > > >In So. Cal. > > That's so very true...Unless you use a way replacement system underneath > the saddle, then scrape it to mate the newly ground bed, and to re-fit > the height of the gearbox and backbox. (Other end of leadscrew, feedrod > & control rod) Other things to consider are the headstock alignment to > the bed vertically & horizontally and tailstock alignment to the head. > We use Turcite & Micarda,and glue them on with a 2 part epoxy with a > 'body" and pin it if necessary. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Re-Conditioning Lathe Beds - SB From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2000 01:34:04 GMT -------- BEEP...Mulligan is right, Bissett is wrong!! Micarta has been used as a slideway bearing material on planers and heavy boring mills for donkey's years!! teenut Robert Bissett wrote: > > mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > > > In article , > > "Ed French" wrote: > > > > > > brings up the questions what is Micarda > > > > Honestly I've never heard of micarda, but "Micarta" is General > > Electric's trade name for various types of composite materials, > > including paper- or linen-based phenolic, and also glass-epoxy > > composites like G10 or such. > > > > Not the sort of matierials I would use under lathe saddles, so > > either there really is a micarda, or maybe he got the name wrong, > > or was using it in a generic sense. > > > > Jim > > > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > > Before you buy. > > ---- > > The main ingredient of "Micarta" is mica. Small chips and flakes in a > binder. It is a hard but brittle material much used in the past for > high-voltage insulation and high-frequency radio equipment . The > panels for this use was 1/2" or 5/8" thick. > > Certainly not paper or linen and goes back at least to the 1930's > as I have some radio switches from that era that use Micarta . > And long before epoxy was invented. > > Hard to see how Micarta could be used for this purpose and as you > say he may have the name wrong. > > Bob > > --- > > . ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: WTB: Kurt swivel base From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2000 02:25:03 GMT -------- I have at least three Kurt (or Kurt "Type") swivel bases I dug out of the detritus in my "new shop" (Also a trolly load of broken Kurts!!) The bases are filthy..but unused (They don't get much use in a jobbing shop and are usuall removed and "stored" early on) $40.00 each plus shipping while supplies last!! Guess what..They offered me a pair of CNC qualified Kurts as part of the new Fadal package and I laughed at them!! Sent them out to find a pair of Gerardi's. Took 'em an hour and cost $200.00 extra, (the pair). Anyone familiar with Gerardi Vices will never take a Kurt seriously again!! The Fadal (30 x 16 x 20..4 axis) will be delivered 3/16/00. I have two of my guys going on a three day training course next week..Three the week after. I got to the shop about ten AM yesterday morning..after running errands..Couldn't hardly get in the parking lot! Inside, everything running like a well oiled clock, every man cutting metal for profit and three new customers, drinking coffee and waiting for me to arrive! Amazing! It seemed like all the blood, sweat, tears, cleaning, fixing, and reorganizing of the previous three weeks, just all clicked into place overnight. Jeez it felt good!! 8^) teenut teenut Grant Erwin wrote: > > After waiting for about 3 years for J&L to put regular Kurt swivel vise > bases on sale, they finally did - they are marked off a whopping 8% or so > and are still damn near $150. I don't need one very often, but when I do > it would be very handy. I happen to have a couple of projects in the queue > which could use one. Anyone got one they would sell (hopefully for a lot > better price)? > > Grant Erwin > Kirkland, Washington ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Toughness From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2000 02:32:09 GMT -------- "Roll Pins" would probably be the "toughest" solution you could buy. teenut "physical (Droll Troll)" wrote: > > . > Awl-- > Long time no post because, well... I got a job! In a machine shop, no > less. What a hellhole. But, still infinitely better than your local > heat treating or foundry purgatory, where Satan hisself would be most > miserable. > > Anyway, I am using .099 pins (#39 drill rod) in shear. What is the > *toughest* material I could practically make these out of, ie, most > resistant to shearing? Would heat treating help my case? It doesn't > need to be super hard, just as shear-resistant as possible. Also, would > your suggested material be available in rod or wire or 3/4" pins? > Almost no machining other than cutting and deburring/slight chamfering > will be done to these pins. > TIA. > > Kris. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: lost downloads From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2000 02:37:54 GMT -------- Unsubscribe and then re-subscribe...you can then choose to down load as many "Back Issues" as you wish. teenut "Richard C. Penney" wrote: > > Hi, > I done a bad thing and don't know how to correct it. Seems I lost all > the previous postings and can only get about 100. I would like to go > back about 500 or so. I have netscape,and this is the first time I've > made this screw up.. Usually it will download 500 or so. But I :^( > crashed my system and ...oooops. Thanks and I'm off for the night. > toff ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Ebay auction on Komet boring bars From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2000 02:49:37 GMT -------- What is the size and spec of thos inserts Rudy? I may be interested in the deal. teenut Rudy wrote: > > > > >If any one gets these bars on ebay I believe I have about 275 inserts to fit > >them that I have no need for. > > Yes I'm a big dummy today forgot the link to the bars ...here it is: > > http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=264792274#DESC > > Rudolph N. Koester CPT,SC U.S.Army > Quality Machine and Hydraulics (ret)(disability) > Macon, Ga Life Member NRA > > Taxation WITH representation isn't all that great either ! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: ferrari video From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2000 03:03:10 GMT -------- I have said it before..and I will say it again.. Abso-f***king-lutely Incredible!! THAT is Model Engineering at its finest. Thank you Paul teenut paul pickard wrote: > > opps! in my haste I forgot the darn link! > > http://www.johnegerton.co.uk/cmcc/ferrari312.rm > > have fun ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Making fillister head screw From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2000 03:09:31 GMT -------- Have you tried Brownells? teenut MLee388407 wrote: > > Hi > > Ive been looking for a certain fillister head screw that no one seems to > have. Does anyone on this newgroup want to make one for me and if so how much > would it cost me? If no one want to take on the project can someone tell me > what is the best way to make it....Im thinking a lathe like the one Scherline > makes may work. Im not a metal worker but I am in the building trades so Im > willing to give it a try. Thanks to all replies > > oh by the way its a 8-32 flat fillister head slotted with a head od of > .315 > > Mike > rec.guns. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: The ole' sliver trick. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2000 03:12:04 GMT -------- Mike, You win this months "teenut Award for Innovation in Bodgery" 8^) teenut Mike Graham wrote: > > Today I had to deal with an odd threaded hole. It's threaded 1/2-16. > Really. Half inch, *sixteen* threads per inch. Needed to be cleaned up. I > didn't have a 1/2-16 tap. > Now, we've all heard that you can stuff a sliver of hardwood in one flute > of a tap and get it to cut slightly oversize. Well, I'm here to tell you > that it takes a helluvabig splinter to get a 3/8-16 tap to cut 1/2-16, but > it worked. > > -- > -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- > Mike Graham | Metalworker by trade > mikegraham at sprint dot ca | Weld to live, like to weld. > Caledon, Ontario, Canada | Weird by nature > > remove reversed 'nospam' to reply > -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- > "By Fire and Iron doth he make Bread." ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: WTB: Kurt swivel base From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2000 06:36:48 GMT -------- "Fitch R. Williams" wrote: > Well, then, what ever you are doing, do it some more! As the Actress said to the Bishop! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Haas or Fadal? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2000 06:54:47 GMT -------- I got the same, lack of response/responsiveness from the local Hass people..Fadal, on the other hand were superb..after being taken to see a few, local machines, talking to owner/operators, seeing their training facilities etc... I ended my search...right there!! Signed the PO on a 30 x 16 x 20, 4 axis Fadal, this week! With modern cnc equipment, the service availability, proximity and training/back up are far more important than a couple extra inches on axis travel or a few more HP on the spindle etc. Modern machine tools are like modern cars..the home mechanic can't fix them anymore!! Downtime is blood money!! teenut "Dan L." wrote: > > lol I just went through the same dilemma. I've heard good and bad about > both irons. We signed a PO on a Fadal last week. We also looked at the > Hardinge. I'll prob'ly get flamed for even bringing this machine up, but it > certainly appeared to be a viable alternative. I talked to the Haas > distributor in my area and did not get a positive feeling about how service > would be handled. I've heard more horror stories than accolades about Haas > service, and I'm sure the level of service varies from region to region. > > I know of a shop that purchased a Fadal VMC15. He loves the machine, but he > regrets not spending a few more dollars to get the better iron. The model > he bought was their *bargain* piece. It does not have a full casting, but > rather a weldment. The machine tends to sing a bit as a result. He also > regrets not going with the extra 10" of travel. Other than that he has been > nothing but pleased with it's performance. > > We had actually planned on going with the new Hardinge as our dealer worked > out a really nice price for us. He was going to get us into a 40 x 20 > machine (with rigid tap, control options, blah blah blah) for $53,500. > After making the decision we realized that the designers of our building, in > their infinite wisdom, left us short 2" on the opening to our shop and the > machine would not fit. The Hardinge is manufactured in Taiwan, and I really > feel better about the Fadal in retrospect. Ultimately we ended up > purchasing a Fadal 3016L (didn't have the bux for the boxway) with a fourth > axis. > > Haas will charge you for options that should be standard, but all told the > prices are very similar. > > Good luck! > > Dan > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote in message > news:7Ofp4.1463$ps1.120584@news1.rdc1.ga.home.com... > > I am going to buy a new 4 or 5 axis VMC. > > > > Anyone out there with direct experience of Hass or Fadal 20 x 16 x 20 > machines, > > controls, options, reliability, accuracy, service etc? > > > > Thanks, > > > > teenut > > > > Robert Bastow > > Express Tool & Die > > Atlanta GA ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Toughness From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2000 15:55:32 GMT -------- Note Hoyt..I said "Buy". Store boughten roll pins are heat treated to maximum toughness..drill rod isn't! 8^) teenut Hoyt McKagen wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > "Roll Pins" would probably be the "toughest" solution you could buy. > > > > > Anyway, I am using .099 pins (#39 drill rod) in shear. What is the > > > *toughest* material I could practically make these out of, ie, most > > > resistant to shearing? > > Since the roll pin is most likely no tougher material-wise than the drill > rod, the DR will beat them on shear, by having more area. When properly > HT the drill rod will be even stronger. > > -- > > Best wishes, > > Hoyt McKagen > > Belfab CNC - http://www.freeyellow.com/members/belfab/belfab.html > Best MC Repair - http://www.freeyellow.com/members/batwings/best.html > Camping/Caving - http://www.freeyellow.com/members/batwings/caving.html > Hac que hac ahac, hoc, hoc, patui ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Bridgeport table material.... Cast iron? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 27 Feb 2000 16:12:38 GMT -------- When repairing gouges in machine tool tables, my preference is always to spend the time and effort, in inlaying pieces of cast iron in the table top. This can be as simple as reaming out a drill hole and tapping in a lightly tapered plug...Or as complex as milling a dovetailed pocket or keying in a shaped piece with a few strategically placed set screws, The inlays are then milled to within a few thou of the surface, and gently peened around the edges before finish machining, grinding or scraping. The results, if properly done, are invisible. Similar techniques have restored badly worn or gouged slide ways. It may take a bit of imagination..but a way can usually be found to restore even busted out tee slots, without loosing strength..Where there is a will..There IS a way!! Finally..don't forget the old "OIL DAILY" trick!! 8^) teenut Tim Leech wrote: > > On Sun, 27 Feb 2000 00:10:20 GMT, mikegraham@sprintmapson.ca (Mike > Graham) wrote: > > >On 26 Feb 2000 05:54:54 GMT, Doug Goncz wrote: > > > >>Aged cast iron is pretty stable. Your fixes may warp the table. > > > > I've considered that. I'm planning on doing 'a ding per day' until > >they're done - I'm not going to do tons at once. There's only one really > >bad gouge where some bonehead didn't tighten the collet enough and an > >endmill dug for china right on the 'overhang' of one of the T-slots until it > >actually went right through (!) and greatly weakened that T-slot in that > >area. > > > My mill table had a number of shallow 'accidents' near the centre, > enough to cause problems clamping small items truly flat. > I'd bought the machine from an engine reconditioning company, I took > the table off & took it back there for them to put through their head > grinder. They took enough off to lose the smaller damage, left one > deeper one. The improvement in useability is tremendous, the remaining > damage doesn't bother me, and they never sent me a bill ;-) > > Might be worth you considering this path, but make sure they take > shallow cuts & keep it cool, otherwise it may bow as the top heats up, > so the nice flat ground top will be dished when it cools again. > > I'd be v. wary of welding it, myself - Devcon sounds a much safer bet. > > Cheers > Tim > ------------------------------------------------- > Tim Leech > > timleech@dutondok.u-net.com > > Traditional & Modern canal craft repairs > > ------------------------------------------------- ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: backwards on gasoline??? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 03:02:56 GMT -------- QE2 (IIRC) was originally steam turbine power...I did some original equipment supply and installation when she was built (They had to reopen three decks for us..but that's a whole different story!!) I was taken on a guided tour of the (rapidly completing) machinery spaces, and, (Again IIRC) I saw banks of steam turbines driving David Brown reduction gearboxes. She was/is a lovely ship. teenut Tim Leech wrote: > > On Sun, 27 Feb 2000 07:42:20 -0800, Hoyt McKagen > wrote: > > >Tim Leech wrote: > >> I'm open to correction on this, but I think she has electric > >> transmission, which should be highly controllable. Fairly sure that > >> was the case when steam powered, & carried over to the diesels. > > > >I think most likely steam/electrics were fairly uncommon; I hate this > >kind of reasoning but I have never seen a cite on that though I heard of > >Diesel-electrics when I was a kid. As for docking under main power, it > >would be my best guess that harbor laws require tugs and dead motors. > >That isn't unreasonable considering the captain cannot know the port as > >well as the tug captains, and the bigger the boat, the harder to land it. > > > > The QE2 is certainly diesel-electric now, can't dig up anything on her > original spec. > She now has nine 9-cyl MAN diesels, producing up to 10.5MW at 10KV. > See http://www.odin.co.uk/qe2/engine.html > > The Canberra was steam-electric throughout her life. > > Cheers > Tim > > ------------------------------------------------- > Tim Leech > > timleech@dutondok.u-net.com > > Traditional & Modern canal craft repairs > > ------------------------------------------------- ======== Newsgroups: misc.survivalism,alt.survival,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT-British Gun Laws Update (long and farther OT) From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 03:12:19 GMT -------- Well put Gunner! Doubtful if it will get him to pull his head out of his warm dark place..but who gives a s**t anyway! teenut One of the few Brit/Americans around here that can truly understand the REAL differences in mindset, between these two wonderful countries! So close..and yet so far away! Gunner wrote: > > J & F Higham wrote: > > >Gunner > > > >I'm sorry but you have failed to 'piss me off' with your original post > >or your most recent reply. What irritates me is the inanity, paucity > >of arguments and logic of the majority of replies that always follow > >these URLs you keep posting. > > Bummer, and I tried so hard. > > >I did in fact thoroughly enjoy the contents of one of the URLs you > >posted in the past because I thought it was one of the best spoofs I'd > >ever read. Unfortunately, I was assured by other members of the list, > >that the article was genuine and not a spoof. This was a great pity > >because it was a much better as a spoof and a very sorry specimen as a > >serious article as the logic was faulty and the attention to > >historical detail was woeful and it was also very selective in quoting > >sources. > Everyone is selective in quoting sources when trying to make ones point on any subject. Whats new? > > > > >As a regular reader of this ng over several years, I am, of course, > >aware of your frequent postings on the topic. It is their usefulness, > >applicablity and effectiveness that I query. You may consider that > >the 'regulars and old timers' have been following 'this' quite well, > >but simply because a thread is taken up and rehashed until it dies > >again does not necessarily mean that it is either on topic, is factual > >or adds weight to any argument either for are against gun ownership, > >criminality or survival. Quantity does not always equal quality and > >to my mind invective and insults have very little to do with quality. > >If you seriously believe that quotes from newspapers and other > >sources with dubious logic and that the nationalistic fervour and > >insults that follow each posting are useful in off list discussions, > >then I am very surprised; particularly when the 'facts' you wish to > >rub peoples noses in are so strongly argued against from those who > >actually live in the country in question. > > So, you have not been reading the info contained in each URL then. Contrary to what I gather you are > trying to portray.... each URL has pointed to UPDATED information. If I had simply gone back and > quoted the same document, I would have been called on it long ago. As I indicated, I try to update > the knowledge base of the folks whom are interested in this topic. Each time I find a new article, > or source, I endevor to post it. The more info, the greater the diversity of sources, the better to > arm ones self with. > > > >Surely if you want to present articles of interest you should check > >out the the NRA or other US gun organisations. They would either have > >access to some researchers or has some staff or volunteers who could > >come up with some reputable research which is more applicable to the > >US than British newspaper articles and presuamably they also have > >better sources of research in other countries. > > Of course I could use NRA data, and often do. However, what better source to protray the British > mindset on the guncontrol issue, than the Times, et al? Were not these the same papers which cried > so loudly for the draconian gun control that transpired in the UK? If I posted NRA info, the data > could be decried as bogus, or heavily slanted, by the Antis. Not so by using the original anti > sources itself. And I reckon, rather fitting. > > > > >Even if you can sorces better URLs, the situation in any other country > >is not the same as that of the US. Although English may be a common > >language of the majority of posters on this list, there the similarity > >ends. The culture, history, government and judicial structures in > >each country is such that trying to apply a policy that is effective > >or even mooted in one country to another is a nonsense. The US may > >have a gun debate, but I fail to see how the action of the British > >government after Dunblane (or the Australian Government after Port > >Arthur) could have any bearing on the US at this late a stage. The > >very fact that both in the UK and Australia managed to put in place > >such policies with very limited outcry from the majority of the > >population is indicative of the differences between these two > >countries and the US. It does not mean that the population of either > >country are either sheep, stupid, incapable of forming an opinion, > >fully support or resist the changes or are paranoid about the actions > >of their Governments: they are merely different from the US. > > Of course they are different. However, freedom, knee-jerk reactionism, and crime are all the same, > no matter where you go. The Antis here in the States have been holding the UK up as a shining > example of how well gun control works. We are now seeing just how well disarming the population > works, and how the rising crime rate in the UK and Oz is directly tied to confistigation, and we can > surmise logicly that the same will follow here in the States if allowed to happen here. > > > >Can you honestly tell me that the US Administration would have a > >possibility of achieving a similar outcome without all hell breaking > >loose from a very large segment of the US population? Does the > >relative calm acceptance of policy in another country mean that the > >policy is necessarily wrong for that country? > > Look at your rising crime stats, the proliferation of guns in criminal hands, the increase in > killings with automatic weapons, and you tell me it was right for your country. > > > > >If you wish to connect a massacre in another country to the possible > >result of unwanted US legislation that deprives US citizens of gun > >ownership, then I believe this to be very dubious. Surely if all the > >massacres in US schoolyards and other places have not yet resulted in > >more than 'anti-gun rhetoric' then you don't seriously have a great > >deal to worry about. Even if such a policy was ever put into place > >(which will happen when hell freezes over from what I've seen and > >read), would you or the many other gun owners hand over their guns? > >I'll bet London to a brick on that the answer is a resounding 'No!'. > >I sincerely think you're tilting at windmills Gunner. > When the US legislation is based on just how well it works in other countries... it is of concern. > The policies are already in place in many US states. SKS Sporter ban/buy back. Assault rifle ban, > etc etc. You evidently are not familiar with the status of ongoing gun control here in the States. > You may wish to educate yourself. Your provinicality is showing. > > > > >The other thing about your post I find very curious, is the reference > >to 'State Propaganda' in the UK. Tell me precisely to what you are > >referring? If I remember correctly, the posters here who actually > >live in the UK, have, with one exception, not said anything that would > >indicate a widespread concern about either the legislation or 'State > >Propaganda'. Are you trying to tell us that you know something that > >those who live in the UK do not, or are you simply extrapolating a US > >based mistrust of 'State Propaganda' and applying it to the UK? > When the confistication of weapons in the UK and Oz are aided and abetted by the frenzied posts of > the popular press, whom followed the wishes of the State in that manner... can it NOT be called > State Propaganda? The Sun, Times etc can be held up as shining examples of State Propaganda (at > least in the Gun Control issue) when they popularize the desires of the State to remove firearms > from the hands of honest British subjects. Oz is another example. And unfortunatly, are many medias > here in the US, whom follow the Party Line. There is a vast difference in reporting the news, as > opposed to :making the news: > > > >The only UK based person who seems to support your view is Yan and > >he/she hopes that your posts might educate even 'one free thinking > >person'. The hairs on the back of my neck always stand up when I hear > >this phrase or the similar, 'right thinking person'. It always seems > >to mean 'someone who thinks just like me' and that always worries me. > >He/she may not like what the British press writes or the information > >coming from the anti gun organisations but they have a right to > >present their view even if he/she has a strong objection to it. > > You should read my email from other Brits.... Yan is not a unique exception. It always worries me > when a person is demontsrativly correct, and is vilified by the "masses" for his politicaly > incorrect views. You appear to be contridicting your self here... you may not like the information > coming from the Pro-gun organizations, but they (and I) have a right to present our views even if > he/she has a strong objection to it. Hypocritical arn't you? > > > > >There has not been one comment on this thread that you have started > >that has any connection with survival issues so I fail to see how you > >can possibly argue that you are posting it because some people do not > >understand a gun/survival connection. All the posts have either been > >about the situation in the UK or arguments about who supported who in > >WWII or the Falklands or who has bad teeth or is overweight or what > >happened to Washington in the 19th century. None of that (except > >perhaps weight) has any bearing on current survival. Why don't you > >post this stuff to a gun ng and post survival URLs instead? > > If you cannot make the reach necessary to link survivalism, and the use of weapons (which are now > unabailable in the UK for all practical purposes) as tools most helpful in surviving, your narrow > views and personal slant have blinded you to reality, and you are unlikely to be smart enough to > survive. Imagine if the posted subject was the banning of water filters? Would that not be a survial > issue as well? > > > >If you can't lay off perhaps we could divert the topic to something > >with a more survivalist flavour. > Each to his own. Feel free to enter my data into your kill-file. Feel free to enter hell. > > > >I saw something the other day that said that cardio-vascular surgery > >was now the most common form of surgery performed in the US today and > >that this was considered to be a direct result of 30% of the US > >population being obese. Now I find it hard to believe that 30% of the > >US population could be considered to be obese as opposed to merely > >overweight. It was a US article and I don't know where they got their > >statistics (which seem very exaggerated to me) but it started me > >wondering what sort of food storage program one would have to have in > >order to cater for those who are outside the range of what could be > >considered a 'normal' healthy weight and also what measures one would > >need to take to ensure survival if one did fall into either an > >underweight, overweight or obese category. Any thoughts? > > hehe... nice Segway... the US is fat thread/insult with a smooze into food storage. Nice, very nice. > Thats been explored before in depth by other posters however. Be a bit more original, and do try to > keep up. > > > >Fran > > > > --------------------------------------------------------- > > "A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an > invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write > a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort > the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, > solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program > a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die > gallantly. Specialization is for insects." Robert Heinlein ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Don't Give An Inch! (was OT-British Gun Laws Update) From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 03:14:57 GMT -------- Jack Erbes wrote: > (Disclaimer: Sardonic humor at work, things may be less sincere than > they appear.) Wrong Jack! Don't apologise for things being MORE sincere that they appear! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Don't Give An Inch! (was OT-British Gun Laws Update) From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 03:20:46 GMT -------- Tom Lantz wrote: > > I sure hope that we (Americans) never forget what our freedoms are based on > or the price paid to obtain them. Or that the Second Amendment..with all its painful aspects, is the price we must pay to protect those rights and freedoms..especially the FIRST Amendment agains ALL comers! Especially those within, that would dearly love to see them curtailed. This isn't about GUNS!! It's about FREEDOM!! When WILL they ever learn! More and more determinedly.. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Magnetised digital calipers From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 03:24:44 GMT -------- It doesn't take long does it Jeff ;^) teenut Jeff Pack wrote: > > Yea Robert, you'd think demag's, oughta be sold along with every > Surface Grinder... :) > > It was my first purchase after I got my Grinder! > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: I have never seen a straight edge like this. should I get it? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 03:26:59 GMT -------- Oh! That's "Cruel and Unusual"!!!! Do it!! teenut Robert Nichols wrote: > > In article <38B8735B.AB34E114@vom.com>, Jack Erbes wrote: > :Mark wrote: > : I guess it would be good for making everyone wonder what the hell > :that is after the funeral :>). > > For that purpose I've already got a collection, accumulated over the > years, of nicely machined and finished odds & ends that look like they > ought to fit together somehow but don't. They're in a cardboard box > marked, "Tracer assembly." I've been thinking about making a nice > wooden case for the lot of them and putting the set up for auction as a > "Mystery Tool" on eBay. There's bound to be a couple of people out > there who think they know what it is. > > -- > Bob Nichols rnichols@interaccess.com > PGP public key 1024/9A9C7955 > Key fingerprint = 2F E5 82 F8 5D 06 A2 59 20 65 44 68 87 EC A7 D7 ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: home made Electronic Edge Finder From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 03:32:40 GMT -------- It's a racing certainty...If you don't screw up..y'ain't achievin' nuthin! I hope to be counted among your illustrous number! teenut Ted Edwards wrote: > > mike II wrote: > > > You two have destroyed my last vestiges of self respect. I will now go > > Take heart. Maybe we'll *both* screw up tommorow. :-) > > Ted ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: clam rake & oyster tongs From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 03:37:42 GMT -------- For top performance, I would forge weld and form them from OCS Steel. (OCS?...."Old Chevy Spring"..5160) teenut John213a wrote: > > << Well, I suspect that these could be either forged or cast. >> > > My understanding is that they are forged, the individule tines shaped and then > forgewelded to the main body of the rake. > > I have forged two tined forks, (for use by the kids for marshmellowing), but > these did not require the tines to stand up against the pull of a sandy bottom. > Would mild steel, hot rolled, resist the tendency to bend when sideways > pressure was applied against it? Would subjecting the finished rake head to > "Superquench" make them resistant to bending? or just surface harden the mild > steel? or do I need something in the line of a "spring" steel. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: A question From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 03:38:50 GMT -------- Ted Edwards wrote: Sorry, I don't what the adjustment > procedure is for the Granite but I'm willing to bet there is a way to > adjust or shim the mill head. > > Ted BFH!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: The ole' sliver trick. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 03:41:43 GMT -------- It WAS meant as a compliment..Well deserved! ;^) teenut Mike Graham wrote: > > On Sun, 27 Feb 2000 03:12:04 GMT, Robert Bastow wrote: > > >Mike, You win this months "teenut Award for Innovation in Bodgery" > > 8-) I'm flattered, really. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: The ole' sliver trick. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 04:12:46 GMT -------- John Flanagan wrote: In BSF lingo, a 1/2" bolt has a head > that is ???, some wierd size that I could never figure the logic for, > something like .792" ??. So a 1/2" BSF wrench is .792 wide, whereas > a SAE would of course be .500", and the 1/2" BSF wrench is used for > 1/2" diameter bolts. BSW hex sizes came first....LONG before BSF. BSW a/f sizes were very carefully calculated by Sir Joseph Whitworth (Do a web search): A) To be the minimum sizes able to stand up to the required torque , in the AVAILABLE MATERIALS OF THE DAY!..ie. wrought iron of variable and often dubious quality. BSF standardization came along when materials were consitantly stronger and more reliable..and simply took the next smaller size of hex as the standard. I.e. 1/4" BSF has the same a/f as 5/16" BSF. B) So that the maximum A/F measurement of each size in the series would be less than the maximum A/C dimension of the next smaller size.. I.e. A 5/16" BSW wrench will not catch on the corners of a 1/4" BSF bolt or nut. Why is this important? US A/f sizes are bad enough in this respect..Metric sizes are the pits!! You are doing some "Shade tree" (or Professional!) nut wrenching. You are reaching "Up Under" out of sight..like a Victorian Gynecologist ..feeling for a nut and trying to guess its size. You grab the wrench that feels right and try it..The wrench catches and grips...bear down..and the sucker rips the corners off the too small hex, and the skin off your knuckles!! Don't knock what you don't understand! Find out why it was done that way...and you will usually find a very logical reason for it! Our Fore-fathers were NOT stupid people! teenut > > BSF, BSW, BSA, BC, all those threads are really wierd. I imagine > there is some very good reasoning behind them but nothing too obvious. > BS threads do have one feature I liked and that was rounded roots and > crests. Their angle was a strange 55.5° (or was it 55?) instead of > SAE's 60°. Why? Again I never did figure it out. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: The ole' sliver trick. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 04:19:09 GMT -------- Mike Graham wrote: > What is the benefit of the rounding? Less stress concentration? Absolutely..so far as the ROOT is concerned, The rounded crest just means the CHASER or die is easier to form and it doesn't cut through thread sealants as readily. It is also far easier to accurately thread roll. Chased or screw cut threads with a rounded crest don't need to be de-burred either! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Purchasing Vibratory Deburrer From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 04:24:55 GMT -------- Who is this Paragon Ed??? I am looking for a Vibratory Deburrer myself. (I tried to abbreviate that to "VD"..but decided not to go there!!) teenut Edward Haas wrote: > FWIW, the guy who sells the machines occasionally has a > reconditioned one for sale and you might ask if there's one on hand. > Cheaper than new and just as solid as a new one. Nice guy to do business > with. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 1/2" 16 TPI thread form answer to earlier query From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 04:44:53 GMT -------- One thing that continues to amaze me Jack, is that even the most meticulous, top flight, Rifle Smiths and Barrel Makers, continue to assert that 1.10"-12 tpi, 60 deg "American" thread is "Fine" for use in the 1.10" 12 tpi 55 deg Whitworth Form thread used in the 98 Mauser receiver! Mauser was a METICULOUS designer..He didn't choose the Whitworth form over the Metric/American 60 deg form, without a damn good reason..it being, that it is, overall, a STRONGER thread form. It is still the form of choice for high pressure threads..in "metric" countries too!! teenut Jack Erbes wrote: > To Whom it May Concern: Please don't tell me that 1/2-16 and 1/2 BSF > can be used interchangeably if you have a big enough wrench or some good > thread locker. I see a clear difference. > > -- > Jack in Sonoma, CA, USA (jack@vom.com) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Sokki digital readouts for sale From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 04:46:23 GMT -------- I am emailing!! teenut KMF ON TAF wrote: > > email for details ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: TEENUT! your email bounces .. was Re: Kurt swivel bases From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 04:51:53 GMT -------- Grant, Neither my Email, nor my cheques, nor my meatballs will ever BOUNCE!! I don't know what YOUR computer said to you....But mine said I had an email from Grant Erwin..to which I replied appropriately. 8^) BOUNCED!!! The very IDEA!!! (sniff) teenut Grant Erwin wrote: > > Sorry, everyone, this should have done in private email, but it bounced .. Mr. > T, > I have a 6" vise, and am trying to get you the following message: > > Grant Erwin wrote: > > > > As the original poster, I can proudly lay claim to pick of the litter! :-) > > > > Seriously, I need one. Can you please tell me how much one is shipped to: > > > > Kirkland, WA 98033 > > > > and let me know how to send you payment? I'll send it promptly! > > > > Grant Erwin ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO List invitation From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 04:52:44 GMT -------- Bill...Grab the stick and pull it back!! teenut WAnliker wrote: > > Hello, > > I would like to invite you to join the CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO mailing list. > > The description of this mailing list is: > > This list is for discussion of CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO. This list is aimed at the > construction and use of this equipment in a Home Shop Machinist environment. It > is not moderated, but I would hope that the discussion will consist of Links, > sources, progress reports, and things of this nature, on the above subjects. It > not aimed at the commercial professional systems, and there users. This list is > a direct result of the discussions on the above subject at NAMES, 1999. > > You can join this list by going to the following web page: > > http://www.onelist.com/subscribe.cgi/CAD_CAM_EDM_DRO > > If you do not wish to join this list, please ignore this message. > > Thanks, > > wanliker@aol.com > List Owner ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How to make a hollow mill? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 05:23:18 GMT -------- EDM will work..depending on size of course, I can't see charging more than $50/60 for the job!! I don't think that a lot of jobbing shops truly understand the way to set prices. They figure...if it takes a skilled man at $25 per hour, 15 minutes to set up a job..on a machine that will run on auto pilot for the next two hours..then they should charge 2 x $25 plus overhead and profit PLUS 2 hours for the machine at whatever they think it is worth..based on what it cost to buy and run, etc. Result..inflated price..idle machine..pissed off customer..lose-lose situation. I figure 15 minutes set up..plus 2 hours COST on a machine that might otherwise be standing idle..plus whatever the market will bearas against..what will I do with this machine..For the NEXT two hours? NOT some theoretical 2 hours next week IF a better paying job comes in!! Bad planning/management? Certainly..If I am Production Manager of a Widget Factory with steady orders..My Job then is to maximise machine utilisation etc. But in a Jobbing shop? I have to have a lot of machines "available" to do a vital task when needed..without them I may as well shut the door. Load them 100%? 50%? 20%?...I should be so lucky!! At 50% I start getting concerned that I need an extra machine! So! My philosophy is this... that any "extra" metal I can cut on that machine REGARDLESS OF ITS COST/VALUE/OVERHEAD....Is essentially cut for FREE!..Other than setup time, power and consumables, anything I can get for time on it, goes directly to pay other, relentless, overheads and costs. Quite apart from that..I get another satisfied customer, who will tell two friends..and who WILL come back! teenut John Flanagan wrote: > > I need to mill a small post with a shoulder and would like to do so in > one plunging operation. The material is brass so a HSS mill is fine. > The question is what is the best way to go about hollowing out the end > of the end mill? > > I looked into EDM, that's around $150 for a shop to do, although I > might be able to do it myself but I've never done EDM. I was thinking > of just chucking a HSS endmill in the lathe and then using a carbide > centercutting endmill of the proper diameter to plunge into the end of > the endmill from the tailstock. Or perhaps chucking the carbide bit > in the mill and holding the HSS endmill in a V-block in the vise... > > Any ideas? Before I destroy two endmills will the carbide idea work? > > BTW, thanks Hoyt for the idea of a hollow mill. I decided this would > be the best way to go. > > John ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How to make a hollow mill? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 05:31:42 GMT -------- How many do you need to do? Between one and few dozen off? Drill and ream a suitable core hole in a length of drill rod. File or mill four teeth in the end, leave a narrow land on the tip of each tooth. Harden in oil or water..depending on steel type, polish and temper back to medium straw. Hone cutting clearance on the lips, Run at 100 SFPM or less, with lots of coolant. I have made hollow mills for running down STEEL bolts, by these methods..and run HUNDREDS of parts before needing to touch up the edges. Be not afraid! teenut Tom Holt wrote: > > > On Sun, 27 Feb 2000 19:42:27 GMT, jflangan@usit.net (John Flanagan) > > wrote: > > > >I need to mill a small post with a shoulder and would like to do so in > > >one plunging operation. The material is brass so a HSS mill is fine. > > >The question is what is the best way to go about hollowing out the end > > >of the end mill? > > How about buying a cheap endmill, annealing it, boring it out on the > lathe in the usual way, rehardening and retempering? Ought to do for > cutting brass. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Lacquering, Before or After? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 05:33:19 GMT -------- Be VERY careful?? teenut Akilli wrote: > > Greetings, > For a project which is an assembly of numerous brass and copper parts, > some of will be rather inaccessible, should a coating of protective lacquer be > applied before or after construction? If the answer is, as I suspect, "before", > are there any special steps which can be taken to ensure the lacquer does not > come off during the assembly process, (aside from "be careful") ? > > Much Obliged, > Ethan Gross ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Help w/ id: Oldest Watchmaker's Lathe I've ever owned????? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 05:38:13 GMT -------- Age..anything from one to two or more centuries. Maker..Obviously a skilled artisan..possibly for his own use, or a "local" customer. We probably will never know his name..I hope he knows we admire his work!! teenut Dave Ficken wrote: > > Greetings, > > I just aquired a real old Watchmaker's Lathe and hope someone in the group > can help identify it. I'd like to know just how old it is and who may have made > it. > > Photos and explaination can be found at: > > http://www.mermac.com/oldlathe.html > > TIA for any help anyone can offer. > > Regards, > > Dave Ficken > Meridian Machinery > http://www.mermac.com > Email:Dave@mermac.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Material identification From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 05:46:14 GMT -------- Non magnetic sugests stainless steel..300 series. Is it rusty?? Another possibility is Monel metal..machines well..but is tough and the chip form suggests tough and ductile. I fyou are "just curious" settle for that...If it is keeping you awake at night..try a variety orf strog and weak acids or alkalies on it. Stainless steel with show reaction with some..Monel is pretty impervious to most things! (Monel? A naturally occuring alloy of Nickel/Copper plus other bits and pieces) teenut "Joe P." wrote: > > I need help trying to identify a piece of round stock that I got from > my local scrap dealer. the mill edge of the bar is painted light blue, > and stamped 18488. It is non-magnetic, and machines freely at low > speeds with hss tool bits, producing a continuous, very sharp chip. > Don't ask how I found this out. SAE numbers would suggest carbon steel > silicon manganese alloy 4% and 88 point carbon? But wouldn't this alloy > be magnetic? Or am I looking at a piece of Austenitic stainless with a > lot # stamped on it? Thanks, Joe > > * Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet's Discussion Network * > The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet - Free! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Got a Craftsman Lathe Today From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 05:53:17 GMT -------- Atlas lathes? Love 'em or depise them..people do both! Fix up? Search your heart as to wether that is how you want to spend your time. Failing that..there are a lot of people will give it a good home. Weekend work? Yes. And if you limit it to one weekend a month..it will last a lifetime. Personally..not for me. But I respect the many people I have known personally, that could do better work on an Atlas, than I could on a Hardinge! teenut John Jacobs wrote: > > A few days ago I aked about a craftsman lathe. Well, I picked it up > today. It was given to me. What a gem. I'm joking. Now I know why it was > free. It only has a four jaw mounted on a craftsman face plate. No > change gears, and what looks like an old washing machine motor. I'm > shure in its day it was a very nice machine. > I'm gonna go look at a sb 9" soon. Thats what I want. Quick change gear > box so I can thread. My question is is this thing worth restoring? It > shows no signs of abuse, just old and neglected. Anyone have one in > operation? Were these lathes made for weekend machinists ? The model # > is 101-L6A s/n 34428. Any info would be greatly appreciated. > > John (never met a machine I didn't like) Jacobs ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Birmingham YCL-1236 Geared Head Lathe From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 05:59:34 GMT -------- Ebay = Cheap National Advertising!! It is a standard format lathe, from the "Great Western Wall, Tractor, Machine Tool and Silk Flower Factory Number 47 B" ..of dubious origin and quality! Good design and robust..but spend a few extra bucks and get the same thing from a reputable seller..Jet, MSC (Good Lord..Even Grizzly!) teenut foxeye wrote: > > Anyone familiar with this lathe? > > http://members.aol.com/norton450/lathe12.html > > For $2,185.00 plus shipping (guessing about 200 to 400 from West coast > to East coast.the price looks pretty good. Quality, ???? Feedback > appreciated. This lathe is advertised on ebay, however the dealer > siad he would sell them out the door for the above price. Don't ask me > why he is advertising on ebay. > > foxeye ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: South Bend 9" Installation From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 06:01:37 GMT -------- Yes! And if you have come far enough to figure that out..you will have no difficulty figuring out the rest! 8^) teenut "Dr. Robert A. Harms" wrote: > > Has anyone had any experiance in mounting the motor carrier in some other > attitude than to the rear. The 33" space requirement is a pain to work > around. > Is it possible to mount the motor cradle on the wall behind the lathe ? > > | > / O==| w > / | a > / | l > lathe | l > _________________| > > ??? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: FS: Rockwell Combo, Horiz/Vert Mill From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 06:11:36 GMT -------- Tasty looking machine Marty..Would be a nice addition to any shop. Now, if you would consider driving about 20 hours EAST to meet me, coming from Atlanta!! teenut Most of the time I LOVE this country..'til it comes to buying and shipping heavy machinery. Then (and only then) I wish I was back in England!!) teenut Marty Escarcega wrote: > > In VERY GOOD to EXCELLENT condition. Rockwell Combination, > Vertical/Horizontal Milling machine. Been gone through and worn parts > replaced. $2500. Offered here before Ebay. If interested, contact me > directly. > > Machine can be seen running under power. Its located in Mesa, AZ > > Pictures and description can be seen at: > http://members.home.net/escarcega/rockcmbo.htm > > Marty ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: "Burgmaster Turret Drill" Questions From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 06:15:30 GMT -------- I know and love/hate Burgmeisters! I am looking for one myself. Great machine until something goes wrong..It takes a long time..they are VERY well made. But when it does..buy another one!! teenut GSSVIOLIN wrote: > > Hi group, > > Anyone familar with a Burgmaster, model 1D Turret Drill? Likes and > dislikes,etc. Are parts available for them? > > I'm going to be in the need for a light duty production drill with tapping > capabilities. I've located two in my area that are for sale. I thought it > might be a good idea to do a little footwork before I make an attempt at either > opportunity. One of the machines is apparently in need of some repair.... One > station doesn't work. That is why I'm enquiring about avaiability of parts. > > Thanks in advance, > > Greg ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Can I 'plane' with a lathe From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 06:19:14 GMT -------- Yes..It is done all the time by HSMs. Try to get a copy of "Milling in the Lathe" By Edgar T Westbury. Nexus Prees available from Tee Publishing in the UK...Do a web search for them, you can order it online. teenut Jim Washer wrote: > > I'm new to this... in fact, my lathe hasn't even arrived yet, so this may be > a bit silly... > > Not having a milling machine, I was wondering if I could could chuck some > sort of cutter in the lathes 3jaw chuck, and support it at the far end with > the tailstock, and then use it somewhat like a horizontal mill to plane the > surface of a workpiece? > > - jim ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: The ole' sliver trick. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 06:31:10 GMT -------- Even in England, "Bodging" has two, entirely different meanings! Now YOU explain what a "Bodger" does..as opposed to a "Bodged" job!! 8^) teenut Dave Baker wrote: > > >> On Sun, 27 Feb 2000 03:12:04 GMT, Robert Bastow wrote: > >> > >> >Mike, You win this months "teenut Award for Innovation in Bodgery" > > He goes out into the woods and makes chair legs on a treadle lathe ??? Well > I'll be..... > > Dave Baker at Puma Race Engines (London - England) - specialist cylinder head > work, flow development and engine blueprinting. Web page at > http://members.aol.com/pumaracing/index.htm ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: TEENUT! your email bounces .. was Re: Kurt swivel bases From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 06:35:05 GMT -------- Marty Escarcega wrote: > > Yes, Teenut's email bounces when you email reply to him directly from one > of his posts. ANTI-SPAM bogus address. Try this email address for him: > teenut@hotmail.com > > You've been found out Teenut... > > Marty RATS!! tee ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Enco Precision Milling Machine Vice? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 07:16:37 GMT -------- If this is a "Lifetime" purchase..buy a Gerardi!! teenut Jeff Pack wrote: > > yes, but neither done very well... > > my advise... > > if its for a machine you will keep, buy the Kurt. > If not, buy a copy... > > Clark Magnuson wrote in message > news:38BA03D5.63694106@home.com... > > Is the Kurt clone hardened and ground? > > TIA Clark ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 1/2" 16 TPI thread form answer to earlier query From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 28 Feb 2000 08:22:35 GMT -------- Notwithstanding that it has a lesser theoretical "shear" area my "Gut" feel (And that is all it is..absent hard evidence" is that the whitworth form is less prone to shear ..if only due to the radiused root and crest. After all..when you look at a sectioned view through a MATING male and female thread...both have the same area in shear resistance through the pitch line diameter..Ie. 100% metal. Thus the only real differenciating factor becomes the reistance to fatigue and shear at the point of greatest stress..logically the thread root. Square threads? Frankly I find them easier to cut than vee..grind to pitch width by micrometer..and it is a simple, helical "parting" cut..until you hit the minor diameter...no peeing around with pitch diameter measurements, vee angles, root or crest forms...In and out like Flynn! teenut Jack Erbes wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > One thing that continues to amaze me Jack, is that even the most meticulous, top > > flight, Rifle Smiths and Barrel Makers, continue to assert that 1.10"-12 tpi, 60 > > deg "American" thread is "Fine" for use in the 1.10" 12 tpi 55 deg Whitworth > > Form thread used in the 98 Mauser receiver! > > Yep, I heard that same story. I will begrudgingly admit that it can be > made to work "okay" but it was not in my shop. It only takes a few > minutes to turn a 60 degree threading tool into a 55, can't understand > why some smiths couldn't take the time. They must have been the guys > with bigger wrenches or lots of Loctite :>). > > > Mauser was a METICULOUS designer..He didn't choose the Whitworth form over the > > Metric/American 60 deg form, without a damn good reason..it being, that it is, > > overall, a STRONGER thread form. > > It that stronger in shear? I think there is more metal to shear with a > 60. > > I wonder how V and square threads compare for strength? As much of a > PITA as they are to cut, I have always had an inordinate fondness for > the square threads in the Springfield, Enfield, and old rolling blocks. > A lot less advance and crush in those once the barrel hits the action > face. > > -- > Jack in Sonoma, CA, USA (jack@vom.com) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Enco Precision Milling Machine Vice? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 29 Feb 2000 07:26:28 GMT -------- The Gerardi isn't just avice..it is a complete work holding system. All components are made from hardened tool steel at around 60/62 Rc Ground to tenth thou limits The base is two inches thick, fixed jaw is bolted to it and can be reversed, to grip inside the job if required, The sliding jaw acts on dog notches in the body..much like a screwless tool maker's grinding vice. The jaws, which are interchangeable, actually slide down an incline as the vise is tightened..such that back AND front jaws are both pulling down on the job. Bedding, free of lift is absolutely guaranteed. As all the components are interchangeable and "NC Qualified: the basic vice becomes an expandable unit.a sub- base, about six inches long will extend the gripping range the full length of the mill table, if required. Hydraulic/ hand or full automatic, hydraulic clamping cn be added as required. All in all a very versatile, accurate and robust system..The fact that the body is solid steel, and of heavier section, makes it about five or more times stiffer than a Kurt! As I said..once you have driven one..You will never be happy with "ordinary transportation" again! Prices?..very reasonable considering the huge performance gain..start at a hundred or so higher than a similar sized Kurt. teenut Jeff Pack wrote: > I've never seen one, ergo they dont exist until then... :) > > Actually, until you mentioned it in the other thread, I'd > never heard of one before either... > > so what makes these so ,much better than a Kurt? > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote in message > news:phpu4.2493$ps1.142515@news1.rdc1.ga.home.com... > > If this is a "Lifetime" purchase..buy a Gerardi!! > > > > teenut > > > > Jeff Pack wrote: > > > > > > yes, but neither done very well... > > > > > > my advise... > > > > > > if its for a machine you will keep, buy the Kurt. > > > If not, buy a copy... > > > > > > Clark Magnuson wrote in message > > > news:38BA03D5.63694106@home.com... > > > > Is the Kurt clone hardened and ground? > > > > TIA Clark ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT-British Gun Laws Update (long and farther OT) From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 29 Feb 2000 07:40:26 GMT -------- OK, Enough already..Please quit Cross-Posting from your Looney Fringe News Groups! teenut J & F Higham wrote: > Gunner wrote: > > > > J & F Higham wrote: > > > > >Gunner > > > > (snip) > > Everyone is selective in quoting sources when trying to make ones point on any subject. Whats new? > > Not correct Gunner. The citation of sources varies according to the > medium. For example, newspapers will occasionally quote sources and > say something along the lines of "President Clinton stated today at a > lunch which was hosted by the NRA that the gun owners of America > were....". Sometimes they will just refer to a 'reliable source' or a > similarly useless 'statistics released by the XYZ reveal that...'. > The article to which I referred was a supposedly serious University > research paper. It is quite acceptable to be selective in sources in > an ng where supporting an expressed opinion is the aim of the > discussion, such is not the case in serious University research. The > citation of sources is a very telling factor in checking on the > veracity, reliability and thoroughness of the author's work if they > are not writing an item of fiction. > > > So, you have not been reading the info contained in each URL then. Contrary to what I gather you are > > trying to portray.... each URL has pointed to UPDATED information. If I had simply gone back and > > quoted the same document, I would have been called on it long ago. As I indicated, I try to update > > the knowledge base of the folks whom are interested in this topic. Each time I find a new article, > > or source, I endevor to post it. The more info, the greater the diversity of sources, the better to > > arm ones self with. > > As a regular reader of this ng I try to follow up on all URLs posted. > Sometimes the information they contain is very useful, sometimes they > are very ordinary and sometimes they simply make me wonder whether the > poster is resident on this planet, but I do follow them up. I admit > that I don't read all URLs thoroughly. A lot can be assessed within > the first few paragraphs and I simply do not have time to read > rubbish. This criticism does not necessarily apply to any or all of > your URLs, but merely a reflection on URLs given in totality. > > I do not dispute that the URLs you post are not repeats; it is the > quality of some of the URLs and the aftermath that I am complaining > about and the > majority of the URLs make me wonder why you aren't posting them to a > gun ng where the issue is truly pertinent. I know if I wanted to > follow up on gun bans I'd read a gun group and not one called > alt.survival. > > I do not automatically accept any information I find solely on the > fact that it agrees with a view in which I may passionately believe. > I make an assessment about the quality of the information. There is a > lot of rubbish on the internet and there is also a lot of extremely > good information that it would take me ages to access from a library. > Some information, especially experiential information, I know would > not exist outside cyber space and yet again some of that is of top > quality and some is pure dross. > > I do see guns as being important to survival but wading through a ton > of chaff to find one kernel of wheat > (to use your previous analogy) is tedious when the ng is in fact about > survival and that encompasses much more than simply guns. This ng is > in very serious danger of becoming purely a gun group and I have a > great deal of sympathy for the view expressed by a UK poster who > complained that this group no longer survival based. You are adding > to that loss of focus and simply causing more chaff production. > > (snip) what better source to protray the British > > mindset on the guncontrol issue, than the Times, et al? Were not these the same papers which cried > > so loudly for the draconian gun control that transpired in the UK? If I posted NRA info, the data > > could be decried as bogus, or heavily slanted, by the Antis. Not so by using the original anti > > sources itself. And I reckon, rather fitting. > > Mindset? What are you talking about? The article says absolutely > nothing that could relate to a British mindset on gun control. It is > merely an article giving statistical estimates from an unnamed source > on illegal guns and activities among criminals in a few selected UK > locations and > largely black criminals at that. The article tells me absolutely > nothing about the British attitudes to gun control and tells me > nothing meaningful about British criminal activity either. What can > be inferred about race and crime in the UK is also questionable and > may simply be the view of the writer in this instance or the ongoing > view of the paper but I have no way of telling from one isolated > article. > > The Times may have called for gun control but the article says nothing > that suggests that it now views the introduction of legislation as > being either draconian > or whether they are now calling for further gun control. You may > think it is rather fitting to quote the article but I fail to see why > since it says so little. It certainly does nothing to illuminate the > British gun control 'mindset'. The only purpose it has served is to > bring forth ire on the part of the UK residents you claim to be > informing and nationalistic fervour from US posters who choose to post > about teeth and sheep and and a whole range of other non sequiturs. > > > > > > (snip) The Antis here in the States have been holding the UK up as a > shining > > example of how well gun control works. We are now seeing just how well disarming the population > > works, and how the rising crime rate in the UK and Oz is directly tied to confistigation, and we can > > surmise logicly that the same will follow here in the States if allowed to happen here. > > > > > (snip) > > Look at your rising crime stats, the proliferation of guns in criminal hands, the increase in > > killings with automatic weapons, and you tell me it was right for your country. > > Are you sure you are not confused about which country you are writing > about? I don't know about the UK but when it comes to Australian > crime rates, guns in criminal hands and increased killings from > automatic weapons, it seems that you are claiming to know > something that is not known in Australia by those who collect and > analyse the data. If you bother to check out the Australian Institute > of Criminology at http://www.aic.gov.au/publications/tandi/ti116.pdf > you might be able to base future comments on fact. > The available information simply does not support your view. > > If the 'Antis' in the US are claiming that Australia is a shining > example, then they are being precipitate as the jury is still out on > whether the reduction in death rates from fire arms following > introduction of the legislation is merely a 'blip' in the statistics > or an ongoing trend. > > > > > > > >If you wish to connect a massacre in another country to the possible > > >result of unwanted US legislation that deprives US citizens of gun > > >ownership, then I believe this to be very dubious. Surely if all the > > >massacres in US schoolyards and other places have not yet resulted in > > >more than 'anti-gun rhetoric' then you don't seriously have a great > > >deal to worry about. Even if such a policy was ever put into place > > >(which will happen when hell freezes over from what I've seen and > > >read), would you or the many other gun owners hand over their guns? > > >I'll bet London to a brick on that the answer is a resounding 'No!'. > > >I sincerely think you're tilting at windmills Gunner. > > When the US legislation is based on just how well it works in other countries... it is of concern. > > The policies are already in place in many US states. SKS Sporter ban/buy back. Assault rifle ban, > > etc etc. You evidently are not familiar with the status of ongoing gun control here in the States. > > You may wish to educate yourself. Your provinicality is showing. > > Nice try Gunner, but I've been insulted by experts and they all knew a > darn sight more about my background, history and carapace chinks than > you do. > > Just which nation do you think is responsible for introducing the word > 'lobbyist' to the English language? As a resident in a democracy you > would know that no government takes action that will result in it > losing government. Governments in a democracy now seldom move to > introduce any legislation of even slight contention unless the > proposed change has been thoroughly researched and the impact on the > ballot box assessed. > > The argument that the US takes into account legislation in other > countries is a blind and you have been duped by it. The richest, most > powerful nation on earth has no need to take into account what is > going on in other countries. The generation of lots of publicity on > an issue can impact on legislative change but it is what the electors > think and how that will be translated into votes at the next election > that is the deciding factor. > > I do not believe that the American public is incapable of forming an > opinion and moreover they are perfectly capable of translating their > opinion into votes. If you take the recent thread as an example, you > will notice that the US posters did not choose to believe what the UK > residents had to say. The UK posters are much closer to the problem > than the US posters and even though a common survival interest exists > between the two groups and this frequently leads to tolerance and a > wish to understand, the US posters were not prepared to accept what > the UK posters had to say. That should tell you something about the > differences between reality and perception. > > Self interest is the prime mover in how most people make their > decisions and how they view the world and not what happens in other > countires. Better to look to what is happening in your own backyard > and what self interest is at work than waste your time getting worried > about the happenings in another country. The Antis may be using the > information but it is just a tool (or a selective quotation of sources > if you want to view it that way); look for the self interest and that > is where they will be weakest and vulnerable to attack. > > > > (snip) > > When the confistication of weapons in the UK and Oz are aided and abetted by the frenzied posts of > > the popular press, whom followed the wishes of the State in that manner... can it NOT be called > > State Propaganda? The Sun, Times etc can be held up as shining examples of State Propaganda (at > > least in the Gun Control issue) when they popularize the desires of the State to remove firearms > > from the hands of honest British subjects. Oz is another example. And unfortunatly, are many medias > > here in the US, whom follow the Party Line. There is a vast difference in reporting the news, as > > opposed to :making the news: > > What you have written is turgid, paranoid nonsense. The written and > electronic press in both the UK and Australia do not operate > substantially differently from in the US. Some are relatively > reliable and some are not worth the time involved in reading or > listening to them. The > Times is one of the more reputable ones (albeit, since Rupert's > arrival, not as good as it once > was) while The Sun is only good as a lining in a cat litter box. > > You'd probably get a better understanding of what constitutes > propaganda in the press if you took time to understand Rupert's world > view. He is ruled primarily by what suits his business interests and > occasionally by his foibles, the rest of the time he really doesn't > give the proverbial rat's arse for what any Government thinks or acts. > > In London in the mid '70s we lived in a group house in London that was > caught up in an IRA seige which became known as 'the Balcombe Street > seige'. For weeks we had to pass many times daily through a police > cordon and we were always almost attacked by reporters after we passed > through. I have very fond memories of bating Sun reporters as they > rushed us. The reporters from other papers seemed to enjoy our bating > as much, if not more, than we did. The Sun was scummy then and > certainly has not improved in the intervening time even though it does > have a huge production run. > > If you cannot differentiate between 'State Propaganda' and a reputable > newspaper that is doing it's job, I suggest you have a rethink based > directly on one specific US example. I hardly think that Tricky Dicky > Nixon would consider > the Washington Post and the New York Times to have been an agents for > State Propaganda. > > > > > > >The only UK based person who seems to support your view is Yan and > > >he/she hopes that your posts might educate even 'one free thinking > > >person'. The hairs on the back of my neck always stand up when I hear > > >this phrase or the similar, 'right thinking person'. It always seems > > >to mean 'someone who thinks just like me' and that always worries me. > > >He/she may not like what the British press writes or the information > > >coming from the anti gun organisations but they have a right to > > >present their view even if he/she has a strong objection to it. > > > > You should read my email from other Brits.... Yan is not a unique exception. It always worries me > > when a person is demontsrativly correct, and is vilified by the "masses" for his politicaly > > incorrect views. You appear to be contridicting your self here... you may not like the information > > coming from the Pro-gun organizations, but they (and I) have a right to present our views even if > > he/she has a strong objection to it. Hypocritical arn't you? > > I accept what you say about your e-mail but I am surprised given your > statement, that they have not bothered to post to the list. Most > Brits I have come across are highly skilled in presenting an argument > and most can do it objectively. > > I am however beginning to have doubts about your skills when it comes > to > comprehension. > > Try rereading what I wrote. I made no statement about whether I > thought Yan was demonstrably correct or demonstrably incorrect. I > said that Yan supported your view. I commented on the choice of words > Yan used. If you have never noticed that those words are usually used > by people who wish to garner support for a view (irrespective of what > that actual view may be) then I cannot be blamed for your > inattentiveness. All individuals want to be considered as being 'free > thinking' or 'right' thinking or otherwise we would have to consider > ourselves as 'slave thinking' or 'wrong thinking' and consequently I > hate those words with a passion. Using these words means that I'm > being told what is the 'right' or 'free' thing to think. I like to > make up my own mind and not be told that this is the view I should > take if I wish to be considered 'right' or 'free'. Do you understand > that? > > I made no statement at all about the rights of the Pro-guns > organisations to present their views. They have every right to > present whatever views they choose and to do so in whatever forum they > choose so long as it complies with the relevant laws of the country in > which they are located. Of course, the same would also apply to any > anti-gun lobby. > > Simply because I make a statement about one side of the coin and do > not also make a statement about the other side of the coin does not > mean that I have contradicted myself. I simply commented on one and > not on another. Do you understand that? > > Please do me the common coutesy of reading what I actually wrote and > do not invent things that you THINK I have > written but have not. > > > > > > > > >There has not been one comment on this thread that you have started > > >that has any connection with survival issues so I fail to see how you > > >can possibly argue that you are posting it because some people do not > > >understand a gun/survival connection. All the posts have either been > > >about the situation in the UK or arguments about who supported who in > > >WWII or the Falklands or who has bad teeth or is overweight or what > > >happened to Washington in the 19th century. None of that (except > > >perhaps weight) has any bearing on current survival. Why don't you > > >post this stuff to a gun ng and post survival URLs instead? > > > > If you cannot make the reach necessary to link survivalism, and the use of weapons (which are now > > unabailable in the UK for all practical purposes) as tools most helpful in surviving, your narrow > > views and personal slant have blinded you to reality, and you are unlikely to be smart enough to > > survive. Imagine if the posted subject was the banning of water filters? Would that not be a survial > > issue as well? > > Haven't you been reading what has been posted following your Times URL > post? Tell > me, what do teeth, weight, Washington in the 19th century, the > Falklands War, arses kicked at Dunkirk, sheep, sheep with claws, sheep > being elected to Congress, Guns to Britain in WWII, Freud, NATO etc > have to > do with survival? Your response makes you sound obtuse and I had in > the post assessed you rather differently. > How difficult can it be for you to understand that I am saying that > the Times URL was not at all useful, had no impact on survival issues > and did not lead to useful discussion? You simply have to look at > the posts which have resulted from your URL to make that assessment. > The same thing has also occurred following other URLs you have posted > but admittedly not all of them. Surely you must spend some time > reflecting on the consequences and outcomes of your actions and assess > whether it was successful or not. It is fairly basic to survival and > if you automatically adopt it in all situations in which you > participate then you have a better chance of doing so in a real > survival situation. Resorting to aggression and insults is suggestive > of an unthinking response and that can be self destructive. All I am > asking of you is that you actually spent some time thinking about the > URLs you post and that you make an assessment based on the name of > this ng. The mere presence of the word 'gun' does not necessarily > equal survival. > > Just how many times do I have to say to you that I believe guns are > important > for survival before you take on board my statements? I put a lot of > effort in writing what I believe is perfectly understandable prose but > if you do not recognise what I am writing then I cannot do more. As a > final effort I will repeat myself: I do see guns as being very > important in survival. Would it help you if I put it in caps? > > I would also suggest that I have a very sound view of reality and how > guns may be factored into a survival situation. The simple possession > of guns does not work in all survival situations as I know from direct > experience. A little over a year ago an 'incident' occurred that > could have results in the death of one or all of my family and guns > would have been of no assistance in the circumstances. The case is > due to be finalised soon but no doubt there will be the usual appeals > and it will drag on for much longer. > > Guns are very useful, but I do believe that the mere possession of > them can lull one into a sense of false security and blind one to > other threats. > > Following the 'incident' our property was assessed by a top security > firm. Despite the reputation and the standing of this firm (and the > high cost of the service), they did not identify a number of areas > which I consider to be a real weakness and they did not even mention > the one area where we are truly vulnerable and about which we can do > nothing. Needless to say we have made some plans based on that > experience. > > > > > > >If you can't lay off perhaps we could divert the topic to something > > >with a more survivalist flavour. > > > Each to his own. Feel free to enter my data into your kill-file. Feel free to enter hell. > > For Heavens sake Gunner stop acting like a tantrum throwing two year > old. If you feel compelled to issue > insults and aggression when faced with some fairly simple written > comments that call you on your action and logic how are you going to > cope when faced with a real emergency? You really should take some > time to reflect on how you cope when someone does not agree with you. > A response based on anger suggests a lack of control and an inability > to stay calm and act after thought and that could be very dangerous in > a survival situation. > > > > > > >I saw something the other day that said that cardio-vascular surgery > > >was now the most common form of surgery performed in the US today and > > >that this was considered to be a direct result of 30% of the US > > >population being obese. Now I find it hard to believe that 30% of the > > >US population could be considered to be obese as opposed to merely > > >overweight. It was a US article and I don't know where they got their > > >statistics (which seem very exaggerated to me) but it started me > > >wondering what sort of food storage program one would have to have in > > >order to cater for those who are outside the range of what could be > > >considered a 'normal' healthy weight and also what measures one would > > >need to take to ensure survival if one did fall into either an > > >underweight, overweight or obese category. Any thoughts? > > > > hehe... nice Segway... the US is fat thread/insult with a smooze into food storage. Nice, very nice. > > Thats been explored before in depth by other posters however. Be a bit more original, and do try to > > keep up. > > I thought you might like that one and I'm glad it didn't escape you. > If you believe that it is alright for you to troll with the chaff > making URLs why do you object to me doing so? > > As for keeping up, I don't see that I have a problem. To summarise on > your signature blck: Our evacuation plans have been tested in a real > live survival situation and they worked brilliantly. I can butcher a > hog and change a 'diaper' and I can also filter water without a water > filter and much more besides. I am not interested in planning an > invasion but I do know how I would 'take out' someone in our situation > and it would not be the way used against us. My way is much more > devious and deadly. I have lived and can live without electricity. I > know what native plants I can eat but would have trouble if I had to > solely rely on them. I hope to ever avoid the need to fight by using > my brain and the natural protection afforded by a remote location and > the few resident neighbours who understand the concept of > cooperation. As for dying, I don't really care whether I do it > gallantly or not, dead is final and gallantry is a romantic notion > that I can do without. I have guns, I know how to use them but I do > not see them as a sole protection in any situation. They are a simple > tool and do not have some mystical ability to give me protection > against someone who can think more inventively and more deviously than > I can and who can figure out a way to attack without being obvious. > > All I an asking of you Gunner is that you make an effort to get the > point. Think about your posts and assess whether they are survival > based or not. If they are just about guns, post elsewhere. If they > combine guns and survival then please do post them here. It is very > simple and my complaint is a very simple one. I cannot understand why > you feel the need to issue insults and why you seem to have such > difficulty understanding what is such a simple issue. The only > explanation that would seem to fit your reaction is that you are so > gun obssessed that you cannot step back and look at the issue > dispassionately and that guns to you are a sole focus in survival. If > that is the case then I hope that the only survival issue to ever > confront you is one that can be solved by guns. > > Our experience has been different and we did manage to survive. I > don't consider myself to be particualrly smart, but I am observant, > realistic, pragmatic but perhaps most importantly calm. We took > action when the police rang to wake us after midnight and told us to > evacuate and we did so without panic and knowing precisely what we > were doing. Our evacuation took less than 5 minutes and that included > a number of checks which had to be performed based on the nature of > the threat and the collection of domestic animals. I have every > reason to believe that I am well prepared and that I can survive in a > lot of situations. I am not deluded enough to think that I can > survive all situations but based on risk assessment I have no doubts > about my abilities or those of my family in the majority of situations > which we could realistically be expected to face. > > Fran > > > --------------------------------------------------------- > > > > "A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an > > invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write > > a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort > > the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, > > solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program > > a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die > > gallantly. Specialization is for insects." Robert Heinlein ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Why Not to BY Cheap Imports! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 01 Mar 2000 03:29:58 GMT -------- "The Road to Excellence is paved with Attention to Detail. It begins with the removal of all possible excuses!" teenut's Law. In other words: Buy the best available tools..and try to match their demands..With no place to hide from your own shortcomings!! teenut Edward Haas wrote: > > --Those who buy crap support the notion that crap is good enough. > Conversely, those who buy excellent stuff subscribe to the notion that > excellence is preferred. I buy the best when I can, because I want the > stuff to work forever, withough having to tinker on it all of the time. > Starret, Clausing, etc have, over the years, demonstrated this latter > philosophy and they'll get my business every time. If more folks get into > this camp, it becomes more likely that overall quality of *all* > tools offered to us *might* improve a bit. Wouldn't it be great if > Clausing came out with a really great small mill and/or lathe again? Not > likely, of course, since all of their old ones still command a premium > price, but imaging never having to whine about what isn't right on the > tools you use! Imagine firing up the tool and actually *making* something > with it, first time, every time. Imagine having the occasional spare part > *available*. I'd buy domestic every time if only for this reason. > > -- > "Steamboat Ed" Haas : Just a B4 guy > Watch link rot in action! : in an A4 world... > http://www.nmpproducts.com > ---Decks a-wash in a sea of words--- ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: CBX dro vs. leadscrew From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 01 Mar 2000 03:53:10 GMT -------- Old Chinese teenut proverb: Man with only leadscrew or DRO always know exactly where he is. Man with both never sure! teenut Hugh Strong wrote: > > On a related subject: > > Does the CBX have any significant backlash itself? As I > remember, it is a rack-based system. > > -- Hugh > > "Eastburn" wrote in message > news:38BB5F9A.332E6A71@pacbell.net... > > I agree - > > > > a 1/8" pin (slightly warn from use) sliding in a 3/16 > worm - > > > > Not your numbers - but useful in example. > > > > You need to take out the backlash and recalibrate if you > reverse. > > Always start out with a positive back force on the handle. > > > > > > BUT - a DRO should take that into account. e.g. it > measures what > > the slide does, not what the handle does. The handle has > the slop/backlash. > > > > So something seems rotten here - somewhere. What are you > reading? > > Should always read going the same direction - e.g. turn > and calibrate with knob - > > log the CBX. I think you might have gone out one mode and > came back in the > > other mode - turned and calibrated with CBX and logged > knob... > > > > > > Martin > > -- > > NRA LOH, NRA Life > > NRA Second Amendment Task Force Charter Founder > > Martin Eastburn, Barbara Eastburn > > @ home on our computer oldtree@pacbell.net ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Morse taper -- on the level. Was: Anyone see Traveling Roadshow? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 01 Mar 2000 03:58:19 GMT -------- You have obviously never lived out West....Where Cow Chip throwing is an athletic art form! teenut tonyp wrote: > > boris beizer wrote in part: > > > I'm going to have to find a hobby for which it is impossible to > > generate a collector mania -- how about petrified bison droppings? > > That won't work. What _can_ one do with petrified bison droppings except > collect them? > > :-) Tony P. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Floor mounting From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 01 Mar 2000 04:01:47 GMT -------- The only machine lagged to the floor in my 8000 sq ft Tool and Die shop, is an ancient wide belt sander, that tends to fall over if you bear down too hard on it! teenut Garrett Fulton wrote: > > Just unloaded into the garage an old '64 vintage Millrite 8" X 32" vertical > mill after becoming disgusted for the last time with trying to mill on my > Shoptask. (No knee or rigidity.) I am an amateur and lurker, but very > impressed with the knowledge of the contributors to this list. I was > wondering if anyone had any experience with this machine and their opinion > of it. Also, in all the machine shops I've been in, it always seemed to me > that the machines were bolted to the floor. In the factory manual for the > Millrite it states,"We do not recommend lagging the machine to the floor." > Why? > > Garrett Fulton ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Does Enco sell returned goods?? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 01 Mar 2000 04:16:12 GMT -------- When? Where? teenut raffles97@my-deja.com wrote: > > MSC sells truck loads of returned merchandise all the time. Mostly > bought be dealers as the company won't spend the time to deal with > individual one time shoppers. I was told they are planning another tent > sale like the one last year in Atlanta. > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Morse taper -- on the level. Was: Anyone see Traveling Roadshow? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 01 Mar 2000 04:17:00 GMT -------- Cat Pee! teenut Bruce Carlisle wrote: > > Anybody know how to put a patina on these fresh bison droppings to make them > look like the old and collectable ones? ;-) > > Bruce Carlisle ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: view camera plans? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 02 Mar 2000 04:08:05 GMT -------- I have one of those early Polaroid-Land, folding view, cameras in mint condition,,Case and all. I was under the impression it was worthless and was working my way down the shop storage to sling it in the can! Is it indeed worth the powder to blow it to hell? teenut Marv Soloff wrote: > > Gunner wrote: > > > I may get flamed for this..., but when considering various lenses, pick up a couple EARLY > > Polaroid cameras at your local second hand store (the big clunky ones with the leatherette > > covering), for $5.00 They were typically high end Wollensack lens and shutters and make an awesome > > view camera lens. Nice and contrasty, and very sharp. I even have a couple on boards that have X > > sync for use with a strobe. > > > > Gunner > > > > Generally only the Polaroid 110, 110a and 110b. There are others in the > Polaroid line with mechanical (versus electronic/electric) shutters, > but if you savage one of them, the Polaroid Collectors Club will come > after you and do serious harm. > > Regards, > > Marv ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: view camera plans? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 02 Mar 2000 04:54:36 GMT -------- OK..I just checked..and mine's a 900. Det Cord anyone? teenut Marv Soloff wrote: > > Gunner wrote: > > > > On Wed, 01 Mar 2000 22:08:04 GMT, Marv Soloff wrote: > > > > >Gunner wrote: > > > > > >> I may get flamed for this..., but when considering various lenses, pick up a couple EARLY > > >> Polaroid cameras at your local second hand store (the big clunky ones with the leatherette > > >> covering), for $5.00 They were typically high end Wollensack lens and shutters and make an awesome > > >> view camera lens. Nice and contrasty, and very sharp. I even have a couple on boards that have X > > >> sync for use with a strobe. > > >> > > >> Gunner > > >> > > > > > > > > >Generally only the Polaroid 110, 110a and 110b. There are others in the > > >Polaroid line with mechanical (versus electronic/electric) shutters, > > >but if you savage one of them, the Polaroid Collectors Club will come > > >after you and do serious harm. > > > > > >Regards, > > > > > >Marv > > > > Polaroid Collector$ Club? Now they tell me....... ooops..... > > > > Gunner > > > > Gunner: The reason I hung that last bit about the PCC was this: > two specific Polaroid models, the 180 and the 195 were built in Europe > and Japan for the "professional" market and take the current 3 x 4 pack > films. Both have integral mechanical lens/shutter combinations and are > highly sought after as "user" cameras by both collectors and photo > professionals. Current value on the used market about $500 each in > good/mint condition. It's OK (for now) to rob the excellent lens and > shutter from the 110 series, but stay far, far away from the 180 and > 195's. > > Regards, > > Marv ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Floor mounting From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 02 Mar 2000 05:02:00 GMT -------- No. Certain larger machine tools..lathes, floor borers etc rely on very accurate leveling and a special concrete floor/foundation, as part of their "Structure" They are levelled, bolted and grouted in. A lot of older machines were lightly built by today's standards and had to be bolted down to give the needed rigidity. OTOH modern tools tend towards much more massive and rigid steel box weldments or castings and can happily function at an angle of 45 deg to level!! The Fadal VMC I am expecting shortly is simply plonked on resiliant pads. teenut RobHarMill wrote: > > >Subject: Re: Floor mounting > >From: Robert Bastow "teenut"@hotmail.com > >Date: 2/29/00 11:01 PM Eastern > > >The only machine lagged to the floor in my 8000 sq ft Tool and Die shop, is > >an > >ancient wide belt sander, that tends to fall over if you bear down too hard > >on > >it! > > question--- is this the only reason (instability) that you bolt any machine > down? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Floor mounting From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 02 Mar 2000 05:07:59 GMT -------- Not unless I am installing a 30 foot floor borer..then I rent an aouto collimator..haven't done that in years (Hope never to do it again!!) I have a Moore & Wright "Precision" Level..good for about .0005" per foot, and that does for me. As I have previously stated: So long as it doesn't look crooked from across the room, and so long as the oil and coolant levels are draining the right way, I don't pay in-ordinate attention to "Dead Level" It is simply a means to get things reasonably close..befor doing test bar and turning tests. teenut George Glines wrote: > > teenut, > > Do you use those fancy and expensive machine levelers or ??? > > Thanks, > > George > > "Robert Bastow" <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote in message > news:LC0v4.2731$ps1.144622@news1.rdc1.ga.home.com... > > The only machine lagged to the floor in my 8000 sq ft Tool and Die shop, > is an > > ancient wide belt sander, that tends to fall over if you bear down too > hard on > > it! > > > > teenut > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: sheet copper patinas??? Any one ??? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 02 Mar 2000 15:43:31 GMT -------- Cat pee! teenut Ed Baker wrote: > > I want to patina the 16 Oz. copper roof on my little bay window... besides > paint... does any one know what chemicals I would use? > > ed@tamillwork.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: FAQ list for this group From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 02 Mar 2000 18:06:12 GMT -------- You just did!! ;^) Teenut woodwright@my-deja.com wrote: > > Does this group have an FAQ list anywhere. I'd rather > search it first before asking a question that's probably > already been answered a hundred times before. tnx. > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Bandsaw question. purpose built metal saw vs converted wood saw From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 02 Mar 2000 18:13:28 GMT -------- Jim Washer wrote: > > I've seen a few post over the years talking about gearing down various > woodworker's bandsaw for use in the metal shop. As I'm in the market for a > bandsaw for my (soon to be) metal shop, I have a few questions. > > 1) What do people do for coolant on a converted bandsaw? Most vertical bandsaws..including heavy industrial ones do not use coolant. > > 2) Does a converted bandsaw come close to equalling a real metal cutting > bandsaw. Sure..of a light variety. Set it up accurately, use roller guides and use it with a bit of commonsense and it will do a fine job. > > On a slightly different note, I see that some of the tilt-over 'automatic' > cutoff bandsaws have a small table and can be used upright. Any comments on > using on of these in the upright position? Barely adequate and exquisitely uncomfortable!! > > Finally, would I be better off buying a nice plasma cutter and forgetting > the bandsaw? Yes, I know that's a vague question. To help clarify things a > bit, I want the bandsaw mostly for cutting small notches(1"x1") in 1/2" > plate and for cutting 'welding test coupons'. > > thanks > - jim Different horses for different courses. A plasma cut, weld coupon will have different metallurgical properties than a bandsawed one! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Is Teenut actually Robert Heinlein? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 03 Mar 2000 05:19:32 GMT -------- If I had a clue who Robert Heinlein is/was I might be qualified to comment! BTW I have been called a lot of things in my life..Heinlein is just one more! teenut eberlein wrote: > > Robert, > > They are using your name in vain on the ATTN: GUNNER thread. Personally, I think > it's a pretty good comparison. > > Regards, > > Mike ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Machine shop sales reps From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 03 Mar 2000 05:50:52 GMT -------- Growth doesn't come easily or cheaply..but without sales you ain't goin' nowhere. Look upon it as an investment..just as you would a new piece of equipment..and hire a GOOD Sales guy for a guaranteed salary plus a small commision with a promise of bonuses and a review as he hits certain target levels. However..be sure you can handle the volume of work he/she (Mine's a Woman!!) brings in..and be prepared to invest whatever it takes to keep the growth moving. By that I mean; Don't expect to just load your shop with the optimum amount of work and stop there! You are about to sow the wind..be prepared to reap the wirlwind!! teenut dkmachine@my-deja.com wrote: > > How does a small (1-2) man machine shop find a sales rep? > Most rep's won't bother with a shop unless they do 1/2-1 mil > a year in sales. That's understandable, as they want a worth > while commission for their efforts. I've got manual and CNC machines, > but have a hard time finding enough work & would like to grow the biz > to 10-20 people. Any rep's out there to help toe small shop grow? > DK > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Darwin nominee From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 03 Mar 2000 14:50:49 GMT -------- Ouch! That could spoil your whole day! I hope he didn't go in feet first! teenut Bob Paulin wrote: > > Thursday night in Maine.... > > A jammed brush chipper......Positive identification required DNA testing. > > http://www.centralmaine.com/news/stories/000303carrier_.shtml ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Is Teenut actually Robert Heinlein? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 04 Mar 2000 05:28:57 GMT -------- Now why would I waste the time doing research on a name I have been called? A) I don't give a good God Damn! B) I've been called worse! C) You are leaving some other poor bugger alone! D) I haven't had time to waste on reading a work of fiction since I was about ten years old ! E) I'm just disappointed you couldn't think up a more appropriate insult for teenut! teenut eberlein wrote: > > His refusal to admit he recognizes the name makes me suspicious. > Possibly true. If so, he should do a search and discover who this man > was, and what he wrote. RAH mostly wrote science fiction, but he > influenced at least 2 generations (including mine) with his stories, and > was responsible for lots of impressionable boys (and some girls) deciding > that science and engineering were the only truly important fields to make > careers out of. > > Mike Eberlein 3/3/99 > > Gunner wrote: > > > On Fri, 03 Mar 2000 06:13:01 GMT, mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > > > >In article , > > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > > >> If I had a clue who Robert Heinlein is/was I might be qualified to > > >comment! > > > > > >Just a guy who wrote some books... > > > > > >BTW it was not really in vain. Most who saw the similarity > > >would agree that it's a compliment. The character in the book > > >is strong-willed, smart, and uncompromising. Sometimes > > >a big pain in the behind, but always cantankerous. > > > > > >Feel free to reject any/all of the above. > > > > > >Jim > > > > > Im afraid I swallowed my gum when Teenut asked who Heinlein was..... > > > > Gunner > > > > > > > >Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > > >Before you buy. > > > > --------------------------------------------------------- > > > > "A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an > > invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write > > a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort > > the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, > > solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program > > a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die > > gallantly. Specialization is for insects." Robert Heinlein > > > > Free Hobby Buy/Swap/Sell Website > > www.cyberg8t.com/gunner/hsm/index.html > > > > Home Page > > http://userzweb.lightspeed.net/gunner ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Floor mounting From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 04 Mar 2000 05:31:37 GMT -------- It would "Sing like a bird" if you did that!! Far better to sit it on four pads of Weetabix and let it find its own equilibrium! ;^) teenut David Berryhill wrote: > > > "Garrett Fulton" wrote: > > > >> "We do not recommend lagging the machine to the floor." > > > >Quite possibly because the base of the machine is flatter than > >most floors. Bolt it down, and strain induced in the machine > >will cause it to loose accuracy. > > > >Jim > > > > I've wondered about putting some threaded rod in the concrete floor, putting > a nut on the rod, then the lathe, then another nut. That way you can adjust > each of the mounting points independently and still have the lathe solidly > attached to the floor. > > What do you all think, would this work any better than leveling feet on a > lathe? > > Dave Berryhill ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Darwin nominee From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 04 Mar 2000 05:58:30 GMT -------- How true! One of the first things I was taught when around machine tools (after "They don't have an "Ouch Switch"!) was to always ensure at least two different avenues of escape, and a clear, safe, standing area. I have seen people SERIOUSLY hurt by ignoring those fundamental rules. teenut Gary Coffman wrote: > I also think one of the most important things when running machines is to > make sure your footing is secure. I try to keep the floor clear of chunks of > crap that might trip me, and I try to make sure any oil spills are immediately > cleaned up. Losing your footing and falling into a running machine can have > unacceptable consequences. > > Gary > Gary Coffman KE4ZV | You make it |mail to ke4zv@bellsouth.net > 534 Shannon Way | We break it | > Lawrenceville, GA | Guaranteed | ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Floor mounting From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 04 Mar 2000 06:17:43 GMT -------- GOTCHA!! ;^) teenut "Ward M." wrote: > > Weetabix ? What is it? > > Ward M. > > "Robert Bastow" <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote in message > news:Zc1w4.6054$ps1.148020@news1.rdc1.ga.home.com... > > It would "Sing like a bird" if you did that!! > > > > Far better to sit it on four pads of Weetabix and let it find its own > > equilibrium! > > > > ;^) > > > > teenut > > > > David Berryhill wrote: > > > > > > > "Garrett Fulton" wrote: > > > > > > > >> "We do not recommend lagging the machine to the floor." > > > > > > > >Quite possibly because the base of the machine is flatter than > > > >most floors. Bolt it down, and strain induced in the machine > > > >will cause it to loose accuracy. > > > > > > > >Jim > > > > > > > > > > I've wondered about putting some threaded rod in the concrete floor, > putting > > > a nut on the rod, then the lathe, then another nut. That way you can > adjust > > > each of the mounting points independently and still have the lathe > solidly > > > attached to the floor. > > > > > > What do you all think, would this work any better than leveling feet on > a > > > lathe? > > > > > > Dave Berryhill ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: "Seasoned" or "Aged" Cast Iron From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 04 Mar 2000 06:26:40 GMT -------- I have never heard of burying castings..But when I was an "Oily Rag" (Apprentice!!) We machined a LOT of big castings..machine tool and such. These were always "Skinned" (Rough machined" and sent back to the yard to "Weather" before finish machining. Six months was the minimum..They always came back with a measureable degree of warpage, which, once they were finish machined, did not reoccur. I am sure that modern vibratory and heat treatment methods of stress relieving have largely replaced the operation..but not on large and complex machine tool castings. Weathering, has nothing to do with rain and rusting..just the temperature cycling that gently relieves stresses. teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article <38BF48CD.2093B100@rma.edu>, > Stan Stocker wrote: > > > I understand that > > Ford used to bury flathead V8 blocks for at least a year prior to > > final machining. > > Supposedly one thought on this is that by burying them the > castings get subjected to freeze-thaw cycles, and other > low-frequency excitations that are related to movements of > the earth's surface. And that this somehow will 'anneal' out > casting strains. > > Sounds like a bunch of old wive's tales, but then who am I > to disagree with the folks who really *make* the bridgeports? > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Oilite bearings - oversize bore ? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 04 Mar 2000 06:39:50 GMT -------- I was always taught (and we machined a LOT of big bushings from Oilite stock) to use a razor sharp tool and to avoid overheating the material. OTOH, I read that Oilite themselves recommend reamer..even ball burnishing techniques! I strongly suspect..In REALLY thinking about it..That the manufacturers probably know best! In reality, oilite doesn't have "pores"..It has honking great (relatively) large interstices, between (relatively) large bronze balls. Difficult to "smear" closed..and the burnishing probably produces a larger area of bronze bearing surface..with somewhat smaller..but definitely present.."pores" leading to larger, back-up, oil resevoir spaces. In retrospect, I have to face the fact that one is never to old to learn! teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article , > Kevin Pinkerton wrote: > > > A lot of folks have said that you are supposed to only use very sharp > > cutters in reaming oilite bearings. Reamers probably would not fit > > this category. The little holes in the surface of the oilite will > > become clogged and keep the oilite from doing what it is meant to do. > > I am just repeating what I have been told here before.... > > Right, I remember that thread from a few months ago. I do seem to > recall that Robert B got pretty insistent about something, but I > cannot remember if it was for, or against reamer use. But that > everyone pretty much shut up after he put his comments out. > I remember some folks said they used reamers for this all the time, > and others who said they never did as they were sure it would not > work well. Some said the 'pores' were way too large to be smeared > over, and others who said that a good sharp reamer would not do > any 'smearing' at all. > > As Bertrand Russell said, when the experts disagree, then there > is probably no simple answer to a question. > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Floor mounting From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 05 Mar 2000 16:21:51 GMT -------- A machine tool as big and "flexible" as a planer bed, is a very different case than a chunky tool room lathe. It was designed with the foundation as a vital part of its integrity, stiffness and accuracy. The foundation block needs to be very heavy and stiff..The bed is then levelled with large area shims before bolting down. Then the feet or base are grouted in place. Quite an elabprate procedure..one which needs to be done by someone with specialised knowledge..or a set of precise instructions! The hand book for the machine would contain the instructions...Beg borrow or steal a copy! No short cuts here I'm afraid. teenut rdanzey@seidata.com wrote: > > In article <89ktdu$sce$1@nnrp1.deja.com>, > rdanzey@seidata.com wrote: > > In article <4DJu4.34$ST.2238@news2.randori.com>, > > "Garrett Fulton" wrote: > > > Just unloaded into the garage an old '64 vintage Millrite 8" X 32" > > vertical > > > mill after becoming disgusted for the last time with trying to mill > on > > my > > > Shoptask. (No knee or rigidity.) I am an amateur and lurker, but > > very > > > impressed with the knowledge of the contributors to this list. I > was > > > wondering if anyone had any experience with this machine and their > > opinion > > > of it. Also, in all the machine shops I've been in, it always > seemed > > to me > > > that the machines were bolted to the floor. In the factory manual > for > > the > > > Millrite it states,"We do not recommend lagging the machine to the > > floor." > > > Why? > > > > > > Garrett Fulton > > > > > > > > > > The only reason that occurs to me is that it might distort the machine > > and cause problems. FWIW... > > > > In a similar vein, I have both a shaper and a planer both of which > have > > substantial weight which will be reciprocating back and forth when the > > machines are finally put back into use. Both have anchor bolt holes > in > > their legs/bases. The planer was bolted down to a chunk of concrete > > reported to me by the previous owner's daughter to be mounted to a > chunk > > of concrete 6' deep into the ground,and reinforced by lots of steel in > > the hole, all welded together. Does this constitute a different > > situation and *require* secure anchoring? Any recommendations about > how > > to deal with setting up these honorable old beasts would be greatly > > appreciated. > > > > Best wishes... > > > > danz > > > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > > Before you buy. > > This is a pretty interesting thread, since it comes just before > (hopefully) I set about 'installing' a planer and shaper. I am > particularly concerned about the planer since it sits on 6 legs. I had > my floor (4" type C concrete with 6" mesh reinforcement) finished as > smoothly as possible without incurring additional cost, but I suspect > the floor is not quite flat enough to assure that each leg will rest on > it in the position it would 'want' to if it were free to relax into it's > 'normal' alignment. > > Given that the planer may weigh 4500#, how can I determine that it isn't > pulling itself out of 'true' with it's own weight when it sits where I > want to put it? > > And will I need to be concerned about reciprocating weight of > table/platen and workpiece moving the whole machine around and > compromising safety, accuracy, even the building? As I mentioned, it > was not only anchored all it's 100 or so years of life, but the concrete > lump it was anchored to probably weighed more than the machine does. > > It seems like everywhere I want to go with this project is one of those > places you can't get to from here. Where is my indefinable starting > point or plane upon which to build? First things first, I guess, and > one step at a time. Help. Please? > > danz > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: "Seasoned" or "Aged" Cast Iron From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 05 Mar 2000 16:26:50 GMT -------- No, modern engines are designed and manufactured with wide enough clearances to accomodated the EXPECTED warpage. When Race Preppers "Blueprint" an engine, the work to far closre clearances and tolerances..They NEED a stabilised block! teenut Docky Wocky wrote: > > Many of the "hor rod" engine rebuilders seek out used blocks to minimize > distortion problems. > > Jan Howell > _______________________________ > > Gee! All the new model iron out there must have terrific problems with all > of those warped blocks. How come it never seems to get to the point where > recalls are issued for everything that rolls off the lines? > > Government cover-up? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Name this Key! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 06 Mar 2000 00:53:57 GMT -------- It is more correctly known as a "Tapered Gib Headed Key"..to differentiate it from the non tapered and none headed type. Of all the various keys for different applications..this is the "Big Mutha"..takes time and patience to properly fit (the keyway in the HUB should also be tapered), on a critical assembly, the procedure is to "Blue and Scrape" it into place and firmly tap it home until the hammer bounces!! Used on heavy, high speed rotating assemblies, large motor drive shafts etc. I have fitted them, on turbine shafts, up to 3" X 3" x 18" long! A "Gib" key is somewhat different..it is used on the gibs of larger machine tools to prevent the gib from slipping out of place. Almost semantics I realise..but not quite! teenut Joe Way wrote: > > On Sat, 04 Mar 2000 10:37:19 -0600, Wayne Cook > wrote: > > >On 04 Mar 2000 07:09:08 GMT, robertdurango@aol.com (RobertDurango) > >wrote: > > > >>What is the name of this type of keyway key? > >> > >> It is uniformly wide, slightly tapered over its length from the thin end up to > >>the fat end, and the fat end has a protrusion or lump on it so that that a > >>puller can get purchase on the key for extraction, or you can pry it out. > >>(Found on a printing press to hold a big flywheel on a shaft.) > >> > > > > Tapered key. Used instead of a setscrew to lock stuff on the shaft. > >Mc MasterCarr has them listed as machine taper keys. > > > >Wayne Cook > >Shamrock TX > ------ > Often referred to as gib key, as well. > > Joe > Heather & Joe Way > Sierra Specialty Automotive > Brake cylinders sleeved with brass > Delco alternator One-Wire conversions > http://www.restoresource.com Joe Way wrote: > > On Sat, 04 Mar 2000 10:37:19 -0600, Wayne Cook > wrote: > > >On 04 Mar 2000 07:09:08 GMT, robertdurango@aol.com (RobertDurango) > >wrote: > > > >>What is the name of this type of keyway key? > >> > >> It is uniformly wide, slightly tapered over its length from the thin end up to > >>the fat end, and the fat end has a protrusion or lump on it so that that a > >>puller can get purchase on the key for extraction, or you can pry it out. > >>(Found on a printing press to hold a big flywheel on a shaft.) > >> > > > > Tapered key. Used instead of a setscrew to lock stuff on the shaft. > >Mc MasterCarr has them listed as machine taper keys. > > > >Wayne Cook > >Shamrock TX > ------ > Often referred to as gib key, as well. > > Joe > Heather & Joe Way > Sierra Specialty Automotive > Brake cylinders sleeved with brass > Delco alternator One-Wire conversions > http://www.restoresource.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 1/2" 16 TPI thread form answer to earlier query From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 06 Mar 2000 04:38:21 GMT -------- I suppose if you are a "Gud enuf" person Mike..then that will be good enough for you. Frankly, if I went to Home Despot to buy an eye bolt and a nut to fasten my dog out in the yard..and found that one had a 60 deg thread and the other a 55 deg whit form..I would have at least SOMETHING to say about it on this NG. So would a great many other listers..and so, I suspect would you. BTW. Why don't you draw a ten times full scale profile of a 60 deg flat top, flat root thread, and a similar profile of a rounded top and root 55 deg Whitworth thread. Mate them together..see where and how often they actually touch...Then tell me if you want 55,000 psi bearing on that joint. I would be willing to bet that half the so-called "lug set-back" headspace problems are caused by "Thread Set-forward" !! Prove I am wrong with your own rifle, your own nickel and your own head!! teenut eberlein wrote: There are no "standard" Mauser barrel thread > specs, anyway. 98 Mauser receiver thread diameters vary enough between > different models and countries that you need to machine the individual > barrel threads to match the actual receiver thread diameter for a good close > fit. This can be done with a 60 degree thread form just as easily as with a > 55 degree thread. > > Regards, > > Mike Eberlein 3/5/99 > > brian whatcott wrote: > > > There is something unesthetic about using the wrong thread form > > - no doubt. > > Mike's comment reminds me of the street sweeper > > approach to shotguns - take a pipe that will fit a 12 gage shell nicely. > > Find another pipe that will slide over it. Fit a nail in the end of the > > bigger pipe, and a but - and there you have it. > > > > To fire, load forward pipe with shell place into outer pipe, and > > pull it back smartly onto the nail. > > > > Forget about 60 deg threads in 55 degree receivers or whatever - > > that's just one hand holding the barrel together! > > > > Brian W > > > > In article <38C2C3D2.D99B4024@usit.net>, ebertenn@usit.net says... > > > > > >Robert, > > >The only use that the thread has is to make sure the barrel is snugged > > > up tight to the receiver, and a 60 degree thread works as well as a > > 55 deg, even if it's the wrong shape. > > >Mike Eberlein 3/5/99 > > > > > >Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > > >> One thing that continues to amaze me Jack, is that even the > > >> most meticulous, top flight, Rifle Smiths and Barrel Makers, > > >> continue to assert that 1.10"-12 tpi, 60 > > >> deg "American" thread is "Fine" for use in the 1.10" 12 tpi > > >> 55 deg Whitworth > > >> Form thread used in the 98 Mauser receiver! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Floor mounting From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 06 Mar 2000 12:48:49 GMT -------- Best of both worlds Tim. The wood pads will crush to conform with floor iregularities..the steel shims with spread the load of the machine on the pads. Be sure to check and re-level after allowance for settling..and recheck periodically if the wood pads are subject to oil or water contamination. teenut Tim Leech wrote: > > On Thu, 02 Mar 2000 05:02:00 GMT, Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ > hotmail.com> wrote: > > >No. Certain larger machine tools..lathes, floor borers etc rely on very accurate > >leveling and a special concrete floor/foundation, as part of their "Structure" > >They are levelled, bolted and grouted in. > > > >A lot of older machines were lightly built by today's standards and had to be > >bolted down to give the needed rigidity. > > > >OTOH modern tools tend towards much more massive and rigid steel box weldments > >or castings and can happily function at an angle of 45 deg to level!! > > > >The Fadal VMC I am expecting shortly is simply plonked on resiliant pads. > > > >teenut > > > >RobHarMill wrote: > >> > >> >Subject: Re: Floor mounting > >> >From: Robert Bastow "teenut"@hotmail.com > >> >Date: 2/29/00 11:01 PM Eastern > >> > >> >The only machine lagged to the floor in my 8000 sq ft Tool and Die shop, is > >> >an > >> >ancient wide belt sander, that tends to fall over if you bear down too hard > >> >on > >> >it! > >> > >> question--- is this the only reason (instability) that you bolt any machine > >> down? > > The previous owner of my 'new' mill had his machines sitting on scrap > steel pads (about inch thick) at each corner. Easy to shim, easy to > bar it up to get rollers under to move, etc., eay to make allowance > for uneven floor. > I propose to sit it on similar pads, but of dense hardwood, with steel > shims as neccessary. Is this likely to cause any difficulties? My > floor surface is not the best. > > Cheers > Tim > ------------------------------------------------- > Tim Leech > > timleech@dutondok.u-net.com > > Traditional & Modern canal craft repairs > > ------------------------------------------------- ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 1/2" 16 TPI thread form answer to earlier query From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 07 Mar 2000 02:31:21 GMT -------- That crude inter-squishing was the subject here!!!!!!! Go figure. teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article <38C3C8D3.68C98BDB@vom.com>, > Jack Erbes wrote: > > > My feeling is > > there is a right way and a wrong way do to the work and I agree with > > Robert that matching the receiver thread angle is the best way to do > > the work. > > Best? I cannot honestly imagine *anyone* suggesting that a > 55 deg form be intermated with a 60 deg thread. I thought > the discussion was about which was better, 60 with 60, or > 55 with 55. > > Or am I missing something here? > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 1/2" 16 TPI thread form answer to earlier query From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 07 Mar 2000 02:41:22 GMT -------- Mike..I am not going to take this thread (pun??) any further. Of COURSE you can get a 60 deg male thread to 100% contact a 55 deg female thread..given enough torque and bloody minded determination, you could get a bloody ACME thread to mate with it! As for your "Resident Stress Analysist"....I don't EVER want to cross a bridge he passes off! Right now he is probably out trying to patent the new 57 1/2 degree thread form you two munched up!! Quit defending the indefensible and let's move on. teenut eberlein wrote: > > Robert, > > I did just exactly that in 1984 at CCI/Speer where I was employed as an ammunition > engineer for a number of years. Used an optical comparator at 10X and 30X. I heard > > this old wife's tale about 60 degree barrel threads used in a 98 Mauser with 55 > degree receiver, and thought it was a bunch of shit. To my surprise, I found that a > > 60 degree thread can be made to contact BOTH sides of the mating 55 deg thread form, > > instead of just one when fitted correctly (remember, to assembly a thread easily, > you need clearance between the bolt and nut mating surfaces, hence only one side of > the thread > contacts at any one time). The key is that the 60 degree threads don't need to have > flat roots on the > threads. Ran it by the resident stress analyst, and he concluded that the result > was probably STRONGER than if a 55 degree thread was used for both parts, because of > > the increase in shear area. > > Since CNC Whitworth thread tooling wasn't very common in Lewiston, Idaho, in those > days, > and there were lots of of custom 98 Mauser rifles around with this 60 degree barrel > thread style, I decided to try it and never looked back. > > Lighten up guys. Maybe you can learn something after all! > > Mike Eberlein 3/6/99 > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > > > > BTW. Why don't you draw a ten times full scale profile of a 60 deg flat top, > > flat root thread, and a similar profile of a rounded top and root 55 deg > > Whitworth thread. Mate them together..see where and how often they actually > > touch...Then tell me if you want 55,000 psi bearing on that joint. > > R ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Opinions on slot-milling technique From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 07 Mar 2000 02:49:31 GMT -------- I wondered when some one would quit all this friggin' around and pick up a file!! ;^) teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article <38C31FFA.B59C5E@xtra.co.nz>, > tmartin@xtra.co.nz wrote: > > > Even better still would be a Bridgeport slotting attachment > > mounted on the other end of your ram. Nice device. > > Exactly - a shaper is a tad on the big side, but it would work. > The B'port attachment would be nice, and aside from a broach > or EDM this is one of the few ways to achieve square corners > in the slot. > > OK, Robert. Aside from using a file, that is. > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Name this Key! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 07 Mar 2000 02:58:58 GMT -------- Yeh it was a big Freekin Key..fitted to a Big freekin rotor on a big freekin shaft..not the kind of thing you want coming adrift at high speed. The keys were fitted with all the precision of a machine tool part.,,bottom sides and top. teenut metalmauler@webtv.net wrote: > > I thought was the "proper" name for that key. Didn't want to stick my > neck out too much as a new poster though... > > I DIDN'T know they should be scraped to fit though. (On high speed > applications?) I'll keep that in mind... > > A 3" x 3" x 18" Tapered Gib Key? THAT'S a big freeken key mister! > > Group: rec.crafts.metalworking Date: Mon, Mar 6, 2000, 12:53am (EST+5) > From: "teenut"@ hotmail.com (Robert Bastow) Re: Name this Key! > It is more correctly known as a "Tapered Gib Headed Key"..to > differentiate it from the non tapered and none headed type. > Of all the various keys for different applications..this is the "Big > Mutha"..takes time and patience to properly fit (the keyway in the HUB > should also be tapered), on a critical assembly, the procedure is to > "Blue and Scrape" it into place and firmly tap it home until the hammer > bounces!! > Used on heavy, high speed rotating assemblies, large motor drive shafts > etc. I have fitted them, on turbine shafts, up to 3" X 3" x 18" long! > A "Gib" key is somewhat different..it is used on the gibs of larger > machine tools to prevent the gib from slipping out of place. > Almost semantics I realise..but not quite! > teenut > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > Gallery of Machines Machinetool Rebuilders > > New & Used,Reconditioned Machines > > Russ Penrose > > Marathon NY > > Part/timeWoodworker ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Getting a hole exactly center on roundstock question From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 07 Mar 2000 03:09:13 GMT -------- That's as good a method as I have heard Gary..with one proviso. Use a ground center point (Every tool box should have a few!) rather than the rather iffy point of a drill. Given that, you "eyeball" method meets "teenut's exacting standards" (;^)..and will get closer than any one has any right to expect in a drill press..Closer I suspect than a lot of people can achieve in a mill with edge finder and DRO!! teenut Gary Wooding wrote: > > Here's a quick and easy method that is surprisingly accurate. Put a centre > drill in the chuck, put the bar in the vice and line it up roughly by eye, > then place a metal rule or strip of stiff lightweight metal across the bar > at right angles to the axis (like a see-saw made of a plank across a log of > wood) and lower the drill to gently pinch the rule between it and the bar. > Chances are the rule will be forced so that one side lifts and the other > drops - this is because the centre of the drill is not on the highest part > of the bar. Adjust the vice so that the rule is as horizontal as you can > get it - the drill is then accurately centred, so remove the rule and start > the drill. > If you use a 12" rule as the metal strip, when it is 1/2 degree out, one end > will be 0.2" below the other and that translates into an accuracy of approx. > .004 x the > diameter of the rod. IE, 4 thou on a 1" diam. bar. Since 0.2" is very easy > to see, it is quite feasible to aim for a difference of 1/16", which > corresponds to an accuracy of around .0015 x the diameter of the bar. Is > that accurate enough? > > -- > > Gary Wooding > > - > foxeye wrote in message > news:38c3acea.46011278@news.ddyne.com... > > How does one get the drill to go dead center through the diameter of > > round stock when drilling on the drill press. What and how is it > > setup. I usually clamp it in a dp vise, and then using a hermorpodite > > cal, find center by scribing on the top of the round stock using the > > vise jaws for parralells or by swinging an arc from detents that I > > have drilled on my on my dp vise in line with each other but on each > > jaw. Then prick punch this intersection mark, and drill. Is there an > > easier way? > > foxeye ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Scrapheap Challenge/Junkyard Wars -- team NERDS update. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 07 Mar 2000 03:21:51 GMT -------- What did you have to make? Or is that still a secret? Did you make it? Did it work? teenut Jeff DelPapa wrote: > > Saturday, entirely too early in the morning, we took the next step on > a road that hopefully has us in London this summer, attacking British > junk. Having produced a suitably entertaining short audition tape, we > were put on the short list for the next step, the mini-challenge (or > long audition). With the various bits on their list in hand, we met > in E40-316. (chosen because it had a fast net connection unencumbered > by firewall) > > Normally this test is done live, as it is an interactive process. > Given the distances involved, the alternative we produced was a web > cam, a speakerphone and a real video done at the same time, to be > mailed. A few minitues futzing, with camera's and microphones, they > gave us the task, and we were off and building. Since there are still > teams to audition, I will hold of on describing the actual task. > > We had 45 minutes to complete the test bit, all the while answering > questions from the production staff. Many times Nancy leapt to get a > close shot of some part of our "machine". The blackboard got filled > with pictcures of ropes, pulleys and the odd anvil. > > We completed the task, within the time limit (save final calibration). > We demonstrated it in action. We talked a bit longer about > logistics. They asked us some safety and skill related questions. We > said goodbye. We adrenaline crashed. (and went off to E51 to watch > the the tape and Geo's new edit of the audition tape) > > Special thanks to LCS, Nancy and Jered, for all their help on > Saturday. Larry for the room, net stuff, and being there to let us in > during prime sleeping hours. (also for not ducking under the table > when we pointed the camera at him, and offered him as another reserve > team member) -- Nancy for operating the web cam (get your leg > checked), and Jered for his camera work, and especially for getting > the PAL transfer done. > > Some numbers: There were about 2500 teams applying (including 3 other > American teams) From the forms provided, they chose 250 that merited > watched their short video. From the 250, they chose the teams for the > longer interactive audition. That "short list" was 25 teams. They > have to pick 10, we hear the decision Mar 20. No other international > team made the short list. > > -dp- > > The New England Rubbish Deconstruction Society -- The NERDS. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: collet chucks for milling and drilling From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 07 Mar 2000 03:40:28 GMT -------- Today, I spent several thousand dollars with the local Valenite Rep, tooling up for the arrival of my new Fadal 4 axis machine. Believe it or not..I didn't buy a single drill chuck for drills, or collet for end mills!! For drills (Straight shank) I bough DA type collets in 300 and 200 sizes with long and short chucks. For end mills I bought Weldon type holders. At home I now use a set of 300DA collets for ALL drills under 1/4" on my lathe and Deckel mills. One exception..I do have a teensie little Albrecht chuck on a sensitive (finger) feed spindle, for drills under 1/16". Go figure! ;^) teenut Chuck Sherwood wrote: > > Hi Folks, > The discussion last week about using collets and Teenuts followup > got me to thinking and reading about Collets chucks and the different > type of collets. > > My goal is to find a collet chuck that can be used for drilling and > milling so that there are no significant Z axis changes when changing > between the two, which can be a real pain on a mill drill or a small > inport knee mill. > > I have found two basic types of collet chucks. ER and DA series. > It seems that Erickson makes double angle. I did not see any Erickson > ER collets so I wonder if they are a competitor's clone. > > Erickson makes an R8 collet chuck for series 180 collets which they > claim can be used for milling or drilling. They make special collets > that engage the flat on the endmill so they cannot pull out. > > There are several different sizes of ER collets and R8 collets chucks > are available for several of them. The catalog also states that ER > collets compress and grip more uniformly than DA collets. > > I'm looking for advise on which type of collets that can be used for > both milling and drilling. I called erickson customer support via > MSC and they recommended the 180 series because of the locking feature. > They warned by about endmills pulling out of collets. > > It would be nice if you could copy me at sherwood@lucent.com because > I am 500 articles behind in this group and I don't want to miss the > followups. Thanks > > chuck sherwood ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: JET GHB1340 Lathe questions From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 07 Mar 2000 03:50:57 GMT -------- Actually the toolposts shipped with these lathes ain't that bad!! Learn to shim tools to the right height, then keep the pack of shims with the tool when you change it out. Forget carbide tooling..buy a small five or six inch grinder, half a dozen 3/8" HSS tool bits and a good book and LEARN to grind tools...and HONE them. It always amazes me that some people who purport to do serious lathe work are totally unaccustomed to that concept!! Steer away from rocker type (lantern) toolposts and the associated toolholders. These are a step back into the Eighteenth Century!! I will let others address the rest of your questions.. Happy turning! teenut foxeye wrote: > > It seems like I talked the wife into getting a Jet GHB 1340 lathe. Now > for some questions. > 1 I have been told the tool post that ships with these lathes leaves > a lot to be desired. What should I get. > 2. I assume if I get a rocket type post, I will need tool holders. a > L,R, and C. > I have a lot of 5/16" and 1/4" tools, both HSS and Carb. Would these > be satisfactory in using on this lathe? The dealer said I need to > restrict tool size to 3/16" or 1/4" max. seems small IMHO. > > 3. Need a boring bar. Any recomendations. I was informed of a 9/16" > bar that is sold by Blue Ridge MAchnery. Anyone familiar with it. BTW > BlueRidge is where I am going to order it from. I also will get a #3MT > live center, and a #3MT to 33JT arbor (have Jacobs 1/2" chuck), > Stand, Anything else I should consider on getting with this machine. > I would like to get the collets and closer, however its kinda pricey > at this time. If and when I do decide to get a collet system is it > going to have to be a JET system or will any fit? I know any 5C > collets will work. > > How are the chucks that come with these machines. > > I test drove a Grizzly, and basically after a couple of minutes of > playing with it, I decided it was a cheaply made unit, and left a lot > to be desired. No thanks. > > Having been steered away from Birmingham and Runmasters, My only out > was the JET or a good used machine, which I have been unsucessufll in > finding.......that is until I send the check for the JET then they > will be all over the place . > > So far I obtained a B&S 1" Black finish MIC. > Mitituyo 6" digital cal > Federal dial indicator .50 travel > Central (U.S.Made not china) dial indicator w/stand > Thread pitch gages > > What else am I going to need. I hate to not have everything the wife > is going to need on her birthday when she open her present up Its > once in a blue moon that my better half gives a go ahead for a > purchase like this, so there is not going to be any "well I sure do > need this" and "wish I had that" > a week or two later. > Thanks > > foxeye ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: One more ?? on the JET 1340 lathe From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 07 Mar 2000 04:03:57 GMT -------- On a cheap lathe, like this, steer clear of the gear drives..noisy at best, nasty finishes at worst. The belt drive will also give you LOWER speeds..something that beginners tend to overlook in the search for magical top speeds. That is, until they try their hands at larger pieces and screw cutting!! My own Maximat Super II has a gear head..frankly I wish it were a nice quiet, ripple free belt drive. 90% of all my turning is done at 300 and 600 rev/min..dropping down to 100 rev/min for screw cutting and up to 1100 rev/min for polishing! Very rarely do I crank it up to top speed of 2200 revs..never much find the need for all that excitement! And yes..I DO use carbide insert tooling..just never been fooled into believing that a SHINY finish is necessarily a GOOD finish! teenut foxeye wrote: > > Am I gaining anything other than less speeds with the gear head, over > the belt drive lathe and the convienience of not having to swap belts > around?. How about changinbg the speeds, is changing the belt out all > that much of a hassle. Its like $800.00 less for a belt drive JET, so > just how often does one need to change the belts around? > I assume it would be nicer if the GH had a lower speed, such as > offered by the BD model. > So is a belt driven job that much more of a hassle for $800.00 > difference in price? > > Why are micrometer carraige stops not offered for a lathe like this. > Is there a work around? > > foxeye ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: collet chucks for milling and drilling From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 07 Mar 2000 05:28:20 GMT -------- It has a 40 taper. teenut Chuck Sherwood wrote: > > >Today, I spent several thousand dollars with the local Valenite Rep, tooling up > >for the arrival of my new Fadal 4 axis machine. > > > >Believe it or not..I didn't buy a single drill chuck for drills, or collet for > >end mills!! > > I suspect that our requirements are different though. > > My main goal is to have similar Z offsets for milling and drilling because > of the limited Z travel of my small knee mill and the standard mill/drill > Z problem of not being able to move the head. A collet chuck can solve > this problem if it can mill with collets. So far it seems like the > erickson DA180 with DANP collets is the winner. These collets engage the > flat of the endmill to prevent the endmill from pulling out, hence the > name NP. Standard collets can be used for drilling. The only downside > is the cost. > > What kind of a spindle does this Fadal machine have? Iso 30 or 40? > > chuck ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: WTF 1/4-8tpi allthread From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 07 Mar 2000 05:38:24 GMT -------- A cheepie, multistart ball screw with unground screw might be a good place to start. An old plotter might yield something suitable. What helix do you want in what diameter? I could mill you a single helical groove in a round bar (on a 4 axis cnc) for very reasonable cost (ONLY for you Ed!!!) A simple bushing with a peg to engage the slot would complete the picture, and I am sure you could manage that bit! Contact me off list. teenut Edward Haas wrote: > > --Anyone ever seen anything like this, i.e. I need a foot or so of > threaded rod (or cheapie ballscrew with turcite "nut") with a radically > high helix, so that just a few turns would move the nut along a good > distance. I'm cobbling together a whatchacallit that changes rotary to > linear motion (feed pump stuff for a steam engine) and I've thrown in a > dodad that lets me vary the stroke while the device is in motion. The high > helix (or low number of tpi) would allow for more rapid changes of stroke > length. > --Any pointers to sources appreciated.. > > -- > "Steamboat Ed" Haas : Trying to pass for normal > Watch link rot in action! : in a muggle world... > http://www.nmpproducts.com > ---Decks a-wash in a sea of words--- ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 1/2" 16 TPI thread form answer to earlier query From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 08 Mar 2000 05:05:28 GMT -------- SFAIA the thread pitch IS 12 tpi Whitworth form. Not unusual in that the Germans stuck to Inch standard threads for many years..even into present times. For instance the Din 477 standard pipe threads are simply metricised BSP threads 25.4mm diameter and all that! Remember too that in 1898 Germany was not the Industrial Powerhouse she was to become a few years later..Britain may well have been the nearest, reliable, source for standardised cutting tools. teenut eberlein wrote: > > Randy, you're on to something, but I promised I wouldn't bring up bad > "craftsmanship" again, so while I agree completely, I am not supposed to say so > in public. > > Mike E. > > Randy O'Brian wrote: > > > Hey Mike, > > > > Ask the nit pickers why they use 12 TPI for Mauser threads. It is a metric > > pitch and it is not 12 TPI. I'm guessing it is 2mm but I don't have an > > action around to measure at the moment. Seems to me that after the perfect > > 55 deg Whit. thread is cut at the wrong pitch, any perceived benefit over a > > 60 deg thread cut at the same pitch is probably self- delusion. Both kinds > > of barrel threads are going to be deformed to the receiver's pitch when > > cinched up. I think I would rather start with the 60 deg thread if I > > couldn't cut the "correct" pitch. 8^) > > > > Randy > > > > "eberlein" wrote in message > > news:38C453EC.175D8947@usit.net... > > > Robert, > > > > > > I did just exactly that in 1984 at CCI/Speer where I was employed as an > > ammunition > > > engineer for a number of years. Used an optical comparator at 10X and > > 30X. I heard > > > > > > this old wife's tale about 60 degree barrel threads used in a 98 Mauser > > with 55 > > > degree receiver, and thought it was a bunch of shit. To my surprise, I > > found that a > > > > > > 60 degree thread can be made to contact BOTH sides of the mating 55 deg > > thread form, > > > > > > instead of just one when fitted correctly (remember, to assembly a thread > > easily, > > > you need clearance between the bolt and nut mating surfaces, hence only > > one side of > > > the thread > > > contacts at any one time). The key is that the 60 degree threads don't > > need to have > > > flat roots on the > > > threads. Ran it by the resident stress analyst, and he concluded that the > > result > > > was probably STRONGER than if a 55 degree thread was used for both parts, > > because of > > > > > > the increase in shear area. > > > > > > Since CNC Whitworth thread tooling wasn't very common in Lewiston, Idaho, > > in those > > > days, > > > and there were lots of of custom 98 Mauser rifles around with this 60 > > degree barrel > > > thread style, I decided to try it and never looked back. > > > > > > Lighten up guys. Maybe you can learn something after all! > > > > > > Mike Eberlein 3/6/99 > > > > > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > BTW. Why don't you draw a ten times full scale profile of a 60 deg flat > > top, > > > > flat root thread, and a similar profile of a rounded top and root 55 deg > > > > Whitworth thread. Mate them together..see where and how often they > > actually > > > > touch...Then tell me if you want 55,000 psi bearing on that joint. > > > > > > > > > > > > R > > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Getting a hole exactly center on roundstock question From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 08 Mar 2000 05:08:26 GMT -------- Sounds like it to me Ted. teenut Ted Edwards wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > That's as good a method as I have heard Gary..with one proviso. Use a ground > > center point (Every tool box should have a few!) rather than the rather iffy > > Is that the same thing that I'm calling a "spud"? Forget where I > encountered the term but it's a cylindrical rod pointed at the end. I > made mine by carefully truing a piece of drill rod in the 4-jaw and > turning a 30 degree included angle point. > > Ted ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Express Rifle Company-Update From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 08 Mar 2000 10:20:18 GMT -------- Great news today..The local FADAL dealer told me that delivery of my new $74000.00, 4 axis, machining center is brought forward to Friday THIS WEEK!! Frantic floor clearing going on to make room for this puppy, which is two weeks ahead of schedule. (Let's hear it for American Manufacturers!!) We are still waiting for the BATF to issue our manufacturer's licence..Bit of Local and State Political power being brought to bear.."Jobs at stake" and all that!! Demand for the "regular" magnum size is such that this will take priority..bolt WILL be larger than the .700" of the old 98s.and it will be long enough to throw any 505 Gibbs based round into it. That bit of extra margin on bolt diameter won't hurt with other big bore rounds..even down as far as the 375 HH based cases. Standard receiver ring diameter will be 1.420" with regular sized Mauser threads..1.10" x 12 TPI (60Deg VEE form) My own feeling is that a slightly larger thread should be used for the 505 and this will be an available option. After much soul searching I must go with the angled ejector of the Model 70..with its solid left locking lug it is definitely one of the few "improvements" ever made to the old 98 design..as is the forward recoil lug and "Girder" underside of the Winchester. Bolt stop will be pure "Mauser" though. Along with this goes the double rail trigger group mounting. The standard trigger will be a pre-64 over-ride type but ANY after market trigger made for the Winchester 70 will fit, and can be provided. Double square bridge, solid left rail of course..though, for the purists (like me) the thumb cut and clip slots will be available,(Clips even!!) as will a round top option. Bottom metal..solid steel! Magazine release in bow, fully contoured bow available or we can leave that for you or your Riflesmith to do. The box will be straight sided for ease of inletting, with a narrow 5 deg. tapered flange around the bottom for crisp, tight, final fitting. Inside the box will be special shoulders to engage the cartidge rim, so as to protect soft bullet noses from the battering of heavy recoil..a device first patented by Mauser and used on the big Heym Express action. Three different safety arrangements will be offered..The Classic up and over Mauser three position..A side swing modification of this..which some people prefer to see on a Custom Mauser...and a Model 70 style, 3 position side swing. Of course the low swing Traister Mk II can be fitted to the Classic pattern by those that prefer it. Bolt handle will be classic "straight down" tear drop knob, Mauser Magnum style..but a lower profile contour, for scope clearance will be an option. I advise AGAINST asking for too much in the way of back sweep on these heavy calibers!! Left hand versions will follow right on the heels of the first batch of right hand models!! AND they will have their own series of serial numbers....Yehh!! Order taking is still in the lap of the Gods (BATF!!) but work is proceeding with protoyping, tooling, fixturing and programming..so please be patient. Meanwhile, those who are SERIOUS about eventually placing an order in the first run (To the above specs) should contact me directly, (Send NO money!!) as I need to start formulating production and materials procurement planning. Final specs will be announced BEFORE orders are taken. Before you ask..Serial Numbers P1 to P10 will be reserved for field tests and publicity purposes...Number 100001 is MINE!! When orders and deposits are in we will allocate numbers by lot..but, on the first batch, will include the owners initials at no extra cost. (CNC Engraving is WONDERFUL!!) Thanks for your patience and support guys..but we ARE getting there!! teenut Robert Bastow, The Express Rifle Company, Express Tool & Die 5390 Oakdale Rd. Smyrna GA. 30082. Fax 404 792 2668. Email teenut@hotmail.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: setting a micrometer From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 08 Mar 2000 10:33:31 GMT -------- The Micrometer barrel is a simple press fit in the sleeve..no locknuts involved. Set the mic to your "feel", on the standard and lock the spindle. Take your cee spanner and gently twist the barrel until the zero lines line up. Direction is kinda counter-intuitive..so don't be surprised, or alarmed. if you turn it the wrong way at first (I always do!!) If this happens, or if you overshoot..simply turn it back a bit. NOW!! Put the mic down and let it cool down to ambient temperature before re-checking the zero and tweaking again. The mic WILL have expanded from your hot, sweaty little hands..so don't rush it and get a false reading. teenut (Who did TEN of them yesterday!!) Zebee Johnstone wrote: > > So.. I have my shiny new micrometers. Made in China but a reasonable > brand name and claimed to be to their standards and QC, so > I'm willing to trust. > > The set of 4 came with 3 bits of metal, labeled with sizes, > I presume these are to test and set the mikes up. > > So I take one - the 25mm - and insert it into the 0-25mm mike. > > twirl the ratchet thingy on the end of the mike till it goes > clickclickclick and... > > It's reading 25.02 > > So I presume I have to set it somehow, how? There's a hole in the shaft > you turn that matches a little c-spanner, and the ratchet thingy has > a slot in the end, so I think there has to be some kind of adjustment > but what? > > How do I set this thing up? I'm understandably reluctant to > go diving in without some clue! > > Zebee > -- > Zebee Johnstone (zebee@zip.com.au) > Proud holder of aus.motorcycles Poser Permit #1. > "You don't own an Italian motorcycle > - you merely have the privilege of paying its bills." ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 1/2" 16 TPI thread form answer to earlier query From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 09 Mar 2000 04:32:52 GMT -------- Yes, I have a copy of it..and find it too full of holes and repeated "old saws" to take very seriously! teenut Randy O'Brian wrote: > > The late great Frank DeHaas in his book "Bolt Action Rifles" > has a few paragraphs discussing the 98 Mauser barrel thread and indicates > that it is metric but that all the smiths he knew used 12 TPI. Harold E. > McFarland in the "NRA Gunsmithing Guide" indicates that it is "Approx. > 12TPI". Anybody have a copy of Jerry Kuhnhausen's "Mauser Bolt Actions" ? I > have found his pistol manuals very detailed and well researched. > > Randy > > "Robert Bastow" <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote in message > news:sclx4.6219$ps1.152894@news1.rdc1.ga.home.com... > > SFAIA the thread pitch IS 12 tpi Whitworth form. Not unusual in that the > Germans > > stuck to Inch standard threads for many years..even into present times. > For > > instance the Din 477 standard pipe threads are simply metricised BSP > threads > > 25.4mm diameter and all that! > > > > Remember too that in 1898 Germany was not the Industrial Powerhouse she > was to > > become a few years later..Britain may well have been the nearest, > reliable, > > source for standardised cutting tools. > > > > teenut > > > > eberlein wrote: > > > > > > Randy, you're on to something, but I promised I wouldn't bring up bad > > > "craftsmanship" again, so while I agree completely, I am not supposed to > say so > > > in public. > > > > > > Mike E. > > > > > > Randy O'Brian wrote: > > > > > > > Hey Mike, > > > > > > > > Ask the nit pickers why they use 12 TPI for Mauser threads. It is a > metric > > > > pitch and it is not 12 TPI. I'm guessing it is 2mm but I don't have > an > > > > action around to measure at the moment. Seems to me that after the > perfect > > > > 55 deg Whit. thread is cut at the wrong pitch, any perceived benefit > over a > > > > 60 deg thread cut at the same pitch is probably self- delusion. Both > kinds > > > > of barrel threads are going to be deformed to the receiver's pitch > when > > > > cinched up. I think I would rather start with the 60 deg thread if I > > > > couldn't cut the "correct" pitch. 8^) > > > > > > > > Randy > > > > > > > > "eberlein" wrote in message > > > > news:38C453EC.175D8947@usit.net... > > > > > Robert, > > > > > > > > > > I did just exactly that in 1984 at CCI/Speer where I was employed as > an > > > > ammunition > > > > > engineer for a number of years. Used an optical comparator at 10X > and > > > > 30X. I heard > > > > > > > > > > this old wife's tale about 60 degree barrel threads used in a 98 > Mauser > > > > with 55 > > > > > degree receiver, and thought it was a bunch of shit. To my > surprise, I > > > > found that a > > > > > > > > > > 60 degree thread can be made to contact BOTH sides of the mating 55 > deg > > > > thread form, > > > > > > > > > > instead of just one when fitted correctly (remember, to assembly a > thread > > > > easily, > > > > > you need clearance between the bolt and nut mating surfaces, hence > only > > > > one side of > > > > > the thread > > > > > contacts at any one time). The key is that the 60 degree threads > don't > > > > need to have > > > > > flat roots on the > > > > > threads. Ran it by the resident stress analyst, and he concluded > that the > > > > result > > > > > was probably STRONGER than if a 55 degree thread was used for both > parts, > > > > because of > > > > > > > > > > the increase in shear area. > > > > > > > > > > Since CNC Whitworth thread tooling wasn't very common in Lewiston, > Idaho, > > > > in those > > > > > days, > > > > > and there were lots of of custom 98 Mauser rifles around with this > 60 > > > > degree barrel > > > > > thread style, I decided to try it and never looked back. > > > > > > > > > > Lighten up guys. Maybe you can learn something after all! > > > > > > > > > > Mike Eberlein 3/6/99 > > > > > > > > > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > BTW. Why don't you draw a ten times full scale profile of a 60 deg > flat > > > > top, > > > > > > flat root thread, and a similar profile of a rounded top and root > 55 deg > > > > > > Whitworth thread. Mate them together..see where and how often > they > > > > actually > > > > > > touch...Then tell me if you want 55,000 psi bearing on that joint. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > R > > > > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: FS HSM magazine From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 09 Mar 2000 04:49:30 GMT -------- It wusn't me!! One of my many tame "critters" caught the little bleeder trying to steal the sunflower seeds an' whupped his delinquent ass! The local cops are used to being called out for such "incidents"..Last week the next door neighbor's twin Rottweilers got caught red handed and the neighbors are trying to sue me for their vet bills! teenut..The Beastmaster! best_before_'89 wrote: > > Rex wrote: > > > > Michael, I think these magazines are too advanced for your group, > > cause they use technical tools like files and really hard to read > > sliding metal ruler things > > Our little Christopher was heartbroken when we read your response to > him. He so loves to shine up the little bits of scrap metal we find > behind Mister Bastow's house. Mister Bastow turned out to be a really > nice guy after we promised to drop the assault charges. Timmy had no > right trying to find us our first meal in days by going into Mister > Bastow's garden anyways. The doctor says Timmy's cast should be coming > off in 6 weeks time. We were hoping to sell the Home Shop Machinist > magazines you so lovingly collected, and pay for Timmy's medicines and > doctor bills, but only after we had memorized them from cover to cover. > Please think of us if you save up any more magazines. Timmy would never > forget you... > > michael ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Express Rifle Company-Update From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 09 Mar 2000 05:03:18 GMT -------- That would mean I have to buy a whole new set of hammers! Mine are all Imperial sizes and I understand that all the screws and fine adjustments on the Grisly's are Metric (or some close approximation thereto) teenut It is not knowing that it needs to be hit with a hammer..But where..and how hard! PLAlbrecht wrote: > But Robert, with all the resources at your disposal, why, oh why didn't you buy > a fine imported Grisly or such? Why, I'll bet you could have one of those > repaired in no time! Not six months but two! > > Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Express Rifle Company-Update From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 09 Mar 2000 06:27:48 GMT -------- Bray Haven wrote: > > > Inside the box will be special > >shoulders to engage the cartidge rim, so as to protect soft bullet noses from > >the battering of heavy recoil..a device first patented by Mauser and used on > >the > >big Heym Express action. > > Hmmm hadn't seen this one. been working on Mausers for 30 years or so. You could probably work on Mausers a coupla lifetimes and never see one! It was patented late in the regime and used very rarely..mostly I believe, on the high velocity Vom Hofs What > will you do for the rimless cartridges? This IS for rimless cartridges! OR Rimmed! Or did you mean to say "shoulder". > Which would also need different configuration for different shoulder placement. If I had MEANT "shoulder..I would have SAID "shoulder" In the Original Mausers it took the form of a shaped strip of steel, riveted inside the magazine box,one on each side... in such a position as to engage with the extractor groove of each cartridge and hold it to the rear of the box under heavy recoil. This rib, which necessarily engages only one side of any shell in a staggered box, is relieved and blended out towards the top of the box..so as not to interfere with the easy loading of the top round...and its subsequent feeding to the chamber. In the Heym Express, and in my design, these ribs are machined, integrally, right into (or rather ONto) the steel wall of the magazine box. The DIFFERENCE between the two..is that the Heym ribs were broached and could not be made suitable for RIMMED SHELLS..such as the .577 and .600 NE. My design is CNC wire EDM cut and the ribs, indeed the whole BOX can be properly angled for rimmed rounds. Additionally, because these ARE custom actions..and through the magic of modern production machinery..the magazine boxes will indeed have a custom shoulder for each case type..best of both worlds! > Probably be about as easy (and more effective) to just put a nylon buffer > strip in the front of the mag box. I used med rubber which work fine and > didn't interfere with feeding. Nylon would NOT protect the delicate lead tips under HEAVY recoil..It certainly won't prevent the MAJOR problem, which is the battering of bullets down the neck, compressing the load of powder. This is a very real complaint from Game Conservation Officers in Africa! During culls, when firing is often fast and furious, they, very wisely, take the opportunity to top up the magazine at every lull in firing..Not a Good Idea to be caught in the middle of an angry and terrified mele' of pachyderms..with only one shell in the box!! This means that the very first round to be loaded..early in the fray, often stays in the bottom of the box while thirty or forty of its fellows are loaded and fired above it. That last shell may then be dumped out, popped in a pocket, and reloaded the next day for another foray! Bullets (Solids) that have been pounded deep into the neck, turning the powder charge into a rock-like mass have been reported too frequently for comfort. The result, if the round is fired, before discovery, is usually a combination of squib and hangfire. Disconcerting and dangerous at the best of times..REALLY NOT A GOOD THING when Mr Jumbo is trying to make you a rapidly drying stain on the landscape!! This problem is particularly prevelant in the straight cased 458 Winchester Magnum..and one of the many reasons why Professional Hunters, Game Conservation Officers and discerning amateurs, are turning to more powerful and reliable alternatives. So far as putting soft rubber in the end of the magazine is concerned..A) there ain't room for it in these cannons. B) Anything that introduces friction into what needs to be the worlds slickest rifle action is likely to get you C) suddenly DEAD!..or D) laughed out of Africa! As for locking lugs you really don't have a > high pressure problem on any of the cartridges you are talking about. In fact > the big bores generally run lower pressures than the > "eargensplittenloudenboomers" as PO called them like the small cal, big cases. Ah BUT! The inevitable modern tendency is to load UP those old boomers to magnum pressures! 505 Gibbs pushing 600 grain solids at 2600 fps (Rather than the original cordite load of 525 grains at 2300 fps. How so? Well in the first place..people just like to try and get the best performance possible out of them...Secondly, the Cordite rounds were "down-loaded" to give initially low pressures..A) because cordite has a marked tendency to give much higher pressures when the loads reached their tropical destinations. B)Many of the rifle designs of the day, the gunsmithing that shoehorned "African Calibers" into said rifles, and the metallurgy then available, made it prudent for the ammunition manufacturers to set their own, lower, safety margins. Modern powders are much more stable, and modern metallurgy is light years advanced on that available at the turn of the last century. > Good ejection at the end of the stroke is more important (IMO). The ejection of the angled, none intrusive, blade of the pre-64 Model 70, is in fact just as positive and somewhat better positioned in the bolt face to flip the empty shell clear of the receiver port. On the other hand..the split locking lug of the 98 is one of the design's, acknowledged, weaker links. This is not so much because of reduced shear strength of the lug..but a definite cause of reduced bearing area and subsequent set-back of the bolt lug in the receiver shoulder. This leads to head space problems, increase effort on bolt lift..and the inevitable scrapping of the receiver! The ONLY objection I have ever seen..even from Mauser "Purists" is that the Model 70 style is more difficult to field change than the Mauser 98 style. Having said that..the gentleman agreed that the Model 70 had a sronger blade, pin and coil spring, and was far more reliable than the Mauser ejector with its leaf spring. Indeed, he had changed several Mausers out in the field..but never needed to do it with a Model 70! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Express Rifle Company-Update From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 09 Mar 2000 12:22:02 GMT -------- Yes, the "controlled" round feeding and long, non rotating claw extractor will be similar to both Mauser and Model 70...a blending of the best of both in fact. It will have the more pronounced lead chamfer of the Model 70, to facilitate the loading of single rounds direct into the chamber. But it will retain the Mauser's uni-directional, dovetail lock down for the extraction cycle. I will be looking for field testers and developers, especially for a range of Big-Bore wild cats this action makes possible..for example the 505 3 1/4" Gibbs basic case used for new rounds in 450, 470, 510 and 550 calibers! Black, Blue and Purple Heart recipients will receive special consideration! teenut Gunner wrote: > > On Wed, 08 Mar 2000 10:20:18 GMT, Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > > >Great news today..The local FADAL dealer told me that delivery of my new > >$74000.00, 4 axis, machining center is brought forward to Friday THIS WEEK!! > >Frantic floor clearing going on to make room for this puppy, which is two weeks > >ahead of schedule. (Let's hear it for American Manufacturers!!) > > > >We are still waiting for the BATF to issue our manufacturer's licence..Bit of > >Local and State Political power being brought to bear.."Jobs at stake" and all > >that!! > > > >Demand for the "regular" magnum size is such that this will take priority..bolt > >WILL be larger than the .700" of the old 98s.and it will be long enough to throw > >any 505 Gibbs based round into it. That bit of extra margin on bolt diameter > >won't hurt with other big bore rounds..even down as far as the 375 HH based > >cases. > > > >Standard receiver ring diameter will be 1.420" with regular sized Mauser > >threads..1.10" x 12 TPI (60Deg VEE form) My own feeling is that a slightly > >larger thread should be used for the 505 and this will be an available option. > > > >After much soul searching I must go with the angled ejector of the Model > >70..with its solid left locking lug it is definitely one of the few > >"improvements" ever made to the old 98 design..as is the forward recoil lug and > >"Girder" underside of the Winchester. Bolt stop will be pure "Mauser" though. > > > >Along with this goes the double rail trigger group mounting. The standard > >trigger will be a pre-64 over-ride type but ANY after market trigger made for > >the Winchester 70 will fit, and can be provided. > > > >Double square bridge, solid left rail of course..though, for the purists (like > >me) the thumb cut and clip slots will be available,(Clips even!!) as will a > >round top option. > > > >Bottom metal..solid steel! Magazine release in bow, fully contoured bow > >available or we can leave that for you or your Riflesmith to do. The box will be > >straight sided for ease of inletting, with a narrow 5 deg. tapered flange around > >the bottom for crisp, tight, final fitting. Inside the box will be special > >shoulders to engage the cartidge rim, so as to protect soft bullet noses from > >the battering of heavy recoil..a device first patented by Mauser and used on the > >big Heym Express action. > > > >Three different safety arrangements will be offered..The Classic up and over > >Mauser three position..A side swing modification of this..which some people > >prefer to see on a Custom Mauser...and a Model 70 style, 3 position side swing. > >Of course the low swing Traister Mk II can be fitted to the Classic pattern by > >those that prefer it. > > > >Bolt handle will be classic "straight down" tear drop knob, Mauser Magnum > >style..but a lower profile contour, for scope clearance will be an option. I > >advise AGAINST asking for too much in the way of back sweep on these heavy > >calibers!! > > > >Left hand versions will follow right on the heels of the first batch of right > >hand models!! AND they will have their own series of serial numbers....Yehh!! > > > >Order taking is still in the lap of the Gods (BATF!!) but work is proceeding > >with protoyping, tooling, fixturing and programming..so please be patient. > > > >Meanwhile, those who are SERIOUS about eventually placing an order in the first > >run (To the above specs) should contact me directly, (Send NO money!!) as I need > >to start formulating production and materials procurement planning. Final specs > >will be announced BEFORE orders are taken. > > > >Before you ask..Serial Numbers P1 to P10 will be reserved for field tests and > >publicity purposes...Number 100001 is MINE!! When orders and deposits are in we > >will allocate numbers by lot..but, on the first batch, will include the owners > >initials at no extra cost. (CNC Engraving is WONDERFUL!!) > > > >Thanks for your patience and support guys..but we ARE getting there!! > > > >teenut > > > >Robert Bastow, > >The Express Rifle Company, > >Express Tool & Die > >5390 Oakdale Rd. > >Smyrna GA. 30082. > >Fax 404 792 2668. > >Email teenut@hotmail.com > > Sounds like a winner going there Bob!. Like the ejector system as well. What method are > you going to use for "controlled feed"? Mod 70 style? > > I know that I will never be able to afford one of your rifles, but someday I at least hope > to put a few downrange through one. You ever need a recoil junkie for field testing, with > 25yrs experience in handloading rifle cartridges... keep me in mind. > > Gunner > > --------------------------------------------------------- > > "A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an > invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write > a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort > the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, > solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program > a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die > gallantly. Specialization is for insects." Robert Heinlein > > Free Hobby Buy/Swap/Sell Website > www.cyberg8t.com/gunner/hsm/index.html > > Home Page > http://userzweb.lightspeed.net/gunner ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Machining food? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 09 Mar 2000 12:27:18 GMT -------- I have been known to use my bandsaw to slice a Boule of crusty French bread..that got a bit TOO crusty!! Of course, bandsaws are used, comercially, to slice bread and process meat and frozen fish every day. teenut The Hurdy Gurdy Man wrote: > > Has anyone out there ever tried machining food? As in using food as raw > material, that is. I ask because I was thinking recently about trying to > build a "parmesan microtome" in order to make extremely thin parmesan > slices, which, incidentally, is the only way to eat parmesan. And during > my thinking, it occurred to me that parmesan seems like it'd hold up > reasonably well to milling, and perhaps even lathe work seeing as a well > aged parmesan does seem to behave a bit like nylon. > > Now, I know a guy who once used a band saw to slice up some asiago, and > apparently it worked reasonably well, leaving a fairly clean edge. Plus > they have SPAM carving contests every year. But I've never heard of > anyone else machining food. Anyone have any interesting anecdotes on the > subject? Maybe a good old shop story or two? There's got to be at least > one person who has thought to try using a lathe and a parting tool to get > some perfectly uniform slices of Genoa salami. > > Bryan ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Acid to dissolve broken tap in aluminum? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 10 Mar 2000 04:20:54 GMT -------- This is also my prefered method. For obvious reasons it works better on four flute taps than three and on coarse threads better than fine. No doubt about it though, a hefty wallop, with a flat ended punch will usually shift a broken tap..often with no discernable damage to the threaded material!! I know...I know!! Just go try it first..before you tell me it can't possibly work! teenut Bray Haven wrote: > > >Don't try pushing a tap out - you may be disappointed. > > Give this method a shot. > > Haven't tried it in alum but have removed broken taps in steel (through hole) > by putting a punch on them and sharply rapping it shaering of the tap threads > which are harder & more brittle. Obviously this works better with carbon steel > taps than HSS but have done it with both. > > Greg Sefton ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: WTB or WTT Southbend 16 Parts From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 10 Mar 2000 04:39:01 GMT -------- Let's DO it Randy!! Fax me an EXACT spec. to Express Tool and Die 404 792 2668 and I will work out a price for a one off for you. If, as I suspect, the spindle is hardened, and ground all over ,to pretty tight tolerances, you will have much change out of your $4,263.68..but not a lot! 8^) teenut reidry@my-deja.com wrote: > > Just got off the phone with Southbend and I am now recovering from > severe sticker shock. They tell me "We have all the parts on the shelf" > ... ok good so far, "and the price is 4,283.68." > > Oh my... someone catch me I'm about to faint. If this is old stock how > in the world can they demand a price like that? I think I could call up > a precision shop, deliver my threaded spindle and tell them to make me a > new one with a D14 camlock front end .. and come out cheaper! > > Unreal ... > > Anyone have a beat 16" with a D14 spindle? Still looking ... > > Ryan > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Way off topic. ..... Nonstick fry pans! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 10 Mar 2000 12:43:34 GMT -------- Get yourself a GOOD frypan..one with a machined bottom at least a quarter inch thick. Throw the skinny ones as far as they will go! I love my cast iron skillets..properly seasoned and cared for (follow the instructions with the pan) they are as non-stick as teflon, transfer heat and even it out beautifully and will never warp. I keep separate skillets for frying and crepe making (NOBODY touches THAT one!!) Chef Boy-ar-teenut BillDarby wrote: > > Background > I am on a low carb diet, which just about means that I eat nothing but > meat, fish and foul. So, I am always frying one thing or another and have had > to return about four different (faulty) models of non stick frying pans to Sears > so far. > > The problem is that the pans all start out good, but over time, they all > acquire a convex shape on what should be a flat bottom. Everything runs to the > center of the pan and the only "good" heat transfer is just in the middle. > > To give you an idea of the extent of this "bulging" of the bottom,,, > when I press down near one edge of the pan, the opposite side rose off the > burner a full quarter of an inch. > > I got so mad at the bulge in my largest pan that I took it out to the > shop and gave it a good whack with a large dead blow hammer (through a block of > hard wood). All that achieved was to turn the bubble inside out (upward). [It > now makes great "lifesaver" shaped omelets.] :o) > > Is there a simple metal working cure? I have considered turning the > bottom flat but if I did I'd have nothing left. > > Or ... perhaps someone knows a brand that does not bow down in the > center like the Sears pans? > > Bill Darby ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Making a welding/cutting table From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 12 Mar 2000 03:09:22 GMT -------- Bed frame irons were often made from re-rolled old railroad track..high manganese content that work hardens like an SOB. Can be a false economy to try to use it as serious work material. teenut Bob Engelhardt wrote: > > Ted Edwards wrote: > > > > I made a welding(Tig,stick,O/A)/cutting(O/A,Plasma) table out of > > 1.5x1.5x.125 steel angle (old bed frames), ..... > > Several post-ers have suggested using angle from old bed frames. > Whenever I've used it, it was impossibly hard to work (i.e., with > hacksaw and hss drill bits). I had to bludgeon it by using cut-off > wheels in my angle grinder and punching holes in it with my stick > welder. > > Am I missing something? Is there some way to work this stuff, or are we > talking about different kinds of bed frames? > > Puzzled Bob ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: D1-3 tooling wanted From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 12 Mar 2000 17:37:38 GMT -------- Hi Robert, I have a good quality, good condition, 8" 4-jaw chuck with a D1-3 integral back plate. Yours for $150.00 plus P&P I also have a Jacobs Rubberflex collet chuck of the same persuasion, good overall, but could use new thrust bearing balls (easy to fit) $100.00 plus P&P New collets to fit 1/16" to 1" ..$120.00 teenut "Robert C. Medernach" wrote: > > Does anyone know of a faceplate and/or a 4jaw chuck with D 1-3 backs for > sale? Also could use a steady rest for a Monarch EE lathe. > reply to rcmed@iquest.net ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Norton vrs other type gearbox From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 13 Mar 2000 04:31:29 GMT -------- Methinks Peter knows not that he knows not! A Norton gearbox has nothing to do with spindle speeds..or British Motorcycles for that matter. It remains the basis and standard for all (manual) screw cutting lathes. More modern ones are totally enclosed and have rotary selectors (Which merely operate a rack and pinion to move sliding selectors anyway!) The Original type..as fitted the hundreds of thousands of toolroom and engine lathes, are as accurate and durable as one could wish for..I have never heard of one breaking (in a crash it is the pick-off, tumbler reverse, or translation gears that suffer..ask me how I know!!) I have NEVER heard of one WEARING out..and, even on the old, open bottom type, it would take a determine effort, with a shovelful of chips thrown at exactly the right, upward angle (ie. Sabotage) to jam one. Do a bit of reading Peter..Questions will be asked later! teenut Tony Jeffree wrote: > > On Sun, 12 Mar 2000 20:51:33 +0100, Peter Groepper > wrote: > > >Tony Jeffree wrote: > > > >> On Sun, 12 Mar 2000 13:33:34 +0100, Peter Groepper > >> wrote: > >> > >> >Don't confuse modern with new. There may be new lathes with > >> >a Norton box. Modern smaller lathes have full variable speed > >> >from say 30 to 4000 RPMs. Less modern have gearboxes, > >> >but not the Norton box. > >> > >> Methinks you're confusing two different needs, and two sets of > >> solutions to those needs. > >> > >> Need 1: Changing the speed of rotation of the lathe spindle itself. > >> Older designs may use gearboxes, stepped pulleys, even variable pitch > >> pulleys etc. to achieve this. Modern designs tend to use techniques > >> that directly vary the speed of rotation of the motor - including > >> systems that involve direct drive to the spindle without any > >> intervening pulleys or gears. > > > >agreed, that's what I meant with "full variable speed...". I thought, the > >Norton box would belong here, too. > > > >> Need 2: Changing the ratio between the speed of rotation of the > >> leadscrew/fine feed drive spindle and the speed of rotation of the > >> lathe spindle, in order to change the feed per spindle rev (for > >> threading, changing from roughing to finishing cuts, etc.) I think > >> that you will find *very few* lathes, of old or modern design, that do > >> not employ some form of gearbox or gear train to meet this need. The > >> only exceptions here are likely to be found in CNC tools where the > >> feed per rev can be computer controlled. > > > >didn't know, the Norton box would be used for threading, too. I did > >not mean, that threading would be done without a gearbox, however. But the > >Norton box remains unprecise (comparatively) and noisy and sensitive to > >chips entering the housing, you agree? > > > > No, I don't agree! Unprecise in exactly what sense?? If you have a > geared drive between lathe spindle & the power feed then it seems to > me that the drive is very precise indeed. > > Regards, > Tony > > Website: http://www.jeffree.u-net.com/ > When replying, delete "X." from the Email address to remove anti-SPAM measures. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What I love about Chinese tools From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 13 Mar 2000 04:47:24 GMT -------- Steve Rayner wrote: > Canada is in North America, but no bloody way are we Americans! Nor do we > want to be! Definition of a Canadian? Someone who can't get a Green Card! > I'm a Canadian eh! So am I!..But I got a Green Card! ;^) teenut (ducking for cover!) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: shop rules? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 13 Mar 2000 05:00:11 GMT -------- > Absolutely pointless. Fitch is *ridiculously* protective of his Titian- > haired daughter. Ask any lecherous Englishman... ;^) > From what I garner of Fitch's Daughter..She is well able to take care of herself! teenut (another lecherous Englishman!) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What I love about Chinese tools From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 14 Mar 2000 01:36:38 GMT -------- Steve Rayner wrote: > > > > No! A Canadian is someone who has medicare. Now I live and work (WITH a Green Card!) in the USA..I can afford my own, first class, Medical Care. I nearly hemorrhaged to death waiting for an "emergency" operation in Canada! Don't knock it 'til you have tried both! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking,alt.machines.cnc,alt.manufacturing.misc Subject: Re: agent work wanted From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 14 Mar 2000 13:15:53 GMT -------- My "Agent" is called "Sande" She works for me full time..as an Admin/Personal Assistant/Outside Rep. In addition to a good salary, I pay her a small percentage on new Customers and she is GOOD. She walked into my office..unannounced..and told me I should hire her! (She is the Ex-wife of the Ex-Partner of the Ex-Owner of the business I bought and had previously take the business up to $2 million a year, before they sold out to the other partner..to do other things. It took him four years to grind it back down to $1/2 Million and failing!!!) I hired her!! Find yer own!! But don't try to find a "Good"/"Cheap" one...They are worth either Zip..or their weight in gold! teenut smcdonal wrote: > > A few days ago someone mentioned that they have an agent that finds them > work for a small finders fee and they also mentioned that the agent was > female. Nothing wrong with that. What are these agents called and how > can I locate one or more. I operate a small metal shop that offers CNC > lathe and mill work, we also do welding arc, mig and tig and would like > to locate such a person. > Please send any contact info to > smcdonal@kos.net > Thanks > Stan ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Boring a gun barrel From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 14 Mar 2000 13:21:16 GMT -------- "The Story of Pope's Barrels" Ray Smith, Wolfe Publishing. Currently in print $19.95. Fascinating reading about the triumph of Business Ineptitude over a God Given gift for exquisite workmanship....Truly a tragic story! Required reading for any "Craftsman/Artisan" who thinks they can run their own business. teenut Lowell Kenney wrote: > > I thought that there was a video on boring rifle barrels but I can't find > it. Also someone said there was information on how Pope made his barrel > drills somewhere, book, article ?? > > Information would be appreciated. > > Thanks > > Lowell ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Boring a gun barrel From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 15 Mar 2000 04:12:30 GMT -------- No it won't tell you that..simply because the author didn't have a clue..technically. Do a search for "Border Barrels" One of the better discourses on the subject. teenut "Orrin B. Iseminger" wrote: > > Robert and List -- > > I'm going to splurge and buy the book. Will it explain how to bore a barrel and > keep the hole concentric? At the rate I've been going, if I tried to drill a hole > that deep it would poke out the side of the barrel, somewhere. ;-) > > Seriously, I wonder what the secrets of truly concentric boring are. Does > anyone know them? If they're in the book, the information will easily be worth > the price of it. > > TIA, > > Orrin > In article , "teenut"@hotmail.com says... > > > >"The Story of Pope's Barrels" Ray Smith, Wolfe Publishing. Currently in print > >$19.95. > > > >Fascinating reading about the triumph of Business Ineptitude over a God Given > >gift for exquisite workmanship....Truly a tragic story! > > > >Required reading for any "Craftsman/Artisan" who thinks they can run their own > >business. > > > >teenut > > > >Lowell Kenney wrote: > >> > >> I thought that there was a video on boring rifle barrels but I can't find > >> it. Also someone said there was information on how Pope made his barrel > >> drills somewhere, book, article ?? > >> > >> Information would be appreciated. > >> > >> Thanks > >> > >> Lowell ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Etched teflon glue From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 15 Mar 2000 04:21:35 GMT -------- I suggest you wash your mouth with clorox..then swallow it! There is absolutely NO place here for Racist slurs! teenut "Timothy A. O." wrote: > If you soak a niggers balls in clorox will they smell as bad? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: My LUCKY Day!!!!!! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 15 Mar 2000 13:31:30 GMT -------- Monday was a day of frantic activity around the shop..Local Dealer delivered a honkin' great Rambaudi turret/knee mill and took away (in exchange) two tired old Bridgeports, a big German engine lathe, a Gros Band Filer and a throatless shear. That was at the ground level door. At the dock door an eighteen wheeler delivered a 12' x 12' x8' crate containing my new Fadal Four Axis Machining center..while the rigger unloaded a 12000lb forklift truck to roll it into place. First sign that all was not as it should be was when the forklift started to tilt forward under the weight of the "9000lb" crate. A couple of 300lb guys riding shotgun on the back end fixed that, it was uncrated, placed in position and hooked up to power and air without further drama. Yesterday, the Local Dealer (Flint Machine Tools) Technician (Dennnis) arrived to do the final assembly, alignment, calibration etc. First thing he commented on was that the Fadal was fitted with the Higher Torque 20 HP 10,000 Rev/min spindle, complete with refrigeration unit for sustained high speed running. This is an EXPENSIVE option and one which I certainly didn't order. Consensus was a general shrugging of shoulders..all concerned figured that Fadal had shipped that option as they happened to have it on the only machine in stock. The start up went without hitch and Dennis appeared in my office with a bunch of sign-off papers which he proceeded to fill out for my signature. A shadow crossed his brow. "It says 3016*L* here..That machine doesn't have an *L* on it!" Both of us headed to the door, colliding on the way..."Nope" says I "No *L*..Paint department musta left it off" Meanwhile, Dennis is making a closer inspection. He straightens up, his face GREY!! "Omigawd..they shipped you a heavy duty, high torque full box way machine in error..this machine is worth about 30 grand MORE than the one you ordered..I gotta call the office!" Thinking quickly, I called my biggest guy over.."Kill him!" I said, "and put the body in one of the new Haz. Waste barrels". I thought Dennis (who stands five feet-zip!) was going to throw up... Double, triple checked the paper work...Sure 'nuff a monumental cock-up had sent a 12000 lb 20 HP Full Box Way 3016 my way instead of the lighter, cheaper, 3016L I ordered. Dennis beat a hasty retreat back to his office..I called my Lawyer. "Legally they have every right to demand the machine back" He said.."But concede nothing 'til they make a move" Their move came thirty seconds later..Mike the Sales Rep called.."I guess we have a problem with the Fadal" he said. "Waddaya mean WE?" I responded..."You got a frog in yer pocket"? As it happened, I was going over later to visit their headquarters for their open day.. Sande (My Assistant) and I were greeted warmly.."So YOU"RE Mr. Bastow!!" Our way into the showroom was blocked by Mike accompanied by two (smiling) GIANTS..Who introduced themselves as Don and Mike Flint, the Owners of Flint Machinery. Firmly but gently we were ushered into the Inner Sanctum..and the door closed. Sande and I clutched out cell phones..thumbs at the ready, She with 911 plugged in..Me with my Lawyer's number at the ready. "Our" Problem (I didn't mention frogs..) was discussed! And Fadal's error/dilema..A wrong computer key stroke had sent a machine my way, set to tear new **sholes in toughened mold steel at phenomenal rates..and worth a conservative $22 THOUSAND more than I had agreed to pay...Bit of a Mexican Standoff loomed.... Mindful of my lawyer's advice I simply asked "So what would YOU guys like to see happen? "Merry Christmas" said the larger of the two (large) brothers and held out his hand. "Santa came early!" I was dumbfounded.."You are KIDDING ME!!" "Nope" "Fadal figured it was their screw up; by the time they swapped it out and resold the big machine as used, they might just as well "eat it" and wish you "Merry Christmas" I wanted to cry. Today is another (sure to be adventurous) day! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: My LUCKY Day!!!!!! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 16 Mar 2000 02:09:27 GMT -------- For a business..New Machines, like new cars, always have the best deals and the best financing or lease rates. When I buy a machine I look FIRST at the support I am going to get..A machine that is running will make money..one that is standing idle due to a problem can bleed you white just as fast. Then I look at the cost/month of purchasing or leasing it..and compare that with the wages I would have to pay to skilled men if I DIDN"T have it. Bottom line is, that the $1200 per month it costs to lease the Fadal is a whole lot less than the wages for even ONE semi-skilled operator. My top Tool and Die guys walk out with at least that amount per WEEK..some of them double that in a good week. teenut Bob Chilcoat wrote: > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote in message > news:SgMz4.6818$ps1.163632@news1.rdc1.ga.home.com... > > > > > Today is another (sure to be adventurous) day! > > > > I don't know how you do it, you dirty Bastow. I've been trying to talk a > Chicago company down a few thousand on a well-used Dyna 2800 they've had in > their inventory for THREE years. Won't budge a $. Perhaps I should be > looking at new machines. > > Bob ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: My LUCKY Day!!!!!! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 16 Mar 2000 02:24:30 GMT -------- Certainly in Atlanta GA., new companies open or migrate here daily. Many are non-manufacturing (at least directly) but the demand for skilled machinists has far outstripped supply. I pay $25.00 per hour for top toolmakers as a STARTER! Still can't find them though! teenut Steve Carlisle wrote: > > You guys must have a truely fantastic economy . > > Steve Carlisle > > On Wed, 15 Mar 2000 13:31:30 GMT, Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ > hotmail.com> wrote: > > >Monday was a day of frantic activity around the shop..Local Dealer delivered a > >honkin' great Rambaudi turret/knee mill and took away (in exchange) two tired > >old Bridgeports, a big German engine lathe, a Gros Band Filer and a throatless > >shear. That was at the ground level door. > > > >At the dock door an eighteen wheeler delivered a 12' x 12' x8' crate containing > >my new Fadal Four Axis Machining center..while the rigger unloaded a 12000lb > >forklift truck to roll it into place. > > > >First sign that all was not as it should be was when the forklift started to > >tilt forward under the weight of the "9000lb" crate. A couple of 300lb guys > >riding shotgun on the back end fixed that, it was uncrated, placed in position > >and hooked up to power and air without further drama. > > > >Yesterday, the Local Dealer (Flint Machine Tools) Technician (Dennnis) arrived > >to do the final assembly, alignment, calibration etc. First thing he commented > >on was that the Fadal was fitted with the Higher Torque 20 HP 10,000 Rev/min > >spindle, complete with refrigeration unit for sustained high speed running. > >This is an EXPENSIVE option and one which I certainly didn't order. Consensus > >was a general shrugging of shoulders..all concerned figured that Fadal had > >shipped that option as they happened to have it on the only machine in stock. > > > >The start up went without hitch and Dennis appeared in my office with a bunch of > >sign-off papers which he proceeded to fill out for my signature. > > > >A shadow crossed his brow. "It says 3016*L* here..That machine doesn't have an > >*L* on it!" Both of us headed to the door, colliding on the way..."Nope" says I > >"No *L*..Paint department musta left it off" Meanwhile, Dennis is making a > >closer inspection. He straightens up, his face GREY!! "Omigawd..they shipped > >you a heavy duty, high torque full box way machine in error..this machine is > >worth about 30 grand MORE than the one you ordered..I gotta call the office!" > > > >Thinking quickly, I called my biggest guy over.."Kill him!" I said, "and put the > >body in one of the new Haz. Waste barrels". I thought Dennis (who stands five > >feet-zip!) was going to throw up... > > > >Double, triple checked the paper work...Sure 'nuff a monumental cock-up had sent > >a 12000 lb 20 HP Full Box Way 3016 my way instead of the lighter, cheaper, 3016L > >I ordered. Dennis beat a hasty retreat back to his office..I called my Lawyer. > >"Legally they have every right to demand the machine back" He said.."But concede > >nothing 'til they make a move" > > > >Their move came thirty seconds later..Mike the Sales Rep called.."I guess we > >have a problem with the Fadal" he said. "Waddaya mean WE?" I responded..."You > >got a frog in yer pocket"? > > > >As it happened, I was going over later to visit their headquarters for their > >open day.. > > > >Sande (My Assistant) and I were greeted warmly.."So YOU"RE Mr. Bastow!!" > > > > Our way into the showroom was blocked by Mike accompanied by two (smiling) > >GIANTS..Who introduced themselves as Don and Mike Flint, the Owners of Flint > >Machinery. Firmly but gently we were ushered into the Inner Sanctum..and the > >door closed. Sande and I clutched out cell phones..thumbs at the ready, She > >with 911 plugged in..Me with my Lawyer's number at the ready. > > > >"Our" Problem (I didn't mention frogs..) was discussed! And Fadal's > >error/dilema..A wrong computer key stroke had sent a machine my way, set to tear > >new **sholes in toughened mold steel at phenomenal rates..and worth a > >conservative $22 THOUSAND more than I had agreed to pay...Bit of a Mexican > >Standoff loomed.... > > > >Mindful of my lawyer's advice I simply asked "So what would YOU guys like to see > >happen? > > > >"Merry Christmas" said the larger of the two (large) brothers and held out his > >hand. "Santa came early!" > > > >I was dumbfounded.."You are KIDDING ME!!" "Nope" "Fadal figured it was their > >screw up; by the time they swapped it out and resold the big machine as used, > >they might just as well "eat it" and wish you "Merry Christmas" > > > >I wanted to cry. > > > >Today is another (sure to be adventurous) day! > > > >teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: My LUCKY Day!!!!!! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 16 Mar 2000 02:39:52 GMT -------- I am glad you enjoyed the tour and picking through the scrap bin....I am still a HSM at heart and hope I always will be. Sorry I couldn't get to spend more time with you..but as you could see, I had my plate (and both hands) rather full...I felt like a Bobby on point duty at times. Tired but triumphant.... teenut David wrote: > > I missed the orig. post on this. #@%$ AOL....I visited Teenut`s shop yesterday, > I felt like a kid in a candy store. There was some head scratching going on > about this new machine, (my attention was elsewhere), but it sounds like you > got a *heckuva* windfall, Robert, that`s incredible! Must have been good Karma > about that time; after I left, I went to the regional Yancey/ Caterpillar > repair shop begging used bearings, shafts, etc and expecting the > "We-scrap-everything-and-besides-insurance-policy.." spiel. Instead, the shop > manager says "pull your car in, and there`s a handtruck". I think I invoked the > name "Santa Claus" about the same time you might have. > > Dave > > > > > > > It`s not the hallucinations that frighten me..... > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: My LUCKY Day!!!!!! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 16 Mar 2000 02:48:41 GMT -------- cbearden wrote: > > Given the choice between Brains and Luck, I will take luck any day... > Cecil in OKla People often say that to me..but y'know...The harder I work..The luckier I get! I make most of my own luck..and usually keep the many failures and disappointments to myself. "Luck" is all about making sure you are at the right place at the right time. "Luck" is about recognising the opportunity when it comes. "Luck" is about making sure you are ready and able to take advantage of that opportunity. Above all.."Luck" means having the guts to pull the trigger!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: My LUCKY Day!!!!!! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 16 Mar 2000 02:50:31 GMT -------- Who are you talking to at Redmond? teenut W E Griswold wrote: > > T, > > You lucky dog - may more riches fall from the sky for you. I > can't get Redmond to move an inch on a tired old South Bend. > > wegriswold > > * Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet's Discussion Network * > The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet - Free! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: My LUCKY Day!!!!!! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 16 Mar 2000 12:09:17 GMT -------- That would be gross..Cost to me...much higher! teenut William E Williams wrote: > > In article , > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > > > >Bottom line is, that the $1200 per month it costs to lease the Fadal is a whole > >lot less than the wages for even ONE semi-skilled operator. My top Tool and Die > >guys walk out with at least that amount per WEEK..some of them double that in a > >good week. > > Is that take home, gross or cost to you? > > Ted > -- > %%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%% > %% William E. Williams Nic: Ted (*NOT* Bill) %% > %% Systems / Programmer III Phone: (412) 624-HELP %% > %% Help Desk Office: 230 David Lawrence Hall %% ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Single point threading tip From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 16 Mar 2000 12:26:11 GMT -------- Using old geometric dies for single(actually Multi-)point threading was SOP when I served my time. I have used the method ever since. Three or four passes and you are done..perfect thread form every time. I wrote about this many months ago on RCM and a few people took up on it then. All you need is one die head cutter per thread pitch...make internal and external tool holders to suit. Usually you can scrounge old cutters from screw machine shops..they will discard a set if one is chipped. Even after regrinding them to their limit of usefulness in a die head, they still have lots of life for our purposes. Try to get the "Projection" type if you can..I have threaded inside face receses with these in the past. teenut SLEYED wrote: > > Hope this helps! > I have spent some time grinding cutters for doing this operation with great > resentment in getting the proper angles on the cutter and then setting it in > the machine to the proper relation to the x axis. > I was at a used machine tool dealer that had a ton of old unused geometric > threading dies. I got the idea to try and use them for a buck a set for an > insert. > Neat set up and and nice cut. I went back and for 20 bucks picked up most of > the thread pitches available. There were some for 4tpi that I ground for single > pointing just in case I may need them. At least I won't be grinding cutters if > I don't have to. > Doug ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: YECH!! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 16 Mar 2000 12:31:59 GMT -------- I strayed over to the Rec.CNC group in error. Felt like I needed a shower when I left..talk about invective!! It was worse than a KKK Klaven! There may have been useful information to glean over there..but I would feel permanently soiled if I had hung around to glean it! How NOT to conduct a NG. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Mimik Hydraulic tracer From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 16 Mar 2000 12:40:29 GMT -------- Does anyone have a copy of the installation, set up, and operating instructions for one of these Canadian built units? Does the parent company still exist..in Ontario, Canada IIRC? Anyone got a phone fax or link for them? Thanks, teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: My LUCKY Day!!!!!! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 17 Mar 2000 03:03:25 GMT -------- I still don't have a clue who "RAH" is..nor do I much care! But I firmly believe in the "Best employees..rewarded handsomely approach. Mistakes, honestly made are treated as a learning experience... Their Family requirements come first.. Their safety, wellbeing and self respect is my primary goal.. I believe in "Sharing the Wealth" I provide them with the very best of working conditions, equipment and tooling... I bail them out of jail.. I send them home when they are tired..or just plumb beaten by frustration... Every one of them..Down to my "Head of Maintainence and Janitorial Services" has his or her own business card. They are PROUD of who they are, what they do and the Company they work for. Any one of them can borrow the company truck for personal hauling..or one of the Jags for a special date!! First job was to have hot water and a $5000.00 new bathroom, toilet and shower installed. They have volunteered to build their own airconditioned, fully equiped lunch/rest/recreation room with company provided materials..on their own time!! Four have already been sent on three day CNC programming/Operating courses..on company time..and got a raise for it!! Not bad for the first month in business..with a hitherto rag-tag bunch of casual "Contract" workers. All I ask in return is total loyalty, the willingness to follow instructions, to learn new skills and work habits and enjoy the feeling of ranking with "The Best" teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article , > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > > That would be gross..Cost to me...much higher! > > You can't fool me - you really *are* RAH. This is his classic, > 'find the best employees you can, and reward them handsomely' > approach to life. > > Any signs of disloyalty are punished swiftly and surely. > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: YECH!! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 17 Mar 2000 03:29:06 GMT -------- I was looking at a 13 axis Swiss type cnc turning center with live tooling, only yesterday at a local dealer's. Damn those things are clever..and quick, and complex...and EXPENSIVE!!! My Mill is a 4 axis...X,Y,Z and A..rotary workholder/table which can be mounted vertical or horizontal..or any fixed angle in between A fifth axis might be the addition of a programable angle for the A axis. Sixth might be a "nutating" spindle..ie one which can articulate between vertical and horizontal..Here a seventh might be a rotation of said articulated spindle..givin it almost a "Wrist" movement to move into or reach up and under various odd shaped cavities etc. Don't ask me to enumerate all the axes on the swiss type machine..I start getting confused at 4 or 5 !! Do bear in mind that in machine tool terms..an "Axis" is not neccessarily a plane of movement or freedom..but a separately programable movement of workpiece or spindle or other function. teenut sunworshiper wrote: > > One would think that would be a good place for you to hang out with you > new 5 axis machine and all. > > BTW, what is the definition of axises and how far can it go? > Like is 6-7 the limit? Or is 5 it? > > The Sun shines , people forget. > Without the Sun none of us would be here. > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: YECH!! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 17 Mar 2000 03:32:19 GMT -------- No Peter. It wasn't any one particular posting..the whole tone of the whole group is one of supercilious nastiness and general contempt for others and their ideas. I "pop" in there from time to time..to "lurk"..always I want to wipe my feet when I leave! teenut Peter Reilley wrote: > > I think that I saw the posting that caused you to react this way but > I would not paint the whole group with this one occurrences. It was > roundly condemned by people on the group. They do tend to have > overly excited threads on this cad system vs. that cad system, but > all in all there is good information there. > > Anyone can post anything to an un-moderated group, it is the response > to the posting that is the measure of the group. I think that they > responded > in an appropriate manner. > > Pete. > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> > wrote in message > <3v4A4.6849$ps1.165185@news1.rdc1.ga.home.com>... > >I strayed over to the Rec.CNC group in error. Felt like I needed a shower > when > >I left..talk about invective!! It was worse than a KKK Klaven! > > > >There may have been useful information to glean over there..but I would > feel > >permanently soiled if I had hung around to glean it! > > > >How NOT to conduct a NG. > > > >teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Mimik Hydraulic tracer From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 17 Mar 2000 03:33:55 GMT -------- Thanks, I contacted them today and they are mailing me a handbook..$50.00!! teenut Spehro Pefhany wrote: > > The renowned Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > > Does anyone have a copy of the installation, set up, and operating instructions > > for one of these Canadian built units? > > Does the parent company still exist..in Ontario, Canada IIRC? > > Anyone got a phone fax or link for them? > > This might be it, Robert: > > Mimik Industries > 131 Sheldon Dr. > Galt ON N1R 6S2 > (519) 621-8010 > > -- > =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= > Spehro Pefhany "The Journey is the reward" > speff@interlog.com > Fax:(905) 271-9838 (small micro system devt hw/sw + mfg) > =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Opinions on Shaper, please. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 17 Mar 2000 03:40:07 GMT -------- For a home shop a small shaper would be my first recommendation after a lathe. Very, VERY versatile if you take the trouble to learn how to use it properly. I have a monster 36" and a "smaller" 20" shaper in my Tool and Die Shop..they will always have an important role there regardless of all the advanced technology stuff that follows them in there. teenut PLAlbrecht wrote: > > I have both a shaper and small mill. The mill does not entirely replace the > shaper. Among other things shapers are useful in making flat surfaces. A shaper > will machine a smoother and flatter surface than a mill could ever hope to do. > With the right tool grind and feed, the surface comes out looking almost like > it's been surface ground. Shapers are also the tool of choice for things such > as V ways. > > Besides, shapers are fun. > > Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: I need an "anvil" From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 17 Mar 2000 03:54:16 GMT -------- Just bear in mind always, that the scrap yard (or Bin) is a wonderful Slave..But a terrible Master! teenut..Who used to be a Slave..but has been a Master now for 14 years, eight months and three days! ;^) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Robert Bastow From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 17 Mar 2000 04:02:20 GMT -------- You already did connect..I got two rather abrupt messages from you..addressed to "Bastow:" No one has called me that since I left school! Basically asking if I could tell the difference between D1-3 and D1-4 Didn't bother to reply! teenut "Robert C. Medernach" wrote: > > Please give me your correct e-mail address or phone number. I can't seem to > connect with you on hotmail . I want to talk to you about the D1-3 tooling. > rcmed@iquest.net ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Mauser Bolt Facing? primary torque shoulder facing? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 17 Mar 2000 04:41:59 GMT -------- I have Kuhnhausen's book..got it to see what all the fuss was about..can't say I agree with a lot of his methodology..bit anal for me. However, not being able to imagine, even after racking my brains..what on earth a "cartridge recess" was or where it could be on a mauser action (I am fairly familiar with them!!!) I reached for and dusted off Kuhnhausen's tome... Waddya know, his "Cartridge Recess" is what every one else calls a "Bolt Face" and his special tool is..so far as I am aware, still sold by Brownell's as a "Bolt Facing tool" That said, I have looked at his tool design and his description of its use, and for the life of me I can't see what he means or how that curious dogleg design is supposed to be set up and used. I have "opened up" and refaced plenty of Mauser bolt faces..always used a short, stiff carbide boring tool. Cut from firing pin hole outwards. On some REALLY hard bolt faces I have used a tool post mounted, high speed grinding spindle with an end cutting carbide or even diamond burr about 1/8" diameter. Then, with the lathe spindle locked I can face out the cut away portion of the bolt face to the same level..befor hand finishing with stones and hand laps. Kuhnhausen says you don't need to bother doing this..true but it looks like S**t if you don't..not the trademark of a Master! His inner collar facing tool is simply a lapping disc running on a guide spindle through a long bushing that is threaded to fit the receiver ring. This is all well and good..except NONE of his methodology first ensures that the receiver threads are true to the receiver bolt bore. After all, the whole point of all this laborious, often anally retentive, "Truing"...is to ensure that the barrel/chamber axis is truly aligned with the BOLT axis and face. As I said...I ain't impressed by Kuhnhausen! teenut (Proprietor of The Express Rifle Company, Atlanta..Soon to be in full production with "True" Mauser Action Replicas!!) ( which won't need "Truing"!! Clark Magnuson wrote: > > Jerry Kuhnhausen's book on Mausers on page 171 figure 208 has a > cartridge recess spot facing tool. It is designed by the author and I > don't see one offered in Brownell's catalogue. > > Does someone sell these? > How do I make one? > > Likewise how about facing the primary [inner] torque shoulder of the > receiver on page 163 figure 193? > TIA Clark ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: the chicken or the egg .. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 17 Mar 2000 04:51:33 GMT -------- Carve a wooden bung to fit the tube...tap it into place..leaving a bit sticking out. Find the center with odd-legs, surface gage or WHY, center pop it and centerdrill it with your trusty Black and Decker. Mount the tube in the lathe, suporting the bung end on the tailstock center..Face the end of the tube..You can let the tool run into the wood bung, even undercut it a bit to chamfer the inside of the tube when you are done. Unless the centering is grossly off..small errors will not effect the "Squareness" of your tube end a lot. This is a method used by Live Steam Modelers for squaring up boiler tube ends..since models and small lathes were invented. teenut Grant Erwin wrote: > > This problem has come up for me a few times .. > > Given a tube with uneven ends, long with respect to the chuck jaws, wider > than the lathe spindle, with the outside surface such that you don't want > to use it directly in a steady rest, how can you face the ends? I'm > assuming you hold one end in a lathe chuck and it's concentric. > > If the tailstock end were clean, you could hold it on a bullnose center > and turn the OD for use in a steady. > > If the OD were clean, you could hold it in a steady and face the end > for the bullnose. > > But if it's neither, what to do? > > Grant Erwin > Kirkland, Washington ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: cutting tapered threads without a taper attachment From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 17 Mar 2000 04:54:23 GMT -------- Use a cheap and cheerful tapered die! For a long, slow taper, you can off-set the tailstock center and turn and screw cut in the regular way. teenut Jens wrote: > > Is there a cheap and cheerful way to cut a tapered thread on a lathe > without having to spring for a taper attachment ? > > Jens ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: My LUCKY Day!!!!!! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 17 Mar 2000 05:12:08 GMT -------- He will!! Just make sure you are THERE...and LISTENING!! teenut Marty Escarcega wrote: ...my wishes are to be where Robert is at, doing my own > thing. I hope the man upstairs lets me know when the opportunity is right. > > Marty ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: cutting tapered threads without a taper attachment From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 17 Mar 2000 06:22:14 GMT -------- Ah! A TRULY cheap bugger! ;^) No point in telling you then that my local hardware store will thread pipes for 50cents an end. I needed several the other day and sent my driver down to the local Ace to get them done. I have the dies..but I can't do them for THAT price. teenut Jens wrote: > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > > >Use a cheap and cheerful tapered die! > > > >For a long, slow taper, you can off-set the tailstock center and turn and screw > >cut in the regular way. > > Just to add to my previous question (now don't anybody flame me for > this - please) I am trying to cut a 3/4" NPT thread to make up some > pipe clamps for my wood shop. > I was under the impression that a tapered die needed a special holder > so that you can tap dance on the end of a 6 ft wrench to turn the > silly thing - in other words not something for lathe work. Although, 5 > HP at about 60 RPM ought to give a good amount of torque :) ... I > wonder what would bust first ... > Also, being a cheap bugger and this is for occasional work only I was > hoping not to spend the $60 and up for a die. > > On the off-set tail stock suggestion that a number of you made - thank > you very much. Since I have always threaded right at the chuck this > never occurred to me. One question though, how much length between > chuck and tailstock would I need in order for the 3/4" pipe not to > stress the average lathe (if there is such a thing) assuming a 1 in 12 > taper (I think) ? > > Jens ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Square hole drills From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 17 Mar 2000 11:56:02 GMT -------- Sounds like a variation of what used to be called an "Automotive shank" It was primarily for production and transfer line dedicated machinery. The square thread was for a split screwed collar with a locking set screw. Newly sharpened drills, boring, reaming, counterboring and milling tools would be pre-set to a "Gage Length" in the Toolroom and shipped to the Transfer Machine line There the operator could swap out worn tools quickly..knowing that the pre-set tools would cut right to spec. without further adjustment. Similar procedures are used nowadays to pre-qualify cutters for CNC production machines. teenut Hugh Strong wrote: > > Now, you don't have to drill a square hole, and you don't > have to broach. You can bore it (and other insane shapes) > instead! > > http://www.toolingsystems.com/microbore/formbore/index.html > > I found this when researching (unsucessfully) a > Devlieg-Microbore artifact that I found at the P&W surplus > store in East Hartford, CT. Said artifact was an endmill > holder, about 1" size. It had a shank about the size you > would find on a R-8 taper, with two weird exceptions: > > 1. There were threads where the taper would be. > 2. There was a keyway, but there was an anti-rotation key > fixed in it. > > "Larry Phillips" wrote in message > news:38CBDD00.18B157E9@home.com... > > howkers wrote: > > > > > > No-one seems to have mentioned square hole drills. > These consist of > > > a drill with one flute less than the number of hole > sides ie 3-flute > > > for square, 5-flute for hexagonal etc. This is used in > conjunction > > > with a hardened steel bush with the required hole in it. > The drill > > > orbits about inside the hardened bush and creates a > square hole with > > > a radius in the corners. > > > > Hey! Years ago (at least 40 years ago, actually), I read > about a drill > > bit that made square holes. There was a drawing and > explanation, and I > > understood it. Since then, I have often wondered if I > imagined or dreamt > > it, or if it was perhaps an April Fool joke in a magazine. > > > > Your mention of it led me to look around on the web, and > sure enough, it > > was no dream or joke. I probably read it in Scientific > American, in one > > of Martin Gardner's articles. A fellow named Henry Watt > inmvented a > > square drill bit in 1915. It is based on a construct > called a 'Reuleaux > > Triangle', which is one example of a curve of constant > width. > > > > You can see an animation of a Reuleaux Triangle at > > > > http://mathworld.wolfram.com/ReuleauxTriangle.html > > > > and an example of a two-sided curve of constant width at > > > > http://mathworld.wolfram.com/Rotor.html > > > > I have yet to find an actual picture or explanation of a > practical drill > > bit, though. > > > > > > > Costs big bucks and not much use for a do it youselfer > who can't make > > > the square holed hard bush. Cant remember the name of > the firm that > > > makes them but I think they're from Surrey England. > > > > If you remember, please let us know. > > > > -- > > Hukt on fonix werkt fer me! > > > > http://cr347197-a.surrey1.bc.wave.home.com/larry/ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: My LUCKY Day!!!!!! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 17 Mar 2000 12:20:02 GMT -------- Hmmm! A curious observation to make about a considerate Boss. Perhaps he was just too accustomed to being treated like a disposable commodity..Kinda like being "Institutionalised". Or like a badly beaten dog, rescued from the pound, that can never fully be brought back to full mental health. Maybe you Darface, with your profound experience as an employer, can shed some further wisdom..I know I have a lot to learn, both as a metal shifter and as a "Boss". It took me a LONG time to learn and admit "that I know that I know not" teenut ^:# DarFace wrote: > > I have a guy come over to my dirty old garage to shape and cut metal > parts on my presses. > It's heated and AC'd . The work is easy though boring. I pay decent and > am polite and understanding , patient and encouraging. He's quick and > clever. Smart and a wiseacre in a good way. He would SURELY tell Robert > Bastow EXACTLY what he told me, which is: > "YOU HAVE A LOT TO LEARN ABOUT BEING A BOSS" (^: > D. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Boring a gun barrel (long) From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 18 Mar 2000 00:50:10 GMT -------- Jacob, you covered the subject beautifully..especially the bit about extreme attention to detail. Above all else in deep hole drilling..There ain't much room for mistakes. teenut..who has made most of 'em!! Jacob Henteleff wrote: > > There are a number of "secrets to truly concentric boring. The drill bit is > the first critical item. It should be of the gun drill (also called deep > hole drill) variety which has two flutes like a conventional twist drill but > they intersect at point off center and therefore cut a sort of "W" shaped > surface if you look at in cross section. > > There are no spiral flutes, just a long trough along the length of the bit. > Oil under pressure is fed through a pipe to the back end of the gun drill. > It emerges at one of the relief faces of the bit and lubricates the area > behind the cut. It then finds its way to the trough and carries the chips > back out of the bore. > > When the barrel is readied for boring it is set up in a chuck that will > support the blank at both ends and with both ends running as truly as > possible. Since most rifle blanks come with a rough exterior you generally > turn a smooth area at each end to run a dial test indicator on. > > The end at which the hole is started is turned flat across the end with a > little of the concentric turning marks vivsible. This will help retain a > tight oil pressure seal while the oil pressure is applied to the bit. > > The bit itself is passed through a closely fitted bushing. Normal drilling > practice on the lathe or drill press is to chuck the twist drill by its > shank and just shove it at the work piece. We all know that the small chisel > tip isn't very happy about this even if you started with a pilot hole. > Because the average twist drill bit is upwards of 10 times as long as it is > in diameter and given that the bore of the tails stock and the head stock > aren't allways precisely in line and given that even the nicest factory > drill bits may not have precisely identical flute lengths on each side, the > result is the bit wobbles a bit until it's in deep enough that the hole > controls it. > > That's where the bushing comes in on barrel drilling. It is mounted in a > housing that has been set up to hold the bushing so that it aligns perfectly > with the axis of rotation of the barrel. The face of the bushing is greased > lightly and brought into close contact with the face of the barrel blank. > The turning grooves act as a seal. > > The gun drill which is like a groud rod with a trough along the side is a > perfect sliding fit in the bushing. The barrel blank is set to turning. Then > the gun drill is fed through the bushing until it touches the face of the > barrel blank. A little oil can be fed but not much. Too much flow or > pressure might affect something. Because the bushing is exactly in alignment > with the center of rotation and because it holds the bit so snugly the bit > starts a perfect hole down the barrel. > > Once the drill is started and has gotten deep enough that the barrel hole > now acts like a bushing for the drill bit the oil pressure can be brought up > so that it flushes the chips out well and reliably. Getting a pile up of > chips is guaranteed disaster. A 6mm bore might need over 400 psi to flush > well and perhaps higher. Remember that the drill bit is going to be 20 plus > inches down the hole and that's a big stack of chips to move. Also the oil > pipe is what is holding the bit down there so it's doubly fragile. > > You can see that as the bit passes farther into the bore and no longer has > the support of the bushing and because the bore it makes is less than > perfectly smooth, there is bound to be a slight tendency to wander, however, > slight. Really close attention to the details of bit grind, oil pressure, > rate of feed, and rotational speed of the blank can all contribute to > success or failure. > > In an amateur rifle making environment you will not want to bore right > through the blank. If you pop through the end with 400+ psi of oil on tap > you'll rust-proof everything in sight before you can say holy crow. > > Stop an inch or so short and just cut the "cap" off to expose the hole. > > Now that you have a hole as concentric as care and attention to details can > provide, say less than 20 thou TIR over 24 inches you can set up the barrel > for reaming. Reamers with oil pressure feed are drawn through the bored > barrel to clean up the surface. Ususally this is done in two steps, each > taking out a few thousands of an inch only. > > The bore is then ready for rifling and if you are cut rifling for lapping. > most manufacturers of rifle barrels use a carbide button to swage the > rifling into the drilled bore which is much faster than cutting individual > grooves a few ten thousandths at a pass. It also produces a smoother bore > finish and probably work hardens the bore surface a bit too. A button takes > only one pass to produce full rifling. > > There you have it. There is no secret to drilling rifle barrels. All you > need is a full understanding of the process, infinite patience in > preparation or tools and set-up and then loads of experience (in other words > you screwed up a lot of other people's barrels first). What could be > easier!? > > Want more info? Buy a copy of Guy Lautard's video on amateur rifle barrel > making. It will tell the whole story and is well worth the price. You can > find ads for his books and videos in Home Shop Machinist and other magazines > and I believe he also has a Web Site now. Sorry I can't reproduce it here. > > Whether you make your own barrel or not you will know a lot more about the > subject than I just gave you. > > Paul Koning wrote in message <38D14E87.DFD49BE5@lucent.com>... > >Lou Boyd wrote: > >> > >> "Orrin B. Iseminger" wrote: > >> >... > >> > Seriously, I wonder what the secrets of truly concentric boring are. > Does > >> > anyone know them? If they're in the book, the information will easily > be worth > >> > the price of it. > >> > > >> The way to end up with a concentric bore is to turn the outside after > >> the hole is bored. > > > >Not from what I understand reading the articles. > > > >For one thing, if the drilling process itself couldn't be trusted > >to go concentric, it couldn't be trusted to go straight either. > >And turning the outside last is no help at all if the bore has > >a curve in it! > > > > paul > >-- > >!----------------------------------------------------------------------- > >! Paul Koning, NI1D, D-20853 > >! Lucent Corporation, 50 Nagog Park, Acton, MA 01720, USA > >! phone: +1 978 263 0060 ext 115, fax: +1 978 263 8386 > >! email: pkoning@lucent.com > >! Pgp: 27 81 A9 73 A6 0B B3 BE 18 A3 BF DD 1A 59 51 75 > >!----------------------------------------------------------------------- > >! "A system of licensing and registration is the perfect device to deny > >! gun ownership to the bourgeoisie." > >! -- Vladimir Ilyich Lenin ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: My LUCKY Day!!!!!! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 18 Mar 2000 00:53:06 GMT -------- Er...Isn't that what I said? teenut Uncle phil wrote: > > Ummmm.... I'm not sure I appreciate being characterized as "a badly beaten > dog, rescued (etc)". > > That comment Dar(face) referred to was meant - and, I think, taken - as a > left-handed compliment. > > True, I have spent most of my working life with "Use 'em up, Burn 'em out, > and Dump 'em" organizations, but I've never given up hope. Dar is the kind > of "Boss" I hope to grow up to be. > > Uncle Phil > Dar's Part-time Assistant/ > Proprietor of "Newelry Fashion Jewelry." (Our motto: SOMEDAY we'll make > something that sells!!) > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote in message > news:SppA4.7095$ps1.167218@news1.rdc1.ga.home.com... > > Hmmm! A curious observation to make about a considerate Boss. > > > > Perhaps he was just too accustomed to being treated like a disposable > > commodity..Kinda like being "Institutionalised". Or like a badly beaten > dog, > > rescued from the pound, that can never fully be brought back to full > mental > > health. > > > > Maybe you Darface, with your profound experience as an employer, can shed > some > > further wisdom..I know I have a lot to learn, both as a metal shifter and > as a > > "Boss". > > > > It took me a LONG time to learn and admit "that I know that I know not" > > > > teenut > > > > ^:# DarFace wrote: > > > > > > I have a guy come over to my dirty old garage to shape and cut metal > > > parts on my presses. > > > It's heated and AC'd . The work is easy though boring. I pay decent and > > > am polite and understanding , patient and encouraging. He's quick and > > > clever. Smart and a wiseacre in a good way. He would SURELY tell Robert > > > Bastow EXACTLY what he told me, which is: > > > "YOU HAVE A LOT TO LEARN ABOUT BEING A BOSS" (^: > > > D. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: My LUCKY Day!!!!!! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 18 Mar 2000 00:57:24 GMT -------- Cecil..any time you want to talk about it..call me. Express Tool and Die should be listed by now, under "New Subscribers" teenut cbearden wrote: > > Teenut: > Would you be interested in hiring an engineer willing to learn a useful > trade? I have tried to find another job for 20 years around here, and when > they learn that I worked for the gov't, it is like I had leprecy, or passed > gas in church.... One time I was told that my work ethic was not up to the > standard of the engineering organization I was talking to at the time.. > Next week they were in my office asking how to repair a complex problem that > they had spent $65K of a small town's money on without solving it. their > solution was to excavate 2000 yds into the main water supply dam for the > town, and install all new piping through the embankment to replace the > Siphon line they had spent so much money on trying to make it work. This > line was installed without our approval also.. I looked at the as-builts > and the specifications for 10 minutes or so, and asked the question "is your > butterfly valve stem seals rated for suction pressures?" "Of course " was > the answer I received. I pulled out my trusty 1950's catalog on crane > valves and noted that the cross section of the valve seals indicated single > lip seals that would allow air to enter the pipeline under vacuum > conditions, or in the case of a siphon. A call to a retired salesman for > this area led me to the engineering dept of crane, who said I made his day > when I told him of the problems this engineer and town had with the valves. > In fact they FedExed a new set of seals for negative pressures at no charge > because the story was so entertaining. > now our governor wants to make all gov't jobs privatized, because anyone can > do our jobs. > > 6 more years and I can walk out the door. A long 6 years.... > > Cecil in OKla > > Marty Escarcega wrote in message <8EF9DFAE5escarcegahomecom@24.1.240.74>... > >"teenut"@ hotmail.com (Robert Bastow) wrote in > ><1ghA4.6979$ps1.166762@news1.rdc1.ga.home.com>: > > > >>I still don't have a clue who "RAH" is..nor do I much care! > >> > >>But I firmly believe in the "Best employees..rewarded handsomely approach. > >> > >>Mistakes, honestly made are treated as a learning experience... > >> > >>Their Family requirements come first.. > >> > >>Their safety, wellbeing and self respect is my primary goal.. > >> > >>I believe in "Sharing the Wealth" > >> > >>I provide them with the very best of working conditions, equipment and > >>tooling... > >> > >>I bail them out of jail.. > >> > >>I send them home when they are tired..or just plumb beaten by > >frustration... > >> > >>Every one of them..Down to my "Head of Maintainence and Janitorial > >Services" has > >>his or her own business card. They are PROUD of who they are, what they do > >and > >>the Company they work for. > >> > >>Any one of them can borrow the company truck for personal hauling..or one > >of the > >>Jags for a special date!! > >> > >>First job was to have hot water and a $5000.00 new bathroom, toilet and > >shower > >>installed. > >> > >>They have volunteered to build their own airconditioned, fully equiped > >>lunch/rest/recreation room with company provided materials..on their own > >time!! > >> > >>Four have already been sent on three day CNC programming/Operating > >courses..on > >>company time..and got a raise for it!! > >> > >>Not bad for the first month in business..with a hitherto rag-tag bunch of > >casual > >>"Contract" workers. > >> > >>All I ask in return is total loyalty, the willingness to follow > >instructions, to > >>learn new skills and work habits and enjoy the feeling of ranking with > >"The > >>Best" > >> > >>teenut > >> > >> > >> > >> > >> > >>mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > >>> > >>> In article , > >>> Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > >>> > That would be gross..Cost to me...much higher! > >>> > >>> You can't fool me - you really *are* RAH. This is his classic, > >>> 'find the best employees you can, and reward them handsomely' > >>> approach to life. > >>> > >>> Any signs of disloyalty are punished swiftly and surely. > >>> > >>> Jim > >>> > >>> Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > >>> Before you buy. > > > >I tip my hat off to Robert. He recognizes that the best days (most > >productive and healthiest) of our lives are spent at work. Most of the day > >is with our employers, not our families. > >How many hard working people have dedicated our lives and looked forward to > >retirement plans and then passed away... > > > >Again, you get one life, live it to its fullest. Pay attention to your > >families and loved ones, try to find a job or a business that you enjoy and > >have fun at it...my wishes are to be where Robert is at, doing my own > >thing. I hope the man upstairs lets me know when the opportunity is right. > > > >Marty ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Casting/Foundry Symbols or Trademarks From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 18 Mar 2000 01:03:32 GMT -------- Kurt, I can't help you with the casing symbols..but you sound like my kinda anally retentive Model Engineer!! I spent twenty years tracking down the direction of drawfiling and polishing marks on the breech mechanism of a 9.2" Howitzer! Who cares? Me! (Yes I got them..from an old Geezer that used to finish file and fit Welin Breeches for Vickers!!) teenut Kurt Laughlin wrote: > > > Looking for turret patterns? :O) > > Actually, just trying to determine who "GAD", "C in an octagon", and "SS" > were, among others. There were variations in the parts due to design > changes and variations due to normal differences in foundry practices. This > info will help sort these out. > > KL ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: I need an "anvil" From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 18 Mar 2000 01:33:53 GMT -------- I don't remember the source..but at the time, certainly one that I respected..Said: "Knuckle height is good..If you want to spend your time resting your knuckles" "However..if you want to do Serious Smithing...Raise it considerably higher than that!" I checked out "Knuckle height"....Got a bad back, tennis elbow and eye strain trying to do fine hammer work thusly. Four or five inches higher works for me. teenut william thomas powers wrote: > > >The legs should be of a length such > >that, if you stand beside your finished anvil with your arms hanging at > >your sides and your fists clenched, your knuckles should just brush the > >top of the anvil. This may seem low to you at first but, trust me, the > >more blacksmithing you do the more you'll become convinced that this is > >right. > > Well I've been smithing for over 20 years now and I don't find that right! > > This was the traditional height for a smith using a striker or top tools. > For a knifemaker or someone doing "little" work its usually too low. If > you find yourself bending over while working RAISE YOUR ANVIL! Your > back will thank you! I usually advise people to stand straight and take your > favorite hammer and swing it in your normal form. Where the face of the > hammer is parallel to the ground is where the face of the anvil should be. > (You can allow for your stock thickness too). > > Thomas Mid Ohio Blacksmiths meeting Saturday at 3 pm in Columbus OH ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: welding away... From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 18 Mar 2000 01:38:17 GMT -------- Mike, as a "Native Born Canuck" you don't need 'ole t*****t to tell you how to go f**k yourself. ;^) cordially, tee Mike Graham wrote: > > On Thu, 16 Mar 2000 19:46:39 -0800, Gary Hallenbeck wrote: > > >Ah Mike, Canadian and humble too? What a guy! :>) > > It comes with the citizenship, eh? Though some of the imports have dual > citizenship which restricts their humility. I don't want to mention any > names, but it starts with 'T' and ends with 'Nut'. 8-) > > -- > -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- > Mike Graham | Metalworker by trade > mikegraham at sprint dot ca | Weld to live, like to weld. > Caledon, Ontario, Canada | Weird by nature > > remove reversed 'nospam' to reply > -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- > "By Fire and Iron doth he make Bread." ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Mauser Bolt Facing? primary torque shoulder facing? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 18 Mar 2000 01:41:49 GMT -------- That's what I said..or at least "meant"..By "anally retentive" So many people, in so many fields, try to replace skill and practice with technology! teenut Bray Haven wrote: > > >After all, the whole point > >> of all this laborious, often anally retentive, "Truing"...is to ensure that > >the > >> barrel/chamber axis is truly aligned with the BOLT axis and face. > > Which then must be trued with the lug shoulders turning (perpend. with the axis > of the bolt bore) with an internal mandrel, which all assumes the threads are > aligned with the bolt axis. Mostly nonsense. I've seen very few actions > actually improved with this work (unless you need to open the face up anyway. > n the other hand, I've seen some good actions screwed up. Ole's description > of "anal methodology" is quite accurate here. > > Greg Sefton ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: cutting tapered threads without a taper attachment From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 18 Mar 2000 01:48:58 GMT -------- Fear not! A tapered pipe tap is a chunky thing. I have NEVER seen one break in a hole. Indeed, I have seen them screwed completely through the solid 4130X, heat treated neck of an new, emergant, gas cylinder..to be lost inside it! This when the automatic transfer line, machining and tapping new cylinder necks, got out of whack! teenut Jack Erbes wrote: > > Jens wrote: > > > > A related question - just how do you know to back off from threading a > > pipe (NPT - die or tap). It seems that I run into very strong cutting > > resistance fairly soon (like after a few turns) and don't particularly > > want to break off an expensive tap so most of my stuff isn't fully > > threaded. There is now way that I will take a 3 ft long cheater bar > > and hang it on the end of my little tap or die (this procedure seems > > standard whenever I have seen a commercial guy use threading gear). > > That is a result of the steadily increasing load as the cutting teeth > cut farther outward from the drilled hole. Particularly if the hole has > not been reamed to a matching taper before tapping. > > But I also always get nervous, use plenty of sulphurized threading oil, > and back off to cut the chips much more frequently as the thread > deepens. > > Prepping the hole with a tapered reamer after drilling and before > tapping makes a big difference. > > -- > Jack in Sonoma, CA, USA (jack@vom.com) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Anvils at shipyard auction - How much$? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 18 Mar 2000 01:59:52 GMT -------- I feel fortunate now..I got my English made, 125# steel faced, forged anvil..in perfect shape, for 70c a pound!! Got another at the same price for a Buddy..No, they ain't any left....Find yer own! teenut Steve Smith wrote: > > GaryH82012@aol.com wrote: > > > I have been attending a series of auctions this month and buying a few tools > > and some machinery. All of it is well used but still servicable. These auctions > > have been open only to business owners within the city and it's a pretty small > > crowd. Prices have been low, but not extremely so. The next sale to be held, > > and all subsequent ones, will be open to businesses in 26 other cities. More > > competition and higher prices, I'm sure. Only one anvil has appeared so far and > > it sold for about $250. It probably weighed 100 #, not counting the chunk of > > wood it was bolted to. There are about 10 more anvils coming up at future sales > > and I would like to get one. These are bigger, maybe 300#, mostly on stands. > > They are from the foundry building and all in good shape. So as not to get too > > caught up in the auction fever, I'm wondering what a market price for one of > > these might be. They are not cast iron or an import. Thanks for replys, Gary > > Hastings > > Prices in Colorado are a little higher; I haven't seen an anvil anything like > useable for less than $2 a pound for some time. > > I have a list of anvil dimensions for a given poundage at home. I will get it to > you tonight, and post it on rcm Monday. > > Steve Smith ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Troyke rotary problem From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 18 Mar 2000 02:06:42 GMT -------- Wack harder is an option...rigging up a through bolt to pull it out, is a safer, saner, sounder, idea! teenut Peter Reilley wrote: > > I bought a Troyke 9 inch rotary table. This table has a sleeve inserted in > the > center that has a 1 inch bore. It looks like it is hardened and ground. > I > believe that it is part of the table as it came new. The problem is that > this > sleeve is a few up a few thousands above the table surface. I have tried > to tap it out from the bottom using an aluminum drift and taping it down > with a plastic hammer but it won't move. There does not appear to be any > set screws at the ends of the T slots that would hold it in. > > What should I do? Wack it harder? Any ideas? > > Thanks, > Pete. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Got my anvil / A trip to the scrap yard. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 18 Mar 2000 02:19:48 GMT -------- You took a big step towards growing up Justin..venturing into a strange scrap yard is not for the faint hearted (I'd sure like to shake your Mom's hand!) Things started to go awry with all the "I said, like.." That's kids talk. (I know..I have kids and it drives me NUTS!) You blew it with A**BUTT!! Better luck next time kid. teenut Justin Headley wrote: > > Well i went to the scrap yard with my mom, and we looked around for some > steel plate. I found some good stuff, exactly what i needed, but it was > a huge sheet, like 15 x 15, and the dood was out there cutting stuff, > but didn't want to ask him because you guys told me not to. So then i > rummaged around in the place with all the rusty metal, since everything > that looked like i could use it was shiny so i assumed it was stainless. > I found a lot of really big things that look like H's when put on their > side. I thought it would make a good anvil but heavy as hell!. So i got > a steel "bar", whatever you call it, about 2 feet long, 4 inches wide, > and maybe 2-3 inches thick. I was trying to cut it in half with my OA > cutting torch, with my 0 tip. Boy, did that sure suck. I found i could > use my hammer and an old railroad nail, and chisel away the slag. > I asked the dood for some angle iron, and he was like, what kind, and i > was like, uh... steel, 1/8 inch thick. And he was like what? You mean 1 > by 1? And i was like ok.... and he was like, how thick? and i was like > 1/8. and he was like 1/4, 1/2? and i was like EIGHT, ASSBUTT! > > -- > Where a calculator on the ENIAC is equipped with 18,000 vacuum tubes and > weighs 30 tones, computers in the future by the year 2000 may have only > 1,000 vacuum tubes and weigh only 1.5 tons > > -- Popular Mechanics, March 1949 ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: My LUCKY Day!!!!!! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 18 Mar 2000 14:59:44 GMT -------- John Stevenson wrote: > > On Wed, 15 Mar 2000 13:31:30 GMT, Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> > wrote: > > Congratulations Robert on your good luck. > > >Monday was a day of frantic activity around the shop..Local Dealer delivered a > >honkin' great Rambaudi turret/knee mill and took away (in exchange) two tired > >old Bridgeports, a big German engine lathe, a Gros Band Filer and a throatless > >shear. That was at the ground level door. > > Why didn't you offer the Bridgeports on the NG? > Knowing what S/H machine tools fetch in exchange you could have earnt more > brownie points letting them go here Sorry John, Business is Business...Brownie points don't meet the payroll! I NEEDED the Rambaudi for roughing out Honkin' great die and mould blocks. Cash flow is everything, this way I didn't need to find the cash to pay for the Rambaudi or the Jet 14x40 that came with it. > > >Firmly but gently we were ushered into the Inner Sanctum..and the > >door closed. Sande and I clutched out cell phones..thumbs at the ready, She > >with 911 plugged in..Me with my Lawyer's number at the ready. > > Again congratulations. From an earlier post you said that only brain > surgeons and drug dealers need cell phones. > I'll give you the credit of not dealing so you must have made the ranks of > a brain surgeon Dealing is one way to make the payroll!! Or I could offer CNC Brain Surgery!! (I am already making surgical implants for the treatment of brain tumors!!) > > >I was dumbfounded.."You are KIDDING ME!!" "Nope" "Fadal figured it was their > >screw up; by the time they swapped it out and resold the big machine as used, > >they might just as well "eat it" and wish you "Merry Christmas" > > Remember keep up the rental payments or they'll soon find the time to > remove it. Ain't THAT the truth..no free rides! > This obviously means good news for your customers as now you can remove > metal quicker you can reduce your cost accordingly. I can also sell my older Hurco VMC and put the proceeds towards a CNC Lathe. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Young's Modulus Question From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 19 Mar 2000 01:24:27 GMT -------- Printed and filed..Won't ask again! Thanks Brian, teenut brian whatcott wrote: > > >eberlein wrote: > > > >> My old textbook says that tungsten carbide E is 100X10^6. That makes it > >> more than 3X larger than steel. > > Ted_E@bc.sympatico.ca replied... > >Almost 3 1/2. Guess that's why a solid carbide slot drill makes a good > >boring bar. > > >Ted > > Finally, here's a list I collated of metals and ceramics with E greater than > 31000 ksi (so a few steel alloys crept in...) > > I didn't note if I lined it up in a monospace font or not, so it will > probably come out ragged on your copy. > > Don't ask again! :-) > > Brian Whatcott Altus OK > > Material Name Modulus of Elasticity, ksi > > Alumina, 99.9% 53070 > 85% Alumina, vitreous body 33060 > 95% Alumina, vitreous body 41035 > 99.5% Alumina, vitreous body 52200 > Alumina, alpha Al2O3, 99.5% 53940 > Alumina, alpha Al2O3, 96% 43935 > 99.5% Alumina,thin film 53650 > Barium Boride, BaB6 55825 > Calcium Boride 65395 > Chromium Carbide, Cr3C2 55100 > Cerium Boride, CeB6 54955 > Hafnium Carbide, HfC 51040 > Molybdenum Carbide, Mo2C 56550 > Niobium Carbide 62930 > Silicon Carbide, CVD 60900 > Silicon Carbide, sntrd alpha 59450 > Silicon Carbide, sublimed 67860 > Tantalum Carbide 69890 > Titanium Carbide, TiC 65250 > Vanadium Carbide 49880 > Tungsten Carbide, W2C 60900 > Tungsten Carbide, WC 99035 > Zirconium Carbide 51910 > Silicon Nitride, HPSN 46400 > Silicon Nitride 42050 > Silicon Nitride, SRBSN 42050 > Silicon Nitride, HIP-RBSN 46400 > Silicon Nitride, Sialon 43500 > Titanium Nitride (TiN) Coat 87000 > Coors Alumina, various, 31900 to 53650 > Ceralloy 225,Titanium Diboride, > TiB2 83375 > Ceralloy 546, Boron Carbide, > B4C 64960 > Ceralloy 418, Beryllium Oxide, > BeO 50025 > Ceralloy 137, Aluminum Nitride, > AlN 39875 > Ceralloy 146, Silicon Carbide, > SiC 62350 > Ceralloy 147, Silicon Nitride, > Si3N4 44950 > Diamond 123395 to 130000 > Diamond, thin film 113970 > FerroAluminum Oxide > Grinding Media P99 38483 > Ferro CeZrO2 Grinding Media 33422.5 > Ferro Aluminum Oxide 40000 to 47995 > Ferro Zirmonite 200, ZTA 40310 > DERANOX® 970 Alumina 47850 to 55100 > VITOX® Alumina 58000 > D995T, toughened alumina 49300 > Silicon Nitride 32045 to 45000 > Coors Zirconia, ZTA 52200 > Thornel® Carbon Fiber > Polyacrylonitrile > (PAN) Precursor 33500 to 52200 > Thornel® Carbon Fiber, > Pitch Precursor 55000 to 120350 > AISI 4340 31755 > AISI 8630H Steel 31000 to 32335 > AISI 86B30H Steel 31000 to 32335 > Beryllium, Be 43935 > Chromium, Cr; Recrystallized 35960 > Iridium, Ir 75980 > Molybdenum, Mo 47850 > Osmium, Os; 81200 > Rhenium, 66700 to 68000 > Rhodium, Rh; As-Plated 52055 > Ruthenium, Ru; Bar 60030 > Technetium, Tc; Annealed 46690 > Tungsten, W, (drawn wire) 58000 > Molybdenum Disilicide, MoSi2 54665 > Molybdenum > Mo-0.5Ti; M0-0.5Ti-0.02C > (Molybdenum Alloy 362) 45675 > Mo-47.5 Re > Molybdenum Rhenium Alloy 52925 > CuMoCu 13/74/13 39005 > W-25 Re > Tungsten Rhenium Alloy 62350 > Brush Wellman E60 > Beryllium/BeO Composite, > 60 Volume% BeO 47850 > Carpenter MP35N* > Ni-Co-Cr-Mo Alloy 34046 > Carpenter HyMu "80"® > Electronic Alloy 31465 > Haynes® 188 alloy 33640 > Haynes® 263 alloy 32045 > Hastelloy® B-2 alloy 31465 > Haynes® Multimet® alloy 31030 > Hastelloy® alloy N 31755 > Haynes® Ultimet™ alloy 31175 > Hastelloy® B-3™ alloy 31320 > Hogen > Tungsten-Base Metal 40020 to 52925 > Haynes® R-41 alloy 32190 > Alloy B-2 31465 > Stellite® alloy 21 35960 > Stellite® alloy STAR J-Metal 37410 > Delcrome® alloy 90 32625 > > PCC-Advanced Forming > Technology 68% AlSiC™ > Metal Matrix Composite 36975 > AISI Type > Stainless Steel(PH 13-8 Mo) 32000 to 33350 > AISI Type O1, Oil-hardening > Tool Steel 31030 > > (Copyright 2000 BWI) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: YECH!! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 19 Mar 2000 15:42:47 GMT -------- It was alt.machines.cnc...Sorry, I was too busy wiping ordure from my boots to take much note. teenut "Mark W." wrote: > > Is there a NG that I don't get? I am familiar with alt.machines.cnc, but I > can't find rec.cnc > Mark > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> > wrote in message > <3v4A4.6849$ps1.165185@news1.rdc1.ga.home.com>... > >I strayed over to the Rec.CNC group in error. Felt like I needed a shower > when > >I left..talk about invective!! It was worse than a KKK Klaven! > > > >There may have been useful information to glean over there..but I would > feel > >permanently soiled if I had hung around to glean it! > > > >How NOT to conduct a NG. > > > >teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Phase II Toolpost mystery holes (and question for Fitch W). From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 20 Mar 2000 01:32:55 GMT -------- Always looking for products I can manufacture during "Down Time" on my CNC equipment: I have been thinking about producing a few batches of high quality tool holders to fit the Aloris/Dorian/Phase two type toolposts. (I need a bunch myself!!) Probably, mainly "regular" holders at $22.00 each, parting tool holders for $26.00 each and Boring tool holders for around $30.00. Material..Pre heat treated 4140, tolerances as good or better than originals. Black oxide ore temper straw finish. Comments?? teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Results of Auction in Fredricksburg, VA, 3/15 From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 21 Mar 2000 02:52:19 GMT -------- If the equipment has been weel looked after, most of those prices sound pretty reasonable..especially the little Dumore Drill Press. I am looking for one of those myself. teenut Kevin Pinkerton wrote: > > I went to the machine shop auction held in Fredricksburg, VA. It was a > small operation and the fellow was retiring as well as there seemed to > be lease problems as well. The shop was very clean and neat and the > machines were well kept and you could tell he cared about his stuff. > Nothing was given away there for sure. Here are some prices: > > Carbide insert sets (10) $1.50 package > Letter Drill bit set $27.50 > Fraction Drill bit set $25.00 > Various End mills $5 each > small drawer of various taps $47.50 > Durmore Precision Drill press w/cabinet $200. This was a very small > drill press, probably no more then 12" tall. > Cheap import metric tap/die set $17.50 (not worth $1 in my book) > Large B&S square $75 (probably 18" on the long side) > Tumico Precision level $125 > 24", 24" and 36" veneer calipers $30, $60, and $75 > 12" rotary table, missing large wheel $100 > Campbell Sever-all w/12" cut-off wheels $475 > New imported tube bender $95 > Sheldon GR-30-P Lathe, 15". New in early 1960s, well used, but still > had life left in it $1600 w/some tooling > Standard-Modern 17x54 Lathe (made in India) with tooling, $1650 > Powermatic Mdl 600 Band Saw and welder $2200 > 4"x6" import H/V bandsaw $150. This was amazing. This thing was well > used and could have been a HF for all I knew. > Matching set of Kurt vises, I think 6". Well used and probably many > years old $175 each > Bridgeport Mill, 2HP w/riser block and DRO. $2750. This mill was in > exc condition. Lots of swirling on the ways. This machine was used for > the fine work and was spared of the heavy cutting (as told to me by a > shop worker). > MSC vertical Mill, 2 axis CNC w/recorder. This was a large mill, > larger then the Bridgeport. $4500 > Sharp vertical Mill. This had a short table on it, but it was about > the same size as the bridgeport and in pretty good shape. $1750 > Entreprise L model Lathe w/accessories $1650 > Hardinge Second Operation Lathe $2800 Looked to be in good condition. > I don't know much about these lathes. > Delta Surface Grinder w/magnetic chuck. This was a 6x12 manual > grinder. It looked to be in nice condition and I am not sure how old > it was. It went for $775. > > It was a nice day out and the auction was done very smoothly and > professionally. There was a preprinted itemized list and the auction > went in numerical order. 272 items went in about 2.5 hours. > > Kevin ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Phase II Toolpost mystery holes (and question for Fitch W). From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 21 Mar 2000 03:08:03 GMT -------- I haven't actually measured them yet..but I took a couple of my AXA (Dorian) holders into the shop today. The dovetails looked suspiciously similar to the BXA that we use there..so I tried them.. Close! But no cigar! The BXA are just a few thou bigger..Enough so that the AXA holders WON"T go on. However, it may be that the BXAs will clamp up on an AXA post,,if it has sufficient movement. Interesting! I am curious why..given the two dovetail sizes are SO close together (By eye..the BXA is maybe twenty thou bigger!..why didn't they make them both the same? Too simple I suppose. teenut Hugh Strong wrote: > > Whoops, > > As Robert Bastow would say, I knew not that I knew not. I > thought I had an AXA post and was successfully using BXA > holders, but it now looks like everything I have is BXA. So > as they say in government circles, I can neither confirm nor > deny that the two standards have any degree of > interchangeability, whatsoever. > > "George Glines" wrote in message > news:DBAB4.64044$G91.528658@news1.rdc1.az.home.com... > > > > "Hugh Strong" wrote in message > > news:8b6gid$4eo$1@nntp9.atl.mindspring.net... > > > BXA holders work on an AXA post. > > > > > Hugh, > > > > Are you sure? > > > > Thanks, > > > > George > > > > > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Question - Chip Cleanup Techniques? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 21 Mar 2000 03:14:57 GMT -------- I won't allow the use of compressed air to clean machines in my shop! Blowing chips out of slots, drilled or tapped holes is a different matter. teenut Mike Graham wrote: > > On Mon, 20 Mar 2000 14:04:51 -0500, Josh Finkler wrote: > > >i recently acquired a very nice old clausing 8520 milling machine, and > >have begun some entry-level milling operations. i've gathered an array > >of texts on the subject, but unfortunately, none of them address the > >topic of cleanup, aside from giving a few pointers like "don't brush > >chips off of a turning endmill bit with your hand" and "use a paintbrush > >to clear the work area of chips", stuff like this. > > I recently asked a very similar question. > > I do work for a shop where every machine has two lines from the compressor > plumbed in, and air is used with joyful abandon to clean the machines all > the time. The problems include what you've already mentioned - the swarf > can get blown where you don't want it, and also the swarf still has to go > somewhere, and the 'somewhere' in this case is on the floor. You blow it > from here, and it goes somewhere else. Not a permanent solution for the > swarf in question. Also, the air is very noisey. > When I asked this I had a bunch of people mentioning shop vacs. I choose > not to use one, because it is almost as noisey as an air line, and it gets > in the way if you keep it with the mill, and I won't want to go and get it > if it's kept somewhere else. So, I asked around, and the first usable > suggestion was those sheet-metal T-slot cleaners. I decided to save the $2 > and make one out of a section of 1" copper tube. Works great. One end > clears the T-slots and the other end is flared out to remove the crap out of > the wells at the end of the tables in one scoop. This works. However, > there is an even *better* way, suggested by John Stevenson. I made a > sheet-metal pan about 2' square and 6" deep. The mill vise sits in the pan. > I used the plasma cutter to cut a long slot in the pan for clearance for the > studs holding the vise down, and the bar that I have mounted on the bottom > of the vise to index it to the table. Works great. The best part is that > not only does every chip get caught by the pan, but the coolant (I use a > flood coolant) can't escape, either. It stays in the pan, and drains into > the t-slot that the vise is bolted to via the slot that I cut in the pan. > So the coolant goes through, but the chips stay in the pan. It works > fabulously! Now, if I'm doing something that requires a large setup, then > the vise comes off and the pan isn't going to do me any good, but those > times are rare, and that's when the t-slot cleaner comes in. The best part > about the pan is that you don't have to worry about the coolant running off > the front lip of the vise base and 'filling your boots' as John put it. > > -- > -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- > Mike Graham | Metalworker by trade > mikegraham at sprint dot ca | Weld to live, like to weld. > Caledon, Ontario, Canada | Weird by nature > > remove reversed 'nospam' to reply > -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- > "By Fire and Iron doth he make Bread." ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Titanium uses & machining? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 21 Mar 2000 03:16:44 GMT -------- Yup!! Just hold a match to a tuft of steel wool! teenut william thomas powers wrote: > > >> Be real particular about handling titanium chips; they burn like magnesium or > >> worse. Plenty of shops have burned to the ground because titanium chips were > >> handled in a careless way. > > > > > >Excuse my ignorance; but recently there was a thread in > >alt.crafts.blacksmithing about forging titanium. I was under the > >impression that titanium gets pretty ornery when overheated, and the > >last thing you'd want to do with it is stick it into a hot fire... > >Can somebody clarify, please? > > > > Finally divided almost any metal will burn, in a lump many can be > forged *until* you reach the temperature where they burn. > > I'm the one who just forged a set of Ti tongs; no problem > However I've burned a *lot* of steel in the forge learning > to keep stuff below their ignition temperature! > > Flour can be explosive; but I bet you know folks who bung it in > an oven! I can't see the confusion myself; perhaps I should try > to forge some Mg....anyone know its ignition temp for a mass? > > Thomas ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Wandering Slitting Saw From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 21 Mar 2000 04:41:29 GMT -------- Way too deep a cut Kris..it would be a bit "iffy" even with a razor sharp new cutter..With a worn one..No chance. The reason the cut was "sway backed" was because the teeth are not eqyally sharp on both sides..it only started to head back in line when the side tension in the blade started to equal the side presure from the duller side..The alternative would have been for the cutter to deflect until it shattered. A band saw or even a table saw blade will do the same thing. I'll bet the slot is not vertical to the surface either!! 8^) Get a new or sharp cutter and take it in at leat two..even three bites. teenut "physical (Droll Troll)" wrote: > > Now, admittedly I'm not a great machinist, and the blade was dull, AND > I cut the whole depth in one bite, ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Need help with Roofe live center From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 21 Mar 2000 04:55:19 GMT -------- It is best if they are held in a fixed sleeve..better still if ground on their own bearings while held in the tailstock socket of the lathe they are to be used on. I used my tool post grinder to true up a couple of good quality..but somewhat "notched" running centers that came out of a school. First I stripped, cleaned and regreased them..bearings were fine. I puzzled for a while, about how to drive the center point in its own bearings..until I hit on the idea of using a smale "Cratex" rubber/abrasive wheel..mounted on a mandrel and held in the chuck of my Black and decker cordless screw driver. There was enough friction and about the right peripheral speed, to drive the point on its bearings, while I reground it to 60 Degrees with the Dumore grinder. I marked the angular position of the shanks in the tailstock before removing it. Now they go back in and run with zero detectable runout. teenut Dave Baker wrote: > > >Subject: Need help with Roofe live center > >From: Bill Browne bill@excalibur-dbf.com > >Date: 21/03/00 01:35 GMT Standard Time > >Message-id: <38D6D48B.DF56FB07@excalibur-dbf.com> > > > >I have a Roofe HD2-A live center that came with my SB9. The MT2 is not > >too banged up, and it turns smooth, but the center point has been > >mangled pretty good. I can remove the front with a pair of needlenose > >acting like a spanner wrench. The MT2 end doesn't have a tang, it has a > >set screw, but not big enough to be drawbar stuff. I took the set screw > >out and put a rod in, whacked it with a hammer to try to knock the > >center out, but no good. > > > >So if I haven't permenantly destroyed the thing yet, my questions: > > > >1. These guys still around? Could I get a replacement tip if I wanted > >to? > > > >2. What's the set screw covering up? Is it access to knocking the tip > >out? > > > >3. Should I waste my time? Were these junk? Seems like it was pretty > >well built to me, but I'm no expert. > > Can't answer most of your questions about the specific item - but - you can get > any running centre reground provided it is through hardened (which any decent > one should be) rather than case hardened. > > Your local tool & cutter grinding specialist will be able to hold it in a MT2 > sleeve and regrind it true to its axis for a measly sum. > > If it runs true and freely then don't bother taking it apart - you might damage > it - just get it reground. > > Dave Baker at Puma Race Engines (London - England) - specialist cylinder head > work, flow development and engine blueprinting. Web page at > http://members.aol.com/pumaracing/index.htm ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Wandering Slitting Saw From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2000 05:05:40 GMT -------- Me TOO!! I have to pay for them!! I think the cutting charts freely furnished to CNC Programmers by the Tool Suppliers are designed to keep them in (regular) business!! I have never changed my opinion..I doubt I ever will..You can teach a good Machinist all he needs to know about programming in a week or less. OTOH it takes five years to turn a Computer Jockey into a decent Machinist!! So often I smile at comments in these pages from new people, eager to get their first machine tool.."Which MUST be CNC ready" The tool may be "ready"..But they are kidding themselves if they think that technology will much substitute for the skills it takes to USE the machines properly. THEY are not going to be "CNC Ready" for quite a while. teenut Rich McCain wrote: > > My experience is that with a slitting saw that size, slow is better. I > have been running into this problem with the cnc guys where I work who > think just because it is a cnc they can run the piss out of something > and then say "huh" when it doesn't work or blows up. As a tool & die > maker, they don't like to listen to me when I tell them to slow it down. > Whatched many a good tool go in the dumpster because of cnc. > > * Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet's Discussion Network * > The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet - Free! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Stethoscopes&edgefinding From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2000 05:22:26 GMT -------- A favorite tricl of Millwrights was to clench the fist over the handle of a large screwdriver..or the head of a hammer..and press the back of the fist against the ear, while the other end touched the bearing housing of a machine. It was very easy to pinpoint a grumbling bearing or a dicky seal this way. I quit doing it after clenching the head of my 2 1/2 lb Ball Pein Hammer in one hand...and pressing the other against the spindle housing of a rapidly spinning 50 Taper mill. Of course, the end of the handle slipped in way of the drive dogs! I went clear over the next machine, saw stars for hours and had THE most "Entire Side of Face" Shiner for weeks. I decided "Machine Tool Fitter" was my calling, very shortly after that!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Chuck is Stuck, Shucks? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2000 05:38:59 GMT -------- Chucks..Especially Albrecht types ALWAYS turn contra the normal direction of rotation (of the drill bit) to tighten. If they didn't, the drill would drop out as soon as you started to drill a hole. Ergo..If your chuck is on a normal "Right Hand" rotation spindle..for regular right hand drills..try to envisage which way you would need to stop it rotating. That is the tightening direction. (Yes there ARE left hand chucks..for left hand drills!!) teenut "G. J. Kuebler" wrote: > > Go to the hardware store, Chuck, and see which way the chuck turns, then > apply judicious force with the vice-grips. > > GSStratton wrote in article > <20000321200110.01947.00007497@ng-dc1.aol.com>... > > My little, 0-1.5 mm, Albrecht drill chuck is stuck in the full open > position > > and before I take vise grips to it I want to know if anyone has a good > idea. I > > can't recall for sure which direction it turns to tighten. > > > > Gil Stratton > > G Stratton > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What Is The Best Way To Cut A Washing Machine In Half? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2000 05:40:59 GMT -------- Rent it to the next occupants..and ask them to take GOOD care of it!! teenut rbarch wrote: > > OK, this is the problem...I have a house that I rent out. The > tenants always leave old broken down washing machines and dryers in the > basement. The basement stairs are narrow and even with > help it is difficult to carry the machines out. Most of the time I > cannot even get someone to help me. > These machines are junk and are just going to be thrown away. I > want to cut or chop up these old machine to make it easier to remove. > The questions is what is the best way to do this??? What > would be the easiest way to cut up an old washing machine to get rid of > it? Any help or suggestions > would be greatly appreciated. Thank you, > Robert ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: cutting up a circular saw blade From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2000 05:51:10 GMT -------- Steel from a circular saw blade is WAY too thick for a scraper..as well as being entirely the wrong grade of steel. What the "Old Timers" were pointing you to was an old HAND saw..tenon or even panel saw. Remember the old "Silver Steel" Disstons etc? Make LOVELY scrapers. Score it along the line, both sides, deeply with a bit of old file. Bend it over an edge and it will snap cleanly. If you try to shear it, it will shatter and splinter. teenut Mark Kinsler wrote: > > It's really a woodworking question. I wanna make a wood scraper, which is > the best thing for removing old finishes and smoothing off surfaces before > applying a new finish. I like metalworking better, but I seem to be > condemned to do more woodwork than I'd like. > > My old man, who is a helluva good woodworker, tells me that about the best > thing to make a scraper out of is a saw blade. I don't know how critical > the variety of steel really is, but I did try steel from a rotary > lawnmower blade and it didn't work particularly well. Anyway, I bought a > cheap circular saw blade the other day so I could cut it up and make some > scrapers. A set of new ones is expensive: the Old Man sez they used to > cost about 25 cents each. > > So what I'm wondering is what the best way to cut this thing up, if any. > I used a reciprocating saw for the mower blade, but it's possible that > with the saw blade it might be a better idea to use a cutting torch, or > try to break it in a vise, or score it with a grinder and break it, or > what. > > M Kinsler > -- > ............................................................................ > 114 Columbia Ave. Athens, Ohio USA 45701 voice740.594.3737 fax740.592.3059 > Home of the "How Things Work" engineering program for adults and kids. > See http://www.frognet.net/~kinsler ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: cutting up a circular saw blade From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2000 12:53:38 GMT -------- Je suis d'accord..you can't beat the Sandvick scrapers for price nor performance. teenut Mike Graham wrote: > > On Wed, 22 Mar 2000 04:30:25 GMT, Mark Kinsler wrote: > > >It's really a woodworking question. I wanna make a wood scraper, which is > >the best thing for removing old finishes and smoothing off surfaces before > >applying a new finish. I like metalworking better, but I seem to be > >condemned to do more woodwork than I'd like. > > You can buy a set of scrapers for screw-all for money. Veritas (sold > through Lee Valley Tools) has the snazziest scraper holder known to mankind, > that really saves wear and tear on your thumb. Check them out. > > >My old man, who is a helluva good woodworker, tells me that about the best > >thing to make a scraper out of is a saw blade. I don't know how critical > >the variety of steel really is, but I did try steel from a rotary > > Wait a minute. Are we talking about a paint scraper, here? Scrapers > (hand scrapers) are really thin - like 1/16" thick or less. Cabinet > scrapers are about 3/32". Floor scrapers might hit 1/8", but I'd just make > one out of 1/8" O1. > > >I used a reciprocating saw for the mower blade, but it's possible that > >with the saw blade it might be a better idea to use a cutting torch, or > >try to break it in a vise, or score it with a grinder and break it, or > >what. > > If this is a carbide-tipped blade or bi-metal blade then it won't be worth > using. Only a plain blade is going to have decent metal in the body of the > blade, and only a pedestrian blade is going to have a consistent thickness > (the swanky ones are dished slightly to reduce friction). Waaaait a minute. > Are we talking about a regular handsaw blade? Either way, check out Lee > Valley Tools (they have a website... with manuals > online and all kinds of neat stuff. I suspect you'll find that you can pick > up excellent-quality Sandvik scrapers for not much money, and as I said the > scraper holder is fabulous. > > -- > -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- > Mike Graham | Metalworker by trade > mikegraham at sprint dot ca | Weld to live, like to weld. > Caledon, Ontario, Canada | Weird by nature > > remove reversed 'nospam' to reply > -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- > "By Fire and Iron doth he make Bread." ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: cutting up a circular saw blade From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2000 12:57:27 GMT -------- The problem with friction (or Plasma) cutting..is that the heat affected zone in thin, high carbon steel would be WAY too wide to be acceptable. teenut Dave Carnell wrote: > > For cutting any kind of steel up to ½" thick the quickest, easiest way is > friction cutting with your table saw. Sacrifice a fine-tooth plywood cutting > saw to the job. It will last forever; mine has been in use for >30 yr. and just > has dull teeth. Suit up with a face mask and long sleeves. Push the work into > the blade as hard as you can. Friction melts the metal and molten pieces fly > around. A flash burr is left on the cut piece. Melting point is the only > factor, so files, stainless, etc. all cut the same. Use only on iron and > steel. Clean the sawdust from under your saw before you start to avoid fires. > > Mark Kinsler wrote: > > > It's really a woodworking question. I wanna make a wood scraper, which is > > the best thing for removing old finishes and smoothing off surfaces before > > applying a new finish. I like metalworking better, but I seem to be > > condemned to do more woodwork than I'd like. > > > > My old man, who is a helluva good woodworker, tells me that about the best > > thing to make a scraper out of is a saw blade. I don't know how critical > > the variety of steel really is, but I did try steel from a rotary > > lawnmower blade and it didn't work particularly well. Anyway, I bought a > > cheap circular saw blade the other day so I could cut it up and make some > > scrapers. A set of new ones is expensive: the Old Man sez they used to > > cost about 25 cents each. > > > > So what I'm wondering is what the best way to cut this thing up, if any. > > I used a reciprocating saw for the mower blade, but it's possible that > > with the saw blade it might be a better idea to use a cutting torch, or > > try to break it in a vise, or score it with a grinder and break it, or > > what. > > > > M Kinsler > > -- > > ............................................................................ > > 114 Columbia Ave. Athens, Ohio USA 45701 voice740.594.3737 fax740.592.3059 > > Home of the "How Things Work" engineering program for adults and kids. > > See http://www.frognet.net/~kinsler ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: EMCO maximat S 11 on ebay? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2000 13:31:07 GMT -------- http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=285745327 If this goes for under $5500..Someone was ROBBED! I have A Maximat Super II..and I am a SORELY tempted to put the new one away "For Stock"!! appsman wrote: > > I've been watching. What DID you pay for a new one? I have a > mill and would like the lathe, but for over $3k it seems there > are lots of better (cheaper?) options, even if I pay top dollor Name One? 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: cnc vise recommendations? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 22 Mar 2000 13:35:29 GMT -------- Take a look at the Gerardi..$645.00 each from Traver's. I just bought two for my new FADAL. Try one and the Kurt will never seem the same again! teenut RWR wrote: > > I've gotten the OK to buy a new cnc vise at work. Any recommendations? > -- > Randy Replogle (Central Indiana) > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: cutting up a circular saw blade From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 03:08:49 GMT -------- Not that I recall... But I've done a LOT in this Incarnation. Next time I want to come back as one of my tools! (or Employees!!) ;^) teenut Marshall Pharoah wrote: > Exactly what I was taught as well, teenut. > > So, were you a cabinet maker in a previous incarnation? > > Marshall ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What's going on!! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 23 Mar 2000 03:26:30 GMT -------- Naw Cass, Yawn!! It wasn't cancelled..just ignored! I guess most people have no idea what you are babbling on about. Is your whole life spent in such an angry haze? Perhaps it's just time for a lttle nap. Eh? Perhaps one of your tablets. teenut Cass wrote: > > -- > x-no-archive: yes > > Speaking of what folks will accept, I would wager that everyone > reading this message and who shop at Sam's Wholesale Club, obediently > show their receipt to the person at the exit. CompUsa also does this. > I absolutely refuse to do it. Yes, it is a small thing but freedoms > are encroached upon on the edges at first. > > One time, at Sam's, I refused to show the girl my receipt and I > merrily went on my way. She called the guard who was on off-duty > policemen in full police uniform and he ran out to my car and jerked > the door open and demanded my receipt and naturally, I showed it to > him but pointed out that he was in error of detaining me since he had > NO REASON to suspect me of theft. He said it was store policy and > that I should find somewhere else to shop. I told him it was my > POLICY not to show my receipt at the door. My wife tried to shut me > up however, I was through and had made my point. > I called the mgr. at Sam's and told them what happened and he > apologized. Think they will stop me again? Yes, they will and why > they will is that they STOP YOU and get away with it! > > Cass > > I sent this again as it seems the first one got cancelled. It won't > get cancelled this time. > > -- > x-no-archive: yes > > "John Flanagan" wrote in message > news:38d8e738.73553734@news.usit.net... > > On Wed, 22 Mar 2000 14:28:14 GMT, Jack Fisher > > wrote: > > > > >I'm kind of curious about something, I read a lot of posts about > people > > >receiving "new" products in less than ideal condition, and > accepting > > >this as "ok". Why would this be ok but you would never accept a new > car > > > > I don't tolerate this. When I buy a tool I don't buy it as a "kit" > > that is going to require additional work. Even if it is inexpensive > I > > still expect it to be usable. I just bought a small angle iron from > > Enco. The first one was badly stained/corroded on the ground > finish, > > sent it back. Replacement was dinged with raised surfaces on the > > ground finish and wasn't square to the specs listed in the catalog, > > that one's going back too. But I believe this won't make much > > difference to them since there is enough people who accept this > stuff > > so they are still making money. > > > > I must say I have never had an order from Enco that wasn't screwed > up > > in some way and required an item to be sent back. Some screwups > were > > MAJOR too. > > > > John > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What's going on!! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 24 Mar 2000 02:04:14 GMT -------- PLONK Cass wrote: > > Robert, > > I'm, sorry but you are mistaken, it was cancelled. > I hope you aren't going to start up again as I thought you had learned > your lesson from last time. It is your call, however. > > Cass > > -- > x-no-archive: yes > > "Robert Bastow" <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote in message > news:G9gC4.7413$ps1.175587@news1.rdc1.ga.home.com... > > Naw Cass, Yawn!! > > > > It wasn't cancelled..just ignored! > > > > I guess most people have no idea what you are babbling on about. Is > your whole > > life spent in such an angry haze? > > > > Perhaps it's just time for a lttle nap. Eh? Perhaps one of your > tablets. > > > > teenut > > > > Cass wrote: > > > > > > -- > > > x-no-archive: yes > > > > > > Speaking of what folks will accept, I would wager that everyone > > > reading this message and who shop at Sam's Wholesale Club, > obediently > > > show their receipt to the person at the exit. CompUsa also does > this. > > > I absolutely refuse to do it. Yes, it is a small thing but > freedoms > > > are encroached upon on the edges at first. > > > > > > One time, at Sam's, I refused to show the girl my receipt and I > > > merrily went on my way. She called the guard who was on off-duty > > > policemen in full police uniform and he ran out to my car and > jerked > > > the door open and demanded my receipt and naturally, I showed it > to > > > him but pointed out that he was in error of detaining me since he > had > > > NO REASON to suspect me of theft. He said it was store policy and > > > that I should find somewhere else to shop. I told him it was my > > > POLICY not to show my receipt at the door. My wife tried to shut > me > > > up however, I was through and had made my point. > > > I called the mgr. at Sam's and told them what happened and he > > > apologized. Think they will stop me again? Yes, they will and > why > > > they will is that they STOP YOU and get away with it! > > > > > > Cass > > > > > > I sent this again as it seems the first one got cancelled. It > won't > > > get cancelled this time. > > > > > > -- > > > x-no-archive: yes > > > > > > "John Flanagan" wrote in message > > > news:38d8e738.73553734@news.usit.net... > > > > On Wed, 22 Mar 2000 14:28:14 GMT, Jack Fisher > > > > > wrote: > > > > > > > > >I'm kind of curious about something, I read a lot of posts > about > > > people > > > > >receiving "new" products in less than ideal condition, and > > > accepting > > > > >this as "ok". Why would this be ok but you would never accept a > new > > > car > > > > > > > > I don't tolerate this. When I buy a tool I don't buy it as a > "kit" > > > > that is going to require additional work. Even if it is > inexpensive > > > I > > > > still expect it to be usable. I just bought a small angle iron > from > > > > Enco. The first one was badly stained/corroded on the ground > > > finish, > > > > sent it back. Replacement was dinged with raised surfaces on > the > > > > ground finish and wasn't square to the specs listed in the > catalog, > > > > that one's going back too. But I believe this won't make much > > > > difference to them since there is enough people who accept this > > > stuff > > > > so they are still making money. > > > > > > > > I must say I have never had an order from Enco that wasn't > screwed > > > up > > > > in some way and required an item to be sent back. Some screwups > > > were > > > > MAJOR too. > > > > > > > > John > > > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Tom Senior mill-any good? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 24 Mar 2000 13:20:54 GMT -------- Tom Senior made excellent small milling machines. Take a look at: http://www.lathes.co.uk/senior/index.html teenut Kevin Duckworth wrote: > > I'm considering a Tom Senior mill. It has a 30x5" table and described as > excellent condition, although I haven't seen it. > > Any thoughts as to whether this is worth considering for a home shop > machinist who is now determined to buy good quality equipment first off? > > Thanks > > Kevin ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What's going on!! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 25 Mar 2000 00:55:50 GMT -------- Aw Shit! Cass is having one of his "Episodes" again! teenut Cass wrote: > > Jim, > > A fuse is not the only department you are lacking in. > > You know, in this life there are 'constructors' and 'destructors'. > The 'constructors' are the folks who try to make things better, who > help others and like to learn things themselves for various reasons. > Almost always, these folks have a much better quality of life in all > ways. > > 'Destructors', on the other hand, are folks who, for whatever sick > reason, like to tear down and destroy and generally wreak havoc and > their lifestyle and everything about them shows what they are. > > Why not think about how you can make things better for other folks, > Jim? I think you would be a lot happier. > > You also can choose whether you have a short fuse or not. No one else > can have that control over you unless you hand it to them. > > Cass > > -- > x-no-archive: yes > > wrote in message > news:8bgli4$jae$1@nnrp1.deja.com... > > In article <8bgh9n$d4t$0@dosa.alt.net>, > > "Cass" wrote: > > > > > When will you ever grow up? > > > > When they nail the lid on the box. > > > > > I sit here and read all sorts of > > > off-topic threads > > > > That's one of the nice things about rcm. The truly off topic > > bullshit is kept to a bare minimum. Even the OT stuff is > > on topic mostly. I like that. If you get your shorts in > > a knot with somebody then go ahead and yak it up. AFter that > > group purchase thing I have a short fuse. > > > > May I suggest you attempt to contribute here in some sort of > > meaningful way. You will find the responses more hospitable. > > Ease into it, maybe try out one of the gun threads. > > > > Jim > > > > > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What's going on!! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 25 Mar 2000 22:00:30 GMT -------- How original of you Cass! Tell me; did you go to College, full time, to learn how to be an Insufferable Prick..or is it a God-given, natural talent? Now please fuck off! teenut Cass wrote: > > Well, when referring to Sweet Old Bob, I could just use the initials > S.O.B. > > Cass > > -- > x-no-archive: yes > > "Gary Coffman" wrote in message > news:q2hpds48i32u0db425o3uvfissjsvsdva4@4ax.com... > > On Fri, 24 Mar 2000 20:41:25 -0600, "Cass" > wrote: > > >Robert, > > > > > >Would you mind if I refer to you as Sweet Old Bob? > > > > > >Cass > > > > Don't call him Bob. You don't want to meet Bob. > > (Must be a Jekyll and Hyde thing). > > > > Gary > > Gary Coffman KE4ZV | You make it |mail to ke4zv@bellsouth.net > > 534 Shannon Way | We break it | > > Lawrenceville, GA | Guaranteed | ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: cutting up a circular saw blade From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 26 Mar 2000 03:56:33 GMT -------- All I know about friction cutting I have already expounded in the past. What I do know, is that a regular, fine tooth, carbon or HSS metal cutting bandsaw blade, run at wood cutting velocities will do an amazing number on ferrous metals up to 3/16" thick. teenut "James R. Johnson" wrote: > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> > wrote in message ... > >The problem with friction (or Plasma) cutting..is that the heat affected > zone in > >thin, high carbon steel would be WAY too wide to be acceptable. > > > >teenut > > > > Years ago I saw a photo in Pop. Sci. or some such that showed a band saw > cutting out a connecting rod for the engine in a ship. This thing was about > 6" thick and the blade was only about 1/2" wide. It looked as if it was > cutting wood. IIRC the surface speed of the blade was something like 10 or > 12,000 ft/min. AND the blade was just mild steel. Maybe teenut would treat > the group to a treatsie on friction cutting with a band saw. Huh? teenut? > Purty please? > > James R. Johnson Shadetree Engineering > Home page www.ktc.com/~streeeng .................................... ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What's going on!! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 26 Mar 2000 03:59:11 GMT -------- The sheer slimeyness of this individual takes my breath away. teenut Cass wrote: > > Kurt, > > You are so right. Mostly, from what I have seen, there are some very > good, knowledgeable and helpful folks in this group. There are just a > few, blackguards who try and impress each other and make it difficult > for the rest. It is the same all over. Those that cause the most > trouble always think it is someone else' fault - never theirs. > They ruin the goodwill generally found here and unfortunately, not > everyone will speak up and against their tactics. > > Every time I have asked for help, I have been pleasantly surprised at > all of the responses and they have helped me greatly. I am just > starting out and trying to learn machining so, I will be asking for > help often. > > Cass > > -- > x-no-archive: yes > > "Kurt Bjorn" wrote in message > news:4DbD4.14059$624.1320301@news.flash.net... > > Amazing... after a 3 moth hiatus from RCM, being tired of the > screaming > > drivel, tantrums, and name calling, I return hoping for the best and > being > > confronted with this thread. Owie. > > > > I have vague memories of a small, friendly group who liked to talk > metalwork > > instead of using expletives. > > > > :=( > > > > -- > > Kurt Bjorn > > http://www.flash.net/~pyroware > > > > > > > > > > Jeff Pack wrote in message > > news:uoyPpXjl$GA.215@cpmsnbbsa05... > > > > > > Cass wrote in message > > > news:8bhc1t$31b$0@dosa.alt.net... > > > > Larry, > > > > > > > > I notice that you can't seem to shut-up either. > > > > However, you are suggesting that I should be quiet because you > say so? > > > > C'mon, kid, get a life. > > > > > > > > Cass > > > > > > > > > > > > I am not going away so either filter me or live with it > > > > > > > > > I think I'll vote filter. goodbye... > > > > > > > > > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Chatter, while Milling slots in Aluminum... From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2000 05:33:30 GMT -------- Sounds like an excess of play in the spindle bearings, particularly end play. Check radial and end play with a DTI Jeff..shouldn't be much more than a few tenths. What machine are you using? Whact bearing arrangement does it have? What sort of cutter holder? More detail = More help. 8^) teenut Jeff Pack wrote: > > Using a 5/8 cutter (2 flute), I'm milling a 5/8 slot, .250 deep (done in 3 > passes 100/100/40/10/10). > Whenever I reach the edge of th eslot, the endmill starts chattering, and > buggers the > end of the slot. I could probably run the mill faster, as I beleive I was > using 200 SFM, > but other than the ends of the slot, the surface finish is good. > > Also though, I'm noticing chatter on the sides of the slot as well. > > Any suggestions? I even tried plunge cutting 10thou off the edge for a > finish > cut, and still chattered. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: cutting up a circular saw blade From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 27 Mar 2000 05:36:28 GMT -------- True..that is a very narrow HAZ, less than I imagined. But still more than I would want to grind off if I had an alternative cutting method. teenut Ted Edwards wrote: > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> > wrote in message ... > > > >The problem with friction (or Plasma) cutting..is that the heat affected > > zone in > > >thin, high carbon steel would be WAY too wide to be acceptable. > > > >teenut > > Not so. I just cut a piece off an old circular saw blade with my plasma > cutter (TD PakMaster 50) after first cleaning/polishing up the blade so > I could examine the oxide colors. 1/16" from the cut, there is not the > faintest trace of even yellow. Blue is about half that distance. So if > one is willing to grind off 1/32 to 1/16" from the cut edge, the steel > should be as good as new. > > Ted ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Chatter, while Milling slots in Aluminum... From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 28 Mar 2000 17:55:09 GMT -------- A technique I use, to clean up the end of a slot when using a less-than-perfectly-rigid machine or set up..Is to SLOW the cutter down! Even to the point of switching off the spindle as I approach the last thou or so of cut..and then withdrawing the cutter just before it coasts to a final halt. teenut Jeff Pack wrote: > > <4> is what I did at the end, that seems to work well. > Leaves that damned plunge mark though... :( ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Can You Build This for me? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 01:39:41 GMT -------- Well put Lou!! I seem to have got into the business of sorting "Draftsmans Dreams" from "Machinist's Nightmares" After a ten year hiatus I come back to find the stupidest "Engineers" going hog wild with AutoCad..and wondering why I send the drawings back with a "Yer Dreamin'" comment. What happened to all the Designers in this Country?? teenut Lou Boyd wrote: > > mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > > > In article <20000328112103.02496.00005232@ng-ce1.aol.com>, > > dgoncz@aol.com ( Doug Goncz ) wrote: > > > > > the usual way is to hire a drafter for a low price to draw what's > > > required, > > > > Geez, Doug. This is really unfair. You're asking him to produce > > a print, with dimensions and tolerances on it. Too much! > > I'm not a professional machinist or draftsman, but I do some of both. I > frequently have work done in machine shops. A few things I have > learned. > > 1. A quote will generally get you a part which matches the drawing you > provide. If your drawing has no tolerances given, the precision will be > a function of the number of 0's you place after the decimal point. The > number of zero's in the price goes up at about the same rate as the > number of zero's on the drawing. If your drawing is wrong, the part > will be wrong. Fixing mistakes alwasy costs more than doing it right > the first time. > > 2. If you just specify a .499 shaft which is to fit in a .500 hole, you > can be assured you will either end up with a loose or press fit as both > meet standard tolerances. If you specify a .4990 shaft in a .5000 hole, > it will cost considerably more than necessary. > > 3. If it's obvious to you that two parts should go together, like the > ring screw of your lens cell and the cell itself, they won't if they > aren't accurately dimensioned and toleranced. You may get one machinist > who fits them , but the parts might be made by different people. > > 4. Without a good drawing an XX dollar per hour quote is meaningless. > A very tiny design change can cause setup time to vary by several > times. I find it helpful to discuss designs with the shop supervisor > before firming them up. Sometimes items can be made more easily from > multiple pieces than from a single block or vice versa. Complex curved > surfaces can really run up the price. > > 5. Single machined items are very expensive. Material has to be > gathered and the machines set up for each operation. You an often get > ten objects made for only twice the price of one. Depending of the kind > of work a 100 may only be twice that. > > 6. You have a choice of quality, low price, and quick delivery. With > good drawings you still only get to pick two. Without good drawings you > will get only one, or more likely none. > > 7. Having a "low priced" drafstman do your drawings may be worse than > having the machinist do it from pencil sketches. A draftsman is > generally not an engineer. They can make beautiful but useless drawings > if they don't understand the concepts of how the object you need is > supposed to function. For example on a brass lens cell is the draftsman > aware of the differential temperature coefficients of the glass you're > using and the brass, and over what temperature range it's to be used? > You could get a beautiful sliding fit job done but the glass may crack > in cold weather or be loose in hot weather. Two dimensional CAD > programs are inexpnsive and completly adequate for simple parts. You > may be much better off doing the drawings yourself. > -- > > Lou Boyd ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Can You Build This for me? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 08:28:32 GMT -------- In my training days, we weren't allowed NEAR a drawing board until we had spent at least four years on the shop floor. teenut DAFkite wrote: > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote in > : > > >Well put Lou!! > > > >I seem to have got into the business of sorting "Draftsmans > >Dreams" from "Machinist's Nightmares" > > > >After a ten year hiatus I come back to find the stupidest > >"Engineers" going hog wild with AutoCad..and wondering why I send > >the drawings back with a "Yer Dreamin'" comment. > > > >What happened to all the Designers in this Country?? > > they're all out designing web graphics with Frontpage.... > > but seriously, what I've seen around here is that engineers get > trained the old way, via apprenticeship, whereas 'designers' now get > trained at a university and never even see a mill..... > to my mind, the designer should do the engineering thing (ie, > actually building thing) for a good few years before picking up a > mouse..... ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Can You Build This for me? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 29 Mar 2000 15:58:02 GMT -------- A Jobbing Machine Shop has to machine, usually, one-off or two-off parts from a whole variety of different sources..And from drawings that range from sketches on envelopes to the latest in 3D Cad. These drawings come from a variety of different People..Of different competence and experience levels..Most of whom, nowadays, have no real idea about how the parts they draw are to be manufactured. The specifying of fits or tolerances is beyond most of their ken! When I get a drawing with two, obviously mating parts, I invariably have to go back to the designer to ask EXACTLY what type of fit he wants..It invariably comes down to a discusion at the "Slip, Sliding, push, running, shrink, press, piss-fit" level...H3 H7 etc mean NOTHING to these people..or to my Machinists...Unless they look it up (Time) and read it right first time (ERRORS) What I much prefer to do, is give the machinist a drawing on which the dead sizes are spec'ed..eg..6.4300" - 6.4304"..far fewer sources of error and misunderstanding...remember these guys are top machinists..but they ain't paid to be design engineers! Unfortunately it seems, increasingly, that a Shop lives or dies on the accuracy of its "second guesses" teenut Mike Graham wrote: > > On Wed, 29 Mar 2000 14:42:58 +0000, Lou Boyd wrote: > > >If I just specify a dimension to three decimal places, say .499 , does > >that not in itself indicate that the allowable range is .4985 to .4995 > >if nothing else is given? Specifying .499 +/- .0005 should be exactly > >the same, right? Or am I very confused as to standard machine shop > >practice? > > You're assuming bilateral tolerances. If you *specify* tolerances then > the tolerances are what you specify. If you say "1.000 +.002" then the > allowable range of sizes is between 1.000 and 1.002; anything smaller than > 1.000 or larger than 1.002 is unacceptable, but anything in that range is > okay. This gives them 2 thou of tolerance, and is equivalent to specifying > 1.001 +/- .001", but it makes a helluvalot more sense to the guy looking at > the drawing, because seeing a hole that is 1.000 +.002 and a shaft 1.000 > -.002 makes sense and matches up easily in your brain. Seeing 1.001+/- > .001" and .999 +/- .001" doesn't match up as easily, if you get what I mean. > Using bilateral tolerances requires giving the middle of the allowable > range, unless you specify asymetric bilateral tolerances, such as 1.000" > +.001/-.002, whereas unilateral tolerances specify one 'edge' of the range, > and then the size of the range. For fits, unilateral tolerances are much > more sensible. > > >If I want a gap between two pieces to be .001 +/-.0002 I could > >specicify the diameters as 4.000 +/- .0001 and 3.990 +/-.0001 to insure > >a fit I want. But since I don't care about either diameter closer than > >.001, just the fit, I was hoping there was a way to specify the fit > >only. > > 4" diameter, and you want a 1 thou fit, so that's about RC 1, which is a > clearance between .0005 and .0015, giving your hoped-for .001 right in the > middle of the range. ANSI fits are all done in ranges. An ANSI fit won't > be done for exactly 'n' thou, rather it's done on a range of 'n' to 'n+m' > thou, so if you really really really want a sliding fit of exactly one thou > +/- a tenth, then you specify the shaft and hole as each being 4.000 +/- > .001" and put a note specifying a sliding fit of .001" +/- .0001". > > >correct when the two parts are eventually assembled. I'll look at the > >RC and FN numbers in the handbook and see if they do the job. Thanks. > > I don't think you'll find one that *exactly* matches what you want, but > you may well find one that is close enough to do the job, and a heck of a > lot cheaper. > > >Another question. At what temperature are machined parts expected to > >meet their dimensions if none are on the print? If I specify 4.000" on > >an aluminum part it probably won't meet spec from 0 to 100 F. Most shop > >measuring devices are made of steel and aluminum doesn't track with > >temperature. > > Good question. Prints are expected to represent parts at room > temperature. If you're making a die that will be used at extreme heat, you > intentionally design it small, and take the expansion from heat into > consideration while designing it. So the die might have a .995" bore when > you machine it, yet it makes 1.000" parts in use. If the prints try to > specify otherwise, you'll have a helluvalotta explaining to do, and probably > have to pay the shop to design your part. Like, if you say "these sizes are > representative of the dimensions at 300 degrees farenheit" the shop likely > won't touch the job with a stick unless the tolerances are really large. > > -- > -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- > Mike Graham | Metalworker by trade > mikegraham at sprint dot ca | Weld to live, like to weld. > Caledon, Ontario, Canada | Weird by nature > > remove reversed 'nospam' to reply > -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- > "By Fire and Iron doth he make Bread." ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: PRO Gun Fingerprinting From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 00:43:25 GMT -------- Not the right forum..but who can disagree! teenut "Jeepers!" wrote: the undeniable truth ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Can You Build This for me? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 01:01:06 GMT -------- Erich Coiner wrote: > > What is inappropriate is trying to take the hay bailer down to the local > CNC machine shop and saying the same thing. They ain't set up to handle > that kind of work. > > Erich Yes they are Erich..but if you have to ask how much it costs to "take time out" of that environment to figure out what you need...You probably can't afford it!! Right now I have right at $600,000.00 in hard cash investment and a payroll running $25000.00 plus fixed overheads of about $8,000.00 I would love to take the time out to design your part for you..I can do it! ..No problem. But I have to be compensated adequately for the risk *I* take!! If what I recommend doesn't fit, or work...you will be totally pissed and won't pay the bill. Probably bad-mouth me around the trade too! I will make "A" to your spec for $X.00..If I have to spec out "A" and guarantee it will work, I am going to charge at least $2X.00. If you don't like that....Find another Pidgeon!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Thoughts/Values of Atlas 10x24 Lathe From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 01:10:33 GMT -------- It certainly does..and works just dandy with them. Flat ways have several advantages for the HSM: Better for milling..far less chatter, increased bearing surface to resist thrust. (when was the last lime you saw a milling machine with Vee ways?) Nice handy set up surface or surface plate for layouts. Simple to make special attachments for. Easy to recondition..I have filed and scraped a Myford back into wack before today! Don't knock the Atlas..It is a good, sound and honest machine tool! teenut Gary Hallenbeck wrote: > > Does the much touted, and highly regarded Myford not have flat ways as well? > > Larry Phillips wrote in message > news:38E15018.694D4D78@home.com... > > Josh Finkler wrote: > > > > > i've heard discouraging things about these lathes suffering real > > > problems with the ways, especially in front, causing the whole thing > > > to shimmy during traverse, but i figured it's at least worth > > > looking at. any other tips on things to watch out for with these > > > lathes? > > > > I spoke with a fellow today who seems to know whereof he speaks, and it > > is his opinion that the Atlas, in ANY size, was a poorly designed and > > poorly made machine that didn't last very long, and they haven't made > > them in about 30 years. He said that 'free' was too high a price to pay > > for one, and that "It's an unhappy machine, and will make you unhappy". > > > > > > -- > > Hukt on fonix werkt fer me! > > > > http://cr347197-a.surrey1.bc.wave.home.com/larry/ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: The Ultimate Milling Machine ? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 01:22:50 GMT -------- It has already happened Bob..Lie down, you're dead!! teenut Bob Edwards wrote: > Nah -- the ultimate milling machine will be a bin full of nano-technology > robots that allows you to drop the stock in the bin and take the finished > part back out after a little while. When that happens we're both out of > business ;-) > > Bob > > > > -- > > Jack in Sonoma, CA, USA (jack@vom.com) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Gun control From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 01:28:34 GMT -------- Yes. But about 80% of the readers of this list could figure out how to circumvent it with a length of knicker elastic and a paper clip in no-time flat! They are dreaming if they think they can disarm determined people with technology! teenut Doug Goncz wrote: > > Would it be practical for a pistol to be unfireable unless someone's driver's > license or ID were inserted? I doubt mag stripes would work. Notched edges > could be faked. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Gun control From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 01:34:20 GMT -------- You are SO right Gary! Perhaps a nice warm sand pile to shove your head into.... If "This Stuff" isn't discussed..Kiss goodbye to discussions of anything else you hold dear! Respectfully teenut Gary Hallenbeck wrote: > > Could we not waste bandwidth on this discussion. It is obvious from past > threads that it becomes a heated debate which degenerates into personal > attacks and a lot of wasted space. > Gary H. > > Doug Goncz wrote in message > news:20000329115608.02489.00005099@ng-ca1.aol.com... > > Would it be practical for a pistol to be unfireable unless someone's > driver's > > license or ID were inserted? I doubt mag stripes would work. Notched edges > > could be faked. > > > > Also, can the blowback on a pistol be used to send a high power, low > energy, > > short signal for detection at multiple cell phone sites by multiple time > of > > arrival, locating the time and place the pistol was fired? Acoustic > monitoring > > of gun shots has already been done but doesn't identify the gun. A short > cell > > signal could identify the gun. Once again, subject to tampering. > > > > Any other way out there ideas that might help, or, hmm, could it just be > > personal responsibilty? > > > > Could a camera in a pistol take a picture of the shooter for each aimed > shot? > > There's really no other way to aim the thing. Sure, you wouldn't have a > picture > > of the shooter if it was off hand, but unless it was point blank, the shot > > would probably miss. A camera pointing back from the pistol along the line > of > > sight to the shooter's eye. And an IR flash to illuminate the shooter's > face. > > (IR provided by gunpowder?) A camera at each end? > > > > Just rambling... > > > > > > Yours, > > > > Doug Goncz > > Experimental Machinist > > Replikon Research > > Seven Corners, VA 22044-0394 > > > > What I'm into: > > http://www.deja.com/profile.xp?author=dgoncz@aol.com* > > Home Page (1999-11-24): > > http://members.aol.com/DGoncz ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Gun control From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 01:36:16 GMT -------- Dream on Doug..The world needs people like you..To PROTECT!! teenut Doug Goncz wrote: > > Could the federal government use its vast resources to flood the market with > any one of the many suggested safety guns? The leverage into market has been > well explored by computer software marketing. Once flooded, the cheap repair > parts and interchangeable parts would sustain an enforced compliance with what > I'd hope to hell would be a properly thought out design, but wouldn't be in > this world. It's always fascinated me that the invention of interchangeable > parts never led to a saturated market and a Volksrifle... > > Yours, > > Doug Goncz > Experimental Machinist > Replikon Research > Seven Corners, VA 22044-0394 > > What I'm into: > http://www.deja.com/profile.xp?author=dgoncz@aol.com* > Home Page (1999-11-24): > http://members.aol.com/DGoncz ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: turning hard materials From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 01:46:47 GMT -------- Use air hardening tool steel...A2 or similar. Wrap in stainless foil to harden..air cool to 300-400 degrees and wack it straight with a lead hammer on a wooden block. Temper at 400 degrees for 2 hours in the wife's oven and air cool again. Stone to finish and cut flutes (musical) to your heart's content..It should last a couple of generations! 8^) teenut Sean Thomas O'Malley wrote: > > What is the hardest form of steel that I can effectively turn > on a South Bend 10L? Available cutters are either home-ground > HSS 1/2 inch bits or a set of import indexable carbide cutters > (slightly less than 1/2" shank), held in a Phase II QC post.. > > The reason? > > I make wooden flutes (the musical kind, not the cutting > kind :), and I'm looking for a way to produce a longer lasting > tapered reamer. I'm going to try hardening one of my existing > drill rod reamers, but engineer friends have warned me that I'll get > unacceptable distortion by doing that. So I'm wondering about > starting with something that's usably hard from the get-go. > > FWIW, these reamers are around 12" long, tapering from 3/4 inch down > to about 1/2 inch with a single cutting flute running the length of the > tool. You can see pictures of one being milled at > http://www.cns.ohiou.edu/~somalley/reamer. > > Any other approaches I haven't thought of would be appreciated, > too. The taper is a complex one (IE not linear or parabolic or > anything like that), so I assume that it'd be bloody expensive > to try contracting this out. > > Thanks, > > --sean ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: And You Thought Import Lathes Were Overpriced! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 01:50:27 GMT -------- You have got to be Sh*****g me! I am in the wrong business! teenut Paul Jones wrote: > > Check out this 6" x 18" Atlas lathe that closed today on ebay. > http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=287723171 > ...........Paul > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Can You Build This for me? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 01:55:49 GMT -------- Wassamarrer Cass? No-body paying attention to you? 8^) teenut Cass wrote: > > yeah, yeah, yeah! > > Is anyone else sick of all of this bragging? > > -- > x-no-archive: yes > > "Robert Bastow" <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote in message > news:mHxE4.8686$ps1.187656@news1.rdc1.ga.home.com... > > > > > > Erich Coiner wrote: > > > > > > > > What is inappropriate is trying to take the hay bailer down to the > local > > > CNC machine shop and saying the same thing. They ain't set up to > handle > > > that kind of work. > > > > > > Erich > > > > Yes they are Erich..but if you have to ask how much it costs to > "take time out" > > of that environment to figure out what you need...You probably can't > afford it!! > > > > Right now I have right at $600,000.00 in hard cash investment and a > payroll > > running $25000.00 plus fixed overheads of about $8,000.00 I would > love to take > > the time out to design your part for you..I can do it! ..No problem. > But I have > > to be compensated adequately for the risk *I* take!! If what I > recommend > > doesn't fit, or work...you will be totally pissed and won't pay the > bill. > > Probably bad-mouth me around the trade too! > > > > I will make "A" to your spec for $X.00..If I have to spec out "A" > and guarantee > > it will work, I am going to charge at least $2X.00. If you don't > like > > that....Find another Pidgeon!! > > > > teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: The Ultimate Milling Machine ? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 01:59:13 GMT -------- And you are only half-joking!! teenut Lou Boyd wrote: > > I'm looking for the ion beam machine which simply lays down the metals > and crystal structure that you want in a vacuum chamber. It can do > precision internal voids, gradient alloys, gradient hardness, and even > apply coatings, inside and out. Any shape you want. You feed it scrap > alloy contain the appropriate atoms. Old tin cans will do for most > projects. It will be available in 15 years, 16 years for the Grizzly > import. > > -- > Lou Boyd > Fairborn Observatory > > -----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =----- > http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! > -----== Over 80,000 Newsgroups - 16 Different Servers! =----- ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Can You Build This for me? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 03:22:25 GMT -------- Cass, you never cease to amaze and amuse me! Never, In the field of human experience, has so little, caused so much wedging of shorts..... or been so easy! Hang around Cass..you are fun to play with! teenut Cass wrote: > > Robert, > > I didn't catch myself during a weak moment and I regret that I sent > the previous message. I don't regret it because it isn't true, I just > think things like that are better left unsaid. Then, too, I don't > always do the best thing. > > It appears that my message did generate some rapid email. I have > gotten some mail from your brothers across the pond ( they are up > late) that said that they are so glad you are over here and not in > their backyard and they wish you would quit claiming your British > heritage as it is giving them a bad name. > > Robert, when you use the trite old saying that "if you have to ask how > much it costs, you probably can't afford it" is foolhardy. Anyone who > writes someone a blank check is an idiot and won't long have their > money. Yeah, I know, you have this and you have that. > > Now, I expect your little minions to come in and defend you as usual. > > Fire one! > > Cass > > -- > x-no-archive: yes > > "Robert Bastow" <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote in message > news:FuyE4.8695$ps1.187826@news1.rdc1.ga.home.com... > > Wassamarrer Cass? No-body paying attention to you? > > > > 8^) > > > > teenut > > > > Cass wrote: > > > > > > yeah, yeah, yeah! > > > > > > Is anyone else sick of all of this bragging? > > > > > > -- > > > x-no-archive: yes > > > > > > "Robert Bastow" <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote in message > > > news:mHxE4.8686$ps1.187656@news1.rdc1.ga.home.com... > > > > > > > > > > > > Erich Coiner wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > What is inappropriate is trying to take the hay bailer down to > the > > > local > > > > > CNC machine shop and saying the same thing. They ain't set up > to > > > handle > > > > > that kind of work. > > > > > > > > > > Erich > > > > > > > > Yes they are Erich..but if you have to ask how much it costs to > > > "take time out" > > > > of that environment to figure out what you need...You probably > can't > > > afford it!! > > > > > > > > Right now I have right at $600,000.00 in hard cash investment > and a > > > payroll > > > > running $25000.00 plus fixed overheads of about $8,000.00 I > would > > > love to take > > > > the time out to design your part for you..I can do it! ..No > problem. > > > But I have > > > > to be compensated adequately for the risk *I* take!! If what I > > > recommend > > > > doesn't fit, or work...you will be totally pissed and won't pay > the > > > bill. > > > > Probably bad-mouth me around the trade too! > > > > > > > > I will make "A" to your spec for $X.00..If I have to spec out > "A" > > > and guarantee > > > > it will work, I am going to charge at least $2X.00. If you > don't > > > like > > > > that....Find another Pidgeon!! > > > > > > > > teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Can You Build This for me? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 06:04:47 GMT -------- I got a deal on "d"s on Ebay..Have to use 'em up somewhere! ;^) teenut tonyp wrote: > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote in part: > > > I will make "A" to your spec for $X.00..If I have to spec out "A" and > guarantee > > it will work, I am going to charge at least $2X.00. If you don't like > > that....Find another Pidgeon!! > > Robert, you'll go broke at that multiple. You'd have to "guess" the specs > correctly in no more than 2 tries. I'm not doubting _your_ capabilities, > just the customer's ability to define what "works" means. > > But what's with the "d" in pigeon? > > -- Tony Prentakis ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: And You Thought Import Lathes Were Overpriced! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 30 Mar 2000 06:19:47 GMT -------- "charles.morrill" wrote: > You know how it will go. You'll walk into some new restaurant chain some > day and they'll have an SB 9" behind the bar. It will happen! I remember the sick feeling I got in some Mid-West Hotel buffet..They had the front half of an early E-Type Jag made into a salad bar! I had to leave..hungry. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: DRILL HOLES IN HSS - HELP From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 31 Mar 2000 04:18:23 GMT -------- A carbide diemaker's drill will cut the holes clean as a wizz..lots of pressure and either full flood, air mist or zero coolant..Dribbles will break the drill. Useful for making half round ball forming tools in HSS. Lots of cheap drills on Ebay..or try your local Industrial supplier...buy a couple!! teenut GUYMO wrote: > > Could anyone tell me how to drill holes in HSS? I need about 1/4" holes > drilled into 1/4 and 1/2" thick high speed steel. I know I could burn the > holes but appearance is important. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Russian ERTEN Machining Center From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 01 Apr 2000 03:51:37 GMT -------- I'm NOT a Latheaholic...I'm a Lathie! Latheaholics go to meetings! 8^) teenut "charles.morrill" wrote: > Robert, how do you spell "latheaholic?" > > Chas ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Where can I buy 'Using the Small Lathe?' From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 01 Apr 2000 04:01:19 GMT -------- Likliest source would be Tee Publishing in the UK. They have a web site. teenut Marv Soloff wrote: > > Steve Rundell wrote: > > > > When Projects in Metal changed its name to Machinist's Workshop, it > > started a series by Barry Young called 'The Amateur Machinist.' > > Besides recommendations on hardware, he recommends Using the Small > > Lathe, a book by L. C. Mason. However, the local Barnes & Noble > > doesn't carry it, nor does their web site. Can somebody help me out > > here? Suggestions on one of the mail-order booksellers would be good, > > as would the mention of any Seattle-area bookstores. You can reply to > > my e-mail; > > > > StephenORundell@worldnet.att.net > > > > but replies to the news group help to spread the knowledge. > > > > -- > > > > Thank you > > > > Steve Rundell > > Home; 206-526-5590 > > Seems both books by L.(Leonard) C.(Charlish) Mason were published in > the UK by Model and Allied Publications, Kings Langley. No ISBN > numbers assigned, which is going to make it tough to find. > > Regards, > > Marv ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Pilger Mill From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 02 Apr 2000 16:41:33 GMT -------- A Pilger Mill uses two or three angled rollers through which a hot billet is fed. The angle causes a "Pipe" (Similar to the concavity formed in a plug of pla-do if you try to roll it out in your hands) to form in the end of the billet. Into this is inserted a bullet ended mandrel and the continued rolling action forms a continuous pipe or tube to form. This then goes on to further rolling or drawing operations. The Pilger Mill is used world wide in the production of high quality seamless steel tubing. teenut s-cubed wrote: > > Does anyone know what a Pilger mill is? I have a vendor that wants to > sell us pipe made in a pliger mill and i don't know the difference > between this type of mill and the retained mandrel mill that we > normally > use. > Thanks!! > Steve Smith > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Some easy(?) questions From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 03 Apr 2000 15:15:21 GMT -------- > On Mon, 03 Apr 2000 01:17:37 GMT, peter michaux wrote: > > >1) What does F.O.B. mean? By International Convention it means "Free On Board" And must always be accompanied by an FOB Point. "FOB Our Works" Means that the supplier is responsible for Supply, packing and crating etc and for placining on board YOUR transportstion at THEIR Loading Dock. FOB New Orleans (Referring to sea freight) Means that they are responsible for Supply, Packing for sea freight, transporting to dockside and arranging for placing on board the ship. It has important legal meanings...The FOB point being where ownership passes (Payment being due at that point) also determins the point at which responsibility for INSURANCE begins and ends. A famous case refers to a shipment of steam locomotives being shipped FOB Liverpool. Normally the point of insurance is taken to be the ship's rail. If it is damaged or lost befor crossing the ships rail it is the responsibility of the FOB shipper and his Insurers. If the point of loss or damage is beyond the ship's rail..the loss must be covered y the PURCHASER'S Insurance. In the Liverpool case, a locomotive was being swung over the ships rail when the sling broke and if fell, first on the ships deck and then slipped into the water (Where it remains to this day!) Subsequent court hearings ruled, that as the locomotive had in fact CROSSED the ships rail before falling OFF the ship into the dock..the FOB delivery requirement had been met and the Purchaser's/Shipper's Insurance was responsible for covering the loss. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Some easy(?) questions From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 06 Apr 2000 03:48:26 GMT -------- It might be a "Common US Definition" but it is WRONG!!! teenut eberlein wrote: > > The other common US definition is "freight on board". There is more than one > meaning, though. See link below: > > http://www.AcronymFinder.com/af-query.asp?Acronym=fob&String=off&search.x=47&search.y=6 > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > By International Convention it means "Free On Board" And must always be > > accompanied by an FOB Point. > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Position for a student? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 06 Apr 2000 04:21:53 GMT -------- Good for you Robin! I have substantial experience of the Machine Shop Business in the Toronto to Grimsby corridor. My advice is to steer clear of the larger shops..Magna in particular..Soul-less bunch!! You will spend your time loading a cnc machine, or punching palm buttons on a press. The SCOPE of your experience will be VERY limited. Find a small job shop (try Mississauga..there are dozens of them) Be prepared to do whatever they ask..start sweeping floors. But watch, listen and learn. Soon enough they will start giving you metal cutting jobs to do..from there on it just gets better! Or come to Atlanta and work for me!! teenut "[©ØMMÄÑУ®]" wrote: > > Hello all, > > I'm just wondering about looking for a summer job as a quasi-machinist? I'm > a mech design student (grade 12), and I'm told I'm at the top of the class > (I'm normally very humble :)).. My machine shop teacher, an Ontario > Certified General Machinist, thought I should go to the larger companies... > Namely Magna International. > > I'm wondering if anyone has any thoughts on this? > > BTW, I'm in the Toronto area... > > Thanks in advance, > > Robin ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: CUT OUT METAL FIGURES From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 06 Apr 2000 04:32:15 GMT -------- I am assuming that these are from thin gauge metal and that you don't want to go into Commercial Production ;^) 1) Hammer, cold chisel and steel block for an anvil 2) Hacksaw frame with a round "all-way" blade (Ask at Ace or Home Despot) 3) Jig Saw..$100 to $300 (Sears or Home Depot) 4) Ask at your local library for books on metalwork or Art Metal..even Jewelry books will have a wealth of information. 4) Stick around RCM..read and ask questions...This bunch of Recidivists and Reprobates will teach you more than you ever needed to know about every aspect of cutting and bashing metal!! 8^) teenut Jo helen matheson wrote: > > can someone tell me how to cut these out of metal. you see them at the > garden stores all the time. they are so expensive i thought i might try > to do this. > > jo helen ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Anyone Seen Teenut?? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 05:34:13 GMT -------- Wrong..All wrong!! Yes, 'ole teenut's been busy... I HAVE been on a junket to N'Orleans ($1100.00 on food and booze ALONE, for me and the Missus..Friday lunch through Sunday lunch) (Plus $50.00 on Tums when we got back!!) I also had the "Official" Opening of the new company.... Sold a couple of OLD Bridgeports for $900 each (I couldn't hardly GIVE them away in Atlanta!!)... Ordered a new CNC Lathe... Spent two days in hospital with pneumonia... Made several, almost full day trips, to see a Pneumocologist, a Thoracic Surgean and an Oncologist plus a dozen X-Rays and CAT Scans. Yes, I do have Lung Cancer..I go for exploratory surgery on Wednesday to find out what type and at what stage. At best I will lose a lung..I don't yet want to contemplate the worst!! So you see, I have had my hands full..I have been lurking whenever possible and haven't missed a message. You guys seem to be coping quite well and I guess I just didn't feel up to starting another war!! By the way, I HAVE quit smoking (HELLO-O!) so save me the lectures (and all the herbal cures) My chin is WELL up and, in actual fact..I haven't felt this good in a LONG time. And have no fear..They ain't going to get me THIS easy!! Best wishes to all. I'll talk at you towards the end of the week. teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article <29283-38FA71E8-35@storefull-261.iap.bryant.webtv.net>, > JNS99@webtv.net (John Jacobs) wrote: > > I was off a few days and when I returned to RCM, I didn't see any > > Teenut postings. Did I miss something? > > I dunno, he's been absent for nearly a week now. My suspicions: > > Away on a company-sponsored junket, complete with fancy eats and > dancing girls. > > The startup shop is devouring his entire life. > > He realized that we're all pathetic computer-nerds and wants to work > with real tools. > > He forgot his computer-password. > > The litigation for the more expensive CNC milling machine finally hit > the fan. > > His business manager finally realized how much she could make for > somebody else, so teenut is being held ransom for her back pay and a > raise. > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Anyone Seen Teenut?? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 17 Apr 2000 07:07:56 GMT -------- mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > I suppose I will go out on a small limb here and say that > we all will be thinking of you then, and wish you all the best. Thanks Guys..If you know any..Say 'em!! > > I think there are few, if any here who would disagree with > the sentiments. Oh..I can think of a couple! ;^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Need help trepanning D-2 From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 14:59:16 GMT -------- Hi Tom, Helluva first project to cut your teeth on trepanning!! Obviously you have a few to make...and D2 is neither cheap..Nor a material with which to take liberties. So here is how I would go about it on a methodical basis. Soft jaws are GOOD..Make them deep enough to get a real good hold, and make the bottom step WIDE enought to support, not just the outer ring...But the INNER circle as well. A step that reaches inwards at least 3/8" past the cut is required. Face one side, flip and face the other. Now, either center drill..Or if you don't want to "spoil" the cutout..use a pressure pad..A short stub of round bar, faced both sides and center drilled, so that you can apply pressure with the tail stock while you do the actual cutting. Go right through from one side! The pressure pad will take up end play in the spindle and it will prevent the inner disc from canting and jamming the tool as you break through. No need to break right through..As you come to the back face, the tool nose will cut right through and slightly INTO the soft jaws. However, BETWEEN the jaws, it will push out a thin web of D2 that will hold the disc in place. You can then remove the tool and tailstock and break the inner disc out with a pry bar. leaving the outer disc in place to finish the bore. The tool is critical. Ideally it should be custom made for THAT Diameter! The external radius and the internal radius, should match the external and internal radii of the cut..less a bit for clearance. Make it as DEEP as possible. Grind it from a chunk of HSS (Some on EBAY as we speak..1/2" x 3/4" deep! For cheap!) Or..Machine it from a chunk of 4140, and braze on a "Thinbit" carbide tip. If you have a lot to do..GO BUY ONE!! ;^) The tool should have a good chip breaker groove..Curl up and break those little suckers..And use pleanty of HP cutting oil. LUBE is what you want..NOT coolant. Run at about 50 ft/min and keep up a gentle but steady feed pressure. LOCK every slide and gib not actually moving!..Even put a bit of drag on the one that is!! If the Lathe is at all old or worn..Consider taking off the top slide and substituting a solid tool block, mounted directly on the top slide. In any case..reduce all overhangs to a minimum. Finally, Grind the trepanning tool with a SLIGHT "Bull Nose" and break the sharp edges on the corners slightly..The bull nose will produce a chip that cups in on itself (like the chip from a round nosed gouge)..this will make it slightly narrower than the tool and the groove..easier to clear out and less likely to rub and gall the sides of the groove. Happy trepanning!! teenut Tom Gardner wrote: > > I need to make more cutter knives from D-2 sawn disks that are 9" OD x 7/8" > thick. I couldn't get hollowbar cheap enough. The final ID will be 4". I > made soft jaws. I turn one face then trepan the ID to about 3-7/8" half way > through, flip the blank, face the new side and trepan the other half then > bore to final ID . I hand grind the cutter bit from 3/8" HSS cobalt so the > cutter land is about 1/8" wide with a few deg. of rake and the nose with > just a little rake to controll the "pull" into the cut. This works ok but > it's ssslllllloooooowww and I get only three blades done if I am lucky > before the trepan bit breaks and imbeds into the disk. (I'm good at getting > the shattered pieces out...practice) I am mist cooling and the speed feels > right. > > I have never seen a real trepanning bit so I am guessing at the geometry. > Is there a formula for the bit? Hell, I don't know if I'm even spelling it > right. Is there a better way? I can't just bore the blades and turn all > that D-2 into chips, I guess I'm cheap, but the slugs are too handy for > small dies and other stuff. The job is like dental work and we have to do > 18 more. > > Tom Gardner ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Teenut's Gun From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 15:18:10 GMT -------- Absolutely, a US 16 Inch Naval Gun. Every other Nation used side swing breeches..Except Germany, who used sliding block breeches exclusively..Even on the 80 CM "Gustave Gerat"!! Helluva shell case! teenut (starting to sit up and take a little light nourishment!) Brian Lawson wrote: > > Sure looks like the breech lock for a 16 incher. > > XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX > > On Tue, 18 Apr 2000 03:42:27 GMT, John wrote: > > >Does anyone know the size of this gun and what it was fitted to? > > > >Thanks > >John > > > > > >Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > >Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Coolant pump From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 15:28:14 GMT -------- Theoretically..It will work fine. In practice, you will need to ensure that the tubing is ABSOLUTELY resistant to the oil..It undergoes a lot of stress in a Peristaltic Pump. You will also need to have a very fine filter on the system..any metal or grit particals re-circulated through the tubing will chew the heck out of it in short order. Hand though..especialy if it has a Variable Speed Drive. teenut LBailey wrote: > > I just scored a roller pump from the hospital where I work. It needs a > small DC motor, but is otherwise OK. These are small pumps used in > endoscopic surgery, etc. My plan is to use it for coolant/lubricant. Has > anyone here done something like this? How did it work out? > > -- > Larry Bailey > Illegitimi non carborundum ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 4 Cuts to Exact Dimension From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 15:34:51 GMT -------- Me too!! teenut Rich wrote: > > Chet Roberts wrote: > > > "(Who's cut far too many diameters a tad too much...)" > > Please put my name on that list, I did it just last night (it wasn't the first > time either). I would like to see the hint Chet is speaking of, I missed it > on the first go around. > > Thanks, > > Rich ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Anyone Seen Teenut?? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 17:05:59 GMT -------- Sorry Mike..I have been back in the US for quite a few years now. My butt is WELL covered from a Medical Insurance point of view..What with my own Company coverage, PLUS my wife's State Merit coverage (she is a teacher) PLUS a "Dread Desease" Policy designed to kick in with all kinds of goodies in cases like these. (I'm not short of a bob or two myself either!!) Add to that, the fact is from an eminent "Medical" family..Father is one of the top Nuclear Pathologists in the world, Brother is Head of Surgery for a group of Hospitals. Lots a "Clout" there when needed (Like INSTANT appointments with any specialist I need..etc.) Yes, I am one of the lucky ones..This is a wonderful country if you are Free, White, Educated, Protestant, Employed and Wealthy. Fall outside that narrow band and things start to get grim..FAST!! teenut Mike Graham wrote: > > On Tue, 18 Apr 2000 12:00:31 GMT, brian whatcott wrote: > > >But there is one trap that I don't see an escape from - you are in the > >hands of the medical system. This is so much more dangerous for your > >financial well being that I can't think of a strategy. > > I thought ole' Teenut was still in Canada. Or did he move to the states? > If he did, my condolences. Better move back *real* quick. > > -- > -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- > Mike Graham | Metalworker by trade > mikegraham at sprint dot ca | Weld to live, like to weld. > Caledon, Ontario, Canada | Weird by nature > > -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- > "By Fire and Iron doth he make Bread." ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Need help trepanning D-2 From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 18 Apr 2000 17:57:29 GMT -------- Chip breaker should be a groove, across the nose, about 1/8" wide and .030" to .040" Deep..leave a TINY flat on the extreem tip, so as not to weaken the tip too much. "Bull Nose" means slightly radiused..even a shallow vee nose..either should be CONCAVE. teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > > The tool should have a good chip breaker groove.. > > What would your preferred chip breaker look like on a tool > like that? > > > Finally, Grind the trepanning tool with a SLIGHT "Bull Nose" > > By bull nose, do you mean a concave front to it? > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Automotive whine - foiled by Buick. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 05:40:33 GMT -------- gcouger wrote: > > > If I remember right you started the engine and got up to 20 mph and killed > the engine and coasted as far as you could and repeated. Not the kind I used to go on in the UK..run on regular roads with regular cars (obviously well tuned) with regular gas, in normal traffic and an "Observer" The objective was to go from A to B and the one using the least gas per cc of engine capacity was the winner. All normal road and traffic rules had to be observed and a MINIMUM average speed of thirty MPH had to be maintained. Not many Broke 100 mpg..but some surprising numbers were logged up..especially when you realise the cars ran the gamut from pre-war Austin 7's and Rolls-Royces to full rally twin-cam Escorts and Lutus's (Loti?) Made a pleasant break from Rallies and Gymkhanas..good practice too..in the days when I often didn't have the price of a gallon of gas to get home! Even today I drive a LOT faster than my wife ever does..but I get 20% better mileage out of the V12 (I average 18 around town and 24 on a run) than she can out of the XJ6! A tank of gas, in the Kitten, lasts me all week commuting and general business running around town. It is all in pedal control and timing..Of the road, of traffic and conditions. If I am balked in traffic..I don't follow hot on his heels waiting for the first crack to open that I can squeeze into. I fall back a ways..bide my time....gives me a breather, lets him do what he needs too without being pushed...and then gives me a clear run, into clear space, at a higher overtaking speed than I could have without crowding up behind him. (It reduces "TED"...Time Exposed to Danger" One Golden Rule I was taught by the BIAM (British Institute of Advanced Motorists) was NEVER, NEVER, NEVER....pull alongside a truck, to overtake...UNLESS your path is clear out the other side of him. Even if it means holding back until the guy in front is just a car length clear of the other side. Some truly nasty things can happen to cars alongside trucks..even in good weather and visibility. Make sure you have a way out BEFORE you enter that Zone..conditions and circumstances can happen very quickly at 70 MPH and often the result will be that the space available for YOU will shrink suddenly! Unfortunately, I see people breaking this rule every day of the week..Sad thing is..I will get there faster than they will..without one tenth of the "T.E.D." teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Automotive whine - foiled by Buick. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 05:57:38 GMT -------- Mike Graham wrote: > > I remember reading a story where the author was touring in some > back-of-beyond place, and was at a motorcycle-rental place. Sitting under a > shady tree was a small boy laboriously filing away at a piston trying to get > it to fit an engine for which it had never been designed. I'll bet it > worked, too. 8-) > > -- I bet it did too! I have often watched Arab Craftsmen, in the Souks of Cairo, file down a set of Ford Pistons to fit a Mercedes...Sitting cross-legged on the sidewalk and holding it with their toes! I was reliably informed, that this was a regular circumstance..the only pistons they could get were Ford, Fiat and Peugeot..all other sources of new or "recycled" ones had been used up long ago. Yes the cars run well. Made me 'umble! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Anyone Seen Teenut?? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 06:28:14 GMT -------- Russ Kepler wrote: > > >Usually after spending 1100 bucks on food you either get indigestion, food > >poisoning or wind. > > If I spent that much I'd demand all three. Two outa three!! I love oysters..but they give me gas. I spent so many years in Africa and the Middle East that I think I am immune to food poisoning nowadays! As I won't be allowed to eat tomorrow, I just took my Wife and sone out for a Honking great plate of tucker (at Joey D's) including a 22 oz Ribeye and several very dirty Martinis!! Hopefully I will make it until 11-30am when they put me under!! (Damn..I'm feeling peckish already!!) Just a quick word of thanks for the Best Wishes and Prayers I have received from everyone..Online, offline and by phone..far too many for me to be able to reply to each individually. Sincerely teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Anyone Seen Teenut?? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 06:33:56 GMT -------- I'll say one for you Mark..after all the attention my case has been getting with "'im Upstairs" I probably have a bit more clout than most folks usually do..At least for a short while I hope! Good Luck! teenut "Mark W." wrote: > > Robert... I'll be thinking about you; I'll be in surgery the same day. You > can worry about me, I'll worry about you. > > Best of luck, > > Mark > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> > wrote in message ... > > >Yes, I do have Lung Cancer..I go for exploratory surgery on Wednesday to > find > >out what type and at what stage. At best I will lose a lung..I don't yet > want > >to contemplate the worst!! > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Anyone Seen Teenut?? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 06:34:47 GMT -------- Me too! ;^) teenut "Fitch R. Williams" wrote: > > "Mark W." wrote: > > >Robert... I'll be thinking about you; I'll be in surgery the same day. You > >can worry about me, I'll worry about you. > > Good luck to both of you. I will be watching here at tentatively for > the next post from you folks. > > Fitch > In So. Cal. > > The FAQ for RCM is: http://w3.uwyo.edu/~metal > Metal Web News at http://www.mindspring.com/~wgray1/ > The "Drop Box" is at http://www.metalworking.com/ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Teenut's Gun From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 07:12:05 GMT -------- The full effect of firing a simultaneous broadside with all 9 guns would certainly give a helluva shove to the ship..Howver, by no means would it be moved 16 feet..or even 16 inches.."sideways" Recoil calculations are complex. Foot pounds of energy don't tell the whole story, nor does mass or velocity or inertia. However, the main point being missed is that it takes a sustained shove to move a large mass, especially against massive resistance. A sharp bang won't do it. A long, gentle shove often will. Consider that the duration of recoil thrust is microseconds. That a huge amount of it is absorbed by a VERY sophysticated Hydro-Pneumatic Recoil Buffer and Recuperator System. (the guns recoil about three feet..90% of it AFTER the projectile has left the barrel) Then a bunch more of it is absorbed by the elasticity of the turret, decks and hull structures. By the time the compression wave has reached the far side of the ship, the structure has started to expand again and the primary wave is being met and countered by return waves. The result is that the recoil energy is dissipated as other forms of energy..mainly noise! Can you say "CLANG!!" teenut MegaShaft 4000 wrote: > > Let's not forget that lots of that energy will go into rocking the ship, > since the guns are above the center of gravity. Also, for the ship to go > sideways, it will need to push against all the water on its side, and since > it will be going sideways, it will have to move a 15+ feet deep 800 foot > long wall of water. It won't exactly "cut" through the water going sideways > :-) > > I think the wind and ocean currents will have a much greater effect on the > movement of the ship than the firing of the guns would have. So much, in > fact, that measuring the movement of the ship would be nearly impossible. > > "Gary Coffman" wrote in message > news:kf7pfs8am5ntob7cnjkai4mbd7r9h9hues@4ax.com... > > On Tue, 18 Apr 2000 16:09:21 GMT, "MegaShaft 4000" wrote: > > >I've hear that also, but it isn't true. > > > > > >The mass of the bullets fired (which would equal the recoil) don't even > > >compare to the mass of the ship. Also, if it slid 16 feet when it was > fired, > > >everyone inside the ship would be slammed against the metal walls inside, > > >and you'd be getting numerous fatalities inside the ship every time it > was > > >fired. According to that story, even if a few guns were fired, the ship > > >would slide a little bit which would still knock people off their feet. > > > > Well, actually recoil is figured according to > > > > M1*V1 = M2*V2 > > > > The 16 inch shells weigh 2200 pounds each, and before the refit there > > were 9 main guns. So M2 for a broadside would be roughly 10 tons > > (it's actually more than that, because the expelled propellant gases > > count too). The Iowa class weighs 45,000 tons, so that's the value > > for M1. V2 is the muzzle velocity of the guns. I don't have good data > > on that, but the shells are subsonic, so we can set an upper limit of > > about 1000 fps for V2 (the propellant gas velocity will be sonic, and > > the mass of the propellant is nearly the same as that of the shells, > > so this is reasonable). Now we have to solve for V1. > > > > V1 = (10 * 1000)/45000 = 0.2222 fps or about 0.15 MPH > > > > That's how fast the ship will move in the opposite direction from > > the broadside counting only the mass of the shells. If we include > > the propellant mass, the speed will be about double that. That's > > not going to smash anyone against a bulkhead. But 45,000 tons > > moving at somewhere between 0.15 and 0.3 MPH is going to be > > hard to stop. > > > > Whether the ship will move 16 feet sideways before stopping or > > not depends on how much lateral resistance to movement the > > water provides. This is a vector problem because the ship is > > moving forward at up to 33 knots at the same time. I'm not going > > to try to calculate that, but I'd suggest that 16 feet is a reasonable > > number. I've seen it in print a number of times, so I'd tend to go > > along with it. > > > > >This story is nonsense, along with the stories about how the A-10 > > >temporarily stops when it fires it's gatling gun. > > > > When the 37mm cannon is firing, about 1500 pounds a second of > > shells are exiting the cannon at supersonic speed. That's a momentum > > of greater than 1,500,000 ft-lb/sec (I don't know the actual muzzle > > velocity). I don't have the weight of the A-10 at hand, but I do recall > > that it attacks at 400 knots, or about 666 fps. I suspect it weighs > > around 20 tons fully laden. That's a forward momentum of about > > 26,000,000 ft-lb/sec, so it should *not* stop in the air when firing. > > > > What I have read happens, however, is that the exhausted propellant > > gases oxygen starve the jet engines momentarily when the cannon > > is fired, and thrust drops to near zero. So it certainly does slow down > > sharply while firing. > > > > Gary > > Gary Coffman KE4ZV | You make it |mail to ke4zv@bellsouth.net > > 534 Shannon Way | We break it | > > Lawrenceville, GA | Guaranteed | ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: pipe threads From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 19 Apr 2000 07:38:58 GMT -------- Sometimes it is better to remain silent... The 5/16" Whitworth wrench has the same size head as a 5/16" Whitworth bolt..DUH! Why would the Americans go put the 3/4" head on a 1/2" Bolt? Do you need a spare one for the 3/4" bolt? Did Willie do it? teenut foxeye wrote: > > Probably that same fellow measured and declared its sizes that came up > with that English sizing called Whitworth..where a 5/16 whitworth OE > wrench is about equal to a 3/4" SAE OE wrench... ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Anyone Seen Teenut?? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 11:55:48 GMT -------- He's ba-ack! ;^) Preliminary results not as optimistic as we I hoped.. Stage3.. Inoperable at present. Not the end of the world though..Hopefully, treatment with Radiation and Chemotherapy will reduce it to the point where it WILL be operable. Thanks for all your support Guys and Gals..It makes me proud to be a member of this Group. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Apprenticeship in area? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 12:45:24 GMT -------- Any old Body Jewelers out there, wanting to pass on the trade before retiring? teenut illusion@hickory.net wrote: > > I'm new to the entire metalworking scene and was wondering if there > was anybody in the Hickory, NC area that would be willing to > apprentice or just teach in their spare time. I eventually plan on > making body jewelry out of surgical stainless steel, titanium, and > niobium if at all possible. Also, any books or websites with > information on starting with this hobby would be greatly appreciated. > Thank you for your time and information... Robert Beal. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Is there more than 1 definiton of micron? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 20 Apr 2000 20:57:13 GMT -------- I have NEVER called a Micrometer a "Micron" ;^) teenut Paul Koning wrote: > Weird. I would say that only the thoroughly warped > would use the word "micron" to refer to anything other > than a micrometer. > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Oil hardening rod as (automotive) suspension component? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 21 Apr 2000 20:11:40 GMT -------- Best of all will be 5160..specifically a spring steel..also beloved by custom blade makers as "OCS" (Old Chevy Spring) Obtainable in bar and rod form from any good Specialty Steel Supplier. Your Friendly Local Truck Spring Company probably stock round bar of varying diameters, from which they form coil springs and torsion bars to order. Have you enquired about having a custom torsion spring made by one of these people locally? teenut Randy O'Brian wrote: > > From what I have read, O1 is not too good as a spring. W1 would probably be > better since it is similar to 1075 which is often used in spring manuf. The > best of the common tool steels would probably be S7. It is very shock > resistant and is available in drill rod form. > > Randy > > "Ted Edwards" wrote in message > news:38FF9BA4.6EAA@bc.sympatico.ca... > > Jan Ben wrote: > > > > > so do you think the oil hardening alloy would do OK as far as fatigue? > > > annealed or treated? > > > > Let's see what others have to say. I'm sorry, I don't know the fatigue > > properties of O-1. > > > > Ted > > > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Milling Aplications From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 02:31:39 GMT -------- I think you will find that the slotting (saw) cutter is faster by a long chalk. Your limiting factor will be the number of teeth per minute and the depth of chip per tooth. The saw cutter will cut each slot in one pass, whereas the end mill will take at least two. Tell us what surface feet per minute, what number of teeth on each cutter etc. and we can work out the time to cut with each. Have you considered that, on the horizontal spindle, you could use two three or many more cutters ganged together and cut several slots at a time? teenut teenut metalmauler@webtv.net wrote: > > We're making a mold out of hot rolled steel, approximately 3' X 4'. We > have to mill 15 to 20 1/4" X 1/4" slots down the 4' length. > > I suggested using a 1/4" solid carbide endmill in a Bridgeport 2 hp head > on our planer mill. > > The boss wants to bolt on the horizontal attachment and use a 1/4" > slotting cutter. > > I think my suggestion would be quite a bit quicker. Any input would be > appreciated. We're trying to make a buck, and save the customer $$$ > > TIA, > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > Gallery of Machines Machinetool Rebuilders > > New & Used,Reconditioned Machines > > Russ Penrose > > Marathon NY > > Part/timeWoodworker ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 4 Cuts to Exact Dimension From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 22 Apr 2000 14:26:20 GMT -------- "Scott S. Logan" wrote: > Home phone, 0 hits > Cell Phone, 0 hits > Work phone, 0 hits > > What does this mean? You didn't pay the phone bills and you've been cut off?? teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Setting a bad example for the children From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 24 Apr 2000 19:36:33 GMT -------- Be careful..Be VERY careful...mentioning bombs in any way, shape or form in an airport. It is a Federal offence for which you can do hard time. Security people have a miserable job and they just LOVE it when you try to bring a little humor into their days..You WILL miss your flight and spend time in handcuffs while you wait for your Lawyer to arrive and raise bail. Proving that you were "Only Kidding" does NOT mitigate the offence..the penalty is the same wether you meant it or not. teenut..who saw it happen to a travelling companion..Idiot!! Nick Hull wrote: > > In article <01bfad8b$d3477c00$0f9b10cf@pavilion>, "G. J. Kuebler " > wrote: > > > that's like getting on the paging system at the local airport at the > > unattended counter at one of the gates....."paging Dick Tracy".... > > > > I prefer to announce 'the bomb threat has been cancelled' > > -- > > Committees of Correspondence Web page: > http://www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/5357/ > - free men own guns, slaves don't ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 1,2,3 blocks setup & monograph &/or text From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 25 Apr 2000 12:34:51 GMT -------- metalmauler@webtv.net wrote: > Most of the 1,2,3 blocks you buy are hardened. We don't really need > hardened, we just kiss them off on the surface grinder if they're out > some. For our purposes they don't have to be exactly 1.00 or 2.00. They > can be any needed size as long as they're accurate. Hmm!! As a LOOONNNGG time T & D Maker, Machine tool Fitter and Job Shop Machinist/Owner I can assure you that SOFT 1-2-3 blocks that are NOT dead square, accurate and made to aliquot dimensions, are as useless as tits on a bull..AS 1-2-3 BLOCKS!!! There is a definite need in any Tool Room or Jobbing Shop for lots of PACKERS..The more the merrier, in as many different sizes as possible. It is not Economically possible to have them all ground and hardened. Indeed it isn't even desireable as, many times, the set up may require cutting or drilling right through the workpiece and into the packing materials. In a jobbing shop any offcut eventually becomes short enough to toss into the Pairs of parallels are another, separate requirement. To be of any reliable long term use they must be hardened and accurately ground in pairs. The best ones are accurate in two dimensions..say 1/4 x 1/2 or 3/8 x 3/4. Their value is increased enormously if they are ground to accurate, aliquot dimensions as then, two or more can be stacked together to equal a thir one. Better still they have holes drilled in the larger ones..for lightness, and for ease of bolting during settups. 1-2-3 blocks serve a separate and specific purpose for which it is mandatary that they are hardened and ground accurately in pairs..but also to a common dimension so that two or more PAIRS can be used together. Yes they can be used as simple parallels, but their main, intended use is as high precision set up, layout and inspection aids. They are usually found in the Toolroom or Inspection/Metrology Lab. Two 1-2-3 Blocks, on their own have limited use..They should, at least, be equipped with a set of screws or studs of varying lengths so they can be bolted together in pairs to form custom sizes, angle plates, vee blocks etc. A complete set, as supplied by Jig Borer Manufacturers like DeVlieg, S.I.P. Hauser, Deckel and Moore Tool are invariably in sets that include (at very least) one or two pairs of 1x2x3 blocks, 1/2 x 3/4 x 1 1/2 and possibly even 2 x 4 x 6. All as accurately ground and lapped as Gauge Blocks and complete with a full suite of studs and accessories. With these a "Custom Made" fixtur or jig can be rappidly and accuratel put together. teenut > > Our uses are getting whatever we're grinding off the table of the > surface grinder or way grinder, so we can mic for thickness. We put our > blocks 25% of the way into or under our parts and grind accordingly. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 3 phase motors, single phase power From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 08:38:15 GMT -------- Among the many "Treasures" I dug out in the clean up of my new shop is a large, old and very heavy 5HP 3 HP 1180 rev/min Motor. Grimy but in perfect working condition. Before I start to fit my home made phase converter with run-balance Capacitors (Presently it uses a 3PH 3 HP 3450 Rev/min motor of light-weight modern persuasion with a kit-built 3-5 HP static converter to start it.) I was wondering if (apart from the increased HP) There would be any advantage or difficulty installing the 1180 rev/min motor in its place? Would it run more smoothly? teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: MetalMauler Deckel Slotting Attachment From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 26 Apr 2000 10:01:06 GMT -------- Hi there, I didn't see the message myself, but I am reliably informed that your Company may have a Slotting Atachment available for the small (FP1) Deckel Mill. If that is the case, can you give me some details..Age, condition, tooling, and your best price? Do you have any other Deckel Accessories or Tooling available? I need 4 MT Horizontal milling arbors, Collets particularly. If you have photos, etc... email them, mail or fax to: Robert Bastow Express tool & Die 5390 Oakdale Rd Smyrna, GA 30082 Ph 404 799 6304 Fx 404 792 2668 (My server failed to recognise the webtv address) Cheers, teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Correct term for spring failure From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 28 Apr 2000 14:03:00 GMT -------- "Sprung" teenut Joules wrote: > > Can anyone jog my memory, I am trying to remember the term used > to describe a spring that has lost its memory/exceeded it > working length and has now taken a new shape. This is one of > those tip of the tongue type things...... > > Joules > > * Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet's Discussion Network * > The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet - Free! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: *NEW* group purchase plan! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 29 Apr 2000 01:53:15 GMT -------- metalmauler@webtv.net wrote: > How would you like to have to scrape those parts? Talk about a major > rigging/scraping job. Gives me nightmares thinking about it! > That, and much larger lathes, vertical boring mills and planers were built by my old "Alma Mater" Scraping was the easy bit! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: *NEW* group purchase plan! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 30 Apr 2000 00:57:51 GMT -------- One of the best descriptive articles is here on the "Border Barrels" webpage: http://www.border-barrels.com/articles/bmart.htm teenut "[©ØMMÄÑУ®]" wrote: > > BTW, on a more serious note, how does one rifle barrels? My shop teacher was > talking about how he used to make little brass cannons, but he didn't know > how to rifle them... ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: WTD: A 2.75" column for floor model drill press From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 02:07:44 GMT -------- I extended a bench model into a floor model. many years ago, not by replacing the column with a a longer one...But by the simple expedient of making a tubular spacer, of the required length, to lift the existing column further from the base. In my case I decided that a piece of sched. 40 pipe of the SAME diameter as the round flanges was easier to make, and aestheticaly more pleasing to the eye than a section of tube the same diameter as the existing tube. I obtained the length of tube and two 5/8 thick, round, flame cut "Drops" from "Evans the Scrap" for a six pack of beer, took them round to the local machine shop where, for another six pack I had the ends of the tube squarded in a large lathe, the flanges welded on each end and finally trimmed to length and faced both ends in the lathe. (Would I do that for a six pack in my shop today? Probably yes, if a local HSM'er of my aquaintance (Who I was) came with a genuine request for a simple job out of his capacity and ready willing and able to wait in line and pay the full going rate (Which I did) I would probably whip it out as a freebie..which they did. What goes around comes around. I "Match" drilled and tapped both ends at home to suit the column flange and base, and joined the three bits back together with (IIRC) 3/8" x 1" cap head setscrews and shakepruf washers. The drill press was converted in less time than it took me to (peck, peck, shit...peck,peck) this out on the old ivories. You may well remark that, although the drill press did a magnificent job standing on its own foot henceforth..it wasn't really the same as a full length column, even so. Well so it wasn't..but in the ten years I used it, though I frequently had to turn the table to one side so I could stand tall objects on the base...I never once needed to run the middle table down past the level of the original column!! And y'know, if the need HAD arisen..I would have bought me a six pack an' sloped off down the road to the "Friendly Local Machine Shop"! 8^) teenut foxeye wrote: > > Looking for a 2.75" column for a drill press. I need to get the bench > model off the bench and convert it to floor. The only difference in > the two are the length of the column. Anyone know of a source for a > 2.75" column, of length sufficient for a floor model? Simply a turned > and ground (I think) steel tube, plain on the end, no > holes........anywhere. Its an old Milwaukee Delta from the early > 50's.....with a Hoover 3/4hp motor. > Foxeye > > "Remove nospam to send email" > nospamfoxeye@ddyne.com > foxeye@nospamddyne.com > Just my .02 cents worth! > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Update and body piercings From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 03:01:44 GMT -------- So many people have sent me messages of good will and prayers for a safe recovery that I cannot begin to thank everyone personally..So please bear with me if I use this forum to express my deep gratitide and to bring folks who have enquired, up to date on the situation. I has been confirmed that I have small-cell cancer of the right lung and that it has already spread, beyond surgical reach into the lymph nodes of my center and upper chest. Recent byopsies, A mediastinoscopy, (they cut your throat and shove a tire iron down the inside-front of your ribs (OUCH)!) a bone scan, a liver and brain scan, and another cat scan of my chest show no apparent spread beyond that..So far so good. It means my life expectancy without treatment is currently four to six months..rather than two to four!! Of course I AM going to start immediate treatment. On Wednesday I go for one further test..a bone marrow extraction (OUCH again!) and will have a "Venal Portal" installed under my left collar bone. This is to provide a convenient "Filler Cap" for chemotherapy..the Idea being to dump it straight into a major vein close to the heart so as to protect the smaller veins of my arms etc from the extremely corrosive nature of these concoctions. (Platinum based I understand, plus some other road spill special stuff!!) I will start Chemo on Thursday, I will have it again on Friday and Monday and thence three days every month for the next six months. On Friday I will also start a daily regimen of radiation to my chest and brain. This is a pretty tough regimen to endure..but the first objective is to get into remission and still be alive six months from now! So, I guess I may be feelng a little out of sorts over the next few days. However there is only one acceptable outcome in this fight and there will only be one winner..teenut!!! So watch this space! Meanwhile..speaking of body piercings...I have decided I will be quite disappointed if I don't loose all my hair..Always wanted to let the Barbary Pirate in me loose. So..I am going to shave it all off anyway.. and while I am about it..have my ear pearced for one of my wife's one carat diamond studs!!! Cheers to all, teenut the Pirate ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Flatness Illuminated - Surface Plate (On the level) From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 03:53:42 GMT -------- Bob Maricle wrote: > > Less than 24 hours ago I asked a question (snip) Thank God for the relative anonymity and brief memory of such a > forum as this. Relax Bob, you are among Friends here! Friends who know that this subject is too vast for anyone ever to remain too proud for too long..And understanding enough to give anyone the room and the courtesy, to fall flat on their faces in quiet privacy. Welcome to the Brotherhood of those who strive after the simple truth..And will not settle for less! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Band Saw modifications? Topic change... From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 04:02:07 GMT -------- What you need for re-sawing is not a NARROW blade..but a wide THIN blade, precisely sharpened and set and highly tensioned. I get my "Reslicer" Resaw blades from Highland Hardware in Atlanta GA. A web search should throw up their page wihich has IIRC, a section on resawing. Their blades ain't cheap..but even on my low end Delta Bandsaw with riser blocks I can slice veneers 40 thou, thick a foot wide, from the full length of a Rosewood plank all day long..just set it up according to the "Words and Music" teenut rdanzey@seidata.com wrote: > > I recently saw a reference to resawing wood (I think) with a bandsaw and > it suggested using a very narrow blade in extreme tension--IIRC. I > didn't pay enough attention, and now for the life of me can't find the > site I saw it. I hope someone here might have seen it or know where I > might look to see it again. Sorry for the off topic... > > danz > > In article , > beer@sfu.ca wrote: > > On Mon, 01 May 2000 , P'rfesser > wrote: > > >Hi gang: > > > > > >I bought a friend's cheapie 4x6" bandsaw this weekend. Seem to > recall > > >that there was an URL describing modifications to improve the saw > > >(i.e., fix the stand, etc.) Does anyone have that URL (tried Google > > >on "metal cutting band saw modification" to no avail.) > > > > > >Or am I imagining an URL? Maybe I'm imagining me? > > > > > >I paid $125 for the saw plus a homemade wood lathe. Some might say > > >that was a bit steep. I had heard complaints about the new saws, and > > >figured that a used saw that *definitely* worked wasn't a bad deal. > > > > No worries, guy. I've bought one recently, and while quality is > typically > > Chinese ( large metal CHUNKS and lots of filings in the gearbox, etc. > ), > > this is the tool I've grown to like the most of any in my shop. ( At > the > > same time, I've grown to hate hacksaws ) > > > > Try > > > > http://www.halcyon.com/meretrix/4x6bsFAQ.txt > > > > Alan > > > > -- > > > > Alan Rothenbush | The Spartans do not ask the number of > the > > Academic Computing Services | enemy, only where they are. > > Simon Fraser University | > > Burnaby, B.C., Canada | Agix of Sparta > > > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Positive Mental Attitude From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 02 May 2000 14:54:30 GMT -------- Bill wrote: > My prayers are with you, keep on fighting that SOB with the Scyth and > never give up! Thanks Bill and all of you guys for your Prayers and your encouragement. I have saved and printed over five hundred email messages from every corner of the globe. One day I will give them to my Children to let them know that their Old Man DID make a difference! I have had a plaque over my desk for many years with a quote from Winston Churchill, that reads: "When you are going through Hell...Keep on Going!" The more I learn of Cancer Survivorship (and I HAVE become a bit of a student recently!!) the more I understand that, it really IS a question of positive mental attitude and sheer, bloody minded determination, that usually makes the ultimate difference. This has nothing to do with "wishfull thinking"..you cannot THINK this beast into oblivion. It all has to do with the fact that Modern Medicine DOES have cures available IF you can stand up to them!!! Cancer is such an invidious enemey..a real "Fifth Column"..Kinda like a Viet Cong attack on a US Fire Base where the yanks had to call down friendly fire support ON THEIR OWN HEADS to winkle out the enemy..often taking heavy casualties among their own ranks to achieve victory. Fighting Cancer is a similar battle..The past few weeks have seemed interminable..awaiting the many appointments, operations, procedures, tests, biopsie, evaluations etc while waiting to hear whether one is going to live or die before Fall. But is has NOT been wasted time! It has been a cathartic time of self evaluation and mental preparation. A time to overcome the first shock and disbelief, to let the self pity and despair run its course, to come to terms with the reality of the situation and to gather ones strengths and resourses for the upcoming Battle of a Lifetime!! Yes I am scared..I am going to walk, for a long time, in the Valley of the Shadow of Death!! But I am NOT AFRAID to go where I need to go, to endure what I will have to endure and to KEEP ON DOING IT for as long as it takes to prove I am the MEANEST SOB in the Valley!! I have elected to undergo simultaneous treatments of chemotherapy powerful enough to corrode human tissue and Radiation treatments to my head and chest at the same time! Part of the delay has been the battery of tests and mental evaluations I have been subjected to, in order to determine that I am Mentally and Physically STRONG enough to survive it and to persevere through the pain and misery of it, long enough and OFTEN enough to beat this monster! Bottom line is, that I am EXTREMELY FORTUNATE to be, otherwise in RUDE GOOD HEALTH!!!! My Oncologist says I have a grip on Life.."like a Junk Yard Dog!!" and is willing to allow me to go WAY beyound the normal limits of patient subjection to borderline lethal treatments! So, Yeah! Im Scared! But NOT AFRAID! I am NOT looking forward to the next few months during which I will have to push myself to the brink of death, the limits of pain, and beyond all present concepts of my own determination and endurance...AND KEEP ON KEEPING ON! In the words of Winston Churchill's last and shortest recorded speech...Given at the Commencement Address of Charterwell..his Old Middle School. It was very shortly before his death at a time when he appearead very infrequently in public, and the Worlds Press were gathered to hear what this Magnificent Old Warrior would have to say to a bunch of junior teenage boys, as they prepared to enter Adulthood. He stood in front of his young audience in that characteristic, stooped manner he had. Hands behind his back gathering up his Doctor's Robes, scowling at the boy's upturned faces over his half rimmed glasses and seeming to look deep into the soul of each one in turn, for a looong time before he spoke... And when he did he said (Here in it's entirety).. "Never,(quietly) never, Never(louder) NEVER! (roaring!!) NEVER! I tell you NEVER, NEVER QUIT!!!" teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Apprenticeship in area? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 03 May 2000 02:26:32 GMT -------- > illusion@hickory.net wrote: > > > Actually, it's a very very painful process. Geez! I'm just hoping they don't announce it as a sure-fire cure for Cancer!! ;^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Update and body piercings From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 03 May 2000 03:48:25 GMT -------- Again, thanks to all of you for your messages I a have seen my enemy and it is within!!! I went today to have a high definition CAT scan done of my chest so that on Friday they will dial me in on the Radiation Treatment Machine to very precise co-ordinates..Getting ready to call down Friendly Fire on my own position!! Six weeks ago it tooa very keen, trained eye to spot the lesion. Not now! It is as big as my fist with a couple of outreaching fingers that go clear across my lung. My windpipe is completely enveloped and the center mass of Lymph Nodes in my chest is completely involved. Easy to see why it is non-operable! I am amazed that I remain symptom free..no cough since my pneumonia cleared, no pain or discomfort whatsoever, no difficulty breathing..It is easy to see why this is such a fast and deadly killer! At this rate I would have been dead within two months and probably may not have been diagnosed until the last week or so. Thank God for Georgia Pollen and my dear Wife who came home from school early and insisted on taking my protesting butt to the emergency room. Thank God for a wide awake Radiologist there, that spotted "something not right"..Those X-Rays and Cat scans were subsequently reviewed at my Father-in-Laws Clinic by some of the top Radiologists and Oncologists in North America..Not one of them was prepared to make a call on it at that stage!! Somebody up there decided to give me a second chance! Hey! Guess what? I get free valet parking now, every time I go to the Cancer Center..Never get that in Canaderrr! More needles tomorrow..Bone Marrow aspiration, and then they implant the "port" in my chest. Take care. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: white canes. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 03 May 2000 03:55:31 GMT -------- Take 'em to your local Golf Pro shop..they will zip them on in seconds..I'll be surprised if they charge you a dime considering the cause! teenut > >>On Mon, 01 May 2000 17:00:03 -0700, Steve Knight > >>wrote: > >> > >>>But getting the grip on is something else. they just look way to small > >>>to slip over the end of the shaft. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Parting tool trouble From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 02:57:59 GMT -------- eberlein wrote: > > I routinely use a cutoff tool to start a groove into a solid bar supported by the > tailstock, and then complete the cut with a hand held hack saw. Probably lousy > technique, but the groove prevents the hack saw from jumping out of the cut. Using > a high spindle speed makes the hack saw cut relatively easily. I disengage the > tailstock before the cut is complete (usually, but not always). Part falls right > off the tailstock when cut is done. Haven't broken anything yet, tho' I doubt > Teenut would approve of the method. > I'll guarantee teenut would sniff at the very idea!! In my "Bob" days I once fired a kid for using a hacksaw on the lathe! Mind you..he did leave six saw scars in the previously pristine, hand scraped bed of a VERY expensive toolroom lathe!! If I hadn't fired him I would have killed him! I did rehire him the following Monday though..he turned out to be one of the best Tradesmen I ever trained and went on to become the Toolroom Superintendant of a major Aerospace Contractor. First you have to get their attention! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: metalwork and oncology From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 03:54:23 GMT -------- One of the many questions I have been asked frequently, when registering with a new Specialist is "Have you ever been exposed to known carcinogens" My usual reply of "Yeh. Hundreds" is usually met with disbelief..until I reel a few off...I have waded knee deep in PCBs, worked downwind of the source of the biggest ever UK Dioxin scare, I have chipped endless feet of asbestos lagging off steam pipes, built asbestos board tool sheds, Fired off hundreds of 1,1,1, Trico Fire extinguishers as thhe Export Director ot Englands biggest manufacturer, worked inside scores of charged up, trico laiden Drycleaning machines.as a sevice engineer for the manufacturer, ditto in Dye Plants with some REALLY "iffy" heavy organic chemicals... Two packs of Camels a day for forty years seems almost co-incidental! teenut (Sore as hell tonight after a day of bone marrow aspirations and the surgical implanting of a "port" in my shoulder. It remains in my shoulder, covered by a plastic cup to protect the needle they left in place ready for a 9.00 AM first session with chemotherapy) mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article <39103C41.B73ED128@ts-art.com>, > tsns@ts-art.com wrote: > > > What is in that Cutting Fluid? > > How about that parts washer? > > what about the grinder dust, the electrode smoke... > > My mom's a nursing specialist at Sloan-Kettering. She notices a large > percentage of folks who work with sovlents, paints, and so on. A real > correlation. For the past years I've tried to restrict my exposure > to as many solvents as possible, and use gloves, etc to minimize > whatever contact does happen. > > > the list goes on. Sure there are MSDS sheets now and it helps to know > > more. However, my impression of the latest views on cancer, is that it > > is a product of our modern age, and more often a result not only of > > genetic factors, but compounded multiple 'insults' to the body.Like > > smoking,and and other exposures combined. > > Althought of course to be accuarate one has to consider that back in > the 'good old days' before antibiotics and modern sanitation, most > folks died before they were 2 years old. And once one was an adult, > the life ended on average by 40 or so. So the disease that took longer > than that to develop never made any appearance. > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: KNURLING ALUMINUM From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 04 May 2000 04:07:29 GMT -------- Wire brush as you go! teenut John Jacobs wrote: > > What's the best way to keep the knurling wheels clean while knurling > aluminum? I have a job that requires very crisp, clean knurls. Oil? > Kerosene? Coolant? Thanks in advance. > John Jacobs ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: metalwork and oncology From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 05 May 2000 01:38:03 GMT -------- I am in Atlanta GA and if I need some weed I can score from any of the kids getting off the local school bus!!! Or any one of my employees..all seem to have adequate sources. Or my Wife can confiscate some at her school. Or my Oncologist will write me a prescription!! As it is, the drugs the have now do a remarkeable job (So they should alt $160.00 for two tablets a day!!) I was able to go straight from an eight hour chemo session to my local Pub and have a prime rib and three pints of Caffreys..no problem! The beginning of the session WAS a problem though..the needle left in my port aftert surgery yesterday proved to me the wrong type and had clogged. So they had to remove it and replace with a fresh one...three times before they hit it!! This thing is 3/4" below the surface and very swollen for the surgery..VERY tender too! They have to probe and poke to get the needle exactly into the right place. I thought the Bone Marrow Aspiration, yesterday, was sweet agony..this had it beat by an order of magnitude!!! Still, we got through it, and that needle will remain in place now for the next three sessions on Friday and Monday. Thanks for all your scores of messages guys..I feel unbeatable! teenut Mike Slowey wrote: > > Teenut, > > I'm a newbie to this NG and I sincerely sympatize with your condition. > Both my father and my father-in-law had similar conditions. If I read > your messages correctly, it appears you are in the UK. If you can > score some cannabis it may help with your Chemotherapy side-effects. > If this is a controlled substance in your country, then maybe a trip > across the channel to the Netherlands would get you some assistance in > your struggle. > > Prayers and best wishes to you. > > Mike Slowey > > On Thu, 04 May 2000 03:54:23 GMT, Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ > hotmail.com> wrote: > > >One of the many questions I have been asked frequently, when registering with a > >new Specialist is "Have you ever been exposed to known carcinogens" > > > >My usual reply of "Yeh. Hundreds" is usually met with disbelief..until I reel a > >few off...I have waded knee deep in PCBs, worked downwind of the source of the > >biggest ever UK Dioxin scare, I have chipped endless feet of asbestos lagging > >off steam pipes, built asbestos board tool sheds, Fired off hundreds of 1,1,1, > >Trico Fire extinguishers as thhe Export Director ot Englands biggest > >manufacturer, worked inside scores of charged up, trico laiden Drycleaning > >machines.as a sevice engineer for the manufacturer, ditto in Dye Plants with > >some REALLY "iffy" heavy organic chemicals... > > > >Two packs of Camels a day for forty years seems almost co-incidental! > > > >teenut > > > >(Sore as hell tonight after a day of bone marrow aspirations and the surgical > >implanting of a "port" in my shoulder. It remains in my shoulder, covered by a > >plastic cup to protect the needle they left in place ready for a 9.00 AM first > >session with chemotherapy) > > > >mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > >> > >> In article <39103C41.B73ED128@ts-art.com>, > >> tsns@ts-art.com wrote: > >> > >> > What is in that Cutting Fluid? > >> > How about that parts washer? > >> > what about the grinder dust, the electrode smoke... > >> > >> My mom's a nursing specialist at Sloan-Kettering. She notices a large > >> percentage of folks who work with sovlents, paints, and so on. A real > >> correlation. For the past years I've tried to restrict my exposure > >> to as many solvents as possible, and use gloves, etc to minimize > >> whatever contact does happen. > >> > >> > the list goes on. Sure there are MSDS sheets now and it helps to know > >> > more. However, my impression of the latest views on cancer, is that it > >> > is a product of our modern age, and more often a result not only of > >> > genetic factors, but compounded multiple 'insults' to the body.Like > >> > smoking,and and other exposures combined. > >> > >> Althought of course to be accuarate one has to consider that back in > >> the 'good old days' before antibiotics and modern sanitation, most > >> folks died before they were 2 years old. And once one was an adult, > >> the life ended on average by 40 or so. So the disease that took longer > >> than that to develop never made any appearance. > >> > >> Jim > >> > >> Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > >> Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Acceptance Stamps: How are they made? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 06 May 2000 02:08:06 GMT -------- Typically made on 3D pantograph engraving machines..Deckel in Germany, Alexanderin G Britain, Gorton in the USA. They will take a master pattern and reproduce it exactly to any smaller scale. A simillar but older machine, used for coins and medal dies is called a "Medallion Lathe" This has two spindles, geared together. One carries the master, one the die to be cut. I nthis cas the linkage is designed not just to cut a reduced patern but a mirror image if required. In either case the original masters are engraved, very skilfuly by hand..the Masters may then be copied to produce "Working Masters" which are actually then used to produce the finished dies and stamps. teenut Randy O'Brian wrote: > > An area of tool making I have never seen addressed is how those little > stamps are made. For example, German WW1-2 > military friearms have several tiny inspection/acceptance stamps on them. > They are usually about 1/8"-3/16"" across and show an a spread eagle(several > different designs) with 2 or 3 tiny numbers underneath. There is a good > amount of detail in the eagle alone. Since tens of thousands of them were > made in hardened steel, there had to have been a significant stamp making > effort. What were the techniques and tools used to make them? I don't > believe they used EDM. 8^) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Internal threading idea? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 06 May 2000 02:19:05 GMT -------- I have never tried it Kevin..simply because, in my Day and World, threading inserts were ten a penny and single edge thread milling inserts were unheard of!! However...It sounds like a GOOD IDEA..it I ever need to add another size to my collection I will try it out. teenut Kevin wrote: > > Gentlemen; > > I read a earlier post about using geometric threading die inserts for > cutting threads on a lathe. I was interested in trying this but the > price on new inserts seems very high and used inserts are unavailable > in this area. Does anyone see any problem with using a mill threading > insert? New ones appear to be significantly cheaper, and I cannot see > any real difference except for the way the inserts are attached to the > toolholder. A different insert would still be required for each pitch, > and it looks like it would be more easily mounted to a toolbar than the > geometric threading inserts. > > * Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet's Discussion Network * > The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet - Free! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Need Ideas to Solve a Problem - Help From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 06 May 2000 02:22:08 GMT -------- Soapy water! teenut Bachman wrote: > > I need some ideas to solve a problem for one of my customers. > > I need to turn a 3” dia. rubber sleeve inside out. The sleeve is about > 12” long with about a 1/8” wall thickness. It is molded rubber with a > stretchable fabric in the sidewall. The outside surface of the sleeve > has a slight texture, but the inside is smooth. These smooth surfaces tend > to stick to each other when I try to roll/slide the sleeve down over itself > to invert it. I have tried sealing the ends and inflating the sleeve, > then pushing the ends towards each other. I can get the it roll down > over itself half way but then the two ends come together and of course > the ends can’t pass each other so that won’t work. > > I am open to all ideas. Push, pull, stretch, inflate, twist, or blow it. > Been puzzleing over this one for months with no workable solution. The > customer’s employees are turning these things inside out by hand which > is a real struggle - hard on the hands and time consuming. They want a > machine to do the job. > > Ideas??? > > Thanks, > > Bob ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Where to buy Dividing Head and Rotary Table? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 08 May 2000 21:31:41 GMT -------- Hmm. I still have no Idea where J&L is in Atlanta..nor have they ever sent me a catalogue..Consequently I get everything from MSC and McMaster-Carr.(Who HAVE sent me a catalogue) and even Travers Tool. Where ARE J&L?? teenut Gary Coffman wrote: > > On 07 May 2000 22:22:51 GMT, gjrepesh@aol.com (GJRepesh) wrote: > >I use J & L in Dallas, TX. There is no minimum charge that I am aware of and > >they seem to go out of their way to help me. Maybe each store manager gets to > >make their own policies. Any other cities care to respond? > > The folks at the Atlanta J&L are a pure pleasure to deal with. They don't > enforce any minimum, are willing to order in things just so you can look > at them, etc. If you can stump them, which is rare, they'll put you on the > phone with Barbara in Charlotte (a J&L regional warehouse), who appears > to know the details about every item in their catalog, and where to find > things that aren't in their catalog. (My last talk with her was about flood > coolants, she told me more than I thought there was to know about them, > then told me J&L doesn't carry the one I should use and directed me to > the folks who do.) > > Best of all, if a counter person is helping you, they are helping *you*. > They don't answer the phone or deal with another customer until > they satisfy you. (I hate it when a counter person gives priority to > the telephone.) Great people, great service. They are my first choice > for anything I might need. > > MSC is my second choice, and no poor second either. They've also > been extremely helpful, and since their regional warehouse is here, > they have virtually everything they sell in stock. J&L does often have > to ship out of Charlotte. But they'll do it as a store transfer so you > don't have to pay shipping, if you're willing to come back and pick > it up. I do that a lot. (They know that's good business because I > virtually always buy something else when I go into the store to pick > up my order.) > > Gary > Gary Coffman KE4ZV | You make it |mail to ke4zv@bellsouth.net > 534 Shannon Way | We break it | > Lawrenceville, GA | Guaranteed | ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Typical US Service From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 09 May 2000 00:37:16 GMT -------- I sent out a request for gundrilling systems that I need to fit to a new CNC Lathe. Out of six requests I received this ONE reply: "Robert In reference to your request for quote for a complete gundrilling system. I will have to no quote that, I just supply the tools and accessories. Ruth Alt" My response was: "So quote the tools and accessories you DO have..DUH!! I still need to drill the damned Holes!!" SHHEESHH!! teenut PS A request to a site in Taiwain brought me a quote for a complete add-on Gundrilling system with pumps, resevoirs, drill guides, steadies, drivers, dampers, chip boxes drills, grinders, etc. Makes you wonder. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Sort of OT: Messed up piece. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 09 May 2000 00:58:36 GMT -------- I think part of you problem might be in trying to use mixed measuring systems. Taking of 2.3MM to arrive at a size of 2.500" is asking for insanity!! Decided on one system or the other. If you lathe indecices are in metric, convert you finished size to metric and use a metric mic to measure progress. Be sure you know whether the cross-slide index reads off DIAMETER or RADIUS!! There are no hard and fast rules..That one single nuance has brought more good turners to grief and hair tearing than any other. I convert all my lathes to DIRECT RADIUS reading so that there is no mistake in the shop. Go forth and try again...Think three times, measure twice, cut once. In a few years you will get it right (almost) every time!! Never QUIT! ;^) teenut "[©ØMMÄÑУ®]" wrote: > > Hello group, > > Do you ever have one of those days where things just don't want to go your > way? Today was one of those days. I am doing a project on Selective Laser > Sintering, and machining all the parts for it in the school machine shop. > Well, today I was attempting to put a 2.5" dia hole in a 5"X3"X0.75" Al > plate. So how do I do this? 4 jaw chuck, of course :) BTW, I've never used a > 4 jaw before. Anyway, it takes about, say ~20min so set the dang part in the > 4 jaw where I want it. OK, that's done. The part had already been centre > drilled so I use the live centre to get it right (within ~10 thou, good > enough for that part). So I web drill with a 0.2" drill, then drill with a > 55/64" drill, and that's as big as I can get (drilling) with the tail stock > on that machine. > > Now comes the boring bar. 0.5" increments from 55/64ths --> 2.497" (press > fit for a 2.496" steel cylinder). OK, so it takes a fair amount of time to > get the part to within ~2.9mm of the finish diameter. OK. I figure I'll take > off 2mm, measure, and do 1 or 2 more finishing cuts (I measured after taking > 3 passes without touching the cross feed, because the boring bar was > bending. I had a nice finish and the cutter was no longer touching.) So I > take off the 2mm (3 passes without touching the cross for the final cut). So > I measure agian. > > Well what do I find? 2.530" ID! @$#^%$!!!!!!!!!!!! > > AHHHHHHHHH! > > Anyway, I now have to do the whole thing again... > > Thanks for listening... Just had to vent :) > > Robin ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Serious US Metalwork From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 09 May 2000 01:44:36 GMT -------- Absolutely no ax to grind here..except as a previous very satisfied and frequent buyer from Kenny. For some one looking for a seriously nice chunk of US metalwork at a fair price.take a look at this. http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=325405211 teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT : Gun Siezed at Toronto Airport From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 09 May 2000 05:40:56 GMT -------- Shouldn'nt that penultimate line read: c m b d bd is (see 'em blink dere beady eyes)? teenut Howard Bailey wrote: > > On Mon, 08 May 2000 23:50:41 GMT, Eddy Wells > wrote: > > >I jis love it when you yankee boys try ta copy us...Hee Hee! > > > >It's plane ole WARS, not wores....Makes me thank of a few wimin > >I've nown ......An while Ima thanking about it....It's YALL (one word) > >an not Y'all.....That sounds lack "YeeeAll" ta me....(LOL) > > > >Eddy Wells > >Texas > > > > m r ducks > m r not ducks > r 2 > c m e d b d feet > l i be, m r ducks ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Where to buy Dividing Head and Rotary Table? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 09 May 2000 13:55:42 GMT -------- Thanks for the Directions..next time my Driver is over that way I will ask him to pick up a copy. (I am at South Cobb Drive and 285) I suspect MSC will still be supplier of choice as they are only about 3/4 mile down the road from the shop. We are still at the stage where most tool purchases are made when something goes "Bang" so speed is of the essence. teenut Gary Coffman wrote: > > On Mon, 08 May 2000 21:31:41 GMT, Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > >Hmm. > > > >I still have no Idea where J&L is in Atlanta..nor have they ever sent me a > >catalogue..Consequently I get everything from MSC and McMaster-Carr.(Who HAVE > >sent me a catalogue) and even Travers Tool. > > > >Where ARE J&L?? > > 4220 Steve Reynolds Boulevard. Go north on I-85 to Beaver Ruin Rd, go east on > Beaver Ruin to Steve Reynolds, turn right (south) on Steve Reynolds, and they > are on your left about a half a block from the intersection. They usually have a > stack of catalogs by the door. Once you buy something, you'll get flyers about > every 2 weeks, and new catalogs as they come out too. Their catalog is also > online at www.jlindustrial.com > > Gary > Gary Coffman KE4ZV | You make it |mail to ke4zv@bellsouth.net > 534 Shannon Way | We break it | > Lawrenceville, GA | Guaranteed | ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Tool Sharpening Text???? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 02:44:40 GMT -------- Garry wrote: > > Well if you cn't find the post I am not sure you can do a drill. > > I am reposting it here below as it is a classic I think. I do not > think Teenut will mind the repost and sure hope he doesn't. It is also > available in Deja News under drill sharpening just as I stated. > > It really should be put in the faq as well as posted to the drop box. > Robert would you you allow it to be posted to the drop box.. > > The text of the original message follows...The good stuff starts at a > about the point > "6 Million Dollar Bionic Darex" ;^) Feel free to use any of my stuff anyway it will benefit anyone. A lot of (Now gone) old timers spent a lot of time and patience teaching me the easy way to do things right, and I welcome any opportunity to pass it on. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT : Gun Siezed at Toronto Airport From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 02:57:50 GMT -------- eberlein wrote: > PS. Really want a interesting trip? Fly into Montreal from the US and forget your > passport/birth certificate. Makes "cluster f**k" take on new meaning! Want a REAL interesting trip!! Fly into Tripoli Libya without the ability to read AND fill out the pages of entry forms in ARABIC..no they WON'T help you! YES I could..but it took three hours to get it right for them! Bastards!! Or Fly into Afghanistan without a valid visa! Yes they WILL put you in a holding cell, under armed guard, and put you on the next flight out regardless of destination..in my case Sofia, Bulgaria, on Aeroflot! Flew right back in the following day to be met this time and cleared through, by the British Embassy wallah that was supposed to meet me the first time! Bastards!! One day I will write a book!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Cancelling video air pistol From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 03:05:45 GMT -------- Someone, who really ought to know better wrote: > XXXX XXXX is one of those guys who people laugh at and read his posts and > >shake their heads. We behave better than that towards people on this newsgroup! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: New Import vs Used American- What is better? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 03:17:37 GMT -------- The Ford purchase of Jaguar was the best thing that ever happened to Jag. The quality is now superb..even though they pinched the original "E-Type" replacement prototype and gave it to Aston Martin! There is a definite tendency to blend the styling of Ford and Jaguar..It pisses my buddies at the local Jaf dealership every time I pop in and ask them how the new "Jaguar Taurus" is selling!! (The "S Type") But I have my sights set on a new XKR as my "Remission Gift" A RED one to match the bald head, red bandanna and 3/4 carat stud in my LEFT ear!! "Arrest me red"..like who gives a f**k anymore!! teenut the Emergent PLAlbrecht wrote: > > >Well at least we can console ourselves that Rover cars are British > >once again. > > Sorry, I can't resist, I think this is pretty funny. A few years ago the > British press was all upset because those feelthy Germans were buying up all > the British car companies. Now the British press is all upset because those > feelthy Germans are selling all the British car companies... > > The obvious next stage is that the British press will be all upset because > nobody is buying the British car companies. > > The machiavellian goings-on at BMW are pretty funny too. The whole Rover fiasco > has cost at least two generations of CEOs (and therefore their cronies) their > jobs, with I think the third generation about to go to the chopping block. I > have a pretty good idea who the next CEO is going to be but I can't say > anything as his current company is one of my clients... > > Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: New Import vs Used American- What is better? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 03:21:43 GMT -------- I do know that I lusted after a brand new Myford from my late teenage years..and the price in 1960 pounds was just as out of reach as it is in 2000 dollars!! Good quality was never "Cheap" teenut PLAlbrecht wrote: > > >>You know, I've wondered about this a lot. I know a 90+ year old guy who > bought his > Logan from Montgomery Wards new. > > If you can get a year and an accurate price, we can crunch some numbers > together. You or I can get figures on median income or per-capita salary or > whatever for that year from the library, and I can get you prices of a bunch of > regular American cars. Spreadsheet time. Really, this could be interesting. > "How long did Joe Lunchbox have to work for (a) an average four-door full-size > sedan and (b) for a decent American-made lathe?" For that matter if we just get > a year, Scott Logan can probably tell us what retail was. > > >I do have a "deal finder" aquaintence who > >sold a minty Atlas bechtop horizontal mill for $100 because "they're junk." > > I don't think so, but even if they were, they're worth 800 and up to somebody > else. I'm happy with mine for what I do with it. Somebody sold a very nice one > on Ebay a few weeks ago with all the accessories for something in the 700s I > think, but wouldn't ship (in Miami). I think you need to keep bugging your > friend. He may throw out more "junk" if he remembers you. > > <>>That is one heck of a good question. Anybody got a kid in college studying > business? Sounds like an interesting project in business viability or modelling > or > something. > > I don't know how it works in the machine tool industry, but when I worked in > the automotive components industry, I saw what it actually cost us to make > diesel injection pumps, and what they cost retail. It's a factor of five > between mfg cost and street price. OK, so assume that's still true for machine > tools. Figure the $2500 Chinese lathe cost them $500 to make. That means > they're buying their castings for way less than a buck a pound (machine must > weigh 500 lbs at least), and machining them, and assembling them, and still > investing less than $500 total FOB the factory. Profits for factory, shipping, > U.S. distributor go on top of that. > > There's no way a U.S. manufacturer can even get the raw castings for $500, not > even if he casts himself. Then there's still the bought-in parts. A decent > American electric motor is not going to cost less than $100. The factory needs > to buy the motor and mark up its price as part of the complete machine (they > don't just pass on their cost for bought-in parts; they can't). Maybe they get > a quantity discount but that's about the motor price ballpark. Now add in a > decent (say Bison) 3-jaw, a few centers, reversing drum switch, whatnot... > > Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: New Import vs Used American- What is better? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 03:27:11 GMT -------- They are like Hens Teeth in Atlanta..and REAL proud of their stuff! Then again, compared with other cities of like size this has VERY few machine shops and VERY few HSM's teenut mact wrote: > > I figured that a city with 3 million people would have several machine dealers in > or > around town. I live 325 miles from dallas and there is bunches and bunches of > machines for sale in or around dallas. I guess the people in San Diego are too busy > > enjoying the weather to use a machine or they are too busy importing them. > > "Bob S." wrote: > > > On 08 May 2000 20:43:56 GMT, plalbrecht@aol.com (PLAlbrecht) wrote: > > > > >All this means is that you have to look at 11 lathes. I can do that in one day > > >if I set my mind to it and spend some time driving from Santa Fe Ave. in LA > > >down to San Diego, hitting all the usual suspects on the way. > > > > Don't bother driving to San Diego the used machinery dealers down here > > (all 2 of them) think their stuff is gold plated. Occasionally there > > is an interesting private offering but certainly not every week more > > like every month or two. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Sort of OT: Messed up piece. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 03:44:50 GMT -------- "[©ØMMÄÑУ®]" wrote: > > Success is mine! I think it was cooling down and contracting, but I have > no idea. BINGO!! The one solution no-one hit on..and the most obvious!! If it was cooling down, rest assured is WAS contracting..and to a significant degree. ALWAYS let the work piece cool down before taking critical measurements or final cuts..this is one of the MAIN reasons for using flood coolant in Industrial Machining..to keep the work piece at a constant temperature/size. The effect on aluminum is more drastic than on steel..but just a few degrees will totally screw up a bearing fit in any material!! Betcher won't forget that one in a hurry! NEXT! (There's lots more..but you are learning fast!) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Detroit area help From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 03:52:25 GMT -------- There is a wonderful one..one of the largest and most active in the world!! Toronto Society of Model Engineers..TISME for short. I used to be an active member but have lost the contact details..others on the list will fill you in though. Go join them and tell them Robert Bastow sent you! It won't get you free membership but I know one or two old hands may remember me with some affection! teenut "[©ØMMÄÑУ®]" wrote: > > Speaking of machining clubs, is there one in Toronto? > > Thanks, > > Robin > > "Brian Lawson" wrote in message > news:3928b6ae.145864007@snews.mnsi.net... > > > > Hey Michael, > > > > Next meeting of the Metropolitan Detroit Metalworking Club (MDMC) will > > be Wednesday May 17, 2000, at the Old Firehall at the Historic Burgh > > centre, at 7:00pm. Historic Burgh Centre is at Berg Road and Civic > > Center Drive, in Southfield, (in the Telegraph Rd. - M10 area.) > > Great bunch of guys. Come on out and make you self known, and I'm > > sure that there will be someone from your area. > > > > Brian Lawson > > Windsor, Ontario > > > > On Tue, 09 May 2000 03:46:09 GMT, "Michael D. Lindner" > > wrote: > > > > >Hi there, > > > > > >Allow me to introduce myself. My name is Mike Lindner. I've been > lurking > > >for a few weeks and have learned a bit, and have also gone through some > of > > >the FAQ as time permits. I'm not yet able to understand everything, as I > am > > >completely new to metalworking. > > > > > >I just purchased a rebuilt/reconditioned Atlas 12" precision lathe and > I'm > > >picking it up this weekend. If you want to see it, there's a link off my > > >webpage: > > >http://www.thepiperack.com/images/lathe1.jpg > > > > > >The problem is this: I have no idea about the basics of how you actually > > >*use* a lathe. So, my two questions are this: > > > > > >1. Can anyone recommend a good book for the layman that would be a > good > > >intro into using a precision lathe? > > > > > >2. I understand that the Detroit area has a metalworking club, which I > am > > >going to look into. I am wondering if there are any members (or > > >non-members!) in the Auburn Hills/Rochester/Troy area who might be > willing > > >to come over and show a newbie around his new toy. > > > > > >Return address is shown below, or respond directly to the newsgroup - I > read > > >it daily. > > > > > >Thanks in advance, > > > > > >Michael Lindner > > >www.thepiperack.com > > > > > >returnpath is full of Neanderthals, but happy bunnies may be found at: > > >sasieni (at) pobox (dot) com > > > > > > > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Gun Barrels??? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 04:09:30 GMT -------- Do a deja news search..this subject was covered ad nauseum in the VERY recent past. Border Barrels have a web site with excellent coverage of the subject..do a search on "rifling" you will find scores of good and bad references! teenut andy wrote: > > Can anyone explain to me how the rifled bore of a gun barrel is machined? > any interesting gunsmithing links etc??? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: New Import vs Used American- What is better? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 04:20:31 GMT -------- ARRRGH!! A POX ON YOU DARBY!! I intend to outlive you so I can steal it from your starving widow!! Enjoy;^) teenut BillDarby wrote: > > Occasionally, it is Robert!! > > Tool gloat > > Yes! This morning I picked up a 30 year old Myford Super 7 lathe and I have > spent the entire day > unpacking the chucks, milling attachment and accessories from their original boxes > and removing the > rust preservative. It is truly hard to believe that a man would have such a fine > machine for so many > years and not even connect a power cable to the motor and do a bit of turning. ( it > sure looks good in my > shop) Everything is pristine (virginal even!!) not even a scratch on the paint work. > The ways are > "perfect" and I just know that when I spun the 3 jaw on, it was the first time ever. > > I have never used a Myford (never seen one other then a photo). It almost looks > to pretty to use. > > Bill Darby Good luck Robert. > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > I do know that I lusted after a brand new Myford from my late teenage years..and > > the price in 1960 pounds was just as out of reach as it is in 2000 dollars!! > > Good quality was never "Cheap" > > > > teenut > > > > PLAlbrecht wrote: > > > > > > >>You know, I've wondered about this a lot. I know a 90+ year old guy who > > > bought his > > > Logan from Montgomery Wards new. > > > > > > If you can get a year and an accurate price, we can crunch some numbers > > > together. You or I can get figures on median income or per-capita salary or > > > whatever for that year from the library, and I can get you prices of a bunch of > > > regular American cars. Spreadsheet time. Really, this could be interesting. > > > "How long did Joe Lunchbox have to work for (a) an average four-door full-size > > > sedan and (b) for a decent American-made lathe?" For that matter if we just get > > > a year, Scott Logan can probably tell us what retail was. > > > > > > >I do have a "deal finder" aquaintence who > > > >sold a minty Atlas bechtop horizontal mill for $100 because "they're junk." > > > > > > I don't think so, but even if they were, they're worth 800 and up to somebody > > > else. I'm happy with mine for what I do with it. Somebody sold a very nice one > > > on Ebay a few weeks ago with all the accessories for something in the 700s I > > > think, but wouldn't ship (in Miami). I think you need to keep bugging your > > > friend. He may throw out more "junk" if he remembers you. > > > > > > <>>That is one heck of a good question. Anybody got a kid in college studying > > > business? Sounds like an interesting project in business viability or modelling > > > or > > > something. > > > > > > I don't know how it works in the machine tool industry, but when I worked in > > > the automotive components industry, I saw what it actually cost us to make > > > diesel injection pumps, and what they cost retail. It's a factor of five > > > between mfg cost and street price. OK, so assume that's still true for machine > > > tools. Figure the $2500 Chinese lathe cost them $500 to make. That means > > > they're buying their castings for way less than a buck a pound (machine must > > > weigh 500 lbs at least), and machining them, and assembling them, and still > > > investing less than $500 total FOB the factory. Profits for factory, shipping, > > > U.S. distributor go on top of that. > > > > > > There's no way a U.S. manufacturer can even get the raw castings for $500, not > > > even if he casts himself. Then there's still the bought-in parts. A decent > > > American electric motor is not going to cost less than $100. The factory needs > > > to buy the motor and mark up its price as part of the complete machine (they > > > don't just pass on their cost for bought-in parts; they can't). Maybe they get > > > a quantity discount but that's about the motor price ballpark. Now add in a > > > decent (say Bison) 3-jaw, a few centers, reversing drum switch, whatnot... > > > > > > Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: New Import vs Used American- What is better? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 08:40:28 GMT -------- IIRC Rover campaigned a gas turbine GT at LeMans..quite succesfully. I believe class changes or the way air intake size was interpreted shut turbines out of that class of racing..before they took command of the field!! The French Automobile Club de l'Ouest always were sore losers! teenut timleech wrote: > > On Tue, 09 May 2000 23:22:40 GMT, inet@intellisys.net (brian whatcott) > wrote: > > > > >I saw a gas turbine Rover once. I think it was a modified Rover 90 > >body - as a drop head. > > With VW like air grilles in the rear boot area - very elegant > >looking. Avtur-guzzler, I think. > > > > It is (or was, IIRC, must still be somewhere around) in the Science > Museum in London. Based on the early 'Cyclops' version of the 60/75/90 > etc body shape. > I've seen film of it in action. I have a feeling they built another > turbine car somewhat later, may be wrong. > > Tim > Who drove a 1947 Rover 12 drophead tourer in the 70's, and wishes he > still had it. > > Tim Leech > Dutton Dry-Dock > timleech@dutondok.u-net.com > > Traditional & Modern canal craft repairs ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Shapers From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 13:49:27 GMT -------- That IS a tasty machine!! Even though I have three..at that price I'm tempted to give it a good home! Some HSM needs to grab this..even if you currently believe shapers went out with the Ark..Trust me, it will rapidly become your new right hand!! teenut Gunner wrote: > > Check Ebay for some NICE shapers. > > Some lucky bugger in the east can get this one: > > http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=325582935 > > gunner > --------------------------------------------------------- > > "A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an > invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write > a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort > the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, > solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program > a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die > gallantly. Specialization is for insects." Robert Heinlein > > Free Hobby Buy/Swap/Sell Website > www.cyberg8t.com/gunner/hsm/index.html > > Home Page > http://userzweb.lightspeed.net/gunner ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Shapers From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 13:54:31 GMT -------- God only knows what a table like that would cost to produce in the USA today..More than some large CNC mills!! In fact..grafted onto a "Tombstone" it would be a hell of an accessory for a large, horizontal, or even Vertical CNC Machining Center Hmmm!! teenut Tom Martin wrote: > > Absolutely! I'd like the table! > > Gunner wrote: > > > > Check Ebay for some NICE shapers. > > > > Some lucky bugger in the east can get this one: > > > > http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=325582935 > > > > gunner > > --------------------------------------------------------- > > > > "A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an > > invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write > > a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort > > the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, > > solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program > > a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die > > gallantly. Specialization is for insects." Robert Heinlein > > > > Free Hobby Buy/Swap/Sell Website > > www.cyberg8t.com/gunner/hsm/index.html > > > > Home Page > > http://userzweb.lightspeed.net/gunner ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Shapers From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 13:59:28 GMT -------- Well, Folks are not as dumb as they appear! I just bid it up to $200.00 and was outbid. Set me off looking for one locally though! teenut Tom Martin wrote: > > Absolutely! I'd like the table! > > Gunner wrote: > > > > Check Ebay for some NICE shapers. > > > > Some lucky bugger in the east can get this one: > > > > http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=325582935 > > > > gunner > > --------------------------------------------------------- > > > > "A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an > > invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write > > a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort > > the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, > > solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program > > a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die > > gallantly. Specialization is for insects." Robert Heinlein > > > > Free Hobby Buy/Swap/Sell Website > > www.cyberg8t.com/gunner/hsm/index.html > > > > Home Page > > http://userzweb.lightspeed.net/gunner ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 3/4-28 NPT double start threads From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 14:12:49 GMT -------- I think you're going to un-necessary complication.and will finish with a weak and non-durable joining system. Better to stick to solid plugs, no threads. Make the fixed end a shrink or glue fit in its tube. Split the other "Male" end and arrange a tapered headed expander plug..a regular 5/16 cap screw with modified head will do..such that when you twist the two tubes together, the screw is caused to expand the plug to a snug fit. Threads cut directly into the side wall of your tubing will wear rapidly..and stretch like crazy, first wiff of side loading they get!! Even chrome moly tube would be an iffy proposition for the system you propose! K.I.S.S. teenut DGoncz wrote: > > I am working on some telescoping tubing in sizes 7/8, 3/4, 5/8, and 1/2 inch. > It is fairly ordinary material, aluminum, 6061-T6 I think, with a mill finish > outside and a remarkably smooth bore. Drawn over mandrel, I think they call it. > With the mandrel being part of an extruder. The walls are .059, near the 1/16 > required for nesting. > > I'd like to machine the ends to stack and also to nest. In other words, one end > of each needs to be male, and the other female tapered threads to stack. And to > nest, each end would be fitted with a slotted cap or plug of the same diameter > tubing, allowing expansion within the next larger size with a cap, or > compression onto the next smaller size with a plug, like a collet. > > I'd like to retain compatibility with any other existing threads so I thought > why not a double start NPT (National Pipe Taper) thread? That should allow a > 3/4 inch pipe fitting to be screwed on or into the 7/8 tubing size. The second > start would fit between the threads that actually mated. The assembly doesn't > need to hold pressure, it'd just be handy to screw on a floor flange to a > telescoping tube, or a couper to the end of a long pole to add weight. I guess > with this thin wall it'd be around a schedule 10 or 20, and I know there are no > schedules that low. In PVC pipe there is a schedule 20, I think. > > Such a double start thread has 28 crests per inch, but actually only 14 threads > per inch. I think... How does that go again? > > I'm ready to buy a lathe if there's no other way to do this, and I am pretty > sure there isn't. An extremely complicated single purpose machine might be set > up from collet indexers and existing 14 tpi NPT dies and taps, but... I'd just > be building a lathe from scratch. Why bother? > > Sherline has a small lathe with pivoting headstock and a threading attachement. > Matching the taper would be tricky. Taig has a moveable cross slide, I think, > but no threading. And the HF mini lathe does threads but can't rotate the > headstock. > > What might be involved with adding a taper attachment to the HF lathe? > > You don't think I should go for a triple start at 42 tpi, should I? > > Any small lathe with steady rest and taper attachment would do. I'll check HF's > $999 lathe with the tool post grinder and see if it has these two, too. > > I see only one reply to the Unistrut thread, about this. It wasn't as well > written or thought out as this one. I mean my post, not the reply. This seems > definitive, something that could be put on a blueprint. Maybe I should send > these out and set up PO's to manufacture to order for amateur radio operators > and the like, setting up antenna masts. Or Boy Scouts raising the flag at a > Jamboree. Or NASA, as a building component for the space station, a truss > member. > > Well, the decaf has cooled so I'd better go drink it... > > Yours, > > Doug Goncz > Replikon Research > Seven Corners, VA 22044-0394 > http://members.aol.com/DGoncz > http://www.deja.com/profile.xp?author=dgoncz@aol.com* ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Variable Frequency Drives For Sale From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 14:16:32 GMT -------- Now THAT'S what I call a useful, informative, brief, welcome, Non-SPAM Commercial message suitable for this NG!! Thanks. teenut Harold Brenner wrote: > > Hi, > We just received a shipment of new surplus "Speecon" variable frequency > drives. We have over 200 single phase input units in stock, ranging in HP > from > 1/4 to 3. Many of these units are rated 120/240 volt input. In addition > to these we have over 2500 other new surplus three phase units in stock > up to 75 HP. You can view our inventory on our web page > http://www.dealerselectric.com just click on the > "Adj. Freq. Drive" tab. All of our frequency drives are listed with > prices. > > P.S. Quantity discounts are available. > Thanks for your interest, > Dealers Electric Motor ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Variable Frequency Drives For Sale From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 10 May 2000 14:29:15 GMT -------- Tasty prices too! Hmmm! teenut Robert Bastow wrote: > > Now THAT'S what I call a useful, informative, brief, welcome, Non-SPAM > Commercial message suitable for this NG!! > > Thanks. > > teenut > > Harold Brenner wrote: > > > > Hi, > > We just received a shipment of new surplus "Speecon" variable frequency > > drives. We have over 200 single phase input units in stock, ranging in HP > > from > > 1/4 to 3. Many of these units are rated 120/240 volt input. In addition > > to these we have over 2500 other new surplus three phase units in stock > > up to 75 HP. You can view our inventory on our web page > > http://www.dealerselectric.com just click on the > > "Adj. Freq. Drive" tab. All of our frequency drives are listed with > > prices. > > > > P.S. Quantity discounts are available. > > Thanks for your interest, > > Dealers Electric Motor ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT : Gun Siezed at Toronto Airport From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 11 May 2000 02:09:38 GMT -------- I wonder if he ever DID find a pulse where he kept his finger? Dear God, THAT was comedy!! teenut one of the 0.00005%ers Nigel Eaton wrote: > > 'Harold'. 8-) > > > > Oh you DUHTY old man........ > > Nigel (who reckons about .0005% of RCM'ers will understand that) > > :^) > -- > "The Mome Rath hasn't been born that could out-grabe me!". > ------------ > Nigel Eaton ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Variable Frequency Drives For Sale From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 11 May 2000 03:18:08 GMT -------- Robert, I am seriously concerned for your health! I have watched you dissemble into a shambling mass of phobias verging on clinical paranoia. You appear to be in imminent danger of disappearing up your own rectum unless drastic steps are taken to de-tox you! I strongly suggest you take a month off this technical shit. Take a chunk of pla-dough out of your bank account, mattress cover or startched shorts (Only you need know for sure) Book yourself an hotel room in a town at least fifty miles from home. Don't tell anyone where you are, who you are, or where you are from! Go get Drunk and Laid! Several times! Life will take on a whole new meaning and challenge..when you return, these petty hangups will seem just that and you will be able to laugh and play with the rest of us. No! I am not really kidding! teenut Robert Swinney wrote: > > Yeah! I went there too, curious about a 5 HP VFD --- Prices , Yes, but > there were no pertinent electrical details. Is it just me or does > everything about VFDs seek to conceal information from me? Do they, like > dogs, smell my fear and basic distrust? Do they suspect I don't trust the > nasty little buggers with their RF pollution and poor electrical efficiency, > what with their tendency to cause overheating and etc.?? Closed mind, open > up, I command you in the names of Tesla, Westinghouse, Edison, Franklin and > Fitch. If anyone can point me in the direction to obtain honest, accurate > and factual electrical information on VFDs, please do! > Bob (if I can't spec it, it ain't to be trusted) Swinney > > "DoN. Nichols" wrote in message > news:8fcad5$n38$1@izalco.d-and-d.com... > > In article <3919792B.ED348EF1@massed.net>, > > Bob Engelhardt wrote: > > > > > > > > >Harold Brenner wrote: > > >> > > >... > > >> http://www.dealerselectric.com just click ... > > > > > > > > >Ah... dealerselectric.com. I went on that site, looking for a 3-phase > > >motor, clicked on the "3-phase motor" button and waited and waited and > > >waited and ... > > > > > >That _page_ was 1.2 MB (IIRC)! It took 20 minutes to display! And > > >_then_ there were no prices!!! Aaaarrrrgggghhhh!!! > > > > Hmm ... the VFD page certainly has prices. > > > > As for the three-phase-motor entry, it now has several subsets, > > one of which is the "10HP and under" *only* 720K. :-) > > > > Not sure what is supposed to pop up when you look at the detail > > image. It wants javascript, and I don't want to give it javascript. > > > > Enjoy, > > DoN. > > > > -- > > Email: | Voice (all times): (703) 938-4564 > > My Concertina web page: | > http://www.d-and-d.com/dnichols/DoN.html > > --- Black Holes are where God is dividing by zero --- ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Shapers:Sent one to the scrap From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 11 May 2000 06:12:02 GMT -------- It was "All Hands to the Pumps" today at my shop..Every person working feverishly to shut down, disconnect clean and dismantle an outgoing Hurco Machining center..and to move in, and hook up a new CNC Turning Center. No one cut any metal..we were working against a deadline of two 18 wheeler Low Loaders and a crew of riggers who hadn't a clue what they were doing!! Whole 'nother story one day..I almost got to eating raw meat today!! No metal that is..except the 36" Shaper..which throughout all the fuss and upset, slowly munched a 1/4" deep slice right off the top of a 24" square slab of pre-heat treated 4140..that is now the right size and flat enough to drop straight on the table of a space age machining center, first thing in the morning. That machine was old when I was born..but it has a treasured and guaranteed space in my "state of the art/space age shop" teenut "Mark W." wrote: > > I actually paid $2000 for a mechanical Steptoe 14" shaper about 15 years ago > at a university auction. WW2 vintage, it had never been used. One of my > favorite machines... love to watch it work. > > Mark > > brownnsharp@my-deja.com wrote in message <8fd9f6$oe1$1@nnrp1.deja.com>... > > Williams tool had an 18 inch shaper with chrome plated ways. > >Beautiful machine. Wasn't sold at the time I left (7 years or so ago). > >They wanted 2500 for it. Just couldn't rationalize owning it $2500 > >worth. If they are still in business (Bill Williams Tool) they might > >know where you might get one today. > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Shapers:Sent one to the scrap From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 11 May 2000 22:07:45 GMT -------- The slab is for an injection molding die. The actions are going to be made out of 8620, and case hardened. teenut Jack Erbes wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > No metal that is..except the 36" Shaper..which throughout all the fuss and > > upset, slowly munched a 1/4" deep slice right off the top of a 24" square slab > > of pre-heat treated 4140.. > > I'll bet that was a lovely sight. I like it best when there is some > cutting oil on the surface and each chip marks its departing trajectory > with a smoke trail. That is the kind of work where you can stand > downrange with a bucket and catch every chip. > > Let me guess, you are going to cut the blanks for the actions out of > that slab? > > -- > Jack in Sonoma, CA, USA (jack@vom.com) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Shapers:Sent one to the scrap From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 11 May 2000 22:15:34 GMT -------- That machine could probably take a 1.00" deep cut x .060" feed..given a rigid set-up, workpiece and a well ground tool. I have seen similar machines take a 2" deep cut x 0.030" feed without even grunting! You DO need to stand clear when those chips come "spanging" off...they will rapidly punch holes in a 16 Ga steel chip shield!! Even my little 8" Boxford can take a 1/4" x 0.030 slice with a good knife tool..limitation is only by belt slip! teenut Mike Graham wrote: > > On Thu, 11 May 2000 06:12:02 GMT, Robert Bastow wrote: > > >No metal that is..except the 36" Shaper..which throughout all the fuss and > >upset, slowly munched a 1/4" deep slice right off the top of a 24" square slab > >of pre-heat treated 4140..that is now the right size and flat enough to drop > >straight on the table of a space age machining center, first thing in the > >morning. > > Would you take the 1/4" off in one pass with a round-nose cutter, with > very low feed rate (2 thou or so) or was it done in multiple passes? Just > curious what a machine of that size is capable of. > > -- > -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- > Mike Graham | Metalworker by trade > mikegraham at sprint dot ca | Weld to live, like to weld. > Caledon, Ontario, Canada | Weird by nature > > -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- > "By Fire and Iron doth he make Bread." ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Typical US Service From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 13 May 2000 01:50:32 GMT -------- I am doing my bit to clean up Georgia...Just cost me $3400.00 to legally and properly dispose of several drums of accumulated Engine oil, cutting fluid, Dielectric oil etc that I "Inherited" with the shop. Some of it had been there for thirty years (Vietnam War Era drawing oil for bomb casings and tail assemblies!) I could have had my guys "lose" the stuff in a field somewhere..but the thought of my grandkids (or anyone elses for that matter) sucking the stuff out of the watertable was more than even this greedy old capitalist could concience! It is done with now and it was a small price to pay for a clear mind! teenut PS Free to a good home..must pick up!! Almost full, brand new, five gallon pail of Valcool soluble cutting oil. Good stuff..but the one I am using is better and I don't want to pay to dispose of perfectly good product. Call me at the shop..404 799 6304 Robert mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article , > Gary Coffman wrote: > > > It isn't just machining either. I'm involved with a group that's > > developing a new electronic product. We're having our > > prototype circuit boards made in Bulgaria. We get a higher > > quality board, a quicker turn around, and a lower cost (even > > including a $55 FedEx charge for overnight delivery) by going > > there instead of having it done locally. > > I bet you a nickel that I know what they do with their used > etchant, plating solutions, and solvents. > > And you *can't* do that here in the US. > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Safety of Aluminum Alloys used in food preparation. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 14 May 2000 02:10:32 GMT -------- Ask the Crew of the British Frigate "Sheffield" whether aluminum burns..those that survived after the hit from an Exocet missile set her (Aluminum) upperworks ablaze. My son's best friend wasn't one of them and they couldn't find enough to bury!! All Royal Navy ships are now required to have steel upperworks..even at the expense of the weight penalty. I believe the same thing happened to a US Navy Ship hit by an Exocet in the Persian Gulf. Was it the USS Stark?? ALL metals will burn under the right conditions...ALL!!!! teenut Eric Keller wrote: > > One of the most interesting things i have ever seen was an F-16 in puddle > form after it crashed and burned. So i guess we can safely say that 7075 > and 2024 don't burn, but may melt. > eric ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Safety of Aluminum Alloys used in food preparation. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 14 May 2000 02:15:18 GMT -------- Asphalt Paving soaked with Lox is as powerful an explosive as most commercial explosives. ANY flamable material, soaked in Lox is a potential high explosive. teenut Tim Shoppa wrote: > > Paul Koning wrote: > > > > Eric Kudell wrote: > > > > > > Hello, > > > > > > I am in the process of repairing an old ornate German barbecue. I am > > > planning on rebuilding the firebox out of aluminum for various reasons, > > > and am wondering if there are alloys to stay away from because of any > > > toxicity they may impart to the food. > > > > Aluminum firebox? As in: you're going to build a fire > > in an aluminum container? > > > > I'm not sure about food issues, but you may get a lot > > more excitement than you want when the aluminum catches > > on fire. Look up "thermite". > > As I understand thermite, the other essential ingredient (in > addition to the powdered aluminum) is iron oxide, which serves > as an oxidizer. Sheet aluminum by itself won't go up like a bomb. > > If you add a powerful oxidizer (say, liquid oxygen!) > to any barbecue you've got quite a mixture on your hands. > See George Goble's page at > > http://ghg.ecn.purdue.edu/ > > for the ultimate in "do not try this at home kids". According to > the page, one charcoal briquette soaked in LOX is equivalent to > a stick of TNT. > > Tim. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Opening a Machine shop From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 14 May 2000 02:33:35 GMT -------- "Those whom the Gods wish to Destroy..They first make open Machine Shops!" teenut oddjob7818@my-deja.com wrote: > > I'm thinking about opening a machine shop. What > do companies look for in a machine shop? Would > they look at experience? Should I go to nearby > companies advertising my service? If so, who > should I talk to? > > Jody > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: really small planer From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 14 May 2000 02:49:55 GMT -------- What a delightful little machine! You will also find, with a bit of TLC and understanding, that it can turn out surprisingly precise work. Please resist the urge to "Modernise" it..though it would make a heck of a basis for a gantry type CNC mill!! Please don't..what you have is an heirloom and examples like that one are getting real hard to find. Are you in the US or the UK? By the style of it it could be as early as 1870 to 1890...or even a lot earlier than that, though the "style" continued to be manufactured until the first 1/4 of the last (20th) Century. Could be an old Hendy Norton..though that would likely have the name somewhere. You may never find a name to put to it simply because, literally hundreds of small machine shops, Iron Foundrys and the like would turn out a few here and a few there. teenut Geoffrey Brown wrote: > > I bought a nice small planer today -- work area 2' x 9". I've put a few > pictures > on my web site. If anybody had any clues who might have made it I'd > love to > hear. > > http://members.tripod.com/Geoffrey.Brown/id35.htm > > Geoffrey ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Dressing a Grinding wheel From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 14 May 2000 03:31:35 GMT -------- If you learn to use it properly the star type shouldn't leave Divots in your wheel..sounds like you are using too much pressure. Use light pressure and try to hold the wheels at a slight angle to the wheel face so that they spin freely at wheel speed. Done properly the star wheel will leave a vastly superior grinding surface than any stick or diamond. It works by crushing the bond and thus allowing grit to be pulled off..leaving fresh, sharp, undamaged grit and a fresh "open" bonded face that will cut more freely, cooler and with less loading. Sticks etc work by cutting the individual grits..leaving a mish mash of damaged cutting grits behind. the wheel may "Look" smoother..but it won't cut as freely, will heat up faster and will load and glaze far faster. I have never actually done scientific tests..but in my experience a star dressed wheel face will outlast a stick dressed one..between dressings..by a factor of at least ten!!! teenut Who has dressed a few!! John Jacobs wrote: > > What do you think is better. A star type wheel dresser or a dressing > stick? The star type seems to leave small divots in my wheel. Thanks in > advance. > John ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Off-topic ebay question From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 14 May 2000 15:04:09 GMT -------- Jim! Will you please stop giving away all the Ebay tricks!!! It's getting tough enough as it is!! Shut the F*** UP!!! ;^) teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article <391d8139.2955406@snews.intellisys.net>, > inet@intellisys.net wrote: > > > It helps to have a guaranteed clock time if you want to get to within > > a minute of close time. > > No, not needed. The ebay 'time remaining on auction' clock > works much, much better. > > Here's how to do it: > > Say the timer says 10 minutes, 30 seconds left on the auction. So > click on the reload button when the second hand hits 30 seconds. > Then there will be a turn-around delay when you contact your ISP, > the message gets to ebay, then send a re-loaded page to you and you > display it. > > Now it says there are 10 minutes, 5 seconds left. Which means that > the 30 second mark should have been the 5 second mark - so turn the > clock so the 30 goes up to 5 seconds before the top. Then when the > second hand ticks to, say 15 seconds after the new time, hit reload > again. Now after the turn-around delay it will say 9 minutes, > 45 seconds. It's been dialed in, and with small variations in the > delay times excepted, the time on that clock is now the time > remaining to the end of auction. Usually it takes a few tries to > get it dialed in, about 5 or 10. > > But with this one can reliably bid within the last 15 seconds because > the method accounts for the turn-around delays. Note, however, if > the server loads change during the last few minutes, or your ISP > has a big change in use patterns, things will shift a bit so you have > to keep re-checking as the time drops down to a minute or two. > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Dressing a Grinding wheel From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 15 May 2000 02:01:16 GMT -------- True! I was only considering the use of a star wheel dresser for a bench type grinder. Diamonds are usually used for surface grinders, though for form wheel dressing the very best results are obtained by crusher wheel dressing..which is actually the way that a properly used star wheel dresser does its job! teenut "Mark W." wrote: > > good advice, as long as it's not a surface grinder! The star dressers are > great for off hand grinders... hardly anyone knows what they are anymore. > > Mark > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> > wrote in message ... > >If you learn to use it properly the star type shouldn't leave Divots in > your > >wheel..sounds like you are using too much pressure. Use light pressure and > try > >to hold the wheels at a slight angle to the wheel face so that they spin > freely > >at wheel speed. > > > >Done properly the star wheel will leave a vastly superior grinding surface > than > >any stick or diamond. It works by crushing the bond and thus allowing grit > to > >be pulled off..leaving fresh, sharp, undamaged grit and a fresh "open" > bonded > >face that will cut more freely, cooler and with less loading. > > > >Sticks etc work by cutting the individual grits..leaving a mish mash of > damaged > >cutting grits behind. the wheel may "Look" smoother..but it won't cut as > >freely, will heat up faster and will load and glaze far faster. > > > >I have never actually done scientific tests..but in my experience a star > dressed > >wheel face will outlast a stick dressed one..between dressings..by a factor > of > >at least ten!!! > > > >teenut Who has dressed a few!! > > > >John Jacobs wrote: > >> > >> What do you think is better. A star type wheel dresser or a dressing > >> stick? The star type seems to leave small divots in my wheel. Thanks in > >> advance. > >> John > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Ebay pet peave "Handling fees, and astronomical shipping fee's!" From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 15 May 2000 02:11:32 GMT -------- I have only one time been hit with a request for excessive "Handling fees"..IIRC about $10 on a $6.00 item. I told the seller to stick it where the sun don't shine. He threatened a bad feed back and I told him to go right ahead..and by the way I was copying all our correspondence to Ebay... That was the last I heard from him. teenut Robert Swinney wrote: > > I totally agree! Some e-bay shippers have discovered the little extra > profit gouge in "shipping and handling". This puts them in a class with the > drop-shippers that routinely use this method to mark all their goods up by > 10%. They're not hard to spot, usu. have shipping and handling charges > based on a range of selling prices -not- weight or size of the article. > Probably though, in all fairness to e-bay sellers, there is less of this > going on through e-bay than in the general market. > Bob Swinney > > "foxeye" wrote in message > news:391ee1c1.5271341@news.ddyne.com... > > When there is no mention of the cost of shipping. So you bid on an > > item that may sell lower than what the seller figured it would sell > > for, and then they add a handling fee, and then an exhorbarant > > shipping fee. I paid $1.50 for a #2 to #3 MT adapter one time, and the > > idiot wanted a $2.50 handling / packing fee, and then $10.00 shipping > > fee on top of that.... NO WAY. I refuse to pay extortion fees for > > shipping, and if it means I get labeled as a non-payer then so be it. > > I usually ask sellers the approx weitght or at least where they are > > from and sort of figure out the shipping fee so I know it before hand, > > but those that in the end come up with an astronomical amount to > > handle and ship it, , suck! > > > > I believe that ebay should make the seller post the shipping amount. > > YOur left holding the bag at the sellers mercy in the end. Another > > thing is they need to drop the handling fee's. If they want to charge > > for this, then they need to add it to the reserve or to the first bid > > price they set as starters. I can handle a reserve, I just bid as > > usual. If its outside my range and still not met, then I just move on > > to something else. If it is below what I figured I would be willing to > > spend, I'll stay with it to my predetermined amount I was willing to > > spend. > > > > > > Foxeye > > > > "Remove nospam to send email" > > nospamfoxeye@ddyne.com > > foxeye@nospamddyne.com > > Just my .02 cents worth! > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Opening a Machine shop From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 15 May 2000 03:28:23 GMT -------- oddjob7818@my-deja.com wrote: > > I'm thinking about opening a machine shop. Having recently opened my fourth Machine Shop, I have been thinking long and hard about how to answer this question, in a meaningful and useful way...without running to about two hundred pages of closely type text!! The first thing to understand about opening a machine shop, or any other type of business, is that 96% of ALL new businesses fail!!! At the end of ten years, out of every 100 new openings, 96 have failed, three are struggling and only one can be deemed to be "A Success" It is important therefore to understand WHY this is so if you are to have any chance whatsoever of survival. My first advice is therefore, to go out and buy a book called "The E-Myth Revisited" by Michael E Gerber..available from any bookstore...ISBN 0-88730-728-0. My last copy cost $15.00 (I say "last copy" because I have bought several copies in my time and keep giving them away to friends who express the desire to open businesses!!) Next you have to ask yourself (and honestly answer) the question " Why do I want to open my own business?" So you can be your own boss?...You will find you have more "Bosses" as a small business owner than ever before!! It has often been said.."Having your own business means working 80 hours a week for yourself..so you don't have to work 40 hours a week for someone else" That can be a very true statement. To me, the objective of a business is, as quickly as possible, to reach a stage where it produces an ongoing stream of income, more than sufficient to meet your needs..WHETHER YOU ARE THERE OR NOT!!!!!! (My latest new venture has achieved that position in less than three months!!) Anything else is not a business..it just means YOU OWN YOUR OWN JOB!!!!! To achieve this, you will need to reduce the details of how to run your business to a "SYSTEM" You (or someone else) runs the "SYSTEM" and the "SYSTEM" runs the business. It is for this ONE SINGLE REASON that business people are so willing to buy a franchise type operation...Franchise businesses have the exact reverse track record in new start-ups...96% succeed and less than 4% fail. What you primarily pay for in a franchise is a Guaranteed, Turn-Key System. You run the system, the system runs the business and the business makes money. It really is as simple as that. If you can't buy a working system then YOU have to develop it..Gerber's book will hammer this concept home and teach you how to do it for yourself. What Gerber's book will teach you, is how to work ON your business..rather than IN it. Now! Having said all that, you need to understand that you will need enough working capital, not just to buy or lease the space and equipment to start up with..but to be able to cover your operating costs, fixed and variable, for up to TWO YEARS, including YOUR living expenses, without counting on taking a dime of income out of the business. What do machine shop customers look for? If you have to ask that question you are in Deep DooDoo before you start. Yes I could tell you..but it would take the afforsaid megapages to do it. Yes I could teach you and I will make you the following offer.. Assuming you are a pretty damned good Machinist or Tool and Die Maker..Come to Atlanta and work for me for THREE MONTHS..I will pay you 2/3 of what I regularly pay my top people ($23 to $30.00 per hour) and I will undertake to teach you the BUSINESS from top to bottom!! That is about as close to "Turnkey" as you will get in this business. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Opening a Machine shop From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 16 May 2000 02:42:26 GMT -------- Peter Drumm wrote: > > In message - Robert > Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com>Mon, 15 May 2000 03:28:23 GMT writes: > :-> > :->Now! Having said all that, you need to understand that you will need enough > :->working capital, not just to buy or lease the space and equipment to start up > :->with..but to be able to cover your operating costs, fixed and variable, for up > :->to TWO YEARS, including YOUR living expenses, without counting on taking a dime > :->of income out of the business. > :-> > > I've been told 3 years minimum, and I believe it. When Mark took over > the shop(which had been in business for 20+ years already) he didn't > make a dime for the first 5 years, they lived off his wife's income. > He's been there 20 years now, and makes a good buck, but he also > spends 80 hours or more working every week. > Then..As I stated..He doesn't own a "Business" he owns his own "Job"!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Opening a Machine shop From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 16 May 2000 02:52:37 GMT -------- "Ian W. Douglas" wrote: > > On Mon, 15 May 2000, Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > > To achieve this, you will need to reduce the details of how to run your business > > to a "SYSTEM" You (or someone else) runs the "SYSTEM" and the "SYSTEM" runs the > > business. It is for this ONE SINGLE REASON that business people are so willing > > to buy a franchise type operation...Franchise businesses have the exact reverse > > track record in new start-ups...96% succeed and less than 4% fail. What you > > primarily pay for in a franchise is a Guaranteed, Turn-Key System. You run the > > system, the system runs the business and the business makes money. It really is > > as simple as that. > > > > I can see it now: > > - Machine shops with golden arches in front of them > > - Signs that say, "Over 26 billion set up and milled" > > - Coupons for a free McTurning Job with every 20 holes drilled > > - Ronald McLathe Operator commercials > > The possibilities are endless. Yes they are...if you are not too dumb to see it!! No-one (Yet) has ever turnkeyed and franchised a succesful machine shop! Go read "Grinding it out" by Ray Krok..the guy who showed everyone the way with MacDonalds. Then go look around at all the successful franchises and turnkeyed business that soak up your hard earned dollars every day From Wendies to Minuteman Press, to hotel chains to hardware stores To Mailboxes Etc...etcetera, etcetera,! Go learn something about how BUSINESS really works and then come back and I'll discuss Macdonalds and Turnkeying with you! Sorry to be snippy..but don't bring a knfe to a gun fight! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Quick change aloris type toolposts From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 16 May 2000 03:05:17 GMT -------- Miles wrote: > The holder is only held 'up' by the contact of the adjusting screw on > the top of the tool post. Rubbish! I regularly use wedge type toolposts from AXA through CXA sizes without adjusting or locking the height adjustment screw. Chuck in a tool, eyeball it to center height lock it there with the wedge, and turn all day long, if required, without it shifting. If the only thing holding up your tool block is the screw..don't blame the screw..its the wedge that ain't working! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What is your Hobby? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 16 May 2000 03:11:03 GMT -------- Scraping is a skill that every machinist should master..then hope never to use again! (I sold BOTH my copies of "Machine Tool Reconditioning"..I don't ever have that much difficulty getting to sleep!) teenut GJRepesh wrote: > > I seem to resemble this discussion. Almost all my machines are used or > new-damaged. I recently bought a Darex end mill sharpener that was damaged in > shipping. Made some new handle, etc., straightened the bent legs and have a > nice machine. My big project is finishing up the rebuild on a Bridgeport clone. > Learned to scrape with the Machinery Reconditioning book. Scraped the knee, > saddle, and table. Applied turcite to the saddle. Hope to finish it up soon. I > just couldn't leave it alone after I bought it. Then I have a B & S #2 surface > grinder to work on. It never ends. But the challenge is something else. > > GJR ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Taking the mighty Myford for a test drive this evening From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 16 May 2000 03:33:09 GMT -------- It is not so much that the Myford has a "Different feel to it" Though that may appear to be the case to someone not used to it. The truth is that the Myford is one of the few small lathes in its class, that is built to give the same "feel" as a "Proper" Quality lathe!! Try out a class act Tool Room Lathe..I don't care if it is a New Hardinge (doesn't seem to last long on them) or an old Cazeneuve, VDF, Heiller, Brown and Sharpe, Monarch, Lodge and Shipley, etc etc...Hey! They feel just like Myfords!! My Super 11 felt like a can of rusty bolts when I aquired it almost unused. There were a lot of features I liked though so I rebuilt and modified it to suit my tastes..NOW it has that "smooth as silk" feeling too, and I wouldn't part with it.!! teenut Joules wrote: > > Try sliding a strip of shim between the jaws and work to correct > for the runout, this works for me. I love my Myford, the power > crossfeed is something I have never experienced before with any > of my previous lathes. Yes...the Myford does feel loose, > because of it's silky smooth travel. This is what gives you the > feel to cut a thou, rather than backlash chattering 3 thou off > the work. In fact the more I think about it, my Myford is an > extension of my senses. I can feel the material I am working, > like no other machine I have used. > Welcome to the Zen group of Myford owners...It's an English > lathe. No one else builds them like this. Alot of people > critisise them for being old fashioned...I think it does its job > elegantly. > > Heavily biased opinion. > > Joules > > * Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet's Discussion Network * > The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet - Free! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Taking the mighty Myford for a test drive this evening From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 16 May 2000 03:37:44 GMT -------- Yes it CAN!! Super 7s were produced for years without power cross feed and if it has a quick change it became a Super7B The Super 7 has a totaly different bed, headstock,drive unit, speed range, tailstock and carriage than the slower speed ML7 (Which with a QC became an ML7B) teenut Robert Mitchell wrote: > > Bill, if your lathe does not have power cross feed and a quick change > gear box, it is not a "Myford Super 7". > > Could it be a Myford ML 7? > > - Robert Mitchell > > "BillDarby" wrote in message > news:391FFDA2.B875C46F@sympatico.ca... > > Hi all > > > > Just as background, and to add to the subject heading, let me > > explain that I just purchased a Myford Super Seven lathe from a > > gentlemen who has had, but never used the lathe in just over 30 years. > > If it were a car I would say it was cherry. I have never run anything > > but tired old clunkers, so,, to use a machine like this (that has a > > tailstock that always points at the headstock and a headstock that > > always points at the tailstock) is quite a treat! > ... > > > > I most of all miss not having the cross feed powered and without > > the quick change gear box you tend to settle for whatever longitudinal > > feed you happen to get with the the gearing selection that the machine > > is using. God forbid you should bother changing gears just to get a > > more suitable feed speed. :0) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: drilling a washer From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 16 May 2000 03:50:45 GMT -------- Use a back stop. Can be either as simple as a cylinder of steel slightly smaller than the washer and slightly shorter than the chuck jaws. It can be (as I do) drilled,tapped holes in the face of every chuck (3 and 4 jaw) to which I can bolt individual stop blocks...With the jaws removed, these can then be faced, machined, counterbored to any configuration to back up or locate the job while the jaws hold it in position. Or it can be a custom made, adjustable device that locates and locks in the spindle or the chuck bore. If the chuck is pre-fitted with a simple plain plug..flush with the chuck surface..it will allow you to use many methods of locating or aligning parts while you "Get a grip" on them. Treat the plug as renewable..bore, counterbore it, drill clean through it, drill and ream it for a small dowel or a center point..... Don't be limited by what the manufacturer deemed as the minimum on your lathe..use your Imagination and add or modify it to suit many, many more purposes! teenut Ted Edwards wrote: > > A frequently arising problem: How do you secure a washer in the lathe > so it's square to the axis without damaging the edges or surfaces. The > purpose is to drill/ream the hole larger. > > Ted ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: RCM causes bad habits From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 16 May 2000 04:26:55 GMT -------- There IS a simpler answer! Let teenut..with 38 contiguous (but not continuous) years of Marriage..on # 4 (or 5 I forget) right now..and 39 years of machine addiction, tell you the secret to eternal happiness. Brace yerselves!! My Wife..like any good Southern Gal was brought up to shop..professionally!! She and her Mother (the Grand Dame) and Sister..do not go "Shopping" They set out to "Work the Mall" I watched and learned from my Father-in-Law..A true Professional!!! Every three to six months you have to sacrifice..if required...a whole weekend. Get used to the pain and the dreariness of sitting for accumulated hours outside an endless stream of expensive stores, while the girls go in and terrorise the help. Later, rather than sooner, one or all will emerge and say "I just saw X..its beautiful..its expensive..what do you think?" Grit your teeth, smile and say..."You go right ahead and get it darling!!"..They knew you would!! NOW comes the MASTER STROKE When they emerge, burdened with heaps..(it appears like a lifetimes supply of shop rags to you) They always have a prepared routine of chattering to each other about the stuff they would have loved to get..but didn't...because they (Lyin' B*****) were concerned that they had spent too much!! NOW you REALLY grit your teeth and send em RIGHT BACK IN....With instructions to keep on buying till they think they have saved you enough! You do this several times..until THEY are exhaused! It takes a MAN with real staying power to do it!! Dear God it is hard the first couple of times!!! It may at first seem to be an Expensive Strategy!! But!!!! As an investment it will repay itself a thousand fold. You see it will take them another six months for them to pluck up enough brass neck to demand you accompany them again. Meanwhile, seven days a week for six months you can spend your nuts off on any kinda good stuff that takes your fancy. RIGHT UNDER THEIR PRETTY NOSES!!!! And they won't dare say a damned thing!!! George (my Father in Law) went out and bought him a twin engined Cessna!!! And a red Pickup!! He is looking now at a new two seat Jag and he is 74 years old!!! Try it..it works..it was my way to the eternal happy zone of being an addict and not giving a good goddam about it!! teenut the content. AZOTIC wrote: > > >...Please > >tell me there is a cure....... > >Corey > >AKA sanford at the rate things are going > > Sorry there is no known cure, this is > is progressive afliction and lasts the > lifespan of the infected individual. > I beleive it is covered by the ADA and > there is help. The cronic symptoms can > be relieved by purchasing things that > you cannot identify or have no immediate > need for, but you may need someday. > The second stage is buying a larger > house for more shop space to hold your > ever increasing inventory of machines > and tools. The third stage is never throw > anything away, you may need it someday. > The fourth stage is fellowship with other victims in an industrial supply store > on saturday mornings until they throw you out at closeing time. The final stage > requires the victim to be confined in a > machine shop or steel mill for thier own > saftey, cared for by a professional staff > of machinists. There is work being done > in the treatment of this affliction along > the line of virtual reality where the victim > can get relief of the symptoms by viewing > visions of any machine they wish to > operate and master. > > Thats my story ( 40+ years of collecting ) > > Hope this helps. > > Best Regards > Tom. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: ANYONE know a source for 20 mm brass shells? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 16 May 2000 04:29:30 GMT -------- I do..but I ain't about to tell a nut like you where I live!! ;^) teenut Gunluvver2 wrote: > > I have a project that requires about 300 used 20mm brass shells. Does anyone > live near a navy/air base where these might be available? I will pay reasonable > prices for these. If you have some E-mail me with the info. > Thanks, > Dennis > Gunluvver2@aol.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Taking the mighty Myford for a test drive this evening From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 16 May 2000 04:46:47 GMT -------- DSGs are probably, all round, the finest lathes ever built!! Regardless of size!! BTW apart from being standard on any gap bed lathe..the RH Carriage wheel is found on most British Lathes. Its purpose is to keep your carriage control hand out of the stream of hot chips coming from the chuck...I am now so used to either hand I don't notice..until the chips start to fly and then I curse the designers of LH Handwheel lathes! teenut Ttools@ix.netcom.com wrote: > > Hey Ill take my Dean Smith & Grace any day over a truck load of Myfords or any other machine made and I have a L&S and a Cazeneuve, that is after I got used to the right hand carraige wheel. > Tom > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > It is not so much that the Myford has a "Different feel to it" Though that may > > appear to be the case to someone not used to it. > > > > The truth is that the Myford is one of the few small lathes in its class, that > > is built to give the same "feel" as a "Proper" Quality lathe!! > > > > Try out a class act Tool Room Lathe..I don't care if it is a New Hardinge > > (doesn't seem to last long on them) or an old Cazeneuve, VDF, Heiller, Brown and > > Sharpe, Monarch, Lodge and Shipley, etc etc...Hey! They feel just like > > Myfords!! > > > > My Super 11 felt like a can of rusty bolts when I aquired it almost unused. > > There were a lot of features I liked though so I rebuilt and modified it to suit > > my tastes..NOW it has that "smooth as silk" feeling too, and I wouldn't part > > with it.!! > > > > teenut > > > > Joules wrote: > > > > > > Try sliding a strip of shim between the jaws and work to correct > > > for the runout, this works for me. I love my Myford, the power > > > crossfeed is something I have never experienced before with any > > > of my previous lathes. Yes...the Myford does feel loose, > > > because of it's silky smooth travel. This is what gives you the > > > feel to cut a thou, rather than backlash chattering 3 thou off > > > the work. In fact the more I think about it, my Myford is an > > > extension of my senses. I can feel the material I am working, > > > like no other machine I have used. > > > Welcome to the Zen group of Myford owners...It's an English > > > lathe. No one else builds them like this. Alot of people > > > critisise them for being old fashioned...I think it does its job > > > elegantly. > > > > > > Heavily biased opinion. > > > > > > Joules > > > > > > * Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet's Discussion Network * > > > The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet - Free! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Taking the mighty Myford for a test drive this evening From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 16 May 2000 09:50:03 GMT -------- Not a cut rate way to use the same indices Janos..but an indexing method..preferred by some...hated by the true cognicenti. It is called diametric indexing. The CROSS slide is indexed in such a way that, say to reduce a diameter by 1mm, you move the index 1mm, that moves the cross slide 1/2mm and the resultant reduction in diameter is 1mm. The Topslide is usually used for LENGTH reduction..a sort of fine adjustment on the CARRIAGE Slide...They are therefore Directly indexed..1mm on the dial means 1mm of movement. This, at first sight might seem a perfect arangement...It means you don't have to take every diametric measurement, deduct it from the finished diameter required and divide the resultant by 2 to determine the cross slide movement required to achieve that. For that reason, it is a prefered arrangement on training lathes and those to be used by semi-skilled labor (in the UK..a lathe or a milling machine operator..in fact any specialised machine operator, is or certainly was classified only as semi-skilled!!) Fully skilled tradesmen..including Tool and Die Makers however expect and wish to use a lathe for quite few operations where the ability to diectly call off cross slide movement is as important as any diametric movement they may wish to use. To them the Diametric Indexing is a Pain in the Butt!! To Jobbing Machine shop owners..who most often have a crew of skilled and semiskilled Tadesmen moving daily if not hourly arround a bevy of different lathes, milling machines, grinders etc., It is a total disaster!!!! I don't care how "accustomed" any operator is, to moving to and fro from direct indexed mills and lathes to a diametrically indexed lathe. Sooner, rather than later, the arrangement will cause a mix up, and double the quantity required will be removed from a diameter. Murphy's Law Dictates that it will happen. It also dictates that it will be on the single most valuable and difficult to repair or replace component going through the shop at the time. For these reasons..I personally..as a Skilled Tradesman.....hate diametric indices..As a Machine Shop Owner, I will not have them within a country mile of my shop!!! teenut Janos Ero wrote: > The other oddity on my metric Myford is, that > the cross-slide's wheel is scaled to the > half: moving from 0 to 10 does not move it > by 1mm, as usual, but only 0.5mm! One turn, > 40 units means then 2mm. I think this is > simply because they use the same scale for > the cross-slide's diameter screw: there > the movement means diameter, 10 units, 0.5mm > movement removes 1mm in diameter. > > Janos Ero ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Swordmaking.... From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 16 May 2000 15:32:44 GMT -------- Monty Python and Benny Hill were two of the reasons I left England..there were others, including the TR7! I love John Cleese..but MP left me cold. I wish we could resurrect Steptoe and Son somehow...THAT was funny! Was any of that ever released on video or tape? teenut Gunner wrote: > > On Tue, 16 May 2000 13:41:52 GMT, paul.carre@polar.co.uk (Paul Carre) wrote: > > >Nigel Eaton wrote: > > > >>In article <8fpd26$bm0$1@news.cis.ohio-state.edu>, william thomas powers > >> writes > >>>I always assumed that perhaps he was a cousin to Nigel Nigel hyphen > >>>hyphen > >>>stroke Money.... > >>> > >>>Thomas "Two-Sheds" Powers > >>> > >>Stop that! Stop that, it's silly. > >> > >>I'm actually (distantly) related to Tarquin > >>Fin-tim-lin-bin-whim-bim-lim-bus-stop-F'tang-F'tang-Ole-Biscuitbarrel > >>(Silly Party). > >> > >>And now for something completely different.......... > >> > >>Nigel (two names) Eaton > >>-- > >>"The Mome Rath hasn't been born that could out-grabe me!". > >>------------ > >>Nigel Eaton > >> > > > >This is going to be lost on those across the pond. > > > >Design Engineer > >Polar Instruments Ltd > >Guernsey > >Channel Islands > > Hummm depends on if a Yank is a fan of Monty Python, Benny Hill, Dr Who, etc > etc... > > > --------------------------------------------------------- > > "A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an > invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write > a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort > the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, > solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program > a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die > gallantly. Specialization is for insects." Robert Heinlein > > Free Hobby Buy/Swap/Sell Website > www.cyberg8t.com/gunner/hsm/index.html > > Home Page > http://userzweb.lightspeed.net/gunner ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Specs on Myford lathes From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 16 May 2000 15:40:52 GMT -------- I think I learned more of use and value, from George Thomas, than any other single source in my entire career! He really acted as a catalyst that helped define my Metalworking methods, expectations, objectives and criteria. A huge amount of stuff I already "Knew" came together under the Mentorship of George, and, while he was alive, we used to correspond at some length. I have added a tremendous amount of knowledge and experience since then..but I can look to that source as a definite "turning point" in my life. Yeh! The book is worth getting!! teenut Paul Carre wrote: > > tony@jeffree.X.co.uk (Tony Jeffree) wrote: > > >On Tue, 16 May 2000 10:26:24 GMT, paul.carre@polar.co.uk (Paul Carre) > >wrote: > > > >>Bruce Simpson wrote: > >> > >>>Steve, > >>> > >>>A good cheap book well worth buying is "Myford Series 7 Manual" (second > >>>edition, reprinted 1997; includes ML7, ML7-R and Super 7) by Ian Bradley, > >>>published by Nexus Special Interests Ltd, ISBN 0-85242-775-1. Price in > >>>Australia A$19.95 so probably less than US$10 elsewhere. > >>> > >>>Regards, > >>>Bruce Simpson > >>>Perth, Australia > >>> > >>> > >> > >>First person to email me an address can have mine - its junk! > > > >I have to agree - NOT a great read. > > > > > >Regards, > >Tony > > > >Website: http://www.jeffree.u-net.com/ > >When replying, delete "X." from the Email address to remove anti-SPAM measures. > > > > If you want a GREAT read and it has Myford implications then try the > George Thomas workshp manual, the one that he was working on when he > died. > > Now that IS good value. > > Design Engineer > Polar Instruments Ltd > Guernsey > Channel Islands ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What is your Hobby? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 16 May 2000 15:53:52 GMT -------- GJRepesh wrote: > > >Scraping is a skill that every machinist should master..then hope > >never to use again! > > There is wisdom in those words. > > Thank God I don't have to make a > living at this. I have!!! And I pray I never have to again! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: ANYONE know a source for 20 mm brass shells? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 16 May 2000 17:36:25 GMT -------- OH! Ok then. Just wanted to be sure. A previous poster mentioned Fort Benning as a source to start from. In actual fact I MAY have a use comming up for 50BMG shells so if you track down your supply keep me informed! teenut Gunluvver2 wrote: > > >I do..but I ain't about to tell a nut like you where I live!! > > That's all right Teenut I already know where you live. I have a satellite > with a death ray passing over your house every three hours. The only thing that > has saved you so far is I don't want to damage all those beautiful machines in > your shop. Just watch it if you ever decide to leave the shop. > Actually I had an entirely peaceful use in mind for the used 20 mm ammo. > Something along the line of turning swords into plowshares. > > Dennis ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: ANYONE know a source for 20 mm brass shells? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 16 May 2000 17:37:42 GMT -------- Nope! It's to confuse the Black Helicopters!! teenut william thomas powers wrote: > > > Actually I had an entirely peaceful use in mind for the used 20 mm ammo. > >Something along the line of turning swords into plowshares. > > Funny that; did you know that the Bible has two places that talk about > forging plowshares into swords and only one place going from swords into > plowshares... > > Thomas who wanted to know why Teenut was building that deathray mirror for > his hat...hey he's being irradiated by pro's! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Sure sign of encroaching old age From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 16 May 2000 17:46:05 GMT -------- I was sitting in a local restaurant this morning, having breakfast. A cell phone goes off nearby. Two middle aged gentlemen, in buttondowns, sat at a nearby table, both reach for their cell phones. One answers the call...While the other sits, stupidly staring at the TV Remote in his hand!! I almost "Lost It" There but for the Grace of God!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Good News at Last From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 16 May 2000 18:01:16 GMT -------- This last few weeks, as some of you know, I have been going through both Chemotherapy and Radiation Treatment. Over-all the effects havn't been as bad as I expected..though there have been periods when I have been deathly ill..Generally I am in better shape than I have felt for years!! Go Figure! Recent test results show that I am standing up to the treatments so well that they are going to step up the scheduling. More importantly..Sparing you the gross details..There are signs that we have this thing on the run!!!!!!!!! Now to kick and then kill the bastard while it is down!! No pity, No quarter, No Prisoners!! Again, thanks to all of you for your good wishes and prayers, I know that sumpn' bigger than me is at work out there. For the last forty years I have hovered between Agnosticism and Atheism. I have often heard it said that there are no Atheists in Foxholes...I am here to tell you...There are very few with Lung Cancer either!!! Perhaps the Good Lord just wanted to get my attention!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: wrought iron research project From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 16 May 2000 19:10:23 GMT -------- The Titanic was simply a classic example that Murphy has been around a long time! teenut Dave Mundt wrote: > > Greetings and Salutations... > Well, I have SLEPT since then (not much, and not well, but, I have > slept), but, I seem to recall a lengthy documentary on The Discovery > Channel about this, where samples of either the hull itself, or, > samples from contemporary sources were sent to a lab and tested under > various conditions. They were found to become terribly brittle when > chilled to the water temperatures at the time... Don't know how > "scientific" this was, but, it did look pretty interesting. > Also, it seems like one of the BIG reasons for the Titanic tragedy > was human hubris. Not only did the designers do an insufficient job > of constructing the ship as a series of watertight compartments > ("oh...we dont have to spend the extra money to take the partitions > ALL the way up...water will NEVER that THAT deep in the ship") but, > because of this, and, OTHER management decisions, there were > insufficient numbers of life rafts on the ship, nor were there enough > safety drills held. This was a case where "blind faith" proved to be > the undoing of many, not only the victims, but their families, the > shipline, and ship architects and builders. > If we had TRUELY learned from that experience, Challenger would > NEVER have happened. > Regards > Dave Mundt > > "John (EBo) David" wrote: > > > > >For those of you not subscribing to alt.crafts.blacksmithing, I > >researcher doing research on wrought iron sent the following request > >which I am reposting here with his permission. > > > > EBo -- > > > >>Tim Foecke wrote: > >>> > >>> Hello all, > >>> > >>> I am the chief metallurgical investigator in the project looking into > >>> the sinking of the Titanic. I have about 350 pounds of the ship in my > >>> lab, and am looking at the quality of the metal used to construct her. > >>> > >>> We have found (you might have seen in the news) that the wrought iron > >>> in the rivets was of sub-standard quailty, leading to weaknesses at the > >>> junction between the shaft and head and a number of the heads popping > >>> off. > >>> > >>> I have a quandry. I need to establish a baseline of wrought iron > >>> quality for turn-of-the-century UK ironworking. Unfortunately, wrought > >>> iron is not big in the scientific literature, which only came into > >>> being in the 1870s or so, mainly to document the study of steels. > >>> > >>> I am soliciting contributions of wrought iron samples from groups such > >>> as yourselves. If you have Edwardian or Victorian legacy material, > >>> with a fairly good idea of when it was made and what it was originally > >>> used for, I would very much appreciate a donation of a sugar cube-sized > >>> piece for me to study and compare to Titanic. > >>> > >>> Please contact me at tfoecke@nist.gov if you can make a contribution. > >>> I will try to keep you up to date on the study as it progresses, if you > >>> would like. > >>> > >>> Thanks in advance for your consideration, and please pass this request > >>> along to your smithy friends who are not on the net. > >>> > >>> Tim Foecke, PhD > >>> National Institute of Standards and Technology > >>> Gaithersburg, MD, USA > > Remove the "REMOVE_THIS_" from my email address to get to me... > I hate Cullers who gather from newsgroups > > Visit my home page at http://www.esper.com/xvart/index.html ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Good News at Last From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 17 May 2000 02:24:54 GMT -------- Got lotsa hair!! Nary a grey one either. Haven't lost a single one to the Chemo (so far) Indeed I went ahead with the diamond stud..but my hairdresser refused point blank to shave my head. Said she would do it for free IF my hair started to fall out!! Only Half a Barbary pirate yet!! teenut Bill wrote: > > I see the internal 'plating' is working. :) > Great to hear it, will your hair start growing back now? Did you have > any to start with? ;) > > Bill > > In article , > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > > This last few weeks, as some of you know, I have been going through > both > > Chemotherapy and Radiation Treatment. > > > > Over-all the effects havn't been as bad as I expected..though there > have been > > periods when I have been deathly ill..Generally I am in better shape > than I have > > felt for years!! Go Figure! > > > > Recent test results show that I am standing up to the treatments so > well that > > they are going to step up the scheduling. > > > > More importantly..Sparing you the gross details..There are signs that > we have > > this thing on the run!!!!!!!!! > > > > Now to kick and then kill the bastard while it is down!! No pity, No > quarter, > > No Prisoners!! > > > > Again, thanks to all of you for your good wishes and prayers, I know > that sumpn' > > bigger than me is at work out there. > > > > For the last forty years I have hovered between Agnosticism and > Atheism. I have > > often heard it said that there are no Atheists in Foxholes...I am > here to tell > > you...There are very few with Lung Cancer either!!! > > > > Perhaps the Good Lord just wanted to get my attention!! > > > > teenut > > > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Good News at Last From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 17 May 2000 02:30:28 GMT -------- rdanzey@seidata.com wrote: > > YES!!! But don't waste time kicking it. Kill it instantly!!! Hmm!!! But I WANT to kick it a lot first!! It has me pissed off. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Good News at Last From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 17 May 2000 02:33:56 GMT -------- I figured, when I was invited to come for a walk in the Valley of the Shadow...I was going to leave some sorry F*****s behind in there when I left it!! teenut Jeff Pack wrote: > > I'd feel sorry for any cancer that would be foolish enough to take > a crusty old bastard like you on... :) > > best wishes. > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Good News at Last From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 17 May 2000 02:39:31 GMT -------- I never had the pleasure of meeting Altavoz..before my time. Trust me..nothing or no-one in human form deserves the name I have given my little visitor. If I told you I would have to kill you! I HAVE seen my enemy..in living, moving color...that was a joyous day. It was the day I knew I would beat it. teenut Nigel Eaton wrote: > > In article , Robert Bastow > <"teenut"@hotmail.com> writes > >More importantly..Sparing you the gross details..There are signs that we > >have > >this thing on the run!!!!!!!!! > > > > A good friend of mine gave the tumour he beat a name (said it helped him > to think of it that way). > > I suggest you call yours 'Altavoz'. > > "It showed up uninvited, made a real bloody nuisance of itself, then > quietly disappeared, never to be heard from again........ " ;^) > > Cheers > > Nigel > -- > "The Mome Rath hasn't been born that could out-grabe me!". > ------------ > Nigel Eaton ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Cutting expanded sheet From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 17 May 2000 02:49:12 GMT -------- With a long, straight, cutter? ;^) teenut (sorry..couldn't resist!) "jheadley@centralva.net" wrote: > > what is the best way to cut 18 gague expanded sheet in a long, straight > line? > > -- > > How do you eat soup in the Matrix? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Specs on Myford lathes From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 17 May 2000 03:03:37 GMT -------- "The Model Engineers Workshop Manual" George H Thomas. Tee Publishing, ISBN 1-85761-000-8 teenut Steve Blackmore wrote: > > On Tue, 16 May 2000 15:40:52 GMT, Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ > hotmail.com> wrote: > > >I think I learned more of use and value, from George Thomas, than any other > >single source in my entire career! He really acted as a catalyst that helped > >define my Metalworking methods, expectations, objectives and criteria. A huge > >amount of stuff I already "Knew" came together under the Mentorship of George, > >and, while he was alive, we used to correspond at some length. > > > >I have added a tremendous amount of knowledge and experience since then..but I > >can look to that source as a definite "turning point" in my life. > > > >Yeh! The book is worth getting!! > > What's it called? ISBN No? > -- > Steve Blackmore > > Pilot Consultancy Limited ***** Computer Consultants > Telephone 01744 752256 Mobile 0831 768478 > Email: steve@pilotltd.net WWW: http://www.pilotltd.net ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Cutting expanded sheet From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 17 May 2000 03:12:34 GMT -------- My sincere apologies to you Sir, and this Group..You both deserve far better! Sheet metal isn't my Forte'..but I know you will get lots of good answers and information from others here present. Sorry Guys! I just needed a good giggle today! teenut Robert Bastow wrote: > > With a long, straight, cutter? > > ;^) > > teenut > > (sorry..couldn't resist!) > > "jheadley@centralva.net" wrote: > > > > what is the best way to cut 18 gague expanded sheet in a long, straight > > line? > > > > -- > > > > How do you eat soup in the Matrix? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: what lube should I use ? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 17 May 2000 03:21:27 GMT -------- "jheadley@centralva.net" wrote: > my favorite lube is, and always will be, KY jelly > great stuff Frankly, never found the stuff would stand up to the speeds, pressures and feed rates involved. It lacks a high pressure additive...Too much smoke at high speeds! Certainly, it is not up to interrupted cuts. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Most dangerous or scary tool in your shop? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 17 May 2000 03:30:56 GMT -------- In my Home Shop..the Table Saw gets my 150% attention every time..makes my nuts crawl 'til I am finished with it. I won't have a Radial Arm Saw in the place. Next..in any shop..come grinders. I will not have an 8" bench grinder..even a 6" keeps me wary and taking special precautions. Until you have witnessed what a bursting wheel can do, my special prayers for safety go with you all! teenut peter michaux wrote: > > In mine it is the table saw. I hate looking down at that 10" carbide tip > blade spinning at thousands of RPM. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: what lube should I use ? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 17 May 2000 03:51:57 GMT -------- To a trained ear..the right pitch of screaming is an indication that the cut is going well! teenut BillDarby wrote: > > Does the screaming bother you to Bob? :0) > > Bill Darby Glad to hear things are going well for you. > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > "jheadley@centralva.net" wrote: > > > > > my favorite lube is, and always will be, KY jelly > > > great stuff > > > > Frankly, never found the stuff would stand up to the speeds, pressures and feed > > rates involved. It lacks a high pressure additive...Too much smoke at high > > speeds! Certainly, it is not up to interrupted cuts. > > > > teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Good News at Last From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 17 May 2000 04:27:10 GMT -------- Never mind the citation..I couldn't afford the EPA Fines and Clean Up Fees!! Have you no more respect for the groundwater and my grand-children's heritage!! But thanks anyway. 8^) teenut Robert Swinney wrote: > > Teeheenut, > Take all the good wishes and kind sentiments of all the respondents in this > thread, put 'em in a sack, shake 'em up and then dump 'em on Peachtree > Street -- the size of the citation one would get is a measure of my kindly > feelings and best wishes for you. > Bob Swinney > "Eric R. Snow" wrote in message > news:3921e9b0.2567266942@news.whidbey.com... > > Greetings Robert, > > I am so glad that the treatments are beginning to work and that your > > attitude is so good. Though we have never met I feel as if I know a > > part of you by reading your posts over the years. Keep up the good > > work! > > Best wishes, > > Eric R Snow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Good News at Last From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 17 May 2000 07:03:37 GMT -------- Hey Steve, I was In Canada at the time of Terry Fox..Gutsiest Kid Ever..and Steve Fonyo..who did the impossible and followed Terry's act!!!! I am delighted to hear that the dollars we contributed (Yeh..even me!!) went to a good cause. Even more delighted to hear personally from someone who directly benefited..It makes it all the more worthwhile and rewarding to know. I can't wait two years..but I will be there for someone who can. I already have so much to give back and I will find a way. teenut Steve Rayner wrote: > > Same here! When I knew chemo was the next step, my barber was asked to > shave it all off. He said no, but I could have a free haircut if it did > start to fall out. A week later I was back. He still didn't want to do it. > He ran his fingers through my hair, and wound up with a handfull of hair. > That did it, and he cut it all off! > > All the best in your treatments from someone who has been there. > > Small cell carcinoma may be more treatable in two years or so. The > Unversity of British Columbia is developing a "Vaccine", that causes the > body to reject the cancer cells,and kill them. It works in animals, so > human trials will begin in two years. > This is a result of the millions of dollars raised by the late Terry fox, > and Steve Fonyo (Who is still with us). > > Hang in there! > > > Robert Bastow ("teenut"@hotmail.com) wrote: > : Got lotsa hair!! Nary a grey one either. Haven't lost a single one to the Chemo > : (so far) Indeed I went ahead with the diamond stud..but my hairdresser refused > : point blank to shave my head. Said she would do it for free IF my hair started > : to fall out!! > > : Only Half a Barbary pirate yet!! > > : teenut > > : Bill wrote: > : > > : > I see the internal 'plating' is working. :) > : > Great to hear it, will your hair start growing back now? Did you have > : > any to start with? ;) > : > > : > Bill > : > > : > In article , > : > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > : > > This last few weeks, as some of you know, I have been going through > : > both > : > > Chemotherapy and Radiation Treatment. > : > > > : > > Over-all the effects havn't been as bad as I expected..though there > : > have been > : > > periods when I have been deathly ill..Generally I am in better shape > : > than I have > : > > felt for years!! Go Figure! > : > > > : > > Recent test results show that I am standing up to the treatments so > : > well that > : > > they are going to step up the scheduling. > : > > > : > > More importantly..Sparing you the gross details..There are signs that > : > we have > : > > this thing on the run!!!!!!!!! > : > > > : > > Now to kick and then kill the bastard while it is down!! No pity, No > : > quarter, > : > > No Prisoners!! > : > > > : > > Again, thanks to all of you for your good wishes and prayers, I know > : > that sumpn' > : > > bigger than me is at work out there. > : > > > : > > For the last forty years I have hovered between Agnosticism and > : > Atheism. I have > : > > often heard it said that there are no Atheists in Foxholes...I am > : > here to tell > : > > you...There are very few with Lung Cancer either!!! > : > > > : > > Perhaps the Good Lord just wanted to get my attention!! > : > > > : > > teenut > : > > > : > > : > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > : > Before you buy. > > -- > > I'm a Canadian eh! Steve. > ************************************************************************** > The FAQ for rec.crafts.metalworking is at: http://w3.uwyo.edu/~metal > The metalworking drop box is at http://www.metalworking.com > Indexes for Model Engineer Magazine from 1950 to 1999 are at: > http://www.groundlevel.demon.co.uk/me_index.html > ************************************************************************** > Visit my website at: http://www.victoria.tc.ca/~ud233/homepage.htm > > ************* Tu ne cede malis, sed contra audentior ito. **************** > ******************************** - Virgil ******************************** > ******Yield thou not to adversity, but press on the more bravely.********** ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Good News at Last From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 17 May 2000 07:35:26 GMT -------- Oncology Nurse! A very special breed of Angel.. Totally different from the regular RN's who's only mission in life is to inflict, and then remain stone cold and uncaring, about as much human suffering as possible!! I get hugs every day from my Oncology and Radiation Nurses..They are gentle and caring, and walk, suffer and rejoice with every one of their patients, through every Pain and every Victory. How they manage to deal with their inevitable losses and remain so upbeat and HUMAN is beyond me. Give your wife a special hug, and say thank you from teenut! 8^) Carl Byrns wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > > > Recent test results show that I am standing up to the treatments so well that > > they are going to step up the scheduling. > > > > More importantly..Sparing you the gross details..There are signs that we have > > this thing on the run!!!!!!!!! > > > SWMBO (who is an oncology nurse) has been following your posts with me > and notes that small-cell cancer responds quite well- sometimes > dramatically- to chemo > and radiation. > > High doses of piss n' vinegar don't hurt either ;-) > > Keep on fighting! > > -Carl ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Naval Brass From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 17 May 2000 12:18:06 GMT -------- Ernie Leimkuhler wrote: (Regarding Naval Brass and 360 Alloy) > > These 2 alloys are in no way comparable. Shhh! Ain't no comparison in price either. John Jacobs...Double check that the customer will accept 360..then get it in writing! Then make the buggers out of 360 asap. Give him a discount for cash! The ONLY CAVEAT!!!! If life, limb, or safety depends upon the special properties of Naval Brass..In which case YOU have a responsibility to call his attention to it!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What is your Hobby? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 17 May 2000 12:26:12 GMT -------- Ha! The truly skilled and experienced scrapers are coming out of the closet. teenut Peter Drumm wrote: > > In message <20000516111740.09506.00003241@ng-cn1.aol.com> - > gjrepesh@aol.com (GJRepesh) writes: > :-> > :->>Scraping is a skill that every machinist should master..then hope never to > :->>use > :->>again! > :->> > :->>(I sold BOTH my copies of "Machine Tool Reconditioning"..I don't ever have > :->>that > :->>much difficulty getting to sleep!) > :-> > :->There is wisdom to in those words. For me the sleepless nights are over...at > :->least until I decide to do another machine. Maybe I'll come to my senses and > :->stop with this one. Nah, probably not. > > The next machine I do(if there ever is one) is going to the grinding > shop. I sold my Machine Tool Recon book years ago :) > > Custom machining; Tool & Cutter grinding, prices at > > Peter Drumm, Wausau WI > , > Dual Celeron 466's, Abit BP6, Matrox AGP, OS/2 Warp 4, Linux, BeOS ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What is your Hobby? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 17 May 2000 12:31:36 GMT -------- That is a wonderful way to teach kids! I think most of us started that way..and I have watched and encouraged two generations of my own offspring go through the same enlightening process. Sometimes it seems to take forever before the tide turns and they start to get more interested in putting things together, rether than taking them apart. S'Okay..don't rush or push them..they WILL do it in their own good time. teenut ERich10983 wrote: > > >Speaking of hobbies and grand kids------ > >Why not start them out on the right foot this summer vacation, and give them > >something to take apart, like maybe an old type writer, clock, computer > >printer etc. > > I'm doing this with my nephew's kids. The firs time, I gave them a telephone > with explicit instructions to take it apart to find out whats inside it. Their > dad wouldn't let them do it, afraid it would start something he couldn't stop. > Next time I gave them a couple of dot matrix printers and carefully explained > to him my reasons. He agreed and worked with them on the deconstruction > project. They still look forward to my visits with more gadgets to explore. > > > Earle Rich > Mont Vernon, NH ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: any one uses a drill press for milling ? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 17 May 2000 12:41:05 GMT -------- Hats off and hands together for a great Mechanic! It is why threads like this are so important..Every good Machinist needs to know the BEST way to do things, several GOOD ways to do things and what, under NORMAL conditions, is a LOUSY way to do things. Under ABNORMAL conditions..all bets are off, rules are there to be bent and broken..anything to get the job done is acceptable. Knowing the BAD ways helps you to use them without HURTING yourself! teenut Jordan wrote: > > I saw a bush mechanic make a new king-pin for a tractor with one. > It was just a piece of round bar, about 2 inches diam and about a foot > long. Just needed a keyway cut for all of its length. He had it set up to > take very fine cuts, and had some sort of ingenious rig for self-feeding. > Took about 2 days, but succeeded. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Most dangerous or scary tool in your shop? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 17 May 2000 12:47:43 GMT -------- Low Rpm is not a problem. 8" diameter at 3600 is, for me, pushing the envelope a little too close to the point where it starts to get Murphy's attention! teenut Mike Graham wrote: > > On Wed, 17 May 2000 03:30:56 GMT, Robert Bastow wrote: > > >Next..in any shop..come grinders. I will not have an 8" bench grinder..even a > >6" keeps me wary and taking special precautions. Until you have witnessed what > >a bursting wheel can do, my special prayers for safety go with you all! > > I run an 8" all the time, and I'm watching for a 12". A 14" is just too > much to hope for. They hog metal just wonderfully. Of course, my limestone > wheel is about 2" across, but it only turns at about 100 rpm, so it's not > too scary. > > -- > -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- > Mike Graham | Metalworker by trade > mikegraham at sprint dot ca | Weld to live, like to weld. > Caledon, Ontario, Canada | Weird by nature > > -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=- > "By Fire and Iron doth he make Bread." ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Most dangerous or scary tool in your shop? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 18 May 2000 01:31:45 GMT -------- That is too close to the dark side for me! I bear the scars of a sheet (4 x 8 x 1/4") of waferboard that my 5hp Powermatic Tablesaw decided to toss at me. I still consider that a relatively safe operation if you take all the right precautions. It was my fault that on this occasion I omitted to do this and I paid the price. But I still feel I have, by choice, a control over the machine next time. Ripping on a radial arm is too close to a deathwish..those suckers can pull you in or come down the board at you..either way too fast to duck! Your options of control are limited every time to too few. (shudder) teenut eberlein wrote: > Ripping a narrow cut on a long board with a radial arm saw is my least favorite > activity!! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Most dangerous or scary tool in your shop? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 18 May 2000 01:41:58 GMT -------- Yeh! Buffers!! I have a big Burr King and I fitted the optional ten inch buffer to it ..One Time!! With 1 1/2 HP on tap I decided it could kill me in a heartbeat and ever since..slow as it may be..I use nothing more than six inch buff on a 1/4 HP spindle..in otherwords, In a pinch I can stall it by Hand. The big bugger would take (whatever) round the buff and chuck it at you HARD! Figure out the peripheral speed on say a 1 1/2 pound-15" Bowie blade!! No thanks! I LIKE Fingers!! teenut william thomas powers wrote: > > Buffers!!!! They hunger for you and plot against you. I know of more > knifemakers with buffer stories than anyother item in the shop and we're > talking forges, triphammers, grinders, etc. > > Of course having to buff a nearly completed blade doesn't help...had > a friend who was a professional swordmaker who built an *underpowered* > buffer with a spring loaded belt---if something went *wrong* he could stall > the motor or slip the belt rather than have it control him! > > Thomas ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Most dangerous or scary tool in your shop? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 18 May 2000 01:47:14 GMT -------- Most, non Die-makers don't realise just how dangerous even a very small die set is..by itself..Nowhere near a press! Even a little one can nip off fingers before you can blink! I always insist on fitting safety straps to any die before it leaves my shop..Though I understand it doesn't seem to be a legal requirement in the USA as it is in some other countries. teenut "John (EBo) David" wrote: > > Dan Caster wrote: > > > > ... [snip] ... > > > ... But it is repetive work and I am scared > > that I will get careless. So I do my best to be afraid. It the > > closest thing I have to a punch press in that it isn't dangerous if > > you don't get careless, but the repetition can cause one to quit > > thinking. > > I agree that lack of thinking is the worst. It is that that motivated > my "my brain before my 3'rd cup of coffee/tea" > > EBo -- ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Idea to Radius the Edges of Long Pieces of Flat Stock? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 18 May 2000 02:15:01 GMT -------- C'mon down y'hear!! Call 404 799 6304 to be sure I am there to greet you. teenut John Flanagan wrote: > And it's good to hear the news Teenut! :^) One of my first customers > lives near Hotlanta. I'm going to have to come by for a quick visit > while I'm down there. > > Thanks, > > John ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: FREE:APROX 12500 or more 50 pallets 96 Swedish mauser Rifle Stocks From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 18 May 2000 02:16:52 GMT -------- Anyone wanna start a war? teenut Ttools@ix.netcom.com wrote: > > FREE:APROX 12,500 (50 pallets aprox 250 to a pallet) 96 Swedish mauser Rifle > Stocks > > FREE:APROX 12,500 maybe more than that some pallets have 300 on them 50 pallets 96 & Model 39 Swedish mauser Rifle Stocks (walnut and boxwood) takeoffs for sporting conversions, must pickup, must take > all and > get them all by 5/27/00 Located Wa state 98642 > have 8 50 gal drums of hardware sites for same sell $75 per ton > Also have about 1000ea 6.5 barrels and 98 8mm barrels > 99% good or better $5. ea on 6.5 $2. ea on 8mm > must take by the 50gal drum pack 200 to 275 in a drum. > > Thanks Tom > > More details here > http://www.InsideTheWeb.com/mbs.cgi/mb874451 ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: FAQ? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 18 May 2000 02:22:35 GMT -------- I don't know who you are Sir! Or who Cassidy and Eccarius are! But I am sending you the bill for a new Keyboard and Monitor LMFAO!! Thanks teenut Sola wrote: > Cassidy: " Did yeh ever try jumpin' off a roof an' turnin' into a > bat? Or ridin' moonbeams as a cloud of dust? > Eccarius: "I tried the bat thing once. Broke both my fucking legs." > --_Preacher_ ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Typical North American whatever From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 18 May 2000 02:35:54 GMT -------- Ontario, Canada. NAFTA..They didn't "Wink" out of existence..It was wholesale slaughter of tens of thousands of manufacturing jobs..Hundreds of thousands eventually. teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: >and all the stories > I hear are about how jobs are winking out of existence. > > Jim ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Most dangerous or scary tool in your shop? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 18 May 2000 12:48:27 GMT -------- DO feel lucky!! It could have cut your head off. teenut Charles Gallo wrote: > > My almost irrational fear is cables/chains under tension. I say > almost irrational as I got bit by a SMALL cable once (3/16"). > Luckily, when the cable parted, I was far enough way that almost all > the energy was gone when I got hit in the mouth. Lost two teeth, and > needed stitches, and I consider myself lucky > > On Tue, 16 May 2000 23:15:27 -0500, "gcouger" > wrote: > > > >My brother-in-law lucky has a whole list of accidents that nearly > >got him > -- PGP Key on Request > For the Children RKBA! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: FREE:APROX 12500 or more 50 pallets 96 Swedish mauser Rifle Stocks From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 18 May 2000 15:05:36 GMT -------- Yes! I am tooling up..as we speak..to build Mauser actions in Magnum, Standard and Kurtz lengths! teemut XPRTEC wrote: > > Subject: Re: FREE:APROX 12500 or more 50 pallets 96 Swedish mauser Rifle > Stocks > From: Robert Bastow "teenut"@hotmail.com > > Anyone wanna start a war? > > teenut > > Bob, gonna be some heck of a war with only stocks and barrels! Of course > theres always Ebay. Maybe you could get a price war going. > Now theres a goal, anybody know where to get 12,500 "actions"? > > Jim ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 0- 80 tapping in .090" thick aluminum plate From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 18 May 2000 15:13:56 GMT -------- Use a "Forming tap" rather than a cutting tap..find them in MSC catalogue. Follow the recomendations on hole size..it will be larger. Use Tapmagic for aluminum or similar. Set up in drill press if you have one. Ideally...get a tapping head...(cheap enough on Ebay) You will be able to tap your holes as fast as you can pull the handle, at a speed of 1800 rev/min upwards. Perfect thread! you will have to hit the tap with a hammer to break it, and one tap will last for thousands on holes in aluminum. teenut BillDarby wrote: > > I just started the first of a hundred or so holes to be tapped > 0-80 and wondered if the taps I have are up to the task. > I ordered and received two spiffy made in india tapping guides: > > One that you place on the work that holds the tap wrench > perpendicular and free to rotate in a sleeve. The idea is good, but > the tap jaws did not hold the tap properly (the tip wandered around a > hundred thou circle) It's on it's way back. > > The second guide was a tap wrench which was meant to be fitted > into a drill press (just to hold it ,,,, not ever operating the drill > press) It had a telescoping shaft that was clamped into the chuck and > the body of the wrench was then free to be rotated by hand, on the > shaft, down into the work. It did not hold the tap properly either and > the fit of the wrench on the pin was awful. > > I packed both wrenches up and they are going back. I doug > around in my mountain of seemingly useless stuff and found a little > "old" craftsman chuck, on a 7/16 ths arbor, a sleeve that was a perfect > fit on the arbor and a short length of 7/16 rod that I could use as a > guide pin in the chuck of my drill press. I shortened the arbor on > the craftsman chuck as much as possible and drilled and pinned it into > the sleeve. The 0-80 tap now rides perfectly true, in the craftsman > chuck. > > So!!! I drilled about six .0469" test holes in a test plate and > tried out the rig. The tap was held nice and true and with a little > tapping fluid I got down through three of the holes (rotating the sleeve > like a man trying to start a fire with a "stick") It's not pretty but > it works however I am feeling a fair amount of resistance on the tap and > I don't think it will stand up long. > > I did not use a lot of tapping fluid and I did not clean the tap > between holes and!!! I did not buy the most expensive taps. (five of > them at about $5 each) > > Is there anything more that you think I should, or might do to > make this task go better?? > > Thanks .... Bill Darby ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Thanks to Dale Grover for Machine Tool Reconditioning group buy From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 18 May 2000 18:37:09 GMT -------- And so..Another group of sonambulist trainee scrapers starts the long road to recovery! teenut Michael T Kasimirsky wrote: > > Hey everyone, > > I just wanted to take a minute to publicly thank Dale Grover for all > his work on the group buy of the Machine Tool Reconditioning books. > I got mine yesterday and I've got nothing but praise for Mr. Grover > and all his hard work on this project. > > I can see why everyone wants a copy of this book. Wow, there's plenty > of good information in it. Now I just wish I knew a way to acquire > the skills detailed in the book without the hours and hours of labor. :-) > > Michael T. Kasimirsky ----> mtk@tmc.astm.cmri.cmu.edu > Days: Staff Engineer or mk4u@andrew.cmu.edu > ASTM Test Monitoring Center Phi Gamma Delta > Nights: 1993 Kawasaki ZX1100D1 Pilot NRA Life Member, AMA Member > 1990 Yamaha FZR400 Superbike Racer FASTTRAX & WERA Expert #21 > 1991 Suzuki GSF400 Bandit Mechanic ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Most dangerous or scary tool in your shop? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 19 May 2000 03:20:46 GMT -------- No way I am going to grind 1.4" off ANY part of my body..just to see if it would grow back bigger! Anyway..I take a size 14 1/2 ring and size 12WWW shoes..so go figure! teenut JP wrote: > > Hey! If we could get that growth targeted in the right places (2 for > women and 1 place for men), Bill Gates would have nothin' on us!! > > I'd be the spokesman: "I'm not just the president on the Inch Adders > Club, I added 5" to my own putz! > > Salamander blood.....Mike, you're a hoot! > > Regards, > JP > > mikegraham@sprint.ca (Mike Graham) wrote: > > ">"On 18 May 2000 14:13:22 GMT, DAFkite wrote: > ">" > ">">that said, my worst injury was from the bench grinder, took about > ">">1.4" off the end of a thumb.... it grew back though.....no scar > ">">even.... > ">" > ">" You grew back almost an inch and a half of thumb? Would you > happen to > ">"have any salamander blood in your family? 8-) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Welding glass? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 19 May 2000 04:02:30 GMT -------- Someone, whose opinion I respect, told me today about a technique for welding glass sheets together with a stick welder. The sheets of (pyrex) glass are set up with a steel backing plate. The "Electrode" is a common drinking straw filled with clean silica sand, with a length of Iron wire threaded through it. The ends of the straw are then pinched and twisted to stop the sand running out. Welding procedes by sriking the arc through to the steel backing plate and welding as usual..the molten silica sand fuses the edges of the glass together, while the backing plate and its bead of iron are easily removed. Said to give a very rough looking weld...but very effective, and is used to make up special sized pyrex vats. It is a new one on me..it SOUNDS Feasable!! And I have no reason to doubt my source, who says it was demonstrated to him by his Father. Does anyone have any DIRECT experience or knowledge that this works or not? (please spare us the WAG'S) Thanks teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: FS: 7" Atlas Shaper From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 19 May 2000 11:56:32 GMT -------- For the right person..in the right place...That Machine was worth every penny of $1600.00! I wouldn't sell either one, of my three shapers for that price. teenut TrigTrax wrote: > > You people make me feel guilty.. I dragged one out of a guys basement for $125 > and for $35 more he threw in a Butterfly Filing machine. > I watched that auction of the 12" with tilting table on e-bay. One day it was > $200 and by the end they bid it up to around $1600.I thought I'd die! > The internet may be the greatest thing since sliced bread but not for buying > old cast iron. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: WTB:1-1/2 x 8 Tap From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 19 May 2000 12:20:12 GMT -------- You will see this size frequently on Ebay..cheap! I have bought several larger taps there with nary a problem. teenut Ttools@ix.netcom.com wrote: > > Wanted a good used 1-1/2 x 8 tap let if you have one to sell or want to trade for some other size tap > Thanks Tom ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: accurate hole technique From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 20 May 2000 02:36:11 GMT -------- Quit fighting the inevitable..set up the boring head, as any sane machinist would! Then finish ream if you must. Sheesh! teenut Miles Jaffe wrote: > > Looking for tips to make accurately sized and located holes on a BP. > Tolerance? As tight as I can make it. > > Locating is not to bad - I use the plug method to locate the spindle in > relation to the work. But no matter how nicely I locate, I cannot get a > 'true' hole. I can get a nicely sized hole with a parabolic drill or a > reamer but the holes usually wander somewhat no matter how carefully they > are center drilled and then step drilled up to size, even using screw length > parabolic drills. I find that a 3/8" hole 1.2" deep can easily wander .0005" > or more, both axially AND from it's spotted location. And yes, I've set the > spindle vertical to my fixture within .0001" or so. > > I'd rather not set up a boring head to make nice straight 3/8" and 1/2" > holes. Next step is to try plunging an 11/32" center-cutting end mill > followed by a 3/8" reamer (and 15/32" emill / 1/2" reamer). I'll drill a > small clearance hole to start to make the plunge easier. > > EXPERIENCED suggestions appreciated. Please, no "put some hair around it" or > "buy a jig borer" answers. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: bastard explained From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 21 May 2000 17:21:32 GMT -------- Absolute Rubbish! In Old English a "bastard" (size, type what-have-you) is anything that falls between two accepted standard sizes or types. 'Mr Barstard" never existed and is the figment of some ignorant writer's mind! teenut Jim Stewart wrote: > > I was thumbing through Audel's "Machinists and Tool Makers Handy Book", > 1946 edition when I found this little gem: > > ____________ > > Ques. What is a bastard file? > Ans. A misnomer and nothing can be done about it. > > According to Raabe, the so-called bastard file was invented by an > Englishman named Barsted. When English machinists came over and asked > for Barsted files, the Americans naturally thought Barsted was the > English pronunciation for bastard. By definition: A file between > coarse and second cut. > > ______________ > > How about it, Robert? Relation of yours? > > -js > > -- > > http://www.strappe.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Cutting keyways with shapers From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 22 May 2000 23:50:20 GMT -------- By hand..A couple of thou on each backstroke until you reach depth. Some larger Shapers have an automatic downfeed. teenut Rob wrote: > > How do you advance the down feed of a shaper while it's running to cut keyways? > > Rob > > Rob Dennett, Software Engineer > > Top Drawer Productions > Multimedia that entertains, educates and uplifts. > > 1606 Headway Cir. > Austin, TX 78751 > (512) 719 - 4001 ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: maximat 7 change gears From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 23 May 2000 04:06:48 GMT -------- Even if the welding fails..It will probably be cheaper to have a local CNC shop knock you one out. Blue Ridge prices are wicked. Fax me a drawing 404 792 2668 and I will give you a quotation..based on my Rec.crafts Metalworking/HSM rates!! teenut metalmauler@webtv.net wrote: > > Group: rec.crafts.metalworking Date: Sat, May 20, 2000, 7:34am (EDT-3) > From: pdrahnNOpdSPAM@coinet.com.invalid (paul) Re: maximat 7 change > gears > > > >I just broke the quadrant casting on my lathe > > and am looking for a replacement. Blue Ridge > > has not replied to email. Any thoughts on > > this? > > >Paul in Redmond, Oregon. > > Instead of replacing it, why don't you just take it to a fab shop? All > you need to do is "V" it out and braize it. Make sure it's clamped flat > so the gears retain the same backlash and everything is plumb and square > to each other. Not that bad of a job, and it'll be a LOT cheaper. > > My 2 cents, > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------- > Gallery of Machines Machinetool Rebuilders > > New & Used,Reconditioned Machines > > Russ Penrose > > Marathon NY > > Part/timeWoodworker ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Industrial applications of a CO2 laser? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 23 May 2000 04:14:59 GMT -------- "[©ØMMÄÑУ®]" wrote: > BTW, I recieved an honerable mention for my work. Congratulations Robin! I think you have earned an "Honorable Mention" from this NG too. The "Old Farts" find it encouraging to know that there are young people like you, ready, willing and able, to pick up the banner! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Chuck Threads Fit From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 23 May 2000 04:26:56 GMT -------- It is (or should be) the register..both on diameter and on the rear face..that do the location of thr chuck. The thread is simply there to hold the chuck to the register. As such it can be a "Rattling good fit" without detriment. Indeed, a tight fit on the thread would be a definite drawback..no way can a vee thread act as a location or centering device to the accuracy required by a chuck. Even if it set out that way..lapped to fit etc...it would soon wear and loose it. Threads are HOLDING devices ..not LOCATING devices. Yes..even leadscrews are only good for AXIAL location. teenut brownnsharp@my-deja.com wrote: > > I just bought a Chinese chuck, with a backplate. The backplate rattles > on the 1 1/2 X8 thread on my SB spindle. The thread is at least 0.012 > oversize. The straight parallel shank behind the thread on the spindle > is 0.04 smaller than the bore on the backplate. It seems to run fairly > true though, so I am going to try it. I am curious if anyone has any > idea of what is reasonable tolerance for spindle/backplate fit. I have > always made my own backplates, and I just made them fit, i.e. snug. > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Is it steel or gold? Rip-off? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 23 May 2000 04:32:08 GMT -------- Seems like a pretty fair price to me. Call your nearest full service stockist and ask the price of three similar pieces cut to size! teenut Doug Warner wrote: > > It's been a long time since I bought any steel stock. I needed some > 1/4" plate, so I stopped at a local steel shop. It's a small outfit, > but they have a good assortment of items. I found three 1/4" 6" > square pieces in a bucket full of cut-off's next to a big shear. They > charged me $10.00 for all three. Seems a tad expensive, especially > since they didn't cut anything for me. > > To reply, please remove one letter from each side of "@" > Spammers are scammers, avoid them! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Need Help w/ Gear Hobber From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 01:27:03 GMT -------- While it sounds real feasable in theory..I have real reservations of it working in practice. Remember you are trying to pull a single tooth cutter many many times along the same path..for each of up to six or eight grooves and at twist rates varying from one in 6.5" to one in 72" I am not sure the average cnc lath headstock and carriage could handle that for long. OTOH My new Fadal machining center is equiped with a CNC 4th Axis. I KNOW that that could produce the linear pull force (over 40") AND the required degree of repeatable angular "twist Control"..it could be set up to rifle barrels all day long. However..For the almost $100,000.00 cost of a machine like that, I could build you half a dozen, dedicated, cut rifling machines that would do an even better job of rifling match grade barrels! Perhaps double that number of top grade Button rifling machines. teenut (who knows enough about drilling and rifling top class, match grade barrels..to want to buy ALL mine from the guys who REALLY know how to do it..and will sell you the worlds finest barrels for under $200.00 each!! Ole-Hjalmar Kristensen wrote: > > John Stevenson writes: > > This reminds me of something I ahve thought about for a while. > Would not a CNC machine be ideal for rifling gun barrels? > You could get any twist rate you wanted. > The program would be about as trivial as John's program below. > The only problem I can see is if the resolution of the servo is > limited, so you would not get a smooth enough helix, but I assume that > is not a problem with modern commercial equipment. > I haven't checked, but it would not surprise me if a used CNC machine > could be bought for the same price as a Pratt & Whitney rifling > machine (if indeed you can find one). > Comments, anyone? (Teenut?) > > > On 22 May 2000 14:47:34 -0400, paul@tiger.auroragrp.com (Paul Amaranth) > > wrote: > > > > >In article <3925D66F.30195352@nxnetworks.com> bholder@nxnetworks.com writes: > > >>Bruce > > >> > > >>PS - Anybody ever hear of a benchtop gear hobber? > > > > > >Yes, I saw a picture of one in, I think, PIM the other year. I think > > >there was an article in ME on how to build one. > > > > > >It occurs to me you could build a CNC gear machine much easier than > > >building a hobbing machine. You could probably even handle helical > > >gears without too much trouble (excluding the software, of course, that's > > >always trouble) > > > > > > > I have posted a picture and text file in the dropbox at > > www.metalworking.com > > > > This file accompanies one called Helical.jpg > > The picture relates to a brass helical gear being cut on a CNC milling > > machine with a home made cutter machined as a 'D' bit. > > The cutter was made from a piece of silver steel [ drill rod ] from the > > details on making gear cutters in the Metal Web news article. > > The program was quite easy and actually consisted of one line that gave the > > angle that the rotary axis had to travel whilst moving the X axis. > > This is basically the lead angle of the gear. All formula's were obtained > > from the Browne and Sharp book 'A Treatise on Gear Cutting' > > This line was then repeated 37 times to finish up with a 38 tooth gear. > > The 4 gears required were cut off this blank by parting off. > > This 'quick and dirty repair' was to get a customer out of the proverbial > > 's**t'whilst he ordered some new gears. > > Needless to say they are still in and working. > > > > -- > > > > Regards, > > John Stevenson > > Special Purpose Machines > > Nottingham, England > > -- > E pluribus Unix ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Way OT, but need and answer if possible... From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 12:05:41 GMT -------- "John (EBo) David" wrote: > Actually I lived in a home that had a really nice hydro system in it. For our Non-Canadian readers..wondering what kind of home heating a Hydraulic System can provide..... In Canada, most electrical power comes from Hydro-Electric generating stations. Hence, the common name for electricity is "Hydro" teenut Who has built many a Hydro Powered, Hydraulic System!! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Cutting keyways with shapers From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 12:27:27 GMT -------- mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > Coolest shaper pic I ever saw was the ww2 vintage production of > interrupted threads for the breeches of large guns. Where, Where, Where? You may recall that one of my projects is a WWI 9.2" Howitzer to 1 :12 scale. I would love to see that photograph if you still know where it is! > > Jim (wishing Robert all the best) Thanks Jim, Frankly, I will be glad when I can declare myself cured..and we can all stop being nice to each other and get back to the seriously informative and fun business, of snapping at each other's heels. I miss my daily "duels" with the other curmudgeons on this list!! ;^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Hard Anodizing From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 24 May 2000 12:47:24 GMT -------- I have a customer with a regular requirement for aluminum parts. The surface treatment specified is "Clear, Hard, Anodizing" I would swear on a stack of bibles, that I used to get this done on a regular basis..a few years ago. However, both my local anodizers are equally adamant that this is impossible! I can have either "Clear" or "Hard"..but not both! They told me that the "Hard" anodizing would come out a "Greyish" color..so the client decided to give it a try. Whoops! "Greyish" turns out to be damned near Black..absolutely useless to the client who uses thes components in an optical comparator process. He requires a light but not highly reflective finish. I was able to get him by temporarily with steel components..ground to the required tenth thou limits and then treated with a light solution of a parkerising type rust remover. This left a light greyish, non reflective surface that "will do for now" However.."Clear Hard Anodizing" is what he wants..Period! Are both of us dreaming? Or are there processers who can do this? If so..Who, and where are they? Thanks for your help. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Small lathe questions... From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 25 May 2000 01:43:58 GMT -------- Brian Lawson wrote: > > Why does it have to be small. No room, or no dollars? > > Some school shops are open for part of the year outside "regular" > teaching days. > Have you got a summer job yet? Maybe if you take your present project > around to a few places they would hire you for the summer, and let you > use there machines after hours, or even help you. I bet if you lived > in Atlanta, TO-nut would be drooling over you! Perhaps "Drooling" is a less than appropriate description..But for sure I would welcome a few "improvers" like Robin. I would pay them well..more as they learned. I would teach them a helluva lot about all aspects of the trade..and give them free run of the shop to work on their own products in their own time. How else does the industry expect to get the trained people we need ..Now and in the Future. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Knifemaking supplies? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 25 May 2000 01:58:22 GMT -------- Atlanta Cutlery are probably the WORST possible source for knifemaking supplies. Get yourself a copy of Knives Illustrated and /or Blade Magazine. Lots of good suppliers listed there. Try a search on Knifemakers supplies (WOW..what an original Idea) Check out Jantz Supplies. Texas Knifemakers Supplies. Sheffield Knifemakers Supplies... Hell if I do any more work for you I might as well come over and make the blades for you!! Ger wrote: > > Hello, > > I'm just starting out in knifemaking, does anyone know of a good source > for supplies other than Atlanta Cutlery? > > Thanks, > Ger ======== Newsgroups: alt.machines.cnc,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: tolerancing, geometry files...what and how do you prefer From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 27 May 2000 03:38:16 GMT -------- Whereas, I, As a Working Custom Machine Shop, CNC machining and Tool and Die Shop Owner, will be glad to see the back of this thread....and see the Alt CNC Dreamers piss off back to their Dream NG and their Dream Worlds. They are the kind of "Engineers"/"Customers" that I enjoy telling to take a Hike!! They don't know Shit from Shinola and just can't wait to brag to the world about it! teenut Bill wrote: > > I would like to thank all who have participated in this thread. > > Bill Griffin > > Bill wrote in message ... > >I run a small ModelShop for a mid sized electronics company. Our > engineering > >team designs in ProE and provides solid model files to the ModelShop for us > >to fabricate prototype parts. > >You can see samples of the kinds of parts we fabricate at: > >http://www.grifftek.com/images/misc/sample_parts/smp.html > Snip > >Bill Griffin > >www.grifftek.com/links.htm > > > > > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Small lathe questions... From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 27 May 2000 04:11:43 GMT -------- It has been almost ten years since I worked in Southern Ontario..So I can't give you any reliable/positive leads..A heck of a lot of shops have simply been ground out of existance by the NAFT agreement. However! Don't you DARE take another job at Loblaws..EVER!! Not if you REALLY want to learn this trade! There are still plenty of good shops around in the Toronto Area..perhaps more per square mile in the Golden Horseshoe than almost any other part of North America. Go Dig 'em out..Both they and You will be glad when you make the right connection. Get out the yellow pages, get on the Blower and TALK to every shop owner/manager you can find. Trust me..Most of them WILL be happy and willing to talk with you about your plans and achievements..those that don't/won't are the loosers not you. Get on your bike or the bus and go bang on their doors..you won't believe how little competition you have from your age group. Be willing to start at whatever they offer (over Loblaws levels!!) Do what ever they want you to start doing (It will probably involve a broom somewhere :^)...Watch, listen, ask questions, take an interest, show willingness and they WILL start adding more demanding/productive jobs to your "Job Spec" The more you do, the more you show ability and willingness to master..the more they will add and the more they will be willing to teach you..and pay you. In fewer years than you might at first imagine, you will become a rare commodity....a YOUNG Skilled Machinist. You will be able to parley that into any kind or direction of Engineering career that you want...simply because you will have an unbeatable "Edge" over all the other "Wannabees..But didn't wanna work at it's" Good Luck. teenut "[©ØMMÄÑУ®]" wrote: > > Hmmm... Know any shops like yours in Toronto? :) I don't know if I can take > another summer at Loblaws (local grocer). > > Thanks for all the suggestions everyone. I'm gonna try an look for a used > 22" or something like that. I'm also entertaining a number of other > thoughts, so I'll be in touch when/if I make a decision :) > > Regards, > > Robin > > "Robert Bastow" <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote in message > news:yz%W4.3646$t4.47330@news1.rdc1.ga.home.com... > > > > > > Brian Lawson wrote: > > > > > > Why does it have to be small. No room, or no dollars? > > > > > > Some school shops are open for part of the year outside "regular" > > > teaching days. > > > Have you got a summer job yet? Maybe if you take your present project > > > around to a few places they would hire you for the summer, and let you > > > use there machines after hours, or even help you. I bet if you lived > > > in Atlanta, TO-nut would be drooling over you! > > > > Perhaps "Drooling" is a less than appropriate description..But for sure I > would > > welcome a few "improvers" like Robin. I would pay them well..more as they > > learned. I would teach them a helluva lot about all aspects of the > trade..and > > give them free run of the shop to work on their own products in their own > time. > > > > How else does the industry expect to get the trained people we need ..Now > and in > > the Future. > > > > teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Be an Associate and work at your Own pace!- FAR FROM SPAM From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 27 May 2000 04:28:52 GMT -------- D Collins wrote: > Favorites: > > The Dirty Vicar > > The Dead Parrot > > Department of Silly Walks > OK! OK! Already! Yes..they were very funny..so I guess I DID like some of Monty Python. But John Cleese was (IMHO) far funnier in "Faultey Towers" Que? In "A Fish Called Wanda" he was SUPERB!!! (so was everybody else!!) For those who recall..the scene where Kevin Kline is throwing an incredible line to Cleese' wife and Cleese just stands there for several seconds with an absolutely blank look of disbelief on his face...that is truly the peak of an absolute mastery of the comedians art. I can replay that segment over and over again, and it kills me every time! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Dryer vent question From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 27 May 2000 05:29:13 GMT -------- Nope! It's called "Duck" tape 'cos you wrap it round your pet duck so it doesn't burst when you screw it! Works with Gerbils too! teenut PLAlbrecht wrote: > > >I just love when I see it called "DUCK" tape. > > That's used to hold ruptured ducks together. > > Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Myford ML7 Tailstock adjust From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 27 May 2000 06:05:43 GMT -------- "Good Practice" in machine tool design and building is to make sure that the machine first wears "more accurate" before it starts to wear "less accurate" teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > which is a current project. The machine was made in 1938. But > when I put an indicator in the spindle, and swept the tailstock > ram, it read zeros all the way 'round. Now how else could this > be (given the obvious wear on the bed and bottom of tailstock) > unless it was rigged high to start with. > > Jim ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Chuck Threads Fit From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 27 May 2000 08:04:02 GMT -------- B & L Denard wrote: > > Robert ! > You can lead a mule to water but you cant make him drink. > The thds are to hold chuck on lathe ,the Register lines it up. are we > right.? > Bill D. Dead Right! I have been holding off on replying to the many messages on this thread. Several reasons have involved workload and available energy level.. But the main one was that I was trying to think of a way of telling so many otherwise apparently knowledgeable (and nice) people that they are full of "S***" in a polite way..the other was trying to figure out why they could be so mistaken. Bingo! the light finally went on! You see..in theory..they are right. Threads are the only centering device you need..so long as they are perfect! The problem is that there are two very different kinds of "Design Engineers" A pre-requisite for the job is an ability to envision three dimensional spatial relationships..preferably in full color and in full, real time movement. In other words the instinctive ability to envisage how two, or many more, three dimensional parts will fit and interact together...put all the parts of a simple ..or complex...piece of machinery, together in your mind and watch it run through complete cycles in your "Mind's Eye" (studies and tests done, in the selecting of suitable candidates for apprenticeship training programs, have shown that a far greater proportion of Females possess this quality than Males!!!! Unfortunately, in our culture at least, a very large proportion of females rule themselves out from engineering or machinist type careers because of a lack of (acquired) ability in quite basic math, and/or, an aversion to any kind of job that might involve getting their hands dirty or appearing less than "feminine" to their family or friends) Room for a whole different thread there!! Why then do so many "mechanically knowledgeable" people screw up on something as simple and basic as the functioning of a threaded lathe spindle nose? This type and many many other examples of similar thinking had me puzzled for years...years during which I could only shake my head and either countermand it, change it or fix it!! Until I realized that mechanical "designers" fall into two, fundamentally different groups! one large..the other small..or should I say practically all start out in the larger group..but only a few eventually cross over into the smaller group. The first, larger group, see all their elements and components, in their "minds eye" as perfectly formed, sized, aligned etc....If you like, as a computer generated "Perfect Picture" These people are dead right..two perfectly formed, perfectly dimensioned, perfectly finished...and perfectly started!! threads, will indeed locate and perfectly center a chuck on a spindle without any aid from a register. These people design parts and mechanisms as though the world were perfect..and then wonder why it doesn't all come together and "work" perfectly!! Others, a smaller group, envisage the parts or components as they "really are"..in a "real" world..and how these "less than perfect" bits will REALLY interact, fit, and move together. Their designs actually start out with a genuine chance of "working"!! First of all..ask yourselves...why lathes (of any quality, durability and reputation) are, in fact, provided with a fitted register AND a threaded nose piece. SURELY so many different machine tool designers from so many companies, so many countries and over so many years, can't possibly have continued to waste their Company's manufacturing resources, and cut into Corporate Profit levels by providing an (apparently) useless and expensive appendage, as a spindle nose register, without SOMEONE yelling out "The Emperor has no clothes"!!..and getting the whole lot of them fired on the spot Why...would any Die, Fixture, Tooling or Machine Designer be laughed out of the drawing office if..faced with the need for an ACCURATELY located pin or dowel, he simple spec'ed a tapped hole and a pin with a thread to match? Reason? Because anyone who understands and can envisage the way REAL parts fit and interact in the REAL world..would know and understand that, IN REALITY...it simply DON'T WORK THAT WAY. Real World threads DON'T come perfectly formed, matched, dimensioned, centered and located!!! As a result..if you screw a couple of them together WITHOUT OTHER MEANS OF RADIAL AND AXIAL LOCATION....They will do ANYTHING BUT self center and or locate! I could go on..but it is late, I am tired, and I am sure the ding dong "Battle" this will start, will give me more than enough opportunities to fire a few more shots from my "Ready Ammo" locker!! Just remember Guys (And I Love and Respect all of you)..Don't bring knives to a gun fight!! ;^) teenut > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote in article > ... > > It is (or should be) the register..both on diameter and on the rear > face..that > > do the location of thr chuck. The thread is simply there to hold the > chuck to > > the register. As such it can be a "Rattling good fit" without detriment. > > > > Indeed, a tight fit on the thread would be a definite drawback..no way > can a vee > > thread act as a location or centering device to the accuracy required by > a > > chuck. Even if it set out that way..lapped to fit etc...it would soon > wear and > > loose it. > > > > Threads are HOLDING devices ..not LOCATING devices. Yes..even leadscrews > are > > only good for AXIAL location. > > > > teenut > > > > brownnsharp@my-deja.com wrote: > > > > > > I just bought a Chinese chuck, with a backplate. The backplate rattles > > > on the 1 1/2 X8 thread on my SB spindle. The thread is at least 0.012 > > > oversize. The straight parallel shank behind the thread on the spindle > > > is 0.04 smaller than the bore on the backplate. It seems to run fairly > > > true though, so I am going to try it. I am curious if anyone has any > > > idea of what is reasonable tolerance for spindle/backplate fit. I have > > > always made my own backplates, and I just made them fit, i.e. snug. > > > > > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > > > Before you buy. > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Small lathe questions... From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 27 May 2000 08:16:49 GMT -------- Don't like football..could never figure where I was supposed to throw the bat after I hit the ball!! I have taught a helluva lot of Apprentices though..and turned out a lot of first class Machinists! Go do it..There really are a lot of the older hands out there that would jump at the chance to pass some of it along! teenut "[©ØMMÄÑУ®]" wrote: > > Have you every coached football? I think you'd do a great job at it :) I > think I'll have to take your advice and go "bang on some doors". > > I just have to find the time.... Hrm... > > Robin > > "Robert Bastow" <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote in message > news:3WHX4.3745$t4.52204@news1.rdc1.ga.home.com... > > It has been almost ten years since I worked in Southern Ontario..So I > can't give > > you any reliable/positive leads..A heck of a lot of shops have simply been > > ground out of existance by the NAFT agreement. > > > > However! > > > > Don't you DARE take another job at Loblaws..EVER!! Not if you REALLY want > to > > learn this trade! > > > > There are still plenty of good shops around in the Toronto Area..perhaps > more > > per square mile in the Golden Horseshoe than almost any other part of > North > > America. Go Dig 'em out..Both they and You will be glad when you make the > right > > connection. > > > > Get out the yellow pages, get on the Blower and TALK to every shop > owner/manager > > you can find. Trust me..Most of them WILL be happy and willing to talk > with you > > about your plans and achievements..those that don't/won't are the loosers > not > > you. > > > > Get on your bike or the bus and go bang on their doors..you won't believe > how > > little competition you have from your age group. Be willing to start at > > whatever they offer (over Loblaws levels!!) Do what ever they want you to > start > > doing (It will probably involve a broom somewhere :^)...Watch, listen, ask > > questions, take an interest, show willingness and they WILL start adding > more > > demanding/productive jobs to your "Job Spec" > > > > The more you do, the more you show ability and willingness to master..the > more > > they will add and the more they will be willing to teach you..and pay you. > > > > In fewer years than you might at first imagine, you will become a rare > > commodity....a YOUNG Skilled Machinist. You will be able to parley that > into > > any kind or direction of Engineering career that you want...simply because > you > > will have an unbeatable "Edge" over all the other "Wannabees..But didn't > wanna > > work at it's" > > > > Good Luck. > > > > teenut > > > > "[©ØMMÄÑУ®]" wrote: > > > > > > Hmmm... Know any shops like yours in Toronto? :) I don't know if I can > take > > > another summer at Loblaws (local grocer). > > > > > > Thanks for all the suggestions everyone. I'm gonna try an look for a > used > > > 22" or something like that. I'm also entertaining a number of other > > > thoughts, so I'll be in touch when/if I make a decision :) > > > > > > Regards, > > > > > > Robin > > > > > > "Robert Bastow" <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote in message > > > news:yz%W4.3646$t4.47330@news1.rdc1.ga.home.com... > > > > > > > > > > > > Brian Lawson wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Why does it have to be small. No room, or no dollars? > > > > > > > > > > Some school shops are open for part of the year outside "regular" > > > > > teaching days. > > > > > Have you got a summer job yet? Maybe if you take your present > project > > > > > around to a few places they would hire you for the summer, and let > you > > > > > use there machines after hours, or even help you. I bet if you > lived > > > > > in Atlanta, TO-nut would be drooling over you! > > > > > > > > Perhaps "Drooling" is a less than appropriate description..But for > sure I > > > would > > > > welcome a few "improvers" like Robin. I would pay them well..more as > they > > > > learned. I would teach them a helluva lot about all aspects of the > > > trade..and > > > > give them free run of the shop to work on their own products in their > own > > > time. > > > > > > > > How else does the industry expect to get the trained people we need > ..Now > > > and in > > > > the Future. > > > > > > > > teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Dryer vent question From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 27 May 2000 08:20:51 GMT -------- Naw! Doesn't have the holding power for gerbils..See, they don't like it and they wriggle loose real quick from Sparky tape! teenut bholder@nxnetworks.com wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > Works with Gerbils too! > > > > I thought it was black electrician's tape for gerbils. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Leblond lathe From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 27 May 2000 14:36:28 GMT -------- I have two in the shop, a 15" Dual-Drive and a 14" (Duh! I can't remember the name..but a latter model than the Dual Drive) I agree, they are top grade machines and I love 'em! Unfortunately, in prior ownerships, my LeBlonds were "Ridden hard and put up wet" too many times..so I have to relegate them, for the time being, to roughing and primary ops. However, they stay! Until I have time to have one or both rebuilt..or until I get an offer I can't refuse!! ( Or until one "finds its way" into my home shop!!) BTW..that doesn't mean they are beat up relics..they still cut better and straighter than most lathes do when brand new. They just can't be relied to do so "first time..every time" without the touch and time of a skilled operator..which is an expensive commodity in a Jobbing Shop. teenut Marty Escarcega wrote: > > I was fortunate enough with the tip/help of a local friend to pick up a > LeBlond 15"x44" Dual Drive Gear/Belt drive lathe with some tooling. It had > a twisted shaft, which was still available from http://www.leblondusa.com. > I've recently replaced it and got the machine up and running. LeBlond's > customer service is top notch. They still had records on my 50 year old > machine and knew its ship date, who it was sold to and for how much. For > being 50 years old this lathe is feature rich with well thought out ideas. > Personally I believe LeBlond to be one of the best machines available. > > Anyone else have one or use one? > > Marty ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Small lathe questions... From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 28 May 2000 00:51:34 GMT -------- I used to have the statistics..until I lost interest and dumped them. But one of our Canadian Readers may be able to come up with the number of manufacturing jobs the NAFTA agreement cost Canada. Purely from a faulty memory cames a figure of 400,000 in Southern Ontario alone. Whole manufacturing plants were loaded on trucks and sent to the USA and Mexico. Plants employing 600 to 3000 manufacturing employees became "Distribution Centers" with 12 to 60 clerical staff. This was so that the companies involved could avoid the Political Incorrectness of "Shutting Down"..the work and workers could be quietly phases out over a period of a few months. Others followed a "Scorched Earth" policy. In order to avoid any likely hood of being Politically pressured into returning to Canada..not only was the equipment moved and the workforce laid off..but the buildings were sold and flattened and reverted to "Car parks" Because of higher wage and overhead costs in Canada..plus the need to build, insulate and heat plants for a 9 month winter!! Canadian manufacturing became, of neccesity, far more efficient and automated that its US counterparts. Consequently the Canadian Automation Industry was relatively larger and more advanced than its US counterparts. With the Canadian market place decimated, I formed, in 1991 a Consortium of some of the most technically advanced Canadian Companies..In the fields of Automated Parts orientation, feeding and assembly. High speed automated manufacture, assembly and in-process gauging..including automated vision and parts recognition capabilities. High speed packaging and custom designed (mainly gantry and track type) Industrial Robotics. I brought this Consortium south to where the new market "Should" have been about to develop. I chose to begin in the South East..in Atlanta..simply because I had lived hear before and preferred the climate and topograpgy to that of the South west. It didn't take long to realise that Automation was never going to come to the South East!! Most of the Manufacturing Facilities had been set up here to take advantage of lower paid, non-union, workforces, lower heating and other operating costs, lower standards of building code, safety and polution controls etc etc. It came as quite a shock to enter busy plants here and literally, take a step back into the 19th Century. Lines of cheap "sweated" labor for whom "automation" meant a power screw driver. More depressingly were plant managers determined that..when costs here eventually rose to unacceptable levels, the movement would NOT be to greater Manufacturing efficency and automation..but to Mexico and the Pacific Rim countries where cheap labor and lower standards and cost could still be found!! teenut gcouger wrote: > > "Robert Bastow" <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote in message > news:3WHX4.3745$t4.52204@news1.rdc1.ga.home.com... > : It has been almost ten years since I worked in Southern Ontario..So I > can't give > : you any reliable/positive leads..A heck of a lot of shops have simply been > : ground out of existance by the NAFT agreement. > : > I don't know about Canada but in the US it was CNC and longer part life on > cars, truck, earth moving and farm machinery and the consolidation of > small business and farms that killed the little shops. > > -- > Gordon W5RED > > G. C. Couger gcouger@couger.com Stillwater, OK > www.couger.com/gcouger > "You miss 100 percent of the shots you never take." - Wayne Gretzky ======== Newsgroups: alt.machines.cnc,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: tolerancing, geometry files...what and how do you prefer From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 28 May 2000 01:11:57 GMT -------- I guess, If I had to explain..you wouldn't understand! teenut Bill wrote: > > Robert > > I tried to reply to your post via email but it bounced. > > Could you please explain your post, I do not quite understand what you are > talking about. > > Bill Griffin > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> > wrote in message ... > >Whereas, I, As a Working Custom Machine Shop, CNC machining and Tool and > Die > >Shop Owner, will be glad to see the back of this thread....and see the Alt > CNC > >Dreamers piss off back to their Dream NG and their Dream Worlds. > > > >They are the kind of "Engineers"/"Customers" that I enjoy telling to take a > >Hike!! > > > >They don't know Shit from Shinola and just can't wait to brag to the world > about > >it! > > > >teenut > > > >Bill wrote: > >> > >> I would like to thank all who have participated in this thread. > >> > >> Bill Griffin > >> > >> Bill wrote in message ... > >> >I run a small ModelShop for a mid sized electronics company. Our > >> engineering > >> >team designs in ProE and provides solid model files to the ModelShop for > us > >> >to fabricate prototype parts. > >> >You can see samples of the kinds of parts we fabricate at: > >> >http://www.grifftek.com/images/misc/sample_parts/smp.html > >> Snip > >> >Bill Griffin > >> >www.grifftek.com/links.htm > >> > > >> > > >> > > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Chuck Threads Fit From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 28 May 2000 18:33:04 GMT -------- Whoa! Whoa ! WHOA!!!!! First of all Bill..If you think I am a bit windy..Fine!! I have no problem with that..I am YES! Agreed!! OK! No you don't want to meet "Bob" Bastow..no one has, in the past thirteen years..no one will ever again. "Bob" Bastow was not a nice person..but he got "Robert" Bastow through some awfully rough and dangerous places in his earlier life. He "lived" long enough for Robert Bastow to mature and start to develop into a much nicer person who wanted to help people avoid some of the mistakes he made and above all...to pass on the benefit of years of experience, knowledge and know-how in this fascinating Hobby/trade/Industry...much of it learned by bitter experience some of it from people who took the time and effort to teach and mentor him. That persona is known as "teenut" round these parts If I appear to you as an ALPHA male in this group..that certainly is not my desire or intention. If my responses to some of your posts has appeared to you to be demeaning..I apologize! It is not my intent! Having said that!! I stated, at the beginning of my response on the thread about chuck threads that I was about to step on the toes of a lot of people I love and respect..I did..and I will continue to do so..because they are (in this case) WRONG!! Period! Now the responses start to come in we start to see a trend.."So what if Locating Collars etc. are theoretically..or even practically better..my chuck screws on my lathe ACCURATELY ENOUGH FOR ME AND MY PURPOSES" Well fine! Why didn't you say that in the first place..I don't have a problem with that! But it sure as hell ain't accurate enough for MY purposes..in my home shop or in my "Pro" shop! My Home shop has taken me years to get to what I call an INTEGRATED level. One of the useful things I can do is to start out with a job in the lathe chuck, machine it part way, transfer the CHUCK with its part to either mill table, rotary table, dividing head, shaper, engraver, and back to the lathe for finishing...WITHOUT LOSING EVEN A TENTH OF A THOU IN CONCENTRICITY OR ACCURACY! It didn't take me a tenth of that time to introduce the same concept into my "Pro Shop" Sloppy fit of chuck to lathe spindle will not cut it for me..nor for anyone else who wants to follow this same path, be it as a Proud Amateur or as a Competent "Pro" There are a whole host of applications..some of which I touched on, where a thread, on its own, simply WILL NOT provide the accuracy required! teenut BillDarby wrote: > > I don't know what you want. I said nothing in ths post that I haven't said to you > privately as witnessed by this, my last post to you: > > "Hello again John! > > Welllllll,, Robert is given to be a little windy at times. Both he > [and you] (and all the men who have made machining a career) have the others in the > group at quite a disadvantage in the sense that they are playing in their own sandbox. > If this were rec.crafts.heartsurgery then the doctors in the group would be in the > position of "playing on home turf" I just tend to get annoyed at hearing an amateur > berated by a pro as if he were an apprentice,,,, when in fact the "amateur" is a grown > man perhaps of some station in life and possibly the ultimate professional in his chosen > field and who comes to the group for the love of machining in a quest to learn. > > That is not to say that all or even a very few "lord it over" others, but I see > it now and then and it does grate. I do also notice that people defer to the Alpha male, > which, I guess is no big deal,,,, it's so natural! > > I think both you and Robert are Alpha males (in the trade, of course) and are both > recognized as such. I like the way you conduct yourself,,, by contrast, lets just say > Robert is a little windy. I think him to be a good soul though. > > That's my bit of insightful thought for the evening. > > Bill " > > Now, if you think I am a little intimidated in trying to argue machining concepts with > the likes of Bob, your right! He spent 35 plus years working "in the trade" while I was > digging slit trenches in Germany. So, yes, he does have a decided edge but you know from > his writing that he is not mean. > > Which brings me to your post. I do not know what you want. I know it's not about > machining concepts. > > Bill Darby > > John Stevenson wrote: > > > On Sat, 27 May 2000 12:36:28 GMT, BillDarby wrote: > > > > >Well, here I go into the "Jaws of death" > > > > > > When it comes to machining knowledge and experience, I'm so far down the > > >food chain that I don't exist and maybe I am full of S**T but I have not lost the > > >ability to think for myself. I both like, and admire you. I envy your experience > > >in machining and I respect your words, but if you stop quick, you won't find my nose > > >up your butt. > > > > > My God Bill I have to give you credit you've certainly got balls. > > Have you taken legal advise before you posted this ? > > After all you don't want to meet Bob Bastow. > > Would you mind terribly emailing me your full name, date of birth and > > address. > > I would like to take some life insurance out on you if you don't mind. > > I might just get enough to buy a new chuck and spindle so I don't have to > > risk somebodies wrath. > > -- > > > > Regards, > > John Stevenson > > Special Purpose Machines > > Nottingham, England ======== Newsgroups: alt.machines.cnc,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: tolerancing, geometry files...what and how do you prefer From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 00:42:52 GMT -------- EXACTLY The response I expected..From EXACTLY the person I figured it would come from! Chief Wannabee hisself. teenut Bottlebob wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > Whereas, I, As a Working Custom Machine Shop, CNC machining and Tool and Die > > Shop Owner, will be glad to see the back of this thread....and see the Alt CNC > > Dreamers piss off back to their Dream NG and their Dream Worlds. > > Robert: > > Well what have we here, a bitter, cantankerous, dinosaur that thinks he > knows it all, and that everyone should bow down to his superior > knowledge? You sir are overdue for a serious reality check if you can > automatically discount the knowledge of everyone in a newsgroup where > you have NO intimate awareness of the education and experience of those > you are speaking of. > Do you usually make such ill conceived, all inclusive, statements based > on no more than ignorance and some bogus "opinions" about programmers, > CNC machinists, engineers etc. in the alt.machines.cnc? Or are you just > trying to act knowledgeable and play the role of the worldly BIG MAN in > rec.crafts.metalworking? > You're not one of those that try to cause friction between > rec.crafts.metalworking and the cnc group, are you? We all appreciate > machines and machining and that is the glue that ties us all together. > If you're too self-centered, opinionated, or poisoned in some way to > realize that, then I feel sorry for you. > Bill Griffin just asked some pertinent questions relating to > tolerancing, complete CAM file creation and the role adequate > engineering design would play in making the model maker's job easier. > If you are incapable of making a constructive or intelligent reply you > should just skip the thread entirely and leave it to those that have > something cogent and helpful to contribute. > > > > > They are the kind of "Engineers"/"Customers" that I enjoy telling to take a > > Hike!! > > > > They don't know Shit from Shinola and just can't wait to brag to the world about > > it! > > They don't know Shit from Shinola? Like in YOU know more than every > single person in the CNC group? Get real! That's quite an ego you've > developed for yourself there, if you automatically think you know more > than someone or a quite large group of someones that you've never even > met. I wonder if you really know a tenth of what you think you do. > It's said that; A person can be silent and be thought a fool or they can > speak and remove all doubt. I think your personal situation falls into > the latter category. > > > > > teenut > > -- > Bottlebob > http://home.earthlink.net/~bottlbob > > #56 > Play the joker > Or a poseur > But don't expect > Genuine respect ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Chuck Threads Fit From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 15:12:52 GMT -------- > Mike Rehmus wrote: > > > My chuck backing plates already don't touch the register. Never did, even > > straight from the factory. Neither did yours or Bob' or anyone else's. If > > they touched, they'd jam on. And if they touched the first time, they'd > > rapidly wear until they didn't. Understand? > > > > You want to volunteer, go make yourself a backing plate and try it. On your > > lathe. I already know it works. The "Correct Specification"...If there is such a thing!! for a parallel chuck nose register and its backing plate, is that the male register should be ground true and parallel to the lathe axis, to VERY close limits. The Female register should be sized "dead on size" in other words between a few tenths over size to a tenth or so under size..in other words a very close "push" fit to a VERY slight "Interference fit" Both should be kept spotlessly clean and lightly greased before screwing together. This will make the last few turns quite stiff..but far less likely to unscrew at an inopportune moment..like cutting threads in reverse. Yes! They WILL eventually wear..which is why they are not my favorites for spindle noses..nor are they used much on "High Class" lathes..except the very smallest ones. They are used there, because there really isn't room for a "better" spindle nose arrangement..like an L0 taper or a D1 type..without massively increasing the spindle diameter..which requires either lower speed limits..or VERY much more expensive bearings...A kinda "Catch-22" situation. In actual fact, the wear on such an arrangement is not as rapid as one might expect...given proper cleanliness and lubrication care..in that the spindle is (or should be) hardened steel and the backplate is (or should be) close grained cast iron..An almost perfect, slow wearing, non-galling, "bearing" combination. I have only ever owned two lathes with parallel thread/register spindle noses. One a Myford Super7 the other a Smart and Brown Toolroom lathe. In both cases I had to have the spindles Hard Chrome plated, and ground back to original spec's..and either make new backing plates or bush and bore existing plates to the above mentioned "tight clearance" spec's. In both cases they then gave many years of sterling service, during which the chucks and fixtures were completely and accurately interchangeable between lathe and other workshop equipment. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Chuck Threads Fit From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 15:28:51 GMT -------- Mike Rehmus wrote: > > Guys, I hear what you are saying. > So, those of you who have tried it, seem to believe me. Practical proof. > Those of you that don't. It's OK with me. We'll all probably be able to > turn out good work no matter which way we go. > Pax Pax indeed Mike!..It really is a grey area..and I tend to become a little "Anal" in grey areas!! On the other hand I am trying to guide people who, right now..or some time in the future, for whatever reason, need to "Chase Tenths" Remember that if you CONSISTANTLY want to work to "thous" your equipment and set ups must be repeatable to "tenths" For those that need or want to work consistantly to "tenths" The margin of machine and set-up repeatability becomes very tight indeed. Having said that..My weapon of choice in the shop, is still, a two pound, ball pein hammer!! A judicious tap..or even placing it in close proximity to a problem..works wonders!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: alt.machines.cnc,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: tolerancing, geometry files..an Apology From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 15:57:24 GMT -------- Bottlebob wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: "Bottlebob" Bill Griffin, Et Al, I was doing a lot of thinking last night..and I came to the keyboard this morning with the determination that..regardless of the responses to my posts..and I have NOT read this one of yours yet..I owe you, Bill Griffin, all the readers of the Alt CNC group and everyone on the RCM group a huge and unqualified apology. I hope you will accept it in the spirit in which it is offered. By way of reason..but NOT excuse: I have been in poor health recently..Friday was a "Day from Hell" during which I spent fourteen hours and several thousand dollars, bailing one of my employees out of Atlanta City Jail and resuing my Company Truck from the police pound!! I am, at the best of times, an opinionated old curmudgeon..but for reasons I usually can justify!! But not on this occasion! But yes! After MANY years associated with CNC Machining..On BOTH sides of the "fence" As a Programmer..as a Machine tool Sales Engineer and as an owner operator etc...going back pre-CNC..Pre-NC..pre-Hardwire..Pre-Plugboard Programming etc Blah blah Blah!! I have had more than my fair share of run-ins with "Programming Engineers" totally incompetent and uncaring in the metal cutting end of the business..who looked down their noses at the Operators and skilled machinists who REGULARLY had to make sense of, make work, and eventually cover the a**** of said "Programmers" I know this goes on at an ever increasing level today..I am an "Owner/Operator" right now..and, daily, have to sort out, make work, (at MY cost) or totally reject, the most amazing stream of "engineers dreams" and other total fusterclucks by "programmers" who shouldn't be given access to a sharp pencil..never mind a computer!! My error is to assume that this applies to every Programming/Designer/Engineer...which is patently wrong and unjust. For this I apologize. Robert Bastow teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Hand Tapper From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 16:11:56 GMT -------- Sfc149 wrote: > > 2nd request > How does one secure work to be tapped to the base of a hand tapper, such as the > E-Z? What's the purpose of the pin that can be set in the holes behind the > larger hole under the spindle? This is an interesting question..one which I have never yet been able to come up with an answer to..and which has prevented me from ever buying or making a Hand Tapper. Every solution I have ever been able to dream up or see in action has been either less accurate, less "secure" or slower than other alternatives...such as the drill press or mill. I have, in the back of my mind, a rather different design that "ONE DAY when the ROUND TUITS" are delivered, I may try out.. This is a heavy base with a fixed and accurate machine type vice. The vertical column carries a radial arm drill type of arrangement..maybe even a rigid pantograph...like a large drafting machine arm..which will allow the tapping spindle to be aligned over the hole (always remaining truly vertical of course) and then rigidly clamped while tapping takes place. In my case..for MY purposes..this may well take the form of an attachment for the bench vise..which I make and maintain as accurate as any of my machine vises. I would be more than interested in what solutions other people HAVE come up with. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Getting projects done From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 16:28:15 GMT -------- A wise old machinist once told me.. The scrap box is a wonderful servant..but a terrible master!! I bear that in mind and try to prevent $25.00 an hour Machinists from spending half an hour searching the off-cuts bin to save five bucks on chopping off a new piece of material!! I dread to think how many, otherwise productive hours, I have wasted trying to turn that "Promising Lump" of scrap or salvage into the "device" it first suggested...but which seems ever more elusive the more time and effort I put into it!! Personal conclusion..Dump the pack-ratted stuff! It is easier, quicker and cheaper to start from scratch!! teenut San wrote: > > I´m oddly....................familiar with that situation!!!!!! > > SAN > > tonyp wrote in message > news:01bfc78a$3be152a0$0f02000a@chucktop... > > "SNIP" > > I suffer from an additional form of lunacy, though -- the "better not use > > this now 'cause I might need it later" syndrome. I need to make a part. > > I have some perfectly good bar stock I can cut a chunk off of to make it > > from. But I'll spend half an hour hunting around the scrap bin for some > > piece of material that might be adequate for the job! The worst part is > > that I _know_ I'm being stupid :) > > -- Tony Prentakis > "SNIP" ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Chuck Threads Fit From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 17:26:12 GMT -------- brian whatcott wrote: > > Perhaps a British example will have some meaning for Robert. The > fellow who designed the front suspension for the Morris Minor > (think it was Alex Issigonis) chose screw threads for the upper and > lower 'kingpin' bearings. > When asked why, he apparently said - a screwthread is more > forgiving of wear - it stays centered under load, when a plain bearing > is shaking from side to side.... > > (Always glad to help stir it up :-) I don't disagree with Alex Issigonis..in that type of application. But a kingpin held by a thread at both ends is a very different application..with a very different set of criteria than a chuck on a lathe..or any other accurate location dependent on "one end" only. teenut ======== Newsgroups: alt.machines.cnc,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: tolerancing, geometry files...what and how do you prefer From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 17:36:18 GMT -------- Exactly the "War" I DIDN'T want to start!! Let it be known that this "Dinosaur" Just invested a HEAP of hard earned cash in a spankin' new Top 'o the Line Fadal 4 axis machining center with rigid/turcite lined slideways and refrigerated high speed spindle etc...PLUS a brand new "Manual/CNC" CNC lathe so that he and the rest of his "Dinosaurs" can stay competitive in the custom tool/die/mold/prototype market! My problem with SOME programmers and my apologies to the rest have already been addressed. teenut Bottlebob wrote: > > Lennie the Lurker wrote: > > > > In article <39308CF4.86E2885B@earthlink.net>, > > Bottlebob wrote: > > > > > > Well what have we here, a bitter, cantankerous, dinosaur > > > > Hmmm? I happen to resemble that remark. However, I should mention > > that I'm a very well paid dino. Roughly $4 per hour more than the > > average for CNC clowns in this area. Or I should say "was" because > > three weeks ago I decided to go back into full retirement. From a shop > > that was so "progressive" that we didn't even have a computer in the > > office, let alone screwing up a good machine. > > Lennie: > > Actually I'm quite familiar with the term dinosaur myself. Being 55 > and having served a formal 4 year Tool & Die Apprenticeship back it the > early 70's, when they still had such things. But shops and people that > don't advance their knowledge and technology to keep up with the times > can suddenly find themselves left behind and almost cut out of the loop > except for certain niche jobs. > And running a CNC mill WITHOUT a computer and a good CAM system is > definitely working in the stone age, in my considered opinion. > And by CNC clowns do you mean operators? Set-up men? Programmers? > Operators usually make around $8-$12, set-up guys can make in the rage > of $10-$14, programmers can make in the range of $15-$24. These figures > are my own particular opinions, your mileage may vary. But they are > VERY experience dependent and are greatly influenced by the particular > area you happen to be in. > > > The shop is in no danger > > of sinking, not as long as they can do the work they do for 1/2 to 1/3 > > of what the cnc houses quote. Seems like cnc has a small problem with > > just one or two pieces, unless the customer has unlimited wallet. > > While most would admit that CNC's can't reasonably be competed with for > production work there is a common misconception that they are totally > useless, on a cost per part basis, for prototype work or onezies & > twozies. That is not necessarily true in all cases, our shop does > "primarily" prototype work with our CNC mills, with some tooling and > very short run production thrown in. If you have talented people that > are conversant in a good CAM system (Virtual Gibbs in our case) you'd be > surprised how productive a CNC can be, even doing a few small simple > pieces. > > > > But, > > let's just say that I enjoy being a dinosaur, the worst kind, a retired > > one, fully knowing that I could go back into the shop tomorrow if I > > decided I wanted to. Retirement is sweet, especially after the third > > time. Only this time I won't be talked into going back to work. > > Must be nice, I don't think retirement is in the cards for me though. > It's more a "work till I drop" type of situation. :) > > > Let > > one of the cnc (giggle, snort!) machinists learn to run a real machine. > > A REAL machine? As in what? A shaper? A drill press? A manual > lathe? A manual Bridgeport mill? What? > CNC's (mill or lathe) are usually just so much more versatile and can > make parts very quickly and easily that might require rotary table > setups, compound sine plate setups, or having special holding fixtures > built if they were to be machined on a manual machine. The positioning > accuracy of most CNC's is vastly superior to most manual mills. CNC's > are usually so much more rigid and beefy, and have so much more > horsepower, that they can make cuts that a lot of manual machines can't > even DREAM about. I frequently cut aluminum with a 3/4 inch inserted > end mill at .150"-.200" depth of cut at 10,000 RPM and 250 inches per > minute (the machine maximums for our Fadals). > It really wasn't my intention to turn this post into a comparison of > CNC's to manual machines since the manual machines come out on the short > end in so many areas, (and this isn't even taking into consideration > wire EDM's, waterjet machines, CNC surface grinders, CNC plasma cutters, > etc. but some people seem to have a "John Henry" outlook (that's > thinking that a good manual railroad spike installer can realistically > compete with an automatic spike installing machine). Now you tell me > Lennie with your "giggle" and "snort" which are the REAL machines doing > REAL work or the REAL machinists? > > > > > Lennie the Lurker. > > -- > Bottlebob > http://home.earthlink.net/~bottlbob > > #29 > Tryin' to address > Flagrant BS > Correctin' a lack > Of obvious facts ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Hard headed/wrong way machinists From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 29 May 2000 17:50:18 GMT -------- brian whatcott wrote: > > On Mon, 29 May 2000 20:48:41 +0800, "Wayne Bengtsson" > wrote: > > >If you look at most prints, they specifically mention "DO NOT SCALE PRINT". > >This means do not use the print to measure dimensions directly. IMO only, > >unless you have a written instruction to do otherwise, you are within your > >rights to refuse to use the print as a template. I just had a job which involved the emergency repair of a smashed up (very complex) stripper plate..in order to "get the line running" Plus a request from the plant manager to make a drawing while I had the die stripped in order to quote for a new, replacement plate of better design and materials..that can be made and fitted "at Leisure" This is a fairly common sort of job in this line of business. So, while the die was being repaired, I had my Draughtsman/Programmer take an accurate set of dimensions for a new part. I temporarily mystified him, by also asking him to make a "Rubbing" of the original part on a piece of drafting vellum. I explained that this was as a final "arbiter"..all the accurate measurements in the world don't help if just ONE is off somewhere..the result is an accurately dimensioned f***up!! The finished new part..or rather the program and drawings for it MUST match the rubbing..or the part simply won't fit! Kinda "Reverse Engineering" in Reverse!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: A Revelation !!! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 02:05:34 GMT -------- ROTFLMAO!! Thanks John, It is a shame that so much of the humor will be missed by non-Brits! Lots there for everyone though!! teenut John Stevenson wrote: (Snip..real funny stuff! Esp. the bit about Newcastle Brown Ale) > ======== Newsgroups: rec.knives,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Annealing hacksaw blade From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 02:37:21 GMT -------- Heed the advice of old Tubal Cain! You don't say what particular type of steel your recycled hacksaw blades are made from..which indicates (a) you don't know (b) you don't realise that it makes a helluva difference. What you have are (probably..judging by the 68Rc figure) "All-Hard High Speed Steel" or even "Flexible" or "Bimetalic" blades..It really doesn't matter which!! The annealing and re-heat treatment of these are WAY beyond the capabilities of a (beginning) "Amateur" And way too much trouble for the "Pro" who will start with raw stock of a known composition. Useful raw material for something you can shape without reheat treatment..Junk otherwise when you have made all the thin parting blades, box cutters, scribes etc you can possibly use in one lifetime. Don't let this put you off knifemaking though..but do get yourself a couple good books etc..But first, go to any (or ALL) of many knifemakers pages you will find on the web..do a search and check them ALL out!!..Don Fogg has probably the best and most Informative/authorative site of all. That Guy KNOWS metal and processes better IMHO than all but a few other living human beings (Some Westerners some Japanese) Learn a little about easier to use materials, and get ready for LOTS of practice..'cos once the bug REALLY bites it is impossible to shake! teenut Andy Dingley wrote: > > I'm trying to manufacture knife blades from power hacksaw blades. As > there's a fair bit of machining to do (it's a folder) then I'd like to > fully anneal, machine, re-harden and temper. > > So far I'm entirely failing to anneal them 8-( > > I think the problem is too fast cooling, maybe insufficient time at > high temperature too. The blades start at Rockwell C68, dropping to > C38 after "annealing" - as a comparison, my AUS-8 Spyderco is also C38 > hardness ! > > I'm using a propane/butane natural draft torch to heat the blanks on a > flat firebrick hearth. They're up to a red that I'd estimate at about > 780°C from a colour chart, holding for 10 minutes, then cooling under > a layer of pre-heated sand. > > Any advice ? Do I need to get a muffle furnace to do it properly ? A > better hearth ? > > One of my textbooks (by Tubal Cain) says simply not to mess with > hacksaw blades, as the alloy is simply too sophisticated for the > amateur to achieve anything worthwhile; either annealing or > re-hardening. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: accurate hole technique From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 02:42:00 GMT -------- Miles Jaffe wrote: > Somebody was talking about Satori - true enlightenment is when you begin to > understand just how ridiculous what you are trying to do really is. > > What amazes me is the hardware stuff I can get from McMaster for $6 that is > accurate beyond my ability to measure. From here on in..true enlightenment gets easier..as you learn to work WITH the Materials, Machines and Processes.. 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Hand Tapper From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 30 May 2000 03:03:49 GMT -------- Yeh! Those I am familiar with and have bought and installed on semi-automated assembly machines together with auto screw feeders I used to build. In Canada!! Once...a long time ago..before Canada decided to return to an Agriculturally based economy. ;^) The design is simple and should be buildable by a competent machinist..the only real requirement being..bearings with no slop and arms that are REALLY the same length! Mounted on a vertical column, at the back of the bench, adjustable to true vertical, with respect to either the bench vise or a separate machine vice. Pantograph mounted on a collar, adjustable for height, over a fairly wide range..there is no need to clamp any of the three axes for tapping. Use a hand tapping spindle..but provision to drive this with (say) an electric, reversable screwdriver, will be much quicker and far less likely to break taps. (I swear, more taps are broken by the sudden, involuntary, twitches of "over care" than any other means!!) I would build one..but I don't ever envisage tapping that many holes by hand in the rest of my life!! teenut Brian Lawson wrote: > > Too late Robert! Already being produced. $3,000 Canadian with a > DeSouter air powered tapping head. Vertical column fastens to table > you provide. Works on a stretch arm like a "Luxo" lamp arm type > thingy, which is probably the pantograph you like. Keeps the working > end vertical. Very sensitive feel. Good for #2 to 3/8" machine > screws in the version here. If you care, I'll get the makers name. > > About 3 weeks ago, there was a similar 'Boeing Surplus' gadget on > Ebay, only it had 3 different tapping arms and heads on one vertical > column, each of different capacity if I recall. Personally, I can't > see why you couldn't drill and tap both with them, but I haven't tried > it. > > Brian Lawson > Windsor, Ontario > XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX > > On Mon, 29 May 2000 16:11:56 GMT, Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ > hotmail.com> wrote: > > > > > > >Sfc149 wrote: > >> > >> 2nd request > >> How does one secure work to be tapped to the base of a hand tapper, such as the > >> E-Z? What's the purpose of the pin that can be set in the holes behind the > >> larger hole under the spindle? > > > >This is an interesting question..one which I have never yet been able to come up > >with an answer to..and which has prevented me from ever buying or making a Hand > >Tapper. > > > >Every solution I have ever been able to dream up or see in action has been > >either less accurate, less "secure" or slower than other alternatives...such as > >the drill press or mill. > > > >I have, in the back of my mind, a rather different design that "ONE DAY when the > >ROUND TUITS" are delivered, I may try out.. > > > >This is a heavy base with a fixed and accurate machine type vice. The vertical > >column carries a radial arm drill type of arrangement..maybe even a rigid > >pantograph...like a large drafting machine arm..which will allow the tapping > >spindle to be aligned over the hole (always remaining truly vertical of course) > >and then rigidly clamped while tapping takes place. > > > >In my case..for MY purposes..this may well take the form of an attachment for > >the bench vise..which I make and maintain as accurate as any of my machine > >vises. > > > >I would be more than interested in what solutions other people HAVE come up > >with. > > > >teenut ======== Newsgroups: alt.machines.cnc,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: tolerancing, geometry files...what and how do you prefer From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 31 May 2000 02:57:15 GMT -------- Ten parts is a luxury for us. One offs..Two offs..We use CNC because it really IS faster to program, work out bugs, set tools etc. then hit the (Usually) very expensive material ONE TIME..Right first time..and, on balance, more economically than the same or an equally skilled man can do on standard, manual equipment. One off is often a judgement call..two off..CNC has it hands down! Yes it all has to do with metal removal rates, rigidity of setup and machine, and tolerances..Documentation is good..but the same job rarely comes back again. If it does it has been redesigned out of all useable recognition. Get "IT" right and you make money..miss "IT" and you lose money. Job Shop work is almost a minute by minute "life or death" decision making process..Do I CNC it? Do I Manual machine it? You need both and you need to be aware of very subtle differences, abilities, and weaknesses of both processes that..ignored or unknown...will jump out and bite you! Hopefully I have made my peace with the Alt Machines CNC group..because I DO have a lot of questions! Especially about available "modern" programming software. teenut Glen wrote: > > A former employee went to work in a CNC job shop in Portland Oregon where he said > they almost never do more than ten parts in a setup, high temp alloys, very > complicated lathe parts. I think it's about part accuracy, scrap rate, and > documentation, I don't know. > > Glen > > > While most would admit that CNC's can't reasonably be competed with for > > production work there is a common misconception that they are totally > > useless, on a cost per part basis, for prototype work or onezies & > > twozies. That is not necessarily true in all cases, our shop does > > "primarily" prototype work with our CNC mills, with some tooling and > > very short run production thrown in. If you have talented people that > > are conversant in a good CAM system (Virtual Gibbs in our case) you'd be > > surprised how productive a CNC can be, even doing a few small simple > > pieces. > > > > > > > > It really wasn't my intention to turn this post into a comparison of > > CNC's to manual machines > > > Lennie the Lurker. > > > > Sorry to go that direction, it's very interesting comparing the two methods. > > > > > -- > > Bottlebob > > http://home.earthlink.net/~bottlbob > > > > #29 > > Tryin' to address > > Flagrant BS > > Correctin' a lack > > Of obvious facts ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Welding cast iron From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 31 May 2000 06:10:18 GMT -------- UntMaintco wrote: > When I read my posting it sounds like I was mad and nasty..... Not my intent.. > Sometime things dont write out as well as they should sound > > Tom. Hmm! I resemble that remark! teenut ======== Newsgroups: alt.machines.cnc,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: tolerancing, geometry files...what and how do you prefer From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 31 May 2000 06:35:13 GMT -------- Bottlebob wrote: > You've GOT to say something I can disagree with, and argue about, in > the near future or my life just won't be complete. > Oh I'm sure I'll think of something.. ;^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking,alt.machines.cnc Subject: Re: tolerancing, geometry files...what and how do you prefer From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 31 May 2000 08:08:49 GMT -------- Bottlebob wrote: > The "modern" programming software issue is quite THE contested subject > in a.m.cnc, everyone has their favorite likes and dislikes. Ask 10 CNC > machinists what the "Best" CAM software is and you'll get 20 answers. > That's what I was/am afraid of! Where then, do I go to get a simple, honest, knowledgeably unbiased opinion? I HONESTLY do not have the time, the desire, OR the direct experience to wade through ten or 20 different "This is the best because *I* use it and if YOU don't then you are both ignorant AND stupid..." kind of answers..Which is what I seem to see everytime I subscribe to alt.machines.cnc..with the intention of asking a question. Everytime I retreat silently..question unasked..vowing never to return...I don't like to be ridiculed for asking a "Dumb" question, anymore than anyone else does! People who do that get shot out of the sky REAL fast on RCM..because we recognise that an atmosphere like that would quickly destroy the use AND the value of the Group as a place where there really ARE no dumb questions..and only a small and acceptably necessary proportion of dumb answers. People who berate or belittle newcomers or others of less experience are dealt with quickly and effectively by ANYONE in the Group..with full support of EVERY OTHER member. Don't ask me how or why this came about..it was here when I arrived, why I stayed..and it will surely continue when I leave..but it does promote an atmosphere, based on mutual respect..where we can also have a lot of FUN! Respectfully, teenut ======== Newsgroups: alt.machines.cnc,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: tolerancing, geometry files...what and how do you prefer From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 31 May 2000 08:08:54 GMT -------- Glen wrote: (the turret lathe that we had that was a good one was a Herbert) They are, they are! Or at least USED to be! I worked for Herbert's and used to sell the whole range of Herbert, Devlieg, Churchill, Broadbent etc., machines. (plus Boxfords and several others.) Few people realize that, during the last few years of Herbert's existence, the "Herbert" Turret lathes were built in (Brace yerselves!!) INDIA..and the quality was SUPERB!! I do believe they may well continue to be made there..even if no longer available in the USA or Europe. Herbert's also were one of the pioneers of NC/CNC and as I recall..were the originators of the G-Code system. During their final years, they built (and I sold in Canada) a range of CNC lathes..the AL20 AL30 Al40 Machines which some of our readers may be familiar with. What became of them when stripped of factory support, when Herbert's finally shut down in IIRC about 1982/3..may well be a whole different (and Sad!) story! Maybe I don't want to know! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Hand Tapper From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 31 May 2000 08:18:52 GMT -------- Sfc149 wrote: > Robert, a creative mind such as yours belongs in an Industrial Think Tank! It was..and I went Broke! "Those whom the Gods wish to destroy..They first have build "Special" Machines"....teenut's Law! > Hope your doing well. > Sig > Chicago Scary well thanks. Though "They" intend to fix that tomorrow, with another three day cycle of (cranked up) Chemotherapy. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Specialty Stainless for Projects From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 31 May 2000 08:32:12 GMT -------- Taking this out of the realms of spam..which it is NOT! IMHO..(Before the Net Nannies jump on it)..it is "Useful Information" for Metalworkers. How does one obtain those "titanium colors" on SS sheet? Do you electroplate the SS with Ti and then anodise? Thanks, teenut mtaylor@pacificplus.com wrote: > > Hi all, > > We are producer and distributor of specialty stainless steel sheets in a > variety of finishes, etched designs and titanium colors. Our web site > is: www.pacificplus.com > > Please visit us and if we can be of service please let me know. > > We are located in Carrollton (outskirt of Dallas), Texas. We stock > popular size and gauge of stainless steel sheets. > > Sincerely, > > Michael Liu Taylor > General Manager > Pacific Plus > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: alt.machines.cnc,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: tolerancing, geometry files...what and how do you prefer From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 31 May 2000 08:55:34 GMT -------- unzrv@cnporyy.arg wrote: > > In <8h1rps$ac0$1@nnrp1.deja.com>, Lennie the Lurker writes: > > >It is not totally all CNC versus "skill", but that in every shop that I > >have worked in that bought a cnc, the older machines automatically were > >out the door, and along with them, the skills required to use them. As (Rest snipped reluctantly in the interests of brevity) I am trying (and Succeeding) in putting together a shop that has BOTH spankin' new CNC equipment AND new or rebuilt conventional equipment PLUS the people I am hireing AND training with the skills and adaptability/versatility to use and understand BOTH. It ain't cheap to do that!!! Apart from a helluva capital investment..it means "Eating" a lot of mistakes on a very steep learning curve, as you train "skilled" individuals to work together as a team and become "REALLY skilled" individuals..Meeting a payroll EVERY week for $18.00 to $30.00 per hour people is just the beginning...and the Cheapest bit. BUT, IMHO, there is a need to blend and use the older and the newer machinery and methods..It WILL produce a different type of Jobbing Shop ...One that will become VERY highly sought after (and priced) as the real "old farts" die and the "young farts" fall flat on their faces trying to do it all by some textbook they read one night as part of "Manufacturing Technology 101" teenut ======== Newsgroups: alt.machines.cnc,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: tolerancing, geometry files...what and how do you prefer From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 31 May 2000 09:11:49 GMT -------- Lennie the Lurker wrote: "We can make 10000, but we have no > facility to make just one". I made it in my basement. For $50. Took > me all of 45 minutes. Used a 6 inch Atlas. Extremely difficult, you > understand. Something that would have been given to the apprentice 35 > years ago. Today, they can't do it? Am I missing something here? Not a damned thing Lennie..Except perhaps the Golden Opportunity that hides within. Called "Take the Road Less Travelled" In the land of the blind..the man with two eyes, TV, Video, night vision goggles, machine recognition vision and eyes in the back of his head..can do any damned thing he wants...at very least playing "Daddy Mend" for $75.00 an hour plus priority charge plus emergency set up charge plus overtime..or stand in line with the rest of the "My line is down and it is costing me a thousand dollars a minute" silly buggers.with no where else to go. Not ever, or not yet, you say..I did that three or four times THIS LAST WEEK ALONE! Taking the Road Less Travelled teenut ======== Newsgroups: alt.machines.cnc,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: tolerancing, geometry files...what and how do you prefer From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 31 May 2000 09:34:33 GMT -------- I am starting to like this guy! C'mon yer bugger..say something *I* can disagree with..this is getting boring! ;^) My only (moot) point of difference is that most of my CNC equipment IS new, (I threw out the Junkers..CNC and Manual...for "shiftin' money") I follow the same principle of one shop rate for all I just choose to amortise my (personal) investment in new equipment (and training) over whatever period of time it takes to make it all come together. It is true that few have the luxury of doing that...and certainly no "Third Quarter Bottom Line MBA Bean Counter" could hold his job long enough to even try the tactic. Oh! we also do CNC wire cut and conventional Sinker EDM which adds another layer of versatility It does kinda make it a war of attrition with the few existing local shops..but they are tired and I am not! teenut Bottlebob wrote: > > Lennie the Lurker wrote: > > > > > It is not totally all CNC versus "skill", but that in every shop that I > > have worked in that bought a cnc, the older machines automatically were > > out the door, and along with them, the skills required to use them. > > Lennie: > > You make some good points but a shop that suddenly converts to ALL > CNC's that are being paid for on payments, is in my opinion, not the > best of business decisions. > We have 6 manual mills, 4 manual lathes, 4 CNC mills that are paid for > and 2 CNC lathes and one mill that are leased. > ALL our CNC's don't HAVE to stay busy and that's one of the essential > factors in deciding which jobs to run manually or to CNC. We just > choose whichever way get the job done the quickest. We don't have any > CNC only prima donnas in our shop, the 3 CNC guys, of which I'm one, > were experienced manual machinists first. > > > I'm sure we lose some work to small shops that are run on a shoestring > (our shop rate is $65/hr for manual OR CNC - we make NO distinction in > our bidding) but some jobs just are too time consuming to do manually. > Take today for instance, I was doing this prototype job of making > rectangular stainless insert 2 X 7 X .200 to fit in a similar sized > pocket. I used the same program for making the pocket, as for doing the > outer perimeter of the insert, AND the same program for milling an > O-ring groove on the outer perimeter of the insert with a .0625 key seat > cutter. All I had to change was the cutter comp offsets and the tools. > There is just no easy way to cut that O-ring groove on the perimeter > (with radiuses in the corners) on a manual mill. Plus I don't think > someone could manually mill that pocket and insert in the time it took > me to program, setup tools, and run the parts AND keep the clearance > between the pocket and the insert to .001 per side even in the corner > radii. Plus if there had been a mistake made the remake would be so > much quicker since the program is already written. > snip > No one is doubting that quality work can, and is, being done on manual > machines - we do it ourselves. It's just that CNN's excel in contouring > and angles where manual set-ups can eat up the time allotted for the > job. > > Bottlebob ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: A Revelation !!! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 01 Jun 2000 00:58:13 GMT -------- Funny enough -and it could be true!! Anyone remember the "Flyin' Jam Sandwiches"..Mk II Jaguar XJV12 two door Coupe's..White with a red horizontal stripe around. Police cars with 155mph+ capabilities. No you didn't try to out run them..because if you took off across country the 4 wheel drive Police range Rovers would nail you @ 135+mph. Do they still have the "Cape Canaveral" elevated observer/takeoff ramps along the sides of the motorways?..No place to run..No place to hide! teenut Bob Chilcoat wrote: > > "Tony Jeffree" wrote in message > news:393513f6.65569516@news.u-net.com... > > On Wed, 31 May 2000 11:34:38 GMT, mikegraham@sprint.ca (Mike Graham) > > wrote: > > > > >On Tue, 30 May 2000 23:07:11 +0100, Nigel Eaton wrote: > > > > > >>Why aye, a bottle'a'dog fower me ya buggah! > > > > > > My understanding is that Newcastle Brown is called "dog" because the > lads > > >would tell their respective missus' that they were "going out to walk the > > >dog" and then walk them right to the pub for a pint. Or three. > > > > The technical term is "A Swift Half". > > It's Christmas day in a suburb of London. Husband informs Wife that he's > heading over to the Golf Club for a drink with the Boys. "OK, says Wife, > but be back by five because my family is coming for dinner." Husband > departs; Wife finishes preparing meal. Five arrives, along with In-Laws, > but no Husband. Six o'clock and still no Husband, dinner has now started, > late. Half past six: back door opens; Husband arrives, legless. There is a > short scene, and Husband is summarily dispatched to bed. > > Seven o'clock: the doorbell rings. Wife answers door to discover four > Policeman standing on stoop. Constable, serving as spokesman, asks if > Husband lives there. "Yes," answers Wife, "that's my husband." "May we see > him?" asks Constable, "It's police business." "I'm sorry," replies Wife, > digging in, "he has been taken ill and is asleep in bed. Can I help you?" > "Perhaps," continues Constable, "Does he drive a white Jaguar, number > XXXXX?" "Yes," replies Wife, "that's his car." The Constable gets a bit > more animated. "And, do you know if he was in the vicinity of the Golf Club > within the past hour?" "Why yes," answers Wife, now quite worried, "that's > where he said he was going." > > The assembled cops all shift slightly forward. "In that case, Madam, I'm > afraid we must speak with him immediately." Wife rises to the occassion. > "I'm sorry, but he is quite ill and I will not disturb him. Isn't there > some way I can assist you without waking him?" The Constable falls back > with his colleagues and they confer, apparently quite agitated. The > spokesman returns. "Perhaps we could see his car, at least," he requests, > compromising. > > Wife nervously leads the party around to the back of the house to the > garage. She opens the garage door, and there, indeed, is the white Jaguar, > but with a blue light on top. She stares in amazement and confusion for a > few seconds. The Constable approaches, obviously very relieved. "Your car > is out on the street," he explains. "And we won't tell anyone about this if > you won't..." > > Presumably an Urban Legend, but it was told to me as a true story years ago. > > Bob ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: A Revelation !!! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 01 Jun 2000 01:18:50 GMT -------- Not as I recall..bottled beer is never drunck out of the bottle.allways the glass. Makes it taste different! Don't believe me? Take a bottle or can of your favorite tipple..put half in a glass..drink the other half straight from the bottle..I will assure you the they will taste different and that the glass beer has a richer, smoother, less acid taste. Reason: The tongue has taste buds in different areas that pick up different elements of flavor. Salt, sweet, aci, sour. Drinking from a bottle funnels the bee over only part of the tongue..the center and only part of the flavor is sensed. Drinking from the glass allows the fuller, true flavor to be savored. Newcastle Brown Ale is correctly ordered in a Pint/20 oz bottle..curiously NBA imported into the USA says Pint/26 2/3floz..haven't figured that out yet. I should be served cold, with a SMALL glass..US 10oz..The beer is poured and drunk in two or three helpings from the small glass. I never saw NBA on draught in the UK..always in clear glass Pint bottles. It's name was "Journey into Npace" or "Passport to Paradise". Reputed to be made from a distillation of Boxing gloves and Condoms..four or five pints and you would be either fightin' or f****in'!! Here in the USA it is sold in draft form as well as small and real size imported bottles. The draft tastes ok..if it's all you can get..but it is a pale imitation of the "Real thing" teenut Who just washed down seven hours of chemotherapy with five pints of Draft Caffrey's Irish Ale and a Steak..Damn the torpedoes!! John Stevenson wrote: > > On Wed, 31 May 2000 13:31:35 GMT, tony@jeffree.X.co.uk (Tony Jeffree) > wrote: > > >On Wed, 31 May 2000 11:34:38 GMT, mikegraham@sprint.ca (Mike Graham) > >wrote: > > > >>On Tue, 30 May 2000 23:07:11 +0100, Nigel Eaton wrote: > >> > >>>Why aye, a bottle'a'dog fower me ya buggah! > >> > >> My understanding is that Newcastle Brown is called "dog" because the lads > >>would tell their respective missus' that they were "going out to walk the > >>dog" and then walk them right to the pub for a pint. Or three. > > > >The technical term is "A Swift Half". > > > >Regards, > >Tony > Which is like Grandads original hammer, only had two new heads and three > shafts. > NOBODY counts how many times you fill it up. > > Anyway the secret is to drink it straight out of the bottle, in the north > if you order Newcastle you DON'T get a glass, that way there's less washing > up and more time for either the workshop or having another one.Which then > leaves you with a gut wrenching decision, as these are still glass bottles > and still have a deposit on them in this day and age of plastic throw away > - do you take it back to get the deposit and POSSIBLY restock up, or do you > throw it at next door cat and loose the deposit. > Like I said a major gut wrenching decision. > -- > > Regards, > John Stevenson > Special Purpose Machines > Nottingham, England ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Storing Mecury From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 01 Jun 2000 01:21:00 GMT -------- Peter Drumm wrote: > A friend of mine refuses to drink milk, and has not touched a drop > for 33 years. When he was 8 yrs old his class went to a farm on a > school field trip. He told me "once I saw where it came from, I said > I'd never drink another drop of that stuff". Does he eat eggs? teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Attn: Gun Lovers of the Group From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 01 Jun 2000 01:41:33 GMT -------- Careful Robin, At this stage you are young, inexperienced and idealistic..and you "Know not that you know not" Apart from that, your choice of language and rhetoric serves you ill. That is No Way to promote any kind of serious discussion and enlightenment, no way to speak to a fellow human being..especially from the security of a computer keyboard. Regardless of right or wrong, if you were to address me or most of the guys on the NG, like that, face to face, you would find yourself flat on your young ass, with at best, a fat lip..end of discussion..right or wrong! And don't come back and tell me how big, strong and fast you are..that only makes it more of a racing certainty! Clean up and wise up my young friend. respectfully, teenut "[©ØMMÄÑУ®]" wrote: > > Holly smokes. NOW you're twisting things. You're accusing doctors of being > more dangerous than guns? You list accidental deaths only. What does that > mean, exactly? People mistakenly shooting themselves vs. doctors mistakenly > killing a patient while attempting to help them? GREAT comparison, you > half-whit. > > I try not to get mean on news groups, but this takes the cake. You are by > far the most dim-whited individual I have EVER seen on a news group. > > You are comparing two things without giving greater detail. To someone who > has half a brain, you look like a fool. It would be difficult to say how > (for lack of a better expression) stupid you are, because the words don't > exist in this situation. > > > > Robin > > wrote in message news:8h3oop$lcl$1@nnrp1.deja.com... > > In article , > > "[©ØMMÄÑУ®]" wrote: > > > I love all these statistics, but your using them incorrectly, IMHO. > > All of > > > the mentioned locations were nothing or are nothing like the USA. > > > > > > > > > > I don't think so. May be you will like this quote better. > > > > > > "THIS YEAR WILL GO DOWN IN HISTORY. FOR THE FIRST TIME, A CIVILIZED > > NATION HAS FULL GUN REGISTRATION. OUR STREETS WILL BE SAFER, OUR POLICE > > MORE EFFICIENT, AND THE WORLD WILL FOLLOW OUR LEAD INTO THE FUTURE."--- > > ADOLF HITLER 1935 > > > > Or may be you like these statics better. > > > > > > Number of physicians in the U.S...........................700,000 > > Accidental deaths caused by physicians per year...........120,000 > > Accidental deaths per physician.............................0.171 > > Number of gun owners in the U.S........................80,000,000 > > Number of accidental gun deaths per year (all age groups)...1,500 > > Accidental deaths per gun owner.........................0.0000188 > > > > Therefore, doctors are approximately 9,000 times more dangerous than > > gun owners. > > > > > > The problem is not guns but removing the criminals from society. It's > > funny the way people talk about the rights of criminals and actually > > give them more rights than the victims. The population count proves > > that people are not an endangered species. So why can't we permanently > > remove criminals from society? It's the revolving door policy that > > keeps putting repeat offenders back on the street and keeps the crime > > rate up. > > > > > > > > Richard W. > > > > > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Attn: Gun Lovers of the Group From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 01 Jun 2000 02:21:01 GMT -------- "[©ØMMÄÑУ®]" wrote: > > It's interesting that a country like Canada, that is so similar to the US > does not see it necessary for citizens to carry guns to protect themselves > from politicians. Wake up and learn Robin..Any similarities between the USA and Canada are purely co-incidental. Similarities of language apart..which is misleading, Canada and the USA are as different as Canada and Mexico! > > Do you really feel the need to protect yourself, physically, from your local > mayor, or senator? I suppose this mentality is why so many American > presidents have been killed, or had an attempt made on their life. > > In Canada, our Prime Minister doesn't have body guards around him 24/7. Why? > Because there's no need. BullSh**t..the Canadian PM is guarded 24/7 by as tough a bunch of armed spooks as any US President..with greater powers to shoot you dead or help you disappear for a while than ANY US Secret Service Agent!! Granted, the role of the PM vs. the American > President vary significantly, but they are both at the top of the food chain > (Well, sort of. You know what I mean). Go check your history Robin..Look up Louis Reil..Look up Trudeau, Montreal and "The Emergency war powers act" that he invoked....Martial law and the power to shoot you dead in the street because somebody set fire to a MAILBOX!! You want an up front example..Go F**k with the RCMP, OPP or Toronto City Police Force..Those guys scared me far more than any US cop or Agency!! > > Anyway, I suppose it's difficult for someone like myself, a foreigner, to > attempt to understand the delicate political system of another country, > regardless of how similar it seems to be to my own. Difficult Yes..but not Impossible. But I suggest strongly that, before you begin to postulate or sound off..you go make the effort to learn. Above all, figure out WHY it is so different..WHY Americans want NO PART of your Colonial, Dominion, kowtow beliefs and attitudes..Why Americans fought a bitter War of Independence to be free CITIZENS with INALIENABLE RIGHTS...not SUBJECTS that rely on the assumed and continuing, good will of a RULING CLASS for any Granted Privileges. Why the Canadians STILL don't have guaranteed property ownership rights. And no means to defend any such privileges if the next or present government decided to invoke its written laws, Executive powers of Privy Council or WHY?? plus their armed power to take them away. Don't Imagine that I left Canada for the USA..to battle ten years for the right to stay here and become a US Citizen..just because of the Climate and the Economy. Canada scared the Hell out of me!! First of all, wise up to the fact that the guns and gun control issue has NOTHING TO DO WITH CRIME STATISTICS!! DUH!! In the USA we take our Freedoms as Inalienable Rights..we have the Second Amendment to guarantee that WE THE PEOPLE can, in the final analysis, DEFEND those rights from a GOVERNMENT...NO LONGER..."OF THE PEOPLE, FOR THE PEOPLE" And for Gods sake don't cross over the Gorge to a Buffalo pub and sound off your silly ideas..They will toss you in the River! Respectfully, teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking,alt.machines.cnc Subject: Re: tolerancing, geometry files...what and how do you prefer From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 01 Jun 2000 02:30:56 GMT -------- Useful replies..filed and printed for future reference. Thanks, teenut Bottlebob wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > Bottlebob wrote: > Here are the results of a survey asking which CAD/CAM systems were/are > used by the posters in alt.machines.cnc: > > CAM System Number of People Who Use It. > > Mastercam 7 > Surfcam 6 > Smartcam 6 > Cimatron 4 > Virtual Gibbs 4 > Edgecam 3 > Vector 3 > Cadkey99 2 > Esprit 2 > Bobcad 2 > Vero 2 > ProNC 1 > Procam 1 > EZ-Mill 1 > UG-II 1 > SNAP 1 > CADDS5 1 > Applicon 1 > Alphacam 1 > Apt 1 > Xcad/XMill 1 > Featurecam 1 > NCTool 1 > Catia 1 > Hypermill 1 > > So you can see there is quite a bit of variation among just the people > in the CNC group. And those were only the ones who responded to my > survey. > > But I'll give you MY opinion on which CAM system I'd recommend. We use > Virtual Gibbs which is a 2 1/2 axis CAM system that is easy to learn and > use. BUT, even though I like Gibbs, my suggestion to a job shop that > was searching for a CAM system would be to go with a system that has a > large knowledge base of people that know it and are already proficient > in it's use. That way you won't be held hostage by the one or two > employees in the western hemisphere that know "Freakazoid-CAM", plus > you'll be able to pick and choose from a variety of applicants (that > won't have to be trained) when you want to increase your work force. > The undisputed system with the most seats world wide and programmers > that already know it is MasterCam. I personally would also want to see > the SAME basic program interface whether it was a lathe, mill, wire, or > whatever else in the shop needed to be programmed. MasterCam can be had > with a number of different modules, lathe, mill, wire, etc. I don't > particularly like MasterCam but then I'm just generally familiar with > it, not proficient in it. > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: A Revelation !!! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 01 Jun 2000 02:41:35 GMT -------- Judging by the lack of spel-chek etc..it may have been 7 pints of Caffrey's!! teenut Robert Bastow wrote: > > Not as I recall..bottled beer is never drunck out of the bottle.allways the > glass. Makes it taste different! > > Don't believe me? Take a bottle or can of your favorite tipple..put half in a > glass..drink the other half straight from the bottle..I will assure you the they > will taste different and that the glass beer has a richer, smoother, less acid > taste. > > Reason: The tongue has taste buds in different areas that pick up different > elements of flavor. Salt, sweet, aci, sour. Drinking from a bottle funnels the > bee over only part of the tongue..the center and only part of the flavor is > sensed. Drinking from the glass allows the fuller, true flavor to be savored. > > Newcastle Brown Ale is correctly ordered in a Pint/20 oz bottle..curiously NBA > imported into the USA says Pint/26 2/3floz..haven't figured that out yet. I > should be served cold, with a SMALL glass..US 10oz..The beer is poured and drunk > in two or three helpings from the small glass. > > I never saw NBA on draught in the UK..always in clear glass Pint bottles. > > It's name was "Journey into Npace" or "Passport to Paradise". Reputed to be > made from a distillation of Boxing gloves and Condoms..four or five pints and > you would be either fightin' or f****in'!! > > Here in the USA it is sold in draft form as well as small and real size imported > bottles. The draft tastes ok..if it's all you can get..but it is a pale > imitation of the "Real thing" > > teenut > > Who just washed down seven hours of chemotherapy with five pints of Draft > Caffrey's Irish Ale and a Steak..Damn the torpedoes!! > > John Stevenson wrote: > > > > On Wed, 31 May 2000 13:31:35 GMT, tony@jeffree.X.co.uk (Tony Jeffree) > > wrote: > > > > >On Wed, 31 May 2000 11:34:38 GMT, mikegraham@sprint.ca (Mike Graham) > > >wrote: > > > > > >>On Tue, 30 May 2000 23:07:11 +0100, Nigel Eaton wrote: > > >> > > >>>Why aye, a bottle'a'dog fower me ya buggah! > > >> > > >> My understanding is that Newcastle Brown is called "dog" because the lads > > >>would tell their respective missus' that they were "going out to walk the > > >>dog" and then walk them right to the pub for a pint. Or three. > > > > > >The technical term is "A Swift Half". > > > > > >Regards, > > >Tony > > Which is like Grandads original hammer, only had two new heads and three > > shafts. > > NOBODY counts how many times you fill it up. > > > > Anyway the secret is to drink it straight out of the bottle, in the north > > if you order Newcastle you DON'T get a glass, that way there's less washing > > up and more time for either the workshop or having another one.Which then > > leaves you with a gut wrenching decision, as these are still glass bottles > > and still have a deposit on them in this day and age of plastic throw away > > - do you take it back to get the deposit and POSSIBLY restock up, or do you > > throw it at next door cat and loose the deposit. > > Like I said a major gut wrenching decision. > > -- > > > > Regards, > > John Stevenson > > Special Purpose Machines > > Nottingham, England ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: A Revelation !!! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 01 Jun 2000 02:54:39 GMT -------- All depends on What you are drinking and what you want to taste. I agree that aroma is a big part of perceived flavor. As far as southern moonshine is concerned..I used to have access to some of the finest "sippin whiskey" it has ever been my privilege to savor..maybe when my buddy gets outa jail again!! Straw!!..would have to be laboratory grade glass!! I have just half a Mason Jar left, preserved over twenty years and sampled at the rate of a few sips a year..Smooooth! I don't know how strong it is..but three or four sips have me "Buzzin'like a cheap TV" teenut C wrote: > > In article <_RiZ4.3816$t4.54961@news1.rdc1.ga.home.com>, Robert Bastow > <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > > > Not as I recall..bottled beer is never drunck out of the bottle.allways the > > glass. Makes it taste different! > > > > Don't believe me? Take a bottle or can of your favorite tipple..put > half in a > > glass..drink the other half straight from the bottle..I will assure you > the they > > will taste different and that the glass beer has a richer, smoother, less acid > > taste. > > > > Reason: The tongue has taste buds in different areas that pick up different > > elements of flavor. Salt, sweet, aci, sour. Drinking from a bottle > funnels the > > bee over only part of the tongue..the center and only part of the flavor is > > sensed. Drinking from the glass allows the fuller, true flavor to be savored. > > > > Sorry but I will disagree on part of this answer. > > When drinking from a bottle you get the taste buds reaction to the drink > but when you drink for the glass you get the taste buds and also the aroma > as you breath. > > Whe growing up in the south eastern US where moonshine was prevalent (we > were known as Keg County) If you wanted to get drunk quicker you drank > from the mason fruit jar but if you wanted to savor the time and drink you > drank from the same fruit jar using a straw (if the straw did not fall > apart). > > C. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Attn: Gun Lovers of the Group From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 01 Jun 2000 03:56:52 GMT -------- "[©ØMMÄÑУ®]" wrote: > "When guns are > outlawed, only outlaws will have guns" fits very nicely into the American > landscape. > > Can I suggest a solution? No. I guess you guys will just have to accept the > fact that it's easy for criminals to obtain firearms, and protect yourself > accordingly. > Again Robin, The voice of Idealism and lack of practical experience. I have lived AS AN ADULT..for over fifteen years in the UK, twelve years in Canada and a total of thirteen years in the USA. During all of my Adult life I have been interested in the finer points of guns and shooting. In the UK I had several Legally permitted weapons..mainly target rifles and pistols...small and "Full Bore" I had MANY More Illegally held "off ticket" weapons..including a full auto 9mm sten gun. So did almost every "Shooter" I knew then!! In Canada I had no weapons..lack of time and interest..but I could have obtained "Illegal" weapons a damned sight easier..then and now..than I could have obtained legal weapons. Actually I mis-speak..I had one illegally held .22 single shot Anschutz rifle..given by a neighbor..handed on to one when I left..Can't remember their names!! But I knew many people with "illegal weapons" NON with legal ones! In the USA I have fewer, but ENTIRELY LEGAL Weapons..Reason, it is easier, and cheaper as a law abiding citizen/legal resident to obtain legal weapons..which CAN be traced..I agree. Here it seems, MOST of the people I know have legally held weapons for legitimate, law abiding purposes..and yes, that includes legal carry for self defense purposes. It is a fact, that the areas with the highest proportions of LEGALLY held fire arms have the lowest armed crime statistics and vice versa..Check out Kennesaw GA vs Washington DC. Never heard of Kennesaw GA? Go do a web search and learn! The laws regarding the obtaining and passing of illegal weapons are in the USA are DRACONIAN..Just ain't worth a law abiding citizen fooling with them. Now this won't affect the transfer of illegal weapons from one criminal to another..but it sure makes the passage of a Legal weapon to the "other side" a subject for some pause and thought. Now! In the UK and Canada..and several other Countries..What was... and still could be...an entirely legal practice.. the ownership and legitimate use of firearms by Law Abiding Citizens..Has been made illegal!! These are NOT stupid people..they know, since they have not suddenly started to act criminally..that the law that says they have is an ASS!! They recognize, that perfectly ordinary people used to have legitimate uses for guns...THEREFORE THEY FEEL THEY STILL DO!! The "Black Market" in firearms in the UK and Canada, is now very many more times, more active than in pre-ban days..almost on a par with "Pot" use in the two countries and the USA..Where the citizens perceive the law to be an Ass..They treat it as such!! No I don't use pot..but, especially as a known Chemotherapy Patient, I am offered supplies "should I need them" almost daily..from some REALLY surprising sources! I could find and buy, should I so desire, an illegal firearm in Canada and the UK much faster and more easily than I could in the USA..WHY? Because there I would know who to talk to..Here I wouldn't have a clue..wouldn't need to..wouldn't want to! teenut PS I might be brought to task by a few "black helicopter observers" about the wisdom of sounding off about such stuff..especially when "THEY" are listening and can come find me!! Fact is, as a law abiding Citizen, breaking no law, with INALIENABLE rights of free speech guaranteed by the First Amendment and protected by my fellow citizens with the Second Amendment..I feel a damned sight safer writing this here, than in any other Country on Earth!! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Attn: Gun Lovers of the Group From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 01 Jun 2000 03:59:28 GMT -------- Larry Phillips wrote: > Be ashamed and afraid of your government, for it is they who are the > biggest threat to your well-being. > > I've lived in this country for about 40 years longer than you, and I can > see the steady erosion of our freedom and the increase in totalitarian > methodology. It is my considered opinion that it is currently a tight > race between increasing totalitarianism and revolution. Only time will > tell. Well said Larry! Be Afraid..Be VERY afraid! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Attn: Gun Lovers of the Group From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 01 Jun 2000 04:04:41 GMT -------- No Tony! The contributor was right regarding the Doctors! Whether he chose to use it rhetorically (as I believe) to illustrate the damn fool stupidity of relying on statistics..or he has a perceived legitimate beef with doctors.. He is still right! The Rude attack from Robin did nothing to strengthen his argument or refute the "anti-doctor" Robin was wrong..and so are you! 8^) teenut tonyp wrote: > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote in article > > > Careful Robin, > > At this stage you are young, inexperienced and idealistic..and you "Know > not > > that you know not" > > Apart from that, your choice of language and rhetoric serves you ill. > That is > > No Way to promote any kind of serious discussion and enlightenment, no > way to > > speak to a fellow human being..especially from the security of a > computer > > keyboard. > > Regardless of right or wrong, if you were to address me or most of the > guys on > > the NG, like that, face to face, you would find yourself flat on your > young ass, > > with at best, a fat lip..end of discussion..right or wrong! > > And don't come back and tell me how big, strong and fast you are..that > only > > makes it more of a racing certainty! > > Clean up and wise up my young friend. > > respectfully, > > teenut > > Robert, of all the people I have encountered on various newsgroups, I > respect you the most. But you're wrong on this one. > > Regardless of which side you take on guns, doctors, public schools, > immigration, Chinese tools, or any other political brushfire that > periodically flares up in RCM, you have to acknowledge that idiotic > statements get made by people on both sides of every issue. We have seen > the "Doctors are more dangerous than guns" post before. It was stupid > then, it is stupid now. The person who concocted it may be on the correct > side of the gun debate, but he does a disservice to his cause by > presenting such a moronic argument, twice, when _logical_ arguments are > available. I have no idea how old or wise that person is, but whether > he's 19 or 90, that post was entirely worthy of contempt. Robin has the > right to call a spade a spade, even if you disagree with him. > > We can all stick to being polite to each other, of course, but what fun > would that be? > > My very best wishes, > > -- Tony Prentakis ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Attn: Gun Lovers of the Group From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 01 Jun 2000 04:14:47 GMT -------- Read and weep..If you don't already HAVE our Constitutional Protections! Weep Harder..and with Shame..If you want to diminish them! Thanks Jim, teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article , > "[©ØMMÄÑУ®]" wrote: > > > > > Do you really feel the need to protect yourself, physically, from your > local mayor, or senator? > > Not local, but federal. The second amendment was born out of a need > to reconcile the individual state's need for autonomy from a strong > *federal* goverment. Don't forget, the colonies had just finished > one shooting war with a government, and individual states would > _not_ sign on to a constitution which would allow a strong federal > government to enforce arbitrary rules on any particular state, but > minimizing the citizens rights to speech, assembly, and firearm > ownership. > > Now WHAT does this all have to do with the 21st century you might > ask. > > Well, that document (constitution with bill of rights) is still very > much in effect. And there are many forces in play that would limit > the rights to free speech, and so on. And many of the paradigm shifts > that are occuring right now in the US do indeed tend to concentrate > more power, more tightly, in a strong federal government, and limit > the citizens access to federal courts. > > The recent spate of drug laws, for example, are really not the > province of the feds, but should be handled by *state* legislatures. > The recent limitations on the filing of federal habeus corpus petitions > is another example of why the feds want more power and the citizens > to simply 'go away and not bother us.' > > The US was founded on the principles set forth in those documents, > and I for one will be as unwilling to give up one of them as I would > be to give up any other. > > To me, to say 'let's get rid of this right to keep and bear' is > tantamount to saying 'hey, those guys didn't really want us to > publish whatever we wanted about our sacred politicians, get rid > of that antiquated law so we can put the malcontents in jail and > make things run smoother.' > > This from the country where it's protected by that same document > to publish a political cartoon of Abe Lincoln dressed up like a > monkey, where it's ok to pass along the joke about 'spitting on > the wrong side of the FDR stamp,' where you can call any politician > literally *anything* under the sun, and they cannot do one tiny > small thing about it. No knocks on the door in the night, no > black Ford Falcons will arrive on your street. No glass will be > broken on a Kristalnacht and no piles of human skulls will be > made. Nobody will enter your house without a warrant, and if you > can scratch together the cash to publish a paper, there will be > no prior restraint. > > The guns are part of the deal. They made it all happen. > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Attn: Gun Lovers of the Group From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 01 Jun 2000 04:28:45 GMT -------- Jeez Carl..so what you gonna do..throw dog poop at them when/if they come...or just roll over (and play?) dead. Seven hours of Chemo today, and I haven't needed to take an anti-nausea tablet..'til now!! (They are $60.00 a pop..can I send you the bill) One sure thing! The results of your craven lack of forsight will not last. Except that my grand children or theirs or even yours (if the genes work in their favor) will have to start with a bunch of out of date, antique, long buried, shotguns, sporting rifles etc., and fight and DIE ten times harder and longer against even stronger, Tyrannical forces to win back the freedoms you so cravenly give up!! Tyranny, Dictatorship, NEVER lasts more than one, two, or a few generations...But it is a damned sight easier to give in to its beginning than it is to fight it to its death! Please go rethink what you just suggested. Respectfully, teenut Carl Byrns wrote: > > mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > > > > Indeed again. There is a reason for this belief on our part. The > > heritage behind gun ownership is not so much protection for the owner, > > but the ability to repel, forcibly, those people who would attempt to > > impose an unwanted political ideology on the citizens. > > > > In a way this is protection (over the long term) but it's not about > > shooting bears that try to come in the house. It's about shooting > > the two-legged varmints who would prevent free speech, free assembly, > > representation in government, and access to the courts. > > > Let me preface this by saying I enjoy target shooting and support > responsible firearm ownership. > > Rant on- > > The above argument (government won't mess with an armed citizens) made a > lot of sense in 1776. Back then, the government and the citizenry were > pretty equally armed: single-shot rifles on both sides. Today the > government has much more powerful weapons than the citizenry. > > You can't use a snub-nose .38 stop a fighter jet from bombing your > house. > You can't use a 12-gauge to stop a tank. > > I once saw some footage of an A-10 doing a live fire demo. On burst from > the Minigun and zap! Goodbye building (truck, locomotive, bridge, you > get the idea). Ain't no way no how is any hunting rifle going to be > effective against an attack from one of those mothers. > Please bury the "We're keeping the Government Blue Meanies from taking > over" argument. > > Rant off > > -Carl ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Attn: Gun Lovers of the Group From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 01 Jun 2000 04:48:26 GMT -------- Oo! Scary! Is there NO-ONE left in the World, except Americans and at least one BullHeaded (baldheaded, bloody minded!) ex-Yorkshireman,who understands and still believes in the doctrine..."They Shall Not Pass"!! Seems I remember it was a Brit who first put it in words and a bunch of Brits, Canucks, Anzacs, Indians etc., etc., that slugged toe to toe to hold that line...Before being joined by Yanks and Russkis to Hammer the point home! What the hell happened to all you Guys?? Was it something they started putting in the free Orange Juice? Or the stuff in your tea at Boy Scout Camp? I am not ashamed of my Heritage..but bitterly so at what it has become!! teenut Zebee Johnstone wrote: > > In rec.crafts.metalworking on 31 May 2000 23:38:50 EDT > Carl Byrns wrote: > > > >You can't use a snub-nose .38 stop a fighter jet from bombing your > >house. > >You can't use a 12-gauge to stop a tank. > > > >I once saw some footage of an A-10 doing a live fire demo. On burst from > >the Minigun and zap! Goodbye building (truck, locomotive, bridge, you > >get the idea). Ain't no way no how is any hunting rifle going to be > >effective against an attack from one of those mothers. > >Please bury the "We're keeping the Government Blue Meanies from taking > >over" argument. > > > > Well, as an outsider from a different culture, what has confused me > about it is *how* it will be done. > > SHoot a politician? Hold hostages until the govt does what you want as > is happening in Fiji? Blow up army vehicles and kneecap people as they > do in Northern Ireland? And in this era of total war, who deals with > the non-combantants? Refugee camps are ugly places. > > And what is a tyrannical govt anyway? Where's the threshold? Someone > mentioned the current USA drug laws which seem to have some very nasty > provisions in them. Is that worth fighting over? What will be? > > When does this fight tyranny hting happen? What's the critical mass? > > And what stops it from turning out like Northern Ireland, or the current > resistance to the Taliban in Afghanistan? I presume that if it isn't > split on race lines it won't turn out like the various messes in the > former USSR, but what if it does split on such lines? > > I believe that the real key is the democratic system itself, which was > a pretty new idea back in 1776. That combined with the habits of mind > and the ways of thought needed to keep a strong economy going seem to > mitigate against tyranny far more effectively than the guns of say the > communist insurgents in the Phillipines have done. > > The Chinese govt is learning that the hard way, as the Indonesian govt > did, and the Malaysian one will soon. You can't survive as a nation > in the modern world if you are a totalitarian state, because you can't > compete as the democratic ones with their incentives can. YOu used to > be able to because the people didn't know any better, but they do now. > And even if they didn't, the totalitarian way, (esp combined with the > usual cronyism and graft) is inherently inefficient, and the industries > will go bust. > > I also think that if the army is against you, then you are not going to > get anywhere with personal weapons. IF the army is with you, then as the > Phillipines showed you don't *need* personal weapons. So another key to > freedom is tp be sure the army is made up of people who spend a lot of > time with civilians, rather than segregated and indoctrinated the way say > the Chinese one is. IF you want to fight tyranny, invite a squaddie home > for dinner, and encourage your children to do short time in the forces, > and to keep up friendships with the people they met there who stayed in. > > I view it as one of those cultural religious things. Impossible for > outsiders to understand, and impossible for insiders to abandon. > > Aussies have the same attitude to other things, I think every culture > does. > > Zebee ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Storing Mecury From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 01 Jun 2000 05:00:29 GMT -------- Flown high enough and hit hard enough..it might prove a popular fertilizing program for less populated agricultural areas. Not near my house though please. We have been secretly turning lawyers into the purest form of fertilizer known to man..but you can get too much of even that good thing. Got to let the stench die down a bit! Great roses though! teenut Spehro Pefhany wrote: > > The renowned Larry Phillips wrote: > > > Just another example of why I think that the best use of news reporters > > is as air-to-air towed targets. > > Considering what they are full of, it might not be popular with those on > the ground. ;-) > > Best regards, > -- > =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= > Spehro Pefhany --"it's the network..." "The Journey is the reward" > speff@interlog.com Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com > Embedded software/hardware/analog Info for designers: http://www.speff.com > Contributions invited->The AVR-gcc FAQ is at: http://www.BlueCollarLinux.com > =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Attn: Gun Lovers of the Group From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 01 Jun 2000 05:38:03 GMT -------- Don't Like!! Or don't agree? Ain't no-one I don't like. Life is too short. OTOH shortness of life is a real good reason not to AGREE with a whole bunch of folks! Yerself included on most occasions! 8^) teenut "Mark W." wrote: > Sometimes I don't like you, but on this, we stand together. > > Mark ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Attn: Gun Lovers of the Group From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 01 Jun 2000 06:21:41 GMT -------- Stephen Young wrote: > And of course the statement "When guns are outlawed, only outlaws will have > guns" is not idiotic? That one always makes me wonder about those who believe > its' relevance. Hmmmm, lets see. If kitchen sinks are outlawed, only outlaws > will have kitchen sinks. Yep, I guess it makes sense. What kind of moronic > logic is that? Obviously way beyond the limited power of deduction of SOME people huh Stephen! Guns are outlawed in Britain! I personally know several (Many) people, in Britain who still or have since obtained guns that are "Out side the law" Are they not then "Outlaws with guns" If not..how would you describe them? Lets take a simpler line of reasoning that many other people may be able to follow (Do your best Stephen) In the USA there are many people who own legally registered guns and have, for now, the legal right to own them...Including myself There are also many people who do NOT have the legal right to own guns (check the law) but, nevertheless DO own guns..can you even IMAGINE why Stephen? Let us take the (not so unreasonable) supposition that the Government is to ban ALL firearms. (Stay with us here Stephen..not long now) Because the Law abiding people ARE law abiding people..they will hand in their guns..Right Stephen..because if they don't they will become OUTLAWS..Or, because the guns are registered, the Government will know where to go to collect them. Even I won"t have a gun..because I will not become an outlaw. Now then, Stephen..do you imagine that all the people with ILLEGALY HELD GUNS..Y'know, the Convicted fellons, the wife beaters, the thieves, murderers and drug dealers etc., will go and hand IN THEIR guns? Do you imagine the police will know where to go to find them? If they do..Why don't they go and get them NOW!! They are already illegal guns in the hands of OUTLAWS!! Now Stephen..not so difficult conclusion.. Guns are outlawed..People who have guns are outlaws..Who still has the guns? The OUTLAWS, RIGHT!...Well done Stephen If they decide to bust down my front door Guns in hand, to get at my wife and her jewellry, my son and his computors, my 15 year old Daughter and her friends or me and my Starretts, or you Stephen who are visiting me to look over a piece of machinery! WHO is going to stop them? And PUHLEASE!!! Don't say the local Constabulary with THEIR legally held guns and ten minute response time!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Chuckle time..teenut From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 01 Jun 2000 06:35:59 GMT -------- One of the many side effects of the chemo and radiation treatments is a sudden swing in body temperature..from sweating in cold rooms to shivering in warm ones. This evening, though warmly wrapped I got a real shivery spell. My Robe simply wasn't enough, so my wife went and fetched her heaviest one. Hey it is Bright yellow Candle wick..but in the security of my own home..what the hey! Soon I warmed up and made a trip to the bathroom. On the way I caught a glimps of this person, in a large hall way mirror..Bald head, earstud, full length saffron robe..and something in my mind went CHING! CHING, ching ching CHING! Ching ching CHING Hare Krishna Hare Krishna Going down to the Airport tomorrow..between sessions..to make some SERIOUS Coin!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: chemo From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 01 Jun 2000 19:49:47 GMT -------- Sure, if you wanna wear turd shaped jewelrey teenut EjayHire wrote: > > Since they are platinum plating your insides, have you thought > about doing some kind of reclamation? Make some jewelry or > something for all the pain it's causing you???? > > :> > > * Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet's Discussion Network * > The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet - Free! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Attn: Gun Lovers of the Group From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 01 Jun 2000 20:05:27 GMT -------- I guess I was just wasting my time and my breathe..pity! Won't happen again. teenut "[©ØMMÄÑУ®]" wrote: > > Well, my friends, I have apparently been out gunned. I'll just go one living > in the best country on earth, with my head under the sand. Why? Because at > this point in my life, things seem to be going OK, except for Mr. Harris. > Wish I had a bullet for HIM... > > Anyway, enjoy your gunz, guys. > > Robin ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: When will we see cheap Indian tools?! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 01 Jun 2000 22:56:33 GMT -------- Barney, If your dick is as big as your brain you have a real problem! teenut Barney Rubble wrote: > > Bob Edwards wrote: > > > > but now most you see are Indian). > > > > I had an Indian made rolling mill for a while -- > > > > > > OTOH, I have a number of Indian-made cheap (AND inexpensive) hand tools, > > fixtures, gauges, etc. and they all work fine for a fraction of the cost of > > German or Swiss. > > Are you talking about the blanket ass type indian in the U.S. or the > towel > head variety of the over seas? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Chuckle time..teenut From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 02 Jun 2000 01:28:06 GMT -------- Hey Tony You got some facts and reputable sources to back up this BS? Last I heard tapeworm came from pork and I'll bet Brits out eat Yanks on pork three to one! teenut > The renowned Tony Jeffree wrote: > > > Thats as may be...but what hasn't been disproved is the (relatively) > > high incidence of tapeworm infestation in North America caused by > > eating rare steaks... > > Bon appetit... ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Attn: Gun Lovers of the Group From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 02 Jun 2000 04:09:03 GMT -------- Ah! Now I see that when it is YOUR Ox that is being gored..your promary answer is a bullet for Mr Harris. Well, well , well! teenut "[©ØMMÄÑУ®]" wrote: > > Trust me, a room full of monkeys would be more to my liking than Mr. Harris. > > Do you work overtime for free? I don't, and I don't know many people who do. > Well, Mr. Harris is going to make it law that all Ontario teachers must do > after school activities (football, rugby, etc), and they will not be paid > for it. Hmmmm... That's interesting. My parents are both teachers, so this > house does not find his crap amusing in the least. > > Robin > > "esnel" wrote in message > news:DYCZ4.74547$au2.866306@news1.rdc1.bc.home.com... > > > > [©ØMMÄÑУ®] wrote in message news:tbrZ4.3654, > except > > for Mr. Harris. > > > Wish I had a bullet for HIM... > > well Robin we'll trade him for the NDP govt we have out here in BC if > your > > intrested > > > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Chuckle time..teenut From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 02 Jun 2000 04:24:26 GMT -------- Yeh! Like having a leg amputated! teenut "Mark W." wrote: > > Hey,... nothing beats a visit to the operating room for losing weight! > > Mark > > (42 days and counting....) > > hardy wrote in message ... > > > >PLAlbrecht wrote in message > >news:20000601142554.28916.00001136@ng-fv1.aol.com... > >> >and their descriptions of meat decaying in your too-long bowels might > put > >> >you off of your next encounter with Ruth's Chris. > >> > >> There was a thing on the tube a few weeks ago about some woman in England > >who > >> weighed some obscene amount, 350 lbs. or something. So they went in and > >> reconnected the large intestine so there was less "residence time" as it > >were. > >> > >> She lost weight incredibly fast, but had to eat constantly. And her > >biggest > >> complaint was that she "couldn't get relationships to work" because she > >was > >> constantly on the pot and the house... uh, smelled. > >> > >> So she had it put back the way it was. > >> > >> Well, off to breakfast with me... > >> > >> Pete > >Pete I like the idea of the new method of losing weight with hypnotism, the > >hypnotize you real good and come back 3 months later and wake you up > >Paul > > > > > > > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Single flute drill bits From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 02 Jun 2000 11:58:42 GMT -------- Engraving or "D bit" cutters are single flute..so are "Diemakers reamers" teenut Greg Nuspel wrote: > > Gun drill bits are single flute. > > -- > > -- Greg Nuspel > > "The whole of science is nothing more than a refinement of everyday > thinking" > -- Albert Einstein > > Home Page http://members.home.com/gregsdiversions > Clubs Page http://www.cadvision.com/crcss > "Ed French" wrote in message > news:NCJZ4.38937$v7.1844528@news-west.usenetserver.com... > > Does anyone make a single flute drill bit or end mill? > > > > > > > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Care and Feeding of a good mill vice From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 03 Jun 2000 01:06:43 GMT -------- Mike Graham wrote: > >> 1. does one tap or rap the handle to lock it tight ? > > I always do. Every machinist that I have worked with does it. > Time to try a Gerardi Vise in place of the ubiquitous "beat em shut, beat em down type of "conventional vise" (and I DO include Kurts herein) Properly set up and used by some one who knows how, the Gerardi will hold and hold gown tighter than any other vise with a simple flick of the wrist. Anyone else out there ever USED one? teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Single flute drill bits From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 03 Jun 2000 01:45:42 GMT -------- Curiouser and curiouser! The only single flute drill I can recall with a "U" shaped flute is a woodworker's "Ppoon Bit" The usually are straight fluted..but I have seen one or two with spiral (single) flutes. What are you wanting to drill Ed..and with what regree of accuracy and speed? teenut Ed French wrote: > > I need to add a couple more requirements. The flute needs to spiral around > the bit and it should be U shapped. I have a single flute countersink which > almost does what I want but the flute is V shaped. > > Thanks > > wrote in message news:8h8ehh$lks$1@nnrp1.deja.com... > | In article , > | > | Likewise I have seen (long ago, and never since) some brass > | drills that were single flute. > | > | > Engraving or "D bit" cutters are single flute..so are "Diemakers > | reamers" > | > | > > Gun drill bits are single flute. > | > | > | Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > | Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Single flute drill bits From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 03 Jun 2000 01:47:52 GMT -------- Make that "Spoon bit" before the linguists and wise asses get to it! teenut Robert Bastow wrote: > > Curiouser and curiouser! > > The only single flute drill I can recall with a "U" shaped flute is a > woodworker's "Ppoon Bit" The usually are straight fluted..but I have seen one > or two with spiral (single) flutes. > > What are you wanting to drill Ed..and with what regree of accuracy and speed? > > teenut > > Ed French wrote: > > > > I need to add a couple more requirements. The flute needs to spiral around > > the bit and it should be U shapped. I have a single flute countersink which > > almost does what I want but the flute is V shaped. > > > > Thanks > > > > wrote in message news:8h8ehh$lks$1@nnrp1.deja.com... > > | In article , > > | > > | Likewise I have seen (long ago, and never since) some brass > > | drills that were single flute. > > | > > | > Engraving or "D bit" cutters are single flute..so are "Diemakers > > | reamers" > > | > > | > > Gun drill bits are single flute. > > | > > | > > | Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > > | Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Welcome Can Makers From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 03 Jun 2000 01:50:01 GMT -------- Are these the guys that make all those smelly, plastic Porta-Cans? ;^) teenut Fdmorrison wrote: > > >can_guru_2000@my-deja.com > > >Welcome Can Makers > > > >This is a place to discuss whats going on in the can industry in the US > >and Overseas. > > Absolutely. Good opener. > > Frank Morrison ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: For Gunner And Teenut From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 07 Jun 2000 19:17:12 GMT -------- If you can't stand the heat..stay out of the kitchen! You were the one that started the pissing contest Robin..made some pretty rude and uncalled for personal remarks about a poster with whom you did not agree. Now you wish it would all go away..Well, sorry son, life (fortunately) ain't like that. Stand by your beliefs and make your arguments stick with logic and facts..or be a man, admit you were wrong and apologise. "Please go away" won't hack it..and certainly won't engender future respect for anything else you might want to say..regardless of the subject. teenut "[©ØMMÄÑУ®]" wrote: > > Blah blah blah blah. Lets not get into a pissing contest. All I was saying > was that this topic had been discussed before, at least once to my knowledge > and more than once from what I've heard. I think we all understand each > other's opinion on the issue. This one topic seems to get everyone up in > arms over and over again. > > Robin > > "PLAlbrecht" wrote in message > news:20000605224626.07475.00001499@ng-fb1.aol.com... > > >I find it interesting that you comment on someone having 12 of 168 posts > on > > >a single subject when you have, as last count, well over 20 of 80 on a > > >single subject. > > > > 1) You may well find it interesting. If so, you are easily amused, and > perhaps > > you really can't tell the difference between the two situations. > > > > 2) I commented on that someone having 12 out of 168 posts on a subject > > precisely because and only because he then asked that people stop posting > on > > the subject. Do as I say, not as I do? For all I care he can have 0 or 1 > or 167 > > posts out of 168; the subject matter (guns in this case) isn't even the > point. > > It's the nerve of telling people to stop posting to the thread, after > taking > > such an active part in propagating it, that I found absurd. > > > > < > >everything posted as if it were directed at you personally. What is this? > > > > No, but your post WAS directed at me personally. Your reply began with the > > words "As are you..." The word "you" is the subjective personal pronoun > > referring to _me_ and therefore your reply was directed at _me_ > personally. > > You... me... get it? > > > > I'm not the one making a federal case out of it. I pointed out the > absurdity of > > Robin's request and that's the end of it as far as Robin and I are > concerned. > > But you're the one who brought up how many times I post, which is > irrelevant > > because I don't ask people NOT to post, especially not on threads that I > > participate in. If I don't like the thread, I don't read it. If I don't > like > > where a thread has gone, I don't read it. You are welcome to do likewise, > or > > you can just continue this and keep your blood pressure on the boil. > > > > >Robin was plainly expressing some frustration with the subject - which > you > > >failed to grasp - > > > > I did grasp that his frustration at being unable to defend his position > led to > > his asking that people stop posting to the thread entirely. Just as you > failed > > to grasp that very same point. > > > > >>as you failed to grasp that 'live by the sword, die by the sword' is > simply a > > statement reflecting my attitude toward guns. Yet you choose to read this > as > > some sort of threat or insult. > > > > Yes, I did. Because you began the post in bringing up not the topic of > guns, > > but rather the number of posts I had made to a certain topic, as a counter > to > > my bringing up how many posts Robin made to a thread which he then wished > would > > go away. The "sword" analogy could just as well refer to people using > posting > > statistics as to using guns.If you did not intend it to be a personal > attack > > (doubtful, as you quite definitely directed your reply to me) you should > have > > chosen your taglines more carefully. I, on the other hand, DO intend this > as a > > personal attack. I don't think even you can mistake it for anything else. > > > > To reiterate: I said > Yeah, but remember that with 12 of 168 posts on the > > original thread (and two on this thread) coming from you, you were a > > significant part of that bandwidth. > > > > You said > > >As are you with over 20 of your last 80 posts on a single other subject > ... > > > > and one paragraph later, > > > > >Live by the sword, die by the sword. > > > > After challenging my post re Robin's "bandwidth" by citing my number of > posts, > > it seemed a quite obvious personal jab to me, and I responded with logical > > force. > > > > >What you may consider your 'intellectual weight' others may consider a > 'fat > > >head.' > > > > Awww... poor baby... Whatsumatta? Feel like you're fighting out of your > weight > > class? (Headbutt to Jaffe's underdeveloped logic center...) > > > > >And I even started to think you might be hip with that 'Taxi Driver' post > > >... sorry, my mistake. > > > > No doubt you make lots of those. > > > > >wherever you go, there you are > > > > Have you ever considered that you may be nowhere at all? > > > > And furthermore... in another message in this thread, in response to > another > > poster's > > >>> As long as 60 to 80 million citizens have privately owned firearms > > we have a litle bit of control over a runaway government. > > > > you wrote > > >>That's what Timothy McVeigh thought. > > > > Now that's really deep. Right along with "lives by sword." And you wonder > why > > you're misunderstood. > > > > Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Four jaw toolmaker's lathe chuck From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 08 Jun 2000 23:12:47 GMT -------- The type of "Faceplate/Chuck" you suggest actually precedes the "regular fourjaw chuck"..both historically, and in usefulness, especially at the the extreme ends of the size spectrum. Watchmaker's faceplates often use either clamps OR small adjustable dog type jaws. The huge Roll turning/gunbarrel lathes also use moveable vise type jaws on a large faceplate..rather than a four jaw chuck of the conventional type. For the HSM I firmply believe that a lightweight faceplate/chuck can be more versatile than a clunky 4-jaw. IIRC "Tubal Cain" came up with a very versatile design, many years ago. (Or was it ET.Westbury?) Anyway Doug..you are on the right track. teenut DGoncz wrote: > > I'm wondering if I can combine a faceplate with shallow milled slots and the > type of jaws used in the small toolmaker's and also larger CNC milling vises. > > The slots on my Harbor Freight $20 four jaw lathe chuck should do. They are > about 1/16 inch deep and keep the jaws from twisting. The jaws are tightened by > screws through studs in counterbores in the middle step of each jaw. The studs > are retained by nylon locking nuts and brass washers on the faced rear of the > chuck. These can be adjusted to a fine fit or firmer, for clamping. The screws > are 8mm x 1.25 pitch, finer than the usual four jaw chuck, but the design is > different and they do not apply as much force. > > I'd like to rough face circular slots, then mill slots into these faced areas > to accept pins that can pivot around axes tangent to a circumfrence through the > center of each pin, using the toolmaker's vise principle to apply more force > down (toward the headstock) than in. In other words, each pin rests in a groove > perpendicular to the existing shallow grooves. They pull toward center. An old > Sherline catalog shows his vise with a 50 degree minimum angle specified from > what would be horizontal on a milling machine. > > I'd have to mill spherical recesses in the jaws or mill 55 degree miters and > use spherical washers. I'd like to use the 8mm clamping screws already in use, > or shorter versions of the same screws. The vise comes with square head screws. > I've changed these to button head cap screws. I can mill spherical surfaces on > the bolts in use without degrading their function. The collet indexers fit in > the chuck and the center of rotation can be arranged to be within or near the > screw heads. The outer button head provides inward pressure in the existing > chuck, similar to the a feature needlessly machined into the small lots of > square headed screws, and a 120 degree point milled on the inner ends provides > outward pressure for chucking tubes and rings. > > With an 8mm screw through a 3/8 (10mm) steel pin, there might be enough > strength. With a 3/8 pin, the increment is near 3/8. I don't know about the > range of such a clamp. As it's tightened, the angle increases from the 50 > degrees to, um, I have to work that out, but in any case there's still more > force clamping down than in so the part won't lift. > > I wonder if I need to use tool steel for the pins? Or 1/2 inch steel. The usual > pin is the absolutely worst thing you could to to a round beam -- drill a hole > right through the center where the most stress is! I can easily braze angles to > the back of each pin to add compressive strength to that side of the beam. > Perhaps that's best. The travel of the screw through the pin will determine it. > Ideally, a rectangular bar with one narrow face milled both corner to fully > round would be nice, and an arc across the back centered on the pivot line. > Such a deep rectangular beam would be much stronger than a rod. There'd be a > lot of web around the screw hole. > > I can face the slots as v shapes instead, then mill square v slots with an > angle milling cutter I have for this drill press mill/wood > shaper/polisher/grinder/pencil sharpener. > > Think zebras! > > Yours, > > Doug Goncz > Replikon Research > Seven Corners, VA 22044-0394 > QSL: DGoncz @ aol.com or 22044-0394 > http://members.aol.com/DGoncz ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Aging copper From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 08 Jun 2000 23:22:07 GMT -------- Cat pee! teenut rickmoto wrote: > > Is there any quick method for getting copper sheeting to turn blue/green ? > Thnks, Rick ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT sort of......I need me a job!!! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 10 Jun 2000 00:26:15 GMT -------- Where are you foxeye? teenut foxeye wrote: > > Hell I am not retired any amount of tinme yet , and I am bored > already. Lots of new toys , but I still crave for a job........I > always assumed I would enjoy every minute I did not have to go to work > or any other place if I did not want, and now that that time is here, > I don't particularly care for it. Hope its just a phase. Think > tomorrow I just may go look around for something partime to help me > pass the time......yea, thats it, a part time apprentice in a big > machine shop...I sure as hell can't see hpw those welfare idiots sit > on their butts all day for years at a time..........I would go > bonkers...... > Foxeye > > "Remove nospam to send email" > nospamfoxeye@ddyne.com > foxeye@nospamddyne.com > Just my .02 cents worth! > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT sort of......I need me a job!!! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 10 Jun 2000 16:41:06 GMT -------- Helluva commute to Atlanta..but if you REALLY want a job...... ;^) teenut foxeye wrote: > > Montgomery, Allllllllllllllaaaaaabaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaama > On Sat, 10 Jun 2000 00:26:15 GMT, Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ > hotmail.com> wrote: > > >Where are you foxeye? > > > >teenut > > > >foxeye wrote: > >> > >> Hell I am not retired any amount of tinme yet , and I am bored > >> already. Lots of new toys , but I still crave for a job........I > >> always assumed I would enjoy every minute I did not have to go to work > >> or any other place if I did not want, and now that that time is here, > >> I don't particularly care for it. Hope its just a phase. Think > >> tomorrow I just may go look around for something partime to help me > >> pass the time......yea, thats it, a part time apprentice in a big > >> machine shop...I sure as hell can't see hpw those welfare idiots sit > >> on their butts all day for years at a time..........I would go > >> bonkers...... > >> Foxeye > >> > >> "Remove nospam to send email" > >> nospamfoxeye@ddyne.com > >> foxeye@nospamddyne.com > >> Just my .02 cents worth! > >> > > Foxeye > > "Remove nospam to send email" > nospamfoxeye@ddyne.com > foxeye@nospamddyne.com > Just my .02 cents worth! > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Beginner's book on CNC milling ??? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 10 Jun 2000 20:38:55 GMT -------- Pat McGuirk wrote: > > John, > You might also want to lurk at -- alt.machines.cnc > and dont let the Roberts of the world slow you down. I will treat that remark with the contempt it deserves! teenut..AKA one of the Roberts of the world. In case you are still wondering..your asshole is the one with hair round it..but I bet you have a beard Huh!! The company I > work for was at one time hiring people off the street and training them > on big Cincinnati 3 spindle 5 axis machines, --I think they have > figured out thats not the way to go, but we all learned somewhere > sometime. > Good luck, > Pat > > My Metalwork Links Page: > http://www.angelfire.com/ks/mcguirk/metalworklinks.html > > * Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet's Discussion Network * > The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet - Free! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Bad day finally resolved From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 11 Jun 2000 14:57:25 GMT -------- Dave Baker wrote: I once quoted on a complete rebuild of > a Daimler Dart 2.5 litre V8 engine > At least the engine ran like a dream at the end of it all :) > Probably the first time..EVER!! ;^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: For Sale: Logan 10" late, 8" metal shaper, surface grinder From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sun, 11 Jun 2000 18:00:29 GMT -------- Anyone who has previously complained about the lack of "Good American Metal at reasonable prices"..Who is not already on their way, to Tampa, with a rental truck waiting for them, and with Laptop and cell phone at hand..has forever lost their "Bitchin' Rights" on this list!! Better hurry guys..my flight leaves in an hour!! ;^) teenut Mark Marks wrote: > > I have several older pieces of metalworking machinery for sale. This > equipment belonged to my father for many years and will soon get me a > divorce if I don't move it out of the garage. (I've had them since 1988 > and my wife has been parking outside for 12 years so > don't be too hard on her.) > > The lathe is a Logan 820 which is 10" by 24" with a quick change gear box. > It was purchsed new from Logan by my father in 1950 and was never used for > factory work. (I have the original sales reciept.) It comes with 2 sets of > chucks: 8" 4-jaw & 3-jaw and 5" 4-jaw & 3-jaw. It also includes a > Palmgreen milling attachment, live center, dead centers and some tooling. > The lathe needs a good clean-up and paint job. There is no rust on the > machine but the paint is worn off or is very thin on most handled surfaces. > The only defect I'm aware of is that the reverse setting for the motor > isn't working (I think it has the original motor.) I'll sell it for $850 > cash for pick up in Clearwater, Florida (Tampa Bay area). > > The shaper is a Havline 8" floor standing unit and weighs approximately 650 > pounds. The ram is very tight and the table is in nice condition. It has > an 5" drill press vise mounted to the table. The shaper is $575. I have no > idea of the age of the shaper but my father also owned it since the early > 1950's. > > The surface grinder is a Delta Rockwell and includes a 6" x 10" magnetic > chuck. It has manual feeds and a 3/4 hp motor. This machine was purchased > used in 1972; I believe it is early 1960's vintage. Price $550. > > I'm not computer savy enough to post pictures online but can email them next > week to anyone who is interested. Again, I'm not prepared to ship them but > they can be inspected / picked up in the Tampa Bay area of Florida. > > Please email me at mwmarks@tampabay.rr.com if you have any questions. > Thanks. > > --Mark ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.org.sca Subject: Re: Modern Metals, Old Weapons... From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 14 Jun 2000 01:05:22 GMT -------- Reactive armor has been effectively used for years, to protect armored vehicles from both KE (Fast moving, pointy projectiles) and Shaped charge type warheads.(Fast moving jet of gas) The objective being that the reactive armor, (a box of high explosive, in its simplest form) explodes when hit and the wave of blast energy deflects or disrupts the penetrating effect of the incoming round. It occurs to me that reactive armor could be devised for defense against cutting/piercing type weapons...a simple jacket, in which is embedded a conductive grid and a large capacitor. The discharge of the capacitor would metal the cutting edge before it had time to penetrate. Ten thousand more knowledgeable people than I will now tell us why it will never work! ;^) teenut Ulfar Macvanis wrote: > > 1) Are there materials today which are so strong that the resiliency factor > is irrelevant: a person simply isn't strong enough to cause it to shatter? > What are they? How are they worked? > > The military have some amazing composite metals that are built up of layers > from many different composites but they are hard to produce and the cost is > prohibative.. For the day to day world good high carbon steel worked by a > decent bladesmith is really hard to beat for price V quality.. A good steel > sword is truly an amazing thing.. > > >2) What is the historic relationship between the edge of a sword and it's > weight? I understand that lighter swords, not designed to deal with an > armored foe, generally have a keen and sharp edge, where heavier swords, > designed as much to bludgeon as to wound, have an edge like a chisel (which > would last longer). Is this still an issue? > > What are you trying to cut ?? an armoured man ? Unarmoured ? > A good viking patternwelded sword was very sharp and reasonably weigted, > Then you could go as far as the huge two handers designed to crush as well > as cut.. > > >3) How about composites: multiple metals forged/fused together into a whole > greater than it's parts? Is there a superior material that can be forged > into the blade to be an edge, and a different material that can be used for > the bulk of the weight? Is it worthwhile? > > One again the Viking blades are a good example here they were made of many > different metals A soft flexable core and a high carbon edge forge welded on > they were supremely flexable while still having a hard sharp edge some > blades have even been found to have the centre removed so that they are just > a backed edge... > Weight = heavier blows the can cleave through tough armour. > > >4) The relationship between mass and purpose? At what point does a sword > become no more (or even less) effective against an armored for than a mace? > > A mace is a great crushing weapon some would argue that it is also clumsy > when used againt a sword, A sword with it's sharp edge can also be thrust > into weak spots of armour etc.. > > >5) Big or small? Heavy or Light? I was thinking that very small, but very > heavy would be the best of all worlds: something as slim as a rapier, but > weighing as much as a backsword, or even a claymore (the two-handed-kind), > with a handle much like the claymore or even the German Landesnecht (sp?) > sword-type. > > There is no perfect sword one will get used to the advantages of their > weapon and learn to compensate for it's weaknesses, The romans used a very > short sword called the gladius, it was primarily a thusting weapon but was > an efective slashing weapon as well. about 30 to 40 inches seems to be a > good comprimise for blade length. it gives you reach while being realativly > quick to use.. Remember the heavier your wepon the more effort it takes to > use . > > >Now, for armor: > > > Where are we at? It seems to me we could encase an individual in metal > sufficient to ward any blows: could we do it and let the poor guy walk > around too? Is metal the best material for this task (I know I am asking on > the metalworking group, but...)? In my mind, strength-to-weight ratios, > modern plastics generally have it all over metals, or am I wrong? > > If you put a lot of modern plastics in the way of a good blade you prob will > need a good doctor or mortitian..A full suit of steel isnt that heavy and if > made properly it proves to be little hinderance to all moves .. > Although the possibility of a titanium mesh imbedded in a high grade > toughend plastic has many possibilities..or even a cremic steel > hybrid....worth looking into me thinks.. > > >What about articulations? Are we any better than previous armorers in this > respect? I recall that the stunning Henry VIII's 'Armor for Fighting on Foot > in the Lists' looks very much like a spacesuit: on purpose, that is, since > the NASA guys took notes from it. Can we do better? Have there been advances > in articulation? > > This is a real problem modern armourers stil hevent bettered some of the > best medieval armour as it's damm near perfect.. > > Padding would certainly be better: there is some stuff with extraordinary > dampening properties these days. Bubblewrap, for example. :) > > It is truely amazing what a few layers of quilted cotten wadding can > absorb...Clozed cell foam is the commen most used product for shock > absorbtian these days.. > > >At the moment, energy density isn't enough to create an effective powered > armor (where the articulations are motorized), so I'm leaving this (and > sci.robotics) out of this conversation. > > On this note scientists have already made artificial electro responsive > muscles that could be easily worked into a AKA Power suit design...(No > servos,motors, gears etc) > > Ulfarr ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Help, homemade vertical mill head. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 15 Jun 2000 04:20:46 GMT -------- Try pricing ABEC 7 taper roller bearings!! teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article , > beer@sfu.ca wrote: > > On Mon, 05 Jun 2000 09:50:27 -0400, Brian Evans > wrote: > > > I'm thinking about using an MT3 sleeve ( tapered inner, round outer ) > with some tapered roller bearings pressed on. > > I really wonder *why* manufacturers like bridegport insist on using > angular contact ball bearings in the spindles. The tapered roller > pair seems, at first glance, to be a *much* better choice. > > 1) the pre-load can be set with a threaded collar on the spindle > which loads up the inner races. > > 2) these bearings can take ferocious loads. Think of a car wheel > bearing. > > 3) inexpensive. Anyone who's priced abec7 spindle bearings knows this. > > I wonder why the obsession with angular contact ball bearings. Maybe > it has to do with the level of precision attainable this way. > > What bad things happen if one uses tapered roller bearings in a > mill spindle? > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.org.sca Subject: Re: Modern Metals, Old Weapons... From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 15 Jun 2000 04:41:05 GMT -------- Whether ERA is as effective against KE projectiles as against CE type attack is not in doubt. But the reason certainly has nothing to do with the KE projectile being faster than the explosive front. Typical KE projectile muzzle velocities in the 5000 feet per second region..explosive front velocity of reactive armor..20,000 METERS per second plus. Which is shiftin' a bit!! teenut "I. C. Koets" wrote: > > ERA is only marginally effective against KE projectiles. The projectiles > sometimes even travel faster than the explosion front of the ERA, thus only > taking effect after the projectile penetrated. > > I.C. Koets > > PS: sorry about the jargon, I've just been to sci.military.naval ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking,rec.org.sca Subject: Re: Modern Metals, Old Weapons... From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 15 Jun 2000 04:50:17 GMT -------- ROTFLMAO!! But read (what little is published) on the makeup of "Chobham" type composition armor..and understand that your spec for reactive body armor may not be far from reality...or attainability. Certainly it is less complex than say, your average space walk suit! Perhaps a reactive explosive type body armor is within the realms of possibility for duty in Bomb Disposal applications. Sure, it might blow the "Protectee" right across the carpark..but will prevent penetrative type wounds. The human body can withstand massive impact energy..so long as it is properly dispursed. Just musin' teenut teenut David Hughes wrote: With use, abrasion, normal wear and > tear, etc. it's going to be difficult to maintain that mid-layer. > "Did you hear about poor Charlie? He bent over a gaurdrail to pick up > something, and welded himself to the TriState Bridge!" > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: perils of being an amateurish machinist From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 15 Jun 2000 06:19:26 GMT -------- And John has a brother in Nottingham University..Not in a Faculty though..he's in a bottle..wi' two heeds! teenut John Stevenson wrote: > > On Wed, 14 Jun 2000 16:35:12 GMT, mcgray@futurenet.bc.ca (Mike Gray) wrote: > > >John Stevenson wrote: > >snip > > > >>For the past 35 years they have had to make do with The Dandy, Beano and > >>Red Cross food parcels that usually come wrapped in a three year old copy > >>of Exchange and Mart > >You forgot The Eagle, Meccano Magazine, and the Ashington Post. > >> > >>Although much critised and down trodden they are a hardy and likable breed > >>of people. And I would like to state in writing that its a ->downwrite<- lie > >>that all folk North of Manchester [ except Salford ] keep the coal in the > >>bath. > > > >Agreed, it is a downwrite (sic) lie.... we kept wor coal in the nettie > >doon the backyard. > > > >Mike, originally from Ashington, NBL, and who, thank God, was rejected > >by Nottingham Univ., went to Ormskirk TTC, in Lancs, and learnt to > >spell DOWNRIGHT. > > I'll have you know kind Sir that I also went to Ormskirk TTC. > I delivered 22 ton of bricks there. > -- > > Regards, > John Stevenson > Special Purpose Machines > Nottingham, England ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: MSC From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 15 Jun 2000 06:47:59 GMT -------- All I can say is that there must be two different MSC's. I place, sometimes two or three orders a day with them (for a commercial tool and die shop) NEVER had a wrong delivery! Only ever had ONE back order..Skip tooth taper pipe tap that came the following AM before 9 AM Have returned lots of stuff for credit due to MY over ordering or for exchange due to MY wrong spec. Never had a complaint or a restocking charge. Only ever had one part go tits up on me ( a Royal live center with a duff bearing..changed for a good one in SECONDS while I waited at the desk. Technical staff I deal with (Atlanta Office) are a delight and go to extreme lengths to get the right answers and the right bits. Never a minimum charge..and some of my orders are for less than five dollars. I have an open account..they insist (My Specification) on getting a PO # from us and invoice on a rolling monthly basis. Oh and I get a great reception, friendly smiles, enquiries about my wellbeing and free coffee everytime I go in the store. What else I could expect ..I don't know I use the M-C catalogue as a door stop..don't know where my J&L Cat is! No I don't have shares in MSC..wish the heck I did!! teenut hardy wrote: > > Phil I am with you and will back you 100% I to have had problems with them I > refuse to let MSC train their people on me at my expense, i.e.. pulling my > hair out by the handfuls trying to straighten out a screw up at their > end......I never thought I would ever say this but Mcmaster-Carr I have NO > problems, that in it's self is worth a little more in cost, when I call M-C > about any questions it seems that I always get someone who knows what the > hell they are talking about.... why can't MSC do that ????? > > Paul > > Phil Koenig wrote in message > news:39483963.BE9B20AF@tuna.net... > > > > > > bob149@uswest.net wrote: > > > > > ptmachine wrote in message > > > news:1b58ba3b.81e6fc86@usw-ex0106-044.remarq.com... > > > > I just placed an order with MSC today and while I had them on the > phone > > > > I asked if there was a minimum order. I am happy to say that there is > > > > no min order! Just wanted to dispel the rumors. N. > > > > > > > > > > Cool :) > > > They used to have a $25 min order ,which I thought was just about the > same > > > as no min. > > > > I don't like to badmouth any company, and I certainly don't like doin' it > to MSC, > > however, given the forum, I can't be silent. MSC carries an astounding > range of > > product, but out of the last ten orders we have placed, at least 50% of > what was > > ordered came in as the wrong merchandise. That's not great at the very > least, > > especially if you are working under time strictures. What REALLY soured my > taste for > > them was when we called to point it out and get it corrected. Even though > they were > > clearly wrong in what they had sent, they gave us a hard time. Eventually > it was > > straightened out, but it took too many man-hours to do it. I'm just a > semi-boss where > > it comes to ordering, but I don't like being made to look bad in front of > my big bosses > > for telling them to order this and such from MSC. I also don't like being > ung up on a > > job because some hamburger turner picked the wrong tools. > > Philfthy says as Philfthy does. > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: MSC From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 15 Jun 2000 22:40:48 GMT -------- 6700 Discovery Blvd Mableton GA 30126 Local Phone # 770 739 2119 Local Counter Reps: Todd Moles, Patricia Stanley (Worth a trip to see Patricia) and Angie (The Boss) Location is NW of Charlie Brown Airport, Discovery runs parallel to the Chatahoochee River between MLK and Bankhead highway..becomes Oakdale road where my shop is located. teenut Cathy Morgan wrote: > > Where's the MSC office in Atlanta? Atlanta is "my city" tho > I live a 2-hour drive away. > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> > wrote in message ... > > >Technical staff I deal with (Atlanta Office) are a delight > and go to extreme > >lengths to get the right answers and the right bits. > > > >Oh and I get a great reception, friendly smiles, enquiries > about my wellbeing > >and free coffee everytime I go in the store. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: MSC From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 15 Jun 2000 22:42:30 GMT -------- Yeh!..What he said!! 8^) teenut Dave Mundt wrote: > > Greetings and Salutations... > Here you go: > http://www.mscdirect.com/locations/mableton.htm > Regards > Dave mundt > > "Cathy Morgan" wrote: > > >Where's the MSC office in Atlanta? Atlanta is "my city" tho > >I live a 2-hour drive away. > > > >Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> > wrote in message ... > > > >>Technical staff I deal with (Atlanta Office) are a delight > >and go to extreme > >>lengths to get the right answers and the right bits. > >> > >>Oh and I get a great reception, friendly smiles, enquiries > >about my wellbeing > >>and free coffee everytime I go in the store. > > > > > > > > Remove the "REMOVE_THIS_" from my email address to get to me... > I hate Cullers who gather from newsgroups > > Visit my home page at http://www.esper.com/xvart/index.html ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: MSC From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 15 Jun 2000 22:46:56 GMT -------- That is a VERY subjective statement..that I, for one, would STRONGLY dispute! If M-C are so damned good on "Customer Service"..how come so many prospective customers are told to take a hike when they ask for a catalogue?? teenut Miles Jaffe wrote: > Both have good customer service, although McMaster would easily win a > contest in that category. > > -- > wherever you go, there you are ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: 5" GUN ON WWII SUB From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 15 Jun 2000 23:30:45 GMT -------- In the Canadian Artillery they used toilet rolls instead of shells too!! The reason it took so long to get their (single) ship out to the Gulf was that they had forgotton which way to wind the spring! teenut teenut Brian Evans wrote: > > When I was in the (Canadian) artillery, we cleaned the gun bores with a fine > brass wire brush, a felt bore swab, and mostly rolls of toilet paper that we > pushed through the bore with the cleaning ram. 105mm howitzer, btw. > > Brian > > Tom Gardner wrote: > > > This is a good one, > > > > I got a request today from the USS COD for a brush to clean the 5" deck gun > > bore. The curator of the COD museum wants the brush for show as a group of > > High School kids want to do gun drills as part of a show, so actual cleaning > > the stainless steel bore sleeve is probably unnecessary and he doesn't want > > to wear out the bore with a wire brush. He wants more of historical > > accuracy. Of course I asked if any live shells are available...you know, in > > case of trouble with those pesky Canadians across lake Erie from Cleveland. > > He said a better target would be 180 deg. toward City Hall, but he would > > keep an eye on the Canadians just in case. > > > > I know this is OT but you guys know everything. I am thinking a > > multi-section threaded handle to reach the 128" length bore and a tampoony > > kind of thing made from a fleecy material threaded on the end...do any of > > you have one of these guns? How do you clean it? What was the OEM part? > > Should we fire on Canada? > > > > Tom Gardner Ohio Brush Co. tom@ohiobrush ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Case hardening From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 16 Jun 2000 00:10:13 GMT -------- Case hardening is nothing but a simple process during which soft, low carbon iron or steel is heated in the intimate presence of a carbon donating (carburising) material. this can be charcoal, cyanide, acetylene gas or any of many other materials. The carbon, is infused into the surface layer of the soft iron, and turns it into a HIGH CARBON STEEL. This when quenched from a suitable temperature, results in a thin, surface CASING of glass hard, wear resistant material. Case hardening is NOT a cheap man's rout to a harder material..Rather it is a expensive and complex process done to provide the OPTIMUM of material conditions..a soft, tough core for shock resistance, coupled to a glass hard exterior for wear resistance. It is the process of choice for such things as automotive transmission gears, gun parts, etc Your local heat treatment company will case harden parts for a reasonable fee. They will either Gas Carburise or Cyanide (salt bath) carburise before quenching to leave a pale grey, glass hard surface on the part. There is some risk of distortion with intricate or thin parts..you may want to ask about Nitriding which is done at a lower temperature. You can specify the depth of case required to quite narrow limits. "Kasenite" and similar products such as "Hard N' Tuff" are used by, first, heating the part to a dull red heat, rolling or dunking the part in the sand like compound, until a glassy, melted coating covers it. The component is then brought up to a bright red heat and quenched in clear cool water. This process can be repeated to give a thicker coating. Traditional Case Hardening is done by packing the soft iron or steel parts in a cast iron box, together with a mixture of charred bone meal, leather scraps or parings from hooves etc. The top is wired in place and sealed with fireclay. The entire box is then heated in forge or furnace, to a medium red heat for several hours, after which it is removed, the wires clipped and the entire contents dumped into clear cold water. COLOR case hardening is a similar process to the above. In this case however the parts are first polished to about a 400 grit finish and CAREFULLY DEGREASED. They are then packed in the bone meal/leather charcoal mix and sealed absolutely air tight. After heating, the contents of the box are dumped into a barrel of clean, cool water to which a small amount of nitrate may be added to enhance the color ranges. This tub of water will have a grill half way down to separate the box contents and will be arranged with a vigorously bubbling supply of air from a perforated pipe at the bottom of the tub. Beautiful ranges and variations of colors can be obtained..though getting CONSISTANT, REPEATABLE, PREDICTABLE results make this the realm of a few VERY practised masters. teenut Stephen Young wrote: > > There is a product called Casenite for case hardening metals. You heat up your > part and then drop it in this sandy-powder material. That's it. Don't know where > to get it - maybe McMaster Carr? > > gfulton wrote: > > > Was wondering if anyone knew of a home shop method for case hardening. > > -----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =----- > > http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! > > -----== Over 80,000 Newsgroups - 16 Different Servers! =----- ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Any one hear from Teenut? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 16 Jun 2000 00:13:36 GMT -------- Yes you bloody well did!! teenut "[©ØMMÄÑУ®]" wrote: > > I recently e-mailed him.. Never received a response though..... > > Robin > > "Jack Erbes" wrote in message > news:3948DAE1.DF475221@vom.com... > > Jack Fisher wrote: > > > > > > I haven't seen any postings from our beloved Teenut lately, has any one > > > any information on how he is doing? > > > -- > > > Jack Fisher‰ > > > > I saw a post from him here yesterday, seemed to be up to his normal > > standards. Try asking a silly question, that will usually bring him > > out. :>) > > > > -- > > Jack in Sonoma, CA, USA (jack@vom.com) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Any one hear from Teenut? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 16 Jun 2000 01:12:19 GMT -------- teenut is alive and ...well...better than he has ever been!! Coupla trips to ER and a couple or three days in ICU will make a new man out of anyone! Bad news was a huge, painful, debilitating (but not "life threatening") (Yeh! Right!) Thrombosis in my upper chest/neck area (Subclavial and jugular vein) that resisted all attempts to reduce it via Coumoudin and similar blood thinning medication. After a week of agony (I look like I went ten rounds with Sonny Liston..massive swelling and bruising)..during which I was (literally and repeatedly) told to "Take two tylenol and call me monday!!)..they finally put me on the table, did a full ultrasonic scan, shoved IV's and tubes and sleeves into every vein in my body,catheterised every available orifice, and started a three day infusion drip (Though SIX perforated tubes etc) of some magic "Liquid plumber" medication (TPA or somesuch) plus they angioplastied (Roto-routered) several areas for good luck. During this time I was declared close to imminent death from anything so insignificant as a paper cut or a sneeze and incarcerated in ICU..Frankly I would rather be on death row!! The beds are more comfortable!..certainly the food is better! (Do you know they don't have bathrooms in ICU'S!) Then they abruptly declared me cured, unhooked everything, jerked all the tubes out (some a yard long!) and sent me home. Co-incidentally, the thrombosis was a direct result of the botched surgical insertion of a "Porta-Cath"..a "Dune Heart Plug" type of device supposed to make it easier for them to give me IV medication!! I musta had forty or fifty IV insertions done and/or blood samples taken last week alone..as a direct result of this "great leap forward in Medical Science" I am having the portacath removed next week..as soon as my damn surgeon gets back from vacation. Apparently he got it in sideways, pinched a vein, caused some scar tissue..and the thrombosis was inevitable! The upside was that, one of the diagnostic procedures was a full Brain/neck/thorax CT Scan (ever see your own heart beat??) to eliminate any possibility that this was caused by further development or metastis of my lung cancer. Guess what? The first two Docs to review the screens couldn't FIND the original tumor..the one that was fist sized six weeks ago!! It has shrunk dramatically..I KNEW all those lumps I kept coughing up were BAD bits!! They did find a previously un-noticed grape sized tumor, isolated in the lower, center of my right lung..(no immediated threat)..so that is getting the full "Fire for effect" treatment now..as well as my concentrated powers of loathing and hatred!!..so it is history too!! I have finished my first batch of Radiation ("Robert's off to the Heat Treater's again" was the quip from the lads in the shop) Half way through ChemoTherapy and there is no doubt in my mind that this is a "Done Deal" I am feeling much better than I have for months and was able to get a full day in the shop yesterday and today...too busy to be sick!! Got medical bills to pay too! JEEZ do I ever have medical bills!!;^) Keep asking the dumb questions..I'll keep coming up with the dumb answers. teenut Jack Fisher wrote: > > I haven't seen any postings from our beloved Teenut lately, has any one > any information on how he is doing? > -- > Jack Fisher‰ > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Looking for Pratt & Whitney lathe info From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 16 Jun 2000 01:15:21 GMT -------- Congratulations..Lovely bit of old iron, I had one for a couple of years while still in England. teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article <8ibh6j$9oj$1@nnrp2.deja.com>, > kaosracing@my-deja.com wrote: > > My father recently bought a Pratt & Whitney 12 x > > 30 model B lathe. We can't find a build date on > > it anywhere but the newest patent date is 1925. > > It does not seem to be an exact match, but this might > be close: > > http://www.lathes.co.uk/pw/page9.html > > Tony has a large quantity of information, some of which might > not be on his site. You might send him a note. > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT-Crime in the UK/US From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 16 Jun 2000 01:36:23 GMT -------- Gunner wrote: > > In the Absence of Guns > > In Britain, defending your property can get you life. > > by Mark Steyn > Here, Here! Bravo Author! Author! THANK YOU FOR TELLING IT AS IT IS!! My 82 year old Mom dare not walk the 3/4 mile to the center of the rural village I was born and brought up in..for fear of being knocked on the head as was her 86 year old neighbor last year..In BROAD FUCKING DAYLIGHT!!!!! I now live just outside the center of the "Crime City of the USA"..Atlanta GA...where "kids" (13-19yr old drug thugs) are shot dead every day Good riddance!! I sleep secure at night..don't worry if I have set the alarm or locked the door. I am well armed, so are my neighbors..the Perps know it and wouldn't dare risk their scraggy necks knocking off an armed citizen. Without my second amendment rights I may as well post a sign in my yard..GUN FREE NEIGHBORHOOD..and wait in terror for my turn to come! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: perils of being an amateurish machinist From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 16 Jun 2000 01:42:45 GMT -------- Which reminds me!! If tha Bob dun't gi'yar Bob that Bob at tha Bob owes yar Bob..Yar Bob'll gi'tha Bob a Bob on't noo'as. ;^) teenut John Stevenson wrote: > > On Thu, 15 Jun 2000 06:19:26 GMT, Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> > wrote: > > >And John has a brother in Nottingham University..Not in a Faculty though..he's > >in a bottle..wi' two heeds! > > > >teenut > > > Actually Teenuts post here does have an element of truth in it. > I'm ashamed to admit that I haven't been as truthful with my past as I have > admitted to some. This has caused me some worry especially about my older > brother. > My older brother who Teenut refers to was the result of a bad pregnancy by > my mother. Some say she was startled by a horse and cart belonging to the > local greengrocer bolting. My father insists that it was a notice in the > local paper saying that Myfords were offering a discount. In the small > print though you had to be over 75 and accompanied by both parents to get > this. > Anyway my elder brother Bob was born with two heads. This is where the > saying comes from " You don't want to meet Bob " which Teenut perloined in > later years. Would YOU want to meet a two headed person in an alley on a > dark night ? > Even as you recoil and think this was terrible that was only part of the > story. One of the heads was skits-o-frenic so in actual fact I had three > brothers, Bob 1, Bob 1/A and Bob 2 The one that wasn't skitso, Bob 2 was a > kleptomaniac and kept nicking things from the Bob 1A which caused > tremendous problems. My mother took them to the doctors to get some help > for Bob 2 but he wanted to examine Bob 2 whilst Bob1 and 1A waited outside > which was a problem. In the end he had to wisper and examine Bob 2 for this > kleptomania. He then advised Bob 2 to take something for it. > > As they approached adulthood disaster struck our household when my father > was made redundant. He was employed as Chief Cat Throttler by the Local > Corporation and in the light of new EEC legislation about the humane > treatment of cats they found they could save fourteen pound seven and > elevenpence wages per week and make three pounds eight and a tanner by > selling the cats to One Hung Low at the local Chinese take away. > With no income coming in we were forced to exhibit the Bobs in a local > circus. > The old man was glad to get him / them off his back as they were playing up > something terrible. One of them, probably Bob1A listed a Graham White down > on the voting register. When to papers came for Graham White to do jury > service our old man had to appear before a Judge and explain that someone > had listed our Old English Sheepdog down as Graham White. The Judge didn't > get that one which was hardly surprising as the dog had FAR more brains > than the Judge > This is when things changed for the better for us I am ashamed to say. The > Bobs proved to be immensely popular and queues would form for miles to see > them. > With the money earnt my father was able to provide a wunderful edekation > for me. The spell checker came later. > > The Bob's never liked it in the circus and decided to run away . > As they stole away one dark night from their caravan a fight broke out > between Bob1 and Bob1A over which way to go. Whilst this was going on Bob 2 > was trying to nick the brass radiator off one of the generating sets. A > Gardner 6LW is anybody is interested ? These were horrible engines to > overhaul as the rods and pistons came out from the bottom, being too wide > to pass up the bore. > Anyway I digress again. > In fact I think I'll leave the next part of Bob's life until another night > as it's getting late. > I would just like to say a big thank you to Teenut for reminding me about > our Bob and reminding me about humility. > > -- > > Regards, > John Stevenson > Special Purpose Machines > Nottingham, England ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Case hardening From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 16 Jun 2000 02:31:47 GMT -------- Yes, Particularly on highly stressed parts. The "dead quenched" high carbon steel outer layer can be treated like any other High carbon steel and tempered according to requirement. Often the component is allowed to cool slowly after carburising so as to give a soft outer layer. This can then be further machined before final heat treatment. Areas that one doesn't require to be carburised can be "masked" by a variety of means..whitewash being one, copperplating another.. teenut teenut mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article , > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > > > .. when quenched from a suitable > > temperature, results in a thin, surface CASING of glass hard, wear > resistant material. > > Interesting post. Thank you. > > Are there ever situations where the hardness of the case is > drawn after the initial quenching, to provide a surface hardness > below that of glass-hard? > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Any one hear from Teenut? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 16 Jun 2000 02:38:32 GMT -------- Robert Swinney wrote: Most of us would rather take an ass-chewing > from you than a blessing from the pope. I can think of no higher compliment. Thanks, tee ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT-Crime in the UK/US From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 16 Jun 2000 02:52:35 GMT -------- The "Trial of the year" here in Atlanta..the Buckhead murders, just closed with Ray Lewis and a couple of his thugly friends getting off on murder raps. Fortunately the perps used knives (quite small..if ugly thumbhole opening types IIRC) and both victims and alleged perps (and everyone else within a halfmile radius) plus the Dumb as a Stump DA that screwed up an open and shut case, were all of the same race/color..otherwise we would have had the Million Mom marchers clashing with the Rodney King rioters plus the AACP here in Hotlanta this week! ....and Justice for All.. Shmedia still trying to figure the angle on this one!! ;^) teenut tony wrote: > > If OJ Simpson killed his wife with his gun, the liberals would be crowing, > "If he didn't have the gun close by, or if there was a five day waiting > period blah blah blah OJ would have cooled off, and Nicole Simpson would be > alive today. " This theory is bandied about when someone gets killed during > the heat of passion. Now we all know OJ didn't need a gun, a knife did the > job quite well. > > -- > Check out my website at www.csgnet.net/toolroom/ > for surplus stuff I'm trying to get rid of > and my Precision Scraping Page > > Gunner wrote in message > news:394b71bb.228881254@news.uia.net... > > > > In the Absence of Guns > > > > In Britain, defending your property can get you life. > > > > by Mark Steyn > > > > > > > > Celebrity news from the United Kingdom: In April, Germaine Greer, the > > Australian feminist and author of The Female Eunuch, was leaving her house > > in East Anglia, when a young woman accosted her, forced her back inside, > > tied her up, smashed her glasses, and then set about demolishing her > > ornaments with a poker. > > > > A couple of weeks before that, the 85-year-old mother of Phil Collins, the > > well-known rock star, was punched in the ribs, the back, and the head on a > > West London street, before her companion was robbed. "That's what you have > > to expect these days," she said, philosophically. > > > > Anthea Turner, the host of Britain's top-rated National Lottery TV show, > > went to see the West End revival of Grease with a friend. They were > spotted > > at the theatre by a young man who followed them out and, while their car > was > > stuck in traffic, forced his way in and wrenched a diamond-encrusted Rolex > > off the friend's wrist. > > > > A week before that, the 94-year-old mother of Ridley Scott, the director > of > > Alien and other Hollywood hits, was beaten and robbed by two men who broke > > into her home and threatened to kill her. > > > > Former Bond girl Britt Ekland had her jewelry torn from her arms outside a > > shop in Chelsea; Formula One Grand Prix racing tycoon and Tony Blair > > confidante Bernie Ecclestone was punched and kicked by his assailants as > > they stole his wife's ring; network TV chief Michael Green was slashed in > > the face by thugs outside his Mayfair home; gourmet chef to the stars > Anton > > Mosimann was punched in the head outside his house in Kensington.... > > > > Rita Simmonds isn't a celebrity but, fortunately, she happened to be > living > > next door to one when a gang broke into her home in upscale Cumberland > > Terrace, a private road near Regent's Park. Tom Cruise heard her screams > and > > bounded to the rescue, chasing off the attackers for 300 yards, though > > failing to prevent them from reaching their getaway car and escaping with > > two jewelry items worth around $140,000. > > > > It's just as well Tom failed to catch up with the gang. Otherwise, the > > ensuing altercation might have resulted in the diminutive star being > > prosecuted for assault. In Britain, criminals, police, and magistrates are > > united in regarding any resistance by the victim as bad form. The most > > they'll tolerate is "proportionate response" -- and, as these thugs had > been > > beating up a defenseless woman and posed no threat to Tom Cruise, the > > Metropolitan Police would have regarded Tom's actions as highly > > objectionable. "Proportionate response" from the beleaguered British > > property owner's point of view, is a bit like a courtly duel where the > rules > > are set by one side: "Ah," says the victim of a late-night break-in, "I > see > > you have brought a blunt instrument. Forgive me for unsheathing my bread > > knife. My mistake, old boy. Would you mind giving me a sporting chance to > > retrieve my cricket bat from under the bed before clubbing me to a pulp, > > there's a good chap?" > > > > No wonder, even as they're being pounded senseless, many British crime > > victims are worrying about potential liability. A few months ago, Shirley > > Best, owner of the Rolander Fashion boutique whose clients include the > > daughter of the Princess Royal, was ironing some garments when two youths > > broke in. They pressed the hot iron into her side and stole her watch, > > leaving her badly burnt. "I was frightened to defend myself," said Miss > > Best. "I thought if I did anything I would be arrested." > > > > And who can blame her? Shortly before the attack, she'd been reading about > > Tony Martin, a Norfolk farmer whose home had been broken into and who had > > responded by shooting and killing the teenage burglar. He was charged with > > murder. In April, he was found guilty and sentenced to life > imprisonment -- > > for defending himself against a career criminal in an area where the > police > > are far away and reluctant to have their sleep disturbed. In the British > > Commonwealth, the approach to policing is summed up by the motto of Her > > Majesty's most glamorous constabulary: The Mounties always get their > man -- > > i.e., leave it to us. But these days in the British police, when they > can't > > get their man, they'll get you instead: Frankly, that's a lot easier, as > > poor Mr. Martin discovered. > > > > Norfolk is a remote rural corner of England. It ought to be as peaceful > and > > crime-free as my remote rural corner of New England. But it isn't. Old > > impressions die hard: Americans still think of Britain as a low-crime > > country. Conversely, the British think of America as a high-crime country. > > But neither impression is true. The overall crime rate in England and > Wales > > is 60 percent higher than that in the United States. True, in America > you're > > more likely to be shot to death. On the other hand, in England you're more > > likely to be strangled to death. But in both cases, the statistical > > likelihood of being murdered at all is remote, especially if you steer > clear > > of the drug trade. When it comes to anything else, though -- burglary, > auto > > theft, armed robbery, violent assault, rape -- the crime rate reaches deep > > into British society in ways most Americans would find virtually > > inconceivable. > > > > I cite those celebrity assaults not because celebrities are more prone to > > wind up as crime victims than anyone else, but only because the measure of > a > > civilized society is how easily you can insulate yourself from its > snarling > > underclass. In America, if you can make it out of some of the loonier > > cities, it's a piece of cake, relatively speaking. In Britain, if even a > > rock star or TV supremo can't insulate himself, nobody can. In any > society, > > criminals prey on the weak and vulnerable. It's the peculiar genius of > > government policy to have ensured that in British society everyone is weak > > and vulnerable -- from Norfolk farmers to Tom Cruise's neighbor. > > > > And that's where America is headed if those million marching moms make any > > headway in Washington: Less guns = more crime. And more vulnerability. And > a > > million more moms being burgled, and assaulted, and raped. I like hunting, > > but if that were the only thing at stake with guns, I guess I could learn > to > > live without it. But I'm opposed to gun control because I don't see why my > > neighbors in New Hampshire should have to live the way, say, my > > sister-in-law does -- in a comfortable manor house in a prosperous part of > > rural England, lying awake at night listening to yobbo gangs drive up, > park > > their vans, and test her doors and windows before figuring out that the > > little old lady down the lane's a softer touch. > > > > Between the introduction of pistol permits in 1903 and the banning of > > handguns after the Dunblane massacre in 1996, Britain has had a century of > > incremental gun control -- "sensible measures that all reasonable people > can > > agree on." And what's the result? Even when you factor in America's > nutcake > > jurisdictions with the crackhead mayors, the overall crime rate in England > > and Wales is higher than in all 50 states, even though over there they > have > > more policemen per capita than in the U.S., on vastly higher rates of pay > > installing more video surveillance cameras than anywhere else in the > Western > > world. Robbery, sex crimes, and violence against the person are higher in > > England and Wales; property crime is twice as high; vehicle theft is > higher > > still; the British are 2.3 times more likely than Americans to be > assaulted, > > and three times more likely to be violently assaulted. Between 1973 and > > 1992, burglary rates in the U.S. fell by half. In Britain, not even the > Home > > Office's disreputable reporting methods (if a burglar steals from 15 > > different apartments in one building, it counts as a single crime) can > > conceal the remorseless rise: Britons are now more than twice as likely as > > Americans to be mugged; two-thirds will have their property broken into at > > some time in their lives. Even more revealing is the divergent character > > between U.K. and U.S. property crime: In America, just over 10 percent of > > all burglaries are "hot burglaries" -- committed while the owners are > > present; in Britain, it's over half. Because of insurance-required alarm > > systems, the average thief increasingly concludes that it's easier to > break > > in while you're on the premises. Your home-security system may conceivably > > make your home more safe, but it makes you less so. > > > > Conversely, up here in the New Hampshire second congressional district, > > there are few laser security systems and lots of guns. Our murder rate is > > much lower than Britain's and our property crime is virtually > insignificant. > > Anyone want to make a connection? Villains are expert calculators of risk, > > and the likelihood of walking away uninjured with an $80 television set is > > too remote. In New Hampshire, a citizen's right to defend himself deters > > crime; in Britain, the state-inflicted impotence of the homeowner actively > > encourages it. Just as becoming a drug baron is a rational career move in > > Colombia, so too is becoming a violent burglar in the United Kingdom. The > > chances that the state will seriously impede your progress are > > insignificant. > > > > Now I'm Canadian, so, as you might expect, the Second Amendment doesn't > mean > > much to me. I think it's more basic than that. Privately owned firearms > > symbolize the essential difference between your great republic and the > > countries you left behind. In the U.S., power resides with "we, the > people" > > and is leased ever more sparingly up through town, county, state, and > > federal government. In Britain and Canada, power resides with the Crown > and > > is graciously devolved down in limited doses. To a north country Yankee > it's > > self-evident that, when a burglar breaks into your home, you should have > the > > right to shoot him -- indeed, not just the right, but the responsibility, > as > > a free-born citizen, to uphold the integrity of your property. But in > > Britain and most other parts of the Western world, the state reserves that > > right to itself, even though at the time the ne'er-do-well shows up in > your > > bedroom you're on the scene and Constable Plod isn't: He's some miles > > distant, asleep in his bed, and with his answering machine on referring > you > > to central dispatch God knows where. > > > > These days it's standard to bemoan the "dependency culture" of state > > welfare, but Britain's law-and-order "dependency culture" is even more > > enfeebling. What was it the police and courts resented about that Norfolk > > farmer? That he "took the law into his own hands"? But in a responsible > > participatory democracy, the law ought to be in our hands. The problem > with > > Britain is that the police force is now one of the most notable surviving > > examples of a pre-Thatcher, bloated, incompetent, unproductive, over-paid, > > closed-shop state monopoly. They're about as open to constructive > > suggestions as the country's Communist mineworkers' union was 20 years > ago, > > and the control-freak tendencies of all British political parties ensure > > that the country's bloated, expensive county and multi-county forces are > > inviolable. > > > > The Conservatives' big mistake between 1979 and 1997 was an almost > willfully > > obtuse failure to understand that giving citizens more personal > > responsibility isn't something that extends just to their income and > > consumer choices; it also applies to their communities and their policing > > arrangements. If you have one without the other, you end up with modern > > Britain: a materially prosperous society in which the sense of frustration > > and impotence is palpable, and you're forced to live with a level of > endless > > property crime most Americans would regard as unacceptable. > > > > We know Bill Clinton's latest favorite statistic -- that 12 "kids" a day > die > > from gun violence -- is bunk: Five-sixths of those 11.569 grade-school > > moppets are aged between 15 and 19, and many of them have had the > misfortune > > to become involved in gangs, convenience-store hold-ups, and drug deals, > > which, alas, have a tendency to go awry. If more crack deals passed off > > peacefully, that "child" death rate could be reduced by three-quarters. > But > > away from those dark fringes of society, Americans live lives blessedly > > untouched by most forms of crime -- at least when compared with supposedly > > more civilized countries like Britain. That's something those million > > marching moms should consider, if only because in a gun-free America > > women -- and the elderly and gays and all manner of other fashionable > victim > > groups -- will be bearing the brunt of a much higher proportion of violent > > crime than they do today. Ask Phil Collins or Ridley Scott or Germaine > > Greer. > > > > > > -------------------------------------------------------------------------- > -- > > ---- > > Mark Steyn is theater critic of the New Criterion and movie critic of the > > Spectator of London. > > > > Alone we are just nails in the road... Together we are a wall of > > steel. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: MSC From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 16 Jun 2000 02:57:50 GMT -------- How do you know that "Patricia" isn't a feller! ;^) teenut Brian Lawson wrote: > > Hey teenut, > > Cathy always seemed pretty straight whenever I read her posts. Do you > really think she's going to run down to see Patricia. The guys might, > but Cathy? I don't think so. > Gay Pride parade and convention was held here last week, and I didn't > see anybody I knew there. Not even one "I'm a Gay and Proud RCM'er". > XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX > > On Thu, 15 Jun 2000 22:40:48 GMT, Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ > hotmail.com> wrote: > > >6700 Discovery Blvd > >Mableton GA 30126 > > > >Local Phone # 770 739 2119 > > > >Local Counter Reps: Todd Moles, Patricia Stanley (Worth a trip to see Patricia) > >and Angie (The Boss) > > > >Location is NW of Charlie Brown Airport, Discovery runs parallel to the > >Chatahoochee River between MLK and Bankhead highway..becomes Oakdale road where > >my shop is located. > > > >teenut > > > > > >Cathy Morgan wrote: > >> > >> Where's the MSC office in Atlanta? Atlanta is "my city" tho > >> I live a 2-hour drive away. > >> > >> Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> > wrote in message ... > >> > >> >Technical staff I deal with (Atlanta Office) are a delight > >> and go to extreme > >> >lengths to get the right answers and the right bits. > >> > > >> >Oh and I get a great reception, friendly smiles, enquiries > >> about my wellbeing > >> >and free coffee everytime I go in the store. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: For Gunner And Teenut From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 16 Jun 2000 05:32:37 GMT -------- Gary Coffman wrote: Any people > can be cowed and manipulated when the tools for their survival are > in the hands of the state rather than firmly in their own hands. > > Jefferson understood this and expressed it eloquently, Washington > warned us of this, even Eisenhower quietly tried to tell us this. Too > many of us haven't listened well. As Ben Franklin said, "Those who > would trade essential liberty for the promise of security deserve > neither liberty nor security." > Herein lies the crux of the matter..and the reason for our fierce defence of the second amendment. Bottom Line.. The ONLY person I trust implicitly to defend my best interests is MYSELF! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: MSC From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 16 Jun 2000 05:35:48 GMT -------- Eh! Waddya say? Dammed close though!! teenut Gary Coffman wrote: > > On Thu, 15 Jun 2000 22:40:48 GMT, Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > >Location is NW of Charlie Brown Airport, Discovery runs parallel to the > >Chatahoochee River between MLK and Bankhead highway..becomes Oakdale road where > >my shop is located. > > Uh, that wasn't your place that blew up yesterday on Oakdale was it? > > Gary > Gary Coffman KE4ZV | You make it |mail to ke4zv@bellsouth.net > 534 Shannon Way | We break it | > Lawrenceville, GA | Guaranteed | ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: MSC From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 16 Jun 2000 05:39:06 GMT -------- I just told TULL metals to take a hike..they have imposed a $250.00 minimum order. My orders often exceed that..but they will never go to Tull again. teenut Gary Coffman wrote: > > On Thu, 15 Jun 2000 22:46:56 GMT, Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > >If M-C are so damned good on "Customer Service"..how come so many prospective > >customers are told to take a hike when they ask for a catalogue?? > > When they informed me that I didn't qualify to receive their catalog, I informed > them that they didn't qualify to receive my orders. That's no big loss to them, > I'm sure, but it made me feel better. I'd much rather do business with companies > like MSC or J&L who want my business. (Grainger is off my Christmas list too, > surliest bunch I've ever tried to get to take my money.) > > Gary > Gary Coffman KE4ZV | You make it |mail to ke4zv@bellsouth.net > 534 Shannon Way | We break it | > Lawrenceville, GA | Guaranteed | ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: For Gunner And Teenut From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Sat, 17 Jun 2000 03:00:00 GMT -------- Why does it have to be one or the other Tony? I feel much more comfortable when Politicians are afraid of both my Vote AND my ability to defend my rights more positively if stick comes to lift. How long do you imagine the Pols will heed or seek YOUR vote Tony if they ever find a way to safely ignore it? For Christ's sake man..learn to THINK things through before you mindlessly sound off! teenut tonyp wrote: > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote > > > Gary Coffman wrote: > > > Any people > > > can be cowed and manipulated when the tools for their survival are > > > in the hands of the state rather than firmly in their own hands. > > > Herein lies the crux of the matter..and the reason for our fierce > defence of the > > second amendment. > > Yeah, but maybe the "tools" he was talking about are _ballots_. > I still say politicians are more afraid of your vote than your guns, > Robert. > Burglars (if you admit there's a difference) are another story, of course. > > -- Tony Prentakis ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: For Gunner And Teenut From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Mon, 19 Jun 2000 00:44:41 GMT -------- Since when did I ring the bell of "Jaffe the Huff" teenut Miles Jaffe wrote: > > > All I'm willing > > to allow is that your conclusions _might_ be right and mine wrong. I > > neither hope for nor demand the reciprocal courtesy. > > That's good, 'cause around here you're not likely to get it. > > -- > wherever you go, there you are ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: really small planer again From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 20 Jun 2000 02:10:06 GMT -------- Beautiful machine Geoffrey..The casting "curlicues" and spiral spokes really do place it firmly in the 1860 to 1880 era as I first suspected. Please take good care of a superb example of a vanishing heirloom. teenut Geoffrey Brown wrote: > > I recently asked for information on a small bench planer. I've since > learned it was made by S P Wormwood company in Watertown Massachusetts > between 1875 and 1890. When I asked for info, somebody asked to see > pictures of the interior mechanism. I've added a couple of photos to my > > web page > > http://members.tripod.com/Geoffrey.Brown/id35.htm > > Geoffrey ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: VIBRATION GURU NEEDED TO ORIENT PARTS From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 20 Jun 2000 02:37:33 GMT -------- Forget the vibrating trough..it ain't gonna work. What you need are a set of ROLLER Feeders. Two long straight hardened steeel rollers with belt or friction drive arranged to couter-rotate them up and away from each other..if you catch my drift. In other words, vieved from the end, the LH roller should rotate CCWa nd the RH roller should rotate CW. The feed will be along the trough or vee formed between the rollers and direction of feed and spped will be determined by the decline of the roller axes from horizontal. These can be made from Thompson hardened shafting, driven by a FHP motor and will feed at phenomenal rates..fast enough to shoot the wires full length of the stack at the end. Vibratory trough feeders tend to jam and balk, especially with less than perfectly straight or smooth ended parts. They also loos the feeding "Oomph" as soon as the part starts to leave the trough. Noisy buggers too! teenut Parts feeding guru!! Tom Gardner wrote: > > I have just finished a machine that cuts tempered steel .013" dia. wire, 3" > long. The machine cuts 6 wires at a time, guillotine fashion, at 600 cuts > per minute. > > The end product needs to be a bundle of wire about 2 to 3" in diameter so > the operator can put rubber bands on it. I need about 160 to 200 bundles > per shift. > > The guillotine imparts a lot of kinetic energy to the wire when it is cut. > I have a "V" shaped trough with a vibrator attached that then walks the cut > wire, now without kinetic energy, down a 20 deg. incline and dumps it into a > vibrated container. > > The biggest problem is the wire doesn't orient in the container fast enough > and the incoming wire has a tendency to "nose-dive" into the fluidized > surface of the wire in the container. > > I know too little about vibrators and would gladly hire or buy ideas that > work. > > Tom Gardner tom@ohiobrush.com ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Looking for D1-* chuck mount. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 20 Jun 2000 02:46:57 GMT -------- A right "Kak-Handed" way of going about it!! You will be very disapointed by the rigidity and accuracy of the lash-up you are suggesting Suggestions.. Sell the D1-8 chuck and buy a proper A2-11 mounted one. Or get a complete Clausing -Matosa spindle with D1 nose (I believe D1-6 is as big as they go! What make, age, size and condition is the D1-8 chuck..I am looking for an 8 to ten inch fourjaw with a D1-8 fitting. How much and where are you? teenut Peter Drumm wrote: > > Here a question for you folks. Mark wants to adapt a D1-8 4jaw chuck to > the Clausing-Metosa lathe which uses a A2-11 mount. What we're looking > for is the -female- part of the D1-8 mount, the part with the locks not > the pins. I'm thinking maybe an old spindle could be cut off and adapted > to go on the A2-11. Anyone know where one might find such an animal? > > -- > > Custom machining; Tool & Cutter grinding, prices at > Peter Drumm, Wausau WI , > Dual Celeron 466's, Abit BP6, Matrox AGP, OS/2 Warp 4, Linux, BeOS ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Need old Gundrill operators help! From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 20 Jun 2000 12:45:13 GMT -------- I have had quite a bit (too damn much!!) experience with gundrills..so maybe I can help a bit. Firstly, Eldorado are still in business..they don't appear to have a web page but you will find them in California. They should be able to help with manuals, instructions, advice on the machines. There ISN'T a book or manual or web page..NUTHIN'..that will give you much help on set up, speeds, feeds, point grinds, lubricants, pressures etc. I suggest you contact the gundrill makers (Eldorado, Stardrill etc for specific information..they will be very helpful. Good Luck, teenut Derek wrote: > > Hi, > I'm a machinist with about 20 years experience in manufacturing. > > I'm trying to find some information on a couple of > gundrilling machines I recently purchased. > > I have 2 "TWO ELDORADO HYDRAULIC-FED GUN DRILLING MACHINES > (MODEL M7428) WITH 3 HP SPINDLE DRIVES MATCHED WITH A MODEL M3619-2 > OIL CLARIFYER WITH 10 HORSEPOWER HIGH PRESSURE 3000 psi COOLANT > PUMPING UNIT WITH DUAL FILTERS and THERMOSTATICALLY REGULATED > COUNTER-CURRENT HEAT EXCHANGER TO MAINTAIN OIL TEMPERATURE and MAYFRAN > CHIP CONVEYOR" > > That's a bit of a mouthful :-) Actually that was a copy of the add > from witch > I purchased the machines them from. > > By any chance would anyone know where I can find a copy the > original owners manuals and Maintenance manuals? Or any good books that > might help with these machines? Web sites? > > Any help on this machines would be greatly appreciate. > > Thanks. > > Derek > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: One of my dumbest mistakes. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 20 Jun 2000 13:12:13 GMT -------- My personal "mottos": "An Imperfect plan..Violently executed"...George Patton "Never, NEVER, Quit!"..Winston Churchill "Being beaten is no excuse for quitting"...teenut Cheer up..The worst is yet to come!...unknown. "The mass of men lead lives of quiet desperation"..Henry David Thoreau "My Success will be determined by the courage and enthusiasm I show in moving from one setback to the next"...teenut I have the courage to do what other people won't..so that I can achieve successes other people never will...teenut STAY FOCUSED..Do the IMPORTANT things first..not just the URGENT things..teenut Is what I am doing RIGHT NOW..the "IMPORTANT Thing"? teenut Select your bridge..Cross it..And BURN it behind you! Unknown ..adapted by teenut. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Attn: Gun Lovers of the Group From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Tue, 20 Jun 2000 23:13:40 GMT -------- I suppose if you "maybe" long enough and often enough Tony..you might convince enough people that the Moon is made of green cheese, to form a "Statistically Significant Green Cheese Party". I may be one of the *later* converts. Keep trying though..it is amusing to say the least! ;^) teenut tonyp wrote: > > Gary Coffman wrote > > > On a somewhat related note, some research has been done on > > the so-called gun buy back programs. These government sponsored > > programs buy guns from citizens using taxpayer funds with no > > questions asked. It is a strict cash for guns deal with no names > > asked or given. > > > > Traces on serial numbers of a statistically valid sample of the guns > > obtained this way showed that the majority of them are stolen. So > > the government is acting as a no questions asked fence for this > > stolen property. It is a ready, and totally safe, market for criminals > > to turn stolen property into cash. > > Presumably "stolen" means "reported stolen". I am not so cynical as to > suggest that this distinction is meaningful in the context of the gun > buyback studies you refer to. > > But I am cynical enough to remember the old George Carlin joke: > "Statistically, 25% of men are gay. So all you have to do > is get three of your friends together, and if they're not, > you're it." > I mean, if "studies show" that 25% of men are homosexual, or 15% of > children are abused, or 1 in 3 women will be raped in her lifetime, a > sensible person can ask himself whether such numbers are plausible given > his own "statistical sample" of people he knows. > > I don't know many gun owners (outside of RCM), but I know a few, and none > of them has had a gun stolen from him. I wonder how many RCM folks have > had guns stolen from them. It's probably not many, because we're all > responsible citizens here, and responsible citizens don't make it _easy_ > for anybody to steal their guns. So if the "majority" of guns turned in > to buyback programs are "stolen", who are they being stolen from? > > Maybe the "buyback guns" are not a valid sampling of all "illegal guns". > Maybe, as you seem to suggest, crooks steal guns specifically to "fence" > them to "the government". If so, the studies you refer to ought to say > something interesting about the turnaround period: what's the average > time between a gun being "stolen" and "bought back"? > > I don't deny statistics, I don't blindly accept statistics -- I merely ask > if they make sense. > > -- Tony Prentakis ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: oxygen bottles From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 00:18:48 GMT -------- In a "previous life" I was Senior Overseas Representative for T.I Chesterfield Ltd..a Division of Tube Investments Ltd, and one of the worlds largest manufacturers of high pressure gas cylinders. I did at one time, have all the calculations and figures at my fingertips..but that was several lifetimes ago. Suffice it to say, that a rough rule of thumb, is that a 240 Cu Ft Compressed Permanent Gas (Oxygen, nitrogen etc..) Cylinder contains roughly the same explosive power as a 25lb Howitzer shell!! "Torpedoing" horizontally 300 yards through a couple of factories, across a crowded freeway, Mall Carpark (including a dozen or so cars) and flattening a gas station..WITHOUT HURTING ANYONE!!! is just one of the repertoire of gas cylinder antics!! I have seen, and had to help investigate, some NASTY CG "accidents" including one that involved scraping the remains of eight men off the INSIDE of a concrete blockhouse in Kuwait...three days after the blast and in temperatures well over a hundred degrees!! The FUNNIEST (albeit NOISIEST) incident was in Enid Oklahoma, where we built a brand new cylinder manufacturing facility. As part of the start up, and to begin manufacture, testing etc of PG cylinders,before the huge Loewe Forge was commissioned, we imported 3000 open ended cylinder "Shells" from the UK. These are forged from billet, open ended cylinders, about 9" diameter with solid forged base and a wall thickness of IIRC 0.215"..each one about 6 feet tall. These were all stored in vertical ranks, by heat and lot number, in the 400,000 square feet Enid Facility..there to await finishing by spin forming the neck, heat treatment, machining etc., etc. One day a forklift driver backed into the end of the serried ranks... I sat in my office and listened for the best part of 30 minutes as row after row of the worlds biggest wind chimes "dominoed" and bounced and clanged and clattered and reverberated..The Forklift driver walked out of the building and never came back. No one was hurt..but there may have been a few who were brain dead after that enormous clatter. Then they had to sort them all out..by heat and lot number...and stand them all in rows again! THIS time with anchor blocks and chains and... ;^) teenut > > Jon Elson wrote: > > >Remember the story a few replies ago about the exploding oxygen bottles > >in Houston? Presumably, those bottles were stored right side up, and had > >to flip over before they were in a proper attitude to take flight! Whew, I > >wouldn't want to be anywhere near where these things were flying through > >the air like Scud missiles! > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Looking for D1-* chuck mount. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 00:26:11 GMT -------- Peter Drumm wrote: > > On Tue, 20 Jun 2000 02:46:57 GMT, Robert Bastow wrote: > > :->A right "Kak-Handed" way of going about it!! You will be very disapointed by the > :->rigidity and accuracy of the lash-up you are suggesting > > Well, it couldn't be any worse than holding the 14" 4jaw in the 3jaw like > he does now. JESUS....I knew of a guy that got KILLED doing that!! Cambridge, Ontario about 1985-7 if you want to look it up!! > > :->Sell the D1-8 chuck and buy a proper A2-11 mounted one. > > IF anybody makes one, it would probably be $5000 or more :( Almost as cheap as a life huh! > > :-> > :->Or get a complete Clausing -Matosa spindle with D1 nose (I believe D1-6 is as > :->big as they go! > > A D1-6 would probably slide right thru the A2-11 spindle, it's got a > 6.2" hole thru it. > > :-> > :->What make, age, size and condition is the D1-8 chuck..I am looking for an 8 to > :->ten inch fourjaw with a D1-8 fitting. How much and where are you? > > It's a 20" Bison, brand new, removed from service in a paper mill > because they're not allowed to use cast chucks. I think he got it for > ~$30, I know he doesn't want to sell it. > -- > > Custom machining; Tool & Cutter grinding, prices at > Peter Drumm, Wausau WI , > Dual Celeron 466's, Abit BP6, Matrox AGP, OS/2 Warp 4, Linux, BeOS ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: New carbide inserts look dull !! ?? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 00:30:09 GMT -------- Not if it is good HSS, well heat treated. Sure it will WEAR at ambient temps..but HSS WILL hold enough hardness at a dull red heat to continue cutting quite well. Done that many times!! teenut Jon Elson wrote: > It has to be the other way. HSS loses its edge WAY before red heat. > > Jon ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: machine oil for new lathe From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 00:38:02 GMT -------- Go to your local NAPA store and get a quart of 30 weight NON-detergent oil..it will do all you need it to do on a "standard" lathe or mill teenut J Parlane wrote: > > Hi ,New to this group. > In the instruction book of my new chinese lathe they advise oiling all the > ball oilers on the cross slide and the apron drive rods with machine oil. > Minium quantity from local oil companies is 20 litres which would last me > till I am 300 years old. > Is it possible to dilute ordinary motor oil with either > kerosine or diesel oil to thin it down a bit. thanks for your help. yours, > Jim Parlane (jparlane@ihug.co.nz) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: x-rays and lead From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 00:42:15 GMT -------- Cliff Ray wrote: > > X-ray radiation is an electromagnetic wave rather than a particle so doesn't > change the atoms of lead into anything else. There is a very slight warming > of the lead, but if you see it melting start to run :) Especially if it is a lead apron you are wearing!! teenut Who is radioactive enough by now to read in the dark without aid!! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Oil wick for old lathe From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 01:27:52 GMT -------- Fdmorrison wrote: > > Afaik, capstan and turret are just Brit vs USspeak for a lathe that has a > multi-tool holder in place of the tailstock. > In the UK a capstan and a turret lathe are different animals. A CAPSTAN lathe is the smaller of the breed..the six sided (usually) turret, slides in ways on a saddle clamped to the bed. The position of the saddle is adjustable..but does not normally move during machining. Very similar to a HSM lathe with a bed turret afixed. A TURRET lathe, OTOH is usually a much heavier beastie..I have run TLs up to 24"swing, (US 48")..7" swing (US 14" swing) is about as small as they go. The Turret lathe has the tooling turret fixed to a separate MOVEABLE saddle..very similar to the saddle on a regular engine lathe (In effect the lathe has TWO saddles..one with a turning, threading and cut-off cross slide, the other with a six station, indexable turret. Longitudinal feed of the turret is affected by moving the entire SADDLE along the bed. I have never seen this differentiation of terms used here in the USA..in Canada yes, but there they follow more closely to UK practice and use heavy Turret lathes rather than Engine lathes for production. In UK practice..most lathe production work is (Was) done on capstan and turret type lathes. The ENGINE type lathe was rare, and either reserved for one offs, tool room work, or VERY large faceplate (tee-bed) and roll turning type work. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Oil wick for old lathe From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 03:24:36 GMT -------- Fdmorrison wrote: often worked with a Warner & Swasey turret lathe (3A, IIRC). I think > he pretty much liked the lathe, though thought it could wear on you in the > long term. > > Frank Morrison They sure could..I STILL have one shoulder an inch lower than the other and a right hand a couple sizes larger than my left..developmental deformities from running HEAVY lathes 12 plus hours a day as a teenager! Good old days..Piss on 'em!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Oil wick for old lathe From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 03:37:38 GMT -------- I used to work for Alfred Herbert and yes..your #3 is a capstan..not a turret IN UK PARLANCE!! Even there the difference was blurred. The Big Muthas were strictly speaking, referred to as "Saddle Type Turret Lathes"..Capstan lathes were always just that..a ram type "turret" lathe..but even to many people in the industry a "Turret" lathe could be a ram or a saddle type..Igorant pr**ks! ;^) teenut Wish I had a # 3 in my shop! Or a Ward 7 Saddle Turret! (and someone who knows how to set and operate them..'cos I sure the hell ain't ever going to touch one again!!) ;^) teenut Dan Buckman wrote: > > So my little herbert #3 is a capstan and not a turret? > The saddle for the turret is clamped to the bed. > > "Robert Bastow" <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote in message > news:sSU35.854$5e2.5713@news1.rdc1.ga.home.com... > > Fdmorrison wrote: > > > > > > Afaik, capstan and turret are just Brit vs USspeak for a lathe that has > a > > > multi-tool holder in place of the tailstock. > > > > > > > In the UK a capstan and a turret lathe are different animals. > > > > A CAPSTAN lathe is the smaller of the breed..the six sided (usually) > turret, > > slides in ways on a saddle clamped to the bed. The position of the saddle > is > > adjustable..but does not normally move during machining. Very similar to > a HSM > > lathe with a bed turret afixed. > > > > A TURRET lathe, OTOH is usually a much heavier beastie..I have run TLs up > to > > 24"swing, (US 48")..7" swing (US 14" swing) is about as small as they go. > The > > Turret lathe has the tooling turret fixed to a separate MOVEABLE > saddle..very > > similar to the saddle on a regular engine lathe (In effect the lathe has > TWO > > saddles..one with a turning, threading and cut-off cross slide, the other > with a > > six station, indexable turret. Longitudinal feed of the turret is > affected by > > moving the entire SADDLE along the bed. > > > > I have never seen this differentiation of terms used here in the USA..in > Canada > > yes, but there they follow more closely to UK practice and use heavy > Turret > > lathes rather than Engine lathes for production. > > > > In UK practice..most lathe production work is (Was) done on capstan and > turret > > type lathes. The ENGINE type lathe was rare, and either reserved for one > offs, > > tool room work, or VERY large faceplate (tee-bed) and roll turning type > work. > > > > teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Enco 110-2038 vs. Griz G4003: which one sucks the least? :) From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 13:41:09 GMT -------- Best of a bad bunch? Go with the slower speed, wider thread range, US Motor!! Camlock spindle is NICE but... Enco DO seem to be getting their quality and service act back (Back??) together since the purchase by MSC teenut Tom Simpson wrote: > > Okay, so now I am looking to buy a 12x36 class machine and these two are > looking the best at the moment, both costing about US$2200. The Enco > offers a wider range of threads, has a US-made motor and can turn > slower, which is a good thing in my book. The Griz has a bigger motor > and a cam-lock spindle. Otherwise they would appear to be comperable. I > know that traditionaly Enco is more os a problem child when it comes to > quality. > > Comments? > > Thanks: > > -Tom ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Oil wick for old lathe From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 13:45:56 GMT -------- Herbert definitely out of business..but the vast number of machines out there spawned a whole new industry for service and spares. Herbert manual machines were made in INDIA for many years..maybe still are. The quality was SUPERB! Parts, collets etc should not be difficult to find..especially in the UK or Canada. teenut Dan Buckman wrote: > > You don't suppose they had to close shop after you left? > In fine British tradition (and perfected by USA) I think the air collet > chuck takes Alfreds Own brand of collets. I didn't see them listed on > hardriges spec sheets. > A quick web search for the company did not produce any results. It would be > nice to know I could get replacements. > > "Robert Bastow" <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote in message > news:6MW35.860$5e2.5791@news1.rdc1.ga.home.com... > > I used to work for Alfred Herbert and yes..your #3 is a capstan..not a > turret IN > > UK PARLANCE!! > > > > Even there the difference was blurred. The Big Muthas were strictly > speaking, > > referred to as "Saddle Type Turret Lathes"..Capstan lathes were always > just > > that..a ram type "turret" lathe..but even to many people in the industry a > > "Turret" lathe could be a ram or a saddle type..Igorant pr**ks! ;^) > > > > teenut > > > > Wish I had a # 3 in my shop! > > > > Or a Ward 7 Saddle Turret! > > > > (and someone who knows how to set and operate them..'cos I sure the hell > ain't > > ever going to touch one again!!) > > > > ;^) > > > > teenut > > > > Dan Buckman wrote: > > > > > > So my little herbert #3 is a capstan and not a turret? > > > The saddle for the turret is clamped to the bed. > > > > > > "Robert Bastow" <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote in message > > > news:sSU35.854$5e2.5713@news1.rdc1.ga.home.com... > > > > Fdmorrison wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Afaik, capstan and turret are just Brit vs USspeak for a lathe that > has > > > a > > > > > multi-tool holder in place of the tailstock. > > > > > > > > > > > > > In the UK a capstan and a turret lathe are different animals. > > > > > > > > A CAPSTAN lathe is the smaller of the breed..the six sided (usually) > > > turret, > > > > slides in ways on a saddle clamped to the bed. The position of the > saddle > > > is > > > > adjustable..but does not normally move during machining. Very similar > to > > > a HSM > > > > lathe with a bed turret afixed. > > > > > > > > A TURRET lathe, OTOH is usually a much heavier beastie..I have run TLs > up > > > to > > > > 24"swing, (US 48")..7" swing (US 14" swing) is about as small as they > go. > > > The > > > > Turret lathe has the tooling turret fixed to a separate MOVEABLE > > > saddle..very > > > > similar to the saddle on a regular engine lathe (In effect the lathe > has > > > TWO > > > > saddles..one with a turning, threading and cut-off cross slide, the > other > > > with a > > > > six station, indexable turret. Longitudinal feed of the turret is > > > affected by > > > > moving the entire SADDLE along the bed. > > > > > > > > I have never seen this differentiation of terms used here in the > USA..in > > > Canada > > > > yes, but there they follow more closely to UK practice and use heavy > > > Turret > > > > lathes rather than Engine lathes for production. > > > > > > > > In UK practice..most lathe production work is (Was) done on capstan > and > > > turret > > > > type lathes. The ENGINE type lathe was rare, and either reserved for > one > > > offs, > > > > tool room work, or VERY large faceplate (tee-bed) and roll turning > type > > > work. > > > > > > > > teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: New carbide inserts look dull !! ?? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 21:54:56 GMT -------- Usual ways... Name brand/Origin. Price. Performance. How else? teenut Bucky Goldstein wrote: > > Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > > > Not if it is good HSS, well heat treated. Sure it will WEAR at > > ambient temps..but HSS WILL hold enough hardness at a dull red > > heat to continue cutting quite well. Done that many times!! > > How do you tell good, well heat treated HSS from garden-variety > cheapie stuff? > > -- > Bucky Goldstein > > I lost a button hole. > -- Steven Wright ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Appology to Teenut From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 22:01:57 GMT -------- Yer STILL got it wrong Doofus!! Its "teenut" (Small "t") ;^) teenut Ted Edwards wrote: > > Just checked the drop box and discovered a I had a "senior's moment" > when I posted your account of hand sharpening drills. I credited "John > Bastow (Teenut)" instead of "Robert Bastow (Teenut)". Most humble > appologies, Teenut. > > Ted ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Moving gas cylinders. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Wed, 21 Jun 2000 22:07:33 GMT -------- Don't attempt to move it without a cap screwed firmly in place. Chain it upright in an open vehicle (pickup truck) NOT hanging ou of the trunk of your car. Don't allow it to overheat. Other than that..it is as safe to handle as any other 25 Pounder Howitzer shell! In other words..think ahead..get help so you don't risk dropping or knocking it over. teenut "[©ØMMÄÑУ®]" wrote: > > Hello all, > > I'm just wondering if anyone has any experience with moving gas cylinders? I > have one full of co2 laser gas mix at school that I need moved to UofT (from > the north end of Toronto to the south end). I will probably have to rent a > truck to take it. I'm just wondering if there's anything that would not be > obvious, but could be dangerous that I should look out for? I don't want a > cylinder pressurized to 2500psi going *pop* in the middle of down town > Toronto :) > > Thanks, > > Robin ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Looking for D1-* chuck mount. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 22 Jun 2000 04:34:32 GMT -------- I don't know how big or fast..how big does a chuck have to be and how fast does it have to nail you in the center of the chest to cause serious dicombobulation..yea, even unto death! Machine tools are DANGEROUS..Quiet killers without an "OUCH" switch! Familiarity can make them more dangerous..though our years of training make basic safety precautions almost instinctive. teenut Peter Drumm wrote: > > On Wed, 21 Jun 2000 00:26:11 GMT, Robert Bastow wrote: > > :->Peter Drumm wrote: > :->> > :->> On Tue, 20 Jun 2000 02:46:57 GMT, Robert Bastow wrote: > :->> > :->> :->A right "Kak-Handed" way of going about it!! You will be very disapointed by the > :->> :->rigidity and accuracy of the lash-up you are suggesting > :->> > :->> Well, it couldn't be any worse than holding the 14" 4jaw in the 3jaw like > :->> he does now. > :-> > :->JESUS....I knew of a guy that got KILLED doing that!! Cambridge, Ontario about > :->1985-7 if you want to look it up!! > > How big was the chuck, and how fast was it turning? > In this application(we've only had to do it once so far), the 14" is > held by a 20" 3jaw, speed is ~16-65 RPM, and a center is used. I can't > see any problems there. The work being done is turning & grinding > Stellite faces on steam valve seats, the last one was 11" diameter, you > -have- to go slow on that stuff :) > -- > > Custom machining; Tool & Cutter grinding, prices at > Peter Drumm, Wausau WI , > Dual Celeron 466's, Abit BP6, Matrox AGP, OS/2 Warp 4, Linux, BeOS ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: case hardening From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 22 Jun 2000 04:44:31 GMT -------- Go to deja news and do a search on case hardening..I covered this extensively less than a week ago. teenut nunchaku@softhome.net wrote: > > i'm new to this forum, i'm in high school and have been in metal > working for more than 9 years, i have started early since the age of 11. > > what do you use for case hardening? potassium cyanide, kasenite or > powdered charcoal. > > obviously i know the procedure how to do it. i use carbomn powder since > it is cheap. > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: New carbide inserts look dull !! ?? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 22 Jun 2000 12:17:18 GMT -------- Well Bucky me Boyyo..sorry I couldn't come up with a "Duh" answer for you. HSS on Cast Iron? Not my weapon of choice, especially if there is a skin to go through first..I suggest you invest in a carbide tipped tool for that. Either one of the small indexable tip tools which are, admittedly expensive unless you make your own. Plenty of (releatively) cheap tips on Ebay etc..buy the C2 Grade for CI. Or you can get a brazed tip tool and a green grit wheel for you grinder..not a major expense. So far as HSS tool bits are concerned, you generally DO get what you pay for. The Cheap, import bits aren't worth the powder to blow 'em to hell. I buy Cleveland, REX or M42 cobalt bits..tougher to grind, more expensive..but they do the job. Again these are available at firesale prices on Ebay. teenut Bucky Goldstein wrote: > > In article , > when asked how to tell good from cheapo HSS tooling, Robert Bastow > <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > > > Usual ways... > > > > Name brand/Origin. > > > > Price. > > > > Performance. > > > > How else? > > Well, shoot, teenut, I thought maybe you had to pour vinegar on 'em and > watch for blue smoke, or coat 'em in peanut butter and if there's > bubbling then you have good HSS and if there isn't you don't. Something > like that. But if it's just a price thing, well ... that's how I choose > wine, so I guess I can choose a tool bit that way. > > I'm curious because I don't really know the differences among plain HSS, > cobalt, M2, M42 and whatnot. I'm using 1/4" tooling to remove a lot of > cast iron. Haven't done this before. It's working fine, but I'm > wondering whether I can't make the edge last a little longer. > > If anyone can direct me to a tool bit FAQ, I'll appreciate it; or if > someone wants to lend me a clue directly, that's fine, too. Or if I > should just spend ten dollars a whack for 1/4" tools, well, whatever. > If they're really that much better, so be it. > > Anyone wants to smack me with a clue-by-four, feel free. > > -- > Bucky Goldstein > > I lost a button hole. > -- Steven Wright > > -- > Bucky Goldstein > > I lost a button hole. > -- Steven Wright > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Appology to Teenut From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 22 Jun 2000 12:24:01 GMT -------- And YOUR point is what John? teenut John Flanagan wrote: > > On Wed, 21 Jun 2000 22:01:57 GMT, Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ > hotmail.com> wrote: > > >Yer STILL got it wrong Doofus!! > > > >Its "teenut" (Small "t") > > Are you sure it's not "TeEnUt"? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Swarf, Dropoffs, Scrap and how the average guy gets screwed... From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Thu, 22 Jun 2000 12:37:16 GMT -------- rufo wrote: > > I just started a new position as a machinist/fabricator in a sheet metal > shop. I also have a home shop. When I cast my eye into the scrap bins > I think: there has got to be something I can make from THAT! Be afraid young man..Be VERY afraid!! The scrap box is a wonderful servant..but a TERRIBLE Master. You are starting on that slippery, downhill slope to Packrat Hell that so many of us have followed before! I just sent my driver to the dump with four drums of "scrap" Even with my years of experience, treatment and almost full recovery, I had to take one of my tablets to avoid having him tip them out so that I could cull through it one last time. It is a terrible, wasting, disease from which you can NEVER be fully cured! Take cold showers, think CLEAN thoughts and FORCE yourself to pass by that scrap box, several times a day without a sideways glance! Might I suggest the weekly meetings of Pack Rats Anonymous..their twelve step plan is wonderful! ;^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: oxygen bottles From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 23 Jun 2000 02:12:50 GMT -------- Bob Chilcoat wrote: > > I've told this story before, but it's worth a brief repeat. A gas analysis > company down the road from where I used to work tried to vent a large silane > cylinder that had been contaminated with nitrous oxide in their parking lot > late one night. Silane is a hypergolic gas that bursts into flame in the > presence of AIR, and nitrous is a great oxidizer! They apparently had close > to a stochiometric mixture in the cylinder. The blast killed all three of > them, including the one who managed to get inside the building on the other > side of a concrete block wall, and left a 15 foot deep crater in the tarmac > parking lot. > > Bob That is a very similar incident to the one I mentioned a couple of days ago. A brand new cylinder exploded in the storage area of (IIRC) Kuwait Oxygen, killing the employee who was sampling it. The Chief Engineer had a similar cylinder brought into their Concrete Block House where another seven, high level, officials of the company, gathered around as he cracked the valve to sample it. The Cylinder, a European spec. 300 cu ft 3000 psi, lightweight nickel steel example, filled with Hydrogen and contaminated (again IIRC) with oxygen and chlorine..(They had been filled at the local desalination plant) did not "Burst".. IT DETONATED!!!! The resultant carnage can only be imagined!! As these were brand new cylinders that *I* had sold to them only a couple of months previously, they, of course, pointed the finger at us, and left everything EXACTLY as was for several days, until I could fly out with Technicians and organize an independent consultant etc., etc... After several days in 100 plus temperatures I leave the rest to your imagination! Eventually the culprit was proved to be contamination, NOT faulty cylinders. We were exonerated, and the rest of the cylinders were taken out into the desert and used for target practice by the Kuwaiti Air Force.. I got an order for a thousand, new, replacement cylinders!! And a "Stench Memory" that remains with me to this day! Life goes on! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: oxygen bottles From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 23 Jun 2000 02:14:18 GMT -------- mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > Hmm. What *would* one do with a cylinder that had such an accidental > mixture in it? > > Seems to me, after some thinking, the best thing to do would be either > send it out to an ordinance disposal range and blow it up, or take it > out in a large field and shoot it. > > The latter is what one does for liquid helium tanks with bad air > plugs in the necks. > > Jim See my response.. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: New carbide inserts look dull !! ?? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 23 Jun 2000 02:30:11 GMT -------- They may NOT be "ready to use" Some brazed carbide tipped tools are sold, sans relief or cutting rake etc..ready to be ground BEFORE use into whatever shape the customer desires. If indeed your cutters are "Ready to use" and if indeed, you have them set, correctly on C/L, etc..they should cut, even if the cutting rakes, clearances and angles are not perfect. However, they probabably come with a perfectly "Sharp" point! Not a "Good Idea"..what you are trying to do is cut a fine thread..pitch equal to your feed rate. Result is bound to be "messy" Might I suggest, that before use, you take your diamond hone (You DO have a ten dollar diamond hone I take it??;^)...And hone a small radius on the edge..anything from five to fifteen thou radius..depending on your feed rate, finish requirements...and POWER available. Try again, with a good cutting oil, and report back! Then buy a "Green Grit" wheel..not a cheap one from ACE Hardware..but a good quality one, about 80 grit with an "Open" structure and soft bond..ask at your tool dealer..and try grinding your tools with a bit more top rake than generally supplied..say about ten degrees. Finish hone with your diamond hone, don't forget the radius!! Experiment and ENJOY!! teenut teenut Brian Evans wrote: > > Here is what I expect to be regarded as a really dumb question. I've bought brazed > carbide tool bits, tried them, and couldn't get them to either work well or to last > at all. I thought they were ready to use out of the box. Do I need to sharpen them > first, can I sharpen them after they chip, and what angles do I sharpen them to? > > I use them level to the work, set at center height so there is no relief. They just > seem to tear the metal, not cut, on mild steel, aluminium, 4140, which is what I > mostly use. > > Brian > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > > > > Or you can get a brazed tip tool and a green grit wheel for you grinder..not a > > major expense. > > > > So far as HSS tool bits are concerned, you generally DO get what you pay for. > > The Cheap, import bits aren't worth the powder to blow 'em to hell. > > > > I buy Cleveland, REX or M42 cobalt bits..tougher to grind, more expensive..but > > they do the job. Again these are available at firesale prices on Ebay. > > > > teenut > > > > Bucky Goldstein wrote: > > > > > > In article , > > > when asked how to tell good from cheapo HSS tooling, Robert Bastow > > > <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote: > > > > > > > Usual ways... > > > > > > > > Name brand/Origin. > > > > > > > > Price. > > > > > > > > Performance. > > > > > > > > How else? > > > > > > Well, shoot, teenut, I thought maybe you had to pour vinegar on 'em and > > > watch for blue smoke, or coat 'em in peanut butter and if there's > > > bubbling then you have good HSS and if there isn't you don't. Something > > > like that. But if it's just a price thing, well ... that's how I choose > > > wine, so I guess I can choose a tool bit that way. > > > > > > I'm curious because I don't really know the differences among plain HSS, > > > cobalt, M2, M42 and whatnot. I'm using 1/4" tooling to remove a lot of > > > cast iron. Haven't done this before. It's working fine, but I'm > > > wondering whether I can't make the edge last a little longer. > > > > > > If anyone can direct me to a tool bit FAQ, I'll appreciate it; or if > > > someone wants to lend me a clue directly, that's fine, too. Or if I > > > should just spend ten dollars a whack for 1/4" tools, well, whatever. > > > If they're really that much better, so be it. > > > > > > Anyone wants to smack me with a clue-by-four, feel free. > > > > > > -- > > > Bucky Goldstein > > > > > > I lost a button hole. > > > -- Steven Wright > > > > > > -- > > > Bucky Goldstein > > > > > > I lost a button hole. > > > -- Steven Wright > > > > > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > > > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: what knid of aluminum is a soda/beverage can?? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 23 Jun 2000 02:33:03 GMT -------- There are some incredibly knowledgeable people on this list..as well as the usual bunch of deadbeats, dropouts and comedians! ;^) teenut Chipper wrote: > > Hi all; > > I dont know how in depth of an answer you wanted, but I tried to find out > exactly what alloys the used beverage cans (UBC's) were made up of about 6 > months ago and came up with the following answer. > > The lids are 5182 alloy, the body is 3004. Based upon the maximum values > for those alloys, and given that the lid comprises approximatly 22.75 % of > the can, and the body 77.25 % (based on gram weights of ten can lids and > bodies weighed separatly on a gram scale) I've calculated the resulting > alloy as follows: > > Si: .2773 > Fe .6204 > Cu .2273 > Mn 1.2721 > Mg 2.141 > Zn: .25 > > All the other elements would more than likely be trace. There aren't any > commercially available casting alloys with a spec that fits the melted UBC's > so I cant really compare it to anything as far as characteristics of the > metal; but the high Mg should make it machine nice. If someone has melted > some cans down into a hockey puck sized sample and would like to send it to > me, I can analyze it on my arc spectrometer and post the results to the > group. > > Hope this helps. > > Cheers! > > Ben Bieber > > rad0 wrote in message > news:tLS35.10648$dF.472720@news1.rdc1.il.home.com... > > all right sports fans... > > > > I seem to throw out a lot of aluminium cans > > > > if they were melted down and cast into blocks > > > > how different from 6061- alum. would they be? > > > > harder / softer ? > > > > strength ?? > > > > tia > > > > > > > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Swarf, Dropoffs, Scrap and how the average guy gets screwed... From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 23 Jun 2000 02:47:16 GMT -------- Bob Unitt wrote: > > Shame on you, Sir ! > > In article <0Mn45.893$5e2.6812@news1.rdc1.ga.home.com>, Robert Bastow > <"teenut"@hotmail.com> writes > >I just sent my driver to the dump with four drums of "scrap" > > You could have at least posted a list of the contents of the drums here > first, so we could all ferret through for things which might be useful > one day(*). I have more respect for my fellow Yuman Beans..as well as a limited defense perimeter set up around my shop!! The Shop Mutt (has a clock card!!)..Half purebred Chocolate Lab..Half "Fence Jumper" with strains of Pitbull, Mastiff and Moose evident..is still only three months old and can only be relied on to grow, eat and bark..in that order..no defensive use...YET!! (Her name is "Lady"..THAT'LL be the day!!!) However!! Any fellow RCMers living in, or passing through, Hotlanta are welcome to drop in and "ferret through"..the coffee is ALWAYS fresh and hot! Call me first though..404 799 6304 Ask for *Mr* Robert..they don't know teenut there! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Appology to Teenut From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 23 Jun 2000 02:52:45 GMT -------- Here, here, John (TeeNuT) Bastow Ted Edwards wrote: > > Steve Stallings wrote: > > > At any rate the problem has been fixed. > > And that's all that really matters. Thanks. > > Ted ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Moving gas cylinders. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 23 Jun 2000 03:24:24 GMT -------- Mike Graham wrote: (Snip good advice on moving, chaining, gas cylinders) > You don't really have to worry about the cylinder going 'pop'... it won't. > You could drop it from a moving freight train and it would survive intact. Ain't that the truth! Few people realise how "high tech" and TOUGH a High Pressure gas cylinder is. Even in North America..(Which has the LOWEST Spec, LOWEST pressure and HEAVIEST cylinders in the world!!) A Modern gas cylinder to US DOT spec has a minimum wall cylinder thickness of (IIRC) 0.215" and is forged (in larger sizes) from a solid billet of 4130X steel..the X indicating that it is a special "Tighter, Cleaner" spec than regular 4130 steel (Incidentally, most US Steel Producers CAN'T MEET this spec!!! We had to ship steel in from Brazil and Mexico to make cylinders to the (worlds lowest) US spec The solid forged shell is then spun or forged to form the neck..which is welded solid during the process (or should be!!! Whole different story for another day!!) It is then heat treated..oil quenched and tempered..before the neck threads are machined, the collar swaged on, stamped with serial numbers etc, pressure tested and shipped to the customer. The resultant cylinder has ABOUT the tensile strength, etc., of a good quality mechanics wrench! Hit one with a sledge hammer and it will BOUNCE RIGHT OFF IT!! If you EVER see a dented cylinder RUN don't walk to the nearest exit...it takes a HELLUVA whack to dent a cylinder!! The two main enemies of HP Cylinders are Arc Strikes and corrosion. An arc strike on a cylinder will draw the temper and is grounds for INSTANT CONDEMNATION. Corrosion is a fact of life..and one of the reasons for scheduled inspection and Hydro testing. So long as the corrosion is even and NOWHERE does the wall thickness fall below minimum,(as measured ultra-sonically) then the cylinder, provided it passes Hydro testing (HydRAULIC Mike and other Canucks..NOT Hydro ELECTRIC)..will soldier on indefinitely. There are cylinders of pre-war (FIRST WW) vintage still in good service here in the US. However, LINE corrosion..as in lines of pits, usually found in a ring around the inside of the base, is grounds for condemnation! More than you EVER wanted to know. Huh! ;^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Tempering of handsaw From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 23 Jun 2000 03:35:23 GMT -------- A good "Smith" would hammer forge weld the broken blade back together and restore the temper, not by re-heat treating the whole, but by selective local heating and hammering. Surprisingly, due to the upsurge in interest in Blacksmithing, Blade Forging, etc., there are probably more GOOD Smiths around nowadays the there ever were in the past..many capable of doing the above type repair and including, I suspect, a couple of members of this NG!! (NOT me I hasten to add..I can forge a MEAN Blade, make damascus (patternwelded) steel etc..but the above is WAY beyond my capabilities) teenut timleech wrote: > > On 22 Jun 2000 12:16:26 GMT, dgoncz@aol.com (DGoncz) wrote: > > > > >It's good luck to own grampa's tools. > > > > Slight change of topic > I have a 28" carpenter's ripsaw, belonged to my great great > grandfather. Some pi**ock borrowed it, thirty years ago, and snapped > the last five inches off the end of the blade. I still have the saw > ('cast steel') and the broken piece. Often wondered about the > practicality of reuniting them. > At the time, all I had access to was Oxyacetylene and stick welding, > and a lot less welding experience than now, didn't fancy trying > either. > Now have all the usual mig, TIG etc. Anyone stick their neck out as to > the best way, or whether it's practical at all? > > Cheers > > Tim > Tim Leech > Dutton Dry-Dock > timleech@dutondok.u-net.com > > Traditional & Modern canal craft repairs ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: hand scraping book From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 23 Jun 2000 03:42:20 GMT -------- I have said it before...Hand Scraping is a skill EVERY machinist should master..Then hope he NEVER has to do it again! ;^) FORMER blue fingered, sorebacked teenut..STILL with forearms like Popeye and a handshake yer don't want to mess with!! Dale Grover wrote: > > I'm figuring I've got no more than 2 or 3 weeks before a > gang of blue-fingered, bloodshot-eyed, sore-backed people > start cursing my name (along with that Connelly character) > for ever having suggested hand scraping :) > > Got to get that phone number changed quick, before those 2 > am calls start coming... > > Actually, RCM folks are the best. I got to find out a > little more about some RCMers during this process, and as > everyone here knows, behind most every name or handle is > someone who has done and/or is doing the most amazing > stuff. Hanging out in such company has got to be good for > the spirit. > > Hope some folks will be posting their hand scraping > experiences and successes. > > --Dale ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What's the Scam? From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 23 Jun 2000 03:54:38 GMT -------- DGoncz wrote: > But point contact does not exist in > any automobile engine I know of. > I think I developed it, once, in an old 350 Pontiac that I spread between two exits of the QEW between Oakville and Burlington, Ontario. Couldn't have done more damage to that motor with an Exocet Missile! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Info on Boxford Model 500 Lathe From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 23 Jun 2000 03:56:29 GMT -------- AFAIAA Boxford are still in business and have a web page. teenut JimWeld wrote: > > I just purchased a Model 500 Boxford lathe. Looking for manual and info on > parts in the US. It was imported in the late 70's and sold to a school shop. > It's variable speed and cabinet mounted. Any info will be appreciated. > > Thanks Jim Stanlick > Precision Welding ======== Newsgroups: alt.survival,misc.survivalism,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT- Update on Gunner From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 23 Jun 2000 04:06:34 GMT -------- Let it go! You are not the first and won't be the last. Good riddance to bad rubbish! Today is the first day of the rest of your WONDERFUL life. Start by shutting down/wiping clean that web page..it serves no useful purpose but to hurt you. Sincerely, teenut Gunner wrote: > > If anyone wants to know why Gunner has been in such a foul mood in the last > month.. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: =-=-= üìåëôòïó÷áòîùå ôòõâù =-=-= ÐÒÏÉÚ×ÏÄÉÍ É ÒÅÁÌÉÚÕÅÍ ÓÍ.ÓÏÏÂÝÅÎÉÅ Ô.( 05662)44 559 e-mail: slav3@nikopol.net From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 23 Jun 2000 04:09:34 GMT -------- Wow!! I'll take a whole case! teenut "óÌÁ×ÕÔÉÞ-3" wrote: > > ïïï "óÌÁ×ÕÔÉÞ-3" ÐÒÏÉÚ×ÏÄÉÔ É ÒÅÁÌÉÚÕÅÔ ÜÌÅËÔÒÏÓ×ÁÒÎÙÅ ÔÒÕÂÙ ÓÌÅÄÕÀÝÅÇÏ > ÓÏÒÔÁÍÅÎÔÁ: > > çïóô É ÍÁÒËÁ ÓÔÁÌÉ òáúíåò äìéîá > ============================================= > 10704-81 16È33È1,2-2 Î.ÄÌ > Í/Ó 08ëð 38-51È1,5-2 ÉÌÉ > 1-3ðó,ëð 51-89È2,5-3,5 ÍÅÒÎÁÑ > ___________________________________________________ > çïóô 3262-75 äõ 15 (21,3È2,8) Î.ÄÌ. > 1-3 ðó, ëð äõ 20 (26,8È2,8-3,2) ÉÌÉ > 10-20 äõ 25 (33,5È2,8-3,2) ÍÅÒÎÁÑ > äõ 32 (42,3È2,8-3,2) > äõ 40 (48È3-3,5) > äõ 50 (60È3-3,5) > ___________________________________________________ > çïóô 8639-82 20È20È1-2 Î.ÄÌ > 1-3 ðó, ëð 25È25È1-2 ÉÌÉ > 30È30È1-2 > ÍÅÒÎÁÑ > ___________________________________________________ > çïóô 8645-68 28È25È1-2 Î.ÄÌ > 1-3ðó, ëð 40È25È1,5-3 ÉÌÉ > 40È25È2-3 > ÍÅÒÎÁÑ > 40È28È2-3 > 50È30È2-3 > ___________________________________________________ > çïóô 8644-68 30È15È1,2-1,5 ÐÌÏÓËÉÊ > ÔÉÐ á > Ï×ÁÌ > ___________________________________________________ > çïóô 8644-68 40È20È1,2-2 ÁÒËÁ > ÔÉÐ á 30È33È1,2-2 > ============================================= > > ôÅÌÅÆÏÎÙ: (05662)44 559, 15 377, 44 665 > e-mail: slav3@nikopol.net ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Appology to Teenut From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 23 Jun 2000 04:26:32 GMT -------- Originally it was "tubalcain"..a reference to the original, biblical Tubalcain..the original metalworker, and was adopted when I first came on the web and read/contributed only to Blacksmithing and Blademaking sites. However, as I found and started to contribute to RCM and the Modeleng-list, I found it to be a bit of a burden. You see, one of the "All Time Legends" of the UK Model Engineering world, a contributor to "Model Engineer" and prolific ME author..used the pen name " Tubal Cain" I got fed up of explaining to stupid people, how and why MY handle of "tubalcain" originated..so I changed it. "teenut" sounded better than "Indexable Carbide Milling Cutter"..So thats what yer got!! teenut (was tubalcain..NOT Tubal Cain) Jim Wilson wrote: > > wrote > > > Actually Robert originally chose a different handle > > So what wuz it?? ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Appology to Teenut From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 23 Jun 2000 04:48:35 GMT -------- Still not sure what the point was though! I'm 55..I have already lived three lifetimes! Looked 35 'til I was fifty..now, since the chemo, the head polish and the diamond stud lotsa peple call me "Mr Clean" (Or Mr Dirty if they REALLY know me) Me..I think I look like Marlon Brando in "Apocalypse Now" 8^( NOT a face to F**k with! teenut John Flanagan wrote: > > On Thu, 22 Jun 2000 12:24:01 GMT, Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ > hotmail.com> wrote: > > >And YOUR point is what John? > > > >teenut > > > >John Flanagan wrote: > > >> Are you sure it's not "TeEnUt"? > > DooD, haven't you seen the cool internet HiPsTeRs that alternate > capital and lowercase letters in their name? Where have you been? > Don't feel bad Teenut, I couldn't figure out why they were typing > their names that was at first either, actually I still don't know > except to be hip I guess. > > Was at a former place of employment a few nights ago. They had a new > girl working there. Looked like she was 15 but she is 19 I think. I > was helping out because they were shorthanded. She was able to > observe my youthful and perhaps immature joking around for a few > hours. I asked her how old she thought I was, she said 24. HA!!!! > I'm 40. (I think I had a chance up to that point :^) ) It's pretty > impressive how mannerisms and attitudes will influence people's > perceptions of my age. Most guess 10 years younger even though I have > a fair amount of grey in my hair. > > One of the men who works there is rather gruff, has a little bit of > grey hair, slightly overweight and has a generally pessimistic > attitude. He always called me "Son", not as a term of affection > either :^). He was _quite_ shocked, as I must say I was too, when we > found out that I was one year older than him. I thought he was fifty. > I think it ruined his whole day :^). He treats me different now..... > > John ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Moving gas cylinders. From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 23 Jun 2000 04:52:03 GMT -------- I really do wonder why you bother to ask..and why we bother to reply! You are a smart kid Robin..Stop trying to be a "Smart Ass"..it doesn't suit you..and it DOESN'T sit well here. Last time I'm gonna tell you! teenut "[©ØMMÄÑУ®]" wrote: > > You see, you guys say this, and everyone is like "Yeah, they know what > they're talking about so it's ok". When I tell this to my dad, he'll be like > "Yeah, I'm sure YOU know what YOU'RE talking about! Phht!" He's not really a > techie, more of an artsy... If I just plunk that thing in the pack of the > (rented) pick up and say "Lets go!" he'll give me a funny look, shake his > head, and have a nervous break down... > > Anyway, thanks for the advice (again.. Hehe). > > Regards, > > Robin > > "Robert Bastow" <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> wrote in message > news:ILA45.921$5e2.7435@news1.rdc1.ga.home.com... > > > > > > Mike Graham wrote: > > > > (Snip good advice on moving, chaining, gas cylinders) > > > > > You don't really have to worry about the cylinder going 'pop'... it > won't. > > > You could drop it from a moving freight train and it would survive > intact. > > > > Ain't that the truth! > > > > Few people realise how "high tech" and TOUGH a High Pressure gas cylinder > is. > > > > Even in North America..(Which has the LOWEST Spec, LOWEST pressure and > HEAVIEST > > cylinders in the world!!) > > > > A Modern gas cylinder to US DOT spec has a minimum wall cylinder thickness > of > > (IIRC) 0.215" and is forged (in larger sizes) from a solid billet of 4130X > > steel..the X indicating that it is a special "Tighter, Cleaner" spec than > > regular 4130 steel (Incidentally, most US Steel Producers CAN'T MEET this > > spec!!! We had to ship steel in from Brazil and Mexico to make cylinders > to the > > (worlds lowest) US spec > > > > The solid forged shell is then spun or forged to form the neck..which is > welded > > solid during the process (or should be!!! Whole different story for > another > > day!!) > > > > It is then heat treated..oil quenched and tempered..before the neck > threads are > > machined, the collar swaged on, stamped with serial numbers etc, pressure > tested > > and shipped to the customer. > > > > The resultant cylinder has ABOUT the tensile strength, etc., of a good > quality > > mechanics wrench! Hit one with a sledge hammer and it will BOUNCE RIGHT > OFF > > IT!! If you EVER see a dented cylinder RUN don't walk to the nearest > exit...it > > takes a HELLUVA whack to dent a cylinder!! > > > > The two main enemies of HP Cylinders are Arc Strikes and corrosion. An > arc > > strike on a cylinder will draw the temper and is grounds for INSTANT > > CONDEMNATION. Corrosion is a fact of life..and one of the reasons for > scheduled > > inspection and Hydro testing. So long as the corrosion is even and > NOWHERE does > > the wall thickness fall below minimum,(as measured ultra-sonically) then > the > > cylinder, provided it passes Hydro testing (HydRAULIC Mike and other > > Canucks..NOT Hydro ELECTRIC)..will soldier on indefinitely. There are > cylinders > > of pre-war (FIRST WW) vintage still in good service here in the US. > > > > However, LINE corrosion..as in lines of pits, usually found in a ring > around the > > inside of the base, is grounds for condemnation! > > > > More than you EVER wanted to know. Huh! > > > > ;^) > > > > teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What will they sell, eGad.... From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 23 Jun 2000 04:57:23 GMT -------- I have a couple of BIG ones in the shop (as well as a little 8" Boxford at home.) They get run every day..especially now that I have started to teach the guys how to REALLY use one. teenut PLAlbrecht wrote: > > >Is this because of the difficulty in moving the thing or is it because > >no one wants a seldom used piece of equipment taking up fourty square > >feet of shop space? > > Probably both. I have a little 7" shaper and it's neat and useful for lots of > stuff, but I don't know where I'd put anything larger. > > But big shapers are really neat if you've got the space and the electrical > power they need (220, 3ph, whatever).You can do stuff on a shaper that mills > could never do. > > Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Appology to Teenut From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 23 Jun 2000 06:03:30 GMT -------- Oh! You wanna PLAY! I'll bear that in mind. ;^) teenut John Flanagan wrote: > > On Fri, 23 Jun 2000 04:48:35 GMT, Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ > hotmail.com> wrote: > > >Still not sure what the point was though! > > Just to play with you and see what you'd say. I guess you aren't > familiar with the young saavy internet hacker types that either > alternate the case of letters or purposely misspell "wordz". I don't > know why they do it, must be a sub-culture thing. > > John ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Appology to Teenut From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 23 Jun 2000 06:04:55 GMT -------- Yer Crusin' John! teenut John Flanagan wrote: > > On Thu, 22 Jun 2000 12:14:12 -0400, "Steve Stallings" > wrote: > > >At any rate the problem has been fixed. > > Yea, what one-liners I shall discard, nor employ. So as to defer to > the traditions of respect for one's elders. Therefore I shall not > make use, the association of the words "fixed" and "teenut" :^). > > John ======== Newsgroups: alt.survival,misc.survivalism,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT- Update on Gunner From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 23 Jun 2000 07:23:37 GMT -------- John Flanagan wrote: > > On Fri, 23 Jun 2000 04:06:34 GMT, Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ > hotmail.com> wrote: > > >Let it go! You are not the first and won't be the last. > > > Again Gunner, this time I must disagree with the slug-giver. John, Would you mind, pretty please, defining the term "slug-giver" 8^) I have been called a LOT of names in my time..even accused of giving ALL kinds of things..But this is a new one on me! Should I be flattered? Or just write you off as some kind of religious nut? teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: =-=-= üìåëôòïó÷áòîùå ôòõâù =-=-= ÐÒÏÉÚ×ÏÄÉÍ É ÒÅÁÌÉÚÕÅÍ ÓÍ.ÓÏÏÂÝÅÎÉÅ Ô.( 05662)44 559 e-mail: slav3@nikopol.net From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 23 Jun 2000 07:26:18 GMT -------- Tony Jeffree wrote: > > On Fri, 23 Jun 2000 04:09:34 GMT, Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ > hotmail.com> wrote: > > >Wow!! > > > >I'll take a whole case! > > > >teenut > > > Nah. These ÒÅÁÌÉÚÕÅÔ's really suck. Save yer pennies... > ;-) > Regards, > Tony I had heard the new Mk 2 ÒÅÁÌÉÚÕÅÔ's were a great improvement on the old Mk 1's But I will be guided by your wisdom and cancel my order. 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: =-=-= üìåëôòïó÷áòîùå ôòõâù =-=-= ÐÒÏÉÚ×ÏÄÉÍ É ÒÅÁÌÉÚÕÅÍ ÓÍ.ÓÏÏÂÝÅÎÉÅ Ô.( 05662)44 559 e-mail: slav3@nikopol.net From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 23 Jun 2000 07:54:49 GMT -------- I'm not surprised..at this time of night! I have an excuse..had Chemo today and they give you a drip feed that includes knockout drops. I already got my beauty sleep today..not that it made me any prettier!! Besides..every time I go to lie down I wanna puke!! wots YOUR excuse? teenut Tony Jeffree wrote: > > On Fri, 23 Jun 2000 07:26:18 GMT, Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ > hotmail.com> wrote: > > > > > > >Tony Jeffree wrote: > >> > >> On Fri, 23 Jun 2000 04:09:34 GMT, Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ > >> hotmail.com> wrote: > >> > >> >Wow!! > >> > > >> >I'll take a whole case! > >> > > >> >teenut > >> > > >> Nah. These ÒÅÁÌÉÚÕÅÔ's really suck. Save yer pennies... > >> ;-) > >> Regards, > >> Tony > > > >I had heard the new Mk 2 ÒÅÁÌÉÚÕÅÔ's were a great improvement on the old Mk 1's > > > >But I will be guided by your wisdom and cancel my order. > > > > I hear that the new !!%%<>$*Q?Q@#? works really well...trouble is, I > can't remember who the *@~% sells them... > > Regards, > Tony > > Website: http://www.jeffree.u-net.com/ > When replying, delete "X." from the Email address to remove anti-SPAM measures. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Appology to Teenut From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 23 Jun 2000 07:59:48 GMT -------- Oh! a good looking dude huh? Me..I just look butt ugly..and mean as a junk yard dog!! Kids in passing cars dive down in fright and then peer nervously over the window ledge. Had a coupla good offers from horny young ladies who just want to help polish my head though ;^) Did I ever mention that young women are WASTED on young men!! teenut Steve Rayner wrote: > > Heh heh! After the chemo I frequently went swimming at a local lake. The > kids there refered to me as "Kojack". > > Robert Bastow ("teenut"@hotmail.com) wrote: > : Still not sure what the point was though! > > : I'm 55..I have already lived three lifetimes! Looked 35 'til I was fifty..now, > : since the chemo, the head polish and the diamond stud lotsa peple call me "Mr > : Clean" (Or Mr Dirty if they REALLY know me) Me..I think I look like Marlon > : Brando in "Apocalypse Now" 8^( > > : NOT a face to F**k with! > > : teenut > > : John Flanagan wrote: > : > > : > On Thu, 22 Jun 2000 12:24:01 GMT, Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ > : > hotmail.com> wrote: > : > > : > >And YOUR point is what John? > : > > > : > >teenut > : > > > : > >John Flanagan wrote: > : > > : > >> Are you sure it's not "TeEnUt"? > : > > : > DooD, haven't you seen the cool internet HiPsTeRs that alternate > : > capital and lowercase letters in their name? Where have you been? > : > Don't feel bad Teenut, I couldn't figure out why they were typing > : > their names that was at first either, actually I still don't know > : > except to be hip I guess. > : > > : > Was at a former place of employment a few nights ago. They had a new > : > girl working there. Looked like she was 15 but she is 19 I think. I > : > was helping out because they were shorthanded. She was able to > : > observe my youthful and perhaps immature joking around for a few > : > hours. I asked her how old she thought I was, she said 24. HA!!!! > : > I'm 40. (I think I had a chance up to that point :^) ) It's pretty > : > impressive how mannerisms and attitudes will influence people's > : > perceptions of my age. Most guess 10 years younger even though I have > : > a fair amount of grey in my hair. > : > > : > One of the men who works there is rather gruff, has a little bit of > : > grey hair, slightly overweight and has a generally pessimistic > : > attitude. He always called me "Son", not as a term of affection > : > either :^). He was _quite_ shocked, as I must say I was too, when we > : > found out that I was one year older than him. I thought he was fifty. > : > I think it ruined his whole day :^). He treats me different now..... > : > > : > John > > -- > > I'm a Canadian eh! Steve. > ************************************************************************** > The FAQ for rec.crafts.metalworking is at: http://w3.uwyo.edu/~metal > The metalworking drop box is at http://www.metalworking.com > Indexes for Model Engineer Magazine from 1950 to 1999 are at: > http://www.groundlevel.demon.co.uk/me_index.html > ************************************************************************** > Visit my website at: http://www.victoria.tc.ca/~ud233/homepage.htm > > ************* Tu ne cede malis, sed contra audentior ito. **************** > ******************************** - Virgil ******************************** > ******Yield thou not to adversity, but press on the more bravely.********** ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Swarf, Dropoffs, Scrap and how the average guy gets screwed... From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 23 Jun 2000 08:02:48 GMT -------- You are welcome John..but leave the attitude at home. Huh! teenut John Flanagan wrote: > > On Fri, 23 Jun 2000 02:47:16 GMT, Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ > hotmail.com> wrote: > > > > >Any fellow RCMers living in, or passing through, Hotlanta are welcome to drop in > >and "ferret through"..the coffee is ALWAYS fresh and hot! > > > >Call me first though..404 799 6304 > > Whenever I get my client's job done, and then deliver it to Hotlanta, > I will be there! I've got to see if you're really as crusty as they > say. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: =-=-= üìåëôòïó÷áòîùå ôòõâù =-=-= ÐÒÏÉÚ×ÏÄÉÍ É ÒÅÁÌÉÚÕÅÍ ÓÍ.ÓÏÏÂÝÅÎÉÅ Ô.( 05662)44 559 e-mail: slav3@nikopol.net From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 23 Jun 2000 08:15:10 GMT -------- 9AM! In the MORNING!! How come you're up SO late? teenut Tony Jeffree wrote: > > On Fri, 23 Jun 2000 07:54:49 GMT, Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ > hotmail.com> wrote: > > >I'm not surprised..at this time of night! > > > >I have an excuse..had Chemo today and they give you a drip feed that includes > >knockout drops. I already got my beauty sleep today..not that it made me any > >prettier!! Besides..every time I go to lie down I wanna puke!! > > > >wots YOUR excuse? > > > >teenut > > You forget - its 9AM where I am. Those knockout drops are killing off > the old brain cell, Robert... ;-) > > Regards, > Tony > > Website: http://www.jeffree.u-net.com/ > When replying, delete "X." from the Email address to remove anti-SPAM measures. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Appology to Teenut From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 23 Jun 2000 08:34:45 GMT -------- All depends on HOW or WHERE they want to polish it! teenut Tony Jeffree wrote: > > On Fri, 23 Jun 2000 07:59:48 GMT, Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ > hotmail.com> wrote: > > >Had a coupla good offers from horny young ladies who just want to help polish my > >head though ;^) > > Wasted on old men too if all you want is for them to polish your > head... > > Regards, > Tony > > Website: http://www.jeffree.u-net.com/ > When replying, delete "X." from the Email address to remove anti-SPAM measures. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Appology to Teenut From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 23 Jun 2000 09:14:19 GMT -------- I see you begin to catch my drift! I'll never tell! Hope they don't either!! teenut (smiling) Tony Jeffree wrote: > > On Fri, 23 Jun 2000 08:34:45 GMT, Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ > hotmail.com> wrote: > > >All depends on HOW or WHERE they want to polish it! > > ...and WITH WHAT, I guess... > > Regards, > Tony > > Website: http://www.jeffree.u-net.com/ > When replying, delete "X." from the Email address to remove anti-SPAM measures. ======== Newsgroups: alt.survival,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT- Update on Gunner From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 23 Jun 2000 09:29:21 GMT -------- Jeeez John..get a life willya! John Flanagan wrote: > > 3:23 AM!!! Time to go to bed! :^) I can't imagine you being anything > but a hard worker but I don't know any hard workers that stay up this > late, my heads a spinnin', I feel dizzy. > > On Fri, 23 Jun 2000 07:23:37 GMT, Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ > hotmail.com> wrote: > > >Would you mind, pretty please, defining the term "slug-giver" 8^) > > > >I have been called a LOT of names in my time..even accused of giving ALL kinds > >of things..But this is a new one on me! > > > >Should I be flattered? Or just write you off as some kind of religious nut? > > > >teenut > > It took me awhile to find it but back on Feb 8, '00 you posted a > response to someone asking for advice for a casting project for a > church group. The following is the request and your response: > > Esther Heller wrote: > > > > Don Buchan wrote in message <38a04196.3225190@news.mb.sympatico.ca>... > > >We are thinking of starting a mens group at our church and the Pastor > > >has asked me to think of a one night casting session for the men to > > Something in pewter (doesn't get as hot). tchotchkes for the women in > > your lives? fishing weights? checkers? pins to label the ushers as > > ushers? Pendants? (our ruling elders wear nametags and wood crosses > > with doves on them to be easily recognisable) Recognition medallions > > for Sunday School teachers or nursery workers? Got some soapstone or > > slate to carve molds out of? > > > > Esther > > eoh at kodak > > Slugs for the offertory plate? > > ;^) > > teenut > > I thought your reply irreverent, yet somehow funny (made me laugh) > :^). So on Feb 10, '00 I told a related story of mine which I started > by saying, "Teehee you're such a nut" :^). The strongly religious > context (from my viewpoint) of Gunner's situation and your response > just reminded me of all this. > > John ======== Newsgroups: alt.survival,misc.survivalism,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT- Update on Gunner From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 23 Jun 2000 09:31:21 GMT -------- John, I just realised that all this has been cross-posted to or from Misc.survivalism. NOW I understand! plonk teenut John Flanagan wrote: > > 3:23 AM!!! Time to go to bed! :^) I can't imagine you being anything > but a hard worker but I don't know any hard workers that stay up this > late, my heads a spinnin', I feel dizzy. > > On Fri, 23 Jun 2000 07:23:37 GMT, Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ > hotmail.com> wrote: > > >Would you mind, pretty please, defining the term "slug-giver" 8^) > > > >I have been called a LOT of names in my time..even accused of giving ALL kinds > >of things..But this is a new one on me! > > > >Should I be flattered? Or just write you off as some kind of religious nut? > > > >teenut > > It took me awhile to find it but back on Feb 8, '00 you posted a > response to someone asking for advice for a casting project for a > church group. The following is the request and your response: > > Esther Heller wrote: > > > > Don Buchan wrote in message <38a04196.3225190@news.mb.sympatico.ca>... > > >We are thinking of starting a mens group at our church and the Pastor > > >has asked me to think of a one night casting session for the men to > > Something in pewter (doesn't get as hot). tchotchkes for the women in > > your lives? fishing weights? checkers? pins to label the ushers as > > ushers? Pendants? (our ruling elders wear nametags and wood crosses > > with doves on them to be easily recognisable) Recognition medallions > > for Sunday School teachers or nursery workers? Got some soapstone or > > slate to carve molds out of? > > > > Esther > > eoh at kodak > > Slugs for the offertory plate? > > ;^) > > teenut > > I thought your reply irreverent, yet somehow funny (made me laugh) > :^). So on Feb 10, '00 I told a related story of mine which I started > by saying, "Teehee you're such a nut" :^). The strongly religious > context (from my viewpoint) of Gunner's situation and your response > just reminded me of all this. > > John ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Apology to Teenut From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 23 Jun 2000 12:36:41 GMT -------- Depends on how one defines "pornography"! I know everyone has their own cut-off point..but I doubt, nowadays, that even a Catholic Nun would classify the discussion of normal heterosexual activities as "pornography" OTOH I would certainly be the first to begin to agree with you as the subject moved away from heterosexual activity..and LONG before it descended to Barnyard levels! Now, some of my (Unsolicited) spam email..THAT is Pornography!! YUK!! Perhaps it is time though, to leave this subject...it served only to while away an otherwise painful and sleepless night. Finis teenut teenut lharts@unm.edu wrote: > > In article , > Tony Jeffree wrote: > >On Fri, 23 Jun 2000 08:34:45 GMT, Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ > >hotmail.com> wrote: > > > >>All depends on HOW or WHERE they want to polish it! > > > >...and WITH WHAT, I guess... > > Lets be carefull here it's getting close to "pornography" :-) > > ...lew... ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT- Update on Gunner From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 23 Jun 2000 17:51:14 GMT -------- Gunner, You probably know enough of me..where I am from, what I have done and what I believe in..to accept a couple of words of advice from 'ole teenut. I have been where you have been, where you stand now..and here's the edge I have on you Gunner..where you are going!! Two principles I have bitterly learned, two principles I have known of since youth..but resisted over and over, at enormous personal cost..until I could pay no more and had to come to terms with, accept, and learn to live by 1) Life is too short for bitterness and revenge or "payback".."know when to fold 'em"..walk away, move on and let nature's miracle healer..time do it's thing. Trust me my friend..the time will come when this is all a distant memory, that when, or if, you ever think about it..you will wonder what all the fuss was about..and FOR SURE you will feel proud of yourself for having taken the high ground..not lowered yourself for a fleeting moment of revenge. 2) Chinese Proverb.."Man can never cross same river twice..Man change. River move." You can NEVER go back..The circumstances are different..you are not the same person . Move on and don't look back Gunner..Believe me..every step you take will reduce the pain exponentially. Right now you are standing too close to the fire..burning like hell and..fer chrissakes..wanting to get closer! Of COURSE it hurts, yer dumb f**k..get the heck away from it..the pain will receed with time and distance. Every moment you resist, as I used to, is just another moment of wasted pain and life. Move on and don't look back. We love you Gunner. Sincerely, teenut ======== Newsgroups: alt.survival,misc.survivalism,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT- Update on Gunner From: Robert Bastow <"teenut"@ hotmail.com> Date: Fri, 23 Jun 2000 17:53:08 GMT -------- This is profoundly true! teenut echosix@my-deja.com wrote: > Remember, there is only one rule in survival: Survive. Everything > else is gravy. You can do gravy later. There will be a later. There > will be gravy. > > Good luck. > > -Dennis ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: explosive forming From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 24 Jun 2000 00:18:38 GMT -------- It has been quite a while since I took an instant dislike to some one..This big headed little prick is doing his best to set a record for "PLONK" teenut nunchaku@softhome.net wrote: > > hehehe, you think that uyou look cool with your sarcasm. piss contian > urea and with urea, urea nitrate can be made, uncle. this is an > explosive. i know my subject well so give me a break. > > In article <39518266.ABAB5135@tuna.net>, > Phil Koenig wrote: > > > > > > nunchaku@softhome.net wrote: > > > > > reply to nucnhaku@softhome.net > > > > > > has anyone experience explosie forming. aeroplanes front are made by > > > this method. its bending a sheet metal using an explosive charge. > the > > > whole operation is cariied underwater. > > > > Yes. I do this every morning. An explosive urine charge is a thing of > > great might. The problem is, that at my age, I have difficulty > focusing > > the "radiation," so to speak. > > Anyway, what is needed to perform this act is a ciclaforic funnel. You > > can find these at your local dealer in overglorified tube type > amplifiers > > (more on that later). Anyways, where was I? Oh yeah, the ciclaforic > > funnel. Well as any good amurican knows a ciclaforic (Wait a minute. > You > > ARE an Amurikan ain't you son?) Well now, given my security clearance > and > > yer lack of stature as an Amurikan, I have to cease this here > > conversation. I wish ya luck in yer endeavors, but I hope ya know the > > eyes of Christiandom are upon ya. Over an' out. > > Uncle Philfthy > > > > > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: explosive forming From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 24 Jun 2000 00:27:04 GMT -------- nunchaku@my-deja.com wrote: > > sorry but i don't have time to read threads but if you could reply > directly to my email, it would be grateful nunchaku@softhome.net. i > will cetainly reply since i've time to do it offline. i would be very > happy to give my opinion on certain subject also. When I want to know how NOT to conduct my sorry ass on a newsgroup and how to piss off the maximum number of people in the shortest possible time..I will be sure to ask your opinion, numbnuts. 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Honda Insight hybrid G/EV From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 24 Jun 2000 11:25:44 GMT -------- mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > See, in my mind, I equate starting and owning a business as one > definition of success. The old saying 'you don't get rich working > for somebody else' always seems very much on point to me. > But I still have that self-made-man idealism there. Fortunately my > wife keep kocking some sense into my head! > > Jim Hi Jim, I have expounded, at length, recently, on the joys and pitfalls of "being your own Boss" It is the only way of life acceptable/possible for the likes of myself..I declared myself "Unemployable: a long time ago! However! for anyone contemplating crossing over "The great Divide" I strongly recommend Michael E Gerber's book.."The E Myth Revisited" This one book will give anyone, the best shot they have, of success in their own business. "Two thumbs up" from teenut ;^) tee ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Anybody have tips for drilling/reaming 1018 CR? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 24 Jun 2000 11:33:42 GMT -------- Todd wrote: > > 5) > a) spot drill > b) drill with 31/32" two flute 118 degree HSS drill (600 rpm) > c) drill with 63/64" two flute 118 degree HSS drill (200 rpm) > d) follow with 1.000 right hand spiral flute HSS reamer (200 rpm) > Result was better but not good enough. > > What am I doing wrong? Do I need TiN coated drills and reamers? > I tried boring the hole but my lathe can't hold the required 0.002" > accuracy. > > Any hints will be greatly appreciated. > > thumbunny@home.net Skip the 63/64" drill Todd..give the Reamer a bit more to "Bite" on. Us an EP cutting oil rather than a soluble oil. Speed is about right..increase feed. All assuming your reamer is sharp! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking,alt.computer.consultants,alt.education,alt.machines.cnc Subject: Re: When will we see cheap Indian tools?! From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 24 Jun 2000 12:00:06 GMT -------- shaadow@trial.freedom.net wrote: > I have decided for good or bad to leave the machine tool trades. > I fed up with CHEAP BOSSES, CHEAP COMPANIES AND A CHEAP DYING TRADE that > I figure will be be dead in this country (US) with in the next 10years. > > Companies can export manufacturing jobs out to Countries of Convenience > and > setup shops in places where labor and utilities are cheap. They know > that machines cost the same basically the same any were in the world, > but labor is the most expensive variable and that variable can be bought > down by going to 2nd or 3rd world places like India. > > In deciding to leave the manufacturing trades to Computer Informational > Technology, companies will not export corporate computer jobs or > computers > to these other places, at lest for while. And most importantly > Information Technology is bettered paid and seems to have a better > future. > It is hard, as a Tool & Die Shop Owner, to deny the awful truth of Shaadow's post. He has reached a conclusion and is following a path that I followed twelve or more years ago..vowing never to scrabble for a living at the bottom of the food chain ever again! Self employed machinists ..(one man one machine and a basement) are their own worst enemy..They don't charge enough! There are too many one man shops around (yet) who are prepared to do jobs for subsistance money. The result is a market place accustomed to paying hourly rates LESS than they would pay a Plumber or Electrician. Considering that, even a SMALL, good quality and reasonably versatile Job Shop may have a third of a million dollars invested before they open the doors..compared with other trades that have their entire capital investment hung on a belt around their waist, it is a crazy situation!! The going rate around here for tool and die or CNC mold work is $55.00 or LESS! Realistically it needs to be $65.00 or more to make it worth my even switching the lights on! I don't know what the short term solution is..I do know that, as fewer and fewer good people learn the trade, as more and more good people retire or leave the trade, and as less and less good cheap machinery is available from manufacturing shut downs,,the situation can only improve. I believe I have found my niche..but though you may know WHERE it is (Atlanta) I sure as heck ain't going to tell you WHAT it is! ;^) Good luck in your new venture..but keep a weather eye on this industry..the time make come again when you see new opportunity! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: AutoCad From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 24 Jun 2000 13:20:05 GMT -------- I have decided it is time to join the 21st Century! During my treatment/recovery period I have a lot of time on my hands when I am too sick/weak to go run the shop..but I can sit at the computor or read and LEARN! Almost ashamed to admit..I have never learned to use Autocad properly so I have decided to remedy that. My son has "obtained" a copy of Autocad 14 for me and loaded it on a brand new HP Pavilion that runs like greased s**t..17" monitor..the whole works! So where do I begin? He has taken a couple of classes at school and can pick and poke his way around using mouse pad and keyboard. But I recall designers using something like SummaSketch etc, which seems to me to be a faster, more natural and "civilised" way of going about it. Is it? These things are available on Ebay at give away prices..would this be the way to go? Can you recommend a good "Autocad for Dummies" book for me. (on screen tutorials etc drive me nuts and seem counter-productive) 'Elp!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: AutoCad What do you really want to do with it? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 25 Jun 2000 14:39:53 GMT -------- Bill Bratten wrote: > > Teenut's original inquiry gave me pause to throw in my 2 cents. > I've used Autocad for 12-13 years now. It's great for DWG's... > I have recently gotten into the realm of CNC and have been looking for a > compatible code generator / tool path program ala Bobcad... > That would be similar to, or interactive with Autocad... > And by the way,.... did I say inexpensive? Better yet would be cheap... > There ain't none.....That I have yet found.... Bobcad ain't it either. > Now I am in the process of reviewing Powerstation, Vector, etc... > To find a friendly drawing / machining program in the $1000.00 range. > That I feel comfortable enough with, to invest the time to learn how to > use. > IMHO... > If you just want to draw or generate fancy 3-D images, Autocad is fine. > It's probably the most universal drawing package in the world. > If you want to make parts from your drawings, invest your learning time > in a program that will generate G code, as well as plot dimensioned > drawings. > > Respectfully Submitted, Hmm! We have the latest version of Bobcad at the shop..inherited when I bought it. Maybe I would do better to load this on my home computor and learn how to use it...Especially as I have three employees that could teach me. Now why didn't I think of that before!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: alt.survival,misc.survivalism,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT- Update on Gunner From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 25 Jun 2000 14:48:20 GMT -------- Don Foreman wrote: > Pop -- pop -- pop -- BOOM! (Need bigger font here; think > 105mm howitzer) > > The neighbor's back door flew open. "RICHARD!!!" "Hey, > that wasn't me!" "GETCHERASSINHERE NOW" > Thanks for the "Chuckle of the Day" Don! teenut ======== Newsgroups: alt.survival,misc.survivalism,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT- Update on Gunner From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 25 Jun 2000 15:42:53 GMT -------- "Fitch R. Williams" wrote: > > That was just what my monitor needed! > > Fitch"where IS that rag?"Williams What this forum needs is a ROTFLMAO warning sybol..so that we can empty our mouths of coffee/chips/bacon butty/beer or whatever..before pulling up a new message with an explosion inducing funny in it. I am on my third keyboard this year and it's getting expensive. Besides, they make such a clatter in the washing machine and tumble dryer!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: misc.survivalism,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT- Update on Gunner From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 02:28:01 GMT -------- Norman Yarvin wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > >I am on my third keyboard this year and it's getting expensive. Besides, they > >make such a clatter in the washing machine and tumble dryer!! > > You're supposed to use the dishwasher for that! > > http://www.ttgnet.com/rbt/daynotes/2000/20000515.html#Sunday > > -- > Norman Yarvin yarvin@cs.yale.edu I usually have the monitor in the dishwasher..they break too easily in the tuble drier! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: stuff for sale From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 02:33:21 GMT -------- paul pickard wrote: > > Hi guys, > > Well I listed this stuff on Ebay and got no takers! What is the world > coming to? > I have an Oliver die filer Nice bit 'o kit..good price...but I already have one! My guess is that most people don't have a clue what it is, or how to use it! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: AutoCad From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 02:54:58 GMT -------- Ted Edwards wrote: > > Doug Philip wrote: > > > http://www.genericcadd.com/ > > > Don't think they have a download though. > > I'm aware of them but, unfortunately, they don't seem to have copies for > sale or otherwise. Nevertheless, I'd be surprised if teenut's son > couldn't "obtain" it. > > Ebay??? > > Ted Since my son came to live with us I have laid down STRICT ground rules regarding computor use..I think he has come to understand that "hacking" etc (Which he COULD be very good at!) is not acceptable...at home or elswhere..it is theft or vandalism or worse and a felony to boot! Nevertheless I DID question him closely about the Los Alamos incident!! ;^) teenut BTW, the copy of Autocad 14 is the genuine article..not a pirated version and one that he obtained in trade and for services rendered in web design! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: AutoCad From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 02:57:41 GMT -------- Robert Bastow wrote: > > Ted Edwards wrote: > > > > Doug Philip wrote: > > > > > http://www.genericcadd.com/ > > > > > Don't think they have a download though. > > > > I'm aware of them but, unfortunately, they don't seem to have copies for > > sale or otherwise. Nevertheless, I'd be surprised if teenut's son > > couldn't "obtain" it. > > > > Ebay??? > > > > Ted > > Since my son came to live with us I have laid down STRICT ground rules regarding > computor use..I think he has come to understand that "hacking" etc (Which he > COULD be very good at!) is not acceptable...at home or elswhere..it is theft or > vandalism or worse and a felony to boot! > > Nevertheless I DID question him closely about the Los Alamos incident!! > > ;^) > > teenut > > BTW, the copy of Autocad 14 is the genuine article..not a pirated version and > one that he obtained in trade and for services rendered in web design! PS..Don't ever try to spam him..he will ruin your whole MONTH!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: AutoCad From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 26 Jun 2000 03:35:24 GMT -------- Thanks to all who contributed to my questions ref AutoCad. I have since taken a closer look at the capabilites of my BobCad programs and decided that they will do all I need..and with the advantage of being able to generate programs for CNC Machining Center, Lathe and wire cut EDM. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: He's Baa-ack From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 29 Jun 2000 02:33:16 GMT -------- Back on watch after a few days stroll though the valley of the shadow! Fired four employees..including one Charlatan that cosy me $40.000 hard cash! Hired five new people..top of the line (after a few days observation and guidance) Now got the "Good beginners" I need!! Spent a week eating crow pie and pulling chestnuts out of the fire. Five days rounding up cash for payroll. Four days in radiation! Two days fixing my HT Furnace. One day (today) first day of three..nine hours in chemotherapy..finished with a 14 oz ribeye, two pints of Caffreys Irish Ale and a glass of red wine Sign on to RCM and find 496 unread messages! Catch up ASAP! teenut OBTW..Feeling better than I have in YEARS!! ======== Newsgroups: alt.survival,misc.survivalism,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT- Update on Gunner From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 29 Jun 2000 02:35:28 GMT -------- Strider wrote: > I don't think that there were any real civilians in that war. Nobody > could tell the difference, at least. Only God could sort 'em out. Any Grunt that tried got hurt or dead in a hurry! teenut ======== Newsgroups: alt.survival,misc.survivalism,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT- Update on Gunner From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 29 Jun 2000 02:38:25 GMT -------- > On Mon, 26 Jun 2000 02:33:45 -0400, Strabo > wrote: > > > > >What other fuels will work? Half a shoe box of flour, two cherry bombs..differentially fused. one burster/ diffuser..one igniter of FA mix. BOOOM! teenut ======== Newsgroups: alt.survival,misc.survivalism,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT- Update on Gunner From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 29 Jun 2000 02:40:51 GMT -------- John Flanagan wrote: > > Mind you this was long ago before I matured :^). Now why yer wanna go do that???????? teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: He's Baa-ack From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 29 Jun 2000 02:52:34 GMT -------- Robert Bastow wrote: > > Back on watch after a few days stroll though the valley of the shadow! > > One day (today) first day of three..nine hours in chemotherapy..finished with a > 14 oz ribeye, two pints of Caffreys Irish Ale and a glass of red wine > > Sign on to RCM and find 496 unread messages! Catch up ASAP! > > teenut > > OBTW..Feeling better than I have in YEARS!! This could be a LOOOOOONG Night! They "Hydrated" me with several gallons of fluid and then gave me a shot to make me pee every five minutes! Sat here with eyes out like organ stops, popping $75.00 anti-barf pills to avoid losing a $40.00 steak and ale supper! The things I do for the advancement of medicine!! teepeenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: .006" wide slot From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 29 Jun 2000 03:37:42 GMT -------- payt wrote: > > We're trying to put six .006" x .75" slots in a .030" diameter tubing. > The wall is .006" and the tube is about 1.00" long. The six slots are > 60 degrees apart and parallel with the length of the tube. > > We are currently laser cutting the slots but are having trouble with the > heat affect zone propogating cracks. EDM has the same problem. Also, > the EDM people don't really like to use the wires smaller than .006". > Plunge might be a way to go but I'm not sure how long the electrodes > would last. > > I've looked into waterjet cutting but the smallest kerf is about .020" > with abrasive and about .006-7" with plain water. However, nobody can > cut NiTinol tubing with plain water. Also, there may be a problem with > deformation with subsequent cuts due to the extreme water pressure. > > I've looked into photo/chem etch and most places won't cut NiTinol or > won't cut tubing. > > We've considered lasering or EDMing undersize and extrude hone to finish > to size but this may increase cost and time too much. > > Does anbody out there have any other suggestions or know of a shop with > the capabilities? > > TIA, > > Payt > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. Just had the same problem. 2" x 1" x 18" long oblong aluminum tubing 1/8" wall thickness. customer needed ten of them with slots across the 2" wall 0.006" wide and 0.130" deep (to be sure they went right through) x 3/16" pitch (Lotta slots!!) Using 0.006" wire on the edm worked fine for two pieces then fried the power unit. OUCH! Laser or waterjet cutting too expensive! Finally bought a hss slotting saw of .030" thickness, hollow ground the outer 3/16" to 0.006", Mounted it on a long mandrel, between centers on the CNC Lathe. Mounted the tubes on the cross slide, packed to the correct height, wrote a simple program, set the right speed and feed and Voila! teenut Using .006" ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: AutoCad From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 29 Jun 2000 03:40:32 GMT -------- Fred Smith wrote: > > On Mon, 26 Jun 2000 03:35:24 GMT, Robert Bastow > wrote: > > >Thanks to all who contributed to my questions ref AutoCad. > > > >I have since taken a closer look at the capabilites of my BobCad programs and > >decided that they will do all I need..and with the advantage of being able to > >generate programs for CNC Machining Center, Lathe and wire cut EDM. > > > >teenut > > Robert, > > You better look at Vector. It all comes in the same package > (wire & lathe & mill) & I guarantee that it is better & for you, I'll > give you a special deal. Probably about what you will have to pay for > an upgrade to either the wire or mill package. > > Best Regards, > > Fred Smith > IMService > > imserv@imsrv.com > > Voice: 248-486-3600 or 800-386-1670 > Fax: 248-486-3698 I already have the upgrades I need..but thanks anyway. 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Is This Atlas Lathe a Good Deal? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 29 Jun 2000 03:54:50 GMT -------- Paul Bodenstab wrote: > > I've been wanting a lathe for a long time and finally through a friend of a > friend of a friend I have the following opportunity: > > Atlas 10F lathe 10" swing/ 54" bed > 3 and 4 jaw chuck > face plate > steady rest > live and dead center > milling attachment > metal bench > > The retired gentleman who is selling this lathe says the machine and all > attachments are in excellent shape and the lathe is in excellent alignment > ( ~1/10000" runout ). Spindle nose runout..maybe. Alignment...Baloney!! The gentleman used the lathe for boring his own > rifle barrels for markmanship shooting purposes which indicates the need > to keep the machine in tiptop shape. It doesn't take a MACHINE with any special accuracy to drill and rifle a barrel,the accuracy is in the TOOLS! ;^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Skilled Machinist Wanted for Prototype Tool R and D in Colorado Springs From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 29 Jun 2000 03:57:46 GMT -------- Employment80903 wrote: > > Our company, the largest and best professional and technical staffing service > in the world, is looking for a skilled machinist for prototype tool > development. > > You must have experience with shop machinery such as lathes and grinders, as > well as all manner of hand tools. A background in prototype tool development > and the ability to read blue prints and drawings is required. No production or > CNC professional, please, just skilled prototype R and D machinists. > > The job is contract for ninety days then direct hire. It pays $17.00 per hour. $17.00 an hour for that resume...This is a troll, right!!! I would START the guy with $27.00 and go up from there. teenut ======== Newsgroups: alt.survival,misc.survivalism,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT- Update on Gunner From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 29 Jun 2000 19:54:31 GMT -------- lharts@unm.edu wrote: > > In article <395AB727.2D2B7282@hotmail.com>, > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > >Half a shoe box of flour, two cherry bombs..differentially fused. one burster/ > >diffuser..one igniter of FA mix. > >BOOOM! > >teenut > > What time differential? :-) sounds like a winner. > > The 4 th is comming :-) > > ...lew... 1 to 5 seconds depending on the environment..shorter in open air, a bit longer in a building. Done right it will flatten a single family home! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Quotations for today OT From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 30 Jun 2000 05:47:37 GMT -------- FRIDAY'S QUOTATIONS - 2000-06/30 /// Food for Weekend Thought (selected, assembled and distributed weekly by R.C. Varga) "Better wear out shoes than sheets." - Scottish Proverb "Life goes on long after the thrill of livin' is gone." - John Cougar "Silence is true wisdom's best reply. " - Eurpides "Nature gives man corn but he must grind it; God gives man a will but he must make the right choices." - Bishop Fulton J. Sheen "'Yes,' I answered you last night, 'No,' this morning, sir, I say. Colours seen by candle light Will not look the same by day." - Elizabeth Barrett Browning "Success without honor is an unseasoned dish; it will satisfy your hunger, but it won't taste good." - Joe Paterno "Get a new car for your spouse - it'll be a great trade!" - Unknown "The optimist proclaims that we live in the best of all possible worlds; and the pessimist fears this is true." - James Branch Cabell "We must never throw away a bushel of truth because it happens to contain a few grains of chaff." - Dean Stanley "Whatsoever thy hand findeth to do, do it with all thy might." - Ecclesiastes 9:10 "Those who dance are considered insane by those who can't hear the music." - George Carlin "It is better to be hated for what you are, than loved for what you are not." - Andre Gide "A book, tight shut, is but a block of paper." - Chinese proverb "Never be afraid to try something new. Remember: Amateurs built the ark. Professionals built the Titanic." - Unknown "After all is said and done, more has usually been said than done." - Michael W. Hamrick "Hope is not the conviction that something will turn out well but the certainty that something makes sense, regardless of how it turns out." - Vaclav Havel "There is not a heart that but has its moments of longing, yearning for something better." - Henry Ward Beecher "Learn to let yesterday end so that today can begin." - Unknown teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Rules regarding the development of firearms... From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 30 Jun 2000 05:50:00 GMT -------- Phil Koenig wrote: > > I'd like to pose a question of the group. Hypothetically, if you had an > idea/design for a weapon which would be considered illegal to sell to > the general public (say a sort of machine gun for instance) and you > wanted to make a prototype, how would you proceed and stay within the > law? > Philfthy Apply for a Class three (destructive devices) Licence from BATF Call your local Batf Office, they will send you the application forms. Good Luck teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Files From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 30 Jun 2000 06:06:45 GMT -------- harrop wrote: > > Can anyone fill me in as to the carbon content of hand files as well as a > run-down on how they are manufactured? Thank you in advance. Rob Good Quality modern handfiles should run about 1.1% carbon. Poor equality may simply be case hardened mild steel..this applies especially to imported rasps. Files are stamped from bar, straightened, annealed. surface ground and then the teeth are cut by chisel type cutters in automatic machines. They are then heat treated, inspected and packed. Not too long ago, files were being hand cut by File Cutters, one tooth at a time with chisel and a special file cutters hammer while resting on a lead block. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Inventing the wheel WASRe: Used my ClampTite finally From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 30 Jun 2000 06:21:56 GMT -------- > On Thu, 29 Jun 2000 19:42:18 GMT, lawsonb@mnsi.net (Brian Lawson) > wrote: > > >Somebody mentioned that we shouldn't try to re-invent the wheel. Heard about the stone age guy who ALMOST invented the wheel? He spent the entire winter, chipping away in his cave at a what became a beautiful six spoked cartwheel. "What is that?" a fellow caveman asked. "A new gate for the front door..if I can figure out how to carry it over there" "I think you should call it "Fire" said a third! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: He's Baa-ack From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 30 Jun 2000 11:53:29 GMT -------- Steve Rayner wrote: > > When I went through chemo, they put about 16 litres of fluids through me > during each treatment! Man! Talk about being "Hydrated"! > That's about what they put into me..Plus I followed it with a couple of pints of ale!!....Permapee! Feeling better today than I have in three years!! later teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Rules regarding the development of firearms... From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 30 Jun 2000 11:57:58 GMT -------- Nick Hull wrote: > > Why go thru all thet harrasment from the feds just to make some new goodie > for the feds so they can harass you more? If the idea is that good you > might think of making it for those opposed to the feds. (not legal > advise). > Not real GOOD advise either..for him OR for you! Please repost it ..with a smiley so that we AND the Feds know you were just kidding!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Skilled Machinist Wanted for Prototype Tool R and D in Colorado Springs From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 01 Jul 2000 01:55:40 GMT -------- "Craig C." wrote: > > mact wrote: > > >Not trying to be rude or anything but I would believe $27.00/hr when I seen the > >paycheck on a regular bases. > > You are obviously new to the group and therefore do not know about > teenut.....Probably one of the finest and best capable > machinist/designer/fabricators around outside of a couple of extremely > high dollar research labs. He has quite a nice facility in Ga as I > understand it and I for one wish that I had enough skills to even > come close to being able to do an aprenticeship in his tool and die > shop. I wouldn't have to be screwing around as an autocad driver at > 17-25$ an hour and putting in 40+ hours a week. Even though I'm a 5th > generation machinist in my family, there is still a lot to learn out > there.... > > Craig C. Yeh! What he said! Top toolroom/prototype/programmer/CNC machinists are worth gold to me. My payroll this week for a staff of nine was well over ten thousand dollars..and worth every penny! BTW that included my PA and licenceless driver..and the shop mutt! teenut Craig. You don't need skills to start..Attitude and aptitude is all! tee ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: ebay is insane From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 01 Jul 2000 12:58:25 GMT -------- Aikens wrote: > > need proof > http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=371034642 > now I know titanium is pricey...but jeeze.... > Corey > > -- > http://www.chattown.com/home/biz/opps/getpaid/ I don't buy much titanium..offhand I don't know the price per pound of Mil spec. certified stock. But that is a lot of titanium and I suspect the opening price might be a deal!! Cab someone do the math on it? teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Question on pantographs ??? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 01 Jul 2000 13:06:59 GMT -------- rufo wrote: > > I have a Gorton P2-3 pantograph mill and it will do a 1:1 transfer > Gorton also made a 3-d mill. But I think a tracer mill is better suited > for 1:1 copying. Rufo > > * Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet's Discussion Network * > The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet - Free! I have a Deckel 3-D mill and it will do 1 : 1.5 Minimum. I had thought od making longer pantograph arms for it..until I tried milling at 1 : 1.5..control is difficult enough at that ratio..It would be a real PITA at 1 : 1. Besides, I now have a Fadal 4 axis CNC mill to play with! ;^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Rules regarding the development of firearms... From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 01 Jul 2000 13:09:46 GMT -------- Nick Hull wrote: > > In article <395C8BC1.33221595@hotmail.com>, Robert Bastow > wrote: > > > Nick Hull wrote: > > > > > > > > Why go thru all thet harrasment from the feds just to make some new goodie > > > for the feds so they can harass you more? If the idea is that good you > > > might think of making it for those opposed to the feds. (not legal > > > advise). > > > > > > > Not real GOOD advise either..for him OR for you! > > > > Please repost it ..with a smiley so that we AND the Feds know you were just > > kidding!! > > > > teenut > > Was George Washington kidding? The feds have surely read my web page, > which is more radical and has no smileys. If we don't exercise the 1st > amendment we will lose it as we have already lost most of the 2nd. Sorry > if it sounds grim to you, but I want the right to keep & operate lathes. > > -- > > Committees of Correspondence Web page: > http://www.geocities.com/CapitolHill/5357/ > - free men own guns, slaves don't Maybe I should have put a smiley on my response..I was only kidding..and I agree with your sentiments ref 1st ammendment rights entirely. Sorry meself! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Skilled Machinist Wanted for Prototype Tool R and D in Colorado Springs From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 01 Jul 2000 13:11:48 GMT -------- "Craig C." wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > >Craig. You don't need skills to start..Attitude and aptitude is all! > > > >tee > > Thanks for the nudge....I do have to be realistic about it though. > While I do have good basic skills, for every dollar I would earn you, > there would be some scrap for a while, more importantly is the > expense of making sure that I am doing it correctly, but above all > making sure that my work meets or excedes the quality the client > needs. If it doesn't then all I would be doing is wasting your money > and possibly costing you a client, and we all know that if there isn't > a client, then ain't no bucks coming... When I'm ready to have a > couple of dies made, I might see about coming over and watching the > process...that way I can't cost you any bucks.... :) > > Craig C You are welcome anytime! email me direct for phone # directions etc. tee ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT American Independence From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 03 Jul 2000 00:12:29 GMT -------- Bruce Hassell wrote: > > Hi Guys, > Excellent article. Thank you, teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Ripples in shaft surfaces From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 03 Jul 2000 00:30:57 GMT -------- "Antonio Carlos M. de Queiroz" wrote: > > Hi: > > When I try to turn long shafts in my lathe, specially when turning > long cylinders from materials as acrylic and nylon, but sometimes > with metals too, I frequently have problems with a kind of mechanical > resonance producing ripples in certain areas of the shaft. Do someone > know a solution for this problem? I have tried the usual solutions of > reducing the feed speed and using very sharp tools, but the ripples > continue to appear. > > Thanks, > > Antonio C. M. de Queiroz Hi Antonio, What you have is called "Chatter"....caused by deflection/vibration of a shaft that is just too long to be machined while unsupported. Invest in or make a steady rest..fixed or follower type and your problem will be cured. BTW..in MARGINAL cases, one can overcome chatter by INCREASING the feed rate, reducing depth of cut and reducing nose radius. In many cases, a pad of oiled leather or a wooden stick can be used to damp vibrations in a long shaft..well enough to get the job done. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: what machinist get paid From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 03 Jul 2000 00:48:23 GMT -------- mact wrote: > > I did a search on monster.com for machinist and noticed that most of the > ads offered > a wage of 8.00/hr to 25.00/hr with most being in the 15.00 - 20.00/hr so > the 17.00/hr that the company in Colorado was offering is not far off > the mark. > michael $17.00 wouldn't hack it in Atlanta for a GOOD Machinist. A machinist who isn't GOOD ain't worth beans!! My lowest paid guy is on $21.00 and learning fast..Can't wait 'til he is worth $25.00..I sometimes give a dollar an hour payraise per week if someone is a fast learner and has the right attitude. My Philosopy is to "Share the Wealth" ..I am nothing without my skilled people and I want them to feel as though they are as much a part of the operation AND the rewards, as I am. Of course, when something goes wrong and a two hundred dollar chunk of material gets scrapped..I alone take the hit..which is why I pay myself more than I pay them!! I am trying to work out a monthly shop production bonus plan that will address that kind of problem. My intention is to introduce employee ownership as soon as possible..on a free issue, bonus basis. Eventually, my plan is to hand over the entire company to the employees when my time comes to retire. The days of "Robber Baron" employers are over. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: what machinist get paid From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 03 Jul 2000 04:48:55 GMT -------- peter michaux wrote: > > teenut > > For every word: WOW!! You must be the best boss ever! Do your people ever > leave? They do if they can't cut the mustard!! > > So how well do you think a shop run with many equal partners making the > decisions? > > Peter The objective is not to have a bunch of equal partners..There will only be one Boss..Me!! The objective is to give the employees a Part Ownership..up to 33% so that the directly benefit (or suffer) from the fortunes of the business. This will reflect in the way they treat equipment, quality control, etc..sort of peer pressure to perform to their best ability, without sandbagging etc Sam Walton pioneered employee ownership of Walmart and died the wealthiest man in the USA. Some of his $6.00 an hour shelf fillers are stock millionaires. Employee ownership is where it is all at nowadays. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Precision Ground Dowels? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 03 Jul 2000 16:01:59 GMT -------- peter michaux wrote: > > wrote in message news:8jppni$983$1@nnrp1.deja.com... > > In article , > > "Gary Hallenbeck" wrote: > > > There are taper reamers and straight reamers. You want a straight > > reamer of > Thanks Richard. > > Do I hold the reamer in a drill chuck, a collet or do it by hand. They don't > mention the shank size for "dowel pin reamers" in catalogues. > > Peter Ref. Parallel Reamers. "Hand" Reamers..the ones with a square shank, have a slight taper over the first inch or so of flutes. They are designed to be held in tap wrenches and cut on the SIDES of the flutes, with a shearing action. "Chucking" reamers have straight or morse taper shanks. They have no lead in taper but cut directly on the very end which has a small bevel. Chucking reamers are held in collets, chucks, taper sockets or..best of all..in a floating reamer holder. Don't try to hand ream with a chucking reamer. Be very careful "machine reaming" with a hand reamer. "Taper" reamers come in both persuasions..hand or machine shank. They are used for such taper applications as taper pins, Morse taper sockets, rifle chambers and the like. For best results use a floating holder. "Bridging" reamers have a parallel section with a substantial lead in taper. They are used to align holes in steelwork, prior to inserting "fitting" bolts or rivets..a "Bodging" tool..used by hand or with hand held power tools. One step up from bashing a tapered drift through to align two holes. Keep your fingers out of the holes!! ;^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: AMERICAN MADE 3IN1 MACHINE From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 03 Jul 2000 16:03:55 GMT -------- Yer Dreamin'..the lot of you! ;^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: adapting gun drills for use on standard type lathes From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 04 Jul 2000 01:23:14 GMT -------- foxeye wrote: > > Has anyone adapted gun drills for useon a standard type lathe. By this > Imean, make an adapter to thread the gun drill into. Out of that > adapter have an inlet for the coolant supply line to hook up to, and > on the back of it, make it to fit either a morse taper or other taper > or just chuck it into a reg tailstock chuck or perhaps fasten it into > a hold such as an aloris type. > > Curious if someone has done this, as to how good it works. > > Foxeye > Standard lathes have often been adapted successfully for gundrilling. Primarily you should aim to feed from a carriage adaptor..so as to have access to the full range of speeds and feeds available. Gundrills require a high pressure cutting oil supply, with associated chip seperators filters etc. A seperate unit is usually required as the regular coolant pump is nowhere close to providing the volume and pressure requirements. Gundrills have to be started very accurately..either in a fixed hardened bushing, or in a short section of the bore which is accurately drilled and bored to size. On long drills, provision must be made to steady the drill, often at several points along its length and provision must be made to damp the characteristic high pitched "singing" vibration that can lead to chipped cutting edges. More modern gundrilling techniques involve the use of a compresses air/coolant flow to remove chips..though I have no personal experience of these systems. The short answer is Yes. You can gundrill on a "standard lathe"..but don't imagine it is as easy as it sounds. Get some expert guidance from the gundrill makers as so much depends on having the right speed, feed, lubricant, pressure etc for each particular application. It is a very "unforgiving" operation..get just one thing out of wack and the result is an expensive CRUNCH!! Do a search on gundrilling and send off specific enquiries to the companies you find..Thompson, Eldorado Tool, Starcut etc., you will find them very helpful. For obvious reasons I don't think this is an undertaking for a "one off job"..If that is the case..put it out to be drilled, the cost is peanuts compared to the cost of setting up to do it yourself. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: what machinist get paid From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 04 Jul 2000 01:50:15 GMT -------- Dan Caster wrote: > > In article <39601BC3.20936C89@hotmail.com>, > Robert Bastow wrote: > everything snipped > > Robert, I know you don't do a lot of reading for enjoyment, but you > might see if the local library has " American Steel ". Your wife can > check it out on her library card. > Au Contraire Dan, I do a LOT of reading for enjoyment as well as for edification. I even have my own Library Card! ;^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: what machinist get paid From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 04 Jul 2000 01:57:42 GMT -------- mact wrote: > > Robert. > How many years of experience does a machinist have to have to be worth $21.00/hr or > is it attitude and aptitude That is a "how long is a piece of string" sorta question. I have seen machinists with 20 years experience (usually ONE years experience TWENTY times over..in the same plant!!) who I wouldn't pay to sweep my floor. Given the right apptitude and attitude AND the opportunity to learn daily in an environment where it is encouraged and from people who take an interest and the time to explain things, a machinist can go from beginner to top rate in a relatively short time..three to five years. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: what machinist get paid From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 04 Jul 2000 13:01:34 GMT -------- AZOTIC wrote: > > > > >Given the right apptitude and attitude AND the opportunity to learn daily in > >an > >environment where it is encouraged and from people who take an interest and > >the > >time to explain things, a machinist can go from beginner to top rate in a > >relatively short time..three to five years. > > > >teenut > > Well said Robert. > > I feel this is a big problem in our current > system of education. The education system needs to be changed to allow people > that have the talent and desire to pursue the industrial arts an oppertunity > to do so. There should be a choice of > education available to students, and > those students who wish to become > involved in industry should be given the > proper education in basic shop skills > and current machine tool technology to > make them a valuable asset to thier > employer. > > Whats your point of view on this subject ? > > Best Regards > Tom. I can't agree more! When I lived in Canada I was HEAVILY involved with Mohawk College and Hamilton Industrial Training Board...as a Member of the Metal Cutting Group Board of Advisors. We not only ensured that the right curriculum was set to train Machinist/toolMaker Apprentices..but I used to hire a half a dozen at a time on Co-Op programs as part of their training. No, their wages were NOT subsidised! I took a personal interest in teaching them every step of the way and they did a wonderful job! But I am proud to say that we turned out some first class Lads and Lasses, many who went on to supervisory positions in the Industry in Canada. Here in the US I can't get any of the Vo-Tech people to return my phone calls!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Picture for positive identity of boring bars From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 04 Jul 2000 17:07:59 GMT -------- foxeye wrote: > > Below is a address for the boring bars I had asked about earlier. If > it is indeed boring bars, then I need to find out how to sharpen these > things. They sure don't resemble any of the other Borkum (sp?) types > I have seen around. > > http://ww2.ddyne.com/foxeye/bbars.htm > > Thanks > > Foxeye > > "Remove nospam to send email" > nospamchipmkr@hotmail.com > chipmkr@nospamhotmail.com > Foxeye don't live at ddyne.com anymore thankyou! > Just my .02 cents worth! > They look more like slotting cutters..used in (for example) a Bridgeport or Deckel vertical slotting attachment. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: glazing on grinding point - cause? cure? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 04 Jul 2000 21:58:15 GMT -------- Cathy Morgan wrote: > > For the first time I can remember, an aluminum oxide > grinding point glazed over. I had used it about 30 minutes, > maybe less. I was using a Makita die grinder, same grinder > I've been using. What's the likely cause? Any way to fix > it? I have a dim recollection of having bought a > rectangular stone years ago, for just this purpose - but it > might be for something else. If it is indeed for this, I > guess I'd hold either the die grinder or the stone in a > vise, and lightly hold the stone against the rotating > grinding point? Likely causes..crappy stone, too hard a bond, running too fast. As you surmise, hold the grinder in a vise or similar and use the dressing stick to remove the glaze. Buy a white or pink stone with a softer bond. Happy Fourth teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Picture for positive identity of boring bars From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 04 Jul 2000 22:01:07 GMT -------- Phil Koenig wrote: > > foxeye wrote: > > > at work at one time we did have an old > > bridgeport.....but it was never ever used, and was turned in to > > salvage, and a new Series II replaced it, as the government said it > > was to old, to be of much use, even if it was like new...... > > Foxeye > > The govamint...they're a damn laugh a minute. They'd prolly throw Teenut > out if they got a look at him. > Philfthy They tried!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Melting .999 silver From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 05 Jul 2000 00:03:06 GMT -------- I need to melt and cast the remnants of a J-M .999 fine silver bar (scraps, filings turnings etc) to form the guard and butt plate on a custom Damascus Bowie. I have a propane furnace and a cast iron ladle plus a plentiful supply of borax for flux. Molds will be machined from aluminum. Any caveats, 'intsies and tipsies from this Illustrious and Learned Group? teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: To all Americans on the group, Happy Birthday!, from Canada From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 05 Jul 2000 00:05:51 GMT -------- "Fitch R. Williams" wrote: > > gordon b. wrote: > > > Topic: "The Americans" > > Thanks for posting that. I love reading it. > > Thanks to Canada for being the good neighbor to the north. > > Fitch > In So. Cal. > > The FAQ for RCM is: http://w3.uwyo.edu/~metal > Metal Web News at http://www.metalwebnews.com > The "Drop Box" is at http://www.metalworking.com/ It's nice when you don't have to watch your back all the time! Happy Fourth to all. Sorry I missed the original..but if I could have...I would have bin there kicking butt and taking names with the rest of those rebels! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: welder advice - home hobbyist From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 05 Jul 2000 00:57:34 GMT -------- Steve Carlisle wrote: > > Those auto-darkening helmets are for sissys. Agreed! I use one and I eat Quiche too! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Spot the Babin, Round 4 has begun! From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 05 Jul 2000 01:06:09 GMT -------- Ironhorse wrote: > How about genitalia? The shipping costs would kill you..Babin has more Brass Balls than the National Association of Pawnbrokers. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: wood turning From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 05 Jul 2000 01:08:27 GMT -------- P2TheShed wrote: > >and use compressed air to blow off the rest. AAARGH!!!!!!!!! May the curse of a thousand Poxes fall on your household! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: welder advice - home hobbyist From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 05 Jul 2000 04:01:54 GMT -------- Steve Carlisle wrote: > > What the heck is "Quiche"? > > Steve > > > >Agreed! I use one and I eat Quiche too! > > > >teenut Cretin!! Bacon and egg pie. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Exciting Failure With 4x6 Bandsaw! From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 05 Jul 2000 04:02:35 GMT -------- PLAlbrecht wrote: > > >I've had mine for about 18 years now. Still sawing. > > On-off switch broke, huh? > > Pete Blunt blade? teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Melting .999 silver From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 05 Jul 2000 04:22:53 GMT -------- Donaldo3211 wrote: > > >I have a propane furnace and a cast iron ladle plus a plentiful supply of > >borax > >for flux. Molds will be machined from aluminum. > > Greetings: I would rather see a ceramic crucible or even a hollowed out > charchol block and a ox/ac torch to melt silver. I'm not sure the iron ladle > would'nt contaminate the silver. Also you might have sticking problem with > aluminum molds. Sand casting is a better way to go. Thanks I can machine the mold out of solid graphite. I will use a Satanite wash in the Iron ladle to avoid contamination. What about flux? PS this is a one piece deal. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Sherline mill and coolant-flooding system? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 05 Jul 2000 21:58:04 GMT -------- Michael Justice wrote: > > Does anyone have experience putting a coolant-flooding system on a > Sherline mill? Yer kidding!! This is a troll..Right? teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: adapting gun drills for use on standard type lathes From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 05 Jul 2000 22:22:43 GMT -------- Bucky Goldstein wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > The short answer is Yes. You can gundrill on a "standard > > lathe"..but don't imagine it is as easy as it sounds. > > Mr. Nut, I'm still curious re: something I asked you about last > week. I think it was last week. You told someone that a lathe > needn't be notably accurate in order to drill and rifle barrels. > I was curious about that. I assume it's because the drilling > setup itself has provisions to ensure its own accuracy (given > proper setup). Is this something like the truth? Something in > the jigs/holders/whatever to allow for a little slop in the lathe > setup? That's about the strength of it. Barrels can and have been accurately drilled and reamed with nothing but a hand brace and bit. Setting up a standard lathe to GUNDRILL fast, and with repeatable accuracy is a whole different kettle of fish. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: today's weirdness.... From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 06 Jul 2000 06:56:31 GMT -------- Phil Koenig wrote: > > There is a job inhouse that I, as the soul "machinist" got handed. It > involves first facing to 1/4" thickness, 5" diameter "plates" that were > originally cut to apprx. 5/16" on a horizontal bandsaw. There are about > 85 of 'em to be done. The material is 1018 cold-rolled, and it was all > chopped off the same billet. As I've mentioned before, in my past life > most of my work has involved very small stuff, so dealing with a 5" > piece is new to me (They bought me a new chuck since the ancient one on > my Clausing was obsolete and wouldn't reverse to accommodate). > To go on, for the purposes of the job, finish is relatively uninportant. > They just don't care, they want it out the door. However, I have to > drill, all of them with 4 holes each, tap one half of them and oversize > drill and countersink the corresponding mate, so turning them nice might > not matter to them, but it sure as hell matters to me. I should mention > here that this whole thing is gonna get buried in some kind of resin and > be a a stair tread. > Anyway, all that aside, I came across this weird phenom. > For the first 3/4" of the cut I get a beautiful "rainbow" cut, and then > it begins to degenerate into someething very much less then perfect. > Like I say, for their purposes, it doesn't matter, but for my own > edification, I wanna know What THE F*CK is goin on! I tried all manner > of speeds and feeds, finally settling on 600RPM at .0033 feed. Nothing > made any difference at all, it was just the SOS. > At the end of the day, I went up to the Mountain and threw the > obligatory 2 chickens at Magog, and after he did his usual burpin' and > fartin' act, he said, "1018 is shit. It varies from the inside to out. > Ya done as best as ya could ya dummy." Then he puked on me. I'm an old > guy and I hate bein' puked on, and I want my 2 dead chickens back. > Anyway, my first reaction was that it must have something to do with > effective speed change goin from 5" to zero, but even changing speeds in > mid cut didn't change a damn thing, so that must be a bullshit idea too. > > I'll get thru the job OK, but we have a big chunk of this stuff left, > and I have projets of my own to do, so I'd like to figger out what's > goin on here, and if it's possible to get a nice mirror finish out of > this stuff. > Sorry for being so long-winded. > Philfthy Simple answer Phil.. The material may well have been ordered as 1018..but I will bet a pound of donuts to pinch of sh*t that what was delivered was A36 structural hot rolled. I hate the stuff as do most machinists..difficult to machine to a good CONSISTANT finish. Very "gummy" stuff..chips won't break. YUK! Steel stockholders supply that stuff nowadays because most demand is for structural or welding steel..too few people know or care about machining qualities. Don't feel bad about not being able to get a good facing cut..it would have been difficult for an experienced machinist even one armed with a variable speed lathe or CNC on which he could dial in a constant surface speed. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Shop Teachers RE:machinist pay From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 06 Jul 2000 11:26:10 GMT -------- William E Williams wrote: I think > it shows how effective media influence is. To often people form strong > opinions about an issue and are unaware of the facts around it. To me, > this means people are making there opinions from other peoples opinions > and not thinking for themselves. This is the real crisis our society > faces today. Calls for Gun Control as an answer to Social Problems being a classic example. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT...need to carve a notch, but where.. From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 06 Jul 2000 20:08:10 GMT -------- Ted Edwards wrote: > > Tools don't have feelings: affection, loyalty, ... . Mine do!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Q: Bobbiting on the lathe From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 06 Jul 2000 20:14:07 GMT -------- Bucky Goldstein wrote: > > I can't get a straight cutoff on the lathe. The setup: > > - Cross slide moves perpendicular to axis of rotation > > - Saddle is locked against longitudinal travel > > - All gibs adjusted to a slightly stiff slide, no play > > - Slow rotation > > - Slow infeed (by hand or auto) > > - Cutoff tool indicates square to workpiece > > - Height of tool equals ctr height of workpiece > > - Tool contacts the workpiece only at the cutting point > > - Tool is good & sharp on the top corner > > - Plenty of cutting fluid > > What happens is that the tool point drifts to the right instead > of going in square. The piece left in the chuck is slightly > convex on the cut face, and the piece that gets cut off is > slightly concave. This is consistent. The greater the diameter > of workpiece, the greater the error. Can anyone tell me why? > > -- > Bucky Goldstein > > I lost a button hole. Tool is not square across the front? Ditto the top? Tool is NOT as sharp on one corner as the other? Uneven side clearances? Does a different tool give the same results? teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Bobbiting on the lathe From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 06 Jul 2000 20:22:42 GMT -------- Brian Lawson wrote: > I have a tough time to get the "rocker-type" tool > posts tight enough so it won't "move". Have you tried welding? ;^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Electric motor redux all over again From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 06 Jul 2000 20:27:07 GMT -------- Bucky Goldstein wrote: > Now, what's the best way to take 3/4" off an HSS bit? > -- > Bucky Goldstein > > I lost a button hole. Grind a notch all the way round it, Put it in your vise with the notch at jaw level COVER WITH A RAG!!!!!! Smack with hammer. Pick up pieces teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Q: Bobbiting on the lathe From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 07 Jul 2000 00:07:11 GMT -------- ppierce wrote: > > Yeh. Usually a squirt in another drop when the metal stops coming off in > > nice curls and starts coming off kind of crumbly. ......... > > Studying the curls while parting it is real easy to tell when you need > to > add another shot of oil. With the oil you get nice looking curls, as > soon > as the oil is about gone the curls get rough looking. Time to add oil, > Not much time. No need to study curls (or chicken entrails) do it by ear! A happy parting tool sounds like frying bacon. Add a drop of oil as that sound starts to fade and well before it starts to sound grauchy. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Sherline mill and coolant-flooding system? From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 07 Jul 2000 00:15:42 GMT -------- Mike Graham wrote: > > On Thu, 06 Jul 2000 17:44:49 GMT, Edward Haas wrote: > > > --If you have access to an air compressor, consider using a spray > >mist system. > > Call me paranoid, but I worry about breathing that mist. > ME TOO!!! I tossed the systems I found in my shop when I took over and banned their use..PERIOD! This was well before I was diagnosed with lung cancer...So that had nothing to do with my decision. What I did know, was that even my leather lungs, (pre-cancer 3 packs a day of Camels x 47 years!!) used to start acting up and set me in a coughing spasm as soon as I got near one of those infernal mist systems. Be Warned! teenut teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: what machinist get paid From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 07 Jul 2000 00:19:04 GMT -------- Phil Koenig wrote: > > ADEEDS6213 wrote: > > > teenut do you have any openings. Arnie > > Hahaha....I'll bet at least half the guys in this group have asked > themselves the same question...I know I have. > Philfthy Not right now..Later fer sure. I just finished hiring five new Tool & Die makers, Toolroom Machinists, and CNC Programmer Machinists..It will take a couple of months to get them retrained "teenut Style" teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Junkyard Wars rules From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 07 Jul 2000 01:11:18 GMT -------- Bruce Simpson wrote: > > On Thu, 06 Jul 2000 15:25:04 GMT, REMOVE_THIS_xmundt@esper.com (Dave > Mundt) wrote: > > > Greetings and Salutations... > > Hear! Hear! > > Not only is the show well paced, but, one has to admire the > >techniques (and insane bravery in the case of the flying machines) of > >the teams. The individual who "flew" the metal canard was either an absolutely brilliant aerodynamicist..who knew FAR more than he let on. Or he was totaly stupid. At that take off speed and altitude (40 plus mph and thirty plus feet) a stall would have killed him with a tail first dive, breaking his neck or back. I saw it happen once with a REAL glider and pilot when he lost the tow line and did a "Tail Dive". Everybody laughed till they discovered he was stone dead. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Junkyard Wars rules From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 07 Jul 2000 14:08:28 GMT -------- Ernie Leimkuhler wrote: > > I would be tempted to try out next year. > Count me IN! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Electric motor redux all over again From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 07 Jul 2000 21:11:43 GMT -------- Bucky Goldstein wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > Grind a notch all the way round it, > > > > Put it in your vise with the notch at jaw level > > > > COVER WITH A RAG!!!!!! > > > > Smack with hammer. > > > > Pick up pieces > > Tried it last night and hallelujah, it works. > Glory Be! I'll hafta try it myself one day. ;^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Electric motor redux all over again From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 07 Jul 2000 21:17:53 GMT -------- Bucky Goldstein wrote: > > Jack Erbes wrote: > > >> So if I want I can grind the spit out of an HSS bit, until > >> it's all nice & blue, and it'll still keep the edge I put on > >> it? > >> > > > > No, getting HSS that hot will take some of the hardness out. > > That's what I thought. But the recent talk of cutting with a > red-hot HSS bit had made me wonder. My usual thing has been > about what you describe: if it's too hot to hold, take it off the > grinder and dunk it. Seems to work okay. > > But I did find out that brother teenut was right that a > good-quality HSS bit will keep its edge even when cutting a heavy > load and getting pretty dam' hot. I did a little testing last > week, got some surprizes. Gotta watch this teenut character..The guy keeps telling you the truth! Personally, I am very rarely in such a hurry to sharpen a tool that I don't take the time to use the bare fingers/dunk often routine. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Q: Bobbiting on the lathe From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 07 Jul 2000 21:31:34 GMT -------- Bucky Goldstein wrote: > > Jack Erbes wrote: > That's pretty much how I sharpen all my tools, but I use an India > stone and then an Arkansas stone, and I use 'em dry. It's okay > to use oil for rough stuff, but for a nice edge it's best to hone > on a dry stone. Oil suspends particles of grit & metal. Push a > blade through that and it's like driving it through a pile of > sand. Better to clean the stone with solvent, then hone the > tools dry -- makes a very nice edge. Never oil a whetstone. > (Most people disagree with me on this, but they're wrong.) I would like to see your authority on this! As in..where the f**k did you get THAT gem of misinformation? Curiously. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Junkyard Wars rules From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 08 Jul 2000 10:21:07 GMT -------- PLAlbrecht wrote: > > >Yes, but you're neglecting ground effect! These are clever Poms > >and their cunning & devious plan was never to escape from it! > > Too clever for their own good. Ground effect basically goes away once your > altitude exceeds your wingspan. > > Pete Ah-Ha!! THAT'S why I have never been able to reach escape velocity! My wingspan has ALWAYS exceeded my altitude. 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: New metalworking business? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 08 Jul 2000 10:24:50 GMT -------- Doug Warner wrote: > > An article in the paper today mentioned the booming new business of > booting cars parked improperly in business owner's lots (such as after > the business is closed) Private boot companies show up, clamp their > hardware onto the wheels of all the cars, and charge $90-100 to remove > them. I suppose they kick back a portion of this to the business > owner, who provides only the legal right to engage in this form of > extortion.. > > Here's a perfect opportunity for a competing business. You get out of > the club at 1AM, see a big steel thing clamped onto your wheel.. What > to do? Call 1-555-BOOT-OFF. In a short time, a vehicle shows up, the > operator takes your card info, unreels the plasma torch, and burns the > boot off in a couple of minutes.. Facing a $100 fee, I'm sure most > would pay at least $40.00 :-) > > To reply, please remove one letter from each side of "@" > Spammers are scammers, avoid them! You would be in jail before you could turn the torch off..it has been tried!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Threading HRS. From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 08 Jul 2000 10:29:37 GMT -------- Grant Erwin wrote: > > 1. Turn the workpiece to the correct starting diameter. (HINT: if it's for a > 1/2" > thread, the correct starting diameter is NOT 0.500"!!) Huh?? teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Tooling questions From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 08 Jul 2000 10:33:41 GMT -------- Pete & Sheri wrote: > How about walking into some local machine shops and asking the boss where his > employees go to get trained. McDonald's?? teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: VERNON HORIZONTAL MILLING MACHINE From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 08 Jul 2000 10:39:20 GMT -------- Rich wrote: > > Dear Group. > > If you have a minute please follow the link below and tell me what you > think about the > machine pictured. No, I didn't buy it but I was tempted. Frankly I am > afraid to buy > a machine without at least seeing it in person (not that I that much > about machine tools). > This is the size horizontal mill I would love to have and the price was > right just wasn't > around for end of the auction. > > http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=371498630 > > Does anyone have experience with the Vernon brand name. > > Thanks in advance, > > Rich I am sorry I missed that one. I'm not familiar with the Vernon Name, but it looks like a tasty and useful addition for the HSM. I would buy sight unseen..based on the say so of Reliable Tool. I have had extensive dealings with them and have never been disappointed. The price was right..my only personal reservation would have been the cost of shipping to Atlanta. If I lived within a day's drive I would have grabbed it. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: what machinist get paid From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 08 Jul 2000 10:42:55 GMT -------- Phil Koenig wrote: >Did I mention that my entire family is crazier than shithouse rats? > Best Regards, > Philfthy You didn't need to..We guessed! ;^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Q: Bobbiting on the lathe From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 08 Jul 2000 12:06:41 GMT -------- Bucky Goldstein wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > Bucky Goldstein wrote: > > > > > That's pretty much how I sharpen all my tools, but I use an India > > > stone and then an Arkansas stone, and I use 'em dry. It's okay > > > to use oil for rough stuff, but for a nice edge it's best to hone > > > on a dry stone. Oil suspends particles of grit & metal. Push a > > > blade through that and it's like driving it through a pile of > > > sand. Better to clean the stone with solvent, then hone the > > > tools dry -- makes a very nice edge. Never oil a whetstone. > > > (Most people disagree with me on this, but they're wrong.) > > > > I would like to see your authority on this! > > > > As in..where the f**k did you get THAT gem of misinformation? > > Well shoot, brother 'nut, let's not do it that way. Not much to be > gained by comparing authorities (though mine are actually pretty good, > and I'll tell you about 'em if you think it matters). Yes it matters! I DO need to compare. You show me your's..I'll show you mine! But as I often say.."Don't bring a knife to a gun fight"! > But. The conventional wisdom of honing is false. You get a better edge > with a dry whetstone than you do with oil. I'm willing to be corrected, > but it'll take some doing. No doubt about it..a dry whetstone will put a shinier finish on your edge than a wet one. A fact that is used as an accepted technique with WATER stones. They are often used beyond the point where the available water and the slurry it forms, dries out and continued honing provides a final finish. But don't confuse the characteristics of a water stone and an India or Arkansas "oil" stone..they work and are used in quite different ways. On the water stone the surface is considered a consumable part of the process..it is repeatedly "sacrificed" in the use of the stone. Not so with a hard arkansas stone..like a diamond hone, they are expensive and difficult to resurface. Every attempt is made to keep them free cutting, clean and "open" DURING the honing process. Your use of a dry "Oil" stone is destroying the cutting features of the stone which will need to be frequently (and expensively) renewed or replaced. It is a quick fix, "dirty" way to get a good edge..It certainly won't work for long if extensive honing is required (have you tried sharpening many knives with a dry stone?) >Let's do it this way: what do you think oil > adds to the honing process? > That ain't the way this or any other discussion forum works Bucky..I asked first! But, for what it is worth..it adds a not unimportant factor, like LIFE to the (Usually) expensive hone, prevents clogging of the pores and washes away debris so the stone can keep on cutting. BTW when you say "Oil" I do hope you understand that 10W40 is not the correct "oil" for honing. It will simply clog the surface of the stone. Honing oils are very light..I use straight kerosene. I keep the "Ready use" slip stones on my bench in a jar of kerosene..these being the ones I use, not just for touching up tools, but for "Hard Fitting" of tool, die or gun parts. There are, perhaps, a dozen different shapes, types and grades in that jar..all with their specific uses..and ALL too damn expensive to want to screw them up! Respectfully, 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: I shall return From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 08 Jul 2000 12:10:09 GMT -------- Personal reasons (not health related) will keep me from monitoring the NG for the next few days. I shall return. Later, 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Junkyard Wars rules From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 18 Jul 2000 00:42:21 GMT -------- "DoN. Nichols" wrote: > And when you realize that the hood is the convertible top over > your head. > Ahh! My wife (a steel magnolia from Alabama) and myself (Ex-Pat Brit with twenty four years learning to be B-Lingual in English and 'Mericun) are currently striving to reach an understanding ref. the convertible roof of our Jaguar XJS To her "top up" means the same as my "hood down" ie..open to the fresh air. to understand that you have to understand that in the South, to "put something up" means the same as to put somthing away or into storage. Anyone doubting the "Correctness" of aluminium as the original spelling on BOTH continents, should do a search on the original articles of incorporation for ALCOA. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Junkyard Wars rules From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 18 Jul 2000 00:57:18 GMT -------- Jeff DelPapa wrote: > followed by an all US teams series, with a different host. @@#&^$(&$#%)+_^%$##@!@^^&&!!!!!!!!! That is the worst possible thing that could happen..look what they did to "Steptoe and Son" (Sandford and Son) and "Fings ain't Wot they used t'Be" (All in the Family) Watered down, useless, apologies for the original British shows. Expect the all American Junkyard Wars to be a contest of politically acceptable, ethnically balanced "faces", making totally non litiginous, but pretty objects out of egg cartons and Elmer's Glue! Blah!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Junkyard Wars rules From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 18 Jul 2000 01:07:03 GMT -------- John Flanagan wrote: cordite isn't a > propellant though.... Yes it bloody well is! It was one of the original (successful) smokeless propellants, invented and used by the British military for over six decades in everything from the .303 rifle cartridge right up to the 15" guns on British Battleships! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Q: Bobbiting on the lathe From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 18 Jul 2000 01:25:19 GMT -------- Ted Edwards wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > "sacrificed" in the use of the stone. Not so with a hard arkansas stone..like a > > diamond hone, they are expensive and difficult to resurface. > > Not just expensive, unobtainable. I have a hard Arkansas (50 yrs old) > that is almost as fine as my black hard (25 years old). This material > is running out (has run out according to one source) and the quality of > what's left is not as good. So far I've not been able to find a > replacement that's as good for *really* serious honing. Listen to > teenut if you want to have a stone that cuts quickly, stays flat and you > can pass on to your kids in good condition. > > teenut: Isn't kerosene a bit too light? My 20 yr old bottle of honning > oil is getting low and I'm interested in whether there is a common > alternative. > > Ted I have a couple of bottles of honing oil I picked up at a garage sale. I was curious about it because I had never heard of it before coming to the USA. In England I always used kerosene (paraffin in UKSPEAK), everything else was sure to "cure" or air dry sooner or later and require the stone to be boiled out in kerosene to restore its cutting qualities. I would offer to mail the "Honing Oil" to you..but I won't, as a I think I would be doing you a disservice!! The stuff is FAR too thick and DOES dry, eventually. In an emergency I would go to something THINNER than kerosene rather than thicker..like WD40 or even water. On the hard Arkansas I always carry "in the field" for touching up my knife blades, I always use spit!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Q: Bobbiting on the lathe From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 18 Jul 2000 01:34:59 GMT -------- Ted Edwards wrote: > > But I do differ with you on the oil/longevity issue: done right, you can > > dry-hone for a long, long time on the same stone & not wear it out. > > You've been blowing that horn for too long and it's going flat. Believe > it or not, other people read and even look through microscopes. You're > full of it on that issue so lay off. I couldn't have put it better meself Ted..The only thing I dry hone on is a folded newspaper!! Try it some day when you want that "Scary Sharp" edge on a knife or razor..Good for a swift touch up on a field knife too. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Q: Bobbiting on the lathe From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 18 Jul 2000 01:45:15 GMT -------- Bucky Goldstein wrote: > > Ted Edwards wrote: > > > Religion? Try over 50 years of sharpening, both for myself and > > professionaly. I have also *tried* both ways *and* examined the > > resulting edges under a microscope. Have you? > > Yes, Ted. > > Done? > > -- > Bucky Goldstein > > I lost a button hole. Bucky me Boyo..button holes ain't the only thing you're losing. Your credibility is going down the toilet FAST with this NG. When this POS thread started, you were asked by me to provide your references and authority on the subject. Your smart-assed response was to demand mine. You got them from me and from other more knowledgeable people. Now it is time for you to put up..or shut up, because no one believes you have any knowledge of the subject. If you have proof or independent documentation I will the first to admit I was wrong and you are right. Otherwise, shut the f**k up about it! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Q: Bobbiting on the lathe From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 18 Jul 2000 01:52:21 GMT -------- Bucky Goldstein wrote: > > Actually, no. French polish uses mineral oil, which does not harden; > and by the end of the process, all the mineral oil has been worked out > of the finish. Keerist Bucky!! It really is time you got off this subject or steered us onto a subject where you know shit from shinola!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Q: Bobbiting on the lathe From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 18 Jul 2000 01:56:51 GMT -------- Bucky Goldstein wrote: > > steve@pilotltd.net wrote: > > > Have a look at http://www.extremely-sharp.com/direct/sharpknife.html > > > > Instructions supplied by DMT ;) > > Why, looky here. Steve, I'm glad you posted that url. The following > paragraph comes from that page: > > ----------- > > IMPORTANT! Do not use water or oil of any kind on any stone to sharpen > your knife. In fact if you have been using some liquid on your stone, > wipe it off as best you can or get a new stone which has not been > tainted with such a substance. I know this goes against years and years > of trusted advise from friends, fathers, aunts, uncles, grandfathers and > etc.... Trust me on this one. Read the book to find out why this is > true. > > ----------- > > I'm looking around the site now to find out what book they're talking > about, in case anyone here is curious. As for myself, I'm about done > with the subject. I've pissed off enough people for one weekend. > > Ah. Here's the book. From the top of that page: > > "Note: All the following were gleaned from the bible of knife sharpening > called "The Razor Edge Book of Sharpening" by John Juranitch published > by Warner Books" > > Anybody interested, go have fun with it. I don't know this book or > whether it's credible. > > There. I'm done. > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. If it contains that kind of advice it holds no credibility at all..except with the kind of Weekend Warrior "Expert" who buys all his "expertise" at Walden Books and never misses an episode of "This Old House" teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Q: Bobbiting on the lathe From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 18 Jul 2000 02:20:26 GMT -------- Bucky Goldstein wrote: > That slurry (call it whatever) is the problem. You can get a sharper > edge if it's not there. (I wonder whether anyone here will actually > _try_ it.) > I already stated that a dry stone WILL cut faster...But for a limited length of time before the exposed cutting grains become blunted and the pores become jammed with METAL particles. No amount of solvent will remove/restore it's cutting qualities when that happens. You have to physically remove the top layer of the stone to restore its cutting qualities. Good stones are too expensive to waste rapidly with such "quick and dirty" abuse. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Honing Stones - Was Q: Bobbiting on the lathe From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 18 Jul 2000 02:34:23 GMT -------- "Michael P. Henry" wrote: > > What type of stone would you recommend for HSS tool bits? I'm off to J&L > this morning and will be picking up a a boxed set of 4 Norton ultra-fine > hard Arkansas stones (3" long x 1/4" in square, round, and triangular cross > sections). Are these appropriate for home shop use? Their are a > bewildering array of stones available and I haven't a clue of what to use. > > > > > Respectfully, > > > > 8^) > > > > teenut Hmm! It has been a looong time since I bought any new slip stones..for reasons stated in my previous post ;^) The shapes size and type of stones are perfect for a starter set..however the ultra fine grade may be a bit too fine for regular workshop use. I use my ultra fine grades only for final hard fitting of say gun scears or die parts. You might want to start with a medium or fine grade for tool honing and general hard fitting. I have heard good things about "ruby" stones..synthetic hard arkansas if you wish, but I have never used them. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Honing Stones - Was Q: Bobbiting on the lathe From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 18 Jul 2000 02:44:44 GMT -------- Bucky Goldstein wrote: > > "Michael P. Henry" wrote: > > > What type of stone would you recommend for HSS > > tool bits? I'm off to J&L this morning and will > > be picking up a a boxed set of 4 Norton ultra-fine > > hard Arkansas stones (3" long x 1/4" in square, > > round, and triangular cross sections). Are these > > appropriate for home shop use? Their are a > > bewildering array of stones available and I haven't > > a clue of what to use. > > I know you were asking Mr. 'nut, but FWIW: you definitely want to use > those little slipstones dry. I think if he wanted YOUR advice he would have asked for it Bucky. I will thank you NOT to quote or misquote my name with any of your cockamany advice. And while we are on the subject I will also thank you to call me teenut and not some shortened version that implies (wink, wink, nudge, elbow, elbow) that I am less than compus mentis. If you want to get into name calling, I can think of some doozies based on "Bucky Goldsein" Respectfully (for the very last time) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: torque ??? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 18 Jul 2000 02:56:34 GMT -------- Jim Stewart wrote: > Damn right! I've had my speedometers recalibrated in furlongs per > fortnight... Very appropiate for a British car fitted with Lucas electrics. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How to make small rocks out of a BIG rock From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 18 Jul 2000 03:35:52 GMT -------- Don Foreman wrote: > > On Mon, 17 Jul 2000 03:20:57 GMT, Jens wrote: > > >Thanks for all the suggestions so far. A couple of additional points > >.... > > > >I would not survive anything that involves explosives (if the bang > >won't get me the wife will for sure !!) > > > What if someone else does it? I know a guy who has the > patent rights to, and distributes, a tool specificially > intended for splitting big rocks that uses modified 12-gage > shotgun shells. The tool is expensive (>$1K) but you might > find a service in the phone book where someone will come > out, drill a hole and pop the rock for a reasonable fee. > > This is quite different from using HE because the charge in > a shotgun shell is propulsive rather than concussive -- more > like hydrostatic pressure than detonation shockwave. > > I have also heard of some chemical used to split granite. > One packs the hole with it and then gets it wet and it > splits the rock. Probably less compressible (hence more > force) than wet wood. > > If you're interested, I'll email the guy that told me about > it and see if he remembers anything about it. > Regards from Foreman, dforeman@Ugoldengate.net. > Please remove U from email address to reply Millions of tons of rock have been split with wooden wedges..Specifically by drilling a line of holes, banging in DRY wooden wedges..then WETTING the wedges. As the wet wood expands it exerts enormous forces. Another technique, also dating from the stone age, is to light a huge bonfire on or around the rock. Keep it burning a few hours or days, depending on the size of the rock. Then rake away the fire and pour or squirt cold water on the rock. Make sure you do this from a safe, well protected position, as the effect is almost indistinguishable from dynamite. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: opinions wanted: toolposts From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 18 Jul 2000 03:52:36 GMT -------- "DoN. Nichols" wrote: Typically, the > tools which I will need for a given project ride on top of the lahte > headstock, and the rest are stored in a toolbox (until I make a rack for > them.) Or until one of them kills you! I have several "traytop" lathes in my shop..in my honest opinion the manufacture of such lethal features should be banned by law. It has taken a while, and several educational, "Come to Jesus" meetings with my employees, but they all now understand that I will instantly fire any man I find with tools on the top of his lathe headstock. Why? Safety first. I once had to help pack a man's ear in ice before rushing him and his ear to hospital. Luckily the flying micrometer hit a little left of center, so it didn't kill him. Secondly...Any Machinist worthy of the name knows that a heated micrometer is not likely to give an accurate reading. I know how I would feel about giving work to a shop..as a customer..if I toured it and saw such bad practices being tolerated. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Beginner's book on CNC milling ??? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 22 Jul 2000 23:41:25 GMT -------- Pat McGuirk wrote: > > Robert Bastow, > I don't know what to say other than that I am sorry that I offended > you, or any other Robert for that matter. I hope you had read the rest > of this thread to know that I was speaking of Robert Swinney in > particular, and only then because of his answer to John's original > question. I may not always communicate my feelings in the best way, > but I usually don't intend to be rude. I enjoy your posts, appreciate > you sharing your experience, and wish you the best. > Sincerely, > Pat McGuirk > > * Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet's Discussion Network * > The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet - Free! Hey Pat, don't sweat the small stuff!! I take a lot more "offending" than people would have you believe. 8^) Robert (teenut) Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Junkyard Wars From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 00:23:51 GMT -------- John Flanagan wrote: > I live in a university town. I once worked for an aerospace professor > restoring and keeping up his collection of antique british racing > cars. Every hear of Tommy Wisdom Teenut? Never met him personally, but I knew his Uncle Norman..Who turned "Washin' Windows" into an art form. ;^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Junkyard Wars From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 00:53:33 GMT -------- Tom Martin wrote: > > This is a competition where 20/20 hindsight is redundant! > It's motto could be: "Carpe diem" "Carpe diem" ? Fish of the day. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Green metal...is there such a thing? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 01:03:31 GMT -------- "russ@rachis.com" wrote: > > Have been working in metals (mostly silver and gold) for a while now > as a hobby. A friend of mine brought to me the challenge of > constructing a ring for him that was solid green. I have tried Patina's > (they wear off too quickly), Enamels (chip and crack easily), and even > called in a favor and had a copy of the ring cast out of titanium and > anodized! (needless to say, the anodizing does not hold up) What I am > looking for is a metal that is green, through and through, that I can > cast, or carve into a simple ring. > Any help would be AWESOME as I have about reached the end of my rope > with this one! > > Thanks, > Russ > > * Sent from RemarQ http://www.remarq.com The Internet's Discussion Network * > The fastest and easiest way to search and participate in Usenet - Free! What you need is Scottish Gold..Guaranteed to turn green in time for St Patrick's Day. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Boring between centers From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 01:20:03 GMT -------- Bucky Goldstein wrote: > > Bucky Goldstein wrote: > > > - Should it be angled, or square to the axis? If angled, what should be > > the angle? (1/4" HSS bit, CRS bar ~1", cast iron workpiece.) > > In the question above, "it" refers to the cutter, by the way, > not the bar. Sorry I didn't make this clear. > > -- > Bucky Goldstein > > I lost a button hole. The advantage of an angled cutter hole is that you can use a micrometer over the tip of the tool, the opposite side of the bar and a bit of shop math, to set the cutter radius to very precise limits. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: If you've emailed me.... From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 01:26:37 GMT -------- Bucky Goldstein wrote: > > I don't think anyone from here has tried to email me these past > couple of days, but if you have, my apologies. Some incoming > mail got sent to the bit bucket. Problems with the mail server. > If you've mailed me and haven't heard back, please resend. > > Thanks. > > -- > Bucky Goldstein > > I lost a button hole. Ah! That explains why you didn't respond to my offer to send you a Brand New Hardinge Lathe for just the cost of shipping.. Better luck next time. ;^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: New lathe suggestions wanted From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 01:43:35 GMT -------- Keith, If you are only contemplating making two machines a month, you won't live long enough to amortise the capital cost difference (never mind your own time) between buying and tooling up your own machinery and what the machine shop quoted you. Fax me a drawing and specification (Express Tool & Die. Fax 404 792 2668 Attn. Robert Bastow) and I will give you a realistic price for the job. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: gerardi vise for clausing 8520 From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 02:13:47 GMT -------- John Blinka wrote: > > A while back, there was some discussion about > appropriately sized vises for the Clausing 8520 and > complaints about the expense of the 4" Kurt. At > the same time, teenut was expounding on the virtues > of Gerardi. I found out that the 100 mm Gerardi is > less expensive ($495) than the 4" Kurt ($593), so > I ordered one. > Thanks to teenut for making the Gerardi known to me and > for answering questions before I ordered it. > I have just ordered four more Gerardi's for my shop. None of my guys had ever heard of them and were weaned on Kurts. After using the two Gerardi's I initially purchased, they won't use the Kurts anymore!! One word of advice John. The Gerardi's come with minimal instructions. Be sure to back off the jaw holding screws a teensy amount so they can slide down the angled face as you clamp the work piece (you will see what I mean when you do it..both mine came with the jaws clamped solidly) Also, because of this feature be sure to clamp an accurate parallel in the jaws when you mount it on the mill, and tramm along this bar to set the vice accurately in place. Because of the sliding function of the jaws, they may not be, nor do thay need to be, exactly square to the vice when "unloaded" The Gerardi's are made of solid steel, heat treated to 60+ Rc, and ground to less than .0002" limits..in other words, "dead nuts" and interchangeable with any other similar sized Gerardi. No need to buy "CNC Qualified" pairs of vices, at extra cost, as with other makes. The fact that they are also lower priced is just an added bonus. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Most impressive lot of tooling... From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 02:34:34 GMT -------- I arrived back from my vacation to be able to load the pictures of this lathe. My assumption is that "the different saddle layout" includes a saddle hand wheel mounted on the right hand side..rather than the customary (in the US) left hand side of the saddle. This is standard layout for a gap bed lathe because the bed rack is shorter than on a straight bed. It is also standard on many English and European straight bed lathes and preferred by many because it keeps the "saddle hand" out of the way of flying hot chips. Most non-US trained machinists are ambidextrous when it comes to operating lathes. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: SB 13 inch lathe spindle nose dims? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 02:50:09 GMT -------- mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article <17t2ns8a5n5ir34ga8k2kpomvjeo1c2l75@4ax.com>, > John Stevenson wrote: > > > Nope - no me. > > I think the original discussion was with Bob Bastow who wrote this. > > IIRC Robert weighed in on the other side of the issue. That the > threads alone were not sufficient to do the job. > > Jim S'right. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: FS Tool and cutter grinding shop From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 04:29:35 GMT -------- bcotton wrote: > Contact me and I will put you in contact with the widow. Is she rich? ;^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: *^%$ ENCO rant,ENCO REPLIES From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 04:36:47 GMT -------- David wrote: > > What I can`t quite understand is how UPS manages to damage 70+ lb vises? I > could see a problem if it were mason jars filled with rocks...... Or lose a 170# Rotary Table (the box was delivered empty, clearly marked "Heavy" and the weight, by a UPS man who held it out to me at arms length! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Need a ruling From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 04:53:04 GMT -------- Chris Sypolt wrote: > > Greetings to all - > > I've been lurking for a while, and hesitate even to post this, but I was > curious about what the group's view was of commercially-related messages > being posted to the group. The last thing I want to do is tick off one my > company's primary markets, but from reading your posts I'm pretty convinced > that there's a pretty good match in what you as a group do and what my > company we does. > > At any rate, I'm glad to hear your suggestions and comments about whether or > not I should even try this. > > Chris Sypolt Chris, In my opinion (I cannot speak for the group) a short post, outlining your products/services, a pointer to your web site (if you have one) and a willingness to answer questions honestly, will be welcomed here. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Need a ruling From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 04:57:32 GMT -------- Bob May wrote: > BTW, you are probably accessing about 1000 persons on this NG at the > most. Ah, but what a superbly talented, intelligent, influential and modest group of people they are! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Need a ruling From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 05:06:20 GMT -------- Bob May wrote: > > My thumb isn't always exact and it does have a large spread in it. > Personally, the big posters would need to get something real special > to actually do a buy from a mailorder place. OTOH, I own a busy and rapidly growing Tool, Die, Mold and Production machine shop and am actively looking for alternative material suppliers.. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How are watch parts made? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 13:23:19 GMT -------- "Dr. Rev Chuck, MD, PA" wrote: > > MP Toolman wrote: > > > > This method was used in colonial times (and probably before) to make lead shot > > for shotguns. I have seen a stone tower somewhere in NewEngland which was > > built just for this purpose. > > Baltimore's Shot Tower still stands. Lead shot is still..or was until quite recently, made in Shot Towers. There is..or was until recently..a working shot tower in Ancaster, Ontario, Canada. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Aciera F3 mill? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 13:50:25 GMT -------- Brian Drummond wrote: > > On Sat, 22 Jul 2000 02:00:42 -0400, Doug Warner > wrote: > > > > >While searching the metalworking boards, I found this picture of a > >really nice looking small mill: > > > > http://www.lathes.co.uk/aciera/index.html > > >(As if I could actually afford even a used one :-) > In North America you are more likely to find a Deckel FP1 at an affordable price. See: http://www.lathes.co.uk/deckel/index.html This is the actual Mill I purchased for my home shop for $2150.00..on Ebay!! (See the credits on the photos) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Junkyard Wars rules From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 14:02:55 GMT -------- Tom Martin wrote: > > Your forebears must have been annoyed! Anyway you Yanks always > shortchange yourselves with those suds that you insist adorn > your beer glasses! > > Tom > > Dick Brewster wrote: > > > > In article <397A6532.FC1EB32D@vom.com>, jack@vom.com says... > > > Tom Martin wrote: > > > > > > > > Best you read carefully what the OED said, Jack, then > > > > you'll see the real irony! > > > > > > > > Tom > > > > > > Is it that the British themselves changed the original spelling from > > > aluminum to aluminium? I got that point on the first reading. > > > > > > Maybe this is like the deal where my wife says "don't you notice > > > anything new?" and from that point on I know that no matter how hard I > > > look I will not find whatever it is I am supposed to have already seen. > > > > > > > > > > The problem is that the British have no sense of tradition. The use the > > Imperial gallon, something they came up with in the mid 19th century so they > > could have bigger pints of beer, while we use the smaller traditional Queen > > Annes's gallon that goes back to 1707. Hmmm, maybe they are smarter than we > > are. > > > > Dick > > > > -- > > username. dbrewste > > domain. mindspring.com At the insistance of my wife, I now grit my teeth and remain silent every time I go into a "British Pub", order a pint, and am served 12 or less ounces of beer in a 16oz glass. My local "British Pub" (owned by an Ex-Pat Brit) serves a full 20oz pint in imported British pint glasses. (after I scared off every bartender they hired for a few months!!) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: If you've emailed me.... From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 14:07:00 GMT -------- Robert Swinney wrote: > > Teeheenut, > I responded. Where's my Hardinge? > Bob Swinney > "Robert Bastow" wrote in message > news:397A4A6E.F9D05A9C@Nospamhotmail.com... > > Bucky Goldstein wrote: > > > > > > I don't think anyone from here has tried to email me these past > > > couple of days, but if you have, my apologies. Some incoming > > > mail got sent to the bit bucket. Problems with the mail server. > > > If you've mailed me and haven't heard back, please resend. > > > > > > Thanks. > > > > > > -- > > > Bucky Goldstein > > > > > > I lost a button hole. > > > > Ah! > > > > That explains why you didn't respond to my offer to send you a Brand New > > Hardinge Lathe for just the cost of shipping.. > > > > Better luck next time. > > > > ;^) > > > > teenut Er!..I guess I had the same problem as Bucky. Better luck next time huh! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Most impressive lot of tooling... From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 14:11:03 GMT -------- Robert Bastow wrote: > > I arrived back from my vacation to be able to load the pictures of this lathe. That should have read.."too late to be able to download the pictures" teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Keyless chucks a problem on cordless drills? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 14:31:44 GMT -------- Bill Lewis wrote: > > I'm tempted to by a Dewalt 18 volt cordless drill but > I'm concerned about the keyless chuck. > > Do these things really grip properly? > > Bill Yes. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: If you've emailed me.... From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 14:38:40 GMT -------- Miles Jaffe wrote: > > > I responded. Where's my Hardinge? > > I got mine, delivered by the nut himself. The reflection off his highly > polished dome nearly blinded me. > > You should see the two babes he's got to move the equipment for him. Lean and > mean, and they KNOW how to handle a Johnson bar. They were wearing these > little overalls that weren't much more than hot pants with suspenders ... I > forgot to ask if they're the same ones that apply the dome wax. > > BTW, teenut - I'm still waiting for the tooling package ... > > -- Don't hold yer breathe..The babes are busy polishing my dome..and it ain't done with wax! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Keyless chucks a problem on cordless drills? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 15:26:48 GMT -------- Jeff Pack wrote: > > My experience would differ from such a resounding yes... > > But it all depends on bit condition, and what you are drilling. > > Personally, I'd be happier with a key'd chuck.. > > Robert Bastow wrote in message > news:397B026D.67270893@Nospamhotmail.com... > > Bill Lewis wrote: > > > > > > I'm tempted to by a Dewalt 18 volt cordless drill but > > > I'm concerned about the keyless chuck. > > > > > > Do these things really grip properly? > > > > > > Bill > > > > Yes. > > > > teenut He asked specifically about the Dewalt 18V. I have one, and I am very pleased with its performance..including the keyless chuck. On the subject of keyless chucks in general..obviously the performance varies with quality. However, in my experience, a high quality, keyless chuck will out-perform and out-last a similar quality, keyed chuck. Because it grips tighter there is far less damage done to drill shanks..less spinning and scoring of shank and jaws..with a consequent increase in accurate life of both. There is no chuck key to fiddle with, lose, or have "chucked" at you. Speed of changes is a not-unimportant feature in a commercial machine shop, and I am in the process of changing all my keyed chucks over to keyless, as quickly as I can. teenut. ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Most impressive lot of tooling... From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 15:30:01 GMT -------- mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article <397AFD95.6E22AFF@Nospamhotmail.com>, > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > .."too late to be able to download the pictures" > > Not to worry Robert. It was only some junky 'like-new' HLV > that went for $150.... > > Jim ....Sounds of barfing, off stage, center. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Need a ruling From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 15:31:27 GMT -------- mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article <8l5hsv$ano$1@izalco.d-and-d.com>, > dnichols@d-and-d.com (Donald Nichols) wrote: > > > Mulligan was the most prolific at 93, > > Hmm. Must be some mistake. Perhaps I had better start cutting > back a bit. > > Oh. Robert was not present for a good bit of that time, I believe. > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. He's back, to trim yer wick if the flame gets too high. ;^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Keyless chucks a problem on cordless drills? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 15:39:07 GMT -------- MP Toolman wrote: > > The biggest gripe I have about the keyless chucks they install on portable > drills is that the plastic or rubber outer sleeve is big and bulky. Take it off!...Or grind it off on the first tight, wall corner you drill into. It is only there for amateur pansy palms anyway. The absence of it does not affect the gripping power of the chuck..it is self actuating. It just makes the UN-Tightening a bit easier for said pansy palms. 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Junkyard Wars rules From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 18:19:11 GMT -------- John Flanagan wrote: > > On Sun, 23 Jul 2000 14:02:55 GMT, Robert Bastow > wrote: > > >> > domain. mindspring.com > > > >At the insistance of my wife, I now grit my teeth and remain silent every time I > >go into a "British Pub", order a pint, and am served 12 or less ounces of beer > >in a 16oz glass. > > > >My local "British Pub" (owned by an Ex-Pat Brit) serves a full 20oz pint in > >imported British pint glasses. (after I scared off every bartender they hired > >for a few months!!) > > Do they have yards of beer too? Is that a British thing or what? > > John They did, until the last one got broken about six months ago (Yanks can't handle 'em) Now, for the time being, we are stuck with half-yards..made of plastic!!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Junkyard Wars From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 18:23:02 GMT -------- John Flanagan wrote: > > On Sun, 23 Jul 2000 00:23:51 GMT, Robert Bastow > wrote: > > >John Flanagan wrote: > > > >> I live in a university town. I once worked for an aerospace professor > >> restoring and keeping up his collection of antique british racing > >> cars. Every hear of Tommy Wisdom Teenut? > > > >Never met him personally, but I knew his Uncle Norman..Who turned "Washin' > >Windows" into an art form. > > The way I worded my post was misleading. Tommy Wisdom won the 1932 > Alpine Cup driving the 1932 MG L2 Magna (assuming I remember the name > correctly) that I took care of for the Professor. I thought if you > had been into racing before leaving England you might of heard of him. > (Now I'm not trying to make a joke here :^) ). > > John Yes I have heard of Tommy Wisdom..the Famous Racing Driver..Never heard of Tommy Wisdom the Aerospace Prof though. I still prefer Norman Wisdom though. 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Aciera F3 mill? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 23 Jul 2000 18:26:13 GMT -------- "Fitch R. Williams" wrote: > > mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > >Here's a poor man's deckel: > > > >http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=382477413 > > > >I always thought these were cute. This early version has no overarm > >support, but for a home hobby shop, it could do some nice work. > > You better hope the wood workers don't see it - that would make a > great slot mortiser. > > Fitch > In So. Cal. Go wash your mouth out Fitch! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What is it with the Brits!!? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 00:10:45 GMT -------- "[©ØMMÄÑУ®]" wrote: Hey, I'm an impulsive 18 year-old!) You are right on track for your age Robin. Anyone under 25 who is not a socialist/liberal, has no heart. Anyone over twentyfive who is not a conservative, has no brains. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Thoughts on Concorde crash From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 03:38:18 GMT -------- Tom Martin wrote: > > They did actually build 14 but crashing one at the Paris Air Show Trying to emulate a fly-by..by a Concorde! BTW. The Concorde was a Joint Venture by the BRITISH and the French..engines by Rolls-Royce. The US 'equivalent' was not the Valkyrie, but the SST that was killed by Congress. The US then banned the Concorde's from landing in the US for several years..hoping to kill the Concord too. Sour Grapes as usual. I watched prototype 002 take off from Bristol in the UK and managed to get a flight back from Bahrain to London on a BA Concorde. SMOOOOTH! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Thoughts on Concorde crash From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 27 Jul 2000 12:01:04 GMT -------- John Flanagan wrote: > > On Thu, 27 Jul 2000 03:38:18 GMT, Robert Bastow > wrote: > > >I watched prototype 002 take off from Bristol in the UK and managed to get a > >flight back from Bahrain to London on a BA Concorde. SMOOOOTH! > > Did you get to see the black sky and the curvature of the earth? I don't recall seeing that or having it brought to my attention. Maybe wedidn't go high enough (50,000 feet). Anyway, I was too busy sipping free Champagne and marvelling at the totally smooth and uneventful transition through mach 1.0 and beyond. Way to Fly! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Big dowel pins, where do I get one? From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 12:08:06 GMT -------- VAntonova wrote: > > I'm having a hell of a time finding a 1.4975" by 4" long dowel pin. Tried just > about evertything, no luck. > > Here's some background on the problem. A month ago I moved about 60,000 pounds > of machine tools about 60 miles and unloaded them in a gravel yard with my > little 5000lbs Alice-Chalmers lift. All was well until I saw pieces of a > spherical bearing falling out of the rear. > > Turns out two large spherical bearings support the rear end. They are pressed > on the dowel pins which in turn are pressed into the rear axle forging. One of > the bearings broke up, and the pin started rubbing on the bearing retainer and > got badly buggered up. I took the whole mess apart and threw all the broken and > worn parts into a box. Then I machined out the dowel pin and proceeded to hunt > up the parts. > > I found everything except the damn dowel pin without having to go to KK Kalmar > (they own what used to the the A-C forklift division). But no luck on the dowel > pin. Tried about 25 bearing, industrial supply, fastener, power transmission, > etc. houses from Oakland to San Jose, no luck. Tried Western tool, Rutland, > MSC, Grainger, McMaster, etc. No luck. > > The pin was hardened like a dowel pin (found that out while cutting). It looked > like a dowel pin. Even had the spiral groove for air to escape. And the bearing > house that got me the spherical bearings said they were meant to be placed on a > dowel pin, but Torrington doesn't make pins for their bearings. > > So, anyone got any ideas? I don't want to go through Kalmar as they are not too > interested in supporting a 30 year old A-C machine, and the dowel pin was > probably not considered a replacable part. > > BTW anyone know of an easy way to retrofit an isochronic (I hope I'm using the > word correctly, I'm trying to say constant RPM) govenor onto the 4-cyl > Continental flathead in the lift? I considered using a servo amp, a geared DC > motor and a tach-generator, and using a welding pedal (potentiometer linked to > pedal) to provide the velocity referance to the servo amp. Sounds like a lot of > work, but not like rebuilding the rear axle, steering linkage and steering > hydraulics is a piece of cake. > > Thanks for any help. > > Alex. Ifr the bearings are pressed onto the "dowel Pin" it probably doesn't need to be hardened. I suggest you replace it with a chunk of mild steel or hydraulic cylinder shafting. It will probably last a very long tom and be easier to replace next time. The use of a spiral groved, hardened pin in this application smells of an OEM change over from a plain, bushed bearing to a ballbearing arrangement at some time during the life of the design. The pin is a holdover to use up existing stocks. FWIW teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Holdridge radius cutter From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 12:13:30 GMT -------- Grant Erwin wrote: > > Anyone know if a Model 4 Holdridge radius cutter can work on a 9" South > Bend lathe? > > Grant Erwin > Kirkland, Washington > > -----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =----- > http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! > -----== Over 80,000 Newsgroups - 16 Different Servers! =----- Bit on the big side Grant..though all things are possible! I acquired one when I bought the Tool & Die shop and have set it aside for use at home on my 11" Maximat. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Big dowel pins, where do I get one? From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 28 Jul 2000 23:43:50 GMT -------- On re-reading your original post and other suggestions..Comtact me off list with your address..I may be able to scare up a couple of die set pins that will meet your exact requirements. Cost of shipping only. teenut@hotmaildotcom. teenut who previously wrote: > The use of a spiral groved, hardened pin in this application smells of an OEM > change over from a plain, bushed bearing to a ballbearing arrangement at some > time during the life of the design. The pin is a holdover to use up existing > stocks. > > FWIW > > teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: ?????? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 29 Jul 2000 08:50:14 GMT -------- "Fitch R. Williams" wrote: > > Dan Caster wrote: > > >Maybe this isn't what he was trying to say, but that is how I read it. > >And I think that some others read it that way. > > Dan > > Me too as a matter of fact. > > Fitch > In So. Cal. > > The FAQ for RCM is: http://w3.uwyo.edu/~metal > Metal Web News at http://www.metalwebnews.com > The "Drop Box" is at http://www.metalworking.com/ Me too. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: ?????? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 29 Jul 2000 09:01:46 GMT -------- "Fitch R. Williams" wrote: > > > BTW has any one out ther ever built any Floating Boreing Bars or Reamers > >?. l woul give odds that Tee Nut has. > > I confess I don't even know what one is! > Af loating reamer (or tap) holder comprises three main parts: the lead end has a morse taper socket and has an acurately ground flange at its rear end. This fits into a shallow socket, formed on the shank of the holder where it is closely retained by a disc and two or three through bolts or a circlip. Some are as simple as two parts..each with a flange that are held together with a couple of bolts The idea is that the reamer is free to float AXIALLY but not Radially..this is in order to take up misalignment between tailstock and spindle center without which a bell shaped reamed hole will result. No, I have never made one..Lots of 'em cheap on Ebay. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: ?????? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 30 Jul 2000 00:42:11 GMT -------- Jack Erbes wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > Some are as simple as two parts..each with a flange that are held together with > > a couple of bolts > > > > The idea is that the reamer is free to float AXIALLY but not Radially..this is > > in order to take up misalignment between tailstock and spindle center without > > which a bell shaped reamed hole will result. > > Am I confused here? I think my floating reamer holder (acquired for > chambering rifle barrels) floats radially not axially. To allow for > axial misalignment of course. > > Or did teenut salt the metalworking content mine with an intentional > error to see if anyone really reads it? > > -- > Jack in Sonoma, CA, USA (jack@vom.com) Yes you are correct, as usual Jack..Brain Fart! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Enco 6" Mill Vise From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 30 Jul 2000 17:03:40 GMT -------- John Jacobs wrote: > > Anyone out there have an Enco Kurt clone? Enco has them for $114.00 My > Bridgeport comes tomorrow and I need a vise quick. I realize you get > what you pay for but if it is not that bad please let me know. Thanks in > advance. > John Jacobs Avoid it like the plague! I needed one in a hurry for the shop..it lasted a week and is now useless. Save up and buy a Gerardi! Cheaper and better than a Kurt. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Enco 6" Mill Vise From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 31 Jul 2000 00:18:06 GMT -------- Edward Haas wrote: > > --Unfamiliar with Gerardi. Where do you get them?? > > -- > "Steamboat Ed" Haas : Success without failure > Watch link rot in action! : teaches nothing useful... > http://www.nmpproducts.com > ---Decks a-wash in a sea of words--- Travers Tools teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Headstock bearing ? on Myford ML7 From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 31 Jul 2000 00:24:48 GMT -------- brownnsharp@my-deja.com wrote: > > My Myford ML7 lathe manual, by Ian Bradley, circa 1973 shows the ML7 to > have a conical bearing much like a jewelers lathe for the bearing toward > the chuck. The bearing is tightened by movng the spindle back and fourth > using the nuts on the rear bearings, which are shown as double ball > bearings. > I presume the shim is between the conical bearing and headstock > casting. If the bearing adjustments are a little shy of having enough > range to adjust the play out of the conical bearing, a shim might help. > It is also possible that something inside the headstock (gears, housing > etc) might just hit the casting when rotating unless the spindle is > adjusted a little towards the tailstock. There is no shim shown in the > headstock diagram in Bradley's manual, which is not a Myford Official > Document, but more of an amateur machinist publication The ML7 Has capped , plain bearings, shim adjusted. The Super 7 has the conical bronze front bearing with angular contact bearings at the rear. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Aluminum pan handle repair From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 02 Aug 2000 11:46:42 GMT -------- Mark Kinsler wrote: > > Hokay, here's a question for the metallurgy crowd: a cool old > cast-aluminum saucepan (Majestic Ware, I think) has a broken handle. > There's a steel rod with an eye formed at one end. The other end is > attached to the pan casting, but precisely how it is attached is not > clear. A wooden handle fits around the steel rod. > > The rod is broken and it's not safe to repair. If I can get the broken > end out of the pan, I can make a new one, but getting the old end out is > the problem. If it's threaded into there, it's completely jammed and > corroded into place. > > But what it really looks like is that the rod is cemented in place with an > unknown, presumably heat-proof cement. The alternatives seem to be to > chisel the old cement out, if possible, and epoxy a new rod in place, or > figure out that the old rod is really threaded in place and try to unscrew > it, or just cut off the old rod short, drill it out, tap the resultant > hole and screw in a new rod, or something. > > Does anyone have any ideas? > > steel rod fits into sort of a socket in the cast aluminum pan. It was > broken when someone tried to tighten the handle by twisting it. > > | > | > V ___________________ > O-----------]_ | > | | > | | > | | > |_________________| > > > Mark Kinsler > > -- > New Address after August 3, 2000: > 512 E. Mulberry St. Lancaster, Ohio USA 43130 > Voice: 740.687.6368 Fax: 740.687.6108 > Home of the "How Things Work" engineering education program. The steel rod was probably formed with a flanged end or some such..and cast into place in the pan. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: SB lathe sure seemed cheap on ebay:Was ended early why? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 03 Aug 2000 14:37:58 GMT -------- Ttools@ix.netcom.com wrote: > > One thing that is strange if you look, is that auction was ended early, > which had to be done by the seller. Since the seller never canceled the > bidders bids he is still obligated to sell to the high bidder. Nothing > wrong with ending early but very strange. > Tom > > http://cgi.ebay.com/aw-cgi/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=396431931 > > mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > > In article <39887A3D.D5F007E7@artsci.wustl.edu>, > > Jon Elson wrote: > > > > > The above misspelling and proximity to a CT address might make > > > people fear this is yet another Al Babin clone, although I don't > > really > > > think it is. > > > > Nor do I, although the thought crossed my mind. > > > > There are a lot of bids on the auction - but there were two items. > > Some of the usual characters bid on the auction. > > The comment about the mill not running is very much *not* > > like Al. All his stuff is in 'excellent' shape. > > The photos were not like al's - they were quite clear and > > well done. > > I've never seen the windows in the background in any of Al's > > other auctions. Nor was the background obscured, as most of > > his present auctions seem now. > > > > But like you say, who knows? He may have connections with > > other dealers, and they may be passing items back and forth. > > > > Jim > > > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > > Before you buy. It is possible that someone emailed him directly with an offer he couldn't refuse. I have done this a couple of times myself. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: self darkeing helmets from Harbor Freight From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 03 Aug 2000 14:41:50 GMT -------- Bruce Simpson wrote: > > On Tue, 01 Aug 2000 19:05:51 GMT, filmo@bellsouth.net (Roger Duncan) > wrote: > > >I broke a eardrum when I was 8. They put somthing in my ear calling it > >a bridge might of been plastic. Now eardrum has grown back and doctor > >can't tell eardrum was broken. Hearing tests as good as most people. I > >have very slite ringing only really notice it when taking ear test. > >They now can even replace hammer and stirrup. > > I had a burst eardrum a couple of years ago (due to an infection) -- > my hearing in that ear was out of whack for about a month but it > returned to normal without any kind of surgery or intervention (other > than the antibiotics). > > --------------------------------- > Don't send email to me, send a Memo.to me > http://memo.to/BruceSimpson > Memo.to, your email firewall, stops junk email dead! Same thing happened to me as a teenager..infection leading to a perforated eardrum. Antibiotics cured it, docters can detect a scar even now, and my hearing in that ear is a teensie bit less acute than the other. Otherwise, no long term effects. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: single shot rifle (is it legal?) From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 03 Aug 2000 14:52:44 GMT -------- Jack Erbes wrote: > > I have lost touch with it to some extent (my FFL expired in 1996 and was > not renewed) but I think that .50 caliber is now the largest fixed > ammunition centerfire rifle that can be legally owned by the average > citizen. Not so, it is perfectly legal to own, build, shoot or sell any rifle that is not fully automatic (a "Machine Gun") in any caliber over .500" that is LISTED by the ATF. These calibers include .577" .600" and .700" Nitro Express. I am currently building a pre-production prototype Mauser Type bolt action in .577 3 1/4" Nitro Express. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT: "Bodger"?? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 03 Aug 2000 22:26:54 GMT -------- Edward Haas wrote: > > --Can someone in the UK define the term "bodger"?? Just curious... > :-) > > -- > "Steamboat Ed" Haas : Success without failure > Watch link rot in action! : teaches nothing useful... > http://www.nmpproducts.com > ---Decks a-wash in a sea of words--- A Bodger is a chairmaker..specifically windsor chairs made in a forest clearing from unseasoned beech using axe, adze and pole lathe. However, modern terminology refers to a rough and ready "attack" on the job in hand..a corruption of "Botcher" as in a Botched job. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT: "Bodger"?? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 03 Aug 2000 22:28:12 GMT -------- Tom Martin wrote: > > DGONZ! > YESSSSS! Bless 'im teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: single shot rifle (is it legal?) From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 04 Aug 2000 01:28:49 GMT -------- Jack Erbes wrote: > > Gary Coffman wrote: > > > Except for some curios and relics (and muzzleloaders), any rifle over > > .50 cal is classed as a destructive device and requires a special tax > > stamp to make or transfer. > > So the stuff over 50 caliber that BATF backed off on was the stuff that > was historically well documented as not modern/and or other than > military stuff. The .700 Nitro Express is a recent development by Holland and Holland. ;^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: self darkeing helmets from Harbor Freight From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 04 Aug 2000 07:23:42 GMT -------- Gunner wrote: >I find myself lip reading most women.. Sometimes I wish I had a hearing aid that I could turn off!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: single shot rifle (is it legal?) From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 04 Aug 2000 07:26:30 GMT -------- Bob May wrote: > > Woof, something like that would just go through a Bradley! And it's > legal to build one? Make mine with a 8' barrel of some good steel and > I'll put enough large grain blackpowder to put that round through a > column of Bradleys. Why? Ever heard of "Chobham" armor? teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: single shot rifle (is it legal?) From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 04 Aug 2000 07:38:39 GMT -------- Jack Erbes wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > The .700 Nitro Express is a recent development by Holland and Holland. > > > > ;^) > > > > teenut > > The story I have on the 700 Nitro Express was that it was developed in > 1988 for and/or by Bell (or Bell Basic Brass fame) for a gun to be built > by H&H. > Kind of makes me wonder it BATF knows the story. According to "Cartridges of the World" 8th edition, page 339 it was indeed developed by Jim Bell at Bell Labs. at the behest of William Felstein of Beverly hills. > > I was thinking BATF might have blessed it because it sounded to them > like another of the old timers or a descendent thereof. Have they > approved your building any of the three you mentioned? Including the > 700? > One doesn't require BATF permission to build any kind of manually operated firearm..provided it is not for resale, or on their proscribed list of destructive devices. I am currently seeking an ATF Manufacturers licence for bolt actions so that I CAN manufacture and SELL them. None of the calibers I mention present any problem so far as that is concerned. > -- > Jack in Sonoma, CA, USA (jack@vom.com) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Thoughts on Concorde crash, and Russian SST From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 04 Aug 2000 07:44:07 GMT -------- PLAlbrecht wrote: > > > > >P.S.: In Canada any and all prize monies are tax free! > >Wolfgang > > > > Wait, let me guess... first prize is a one-way ticket to Buffalo? Second prize is a two way ticket. teenut > > Pete ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: single shot rifle (is it legal?) From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 04 Aug 2000 11:33:20 GMT -------- John Flanagan wrote: > > On Fri, 04 Aug 2000 07:26:30 GMT, Robert Bastow > wrote: > > >Bob May wrote: > >> > >> Woof, something like that would just go through a Bradley! And it's > >> legal to build one? Make mine with a 8' barrel of some good steel and > >> I'll put enough large grain blackpowder to put that round through a > >> column of Bradleys. > > > >Why? > > > >Ever heard of "Chobham" armor? > > No what is it? Composite armor, developed by the British at Chobham, currently used on Abrams tanks and Bradleys. Will stop most projectiles or hollow charges. teenut ======== Newsgroups: alt.machines.cnc,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Glass scales versus encoders?? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 06 Aug 2000 11:13:28 GMT -------- Jon Elson wrote: > > Gary wrote: > > > Hi James, > > > > I'm not sure where you get your information from > > James but this makes no sense at all and even sounds > > pretty silly. Stretching ball screws? Which "high end" > > machine tool builders are you refering to that do this? > > I think many of them do this. Another advantage is that > applying tension with axially constraining bearings at both > ends reduces 'whipping' of the screws, which is a problem at > the high rapid feed rates machines are running today. > A number of machines also have hollow ballscrews, and > coolant or temperature stabilized oil is run through them. > They do this in the spindle head, too, flooding the entire > head with a flowing temperature stabilizing fluid, to prevent > thermal deflection of the machine head. > > Jon My new Fadal 4016 4 axis CNC machining center has these same features. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Myford ML7 rising block studs, help needed UK. From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 06 Aug 2000 11:26:06 GMT -------- MikeT wrote: > > I took the plunge and bought a 1956 ML7 which seems to have little wear > and has from the amounts I have been digging out from everywhere been > used for woodturning for a number of years. > > It came on a chip tray attached to a sturdy wooden bench, unfortunatly > for me the rising block studs go thro the chip tray and into the wooden > bench top but are too short to have ever been bolted thro. > > I would like to use studding of the same thread in place of the original > studs, but 50mm longer. This would allow me to bolt down right thro and > maybe also have 2 sections of angle iron under the bench top, drilled > and fitted to the riser studs as a sort of belt and braces to try and > keep everything more in line. > > So, my problem is where do I get some lengths of studding the right > thread size (is it 5/16 BSF??). > > I have no way of exactly sizing the thread and am relying on sombody who > knows chipping in with that info, but the original studs are 4" long and > I need them 6" long. > > Would anyone like to please identify the thread and point me to a > supplier of the correct studding. > > Many thanks. > > Mike. Surely you jest Mike! You have an ML7 and now you want to BUY studding? Got a handbook for the lathe? Look up "Screwcutting" ;^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Parting tool use and questions? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 06 Aug 2000 11:39:24 GMT -------- Robert Swinney wrote: > Here's the catch: Parting is "supposed" to be done at a slower speed than > ordinary lathe work - the experts say this - I am not sure why they say > "slower" Probably because the "Experts" learned from other "Experts" who learned from books written by "Experts" who had only ever parted off in a lathe fitted with a "Lantern" style tool post. "Down the wibbly-wobbly way", so to speak. More unmitigated crap is written by "Experts" on this subject, than on any other aspect of lathe usage. I suggest you do a Deja search..some sound advice HAS been offered on this NG many times in the past. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Parting tool use and questions? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 06 Aug 2000 12:33:17 GMT -------- raweich@my-deja.com wrote: > > In article <39904602.5162246@news.yellowhammer.com>, > chipmkr@hotmail.com wrote: > > I have never given any thought to using a parting tool, as everyone I > > know always shys away from their use, and goes to the saw, makes the > > cut and then uses the lathe to face the sawed face. I broke mine out > > and figured since I bought it, may as well give it a try...I use an > > ALoris BXA tool post, and have a ISCAR parting tool blade > > holder....which takes the standard 1/8" HSS parting tool. > > > > I then tried using the power feed, and viola...no chatter, and it made > > the chips come off in a tight unending coiled piece of metal, just > > like what you get if you opened a can of spam with those metal keys. > > Is this the way the parting tool shold make chips. I had a notch > > ground in the end for a chip breaker, but it just made nice tight > > curls, and a super finish. I did use water soluable cutting fluid, > > during the process. I was cutting 1 1/8" roundstock with a 1/2" bore. > > Foxeye > > > > Sounds like you are on the right path and you are getting some good > advise here from the group. The one thing I would add is on lathes that > have the Aloris style tool holder. The first thing I do is put the > parting tool in and line the parting tool. Even if I am not going to > use it on the job I am doing, because on the next job I might. It's a > real pain to have stops set and go to part and find the tool isn't > lined up. Then it's setting up everything all over again. I usually > line up the parting tool to the face of the chuck or chuck jaw. Which > ever is the easyist to see. > It's really funny that the parting tool use has taken over as being > the black art that no one seems to understand. I remember the time when > every one thought that way about CNC. > Just remember to keep your material as close to the chuck as you can > to reduce the flexing of your material. Also keep your parting tool as > short as possible which makes it more rigid and reduses chatter. > > Richard W. > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. Sound advice from Richard..to which I would add this: Most people treat the pre-ground HSS parting blades as a finished tool, ready for use. It is NOT! No more than a ground, square, HSS tool bit is a ready to use tool. Parting tools NEED side clearance. This must be ground into the blade before use. When re-sharpening has reduced the length of useable blade below the radius of the piece to be parted off..start again! Snap or grind off the short end and regrind side clearance on a new section. Fer Chrissakes..new blades are cheap enough to buy! Lets belay all this crap about whether the blade should be at, above or below center. ANY and EVERY lathe tool should be set at dead center height..PERIOD. If you get better results by not doing so..you are doing something WRONG and need to re-examine the geometry of your tool bit. Unless you are parting off SMALL diameters, and wish to reduce or eliminate the center "Pip", the nose of the tool should be ground SQUARE to the body. Any angle to the nose will, invariably, deflect the blade to one side, during deep cuts..resulting in binding, rough finish, non-flat surfaces or breakage. More importantly, an angled cutting edge produces a chip WIDER than the slot..how the hell do you expect this to escape freely from the cut? Better, even than a square grind, is a slight radius, or as I use a broad "Vee" shape to the nose..This flows the chip in on itself, producing chips that are noticeably narrower than the cut and which clear the slot easily. If you want to add belt to suspenders, use a tiny mounted point to grind a shallow, radiused groove LENGTHWISE in the top face of the tool. Examine a carbide, inserted parting tool tip, to get an idea of the best geometry to achieve. Chatter is reduced by INCREASING feed! Power feed will give best results. Rigidity of the entire set up is next to Godliness! Lock all slides not in use. Normal cutting speeds are the rule..Reduce ONLY if your rigidity is suspect. Reduce overhang to a minimum..both in the tool setup and the workpiece. Avoid Lantern type tool posts and Armstrong tool holders like the plague. Especially the angled parting tool holders..the worst abomination ever foisted on unsuspecting machinists. If you can't afford a rigid tool post..MAKE one! Rear mounted toolposts have definite advantages..Deflection of the tool or workpiece tends to lift the cutting edge OUT of the cut, rather than forcing it deeper...this by dint of the geometry involved. Mounting the parting tool upside down, in the front tool post, and running in revers, has the same effect. This same arrangement works wonders with broad form tools too. Part off as close to the chuck as possible. If a long overhang is unavoidable, or the parted off piece is relatively long..use GENTLE pressure from the tailstock to prevent whipping and chatter. Remove this just before final breakthrough or you may get a jam up. Judicious use of a fixed steady, a wedge of wood 'twixt toolpost and job, or, (dare I say it,) a well lubed hand, (NO GLOVES PLEASE!!) will also help to reduce chatter in these circumstances. Lubrication is a MUST except on free cutting brass and MAYBE good grades of grey iron. Drip feed or flood lubrication..matters not. Just bear in mind that a happy parting tool sounds like frying bacon. The instant it starts sounding grouchy..add more lube. Happy partings.. 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: propane tank conversion? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 06 Aug 2000 12:48:28 GMT -------- Quick, easy, test anyone can set up to test the strength of a 100 lb propane tank as a vacuum tank. Empty tank (yeah really!!!) add a cupful or so of water. Boil the water in the tank and when the interior is purged by steam, plug the tank and allow to cool. As the steam condenses, a high vacuum will be formed ( a principle used by James Watt!!) If the tank isn't strong enough it will collapse (it won't!!) I suspect the same effect is achieved when the rate of extraction of propane vapor from a tank is such that it freezes (something I frequently do if I run my 1 1/2 million BTU propane forge burner too long and hard) Never seen a tank collapse under those circumstances. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: single shot rifle From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 06 Aug 2000 12:56:24 GMT -------- "jheadley@centralva.net" wrote: > > Mike Rehmus wrote: > > > Guys around here build 50 Cal single-shot target rifles. Ed Hass has a 20 > > mm barrel that I guess he will turn into a single shot. Think one has to > > have shoulder insurance to fire one though. > > > > pmenace wrote in message > > news:0d8f36c7.ca77b8fd@usw-ex0103-019.remarq.com... > > > Where is a good place to find a set of plans for a single shot > > > rifle. Thanks Pete Ashton > > > > > > > > > ----------------------------------------------------------- > > > > > > Got questions? Get answers over the phone at Keen.com. > > > Up to 100 minutes free! > > > http://www.keen.com > > > > > since people have the capability to make guns out of metalworking tools, do > they need to register the machines in the socialist countries such as england, > canada, and australia? Just wondering. Of course you know what happens after > you register them, the government will come to your house and confiscate your > lathe and drill press... Used to be, that all duplicating, printing, photocopying, computors and typewriters had to be "Registered" in the USSR and other Communist countries! What makes you think this can't happen to metalworking machinery in western countries? IIRC it is, or was, a requirement in Northern Ireland..for the very reasons you quote!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: single shot rifle From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 06 Aug 2000 13:22:55 GMT -------- John Stevenson wrote: > To me it's not a gun but an heirloom. > And NO it doesn't have to be registered, it's exempt! You miss the whole point John! What if it were NOT exempt? Would you willingly register it? Would you happily open your home to unannounced inspections? Special Security arrangements? (ALWAYS a requirement under British FAC regulations..well before confiscation came along) Would you HAPPILY give it up? What makes you think a large proportion of firearms in the USA are not "Family Heirlooms"..many, given the Pioneering Past of this country, with significant historical and sentimental value? BTW..I too manufacture PARTS for firearms without requiring to be "Registered" But in order to manufacture complete, working firearms, (In my case, Mauser type BOLT actions fer chrisssakes!) I have to have BATF and Local Police clearance and an ATF Manufacturers Licence. I, My wife and ALL my employees are subject to Background checks and my premises subject to unannounced (regular) inspection and special security arrangements. Every firearm I make (a receiver is a "Firearm) has to have a unique serial number STAMPED, not engraved, on it, Those serial numbers have to be registered in my permanent (subject to inspection) "Book" I am allowed to sell these actions only to OTHER registered FFL Dealers..who, sujected to the same thorough reqirements for inspection and record keeping, can sell these actions or parts to a Private Individual, ONLY within their State and ONLY after running a Background check through the local Police..who in turn link up with Federal FBI sources..Who BTW link with CIA sources!! Contrary to popular Alien (Furriner') beliefs..this ain't the "Wild and Wooly West" anymore! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: single shot rifle From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 06 Aug 2000 13:27:10 GMT -------- timleech wrote: Very few > people in the UK today would say that it is a socialist country. > Yer shittin' me! Right Tim? teenut. (Bred, born and brought up in the UK..as a SOCIAIST!! Escaped at age 34 to a better WAY of life) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: The pits From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 06 Aug 2000 14:08:10 GMT -------- If the pits ar shallow, grind them clean and fill with regular (or better still) with 50/50 body solder, "float" the surface flat before painting. If they ar deep, drill, tap and Screw in brass or steel plugs, then solder over the top of them. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Myford ML7 rising block studs, help needed UK. From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 06 Aug 2000 14:13:03 GMT -------- MikeT wrote: > > On August 06 2000, Robert Bastow wrote: > > > Surely you jest Mike! > > > > You have an ML7 and now you want to BUY studding? > > > > Got a handbook for the lathe? Look up "Screwcutting" > > > > ;^) > > > > teenut > > Gee....why didnt I think of that! > > All I have to do is collect all the bits of lathe I have spread all over > my workshop floor, slides, saddle, spindle, motor and cradle, fit them > all back on my now bare bed, hope the thing doesnt tip over backwards > while I make 4 studs to hold the lathe down with. > > This of course also relys on me knowing how to screwcut, having some > blank stock around and having the right changewheels to cut the correct > thread, oh and the tooling too.....none of which i'm too sure about. > > What handbook?? > > Please remember this is my first lathe and it hasnt even been near an > electricity supply since I got it. I thought it best to strip it and set > it up right first. > > Thanks for the suggestion tho....... > > Mike. Welcome to the endless "round tuit" list of a machine shop!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: single shot rifle From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 06 Aug 2000 15:03:28 GMT -------- John Stevenson wrote: > > On Sun, 06 Aug 2000 13:22:55 GMT, Robert Bastow > wrote: > > >John Stevenson wrote: > > > > > >> To me it's not a gun but an heirloom. > >> And NO it doesn't have to be registered, it's exempt! > > > >You miss the whole point John! > > > >What if it were NOT exempt? > > At some point in it's life until it reached age it was not exempt but it's > still here. > > > It's a bit like saying you have the equipment so you need a license. > Might as well charge me with rape then 'cause I have the equipment. > > Basically as I keep saying no one here gives a toss about firearms. > Even the police don't want them. > > > >BTW..I too manufacture PARTS for firearms without requiring to be "Registered" > >But in order to manufacture complete, working firearms, (In my case, Mauser type > >BOLT actions fer chrisssakes!) I have to have BATF and Local Police clearance > >and an ATF Manufacturers Licence. I, My wife and ALL my employees are subject > >to Background checks and my premises subject to unannounced (regular) inspection > >and special security arrangements. > > > Your choice to manufacture these. > Obviously you think the return is worth it to put up with the hassle. > -- > > Regards, > John Stevenson > Nottingham, England My point is John...That you choose to ignore..These things are probably as fully regulated in this Country as anywhere else on Earth! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Brit vote Was :Re: single shot rifle From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 06 Aug 2000 21:56:33 GMT -------- John Stevenson wrote: > > Vote on list Brits only [ Yes Tom this includes you ] > > I'll start it by voting Not to own one. Send me your Manton Double and I'll believe you mean it! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Parting tool use and questions? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 06 Aug 2000 22:06:35 GMT -------- mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article <398D5BC0.37202C4C@Nospamhotmail.com>, > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > Parting tools NEED side clearance. This must be ground into the blade > before use. > > The parting blades I've been using lately have side clearance > formed in on the cross-section. Some of these blades should > not be touched up on the side as it will only make them worse. > Really> I'm intrigued to know how you figure that. > > ANY and EVERY lathe tool should be set at dead center > height..PERIOD. > > With the possible exception I would claim of boring tools. Those > sometimes seem to do much better if a tad above center, at least > until the hole opens up enough so the tool has enough side clearance. Read what I wrote about your tool geometry being wrong!! > > > Drip feed or flood lubrication..matters not. Just bear in mind that a > happy parting tool sounds like frying bacon. The instant it starts > sounding grouchy..add more lube. > > It truly is amazing how a seemingly poor setup for a cut-off will > start to prerform magically well with the addition of a brushfull > of cutting oil. I swear there must be something in the oil that > damps the vibration between the tool and work... not just a > stick-slip kind of thing. Nope, It stops tool tip build up and lubricates the pasage of chips out of the cut..among other things. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Parting tool use and questions? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 06 Aug 2000 22:08:16 GMT -------- Tony Jeffree wrote: > > On Sun, 06 Aug 2000 12:33:17 GMT, Robert Bastow > wrote: > > >Mounting the parting tool > >upside down, in the front tool post, and running in revers, has the same > >effect. > > This is NOT a smart move for those of us who use lathes with a > threaded nose - this is a recipe for having the chuck unscrew while > parting off, which can get rather more exciting than you really need. > > Regards, > Tony > http://www.jeffree.u-net.com/ Never had a chuck unscrew on either my Myfoed or the Smart and Brown Model A. How would you acount for that? 8^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Parting tool use and questions? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 06 Aug 2000 22:10:08 GMT -------- "DoN. Nichols" wrote: > > In article <398D5BC0.37202C4C@Nospamhotmail.com>, > Robert Bastow wrote: > > [ ... ] > > >Sound advice from Richard..to which I would add this: > > > >Most people treat the pre-ground HSS parting blades as a finished tool, ready > >for use. It is NOT! No more than a ground, square, HSS tool bit is a ready to > >use tool. > > > >Parting tools NEED side clearance. This must be ground into the blade before > >use. When re-sharpening has reduced the length of useable blade below the > >radius of the piece to be parted off..start again! Snap or grind off the short > >end and regrind side clearance on a new section. Fer Chrissakes..new blades are > >cheap enough to buy! > > I have a question: How do you feel about the T-section cobalt > steel blades? Those seem to me to have all the side clearance you > should need, and I just grind the end clearance and hone the top edge a > bit. (Though I should perhaps consider the V-groove chip-narrower which > you mentioned below.) The tee section at the top is parallel..where is the side clearance? teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: It's FINISHED From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 07 Aug 2000 07:06:39 GMT -------- Nigel Eaton wrote: > > Be it known that on this the 6th day of August in the year 2000, that I > Nigel Eaton of the parish of Holwell have this day made the last piece > of my James Coombes table engine. > > Be it furthermore known that said engine is erected and turns over > whilst pumping air out of most appropriate orifices, leading to the > string suspicion that when I put an air supply on her, she'll run. > > Be it also known that I, said Nigel Eaton am as pleased as the > proverbial dog with two wossnames, and that I wanted to share the moment > with my friends on rec.craft.metalworking with all appropriate thanks > for the help, inspiration and entertainment. > > Now, on to the inch-and-a-half Allchin. :^) > > Cheers > -- > Have you hugged *your* lathe today? > ------------ > Nigel Eaton Congratulations! In a group of people known for their round tuits, a reminder that (occasionally) one should actually FINISH a project is like a breath of fresh air. ;^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: The pits From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 07 Aug 2000 07:14:18 GMT -------- Bucky Goldstein wrote: > > Robert Swinney wrote: > > > Fill me in here, please. I've seen all the advice about > > filling with solder - but - what about the heat required to > > cause the solder to bond with the base metal (cast iron)? > > Wouldn't it require that the mass of cast iron in the vicinity > > of the repair be heated to the "tinning temperature" of solder? > > It would seem so to me, anyway. > > Someone mailed me backchannel and gave what's probably the > solution. The casting is small, and the wound is small. I think > I'm going to grind out the wound as brother teenut said, then > throw the casting in the kitchen oven at ~400F for a bit, then > take it out, tin it up quick and then fill 'er up with solder. > I'll be using solder without the rosin core, the stuff my wife > uses for stained glass. Not ideal, but as I say, the flaw is a > small one so I can't see worrying about special body panel > solder. Then I'll file and paint and be done. > > Comments, anyone? -- especially re: the temperature of the oven. > Is 400F about right? > > BTW thanks, all, as always, for sharing the knowhow. > > -- > Bucky Goldstein > > I lost a button hole. Just remember to flux it BEFORE heating, to prevent oxidation..otherwise you will need to regrind it. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Parting tool use and questions? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 07 Aug 2000 07:22:01 GMT -------- John Flanagan wrote: > > On Sun, 06 Aug 2000 22:10:08 GMT, Robert Bastow > wrote: > > > > >The tee section at the top is parallel..where is the side clearance? > > I think I like the T blade style the best, although I was thinking the > same thing that you would have to grind the 1/16" or so on the side of > the T to get your side clearance. Wow Teenut, does this mean we think > alike?? :^). I'm going to try that pointed V tip idea, it does sound > like it would help clear the chip better. > > I have a question for you Teenut, you said in an earlier post in this > thread to "Avoid ..... the angled parting tool holders". My parting > tool hold holds the tool so that it points up at an angle relative to > the part being parted. Is this what you meant and if so what kind of > holder would be better. I had in mind the "Dog's Hind leg" style that angles to right or left. These impart, not just an exesive overhang, but a twisting moment too to the blade and the compound slide. > > Second question, you also said, "Normal cutting (for parting) speeds > are the rule..Reduce ONLY if your rigidity is suspect". When I was > doing serious damage to my compound slide I was told to SLOW the > rotational speed down from normal cutting speeds. Which I did do to > around 70-120 rpm. This really improved things. So I was just > wondering what you meant by the quoted comment above. Simply that, given the right tool and set-up there is no earthly reason to slow down from "normal" turning speeds. If you need to..s'OK..but be aware that it is an indication that all is not well. > > Hopefully one day we can drink a yard together. :^) How 'bout we drink a yard apiece? teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Parting tool use and questions? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 07 Aug 2000 07:27:01 GMT -------- "DoN. Nichols" wrote: > > In article <398DE2F4.58ED1A5C@Nospamhotmail.com>, > Robert Bastow wrote: > >"DoN. Nichols" wrote: > >> > >> In article <398D5BC0.37202C4C@Nospamhotmail.com>, > >> Robert Bastow wrote: > > [ ... ] > > >> >Parting tools NEED side clearance. This must be ground into the blade before > >> >use. When re-sharpening has reduced the length of useable blade below the > >> >radius of the piece to be parted off..start again! Snap or grind off the short > >> >end and regrind side clearance on a new section. Fer Chrissakes..new blades are > >> >cheap enough to buy! > >> > >> I have a question: How do you feel about the T-section cobalt > >> steel blades? Those seem to me to have all the side clearance you > >> should need, and I just grind the end clearance and hone the top edge a > >> bit. (Though I should perhaps consider the V-groove chip-narrower which > >> you mentioned below.) > > > >The tee section at the top is parallel..where is the side clearance? > > Well ... I remembered taper on mine, but had never measured it, > so I just went down. > > 0.125" wide at the top of the crossbar of the 'T' > 0.110" wide at the bottom of the crossbar of the 'T'. > 0.100" wide for the upright of the 'T'. > > I think that is adequate side clearance. Are you saying that not all > 'T'-section parting tools have this taper? > > Or are you talking about reducing the width of the top as you go > back from the tip, not as you go down from the top? I've not done this, > just worked to make sure that the tool goes in at a clean right angle. For best results on deep parting cuts, you will find that side (back) relief helps. No matter how square your settings, nor how rigid the set-up, deflection of the blade to one side or the other is inevitable. When this happens you wiil get side cutting which will degrade the surface finish at best, or result in a dig in at worst. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Parting tool use and questions? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 07 Aug 2000 07:36:19 GMT -------- mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article <398DE21F.7A622EDA@Nospamhotmail.com>, > Robert Bastow wrote: > > mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > > > The parting blades I've been using lately have side clearance > > > formed in on the cross-section. Some of these blades should > > > not be touched up on the side as it will only make them worse. > > > > > > > Really, I'm intrigued to know how you figure that. > > With a micrometer. The blades are tapered in cross section, > thickest at the top. There's several thousanths of reduction > in the thickness as you drop down to the bottom of the > T top, then they become much thinner for the rest of the > section. > That isn't side cutting relief..the blade is still the same width as the slot, from front to back. Inevitably you will get side cutting in a deep slot. Why do you imagine that slitting saw cutters have a hollow grind to them?? > They basically look like the parting blades I form on the end > of HSS blanks when I want a short, solid cutoff tool that fits > into my indexing toolpost. > Read what I wrote about your tool geometry being wrong!! > Here again I rely on the geometry of the Bokum type boring bar. > There is so much adjustability because the rotation of the bar > around its center axis is not fixed. But once everything looks > right, often just bringing the edge up a tad will make it cut > so much nicer. You can achieve the same thing by rotating the > tool so there's correct front clearance but then the side rake > goes away. So especially if I know that the hole is small in > realation to the bar size, and I will be opening the bore up > as I go, I will lift the tool so it is above center until the > bore opens up and I get more side clearance naturally. > HUH? If you rotate the tool tip above or below center, you are changing its relative cutting angle as well as its side clearance. If that helps to get a better cut or finish, then your cutter geometry wasn't right to begin with! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Parting tool use and questions? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 08 Aug 2000 04:50:33 GMT -------- foxeye wrote: > > So what your saying is that the parting tool blade needs to be > tapoered front to back as well as from the top to bottom, sort of like > a double hollow ground blade, to provide clearence. > > Foxeye That is exactly what I mean. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Parting tool use and questions? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 08 Aug 2000 04:53:19 GMT -------- "DoN. Nichols" wrote: > > In article <398E6579.2B6D5168@Nospamhotmail.com>, > Robert Bastow wrote: > >"DoN. Nichols" wrote: > > [ ... ] > > >> Or are you talking about reducing the width of the top as you go > >> back from the tip, not as you go down from the top? I've not done this, > >> just worked to make sure that the tool goes in at a clean right angle. > > > >For best results on deep parting cuts, you will find that side (back) relief > >helps. > > > >No matter how square your settings, nor how rigid the set-up, deflection of the > >blade to one side or the other is inevitable. When this happens you wiil get > >side cutting which will degrade the surface finish at best, or result in a dig > >in at worst. > > O.K. Now that I know what you are saying, it makes sense. I > tend not to do very deep parting under normal circumstances -- usually > about 0.500" to 0.750" before I reach the ID bore. Certainly, for > deeper parting, that makes a lot of sense. > > How much back clearance do you grind on them? > As little as I can manage..1 or 2 degrees per side. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Parting tool use and questions? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 08 Aug 2000 21:02:06 GMT -------- BillDarby wrote: > > > > > > How much back clearance do you grind on them? > > > > > > > As little as I can manage..1 or 2 degrees per side. teenut > > > > teenut > > Your response has really confused me as to what you are actually doing. > > I thought about this problem some time ago and the only practical way that I could think of to achieve any > clearance was to > grind away the top, such as to form a gradual slope from the cutting tip rearward to the extent of the expected > cut. As the grind gets deeper the stock being ground becomes narrower and provides the desired clearance. > > Aside from doing as above, one could grind away the sides but this would take a great deal of skill to do > well, I think. ..............................Is this what you do??(1 or 2 degrees per side.) > > Bill Darby Yes. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Cutting fluid.. From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 08 Aug 2000 21:08:13 GMT -------- mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > In article , > "Robert Swinney" wrote: > > What exactly is lard oil? > > Just like it sounds - from pigs. This is a purified porcine > product. It's animal fat, molecules sized to be liquid at > room temperature. > > Jim > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. Bacon grease (or Crisco) diluted with kerosene. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Parting tool use and questions? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 10 Aug 2000 13:30:42 GMT -------- raweich@my-deja.com wrote: > > > > I can understand grinding the relief for certain jobs when the finish > is required, but to do it for every job I think is a waste of time. Me..I just offered the advice. Whether you choose to act on it is entirely up to you! > I think that if you are after the surface finish then may be you > should look at the iscar style parting blades. The relief you are > looking for is built into them. Often I get a 63 or better finish with > out even trying and you can move the blade in or out with out any > problem. Isn't that what I already suggested? teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Very long hole From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 10 Aug 2000 13:35:51 GMT -------- Tracy Hall wrote: > > Here's a challenge: > > I want to drill a hole 1.7 mm in diameter 9 *meters* deep in 4140 steel > of hardness 30-35 (Rockwell C) and end up within 0.5 mm of the target > at the far end. > > Could this be done with a souped-up gun drill? > With that length/diameter ratio your chances of hitting the target with a gundrill are slim to zip..and Slim left town!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Magnum action update From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2000 08:28:45 GMT -------- Hi List, The "Mauser" program is forging ahead..now I have got my health problems sorted. The first pre-production prototype will be "the Biggie"..bolt diameter .750 with a box length of 4.00" This first example will be made up into a custom rifle in .577-3 1/4" (ouch) purely for press release and publicity purposes. This rimless round is based on the .585 Nyati, full length basic case without the rebated rim. This size of action is suitable for 505 Gibbs and any other cartridge of this or larger size..up to .577-3 1/4" rimmed. The production models will be sized, according to market demand, in this and a shorter .375 HH "regular" magnum length..still with the .750" bolt and receiver ring diameter of 1.450" I will shortly be asking for firm orders for BARRELLED actions only..This so that I have control over quality of breeching and chambering (to be done by Pac-nor) and so that the complete actions can be proof tested by Pac-nor. Price for the finished barrelled action will be in the $1000 to $1200 range, depending on caliber and options (DOUBLE square bridge is standard.. SINGLE square bridge with thumb cut and clip loading, timney trigger, and three way side swing safety will be extras. Receiver design is such that rigidity will NOT be compromised by the thumb cut (an essential mauser feature in my book) a solid steel bedding plate will be provided along with the Three screw bottom metal the receiver will be case hardened 8620 steel with a locking lug insert incorporating the inner "c" ring made from A2 steel at 60 Rockwell C. Tis feature will facilitate a "Takedown" construction if desired with a GUARANTEED return to zero WITHOUT a bedding shot being required (a la Dakota takedown) The bolt is also case hardened to 60C..NO setback anticipated!! Standard bolt shroud and cocking piece will be regular Mauser type with military style three way safety. for those requiring a side swing type..for low scope mounting..the Gentry or Dakota style can be specified..along with a cutaway bolt handle (NOT swept back please..it will break your finger!!) Trigger guard will be the larger Original Oberndorf bow with internal floorplate release I will be asking for deposits of the order of 30% with deliveries in 8 to ten weeks from order. please email me directly with enquiries and orders..teenut@hotmail.com teenut Robert Bastow, The Express Rifle Company, Atlanta Ga, Fax # 404 792 2668 Ph 404 799 6304. Visitors and rubberneckers welcome! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: New business idea -- Firestone tires From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 11 Aug 2000 08:41:29 GMT -------- tonyp wrote: > > PLAlbrecht wrote > > > I am now accepting franchising fees for my wonderful new enterprise, The > Tire > > Exchange. See, it works like this. You go to the local junkyard and find > four > > Firestone ATX whatever tires in the required size. (I will refrain from > the > > easy shot about "just look for two wrecked Explorers." Darn, I think I > just > > said it...) Take tires home for cheap. Sell them to somebody whose SUV > tires > > need replacin'. Four Firestones in those types and size, in any > condition, now > > amount to a "new tire coupon." > > Can't anybody get rubber right any more? > Space shuttle: O-rings > AF Concorde: tires > Ford Explorer: tires again > Next time you rely on a condom, be very afraid ... > > -- Tony Prentakis > Apparently not. I had four new Pirelli P 4000's put on the XJS about a month ago..cost of $1300 smackers by the time they were on. within a week I started experiencing severe out of balance vibrations, Took 'em back to NTW who replaced three out of the four due to severe out of roundness, Now, two weeks later..same problem and back it goes again, tomorrow..must have been a REAL bad batch. From fading memory it seems always that at least one out of every set of high performance tire I have ever bough has to be replaced in short order due to construction failure. I guess we..the consumer..are the final QC on new tires. teenut teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Clausing-Metosa Lathe Quality From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 12 Aug 2000 21:19:20 GMT -------- Bruce Hunt wrote: > > Greetings All! > I am looking for opinions on the quality of the Clausing-Metosa 14-40 > lathe. I bought one of these, brand new, a couple of months ago, for use in my tool and die shop. Nice machine! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Magnum action update From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 13 Aug 2000 15:05:36 GMT -------- "David R. Birch" wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > Receiver design is such that rigidity will NOT be > > compromised by the thumb cut (an essential mauser feature in my book) > > Is stripper clip loading intended in your design, or is there another function of > the thumb cut? > > David I consider stripper clip loading as an essential feature of any Dangerous Game Rifle..and the thumb cut is an essential feature of that design. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Heavy recoil From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 18 Aug 2000 16:31:01 GMT -------- You want to see the effect of heavy recoil? Go to http://www.accuratereloading.com/videos.html Click on the video clips of people firing a .577 caliber rifle with a HEAVY load. Hilarious!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Attn: Gun Lovers of the Group From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 20 Aug 2000 01:05:34 GMT -------- Gunner wrote: No longer did you worry about "the bullet with your name on it",during transit. Not much you can do if it has your name on it...It's the ones addressed "To Whom It May Concern" that you have to watch out for! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Black Powder Experts From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 21 Aug 2000 18:45:19 GMT -------- Rhbuxton wrote: > > Hi, > A simple question. At what range does the difference between a round ball and > a "mini" ball show up in accuracy? > Thanks > Rick Any range you care to measure it at teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: A safety reminder. From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 26 Aug 2000 11:18:27 GMT -------- Bob Unitt wrote: > > (* - I've never trusted water - do you know what fishes *do* in that > stuff ?) I've seen what it does to the insde of kettles!! My body is a Temple! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: FORD Explorer safety (roll over test compliance with 26 PSI tire pressure) From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 26 Aug 2000 11:48:08 GMT -------- mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > > > Ever heard of anyone running a red light? > Yeh! Recently!!!!! Had a lady driver (Ex-cop fer chissakes!) run clear through a red light as I began to cross. All the binders on and smoking all four tires. Fortunately, aware of the local inhabitants treating stop lights as "optional", I was going slowly and watching my side. I, too, hit the anchors. Fortunately the Jag stopped dead..but she still managed to clip about $4000.00 dollars worth off the front bumper and air dam. The local constabulary were NOT impressed by her ex-cop status OR her driving skills and ticketed her on the spot. Good job *I* was looking left and was able to stop..three more feet forward she would have "Teeboned" me dead center. NOT a pretty thought! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Hardening heat source question. From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 26 Aug 2000 12:04:53 GMT -------- Alan Rothenbush wrote: > > For hardening things like drill rod, what's the smallest and/or > cheapest source of heat that will get things hot enough. > > ( I have a tiny shop and an angry wife, so both cost and size are > a factor. ) > > Alan > > -- > > Alan Rothenbush | The Spartans do not ask the number of the > Academic Computing Services | enemy, only where they are. > Simon Fraser University | > Burnaby, B.C., Canada | Agix of Sparta A propane or Mapp gas torch will suffice for small jobs. However, a "Coffee Can Forge" will give a dramatic increase to your firepower? Take a regular sized coffee can and punch a hole about 3/4" diameter, halfway down one side. Line the can with a 1" layer of ceramic wool blanket (Dura Blanket) Your local heating or furnace company will give you a lifetime's supply of offcuts if you say "Pretty Please!" Stick the nozzle of your torch through the hole and fire it up. I have reached forge welding heat on a 1/2" square MS bar in just a few minutes! You can use it horizontally for forging and heat treatment..or vertically for melting a ladle of lead or aluminum. I have a much larger version, 8" inside diameter x 18" long, that I use for blade making and for damascus steel. It has home made, "swirl" burner with a forced air feed, that will crank up to over a million btu! But my little coffee can forge gets the most use!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Mold makers' salaries, etc? From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2000 11:29:27 GMT -------- "Robin S." wrote: > > Hello all, > > I understand this has come up before, but I'm curious concerning this > particular topic. What are mold makers worth? I went to monster.com and > looked for mold maker. I came up with salaries from $35K - $80K+/year. These > jobs are from all over the place (in the USofA) but I still find these > numbers confusing. > > I'm seriously considering becoming a mold maker, although I'd like to get my > Mech Eng degree first. > > Are there any professional mold makers out there that I could speak to about > their experiences? That would be a great help. I don't really know any off > hand :) > > Also, where does one train to become a mold maker? I understand Husky > Injection Molds has a mold making school, but that if one doesn't go there, > then you have to jump across the pond to England, Germany, Austria, ect. Is > this true? > > Thank you for any help you can provide. > > Sincerest regards to all, > > Robin > lasernerd@hotmail.com In the Atlanta area, a GOOD Mold maker..one who is able to do the detail design, program the CNC and produce a finished (other than polished or surface etching/texturing) mold that WORKS!!..could expect to start at around $25.00 per hour and go up from there. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Black Powder Experts From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2000 11:36:23 GMT -------- William Handzlik wrote: > > As I understand the round ball is good out to about 50 to 75 yards and the > accuracy drops off depend on the winds and mini ball is more accuracy out to about > 150 yards. > There is some books on black power shooting that can give you some information > from the local sporting good store. I have heard of some black power guns can > shoot out to 800 yards. > and beyond. The Muzzle loader's Association of Great Britain regularly hold long rang shoot up to 1800 yards. Rifles of choice include Whitworth, Gibbs, Alexander Henry and Rigby Match Target Rifles..usually with a 32 to 36" barrel, .451 caliber, 18 to 22" twist and shoot a 530 grain, flat based, paper patched bullet, using 90 to 120 grains of ffg black powder. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Black Powder Experts From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2000 11:54:04 GMT -------- Robert Swinney wrote: > > Excuse the double post - the ng server first said it was undeliverabe so I > hit it again. Sorry! BTW there is a documented case of a sniper with > telescopically sighted US Army civil war rifle (musket) killing a > Confederate general at a range of one mile. This was done with a minie > ball. > Bob Swinney > > "Robert Swinney" wrote in message > news:yJhq5.103139$6y5.71635711@news2.rdc2.tx.home.com... > > A round ball is not as "accurate" a minie ball which is not as accurate as > a > > modern boat-tail bullet - but there is no specific range at which > "accuracy > > falls off" with any particular type of bullet. Bullet stability (?) is > > effected by many things. Two things that impact accuracy (stability) is > the > > correct amount of rifling twist for the weight and shape of the bullet and > > the bullet's ability to withstand the effects of the air it is fired > > through. There are many others, such as the shape factor, or sectional > > density, of the bullet. An oblong bullet (with high sectional density) > > requires a faster rifling twist to stabilize it than does a round ball, > and > > it has greater wind-bucking ability. On the other hand, longitudinal > > balance is more critical with the oblong bullet, but it generally takes > less > > time in flight than the round ball and is under the influence of > > distrubances for less time than a round ball of equal weight. > > > > The "accuracy" of a bullet is degraded by many things from the time it is > > loaded into the cartridge case (or gun muzzle) and these degradations > effect > > different bullets in different ways. There is no quantifiably accurate > > range to ascribe to any particular type of projectile. All things > > considered, the round ball is the least "" accurate "". > > Bob Swinney > > > > > > > > Handzlik" wrote in message > > news:39A97BC7.4AD6E207@sgi.net... > > > As I understand the round ball is good out to about 50 to 75 yards and > the > > > accuracy drops off depend on the winds and mini ball is more accuracy > out > > to about > > > 150 yards. > > > There is some books on black power shooting that can give you some > > information > > > from the local sporting good store. I have heard of some black power > guns > > can > > > shoot out to 800 yards. > > > > > > > > > > > > Rhbuxton wrote: > > > > > > > Hi, > > > > A simple question. At what range does the difference between a round > > ball and > > > > a "mini" ball show up in accuracy? > > > > Thanks > > > > Rick > > > > > > > Not a Minie ball..The shartpshooter in that incident used a flat based, hexagonal section, elongated lead bullet, in an English Whitworth, hexagonal bored rifle. The distinguishing feature of a "minie" bullet is its hollow base..used with or without a metal, wood, clay or papier mache base plug. The original intention being that the plug was forced into the cup shaped base cavity by the exploding powder, expanding the bullet skirt to fill the rifling. It was very quickly determined that the wallop given to a plain bullet base..even a hardened lead bullet is sufficient to cause upsetting in the bore...Eliminating the occasional tendency of the Minie slug to shed all or part of its skirt..even for the base plug to blow right through the bullet. In the hands of an expert, a good, patched, round ball rifle will out shoot a minie rifle up to about 150 yards. Thereafter the Minie has a definite edge..one reason being a reduced tendency to "drift" due to its rotation, and of course, because its better ballistic coefficient causes less velocity loss..the trajectory is flatter and less affected by side winds. However, at a hunderd yards, I would back the patched ball! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Black Powder Experts From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 28 Aug 2000 12:02:20 GMT -------- Steve Rayner wrote: > > There is something wrong here! A rifle is not a musket.....ever! A musket > has a smooth bore, a rifle has a rifled barrel. Ah..But!! During the transition period between smooth bore "Muskets" and rifled "Rifles"..generally accepted as the period 1820 to 1860..the common practice was to rifle the barrels of smooth bore muskets in order to utilise the new Minie' bullets. They were commonly, then, referred to as "Rifled Muskets" Indeed, standard military nomenclature of that period, refered to Springfields, Enfields, etc, designed from the get go to shoot minie slugs, as "Rifled Muskets. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Black Powder Experts From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2000 02:31:33 GMT -------- Gary wrote: > I'm not going to try crank out actual numbers for the Whitworth because > I don't know the sectional density or ballistic coefficient of the Whitworth > bullet. A safe assumption is that they're worse than those of a modern bullet. Not a whole hell of a lot worse Gary.. The whitworth hexagonal "Bolt" in 451 caliber is actualy .447 across flats. (to allow for paper patching which was NOT glued on but expected to shed at the muzzle..I know because I used to shoot a whitworth and have picked up scores of patches in policing th range after a session. The length is about 2 1/2" in a 530 grain slug. muzzle velocity of the order of 1800 fps. From memory..the drop on our 1800 yard shoots was 16 feet or so..easily accomodated by the ladder sights of the day. Remember too that the "Drop" of a bullet fired horizontally is not quite the same as one fired on an upward trajectory...it has to stop going up..before it starts going down. Sothe "Holdover" might be half of the theoretical drop. The advantage of the big, heavy slug comes in wind bucking..which is far more difficult to judge than range..and far more predictable at 1800 yards with the Whitworth than say the .303 I used to shoot up to 1200 yards in competition. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: All regulars please read From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2000 03:33:04 GMT -------- Why don'tchall quit bitchin' about all the OT stuff..and think up a few OT subjects to write CONSTRUCTIVELY about! sheesh! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: "Mold makers' salaries, etc. From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2000 03:37:31 GMT -------- jdoneill12@my-deja.com wrote: > > I have a friend who has been in this trade for probably twenty years in > Rochester, New York, and I doubt that he makes $20 an hour. I know he > has no pension. He is a very good craftsman, but it doesn't pay that > well here. > John > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. He has two choices..put up with it..or move where the opportunities are, just like tens of millions of people have been prepared to do in the past..and will continue to do in the future! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Your help would be wonderful From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2000 03:38:33 GMT -------- odiebaby@hotmail.com wrote: > > Hello there. I wonder if you could help me. > > What's the best site on metalworking? Alt.Machines CNC would be right up your alley! teenut ======== Newsgroups: alt.coatings.paint,alt.sculpture,alt.crafts.blacksmithing,rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: potential lifespan of finish on exterior steel? From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2000 03:47:30 GMT -------- Doug Roberts wrote: > > I have been painting, or causing to be painted steel in ships structures > for years first as a seaman, then later as mate. As I understand the > physics of paint adhesion to metal it goes like this- the steel is > cleaned as good as possible. Iron oxide crystals form immediately at a > microscopic level. This crystalline structure is necessary for adhesion > of the primer, that is the primer needs something to hold onto. The > primer is made to be porous, the finish coat is applied, and flows into > the holes in the primer causing adhesion through a mechanical bond. That > is how conventional paint systems work. Some modern paints may > chemically bond to the metal, I do not know. The rust stabilizers that > are on the market now are a waste of money though. They turn iron oxides > into iron phosphides, or iron phosphates, the rust turns nice and black > instead of red, but is still only as stable as the bond it has to the > metal. Most modern finishes owe their durability to their chemical > structure, and still need to mechanically adhere to the metal. > Doug Roberts Master Mariner > > Don Foreman wrote: > > > > No one has mentioned "cold galvanize" -- an epoxy-based > > paint with zinc dust as pigment. They cite applications > > like water tanks (inside and outside), boats, docks, marine > > warehousing, structural steel, sign equipment, etc etc. > > > > The zinc dust electrolytically protects the steel just as > > regular galvanizing does. > > > > LPS is one mfr. A couple of brands are available from W.W. > > Grainger. > > > > It can be topcoated with other paints for desired color. > > > > Also, check out www.por15.com > > > > I've had good luck with the cold galvanize paint. I painted > > a light stand on my deck 20 years ago and it still looks > > fine. I live in Minnesota. > > > > As others have noted, having the metal very clean is > > important. I'd also recommend use of the metal-treatment > > stuff sold by auto paint suppliers. It passivates the > > surface of the steel and provides "tooth" that aids paint > > adhesion. Paint also flows out better on metal thus > > treated. I would particularly recommend this if the metal > > is blasted to clean it, because blasting makes the surface > > so chemically active a fine film of rust starts to form in > > minutes. You may not see it, but it's there. The metal > > treatment stuff neutralizes that. It's inexpensive and easy > > to use; just slop it on with a rag or a paintbrush, let it > > work for a few minutes, hose it off. > > > > I do not have any long-term experience with the POR stuff, > > but I can attest that it is incredibly hard when it dries. > > You can't scratch it with a car key. It's pricey. > > Regards from Foreman, dforeman@Ugoldengate.net. > > Please remove U from email address to reply I was once, involved as an observer, on tests done to determine the best paint finish for industrial gas cylinders. Bottom line was, that after shot-blasting, the cylinders were allowed to acquire a LIGHT coat of rust and then powder, finish coated. This combination proved to be very durable under arduous service conditions..including duty on oil rigs where salt spray was a constant problem with earlier finishes and priming methods teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: All regulars please read From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2000 04:00:13 GMT -------- "Robin S." wrote: > > I agree. Perhaps I'm a bit obsessive or something, but I attempt to either > read every message, or label it as being read. It becomes difficult to > observe those wee gold nuggets in long off-topic threads. > > Now, I understand that gun control, the forthcoming new President, and > various other political interests may hit home with many of RCM's > subscribers, but it has to stop somewhere. For instance, the IRS > registration of guns thread sits at the top of my list of topics, and > probably will for some time to come (because of the date of the post). This > is a continuing reminder of RCM's tendency to veer off course. That thread, > or at least its original topic, is really only of interest to American > citizens. I'm Canadian, and I don't really care THAT much about American gun > control. (Forgive me if it does indeed have international content in it. I > haven't read the entire thing) > > As an aspiring home shop machinist, and perhaps even a professional > metalworker, I read this group to gain and (in rare instances) share > knowledge concerning the fine art that lured us all here. Lets not have this > resource contaminated with pissing contests and political debates. > > Remember, this is not a gentlemen's club. It's a metalworking forum. > > Regards, > > Robin Ah! But in a less than perfect world, this Gentleman's Club/Metalworking Forum IS, HAS and will CONTINUE to suit the needs of many people. The signal/noise ratio would rise significantly if you stopped wasting your time and MY time, bitchin' about OT posts!! Failing which Robin, go start your own Moderated List, appoint yourself as "Net Nanny" and allow listers to enjoy ONLY what you enjoy! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Turning Ballrace Bearing endcaps From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2000 05:27:52 GMT -------- Rolie Baldock wrote: > > How does one hold these very thin objects when turning them ? > > Ideas Please. > > --Rolie Baldock. email: Superglue them to a suitably sized stub after facing it square in the chuck. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: OT but relevant to all!! From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2000 15:20:42 GMT -------- Where We're Headed By Robert A. Waters - 06.23.00 You're sound asleep when you hear a thump outside your bedroom door. Half awake, and nearly paralyzed with fear, you hear muffled whispers. At least two people have broken into your house and are moving your way. With your heart pumping, you reach down beside your bed and pick up your shotgun. You rack a shell into the chamber, then inch toward the door and open it. In the darkness, you make out two shadows. One holds something that looks like a crowbar. When the intruder brandishes it as if to strike, you raise the shotgun and fire. The blast knocks both thugs to the floor. One writhes and screams while the second man crawls to the front door and lurches outside. As you pick up the telephone to call police, you know you're in trouble. In your country, most guns were outlawed years before, and the few that are privately owned are so stringently regulated as to make them useless. Yours was never registered. Police arrive and inform you that the second burglar has died. They arrest you for First Degree Murder and Illegal Possession of a Firearm. When you talk to your attorney, he tells you not to worry: authorities will probably plea the case down to manslaughter. "What kind of sentence will I get?" you ask. "Only ten-to-twelve years," he replies, as if that's nothing. "Behave yourself, and you'll be out in seven." The next day, the shooting is the lead story in the local newspaper. Somehow, you're portrayed as an eccentric vigilante while the two men you shot are represented as choir boys. Their friends and relatives can't find an unkind word to say about them. Buried deep down in the article, authorities acknowledge that both "victims" have been arrested numerous times. But the next day's headline says it all: "Lovable Rogue Son Didn't Deserve to Die." The thieves have been transformed from career criminals into Robin Hood-type pranksters. As the days wear on, the story takes wings. The national media picks it up, then the international media. The surviving burglar has become a folk hero. Your attorney says the thief is preparing to sue you, and he'll probably win. The media publishes reports that your home has been burglarized several times in the past and that you've been critical of local police for their lack of effort in apprehending the suspects. After the last break-in, you told your neighbor that you would be prepared next time. The District Attorney uses this to allege that you were lying in wait for the burglars. A few months later, you go to trial. The charges haven't been reduced, as your lawyer had so confidently predicted. When you take the stand, your anger at the injustice of it all works against you. Prosecutors paint a picture of you as a mean, vengeful man. It doesn't take long for the jury to convict you of all charges. The judge sentences you to life in prison. This case really happened. On August 22, 1999, Tony Martin of Emneth, Norfolk, England, killed one burglar and wounded a second. In April, 2000, he was convicted and is now serving a life term. How did it become a crime to defend one's own life in the once great British Empire? It started with the Pistols Act of 1903. This seemingly reasonable law forbade selling pistols to minors or felons and established that handgun sales were to be made only to those who had a license. The Firearms Act of 1920 expanded licensing to include not only handguns but all firearms except shotguns. Later laws passed in 1953 and 1967 outlawed the carrying of any weapon by private citizens and mandated the registration of all shotguns. Momentum for total handgun confiscation began in earnest after the Hungerford mass shooting in 1987. Michael Ryan, a mentally disturbed man with a Kalashnikov rifle, walked down the streets shooting everyone he saw. When the smoke cleared, 17 people were dead. The British public, already de-sensitized by eighty years of "gun control", demanded even tougher restrictions. (The seizure of all privately owned handguns was the objective even though Ryan used a rifle.) Nine years later, at Dunblane, Scotland, Thomas Hamilton used a semi-automatic weapon to murder 16 children and a teacher at a public school. For many years, the media had portrayed all gun owners as mentally unstable, or worse, criminals. Now the press had a real kook with which to beat up law-abiding gun owners. Day after day, week after week, the media gave up all pretense of objectivity and demanded a total ban on all handguns. The Dunblane Inquiry, a few months later, sealed the fate of the few sidearm still owned by private citizens. During the years in which the British government incrementally took away most gun rights, the notion that a citizen had the right to armed self-defense came to be seen as vigilantism. Authorities refused to grant gun licenses to people who were threatened, claiming that self-defense was no longer considered a reason to own a gun. Citizens who shot burglars or robbers or rapists were charged while the real criminals were released. Indeed, after the Martin shooting, a police spokesman was quoted as saying, "We cannot have people take the law into their own hands." All of Martin's neighbors had been robbed numerous times, and several elderly people were severely injured in beatings by young thugs who had no fear of the consequences. Martin himself, a collector of antiques, had seen most of his collection trashed or stolen by burglars. When the Dunblane Inquiry ended, citizens who owned handguns were given three months to turn them over to local authorities. Being good British subjects, most people obeyed the law. The few who didn't were visited by police and threatened with ten-year prison sentences if they didn't comply. Police later bragged that they'd taken nearly 200,000 handguns from private citizens. How did the authorities know who had handguns? The guns had been registered and licensed. Kinda like cars. Sound familiar? WAKE UP AMERICA, THIS IS WHY OUR FOUNDING FATHERS PUT THE SECOND AMENDMENT IN OUR CONSTITUTION. "..it does not require a majority to prevail, but rather an irate, tireless minority keen to set brush fires in people's minds.."-Samuel Adams teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Black Powder Experts From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2000 15:39:28 GMT -------- Gary Coffman wrote: > > It should have good sectional density, but the ballistic coefficient of a hexagonal > bullet can't be good. It has to be spinning at about 200,000 RPM to stabilize, and > that hex shape has to be acting like a fan and kicking up a lot of turbulence compared > to a clean modern HPBT. In actual fact we used cylindrical bullets..it was long ago discovered that they perform eqally well in the whitworths hexagonal bore..Damn sight easier to make the mold too! The flat based, grease grooved bullet was a tad longer and heavier than the hex "bolt" and shot very cleanly. > It is true that as the bullet gets smaller, the ratio of surface area to volume > (and hence mass) becomes larger. That means there's relatively more > square inches against which the wind can act per unit mass. But for a > given muzzle energy, increasing the bullet mass decreases velocity, > and hence time of flight gets longer, which gives the wind longer to kick > the bullet around. A smaller or bigger bullet would perform less well > than one that falls near the optimum for the muzzle energy of the rifle > used. It is true that SD has everything to do with wind deflection..more important is the need to keep the speed above sonic velocity..the big, heavy slugs would sustain speed much better than smaller, lighter bullets. At trans-sonic speeds turbulance can cause severe deflection and drift. > > With the specs you gave for the Whitworth, it has a ME of 3833 foot pounds. > For MEs in the range of 3500 to 4000, the caliber range which works best is > .37 to .44 cal. The Whitworth is a tad big for its ME, but not too much so. > I wonder if the old guys calculated this out or discovered it empirically. > Probably the latter. > Whitworth was given the weight of bullet..530 grains..same as a Brown Bess Ball..deemed desireable by the Rifle committee, together with the service powder load of IIRC, 70 grains of powder. He calculated bore size and length from that and the twist required to stabilize that length of bullet at the expected MV. During his experiments he was successful in producing and shooting a barrel with a 1" twist. Many feared that a hexagonal bullet would "Jam in the bore..but this was proven not to be the case. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: OT and I don't care!! From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2000 15:45:54 GMT -------- Had some very welcome news today, after a CT Scan yesterday and a meeting with my Oncologist this morning..I am now considered to be Cancer Free..In complete remission! Yee-Hah! Have to have a checkup in three months and the Doc told me it will take three to six months to clear the Chemo Therapy from my system. Return to full health and strength will take at least that long. I took the time out to say "Thanks" to 'Im Upstairs, 'Er Indoors, and now, to all those friends out there who have been so supportive during this difficult time of my life. Thanks Guys, it IS appreciated. teenut Cancer Survivor ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Robin's Takeover Bid OT!!! From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2000 20:53:51 GMT -------- "Robin S." wrote: > I don't care about American gun control. I don't care about who the next > American President is. I don't care about other American politicians. Does > it sound like I'm picking on RCM's American subscribers? Well it should, > because a substantial amount of the off-topic posts are by Americans and/or > concerning American interests. Well Sonny, I got news for you..We 'Mercuns don't have a great deal of interest in your wild colonial vaporings either. You are starting to sound like a liberal and we don't have much time for them either..less use than tits on a boar. So relax, go with the program or not, as the case may be..but quit trying to tell us what YOU find socially acceptable..it gets BORING in a hurry! > > You say to skip over those threads I don't want to read. Well, with the way > things are going, there may not be any posts that I (as an amateur > metalworking) care about - So unsubscribe, and go cry on someone elses shoulder..it IS a free country (tho' I'm not too sure about Canada..If you are a sample of the generation coming, I forsee a vast levelling and a sacrifice of individual rights and freedoms.. and people like you will be leading the charge of the Thought Police. (Kristal Nacht anyone?) > (the most notable > regular that seems to keep OT to a minimum is Mr. Robert Bastow). The > phrase, "Bumbling Titan" comes to mind here. Bumbling?? Titan?? where DO you learn such stuff? I will have you know young man, that I have NEVER knowingly or willing, stayed ON topic in my life! That way leads to insanity, boredom and a shrinkage of your powers of reasoning. Your young brain does not have a finite capacity for learning..So treat it to an overload..Thus, by way of all those bits of "OT" information, you will EVENTUALLY!!!!.....BECOME A WELL ROUNDED AND WELL EDUCATED ADULT! > > I find it amusing some time back you stated to the ng that you wanted to > > learn from the members here on the group now suddenly > > you want to be the one teaching, proper manners I presume. > > > > > > Paul My sentiments entirely... BACK OFF Robin..on pain of PLONKING!! teenut (Bumbling Titan indeed!!) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Black Powder Experts From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2000 21:10:06 GMT -------- Ttools@ix.netcom.com wrote: > > I am not familiar with this hex bore rifle, just how was the bore made. It must be a smooth > bore. Just when were they first made and what was the original purpose intended like hunting > or wars. > Tom > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > Gary Coffman wrote: > > > > > > > > It should have good sectional density, but the ballistic coefficient of a hexagonal > > > bullet can't be good. It has to be spinning at about 200,000 RPM to stabilize, and > > > that hex shape has to be acting like a fan and kicking up a lot of turbulence compared > > > to a clean modern HPBT. > > > > In actual fact we used cylindrical bullets..it was long ago discovered that they > > perform eqally well in the whitworths hexagonal bore..Damn sight easier to make > > the mold too! The flat based, grease grooved bullet was a tad longer and > > heavier than the hex "bolt" and shot very cleanly. > > > > > It is true that as the bullet gets smaller, the ratio of surface area to volume > > > (and hence mass) becomes larger. That means there's relatively more > > > square inches against which the wind can act per unit mass. But for a > > > given muzzle energy, increasing the bullet mass decreases velocity, > > > and hence time of flight gets longer, which gives the wind longer to kick > > > the bullet around. A smaller or bigger bullet would perform less well > > > than one that falls near the optimum for the muzzle energy of the rifle > > > used. > > > > It is true that SD has everything to do with wind deflection..more important is > > the need to keep the speed above sonic velocity..the big, heavy slugs would > > sustain speed much better than smaller, lighter bullets. At trans-sonic speeds > > turbulance can cause severe deflection and drift. > > > > > > > > With the specs you gave for the Whitworth, it has a ME of 3833 foot pounds. > > > For MEs in the range of 3500 to 4000, the caliber range which works best is > > > .37 to .44 cal. The Whitworth is a tad big for its ME, but not too much so. > > > I wonder if the old guys calculated this out or discovered it empirically. > > > Probably the latter. > > > > > Whitworth was given the weight of bullet..530 grains..same as a Brown Bess > > Ball..deemed desireable by the Rifle committee, together with the service powder > > load of IIRC, 70 grains of powder. He calculated bore size and length from that > > and the twist required to stabilize that length of bullet at the expected MV. > > > > During his experiments he was successful in producing and shooting a barrel with > > a 1" twist. Many feared that a hexagonal bullet would "Jam in the bore..but > > this was proven not to be the case. > > > > teenut The Whitworth Hexagonal bore was just that. It started with a smooth bore tube of IIRC .442" diameter and a suitable scrape cutter was pulled through it, guided by a spiralling mechanism, to produce a rifled bore of hexagonal section. The bullet or "Bolt" was similarly shaped with a twisted hexagonal section to fit the bore. Sir Joseph developed the system in answer to a request from the British Small Arms Committee to investigate the elements of a rifle barrel conducive to repeatable accuracy and consistancy. In the process he developed much of our present day understanding of precision gauging and measurement. (Metal Working Content!!..OK Robin et. al.?) The Whitworth Enfield was the Volounteer Rifle of choice and found great favor amongst the Confederates during the Civil War. It was the fore runner of many copies of greater or lesser efficacy, among them, Rifles by Rigby, Alex Henry, The London Arms Company and others and lead to a greater understanding of the rifle as a whole. teenut OT as usual! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Black Powder Experts From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2000 21:17:09 GMT -------- Ed Peterson wrote: > > Ttools@ix.netcom.com wrote: > > > > I am not familiar with this hex bore rifle, just how was the bore made. It must be a smooth > > bore. Just when were they first made and what was the original purpose intended like hunting > > > It had a twisted hexagonal bore. Done initially with tooling or by > twisting the barrel later I have no idea. (Teenut probably does.) IIRC > Dixie Arms was once selling a British-built repro of that gun and the > mold for the bullets but it was Really Expensive. > > Some years back, my sister got me a subscription to 'Civil War Times' in > which I remember reading a debunking of the 'shot the guy at a mile > away' story. Seems no one knows where, when, and what units were > involved in this incident at least from what the writer could glean from > research so he deemed it unfounded. (an urban military legend?) There > was more to it but I can't remember anything more. NOT an urban legend..but a true story. Took place at Chickamauga Battlefield in Tennessee. While undoubtedly the Confederate Sharpshooter was a master of his craft...just to place his bullet within the circle of probability occupied by the Generals head at that precise moment..it is equally certain that, given the probable effective size of the rifle's "Grouping" capability at that range (About 30")..He surely was a very unlucky General on that day! Lucky shot? The harder I practice..The luckier I get! teenut > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT and I don't care!! From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2000 21:21:06 GMT -------- PLAlbrecht wrote: > > Teenut gave us the welcome news with > >>I am now considered to be Cancer Free..In complete > remission! > > YEE HAH INDEED!!!! > > Way to go, Teenut!!! > > Can we expect even more crustiness now? Please? > > Congratulations, > > Pete Crusty! Moi? Too busy being a "Bumbling Titan". Too busy trying to understand the likes of Robin..who IS BTW starting to show early symptoms of a budding curmudgeon. ;^) teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT and I don't care!! From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2000 21:23:22 GMT -------- Spehro Pefhany wrote: > > The renowned Robert Bastow wrote: > > Had some very welcome news today, after a CT Scan yesterday and a meeting with > > my Oncologist this morning..I am now considered to be Cancer Free..In complete > > remission! > > Excellent! I had a feeling that wimp with the sickle would back down. > ;-) > > Best wishes, > Spehro Yeh! As I promised, I left some sorry MF's behind in the Valley! NEXT!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT but relevant to all!! From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2000 21:29:34 GMT -------- mulligan@advinc.com wrote: > Now Robert. > > Here we have a delicate situation in rcm, where everyone is > decrying the lack of metalworking posts, and bemoaning the OT > stuff. YOU are in a singular position of contributing your > manifold experiences, _on_ topic. > > > > WAKE UP AMERICA, THIS IS WHY OUR FOUNDING FATHERS PUT THE SECOND > AMENDMENT IN OUR CONSTITUTION. > > Well now this is a bit of a mis-statement. You know my thoughts > on the matter. The second amendment is not really there so > citizens can fight off burglars, or shoot squirrels for food. > Really it is there so citizens can raise an army and attempt to > kill anyone who would attempt to impose political ideas on a state > that objected to those ideas. > > Attempting to justify the second amdendment on the ground of > 'we need guns to shoot food' or 'we need guns to fight crooks' > is doomed eventually to failure - ie, the weapons will be > restricted. But referencing back to the original reasons the > document was written is more compelling. > > 200 years is not really that long a time. I hope that the > personal and political freedoms that have been a hallmark of US > citizenship for that time continue and grow in the future. > But other countries have had upheavals. The US could too. > Who knows? > > Jim IMHO the Second Amendment was put there for one reason and one reason only..To protect the FIRST Amendment and our inalienable rights and freedoms. No wonder the aliens in our ranks have such difficulty in understanding what the heck we are so concerned about. It IS difficult to understand that which you have never had! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Repairing old rifle From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 29 Aug 2000 21:31:34 GMT -------- "Eric R. Snow" wrote: > > Hey Y'all, > This is an on topic question. I have an old (1904) rifle with a > falling block action. This is a .22 caliber rifle. When I bought it it > had a piece of steel about 5/8 " long pounded into the business end. I > then discovered that the barrel was swelled slightly just beyond the > plug. I removed the plug and tried firing it and the bullets tumble. > Finally, I removed the last 3/4" from the barrel. This cut into the > dovetail for the sight. What I want to do is weld the dovetail to fill > it in. Then, remachine the crown, and machine a new dovetail for a > new sight. I will be tig welding the barrel. I would like to know if > this is a bad idea and if the rifle still shoots bad should I line it. > Thanks in advance to all the gundamentalists et al who respond. > Eric R Snow Shouldn't be a problem..remember to stuff the bore with soft soap to prevent oxidation from the conducted heat...And DON"T burn a hole through it!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Black Powder Experts From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2000 00:10:40 GMT -------- jkessler wrote: > > Hello group, > I read these posts about black powder, Whitworths,long shots, and think > most of the group still hasn't got a clue as to what you guys are talking > about. Maybe a little background info will help. > Black powder, compared to modern nitrocellulose (smokeless), burns slow, > doesn't produce much chamber pressure and is very dirty. Black powder may > only produce about 12,000 lbs of pressure while smokeless produces higher > than 35,000 lbs. in some loadings. Try 28 to 40,000 psi for BP and 65000 plus with nitro. And since BP is always packed tightly > (smokeless is often loose) in the chamber, the only way to get more > pressure is to add more powder. BTW, pressure effects velocity. Doubling the bullet weight will SIGNIFICANTLY INCREASE PRESSURES. Having said that..Good post! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Black Powder Experts From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2000 12:25:36 GMT -------- "DoN. Nichols" wrote: > Somewhere later in the thread, I saw a mention of one twist in > 1". I *hope* that was one twist in 1' (foot, not inch), or the spin > would be rather extreme. It was indeed one turn in one INCH!! Whitworth did it to prove a point..That a properly fitted hex bolt would NOT jam in a hex bore..regardless of how tight the twist was. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: wasted bandwidth on off topic topics! From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2000 15:43:57 GMT -------- Richard Herrmann wrote: > > People on this newsgroup waste a great deal of bandwidth and my time > with all the peripheral discussions. I didn't join this newsgroup to > wade through all the non-metalworking-related junk that permeates the > messages. Sorry to say, but I'm gone! > > Rick Don't let the door hit your butt! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: All regulars please read From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2000 15:47:39 GMT -------- stubbsg wrote: > > These OT debates (guns, politics etc,etc) pinch about 700K of my 150MB > bandwidth per month, whatever the basis of a debate is if it is OT it has, > by definition, no place on this newsgroup . > > The fact that OT debates are carried out on this group seems to demonstrate > at least that: > > 1. Those involved are all unable to comprehend what rec.crafts.metalworking > means > 2. Those involved do not care about the rights of other users of this group > not to have their bandwidth wasted by an OT debate > 3. Those involved can not resist a bait when some sod dangles it in their > pond. > > Please respect my rights and those of other users of rec.crafts.metalworking > and > > 1 do not bite. > 2 if you want to debate an OT topic go to for example > > alt.politics.usa.constitution.gun-rights > rec.guns > talk.politics.guns > > or even > > alt.sex.guns if that is what turns your crank > > or a newsgroup suitible to the topic you wish to debate. > > Feel free to invite your mates to come with you for the debate and feel > free to come back to rec.crafts.metalworking when you want to talk about > rec.crafts.metalworking. > > Thank you all and I look forward to all of your useful and informative posts > concerning rec.crafts.metalworking. Thank YOU for your OT post..I'll eturn it in full so as to waste more of your bandwidth. Might I suggest you get a Free server with unlimited bandwidth..and quit WHINGEING!..You sound just like a Pommie! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Black Powder Experts From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2000 22:17:30 GMT -------- Gary Coffman wrote: > With a muzzleloader, > you swage the bullet to shape as you load it. (Or in the case of paper patched > bullets, you swage the paper to shape as you load it, leaving the bullet a nice > clean cylinder.) Not quite so Gary. In the whitworth system, the bullet was made hexagonal too and mechanicaly fit the bore. The original A/F dimension was such that, after applying a paper patch of the correct thickness, the bullet was a nice SLIDING fit in the bore. Upsetting took place on fireing as the base accelerated faster than the nose so that a tight gas seal was achieved. (Early Whitworth, hexagonal bullets had a hollow base..like a minie bullet..which was filled with a papier mache plug. Later it was discovered that the hex shape wasn't needed..a bore riding, cylindrical bullet would upset just as well to fill the hex bore. At no time were the bullets "swaged into the rifling" during loading..that would have lead to difficult (Impossible) ramming and deformation of both the nose and the base of the bullet. Maybe you are thinking about the "Mini-Balls" (not Minie) supplied for use in modern cap and ball replicas...Thompson-Center for example. These do indeed have a groove sized, narrow band above the bore sized base..the objective here being to "Engrave the rifling" on loading..might also act as a scraper to push soft, light fouling down the bore during loading. I would imagine that after a very few shots with less than perfect black powder, loading would become VERY difficult. These Mini-balls are only just over bore diameter in length..to suit the much slower twist of a patched ball rifle..they are grease grooved and NEVER used with a paper patch. The pre-engrave ring is not sufficient to give a tight gas seal though..this occurs via "upsetting" of the solid base on firing. > > > Now sonic velocity is another factor of interest to bullet behavior. It isn't > directly related to cross wind behavior, though again everything is interrelated > in one way or another. At ranges beyond 1000 yards, the bullets of nearly all > commonly used rifles will have become subsonic. You notice this in the target > pits at Camp Perry. Subsonic bullets don't have the "crack" sonic boom sound > as they pass overhead. Only those bullets in the 180 and 200 grain weights > loaded to a muzzle velocity in excess of 3000 fps in .30 cal, will still have a > "crack" as they reach the 1000 yard target. Even then, they'd better be low > drag bullets. AFAIK at 1800 yards, no common cartridge short of a .50 BMG > will still produce that "crack". Caliber .50 M1 ball remaining velocity at 1800 yards = 721 fps..still packing a helluva wallop though..5397 ft pounds! It is during the transition from super to sub sonic velocity that the greates disturbance occurs..and this is effects small bullets far more than big ones. Figures from "Hatcher's Notebook" teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Black Powder Experts From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 30 Aug 2000 22:19:29 GMT -------- Gary Coffman wrote: > > On Wed, 30 Aug 2000 12:25:36 GMT, Robert Bastow wrote: > >"DoN. Nichols" wrote: > >> Somewhere later in the thread, I saw a mention of one twist in > >> 1". I *hope* that was one twist in 1' (foot, not inch), or the spin > >> would be rather extreme. > > > >It was indeed one turn in one INCH!! > > > >Whitworth did it to prove a point..That a properly fitted hex bolt would NOT jam > >in a hex bore..regardless of how tight the twist was. > > That *isn't* the twist of the Whitworth rifle used for the sniper shot we've > been discussing, though. That had a more normal twist. About 1 in 22" was the Whitworth standard twist. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Black Powder Experts From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 01:01:38 GMT -------- jkessler wrote: > > Hello group, > You are right on both counts, Robert. I was just trying to make a general > comparison between BP and smokeless pressure curves, and to highlight the > solutions our ancestors developed to solve the inherent problems they > encountered with BP. Getting a large, heavy ROUND ball to engege enough > rifling to spin and stabilize was one of those problems. So was trying to > increase pressures with a round bullet. After conical bullets came into > widespread use around the time of the Civil War, it got easier to do > because you could indeed just make the bullet longer in the SAME sized > caliber, whose increased weight WOULD raise pressures. The hexagonal > barrel unsuccessfully addressed these issues. jk The Whitworth Hexagonal bore was, in fact, VERY successful in it's era..Sought after by Confederate sharp shooters, rifle teams, and the British Volounteer movement (para-military "Weekend Warriors of the day) It not only, for the first time, placed an accurate, consistant and easily loaded rifle in their hands for the very first time..But it also opened up the whole era to experimentation..most of it in vain attempts to BETTER the Whitworth Rifle. Some succeeded, it is true. Legendary names like Rigby, Alex Henry and Gibbs-Metford spring to mind. But the Whitworth was a quantum leap forward in military rifle development, akin to the Gatling gun or the Phoenix Missile. Today, whitworth type rifles ar STILL in demand and production..the best being the Parker Hale Volounteer Rifle..even though the hexagonal bore has been bettered by several other systems. I would love to own and shoot the pristine LAC Whitworth Volounteer rifle that gave me so much satisfaction during my long range shooting days. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Black Powder Experts From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 01:19:48 GMT -------- Robert Bastow wrote: > > > LAC Whitworth Volounteer rifle that gave me so much satisfaction during my long > range shooting days. > > teenut Er! Try Volunteer..spel chekr's down! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Express Rifle actions From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 04:11:27 GMT -------- This project is rapidly coming to fruition..I have firm orders in house for a twelve week delivery for 12 barrelled actions..ranging from 375 H&H (for a gent in OZ) through 416 Rigby, several 505 Gibbs and a couple in .585 Nyati caliber for a Gunsmith in South Africa. I tried to order a Cogsdill Tool "Shefcut" reamer today..the precision and finish of the 3/4" bolt raceway through the length (10") of the receiver is paramount. Jeez! They (eventually..a whole differnt thread!) quoted me almost $800.00 and 12 weeks delivery! They must be real proud of them! I settled for a carbide tipped, oil fed reamer in a RH Cut, RH helix persuasion..I just finnished making a coolant line adaptor with a built in floating reamer holder to guide it on its way. I have opted to use 8620 for the actions..to be case hardened after finishing, with a locking lug insert of A2 air hardening steel. The bolt is an assembly of a length of 3/4" Thompson "60 case" shafting with a head of A2 and the bolt handle plug welded in place. I have chosen Lothar Walther, just up the road from here, to supply the barrels and to fit and chamber them. They do beautiful work, so I am not concerned about the rifle being accurate as well as hard hitting. For my own use I am currently hand building an even bigger action..this one with a bolt 20MM diameter (,787") to accomodate the big, rimmed, Kynoch cases of the .577-3 1/4" Nitro Express. Developing a magazine box to succesfully accomodate three of these cigar sized shells and to smoothly and reliably feed the fat buggers, is my next challenge! I am planning on a Safari trip to Africa in 2003..I hope to knock my very own "Buff" flat on his ass! With trophy fees hovering around 20 grand for a Bull Elephant, I may pass up THAT opportunity! I am also going to be manufacturing, on a larger scale I hope, a "Blueprinted" copy of the 1878 Sharps-Borchardt single shot, falling block action..The interest shown in these..even at this early stage.has been phenominal. Maybe next the big Sharps 1874 0r 1875 action (the one Quigley used in the movie) There are a couple of companies in the USA that already have them in production..but their prices are DAFT!! ($3000.00 and up) even so they are backlogged on orders up to four years. Room for a little Entrepreneurial Competition here methinks! Dear Lord, Thank you for my Health, CNC...and the Good 'Ole US of A!! Living every day to the full. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Express Rifle actions From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 31 Aug 2000 15:42:15 GMT -------- Matt Shaver wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote in article > <39ADDBB8.5B6C5BA5@Nospamhotmail.com>... > > several 505 Gibbs and a couple in .585 Nyati caliber > <...> > > .577-3 1/4" Nitro Express > > First, let me add my heartfelt congratulations on your recent return to > health and being able to concentrate on the important things, like making > these rifles. > > I've been meaning to ask this question for some time, but just now got > around to looking up the reference. I was wondering what sort of hoops you > have to jump through to comply with: > > THE GUN CONTROL ACT OF 1968, PUBLIC LAW 90-618 > TITLE 18, UNITED STATES CODE, CHAPTER 44 > <...> > § 921. Definitions > (a) As used in this chapter – > <...> > (4) The term "destructive device" means - > <...> > (B) any type of weapon (other than a shotgun or a shotgun shell which the > Secretary finds is generally recognized as particularly suitable for > sporting > purposes) by whatever name known which will, or which may be readily > converted to, > expel a projectile by the action of an explosive or other propellant, and > which > has any barrel with a bore of more than one-half inch in diameter; > > Are your rifles covered under the "suitable for sporting purposes" clause > (certainly you're making one of the most "sporting" types of firearms!), > even though they're not smoothbore? > > Thanks for the insights! Maybe some day I'll give up being poor and I'll be > able to buy one of your rifles... > > Matt Shaver Thanks for the good wishes Matt, I had to apply for an BATF manufacturers licence..other than delays, it wasn't a problem. As was stated a short while back, the ATF have a list of "acceptable" big bore sporting calibers. Both the above are on it. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Falling block actions... From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 01 Sep 2000 16:50:23 GMT -------- Edward Haas wrote: > > --Hey, has there ever been a cannon that used the falling block > action? This sounds easier to fabricate than a screw breech design, but > one wonders about the pressures involved... I'm thinking of building a > slightly more robust version of the hydraulic pipe device seen on Junkyard > Wars... :-) > > -- > "Steamboat Ed" Haas : Why won't the money come? > Watch link rot in action! : Om mani padme hum... > http://www.nmpproducts.com > ---Decks a-wash in a sea of words--- Lots of examples of the sliding block breech, 195 mm Howitzer for one, British 25 Pounder for another. Generally used on calibers umder 6" by most nations..But the Germans used them on every gun in their inventory..even the 80cm "Dora"! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Falling block actions... From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 01 Sep 2000 16:52:15 GMT -------- Robert Bastow wrote: > > Edward Haas wrote: > > > > --Hey, has there ever been a cannon that used the falling block > > action? This sounds easier to fabricate than a screw breech design, but > > one wonders about the pressures involved... I'm thinking of building a > > slightly more robust version of the hydraulic pipe device seen on Junkyard > > Wars... :-) > > > > -- > > "Steamboat Ed" Haas : Why won't the money come? > > Watch link rot in action! : Om mani padme hum... > > http://www.nmpproducts.com > > ---Decks a-wash in a sea of words--- > > Lots of examples of the sliding block breech, 195 mm Howitzer for one, British > 25 Pounder for another. > > Generally used on calibers umder 6" by most nations..But the Germans used them > on every gun in their inventory..even the 80cm "Dora"! > > teenut OOPS! That should read 105MM Howitzer! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: knife blade tempering question From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 05 Sep 2000 14:37:47 GMT -------- George Glines wrote: > Legend has it that the ancient Japanese blade makers would plunge the blade > straight from the forge into the flesh of giant killer creatures. Godzilla > would yield a Rockwell C hardness of 63, Monster Zero a 60 and Rodan a 58. > No one in the west has been able to duplicate these fine blades however, as > we lack the requisite monsters. > Rumor has it that there a still a few Virgins around in these parts..but they are becoming increasingly difficult to find! (Could be my advancing age has something to do with it!) Anyhow, I will have to find an alternative quenching medium, soon, for the large blades I make from time to time. Downside of Virgins is that they are only good for one quench! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: knife blade tempering question From: Robert Bastow Date: Tue, 05 Sep 2000 14:39:36 GMT -------- Gary Coffman wrote: > I'd be interested in a pointer to the reason for tempering while the piece > is still warm from the hardening quench. Simply that it reduces the tendency to crack. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: ATTENTION BRITS From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 06 Sep 2000 01:02:05 GMT -------- "Robert C. Medernach" wrote: > > I just bought a lathe made by Smart & Brown Machine Tool, Ltd. It is a model > 1024. It is in reasonably good condition and appears to be a high quality > machine. Probably got over here during WW2. Nope, it is a post-war model > A. What is the reputation of these machines in the UK? Excellent > B. Is the company still in business? No > C. What is their mailing or e-mail address? See above > D. Does anyone have a manual and parts list for copying? Tony Griffiths may have one > Thanks-- please reply here or to rcmed@iquest.net ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Surface Plate question From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 06 Sep 2000 01:12:25 GMT -------- Alan Rothenbush wrote: > > Are surface plates typically ground parallel, as well as flat ? > > Alan > > -- > > Alan Rothenbush | The Spartans do not ask the number of the > Academic Computing Services | enemy, only where they are. > Simon Fraser University | > Burnaby, B.C., Canada | Agix of Sparta No. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Surface Plate question From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 06 Sep 2000 12:26:02 GMT -------- John Flanagan wrote: > > On Wed, 06 Sep 2000 01:12:25 GMT, Robert Bastow > wrote: > > >Alan Rothenbush wrote: > >> > >> Are surface plates typically ground parallel, as well as flat ? > >> > >> Alan > >> > >> -- > >> > >> Alan Rothenbush | The Spartans do not ask the number of the > >> Academic Computing Services | enemy, only where they are. > >> Simon Fraser University | > >> Burnaby, B.C., Canada | Agix of Sparta > > > >No. > > > >teenut > > While we're at it are the sides typically at accurate right angles to > the top? Depends on the type...Some is, some ain't. My Chinese made "Rough Work" 12" x 18" Granite plate isn'nt square nor flat on the edges. OTOH my Starret 12" x 8" granite, "Toolmakers Flat" is dead nuts for square, all round..though I would suspect the flatness of the edges. I also have an old, hand scraped, cast iron plate that I made as an Apprentice. The edges on that are dead square and dead flat, cuss I made 'em so! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Whilst shopping at Lowe's From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 06 Sep 2000 12:59:59 GMT -------- Ernie Leimkuhler wrote: > > In article <8p2geu$4n9@nntpa.cb.lucent.com>, Bucky Goldstein wrote: > > > Howard Bailey wrote: > > > > >>thread on the pros and cons on using or the merits of titanium > > >>hammers in the woodworking group..... > I also don't see the point in a lighter hammer. > I like my 30 oz estwing. I like a lighter hammer for most work..I find my 12oz and 20oz Warringtons to be just as effective as my 16 or 24 oz claw hammers when it comes to driving nails fast and deep. I have better control and can swing faster and longer. I find the balance of claw hammers..particularly the joiners type with steep angled claws, to be borderline, leading to twisting and loss of control. I don't often bend nails so the claws are of limited utility to me in any case..I have some big carpenter' and framer's hammers but they remain shiny and unused on my tool rack. However, I have my doubts about the utilty of titanium..methinks the speed of swing and the final "wrist flick" technique used in hammering would exceed the "Fast Twitch" capability of most muscles. One has to real force the downswing to get the same striking power, compared to an equally sixed, steel hammer. Simply a "Consumer Marketing ploy" as far as I can see. BTW, every craftsman should try a "Warrington Pattern" hammer...the speed and balance are superb. I also use the cross pein frequently for starting smaller nails and for nailing into a tight corner or toe nailing. Makes for a useful metalworkers hammer too..along with the ubiquitous ball peins though the Warrington seems better balanced to me. First class Warringtons are made by Record and usually available at good woodworkers supply houses. Prices range from $15.00 to $25.00 or so at Highland Hardware in Atlanta. I have the 6, 8, 12 and 20 oz patterns hanging over my woodworking bench. One final point..I hate the steel and fibre glass shafted types..they make my hand numb in short order. You cant beat Ash or hickory..or best of all the straight grained, English walnut, laminated with hickory that I have used to re-haft several of my "Best" hammers. teenut Known as Bob's Hammer in my boxing days! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT: More on the Concorde crash From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 06 Sep 2000 13:08:21 GMT -------- PLAlbrecht wrote: > > >So it may not have been a design flaw after all. > > > > Yeah it was. 1). > > Pete You might as well quit trying to change Pete's view point..he has made up his Volksturm mind that the Concorde is a Bummer. Sorry I have to disagree on this point Pete, but I learned long ago not to argue with a made up mind. The Concorde WILL fly again..having flown it one time (Bahrain to London) I wouldn't hesitate to fly it again! Respectfully, teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Razor stropping? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 06 Sep 2000 13:13:03 GMT -------- RobertDurango wrote: > > Thanks to all those who responded to the stropping questions I posed. > > I have a good idea of theprocess now, and have started to experiment with an > old slab of leather I have. Perhaps I get really good very fast. > > Thanks to you all. > Robert Durango I finish strop my blades on a folded news paper! I now know why my mother issued dire threats about using her best dressmaking scissors to cut paper! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Miscelllaneous Musings on the origins of Craftsmanship. From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 06 Sep 2000 14:02:47 GMT -------- I have often wondered where "Craftsmanship" is aquired and nurtured. For some it is a God given Talent..a gift that will emerge, regardles of circumstances. For others, I believe, it begins in childhood, nurtured in the home. My Father was a Master Plumber, Glazier and Lead Burner. A very taciturn but wise and kindly Gentleman who had many apprentices of his own, and who influenced me greatly. I miss him and his sage advice even 18 years after his death in 1982. His "craftsmanship" did not extend to DIY work at home..where it could be a bit rough and ready. But his Lead burning, stained glass framing and plumber's wiped joints were joy to behold. I learned much from working alongside him and was encouraged in my interests all the way. Tools were always top of my Christmas list! Later, his influence helped secure me one of the last 6 year Apprenticeships to be offered in the UK..and insisted that I stick with it when I experienced a swift and unplanned marriage at age 17!! Though my Career path took me through Research, Development and Customer Application paths..on to Engineering Sales, and Export Sales travel and living in many Countries..he always confided to my Mum (now 82 and fiercely fit and independed as befits her Gypsy (Romany) origins) that I would, one day, return to my craft and the use of my hands to earn a living. I have always maintained a comprehensive workshop at home, and my four children were brought up in a "Can Do" environment that has manifested itself in a variety of ways. My #2 son Apprenticed as a painter, decorator and sign painter (after discovering that my old alma mater no longer offered apprenticeships!!) and went on to found his own, highly successful Commercial Painting company. His woodgraining and Faux Marble work is outstanding, while a "Trompe d'oeil" painting of a violin, hanging on the back of his study door just glows with life and begs one to take down and handle it. I. myself, have been active in organising apprentice training schools and programs..but, in my mind, it all begins in the home! Now, as I enter a new chapter of life, freshly victorious from a battle with, potentially deadly, lung cancer, I am ready to, once again start to teach and nurture the interests of young people, and am actively searching for apprentices willing to work hard and become Craftsmen in their own right. If you think you fit the bill, and are willing to make the sacrifices of a long term apprenticeship (starting at $10 to $15.00 an hour, depending on experience) mail or fax your resume to me at: Express Tool & Die Company 5390 Oakdale Rd Smyrna, GA 30082 fx 404 792 2668 or e-mail me direct: teenut@hotmail.com teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT: More on the Concorde crash From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 06 Sep 2000 14:32:59 GMT -------- PLAlbrecht wrote: > > >The Concorde WILL fly again. > > Bet? > > Pete Yeh! Whatcher got? tee ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT: More on the Concorde crash From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 07 Sep 2000 10:46:52 GMT -------- PLAlbrecht wrote: > > >Bah! Kids stuff... you havent had donuts until you have pigged out on Krispy > >Kremes... > > I'm afraid it's becoming a yuppie item. Like Starbucks. I flat refuse... > > Pete I agree there..not the "yuppie" aspect..But almost two bucks for a cup of driveway sealer has to be one of the greatest consumer marketing ploys ever pulled on the American Public. Jeez..Even McDonalds serves better coffee! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: HT Furnace Controller From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 07 Sep 2000 10:53:59 GMT -------- I am in the market for a Heat Tratment furnace controller..preferably 100 or 220 V with a thermocouple suitable for temperatures up to 2000 Deg F. Anybody got one for sale..or can you point me to a suitable supplier and model#? Even a kit of parts or a circuit board diagram that my Son can put togethher! Thanks, teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT British crime (only remotely related to gun control) From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 07 Sep 2000 11:05:08 GMT -------- Wolfgang Habicher wrote: > > Steve: > > Lighten up, man! No sense of humour??????? > > What was that crack about WWII? Britain won that??? > > Ha, Ha, Ha, Ha! > > Wolfgang You Buggers certainly LOST it! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: HT Furnace Controller From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 07 Sep 2000 20:30:35 GMT -------- Spehro Pefhany wrote: > > The renowned Robert Bastow wrote: > > I am in the market for a Heat Tratment furnace controller..preferably 100 or 220 > > V with a thermocouple suitable for temperatures up to 2000 Deg F. > > Hello, Robert, > > How much of a hurry are you in? What features are you looking for? > > I've got at least one Ramp + Soak unit (or one that will just maintain > a constant temperature) laying around that I could lend you until my > ultimate one is finished. > > Real precision time-proportioning PID control with the settings, of > course, none of this Mickey-Mouse(TM) craaaap they foist off for hobby > kiln use! > > Best regards, > -- > =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= > Spehro Pefhany --"it's the network..." "The Journey is the reward" > speff@interlog.com Info for manufacturers: http://www.trexon.com > Embedded software/hardware/analog Info for designers: http://www.speff.com > Contributions invited->The AVR-gcc FAQ is at: http://www.BlueCollarLinux.com > =-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= Hi Spehro, Thanks for the offer..I'll take you up on it just to give me some experience and to look around for my own. You can mail it to me at: Robert Bastow Express Tool & Die Company 5390 Oakdale Rd Smyrna GA 30338 USA I will send you a check to reimburse the expenses. What voltage does it need? Temperature range? Will it give a 12VDC signal to cut off the gas supply and fan motor? Thank you very much. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT British crime (only remotely related to gun control) From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 07 Sep 2000 20:35:23 GMT -------- PLAlbrecht wrote: > > >Well share the joke, when did Germany win anything? > > Well, let's see now. 55 years on, Germany is about the same size it was after > WW1. Missing a few bits around the Polish border and East Prussia. > > The British Empire is so old a joke it's not funny anymore. Britain has lost > all of its colonies and posessions except, what, the Falklands? A few islands > in the Carribbean? India, Hong Kong, everything in Southeast Asia, South > Africa, most of non-French Africa, the entire Middle East, especially the bits > with oil under them... The days of "the sun never sets on the British Empire" > are decades gone. The stuff it used to get for next to nothing from its > colonies, it now has to buy -- or do without. > > Britain still can't build a decent car to save its life. The British auto > industry has ceased to exist; cars are still made there but all of its major > manufacturers and most of the minor ones are owned by foreign interests, > including the "losers" of WW2 (Germany and Japan; VW, BMW, Toyota) and they > call the shots. (At last count the largest British-owned car company was... > Marcos. Who?) And for more than a decade after "winning" the war, Britain had > to export those poor excuses just to get foreign currency to buy food, steel, > etc. > > German cars are arguably the performance and quality standard for the rest of > the world (well, they were until imaginary moose started knocking over small > Mercedes and the big Mercedes needed tank transporters to go by rail). Are they > really that good? Doesn't matter, most of the world thinks they are -- and > wouldn't touch a British-made car with a bargepole. > > Britain (and France) received more money from the U.S. under the Marshall Plan > -- and did less with it: > > U.S. Economic Assistance > Under the European Recovery Program: > April 3, 1948 - June 30, 1952 > (Total Amount in Millions of U.S. Dollars) > > United Kingdom 3,189.8 > France 2,713.6 > Italy 1,508.8 > Germany (West 1,390.6 > > from > http://www.germany-info.org/newcontent/ff/ff_6c.html > > Also > http://www.libertyhaven.com/countriesandregions/germany/originsgerman.html > > wherein we read > "The Marshall Plan certainly helped, but its influence was not great enough to > cause the German "miracle." As historian LaVerne Ripley points out, "vastly > larger sums have been donated to other countries without preventing their > economic disaster."4 > > Britain happily dragged off all the shrapnel-riddled machinery (metalworking > content) from bombed-out German plants as war booty to replace their own > machinery. Germany, given no choice, happily made newer, better machinery and > used those to bury British industry. For example, Lord Rootes himself went > through the bombed-out VW plant looking for one single, specific press to carry > off; for whatever reason, he didn't take it, and British industry rejected the > whole VW idea as beneath contempt. (See the recent books by Karl Ludvigsen, > "People's Car : A Facsimile of B.I.O.S. Final Report No. 998 Investigation into > the Design and Performance of the Volkswagen or German People's Car" and "The > Battle for the Beetle.") VW's still here, those very same machines are still > working, now in Mexico still punching out Old Beetles, but Austin, Hillman, and > the rest are long gone. The Russians, similary looking for a freebie, dragged > off the entire Opel Kadett assembly line and then built the car as the > Moskvitch for 12 years. Meanwhile Opel, as a GM subsidiary with deep pockets in > Detroit, said "good riddance" and built more modern cars from 1948. > > The whole phenomenon is summed up in the phrase "German Economic Miracle," a > time period from about 1948 to 1965ish (some say 1975ish-1980). There was never > a "British economic miracle." After the war, Germany got Ludwig Erhard. And > Britain voted out Churchill and voted in Labour. That's the key difference. By > the time Churchill got back in, it was too late. > > Germany's greatest triumph however is in public relations, not engineering or > manufacturing (both of which they're as capable of screwing up as anybody > else). Rightly or wrongly, they've convinced the entire world that if they > build it, it's the best there is. And they manage to charge extra for it. (This > is rapidly ending; 6 weeks paid vacation etc., socialized everything, take > their toll and the "miracle" is already history). > > And Japan? The same could apply to them. They're more of an economic powerhouse > now than they were before 1941. Japanese products are sought out as quality, > often as good as or even better than German. (Nikon vs. Leica? Lexus vs. > Mercedes? Honda vs. VW? Sony vs.... vs... never mind). > > 20-odd years ago, Car and Driver magazine had a "year in review" issue with a > headline "Germany and Japan win WW2 -- late, but convincingly." It's even more > true today. > > Italy shoulda stuck it out, taken a very profitable defeat, and not changed > sides so quickly. > > Pete And the Old German Imperial Empire? Or the Thousand Year Riech? Get real Pete and stop blathering. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Floating reamers From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 07 Sep 2000 20:52:51 GMT -------- Jack Erbes wrote: > There are no idiots here, Ed. > > Pretty much. On the one I use for cutting rifle chambers the reamer is > held parallel with the tailstock quill center by the MT-2 shank it is > mounted on. The reamer can float axially around, but parallel to, the > spindle centerline as it follows the bore in the rifle barrel. I think > nearly any reamer will shift any where from very slightly to a lot > depending on the concentricity and condition of the cutting edges. The > best shift very little of course. > > A rigidly mounted, off center reamer will cut an oversized hole as as > the barrel rotates around it and the cutting forces are badly skewed and > out of balance. And that can also break cutting edges or the reamer. > I have just built a combined floating reamer holder and coolant manifold similar to the one you describe. It allows axial, but not radial compliance with the spindle center line. This for raming the 7" long bolt channel in my Mauser actions in 8620 steel (normalised) After a few trials and tribulations, I am getting a mirror finish in the bore..ready for a final lick with a diamond lap. I made the first examples from CRS..FORGET IT!! Why do I still piss around with that stuff? Masochism? The reamer I am using is a coolant fed, carbide 3/4" straight flute from MSC. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: OT British crime (only remotely related to gun control) From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 08 Sep 2000 01:19:39 GMT -------- Brian Drummond wrote: > Of three hundred (or so) languages spoken in India, English is the third > most popular. > But it is the Universal Language there in industry, commerce and government. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Furnace brazing From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 08 Sep 2000 01:37:15 GMT -------- I am looking into the possibilities of furnace brazing..with copper foil..to joint the bolt handle (4140) to the bolt body (Thompson 60 case shafting, 3/4" diameter) for the new range of Mauser actions we are building. I have talked to my Heat Treating Company, who will be Gas Carburising the Receivers (8620) at a very reasonable cost..and they do this process for several customers. It involves fixturing and heating in a closed atmosphere to braze the joint, then reheating and oil quenching to re-harden. This will give enough hardness to the bolt handle extraction cam to serve the purpose. Copper melts at a high enough temperature not to let go at heat treatment temp. Do any of our listers have sources of information, suppliers etc for the copper foil and fluxes. We can do this processing in out own shop, wrapping the components in stainless steel foil for both operations...It DO get a bit spendy to shop it out!! Thanks, teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Floating reamers From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 08 Sep 2000 12:45:16 GMT -------- Gary Coffman wrote: > > On Thu, 07 Sep 2000 20:52:51 GMT, Robert Bastow wrote: > >I have just built a combined floating reamer holder and coolant manifold similar > >to the one you describe. It allows axial, but not radial compliance with the > >spindle center line. > > Isn't that backwards terminology? The idea of the floating holder is that the > reamer can move radially, IE at right angles to the bore axis, to find alignment > with the hole, but isn't allowed to "cant" at an angle to the bore axis, or walk > axially in and out. > > Gary > Gary Coffman KE4ZV | You make it |mail to ke4zv@bellsouth.net > 534 Shannon Way | We break it | > Lawrenceville, GA | Guaranteed | That IS what I meant to convey. Brain Fart! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Furnace brazing From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 09 Sep 2000 00:45:54 GMT -------- eberlein wrote: > Welding is possible, as I'm sure you know, but the choice of filler material and > compatibllity with the blueing process is important, also. > I thought about plug welding in a couple of places through countersunk holes. However, the bolt material is 60Case Thompson shafting with a thick, carburised outer layer. I would expect that the resultant weld would be brittle because of it's resulting high carbon content. African temperatures tend to produce higher pressures and the resulting sticky extraction. I would hate to see the bolt handle pop off, in the middle of the Veldt, because some white hunter was whaling on it with an ironwood branch! I just got a confirmed order in from a custom rifle maker in Las Vegas, for TEN of my actions. I am making plans to exhibit at the upcoming Safari Club show, there in Jan 2001. He has been asked to contribute one of two rifles, commissioned by the Safari Club, annually, and auctioned off to members, and plans to use one of my actions for it. The last such rifle, a Mauser actioned 416 Rigby caliber DGR, fetched $140,000, and is considered the top honor bestowed by the industry. Fame and fortune are just around the corner! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Furnace brazing From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 09 Sep 2000 14:38:39 GMT -------- Gary Coffman wrote: > > On Sat, 09 Sep 2000 00:45:54 GMT, Robert Bastow wrote: > >eberlein wrote: > > > >> Welding is possible, as I'm sure you know, but the choice of filler material and > >> compatibllity with the blueing process is important, also. > > > >I thought about plug welding in a couple of places through countersunk holes. > >However, the bolt material is 60Case Thompson shafting with a thick, carburised > >outer layer. I would expect that the resultant weld would be brittle because of > >it's resulting high carbon content. > > Well, whether you braze or weld, you're going to need to grind a flat on the > bolt to get a good joint. That should cut through the case. You don't want to > weld or braze directly to a case hardened surface. That would be a brittle > joint because the case itself is brittle. If you TIG weld the handle on, you > can make a satisfactory butt joint by Veeing out the handle where it meets > the bolt and filling with weld. But if you braze, you need the tightest capillary > fit up you can get. A brazed joint is strongest when the braze has to span > the smallest gap. A pure butt braze still isn't the best idea. If you can give > the joint mechanical support, IE a shoulder, it'll be lots stronger. > > Gary > Gary Coffman KE4ZV | You make it |mail to ke4zv@bellsouth.net > 534 Shannon Way | We break it | > Lawrenceville, GA | Guaranteed | The bolt handle and it's sleeve are in one piece..joint geometry would not allow an undercut deep enough to eliminate the very thick case on this 60case shafting. A very minimal gap is called for by the people who will be doing the furnace brazing. This method has been succesfully used to give a VERY strong joint on many differnt rifle bolts..beginning with, IIR, the model 1917 and P1914 Enfields. It is succesfully used today, by Winchester on the Model 70 and Remington's Model 700. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Triumph Lathe From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 09 Sep 2000 14:44:23 GMT -------- "Paul G. Shultz" wrote: > > A person in town has a Triumph 7 1/2" X 48" lathe for sale. He says he > thinks it is thirty or more years old. Are any readers of this group > familiar with this machine? Are there any words of wisdom re this > lathe? Probably a Colchester Triumph, marked here by Clausing..who may have spares for it. Good, heavy machine. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Q: (faq) Quenching oil From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 09 Sep 2000 17:02:51 GMT -------- Bucky Goldstein wrote: > > This is probably a FAQ, but what do you use for quenching oil for > hardening, say, drill rod? I spoke with a blacksmith the other > day who said he used salad oil: it works, he said, and it smells > nice and it doesn't catch fire. What do you think? Anything > wrong with this? > > Sorry, I have a lot of reading to do on this topic. Two books > should be arriving next week. Only I have to harden some stuff > today. (Have Reil forge, will sizzle.) > > -- > Bucky Goldstein > > I lost a button hole. I use peanut oil for my blades..doesn't smell! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Railway Wheel Lathe - Picture in dropbox From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 10 Sep 2000 00:48:02 GMT -------- "DoN. Nichols" wrote:> >lathe was tucked away in a corner, minding its own business. > > Well ... according to the photo, the machine is an old line > shaft driven machine which is currently connected to a big white > electric motor on the wall above and behind it, which suggests that they > made this modification so they *could* use it from time to time. > Otherwise, they would have it hooked to some dummy lineshafting just to > show what it would normally have looked like in the shop. > I ran a double headstock railway wheel lathe for a while..Donkey work! The drivers where up to six feet in diameter! We used a huge goosenecked, 6" wide forming tool to cut the flanges and tread in on pass. Lots of suphurised oil and SLOOOW reverse speed to avoid chatter. Those (IIRC) manganese steel tyres were as tough as old boots and work hardened in a heartbeat if you allowed the tool to dwell. The chips came off in crinkly ribbo to the sound of frying bacon and lots of smoke. Nowadays it would be don with a tracing or CNC lathe using a single point tool. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Railway Wheel Lathe - Picture in dropbox From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 11 Sep 2000 11:27:35 GMT -------- Janos Ero wrote: > > Nigel Eaton wrote: > > > Whilst we were on our honeymoon we visited a steam museum (didn't I say > > she was great?). We found a really interesting lathe (big bugger!) that > > had been used to turn railway wheels. There's a picture in the dropbox > > "Wheel_Lathe.jpg". Enjoy! > > Hm. I thought the really big railway wheel lathes were > horizontal ones, with vertical axle. This one is surely > suitable for car wheels, but not for turning large (70-80") > steam locomotive wheels. > > Or am I mistaken? > > Janos Ero The one I ran had a horizontal spindle and was 96" Swing. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Investment casting steel From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 20 Sep 2000 17:25:41 GMT -------- I would like to investigate the possibilities of investment casting certain of my gun parts in 4340 and 8620 steel. Does anyone know of a commercial company who can do this from my own wax models? I will also requaire a wax injection moulding machine. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Trap door Springfeild ramrods From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 22 Sep 2000 22:32:23 GMT -------- Glen wrote: > > I have a commercial machine shop, a customer asked me to quote on > producing 50 ramrods for trapdoor Springfield rifles. The sample I have > is well over 100 years old, it appears to be some level of spring > hardness (I haven't rockwell tested it yet) and I'm loath to bid on it > as it's way too long for my CNC. It has an average diameter of about > 3/16" that swells at one end to approximately .400 with various geometry > at that end. The taper of the thing is very subtle down most of the > length, you can measure it but scarcely see it. My question is, how was > this produced? I can't imagine turning something 40" long and 3/16" > diameter with a follow rest. Was it turned rough thus and then heat > treated followed by grinding? I'm thinking this must have been made on > very specialized turning and grinding equipment. Does anyone here know? > Glen Thet are forged in split dies and then heat treated..as you note, to spring temper. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Breach lock design ideas From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 02 Oct 2000 17:03:38 GMT -------- Grant Erwin wrote: > > The breech on the French 75 used Welin interrupted threads. The French 75 did NOT use a Welin breach but a Jorgenson ?? eccentric block. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Breach lock design ideas From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 08 Oct 2000 20:42:16 GMT -------- Robert Bastow wrote: > > Grant Erwin wrote: > > > > The breech on the French 75 used Welin interrupted threads. > > The French 75 did NOT use a Welin breach but a Jorgenson ?? eccentric block. > > teenut Correction..It was the NORDENFELDT Eccentric Screw Breech. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: CNC Machining and standard machining From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 08 Oct 2000 20:55:36 GMT -------- Glen wrote: > > what I think I see in the future is a lot more of the electronic engine > lathes (halfway between a full CNC and a manual lathe, run it manually with > electronic handwheels or use the manual actions to "teach" the controller > what to do the next time, or program at the PC and run a part without the > handwheels) and fewer and fewer manuals in the job shop arena. If true then > eventually we or our descendants will see fewer and fewer used manual > industrial machines coming into the marketplace. Even now you will see the > electronic ones going cheap as used, on ebay recently a 1995 Standard Modern > sold for I think $6100, and they sell new for over $35,000 I think. > I absolutely love what I can do with my CNC lathe, but I wonder if I will > ever look at a 15 year old Mazak CNC with the dewy eyes that I get looking > at a Reed Prentice from the 50's now (best engine lathe ever built IMHO) For > one thing > someone will have to certify that the controls work as they did when new, > and horror of horrors the problem of parts availability will have to be > assured, electronic as well as iron. It will be interesting to watch. > Glen > Jean-Marc Fafard wrote: > > > Hello! > > > > With the time, I'm getting more and more curious about the world of > > metalworking. Inevitably, I have come along with the words "CNC > > machining" in my various readings. > > > > So, is "standard" machining have it place today (i mean lathe, press > > drill, metal shaper, milling machine, etc.) in a world full of CNC > > machines? > > > > I know that industry have an intensive use of CNC. The big boys use > > it because in very short time, you can have a complex machined piece > > exactly as you specified in your hands. People around me are saying > > that is the future, that's it, that's all. > > > > But the future have a price. I don't know a lot of people who have > > a Mazak CNC machine (or others big names) in their basements.... For a > > job as a machinist in aeronautics as an example, this is a must. But > > for others applications, I'm sure that standard machining have it place > > in this world. > > > > Just wondering about the subject. > > > > Thanks, > > > > Jean-Marc Fafard Hi, I recently bought a new TRAC lathe, 14 X 40 which has the manual/CNC options. Using handwheels and the DRO it can be used as conventional lathe..Or it has full CNC capability in two axes. Tools have to be changed manually and the tailstock is hand operated too. Beats me why this mode of operation took so long to hit the market..it seems to me to be the logical FIST progression into full CNC Control. My "Conventional" Machinists and Tool Makers love it and the basic operation is very simple and logical, with "ordinary language" commands rather than G and M codes etc. All in all a very robust, accurate and versatile machine tool. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: CNC Machining and standard machining From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 08 Oct 2000 21:01:06 GMT -------- Glen wrote: > > I'm sorry, I don't understand the TIG reference, repairing insert pockets? > There have been quit a few more in my shop needing repair since using the > CNC but that's part of the learning curve, isn't it? > Glen > > Galaxy@Berkshire.net wrote: > > > I don't feel right selling a part that's fixed with weld. Machined > > parts are very expensive. When a company spends alot of money on parts > > they expect high quality. I can see fixing your own tooling by welding > > though. > > > > Regards, > > Galaxy > > > > > > > > > Whoa!!! Buy the TIG welder before you buy the CNC. Get some practice > > > with the welding. Then run the CNC. > > > > > > Brian Lawson > > > Windsor, Ontario. > > > XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX > > > > > > On Fri, 06 Oct 2000 16:47:11 -0400, Wolfgang Habicher > > > wrote: > > > > > > >CNC also shines on one-off parts that are geometrically complex, and > > > >those where the likelihood of ONE machining error would scrap the > > work > > > >piece. > > > >Wolfgang > > > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > > Before you buy. I used to have a small, succesful business, in Canada (CanTool Inc.) that repaired insert pockets with fine tig welding and hand finishing with dental grinders..A task well suited to female labor. The tools repaired varied from simple single point lathe tools, to complex, multi pocketd broaches etc for the automotive industry, We made pretty good money, for a while, until the NAFTA agreements killed Canadian Industry. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking,alt.education,alt.computer.consultants Subject: Re: Pretty Bad From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 13 Oct 2000 18:45:49 GMT -------- Ray Brandes wrote: I am a journeyman tool and die maker with papers and > all and as late as 1995 was offered $12.50 in Georgia> > George I START my Tool & Die Makers at DOUBLE that rate (In Georgia) I am looking for a couple of T&D makerts and a couple of GOOD machinists with programming experience...Spresd the word! teenut Express Tool & Die Company Express Rifle Company 5390 Oakdale Rd Smyrna GA 30082 404 799 6304 ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Hi Guys! SS100 Information From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2000 04:04:02 GMT -------- Hi Guys, A timely reminder from Fitch reminded me that I have been absent from these pages too long. I am doing much better now..The road to recovery from all the Chemo Has been long and hard and I still have a long way to go. In addition to the lung cancer, I had an operation to suposedly??repair a wrecked shoulder and recently contrived to break my damned ankle..thoroughly. The new company is doing well..we just started a second shift..Much of my time has been occupied in bringing the Magnum Mauser actions into production. These are selling quite well with orders from South Africa taking the lead (Surprise!) It is getting time to honorably retire (Not sell!!) the XJV12 and I have been hankering after an SS100 replica built by Suffolk Engineering in the UK. Do any of our readers have any knowledge of the breed? I am lead to understand it is a VERY close replica (not Cheap) and available fully finished or in a kit form. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Hi Guys! SS100 Information From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 16 Nov 2000 01:32:04 GMT -------- Dan Caster wrote:> > teenut > > > > I can still remember seeing a SS100 for the first and I think the last > time in about 1954. Besides how beautiful it looked, the other thing I > seem to remember is that it had a Chevie engine in it. Do you know > what the engine options are for the replica? > > The other car that is in that class is the 1936 Cord. Both of them are > distinctive and beautiful cars. > Dan > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. The "donor" car for the Suffolk SS100 replica is an XJ6 complete with six cylinder 4.0 litre Jag engine teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: What method to produce a new tool? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 22 Nov 2000 00:46:38 GMT -------- jdoneill12@my-deja.com wrote: > > I'm looking for a method, and a company, to manufacture a tool from > M2 steel for me. It is basically a round tube, 1 & 1/4" OD, 1" ID, 4" > long, sharpened on one end, with a 35 degree bevel, hardened and > tempered. What is the best way to make it? Investment casting, > powdered metal, drill out a solid bar, or "other". > I just got a patent on this, was offered a license agreement by a > tool company, but would like to have some fun with it. The license > agreement left me with no input or control, just royalties, if they can > sell it. > The highest price I can pay is about $50 each, initial quantity 100. > Any advice or help with this will be greatly appreciated. > John O'Neill > > Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/ > Before you buy. I will make you all you need for that price! teenut Express Tool & Die, Atlanta ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Trouble at 't mill again! From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 18 Dec 2000 14:54:49 GMT -------- Regeretfully my recent CAT-Scans have shown that my troubles are by no means over...The Small Cell Lung Cancer..as is its frequent habit... Has spread to the right side of my Brain, my lower spine and pelvis, my ribs and lungs and even the shoulder I recently had operated on for bone spurs, plus the ankle I recently broke. "Riddled" would be the operative word!! I have already started radiation treatment on the brain etc. and a decision will be made totday whether to start straight back on chemo-therapy concurrent with the radiation. This promises to be a tough one to beat so your prayers and good wishes will be much appreciated. Unlike the Last bout with Lung Cancer, this already hurts like hell and I am scared of deterioration in brain and bodily functions. Already I could start my own Medlin Cartel with the pain killers they are feeding me..and I am noticing some confusion and memory losses. Please excuse any spelling or grammatical mistakes that may crop up. Once more into the "Valley of the Shadow" to kick some serious butt!! Will those Buggers never learn? teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Trouble at 't mill again! From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 20 Dec 2000 13:24:56 GMT -------- Brian Lawson wrote: > > I suspect most of on RCM are a bit like me, teenut. Don't really know > what to say, but I think that it is important that we all DO say Hi, > just to let you know you've got lots of rooters out here. I've > never had to face anything like you have, and we were all VERY pleased > with the early results you had. > > We're all still here for you, and wish you the best. You've got good > family and good medical people. You've got good friends here and at > home too, I believe. > > All the best. > > Brian Lawson > Windsor, Ontario > > ps.. I've often wondered if there was a significance to your choosing > "teenut" as an on-line handle? Story here, or what? Thanks for all the good wishes guys..It really does help a lot. Ref: teenut as my "handle" When I first got onto the internet I was doing a lot of Blacksmithing..Particularly Forge welding of "damascus type" steels and blade making. The "handle I originally chose to reflec this interest was "tubalcain" from the biblical reference to Tubalcain..master of al "artificers in brass and iron" As I found my way onto Home metalshop lists and particularly to Model Engineering Groups, I foun this confused and even angered a few of these types why associated the name more with "Tubal Cain" the pen name of a famous, much loved and respected English writer of "Model Engineering" renown. Eventually I got fed up of explaining that I was not THAT Tubal Cain nor had any pretentions to be judged as his equal(far too big a footsteps for me to fill) So I decided to let tyhe whole thing drop and find a new, less contentious handle..One with machinist conotationsthat was easy to rmembet, type and spell to trduce the amount of walking my fingers would need to do! Little did I realise the perverted ways in which spammers work..for a while I was buried with stuff about teenage porn pages!!(You wanna buy some postcards Sailor") "teenut" (note the lower case..for further differentiation and ease of typing) seems to fit the bill for now..though I am sure we all cast around from time to time for that "perfect Handle" I seem to have become well enough known by this name...with less contention and problems..so I think I will stick with it for a while. On that same Note..Please don't call me "Bob"! I prefer "Robert" or "teenut" I was "BOB BASTOW" for many years and he was NOT a guy you wanted to mess with. He served a purpose in my life, career and Business for an extended period..but his "services" are no longer required..or desireble. I only let him out of his cage when I go talk to the Bank Manager or the Jaguar Dealer. My Wife, a dynamite lady in her own right, uses it as the ultimate threat for suchlike recalcitrant Service People..As in.." you had best give ME the right answers..Or I will bring BOB down to have a chat with you! You've never met BOB BASTOW have you?!!"..He can spoil your whole Millenium! I recall a run-in she had over the sudden disppearence of the extended warranty on the XJ V 12 Jaguar. She leaned over the Dealership manager's desk ans asked him softly if "BOB" had ever explained his own return policy to the Gentleman? To his dumbly shaking head, She explained that I would personally return the vehicle to his Showroom..Right through the front F***ING WINDOW!!! He blanched and folded to our demands!! Just out of curiosity. What new "handles"would our listers chose for them selves (or for ME come to that?) faced with the need to change for any reason? Inquiring Minds would like to know. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Why can't I use a hack saw? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 21 Dec 2000 00:45:10 GMT -------- AAFRadio@erols.com wrote: > > Ivan Vegvary wrote: > > > I'm making a small part (3/8"± dia.) in the lathe. Rather than using > > a cutoff tool (I'm an amateur, too much chatter, etc.) why won't a > > plain old hack saw work? > > Others have addressed your basic question, but I haven't seen another > point expressed yet. I seem to recall teenut saying that any employee > he caught with a hacksaw near a lathe was fired on the spot. I might be > misquoting him, and goodness knows I've done plenty of it, but some > reasons pop out at me: > > Whether the lathe is turning or not, the swarf from the saw blade seems > more abrasive than turned swarf, and it's not something you would want > in between the saddle and the ways. Take a look at some of it under a > microscope and you'll see the difference. The mitigation here is the > same one necessary for grinding on the lathe, which is covering up the > ways as much as possible, but I've personally never been that > meticulous, or perhaps usually in a hurry in this phase of the > operation. That brings up the other bugaboo, and that's the sudden > breakthrough that I have experienced at times at the end of the cut, > causing the blade to come perilously close to something I would > ordinarily *not* want to cut. > > If the lathe is turning, you're holding a pretty big contraption fairly > close to a large spinning mass. Though I know nothing will *ever* > happen to *me* because I'm such a good person, actuarial tables and > Murphy have occasionally decided otherwise. :-) Yes, I know we all use > a file, but the geometry is different and the mass is much smaller. > > Those are the only drawbacks I can think of to using a hacksaw on the > lathe. Am I missing any? As far as I know, teenut never did an > exhaustive list of why most machine shops frown on such a procedure, if > not outright prohibit it. > > Please don't shoot the messenger, :-) > Mike Hanz > Herndon, VA Th"senior" aprrentice in question took a hacksaw to cut off 6 lengths of 3/16"Diameter drill rod an managed to put six coresponding slots in the back shear om my Smart and Brown Model A tool room lathe..not a week after I hd finished reqrinding it, fitting turcite wayliners and hand scraping it to "schesinger"limits. He was fired on the spot and sent back to his co-op school to explain why. His "super offered to boil him in oi for me!! I rehired him the following monday when the point had had had time to sink in snd he eventually became a top tool room machinist. "First you have to get their attention!! teenut..being "BOB"! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Why can't I use a hack saw? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 21 Dec 2000 00:50:11 GMT -------- boris beizer wrote: > > wrote in message news:3A40EE7D.DC48277B@erols.com... > > Ivan Vegvary wrote: > > > > > I'm making a small part (3/8"± dia.) in the lathe. Rather than using > > > a cutoff tool (I'm an amateur, too much chatter, etc.) why won't a > > > plain old hack saw work? It will..but is much slower and less accurate thn the results achieved if you make the effort to learn how to do the job properly. Your employer has a right to expect that you will doo your job accurately and efficiently. Every timr you fail to do that you are steling money from him that he has to work for and provide to furnish your tools ,materials and wages. teenut > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Why can't I use a hack saw? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 23 Dec 2000 03:16:07 GMT -------- John Flanagan wrote: > > On Thu, 21 Dec 2000 00:45:10 GMT, Robert Bastow > wrote: > > > > >Th"senior" aprrentice in question took a hacksaw to cut off 6 lengths of > >3/16"Diameter drill rod an managed to put six coresponding slots in the back > >shear om my Smart and Brown Model A tool room lathe..not a week after I hd > >finished reqrinding it, fitting turcite wayliners and hand scraping it to > >"schesinger"limits. He was fired on the spot and sent back to his co-op school > >to explain why. His "super offered to boil him in oi for me!! I rehired him > >the following monday when the point had had had time to sink in snd he > >eventually became a top tool room machinist. "First you have to get their > >attention!! > > > >teenut..being "BOB"! > > Dog gone teenut, you probably hurt his feelings. So did he come back > to ask for his job or did you go to him to offer it? I'd say this > method is very effective, especially when they realize it wasn't > personal but meant to impress. I'd say you got his attention. > > John I went and offered him is job even though the School Super told me I had no such obligation. His heart WANTED that job and I didn't feel the need or desire to destroy that kind of dream just because I was personally miffed. He never let me (or himself) down again!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Gun Barrels:How To make them From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 23 Dec 2000 04:23:02 GMT -------- Rob wrote: > > In article <3A42DD12.2786C35C@ix.netcom.com>, Ttools@ix.netcom.com wrote: > > > Brownells (has web site) gunsmith supply Monta Zoma Iowa, has a great little > > book on how to Drill and riffle gun gun barrels using a small 10" or so lathe. > > Howe Gunsmithing has the blue print for the cutting head. Howes also shows how > > to do rifling on a milling machine using an indexing head. > > TT > > > > > > What's the title of these books? How can you reach Howe Gunsmithing? > > Thanks, > Rob > > Rob Dennett, Technical Specialist > > Sapient > > 816 Congress Suite 900 > Austin, TX 78701 > (512) 651 - 8405 Why would want want to make one's own rifled barrel? You can buy a top quality, cheap,reliable and accurate barrel. either finished to fit, or in blank form from so many sources that any serious investigation of the materials, resources, tooling, equipment, practice and experience required to make one's own barrel will quickly reveal it to be an excersise in frustration, futlity and the waste of your cash and talents. Been there and done that (simply because it was illegal where I was at the time!) I would rank the cost and difficulty level of ever producing a GOOD barrel on the same level as producing an efficient, aircraft quality, gas turbine engine. teenut (not one known to put "the spoilers" to an idea very often) ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Help I can"t make up my mind which lathe From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 23 Dec 2000 04:33:06 GMT -------- HORSEMAN50 wrote: > > I want to buy a lathe but is an old atlas or south bend better than a new Enco > or Grizzly? What about the Smithy combos since I also want a mill? I only have > the money to do this once, so I have to get it right the first time. > > > > Craig God! I hope this IS a troll!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Re: Gun Barrels:How To make them From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2000 05:47:25 GMT -------- Haze wrote: > > Well, I can't argue that point. If you wanted to make one, the tooling > effort would add considerable to the ROI. I would imagine I would be > inclined to make multiple barrels. Still, I neglected the legal aspects. > Gas turbines, eh? That's a thought..... > By the way Lou, what's your thoughts on polar mounts for 12" telescopes. > (Noticed you address) > > "Lou Boyd" wrote in message > news:3A44BC47.C4A7B5C3@fairborn.dakotacom.net... > > Usually the price of a machined object reflects its difficulty of > > manufacture. A top quality rifle barrel from Hart or Shilen costs > > around $200 to $250 as a blank (bored, rifled, polished and contoured) > > and $500 to $550 properly installed on your rifle's action. That > > includes crowning, chambering, headspacing, and truing the action. > > > > I haven't seen any gas turbine engines for sale at that price, > > especially not installed in an aircraft and ready to run. Not even > > model engines for model aircraft. Do they exist? > > > > Making a rifling machine to make top quality barrels would probably be a > > comparable effort to building a gas turbine engine so the comparison > > would be valid if you only want to make one barrel. > > -- > > Lou Boyd > > > > Haze wrote: > > > > > > Can you help me understand how you are comparing the difficulty in > making a > > > rifled barrel - one part and maybe 5 operations - with an aircraft > quality > > > gas turbine engine? I admit to not being a machinist, but even to an > > > ignorant engineer (electrical - not mechanical) this statement seems > > > fallacious. I guess it would wouldn't it! teenut > > > > > > > Why would want want to make one's own rifled barrel? You can buy a > top > > > quality, > > > > cheap,reliable and accurate barrel. either finished to fit, or in > blank > > > form > > > > from so many sources that any serious investigation of the materials, > > > resources, > > > > tooling, equipment, practice and experience required to make one's own > > > barrel > > > > will quickly reveal it to be an excersise in frustration, futlity and > the > > > waste > > > > of your cash and talents. > > > > > > > > Been there and done that (simply because it was illegal where I was at > the > > > > time!) > > > > > > > > I would rank the cost and difficulty level of ever producing a GOOD > barrel > > > on > > > > the same level as producing an efficient, aircraft quality, gas > turbine > > > engine. > > > > > > > > teenut (not one known to put "the spoilers" to an idea very often) > > > > > > > > -- > > Lou Boyd > > Fairborn Observatory > > > > > > -----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =----- > > http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World! > > -----== Over 80,000 Newsgroups - 16 Different Servers! =----- > > ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How come most people get a lathe? From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2000 07:26:11 GMT -------- Ben Shank wrote: > > >I was taught long ago that with proper attachments, etc, a mill could be > >theoretically made using a lathe. > > >Not possible other way around?? > > The lathe is the most basic machine in the shop, the only machine that can > reproduce it's self..... Here we go again.. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Trouble at 't mill again! From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2000 15:40:11 GMT -------- Sam Spade wrote: > > On Mon, 18 Dec 2000 14:54:49 GMT, Robert Bastow > wrote: > > >Regeretfully my recent CAT-Scans have shown that my troubles are by no means > >over...The Small Cell Lung Cancer..as is its frequent habit... Has spread to the > >right side of my Brain, my lower spine and pelvis, my ribs and lungs and even > >the shoulder I recently had operated on for bone spurs, plus the ankle I > >recently broke. "Riddled" would be the operative word!! > > > >I have already started radiation treatment on the brain etc. and a decision will > >be made totday whether to start straight back on chemo-therapy concurrent with > >the radiation. > > > >This promises to be a tough one to beat so your prayers and good wishes will be > >much appreciated. Unlike the Last bout with Lung Cancer, this already hurts > >like hell and I am scared of deterioration in brain and bodily functions. > >Already I could start my own Medlin Cartel with the pain killers they are > >feeding me..and I am noticing some confusion and memory losses. Please excuse > >any spelling or grammatical mistakes that may crop up. > > > >Once more into the "Valley of the Shadow" to kick some serious butt!! Will those > >Buggers never learn? > > > >teenut > > It's disheartening to see a yorkshire lad fall on hard times - > I wish you the best teenut, Good Luck. > > NF Thanks, It is REALLY appreciated. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Help answer a 'Timely Question" From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 27 Dec 2000 16:02:22 GMT -------- The Christmas gift of a Rolex GMT-Master 11 wristwatch from my In-laws has raised a perrenial, thorny problem for me again. How do I get an ACCURATE TIME CHECK ON THIS CONTINENT??? Back in the UK I was able to pick up any public telephone, dial T. I.M. and get a speaking clock that gave Greenwich Mean time checks at ten second intervals. Have never found a similar system hear in the USA since first arriving back in ENID OK in the late seventies. Even the online computor time checkes say to allow "a few seconds processing time"..Useless as tits on a boar!!! How many seconds? Surely, this great nation, guardian of the Worlds time standards..from whom the Greenwich Observatory gets their own time checks has a means of simply conveying this fundamental information, quickly, reliably, and unambiguously accurately to the many people who may rely on it. HOW??? teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: copper patina From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 28 Dec 2000 13:12:54 GMT -------- Bear wrote: > > Can any one tell me how to speed up the process to turn copper green? Get an extra tom-cat teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Flat Drive Belts From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 28 Dec 2000 13:28:47 GMT -------- Tony wrote: > > I didn't put much info about the Alligator clips on my site because I don't > use them. What would I do with all my nice clipper machines? > > Any pin of suitable diameter will do, use whatever is handy if you don't > have any of the nylon coated pins. Wire brads work ok, drill rod, weedwacker > string perhaps. > > -- > Tony > > Visit TonysToolroom for Surplus Stuff for sale > and my Precision Scraping Page. > > Don't skive that belt before you visit my flatbelt page! > > www.csgnet.net/toolroom/ > > be nylon coated, or could I turn one from a piece of nylon bar) > > > > The site doesn't go through the steps of using the steelgrip type of belt > clip. > > > > The ones I have are "Alligator" brand steel belt lacing. Can't see what > swamp > > it comes from on the box. U. S. patents go back to 1909. > > > > As well as the steel lacing, there's a spacer rod to be temporarily > inserted at > > the very end of the belt so that it contacts that and the inside of the > curve > > in the longer set of teeth. > > > > You snap off a section of teeth, and place your square cut (yes, use a > square) > > belt end on a flat surface (table saw he whispered) with the cross piece > facing > > up, teeth spaced so that they don't line up too close to either belt side. > The > > longer teeth will be going out in front of the belt end, and down under > it. > > The spacer rod (probably 3/16 or so in width for the smaller clips) is > > inserted, then the teeth are hammered into the belting. > > > > The secton of the clip that you have on the top--the one with the cross > piece > > that holds all of the teeth together--will be facing outside the pulley. > So if > > you want leather smooth side in, make sure you account for this as you > proceed. > > > > Probably be prepared for a couple of practice attempts. But it really is > > doable without any clipper machine. > > > > The Allegator clips come with pins that are split. Each half round pin > has > > serrations that line up between clip teeth to keep the pin from coming > off. > > This shouldn't be a necessary component, however. > > > > Often leather sinew is used for pins. I have seen lots of make do pins as > > well. sometimes a finish nail serves as adequate, so long as the head's > not > > riding against a pulley shoulder. > > > > Frank Morrison > > Modern Drive belt manufacturers have the perfect answer to the needs of flat belt drives similar to the Southbend. They make a composite belting with a high tensile plastic outer and a split, grey chrome leather inside ddrive face. The -plasic outer absorbs shock and stretch and the inner, leather face provides an excellent traction, even when the pulley/belt starts to get oily. For a nominal charge the local distributot will cut the belt to width and length for you. He wil "skive" the ends, by grinding, ready for bonding, wrap them to keep out dirt and give or loan you enough cement to do a first-class, on-sight bonding, without having to disturb the headstock spindle and bearings. A couple of flat steel plates and "C" clamps are all that are needed to align and clamp the skived ends. Well worth the investment and effort on a good little lathe. Try looking up "Habasit" in you local phone book and go chat to them. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Help answer a 'Timely Question" From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 28 Dec 2000 13:41:31 GMT -------- JP wrote: > > Teenut, > > I didn't read all of the answers to your question so this may be a > redundant answer. There is lots of free software out there which will > sync your computer's clock to the atomic clock. You sure have some > nice inlaws!!! Hope you are feeling better and getting ready for the > next battle. All of us would jump in and help you if we could. Have > a happy new year. > > Regards, > JP > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > ">"The Christmas gift of a Rolex GMT-Master 11 wristwatch from my > In-laws has > ">"raised a perrenial, thorny problem for me again. > ">" > ">"How do I get an ACCURATE TIME CHECK ON THIS CONTINENT??? > ">" > ">"Back in the UK I was able to pick up any public telephone, dial T. > I.M. > ">"and get a speaking clock that gave Greenwich Mean time checks at > ten second > ">"intervals. > ">" > ">"Have never found a similar system hear in the USA since first > arriving back in > ">"ENID OK in the late seventies. > ">" > ">"Even the online computor time checkes say to allow "a few seconds > processing > ">"time"..Useless as tits on a boar!!! How many seconds? > ">" > ">"Surely, this great nation, guardian of the Worlds time > standards..from whom the > ">"Greenwich Observatory gets their own time checks has a means of > simply conveying > ">"this fundamental information, quickly, reliably, and unambiguously > accurately to > ">"the many people who may rely on it. > ">" > ">"HOW??? > ">" > ">"teenut Thanks JP, I have, with the help of our RCM'ers managed to get it " close enough" for now and spent an entertaining few minutes watching the local TV channel time check go "Up and down like a Bride's Nightie" this AM! I decided my new "toy was worth a little extra ($30.00 + 2 x AA batteries) investment and ordered one of the plethora of Atomic Radio Clocks from E-Bay last night. Feeling much better and stronger today. Thanks to ALL of you great guys and Gals for the words of support and encouragement. Who and where is "Altavoz"?? I need a good workout! Sincerely teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: has anyone made a contender barrel lug? From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 28 Dec 2000 16:16:45 GMT -------- Bray Haven wrote: > > I'm wondering if anyone here has made barrel lugs for thompson contender > barrels. Should be easy for a CNC machine to do. A couple slots and several > holes. I could use 20 or so of them if the price is right. Anyone care to > give it a try? Fax me a drawing and spec and I'll give you my best price. Robert Bastow Express Tool & Die Smyrna GA 30082 fx 404 792 2668 teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Model Engineer's-list From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 28 Dec 2000 16:33:42 GMT -------- I want to re-subscribe to the Model engineer's list but have lost the directions for????@ SWCP.com Can someone please fill me in on the protocol? Thanks. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Model Engineer's-list From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 28 Dec 2000 17:47:06 GMT -------- Bob Unitt wrote: > > In article <3A4B6C5F.5D5F6E41@Nospamhotmail.com>, Robert Bastow > writes > >I want to re-subscribe to the Model engineer's list but have lost the directions > >for????@ SWCP.com > > > >Can someone please fill me in on the protocol? > > > >Thanks. > > > >teenut > > Send the line "subscribe modeleng-list" to 'majordomo@swcp.com' . > > Welcome back - you've been missed... > -- > Bob Unitt (UK) Thanks Bob. Done! See yah over there. Robert ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: This group needs a rating system From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 28 Dec 2000 17:52:55 GMT -------- "Grumpy, the Third Dwarf" wrote: > > > > OK, this is going to be a bit tough for a lot of you "experts," as you > will want to shoot from the hip before reading and understanding the > entire posting. So do your blood pressure a favor and read right to > the end before reacting. > > OK, here goes... > > Having just read another bunch of unmitigated crap and opinion on this > news-group by people who think they know the answers, compared to > actually knowing what they are talking about, I think this group > could benefit from a rating system. > > I worry about newbies lurking here and reading stuff, then going away > thinking it is "for real" and maybe doing themselves some harm in the > process. > > We need a group of **knowledgable** peers to band together and agree > on their areas of real knowledge and expertise and then tag their > "reply name" with a rating. Not a quantitive rating but an "area of > expertise" rating. > > We know John Stevenson really knows what he is talking about when it > comes to machining, so John could have "J.Stevenson (Team-M)" for > Machining. We know he also knows a lot about CNC stuff so that might > be "J.Stevenson (Team-M/CNC)" > > We know Fitch knows his stuff about motors and 3-phase generators so > he could have "F.Williams (Team-E)" for Electrical. There are many > others like Jim, and Scott etc etc etc. > > There could be any number of members in each group, but before being > allowed to carry the "Team-??" tag, their level of knowledge and > expertise must be recognized by their peers. > > This would enable newbies, and others to decide whether advice given > is based on real knowledge (what a novel concept here!) or assumed > opinion, (more the norm here!) > > If the advice was not by a "Team-??" participant then the advice can > be considered on that basis. It may not need to be discarded, but just > read with caution. If it is by a "Team-??" participant it can be > regarded as having a certain degree of knowledge behind it. > > After a few months on this group, the smarter ones amongst us, quickly > learn who is full of shit and who actually knows what they are talking > about, but a newbie does not have that advantage. > > A rating system would not ensure the advice is 100% salient but it > would certainly lead to more consistent and viable advice from people > who have used more than a Sherline toy on their bedroom nightstand and > think they are machinists. > > In closing, I have no intention of being a "Team-Anything" as I do not > have the time to participate here often enough to be of any great use > to others. I am still happy to field the occasional private email as > before though, however it just occurred to me that this might be a > good idea given the bullshit that frequently and persistently pervades > this group. > > -- > > Grumpy, the Third Dwarf > (Dave Johnson) > > ***************************************** > If I were taller, I wouldn't be so short! > Dyslexics of the world, untie > ***************************************** Doesn't want to be a "team anything" But full of neat suggestions to make all the rest of it easier for his otherwise grumpy life..Go get one Dave and meanwhile...Keep an eye on Dopey, I hear he is back into Penguins!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Gun Barrels From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 28 Dec 2000 23:03:24 GMT -------- Brunhilda wrote: > > Dan Bollinger wrote in message > news:xoH26.39566$36.1241218@news1.rdc1.il.home.com... > > > Many old timers held that "gain twist" barrels were far superior to > > uniform > (snip)> > > Greg, Yes they did. As I recall, the only way to get gain twist is using > a > > hook shaped cutter and a sine bar rifling engine. Buttons and broaches > > only cut fixed twist. Dan > > > > Why would that be? Are the buttons/broaches so long that the twist can't be > progressively increased? Also, I have yet to see a good schematic drawing > that shows how the sine bar fits into this, although I've seen several > references to it's use in a rifling machine. I understand that the sine bar > would allow precisely setting the slope of the twist but I can't quite see > how the rifling machine uses the sine bar to rotate the cutting tool. > > I have no plans to make a barrel; I'm just curious about how it's done. The > more I learn about it, the more surprised I am that someone didn't introduce > mandrel forged barrels (ala Glock) long ago. It seems like an easier > manufacturing process than cutting the grooves. > > -B. It is..and is used as such in most major arms manufactuing plants. Only one problem..have you ever seen a barrel forging machine? Try a coupla million bucks on a million dollar foundation!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: This group needs a rating system From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 28 Dec 2000 23:16:27 GMT -------- Peter Forbes wrote: > > Ron Thompson wrote: > > > > > > > > Having just read another bunch of unmitigated crap and opinion on this > > > news-group by people who think they know the answers, compared to > > > actually knowing what they are talking about, I think this group > > > could benefit from a rating system. > > > > > > I worry about newbies lurking here and reading stuff, then going away > > > thinking it is "for real" and maybe doing themselves some harm in the > > > process. > > > > Hmmmm... > > Uh, who is going to educate these said "newbies" as to what the ratings > > mean? Most don't read the FAQ before venturing forth, so where are they > > going to come by this info? > > As for Sherline owners not being "real machinists", you may want to > > review the title of this news group. Do you know what the REC means? > > Also, I took Meatalworking to encompass more than just machining. > > I have noticed in the past that anyone trying to pass bullshit as > > gospel gets tromped on with both feet by all and sundry. > > However, not being one to wish to be accused of closed mindedness, I > > will get the ball rolling and see if it flies. Please note the > > signature below. > > -- > > Ron Thompson (Doesn't Know Jack Shit) > > On the Beautiful Mississippi Gulf Coast > > http://ametro.net/~ronthomp/ > > > > Sent via Deja.com > > http://www.deja.com/ > > I'll join Ron's team on that basis :-)) > > Peter > > Peter & Rita Forbes > email:- diesel@easynet.co.uk > Lister Cold-Starting Diesel Engines > Engine info etc at:- > http://www.oldengine.org/members/diesel Count me in too! Know enough to know that no-one knows it all..or even enough, and hopefully humble enough to recognise it. Happy New Years to all of you. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: This group needs a rating system From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 28 Dec 2000 23:22:14 GMT -------- "Grumpy, the Third Dwarf" wrote: > > It's good to see you back wingnut. Fuck you too! teenut > > -- > > Grumpy, the Third Dwarf > (Dave Johnson) > > ***************************************** > If I were taller, I wouldn't be so short! > Dyslexics of the world, untie > ***************************************** ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Gun Barrels From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 28 Dec 2000 23:29:58 GMT -------- Bray Haven wrote: > > >> Greg, Yes they did. As I recall, the only way to get gain twist is using > >a > >> hook shaped cutter and a sine bar rifling engine. Buttons and broaches > >> only cut fixed twist. Dan > >> > > > >Why would that be? Are the buttons/broaches so long that the twist can't be > >progressively increased? Also, I have yet to see a good schematic drawing > >that shows how the sine bar fits into this, although I've seen several > >references to it's use in a rifling machine. I understand that the sine bar > >would allow precisely setting the slope of the twist but I can't quite see > >how the rifling machine uses the sine bar to rotate the cutting tool. > > > >I have no plans to make a barrel; I'm just curious about how it's done. The > >more I learn about it, the more surprised I am that someone didn't introduce > >mandrel forged barrels (ala Glock) long ago. It seems like an easier > >manufacturing process than cutting the grooves. > > > >-B. > Because the pitch or twist is built into the button. It's drawn through a > worm type assist but there must be a slant in the swages built into the button > so it follows the "lead" At least from the barrel shops I've toured. Never > made a rifled barrel. > Greg Button rifling heads have a very short length/diameter ratio and in order to produce an ACCURATE fixed twist really do need to be pulled by a controlled twist mechanism. Gain twists can be and are achieved with pull buttons by using variable twist pull devices. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Gun Barrels From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 29 Dec 2000 00:49:56 GMT -------- veeduber@postoffice.pacbell.net wrote: > > > Someone opined: > > > >> As I recall, the only way to get gain twist is using > > > >a > > > >> hook shaped cutter and a sine bar rifling engine. Buttons and broaches > > > >> only cut fixed twist. Dan > > > >> > > > > To which Teenut replied: > > > Button rifling heads have a very short length/diameter ratio and in order to > > produce an ACCURATE fixed twist really do need to be pulled by a controlled > > twist mechanism. Gain twists can be and are achieved with pull buttons by using > > variable twist pull devices. > > > > The buttons I have range in thickness from .090 to about .190. Gain twist is easily > accomplished using the same principle found in the rifling tool I described in an > earlier post. To stave off confusion, the original post was with regard to PISTOL > barrels and the tool I described provides for hand-cutting of the rifling. The > buttons I have are for .30, .50 and 20mm bore, require a hydraulic puller and no, > you can't borrow them :-) > > -Bob Hoover Hook type rifling cutters can be as simple or as complex as you wish them to be. The olde tymie backwoods gunsmith used a lead slug, cast to the bore in which he cut a slot with his pocket-knife to take a simple hook or scrape cutter, the depth of cut being regulated by paper shims. My first, SUCCESSFUL muzzle-loader barrel of .437 caliber was made from a length of mechanical (solid drawn) tube with a rifling guide made from a cold twisted square steel bar that ran in an indexing head fitted with follower rollers. The bugger would outshoot anything else on the Range! teeenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Noboby got killed ...or my crew broke a bigger part than your crew From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 29 Dec 2000 01:25:06 GMT -------- Tom Gardner wrote: > > It sounded like gunshots! After the shootings in Boston, there were people > running for cover! The biggest, loudest, scariest crack -up I ever personally witnessed (and wet my pants by) was in the UK at the plant of a Gas Cylinder Manufacturer. Though many cylinders are now made by spin forging from solid drawn tubes, the best method was then, and remains, the solid forging from a cubical steel billet. The process involves first heating the billet (about 9" cube for a 250 cu ft cylinder) This is placed in a vertical Hydraulic Forging press of some 15000 ton capacity and the billet transformed by "Back Drawing" to a hollow cup of about 2" wall thickness in one massive downstroke. Next, the hollow, still yellow hot "Cup" is transfered to a horizontal push bench of about 10000T capacity, placed on a solid steel mandrel and pushed though a series of ring or roller dies to iron down and extend the hollow wall to a thickness of something under a 1/4". As the mandrel pushes it is held in check against bumping and surging, by a counter pushing cylinder of about 5000T coupled to the main carriage via a LARGE cast Iron "slipper" held with a couple dozen or more one inch or larger, high tensile bolts. One day the bolts sheared under "full push"!!! Freed from it's constraints the slipper shot out the end of the bench, destroyed its 3" diameter safety barrier, sheared through a 16" diameter 5000PSI Hydraulic Main, shot the length of the forge shop, destroyed a BIG fork-lift truck and flattened a 12 foot cubical stack of cut billets waiting to be loaded in the furnace. The slipper broke into "many" pieces while a column of white, hydraulic fluid blew a hole through the roof some forty feet in the air. NO-ONE WAS HURT! JUST VERY, VERY SCARED!!!!! Within half a day the company had called in "Metal-Stitch" from Sheffield, the slipper was stitched back together..probably stronger than new. New bolts made and fitted, a new hydraulic main fabricated and the line was back in operation. Ruffled feathers were smoothed..everyone changed their underwear and production went on. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Atlas Clausing question From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 29 Dec 2000 03:13:18 GMT -------- Vittorio wrote: > > at what angle do companies make the "V" ways? > Should always have an included angle of 90Deg. Most lathes, certainly smaller ones have this set equally disposed about the horizontal and parallel to the run of the bed. However on larger, heavier and special duty lathes this is often off-cast to give a much more vertically disposed inner thrust face. 60 deg/30deg innner to outer is common on high grade tool room lathes. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: True after all (was Re: stand up America, eh!) From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 29 Dec 2000 03:25:41 GMT -------- Bray Haven wrote: > > > when > >I see "popular facts" bandied about Germans that have been refuted, or > >at least raised in serious doubt, I toss in my opinion > > I think Wolfgang is a former Hitler Youth (or wannabe) who's still pissed > because they lost :o). > > Greg S. Even in Jest..thats a pretty nasty and sweeping statement to make about a fellow Human. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: I've gone and done it now... From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 03 Jan 2001 14:23:40 GMT -------- michael wrote: > > I started at a local junior college and took their machinist trades course for a > hobby I ended up graduating two years later with the Associates Degree. Had no > trouble finding a job. The pay in my part of the country sucks but I'm working > up to better things later. Most computer components are made overseas and the > parts are assembled into computer in this country. So I doubt that the machine > shops are > busy making machinery for the manufactures of computers. Machine shop will > tank before the compurter manufactures. > michael > > "J. Eric Townsend" wrote: > > > I signed up for the introduction class, "Machine Tools and Practices" > > at the local JC. (De Anza). > > > > If nothing else, I'll consider this a backup plan in the case that the > > computer industry really does tank. > > > > -- > > J. Eric Townsend -- http://www.spies.com/jet > > > > Were you in USASSG/ACSI/MACV in Vietnam, 1967-1970? Drop me a line if so... > > -- > Visit my web site, Metal Lover's Web Site. Http://members.door.net/metal Helluva lot of modern (and fast developing)US Industry relys on machine shops than just the Computer Industry. I did close to a million dollars in machine shop work last year...not a dime of it for the "Computer Industry" teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Polishing compounds From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 03 Jan 2001 14:30:08 GMT -------- "James P. Riser" wrote: > > Rick; > You might want to check out: > http://www.caswellplating.com/nsindex.htm > They have a free pdf file to download that might be of interest. > Jim > > Rick Nelson wrote: > > > Hi all, > > > > My shop is currently in it's infancy. Basically a large workbench, a > > vice, a bench grinder, a few power hand tools, and a fairly large > > assortment of auto mechanic's hand tools. Not exactly a full > > production shop. A drill press, belt/disk sander, and oxy-aceteline > > torch are in the works. Someday..the almighty lathe and a drum > > sander! :) > > > > Anyway, since finally getting my own bench grinder a few months ago, I > > have managed to polish just about every metal object in the house. I > > keep the little chart from the back of the polishing compounds package > > on the wall as a guide for which compounds to use for which > > applications. > > > > The other day, I got to wondering just what the difference (aside from > > name and color) was between these compounds. I assume the black has > > some abrasiveness to it, but what is the difference in the makeup of > > the tripoli, rouge, and white compounds and why is each recommended > > for a different type of metal? > > > > Along the same lines... > > > > The face of my polishing wheel is black. The directions for the > > compounds recommend running a sharp edge (such as a knife or > > screwdriver blade) along the spinning face of the polishing wheel to > > remove the existing compound before switching to a different compound. > > I sort of have my doubts about the effectivness of this and am > > seriously considering buying four seperate polishing wheels...one for > > each compound. Anybody feel that this is a good/dumb idea? > > > > And yes, I do use the "apply frequently, but sparingly" method with > > the compounds. > > > > Thanks, > > Rick If you want to do any SERIOUS high quality polishing, get different mops for each type and grade of compound. You can never clean off all previous traces and it only takes one stry grain of grit to ruin a surface. Keep them clean and separate in sealed poly bags when not in use. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Balls and the Brass Monkey Myth From: Robert Bastow Date: Wed, 03 Jan 2001 18:43:23 GMT -------- Personally, I have never felt comfortable with the "Brass Monkey/Cannonballs" explanation. For one thing...All the authentic deck gun set-ups I ever saw, had the "Ready use" cannon balls held in ROPE GROMMETS: Never saw a legitimate Brass Ring. Secondly the "Monkey" was the BOY who carried the powder and shot up from the magazines to the guns. IMHO the "balls and a brass monkey" explanation is one of our typical American Euphomisms to hide the realities of times when it is "Cold enough to freeze the balls off a well digger" No, they don't mean cannon balls! I have heard the phrase in the UK.."Cold enough to freeze the NUTS off a brass monkey" FWIW teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Myfords new lathe From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 04 Jan 2001 07:41:58 GMT -------- > Norman Billingham wrote in message > news:3A536A29.D819F2E9@sussex.ac.uk... > > At the recent Model Engineering Exhibition, Myford had on display the > > first of a new model, the Super 7 plus. > > > > It has a new headstock casting with much bigger bearings, allowing the > > spindle to be bored 1 inch diameter and 4MT. With a new 5 inch chuck it > > allows a full 1 inch through the spindle. About Bloody time!!! The spindle hole diameter has been about the only thing preventing me from buying a brand new Super 7 for close on thirty years!! Even then, 1" is only half assed. They had the oportunity to do it right and blew it again. a Super 7 with a full 5C taper and a 1 3/8" bore should have been their goal and would have put the Super 7 into a world market situation. teenut teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Balls and the Brass Monkey Myth From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 04 Jan 2001 07:54:49 GMT -------- Garrett Fulton wrote: > > I don't believe it's a myth. I heard the exact same explanation from an > instructor in Aircraft and Powerplant school 25 years ago who was a retired > Navy man. He was storehouse of information on old marine lore. Didn't seem > like a bullshitter in the least to any of us. > I would be curious to know where he had ever seen a ligitimate, "brass monkey" Rope Grommets were used to hold ready use cannon balls...I can't imagine that a brass ring has anything but dockside, tourism appeal. It wouldn't hold a stack of cast iron shot in a high sea..never mind cold weather! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Balls and the Brass Monkey Myth From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 04 Jan 2001 17:57:25 GMT -------- Ron Thompson wrote: > > Didn't seem > > like a bullshitter in the least to any of us. > > Of course, that is how you tell a really great bullshitter. > I have worked with several ex-"Andrew" ( British Navy familiar knickname) types. including the ex-Chief Gunnery Officer of the "Vanguard". (Britain's last Battleship) Charming, Rough cut, witty and wise..All of them! Who could bull-shit the brass balls off a PawnBroker's Sign. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Has anyone made a snow blower From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 04 Jan 2001 17:59:12 GMT -------- Mike Graham wrote: > > On Thu, 04 Jan 2001 01:14:25 GMT, Roger Duncan wrote: > > >What about your Yert? > > Do you mean a yurt? I don't know of a yert. I'll check the dictionary. > Nope, no yert there either. What's a yert? > > Mike Graham Yaskin' or yertellin'? teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Myfords new lathe From: Robert Bastow Date: Thu, 04 Jan 2001 18:05:24 GMT -------- Sales Office wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > > > Norman Billingham wrote in message > > > news:3A536A29.D819F2E9@sussex.ac.uk... > > > > At the recent Model Engineering Exhibition, Myford had on display the > > > > first of a new model, the Super 7 plus. > > > > > > > > It has a new headstock casting with much bigger bearings, allowing the > > > > spindle to be bored 1 inch diameter and 4MT. With a new 5 inch chuck it > > > > allows a full 1 inch through the spindle. > > > > About Bloody time!!! > > > > The spindle hole diameter has been about the only thing preventing me from > > buying a brand new Super 7 for close on thirty years!! > > > > Even then, 1" is only half assed. They had the oportunity to do it right and > > blew it again. a Super 7 with a full 5C taper and a 1 3/8" bore should have > > been their goal and would have put the Super 7 into a world market situation. > > > > teenut > > > > teenut > > Hi Bob: > > 1-3/8" through the spindle would make the whole headstock a lot bigger, the > spindle itself would have to be 1-5/8" to 1-3/4" diameter minimum, then the > bearings would be bigger... > > They probably wanted to keep the headstock using as much of the existing parts as > possible. I agree entirely! Chance at a major advance in performance and market appeal ruined by typical Brit Chintz/Parsimony! > > My Ward 2A capstan has 1-3/8" capacity through the spindle, and that is a much > bigger machine altogether. > > The other problem would probably be the motor hp for the increased capacity, > although the swing remains in the same ball park so maybe that wouldn't be so much > of a consideration. 3/4 to 1 HP would be more than adequate for 90% of uses. > > Hope your health is on the mend thanks. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Junkyard Wars USA From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 05 Jan 2001 00:34:01 GMT -------- isetta wrote: > > And they're OFF! > > To a rather disappointing start, I'd say... > > Whereas the UK series was a bit of fun AND instructional, the > US-version seems to be MUCH more competitive. (???) > > Remember in the UK version of "Dragsters" when the trike team went over > to help Bowser's team flip over the rear axle so they could race > forward? > > here's what the US "Chicago Fire" conversation was when they noticed > some trouble with the other team's engine: > > "What's wrong with their engine?" > > "I don't care" > > Yeah, that's the American Spirit for ya! > > Boooooooooo....... > > -Jim > > at least it got a bit better with the Punkin-chukin episode....... Not as competitive or as competant as I feared it might have been..Maybe the English Producer's Hand in choosing the teams. Surprises: Neither Drag Racer teams deemed it neccessary to see if their engines even RAN until way to late to do anything if there was a problem. THAT is the American attitude that lead to the Jimmy Carter screw up in Iran, the Challenger Disaster, Hubble, and the Mars lander cock-ups to mention just a few!! That the young guys building the trebuchet could'nt use a tape measure or a welder between them put them in a parlous position from moment one. IMHO any team should have a half decent number cruncher and a first class welder on board. The team leader and one other good "Bodger" can take care of the scrounging, svchemeing, planning and that certain "Junk Yard Conversion Philosophy" Why a guy who had already built several working Trebuchets should decide to experiment with a new design under these circumstances smacks of an arrogant stupidity that was overcome ONLY by the luck of one shot! Given a better clue on how to aim their Pneumatic Cannon, the old farts could have settled down to blow the opposing caslt to rubble in short order. Didn't it occur to the cannon team that the "loading cup" should have gone in with SKIRT DOWN!!!!! Half the pressure would have given them twice the range. Dumkopfs! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: mist or flood coolant From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 05 Jan 2001 00:57:41 GMT -------- Edward Haas wrote: > > --FWIW there are additives that can be stirred into these > concentrates that reduce the amount of mist that hangs in the air to a > significant degree. Wynns sells some and I'll bet the other manufacturers > have similar stuff as well. Give the manufacturer (not the dealer) a call; > explain the problem and see what they have to offer... > After 40 plus years of smoking three packs of Camel's a day I thought my lungs were immune to anything. Then I bought what became Express Tool & Die, and "inherited" spray coolant systems on every machine. Within a few days I was in severe congestive lung distress. I noticed every one of my machinists wore masks while machining and IMMEDIATELY had my shop guy collect all the mist systems and put them in the next scrap run. I "decreed" that flood coolant would be used in MY SHOP, paid whatever it cost to set up decent systems, searched for a coolant base that met our requirements (it costs four times as much as the regular Valcool stuff) I have the Rep come in every week to test and adjust the mix (free unless I need extra base which is rare..this stuff holds up beautifully) The solution is a translucent blue, not an opaque white or pink, the rust protection on the machines and components is superb. Coolant is as important to accuracy as the type and grade of tooling and machines used. It sure as hell isn't worth the REMOTEST risk to your health!!! FWIW teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: mist or flood coolant From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 05 Jan 2001 06:30:01 GMT -------- George Glines wrote: > > teenut, > > What Valcool product are you using, I know they sell several flavors? > > Thanks, > > George > I am not using a Valenite Product..Don't like the opacity or durability for starters. I am using a Local product..I will check the name, supplier etc and get back with the information. As many lister's will recall I have NEVER been a fan of water based, soluble coolants. I have rebuilt too many good machine tools, rotted out from the inside to ever want to use anything but non-aqueous, oil based coolants on any machine of my own. This stuff changed my mind!! It isn't cheap, but then, neither are 4 Axis Machining Center's!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How come most people get a lathe? From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 05 Jan 2001 13:46:18 GMT -------- jk wrote: > > bkober7160@aol.com (BKober7160) wrote: > > >:As you know the lathe is the only machine that can make itself. > > You know, I have heard that a lot, but I frankly don't see it. How > does a lathe make ways? Especially ways that are longer than it's > cross slide. > > >Theres a large > >:selection of adaptations to perform difficult machining arrangements on a > >:lathe, that a milling machine cannot perform. and sometimes for a lot less > >:money. Several successful Lathes use round bar beds. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Flood Coolant From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 05 Jan 2001 14:36:14 GMT -------- The Product I am using is:- SYNTILO 9822 By Castrol Industrial. I get it supplied and serviced here in Atlanta by Neuco Distribution. Can't find it in MSC Catalogue but your local Castrol Distributo should be able to help Having the local Rep. drop by weekly to check the quality snd keep it up to snuff is BIG plus for me. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Homemade Compressor Tank Questions From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 06 Jan 2001 00:40:26 GMT -------- jim wrote: > > Hi Folks, > > First let me say I am well aware of the consequences of a poorly > designed tank. For that reason I would like to hydro test this tank to > 450 - 500 psi. Can anyone advice me on ways to reach this pressure. > > Here are some specs on the tank. > 26" od 3/8" wall pipe Grade 3 (From a Billboard we took down) > Approx 40" in length. > End caps are ½" A36 plate > > Also if you have any advice on what type of welding rod to use for the > end caps first pass/ final pass. > > Thanks > Jim Jim, If you are not an ASME Certified Designer and Welder of Pressure Vessels run away from this one!! The regulations are so well understood, so well controlled and easily measured that WHEN something goes wrong (not neccessarily your fault!!) it will take only a junior para-legal to ruin your life!! Have you ANY idea of the potential destructive power of even a low pressure receiver of that size..think in terms of howitzer shells! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: How come most people get a lathe? From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 06 Jan 2001 00:43:58 GMT -------- Mike Graham wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > >Several successful Lathes use round bar beds. > > If you're talking about multiple-round-bars for a bed, then I agree. I > have, however, one with a single round bar, keyed, which sucks. > > Mike Graham Depends on the design, quality of manufacture and condition, Mike. The old Drummond round beds have given sterling service for years..even have a few unique and useful features! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Junkyard Wars USA From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 06 Jan 2001 00:59:50 GMT -------- boris beizer wrote: > teenut wrote: > > > Didn't it occur to the cannon team that the "loading cup" should have > gone in > > > with SKIRT DOWN!!!!! Half the pressure would have given them twice the > range. > > > Dumkopfs! > > > > > teenut > > Right on, teenut. I was puzzled by that. The improvement with the skirt > down is twofold -- better seal, which is probably the primary impact and > also lower friction.> ------------------------------------------ In actual fact, the FRICTION would be greater, pound for pound of pressure. But without the skirt farting and fluttering all the way up the bore they could have got the same or greater muzzle velocity and a more consistant exit (more accurate shot) with a lower operating pressure. Given the marginal reserves of energy they had, and air holding capacity of their system, it would have been a smart move!! I would have used a SHORTER cup, skirt DOWN, and WADDED each pumpkin with newspaper to a snug fit in the bore. A simple balance scale would have ensured WEIGHT of each shot was close enough together. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: mist or flood coolant From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 06 Jan 2001 01:22:59 GMT -------- Galaxy@Berkshire.net wrote: > > Another question for ya. Do you run the coolant through a filter before > it's flooded into the cut? If so what filter? I have flood coolant in > my VMC and currently I have no filter for small particles. I'm > wondering if adding one will help tool life and or surface finish. > ABSOTIVELY-POSOLUTELY!!! Bear in mind that these coolants are being used on Y2000 vintage 4 axis machining centers and cnc lathes. SPENDY STUFF! All are fitted with filter, fine filter and expensive tramp oil systems. I don't keep micron sizes in mind though ;^) But each time that coolant comes around it is as good as brand new as we can make it. We even put fine paper A/C filters over the final drop into the tanks. these are changed weekly and take care of airborne dust and grit contamination...a surprising amount in a production tool room. The coolant system is as important and well cared a component of quality and performance as the high grade machinists, the mechanical, the tooling and the programming systems. Skimp, you miss it! Miss it, you die! (BOB'S Law) teenut PS At my shop, I pay a guy whose PRIMARY job is to keep the BATHROOM to hospital standards!! Pop in one day and talk to Eric and ask him! The rest of the shop is quite clean too..He doesn't want to meet BOB! ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Q: cutter size From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 06 Jan 2001 01:51:39 GMT -------- Brian Drummond wrote: > > I saw a lantern toolpost once. > > 20 years ago I had a short shop course as a grad trainee for the BBC. > The shop instructor held it up and told us, we'd probably never see one > of these again. >Americans use them, he said, he didn't know why... Never heard it so succinctly put! Cleaning tackle out for the computer again! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Homemade Compressor Tank Questions From: Robert Bastow Date: Sat, 06 Jan 2001 07:54:32 GMT -------- clare@snyder.on.ca wrote: > > On Sat, 06 Jan 2001 05:04:41 GMT, howard yoshida > wrote: > > >In article <3A56697A.5059A98B@Nospamhotmail.com>, > > Robert Bastow wrote: > >I am just curious and I was wondering if any of you ever saw a > >compressed vessel blow up. Did the whole thing actually blow up or > >only a small section. Did the pieces fly or did it just split the > >seams. I never saw one that blew so I was just wondering how it looked. > >> >http://www.deja.com/ Actually I DIDN'T write that! But yes, I have seen a few. I used to be ASME Certified and heavily into the High Pressure vessel industry. I have seen and investigated scores of accidental and deliberate test failures. Acted as a "Professional Witness" in a few multi-million dollar law suits too. We used a huge, re-inforced concrete blockhouse for testing, with walls 4 feet thick, buried in the earth and a hundred yards from the plant. Nervously sometimes! When such a vessel lets go under gas pressure the results are invariably catastrophic..Artillery shell like. Because, once failure begins, the disruptive effect of the gas doesn't stop, unlike a hydraulic failure. The expanding gas keeps on pushing stuff around as long as there is stuff to push! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: This group needs a rating system From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 07 Jan 2001 03:13:13 GMT -------- XPRTEC wrote: > Gentlemen, allow me to speak for teenut who is up to his butt in work and also > trying to fight the cancer back. > > I would nominate for teenuts' Team Name: > > KIA & SATPI (Know It All & Staying Alive To Prove It!) > > Jim teenut doesn't want or care about being rated. But if it were mandatory lets try: Team: STWSD&TRTHB (Team: Stirsintruth) Speak only the Truth about What you have Seen and Done & Try not to get Rude to Those who Haven't but don't Believe You. teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Homemade Compressor Tank Questions From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 07 Jan 2001 15:16:51 GMT -------- Dan Bollinger wrote: > > > I am just curious and I was wondering if any of you ever saw a > > compressed vessel blow up. Did the whole thing actually blow up or > > only a small section. Did the pieces fly or did it just split the > > seams. I never saw one that blew so I was just wondering how it looked. > > Howard, it depends on the material and construction. Cast iron usually > fails catastrophically, that is to say like shrapnel. Composites usually > don't fail catastrophically, a crack opens, pressure is relieved, very > little damage other than a cracked part. > With respect Dan, 'tain't the way it happens, A COMPRESSED GAS CONTAINS A COLOSSAL AMOUNT OF STORED ENERGY!! Once failure of the container begins, that energy will continue to dissipate at a very high rate, pushing and shoving on ANYTHING that gets in in its path. This usually results in what remains of the original container being reduced to shrapnel flying at LETHAL velocities. The characteristics of a COMPRESSED GAS and a HYDRAULIC pressure at EQUAL PRESSURE are ABSOLUTELY DIFFERENT and INCOMPARABLE!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Homemade Compressor Tank Questions From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 08 Jan 2001 21:00:35 GMT -------- Steve Rayner wrote: > > The only one I have seen, blew the end off the tank. Said end embedded > itself in the opposite wall (An inside wall of the shop, which was the > outside wall of the house). The compressor itself went through the outside > wall, then through a concrete block fence, coming to rest in the neighbours' > garden. A bench top was blown upwards with such force, that a hammer that > had been on it, went through the roof. The failure was along the weld seams > at the end. It was a commercial tank. There was no shrapnel. > Waddya call an end cap and a hammer then????????????????????????? In the strictest definition, "shrapnel" is round lead or cast iron balls. anything else resulting from an an explostion is 'FRAGMENTS' or 'FRAGMENTATION' Maybe if we get the terminology correct guys, we might all get on the same page!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Homemade Compressor Tank Questions From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 08 Jan 2001 21:09:24 GMT -------- Dan Bollinger wrote: > > Robert Bastow wrote in message > news:3A588864.59FF180A@Nospamhotmail.com... > > Dan Bollinger wrote: > > > > > > > I am just curious and I was wondering if any of you ever saw a > > > > compressed vessel blow up. Did the whole thing actually blow up or > > > > only a small section. Did the pieces fly or did it just split the > > > > seams. I never saw one that blew so I was just wondering how it > looked. > > > > > > Howard, it depends on the material and construction. Cast iron usually > > > fails catastrophically, that is to say like shrapnel. Composites > usually > > > don't fail catastrophically, a crack opens, pressure is relieved, very > > > little damage other than a cracked part. > > > > > > > With respect Dan, > > > > 'tain't the way it happens, > > > > A COMPRESSED GAS CONTAINS A COLOSSAL AMOUNT OF STORED ENERGY!! > > > > Once failure of the container begins, that energy will continue to > dissipate at > > a very high rate, pushing and shoving on ANYTHING that gets in in its > path. > > This usually results in what remains of the original container being > reduced to > > shrapnel flying at LETHAL velocities. > > > > The characteristics of a COMPRESSED GAS and a HYDRAULIC pressure at EQUAL > > PRESSURE are ABSOLUTELY DIFFERENT and INCOMPARABLE!! > > > > teenut > > I don't disagree with you. I'm well aware of the difference between the > potential energy in compressed gas versus fluids. I'm confused, did you > read my post carefully? I'm not even sure which of my two points you are > referring to. > I QUOTED THE REFERENCE IN THE MESSAGE ABOVE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! > 1. A hydraulic accumulator works by having a portion of the tank filled with > oil and a portion filled with a compressed gas. In the Alcoa incidence the > compressed gas (in this 20-24' tall tank) supplied the energy which failed > the weld and lifted the lid through the roof. I don't believe the tank > walls were destroyed. > > 2. I performed a burst test of a domed, composite pressure cover using > compressed nitrogen. The part failed at 760psi. It separated into two > pieces, the dome went ballistic. It was a catastrophic failure in the sense > that a piece separated, but not in the sense that the part disintegrated > into scrapnel. > > I have no doubt that some pressure vessel failures resemble explosions and > do tremendous damage like people have mentioned, just like the steam boiler > explosions common on old Steamboats. But, both of my examples show that > some pressure vessel failures do not fail and create shrapnel every time. > Dan EXCUSE ME BUT WE WERE NOT DISCUSSING COMBINED GAS/HYDRAULIC FAILURES!!!! DIFERENT CHARACTERISTICS ENTIRELY!! teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: Homemade Compressor Tank Questions From: Robert Bastow Date: Mon, 08 Jan 2001 21:16:09 GMT -------- Jon Elson wrote: > > howard yoshida wrote: > > > In article <3A56697A.5059A98B@Nospamhotmail.com>, > > Robert Bastow wrote: > > I am just curious and I was wondering if any of you ever saw a > > compressed vessel blow up. Did the whole thing actually blow up or > > only a small section. Did the pieces fly or did it just split the > > seams. I never saw one that blew so I was just wondering how it looked. > Robert Bastow did NOT write this!!!!!!!! I don't need to ask that question...I have seen Scores of compressed gas container failures and, at one time, it was MY JOB to investigate them on every Continent of the World!! With Respect teenut ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Teenut From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 04:24:33 GMT -------- This is Ellen Bastow, teenut's better half. I wanted to let everyone know that teenut passed away tonight, January 11 around 9:15 pm. He had a tough fight and his body just gave out. He was not in any pain at the end - just slipped away quietly with his childern at his side. I want you to know how much all your messages and prayers meant to him. He would get so excited and call me over to see what had been posted. Thank you for giving him that - there will never be another teenut or Robert, as I call him. My email address is ebastow@hotmail.com and I would love to ear from anyone. Thanks again for all your prayers and know Robert is up there watching us. Ellen Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Teenut From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 04:24:33 GMT -------- This is Ellen Bastow, teenut's better half. I wanted to let everyone know that teenut passed away tonight, January 11 around 9:15 pm. He had a tough fight and his body just gave out. He was not in any pain at the end - just slipped away quietly with his childern at his side. I want you to know how much all your messages and prayers meant to him. He would get so excited and call me over to see what had been posted. Thank you for giving him that - there will never be another teenut or Robert, as I call him. My email address is ebastow@hotmail.com and I would love to ear from anyone. Thanks again for all your prayers and know Robert is up there watching us. Ellen Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Teenut's Celebration From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 20:05:57 GMT -------- Thanks so much for all the responses. Your words and thoughts have given me so much comfort and opened my eyes to side of Robert I knew existed, but didn't know how much he was loved. Robert did not want a funeral service - he wanted to be cremated and taken home to England and scattered over a childhood place. I am planning to take him home to his mum, two older boys, and grandchildren hopefully in the spring. I am having a celebration of his life on Sunday, January 14 from 2-4 at the Dunwoody Tavern in Dunwoody Village in Dunwoody Ga. I know that most of you live outside of Georgia, but please raise a pint for him, as we will be doing and know that he will be with us. He requested that any memorials be made to St. Joseph Mercy Foundation, 1100 Johnson Ferry Road, N.E., Suite 150, Atlanta, Georgia 30342-1746. All donations should be restricted to the Cancer Research Fund. My address is 4744 Holly Oak Place, Dunwoody, Georgia 30338 (770)350-0322. Once again, thanks for all your comforting words. Ellen ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Teenut's Celebration From: Robert Bastow Date: Fri, 12 Jan 2001 20:05:57 GMT -------- Thanks so much for all the responses. Your words and thoughts have given me so much comfort and opened my eyes to side of Robert I knew existed, but didn't know how much he was loved. Robert did not want a funeral service - he wanted to be cremated and taken home to England and scattered over a childhood place. I am planning to take him home to his mum, two older boys, and grandchildren hopefully in the spring. I am having a celebration of his life on Sunday, January 14 from 2-4 at the Dunwoody Tavern in Dunwoody Village in Dunwoody Ga. I know that most of you live outside of Georgia, but please raise a pint for him, as we will be doing and know that he will be with us. He requested that any memorials be made to St. Joseph Mercy Foundation, 1100 Johnson Ferry Road, N.E., Suite 150, Atlanta, Georgia 30342-1746. All donations should be restricted to the Cancer Research Fund. My address is 4744 Holly Oak Place, Dunwoody, Georgia 30338 (770)350-0322. Once again, thanks for all your comforting words. Ellen ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Teenut's Postings From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 08:18:08 GMT -------- Hey, its me again, Ellen Bastow. I have been reading the hundreds of messages and kind words you have been sending. You have opened my family's eyes to the real Robert. I was hoping that some of you might have some of his postings. I read a few - those he chose to share with me-especially when someone was disagreeing with him- but I don't have a copy. I want to compile a "book" of these, along with your messages to get me through the lonely nights that await me. If you can help me out, I would appreciate it. Thanks, my new friends - Ellen ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Teenut's Postings From: Robert Bastow Date: Sun, 14 Jan 2001 08:18:08 GMT -------- Hey, its me again, Ellen Bastow. I have been reading the hundreds of messages and kind words you have been sending. You have opened my family's eyes to the real Robert. I was hoping that some of you might have some of his postings. I read a few - those he chose to share with me-especially when someone was disagreeing with him- but I don't have a copy. I want to compile a "book" of these, along with your messages to get me through the lonely nights that await me. If you can help me out, I would appreciate it. Thanks, my new friends - Ellen ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: teenut From: "Robert Bastow(Ellen)" Date: Wed, 14 Feb 2001 23:32:04 GMT -------- Mike Graham wrote: > > Brian Lawson wrote: > > >I meant to post this an hour ago. Saturday was the one month point > >since teenuts passing. I still think of him often. > > Wow. Sure doesn't seem like it's been a month. > > -- > -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= > Mike Graham | Steel-fitter and CWB-certified weldor > metalmangler at headwaters dot com | Raiser of horses > | Tester of limits (esp. patience) > -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= Hey, this is Ellen Bastow. I've been keeping up with you guys. Saw this thread on Robert. Mike, I still can't believe he is not here. Everyday I know I will see him in the shop or at the computer giving you guys grief over some subject. I've enjoyed reading some of your posts - even though I don't understand most of what you are talking about. Somehow, it gives me comfort since I know that Robert loved working with metal. The guy that was running the shop while Robert was undergoing treatment has bought it. They are swamped with business- so at least his dream will continue. They are planning to produce the action in his name. Hope you don't mind me butting in every now and then. Ellen Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: teenut From: "Robert Bastow(Ellen)" Date: Wed, 14 Feb 2001 23:32:04 GMT -------- Mike Graham wrote: > > Brian Lawson wrote: > > >I meant to post this an hour ago. Saturday was the one month point > >since teenuts passing. I still think of him often. > > Wow. Sure doesn't seem like it's been a month. > > -- > -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= > Mike Graham | Steel-fitter and CWB-certified weldor > metalmangler at headwaters dot com | Raiser of horses > | Tester of limits (esp. patience) > -=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-=-= Hey, this is Ellen Bastow. I've been keeping up with you guys. Saw this thread on Robert. Mike, I still can't believe he is not here. Everyday I know I will see him in the shop or at the computer giving you guys grief over some subject. I've enjoyed reading some of your posts - even though I don't understand most of what you are talking about. Somehow, it gives me comfort since I know that Robert loved working with metal. The guy that was running the shop while Robert was undergoing treatment has bought it. They are swamped with business- so at least his dream will continue. They are planning to produce the action in his name. Hope you don't mind me butting in every now and then. Ellen Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: Re: teenut From: "Robert Bastow(Ellen)" Date: Thu, 12 Apr 2001 23:50:21 GMT -------- Brian Lawson wrote: > > April 11, 2001. > > Hey guys, > > Today is 3 months since teenuts passing. I still think of him > often. > > I won't write directly to her, but has anyone any news about > Ellen and the rest of the family? And what about the business and > "THE" gun? Anybody heard? Maybe you guys around Atlanta? > > Brian Lawson > Windsor, Ontario. > > No "replies" or comments expected. I am keeping in touch with you guys. I review the threads 3-4 times a week. Some of the topics would have really gotten Robert heated. Wednesday was a very hard day for me. I can't believe he has been gone for 3 months- I feel like I am just existing. The business has been sold and the guys are making a go of it. They have been getting in new business everyday. The gun is still in the works - I haven't talked directly to Mike - the one who is building it- but he has all of Robert's plans. Robert's son is living with me - until June 4 when he graduates from high school. He is going back to Canada to live with his mom. I am planning to take Robert home to England around June 18. His ashes are in the basement on his workbench. Believe me, I talk to him everyday. Don't hesitate to get in touch with me directly. After all, Robert was/is my favorite subject to discuss. Take care you guys. Hope everyone has a wonderful Easter. Ellen Bastow ======== Newsgroups: rec.crafts.metalworking Subject: teenut From: "Robert Bastow(Ellen)" Date: Mon, 11 Jun 2001 23:22:42 GMT -------- Hey guys! This is Ellen Bastow- teenut's better half. I can't believe it is 5 months today - Thanks Brian for remembering. Things have been hectic for me lately. Our stepson, James, who has been living with us for 2 years graduated from high school on June 4. I know Robert was there beaming with pride. His mother - who lives in Canada - came for the graduation and James went back to Canada to live with her. Needless to say, I know what a momma bird feels like when the babies leave the nest. This is a big, lonely house. I leave for England on June 18 to take Robert's ashes home. His mum and 2 sons live there, so we will finally put Robert to rest. It will be a hard trip for me. I've been monitoring your threads. I know Robert would have enjoyed putting his two cents in on a lot of the topics. I have kept all the wonderful e-mails from you guys and will take it to England and share your marvelous words about Robert with her and his sons. It is such a beautiful tribute to a fine, true gentleman. The action has been put on hold for right now. The selling of the tool and die shop has been a nightmare for me. I will spare you the gory details. Anyway, just wanted to let ya'll know I am doing ok - I guess that is all I can do for now. I'll keep popping in every now and then. Take care, Ellen